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The Color Of Green

April 20, 2011 by  

The Color Of Green

“You walk in to a shoe store with $150, you walk out with one shoe." —Paul Newman speaking to Tom Cruise in the film “The Color of Money.”

Earlier this month another terrible blizzard struck in what has been one of the worst winters in memory. As snow packs finally begin to melt I can’t help but think that the environmentalists are not telling us the truth. Of course, having two terrible winters in Western Canada over the past three years can’t yield a scientific conclusion. Yet my observations may carry as much evidence as the Green’s theory that the earth is melting beneath our mukluks.

In his 2009 book Heaven and Earth: Global Warming—The Missing Science, Australian geologist Ian Plimer makes the following points:

  • There is little to no geological, archaeological or historic analysis on what is causing climate change.
  • Greenland was once a green land because of natural occurring global warming. During medieval times Earth was several degrees warmer than it is now.
  • Climate has always changed but it is not because of industrialization.
  • Atmospheric CO2 has been far higher than it is now.
  • The hockey stick graph that charts global warming as the result of manmade CO2 emissions is fraudulent.

The book concludes that the slogan, “Stop climate change”, is a public phenomenon based on widespread ignorance rather than real science. The sheer number of TV programs that go out of their way to hammer home the dangers of global warming is evidence that Plimer is on to something.

You can order this book from Amazon.com by clicking here.

President Barack Obama is staking America’s future on clean energy while ignoring these truths. A few weeks ago in a major policy address, Obama announced that America would continue to pursue green energy solutions from wind, solar, biofuels and nuclear power.

According to the President, “We cannot keep going from shock when gas prices go up to trance when gas prices go back down.”

This prompted The New York Times toconclude: “The path to energy independence—or at least an end to dependence on the Mideast—could well be dirty, expensive and politically explosive.”

What the Greens seem blind to is the fact that a shift away from fossil fuels will have huge opportunity costs for the United States at a time when the country can least afford it. The technology for clean energy does not yet exist. To embrace it when competitors like India and China do not would be economic suicide.

What the President either cannot or will not grasp is that these solutions involve huge subsidies and are cost ineffective.

Why Adam Smith Would Hate The Environmentalists
Over the past couple of years I have written to you about all the problems inherent with renewable energy. On that list is the vast amount of cropland needed to create ethanol, the inefficiency of solar energy and the lack of an infrastructure for hydrogen vehicles. In time, all of these problems can be worked out, but the best way to achieve a seamless switch is to take government out of the equation.

And while Adam Smith died more than 200 years ago, the father of economic thought would object to Obama’s energy agenda because it does not allow free markets to operate.

The invisible hand that Smith spoke of when describing how free markets create wealth was at work when oil was trading above $120 per barrel. The record purchases of hybrid cars three years ago were evidence that free markets work.

The chart below shows hybrid car sales statistics along with the price of gasoline over the past seven years. As gasoline prices have declined so too have sales of hybrid cars. That is how the free market works.

Hybrid car sales statistics, January 2004 to March 2009

As petroleum becomes less and less affordable, consumers will switch towards other types of transportation, including electric cars. This will encourage outside investment and, over time, crude oil will be displaced. This won’t happen because the Federal government mandates a changeover which is neither practical nor affordable.

Despite this fundamental truth, Obama is hell-bent on the Federal government fixing a problem (global warming) that doesn’t even exist. It seems hard to understand why, but the Las Vegas Review Journal suggested an answer. A headline in the April 4 issue read, “Green goal: End capitalism, destroy our quality of life.”

According to that newspaper:

“Those who claim to be trying to save the planet from the scourge of greenhouse gases and catastrophic global warming have a few other goals: social engineering, assaulting capitalism and assailing the American lifestyle.

“United Nations Environment Programme (UNEP) defines a green economy as one that results ‘in improved human well-being and social equity, while significantly reducing environmental risks and ecological scarcities.’ In its simplest expression, a green economy can be thought of as one which is low carbon, resource efficient and socially inclusive.

“By socially inclusive they appear to mean a leveling [SIC] of the capitalist system under a global government, with less wealth spread equally among a population of green-collar workers without social or employment mobility.”

I don’t know if Obama and his Green coalition are nefarious. But there remains one simple fact—fossil fuels still make economic sense. To claim otherwise and keep subsidies for renewable energy or pass carbon tax legislation would only serve to sell the American people a useless bill of goods.

Yours in good times and bad,

John Myers
Myers’ Energy & Gold Report

John Myers

is editor of Myers’ Energy and Gold Report. The son of C.V. Myers, the original publisher of Oilweek Magazine, John has worked with two of the world’s largest investment publishers, Phillips and Agora. He was the original editor for Outstanding Investments and has more than 20 years experience as an investment writer. John is a graduate of the University of Calgary. He has worked for Prudential Securities in Spokane, Wash., as a registered investment advisor. His office location in Calgary, Alberta, is just minutes away from the headquarters of some of the biggest players in today’s energy markets. This gives him personal access to everyone from oil CEOs to roughnecks, where he learns secrets from oil insiders he passes on to his subscribers. Plus, during his years in Spokane he cultivated a network of relationships with mining insiders in Idaho, Oregon and Washington.

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  • Jeremy Leochner

    Personally the best I can figure based on every form of science I have ever taken is that carbon when its pumped into the atmosphere combines and can act as a green house gas. I feel it certain mankind pumps alot of carbon into the atmosphere and I think it not altogether good that we do that. I feel that if the hole in the ozone is any indication and if air quality in my native state has improved over the years as my parents and grandparents tell me then I feel mankind is capable of altering our enviornment for good or bad. I figure carbon creates inbalance and produces more bizarre and unstable weather patterns like hurricanes and acid rain. Wether or not it will ultimatly result in an increase in earths temp and a flooding of earths shorelines I dont know. But I think it better to be safe than sorry in such matters. Afterall coral reefs have been shrinking and the ice caps have as well. It seems that if funding or focus could be given to renewable energy forms perhaps better methods of finding and using them could be found. And for the sack of argument I would think renewable energy to be more practical and reliable than non renewable energy. I figure the amount of fossil fuels is finite and going down as we speak. So best to start looking to replace it as soon as possible. One dosent want to run out of gas on the road one might say. For me I love capitilism and have no desire to assault it. If we can find a way to implement renwable energy without effecting it I am all for it. I simply feel renewable energy is the most practical overall plan and feel we must strive to make the transition as smooth as possible but to make that transition as soon as we can.

    • Vigilant

      Jeremy,

      Acid rain is caused by nitrogen and sulfur, not carbon.

      Moreover, as stated in the article, both carbon dioxide and temperature levels have been higher in the past than now.

      • Denniso

        Myers would do well to read some actual science before he spouts off again. More extreme snow events are part of global warming,as increased atmospheric temps allow for more moisture in the air,hence more precip in some areas and less in others. At the same time as these big snows,we are watching extreme drought in the SW w/ unprecedented fires in TX…something like 400,000 acres burned.

        Sure,let’s follow the advice of the pseudo-scientists Myers and Limbaugh,and keep doing exactly what we’ve been doing for the past couple hundred yrs…trash the atmosphere w/ any and all waste from our glutonous lifestyle and watch the entire earth’s eco system crumble right before our closed eyes. Good job, Myers,keep shilling for the energy industry so they can continue to reap their billions while the earth and all life suffer.

        • ValDM

          While all the earth suffers???????? Really?? I don’t suffer to any measurable degree And I’ll bet you don’t either. Incidentally, there are more trees now than there were 50yrs ago. Since trees use carbon dioxide to grow and then exude pure oxygen, your argument is full of hot air. (pun intended)

          • Thamera

            There goes Denniso again, no facts, just conjecture and the oh so tiresome rhetoric about anyone that doesn’t drool green hates the planet.

          • http://Illinois'17th Old Henry

            Val:

            Ever notice that initially “global warming” was causing all the extreme temps and when it was debunked that now “global warmeing” is causing all the cold / snow?

            Deniso says that the “globaal warming”, oops, “climate change” causes all the heavy snow. However, what do you need for snow? COLD WEATHER.

            I rmember in the early – mid 60s we had tremendous amounts of snow. My dad told me about the horendous winters / snow in the mid-30s.

            Follow the money. Think Albore.

          • JeffH

            Old Henry, funny you should say that. I live in an area in California where snow has been nearly non-existent. I do remember some snow in 1957 and again in 1972…haven’t had any since though. I can also remember that in the 60′s we had a lot of weather that is very similar to todays weather.

            I’m all for everyone doing their part to keep the environment clean, like I’m sure most of us do, but I’m not supporting the environmental extremists or the UN’s phony green agenda’s(see Agenda 21) which was created to put our greenbacks in the “One Worlder’s” pockets.
            http://green-agenda.com/agenda21.html

            So I say to all of you environmental “extremists” out there…wise up and stop being played like a 5 string banjo. There is a much easier way to continue keeping the environment clean and creating alternate energy sources and it can’t be done economically through government “force”. Let the free market work utilizelise the oil resources within our boundaries…in my opinion the only way to satisfy our quest to economically create cleaner energy and a cleaner environment. I do think most of us would be more than satisfied if we could remove the “secret agendas” and the “extremists” from the equation.

          • Denniso

            Joe is ‘all for taking care of the environment’,yet he must think that it’s perfectly OK to continually pour billions of tons of greenhouse gases into the atmosphere. I guess Joe doesn’t know that the atmosphere is a part of ‘the environment’. Read some real books Joe…

          • JeffH

            denisso addresser his/her comment to Joe. Who the hell are you talking to…those little demons dancing on your shoulders or the ones ravaging your brain?

        • http://Illinois'17th Old Henry

          Your thoughts are just another example of man’s high opinion of himself thinking that he can control / change something as large and diverse as our planet.

          The climate has been chaning for the ten or 12 thousand years that the earth has been in existence as we know it today and it will continue to do so = with, or without man.

          The earth is not going anywhere due to man. If it ceases to exist it will be due to God Almighty.

          Watch the greenies and follow the money. Think Albore…

          • Augie D

            Henry, The earth is simply much more older than you. Try billions of years. Christian fundamentalism cannot explain the earth and sun, stars, galaxies, the entire universe as 10 to 12 thousand years. It takes light 100,000 years to cross the Milky-way. If you are seeing a star within the Milky-way, it took an average of 50,000 years to get to you. I will agree with you in part, Man has only been on earth for around 7,000 years. Man’s history is very well documented by ancient writings. He was never a stooped over, grunting animal, as some would believe.

            Back to global warming: The earth cycles around the sun in one year intervals. But it wobbles around the sun like a spinning top. It takes 20,000 years to arrive at the same location point around the sun. The Egyptians figured that out while building the Giza pyramids. 20,000 cycles that put the earth in different locations around the sun every year. That would surely give slight angle changes to effect our weather. Add the more frequent forest fires that spews out tons of Co2, volcanoes (above and undersea)plus many other sources of hot house gasses. Man has only kept an accurate weather record for little more than a hundred years. No where near enough to compare with the billions of years that the earth has been around.

            Yes, Al Bore has more to do with global warming. Not as an ecological warning, but an opportunity to capitalize on fear, and unscientific pandering to the masses. Check out the Club of Rome, and their agenda. And don’t bother with the official website. Look beyond!

          • independant thinker

            Augie D……….If you will re-read his statement he did not say the earth was only 10-12 thousand years old he said that is how long it has existed AS WE KNOW IT TODAY.

        • Bob from Calif.

          Hello Denisso,

          It sounds to me that you like most other environmentalist Greenies are are drawing all of you conclusions from emotion and believing fraudulent facts just because someone famous like Al Gore says so. Al gore has an agenda, and that is to make Al gore richer. I have a degree in Environmental Biology. What is your degree in? You should know that when one area is receiving vast amounts of rain, that another area of the world is usually suffering from droughts. Thats the way the Earths systems work. As for your increased atmospheric temps, that is completely fraudulent. As a matter of fact, the Earth is cooling. If you look at the research from the ice cores taken from antarctica you would see that the Earths cycle is going into the next ice age, not Global Warming. This whole Global Warming scam is being used by elitists to enslave you. Did you know that mankind only contributes less than 1% of greenhouse gasses. Hardly enough to even worry about. There is also something called the carbon cycle. This cycle is necessary for all forms of life on the planet. There are feedback loops on the Earth that compensates for high levels of CO2. Any fluctuations you are seeing are natural cycles. Scientists still don’t have all the facts locked down yet, but they are getting closer all the time. All this Global warming nonsense is hogwash. You should be a little more worried about the upcoming solar maximum, and the fluctuations in the Earths magnetic field that are presently occurring. Don’t get me wrong, I love the environment and want to protect it. But protecting it to the point that mankind suffers is wrong. There is a way to use the Earths’ resources responsibly and protect the environment at the same time. That’s what we should be doing instead of using fraudulent facts and fear to achieve our goals. Stop worrying so much there is new technology being discovered every day that will carry us into the future, such as cold fusion and Zero Point energy.

          • http://FarTooMuch.Info Russ Lemon

            To say that humans contribute less then 1% of the green house gasses is technically correct as long as you include the number one green house gas – water vapor. Actually, power plants and vehicles contribute about 6% of the total CO2 emitted into our atmosphere. The major effect of increased atmospheric CO2 is an increase in the rate of plant growth. And that includes food crops. It also assumes an adequate supply of water, minerals and sun.

          • Warlord X

            Rob, thanks for an explanation even these unappreciated libtards should understand. But facts aren’t their forte’; feelings are.

        • Johnny

          Wow, someone who actually believes in the global warming dribble. We may as human beings have some very slight effect on the heating and cooling of the earths atmosphere but for the most part it is purely cyclical. The global warming agenda is just another way for certain people to control the U.S. and our economy. Do you really believe this junk or are you just trying to make folks sick?

        • Flynn

          Dinniso,

          If you want to understand global climate change, then you must factor in changes that occur cosmologically, not just globally. The last three years have been cooler because the great Pacific sea is cooler. The Pacific is cooler because our great nuclear reactor in the cosmos has been in a solar minimum since 2008. When the sun is in a solar minimum, the Pacific (and the earth) absorbs less energy from the sun; therefore, it cools. North American weather is dominated by the Pacific Ocean; therefore, when it is cooler, our weather is colder. Now that the sun is entering a more active phase, we can look forward to warmer winters, hotter and drier summers as well as more active hurricane (Typhoon) seasons. Changes in the weather and climate has very little to do with billions of cars burning nonrenewable fossil fuel.

        • DaveH

          You’re not talking about “actual science”, Denniso. You are talking about conjecture and Liberal talking points. I doubt you know much of anything about the “actual science” of Homogenic Global Warming. If you did, you would know that it is a hoax.
          For instance, what are the Global Warming predictions based on?

        • blackmark48

          This is more of a response to several of the comments rather than just to Denniso. One comment there just got to me.

          An increase in the number of wildland fires and acres burned in one state isn’t much of an argument for global warming. There are only two ecosystems in the continental United States that are not either fire tolerant or fire dependent (ie fire generated). Those two ecosystems are the Sonoran Desert, and 3 temperate rain forests on the west side of the Olympic Peninsula, in Washington state. (The Quinault, the Queets-Clearwater and the Ho. Each river 20 miles apart)(and in real dry years with major wind events, they can burn). All of the other ecosystems in the continental US require periodic fire for ecosystem health.

          Those ecosystems are stressed and out of whack because we have been practicing almost total fire exclusion via suppression in this country since 1910. Pretty much had to, to protect life and property. Not so much in the early years, but definitely at this point in time. In the areas where fire could be allowed to burn, politics and smoke into populated areas rapidly becomes a major issue, and suppression is usually the result. At great expense to the taxpayer.

          Ecosystems build up dead dry fuels over the years. Periodic fire removes them. Ecosystems are dynamic, not static. They change. Spruce ecosystems get old and decadent at about age 200. Pine ecosystems vary. Some younger, some older. In a weakened state they get attacked by outbreaks of mountain pine beetle, spruce bark beetle, etc. Most spruce ecosystems in the US get taken out by fire on an average of every 200 year. That’s about the time they reach old age. Most Lodgepole pine systems can’t regenerate themselves without fire. (Yellowstone NP, 1988) When they get old and decadent, they get taken out by fire, and new lodgepole pine systems start up again from the ashes.

          West of the Missippi River has roughly 20 year drouth cycles followed by 10-15 year wet cycles. The sun has 7 and 14 year sunspot cycles, the magnitude of which is greatest during the 14th year. Sunspots cause electrcal storms on the surface of the earth. Electrical storms cause lightning. Lightning causes fires. (at least those that aren’t caused by humans at the wrong time and place).

          Learned that at fire school in 1967. Was amazed to read in the news in the mid 90′s that scientists had finally determined that the sun has 7 and 14 year sun spot cycles that cause electrical storms on the surface of the earth.

          The Wenatchee NF in Washington was practically burned over in its entirety in 1970. It was an asbestos forest for the next 20 years, when it started to have large fires again. Took a while to build up enough dead and downed fuels to generate large fires again.

          It wasn’t until the last 20 years that scientists identified and determined some of the effects of the El Nino and La Nina currents on the west coast of the US, which pretty much determine how much moisture makes it inland.

          Are we going through global warming? Yes, of course we are. We had 4 major world glaciations in a row, and we haven’t entirely come out of the last one. We have been going through global warming, with the exception of the Little Ice Age between 1200-1850, for at least the last 10,000-12,500 years. (1,200 AD, just about the time the Anasazi moved out of the 4 corners area in the Southwest)

          The Sphinx, next to the great pyramid at Cheops, was estimated to have been built 10,000-12,500 years ago. It is tremendously eroded, consistent with erosion patterns from water, not wind and sand.

          Has it been warmer and drier before? In the Pleistocene, western Washington had a northern California ecosysten all the way up into the southern third of British Columbia. Remainders of that ecosystem can be seen on the East side of the Olympic Peninsula in Washington state. It’s in a rain shadow of the Olympic mountain range and gets only 13 inches of rain a year. The west side of that range gets 12-14 feet of annual rainfal.

          Global warming is a fact. But it’s a natural fact. It’s a long term description of combinations of numerous long term natural cycles on this planet, (some which likely haven’t even been determined yet), that far exceed the lifetimes of of one, two or three generations of humans.

          If a person has been in one place all their life and never seen “this” before, it doesn’t really mean much in the context of local change, let alone global change.

          Humans aren’t the cause of global warming. Our actions contribute to speeding the current process up. There will be changes in ocean currents, wind patterns, rainfall, etc. Most likely we will eventually go through another ice age. All natural cycles over long period of time.

          For what it’s worth, I went to college to become an archaeologist, and spent 34 years in wildland fire suppresssion and prescribed burning. It was much more exciting. I’m no expert on either. I doubt that there is anyone who really is. We all just have a small nitche of knowledge.

          Why anyone would trust what any politician says is beyond me. They will say and do whatever it takes for them to stay elected. Fear tactics is one of their major tools of rhetoric.

          Our politicians got us where we are today. And we got where we are today by not paying attention, and letting them.

          • Denniso

            Some of the rightwing deniers of climate change say we are experiencing a natural warming now,others say we are actually cooling. You can’t have it both ways and also be in denial of the science.

            Some say that the climate scientists are not doing real science…I wonder what it is then? Ice cores,tree rings,ocean temps,atmospheric sampling,is that magic or astrology or religion?

            Other deniers say that we only affect greenhouse gas in the atmosphere by 1%….that’s wrong,but even if it were that small an addition to the natural emissions it would still have an effect over time. If you add any appreciable greenhouse gases to what ocurrs naturally then the balance can be tipped toward a level that is detrimental to the planet.

            Some say that they love the environment but we shouldn’t hurt humans in order to protect it…sounds a bit selfish of humans to me. Beyond that,we don’t have to harm humans or our lifestyle to care for the environment and planet. Why can’t we essentially live the same as always if we do something like increase gas mileage standards for autos? Does our lifestyle dictate that we be allowed to drive any size car/truck that may get only 15 mpg? How does it wreck our lives if we have more renewable energy sources? Why are you willing to subsidize oil and nuclear w/ hundreds of billions and then demand that solar and wind compete on their own?

            Someone above wondered what degree I have…engineering w/ a minor in econ. Work in engineering,construction and architecture.

          • DaveH

            All of those mentioned measurements, except atmospheric measurements, are roughly approximate. And even the atmospheric measurements are flawed because at the time of the purported rising in temperatures the Russians were in the midst of economic meltdown, so they weren’t maintaining the measurement stations in Siberia. Thus a whole lot of cold temperature data went missing.
            By the way, you haven’t answered my question. It’s because you just don’t have a clue, isn’t it Denniso? If you read some books about Global Warming “Science”, you would know the answer.

          • Denniso

            They are not just predictions. We are seeing actual evidence for warming and it correlates w/ higher CO2 levels in both the atmosphere and oceans. Glaciers are in fact melting at faster rates than in the recent past.

            You claim a degree in science,yet you think most of the climate scientists around the world are involved in a hoax,and why would they be supporting a hoax after all these yrs? You think it’s for money and control,which is absurd and doesn’t show much respect for thousands of scientists….maybe the problem is that you never worked in science so you don’t understand that the vast majority of scientists work for the love of it and not for piles of money. Your theory would be closer to truth if you were talking about bankers,wall street,big industry,oil companies,Donald Trump,Limbaugh and almost all other professions…not scientists.

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            Study your history denniso. Temperatures are cyclical. We are not warming. Do not believe Al Gore

          • libertytrain

            blackmark48 – excellent post. Been reading about the need/requirement for the fires for decades and decades now. All of your post was great info.

          • Denniso

            Of course fire is part of the natural systems…any person who can think at all knows that,but when we get unprecedented fires,heat and drought it can’t just be written off as ‘normal’.

            Even if all we were doing is ‘speeding up the current warming process’,that’s hardly benign. Humans don’t live and exist in geologic time. If we speed up something like warming so that it affects us in the short term,not to mention the living eco systems,we and our economic system will have a very hard and expensive time trying to deal w/ it. If a warming or cooling cycle takes thousands of yrs to happen,that’s manageable,as opposed to major changes ocurring in 20 or 30 yrs…much more difficult and dislocating to us and all earthly systems. That’s what happened to the dinosaurs,too sudden a change.

          • Warlord X

            It is explanations and life experience such as this that keeps me interested in reading these articles. Thanks.

          • Denniso

            If you mean me,then you’re welcome.

          • Patty

            Denniso-Why did the word narcissist pop into my head as soon as I read, “If you mean me,then you’re welcome.”

          • Denniso

            You don’t understand when someone is being facetious? This warlord guy is just another rightwing kook who has the need to use juvenile name calling.

        • http://McDsPlace@facebook.com RMcDinGa

          To listen to some of the opponents of CO2 gases, or greenhouse gases is like listening to the guy on this TV ad marketing a bracelet that claims to “Create Balance in Your Daily Activities”! How can educated individuals actually buy into this sham? To create a society that is less capitalist and more socialist requires taking a coomodity necessary, consumed, and has significant profitable potential in a free market society. Environmentalists have found the one important commodity used world wide, is in continual high demand, and creates wealth for large corporations in the modern era. Obviously oil as well as many other natural resources used to create energy was deemed the perfect target! In 1972 the UN began a long term study of how to better “serve” the global community. Maurice Strong, a successful Canadian investor in petroleum based commodities, was hired to take on a “study of the specific areas globally which were inhibitors of the UN’s capability to control” future difficulties. The study used “Population Growth and Poverty” as its foundation. As a result this study evolved into what became “The Kyoto Protocol”, which served to limit “Greenhouse Gases”!
          Al Gore has made a fortune telling people L.A. and Manhattan would be under water from all the “Glacier Meltings” from Global Warming, yet he just recently purchased a multi-million dollar mansion right on the coastal areas he denegrated. Obama served as the top dog of the Chicago based CCCI, a Climate control entity seeking legislation selling industry allowances for certain amounts of carbon gases, also known as “Cap & Trade”! The entire scam has Money at its core along with more and more Government Control and the decrease and eventual elimination of a Free Market Society!
          God controls climate, The United States of America is a Constitutional Republic built upon Divine Providence! Obama was allowed this one term as President in order to awaken
          the American people. The 2009 Executive Order issued by Barack Obama, written by Cass Susstein, was created for environmental control for the purpose of imposing a more socialist agenda without, necessarily, violating our constitution! Remember all the birds that kept dying by the thousands a few months ago? The reason: Gigantic, extremely sharp blades on Windmills!
          Try using a little common sense and study some material on metereological science, human nature and greed, survival of the fittest through territorial manipulation, and search the web for info on Maurice Strong, The Secret Jekyl Island Summits during Wilson’s Presidency, and talk to Seniors over 60! Stop being so gullible! For some thought, how did a man overseeing three wars receive The Nobel Peace Prize? RMcDinGa

          • denniso

            ‘God controls the climate’? That’s such a nice and tidy belief to hold onto,w/ of course no evidence at all,so you don’t have to be concerned about any aspects of the planet’s health do you. For that matter,why would you and people like you be concerned about anything at all,since I guess your God controls essentially everything. Why worry about the debt,or who’s president,or war and peace? Your all powerful God is in control of everything so it is all going according to his plan,isn’t it?

            I imagine that most climate change deniers are believers like you,and so it would follow that they also have no worry because God’s in control…why don’t most of them come right out and say it? Afraid of looking like wackos?

          • Patty

            Denniso-Why worry about the debt,or who’s president,or war and peace? Your all powerful God is in control of everything so it is all going according to his plan,isn’t it? These are man made catastrophes, not natural.

          • Denniso

            So the Christian god only controls ‘natural’ events? Anything connected to man is out of his purview?? Some all powerful god you’ve got there…

        • BCohio

          The hardest thing for all LIBERAL SOCIALIST to do in life, is to admit they were WRONG about anything!..one more thing is that you BIG AL!????…

        • Mike

          Denniso, See the comments below about you…They are not smart enough to connect the dots…Thats what they have Lumbauh to do it for them.

          I hope these half wits (Ditto Heads) forget to vote!!

      • Jeremy Leochner

        Got me there vigilant. However if im not mistaken we also pump or release sulfur as well. As to carbon amounts yes your right. I just figure we have some control and since the levels appear to be going up again we should try to do something about it.

      • Roy Major

        All the more reason to change over to clean and safe energy. The new capitalist of the future will be those who change over to the clean energy economy.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      Jeremy, it has been proven, and even admitted to by the green house gas nazi’s, that the majority of green house gases emitted, are caused by the evaporation of the oceans. I would call that a natural thing. I suppose we could tarp the oceans to hold them in, and maybe that would make the greenies happy. But I doubt it. You see, if they dont promote “green strife”, they dont have a job. Kind of like Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton. If they dont promote racial strife, they dont have a job. Its a scam. Get the picture? Just like cancer. They have a cure. You know they have a cure. But too many people are making a living fighting it, so you wont see the cure. Understand.

      • Vigilant

        “Jeremy, it has been proven, and even admitted to by the green house gas nazi’s, that the majority of green house gases emitted, are caused by the evaporation of the oceans.”

        I’m afraid I’ll have to challenge that. Evaporation of water, salt or otherwise, creates one thing: water vaper, and little of anything else. It’s the principle of distillation.

        Evaporation/distillation does not produce methane, CO2, or airborne particulates.

        • patrick H.T. paine

          “To conquer, first divide.”

          The ocean’s, are a major CO2 absorber, a natural cycle driven by
          currents……absorbing at the polls, releasing at the equator.
          The warmer the ocean’s become, the less ability they have to absorb
          the excess……ocean temps are a major indicator of warming, and
          climate change.

          You all can continue to deny the science all you want….and even if
          we ceased all man made CO2 emissions TODAY, climate change is locked
          in for the next twenty to thirty years……and since we are not going to do this…….your future will be quite interesting indeed.

          There was a gentleman named Thomas Malthus, who offered a prediction
          regarding the world’s population and the planet’s ability to sustain it…….of course when he did so, the population was relatively
          small, less than 1 billion …..we are now approaching 7 billion, or
          have exceeded it.

          Malthus will be proved right, and so will climate change, with the
          single exception that the latter, will happen far more quickly, and
          there is a nasty little fact that is NOT mentioned regarding, CO2
          and that is it’s percentage of the atmosphere. When it hits .006 the effects are irreversible: game over.

          Of course, most of us will be dead by then, but your great grand chidren won’t be…..

          Given the mind set of most of the people who frequent this site, as
          well as the current state of our government and the corrupt nature
          of the political machine…….as well as the general idea that this
          is all being controlled by an elite cabal, what should concern you
          is the “solution” to the “reality”, of climate change and Malthusian
          Theory, whose effects are already being felt.

