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The Dispossessed Majority

August 10, 2012 by  

The Dispossessed Majority
SPECIAL

The bumper sticker on the beat-up pickup truck read: “Friends don’t let friends vote Democrat.”

The driver was obviously not affluent. Yet, despite all the news about mega-trillion-dollar bankster bailouts, mega-million-dollar bonuses for financial crooks and unimaginable compensation packages for corporate CEOs who have moved middle class jobs out of America, something made the down-and-out pickup truck driver associate with the political party of the super-rich.

As I wondered at this strange alliance of the dirt poor with the mega-rich, I remembered that in 2004, Thomas Frank wondered about how the Republicans had managed to convince the poor to vote against their best interests. Frank’s answer, or part of his answer, is that the Republicans use “social issues,” such as gay marriage and Janet Jackson’s exposed nipple, to work up indignation over the threat to moral values posed by liberal Democrats.

The working poor have been convinced by Republican propaganda that voting Democrat means giving the working poor’s tax dollars to the non-working poor, to providing medical care and schooling for illegal aliens, and being soft on terrorism.

To the pickup truck driver, standing up for America means standing up for bankster bailouts and the military/security complex’s multitrillion-dollar wars.

The Karl Rove Dirty Tricks Team has honed the Republican propaganda. Republicans send each other via email an endless number of nonsense stories about Barack Obama being a Muslim, about Obama being a Marxist, about Obama being a Manchurian candidate turning America over to the New World Order, the United Nations or some other dastardly plotting organization. But never is Obama accused of turning the United States over to Wall Street, the military/security complex or Israel.

There is never any citation or source for the accusations in the emails. None is needed, because the words are what the Republicans want to hear. Ask them why Obama would be killing Muslims in seven countries if he was a Muslim or why Wall Street and the military/security complex would put a Marxist in the White House, and they turn purple with rage. Just by asking the obvious questions instead of joining in the denunciations, a person confirms the propaganda that America is threatened by Obama dupes who won’t stand up for the country.

The non-affluent who rage about welfare, Medicaid, Obamacare and public schools can’t seem to put two and two together. The $750 billion TARP bankster bailout, a small part of the total and ongoing bailout, would have sufficed to cover any holes in these budgets for a long time. Instead, the money went to reward those who caused the financial crisis and threw millions of Americans out of their homes. As far as I know, the pickup truck driver is one of the dispossessed.

The same brainwashed Americans who rage against Obamacare and are lined up to vote for Mitt Romney are oblivious to the fact that Romney, while Governor of the eastern liberal Democratic state of Massachusetts, had his version of Obamacare enacted at the State level.

The greatest irony about Obamacare is that it was written by the private insurance companies and diverts Medicaid and Medicare funds to their profits. It is socialized medicine alright, but it is socialism for the private insurance companies.

All it took to convince Red Staters to go along with the military/security complex squandering $6 trillion on the Iraq and Afghanistan wars were yellow ribbon decals and a slogan, “Support the troops.”

Obama, Republicans claim, won’t stand up to Syria, or against Iran or for Israel. But Republicans are proud when Romney goes to Israel to slither on his belly, pandering to the crazed, bloodthirsty Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu, who called Israeli top generals “pussies” for warning against attacking Iran. Romney told Netanyahu: “Just tell me what to do, and I’ll do it; I am loyal to Israel.” Apparently, flag-waving Republican patriots are not bothered when their Presidential candidate announces that as soon as he is in office he will turn over U.S. foreign policy to Netanyahu and send more americans to death and bankruptcy for Netanyahu.

Karl Rove didn’t have any trouble at all in brainwashing Red Staters to support their own demise. The pickup truck driver could just as well have sported a bumper sticker that read: “Don’t support a Democrat. He might do something for you.”

Yes, I know. It is almost as easy to beat up on Democrats. George W. Bush, Dick Cheney and their neocon hoodlums destroyed the Constitution and, thereby, America. But the Democrats let them. It was Nancy Pelosi, who as Speaker of the House stridently declared Bush’s impeachment to be “off the table.”

Bush and Cheney unquestionably violated both U.S. and international laws and the Constitution. Pelosi’s refusal to hold them accountable established the precedent that the executive branch is no longer accountable to law or to the Constitution. In effect, the executive branch now comprises a dictatorship. It acts outside of law and Constitutional restraints. On some issues it still has to consult with Congress or the courts; but as the executive branch’s power and audacity grows, consultation will become a formality and then drop away. Congress will have no more influence than the Roman Senate under the Empire, and courts will become stages for show trials.

Americans elected Obama President, expecting that he would restore the rule of law. Instead, he codified the Bush regime’s transgressions and added some of his own. No one of my generation could have imagined the President of the United States sitting in the Oval Office signing off on lists of American citizens to be murdered without evidence or due process of law.

So which do you want? The Republican panderer to the rich and Israel whose foreign policy is war or the Democrat panderer to the rich and Israel whose foreign policy is war? As Gerald Celente wrote in the July issue of the Trends Journal, americans “argue among themselves why their freak is better than the other freak. They will get angry with you if you call their freak a freak. They will actually fight and die to defend their freaks.”

It is extraordinary that millions of americans actually believe fervently that it matters whether Romney freak or Obama freak gets elected. If americans had any sense, they would stay home and not vote. The 1 percent control the country, and the 99 percent had just as well own up to it and stay at home. Nothing is going to change because of the ballot box.

What do you suppose the Ron Paul supporters will do? Will they see Romney as the less socialist of the two and vote for the Republicans who stole the nomination from Paul? (Jaret Glenn, “How the GOP Establishment Stole the Nomination from Ron Paul,” published on Aug. 6 on the OpEdNews website.)

The United States is ruled by a private oligarchy. The government is merely its front. The country’s resources are diverted to the pockets of Wall Street, the military/security complex and to the service of greater Israel. The oil, mining, timber and agribusiness companies control the Environmental Protection Agency and the Forestry Service, which is why regulation pertains only to the small individual, while fracking, mountaintop removal mining and pollution of air, water and soil run wild.

The oligarchs have succeeded in making americans a dispossessed majority in their own country. In November, americans will again give their approval to one of the oligarchy’s two candidates.

–Paul Craig Roberts

Paul Craig Roberts

was Assistant Secretary of the Treasury for Economic Policy and associate editor of The Wall Street Journal. He was columnist for Business Week, Scripps Howard News Service, and Creators Syndicate. He has had many university appointments. His Internet columns have attracted a worldwide following, and can be accessed here.

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  • Vigilant

    Mr. Roberts says, “”Ask [Republicans] why…Wall Street and the military/security complex would put a Marxist in the White House, and they turn purple with rage.”

    Ask a Libertarian or a NWO conspiracy theorist that question and you’ll get the same reaction.

    • Michael J.

      Vigilant says,
      “NWO conspiracy theorist”

      Surely, you jest.

      • Vigilant

        So, are you saying then that “Wall Street and the military/security complex…put a Marxist in the White House?” If you are a NWO conspiracy theorist, you would take issue with Mr. Roberts’ statement. Unless, of course, you believe that EVERYTHING that happens in this world is controlled by the Biderburg Group.

        Not taking a side (yet), just pointing out the obvious and the logical.

      • TIME

        Dear Michael,

        When speaking with the Blind or ones who’s ears are filled with hate, or who’s soul is split in to fragments of rotten decay.
        Expect the responce to be nothing less than that of a Mindless sheep.

        Saddly I say this again: the 41st Ccngress is where the Point of most of our problems today really began.
        As the vast amount of Americans can’t “COMPREHEND” the full “Ramifiucations” of what was done to the American people, they are only a symptom of what’s wrong with out nation. Its just sick beyond repair.

        The question is this – if one falls and breaks their knee, would applying a cold compress to your head be of any benifit?

        The answer to anyone who can still use their GRAY matter is; NO.

        Yet – To some it will be – {perhaps if it’s done right.}

        To others it will be {yes indeed that works just fine.}

        Then we also have the {I don’t know, what are them things again?}

        And that’s in fact whats broken in our nation, we have FOSTERED STUPIDITY for so long that its now just common place.

        As well we have also fostered total ignorance of what has become a staple diet for the vast amounts of sheep who are still eating the rancid grass in the field.
        Thus they just don’t care as long as that rancid grass is still there.

        Its a simple case of; Divide / Divide & Divide again & again unitil you get the soup just right, then you can CONQUER.

        Saddly we the few, the less than 10% who are really awake and have not only broken the CODE, but also looked in to that box of rancid road apples are vastly out numbered by the PURE IDIOTS / worthless eaters.

        Peace and Love

      • Michael J.

        Vigilant,
        To nutshell The Earth’s problems, I say that all roads lead to The Rothschild Dynasty. A distinction inherited from The Romans.

      • DaveH

        It really doesn’t matter if it’s the Rothchilds, the Rockefellers, the Morgans, or some other super-rich that are pulling the strings. What matters is that it has been shown time and again that Big Government just doesn’t work for anybody but a select few. We need to shrink it dramatically and get this country back to the Freedom and Prosperity that come from Limited Government.
        For Individual Freedom, Personal Responsibility, Free Markets, Limited Government, and the PEACE that accompanies them — Vote Libertarian!
        http://libertarianparty.org/

    • Nadzieja Batki

      So both groups are using people as cat’s-paws for their own agenda.

      • my 2¢ worth

        There is no “Both Groups”.. Only on paper. WE are the groups and we’re all mad as hell.

    • junkmail

      after reading the columns and posts I have come to the conclusion that this is is home of the never to be satisfied unless the majority kneels down and gets stupped by them.
      The country can be put back on the path of recovery and with 30 years of hard work be what it was meant to be.
      I read petty sniveling comments here by people who will destroy the country rather than not have the republican party kiss their ass. Wa Wa I will not vote for Romney.

      OK all you college grads and moonshine drinkers. you get this ONE CHANCE. It is here, right now. If you do anything other than vote for Romney, Obama gets elected.
      Is this perfectly clear?????????? This is not some theory it is fact. Cut the crap and man up. If you do not vote for Romney please tattoo the fact on you, your wife, your children your house, your car, and your business. This way we know who helped to destroy America by helping elect Obama

      • http://none Charlie

        Heathen,,, IF,,,this Romhead is our last chance ,,,then America is on the way to Hell in a Chinese hand basket,,, The King of America has different Plans called out in His Law Book.
        Praise King Jesus for Salvation and Healing … Acts 2:38…

      • Jeff

        Junk:

        When attempting to lead, it is sometimes wise to turn around and make sure someone is following. Who left the country heading off a cliff? Was that Obama or your guy, W? How many times would you have voted for the little moron anyway? Still see a lot of W ’04 signs around? How many people will admit they voted for him or for Nixon (or bought an Edsel)?

        • bonniewheeler

          I voted for George W. Bush – I would do so again. Former President Bush was not a thin skinned egotist. . He was no coward – He was proud of America and never hisitated to salute the flag or quit wearing a patriotic symbol for fear of “offending” unlike the current president who made one of the most stupid statments by an American, much less a President, t that I have ever heard in the history of this nation. He has always had a vendetta against America. On the other hand former President Bush did what he thought was best for America, Some of you guys, who are always criticizing Fox, never mention how CBS tried to bring him down with forged documents. I would suggest when you are working so hard to try to find a fault with FN just go back a few years and let’s talk about the forged documents by CBS. . Jeff, I agree we can once again be the great nation we once were but its definitley after we get rid of the present leader because he has never thought of America as a great nation. He has alway had vendetta against America and found fault.

          • Jeff

            W was a disaster as president. If you can’t see that, you are simply blind. Why do you think even the Republicans will barely mention his name? They do, however, want to repeat his policies – tax cuts, for the wealthy, deregulation, defense spending increases – all in the name of fiscal responsibility while exploding the deficit and enriching the already wealthy. It’s what Republicans do. Like the old Green Bay Packers. They ran over left tackle. It was what they did. If you think Romney will be different from GW Moron, you are sadly mistaken.

          • http://www.facebook.com/robert77581 Robert Allen

            Jeff, you may be right in some areas , but the fact is Romney is at least proud to be an American and no matter what shape our country is in, it is 100% better to live in that anyother . I’m voting for Romney the same reason I voted for Bush, because I believe the mistakes he made were not intended to collapse the system as we know it, and that is the stated goal of the current ‘occupier’ of the White House. I wil vote for Romney/Ryan for that reason and the fact that Mr. Romney at least knows what’s it like to actually run a private enerprise and I , for one, am not jealous or envious of someone who basically earned their wealth on their own, not like Clinton and Obama, who have become millionaires as ‘public servants’…That’s all they know…Do I agree with all the ideas; no’, but they sure come closer to my personal convictions than some person who would love to see America become another 3rd world country, where all the power resides in government and unions and not enterprenuers and small business owners…

          • Jeff

            What does running a private business purely for profit have to do with running a government? When one of Romney’s companies underperformed, he sold off the pieces, even if it meant putting people out of work. That may be a legitimate way to earn profits for investors, but it has NOTHING to do with providing for the welfare of citizens. Romney will take good care of people like him and will not even consider the needs of people who actually need help from the government to reach the middle class. Romney will be a W-like disaster as president and Ryan is a complete fraud.

            Ryan reminds me of Nixon. He’s smart enough to know that what he’s saying is bunk. On February 14, 2002, Ryan addressed the House in favor of exactly the kind of economic stimulus he now decries as wasteful, socialist, post-Keynesian, etc. It was a full-throated defense of everything he now calls socialist: unemployment benefits, health care, younameit. The difference? A Republican was president then.

          • bonniewheeler

            Bush must have done something right. Look at the unemployment under Bush and look at it now. He cut taxes on everyone, even me. Taxes under Clinton brought me to tears I just didn’t have the money. After Bush came to office I never had to pay again. Your statement that he only helped the wealthy is either a lie or you have been horribly misinformed. He also cut taxes on the wealthy which he should have done. They pay more than their share already. . Obama policy of raising taxes has discouraged business and growth.
            Who wants to get punished because they succeeed and, on the other hand, who is going to try to succeed when they are already living just as well as those who do. Obama is the welfare king. Clinton required welfare recipients to work – then comes Obama and defines lying in bed all day as work. If you don’t believe me, look it up – I didn’t believe it either when I first heard it.

          • Jeff

            Where was the stock market when W finally left office? Where is it today? Does that have no bearing on business confidence?

      • Farleyagain

        The ultra wealthy already pay a low rate on their income. That’s what they pay law writers for, but the top 10% of income earners pay 70% of all income taxes, so why worry? Still, my favorite sign from all the demonstrations in the past four years was, “Why pay taxes when they can just print money?”

    • SJJolly

      In Conservative-think, a Marxist is anyone who doesn’t have their lips firmly pressed against Wall Street banker backsides. By which defination, Obama is NOT a Marxist.

      • tesmith47

        100% right, the anti Obma folks call Obama a marxist,muslim atheist?
        which means they dont know anything , they are just calling him “bad” names

      • bonniewheeler

        Are you saying that he dropped his Marxist views when he became President?

        • Jeff

          Could you define his Marxist views? You do know we’re not talking about Groucho?

      • bonniewheeler

        I can give you information on Karl Marx. he believed in immorality and same-sex marriages (does this ring a bell?) And as his family nearly starved and and as his long-suffering wife neared the breaking point, Marx began an affair with the family’s young nursemaid. He impregnated her and when the child was born, Marx refused to acknowledge its existence and his paternity. Marx’s disciples, of course, happily followed in his footsteps. Marxism is another word for extreme immorality. Anyone who would think of condoning such as this should not be allowed to even be a citizen in this great country, whose vfoundation was based on Godly beliefs

  • Michael J.

    Mr. Roberts,
    You appear to possess an in depth understanding of the worlds predicament(some I agree with and some I do not), but fall short of naming the ultimate culprit.

    When we see the end of The Rothschild Dynasty, The world will breath a sigh of relief, but not before. A mere thousand of them and their surrogates versus six billion humans with the internet as ally, has them scurrying towards a final solution that would make Adolf jealous.

    • Karolyn

      According to debunkers, there is no Rothschild Dynasty. Here is one link. This one doesn’t have a lot of info, but there are more to be found. Unfortunately, I cannot find the one I was using months ago. That guy has a complete Rothschild history, debunking the conspiracy theories.
      http://www.icke-exposed.co.uk/united-states/rothschild-myths-debunked-100/

      • Techno Dan

        Your linked page contains a bunch of ranting that does nothing to debunk the Rothschild conspiracy. And when comments are made against the article, the author calls those people stupid and, in one case, attacks supposed mistakes in grammar and sentence struckure without addressing one bit of the substance of the comment. Pathetic.

      • Karolyn

        Here’s another skeptic’s report:
        http://skeptoid.com/episodes/4311

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jay

        Techno says: And when comments are made against the article, the author calls those people stupid and, in one case, attacks supposed mistakes in grammar and sentence struckure without addressing one bit of the substance of the comment. Pathetic.

        Yup, we get the same types here, Techno. We affectionately refer to them as “socialist-progs”. They despise critical thinking and anyone disagreeing with them. Truly, a deluded bunch!

