The Damage Obama Has Done To Black Americans

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Hello, I’m Wayne Allyn Root for Personal Liberty. I’ve written many times here about what President Barack Obama is doing to the U.S. economy, to business owners, to Americans in general. But today I will look at what Obama is doing to black Americans and his own most loyal supporters. It is, in a word: unimaginable.

It all starts with Syria. Why Syria? Why now? Until Russia interceded, going to war in Syria seemed the most important thing in the world to Obama and his Secretary of State, John Kerry. They seemed desperate to go to war, at any costs.

But why? Syria has nothing to do with us. It is not threatening us. Its own war is a civil war with no “good guys.” How does America benefit from a war with Syria? Why did Obama suddenly decide a “red line” has been crossed when there are “red lines” all over the world, including the killing of Christians and the burning of 71 Christian churches in Egypt. Why is it so important to risk American lives to defend the Syrian rebels who are partners with al-Qaida, America’s sworn enemy? We didn’t go to war to avenge the murder of our own citizens at Benghazi, Libya, so why would we go to war to avenge al-Qaida deaths in Syria?

None of this makes any sense at all — until you realize it’s a massive cover-up: Obama’s WMD, weapon of mass distraction. Obama is desperate to cover up the facts about his dying economy and the damage he’s done to his own most loyal voters. Obama has destroyed the lives of the very people who consider him “the American idol.”

How bad is Obama’s economy? Forget the 7.3 percent unemployment rate that is reported by the government. That’s pure fraud and propaganda. That figure goes down only because hundreds of thousands of Americans drop out of the workforce. In other words, if you stop looking for work and go on food stamps and welfare, Obama says the unemployment number just got better.

The only truth about unemployment is found in the labor force participation rate of 63 percent. That’s the lowest in four decades. For men, it’s the lowest since record-keeping began in the 1940s. What this means is 37 percent of the able-bodied, working-age adults in America are not only not working, they’ve given up looking for work.

Even worse, an unimaginable percentage of those who are employed have only part-time jobs. Seventy-seven percent of the new jobs created since Jan. 1 are part-time jobs. That’s not good, folks. Studies show one in four part-time workers live in poverty, while only one in 20 full-time workers live in poverty. So millions of Americans under Obama who show up as “employed” are merely working their way toward poverty. And millions of others who have full-time jobs are working at McDonalds or are working as waiters or bartenders or janitors. Those are the only jobs left under Obama. The middle class is being slaughtered.

Here are the two most ironic points about this slow-motion train wreck called the Obama economy. Obamacare is the No. 1 culprit destroying real jobs. Business owners are done. No smart business owner in all of America will lift a finger to create a full-time, high-paying job with benefits. It just makes no economic sense anymore. So Obama’s signature achievement has not only created a part-time economy, but all those people in part-time jobs don’t have health insurance. This should be a “Saturday Night Live” skit. The man has created nationalized healthcare so that everyone loses his job and no one has health care. Insanity — unless your goal is to create an entire Nation of Americans living in poverty, dependent on government welfare.

Secondly, here’s the really sad, tragic and ironic fact of the Obama economy. Obama hurts the ones he loves. Obama’s policies are destroying the very people who elected and believed in him. It’s almost as if Obama is out to destroy his own voters. Let’s take a look at who is suffering the most from this Obama Great Depression.

Obama won the 2012 election with a razor-thin 51 percent of the vote. His biggest supporters were blacks (93 percent voted for Obama), Hispanics (71 percent), single women (67 percent), young people (60 percent) and those without a high school diploma (64 percent). This is the loyal foundation of Barack Hussein Obama. This is who made him President, without a single qualification except being a community organizer.

Now, let’s look at how Obama repays his loyal fans. New research out just last week proves that since 2009, income for black heads of households dropped by 10.9 percent. For Hispanic heads of households, it dropped by 4.5 percent. For single women head of households, it dropped by 7 percent. For young people (under age 25), it dropped by 9.6 percent. For those with a high school diploma or less, income dropped by 8 percent.

In dollar terms the numbers are even worse. Female incomes are down by $2,300 per year under Obama. Black incomes are down more than $4,000 per year. Hispanic incomes are down by $2,000 per year.

How about actual unemployment figures for Obama’s fans? We see the same results. Reported unemployment (a bogus figure) is 7.3 percent. But among blacks (93 percent of whom voted for Obama), it is an unimaginable 13.3 percent. Among Hispanics, it’s 9.4 percent. Among black youths, it’s 20.9 percent. Among teens, it’s 23.7 percent.

The black middle class is being destroyed. Black homeownership has slipped to the lowest level in decades.

But the worst statistic of all is the unemployment, plus underemployment, rate for college graduates under age 25: 18.3 percent. That means new college graduates (also big supporters of Obama) can’t find a decent full-time job in the Obama economy; at the same time, they are saddled with the highest student debt in history. That could be why we have the highest student loan default rates in history.

So what does a President, who couldn’t find a job if it hit him in the head, do to keep the masses of his own voters from revolting and rioting in the streets? Go to war.

Create a distraction. Make people look away from the scene of the tragedy. Create a “situation” that induces patriotism. Make the masses rally around the President. And if that “situation” happens to help unemployment by sending unemployed young people and minorities off to war, bingo! You’ve just hit the lottery.

That is the answer to the questions: Why Syria? Why now? How does this benefit America?

Obama’s war is a desperate attempt to keep his own most loyal supporters from noticing that his policies have ruined their lives and set their economic progress back decades. His policies have sent black Americans in particular hurtling back to the days of poverty and racial inequality.

Obama is desperate to keep his own voters from noticing he is the worst thing to happen to them in their lifetimes. His socialist policies don’t solve poverty, they cause poverty. And it’s no surprise. Socialism, income redistribution, big taxes, big spending, big unions and big government have caused poverty in every nation they’ve ever been tried. Obama, Mao Zedong, Josef Stalin, Fidel Castro, Huto Chavez. Same people. Same policies. Same results. They always hurt the masses. They always victimize their own voters. They always hurt the ones they claim to love. A sick, dysfunctional death spiral.

I’m Wayne Allyn Root for Personal Liberty. See you next week. Same time, same place. God bless America and God bless capitalism. It’s time to fight for them both.

Personal Liberty

Wayne Allyn Root

Wayne Allyn Root is one of America's leading Libertarian-conservative authors. Wayne's new book is The Murder of the Middle ClassWayne is a Capitalist Evangelist, serial entrepreneur, conservative media commentator, and proud champion of the middle class. He is a former Libertarian vice presidential nominee and Fox News regular. Follow Wayne on Twitter and visit Wayne's web site: www.ROOTforAmerica.com

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  • Victor Lawson

    Most intelligent people already knew this. Only those people that voted for Obozo specifically because he is 1/2 African (a racist vote) refused to believe it. A lot of black racist hatred towards whites because they don’t have jobs and innocent white people are being beaten and murdered because of Obozo’s policies that hurt black Americans. If you wonder how stupid people can be (?), don’t bother. Obozo was re-elected because of racism against whites and Obozo’s policies against blacks. Sounds pretty damn stupid to me.

    • Alex

      Not nearly as stupid as you sound, Vic…

      • FreedomFighter

        I see you are disciple of Hitler“Our strength lies in our intensive attacks and our barbarity…After all, who today remembers the genocide …?—Adolf Hitler
        Laus DeoSemper FI

      • hippybiker

        “This and no other is the root from which a tyrant springs;when he first appears he is a protector.”- Plato
        Now, you little worm: say something denigrating about Plato.