          You see, there is a solution…..but I doubt it is one that most of
          the world’s inhabitants would favor, because it wouldn’t include them,
          and as the number creeps closer to .006, those who have the means
          to affect it, will certainly consider doing so.

          P.S. There are “other green house gases”, which are also in play,
          among these, methane…….which will come into play……and
          whose effects are far stronger, than CO2……the only bright side here is that, these effects will naturally disapate, in 20 years.

          “Do not ask for whom the bell tolls……….”

        • Bob from Calif.

          Hey vigilant,
          Water vapor is considered a greenhouse gas. As a matter of fact, it constitutes the largest portion of the greenhouse gasses. Do a little research will ya.

          • Vigilant

            Hey Bob,

            Jeremy’s statement was “the majority of green house gases emitted…” Do you, in your lack of reading comprehension, overlook the letter “s” when it indicates a plural noun?

            ONE gas, water vapor, is created. While indeed a greenhouse gas, it is THE gas that keeps this earth a liveable place for human beings.

            Had you an ounce of sense, you’d understand that the envirowackos aren’t interested in the level of water vapor in the atmosphere, as water vapor levels are not affected by human activity.

            Have a little common sense will ya.

          • DaveH

            Vigilant,
            He said “the majority of green house gases”. How else would he say it to be more correct? Majority implies more than one. To say the majority of greenhouse gas would not be proper english. I kind of suspect you are grasping for straws. Suck it up. It was a misguided attack in the first place.

        • DaveH

          Vigilant,
          I’m afraid you are wrong there. He said the “majority of greenhouse gases”. Water vapor is the majority of the Greenhouse Gases by far. See here:
          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greenhouse_gas#Greenhouse_effects_in_Earth.27s_atmosphere

          • Vigilant

            DaveH says, “I’m afraid you are wrong there. He said the “majority of greenhouse gases”. Water vapor is the majority of the Greenhouse Gases by far.”

            Dave, it’s a matter of English. The word “majority” in common usage is never used to describe a relative volume of material. Majority applies to discrete numbers. The correct usage was shown by Bob when he said, “it constitutes the largest portion of the greenhouse gases.

            My irritation with Bob was simply that he was chasing a red herring. Water vapor is not only innocuous, we wouldn’t survive without it.

          • DaveH

            It was Beberoni who made the statement, Vigilant. And I do have a very good grasp of English. A majority is the subset of the total number of objects in a set whose numbers are greater than the subset of remaining objects in the set.
            What Beberoni said does seem not quite right, but then the English language is not perfect. My main point was that it was a trivial pursuit on your part to correct him. For him to have been more precise would have involved much more verbage.

          • Vigilant

            DaveH,

            Point taken, old friend. I’m duly chastised. (:-)

            I tend to get anal about English, as my father often told me to use precision in communicating. Too often a point is missed because someone reads something into, or infers something not intended, in the words we speak and write.

          • DaveH

            Just so you know, I like both of you.

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          I have seen it reported over and over, that the majority of green house gases are cause by ocean evaporations. I have even seen reports where they brought this to the greenies, and they said so also, so I dont know what to tell you.

    • http://none Floyd Hardee

      I agree with Jeremy and Vigilant to a certain degree. There is global warming. We do have changes in temperature due to temporay climatic shifts. Ice packs are slowly melting for whatever reason. The over all temperature in NC has been warming. My father knew a doctor who rode his horse and buggy down the middle of Tar River. I saw much more snow when I was growing up than I do now. Rivers that use to have a great abundance of fish now are closed to fishing for Herring. From industrial pollution you not only get carbon dioxide but acid rain and there are many other chemicals spewing up into the atmosphere as well. We do need our fossil fuels, but we also need regulations for drilling for them, and for using them in order to keep our air and waterways clean. We need to reestablish green vegetative borders along our water ways for many different reasons. They form a wind barrier, they filter both the air and the rains that fall. They convert carbon dioxide into oxygen and also filter out many poisons through their leaves. If we allow developers to continue cutting our forest down we are going to have a lot more pollution. If we allow so called land developers to concrete over our farms we are going to have more reflected heat and a lot less cooling effect from the crops grown there. There is also going to be food shortages and eventually a devastating famine in the land! Everybody who believes there is global warming, or there is pollution is not a left wing nut case. I am very conservative, but I like to look at both sides of an issue before leaping to an erroneous conclusion. We need to do that with both the Democrats and the Republicans. They both have some good points and they both have a lot of bad points and that is an undeniable fact. May your day be filled with sunshine, and may your air be breathable, your friend, Words Hardee.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        Thank you for a good thought out post. I try not to label all as one, but sometimes I do, when I see so many on the left, just tell out and out lies to forward their agenda. Many of Al Gore’s so called scientists have now stated that they basically faked all their so called evidence. And from the reports Ive seen and read from actual geological scientists, they say just the opposite of what Im seeing environmentalists show on the history channel and other networks. They are saying that the ice caps are growing bigger than ever, and that they are so large that pieces of them break off over time because they cant carry their own weight, and that its a natural thing. They have also said, and proven more than once, that these “melting” videos the green meanies keep showing, are places in the spring that naturally melt each year, but the left presents it as global warming melting the polar ice caps, and the video’s they show are from somewhere else. I believe, and history proves it to be correct, that temperatures are cylclical, always going up and down, and have since forever. I know here in Indiana, its been cold all spring so far, where as two or three years ago, we didnt even have a spring, it went straight from winter to 85 degrees in a week or two, and it was a hot summer. But when I look at years gone past, I see warm years, and I see colder years, and in all actuality, what Ive seen and what Ive heard from these geological scientists, is that the earth has actually cooled since the 70′s. And when youve got guys like Al Gore, in bed with GE and a few others, who stood to make billions of dollars if they got everyone scared enough and hyped up enough to buy into what they were selling, well then youve got someone pushing an agenda, and not the truth. But as I compare temperatures these last 10 years, with the 10 previous, and the 10 before that, and the 10 before that, I see nothing at all out of the obvious, to indicate in the least, anything at all resembling global warming. So I find that those who buy into it, are blindly led by TV and newspapers, who are directly influenced by the left wing liberals in bed with the environmentalists, and I dont fall un-educatedly for things like that, or for that matter, for a guy who buys millions of dollars of add’s yelling change, change, change. I dont get swayed by what I read or see on TV. I choose to look into things, and explore all avenues before I make a decision, not blindly following someone because “they said so”. And I love the environment. I am an avid hiker and fisherman. I take care of the outdoors. I do not litter, and I pick up crap others throw on the ground when Im out and put it into its proper place. I drive a fuel efficient vehicle, and put a 97 percent efficient furnace and AC unit in my home. I love the outdoors, and do what I can to protect it. Put I dont believe in driving a spike into a tree that a logger is cutting down, making the chain come off and cut his arm off. That logic is insanity. I dont burn down SUV dealerships because they sell cars that pollute, yet the burning down of these released more pollutants into the atmosphere than these vehicles could have in their lifetime. These left wing liberal enviro’s are insane, and do stupid things like this, in an attempt to further their agenda, and all it does is make it so no one will take them serious, because its lying and cheating when they do this, and it is putting their foot in their mouth. You want to help green meanies, hike the trails I hike, and pick up the trash along the way. Be productive, and quit pushing your agenda at all costs. Its all wrong. I love the outdoors, and I dont damage it, I enjoy it and take care of it. And truthfully, I see no evidence of global warming. I see the lying video’s they produce, and a spring time natural melt is not the ice caps melting. Sorry, Im not falling for that.

      • Bob G

        Floyd, Stick to something simple like checkers.

        • Cawmun Cents

          Better yet Floyd,Just get your Jack-bootsTM on and goose step out to your Chevy VoltTM,glide on over to the global marketTM and scan you some Soylent Green TeaTM,the chosen drink of professional progressivesTM.A fter all…green is the new red.See you there citizen!

      • Robert Moore

        Inconvienient fact. Solar system, Mars etc., experiencing warming trends due to sunspot cycle. Volcanism contributes more co2 than ALL combined. Cathalates, frozen methane in far north has enough energy to power civilization megayears; or kill it if released suddenly. One meteor away from global death. The whole Green thing is about power and control, and making money. If ALL industry was on the Moon,and the earth a virtual park, the weather would still be changing. If we spent our money on Dome homes (super insulated) the twister would blow over them and not blow them away. Shelter in place against terror of bio attack, nature,energy conservation, less trees used for lumber etc. Put roofers out of work wouldn’t it. So much for logic.

      • Bob from Calif.

        Here is a little fact that should comfort some of you. Between 85% to 90% of Earth’s oxygen comes from the Phytoplankton in the ocean. If you want to keep breathing protect the Oceans.

    • Conservative at Birth

      What science are you talking about? Are you aware of the Suns affect on our temperature on earth? When the atmosphere heats up it creates higher levels of CO2. This is a fact. During the increased temperature caused by the Suns activity CO2 increased in the atmospere. Or, are you actually talking about social science?

      • Al Sieber

        I agree, the sun is the main controlling factor of our weather, not man.

      • Jeremy Leochner

        No conservative. Im simply saying when carbon goes into the atmosphere it becomes a green house gas. Yes increased heating can produce more but we produce it as well. Lets at least try and control what we can control-ourselves and the amount we put out.

    • NC1

      Jeremy, have you no memory?! What about your parents and grandparents, do they? When I was growing up, as recently as 20 years ago, the ENTIRE scientific community was all in a dither because the ice caps were GROWING! All of those same idiots who now are crying about “Global Warming” (Oh, dear, we’re all going to melt and fry… boo hoo) were all crying about the next Ice Age, which was all too quickly approaching if we didn’t do something about it! And it was tied to the same things: fossil fuels, industrialization, the cutting down of rain forests, conservation, the list goes on.
      The fact is, the earth, because of the way God hung it in the universe, goes through natural periods of warming and cooling. Our direct impact on this great terrestrial ball is not nearly as great as we’d like to think it is. We’are not THAT good. Although we are to take care of what God has entrusted to us, the idea that we shouldn’t use the resources that He has provided is assinine, at best!
      Renewable energy sources seems like an inteligent solution on paper, but until the FREE MARKET has a chance to make them economical, let’s just use what we have, or could get at (offshore drilling) if that nut in the Oval Office would stop blocking it.

      • Jeremy Leochner

        NC1 My point in refering to my parents and grandparents is that they describe to me in detail the deplorable condition of our air not 40 years ago. They describe smog every day and having a hard time being outside from the lack of breathable air. And this is in the same area we live now. It seems since then laws have been passed to help regulate pollution and clean up the air so to speak. I figure if its possible to do that its possible to have a great effect on the enviornment good or bad.

        • DaveH

          Poisonous pollutants were a very real issue, Jeremy. You’re mixing apples and oranges. Carbon Dioxide is not a poisonous gas except in much higher than normal concentrations. Normal air contains about .04%. It doesn’t start causing problems until it reaches close to 1%. Note that level is 25 times the concentration in normal air.

    • Bob G

      No…you don’t know much about Science jeremy.

    • Lewis Munn

      I wish to point out Nature has shown us something, over and over. BIG volcanic eruptions cause global cooliung! Dust in the upper atmosphere intercepts and reflects the heat from the sun. WW2 also showed us so much effect from industrial smoke flattening the global warming curve in the ’50′s, there was some panic that a new ice age was starting. It is in the literature!

      Then all the agencies jumped on the “pollution”, cleaning it up, and the global temperature with clear air rose twice as fast as before!! It is in the records and on the graphs. A couple years ago, we caught up and passed the rate of rise from the curve pre-WW2 Industry.

      Also, remember the scare on Nuclear winter? For the same reason the dust raised by an all out nuclear war would interce3pt the radiation from the sun putting the whole earth into a permafrost.

      We are fighting ourselves when we make the air pristine and then worry about excessive heating!

      And the fight against “greenhouse gases” seems to do very very little Except cost lots of money, and put dangerous chemicals into the environment.

      And it is based on scientists who cannot get their computers to show history, yet, and who fudge the data to fit what they want to show.

      History tells us that when the climate is warm, living is easier, just like the song, and people are more creative and less stressed.

      And so far, science cannot explain the low temps in the 1700′s, when the sunspots quit for a while. And reasons why those two things happened together? Or is it an inconvenient truth the fat-cat politicians wish we’d forget about? Sun is really active now…does the sun have any effect on the global temperature?

      When we gonna learn? Not when our politicians and industries can get rich off our panic! And stir up more, and enjoy expensive vacation meetings where it is warm!

    • DaveH

      Damn, Jeremy, you are a fountain of Liberal Propaganda, aren’t you? You embrace their ideology so readily, yet you show no signs whatever of having read anything to counter the propaganda. Read the book that John suggested. Read the books written by Chris Horner which explain the fact that Global Warming is just a political football promoted by Big Government lovers. Most of the Environmental “Science” is just alarmism with the true purpose of aiding Crony Capitalists in their attempts to soak up more of our money while stifling their competition with the force of Government.
      And what Ozone hole? We were supposed to have cured that problem when Big Government banned Freon. Never mind that coincidentally DuPont’s patent for Freon was running out at the time of the supposed Ozone Crisis.
      Jeremy, you are just too “naive” for me to believe that you are really that clueless. My bet is that you know full well that you are spreading Propaganda.

      • Jeremy Leochner

        Dave my views are just as valid and genuine as yours. My views are based on honest belief in what I say. Perhaps I am “clueless” as you put it in that I have heard many arguments for and against global warming and have formed my opinions accordingly. I believe the basic sciene of carbon becoming greenhouse gas is a fact recognized by anyone regardless of their beliefs. And I believe it a fact that man pumps much carbon into the atmosphere. Finally I believe it a fact that fossil fuels are finite and that eventually we will have no choice but to switch to some other form. I figure do it quick and get it over with as one would respond to an unwanted doctors or dental appointment. As to the ozone hole. It is in the past and is healing. I used it as an example of mans ability to do damage to the overall enviornment but to do something to repair the damage. The hole wasen’t a lie and it wasn’t big government propoganda. With respect Dave it may be either in your eyes im a liar or im an idiot or im crazy. I assure you Dave I am not a liar. I believe what I believe based on many arguments with many people who both agree and disagree with me. I have formed my opinions based on that. I listen to opposing arguments and I honestly try to recgnize something I did not or do not know when its presented too me. But I still believe what I believe and like all people there is a certain point where one still holds on to what they believe. I still try to be as open minded as possible and perhaps if we met face to face and argued it would be easier to admit when I cant counter something. But for now I believe what I say. I am not spreading propoganda. I am saying what I personally believe. Think it what you will.

        • Carlucci

          Jeremy, it is obvious that you are only listening to one side of the “issue”. I heard a scientist/climate expert on the radio a few weeks ago saying that global warming is a hoax. The earth is covered with trees and plants that clean the air all the time; much like the ocean is full of plants and animals that continuously clean the water. You can keep the air clean in your home with live house plants. This scientist said without plant life, the air and water would be a problem, but it is all about balance in the eco system and always has been.

          I believe the earth is divinely created, and as such, has a built in cleaning system.

          Remember, your mind is like a parachute. It works best when opened.

          • Jeremy Leochner

            I can respect that Carlucci. My only concern is that there is alot of deforestation happening. That could upset the balance. I dont feel the worst case senario of global warming leading to floods and ice ages or the devestation of our planet are valid. However I do believe man is capable of affecting whats around him. Bear in mind we can pollute the ocean and cut down trees. An open is a wonderous thing and I try to have it as often as possible. I do listen to people of different views and at times I have changed my views accordingly.

          • DaveH

            There are more trees now in our country than ever before, Jeremy, thanks to homeowners and others planting trees where they didn’t exist before.
            Did you know that a Greenhouse Gas that is as prevalent as Carbon Dioxide is Methane? Did you know that trees give off Methane?

          • Carlucci

            Jeremy, in all fairness, you have a point about the de-forestation of the rain forests. I find that very worrisome, too, mostly because it upsets the eco system and habitats of all the wonderful animals that live in those forests.

          • DaveH

            Maybe, Carlucci, but that is Brazil’s business, not ours.

          • karolyn

            Carlucci – Not to mention all the as yet undiscovered plants that could lead to curing diseases. And to Dave – It IS our problem. It effects the whole world.

          • karolyn

            Did Jeremy not say that he investigates both sides and then comes up with his own belief? Why does everybody think that investigating both sides would mean only coming up with the answer YOU believe to be true?

          • Carlucci

            DaveH – I still have to agree with Jeremy about the deforestation of the world’s rainforests. Karolyn made an excellent point about the plants and herbs that can heal that grow only in the rainforests all over the world Graviola is just one of those healing plants that comes from a tree found only in the Brazilian rainforest. It put a dear friend of mine in remission from pancreatic cancer, which is usually a quick killing cancer.

          • DaveH

            A much greater danger to the “whole world”, Karolyn, is you Liberals who are hell-bent on impoverishing us all.
            If there are indeed herbs that are going to save mankind, you can bet Free Marketeers will be busily propagating them for profit. What we are talking about is not saving the World, but messing with other countries’ choices.
            And, Carlucci, I am surprised that you would want to be part and parcel of that.

          • Carlucci

            DaveH “part and parcel” of what? I am not following you.

          • DaveH

            Minding other peoples’ business. In this case a country full of other peoples’ business.
            If we want to encourage them to save their rain forests by education or payments of some sort which they can voluntarily accept, that is fine. But I don’t think that is what Karolyn is talking about (voluntary). And, by “we”, I mean voluntary donors, not those who are forced to donate through their taxes.
            Freedom is not qualified by the phrase “unless somebody wants something from you”.

          • Karolyn

            Dave, You are so wrong about me it isn’t even funny. It doesn’t matter what I say; you will misconstrue it to fit your own agenda.

          • DaveH

            I would be happy to be wrong about you, Karolyn, but from my point of view, you are wrong about yourself.

          • patrick H.T. paine

            “To conquer, first divide.”

            Ah, yes….by all means, be sure to listen to the other side! Such wisdom seems common sensical until one attempts to put it into practice, regarding such things as say, heliocentrism……which has another side……should we consider it?

            There is another side to the Constitution, those who listened, helped
            bring into existance, the best government money can buy, using funny
            money at that!

            One of the more interesting aspects of alternative green technologies,
            before they became a part of the “climate change” debate…..is that
            they are most effective and efficient when applied at the point of
            need…….energy grids are inefficient by definition, and the farther
            the end user is, from the source, the more vulnerable they become.

            Given the doom and gloom, the end is nigher mind set, and the annie get your gun, and heirloom seeds ready crowd that seems prevalent here, the resistance to these technologies, seems somewhat self contradictory, given that it is these technolgies, that can be applied, locally…..to disempower, the centralised elites that are
            controlling your existance………

            This is also true for government……since it tends to be much more
            responsible when it’s constituency is next door, than thousands of
            miles away…….

            In 1877, local militia’s refuse to intervene in the railroad strikes
            that were taking place……because they would be firing on their
            neighbor’s…….federal troops had no such problem.

            “The lesson of history, is that we have learned NOTHING from history.”

            But by all means, be sure to listen to the “other side”, because
            we know they both can’t be right……unfortunately, for the
            divided….they both can be WRONG!

            “Do not ask for whom the bell tolls……..”

        • DaveH

          Exactly, Jeremy, your views are based on belief. Mine are based on extensive reading, thinking, facts, and logic.

          • Jeremy Leochner

            As are mine Dave

          • DaveH

            Sure, Jeremy, whatever you say.
            Did you read the links I posted? You could read the book John Myers suggested. Or you could read any of many that Christopher Horner has written.
            Frankly, I would be embarrassed to post comments if I was as lacking in knowledge as you are.

          • Jeremy Leochner

            Yes Dave I did read them. I admit to not knowing certain things such as the various proposals to counter CFCS. However I have not read the book. That being said I wouldn’t make an argument if I wasn’t willing or able to fight for it or if I didn’t believe it.

          • DaveH

            And, Jeremy, I have seen little in your comments but conjecture and the regurgitation of Liberal talking points. Sorry, but those do not pass as facts or logic.

          • DaveH

            By the way, Jeremy, I’ve been thinking and studying outside the Liberal box for well over forty years now. Are you even that old?

          • Carlucci

            Well, from what I understand, the citizenry of those countries that are lucky enough to have rainforests want to preserve them because they contain animal and plant life that is found nowhere else in the world but there. Unfortunately the greedy government officials could give a rat’s patootie about that when they can pocket tons of money for “development”, and screw the citizenry, animals, and plants.

            About ten years ago Sting was on a campaign to save the rainforests and I believe he received tons of donations to do that very thing. I remember sending a donation for the cause.

          • Jeremy Leochner

            No Dave I am much younger than 40 years old. With respect I am still licensed to have an opinion and a belief system. And please know I do have some conservative views, not just liberal ones.

        • DaveH

          The ozone hole wasn’t a lie, but man’s effect on the ozone hole was a lie.
          Use your brain, Jeremy. Chlorofluorocarbons are freely diffusing gases, as is ozone. Are you aware that ozone is a pollutant that many cities fight? If Freon (CFC) broke down the ozone, do you think it would just skip over the surface ozone? Do you think the surface ozone wouldn’t just diffuse freely to the (wait for it) Ozone Layer?
          Jeremy, Liberals prey on the idealistic, easily molded minds of young people. Why don’t you break the mold, and do some thinking for yourself? Read this (Of course you won’t):
          http://www.cato.org/pubs/regulation/regv5n2/v5n2-5.pdf

          • Jeremy Leochner

            I did read it Dave. Cost benifit risks versus health risks. The issue I have is for me health is most important. The basic sciene of CFC breakdown and destruction is discussed and is not denied. For me I point out the vast production of CFCS by man. If the science of CFC breakdown and mans vast production of CFCS is not denied I dont see how it is a lie that man helped create the hole in the ozone.

          • DaveH

            You can’t see? More like you don’t want to see.

        • DaveH

          Jeremy says “Dave my views are just as valid and genuine as yours”.

          What’s the difference between what I know and what Jeremy knows?
          It’s a Big one. I am not trying to force my views on Jeremy. He and his Liberal cohorts are trying to force their views on the rest of us through Big Government.

          Can you imagine even remotely, Jeremy, what it would be like if you were indeed more knowledgeable than I am, and I was trying to force myself on you through Big Government? If you can, then you will understand my frustration with people like yourself.

          • Jeremy Leochner

            Dave im not trying to force my views. Im trying to say my views and support them as best I can. If the people choose not to elect people who share my views or those in power choose not to support ideas or proposals that reflect my views there is nothing I can or would even try to do about it. All I am doing is saying what I think. And I dont consider myself more knowledgeable than you. I am just saying that I am as genuine in my belief as you. I am honest in what I say I believe just as you are.

          • DaveH

            You just don’t get the whole voting thing, do you Jeremy? Government is force. When you vote for a politician who will implement your desired policies, you are voting to force those policies on other people. It’s no different than if you were in a small gang forcing your way on other individuals, it’s just a much larger gang.
            If you want to save the animals, get together with like-minded people and buy some land to set aside a preserve. That’s the voluntary, peaceable way to do things. If you want to save the environment, then ride your bike to work, grow a tree, volunteer to clean up. But don’t force the rest of us to engage in your pet agendas using Government as your bully boys.

          • Jeremy Leochner

            But Dave if the majority of the people support what I support then thats democracy. If what I want has popular support I feel thats grounds for acting on it. If we can get more people to vote and if the majority of those who do vote for the candidate or the proposal that I like then I am happy. I dont want force. If people vote its their buisness. If they dont vote well I cant change them and its their right to do so. And please know they can oppose a plan if it does get the majority vote. Majority tyrannizing the minority is just as bad as minority tyrannizing the majority.

          • DaveH

            Like I said, you just don’t get it.

          • patty

            Jeremy – I applaud you for being on this site and reading other view points. It shows that you are yearning to learn and that you are not convinced of everything you have been taught. By the way, the US is a Republic, not a democracy. Democracy is mob rule. We can start there for lesson 1.

      • DaveH

        Here is some backup for my statement about Dupont:
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chlorofluorocarbon#Regulation_and_DuPont

        • DaveH

          Crony Capitalism at its finest. How many of you had to change your air conditioning systems (as I did) to accomodate the new refrigerent gases? You gotta love those Liberals. NOT!

    • DaveH

      Here is an article that you could learn from, Jeremy. That is — if you really want to learn:
      http://www.cato.org/pubs/regulation/regv15n2/reg15n2g.html

      Keep in mind that in the 1970s, when the Liberals were pushing their alternative energy schemes, they were trying to alarm the public about Homogenic Global Cooling. You can’t have it both ways, Jeremy.

      • Jay

        I remember that, they were calling for an ice age by the year 2000! By the way, what caused the ice ages and environmental catastrophes prior to industrial age? The environmentalist’s never tackle that question!

      • Thamera

        DaveH: I have a children’s book that I was given back in 1978 about pollution and in this book it predicted that well before now the earth would be nothing but a toxic wasteland because of us terrible humans LMAO. I am so glad I kept that book!

        • Carlucci

          I remember a TIME magazine cover from about 1978 that said the earth was getting COLDER and the earth would be covered in ice in 100 years.

          It’s all junk science. I cannot believe that anyone would pay attention to, much less believe what a politician says. It has been revealed that other so called “experts” who support this theory are not experts or scientists at all.

          You can bet that Al Gore and his cronies like B.O. and the rest of the federal mafia stand to get some kind of sweetheart deal out of this – lecturing us, yet all the while flying in their private polluting jets, SUVs, and limosines.

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            Its all about the almighty dollar. Whoever can concoct the lie that they can get the media to hype and the government to force on people, then they collect billions. Al Gore just tried this, and almost made it. First they cry about an ice age coming. Now they cry global warming. Then they make stupid statements like its getting warmer and melting the polar ice caps, and by getting warmer its going to make it colder. What? Do they even listen to what they are saying. Around here, our local mayor said he would raise taxes, he would lower them. So he gets elected, first thing he does is raise property taxes, and says that is part of his plan to lower taxes. Are you kidding me? Do they all thing we are all as dumb as their blind sheeple? Needless to say, myself and a couple thousand now and growing, have moved out of that county, because were not paying their exhorbitant property taxes. Unbelievable.

    • DaveH

      Finally, for anybody who is honestly torn on the issue, think about this. Considering that the Greenhouse Gas Carbon Dioxide is a small percentage of the Greenhouse Gases in comparison to the Greenhouse Gas Water Vapor, what would keep our temperatures from quickly spirally upwards as the heat increases, therefore the water vapor increases, therefore the heat increases, etc.?
      Liberals are a joke. They are so intent on making us their economic slaves that they will use any fallacious arguments they can muster to propagandize the ignorant citizens to get their way.

      Go here to put that Global Warming hoax to bed in your minds once and for all. It’s a political football, that is all:
      http://climatedepot.com/

      • Thamera

        Amen…and you might add a money maker!

    • Boliver

      Water vapor is the number one greenhouse gas by volume, accounting for about 95% of all greenhouse gases. It is not manmade. CO2 is a distand second at about 4%. Over 2/3 of CO2 occurs naturally. Also, like water vapor, CO2 concentrations in the atmosphere are not homogenous, varying from season to season and hemisphere to hemisphere. Temperature affects CO2 (and water vapor) concentration more so than the reverse. CO2 concentrations increase as a result of warmer temperatures and decline during cooler periods. Even Professor Gore’s own humorous slideshow showed this.

    • DaveH

      And here’s my bet. I’m betting that Jeremy, who purports to be interested in education, will not read either of the links that I supplied, or the books that John Myers and I suggested.
      Liberals don’t really want to know the truth, they just want to control our lives and redistribute the wealth.

    • Average Joe

      In seeking wisdom thou art wise; in imagining that thou hast attained it – thou art a fool.
      Lord Chesterfield

      • patty

        Average-I like that! I think I will put that on my wall of sayings in the bathroom. It is a neat wall with framed sayings printed backwards. When you are done with your busness, you can read them in the mirror while you wash your hands. I can’t tell you how many people tell me they can’t read them because they are backwards. My reply is to tell them to go back and wash their hands. I can’t believe in this day and age that that many people do not wash their hands.

    • Jovianus

      Myers writes (I believe this is baloney without the mayo or bread) “What the Greens seem blind to is the fact that a shift away from fossil fuels will have huge opportunity costs for the United States at a time when the country can least afford it. The technology for clean energy does not yet exist. To embrace it when competitors like India and China do not would be economic suicide.”

      A) China and india are embracing new energy changing technology. China leads in solar panel technology and research…having overtaken us while Bush fiddled and let Iraq and our finances burn

      B) We can least afford to stay oil dependent. We are dependent upon the ME and Venezula for oil imports…does that make everyone feel safe and secure? Anyone price out the cost of having a miliatry resence in the ME? Anyone have the cost to our health and safety getting any new reserves out of the ground (ever sread up on ‘fracturing” and what that’s doing to water supplies?).