      • TIME

        Dear Jay,

        Yea, you hit that bloody nail on the head!

        I have spent over 3000 hours digging up intel on them special RED Shield clan, what we have cover here – is not even a NANO amount of what can be found and all of it TRUTH.

        Hey this is a game anyone can play, first look up what the “RED SHIELD” looks like. Hey here’s a clue its the “Rothschilds Family Crest”
        Now take out a US ONE Dollar bill, ok still with me?

        Good here’s just a tad of how much influence they hold over everyones life on this planet. Look at the face of your Dollar bill it must be a paper one. Silver is for later
        Ok still with me?
        Good, look at all four 1′ in each corner. Note you have three with ovals, now look at that odd looking one in the {upper right hand side} Now what do you see there?
        Oh yea baby, its the “”RED SHIELD!”" And who Family crest is
        that again?

        But hey they really are super nice people you know the kind you want to invite over to dinner and a few drinks. Well that is if you like mass murders with blood dripping from their fingers and all that rot.

        Peace and Love to all of you who have seen the ” LIGHT.”
        May God & his SON’s light, bless you and keep you and your familys.
        Be Free My Friends. ;-)

      • Karolyn

        Ditto for many on your “side”, Jay/. Get real.

      • DaveH

        How the Rothschilds and others prosper with Unfree Markets:
        http://mises.org/econsense/ch91.asp

    • Karolyn

      As I said, there are many more skeptics out there should you wish to do some work. Sorry I don’t have the link to the guy in Belgium.

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jay

        Funny Karolyn, when it comes to man-made-global-warming, i’ve yet to see you, or any of your socialist comrades post links to the contrary. Why is that?

        • Jeff

          Komrade:

          To the contrary of what?

      • Michael J.

        Karolyn,
        So you are saying that The Obama Regime can afford to field an army of schills to post disinformation, but The Rothschild Dynasty can not?

    • Vicki

      The dynasty is quite real and there are thousands of links to stories about them.

      The “conspiracy theory” is what are they doing with their money.
      Here is one thing they are doing with it.
      http://money.cnn.com/2012/05/30/news/companies/rockefeller-rothschild/

  • Tom Cook

    Paul, all I can say is that you are completely unhinged. Think the landing on the moon was staged in Hollywood? I thought so. Think that the attack on the Pentagon on 9/11 was staged by the Military-Industrial Complex? I thought so. Your column is kinda funny–sort of like and Al Franken comedy routine or something John Stewart thinks is funny.

    • Vigilant

      “Think that the attack on the Pentagon on 9/11 was staged by the Military-Industrial Complex?”

      As a matter of fact, Tom, “Roberts comments on the “scientific impossibility” of the official explanation for the events on 9/11 and says those engineers and physicists who accept this theory are wrong.” (Wikipedia)

      I guess he’s an accomplished engineer and physicist, as well as being a 9/11 conspiracy theorist.

      • http://boblivingstonpl.wordpress.com Bob Livingston

        Dear Vigilant,

        You write: “I guess he’s an accomplished engineer and physicist…” I don’t know about PCR, but these folks are: http://www.ae911truth.org/

        Best wishes,
        Bob

      • Vigilant

        Roberts is as well a hater of Israel. He’s on record as saying, ” Gaza is “the world largest concentration camp” populated by people who were “driven out of Palestine so that Israel could steal their land.” He called the U.S. State Department a “puppet” of the Israelis and the U.S. itself a “puppet state” of the Israelis. He concludes the article by claiming that “there’s no money for California, or for Americans’ health care, or for the several million Americans who have lost their homes and are homeless, because Israel needs it.” (Wikipedia)

        Not only is he rabid in his blind condemnation, he can’t add two and two as I mentioned later on in this thread. (1) The nations surrounding Israel receive more combined aid than does Israel, and (2) he’s apparently an advocate of the welfare state (socialist), since he thinks the government should be bailing out those who lost their homes and the state of California. Guess he supports Obamacare as well. .

      • boyscout

        For years I worked selective demolition. I an not unaware of project screw ups or hap hazard accidents or natural phenomena. No, I am not a trained and accredited physicist. I will never but the publicized line on the twin towers. However, I do clearly see how such a rendition co relates to the Patriot Act and the great Near East oil grabs that followed.

      • boyscout

        typo: never buy

      • Michael J.

        Vigilant,
        As a former Dubya supporter who voted for him twice, no one was more reluctant to believe the inside job theory, re; 9/11.

        It is my belief that Bush may have had prior knowledge, but was not privy to the details of where or when as was evidenced by the thousand yard stare he assumed upon being informed that “America is under attack” and while on camera. No one is that good an actor. I can also state that there are many levels of top secret security clearance above the POTUS that relegates the job to mere mid-level management that sometimes requires patsyism.

    • Jeff

      Can you imagine W coordinating the attack? The planes would have run out of gas and crashed into the ocean. Bill Maher said he could prove Bush had nothing to do with 911 in two words: “It worked.”

      • boyscout

        Mahr is a funny guy who avoids the obvious by assuming that GW was in charge.

        • Jeff

          So, Cheney did it or was it the Secret Cabal that controls all?

      • Michael J.

        Jeff,
        Bill Maher is blinded by that huge beak that Mother Nature saw fit to appoint him with. Talk about Karma!

      • http://www.facebook.com/christopher.coolidge1 Christopher Coolidge

        If enough people vote for ANYBODY but Romney or Obama it sends a much more powerful message than if most of us hold our noses and vote for the slightly lesser of two evils. Imagine if 80% of the American electorate vote for None Of The Above, the remaining 20% are free to vote for either candidate with eyes wide open on the assumption that either Romney or Obama are what they truly want for the next four years. If you think Romney or Obama is the greatest thing since sliced bread, vote for them by all means. Keep in mind you’re choosing between (expletive deleted) on a stick and a (expletive deleted) sandwich. One may give you some bread and they’ll try to tell you that’s a good thing, but (expletive deleted) is still (expletive deleted). If somebody put a gun to my back and told me I had to vote for either Romney or Obama I’d probably say shoot me, please. If I got to thinking about my kids growing up without a daddy, I’d probably just pick one randomly.

    • DaveH

      You don’t think Politicians are capable of killing a few thousand people to achieve their desired goals, Tom?
      How about 2400 of their own military personnel?
      This may change your mind (but only if you aren’t afraid to read it):
      http://library.mises.org/books/Percy%20L%20Greaves,%20Jr/Pearl%20Harbor%20The%20Seeds%20and%20Fruits%20of%20Infamy.pdf

  • Karolyn

    Love this line: “All it took to convince Red Staters to go along with the military/security complex squandering $6 trillion on the Iraq and Afghanistan wars were yellow ribbon decals and a slogan, “Support the troops.” That’s all it takes for the over-emotional “average” middle class American.

    One of the most interesting articles I’ve read here ever!

    • eddie47d

      Back in the Nixon days they were called the Silent Majority and supported anything by all politicians who pushed a patriotic flavor. Even if the decisions were historically wrong they labeled anyone who didn’t support those wars as enemies of the state. Today we have a few in both camps who fall all over the Patriot Act and going to war with Iran without question.

    • Flashy

      Karolyn…I had the same thoughts. I had to go back and verify that this was an article on the PL forum. Much of what the article states has been stated by the Moderates and Progressives on this site and who were slammed and denigrated for daring to say it.

      It will prove the author’s point (and the points made in the past by the Moderate posters here), m if he is not slammed and denigrated to the same extent had you or I written it as a comment.

      • Karolyn

        Well, Flashy, looking at the posts, I see a lot of people who are po’d; but, oddly, many are not regular posters. I’d love to hear from some of the regulars.

      • DaveH

        Who do you think you’re kidding, Flashman? Certainly not the regular readers who know you have no credibility.
        In fact, I don’t recall you saying anything that hasn’t been in support of Big Government. You are a loyal shill.

    • Jeff

      I’m sure there is some truth in the article, but I don’t buy that it doesn’t matter who gets elected. Can you really say it didn’t matter if W or Gore won? Would we have gone to Iraq under Gore? Afghanistan, maybe, assuming three had been a 911 attack, but the Afghanistan adventure would have been short and decisive.

      Obama v. McCain? No difference? McCain would have NEVER pulled the troops out of Iraq. Plus, one of the most important things a President does is picking Justices to the Supreme Court. We’re still being ruled by appointees from Reagan-Bush 1. I didn’t harbor too many hatreds for Bush 1, particularly compared to W, but his picking Clarence Thomas to replace Thurgood Marshall may have been the most cynical thing any politician has ever done.

      • Polski

        After Eisenhower’s 2 terms were over, the “expert historians” said he was the worst president ever because he never did anything while he was in office. Ten years later, these same “expert historians” said he was the best president ever because he never did anything while he was in office…….hahahahaha…….

    • Polski

      I agree. It’s the first article I’ve read here that is what is happening. But I like this forum. It’s the only one that has fanatics on BOTH sides making ridiculous statements over and over. The other forums are strictly one sided.

      • SJJolly

        Some of us try at making the forums less one-sided. (Sweeping against the tide).

      • Nadzieja Batki

        By whose authority?

      • Nadzieja Batki

        My comment was to SJJolly.

      • Chester

        Nadzieja Batki, who needs any additional authority to comment on here, other than the fact they feel they might have something to contribute to the conversation? As long as you have a computer and an internet connection, plus a link to this site, you need no other authority. I have found that to be true for most of the blogs online, regardless of how much some of the posters cry and gripe and scream about someone disagreeing with them. I don’t always agree with Mr. Livingston, or some (usually most) of the posters on here, but I am free to say so, by my authority, and the fact that there is no moderator to say “You can’t talk about that in this forum.”

    • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jay

      Karolyn says: Love this line: “All it took to convince Red Staters to go along with the military/security complex squandering $6 trillion on the Iraq and Afghanistan wars were yellow ribbon decals and a slogan, “Support the troops.” That’s all it takes for the over-emotional “average” middle class American.

      I’m not sure if i love that line, Karolyn, but i do agree with the statement. But let me ask you; why aren’t you progs not protesting the war in Iraq and Afghanistan, now, during the Obama administration, as in the days of Bush; is it because you wear the decals with the slogan, “Hope and Change”?

      Why aren’t you socialist-hypocrites out there, protesting in the streets, as you did during the Bush administration? I know i know, because we have a socialist-progressive-democrat in the white-house, so therefore, all the wars are legitimate. Ha, you socialist-democrats are no better then the fascist-republicans. In fact, i would say that, in many ways, you people are worse!

      • Karolyn

        My protesting days ended a long time ago. All my protesst these days is done by raising my vibration to a higher level to join with the others of like mind to precipitate change. If more people joined together in harmony, change would come more easily. However, with all the hate and anger, all that negative energy, it is much harder to create positive change. Love has power; hate has force. (Power vs. Force, Dr. David Hawkins)

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jay

        What a load of horse-hockey! You left-wing wackos are bunch of hypocrites!

      • Karolyn

        Jay – All thought has energy.

      • DaveH

        You can call what comes from you “vibration”, Karolyn. But I call it useless chatter.

      • SJJolly

        300,000 people marched against going to war with Iraq. Their protest got far less media attention than the 30 people that counter-protested their protest. IOW, “liberal” or “conservative”, the media does what their corporate owners tell them to do.

        • Jeff

          And don’t forget all the attention the 3 morons playing dress-up received as “The New Black Panthers.”

    • Kate8

      Karolyn – Yes, but we’ve at least wised up on our side. We know now that we were being manipulated.

      What’s your side’s excuse for attacking good Americans? Because Odumbo is setting up Tea Partyers as enemies of the state, and training our military to take them out.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=osIRQ_HDb7s&feature=player_embedded#!

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jay

        Kate8, when it comes to war, obama the-war-mounger makes bush look like sissy-boy. In fact, bush should have a seat and take notes from obama. This administration is by far the worse when it comes to appeasing the military-industrial-complex. Good vibrations my azz!

      • Average Joe

        Jay,

        “when it comes to war, obama the-war-mounger makes bush look like sissy-boy.”

        Hmmmm…I see another Nobel Peace prize in the making…lol (Sarcasm)

        I’m guessing that for the soclibs..war mongering is OK …as long as it thier guy doing the mongering.

        For the rest of us…it isn’t Ok for either side…dang, I haven’t even finished typing and I hear a drone hovering overhead…..

        Best Wishes,
        AJ

      • DaveH

        That’s just Karolyn’s Good Vibrations, Joe.

    • Bonnie Wheeler

      Would you like me to give you a list of the Democrats who urged Clinton and Bush to go to war with Iraq? Bill Clinton made the first strike on Iraq and then Bush and Obama finished what Clinton started – I

      • David E

        Bonnie, You’re wasting your time arguing with these people. They are paid Obama propaganda agents who are trained to do what they do. God Bless, Dave. * * *

        • Jeff

          Dave:

          Are you holding all these checks? For a moron you seem to know a lot.

          Clinton did not start the Iraq war. Bush wanted to go to war in Iraq because he was convinced to do so by the Neocons and to “rehabilitate” Poppy with the far right. No other president, including Reagan, would have been so reckless. We had inspectors on the ground in Iraq who said there were no weapons of mass destruction. They were not just ignored; they were villified by you right-wing lunatics. Remember Hans Blix? You leader Fatbaugh called him Hans Blitzed because he dared to disagree with Cheney. And his young aide was practically labelled a traitor for challenging the Cheney-Rumsfeld Axis of Evil.

          We weren’t all born yesterday.

          • Bonnie Wheeler

            Jeff, Clinton made the first air strike granted it was most likely to divert attention from the hearing that was about to take place in connection with his affair with Lewinsky, nevertheless, He made it and I have the speech he made to the American people in December of that year explaining his decision.

          • Jeff

            You can certainly question the wisdom of Clinton’s air strikes in Iraq, but you simply cannot claim they were the beginning of the Iraq War 41/2 years later. There is a huge difference between air strikes and committing troops to an open-ended occupation of another country, particularly one not already beaten down by years of war (like Germany or Japan after WWII). No, I’m afraid W gets all the credit for the Iraq adventure.

  • Vigilant

    In one of his more disingenuous statements, Roberts says, “The non-affluent who rage about welfare, Medicaid, Obamacare and public schools can’t seem to put two and two together. The $750 billion TARP bankster bailout, a small part of the total and ongoing bailout, would have sufficed to cover any holes in these budgets for a long time. Instead, the money went to reward those who caused the financial crisis and threw millions of Americans out of their homes.”

    I’m surprised that a man who was once Assistant Sec. of Treasury can’t put two and two together himself.

    “Altogether, accounting for both bailouts [TARP and Fannie/Freddie], $602 billion has gone out the door—invested, loaned, or paid out—while $309 billion has been returned…In July 2010, the financial regulation overhaul reduced TARP’s spending cap to $475 billion from the original $700 billion.

    “The Treasury has been earning a return on most of the money invested or loaned. So far, it has earned $82 billion. When those revenues are taken into account, $211 billion is the net still outstanding as of Aug. 1, 2012.”

    Above from http://projects.propublica.org/bailout/main/summary

    So your claim that “The $750 billion TARP bankster bailout… would have sufficed to cover any holes in these budgets for a long time” is entirely misleading. $211 billion is considerably LESS than $750 billion, and the balance continues to be paid back.

    Moreover, since the TARP was DEFICIT spending, we can logically infer that you believe that “welfare, Medicaid, Obamacare and public schools” should be funded via DEFICIT spending, if TARP would have been better used to patch up budget holes in those programs.

    For one of the co-authors of supply side economics, you have a strange perspective on things.

  • eddy114

    This guy sounds a little anti-semitic to me. And full of it too!

    • Karolyn

      Can you define “anti-semitic?” Because people do not agree with being Israel’s lapdog, thy are anti-semitic?

    • Dick

      Anti-semitic? I’m pro Jewish (I like them, they’re great people, damned funny, and such triers – they have reacted to an intense 1900+ years of anti-jewish discrimination and murder with humor and an attitude that somehow encourages them never to give up in spite of the terrible time that almost everyone else has visited on them), but I’m anti-Israeli-state. Israel-in-Palestine is and was a (big) mistake. Does that make me pro- or anti- semitic? And a side note – arabs (the real ones from Arabia), lebanese, Iraqis, Jordanians, Yemenis, and half or more of the Syrians are ‘semitic’ too. Before the rise of Islam, they all, including the Jews, spoke semitic languages, mostly Aramaic, the language of Jesus. And (in case you’re wondering) the exceptions are the Egyptians, who are Copts, and the Iranians, who are and always have been, the Persians (who speak Farsi)..

      • boyscout

        Thanks for the easy to understand clarification. Hope it sinks in. Now to question Anti-Zionism .

  • Dave

    Paul Craig Roberts Hits the nail on the head with this one. He really tells it like it is! We need another political party that represents “We The People”, not the Oligarchy or Corporatocracy.

    • Debbie

      I totally agree. The problem is, how can we get sufficient funding and media coverage for a third party candidate so that (s)he will have a fair chance of winning an election? Both the Democrats and Republicans are funded by the powers that be who want to maintain the status quo. Anyone who would actually represent ordinary working American citizens doesn’t have a chance.

