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Yes, Ma’am!

January 31, 2013 by  

Yes, Ma’am!
UPI
Defense Secretary Leon Panetta shakes hands with Gen. Martin Dempsey, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, after they signed a memorandum lifting the ban on women in combat.

As of last week, the armed forces of the United States will henceforth allow women to join front-line combat units. Defense Secretary Leon “Panther” Panetta directed the military to prepare to rotate members of the fairer sex into firing position. The decision has touched off a fairly predictable firestorm of controversy, with some stating the complete gender-integration of the military was likely overdue and others saying women in combat is an idea whose time should never arrive.

I’m of two minds on the topic. While I fully understand the desire to preserve some semblance of gender roles in an increasingly confused society, I struggle to comprehend the idea that women are somehow unable to perform properly in a firefight because they’re using different plumbing. There are no ladies’ rooms “outside the wire.” And the enemy certainly doesn’t display any hesitation about, or even awareness of, gender differences when rigging improvised explosive devices or aiming B-40s at a passing convoy. Already, women go through the same training expected of any service personnel and engage in air, ground and sea combat, although their primary assignments may vary. Indeed, the lone distinction is essentially a matter of paperwork.

Not too far off in American history, integration meant including blacks in front-line combat units. Conventional wisdom of the time stated that racial integration of the armed forces posed a danger to everything from command structure to unit morale. Find former Sgt. Maj. of the Marine Corps Carlton Kent and tell the men under him that he was not fit to serve with them. I strongly suggest you start running before you finish. Should you survive, try out the same logic on one of the senior officers serving under Vice Adm. Carol Pottenger. Bring your floaties.

I have encountered some people who think women lack the detachment to kill without reservation. I need only two words to gun that down: Janet Reno.

From an anecdotal perspective, with whom would you rather fend off an armed assault, much less participate in one: Sarah Palin or Dennis Kucinich? Ask that same question of some half-starved North Korean zombie or cave-dwelling Akbar who smokes hash to keep the hunger pangs at bay. Something tells me Private Jong-Sun will seriously reconsider just how badly he wants Alaska after he runs into the “Mama Grizzly.”

On the other hand, I once asked Cmdr. Dick Marcinko about women serving in combat units. If that name sounds familiar, it’s probably because he’s the bestselling author of the Rogue Warrior series of novels, and he also happens to be the founder of SEAL Team Six. This guy seriously knows his warfare. Marcinko told me he opposes women in combat not because they can’t be effective soldiers — he noted Israeli military servicewomen and Eastern Bloc snipers as examples — but because of the effect their capture might have on their own units. Marcinko worried that units might take extreme risks should a female member be captured — especially given the fact that the captors are almost routinely islamofascists who force women to dress like beekeepers, find 12 year-old girls alluring and kick back with a nice “honor killing.”

Marcinko’s point is well made. But women who enlist in the military know what they might face. To suggest that they’re unaware of the occupational hazards is to diminish their quality, and I think that’s a bit unfair. If the military — which actually tends to be ahead of the curve when it comes to integration — could learn that the only color that matters is green (or Army Combat Uniform, MARPAT or MultiCam), then I have no doubt that they can learn that the gender of their colleagues matters as little in combat as the gender of the enemy.

I am not proposing some massive social engineering experiment that uses the military as the petri dish. I just honestly believe that women can be just as effective in combat roles as men. In some cases, they might even be a little bit better. My mother is a graceful, delicate woman who makes drinking a martini look like ballet, whereas I have watched my father tear tree stumps out of the ground with his bare hands. And he does what she tells him to with the unblinking obedience of a Marine boot running into the ghost of Lt. Gen. Chesty Puller. With that in mind, imagine the reaction of a cadre of hajis confronted by a battalion that includes women with Hillary Clinton’s disposition.

–Ben Crystal

Ben Crystal

is a 1993 graduate of Davidson College and has burned the better part of the last two decades getting over the damage done by modern-day higher education. He now lives in Savannah, Ga., where he has hosted an award-winning radio talk show and been featured as a political analyst for television. Currently a principal at Saltymoss Productions—a media company specializing in concept television and campaign production, speechwriting and media strategy—Ben has written numerous articles on the subjects of municipal authoritarianism, the economic fallacy of sin taxes and analyses of congressional abuses of power.

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  • Buster the Anatolian

    Excellent article as usual Ben.

    • Speak2Truth

      I say Ben blew it. The problem is not women’s determination or shooting skills. It is their physical prowess, ability to manage heavy loads on forced marches, physical ability to scale walls, breach doors, defeat an enemy in hand to hand combat.

      Recent experiments have already proven a high percentage of women suffer injuries and are not capable of completing testing or real-world physical requirements that Men must to serve in the Marines.

      If women are subject to and pass the same rigorous physical requirements imposed on Men, and those requirements are NOT lowered to accommodate them, okay.

      There’s a reason that testing standards had to be lowered to get women into firefighting and law enforcement. There’s a reason that we don’t force NFL teams to integrate women to square off against male linebackers. We all understand the reason.

      Why MUST we pretend women are as physically capable as men if they are put into the military, where front-line combat requires the skills and prowess to DOMINATE the enemy?

      Because to acknowledge reality would not be politically correct.

      When Socialists gain power, one is punished for acknowledging and speaking of Reality when the political agenda is contrary to it.

      Women do not have a Right to serve as front-line Marines. That job is open only to the most QUALIFIED, which includes physical prowess.

      • http://www.facebook.com/benjamin.fox.98892 Benjamin Fox

        If women were trained like the women in the IDF, I would sy it was alright but, I don’t know one women who could pass IDF training, women aren’t given lighter burdens then the men in the IDF, in America there are two types of training, one easier for women then the mens and that leads many to die.

      • http://www.facebook.com/dan.mancuso.56 Dan Mancuso

        As well Speak2Truth, lets not over look the very real and serious danger of a woman who, monthly, gets PMS – which they all deny – and the fact of the hormonal turmoil this causes in their thinking and actions and the fact that she is carrying a loaded weapon!

  • Warrior

    Coincidently, I was speaking with a friend yesterday who has a son and a daughter currently in the military. His son served in middle east and is up for re-enlistment however he is not going to because the focus now is to be more PC. If this is the case, possibly females are more likely to accept a PC role then their male counterparts? Not sure what PC has to do with military though. Maybe “kinder, gentler killers”? Anyway, there aren’t enough “jobs” available for the “young uns” so let’s create some. Spring is still in the air and there’s a lot of “nations to build”. Don’t worry your pretty little head, Molly, our “leaders” are 100% behind you, literally, “way behind you”!

    • Matrix

      This corrupt government is really out of control as the people sleep.

      Between the government sponsored poisoning of our youth, and creating a full generation of girly boys and wo-men, we have a reversal in hunter-gatherer roles and will pay the price in a very few years.

      Hollywood’s poisoning of women with crap like GI Jane, housewife of Moron County, Mob wives and all these freak shows telling them how strong they are, the idiots are actually falling for it, and will vote in Hillary at the end of American history to finalize the total destruction of the United States of America!

      Now our only defense of our once great nation will be at the hands of girly-boys, homosexuals and girls and it will be quite a site I’m sure, watching this next war as our forces pull hair and threaten to scratch the eyes out of the Chinese super power.

      This is the military the obamanation has created, and the America his father dreamt of.

      This is the end my friends and I hope all of you true Americans are ready for the battle of your lives!

      God Bless America and those of us who fight for her!!!!

  • Tom

    Women are unfit to serve in combat units as are the overwhelming majority of men. I am not talking about those who might end up in a firefight but rather those who have been tasked with looking for and killing the enemy. If women want to be treated as “equals” then they must earn that right by acting like equals. They must be subject to the same Selective Service requirement as their male counterparts; which means all of the females of age,including those age forty who have no desire to serve. Let’s see how that goes over. Additionally, they must meet the same physical requirements as the men. One fitness standard across the board without exception. That is why women are unfit for serving in combat units; they are not equal to the challenge. The integration of blacks worked because there wasn’t a black and white standard so the comparison is baseless. Even the exceptional example of the female sex who can meet the standard once is not physically developed to do the job day in and day out for months on end in a combat environment.

    • rendarsmith

      You are 100% right! Lowering the standards to allow more women is ridiculous. They are doing the same thing with Title IX to make engineering courses easier for women to make more women engineers. I think Ben is trying to pander to women in this article to keep his fan base. I find it hypocritical how we always hear about how women are victims of sexual harrassment and domestic violence (even though both parties are guilty of this if you look it up) but now we are pushing them to the front lines in armed combat. I’m just waiting for the “miliary sexism” accusations and feminists whining “Why aren’t the men protecting the WOMEN???” I wonder if the VAWA will apply to women in combat. Just curious…

      • Jana

        rendarsmith and Tom,
        I am a woman, and I agree with you all the way. When in battle and someone is injured you have to be strong enough to help carry or maybe fully carry your comrade in arms to safety. Most women could not carry a 165 pound dead weight man.
        Combat should be out. There are many things women in service can do. In fact they are doing them right now, and some are more dangerous than others.
        To put women in combat just isn’t wise, it’s not smart, and it sure isn’t practical.
        Most men can physically out work, out run as well as out endure most women.

        My husband served with women who went out on the convoys with them. He said they were always getting dehydrated and he couldn’t figure out why. So I told him why.
        A woman has to practically strip down to go to the restroom out behind some bush. It takes a little longer for her to strip, go, and get redressed and the convoy is held up because of her. Also, a female goes more often then men. So the best thing is don’t drink water, then she gets sick.
        The plumbing really is a big factor.

    • Joe America

      The NWO/UN wants our military to deteriorate, more than it has. It’s not enough that they’ve dumb down the educational system in our country, now they want to lower the standards in our military, so that we’ll be unable to fight. Every move toward reducing the standards of our military only serve the NWO shills desiring to take this nation down. It’s vital that they hobble and conquer the USA, for by doing so, the rest of the world will fall in line. These NWO shills and masters dispise the USA, our Constitition and Bill of Rights, and our freedomes, because it all flies in the face of their one world government agenda. In the end, there will be no middle class, only masters and slaves. In other words, their goal is to return to the old world order of the Lord/Master-Surf relationship. By the time they’re done, you and your children and grandchildren will be freely abused, and, even killed, if the master/lord deems it necessary. This is the kind of world we’re marching toward. It’s going to make George Orwell’s “1984″ look like paradise.

    • alpha-lemming

      Partially right, but the roles are VERY job dependent. I tend to agree that I don’t know if the “trenches” are a good place for women (probably the most physically demanding situation), but say as a sniper (aweful lotta Annie Oakleys out there)?? In the case of a fighter pilot…???… physiologically a women can withstand higher G-forces than a man so… why not…may actually give ‘em a leg up.

    • Texas Ride

      I agree with Tom.

      And, Ben,.. Janet Reno didn’t “pull the trigger.” She gave the order. Big difference!

      First off this regime is all about destroying the military, just like the agenda to destroy the country. How are they able to destroy the country…by dividing the races, dividing the sexes, dividing the classes. The same applies to the military.

      First, attack the integrity of the cohesive military…and divide the existing “brotherhood” among warriors.

      All of a sudden there are no longer any “brothers,” there are groups of homosexuals, groups of women, groups of liberals, groups of racists, groups of classes, groups of conservatives, groups of the “soft and incompetent,” and groups of the weak that are unable to pull their weight! The military is under attack by this regime.

      Men will always be men and they will treat women as the “weaker sex.” (Because they are the weaker sex.”) Men will always lust after women, because that is what men do. Talk about “disharmony” being created among the ranks! The addition of women in the foxholes will do it! Women will be a great distraction, add stress, and divide the troops.
      Not to mention the fact that “tortured women” screaming in the night, and the strewn female body parts, will rattle the concentration on duty.

      The fact is that women can’t withstand the rigorous life of battle on the frontlines. Women will be another hindrance to getting the job done. Women have not/are not raised the same as men. Why should they because Nature has given different roles to women than it has to men. Those roles are played out from birth to the end of life and have always been honored by our culture.

      There is no place for distractions in war.

      • APN

        Well said Texas ride! Only one thing I would like to add…..The war by the progressive-communist began with the destruction of our family unit, by attacking the HEAD, which is we men.