      • Bill

        Alex, you better be careful or your momma is going to take away your computer privileges’

      • Victor Lawson

        So Alex, you sound like another Fool Aid drinker, choose to ignore facts and make up your own. That is the epitome of stupidity.

        • WTS/JAY

          Don’t mind him, Victor, the simpleton voted for Obama, twice, so he’s deeply embarrassed. He’s just punish you for his stupidly.

    • Bill

      Good comment, Vic

    • FreedomFighter

      What is really going on? 2.5 billion bullets for DHS, Armored Troop carriers, millions of MRE, Body Armor, Military grade weapons for police forces and domestic government organizations, activated FEMA camps, TSA checkpoints, implosion of the economy. ramping up of racial hate, multiple attempts to disarm the American citizen, DHS declaration of returning VETS, Christians, Constitutionalist, Ron Paul supporters as TERRORISTS…wtf is happening?
      Takeover of the United States by …>
      The Endgame – FEMA/NWOhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1F9e2Q7HiOE&feature=player_embedded
      Laus DeoSemper FI

  • Christopher Paul Condon

    It is no accident that Obama is hurting his supporters. Socialism is based upon misanthropy. Socialists hate humanity. Schooled in Darwinism, which teaches that human beings are no different from cattle, socialists prefer the economic system that treats people like cattle: socialism. They despise capitalism because it lifts the standard of living of the human race which socialists despise.

    • Alex

      Wow. While not the most incoherent and not containing the most misspellings or assaults on grammar, this is among the stupidest posts Eye have EVER scene on PLD.

      Congratulations, Christopher—you are the Ultra-Maroon of the Year!

      • FreedomFighter

        Alex, I see you are a man of no limits “The difference between stupidity and genius is that genius has its limits.”—Albert Einstein Laus DeoSemper FI

        • Bill

          Good comment, Free

      • SavaDude

        Hey, genius, stupidest isn’t a word. If you are going to pick something apart and use spelling and grammar as a basis, learn some yourself.

      • Nadzieja Batki

        Alex, considering it is a STUPID who is giving Christopher Paul Condon the title. CPC pat yourself on the back, you are officially part of the group that is hated by a Dem/Prog/Leftist named Alex. Alex does not engage the brain so his comment material must come from his handlers and it still comes out as rubbish.

      • Bill

        We can expect no less from Alex, the wise one

      • WTS/JAY

        You’ve blown it many times, Alex.

    • Bill

      Good Comment, Chris

    • Nadzieja Batki

      O is still following the ideology of the Dems/Progs/Leftists/Marxists/Fabians and they are merging old and new ideologies to hunt human souls and of how useful any human is to the STATE. The United States is the last hold out because it still has people who believe in Individualism. O and his handlers will fail but that does not mean that the American people will not be injured. When the fight is with human predators or wolves the sheeple, the sheep, and even the sheepdogs get clawed and hurt.

    • TheOriginalDaveH

      What has Darwinism got to do with Socialistic failure? Your statement is fallacious, Christopher, and it just casts a bad light on those who champion Free Markets for you to say such things.

  • jandeen

    The only option for a thinking man is to follow conspiracy theory, because it isn’t.
    It was clear to most when Obama made his first appointments, Wall Street and the Chicago Gang, where his allegiance lie. Chaos in the Middle East is the policy, war being the only business left to 21st Century. To call a payoff placation is still not Socialism, however. Have we seen any infrastructure improvements or indications of a maturity guided by social conscience and a moral compass?

  • Stuart Shepherd

    Really, Mr. Root, I think you give Mr. Obama far too much “credit.” He’s NOT consciously aware of, or intelligent enough to realize, the ideological underpinnings of his actions or the consequences of them. He is simply a low-life slickster that knows how to talk a good streak, surrounded by other narcissistic sociopaths that don’t have a principle they could consciously identify either, doing what narcissistic sociopaths do best- try to be “in charge,” TELL (not show) everybody WHY they should be in charge including the use of denigration and lies about people who really DO have values and principles and character- ALL of whom COMPLETELY DO NOT KNOW WHAT THEY ARE DOING OR WHY THEY ARE DOING IT!!! Combine this with a populace whose morals and decency have been completely ripped out from underneath them and whose minds are completely turned to mush by PCism and the statistical eradication of the traditional backbone of america- the white race- from within and without- and America is toast. It is a foregone and a necessary conclusion and it is only a matter of time, and maybe not even such a long time.

  • peter

    Remember too that a huge number of his devout fans are not really unemployed. Many have chosen to deal drugs, prostitute themselves, steal cars, rob folks – crime things you know. They are unemployed but actually doing just fine at their newly chosen professions. Many are better off than they would be in real employment, the only drawback is their length of service will be short, but they are having fun while they still can. Beats a nine to five I guess. Where that all leads to in the end of course is up for discussion. A nation of criminals? Not a very sobering thought but Obama should care less whether he gets the nod from scholars or thieves. The good he has done will be interred with his bones and that should not take up any additional space at all. The evil? well that is up to our children to deal with.

    • podunk1

      The defining issue is deception (FRAUD). BLS does report people wanting a job @ 7,152,000, which pushes the Aug unemployment to 18,468,000 and 11.9% (a wobbly number). Reporting 11,316,000 unemployed @7.3% is simply false, based on their data (a matter of disclosure), but, that’s only part of the scam.

      The 12 year average (1997/2008) workforce to population ratio was 66.54%, which indicates August would be around 163,651,000, not 155,486,000, indicating those off the u/c list would be 8,165,000 not 7,152,000 looking for a job. Arguably, 11,316,000 (7.28%) were unemployed on comp,8,165,000 (5.25%) for their total of 19,481,000 (12.53% JOBLESS,
      while 23,470,000 (12.53%) were “laid off” almost 1 day per week. 42,951,000 (27.62%) citizens are awash in various forms of joblessness and economic hardship, while our pathological traitors in DC are fighting to “legalize” 11 to 30 million criminal aliens who are evading taxes, ID thieves, etc.plus their tax evading criminal employers! Stuff citizens find themselves in jail for – with their property seized – and basically no rights !

      Cutting a 40 hr. workweek is identical to cutting the workforce, productive output, earnings, and tax revenue thereon by 20%! BLS said the average hours were 34.4 hours for the end of 2012. If 144,170,000 worked 34.4 hour instead of 40 hours an equivalent 23,470,000 jobs were lost (15.1%) which would boost potential unemployment to 27%!

      The 34.4 hour thing only appears in 2012 & 2013 other than a BLS 1999 article noting it changed from 38.7 hours to 34.4! I doubt there’s any credibility in anything we’re told! Part time work is taking over in the USA!!!

      Colorado threw their tyrants out of office! What are we waiting for???

  • Peter

    When Vladimir Putin is doing more to keep America out of an unwarranted military action than the US President is, it’s time for the American people to take a very deep breath and ask, “What the &*^% is happening here?”

    • Bill

      Good analogy, Peter

  • CCblogging

    Barack Hussein Obama doesn’t give a rip about anyone unless they are Sunni Muslims just like himself.

