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Who Will Keep Our Food Safe?

September 15, 2011 by  

Any conversation about the superfluity of the Federal government or its legion of agencies will invariably turn to this question: “Who will keep our food safe?” It is as sure as Godwin’s law — except in this case, the fascists have, inexplicably, become the good guys.

Apparently, the Food and Drug Administration and the U.S. Department of Agriculture have a stellar and unblemished track record of keeping the populace safe from tainted food and dangerous medicines. It is a measure of the success of State propaganda that such a glaring untruth is so commonly seen as axiomatic and beyond question.

One of the great challenges for advocates of a truly free society is to present its vision of how certain functions of government would be replaced by the free market and voluntary cooperation. We are no less presumptuous than advocates of central planning if we dogmatically claim a comprehensive vision of how things will be in our “libertopia.”

As Murray Rothbard pointed out, the libertarian’s primary task is to:

… offer a few guidelines on how markets might develop where they are now prevented or restricted from developing; but he can do little more than point the way toward freedom, to call for government to get out of the way of the productive and ever-inventive energies of the public as expressed in voluntary market activity.

While we cannot be about the business of substituting one group of central planners for “our sort” of central planners, the nature of our argument behooves us to offer a vision of freedom — not what it must be, but what it could be.

As it pertains to the role of agencies like the FDA and USDA, we need look no further than the sustainable- and organic-food movement to see how the free market makes up for government failures; and it is no great leap to imagine the same market forces supplanting the public option altogether.

Perhaps ironically, it is luminaries of the modern movement toward “sustainable” food, generally confirmed statists, who furnish the crux of our argument.

There is a general consensus among those who are deeply devoted to such things that the USDA Certified Organic sticker is, at best, a limited indicator of the agricultural practices involved in the production of various foodstuffs. The USDA program is, like any government agency, bloated, inefficient and inconsistent. It is rife with corruption and requires expenditures of time and money that preclude many small farmers from participating.

As a result, many small producers are eschewing the USDA label as simply not worth it. Michael Pollan, an icon in the sustainable-food movement, consistently encourages people to forgo Certified Organic produce for local, reasoning that

It often is organic, even if not certified, and you can always ask the farmer. The cost of organic certification can also become burdensome for a small grower.

The farm that runs the CSA (community-supported agriculture) to which I belong is explicit in its disclosure of its growing methods, all the while explaining that it has not received “official” organic certification. In short, there seems to be a general consensus among advocates of organic and sustainable agriculture that the government seal of approval is limited in its value.

But simply buying everything from a local producer is a difficult proposition for the majority of us; time and geographic concerns prevent this as a viable option. How, then, can the average consumer be assured that he is buying food products that have been produced in a manner that is consistent with his ideals? In the face of the failure of the government’s program, as usual, the free market has provided a solution. And it is in this free-market solution that we see the germ of an idea that could totally supplant the government’s role in the inspection and regulation of agriculture and medicine — and do it more cheaply, efficiently and with far greater accountability.

In the absence of a reliable government organic-food regulatory agency, the market has provided several voluntary options. The Certified Naturally Grown program offers “a non-profit organization offering certification tailored for small-scale, direct-market farmers and beekeepers using natural methods.” It relies on voluntary participation and a peer-review system that is less expensive, less paperwork-intensive and more efficient than the USDA program.

Whole Foods Market has developed its own alternative for certifying certain production techniques for livestock and poultry, through a partnership with an animal-welfare nonprofit.

These are two options, but there are several others. All share a focus on voluntary cooperation between food producers and certifiers and greater accountability to the consumer, as they can’t hide their flaws behind the veil of government immunity. These programs, and others like them, are infinitely scalable, completely voluntary and represent a real challenge to the notion that “only the government can.”

The same organizational structure that has rendered the Certified Organic label obsolete could immediately step in to fill the void left by the absence of the FDA and USDA. Private, third-party certifiers could inspect livestock and produce and affix their seal of approval only when certain standards are met. That the reputations of the inspectors and the farmers are truly on the line would preclude much of the graft and inefficiency that is a constant feature of the current system. Certified, inspected produce would compete with uninspected produce for shelf space and consumer demand. I have focused on the grocery side of the equation, but the same general principles would apply to drug development and regulation.

As Rothbard continues,

No one can predict the number of firms, the size of each firm, the pricing policies, etc., of any future market in any service or commodity. We just know — by economic theory and by historical insight — that such a free market will do the job infinitely better than the compulsory monopoly of bureaucratic government.

–Stefano R. Mugnaini

Stefano R. Mugnaini

is the minister of the Essex Village Church of Christ in Charleston, South Carolina. He holds a master of divinity from Amridge University. View his blog.

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  • s c

    Mr. Mugnaini, thanks for using “apparently” in describing the FDA’s so-called stellar and unblemished track record. That’s roughly equivalent to calling the current W H yahoo a demigod. When the smoke clears and people come to their senses, they’ll realize that the Oz performance is a sham and that it’s time to sift, sort and rip our elected losers ‘a new one.’
    Frankly, I do not trust Uncle Scam to deliver on his legal and moral obligation to keep our food safe. Does anyone know ‘USDA Organic’ really means? It means it’s 95% organic, and the other 5% is known to God but not to the FDA.
    I won’t go into a rant about the FDA and the D of A being bed bunkies
    of whoever is throwing money around, but let’s just say that we’d be better off growing our own food and telling Uncle Scam to cram whatever he can get up his rotund and growing “opinion” (preferably sideways).

    • FreedomFighter

      It will be upto growers, distributors and food processing companies to maintain safety, allways has been. Goverment inspectors dont keep food safe, they monitor those doing the job. At least thats the way I see it.

      Laus Deo
      Semper Fi

      • Sam I am

        In reality, the job of the FDA is to help keep us sick and dependent on big pharma later in life. GMO foods are documented to be way worse than organic foods, but the FDA permits GMOs to proagate everywhere.

        • DaveH

          It is very unlikely that the FDA is trying to make us sick. But I believe it is a certainty that they are protecting Big Pharma and Big Agra at the expense of their smaller less-politically-active competitors, the consumers, and the taxpayers.
          For those who just don’t get it, please read “The Big Ripoff: How Big Business and Big Government Steal Your Money”, and lift their veil to see who they really are before you commit any more of your loyalty:
          http://www.amazon.com/Big-Ripoff-Business-Government-ebook/dp/B000VHTU4E/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1316093280&sr=8-2

          • http://yahoo olerocker

            “Protecting big pharmas”..they pay the FDA millions a year to get their worthless and dangerous drugs on the market…..when was the last cure, 1947, when did we get the great cure…1962, called polio…no money in cures, just treatments…the meds on the market do more harm than good when used for the long term….I am living proof of that..last sample drug given was for triglyserides,high dollar drug, read the fine print…..made of fish oil, with some fillers to makeit a script drug…written on the package…”has not been proven to controll triglyserides” heck of a deal. The doctors are trained in school to buy into this stuff because of the money given the colleges by big pharmas…….

          • denniso

            Yep, another move by the rightwing to push us back to the ‘good old’ days of the 1800′s,when everything worked SO well,when a man was a man,women did what they were told,kids worked 12 hr days and our environment and food supply were left to the ‘mercy’ of any businessman who wanted to do absolutely anything he could to maximize his profit.
            The only reason we didn’t totally ruin the country back then and kill everyone w/ toxins was the very small population and the fact that most people provided their own food…the rightwing can’t accept that those days are long gone,and in many instances that’s a good thing. We have 310 million people now,chemicals and elements they never dreamed of and a global economy on top of all that. Wake up from your dream of living like they did in ‘little house on the prairie’.

          • Dan az

            Dave
            I don’t know but the FDA is allowing sea food on the market from the gulf and claims its safe.All the while people are dying from just the air that is polluted from the chemicals they used to sink the oil to the bottom of the gulf.If they aren’t trying to make us sick I don’t know what is!

          • DaveH

            So much conjecture, Denniso, so very little fact. It must be nice to be a Liberal with no moral constraints preventing you from just making up whatever fabricated facts that will support whatever you want people to believe.

          • Kate8

            DaveH – Look at it this way: The PTB have a goal of reducing world populaton by at least 90%. While they are at it, they are out to get ALL of our money and property.

            It takes $billions every day to keep the medical system/big pharma operational. It is a huge, bloodsucking machine. They need multi-millions of sick people, daily, to keep running. Not only that, but drugs will, in due time (if not sooner), kill you, and most likely suck up all of your assets in the process.

            The FDA is in cahoots with big pharma, protecting them, not us. Big pharma is part of the medical system. They are also out to remove all access to wholesome foods, supplements and natural healthcare.

            All of these groups are owned by the same people.

            If this doesn’t equate to intentionally and deliberately making us sick, I don’t know what does.

          • denniso

            You want a treatise on every issue then get off this site and read some real science/history…maybe you’ll eventually understand things are not as simple as you phony ‘libertarians’ want to believe they are,and that returning to the days of crony capitalism and oligarchy will solve nothing and actually make all the problems we already have,worse.

          • Dan az

            Kate
            I hope you get this I got it this morning.I recognize the voice its Aron Russo.Its a keeper!
            http://www.teslasecret.net/2012survival

          • DaveH

            We are in the days of crony capitalism and oligarchy, and have been for a long time. You would know that, Denniso, if you took your own advice and did some studying.
            Of course, you and I know that you do know that, Denniso. But you benefit from the crony capitalism and oligarchy, so you try to persuade ignorant people who don’t know better so you can continue to feed off the taxpayers and consumers.
            You are the phony, Denniso, and the regulars know that.

          • Kate8

            Dan az – Interesting. Thanks.

            Here’s one you will like, for sure. I’m only part way through, but I’m astonished that it coincides with what I’m studying now.

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AanQ2mY2jjc&feature=relmfu

            So, if all the the universe is conscious, and religions are based on cosmic cycles, collisions, etc., then we have a whole new scenario to look at. There are several possible scenarios within this scenario.

            Planet X, (X being ten, but also a cross. Nibiru means “planet of the crossing, or one who crosses). It is not a planet, but a star, with orbiting satellites, and is thought to return every 800 years or so, and every 3600 years “crosses” close enough to Earth to wreak havoc, even knock planets out of their orbits and cause collisions.
            Apparently there are 6 “passes” to Earth, with increasing force.

            Think, too, that Constantine had a vision of a “cross” in the heavens, and the word “Christ” was replaced with X…)

            It is red in color, being molten iron (we are in the Iron Age, Christ returns to rule with a “rod of iron”…)

            Thinking cosmologically, could its “return” cause a “showdown” between it and our sun? And is X the return of Christ, or is it the dragon?

            I can’t get into it much here. There is so much more. There must be a better way to communicate…

          • http://deleted Claire

            DaveH–You are correct. They can be “bought” just like any politician.

          • Dan az

            Kate
            I know what you mean its hard to go over everything here.I think all of this going on with the sun and the star and the prophecies can’t just be a coincidence that would be insane to just blow it off.I’ve been researching everything that I can find and have allot to talk about.We need to find a way!

          • Dan az

            Kate
            I just finished watching the you tube and all I can say is WOW.Excellent find.I just wonder if anyone else will take the time.Makes perfect sense!
            False ego gave me the reasoning that I have been looking for to understand a liberal.I would like to hear what they have to say about the truth.Do you think maybe they would watch it and see why we are? ;)

          • Kate8

            Dan az – Very few people have any real interest in piercing through the illusion of “reality”. Much less spend over an hour on video. Their attention spans aren’t that long and, besides, they may actually learn something that would rock their worlds.

            Funny thing is, even they would probably understand it. Truth has a way of evoking response, no matter where your mind is.

            As for me (and I suspect you, as well), my world is rocked almost daily now! I love it! Just when I start feeling in information overload, and I take a break, I get an aha!

            It’s really getting exciting now.

          • denniso

            So DaveH once again accuses me of feeding off the gov’t,when I’ve repeated over and over that I’ve been self employed most of my life,created my own work,never had a gov’t contract or subsidy,and continue to work in my own businesses. I don’t get a retirement pension from a corporation like he does,and never did work subsidized by the gov’t like he did.

            Anyone who can read real history knows that the regulation and gov’t involvement we have had for more than 1/2 a century is the result of private businesses and large corporations running amok at the expense of the individual citizen. If we could count on a moral compass among all business people then we wouldn’t need the regulation we have built up over the yrs. That wish is so naive as to belong w/ the fairy tales we all grow up on. Business exists to make money…that’s it. It doesn’t exist to help people or the planet. Look back to the 1800′s and turn of the century and see what society looks like w/o enough gov’t involvement in the economy.

          • Meteorlady

            Denniso. My grandfather and uncle both farmed. They raised wheat, flax and corn. They lived to be 95 and 97 respectively. So where were the harmful chemicals then? They didn’t irresponsibly pollute their crops, they raised them to eat and sell and they did a good job. Fact is that all this mess started with the large corporate farming techniques where they don’t care about what polluted chemical they use because they aren’t there and have no stake in the quality of the food. I wonder why we don’t get to know about genetically modified food sources with labeling so we have a choice in what we buy? They don’t reproduce from seed purely so I guess the big boys are going to control our food supply that way. No more seeds on the open market – just buy our products because it’s all you will get.

          • denniso

            100 yrs ago there were fewer toxic chemicals produced and used on crops…now the EPA can’t keep up w. the new ones that come onto the mnarket every year.

            Farms used to feed a family w/ leftover going for sale to the public,and there wasn’t the huge profit motive that corporate farms have today. Our country is more and more controlled by corporations,especially in farming…I don’t think it’s good for the country or our health.

        • Pathfinder

          While I favor “allowing” the development of genetically modified foods, I must question the policy of not labeling them as such. How are consumers to make informed decisions unless the geneticly modified foods are identified as such. Label things properly so we can decide what to buy without being kept in the dark.

          • Meteorlady

            Genetically altered food sources will not reproduce from seeds into the same plant as the parent seed. That’s the bottom line here. It’s called control the food supply so consumers will have to purchase food not grow it. I have to order heritage seeds to for my garden. They taste better, produce better and I have the confidence that they will be healthy for me. No one can tell you what genetically altered food will do to people in the long term.

        • professor

          Everything in the grocery stores, that is processed, in boxes or packages, has ingredients that shouldn’t be allowed. The food causes heart disease in almost 100% of people, a lot of cancers, high blood pressure, and toxin buildup, in our bodies… Frozen meats and fish has toxins (depending where it comes from)and is soaked in brine to make it hold water (sold by the pound) and weigh more.. So, in a way, they do support “big medicine and big pharma!” Cereal, lunch meat, and oatmeal, are some of the most common foods that are processed and that shouldn’t be eaten…anyway, the only things we can eat that hasn’t been touched by processing, is what we grow. Otherwise there is too much corruption and money to be made by the government officials that are supposed to be guarding the food we eat..

          • eddie47d

            You really think that Kelloggs,Pepperidge Farms,Orowheat and Betty Crocker will stop selling their “terrible” products if the government gets out of their way? These corporations would probably continue to use the same ingredients no matter who inspects them.

          • Kate8

            eddie – It’ amazing. You just still don’t get it.

            The same people who own these companies, these corporations, OWN THE GOVERNMENT.

            My gosh, man, snap out of it!

          • BrotherPatriot

            LoL…Kate8.

            God Bless.

          • eddie47d

            When are you Kate 8 going to do something about the thousands of companies out there who have “allegiance” to the government. As You say. Offer some proof that you are taking these companies on to change what they are putting into our food. We can all bring up the evils on any issue and you know I do it all the time. I take on greed driven corporations almost daily. Yes,Kelloggs and Betty Crocker are corporations. Yet the Conservatives don’t like my doing so. I believe you are a Conservative so apparently you are the one who doesn’t get it. You want to really change things or just sit back and get snippy with me?

          • Kate8

            eddie – (sigh). I would try to explain this, yet again, but it’s obvious that your mind is locked into your progressive thinking pattern. You can’t see the forest for the trees, nor do you want to.

            We will never be able to change the way things are as long as we have to play by the rules set by THEM. I, like many others, have phoned, written and emailed daily, and all we ever get is high blood pressure and ulcers (fortunately, by the Grace of God, I don’t have these). The point is, THEY AREN’T LISTENING TO US.

            It’s pretty hard to switch to plan B when we don’t know what it is. But the first step has to be to see it CLEARLY for what it is. As long as we stay engaged in the D/R mentality, we’re stuck. THEY set it up that way.

          • Meteorlady

            Eddie – here’s what I’m doing. I grow my own veggies and share with neighbors. I am going to expand my garden this fall so that I can have more to share. It’s fun and relaxing. I also don’t buy product from companies that have, in the past, had contaminated food. I don’t buy anything from Tyson or Hormel because they employee illegals and they have had tainted food in the past (more than once). I buy eggs and chicken from a local person that lives about 2 miles from and I buy beef from a rancher about 20 miles away. While Kate has valid points, I prefer to take my fight to the manufacturer by boycotting their products rather than keep writing some unresponsive government representative. Until they are voted out and the corruption stops, there is really nothing more I can do except support secession in my state.

      • DanB

        The irony is that when health inspectors find a problem, the government solution is new laws and regulations. New laws and regulations affect all levels, from big processing plants to your local producer. The irony? Most food safety problems actually happen at the large scale processing plants, but the only portion of the industry best suited to handle the increased costs of “improved” regulations is those same large scale processing plants. So the whole irony of the FDA, USDA and so forth is that we are driving our whole food industry into one system that consolidates all our problems into where most of current the problems thrive already. Our very efforts to promote food safety is probably going to make future disasters far more costly, more dangerous….

        • TXMom

          You got that right DanB! That and all the tax codes and laws that make it impossible for families to pass down farms and land to future genererations. Property taxes are driving small farms out of business.

    • Janice M Cullen RE Broker

      Do you go to bed Hungry??? Do you get sick from the food you eat.? Can you go to the store and make CHOICES about what to buy. If you answered yes to any of the above you live in a country that is still the #1 destination for those who answer no to all above questions. Are you to stupid to see that???

      • Karolyn

        And do you support the FDA’s trying to force supplement companies out of business to further serve Big Pharma? You probably think it’s bad to drink raw milk too! Co you want this country to get like Europe where they have to have prescriptions to get supplements? Have you done any research into the workings of the FDA or do you have any idea of the bills in the House and Senate trying to further curb our rights to consume what we want?

