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The Institutionalization Of Tyranny

January 29, 2013 by  

The Institutionalization Of Tyranny
PHOTOS.COM

Republicans and conservative Americans are still fighting Big Government in its welfare state form. Apparently, they have never heard of the militarized police state form of Big Government; or, if they have, they are comfortable with it and have no objection.

Republicans, including those in the House and Senate, are content for big government to initiate wars without a declaration of war or even Congress’ assent and to murder with drones citizens of countries with which Washington is not at war. Republicans do not mind that Federal “security” agencies spy on American citizens without warrants and record every email, Internet site visited, Facebook posting, cellphone call and credit card purchase. Republicans in Congress even voted to fund the massive structure in Utah in which this information is stored.

But heaven forbid that big government should do anything for a poor person.

Republicans have been fighting Social Security ever since President Franklin D. Roosevelt signed it into law in the 1930s, and they have been fighting Medicare ever since President Lyndon Johnson signed it into law in 1965 as part of the Great Society initiatives.

Conservatives accuse liberals of the “institutionalization of compassion.” Writing in the February issue of Chronicles, John C. Seiler Jr. damns Johnson’s Great Society as “a major force in turning a country that still enjoyed a modicum of republican liberty into the centralized, bureaucratized, degenerate, and bankrupt state we endure today.”

It doesn’t occur to conservatives that in Europe democracy, liberty, welfare, rich people and national health services all coexist, but that somehow American liberty is so fragile that it is overturned by a limited health program available only to the elderly.

Neither does it occur to conservative Republicans that it is far better to institutionalize compassion than to institutionalize tyranny.

The institutionalization of tyranny is the achievement of the George W. Bush and Barack Obama regimes of the 21st century. This — and not the Great Society — is the decisive break from the American tradition. The Bush Republicans demolished almost all of the Constitutional protections of liberty erected by the Founding Fathers. The Obama Democrats codified Bush’s dismantling of the Constitution and removed the protection afforded to citizens from being murdered by the government without due process. One decade was time enough for two Presidents to make Americans the least free people of any developed country — indeed, perhaps of any country. In what other country does the chief executive officer have the right to murder citizens without due process?

It turns one’s stomach to listen to conservatives bemoan the destruction of liberty by compassion while they institutionalize torture, indefinite detention in violation of habeas corpus, murder of citizens on suspicion and unproven accusation alone, complete and total violation of privacy, interference with the right to travel by unaccountable “no-fly” lists and highway checkpoints, the brutalization of citizens and those exercising their right to protest by police, frame-ups of critics, and narrowing of the bounds of free speech.

In Amerika today only the executive branch of the Federal government has any privacy. The privacy is institutional, not personal; witness the fate of former CIA Director David Petraeus. While the executive branch destroys the privacy of everyone else, it insists on its own privilege of privacy. National security is invoked to shield the executive branch from its criminal actions. Federal prosecutors actually conduct trials in which the evidence against defendants is classified and withheld from defendants’ attorneys. Attorneys such as Lynne Stewart have been imprisoned for not following orders from Federal prosecutors to violate the attorney-client privilege.

Conservatives accept the monstrous police state that has been erected, because they think it makes them safe from “Muslim terrorism.” They haven’t the wits to see that they are now open to terrorism by the government.

Consider, for example, the case of Bradley Manning. He is accused of leaking confidential information that reveals U.S. government war crimes, despite the fact that it is the responsibility of every soldier to reveal war crimes. Virtually every one of Manning’s Constitutional rights has been violated by the U.S. government. He has been tortured. In an effort to coerce Manning into admitting trumped-up charges and implicating WikiLeaks’ Julian Assange, Manning had his right to a speedy trial violated by nearly three years of pre-trial custody and repeated trial delays by government prosecutors. And now the judge, Col. Denise Lind, who comes across as a member of the prosecution rather than an impartial judge, has ruled that Manning cannot use as evidence the government’s own reports that the leaked information did not harm national security. Lind has also thrown out the legal principle of mens rea by ruling that Manning’s motive for leaking information about U.S. war crimes cannot be presented as evidence in his trial.

Mens rea says that a crime requires criminal intent. By discarding this legal principle, Lind has prevented Manning from showing that his motive was to do his duty under the military code and reveal evidence of war crimes. This allows prosecutors to turn a dutiful act into the crime of aiding the enemy by revealing classified information.

Of course, nothing that Manning allegedly revealed helped the enemy in any way since the enemy, having suffered the war crimes, was already aware of them.

Obama Democrats are no more disturbed than conservative Republicans that a dutiful American soldier is being prosecuted because he has a moral conscience. In Manning’s trial, the government’s definition of victory has nothing whatsoever to do with justice prevailing. For Washington, victory means stamping out moral conscience and protecting a corrupt government from public exposure of its war crimes.

–Paul Craig Roberts

Paul Craig Roberts

was Assistant Secretary of the Treasury for Economic Policy and associate editor of The Wall Street Journal. He was columnist for Business Week, Scripps Howard News Service, and Creators Syndicate. He has had many university appointments. His Internet columns have attracted a worldwide following, and can be accessed here.

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  • http://personalliberty Alondra

    “The fundamental basis of this Nation’s law was given to Moses on the Mount. The fundamental basis of our Bill of Rights comes from the teachings which we get from Exodus and St. Matthew, from Isaiah and St. Paul. I don’t think we emphasize that enough these days. IF WE DON’T HAVE THE PROPER FUNDAMENTAL MORAL BACKGROUND, WE WILL FINALLY WIND UP WITH A TOTALITARIAN GOVERNMENT WHICH DOES NOT BELIEVE IN RIGHTS FOR ANYBODY EXCEPT THE STATE.” — President Harry S. Truman (33rd President, Democrat), from Attorney General’s Conference Address,1950

    “Leges sine moribus vanae” – “Laws without morals are useless”

    “Dei sub numine viget” – “Under the protection of God she flourishes”

    • http://personalliberty Alondra

      America is divided. America is not One nation, but two.

      One nation is progressing under The Kenyan jungle bunny, which is in the total godless evil spirit.

      Another nation still under God and who keeps its Pledge of Allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic with liberty and justice for all.

      “If My people who are called by My name will humble themselves, and pray and seek My face, and turn from their wicked ways, then I will hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin and heal their land. 15 Now My eyes will be open and My ears attentive to prayer made in this place. 16 For now I have chosen and sanctified this house, that My name may be there forever; and My eyes and My heart will be there perpetually.” (2Chronicles 7:14-16)

      “Seek the LORD while He may be found, Call upon Him while He is near. Let the wicked forsake his way, And the unrighteous man his thoughts; Let him return to the LORD, And He will have mercy on him; And to our God, For He will abundantly pardon.” (Isaiah 55:6-7)

      • Gary L

        Alondra, I agree with what you have said. However, you lose all credibility by using racial slurs just before you site scripture. Selah. It is this kind of talk that makes you look like a hypocrit.

      • http://www.personalliberty.com myopinion

        Gary truth is truth. We have to many in this country who cannot rightly judge between their right and left hands. To be Godless is to not agree with what God has said in his word. I choose to agree with God’s word and not government

      • Dave67

        Nice to know racist pigs are alive and well…

        You idiots (which includes the author) have no clue what real tyranny is. That is one thing for certain.

      • Robert Smith

        myopia says: “To be Godless is to not agree with what God has said in his word.”

        Absolutely FALSE.

        One doesn’t need your brutal god to know it is wrong to steal.

        One doesn’t need your brutal god to know it is wrong to murder.

        One doesn’t need your brutal god to know to cheat on a spouse.

        And so much more…

        Rob

      • Nadzieja Batki

        GaryL, you are the hypocrite by first phony praising Alondra and then sticking in your but to condemn her. What is wrong with calling predators like O and his followers exactly what they are of which you are one as well?

      • Bill

        Robert says
        “One doesn’t need your brutal god to know it is wrong to steal.

        One doesn’t need your brutal god to know it is wrong to murder.

        One doesn’t need your brutal god to know to cheat on a spouse.

        And so much more”…

        Then, why are you pushing liberalism?

      • Dave67

        Bill,

        Jesus was a liberal. But you do not need religion to know right and wrong or to be a moral person.

      • http://www.facebook.com/elton.robb Elton Robb

        @Dave67: No, Dave, you are wrong. Jesus Christ is moderate. Jesus said he is the Spirit of Truth, or he represents the Spirit of Truth. Therefore, he allowed everyone he had taught to choose for themselves. It was late in his 70 week ministry that he divided his disciples with an ultimatum.

        Compared to now, though, I see a change in how he is conducting his politics. He’s still the same Alpha and Omega, and it seems that we’ve pushed ourselves to the radical left in respect to his position. The majority of Americans are a stiff-necked people, we constantly tell our God: “You are wrong!” in relation to many of his pronouncements in Leviticus.

      • mark

        No, racism, is allowed on this site as long as it is directed at President Obama.

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing WTS/JAY

        mark: No, racism, is allowed on this site as long as it is directed at President Obama.

        No, racism is not allowed on this site, and you are liar for making such a ridiculous-claim!

        What is, allowed on this site is open-criticism of the one-party system…something you vehemently object to!

      • Bill

        When Robert made his holier than thou statements, I was pointing out the hypocracy of supporting a progressive agenda and talking the ten commamdments

        Liberalism in its pure form is communism which has murdered more poeple than any other cause in the last century. Obamacare will cause many untimely deaths also

        Liberalism as practiced by our current administration is determined to steal my wealth and freedoms.

        So, when Robert pushes his progressive policies then quotes the ten commandments, he is a hypocrit

        • Bob666

          Yo Bill,
          Really?

      • bfree

        AMEN Our government officials, which suppossibly work us ,had better wake up to this administration and its agenda in a hurry. You judge a man (or administration ) by its fruit. If this is true and I believe it is, then this lawless administration and possibly this country may very well be headed for a huge fall. The government deserves such,I pray the country does not.

      • Jana

        Dave67,
        You are right, Jesus was a Liberal, but that was a true liberal, not the same as what we have passing for liberals today, not the same at all.

        Robert was just giving praises to his god, Satan.

        Alondra, very good post. People today say we need to be politically correct. That is just a tool to control what we say. We need to start being more bold by stating the truth. Look at Robert he speaks his mind, eddie and no brain speaks their minds, and when we do we are told we are not tolerant or we are called some other kind of names. PHOOEY!

        Its time to speak out NOW as we have set back and been silent too long. We have allowed the lefties of this world to walk all over us, and now they are stepping in and taking over. It is going to happen. The Bible says so, but that doesn’t mean we have to lay down and let it. That is why we have spiritual armor to put on, so we can stand and fight.

        I am tired of hearing people say we can’t act like the left we have to act such and such way. Well, we can learn the tactics of the left and certain tactics yes, we can use.

      • Karolyn

        Jana – I’m pretty sure we would ever hear you use the racial slur Alondra used. Speaking plainly is one thing, but being so proud of speaking as crassly as you can is another. Sounds to me like Alondra should start her own KKK chapter if she hasn’t already!). She has admitted to being a bigot already.

      • Karolyn

        “never” hear.

      • Jeff

        “One nation is progressing under The Kenyan jungle bunny, which is in the total godless evil spirit.”

        IF, perchance, you had a point to make, no sensible person would ever see it because once you call the President a “Kenyan jungle bunny” you have surrendered your ability to be heard by anyone who isn’t a bigot and/or a right wing loon.

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        Have to agree with Jeff!!!

      • http://personalliberty Alondra

        Gary L, I almost blushed.

        However, there is no any surprise to hear the “rebukes” and “reproaches” from the hypocritical liberals like you, who do not hesitate to slander, demonize, ridicule, bully the opponents.

        Now tell me what “racial slurs” I used?

        Isn’t that true that the CRIMINAL Usurper is the Irish White-Negro (50/50) muslim, who was born in Kenya and whose father is a Kenyan?

        Gary, did you know that the TRUTH makes you FREE. But Libtards like you using Political Correctness to choke, strangle, suffocate, suppress, restrain the TRUTH, FREEDOM and LYBERTY, which were given us by Almighty God – the Creator.

        The Libtards want to be in control of people’s thoughts, speech and actions or inactions.
        Please do not go Ga-Ga and do not waste your time to “SHAME” me. I am not ashamed of the undeniable TRUTH.

        P.S. You wrote: “you lose all credibility by using racial slurs just before you site scripture.”

        Gary, more important fact is that God did NOT “lose any credibility”. And NEVER will. God is “the same yesterday, today and FOREVER.” He NEVER changes.

        “Great is TRUTH, and mighty above all things.” (2Ezdra 4:41)

        BTW, you just confirmed that you are the RACIST. You let me know that “BUNNY” is Caucasian. Did I offended “BUNNY”?

        LiberalGIST Alondra, Proud Naturalized American, Un-Apologetic Christian Bigot, the Tea Party Lover (in any sense), definite Homophobe & Islamophobe, the PC snubber and the Hater of the VOLUNTARY Stupidity

        • Bob666

          Alondra,
          you forgot the term “pig” in that description.

      • Jana

        Karolyn,
        You are right. I never have nor would use a racial slur.
        Thanks for catching that.

      • Right Brain Thinker

        I’m proud of you too, Jana. Now if your very existence could stop being a general “slur” against the concept of rational thinking, I would really sing your praises.

        You might start by looking at all the slurs you have leveled at many folks whose only sin was that they are better thinkers and more open-minded than you.

      • Right Brain Thinker

        PS to bob,
        Don’t get Alondra too stirred up. If she gets too agitated, she may attack the attendants at the asylum later, and their jobs are difficult enough as it is. Alondra, if you’re listening to any real voices right now, rather than those inside your head, let me sneak in one thought. You are the “nutty bunny” par excellence on PLD right now. YouGoGirl!

        • Bob666

          Yo RBT
          LMAO!

      • robb

        Never use racial slurs if you want to have anyone think you have a valid point or have knowledge of any kind. Above all, please do not quote scripture after using a racial slur. It’s insulting on so many levels.

      • http://personalliberty Alondra

        Karolyn @11:12 am
        Hey, Karolyn, since when the “jungle bunny” became the racial SLUR? Who decides what is racial SLUR and what is not. Who is “insulted” by the “jungle bunny”? The CRIMANAL Barry the Kenyan or Bunny?

        Karolyn, there is NO such thing as the “n” word. There is a letter “n”. But there is the Negroid aka Negro race. And your CRIMINAL double illegal puppet in the White House is White-Negro aka Mulatto. But in his TWO biographies he identifies himself as Black aka Negro (Frankly, NO ONE writes TWO biographies, and publishes them, when he is a NOBODY).

        For more than 20 years he attended Black Church, where was preached hatred and racism. In his racist Black pastor he had found a “SPIRITUAL mentor”, “ROLE MODEL”, “MORAL COMPASS”, “CLOSE friend”, “ADVISER”.

        His pastor with another disgraced Negro racist Jesse Jackson ‘arranged’ obamas marriage, because the “jungle bunny” belonged to the Gay Club, because he is pervert not only mentally, but sexually as well.

        Now Karolyn I am going to educate you and other ignorant Libtards on the subject of the RACE.

        In European countries, at list which I visited (Spain, Portugal, Austria, Italy, Czech Republic, Poland, Russia) the “Blacks” are called Negros and no one perceives it as derogatory.

        In FORENSIC anthropology, there are FIVE main races of the human races, which are based on the physical characteristics like cranial profile (skull and facial features), genetic markers (DNA), hair structure, skin color:
        1. Caucasian/Caucasoid/Europoid (White) race
        2. Mongoloid/Mongolian (Yellow) race (Mongolians, Chinese, Japanese, Vietnamese, Koreans)
        3. Negroid/Negro (Black) race
        4. American Indigenous (Red) race
        5. Malayan (Brown) race (Malayans, Indonesians, Philippines)

        The FORENSIC anthropology is widely used in law enforcement for the suspects race profiling and victims’ indification, especially ‘genetic testing’ – DNA. The whole genome testing determines your race identity/characteristics/uniqueness.

        For example Negro “diva” oprah tested herself (probably she wanted to find some White genes). But her genome test determined/revealed that she is 89% Sub-Saharan African NEGRO, 8% Native American and 3% East Asian.

        I hope it was helpful for you, Karolyn.

        Karolyn, when you’ll stop your ignorant nonsensical cry?

        Karolyn, “with me it is a VERY SMALL THING that I should BE JUDGED BY YOU OR BY A HUMAN court (Jeff, Mark, Robert, Bob, David, RBT and the rest of Libtards). In fact, I do not even judge myself…but He WHO JUDGES ME IS the LORD.” (1 Corinthians)

        “Great is TRUTH, and mighty above all things.” (2Ezdra 4:41)

      • http://personalliberty Alondra

        Robert Smith: “One doesn’t need your brutal god to know it is wrong to steal.”
        Robert, your god Lucifer says: It’s OK to steal. And your “leader” the Kenyan jungle bunny, who is worshipping him, STEALS from American People, but he calls it “FAIR SHARE”.

        Robert Smith: “One doesn’t need your brutal god to know it is wrong to murder.”
        Robert, HOW MANY BABIES you, the Luciferians sacrificed and sacrificing to your god in the name of the “right to choose”? Why would not you, libtards, finish the sentence what precisely your chose is: The “Right to infanticide.”

        Last year Planned Parenthood ONLY performed a record 333,964 abortions (915 EACH day)) and American People were forced to pay $542 million. It is MURDER and STEALING.

        How many people and children were MURDERED by the Kenyan jungle Bunny’s drones?

