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Your Vote Won’t Save The Buck

September 19, 2012 by  

Your Vote Won’t Save The Buck
PHOTOS.COM

America will take the biggest wager it has made in generations in just 48 days. Either President Barack Obama or GOP Presidential nominee Mitt Romney will be given the task of rebuilding America.

Liberals believe Obama is the man who can do it if he is given another four years.

Many Republicans think that another four more years of Obama will ensure the economic destruction of the United States. The GOP is resting its hopes on a Romney Presidency.

I have some bad news: The United States is in a permanent state of decline that neither candidate can, or is even willing to try to, fix.

Obama’s plan comprises the tried and failed policies of big government: renewed regulation and higher taxes. As for Romney, he hasn’t presented much of a plan to reverse the four-year recession that has all the makings of a depression.

Both Obama and Romney are big spenders. Their preference on where they will spend differs, but one fact faces them both: America has $16 trillion in Federal debt.

I believe whatever solutions they have can result only in a larger Federal deficit and the continued meltdown of the dollar.

Whoever is President will have a partner in this crime: the Federal Reserve, whose sole purpose in the 21st century is to float trillions of dollars in fiat money regardless of the future cost.

Kids’ Stuff

When I was in my 20s, I did the research for my father’s investment newsletter. This was a decade before the Internet. The Federal Reserve would send out a monthly newsletter, with all the data on interest rates such as the Fed funds rate, plus all the statistics on the money supply.

What I didn’t know then is that reviewing this material made us like the last of the Mohicans. In the future, the Fed wouldn’t operate with restrictions. Federal Reserve Chairman Paul Volcker, who operated the Fed first for President Jimmy Carter and then Ronald Reagan, believed the excesses of the economy needed to be squeezed out. He promptly did what a responsible central banker should do; he raised interest rates.

In 1975, America was road blocked by gasoline lines and escalating inflation. Volcker decided he had to follow what he believed to be the first fundamental obligation of the Federal Reserve: squeezing out excess money. He certainly did. The Fed increased the fed funds rate, what it charged to other banks to borrow money from 4.6 percent in January 1977 to 19.1 percent in January 1981. That kind of rate change had never been absorbed by the United States, yet Volcker bet it would cure the economic malaise that had been part of the Carter experience and that with Reagan’s tax cuts would put America back to work.

There was a price for this aggressive action taken by the Fed, especially in the farm and commodity sectors, which underwent a rolling recession. Yet because of it and the stability that was returned to the dollar, the U.S. began two decades of unsurpassed growth. It also made America an oasis for foreigners to invest their money.

I remember commenting to my dad in 1982 that I was surprised that M3 money supply (a large measure of the money in the economy) was declining.

He said something about the Fed fixing the excesses of the 1970s. By then, he had told his subscribers to sell gold and to accumulate Treasury notes, some which paid 15 percent interest. He believed the actions of the Fed would strengthen the dollar, and he was right.

Because of the Fed’s intervention, the Nation was saved from dollar maelstrom. Instead, the great economic expansion lay ahead, a period during which the Dow Jones Industrial Average would rise more than tenfold. And the dollar would reach heights never achieved before against other currencies.

This Isn’t Your Father’s Fed 

Since 9/11, the Federal Reserve has rejected any obligation to protect the integrity of the dollar. It has created trillions of dollars out of thin air to fend off the liquidity crisis that began in 2008 and persists to this day.

Congress and the past two Presidents have played a role in making the dollar into Monopoly money. The Troubled Asset Relief Program bank bailout added $700 billion into the coffers of big banks. In the HBO movie “Too Big to Fail,” the question asked at the end is whether the banks can be counted on to lend it. The conclusion by the Chairman of the Federal Reserve and the Secretary of the Treasury is that of course they will.

Yet they didn’t. Like a gambling addict, the big banks have just doubled down on this easy money. And like any gambler, they will lose it, too. It won’t be just their loss but the Nation’s loss while the United States continues to forfeit its superpower status.

In his 2009 book End the Fed, Representative Ron Paul (R-Texas) writes:

The Fed itself claims that part of its job is to keep inflation in check. This is something like the tobacco industry claiming that it is trying to stop smoking or the automobile industry claiming it is trying to control road congestion. The Fed is in the business of generating inflation… the entire reason for the Fed’s existence is to generate more, not less, of it.

Paul is dead right; in the past decade, the Fed has given Washington a book of checks to accumulate as much debt as it wants. And from what I have seen proposed by Obama and Romney, they plan to spend the Fed’s windfall like a homeless person would spend $1 million in lottery winnings.

In the first day of Economics 101, my professor pulled an apple from his desk (that was no doubt given to him by a suck-up) and asked: “What do you think this apple is worth?”

There was a lot of chattering. People said it was worth maybe a nickel (don’t forget this was in 1976).

Then the professor asked: “What is it worth if I told you that it was the only apple left in the world?”

We were all stupid teenagers, so we missed his point, which was that it would be priceless.

The professor taught us over the next eight months. We came to understand that the value of one apple would be immeasurable.

That is the problem the President-elect faces. Consider it when you look at this graph:

Graph of St. Louis Adjusted Monetary Base

 

The amount of U.S. dollars that is sloshing around has doubled in the past four years. America has never seen that kind of monetary eruption. With the exception of Weimar Germany and countries ruled by Latin dictators, neither has any other nation.

This is surely a prescription for the dollar’s destruction. And yet neither Presidential candidate will even mention the impending crisis. That should be all you need to know about getting out of U.S. dollar instruments.

Yours in good times and bad,

–John Myers
Editor, Myers’ Energy & Gold Report

Editor’s note: It’s time to make your submissions for this month’s You Sound Off! feature, which will run Sept. 26. Get your submission in by Sept. 24. It should be no more than 750 words (if it is longer, we probably won’t read it). We will select the one or two we think are the best of the week to publish. We reserve the right to edit for grammar and style but will try not to alter the meaning.

Send your submissions to yousoundoff@personalliberty.com. Please include your name, address and telephone number (only your name will be published) so we can contact you if we need to clarify something. Anonymous submissions will not be considered.–BL

John Myers

is editor of Myers’ Energy and Gold Report. The son of C.V. Myers, the original publisher of Oilweek Magazine, John has worked with two of the world’s largest investment publishers, Phillips and Agora. He was the original editor for Outstanding Investments and has more than 20 years experience as an investment writer. John is a graduate of the University of Calgary. He has worked for Prudential Securities in Spokane, Wash., as a registered investment advisor. His office location in Calgary, Alberta, is just minutes away from the headquarters of some of the biggest players in today’s energy markets. This gives him personal access to everyone from oil CEOs to roughnecks, where he learns secrets from oil insiders he passes on to his subscribers. Plus, during his years in Spokane he cultivated a network of relationships with mining insiders in Idaho, Oregon and Washington.

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  • GALT

    Enlightened Self Interest

    begins with a brief excerpt from the book Econned.

    “In 1776, Adam Smith published The Wealth fof Nations. In it he argued that the uncoordinated actions of large numbers of individuals, each acting out of self interest, sometimes produced , as if by “an invisible hand,”results that were beneficial to broader society. Smith also pointed out that self interested actions frequently led to injustice or even ruin. He fiercely criticized both how employers colluded with each other to keep wages low, as well as the ” savage injustice ” that European mercantilist interests had “commited with impunity” in colonies in Asia and the Americas.

    Smith’s ideas were cherry picked and turned into a simplistic ideology that now dominates university economics departments. This theory proclaims that the “invisible hand” ensures that economic interest will always lead to the best outcomes imaginable. It follows that any restrictions on the profit seeking activities of individuals and corporations interfer with this invisible hand, and therefor are “inefficient” and nonsensical.

    According to this line of thinking, individuals have perfect knowledge both of what they want and everything happening in the world at large,and so they pass there lives making intelligent decisions. Prices may change in ways that appear random, but this randomness follows predictable and unchanging rules and is never violently chaotic. It is therefore possible for corporations to use clever techniques to reduce and even eliminate the risks associated with their business. The result is a stable productive economy that represents the apex of civilization.