      C) the technology for clean alternative enrgy doesn’t exist? Really? I understand it does exist..and needs to be improved. We leave it to the oil and gas companies to imporve the technology, or start up new companies trying to obtain fiancning with conservative investors and banks tied to oil and energy…we’re going to have a long wait, fall further behind, and continue to be reliant on outside foreign interests to soak us for every penny they can get.

      Jeesh … it’s not about ‘global warming’ anyore. That’s proven to exist. If that is wrong…no harm if we act as if it’s real. If it’s real, there is a lot of harm if we don’t act because of maysayers who want to destroy our nation.

      The issue is our national security and where this nation heads as we enter the 21st century. Either we lead the way…or we follow and become subservient because we allowed short sighted narrow thinking to overcome the reality.

      • Thamera

        Jovi you are truly clueless about China just for starters. Yes, they have a lot of great technology but they also have a lot of people that LOVE their cars! I know people that work and live there.

      • DaveH

        Speaking of Propagandists.
        Maybe if you repeat your bull often enough, Jovianus, people will believe you. But not if I can help it.
        Jovianus says “it’s not about ‘global warming’ anyore. That’s proven to exist”. Yes, Jovianus, Global Warming has existed. So has Global Cooling, and Climate Change. The issue is whether man has a significant effect on any of those. That has not been “proven” in any stretch of the imagination. What has been “proven” is that Liberals are willing to tell any lies they can muster to promote their agenda.

        What gets me is that Liberals (probably yourself, but I can’t remember offhand) are so quick to damn the rich people, yet you are so blindered that you can’t see this is all about rich people and other leaders making money and taking power at the main street citizens’ expense. Or is it that you don’t want to see because you are one of the takers?

        • Average Joe

          DaveH,
          You have a better chance of convincing a turd that it is a goldfish in a bowl than you do of convincing Jovial Anus that his (or her) thought processes may in fact be flawed.

          There is none so blind as those who will not see.

          • Jay

            Average Joe, people like joy anus are not here to be convinced, they are here to convince us! I would suggest not responding to them.

          • Average Joe

            My point exactly……Which is why I responded to DaveH…and didn’t waste my time on Happy Azz….there is no fixing stupid…so, I didn’t try.

            Two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity…and I’m not sure about the universe.
            Albert Einstein

      • JeffH

        Jovi, you’re nothing more than annoying with your socialist rants! Get it through your head, your work is done here…you’re a failure!
        Go back to the Kos or HuffPost where you can be recieved with open arms and like minds.

    • Void1972

      Any idea backed by the Communist is anti-American. Obama and his “Green Czar” Van Jones are both anti-American Communist, so what ever agenda these people have, you know it’s not for the good of the American citizen!
      Ever time a volcano erupts, more CO2 is ejected into the atmosphere then all man made emissions produce for a year!

      • Donald

        What proof have you that Obama is a Communist? You have none, zero, zip, nil!

        • DaveH

          Did he tell us that he smoked? Did he tell us that he was anti-gun? Did he tell us that he was going to get us out of the wars? Oh, wait, he did tell us that.
          What do you think he’s going to do? Tell us he’s a Marxist and expect to get elected? Intelligent people will judge him by his actions, not by his words:
          http://www.canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/2289

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            You are so correct. I once knew a man who had a wise plaque in his office. It said “What a man says in words, is what he wants you to think he is. What he does in his actions, is who he really is.” And it is true as can be.

        • Allan Halbert

          the stated desire to redistribute wealth

      • Donald

        Pimer’s conclusions are as fraudulent as anything out there!

        • Average Joe

          Donald,
          A legend in your own mind?

          The greatest obstacle to discovery is not ignorance – it is the illusion of knowledge.
          Daniel J. Boorstin

    • Dale on the left coast

      Carbon emissions are not CO2 . . . CO2 is a Benign gas that enables plants to grow. Carbon emissions are pollution particulate from industry, diesel engines etc.
      The hole in the Ozone . . . still happening . . . absolutely nothing to do with man . . . caused by Solar Radiation and extreme cold . . . that is why they open and close mostly over the polar regiona.
      One volcano can emit more flurocarbons and pollutants than man has made since the Industrial Revolution.
      Climate Change? When did the climate NOT CHANGE??? What would be the ideal TEMPERATURE? We are neighte warmer today than in the past, or colder today than in the past . . . SO WHAT’S ALL THE FRIGGIN NONSENSE? Its all about “Wealth Transfer” and “Selling Hot Air” . . . .

    • Lewis Munn

      We do not pump “carbon” into the atmosphere, regardless of what the greenies say. We do put CO2 into the atmosphere, as does everything living, including trees at night.

      Plants absorb CO2 when under sunlight and make wood and other compounds, but we clear trees off as fast as possible!

      Global warming is natural, and goes in cycles, and has for millions of years, based on the earth’s orbit, and solar radiation changes. It also depends on the tilt of the earth’s axis, as shown by the change when to Gulf of Mexico was dug and the earth’s poles were shifted by the impact.

      One thing a lot of folks miss, is the distinction between true science, and science done with the answer in mind to make one group rich or influential.

      In the dark ages, it was the Catholic church and the rich politicians who dictated what science could be allowed to find. And anything else was suppressed as heretical. The laws were made on that basis. A lot like now!

      Right now “Global Warming” is accepted on some evidence and a lot of negative evidence is disregarded, since it does not make money or put people under control of the politicians.

      If you read a lot, you will find that it is a normal earth cycle, for 50 million years or more, and that it is now really a new religion, and is making those who jumped on the bandwagon early very rich, at the expense of the rest of us.

      As with most secular religions, the greatest sin is lack of blind submission! And that must be crushed, usually by the secular government.

      I hope you read on; lots of facts will be offered, but you need to look carefully at who obtained the “facts”; many are suspect due to bias on the part of the fact givers, and lack of support by observations.

      Such as, the planets such as Mars, without man’s pollutions, are warming up also. And Al Gore’s terror film was found to be unsupportable in a court of law, but still is used a lot, and he makes millions off folks who follow its ideas!

    • Kim Rozell

      What most people do not realize is that it takes sun light hitting rare-earth gasses in the upper atmosphere to generate Ozone. In the winter the earth is tilted away from the sun, thus not enough sunlight is present to create the Ozone. Thus a Hole in the Ozone. Ham Radio Operators have known this for years and years as we look for “Skip Zone Conditions.” No Ozone formation, no radio skip. Thus the Hole.

      Besides, it is the formation of Ozone that protects us all from frying. Also, most people don’t know that it takes CO2 to keep plant life alive all around the world. Nitrogen makes it grow, without CO2 the flowers on plants will not open and bloom.

    • Roy Major

      I believe I’m with you. No one has calculated the true total costs to our health and safety of fossil fuels. The only economy hurt in the long run would be the dirty and unsafe energy economy unless they invest a little more of their enormous profits on clean. Some of the “energy” companies are claiming to be doing research into clean energy, but from what I have read, they are spending less than 1% of their enromous profits.

    • http://al@bellaproducts.com al metcalf

      The bottom line is:
      Regardless of whether Obama likes it or not. His engergy policy is complete bunk, except for his Nuclear power thoughts and this is actually doable and viable as a technology.

      Solar is still years away from viability due to efficiency of the sun/energy transfer.
      Wind is viable today except for the same problem we will have with Solar as soon as we solve the efficiency problem. This further problem is ‘storage of electrical energy’.

      In todays world we must use the electrical energy as soon as we produce it or we lose it. There is no high capacity, long term storage available. The technology has never been figured out to make this happen.

      Nuclear works great for the projected amount of energy needed on a time schedule basis. Gas, oil and even coal works good for the variable amount of energy needed for peak uses of energy.

      If these peaks appear in conjunction with wind or solar generating capabilities this is great, but the problem is neither of these methods of energy production is on demand. These technologies will only work when the conditions are correct and we do not have any control of the conditions.

      So we are stuck with Nuclear, Gas, Oil and Coal as our total dependable, on demand energy needs, whether Obama and his Green people like it or not.

      Continuing to dump money into any other technology is a complete waste of funds and time. Money should be spent in the National Research Facilities to solve the energy storage problem and the efficiency problems of solar.

      Instead we are paying ADM $17 Billion per year to make Ethanol which is a complete waste of cropland since the total cost of Ethanol is double what a gallon of gas costs and it produces almost four times the polution when the full production is accounted for.

      Obama doe not have a rational energy policy nor does anyone in his administration, it is all Al Gore Bunk.

      • denniso

        Ethanol subsidies began under Bush,Obama is just continuing the policy. It’s a virtual joke,true,but you can’t blame Obama for it.

        Solar and wind can already do much more than they are if we would subsidize them as much as we do conventional sources and nuclear. Wind and solar have almost no major negative issues associated,unlike every other energy source.

  • Vigilant

    It would be difficult to find a more eloquent modern example of the philosophy of “the end justifies the means.”

    UNEP tips its hand, without embarrassment, when it says that “a green economy [is] one that results ‘in improved human well-being and social equity…” Now if anyone can tell me what logical relationship exists between social equity and climate change, I’ll vote Democrat.

    It should be obvious to anyone with an IQ higher than 50 that the canard of global warming is being used as a tool to effect social change, not as a tool to improve our grandchildrens’ lives. There’s a very clear reason why it’s supported by socialists and viewed with skepticism by the capitalists.

    The logical mind sees it for what it is: a push for “social justice” (the absolute and unchangeable goal), by employing ANY means, including junk science, to achieve the end. Evidence of the weakness in the argument is obvious when you see the ever-shifting “scientific” grounds for it. i.e., first it was global cooling, then global warming, then “climate change.”

    The same left wingnuts who now claim with certainty that it’s global warming are the same idiots who claimed with certainty that it was global cooling in the 1970s. They become strangely silent when you mention the dishonesty of the UN and the East Anglia “scientists,” who stopped being the scientists the second they started to become political zealots.

    • Mick

      Vigilant says:
      April 20, 2011 at 5:24 am
      It would be difficult to find a more eloquent modern example of the philosophy of “the end justifies the means.”

      It should be obvious to anyone with an IQ higher than 50 that the canard of global warming is being used as a tool to effect social change, not as a tool to improve our grandchildrens’ lives. There’s a very clear reason why it’s supported by socialists and viewed with skepticism by the capitalists.
      *****************************
      Vigilant……And what a canard it is !!!!!!!!
      The Democrats are hell bent on taking the American citizen’s rights to freedom away and impose their rules in every crevices of our lives and will use any means to obtain total power and reduce the population to servile dependents to their sick agenda.
      Our constitution has been raped by the left and they don’t give a damn of what we the people think about it….

      • Conservative at Birth

        That is correct. It is the Totalitarians dream.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        I agree, about the lefts sick agenda. See my post above, about the things the left wing liberal enviro green meanies do to push their agenda. Lies, lies, and more lies. They think we are as gullible as their blind followers, and think all they say is true. News to you greenies, we hear you, and we recognize you for the liars that you are. Without your pushing your agenda, you have no jobs. You have become a cancer, and you need cut out. Leave the environment to people like me who love the outdoors, while people like you greenies pound nails into trees causing humans to lose life and limb. That is pathetic of you.

        • Al Sieber

          Right on! and trees are a renewable resource.

      • BeachRoo

        And among facts mased on myth this is among the biggest ones on the planet (No pun intended). As a geologist myself, I find it most interesting that there is never mention that the first atmosphere of the earth was methane, not oxygen…Methane has a carbon base.

        During the carboniferous period, CO2 in the atmosphere was much greater than today and trees were much taller…

        Here is another interesting thing to consider, Has anyone taken the time to document how Al gore has become a billionaire? Further, what is his degree in? the results would amaze you. Look into who is making the money on the backs of the taxpayers and consumers and you will find your answer there.

      • jim

        You are so right on!! Ole barry the Illegal Socialist Idiot,, so called, pres and his Lib Dem Moron cronies are Destroying our Great country daily!! Nature has cycles, which will continue and has NOTHING to do with man!!

    • Lewis Munn

      I agree.

      Also, look at the correlation of great art and global warming peaks, where the earth is most productive! And so are people who have time from scrabbling to maker a living to producing art, and science.

    • DaveH

      Well put, Vigilant.
      Given that the poorest countries on this planet also have the dirtiest environments (that’s a fact), how can the Environmentalists really expect us to have a cleaner environment when they are impoverishing our nation with their tool Big Government?

    • Augie D

      As I posted earlier to Old Henry, the Global warming threat has been engineered by a think tank called Club of Rome. To which Mr. Gore belongs. He just became their mouthpiece to advertise their plans. And you are correct in your statement; “global warming is being used as a tool to effect social change”. That was their plan all along. Present a world problem, get people panicked over pending doom, then offer them a solution, at a premium cost! E85 fuel, ethanol, hybrid cars, green Christmas trees, and the list goes on. They say “do it for the environment”, or save the trees, whales, spotted owl etc. It’s really about forcing us to spend money on something we don’t want or need.

      Research Club of Rome. “The threat of environmental crisis will be the ‘international disaster key’ that will unlock the ‘New World Order’.” Mikhail Gorbachev 1996 Monetary & Economic Review pg. 5.

      What happened to all the hippies? Don’t trust government, or anyone over thirty! Now that I’m almost double that age, at least I know why they are doing these things.

  • homeboy

    instead of pushing the books man writes , why not push the bible for a change. at least you will read the truth.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      Amen brother. Problem a lot have, is that it is just a book to them. The Bible was written as a guide for us believers, and if one is not a believer, it is just a book of stories to them, as you, like I, have probably heard more than one non believer, say how the Bible is full of neat stories……., and that is all it is to them. Without accepting Jesus Christ as one’s saviour, and having the Holy Spirit enter into you, one cannot possible comprehend or understand what God’s word is saying to you, for without the Holy Spirit, they are still of this world, and not of God, and therefore cannot comprehend anything from it, other than it being stories to them. To me, it is life. To us who are saved, it is wisdom and life. To those who are perishing, it is foolishness. It is written.

    • Lewis Munn

      The Bible also predicts what is going on now! Increases in knowledge, and in wars and unrest.

      • Thamera

        While I agree, you cannot argue the bible or religion with agnostics, atheists and or progressives like the environmental fanatics. They simply dismiss it along with you. After all, “they” are omnipotent, they are all knowing and they know what is best for me and you. (note the sarcasm)

  • Robin from Arcadia, IN

    We are at the mercy of our government. They won’t drill and they won’t step in and lower gas prices. I don’t believe they want to lower gas prices. It will enable them to push the ‘green agenda’. I agree that we need to explore any and all other forms of renewable energy, but we need decisions made now to help us at the pump. It is going to come down to using grocery money for gas. What a chilling thought!

    • Mick

      Robin …’They have no intention what so ever to try to lower anything, gas prices, food prices, medical needs or anything resembling savings for our population, their greed goes beyond the welfare of our nation and the dumb a$$es keeping these people in power don’t even realize that they’re being totally screwed….

    • karolyn

      The only thing that can help us at the pump is more regulation on Wall Street. I’m sure you know that the reason for our high prices on gas are the greedy oil speculators.

      • Conservative at Birth

        Where did you study macroeconomics? Did you get a degree out of a Cracker Jax box?

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        Karolyn is right on this. When these speculators see a storm coming, or a damaged well, or anything that they “think” might disrupt drilling and production, they automatically up the prices. That does have a lot, a whole lot to do with it. Now also, there is the angle, of who they are in bed with, and who makes these instant profits when they speculate a rise and jack the price up. Someone is collecting.

        • DaveH

          No, Beberoni, neither of you are right. Speculators can only ride the roller coaster, they do not drive it. See my comment lower in this thread for a more thorough treatment of that subject.

        • Dan az

          The prediction is that, because of the ongoing crisis and the continued decline of the dollar, oil will go to $150 and then to $200 a barrel before the year is out. When it reaches these levels, Williams says, the plan is to cease purchasing oil from the Middle East and begin extracting it from Gull Island in Alaska’s Prudhoe Bay, from the nearby Arctic National Wildlife Refuge (ANWR) in Alaska, and from the Bakken formation where North Dakota meets Canada.

          In addition, 2 trillion barrels of shale oil lie beneath the Rocky Mountains may be tapped. Such a welcome retaliation to the Arab oil czars will certainly be applauded by the American people, who will be told that it is being done to lower prices at U.S. pumps. However, when such a result never comes and gasoline prices soar to $6 a gallon anyway, the American people will realize, too late again, that the only change made has been in who harvests the vast profits.

      • http://WeThePeople Jean

        It is the Banks – World wide that run every country on the face of Eath. They mandate when and where things will run and how much it will be charged. Do not doubt this. The bible calls them whores and they are that. The pimps are the UN. They will herd us all into one category and tag us with their universal chips – This is the mark of the beast. where each and every human will be monitored. They also will control each and every military in existance. Next are the Unions who are the governments thugs who will stop at nothing to make sure that you do the goose step to their will. All reserves are being horded for their use – consider these carrots to dangle in front of your face. The beast runs Obama and that harlot beside him.

        If you have not prayed before – you had better start praying now.

        • Robert Moore

          We do not pay attention to our own history. Sound money, gold and silver,over paper was a huge debate. One the general public lost. We should strive to separate bankers from creating the value of money, and politicians from the ability to own it. http://www.ourcaucus.com & http://www.GOOOH.com, & google “Web of debt”; read creature from Jekyll island.

      • Al Sieber

        The reason the price of fuel and food etc. is going up is because the dollar is crashing, not Wall Street speculators. hyperinflation is on the way.

        • DaveH

          Yep.

          • Dan az

            Follow the money.
            At varying times, some of the top borrowers included Brussels-based Dexia Bank ($33.5 billion), Dublin-based Depfa Bank ($24.5 billion), Parisbased Societe Generale ($5 billion), Tokyo-based Norinchukin ($6 billion), Bank of China ($198 million) and two Deutsche Bank AG divisions ($1 billion each).

            One of the most controversial was the Arab Banking Corp., which borrowed more than $35 billion. Arab Banking Corp. is 35 percent owned by the Central Bank of Libya. Regardless of what readers may think of Libya, the Federal Reserve made an estimated 73 loans to the Central Bank of Libya—the national bank of a country the U.S. military is currently bombing.And guess who owns the central bank of libya?Yep you guessed it the same ones that print the funny money and make us all pay for it.Hyper inflation sounds soft to me!One would bank and one world currency sounds the norm to me.

      • NC1

        Frankly, it makes me tired reading your drivel, along with those who have shown up in suport of it! USE YOUR GOD-GIVEN BRAINS, PEOPLE! Regulation is not the answer. Regulation will stifle and otherwise destroy the market. If you really don’t like the price of fuel that much, then do something that the market will understand: don’t buy it! Do like the rest of the eco-nuts and ride your bicycle, or the bus, or ride-share…whatever.
        But if you want the problem solved, then we need to do what Robin was bemoaning: drill here at home and allow refineries to be built!
        And those “greedy oil speculators” are trying to provide for their families, just like you! Just becaus they’ve found a way to do it well does not mean that they’re evil. In fact, it strikes me that when the prices of oil go up and the price at the pump goes up, so does theirs! The question is, are they conservatives who give to charities, or are they “progressives” who don’t?

        • jim

          The speculators are enabled by ole barry the Socialist and his Lib Dem MORONS!! when Bush was President, the DAY he announced that the drilling prohibitions were removed the price of gas dropped and continued to drop every week!! That is the ONLY way to break the back of the speculators, but of course this DUFUS pres will not do that unless he is FORCED!! IMPEACH NOW!!!!!

          • DaveH

            For those who want to learn some reality about the dreaded “oil speculators”:
            http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=9479

          • karolyn

            Dave – I read the piece at Cato, which is 2 years old, and then opened a recent video from the O’Reilly Factor in which there were still differences of opinion. I do have to say I still don’t understand why gas prices are so high. It is hard to comprehend the explanations.

          • DaveH

            Karolyn,
            O’Reilly is clueless when it comes to Economics. Yet he will still flap his lips as if he isn’t.
            I saw him a year or two ago arguing with Neil Cavuto about oil speculators. Cavuto (who does know about Economics) chewed him up and spit him out, but O’Reilly was too ignorant to know it.

        • karolyn

          The problem is not a lack of oil. People are not driving as much, but it will do no good, because it is those on top of the heap driving up the price of oil.

          • DaveH

            If you mean by “those on top of the heap”, the Regulators, you are correct.
            In all the times that I have posted the rankings of the various countries based on their amount of Government regulation, have you ever once spent any time looking at those real world experiences to learn a little about the damages that Big Government does to countries, Karolyn?
            I know, you “haven’t got the time”. Yet you somehow do have the time to put your two cents in on this board constantly.

          • karolyn

            D – I just read one; and the reasons I don’t read more is because I have more interests than politics.

          • DaveH

            Yet, you are here arguing about politics.

      • chucky

        The best way to lower oil prices because we americans are the biggest consumers of it,is to stifle the economy cutting your gas consumption in half. How do you accomplish this? think of ways to combine trips when driving Do a home project that will make you want to stay home more.We did our backyard with a nice patio and bar-b-que pit and jacuzzi. We would frequent restaurants at least 2-3 times a week now we bar-b-que and enjoy our home a lot more. getting started on the man cave making the basement a family room living space. planning on doing a vegetable garden this holiday weekend.You will be amazed at the extra money you will have if you can cut your gasoline consumption in half. Our family(4) gas card went from $750 adverage a month down to $418. This is the only peaceful way to combat what is going on gas price wise. a stalled economy will get their attention and when there is surplus(there is surplus now because the Saudi’s slowed down production) Once they are drowning in their own oil the price will drop dramatically like last time. costs money and manpower to store it. make them drown in it.

      • patty

        Karolyn – The reason why gas prices are rising is number one, by design, how many times have you heard the ones pushing green say that gas should be somewhere between $5-7/gallon. # 2 your prez has taken competition out of the equation so that the mid-east knows there is no place else for us to get the oil. You can directly blame Obama for not letting us drill. How is that hope and change working for ya now? If you are hoping for lower prices on all of your needs, you better be hoping for a completely different administration from the prez all the way down. All of them, both sides.

      • DaveH

        OMG. Are you really that naive, Karolyn? What kept those dreaded speculators from driving our prices to the sky when there was even less Government? Speculation can only drive prices in the short term. Supply and Demand, or excess money creation are the long term drivers.
        In Free Markets when the demand exceeds the supply, therefore resulting in higher prices, the producers get busy and produce more supply (because they’re “greedy” you know). Then as they fight for more market share and produce more the prices again fall.
        Regulators just cost us more money — directly with their salaries, and then indirectly by hampering the productivity of their target companies.
        The speculators risk their own money because they believe they know where the future prices are going. If they’re wrong, they lose. If they’re right, they win. By their willingness to risk their money, they provide the producers with some safety by allowing the producers to sell their product at known future prices, which allows them to make longer range plans than those which would have been possible if they were stuck only with the Spot Market.
        Speculators can not drive long-term prices.
        The main cause of higher oil prices (in US dollars) is that the Federal Reserve has been flooding the world with excess dollars. More dollars chasing fewer goods, thus higher prices.
        Of course, those in power don’t want the ignorant masses to know that, because they derive a good deal of their wealth by printing more fiat money and giving us the hidden tax of inflation, thereby draining the citizens’ wealth. They always have and always will blame the producers for inflation.

        • Thamera

          Yep, and it is only going to get worse. Do ya think Jeremy and karolyn and the like have read any of your links yet DaveH?

          • DaveH

            I doubt it, Thamera. They are too busy covering their eyes and ears and chanting “na, na, na, na, na”.

    • Lewis Munn

      Chilling enough to offset the man-made global warming? Now that would reduce farm production, as will CO2 reduction. Brrrrr!

  • Jay

    WHAT ABOUT THE SHOCK/HORROR “HOLE IN THE OZONE LAYER”?

    This scare weapon of the New World Order is also a scam!

    1. A note of interest to begin with on the supposed increase in melanoma due to the hole in the ozone layer causing the sun to burn in a harsher way. Studies done inour own country of Australia have shown that indoor workers are more likely to get melanoma than outdoor workers are! Possibly because UVA is not absorbed by ozone, which Coffman tells us is implicated in causing melanoma. The link has not been definitely establish however. [Dixy Lee Ray, Environmental Overkill (Washington, D.C., Regnery Gate, 1993).41.)

    2. The first detection of the ozone “hole at a pole” came in 1956-58. It was thinner then than at any time since. The same problem for the environmentalists arises as it did with the global warming fiasco. The first measurements of the pole holes occurred BEFORE the so-called causes of these holes, (in this case CFCs), even became a significant factor!

    3. Amazingly ozone HOLES, according to the experts, never actually form – “the ozone layer merely thins during the time of maximum levels – in late winter and early spring (for each hemisphere), and mostly at the polar regions. The little ozone thinning that occurs at our temperate latitudes is most likely caused by the same sulfate aerosols discussed above involved in global warming and acid rain.”(Coffman, “Saviours of the Earth?”.p49. He cites the work of Michaels, Sound and Fury, p.166)

    4. There are not many people lying in the sun in early spring when there is thinning, and another fact more telling than this is the content of the so-called holes themselves. The ozone within the “holes” in late winter is still actually thicker than the normal thickness of the hemispheric summer period! WHAT ABOUT THOSE DESTRUCTIVE (chlorofluorocarbons)CFCs? In a small presentation, which is only prepared to stimulate the reader towards further study on the subject, the full weight of evidence cannot be presented. The books cited therefore should be read by those who cannot grasp the whole message herein, or who still have doubts about the veracity of the statements. A brief summary can only be presented in a limited space, with a few facts and figures.

    1. The real culprits of the “holes at the poles” which do not exist are natural phenomena. Things like earthquakes.NOT CFCs! There is a natural thinning of ozone due to periodical natural occurrences, such as earthquakes and volcanoes.

    2. THE MONTREAL PROTOCOL. The international agreement the Montreal Protocol, has been signed by many countries including Australia. This agreement has made the banning of CFCs total by AD 2000, even though there is no scientific evidence that CFCs cause ozone “holes”.

    3. The banning of CFCs is no light matter. There are no cost -effective replacements for the CFCs. All replacements are either ten to thirty times more costly than CFCs, and some are flammable, toxic and corrosive. This means there will be immense hardship, even deaths, caused by the banning of CFCs. Even the eco-terrorists that are demanding the banning know this to be fact.

    4. In only four years time, at the writing of this booklet, all the refrigerators, freezers, air conditioners, millions of these, will be scrapped in Australia, and other nations. All this because of a document of 300 pages which gives “new findings” on the ozone depletion. A document that supported the drastic action of the Montreal Protocol, and which has been mysteriously “lost”! Yes, “lost”! The report cannot be “found” to be verified by other scientists. So that we have facing us a situation which must change our lives for the worse, far worse, the TOTAL banning of CFCs by AD 2000, and the drastic action is only based on “garbage science”. Strange indeed.

    5. From “The New Citizen”, Vol.2,No.1. Sept/Oct/Nov.Edition. “Another environmental hoax – the claim that CFC refrigerants (the chlorofluorocarbons) are destroying the Earth’s ozone layer – was recently denounced by Lewis du Pont Smith, an heir to the du Pont fortune. On the occasion of the du Pont Company board meeting early this year, Smith charged the corporation, now controlled by the Bronfman family of Canada, is furthering the hoax because it has a corner on the market for the CFCs’ replacement; he also charged that millions will die, especially in the Third World, if CFC is banned from use in refrigerating food and medicine.”

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      I dont buy into any of that junk science either. All this sun block and UV rays are going to kill you, really doesnt bother me. I look at it this way. Im 52. My dad is 86. Weve spent all our lives in the sun, baseball and fishing. Neither of us has ever used sun block. Ive been in the sun from sun up to sun down, no shirt on, no sunscreen or oil, and gee, Im melanoma free. Ive got nothing from it. All the people I grew up with are the same way. We dont worry about this stuff, and nothing has happened to any of us. Coincedence? No, I dont think so. I mean, before all this hype about skin cancer and stuff, people were out in it all day for centuries, and people werent dropping dead or getting skin cancer. I just dont buy into it. Now I feel for those who have gotten it, but my bet is, they have been exposed to something other than the sun to get it, or they are laying in those stupid tanning beds, which I know are harmful. Ive seen people get stuff from them. I dont think its natural, and thats why it happens. But I just dont buy into what they are selling when it comes to half the stuff they try to scare people with. I just dont, because Ive seen different too many times.