        • Vagabond

          Karolyn I grew up on a farm. part of my daily chores was milking the cow every morning and every evening. I am 75 years old and I can’t see where whole milk has hurt me at all. and it tasted a hell of a lot better than the crap you buy in the stores,

          • Karolyn

            My friend just got some calves; and I told him as soon as his heifers are mated and have milk, I want to milk them for myself. To get raw milk, I would have to drive about 60 miles in the middle of he week. That’s the closest place. At least we can buy it in SC. The trouble is it is so few and far between because most people have bought the lies aoubt raw milk. As long as the cows are clean and fed well, there’s nothing wrong with raw milk. Now, I could get goat’s milk easily enough, but I really don’t care for it.

        • Meteorlady

          I grew up on raw milk and butter. We never had a problem with contamination. Sorry, but if you are a smaller dairy and keep our cows well fed, clean and use good clean equipment, that is not a problem. Today we have huge farms where the cows are penned together and fed from common troughs. It’s a breeding ground for disease and contamination.

      • DaveH

        Sure we have choices, Janice — The choices that Big Government allows us to have.
        Are you too ignorant to realize that there could be many more choices in a Free society?
        Are you too ignorant to realize that just because you’re content with having somebody else dictate your choices, that doesn’t mean we have to be?

        • vicki

          In a truly free society the most that government would do is require correct and accurate labeling so that we could make informed decisions on our vastly increased choices.

          Unfortunately even that little bit of government force could and would be corrupted thus proving 2 things. The dangers of government as we were warned by George Washington. The inability of the Constitution to govern any other but a moral and honest people.

      • Dan az

        Janice
        When you go to the market and buy sea food do you look to see where it came from first?Even though the FDA says its ok to eat sea food from the gulf or vietnam do you not think twice about what is in the water?Sorry but I do!Just because they have allowed to many products in to this country that has been sprayed with chemicals that we have banned but its ok for them to send it to us to consume.I’m from the gubmnt and I’m here to help you!Ya right!

        • Kate8

          Dan az – I read that a lot of the poisoned seafood is going into pet food.

          My cats have been getting sicker and sicker. I try not to feed them food with fish in it, but you never know. Anyhow, it’s all GMO.

          Even the word “organic” doesn’t mean much these days. It seems that misrepresenting anything is A-okay anymore, even food.

          • Dan az

            Kate
            Sorry to hear that about your cats that explains why the dogs refuse to eat there food!I’ll have to change where I get it to.The stuff I get is local and now I pretty much only eat chineese soup.Cant stand anything else anymore.Hey I left you a site that is a must hear,I’ll leave it here just incase you missed it.Good stuff its Aron Russo check it out!
            http://www.teslasecret.net/2012survival

          • Altaica

            Whoa! Duly noted. I wasn’t aware they were putting that crap in my cat’s food too. No more unless it comes from somewhere safe. When I want to give him a seafood treat I’ll just give a piece of mine. I don’t have kids, I have pets and they are very dear to me. I’ll have to pay more attention to what is in my kitty’s food. Do you know any brands that are safe?

          • Kate8

            Dan and Altaica – Many farmers give their animals diatomaceous earth or zeolites to remove heavy metals and toxic chemicals from their bodies, because they know the food is contaminated. DE is super cheap. I’ve started using both to see if it will help. I’ve given it to my family, too.

            Dan az, I listened to the presentation. My comments above are in relation to it. Did you order the package?

            My resources are dwindling fast, and there are so many thinks I’d like to buy. If I knew for sure when these things would happen…but right now I’m just dealing with basics of life. Maybe this area will wash away…then I won’t need to worry about it. 3 mile high tsunami…2500 ft…gonzo.

          • Dan az

            Kate
            No I don’t think that there is much more that I can do so I will just hang out and watch the show.I wish I could read it though but like you I be broke!I’m curious about the timing because he didn’t mention the comet.All we can do is be prepared and find a good seat for the show.

          • Kate8

            Dan az – Yep. I am also aware that a lot of people are making a ton of money off this impending doomsday scenario. This keeps playing through my mind, and I have felt no real impetus to respond to the hype. I’m hoping that if God wants me to do these things, He’ll provide the way. After all, He knows our situations.

            “As it was in the days of Noah…” So what is the ark today?

            Perhaps, Merkabah?

          • Altaica

            Kate8:

            I’m definitely gonna get some of those powders when I have the funds.

            Dan Az & Kate8

            I was curious are you guys familar with the Hopi Prophecy?
            http://www.welcomehome.org/rainbow/prophecy/hopi1.html

            I know there are a few but I have been reading up a lot on the Hopi as that is where some of my heritage lies. I like you both would be interested in the correlations if you haven’t already read them.

          • Kate8

            Altaica – I have been a student of prophecies and esoterica of all world religions all my adult life. What I have found is that they all share a common thread of truth, but the decoding of that truth is what has stymied humanity for all existence. This attempt to decipher has been the basis for religions, cults and sciences.

            Only now are a few people beginning to understand…it’s mind-blowing. We must remember that what we hear and read are other people’s ideas, meant to stimulate ideas in all of us. I’ve been formulating my own concepts based on my own studied and innate understanding of symbols and metaphor…

            It seems complicated, at first. But I have a feeling that much of that is intellectual calisthenics and meant to confuse us…and will boil down to something incredibly simple…(only to be lost to humanity yet again, and regained over another series of ages and cycles).

            By all means, study the Hopi. But do it soon…It would seem that we are at the end of another major cosmic cycle. :)

          • Kate8

            Altaica – Thanks for the link. I’ve read some of it…it corresponds with other prophecies…

            The Brother who comes with a red cap or red cloak…could this be Nibiru? The red planet, star or whatever, who comes to destroy, wreaking winds and earthquakes and shaking of everything…Also symbolized in many cultures as the “winged star”, as it appears to have wings (a cloak?) as the red gasses flare out at its sides.

            I agree with what it says, that those who seek to prepare and build shelters are material-minded. He who has peace in his heart is always prepared to go on to a new place…

            At this point, it feels like too much effort (and futility) to spend time focusing on material preparation. I’ve done what I can, and it’s likely that we will be separated from our possessions, anyway.

            It is time to be spiritually prepared.

            Good stuff.

          • Dan az

            Kate
            you took the words out of my mouth.I think we can relax now and just watch the show.That site pretty much says the same thing.Its our inner self that we need to study and I agree.This flight or fight is just to tiring and is nothing but a distraction from what we should be doing.Preparing our selves and understanding what is truly going on.I say so be it.Have seat its about to start.

          • Carol J

            It’s been happening since the base for cat food is coming from China. I get the FDA updates, and check the recalls on our food and on pet food. Eukanuba/Iams is the one that has killed 3 of my cats and is going to kill the other 3 that ate a smaller amount of the same food. I bought the Iams pouches in August 2006, (not Dec. like Proctor and Gamble is still lying about distributing). I still have the carboard container and one pouch with the date on them. Jan 30th, 2007: First cat too far gone and had to be put to sleep. Still no announcement that food was contaminated. March 29th, day after their 4th birthday, 2nd cat meowed at me and died. That was a few days after they had finally annouced the contamination. Immediately had other 4 cats tested. I had noticealbe damage to one kidney. He made it to last Dec when his kidneys no longer processed the blood. Had others tested again. Their surviving sister showed negative, but is now dropping weight fast. The other 2, brothers from a different litter, are now very sick. The ones who had the food as their main diet went first. The others were “the clean-up committee and therefore didn’t have as much. And then they found the contaminent-melamine powder used as a filler-in baby formula coming from China. Melamine powder is extremely toxic and cannot be flushed from the kidneys. It’s there to stay. What did the FDA say? It was a negligible amount and was OK. SAY WHAT? It builds up, it can’t be removed and they said it was OK? How many babies who were fed this formula, sometimes up to a year of age, are going to have kidney problems? The regulatory actions of the FDA are a joke although I’m not laughing.

          • Kate8

            Carole J – I remember when that happened…I was feeding my cats contaminated pouches, too. Not all the time, but some. I guess I foolishly assumed that they got rid of the melamine after that, because my cats, especially the one who eats the most catfood, shows definite signs of kidney damage. Constant diarrhea, vomiting and weight loss. The vets I’ve seen have had no answers.

            I am so sorry to hear about your cats. I lost 2 of my cats just prior to this, but didn’t equate it with the food, as I have with these 2. It’s so hard to find anything they’ll eat, and I’m aware that products are coming from China. I just didn’t imagine that melamine was still an issue.

            Thanks for the heads up.

          • Meteorlady

            Why would anyone buy any food stuff, not matter for human or animal consumption, from China, Mexico or any other third world country? Same with seafood from Vietnam – contaminated and farm raised in their own excrement. I feed my cat food from the health food store as she wouldn’t eat processed food, especially IAMs. I thought she was spoiled, but turns out she knew what was best and she lived to 19.

            I just read where Mexico won a international suit about our labeling of tuna and they will not be able to sell their tuna in our country. Like I want it? Not….

      • professor

        It not that we have “choices,” it is that all the choices, when eaten over the long term, cause disease! Are you stupid…

        • Meteorlady

          We have choice. I grow my own veggies and some fruits. That’s my choice and it’s withholding money from the big corporations. I don’t have a huge piece of land, I have a home in a community. I use the side yard for a nice veggie garden, have hanging pots of strawberries and blueberry bushes are part of my landscape. The apple tree and peach tree are also part of my yard’s landscaping and the look pretty good when in bloom. It’s easy, fun and anyone can do it.

    • wandamurline

      Just look at the attorney ads for “bad drugs” and all of the law suits for causing cancer, babies with birth problems, etc. Then we have the “keep us safe” at the airport through TSA which tramples the 14th and 4th amendments of the Constitution against illegal searches and seizures…they can pull you from a line without probable cause, search and seize your belongings without a warrant, mirandizing, or your right to counsel…the criminals in this country have more constitutional rights than the ordinary citizen trying to fly on an airplane. This police state has got to stop.

      • Karolyn

        More illness and death is caused by FDA approved drugs than by the supplements they are wanting to crack down on now. Visit ANH at http://www.anh-usa.org for up-to-date information on what’s going on in that arena.

        • DaveH

          It’s good to see that you’re starting to wake to reality, Karolyn. Government is not our friend. They are looking out for themselves and their favorite dues-paying Crony Capitalists.

          • DaveH

            And thanks for the link, Karolyn, I will pass it on.

          • S.C. Murf

            I could not believe what I was reading and I had to look and make sure that it was truly from Karolyn, way to go girl

            up the hill
            airborne

          • Karolyn

            Dave – I’ve been awake about these issues for ove 10 years now, Dave and regularly write my congressmen about proposed legislation regarding the FDA. Receiving email updates from ANH keeps me informed. I posted a response on this site yesterday from Sen. DeMint to my correspondence regarding S 1310, the Dietary Supplement Labeling Act in which he stated his support for a bill generated by Ron Paul. To get in on the act, ANH has premade letters to automatically send to congressmen.

          • Old Henry

            Ditto DaveH.

          • http://yahoo olerocker

            Capitalist? I think they are Socialist…..the goverment runs business or ruins it how ever you want to look at it…and this includes GMC and GE for starters.

          • vicki

            Karolyn like many others is awake on some issues of big government. In the past we have seen however that she (Or another Karolyn) had not generalized the knowledge to realize it applies to all government and not just a small subset.

            Hopefully thru study she will see even more and will continue to bring us good links like the one she gave us above.

          • Karolyn

            Vicki – I have stated in the past that I am not for big government; however, there are some things I just don’t agree on. I am really, after all, not a liberal but more of an independent with liberal leanings. In some instances I am more conservative.

        • Altaica

          I’ve noticed a serious trend, while it is not all inclusive it is the majority. Most doctors support big pharma to line their checks, which often means you don’t get better, just treated. The symptoms are treated but not cured. While I greatly appreciate the antiobiotics that help me survive my bronchitis, many of the problems of our citizens can be outright cured without patented medications. I have noticed that most holistic practitioners want you to get better and will look for the root cause. They aren’t concerned with lining their pockets, they are concerned with helping you get better. Afterall, most of our pharmaceuticals are based on natural medicine. I’m all for natural medicine. Studying nature and learning the medicinal secrets we don’t need to pay for a pricey formulation. All we need to do is remember how to use the biodiversity of nature and balance ourselves within it and we can address the vast majority of our problems through natural means.

          • DaveH

            And in a Free country, Altaica, you could buy your prescriptions without the extra expense of a doctor who is usually nothing more than a gateway to get the antibiotics you know you need. The Internet has a wealth of information for those who would want to practice caution before they bought their antibiotics. And that’s much more information then we typically get from the doctors.

        • Altaica

          I’ll have to look into that site, got it saved in my email. A resource to help me write my congressmen is indeed helpful. These anti-natural medicine attitudes that the government seems to hold affects me on many levels. While I believe there is much good from medical research I also know that there is also much corruption from greed. Greed has turned what started out as a well meaning search to cure problems into a money race. I see this as a disrespect and a overall lack of compassion for those the field was originally meant to help. It’s really sad.

        • Meteorlady

          The drug companies actually factor in the cost of legal representation for the lawsuits that will result when the drug is released. That’s a huge part of the price. The rest is advertising their crap – it’s added BILLIONS to the price of prescription drugs (a big thanks to Bill Clinton). As for the ads that give the side affects, some even mention death. WTF death? If one single person dies as a result of the drug it should never have been put on the market.

    • DaveH

      SC,
      I think what Stefano meant by “Apparently” was “The MSM would have you believe”.

    • ValDM

      sc,
      Unless USDA has changed their opinions of what ‘organic’ is, you’ve given them far too much credit. In order for a product to wear the “USDA certified organic” label, it only needs to be 75% organic. And the rest? You’re right about that…….only God knows.

      • Meteorlady

        Processed sewer sludge is OK for organic labeling.

    • ralph herman

      USDA has been cut and was over loaded before that so go back to basics wash produce and boil don’t steam.Buy from local family farms and local farmers markets.That way you know where it came from and who to blame.

    • Christine

      In electronics, companies pay CE or UL to certify that their products work as claimed or meet various safety standards. CE/UL are motivated to only certify things that are good so their certification means something. If they let friends “get by” (like the FDA) then their certification won’t mean anything, and companies won’t pay them to certify their product. We don’t need the FDA. If they didn’t exist, companies would pop up to certify various types of food/supplements/drugs. If consumers care they will buy certified products. This will force companies to certify in order to sell their products. We will be both safer and have more freedom to make our own choices. No government control.

      • Altaica

        Medical device manufacturers do the same by paying an agent company to ISO certify them in order to sell their products over seas.

      • vicki

        There is one extra element. Many governments require the use of only UL approved devices in building thus making sure that the hand of Big government is on even the electrical/electronic industry.
        http://www.ul.com/hongkong/eng/pages/resources/faq/gma/
        “#
        Which states in the United States require a UL Mark or another safety mark on products?

        Such a list does not exist. However, the answer to this question is probably all 50 states. Although it is voluntary, the U.S. safety system is driven by market, regulatory and code requirements in more than 40,000 state and local municipalities. These requirements utilize third-party certification as the primary means of demonstrating compliance. The UL Mark is accepted in every municipality in the United States.”

        Note the hint about “code requirements”

        Fortunately some appliances can still be bought without the UL label giving us some freedom from big government.

        • MNIce

          For now, the UL has an excellent reputation. The National Fire Protection Association (the organization responsible for the National Electrical Code) also has a good reputation for its requirements. Rather than attempt the rather technical business of writing suitable regulations for electrical wiring, most state and local governments simply specify that wiring must comply with the NEC and use “listed” components, also as specified by the NEC.

          ISO standards may or may not be adequate. ISO 9000, for instance, is a set of procedures for documenting quality control processes. But if the documents don’t match what really goes on in production, they are worthless. Likewise, if a product submitted for testing meets UL standards, but the product sold to the consumer differs in a manner that compromises safety, the UL label itself becomes questionable. (I had a bad experience with a Chinese-made electrical product – UL-labeled – that as sold to me should not have lasted ten minutes in testing. Fortunately the breaker in my house panel tripped before a fire started. I made a few simple corrections to the product’s wiring and have had no problems since.)

          When these situations arise, we have legal recourse against the manufacturer and if necessary the private standards organization. The threat of a few costly lawsuits and consequent loss of its monetarily valuable reputation should suffice to keep a private standards organization in line. We have no such recourse against a government agency. All we can do is complain to our Congressman and hope he does something about it.

          The bottom line is we are forced to rely on the integrity of whomever supplies the products we purchase. If we survive a bad experience, we know not to buy from a particular supplier without knowing the problem has been corrected. No government agency can adequately substitute for a well-informed competitive marketplace, but there is a place for government in keeping the information honest. And yet, government consists of fallible men who may also lack integrity or have inadequate knowledge. And unlike a private underwriter, there is little or no penalty for a government agency if it grants approval or disapproval where it lacks the expertise to do so properly unless there is a public outcry of sufficient magnitude to make corrective action politically necessary.

          The USDA and FDA were formed with generally “good intentions” – the stuff that paves the road to hell. The authors of the FDA bill truly wanted to protect people from being cheated by snake oil salesmen who sold opium,arsenic and mercury compounds as universal. The Congressmen who expanded FDA authority in the 1960s and made drug requirements more stringent were genuinely horrified by the effects of thalidomide on unborn children in Europe. The difficulty is Congress not consider whether that was the best, or even an appropriate, answer to the problem. They not only overreached limits of Constitutional authority in spirit if not in letter, their measure had the (probably unintended) consequence of making pharmaceuticals and medical devices far more expensive and difficult to market in the US than they need to be. As a result, pharmaceutical companies concentrate only on drugs that are likely to be sufficiently profitable to pay for the FDA requirements. This means they have to be able to sell them for exorbitant prices, or sell them continually. Therefore, it is unlikely they will be interested in something that can be sold for two bucks and cure an uncommon problem in one dose unless it has other mass-market applications.