    This heartwarming picture airbrushes out nearly all of the real business world.”

    If this particular description sounds familiar, it is because it’s naivite is constantly being spouted in one way or another by various individuals, while being challenged by various contemporary works offered in counter point to their “imaginary worlds” which are largely based on “imaginary history”……….Economics Unmasked, Debt; The First 5000 Years, Power, Inc and Extreme Money. The words “cherry picked” are quite apropos…….and this new volume offers further insight into a REALITY which continues to EXPOSE the “magical world” that has been constructed for those who are too intellectually inept to have actually considered the meaning of “enlightened self interest”.

    ECONNED: How Unenlightened Self Interest Undermined Democracy and Corrupted Capitalism by Yves Smith of Naked Capitalsim

    Book Description
    Publication Date: October 11, 2011

    Why are we in such a financial mess today? There are lots of proximate causes: over-leverage, global imbalances, bad financial technology that lead to widespread underestimation of risk.

    But these are all symptoms. Until we isolate and tackle fundamental causes, we will fail to extirpate the disease. ECONned is the first book to examine the unquestioned role of economists as policy-makers, and how they helped create an unmitigated economic disaster.

    Here, Yves Smith looks at how economists in key policy positions put doctrine before hard evidence, ignoring the deteriorating conditions and rising dangers that eventually led them, and us, off the cliff and into financial meltdown. Intelligently written for the layman, Smith takes us on a terrifying investigation of the financial realm over the last twenty-five years of misrepresentations, naive interpretations of economic conditions, rationalizations of bad outcomes, and rejection of clear signs of growing instability.

    In eConned, author Yves Smith reveals:

    –why the measures taken by the Obama Administration are mere palliatives and are unlikely to pave the way for a solid recovery

    –how economists have come to play a profoundly anti-democratic role in policy

    –how financial models and concepts that were discredited more than thirty years ago are still widely used by banks, regulators, and investors

    –how management and employees of major financial firms looted them, enriching themselves and leaving the mess to taxpayers

    –how financial regulation enabled predatory behavior by Wall Street towards investors

    –how economics has no theory of financial systems, yet economists fearlessly prescribe how to manage them

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pIQFPkH3ILI

    • Robert Smith

      If things are so bad why is the stock market so high and the 1% making more than ever before?

      Rob

      • Warrior

        Robert, there is a program on the Documentary Channel tonight named “The End of the Road” “How Money Became Worthless”. If you have this channel, I highly recommend you watch. Helicopter ben has almost now assured the destruction of this fiat currency.

      • Sirian

        RS,
        If things are so bad, in you perspective, why is an ounce of gold now $1770/ounce compared to $342/ounce in 2002. Attach a bit of economics 101 common sense to this and you may stand a chance of not being so blind. It’s very simple, just saying. . .

      • Anthony

        Because the 1% are the people that are involved with the Federal Reserve and the banksters! The Federal Reserve and wall street are twins! These people can create money out of thin air to enslave the rest, then collect on the interest! Now you work for the banksters with your hard earned labor and they get it for free! Now if you stop paying they get your home, car, boat what ever for free! Most Americans have no ideal what has been and still being done to them because they are more interested in who won the ballgame than their children’s future!

      • Vigilant

        “If things are so bad why is the stock market so high and the 1% making more than ever before?”

        One could have asked the identical question on October 23, 1929. The very next day answered that question decisively.

        We’ll get a similar answer sometime in 2013.

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        Robert, I don’t claim to know much about economics but I’ve been reading economists saying for over a yer that the stock market would rise dramatically before the crash. So I’m not comforted by the rise. Another thing to look at is billionaires like George Soros and Warren Buffett are selling off huge amounts of stock and are buying gold. And even an economic idiot would be able to see that QE3 will surely destroy what’s left of the dollar. Don’t be comforted by the rise in the stock market. It’s the proverbial “rise before the fall”.

      • GRusling

        Wall Street does business with the Federal Reserve, while Main Street (that’s the rest of us) doesn’t have access to that (almost) free money. We can’t borrow money for 1 or 2% today and pay it back tomorrow, so we’re locked out of that game. It’s an insider only game between Wall Street, the Federal Reserve and the money centers of the world. We’re not even allowed to know what they’re doing, much less how they’re doing it, so they manipulate us at will. Wall Street Bankers make money on the margin between what the PAY for dollars and what they charge us, and unlike small, local banks, they don’t need to have cash from depositors and investors before they lend, since they can simply “create” money by adding zero’s to their balance sheet, at will.

        Wall Street is nothing but the place where the Banksters of the world come to gamble. They sit at this gaming table with governments, which routinely reach into the pockets of taxpayers to cover their losses. These banks, big businesses and governments swap people back and forth routinely, which should reveal to anyone who’s paying attention that it’s the “insider game” of “crony-capitalism” that’s being played there, and all we’re allowed to do is stand outside the room making side bets with peanuts, on which of them will come out ahead in the next scam they fund with our tax dollars.

        Yep… It’s a great game if you can get a seat at the table, but don’t hold your breath waiting for your turn to come…

      • brett

        see what i’m talking about galt? this guy clearly doesn’t get it. sure things are great for the top tier, it’s the rest of us that are f*cked. other than the 401K scam, what does the stock market mean to the rest of us?

      • Realist

        Sirian says:
        September 19, 2012 at 7:48 am

        RS,
        If things are so bad, in you perspective, why is an ounce of gold now $1770/ounce compared to $342/ounce in 2002. Attach a bit of economics 101 common sense to this and you may stand a chance of not being so blind. It’s very simple, just saying.
        _____________________________________________________________________
        The cost of gold is an indicator of the value of our dollar. Simple answer is that our dollar is valued much less now then in ’02.

      • RichE

        The stock market is higher because of inflation not value. This is not good in the long run. It’ll burst.

        Buying Power: The market isn’t high relative to your buying power. Try using gold to buy stocks. Convert your USD to gold then buy the stock. The stock price is higher, but so is your cost to purchase.

      • libertarian58

        The stock market is nothing more than a huge “casino” run by the FED. Ask why casinos in Vegas do so well. It’s a rigged game where the house always wins, even if a few customers are allowed the occasional jackpot to maintain the facade.

      • Inventor64

        It’s supposed to be that way. Government is a “LOST” leader, it returns no monetary value. It returns useful value like buying a loaf of bread.
        Money is not a value of itself, it is a “Lubricant” and keeps the machinery running.
        Remove most of the money and the engine stops running. The Feds job is to have enough money in circulation to run the engine.
        The negatives are people who work here and send money to other countries, population growth, rich who don’t invest or bank in America etc. That the government isn’t on a flat tax of 10% (About 5 trillion dollars a year) is why we are in trouble now. They have over spent for 200 years. In Thomas Jefferson’s time they spent more than was taken in.
        That is what the study of Political Science is, the over spending of all the other peoples money so they have “NONE”!!!

      • nnicko

        Because it’s a suckers game….most lose and some win….it has the same vegas odds. Know when to hold and know when to fold……..it preys upon the economy and that doesn’t include the 99%. Winner in a polker hand may not have the best hand but he can win by bluffing….something the government has been doing now and in the past..

      • Bob

        Dear, brain dead R.S., The reason the Stock Market is so high is that the fed has been pumping trillions of dollars out with no demand for them by the general economy, they must go somewhere and the big money boy who have access to this funny money put it into the stock market which makes things look rosy. All the while the inflation caused by this extra cash makes everything we buy cost more.
        The price of gold has not really gone up, just the number of ‘funny money dollars’ that it takes to buy it. The gold buys the same as it bought over the last 80 years, the ‘funny money’ dollars it take to buy things has increased about 40 fold besause of inflation.

      • Vicki

        Realist says:
        “The cost of gold is an indicator of the value of our dollar. Simple answer is that our dollar is valued much less now then in ’02.”

        Quite true. Our dollar is of much lessor value today. Thanks to the FED and QEx it is going to get a lot lower. The very simple equation supply / demand is why. There are MANY MANY more dollars in the supply but the demand for those dollars vs gold has not really changed so the price of gold (number of dollars to buy some) has gone up. It will go up a LOT more with QE(infinite) started just a few days ago.