      • karolyn

        Absolutely, we need to be in the sun for vitamin D. However, there are many people who are prone to melanoma. I had a friend who had to keep getting things burned off her face and could not go out in the sun. Another has full-blown cancer that will kill her in the not-to-disant future. We all have cancer cells in us. Why they takeover in some but not in others might be due to genes.

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          Yeah, your right on the genetics thing. There are many families who have people die young of cancer who never smoked and stay out of the sun, but they get it anyhow, and some that smoke like chimneys and have no signs of it.

    • 45caliber

      Jay,

      I doubt if it made the news but the real story of the CFM’s is that there was another company that invented something else to use in air conditioners. It wasn’t as good and it cost more though. So they used the “hole” theory to write up a paper saying it was all the cause of CFM’s and then gave it to some of the “environmental” groups along with some money to “help their cause”. These environ(mental)ists (I like how that is done) then began screaming at Congress and the EPA to do something, demanding that those horrible CFM’s were the problem and this nice company they already knew about had the solution to it.

      When the story finally came out, it was quickly hushed. The companies making CFMs created a new solution that “made them safe” and the company that caused the problem turned their attention to something else.

      • patty

        45cal – The truth is that the patent that Dupont had on freon was running out. They got the regulations past to eliminate freon and replace it with their new patented product. http://www.lewrockwell.com/orig6/blackstock5.html
        And the incestuous cycle continues….

        • DaveH

          And it will continue until the citizens wake up and realize that Government meddling in the Marketplace is causing our problems.
          We need to get back to Free Markets, where the companies must please the consumers to succeed, rather than pleasing the politicians as is currently the case.

          • Cawmun Cents

            Sounds to me like there is a serious depletage of Soylent Green TeaTM in your daily supplements there DaveH.Report to the global marketTM and scan you some re-programming please.See you there citizen!

          • Lewis Munn

            I think that is well stated.

            Only exception I cam see is the control of things that are causing a hazard to the citizens and are not plainly tagged as to the hazard.

            We then also need to be sure citizens can read and understand!

          • DaveH

            Don’t you think, Lewis, that the responsibility to read and learn is theirs?

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            No cawmun sense, Dave is right. The government should not be propping up some companies, and taxing the daylights out of others. If they cant manage their business correctly, let them sink, and let someone else step up and have a chance, and someone else would if the government would back off. But they put up so much red tape, and they give tax breaks to this company and that company, but other companies they tax and tax and tax, and they need to get out of the way, and let the free market work. I cant put it any simpler than this. If your selling a product I want, and at a price I am willing to pay, then you will make the sell to me. If your charging way too much, or selling an inferior product, Im not buying it, and chance are most people wont buy it either, and you will be out of business. And thats the way it should be. But when the government interferes, and helps this company that is failing, and punishes that company that is succeeding, then it screws up the whole thing. They should back off, and let the free market dictate, not government favoritism. That is big problem, and big government is a big problem. Dave is absolutely correct.

          • Jay

            Totally agree, DaveH!

        • Jay

          Patty, good post! How convenient that the eco-nazis hide the politics and the commercial side of this issue, or rather, non-issue! Also, in our schools, global warming or climate change is discussed in social studies, rather then, science class! Interesting, I suppose they are trying to avoid confusing the issue with scientific facts. My ten year old Son knows all the terminology but not the science with respect to this topic. Just as well, I relish the opportunity to explain it to Him. Thanks for the post!

          • Thamera

            so does my ten year old daughter Jay! It is frightening when your child comes home spouting all this PC drivel. They are so innocent and so trusting and believe everything their teachers say. Fortunately that does not go unnoticed in our home and we discuss everything! I am very active in my children’s education. You have to be!

          • Lewis Munn

            I found it necessary to home-school as well as use the public schools, and also gave them when I was able some protestant parochial schooling, so they learned a lot of ways to approach subjects.

            I have never regretted the mix, and am glad they were able to get such a comprehensive outlook on the world.

            It is too bad we cannot get Education Vouchers to put kids in the schools we want and find give good education! In my opinion.

          • Jay

            Totally agree with you, Thamera! We cannot afford to leave the education of our children entirely in the hands of the education system. Every day, after school, I engage in a de-brief and address any questionable information my Son will have heard that day! This is why the system is so hell-bent on driving a wedge between parents and their children, they fear that committed parents that are aware of the truth, will teach it to the children. As I said, He is ten, and at present He is aware of these; santa claus does not exist, main stream media as well as our politicians lie, the education system has become predatory and there is no such thing as the easter bunny, just a few of a long list! He does however, believe in the Sovereign, Omnipotent and loving Creator. If we are to cause any positive change, we as parents, must, protect and properly educate our children!!!

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            The same liberal think tank that wants to teach our kids that a bird shit on a rock, the sun fermented it, and up rose a man who could walk and talk and think. What a crock of bull.

  • Jay

    THE RELIGIOUS BELIEFS OF THE ENVIRONMENTALISTS.

    Many average people who support the environmentalists have no idea that the whole movement has a dark religious thrust to it. Leaders in the environmental groups, on a local level, may not understand this themselves.

    Theosophy has enormous power in the world of the 1990s, this in itself is a supernatural, and astonishing, situation. Too complex to attempt in anything but a brief outline here, the grasp of the Theosphical beliefs will help the reader to understand the environmental movement and globalism today.

    1. GAIA, the Mother Earth or Goddess, is the earth hypothesis which undergirds the environmental groups.The earth is called Gaia after an ancient Greek goddess, and is seen as a living entity who “feels” “thinks” “rules” “commands” and “loves” – and destroys those who would pollute her!. She is more important than humans, who are mere germs on her skin.

    2. Nature is God, and God is nature is a theological doctrine of theosophy. Helena Blavatsky was the founder of the Theosphical Society late last century. Another name which is of importance in the movement is Alice Bailey. These following quotes will help clarify the situation: “[Theosophy] belongs neither to the Hindu, the Zoastrian, Chaldean, nor the Egyptian religion, neither to Buddhism, Islam, Judaism nor Christianity exclusively.

    The Secret Doctrine [of Theosophy] is the essence of all these.” (Helena Blavatsky, The Secret Doctrine.) “SATAN will now be shown in the teaching of the Secret Doctrine [of Theosophy], allegorised as Good, and Sacrifice, a God of Wisdom, under different names.” (Emphasis mine.) The Secret Doctrine. Helena Blavatsky.

    ANTI-CIVILIZATION!

    “Interference by man in this civilisation can disrupt the life forces of nature and the occult. Only in countries where there is no civilisation can the power of nature be found – the world’s soul.” (Helena Blavatsky. Isis Unveiled, Vol. 2:210-11.)

    • 45caliber

      And environmentalism is certainly a religion to many of them.

      • DaveH

        Liberalism in general is a religion. It appeals to the uninformed citizens because the goals sound so good, but it doesn’t stand up to scrutiny. So the followers must take it on faith.

        • Cawmun Cents

          Soylent Green is people.Liberals love people…yum people…..

          • Jay

            I remember that movie Cawmun Cents!

      • Lewis Munn

        Yes, I agree.

        And they will do anything to further their religion, even to lying, falsifying data, and using political pressure to convert people.

        They even have a pseudo-religious structure, and excommunicate and persecute those who find any flaws in it.

  • Jay

    ARE YOU AND YOUR FAMILY EXPENDABLE? ARE THERE MURDEROUS INTENTIONS BEING DIRECTED AGAINST US ALL?

    The New Age deep ecology beliefs dominate the environmental movement. David Garber, research biologist, says this: “Human happiness, and certainly human fecundity, are not as important as a wild and healthy planet. I know social scientists who remind me that people are a part of nature, but that isn’t true. Somewhere along the line – at about a million years ago, maybe half that – we quit the contract and became a cancer. we have become a plague upon ourselves and upon the Earth….Until such time as Homo Sapiens should decide to rejoin nature, some of us can only hope for the right virus to come along.” (Quoted from Robert Bidinotto, “Environmentalism:Freedom’s Foe for the ’90s,”

    The Freeman, Nov.1990,414. Requoted in “Savior’s of the Earth?”, p.92.) “Humans are a cancer to the earth – even those native cultures of a few thousand years ago. The only solution is to eliminate man! Or at least to reduce man’s population to somewhere around 500 million from the 5.5 billion that exist today.
    The more radical groups such as EARTH FIRST!, SEA SHEPHERD, and GREENPEACE, ascribe to these beliefs, which helps to explain their extreme militancy. David Foreman, founder of Earth First! puts this rather succinctly: “We are a BIOCENTRIC WARRIOR SOCIETY….Forget about career, about family, about VCRs and power boats and get out and fight!” (Emphasis added. Coffman, p.93. Quoted from The Animal’s Agenda, December, 1987.)

    • karolyn

      Though certainly not a radical, I do agree with the FACT that we are a part of the earth, and the earth is a part of us. Man’s nature is to plunder and use until something is all gone. We are nothing without the earth; however, the earth could live quite well without human beings.

      • Conservative at Birth

        You are living proof of idiocy!!!!!!!!!!!

      • Bruce D.

        You talk like the Earth is a human being and have been smoking a little too much medical marijuana. Exactly what part of the Earth are you anyway and what part of the Earth is in you? E

        • denniso

          WOW!! Talk about unthinking people! What part of a peraosn is the earth? Let’s see…Every single human(all plants,animals)from the very beginning of life drinks water from the earth to stay alive and grow from a fertilized egg….try not drinking any water for a week and get back to me on it’s importance. Every single human is nourished from food that comes directly from the earth…go for a month or two and see how tou do w/o food from the earth. The very air we breath is also a part of the earth,isn’t it? Would the earth resemble what it is w/o it’s atmosphere and the oxygen it contains for
          us to breathe? Try holding your breath for 10 mins and see how well you do.

          You people think it’s radical to maintain that we are part of the earth,when we evolved and grew directly from it and are constantly sustained by it? My God,what blind rightwingers w/ apparently NO clue about anything.

      • Vigilant

        “…the earth could live quite well without human beings.”

        Then who would take care of my Siberian Husky?

        • patty

          I WILL!!!

          • Vigilant

            Thank you patty! (:-)

          • Carlucci

            me too – !!

      • 45caliber

        karolyn:

        It is the nature of ALL LIVING THINGS to use what is available. If there becomes too many deer, they eat all the food and starve. If they starve, so do the preditors. If they try to move to another location, the animal rights people complain about it and want them moved back so they can starve since it is “nature’s way”. If man tries to feed them, the animal rights people complain about that too.

        Yes, we use things. And we try to replace them if possible. You are listening to too many of the “green” comments.

        Remember in any environment – man is a PART of that enviornment, not seperate from it. Just like all other life.

      • patty

        la, la, la, la, la, la la, or, waa, waa, waa, waa, or babble, babble, babble, or ……

        • Lewis Munn

          Patty, how does this relate to anything in the discussion?

          • patty

            I clicked on the “reply” under Karolyn’s post and it ended up way down here. I was posting sarcatically to Karolyn who constantly seems to babble and yet, say nothing.

      • Jay

        Mankind was not made for nature, but for the worship and glory God, however, nature was made for man! “Be fruitful and multiply and SUBDUE the earth”. Thank you God, I think I will! It is anathema in the eyes of God to worship nature, absolutely the most retarded thing a human being could do! Its idolatry, pure and simple. But when we turn our backs on God and dismiss Him from our lives, we immediately step into Idolatry, why? Because, the chief function of mankind is to worship His Creator, like breathing and the heart beating, worship is fundamental to humankind’s existence, if we will not worship the Creator, we will worship the creation!!!

        • Lewis Munn

          We sure have a lot who worship the creation, even to dispoiling it.

      • Jay

        We could plunder the earth for the next million years and still not exhaust the resources God has placed in nature! The over population and scarce resources myths were invented by the greedy elite who wish to have more for themselves, but like the greedy simpletons that they are, they do not realize that the Creator can provide beyond what we can possibly imagine! Also, the simpletons that believe in the myths, are just that, simpletons, typically atheists, go figure!

      • JIBBS

        You type so many words, and yet you say nothing.

        • Jay

          That’s because you have nothing in your head!

        • Thamera

          Maybe JIBBS that is because you have not read his posts, or, you lack the comprehension to understand so many words at one time. LOL!

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      There is a God, and His name is Jesus Christ. Period. The only living God. All others are dead and buried, and still in their graves. God has destroyed the earth, which He made, once with water, and has it reserved for destruction when he comes again, with fire. It is His, and His alone. And we are pompous if we think of ourselves as great enough to destroy it. It isnt going to happen. He has reserved that right for Himself. And He will destroy it with fire, 2 Peter 3:7, and then will form a new earth Rev. 21:1. Man cannot destroy the earth. The Lord has reserved that for Himself. We cannot do it.

      • 45caliber

        You are correct. But there are some people who insist mankind is the only real god. It makes them feel far more important.

        • Lewis Munn

          Is this why so many are hellbent on destroying the earth, or remaking it into the image they want?

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            Maybe. But God calls us to be good stewards of all we have been given, and that includes the earth. We should take care of it as we can, and not do stupid things like dump old oil into the woods, or antifreeze and chemicals down the sink. We shouldnt throw our wrappers and bottles and cans out the windows of our cars, or our cig butts on the ground. But as someone else posted, many think of themselves as being god, and they do want they want to do, and just dont care. But those who profess to know God, are charged with caring about it. But I myself, I dont believe in global warming, Ive looked at weather patterns since theyve recorded them, and I see them as being a cyclical thing, with no know pattern. And I sure as heck arent going to put 65 thousand dollars worth of solar panels on my roof, or buy 20 acres and put up 200 windmills that I cant afford, let alone aford the upkeep on them. I love the forest, the woods, the streams, the mountains and oceans and lakes. But Im not a greenie, in any form. Those guys are extremists, and they do many dangerous and destructive things, even to this environment they claim to be “saving”.

        • karolyn

          45- Each and every one of us is important no matter what our beliefs.

          • Thamera

            do apply that same consideration to the unborn child karolyn?

        • Jay

          Yes, 45caliber, the original sin! That’s what destroyed the highest ranking angel, Lucifer, he wanted to be god!

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            Ezekial 28: 12-19

    • 45caliber

      Jay:

      You are right. In fact someone yesterday posted the goals of these people which include areas that man can live in. But, interestingly enough to me at least, they always expect themselves from those human enclaves. Only the rest of the people have to live there. They plan to live in the wild to monitor nature – by building nice ranch houses at government expense (our expense) and spending their days riding around and enjoying the world without other humans doing the same thing.

      • Jay

        45caliber, these insane and atheistic monsters will soon be wiped of the face of the earth! God will not allow this kind of madness and oppression to continue much longer! Good riddance to this pack of idiotic mules!!!

      • Lewis Munn

        I hear Al Gore has built himself an oceanside mansion well below the predicted rise in ocean levels due solely to Man!

        Wonder how long he can live in it?

        • Jay

          Sounds like a very expensive coffin! And to think, that this lunatic, was once our Vice-President.

          • Cawmun Cents

            Sounds to me like someone has a serious depletage of Soylent Green TeaTM in his liquid regimen.Get on your Jack-boots,goose step out to your Chevy VoltTM and glide on over to the global marketTM.Scan you some Soylent Green TeaTM,and get with the program citizen.See you there!

  • BigBadJohn

    “The invisible hand that Smith spoke of when describing how free markets create wealth was at work when oil was trading above $120 per barrel. The record purchases of hybrid cars three years ago were evidence that free markets work. ”

    so true, one good thing about high gas prices.

    The only subsidy that should be given for green energy should be something along the lines of the “X prize” that was given for the first civilian space shot.
    Set some very high goals for solar panels, $/watts, or weight.
    With a set prize for the first person to achieve it.

    I had read about a group of scientists that had developed a nano-technology paint that turned your whole house into a solar collector. Wonder what ever happened to that????? Was the patent bought and buried like that 100 mpg carburetor we all heard about?

    • patty

      MN the liberal state that it is, is now researching a mileage tax. Because so many people bought the hybreds and gas consumption in MN is going down, they are not collecting enough tax on gas, so lets come up with a new tax. It just goes to show, you are damned if you do, damned if you don’t and there is no end to their imagination of coming up with a new tax. It reminds me of criminals. If they would spend as much time putting their imagination to a lawful use, they would probably be ahead of the curve instead of losing their freedoms to prison. This will never end.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        Yeah, the same state that put their school buses on bio-diesel fuel, you know, to save the environment. Only thing is, bio-diesel fuel gels when it gets cold, so winter came and none of the buses would run. So then they built great big garages, with running heat 24-7 to keep the buses warm so that they would run in the morning. But there was a problem. Not all of them would fit in the garages. So the rest of them, they pulled up and parked outside, and just let them run all night so they would work in the morning. Genius. Sheer stinking genius. So now that they have saved the environment going to bio-diesel fuel, they are burning natural gas all night to heat buildings and burning bio-fuel all night in the other ones so that they will run. What a joke. They are causing much, much more damage to the environment than if they would have just left it be. Of course, then they also elected Al Franken, so you can see what kind of people we are dealing with here. Unbelievable.

        • patty

          Ya, and those mandatory CFL bulbs don’t work worth a you know what in this climate! Also, can anyone here who believes in all of this global warming tell me where they are going to put all of these car batteries once used up? Hello landfill! Also, our electrical grid will not support the charging of all these vehicles if everyone moves in that direction. Do they realize we will have to build more nuclear and coal plants to generate enough electricity to run them? I cannot believe the amount of uneducated masses.

      • Lewis Munn

        Never underestimate the wiles of the tax collector.

        But wonder why the governments do not raise the taxes on other technologies too, or…reduce the controls so they do not have to spend so much money?

    • 45caliber

      BBJ:

      No, no one bought the patent for that carborator. The Dept. of Energy refused to allow the inventor to market it because it would reduce the amount of fuel taxes the feds gathered each year.

      If he had marketed it, I guarantee you that I’d have been buying one to cut my fuel use. So would most people. And that would have cut the taxes by 1/2 to 1/3.

      The new road tax is to get around the electric cars and the natural gas vehicles coming down the line. They want to install GPS’s in the cars that contain a short range radio. They would transmit your milage to a receiver they plan to put up beside the road at various points. Then you get a bill each month for your “road use tax”. Further, at least one Congressman has proposed that they could also use it to note when you exceeded the speed limit and send you a ticket each time you did as well as failure to stop at stop signs.

      I don’t know about your GPS map but mine is off on both things. Further, a lot of roads aren’t even on it yet – and some are over fifty years old.

      • Thamera

        Exactly Patty, energy costs will only continue to increase as well as taxes. They will only shift from one place to another. The green movement is only another attempt to control people and it is scary isn’t it how many people gulp that down so eagerly but then claim that it is groups like the tea party that are attempting to take away our freedom? It really does put into question ones lucidity…(Denniso, Jovi, Bob w….)

      • patty

        Everyone try this. Open another screen. In your upper finder box (mine is google) key in your cell phone number. I did this and it showed on a map where I was at in the suburbs. I tried it from a clients office space downtown on my computer there. It showed me that my cell phone was downtown within a block of where I was. I don’t have GPS on my phone or tracking turned on. Kinda scary!

        • JeffH

          patty, I did a trace on my cell phone and the city is correct but the location and the carrier are incorrect. I will admit that the name that pops up on the caller ID’s I call shows someone elses name…not even close. I’ve had my current cell phone service for 3 years and even tried to get the ID corrected. Now I’m glad it is incorrect and I’m leavin it that way.

          • Patty

            JeffH – Try it from a different computer and location. I don’t quite get “traced” in your comment. Your phone has a GPS in it and gives the location where you are at if you punch it into google (whether you have it turned on or not. If you email someone a picture from your phone, it gives the GPS coordinates of where that pic was taken. On vacation? The ones that want to rob you will know by cruising the web. There is just too much info buried in whatever you communicate to others that you may not even realize. I never post anything even remotely traceable on facebook. I absolutely remove any “tags” on any picture of me posted on that site. It just seems like why too much big brother for me.

    • Dale on the left coast

      “Was the patent bought and buried like that 100 mpg carburetor we all heard about?”

      IT WAS AN URBAN MYTH!!!! Anyone who knows anything about Tuning a gas or diesel engine . . . . when the Air/Fuel Ratio drops below a certain point about 10 to 1 . . . . it becomes a Cutting Torch and Melts the engine. There never was a “Carburetor” only THE STORY!!

      • BigBadJohn

        IT was SARCASM – of course it was an urban myth……

        • 45caliber

          Not … necessarily.

          I’ve ridden in a Trihumph that got 75 mpg. I wish I had one now.

          And I’ve read an article about the son of the creator of the first carborator. Between him and his father, they had 85% of all patents on those.

          At present about 15% of the gasoline is vaporized and used for power. The rest is burned as small droplets in the exhaust. That’s one reason so many vehicles have catalystic converters – they are there to insure the droplets burn. But they do NOT provide energy.

          The person above created a carborator that would vaporize 35% of the gasoline. Basically is lightly more than doubled the gas milage. If your car got 1 mpg, it would now get 2. If it got 50 mpg, it could get 100. He was not allowed by the Dept. of Energy to make and sell these because they were afraid they would lose too much tax.

      • patty

        Dale-I tried to find that same thing and could only find that it was a myth also.

    • Lewis Munn

      It probably blistered and flaked off, or else shorted in the summer sun and burned the house down!

      Musta been a few bugs in the system!

  • Ed Herold

    There seems to be many people that think they are so smart they will destroy all they come in contact with as they think they know better than anyone else. We have been given the tools within America to live very comfortable,, Please lets get back to Oil and coal as we have more than anyone else in the world. In time we will develop the other tools needed for green – In years to come these smart people will try to destroy or get rid of the oil and gas some way as it then will be in the way———–Trust in the Lord as he has come thru time and time again.

    • karolyn

      Have you not seen the destruction of people that coal brings about? I recently saw a piece on tv about a town in the midst of the coal industry where every street has someone with cancer. There is a new show on called “Coal” about what coal miners have to live with. Yes, I know they would have no means of making a living without coal mining; however, what is the quality of their lives? We are here in earth to enjoy life. No one should have to live like that.

      • Conservative at Birth

        That is their choice and yours. Or don’t you believe in allowing people to make their own choices? I think you have demonstrated a Totalitarian belief system in most of your posts here.

      • NC1

        Karolyn, you’re sounding more radical all the time! As Conservative at Birth says, that IS their choice. We all get to make them – rather we MUST make them. For you to talk down to the choices of others actually paints you with the “progressive” brush in some of the worst possible ways (not that there are any good ways to be painted with that particular brush).

      • 45caliber

        karolyn:

        You almost got it. You said they mine coal because there isn’t anything else to do to earn a living. Correct. So … you want to bann it so they can’t get sick mining it? Then what would their life style be? Welfare recipients?

        You can go too far trying to keep someone safe. What needs to be done – and I suspect IS done – is that they have improved the safety of doing the mining. And they will continue to do that. That makes a lot more sense to me than forcing them all to live in the poverty level on welfare.

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          Not only that, but these people are coal mining people, and they embrace it, and they are proud of it. And things have come a long way since what Karolyn is talking about with everyone on the corner having cancer from it. In the old days, they had no ventilation, no masks, and it was terrible. They now have plenty of safeguards, and pump in oxygen and make it a much safer, and cleaner process than it ever was. We need to use our coal and our oil, and dump these Saudi’s to the curb, or at least start taking some of their oil for protecting them, because without our backing, Saudi Arabia would have fallen a long, long time ago.

      • Jay

        On TV you say, well then, I guess that makes it the Gospel! Tele-evangelism is still going strong, hey Karolyn!

      • Lewis Munn

        Execute the coal miners and their families at once…stop delaying. Be pre-emptive on cancer. Much cheaper to kill them all now, and cut medical costs.

        Do that same thing for smokers, too, while we are at it.

        • Jay

          Why only coal miners and smokers? Why not obese people, the mentally challenged, people who engage in risky behaviour like; homosexuals, athletes engaged in contact sports, people that live on fault-lines, near volcanos…and so on!

      • JIBBS

        DUH, did you notice that those moron’s on that show, choose not to wear any type of breathing protection? They made a choice, so don’t cry to me. Pat attention!

      • DaveH

        But, Karolyn, you just said earlier that the Earth would do just fine without us. Make up your mind.
        And, unless I’m wrong, nobody put a gun to those coal-miners’ heads to force them to work in those mines.
        We all are going to die someday, Karolyn. How about you and your Liberal friends making life a little easier by butting out of our personal choices?

        • Thamera

          Funny isn’t it DaveH how people like karolyn are so concerned with how people act, what they say, what they do, but then champion issues like…abortion????

          • DaveH

            Because, as you and I know, their policies are all about relieving other people of their money and that is all.

          • karolyn

            hamera I do not “champion” abortion. I advocate “free choice.”

          • Jay

            “Free choice” is code word for; Kill the polluting and resource consuming human!

          • karolyn

            Jay – You’re all for less government and laws and more freedom only when it suits your belief system.

          • DaveH

            Ditto, Karolyn. So how about practicing what you preach?

          • Thamera

            And now karolyn, based on former posts involving abortion, you are just being dis-in-genuine. I am also pro-choice in that I believe people have free agency, but – I abhor the practice of abortion…do you?

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            Karolyn – Free Choice – is a left wing liberal term that means its ok to murder an infant in their mothers womb by sucking them out and tearing them to pieces. Its murder, and there is no other way to put it. I dont care if your a Christian like me, or an Atheist like DaveH, the act of ending ones life intentionally like that, is murder. If you dont want the child, give it up for abortion, so that someone who lovingly wants a child but cant have one, can take this helpless child off your hands and give them a decent chance of having a good life. Free Choice. What a cop-out term that is.

      • JeffH

        karolyn, have you seen the commercial where the pre-teen little girl puts a cigarette in her mouth and a side clip comes in showing an old lady with a hole(tracheotomy)in her throat still smoking a cigarette? Do you know who’s paying for that commercial? The American Taxpayers.

        Propaganda pure and simple. FYI, I don’t and never have smoked but I do feel for the smokers that are forced to pay exorbitantnt prices on their smokes because of anti-smokers and government force.

        • DaveH

          The thing that Karolyn and other Liberals don’t understand is that none of us is going to get out of this life alive. The best we can do is leave other people alone to make their own mistakes, and then let them pay for their own mistakes. That’s the peaceful way.

          • Karolyn

            Dave – Why would you think I don’t understand that?

          • patty

            Karolyn-I think people get that idea about you from your previous posts on how the gov’t. should regulate more, take care of everything, make decisions for everyone in a one size fits all mentality. It is you and you alone who make people think of you that way.

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            Your right Dave, to a point. Like I dont smoke or do drugs, but to those that want to, they are going to regardless of what anybody or anylaw says, so let them do it, as long as they arent harming others. But when it comes to someone sucking a live child out of their mother, then there is another in this picture, who is not having their feelings taken into consideration, and that is the baby being sucked out. I have to draw a line there, and say no, you can just do what you want, because in doing that, you are murdering another. I have no acceptance of that at all.

          • karolyn

            Patty – That is not true. I most emphatically DO NOT support more government regulation and have never said I did.

          • patty

            Karolyn-Then exactly what does this mean?
            karolyn says:
            April 20, 2011 at 8:02 am
            The only thing that can help us at the pump is more regulation on Wall Street. I’m sure you know that the reason for our high prices on gas are the greedy oil speculators.

            And it didn’t take me long to find that. It is your post on this same blog. You said it in this post, and you have said it in others.
            I just don’t have the time to find them all.

        • Jay

          And yet, they still collect millions in tobacco taxes that are in turn used to vilify smokers!

          • JeffH

            Imagine that!

      • Lewis Munn

        Some of us believe we are here to glorify our Maker and serve those we can who are in need.

    • 45caliber

      Ed:

      I agree with you. Part of the problem is that people look back on things like London during the late 1800′s when they burned coal there and everyone stayed black all the time. Now they have the technology to stop that – but the “greens” continue to paint a picture of London back then as an example to stay away from.

      Almost anything is bad if you don’t take the time and trouble to control it – by yourself, not via the government. Even too much water will kill you if you don’t control how you use it.

      • Lewis Munn

        Agreed.

        We could say living is dangerous, and maybe all living things should be killed now! Think of the slaughter of germs with antiseptics! Trillions every day.

      • Carlucci

        Did you know that there used to be wild salmon swimming in the Thames?

  • Klaus

    It never fails to amaze me that there are so called educated people that actually believe man has the power to change the earth’s climate. I have absolutely no problem with cleaning up the environment, but man is not responsible for the ozone layer or climate change. Most likely is that the leadership of the environmental movement are in it to control anything and everything, and are using this global warming hoax to accomplish this.

