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The Boat Is Sinking Fast

November 15, 2010 by  

The Boat Is Sinking Fast

The United States financial system is a rickety, leaking boat, and rather than bailing it out, Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke is pouring more water in.

The signs of the sinking system are coming on furiously now. The price of gold tells the story. The state of the “too big to fail” banks is another sign.

Saved from the fate it deserved by former Treasury Secretary Hank Paulson’s infusion of $45 billion from the Troubled Asset Relief Program, Bank of America sucked up the criminal enterprise Countrywide Financial and claimed all was well. Just over a year later it paid back the loan. That was last December.

But since mid-April the bank’s stock price has dropped more than 40 percent. And the value of its outstanding stock is currently at around half of what it should be based on its “book value” — what the company says its holdings are worth, according to the website AlterNet.

Bloomberg columnist Jonathan Weil writes that mortgage-bond investors are demanding untold billions of dollars in refunds, the foreclosure fiasco is metastasizing and a member of the TARP oversight panel is openly worried that BoA may need another bailout.

In other words, the bank is on the brink of another collapse. And it may not be alone.

At 1 a.m. on Nov. 8, ATMs across the country shut down. The problems affected the larger financial institutions like BoA, BBVA Compass, Wells Fargo, US Bank, SunTrust, American Express, BB&T and others. While the excuse given blamed the change from Daylight Savings Time, many in the blogosphere wondered if it wasn’t a prelude to a rumored coming banking holiday to allow for a devaluation of the dollar.

Coming just days after Helicopter Ben announced he wanted to dump another $600 billion into the system in order to spur inflation, the bank holiday/devaluation threat is not farfetched.

In fact, there are reports that a person was told by a bank manager that banks would close for an undetermined amount of time, and that when the banks reopened withdrawals by checks would be limited to $500 per week regardless of the balance in the account.

The last bank holiday in the U.S. occurred on March 9, 1933. President Franklin Delano Roosevelt closed the banks and Congress passed the Emergency Banking Act of 1933 under the guise of reorganizing insolvent banks and reopening those strong enough to survive. FDR used the holiday to confiscate gold from the citizenry and devalue the dollar. The Federal Reserve committed unlimited amounts of currency to reopened banks.

The Act gave the Treasury Secretary the authority to order any individual or organization in the U.S. to deliver any gold they possessed to the U.S. Treasury. Also the Fed was authorized to steal 10 percent of any “check, draft, banker acceptance, etc.”  by converting them into cash at 90 percent of their value.

It was out-and-out theft. Today the theft continues.

The dollar is crashing and inflation is ramping up. Anyone buying groceries knows this. Even former Alaska Governor Sarah Palin knows it. But the ruling elite — including Helicopter Ben — want to hide it from you. And they try to do it by lying to you.

Sarah Palin on Monday [Nov. 8] made a speech at a trade-association convention in Phoenix urging Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke to “cease and desist” his “pump priming”.  Palin said the United States, “shouldn’t be playing around with inflation.” She went on to say, "All this pump priming will come at a serious price. And I mean that literally: everyone who ever goes out shopping for groceries knows that prices have risen significantly over the past year or so. Pump priming would push them even higher."

After obtaining a copy of her speech, the Wall Street Journal’s Sudeep Reddy wrote an article criticizing Palin’s comments about food inflation, saying that, "Grocery prices haven’t risen all that significantly, in fact. The consumer price index’s measure of food and beverages for the first nine months of this year showed average annual inflation of less than 0.6%, the slowest pace on record." NIA [National Inflation Association] finds it unfortunate that Reddy has been brainwashed into believing the government’s phony consumer price index (CPI) numbers.

The U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS)’s CPI is not a reliable indicator of U.S. food inflation or any type of price inflation. NIA estimates the real rate of annual food inflation in the U.S. to already be 5% and projects that this rate will rise above 10% in early 2011. NIA believes the BLS has been using both geometric weighting and hedonics to artificially manipulate the CPI downward. The U.S. government has a strong motivation to keep CPI increases as low as possible because since the year 1975, retired Americans receive annual Social Security payment increases that are tied to the CPI. NIA calculates that based on the way the BLS’s CPI has understated the real rate of price inflation, Americans on Social Security should be receiving payments that are more than double what they receive today. Unfortunately, the government just announced last month that Americans on Social Security will receive no payment increase in 2011, despite the fact that food inflation will likely become the biggest crisis of the year, much larger than the mortgage crisis we have today.

When calculating food inflation, the government uses deceptive geometric weighting, which gives a lower weighting to goods that are rising in price and a higher weighting to goods that are falling in price. If the price of steak is rising while the price of hamburgers is falling, the CPI will give a lower weighting to steak and a higher weighting to hamburgers. The government justifies this by saying that expensive steak prices mean Americans are more likely to eat hamburgers. Therefore, the CPI no longer accounts for the price to maintain the same standard of living. The CPI is now calculated based on the realization that America’s standard of living has been in decline and the expectation that it will continue to decline in the future. — National Inflation Association.

The NIA is predicting massive inflation very soon as a result of Helicopter Ben’s latest escapade. It says that grocery stores will soon charge $11.43 for an ear of corn, $23.05 for a 24-ounce loaf of wheat bread, $62.21 for a 32-ounce package of Domino Granulated Sugar, $24.31 for a 32-ounce container of soy milk, $77.71 for a 11.30-ounce container of Folgers Classic Roast Coffee, $45.71 for a 64-ounce container of Minute Maid Orange Juice and $15.50 for a Hershey’s Milk Chocolate 1.55-ounce candy bar. NIA also projects that by the end of this decade, a plain white men’s cotton t-shirt at Wal-Mart will cost $55.57.

The dollar is on its way out as the world’s sole reserve currency. According to the Financial Times, “Almost everyone involved in the international financial system agrees long-term change is inevitable: the rise of China will surely mean that the dollar cannot continue to be the world’s sole reserve currency.”

The elites are doing all they can to prop up the current failed system. It won’t work.

The American middle class is being impoverished by U.S. dollar depreciation. Will they realize it before Treasury Secretary Timothy Geithner begins adding zeros to the currency, or will it be after?

Bob Livingston

is an ultra-conservative American who has been writing a newsletter since 1969. Bob has devoted much of his life to research and the quest for truth on a variety of subjects. Bob specializes in health issues such as nutritional supplements and alternatives to drugs, as well as issues of privacy (both personal and financial), asset protection and the preservation of freedom.

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  • DaveH

    Sickening. Do you suppose the American people will finally wake up to the fact that Big Government is not good for the economy? I’ve been waiting for 40 years for that event, so I won’t hold my breath.

    • Al Sieber

      Dave, how do expect the people to wake up, it’s Foot ball season.

      • refuse2lose

        Exactly why Barry goes after the youth vote so intensely. He knows they don’t pay attention to what is going on,they are too busy idolizing the latest HollyWood star or buying the latest in technology.

        • http://randall701jen@charter.net Working Man

          Amen!!! That is why I do not have much hope for the future of
          this country. For every young American that realizes what is
          happenning and is conseritive, there are probably 4 or 5 who
          are too interested in the lattest in pop culture.

    • meteorlady

      They are to busy watching Dancing with the Stars, Idol, Lost and all the rest of the crap that’s on right now. Keeps the masses engaged in other things so they won’t notice that the US is going to heck in a hand basket.

      • Christin

        meteorlady,
        Yes, cable tv and all its dumbing down drivel, ipods, cell phones, Gameboy/Nintendo/Wii, ballet, little league, arcade games, gambling… all lull the masses into a ficitous reality of busy fun while true reality has us on board the sinking luxury Titanic and we need to wake up, choose life and jump ship to the USS Constitution (strong military jet-fighter ship) and take our Country back to conservatism and Freedom!

        Prices are going up and the dollar is going down… hope you’ve all been reading the Preparedness & Storage of food, water, medical and meds, clothes, soaps and paper products Articles Bob Livingston has been putting here on this site.

        • http://qstickdenny@yahoo.com dennis cerasoli

          Christen,people do thse things to distract from the pressure’s you are commenting on.Myself,i am a coventional american,so i ask you what to do?are we finished?i hope not any suggestions?

          • smithington

            “Trust in the Lord with all your heart, and lean not on your own understanding; In all your ways acknowledge Him and He will direct your path”. (Proverbs 3:5-6) If your not saved, please do it today while you still have time, by accepting Jesus Christ as your personal Lord and Saviour. Put your faith in Him ALONE for your salvation (not religion). None of us are guaranteed a tomorrow.

          • http://personalliberty.com TJ

            Trusting in the Lord is all fine and good, but you may find that He will not help you when you get hungry or need protection. You need to help yourself and protect yourself or you will find yourself cold and hungry and cowering in a corner waiting for Him to save you. And it may be a long wait.

          • libertytrain

            TJ – you reminded me of: “The Good Lord helps those that help themselves.”

    • albert

      I also 40 plus years

    • PatriotSara

      I implore us NOT to question if the American people wake up in time; instead, we must ensure that they do. This link is a wonderful explanation, very easily followed; it should be required viewing for all Americans: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PTUY16CkS-k&feature=player_embedded

    • RAM JET

      RAM JET
      The Liberals/Progressives have been working on the implementation of the U. N. Agenda 21 for 100years. Both Bushes, Clinton and Obama are guilty of aiding and abetting the enemy. The Elite has infiltrated the political process completely. From the Teaser rates offered to the new home owners (that could not be paid back) to the banks offering to buy back( foreclose)the property, and then sell it to the same bankers that created the problem in the first place, at a discount!
      The Debt and the value of the Dollar must be controlled by ending the FED and stopping Geithner, Bernanke and Obama!?! End Fannie Mae and Freddiemac – get control!
      The Czars must be recalled and their duties returned to the congress where elected officials can again be held accountable for their actions!?! Obama must fire the Marxist, Communists and Socialists that he has placed in too many positions of importance- to our detriment!

    • James

      Dave, Every American knows that. The problem is the government has the power to make itself bigger whether people like it or not. My congressmen answer all of my letters but their answers have little to do with my questions or suggestions.

    • http://boilermaker77@comcast.net Maxwell

      Many of us are awake! What do you suggest we do? Call our congressman?
      LOL

      • http://boilermaker77@comcast.net Maxwell

        The people must demand and impose a “balanced budget amendment” to the U.S. Constitution(supreme law of the land) to force compliance by any political party that is in power. Neither party has shown me any real fiscal restraint. We the people must make them do it or it won’t happen. The state of Georgia and a few others have balanced budget amendments that prevent lawmakers from indulging in the reckless behavior that takes place in the budget process in our nation’s capitol.

  • JeffH

    Bernanke, a cousin to the Rothschilds, knows exactly what the ultimate prize is. A One World Order run by a few elite families.

    Who Controls the Federal Reserve? There is a linear connection between the Rothschilds and the Bank of England, and the London banking houses which ultimately control the Federal Reserve Banks through their stockholdings of bank stock and their subsidiary firms in New York. The two principal Rothschild representatives in New York, J. P. Morgan Co., and Kuhn,Loeb & Co. were the firms which set up the Jekyll Island Conference at which the Federal Reserve Act was drafted, who directed the subsequent successful campaign to have the plan enacted into law by Congress, and who purchased the controlling amounts of stock in the Federal Reserve Bank of New York in 1914. These firms had their principal officers appointed to the Federal Reserve Board of Governors and the Federal Advisory Council in 1914. In 1914 a few families (blood or business related) owning controlling stock in existing banks (such as in New York City) caused those banks to purchase controlling shares in the Federal Reserve regional banks.

    … The most powerful men in the United States were themselves answerable to another power, a foreign power, and a power which had been steadfastly seeking to extend its control over the young republic since its very inception. The power was the financial power of England, centered in the London Branch of the House of Rothschild. The fact was that in 1910, the United States was for all practical purposes being ruled from England, and so it is today.

    Federal Reserve Directors: A Study of Corporate and Banking Influence
    You can see a chart connecting the Rothschilds directly to the Federal Reserve that was published in 1976

    Chart of who “owns” the Federal Reserve
    http://www.save-a-patriot.org/files/view/whofed.html

    • Al Sieber

      Hey DaveH and JeffH, weren’t we talking about hyperinflation last week? as far as banks closing, a bunch of small banks, and savings and loans went under here and closed their doors, they had armed guards at the front door. this is in N.W. Ariz.

    • Al Sieber

      JeffH, thanks for the link.

    • Wanda Murline

      Yes, and the Federal Reserve has been manipulating our economy for decades…starting with Hamilton. They created the crisis of 1807, 1873, 1929 and yes, 2008. They are manipulating our economy and the people at the top know this and are cashing in. Don’t forget that Gates, Buffett, Bloomberg, Soros, Ayers, Bush Sr., and other elists are included here also. I guess being the richest people in the world is still not enough for these people. Their one world order simply will not work…and it will create choas worldwide because democracy will be destroyed and you simply cannot contain a world of poor people who have nothing, are starving and want to kill you.

      • meteorlady

        Don’t forget the 1980 savings and loan gig, plus the “energy” crisis when full boat loads of oil were sitting in the gulf not being unloaded.