  • FreedomFighter

    “Our lives begin to end the day we become silent about things that matter.”—-Martin Luther King
    Blacks need to speak out and not be silent about what Oblamer is doing
    Laus DeoSemper FI

    • NC

      FF. they did speak out in 08 and 12! Which was a belief in 2008 that Obama or anybody could do a better job than the one done from 2000-2008 by that white dude! And again in 2012 because the figures indicated he had in fact done so by stopping the massive job losses by month and getting out of a costly war among other things!
      BTW, they were joined in by some 60,000,000 white folks! THAT’S HOW YOU SPEAK OUT! YOU HELP PUT YOUR MAN IN THE OVAL OFFICE! THAT’S HOW A MINORITY IS HEARD! IT JOINS A MAJOR PARTY AND DOES WHAT IT CAN INSTEAD RUNNING TO A BACKWOODS SITE AND SCRATCHING THE BACKS OF THE REST OF THE 2% ERS HERE AND CRYING “FOUL”!!

      • TheOriginalDaveH

        Mob Rule.
        Imagine that, Folks. NutCase wants to make your personal choices while at the same time SCREAMING at you. How fun.

  • Dave

    Facts to back up W.A.R’s assertions? NAHHH… why bother….
    Of course Congress has nothing to do with the lack economic recovery at all… Its all Obama.
    Funny how Obama won with a bigger margin that Bush did over Kerry and dumb conservatives considered the bush victory a “mandate”
    Amazing what BS propaganda can do… and W.A.R is full of it as usual.

    • SavaDude

      Whats more amazing is that the failures of the current leader are still not acknowledged as long as we can still talk about what an idiot the last guy was. That exempts the current guy from his own failures. Remarkable….

      • smilee

        Bigger margin than Bush, yes, but he ranks with the five largest election vote totals in our history in that they won two or more terms with over fifty percent of the vote totals in each election and they are Jackson, FDR, Eisenhower, Reagan and Obama and that is not no propaganda that is fact. PEW research polls taken recently still rate him as the most popular leader in the world today. so it is not only in this country were the majority have supported him but polls all over the world see him as the best leader and that is not propaganda either, propaganda is what we see so much of from so many on here.

        • Warrior

          What was that term he used again? Oh yes, “democratic republic”. I wonder if he got that question correct when tested for his “constitutional law degree”? LMAO! More from the “stooges”.

          • smilee

            What you say takes nothing away from the truth I gave so what is your point???.

        • Don 2

          “Obama…..the most popular leader in the world.” What world would that be?

          Sept. 6-8, 2013 FOX NEWS POLL of Registered Voters +/- 3%

          U.S. More of Less Respected Around The World Today Compared to 2008.

          ……………………..Now………………..2012
          More………………14%…………………29%
          Less……………….48%…………………37%
          Same……………..36%…………………32%

        • WTS/JAY

          smilee: Bigger margin than Bush, yes, but he ranks with the five largest election vote totals in our history in that they won two or more terms with over fifty percent of the vote totals in each election and they are Jackson, FDR, Eisenhower, Reagan and Obama and that is not no propaganda that is fact.

          Big deal, what good is having the five largest election vote totals when he is completely incompetent, and not fit for the position of president; which doesn’t say much for the dumb-bells who voted for the incompetent nincompoop, twice! So it doesn’t matter to you that he’s incapable of fixing the economy, the only thing that matters to you is that he got the most votes? What kind of a moron are you?

          • smilee

            Your opinion, inaccurate and means nothing!!!

      • Warrior

        Dave makes a valid point. Congress can “Defund Now”!

      • NC

        SAVADUde, how would you describe our countries economic and foreign affairs(wars) condition when Obama took office? When explaining to the people why he does things he has to remind the people WHAT IT WAS LIKE we he started and what he is trying to correct!! Are you also in denial of the fact that he started with a flat and getting flatter economy and two unpopular expensive wars!
        What other incoming President has EVER faced those conditions?? Add to that the fact that he has faced strong opposition for most of his time in office! In the face of that the stock market has regained much lost ground from the 6547 he started with! 500,000 job loses a month have ceased! Job growth is slow but way the hell better than above mentioned losses! Housing prices are recovering! DEATHS AND COSTS OF BAD WARS ARE DECLINING! IF YOUDON’T SEE THAT CHANGE IT IS ONLY BECAUSE YOU DON’T WANT TO SEE IT!
        BTW, THE LAST GUY WAS AN IDIOT! HE BLEW A 91% APPROVAL RATING WITH PRE-Obama POLICIES ! NUFF SAID!

        • TheOriginalDaveH

          NutCase says — “In the face of that the stock market has regained much lost ground from the 6547 he started with!”.
          When Obama took office the Dow Jones Industrials were at 8077. More importantly, the Dow was over 11,000 about the time that Obama was being projected to win the election. Much of the downturn was caused by investors panicking about his election.
          Since September of 2008 (when it was becoming likely that Obama would win) the Dow has gone up about 36%. During that same time period the Money Supply has grown over 100%. In other words, the increase in the Dow is illusory as it is based in dollars, the supply of which has increased dramatically.

          NutCase says — “500,000 job loses a month have ceased”.
          When Bush took office the number of people employed was 137,778,000. By January of 2008, the number of employed people was 146,378,000. In January of 2009, when Obama took office, the number of employed had dropped to 142,153,000. So during Bush’s Presidency, the number of employed people increased by 6% midterm, but declined to an increase of only 3% by the time Bush left office.
          The number of employed now is 144,170,000. So under Obama it has increased by 2 million people or a little over 1%. What did it cost to increase that employment under Obama? It cost $2 Trillion in Stimulus aid. So each new job under Obama has cost us $1 Million. It would have been much cheaper just to give those people about $50,000 a year.

  • me

    It didn’t matter he was incompetent just like hillary said he was in the 2008 campaign. People vote for all the wrong reasons. In the 1992 election women voted for clinton because they thought he was good looking. Sure is enough ignorance in elections anymore. Most people don’ know anything about issues and vote for all the wrong reasons.

  • brownstoneconstr

    the brother from another mother only helps himself. where is the white obama. we’ve seen enough of his black side.

    • real talk 1

      Just where have you seen his black side what has he done for blacks he takes his orders from white elite liberals . How else could he amass his own fortune?

    • real talk 1

      Just where have you seen his black side what has he done for blacks he takes his orders from white elite liberals . How else could he amass his own fortune?

  • 4lifeandfreedom

    It is amazing that so many people, even Christians, were overcome by the rhetoric, toothy grin, and hope and change promises of the “one” who has defaulted on all that he espoused and voted him into office, so the rest of us who saw him as he was from the beginning could suffer the consequences.
    Bet it would be difficult to find many admitting to voting for him, just as one could not find them admitting to voting for Clinton.
    We are where we are because men are more interested in being entertained, rather than researching and gaining insight into God’s Word and what He has to say about everything. Just look at the filled stadium stands for any sport!
    Remind you of the “fall of Rome?”
    Praying for a “Saul Damascus Road conversion” for the idiots who are our leaders would be a good, fresh beginning.

    • peter

      Reminds one seriously of the fall of Rome when we consider how those in power then offered the plebs a circus in the form of entertainment in the Coliseum as we are today offered the same in our stadiums throughout the world. These were and are distractions to ensure that our minds are occupied with matters of little importance whilst the elites wreak their malicious havoc and plunder all and sundry throughout the world. Humanitarianism has nothing to do with the real agenda of the politicos.
      Think Obama really cares about you? Wake up, wherever you are and remember politicians are all the same and are indoctrinated into fulfilling the will of the elites and certainly not of the people. Those politicians who really care never get anywhere near the positions of power in order to make a difference. That is why people lose it and become violent. The saying goes;- If you can’t lick them join them! That is absolutely correct. Corruption is addictive and even afflicts the well intended.

    • Nadzieja Batki

      Maybe the simple reason that these “Christians” voted for O was because they were and are not Christians.

      • real talk 1

        Maybe wannabees huh ?