        I truly feel sorry for the FOOLS who have bought into this PC crap.They have no CLUE what is coming.

        FOOLISH CHILDREN!

    • MD spouse

      Really? Who died and left the men as the standard to reach?

      Do some history homework. This same stupid argument was used to try to prevent women from flying airplanes in WWII. Thank Heaven for one very self-assured woman named Jackie Cochran (born Bessie Prittman) who, with the forward-thinking general Hap Arnold, formed the Women’s Air Service pilots (WASP) despite massive opposition. A very select group of female pilots were trained to fly military aircraft in every role available except direct combat. They flew spotter aircraft, towed target practice banners, and ferried crippled airplanes across oceans to get repaired. They flew many missions considered “too dangerous” for men, but which had to be accomplished to keep the fight going. The WASP were the only pilots to fly all the types of aircraft involved in WWII.

      Doctors warned against allowing women to fly military aircraft because doing so would “render them sterile”. (Seriously! I can’t make this stuff up!) It didn’t. The military fretted that women lacked the upper body strength to handle “men’s” planes. They discovered that women made superb pilots because of their lighter handling of the flight controls. And the public worried that such “butch” ladies would never be able to find good husbands and have normal families. Some of the WASP were already married with children, and well-meaning friends and relatives clucked their tongues that these wives and mothers would give up tending the babies and gardens for the dangerous mission of flight. Little did they understand that, were it not for the roughly 1700 women who gave up civilian comfort for the challenges of working in the Air Force, the rest of the public would soon be speaking German or Japanese.

      The old argument about “one standard” assumes that there is one, and only one, right way to do things based upon he status quo. While the bell curve for men’s brute strength is, indeed, to the right of the women’s curve, brute strength isn’t the only way to accomplish every task. Women are often excellent at accomplishing the same missions in different ways to work around physical differences. If you think this is a bogus argument, consider that nobody considered the Viet Namese ‘inferior” fighters to Americans, despite the fact that Viet Namese were smaller, thinner people who took a totally different approach to warfare. Also, unlike us, they were frequently vegetarian (or nearly so). Our military didn’t ban meat eaters from enlisting, despite the fact that the Viet Namese had an advantage because they could often detect camouflaged American soldiers by the decaying meat aromas given off in the soldiers’ sweat.

      The lesson is that being ‘different’ doesn’t necessarily mean being inferior. If that were the case, we would have to conclude that men are ‘inferior’ because they aren’t built to withstand the rigors of pregnancy and childbirth. As Groucho Mark once quipped, “Giving birth is not difficult. As a man, all I have to do to be equal is open my mouth and stretch my lips around my head.” Let’s see you do that one!

      • Texas Ride

        MD, you are wrong.

        Different can mean “inferior.”

        I don’t want a blind MD trying to do surgery just to prove he isn’t “inferior.”

        We are all inferior in different ways. We are not all the same, nor do we have the same capabilities. Nor, should anyone be given a job to try to make everyone equal, even when they are not.. You must be a big proponent of Political Correctness.

        • MD spouse

          Yes, the word “different” can, indeed,be used as a euphemism for the word “inferior’, as in, “factory farmed chicken is different from backyard chicken”. Depends on context.

          Are you using the word to imply you believe women to be inferior to men?

          Re: the blind doctor argument, that’s a straw man. Nobody is saying to put any military personnel into roles they simply can’t manage. My argument is that the stereotype of the man as the superior force doesn’t hold up when one steps away from the status quo. For example, Asian men, especially those from traditional cultures, are distinctly smaller than American and European men. I would like to hear someone seriously suggest that Asian men are therefore inferior soldiers and should not be allowed in anyone’s fighting units! Other cultures also have different traditional methods of thinking about, and engaging in, combat. Does that make them “inferior” fighters? Go ask the Taliban. Or, better yet, ask the Native Americans, who taught the rag-tag American colonists how to best their well-funded, well-fed, bigger and better armed British cousins by simply thinking differently. Women can often accomplish the same goals as men by thinking differently or employing different tactics to overcome differences in size or brute strength. The military that can’t adjust to new thinking and doing is doomed to lose, as we are finding out by the inability of our current soldiers to effectively counter the tactics of the middle eastern terrorists.

          As for political correctness, yes, I hate that about as much as I also hate stereotyping. If you’re from Texas (as your name implies) may I assume that you’re a Bible-thumping, bull-riding, beer-swilling, gun-grabbing Bubba? Or a rich, nasty oil tycoon living on a huge ranch? No? Well, just because “most” people from Texas brag about their love of God, Country, George Bush, shooting and bull riding (or bull shipping, at times) – the same way “most” women brag about how much they love staying home and dumping the unpleasant realities of supporting the family onto the men – don’t assume the argument applies to ALL of us.

          Freedom means the right of each individual to make their own decisions – and to succeed or fail at them.Some women wan to stay home, and some want to fight. Some men want to stay home, too! To each their own! “Freedom” doesn’t mean the ‘freedom’ of the self-serving majority to decide that everybody is required to feel, think and act in a particular way because that’s the way the majority feels comfortable with. That’s called being a Democrat.

          Oh, and by the way, regarding blind doctors – in China, Japan and Korea, the blind were traditionally considered superior healers because they weren’t distracted in their work by visual cues. This was possible because those cultures developed a medical system that achieved the same ends as ours but in a different way. I think it would be difficult to say that the medical system that historically served the bulk of the world’s people, and which is becoming very accepted in the West, is “inferior” in a fundamental sense to our own traditions. And in Eastern European countries that operated under communism, the blind were often assigned to become massage therapists because, again, vision was not a distraction to their work. I’ve known two blind Romanian masseuses, than they were terrific at their craft. Very successful at certain types of healing that conventional doctors can’t do much about. So please take care in the examples you choose.

      • Matrix

        MD

        This corrupt government is really out of control as the people sleep.

        Between the government sponsored poisoning of our youth, and creating a full generation of girly boys and wo-men, we have a reversal in hunter-gatherer roles and will pay the price in a very few years.

        Hollywood’s poisoning of women with crap like GI Jane, housewife of Moron County, Mob wives and all these freak shows telling them how strong they are, the idiots are actually falling for it, and will vote in Hillary at the end of American history to finalize the total destruction of the United States of America!

        Now our only defense of our once great nation will be at the hands of girly-boys, homosexuals and girls and it will be quite a site I’m sure, watching this next war as our forces pull hair and threaten to scratch the eyes out of the Chinese super power.

        This is the military the obamanation has created, and the America his father dreamt of.

        This is the end my friends and I hope all of you true Americans are ready for the battle of your lives!

        God Bless America and those of us who fight for her!!!!

        • MD spouse

          I agree that the government is corrupt, foolish and out of control. And who votes these shysters into office? We, the people, who believe that it’s not pork if it’s spent in our district, and who want the budget cut but don’t want to help future generations by taking fewer Medicare and Social Security ‘entitlements’. Who was it who said, “a people always get the government they deserve”?

          Anyway, I think your anger is a reflection of an unconscious sense that your validity as a person is threatened if a woman shows herself able to succeed, or even potentially succeed, at an activity you deem to be your purview alone and by which you define yourself. It’s an understandable reaction, although difficult to articulate. We all fear those who might challenge our status if our status is how we judge our own worth. But this isn’t about you or your worth, which is not in question. It’s about allowing each person the freedom – within the bounds of ability to accomplish the mission – to find their own worth and sense of accomplishment in whatever way matters to them. Isn’t that what the American concept of freedom is supposed to be all about?

          I have a question for you. What if a man wants to, say, cook or bake or work as a nurse for a living? Should we ban him from pursuing his dream because those are “female” occupations? Would you refuse to eat meals prepared by Jacques Pepin or Rick Bayless, refuse to allow your son to be instructed by a male teacher, or not allow medical treatment to be dispensed to you in the emergency room by a male nurse, because cooking, teaching and nursing are “women’s work”?

          I’ll offer an example of how this plays out. In Japan, women are basically barred from working in sushi restaurants because the general belief if that women’s hands are too warm to make good sushi. Of course, Japanese women make sushi to feed their families every day, and nobody complains. The issue here is that cooking at home is seen as a lowly task which the women are expected to perform as thanks for being supported by a man. But making sushi in a restaurant is an activity that bestows power in the form of a paycheck. A chef in a sushi restaurant doesn’t need to make sushi better than a good housewife, he just needs to do it, period, and bingo, he’s independent and looked up to! He has power. The ‘good’ woman is supposed to avoid power in favor of dependency. What a fantastic deal! The man gets to have everything, and the woman is basically an indentured servant for life.The same mentality is still the norm the military, where women are supposed to be eager to claim the low-paid, low-status,support tasks to show the men how much more important and capable the men are. And woe to the lady who says “I want more – I want whatever I’M personally capable of!”.

          If a woman really wants to stay home, have kids and be unpaid for her life, so be it. That’s her choice and nobody should tell her she’s wrong if she made the choice freely with full knowledge of alternatives open to her. And if she wants to fight for her country, and is up to the task, so be it. We need all the help we can get. As I mentioned in my first post, women proved at least as capable as men at flying military aircraft in WWII, despite the well-known “fact” that women could not fly big, fast “men’s” planes. And thank goodness they did, or the Allied men would not have been capable of winning. For their efforts, the women had to wait until the 1970′s to be granted veterans’ status and the right to be buried in military cemeteries! Proves what lengths some men will go to to deny reality and try to elevate themselves by putting others down instead of reaching for more in their own right. So stop putting women down. We’re not preventing you from reaching your dream and potential, whatever that is. Using us as scapegoats because you fear you may be shown to be something other than what you imagine yourself to be is unproductive and disabling to yourself as well as to the rest of us.

    • http://personalliberty.com Salty Marine

      Tom, your right. Ben, I find it hard to believe you wrote this. Performance in a fire fight is different than the day in day out of living in the field. You don’t drag a port a potty around with you for those too shy to urinate or take a crap in front of other servicemen. Men get so use to seeing someone else’s harry butt they don’t care anymore. We were happy some times to get a shower once in about 5 days. Throw in the once a month thing women deal with and I suspect a mess. There is NO PRIVACY. Not allowed to get out of your tank for 5 hours…pee in a bottle…and do it within arm’s length of someone else. Now throw in all the sexual harassment training of which you are flat out told if charges are filed against you by a female you are automatically guilty until proven innocent. When women were in the field near our AO it totally jacked up the chemistry of the unit. You civilians don’t understand the dynamics of a front line fighting force. PC needs to stay out of it…I haven’t even gotten started on the physical differences yet. Suffice it to say, young men filled with testosterone LOVE their women. When bullets start flying that is what they will be thinking about instead of doing their jobs. That’s just the way it is and no amount of fantasy will change that dynamic.

      • APN

        MD said…… As for political correctness, yes, I hate that about as much as I also hate stereotyping.

        I don’t believe you. I think you are ALL about the PC crap. Have you served with females in combat??? If so, educate us on how she performed as compared to her male counterparts.

        Bottom line, females in combat is a VERY BAD idea however given the PC BS that is currently dominating and drowning out all ADULT logical reasoning in this nation, well, suit’em up and kick their butts into combat…..NOW!

      • http://www.facebook.com/benjamin.fox.98892 Benjamin Fox

        Salty Marine, first Semper Fi Friend and fellow Marine. You are right about all that you said, God Bless Brother:

  • dg

    While I agree with your assessment generally, I do so with some reservations, not about women but about our politicians. If a woman can meet the existing standards for a combat role, by all means allow her to fill that role. However, if history provides a lesson, expect the standards to be lowered and quotas established when the PC crowd uses statistics to demonstrate that there are not enough women in combat roles. Then our military will begin the slow descent into mediocrity.

    • Warrior

      Well, this much I do know, women in the gubmint make just as good as liars as their counterparts. Now if that doesn’t show “equality” I don’t know what does!

    • ? Chocopot

      That is exactly what they have done with the standards for police officer and firefighter so more women can qualify. Please do not get me wrong – I have no issue with women occupying any job or performing any function they wish, but they need to meet the standard qualifications without any ‘adjustments’ being made for them. As I adored and respected my mother, I treat all women with courtesy and respect, even complete strangers. However, I will never agree that lowering standards in some social experiment is the acceptable way to do things.