        • http://GOGGLE vaksal

          to;meteorlady,the fact you posted about those oil filled tankers,while the energy crisis hit this nation,i was in the taft area and mckittrick oil field area at that time to be exact the missouri triangle,when i was younger,at that time standard oil,getty oil and sun oil were caping the wells,to push the price higer,and getting payed by the federal government for the wells that were out of production,a lot of the folks working those fields,lost bigtime do to jobs being cut back,most of those folks were third generation oil field workers,the point is wheres the justice? it seems at every turn,the people that have corrupted this nation own both sides of the penny,it seems either way we all get fleeced.

      • DaveH

        Wanda,
        The Federal Reserve was created in 1913.

        • Vicki

          Wanda probably ment the Rothchild family. But if not she really should study history. Much easier to avoid repeating it if you actually know it.

        • (WIA) Wild Indian in Action

          DaveH, I’m just an 74 year old American Indian, full blood three tribes, What the hell do I know, You all should do some research and find the document, ” The Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion”. Can all of you spell “Zionist Jews”!

          • DaveH

            What has that got to do with what I said?

          • JeffH

            Dave, I think he was intimating that Zionists were behind the creation of the Federal Reserve.

            The Federal Reserve Bank is a consortium of 9 Zionist Jewish-owned & associated banks with the Jewish banker Rothschilds at the head. The House of Rothschild owns 57% of the stock of the privately-held Federal Reserve Bank.
            http://www.realzionistnews.com/?p=177

      • James

        Wanda, The federal government has been manipulating our country through the Federal Rserve. The Federal Reserve can’t create money unless the national gov’t. authorizes it. Our real problem is that too many people went too far into debt, and when the housing bubble burst it rippled through all the other industries. Stated otherwise, if Americans only bought things they had cash to pay for, we wouldn’t be in this mess.

        • Marion

          Americans built debt yes, their own for sure, but the government is more in debt than we are so who did we learn it from???????????
          and they still have the checkbook!

          • James

            Marion, The government is also certainly guilty of borrowing and spending beyond its means but that’s no reason to follow their example. Until the massive debt of individuals and businesses is either written off by lenders or paid off by borrowers, there can be no recovery from the recession. Government’s continued borrowing and spending to fix the situation is either naive or a deliberate attempt to bankrupt the nation. I believe the latter.

    • TIME

      Jeff, As per the norm a Great Post.

      Folks here are a few other points that Perhaps will aid with what I posted on the Illegals issue and the whole “New World Order.”

      Start with Andrew Jackosn, what did he give away of yours that made you all slaves to the House of Rothschilds, the answer is “the United States”.

      Next look into Income Tax, the first thing we gave away was the basic rights provided by the Constitution. Where “YOU are Innocent Until Proven Guilty.”
      With the IRS its a flip of that Right, You are “Guilty Until Proven Innocent.”
      That goes against everything you have ever been tought.

      As well please note that the way the Income tax law is based on its only; Taxs from Capital Gains and Dividend’s payments.
      {{Not on your labor.}}
      There is no law that states you should or will pay tax on your INCOME from your LABOR. Yet we all do now don’t we?

      Is that Strange or what?

      This by the way opened the door to whats called “GRAY LAW,”
      Thus what that means to you is the following, how well greesed is the unit and by greesed I do mean PAYOLA.
      You can have a rock soild case, but if PAYOLA is in the box, Your case is not worth the paper its written on.

      This all then is divided into color values of gray, Light gray, dark gray, etc.
      If you read case law it will make you go blind with rage. Its all A tad of HoHo $$$$ toss in some YO ??? YO and a touch of BS ^%$# and you can win.

      • http://Na Al Bel

        Dear Sir(s),
        I’m impressed with the facts you guys know – very intellectual. Your knowledge is as good as a book sitting on a shelf – it just collects dust. One guy stated he has known these things for 40 years – my hero! you have no answers so what good is it that you “know”. I’ll bet every one of you guys are way overweight from sitting there typing to impress others of how dumb… ah smart you are. Less Talk – More Action – is that even a fleeting thought to you?

        • JeffH

          Al Bel, you speak like a child, possibly uneducated(?) or are you just stupid…knowing “these” things and then sharing “these” things are akin to educating those that you share “these” things with.
          Answers? Ban the FEDS to start with. Jail all the traitors in government that choose to be “puppets” for the foreign and domestic “puppetmasters” who seek to make the world “their” world. The mountain is a tall one to climb, quite possibly impossible, and some have died trying to climb it…JFK and Abe Lincoln come to mind…so if you’re looking for answers look deep into your patriotism, if it exists, and join the cause…otherwise enjoy your coke, your popcorn and shut up…the movie has started.

          • DaveH

            Without the complicity of Big Government, they would be powerless. We need simply to get Government out of the marketplace. Give the power back to the voluntary choices of the consumers. And not allow the Government to issue any money that isn’t backed by hard assets that retain their buying power, such as silver, gold, land, etc.
            To accomplish that, vote for the only party that wants real Freedom for the citizens, the Libertarian Party.

        • Vicki

          Al Bel writes:
          “I’ll bet every one of you guys are way overweight from sitting there typing to impress others of how dumb… ah smart you are. Less Talk – More Action – is that even a fleeting thought to you?”

          Such a lovely ad hominium attack. Since you had no real point to add to the debate we can’t even have the pleasure of knowing we won the debate with you.

          Btw educating our fellow countrymen IS an action.
          Soap box (That would be us educating our countrymen btw.)
          Ballot box
          Jury box
          Ammo box

          Know the power and place of each in the defense of liberty.

          • TIME

            Al Bel, Or – The Son, The Sun, The Light of Son, Sun of God what ever, very cute indeed. I get it, I bet you think non of us would.

            First off let me say that action is in fact what we have done, perhaps not in a way that may be of an effect that you feel that action has taken place, yet in fact action has taken place to save souls.

            Saddly action taken by way of violence is not the answer, and never has been a real answer.

            To educate is all one is left just as Christ tried to do with Humans who in some cases embraced Christ’s Love toward humanity; yet as we know from history most failed to grasp that his words of wisdom that were powerful beyond any Human’s grasp at the TIME.

            Thus as noted by Vicki, whats your point?

    • Ger

      http://www.federalreserve.gov/pf/pdf/pf_complete.pdf

      Read about the Federal Reserve: history, structure, etc.

      • 57girl

        I’ll bet this site shows you what they want you to see. Just wait until after Jan. 2011 … I’ll be we’ll be seeing a lot that the Federal Reserve is not showing us. They are getting ready to get hammered by the new Monetary Oversight panel, and I’ll bet Ben’s gonna have a lot of explaining to do. (LOL). Can’t wait!

    • 57girl

      Information on the subject of the Federal Reserve is everywhere, yet it is unbelievable as to the amount of people that will defend them, thinking the sky would fall without them. Sad, but we would all be so much more prosperous without them. It is frustrating for those of us that can see the Fed for the thieves they are, when if everyone would open their eyes, unanimously we could overthrow them and place the power of the purse where it rightfully belongs under Article 1, Section 8 of our Constitution. I hope when Ron Paul begins overseeing the Monetary Committee come January 2011, he will be able to finally get an audit of the Fed. Then, maybe people will listen to the truth. Until then, I think there are still a lot of ostriches left. Thanks for posting this info though. I look forward to visitng your link.

      • JeffH

        57girl, let’s just hope Ron Paul can survive long enough to audit The Fed. There have been five US presidents that have refused to deal with foreign ownership of US banks or the Federal Reserve that have either been assasinated or survived an assasinatin attempt.

        1. An attempt to assassinate Jackson in 1834 left him wounded but more determined than ever to stop the central bank.
        2. Thirty years later President Lincoln refused to pay international bankers extremely high interest rates during the Civil War and ordered the printing of government bonds.
        3. In 1881 James Garfield became president and he was dedicated to restoring the right of the federal government to issue money like Lincoln did in the Civil War and he was also assassinated.
        4. John F. Kennedy opposed a private national bank and was assassinated in 1963.
        5. Ronald Reagan opposed a private national bank and in 1981 an attempt was made to assassinate him.

        Coincidence or not the opposition to a privately owned national bank was a common characteristic.

        • JC

          That’s an accurate correlation Jeff.
          It was part of a conversation at work today as to how long it might be before attempts are made on the lives of the “Paul’s” and Beck.
          Depends on their progrees doesn’t it?

          • JC

            And “Progress” too! :)

  • http://drudge 2 sides

    Your worries about the American people waking up are not justified. One example is the Health Care Reform. The majority said NO and they did it anyway. Most of the public dosen’t understand the CPI, I don’t understand the CPI. I have been involved in a few budgets and I do know how numbers are manipulated. No one tells the truth in budgets, cherry pick this, cherry pick that and walla the numbers you want magicly appear. The only way to reign in the goverment is to have an outside accounting firm auditing the books on a continous basis. GOOD LUCK

    • Bob Wire

      “The majority said NO and they did it anyway” there’s that majority again.

      the majority is determined by a vote and not who is screaming the loudest or spending the most money.

      • meteorlady

        Gads – there were numerous polls, numerous. What the heck do you want? Real screaming people because that’s coming.

      • HFlashman

        Bob…you know it, I know it. But the TPers don’t. Can you imagine what it must be like living with half those guys? Screaming and rage ruling the home front. Jeesh … It’s no wonder they can’t offer rational solutions to anything…they’re too busy being paranoid about whatever conspiracy their Masters tell them to be paranoid about… (this week and last week it has been Soros. Any bets on next week’s “liberal demon” ?)

        • DaveH

          Actually, Flashdunce, the only screaming I’ve seen comes from the Liberals. Feed Me! Clothe Me! Shelter Me! Give me Free Healthcare!
          Wah! Wah! Wah!
          Like a bunch of spoiled children throwing a tantrum when they don’t get everything they want.
          It is Liberals who want to steal the money of others. It is Liberals who want to Force their hare-brained schemes on others. It is Liberals who create violence when things aren’t their way.

          • Karolyn

            Hey, Dave, I haven’t had health insurance for at least 15 years, and I’m doing just fine. I take care of myself, which everybody should be doing, which would negate insurance, drugs and doctors! :-) HAHA! Like that could ever happen. Seriously, we have a nonprofit medical group here that charges on a sliding scale. Depending on income level, you can pay at least $20 and get everything done in one day. ie, bloodwork, ultrasound, xrays, counseling, etc. They do very well, too and have good doctors.

          • DaveH

            And that’s how it should be, Karolyn, free choices for free people. Good for you. If we got all this wasteful Government spending and force out of the equation, we would achieve the most prosperity and happiness possible for human beings.
            Insurance companies are in business to make a profit. And that is fine. What is not fine is when we are being forced to buy their product by Government. And it doesn’t matter if they are public insurance companies (public option) or private insurance companies. As long as there are middlemen (Government or Private) our health costs are going to be higher. To incur those extra costs should be strictly a voluntary choice.

      • DaveH

        Actually, Bob, the majority did vote and threw a lot of the rascals out, including my Representative that voted for healthcare. And as Meteorlady said numerous polls support that the majority doesn’t want the Healthcare Law. Here is just one:
        http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/current_events/healthcare/health_care_law

    • deedee

      Take a real look at our sterling health care system. If you have health care with your employer YOU pay a premium, which is probably going up. Then you pay a DEDUCTIBLE, which is probably going up. Then the provider (your doctor) has to accept some previously determined amount set by the insurance company. Luckily, the doctor is allowed to charge you a l;ittle of the difference between what the service costs and what the insurance company will pay (that is called a co-pay and you pay it)!

      So look at the REAL cost of health care and see how much of what YOU pay really goes to the insurance companies, NOT FOR HEALTH CARE, but to pay their work force and especially THEIR MANAGEMENT! Want a real eye opener? Get a prospectus from some big insurance company and see how muych REALLY goes for the health care you need, and how much goes to the insurance company!

      It is simple MATH. But of course Americans are woefully behind the rest of the world in MATH!!!

      AND WHAT ABOUT THOSE WHO EITHER DO NOT HAVE, OR LOSE (DUE TO GETTING DOWNSIZED) THEIR INSURANCE. OK, COME OUT AND SAY IT, they are on their own and that is just too darn bad and they deserve it!

      What a bunch of mean, selfish people we are becoming in our country! And of course, as long as they can keep us angry at each other the RICH are happy, because we are not demanding that these things be made right!

      • DaveH

        Deedee,
        If you knew anything about Math, you would know that there is nothing Free in this world. If you get Free Healthcare it is at somebody else’s expense.
        If you don’t like the high cost of Health Insurance, then don’t buy it! I don’t. Do you even know what Insurance is? People are pooling their money to take care of those who might suffer catastrophic events. The less catastrophic those events are, the less sense it makes to add a middle-man (Insurance) to the equation. The middle men just add costs to our economy, not to mention the interference with your doctor/patient relationship. And it will be even worse with the Government being those middle-men because we can’t even fire them if we don’t like what they provide.
        We’re mean and selfish for not wanting other people to forcefully make our decisions and take away our money? But you aren’t mean for advocating somebody forcefully taking away our money and decisions?
        We want only to keep our own money. You want to take away our money to spend as your own, and you think you aren’t the selfish one? Dream On ignorant Liberal.
        Don’t fancy yourself as charitable. You are simply a thief.