  • KG

    Mr Root, our present economic condition didn’t begin on Jan 20, 2009. Most of the economic chaos that we are experiencing started on Jan 20. 1981. While many people here may remember the seemingly ‘good’ economic period of 1981 to 1988 let us not forget what was really happening during that time.

    While the Reagan years are reminisced as a period of ‘prosperity’, most of that prosperity came at the cost of average Americans. On Aug 5, 1981, Reagan showed what he though of average workers when he fired the PATCO strikers. A crippling blow to the gains that organized labor had given to average workers in America. Many old-timers in the Union will tell you that there should have been a general strike. Nevertheless, American participation in unions have dropped ever since; not because of people rejecting the good wages and benefits of union work but due to propagandization and out-right extortion and fear mongering that conservatives like to heap upon the shoulders of working people. Selling our manufacturing to the lowest bidder – first to Mexico, then to China when Mexican workers became too expensive – Spending inordinate amounts of money on a military – industrial complex – Destroying Unions by making employees “Associates”. It was these actions that have laid the creaking foundations of our current America.

    • SavaDude

      So what Reagan did what, 32 years ago, exempts this guy from any responsibility that he has for not leading us out of it?
      Sounds like people will always hate one side or the other, and love one side or the other regardless of their failures.

      • KG

        If someone wanted you to build a house, but took all of your tools away, how could you do it? The ‘tool’ of shared prosperity through Union membership was the primary ‘tool’ used to end the Great Depression. And without a general prosperity among average Americans, America will continue to suffer. America is great when her workers are great. The working class is the actual “job creators”.

      • KG

        If someone wanted you to build a house, but took all of your tools away, how could you do it? The ‘tool’ of shared prosperity through Union membership was the primary ‘tool’ used to end the Great Depression. And without a general prosperity among average Americans, America will continue to suffer. America is great when her workers are great. The working class is the actual “job creators”.

        • Nadzieja Batki

          You, cagey, would sit and whine and plot how to steal from another human being. Any normal human being would have a spare set of tools even if they were mismatched, a bit rusty but usable or make do till the “tools” could be replaced or borrowed or if the human was handy would make some if they had the skills and the materials.

          • Warrior

            A typical stooge is kg. Won’t pay his “brothers” the “going rate” for work on his own house. Don’t bother responding comrade, I “play” in your arena!

        • SavaDude

          And yet again, you fail to answer my point. That is not unusual.
          So workers create jobs? Then lets get rid of all of the investors, officers, innovators, and entrepreneurs and see how many jobs there are for workers.

          • smilee

            Of course not but that is not the point, the point is unions create balance and good managements are not hindered by them. We did not have all these wage subsidy welfare’s before Reagan who knew if you destroy that balance that worked real well for the country as a whole you had to then create these welfare programs to compensate for the loss of wages and benefits that has been our reality since Reagan, We now have earned income credits (actual dollars to the underpaid by these programs) child care subsidies and on and on and on for working people. We did not need these programs before these organized efforts to destroy unions and thus upsetting this balance that worked so well. This indirect welfare to businesses is far costlier that direst welfare to individuals and the corporate propaganda on this has dumbed you so you cannot see to this reality.

          • SavaDude

            And that is the SECOND time you havent answered my point.
            Care to go for three?

          • smilee

            You do not have a point to answer that is in your imagination

          • SavaDude

            so much for constructive discourse.

          • Bill

            Hi Sav,
            And don’t forget the risk takers willing to put their money where their mouth is. The entrepreneurs should be our heros.

          • real talk 1

            You have it.

        • Dale H Brown

          The Unions were formed back in the 1890’s not the 1930’s ,while the Unions did help the working man, WWII got the people out of the depression, not the Unions –check the history for the truth–I lived through that depression as a child and saw what my Father and Mother did to survive and feed us kids–it could have been worse–

          • WHITE WOMEN EVERYWHERE

            100% correct, BRAVO!!!

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Unions did not help the average working man — only those who were members of the coercive Unions. Unionists can only achieve their higher compensations at the expense of other people — the non-Union workers, or the consumers.
            WWII did not get us out of the Great Depression. We got out of the Great Depression because Government dramatically cut their spending after the war.
            http://mises.org/daily/6424/The-HooverRoosevelt-Depression-Revisited
            http://www.libertyclassroom.com/war/

          • Dale H Brown

            The unions did get a shorter work week and shorter work days back when they first started , I remember the 9 hour days and 6 day weeks my father worked for the small pay he received –unions were for the member of that trade or skill, so it was is a natural part on business for the contracts they were able to negotiate–because of those contracts non members pay got increases also ,it forced the businesses to pay better —-I really don’t care what your links say , I may look at them , but I do remember what happened during WWII and the pay increases most people got due to working in shipyards and for the War effort–
            I have read much info on this type of blog , I don’t believe a lot of it , but I can believe most of what I saw and lived –everyone has an opinion and they don’t always agree , but I do know that for the purpose the unions were started they did help the working man, the problem was when the thugs took over , it made a very good thing into a bad thing, Just as most of the unions are today –such as that thug that is president of the A.FofL–CIO—

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Dale says — “The unions did get a shorter work week and shorter work days back when they first started”.
            The trend was towards more productivity, and shorter work weeks. The Unionists were just along for the ride.
            http://mises.org/freemarket_detail.aspx?control=511
            Unions have never been necessary for the betterment of working conditions. Their benefits to the average workers are the stuff of myths. Whatever gains come to the Union workers are paid for by the non-Union workers or the consumers.
            http://mises.org/daily/3553

          • Dale H Brown

            I guess you feel like arguing about the subject , I don’t have time to for that, nor the desire–I did look at your links , I did see what you base you posts on , all academic educated folks that probably never had a job that required them to work with their hands and brains too –I have a couple of them in my family also —
            The only thing I can actually go on is what I experienced , saw and lived , during my Father’s working years and my working years –that’s all I can tell you and most of my experiences disagree with the authors that wrote the books you put so much credibility on .All I can say is being in a Union when they formed the Local at his work place helped my Father earn more than when there was no union. The Union I belonged to also made my pay better and more benefits. However I have never bought into a lot of the stuff that a lot of those thugs thought up to force unions on anyone or any other unfair practices –I have my own brain and I think for myself. so for me fair is fair , wrong is wrong and that’s it .
            From your posts to me I would think you are anti–union , are you ?? And why are you if you are??Just curious

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Very. They are violent people who gain their wage increases at the expense of everybody else. And Government gives them a Free Pass because Governments are basically just ruthless Gangs of people who will use whatever means available to feather their own nests, not unlike Unionists.
            I would take the educated opinions of academics who study large collections of data over your personal anecdotes any day of the week, Dale.
            I would ask you some tough questions, Dale, but you indicated that you don’t want to argue, so I won’t bother.
            Those who would like a more in-depth treatment of the History of Union Violence should pick up a copy of this book:
            http://www.alibris.com/search/books/qwork/6925650/used/Union%20Violence%3A%20The%20Record%20and%20the%20Response%20by%20Courts%2C%20Legislatures%2C%20and%20the%20Nlrb

          • Nadzieja batki

            So why are you pro union considering that they are the ones who created the shortages of jobs in America and sent the companies overseas.

          • Dale H Brown

            The Unions created shortages and jobs overseas?? You mean because Union workers were paid at a higher rate and had better benefits ?? Evidently the Corporations decided they would rather pay next to nothing for their products –and because of that , Americans got lower grade items —Just as Walmart today has , most made in China and other countries that produce cheap stuff that does not last–
            Myself I prefer American made products and always try to buy them —but it is not possible now a days–
            Am I pro Union?? Not in all things –but I did retire from the IBEW– questions???