          Footnote: As it turns out, thalidomide comes in two mirror-image forms. One prevents morning sickness, the other disrupts fetal growth. Chemical manufacturing technology available today can prevent contamination by the latter, but thalidomide is dead in the marketplace for at least another 20 years unless people can be convinced the problem is truly not going to reappear. It has shown promise as a cancer treatment, but its reputation is so bad no pharmaceutical company will touch it, and no regulating agency is likely to approve it. Bottom line: reputation is a powerful regulator. “A good name is to be chosen rather than great riches.” Proverbs 21:1a

          • vicki

            Keeping the information honest is the ONLY thing the government should be doing with things like UL approvals. But that is not where government stops. Government forces you to use only government approved items in building. The NEC we mentioned.

  • slayerwulfe

    Peanut butter with the addition of other oils, plus a generous serving of corn starch, to soak up the extra oil is not food. Processed sugar or corn sweeteners should not be listed as food either. Cigarettes are not food or actually a drug but it is now part of the domain of the FDA, tell me that isn’t scary.

    • Janice M Cullen RE Broker

      Is there something wrong with you that does not allow you to make different choices????You live in a country that does allow you to shop for what you want. Maybe you would rather live someplace where that is not a viable option!!!!

      • Karolyn

        Why the need for an attack so early in the morning, Janice? What is wrong with what he posted?

        • Ret

          janice is a paid shrill shill. Just hope she doesn’t live in your neighborhood. Bet when she tries to sell her real estate she’s as phony as a $3 bill butt kisser.

      • DaveH

        I choose to recognize you for what you are, Janice — a hateful controlling person.

        • Angel

          I am afraid that Janice just doesn’t “get it”. There are many sheeple out there. Don’t blame her because she has tunnel vision or is too lazy to research the fact that the elite wants us dead…they want the world to be a manageable 500 million slaves thereby poisoning ALL of our food and letting only the fit of the fittest survive.

          GMO’s are dangerous and everything is GMO amymore not to mention all the other crap that is put into foods. Hormones, antibiotics & perservatives just to name 3.

          I can onl;y have pity for the people who are too blind to see what in fact is happening in the world. The coming of the microchip…being “forced” to take it or you can no longer make any transactions, buy nor sell. Hey…isn’t all this in the Bible??? Why…I do believe it is!

          • MNIce

            “GMOs are dangerous” is a fine example of a hasty generalization. The most common artificially modified GMOs are soybeans with a deliberate defect in an enzyme affected by Roundup weedkiller, and corn modified to produce a protein in its leaves naturally found in Bacillus thuringensis – a protein toxic only to insects that chew on those leaves. Bt corn, as it is commonly labeled, eliminates the need for farmers to spray poisons on the field that could contaminate the food.

            Like anything else, they need to be used wisely. Overdoing the Roundup because it won’t kill your crop selects for weeds that naturally have the aforementioned defect so you get Roundup-ready weeds. Likewise, overdoing the Bt corn not only selects for Bt-resistant pests, it cuts down on natural means for controlling them. The answer is to rotate and diversify to keep the pests in check.

            Genetic modification can be a great boon if used properly, and if the resulting food is consumed in proper proportion (as with any other food). It can also cause problems if misused, like any other technology. Saying GMOs are dangerous is like saying concrete is dangerous because somebody misused it or used a bad batch or somebody might do so.

        • JeffH

          That has been Janice’ MO since her arrival on the cite.

      • professor

        Women in Realestate, usually have nasty attitudes! It just attracts that kind of women, those that like to be the “btch” in the group.

      • slayerwulfe

        I don’t dislike living here, I do dislike having to subsidize health care for people who live unhealthy life styles,or make poor choices for their children which is even more ‘sick’. There is another factor those selling this, as diet or health food. Please try to comprehend Janice health care is currently 16% of GDP, according to Kaiser.org. You may have heard of the U.S. postal service and the 5.5 billion annual payment they are required to make, that’s just for employee health care. If you think our gov’t is a problem take a look at us. A person not wearing a seat belt is injured when they wouldn’t have been, transported by helicopter to a hospital(it’s a free ride of course)a police investigation to determine fault for insurance companies and claimants the highway shut down, transportation of good’s,commerce. Cars and trucks idling wasted fuel and no recovery for the loss. I hope some day you can forgive me for being such a horrible person taking away someones freedom of choice.

  • concerned grandma

    TV doctor, Dr. Oz had a segment on apple juice. Evidently the FDA (no one contacted would appear) says that the arsenic levels in apple juice are safe. Even though the level is higher than the allowable level in the US water supply. There are numerous postings covering the issue.
    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44520025/ns/health-diet_and_nutrition/
    It makes one wonder that if food is ‘imported’ for sale in the US; is it tested before it is on market shelves?

    • Rayma Dorsa

      I believe the only way the food is tested is when the Manufacture cross the palm of the hand of the FDA.it has been years since they really cared about the people…if they cared, we would be able to buy raw milk, I can remember “real” milk and it isn’t this “slop” they are selling us.

      • Altaica

        Mmm, fresh from the cow milk, how I miss you! One of the tastiest things I used to get when I went to the fairs back east, fresh strawberries blended into fresh from the cow, unpasteurized whole milk. Yum! Shouldn’t we be allowed to choose this if we want?

        • DaveH

          We shouldn’t NOT be allowed to buy anything we freely choose to put in our own bodies. It is not Government’s business (especially the Federal Government) to dictate our food choices.

          • Altaica

            I agree. My body my choice what goes in it. I want farm fresh non-gmo, hormone induced food. Sure is hard to find, even in the heartland. It’s just plain wrong.

    • Janice M Cullen RE Broker

      Come on Grannie, I am also a grandmother and hopefuly your age has not impaired you ability to make personal choice about what you put in your mouth, it sure allows you to spew he garbage coming out of your mouth.

      • Karolyn

        What is wrong with you? Did you wake up out of a bad dream this morning? Actually, I can see from previous postings on different topics that you are like that all the time. How sad.

      • DaveH

        I can see Janice as a slaveowner telling her slaves “What are you complaining about, you ingrates, I give you 12 hours off each day?”.

        • Buddy

          Give Ms. Cullen some “slack”. All she is saying is that “not as bad” is better than “bad”.

          • DaveH

            Buddy,
            She said that in a very disrespectful way. I will treat her respectfully when she treats us respectfully.

      • Brian

        Janice, The government that you are supporting here is impairing your ability to put whatever you want into your mouth. Wake up. If you think government has your best interest at heart let me know. I have beach front property in Indianapolis I’ll sell you cheap.

      • Ret

        I rarely engage in personal attacks, but will make an exception. Lady, you are a whack job. Have you had your hormones tested? Are you so pathetic that you have to go after everyone on the site just to get attention? An arrogant ignoramus is at the bottom of the food chain.

  • slayerwulfe

    I really need to make a follow up comment to the Minister/Author who seems to follow blind faith over fact. My girlfriend and I have a large walk in pantry, I found only two items that were totally American products, a sack of Idaho potatoes and a bag of yellow onions. Campbell’s soup cooked in America from foreign ingredients, several brands of pasta all made in Mexico, Brach’s candy from China and on and on. Who really knows the origin of or whats in processed food.

    • Janice M Cullen RE Broker

      Honey you need to pay attention to what you buy, as in read first!

      • http://yahoo olerocker

        And most of the time, it will tell what is in it, but not where it came from…only who the distributer was……

  • Polski

    You all make the mistake of giving the FDA, USDA, FTC, etc. credit for being honest. They are all crooks. They are in league with Monsanto and The Bill Gates Foundation to ruin the world’s food crops so GMOs, Genetically Molested Organisms, are all that’s available. All the regulating directors are Monsanto employees on leave. All of Congress and the presidents of the US have been bribed successfully.

    • Janice M Cullen RE Broker

      Sounds like you should go back to Poland as it seems to have been so much better, and everyone there is so honest. What are you doing here if we are all so dishonest? Oh yes, personal freedoms! It is not the fault of the government if you chose not to exercise them!But of course that means you have to investage things before you make descions.

      • DaveH

        So now Janice attacks Poland. You know nothing about Poland, Janice. It’s likely that their leaders tell the citizens similar things to your garbage.

        • Kate8

          DaveH – You reminded me that she also attacked crabs.

          Now I can’t stop laughing all over again! :) :)

          • Ret

            Thanks Kate, needed that.

          • JeffH

            :)

      • Brian

        Personal freedoms? Stop paying lip service to something you obviously care nothing about. If we had personal freedom we could choose to drink raw unpasteurized milk. If we had personal freedom we could use cannabis to treat the many ailments it benefits. But no, we don’t have personal freedom. We have only the “freedom” the government you can’t seem to get through a day without will allow us to have.

        • DaveH

          Janice is endeared to Big Government because without their competition-stifling regulations and licensing requirements, she would have a lot lower salary. In Free Markets, skill talks, BS walks.

        • vicki

          If we really had personal freedom we could us cannabis just cause we want to.

          • Karolyn

            Wow, what a concept. Just sitting here for a couple of minutes thinking about how it could be here without so much regulation. Pretty nice.

          • Kate8

            karolyn – I have a favorite meditation, where I live in a beautiful place where people are loving and there is no evil. I live in a beautiful house with beautiful gardens, and I don’t have to pay anyone for the right to live there. In fact, there is no money! Only kind people who share and trade and work together.

            Even the animals are kind.

            It makes me feel better. I believe such a place exists, somewhere. Maybe in another dimension. You know the saying: if you can conceive it, you can achieve it.

  • http://www.diyyardandhome.com Dan

    Last years bill S 510, the FDA Food Safety Modernization Act gave even more sweeping powers to the FDA. It is seen as giving Seed Giants like Monsanto almost unlimited power in seed regulation. Small farms that grow and produce heirloom seeds can be put out of business if and when the FDA starts their crackdown. The reporting requirements are overbearing and wasted time for most small farmers.

    • Altaica

      I remember watching a documentary on Hulu about this too. Monsanto also has some pull in Canada too. It’s crazy.

  • Free Mind

    Anything the government has their hand in is not safe. This is especially true for health care.
    It is not the government’s job to tell people what to eat, how to treat ailments, what or where to smoke.
    Everytime the government mandates anything, it costs us money and that is the bottom line. Let us make our own personal choices.

    • Janice M Cullen RE Broker

      Do you not consider your self fortunate that you live in a country where you are allowed to make those choices???

      • DaveH

        Well, we do have free speech, so I guess we will just have to endure curmudgeons like yourself, Janice.

        • JeffH

          Hmmmm, just thinking out loud but doesn’t Janice sound a lot like Maxine Watters?

          • DaveH

            You might be onto something, Jeff.
            Did you also notice that little Freudian slip of hers?
            Janice said “What are you doing here if we are all so dishonest?”
            WE?

          • JeffH

            She obviously wasn’t talking about “we” the people…must be a liberal or work for the gub’ment…maybe it really is Maxine Watters or possibly that dingbat Debbie Wasserman Schultz.

          • vicki

            Janice writes:
            “Do you not consider your self fortunate that you live in a country where you are allowed to make those choices???”

            Allowed? ALLOWED? Janice where do you live? Here we are not allowed as WE are sovereign. We ALLOW our government certain powers. It is worth noting that for too long we have allowed our government to threaten our fellow citizens supposedly on our behalf and this is what must change.

            For if we have given up essential liberty for some illusion of temporary safety then we shall deserve and get neither.

            I offer as evidence the War on (some) Drugs.

            On the off chance someone doesn’t know what essential liberty we have given up in said war I will list just one REALLY BIG one.

            1. The right to trial (RICO laws).

            I bet all of us could put together a really big list if we tried :)

          • Kate8

            Well said, Vicki.

            One big difference between those who support the Nanny state and those of us who are sane is that they believe that we are allowed only the “privileges” given by government, and we hold that government is only allowed the authoritative processes given by US.

          • vicki

            Kate8. I think maybe they like being slaves. Or maybe just children.
            What was that line about posterity and countrymen? Oh yes

            —————————————————-
            “If ye love wealth better than liberty, the tranquility of servitude than the animated contest of freedom, go from us in peace. We ask not your counsels or arms. Crouch down and lick the hands which feed you. May your chains sit lightly upon you, and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen!”

            Samuel Adams
            ——————————–

            And I bet the plane fare to get them to some country that already is what they claim to want will be much cheaper than even the infamous TARP bailout.

      • Brian

        Good grief Janice! WAKE UP! We DON’T have those freedom. That’s the point. If our choice is between two things the government accepts and not anything the government doesn’t accept then we really don’t have a choice, at least not one that even resembles personal freedom. Sure, it’s still sort of a choice, but it is not FREEDOM.

        • vicki

          Kinda like a mugger. ” I gives you a choice. Gives me all your money or die”

          The mugger did give you choice.

      • Dan az

        So Janice
        I take it that you think things are good so it explains why your so pissed off with everyone.You voted for obumer because you knew that you would make a killing on the real estate market when he forced the banks to give loans to indigents right.And now that the bubble burst from your greed and over pricing you are stuck with a few investments that you can’t move and blame everyone here because we saw what was happening and spread the word to those that didn’t.Karma is a bitch and you sound like you deserved it.

        • eddie47d

          Some of you have fallen off the banana wagon Dan. Obama wasn’t President when the housing market collapsed. He had little influence over what happened.

          • MNIce

            You’re right, it was Bill Clinton who committed that piece of insanity. The folly showed up when $4/gallon gasoline broke the budgets of many households paying mortgages with marginal finances. The price spike was a combination of the effects of Hurricane Katrina on Gulf of Mexico oil production and Iran using Hezbollah’s missile war on Israel to manipulate the global market – a strong argument for diversifying our oil sources. But we digress from the main topic.

      • DamnTheWarGods

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NCY_vopQbRk&feature=related

        I suggest people watch this; It explains why people bury their heads in the sand and refuse to base reality on Facts. People prefer to live in a fantasy because some things are just too hard to face.

        Taking the position that anyone who calls out the Government for Wrong doing is not Patriotic is completely ridiculous. As a matter of fact it is those that have unwavering trust in Government that allow the corrupt crap to go on in the first place. That is a Nationalistic view that just means that whatever is done in YOUR name is ok by you as long as your on the winning team. You will just cover your eyes and wave that flag.
        A Patriot will question their Government and hold them accountable. So drop the crap of “if you don’t like it here go elsewhere. That type of statement just shows your cowardice for what it is. It is very Myopic and considerably unoriginal…and the funny part is that it is not even your thought, as you are just parroting something from someone else who is too lazy to research anything of value as you want to keep your world view intact even though there is enough evidence to support that it is a Lie. Freedom in the US is an absolute lie…we have the ilusion of Freedom…if you have to ask permission than you are not Free. You think own a Home? if you don’t pay taxes they take it away. You drive a car…you have to Register it with the State…that means you are turning it over to them. The best slave is one who doesn’t realize he is a slave. What is worse are people who despite mounds of evidence still will not fight the real enemy but rather those who are in the same boat.
        If that doesn’t change soon, even the illusion of Freedom will be gone in this country. Try positive thoughts towards your fellow humans it might suprise you what results you get. Negative begets negative and vise-versa. God Bless

  • James

    So long as there is a way to keep companies from letting rat turds build up on top of the meat like in the old days to which Teddy R signed in the FDA.

    • DaveH

      Sure, whatever you say James.
      Here’s some history on the man who rammed the FDA down our throats:
      http://mises.org/freemarket_detail.aspx?control=96

    • Amy

      James, that doesn’t matter anymore. Business will now suddenly police it’s self.

      • http://www.refugeofscoundrels.blogspot.com Stefano

        No, but the free market already provides a mechanism to ensure that food producers are held to certain safety and production standards. This would expand in the absence of the flawed government program.

        Kosher certification is another, totally private example.

        Clearly you didn’t read or don’t understand the essay.

        • Amy

          So if the free market takes care of it’s self, why was the FDA Ever created? Because it wasn’t working, people were eating rat turds and there was nothing they could do about it except complain to the government, the government then created the FDA to police companies. This has all happened before in the 19th century, meat packing plants and such, I learned this stuff in 8th grade American History.
          Oh yeah, I forgot, I went to public school, they don’t teach the real history do they? Just like Kate8′s “REAL” space program where the elite are going to fly away to another place if the end comes. LOL

  • 1minuteman

    the fda is raiding small dairy farmers who sell milk that people want which has not been pasturized or homoginized. they attack our natural suppliments and organic foods because the big drug companies cannot get patents on natural foods so they lobby crooked politicians like obama and go after these good people who are providing what the public wants. this big brother once again. more people die everyday from drugs than anything organic. they keep genetically altering our foods til one day they will create something they cant stop that could kill millions of people.

  • http://aol.com sean murrey ILLInio

    I think the FDA wants to poison us.

    • Angel

      Sean…you have it right. They want us dead….and the ironic thing is…we pay them from our taxes to kill us! Wake up people! Search the fact that when we are issued birth certs…the government takes out life insurance on each of us. The Luciferians want complete control…they want to be worshiped and yes the chip is coming.

      I am truly glad to see that some of my brothers and sisters have the “eyes to see and the ears to hear”!!!!

      • Altaica

        They’ll be one hell of a fight if they try to stick a damn chip in me. I’ll rip the f***ing thing out myself if I have to. I find it against my basic human rights.

        • Kate8

          Altaica – Did you happen to watch the video on the Human Microchipping Agenda? It tells all about how they will do it.

          http://www.brasschecktv.com/videos/offensive-technology/predictive-programming.html

          • Altaica

            I’ll definitely watch that tonight. Thanks for the link, I haven’t seen this one.

          • Altaica

            Thanks for the video Kate8. I bookmarked it and passed it onto a friend I believe will also appreciate it. I hardly watch any TV so I wasn’t aware at how much they are trying to pass off this atrocity. It needs to stop.

          • Kate8

            Altaica – You will probably like this one, as well:

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AanQ2mY2jjc&feature=relmfu

            Only when our eyes are opened will we be free. But we must CLAIM our freedom.

    • DaveH

      Here is a pretty good treatment of how and why we got the FDA:
      http://mises.org/daily/1805/Playing-God-at-the-FDA

      • Altaica

        Thanks for the link. Read through about half of it and the information is quite appalling. The people involved in hushing the scientific information and not allowing the information to be presented to every patient should each be held personally responsible for every death and harm they have caused.

  • http://www.easyinvest.co.za peter

    The FDA keeping ur food safe? Are you kidding?