        • Claire Weber

          I agree with Deedee. I was born and raised during the depression. My parents raised 12 children, my Mom was a stay-at-home Mom, my Dad was a carpenter and we did not health insurance.We survived and as workers when we of age and working, paid into the SS system. Yet, of the 12 only 3 collected SS for not that long of a period. I am collecting and have put 57 years os paying into the system, including double payments while I worked for the government. Now, I am forced to pay taxes on my SS earnings. I never sought a free-handout, ever!!
          It is my opinion, Deedee was implying on the Liberals who believe they are entitled and not telling you how to spend your money.
          Duffy

      • vicki

        DeeDee, Who is being mean. Me because I want to choose which charities I will support with my money or you because YOU want to decide which charities I will support with MY money.

        Charity begins at home go use your own money.

        • Claire Weber

          Kudos to vicki and Ditto to her comment.
          Duffy

      • Zoe D.

        1 out of ever 3 dollars goes to insurance companies…just to push paper. This has been known for at least 20 years!!

      • Zoe D.

        My doc (CT) already stopped taking Medicare, which I paid ALL my working life for.

        • DaveH

          Do you know why? Government has been sticking their big noses into the doctor/patient choices, and demanding unrealistic payments for treatments that must then be subsidized by the patients that aren’t on Medicare. We need to get Government out of our healthcare choices. My first child was delivered by Caesarian 38 years ago for $400 cash (we weren’t insured). Try getting anywhere close to that figure these days. Government meddling has created the high costs we now see. Their solution after escalating our costs dramatically? MORE GOVERNMENT! It must be great to be able to cause the problems that they can then offer to solve.

  • valricoslash

    It is time for the new Congress to hold hearings on how the BLS calculates its inflation numbers as well as what is included in the market basket including food, gasoline, and medical services and drugs. The reason they don’t do this is because it would put Social Security and Medicare further in the hole. Also, congress needs to pass law that states that Medicare cannot go up if Social Security does not go up by the same percentage. Unfortunately seniors this year will see no raise in SSI but will undoubtedly get a nice fat raise in the cost of Medicare and Medicare supplemental insurance premiums. Meanwhile, members of congress stick their head in the sand and either hope the problem will disappear or that the full blow will not hit until they are retired from congress on a big fat pension. No one in DC wants to take responsibility for touching either program for fear of getting whacked at the next election. Meanwhile, the county continues to spiral downward.
    Here is my proposed solution to the problem:
    No congressional retirement system they are there to “serve” not to make a long-term career our of the job. A retirement system only encourages these thieves to stay.
    Cut the Federal non-military, payroll by 50 percent over 10 years by not replacing jobs vacated through retirement at all levels.
    Bring federal salaries in line with those of the rest of the American people. That is the average federal worker can make no more than the average private workers. that means no federal pay raises for probably the next 5-10 years. Perhaps that will encourage some of them to quit early.
    Federal retirees cannot pick up a retirement check until they reach age 62.
    Privatize the money pit known as the Postal Service. There are way too many people selling stamps that are making in excess of $60K a year. These jobs could be held by minimum wage employees. After all, it is not rocket science.
    Cut all foreign aid until we get our house in order. No more borrowing from China to give money to Africa, etc. Let them get it from the Chinese. In fact, we should apply for grants from the World Monetary Fund. Now that would be a hoot.
    Eliminate SSS as we know it gradually putting all new workers that come on board after 2025 on a wholly owned retirement account (401 K) gradually reducing SSI tax until all persons on the current system pass away.
    Remove SSI from the General Fund and use it solely for its intended purpose.
    Require Congress to begin payback of what it has stolen from SSI over the past 60 years.

    • deedee

      Good iudea. Privatize the Postal Service. Let some company move the mailk on minimum wages. And give that company the power to just move their operation out of a town that DEPENDS on the jobs for survival! What kind of fix is that?

      How about just taking all the mail, moving it on container ships to the Pacific Rim, where all our other good jobs have gone, and let someone there sort it for pennies a day. It will only delay the delivery of the mail a few days, nothing we can’t put up with!

      Why is everyone always picking on the POST OFFICE, anyway? They move a first class piece of mail ANYWHERE in the country for PENNIES! If you want to make the Post Office more effective, get rid of the MANAGERS AND SUPERVISORS. That would save a lot, and from what I’ve seen they do next to nothing anyway. (and that is true for “supervisors” and managers in EVERY field. Take a look at our school systems)

      • meteorlady

        Do you not think that if the postal service was privatized that these people would still have jobs? Gads – they are making a mint for doing a job that anyone with a high school education could do.

        • Karolyn

          Spoken to a postal worker lately? It’s not like the “good old days” anymore. they have a lot less since privitization.

          • vicki

            They were overpaid. Now their pay is closer to appropriate for the job. How can I tell? Cause the government has less say on what the wages are which means the market has more say.

      • Karolyn

        The USPS is privatized.

        • JeffH

          WRONG!
          The USPS is created as a government agency under Title 39, Section 101.1 of the United States Code (a) The United States Postal Service shall be operated as a basic and fundamental service provided to the people by the Government of the United States, authorized by the Constitution, created by Act of Congress, and supported by the people. The Postal Service shall have as its basic function the obligation to provide postal services to bind the Nation together through the personal, educational, literary, and business correspondence of the people. It shall provide prompt, reliable, and efficient services to patrons in all areas and shall render postal services to all communities. The costs of establishing and maintaining the Postal Service shall not be apportioned to impair the overall value of such service to the people.

          http://usgovinfo.about.com/od/consumerawareness/a/uspsabout.htm

          • Karolyn

            They are not government employees.

          • JeffH

            K, WRONG again… Employees of the USPS are civil servants. They are unique in the federal government since they are a profit-generating organization. The Postal Service is the largest employer in the federal government aside from the military.

          • Karolyn

            I’m curious Jeff. Why doesn’t the postal service have a .gov at the end of their web address? I is http://www.usps.com. I talk to a couple of women who work at our post office all the time, and she led me to believe that they are not employed by the government.

          • JeffH

            K, probably for the same reasons that the various branches of the military do not have dot gov in their URL.

      • DaveH

        Deedee,
        It is the Big Government that you love that has driven companies out of our country with their high taxes, heavy regulations, and support of the bully unions.
        Look at the countries on the bottom of this list to see where you Liberals are heading us:
        http://www.heritage.org/index/Ranking.aspx

    • meteorlady

      Probably some good ideas. One thing, government workers and your congressional representatives get the SAME retirement plan. They all PAY into it. It’s false that they get something for nothing. They have to be vested in the plan (5 years) to get a PERCENTAGE. The average congressional representative that is in the new plan receives about $36,000 average. If they were in the old plan, they would get a little more, around $53000.

      Also, you can cut government jobs, but you have to cut government services and programs. We pay a huge amount for all the equipment, buildings, property taxes, energy costs, etc. for say… Social Security.

      How about getting rid of entire Departments? Like Education – that should be a state function, not federal. Like the Department of Energy – they were suppose to get us off foreign oil in the 1980′s when they were created by Carter – have they done it? No, their budget has increased every year and they are now a regulatory agency with far reaching arms. Medicare, VA and Medicaid should be privatized so there is good care and less waste and fraud involved. There’s a great organization in Washington State called Group Health Cooperative and they are doing an outstanding job of taking care of people. Don’t even get me started on entitlements…. give them back to the states – no more Department of Human Services. It’s the job of charities and the states to take care of people that need assistance.

      Secure our borders. The illegals are costing us more than both wars combined. They stop importing immigrants that are under educated and head straight to the entitlement offices. There are entire populations of immigrants from Somalia living in subsidized housing, collect food stamps and get free medical in the State of Washington. There are entire populations of Indian and Pakistani that live the same. These people have their own bankers and work for cash a lot so they would appear to need assistance. We need highly educated immigrates and people that are innovators, not more people sucking money from the public trough.

      Best of all END THE FED!

      • spike

        Very good, and well thought out.

      • DaveH

        I agree with most of what you say, Meteorlady, but the illegals aren’t creating our bad economy. I don’t think anybody should be in this country illegally, but I do think it should be easier to come here if they want. As far as them getting on welfare, I don’t know. But the answer to that problem would be to eliminate welfare. All the illegals I have been witness to have worked harder at their jobs than the Americans I have seen doing same jobs. As far as the Drug crime goes, we have created that with our Drug Wars. I would have thought we had learned our lesson with Prohibition which led to the Mafia and other organized crime groups. Certain people are going to seek those drugs no matter how we try to stop them, short of a totalitarian system. All we do by criminalizing them is to drive the prices sky high and enrich the most evil segment of society – The Drug Lords.

        We need to get back to the kind of freedom our Founders envisioned. Where people control their own bodies and property, free of Government meddling. Where charity is voluntary. Where contracts are voluntary. Where bullies can’t force their way on others (that includes Government bullies).
        If people choose to be druggies, that is fine with me. But when they fall on their faces, I reserve the right to let them fall. After all, which is worse? Allowing people to suffer their own mistakes, or forcing others who did the right things to suffer for those mistakes?

        • vicki

          DaveH writes:
          “All we do by criminalizing them is to drive the prices sky high and enrich the most evil segment of society – The Drug Lords.”

          And they can use some of that money to buy a politician or 3 to keep drugs illegal.

          • DaveH

            You will like this article, Vicki:
            http://mises.org/daily/4842

            Especially this paragraph:
            “Bruce Yandle created the “bootleggers and Baptists” model of politics to describe how special-interest groups who normally oppose each other work for a common goal. With alcohol prohibition, Baptist preachers teamed up with bootleggers and moonshiners to make and keep alcohol illegal. Today we see the shared interests of environmental groups and established oil companies, who both want drilling restricted.”

  • http://roadrunner exslushpumper

    Bob: I am a subscriber. You may well be right about the future of our financial system; I am scared, to be sure. But your solutions are packaged in reports requiring a lot of reading, and/or mostly costly. I am a retired executive who required all written material submitted to me to be concise, bullet-pointed, and submitted on no more than one page. Reading long explanations is time consuming, and even in retirement, my days are packed with activities and details. I DON’T HAVE TIME TO READ LONG REPORTS!!! Most of my associates are like me. Please provide short, punchy recommendations on what to do, and folks like me will read them. Otherwise, we’ll all go over the cliff together.

    • Bob Wire

      ” I am scared, to be sure.” that’s the intent!

      for everyone to be scared! It slows spending at just about every level.

      • meteorlady

        You just hang in there Bob. I have watched my mom’s saving go away faster than necessary because of the Wall Street and banks. I have watched as her social security isn’t going up, but her care and food prices are.

        The fact that people are scared has nothing to do with spending. It has to do with they have less and the dollar is worth less now. Prices are going up and we pick and choose what we want to spend our money on more carefully. Get a clue – we are going down hill because of government policies and entitlements.

        • Bob Wire

          I understand and agree completely, ~ but it’s still fear that locks us like a deer in headlights.

          You speak of your mother’s “saving” ~ so let’s not kid ourselves ~ she’s got it ! just like my senior parents has got it! I’m not attempting to turn on Seniors at all. But make no mistake it is and was the seniors that got us to this place in time, we must accept both , the better and the worst of it.

          They claim , but I live on a “FIXED INCOME” !

          I tell you what, ~ I live on what I can chase down everyday and a fixed income sounds pretty good! . LOL!

          It’s largely all about “fear” and uncertainly for tomorrow that has the nation paralyzed and frozen in our tracks today.

          If we could take away the dark threatening clouds of “fear” the Sun would come out once again as it always has.

          The day is cold dark and dreary

          it rains and the winds are never weary

          My life is cold dark and dreary

          it rains and the winds are never weary.

          My thoughts still cling to the moldy past

          and hopes of youth fall thick in the blast

          with every gust the dead leave fall

          and the day is cold dark and dreary

          Be still sad heats and cease repining

          behind yond cloud the suns still shining.

          Thy fate is a common fate of all

          in every life some rain must fall

          Some days must be cold ~ dark and dreary

          HWL (condensed for your time considerations)

          • DaveH

            You know, Bob, I read a book once about the Great Depression which basically laid the cause on Fear. What crap! Since then I have read many other articles which lay the blame where it really belongs – Big Government and their folly. In a Free Enterprise system, markets quickly correct themselves. When the Government gets involved political solutions replace practical solutions and all hell breaks loose. Witness the bailouts of the financial institutions. Rarely has any good come from propping up losers, so that they can continue to compete against the people who did the right things. If there is no punishment for failure, and no reward for success, then why would most people bother changing their ways?
            Get thee some knowledge:
            http://mises.org/Rothbard/AGD.pdf

          • Bob Wire

            hmm? well Dave, I see your point ~ Words and wording can be used like an artist brush and paint to offer a vivid picture in ones mind of what is being presented, ~ it leads and directs the viewer to focus the eye and mind to connect with the imagery on a personal level, bringing forward a host of feeling and emotions stored from personal experiences and bias.

            Leaving you to see, what you wish to see as it’s presented.

            I had a fellow companion that was hit by a shark as we were cutting a 2″ line that had became entangled and wrapped tight into the starboard wheel.

            The doctor’s ruling of death? “Loss of body tissue” ~ that can not be disputed but found being a most accurate assessment of my friends demise.

            And so it is, with “fear” and the Great Depression.

          • DaveH

            Bob, when I read your comments, the word “Obtuse” springs to mind.