        My “brutal” God says: Do Not Lie!
        But the LIE is the Libtards’ virtue because “You are of your father the devil (Satan aka Lucifer), and the DESIRES OF YOUR FATHER YOU WANT TO DO. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does NOT STAND IN THE TRUTH, because THERE IS NO TRUTH IN HIM. When he speaks a LIE, he speaks from his own resources, for HE IS A LIAR AND THE FATHER OF IT.” (John 8:44)

        My “brutal” God is JUST. He warns:
        “Behold, the storm of the LORD! Wrath has gone forth, a whirling tempest; it will burst upon the head of the wicked. The anger of the LORD will not turn back until he has executed and accomplished the intents of His Heart.” (Jeremiah 23)

        “ALL cowards, UNBELIEVERS, the corrupt, murderers, the IMMORAL, those who practice witchcraft, idol worshipers, and all liars—their fate is in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. (Revelation 21:8) Amen

        “Magna est veritas et praevalet” – “The truth is great and shall prevail”

        Veritas vincit – Truth conquers

        P.S. So “Seek the LORD while He may be found; Call upon Him while He is near.” (Is. 55:6)
        ONLY God is the source of the eternal life, whether you like it or not, whether you accept it or not.

        Alondra, Un-Apologetic Christian Bigot, the definite Homophobe & Islamophobe, the PC snubber and the Hater of the VOLUNTARY Stupidity

        • Bob666

          Alondra,
          Your a pig (Bob666:1)

      • Kate8

        Just as a point of trivia, anyone whose blood is Rh+ possess the rhesus monkey gene. This includes about 86% of the human population.

        Rh- means you don’t have the rhesus monkey gene. What you likely have, however, is a reptilian gene.

        The elite often have Rh- blood, and they do think of us as monkeys. They highly prize the negative Rh factor.

        Have fun with that.

      • http://personalliberty Alondra

        Bob666 aka O’Homobama’s Hoax aka Satan’s Pig666, You, stupid sucker, voluntarily sealed yourself. Good luck.

        “The IDIOT has no delight in understanding, but in expressing his mad mindset.” (Proverbs 18)

        Best wishes to you, Satan’s Pig666 from me, Christ’s Pig777.

        BTW Bob666, you are veeeeeeeeeeeery articulate.
        You can put together 3-4 words together. It’s not bad for libtard. Take it as a compliment.

        • Bob666

          Alondra,
          I was wrong, to call you a pig is an insult to Swine World-Wide including Swine of the past.

          You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desire. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies (john 8:44)

          See, I can do that to, but based on your temperment, you have not thought about what you have read.

      • Bob

        It’s about the government wanting to take our freedoms away and incarcerate and turn us into slaves and serfs!! If we had more people that believed in God and did their governing and jobs in an honest and ethical manner we would be just fine. Most of our politicians have sold us out and should be charged with treason! Not that hard to figure out just see thru the propaganda and lies.

      • http://personalliberty Alondra

        “Do not speak in the hearing of a fool, for HE DESPISES THE WISDOM” (Proverbs 23)

        Bob666 aka Satan’s Bob, you just proved your “articulation”. You string words together but you don’t say anything. Like O’Homobama without teleprompter.

        You wrote: See, I can do that too.
        What can you do? PLAGIARIZE my comment (@7:36 pm). Nice job for liberal DUNCE.

        And now you striped my “title” Pig777. Is it jealousy? Jealousy is a sin.

        Best wishes to you, Satan’s Pig666 from me, Christ’s Pig777.

    • http://www.davidlerickson.com David

      Hard to get any discussion going without someone invoking God or claiming this all goes back to something read in the Bible. Many of the Founding Fathers were atheists or non-believers, so claiming the Constitution and all is based on Christian principles is bogus.

      • http://www.facebook.com/rebecca.roth.942 Rebecca Roth

        23 of the signers/founders were pastors of the church. The others were
        well-versed in scriptures, cited scripture when upholding their ideas, and
        made statements of personal belief in Jesus Christ. Our founding documents
        were submitted to the Supreme Court and the court passed judgement that
        our documents were so Christian in nature that we should be called a
        Christian nation.

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        David, what a bunch of CRAP!!! Just because you SAY something, doesn’t make it so!!! The entire Declaration of Independence and the Constitution are based on our GOD given rights!!! Stop spouting the CRAP from the party line of the tyrannical government!!! Step one of the plot to take over our country was to remove GOD from this nation! Fools like you, have fallen right into line!!! Go READ the Declartion of Independence! READ IT!!! Study it!! And then you’ll see how absolutely ridiculous your comment is!!! People can twist words and find ambiguous examples, but the proof is in the document! In the first paragraph, it refers to the Laws of Nature and of Nature’s God! In the second paragraph it says that men are endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights! They signed their names to this document, yet you would have us believe that they didn’t actually believe it?!? You want us to believe that they risked their lives to swear on a document that they didn’t believe in?!? You are a fool who has fallen for the evil that is destroying our country!

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing WTS/JAY

        David: Hard to get any discussion going without someone invoking God or claiming this all goes back to something read in the Bible.

        Hmm, another opponent of freedom of speech…what a surprise!!!

      • Ted Crawford

        Nice try David! However 50 of the 56 signers of the Declaration of Independence were “members in good standing ” of a Congergation! In 9 of the 13 State Constitutions it was a requirement to even be considered for office!
        ” We have no government, armed in power, capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and Religion! Our Constitution was made only for a Religious and moral people. It is inadaquate for the government of any other!” John Adams
        ” We’ve staked the whole future of American Civilization not upon the power of government, far from it! We’ve staked the future of all our political Institutions upon our capicity…to sustain ourselves according to the Ten Commandments of God” James Madison

      • Robert Smith

        33% of the signers of the Constitution of the United States were Masons, including George Washington, who was Master of his Lodge in Alexandria, know known as “Alexandria-Washington Lodge No. 22, A.F. & A.M.”

        You can check some details at: http://aw22.org/

        BTW, if our Constitution is so “christian” can you show us some quotes from your bible in it?

        Rob

        • Bob666

          Yo Robert,
          While it is hard to nail down just how many of the founding fathers were Masons, without doubt, there were in fact a large number of Masons among them. While there seems to be a significant debate regarding the influence of Christians and the Bible on Declaration of Independence and the Constitution of the United States, one thing is quite certain; they (the founders) wanted a limited government that was not unduly influenced by any one individual or group.

          The Lodge network was brought here from England (some from Scotland & Ireland as well) and I believe that it is important to remember the term god in the Lodge system is not specific to any one particular religions group ( Baptist, Anglican, Quakers, Catholics or Jews, etc). While it is obvious the majoriety of our founding fathers were in fact Christians (of various churches), I see no evidence that adherence to any one church was the specific intention of our founding fathers, but to guarantee the freedom for every citizen to worship as they personally desired.

      • OneGuess

        Oh “Rob”! You are so profain. Too bad for you.

      • 100

        All of the Founding Fathers, except Benjamin Franklin and Thomas Jefferson, were Christian. You should read their letters to each other.

      • Jana

        Bob666,
        Excellent. I agree with you wholeheartedly.
        There is one thing I am confused about. People talk about Masons as being so bad. In the small town I was from I knew a lot of men that were Masons as I was growing up and they weren’t these scary evil men. Some even went to the same Church that I did back then. I know they used them as networking, and they were a private organization, but I do know they used scriptures in their memory work. I dated a guy who’s dad was studying. Now whether or not they twisted the scriptures I do not know but… I am just asking here.
        Thanks.

        • Bob666

          Jana,
          I am going to be intentionally vague to you on this subject, not with a lack of respect, but because the Masons while not a secret organization, do have secrets. That being said; Free Masonry is a noble craft and to give you a safe overview, it is an organization that promotes both ethics and respect for mankind.

          I know this is a very general statement to you, but it is the best that I can give you. A couple of comments that I will leave you with is;

          The Lodge system is very much like a religious order in the fact that an individual Lodge can be compared to a church congregation and that lodge personally is reflective of its members. That is one of the reasons why I watch the debate among “people of faith” on this board since there are so many interpretations of the Bible (Baptist-Catholics, etc). That said, a spiritual belief in a higher powered or a relationship with your creator is the mandatory requirement for admission to a lodge in addition to a high moral and ethical standing in your community.

          What I will tell you is; there are Jews, Catholics, Protestants and yes, people that many in the Christian community might label as atheist in the Lodge community. The one common thread is; Just about every person that I have run into in that environment is an honest and patriotic man of high moral character.

          You may not be aware of this, But a significant number of Masons were exterminated by the Nazi’s in WWII. There are many on this board that probably don’t realize this, But this is an organization that has quietly stood up for what is right for several hundred years, we just don’t make a lot of noise in the process.

          I hope this comes close to answering your question.

      • Jana

        Bob666,
        Yes it does, and thank you. I have heard people put it down, but have not understood why and still don’t.

        • Bob666

          Jana,
          Most of the Anti-Mason slurs that I have seen come from the mid-west bible belt other than an era in our history with the Anti-Masonic Party (John Quincy Adams-after the presidency).

          I believe that because the Masonic bodies keep a low profile and we do have secrets, it rouses suspicion among most people who are ill informed. it just goes to show you what happens when ignorance fuels suspicion.

          I remember running into a guy in the Navy who was raised in a small farming community in Nebraska and raised in an assembly of god church and he told me that we were perceived as devil worshipers.

          Fact is always stranger than fiction.

      • Robert Smith

        From Jana: “People talk about Masons as being so bad. In the small town I was from I knew a lot of men that were Masons as I was growing up and they weren’t these scary evil men. ”

        Please remember that when anti-masons start their rantings.

        Rob

      • http://www.facebook.com/benjamin.fox.98892 Benjamin Fox

        David your just a liar, must be in you Godless nature? Most were not only christian but Born Again Believers. The first 13 colonies all have God in their Constitution, Congress printed the first Bibles in America, the Northwest Treatse signed by the same founders said all Schools in the new terriories would teach from the Bible. The first Church services in DC were held in the Capitol for almost 50 years each Sunday, so take your lies and those of your brother David 67 ways to be a commie, rightbrainSTINKER, eddie teddy 47 ways to be a nazi and Jeromy oh my have to protect my nazi and commies friends are all dumber then rocks, have no brains and distort history to fit your commie agenda’s, all you know is your cool-aid drinking robotic ideas. Move to China, you would love it there.

      • Jana

        Robert Smith,
        Yes sir, I will.

      • Jana

        Bob666,
        Thank you for all of this good information. It is of great value to me.

      • Kate8

        Jana – Generally speaking, Masons are upstanding people.

        Realize, too, that the Luciferian elite also operate in the highest degrees of Freemasonry.
        There are the elites of the 33 degree. The lower levels are kept ignorant of the deepest, darkest secrets revealed only to the “illumined” elite. One of these secrets is that they worship Lucifer as being the true god, the “lightbearer”.

        There is much info about Freemasons which is quite enlightening, if you do a search. The lower lodges were given to good works in order to establish respectability, so that they could operate at the higher levels without drawing suspicion.

        Not all things are as they seem. Masons themselves are not aware of what goes on among the elite.

        • Bob666

          Kate8,
          Realize, too, that the Luciferian elite also operate in the highest degrees of Freemasonry.
          There are the elites of the 33 degree. The lower levels are kept ignorant of the deepest, darkest secrets revealed only to the “illumined” elite. One of these secrets is that they worship Lucifer as being the true god, the “lightbearer”.

          I had to think about the appropriate response on your post. I’m not quite sure if I should feel sorry for a truly misguided yet ignorant soul or be seasonably astonished and amazed at how pathetic your statement is.

          But my curiosity leads me to ask, where does one come up with such insight? I mean, this is really far out on the weak end of the limb, but I am all ears to hear this “logic”.

      • Robert Smith

        Kate8bleats: “Masons themselves are not aware of what goes on among the elite.”

        Not all Masons are Shriners, but all Shriners are Masons. Remember, they are the guys who do parades and support hospitals.

        Among them such folks as:
        John Wayne.
        Red Skelton
        Buzz Aldren
        Bud Abbott
        Ernest Borgnine
        Mel Blanc
        Gerald Ford
        Clark Gable
        Glenn Ford
        Barry Goldwater
        Roy Rogers

        And bunches more of loyal and good Americans.

        Are you really trying to tell us you support the notion that these were evil people?

        Rob

      • Kate8

        Call me whatever names you want. I did a study on Freemasonry some time ago, and found some amazing things. Much of this information seems to be either removed from the net or you have to search many pages.

        http://www.religiouscounterfeits.org/ml_realgod.htm

        Check out Freemasonry and Albert Pike.

        I never did say that all Masons were evil. However, things are never what they seem. Some of our most revered icons have some very dark secrets.

        Robert – You do love to use the term “bleats”. Is this a new word you just learned, in order to be as offensive as possible?

        • Bob666

          Kate + 8,

          “There are the elites of the 33 degree. The lower levels are kept ignorant of the deepest, darkest secrets revealed only to the “illumined” elite. One of these secrets is that they worship Lucifer as being the true god, the “lightbearer”.”

          “Call me whatever names you want. I did a study on Freemasonry some time ago, and found some amazing things”

          Did you study Freemasonry in a lodge under a grand- master or did you study it on the Internet (as we know that all of stuff is so accurate and very true)?

          I am not sure what you think that you studied, but Freemasonry, it was not. This is insulting to a lot of of very Patriotic, Moral and Ethical Men (Entered Apprentice to 33rd degree) you should really think very hard before you post crap like this.

      • Matrix

        Jana

        Bob666 is a worshiper of the beast he adores and as a Satanist, supports all that is evil in the world.

        This explains freemasons better than any lie these freaks will tell you as they are taught to deceive by their father from hell!

        “Albert Pike was born on December 29, 1809, in Boston, and was the oldest of six children born to Benjamin and Sarah Andrews Pike. He studied at Harvard, and later served as a Brigadier-General in the Confederate Army. After the Civil War, Pike was found guilty of treason and jailed, only to be pardoned by fellow Freemason President Andrew Johnson on April 22, 1866, who met with him the next day at the White House. On June 20, 1867, Scottish Rite officials conferred upon Johnson the 4th to 32nd Freemasonry degrees, and he later went to Boston to dedicate a Masonic Temple.
        Pike was said to be a genius (as most liberals consider themselves to be) at various stages of his life we was a poet, philosopher, frontiersman, soldier, humanitarian and philanthropist. A 33rd degree Mason, he was one of the founding fathers, and head of the Ancient Accepted Scottish Rite of Freemasonry, being the Grand Commander of North American Freemasonry from 1859 and retained that position until his death in 1891. In 1869, he was a top leader in the Knights of the Ku Klux Klan.
        Pike was a Satanist, who indulged in the occult, and he apparently possessed a bracelet which he used to summon Lucifer, with whom he had constant communication.
        Pike was the Grand Master of a Luciferian group known as the Order of the Palladium (or Sovereign Council of Wisdom), which had been founded in Paris in 1737. Palladism had been brought to Greece from Egypt by Pythagoras in the fifth century, and it was this cult of Satan that was introduced to the inner circle of the Masonic lodges. It was aligned with the Palladium of the Templars. In 1801, Issac Long brought a statue of Baphomet (Satan) to Charleston, South Carolina, where he helped to establish the Ancient and Accepted Scottish Rite. Long apparently chose Charleston because it was geographically located on the 33rd parallel of latitude (incidentally, so is Baghdad), and this council is considered to be the Mother Supreme Council of all Masonic Lodges of the World.
        Pike also predicted three world wars. He not only predicted them, but was major planner of their creation.
        These are his words.
        “The First World War must be brought about in order to permit the Illuminati to overthrow the power of the Czars in Russia and of making that country a fortress of atheistic Communism. The divergences caused by the “agentur” (agents) of the Illuminati between the British and Germanic Empires will be used to foment this war. At the end of the war, Communism will be built and used in order to destroy the other governments and in order to weaken the religions.”
        Students of history will recognize that the political alliances of England on one side and Germany on the other, forged between 1871 and 1898 by Otto von Bismarck, co-conspirator of Albert Pike, were instrumental in bringing about the First World War.
        “The Second World War must be fomented by taking advantage of the differences between the Fascists and the political Zionists. This war must be brought about so that Nazism is destroyed and that the political Zionism be strong enough to institute a sovereign state of Israel in Palestine. During the Second World War, International Communism must become strong enough in order to balance Christendom, which would be then restrained and held in check until the time when we would need it for the final social cataclysm.”
        After this Second World War, Communism was made strong enough to begin taking over weaker governments. In 1945, at the Potsdam Conference between Truman, Churchill, and Stalin, a large portion of Europe was simply handed over to Russia, and on the other side of the world, the aftermath of the war with Japan helped to sweep the tide of Communism into China.
        (Readers who argue that the terms Nazism and Zionism were not known in 1871 should remember that the Illuminati invented both these movements. In addition, Communism as an ideology, and as a coined phrase, originates in France during the Revolution. In 1785, Restif coined the phrase four years before revolution broke out. Restif and Babeuf, in turn, were influenced by Rousseau – as was the most famous conspirator of them all, Adam Weishaupt.)
        “The Third World War must be fomented by taking advantage of the differences caused by the “agentur” of the “Illuminati” between the political Zionists and the leaders of Islamic World. The war must be conducted in such a way that Islam (the Moslem Arabic World) and political Zionism (the State of Israel) mutually destroy each other. Meanwhile the other nations, once more divided on this issue will be constrained to fight to the point of complete physical, moral, spiritual and economical exhaustion…We shall unleash the Nihilists and the atheists, and we shall provoke a formidable social cataclysm which in all its horror will show clearly to the nations the effect of absolute atheism, origin of savagery and of the most bloody turmoil. Then everywhere, the citizens, obliged to defend themselves against the world minority of revolutionaries, will exterminate those destroyers of civilization, and the multitude, disillusioned with Christianity, whose deistic spirits will from that moment be without compass or direction, anxious for an ideal, but without knowing where to render its adoration, will receive the true light through the universal manifestation of the pure doctrine of Lucifer, brought finally out in the public view. This manifestation will result from the general reactionary movement which will follow the destruction of Christianity and atheism, both conquered and exterminated at the same time.”