          • smilee

            Thugs are always were the money is and for a while when unions had money they had some crooks is what thugs really are and today they do not and the crooks (thugs, TODAY CALLED WHITE COLLAR CRIMINALS) today reside in the corporate board rooms but they have a lot more money than unions ever did combined and today have lobby power way over the unions and white collar crime is seldom prosecuted while a lot of crooked labor union leaders when they had money and did go to jail. Today that seldom happens as there is no money in unions so the crooks have abandoned them. I was in the work force from 1962 through 2003 and shop steward for thirty five years and never saw the members interests not addressed but remember many times those who got fired etc did so because the firing etc was just and they could not be helped by the unions and that is a reality more common than workers whom keep their jobs because they were fired without just cause. The corporate propaganda of course says other wise gut a small number of crooks does not define the union movement as the vast part of it is not involved in crime and works hard for its members and this is what I consistently have personally witnessed over the past 50 years. As long as unions stay weak and lack money they are not going to be as effective as they once were but that is not because they are crooks or thugs as the union haters wish to call them

          • Dale H Brown

            Smilee,
            I never said that Unions were all crooks or thugs ,if they had been I would never have joined a Local –but we both know that there some of them in the higher echelons of the National and International parts of the different Unions —
            AS I did say to TH O Dave, being a Union member for my Father and for me , was a very good thing, more money and more benefits than on a non-union job– Who wouldn’t like that ??
            According to Dave’s info in the links he provided , Union members took away from Non Union members–I do not believe that at all –I don’t see how that could be actually–
            To me if there was a job that was Union and a person was qualified to do the work that the contract was for , then knowing it would give him/her better pay and benefits , they would apply for a job at that place and be a member of that local.
            I know when I was working , if before I was a member of a Local , and the Local was hiring permit men , I jumped at the chance to work on that job. To me it was common sense. and I gladly paid the dues required–
            I did not and never felt I was taking anything away from a non union person—but I guess Academia sees things in a different light—

          • smilee

            I did not mean to infer that you said unions were all crooks or thugs as I know you did not. I Meant to express my opinion to many here. I agree with you and very very seldom find anything to agree with, with davy.and certainly nothing to do with unions as he has a very perverted take on them,

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Dale says — “According to Dave’s info in the links he provided , Union members took away from Non Union members–I do not believe that at all –I don’t see how that could be actually”.
            When a Union worker coerces a higher than market wage, Dale, where do you think the company gets the money? They are in business to earn money, typically about 5% return for mature businesses. When they pay the Unionists more they would either have to give up their 5% return on their money, or they have to do something else. If they can’t make a decent ROI, then why would they bother with the headaches of running a business? So they must raise prices (if they can) which hurts the consumers; or they must lower wages to their non-Union workers, or lay enough of them off to make up the difference, which hurts the non-Union workers; or they must find another more profitable way to get a return on their investments which may include moving out of the country, which hurts consumers (less competition, higher prices) and their former workers.

          • Bud Wood

            Your comment that “Thugs are always where the money is” is a great observation on the federal system of Welfare/Warfare”.

          • smilee

            The conversation was about unions and job providers not government and our corporate job providers have been very successful in the last 30 years in getting their people in office and through them getting the government to create these welfare programs which are now for working people and intended to subsidize the wages and benefits of employees in these low underpaid non union jobs that have become so prevent with changes in labor laws that make it hard for unions to be successful in organizing and if they are not successful then wages and benefits go in the toilet and welfare sky rockets which is what has happened in the last 30 years. You vote for your representatives and as long as the voters vote based on the corporate propaganda and give them the legislators that cater to them which gives you this corruption and the welfare we now have . It is up to we the people whom we put in office and we put in the ones beholding to the big corporations.and the welfare that benefits only them.

          • smilee

            Your dead wrong davie, unions balanced the economy between the have and have not’s. Today government does that at the expense of taxpayers by subsidizing the wage and benefits of the employer’s of the all low paid workers of which is so common today. I do agree world war II did get us out of the great depression or the second dip of it. but unions then kept it balanced which balance has been destroyed since the eighty’s. It was war spending that helped get us out of it and after the war it was good wages allowing for large consumer spending to keep it going and balanced. Those of us who lived the good life under unions understand that those of you on the outside looking in are jealous of our good fortune and our wise decision to be union..

          • smilee

            I did live the history and retired in 2003 and they did a lot for those of us still union and where I worked I now get a $1000.00 a month more in company pension than my non union counterparts where I worked do. More SS as I had higher wages and that is just in retirement and says nothing about what they did for the members all the years I worked there (40.5 Years). Now we have wage and benefit welfare’s we never had before 1986, wages before that were livable and the difference between the wages of the rich and poor and underpaid has not been this great since just before black Friday in 1929 then people went to unions for solutions but changes in the organizing and other labor law make it risky for people to join unions today and now lobbing by corporate america has seen to the additional welfare programs that people now have to go to to survive and in the thirties it was to the unions and congress for fair labor law and since the eighty’s that has reversed The difference today is the taxpayer pays a part of the wage and benefits that when unions were strong the companies paid for and now they stiff the public and people are blaming unions and not corporations who lobbied hard for this so they could stiff the taxpayer and laugh all the way to the bank with their savings at your expense.

          • Don 2

            I retired from management, and my pension benefits exceed those offered to the union members. Do you want to explain that?

          • Smilee

            I compared mine with my non union counterparts where I worked, not the management employees who were a small number by comparison and whom did get more retirement benefits but that did not extend to the bulk of the non union employees not in management. Management is way overpaid too, In 1965 our CEO made $30,000.00 and when I retired in 2003 he was making 7 million and in 1965 that was a ratio of 7:1 and well over a 100:1 in 2003 and they also raised their retirement benefit along this amount and could afford that as since about 1980 they started reducing the amount they paid non union employees and took that savings for themselves. Management today is way over paid and still do pay union members on the national average $800.00 a month more than their nonunion employees and more retirement benefits as well. I think you know that comparing any employee to management personal is not a fair comparison as they all are over paid now and I suspect that is why yours is more.

        • Bill

          Kg,
          It’s just like your famous union saying, “The longer it takes, the more we make”

        • Frank Kahn

          The tool of shared union prosperity? Unions don’t share their prosperity with others, it is all about their personal greed.

        • Bud Wood

          Wrong. The working class does the work (in most cases). Job creation is not done by workers; job creation is implemented by those who take the risks of building businesses.

          It is obvious that you have a total misconception of free enterprise. Just like those running the Soviet “workers’ paradise” did.

        • Bud Wood

          If you wanted to build an automobile or a sailing ship or etc., the tools would come from entrepreneurs’ investments, not from any shared prosperity of union membership.

        • TheOriginalDaveH

          If that’s true, KGB, then start your own businesses. It’s as simple as that.

      • smilee

        You can’t lead what refuses to follow, cooperate and compromise with you as the blockade we now have in the US House in a GOP who can not even get along with each other makes it impossible for Obama or anyone else to make progress, These are all solvable problems but as long as its my way or the highway in the house then that will not happen. Too many GOP today wish to destroy the fed gov rather than fix its problems by being .problem solvers and rather have chosen to be the problem.