    • patty

      ABSOLUTELY! No matter what “good intentions” are thought behind all of these enviro(mental)ists, the fact is that with all the damage we have done since we have become industrilized, it is nothing compared to a burp from a volcano. We should be good to our earth, it is the only one we have, but using propaganda and mis information to try to control others is not the way to go. It resolves nothing but to further divide good people.

      • Vigilant

        “No matter what “good intentions” are thought behind all of these enviro(mental)ists…”

        You’ve hit the nail head on. It has always struck me that there are two kinds of liberals, the first type with genuine (though misguided) concerns for “social justice,” saving the environment, etc. and the second type who are the power-hungry, prevaricating propagandists who prey on the fears and sympathies of the true bleeding hearts.

        Notwithstanding the noble intentions of the liberal masses, the opportunist politicians are abusing these good intentions to forward an agenda that will accomplish two things: to line their coffers and consolidate their power over other people.

        • Carlucci

          I read in a book long ago that said the world’s problems revolve around two kinds of people – the busybodies who want to control everything and everyone, and the ones who want to be left alone. I want to be left alone.

          • libertytrain

            Me too Carlucci – I get tired of all those nosy baboons.

          • Vigilant

            Ditto, Carlucci. My dog and I will survive just fine.

            P.S. Thanks for the offer on “Shadow,” but I’d die without him.

          • Carlucci

            I know you would, Vigilant. Shadow sounds wonderful – Huskies are so gorgeous. I feel the same way about my big red puppy dog Willem (collie/chow/german shepherd/golden retriever mix). He is awesome. After my husband died I wanted to die, too. Thank goodness my two dogs were such a comfort to me. Don’t know what I would have done without them. Sadly, my basset hound Chloe passed away 2+ years after I lost my husband. That just about killed me. I still miss my “big boned gal”, but I’m so grateful I still have Mr. Willem.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      I agree totally. Its all agenda based to make a buck. Just like Al Gore and GE did, when they stood to make billions if they could hype it up enough. But hey, they got caught, they lied, and have you noticed your not seeing old Al up there yelling global warming every two minutes on TV like he was. They know they have been exposed, but all the liberal left bought into it. Just like they bought into change, change, change. And what a joke that turned out to be also.

      • Lewis Munn

        They talk of change, but they want all our folding money instead.

    • Jay

      Climate change? That’s like saying, water is wet! Of course climate changes, that’s what climate does, by the way, there was climate change long before the industrial age!

    • Lewis Munn

      We could now. As it says in the Bible, in the end days knowledge shall increase. And it sure is, tho often not used or used rightly.

      We could change the climate drastically by orbiting black panels to block off as significant part of the atmosphere from direct sunlight. Eclipse the sun for 2 hours a day would have a definite effect!

  • Dorothy Jones

    All this green talk Obama is pushing is just another way he can contribute to destroying this country. He has so much looked forward to the ,” Fall of America.” It is eating him alive because he has not succeeded yet during his first trem so he is seeking a second term to make sure it will be a done deal.

    • 45caliber

      Actually, I think the reason he announced so eary running for a second term is 1) all he knows how to do is run so he might as well make it official and 2) he wanted to jump in before the Democrat Party decided someone else is more electable.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        I agree, and I still think he is totally unelectable, and the democrats know it, and as it gets closer, I think you will see them pressure him into announcing he will not see re-election. They would force him out, but he has a card he can play that they fear.

      • Lewis Munn

        What do you think the odds are he will make a Presidential Mandate that everybody vote for him or not vote at all? Or get Harry Reid and all his loyal congressmen to pass a late-night law changing the election rules so only votes cast for him will be counted?

        Harry’s computer repairmen can also change the algorithms so the computers give every other vote that is not for him to him, so he wins in a landslide. But the tampering is not obvious.

        • 45caliber

          Lewis:

          Hairy’s computer repairmen are all union. Imagine that!

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            A democrat in bed with union guys? No way man. So it aint so?

        • JeffH

          Sounds like the coin toss of “heads I win, tails you lose” scam.

    • Lewis Munn

      Sounds about right. I think he wants the Muslims to come off the desert and come to the land of milk and money he is usurping for them!

  • David O. Johnson

    This is an excellent assessment. There probably is natural warming but if the entire US goes broke going green, it can not change what is in process. The entire green movement deludes themselves to think that the rest of the world will follow. Look at Spain’s attempts and the result. We have much greater problems that we can do something about.

    • 45caliber

      I agree. Further, the US is the cleanest nation on Earth. Don’t believe it? Go visit some other nation and compare city to city. We can’t solve the problems of other countries, no matter how hard we try or how much money we pump into it.

      • Lewis Munn

        Agreed, based on limited experience. Singapore is a nice country, but incredibly messy when the religious festivals occur, with paper stuff all over, food spoiling at the curb, etc.

    • Vigilant

      If the environmentalists believe that China and India, let alone other developing nations, won’t nullify all our efforts to clean up the environment, then I’d like to sell them a bridge in Brooklyn.

    • Lewis Munn

      Look at how they measure “Global Warming” now…in big cities, with the gauges near the exhaust of air conditioners, and on black paved areas.

      Anything to fudge the data and cost us more money. So many “scientists” now are paid to find what the politicians desire, to put more government on our backs, and take more money from our pockets.

  • Bert Cundle

    Better check the Gas priceses Today! The Arabs DON’T NEED MORE $$$ They are punnishing us! For our eledged PEOPLES Government!

    • 45caliber

      The Arabs are getting low on oil and are trying to get as much profit as they can before it runs out. So far most of their efforts to fund another source of income are falling through.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        And I think that is part of the problem as to why we arent drilling our own. I think the plan is to suck them dry and then we will have all the oil power. Problem is, from everything Ive read, it takes approximately 10 years from starting a drilling operation to having it pumped out, refined and ready for use. And we need refineries, which take awhile to build also. So do we have enough reserves to get us through 10 years? That is the question.

        • Lewis Munn

          Not under current governmental policies.

          Tho maybe we can disguise wells as wind turbines!!

    • Vigilant

      How about placing the blame where it belongs? The Arabs be damned, it’s the envirowacko policies of a socialist government, in league with the Wall Street speculators, who are doing it to us.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        And who is the one single factor that makes the most on a gallon of gas? The US government and its tax of .46 a gallon, or somewhere around that, and oh yeah, Obama wants to raise that, evidently to make up for the lost revenue of all the jobs he keeps costing us, and to raise more money to pay for all the government jobs he keeps creating as he does the democrat thing, of growing government.

        • Vigilant

          Federal Excise Tax is 18.4 cents per gallon. The states and localities tack on even higher amounts, resulting in an average of around 50 cents total Fed, state & local.

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            First they attacked the smokers and drove off all those millions in taxes they were collecting. Now they want to get everyone off of gasoline and onto electric cars, then they will lose all those billions of tax dollars. What next, Campbell soup? They wont overdue going after the liquor and beer and wine industries, because they all use those products. So maybe bubble gum? Crackers? It wont stop, they will go from one thing to the next, until they chase it all away. Dumb butts.

  • FreedomFighter

    “I don’t know if Obama and his Green coalition are nefarious”

    They are Progressive/Liberal/Socialist/Communist revolutionary scumbags that do not believe America as it is…should exist and they mean to fundamentally change America into the vision they have of a Marxist utopia: slavery, dispair, genocide.

    Nefarious is way to mild a term for these people.

    America is at the edge of an abyss:

    IMHO lose the budget battle and do not greatly reduce spending and the national debt and America falls to the evil and godless ones.

    Obama elected to a 2nd term, America will fall to the evil and godless ones.

    Laus Deo
    Semper Fi

  • http://charter howe

    The Earth goes through a 15,000 year cycle of global warming and has for millions of years, so I can’t blame Al Gore and some of his cronies for conjecturing up a believable yet unproven set of scientific facts that was the under pinning of the green movement. There is a company in Chicago that is churning out a green agenda and they are making billions of dollars, and why doesn’t it surprise me that Al Gore has holdings in that company as does many of his liberal cronies and did I mention that Gore may become the first Carbon footprint billionaire of the world. We need a green movement for the right reasons and one that does not create an Obama do or die agenda for eliminating oil and coal. The year long struggle to get oil drilling moritoreums lifted and the massive red tape to get a drilling license issued along with the threats for new oil tax and the constant attacks on oil company profits by Obama and the democrats at a time when gas is 4 bucks a gallon is insanely stupid. This President claims he wants more tax from the rich, but he doesnt seem to mind being the catylist for hardworking poor people to pay rediculous prices for gas at the pump and lots more for food and other products in case some of you didn’t notice. I wonder if we will tolerate the bullcrap from the progressive liberal democrats to the point that their devisiveness will create riots and other turmoil just like whats happeneing in Greece. I spent 29 years in the military and I have seen first hand how sorry leadership in some countries keeps their people ignorant and in poverty and danger.

    • Lewis Munn

      Approximately 65 million years ago, a huge asteroid carved out the Gulf of Mexico. The debris caused a “nuclear winter” of sorts.

      The impact also knocked the crust loose from the core shifted it, so the North pole, which had been in the pacific, was now in a small landlocked sea we call the arctic ocean, and the South pole is now landlocked in the continent we call Antarctica.

      Possibly the orbit of the earth was made more variable, or more noticeably so, on about as 90,000 year period. Made a bit more variable, also, Ice layers have shown this, as I have read. If this is correct, we have one time now, next will be in 90,000 years, so we need to do it right this time, and getting off the earth into space would be a good idea, if we see a need to survive.

      These are physical cycles, and have been determined by the ice layers, etc. We are still on the temperature upside of this short cycle, so the Northwest Passage is about open for shipping again.

      Ice records show the changes, the long cycle and the short cycle.

      • Lewis Munn

        I agree wirth yoiu, Howe, on many items. Because we have one time around, from the ice record, we need to do it really correctly, not politically corrtectly, especially not liberally politically correctly, ending stuck on an earth under the dictatorship of the Liberals.

        We get another Rome going, shows for the oppressed public, wild parties for the rich, and sacrificing the conservatives and the religious who mention the defects of society, and man may never recover!

  • 45caliber

    The thing that people should remember is that mankind is not that powerful. The problem is with those who believe mankind is god. “We are the most powerful things in existence. Nothing is more powerful. And this proves it …”

    To Earth, man is simply another form of ant. Like ants, there are a lot of us – but not nearly as many as there are ants. We scarcely distrub the looks of the planet and we scarcely do anything else that might disturb it.

    The theory of global warming came about during a phase when the sun was especially warm. You could tell it from looking at other plantes in the system but that was ignored. The “scientists” who proclaimed it were getting massive amounts of grant money from governments – and they still do. As long as they can get that money they will continue to proclaim global warming as a problem.

    One of the main problems was that Al Gore jumped onto the bandwagon – after he had bought millions of dollars worth of stock in companies that have (expensive!) equipment to remove CO2 from the air. He is hoping to get his pals in Washington to pass a law requiring plants in the US to use his equipment since he can then expect to be a billionare within months. They, in turn, expect him to give them massive campaign contributions but are still somewhat leary of the citizens finding out about it.

    If you are REALLY concerned about carbon in the air, plant a tree. It removes it and releases oxygen, which we all need to breathe. And the nice thing it that it costs very little to buy and plant a tree – and it continues to get bigger and better the longer it grows.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      Al Gore and G.E., and a few other corporations stood to make billions on this phony baloney green stuff. They got caught lying, hyping their agenda. Al Gore is a joke. G.E. makes stuff in Mexico and should not be allowed to sell it back here, since they saw fit to leave. Their light bulbs burn out in a month. I wont buy anything again that says GE on it. Ever.

      • Thamera

        Yes, and when they got caught in their lies they just changed their terminology to fit their lies because they truly think that we are all complete idiots..ie global warming is now climate change (lol). Anyone who doesn’t find the egotistical, condescending nature of elites like Al Gore offensive and demeaning deserve to be a pawn in their grab for power and money.

        • Lewis Munn

          How much CO2 does Al Gore’s private jet give off each mile of all the trips he makes? Does he use it to go to his favorite stores shopping?

      • patty

        Beberoni-GE also finances many of the retailers credit cards.

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          Probably the ones that break in half after 2 months..

  • Patriot

    All those wind farms sure look nice don’t they? Living near these things is extremely loud; the next thing will be man-made noise pollution! Can we STOP the madness? If and when alternative methods become efficient and profitable the free-market will make it accessible to all. You cannot force progress, the only reason these folks are forcing technologies and policies are to line their own pockets! Imagine that politicians that are actually trying to save us all when they are profiteering from their agendas! These jokers would be more believable if they lived as they talked; no they want us all to live in poverty while they save us living high on our sweat & dollars.

    • Lewis Munn

      Agreed, most are hypocrites, and those that care are voted down!

    • ValDM

      Re: windfarms. Thousands of acres of farmland have been removed from production. Wildlife won’t go near them (why aren’t the enviorwhackos yelling about that?) Do you know what wind turbines are called by the people in the business? Bird guillotines. Sound like something you can endorse with a clean conscience?

      • Thamera

        Our state just invested in a large wind farm with promises of lowered energy bills and guess what? It has turned into a huge, wasteful and expensive boondoggle which is going to INCREASE the price of energy for all of us and has thoroughly embarrassed the state legislatures as they scramble to try and make all of this “palatable” for us living here. Morons.

        • patty

          Thamera-Wasn’t that GE and T. Boone Pickens? I was trying to find a quote I thought I read somewhere that wind generation will never pay off. http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,450464,00.html

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            It wont, and solar panels are only good if your guaranteed sun all day. Like a place I went to fish in Canada years ago, built a laundry/shower room, all lighted and water heated and powered by this big ugly solar panels they put in where they cut down a bunch of the trees. Yeah, that is what they did. The first day, it was nice having a hot shower, because in the past it wasnt there, and you either went dirty or warmed up water on a coleman stove. However, it turned cloudy and rained most of the week, and needless to say, to go to the bathroom in there, you had to take a flashlight or lantern, because there wasnt even enough power to light a single light bulb. Highly unreliable energy source, expensive, and not practical for most places. And wind farms, most for one cannot afford them or the land to put them on, they are eyesores, and they kill birds and wildlife, and dont put out enough energy to compensate what they cost to build. Then, talk to some areas that have had them for awhile, and have had to have people come in and work on them because a bearing wore out or something like that. Very, very expensive. Not the answer at all.

    • 45caliber

      Patriot:

      You are correct. Several Congressmen want to outlaw a lot of chemicals in the US including NINE ELEMENTS. In fact every metal is on the list except iron. It would shut down all chemical plants and most other businesses – or at least make the businesses expenses go up without increasing any of their profits.

      For instance, aluminum is on the list to bann. The reason? If it is combined with another chemical it can be toxic. But the dirt itself is approximately 12% aluminum! They want to do this because they want to keep us safe. When questioned about it and the loss of jobs, once Congressman stated that he realizes that a lot of Americans now making more than $10 an hour will lose their jobs but “they will be safe!” And, he went on, they can always get jobs as waitresses or convenience store clerks. If they can’t do that, the government will “take care of them”. And we won’t have to worry about pollution because it doesn’t cross our country’s borders (like the illegals do.)

    • Lewis Munn

      I cannot speak for the noise, never been near one rthst was really running. But I know what used to be a beautiful drive into San Francisco is now abusive to the eyes! Ugly, Ugly, Ugly!!! Pretty hills are torn up, trees gone, etc.

      Wonder how many birds they kill each year, or if the noise keeps all birds away forever?

      I heard they put a huge one in in Iowa in an area it seldom blows! Land was cheaper in the hollow!

      I wonder how one looks after a tornado goes through the farm.

      • patty
        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          This is a perfect example of government interferance and wrongful regulations, where they pick and choose to whom the law applies. Because these windmill folks have lined the pockets of government officials, and the government hasnt given them a black eye yet, like the democrats have big oil, they get a free pass. Just remember when demonizing the oil companies like so many do, that yes, although they do make billions, these same politicians that demonize them to the the general public, seemingly make more money off of the oil sold in this country than do the oil companies.

  • don

    One thing is ,China has already started using alternative fuels and second putting hot,poisonous gas into the atmosphere isn’t healthy. I realize this is a investment website, so why don’t you get your investors interested in these technologies. And why doesn’t “wall street” invest in this country instead of against it!

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      China is the top polluter in the world. They are just now getting where we were at during the industrial revolution. Remember how our corporations used to just dump everything the the local river and spew everything into the air without scrubbers or filters? They are doing that in China, on a scale that dwarfs what we did in those days. Already, villages down stream are dying off, from being poisoned by what they dump. And you know what. They dont care. They have no regard for human rights there, and they never have. What the government wants to do, they do. You protest against them, they shoot you, or imprison you. They have no EPA or guide lines to go by, so they just dump the crap whereever they want. They are going to have a big disaster over there, and at the rate they are going, it isnt going to take long.

      • Lewis Munn

        And how long does it take for their pollution to hit the USA and Canada?

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          They dont care. As blunt as that may sound, its the truth. They dont care.

    • Lewis Munn

      Remember an antipollution additive that all gas companies had to mix in, and it was polluting the ground water right and left? Most congressmen seem anxious to vote things in that get them contributions, even before comprehensive testing.

      After all, they do not have to live like the rest of us.

      IF we made them live on the wages of a common person, put them under all the rules we have, you might find some common sense emerging. Might!

      • Thamera

        Exactly Beberoni and Lewis. I know people that live and work in China. They moved their business to China for more favorable tax rates and will be the first to tell you that the Chinese really love their cars and aren’t about to give them up. Beijing is experiencing some of the worst traffic and congestion in the world as the govt. is scrambling to make the underground subway more “cool” to entice people to use it. Not to reduce energy consumption, but to relieve some of the congestion on the freeways. And believe me, the Chinese think that we Americans are STUPID, they laugh at our folly, they laugh at our government, they laugh at all of our misguided policies, regulations and attempt to control the environment and they don’t care. They aren’t in debt, WE ARE!

        • karolyn

          Well, of course China is in good shape. It’s called total governmental control, or communism. Which way do you want it Thamera? You’re anti-communism but using China as your example of a debt-free country that’s laughing at us.

          • 45caliber

            And you believe we should mimic China’s government as a good thing?

            Perhaps you should visit China for a couple of years. They aren’t worried about pollution – that’s something the US does. One friend who goes to China on business regularly told me that one town he visited makes phosphorous … in their homes. They dig the ore by hand, take it home and smelt it on their kitchen stoves. Then they put it into a 30 gallon barrel and carry it on a bycycle to the port to sell. Every person in town, including new babies, have burns and scars from it. The people breathe it daily as they work in their kitchens. Do YOU want to live like that?

          • karolyn

            45 – I was being facetious with Thamera. Don’t get your panties in a bunch!

          • Thamera

            Did I say China was in good shape karolyn? China has become more capitalistic than America karolyn. AS China progresses we digress into the abyss of “progressive change”. China has overcome a lot in the past 30 years but there is still a lot to be desired. My dear lady you live a very sheltered life.

          • Karolyn

            Far, far from sheltered, Thamera.

          • 45caliber

            karolyn:

            I have to agree with Thamera

          • patty

            Karolyn-They may be debt free now, but look at how their population lives. That is where we are headed, only bankrupt.

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          We do have far, far too many governmental controls, too much red tape and governmental interference. Some is need, many are not. But because China has money right now, is no reason to blatantly dump large amounts of chemicals and waste into streams and rivers, and kill people downstream in native areas, and not care. They are ignorant, or just dont care. Back in our industrial revolution, people just didnt know about the damage they were doing dumping everything. Im sure they thought the water would just carry it away and disperse it. Now days we know better. In China, they havent yet found out that there are consequences to being industrialized. It is new to them. But their government could care less about people in most instances, and it doesnt bother them to let places dump waste in the rivers and streams, because those same people downstream are expendable to them, and they dont care. And no amount of money makes that right. No amount. That is not success to me. That is blatant stupidity. And they will pay for it sooner or later.

  • http://com i41

    Cancer is just cells gone wild that the body can not beat. All diseases and medical problemsare ways to thin the weak ones out. Coal is a great mineial anfd more people die from over heating and freezing than the supposedly cancers from it. Most people who die from cancer in the coal burning areas smoke, but that is apersonal choice and the rest of us shouldn’t have to suffer their dumb azzed choices. As for the quality of coal miners I know many who retire at age 55 and have insurance for life and have made enough to buy plenty of land to make off like fat rats. They all drive brand new vehicles every years and all have paid off houses in Wyo., several drive in 200 miles one way to work their shift and spend their time off back home. I know 3 brothers that started when they were 18-21 and one is always off taking care ofthe places, and are about 40 and have over 8,000 acres of farmground and 400 head of beef. Not to bad a start in life, and they aren’t union slubs, and if you want a good azz beating call them a scab. As for oil drilling I’m going to sell a deck hand that is buying a lot from me next week for his family to build a house on that is paying cash. This envior b–l s–t is another pie in the sky crap theory. When any simple minded bastard talks bio fuels, it isn’t cost effective and never will be. One of my daughter has a degree in bio fuels and when she was a 3-4 year student she worked for the professors gathering samples and testing of switchgrass samples. It will burn but the only way to utalize it for efficency was to pellet it and burn it like wood pellets. But the draw back was the transportation and equipment cost to produce it. When it was used as a ethanol source the fiber left over, could not be sprayed on coal to get more BTU,because of evior regs from the belyway and green bastards, even if there was no smoke. Burn a bunch of straw and see how much smoke or ash is left. Hell of a hot flame for s few seconds and no smoke avery little ash, 50 lbs will give you maybe a 1/4 cup of ash. When a closed loop feedlot was proposed to be built in centeral SD, and they were raising money, to buy shares you had to supply at least 59 head a year of feeder cattle, the grain would be pretty much barely, corn, and milo all pretty high sugars cntent and great feeding material, the manure would be turned in to compost for methane and the heat from the digestor, would kill the pathogenes. The methane would supply the heat for the ethanol and the silage would be shipped by conveyor to the feed bunks for the livestock. Another f–king democrap at the time Tax Cheat Daschle promised beltway help with the EPA and other impedements. There we people in 6 states that were in the company. At the last minute when dirt work and concrete work had started, in typical democrap fashion Daschle renigged and several people were screwed out of money, and tasx cheat got beat. It was a producer iwned company for one, 2 the EPA requires all siage be dried down to a certain level which increases the cost and since this was wet feed which any animal will gain agrow better on was the hang up. Self contained and self producing heat, fuel and food. So all of you 4 decades old hippy drug heads need a good beating, a close hair cut and a hanging for dreaming up this s–t. No wonder you hang on this marrxist muslim morons every wordand are soros socialist dumbocraps.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      It isnt much cheaper at the gas pump, it doesnt burn as clean in the vehicle and causes deposits that gunk up the motor, and you gas mileage is not as good with it. Who are we kidding? This isnt the solution. Then, figure in, the amount of corn they are using to make it, all kind of food costs have gone up and skyrocketed because of it. And someone is being greedy, whether its the farmer, the processor or the refiner or the seller, but they are wanting pretty close to what gasoline costs, and its an inferior product to gasoline. It is, a big joke, and not the answer to anything. I remember they said if we started producing this E-85 ethanol fuel, that gas prices would drop. Hello – they are over 4.00 a gallon now in Indiana. And by the way, I know the president doesnt control gas prices, but I recall very clearly the liberal press in the newspapers and on ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN and MSNBC clearly crucifying President Bush over gas prices when he was in charge. Funny, I havent heard a peep about Obama and gas prices. Isnt that just peachy. Bunch of wankers.

      • Lewis Munn

        It seems to me an awful lot of our high governmental folks are heavy ethanol consumers, so naturally they would want more production!

        And precious few have any background in chemistry, or economics; most all are political science of one sort or another, so they do not understand chemistry, mechanics, physics; nearly all know next to nothing of virtually any real science.

        Might help a lot if a degree in any exact science were a requirement in this very technological age for being a congressman at the national level, and perhaps state level too.

  • Rennie

    My theory is that Jimmy Carter is Obama’s real father, think about it, that would explain EVERYTHING.

    • NC1

      Wouldn’t it, though!

  • http://wholehealth4u.com Doctor Mom

    WOW! Powerful quotes!
    But a warning to those who hold these beliefs:
    The Word of God predicts a “catching away”–As in raptor, which is where the word, Rapture, comes from. The true Christ-loving believers will be whisked away in an instant…to a joyous Eternity with their Lord.
    Sadly, when this happens (possibly soon)the Gaia-worshiping environmentalist will say, “Good riddance!! Gaia has cleansed herself of those nasty, narrow-minded Christians!” Please, please warn your atheistic and extreme environmentalist friends and family that the Rapture is NOT Gaia cleansing herself; rather it is the beginning of a horrible 7 years of catastrophe and unbelievable horror.

    • http://wholehealth4u.com Doctor Mom

      I was responding to Jay and his quotes from various Gaia-worshiping groups at 7:40 AM.

      • Jay

        So true Doctor Mom, you hold true treasure!

    • American Citizen

      The “Rapture” happens when you die, your soul is taken up. The universal “Rapture” will happen at the end of the world. Stop reading fiction as truth. Those who use the Bible to write books put their own spin on what the Bible says.

      • ValDM

        Go back and read your Bible some more. The Bible does not state that when you die, you are automatically taken to heaven. It does state, however, that the dead in Christ will be the first to arise; and further, that these newly arisen souls would be part of Christ’s army when He returns for the last and final battle in the Valley of Megiddo.

        • 45caliber

          And I don’t believe that Christ will be all love and kisses in that final battle either, despite what some try to say.

          • Jay

            That’s right 45caliber, He first came as a Sacrificial Lamb, the next time He comes, and very soon, will be as a Conquering Lion!!!

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            You got that right. The first time He came, He came for one reason and one reason only, to serve man. That pretty much is why the Jewish community rejects Him today. They pictured Him coming in triumph to lay His judgment and wrath down upon His enemies, as the Bible says He will do when He comes again. When He came to serve man, and gave Him self up for us, that isnt what they wanted or thought. But your right, when He comes again, I would not want to be one of those walking the earth in that day, as its not going to be pretty. I know that if Im not already dead, I will be taken up, in what is referred to as the rapture, of which that actual word is not referred to in the Bible. 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 tells about all this, but to use just part of this, in verse 17, it says “after that, we who are still alive and are left will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And so we will be with the Lord forever” The “them” it refers to, is those that someone referred to in an earlier post about the “dead in Christ will rise first”. But He is coming, and this time, He will mete out His judgement.

    • 45caliber

      I believe a good part of that horrible seven years will be due to the fact that the Christian influence on the world will be gone. Everyone will do their own thing and won’t have any moral control to keep them from it.

      • Jay

        Also, the Spirit that presently restrains, will be removed. I can’t imagine the horror as a result of God abandoning man!

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          It will be like the anarchy in the Mad Max movies, where groups just go around preying on others and killing them and taking what they have, until they are all wiped out, when God decides to take them out.

  • http://com i41

    Why didn’t the niggardly perputal vacationing Onumnutts and his Big Mamee, pay their fair share of taxes, like 50% as they want every one else to. Theirs was only 27% and I’ll bet that was not including all the freebies like free flights s and vacations with the of the truck loads of servants who travel with the muslim marxist morons. Books sales shouldn’t have any deductions, all are gained income. Why isn’t the free housing and food, charged as a personal gains? I know when the company provided housing and heat for me and my family, I paid taxes as a personal income, as my pay checks showed along with any bonuses. Typical dumbocrap bildge rules for everyone else, but the elitist bastards slide!

    • patty

      i41-because the ones who make the laws, are above the laws they make.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        You got that right. Like Michelle telling us all we just all need to tighten our purse strings and get through this together, then goes out and has a couple hundred dollar lobster dinner. Sweet. Nice, real nice. Her and that long legged mack daddy husband of hers are really enjoying spending all our money. I used to think the Clintons were America’s worst nightmare, you know, white trash with money. That was bad. I think these two have stepped it up a notch higher.

        • patty

          And you aren’t kidding there! He, both of them, run around like a couple of celebrities and socialits. Only, it is on our dime, and they have virtually accomplished nothing except destruction. What did he make this year? 1.1 mill? After taxes, that didn’t even cover Michelle’s trip to Spain. They treat our tax dollars like their own open-ended personal check book.

  • http://n.cates@cox.net Norman F.

    Go to an encyclopedia and look up the word Krakatoa. The explosion off that volcano in the 1800s dropped the temperature of the earth, caused a dust cloud that held down the earth’s food production and caused world-wide famine. There is no sign of it now.
    If the greenies want to hold down CO2 they could all just stop breathing out.