        • Bob666

          Matrix
          “The Third World War must be fomented by taking advantage of the differences caused by the “agentur” of the “Illuminati” between the political Zionists and the leaders of Islamic World. The war must be conducted in such a way that Islam (the Moslem Arabic World) and political Zionism (the State of Israel) mutually destroy each other”.

          I could spend all night shooting holes in that semi hacked hogwash, did it get rejected for the next national treasure movie and not being belivable? You need to get a book named Morals and Dogma by Albert Pike, come back in a couple of years when you finish it, then you will be qualified to have a discussion on this subject.

          To be one, you have to know one and be accepted by many.

      • Kate8

        Matrix – Thank you for that post. I did not have the patience nor the inclination to go into such detail as I knew I would just be attacked for it by the trolls. I am so glad, however, that you did so.

        Freemasonry is spoken of in many books written on the occult, and on the elite who have been plotting for the NWO for centuries.

        I know your info will be helpful to Jana, who was asking.

        • Bob666

          YO Kate + 8,
          “Freemasonry is spoken of in many books written on the occult”

          Well, that just makes everyting legitimate!

      • Robert Smith

        Roy Rogers with a deep dark secret? Really? Not only did he make a bunch of good movies, visit the Children’s Hospitals, adopt a bunch of kids, and stay married to the same woman until he died, he was a Mason.

        Get to know a Mason or two. Then come back with your “theories.”

        Rob

        • Bob666

          Robert,
          When you have a book on the occult, that makes you an expert!

          Ignorance Is Bliss!, as the force is absent with this one.

    • mark

      Racists quoting Scripture, you have to love it. In the name of Christ, His followers have after all, killed millions throughout history, so this should come as no suprise.

      • mark

        No Bob, the term jungle bunny is a racist epithet. Go up to a very large, athletic, young black man and call him a jungle bunny. Then see what happens to you. But you haven’t got the guts for that. You’re only a racist tough guy on-line. That takes a lot of courage. P.S. Your logic of defining a term as the term itself speaks volumes on your intelligence. When a teacher in school asked you what a governor was? Your reply was no doubt: ” a governor is a…..a…. a governor! ” Signifying nothing by simply repeating the term.

    • mark

      WTS/JAY, who’s the liar here? Alondra called President Obama, a jungle bunny. A pretty infamous and longstanding racist epithet. But this site doesn’t care. And since so many of those who post feel the exact same way about black people it is no problem with them either.

      • Kate8

        I’ve never heard the term “bunny” used as anything but a term of endearment. I often call my kids and my cats “bunnies”.

        I think you are making much ado out of nothing.

        I never hear much complaint about the very real slurs against Christians, conservatives and white people coming from the Leftist factions.

        Chill out. Jungle bunny is far too kind a description of this truly despicable man.

      • Dave67

        Kate, where gave you been living for the past 40 years? Alondra is a racist pure and simple.

      • Kate8

        No, I do not believe that Alondra is racist at all.

        She simply sees liberals/progressives for the communists that they are, and like most of us, finds them despicable.

        That means you, Dave67, whatever color you are.

  • Warrior

    You know you live in a Country run by idiots if…
    You can get arrested for expired tags on your car but not for being in the country illegally.
    ====================================
    You know you live in a Country run by idiots if…
    You have to have your parents signature to go on a school field trip but not to get an abortion.
    ====================================
    You know you live in a Country run by idiots if…
    An 80 year old woman can be stripped searched by the TSA but a Muslim woman in a burka is only subject to having her neck and head searched.
    ====================================
    You know you live in a Country run by idiots if…
    Your government believes that the best way to eradicate trillions of dollars of debt is to spend trillions more of our money.
    ====================================
    You know you live in a Country run by idiots if…
    A seven year old boy can be thrown out of school for calling his teacher “cute” but hosting a sexual exploration or diversity class in grade school is perfectly acceptable.
    ====================================
    You know you live in a Country run by idiots if…
    The Supreme Court of the United States can rule that lower courts cannot display the 10 Commandments in their courtroom, while sitting in front of a display of the 10 Commandments.
    ====================================
    You know you live in a Country run by idiots if…
    Children are forcibly removed from parents who appropriately discipline them while children of “underprivileged” drug addicts are left to rot in filth infested cesspools of a “home”.
    ====================================
    You know you live in a Country run by idiots if…
    Hard work and success are rewarded with higher taxes and government intrusion, while some slothful, lazy behavior is rewarded with EBT cards, WIC checks, Medicaid, subsidized housing, and free cell phones.
    ====================================
    You know you live in a Country run by idiots if…
    Being self-sufficient is considered a threat to the government.
    ====================================
    You know you live in a Country run by idiots if…
    The rights of the Government come before the rights of the individual.
    ====================================
    You know you live in a Country run by idiots if…
    You pay your mortgage faithfully, denying yourself the newest big screen TV while your neighbor defaults on his mortgage (while buying iPhones, TV’s and new cars) and the government forgives his debt and reduces his mortgage (with your tax dollars).
    ====================================
    You know you live in a Country run by idiots if…
    Being stripped of the ability to defend yourself makes you “safe”.
    ============================

    Yes Mrs. Clinton, It does matter!

    • FreedomFighter

      You know you live in a Country run by idiots if…Joe Biden opens his mouth to speak.

      Laus Deo
      Semper Fi

      • hipshotpercusion

        You know you live in a country full of idiots if they were suckered into putting a duel citizen of Britain as YOUR president.

      • Kate8

        You know you live in a country of idiots when the leaders continually ignore the Supreme Law and the people still defend and vote for them, and those who question their actions are marginalized and criminalized.

    • nc

      Warrior. you know you live in a country containing idiots when all the idiots do is bitch because ALL things aren’t done their way and they only get two percent of the vote! SIZE COUNTS!!!

      You wingnuts have a 100% right to say what you want to but only a 2% right to be “followed”!!

      • Right Brain Thinker

        The word “follow” evokes a mind picture of the folks in the wing nut circular firing squad doing their “when the music stops” routine. They “follow” each other around the circle of mindless parroting, their numbers shrinking each time a “chair” of self-delusion is removed by some overwhelming truth they can’t deny.

        Until the lone survivor stands there loudly proclaiming VICTORY.

      • momo

        Great rebuttal, nc,—not!

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing WTS/JAY

        Liberal Idiot:

        A gullible person who claims to have a political view that is liberal, but is obviously completely ignorant of the facts and or history, or will blatantly ignore them.

        A person that has little or no respect for anything or anyone that has contributed to their lives in practical ways.

        A person who has based their political view on the fact that they either want everything given to them without earning it, or want to legalize drugs, or will habitually blame others for their own mistakes.

        Traditionally a person with a narcissistic, holier than thou personality that is unable to face reality, and will spend more time tearing others down, rather than doing what is needed to build themselves up. Typically those who are Godless and immoral.

        Berkly is the home of liberal idiots. American media is full of liberal idiots.

      • cawmun cents

        Yeah…but when we are extinct…you will only have each other to feed upon.
        Cheers!
        -CC.

      • Don 2

        WTS/JAY

        That’s exactly who these people are. You nailed it. Right on!

    • http://uncleteddysreducationcamp.com Thaddeus Toad

      Warrior …. It is not about idiots …. It is about a generation of leadership without moral compass or character…. It is about we the people who elected them and tolerate their behavior…My prayer is that God will raise up a righteous leader soon or the alternative will be much worse than we can imagine…

      • nc

        Thad, if you can believe the BOOK when God(?) “raised up” the most righteous leader and sent him into Jerusalem with no shoes and riding a borrowed donkey they killed him! Be careful who you damn! He might be from God(?)

      • Don 2

        TT,

        It is about a generation of leadership without moral compass or character. It is about we the people who elected them and tolerate their behavior. But, it is also about idiots(low-information voters, greedy public employee unions, dumbed-down Americans, useless educators protected by unions, etc.).

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing WTS/JAY

        The liberal-class used to play a vital role in a democracy. It gave moral legitimacy to the state. It facilitated limited forms of dissent and incremental changes. The liberal-class used to be the conscience of the nation. It permitted us, through its appeal to public virtues and the public good, to define ourselves as a good and noble people. Most importantly, on behalf of the power elite the liberal-class served as the bulwarks against radical movements by offering a safety valve for popular frustrations and discontentment by discrediting those who talk of profound structural change.

        Once this class lost its social and political role then the delicate fabric of a democracy broke down and the liberal-class, along with the values it espoused, become an object of ridicule and hatred. The door that has been opened to proto-fascists has been opened by a bankrupt liberalism. The death of the liberal-class resulted in the failure of the liberal class to confront the rise of the corporate state and the consequences of a liberalism that has become profoundly bankrupted.

        There are five pillars of the liberal establishment – the press, liberal religious institutions, labor unions, universities and the Democratic Party— and that each of these institutions, more concerned with status and privilege than justice and progress, sold out the constituents they represented. In doing so, the liberal class has become irrelevant to society at large and ultimately the corporate power elite they once served!

      • Ted Crawford

        Oh be very, very careful, nc! Remember the last World Leader who’s adoring masses believed him to be ‘sent by god’! He was heralded as an advocate for the commonman and friend to the working class. Aided to power with the hugh efforts of the German Unions, elected on January 20, 1933 as Chancellor of Germany, on May 2, 1933 he raided the Union headquarters, arrested all the Union Leaders and executed a large portion of them!

      • mark

        Ted, I don’t understand. You and most of the posters and authors on this site would approve of Hitler’s policies towards union leaders and other “socialists,” “liberals,”, etc. He imprisoned and murdered most of them. They were after all “trying to destroy his country,” something you and others here accuse union leaders, liberals, and socialists of trying to do every day on Personal Liberty Digest? So what’s your beef with Hitler?

    • Jan

      Warrior, you ROCK!!

    • Bill

      Great Post, Warrior !!!

    • Bev

      Warrior I agree with you 100% . How did we let our country become so lopsided? I’m afraid not only for myself and family, but for our entire nation.

      • nc

        Bev, you need to chill out! The words of doom about this nation have been preached to every generation since the Constitution by those who think they have a better way or are just upset by not being in power .Every election since for 100 years the Republicans have preached that electing or reelecting a Democrat will ruin our nation. We elected them and they served and AT EVERY POINT OF THE WAY IF YOU ASKED EVEN THE REPUBLICANS” WHAT IS THE GREATEST NATION IN THE WORLD?” even THEY would say “The good old USA.’

        I really don’t know what countries you are looking at that causes you to think they are better or that we have slipped below them In what we afford for our citizens. WE ARE WHERE WE ARE AND OF THE TWO MAJOR PARTIES THE DEMOCRAT NUMBERS ARE MUCH BETTER THAN THAT OTHER PARTY!!! DO THE RESEARCH!! SEE ” BULLS, BEARS DONKEYS AND ELEPHANTS” IF THOSE AREN’T THE TRUE FIGURES GIVE ME SOME CERTIFIED DIFFERNT FIGURE FOR THAT PERIOD.

        YOUR PARANOIA CAN BE TREATED BUT YOU NEED TO QUESTION YOUR SOURCES FOR THE HEALING TO BEGIN. CLUE: FAUX NOISE AND PL GIVES YOU OPINIONS FROM PEOPLE WHO ARE PAID TO GIVE YOU BIASED OPINIONS.

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        nc, when are you going to realize that this has NOTHING to do with democraps OR republicraps?!? It’s like you’ve been programmed to spout the same lines over and over even though they no longer mean anything!!! We are beyond democraps and republicraps! You can say all the bad things you want about the republicraps and you are just doing what you’ve been programmed to do!!! BOTH parties are DOING the same thing! SO! What are you gonna do about it?!? What you don’t like about the republicraps is what you’re getting from the democraps!!! Wake UP!!! Use your brain!!! Our Founding Fathers wrote the Constitution for US!!! What is happening TODAY is exactly they were planning for!!! They KNEW that there is evil in the hearts of men and that the day would come when someone would decide that they should rule over us! They tried to protect us from ourselves! But if we will not even engage our brains and look at reality, we are doomed!!!

      • ibcamn

        Yes,but remember that you not only have the gov’t and the kings henchmen to worry about,but you also have the idiot’s that follow him(the ones who voted,paid to get him there)so you have to be(think) individually smarter than them,remember they try to do things collectively smart,we are against two sides on this…WSHTF,you have to keep yourself safe to keep your family safe and keep all of you safe while trying to outsmart them!it’s going to be a challenge for large families,know who you can count on and where to be at the right times!be smart,don’t be a martor for the cause!General Patton said a bit ago;”no dumb son of a bitch ever won a war dying for his country,he won the war by making the other dumb son of a bitch die for his country”,think and be smart against a collective and make smart decisions,we did it once before we can do it again,tyranny has no place in this beautiful country of ours,don’t let Obama turn it into a ghettoized third world country!……….

      • Wellarmed

        I agree with you ibcam. I have talked to many across our country who feel that they will merely “bunker down” in the event of continued government oppression. That is an omission to me that they are willing to die in place, and I accept that if they truly understand that is what their ultimate decision needs to be.

        I feel General Patton was giving a very prophetic statement to anyone that had minds open enough to listen. Those who feel they can hold any position while sitting on mounds of food and ammunition are not in my eyes fighting for liberty, but a vain attempt of mere self preservation that can be interpreted as assisted suicide.

        True freedom is understanding the fact that you and I own nothing more than we can carry on our backs. One cannot fight for the cause of liberty if they are touching the face of their maker on the other side.

        All readers should look to nature and understand that many creatures in the wild do not leave all their eggs in one basket. Everyone needs to determine for themselves what the definition of “winning” means?

        As an Atheist and a descendant of Free Masons who were devout Christians, I tend to look at religions in a neutral manner. Can an Atheist say and truly believe that the Bill of Rights are natural rights of birth that are not given to man by their government, but are endowed with by their creator?

        I do not feel that it is a contradiction as an Atheist to say yes. Can one be an Atheist and still have a soul? Spirituality?Care for their fellow man?

        Again I see no conflict present in that position,and it will be up to GOD and no one on this forum to pass judgement upon me when and if that time shall come. I believe that one of the ten commandments states that no one shall worship any god before me? Are you not in violation of that covenant by passing judgement upon me for my beliefs as an Atheist. Am I not protected by the same Bill of Rights to also be left alone by those who wish to force their religious beliefs upon me?

        I find no disagreement with anyone that this country was founded largely upon Christian principles but I do take exception that our country is a Christian Nation and the interpretation that the root of our country’s demise is for the lack of GOD in public schools.

        • Jeff

          Well said.

        • Bob666

          Yo Wellarmed,
          Thank you for being the voice of reason and sanity. Great Americans come from all back-grounds-and we will all have a judgement day with our creator, not those on this board.

    • cawmun cents

      Dare I say it again?
      Brand A is Brand A….Brand B is Brand A….Brand C is Brand A……each with its own name and platform.
      Those who rely on men and governance to help them are lost,and never likely to be found.
      Put “God” back in His place….the overseer and providential supplier,or you will be phased out.
      -CC.

    • Ted Crawford

      When you live in a Country where you will be fined and imprisoned for damaging an Eagles egg, but forced to pay for the destruction of a Human egg!

      • Ted Crawford

        When you live in a Country that forces you to pay for the distribution of Assult Weapons to Drug Cartels, but prohibited from owning them yourself!

      • Jana

        Ted Crawford,

        EXACTLY!!!

    • Nancy in Nebraska

      Warrior, I love your comment!!! It points out the absolute insanity of this government! But don’t be mistaken into believing that these people are idiots! The idiots are the ones who get behind them and fall for all this craziness! The ones behind this aren’t idiots. They are following a long set out plan of evil to turn this world inside out and upside down! They know that they can get the idiots to believe that black is white and up is down! They can get the idiots to get behind them on even the most absurd and ridiculous statements they make! It’s as if these people are hypnotized. I guess Aldous Huxley in “Brave New World”, was right when he said that if you gave the masses their pornography and their mindless gutter garbage you could get them to do anything! These people have lost the ability to THINK! They are only able to spew out lines that they’ve been programmed to say! Anyone who THINKS would read what you wrote and SEE the insanity! The evidence is right before our very eyes, every single day!!! Yet, those who have lost the ability to use their brains deny what is right before us!!! It is my hope that the masses will turn off their televisions and learn to use their brains again!!! The inane programming is just that, programming!!! Wake up, people! Engage your brain! You’re gonna need it!!!

      • ibcamn

        That’s right Nancy,we have two fronts to worry about,king and his henchmen and the ones who put him there.know your enemy and think before you act,and know who to count on(for brief periods of time)and move,don’t stay in one spot too long,two fronts this war on the law abiding citizen is being attacked from,but maybe some liberals may be flipped when things go wrong and Obama will toss most of these supporters out with the trash(when they serve no further purpose,they may see the light)….but if they do,keep them at arms length!