        • SavaDude

          A true leader could find ways to unite even fragmented parties and work toward solving problems. I understand what you are saying, but at the same time I find it to be a really weak argument for the massive failures and excuses of this administration. This guy has the power to heal this nation on so many different levels, and we still hear him playing the blame game, the spin game, and the shell game that makes him no different from any of the other failures that came before him.. And as long as there are those that simply loathe the other side, the excuses will continue to fly in order to support the failures of whomever you support.

          • smilee

            Just your opinion and I disagree. The blame game is a cop out and is only real if what is being blamed is a false but when it reflects reality it is not blame it is reality and needs to be recognized as such and not dismissed and that is why you are copping out. You have this confused. There has never been such an organized effort to undermine a president’s efforts Since Lincoln in our history and every time he opens his mouth 10 falsehoods about what he said are almost instantly raised in our instant means of communication today by those whom are hell bent in trying to be sure he always fails and they have only been partially been successful and the more they become frustrated with that fact the lower they sink in their responses to him they felt that in 2012 they could easily blow him away but the public was not buying their BS.

          • SavaDude

            SO that doesnt apply to blaming Bush, or Reagan, then. Got it.

          • Don 2

            And now the public is beginning to learn not to buy Obama’s B.S.

          • smilee

            The same was being said on here before the 2012 elections and they were proven wrong so there is no reason to believe the bs your throwing out here either.

          • Don 2

            Oh, I think Obama’s continuous drop in the polls is reason to believe liberalism is a complete failure.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            What?

          • Frank Kahn

            Yes, smirky, every time he opens his mouth his administration and the media twist his words to mean something different. If you take his words, literally, then he says really bad crap. Eventually, this nation will recover from its stupor and expel the disease that is liberal tolerance an equivocation. Government policies are destroying the economy, not Bush, not Reagan, all policies. Obama is no better than Bush, and in most instances he is worse. As long as Obama blames everything on someone else, he is a lying b*stard. Time for him to accept responsibility for the destruction of everything this nation was founded on. And he should start by getting on his knees and begging God for forgiveness for his satanic moves against Christians around the world.

          • smilee

            Congress writes the laws and the president either signs off or it or rejects it and Obama has not vetoed anything and congress has passed almost no laws and until they do Obama can administer nothing other than what Congress already has given him so what IS WRONG WITH OBAMA TELLING IT LIKE IT IS AND BLAMING THE DO Nothing congress AS THEY ARE THE ONES Obstructing everything so nothing gets done. It is you blaming Obama for things he has not done that is your biased take and it appears it is because of your hate of him and hate always blinds good judgement..

          • Frank Kahn

            Wrong, frowner, there are many things that Obama has done that are destructive and none of it requires congress. Maybe you need to refresh your memory on what has actually passed in congress. The PPAHCA, for one is so destructive that it will destroy the entire workforce as we now know it. His stimulus spending was billions on billions of wasted money given to his pet projects and unions. He is so racist that it is surprising that he has not been lynched for his bigotry. He is so anti-Christian that God will probably simply laugh at him when he approaches. He refuses to allow the implementation of immigrations laws to eliminate the millions of illegals that are destroying the wages in the country. He murders thousands of sovereign citizens of other nations. He has no concept of the value of capitalism. He spends billions of dollars supporting Muslim terrorist organizations. He uses agencies to put forth regulations that cripple many businesses. He either lies or obfuscates on every issue he is confronted with. He raised taxes on everyone when he said it would only be on the top 2%. Only those with incomes over $250K would see an increase. He refuses to negotiate on the deficit. He insists that congress raise the debt limit so he can continue his drunken sailor spending. He insisted that queers be honored as normal so his getting a BJ from his boys will be acceptable. He thinks that Islam was instrumental in creating our nation. He pretends that the government, somehow, created everyone’s businesses.

            GO AHEAD, GIVE ME AN EXAMPLE OF SOMETHING THAT THE JACKASS HAS DONE, OR PROPOSED THAT IS BENEFICIAL TO THE NATION.

          • Smilee

            Your buying into the far right propaganda rhetoric and then you of course you are in denial of all he has done so as long as your blinded by that I cannot make you see the good he has done. You totally mis-characterize the man and .and see him only as you wish him to be and not what he really is.

          • Frank Kahn

            BLAH BLAH BLAH, in other words you have nothing. I don’t buy into anything, I look into what is actually happening, I read his EO’s, I listen to his speeches. He is pathetic. He has nothing good to say and no working idea how to fix the economy.

          • Bud Wood

            It is somewhat evident that the policiesof bigness and collectivism will produce a federal “implosion”. Doesn’t seem that the federal system can survive much longer. And that’s good.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            No Government can outperform the voluntary actions of citizens freely trading. All Governments can do is transfer the wealth from one productive class of people to another unproductive class of people. The only way we can get a robust economy is to get Government the Flock out of it.

        • Don 2

          We don’t want Obama’s type of progress. We don’t want compromise with Obama. Conservatives have nothing in common with the Democrat/Communist party. We need to defeat these people, not compromise with them. Compromise is a one-way street with Democrats/Communists. Americans are better off with dysfunction in Washington. Dysfunction inhibits Obama’s destructive agenda.

          • smilee

            WE!! you have a turd in your pocket? The majority are not included in your idea of WE!! You are on the losing side remember!!

          • Don 2

            smilee, the tide looks to be changing. People are now living and experiencing the utter failure and false utopia of liberalism…..no jobs and no future for them or their children, only massive debt, poverty, and a loss of freedoms.

            If I had a turd in my pocket, you’d be right here next to me.

        • TheOriginalDaveH

          Governments can’t produce real jobs or create good economies. They can only get in the way of the real producers in the private sector. We are seeing the results of Government meddling right now.
          Government doesn’t create Wealth, Government consumes Wealth.
          Only those people, who refuse to learn and think, can not see that.
          http://library.mises.org/books/Kel%20Kelly/The%20Case%20for%20Legalizing%20Capitalism.pdf

        • Frank Kahn

          The biggest problem with the fed, is its size. Until you realize this, nothing can be fixed. Obama has no ideas for improving the economy. Why would we approve something that is bad?

          • smilee

            Sure it can be fixed but not if you have the tea party in the house blocking every fix there is, doing nothing as they are doing, will never get it fixed Obama can do nothing until the bill is passed and given to him to sign. That is not happening.

          • Frank Kahn

            SURE IT CAN BE FIXED, AS SOON AS LIBERALS ARE ELIMINATED FROM THE WORLD. GOVERNMENT SIZE IS NOT REDUCED BY INCREASING REGULATIONS. IT IS NOT REDUCED BY ADDING THOUSANDS OF IRS JOBS TO MANAGE THE PPAHCA. If Obama, or the democrats actually introduced legislation that reduced government size and spending, maybe something would get passed.

          • Smilee

            Your so totally lacking in knowledge about these things that paying attention to anything you say is ridiculous.

          • Frank Kahn

            I DONT KNOW SMUDGY, YOUR LACK OF FACTS IS MAKING IT IMPOSSIBLE FOR ME TO DETERMINE IF YOU KNOW ANYTHING AT ALL. YOU SIMPLY MAKE STUPID PERSONAL ATTACKS AND NEVER ADDRESS THE ACTUAL ISSUES.

          • Frank Kahn

            I DONT KNOW SMUDGY, YOUR LACK OF FACTS IS MAKING IT IMPOSSIBLE FOR ME TO DETERMINE IF YOU KNOW ANYTHING AT ALL. YOU SIMPLY MAKE STUPID PERSONAL ATTACKS AND NEVER ADDRESS THE ACTUAL ISSUES.