  • Elevenarrows

    As a farmer, this subject hits very close to home for my family. All of this is about one thing: POWER. As long as people are able to make informed choices about something as basic as food (or anything they put in their bodies), the powers that be will not have ultimate power over us. That can’t be allowed to continue. In case you haven’t noticed, they have picked up the pace. Government now regulates every aspect of your life: what you put in and on your body, where your body goes, where and how your body chooses to express religion, what your body chooses to say, and even whether or not your body is actually born, has died or has paid enough blood in taxes. Freedom is only a figment of our imagination. But don’t worry, the government is working hard to make sure the few of us left with imaginations get in line with all the cookie cutter kids their propaganda “schools” produce. First they chipped the dogs and cats, then the livestock, then the big business employees, then…it is coming to the average Joe…make no mistake.

    • Altaica

      I think it is all very sad what is happening to our farmers. When the farmers come out and sell their wares out here I get right in line. I grew up on fresh grown, unwaxed, natural foods and I prefer them and I want to support them. More people in the country need to wake up to what is happening. Sure I pay a little more, but I would rather have good food then poison laced crap.

  • Donald

    If you eliminate the FDA, who will you rely onto keep your food “safe”. You think the local farmer will not cut corners to stave off the local banker’s foreclosure in a bad year?

    Whether it works well, or not, the FDA exists to protect us from the food processors, who will do anything to increase their bottom line. As for GMOs, the were invented by the food industry.

    The FDA doesn’t work well because Congress keeps meddling to keep their constituents and big contributors happy and get reelected. This includes under-funding food inspection.

    It’s not the FDA so much as it is the Congress that makes the whole system breakdown.

    • Ted

      Donald, the FDA and ALL other gov’t watch dogs, exist in order to watch the general population, and they are paid to do so by the very industries we mistakenly believe they are protecting us from. The SEC for example did nothing but help the Dot.com Bubble. They are supposed to protect our money and investments. REAL GOOD JOB THERE, and now they want oversight to watch the SEC. Just more big gov’t watching big gov’t rip off the people. Get rid of the redundend B.S. and let society police itself. Old Western style justice will out in the long run. If we all carry guns people will think twice before pulling theirs.

    • Brian

      Donald, If the government is doing such a wonderful job of keeping our food safe why do we often hear about things like e coli being found in places it never used to be found?

      • Amy

        So getting rid of the FDA Will help because companies will police themselves right? If that’s the case then why do were hear of cases like this. Oh, I know the FDA brought to our attention, without them people would just die for no reason and no one would know about it.

        • Kate8

          Brian and Amy – Those cases of e coli are either completely false, or the bacteria has been planted there.

          It seems that it will be “traced” to lettuce or some other produce, but then will turn up negative, so they move on to something else. Meanwhile, those businesses suffer huge losses because people are scared away from them. For nothing.

          The whole reason for doing this is, as in any falseflag event, not only to cause damage to the businesses, but to set up an excuse for passing legislation that they know will be unpopular, as in requiring the irradiation of ALL produce now, to “insure its safety”.

          So, unless you grow your own, or know a local farmer, all the “fresh” produce, eggs, milk, etc. you are getting now is irradiated and/or pasteurized some other way. Even nuts.

          The object is that we get NO food that is life-sustaining. “Food-safety” is a huge ruse for something that is nothing less than genocidal. And we get it no matter how much we object.

          • Altaica

            Irradiation certainly explains why even those eating a “healthy” diet aren’t getting all the nutrients that need. Radiation can destroy the valuable nutrients and minerals in food as much as it can destroy bacteria. Yet another reason why I want to get a place where I can grow my own food.

          • Kate8

            Altaica – Yes, irradiation not only renders produce “cooked” instead of raw, destoying nutrients and enzymes, but it changes the molecular structure, making it bio-incompatible with our bodies.

            It also keeps the food from spoiling for a long time, as there is no enzymatic action. So if your produce is lasting more than a few days, you know it’s been tampered with.

          • Altaica

            I think that’s why HFC works so poorly with our systems too. Nature did not intend for us to extract the sugar and multiply it thousands of times and consume it enmasse. We were meant to eat the whole kernel and gather some fiber with the rest of the kernel. I believe this tampering along with the GMO tampering with the corn is why there is such a high incidence of corn allergies. Some of my friends developed allergies after consuming these corn products for years. It appears to me there is a correlation.

            I wonder if they have plans to create their own supplement market and usurp our natural alternatives to further control us. The more nutrients they destroy the sicker we become and the more we have to rely on replacement supplements.

          • Kate8

            Altaica – If you do some research on Codus Aliamentarius, you will see that the goal is to have our food so devoid of nutrients, that we starve to death, even though our stomachs may be full.

            This has been accomplished in many ways: poor, mineral-depleted soil, engineered food crops, chemtrail spraying of toxic substances (not to mention blocking sunlight), toxic water, contaminated plant and animal foods and junk-food addiction.

            I’m sure I left a lot out.

          • Tony

            Kate8
            I almost feel sory for you. How difficult your life must be seeing conspiricy everywhere, how scared you must be all the time thinking everyone is out to get you.
            I have been eating grocery store bought food for over 60 years. I’m alive, healthy, and full of energy. I’ve never been in the hospital and enjoy my life here in the USA very much. The government may not always be right, and some of the peopleare corupt, but I’m certainly not afraid that they are “out to get me”
            I do feel sorry for you kate8. Maybe one day before you pass you’ll realize that life is what you make of it and will stop looking over your shoulder for the black helicopters and SUV.

    • Don

      It’s still Big Brother, what part of government don’t you understand ??

    • DaveH

      The flaw in your logic, Donald, is the assumption that the FDA is there to protect the public, and that they are Angels wielding great power only in our benefit.
      Without the FDA would companies knowingly risk losing their customers? Of course not. Those who did would face rapid market extinction. The FDA offers the illusion of security (the case with most Government agencies) but in reality protects the interests of those Big Businesses with strong political connections. For their relatively small contributions to campaign coffers, the Crony Capitalists reap large rewards by the Government Forced weakening of their competitors.

      As Government Grows, Corruption Flows

      • Donald

        The idea that companies would do right by us because if they didn’t they would soon lose our business is naive. There are lots of ways to adulterate food that won’t kill us outright, but will lesson food value. That’s why organic foods were developed by concerned citizens that didn’t like what the big producers were doing to our food because there was no regulation, or inspection to stop them.

        Also, look at all the salt and sugar that is added to food in processing it. This despite the fact that these items in the amounts we ingest them are not good for us. If folks wanted these things they could add them at home. Now we have no choice in the matter. The Food Industry is looking out for the bottom line, not our health. There are always more customers coming along as the old ones die off. So, industry doesn’t have to worry about running out.

        Go read Ida Tarbell to look at how things were before the FDA.

    • Nadzieja Batki

      We keep forgetting that any governmental agency, whether on national level or even in small towns,once it is set in motion, keeps growing and growing. It also is capable of self preservation and self sustaining. Can it be ended or can it be controlled? As of right now the answer is a resounding NO. It shouldn’t have been started in the first place.

  • Keith

    While the idea of replacing USDA, FDA or any other government agency that is supposed to be watching out for us, with a private or voluntary organization of some kind has its merits. Unfortunately, it has the same pitfalls of greed and corruption. As long as companies are willing to pay bribes and individuals are willing to accept them, it doesn’t matter whether it is a federal agency or not. One of the stated goals of the communist party back in the 50’s and 60’s was to remove the influence of religion and morality in our culture as a means to collapsing our form of government and society. Guess what . . . they’ve succeeded!
    If you love America as it was founded and as it was meant to be until the early 1900’s, the following link is both scary and sad, and should make you mad.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xQf_QfitmKE

    • DaveH

      Keith,
      If you think the voluntary watchdogs have the pitfalls of greed and corruption, just imagine the pitfalls and corruption that are inherent in the forced “watchdogs” of Big Government. And keep in mind that campaign aide from the assisted Corporations is an added incentive for politicians to look the other way and assist those corporations who are corrupt.

  • karen haack

    FDA should be renamed Fu@king Dumb A$$e$. It is a worthless organazation which needs to be eliminated and all that work there need to be charged with chemical warfare and mass destruction of our food and water supply. They are all crooks. They need to be charged with treason and murder for allowing dangerous drugs and chemicals in our food and water supply.

    • Amy

      You think getting of the FDA would help? No one to watch over companies that would rather pour chemicals into our streams so that they don’t have to pay to dispose of it so they get more profit?

      Over the past 100+ years these this country has gone through all of these aurguments. Agencies were created to help protect the average American. At one time the skies around Pittsburgh were as dark at 12:00 as they were at midnight because of the polution. The town of Love Canal New York was destroyed due to chemicals because they didn’t dispose of them correctly. Food items such as hot dogs had things in them that you would never want to eat.

      These agencies were created because Americans in the past wanted them. Things had happened to make people aware of dangers and wanted the government to do something. How many lives have OSHA regulations saved? Would you want someone in your family to die on the job because they were forced to work unsafe? Tieing off on roof seems crazy until that one day you slip and slide down the roof and stop from falling because of a safety line.

      Repeal the 20th Century – Vote Republican

      • Kate8

        Amy – The FDA DOES give their full approval to the dumping of toxic chemicals into our water. Is your water fluoridated? Have you looked at all of the chemicals that are, and are planned to be, dumped into our drinking water? How about the ones that are simply allowed to be there because of groundwater contamination?

        Did you know that there are organic compounds that form toxic chemicals when combined with other chemicals, such as chlorine?

        The FDA may have made some gestures toward cleaning up some things, but they have, nevertheless, made sure that neither our food nor our water is safe.

        • Dan az

          yep!

        • Altaica

          Here’s some info on just how horrible fluoride in our water is for us.

          http://www.holisticmed.com/fluoride/

          Here in Nebraska they put some sort of chemical in our drinking water that is known to kill fish and reptiles…both of which are common pets. I grew up on pure well water away from any industrial areas and clean spring water. This water here tastes horrible, that’s why everything is filtered.

          This toxic dumping needs to stop. The government allows it, so they are not doing their job. If you can’t do your job, then I say you are unfit for the position and you’re fired. Straight and simple.

      • Karolyn

        Amy – The agencies were instituted to do good; however, they are outgrowing their responsibilities. I don’t want to have to get a prescription to get vitamins, and that is where we are headed. I’m sure a lot of people who work for the FDA believe they are doing the right thing, but they are just going too too far. Also, the FDA has nothing to do with corporations pouring chemicals into our waterways. That’s the EPA.

        And neither I nor many posters here are Republican.

        • Kate8

          karolyn – The ones at the top know what they are doing, and those who are lower level have, at least, a sense of what’s going on. That is why some have become whistleblowers.

  • Elevenarrows

    Donald, with all due respect, I think you may be a little too innocent in looking at these big issues. If you honestly think the FDA would function well without oversight, you have obviously not done your research. I have no doubt you are a wonderful person, but it is people like you who scare me. I hope you don’t vote based on those pretty, flashy commercials you see or those news anchors telling you who to choose.

  • mikeg

    Large conglomerates that hold a near monopoly on the market (such as Monsanto) simply infiltrate the government programs to maximize their profits. I think the FDA and many other government agents all had good intentions when they were created, its corporate america that is the issue here. Lets say, you do away with the FDA, what makes you think that they simply won’t infiltrate (or start their own more likely) 3rd party food safety organization? The one mentioned in the blog probably hasn’t been touched because no one of consequence really cares.

    • DaveH

      The FDA was created with good intentions? If you mean on the part of the Leaders who created it, it is doubtful. The uninformed public always tends to “think” the intentions are good, but more often than not some Big Businesses are behind the scenes working to stifle their competition or other such self serving endeavors.
      Read this, Mike:
      http://mises.org/freemarket_detail.aspx?control=96

      From the article:
      “Roosevelt, acting in the name of the public interest, ordered an investigation of the meat industry, which was delivered to him in secret later that year. However, the president refused to release the report, saying only that the contents were “devastating,” and he bullied Congress into passing the Pure Food and Drug Act, which created the FDA, an agency which bedevils the country to this day”.
      Why do progressives fear transparency?

      • Amy

        The origins of the FDA go all the way back to the 19th century. The FDA Was created in 1906.

        • DaveH

          Did you think I was talking about FDR? I was talking about Theodore Roosevelt.

          • MNIce

            Yeah we know. But TR was an early example of RINO. He called himself a Progressive, just like today’s socialists. When the Republican rank and file caught on, they dropped him. It’s presented in some of today’s public school textbooks as a tragic blunder by the body politic or simply the result of political missteps by TR. But it was his socialist policies that were rejected.

          • denniso

            You rightwing extremists are running out of heros! You don’t like Teddy Roosevelt or Lincoln,two of the most famous and influential Republicans ever. Instead you have taken on one of the dumbest Repubs as the only one you idolize…Reagan,who trippled the national debt and comitted treason w/ the selling of high tech missiles to our avowed enemy and supporter of terrorism, Iran.

  • Altaica

    I think all GMO foods should be stated right on their labels. I also think that small farmers should not be held accountable or charged when Monsanto and other GMO food producer’s seeds blow onto their farms. If Monsanto wants to jealousy guard their seeds then it is their responsibility to transport their foods in closed containers and enclose their farms in biosphere bubbles to prevent their seeds from getting out. They are ruining the good seeds and the good foodstuff grown by honest farmers. If you have something you want to protect is it not your responsibility to take every precaution you can to keep it secure. Sometimes my mind wonders if they purposely expose farms to their seeds in order to shut down their competition. I don’t think anyone should even be allowed to patent and mess with our food supply. If it ain’t broke don’t fix it. Our food was fine until they started messing with it. I do hypothesize that the increased number of corn allergies we see today has a correlation to the GMO’s and the HFCs.

    While I believe some regulations should be in place I think our government agencies have done a poor job. If you have private regulators their reputations will be on the line and competition will drive quality. If you have failed to do your job your credibility will go down and you’ll lose customers. I haven’t done much research into it, but I do believe other countries have 3rd party regulators. I believe ISO has many 3rd party qualifiers. Could we not do the same with out FDA and USDA regulations?

    The FDA allows HFC’s in our foods and has also allowed companies to rename it to “Corn Sugar”

    As a Biologist I find High Fructose Corn Syrup highly detrimental. The Princeton university study: http://www.princeton.edu/main/news/archive/S26/91/22K07/ is just one really good example as to why HFC’s need not be in our food. And of course the big companies insist they are ok for us in moderation. I call BS on that. And anyway, how are you supposed to have that in moderation when it is in most things we eat. Most people don’t think of just where they stick corn products, it’s in a lot of things you wouldn’t even think of. It’s scary. Having a couple of friends with corn allergies helped me be aware of where it was hiding.

    I have had a working hypothesis for several years now, even before this study, that HFC’s have a very real and direct correlation to the obesity of our country and the high incidence of diabetes. The Princeton study supports this hypothesis very well. And if the regulators are in bed with Big Pharma, of course they would support HFC, it makes many of us sick and in need of diabetic medicines. It makes so many people dependent on Big Pharma. It’s despicable.

    Processed sugar may be bad, but it no where compares to the sheer detriment of High Fructose corn syrup. And there is honestly no reason for it to be used in everything from bread to juice, and even eggs. Yes eggs. My friend and co-worker bought some egg sandwiches, She checked to make sure there were no corn products used in the biscuit. She however did not check the eggs. Who would, it comes out of a shell, gets cooked and put on the biscuit right? Well she gave one of the sandwiches to a mutual friend of ours who has corn allergies. Guess what? His throat swelled and he became very sick. They did some calls and research and found that there was HFC in the eggs. All I have to say is WTF? There should not be anything in my egg but the egg itself.

    The more I learn about processed foods, the more I buy organic and make my own things at home. Vague labeling misleads us, and they are allowed it. Natural flavoring may come from a natural source, but they don’t tell you what. I think those should be disclosed too. I really don’t think some of this stuff should be in our food. Shellac is a good example. Why is something we use to seal our art projects and floors in our food! How is that good for us!

    • DaveH

      This article explains why we have so much high-fructose corn syrup in our processed products:
      http://mises.org/daily/2678

      • DaveH

        From the article — “Furthermore, as James Bovard, policy analyst at the Cato Institute notes, “At least 43 percent of ADM’s annual profits are from products heavily subsidized or protected by the American government. Moreover, every $1 of profits earned by ADM’s corn sweetener operation costs consumers $10.”

        • Altaica

          Yet another example of corrupt government law. Every time I actually want a soda I pay the extra cost for one with real sugar. A lot of people have started to see the problems of HFC’s so now they are calling it “Corn sugar” to lull people into a false sense of security. It’s all sick. I would love to see ADM sink.

          I noted the year and it makes sense as to why I have had a mentality of man, pepsi and coke used to taste better as a kid then the stuff they give us now. When I want a cola and I can’t find a Jones one, I just walk over to the mexican isle and grab a coke or pepsi from there, one with real sugar. I would rather support our local companies, but they aren’t all giving us what we want for products so we’re forced to look elsewhere, so it has hurt our countries economy in other ways.

          I would love to see this protectionist crap stop, especially for an artificial, detrimental product.

    • Dan az

      Altaica
      Thanks for all that!I had problems with gout and started researching it and found it was caused by HFC so I started looking to see what didn’t have it and was amazed at what didn’t have it.But EGGS the only thing that it could be is the feed they give the chickens.I give my chickens organic food only and I have been only eating organic foods myself and I got rid of the gout.Its scary to even read half the things that I used to eat and wonder how I got this far.Thanks for the link!

      • Kate8

        Dan az – Hope you eat lots of black cherries and dring the juice. It’s a great cure for gout.

        • Dan az

          Kate
          I drink that Black berry water and cranberry juice is that all right?I am a coffee drinker at least a pot just before bed and after reading what kind of mold was allowed and seeing what that crap can do to ya,I’m thinking of sticking with instant.What do you think?

          • Karolyn

            Dan, I believe that coffee is not very good for gout. Drink lots of water. It has to be black cherry juice to really work. However, not everything works for everybody. The cherry juice never helped my arthritis when I used to get bad flareups in my wrists.

          • Dan az

            Thanks Karolyn!

          • Kate8

            Dan az – Gout relates to kidney function and differs from arthritis, which is toxic buildup in joint tissue.