        On the plus side the supply / demand affects EVERYTHING. Including how much you get paid for something you have of value (stocks, your time etc). Trade your time for some dollars and promptly trade them for something like gold or silver or lead. If you choose gold or silver I recommend them in old US junk coins as their assay weight is stamped into each one and well recognized throughout the world. If lead I recommend you get it in those cute little brass containers. And the brass has value too. :)

        Lead has the additional value that though you can’t eat it you can use it (in the brass containers) with the proper tool to collect food that you can eat. Also makes it easier for you to protect whatever food / wealth you do have while waiting for the authorities to stop chasing tourist photographers and come assist you.

        http://rt.com/usa/news/lapd-suspicious-photo-sar-553/

      • Linda

        It is called Inflation.

    • brett

      good luck galt, we both know that facts and reason run contrary to what those here have been trained for. i keep asking how it is that we can call this a capitalistic economy when so much capital (wealth) is pooled into such a small concentration. funny how few complaints over how the free market is being collected by corporations not to mention the fear of global gov’t while corps are already global and run gov’ts and wealth is (re)distributed to the top.

      • GALT

        The biggest con is that “government” is the problem……..strange but his initials were RR.

        The sucker bet is to believe this……..and it’s working, at least building up to this required
        government to be “corrupted”………and now that it has been, the sucker’s think the solution is getting rid of it altogether………..which cuts down the costs of having to keep
        it corrupted……….

        As for the FRAUD of Economic Theory……….this “idiocy” has the power of religion,
        with no evidence to support it……..

        The cherry picking of Smith was small stuff……..

        With all the talk of Keynsian Economics……they don’t actually teach or read what
        Keynes wrote………what is taught, is based on an “interpretation” of Keynes, written
        by someone else………

        But here is a little more of Smith……

        “A man must live by his work, and his wages must be at least enough to maintain him. They must even on most occasions be somewhat more: otherwise it would be impossible for him to bring up a family and the RACE of such workmen could not last beyond the first generation.”

        “The subjects of every state ought to contribute towards the support of government, as nearly as possible, in proportion to their respective abilities; that is, in proportion to the revenue which they respectively enjoy under the protection of the state.”

        Not quite the Smith that the “free market capitalists” seem to think they understand?

        Luck?………not likely to be comprehended anytime soon…..

      • brett

        if only we could get big money out of gov’t. the federalist papers (esp. the 1st written by hamilton) warn of how special interests would corrupt the constitution and washington’s farewell address warned of how party partisanship would disrupt the separation of powers, both of which is everything to do with why our gov’t doesn’t work for the people.

      • Vicki

        Corporations have all that wealth cause they earned it (at least those who didn’t make deals with the government devil).

        Government has wealth cause it takes wealth at gunpoint.

    • Ron Christopher

      Everybody who has any knowledge whatsoever knows that in order to kill a country’s financial situation is to flood the market with phony money and that is what the Fed has done.

  • Tom Cook

    Before I have noted that you see the glass as almost empty. I believe Romney and Ryan have real plans to rectify the problem that has been long in the offing, but has been set to Turbo by the Kenyan who truly hates this country and who must go back to Kenya–hopefully to be dealt with by some disenchanted mus. Romney and Ryan both seem to understand that fiat money is a huge problem used by the Kenyan and democrats to buy bread for the masses. I believe they will deal with the Fed by first removing the anencephalic Bernanke.

    • Warrior

      I also agree R/R will try to correct this. It will be the most herculean task undertaken by ANY president. Bailouts have to stop as well as the printing presses.

      • Sirian

        Warrior,
        As long as the “Kenaysian” Bernanke remains in power and runs his printing presses with glee, there isn’t much hope.

      • Vigilant

        “As stipulated by the Banking Act of 1935, the President appoints the seven members of the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System; they must then be confirmed by the Senate and serve for 14 years. Once appointed, Governors may not be removed from office for their policy opinions. The chairman and vice-chairman are chosen by the President from among the sitting Governors for four-year terms; these appointments are also subject to Senate confirmation.”

        Let’s see if Romney has the gumption to fire the Chairman when his term is up. A prudent re-writing of the Banking Act of 1935 would also be in order, but I think it unlikely that we will see any major changes in the Fed, no matter who’s president.

      • GALT

        We seem to be a little “confused” today? ( actually it’s not just today )

        So soon we forget ” The Federal Reserve Conspiracy Plot? ”

        Remember this group of individual private bankers that seeks to control the world?

        1.) They can not do this if there is a “financial collapse”.

        2.) The latest move by the FED is long overdue.

        Why? you might ask……or you might not.

        How did we get here………..and why are we stagnant?

        We are here because of the housing bubble and bank bailouts, which delayed but
        did not alter the underlying problem…………which is that the “imaginary wealth” created
        by the bubble disappeared………..but these losses have NOT been realized…….they
        are tied up in failed mortgages and foreclosure………..

        Fortunately, because of the “derivative” mechanism…….these mortgages are not
        available for the foreclosure process to proceed…….which slows things down…….and
        had allowed us time to unwind this………

        The Fed’s recent move, a 40 billion monthly commitment to purchase mortgages, is
        essentially the correct one………..

        After all, who is taking the risk……….he who holds the paper……the FED.

        This allows the losses to be taken gradually, as they already hold a lot of toxic assets,
        which need to be resolved………..so the imaginary wealth can disappear, while the
        housing market gradually settles to its proper level………

        Considering the alternative ( for them….the conspiracy guys ) it’s the smart move……
        ( see reason 1.)

        This doesn’t solve the actual economic reality……..and RR have no clue how to do this,
        so be happy they will not win……..because they will do exactly the WRONG thing.

        The main problem has been the rise of the financial services industry (shadow banking )
        which is now completely unregulated, but the trend began 25 years ago……which is why the book Econned is a must read……….and this structure must not only be dismantled,
        and the now REALLY,REALLY TOO BIG TO FAIL banks broken up……..and the existing derivatives market ( 87 TRILLION ) also resolved…….because this is 1929 on steroids….

        The direction the country needs to take economically is another matter…….and there is
        no consensus or understanding on this………..but duplicating the past is NOT possible.

        With a little luck, future events will make this path clearer………because we not only
        need to start looking inward…………but the path must be one of sustainable development
        and so far this has not caught on……..

      • Murph

        @ Galt

        Although I enjoy your posts, your disjointed, rambling presentation often fails in regard to clarity. Nonetheless, I often find myself in agreement with your position, when I am able to decipher it. This time however, you have missed, ( I took the liberty to edit your quotes, please let me know if I misrepresented your position)..

        “How did we get here … and why are we stagnant? … We are here because of the housing bubble and bank bailouts, which delayed but did not alter the underlying problem …”

        Not even remotely that simple or that recent. The problem, and I believe you know this, relates to the function of any Central Bank attempting to control an economy. This has never worked in history, and will not work now.

        “The Fed’s recent move, a 40 billion monthly commitment to purchase mortgages, is essentially the correct one …After all, who is taking the risk … he who holds the paper … the FED.”

        I can’t believe you posted this. What utter crap. Who holds the debt? The FED? Not even close. The taxpayer holds the debt, you of all people ought to know this.

        “The main problem has been the rise of the financial services industry (shadow banking ) which is now completely unregulated, but the trend began 25 years ago”

        Try 100 years ago.

        “The direction the country needs to take economically is another matter … and there is no consensus or understanding on this”

        I beg to differ. Try Austrian Economics, simple, clear, and singularly responsible and accountable. Leaders of this school have correctly predicted the past 50 years of economic trends with significantl accuracy. You can do your own research, or if you like, I can provide you with additional information.

        Hard currency has never failed a society, fiat currency has always failed.

      • Vicki

        Murph says
        “Hard currency has never failed a society, fiat currency has always failed.”

        Correct and the reason is in the intrinsic nature of the 2

        Hard currency has an intrinsic value near or above the value printed on it. Fiat currency has an intrinsic value way way way below the value printed on it. Fiat currency can not avoid failure.