      • nc

        Nancy. in a prior post you write” The founding fathers wrote the Constitution for us” Who does ‘US’ INCLUDE OR EXCLUDE???’ Who made you Thomas Jefferson?
        Have you ever been into a law library? Have you ever seen the volumes and volumes of cases decided by the Constitutionally created US Supreme Court? Cases and cases where conservatives and liberals have spent millions of dollars on taking cases to the Court because they were POSITIVE they were right ONLY TO BE TOLD ‘SORRY YOUR SIDE IS WRONG WITH YOUR INTERPRETATION OF THE CONSTITUTION”!

        Your “US’ probably does not include our ” US” . You might need to get your “US” fixed! Call the ACLU! They have a great record of winning with our “US” side.

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        ibcamn, there is only ONE to count on!!! And that is GOD!!! I’ve no fear of evil! They can do what they want! I shall try to be tuned to GOD and follow wherever HE leads me!!!

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        I KNOW how the story ends!!!

      • Jana

        Nancy,
        Thank you. Yes, we know how the story ends, we have read and studied the Bible. The Old Testament has as much prophecy about today as the book of Revelation. When we are right with the Lord, we don’t have to worry, as He is not mad at us. He will take care of us just like He did the Israelite children in the days of Moses, or even Shadrach Meshach, and Abednego in Daniel.

        nc tells you ” Have you ever seen the volumes and volumes of cases decided by the Constitutionally created US Supreme Court? Cases and cases where conservatives and liberals have spent millions of dollars on taking cases to the Court because they were POSITIVE they were right ONLY TO BE TOLD ‘SORRY YOUR SIDE IS WRONG WITH YOUR INTERPRETATION OF THE CONSTITUTION”!”

        But, we know how that works. Instead of sticking with the letter of the law we have slicks out there who twist the law and a judge who has an agenda and then we have what is called a Precedence set. So now we have something that doesn’t quite adhere to the Constitution any longer and it never gets better. We have more and more people like Obama who study the Constitution so they can figure out how to get around it, twist it, and manipulate it.

    • kimo3690

      AMEN WARRIOR!!! AND YES….. Mrs. Clinton IT DOES MATTER!!! TY

    • GJM

      Kudos.
      Nice to see that someone has open eyes.

  • http://a-albionic.com lloydmillerus

    [ad hominem attack removed] PLEASE STOP PRINTING HIS STUFF!

    • Gary L

      It may not have occurred to you but there are probably more people following this discussion that agree with him instead of you.

    • Right Brain Thinker

      lloyd says, “Paul Craig Roberts is an idiot” and then lloyd starts screaming and writhing and smoking as the holy water of some truth is sprinkled on his mindlessness by Paul?

      “PLEASE STOP PRINTING HIS STUFF!”, lloyd begs LOUDLY.

      I haven’t been visiting PLD for long, but I don’t recall seeing any previous articles by Paul. I hope we see many more and see them more often, because Paul has a brain and he uses it.

      PLEASE PRINT MORE STUFF FROM PAUL CRAIG ROBERTS!

      .

      • Bob666

        Yo RBT,
        It there not some irony to people posting on a site called Personal Liberty that want to sensor the post of people who they don’t agree with?

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        Paul Craig Roberts has his own web site where you can read lots and lots from him! check it out!

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        Hey, evil bob!!! Right Brain Thinker isn’t the one advocating censorship! He’s quoting Lloyd!!! DUH!!! Engage your brain, unless you’ve already turned it over to satan!!!

        • Bob666

          Nancy,
          Fortunately for you, my duties are largely ceremonial.

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        evil bob, makes no difference!!! You bear his number, you are him!!!

      • Jana

        Nancy,
        Don’t be afraid of the number 666. What it means is 6th Trump, 6th Vial and 6th Seal. This is when Satan comes as the Anti Christ. We will be safe. God isn’t mad at us.

      • Right Brain Thinker

        Yo Bob—-this site oozes with irony to the point it leaves puddles. And yes, one of the biggest puddles is left by those who would “censor”. And lots of hypocrisy as well. By the way, speaking of irony and hypocrisy, did I ever suggest to you the website “Political Irony–humor and hypocrisy from the world of Politics”. I start the day with a peek there.

        Nancy in Nebraska,
        Slow down and take a breath before you shoot from the hip. You misread bob’s comment.

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        No, I don’t think so. He was responding to you, not Lloyd! Heed your own admonitions.

      • Right Brain Thinker

        Try again, Nancy in Nebraska

        He was responding to me, but talking about Lloyd!

        • Bob666

          RBT / NiN
          refering to RBT abt loydd.

    • Bill

      Lloyd,
      You are welcome to go somewhere else and not read any of this.

  • Warrior

    I urge everyone to contact Rand Paul to form and lead a new “Constitution Caucas”. It is way past overdue.

    • Right Brain Thinker

      After Paul’s shameful and churlish performance at the Benghazi hearings, we should all contact him and tell him to go back to selling eyeglasses. Hilary whipped his butt and he’s not fit to “lead” anything.

      • TML

        Hillary? What a joke.

        How is it that someone can so outwardly appreciate the article for putting forth the failings of both Republican’s and Democrat’s that support the imperialist policies which engage our attention here, and then be against one of the few of those politicians who try to stand against such tyranny?

        Based on this and you post above that beckons more writing from Paul, leads me to believe you are blinded by the left/right paradigm – to condemn the actions of any Republican for no other reason than being Republican, and support the actions of any Democrat for no other reason than being Democrat.

        Your hypocrisy is showing.

        It is the Obama administration that is just as guilty for these acts of tyranny as any Republican president, yet to this, liberals and Democrats remain disturbingly quiet, and when they do speak up, they only zealously defend the acts of this administration.

      • ibcamn

        Yep,just soooo many questions that needed to be asked and it seemed like someone had an invisible lease with a gag around all their mouths so every time someone started to make some sense,they yanked on that lease and all stupid stuff spilled out!it was wrong what Hilary stated,someone should have let loose the Jew Bear on her a$$ after that was said!just shows you how much she and the king care about the American people!

        Jew Bear;”fictional” character from Ingloriouse basterds!

      • Right Brain Thinker

        “Hilary? what a joke”?, you say? You need to start thinking up nastier names for her than “joke” since she’s going to be the 45th. President of the United States.

        Your “inabilities” are showing too. The inability to get beyond your confirmation bias and read what Paul really said or what I said here. But I won’t call you a hypocrite because that would imply that you recognize that you are ignorant and are acting willfully.

      • TML

        Having seen and heard the entire exchange, I’m well aware of what Paul said, as I’m well aware of Hillary’s emotional appeals… which by any logical standard, was a joke, and never answered the questions, while dumping responsibility onto her subordinates. However, you have not said anything except reveal your sociopathic tendencies to accuse someone else of what you were just proven guilty of yourself, relying not on logic or reason, but instead feed on emotional agitation and response (probably why you think she “kicked his butt” and deserving of the Presidency despite her pleas to continue the obviously failed interventionist policies she endorses).

        Now, could you actually attempt answering my question, or no?

      • Right Brain Thinker

        TML says, “Now, could you actually attempt answering my question, or no?”

        I’m sorry, TML, but was there a question in there somewhere?. It just sounded like you were just some self deluded and motivated reasoner trying to convince us of his intellectual superiority by talking about “logic” and “reason” and “sociopathic tendencies” and “paradigms” (that ugly and pretentious word that I hate). In reality, you were just spouting the same tired old horsepucky “talking points” that pass for “argument” in your world..

        Looking at it again, I DO detect some talking points disguised as “questions”—-they have (?) after them so you must think they’re questions. I will humor you and address them as if they were.

        Is this one? “How is it that someone can so outwardly appreciate the article for putting forth the failings of both Republican’s and Democrat’s that support the imperialist policies which engage our attention here, and then be against one of the few of those politicians who try to stand against such tyranny?”

        Simple answer, I don’t see the eye doctor as standing against tyranny, because his backward views are just promoting a different brand of tyranny, and one that is unworkable in the modern world..

        “Based on this and you post above that beckons more writing from Paul, leads me to believe you are blinded by the left/right paradigm – to condemn the actions of any Republican for no other reason than being Republican, and support the actions of any Democrat for no other reason than being Democrat. Your hypocrisy is showing”.

        I will repeat what I said. YOUR “inability” is showing—the inability to get beyond your confirmation bias and try to understand what I said. But I will now call you a hypocrite because your persistence shows you are truly ignorant and are acting willfully in denying that. NOTHING I said would lead anyone with an open mind to believe that. You WANT to believe it, therefore you DO, and you are foolish enough to show us all that YOU are the one operating from a base of “emotional response”—-it’s that amygdala activity of The Republican Brain.

        Read what I said again. “I haven’t been visiting PLD for long, but I don’t recall seeing any previous articles by Paul. I hope we see many more and see them more often, because Paul has a brain and he uses it. PLEASE PRINT MORE STUFF FROM PAUL CRAIG ROBERTS!” Simple truth and NO hypocrisy beyond what you WANT to see. I will spell it out for you—-did I say that I agreed with Paul? With some or any of what he said? NO—-just that he had a brain and he uses it. You have a brain and use it too, unfortunately not as well as Paul.

        You get into frothing at the mouth a bit in your closing remarks. The O’Bama administration is not guilt free, by any means, but the whole “tyranny” thing is overly done and it is not true that “liberals and Democrats remain disturbingly quiet, and when they do speak up, they only zealously defend the acts of this administration”. It only seems that way when compared to the volume and intensity of the insane rantings that come from the right wing. I am not a liberal, but did vote Democrat the last two times and I defend the acts of this administration when they deserve it and attack them when they deserve attack. Do you do the same? Can you see any GOOD things O’Bama has done? Any BAD things the Repugnants have done? If so, tell us, and show us that you DO have an open mind.

        You really lost it here. “However, you have not said anything except reveal your sociopathic tendencies to accuse someone else of what you were just proven guilty of yourself, relying not on logic or reason, but instead feed on emotional agitation and response (probably why you think she “kicked his butt” and deserving of the Presidency despite her pleas to continue the obviously failed interventionist policies she endorses)”

        I won’t waste the time to deal with that mindless ranting other than to say I knew somebody like you would come out of the woodwork and swallow the “kicked his butt” hook. .I’m a “catch and release” angler so I will throw you back and hope you’re harder to catch next time. I don’t like dumb fish—-they’re the ones you shoot in a barrel—-you’re not that dumb (yet).

    • http://www.evergreenfarms.org Fred Howard

      Warrior – I agree it’s time to act. Realistically how can Rand Paul force a Constitutional Caucus to take place? I may have an answer but this is not the right forum to discuss. No matter, no one else has listened so why should you? Hope you’re not a nobody like me. Correction, I’m on Mission for The Lord so that kinda levels the playing field. Please, don’t label me as a religious nut. Just respond out of curiosity if you have time (chosenrescue82@gmail.com).

      • Don 2

        Constitutional Convention??? Careful what you wish for. Technically, only two more states may need to call for one, for it to actually happen. Nevada purged their call, but this could possibly be negated by a corrupt liberal court. Alabama, Florida, and Louisiana rescinded their calls. Again, questionable? The problem is, there is no expiration date, once a state calls for a Constitutional Convention. Regardless of the original reason for a Constitutional Convention, once it happens, you could easily have these anti-constitutional scumbags re-writing the 1st., 2nd., 4th., and other amendments, to suit their agendas.

        It is no secret that Obama has no use for the U.S. Constitution as written.

        http://www.sweetliberty.org/standing_calls.htm

    • truthbeknown

      your are so right. but we need to take back the states. 38 of them can call a constitutiona congress. then we can throw out the idiots and start over. back to what made this country great.

    • Mister Jimmy

      That won’t work. Rand has declared his ‘loyalty’ to a foreign power.

    • Nancy in Nebraska

      Calling for a Constitutional Convention may be the most dangerous thing that we could do! The states may be calling for the convention to deal with one particular issue but the convention is not required to deal with THAT issue! They can overturn any part of the constitution even if unintended! The delegates to the convention are not named by the states but may be hand picked by the very people that you don’t want to control it! We MUST all be informed!!! I’m posting a link that EVERYBODY needs to watch to understand the legal processes of a Constitutional Convention!!! If a Constitutional Convention is called, we could LOSE our Constitution altogether!!! PLEASE watch this!!!

      http://lockerz.com/u/21164787/decalz/12524912/beware_of_article_v

      • ibcamn

        see,be smart,think before you leap!

        remember;what’s the last thing an idiot says before he/she dies?…..hey guys watch this!

      • Wellarmed

        I agree with you Nancy in Nebraska. Many readers of this forum believe that the only problem exists with the Federal Government, and to think so is a grievous error on the part of the American Citizenry. Our State and Local Governments are in lock step in many ways with the Federal Government, in their move to solidify tyranny.

        Government at ALL levels needs to be reigned in by the people, with the specific understanding that they (government employees) work for us and not the other way around.

        I do see that Rand Paul may simply be attempting to bring attention to himself as I can only assume that he will be making a bid for the white house in 2016. That is under the assumption that this country will remain intact by that date. If the issue of voter fraud is not rectified very soon then I would strongly suggest that he spend his time on more worthwhile pursuits, as the results of that election are have already been tallied and the outcome assured.

        It is of little value to caucus for a constitutional convention, if our government is no more willing to follow the existing framework that they have sworn an oath to protect. We are in a dire position due to OUR negligence in settling for less than the rule of law.

      • Right Brain Thinker

        Wellarmed says we are not “dealing” with voter fraud? In the news today, we learned that a Republican woman from Nevada tried to vote twice to prove how easy it was, got caught (easily), and has been fined ~$2500 and given 100 hours of community service.

        The “voter fraud” going on the country right now is the attempts by Republican legislatures and Governors to gerrymander, disenfranchise, and subvert the electoral college—–it IS a big problem, and I agree that we need to deal with it.

  • mark

    You know you live in a country of idiots, when the car in front of you has a Obama Biden for Pres. sticker on it.

    • Right Brain Thinker

      You know you live in a country of idiots, when people think leaving a Romney-Ryan sticker on their car means anything other than that they are sore losers.

      • Bill

        You know you live in a country of idiots when you give the public sector workers higher than market benefits that are unsustainable.

        Stop tax payer subsidies for any public retirement funds and let them be funded by their own investments. like the real marketplace

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing WTS/JAY

        You know you live in a Country run by idiots if… A Muslim officer crying “Allah Akbar” while shooting up an army base is considered to have committed “Workplace Violence” while an American citizen boasting a REPUBLICAN bumper sticker is classified as a “Domestic Terrorist”.

        You know you live in a Country run by idiots if….
        You can get arrested for expired tags on your car but not for being in the country illegally.

        You know you live in a Country run by idiots if…
        Your government believes that the best way to eradicate trillions of dollars of debt is to spend trillions more…

        You know you live in a Country run by idiots if….
        A seven year old boy can be thrown out of school for calling his teacher “cute” but hosting a sexual exploration or diversity class in grade school is perfectly acceptable.

        You know you live in a Country run by idiots if…..
        The Supreme Court of the United States can rule that lower courts cannot display the 10 Commandments in their courtroom, while sitting in front of a display of the 10 Commandments.

        You know you live in a Country run by idiots if….
        Children are forcibly removed from parents who appropriately discipline them while children of “underprivileged” drug addicts are left to rot in filth infested cesspools.

        You know you live in Country run by idiots if….
        Working class Americans pay for their own health care (and the health care of everyone else) while unmarried women are free to have child after child on the “State’s” dime while never being held responsible for their own choices.

        You know you live in a Country run by idiots if….
        Hard work and success are rewarded with higher taxes and government intrusion, while slothful, lazy behavior is rewarded with EBT cards, WIC checks, Medicaid and subsidized housing, and free cell phones.

        You know you live in a Country run by idiots if….
        The government’s plan for getting people back to work is to provide 99 weeks of unemployment checks (to not work).

        You know you live in a Country run by idiots if….
        Being self-sufficient is considered a threat to the government.

        You know you live in a Country run by idiots if….
        Politicians think that stripping away the amendments to the constitution is really protecting the rights of the people.

        You know you live in a Country run by idiots if….
        The rights of the Government come before the rights of the individual.

        You know you live in a Country run by idiots if….
        Parents believe the State is responsible for providing for their children.

        You know you live in a Country run by idiots if….
        Your government can add anything they want to your kid’s water (fluoride, chlorine, etc.) but you are not allowed to give them raw milk.

        You know you live in a Country run by idiots if….
        Being stripped of the ability to defend yourself makes you “safe”.

        You know you live in a Country run by idiots if….
        You have to have your parents signature to go on a school field trip but not to get an abortion.

        You know you live in a Country run by idiots if….
        An 80 year old woman can be stripped searched by the TSA but a Muslim woman in a burka is only subject to having her neck and head searched.

        You know you live in a Country run by idiots if….
        Using the “N” word is considered “hate speech” but writing and singing songs about raping women and killing cops is considered “art”.

        • Bob666

          “You know you live in a Country run by idiots if….
          Using the “N” word is considered “hate speech” but writing and singing songs about raping women and killing cops is considered “art”.

          I agree with that.

      • http://yahoo bob peters

        you know you live in a country of idiots when you think you live in a free country.

      • Robert Smith

        Actually, I’ve done everything I want to today, so far.

        What are you restrained from doing in your life?