  • Jim

    Ben,

    Though I enjoy your Great Eight, I must disagree with you. Any woman who can fireman carry me ( 200 lbs.) for at least one hundred yards, I would serve with, but I have not seen many who are capable.

    • rendarsmith

      It’s all a social and political stunt to increase PC and appease feminists. If the women want it so badly let them have it, but I don’t think the enemy is going to discriminate about who they aim at….

      • Wendy

        I guarantee, most women DO NOT want this. The idea that a 110 lb. woman can be DRAFTED and expected to carry a fellow soldier who usually weighs more than twice her size, is not only absurd, but lacking in intellectual honesty. And if she weighs 130 lbs. it is more likely that 20 lbs. of that is fat because women are designed to sustain new life and are therefore designed differently. Like it or not, the reality is, men and women are physically different. People have been watching too much feminist fiction. If the government wants to see a decrease in population, then what better way to do it then to put women on the front lines. Women have a very unique role in society. A society cannot repopulate itself and its military without women.

      • APN

        Well said Wendy, good to see a REAL woman communicate the FACTS and not some childish foolish feminist propaganda. i.e.; dumb hollywood movie

        The a big difference between men and women is basic chemistry. Get a small man in FEAR of his life and he can become gorilla like deadly in an instant. I can assure you that women in combat will get stomped in the ground, period.

  • Penny Staffney

    I served as a Woman Marine. I am currently 53 and an avid outdoors woman. Here’s the real problems. 1.) Any woman sent into the trenches must be able to fireman’s carry a 200 person so no one is left behind. 2.) Be willing to go potty in front of everyone…not all situations allows you to find a bush (desert). 3.) Try to not be a sexual distraction to bored, horny young men. 4.) Be willing to run out of tampax and walk around messy, or take pills to dry up your ovaries so you don’t menstruate, ruining your chance of children. Be a sharp shooter or many things, Private Ryan work is NOT glamorous!

    • Warrior

      And seriously, I salute you. Rugged “individualism” knows no race or gender boundaries.

      • Jana

        Penny S,
        I agree with Warrior, and thank you for your service. I think you explained yourself and why most women would NOT want to go into combat very well. God bless you.

    • dan

      Rush had a classic when he suggested an Amazon Battalion with synchronized menstrual cycles…Thankyou for your service ,Penny

      • Nadzieja Batki

        Rush didn’t elaborate on what happens in a closed all women societies, that they develop pecking orders, they become more viscious,more cruel,more brutal,more perverted against their own gender than any men are capable of being against their own gender.

    • Right Brain Thinker

      Penny makes many good points, particularly 1) and 3)—-there’s a lot of sitting around in between “actions” and the grunts are the horniest of the horny. Cdr Marcinko’s argument is well taken—the urge to protect the female is inbred in males and could be a problem as Marcinko states. I am most concerned with the issue of physical capabilities, and women in combat need to be way tougher than firemen or policemen. It doesn’t sound as if Ben has ever been an infantry grunt, but the women that are put into front-line direct combat units had better be able to do everything a man can do—-if they can, they belong—-Ben’s mother does not. S/F to Penny

    • Kelly Grindstaff

      Thank you Penny for at least putting that out there. The people who are saying this must understand that a combat load, should not be decreased for who carries it. Most women, not you penny, can not carry that combat load day in and day out, and be ready when the rounds start flying. Others have said they would have to make exceptions for them to be allowed in the full combat units. I say no exceptions!!! Combat unit you hump the ruck or you can’t be there end of story. They will have to go through the exact same physical training as all combat soldiers/marines, no exceptions. I have met women service memebers that could meet these qualifications but they are very few and far between. For the most part a man is built different, physically, and can do it 99% of the time. Most ladies just do not have the capacity to be able to do it in that regards.

      No dumbing down the critieria of the testing and training or like has been said before will equal a less capable combat arms. Face it Politicians/Columists/Reports who say these things have never wore the uniform and carried the loads. Until they do they have no bussiness saying what is possible and what isn’t. You have to walk the walk or you can never talk the talk until you do both.

      • Penny Staffney

        LOL oh no, I can’t carry the 200lbs! I was an Airwinger F4 Radar repair. I can hike, horse ride all day, shoot etc.

      • Jana

        Penny S,
        Thank you again, you helped make one of my points in an above post. Women do well in service for their country. There are many many things women can do as well as or even better than men, without having to go directly into combat. Even so, they do have to be trained in case they come under fire and need to know how to fight and be tough when the need arises.
        One woman in Afghanistan was supposed to be guarding something (don’t remember now what). Her weapon was heavy and she leaned it against a desk. One of the Afghan’s attacked her to try and rape her. Her training took over and she was able to get away from that guy and got her gun and broke his arm and beat the living day lights out of him.
        After help arrived and they took the Afghan off, she was telling what happened and was just sobbing.

  • Joe America

    Based on gender, alone, at the age of 18, our young men are forced to sign up for selective service. Women, on the other hand, are exempt. With all the hubbub about females in our military services desiring to serve in combat, and the recent changes allowing them to do so, it clear that females in the military are doing this by choice. Men, on the other hand, have no choice in signing up for selective service. They, by federal law, must sign up for selective service at the age of 18. Although there is no draft and hasn’t been for many many years, should a crisis result in the need to begin a draft, men would be unfairly “drafted” while women would not. This is a glarring violation of equal rights, which needs to be resolved, if, men and women are, indeed, all equal.

    The fact is that for every infantryman on the field, it takes twenty non-combat military members to support them, logistically and administratively. Women could easily fill any of those roles. And, if combat role restrictions are now off the table for women, then there is absolutely no reason why 18 year old females should not, also, have to sign up for selective service. We’re either all equal, or we are not.

    Our goal should be, either to get rid of the requirement to sign up for selective service, or require that both men and women should be mandated to sign up, at the age of 18.

    It would be nice to see the ACLU offer their assistance in resolving this matter, for the benefit of all, men, and women. This could be a great opportunity for the ACLU to correct a clear and gross violation of equal rights. It can be sumed up as what’s good for the Gander is good for the Goose. However, I feel that the ACLU, which is nothing more than a communist front organization, dedicated to the demise of this great nation, would be inclined not to do anything. Why? Because they really approve of discrimination against men, espcially since most of them in this nation are white.

    Women say they want equality, but that’s a blatant lie. What they really want, is super-equality in a world where they have all of the advantages. It’s clear that men are out numbered by women, but women receive minority status, giving them great advantage in all fields of endevor. You’d think that if women were genuinely serious about equal rights, the selective service issue would have been addressed and resolved decades ago, but that’s never going to happen. The Diane Feinsteins of the world are well aware of the injustice of the selective service process. The fact is, they don’t care about true equality. I freely extend the offer to debate this issue, right here, right now, with any of these old farting out of their mouths hags from Congress. Yes, Diane Feinstein, I mean you. And, Bela-Pelosi, another Congressional hag, is also welcomed to weigh in on this matter. In fact, any rabbid feminist who wants to debate on this issue, better get their asses on this site and go to town. I want to hear your silly ass rationalizations as to why women don’t have to sign up for selective service.

    By the way, the main reason why these particular women demanded to go into combat was not about “duty”, but more about achieving rank and more pay. Rank is achieved more quickly, with combat experience. So, when it’s to their advantage, women demand equality. But, the truth is, until both genders are required to sign up for selective service, the concept of equality will be a joke. Until this issue is resolved, I have no respect for the women demanding to go into combat. Having a choice to do something and being forced to do something are two different things.

    • APN

      Joe America said…” Why? Because they really approve of discrimination against men, espcially since most of them in this nation are white.”

      Best post on this subject to date. That is exactly what is going on here! The marxist females have no intention of putting their BLOOD on the line! All they want is to assert their out of control female foolish ego over we men. In fact, I would assert that they are angry because GOD made them a female instead of a MAN and organizations like the ACLU are playing them like the dumb FOOLS they are.

  • David

    i fully understand the principal of putting women in frontline positions, and like you have two minds on it.
    however pluming does play a part. Our females are the only ones that can carry life. So killing a female kills more than just one. We also have the toilet thing, it isn’ t that easy for a women to simply pee. then you have men who would take unnessasary risks if a female was in trouble (it is in the male dna to protect) As you stated about your dad being able to rip stumps out with his bear hands, yet becomes a puppy when asked to do something via your mom’s request)
    Then if it is law, all women will serve on the frontline, but what of those who don’t want to. will they be given a pass? I served and have no doubt of some women that could be a Sgt. York. but others that dirty nails or bad hair makes them useless. There would have to be some grand(mother) clause that excludes women who joined up to get a tech job and education and now is required to serve on the frontline. Not all women joined knowing they would see combat. (some men too). And when the chips are down everyone picks up a gun and fights…that is a given.
    we also have the way a women’s brain works. maybe you could train it differently, but in general women want to think and talk about their feelings, WHEREAS a man can be told to go here and kill the enemy and they would do it without having to know why.
    If we were fighting a normal adversary that heald women in high regards it would be different. In Vetnam, the cong knew this about American men and set up traps where a naked women armed with a heavy cal. could wipe out 10 or more soldiers before being killed. The main reason is the American hold women in higher regard (do we really want to change that) so a marine seeing a naked women (even tho armed) took a few extra nano seconds to process what he was going to kill and that slag between action got many of our guys killed. The women had no hesitation and reacted instantly. However, they were usually chained to their station and had no way to flight ao they could only fight.
    There I had some input into the topic.

    • Joe America

      Dave, I don’t want to put our women in harms way, but they can’t be a protected class, getting special rights, but not having to pull their own weight. Peoples sons are as precious as their daughters. If the daugheters are going to have “special rights”, which allows them to escape the risk of the sons, then they are not equal. You can’t have it both ways. Women want to stay at home, take care of the kids, and get paid at the same time, as if they were actually working full time, making the same money as males really doing the job. And, if they don’t get what they want, you get an EEOC suit. You can’t say men and women are equal, yet have one sex take on more risks and have to do more work than the other. Besides that, anyone concerned about their little darlings getting hurt in combat wouldn’t have to worry, as much, if they were in a non-combat role. Trust me, I’m not sexist, I’m for true equality and that’s not going to happen unless we get rid of the selective service program, or make both sexes register for it at the age of 18. Look, something is wrong in a nation where a young man, taking pre-med, graduating at the top of his class can’t get into medical school, because he’s white or Asia. We’re loading up medical schools with women and minorities, primarily, minorities from other nations, that, by the way, hate Americans. If everyone is truly equal, then they should be judged strictly on merit and ability, not affirmative action and entitlement programs. Yet, this isn’t happening. Basically, our nation is telling white males to go crawl off in a corner and die. Asian males get screwed over, too, maybe worse than whites. I’m of mixed race, and I’m sick of it. I’m sick of polititians using race like a pawn to get votes. Females are the majority among voters and this is why the selective service burden has been pushed onto males. Girls want to have fun and getting your ass shot up, or blown up, isn’t fun. There are specific gals serving in our military that are tougher than some men, so I give them credit for putting their asses in harms way. But, the majority of women want it all. They want to avoid responsibility for protecting/serving their nation, they want special preference in college admissions, which they get, they want special treatment from the SBA, which they get, they want special treatment in government jobs, which they get, which is why we have so damn many unqualified people in high places. Gross incompetence? Try the head of our state department, Hillary. Our people in Lybia were sacrificed, for what purpose, we’ll never know. Try the fact that both Space Shuttle disasters were caused because black females were put into high positions in the companies responsible for the QA of the specific items that failed, and caused the accidents. What happened to them? Well, they were quietly removed from those positions and given higher ones, where they could cause more damage. If you’re white and male in this nation, you might as well go hang yourself, because this nation has turned against you. You’re done. As far as the liberal left is concerned, you are a dinosaur and the sooner you’re extinct, the better. Any male who votes for the liberal left is voting against himself and all men, particularly if you are white or Asian.

  • johno

    Remember being 20? Sex was probably the most important thought in your mind. Most of the fights were over girls. A man in a combat zone has more testosterone flowing than normal. These are alpha males. The dissension created among the troops would not be because of the enemy.

  • roger gunderson

    Women on the front lines. Insane. I just can’t wait
    for the blowback.