      • GALT

        Although I enjoy your posts, your disjointed, rambling presentation often fails in regard to clarity. Nonetheless, I often find myself in agreement with your position, when I am able to decipher it. This time however, you have missed, ( I took the liberty to edit your quotes, please let me know if I misrepresented your position)..

        Well, Murph……let’s us see if we can clear this up, and the first thing that probably needs to be clarified is that this particular piece is rather narrow in it’s scope…….since it deals specifically with the latest move by the Fed in the context in which it applies. You step outside this context in a number of places which I have no objection to, but it does expand the discussion to encompass a wider range of ideas, as well as the historical setting which makes a difference. Still I will attempt to address this as best I can…..but this simply poses other questions which can be pursued if you like?

        “How did we get here … and why are we stagnant? … We are here because of the housing bubble and bank bailouts, which delayed but did not alter the underlying problem …”

        Not even remotely that simple or that recent. The problem, and I believe you know this, relates to the function of any Central Bank attempting to control an economy. This has never worked in history, and will not work now.

        This is referencing the “here and now”, this crash and what led up to it. You do seem to be making an a very “inclusive” statement that mixes up a bunch of things and then state a general conclusion which takes in all of history. For banks in general, and for central banks specifically, this history is fairly recent……….and they are an evolution of what we have come to understand as Economics, and for which my general position has been stated…..that it is invalid.

        So I agree that historically, empires and economies fail…..but this is a function of “centralization” or “civilization”, if you like…….simply because WE have not adapted to it and are not genetically/ biologically suited to it. ( see The Social Conquest of Earth )
        As for why economics is invalid Economics Unmasked, as well as Econned will provide sufficient evidence regarding the construction of Economics from Smith forward, for what economies actually are and their historical origins ( credit, money, barter ) see Debt:The First 5000 Years.

        “The main problem has been the rise of the financial services industry (shadow banking ) which is now completely unregulated, but the trend began 25 years ago”

        Try 100 years ago.

        As in “1929 on steroids”? That crash was a simple combination of a not so centralized FED, the then “fractional reserve requirements” and finally “credits margins” provided by Wall St. ( see Lords of Finance ) At the time the U.S. controlled 80% of the world’s gold, and operating on the “gold standard”…….with “other economies” attempting to return to it, after world war one……..where Keynes surfaced initially with regard to the reparations…..and where all of these things combined to create a “perfect storm”. What is happening now makes that look like a mild summer shower.

        “The Fed’s recent move, a 40 billion monthly commitment to purchase mortgages, is essentially the correct one …After all, who is taking the risk … he who holds the paper … the FED.”

        I can’t believe you posted this. What utter crap. Who holds the debt? The FED? Not even close. The taxpayer holds the debt, you of all people ought to know this.

        No, I don’t actually………but this seems to be your main point, or objection so let’s see if clarification is possible. In the normal sense of FED operation and it’s lending function to the government you would be correct…….but that is not what this is……..it is an injection of “capital” in exchange for “mortgage instruments” based on assets at current property market values, at current interest rates. To define it as similar to “quantitative easing” in any sense, makes NO SENSE.

        It is actually a stablizing and necessary move for the reasons explained. ( the only correct one, so far by the FED )

        The FED holds the debt….the taxpayers are the debtors, supposedly but they ( the FED ) have to collect it……..and that was MY POINT…….first, they can’t do that if everything falls apart……..and they can’t stop THAT, unless they eat the losses…….which they are going to have to do at some point, because the good olde days aren’t coming back………but they do have a “problem” and “competition”, because neither central banks, nor governments are in control any longer………so it’s a tricky problem which the FED understands, but the collective “corrupted idiots” in government do not.

        This is the only game in town, so the “corruptors” will need to wake up to this too……..and take a few hits…….or it is game over for everyone. Also, while they have taken great pains to do the “corrupting” they can’t be certain that things will stay “corrupted”, although, and as long as “government is the problem”, they will be safe.

        As for being a taxpayer….it is not a requirement, but that is a just “another idea” which most people are oblivious to……..or choose to be……from FEAR, mostly but it also requires them to DO something, so they avoid learning how…….which requires no effort at all.

        “The direction the country needs to take economically is another matter … and there is no consensus or understanding on this”

        I beg to differ. Try Austrian Economics, simple, clear, and singularly responsible and accountable. Leaders of this school have correctly predicted the past 50 years of economic trends with significantl accuracy. You can do your own research, or if you like, I can provide you with additional information.

        No need to beg, but since economics is invalid, a specific school is irrelevant, although which such a wonderful ( although rather short ) predictive track record, they should all be rich…….Keynes lost and then made a fortune on speculation before his Theory surfaced in 1936.

        Hard currency has never failed a society, fiat currency has always failed.

        There is never an Egyptian, Assyrian, Persian, Greek or Roman around when you need them………but this all comes down to “historical perspective” which we apparently do not share.

        Hard Money ( coinage ) doesn’t show up until 800-600 B.C. and it’s primary function was to pay armies for conquest….before that, everything was on credit…….with the “same problems”….the solution to which was…..debt forgiveness. ( the only game in town or no game at all )

        The underlying problem with economics and economies is that they are based on “money”…….which has no valid claim to value, nor is it and appropriate measure of positive contribution, benefit to society or success…….and as a store of value or wealth, it naturally lends itself to “usury”………which will destroy any “economy” eventually.

        This understanding of history is more detailed in the Debt book previously mentioned and Power, Inc………which covers europe specifically from 1100 or so, forward.
        Now I can’t obviously do the cited volumes justice……..but they provide the understanding, evidence and support for my positions, both historically and economically………..and why I have no particular reverence for “historical claims” to knowledge of any kind, since it has become clear to me, that “progress” was simply serendipitous and a natural expansion of our biological/genetic nature……..for which there was a generous margin of error.

        We no longer have that “margin of error”…….and this REALITY is just now making itself known………so even ideas of fifty years ago are useless……….250 is absurd.
        We are essentially starting from scratch which requires the dismantling of all mythologies…….and that is not in our nature, in general……….and given that there are so many of them, and the obvious resistance that is in evidence to even the simplest of exercises……the prospects are not promising.

        Hopefully I have answered your questions within the narrow framework intended by my post………whether you decide to read the recommended volumes is up to you……..you should not be bored, but if you are, you can always come back and yell at me……..

    • RK

      TC says, “I believe Romney and Ryan have real plans to rectify the problem that has been long in the offing. Romney and Ryan both seem to understand that fiat money is a huge problem”. Romney and Ryan are nothing but the destroyer of middle class.

      I think repub voters live in a fools hell because repub politicians have ideology only and no plans, and that ideology is so destructive that repub voters do not realize that the branch they are sitting on is being cut by their repub politicians right in front of their eyes the repub voters do not even realize it.

      I bet weather democrates or repubs who ever comes to power, in 5-7 years time, there will be only two class of people left in USA, (1) super rich (2) poor and super poor.

      • Warrior

        Oh, and don’t forget the 3rd class of a hell of lot more dead voters if this fraud is allowed to continue.

    • libertarian58

      In response to GALT, everything you say is true as long as we stay in the paradigm of counterfeit/fiat/debt economics created by the FED. But this paradigm is the REAL problem and it doesn’t look like any solution is in sight by either puppet president.

      • GALT

        True enough, but Romney would actually accelerate the possibilities of collapse and things would get worse for everyone even if he managed to avoid making the dreams of preppers and gold bugs come true on his watch……..

        Certain other factors are coming into play which may make the necessary shift possible, and since nothing will actually improve until this occurs, eventually the change will be forced………….but we need time…………so slow, steady and stagnant may not be a welcome future………but it beats the alternative…….

      • Deerinwater

        “.but we need time…………so slow, steady and stagnant may not be a welcome future………but it beats the alternative…” Not happy news but a reality well worth repeating.

        The sky is not falling while it does look gloomy at times, regardless who is elected our leader, 2013, it will be a better year as we continue to go though this transformation process and come to grips with the need for changes that this forum frames so well.

        This change can be made fast or slow, while I don’t believe it’s in governments or the money peoples best interest to blow holes in their own boat and sink everyone with them or eating the goose that lays the golden egg.