            In any case, you can never truly heal until you detoxify from heavy metals, chemicals and pathogens. From what I’ve seen, the zeolites (powder, not liquid) are the best way to do this, as they are negatively charged particles which actually bind with the positively charged toxin particles, carrying them out of the body without the danger of them settling somewhere else. (DE is also negatively charged, but clay is not).

            Detoxify, alkalize, oxygenate. When you do the first two, the cells automatically have greater oxygen uptake, but you get great benefit from using an oxygenating product as you go, because oxygenation also burns up toxins. But it won’t remove heavy metals.

            BTW, remineralization is critical, because our bodies are MADE OF MINERALS, and can’t regenerate without them. Foods are now missing critical minerals. You should use NO SALT except WHOLE SEA SALT.

          • Dan az

            Kate
            Thanks still haven’t got any of that stuff yet but I will.And the only salt that I use is sea salt.

      • Altaica

        Another great natural food for gout are nuts, in particular black walnuts and brazil nuts. They are also great for arthritis which gout is considered a type of. They may not work for you, but there is no harm in trying them. I found that eating as little as 2 brazil nuts a day was enough to greatly reduce my osteoarthritis pain in my back and bad knee.

        I am sure there is a tea blend that you can replace your coffee with that would be better for you as well, I’ll have to look through my teas. If you are going to drink coffee I would suggest the shade grown organic types that are both ecologically friendly and generally not as processed. The way to go is looking for a reliable source and getting whole beans and purchasing a grinder. I do believe there is some correlation though between caffeine intake and arthritis pain. That’s something that merits some looking into.

        • Dan az

          Altaica
          Thanks.I have otheoarthritus even if I cant spell it and digenerative that either bone disease,I know what your talking about.Sucks!I do have a coffee grinder but haven’t heard of that one before.

        • Altaica

          Here’s a link to some information http://www.gout-aware.com/herbs-for-gout.html

          Dandelion, Rosehip, ginger and sasparilla all have some very good tea blends. Nettles as well. Tazo teas has a very nice sasparilla tea that tastes like drinking a cup of fresh brewed root beer. You can also make your own blends of dried herbs and put them in a tea ball and find flavors you like. Chai tea contains ginger as well as a host of other beneficial spices. I noticed tumeric is on the list and I have read some recent studies that also links this spice to cancer prevention. I have also seen green tea chai which will give you the added benefit of the green tea. If you like teas you may want to do so more research on your own and shop through some of the more reputable tea companies. I have found I really enjoy Tazo teas for something quick and the Tea smith for my loose leaf blends.

          • Dan az

            Altaica
            Thanks for the list.I’m not much of a tea drinker but my wife is.I guess I’ll just have to bite the bullet and try some.Got any that taste like coffee? :)

          • Altaica

            Dan Az do you like hazelnut? Or french vanilla? Tazo has a hazel nut that is kind of coffeeish, especially when you throw a little milk in it (or in my case almond milk.) You could also try a coffee/ tea blend. I’ve seen them in my local free-trade coffee shop. I suggest slowly scaling back, and trying different things. You don’t have to just quit coffee just not drink as much. The nice thing about buying beans is you can visually inspect them yourself. I don’t advise quite caffeine cold turkey, the dt’s are bad, LOL. I used to be a popaholic and when I quite colas I have some terrible migraines. If you have a Whole Foods I suggest you have a look there. They have some very delicious teas and organic coffees and the nice thing is you can get a cup and try it and see what you like.

          • Dan az

            Altaica
            I can only drink my coffee with hazelnut now,I’m a crack head for the stuff.The only store that I use now is a natural foods store so I will look and test everything.Like you said the head aches aren’t worth it.

      • Altaica

        Sadly what they did with the eggs is scrambled them and mixed in hfc. I don’t know what their reasoning was, but all I have to say is Ew! Sugar does not belong in my eggs, and definitely not an artificial one. When I get scrambled eggs I want them as is, at most maybe some cheese on top and some onions and garlic mixed with them.

    • Scared To Death

      You are so right on the mark, Altaica.

      The FDA and USDA have been corrupt for decades. They do not want people well. They want to make them sick slowly, insidiously, so nothing can be proven definitively.

      There are technologies that they tried to destroy, outlaw, and keep hidden from the public, with marked success. Look up rife machines. Shhhhhhh!!! These machines are real and they work. Don’t read the propaganda about them, it’s BS.

      The day is going to come when this planet retaliates. We can’t sustain what is going on. The government and big business (e.g., plastics, oil, nuclear) will destroy this planet and will kill us all. The bees and other worker insects will disappear. GMO plants are not going to work for them on a molecular level, as it won’t work for humans on a molecular level.

      We can talk on these forums endlessly. It’s not stopping the gods we’ve created from killing us all. Until we take responsibility for creating them and sustaining them, we will never eliminate or modify them.

      I think we made a mistake when we retired the space shuttle program. Instead of spending 1 mil. per shuttle to put them in museums, we should have launched each one again. We should have packed them full with politicians, government officials, some scientists and inventors, CEOs, and dictators, like sardines, and shot them into space on a one-way ticket. And we could have even spared them their 4th amendment rights and skipped the body scan before the flight. There’s nothing in the Constitution that says we can’t still do this, is there? How many narcissists does it take to fill a space shuttle?

      “Soylent Green is people.” – Charlton Heston from the movie Soylent Green. Not so fictitious after all. Why do we never learn.

      • Kate8

        Scared – Don’t you think they’ve got what they wanted from the space program? Not the one we saw, but the REAL one? Don’t you think that the elite of elite plan to make a swift exit into space when our destruction is imminent? That is, if they haven’t left already.

        Science and technology is lightyears ahead of what they show us. What we see is at least 50 years behind. Maybe even centuries.

        Do you really think that we have the computer technology, medical technology and others, as well, but haven’t advanced past the same old rocket launches we’ve seen for half a century?

        I have to wonder if the ones who will go into the bunkers aren’t the semi-elite bozos in government who are expendable.

        Jus’ sayin’.

        • Dan az

          :)We can only hope :)I still think when they close the doors on the bunkers we back up a cement truck and dump on the door. :)

          • Kate8

            Dan az – Great idea, but it may not be necessary.

            If this cycle brings the magnitude of destruction indicated by astronomers and Revelation (and other scriptures), these luxurious bunkers (built with money STOLEN from those they plan to sacrifice, IOW ill-gotten gains) will become their tombs.

            Evil always gets trapped in its own snares.

          • Dan az

            Kate
            I love it when a plan comes together :)

        • Tony

          No one paranoid here huh? LOL

      • Altaica

        Those Rife machines are interesting, but I certainly will have to do more research on them. I know there are lots of inventions suppressed so businesses can make a buck. I know there was a much more fuel efficient engine designed decades ago that was suppressed. It’s one messed up modis operandi.

  • Altaica
    • Dan az

      Well that settles it I just wont eat anymore,Grouse!

      • Altaica

        All the more reason to support the local farmers and grow your own. One of the reasons I want my own home is so I can grow my own food.

  • milt

    Making laws on top of laws is killing us farmers as their laws keep piling up prices that our farmers cannot pay for. Laws are being dreamed up that farmers have no input from. When food prices go up farmers get blamed when in reality it is laws being made up by our government It is us farmers that are being pinched in the middle from which we cannot escape. In reality the tools we need to raise our crops are going up higher then the products we sell to make a living from.

  • Henry Ledbetter

    Thanks for the article…..I personally believe The FDA is doing more harm than good at this point in their history. This is after having to go outside the box to find a cure for RSD my wife suffered after surgery last year. The FDA regulations hindered the treatment we felt she needed and blocked her insurance company from helping.. Our actions probably saved my wife from being a cripple or dead and saved them possibly more major surgery at a tremendous cost. My wife is now doing great and off all prescription drugs..

  • weeble71

    I know this is slightly off subject and i may be being a bit simple but surely the best way of getting all big business, unions and lobbist out of the goverment is to make it illegal for anyone running for goverment (president or congress) to take donations from outside influence. There needs to be a set amount of dollars allocated to each prospective candidate for office, paid for out of taxes. they should not be allowed to take monies from anyone else. This would eliminate outside influence’s (big business,unions and the like) and would also reduce the absolutely stupid amounts of money spent on elections. Candidates would not then be under anyones thumb. If anyone (holding office)is found to be taking money from big business,unions or lobbist, be it cash or promises of a high powered job then they should be removed from their position and prosecuted. If this was done then maybe, just maybe we would get a more resposible form of goverment.

    • Altaica

      We’d certainly have a much smaller government.

    • http://www.refugeofscoundrels.blogspot.com Stefano

      That’s a disastrous suggestion on several levels.

      First, the pesky first amendment to the constitution. They just struck down Mccain-Feingold, which essentially did what you advocate. Campaign donations are a form of speech.

      Furthermore, I don’t want my tax dollars to support the campaigns of Charlie Rangel or Rick Perry or such.

      Third, putting the govenrment in charge of campaign finance isn’t going to shrink government. Every new area of authority is an expansion of government.

    • DaveH

      As Stefano pointed out, weeble, it will not work the way you hope.
      There is only one real solution, and that is for Mainstream Americans to break out of their propaganda-induced stupors and educate themselves. There is no excuse for anybody now with the power of the Internet to continue being unaware of the realities of Big Government.
      Reading this website is a good start.

    • Amy

      Is money speech or a bribe? To me it’s a bribe because the person giving the money is attempting to buy someone’s vote. As I’m sure you are aware the supreme court isn’t always right, but we do have to live with the decissions.

      • DaveH

        Full disclosure of campaign contributions is all we need, Amy. The rest is up to us.

  • Janet

    When I was a child we ate things out of the garden; drank plenty of raw cow milk most days of the week; out of the six children and 2 parents
    none of us ever got sick growing up.
    ‘Bout the only time we went to the doctor was if and when we cut our head or parts of the body that needed stitches.
    My how times have changed.
    I’d say 99% of things in a grocery will eventually kill ya.
    Cancer is an epidemic in our country and our little kids are
    so sick.

    May the Good LORD have mercy on us and I pray we change our wicked ways. Yes, we certainly have ”choices” but boy what a price we pay in the long run.

    • Amy

      But yet in general people live longer, hummmmmm. I’ve read comments that doctors and pharma want to keep us sick. Ummmmmmm, who forces you to go to the doctor? I’ve always made it my decission to seek medical help. When i get sick no one comes to my door and forces me in a black SUV and takes me to the doctor. No one forces me to buy the perscriptions.
      Things that cause cancer have always been around. It’s just that we know more now. People have always died of cancer, but it just wasn’t known or understood that they had cancer. At one time you could die from something as simple as strep throat. But now we have medication that will get rid of it. But if you choose to not go to the doctor and not take any drugs that is up to you.

      • Song

        I agree with you Amy. There are a lot of “alarmists” on this board. That’s okay, some of what they are concerned about are true but if we read everything that is being put out about our food etc., we wouldn’t eat. We couldn’t eat and we can’t and couldn’t drink the water. I stopped paying attention to studies and statistics when the claim that apples can cause cancer came out, for example. And none of that explains why people are living longer and that the quality of life has greatly increased since the industrial era, for example. Nobody forces me to go to the doctor either and I prefer to try natural healing alternatives first but when those don’t work, i am very glad for modern science. Is the FDA over-reaching and heavy-handed? Yes, I would agree with that as well as they are now targeting natural supplements and raw milk is sadly a thing of the past for most consumers.

  • jacksmith

    REALITY!!

    (my.firedoglake.com/iflizwerequeen/2011/05/16/how-about-a-little-truth-about-what-the-majority-want-for-health-care/ )

    ( Gov. Peter Shumlin: Real Healthcare reform — youtube.com/watch?v=8yFUbkVCsZ4 )

    ( Health Care Budget Deficit Calculator — cepr.net/calculators/hc/hc-calculator.html )

    ( Briefing: Dean Baker on Boosting the Economy by Saving Healthcare t.co/fmVz8nM )

    START NOW!

    As you all know. Had congress passed a single-payer or government-run robust Public Option CHOICE! available to everyone on day one, our economy and jobs would have taken off like a rocket. And still will. Single-payer would be best. But a government-run robust Public Option CHOICE! that can lead to a single-payer system is the least you can accept. It’s not about competing with for-profit healthcare and for-profit health insurance. It’s about replacing it with Universal Healthcare Assurance. Everyone knows this now.

    The message from the midterm elections was clear. The American people want real healthcare reform. They want that individual mandate requiring them to buy private health insurance abolished. And they want a government-run robust public option CHOICE! available to everyone on day one. And they want it now.

    They want Drug re-importation, and abolishment, or strong restrictions on patents for biologic and prescription drugs. And government controlled and negotiated drug and medical cost. They want back control of their healthcare system from the Medical Industrial Complex. And they want it NOW!

    THE AMERICAN PEOPLE WILL NOT, AND MUST NOT, ALLOW AN INDIVIDUAL MANDATE TO STAND WITHOUT A STRONG GOVERNMENT-RUN PUBLIC OPTION CHOICE! AVAILABLE TO EVERYONE.

    For-profit health insurance is extremely unethical, and morally repugnant. It’s as morally repugnant as slavery was. And few if any decent Americans are going to allow them-self to be compelled to support such an unethical and immoral crime against humanity.

    This is a matter of National and Global security. There can be NO MORE EXCUSES.

    Further, we want that corrupt, undemocratic filibuster abolished. Whats the point of an election if one corrupt member of congress can block the will of the people, and any legislation the majority wants. And do it in secret. Give me a break people.

    Also, unemployment healthcare benefits are critically needed. But they should be provided through the Medicare program at cost, less the 65% government premium subsidy provided now to private for profit health insurance.

    Congress should stop wasting hundreds of millions of dollars of taxpayer money on private for profit health insurance subsidies. Subsidies that cost the taxpayer 10x as much or more than Medicare does. Private for profit health insurance plans cost more. But provide dangerous and poorer quality patient care.

    Republicans: GET RID OF THE INDIVIDUAL MANDATE.

    Democrats: ADD A ROBUST GOVERNMENT-RUN PUBLIC OPTION TO HEALTHCARE REFORM.

    This is what the American people are shouting at you. Both parties have just enough power now to do what the American people want. GET! IT! DONE! NOW!

    If congress does not abolish the individual mandate. And establish a government-run public option CHOICE! before the end of 2011. EVERY! member of congress up for reelection in 2012 will face strong progressive pro public option, and anti-individual mandate replacement candidates.

    Strong progressive pro “PUBLIC OPTION” CHOICE! and anti-individual mandate volunteer candidates should begin now. And start the process of replacing any and all members of congress that obstruct, or fail to add a government-run robust PUBLIC OPTION CHOICE! before the end of 2011.

    We need two or three very strong progressive volunteer candidates for every member of congress that will be up for reelection in 2012. You should be fully prepared to politically EVISCERATE EVERY INCUMBENT that fails or obstructs “THE PUBLIC OPTION”. And you should be willing to step aside and support the strongest pro “PUBLIC OPTION” candidate if the need arises.

    ASSUME CONGRESS WILL FAIL and SELLOUT again. So start preparing now to CUT THEIR POLITICAL THROATS. You can always step aside if they succeed. But only if they succeed. We didn’t have much time to prepare before these past midterm elections. So the American people had to use a political shotgun approach. But by 2012 you will have a scalpel.

    Congress could have passed a robust government-run public option during it’s lame duck session. They knew what the American people wanted. They already had several bills on record. And the house had already passed a public option. Departing members could have left with a truly great accomplishment. And the rest of you could have solidified your job before the 2012 elections.

    President Obama, you promised the American people a strong public option available to everyone. And the American people overwhelmingly supported you for it. Maybe it just wasn’t possible before. But it is now.

    Knock heads. Threaten people. Or do whatever you have to. We will support you. But get us that robust public option CHOICE! available to everyone on day one before the end of 2011. Or We The People Of The United States will make the past midterm election look like a cake walk in 2012. And it will include you.

    We still have a healthcare crisis in America. With hundreds of thousands dieing needlessly every year in America. And a for profit medical industrial complex that threatens the security and health of the entire world. They have already attacked the world with H1N1 killing thousands, and injuring millions. And more attacks are planned for profit, and to feed their greed.

    Spread the word people.

    Progressives, prepare the American peoples scalpels. It’s time to remove some politically diseased tissues.

    God Bless You my fellow human beings. I’m proud to be one of you. You did good.

    See you on the battle field.

    Sincerely

    jacksmith – WorkingClass :-)

    • MNIce

      You haven’t done your research. We’ve had “public option” programs for certain classes for more than 40 years. They’re called Medicare and Medicaid, and they’re a big part of the reason health care is so expensive. The waste of professional skills and time used to fill out government-required paperwork is appalling (30% of a doctor’s time).

      You might also want to check the historical records on the cost-effectiveness and overall customer satisfaction of single-payer health care systems in other countries. People in those countries either come to the US or some other semi-open market for health care, or they die of routinely treatable illnesses because their own country’s health care systems are swamped with long waiting lists or they ration care.

      Health insurance per se is not immoral. It is problematic when it serves to disconnect the customer from the cost of his choices. Some health care insurers act immorally by using government to manipulate the insurance marketplace, for example by limiting insurance choices through mandated policy structures.

      The best option would be a free market place with readily available, verifiable information. A decently sized population of lawyers to help collect reasonable compensation for the results of irresponsible behavior on the part of the producers is an important part of the equation. (Note the qualifiers “reasonable” and “irresponsible”. It is undeniable that there have been abuses in the legal system as well – to the point that quite a few cases are nothing but Legal Lotto.)

      The most efficient markets are based on information, knowledge, reputation and integrity. When you don’t know what you’re buying, couldn’t understand it if you are told, have no idea who you are buying from, and one or more of the suppliers may be dishonest, you aren’t going to be happy with the result. And if it all goes through a government gate-keeper, it’s going to be even less efficient and even more costly because you won’t be told anything, the gatekeeper will have a great deal of corruptible power, and won’t hurry because he isn’t paid to get things done quickly unless it’s done under the table.