        Rob

  • Jim B

    I’ve forgotten, what is government for? Anybody! …

    • DavidL

      Most, if not all, of the participants on this site would not survive without government. The question isn’t government vs. no government. The question is all the government we need. There is the policy rub. Government will grow as the population grows. This is an undeniable natural fact.

      Governments, all governments, do four things. How they do them differ, but all do the same four things. Here they are: Social order, National security, public services, and peaceful conflict resolution. As you will notice, all of these purposes are fundamentally grounded, (especially in democratic governments) in the protection of life and our survival. Our Founding Fathers identified them in the preamble to our Constitution.

    • Right Brain Thinker

      I’ll take a quick shot at that question. “Government” is something that seems to arise whenever people start to form “societies”. You need a little simple “government” when even two people get together (at my house it’s a dictatorship by my wife—the all-seeing, all-knowing woman who always gets her way).

      The bigger the society, the more complicated life gets, and people start to work out ways they can get along and work towards mutual benefit, and then they codify that into a “system” that is called “government”..

      Unfortunately, since human beings are so sorry, it doesn’t work out well for very long. History shows that as we grow, we will have the rise of the greedy rich, despots, free markets that are not free, the insanely religious who kill for God, and the always present 47% that mooch.

      Is that a start? I can go on for a while, especially about that particular brand of romantics that call themselves Libertarians.

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        If Mama ain’t happy, ain’t nobody happy!!! :-)

      • OneGuess

        LBJ once said there are only two things you (men) can do to keep your woman happy, and it is not enough to do one thing or the other, you must do BOTH things. The first thing is: “Let her think she is getting her way.” The second thing is: “Let her get her way.”

        Just remember, “If a man says something in the forest and there is not a woman to hear him,…he is STILL wrong.

      • Bill

        One Guess,
        I like your comments

    • http://www.sweetsalesgirl.com/Kuurus/ Charles Johnson

      Government is to control the wolves so we don’t run out of sheep.

      • Nadzieja Batki

        How true!

  • http://twitter.com/knussel Babsan (@knussel)

    If anyone remember or read about it ,this was Hitlers tactics too and people just went along all the way to the gas chambers(showers)

    • Bev

      People believe that can never happen here. I’m sure the Germans, French, Polish and other European countries where Jews were rounded up didn’t believe it could happen there either. But it did. And when you have despots in charge anything can happen.

      • http://wildeyguns.com The Christian American

        It’s happened in every civilized country since the world began, and by our apathy it will happen here. I wish people posting here would stop bickering among themselves and spend their energies fighting our common enemy, those that are hell bent trying to convert America into a Communist / Socialist state. There’ll time enough when the people are in concentration camps or on work details.

      • cawmun cents

        To ChristianAmerican:

        Some here want these things to occur,and in fact are in favor of them…..you can tell them by their posts.But nearly nobody believes it can happen to them.Their ignorance and arrogance knows no bounds.That is the condition we live under as Christian Americans,when God warns us…we can tell….many others cannot.
        You can lead a person to knowledge,but you cant make them think.
        Instead you get arrogant conclusions borne out of confusion and delusion.
        Plead with them to repent and turn back to God.
        Do it humbly.
        That is our task in life.
        Ask them if they know Jesus.
        Tell them about how you do.
        I am guilty of failure to do this daily,when it could make the difference.
        I need Christ and prayer as much as anyone,but I try to speak sensibly to those who do not know Him,without speaking His name,and it never works out for me…they will not listen to plain logic.
        It has to be trumped up logic that they learn from trumped up people.
        So I say things that fall on deaf ears.
        Dont we all?
        Cheers!
        -CC.

      • mark

        No, Christian American, it didn’t happen in every civilized country in history. It happened in Europe under the orders and power of 3 nations Nazi Germany, Fascist Italy, and Stalinist Russia. It happened in Asia under Maoist China, North Korea, VIetnam, and Cambodia. And in a few places in Latin America, under Christian, pro-American, military regimes, such as in Guatemala, El Salvador, and Chile that slaughered liberal, socialist, Marxists, and other leftists. The mass murder of millions of citizens by their own state is a fairly rare occurrence that has never touched the vast majority of nations. By the way, all the mass murderers of the Nazi-enforced Holocaust were Christians. Think about it, Christians.

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        mark, the mass murderers were NOT Christians!!! They only CLAIMED to be!!!

      • Robert Smith

        From Nancy: “They only CLAIMED to be!!!”

        Do you mean like Fred Phelps and his “god hates fags?”

        What about those who ran around here calling folks who disagree with them “morons?”

        What about those around here who don’t think their god is brutal when he killed everyone on Earth, including born and unborn children, he killed first born children, and he crushed a couple of cities, except for Lott?

        Rob

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        Robert says: Do you mean like Fred Phelps and his “god hates fags?”

        Yeah Robert! Like that!

    • Nadzieja Batki

      mark, they claimed to be christians because it was expedient to be christians because the population claimed to be christians because it was expedient to claim to be christian. You can expand the round as long as you want. The people of the Roman Empire played this particular round in the time of the emperor Constantine and in other times in history and other nations
      Christians are remnants in any nation at any time in history or in any nation across the world.

  • ToughGuy1

    The whole Democratic Party and their Presidents in American history. For maybe the exception of Truman, want big government, and huge spending lobbying monopolies! Barak Ovomit just spends. like put it in his mouth, and don’t chew before he swallows. Ends up gagging as a superego puke that he is! Call 1-800-WAO-BAMA. Seriously need to impeach him!

    • http://wildeyguns.com The Christian American

      Impeaching him only means he would be endicted for his crimes. Whose going to prosecute him? The Democrats?

      • Bill

        If we impeached Obama then we would be left with Biden as his replacement. At least then we would be extremely entertained by that clown

      • mark

        It would take 67 votes in the Senate to convict Obama of any impeachment charges. Right now, the Republicans could only get about 4 or 5 votes from far-right extremists like Rand Paul. All the Democrats would need to block impeachment is 34 votes and they currently have 55 votes. In 2014 after the Tea Party puts up a few more “witches”, and pro-rape, anti-immigrant, Senate candidates, the Dems will no doubt have 60 seats. So don’t even trouble yourself about this possibility, it is simply a right-wing fantasy. And the hard right in this country doesn’t have the votes, the support, or the legitimacy. Thank God.

  • http://wildeyguns.com The Christian American

    The message is Obama is an outright communist and is using communist tactics to overthrow our Constitutional Republic and replace it with a communist / socialist form of government. The most important step right now for him and his ilk and us is, what’s going to happen with the people’s guns? So goes the second amendment and our guns, so goes America. It’s as simple as that. Everyother safeguard we had in our Constitution has been torn down. If there is a grand enlightening, possibly we can save our country in the ballot box and direct particpation on the part of the people. If not? Well many of you knows what that will mean. America already is a communist country in may ways. We’re at the battle of the bulge

    • mark

      Right, we’re already a communist, Muslim country anyway, so why worry about any of this? Oh also by the way, it now gets sunny all night and the sun shines during the entire evening. 2 + 2 = 5, and pigs can fly. Why you, believe any nonsense, and in fact, proclaim obvious fabrications everyday on this site, so there are a few more for you. But just remember only a fringe element like yourself believes any of it. And Thank God for that!

  • http://midcontent ridge runner

    If any one has a question of what this muslim educated marxist beleives in, read his books, written with an unrepentant domestic terrorist, who has killed American citizens.He is the muddled shining puke of any communist, socialist, marxist, facist, or any type of dictator run countries. This is the goal of any one with a D by their name, government should control you and every thing in the borders of the USA.

    • Karolyn

      Ii read “Dreams From My Father” and thoroughly enjoyed it as an odyssey of a young man trying to find his place in the world.

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        Wow, Karolyn! Is that all you got out of it?

      • Jeff

        You’ll have to excuse Ridge Rat. He’s . . . . no, I guess there is no way to excuse such extraordinary stupidity.

      • Right Brain Thinker

        Jeff, may I suggest that we need to insert “Delusional” in “Extraordinary-______Stupidity” to properly describe rr?

  • MICHAEL LONG

    DO NOT INCLUDE GOP WITH CONSERVATIVES.. MOST GOP ARE NOT CONSERVATIVE…. REMEMBER BUSH 1 GAVE US SLICK WILLIE CLINTON AND BUSH 2 GAVE US OBAMA. AND NOW THE SENATE WHICH INCLUDES GOP IS LOOKING TO GIVE A FREE RIDE TO ILLEGALS WHILE THEY HAVE NOT PASSED A BUDGET IN YEARS UNEMPLOYMENT IS AT ALL TIME HIGH WE WILL NOT DRILL FOR OIL HOUSING IS IN THE DUMPS SPENDING IS OUT OF CONTROL TAXES HAVE INCREASED AND OBAMA CARE IS RUNNING WILD. PLEASE DO NOT INCLUDE CONSERVATIVES WITH GOP. THE GOP IN WASH DC IS JUST LIKE THE DEMS.

    • Capitalist at Birth

      Why must you shout. The senate has been controlled by the Democrats since 2006. Didn’t you know that?

  • Don 2

    Tyranny Is Coming In America -
    Canada Free Press

    http://www.canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/52657

    • Capitalist at Birth

      It has been here in one degree or another since the beginning.

    • Nancy in Nebraska

      Tyranny is not COMING to America!!! It is here!!! They just haven’t announced it yet!!! The idiots won’t believe anything until heir leaders TELL them it is so!!! Time to engage your brain!!!

  • http://twitter.com/athinkr A Thinker (@athinkr)

    Mr. Roberts, the reason I read PLN is because of articles like this one. You have hit one of the 2 most important nails squarely on the head. Unfortunately most republicans in this country have no idea why this is so important. And the few who have read your article can not focus long enough to do anything about it — their minds wander off, like an ADHD child’s, into diatribes about their own personal religious beliefs.

    So lets summarize and keep it simple: large corporations control the government in this country, the government controls the people more and more each day in this country, and the peoples’ response is to be hope-notized by the president (who is just a corporate tool) or by their religion. When I count to 3 and snap my fingers you will all wake up….please wake up.

    • Bob666

      Yo A,
      very well put.

    • Nancy in Nebraska

      Narrow it down just a little more. The same small group of people(?) own the majority shares of the corporations. The same small group of people(?) own the federal reserve! The same small group of people(?) own the politicians of BOTH parties!!! Do you see where this is going?!? It is about this small group of people(?) controlling the world!!! Hence the “one world government”! The “new world order”!

      • http://twitter.com/athinkr A Thinker (@athinkr)

        You are right. It is just a handful of the uber-rich that control it all. The corporation is just the means by which they do it. I don’t think the corporate elite can be fixed because they are technically sociopaths. So I say large corporations are the problem because corporations can be fixed — by a peoples’ constitutional amendment stating that the government is subservient to the people and corporations are not people. And that would restore the proper order of people above the govt. and govt. above corporations.

      • Robert Smith

        “The corporation is just the means by which they do it. I don’t think the corporate elite can be fixed because they are technically sociopaths.”

        That is debatable, but there is another problem.

        The extreme right set things up so corporations are “people.” They can contribute unlimited amounts in assorted ways to candidates they support.

        What happens when a corporation is owned by China?

        Rob

        • Bob666

          Yo Robert,
          You are on the correct path in your thinking. Unfortunately, “We the People” does not carry the same meaning as it once did, it’s all about $$$$$$$.

    • Right Brain Thinker

      A bit long, but says a lot, particularly at the beginning and end..

      “By any other name, it is the system whereby political and economic power is held by a relatively small group of capital owners who permit that capital to be worked or used by the large majority of landless for their subsistence. The landless have little or no political power of their own, but in a stable system are guaranteed a basic set of rights. Supreme authority may be further concentrated in a small group of officials or a single individual elected by the capital owners, but this authority is often loosely wielded.

      Europe, through most of its history since the Dark Ages was a series of feudal states, which remained remarkably stable for hundreds of years, until power was slowly devolved to larger and larger groups of peoples. The very stable Asian societies in Japan and especially China have long been feudal in nature, and as I will argue, China remains the largest and potentially most powerful feudal kingdom in the world’s history.

      The Roman Empire was essentially a feudal empire, albeit with a strong centralized government, as was the Greek civilization before it. Although the cradle of democracy, the Greeks limited democratic rights mainly to the landowners, who were served by slaves and freemen who were not participants in shaping the governmental or economic system.

      The basic contract in the feudal state is that the majority of the population will be content to remain relatively uneducated, unsophisticated, and unambitious. They will demand little more than a job through which they can feed, clothe and house their families. They will expect a basic level of fairness within their class, guarantees of protection by their lords, and perhaps some government entitlements such as healthcare, free education, and the ability to retire before death (these last three are mostly represented in a modern feudal state, not an historically traditional one). In return, the holders of capital are allowed to be wealthy, comfortable and separated from the majority, so long as they provide these basic measures of subsistence to the landless.

      While to the American psyche, this social contract appears grossly unfair and extremely repressive, it has, nonetheless, proven unequivocally to be the most successful in history, in terms of pure longevity. More on America in a moment. First let us consider China.

      China is the epitome of the modern feudal state. Of the 1.3 billion Chinese, only a fraction have ever known political or economic freedom. Until the Communist Revolution, China was a traditional feudal state, and had been so for thousands of years. There was no history of democracy, of economic liberty among the masses, or of social equality. But it was generally a stable country. Certainly, internal wars had racked the nation for much of its history, but the country and the system held together. Following the revolution, China essentially remained a feudal state, but under the “lordship” of a smaller group of political and economic leaders. Today, China has transformed itself from Communism to Capitalism, but remains a de facto feudal society. Economic power is held by a relatively small fraction of business and landowners and political power is held by a small group of Party officials. Often the two groups overlap. The vast majority of Chinese citizens, despite the rapid economic growth of the country, remain uneducated, unsophisticated and unambitious. They expect only what a feudal state has traditionally promised its masses.

      While to the Western eye, the inequality is appalling, the Chinese system has potential to be immensely powerful. The richer China grow, the more stable its guarantees to the masses will become. Without a corresponding increase in education, freedom and political power, these masses are likely to feel their needs are being satisfied, and will not demand more. This was the case in the two decades following the fall of the Soviet Union. A brief experiment with democracy was followed coincidentally by a rise in oil prices. Russians, who had barely a taste of democracy, were happy enough as a whole to give power back to the state in return for a share of the oil riches. They allowed an economic oligarchy to rise rapidly, and the reestablishment of a de facto single party, corrupt political system to occur. It is only because with the overextension of spending and the subsequent crash of oil prices, and the fact that Russia does not have much capacity to produce beyond a few limited resources, that the re-feudalization of the Russian state may ultimately fail.

      China, on the other hand, has become the world’s supplier of manufactured goods of all kinds, and will likely remain so for decades. The small ruling economic and political classes control a vast resource of “vassals” for whom expectations in life are limited and modest. The presumed unstoppable spread of information around the globe into the lives of the other 800 million or so rural Chinese will be slow in taking hold. The desire for riches, freedom and political power may yet come, but it is likely to be long in the future. In the meantime, China appears to have created the “perfect” structure of political and economic power, combined with a willing world to trade with and a willing and limitless population to control.

      I see now, that in America, we have ourselves flirted with feudalism from time to time. I do not consider the Antebellum South to be a feudal state. Slaves were treated purely as property, and there was no social contract between landowners and those that served them. But in the early industrial era corporations became the capital owners and the controllers of millions of workers. Capitalism at its most extreme, is little more than a feudal economic order. The rise of unions in the twentieth century broke somewhat the feudal nature of American capitalism. But it has once again gained ascendancy over the past thirty years, as businesses have made quantum gains in power, both economic and political, and workers have become more dependent upon them.

      I am convinced that if one could describe the Republican Party in one word, ) It is clear to me that it would be “Feudal.” (wish it were “futile” The utopian goal of the GOP and its leaders is to create, or recreate, in America, a feudal state where power is held by a few and a social contract of work and minimum rights is granted to the many. Since the 1970’s the Republican Party has cultivated a large base of social conservatives and re-educated them to become willing vassals. By offering bread and circuses, where the circuses are anti-abortionism, anti-governmentism, anti-gayism, etc… these power holders have – ingeniously really – created a vast mass of people who want little more than the traditional feudal social contracts of old. Protect us, give us a job, and preserve our sense of morality (even if you have invented that morality for us).

      I believe that it is the political and economic oligarchy within the GOP that see America’s only chance for long-term competitive advantage over the Chinas and Indias of the world, and thus the long-term survival of that class’s privilege, to be the creation of a modern feudal state in America.

      The goal is simple, the Rich get Richer – the Poor get used and exploited for cheaper and cheaper labor while the Middle Class Disappears.

      And with no middle class, there’s no upward mobility – and no American Dream. No
      Hope for the future of our prosperity to live in Liberty. Just more back-breaking, nervous breakdown inducing labor for lower and lower wages, while price rise higher and higher.

      True Patriotism in the Feudal States of America (Daily KOS, Mon Jul 04, 2011).

      • momo

        RBT, first let me predicate what I’m about to say by realizing this is a lefitist view of America. However, what’s said about Republicans could also be said about Democrats, both are willing participants. How else do you explain no corporate elite going to jail for the economic mess perpetrated on the world in 2008? Obama, he’s just a corporate stooge, just like Bush. Sure he gives a few things to the masses, health care, extended unemployment and a few more crumbs from the corporate table. But who really benefits from universal health care coverage? Why insurance companies! And extended unemployment, well the unemployed need to spend money to live like everybody else, corporations win again. Nothing happens in this country without the corporate ok.