        The truth being, gold is only worth some people are willing to pay for it, while the last apple could be worth more. Gold affords us a point of reference for an accounting purposes.

        In every life some rain must fall.

        Great write Mr. Myers and great posting by all (except for you Warrior as you speak of killing)

    • Jon

      I don’t think Romney, if elected, will prevent the huge crash which is coming. He may postpone it, and possibly even lessen the impact a little. It is likely too late for even Ron Paul to prevent what everyone in Washington has worked so hard over the last 30 years+ to create. Keep your powder dry.

      • http://www.ovlg.com/blog/author/marc/ Marc Brown

        Well Jon, now when the republican candidate Mitt Romney has not been elected, what do you feel? Will Obama, as re-elected and re-trusted by the American mass, be able to prevent the huge crash you are talking about? But what if Obama, not only postpone the crash, rather successfully prevent it? Can we trust Mr. President with our resources once again? I know a sovereign nation can’t be insolvent…in that case what sort of crash you are talking about? And yes, like everyone, I too have no clue what is going to happen. So I’m keeping my powder dry!!

  • czman75

    The current administration has no intention of rebuilding anything! This Country is already on its way down because of ovomit and that is exactly what he wants. I know this is a rather lame observations/comment, but I risk saying anything else…except, that it is time to water the Tree of Liberty!

  • http://gekruckeberg.com gekruckeberg

    Carter had the inlation rate jacked up to 35%. Reagan brought it down to 17% and Bush II brought it down to 12%, which is where it is now. Don’t underestimate the power of the “invisible hand” if it’s enencumbered by taxes and regulations.

    gekruckeberg.com.

  • dan

    No worries…soon we’ll all be Zimbabwe millionaires

  • JC

    Hyper inflation is in the works and has been for a long time. Both parties are allowing, and in fact are very much involved with the slow but sure destruction of the dollar. All this in order to create a replica of the Eurozone that involves Canada, Mexico and the US. Once we understand that the Global Bankers (Elitists) are busy trying to control and enslave the planet it’s easy to see that their job is much easier with fewer currencies controlling more people. It’s a subversive act of war.
    SO! Unless we abolish the Federal Reserve we can look forward to a North American currency and Globalist Government. Our nation’s sovereignty is at stake here and unless people wake up to this fact…we’re fuc*%! no matter who you vote for.

    • Warrior

      And why do you think the doj is lobbing all these lawsuits at the states. The goal is to break down all sovereignty.

      • JC

        Absolutely right.

  • Louis Lemieux

    When the levels of existing money and debt are collapsing, I think it’s a good idea for the government to inject more money and debt. This does not increase anything, it just replaces what was lost. What was injected can later be withdrawn by raising interest rates once the economy has recovered. This stabilizes the system by balancing what the private sector does. I wish we had more cooperation in Congress to fix the economy.

    • Vigilant

      Your Keynesian take on the problem is precisely what’s drawing this country into an irreversible maelstrom.

      It’s truly unbelievable that you would say “I think it’s a good idea for the government to inject more money and debt” when those precise actions have put us on the brink of collapse. You must be a firm devotee of Cloward & Piven principles.

      And what sort of doublethink is your premise that “the levels of existing money and debt are collapsing?” Both have SKYROCKETED out of control; they’re not collapsing, they’re burgeoning!

      • Louis Lemieux

        I’m confident the economy will improve in the years ahead and our deficit will go down no matter who wins in November.

  • Flashy

    Interesting article. Relies on assumptions which are arguable, and is simplistic in laying out the concepts, but does relate one view of the direction of the country and the economy.

    Taking one statement, it gives forth the view if one is negative and believes the Empire is dying. “The United States is in a permanent state of decline that neither candidate can, or is even willing to try to, fix.”

    If that is the view one has, then leave. because the only reason one would be staying is to pick over a carcass and, without want or desire to mend, repair and go forth in advancing as a society and nation, then one is a barrier and the causation.

    i’d use the analogy of the current football season. Already, though only a few weeks old, some teams which had high hopes and expectations have lost the season. Teams which should prevail on the field will lose…because they will step onto the turf with a ‘losing attitude’ and the only thoughts of players are to pad their stats for their own reasons post season. Team work, winning…all have taken a second place. That team has lost before the game begins. Heck…take the jets this past Sunday. they have a quarterback with talent (Sanchez). unquestionably he has talent. But the team itself has a losing mindset. Tebow came in…three plays, not throwing a pass, and you could quite literally see the team pick up. Charging, tossing their bodies in pushing forward. The entire mindset and “feel” .. the momentum…you could see it changing. Tebow gets taken out…it was all over but the Fat Lady singing from that point onward.

    Without question, Sanchez has the better arm, the most talent. Absolutely no question. But Tebow brings the “tude”… the team responds.

    Same with this nation. You have that defeatist attitude that we are in decline..go home and sit in the corner. All you’re going to do is pick over the carcass you create and work towards creating.

  • nc

    Mr. Myers, how much will your priceless apple be worth if you hold it until the “rot” sets in? Then that nickle might just be a good price. This is a large country with all of the problems of a large country> “People” are the problem and we are getting more of them, especially “poor” people. They are not going away> The problem must be addressed before terminal “rot” sets in! NOTICE TO MR. ROMNEY: iF ELECTED IT IS YOUR JOB TO “WORRY’ about them! SO IT WOULD BE REAL NICE TO KNOW WHAT THAT PLAN IS!! YOU HAVE TOLD US YOUR PLAN THAT WILL BENEFIT THE RICH! NOW TELL US YOUR PLAN TO BENEFIT THE NON RICH!!!!!i A TAX BREAK TO BEBEFIT THE NONRICH? bush did that and the non rich lost jobs, homes and life savings!! COULD YOU CONSIDER ANOTHER PLAN THAN THE ONE THAT DIDN’T WORK??
    t is the job of every president to not let our people die in the streetS>! It is a more primary job than SPENDING LARGE SUMS TO SAVE ISRAEL’S ASS!

    The market value of the apple is how conservative Republicans see the world! How sad!

    • GRusling

      I’m not sure where you get your ideas, but you need to take them back and demand a “refund” of whatever you paid for them, because they’re worthless and not very intelligent. While Republicans certainly don’t have many answers (most are also Progressive in their thinking) it’s a cinch that “TAX-CUTS” by anyone did not create this problem, because no country has EVER failed due to a government which was TOO SMALL! Time after time, throughout history they HAVE failed because they were TOO BIG and ate up the substance of The People, destroying themselves from within. That’s precisely what we see happening in Washington DC today.

      Does Romney/Ryan have a plan? I certainly don’t know, but at least they have some small understanding of what the problem is and they WANT to reverse the downward spiral. That’s a lot more than we can say for the usurper-in-chief who occupies the oval office today and keeps trying to find a higher speed to take us all to hell in a hand-basket…

      • Flashy

        “no country has EVER failed due to a government which was TOO SMALL! ”

        But history is replete where nations have failed because of wealth inequality created the bed of revolutionary fervor where one class was overwhelming in controlling the majority of the people.

        The policies of cutting taxes for the wealthy, and squeezing the Middle and Lower classes to alone bear the burdens in taxes and demands of the State has been ongoing and accelerating since the Reagan years of 1981 onward. Only the brief respite provided by Clinton has this war against the lower classes been slowed and the wealth redistribution halted.

        It’s time for the Middle and lower Classes to regain their seat at the table, end the welfare for the rich programs and subsidies, and slow the giveaway of government largesse bestowed year after year upon the wealthy elite. Then, and only then, will this nation begin to heal from the cancer Reagan infected this nation with.

      • http://wildeyguns.com The Christian American

        You don’t increase the value of anything by making a lot more of them. Economics 101. You can’t consume more than you produce without getting into trouble. Romney thinks he can put value to the dollar at the point of a gun. That’s he wants to increase our “offensive” capability.

      • nc

        GRUSLING, WE ARE GOING TO GET SMALLER AS THE POPULATION GETS LARGER?? LESSENING THE ATTEMPT TO EASE THE SUFFERING OF OUR GROWING POOR CLASS WILL MAKE US A SMALLER GOVERNMENT WITH FEWER PROBLEMS TO ATTEND? A BIGGER MILITARY WILL MKE US SMALLER? A SAFER ISRAEL WILL MAKE US SMALLER???