  • Chris AR

    As a 23 year veteran of the Army who has served in multiple combat operations and had the opportunity to train over 10,000 Soldiers during Advanced Individual Training, I feel I had a pretty good perspective on this issue. I believe it is a bad idea. The economics makes no sense. If, as expected, the number of women that physically qualify is on the order of 0.01% (as has been quoted by several senior officers) – or one in one thousand, then we are putting a lot of time and effort (resources) into something that will have little or no impact on our ability to field an Army. The average length of time any Soldier stays in the service is only about 4 years. Only a small percentage makes the military their career. I have worked with several female General Officers and never heard one lament the fact that she had not had the opportunity to be an Infantryman. In fact, I’m not hearing their voices now. The job of our military is to fight our nation’s wars – not to provide an opportunity for social experimentation.

    • ranger09

      SO TRUE,.I think its stupid and the people that want this to happen are also stupid, Dont we have enought trouble with our young men of today when it comes to combat. But it gives the politicians something to distract the american people from the real problems of this country.
      Will be to many failures in basic training, will be to many failures in advanced training, Most will be sent back for rear type training. Just a waste of time and resources.
      Our women have not been trained as soldiers all their lives as the women that were VC in Viet Nam, Even then most were support for the VC.men soldiers.

      • Texas Ride

        Right now the regime wants to talk about anything BUT the real problems the country is facing. They will do or say anything to distract the people from real issues, even put women on the front-lines in battle.

      • Texas Ride

        If the regime can cause chaos in the military, it suits their purpose.

      • Jana

        Ranger09, You stated”_________Right now the regime wants to talk about anything BUT the real problems the country is facing. They will do or say anything to distract the people from real issues, even put women on the front-lines in battle.”___________

        You are so right. This is what he does best. Makes us wonder what he is up to that he doesn’t want us to know about and what it is that is going to be sprung on us next.

  • dan

    The thing that kills the deal is demoralization….women get PREFERENTIAL TREATMENT and that’s a fact,Jack. They get promoted above and before because they;’re female….sure,some deserve it ,but there’s always the ones gaming the system and men know it.
    What father doesn’t want to give his daughter soap on a rope for a graduation gift.

  • APN

    In my estimation, it is about darn time that females should be REQUIRED to fight for our freedoms just like the men do. In fact, given the “progessive” marxist feminist agenda in this country deployed over the course of the past several decades, WE MEN SHOULD DEMAND IT!

    In other words, you gals want to be a Senator, Congresswoman, POTUS, business leaders, head of household etc etc etc, well, earn it, spill some blood for the aforesaid “Freedoms”, just like we men have and continue to do.

    Fact is, all these self-appointed marxist feminist dictators like HC want is nothing more than to be in CHARGE of things and tell us DUMB men what to do and how to do it including getting our arse shot off in combat while they prance around the globe starting another conflict for we MEN to fight. AND, when the crap hits the fan, well, just look at what happened in Benghazi. BOY, now that is proven “Leadership”, isn’t it? WOW! Let’s make her President in 2016, if we still have a country by then.

    Bottom line, draft them just like men, train them just like men, suit them up and drop their butt’s right in the middle of a firefight. Now that would be poetic JUSTICE for those who assert themselves as something that they CLEARY aren’t.

    APN

    • Texas Ride

      APN, you are very angry! Did some woman treat you badly…was it your Mother.

      Women in the military is a bad, unnatural idea.

      The only way I see women in combat is if our country was overun and there was fighting in the streets. Under those circumstances, the women would be fighting for their homes!

      Put your efforts toward stopping politicians from using our young people as “cannon fodder” on foreign battlefields, in conflicts that mean little to nothing to the lives of Americans.

      • ranger09

        Texas makes sense, But there are a lot of politicians and Rich people out there that will never send their kids into harms way.
        I think that to be fair ALL men and women should serve at lest two years, ALL men should have to do their duty in Combat The Rich and the Poor, Then things would be closer to being fair.
        But i have seen that commanders take extra care in protecting the Politicians and the Rich mans Kids in combat when there was any.

    • Elevenarrows

      APN, some of us want to fulfill our God-given roles of wife, homemaker and mother. Please don’t lump us in with the “women” who wish to be men. Feminism is NOT about wanting to be treated equal. It is about wanting to usurp the role men have traditionally played in society.

      Personally, I LOVE the distinctions between men and women. I cringe when I hear a high-pitched, wishy-washy voice coming out of an effeminate man. Likewise, I find a gruff, manly woman repulsive. The genders were separated for a reason. Give me a wild, rough, hairy, bull-in-a-china shop-type man any day. Please DO open the door for me. Please DO protect me from harm. Please DON’T expect me to go to the front lines. Don’t get me wrong. My husband has taught me to shoot and if an intruder was threatening the sanctity of our home, we both would be armed and ready, but historically speaking, it has always been a curse and a shame on a nation when it is led by women. I can see no good coming out of a weakening of our armed forces at a time when our leaders have already made us the mockery of the world.

      A properly feminine woman brings out the best in a man. She strengthens him best by utilizing HER natural strengths and I assure you, they do not include carrying his wounded body across a battle field.

      • ranger09

        Elevenarrows,,, Nothing better than to hear from a real Woman about this issue, My grandfather taught me that a woman is the 8th wonder of the world.
        Can you give me the reason behind the name Elevenarrows,

      • Andy

        11-arrows, I agree 100%. Women AND men are genetically engineered for the roles they are destined to play in life. Why women would even want to be “like” a man is far beyond my comprehension.

      • Nadzieja Batki

        Thanks Elevenarrows. There is nothing that can be added that you haven’t said already.

      • APN

        Hi Elevenarrows, great response and I respect it.

        Fact is, I’m married to a REAL WOMAN as well(35 years and counting), and yes, she respects me as a Man and I respect her as a REAL woman. I would not be the MAN I am today if not for her and that is a fact. She is the anchor of our family, always has been and always will be. I think I may LOVE her, what do you think? And yes, she gets what she wants when she wants it because she is my WIFE.

        Now, with that said, I made this post to the HC marxist types just to see if I could get a angry response. I love to toy with foolish people who assert themselves as something they aren’t.

        Washington is full of them and apparently given the results of the last election, we have a majority of females now in America who fall in the HC category. i.e.; Dumber than a billy goat.

        I would love to meet these all-powerful females on the battlefield and then “Educate” them. Ever wonder why the girls don’t play professional football?? That may be the reason the progressives are now attacking OUR game? You think? Let’s make sure we destroy anything in AMERICA that can only be done by a MAN, correct? We surely don’t want the big progressive females to feel inferior to a man in any way, correct?

        You see where all this foolish female stuff is going yet?? Fact is, feminism is the worse CURSE that has every been perpetrated on America and will be our doom in the end.

        In closing, thanks for being a REAL woman. Based upon what I witness every day going on with our children, it appears the woman in this country are AWOL to busy trying to be a MAN.

    • Jana

      APN,
      Not all women feel that way. Like you said the Hillary Clintons and the militant women do, but not all of us are militant in any way.
      In fact it makes me mad how our men are put down on television and made to look like idiots or buffoons that can’t do anything without a woman telling them how. TV commercials are very good at putting men down and making them seem effeminate.
      Sadly, SOME of our youth are leaning that this is what is expected of them and then they act upon it.
      We need men teaching our sons how to act like men.

      • Karolyn

        And that also means men teaching their sons NOT to look at women as sex objects.

      • Jana

        Karolyn,
        Right! :)

      • APN

        Jana, well said and I agree with you. Men should act like men and women should act like women. I think GOD created us that way……OOOPS…I said the GOD word!!!! Boy, I bet that just hairlips those all powerful extremely intelligent GOD hating progressive feminists who assert themselves as being superior to we DUMB helpless little white boys!

        Yep, the attack on men is really a little more specific than just men. It’s all about WHITE men, who founded our great nation. How else could you destroy the greatest nation on the planet?? Show me a commercial that puts a NON-White man in bad light. You can’t because it does not exist! However, just about ALL commercials now show white men as DUMB, STUPID, GREEDY, MURDEROUS, UNCARING, ADULTEROUS, PERVERTED, GUN TOTING, ETC ETC ETC

        Better wake up little feminist girls and stand up for your men or suffer the consequences. You may think you understand how the world works but you have no idea but I’m sure the world will educate you in the VERY near future AND THAT IS THE SIMPLE FACTS of the situation.

        We’ll see how well progressive/marxist feminism works under ISLAMIC rule and I’m sure that female combatants will put the FEAR OF GOD IN THEM!

        • Speak2Truth

          I want to explain why Communists actively “feminize” a society that they are “fundamentally transforming”. If I do repeat what I learned in that particular Communist meeting, hosted by our local Democrats, I think even the women here would label me a sexist pig.

          You’d be amazed at how the Left really view society and how they manipulate our culture. Amazed and horrified.

          Now that they have taken control of the US, they are progressively destroying the institutions and traditions that made the US strong and dominant in this world. That’s their goal.

          The Democrat party is the enemy of the United States. I’ve been to enough of their meetings to have learned this horrifying fact beyond a shadow of a doubt.

          Heck, one of them was a fundraiser to help one of the former Communist rulers of Afghanistan, Suraya Parlika, get back into power so she could lead the Communist re-conquest of that nation.

      • Jana

        Speak2Truth,
        I believe it. We are even seeing it happen right before our eyes uhhh except for those who refuse to see.

  • Mac

    I would like to know if Leon think that a 5′ 2″-120 lb. women can win in hand to hand combat with a 220 lb. man with the same training?Can she carry same pack,same #bullets,a 220 lb man a mile,or in Seal training, carry a log in sand & waves with 6′+ men & that all before 7AM, after that it gets tough!

    • http://None Paul Morrison

      Since we are social engineering lets do the job properly. Form two combat teams, one male and one female. Send them out at same time same mission. The one that comes back less scathed wins!

      • APN

        Obviously the women would win hands down because they would RUN for their lives and hide.

  • GRusling

    Mr Crystal, before you open your mind on “combat roles” maybe you need to spend a few weeks in the mountains of Afghanistan, on foot, slipping from rock to rock, hoping to find the enemy before he finds you. Maybe you should check with your “Father” on what he thinks about your Mother being there also, not with you, but 500 miles away with a unit that’s “all men” with the exception of the one, lone female, and I don’t mean as unit Commander. She has to be just “another one of the guys”. I’ll give you LONG ODDS he would object strongly to that arrangement, especially since the bathroom facilities are all in plain view of everyone else, and the sleeping facilities allow breathing room only, for both warmth and security reasons, and forget about taking a bath. That may not happen for weeks at a time.

    Mr Crystal, you point out how “Muslim Men” treat women, but you need to also think about how other people treat women, when they find one in the company of “troops in the field” and what that would mean for the Daughter you’re so proud of. Don’t think about her being dead in combat. That’s not really the problem. Think about her being “captured alive” and basically unhurt, and not by some regular army unit, but by a group of irregulars who haven’t been home to visit their own wives and girlfriends for months, maybe years! You shouldn’t have much trouble envisioning THAT scenario, and once you do, think about the MEN in her unit, who would probably all be dead, to the last man, attempting to protect her from a fate which YOU seem not to find troubling at all!

    Think about it Mr. Crystal… It’s not what women and girls are capable of accomplishing… It’s about what they’d be subjected to routinely, on a daily basis in a ground combat force, and even worse, should they have the misfortune to be captured alive…

    • deerinwater

      It’s never been the size of the dog but the size of the fight in the dog.

      Anything that will enlarge the size of the fight is worthy consideration on the battlefield of war or in each personal life.

      As long as there is no longer conscripted soldiers, and each soldier has made a willful decision to serve, I don’t have a problem with giving it an opportunity to be a failure or success.

      Women are not weak, women will and do fight. Women do not ever fall on their on sword.

      And above all, there is nothing that makes a man fight any harder then a woman.

      • Penny Staffney

        I can tell, I may be 5’5″ and would luv to kick some sense into ya. Women can fight in many noble ways, and yes mr. lib, women like any other have fallen on thier swords too…what movie were you watching? You are right a man doesn’t fighter ‘harder’ than a women…they can lift heavy objects & with less precise hand to hand training hit harder. War is brute force at trench level. If you have = talent…a Bruce Lee at 5’5″ and a big Bruce Lee at 6’2″ the big guy would win. If a woman is that interested in special ops there are forces & organizations to find employment. Average Joe on the line doesn’t need to lose focus…sorry guys, but ya know you focus on one thing at a time…and in war you need your back covered not looking a booty.