      • Right Brain Thinker

        We’ve talked about this on other threads, momo., and we don’t disagree much. Both parties are to blame, but the Repugnants are the ones that started us down the road, and they have led the way ever since. The Democrats have followed along more out of a need to survive rather than basic ideology. This is a “leftist” view only in that it lays more blame at the feet of the Repugnants, and in terms of trying to preserve the nation as we know it, I call it rather “conservative” in its viewpoint.

  • http://www.facebook.com/randy.phillips.33865 Randy Phillips

    Two points, This column is on the money about the militarisic tyranny we live under. It was formeraly called the Cold War, a Democrat program to contain Communism set up under Harry Truman. George Kennan, who put it together in the late 1940s, pointed out that it would be decades long, and put the entire nation on a permanent wartime footing, with all facets of our government dedicated to preventing the spread of Communish. He said it would create the biggest federal government in history, and finally included the peacetime draft, foreign aid, export of US resources and weapons to other countries, the interstate highway system (to move troops when Russia invaded the US), the US Department of education (after Sputnik in 1957 to make sure we were ahead in science and math, lol) and the imperial Presidents, the most recent being Bush 2 and Barack Obama, That Military aind Industrial Complex is What President Eisehnower warned us against in 1961, and said the american people ourselves may have to rise up against it.

    When the Cold War ended in 1989, Bush 1 was President, and instead of dismantling the institutions of the Cold War, he kept them, and renamed the monster “The New World Order” with the ust continuing al it’s militarism in the world and here at home with NAFTA and the first Iraq invastion, the Department of Education, and an ever larger federal government.

    Point two. The posters here reflect one of the things wrong with America now. OUr founding fathers did not want a theocratic government. The Constitution is our governmental inspiration, not the bible nor the book of revelations. It is in the constitution, no state established religion.

    During the past few decades relaigon has entered the Government big time. Liberal churches want the US government to be operated like a church pantry, and ‘conservative” evangelicals want the government run “by God’s Plan”, “the Bible”, etc. Both of hem together is appears, want borders to vanish and anyone who wants to come in the country can just walk in. You hear ministers all the time saying “We’re all God’s children. They have a “right” to be here. We have to live by the golden Rule” Our Government lives by the Constitution, not the effing Ten Commandments, you idiots. They are not in the Constitution, but prohibition against government imposed religion is in the Constitution.

    Republicans lost more votes from the 20% and growing segment of the US population who voted against the Party last fall because too many religious fools want a Government run “by god’s word” and have fastened on the Republican Party as the party of Theocratic Government. Republcians had better look to this group for votes instead of the “religious” hispanics, who will vote democratic forever.

    • Capitalist at Birth

      You are wrong. The “Founding Fathers” were inspired by the Bible and their spirituality. I am sad that you have bought into the secular progressives mantra.

      • Robert Smith

        “The “Founding Fathers” were inspired by the Bible and their spirituality. ”

        Not really. Show us some quotes from your bible in the Constitution.

        The fact is that they mistrusted religion to lead this country and made it clear in the Constitution that we would NOT be run by religion.

        Rob

      • http://www.facebook.com/randy.phillips.33865 Randy Phillips

        CB, I am not wrong, though I may have made a few typos and awkward points in my post. I am right about the Cold War, I lived through it, and sat with my dad on the couch in our living room and heard Eisenhower’s farewell address, as well as Kennedy’s warmongering “We will go anywhere, bear any burden” speech the next day.

        As for your bible statement, you are right that our founding fathers were influenced by the bible and religion. They were so knowledgeable and influenced by the bible that the put it in the Constitution that no established religion could be enacted by Congress. They wanted to avoid government by religious groups, in case you haven’t quite grasped their meaning. You know, the founders did not envision a “Government run according to God’s Plan”, like so many evangeilicals seem to believe today as they wait for “the rapture”. The Founders did not envision a foreign policy based on the Book of Revelations, either.

        As for me being influence by “Progressive relativism” I would just bet i’m more conservative and knowledgeable than you on that matter. I believe this. Every society is unique and should take pride in its heritage and accomplishments. But in Art, in Architecture, in Science, the healing arts, in religion and philosophy and the ordering of society, in all these endeavors and others, the accomplishments of Western Civilization are the glory of the human race. That’s about as far from “deconstructing” Western Civilization and “progressive relativism” as you can get, DB

        • Bob666

          Yo Randy,
          “The Founders did not envision a foreign policy based on the Book of Revelations, either”

          I would agree.

  • r b

    the gop has increased the size and scope of the govt far more than the democrats in the last 50 years. the largest ‘welfare’ programs are supported by the gop.

    eliminate the two wars, homeland security ( a true oxymoron), corporate subsidies, foreign aid and our international police force.

    what you get is a balanced budget with a surplus to pay down the debt.

    end the drug war as well, and you can pay the debt off in less than 10 years.

    • Bob666

      Amen!

    • momo

      r b, I think you’re on to something.

    • http://www.facebook.com/randy.phillips.33865 Randy Phillips

      RB, You are not quite right about the Republicans being bigger spenders of Taxpayer money than Democrats. The Cold War, on which Trillions was spent between 1948, when Truman and Churchill created it until now, when It has been renamed “The New World Order”, was a Democratic creation and both barties are af fault keeping the military industrial complex fat and happy.

      But Lyndon Johnson’s Great Society Progrems, created by a Democrartic President and Democratic House and Senate inceased the size and cost of the US government enormously. These Programs, including “the war on poverty” were efforts to use Taxpayer money to create a durable democratic majority in the country–a government run political machine. Republicans tried to get rid of them, but every time a Democratic President took office, they were expanded. And yes, both George Bushes enlarged them as well. The great Society Programs created huge grant and other programs to non-profit political action groups which still get money, and there were huge grants to local and state governments and highways, etc, which are still in operation and both Parties have enlarged them, but Democrats created them and republicsan like the Bush family support them and spend more money as “kindler gentler” “conservatives” on them.

      The feds intervention in education came from the Cold War to make sure we stayed ahead of the USSR in math and science after Sputnik in 1957, the civil rights movement, and the US Department of Education which was created from the Office of Education by Democrat Carter and a Democratic Congress. Reagan tried to abolish it, Bush I got elected on a pledge to abolish it, but made RINO Alexander its head and spent more money to make it bigger. So did Democrat Bill Clinton, and Bush 2. Of course Barack Obans has poured deficit money into it, and now the US Dept. of Education spends about half a trillion dollars a year running our local classrooms and destroy education through a multicultural, diversity indoctrination program based on Community Organizer “principles’>

      So you see, RB, both parties are guilty of our governmental spending disaster, but Democrats more so. I have ot say the bush family is very “democratic” when it comes to government. They support big government, big deficits, big amnesty, and sending our jobs to China. And they are looking to elect their third family member-JeeeeeBBBBB- President in 2016. Since they have controlled the Republican party since 1989, why not? People will so tried of Democrats in 2016, they will even vote for a lookalike “Republican”, so long as he’s not official “democratic”.

      • Right Brain Thinker

        Short and sweet, Randy. WRONG!!!
        Go look at the deficits racked up by all the presidents going back to FDR. The democrats paid-as-they-went and are responsible for very little of the problem. Our present deficit dilemma is caused by what the borrow-from-the-future-to-benefit-the-rich-today Repugnants have done. Eliminate the Bush-caused “expenses” and “O’Bama’s deficit” shrinks considerably.

        • Bob666

          RBT,
          very factual, republican presidents almost alway leave higher deficets when they leave office.

  • http://www.facebook.com/rhonda.reichel Rhonda Reichel

    Don’t get sidetracked…..the point of this article is that BOTH the Bush and Obama administrations are to blame for the illegality of these unconstitutional laws that were passed. If you all are such good Christians why would you have voted for either man…or Romney for that matter? He is just as guilty of being unconstitutional as Obama or Bush.

    • Capitalist at Birth

      Here Here. It is only a matter of degree starting with Abraham Lincoln which one has been more of a threat to liberty and freedom, other than perhaps; Coolidge, Eisenhower, and Reagan.

    • http://www.facebook.com/randy.phillips.33865 Randy Phillips

      Rhond Reichel, I agree with you entirely. Your statement is right on the money.

    • Wellarmed

      I cannot agree with you more Rhonda Reichel. Both presidents have used the E.O. route to the detriment of our constitutional republic. I would suggest that everyone go to the website DOJgov.net and look at the list of Executive Orders that many Presidents have signed ( D & R ) that puts them squarely in direct conflict with their Oaths of Office.

      Please review these E.O.s as listed and if anyone can honestly say that the stage has not been set and that this play is about to start does not understand that this will not stop until the fat lady signs.

      10990
      10995
      10997
      10998
      11000
      11001
      11002
      11004
      11005
      11051
      11310
      11049
      11921
      12148
      12656

      Please Understand everyone that not all Executive Orders are created equal. It IS OK for your to be afraid, and I know that most on this forum will not admit to that statement. Fear is a natural reaction to traumatic events.

      Most of us have witnessed what a child does when a vehicle accident is about to occur. Most merely cover their eyes.

      The Adult however tends to place their arm across the child and/or take evasive actions that will hopefully prevent the accident from happening.

      Many on this forum who continue to offer dissenting views to your positions MAY just merely be covering their eyes.

      Please have a degree of concern for them, as they do not know what fate is about to befall them, nor do I.

      I see the future that awaits us by continually looking back at past historical events and using those events to formulate a plan not just for my survival and my families, but also hopefully our Nation.

      Be wary of those who think, believe, and act in absolutes. Very few things in life are. Keep those who believe in WAR as a solution, as well as those who believe that it is not possible on our soil at arms length.

      I wish ALL my fellow Americans well, even those who I happen to disagree with, but I would be remiss If I did not mention that we will soon be asked to take our seats, as the show unfortunately IS about to start!

      Cheers.

      • Right Brain Thinker

        I wish someone would some day REALLY explain why old Executive orders going back to JFK (the last one cited here was signed by Reagan in 1988—-25 years ago), have any meaning at all. All I see is shadowy and paranoid references to them meaning that the boogeyman is coming to get us.

  • http://qmcusn.wordpress.com QMC, USN (Ret)

    I have been saying for a while that I don’t see 17 cents worth of difference between George W. Bush and Barack Obama. Obama is a big government liberal. Bush claimed to be a “compassionate conservative” (translation = big government liberal). Mr. Roberts’ lays that out as well as I have seen. Thanks.

    • momo

      You’re right, there isn’t any difference.

      • Jeff

        It’s simply untrue to say there’s no difference between Democrats and Republicans. We have a system that makes getting anything done very difficult, so voting in the Democrats will not cause the sea change you might see in a parliamentary system. There are many constraints on any President, not the least of which is corporate America. You are correct that the Democrats are too close to big business, but the Republican Party is a wholly-owned subsidiary of Big Oil, Big Insurance, Big Banks, etc.

        But can you really say there was no difference between W and Gore or between Obama and Romney? Because of the constraints on any Democrat, Obama may not be all you want him to be (or all he wants him to be), but within those constraints, he will deliver a lot more of what you want than will a Republican.

  • Karolyn

    Hey, Bob Livingston, since when is “jungle bunny” an allowed slur? I know you don’t alow the “n” word and did not think you allowed the other racial slurs; but I guess I’m wrong. Alondra has used that term (mostly used by older prejudiced people) twice now on two different blogs.

    • Nadzieja Batki

      Why do you keep reading Alondra if you already determined by your first reading that you don’t like what she writes? You can’t shut her up yourself so you will whine, like a predator that you are, fo Bob L. to shut her up.

      • Jeff

        I don’t want to shut her up. I think you all should announce yourselves as Idiotic Bigots as Alondra does.

      • Karolyn

        The same can be said for you, Nadzieja. Why do you read mine and Jeff’s and eddie’s, et.?

      • Karolyn

        Why would I want to shut Alondra up? She is just showing her ignorance. That term she so loves to use is even more offensive than the “n” word that would be disallowed here.

    • Nancy in Nebraska

      You should be glad she posts crap like that! It causes rational people to ignore her posts altogether!

    • Jeff

      Let her use the term. The only better way for her to announce her presence would be to use the handle, Alondra The Idiotic Bigot.

      • Nadzieja Batki

        jeff, keep flapping your tongue so we know what a Leftist Jackass you are.

    • http://midcontent ridge runner

      Spoken like a progressive communist/socialist just like the mulium educated marxist, if some doesn’t agree with the abhorant liberiak BS, you get your drawers in a tight left hand twist and want some one else to make niceLiostening to the anti USA Cheif keeps proving what a damned book trained idoit, he and his party are at undersyanding economics and how to create jobs.

      • Right Brain Thinker

        Extraordinary Delusional Stupidity

  • Capitalist at Birth

    Mr. Roberts, Your defense of Bradley Manning, trying to make this homosexual misfit into some kind of hero is disgusting. You are an enemy of freedom, when you think what he has done is okay. You are suggesting total chaos in our military..

    • Jeff

      Your use of the term “homosexual misfit” dates you back to the 1950s. I’m not sure exactly what I think of the totality of what Bradley Manning did, but I am sure I don’t want to be on your side of any argument. And I don’t think I’m alone in that regard.

    • Nancy in Nebraska

      I’m sorry, I have to disagree with you! Anyone who shines a light on evil is a hero in my book!!!

    • http://www.boblivingstonletter.com/ Bob Livingston

      Dear Capitalist at Birth,

      You write: “Your defense of Bradley Manning, trying to make this homosexual misfit into some kind of hero is disgusting. You are an enemy of freedom, when you think what he has done is okay.” I have written in defense of Bradley Manning. http://personalliberty.com/2010/12/17/crushing-dissent/
      http://personalliberty.com/2012/12/04/marine-guards-testify-manning-respectful-compliant-prior-to-base-protest/
      Would you consider me “an enemy of freedom?” Your ad hominem directed at Pvt. Manning is an attempt to dehumanize him to help you justify torture and abuse of an American. I, for one, will be no part of that.

      Best wishes,
      Bob

    • Robert Smith

      “Bradley Manning, trying to make this homosexual misfit ”

      What does his being gay have to do with anything he is accused of?

      The issue is his having revealed classified material. Apparently there is little doubt he did it so the discussion is focused on was it right for him to do so or not?

      Is he evil like John Walker? Does he warrant further thought about his actions like Daniel Ellsberg’s case?

      I suspect that history will give us the answer to this one.

      Rob

  • TML

    “Neither does it occur to conservative Republicans that it is far better to institutionalize compassion than to institutionalize tyranny.”

    Institutionalizing of compassion can lead to tyranny. Is it not in the name of humanitarianism that most imperialist policies or war and intervention are carried out? Take note that the so-called neo-conservatives do not show much opposition to the welfare state.

    It is important to first stop the imperialist policies abroad, and thus relieve them at home. That is after all, the way tyranny came to this land – under the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. When that is done, we can then resume taking care of the more minor problems such as the institutionalizing of “compassion” – which is nothing more than euphemism for supporting policy that makes the role of government to act as your nanny.

    • Nadzieja Batki

      TML, you are correct in your summation that institutionalizing of compassion can lead to tyranny. It does not start out that way, it starts with supposed good people having good intentions that when more people get together that more social good can be done. Eventually they come up with the idea that since doing good is so beneficial they will make everyone do good with the focrce of the government.

    • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing WTS/JAY

      You beat me to the punch, TML…and you are so correct. Whether you are institutionalizing “tyranny” or “compassion”, the operative word that should be of concern with respect to both, is “Institutionalize”! Kudos, TML!

  • Kenneth Howes

    It’s evident that the school of thought that Al-Qaida will stop killing Americans if we’re just sweet and nice to them is alive and well on the political Right as well as on the political Left. There is one level of liberties that American citizens should enjoy, as long as they are not themselves levying war against the United States, as Anwar al-Awlaki did. Those liberties do not necessarily apply to those in other nations who shelter al-Qaida fighters and their allies, and they certainly do not apply to those foreign nationals in the United States who are planning new 9/11 strikes. Or is this one of those websites where 9/11 is said to have been a conspiracy of the Jews, the oil companies and the CIA?

  • Bud. USMC

    THIS HAS BEEN A GOOD DEBATE OF WHAT I HAVE READ, A FEW THOUGHTS FOR YOU TO THINK ABOUT. IF YOU DON’T LIKE IT HERE YOU ARE FREE TO LEAVE. I PREFER TO STAY AND TRY TO MAKE IT BETTER. FIRST BY VOTING AND TRYING TO FIND ALL I CAN ABOUT EACH CANDIDATE. THE PROBLEM WITH THAT IT USUALLY COMES DOWN TO THE LESS OF TWO EVILS. BOTH NANCY FROM NEB AND WARRIOR .MADE SOME VERY INTERESTING REMARKS. I HEARD A MAN SAY IN A SPEECH ONE TIME. THAT CONGRESS HAS PASSED THOUSANDS OF LAWS, BUT IF WE ALL FOLLOWED THE FIRST TEN MOST OF THE OTHERS WOULDN’T BE NEEDED. BUT GOD OR JESUS PRAYER OR MERRY CHRISTMAS ARE NOT TO BE SAID IN OUR SCHOOLS OR PUBLIC PLACES WRONG!!!!
    THOSE WHO THINK THAT OUR GOVERNMENT ISN’T TRYING TO TO AWAY OUR CONSTITUTION AND RIGHTS YOU ARE VERY MISTAKEN OUR GUNS FIRST HOMELAND SECURITY IS BUYING 7000 RIFLES THAT ARE FULLY AUTOMATIC. LOOK AROUND AND SEE WHAT IS GOING ON. IN NEW YORK CITY THE MAYOR IS MAKING IT ILLEGAL FOR YOU TO BUY A 32 OUNCE COKE COME ON NOW. I KNOW IT NOT GOOD FOR YOU BUT SO ARE A HOLE LOT OF OTHER THINGS. WHATS NEXT WHAT YOU CAN EAT OR WHERE YOU CAN GO.
    SOME ONE SOME WERE WITH IN SOME PART OF THOSE IN POWER ARE BEHIND MOST OF THE GUN VIOLENCE GOING ON HERE NOW, THE SAME AS BUSH’S WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION EXCUSE FOR WAR. THEY BEEN DOING IT FOR YEARS AROUND THE WORLD. GOD BLESS.