        • Gary

          Are you kidding me? The current “opposition” in the House is more “go along to get along”. The Speaker and the rest of the establishment types give barely a speed bump’s worth of resistance. And stop using the term “progress” like it is some wonderful term. It is just code for big-government socialism and statism. I could give two sh**s for progress. Give me liberty and freedom from the clutches of the nanny state.

          • smilee

            Your a joke having a dream that is so far out of what is happening in the real world, progress is progress no matter how you spin it, if you do not progress you go backwards and that seems to be where you are going,. Go along to get along what a joke and as an example they have voted 40 times of defund Obamacare which is akin to banging you head against a brick wall as it only hurts and accomplishes nothing and obstructs everything. This is an issue that they are beaten on and they will not prevail. in their stupidity and it only hurts everyone for which they pay a price next year which would be very good for the country.

          • Gary

            Those 40 votes to defund are just symbolic measures. That validates my point that they are a faux opposition. If they truly wanted to take down this monstrosity of Obamacare which will DESTROY the American economy, they would defund it in the upcoming CR. As for progress, I want no part of it if it “progresses” us away from being a Constitutional Republic and destroys my liberty. Sure, we all “progress” in some way. I just don’t like the direction we are currently going.

          • smilee

            Those votes are recorded on the congressional record and that make them real despite your bs. On Obamacare you are just echoing the far right propaganda so those statement of yours are inaccurate and just rhetoric. Remember when we were hearing all this BS from their propaganda about how premium rates for health care where going to double and triple and now in the past two weeks we found that was a lie too but then this came from the same people whom said Romney was going to win by a landslide. Your a sucker for this BS and that is why you wrongly defining progress because nothing you say there is happening either.

          • Gary

            Like I said earlier, the votes were symbolic. They may be part of the Congressional record, but they do nothing to stop Obamacare. Therefore, not much obstruction. As for rates rising currently, I said nothing about that. I did say Obamacare will destroy the country, but I don’t think it will be by rates going up. It will be all the other unintended (actually, intended) consequences. When companies are already laying off workers or making them part time because of healthcare, that is bad for the economy. When people are forced to spend money on services they don’t want or need that hurts the economy. When 40 million are now covered and we the people pay for it it hurts the economy. When the government continues to print money and spend more than it takes in to pay for all this is hurts the economy. The culmination of these events will hurt the country and wreck the economy.

          • Smilee

            Again I say: On Obamacare you are just echoing the far right propaganda so those statement of yours are inaccurate and just rhetoric. None of what you say will happen in any general way, yes, there will be those with exceptions to the rule which you try to make the general rule. Your still saying the rates went up they did not and are for lower than even the lowest estimates so that is another lie of yours.

          • Gary

            Nowhere did I say the rates will go up. The rates won’t matter when you have to wait forever to be seen. That is just a logical conclusion when you cover more people and don’t increase the number of providers. As for echoing rhetoric, that is not the case when actual companies are reducing hours to 29.5 to avoid paying for healthcare. Why do you think Trumka is pushing hard for union exemptions just for this reason? Also, if Obamacare is so wonderful, why is there a need for ANY exemptions?

        • Bud Wood

          What is so sacred about a federal system whose only achievement is Welfare/Warfare? Welfare is to buy votes for federal beneficiarties and warfare is to provide distractions from reality.

          Fix the problems? That’s impossible; the problems of bigness are inherent in size.

          • smilee

            Your full of crap if what you say is true then explain why Mississippi, Texas and other red states whom did not vote for democrats receive the most welfare benefits. Your last statement is inaccurate as good government can be big or small,, that was certainly true in jim crow state laws of which their governments were very much smaller and the feds passed laws to correct that and they were much bigger. It is not inherent in size it is inherent in corruption which at one time was much more prevent in state governments than to today and the feds often have power over the states under the Constitution which does not define the size of government just what the government can do and not do. Some states feel that way but mostly are loosing their cases in the courts because they want to do what is not constitutional and the courts are saying no.

    • peter

      It all started with the American Dream – remember the picket fence and SUV in the driveway for everybody? Well somewhere greed took over and there is no looking back. We got what we wanted and now we need to pay the price! We are all actors fulfilling our parts in the great drama of Humankind. The final act should be very interesting, albeit it’s performance date being unknown as of now. Crystal ball anyone?

    • Bill

      KG,
      You are just mad because Reagan broke the Air Traffic Controllers union after they interfered with the safety of air travelers. The rest of your diatribe is just a made up story to support your communist agenda.
      If you are saying that Obamas economic policies are better than Reagans, then you are just showing us how stupid you are.

    • Don 2

      Forget it KGB, unions are on their way out. You guys are down to 6.6%. Trumpka and the AFL-CIO pushed for Obama’s election and re-election, and Obamacare, and as a result hurt union healthcare benefits, and are making full-time jobs into part-time jobs, or no job at all. You’re getting exactly what you deserve for helping screw the rest of America. No Hope and All Out of Change.

    • TheOriginalDaveH

      KGB says — “On Aug 5, 1981, Reagan showed what he though of average workers when he fired the PATCO strikers”.
      No, he didn’t show what he thought of average workers. He showed what he thought of coercive Unionists who want special privileges over any other workers in the US.

    • Frank Kahn

      SOOOOOOO TOTALLY WRONG. The strike was dangerous to the nation, it had to be broken. It was not what destroyed unions, unions have destroyed themselves. They want to play hardball, and side with liberals, fine let them die with the liberals. We don’t need unions for a strong economy, we need less regulation and to extricate the government from its interference in the market.

      It was also the unions that inflated the cost of manufacturing in this country. Without that massive inflation, we might still be able to compete in the world economics jobs market.

  • vietnamvet1971

    what a WASTE of 8 years with this UNAMERICAN Liberal community organizer playing (Muslim) president and can not even play the part. Yes the American Idol has Tarnished his image where are all the (cult followers) lovers of this Savior now.?

    • Dave

      My disappointment in what Obama has done, is only trumped by my disgust of how low conservative UNAMERICANS are willing to go to regain power (credit rating lowering, record filibusters, blaming Obama for what should be Reagan/Clinton’s along with their Congress’s issues)

      • vietnamvet1971

        sorry I hurt your feelings and that you are so disappointed that you have to Blame us, way to Go you have learned well from your Dear Leader and you use the KISS method “Keep It Simple Stupid”. yes we need to blame all the Career Politicians BUT the current guy in the WH seat is there now so does “The Buck Stop there? you and every one knows it does NOT the man is Sick whether you and the rest of the Liberals will admit it.

      • WTS/JAY

        Oh, boo hoo…did obama disappoint you and made you look like a fool when you voted for him? We told you not to, did we not?

    • real talk 1

      This is something that has been in the making for a long time fifty or more years it just didn’t start with the messiah , The liberal base is intent on remaking America in doing so remake the world the so called New World Order but all we really need is new players in our government they have been there way too long , The people we keep electing got us where we are to day how else did we get here?

  • Ron r

    WAR, had it not been for Obama allowing you to ride his coat tail you would not even be known in reich wing circles. Few and very few outside of the 2%ers even knew you attempted a clown car run at the presidency in 2008. You must love you some Obama.

    • Bill

      [comment has been removed]

    • real talk 1

      Ron r there are other ways to look at this the leaders of the liberal base are the so called educated and they make up the so call brains of the democratic party, A lot of the party base are four or five decades liberal upbringing some pre civil rights era it’s all they have been taught , they are afraid because they have been told the republican party will throw them to the dogs take food stamps / low income housing / energy assistance , so here comes the messiah the churches tell them he’s the one they have been waiting for all these years.