        You hope Romney/Ryan have a plan? We hoped that bush and the Republican platform “plan” would make for a stronger economy and less debt like was promised by bush and the Heritage Foundation> The republican controlled congress gave him the whole ball of wax and he gave us what even Paul Ryan called a very weak economy by the time he left! Romney with the same platform is our way out????

        Hopefully the 47% that has been take off the Romney “worry” list and the women who would like to control their own bodies like the big boys will save us from another bush/republican platform. Over 70% of Americans did not approve of that performance in the end!WONDER WHY???

      • momo

        Flashy says: “The policies of cutting taxes for the wealthy, and squeezing the Middle and Lower classes to alone bear the burdens in taxes and demands of the State has been ongoing and accelerating since the Reagan years of 1981 onward. Only the brief respite provided by Clinton has this war against the lower classes been slowed and the wealth redistribution halted.”

        Sorry, flashman, you’re full of crap. The tax burden on the top one percent has gone up since 1980. The top one percent paid the following:
        1980 19.05% of total tax burden
        1990 25.13% of total tax burden
        2000 37.42% of total tax burden
        2007 40.42% of total tax burden.

        That’s 1.4 million taxpayers carrying 40.42% of the tax burden. Meanwhile the poor, who earn $32,000 or less pay 2.89% of the taxes. Not quite the “cancer” you make it out to be.

  • Nick

    As a sage said recently “The ship has hit the iceberg” and no matter who the new capitan is we are up to sh…. creek without a paddle. The good news is that we may pay our debt with devalued dollars like the Germans did after the WWI.

    Pancho Villa

    • Realist

      Well then, would someone in power order the fed to rush a print of 16 billion dollars to balance our national debt? Gidderdun!!!

      • Realist

        oops! make that 16 trillion! a small down payment to retire the debt to the banksters.

  • Polski

    Obama is horrible and Romney is terrible. Or is it Obama is terrible and Romney is horrible. And no, there is NO “none of the above” available.

    • Inventor64

      It’s just the Big “R” or the Big”D” and no other choice. Have you stopped “Heaving” yet???
      I’m having a nightmare and I can’t wake up.

  • Flashy

    “What do you think this apple is worth?”

    Whatever someone is willing to pay for it. Nothing less, nothing more.

    • Inventor64

      He that grows his own apples has to defend it so some of the 48% on their “Ploomage”
      won’t steal all the apples. Same problem with owning anything, you have to guard it.

      So 12/21/12 the end of the people, we didn’t work out so well.

  • http://wildeyguns.com The Christian American

    Melt down of the dollar simply means printing lots more of them, counterfeit one’s to boot. Say the alchemist dream came true and they could turn dirt into gold, what would gold be worth? This is exactly what the government and federal reserve are doing. Putting either one of these men into OUR White House is like pouring gas on the fire. Here’s the dangerous game they are playing. Both of them have endorsed using “Black Gold” ,oil, as the backer of the dollar to open doors to new found wealth. The paper we’ve got in our pockets is only worth the commodity we can redeem it with and there ain’t no commodities left to redeem them with. Enter black gold. They plan on having everybody trading with oil only do it with dollars. Iraq and Libya bawked and look what it got them. Iran and Russia won’t play the game either and we know what propaganda is doing to them.

    To make it more interesting, these counterfeit dollars the Fed is turning out are in reality NOTES. Federal Reserve Notes. These notes create an obligation on the part of the American people to pay those notes back to the Federal Reserve. They give us paper, we pay back with our property. They print paper, we give them our commodities. Is it to late to turn to Ron Paul?

    • Realist

      Yes sir, it is way too late to turn to Ron Paul. The establishment saw to his demise long ago.

  • http://none Mikee B

    With Obama there is absolutely NO chance of the problem getting fixed.
    With Romney there is a possibility that something MIGHT get fixed.
    So what is your choice?? Use your head. While most of the article is true
    what is your solution Mr. Myers?? Everybody already knows what your are
    saying and have for a very long time. Keep banging your head against the wall.
    It seems to be working.

    • Realist

      If Mitt would only repeal those Executive orders and the NDAA and others that tromp on the rights of America’s citizens. I would have a lot more respect for the man but his handlers would not permit that.

      • Chester

        Realist, IF Mitt COULD repeal all those laws with a wave of his magic wand, this country would no longer even be a democratic republic, but a kingdom, with Mitt as the almighty King with his God given right to rule. First you repeal all the laws you don’t agree with, then you issue new rules with the force of law, simply because YOU are the one and only lawgiver. Kingdom or dictatorship, not a lot of difference when the “elected” president takes it on himself to overturn laws passed by congress. Are you suggesting perhaps Mitt should appoint himself king after the election, assuming, that is, that he wins?

      • Realist

        Chester says:
        September 19, 2012 at 10:40 am

        Realist, IF Mitt COULD repeal all those laws with a wave of his magic wand, this country would no longer even be a democratic republic, but a kingdom,
        _____________________________________________________________________
        So, Chester you think that an executive order is a law? Remember the Bill, introduced and passed in congress and Senate? That is a law! Kings declare their will with the likes
        of an executive order..wanna guess how many has been penned in the last 4 years?

    • Flashy

      Hmmm…given that President Obama has made huge strides in setting a strong base for our future and in attacking the Great Recession bequeathed by the Conservatives, your statement that there is no chance under President Obama is ….questionable.

      I suppose those with short sightedness would say a quickie repair job of wrapping duct tape around the broken parts is sufficient…but to do a good job and not create a rinky dink machine breaking down time after time requires a huge amount of time to the foundation before the parts that can be seen put in.

      The GOP promises a return to what created the mess…a return to redistributing the wealth from the Middle and Lower classes to the Upper Elite, burdening the Middle Class with the costs, socializing the risk and privatizing the profits. In other words, driving this nation further downward.

      Most intelligent people prefer moving forward, fixing it right, and creating a stronger, healthier more robust Middle Class..the REAL job creators.

      • Realist

        Flashy Says:(in part)
        The GOP promises a return to what created the mess…a return to redistributing the wealth from the Middle and Lower classes to the Upper Elite, burdening the Middle Class with the costs, socializing the risk and privatizing the profits. In other words, driving this nation further downward.
        ______________________________________________________________________
        Has hope and change done anything to change that at all?…even slowing it? Heck no!
        It has been business as usual and the jobless record has re-enforced every thing the GOP is feared to do. No Hope, just loose change! The lobbyists own as much of him as they do the GOP pigs that the RNC appoints. You Democrats should have at least produced another candidate who gives a little more care about this nation’s sovernty.

      • momo

        Flashy says:
        September 19, 2012 at 11:12 am
        Hmmm…given that President Obama has made huge strides in setting a strong base for our future and in attacking the Great Recession bequeathed by the Conservatives, your statement that there is no chance under President Obama is ….questionable.

        Huge strides? Strong base? The only thing Obama has done is issue more debt, now his partner in crime, helicopter Ben, with QE to infinity is going to make the dollar wothless. This country, where it is now, reminds me of the Weimar Republic. Pretty soon you’ll be wanting to be paid at the end of each day or hour so you can go buy what you need before the value of the dollar drops some more.

        The whole rotten edifice is a house of cards, just waiting to fall down.

      • deerinwater

        Quote , “Has hope and change done anything to change that at all?…even slowing it? Heck no!”

        Sure, of course there has been but that these many improvements are not very supportive to your briefs, so you refuse to acknowledge them. I could list them of you like? But if you find little reason to support your statements why should I bother support mine?

    • Inventor64

      The problem is that Obama also know as Berry Sortoro is the Islamic choice to make us all kiss the Ayatollah. Get the picture??

      • deerinwater

        I guess not. ~ can you give me a vowel?

  • Jefferson Thomas

    In the history of mankind how many currencies have failed? Answer….all of them.

    If people and governments keep repeating the same mistakes, what makes people think that there will be a different result? It is madness that people can’t see the simple cause and effect of this subject.