  • alfromfl

    While the author makes good points re the other side of big government, you’ll get no sympathy for Manning from me – he’s a traitor and should be shot. It’s also true that giving up rights for security will give you neither. It’s time to cut back the size of federal government and return to the principles as envisioned by the Founding Fathers. We didn’t fight the rev war or WWII to become a 3rd world socialist country.

    • http://www.boblivingstonletter.com/ Bob Livingston

      Dear alfromfl,

      You write: “While the author makes good points re the other side of big government, you’ll get no sympathy for Manning from me – he’s a traitor and should be shot. It’s also true that giving up rights for security will give you neither.” I’m quite certain the dichotomy of these two statements escapes you.

      Best wishes,
      Bob

      • Jeff

        Bob:

        You’re SURPRISED by an illogical non-sequitur on one of these blogs? I thought you had a better feel for the pulse of your acolytes.

  • Jeff

    So write your own book. Problem is it’d bore your own kids to death.

  • http://gravatar.com/dalene44 dalene44

    Mark: You said “So what’s your beef with Hitler?”
    Hitler was a charismatic orator and big government turned dictator who controlled the media, health care, and turned Germany into a police state. He did not tolerate dissent or opposition media. He ultimately turned on his most ardent followers. His campaign against the Jews was initially successful because of propaganda and a complicit media. He promised a German utopia but his big government policies failed. He fooled the majority of gullible Germans for awhile.

    • mark

      Yes, but Hitler also arrested all liberal activists, labor leaders, and socialists, something many of the posters on this site would agree with. Hitler claimed such types were destroying his country, again something that a majority of posters here also claim. Cranks on this blog love to compare Obama with Hitler but they are less enthusiastic when their simliarites with that monstrous dictator are also pointed out to them

      • randyman pooper, er, I mean, Andirsun Coopir

        Hello. Try not to be so deliberate in your comparisons. Remember, Der Fuhrer was. Nationalist. This current crowd are largely internationalists. Most of the world is run by dictators/collectivists. In order to recreate the new global order, they will have to disregard national constitutions and governmental forms, and synthesize all of these into a World is Flat composition. The Best mechanism for this is a militant fascism……disguised as democracy in the short term. Look for no Fuhrer. They want you to expect uniforms. Oz resides behind the curtain. Try Ominous Parallels, by Leonard Peikoff for the mechanics. Apply these to the world. Goal: Oligarchy for them. Collectivist/slavery for 6 billion.

    • http://midcontent ridge runner

      darlene, the main differences between Obama and Hilter and Obama are,the ears, the speech patterns, the dust collector under the snooze, Hitler didn’t shuck and jive or play basketball. Both are racist and anti hristian, both hate Jews, and are beleived by muslims as being a brillant piece of dun, both are drug heads of some type, both think thet know everything when they don’t know s–t about anything except vacationing and wanting adoration non stop.Both blame uveryone and everything, except their own sorry azzes. Oh bedore I forget, the skin color!.

      • Bob666

        Yo R/R,
        “Hitler didn’t shuck and jive or play basketball. Both are racist and anti hristian, both hate Jews, and are beleived by muslims as being a brillant piece of dun, both are drug heads of some type, both think thet know everything when they don’t know s–t about anything except vacationing and wanting adoration”

        Wow, simply Wow.

  • Barbara

    That is exactly why I left the Republican party as a voter. I see no difference between the two main parties anymore. The GOP only plays us for fools trying to lead us into believing that there still is!

  • hair goring

    Neig Heil! Neig heil!

  • herr gobbles

    Envelope you in your own debased behavior, give you juvenile distractions and fantasies on Tv, tell you We are elected on your behalf, and slowly bureacratize and collectivize the system, so that when you finally wake up, pull yourselves away from your whores, and busted families who hate you, and your debts outdoing and competing AGAINST ONE ANOTHER trying to be something you are not (I.e., rich, like us) and wake up, its going to be too late. We will own you: YOU ARE HEADED FOR SLAVERY. Go ahead, talk amongst yourselves in forums such as this. Better yet, write your legislators. After all, They work for you.

  • Johnny D

    The intelligensia has decreed. Who are we peons to reason why. Do as we are told. Bull , big government stinks now and forever. Study and vote that is all we have against tyrants in high places.

  • ICEDRAGONNITE

    JANUARY 13, 2013 @ 2:10 PM
    Bonni I know this is a little long but it will explain a lot.
    The Whore of Babylon 1/13/2013
    Have you asked why have all the Governments of the world jumped on this mohommedist program of trying to water down the societies of the east and west?
    I have, and found it is as simple as the nose on your face. The Whore of Babylon!
    Ok, That sounds simple enough, but how and where? What has permeated our societies since WWI? Central banking for one! But not just Central banking, what else? Manipulation of the world currencies? How is this done? There are two systems that currency uses to function. One, the Austrian pay as you go plan. Buy nothing you cannot afford. Clean and understandable. The other is the Keynesian system, keep all economics slightly unbalanced so manipulation can be achieved through inflation and economic bubbles. Therefore, borrow monies at a time when $1.00 is $1.00 wait a few years and pay that $1.00 back with an inflated dollar that is only worth .25 cents. Now your money looks like it is 75% greater. So, credit is charged at a rate to offset this disparity and banks continue to rake in the bucks. We still have an additional problem to deal with – Real Property. During the 1900’s, a gradual transformation took place in the writing of real estate deeds. What was once your castle and totally inviolate to anyone, became a piece of property to flip and make a buck. No longer a home, but an investment. Don’t leave it to your children, they will have to earn everything on their own, with no great financial assistance from family – that will become illegal in many ways. However, if a special trust is set up, it can be done, but millions have to be acquired to allow this system, within the Keynesian system, to function properly. So, give it back to the landlord. The State! This started when property was allowed by the people to be taxed. Now you are just Tenants.
    With all the unease around the world and the foreclosures here and around the world, who is the actual owner of the real estate? How many pieces of real estate do banks hold that have not been put back on the market, and why? Where did the money come from to hold these properties out of the system, and why? Simple, it’s called too big to fail. QE1, QE2, QE3-QE10, etc.
    This still doesn’t explain how all the nations got hooked on this easy money train. And how did it bring about the infiltration of all Western societies with the mohommedist threat that we see and feel today? What would stop a new world Government if you were trying to take over the world with a financial system that you could completely control with no interference? This is their approach. Steps to break down the Judeo/Christian family and faith.
    Step one: Promote a system of collectivism and central power. Socialism and Communism.
    Step two: Strike a blow against the family. Propaganda for Population Zero. One child per family, abortion on demand. [GOD says go forth and multiply] Women are down trodden and second class citizens. Religion is at fault for all ills of Society because it is old and does not meet today’s needs. Downplay the need for marriage, use taxes and the ERA initiative to accomplish this and skew the court system against the male figure. Then the propaganda starts against the intelligence of the male in society. With the P.C. speech!
    Step three: Break up the idea that the Judeo/Christian way of life is the best in the world. Introduce multi-culturalism. Explain and teach that there is no right or wrong to the way different people live or believe and therefore allow them to have their ideas. After all, they are equal to yours.
    Step four: Create a cultural upheaval that will, and does, create a civil action or war, wars against the system that is working and see that it is demanded to be broken by the people. This brings us to the HATE-FILLED MOHOMMEDIST as a tool in the big picture, to break the system and to remove tranquility from society and create hate and discontent around the world. How do you control this portion of the plan? Economics! Overload the welfare systems. Bring each nation to its knees, until a final collapse is realized and inevitable. By now, all nations have become interlaced with production and consumption around the world. When one fails, it has a ripple effect on the rest. Greece, EU, M.E. and so on. Iceland said NO. They are now on the Austrian system. Pay as you go! They told the Central Bank to take a hike. This is scary to allow a few banks to control the world, but we still haven’t gotten to the Whore of Babylon.
    Here in the USA, we have a system of checks and balances, The Executive Branch, the Legislative Branch, and the Judicial Branch. This system was given to the USA by GOD Almighty, through the guidance of the Professor, while the Constitution was being written. This worked rather well for years, so what happened? At first, we paid homage to GOD Almighty. We understood where we came from. We understood that GOD oversaw our lives and this nation. We were revered around the world as the nation to emulate. Then we had the sexual revolution, with the birth control pill, etc. Then all morals were thrown to the four winds, while we, as a nation, tried to deal with the changes, along with the Vietnam War, etc. We were still the nation to emulate. However, there were cracks beginning to appear in our belief system. The Churches and Synagogues were under fire for preaching about politics and the word went out there is no place in our system for GOD. Remember, we trusted our Government implicitly after WWII, so when they said we know what to teach your children, leave it to us, we believed, and did just that. Being a parent is a lot of work and we are a little lazy, and after all, Dr. Spock said do not spank your child. We all listened, and many followed this improper behavior. Soon, GOD was asked to leave the classroom and government, then, it became a demand. Now, we have a people that are no longer taught the principles of the Judeo/Christian faith and it shows with the corruption in our Government and the disrespectfulness of people in our society toward one another.
    Still we cannot see the Whore of Babylon. It’s right in front of us. We hear about it every day. The question is, what is the control that keeps all nations subservient to this system? Bribes and threats is what it is. The G 7 or 8, whatever you want to call them, is the dispenser of these threats and bribes. But what and where is the real culprit? The World Bank carries a lot of clout, but it does not have enough clout on its own to do what it does unless the real Whore of Babylon is involved. The supply of money in the world is controlled by one source alone, it’s a Corporation. The monies of the world are predicated on one currency, the US Dollar. Who controls the Dollar, is it the mint? Is it the US treasury? Only as far as a function of the real Whore of Babylon, the FED.

  • randyman pooper, er, I mean, Andirsun Coopir

    I have no choice but to shout this for all to hear: NOW, WOMEN IN THE MILITARY! BEFORE THAT, THE HOMOSEXUALS! LOOK FOR ANOTHER 9/11. AND WITH ALL THESE NEW “ACCEPTIBLES” LOOK FOR THE DRAFT TO BE IMPLEMENTED. EVERYONE, FATTEN UP YOUR CHILDREN NOW! AND I MEAN FATTEN! 40-50 POUNDS, BEFORE THEY ARE SENT TO BE MAIMED AND DIE FOR OUR “LEADERS.” SEND THGEM TO SCHOOLS OVERSEAS, NOW! DON’T BE SUCKERED! IRAN/OIL/DEATH IS COMING.

    • Karolyn

      Don’t worry about it, the kids in this country are already overweight.

      • http://midcontent ridge runner

        The main reason we have overweight kids and people, is all the feel good crap, taking away high standrads for grades,performance in anything, boys are being raised more girly every year, and of course the lazy azzed government morons who beleive in doing nothing and getting paid quite well if you have a degree. Any bodyt that actually makes something, operates equipment, repairs anything, or biulds a business is looked down by the degreed worthless s–t birds. These same cegreed morons that beleive in theories and pie in the sky crap, buy into global warming, and blame man kind and beleive man kind can change the climate to what progressives want. What stupid bast–ds pushed this crap, it is the socialist/communist party over decades, first it was the removal of local control over schools, and allowed Washington to decide what everyone needed to learn, and what was considered correct behavior, for males and females, then came teachers were over worked and underpaid, school would get higher scores if more money was spent, and don’t forget a cat gut degree will guarentee big bucks and you will not have to break a sweat, unless you are vacationing, and telling everyone how bright you are. So now this muslim marxist moron is the perfect example ofyears of going to school and being force feed the marxist/communist//facist mantra along with the poor me vioctomology BS.

      • Bob666

        Sad,
        but very very true.

  • Kate8

    For those who haven’t yet heard this, it is a very interesting development.

    In indictment against Obama has been handed down by a federal court.

    Short of a coupe by his supporters, this man is going out.

    http://beforeitsnews.com/politics/2013/01/federal-court-indicts-president-obama-will-not-see-the-end-of-his-second-term-2488220.html

    • Robert Smith

      “Mr. Lyndon Larouche, a well respected journalist and political activist recieved word from his sources within the United States ”

      I thought he died in jail. I should have kept better track of that nut case.

      (Yes, it’s THAT Lyndon Larouch.)

      Rob

      • Bob666

        Yo Robert,
        ““Mr. Lyndon Larouche, a well respected journalist and political activist recieved word from his sources within the United States ”

        “I thought he died in jail. I should have kept better track of that nut case”

        Don’t worry Robert, Kate + 8 will keep track of for us. I thought he was long gone and pushing up daises.

      • Kate8

        We’ll see who laughs last.

      • Kate8
      • Right Brain Thinker

        No, sad to say, he is still wing-nutting away, even though he looks and sounds as if senility has caught up to him. We have watched him for many years here in VA, his adopted home state. In fact, he even ran for congress here while he was serving a prison sentence (and got very few votes).

        He has lately been in the wing-nut fringe news about how “a federal court has indicted O’Bama” and the wing nuts are circulating his views madly amongst the circular firing squad sites. They don’t come any loonier than Lyndon (and what does that say about Kate8, who seems to think he walks on water)?

        • Bob666

          Yo RBT,
          “They don’t come any loonier than Lyndon (and what does that say about Kate8, who seems to think he walks on water)?”

          I’ve been watching the sexual tension between you and a couple of the Palin Drones. After my exchane with Kate + 8 yesterday, I have to tell you, she does nothing for me!

          Think of Kate + 8 and Lyndon like Hugh Hefner and Crystal Harris, but at leat we know Crystal is hot.

      • Right Brain Thinker

        Yo Devil Guy Bob,

        In actuality, none of the Palin Drones “do anything” for me either. The “sexual tension” was just an attempt on my part to have a little fun and relieve the boredom of dealing with their mindless postings. Since their collective sense of humor is as abysmal as their thinking abilities and reading comprehension levels, I have been “rebuffed” in that attempt.

        I guess I’ll just have to content myself with thinking up new and creative ways to point out their failings to the world. Maybe like often quoting some of their more memorable comments? As in “Just because people drown sometimes, should we ban water?” To that, I would respond, “Of course not, just when it’s in its liquid phase—-everyone knows you can’t drown in ice cubes”. Then Jana would say “Yeah, but people die in avalanches, should we ban snow?” and………..does it ever end?

    • kimo3690

      IMPEACH OBAMA NOW!!!

    • Right Brain Thinker

      In a perhaps futile attempt to connect Kate8 with reality, let me point out that courts do not indict, grand juries do—-courts try those who are indicted and convict or acquit. The “indictment” she speaks of was handed down by a “citizen’s grand jury”, which has no standing to do any such thing and the “indictment” was ignored by the court.

      Kate8 parrots the wing nut talk that “this man is going out”. There is a whole string of “indictments” of O’Bama floating in wing nut land, and all they are is the usual crying and complaining and name calling coming from the sore losers. They will never see the inside of any court and any suggestion that they ever could is patently insane..

  • Dave67

    I love the ignorants here that believe for you to me a moral person you have to be religious. Or that the founders had any intention of a Gov endorsed religion.

    Dumb

    Dumb

    Dumb

    • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing WTS/JAY

      Dave: I love the ignorants here that believe for you to me a moral person you have to be religious.

      Totally agree! In fact, that’s the last place one should look to for a moral-compass. Why?

      The reason is that religion is not relationship. Religion is all about us trying to impress God with large buildings, sacrifices, good works and inspirational cultural achievements. But, and this may be hard to hear, God’s just not interested in us impressing him.

      The reason isn’t that surprising when you think about it. It’s simply that, while human achievements might be truly wonderful, our hearts aren’t. In fact, the human heart is dreadful…

  • Dave67

    Also, nobody here seems qualified to know what true tyranny is. If you think Obama is a tyrant, please go to Saudi Arabia, Cuba or North Korea and get an education.

    The right wing information bubble has done you a disservice.

    • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing WTS/JAY

      Do you suffer from cognitive-dissonance, Dave? Not sure? Consider the following information provided for your benefit.

      Cognitive dissonance is a psychological phenomenon which refers to the discomfort felt at a discrepancy between what you already know or believe, and new information or interpretation. It therefore occurs when there is a need to accommodate new ideas, and it may be necessary for it to develop so that we become “open” to them.

      Beyond this benign if uncomfortable aspect, however, dissonance can go “over the top”, leading to two interesting side-effects for learning:

      -if someone is called upon to learn something which contradicts what they already think they know — particularly if they are committed to that prior knowledge — they are likely to resist the new learning. Even Carl Rogers recognised this. Accommodation is more difficult than Assimilation, in Piaget’s terms.

      -and—counter-intuitively, perhaps—if learning something has been difficult, uncomfortable, or even humiliating enough, people are less likely to concede that the content of what has been learned is useless, pointless or valueless. To do so would be to admit that one has been “had”, or “conned”.

      Ring any bells, Dave?