    • Lewis Munn

      I have noted that the greenies and their helpers do NOT look at real science. Talk Krakatoa and their eyes glaze over and they forget it.

      There were two immense volcanic explosions in the 1800s that injected lots of dust into the atmosphere, and lowered the global temperature to where Iowa corn crops failed at least once!

      But the greenies don’t want to hear it.

      If you look at a graph of global warming in the last maybe 100 years, it was warming up before big industry got really going, but as lots of smoke-belching plants were built, the curve dropped off until in the ’50′s, there was talk of sliding back into the ice age, and of earth cycles, with one calculated arctic ocean that looks just like modern satellite pictures.

      Done on primative computers, too! Seems not a lot new since then, just smoke and mirrors and punitive regulations and Al Gore getting rich! And emerging nations penalized and not allowed to develop their own fuel resources.

      Now, with the smoke from factories, “global warming” stopped, but then the EPA forced pollution cleanup, and it came back twice as fast as before! And a couple years ago it caught up to and passed where we would be without all the clean, green, and mean stuff.

      We need to set off a volcano of the right size each year, and we could have the temperature set to “right” long as we did not run out of volcanoes to blow up!

      Or we could put hoppers and spreaders on Al Gore’s planes, and have him go up to 100,000 feet and spread the right amount of dust to keep the temperature “Just right.”

      I note the solar activity is out of our controls, and is rather high as the earth is warming. Strange coincidence. So is the Little Ice Age in the 1700′s, with the strange coincidence there were virtually no sunspots around that period, when Holland froze over. And that our present computers cannot duplicate, so calls into question their predictions.

      Lots of real questions, on both theory and methods used to inflict more regulations on us.

      I also would like to note that in a previous warming period, we had a great age of science and the arts, and the Vikings found grapes growing in higher latitudes, hence named one area with lots of food growing “Iceland” to discourage exploration!

    • 45caliber

      Yeah, I remember it too. In fact, the world temperature dropped over 10 degress for over 10 years. There is STILL dust in the atmosphere from that explosion. And, if you calculate the force that blew up the entire island and the 20,000 or so people living there, it is more force than all the world’s known nukes dumped into a single pile and set off at the same time.

  • http://com i41

    Rennie, I think you are on to something. No wonder Onumnutts spent over 2 million to seal his records, his mother was an albino black hot to trot, and Peanuts said he lusted in PlayBoy interveiw. Educted book trained idoits at best, and they both do the chicken hop when getting on stage. Both are always smoozing with muslims and hate the Jews and Isreal, Both are idoits at real world situations and need to ruminate on when to s–t or get off the pot on every thing!

  • American Citizen

    What the greenies don’t take into account is that it takes energy to produce energy. The ice caps are actually thickening as reputable scientists have investigated and found. The climate history tells us the climate is always changing and man has nothing to do with it. We were once in an ice age, The sun controls the climate.

    • Jovianus

      AC..what world are you living on? Best supply a reputable link on that claim of ice caps thickening.

      • American Citizen

        I didn’t read it on the internet, but in the paper about a year ago. It was about interviews that were given by scientists who don’t agree with Al Gore’s assessment. They had done their own investigation by going to the ice and measuring it. They found it had actually thickened.
        It came out recently that scientists in England, I believe, had falsified results about global warming.

        • Thamera

          You are right AC, I have read that as well. Not to mention that this is one of the coldest winters we have had on record where I live! It is has been so cold in fact that the joke is now when it snows in the middle of April and temps dive back under 25 degrees people say, “gotta love that global warming!”

        • 45caliber

          I saw an article in the newspaper about 15 years or os ago. A climatologist who had worked in that field was warning the world that climates were reverting from their odd pattern to the normal pattern.

          The “odd pattern” was being able to foretell the weather for weeks, months, and even years in advance. That started in the mid-20′s according to him. The “normal pattern” was not being able to tell the weather for more than a couple of days in advance – if you were lucky. He was trying to warn the world that the farmers were going to be plagued with floods, droughts, etc. and if we expected to have enough food to feed everyone we needed to plant about twice as much, expecting to harvest only half of it. He stated that he had records of it snowing in Mexico City on July 4th back in the 1800s and that we could expect the “Normal” patterns to do simiiar things.

          All the “scientists” studying global warming look only at the records in the world over the last fify years or so – when we had abnormal weather patterns.

      • Dale on the left coast

        Arctic Ice today is “Normal” . . . . The snow-pak in the Canadian Rockes is 30% above normal “Today” . . .

        Antarctic ice growing, not melting

        18 Apr 09 – “Ice is expanding in much of Antarctica, contrary to the widespread public belief that global warming is melting the continental ice cap,” says this article in The Australian.

        “The results of ice-core drilling and sea ice monitoring indicate there is no large-scale melting of ice over most of Antarctica, although experts are concerned at ice losses on the continent’s western coast.

        “East Antarctica is four times the size of west Antarctica and parts of it are cooling. The Scientific Committee on Antarctic Research report prepared for last week’s meeting of Antarctic Treaty nations in Washington noted the South Pole had shown “significant cooling in recent decades”.

        “Australian Antarctic Division glaciology program head Ian Allison said sea ice losses in west Antarctica over the past 30 years had been more than offset by increases in the Ross Sea region, just one sector of east Antarctica.

        “Dr Allison said there was not any evidence of significant change in the mass of ice shelves in east Antarctica nor any indication that its ice cap was melting. “The only significant calvings in Antarctica have been in the west,” he said. And he cautioned that calvings of the magnitude seen recently in west Antarctica might not be unusual…………..”

        “Antarctica has 90 per cent of the Earth’s ice and 80 per cent of its fresh water.”

        If Antarctica contains 90 percent of the earth’s ice – and the amount is increasing – wouldn’t that mean that more than 90 percent of the world’s glaciers are growing? (As I’ve been saying all along.)
        See entire article by Greg Roberts
        http://www.news.com.au/story/0,27574,25348657-401,00.html
        Thanks to snowyman in Australia for this link

        • 45caliber

          I’ve seen a lot of this type of info elsewhere too. And I’ve also seen a report that says if ALL the world’s ice melted, we could expect to see the oceans rise by 20 inches – not feet. Much of what the global alarmists are calling ice is actually rock. The ice in the Artic Ocean won’t raise the ocean level if it melts by one millimeter – it floats. Floating ice doesn’t raise the water level. If you don’t believe it, fill a glass with ice and water and then mark the water level and let the ice melt. It remains the same since liquid is denser than solid water.

          Melting water that could raise the ocean only comes from ice on land. There are some mountainous areas of Greenland and Antartica that are being considered as ice. In fact one reason the penquins go so far inland to lay their eggs is because they want those eggs on land and not ice.

      • patty

        Jovi- Here ya go: Greenland’s icecap has thickened slightly in recent years despite concerns that it is thawing out due to global warming, says an international team of scientists.

        A team led by Professor Ola Johannessen, at the Nansen Environmental and Remote Sensing Center in Norway, report their findings online ahead of print publication in the journal Science.
        http://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=95908

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        Here are a few Jovi Anus, one is http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/271218, and another is http://www.iceagenow.com. Or if you want to see hundreds of others, just good Polar ice caps growing, and there are tons of them. Of course, dont go there unless you really want to know, and see how much Al Gore and his ilk are lying.

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          That was a typo of the worst kind. That should read “Just Google Polar Ice Caps Growing”.

  • http://google lubie63

    People quit whining! It can only help the world if we find green sources of energy. Can’t you people agree on anything that simple! Pollution cannot be a good thing. It is just that simple. Take the Rain Forest as an example.

    • American Citizen

      If people want to use green energy, it should be voluntary, not dictated by the government based on dubious science. A lot of us simply can’t afford your green energy.

      • Thamera

        And that American Citizen is the entire point exactly. Education not Regulation…let people decide for themselves. (Although you even have to be wary about the education today, don’t you – you certainly can’t rely on what scientists or even doctors tell you now days)hmmm

        • karolyn

          But only regulation when it fits in with YOUR views.

          • http://google lubie63

            Love it!

          • Thamera

            ah, no karolyn, not in the slightest. You will never hear me say or read a post like ones I have read from you that you ought to force change or behavior on anyone. That goes from everything to being forced to wear seatbelts to what someone can or should say on a blog…ms. “i am all sweetness and light but don’t think anything of killing my own child…”

          • karolyn

            It’s all in the perspective, Thamera. BTW, how did you get so mean-spirited? Is it your job?

          • patty

            Karolyn-Maybe you should follow Thamera around for a day on her job to see the result of what your ideology has produced.

          • karolyn

            Patti – Believe me, I am quite aware of what Thamera deals with, and it was not MY ideologies that made the situation as it is. During my lifetime, I have been in and around a wide variety of people of all socio-economic levels. Where I live now is in a lower socio-economic area. Though rural, the same problems exist here as in the cities although not quite as rampant. I work on the fringe of social services, so I do get to see a bit more than the average citizen. Hey, all one has to do is watch Jerry Springer to see what Thamera faces.

        • patty

          And your belief system and social engineering, and the people who you vote for who also believe in all of this is not your doing? No, the results are there and you are a proponent of these beliefs. The buck stops with you and others who vote like you.

    • Lewis Munn

      Sorry, we have pretty well cut down the rain forest to plant oil palms for biofuel, destroying the habitat of the natives, increasing erosion many fold, and enriching the already rich companies that destroy the environment to monocrop.

      It is known as greening the earth!

      • Dale on the left coast

        Not True

        North America is probably the cleanest continent on the planet.
        The enviro-whacks always use population to determin “Pollution” Factors . . . . but never include Land Mass when comparing us to others. The Fact Is . . . Canada and the USA are a Net Carbon Sink . . . because of the vase forests and farms. The CO2 nonsense is a Total Fabrication . . . there is no Science to prove Anthropogenic Gorebull Warming . . . only Govt Funded Scientists and Computer Modellers.

        • 45caliber

          Dale:

          Don’t forget Gore! The real problem is that he owns millions of dollars worth of stock in companies that can remove CO2 from the air. If he can get the politicians in Washington to force businesses to use the equipment (it is VERY expensive) he stands to be a multi-billionare almost overnight. Why do you think he is pushing this so hard? The only way they can get the people to not object is to convince us – or at least a sizable number of us – that we are terrible polluters and we must clean up things or die.

          Does anyone want to erase their carbon footprint? Plant a tree! I have enough trees on my property to take care of myself, my wife, and all my kids and grandkids. And I still plant trees. All you have is the initial cost of buying them and the labor of planting them. Nature does the rest and provides you with a bigger and better CO2 absorber every year free of charge.

    • 45caliber

      lubie63:

      The Rain Forest in Brazil is not being killed by pollution – unless you consider fire as pollution. The people there (I almost said natives but that word is wrong) are clear cutting and burning everything so they can use the land as pastures.

      The rain forest in Washington is doing fine and so is the one in Siberia.

    • Lewis Munn

      Yes, let’s take the whole rainforest area, cut it to the ground, and then plant it with oil palms so we have enough oil after many years for them to mature.

      The natives can be moved to refugee camps and fed with surplus grains. If we do not have any, too bad for them!

      No need to keep rare animals, or test plants for medicinal value…get it all cleared and grow oil crops, over and over until the soil is exhausted and all the water runs into the seas.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      And there is no proof of me driving my Honda CRV and burning gas is destroying anything either. There is left wing liberal ecologist sentiment that says there is, but there is no scientific proof of it. Therein, lies the difference.

  • http://com i41

    Norman F. since envior want everyone to go back to stone age and live in the dark and warm areas. I think most people know enviors do think to clearly and have mental problems. It isn’t from too much fresh air where their heads are impacted in.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      You do know, those cavemen spent endless hours in caves with fire’s burning to keep them warm, trapped in there will all the emissions from the fire burning. They most likely sucked in more pollution in their lungs that we ever have today.

  • http://com i41

    lubie, pollution like CO2 is great for plants and trees which convert it to oxegen, just another of example of stupid educated people spouting bs. Manure is needed to help grow plants and crops, but the EPA wants a world with now s–t, better destroy Washington. The Rain forest promlems is from stoneage people burning and planting crops on the same area untill it is sterile. As for the trees that are harvested, this is what regressive depressive pukes buy, nost of the expensive products. The Wall Street non producing worthless dumbocraps and their elit slubs. Go into any green weiny offices and get a look at their all nature products and bildge of protecting the earth crap. God put man on the earth to subdo it, and I do beleive in that and love cutting in roads and cutting down workless mountain tops and making places for people to live and enjoy life. That is where people need to live, not in vallies and low lyimg area, too much flooding and takes productive farmground out of production. But that has always been mind set of the dumbocraps and their loony tune groups.

    • http://google lubie63

      CO2 is toxic in higher concentrations: 1% (10,000 ppm) will make some people feel drowsy.[5] Concentrations of 7% to 10% cause dizziness, headache, visual and hearing dysfunction, and unconsciousness within a few minutes to an hour. Enough said.

      • 45caliber

        lubie63: It sure is toxic. And if you don’t have enough around you will die just as the plants do. Further, if you have too much O2 (oxygen) around you definately do NOT want a spark! You will burn just as well as wood does in too much O2. Sodium is exposive in water and poisonous. Chlorine is what they used to make “mustard gas” from in WWI. But if you don’t get enough sodium chloride (table salt) you will suffer, particularly if you get too warm. It helps stop heat stroke. And if you eat too much salt, it will kill you dead.

        Water is necessary for human life – more than 50% of your body is water. But if you get too much of it, it will also kill you.

        The point is, your figures are basically meaningless. The more CO2 that is produced, the more plants absorb and the faster they grow. The more CO2 they get, the more O2 is put out by their leaves. There is enough forest in Siberia or Brazil or the NW USA to handle ALL CO2 in the atmosphere now – and we still have all three areas. And that doesn’t count the rest of the world’s plants.

      • http://google lubie63

        Just making a point to i41. Pollution is not a good thing no matter how you want to spin it. I know all of the scientific facts, but I do not believe extra CO2 produced from pollutants is good for Mother earth. I work for an oil and natural gas pipeline and all of those numbers that you quoted me, are 2nd nature to me.

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          Mother Earth as you call it, can handle anything we can throw at it. Have you ever seen where they have totally scraped off the earth, compacted it, put down a road bed, compressed stone, poured concrete, and it was a road. Then years later the road was abandoned for new roads. And it really isnt all that long, before nature busts up that concrete and takes it over, and restores itself. And this is after we totally scraped it bare and covered it with concrete. No, man can think that high of himself, but he cant destroy it. God will make that call.

      • Lewis Munn

        How often in the outdoors do we reach these concentrations? Tho I guess in locked rooms in the Capitol with everybody smoking up a storm, it might. And that might be why we get such stupid legislation!

        • patty

          Lewis-In the capiol I think it is more methane gas that they are producing.

  • Raggs

    Does obama use a battery operated / “green” vaccum cleaner when he sucks the money out from our pockets?… It looks more like a turbo charged super sucker.

    • bob wire

      Hmm? what is your current cash loss to this “super sucker”?

      • 45caliber

        bob wire:

        The cash loss to this “super sucker” is approximately 53% of all you acquire. That will depend, of course, on whether you are in a middle class income bracket or a rich bracket. It is more in the rich bracket.

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          It was higher in my 50 grand middle class bracket than it was in 2008. Each year succeeding, 2009 was more than 2008, and 2010 was more than 2009. Gee, thanks for the change Obama. Soon, that is all I will have left. I dont know about the rest of you, but this change isnt working for me at all.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        Well Bob, if you want the truth, here you go. I made 10 thousand dollars less the first year after Obama was elected in 2008. Yet when I look at my W-2 forms, I see I paid more taxes in 2009 than I did in 2008, and then even more in 2010 than I did in 2009. Now just who do I attribute that to bob? Is there a way your feeble little mind can blame Bush for this? I dont know a better example, but Im looking right at it in the taxes Ive paid under this democrat tax monster. They definately have figured out a way to up the taxes, because Im paying more, and everyone Ive talked into looking at the last couple of years, mysteriously all noticed theyve paid more taxes in 2009 and 2010 then they did in 2008. How do you account for that bobwire? I can in one word, Obama.

        • patty

          Berberoni – Just wait until you get your real estate tax bill. The feds are cutting to the states, the states are cutting the counties, and we will be left with I am guessing almost double on property taxes to make up the difference. It has been all one big shell game, hasn’t it?

    • patty

      Raggs-That was funny. Thanks for making me smile today!

  • DavidL

    The future is green. The sooner we accept this and get out ahead of it and lead it, the better and more prosperous our country will be. The paradigm is changing. When it changes, everyone who does not embrace the change goes back to zero! Ask the British who lost their empire because they stayed with coal and didn’t move to oil as their military power source.

    Conservatives should stop resisting change because they do not understand it, and are afraid of it. Climate change is real and a profound threat to our planet and economy. We can do something about it, but not if we fall prey, once again, to fear, ignorance, and the propaganda of those vested interests profiting by putting excessive amounts of carbon in the atmosphere.

    http://www.grist.org/article/series/skeptics

    • Lewis Munn

      We also can put the dust back into the atmosphere and reflect the heat back into space. Lots cheaper and very effective, if you look at the later 40′s and early fifties.

      But one DOES need to look at all the data, rather than a slice biased by big business and single-minded politicians.

      • 45caliber

        Don’t you mean “simple minded politicians”?

        • Lewis Munn

          I meant single-minded…for their own political gain. But simple minded would include that and a pathetic paucity of science, economics, charity, honesty, and ethics.

          I’ll buy yours!

    • Dale on the left coast

      DavidL . . . . Change to WHAT????
      Wind and Solar will not power a modern industrial city . . . FACT!!!
      Been watching Spain? Their “Greening” has them Bankrupt and with over 20% unemployment.
      There is NO SUBSTITUTE for oil and gas TODAY . . . FACT!!!
      The Greenies live in a Parallel Universe . . . why not go to China or India and preach your dribble . . . when they catch up to us . . . the cleanest place on the planet . . . . we will entertain moving further.
      David . . . WHEN DID THE CLIMATE NOT CHANGE???? WHAT DO YOU THINK THE “IDEAL” TEMPERATURE SHOUDL BE??? Are you starting to understand the “green” thing is Insane!!!

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      DeviL, Take this Green crap outta here, no one believes we should purposely pollute our lands or water, but you idiots are going way overboard with this crap.__Ya have Any ideas on how to transform our lawn mowers, tractors, farming equipment, weed wackers and on and on, without using oil, water and gasoline to run them?__So that they won’t so called pollute or waste energy?___Why don’t you guys use your heads. _These green scientists are a bunch of “Virtual Planners” everything looks like it should work on a computer screen, or on paper, until ya get in the field and run REAL test runs!___We’re aren’t about to be taken again, like we were with the Global warming Hoax, they’d better come up with some better results, for me to change my mind on this green crap!

      • Lewis Munn

        Don’t sweat it. They will feed you our worthless ground-up money, and the s..t will be green enough for them.

      • Jay

        They just keep coming, don’t they, Angel Wannabe? That is typical behaviour of blind religious zealots. All emotion, zero science, mother nature is their god!

        • http://! Angel Wannabe

          You got it Jay!

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        Thats right. That is where the free market comes into play. If some company out there can come up with something, and it actually works, and its at a price people can afford, and the people actually want it, they will prosper and the people will come running to them. But when government gets in the way, and starts dictating as to what companies they want to bail out and prop up, and what they want to force us to do, then it all gets screwed up. So all you green meanies out there, quit telling us all how bad and evil we are, and quit pounding nails into trees, and burning down condo’s and SUV dealerships, and invent something use able that people will actually want to buy that helps. That is a healthy contribution to society. These things you guys are doing now, such as making people pay 40 grand for a land survey before they build in California so they dont disturb a wooly worm that is 6′ down in the soil, well crap like that is just absurd. And that is what you guys do. Do something productive, and be part of the solution, not part of the problem trying to enlarge government to force more regulations and red tape down our throats. We have enough of that already.

        • http://! Angel Wannabe

          Beberoni, why should the Libs do something productive, when they can get us to pay for they’re stupid ideas, that takes years and millions of tax dollars to finally work. I’d say the bastards are either pretty smart or alot of Liberal sheep are really dumb and drag us along with them!

    • 45caliber

      DavidL:

      I’m probably as conservative as anyone can be. I have no problem with shifting to something other than oil – as long as it is cost effective. (It is probably the engineer in me – I am ALWAYS looking for a better way to do something.)

      But wind and solar power isn’t it. First they are far too expensive to build and maintain. Second, they require far too much land area. It was once calculated that the land required to supply Pennsylvania with solar power would require 6,000 square miles of solar panels. Can you see cutting all trees and leveling that much acreage to provide solar power? I can’t.

      There are other sources of power out there. We should investigate and if they work, use them. But UNTIL THAT TIME we still have a need for power and what we have must continue to be used. We cannot simply stop using it with the idea that we will develope and build a new method by doing so. And it is stupid to not use it as needed. Personally, I think all oil should be used for plastics so I can’t wait to see us get away from it. But first, you have to convince the Federal Government that they can get by with less fuel taxes. Until you do that you will not see oil disappear as a fuel or any real improvement in its use.

      • Lewis Munn

        It will be hard to turn 6000 miles of solar panels to face the sun at all times, and what happens when a storm covers it? Or we get big hail? Or the blizzard covers it in 2 feet of snow? Who is going to hand shovel 6000 sq mi each snow storm?

        Howe big will the backup battery have to be?

        Will it need to be protected from tornadoes?

      • patty

        45cal-Finally, a decent summary. Thank you.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      Sure pal. Lets cap all the oil wells, outlaw all cars and burning of natural gas, those evil bastards. We will all just sit around campfires in the winter to stay warm, and sing kumbaya and sing the praises to Al Gore. Or we could all take out loans we cant pay, maybe get Clinton to get the government to back more bad loans again, and all buy acres of land and put up a bunch of windmills we can afford, or maybe 60 grand worth of solar panels on our houses, and hope the sun comes out so we dont freeze in the winter. Then we all should quit our jobs, because everyone knows those evil business’s burn gas and use electricity derived from burning coal, so we should shut down all those evil business’s too. This is what the ultimate act of the greenies will do, because its their agenda. They need to go away, get in the woods, and pick up trash and do something productive with their time. Put your money where your mouth is. There is a start.

  • Thoughts

    Read an article about 30 group homes getting solar panels donated to them (Phoenix, AZ). Total cost is 3.5 million–fed funds and local utility funds. Savings of $700.00 per year, per home. Way I figure this is: Total savings per year = $21,000.00. Time to repay the 3.5 million = over 160 years! Even if the article was wrong and the savings is $700.00 per month, it will take over 14 years to repay the tax payers. THIS IS NOT A GOOD INVESTMENT OF MY TAX DOLLARS!

    • Raggs

      I seen a guy on the Fox channel that was promised by the government thousands of dollars if he installed solar panels on his roof… He did the installation and the government refused to pay him.

    • 45caliber

      Thoughts:

      There is a solar power plant in AZ that provides power to one of the Indian reservations there. It was built back in the 70s if I remember correctly.

      I saw an article a few years ago from an Electrical Engineer who helped build that plant and worked there until he retired. The article was written AFTER he retired since he didn’t want to get fired and lose his job.

      It stated basically that an average house in the US pays about $250 a month for power in the middle of summer. If the Indians were billed the total cost (with no profits) for the maintenance and labor to keep that solar plant going WITHOUT ANY GOVERNMENT MONEY it would cost them about $15,500 a MONTH for the same amount of power.

      Is that cost effective? I don’t know about you, but I don’t make nearly that much a month.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      Yeah well, guess what. If the sun doesnt shine, no power. And in climates like here in Indiana, you have one day in the winter without power, and your waterlines freeze and burst and youve got big problems. Solar takes up too much room, and isnt economical.

  • ONTIME

    So far for the most part the GE company has saddled us with toxic light bulbs and our government wants you to use them at your peril, more crony facism please..not

    I do like the new bio fuel production of algae for the making of cheap oil and energy products, I like the Prius for it’s efficiency and tech use but for the most part much ado about going green is a bunch of nothing, it cost more to go green than it is worth. Like recycling paper, the cost to chemically remove the inks and other impurties is damned expensive and not cost effective for the product produced making it obsolete and government subsidized.

    Ethanol, why the hell are we using good feed corn for a product that destroys engines and reduces fuel efficiency, again government subsidized but well lobbyed. Nothing like putting some bucks into the coffers of elected official is there for another political screw-up. Hyrogen conversion is neat because a small amount of room is needed to make a instant converter that fits the vehicle, all piston vehicles, all you need add is water and it really works. Why the hell is it not being pushed and used?

    Ruination of the coal industry seems to be the goal of this administration and why they want to punish the industry is anyones guess, the potential of coal is enormous and cheap but the politics are making a mockery of this potential in a effort to drive the cost of energy and related products sky high and then add more punishing taxes. One of you guys must have bad mouthed the wrong guy.

    • bob wire

      Corn gas has always been a joke. It was crafted to pump money into our grain belt back during a slump. For a while there America’s middle was drying up and it offered “some solution” to the problem of cash flowing into a area while creating others elsewhere.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        Good post bob, you are absolutely correct. Someone lined some congressional pockets, and now they are getting paid back.

    • 45caliber

      I bought a Kia Rio about five years ago. It was a plain-Jane car, no extras, and it cost me $5800 brand new. At the same time my (now-ex) son-in-law bought a Prius for $30,000.

      I got 36-38 mpg on the Kia. He got 50 mpg on his Prius. So he got about 12-14 more mpg than I did.

      IF we both drove 25,000 miles a year, just think about how long he would have to drive his car to finally reach the same payoff that I did. Not only his car but HE wouldn’t last that long! But considering that he REALLY bought the car simply because he liked the swell electronics, he got his money’s worth.

  • Gregg Jackson

    Ian Plimer – what a fraud. Any corporation with a pile of money can rent out this whore’s service. He’ll cook his book for anyone who will pay.

    Ian Plimer’s book is a case study in how not to be objective. Decide on your position from the outset, and then seek out all the facts that apparently support your case, and discard or ignore all of those that contravene it. He quotes a couple of thousand peer-reviewed scientific papers when mounting specific arguments. What Ian doesn’t say is that the vast majority of these authors have considered the totality of evidence on the topic of human-induced global warming and conclude that it is real and a problem. Some researchers have show that the Earth has been hotter before, and that more CO-2 has been present in the atmosphere in past ages. Yes, quite — this is an entirely uncontroversial viewpoint. What is relevant now is the rate of climate change, the specific causes, and its impact on modern civilisation that is dependent, for agricultural and societal security, on a relatively stable climate. Ian pushes mainstream science far out of context, again and again.

    When sources correct their information, he ignores it. He presents numbers to prove that CO-2 doesn’t cause warming because of all the cooling in the “post-war economic boom” (1940-1975) from from Martin Durkin’s Great Global Warming Swindle and omits the last 20 years of warming. Even Durkin admitted it was wrong and changed it, but it lives on in Plimer’s book.

    And what of evidence that contradicts his conclusion? For example, the fact that the stratosphere is cooling contradicts his theory that the sun is the cause of recent warming. What does Plimer say about this in a 500 page book with a 70 page chapter on the atmosphere? Nothing. It’s not mentioned at all.

    • Thamera

      And therein lies the point Gregg…top scientists and researchers do NOT AGREE on the “facts” as they are being presented to governments and the populace in general. Good grief, people can’t even predict the weather accurately 10 days from now. What an arrogant group of people to think they know with any certainty what is even going to happen tomorrow. The caldera in West Yellowstone could blow for example, and then what? Exactly….

      • 45caliber

        The caldera in Yellowstone is due to blow too. And when it does, the One Worlders will be very happy since they will get the reduction in population in the US they would like to see. I suspect that you would lose everything from the Pacific to at least western NY in the blast and I might even get a little warn from the magma down here in Texas.

    • Dale on the left coast

      Gregg . . . instead of criticizing Plimmer . . . . which is way over your “Pay Grade” . . . . why not tell us how CO2 . . . . 36 Thousandths of the atmosphere, 3% of that tiny amount contributed by man, can cause the earth to warm????
      Anthropogenic Gorebull Warming . . . that’s Man Caused for you . . . . is an hypothesis . . . . there is NO SCIENCE . . . ZERO!f!!
      Have been asking for the “Science” for 15 years. It doesn’t exist, only 5 Billion worth of govt paid Scientists and Computer Modellers . . . who have been 100% WRONG for 15 years.
      Now it has become Klimate Change . . .Tell me Gregg – When did the climate Not Change??? and What would be the “Ideal” Temperature?