          • Bob Wire

            Well Dave, there you go, my point made, we can all read into a body of work with whatever bias we might bring, in your case “stupid”!

            The Great Depression has been covered many times by many people of different persuasions and most concur, but you’d prefer to believe all but one or two that you favor as being stupid, as they fits well and offers validation to your notions and concepts of Federal Regulation “bad”, unfettered “Capitalism” good!

            Again, I’d offer Wall Street market system is subject to all the weakness of man. Greed, Lust, Power and Fear ~ insider trader is the position most desired and short that, each investor feeling smarter then the next guy and possessing the Midas touch. They are a fearful bunch of investors and if they are not ~ something is bad wrong with the game. Quick to panic with the “herd” mentality.

            When too many play that can’t afford to take the loss, trouble are certain. In a house full of rumors and deception some men find their joy, their “rush”, their “high”, as they managed to get in and out without being eaten alive and made some gains in the process.

            This my bias opinion of a finical institution that’s is seen as an accepted norm. So you are I both hold fringe views in a odd way.

            I love to gamble myself, ~ but I always place it under a Budget labeled “Entertainment”. Horses,~ mud runners with long odds on heavy overcast days, I’ve had some fun and luck with it.

      • Karolyn

        That’s what I’ve been saying.

  • Karolyn

    “There are reports that a person was told by a bank manager” – WOW! That sure is a fact we can believe! It seems to me that a lot of this article is pure conjecture and fear-mongering. Keep the fear alive!!

    • Al Sieber

      Karolyn, so you think printing up money is good? you need to study history.

    • meteorlady

      What planet do you live on? Printing money is bad bad bad. The difference between the dollar in 1988 and the dollar in 2008 is 1.34. It took 1.00 to buy say bread in 1988 and it took 1.34 in 2008 to buy the same thing.

      Now fast forward to all the money that is being printed and figure it out from there. The dollar has been devalued again only more so this time than at any other time in history.

      • Karolyn

        I’m not saying that the whole story is false. It’s all over the news. What I am saying is that the embellishments are not necessary. Hearsay has no place in reporting.

        • DaveH

          If that were adhered to, Karolyn, most of the network news would not exist.

      • Dennis

        And now Nov. 2010 one loaf of bread -> 1.50, 1.98, to 2.38 & up thats in central FL. i don’t know about the rest of the country but i’m sure its the same.

    • JeffH

      Karolyn, Fear mongering…straight out of the liberals handbook, You make it very obvious every day which side of the fence you sit…you’ve been fully indoctrinated into socialism by listening to the Marxist/socialist media, NPR and probably watching MSNBC…oh, you’ll believe what you want because that’s your right do so and you’ll continue to collect from the nanny state because you “deserve” it, if memory serves me right…like the rest of us K, you’re just a statistic to these bums that are selling you short and using you, but what the heck…Rainbows and Unicorns are much nicer to think about than reality.

      • Karolyn

        Jeff – I do not hear liberals “mongering” fear. Besides, I don’t care who’s liberal and who’s not. I hear PEOPLE, whatever their pesuasion, keeping fear alive; and I hear more of it from the right. I DO NOT consider myself ANYTHING, be it liberal, conservarive, or whatever. I am an American giving my opinion about what I hear and see. Don’t label me. I watch very little news and do get the “headlines” from ABC and NPR. Actually, I heard a non-partisan analyst stating on NPR the other day that the only things that would help curb the deficit is cutting military spending, Medicare and Social Security. Everything else is small change. Now, this person cannot be discounted just because she was on NPR. I get more REAL news from NPR than anywhere else, besides learning a great deal about many different things other than current news. Maybe you need to broaden YOUR horizons.

        • http://n.cates@cox.net Norman F.

          non-partisan analyst on NPR? Didn’t you hear? He got fired!

          • Karolyn

            HAHA! This person does not work for NPR!

        • JeffH

          Karolyn, I don’t have to “label” you, you’ve done that all on your own. Keep listening to NPR and ABC along with the other leftist “controlled” media telling you how bad the Tea Party, Republicans and conservatives are and how evrything is getting better. It’s so obvious that you’ve bought into their lies, bile and distain for anyone that doesn’t agree with the “socialization” of the USA.
          Talk about fear-mongering, perhaps YOU might consider broadening your horizons past the end of your nose.

          • Karolyn

            Same thing over and over. You don’t watch ABC News or listen to NPR, so how do you know anything?????????
            I HAVE HEARD NOTHING BAD-MOUTHING THE TEA PARTY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
            GIVE ME A BREAK!!! Any opinion I have formed about the tea party was formed by what I have seen and heard (fact), not what I’ve been TOLD about it. When will you understand that we are ALL capable of forming our OWN opinions based on more than what you think they are based on.

          • vicki
          • Karolyn

            Vicki – I do not read any of that crap either. Just by the title I wouldn’t even link to it. Get my drift? Do you think I surf the net looking for articles badmouthing the right? I have better things to do.

          • JeffH

            K, you have been indoctrinated by NPR and the leftist controlled media like ABC. You refuse to accept it but your words say differently. What a joke!

          • Vicki

            Karolyn writes:
            “Vicki – I do not read any of that crap either”

            Good for you. However that being said your yell (capitial letters) is a bit misleading.

            Karolyn: “I HAVE HEARD NOTHING BAD-MOUTHING THE TEA PARTY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
            GIVE ME A BREAK!!!”

            So you can see it would probably have been better to say (quietly) that “because I never read any of that crap either I would not notice any bad-mouthing….”

          • DaveH

            Karolyn gets her news from ABC and NPR and then tells us she knows the “facts” about the Tea Party. How, when they only present the side of the story they want sheeple like Karolyn to believe?
            Karolyn, I’ll give you a clue (not like she’ll take it). When you listen to a political story on the news, you know that it is controversial (I’ve probably already lost her). Given that, do you hear a robust treatment of the other sides of the story? If you don’t, you are being propagandized. Fox allows the Liberals, as well as the Conservatives and Right-Wingers, to develop their sides of the story (sickening as it is). I haven’t seen such on most of the other stations.

        • DaveH

          You don’t hear Liberals mongering fear? Please, Karolyn, get your ears cleaned.
          Since I’ve been politically aware we’ve had the cyclamate scare, the acid-rain scare, the ozone depletion scare, the global warming scare, the healthcare scare, and probably many others that I can’t remember off-hand. Liberals are expert at fear-mongering as it goes hand-in-hand with their Big Government goal.

          • Karolyn

            That’s not fear-mongering, that’s just stating facts. You don’t believe any of it, so why am I even bothering to respond? Because I can.

          • vicki

            Karolyn so then pointing out that dramaticly increasing the supply of paper used as money will cause prices to rise is fear-mongering why? Not only is it a fact but its the LAW (of supply and demand).

          • DaveH

            Karolyn,
            You are not well-read enough to know whether those are facts or not.
            Virtually every one of them was trumped way out of proportion.
            Read this to get a clue:
            http://www.cato.org/pubs/regulation/regv11n3/v11n3-4-10.pdf

          • DaveH
          • DaveH

            This one will make your eyes glaze over:
            http://mises.org/pdf/asc/2003/asc9saliba.pdf

          • Karolyn

            Dave – The same can be said of “facts” portrayed by the right. So we souldn’t believe ANYTHING! It’s like stats. Anything can be manipulated to serve the intent of the manipulator. I would love to be more well-read, but there are only so many hours in the day and too many books.

          • Vicki

            Karolyn writes:
            “The same can be said of “facts” portrayed by the right. ”

            Well we don’t know cause people on the left almost never bother with cites. We also are willing to read well written and when possible peer reviewed articles but liberals don’t support their “facts” with any more than bald assertion.

            The few links I have seen from liberals go to diatribes by some liberal that is full of ad hominum attacks against people.

          • DaveH

            Liberals base their “facts” on Hopes and Dreams, Vicki. There is little or no substance to them. That is why they must quickly devolve any debate into personal attacks.
            Their goals sound good, so they appeal to the people who are too ignorant to know the truth.

          • DaveH

            Karolyn,
            If you have the time to read this blog and write all the comments you write, you have the time to read some books explaining the reality of economics. Mises.org has many free online books you could read.
            Go here:
            http://mises.org/literature.aspx?action=source&source=Online%20Books

        • Zoe D.

          Go to the .gov site. Social Security money is NOT supposed to be used for anything but SS. HOWEVER, the govt has “borrowed” from it and has NEVER repaid it. Wonder why it’s going broke?

          • Vicki

            Social security NUMBER is not supposed to be used for anything other than social security but has become a de-facto national ID for most financial transactions.

    • HFlashman

      I jknow a few bank managers… I’m not impressed by their intelligence nor their education in economics. In today’s world…think of a manager at your local McD’s….think of a branch manager at the bank….the manager at McD’s is more impressive as to skill and education…

      • DaveH

        No doubt. There are good and bad in every profession. But in Free Markets we can witness that and choose to avoid the bad. Unlike with Big Government where we have no choice but to tolerate the bad apples (and there are many).

      • CJ

        Coming from the guy who continuously shows HE knows nothing about economics 101. ROFLMAO!

        • HFlashman

          CJ … if you would be so kind as to point out where you believe I erred in anything I wrote as to stating facts, you’d be one up as far as anything you have done to date. If you would be so kind as to give a reasoned analysis on any policy, you’d be able to show you have more than a 3rd grade education and grasp of the world at large.

          But then…that would be totally out of character and outside your capabilities.

    • JC

      I caught that small piece of conjecture as well. But since it is surrounded by some very scary realities I let it go and paid attention to what matters.
      Karolyn does us all the same tired old favor of demonstrating Liberal “Cherry Pick” thinking.
      Did you read any of the rest of the article Karolyn…do you not see the consequences coming your way?

      Probably not…but you did find the one week spot in the commentary and ignored everything pertinant.
      Good for you.

      • Karolyn

        Sorry, I read most of it. I cannot really believe that an ear of corn will “soon” cost $11! What is “soon” anyway? 10 years? 20 years? tomorrow? next week? I refuse to allow all of these predictions to interfere with my life as I know it. All I know is what I always say “As ye think, so shall ye be”, and “What goes around comes around.” (among other quotatoins.) I have always refused to live in fear, and I ain’t gonna start now!

        • DaveH

          Read this, Karolyn:
          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_history_of_Argentina#Convertibility_and_liberalization

          And tell me again, you don’t think high priced corn is possible.

          • Karolyn

            On Wikipedia?

          • DaveH

            Oh, Karolyn, your blinders are glued on tight aren’t they? Do you dispute that Argentina experienced hyper-inflation in the 1980s? Do you want me to find another article for you? Of course, you would poo-poo that one too. Here’s another one you can ignore:
            http://goldnews.bullionvault.com/inflation_history_Zimbabwe_USA_101620073

            I understand now why you can’t see the light. You don’t want to. You would rather Hope and Dream then face reality.

          • DaveH

            I would think that you would embrace Wikipedia, Karolyn; you being a Liberal who looks at commercialism with a juandiced eye. It is commercial free by design. And it is peer-reviewed. Anybody can submit corrections or question the facts presented. Also the articles usually contain multiple references to back up the author’s claims. Do you get references for the spoon-fed pablum you receive from PBS which you claim is unbiased?

          • JC

            Karolyn, in times of depression / recession /shortage…articles become expensive, then they become scarce, then they disappear.
            How quickly that happens right now depends a lot on how much more infaltionary “stimulus” we get. How restricted the actions of the manufacturers, farmers and industry become by government decree (meddling in the market)and what circumstances give producers cause to keep going (profits) or throw in the towel (socialism).

        • CJ

          Continue your lack of planning, and don’t come asking for assistance when our predictions become reality. We try to warn you, but you refuse to see the writing on the wall.

          • Karolyn

            Well, CJ, I’m bucking the tide to think positive. Keep fearing what you fear and making it come true. I’m glad that not everybody is living in fear. Fear and projection of future events is useless and self-fulfilling.

          • DaveH

            CJ,
            Karolyn is going to remain positive. She thinks she will be able to help herself to other peoples’ money when the dung hits the fan. So why bother to worry? It must be nice to tip-toe through the tulips in La La Land.

          • JeffH

            DaveH, some just believe that chasing Unicorns and Rainbows make for a utopian life.

          • HFlashman

            LOL….Karolyn…CJ is trying to say what he says that doesn’t come through to fruition you’re not supposed to remember it. But if lightening strikes and he gets lucky, you’re supposed to treat him as god like.

            Of course, you could spot CJ a case of champagne, $500 and drop him off at a Parisian House of Wayward Women and he still wouldn’t be able to score…

        • HFlashman

          Karolyn…they grabbed those numbers out of thin air and then added 100% to them. They need to start the next fear wave they’re going to do to keep the programmed excited with fear, hate, and feeling like it’s them against the world and they’ll save the world from itself. .

          What I’d like to do is form an “office pool” as to what next weeks “liberal danger” will be…they’ve hammered on Soros for two weeks and that should have run its course this week.