      • Right Brain Thinker

        JAY starts out by quoting some generally correct information about cognitive dissonance (source unknown—and Piaget and Rogers references are “over the top” for this audience).

        His last paragraph, however, is totally twisted horsepucky. Jay is following the old propaganda technique of “speak some truth and get them nodding and going “OK”, then hit them with the whopper and hope it sticks”. The only “bell it rings” has a bigger crack than the Liberty Bell.

        • Jeff

          Jay reminds me of the guy with just information to be dangerous – to himself. Like the freshman psychology student with a new toy calling everyone he meets “anal retentive.” Very impressive – to an ignoramus. The art of applying such terms to an individual lies in judgment and Jay has demonstrated none of that.

  • wavesofgrain

    I do not know where the author got the info that conservatives encourage the “police state’, as I am a member of a conservative group and all are against the police brotherhood/state. Unions are a form of communism, and most are fighting for freedom from unions as well. If you abolished public unions, you will see crime decrease and education improve (and municipal bankruptcies diminish), as the public employees will now be working for who is funding their paycheck (citizens), NOT the UNIONS.

    • GJM

      Just like a true Republican, you want to rewrite history and ignore the facts.
      Let’s forget that it was the Bush Republicans that gave us the “Patriot Act”.
      Please let me know what is so “patriotic” about harrasssing American citizens in airports, seaports, And sometimes railway depots. I sincerely believe that these actions, by your beloved Republican Party, has Hitler smiling in his grave!

  • http://GOOGLE PERRY HOLMES

    Dave67 you must work for the goverment because you can not see what is going on in this country. you will be among the first to be a slave to big goverment. when the people say no more to the lies of Obama and the law makers….

  • GJM

    Why hasn’t anybody started a petition to dismantle the government? This is a Constitutional right.

    • Jeff

      You go right ahead.

      • GJM

        I have already started a petition to dismantle the government of the state of Washington.
        What have you done?
        Just sit back and let someone else fight for you.

        • Jeff

          And when you catch the car, what will you do with it? In other words, what will you replace it with? A militia?

  • Attila

    Institutionalizing compassion cannot be done without also institutionalizing tyranny. All posturing aside, this is all about pandering for votes in reality. Robbing Peter to pay Paul means you can usually count on Paul to kiss up.

    • Jeff

      “Institutionalizing compassion cannot be done without also institutionalizing tyranny”

      Try explaining that revocation of the social contract to a mother who can’t feed her kids or provide healthcare to a sick child. Oh, she got food stamps and healthcare? Well, it’s no thanks to the likes of you. You’ll teach her to fish? Oh, right after Mitt Romney gets his tax cut. Never mind, the kid just died.

      • Attila

        Politicians who benefit from the power of dispensing these goodies would like to pretend otherwise, but there were private, city, and state social safety nets before the federal government became involved but they were much closer to and more accountable to the voters. Long before. The Roman Republic, as it devolved into a tyranny gulled the people with free food and entertainment to maintain its hold on power. The end result is always the same: it is all fun and games until they run out of other people’s money.

        • Jeff

          Keep telling yourself your tax cut is not for you but for the poor – to keep them from becoming dependent ans subject to the tyranny of food and medicine. Keep saying it until you believe it.

      • Attila

        Well, boo hoo, it is all about the starving women and children, is it? Go by the SS offices where they sign up for food stamps. They are mostly driving newer cars than I, and the majority of them suffer from obesity rather than hunger. Naturally they dont take the jobs that illegal immigrants are eager to take. Why should they? Educate yourself in the real world instead of parroting propaganda.

        • Jeff

          You’re still pushing the “Welfare Queens in Cadillacs” line, eh? Well, I was a kid in California when Reagan first told that lie. No one ever found Reagan’s Welfare Queen and they won’t find yours either. We spend little enough on the poor that you don’t need to villify them for having needs.

      • Attila

        Guess you dont get much news down there. Watch FOX now and then to get some perspective. According to the US Census Bureau official data, in 2009 31% of US households were receiving means tested benefits. Of course that is never enough when the aim is simply to purchase votes. How about the fact that welfare now exceeds national defense (which, unlike welfare, is actually a legal Constitutional function of the federal government? The snorts of derision you encounter on this site are due to the great amusement in your ignorance and your blissful unawareness of it.

        • Jeff

          Approximately 4 million Americans are receiving welfare benefits. That’s a bit over 1%. More receive food stamps (income tested), but the amounts received are quite low ($100 a month or less). I’m sure some with larger families get more, but it’s a supplement. In comparison to the money we waste on corporate welfare and idiotic foreign adventures, this money is a drop in the bucket.

          When you talk about 31%, I assume you’re talking about Social Security and Medicare? Those expenses have nothing to do with any deficit as they are separately funded and are a reflection of an aging population. As we are a wealthy country with a relatively low birth rate, we have always relied on immigration to provide much of the youthful energy a growing economy requires. Maybe now we can have an intelligent discussion nationally about the value of immigration to the economy.

  • swampfox

    Jesus rules….nuff said!

  • Newspooner

    Each time I return to this website and read another good article I get more disappointed in the quality of the readers’ comments. That quality is declining rapidly as the quantity of professional Establishment shills and misinformed people increases disturbingly. Where we used to find many excellent insights and references to useful information (Thank you DaveH and others!) we now find much more confused expressions of what people think is correct but actually shows evidence of being hoodwinked by the elitist socialists. The likelihood that this is actually part of a conspiracy to neutralize and even destroy the wonderful work of this website is also disturbing. I don’t know what the remedy is, but I hope that the good people with sound minds, good hearts, and true patriotism will continue to try to present the truth here and at other websites.

    • CHRISTOPHER ALLEN HORTON

      “Newspooner,”

      YOU CONTRADICTED YOURSELF.

      NO OFFENSE TO “DaveH,” BUT, PROVIDING WEB LINKS TO OTHERS’ IDEAS IS THE SAME THING AS TYPING THERE ARE PEOPLE ON THIS SITE WHO ARE “shills” AND CAN NOT THINK FOR THEMSELVES.

      “Newspooner,” OBVIOUSLY, YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND THE PURPOSE OF DISCUSSION SITES. ANYONE WHO GOES TO A DISCUSSION SITE IN ORDER TO OBTAIN PRINCIPAL INFORMATION ON A TOPIC WILL HAVE A NARROW VIEW OF THAT TOPIC. SO, “Newspooner,” YOUR DISAPPOINTMENT IN THE QUALITY OF COMMENTERS IS “MISPLACED” BECAUSE Staff Writers AT Personal Liberty Digest KNOW THEIR TARGET AUDIENCE.

  • CHRISTOPHER ALLEN HORTON

    FINALLY – AN ARTICLE WRITTEN BY, Paul Craig Roberts. I WAS WONDERING WHEN I WOULD GET AN OPPORTUNITY TO READ HIS WORK.

    Mr. Roberts, SIR, YOU “SKIRTED” AROUND THE FOUNDATIONAL ISSUE OF YOUR STORY – RACE.

    Mr. Roberts, YOU SAY, “It doesn’t occur to conservatives that in Europe democracy, liberty, welfare, rich people and national health services all coexist, but somehow American liberty is so fragile …” Mr. Roberts, SLAVERY ENDED IN EUROPE LONG BEFORE IT DID IN UNITED STATES. ALTHOUGH AMERICAN SLAVERY MAY HAVE TECHNICALLY ENDED IN 1865, ITS “FRUITS” ARE STILL GROWING IN 2013. THOSE INITIATIVES YOU MENTIONED (democracy, liberty and rich people) ARE TRAITS WHICH HAVE BEEN DELEGATED TO ONLY ONE GROUP IN THIS NATION – CAUCASIAN. THOSE OTHER TWO INITIATIVES (welfare and national health services) ARE TRAITS WHICH HAVE BEEN “FOCUSLY” DELEGATED TO PEOPLE OF COLOR, ALTHOUGH -DUE TO SHEER NUMBERS – POOR CAUCASIANS RECEIVE THE BULK OF THESE BITTER “FRUITS.”

    Mr. Roberts, YOU SAY, The Obama democrats … removed the protection afforded to citizens from being murdered by the government without due process.” Mr. Roberts, THE KENYAN HAS NEGROES “IN HIS BACK POCKET.” NEGROES BELIEVE THE KENYAN WILL HAVE TO DO SOME THINGS IN ORDER TO MAKE CAUCASIANS HAPPY – OR, HE WILL BE ASSASSINATED. [Negroes believe President John Fitzgerald Kennedy was murdered because he liked blacks TOO MUCH]. NEGROES WILL ALWAYS BELIEVE CAUCASIANS ARE OBSESSED WITH JAIL CONSTRUCTION BECAUSE THE EXISTENCE OF NEGROES IN CAGES – FROM, SLAVERY TIMES – IS THE MOST COMFORTABLE “MENTAL PICTURE” FOR CAUCASIANS. SO, NEGROES BELIEVE THE KENYAN’S NONCHALANCE TOWARDS due process IS A WAY OF “GETTING ON HIS KNEES AND WAITING FOR THE PAT-ON-THE-HEAD,” FROM CAUCASIANS.

    Mr. Roberts, I AM INTERESTED IN LIBERTARIANISM; BUT, I HOPE CAUCASIAN LIBERTARIANS DO NOT FALL INTO THE SAME HOLE CAUCASIAN REPUBLICANS FELL IN BY TRYING TO IGNORE THE FACT THERE ARE STILL A LOT OF ANGRY PEOPLE OF COLOR WHO BELIEVE THE “white man” WANTS TO “LINE HIS POCKETS OFF THE SWEAT OF ‘darkies’ BACKS.”

    • Jeff

      Chris:

      I’m sure I’ll regret asking but you seem to be a reasonably aware young Black man, fully aware of Conservative Republican racial attitudes, but you insist on adopting the right wing mantra that Obama is a Kenyan. Who would you prefer to see as president?

      • CHRISTOPHER ALLEN HORTON

        “Jeff,”

        Governor Jeb Bush.

        I WILL ALWAYS BE LOYAL TO THE Bush Family. IF IT HAD NOT BEEN FOR President George Herbert Walker Bush, I WOULD CARE LESS ABOUT POLITICS. THE FIRST President Bush IS AMERICA’S GREATEST STATESMAN. [I know many Caucasian Republicans do not like him - that is "their deal"].

        “Jeff,” AS YOU KNOW, I AM A PERSON WHO VIEWS Old Personal Liberty threads. SO, “Jeff,” WHEN DID YOU START TO BELIEVE I AM – INDEED – NEGRO?

        • Jeff

          When you said so.

      • CHRISTOPHER ALLEN HORTON

        “Jeff,”

        LIKE YOU, “I’m sure I’ll regret asking but … “, AS A PARTICIPANT ON THIS SITE, WHY ARE YOU HERE WHEN YOU KNOW HOW MOST AMERICANS FEEL ABOUT HEBREWS? [I just finished re-reading our discussion on "The Jewish Question"].

        “Jeff” – PLEASE, THIS IS NOT AN INSULT – BUT, I HAVE WONDERED IF LIBERAL CAUCASIANS ARE HERE BECAUSE THEY ARE SENIORS; OR, BECAUSE THEY WANT TO KNOW HOW “THE OTHER SIDE” THINKS.

        • Jeff

          I don’t know how most Americans feel about “Hebrews.” I know there’s still a latent anti-Semitism on the right, particularly the Old Right. The religious right loves Israel but I’m pretty sure they’re not so in love with Jews. It wasn’t more than a generation back that Southern Baptists thought Jews had horns. Certainly, there’s not much commonality on social issues as even conservative Jews are quite uncomfortable with open displays of Christianity with all the baggage they include.

          It does not particularly surprise me that many African Americans consider Jews as just another white man, but I guess I am a bit surprised that many Blacks single out the Jews for special loathing. This surprises me as Jews were the first “white” people in the 20th Century to really “throw in” with the Black Struggle. Jews were among the founders of the NAACP and while there’s been some disagreement over the issue of affirmative action, no other group of American “whites” has remained as committed to the cause of civil rights as have the Jews.

          I understand the differences over Israel and the Palestinians, but you will find that among American (and Israeli) Jews that opinions are extremely divided over Israel’s treatment of the Palestinians. t is an article of faith amongst Republicans that criticism of Israeli policy concerning the settlements is tantamount to anti-Semitism. Jews know that this is nonsense as roughly half of Israeli Jews and a solid majority or American Jews are critical of the Likud position on the settlements.

      • CHRISTOPHER ALLEN HORTON

        “Jeff,”

        PARDON THE THIRD COMMENT, BUT, I AM EMOTIONALLY DEALING WITH YOUR COMMENTARY IN “SPURTS.”

        I TOOK A “MONTH-OFF” FROM, Personal Liberty Digest BECAUSE OF MY STATEMENT OF BEING A, Negro White-Supremacist. MY ANGER TOWARDS Barack Hussein Obama WILL NOT GO AWAY BECAUSE HIS SKIN COLOR IS TOO MUCH OF A “MENTAL BARRIER” FOR ME. I HAVE PURPOSEFULLY IGNORED Personal Liberty Digest’s JANUARY THREADS ON THIS PERSON BECAUSE I DO NOT KNOW HOW TO MAKE COMMENTARY IN REFERENCE TO HIM WITHOUT BECOMING ANGRY. “Jeff,” I AM NO POLITICAL EXPERT – YOU KNOW THAT. I CALL HIM, “KENYAN,” BECAUSE INFORMATION ON CONSERVATIVE WEBSITES HAVE – INDEED – CAUSED ME TO BELIEVE THIS PERSON WAS NOT BORN ON AMERICAN SOIL. I DID READ Personal Liberty Digest’s BRIEF STORY ABOUT PEOPLE IGNORING THE SECOND INAUGURAL. I DID NOT LIKE THAT STORY BECAUSE I BELIEVE POLITICS IS BECOMING A “SHAM” IF PEOPLE WHO DO NOT LIKE HIM (AND, HAVE POWER), DO NOT IMPEACH HIM. “BALL-LESS” CRITICISM ONLY MAKES THESE PEOPLE LOOK LIKE THE “RACISTS” LIBERALS CLAIM, THEY ARE.

      • CHRISTOPHER ALLEN HORTON

        “Jeff,”

        THANK YOU.

        THROUGHOUT MY LIFE, IT HAS BEEN QUITE “TIRING” TO CONSTANTLY HEAR AND DEAL WITH Afrocentric blacks WHO BELIEVE – WITH ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY – THAT THEY KNOW HOW ALL NEGROES FEEL ON ALL ISSUES. YET, THEY FEEL INSULTED WHEN CAUCASIANS SAY, “blacks are all alike.” WELL, I AM INSULTED WHEN ANOTHER NEGRO CALLS ME, “brotha,” WITH ABSOLUTELY “NO CLUE” OF MY VALUE SYSTEM. I GUARANTEE, IF THAT black KNEW THE “REAL” ME, THEY WOULD RATHER SHOOT ME.

        LIVING IN DARK SKIN HAS NOT BEEN EASY FOR ME.

        • Jeff

          Maybe Faux News will offer you a talk show!

      • CHRISTOPHER ALLEN HORTON

        “Jeff,”

        AS AN ATHEIST, I AM NOT SO SURE, “The religious right loves Israel … ” I THINK POLITICAL CHRISTIANS HAVE A LOVE FOR THE Biblical AREA, BUT NOT, THE CONTEMPORARY AREA WHICH IS NOW THE NATION OF ISRAEL. A GREAT EXAMPLE IS, IRAQ. ALTHOUGH THE SO-CALLED, “Garden of Eden,” IS ALLEGED TO HAVE EXISTED BETWEEN THE Tigris- AND Euphrates Rivers, ANYONE WITH A BRAIN UNDERSTANDS HOW CONTEMPORARY IRAQ HAS BEEN DEMONIZED SIMPLY BECAUSE AMERICANS HAVE ALLOWED UNITED STATES OF AMERICA’S SO-CALLED “SUPERPOWER STATUS” GO “TO THEIR HEADS.”

        “Jeff,” I THINK CAUCASIAN CHRISTIANS WOULD STRONGLY DISAGREE WITH YOUR VIEW THAT HEBREWS PLAYED A ROLE IN black civil rights. CAUCASIAN CHRISTIANS GAVE SLAVES THE ENGLISH LANGUAGE AND A CIVILIZED WAY OF LIFE. NEGROES – FOR BETTER, OR, WORSE – HAVE EXPERIENCED A WIDE RANGE OF EMOTIONS IN THEIR DEALINGS WITH CAUCASIAN CHRISTIANS (PRIMARILY, PROTESTANTS). SINCE EMANCIPATION, NEGROES HAVE ALWAYS HAD A DISTRUST (AND, A SUSPICIOUS FEAR [which is not "unfounded," depending on the particular black in question]) OF HEBREWS. IT WAS FRIENDLY CAUCASIAN-CHRISTIANS WHO CAME TO blacks’ AID WHEN THEIR BRETHREN OF Ku Klux Klan SHOWED THEIR MIGHT.

  • Joey

    “It doesn’t occur to conservatives that in Europe democracy, liberty, welfare, rich people and national health services all coexist, but that somehow American liberty is so fragile that it is overturned by a limited health program available only to the elderly.”
    I needed a good laugh. I think civil freedom’s important, but it’s funny how this Reagan treasurer is an apologist for Obamacare and the welfare state. Can somebody say RINO alert?
    As a libertarian-leaning conservative, I DON’T love the welfare state, European socialism and Obamacare as this troll (Paul Craig AKA John) Roberts does, thank you very much!

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