      • TIME

        Dale perhap if you ask the MONKEY what it feels like to crap in his hand he could answer that.
        But most anything else the MONKEYS are little more than blow holes that eat and create to much of a carbon foot print. So don’t wait on any answer that has value.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        Absolutely correct. And I will add this. There are a whole lot of so called scientists, cashing in on the government giving them our hard earned money via grants to study this stuff, and then most of them have already made up their minds that there is global warming, so instead of looking for the truth, they prostitute their numbers to back up their agenda, and then they get caught, because scientifically, the evidence is not there to support the agenda they are trying to push. It just isnt there. Our media so loves to push the doom and gloom, just like good liberals. They have to sensationalize everything. Last case in point, the Gulf Oil leak. These same liberal lefties in the media were writing about this like the Gulf Coast was done for as if 10 Nuclear bombs hit it. It was over with, total devastation unlike seen before in the anals of man. Now a year later, other than in some marshlands, there is no evidence of it left. Ive been to Gulfport and Biloxi, and the beaches are as white as ever, and people are there swimming and boating. Nice call liberal media. If you guys ever return to really reporting the truth, and investigating real stories, you know, like whether your president has a legal birth certificate or where are his college papers, being that people at these colleges seem to have no recollection of him going to school there. I would be surprised to see the press return to actually ever reporting the truth again. At least not while the liberals own them.

    • 45caliber

      Gregg:

      From your description, Ian Plimer must be one of those who believe in global warming. After all, the Russians have already PROVED with their own emails that what you said Plimer is doing is exactly what those scientists are doing.

  • DaveH

    Speaking of guns (I know, lol, we weren’t):
    http://gunowners.org/a04182011.htm

    • TIME

      Dave, how bloody sad is that.

    • JeffH

      DaveH, excellant link and something I would encourage all that believe in individual freedom and liberty to link and send through the GOA email source to their representatives.

      • 45caliber

        And the REALLY sad thing is that some people believe her.

    • patty

      McCarthy is an idiot. Did you notice how she conveniently left out that people with mental disease are not allowed to purchase fire arms. This kid had more than a few years of mental disease. It was documented by his school and the local authorites. If those 2 gov’t. entities had done their due diligence and got him listed as he was, “mentally diseased”, he would not have been able to purchase the fire arm in the 1st place. We don’t need more laws. We need to follow the one on the books.
      Under Arizona law, prohibited possessor are defined in ARS 13-3101 which states:

      7. “Prohibited possessor” means any person:

      (a) Who has been found to constitute a danger to himself or to others or to be persistently or acutely disabled or gravely disabled pursuant to court order under section 36-540, and whose right to possess a firearm has not been restored pursuant to section 13-925
      http://www.arizonaccw.net/

  • giegie

    No one is talking about Obama, Gore and a few other corrupt commie buddies is on the board behind the scenes of ‘greens’ and green energy is why he’s pushing it so hard. Of course it will make them billions. Check it out, find out the truth and all you sheeples thats falling for this, it will set you free.

  • bob wire

    With the exception of this statement; “This won’t happen because the Federal government mandates a changeover which is neither practical nor affordable.” you have offered a solid thread post.

    Practical & affordable are qualities that will change with time. It is for government and the business community to project into the future on matters of such magnitude.

    It’s long been know and understood that the petro industry opposes outside interference, change and competition with great zeal. From buying up patents that save energy and then not developing them but burying them, to supporting politician that show sympathy to the industry to such a degree that they feel compelled to publicly apologize to BP for America’s southern coastline getting in their way. They send out spokespersons, blogger’s and lobbyist to infiltrate the public domain at all level to offer the industries spin.

    Every new industry is met with this resistance to change and in due time this resistance will fall away.

    I just noticed this morning at the old Military Quarter Master 2 miles from my home, they are in the process of erecting a solar array maybe 1/2 an acre in size. Many of our collages and some government building already have them. DWF airport has had a large solar array since it’s creation. It’s no longer something new.

    The more expensive fossil fuels become, the more practical and affordable solar and wind become.

    I’ve been seeing tractor trailers hauling huge wind turbine blades west bound for a good 5 years. Where I don’t know, just west.

    • 45caliber

      bob wire:

      T. Boone Picket bought those wind generators and had them built in Europe. They are hauled into Freeport port and unloaded. They sit in a field there for a couple of years and are then hauled normally to the Great Plains for erection.

      They are, however useless without the infrastructure to deliver that energy to – first – a plant that can regulate it to the needs of people, and then – second – to the people. He had planned on the government being forced to install all that at the tax payer cost. He is paying 10 billion for the wind generators – but the government won’t pay the additional $15 billion to hook up everything.

      Right now he is more than willing to sell you as many of them as you wish.

      • 45caliber

        Sorry, just noticed I misspelled his name.

  • JeffH

    Say NO to environmental extremism. That also means NO to Al Gore’s do as I say, not as I do money making schemes in the name of “green”.

    Climate change is a natural occurance, not an un-natural one as these extremists would lead the sheeple to believe.

    In Nature magazine’s June 1, 2006, issue, scientists demonstrate in three new studies that the area near the North Pole was a balmy 74 degrees Fahrenheit 55 million years ago. That was obviously long before the invention of the wheel, let alone the advent of hydrocarbon scares or the internal-combustion engine (which Gore has called to completely eliminate). So much for Gore’s assertion that climate change is “irrevocable.”

    These studies reconfirm the fact that the earth experienced an extended period of natural global warming millions of years ago, caused by an unexplained increase in carbon dioxide levels. According to the Boston Globe report on the studies, “scientists already knew that this ‘thermal event’ happened but are not sure what caused it.” The possible causes cited by the Boston Globe include “massive releases of methane from the ocean, the continent-sized burning of trees, lots of volcanic eruptions.” Indeed, Kathryn Moran, another co-author of one of the studies, is quoted as saying “it’s the first time we’ve looked at the Arctic, and man, it was a big surprise to us.”
    http://www.cfif.org/htdocs/freedomline/current/in_our_opinion/Nature-Magazine-Provides-Latest-Inconvenient-Truth-Globetrotter-Gore-Climate-Change-Natural-Occurrence.html

    I’m pretty sure I’m not the only one who ever thought these changes were a natural occurance and long before there ever was anything called “Global Warming”.

    Let’s see — naturally-occurring climate change, with an uncertain explanation. Does this sound familiar?

  • Jimbo

    Ever give any thought to the number of times the environmentalists and other scientists have ALREADY been wrong in their dire predictions? Or how much THEY have contributed to what THEY say is the CAUSE of the problem?

    Take “the ozone hole”. In the 80′s we were told the children in Australia were going to die of skin cancer if we didn’t ban the florocarbons in auto air conditioners and aerosol cans. So it was banned. And all across the US, mechanics and auto dealerships miss-read the law. When customers came in for routine servicing, they DUMPED the freon out into the air, and installed the new, expensive, LESS efficient R-134. Despite this dumping, the ozone hole closed up. Why? A few years later, scientists drilling ice cores in Antarctica determined that the ozone hole is a naturally occuring event which occurs every 50,000 years.

    Now BECAUSE we went from an EFFICIENT refrigerant to a less efficient refrigerant, our cars have to consume slightly more gasoline to produce the same BTU’s of cooling. That means more hydrocarbons are released than need be, CONTRIBUTING TO THE INCREASE that the enviro-whackos are now complaining about.

    And what about the aerosol cans? We now have CO2, yes, that’s right, CO2 in our aerosols. Because it is a much smaller molecule than freon, it leaks out of the seams of the cans much quicker than long lasting Freon. So whereas we used to use up the paint, hair spray, etc. in aerosol cans before the gas was exhausted, we now send millions of cans to the dump each year, still full of paints, solvents and other chemicals because we can’t get it out of the can. We poison our water and the land. And we release much more of the dreaded CO2, which the scientists now say is causing “global warming”.

    Remember how accurate the scientists were about their “Year 2000 global meltdown” of our computers, financial system and power grid? Didn’t happen! How about the comets that they thought would come close enough to be a threat, but never materialized? Never showed up!

    They’ve been saying for 30 years that our oil would be exhausted “any day now”. Hasn’t happened!

    Is the earth warming? Let’s assume it is. We’re in a 20 year lull of sunspots. (That’s why our AM radio reception has been so bad.) Could it be that the LACK of sunspots (which are COLDER than the rest of the sun), is responsible for the warming here? Have these scientists checked?

    They tell us the earth has warmed a couple degrees in the last century. Did they HAVE meters that accurate 100 years ago? Were the readings taken in the exact same locations? We were a more agrarian society back then. Are the present locations in cities which have localized heat sources, which could bias the results?

    If NASA is so concerned about global warming and think it is caused by hydrocarbons, why do they keep launching shuttles and other rockets dumping millions of gallons of hydrocarbons into the atmosphere each time?

    For that matter, why is Obama, who drives a car getting about 6 MPG telling ME I have to risk my live in a thin as paper econobox to get 30 MPG? Good leaders LEAD BY EXAMPLE!

    Until the scientists and our leaders answer these and many other questions, I will continue to doubt ‘global warming”. I’m not going to lose any sleep over it. I can’t bicycle to work in the dead of winter, and it’s too far. If YOU want to live in an igloo, burn dung, and eat uncooked vegetables, go right ahead!

    • Thamera

      Exactly Jimbo – throughout history “scientists” get it wrong much more than they get it right, and yet certain people still continue to hang on their every word.

  • JeffH

    Here is a guy who was way ahead in the money making market of Climate Change who partnered with Al Gore and the UN to make billions.
    Remember this name – Maurice Strong.

    Do you think Obama is a partner in all of this scheming? “While on the board of a Chicago-based charity, the Joyce Foundation”, Barack Obama helped fund a carbon trading exchange that will likely play a critical role in the cap-and-trade carbon reduction program he is now trying to push through Congress as president.”

    The “privately-owned” Chicago Climate Exchange is heavily influenced by Obama cohorts Al Gore and Maurice Strong. For years now Strong and Gore have been cashing in on that lucrative cottage industry known as man-made global warming.

    It may be interesting to note that the Chicago Climate Exchange in spite of its hype, is a veritable rat’s nest of cronyism. The largest shareholder in the Exchange is Goldman Sachs. Chicago Mayor Richard M. Daley is its honorary chairman, The Joyce Foundation, which funded the Exchange also funded money for John Ayers’ Chicago School Initiatives. John is the brother of William Ayers.

    “Climate change is the biggest single challenge humans have ever faced. Unlike other problems, which can be solved regionally or sectorally, climate change effects the very future of life on earth. It is the greatest security problem we have ever faced.”
    Maurice Strong

    THE GAME OF RULING THE WORLD BY CONTROLLING THE ENVIRONMENT
    MAURICE STRONG- RIGHT HAND MAN OF ROTHSCHILD.
    United Nations Environment Programme

    Just a note, Obama was never the character he created for himself in the fairy-tale version in “Dreams of My Father”. He’s the agent of Change and Hope for cohorts making money, among other things, down at the Chicago Climate Exchange.

    The Barbarians are pushing at the gate of the Global Warming fraud.
    http://www.greatdreams.com/climate/carbon-trading-conspiracy.htm

    • JeffH

      Another note for those that thought the Chicago Climate Exchange(CCX) was dead and gone…it is alive and runnung.
      http://www.chicagoclimatex.com/content.jsf?id=4572404

    • Dale on the left coast

      “MAURICE STRONG- RIGHT HAND MAN OF ROTHSCHILD.
      United Nations Environment Programme”
      This man is a complete loon. He worked with my father in the 40′s . . . told them all he would be a millionaire.
      Worked in Montreal for Power Corp (where 3 or the last 4 Cdn PM’s were employed). Apointed to the UN by Trudeau (Canada’s Marxist PM).
      Strong had a “Loonie Bin” Ranch in Colorado where his wife entertained all the Panthiest Religions and worshipped mother earth Ghia.
      Was Koffie’s right hand man in the Oil for Food thing . . . and Strong was instrumental in creating the IPCC and the numberous “Environmental” gatherings around the world. Today, in his late 80,s he lives pretty much full time in China where he overseas his joint investments with Soros.

      • TIME

        Dale, Great Post!

      • JeffH

        Dale, I’ll ditto TIME…great post and information on Strong.

      • Carlucci

        You’d be surprised at how many of the Bilderbergs, Illuminati, or whatever you want to call them live in China. David Rockefeller is one of them and now lives in China.

        • Thamera

          One reason is because as America sadly continues to follow the path of socialism, bigger government and more regulations, China has begun to embrace capitalism and gee, look what is happening; their economy is flourishing.

    • TIME

      Jeff,

      Great Post………….> Saddly the MONKEYS will fail at understaning it.

    • 45caliber

      To make matters worse, everyone who owns property (notice this does NOT include those who rest) officially will be allowed carbon credits. If a company wants to emit more of anything they have to buy those carbon credits from those who own them but don’t use them.

      The REAL problem is that the government has taken the stance that all carbon credits are to be owned by the banks that hold the mortgages on the properties. The main beneficiaries will be Freddy Mac and Fanny Mae. So the idea is that the GOVERNMENT shall sell these carbon credits rather than individuals and that they will get the profits from them.

      Further, is is supposedly the idea of several Congressmen who were involved in the two FMs. One of them is Barney Franks. And they have “Patented” the idea. So if they are sold, these Congressmen will recieve a fee for the idea – in excess of a hundred billion dollars.

      So – how do you like the idea that the government can seize your carbon credits and sell them to make them money but not you??

  • Dale on the left coast

    About 12 years ago Dr Willie Soon, Solar Scientist, predicted that the world was going into a Cooling Period. Why you ask? Because Solar activity was receeding. Man has watched Solar Activity for 100′s of years . . . . it is interesting how solar activity and earth temperatures have travelled throught the decades in concert.
    CO2 . . . is 36 thousandths of the atmosphere . . . even if it doubled tomorrow would do nothing but cause plants to grow. Of all the CO2 on the planet . . . man is only responsible to 3% of that tiny total.

    • 45caliber

      True. But too many people won’t pay any attention to that.

  • TIME

    John, A fine Blog!

    Saddly the mass media spin has convinced the “Monkey” populace that their carbon foot print is too large.
    Thats why the “Monkeys” also use more electric power, more water, eat more food and create more waste materials in all respects, not to even get in to the verbal waste.

    Keep up the Great Blogs Dude.

  • American Patriot

    Not to mention the main Monkey Al Whore. By the way. Where is that left leaning baboon. No one seems to know where he is hiding these days. He is without a doubt jet setting in his high carbon foot printing High polluting air plane.

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      AP, The baboon is probably counting his millions from the Global Warming Scam, in the comfort of his home, by candle lite!__God forbid, we turn any lights on, we might waste energy!

  • http://! Angel Wannabe

    Good write up john!___The Obama Regime, remains disconnected from reality.__ Oil is already here, we know how to drill for it, contain it, transport and store it_ and have for years. But with Kissinger’s alleged “no drill for oil in the USA” agreement with Saudi Arabia years ago,it remains to be seen, and seems we won’t be drilling for our own oil, except maybe a trickle anytime soon.
    Green energy,__So we create ethanol from corn, and that drives the price up for it, on the food supply. GOOD Thinking Haaavid Elite Progressives, if you’ve got any more brilliant ideas, keep your mouths shut!!!!!_
    BTW_”I bought a pack of corn for planting at $13.99 for the packet!” Don’t know what it costs other folks across this fruited plain, either way it is thoroughly ridiculous, thanks Obama!.
    As far as Global warming goes, at damn near 55, I’ve seen hotter than normal summers and colder than normal winters, and ya know what, we lived! Global warming my azz!__The Earth like most of life runs in cycles, let it alone and it will take care of itself, tampering with it, like a cold, only complicates it. You EPA”S aren’t God although you think you are, when ya get your wings and cloak, maybe I’ll listen. Go stir up trouble and make your money somewhere else and leave humanity alone!!

    • http://google lubie63

      I truely believe that our government (Repulican or Democrat) wants all of the other countries in the world to use up their oil reserves so that some day we will be the only ones left with oil.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        lubie63, good luck figuring out the Guv, the only thing I know is when they say they’re doing something, they’re not, and visa versa!
        Ya can’t believe anything they say or do, its just all a toss!

      • DaveH

        By then it won’t be “we”. It will be “they” who get to use the oil. The Elite Class, politically attached, who will be driving around in their black limosines and flying their personal jets, while the rest of us ride bikes and do their slave labor.

        • http://! Angel Wannabe

          DaveH, Hell by some of things I’m reading, we’ll be lucky we don’t eventually end up living in dirt dwellings with thatched roofs.
          Doesn’t matter who’s in power Dave, The only difference is the Liberals move faster on they’re agenda’s, and are more openly arrogant & violent than the repubs. I’m sick of what’s happened to America, just sick…

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        I have thought that now for the longest time. Only thing is, by the time that time comes, who will be running us?

  • JeffH

    Some of you might want to read this.

    Three More Attacks on Civilization
    http://mises.org/daily/5227/Three-More-Attacks-on-Civilization

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      Jeffh, this one of Bambi’s answer to job creation & boosting the economy__, make it so appliances don’t work, and ya have to either call the Maytag repair man or buy a new appliances, the jack azz’s!

    • DaveH

      We did have water-spotting problems with our dishwasher starting about 1 year ago. And we have had to do a lot more handwashing, thus wasting a lot more water. You have to love the Liberals. NOT!

      • Thamera

        I agree. For everything that is “seen” there are consequences that are “not seen”. Get rid of toilet paper the greenies say, use a bucket and a rag…now you get to wash the disgusting rag which also is going to use more water…don’t use hot water the greenies say, now you aren’t going to be able to sterilize all the e-coli bacteria clinging to your clothes…same with the push to get ride of disposable diapers…the consequences of these “benevolent changes” just create new problems!

      • Carlucci

        Dave – Try a product called “Lemi-Shine”. It is at the grocery stores on the shelves near the dishwasher soap. The spots are caused by minerals in the hard water building up in the dishwasher. I’ve been using it for over a year and my ancient dishwasher runs just like new
        and my dishes and glassware are crystal clean and spotless. (Lemi-Shine not only prevents spots on glassware and dishes, it cleans the dishwasher).

        • patty

          Carlucci-Was that our commercial break? :) Thanks for the tip, I to am having spot problems even with my new dishwasher!

  • http://marcum1@wildblue.net coal miner

    5)Mar 2, 2007 … Water vapor constitutes Earth’s most significant greenhouse gas, accounting for about 95% of Earth’s greenhouse effect (5). …
    http://www.geocraft.com/WVFossils/greenhous…
    HowStuffWorks “Greenhouse Gases

    • 45caliber

      coal miner:

      It is also the culprit for most pollution problems. It absorbs other things like sulfur and nitrogen to create acids for acid rain problems. It lowers visibility and it holds in heat.

      But this isn’t a problem for those people who want to reduce CO2 because they can’t make money from it readily.

    • Lewis Munn

      Means we need to cover the oceans with a waterproof flexible coating! Also all ponds, lakes, and swamps. Al Gore can fly a jet spray plane and cover the US quickly; Obama can print the money needed.

  • Jay

    I urge everyone here to read “Against Oligarchy”, a free on-line book written by Webster Tarpley.

    Webster Griffin Tarpley – one of the most incisive critics of Anglo-American hegemony. As an activist historian he is best known for his book – George Bush: The Unauthorized Biography (1992), a masterpiece of research which is still a must read. (This book is also free to read and download)

    He is a 9/11 Truth Scholar and activist; AB Princeton 1966, summa cum laude and Phi Beta Kappa; Fulbright Scholar at University of Turin, Italy; and MA in humanities from Skidmore College.

    He is fluent in Italian, German, French, Latin and Russian. A decades-long expert on international terrorism, his 1978 study for the Italian parliament “Chi ha ucciso Aldo Moro?” (Who Killed Aldo Moro?) broke open the ownership of the “Red Brigades” by NATO’s clandestine “stay-behind” networks.

    http://tarpley.net/world-crisis-radio/

    • Carlucci

      I think he’s also featured in that excellent documentary “The Obama Deception” which is available on YouTube.

      • Jay

        Yes, he traces the roots of the present ruling elite!

  • http://PersonalLibertyDigest Janice

    God, in the form of Mother Nature, is still in charge of our climate. Whether it is heating up or cooling down, man does not have the power to effect the kind of “change” the New World Order nuts are pretending is happening.

    • Lewis Munn

      However, we DO have things installed that are causing a lot of the warming, and both nature and our own experience show why!!

      Volcanic explosions shoving dust high into the atmosphere have caused years of depressed temperatures; Krakatoa is one prime example.

      IF you look at the warming curve from the 30′s to the 90′s, all I have seen, they are rising in the 30′s and 40′s, and then flatten out and even droop a little. I recall the fervor over the next ice age starting, after staying pretty steady, in the 70′s they start going up fast, and a couple years ago they went past the rate of the 30′s and 40′s and are climbing faster and faster.

      One thing easy to trace. Not much heavy manufacturing in the 30′s and then when the wars came we geared up and got those plants with the big smokestacks, and the rate of warming dropped way back. When we got the EPA shutting down the smokestacks and demanding billions in precipators to improve air quality, the rate rose to faster than before, considerably faster.

      The difference was the natural and artificial dust in the air.

      When the volcanoes blew the dust up, it immediately drastically lowered the temperatures. As the dust settled, the temps started climbing again.

      The war got our factories going, and the smoke rose and the rate of temperature rise went even below 0. When the EPA demanded all the anti-pollution stuff installed, the air was super-cleaned, and the warming went faster, with no dust to reflect the sun’s heat back out into space.

      All we’d need to do is put dust dispensers on the sides of Al Gore’s jet, and him fly around the world putting the dust back into the air to drop the global warming to negative until it got where we want it, and then he could make more occasional flights when it threatened to rise again.

      It ain’t the CO2, it is the dust!! Combined with the normal warming as we come out of the last ice age, and as the sun’s activity is headed toward a maximum.

      And you may recall that the sun has a lot of effect; when the sunspots quit cold, the little ice age of the 1700′s occurred!

      We can’t change the sun’s activity, which is approaching a maximum now, but we could put the dust shield back in the atmosphere, if global warming is so important to stop!

  • DaveH

    Look what I just ran across:
    http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/general_politics/april_2011/60_reject_proposed_government_id_for_online_security

    Can you believe that? They are going flat out to keep track of our Internet dealings. All this Freedom of Speech is distressing our masters.

    • JeffH

      DaveH, not surprised that they just won’t stop trying to restrict our freedoms and what we do.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      I googled my cell phone number yesterday, and it showed where I was at. Not cool.

      • patty

        Told you. Pretty scary, huh?

  • Lewis Munn

    Reminds me of a cartoon, where the one party was telling of all the evils of the government, and then was asked what he had done, and he said, “I did my duty; I voted for them!”

  • Donel

    AMERICA WILL USE ALL ITS RESORSESS, OIL IN ALSKA, NATURAL GAS
    COAL MINES THAT CLOSED. STEEL MILLS RUN FULL SPEED AGAIN.
    After the collapse of the government. Is it that hard to predict???

    Not for America, Obama did the Apologizing for USA. Black Panther Chant: Give them the Wealth Give Them the Wealth.
    GLOBAL China is waiting for it, with all the other enemies.
    OBAMA’S MENTOR SAID (quote)GOD DAM AMERICA.

  • Willie Evershave

    Being a physicist I sometimes get a little annoyed by some of the off-the-wall comments made by egomaniac ‘greenies’ who are basically like an urban cowboy, i.e. A BIG hat and no cattle, or maybe a BIG belt buckle and a short penis, or a great deal of wind and no rain, or maybe just a BIG mouth coupled to a tiny brain.

    If you want to know how the government, the New World Order, or big money industrialists work simply follow the bloody money! If the ‘greenies’ would research some valid data they would find that the planet, in fact, is warming, but it is simply a natural cycle. After we peak out in heat, we will go back down a slope to another ice-age, so save your coats. We were in a mini-ice-age around 1850, and if you look at a graph which tracks the melting of the ice on the planet from 1850 until the present, you would notice that around 1900 the industrial age and the automobile appeared, and amazingly, at least to the ‘greenies,’ the change in the slope of the melting ice is barely perceptible. This is quite indicative that the warming was NOT disturbed by men and their machines. The globe is warming, and to try and alter Mother Nature’s workings is, in general, futile. Man is just a pimple on Mother Nature’s butt. That is not to say we shouldn’t pick up after ourselves and try to leave this world a better place than when we arrived, but the governments of the world are a function of mortal men, not Mother Nature, and if we get to bothering her more than she will tolerate she will simply put an end to man.

    As to the US government, Al Gore, the environmentalists, and the Obama suckers, there is no valid reason to bankrupt the country just to save a sand flea! If we leave nature alone, survival of the fittest will
    prevail. The cockroach will probably be the survivor that cleans up after man ceases to exist, and then live a peaceful life ever after.

    Gore is simply trying to make a buck off of the rubes with his ‘global warming’ scam. The media loves to promote things to scare the pants off the public, since this increases sales to get ready for the horrendous event that likely won’t happen during man’s tenure on the planet. FDR was right when he said that the only thing we have to fear is fear
    itself, and his socialism provided Social Security, a Ponsi scheme we will likely never recover from.

    The big problem with Obama’s fetish to kill oil and the country is that there is plenty of ‘crude’ under this country to last a long, long time, and the failure to drill for it within our borders is a damned
    shame, caused by a basic lack of leadership over the last 40 or 50 years. There is a dispute over whether petroleum is an organic fossil or a biogenic based product, and I as well as many others in the scientific world now believe it to be abiotic. Abiotic production is thought to be nearly unlimited as opposed to organic fossil production that is predicted to peak and then fail. Technology will likely kill the need for oil long before we run out of oil.

    It is also shameful not to pursue nuclear energy just because of a couple of accidents that could have been avoided by better engineering of safety and location. Does nuclear work and is it safe? I believe it is, since we have nuclear submarines running all over the planet under nuclear power, and they have been for many years, with very little
    trouble. It would be better to put the so-called ‘clean energy’ funds into research to perfect nuclear fusion that doesn’t have the radioactive waste problems of fission. Fission isn’t bad either, particularly if the US government would permit recycling the spent fuel as the other countries do.

    The sun provides a tremendous amount of energy to this planet, but due to the inverse square law we only get about 1.4 kW per square meter around the equator at equinox, and at other times we have to factor in a Cosine to handle the angular change caused by the curvature of the earth and the time of the year. Directly, and indirectly, the sun provides all of the energy available for planet Earth. The land area required to produce enough alternative energy to even make a dent in our usage would be impractical at best, particularly since the efficiency of solar cell conversion is so low. Factoring in the energy it takes to grow the corn or other plant life to produce a gallon of Ethanol, which has less energy than a gallon of gasoline causing the vehicle to get lower mileage per gallon, makes Ethanol impractical without government subsidies, and taxpayers pay these subsidies, which makes the cost of a gallon of Ethanol more than a gallon of gasoline. It would be better to drink the Ethanol than burn it in your car, and it might even make you feel better as well!

    We need a REAL president, not a narcissistic, inexperienced, academic lawyer trained by Communists like Karl Marx, Reverend? Jeremiah Wright, and Bill Ayers to be a very effective community agitator who has never held a real job in his whole life before becoming a hand puppet for the NWO that bought him the office of president for favors they expect from him! Peer through Obama’s smoke and mirrors and don’t be fooled by his smooth rhetoric that reminds me of a Snake Oil or Magic Elixir salesman back in the Wild West days of old! The alcohol in the elixirs would make you feel better if you drank enough of it, but the hangover in the morning when you woke up with no money in your pocket and still had your same old aches and pains made you realize that you had just been scammed! Not buying into the smooth excrement was the best cure for you, not the product! We do need to get agitated all right, but for saving our country, not giving it to those who aren’t willing to work for it and protect it. The Constitution only gives you the right to Life (if you are up to it), Liberty (if you live a moral and lawful life and play by the rules), and the Pursuit of Happiness (if you are willing to make the effort), but it does not guarantee that your pursuit will succeed without effort! Success is up to you, not the government! There are no free lunches, and life is not always fair, so get over yourself or live with the consequences of your actions, or the lack therof!

    Have an enjoyable day, tomorrow will likely be worse if we continue on the path we are now on. Liberals, take of your blinders and the rose colored glasses; the utopia Obama and the NWO promise you is pure Socialism, which has been tried before but has never worked because the Elites in power always eventually run out of other people’s money, and that leads to a revolt that results in a new civilization, and so on, and so on.