          • JeffH

            HFlash…a true liberal spokesperson for the Marxist in charge and Soros…isn’t it just terrible hammering that Nazi collaberator George Soros…Soros also assisted in the collection of Jewish chattels — clothing, furniture, and the like — for shipment to Germany. There was an eyewitness of unimpeachable status: Soros himself. During a 1998 “60 Minutes” interview, Soros admitted to the entire story without hesitation. He also stated that he felt no guilt, adding that the situation cannot be understood be anyone who was not there. Then, in what might be called typical Soros style, he concludes by comparing his cooperation with the Nazis with his later activities in the markets.
            The Guilt-Free Record of George Soros
            http://www.sorosmonitor.com/absolutenm/templates/news.aspx?articleid=33&zoneid=1

  • deedee

    In all the history of the world I only see one way that an economic system has been changed. Pouring money into it does not work. Asking the rich to loosen up and pour their money into it does not work. Asking the rich to do the right thing and allow a bigger share of the pie to be had by the poor folks does not work. But the Russians and the French and even the fledgling Americans knew (somewhat) what to do.

    Turn the system on its head. TAKE the money from the rich and redistribute it. In fact, get rid of the rich and start over again.

    But of course those who REALLY rule, the rich we never hear about or even know the names of, will just move on and keep pulling the strings and keep their money.

    The marvel today in America is, the rich are very successful at keeping those who have nothing at each other’s throats. They are successful at making the common man fight among themselves, and they are very successful at manipulating us into thinking we have any control whatsoever. We do not. Democratic elections have done nothing except put a different bunch of manipulators in charge. They do NOT want to ‘fix’; our problems. Something like 10% of the population controls 90% of the wealth and the gap is getting worse. So, exactly why do the 90% with no wealth think any new elected person is going to be on their side?

    The Sunday Magazine PARADE does a piece each year called “What People Earn”. GO BACK over the last 10, 15 or more years and READ THE PIECE. The money that the average person earns, in ANY job, has basically not changed, while the money the rich “earn” has skyrocketed! Those are facts. Yet the so-called ‘have-nots’ never look at the facts, they fall for campaign promises every time. And they blame their situation on each other, instead of blaming the real culprit, THE RICH, who have all the money and do not plan to let any of it go!

    The real problem in this country, and in others before us, is greed. And those who have money just want more and more. When is enough enough?

    And, the really scary thing about this”recession” (really a depression) is that unlike the Big Depression of 1929, people today have become so mean that they do not want to help each other, they just want to keep whatever token piece of the pie they have. And apparently a LOT of the people are armed to the teeth. So, in the unlikely event that the poor DID rise up, it would be a very nasty event.

    watch the folks who aqre suppoised to have our interests at heart, as they talk about their ‘plans’ to fix the economy. Every ‘plan’ is based on taking from the poor what little they have. The plans are TRICKLE UP 3economics. That is, if the middle class has very little the rich are NOT going to give up anything they have, so the poor must give up more of what they have.

    Didn’t another nutcase blame all the economic woes of a country on one group of people, and didn’t the “solution” make use of the one thing that could rid the country of those people? Is that what is next here? Once all the poor have everything taken away from them, will th4e ovens be built? Is it more cost effective to just get rid of the poor?

    Well, here’s a heads up. If the manipulators get rid of the POOR, the lower middle class become the NEW POOR! And their turn at the ovens will be next.

    • Bob Wire

      This is all about a 3% tax rate rise ~ the fear~!

      Government failed to cut back spending while offering “EVERYONE” tax breaks that are now being paid for via National indebtedness and acuring interest. ~ SO we didn’t really get a tax break but a tab for the pleasure of thinking we did.

      It is now time to decide who’s to carry the weight of this indebtedness.

      The wealthy is saying , “NOT ME!!! you need me! more then I need you!

      and with cheap labor, out sourcing, NAFT,trade imbalances and national border that leak like a screen door and entrenched power on Capital Hill , they are right!

      They will fight, tooth,hair and nail for 3%. While 3% is not that big a deal for most of us. (or should I say people like myself) They know this!

      So we are left to talking about curbing government spending.

      You know big business loves government as it creates the playing field they desire. While the politicians take the heat for poor government policy and line their pocket of their friends and absorb as much freebies and give me’s as the law allows. ~ Grants, sweet deals, inside info on investment opportunities. Educate their children on the Federal dime, etc ~ the list of gaff and under the table deals are endless.

      That’s the Government the American people have got ~ and it works pretty well, ~ until lean times comes ago like clock work.

      • CJ

        Bob, you’re really a fool if you believe the rich ever pay tax. Just like you, they avoid them to every degree possible. They know how to make jobs, and only increase their prices or fees, and pass the tax burdon on down. They can afford to find the loopholes made for their benefit and use them to their advantage. When one becomes less profitable, they move their capital and start again. The only ones who really pay tax are the lowest on the pyramid, it’s just disguised as a price increase. It all rolls down hill, and the guy on bottom gets burried in it.

        • Bob Wire

          Cj, I think it’s called Tax Liability control ~ and while I might be the fool, I know to write inside the context of peoples comprehensions and and not open up a family size can of worms while attempted to present a “clear view” and offer a strong argument.

          As a fool, I write to fools (no disrespect intended)~ and let’s be honest with ourselves here, when was the last time you, yourself has been correct? Or are you telling all of us, you are Presidential Material and running of the nation best left to you?

          And the wealthy do pay taxes ~ the only question in your mind should be, do they pay their proportionate share?

          I know some wealthy people that are extremely forth right and honest in all their business and personal affairs. Now their bookkeepers might be another matter. A bookkeeper is like an attorney, you can hire one that can win! or something less.

    • meteorlady

      I think you make some very valid points, however, where I live we are not mean – we help each other. If the government would butt out and quit taking our money for others, we would have more and more to donate to people in our own communities.

      I work for two charities here and BOTH of the do not pay anyone a salary for ANYTHING they do. We all work for free. We are a small rural county and we having just built of 55th Habitat house in just 10 years. We all work for nothing, donate our own money for the cause and help people help themselves. Unlike government programs that keep people in line in the entitlement offices waiting for their handouts.

      So to say people are mean is not a true statement. That may be in all the over populated cities, but not here where I live.

      A lot of our problems are that we have too many people here for the amount of jobs we have and the amount of resources that we have. We can’t just keep our doors open to all the poor of the world because we can’t afford to do that anymore as a nation. We have been importing poor, under educated immigrants for years and they are still sucking up entitlements. We allow illegals to cross our borders, drop a kid in our emergency rooms for free and then give the child citizenship. We have allowed Mexican and South American gangs to infiltrate this country and we have prisons filled with them. We have gang wars, drugs, weapons, home invasions, and dangerous people running around this country illegally and our government does nothing but advocate that we give them a free ride with citizenship.

      Fact is that we are loosing our Republic fast because the middle class and poor have sat back and allowed the government to take more and more control over them. We get to vote for whom ever either party picks for us – that’s not free and open elections – that’s putting hand picked candidates in front of us. Most believe all that the news media tells us – you can see that in some of the boxed remarks that appear here every so often.

      People need to stand up and take out the trash.

      • Al

        You sure hit the nail on the head Meteorlady. The illegals who are often into drugs or are traffickers are rampant in our country today. Like you said we have a group of hand picked persons running for government positions i.e. governors, house, and senate. All we can do is try to vote in the lesser of the evils on the ballot. Democracy for this land was paid by the toil and sweat of our Ancestors. This new wave of immigrants want to change our Laws our Heritage, Our Constitution and bathe in the sunshine of Welfare,Food Stamps, and every entitlement that should only be for legal Americans that need the help. Foreign Aid needs to be Internal Aid to put our people back to work and price match our products and once again see Made In America on the shelves in lieu of Made in China.

    • DaveH

      Well, you have certainly proved where your morality lies, Deedee. You are just a common thief.

      • vicki

        DeeDee writes:
        “Turn the system on its head. TAKE the money from the rich and redistribute it. In fact, get rid of the rich and start over again.”

        Yep the rationalization of the common thief.

        • DaveH

          I think she really thinks they will be there for her when they grab power. Like the Cuban leaders are there for their citizens. Poor deluded, immoral creature.

          • Karolyn

            Morality, schmorality. It is not a moral issue. What is wrong with the rich paying more? The “moral” rich, like Warren Buffett, are. I certainly don’t think it’s a valid answer to just take all their money and redistribute it, but it doesn’t sound like DeeDee’s immoral to me. I just take issue with that word being used in the wrong context.

          • DaveH

            It’s not a moral issue to immoral people, which obviously you are one of.
            Stealing is stealing, no matter how big your gang. I realize, Karolyn, that your kind only observe morality when it benefits them.
            Read this article, Karolyn, and think about it. Really, Think:
            http://mises.org/daily/4125

            Is that what you want, Karolyn, a free-for-all where there is no ownership of property? The property just goes to the people with the biggest clubs for any excuse they can Dream up.

            I prefer a society where property rights are sacred. Where somebody can take your property only if you voluntarily agree to the taking. Where people choose who to buy from, and who to make contracts with.

            You can keep your Criminal Society to yourself.

          • Karolyn

            You know what, Dave, nothing really belongs to us anyway! I guess morality is in the eye of the beholder. When one doesn’t see things in black and white but shades of grey, the definition is a little broader.

          • Karolyn

            So I guess Robin Hood was immoral to right the wrongs perpetrated by the evil landlords. Wow, I am crestfallen. :-(

          • Vicki

            Great article DaveH (http://mises.org/daily/4125) Well worth reading. For those of you like DeeDee and Karolyn seem to be I strongly recommend you read it. Think about it and read it again.

            I notice that Karolyn does not think that wealth re-distribution by government (at gunpoint if necessary) is an immoral action. Yet when you read the legends of Robin Hood many of them focus on how the Sheriff was using taxation to take (steal) the wealth of the people and keep it for him and his guards using the pretext that it all belonged to the King. Said king conveniently being out of the country at the time.

            So the folk hero Robin was not taking from the rich and giving to the poor, as progressives try to make us believe thus brainwashing us into accepting entitlement programs by our “benevolent” government, but was going in and taking back that which belonged to the people. Of course this can not work in Real Life cause Robin would have no reasonable way of knowing what belonged to whom.

            Now let us find a moral principle to explain why taking wealth and redistributing it is wrong. Your Creator gave you free will. (Those who do not believe in free will can stop reading here) Your creator gave you abilities and talents to allow you to gather wealth in various forms.

            When ANYONE comes in and takes some of that wealth without your consent then the crime of theft has been committed. That government does it under the color of authority makes the crime that much more evil.

            I can already hear the evildoers polishing their pitchforks.
            “But but but you have to pay your taxes. Society would fall apart if too many of you refused to pay.”
            “But what about all that money for the military that we dont want to spend.”

            To the first I would say that society (USA) worked just fine prior to 1913.
            To the 2nd I would say that our forefathers did not want a standing army.

            And that is just 2 easy examples.

          • Vicki

            Karolyn writes:
            “You know what, Dave, nothing really belongs to us anyway!”

            Really? Cool. What’s your address? I’ll be right over to help myself to some of your wealth. I have some homeless here in Calif to feed and cloth. So nice of you to relinquish ownership “for the children”.

            “I guess morality is in the eye of the beholder. When one doesn’t see things in black and white but shades of grey, the definition is a little broader.”

            Right shall be called wrong and wrong, right. And people wonder why some Christians think the end times are near.

          • AnhydrousBob

            Actually Robin Hood was taking the stolen money (which the governemt called Taxes) back to the poor. At least that is the original story.

          • Vicki

            The LEGEND Robin Hood took from the government (Not the rich) and gave it back to the people. (I actually said this in my post above)

            The real Robin Hood, if he existed, was a common thief.
            http://www.history.com/topics/robin-hood/videos?paidlink=1&vid=HIS_SEM_Search&keywords=history%2Bof%2Brobin%2Bhood&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=Robin%20Hood&utm_term=history%20of%20robin%20hood#who-was-robin-hood

          • DaveH

            I enjoy your comments, Vicki. Especially the one about taking Karolyn’s property, lol. I want her computer.
            You are a clear thinker. I appreciate that.

          • Vicki

            Thanks.
            I didn’t actually take Karolyns stuff I exercised salvage rights on abandoned property. :) I suppose I could have asked her whom it belonged but her statement was pretty clear that she was relinquishing any claim to it. :)

  • Bob Wire

    It’s kind of comical, “the sheep” have been calling those that resist the fear mindset ~ sheep !

    Big Business needs to fail if it can’t float it’s own boat!

    We didn’t let that happen and now we pay the long suffering way. We can’t allow the rich to fail and be poor.

    At long as we have a predatory system of economics in place supported by government legislation that pander to special interest and their supporting minions of entrenched “yes men” what might you expect?

    Fear is but one of the many tools they have at their disposal.

    It’s the people that have accumulated large amounts of loot and that are sitting on it are the ones with the most to lose during an inflation cycle.

    It’s a wealth transfer uniquely in it’s own right that affects everyone but to different degrees. The ones playing the game having the greatest to lose. Didn’t you ever consider for one moment, it wasn’t designed for you to win? ~ I think not.

    How about everyone taking stock of what they have, own and control and quit looking over at their neighbors pile? What happen to that idea as being sound policy and being a loyal to Christian principals?

    • meteorlady

      Maybe where you live – I’ll assume a bigger city – people are like that, but where I live they are not. If someone needs help, we help. If a neighbor needs something, we give it. If local charities need help we are there for them. No one charity in my county pays a salary – we all work for free and volunteer our time as need be.