      • deerinwater

        See the fight you bring to the party? ~ You are attempting to fight me and I’m on your side! LOL ~~

        I’ve had my little war and got the mahogany, ~ you’ve got nothing to tell me about hard-times and warfare .

        I enjoy a woman with an attitude. ~ It’s a thrill a minute and makes it very easy to walk away with no guilt attached.

      • Penny Staffney

        Don’t think we are on the same side. WOMEN DO NOT FORMALLY BELONG IN COMBAT

      • deerinwater

        This thread post is not about “Formally” Penny, but opinions to current developments.

      • 45caliber

        deer: I hope I’m not making you feel put down but Penny has been right in every argument between the two of you that I’ve seen. You have been in the militlary in combat? When and where?

      • APN

        deerinwater said: ” As long as there is no longer conscripted soldiers, and each soldier has made a willful decision to serve, I don’t have a problem with giving it an opportunity to be a failure or success.”

        Well I’m sure you don’t because you aren’t the POOR sap in the foxhole with a female next to him. How BRAVE of you!!

        Women are not weak, women will and do fight. Women do not ever fall on their on sword.

        Really now! What a FOOOLISH statement!

        And above all, there is nothing that makes a man fight any harder then a woman.

        LMAO! Fact is sweetie, you will RUN when the HEAT gets turned up. Nothing but idle words from a feminist. You seem to need your little female-ego stroked.

      • Karolyn

        APN – First of all, deerinwater’s name is Bob. Secondly, you obviously do not know a lot about women.

      • APN

        Karolyn said…”APN – First of all, deerinwater’s name is Bob. Secondly, you obviously do not know a lot about women.”

        I know PLENTY about women and the most important thing I CLEARLY understand is…..They aren’t MEN and will get decimated on the battlefield! Just because YOU as a FEMALE gets angry does not translate into victory, correct? Or do you actually think that you can do a little hand to hand combat with a REAL MAN that is EQUALLY as angry? Fact is Karolyn, you obviously don’t comprehend male anger and aggression

        You can’t possibly be this foolish, can you?

  • deerinwater

    There are women that are up to the task, willing and able. I don’t approve of restriction to the spirit of humankind by birth or gender.

    If you think a bunch of horny soldier will be only more horny because there are women in the ranks, I have to disagree.

    Being so damn horny you don’t have enough loose skin to close your eyes has been a soldiers life. ~and one of the reasons that I refused to re-up ~ I like women too much. I see this decision as a potential balancing factor.

    If it doesn’t work out, ~ it can always be changed

    http://www.google.com/search?q=top+women+snipers&hl=en&tbo=u&tbm=isch&source=univ&sa=X&ei=UnsKUYLAOtOu2gXxy4DoCA&ved=0CIMBELAE&biw=1527&bih=850

    • Penny Staffney

      Well, ‘deerinheadlights’ men won’t be ‘more horny’ some may not be as honorable as we imagine, in remote, life/death environments rape, groping, gang banging can occur. Men in jail are known to masturbate, uncaring if others notice, let alone if a woman may be available to be the target. YUK. I went to the website w/photos of women warriors, lot’s of pilots, snipers, they aren’t on front lines. Pic’s in uniform doesn’t mean anything. The movie J I Jane, is a fantasy movie. The real women that can lift 200 lbs aren’t anorexic 105lb’ers. Yes, some women can do the job. A lot of us if in life or death situations will rise victorious, however, we do not need to waste money & training time, men do have ‘protector wiring’ and in training lots of females in martial arts, the killer instinct in most 18 yr old women is hard to tap…so a draft of ladies would be a waste. I like the WWII slogan…’Free a man to fight’. We probably have some bad ass women spys & spec force, but are the exception. Get out of the dorm & kayak w/ you gal for 3 wks w/camping & let me know how she felt about things.

      • deerinwater

        LOL! ~ I don’t guess you know who you are writing too? ~

        and for you information, sniper are behind enemy lines and on the front line as well. A sniper can be anywhere, and usually are.

        So you you can take you bad little self on down the road regarding what you think you know about warfare. ~

        You are coming across like more of a Donut Dolly then a warrior.

        Lyudmila Pavlichenko
        July 12, 1916 – October 10, 1974

        309 Confirmed Kills

        In June 1941, Pavlichenko was 24 and Nazi Germany were invading the Soviet Union. She was among the first volunteers and asked to join the infantry. she was assigned to the Red Armies 25th infantry Division. From there she became one of 2000 female snipers of the soviet.

        Her first 2 kills were made near Belyayevka using a Mosin-Nagant bolt action rifle with a P.E. 4-power scope. The first action she saw was during the conflict in Odessa. She was there for 2 and a half months and notched 187 kills. When they were forced to relocate, she spent the next 8 months fighting in Sevastopol on the Crimean Peninsula. There she recorded 257 kills and for this feat she was cited by the Southern Army Council. Pavlichenkos’ total confirmed kills during WW2 was 309. 36 of those were enemy snipers.

      • Penny Staffney

        Tell me who I am writing too?

      • Jana

        uh oh Penny,
        You have dared to attack deerinwater. Now you will be threatened (for all that is worth). His ego is the next biggest thing on him besides his mouth.
        Sometimes he actually has some good ideas and makes sense, but then he ruins it when he has to have the last word and ALWAYS be the only one who is EVER right, especially against a woman. He definitely has issues.

      • deerinwater

        General Jana does not like to lose an argument, ~ when she offers a better one, ~ maybe she won’t.

        You have shown us great improvement with your debating skills over the months ~ once you figured out that you could not say anything that you wanted to and get away with it.

        No need to thank me. ~

    • 45caliber

      deer:

      You said, “If it doesn’t work out – it can be changed.”

      When was the last time some government program that didn’t work out was changed back? I don’t remember a one. Instead the politicians try to “fix it” – usually making it even worse since none will admit that the real problem was trying it in the first place. Oblamacare is a good example of that.

      • deerinwater

        Well 45 I confess ~ 43 ‘s tax breaks did seem to want to go on forever ! ~ Things are in constant change 45 and you know that is so. ~ If everything was always the same ~ what would all these “self proclaimed alleged conservatives ” have to complain about every day!

        And you should know by now that I’ am a combat infantry vet, served with the 25th Division operating out of Chu Chi 68 and 69″. ~ We’ve spoke of it many times as we have our peace officer years in passing. ~ I don’t forget things about people and what they say on this board, we are bird of the feather while we do share our differences.

        I’ve filled enough body bags to make my comments as sound as any on this board.

        There is some on this board that seem to believe that front line positions might be flooded by women, ~ That just won’t happen. Maybe one in 2 hundred women even capable and of that .02 % , maybe .05 % would even want to be front line soldiers.

        I would not wish to see women conscripted for front line position, ~ but if a woman can prove she has the iron will and determination to be a front line soldier , I say more power to her.

        Men need to get over themselves.

        The two years that I served as a blue water Mariner , we couldn’t have a woman aboard ship ~ but it wasn’t because of the women, but because of the men. ~ Out of 8 men, there will be one that just can’t behave himself. ~ This is not a woman problem, but a mans problem. There is a lot of duties aboard ship that women can do well but the behavior of men simply won’t let them.

        Weak links in character needs to be exposed and dealt with ~~ rather then ignored. ~ perhaps there would be less raping and pillaging by combat soldiers if men less character were identified early.

        A higher bar is what we are shooting for. ~ Much of today’s wars are becoming more and more push button wars, things women are good at. ~ Quick! accurate. ~ I know from experience that a woman can be cold blooded and ruthless ~ and most likely do too..

      • Penny Staffney

        I agree w/you on this post. Thx for the banter

  • Frosty

    My wife of 36 years was enlisted in a “Max Wacs” program at Ft Bliss, Tx when we first met. I can tell you from personal experience that it will be a nightmare for any units sent into frontline combat with female members. Even in training there were day to day situations that would have resulted in mass casualties in the real world. Men, especially American, are conditioned to protect women at all costs. Personal hygeine was a constant problem. I was in an electronic recon unit in ‘Nam (ground sensor implants) and we could actually smell Sir Charles a couple of times before we could see him in the bush. If a combat troop can learn to smell his enemies food, how long do you think it would take him to pick up certain other bodily smells? No offense to the ladies, just a fact. The Max Wac program was finally terminated and the results were restricted from publication. In the Army that normally means the test did not go as hoped. Other nations who have used women in combat were usually forced into such methods only as a last resort. Please don’t do this to our combat troops.

    • Karolyn

      What about Israel?

      • Penny Staffney

        The Jew’s don’t do ‘police actions’ away from their domestic soil.

      • deerinwater

        I guess that depends on what you call “Police Action” ~~ The Korean War was considered “Police Action”

        Israel will strike with force when and where ever she sees a clear “Threat”

        http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-21281923

      • Texas Ride

        “What about Israelies.”

        K, those women are fighting for their homes, their country and to protect their children.

        If our country was under invasion, American women would have no other choice but to take up arms.

      • Penny Staffney

        deer…Israelis don’t send troops too far from home where as Americans do. Police actions, Imperialism, regime change by any name is war.

      • ranger09

        10 years off and on in Israel, And very few women were in the front lines, Just ask anyone who was there, Most were drivers and support and most replaced the men in the cities.
        But yes in a major conflict all are called up, You leave from your home, work or what ever, you grab any transportaion available and head for the front lines.That was the way it was back then. But these people have been trained their hole lives for these kind of problems. But i think today even Israel has revamped its thinking.about direct combat for its women.

      • 45caliber

        Karolyn: when Israel was first formed, women fought in combat. And they did as well as the men in actual combat. But all that combat was local. Later, when things became more peaceful, they were taken out of combat because they weren’t as physically able to do the combat job and because of the sexual problems that came up.

        In the military, you don’t expect to fight for an hour and then go home to rest. In WWI and WWII, they would be on the front line for MONTHS at a time. Ditto for Korea. In Vietnam, we spent roughly a month in the front and then were hauled back to the rear for a couple of days. Many times we had no bathes for that entire month unless a good rain storm happened by at the right time.

        Would YOU want to be in a position where men were around you continually, day and night, in the bath (which many times is simply stripping off in the rain) and when going to the bathroom (which most of the time is simply a trench dug in the ground with no cover around it.) The problem is that many young people have absolutely no idea of what combat consists of – and in the military, they sign up for 6 years whether it turns out that they like it or not.

        • Tim

          All I know is I won’t be trying to convince my children to join the military and its sad because me and my wife’s family have a long history of being army soldiers but I think that is about change for our family.

      • Karolyn

        45 – No I would hate it, and I would never in my wildest dreams ever have wanted to be in the military. However, the women who do join, especially now, WANT to do it and would, I assume, take all pitfalls into consideration before taking the plunge. Not all women are the same, just as not all men are the same. There are millions (billions?) of men who would make lousy soldiers.

  • Jamie

    They wanted Equal rights ” they should eat all the Responsibility that comes with it as well they have the same rights to be in the Game of battle just as much as men
    Glad to see it final came time. hope they sticks to the plan.besides
    Female Cops do it everyday. some get shot and killed.
    you do not hear any national whining about that do you.

    • Karolyn

      Might I ask who’s whining?

    • Penny Staffney

      Cops & firefighters are not in the wilderness for 3 wks to fend for themselves, if officer down, the officer is usually not required carry partner over shoulder miles to field hospital. The shift is over…people go home.

      • Jana

        Around here a lot of the female officers have been raped too. Not all, but several.

      • Karolyn

        Jana – Where do you live? I have never heard of any female cops being raped. All the stories I’ve ever heard are of cops using their authority to rape women they stop for supposed traffic violations.

      • Jana

        Karolyn,
        In Texas. Not only cops, but also some of these reporters that travel all over the world. We watched a news report on it not too long ago.

      • Karolyn

        The bottom line as I see it here is that there are many people who see rigid roles for men and women, and the will of the individual has no bearing. All women should be as “God” made them, have babies, stand beside her man, keep the home fires burning, etc. etc. Fact is that not everybody wants to live that way. Why should they not be afforded the opportunity to live the life they want to? Because YOU believe there is something wrong with them? Nothing is so black and white. I do not bash women who choose traditional roles. Why do so many want to bash women who do not?