  • LAW2

    We raise livestock, sheep and cows. Those animals are organic when they leave our ranch. They have been raised in a holistic manner. However, I have no control or information as to what inputs are added once they are sold. We actually looked at selling direct to the consumer about 15 years ago and the regulation was so horrific and the cost of licencing so high that we gave up before we started! The USDA and the FDA exist for one reason, to investigate a food borne outbreak and assign blame. They do not have enough budget or inspectors to look at even 2% of the food out there prior to purchase, and that includes all the food that is imported in addition to food grown here. A little side note: In order to sustain a family of 4 you will need at least four acres of PRIME farmgroundand all the tools to keep it in production year round I will comment that there seems to be a lot of people living a lot longer these days; just not sure why. Maybe they aren’t working themselves into an early grave these days?

    • Buddy

      Sounds as if you’re doing things right.

      To answer the implied question regarding people living longer, think about who is living longer. Obviously, old people are – - and as a WWII vet, I obviously started out on food prior to the FDA being established. Also, my food choices were mostly simple then. Even in the army, in the 1940s, food was simple. Now, it’s a bit complex as can be verified by looking at the contents of most any packaged food.

      Yes, we have a lot of choices. My choices are mostly fresh foods. Seems to work for me.

    • DaveH

      Good Comment, Law2.
      My pet theory on longevity is the easy access we have in modern times to fresh vegetables, meats, and fruits, thus a healthier diet than they had in times past.

  • alabama redneck

    Well just try to get certain services and the doctor says,” cannot get
    that the government and told the company to stop producing it…Just
    look on the grocery shelf and notice almost all companies are putting
    less of their produce in the package, but charge the same price.. Yes
    we do have choices, only what the government limits us to choose from…
    Do you believe we can trust the government????just ask an INDIAN…

  • freeman

    Thanks for this great article. Having just witnessed here in California the absolutely incredible SWAT team style raid on a rawsome foods for the horrendous crime of selling to willing customers the horribly dangerous raw milk, I’m reminded of what a very smart man once said. Durk Pearson, who is legitimately one of the smartest people on the planet, and who is a research scientist whose specialty is life extension, and who wrote the books “Lie Extension,” and “Life Extension Companion,” and who has been to court on numerous occasions with the FDA, said that the existence of the FDA has caused more death and suffering than all of our wars combined. I agree with him, and a little research on FDA abuses and failings will have anybody agreeing, too. When a friend of mine defended the FDA one time, citing the victory over polio, I said that’s the equivalent of putting a person in the middle of a packed stadium with a machine gun and spraying the crowd. Then sorting through all the dead bodies and finding a serial killer and shouting: “Hey! Look at the good that I have done!”

  • robt shrugged

    all you have to know is that the government believes that we are stupid and they are god and are never wrong. when you have choice you have freedom and life. when you have government you have dictatotship and less choice, choice is freedom and i want freedom always. government hires those people who private industry will not hire because they will not meet the high standards of capitalism. industry wants the best, and government wants yes men, not agressive individualists.

    • Buddy

      No, I don’t believe that the “government”, whoever they are, think that “we” are stupid. I don’t believe that they think much about us. Rather, they primarily think about what is best for them and their campaign donations. As Carolyn Kennedy is quoted as saying, “They’re all in it for themselves”. And we support them by voting for the lesser of evils.

      • Scared To Death

        “What luck for rulers that men do not think” – Adolf Hitler. This is why any dictator has come in to power. This herd mentality is ancient, and it never changes. Rome, the Aztecs, the Chinese, the Japanese, the Germans, …

        This is human nature. We are stupid. We are weak. We are followers looking for a leader. And, mostly, we are fearful creatures with a strong sense of self-preservation at any cost.

        It’s not wise to consider yourself or the people on this forum. Look at the lowest common denominator in this country and listen to the way they think if you can get them talking. Strike up conversations and pick their brains. Then come back and tell me the government doesn’t think we’re stupid. They know the game all too well.

        • Altaica

          And with no child left behind the number of people ignorant to what is going on will increase.

  • Amy

    Origins of federal food and drug regulation
    Up until the 20th century, there were few federal laws regulating the contents and sale of domestically produced food and pharmaceuticals, with one exception being the short-lived Vaccine Act of 1813. A patchwork of state laws provided varying degrees of protection against unethical sales practices, such as misrepresenting the ingredients of food products or therapeutic substances. The history of the FDA can be traced to the latter part of the 19th century and the U.S. Department of Agriculture’s Division of Chemistry (later Bureau of Chemistry). Under Harvey Washington Wiley, appointed chief chemist in 1883, the Division began conducting research into the adulteration and misbranding of food and drugs on the American market. Although they had no regulatory powers, the Division published its findings from 1887 to 1902 in a ten-part series entitled Foods and Food Adulterants. Wiley used these findings, and alliances with diverse organizations such as state regulators, the General Federation of Women’s Clubs, and national associations of physicians and pharmacists, to lobby for a new federal law to set uniform standards for food and drugs to enter into interstate commerce. Wiley’s advocacy came at a time when the public had become aroused to hazards in the marketplace by muckraking journalists like Upton Sinclair, and became part of a general trend for increased federal regulations in matters pertinent to public safety during the Progressive Era.[26] The 1902 Biologics Control Act was put in place after diphtheria antitoxin was collected from a horse named Jim who contracted tetanus, resulting in several deaths.
    [edit] The 1906 Food and Drug Act and creation of the FDA
    In June 1906, President Theodore Roosevelt signed into law the Food and Drug Act, also known as the “Wiley Act” after its chief advocate.[26] The Act prohibited, under penalty of seizure of goods, the interstate transport of food which had been “adulterated”, with that term referring to the addition of fillers of reduced “quality or strength”, coloring to conceal “damage or inferiority,” formulation with additives “injurious to health,” or the use of “filthy, decomposed, or putrid” substances. The act applied similar penalties to the interstate marketing of “adulterated” drugs, in which the “standard of strength, quality, or purity” of the active ingredient was not either stated clearly on the label or listed in the United States Pharmacopoeia or the National Formulary. The act also banned “misbranding” of food and drugs.[27] The responsibility for examining food and drugs for such “adulteration” or “misbranding” was given to Wiley’s USDA Bureau of Chemistry.[26]
    Wiley used these new regulatory powers to pursue an aggressive campaign against the manufacturers of foods with chemical additives, but the Chemistry Bureau’s authority was soon checked by judicial decisions, as well as by the creation of the Board of Food and Drug Inspection and the Referee Board of Consulting Scientific Experts as separate organizations within the USDA in 1907 and 1908 respectively. A 1911 Supreme Court decision ruled that the 1906 act did not apply to false claims of therapeutic efficacy,[28] in response to which a 1912 amendment added “false and fraudulent” claims of “curative or therapeutic effect” to the Act’s definition of “misbranded.” However, these powers continued to be narrowly defined by the courts, which set high standards for proof of fraudulent intent.[26] In 1927, the Bureau of Chemistry’s regulatory powers were reorganized under a new USDA body, the Food, Drug, and Insecticide organization. This name was shortened to the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) three years later.[29]

    • Scared To Death

      So…you pulled this off of Wikipedia, Amy? I’m missing your point. What has this got to do with the corruption in the FDA? You must not have lost any loved ones, yet, to all of the problems going on with the current system. I wish I could say as much. It must be horrible to be a liberal who sticks their head in the sand while others watch and fight to keep the ship from sinking. It will be even more horrible when you finally pull your head out of the sand and see the devastation that has occurred because of people like you who live in what is called… denial. This is the lowest common denominator mentality that I was talking about before. If it were up to you, Amy, you would have been one of the people who stayed behind in England under the Monarchy, content, and complacent under the existing conditions. That’s right sweetie pretend it’s not happening. It can’t be real. Goodness will prevail. Narcissism and the human ego don’t exist. Greed doesn’t exist. Bad people don’t exist. Go to the garden in the sanitarium and do some art work. We’ll come get you when conditions are such that you’ll be able to tolerate it.

      Let me sing you a lullaby…”Stalin never existed, chairman Mau never existed, Hitler never existed, Carl Marx never existed, Castro never existed, the US government never annihilated the Native Americans, the US government never exposed its troops to agent orange, babies were never given immunizations that caused autism, drugs were never given to mothers to cause birth defects, people have never been prescribed drugs to cause suicidal thoughts or trashed heart valves, pesticides have never caused cancers or birth defects, Bin Ladden and Saddam Hussein never tortured and killed their citizens, China never shot students in Tiananmen Square, China never tortured and killed monks in Tibet, oil companies have never spilled oil and do not continue to do so, destroying the ground water, especially not in Colorado, (this is a REALLY long, long song, Amy, are you sleeping, yet?).

      Shhhhhh…I think she’s asleep. Yes, she’s definitely…asleep.

      The poor dear. I don’t blame her. What’s going on is too difficult to face.

      • Dan az

        Scared
        The sad thing is that when chit hits the fan they will just say,so I made a mistake everyone makes a mistake sometimes!We can only hope that they stay a minority.

      • Amy

        Some of what you described is exactly why we need agencies such as the FDA and EPA. To make sure that chemicals don’t go into ground water and such. Because of things like greed we need regulations to keep our markets in order. It’s because of things being too relaxed that bad things have happened. I want to FDA, I want an EPA, I want a department of education. I also want vacines availible so that my kids don’t get polio and other desieses that have been all but wiped out. If you don’t want to take them, fine, but stay the heck away from me when you get sick.
        The liberals actually care about people, we don’t want to aee people suffer, we don’t chear at the thought of someone dieing because they didn’t have health insurance. We feel senior citizens should be taken care of and health care, we want people to prosper and be happy no matter what clor their skin may be. We don’t want to see kids grow up in poverty but if they do at least give them the tools so they can get a good education and get themselves out of poverty.
        Does all this work all the time? No sadly it doesn’t because some people are lazy and don’t want to get out of poverty. But right now the conserivtives want to turn back the clock to 1800 when if you got sick you died. If it was unsafe in the mine you worked in you might die, you might not. If you lost your finger while making hot dogs it was simply ground up and included in the hot dog.
        I actually like the programs we have, social security, medicare, unemployment and so on. I like the progress we’ve made in the 20th century. I don’t want to go back to the 18th century where people die from strp throat and are given cocain to make them feel better

        • Scared To Death

          Amy,

          Who are you speaking for when you say “we”? Are you speaking for all liberals and you are telling us what their values are? Are you speaking for all conservatives and telling us what their values are? I didn’t know this was a discussion about liberals and conservatives. I thought this was about what has repeatedly happened historically and where humanity is today and the patterns that we are seeing being repeated that is headed toward more (and worse) devastation through corrupt government.

          Regarding your idea about illnesses… go and look at this website about frequency machines. http://www.rifevideos.com

          These machines are real. They destroy all forms of pathogens. They reverse cancer. And your friends at the FDA destroyed the physician’s lab, notes, and life’s work so the public wouldn’t have this medical miracle. They made it illegal and continue to make it illegal to have and use these machines. But guess what? There are people who have them anyway and have continued to improve the technology. And they work. They work.

          The FDA allows food to become mainstream that makes people’s bodies acidic and highly susceptible to pathogens and disease. They approve drugs before adequate testing and people die from these drugs. You are naive to believe that the government doesn’t have financial interests and greed. There are people on this forum who have serious concerns.

          Amy, why are you spending your valuable time on this forum? You’re here because you like to argue, not because you are a concerned patriot. I’m guessing that you are about 19-years-old, you live in your parent’s basement, and have no sense of patriotism. You should go back to school, learn how to spell and learn some history, and then go fill out job applications for government positions.

        • Scared To Death

          Amy,

          How many newspaper articles have you read in the past six months? Try reading this one about oil drilling in Colorado…

          Read more: Drilling spills rise in Colorado, but fines rare – The Denver Post http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_18881512#ixzz1Xqx2zal4

          There are people in our area who have big interest in screwing up our water supply for their own profit, too.

          This is the world you are inheriting, Amy. You had better get educated because you are in la-la land.

      • Amy

        The point is the FDA has been around since 1906. It’s not something just suddenly dreamed up to take your tax dollars away. It has done good and if it doesn’t do any good any more it’s because it’s underfunded.

        • s c

          A, the FDA is ‘under-funded’ the same way Congress is – it’s NOT. When you graduated from high school (I’m giving you the benefit of the doubt), did you wear a brown shirt and boots for the class photo? Our non-leaders couldn’t do what they do without lemmings and suck-ups to do their bidding.
          Thanks for admitting that you don’t claim to be a libertarian or a conservative. It was obvious from your first comments that you are a dyed-in-the-wool, starry-eyed, quivering-lipped, NWO utopian. Do your parents know?

          • Dan az

            :) to good :)

          • Tony

            from reading these comments it’s always easy to tell when someone knows they are wrong, they start name calling simply because they have no clue as to what to say.

        • Karolyn

          Amy – The problem with the FDA is it does the wrong things with the funding it gets!

          • Altaica

            Which is exactly the problem with several of our government agencies.

  • Amy

    It must be horrible to be a conservitive or libitarian. Always looking over your shoulder, thinking about conspircies, and afraid that someone will tell you Don’t pee in the pool because it’s your right to freedom to do so.

    Repeal the 20th Century – Vote Republican

    • Alex

      Good one, Amy!

    • Dan

      Actually Amy, it’s quite liberating to be a conservative. And it’s your right to bury your head in the sand and believe that nobody peed in the pool. God bless you, you’re gonna need it.

      • Amy

        I want laws to make sure nobody pees in the pool. You all want to do away with any law that you feel violates your freedom. I’m saying you all want to pee in the pool because you think you should be free to do so. I say we need laws so people respect other people. people and corporations can not police themselves. The government may not be friend but niether is big business who is actually running the government.

        • Dan az

          Actually Amy
          Its rather simple,just get out of the pool!Would you have armed guards at every pool to make you feel safe?Do you think that would stop anyone from peeing in the pool?All I can say to you stop drinking the water!

          • Amy

            So now I have to give up my freedom of going swiming so that you can enjoy your freedom to pee in the pool? This is the problem we have, everyone is so self centered on their on themsleves that no one considers anyone else. Just like the guy that thinks he has to drive 90 MPH on the road. Because he’s in a hurry he gives no thoughts about the safety of others. All he can think about is getting there.

            No need for armed guards, just rules that state if you pee in the pool you will told to leave.

          • Dan az

            Amy
            “So now I have to give up my freedom of going swiming so that you can enjoy your freedom to pee in the pool?” No you have a choice and that’s the great thing about liberty and freedom to choose and not be told to do what they think you should do.I’m sorry that you can’t see that,life must be pretty scary in your own mind.Maybe if you go see a doctor about it he could give you a pill.

          • Dan az

            Amy
            So If a small minority says they don’t like having say people walking on the side walk and they make the rules so you had to walk in the street is that fair to the majority.Just because you don’t like something it dosen’t give you the right to force your beliefs on all of us.And I would grant you the same.There will always be a few bad apples but it dosen’t mean you have to through all of them out just fix the problem with the few.Thats what the law is all about.But know its changed and instead of a simple law we need to keep adding to the laws until there is know freedoms and liberties left.Just for a few to feel safe.

        • Dan

          I want laws too, Amy. I don’t want to do away with any law that I “feel” violates my freedom, I want to do away with any law that “does” violate my freedom according to the Constitution.

          I have the freedom to cut my left foot off, that doesn’t mean I want to do it. I don’t want to pee in the pool “just because I think I should be free to do so”. What makes me want to pee in the pool is big government telling me not to.

          And I’m no fan of big business either. Not in its present form. If we can have a true free market system without big government interference, then big business will have to get “big” by giving us what we want at a price we like. Not just by having enough money to buy off big government politicians.

          • Amy

            You may not want to pee in the pool but someone does and will if there is not a rule about not peeing in it

          • Dan az

            Amy you really should go see someone about that!

          • Karolyn

            Do you really believe that rules stop people from peeing in the pool?

          • Amy

            People need rules to follow. from the poorest to the richest of us. From indivuals to corporations. It would be wonderful to not have rules and everyone did what was right, but that has never happened and never will. It’s up to the government to set and enforce the rules for it’s people. That’s just the way it is. At least here you have the opportunity to tell the government what you think about their rules. In some places you can’t do that and expect to live. This country might have flaws, we might have some stupid laws and regulations, but all in all we have it pretty darn good. I know I can go out to eat tonight and have a meal that won’t make me sick, because there are rules in place that help prevent bad food from being served. But as long as there is money there will be coruption. Back in the 19th century there was coruption. Ever hear the name Vanderbilt? If you look at the past you might understand the present and future a little bit better.

          • Amy

            Yes, I believe rules do keep people from peeing in the pool. You’ll never stop everyone, look how full our jails are. There is a difference between rules and taking away your freedom. Our founding fathers wanted people to be free, not to be able to run a muck and do whatever they wanted. They even had laws that prevented anyone from working on a sunday.

          • Amy

            Dan
            “No you have a choice and that’s the great thing about liberty and freedom to choose and not be told to do what they think you should do.I’m sorry that you can’t see that,life must be pretty scary in your own mind.Maybe if you go see a doctor about it he could give you a pill.”
            So my choice is, swim in filth, or not at all? That’s what you’re saying? That’s not right. Why should ten people have to choose not to swim just because one selfish person things he has the right to make a mess?

        • Altaica

          We had that rule, but all the messed up and convoluted laws and rules that were put in place covers up the fact. In essence we were founded with a set of laws and guidelines that protected our rights as free citizens so long as we do no harm to others. Now we have so many rules, written in convoluted legalese which are hidden and hard to find and filled with pork barrels and utter crap that the few things that are genuine and needed are weighed down like some poor SOB wearing cement shoes and getting tossed in the Hudson.

          Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness so long as you Do no harm to another’s rights. This has been my understanding of the spirit of our founding fathers. Should people be allowed to pee in the pool? No. Simply because in their choice in doing this they are doing harm to others. Simple really, but we have been trapped in a web of lies, backstabbing, and policies that we’re running out of places to go. If we don’t break through the strands we’re gonna be the spiders next meal.

          • Tony

            If the laws are hidden and hard to find out, then they probably don’t affect you, so what does it matter?

            Do no harm to others, OK that sounds good. So say I have a cow and sell it to you, only the cow is sick, looks ok, but is actually sick and I don’t know it so I don’t tell you it’s sick. You eat it and the meat kills you. Did I do harm to you? No, the meat from the sick cow killed you, you’re the one that bought it, I didn’t make you buy it, you bought it with your own free will. Therfore I did nothing wrong, right?