    • boyscout

      A vote for an unsuccessful candidate does, at least, express opinion, and, hopefully influence the successful office seeker. Let us who are to vote a third party line are not instigating repression from the elected.

  • Steve

    What a bunch of crap. You are more than unhinged, you are crazy and misinformed.

  • OOOOPPert EEEEpert

    There is some truth in what he says, but Obama also wants to be portrayed as such, (Marxist, Muslim, etc..)because it energizes his base

    • Shelia

      really ooooppert you realy sound stupid

    • Karolyn

      Ridiculous!

  • Dave

    It is obvious that the Brainwashed Fox News Junkies can’t handle the truth of this article.

    • Vigilant

      Always nice to see a leftist agree with Roberts. It confirms my points posted earlier.

      • Dave

        So being a Libertarian is the same as being a leftest?

      • Vigilant

        Doesn’t matter what you label yourself. If you agree with Roberts on bailing out California, foreclosed morgagees and welfare recipients, Medicaid, Obamacare and public schools with deficit spending and taxpayers’ money, you are no Libertarian.

        If you call it an honest article when he has deceptively played with the TARP numbers, then you don’t recognize propaganda when you see it.

        If you believe that “there’s no money for California, or for Americans’ health care, or for the several million Americans who have lost their homes and are homeless, because Israel needs it,” then you can’t add two and two either. Israel’s “take” is so small compared to the monsters he references as to be a fart in the wind.

        If you don’t perceive his hatred for Israel deceptively wrapped in the nobility of Libertarianism, then you have swallowed his diatribe hook, line and sinker.

      • DaveH

        Paul Craig Roberts is no Libertarian. Please don’t spread rumors.
        If you know anything at all about Libertarianism, you can read just this one article and see that:
        http://www.counterpunch.org/2012/01/23/how-libertarian-dogmatists-are-sabotaging-ron-pauls-campaign/

    • huntman

      There is NO truth in this article, starting with the statement that Al Franken is funny. The author is clearly confused as to why “down-and-out pickup truck driver” (whatever that means) does not want Obama to make the rest of America to be “down and out” like him. It did not even occur to him that maybe this driver wants to stop being “down and out” and wants to count his own money instead of Romney’s. Guy is either a raving moron (if he actually believes this crap) or a sock puppet for the current Politburo at 1600 Pennsylvania Ave.

    • Fred17

      I guess you can’t stand Fox News because it dares to present BOTH sides of issues. Unlike the one-sided networks.

      • Truth2Power

        When has Faux “News” ever presented both sides of any issue?

      • Chester

        I treat FAUX news the same way I treat “HONEST JOHN’S USED CARS,” like the known liars they are. Anyone who has to scream to the world about how honest they are or how “fair and and balanced” their reporting is, I tend to run fast as possible in the other direction, or else accept the fact that ninety percent of what is said is slanted to make the sale, regardless of the truth of the matter.

        • bonniewheeler

          I have requested every one who criticizes Fox News to offer us some false statement from even one of the many Democrats, Independents and Republicans that make up the Fox network – not one has ever been able to do that, therefore, their statement against Fox News is null and void. In addition, Fox has been voted ‘most trusted’ by many pollls

          • http://www.facebook.com/robert77581 Robert Allen

            Bonnie: You are so right!!! Isn’t it amazing that those who criticize FNC the most don’t bother to watch it. I have watched MSNBC and the others but the closest to even balanced is when they have psuedo-conservatives and then only the ones who have no standing in the world of conservatism..Liberals live in an unrealistic world of fantasy and libertarians are also unrealistic and illogical if they actually believe there is no differences between the Democratic and Republican views and party platforms. Granting, I would love to see the Republicans be more realistic when it comes to military expansionism, but I’ve learned that many things which we desire as those who support very limited government must take baby steps many times to accomplish real change.

  • Ted Crawford

    It seems that Politicians and Pundits have the same mindset, to overwhelm us with long winded rhetoric, loaded with ” Facts and Figures” , twists and turns, nuance after nuance, attempting to convince us that without their wisdom, we stand no chance of making wise choices ! HORSE PUCKY !
    There are two primary ideologies, Conservative, anchored by Anarchy, and Progressive, anchored by Marxism!
    The conservatives expand the base, and economy. Do they do this for me? NO! ! And I’m very glad they don’t ! If they were doing it for me, they might easily become discouraged and decide it wasn’t worth the effort. By the very act of expansion they create an opportunity for any willing to do what it takes to also expand their income and security!
    The Progressive also dosn’t labor for my benefit nor, saddly do they do it for the disadvantaged, they, like the Conservatives, do it for their own benefit! However what they do contracts and restricts the base and the economy. This provides NO opportunity for personal income expansion, rather it confiscates income from the productive to enslave the disadvantaged! When a man can make a higher income and access better benefits by not working than by working, he might easily be seduced to take the handout, for the good of his family, rather than take the job!
    The choice is this; Are we to return to a Nation of personnelly responsible citizens or are we better served to accept the Government subsidies and benefits!

    • Vigilant

      Excellent analysis Ted!

  • David

    I’m an advocate of Ron Paul’s philosophy. I will vote for neither Republican or Democrate but what I believe is the most constitutional choice. My fantasy is that the Ron Paul delegates at Tampa will overwhelmingly vote Ron Paul as their candidate and stand up for America and not the GOP leaving Mit Romney and the rest of the establishment standing with their mouth’s open, speachless. If that doesn’t happen I will submit a write in vote for Ron Paul. I cannot conscientiously do otherwise nor will principle allow me to do different.

    • ItCanHappenToYou

      I too will write in for Ron Paul.

    • David

      So you would rather throw your vote away and let obama win and destroy this country? Have we ever been more divided? Then what are you going to do? This may well be your last vote-so figure it out.

      • Nadzieja Batki

        But the voter has a choice. So why would you take the making of that choice away from someone?

      • Average Joe

        David,
        Have you ever considered that your vote for Robamney is throwing your vote away? You do know of course that Obama and Romney agree on policy right? A quick refresher course for you:
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lUs17azUFs

        Just to get under your skin a bit more, I too will be voting for Ron Paul in November.
        If you like “business as usual” candidates, by all means…vote for Robamney (you’ll get the government you deserve)
        If on the other hand, you wish to leave a better America for your children and grand children than you have been left with, you may want to consider “not” wasting your vote…by voting for Ron Paul.

        Best Wishes,
        AJ

      • DaveH

        If Ron Paul gets the nomination or runs as third party, I will also vote for him. But if he doesn’t run, writing in his name will be a waste of momentum. It would be much more productive to throw your weight behind the Libertarian Party candidate — Gary Johnson, who may not have a chance, but the more exposure the Libertarians get, the more people will come to see that their Philosophy is the only Principled political philosophy out there.
        Ron Paul will be gone soon, but the push for Freedom will only be gone if we let it die. Then the elitists win. Let’s not let them.
        If you believe, as I do, that no human, other than yourself, has the right to control your own body and property then only the Libertarian Party can represent you.

        • Jeff

          Here’s some free unsolicited advice I hope the Libertarians don’t take. I thought the Green Party made a huge mistake relying on celebrity Presidential candidates like Ralph Nader for publicity. To build a party, you have to start at the bottom – state legislatures, maybe get someone elected to Congress. Putting up a symbolic figure every 4 years will do nothing to build a party. The Greens and the Libertarians will remain equally hopeless until they recognize that fact and change their approach.

          BTW: The Libertarians want your MONEY, too, Dave!

      • DaveH

        Keep hoping and dreaming, Jeff. The young people are increasingly gravitating to Libertarianism. It’s just a matter of time until people wake up. It might be too late, though, as the PTBs are trying their best to keep the citizens ignorant.
        But keep on spreading your propaganda, Jeff. Maybe people won’t wake up, and you’ll be able to keep your place at the trough.

    • Steve E

      I voted for Paul during the primaries, and I would love to see the Paul Delegates leave the GOP mouths wide open at the convention also. However I will vote for Romney in the elections, if just to do anything, I can cancel out an Obama vote.

      • Average Joe

        Steve E ,

        I am hoping that if the GOP and RNC try to exclude Dr. Paul from the convention, that his delegates have the testicular fortitude to turn thier backs on the RNC and GOP (literally) while the whole world is watching televised… and refuse to vote for Mittens…thereby denying him 1144 votes and the nomination. They can’t nominate Willard with less than that amount…and they certainly can’t take the White House without our support in the general election. The GOP can either get on board with us..or they can lose the battle…we aren’t budging from our convictions. NO WILLARD!

        Ron Paul / Andrew Napolitano 2012! In it to win it!

        Best Wishes,
        AJ

      • Truth2Power

        AJ: As a Jerry Brown delegate to the 1992 Democratic Convention, I can advise you as to what will happen to the Paul delegates at this years Republican Immaculation. If you threaten to or actually carry out any “civil disobedience acts” during prime time at the convention, the powers-that-be will begrudgingly accommodate you – to a certain extent. They’ll throw you a few crumbs like letting Dr. Paul address the convention during non-prime time hours, allow you to place his name in nomination (but without too much fanfare), then step all over you and forget you on the way out the door. Ron Paul no longer has the support or the personal intestinal fortitude to truly turn his back on the Republican Party (which regards him as a joke and a pariah) and launch another independent effort. He only ran this year to keep the Paul name in the headlines and pave the way for his son Rand to run in 2016. The Republicans know you have no alternative now that Willard has the nomination tied up, so expect to be treated as the red-headed step-children at the convention and assumed to be Romney/Ryan voters come November.

      • http://None Paul Morrison

        Steve E- I have been reading this thread with my mouth wide open until I saw your contribution. This election cycle is pivotal. If president obama wins reelection the USA becomes, at best, a third world country with no future. If Romney wins we live to fight another day. The decision is simple. he the american voter makes the right call!

        • Farleyagain

          Paul – Exactly right. We live to fight another day or not. That is the choice.

          • Jeff

            I would say having the Party of Ryan, Akin, Bachmann, Gohmert, Fox, King, and McConnell in power would be the definition of a third world, yahoo nation. They are, as recognized by even John Boehner, “knuckle draggers.”

          • Jeff

            Where do you loons come up with this stuff? Third world? Is that supposed to be a dog whistle reference to Kenya or Indonesia? You guys usually like to compare Obama to Stalin or Lenin. The Soviet Union was the 2nd world, remember?

            No, lets have W Redux on steroids only this time with Ayn Rand as VP. Unbelievable stupidity. Just let Romney pass tax laws that explicitly say no one named Romney ever has to pay taxes again. It would eliminate the need for his elaborate tax shelter schemes.

    • Florence

      David: I am Writing in Ron Paul. There is no one better for the presidency.

      • Florence

        It is incredulous that BO would give amnesty to 2 million illegals and educate them as well as give them job permits. It is not enough that we have given them food stamps and rent stipends and classroom education, and let’s not forget free health care. I am so sure that he is going to grant amnesty across the board if he is re-elected. I don’t want to think about the negative impact on this country. He obviously has a machine behind him. I find it so hard to believe that Americans are not rallying against this blatant disregard for our sovereignty. This is a slap in the face to all Americans and in particular to generations of poor American families whose children would have benefited from college or other higher education. I do not like this president, he is evil to the core!

      • Karolyn

        Just keep believing evrything you hear.( as long as it suits your agenda, that is)

      • Average Joe

        Karolyn,
        OK, you can stop repeating that ..you’ve finally convinced…. yourself.

        Best Wishes,
        AJ

      • DaveH

        Where’s the love, Karolyn?
        Trash that magic mirror. It’s lying to you.

    • Commenttime

      Romeny Or Obama = status qoe. With Romney we will just die a little slower but in the end they both work for the same people and nothing will change. Their speaches even sound the same. Maybe same writer. Voting for Ron Paul and no other.

  • ItCanHappenToYou

    I think that in the future you will see middle classs America come together and elect a representive for themselves, I just hope that will happen before too much damadge is done. Besides it shouldn’t be too hard to find someone better than the choices that we have this election.

    • Florence

      I think this is a great and powerful idea you have. Does anyone know how to go about it?

  • Chad A. Johnson

    Mr. Roberts has overlooked the fact that some citizens remain self-reliant and take pride in providing for their family, a trait our society took for granted 60 years ago. It is not a coincidence that these same citizens have maintained their integrity and love of country despite an environment of greed, corruption and self-serving attitudes.

    Nietzsche’s observation that most men are sheep has proven to be all too accurate. Too bad the sheep wish to follow society’s worst examples in their quest for a “free lunch”. I liked it better when we got our money the old-fashioned way……….we earned it.

    • eddie47d

      Many of those politicians who say they stand up for self reliance and hard work (correctly so) are also the same ones who push for wars of aggressions and insist it is America’s duty to be militarily everywhere in the world. They keep the citizenry in a constant state of fear and panic that someone is out to get them. That always assures that the masses are doomed without them.

    • Fred17

      It’s a shame there are so few of us left. What happens when they run out of other people’s money?

      • http://speedle speedle

        For your answer check out what is going on in the streets of Athens, and soon other European countries. It will be worse here because instead of begging Germany for money we will be begging the Chicoms. There will be civil war.

  • Linda

    As a product of a working poor family – I can see that Mr Roberts doesn’t think much of the working poor. We’re not stupid, blinded or easily led. What we are is loyal to the constitution and republicanism (not to be confused with the GOP). We understand that govt welfare to anyone or anything is a travisty and draining what little wealth we had, we understand that the Democrat party is so leftist to be communistic and that is a very dangerous thing to a society AND it’s people> Most of us (including me) are enlisted veterans or have family who were enlisted (not officers), we work very hard, we scrape and save and borrow as smartly as we can to give our children a better life only to have it stolen by the govt. The best we can do now IS vote republican, get control of the Congress at least and then look for candidates outside of the IVY league good ol guys/gals club. 1st things first -

    • conserve

      Excellent post, hits the nail right on the head.Those of us that are veterans and workig poor also believe that having forward bases across the world is a very good stratigic thing also. We have seen the result of letting the world police itself in the making of WWII as we set back pulled our troops home. I know that if we had forward ases at that time the war would have been shorter with fewer lifes lost.

  • David

    This is another David. I am sorry but to not vote means one should shut his or her mouth for the next four years. At least our sad congress has held up obummer-until he figured out what executive order was…..Not voting could get Pelosi back in the lime light! Do you really want to see that nappy headed B in front of the camera for the next 4 years??!!

    Again Romney isn’t the best but I would vote for a can of bakes beans over what we have now. I hope his veep is better than Biden :0)

    • http://realsustainability.wordpress.com realsustainability

      Oh, no ‘nother Dave! Why would one want to participate in a system that represents the ultra elite while the rest of us are paying for & then scrambling for some of the scraps from the multitrillion dollar bailouts? I’ll not vote for someone I do not beleive in, end of story. Obama is one of those and Romney is one of those. Will probably write in Ron Paul but the rest of the field I’ll take on a one-by-one basis. And yes, it IS possible to feel so disenfranchised by the whole political system that one feels like his vote is useless so why bother…….it hapens all the time.

      • David

        If he wins a second term there won’t be any tax payers left when he is done. I would rather be a tax payer and be pissed off than a sheep working on the plantation with no rights. Stand up now or sit down for good…….

  • Paul Wells

    I’ll gather from Mr. Roberts tome here that he is not a fan of Israel. I’m not sure what is considered “fair” where you are from Mr. Roberts, but to the best of my knowledge, Israel and it’s people have not had an easy go of it throughout history. Also, if you believe in the Bible at all, you’d know that those are God’s chosen people. Why is it so much to ask for the Arab countries to just leave Israel alone, let them have their lands, which God promised to them. I think you’d find they’ll back off and leave the Palestinians alone, if the Palestinians will quit lobbing bombs over their borders towards Israel.

    However, as far as conspiracy theories go, about the dirty Republican’s who are never above the fray, your opinions are interesting. If people would just act honestly, ethically, and remember the Golden Rule, life on this planet would be a lot easier. But, alas, it shall never be.

    • Karolyn

      EVERYBODY is God’s chosen people!

      • Corkey

        The New Covenant established upon Christs death, says otherwise. The followers of the teachings of Jesus are now the chosen ones, which includes people of all races. The Old Covenant is dead and we have absolutely no responsibility towards physical Israel. This heresy was only established in the early 1900s by Nelson Darby and his strange teachings which infiltrated the Christian Churches.

      • Karolyn

        Thank you Corkey. Although I am not a Christian, I am glad that you have brought light on this subject for those Christians who believe that we need to support Israel in absolutely every way because of what the Bible says.

      • Paul Wells

        To Corkey:

        Try reading Matthew 5:17-20. There, you will learn that you are mistaken, that Jesus (and the New Testament in general) did not obliterate the Old Covenant as you have stated, but rather to fulfill it.

    • http://boblivingstonpl.wordpress.com Bob Livingston

      Dear Paul Wells,

      You write: “Also, if you believe in the Bible at all, you’d know that those are God’s chosen people.” Please cite for me book, chapter and verse.