        • MD spouse

          Thanks, Karolyn. Very sensible, and conforms to what the American idea of freedom is supposed to be all about.

      • Jana

        Karolyn,
        I realize not all women want to be wives and homemakers. I know I am talking to one. You have enjoyed your life and you have the right to live it as yo see fit.
        The truth is women are going into the military and for the most part do a wonderful job, but to force ALL women to go into combat because a few masculine type women want to and some delusioned women THINK they can, is wrong.
        I would not want my husband or my son if I had one or my family members to have to depend on a physically weak woman to try and carry them out of harms way when I know they couldn’t do it. When in battle these guys walk for miles and miles carrying 50 to 60 pound packs as well as wearing Kevlar vests that also weigh up to 50 pounds and that is not including their weapon..
        Some of the women that are mixed in with some of these troops that have to walk a lot carrying all of this plus their weapons have major hip and back problems. Sorry I don’t want that for my daughters just so some people can pretend they are tough!
        Before you go on with this you ought to try it for yourself for 1 month and see how it works for you.
        Then you will have the right to talk.

    • Walter & Renee Agard

      if you are speaking anatomy wise there is no way a woman is equal to a man . there’s something a woman can and cannot do like a man.

      • Joe America

        I believe this is the point trying to be made. The fact is men and women are vastly different, physically and emotionally. This does not mean that one is better than the other, nor should one sex have more rights than the other. They…we, are different and thank God that it’s so. Here’s the deal, the international bankers, Wall Streeters and those who desire to bring the New World Order (old world order) back into existence can’t do so until they’ve absolutely destroyed the American (and world-wide) family unit, and sadly, they’re very close to succeeding in their goal. These are the same people promoting homosexuality, abortion, easy divorce, the production of children outside of marriage, and living together, without marriage. Ironically, they’re destroying the normal purpose and function of heterosexual marriage, while promoting marriage between homosexuals. Next, like Caligula, they’ll have us marrying our pets. They could care less about equality. All they want is to destroy America from within. They’ve taken us out, financially, now the family is next. Their goal is to turn men againts women, children against their parents, partents against children, gays againts straights, religion against religion, creed against creed and race against race. The fact is a house divided against itself cannot stand. Of course, the ultimate goal, for them, is to create a new society, where they, the tiny ultra-weathly elite, are, once again, the masters of, what was, their old world order. They desire to go back to the bad old days when there were masters and slaves; lords and surfs. They desire those days of old when one man literally held the fate of the masses lives in their hands. One word, one wave of the hand, could spell death for another human being. It’s not enough for these creatures to have “more money than God”, they must have and weld absolute power over their fellow human beings. This is their end game. And, they are winning because Americans are asleep. We are so easily led by the media, owned by the very people who desire our destruction. We have become, “we the sheeple.”

  • JW M

    A combat patrol is not a safari with the woman warriors with men to pack their ruck and extra ammunition.
    Read “Get Over It! We Are Not All Created Equal” by USMC Capt. Katie Petronio published in the Marine Times.
    She is engineer officer with 5 years of active service and two combat deployments, one to Iraq and the other to Afghanistan.

    • 45caliber

      She is right … but the libs don’t want to admit it.

  • Michael Desrosiers

    The interesting thing to me about this initiative is that as far I can tell, it is not being driven by demand from the women currently serving. I could not agree more that in a fire fight, everyone is capable of fighting and serving together in support of each other. Other articles I have read written by female Marines and Soldiers talk about the rigors of infantry and the requirements for carrying heavy loads, moving great distances rapidly and the constant beating the bodies take during ground operations. At some point, common sense should prevail and acknowledge that there are physical differences in gender which may not enable everyone to do the same jobs. The lives of those serving in combat are at stake and everyone MUST meet the required standards. This initiative is another feel good, political correct step being pushed by clueless politicians and bureaucrats who will ultimately destroy the one successful government agency that exists – the military. And I believe this is just another calculated step in that direction.

  • Guy Waukcinebar

    Women can serve in combat under three conditions. 1. They can pass the men’s physical endurance test. 2. They understand they may have to be crapping in a foxhole with a bunch of guys crouching around. 3. They understand that it is a certainty that they will be gang-raped if captured,

    • 45caliber

      They will mostly fail at 1), may be able to get by on 2) and will refuse to admit that they don’t accept 3) since they think it will never happen to them. And 3) doesnt’ even mean that it is an enemy action unfortunately.

  • Tim

    For this very reasons I left the army after 11 years of service.its just to PC for me.

    • http://midcontent ridge runner

      You can put 20 males of any age in a dwelling and 2 bathrooms for months and remain friends for years. Out 20 female in one dwelling and at best there will be pissing and whining, snipping in a few hours. I have 5 daughters and if there is any cooking going on in some outing, somebody is going to try and play boss of the hen house and it never fails wheather they are 10 or 30. Go to any school, organization meeting or gathering, and some female is going to snip or have some thing that upsets them, economic strata or race it doesn’t matter, the idea that men and women are and can be treated the same is bull.

      • deerinwater

        That is true RR, but ~ in a way, we don’t treat all men the same either.

        I never could, because each one is different. ~ different skills, abilities and talents.

        I can’t send a 145 pond man to do the works of a 198 lb man. ~ he doesn’t have the a$$ to set a 32 ft. extension ladder in a mild breeze much less a whipping wind. Oh! he could do it, maybe on the third try ~ but that is not the way we subject personal to a task and expect professional results.

        I can’t send 198 pounder crawling under a house or into a tight attic. ~ I must treat then differently while I need them both. They are both equally important.

        Don’t send a plumber to do a electrian’s job.

        I’ve got a tiny 97 pound woman on the payroll that I feel required to treat special, ~ I need her and what she can do. The men protect her, ~ she makes their job easier and they know it. The end results is, I get a better, fast job and let loss and down time. I pass on the cost to the job. When she not working, she is watching, ~ safety officer, security officer on the job. she’s watch our trucks and our equipment that scattered about the job site, making sure noting walks off. She is worth ever dollar I pay her.

        It’s called getting the job done, ~ with whatever it takes. ~ work as a team, something the armed forces does very well.

        What will most likely happen is that they will sprinkle these women where they will best serve. There might come a time where there will be a whole platoon of just women. This depends on how women serving on the front lines works out, but that will not happen overnight.

        It was during a fierce debate a few weeks ago with DaveH that we discussed the cutting of military “orders” ~ it’s not a crap shoot as many might believe. ~ It’s a culling process from a pool of talent that starts in Washington , to General staff, to division , to Company, to Platoon to squad. ~ It’s not random accident any soldier gets a duty assignment.

        Augmenting women into front line positions slowly should not be too hard to master.

        • MD spouse

          Well said! Thank you!

      • 45caliber

        deer:

        You are right. Not all men have the physical capability to be a combat soldier too. The training allows them to be weeded out. The problem is that the percentage of men who are weeded out due to physical problems is less than 5%. The percentage of women who cannot handle the same training as the men is closer to 95%. As a result, the military has a toned-down training program for them – which puts them in serious danger when that physical capabilities is required for survival. It also endangers the men with them since they will want to protect them. Your work is a LOT safer than combat and you can adjust for the weaker sex. In combat you can’t.

      • 45caliber

        ridge:

        I agree with you. Women and men are NOT the same – physically, mentally, or emotionally – even though the left have tried to train them to be. That is why feminism is not working for everyone – most women want to BE women, not some neuter person. In some situations the characteristics of the women work best; in others men do.

      • Jana

        deerinwater says,______________hat will most likely happen is that they will sprinkle these women where they will best serve. There might come a time where there will be a whole platoon of just women. This depends on how women serving on the front lines works out, but that will not happen overnight. ______________________

        Sure with the paper pushers that we have they will be sure and find out what each persons strengths and weaknesses are and put them in those special places. Sure they will. NOT!

      • Karolyn

        Oh, please. Women in the military cannot be compared to your daughters. That’s a whole different animal.

        • Tim

          Well I don’t know his children, but I do know what he said about women is correct even in the military. I have seen it myself. In fact I met my wife while we both were in the Army. I’ve spent 11 years in the military to include Iraq. How much time have u spent serving our country with woman. Oh probably none. So how do you know what women in the military are like? Someone tell you?

      • deerinwater

        Agreed, but there’s no need to restrict a person just because of a gender. ~ If they qualify fine , if they don’t , they wash out. ~ just like men do. ~

        I wash out ~ of communicating. ~ and it tickled me to death with my failure! ~ I could send 30 groups a minute but only receive 12 to 15. ~ They can di,di,di da di my assets! ~ It was a hearing problem, that the Army didn’t catch on entry and zero week. I had the mind, I just didn’t have the hearing and the dyslexia was no help.

        I’d rather be shot that do that crap. They found a good place for me, something that I was good at ~ that what the Army does ~ and been doing it long enough to know how.

        This is not about lowering the Bar 45, but raising it.

      • deerinwater

        Jana says; “Sure with the paper pushers that we have they will be sure and find out what each persons strengths and weaknesses are and put them in those special places. Sure they will. NOT!”

        They are not all pencil pushers Jana. ~ First there is the “objective” and planing stage. ~ and then the human resources required must be mustered.~ If a soldier has a history record it will be a consideration. If not, you will be assigned to start one. ~ But when is comes to green cruits ~and assignments, ~ every soldier has at the very least a training record as well as citizens record.

        Do you believe ~ it’s some-kind of big Lotto and somehow a name is pulled from a huge roster by luck of the draw?

        ~ Sometimes a soldier is summoned, ~ for his/her particular skill. The job calls for a Specialist, so one or five is looked for.

        Arriving at my duty station in Cu Chi ~ I was assigned to a “recovery and reclaim” platoon. On a request of the Company CO, I make the mistake of opening a locked safe that had been left behind by a soldier that had shipped out and no one knew the combination. Sometimes a soldier would be killed and there would be his safe that no one could get into to even see what was in it as we sent the body and personal effect home to family.

        The news traveled like wildfire ~ The 25th in Cu Chi had a safe cracked, ~ in the year I was there, I was flown all over South Viet Nam just to opening safes. ~ That’s just a small taste of life in a combat zone. Supply of talent and materials is always limited, ~

        There are many ways for a person to earn the respect of their fellow soldiers, ~ it’s not all about carrying and killing. ~ by the end of my tour, I all but quite carried a rifle as I had men help me with each directive. I attempted to be in and out ~ and for that I was rewarded handsomely on several occasions.

        But few would know about such things unless they lived it. ~This need for Everything to fit inside someone’s box of understanding can be a very limited view of reality .

        Life is what you make it , no matter where you are at or what you are doing.

      • Jana

        deerinwater,
        No I never thought of it as being a big lotto, but knowing it is run by the government, I know how things can sure get mixed up and paperwork reshuffled. The left hand often doesn’t know what the right hand is doing.
        I am glad that you had a good experience, and you had a good talent that was discovered and used effectively.
        Many have not been so lucky. they get assigned wrong and it is like pulling teeth to get it corrected.

      • APN

        deerie said “I can’t send a 145 pond man to do the works of a 198 lb man. ~ he doesn’t have the a$$ to set a 32 ft. extension ladder in a mild breeze much less a whipping wind. Oh! he could do it, maybe on the third try ~ but that is not the way we subject personal to a task and expect professional results. ”

        LMAO!!!! What? Heck, when I was 12 years aged working on the farm I could pick up a 200lb sack of 17-17-17 fertilizer and walk barefoot across a plowed field! I weighed a wopping 75lbs!

        You must be a pansy boy or something? Hell, when I was 16 I could bench press 315lbs free weight and only weighed 165 lbs soaking wet with rocks in my pocket.

        Where do you come up with this foolish JUNK?

        Has America become this soft that a 145 lb “man” can’t handle a 32ft extension ladder?

        LMAO!

      • Jana

        APN,
        I went to the store to purchase a 100 pound weight set for my nephew. I don’t know why I didn’t realize the box was going to weigh 100 pounds as it looked like such a small box. (duh) Long story short, this kid comes up, shorter than me and I am 5’3″ and looked like 12 but probably 15 and he picked the box up and set it in my basket. He didn’t even act like it was heavy and he was a scrawny little kid.
        I told my husband about it and he said at 15 he should be stronger than me. OK.