            But if we have a regulation that says every cow must be checked before it’s sold and I then knowly sell you a sick cow then that is different.

          • Kate8

            Tony – If you think that all cows are inspected, then you aren’t paying attention. They are only inspected at random. Same goes for dairy. Pasteurized milk is much more contaminated, by gross things like pus…but it’s allowed because it’s heated.

            Dead bacteria are unhealthy, too. Besides, bacteria give off toxins.

            I have a friend who has a family-owned slaughterhouse in Idaho. He can tell by the look and smell if the meat is tainted. He won’t process such meat (which is not true of all slaughterhouses), even if the owner wants him to. And the only meat he’ll eat is what he’s processed himself.

            The bottom line for most people is profit. This is true across the board.

            But then, I’m just your average paranoid, you know.

          • Altaica

            ::Tony says:

            “If the laws are hidden and hard to find out, then they probably don’t affect you, so what does it matter?”

            Actually they do, because there is a law that states ignorance of the law is no excuse. This means, even if you don’t know a law exists and you break it, you are still guilty and can be punished for it.

            So, in my home state it was not a crime to say spit on a sidewalk, rude and crass, sure, but if you did it there was no fine or jail time. In Nebraska, you spit on a sidewalk, guess what. I’ve been here 11 years, I only found out about that stupid little law a few months ago when a friend who is training in criminal justice pointed it out. The point is there are a lot of these little, hidden rules, that in a lot of cases are out dated or ridiculous that are hard to find.

            And it’s the same at the federal level. You don’t know you have done something “wrong” until they haul in you.

            Do no harm to others, OK that sounds good. So say I have a cow and sell it to you, only the cow is sick, looks ok, but is actually sick and I don’t know it so I don’t tell you it’s sick. You eat it and the meat kills you. Did I do harm to you? No, the meat from the sick cow killed you, you’re the one that bought it, I didn’t make you buy it, you bought it with your own free will. Therfore I did nothing wrong, right?

            Yes, that would be correct. I could also have chosen to have the animal inspected prior to purchase or in good business a third party that had nothing to gain would inspect the beast. It is an unfortunate fact that sometimes things like that happen, but if I were not to demand a bill of health on the animal before purchasing the animal, it was my choice and my own fault.

            If it is a government responsibility and they fail at their job, they are responsible because they are supposed to be acting as an inspector. I haven’t heard much about them being accountable for their actions. It is acceptable to them to allow a certain amount of pesticides on the foods in the store. The wax they allow on our food harbors dangerous bacteria. They guarantee that the food is safe. If I purchase the food and get sick, I made my choice based on their assertions. In that case they are at fault because they lied.

            “But if we have a regulation that says every cow must be checked before it’s sold and I then knowly sell you a sick cow then that is different.”

            Yes. Basically I don’t think all regulations are necessarily bad, what I think is bad is that decisions are being made based on how much they (The regulators) can profit. I do believe if those of us that want to take accountability for our choices and our bodies should be allowed to do that. And even with the government agency acting as a security blanket we still should not rest and believe everything is pure and clean. Cause it’s not, ultimately we make the final decision from the choices we have. Some of us want to have unprocessed choices and if we want to make that choice we should not be told by government that we can’t, but they are allowed to serve us mold laden food and pass it off as ok. You see, they are lying to us about the cow being sick and serving it to us. The corrupt parts need to be removed and reform needs to happen that both promotes fair trade and provides some protection to the consumer. That is ultimately what I feel needs to happen.

  • Dan

    The government is not your friend, you must look out for yourself. About this time last year, one of the articles on this website (I can’t find it now) opened my eyes about this stuff. I’m not easily convinced, but as I read more and learned more I got really scared. Since then I have devoted almost every extra dollar I had to getting out of the system. Chickens, rabbits, 2 cows, 2 goats, and about 1/8 acre of raised bed garden. I expect to be fully operational by Spring. Everybody tells me I’m crazy including my wife, but I’ll know exactly what I’m feeding to my children. And the feeling of independence is indescribable. You don’t need a lot of land or money to do this if you plan well. I’m on one acre and I’ve got about $5000 invested so far. Best money I’ve ever spent. Thank you to everybody here that helped open my eyes! Get off the grid while you still can.

    • Scared To Death

      You’re not crazy, Dan. Unfortunately for all of us, you’re a realist.

    • Amy

      Of course people living in a highrise apartment in New York City can also do this, right?

      • Karolyn

        To each according to what they are able. Actually, I have heard of people in the cities having rooftop gardens. Also, they can join cooperatives located outside the city. There are ways.

        • Amy

          So you’re saying everyone should grow their own food?

          • Dan

            Only if you don’t want to grow a tail.

          • Karolyn

            It would be nice if it were possible. However, people can be educated to make better choices. Unfortunately, most people really don’t care and don’t have a clue.

          • Kate8

            karolyn – There are some things that ANYONE can do.

            SPROUTS! Sprouts are packed with nutrition, are delicious and could sustain you for quite awhile, if necessary. They are ready in only 3 to 5 days.

            I especially love clover and sunflower sprouts.

        • Altaica

          Kate8,

          Have you tried Lupin sprouts yet? I’ve been itching to try them. I’ve read some great research on natural sugar control and apparently they are hearty and easy to care for.

          Amy,
          It’s all about what efforts people are willing to put in. I have seen some phenomenal systems for indoor plant growing that take up only a few feet of space and have multiple levels. Me, right now I’m in a studio apartment so I go to the local farmers and support them and get my food and shop in the organic aisles as much as I can. I also read labels and work on learning what I can about foods and what is best for me. How to clean the food safely when I have to buy it from a store. Where and how to store it. I freeze what I can for later use and keep dried and canned goods on hand. I had a back balcony garden last year when I had a place with a balcony and the tomatoes, beans and thai basil did pretty well, but the heat was pretty bad. It’s not always affordable to eat healthy, I understand that. I live paycheck to paycheck, but I also buy bulk dried goods to get me by. Things like dried legumes, Quinoa, Amaranth, seaweed and rice make up the bulk of my food stores. I use a water filter pitcher to remove as much of the horrible stuff in my water. (The water tastes like a pool here and I can’t even stand the taste unless I am desperate.) There are options if you want to make those choices, I just want to make sure that those options are open. My drinking raw milk does no harm to anyone else, so I should be able to have it. If I could find it that is.

          • Kate8

            Altaica – have you checked out Berkey gravitational filters?

            It’s one of the best things I’ve ever purchased. Now I have clean, fresh tasting water that I love to drink.

  • Alex

    Stupid Fright Wingers hate regulations because they are “bad for business”.

    Tell the women who died in the Triangle Shirtwaist Factory that regulations are bad.
    Arsenic in groundwater equals freedom!
    Feces in food—-Go America!
    Children’s pajamas made from kerosene-soaked flannel—Capitalism rocks!!
    Buildings that collapse in the night—Free Markets!

    It’s is truly all about the Benjamins—if it increases profit then it must be RIGHT!!
    Ignorant Amerikan sheeple—anything for a buck!

    • Dan

      Correction: “bad for freedom”

      This is the real world, and bad things will happen, but the free market will bear these things out a lot better and a lot faster than government regulation will. And we’ll get to keep our freedom too!

      • Jay

        Dan, to some people the government is like mommy, and daddy. I suspect that people like Alex and Amy grew up in a very sheltered home where mom, and dad constantly hovered, and made all of their decisions for them. This may be why they are so, pro-government! One has to wonder if they make any of their own decisions, or do they seek advice, and direction from daddy government on everything?

    • Karolyn

      You just don’t get it, do you?

      • Amy

        No actually I don’t get it. How does the FDA effect your freedom?

        • http://www.refugeofscoundrels.blogspot.com Stefano

          Amy,

          You’re not very well-informed.

          First, the FDA has nothing to do with groundwater. F is for food. D is for drug. A is for administration.

          Second, the problem is that there is no accountability. If they make a mistake, their government status protects them from repercussions. Also, as with many government agencies, they work with outdated data. They ban things like raw milk, which many people prefer for a host of reasons. They admit corruption and failures to hold inspections and such. Every year there will be salmonella outbreaks from FDA inspected facilities. In short, they do their jobs poorly, but yet they keep them because they are government agents.

          Third, they drive up the costs and stretch the timeline of bringing new drugs to market, because of arbitrary, bureaucratic nonsense.

          The free market provides several alternatives to government standards: natural food certifiers exist as an alternative to the “certified organic program; Kosher food is certified completely by private companies. The point of the essay is that private, third party companies could fill the role of the FDA and USDA more efficiently and effectively than the government. It’s not about conspiracies, but about common sense and basic logic. Two things of which you seem utterly devoid.

          • Amy

            So there are corupt so lets do away with it all together?

        • Dan

          Big government regulation in general affects OUR freedom.

          • Tony

            How?

        • Karolyn

          Amy – Try visiting http://www.anh-usa.org and also mercola.com. Very informative sites.

    • Amy

      I think what it all comes down is they hate Obama so much that now anything remotely connected with the government is considered bad. Theses things were put in place as a measure to help protect the people of this country. Can imagine if drug companies didn’t have to get drugs approved before they went on sale? They would be on the market before anyone did any testing just so they could make a dollar. What if there was no department of health? Would you ever want to eat out if no one told them to clean up the kitchen? They think everyone will just police themselves and do the right thing because if they don’t they won’t be in business. This nation went down that road, that’s why we have these agencies. Don’t worry about putting expiration dates on meat, so what if someone gets sick. It’s because they are just plain paranoid and they continue to read blogs to reinforce it.

      • http://www.refugeofscoundrels.blogspot.com Stefano

        I am starting to think that it is impossible to put this in a way you’ll understand, but I’ll try once more.

        If the FDA were abolished, private companies would take their place. The difference would be that the private company would make money by certifying the efficacy of drugs, so they would be motivated to streamline the process. At the same time, they would be subject to legal action and loss of revenues, which would encourage thoroughness and accountability. In the end, better consumer protection would be provided by the free market.

        If you chose to buy “uncertified medication,” that would be your right. And a risk that you’d have to take.

        Please stop betraying your incapacity for abstract thought by trotting out straw men and ad hominems.

        • Amy

          But who polices the private company? What keeps them becomeing corupt? In theroy the government won’t become corupt because they don’t make a profit, but yet they are corupt, so a private company would be in it for profit, which means drug and food companies will have to pay to have their stuff tested which means the price goes up more.
          Hummmmmmmmmmmmmmm, and who loses? the consumer

          • Kate8

            Amy – I suggest you do a bit of research so you have a clue what you are talking about.

            Drug companies, food comanies, etc. DO pay for their own research. They do it themselves! Results are skewed to favor the product, and the good ol’ boys in the FDA sail it through, with a pay-off, of course.

            Drug companies find it more profitable to put drugs on the market, reap huge profits and then deal with the lawsuits later. This comes straight from insider information.

            One thing you need to learn is that NOTHING is as it seems. They promote the illusion that government is good, government cares about you, government looks out for you. Those who quesion government are bad.

            Nonsense.

            This has nothing to do with Barack Obama. He is just the latest in a line of liars-in-chief.

          • Jay

            The customers, or the consumers, police private companies Amy. If we don’t like their product(s), we simply stop purchasing the product. At this point, the company either shapes up, or goes out of business. It’s that simple. Why in the world do we need government to determine for us, what is a good, or a bad product. Come on Alex and Amy, don’t you think it’s time to put on the big boy pants, and start making your own decisions? Maybe both of you should start thinking about moving out of your parent’s basement!

        • Alex

          Stefano, I bet you think that Massey Energy can extract all the “clean coal” through mountaintop removal they want, as long as the market is there.

          The biggest problem with this nation, from which nearly all the myriad other problems metastasize, is American Selfishness. We want bargains, always bargains—no matter the TRUE cost to people and/or the environment. We want cheap gasoline so we can drive our latest Ford Excretion five blocks to Wal-mart to buy more cheap junk made by unknown children in places we cannot find on maps, even though we have sent our mercenaries there to enforce Capitalism. We eat garbage because it is cheaper and pay manicurists better than teachers because Amerikans are vain and self-righteous, oblivious to the world around them.

          The anti-regulatory crowd is pretty much the same anti-Progressive lynch mob—they want to live in the old White Estates of Amerika, where it is okay when the river catches on fire and the “pro”-life mommas birth Thalidomide babies.

          What is it about Progress that so rattles you people, anyhow? And why are the people of this country so flippin’ selfish? Most of you profess to belive in God or the Gods or Whatever yet all you seem to do is grab grab grab. For God’s sakes, the whole country is stolen property and we celebrate that!

          Cheapskates! rather pay for our mercenaries than for doctors or teachers! Cheap houses! Cheap food! Oh my God…

          You people should listen to Tom Waits’ “Step Right Up” HAA!! One size fits all! Year-end clearance! Don’t be fooled by cheap imitations! No fuss No muss! How do we do it? VOLUME! VOLUME!! VOLUME!!!

          Oh man, I’m tired—meant to give thanks for the REGULATIONS that make life in this wretched country marginally bearable.

          • Karolyn

            Alex, I am considered a liberal on this site, although I think of myself as independent; howevwer, after years of following the practices of the FDA and USDA, I would have to say they just totally overdo everything, especially if Big Pharma and/or Monsanto is in the mix. Personally, I believe they do have a place, but it’s not the one their currently occupying, which is totally in the Big Brother category. How old are you anyway? You sound pretty young.

          • Karolyn

            BTW – You sound like a very miserable person (“life in this wretched country marginally bearable.”). Maybe you’re consuming too many chemicals in your food, which is perfectly alright by FDA standards. Think about it.

          • Jay

            Karolyn, i agree, Alex sounds very angry, and frustrated! I suspect it may be drug related, as there are days when his postings are the epitome of rational, and common sense, and then there are postings such as today, that are filled with aggression, and temper tantrums! Could also be a split personality disorder. Not sure. But one things for sure, there is noticeable inconsistencies in his social decorum!

          • Tony

            Alex you are correct, it’s cheap cheap cheap grab all you can get. Mine mine mine. One thing I have noticed, when someone says they are a born again Christian, LOOK OUT! Those people are typically the greediest, back stabbing, self centered people I have ever met.

          • Jay

            Hey Tony, have you ever met yourself?

          • Altaica

            Alex, have a look into Monsanto and how the government rulings are allowing this company to browbeat and destroy American and Canadian farmers and you’ll get an idea of why I think there needs to be reform.

            Also look up Vioxx. Read the papers on that. The FDA allowed it to sell without a warning label that Merck labs issued that needed to be added after research. There was a very large number of deaths and the FDA did not police this drug at all, it was Merck who ultimately pulled it from the shelves.

            These are just two examples as to why I feel there needs to be change. The system is broken it is time for it to get fixed. I am not advocating a total lack of regulation, but removing outlandish regulations. Making regulations fair across the board and not to the benefit of one company over there other, (have a look at the links provided earlier, read about the reason as to why we have HFC.)

            I think, like UPS and Fed ex compete with the USPS we should have some private companies that provide regulatory inspections and have them all hold to the same set of regulations.

          • http://www.refugeofscoundrels.blogspot.com Stefano

            Thalidomide was approved by the FDA, moron. Just like Celebrex/Vioxx, Fen-Phen, and virtually every other drug with catastrophic consequences. Which is precisely my point.

            Ag Regulations hurt small, generally conscientious farmers and benefit agribusiness like Monsanto.

            You might know this if you quit worshiping regulation for its own sake, and actually studied the things you have the foolish boldness to comment on.

      • Alex

        You are correct Amy.

      • Dan az

        Amy
        If you think big pharmy is having there drugs tested then I would sugest that you start looking at all the drugs that are killing people and you will see that there paying their way by using us as test subjects and can afford to loose a few before they take it off the market.Get real Research the truth instead of blathering on with liberal conjecture.Get the truth its out there!

        • Kate8

          Dan az – People are catching on to the efficacy of “vibrational medicine”.

          I say that ALL medicine is vibrational.

          All things are frequency. The frequency of any substance is either compatible with biology or it isn’t.

          Foods and natural medicines vibrate in harmonious frequencies with our biology. Pharmaceuticals do not. They will often supress symptoms, but they have no capacity to heal, and will eventuall cause harm.

          If we look at things from the perspective of whether they are of harmonious vibration with out bodies, or of disruptive/incompatible vibration, we will have our answers. Remember that the earliest allopathic remedies were toxic metals, like mercury. People often died of the “cure” (just like now).

          • Karolyn

            Read “Power vs. Force” by Dr. David R. Hawkins. Using kinesiology, you can hold something in your hand (or your mind) and find out if it is good or bad.

          • Kate8

            Karolyn – Back in my early days in healthcare (early ’80s) I worked in a clinic with an Applied Kinesiologist. I learned a lot from him.

          • Altaica

            You guys might be interested in Didgeridoo information. I have been learning that they play one in the F key up and down your spine. I want one done, but I do feel more in tune or balance in that key which is considered the healing key. Apparently that particular didgeridoo is supposed to be very hard to play, but I was able to manage. Drums are my main form of music, but I find music that syncs up with me helps me with a lot of things.

          • Kate8

            Altaica – That sounds great. Sound is known to have a powerful effect on things, for better or worse, depending on the frequencies.

            Do some research on the solfeggio musical scale. It was the original scale used in music, and had a positive effect on our bodies and psyche. (There is stuff on YouTube, too. Sacred sounds.)

            Then the military began doing experiments on the effects of sound for warfare purposes, and discovered that if you adjusted the scale by a few hertz, instead of having positive effect, it became discordant and destructive. (This was earlier in the last century). They caused all instuments to be adjusted to the new scale, and hence, we have the music we have today.

            Fortunately, due to the work of men like Dr. Leonard Horowitz, they have returned knowledge of the solfeggio scale and awake musicians are returning to it for the good of mankind. 528Hz is love and healing of DNA.

            You can also buy numerous tuning forks, adjusted to the frequencies of chakras, organs, etc, which are used in healing.

            Fascinating subject.

          • Karolyn

            I have listened to solfeggio frequencies on Youtube in conjunction with meditation. Gregorian chants use them.