    Proverbs 11:1 A false balance is abomination to the Lord: but a just weight is his delight.

    It is an old story my friends.

    • Realist

      Amen! to that.

    • http://wildeyguns.com The Christian American

      Under the Constitution, all we would use as our medium of exchange would be silver and gold. Paper, if any was issued, would be receipts for silver and gold on deposit in banks and the U.S.Treaury. The amount stipulated on the paper would have to be backed in silver and gold.

      Bank fraud started when banks issued receipts without backing. Today, it’s legitimate. Fraud is legalized. If we had stuck with the way the founders intended, twenty $20.00 dollar gold pieces would buy a $37,000.00 automobile. Prices would go down with the genius of industry. The price of gold would be left to the gold market. Some would be used as backing of currency and some would be used in industry.

      • RichE

        How would you govern M2?

  • LC

    I would recommend anyone who would like to know more about our current recession and insight into the next ten years read ‘the great depression’ found on wikipedia. Some very similar actions have taken place. Kind of to the point that what has happened in the past 5 years was taken right out of the 1929 playbook.Or it could just be a coincedental cycled reoccurence. In either case we can research and know what is to happen in the next decade.
    Odd that we find ourselves at war with countries that have returned to the gold standard. Gives me a new reason to believe why we are waring in the first place. Until all get back on paper currency the recession will continue just as it did in ’29.

    • http://wildeyguns.com The Christian American

      The depression occured AFTER the Federal Reserve was in place. When the Federal Reserve orchestrates the next one, they will own everything and most of the rest of the world. The Federal Reserve NOTES will called at heir pleasure.

      • LC

        Yes the FED was in place in ’29. Point I was making is that Britain and others who were operating on paper currency prior to ’29, switched to gold just before the crash happened. We are seeing the same today. Gold is trading high because gov’ts around the world are trying to back up their currencies.(inflow of gold reserves) When gold soars paper deflates. I also read that there are many Arab countries moving away from euro’s and demanding gold as currency (part of the reason for war). The historical gold pricing charts show very high climbs in prices prior to recessions, in all cases. I doubt this is just a coincidence. History is repeating either by natural business cycle or is being manipulated. The only thing that brought the US out of the great depression was the gov’ts of the world all returning to a no reserves type of paper currency. Which in turn deflated gold and trading in the world went back to “here’s my fake currency for your fake currency.” and everyone was happy again. When all are ok with money being worthless it can be business as usual. But when some demand true value, the house of cards falls.

      • Inventor64

        A little side item. When any other country wants gold for their U.S. Dollars, they get it, we don’t. If you own a Gold or Silver or Platinum mine, the U.S. government takes half of the total production up front and taxes the other half. So you get 30% or less of all your hard work. just about what most people get when the governments get done “PILLAGING” us to Death.

    • http://wildeyguns.com The Christian American

      Read zeitgeist.com, particularly the part on the Federal Reserve. It’s the most informative piece I’ve ever read.

      • JC

        Aaron Russo’s : “America: Freedom to Fascism” is bar none the best expose on the Fed other than the Griffin book “Creature From Jekyll Island” zeitgeist is pretty good too as is thrivemovie.com. Any education at all is better than none. :)

      • LC

        Agreed, we all know the FED is and always has been a terrible choice. The Rothchilds and the like are firmly planted not only in our system but the entire world. The big question is, How do we change it? There are plenty who offer better systems or at least therotically better systems for world economy. All of which doesn’t matter one bit until we dethrone what is already in place. How many voices would have to be in unison before leaders hear? 4,5,6, BILLION???? They will have killed most of us off by then. What else ya got?

      • JC

        LC…they will have killed most of us off? They who? and how?
        I’m well aware of what you refer to, but they have zero chance of success.
        We are too many and too well armed.

        As for what’s next monetarily? Hard to say, but I hope it’s a currency anchored by a measurable commodity that establishes its value…not a printing press.

      • LC

        JC,
        I’ll assume that you have heard of the NWO and U.N.AGENDA 21. Search WORLD DEPOPULATION. There is plenty and assorted on theories of means and evidence of, at the very least, a formed plan or arrangement.
        Personally I don’t think that the American citizens have enough fire power to hold off an all out assault by our government for a couple of reasons.
        1) Division. There will be a huge division just lke the civil war. So whatever guns we have is now split in half.
        2) Government controlled forces will shut down all transportation and communication.
        3) They have tanks, planes, drones, HARRP, EMP’s, bombs, bunker bombs, heat seeking missles, grenades, machine guns, chemical warfare, intel, at least half of all servicemen, police, all state militias, CIA, FBI, TSA, HS, UN patrols, coast guard, national guard,etc…
        4) Agenda 21 is agreement of world leaders,rich,and elite. So multiply every resource the US gov’t has by 2 maybe 3.
        I could go on, however, since they are already ‘treating’ our water to keep us sick, I think the only thing they would need to do, if they really wanted to depopulize the world, is poison the water systems. Within a couple of weeks half the worlds population would be gone. Most of the rest would be the countries that are already short on water and starving.
        200 million guns won’t fire themselves.

      • JC

        LC, I’m very well informed about these things and yes they are real.
        But I don’t see American military personnel getting involved except to maybe fall out of ranks and join their families. I do not believe they will fire on fellow Americans.
        And how many doors do you think the UN boys will want to kick in when there’s a one in three chance of being shot in the face? 80+ million Americans are armed. A good percentage of those are hunter’s, meaning snipers. I don’t think the UN boys will get very far.
        We’re on the same page, I’m just a lot more optimistic about it.
        Arm yourselves, inform your neighbors and develop community.

      • LC

        Personally I don’t like the idea of war. Unfortunately I don’t see voting as much of an answer considering that the established gov’t and their handlers are so intertwined. If we were to get a constitutional representative in I fear Bilderbergs would get to him anyway. I think they got to Dr.Paul. My preference alike to Washington’s move across the Delaware. Never seen it coming. Having sniper’s for friends is fantastic, especially since all those we would like to get rid of won’t be any where in sight, if it comes down to that. Too bad we couldn’t all agree to stage some false flag reverse move on these jag holes and send them all running, locking em out, once their gone. Washington’s not that big. All that talk talk talk must make them thirsty. Why wait for the UN to come knocking and let them hide? Enough know that it’s not going to get better under the current system as corrupt as it is. We see the signs and the slide into a martial law/communist state. We know that the next pres won’t be the answer, so exactly what are we hoping/waitng for?

      • JC

        No one likes the idea of war. And I’m not advocating one. BUT! Like most people I will defend my life, my family, my property, my community…my nation.
        And if the elites want to hide, let them hide…forever. ;-)

  • http://gravatar.com/cbgard Carlucci

    Obama and Romney are both boot licking “establishment” status quo candidates. You could even call them meat puppets. They are there to do the will of the true masters who rule the world – the federal reserve and all of the dark forces in cahoots with them. That is why nothing ever really changes no matter who is in office. That is why the lame stream media covers the same white-washed stories and/or cover ups on the three major networks. That is why Jesus Christ went nuts on the money changers in the temple, as they were doing the same thing to people then that the federal reserve has done and is doing to the American people.

    The Doctors Paul and a few others are the only voices crying out in the dark warning the American people about what is really going on with the Fed.

    “It is well enough that people of the nation do not understand our banking and monetary system, for if they did, I believe there would be a revolution before tomorrow morning.”
    Henry Ford

    “Thinking is the hardest work there is, which is probably the reason why so few engage in it.” Henry Ford

  • RichardS

    Great thread. Especially love to see people ignoring Fashy.

  • uvuvuv

    get out your calculators, kids, it’s time for fun with math! first, how much did that obama stimulus come to? 787 billion? right! and what was the civilain labor force both employed and unemployed at that time? yes johnny, 155 million? right! and what does that come to per worker? lois? $5000? right! and where would we be now if that was actually paid out to everyone? 4% unemployment and mandatory overtime? right! so what was that an example of? trickle down economics? right!

    • Inventor64

      That’s “Tinkle” down economics. Quietly close the government, and see if anyone would notice unless the news media told us it was closed.