      • deerinwater

        APN says: A lot of stupid things. ~ In-fact his whole posting was stupid ~ reeking of some male ego ~ of what he “could do” ~ and what was possible.

        I’m a business man ~ I don’t gamble, ~ I sell results with no excuses. I license and insure for 5 million. ~ I don’t allow jobs to go bad. I don’t permit male ego to interfere with sound judgement~ I don’t put my people in to a position that someone can get hurt. ~ It’s call being a responsible contractor and employer.

        I’ve 43 years in the trade business and seen much, to long to speak of.

        APN , You can Attack my posting you [comment has been edited] but don’t attack me.

        If you think shear MASS and size don’t matter ~ fine ! I don’t mind you being a stupid fool, ~ The world is full of them. In their bad judgement, they usually hurt themselves and die earlier then most. It’s no accident that some people live to get old and some just don’t, And then there’s is the ones that don’t die but limp and crawl around the last 20 or 30 years of their lives. ~ Can’t even dress themselves or wipe their own bottom.

        If you believe a “tight end” can do the work of a linebacker ~ I don’t believe that there anything anyone can offer you. ~ Clearly you never handled a large commercial grade extension ladder. ~ Maybe a light weight Home Depot 20 ft’er at most. ~ Those “Honey Do” ladders.

        [comment has been edited]

        A good 32 ft extension ladder cost $550.00 , I don’t want it dropped and damaged to where it becomes a safety hazard. I don’t want it dropped on a customers car ~ and I sure don’t want an employee out of work with a back injury.

        So maybe you need to talk about something that you actually understand and spare us your childish gibberish,

        The right person for the right job, it’s not complicated. It’s not rocket surgery.

        There are some women out there that came qualify for specific front line positions. The fact of being a woman should not exclude all women from consideration for such a positions.

        Women already fly combat missions, they fly the space shuttle, ~ They are serving as snipers. ~

        I know that maybe it’s intimidation perhaps to some men to contemplate ~ but I’m not convinced that theses “some men” should rule the day and evidently,~ I’m not alone with my thoughts.

        If all of a man’s self worth in tied up in his pecker, this is a classic example of a dysfunctional man. He needs to be identified and labeled for what he is.

      • deerinwater

        Jana says “Many have not been so lucky. they get assigned wrong and it is like pulling teeth to get it corrected.”

        This is true Jana. ~ it’s always been so. ~ A certain amount of life is pure “Happenstance”.

        As green recruits would come into country, ~ they was not always treated well by us “short timers” (seasoned combat soldiers with fewer days to serve) for several reason.

        They were at the beginning of a steep learning curve to stay alive and they could get themselves and you killed. ~ If they were poorly suited for the work, you didn’t really what to know them. You didn’t want them around you. Some of them you might find favor, take in and help and some were just too hopeless to help. They just didn’t come across as serious enough or qualified enough.

        This behavior existed among all males combat troops, ~ bring women into the mix might change this dynamics some but this behavior will still exist no matter. A combat soldier learns to block out thoughts and feeling and learn to laugh at things that are not funny.

        Life and day to day existence in combat theater is unlike any life that I ever lived. ~ As for myself, I was luck, ~ I was also very focused, ~ I wasn’t there for pleasure but to work. I stayed away from the dope smoking and drinking and those that did do those things. ~ I did not seek out entertainment and amusement, my work was my fun. I stayed away from crowds, ~ No Bob Hope show for me. ~ The perimeter required defending during such times and that’s where you would find me.

        Every returning soldier will have his own story to tell, this is but a piece of mine.

  • Tim

    I know what you mean I grew up with six sisters.

    • deerinwater

      LOL ~ a lot of fight for sure ~ was you the only boy? Poor guy.

      • Tim

        No lucky me I have a younger brother. That’s the only thing that kept me sane.lol

      • Nadzieja Batki

        You are the poor guy because you have no idea how female minds work when you get more than one together.

  • Abinadi

    Interesting and sometimes Humorous Read. I can agree with some of what he says except for 2 Points he was Dead Wrong on! 1. Women DO NOT go through the SAME training as Men! The Standards are lower, the PT is less vigorous and the actual “COMBAT” training “Which I completed) I will not even Address. 2. As for His Father Obeying his Wife without hesitation is due to one fact only “TRUE LOVE”! I will say though. AS a Trained Combat Infantryman Prior to 1982 when the training was made easier. Yes, there are “Some” Women who can go through the Extensive Combat Training JUST the Same as there are “Some” Men who Cannot! But I totally Agree with his Quoting of CMDR Dick Marcinko. The Enemy would Love to get their hands on an American Woman Soldier.

    HOOAH!!

    • Joe America

      I agree with you 100%. Our women would become a liability to our men in combat. Instead of fighting and concentrating on the battle, they’d be looking out for the ladies. And, women cannot meet standards of physical strength for combat roles. They have the heart, but, most, do not have the strength. The push to make this happen is only being made to weaken our military. It’s going down the drain, quickly.

  • Dave

    Our enemies used to crap their pants if they even thought the Marines were coming. They knew they were hard-core, mad-dog killing machines who never gave up. Now our enemies are delighted to see them neutered by PC, their strategies decided by constututional law professors who never wore a uniform, their rules of engagement dictated by the delicate sensibilities of effeminate liberals from the Associated Press and now the integration of “Bethany” to the battlefield. American liberals and their kissing cousins in Europe keep handing our enemies one advantage after another. I used to encourage young men to serve their country, as I did. Now I tell them to stay home because our leadership isn’t going there to win. They’re more interested forcing their liberal ideals at the cost of effectiveness.

    • 45caliber

      Dave: When Israel was first formed, men and women both fought. They had to since there weren’t enough men to defend alone. BUT … today the women are out of combat roles. The reason? Israel found there were far too many problems when they were mixed.

  • Tom Cook

    Ben, what makes you think that Janet Reno was female? Have you ever served in combat? Thought not. Having spent more than a year in Vit-nam I can tell you that women do not belong in combat. That is a generalization: should some big xyyy decide that she wants to take a chance on getting shot up and she can do exactly what is required of men in training, go ahead and put her in somebody’s unit…just not in mine.

    • APN

      True justice would be to take Panetta,and put him in an ALL FEMALE unit and then throw them in the heat of battle.

  • Tom Cook

    P. S. Ben, just looking at Panetta, do you think he is actually a human being?

  • al sowins

    The administrative intent of this hornswoggling perversion, ie, putting females into combat roles, is to weaken our military so the islamic jihadists can easily over run us.It fits into Obama’s giveaway of several mideastern countries to the jihadists in the socalled “arab spring”, and the sale of 60 billion woth of jets to Saudi Arabia, the home of the 911 terrorists. Clinton helped the moslem cause by destroying Serbia and Obama is helping the jihadists destroy Syria. I was a paratrooper in the korean War and have never known a female who could have begun to keep up with us. Panetta, a traitor to the core, just like his boss, knows this too, proving his decision is deliberate and malicious. Congress should act immediately to correct this; but they won’t, as they are bought and or intimidated by the CFR. Finally, what sort of “man” sends his mom, wife, daughter off to fight his wars for him?

    • 45caliber

      al: What kind of man would send his wife, etc. off to fight for him? Any Washington poliltician.

      • deerinwater

        What kind of man orders his wife to do anything?

    • APN

      Deerie said: “What kind of man orders his wife to do anything?”

      It should be, what kind of BOY orders his wife to do anything. A man EARNS the respect of his LADY through his actions thus she voluntarily follows HIS lead.

      • Jana

        APN,
        You are so right. I happened to be married to a wonderful man that sounds similar to you. He is a great husband and a great daddy. He has the respect and love of his entire family.

      • deerinwater

        APN says ;” A man EARNS the respect of his LADY through his actions thus she voluntarily follows HIS lead”

        I say, and if she doesn’t? ~ Is that your failing or hers APN?

        You seem to be suggesting that a woman can respectfully disagree but still do a man bidding even though she does not want too.

        I ask, how many times exactly have you been around the block? ~ Clearly you have little experience with women ~~ or ~ are you a whole 35 years old and just preying on the Cow Eyed corn feed country girls that live in houses with wheels on them?

      • Jana

        deerinwater,
        The difference in what you are saying and what APN is saying and I have experienced, is before my husband and I got married we talked and talked and knew each others thoughts on marriage, children, and what we expected during our married life. So we both went into our future with our eyes open.
        My husband has never DEMANDED that I do anything. We talk things out. We have respect for one another. In a lot of things he is a lot more knowledgeable than I am, but there are things that I am more knowledgeable than he is. If we were both the same we wouldn’t need each other.
        Sure sometimes we have arguments but we decided a long time ago to argue fairly. Not just argue to win. Anyone that argues just to win doesn’t really win. Hmmm, although I will say I can’t remember the last time we actually had an argument. We have both realized that neither one of us would ever do something on purpose to hurt or put down the other one.
        Sure, this kind of relationship takes work, but it sure is worth it.

  • Ken Juen

    I feel the problem is instinctual. Men want to protect women, it’s nature, live with it. Emotional attachments are impossible to prevent. If one of the women is in trouble or about to be the natural reaction is to protect. I’ll leave it to your thought process as to how this could play out in combat.

  • 45caliber

    Ben:

    Women can cerainly fight – and do about as well as men do in the same ratio. BUT … there are two reasons I am against this.

    First, women cannot carry the same loads as men and cannot handle the rigors as well. The Army attempted a test several years ago. They trained women to a peak condition to see if they could reach the same level as normal soldiers. They came close – about 90% – but the training required extensive time and had to be continuous while the men they were compared against went about their jobs. The real problem with this in combat is that the men who are mostly chavalric, will attempt to carry the loads the women are supposed to carry in addition to their own loads, leaving both men and women exhausted. If they don’t the women are left behind. The pace must also be kept down for the women. This could be fatal if speed was important.

    Second, men and women are … well, men and women. That means sex. Sex has been found to be a serious problem in the past when women were NOT in combat. We had to pull guard on combat lines in Vietnam one hour on and one hour off all night, every night. There were normally two in a foxhole. Whether the women and men share foxholes or not, sex will occur in the field due to combat stresses – and that means someone isn’t pulling guard. Worse, when people become lovers, they tend to want to defend each other at the expense of others. We had a gay couple in Vietnam in our platoon. No one really cared – until we got into a fire fight and they got separated. The sargeant then sent his other men into harms way (Charge!) to end the battle quickly so he could insure his lover wasn’t endangered or injured. Further ,in combat, there is no modesty either. That means men and women bathing together in some cases (such as in bomb craters after two weeks with no bath or change of clothing). I can’t see that reducing the need for sex.

    And finally, due to military rules, a woman who is pregnant is immediately sent out of a combat zone. If half the soldiers are women, how many will deliberately get pregnant just to get out of combat? One ship going to Iran for Desert Storm had over 90% pregnancy rate on the trip from the US to Iran. Can the militlary expect to perform with half their combat soldiers gone?

    • Karolyn

      Well, as far as sex goes, if people, mainly men, would just think more with their brain and not with their penis, there would be no problem. Everybody is too preoccupied with sex. That is also apparent when you see all the rapes that go on in the military. In countries where sex is not so hush-hush, they have less sex crimes. I always thought men in the military were trained to be righteous and single-minded – wanting to do the job they were called up to do. In this article, she says that the men in Isareli’s IDF are well-educated, abd tgat’s why they do not have sexual harrassment.
      http://www.guardian.co.uk/lifeandstyle/2012/jul/09/israeli-defence-forces-women-equality

      • Karolyn

        “and that’s”

      • Speak2Truth

        Number of sexual harassment cases in the IDF climbs
        Official says it’s unclear whether there are more incidents or more willingness to report
        http://www.timesofisrael.com/number-of-sexual-harassment-cases-in-the-idf-climbs/

        Hm…..

      • APN

        Well Karolyn, if we could get WOMEN to think with something other than their vaginas we could make some real progress here. You seem to assert your gender as being superior to we men. Fact is, you can’t think clearly about 50% of each and every month of your life unless maybe you have already reached menopause.

        Once again, you silly little progressive females have no clue.

        Did my response harm your little progressive-feminist ego?