      Best wishes,
      Bob

      • MAP

        That was by the old convenant, not the new. By the new, christians are the chosen.

      • Paul Wells

        Dear Bob,

        Glad to:
        1. Genesis 15:18-21 is the first mention of God giving to Abraham’s descendents the lands of Egypt to the Euphrates River.
        2. Exodus 23:31 is a more detailed granting of lands from the Red Sea to the Mediterranean.Sea.
        3. Numbers 34
        4. Ezekiel 47

        Granted, there is much dispute about the borders and current locations of the described lands, but there is no dispute that the lands described in the Good Book are much more than what Israel currently occupies.

        I’d further note that the New Testament does not disqualify any of the boundaries from the Old Testament, so I’d conclude from that, there hasn’t been any modification of the arrangement that God set down in the OT.

        But really…it comes down to faith, I suppose…either you believe that the Holy Bible is the inspired word of God, or you don’t, or..as some “legalists” do, quibble with minutia of what the Bible has stated, trying to rearrange the meaning, to imply that we just don’t understand what God or Jesus meant. Jesus deals with this subject at length in Luke 11:37-54, where he comes down pretty hard on lawyers and others for attending to the letter of God’s Law, but not the intent.

        Thanks for the opportunity to air my opinion!

        • http://boblivingstonpl.wordpress.com Bob Livingston

          Dear Paul Wells,

          Thanks for responding. You cited exactly what I anticipated. The promise was to Abraham and his seed. His seed broke the covenant. This was confirmed when the nations of Israel and Judah were scattered, and finally upon the destruction of the temple in 70 AD. Now Abraham’s seed is the Spiritual nation of Israel; that is the Church. Jews rejected Christ and have no part in the Church.

          Nehemiah 1: 7-8 (NASB)
          7 We have acted very corruptly against You and have not kept the commandments, nor the statutes, nor the ordinances which You commanded Your servant Moses. 8 Remember the word which You commanded Your servant Moses, saying, ‘If you are unfaithful I will scatter you among the peoples;

          Hosea 8 (NASB)
          8 Israel is swallowed up;
          They are now among the nations
          Like a vessel in which no one delights.
          9 For they have gone up to Assyria,
          Like a wild donkey all alone;
          Ephraim has hired lovers.
          10 Even though they hire allies among the nations,
          Now I will gather them up;
          And they will begin to diminish
          Because of the burden of the king of princes.
          11 Since Ephraim has multiplied altars for sin,
          They have become altars of sinning for him.
          12 Though I wrote for him ten thousand precepts of My law,
          They are regarded as a strange thing.
          13 As for My sacrificial gifts,
          They sacrifice the flesh and eat it,
          But the LORD has taken no delight in them.
          Now He will remember their iniquity,
          And punish them for their sins;
          They will return to Egypt.
          14 For Israel has forgotten his Maker and built palaces;
          And Judah has multiplied fortified cities,
          But I will send a fire on its cities that it may consume its palatial dwellings.

          Because Israel played the harlot God scattered them. Because the Jews rejected Jesus, God rejected them.

          Now the promise in Gen. 12:3 is fulfilled through the spiritual children of Abraham. The Law was nailed to the cross, and with it the promise to the physical children of Abraham was granted to the spiritual children of Abraham.

          Read Galatians 3 for better understanding of this. As verse 29 says, “And if you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s descendants, heirs according to promise.” (NASB)

          Read also Colossians 2
          13 When you were dead [k]in your transgressions and the uncircumcision of your flesh, He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven us all our transgressions, 14 having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of decrees against us, which was hostile to us; and He has taken it out of the way, having nailed it to the cross. (NASB)

          Romans 4
          16 For this reason it is by faith, in order that it may be in accordance with grace, so that the promise will be guaranteed to all the descendants, not only to those who are of the Law, but also to those who are of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all, 17 (as it is written, “A FATHER OF MANY NATIONS HAVE I MADE YOU”) in the presence of Him whom he believed, even God, who gives life to the dead and calls into being that which does not exist. 18 In hope against hope he believed, so that he might become a father of many nations according to that which had been spoken, “SO SHALL YOUR DESCENDANTS BE.” 19 Without becoming weak in faith he contemplated his own body, now as good as dead since he was about a hundred years old, and the deadness of Sarah’s womb; 20 yet, with respect to the promise of God, he did not waver in unbelief but grew strong in faith, giving glory to God, 21 and being fully assured that what God had promised, He was able also to perform. 22 Therefore IT WAS ALSO CREDITED TO HIM AS RIGHTEOUSNESS. 23 Now not for his sake only was it written that it was credited to him, 24 but for our sake also, to whom it will be credited, as those who believe in Him who raised Jesus our Lord from the dead, 25 He who was delivered over because of our transgressions, and was raised because of our justification. (NASB)

          Read also Romans 10

          From Matthew 23:29ff “Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you build the tombs of the prophets and adorn the monuments of the righteous, 30 and say, ‘If we had been living in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partners with them in shedding the blood of the prophets.’ 31 So you testify against yourselves, that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets. 32 Fill up, then, the measure of the guilt of your fathers. 33 You serpents, you brood of vipers, how will you escape the sentence of hell?
          34 “Therefore, behold, I am sending you prophets and wise men and scribes; some of them you will kill and crucify, and some of them you will scourge in your synagogues, and persecute from city to city, 35 so that upon you may fall the guilt of all the righteous blood shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah, the son of Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. 36 Truly I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation. 37 “Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were unwilling. 38 Behold, your house is being left to you desolate! 39 For I say to you, from now on you will not see Me until you say, ‘BLESSED IS HE WHO COMES IN THE NAME OF THE LORD!’” (NASB)

          Best wishes,
          Bob

      • MAP

        Paul, one of questions, for me at least, is: are the present occupants of the state of Isreal the biological descendants of the ancient people of the Old Testament? This is an important question, but the answer varies depending upon the source. Certain people would be compelled to obscure these facts for obvious reasons. I don’t have an opinon, becuse I don’t have the facts, though I, and probably many others would like to. Our entire foreign policy in regards to Isreal are based on only one side of this enigma and appears rather suspicious to say the least.

      • Paul Wells

        Map,
        Having read Bob’s well researched ideas that Israel invalidated the Old Covenant themselves and by their actions, it may be a moot point whether the current inhabitants of Israel are in fact Abraham’s descendents. I’ll do more research on this myself, I’m humble enough to admit that I may not know enough, Bob certainly makes some compelling arguments through scripture.

        But I think it’s a given that until Jews do acknowledge (even if it’s as Jesus returns for his Church) that he is the Son of God, they probably won’t “make the cut” for the next life. Jews for Jesus aside, I think that one transgression does anger God mightily. The Jews were expecting the Son of God to be like a King, and Jesus was…well…more like a carpenter.

        Thanks Bob, for your well reasoned response. Have a good day!

    • Polski

      Well, Israel is the one that told everyone that they are God’s chosen people. But God hasn’t said anything.

      • Nadzieja Batki

        Why don’t you read His Book and find out what God has to say about Israel. You may find out the mind of God.

    • http://none Charlie

      Paul Wells,,, you have a point ,,,but,,,you missed a split in the family tree,,,remember Abraham , Isaac and Jacob Israel are the Founding Fathers,,,BUT,,,Jacob’s twin brother Esau is in the family tree ,,,so,,,these people in the so called state of Israel today are from the lineage of Abraham ,,,but,,,from the Esau lineage , King Jesus pointed them out at Revelations 2:9 and again a 3:9,,,ALSO,,,remember God / King Jesus “Cursed” Esau , lineage forever see that at Malachi 1 … The Bible says in many places that the children of Israel are God’s chosen people ,,,King Jesus said that at Matthew 15:24 ” I came only for the lost sheep of the house of Israel” ,,, no where in The Bible do you find the statement “the Jews are God’s chosen people” ,,,IF,,,. you can find it Please tell Me the Scripture number…
      Praise King Jesus for Salvation and Healing … Acts 2:38…

  • Jim Clark

    The Cat Man
    What puzzles me is why Bob Livingston keeps pushing B.H. Obama

    • http://boblivingstonpl.wordpress.com Bob Livingston

      Dear Jim Clark,

      You write: “What puzzles me is why Bob Livingston keeps pushing B.H. Obama” What I’m “pushing” is for a new paradigm.
      http://teapartyeconomist.com/2012/08/10/obamas-biggest-lie-or-is-he-this-naive/

      Best wishes,
      Bob

      • Alana

        Obama isn’t naive, nor was that a lie. This election is going to make a huge difference in the direction the country is going. Obama is not just another democrat, but a radical America-hater. Our country and our freedom will be DESTROYED if he wins!

      • MAP

        I completely agree with you Alana.

  • Karolyn

    How? What Bob Livingston pushes is thinking.

    • Ted Crawford

      What it is, given the timing here, is little more than the tantrum of a petulant youngster!

      • http://boblivingstonpl.wordpress.com Bob Livingston

        Dear Ted Crawford,

        You write: “What it is, given the timing here, is little more than the tantrum of a petulant youngster!” Who are you addressing here?

        Best wishes,
        Bob

  • Alan

    I too am a Ron Paul supporter. But, if there is a split in the non democratic vote, Obama will win again. And he is the greater evil of the two candidates. A write in vote is not a vote for Paul, it is a vote for Obama. Don’t listen to Mr. Roberts.

    • eddie47d

      That is why the American political system remains the same and we are stuck between the two major parties. Being a Ron Paul supporter and voting against your conscience defeats your reasoning and forces you to accept what you loath.

      • Alan

        Ron Paul unfortunately will not be on the ballot in this race. Once again, follow closely on this, a vote for anyone other than Romney is a vote for Obama. Read this over and over until it penetrates that thick skull of yours.

      • eddie47d

        That is why so many of you are unbelievable. 3 years ago it was Ron Paul or bust. Apparently you will choose the lesser of the two evils and sacrifice your principles at the altar. Now as you say about “thick skulls”? Yours has turned to mush.

      • Vigilant

        Based on your oft-published views, eddie, it would seem that you are trying to engineer an Obama victory by encouraging Paul supporters to divorce themselves from the two party system.

        Who will you vote for eddie? You’re protected by screen name anonymity, so you should have no qualms about answering that question.

  • Reagan

    I do not find you well informed or well read…you seem to be full of the left “disinformation” being dispensed…..wake up..open your eyes! Read some facts, grow up and be through with that ideological childish hang up!

    • Karolyn

      I think you need a course in comprehensive reading.

    • Ted Crawford

      ” Cynics regard everyone as equally corrupt….Idealists regard everyone as equally corrupt, except themselves ” Robert Wilson
      ” An Idealist is one who on noticing that a Rose smells better than a cabbage, concludes that it will also make better soup ” H. L. Mencken

  • dan

    Paul…you forgot to mention that the Twin Towers became the property of an Israeli just weeks before the Israeli (Mossad )operatives were filming their destruction while dancing and celebrating….or that a van filled with explosives and driven by Israeli (Mossad) operatives was intercepted …oh and the gold in the repository in the basement that was sneaked in the back of garbage trucks prior to the tragedy.

    • Paul Wells

      Dan,
      I’m assuming you have some evidence to back up these charges…otherwise, they’re just internet rumors.

      • Nadzieja Batki

        dan is slinging pig manure and hopes that it will stick to somone.

  • bruce

    so when did this site go commie? did i miss something? i have never read such anti american garbage in a long time…..wait, i sub to moveon.org, so i get my trash delivered. you surprised me. wow.

    • Nadzieja Batki

      The site hasn’t gone left anywhere because there are people on this site who predominate the direction of this site by the Freedom of Speech they express.
      Writers write and express what they believe but if no one reads them or talks back to them they are just blowing into the wind.
      Know with certainty as an INDIVIDUALIST what you believe.

    • Vigilant

      bruce, Paul Craig Roberts did postgraduate work at Berkeley and is a member of the ACLU. ‘Nuff said.

      “On March 26, 2010, Roberts announced he was “signing off” as a journalist in a column titled “Truth Has Fallen and Taken Liberty With It”. However two months later another article by Roberts had appeared in counterpunch.org. Thereafter he resumed publishing articles regularly, going on to publish 25 more articles in 2010 alone, cf. on his website.” (Wikipedia).

      Too bad he didn’t honor his sign off pledge, instead of continuing to pollute the media with his anti-Republican and anti-Israeli views.

  • Vet

    We have a idiot in the whitehouse promising free everything , and this guy is saying the Republicans are misleading the poor. That is rich and a lie !!! Pure progressive propaganda !!!

    • http://yahoo bob peters

      Right on brother!

  • http://yahoo bob peters

    You arm chair idiots amaze me..I am neither Rep. or Dem…Just an American voter who is looking at your party pukes wondering what flavor of Koolaid you drink….Barack Hussein Obama is 100% Marxist and is hell bent on destroying your beloved america…Go ahead and put the Red back in the White house..A year from now when your are subjects of the communist state you will realize the harm you have done to your Children and Grandchildren..You will go down in history as the ones who sold your country out! Patriots will fight to the death for our freedom . WSe may die trying to avert the communist takeover,but we will have honor! When we stand before god, We wont have to look down in shame! Have at it,elect your Red!

  • Dennis Lib erty

    That would explain why, I can’t tell the difference between the Democrats and the Republicans after they get into office!

  • Phil

    I agree with just about everything but Netanyahu and Israel. I think that Israel is being played. The US has it’s hand in every pot and is playing the manipulation game from kings of old to maintain dominance. Also like you, I am not advocating anything, it just is what it is.

    • 4204life

      Have you ever wondered why our society has been forcefeed Jewish propoganda and anybody that slightly critisizes the propoganda is ostracized? Predictive programming that will lead to destuction. Please break free from the social engineers control and follow the golden rule. Only a diabolical tribe would try to lay claim as the Supremacist over all others.

      • Nadzieja Batki

        What golden rule?

      • Vigilant

        “Have you ever wondered why our society has been forcefeed [sic] Jewish propoganda [sic] and anybody that slightly critisizes [sic] the propoganda [sic] is ostracized?”

        I’d like to know which media outlet is doing what you claim. The leftist MSM (as well as PLD) goes out of its way to denigrate and criticize Israel at every turn. Approximately 70% of the Jewish population consistently vote Democrat.

        It’s not wise to test the depth of the waters with both feet, son.

  • Charles

    I am voting for Gary Johnson. I got fooled by the Democrats in 1964 and the Republicans in 1968, so I have been voting Libertarian ever since.

  • brabbie2002

    Good Lord..When did this site go dumbocratic? If you have all the evidence that odumbass is NOT an American citizen (judge by the people he surrounds himself with), why are you ranting about Republican propaganda? It isn’t the republicans that started the story, it was people that took one look at the usurper and decided he was totally bad news for the country. By his own admission – in his own words – odumbass warned us about people with something to hide! What does it take for you liberals? He has spent millions on stopping anyone from checking into his background? What the hell is HE hiding?

  • Sarah R.

    You are so right. We The People are being led to believe that we have a choice. But in reality Romney and Obama are clones. Nothing will change. things will only get worse. Goodby America it was a blast while it lasted.

  • jopa

    The above article is so true in so many ways it was a pleasure to read.What it comes to in the end for me is that if Romney were to get in Medicare Medicaid and Social Security as we know it would no longer exist.That would mean a lot of suffering for millions of senior citizens across America.They want to privatize SS so they wont have to pay the trillions owed to the SS fund and the ones that are promoting the end of Medicare themselves will have full insurance for life paid for by the citizens in their retirement packages.Romney is a mere puppet for the likes of Karl Rove the Koch’S or anyone else that knows how to pull a string.What I see in him is a weak kneed individual that has gotten in way over his head and should just take a little time off and go dancing with his horse or even his wife if it’s allowed in the Mormon religion.

    • Vigilant

      jopa says, “The above article is so true in so many ways it was a pleasure to read.”

      Thank you, jopa, for confirming the statements I’ve made about Paul Craig Roberts’ hatchet job. We all know that, if jopa supports it, it’s definitely wrong.

  • David Emery

    You are correct that both parties are corrupt. What you are missing is that the democratic party has been literally taken over by the communists. Obama was put into power with Russian money and training. He has been put into this position to destroy America’s economy using any and all means. The ultimate goal of his puppet masters is to reduce America’s armed forces and nuclear arsenal to zero. This will allow the Russians and the Chinese to nuke us before invading the country. Yes it all sounds like tin foil hat stuff but look at the facts.

    • Jeff

      The fact is that you don’t know what you’re talking about. No news flash – just a fact.

      • jopa

        David Emry: Another fact is that Romneys campaign is being financed to the tune of tens of millions of dollars from Communist China through the gambling magnate Edelson with his Chinese properties in Macau.This is out for anyone to read, can you imagine what his tax returns would show in that almost all of his money is made overseas.India, Pakistan, and even France are rooting for this guy.Almost forgot about the Cayman Islands, the Swiss, Luxembourgh, and the list goes on.He doesn’t even qualify to be an American worker, much less a President.