      You talk smart and are condescending sometimes, but you don’t know the hearts and minds of most Americans in small communities.

      We all know that game of politics is rigged and is not for us to win, but we try our best at any rate. In my community we consider our friends, family and surroundings the most important things we have. Without them – money would mean nothing.

      • Karolyn

        Hi Meteorlady – You must live in a wonderful place. I live in a rural area in SC, and I have not seen that much love displayed here. It’s pretty much an “I’ll take care of my own and forget everybody else” mentality. Of course, it is a lower socio-economic area with a lot of people on public assistance, but the people with the money stay to themselves. It’s an old southern “thing.”

    • vicki

      Bob Wire writes:
      “We didn’t let that happen and now we pay the long suffering way.”

      Who’s this “we” All the bailouts were enacted by Democrats and signed into law by a RINO and a Democrat.

      We the people made a minor statement (With a VOTE Mr Flashman” on Nov 2,2010 if anyone happened to notice. Of course a bunch of Democrats who caused the problems actually got re elected thus proving that for some you do get the government you deserve.

      For the rest of us we get to as Bob Wire said “pay the long suffering way”

    • DaveH

      Bob, if you are talking about Crony Capitalism, I am with you. There is a big difference between Free Markets and Crony Capitalism where certain companies get special protections from competition. The simple solution to that problem is to get Government out of the marketplace. Give the power back to the consumer.

      • Bob Wire

        “Crony Capitalism,” That’s all I see today Dave. ~

        If an operator does manage to become very successful ~ here they come! They will wrap anchor chain around your neck to slow you down, Or attempt to put you out of business by other means.

        It happens again and again.

  • Dale Hogue

    I gave away all my money and have gone on welfare twice in the last 20 years. I make a small investment and it pays off real big and that puts me right back in the race. Some days I can’t lose for winning! When will it all end?

    • Bob Wire

      yea , I have a brother that’s done much the same thing. ~

      A few years ago, he tried to get me involved with currency trading . LOL! He was on his way to being a tycoon !

      After almost loosing a child to food poisoning and a 175,000. hospital bill, it turned him around.

      He can make 13,000.00 per year and enjoy the fruit of being poor in America today.

      Screwed up system ~ to be sure. ~ The system in place wants you to “try” while defeat is most certain. ~ The road to prosperity fraught with pitfalls , and land mines. You don’t have to be the one that falls prey but just be near the explosion.

      The minefield of life in America ~ a lot of hard work and luck.

      I know it sounds a little ~ hmm? “holy water drunk” but a few trips to the church house and little soul searching from time to time seems to open doors of opportunity that were once seen as locked closed and not inside your reach.

      It happens so quickly and easily ~ it can make your head swim.

      On a personal level, never rule out the divine and stay humble.

  • HFlashman

    Let me see if I understand all this correctly. Either…offer no solutions to the current issues and just whine about what the Conservative Economic policies over the past 20 years have brought us to (and blame it everything but the Economic policies of the Reagan/Bush Conservatives)

    or … call for policies which will immediately send this nation into a Depression and massive bank collapse.

    Bernanke is facing the problems wrought by the disaster known as Bush and the Conservatives idea of sound economic policies. What would you do in his stead? Send our banking system into collapse, our ecoomy into a Depression….or fix the banking and economy (jobs) and worry about inflation later?

    Jeesh …

    • JC

      Still caught up in that left/right paradigm of blame and rationalization eh, Flashdance?
      The solution is to dissolve the Fed and reduce the size of Government by about 90%…no matter what party you think did what…the reality remains the same. We need to return to the Constitution and a system of Justice.

      • HFlashman

        OK…so JC votes for an immediate Depression and complete collapse of our banking system. Nice and rational thought process with sound reasonable solutions offered (criminey).

        • Average Joe

          That option (banking meltdown) seemed to work pretty good from 1020-1922 (the first depression after the Fed came to power), it only took the nation 1.5 years to recover (they were allowed to fail), unlike FDR’s 1929 depression which lasted until the begining of WW2, roughly 11 years. BTW, FDR did the same thing that is being done now, with one exception…(there is no gold to confiscate now)……but 11 years of pumping “monopoly money” into the economy produced no results in stabilizing the economy…it took a war to pull us out.Currently, we have several “wars” going on all over the world, so the war theory won’t help this time.
          Yes, the bad business deals made by corporate America should have been allowed to fall…the sooner…the better…no more free rides.

          • Average Joe

            1920-1922…sorry for the typo.

          • AnhydrousBob

            Good point on the 1920 depression. What is more, AverageJoe, the 1920 depression started off worse than the 1929 one. The only difference, since it was a very new organization, the Fed didn’t know what to do, so it did nothing. Unfortunately, Mr Keynes schooled the Fed in it’s proper actions, so it was ready for the next time.

            And, if you do some reading, it seems that there is no evidence that the War brought an end to the Depression. Since the Gov’t controlled the economy during the war, the monetary figures for the war times have no meaning whatsoever. It was the end of the war, the end of economic control and a huge influx of returning soldiers wanting to get on with their lives that ended the Grrreat Depression.

          • Average Joe

            AnhydrousBob says:
            Actually the Day after Pearl Harbor, 1 million men enlisted in the military to fight those red devils (who attacked us only after being harrassed and hindered in all of their trade routes etc. for a year by FDR and his policies). Before the attack on Pearl Harbor the people in the US had no interest in joining the second World War. Whithin one year of the attack, the US was approximately 95-97% employed…thanx to the “War Effort”. Most of the men were off fighting the war and the women were working the factories at home. After the war was over, as soldiers were returning home, most of those wartime jobs were gone, women returned to the home and many men could not find employment ( which BTW led to the “baby boom” of the late forties and early fifties).The economy did not start to pick up again until around the time that we got involved in the Korean conflict…. around 1950….and it was good until LBJ and the “Great Society” in 1964…..since then it has been all downhill.

        • DaveH

          Your kind of thinking, Flashman, is what turned economic calamity of 1929 into a full-blown 10-year long Depression.

  • Henry Ledbetter

    Thanks Bob Wire for reminding all to stick to Christian Principals. Seems to me we may all be in this leaky boat together: honesty, integrity and faith should be the thing that is preeminent in our life. I am old enough to remember that a mans word was his bond and he had rather die than to lie. When I came along in 1941 my dad was a sharecropper and we had very little but each other. We grew up thinking hard work was normal and the trip to town, on rare occasions, with the mules Kate and Ader pulling the wagon was very special. Let us all remember to be content and thankful for such things that we have for money is not the root of all evil but the love of it is.

  • Judy

    The Postal Service has to deal with big, powerful unions in regards to pay and benefits. Also, it is not subsidized by the government.

    • Karolyn

      Have you spoken to anybody who works for the post office lately? I have; and they get very little of what they used to.

      • DaveH

        My local post office has one lady that works her hiney off, a guy who does a good job, and two others who personify the stereotypic postal worker.

  • TonyP

    For those of you that have seen the movie SOYLENT GREEN, dosen’t seem that far fetched anymore does it?

    • Karolyn

      Actually, no sci-fi movie seems farfetched anymore!

    • Bob Wire

      they never was that far fetched ~ I guess you know and understand science fiction writers are “not” political conservatives?

      we are eating people ! we eat the fruits of their efforts, the spoils of their failures.

      The Matrix is a great study of a society living inside a false illusion of personal freedoms and liberties.

      People are but an energy source to be harnessed and used for a purpose beyond their wants and needs to serve another.

      • Karolyn

        Well, we’re all supposed to be serving each other and the earth, aren’t we? All little pieces of the grand puzzle. Most people don’t get that. Each individual is a speck of dust in the universe. We are really not as important as we seem to think we are.

        • vicki

          What is your stance on AGW? Just curious.

          • Karolyn

            Vicki – If I knew what AGW was, I’d answer you.

          • Vicki

            Karolyn, Sorry AGW=anthropomorphic Global Warming

          • Richard Pawley

            Global warming has been going on for at least a 100,000 years and more than once the entire earth was covered with ice. New York was once covered with ice more than a mile thick just a few ten thousand years ago. It has been warmer than it is now and it has been a lot colder. No amount of taxation will do one bit towards changing the temperature but of course those who want a one world government or money system are convinced they can change the planet for the better and that taxing everyone to support the UN will save us. If Americans fall for this then they deserve what results, a lack of freedom for all.

        • Bob Wire

          So true karolyn, so true. We are all here to serve, somebody, something.

          but it needs to be a deliberate act with intent and purpose and offers benefits to mankind and not machines, not false gods. For without any purpose diminishes our own importance as you suggested.

          I’m not sure but I’m left to think Ayn Rand would disagree, the individual seeming to be her central theme.

          I’ve never been sure if Ayn Rand was just a self-indulging narcissist with a steel trap for a mind or the devils advocate. In any case, she offers good argument against the notions of servitude.

          I had an very old man tell me once, if you want something done, you must make it worth people wild (time/effort) and I do believe that he was correct.

          But what we see happening time and time again, and it’s the oldest trick in the book, “Bait & Switch” ~ It’s used over and over again on people that hold onto their strong desire to believe in noble and virtuous ideas. It makes them work while depriving them of just rewards, left only to be thrown an old bone to chew on.

          That’s not to say it’s used by every politician or used all and every time. But it’s used often enough I can smell it coming and I still hold serious concerns about the tea party movement and all the many “good intentions” that’s been discussed in great length over the past months.

          I think in the beginning many found the virtues most appealing and seen it as reform, while others seen it as garnering the vote. Myself, I seen it as an attempt to split the vote. To date, it’s achieved all three to various degrees.

          Leaving me to say, life hasn’t been boring. As least I’ve been entertained in this downward spiral of stall, spin, crash and burn.

          I’m hearing the wolf a chewing on the front door now, ~he’s wanting in. LOL! hahah, hehe. This week, I’ve got to go out and kill something and bring it to the table, as I have several families depending on me to make things happen. I’ve got to sell someone a good reason, a good idea. Fill a demand. Hmm? ~~ okay, you folks stay in good spirits and keep the fire burning. see ya next week.

          • Vicki

            Good luck Bob. And good hunting :)

        • AnhydrousBob

          Whoa, dude, pass that over here. That’s crazy, for real, I mean, what if we were just, like, you know, dust? and specks?

  • http://Na Al Bel

    I’m impressed with the facts you guys know – very intellectual. Your knowledge is as good as a book sitting on a shelf – it just collects dust. One guy stated he has known these things for 40 years – my hero! you have no answers so what good is it that you “know”. I’ll bet every one of you guys are way overweight from sitting there typing to impress others of how dumb… ah smart you are. Less Talk – More Action – is that even a fleeting thought to you?

    • JeffH

      Al Bel, two things have been obvious in your comments…they’re either computer generated or your’re a “pete the repeater”…either way, the results are the same…meaningles!

    • Bob Wire

      it’s true, knowledge without application is worthless.

      This is an “acquired process” of living and learning.

      It’s not wise to deny people their mistakes and the rewards.

      we are all at a difference level in this process, ~ scoffing the very process serves little and few.

      You will heard it a thousand times, a thousand different ways before
      you ever “get the message” and then the knowledge is now yours and can never be taken from you.

  • bp

    There’s only one way to stop the MADNESS. Everyone stop paying taxes, immediately! They can’t lock all of us up. The Federal Government not only wastes our hard earned money, it borrows forty five cents on the dollar it spends! Who invests in a failing enterprise? No one with any financial sense. Imagine how the economy will thrive if we take home our pay!!

    • HFlashman

      You can’t go to jail for owing money…

      The IRS can toss your hind end in jail for not filing or filing false tax returns.

      But then….not paying taxes means you want to crash the government. What replaces it? Maybe you should call a few terrorists since they have the same goal in mind to crash this government…

      Nice solution you’ve come up with. Based all on greed and to hell with this nation. jeesh

      • JeffH

        HFlash, …I suppose your words are the voice of reason? Your comments seem to be based on to hell with this nation. jeesh!

        • HFlashman

          HFlash, …I suppose your words are the voice of reason? Your comments seem to be based on to hell with this nation. jeesh! <—JeffH

          So telling someone who suggests sending us straight to a Depression and banking collapse that they're out of touch with reality or in league with terrorist goals is not a voice of reason?????

          Let's see. The entire world financial system is based off of and depends upon our financial system. So doing away with the Fed and taxation pretty much blows that away, wakens the US to an unimaginable level, collapses the US AND world economy and sends us straight to a Depression, financial chaos and collapse. That's reasonable to you?

          Wow …

          • vicki

            Banks tend to collapse when a bunch of depositors want their money. If banks did not lend out the money they wouldn’t have to worry about collapse.

          • JeffH

            HFlash…you refuse to look past your nose. Understandable, you being a liberal, that you refuse to look “outside the liberal box”.

            It is easier to perceive error than to find truth, for the former lies on the surface and is easily seen, while the latter lies in the depth, where few are willing to search for it.”
            - Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

            Here’s a hint….House of Rothschilds Banking Cabal

            If one understands that socialism is not a share-the-wealth programme, but is in reality a method to consolidate and control the wealth, then the seeming paradox of super-rich men promoting socialism becomes no paradox at all. Instead, it becomes logical, even the perfect tool of power-seeking megalomaniacs.