      • Karolyn

        APN – Thanks for the laugh! :-)

      • John Woodbury

        Komrade K, I would wish no one, not even you, to be on the front lines of a major battle. Could you function with your friends brains splattered over you? I forget the name of the book about Cynthia Ann Parker, it was published in 1980′s (early). Read what happens when the noble savages take the women hostage, look what happens to each of them, carefully, then come back and tell me you would just love to be on the front lines. http://www.lulu.com/shop/james-t-deshields/cynthia-ann-parker-the-story-of-her-capture-at-the-massacre-of-the-inmates-of-parkers-fort-of-her-quarter-of-a-century-spent-among-the-comanches-as-the-wife-of-the-war-chief-peta-nocona-and-of-her-recapture-at-the-battle-of-pease-river/ebook/product-20512578.html this is not the book, it is called something free, I am sure it is not published any more as it is real account of the capture and life of my great-something- great aunt.

      • deerinwater

        APN says:
        January 31, 2013 at 6:19 pm
        Well Karolyn, if we could get WOMEN to think with something other than their vagina’s we could make some real progress here.”

        That sounds like something a pecker head would say. About Par for you.

        You must be quite a catch, ~ no doubt the women are crawling all over you. ~ Are you from Bama or Arkansas?

  • 45caliber

    I just noticed an article where a cop in NJ committed suicide due to a woman commander insisting on sex if he expected to do any good. How do you think this might affect the military in combat as BOTH sides tend to do the same thing.

    • deerinwater

      So just how might such a set of circumstance be avoided 45? ~ Excluding women from all positions and the work place?

  • Karolyn

    You naysayers are not taking into account the fact that only women who are CAPABLE and WANT to fight will join the military. You all are of the opinion that men and women cannot be equals and cannot have platonic relaitonships, especially when their livves depend on it. Proper education is the answer.

    • Tom

      Karolyn,

      What you don’t take into account is that it isn’t about the ones that want to serve. If women want equal opportunity and access then they must be treated equally. That means that if you are 40 years old and never served and have no desire to serve you still have to go to the Post Office and sign up for the Selective Service. If women are equal then every one of them must be held to the same standard as all of the men. All of the women in the military, regardless of the job selected, will have to meet the same physical fitness standards as the men. You will not be allowed to have the advantage of a lower standard because that wouldn’t be equal. I can assure you that the overwhelming majority of women currently serving don’t want you to screw it up for them by insisting on being treated as equals. If you aren’t equal to the task then you have no business being in the position and putting others at risk.

    • John Woodbury

      If you are still convinced KK, read what happened in WWII in Nanjing (Nanking). (southern Capital) No fair saying you read all about it, you have not, I am sure. Most of looney leftist would argue the sky is red if Ben or any other conservative said it was blue.

  • deerinwater

    And you don’t say Yes Ma”am Ben.

    You say, Yes Sir. ~ That has became acceptable and preferred.

  • Chris

    I am a female, and I do not think women should be in combat because: #1, It is a known fact that men are stronger than women…….and #2, women would only be a distraction………and that can be deadly.

    • Equal sequel

      Oh, look at you. All of a sudden it gets a little uncomfortable for you and you want to throw away your equality? It’s fine, if you’re given preferential hiring because you are a “minority.” Getting the good job because you are a broad. No guilt there. I’m entitled. All of a sudden, your little leaders are giving you everything you wanted: total equality. And now you come up with excuses. Well, you wanted it, with your loud flapping mouths. File a suit on this one! In the meantime, suit up and shut up!

      • APN

        I agree, it’s time to get these big powerful feminist mouths in combat, fighting for our freedoms, just like we men have done for centuries. We are either equal or not and the females need to decide. I can assure you if duty calls and the draft is activated, there is not a male in our family that will enlist unless EVERY female in this country does the same. Who do they think they are anyway? Do they actually think they can be the great “leaders” of this land and not pay the same sacrifice in BLOOD that we do??? Pretty foolish concept, if you ask me, and only a CHILD’s mind could come up with something this foolish.

      • Penny Staffney

        Ever notice how all the big shot feminists never get upset about Sharia law & the treatment of women….they are so 2 faced. We have our equality in the west, but you guys are right they want to be superior, cake & eat it too. They are lowering the standards of our military & thus endangering our troops as well as wasting $$ for training in a MOS that many ladies will wash out of & be retrained in another.

  • Gomer Pile

    I think this, you think that. Okay, but why are they allowing Homoz and women in now? Heres my theory: Another 9/11 event, Iran, Oil and the.need for the DRAFT. How else are they, in the Milirtary Industrial Complex, going to blow up billions in overpriced toilet seats, hammers, tanks, etc., in the face of B. Hussein Soetoros coming military cuts? All the young men have been chewed up by the current “efforts,” so in order to blow up more overpriced tax dollars (materiel), we (they) are going to need fresh blood. What better place to look than to our daughters and the stool sniffers. How many “wars” have they won since WW II? Korea? Vietnam? Iraq? Afganistan? Nope. But they sure did blow up a lot of stuff. ( Heh, oil resources were supposed to pay for the Iraqi war…..What happened?) Best bit of advice: fatten up your kids now. Make ‘em huge. Disqualify them. Get them volunteering, helping our disabled vets. These people were well intended. Destroyed by complex. We, are not them.

    • Barn E Fraynk, leading from behind

      Be sure to draft the Grandchildren and children of our leaders, first. Make sure that they are required to serve on the front lines, in the infantry. Regardless of their privileged educations, make sure they serve as privates and not in command roles whatsoever. “Private Mahlia, git your useless ass over here, scumbag! Move it! Move it! 1, 2, 3, 4 who do you think we call the whxxx.”

  • Karolyn

    Way off topic, but I thought many of you might be interested in a new show on scifi called Oontinuum, about a future US with a “Corporate Congress” brought about after the corporations bail out the government after its bankruptcy and control the country.

    • APN

      Do women run it?

      LMAO!

  • Matrix

    This corrupt government is really out of control as the people sleep.

    Between the government sponsored poisoning of our youth, and creating a full generation of girly boys and wo-men, we have a reversal in hunter-gatherer roles and will pay the price in a very few years.

    Hollywood’s poisoning of women with crap like GI Jane, housewife of Moron County, Mob wives and all these freak shows telling them how strong they are, the idiots are actually falling for it, and will vote in Hillary at the end of American history to finalize the total destruction of the United States of America!

    Now our only defense of our once great nation will be at the hands of girly-boys, homosexuals and girls and it will be quite a site I’m sure, watching this next war as our forces pull hair and threaten to scratch the eyes out of the Chinese super power.

    This is the military the obamanation has created, and the America his father dreamt of.

    This is the end my friends and I hope all of you true Americans are ready for the battle of your lives!

    God Bless America and those of us who fight for her!!!!

  • http://google rose

    First of all, I never voted for any law demanding that I get treated equal in all things as a man. And as a woman.I know not to get into a fist fight with even a man of a small frame, because I would most likely lose. If I were in a jungle or out in a desert fighting for my life, I would rather have a man by my side fighting, than a woman. I bet my odds of survival would be much greater. Men tend to be more fearless than women in scarey situations and think more logically instead of emotionally. Now I know there are exceptions to every rule, but this generally true. And as far as old Hillary being so tough, I recall her bawling and crying during her questioning of Benghazi/ I have never seen a secretary of state cry like that before. I think her tears were really over her fear of being caught in a lie. I know several little gals fixin to turn 18 over the next few motnths and i can’t imagine them being stuck out on the front lines in war. Girls who get scared if a thunder storm comes in the night or are scared of the dark. Yes, men in general are more physically stronger and mentally agressive than women and more geared to be the protectors of people and lands. Now if put in the situtation where I have no choice but to fight or die,I will fight. But think about it, if you ever watch how most women fight do you really want them on the front lines?

    • Matrix

      Rose

      In all my years in this sick an demented site, have I never met a more common sense cure, other then Kate8 then the truth you have stated!

  • Michael Stroup (GySgt, USMC, Ret.)

    News flash: there are differences between men and women. You give me the next 100 male Marines out of Parris Island. You get your pick of the best 100 fighting women in the DoD. All other things being equeal, this would be the result of combat between those two forces-almost all of my Marines would clean and stow their gear then go on liberty while all of your women would be rotting corpses. Get it now?

  • Elevenarrows

    ranger09, APN, Andy, etc. Sorry for not responding to your later posts yesterday…I was busy rearing my eleven arrows. I manage my husband’s company, manage our organic farm, teach our children, manage properties for an elderly friend and try to not go insane in the process! I DO think women are very capable…in the role that God gave them. I daresay my husband would tell you he can’t manage without me. I do not feel the need to validate my worth through a twisted, confused society that thinks the best use of a woman is placing her on the front lines! My husband likes to say “I have my aces in their places.” By that he means that he has evaluated each person (on his team, in his family, etc.) and knows their strengths and weaknesses and has placed them in the place they can best serve. He, unlike feminists and our government, does not feel the need to bang his head against a brick wall or to cram a square peg in a round hole.

    As to the name, Elevenarrows…we have had 14 pregnancies and 11 live births. No, we are not Catholic. My husband delivers our babies, we strive for self sufficiency in many areas of our lives and highly recommend that mindset for the masses on government handouts. (Side note: why do we call them government handouts? They are definitely not funded by the government!)

    Children are arrows that we can shoot into the future to influence a time in history that we will not see. I want my legacy to be children that know the foundation of their faith and of their country. I want to rear children that will be responsible for their actions, that will serve other people as a way to serve their Lord. I want my children to see the dangers in the agenda of progressives and those who would seek to destroy what was once a country of refuge for the religiously oppressed. And of course, we want our children to be armed–intellectually, spiritually, and physically–to protect our freedoms.

  • John Woodbury

    I am very sorry Ben but we do not see eye to eye on this. My experience in Vietnam in 1972 and Israel in 1973 tells me you and the women of America do not want this. IDF vets are real tough guys but even they broke apart when they found young IDF females that had been “hurt” really bad before dying. Being raped by 10-12 guys or more, before having your brains blown all over the desert is not on my list of things to let females do to satisfy PC. In every war rape has been used a method of torture, yes men get it too, but they do not usually get pregnant. As for fighter pilots, that is different. Before being found one must get to the ground, many do not. Still, really Ben do you want your female relatives to die like this?

    • deerinwater

      Something to think about John for sure~ What about a woman point of view? You and I have gave ours. ~ I say, ~ if a woman want to settle the score ~ are you going to be the one that stands in her way? ~ Why she fights? ~ is hers to decide while you are saying that it’s not hers.

  • Karolyn

    The bottom line as I see it here is that there are many people who see rigid roles for men and women, and the will of the individual has no bearing. All women should be as “God” made them, have babies, stand beside her man, keep the home fires burning, etc. etc. Fact is that not everybody wants to live that way. Why should they not be afforded the opportunity to live the life they want to? Because YOU believe there is something wrong with them? Nothing is so black and white. I do not bash women who choose traditional roles. Why do so many want to bash women who do not?

    • Jana

      Karolyn,
      Since you repeated this twice, I will answer this twice.
      I realize not all women want to be wives and homemakers. I know I am talking to one. You have enjoyed your life and you have the right to live it as yo see fit.
      The truth is women are going into the military and for the most part do a wonderful job, but to force ALL women to go into combat because a few masculine type women want to and some delusioned women THINK they can, is wrong.
      I would not want my husband or my son if I had one or my family members to have to depend on a physically weak woman to try and carry them out of harms way when I know they couldn’t do it. When in battle these guys walk for miles and miles carrying 50 to 60 pound packs as well as wearing Kevlar vests that also weigh up to 50 pounds and that is not including their weapon..
      Some of the women that are mixed in with some of these troops that have to walk a lot carrying all of this plus their weapons have major hip and back problems. Sorry I don’t want that for my daughters just so some people can pretend they are tough!
      Before you go on with this you ought to try it for yourself for 1 month and see how it works for you.
      Then you will have the right to talk.

  • Jimbo

    Most women, I say “MOST” cannot defend themselves as well as a man UNLESS they have a firearm or other weapon, because they don’t have the same strength. So what’s going to happen when the ammunition is gone, or the gun is damaged, and the fighting has gone “hand to hand”? And do we really want our women to suffer capture and rape by enemy forces?

    Firearms, Sam Colt’s great equalizer!

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