  • bob

    our tax dollars do support everything you say is propaganda. the democrats are all about big government, and government control. they do not care about anything, but retaining their power over us. hitler. stalin, mao, castro, chavez, polpot all big government people intent on retaining power at all costs, promising to get those evil rich people then becoming rich themselves through force. this is not propaganda it is called history trying to repeat itself in the last bastion of hope on earth. talk about propaganda the so called 99% will never get wealthy from government hand outs a person needs to get off their rear end, and do something for themselves. the party of the rich? so you think there are no rich democrats? they are all rich. that is why they become career politicians so they do not have to work honestly ever again. ask yourself this mister roberts how do these politicians become rich while in office? you really need to do some research before spewing nonesense. i reasherch all of my facts, and do not trust career politicians from either party, however the democrats seem bent on controling every aspect of our lives through regulation, and court law, force in other words. they ignore the constitution always. nazism, facism, communism, all big goverment schemes like the democrats want to implement, control, and power for goverment.

  • dcjdavis

    Problem is, there is nothing electable between. See you at the “poles”.

    • jopa

      dcdavis; I may see you between the poles, but not at the poles.Are you at the North or the South?

  • http://www.facebook.com/Brownink09 Frank B.

    Where in the hell did the concept that a third party vote is the same as a vote for ob come from? Because everyone says it? How about those of you that want Ron Paul for prez, real money(gold standard), and NO federal reserve, send an email of your support to everyone you know, then close your damn laptop and go visit your neighbors to let them know there IS a choice!!! They call it grass-roots, and we MUST start somewhere!! If enough people “throw away their vote” by giving it to RP, who knows what surprises may happen.

    • Alan

      Because the same 43% that voted for Clinton twice will also always vote for the democrats. Obama is assured of 43% of the vote. That means if there are two others of some popularity, they will split and assure Obama of victory. What is it you don’t understand about this?

    • Vigilant

      Frank B., who escews solid research, says, “Where in the hell did the concept that a third party vote is the same as a vote for ob come from? Because everyone says it?”

      No, Frank B., it comes from the historical record.

      Since 1990, candidates in 32 (8%) of the 380 Senate elections have met this criterion [5% or more of popular vote], and two (0.5%) have won, both in 2006. In six of the 32 races, one or the other of the major parties failed to nominate any candidate, allowing third-party candidates to perform better than usual.

      In the 302 gubernatorial elections since 1990 the criterion has been met 49 times (16%) and six candidates have won (2%). Until Lincoln Chafee’s victory in 2010, no third-party or independent governor had been elected since the 1990s. In the 38 presidential elections since 1856, the criterion has been met in eleven (29%) elections, with no third-party or independent candidate being elected president.” (Wikipedia)

      Moreover, in the 1980 election, “Libertarian Party candidate Ed Clark won 921,128 votes, or 1.1% of the total. No other Libertarian candidate has ever gotten more than 0.5% in a presidential election.” (Ibid.)

      Does that answer your question?

    • Vigilant

      ” If enough people “throw away their vote” by giving it to RP, who knows what surprises may happen.”

      Sorry, Frank, the last miracles known occurred during the Biblical era.

  • Steve

    No lover of either of the big parties, but trying to hang most of Tarp or Obama care on the republicans? Come on. Sure, the Big R uses conservative social issues to get into office, to line the pockets of their friends, family and self. The Big D uses liberal social issues to get into office, to line the pockets of their friends, family and self. Both sides want big government, money and control. For some strange reason the people of the US seem happy having just those two sides. Although with the level of screwing up both have done, it may be time for new players.

  • Rosech

    I grew up in a VERY demo family, when in middle 60′s my mother and father realized the demos were NOT for the working man, just themselves, and immediately became Republicans. I am an Independent and I did NOT vote for Obama or others trying to take America away from us! Repubs are better on most stuff; the Demos have failed every test for the last 40 years – liars, cheats, and full of baloney.

  • schneirj

    The idea that the Republican party is the party of the super rich is what caught my eye. That’s phony. The Republican party is the party of the middle class and the newly rich. The super rich are all over in the Democrat party which is that party of the conspiracy of inherited wealth to bribe the poor to vote them the power to crush the middle class.

  • brett

    of all the nonsense i’ve come across here, pound for pound this rings clear with such a level of reality that i almost thought that i woke up in bizarro world. if you like bill hicks than you would understand why obama has little over all power and why we still suffer from the policies of old. i, however, do believe in the power of vote and i am deeply disturbed as to how easily people are manipulated through propaganda. it is a shame how many people vote based on what they saw or heard in a commercial and not what they know is right. obama won on the wave of popular sentiment of the rejection of the status quo. a true peoples movement that scared the crap out of the powers that be ( no real conspiracy here, money and special interest rule, individual needs over the many, an ever changing face based in power of wealth ). unfortunately, despite the record braking turnout from the presidential election, many eligible voters don’t vote because they don’t believe that their vote counts. the powers that be know this, which is why they were so successful in the mid term elections ( which had a relatively low voter turn out ). it is a shame how the intent of our founding father’s have been manipulated and perverted under the guise of patriotism. it is a shame how political ideologies have been so misrepresented, distorted, and demonized that they are no longer recognizable from their intended conception. it is no wonder that we, as americans, can no longer agree on issues that should be as basic as human nature. a government for the people and by the people should not be one that is feared nor resented; one that is for individual needs and by individual needs should be. our founding father’s believed in the power of democracy and compromising the needs of the few for the benefit of the many. they warned of special interests and party partisanship usurping the power invested within our constitution. we need to put aside our prejudices and see through our stereotypes to begin to full fill our legacy of what our founding father’s intent. we are all, all in this together. as long as we allow what makes us different divide us, than the short term, selfish needs of the few will proper, and we all in the end will lose.
    peace, love, and god’s blessing from a starry eyed idealist.

  • TheTruthHurts

    Arguably one of the better articles written on this website. Two sides of the same coin.

  • http://personallibertydigest gottaplenty

    The libtards dems and followers of freehandouts ,that think for some reason they have rights over and above the producing middle class ,to thier money, is the down fall of our country.. Thier masia ,Odummer could tell them the best way to see the grand canyon is to drive off into it. And immediatly you would see the worlds greatest junk yard. They would do it without hesitation. Just follow the idiot and have the same results…. !!!

  • CB

    It’s too bad that Ron Paul did not fare better during the primary. I believe that he would have been good for the Country. However, Romney won the primary and he is the Republican candidate. So, dear people, you can either vote for the American Republican candidate or the Democrat with the suspect birth certificate, hidden college records, acknowledged muslin beliefs, ( not a Christian), the one who has indebted future generations, the one who has openly lied to the American people time and time again and whose policies are destroying the Country. Responsible voters don’t really have a choice. With all his faults, I will take the American patriot, Mitt Romney.

    • Honest Al

      CB, I agree that Obama and his socialist party sucks but I refuse to support a dickless puke who did not rise to the level of that loser, John McCain. So now it is the least stinky turd in the punchbowl again? Not me, I have principles and you sir have no pride in the country at all if you stoop to support either. It is your philosophy that brings this country to it’s knees. You do have other choices…study them and take them or you will just keep the status quo and we as a nation will lose!! I am going to be a part of destroying America because the other team may win. You cast your vote toward the betterment of America. Reelect no one and stay away from losers who do not have your best interests at heart. Now, I’m hinting..vote for candidates not party…rehire nobody!..I mean nobody because a lobbyist owns a first termer and they are loyal only to them.

      • CB

        I have intergrity as well. But I am also a realist. If we choose to stand on principles and not vote, then look for Obama to have four more years to destroy this Country. How well will you sleep knowing that you stood on the sidelines and proudly kept to your principles?
        My principle interest is getting Obama out of the control of this Country.

        • Jeff

          I know you can’t wait to get W (or his policies) back. He was a moron who virtually destroyed the economy, but at least he’s white, right? And he seems just like the guys you drink with at the bar. Don’t you think we should aim a bit higher for the presidency? I want a president who’s smarter than me and certainly smarter than you or the other bar patrons.

          • CB

            Whoa! You’re making a lot of assumptions and I might add… all wrong

    • Pam

      You are right I just hope they let the Troops over seas vote this time

    • Jon

      One minor correction, CB. Romney is not the Republican candidate. There isn’t one and won’t officially be until after the convention. He probably will get the nomination, but we should keep the facts straight.

  • SJJolly

    Paul Craig Roberts, a voice of sanity in a Libertarian / Tea Party Republican political windstorm.

    Obama is following 50% of the hard-right doctrine. Romney is following 100% of it, selling his beliefs and his principles, if not his soul, to increase his chances of winning the Presidency. Quite possiblity, the biggest regret in Romney’s life will be having to deliver on his promises to the hard-right after he wins. G.W. Bush got played by the hard-right; Romney is smart enough to see through the illusions.

    • Pam

      Well I just hope that they will let the American Troops vote this time I have 2 grand kids that said they didn’t get their voter ballots until 4 days after the election

  • Winddrinker

    This article stinks like garbage. It needs to go in the dumpster and the author should go and every place where he uses the word “Republican” he should change it to “Demonrats.” He seems to have gotten them mixed up! It is not the conservatives that threw away the Constitution, it is the failed-Marxism of the “progressives” (otherwise known as the “Regressives or RETROS.)

    • Nadzieja Batki

      Either Roberts is playing Devil’s Advocate or he is making a stand for what he actually believes.

      • Winddrinker

        Wealthy RETROS (progressives) make their money in a capitalist country, but they demonize the very system that allows them to prosper.

  • Chester

    It seems funny to hear people claiming Obama has spent “millions to hide his background” when any decent internet search will show you far more than you want to learn about him, including the fact that he was NOT the partygoing type that gets noticed and known in college.
    Another little bone to pick is the complaint about not being able to imagine any president inthe past sitting in the oval office and signing papers assuring the death of American citizens. It has happened almost as far back as the presidency began, and the deaths ordered were not only American citizens, but citizens of a number of countries who were actively working against America, especially during a period of conflict. Why do you think the CIA exists now. It didn’t exist until after world war 2, but there were a number of other agencies who did much the same things. Study ALL the history of the world, including America, and you will find that ordering deaths of a country’s citizens because they are actively working against their country is not at all uncommon.

    • David E

      Chester, if you have been reading about Obama on the internet you would be fully aware that he is a usurper. His birth certificate is false, he has sixteen different social security numbers (the one he uses today was issued in Connecticut where he never lived) and he has a false selective service card. He was also forced to resign his license to practice law as did Michelle Obama. guess that none of this worries you. Let’s hear it for the usurper!!!
      If he is re-elected I assure you that you won’t recognize America in four years time.

      • Jeff

        Where is your evidence for any of this? Particularly the part about he and Michelle being forced to surrender their law licenses. My understanding is they are inactive. It is unlikely either will choose to practice law in the future, but I see no evidence they could not.

        • David E

          Jeff, Regarding the Obama’s licenses to practice law, read this: http://jdlong.wordpress.com/2009/05/15/pres-barack-obama-editor-of-the-Harvard-law-review-has-no-law-license/

          Regarding the phony birth certificate, my wife has worked in computer graphics for over thirty years. She had the alleged birth certificate broken down into dozens of pieces in a few minutes. She said it was a poor forgery at best.

          Sheriff Arpaio and his people have some pretty clear evidence that Obama’s documents are false. Ask yourself why Obama has paid his lawyers to keep all his record sealed? Ask how he travelled to Pakistan at a time when Americans were not allowed to travel there? Which countries passport did he use?

          Jeff, I really feel sorry for anyone who relies 100% on their emotions and not on the facts.
          Wake up, Obama is a communist. he is doing his best to destroy our country!

    • Pathfinder

      Chester: Obama has a lot to hide. We need not get into college days with the exception of who paid for his very expensive education???? We know that he had dual citizenship and is suspect of using the aid for foreign student loan system as a non citizen, Why are his records SEALED? When and why did he change his name from Barry Soetors to Barrak Obama?
      BOB’s rise to power in Illinois is a model of fascist strong arm tactics destroying his opposition both democrat and republican. His Chicago connections are nefarious, Ayres (Weathermen terrorist), Axelrod, Reznick (in jail for corruption), Wright (God damn America), and The Brothers Emanual; all far, far left ideologues as are his czarist appointments
      Then there is Acorn. Delve into his history and here and the theme repeats, strong arming banks to make loans to unqualified applicants, registering non-qualified illegals to vote, ( convicted in Ohio) and the corruption runs deep. Guess who backs Acorn and its myriad of far left branches? … GEORGE SOROS!
      How did this “poor black kid” go from poverty to being a multi millionaire in so short a time. He certainly did not get wealthy on public service and elected office. If anyone needs to release financial statements it is BOB. How much stimulus money made it back to BOB via all the bankrupt Solyndras and the many foreign governments that prospered from stimulus funding?
      Barry Soetoro has much to answer for and the corrupt press needs to supporting him and investigate what may well be one of the most sinister presidents and administrations ever to occupy the White House. So much for Hope and change and Barry’s FUNDAMENTALLY CHANGING AMERICA campaign promise. He is succeeding in ways that will destroy America.

  • mea

    Ever being democrat party lackeys, republicans still have not run any political campaigns or otherwise worked to convinced anyone of anything, lately [see the phony mitten and local republican campaigns].
    While the democrats are running campaigns, getting elected, doing all of the things people object too [see above] as a matter of fulfilling the democrat objectives : Policies to achieve and perpetuate the destruction of ‘successful’, ‘wealthy’, ‘free’ America.
    Part and parcel of which is the article, above, accusing the do nothing republicans of doing the Stuff the democrats are actually doing; again, while the republicans do their usual nothing.
    Excellent job democrats !

  • Pathfinder

    Interesting commentay Paul.
    I was just wondering how the poor, unemployed, and underemployed American citizens are going to feel about the Obama amnesty that will allow 1,8 million illegal residents to legally gain employment in the US. Will this not increase competition between citizens for job? Will this not enlarge the unemployment recipients? Will this not further place the US economy down the road of “perdition”? You speak of Both Romney and BOB as freaks justifiable so, The two party system has failed us again and the corrupt press continues to support an agenda in lieu of publishing the truth. Given all the signs that I see, America has seen its best days and will now go the way of other great nations that are on the ash heap of history. The only alternative may be a rising of AMERICANS , and just as the founding fathers did against King George, rebel against a tyranical government.
    Thomas Jeffersone one the most visionary and elequent Founding Fathers predicted this current state of affairs

    • Pam

      You are right! This is what the American turned out to be with Obama You know what I tell you There are good white peoples and good white peoples and some good Hispanic peoples But Obama I have to say he a sorry black man if I have ever seen one some of the out right lies he tells and we know he is lying And that there Harry Reid he too so there is 2 one white one black and that there polosie I don’t know how to say her name I even bet she has problems saying it too

  • Karolyn

    This is off-topic but worth sharing. I got an email from a conservative friend the other day about HR 4646, which was to have been a 1% tax on all bank deposits. Wellm the email is a hoax, It instructs people to check with Snopes to see that it is real. Well, I did; and it isn’t. I went further than Snopes too. The bill number was changed, and it has been in the House since 3/11 with no chance of going anywhere. Another thing is that the purpose of the tax was to get rid of the income tax. So, anyway, here’s another rumorbeing sent to conservatives everywhere that is put to rest. People,, please factcheck everything.

    • Pathfinder

      Karolyn: The “rumor” is correct and the bill is in the house since 3/11 If BOB loses the election watch for his slash and burn tactics especially on 3 remaining UN treaties that yields American sovereignty to the UN (the 4th treaty ATT was recently shot down by 51 senators) BOB can not be trusted to act in Americas interests.

      The problem with the AHCA is as Ms. Pelosi said, “We will find out what is in the bill once we pass it”. Now here is the dirty secret and funding trick used by unscrupulous democrats: The Affordable Health Care Act (AHCA) was passed with funding attached.That means the House is not necessary to bring up funding bills for the AHCA.
      K Sebalius (health care administrator) has a blank check to fund the AHCA and need no congressional approval. This is why repeal of the AHCA as it stands is necessary. No question health care laws need changing but think of this; the same congress that made current laws, which are the problem, is responsible for creating the new laws. Fat chance of the congressional power brokers getting it right for American citizens.

      • Karolyn

        According to the sources I checked that bill has no chance of going anywhere.

  • Mike

    Roberts, your comments are filled with hatred toward Israel, and seem to favor Obama over Romney. Sure there were some token jabs at the end of your article toward both candidates, but your flavor seems to be a bit more Democrat than Libertarian. Btw, I’m no fan of Romney, I’m actually a very recent convert from being a lifetime conservative Republican to the Libertarian perspective. I really want to see the Libertarian movement grow. I just think your heavy rhetoric pushes away more conservative-minded people like me who are actually listening to you and exploring a departure from the two party system.