            Communism or more accurately, socialism, is not a movement of the downtrodden masses, but of the economic elite.
            Gary Allen, Author

          • DaveH

            You know nothing of what creates a Depression, Flashdunce. Try reading this article and learn something (get out your dictionary):
            http://mises.org/rothbard/agd.pdf

          • DaveH

            Who am I kidding? Flashdunce doesn’t want to learn anything. I doubt he will read it. He doesn’t have enough time to read it, but he does have plenty of time to spew his nonsense on this site.

          • AnhydrousBob

            Dave, I was a neocon with definite libertarian leanings till I found Mises.org. A couple of weeks with Murray Rothbard’s “For a New Liberty” and I was hooked. Don’t get me wrong, I argued with the man, page after page, but I couldn’t refute his logic. Plus, when I finally accepted it, I realized that it fits square with so much of what the bible – the OT especially, teaches.

          • DaveH

            Welcome aboard, Bob.

  • http://com i41

    Karolyn, all mail moved between hubs is by private contracted carriers, the union postal employees, not getting the same pay as the “old days” is bull. I was a contract truck driver carrier, it is the f–k up union idoits in the hubs, who are drag reared idoits with multi layered do nothings. On a trip between hubs that I ran averaged 200- 260 miles. My lee way time was 15 minutes, and we were supposed to only go 55 mph. You cann’t be a driver if you ever had a DUI, even if it was when you were 18 and are now 40 with a clean driving record, but as a union smuck, you can be a convicted pedophile, spend time in jail and still keep your job. I have watched more than one screw off, read post cards instead of sorting mail, The manager when notified about the infraction, she told me she couldn’t fire the idoit, union protection. As a contract driver I had to purchase my own health insurance, and it was no problem. When contract carrying everyone, down to contract signer is doing work, not sittting in a office drinking coffee sleeping or staring at the ceiling, in a suit and tie. The way businesses should be operated with every person pulling the freight. Postal managers get bonuses 3 times the average of a contracts yearly salary. If the government wants to cut costs, make the hubs managers in these big cities work shifts, sort mail, deliver, and get rid of all the middle management screw offs. Little PO managers do it all Unlike all big conglomerates, who the democrat party supports. PO should be completely privatized and everyone would save money with greater effiency, as when transportation between hubs were implimented. Tin can the damn unions, and have better preformance in the workplace, as well as the ads for democrats and the party bu== s==t in the employee work areas.

  • guyb

    Lets just face the truth, Here in the greatest country in the world,AMERICA,we have elected officals that only care about padding there offshore bank accounts. We can bring our great nations economy back by a few simple rules. First,force our elected officals to love and care about America and the American people they represent over and above all….. Stop letting opec money fund our environmentalist who tell our elected officals why we can’t drill for our own oil. Oh,that lizard or that turtle or that frog might go extinct. Oh,that fish(delta smelt) might go extinct ect. Baloney. We need to drill for our own oil and then the 1 trillion dollars we spend on imported oil would stay in our own ecomony and if they raise the price of oil to $200 a barrel it would not affect us.If we drill for our own oil it would give us over 6 million jobs in 4 years and make us independent. WOW,fixing our own problems with a simple idea. No wonder we will not drill for our own oil, thats to easy.

    • Zoe D.

      Indeed. And replacing gas as fuel for cars with batteries? Another boondoggle waiting to happen. Potash is used to make the new car batteries.
      First, the King of Morocco has a monopoly on most of the world’s Potash, and already he’s manipulating its price. Exchange OPEC for Morocco…yeh, smart idea them car batteries.

      Second: the cost of electric generation? to charge them car batteries? I don’t see why this is being encouraged. Electric generation costs are hitting the roof already. Isn’t electric just another energy thing? What makes energy? Oil, gas, coal, DUH.

      Never mind OUR own oil, we have enough COAL in this country to last 100 years. We need to develop better technologies to “scrub” it and make it clean. R&D. Employ engineers…let’s move it.
      Coal is being EXPORTED anyway. DUH guess where? LOL

      NDRC will send you to a site where top-mountain coal mining is “ruining” certain areas. Well, all we have to do is make a law which says they have to RESTORE what they muck up. DUH.

  • http://hotmail Joe Dennison

    We are not sunk yet..but we are taking on alot of water. If only nthe EL Odumbo would put oeople in that knew what they were doing. But no only his pals and they are the onesthat tell him what to do. Thanks. Joe.

  • http://com i41

    guyb, first off, if we drill in the USA, it would show what a farce windmills and batery power is. Windmills have been used for years to pump water for livestock, and reserviors were always needed as a back up. Same goes for 3 decades of paying billions to land owners for their own private wildlife preserve under CRP,if it was stopped we could save at least 100 billion this next year. When the food poisening of dogs and cats happened a few year ago, where did the wheat mids come from, China, never heard a peep from peta or any other animl rights idoits. Usually our wheat mids go into livestock feed. Our cow herd is now lower than in 1952, think we will be eating hamburger in 4 years, also soybeans are going to be imported imported and not growen here in the USA, if the productive land keeps being idled, so where is the b–l crap coming from, our socialist democrat and their lap pooches, professors in colleges and the “we should all eat more vegatables and nuts or grains”. Damn that is the prefect diet to fatten hogs and feed lot animals. Ask some of your elected morons if you get a chance, why drilling and pipelines aren’t being put in, and jobs aren’t being created? Also, ask why mandates by agency wonks are allowed to be implemented, hope you get an answer.

    • Zoe D.

      I saw canned vegetables in Walmart and Aldi’s with CHINA on the label.

      We are importing FOOD from China…and China is crying about being able to feed their own people! Well, we obviously pay more than their own people can. Put some skin in the game: tax the imports. Stop paying farmers to raise corn for fuel instead of raising food.

      • AnhydrousBob

        Forget taxing the imports, but you are dead on about the Corn. My philosophy, if two folks want to trade, even thru some middlemen, why should the government meddle. And on the corn side, they are taking money from me to pay the farmers for their corn.

  • FreedomFighter

    The “boat” is sinking due to the progressive/liberal commies blowing holes in it for the last 100 years, what-u-spectin foo.

    Had enough yet?

    Laus Deo
    Semper Fi

  • 45caliber

    Let it collapse. If they can’t make a profit on it, they certainly aren’t the right people for the job. And they certainly don’t need to keep getting more tax dollars for their stupidity and their lack of skill .

  • http://www.brokerspath.com Dan

    I have money, some say way more than my share. My life was hard and now it’s not becasue I believed in delayed gratification. But lately, it all seems to be just that, a dream. I’m affraid to tell my kids what I actually believe because I don’t want to demoralize them or, worse, have them think Dad is a nut. I get “prepare” (food, etc) but what do I say to the kids when they come home to visit… Dad has turned into Richard Dreyfuss… (Close Encounter movie)? I’m struggling not to believe articles like this are the last warning, not the first signs of warning. I’m troubled. For a time urgent personality I fell like I need to committ and do “stuff” now. Am I over-reacting?

    • Karolyn

      Dan – If you never read articles like this, you would be fine, right? Since you have, what I would say is “follow your gut.”

  • DaveH

    Wow. The leftist economist Paul Krugman is coming out of the closet Big Time!
    http://www.newsmax.com/InsideCover/krugman-death-panels-vat/2010/11/14/id/377008?s=al&promo_code=B1AB-1

    • JeffH

      DaveH, thanks for posting…I almost did the same this weekend.
      And the liberals will tell you you’re being delustion in believing there will be “death panels”. Guess Palin got it right afterall…again!

      • DaveH

        At least we can give Krugman credit for being honest enough to admit it. What lowlife Liberals are. They whine incessantly about the Rich taking advantage of them, but then they turn around and promote evil like that. The truth is they are much more evil than the Rich who they love to envy.

  • Bill

    OK, I read about 80% of the posts here. I’ll now offer my take.

    Let’s first leave which side of the aisle out of the discussion, because in my observation, both sides have led us to the place we find ourselves today. There is room in this country for both liberal and conservative ideas, and in fact, the dynamic tension between the two, is in my opinion one of the greatest catalysts for innovation we’ve had.

    That said, it is my view, that the greatest detriment to this nation can be traced to one very simple point. During the greater part of the history of the United States, virtues, ethics, truth, and trust were epitomized in almost every example of leadership we admired. While the doctrine in the country was by far dominated by Christian theology, there were other religions, teaching often similar value systems present as well. Basically, for most of our history, the majority of people strived to live their lives in an honest and ethical manner. So, to put it another way, America was led by the archetype of the “Hero/Heroine”.

    Usher in the 60s…then the 70s, the 80s….by this time, a growing trend, which began to blossom in the 1980s and exploded in the 90s, was to replace the “Hero/Heroine” with the “Villain”.

    We began to see “gangster rap”, criminals who blamed their parents, their upbringing..or whatever else for their crimes. We began to see corporate executives bend moral rules to bring in greater profits, at the expense of the customer. Until, now, we find ourselves slipping down a collapsible moral slope…with a majority of people doing whatever it takes to survive or even more ideally thrive.

    Even the “Mafia” knew that in order to exploit the system they had to preserve it. This is why Mobsters often donated to the Catholic Church, orphanages and other charities. You need good people to exploit to make criminal enterprises work. When everyone or even the majority of people become criminals, the system turns to chaos and falls over on itself.

    With this viewpoint in mind, I agree, yes we need to return to sound economic principles, a free market, an end to the Fed and the countless pages of legislation that do nothing but gum up the normal processes. But even vastly more important, we need to demand the highest ethical accountability, from our politicians, our business leaders and our religious leaders. Also, we must demand the same high ethical accountability of ourselves, so that if we cannot find the leaders who exhibit these virtues, then we can become the leaders we are looking for.

    Without this critical element, of returning to a common doctrine of truth and trust, no trimming budgets, changing legislation or other attempts to return our nation to its former status will succeed over the long term.

    May God Bless Us All.

  • http://com i41

    The demorat party just created another postition for another stretch limo and a driver so the fat bastards don’t have to ride on their own rail system and need to driven around. Why don’t all the airy fairy elctric car smucks put these leeches in these little putt putts of the government motors and stop global warming. As usual these s==t brained clowns, preach to rest of us to drive match box models, but don’t follow their own rules. Darn, I forgot it is the National Marxist Cummunist Democrat Union Party crap social justice line everytime, just more book trained puke minded “experts” mouthing off. Get rid of all the limos and drivers and security for these morons, they only have to worry about the peaceful muslims and crimminal, but that is their bros, all the way to the WH.

  • Tank

    Stop Social Security, I f you have gotten out more than you out in at 5% interest sorry buddy you’re sucking blood form me. Cut the Defense budget 10% even SECDEF Gates said we’re prepping to fight the last war…how many aircraft carriers does Al Queida have? Planes? Tanks? We’re relieving ourselves down a drain with all that spending bought by lobbyist cash drugs and sex…weapons systems built in 40 congressional districts? P-O-R-K!!!

    End Medicare socialist pigs sucking money out of the system, where is it in the constitution, you are robbing the young blind.

    End Foreign Aid why are there 25000 troops in Korea, they slap us in the face and sell like 50 cars here for every car we sell there? Bring them home and what exactly is “victory” in Afghanistan a “country” made of of tribal thugs?

    • DaveH

      Tank,
      If they gave me back the money they forcefully took on my behalf with 5% interest to boot, I would be ecstatic. I won’t be holding my breath for that event though.
      Isn’t it wonderful? Somebody appoints themselves as the guardian of your savings because you can’t be trusted to protect yourself, and then they proceed to spend all the money that they took on your behalf. I can think of no better word for that travesty than Scandalous.

      • Tank

        Well you must be under 55, there are 70+ year olds and everybody older who paid 1% of their income in and it stopped at like $5000 a year. They are welfare queens, but they scream keep your socialist hands off my social security and socialized medicine!!!

        • JeffH

          Tank, I’m one of those collecting SS and a Medicare Advantage Plan to boot and I’m not on welfare and live 100% off of my Social Security benefiets, pay all of my bills and owe no one. Oh, I spent over 45 years paying into it so I could collect it down the road. I and my brother share a rental house and if the government had not “stolen” the money from SS, thanks to LBJ, then it would be doing just fine and people down the road could look forward to it. Just remember that it was big government that screwed it up.

          • JeffH

            Tank, I agree…stop the SS/FICA collection and let the people keep the money to invest as they please.

        • DaveH

          Tank,
          Over my 40 years of work-life they have taken $160,000 on my behalf. If I had simply earned 5% on that money it would have compounded to over $400,000. In fact, I am an astute investor and could have turned it into much more than that with relatively safe investments. But ignoring that, I could have lived handsomely on that money for my last years. Instead, now, I have to wonder from day to day if they will stiff me completely.
          Jeff is right. They need to make the program voluntary. Who, though, in their right mind would voluntarily let Government control their savings? Contrary to what so many people say, Government could stop right now from forcing people on the system, and pay those who are already deeply involved by selling off all the Government controlled land in the country. And if we pared Government down to less than half its current size and get them out of the marketplace, our economy would be so robust that only the laziest citizens would suffer (as it should be).