    This Nations founding fathers were considered rebels and terrorists by England, but they considered themselves to be Patriots, and they were! Whether you were considered a terrorist or a patriot just depended on whose side you were on, and your point of view, which is still true today! Are we the United States, or the Disunited States? Choose wisely! United we stand, divided we fall! Obama, the Congress, the NWO, Political Correctness, and Multi-Lingual Multi-Culturalism, are dividing us as a nation by causing us to bicker among ourselves over petty excrement so we won’t notice they aren’t doing their elected jobs, so don’t buy it! Our forefathers gave us an excellent Republic, under God, if we could keep it, but we are throwing it all away by our racism, political correctness, inaction and complacency! The politicians soon learned to skim the till, and they fleece us daily by their extreme lies and heavier, and heavier taxation!

    Obama has been on vacation, or golfing, or partying, using our dime since he first sat down in the Oval Office! He uses our Constitution for toilet paper. He destroys jobs and incentives. He pees on our backs and tries to convince us that it is raining! He thinks we are just too damned stupid to notice! Without incentives to get ahead and commitment to get along and succeed, socialism simply dries up and fails. And it will fail this time if allowed to take over the country. Limited Capitalism provides the incentives to get ahead, but YOU have to provide the WILL to get ahead, to get along and to succeed. Don’t think politicians are crooks? Check into their records! They are in government for the same reason Willie Sutten robbed banks; because that’s where the easy money is! Think about it!

    Patriots: 2012 is coming, we need to take our country back, so let’s get off our butts and get’r done! Clean the House, clean the Senate, and clean the Oval Office! Fumigate the White House to rid it of rodents and pests! Re-staff the Supreme Court! It’s better to be DEAD than RED! I’m quite willing to die for my country, but NOT the NWO or Obamaland, are you? God help us all to remain a Sovereign Nation, under God, called the United States of America! Remember the Alamo (a simple back door could have changed the coarse of history)! We can change the coarse of history in 2012, if we really put our mind to it!

    • Jay

      I totally agree, Willie Evershave! A monumental task nonetheless.

      • Thamera

        So true!

        • Denniso

          I seriously doubt that the guy is an actual physicist because it’s clear he can’t think very well. If he is trained in science then I would wonder what podunk college he attended that apparently failed to teach him to think in any sort of logical way. Sad…

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            M.I.T.

          • Denniso

            If that’s true,and who really knows,then he’s a physicist who can’t think very well…it happens.

  • American Citizen

    What it all comes down to is that man can do nothing about climate change. He can do something about air and water pollution, but not the climate.

  • blackmark48

    Wind turbines going west from where? I live in Alaska. My Brother lives in Portland, Oregon. My Mother lived in Boise, Idaho. Made lots of drives between the two on visits. Since 1998 I noticed a tremendous increase in wind turbine palcement on the Washington side of the Columbia River east of the Cascade Mountain Range. On my last trip two years ago, there were almost as many on the Oregon side of the river. There must be hundreds. Hasn’t been that long since there were none.

  • Ridge Runner

    I think the biggest problem with our planet is over population by the wrong kind of oeople.these people want control the rest of the people.these lytng thiving liberals(communists) want complete control and will kill to get it.when these people get control they will have the good life and the average will live on their leavings.The only thing i want is them to lesve me along,Vamose go away leave.

    • Denniso

      Is it just a figment of my imagination that it is Repubs who want to tell women what they can or can’t do w/ their own bodies? Do you have enough awareness to realize that it is primarily the religious conservatives who want to lock you in prison for smoking a weed?

      Why don’t you try hard to name one single thing that liberals want to force you to do or not do?

      • patty

        Fund all of their social ideologies. Pass laws to conform to your ideologies. Smoking in public, helmet laws, teach my children things that they have no business teaching them such as alternative lifestyles, sex education, abortion, trying to pass laws so you cannot own a gun, that god does not exist, that they were not a creation of God but that we are a product of evolution, don’t have time for more, sorry, but you get the idea. Liberals force people into thier ideoligies by passing laws and making them pay for them.

        • Denniso

          Who’s passed any law that says God does not exist? What law is paased that forces you to believe any ideology? Smoking in public affects other people’s health,that’s why it’s finally being outlawed after centuries of non smokers and children being forced to inhale the smoke. And what law is it that forces you to seek an abortion? There is likewise no law that says you have to become educated and accept evolution as the scientific theory it is.

          You’re mixed up and confused about what is a law to force or constrain action compared to laws that protect public health and safety. Anyone dumb enough to ride a motorcycle at 70 mph in traffic is already too clueless to worry about wearing a helmet or not. Do we have laws saying you are not free to smoke pot? Yes. Is the rightwing trying to constrain and interfere in what a woman does w/ her body? Yes. Does the rightwing want to force religion into schools and public life w/ laws? Yes.

          • Jay

            Does the left wing force religion out of schools? The answer is yes, you do, you control freaks!!!
            Does the left wing engage in pre-netal murder? Yes!
            Does the left wing wish that all be on medication? Yes
            Does the left win force belief in evolution? Yes. Why? Because you’re a bunch of control freaks!!!

          • Denniso

            Learn the constitution, and then get back to me. The rightwing is so dense and hypocritical that they are hopeless. You and your neo fascist buddies really need to learn how to think rationally as well.

          • patty

            Dennisio – Number 1 – I wear a helmet in a state that does not require one. So take your sarcastic jump to conclusions attitude and shove it. Number 2- they have made people take down manger scenes from private property because some a hole found it “offensive” http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1530444/posts, I am forced to pay for abortions through tax dollars by law, did they pass laws against smoking on/in someones private property (bars)yes. Are there laws on the books that let you smoke medicinal pot-yes (15 to be exact:http://medicalmarijuana.procon.org/view.resource.php?resourceID=000881, some religious people do not believe in abortion, they may belong to the repubican party, I am not one of them. I do not care what a female does with her body. By the way, if a woman elects to keep the baby, should the man have to pay child support because he wants her to have an abortion? It is her decision to keep it…they don’t want to force to keep religion anywhere, they want to have the option for those who want to to be able to pray without getting arrested for it. Your group is the one passing laws to make it so you cannot personally do that. But yet, they more than allow Muslim kids to pray in school. http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/2007-07-25-muslim-special-treatment-from-schools_N.htm
            They also allow kids to fly a Mexican flag above an upside down American flag, then send the kids wearing an American flag on their person home. Plus suspend the kids who try to correct the flags.
            So, take ALL of your hypocrital double speak and put it where the sun does not shine. This country was founded on judeo-christian principles and if you remove the ‘found’ation there is no support left. The fact is YOU have no concept of our constitution or you would not be supporting what you do. Our federal gov’t. has literally shredded our contitution. Obamacare is unconstitutional and more and more states are lining up to fight that.

          • Denniso

            ‘They’ have made people take down manger scenes on private property?
            That ridiculous comment is indicative of the rest of your mindless post. NO ONE makes ANYONE do anything in regard to Xmas scenes on PRIVATE property…that just shows how little you know about these issues. You can put Jesus on a ferris wheel smoking a cigar w/ Trump’s hair piece on,if it’s on your property. You can have Budda kissing Mary if it’s on your property. The only legal issue is w/ RELIGIOUS scenes on PUBLIC property. Can you follow the distinction?

          • Patty

            Denniso-Did you bother to click on what I posted? Obviously not. That was a situation where a family was told they had to remove their nativity scene from their front lawn because someone in the neighborhood found it offensive. I proved each one of your allegations wrong. Point by point. Suck it up and acknowledge that you were wrong. I can’t help it if you are determined to not beieve facts. Maybe you need to de-program yourself before you can let some intelligence in. That is too bad.

          • Jay

            Denniso, you are a lunatic!

          • Jay

            According to popular belief, the left has always preached that a woman is capable of raising a family, supporting a husband, and having her own career. She should have a choice as to whether she has a child or not, she can have an abortion if she so chooses, without consulting anyone including her husband. Children and family come second to a woman’s right to have a career.

            They believe it is perfectly OK and normal for teenagers to have sex, out of wedlock, and if they are burdened with a baby, it is perfectly OK to abort it. Not only is it OK, it is encouraged. One should be pro-choice, if one is not pro choice, they are old fashioned and not keeping up with the times.

            Let’s see now, so what is the problem with Sarah Palin?

            She has five children, a good marriage, and a successful career, and she is practicing pro-choice, pro choice should mean that she has choices as to if she would keep a baby or abort, she decided to keep her child, although knowing that the baby would be born severely handicapped. Her teenage daughter became pregnant, an all too common occurrence today.

            This all should fit right into the left’s game plan, they should be clamoring all over this lady! Instead of praising her, they are asking if a woman is capable of maintaining a career and raising a family. they are asking if she has time to do both. Haven’t they been preaching for years that a woman can do it all? So What is the problem?

            The problem is, in their minds pro-choice isn’t pro choice, in their minds pro-choice means pro abortion, there is no other option.

            The fact that mother and daughter both decided to keep their babies infuriate them, they think most women are pro abortion, most women are not. Women who have an abortion , live with that fact for the rest of their lives, if they have a conscience.

            The next and maybe the most crucial problem that the left has with Sarah is jealousy, the left thought they had sole ownership of the fact that a woman would someday reside in the White House. That possibility has been taken away from them. That right was theirs and theirs alone, the fact that Mrs. Palin has a real good chance of becoming the first female Vice-President and President and along the way upstaging their guy terrifies and infuriates them. I bet Bill spent all week-end picking up broken lamps at the Clinton household!

            The left does have some issues with some of her conservative views, from their point of view. But, on these issues, there is nothing they can say, and still be taken seriously.

            Article Source: http://EzineArticles.com/1462427

          • denniso

            So, what’s wrong w/ Sara Palin? Let’s see,she’s a fraud and a phoney for starters. She’s not very bright. She used her office for personal gain,then quit when she was investigated. How many governors have quit office after only 2 yrs because they are being looked into? How many of those would have been innocent of wrong doing? Did she quit because she wanted to cash in on the millions that were offered,or did she quit because she was guilty? Either way,it makes her look like political scum.

          • denniso

            Patty..I’m not going to waste my time looking at some slanted and probably lying video that some kook put out there. There are NO laws that say you can’t put up any religious monstrosity you like in your own yard. Neighborhood covenants are different and not law,and people live w/ all sorts of those. Whatever reason the people were forced to take down their xmas stuff,it wasn’t because there is a law against religious junk on their lawn. I can imagine that you people are spinning it to make it appear that it’s big bad gov’t and Liberals who are forcing the action,when it’s probably neighborhood covenants.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        They force me to payer higher taxes. They then force me to pay higher taxes, to fund a health plan that 70 percent of us dont want. They force me to pay higher taxes so that they can give GM and Chrysler billions of dollars, that I dont want to give them. They force me to pay high and higher social security taxes so that they can give them to illegal aliens who are here, illegally. They force me to accept abortion as legal, when its clear cut murder. They force us to accept that one guy bonking another is ok, or I should say they try to force, because Im not agreeing to any of these things, but they try. They take our money by force and now pay for abortions overseas, one of the first things Obama signed into office. They force us to legally allow perverted men to marry each other, (yeech). Yes, it is forced upon society by the liberals, so that they can corner the gay vote. There are many many other things they force on us pal, your evidently to dumb to see it. Of course, they are forcing to to make stupid comments backing them, but you dont understand that part of it either.

        • Denniso

          You sound like a thirteen yr old…no thinking at all in your comment.

          • Patty

            Denniso-read Penny’scommens below. More facts that you can deny. Does this mean you are in denial of reality?

          • denniso

            Most of what you,Penny and other rightwingers call ‘facts’ are just lies made up for the purpose of propoganda. You wouldn’t know a fact if it hit you in the face. You think Beck and Limbaugh spew facts,and you spread their lies willingly because you’re nothing more than sheep following what makes you feel good or superior or sanctified.

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            denniso,sooooo what makes you an authority on climate change?_ a couple of links, Really?_-Damn I’m doing it alll wrong!__ lol

        • denniso

          No,all I do is read the science. I’m no expert in global warming,but understanding the science and then trusting most scientists to be right in what they are doing…it’s a bit better than trusting it to idiots like Limbaugh,Beck…

  • Penny R. Freeman

    Ok Denniso if the right wing is as dense as you claim, then you explain to me why the biggest propaganda czar for climate change, Al Gore, went out after he raked in so much cash from that idiotic movie and spent it on a home that consumes more energy (none of which comes from green technoloy) than a huge number of average sized homes. The scientists who gave the info for that stupid movie actually admitted that they filled in the blanks where the info was missing with facts to fit the theory that we humans are changing the earth’s climate-in other words they made some of it up. Also in their words they “adjusted” the temperatures they reported where there was actual data to fit into that theory. Obama’s end goal in all of this is the same as George Soros’s, Bill and Hillary Clinton’s, and quite a few others of the left wing progressives-to destroy America, the only country strong enough to stand in their way of destroying capitalism and forming a one world government. If that isn’t their end goal then you explain why Obama is working every way he can to tear to pieces our Constitution, do away as much as possible with our personal liberties, make the American public dependent on our government (create a nanny state), and to ally with the U.N. (an organization that should be destroyed or at least run out of this country and in which the U.S. should have no part) to take away not only Americans’ money but their guns as well. You do know the tried and true statement that when the public is left without arms the only ones with arms will be the criminals and the government. Obama is doing everything he can to force the American public to march to his orders. He’s the one that said in some of his preelection speeches of the past that “energy prices would necessarily skyrocket”. He is wanting gas prices to go to $10/gallon in the U.S. He even stated that there would be 1 million electric cars on the roads of the U.S. before he left office. Yes he claimed in a recent speech that his administration is responsible for the recent increase in oil pumped from our waters. That is another of his lies. What the liberal media isn’t telling the public is that his administration is under threat of a charge by a federal judge of “contempt of court’. Why? Because even though Obama has made the claim that the moratorium on off-shore drilling has been lifted, his administration through the Pelosi/Reid controlled Congress added so much redtape it has become almost impossible to even get a permit to explore for oil in the Gulf or elsewhere in the U.S. on or off shore. His administration after that judge gave them only thirty days to comply with his order or face that charge has actually aproved of ONLY one permit! And Obama has demanded that so much land in our western states, a vast amount of which has been proven to be ripe with energy resources such as natural gas, coal, and oil, be converted to federal property that in no way can be used by the public for development or companies wanting to extact those energy resources. You liberals need to look beyond that thin veil disguised by that smirky smile and see the liar-in-chief you put in office. Maybe he thinks he’s made no mistakes and is pushing this country in the right direction, but at this point 70% of the American public totally disagrees with him. And if you’re dumb enough to believe that the healthcare reform garbage he spent most of his first two years in office will actually help the public, you are a gullible ninny. You need to actually get into that garbage and find out what is in it. That’s one huge bundle of mandates, tax increases, and nefarious was to destroy your privacy and take your possessions and liberties away from you. There’s even a provision in there for the formation of a civilian force in case of public unrest-similar to Hitler’s brown shirts, people to go violently against the public and regular military when they won’t march to Obama’s orders! If you don’t believe me get a copy or look it up through the records of Congress and read it-I’m sure you’ll need the help of an attorney to untangle all that legal language. If you’ve ever had to read tax law, which I have, you can decipher it.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      Dumbniso wont reply to your post, because you nailed her to the wall, and she cannot argue with the truth. Nice job.

      • Denniso

        Sorry,but there is nothing there to respond to. No facts,no thought,only ranting that reminds me of Limabugh.

        For the record…I am totally opposed to any insurance mandates and am waiting for the supreme court to rule against the idea. It was the single dumbest thing Obama did in his first two yrs,both politically and legislatively. But, you choose to ignore the fact that it was the Repubs plan in the 90′s when they fought Clinton’s healthcare reform,and even this time there were Repubs in favor of it early on,Charles Grassly for one,until they all got in line to oppose anything that Obama proposed.

        That being said,the Repubs have only fought any realistic reforms of our mess of healthcare system for decades and are not bothered in the least that 40 million are left out of reasonable and affordable care,w/ bankruptcy and lack of access being common. It’s utterly shameful that we have the most expensive system in the world and leave so many people out of it and impose such ridiculous costs on almost everyone else. All so that the CEO’s in the healthcare industry in all aspects can collect their multi million $ salaries…disgusting and pathetic for the richest country ever in world history.

    • patty

      Thank you Penny for pointing out all of those facts. But, I am sure Dennisio, if they can grasp any of it, would be just fine with all of it.

    • Jay

      Penny, although your arguments are sound, they will have no impact on libertards like denniso. The likes of denniso are here only to disrupt and subvert!

      • Denniso

        Your choice of words speaks for itself…’l1bertards’? How old are you,12?

        And you’re wrong,some of us are here to try to straighten out the wacko lack of reasoning we see. It’s a bit depressing though to hear so many non thinking people(children?)in one place spouting the exact same nonsense and talking points that derive from your truly wacko leaders,like Limbaugh,Beck,Savage…depressing and sad for the country.

        • Denniso

          Your name calling childish word is ‘libertard’. Something wrong w/ my fingers. I often wonder where and how you rightwing nutcases come up w/ such stupid and juvenile word and names that you toss around at Obama,liberals,Democrats.etc. What a silly and nonsensical waste of any sort of brain you people may have. Why don’t you instead act like adults,read some real books and use what may be left of your minds to do some real thinking? I believe that essentially everyone,even hardcore,fundamentalist,uneducated,rightwingers can do a little reasoning,rather than just following like shhep. Tyr it,you may like it.

  • Earl, QUEENS, NY

    And we also hear BHO talking about probing the possibility of collusion, price gouging, etc. by the fuel and energy industries. BS!! Put the blame for high energy costs where it belongs – on our dependency on foreign oil!! If there is any collusion, how can we be sure it’s not between OPEC, BHO, his democraps and/or the flat-earth no-growth environmentalist wacko Marxists?? It’s obvious BHO is exploiting this situation, and using it as a campaign ploy to give the impression he’s doing something good when he’s not. And sadly a large % of Americans are dumb enough to fall for such lies. We can only hope that voters will wise up in 2012 and realize that the solution is domestic drilling and energy independence; neither of which is possible with BHO and his democraps in control!!

  • Jay

    The United Nations’ (UN) current plan to discuss a treaty proposal granting more rights to “mother earth” than humans is nothing more than an elaborate attempt to re-market the climate change program in a neatly wrapped package called “environmental justice.”

    The UN proposal, drafted by Bolivian socialist president Evo Morales (the same guy who claims that eating chicken causes male baldness and homosexuality), is similar to a new Bolivian law which elevates trees, animals, insects and “living things” to the same level as humans. Raised to this new level, mother earth and her “living things” would be assigned an authorized representative to hear complaints brought on their behalf and would have the right to seek financial compensation for damages.

    All bug-stomping humans beware: Morales’ proposal does not stop at financial compensation but goes a step further to execute judgment upon the guilty by organizing a “tribunal for climate justice.”

    During an interview at the 2009 Climate Change Summit, Morales said his plan to save the planet included ending luxury and consumerism, while destroying capitalism and forcing rich nations to settle their “climate debt” to the poor. Morales said capitalism is “the worst enemy of humanity.

    It may be just me, but does it seem that the human race has gone stark raving mad that some would think it is reasonable to ascribe human rights to grass and bugs? One can only hope that someone will also provide delegates with a clean sandbox to play in during recess, provided someone is there to monitor the rights of the sand fleas. It is tempting to dismiss this plan by Morales as ridiculous as the UN naming Iran to a women’s rights panel last month, but it seems Morales has ready and willing partners in the U.S. administration.

    Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) Administrator Lisa Jackson spoke last week at the Power Shift 2011 conference assuring an audience of young, impressionable minds that the EPA has “restored science to its rightful place as the backbone of everything the Environmental Protection Administration does, and that includes the science of climate change. We are using that science to take action on climate change.”

    Layman terms: Cap-and-Trade legislation based on junk science failed, so the Obama administration used the EPA to go through the back door. No wonder some prefer the EPA be defunded.

    Highlighting her list of accomplishments, Jackson revealed her crème de la crème was expanding “the conversation on environmental justice” – that “unfinished business” – in “low and minority neighborhoods.” Jackson reassured the activists that Obama needed them to stay focused on promoting their beliefs that “there is no difference and choice to be made between a healthy economy and a clean and healthy environment.”

    Van Jones, the past Obama White House “Green Czar” who resigned in 2009 after his “green socialism/environmental bias” leanings surfaced, also spoke. During the conference, Jones placed an Atlas-sized burden on the shoulders of these easily influenced kids when he told them that “the entire planet, the children of all species are banking on you.” Jones assured the audience that although he loves “rich people,” he intends to cash in on their money to fund the green movement cause.

    In a January 30, 2005, Miami Herald editorial, former Greenpeace co-founder and president, Dr. Patrick Moore said he left his own organization because “much of the environmental movement, made a sharp turn to the political left and began adopting extreme agendas that abandoned science and logic in favor of emotion and sensationalism.” It’s only gotten worse. The once wholesome and worthwhile goal to protect the planet was hijacked and turned into a pseudo religion – by some who care more about transferring America’s wealth than they do the environment.

  • WendelFl

    Denniso, if you are quoting Al Gore on global warming, you are an idiot. He is one of the dumbest politicians to ever scam the public. He once said that we could tap thermal heat beneath the earth for power, saying it is only a few miles of drilling to tap in it. He was talking about the earths core. Which is 1000s of mile beneath the earth. What an idiot. He was a c student in college and if he didn’t have a famous daddy would be flipping hamburgers. I guess I can give him some credit for running the global warming scam and the movie which have made him a multi millionaire off of people like you.

    • Denniso

      You think I’m an idiot,I think you’re a fool. Al Gore only publicizes what thousands of climate scientists have been saying and continue to try and get across to fools like you. Al Gore didn’t have anything to do w/ any of the studies,research or science…he is only a spokesperson,as many others are.

      You neanderthals want to put your kid’s and grandkid’s futures at risk by ignoring the threat of climate change,because you’re too dense to understand any science at all,and think you owe some stupid allegiance to the oil industry. Shame on any like you who are only thinking of the short term and playing politics w/ probably the greatest problem to face humanity and the earth.

  • Geoman

    Jeremy Leochner ,Denniso and his ilk are “fraud apologists” for Gore – Obama -the IPCC and UK non- scientists . 31000 real scientists have declared that there is no truth to the man-made climate change /global warming hoax .The nefarious cultists are out to change the world order by any means including subterfuge and threats against any and all who call them for the liars they are.

    • Patty

      Sorry Geoman I didn’t see your post before I found what I posted.

  • Patty

    There was a plethera of information contradicting what Al Gore has said. But why would some one believe a man that said he invented the internet? Was this during a massage?
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G7VUg7nG3lw&NR=1

    • Denniso

      Forget Gore,he’s just a spokesman. Read the science and do some thinking outside of the political realm. Don’t listen to Beck,Limbaugh and co either,who are playing politics and making money on the issue as well. You don’t have to follow anyone if you can read and understand a little science. It’s not all that difficult.

      • Patty

        Denniso-Don’t listen to Gore, etc… You are no longer worth the effort to communicate with. I am not liscensed to instruct special ed people.

        • Denniso

          Have you read the science on global warming? And do you understand it?
          If not,then you should before you make adament statements against it.
          Most rightwing deniers don’t read it or understand it,so they should keep quiet on something they can’t follow. Following people like Limbaugh on any issue is like following a zombie…no brain.

          • Patty

            Denniso-FU, you are an idiot. Everyone else on this blog and others implied it, I tried to give you the benefit of the doubt. You are not worth the air space you take up. I will not reply to you again.

          • denniso

            I guess that means that you haven’t read or don’t understand the science on climate change…that’s OK,if you then kept your opinion to yourself,since it’s based on nothing except politics.

            Your reactionary response and FU makes you sound like a rabid dog foaming at the mouth. Did anyone ever force you to read or respond to me?

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Way to go denniso, work your enviro-wack-job magic__your hilarious!__climate change runs in cycles, anything else science says is a scam, NOOOOOO PROOF!!!!

        • denniso

          You won’t read the science,or can’t understand it,so there is absolutely no point in discussing a scientific issue w/ you.

          I wonder,do you have any proof that your Jesus floated ‘up’ to heaven?
          Do you have any proof that he even existed,since no one wrote about a
          Jesus except the biblical writers?

  • BCohio

    The hardest thing for all LIBERAL SOCIALIST to do in life, is to admit they were WRONG about anything!..

  • Joseph A Vanchieri jr.

    Just another way that Obama and his Chicago thugs are trying and suceeding in ruining the United States. I have known for years that this global warming and go green junk was a big lie to make big money. Get them out of Washington D.C. as fast as we can!!!!

  • Dr. Conrad A. Lohutko

    The real energy breakthrough is not being mentioned and is being put down. If there was sincerity in the movement for clean energy and not just politics, my companies would have lots of investors. Please read the following:
    REVOLUTION IN ELECTRIC POWER GENERATION
    Oil production has peaked. Nuclear power is dangerous. So, what’s next?
    You are probably not aware that one of the greatest scientific transformations of all time is taking place in the field of production of electricity. Basically, it is now possible to produce more electricity from an advanced turbine generation system than is consumed in the process of electricity generation. I am the owner of the companies involved in this revolution. The governments of the US, Russia and China are aware of these developments and have shown some interest because they have not been able to replicate the technology. However, they have dragged out negotiations for too long a period. As a result, OPEC, many Arab nations, oil companies, and the nuclear power industry are extremely determined to maintain the status quo by blocking this transformational technology.
    I had two billionaire American investors who were very interested in investing, Because of intensive lobbying efforts by the energy industry and Arab leaders, who are determined to stop technological progress, they decided against investing. One billionaire even had all of his debt notes called by Arab investors.
    The stakes are very high for the US and the rest of the world because without energy independence, the US and all other nations will continue to bleed money. Natural gas represents a partial alternative but will always be more expensive than the advanced electrical power system.
    Incidentally, the engineering estimates for the production costs per KWH are only .0125 cents. This makes the new technology and its system the lowest cost producer. There is currently only a test system, number 14. It has proven the concept. A production quality system still needs to be built with money from investors. The system is initially for the production of electricity, but may be adapted eventually down-sized to power electric vehicles and boats. Larger systems could power trains and ships. It is also a zero emission system, 100% clean, and 100% non-polluting.
    The concept for the system and the initial design work were from my father, Floryan A. Lohutko, who just happened to create the silicon wafer chip at Xerox and the pulse engine for secret US aircraft.
    This new technology is very real and has taken 30 years to develop. Can you see the need for brave investors or a new Manhattan type program under a world-wide consortium? It would mean energy independence for all nations. Without energy independence, we will continue to be at the mercy of oil producing nations or dangerous nuclear power. Just count the cost.
    Conrad A. Lohutko, Ph.D.
    President,
    Sterling Enterprises, Inc.
    Agile Logistics Technology, LLC

  • mark

    What is wrong with having a clean enviroment? Do you not keep your house clean? We need to keep our planet clean. I myself want clean air to breath, fresh water to drink. I do not understand you conservatives that want to treat our planet like a garbage dump.

    • denniso

      Good points…too many ‘conservatives’ mix their religious views w/ politics,in believing that since God created the earth for us exclusively we can do w/ it what we wish,including trashing it. They also believe too often that only God is in control of things, that we are only instruments for his use,so we can’t possibly have the power to wreck the earth as that is only for God to deal with. I’ve heard ‘conservatives’ say that it is extreme human arrogance to think we can have any real impact on the earth and it’s complex eco systems.

      It’s actually a bit more than scary to realize what it is they really believe,and how it can affect us and the earth.

  • Eric Bischoff

    Last I read a 6 million year old human is the latest find. So now that Obama has produced a birth certificate the conservative morons on this site can now redirect there ignorance to the global warming issue. I know the earth is flat!

  • Eric Bischoff

    I know! I know! the free market system will fix everything. Greed is good, government is bad. Taxes are evil. Regulations are bad. Carbon and nuclear energy is the best and renewables are a joke. The black man is solely responsible for destroying America. Environmentalist are all commies. Social Democrats are commies. Soros is a commie. (mind you, he is the only Billionaire committed to living by Jesus’ principle of a rich man’s chance of getting into heaven and dying broke by giving away all of his billions to improve mankind). Carter, Gore, Clinton were idiots but Reagan and the Bush clan are all brilliant. And finally everything that’s wrong in America is because of illegal immigrants and abortions.

    You are all out of your freakin out of your minds!

    • denniso

      It does seem that many rightwingers are partly insane,at least. I think they are part of a mass hypnosis of a sort that is fed by millions of them acting like an echo chamber,as well as following their ‘divine’ leaders like Limbaugh.

      Now that they will have to drop the ‘birther’ issue my guess is that they will just move on to another idiotic smear of Obama…how about forcing him to ‘prove’ he’s not a Muslim? The insane right will not sit still for as long as ANY Democrat is president,especially a black
      Democrat.

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