  • http://www.facebook.com/warcraftsailor Bradley Flinn

    it’s simple on one side you have crony capitalists on the other crony socialists. The bumper sticker should say friends don’t let friends vote for the R or the D running in the dempublican party. As long as we let so few control what we hear and see I don’t see DC changing anytime soon
    http://www.commoncause.org/site/pp.asp?c=dkLNK1MQIwG&b=4923173

  • chuckb

    we have people advocating hatred for both parties, does this mean all politicians are bad so lets just leave the ignoramus in the white house? diversionary tactics.
    some mealy mouths comment on here, they can’t stand either candidate, so they won’t vote for romney, does that mean they are going to turn their head and vote for barry, a vote for anyone else amounts to a vote for barry.

    the bolshevik party is just that, they are socialist, they have been working on installing a marxist type government for the last forty years or so. they sneak in a black man as president,knowing full well the the bleeding hearts would cower in fear before confronting him on his issues, (fear of the name calling that would soon be coming). we have a republican candidate that is made to order for them. he refuses to fight back, something like george w bush, he sees everything as kinder and gentler, while the bolsheviks tear him to pieces. with thirty five percent of the country on welfare of some sorts, and they are not about to give up the freebies, i see barry winning another four years and we lose our country.

    if you think the vacations were loud and expensive the first half wait until after he wins, air force one will most likey be retired and a new one gained, can you imagine the miles on that plane. can you imagine the price of luxury we will afford moochella and barry,

  • Farleyagain

    It became clear to me after a few years in Iraq that the stated aims and reasons for sending our guys over there to die and be maimed had very little to do with our national security. So I went looking for the reason. Why were we in Vietnam? Was that just a political goof by Johnson to stay in power following the charismatic Kennedy? Why does Caroline Kennedy, the only survivor of that immediate family campaign for the puppet, so unlike her father? The most likely reason I have found is Iraq’s threat to start trading oil for something other than dollars. Everytime oil is sold on the world market, the Fed and the US Govt. make money on the interest from loaning dollars to foreign countries needing to buy oil. This is not an insignificant amount of income apparently. Makes you wonder if Iran’s similar threat is the real reason for the war mongering against them. I have concluded that it isn’t about religion or political power for their own sake, but it is all about money and the control of money and its movement worldwide that decides who lives and who dies, who wins and who loses, who makes money and who is impoverished. And the fact that local public schools cowtow to the Federal Govt because they get 8.3% of their funds from that source shows how little leverage it takes to gain that power. http://www2.ed.gov/about/overview/fed/10facts/index.html

  • Pam

    So much Hate and Rage and putting the blame on either side to say they are the problem, but the truth is the whole system is broken. Splitting the country black against white Hispanics against both. One who is running to be president again spreads lies and buys people off to tell fichus stories against the other. The other person running don’t lash back, trying to be composed on everything. People say they want to see their taxes the other had to have a birth certificate made tell yarns about schools about his past but he points to the other to take the spot light off from himself.
    This election its either choosing the better of the Evils or deciding if a business man that worked with a company that bought companies out that were failing and people selling their half true stories about what happened. And comparing it to a man that done nothing but help people get government give a ways for poor people which the tax payer is paying for. This economy keeps up there will not be any tax payers. The government will own all of us or sell us out to the highest bidder, because we all know The government will not except not getting their money. Romney = Economy-Jobs-fair tax-state controlled programs such as Social Security- less government control-and a set intrust rate on banks no more that 2% more than government programs. Obama= everything is free=the working class pays for those that cant find a job or don’t want a job.
    The town I live in I can drive down the street people setting out under a shade tree drinking beer their kids in rags a new car with a house that looks like it is ready too fall down. This wasn’t that way 4 years ago. Most had a old car like mine kids playing in the streets and they wore clothing that was nice. I think what has happened? Is this the Change that America wanted? Are we all living the great American lie? Now we have Mexican Gangs beating up on our Kids because they are black. We have white kids that are afraid to play with our kids because they don’t want to get hurt? Is our country going back to the way it was in the 50s I don’t know. Obama says that it is OK with him if a guy marries a guy and a women marries a women. I know his mama is rolling in her grave over that.

    • Pathfinder

      Pam; You are correct with your statements about current conditions.
      However: I grew up in the 50′s and I don’t see the current state of affairs anything like the 50′s. In my view things are fare worse. Much has changed here in America since then. Back in the 50′s Churches played a primary role in helping those in need. Families were more unified and the drug problem was insignificant compared to today. The birth of out of wedlock children was a fraction of what it is today. We did not have the influx of illegal residents; immigrants needed sponsors so that they were financially secure.
      Our FEDERAL GOVERNMENT changed all that under the guise of “helping the people”.

      Words to ponder….
      “I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.”
      ……………….profound words by Thomas Jefferson

  • Karolyn

    Just saw on the news that Obama is pulling ahead.

    • Pathfinder

      Karolyn: Please be careful of who is reporting what. If your reading polls look for LIKELY voters not REGISTERED voters. Second. Polls are supposed to sample equally but some survey more democrats than republicans (as much a 8% more). And rarely do they specify the number surveyed and percentage deviations. There was a recent poll in which the reporter predicted an OBAMA landslide. Be carful of the smoke and mirrors generated by the corrupt press. It is much to early for any accurate predictions. The American people (and probably a number of Illegal residents) will decide Americas fate in November.

  • Commenttime

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=4s_IUwwGq-A

    Ron Paul tried to warn us with his what if speach. Watch it.

  • Commenttime

    Romney needs to beg Ron Paul to VP for him and win in a land slide or step aside. He won’t even go after Ob long list of crimes. He has orders to not go there. I am sure the masters don’t want their child exposed to that and loose power if the truth came out. To bad we can’t cut off his funding. I guess he would just print money out of thin air.

  • Jefferson Thomas

    There are many pieces to a puzzle Mr. Roberts.

    I’ll address a small part of your statement concerning the Muslim question. I’m not saying the Clown in Chief is a Muslim but sources close to him have given me information that he bows down towards Mecca 5 times a day on his prayer rug (that is a joke son, can you guess what current news story it refers to?)

    You say “Why would a Muslim in the white house kill other Muslims?” I’ll answer your question with some questions.

    Why would Iranians and Iraqis kill each other in a war for 7 years? Why do Sunni and Shiite Muslims kill each other and bomb the mosques of their enemies? Do other ethnic groups within Islam hate each other and have they had wars as well? How old are these ancient hatreds between these different ethnic groups?

    Just for kicks let’s say that Islam is at war with the rest of the world…Do you think they would accept collateral damage to win this war? Would Muslims ever lie about who they are and what they are doing to win this war?

    Are you an anti-Semite?

    Many other questions come to mind but that is good for a start.

    • Noel

      Well written response! I don’t know why or how I got the newsletter that linked to this article, initially it seemed like a pro-Liberty site, guess I was tricked! Anyway, the knee-jerk bashing of Israel, and resorting to name calling against Natinyahu sends up red flags…I think the left, and this new sick hybridization of the left who are Ron Paul maniacs hate Jews blindly.

      Also using “flag wavers” in even the the most subtle of derogatory of tones makes me recoil, it’s a despicable mind set!

      • Jefferson Thomas

        I’m not sure where you get your information about Ron Paul but you may want to check your sources, their motivations, and the actual words of Mr. Paul. I happen to be a Libertarian with a conservative leaning if that fits me into a pigeon hole you are looking for. Jewish people have people who are good and bad just like any other ethnic group.

        I happen to think that Benjamin Netanyahu would make a better American president than the clown in the white house now because Netanyahu actually went to school here, lived here and is more “American” than the jackass in the white house now. Going out on a limb I would venture to wager that he knows more about the US Constitution than either of the clowns running for president in the major parties.

      • Jeff

        Why is all criticism of Netanyahu and Likud reflexively seen as anti-semitism? Netanyahu gets criticized plenty in Israel and I daresay the majority of American Jews have at least some difficulty with his policies. Where he is really loved is among the fundamentalist Christians who, until maybe 2 generations ago, thought Jews had horns!

  • Noel

    Republicans aren’t happy about the Wallstreet idiots getting bailed out either, they’re just not reflexively class envious so that they jump to thinking that is worse than other socialist shenanigans. The military, and defending against terrorist nations doesn’t irk Republicans the same way, because they understand it is one of the few things the Federal government is actually supposed to do, Constitutionally, not take on whatever issue they think can create dependence.

  • StevenGarrick

    I do not care what religion he(barry soetoro)practice’s,but i care about what this obvious fraud has done to my country!,..I swore an oath to protect her,and for over 2 decade’s,even with the like’s of that complete loser Clinton,and both waste’s of time(bush sr.& son),i did,..and now,the mentally challenged voted this,…in,and want more?,..Damn,..i will go back to my family’s land,and,..

  • MontieR

    What a load of road apples.

  • Commiefornia

    This is why I tell people all the time that the Democrats have turned this independent voter Republican, and the Republicans are turning me into a Tea Party member. There is no difference between establishment Democrats or their Republican counterparts. They’re both for big federalist government. I liberal minded person challenged me on Bush’s 2 terms and I told him I make no excuses for what Bush and the Congress did. They spent a lot of money on pork barrel crap and expanded the federal government like it’s never been expanded before.

  • bonniewheeler

    I’m not sure what Romney will do but I already know what Obama has done and I also know what he would like to do. Why did he tell Russia that his hands were tied right now because of the next election but his second term will be different? And the Russian representative responded knowingly “I understand” They didn’ t know the camera was on. Obama meant that he couldn’t do what he would like this term because the people would not vote him back in. If he wins next term, we can expect the drastic change he has had in mind all along. We will not recognize America by the time his second term ends.

  • http://rightgunner.wordpress.com rightgunner

    Well Mr. Roberts has spoken, and what message and response does he expect from us belittled “americans”? He says some of the same as the originator of this very interesting blog, Mr. Livingston, says.

    In support of Mr. Roberts, most of us do believe in DWOD, not a Dimes Worth Of Difference between the Wizards pulling the strings behind the screens of the two major parties, and thus the parties. And we are targeted for demoralization, just like Greece, Italy and the rest of Europe, with financial actors claiming to provide salvation by “only” transferring “some” sovereignty.

    Besides the financial, over here we are also demoralized by finding all the misfits from the 60’s, the Communists so adept at undermining societies but unable to do anything productive themselves, the free sex and drug crowds now needing real medication, the persons who identify themselves by their perversion of the sexual function and various other totalitarians for diverse dictatorships, etc., in the drivers seat of the country. But this is just minor and temporary demoralization to condition us to give up our sovereignty.

    Up to now Mr. Roberts would probably agree with this. The problem is what are we supposed to do from here on. Both Mr. Roberts and sometimes Mr. Livingston seem to give the idea that there is no hope but that is not a productive message. We do not have to give in and we do not have to retreat. We are already seeing some real conservatives getting elected to Congress and at least some may not become contaminated by the system-as-usual.

    Our problem in reclaiming the Republic, since we didn’t “keep it’, is fighting things that incrementally perverted our government and our perception of our history, for well over one hundred years. Therefore we will have to incrementally fix things possibly for the same length of time or greater. And small steps like winning conservative seats in Congress are part of the that.

    Do not give up and do not follow anyone who invokes the poor as being cheated out of free medical treatment and other government services by the illegal bank bailout. Neither crony capitalism nor socialism is what this country was or should be in the future and we need to fight against them both. God is the creator of the Universe and everything in it. God made Man free, but mankind must fight to stay free and God does not appear to micromanage the Universe. We have a job to do ourselves.

  • GregS

    Reality #1: A third party candidate will NOT win in November, no matter how much anyone would wish this to happen. IT JUST WON’T HAPPEN.

    Reality #2: If Obama gets re-elected for another term, the damage that will be done will be irreversible, regardless of who succedes him in 2016: ObamaTAXCare will NEVER be repealed, because it will have established its roots as a PERMANENT ENTITLEMENT.

    All potential third-party voters should keep these two realities in mind when “voting their conscience” in November.

    • Honest Al

      This is what I have in mind, if you do not like either candidate, give him a mixed congress powerless to pass any kind of crap that either will mess the country up with. (short of executive orders that can be repealed by another) A third party choice is justified if both candidates are New Word Order supported and are prone to force amnesty on this country and so far, both are leaning that way. They are both in bed with Israel and the UN.

    • Farleyagain

      You are correct.

      • bonniewheeler

        richard, you are absolutely right = Obama (and I heard him say it when he didn’t know the cameras were on) told the Russian diplamat that he couldn’t do much now because of the election but when the election is over we will see facism in this nation like we’ve never seen in its history.

  • http://windstream WayneB

    As one of those “working poor,” I can tell you that the Democratic Party, along with the Republican Party really does very little for us. This said, I reluctantly vote Republican in most elections because their political programs/policies are less dangerous and less destructive as the Democrats have been over the years.

    • Jeff

      If you are part of the “working poor,” and you vote for Mitt Romney’s tax cuts, you are simply voting stupidly. Wise up. I know you don’t feel worthy of any consideration because you don’t make much money, but it is important that people like you can maintain a reasonable lifestyle, can receive healthcare, and will not be in abject poverty if you lose your job. Republicans don’t consider your economic welfare to be any of their business. Romney has now chosen Ayn Rand as his running mate. Could there be a clearer declaration of Class Warfare from the top?

      • David E

        Jeff you are either a blithering idiot or you are a Marxist – Communist just like your little friend Obama. If Obama gets a second term he will finish the job of destroying America. Read up on how the people of the Soviet union fared under communism. Ask some of the thousands of proud US citizens who were born in communist countries why they are going to vote for anyone but Obama. Albert Einstein once defined Insanity as doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. Such have been every attempt to implement communism. It has been tried many times and it has failed. Look how free the Chinese people or maybe North Korea. Look at Cuba. Do you see boats full of people leaving Miami destined for Havana? Everyone who was shot trying to cross the Berlin wall was headed from east to west. Wise up you Marxist jerk!!!

        • Jeff

          Ifou think Bush Redux will better than the original, then I guess you meet Einstein’s definition. The screams from the right that Obama is Stalin or Lenin or Marx don’t make them any less crazy. But Romney picking Ayn Rand as his running mate makes very clear his intention to return to the W policies that got us where we are. Rand-Ryan voted for every idiotic W policy, yet now he worries about debt because a Democrat is in office. Remember “deficits don’t matter?” Remember tax cuts coupled with pre-emptive wars? Ryan voted for all of it.

          Now, Romney wants to pay even less in taxes and deregulate the banks and big oil even more. If you think his agenda will help anyone but the already wealthy, you are nuts. And calling Obama a socialist or an SOB won’t change that.

          • David E

            Jeff, I am not calling Obama a socialist or an SOB I am calling him a communist who hates America. Sure Bush was bad for the country and Romney is no angel but read this and read it well:

            Romney is a capitalist. Capitalists start companies and create jobs. The people who have those jobs pay taxes just as their bosses do. The top 1% pay 40% of the taxes. Only now does government have any real money to spend.

            Life under communism is a little different. There is no such thing as private property. You cannot own a house as all property is owned by the state. You are told where to work. You do not have a choice. There is almost no difference in living conditions for a skilled professional to a common laborer. The result of this is that nobody tries very hard to do their job. If you are a farmer you are paid just as much if the farm you are employed in grows a ton of potatoes or a hundred tons of potatoes. Why bother to work hard?

            The inevitable result is what we saw in the old Soviet Union. One could sit on a train and look out of the window at field after field of weeds. The people working in the factories used to steal sugar from the cafeteria so they could make rot gut vodka.The police paid people to spy on their neighbors. Huge files were kept on everyone. Anyone causing trouble for the government simply disappeared. You really need to study the history of communism so as to understand it. Better still, find someone who grew up in the old Soviet Union. They will tell you their own personal horror stories.

            Now back to Obama. Obama senior is one of the possible men who fathered him. It is a well known fact that Obama senior was a devout communist. Frank Marshall Davis is more likely to be his father as he was his childhood mentor. Obama looks nothing like Obama senior but very much like Davis. Regardless of who fathered Barry it is a fact that Davis was his mentor. Davis was a card carrying member of the ACP or American Communist Party. The phrase “Fundamentally transform America” is from one of Davis’s speeches to a communist audience. Look it up on google.

            Davis had many contacts in Chicago with the unions and the corrupt local government.

            If you keep up your research you will find that Obama was introduced to the political left at a party given by the unrepentant terrorist Bill Ayers at his home. Ayers father (also a communist) gave Obama his first real job. Today Obama says that he never knew Ayers, this even though Obama and Ayers sat on many far left – communist boards together.

            I could go on and on but I will leave it to you to do some research. If you are under forty years old you almost certainly were indoctrinated by the super far left run education system so it’s not your fault if you do not know the true history of communism.

            The problem today is that Obama who is without any question a communist has surrounded himself in his administration with fellow communists. Google “Obama white house communists” to learn who these people are.

            You may also want to read the works of Karl Marx. You will recognize many of the things Obama is pushing for such as the insane idea of redistribution of wealth.

            Four more years of Obama and the constitution will be torn up. Your rights will be taken away. You will be very poor in comparison to how well off you are today. In short you will not recognize the country and your freedom will be just a memory.

            Remember that it is the agenda of all communists to destroy capitalism. That means we have traitors in the white house. These people took an oath to protect the United States constitution. Their real agenda is to collapse the system.