          • DaveH

            Keep in mind too, Tank, that the money they forcefully took from me over 30 years ago had much more buying power then than it does now. This of course is the result of excess money creation by the Federal Reserve.

  • HungryNTexas

    At these prices for stables like corn, bread, sugar, and what not, a cheaper route will be to cut backstraps out of the neighbors.

  • Robert

    Most of the major US banking institutions have yet to book their off balance sheet assets to their books. Compliments of the US Government’s reckless behavior in not accepting Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac as insolvent with losses in the trillions of dollars. Bernake can continue this smoke and mirrors facade along with the bums in Washington. Sooner, rather than later, this next crisis will erupt and Ben, the President, Congress and the Senate wont be able to put Humpty Dumpty back together again. Then what?

  • P Hoover

    My husband worked at Port Everglades, Ft. Lauderdale, FL when there was a supposed gas shortage He saw all the tankers circling offshore. Nothing came to the port to offload .
    I was a child during the Depression and remember what we ate for supper. Potato pancakes and vegetable soup. Still not my favorite foods.

  • GotSense

    The fact is that “the FAKE financial crisis” is a planned orchestrated act, by a small group of people behind the scenes who presently control the majority of the world’s money, and banking institutions. These people have all the money they will ever need, now and in the furture, so it is not about money, or profits. It is about a group of corrupt power hungry people behind te scenes who get pleasure in oppressing, raping, and pillaging countries just for pleasure. It is these evil people who want to tear down this great country, just for they own sick, evil pleasure. WE are Americans, and we can never let this happen. This great country founded on Godly principles, so let us rise up, and be proud of who we are, look to God for help and make this country the shining jewel again, of the world it should be. Let us focus on improving our lifes, and the lifes of our fellow man as we move into this 21st century and beyond.

    May God Bless you, and God Bless America.

  • Gene

    I am getting sick and tired of the rest of the world and we are ourselves calling us a Demrocracy. We are not a Demrocracy, we use some of the principles of Democracy. Pure Democracy does not exist and cannot exist. The Romans and Greeks tried it. We are a Republic!

    I pledge alligance to the flag of the United States of America and to the REPUBLIC for which it stands………

    It is does not say DEMOCRACY.

    Following is excerpt from the Declartion of Independence by Thomas Jefferson. Read the whole thing but pay special attention to the part that begins with: “That to secure these rights…..” And pay special
    attention to the part that begins with: “That whenever any form of government becomes desstructive to these ends…………..”

    We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness.

    • Vicki

      Actually we are not a Republic. A Republic has some of the same weaknesses a Democracy has. We are something entirely new (well at the time :) We are a Constitutionally LIMITED Republic. Therein is the special sauce that made us able to exist for more than 230 years. (more than 200 years past T. Jeffersons best guess. ) )

      Democracies suffer from Tyranny of the Majority. Republics suffer from the same thing but it is once removed by the representatives. Because of the limitations the Constitution imposes on the government and the peoples representatives neither the representatives nor the people can vote to delegate certain powers to the government.

      But as John Adams said.
      “Our constitution is only fit for a moral and religious people. It is wholly unsuited to the governance of any other kind.”

      We see that if the Constitutional limitations are not honored the beast we call government grows and grows and grows and…..

      • Bob Wire

        insightful write Vicky, thought provoking.

        • Vicki

          Thanks. :)

      • Bob Wire

        it’s the nature of things ~ to grow and to die. Seems it’s one or the other. Both Church & State require occasional “pruning” as each seems to encroach on one another.

        This “pruning” is met with cry’s of protest. Christian are being under attack! Christmas is under attack!

        Government response is a little different, less in your face and grows like a cancer, capable of creating “need” and “demand” to justify it’s self, it does so in more creative ways. Next years spending such naturally be larger then this years if for no other reason, inflation and the population growth. If the work load is not any smaller why should the budget?

        I read this morning Mich McConnell has decide to go with Jim Demint and oppose the standard “line item” pork issues having earlier being in favor of the practice. And Obama claims to be on board to stop wasteful spending with line item pork.

        Well, ~ I’ll hide and watch. Sounds to good to be true.

        • DaveH

          It is too good to be true. They will throw us a few bones, and party on.

  • Mr. P

    The liberal progressive socialists love to use the word “entitlement” like it was a 4 letter word. What is the definition of entitlement? Is it not “Something one is entitled to”? Why are those of us who have worked all our lives and seen “Social Security,” “Medicare/Medicaid,” and local, state, and federal money with-held from every check considered selfish because we want the money we paid into the system? The money we are entitled to? Social Security started going down the drain when our greedy, “what’s in it for me” Congress moved it from the lock-box to the General Fund, where they have since “stolen” 3 trillion dollars from it on pork and perks. Medicare is not a bad program; it is badly managed. If it had proper oversight, doctors wouldn’t get away with charging for MRI’s, EKG’s, and other procedures they never performed. Congress kills COLAS for seniors for several years, but keeps taking their back-door automatic pay raises every year. The problem, besides a Congress and administration that have lost their moral, ethical and spiritual compass, is that we the people have allowed it to happen. We need to stop going to the mall, watching football on TV, and start paying attention to the morons we’re putting in charge of us. As a writer for the Orlando Sentinel correctly said, “To let 535 people run the lives of over 300 million people is insanity.”

  • cboy

    Both liberals and the “conservatives” are the elite. They both have been putting the classes against each other. Kill the fed reserve now and all the other govt take away to give away programs and put money back into the hands of the people to work with. Let any people on SS earn all they want. Stop taking it out on all workers under 40 and let them get a real pay increase for once in their lives(they will have to plan for their own retirement). No one retires until they are 65 now increasing to 68 over 20 years until SS is paid out to the last ones eligible. Kill medicare in 10 years. If as a people we don’t get off the Gov’t tit we are still just a bunch of babies. This printing of money is the road to slavery. Kill the income tax and have a flat national sales tax of 10% for defense and govt operation for regulation that is necessary for the common good and not special interest good.

    God help us to put others first and self last.

  • DaveH

    An example of Liberal Pablum:
    http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Roubini-Inflation-Is-Not-a-cnbc-3089109750.html?x=0&sec=topStories&pos=2&asset=&ccode=

    But the money is out there now. It may not be changing hands in the short term, but it is out there with its pent-up potential energy just waiting to spring. They can use all the double-speak they want (velocity, M0, quantitative easing), but we now have a $1 trillion dollar increase in our money supply (close to 10% increase). That means basically that our cash money will buy 10% less in the future than it would have without the “quantitative easing”.

  • TRUE PATRIOT

    Bank of America and Chase Manhattan are both owned by the Illuminati! They want these Banks to fail and many other businesses that they own so they can come in afterwards and be the saviors and implement the rest of their plans! All anyone has to do is look at the model or precident that was set in Germany before WWII and see what is going to happen here! Look at the faces of the German people when Hitler was giving his speeches! They were literally worshiping him! Only instead of the Reichstag we had the Twin Towers, instead of Jews we have the terrorists, instead of the National Socialists(NAZIS) we have the Dems. It’s all there in your history books, just stop watching Am. Idol and do a little reading! It was the Illuminati then and it is the Illuminati now! They just think you are to stupid to connect the dots! Don’t forget they have to take our guns away before they can complete their agenda. Look what happened in Louisiana, they went house to house with the Military taking people’s guns at gun point! What a great training mission that was! Crashing the country financially is one big step towards one world government and one world currency! These people don’t need money it is all about power, control, manipulation and enslavement! 800 FEMA Camps now nationwide, what do they have to do before everyone wakes up, name 2 of them Krackow or Auschwitz?

  • Eric Bischoff

    DaveH do you realize that everything you quote is either from Cato or Heritage or Fox and that both of these supposedly think tanks were started and are funded by the Koch brothers who also are responsible for the Tea Party and the lovely John Birch society and that, Fox, which you love so much is their bull horn. You are the one who has bought in to all of this propaganda. You have been manipulated. And you have the nerve to yell at everyone that disagrees with you or watches other media. You are a joke, a bad joke. And I may add you need to learn compassion, open mindedness (liberalism) and the art of civility in debate.

    • Vicki

      lots of talk. no evidence.

      • Eric Bischoff

        Oh Vicki you have your nose up DaveH’s arse all the time. Both of you either are plants to stirr things up or you really sincerely get it wrong a lot and yet you are convinced every one else is wrong.

        You went after Deedee with the old horriffied with the redistribution of wealth. What you fail to realize is that redistribution of wealth is going on as we speak. The rich have rigged the game and they are stealing as much as they can. It is ironic to me that when redress finally happens when the PEOPLE have had enough of being squeezed you two will stand there and argue the case for the wealthy who are plundering the masses. Revolutions and the Robbin Hood story are all about we’ve had enough.

        There’s plenty of evidence but your ignorance will never stand up in a court of law.

        • Vicki

          Eric Bischoff writes:
          “Oh Vicki you have your nose up DaveH’s arse all the time. ”

          Such a wonderfully witty comment. Your eloquence deceives you.

      • Eric Bischoff

        My differences with you on the separation of church and state.

        I stand mostly with Thomas Paine. Anything after that was a watered down version of what we could have been only to please the naysayer who weren’t ready for greatness. I don’t want to know about your religion and I don’t care about the presidential candidates faith or lack of. It is none of our business. What matters is their qualification and their character. I find plenty of people who do not believe in God that and still they have more character in their little pinky than many vociferous christians. I find it offensive than only a christian could ever become president of this country. That alone severely restricts our choices for great leadership.

        I quote:

        When the United States of America was founded, it represented the most progressive political movement in Western Civilization since the days of the Greek democracies over 2,000 years ago. The movement for revolution, as most of us should know, was sparked by Thomas Paine, who roused colonists’ desire for freedom with his best selling book Common Sense and then participated in the Revolution both as an enlisted man and by writing the inspirational series Crisis.

        Paine was the first to suggest the unification of the separate states, and the first to use to term United States of America. Paine turned over all the money he received from the sale of his works to the Continental Army to support the cause of the Revolution. After the American Revolution was over Paine went on to France where he then participated in the French Revolution in his lifelong effort to fight for freedom from tyranny.

        Perhaps more than any other single man, Thomas Paine is responsible for the formation of the United States, for as fellow revolutionary and American president John Adams stated: “Without the pen of Paine the sword of Washington would have been wielded in vain.”

        Thomas Paine Now there was a man with character.

        “I believe in the equality of man; and I believe that religious duties consist in doing justice, loving mercy, and endeavoring to make our fellow-creatures happy.

        But, lest it should be supposed that I believe in many other things in addition to these, I shall, in the progress of this work, declare the things I do not believe, and my reasons for not believing them.

        I do not believe in the creed professed by the Jewish church, by the Roman church, by the Greek church, by the Turkish church, by the Protestant church, nor by any church that I know of. My own mind is my own church.

        All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power and profit.”

        “Deism, then, teaches us, without the possibility of being deceived, all that is necessary or proper to be known. The creation is the Bible of the deist. He there reads, in the handwriting of the Creator himself, the certainty of his existence and the immutability of his power, and all other Bibles and Testaments are to him forgeries.”

        “The opinions I have advanced… are the effect of the most clear and long-established conviction that the Bible and the Testament are impositions upon the world, that the fall of man, the account of Jesus Christ being the Son of God, and of his dying to appease the wrath of God, and of salvation by that strange means, are all fabulous inventions, dishonorable to the wisdom and power of the Almighty; that the only true religion is Deism, by which I then meant, and mean now, the belief of one God, and an imitation of his moral character, or the practice of what are called moral virtues-and that it was upon this only (so far as religion is concerned) that I rested all my hopes of happiness hereafter.”

        “Of all the systems of religion that ever were invented, there is none more derogatory to the Almighty, more unedifying to man, more repugnant to reason, and more contradictory in itself, than this thing called Christianity.”

        “We can know God only through his works. We cannot have a conception of any one attribute but by following some principle that leads to it. We have only a confused idea of his power, if we have not the means of comprehending something of its immensity. We can have no idea of his wisdom, but by knowing the order and manner in which it acts. The principles of science lead to this knowledge; for the Creator of man is the Creator of science; and it is through that medium that man can see God, as it were, face to face.”

        • Mr. P

          Oh no! Another liberal know-it-all. Your definiton of Deism is totally wrong. Deism is the belief that an all powerful and intelligent designer created this universe, and then went on His way, never to look back or care about what happens to it. The experience of history is just the opposite. He has tweaked his creation many times, still sees all that goes on, and works in His creation everyday. Some just can’t see it. Secular humanists. It states very clearly in 1 Corinthians that God intentionally made it so mankind could never find Him through “human intelligence.” Humans can understand humans because they share a common spirit. We cannot understand God until He chooses to reveal Himself to us. He does that through the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit only resides only in believers. Non-believers will never understand, because they do not have the Holy Spirit to reveal the things of God to them.

  • Greg Jones

    JeffH,
    Unsure if it was you’r or my blood your talking of sacrificing.
    Or if perehaps you were just talking out your ars?

  • Lloyd Olson

    The last election gave a good sample of what can happen. In the next election we may see Palin or someone close to her thinking on the Republican side of the fence. In a news letter like this we sing to each other. Each person needs to contact 10 others and sell at least 3 to consider how they vote. It takes work boys and girls, we have 2 years, we can change things so get busy. Lloyd Olson

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