          • Karolyn

            Kate – I know you have mentioned before having knowledge of Emoto’s work with the influence of energy vibrations on water molecules. For those unintiated, high quality water molecules turn into beautiful crystals when subject to the emotion of love and into brown ugly clumps when subject to hate. There are videos on Youtube. Since our bodies are composed mostly of water, you can see the correlation of how negative energy can make us sick.

          • Kate8

            Karolyn – Thanks for reminding me about that.

            I played around with using 528Hz and beautiful music, placing speakers next to a glass of water, then drinking it. It was fun, but sometimes I’m easily distracted into something else and I forget about it. In fact, I used to listen to uplifting music all the time, and now I rarely play it at all.

            Maybe it’s time to return to this soothing practice. In fact, there is a website where you can convert your favorite music to the solfeggio scale. I have it saved somewhere.

    • Altaica

      Unfortunately, the problem ultimately is that the agencies are not doing the job well. Reform needs to happen and those responsible need to be held accountable for their actions the same way we would hold a surgeon accountable for a botched surgery.

      I think another point to think about is when is regulation too much or too little. What I see here is the corrupt members of the agency taking buy-offs and pass harmful drugs for their horse to win in the race. Or they allow harmful things in our food because of Company buy-offs. (Check out the links above on High fructose Corn Syrup) They have been given this power through over-regulation. Look up the whole issue on Vioxx.

      We have tipped over the balance of what is helpful and gone into the realm of what is harmful. When the FDA inspects facilities or products there are many examples of them treating two comparable products differently. To me the FDA should be an organization run by scientific method, but it is instead run by politics. Scientific method requires the evidence to be viewed in an objective manner, free of bias, and make a judgement based on the data collected.

      In my experience if you are a bad employee and you make mistakes you are punished and held accountable for those actions. If you cause big enough mistakes you are fired and replaced. This is not how the FDA is being run. As regulators no employee that works there should involved with any company or entity that their decisions would result in a positive gain for themselves. This makes them biased and unfit for the position. No business should have any input on the regulations put in place that solely allows for that company to make a gain. Such as the case with the whole HFC issue where there are limits on our import amount of sugar, a government regulation used to give preferential treatment to a major (80% of the market) company. This is corruption.

      In addition to this the FDA has effectively crippled us in our ability to make choices and informed decisions. They have with-held information on drug testing. They keep us ignorant to feed us drugs that will make some of the higher up FDA officials wealthy. They have also crippled our abilities to choose our food. If we want to purchase something from a non-regulated producer, like over seas or a local farmer they should let us make that choice. What goes in our bodies, ultimately should be our choice.

      As for the cleanliness, scroll up. I provided a link, from the FDA about their defect policies. They allow feces and insect parts in our food. They also allow companies to call something a “natural flavoring” but not disclose it’s source. I’m sorry but if the natural flavoring in my food is beef lard I have a right to know that. What if I have an allergy? What if I have religious beliefs that prevent me from partaking from any part of a certain animal? By allowing these mystery ingredients to go unnamed, they also affect our freedoms. There are some things I no longer eat because of what I found out was in them. Type into your browser the grossest food additives and you will get an idea. Did you know that shellac is used in our candies…yeah I use that to seal my art projects. I don’t want to eat it. How about that duck feathers and human hair are used in some doughs? These are not meant to be food items!

      I am all for someone who tests the standards and makes sure that they are upheld, but not one who is going to deceive the people and actually allow harmful ingredients in our food and medicines. I think that maybe we should allow private contractors in now to compete with the FDA and do some of the regulating. There certainly is a very good reason why one of my shopping stops is the kosher section of the store. I’m not Jewish, but I know if it is Kosher the standards are very high and I trust them.

  • Dan az

    This can’t be the same Alex from the other day he had sense!
    And karolyn Amy is just here to convince her self that she has know clue!

    • Karolyn

      Dan – I was thinking the same thing about Alex.

    • Song

      I think that there are 2 Alex’s that post on this site or Alex is Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde.

      • Jay

        You beat me to the punch Song. Either there are two people with the same moniker, or Alex is one sick puppy!

  • http://www.blogspot.snowflakehell.com Ken Brody

    Let’s have more light and less heat on a critical subject.

    Organic vs standard produce is a personal option. Salmonella and infectious E. Coli are not. The resources necessary to investigate, find the origin, and eliminate infected foods cannot now be duplicated by any private company or agency, and certainly the current laws would prevent private agencies from stepping in. Could a private company rise to this occasion? In time, yes. Could that private company be influenced by hidden dealings with produce suppliers when there are billions in liability and damages at stake. You betcha.

    I favor small government, but public health may not be served best by private enterprise. Still, there is lots of room for improvement at the FDA, whose scientific practices are 2 decades behind the times.

    • Amy

      Hey now Ken, We’ll have no logic here. Government bad. That’s all there is, Ha!

      Actually these people want to go back to the 19th century, forget about decades.

      • Song

        No Amy, that is where you are wrong. What (we) want is accountability on all fronts. Government is no different, no less corrupt then the industries and corporations that government is supposed to be holding accountable. This fact has been born out time and time again…like the attack on raw milk and now natural supplements. That may seem like a small thing, but it is an attack on our personal choice which is an attack on our freedom. Conservatives and Libertarians all care about the same things that you do but favor less, restrictive government. That does not mean absolute anarchy, free of any laws or rules or regulations like you or Alex seem to like to suggest. It means smarter laws, fewer laws and enforcement of the laws we already have. What it means is holding the government accountable as well as the corporations etc.

        • Karolyn

          Gee, song, for a change we agree! :-)

        • Tony

          The corporations own the government though. The only way to change this is to keep electing new people every two years. It might take a while until the politicians realize there job is not safe. It amazes me how campaigns are run today. No one will say exactly what they plan to do, only how bad it will be if the other guy gets elected. But no matter who gets elected the corporations are there to bribe them and call it lobby money.

    • http://www.refugeofscoundrels.blogspot.com Stefano

      Ken,

      There is no private alternative because it’s not allowed; not because “no private company could do the job done by the FDA and USDA.” Your assertion is preposterous.

      Everything the government does can be done more efficiently by private companies, and it is; except where the government bans competition. This is one of those categories.

      The point of the essay is that, in the absence of a government monopoly, private companies would immediately arise to fill the void.

    • Dan az

      Ken
      So you think that when the FDA says that all you need to do is smell the fish to tell if its been contaminated you believe them?Really?Thats what they did in the gulf!Why not go down there and prove to us they are doing there job!Hey your the one that thinks were all nuts Prove it!!!!

    • Altaica

      I do think it can be done. We have lots of scientists that have the same tools and abilities to do just that, only many of them are engaged in research or other endeavors.

      I think the important thing would be accountability. If we actually held the people in government agencies to the same level of accountability we would hold anyone else I think some, not all, of the issues could be dealt with. I think that there is a better solution out there then what we have, and it is clear that what we have is a very broken thing that needs a lot of fixing.

  • Amy

    Actually I’m here because I truely enjoy the paranoid thoughts that you all have and love to aurgue with you. I know you I will never win because you are very closed minded people who will only believe what you have been preprogramed to believe. It’s your nature, you can’t help it and I understand that. But it makes me feel a live to argue. Plus if people like me weren’t here you’d all be a bunch of yes men and women feeding off each other’s paranoid fears. HA!

    Repael the 20th century – Vote Republican

    • Dan az

      Thats all most funny Amy why don’t you stick around and prove One thing that you say instead of having us try to understand the liberal way of thinking.Thats classic.You see it you read it and yet it never sinks in.Ya you really got it together girl.Socialism has never worked and never will.Get over your self.

    • Kate8

      Amy – That would almost be hilarious if it weren’t so pathetic.

      You, my dear, are the indoctrinated one.

      I’m wondering, just how old are you?

      • Jay

        Dan and Kate, Amy can’t take people disagreeing with her, so she had a temper tantrum. Kate, you’re right, she sound like she may be a young whipper snapper.

    • Jay

      Amy, has it ever occurred to you that that may actually apply to you, and you may unknowingly be projecting?

    • slayerwulfe

      To not only Amy but the rest of you,she’s not that young at least mentally. HA! instead of Lol kind of interesting.

  • Curtis Mills

    It is my understanding that Whole Foods Market, Organic Valley, and Stoneyfield Farm tried to get genetically modified food listable as organic if it meets organic growing practices. Does anyone out there know if this is based on fact or fancy?

    • Karolyn

      I would seriously doubt the varacity of that, especially for Stoneyfield Farm.

    • DaveH

      This article makes it sound like they gave in to, rather then promoted GMOs:
      http://foodfreedom.wordpress.com/2011/01/27/organic-elite-surrenders-to-monsanto/

      • Karolyn

        Wow! That is depressing! It’s like rats deserting a sinking ship! Organic Valley and Stoneyfield are the only organic brands available in regular grocery stores. Soon we will be left with no choice! F Monsanto! Every time I pass by their farm in a town 28 miles from here I want to smear crap all over it! What can we do about it????

        • Kate8

          Karolyn – For one thing, the elite-owned corporations have been buying up all of the smaller organic companies. These include Hansens, Whole Foods, Odwalla and many, many more.

          It sucks, but you CAN’T TRUST ANYONE anymore.

        • Tony

          Guess you will have to grow your own food

          • Kate8

            Tony – Guess what? I DO! And have for many, many years.

        • DaveH

          Shrink the Government, Karolyn — Dramatically.
          Vote Libertarian:
          http://libertarianparty.org/

  • http://WellnessAwaitsU.com Larry Murawski

    It’s time for people to take responsibility for their Lives, and Health. Science has proven it, clinical studies have proven it, you are what you eat, no different than you are what you think. Start your day with 5 servings of organic fruits and vegetables with a 1oz. serving of great tasting Via Viente. A living whole food puree, no preservatives, non-pasteurized, Great for everyone, any age, with no side effects. If you’d like, you can see it here> WellnessAwaitsU.com

  • gserlin

    As a negligence lawyer for 44 years before I retired, I can tell you that the law of negligence, going back to the 12th century of the common era and even as described in the Bible, will cover this situation where personal injuries are caused by unsafe food. And all without the intervention of the govt.

    The way it works is as follows: a product is sold. If it injures a person (food poisoning, etc.), that person has the right to make a claim against the seller and/or processor of the food product. If the claim is not paid, the consumer has the right to sue the alleged negligent offender and the matter is disposed of by the court. The question of who caused the damages and the value of the injury are decided by the court. The govt is never involved, except to act as the neutral decision maker through the court. No bureaucracy, no regulations. Period.

    Once a suit is decided infavor of the claimant, all producers and processors are forewarned that their money will be used to pay damages, if they are negligent. They will avoid this by being more careful in the future. Problem solved.

    • Dan az

      Now there’s a new concept Free Markets I wonder why we don’t just do that? :)

    • slayerwulfe

      I liked the majority of your comment but I did ‘take’an exception to “And all without the intervention of govt.” I believe if you look closely at the Catholic church and others you will recognized them as possibly the earliest multinational corporations, that are equivalent to governments because they also held power over life and death. If I remember correctly there was a 12th or 13th century Pope who banned the manufacture of glass because it was made with fire, an element of the devil but he ate cooked food, definitely a government.

  • Kevin Beck

    I agree with you, Stefano. The farmers that belong to the co-op where I buy my food are higher on the trust quotient than Food Doctors Anonymous (or Foolish Drug Addicts: take your pick).

  • Dan az

    Kevin
    Mine too!

  • Robert Morrow

    i do not know just where this idiot is from but he should look up the facts. The FDA should be renamed to “Murder for Profits Inc.” I will just mention one thing. Just why is Plastic Foam, which by the way is outlawed in almost all countries in the world, to be laced with other poison toxins in breads and other food supplies? This does not mention wood product and other poison chemicals. All approved by the Shadow Government the FDA. Why, because it all boils down to Profits for the Pharmaceuticals and big food processors. That profit goes to pay the FDA and your own Senators, just like mine in New Mexico who would sell the own family for their part of the 30 pieces of blood stain silver. We have been sold out for Profits by the progressive socialist liberal and any other who would allow murder.

    • Karolyn

      It’s not just the “progressive socialist liberal” but the republican and even conservative politician who knows what side his bread is buttered on. Call a spade a spade.

  • Karolyn

    I just wanted to mention one thing that really sticks in my mind. I have been using Stevia for about 10 years; and up until 2 years ago, you could only get it in a health food store because the FDA would not classify it as a food. However, as soon as Pepsi and the other big companies started pushing so they could get their hand in it, it was approved for general consumption as a food. All this time it was withheld from the general public because the big companies didn’t want it cutting into their monoply on zero calorie sweeteners. As a totally natural, zero calorie sweetener, it far surpasses those artificial and harmful sweeteners. All this time people who wanted to restrict their calorie intake and also diabetics were forced to take those harribledisgusting artificial sweeteners that are still approved by the FDA. Aspartame is the worst, but they’re all bad.

    • Karolyn

      I thought I took out “harrible.”

      • slayerwulfe

        I thought it was for effect, I liked it.

    • Altaica

      Not to mention the recent studies have shown that those artifical sweeteners actually make you crave sugar. I though as a diabetic I was being a good girl switching to diet. I quit diet pops cold turkey when I found out. it is better for me to treat myself with a soda with real sugar than to drink that crap.

      Karolyne have you tried tje new Agave nectar sweetened sodas? They’re pretty good too and for me a plus as agave nectar falls on the lower end of the glycemic index.

      • DaveH

        I believe the worst thing about excess sugar (the case in most processed foods these days) is that it creates a craving that leads people to avoid carrots, celery, and other such healthy foods, thus causing your body to miss out on the nutrition of those foods.
        Do Stevia and Agave nectar have that same effect?

        • Karolyn

          Dave – I have heard of and am not aware of this being true of stevia and agave. I have heard that stevia may even be beneficial.

        • Altaica

          I haven’t run into those problems with Agave nectar. I have a co-worker that uses stevia as her sweetener and she consumes a very vegetable dense, low meat diet. I happen to love carrots and celery and to me a bag of carrots is as much a snack food as a bag of chips.

          Even though I am diabetic I rarely crave sugar, it is salt that I usually crave. I don’t add sweetener to most things, typically I only use sugar, honey or agave nectar when I am having a tea and the choice I make depends on how the flavors play with each other. If I am having Chai tea any of those will work, but if I have a ginger tea I’m more likely to grab honey or agave nectar over honey. If I have coffee or make iced tea I use sugar, which I have switched over to raw now that my white stores are depleted. I think as far as the sweet cravings go with natural sweeteners it has a lot to do with how your body reacts. Even I drank the diet sodas I did find I ate more because I felt hungry more often. Now that I have stopped drinking them and HFC drinks my hunger is more manageable and less chaotic. I do occasionally crave a soda or chocolate, but I have found as I pulled away from those two ingredients that if it is too sweet I feel sick or can’t handle more than a bite or two. Since my preferred chocolates are dark 60-80% cocoa they aren’t really all that sweet, and chocolate provides some good health benefits as long as you are eating the dark stuff. I used to drink anywhere from 4 to 6 cans of soda a day. Now, in an average week I drink maybe 3 or 4 cane sugar or agave nectar sodas. Rootbeer is my biggest weakness, which I can put off with Sarsparilla tea, but I have scaled back greatly on my sodas. The biggest craving I have noticed is the salt one. I’ve always liked salt, and I do crave it. I do get some of my daily amount from the V8 low sodium drinks. I know the cravings are likely indicating a deficiency, but are also part of being a Diabetic. Since I have scaled greatly back on processed foods and watch the labels more I am sure I am not in-taking as much salt as I used to. That’s ok, that is easy to manage and I have sea salt in my cupboard. I find usually when I crave salt I grab a V8 or celery or make my self an olive oil dip with sea salt and that takes care of it. I know I still have a long way to go, but I have come a long way since I was diagnosed. I’m always looking for new information and working my way to a more balanced, natural diet.

          • Kate8

            Altaica – If you are craving salt, make sure you use only whole sea salt, such as the Celtic salt (should be grey in color and moist). This will help to replenish your trace minerals, and is really good for you! In fact, it’s used to correct many health issues as a remedy. You may crave salt because you need the minerals. Everyone needs minerals, and we aren’t getting them anymore.

            Also, I was disheartened to learn that most chocolate is now GMO, so make sure what you get is certified organic.

            I like agave, too. Dr. Mercola says the problem with it is in the processing…that, like corn syrup, it is contaminated with mercury.

            I came to the conclusion years ago that life is hazardous to our health. So we do the best we can, and not worry so much about it. One thing we can do is something that is no longer practiced much, and that is the blessing of our food. It is said to rearrange the molecules so it becomes life-enhancing.

        • Altaica

          The nice thing about Agave and stevia is they are natural sources. The nectar is essentially the sap from the agave cactus, which I buy in the raw form. Stevia comes from a plant as well, but I am not as versed in it as Agave. Stevia didn’t seem to agree with my palette although my tastes have changed and I may try it again.

  • http://slayerwulfe slayerwulfe

    I understand the activity may be over on this page,further comment could be for nothing. The author of this page Stefano R. Mugnaini and the faith he has in his fellow humans and then there is Dr Oz. Motive? and does Dr. Oz have one, yes advertising dollars,advertisers want numbers,as viewers and without that Dr. Oz is gone. If Mr. Mugnaini has a motive it could be nothing more than an interested opinion.

    Arsenic comes in two forms organic and inorganic, the latter is considered more potent or harmful and is found combined with minerals in the earth.One such mineral Oriental’s made drinking vessels from,I believe the translation is agar,the concept what doesn’t kill you makes you stronger.If we are talking P.P.M. in ground water it may have less but pose a greater risk to health. I’m not real happy with the Dr.’s scare tactics compared to toxicological profiles. I hope somebody reads this I think it’s worthwhile, reading about our fellow humans.

  • robt shrugged

    amy you are a crazy person, because just think you are worried about people peeing in the pool, but birds poop in the pool, dogs,cats, and other animals pee in the pool so in your world you would kill all animals because they upset you. you have no idea of reality. when you are finished swimming just take a shower. I thought you were taught by your parents to do this. I must be mistaken, for you talk like someone who does not understand life.

  • robt shrugged

    will you tell me why

  • http://slayerwulfe slayerwulfe

    Dr.Oz’s apple jack crap may not be trending here but he is big time everywhere else, or ilka depending on what century you exist in.

  • robt shrugged

    why amy?

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