          • Jeff

            If you think Obama is a Communist, there is no possibility you can think clearly. He has shown no evidence of such inclination. The stock market is double what it was when W left office. If Obama’s a Communist bent on destroying the capitalist system, he’s not doing it very well!

          • Jeff

            Sorry, you are simply paranoid and completely, 100% wrong in your analysis.

          • bonniewheeler

            Obama is the only president who has gone abroad and called America arrogant and he even made a statement that ‘America can’t always be number one’ My response to that is ‘O yes we can’ but we’ll have get rid of the current president first. He doesn’t want America to be number one. He has always been anti-america – He hates our economic system. He’s for socialism which means that he would like to rob those who earn to give to those who don’t. Capitalism is the fairest system in the world. Individuals who work should never have to give their earnings to those who don’t.

          • Jeff

            Other than on this blog, Rush, Sean, and the other geniuses at Fox, where is the evidence of Obama’s socialism? You guys state it as a fact, then go on to say how bad socialism is, but you NEVER cite anything the least bit credible in support of your central point. That is an error commonly made by cranks.

          • bonniewheeler

            His notion that the government can compel individuals to participate in a particular marketplace against their will reeks socialism. He has already forced health care against the will of the people. He told Joe the plumber that he plans to spread the wealth around. That again reeks socialism in the highest degree. He has also threatens tax hikes and new regulations against the will of the people to pay for this – socialism pure and simple. Americans must quit voting party and vote for those who are willing to stand firm on American principles, morals and values.

          • Jeff

            Government regulating private industry is not socialism; it is common sense. Government nationalizing private industry is socialism. So, I suppose you think Glass-Steagall and the FDIC constitute(d) socialism. How simple-minded can you be? We’re talking about an actual economy here; not some Ayn Rand fantasy for high school sophomores.

            The Affordable Care Act is set up as it is to keep the private insurance industry involved. I believe single payer would be a preferable system and we would not have to discuss the silliness about the mandate. That would be a socialistic element in a mixed economy, like Medicare. But that’s not the law.

            You want the right to opt out of society? Move out to the desert or live in a cave. If you live in a society and you fall down unconscious on the street, you will be taken to a hospital. If you are uninsured, who pays for that? Is that socialism?

        • Jeff

          David:

          No, I haven’t blithered in weeks. How about you? Calling your opponents Marxist jerks will not win you points in debate nor in conversation. It will convince people you are not very intelligent and unable to support your opinions without name-calling. This link shows the view of a real economist.

          http://www.moneynews.com/StreetTalk/Stiglitz-wealth-gap-inequality/2012/08/09/id/448084?s=al&promo_code=FB98-1

      • DaveH

        Jeff says — “But Romney picking Ayn Rand as his running mate makes very clear his intention to return to the W policies that got us where we are. Rand-Ryan voted for every idiotic W policy, yet now he worries about debt because a Democrat is in office. Remember “deficits don’t matter?””
        Do you really expect anybody to give your comments any credence, Jeff, when you say garbage like that? His name is Paul Ryan, and he is just another establishment Republican in Conservatives’ clothes. He bears no resemblance to Ayn Rand.

        • Jeff

          Are you kidding me? He has cited her as his favorite “philosopher.” He requires everyone in his office to read her crap. I would think that must somehow violate the 8th Amendment. Only recently has he repudiated her because he “just learned” about her atheism. Give me a break. Ryan is a very smart guy and he didn’t address her Society without being fully versed in every aspect of her life.

          Calling Ryan a mainstream Republican is actually quite revealing. He is about as far right wing as you can get; yet these days that is mainstream in the Republican Party. Interesting how 10 years ago he willingly acknowledged the importance of stimulus spending by the Government. Of course, that was when he wanted the economy to thrive so W could take credit for it.

      • Bonnie Wheeler

        Jeff, do you reallly believe anybody could do worse than Obama – how long has it been since unemployment was 8.5 percent- not in the last 30 years I’m sure. When has gasoline been this costly? When has inflation reached this height. Not in my lifetime and I’ve been around since Calivin Coolidge. FDR didn’t allow it. He placed a ceiling price on everything

        • Jeff

          So, are you saying you want the government more involved in the economy or less?

          • bonniewheeler

            I’m saying I want Obama out! He makes Carter look good and he is socialist from the word ‘go’ (Carter was inclined to go that way) Obama wants complete control over the people and their money so he can dole their earnings out to whomever he pleases.. In reply to Joe the Plumber’s question “do you want to take my money and give it to others” he said as much in no uncertain terms.
            I believe in feeding the hungry I don’t believe in making life so easy for those on welfare that they would want to stay on it forever. Some have made it a way of life. They sit on the seat of do nothing, reproduce , and force the consequences of their immorality on the hard working people who have their own responsibilities.
            There is no compassion among politicians – They take money from hard working people to buy votes.

          • Jeff

            So, your definition of “socialist” is 3 or 4% difference in top marginal tax rates? That’s the difference between a free marketeer and a socialist? Wow!

    • bonniewheeler

      Wayne, we really need government to set us free so we can do for ourselves. We are so bogged down in restrictions and red tape that we will never have the success we deserve. China is freeing up their people while our government is restricting its people

  • Haywood Jablomie

    What a complete load of liberal crap. I’ve rarely seen so many obvious LIES in one article. I hope no one falls for this blatant pro-Obama propaganda.

  • Dave

    I’m an independent, BUT when the Obama says “let the rich pay their fair share” and although they may pay only 15% for capital gains, they paid say $100,000 in total tax and almost half the middle and lower middle class pay NO income tax at 25% rates I wan’t to say “let EVERYONE pay something”. When I hear of individuals who do not work can file a tax return and get thousands back in refund due to the unearned tax credit, and hear plans to buy people who can’t afford them cell phones, not wonder the demo’s need someone to pay more tax so they can spend it bribing folks to vote for them. A 16th Century writer said that democratic governments can’t last much more than 200 years because eventually half the population learns they can vote themselves onto the public doal and the other half can’t afford it and the society goes down.

    • bonniewheeler

      Dave, my sentiments exactly

  • GiveMeLiberty

    I agree with all points made by the author except the stay home in November point.

    Both sides are criminal therefore we must “REPLACE THE ESTABLISHMENT”!

    That means just that, replace them all, both R’s and D’s! Vote ONLY for Constitutional and Ultra-Conservatives candidates. I’m a realist and we won’t kill all the roaches but we can certainly dilute them.

    Some examples of candidates who we need hundreds more of are Ron Paul, Gary Johnson, Wayne Allen Root, Sara Palin, Michelle Bachman, Paul Ryan, Jim DeMint, Allen West, with some others.

    For far too long we’ve only voted “the least of two evils”! I’m done with that. It’s time we watch reruns of The Outlaw Josey Wales and really listen to the scene with Ten Bears!

    • David E

      I would vastly prefer Ron Paul as my choice for president but let’s face it, there isn’t a cats chance in hell that he can win as there are just too many idiots out there.

      Romney is a capitalist and I am sure that he has many faults but Obama is a communist. Four more years of Obama and there will not be a country left to hold an election in.

      Google Hugo Chavez and read about how he destroyed Venezuela and turned it from a prosperous country into the hell hole that it is today and you will have a good idea about Obama’s plans for America. We simply cannot afford another four years of this man.

      With 49% of people in the country receiving money from the government we are seeing a replay of Venezuela. Once the number of people receiving government money gets to about 55% – 60% then it will be impossible to ever vote out the democrats as the majority of people will not vote to lose their share of the pie. Chavez used this method.

      Chavez redistributed wealth to the peasants in return for their votes. Venezuela today is 95% non functional. Caracas has one of the highest crime rates in the world. Even the post office there no longer functions. Piles of mail lie rotting in the street.

      Yes you can make your point by not voting but be aware that you may have to pay the ultimate price for your inaction. Our country is at a tipping point. OBAMA = DISASTER.

      • DaveH

        Romney and Obama are just different branches of the same tree — Rule by the Elites. If you want to be a serf, then continue to rubber stamp Establishment Republicans and they will continue to supply more Establishment Republicans for you to rubber stamp in the future.
        If you want to have Free Markets where people do what they do best, absent Government picking winners and losers, and they trade voluntarily with one another without Government meddling in their chosen work, then you must break the mold, take the ring out from your nose, and start voting for people who truly represent Freedom not just lip-service about Freedom:
        http://www.lp.org/platform
        Voting for Romney just to keep Obama from winning is truly Throwing Away Your Vote.

        • bonniewheeler

          I like Romney and what he stands for right now – Anyone however is better than Obama. I know Romney is a Capitalist. The system on which this nation was founded. It’s the best and the fairest in the world. It used to mean that each person had the right to pursue his own happiness, that includes his financial status. And then what happened? Some nuts figured if they would start rewarding failures and punishing success they would get more votes. People were suckered into expecting government to take care of them. Morals deteriorated and people who would have become successful only became weaker because they did not try to succeed. Those who didn’t work or take responisiblity had just as much as those who did work. Bad government destroys one’s will and self-confidence

      • DaveH

        Romney is anti-gun, and anti-freedom.
        And don’t confuse Crony Capitalism with Capitalism. They are two entirely different animals.

  • wallace

    all this discussion is well and good but what needs to be done to make our country prosperous again? for our citizens to have the opportunity make a decent living? who should pay taxes and how much? what are the goals that we should aim for?

    • DaveH

      We should strive for a moral society as well as a prosperous society.
      We can start by quitting assuming that Government has a right to steal other peoples’ money. We can start by recognizing that Government doesn’t regulate markets for our good, but for the good of their Crony Capitalists and themselves.
      We can start by recognizing that Charity doesn’t come from unwilling donors, and that Vote-Buying, not Charity, is what Government engages in.
      We can start by learning that Free Markets unleash the productive energies of people, resulting in the most prosperous Societies that a people can hope for.
      We can start by reading as much as we can about the real world results of Big Government.
      Start here to understand what money is, and how Government is robbing us blind with the help of the Federal Reserve:
      http://library.mises.org/books/Murray%20N%20Rothbard/What%20Has%20Government%20Done%20to%20Our%20Money.pdf

  • C.R Tucker

    How the greatest country with the greatest people have succumbed to this place saddens me how true I hate it but true the true hope is to stand up and kick every elected official out and bring in new no matter what dont vote for the incumbent maybe all new blood can over come the moral Rot that has invaded the we the people government and send a strong message that says we are the people all of us

    • DaveH

      If the people aren’t educated to the benefits of Freedom and Limited Government, we could throw all the rascals out but they will just be replaced by other rascals.

  • swampfox

    OBAMA HAS TO GO!
    we HAVE to sack obummer,
    my god people,it’s common sense,
    why the debate,there IS’NT one!
    it is the DUTY of every patriot who loves our country to vote this Marxist out and as many as we can that are allied with comrad ovomit.
    dang,I can’t beleive this,
    romney is not a Marxist!
    There are things I don’t care for about him,but it’s small taters next to what we KNOW Obama is!
    Obama=ruin and communism,fact!

    • DaveH

      Common sense tells me that going South with Obama won’t get me to a Northern Destination, but then neither will going East with Romney.

    • Jeremy Leochner

      Yes. Obama is a communist. As we all know communists give billions of dollars in bailouts to big business and constantly ask business’s to regulate themselves.

  • richard

    I drive a beat up pickup too, and feel the same way. My reasoning is that in 3 and a half years I have seen NO one and I mean No one go to jail for any of this mess. So I might as well vote for someone that has a clue about putting us all back to work!

  • afdbghq

    Paul Craig Roberts writes “Republicans send each other via email an endless number of nonsense stories about Barack Obama being a Muslim, about Obama being a Marxist, about Obama being a Manchurian candidate turning America over to the New World Order, the United Nations or some other dastardly plotting organization.”

    This says everything that needs to be said about obummer. He is doing all of these things and more in order to destroy the greatest country this world has ever seen. I for one am tired of it because I love this country ans what it once stood for. It is time to put people into office that will restore it to its greatness. Vote all of them out and start over and tell them that if they do not perform as WE THE PEOPLE (the majority of people and not the fringe elements) demand then their time in office will be short.

    It is time to restore this government to the way it was originally meant to be A GOVERNMENT OF THE PEOPLE, FOR THE PEOPLE, BY THE PEOPLE and not a government of the bureaucrats, by the bureaucrats, for the bureaucrats

    • David E

      Amen to that. One thing that also needs to be mentioned is that there are a lot of Ron Paul supporters who have posted that they will only vote for Ron and nobody else. I do not think they realize that by not casting their vote for Romney that they are helping to re-elect Obama.If Obama is re-elected he will finish off the job of destroying our country.

      I am quite sure that if you asked Ron Paul he would agree with me. Remember that he is a republican. Don’t get me wrong as I too am a Ron Paul supporter. He is what we need for our country and he has many really great ideas. The problem is that he simply cannot win the upcoming election in November. Don’t you think it would be better to elect a capitalist to replace this unknown Marxist with his record of destruction to our economy.

      At least with Romney we will still have a country that we recognize in 2016. I sincerely doubt if that will be the case if Obama remains in office. Here is a man who wrote in his book that he and Michelle often participated in American flag burning ceremonies. Here is a man who cups his hands at his crotch when the national anthem is played. Here is a man who goofed his oath of office. Did he really take it again later on as reported?

      What a great choice for a president. I truly believe that back in 2008 America the Beautiful should have been changed to America the brain dead. How on earth did this man ever get elected? Why on earth are there still people who will vote for him again?

      • Jeff

        No, I don’t think it would be better to elect a “capitalist” like Romney. He and his ilk are already well-represented through their thousands of lobbyists in Washington. They write the laws specifically for the benefit of people like Romney. You’re simply a tool of entrenched power. You keep saying Obama is a “socialist,” a “marxist,” blah, blah. WTF are you talking about. The economy was heading off a cliff when he took office. His policies stopped the bleeding and turned things around. What kind of a Marxist doubles the value of the NYSE in 3 years?

        Romney, like W before him, wants to lower taxes on the wealthy even further and he wants to deregulate the banks even more. Let’s remove all regulation and legalize the banks opening casinos with depositors’ money. We’ve already seen how that movie ended. You’ve been sold a bill of goods that all regulation is the same as socialism. It’s hogwash designed to convince voters to give more and more to those that already have everything.

        And why do you assume that those who disagree with you are “at the trough.” You think I get money from the government? You think that only people on welfare favor a social safety net. Who feeds you this nonsense? And why would you believe it?

        • David E

          Jeff, You fit the profile 100% for a paid misinformation operative who is working for the democrats. That said I can give you 1001 reasons why Obama should not be re-elected as president. Go to: http://www.conservativedailynews.com/2012/06/1001-reasons-to-vote-against-barack-obama-complete-edition/

          • Jeff

            I know, I know: communist, socialist, marxist, muslim, kenya, blah, blah, blah.

            What I really want to know is where to I send my invoice to get “paid” by the Democrats?

          • David E

            Jeff, try this address. I am quite sure that they can put you in touch with their internet monitoring group. Spend the money quickly as it won’t be worth very much if Obama is re-elected for a second even more disastrous term.

            Cook County Democratic Party
            134 N. LaSalle Street
            Chicago, IL 60602
            (312) 263-0575

          • Jeff

            Thank you. Maybe I’ll get combat pay for subjecting myself to the idiocy on this blog.

    • Jeremy Leochner

      The problem is all those things said and written about Obama are not true. And in the case of being Muslim irrelevant.

      • David E

        Everything written about Obama being a communist is true. Who the hell knows where he was born? Ask any computer graphic artist and you will be told that the posted birth certificate is fraudulent. My God, I bet if the democrats were to run charles Manson for president we would have the likes of you and Jeff saying that he never murdered anyone and it was all just a pack of lies.

        • Jeff

          There can be no clearer illustration of your insanity than your comparison of Obama to Manson. Comparing W to Bonzo the chimp is far more apt, and I’m sure you’d vote for W until Hell freezes over. Let me explain something. Your saying Obama is a Communist doesn’t make it true any more than my saying I’m a Rockefeller descendant makes it so. You are an insignificant little man who can’t stand that a Black man is president and you will go through all sorts of mental gymnastics to convince yourself you are not a racist.

          • David E

            Jeff, I did not compare Obama to Manson. I am sure that Obama is a lot more dangerous as he is capable of ruining not just a few but millions of good American peoples lives.

            My personal opinion of Bush is that he was not a great president. His main problem was that the democrats controlled everything during his last two years in office which stopped him from changing the direction of Fannie and Freddie. The well planned collapse of the housing market right before the election was of course one of the main reasons Obama won the election which saw millions of white Americans vote for him.

            As to my not liking a black man being in office, I recently donated $200.00 to a real full blooded black man called Allen West. Maybe you have heard of him? I also donated $200.00 to Sheriff Arpaio who has uncovered irrefutable evidence that your dear leader is a usurper. Go to youTube and watch the video of his team giving their report.

            By the way, here is a factoid for you: The term “fundamentally transform America” came from a speech given by Frank Marshall Davis who was Obama’s childhood mentor. Davis a card carrying member of the American Communist Party or ACP gave the speech to a group of his fellow communists. Davis also had ties to Soviet Russia.