      • Karolyn

        Oh, you can bet everybody would know immediately as they went to Federal office bldgs. and found them closed and also when they checked their bank accounts and their SS wasn’t deposited.

  • Louis Lemieux

    The supply of dollars has to go up as Gross Domestic Product increases (1.7% August ). Without the Fed how are those dollars going to be fed ( no pun intended ) into the mainstream public?

    • Louis Lemieux

      I guess no libertarian can answer me!

      • Nadzieja Batki

        They answered you but it seems that you don’t like the answer.

      • JC

        You’ve asked a completely inane question taylored to elicit a specific response.
        Why would anyone try and answer something so obvious?

    • Louis Lemieux

      No wonder libertarians will never get anywhere! No one can really answer the question?

      • JC

        Your problem is that you are still working in terms of Keynesian Economics.
        No Fed…No Keynesian Economics… no expansionist economic policies…get it yet?
        To Libertarians…you’re asking an absurd question that shows you haven’t got a clue.

      • JC

        “What is needed here is a return to the Constitution of the United States. We need to have a complete divorce of Bank and State. The old struggle that was fought out here in Jackson’s day must be fought over again… The Federal Reserve Act should be repealed and the Federal Reserve Banks, having violated their charters, should be liquidated immediately. Faithless Government officers who have violated their oaths of office should be impeached and brought to trial. Unless this is done by us, I predict that the American people, outraged, robbed, pillaged, insulted, and betrayed as they are in their own land, will rise in their wrath and send a President here who will sweep the money changers out of the temple.”
        – Louis McFadden
        (1876-1936) US Congressman (R-PA) (1915-1935), Chairman of House Banking and Currency Committee. Poisoned in 1936.
        Source: Speech in Congress, June 10, 1932

      • JC

        “To combat depression by a forced credit expansion is to attempt to cure the
        evil by the very means which brought it about; because we are suffering from a
        misdirection of production, we want to create further misdirection — a
        procedure which can only lead to a much more severe crisis as soon as the
        credit expansion comes to an end.”
        – Friedrich August von Hayek
        (1899-1992), Nobel Laureate of Economic Sciences 1974

  • libertarian58

    NOTHING in this country will ever change until the world’s largest counterfeiting ring (FED) is abolished… EVER! It will just keep heading toward collapse. Neither “president” will fix it because both are installed as puppets.

    • JC

      Yep, exactly right.
      It’s the elephant in the room no one wants to talk about.

  • http://alsina846.wordpress.com Proud American

    I believe that the economy will crash, it has been set up on purpose by pappy Bush whose talked about the New Word Order and his crony of a son Bush Jr. and now this Kenyan the puppet, these people belong to special interest groups which includes banksters and you be surprise many people that we all know to well in government. The economy will crash and we will have a global monetary system which I believe it will be a cashless sociality by the RIFD Chip. This government knows that if they keep printing the economy will eventually crash it is only a matter of time. Do you research on the New World Order, the info is out their on the internet.

    • Inventor64

      Actually a “GPS” chip. That way they know where you are at all times. Think that little dashboard device is nifty?? The military version knows where you are plus or minus 1/1000 of one inch. Just wiggle your finger and they know how many wiggles you did.
      Can you say “1984″???

      • JC

        Can you say Remington? ;-)

  • chuckb

    `this is a bunch of `bs, it matters not which president is elected, this is talk the bolsheviks love to hear. it will matter to the highest degree, we are not whipped yet, however, if we leave barry in office this november, you better go down to the dock and buy yourself a one way ticket to somewhere.
    this country isn’t defeated yet, the last four years they started shoveling dirt in our face, are you going to lay down and let them cover you? we don’t know what romney will do, but, i bet he isn’t ready to give up his wealth to the socialist and i feel he’s patriotic enough to do whatever is necessary to secure our economy, we cannot go on with a few carrying the tax burden and the majority sucking on the government teat, this is how communist control is festered. this is what barry is all about. if we have to be taxed, everyone that lives in this country should pay their fair share, not just the 1%, we are listening to the most corrupt news media in our history, they are owned by this administration, they are the goebbels of modern day. we are in danger of losing this country. this illegal immigration wasn’t for not, thanks to this administration and the s.e.i.u. most of these illegals are geared for socialism, this is the way they think and this is a force that will be voting this november..

    • RichE

      You make it sound like Berry put the US on the road to perdition.

  • James Corbin

    As long as the money keeps getting printed we will go down the tubes!!!!!

  • FreedomFighter

    Your Vote Won’t Save The Buck

    I believe whatever solutions they have can result only in a larger Federal deficit and the continued meltdown of the dollar.

    This will be used to rape the natural resources of the United States and its people, to buy up all hard assets and consolidate power into the hands of a select few

    End the FED and back to the constitution.

    Laus Deo
    Semper Fi

  • Murph

    @ Flashy

    “… it gives forth the view if one is negative and believes the Empire is dying … If that is the view one has, then leave. because the only reason one would be staying is to pick over a carcass and, without want or desire to mend, repair and go forth in advancing as a society and nation, then one is a barrier and the causation.”

    Hey Flashy, how ’bout you leave, and let those of us who accept reality get these idiots out of office and fix it. Your “two party” solution is the problem bud. There is an answer, but neither Romney nor Obama are it.

    “i’d use the analogy of the current football season. Already, though only a few weeks old, some teams which had high hopes and expectations have lost the season…”

    I left out the majority of the statement, but it is an excellent point … for me. THIS IS NOT A FOOTBALL GAME! Unfreaking believable. I can hardly fathom that you think your post has any merit. Get out of my country, your a cancer. For myself and my house, we will fight for freedom, we will fight for life, we will fight for liberty, we will fight for the pursuit of happiness. against all threats, both foreign, and domestic. The DEMS and GOP are domestic threats. If you can’t see that reality, you’re blind, and I may have just wasted my time, but my grand kids deserve all I can do to help the country I fought for. If that means I confront you and your diametrically opposed cronies from the other side of the aisle, so be it, your all the same anyway, one will kill us from the right, one will kill us from the left.

    And a final word of advice; Don’t you dare ever suggest that I, or my brothers, leave the country we offered our lives to protect. If you were in front of me and made a statement like that, I promise, you would never offer such a rude insult within my sphere again.

  • Louis Lemieux

    Anyone who believes the US can function today with the same amount of dollars the country had 50, 30, 20 or 10 years ago knows hardly anything about economy. Without the Fed, how do you get in the American public those extra dollars needed due to economic expansion?

  • Pingback: Your Vote Won’t Save The Buck : Personal Liberty Digest™ « shofar37

  • Strighttothepoint!!!!!

    Read “Aftershock”It will make it all clear!!!Trust me(smile)

  • Carey Johnson

    Yes, this is going to take time. Reagan didn’t see results until Clinton’s second term. It is time to cut up the credit card.

    • Linda

      Already cut up the credit card years ago when Obama made all those changes.

  • Hey You

    In walking into a store, today, a woman seated near the entrance shouted at me, “Obama or Romney”? I looked a bit non plussed, so she said, “We’re taking a poll, Obama or Romney”?

    I wasn’t sure that I cared, but managed to say, “None of the above”. Wonder if that reply was added to the poll.

  • Strighttothepoint 2012

    Yes!!It was added to Obama!!A no vote for Romney is a vote for Obama(or,whatever his name is!!)Please keep that in mind when you vote,or not vote!!!But just remmber,anybody would be better than Obama(Real name,Please???,unless Their a Dem too!!.

  • Strighttothepoint 2012

    It may be too late to save the dollar,But we may still have a choice of either a”Crash-landing,Or a “Soft-landing”!!That choice will be made in Nov.I prefer a “soft landing”Thats why I’m voting for Romney!!Please read “AFTERSHOCK!!!!!!!!”

  • Strighttothepoint 2012

    PS Good luck,And May god bless America(again)!!!!

  • Pingback: At The Height Of The Banker Orchestrated Crisis: 70% Of Tax Payer’s Money From Rothschild’s Federal Reserve Went To Foreign Banks ~ While Americans Slipped Into Poverty! | Political Vel Craft

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