          • Jeff

            I knew that would be your response, but you did compare the two. You didn’t say Obama was a psychotic mass killer, but the implication is that he is just as unfit to be President as Manson.

            As for Allen West, good luck with that. I can now see where you get your definition of “Communist.”

          • bonniewheeler

            Bush 2 was the most honest president since Reagan; What you saw was what you got. Nothing pretentious He made decisions according to what he thought was best for the country. Most of them were. He didn’t pander to the rich – Obama does that

          • Jeff

            I guess honesty is in the eye of the beholder. Bush wanted tax cuts because he wanted tax cuts. It didn’t matter if we were in surplus or in debt, affluent or in recession. The same prescription applied no matter the ailment. You can call that honesty or you can call it idiocy. The Iraq invasion? Honesty? We had inspectors on the ground in Iraq saying they could find no weapons of mass destruction. What did W and the right do? They trashed their own inspectors, implied they were either drunk or corrupt, pulled them out, and announced they “knew” where the weapons were. Remember the references to Hans Blitzed? Honest? To paraphrase Mitt Romney, “It wouldn’t be the word I would use.”

      • Jeremy Leochner

        1: There is no evidence beyond connections with communists that Obama is a communist. I have friends who are conservative and libertarian. That does not make me conservative or libertarian.

        2: The posted birth certificate is not fraudulent. People who believe conspiracy theories want to find inconsistencies in whatever evidence is presented to the contrary. The doctor who delivered Obama could come out and say it was him and people would say he was paid too. No amount of evidence will convince conspiracy theorists. There is just to much fear and anger to believe anything to the contrary.

        3: If the democrats were crazy enough to run Charles Manson everyone including me would be against it. For one thing it was long ago proven that Manson committed the murders, or rather planned and ordered them. At any rate the evidence involving Manson committing the murders is less then the evidence that Obama was born in this country. It is well known that Manson is guilty based on the evidence against him. Since the evidence in favor of Obama being born in America is even greater it just stands to reason that Obama was indeed born in America.

        • David E

          Jeremy, Interesting that you feel that you can make a statement when you cannot back it up. My wife is an expert computer graphics artist who does work for many companies world wide. She and every single one of the graphic artists she knows across the planet all say that the alleged birth certificate is not just a forgery but it is a very poor forgery.

          Go to YouTube and watch the video of sheriff Arpaio’s team giving their report. Had Obama been a republican he would have been out of office like dung through a goose.

          The fact that almost the entire media including Fox is being controlled and is reporting everything in Obama’s favor is in itself disgusting.

          The fact that many judges have refused to hear cases regarding Obama’s eligibility is really frightening.

          The fact that there are still idiots who will vote for Obama is is downright unbelievable.

          Here is a man who boasts in his book that he and Michelle participated in numerous American flag burnings and yet today he is our commander in chief.

          Here is a man who refuses to salute when the national anthem is played. He stands with his hands cupped over his crotch while everyone around him puts their hands over their hearts or gives a military salute.

          Yeah why don’t you go out and vote for him again. If he wins you will find out in very short order how very wrong your belief in him was. He is a communist who is purposely destroying the countries economy to aid in changing America into a communist country.

          Then maybe you are a Marxist – communist? Then you will indeed get what you want but I sincerely doubt if you will actually like the change.

          • Jeff

            If PRESIDENT OBAMA has been clever enough to fool the American people, Harvard, Columbia, INS, SSA, the State of Hawaii, NASA, and Col. Sanders, wouldn’t you think if he were going to forge a birth certificate it would be a good forgery? All along you’ve claimed he’s the cleverest criminal in history and now, suddenly, a botched forgery? How does this fit into the elaborate conspiracy fantasy you wingnuts have been using to jerk yourselves off for the past 3 years?

    • bonniewheeler

      Yes! Government is supposed to be for all people – not just the poor, not just the wealthy. Don’t bog the poor down with all sorts of restrictions and regulations and don’t steal money from those who earn (albeit they may be wealthy) and give to those who don’t
      America wasn’t built that way. Here’s a little story from early America: ” Davy Crockett advised the Senate that someone’s house had burned and money should be taken out of the treasury to help rebuild They did. A week later he was visiting another farmer who informed Crockett he would never vote for him again. He went on to explain to Crockett that the money he gave the burned out farmer was not his to give. It belonged to the taz payer.
      Our government does not seem to realize our tax dollars do not belong to them. All this free money thery are giving out for welfare and other things more frivolous, doesn’t they don’t have the right to give. . Let them go deep into their own pockets if they want to help people, but allow the people who pay taxes to decide which charity they would prefer to donate. The only thing that citizens money should be going to is defenseThat should be our tip priority, however, it has become the bottom of the list for the current president.

  • Jeremy Leochner

    Has anyone actually examined the actual document itself. That is not a forgery. Even Bill O’reilly a man not known for his strong support of Obama thinks the birther movement is wrong.

    Yeah fox news is reporting in favor of Obama. Have you seen fox news. They go after Obama no matter what he does or says.

    They refuse cases because the case has been proven. Obama has presented a long and short form birth certificate. Many people are just refusing to accept it.

    How easy is it to not vote for Obama when the only real opposition offered is Mitt Romney.

    I do not know what to make of that. All Presidents make mistakes as younger men. I am sure the flag burning was such an example.

    That thing about him and the national anthem was declared wrong. Go to fact check.org and see. Or go to politifact.

    Many people said that same thing in 2008. Why is he waiting. In his second term he will have less popularity, less time and less influence. And yet you say he is going to push a radical agenda that will fundamentally alter our nation. I do not believe that. And I am not a communist. I am a social democrat. There is a huge difference. Communists believe in total government control. I believe in a blend of regulation and competition. And I believe Obama is inclined towards that notion as well.

    • Jeremy Leochner

      My statement above is in reference to Dave E.

      • bonniewheeler

        Fox News have been voted ‘most fair’ for a reason – they are made up of Democrats, Independents, Republicans etc. They bring out the facts despite who it involves.

        • Jeff

          Who voted them that? The same viewers who were more likely than any other demographic to believe Saddam Hussein was behind 911? The more you watch Fox News, the less informed you become.

          • bonniewheeler

            Not according to the majority – Why not watch all of them? I usually research everything that I see on FN and other news media. I find that Fox has more detailed information. I have a habit of researching all the important news items that are on all the channels that I watch – I find a lot of them will cover for a political figure that they favor. Fox doesn’t do that. I like to watch them all but I mostly have to go to Fox and other informants to get the detailed info – that is both sides of an issue

          • Jeff

            I am sure it is possible to watch Fox and still remain informed by keeping your skepticism intact. But the people who watch Fox and Friends or Hannity and think they’re getting actual information are the real victims. There are some actual journalists there, but how often is the Ailes/Murdock bias inserted into straight news reporting. The biggest joke is when “liberals” show up on Fox to portray the Washington Generals while the show is set up to make someone like Anne Coulter look sane.

          • bonniewheeler

            Ann has the right idea and she has done well for herself financially. She can’t be too dumb to have accomplished all that she has. I disagree with some things she says but I do agree with much of what she has to say.

          • Jeff

            Intelligence is hardly the issue. It’s her duplicity and utter dishonesty that make her beyond the pale for me. I refuse to watch if she’s on as all she does is accuse her opponents of treason or other such crimes. Her ratings will not be aided by me.

      • Jeremy Leochner

        I think above all the problem with Fox News is that often the opinion and the news halves of the network seem or are lumped together. For instance Bill O”Reilly and Sean Hannity are featured on Fox News Fair and Balanced promos even though their shows are opinion shows. In regards to fox news accuracy I would always suggest the Daily Show. Whether you agree with Jon Stewart’s politics or not he can always be relied on to take Fox News to task. Specifically Jon Stewart did a segment regarding politifact and how they rated several statements that were made by numerous Fox News anchors and correspondents, not just on the opinion side but also the news side.

        • Jeff

          Jeremy:

          I agree but I suspect that the intersection of the sets of people who watch Fox and who watch The Daily Show is very small.

      • Jeremy Leochner

        Perhaps. But I just like recommending the Daily Show.

  • Bonnie Wheeler

    Not a small group at all Jeff This is one of many about the popularity of Fox
    “Fox News marks 10 years atop cable ratings RICHARD HUFF
    Monday, January 30, 2012
    Amid the day-long coverage of the Florida primary vote Tuesday, there also will be a little cheering in the halls at Fox News Channel.
    Not because of the vote, but because in the morning, when Nielsen releases ratings for Sunday, the network will notch its 10th consecutive year as the most-watched cable news network.
    “The boss said we’d be able to do this, and it’s happened,” says recently slimmed-down anchor Shepard Smith.
    Smith says being on top is great because that means he — and everyone else there — can simply focus on the product”.

    • Jeff

      I understand a lot of people watch Fox. I also understand a lot of people watch Nancy Grace. I question only how many Fox watchers also watch Jon Stewart.

      • Big Woody

        When the presentation is offensive and uncouth, I seldom find myself going back and watching a show again. Stewar’s presentation is one that shows no respect for anybody or anything as if his opinion is the only one with any validity. He leaves no room for debate as if all others are stupid and not worthy. Even with his most contiversial outbursts that have gotten him headlines, I cannot bring myself to watch his show for more than a few minutes and then turn him off as quickly as he turns me off. Disagreement is normal. But there is no excuse to be nasty about it.

        • Jeff

          He does a comedy show. He never claimed to be “fair and balanced.” You find no nastiness on Fox? You must not be looking very hard. Also, sometimes Jon Stewart’s approach is the only one that works to demonstrate the utter hypocrisy on the right. If you’re happy in the Fox News Bubble, stay there.

  • bruno

    Again it boils down to voting for the less of 2 evils…not a candidate for a solution. The system won’t allow it!

    • Deerinwater

      Hmm” Is it the system or voters not willing to stand behind their convictions and render their vote? Even a horse racing , it’s win, place and show. For a third party candidate to made a stellar showing in a general election affords such a candidate power and political equity that can be brought to bear, wielded and brokered.

      It’s only an “all or nothing” situation if you are the type of person that insist on immediate gratification and instant rewards. While it is know to any successful person, for one to succeed , “we prepare for tomorrows success today” we place ourselves in the position to win.

      If any win has to be contrived and outright bought, who really wins when we are focusing on sound leadership and the direction of the nation? In a nation of free men & women where there is more that unites us then divides us, this behavior fails to make good sense.

      It is the people that is suppose to have the power, that we in our foolishness, squander our opportunity and sell-out cheap is the failing of the people and not the system.

      Wild ideology? Well at one time the American people didn’t think so.

  • Big Woody

    As I read Mr Roberts article, all I could think of is an old black and white movie where the corrupt gang is outside shouting to us inside that “we must surrender and come out with our hands up. Resistance is futile. Nobody will get hurt if we surrender now. Your cause is lost” Yet we resist and sure enough a lone rider comes to the rescue. Was that lone rider Ross Perot or Ron Paul and we missed him or is there another, maybe with the carisma of Obama but with the message we the people want to hear out there, just over the horizon. Will this year’s elections and the Tea Party or even OWS motivate our hero to step forward. Is there another Moses, Gaundi, John Hancock, MLK or even John Galt out there waiting for our call to bring him in for our salvation? I believe there is and therefore I reject the article in it’s entirerty. I will not surrender, nor will I accept that all is lost to our fatally corupt politicians that are trying to destroy our system. We the People built this great nation and We the People can save it from the Hord that is tearing at our doors.

  • http://www.facebook.com/robert77581 Robert Allen

    The most common sense I have heard in all these replys were yours Big Woody and also the ‘truth’ of our current system. Until one of the ‘third’ parties begins to better organize at the grass roots level and elect Mayors,Governors,state reps,Senators,Congressmen, etc., putting up the ‘sacrifical cow’ every 4 years will never effect true change in the country. A start has been made, but unless Mr. Paul’s delegates can legitimately win the nomination at the convention, my choice will be for the ‘lesser of two’ evils-Romney, and in the interim continue to work to get true consitutional supporters at my local and state levels. Also, as a Christian, I realize I have dual citizenship and spiritually, my final desination is settled and my real COMMANDER-IN-CHIEF is in control, regardless of the outcome of an election in the USA…God Bless

    • http://none Charlie

      SO,,, Praise King Jesus for Salvation and Healing …. Acts 2:38…

    • Farleyagain

      Robert Allen, you are absolutely correct regarding the need to focus on local elections. As conservative Christians we also need to organize to avoid the fiascos we’ve had this round with multiple better candidates put up diluting our power over the “moderate” candidates.

  • http://Personalliberty Barbara

    This article is an insult. Obviously the author is living in the progressive fairy land. To advise people to stay home and not vote is more or less allowing the liar-campaigner-vacationing-golfing-whining-passing the buck-poor excuse of a president to stay in office. If there is one thing that MUST be done this election is to FIRE this lying loser. If Ron Paul supporters are stuck in the “all or nothing” mind set. They will no doubt throw a wrench in the election because their guy didn’t get the nomination. For Ron Paul to encourage this behavior shows me he is NOT ready to be a president. There IS a difference between progressive liberals and conservatives, just take a look at the mess the democrats have gotten us into. You can thank the liberals media for the Bush bashing that lead to the take over of our country by these liberals socialist. As a matter of fact you can thank the main stream liberal media and liberals pundits ( getting their script directly from the current White House) and writes like Roberts (the author of this insulting article) for the socialist take over by this inexperienced, amateurish administration. Obama and done a good job of dividing the country, Mr. Roberts, he doesn’t need your help. Don’t listen to this guy, get out and vote and send the present disaster in control packing back to where ever he came from.

    • Deerinwater

      Mr. Roberts is on the button to ask such a question as it WHY! ~ Why indeed would a hillbilly, hay shaker throw his support behind the mega rich, people that pay 14.5 % of their gross annual (1 to 3 million) earning in federal taxes while he is paying 17 to 23% on $36,000.00?

      Barbara say; ” If Ron Paul supporters are stuck in the “all or nothing” mind set. They will no doubt throw a wrench in the election because their guy didn’t get the nomination.”

      I would say; Clearly , it is Barbara that act

      So why is Barbara and people like Barbara willing to compromise their conviction in some feeble effort to save the election process while insisting the other voters and politicians be principled with convictions?

      If you can not step up and be counted and let your convictions be know how would you ever think any election process would be better for it and yield any outcome worthy of a Republic nation of self determined people?

      The desire to “win” at any cost is being very short sighted in a game that you can win the battle at the cost of losing the war.

      If you are a Ron Paul supporter, why much you vote for Mitt Romney? Why is it that you wish to win so badly you would uncut all the work Ron Paul and his supporters have done in showing the American people the errors of both parties as they both squander, pillage and plunder American resources and tax dollars on a global scale?

      Give Ron Paul the power he needs to broker a meaningful change of direction in federal politics and policy. Ron Paul can not do this without your help , support him with your write-in vote.

      Stand up and be counted November 2012, vote your convictions, offer America an example of a person of convictions and not someone willing to compromise their convictions for short term gains. ~ Send a shot across the bow of smug politicians and Capital Hill. We are not buying into their game anymore.

      • tesmith47

        I am not a ron paul supporter but,i agree with you, vote your convictions, i will be voting GREEN party , jill stein

        • bonniewheeler

          Wealth should be an asset, not a liability. Those who become wealthy by their own intelligence certainly has leadership qualities. However, I don’t like those who use their government offices to gain wealth as did Barney Frank and a few others.

      • Deerinwater

        I can’t help but believe that you are overlooking something,~ a lying, cheating thief could be referred to as clever, bright and smart. Where one has either the appearance of wealth or actually has wealth, from the outside appear much the same. Would that matter to you?

        How one obtain wealth or the appearance of wealth is again a subject of debate, does it matter that John McCain dumped his 1st wife while she was laid up in a hospital bed to marry a wealthy woman? That John Mc Cain or Raul Ryan “married” into wealth might make them “bright” but is this virtue in itself desirable in a president? ~ Does this money not earned but acquired seen as an asset in character or cunning?

        Bernie Madoff was seen as a very cleaver man until his activities were exposed. Both history and current events are loaded with stories of perceived wealthy clever man and women until one day they are exposed. It is then that you realize they are people void moral compass, cleaver as they may appear to be and unworthy your trust and loyalty.

        A person that has paid his or her dues and came up the hard way, engaging in commerce on a level playing field, not employing fraud, deceit, smoke , mirrors and magic tricks, but hard work and determination should take pride in their achievements and have little to hide from his fellow man if asked to do so in return for our loyalty,trust and “vote”.

        So why is it that Mitt claims of being cleaver in business matters is a sorted affair of unclear certainty while he offers us only two years of documentation yet expects our trust?

        Mitt Romney, could take 5 years off to work at a saw mill, making 5 dollars an hour, eating saw dust and crapping 2″X4″ and show us how he paid 19 % in income tax rather then 14.5% and still maintain 3 residence in the US and one aboard.

  • Dad

    Made you flinch!

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