      • Ron r

        They are afraid because of the extream right the 2%ers who seem to think they speak for the Republican Party . Along with the fact that few in the party will discuss or attack corporate welfare. You do make a good argument. But most on thus site are not republicans they are regressive extreamist.

        • WTS/JAY

          Don’t you have an appointment with a suicide-bomber, ronr/dave? Just think of the 70 virgins waiting for you…:)

          • Ron r

            Don’t you have a klan meeting to attend and a black church to bomb Jay/S.Thurman??

          • Nadzieja Batki

            Last I looked it was a white face peering from the picture and from reading WTS/JAY comments it would not be something he would do. You on the other hand I would believe would don a white sheet and then go harass your own people and then blame the Whities. Besides it usually were blacks who burned their own churches and then squawked that it was the whites doing the burning.

          • Ron r

            Stop jocken!!!!

      • Don 2

        If Obama, Kerry, and Hagel are the smartest guys in the room, Putin is going to have a field day making monkeys out of these guys.

        • Ronr

          Yeah Putin a a smart guy he pulled your dumb ass in

          • Don 2

            No, he pulled Obama’s dumb a$$ in and is making Obama look like a monkey. Putin’s doing donuts in Obama’s front yard.

    • Bill

      Ronr,
      That was a dumb comment, have you been drinking again

      • Ron r

        Don’t drink Bill , now go eat a snickers bar. You know how you get when you try to communicate with adults.

        • Bill

          So you mean there is a sense of humor buried somewhere in your brain

          • Ron r

            Get some rest Bill.

  • Bill

    Obama is either intentionally destroying our economy by following the principles of Saul Alinsky or he is incredibly stupid. Maybe a little bit of both. The sad reality is that people have been so dumbed down by the media and the education system that they do not know what creates a thriving economy. As evidenced by the progressive posters on the site.
    All we have to do is mimic the policies of Reagan after he turned around the economic disaster created by Jimmy Carter. Just look at the numbers. Carters economy left us with a new word, stagflation, GDP numbers under 1%, unemployment 10%, inflation 15% and mortgage rates 21%. After three years in office, Reagans GDP was running 7-8% and if you could breath, you could find a job.
    Obamas numbers are pathetic. 1-2% GDP after FIVE years in office and everyone is fighting over part time jobs at McDonalds. And if you work real hard and get an education you can strive to become a greeter at Wal Mart
    Most all of your mainstream media nowadays is diversion, it is all one big dog and pony show. Wake up America, you are getting screwed

    • dlp

      Do you know historically how long it took to pull our economy out of the great depression and what that took? I’m thinking Obama’s context may be a little different than Regan in many areas.

      • Bill

        If you are referring to the depression during the twenties and thirties, governmental policies under Roosevelt prolonged the depression just like Obama is doing now.
        The only difference between what Reagan inherited and what Obama inherited is that Reagan inherited something worse

        • TheOriginalDaveH

          Actually, the person who got the Big Government ball rolling under the Depression was a Republican — Herbert Hoover.
          http://mises.org/rothbard/agd/chapter8.asp
          http://mises.org/daily/6424/The-HooverRoosevelt-Depression-Revisited
          Ironically, FDR campaigned against Hoover’s Government interventions, but after winning the Presidency reverted to them and many more.
          “Roosevelt had denounced Hoover as a spendthrift, and his platform promised strict economy in government. But a government that spent little would give Roosevelt scant opportunity to exercise the patronage he craved. Accordingly, “Roosevelt sent his now famous message to Congress deploring the disastrous extravagance of the Hoover administration…. As one reads that message now it is difficult to believe that it could ever have been uttered by a man who before ending his regime would spend not merely more money than President Hoover, but more than all the other 31 presidents put together three times more, in fact, than all the presidents from George Washington to Herbert Hoover”:
          http://www.mises.org/misesreview_detail.aspx?control=49

      • TheOriginalDaveH

        There was a similar economic calamity in 1920. It ended a little over a year later because Government butted out:
        http://mises.org/daily/3788

      • Debbie Hogan Tate

        10 years start to finish. Stock market crashed in 1929 and unemployment was low but by 1930 unemployment rose to 8.9%. 1931 (the major banks collapse) it was at 16.3%. 1932-24.1% and unemployment peaked at 24.9% in 1933. In 1939 unemployment had dropped to 17.2 % It took another 3 years for the country to stabilize! Sorry to be the bearer of such news!

    • real talk 1

      It’s a little of both intentional and arrogant either way stupid.

    • TheOriginalDaveH

      Bill says — “Obamas numbers are pathetic. 1-2% GDP after FIVE years in office and everyone is fighting over part time jobs at McDonalds”.
      It’s important to know that GDP is a flawed calculation because it takes into account Government spending. As the Federal Reserve prints more counterfeit money, and the Government spends it, the GDP takes on the appearance that the economy is growing even as our real wealth (goods and services — NOT paper money) is shrinking.
      http://mises.org/daily/3843

      • Bill

        Dave,
        Which numbers would you use to show the difference between Reagans success and Obamas failures

        • TheOriginalDaveH

          Reagan talked a good show, and maybe he really meant it. But the reality is that Government grew during his terms. Taxes grew and Spending grew.
          http://mises.org/daily/1544
          Of course he was better than Obama, but I want more than “better than Obama”.

  • Carl Mason

    our half white muslim president, has done nothing to improve job creation, he has done just the opposite. He has no plans on energy independence, How about approving the keystone pipeline to canada? He wants all coal powered electric generation plants closed to raise the cost of producing electic, I’m from one of the highest taxed states, New Jersey, vote in October and November and throw the Dems out. So much for the 5th year of hope and change.

    • TheOriginalDaveH

      It isn’t just the Democrats, Carl.
      The Republicans have been practicing Mercantilism (Crony Capitalism) since the party was started in 1854. Both parties’ Leaders are in it for themselves, as Leaders typically are. The only chance we have at a renewed robust economy is by getting Government out of it.
      There is only one Political Party who has that goal — The Libertarian Party:
      http://www.lp.org/

    • Debbie Hogan Tate

      Hope and change that we can get them out!

  • dlp

    Does anyone know historically how long it took to pull out of the great depression economically?

    • Vigilant

      The Great Depression is recognized as occurring from 1929-1941.

      Roosevelt’s New Deal merely served to lengthen and deepen the Depression, and his alphabet agencies were mostly found to be unconstitutional by the Supreme Court..

      World War II pulled us out of the Depression, period.

      • TheOriginalDaveH

        In the sense that America was profiting from selling armaments to the English, WWII did help the economy, but once the US started joining in the fight and destroying wealth (our own as well as the enemy’s) War became a drain on our economy, as it always does. The US did not stage a real economic recovery until the Government cut spending dramatically after the war:
        http://mises.org/daily/5069/World-War-II-Did-Not-End-the-Great-Depression
        http://www.libertyclassroom.com/war/

        Wars are only good for the Leaders who use them to take more of the people’s Freedom away, and transfer wealth from our pockets to the pockets of Crony Capitalists:
        http://library.mises.org/books/John%20V%20Denson/A%20Century%20of%20War%20Lincoln,%20Wilson%20and%20Roosevelt.pdf

        Those people, who think the Destruction of War makes for good economies, need to read this:
        http://mises.org/daily/5593/The-BrokenWindow-Fallacy

        • Vigilant
          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Communist countries claim full employment. So what?
            Did you read (or listen to) the material I linked to, Vigilant?

          • Vigilant

            No I didn’t. Mises has been outed for what it is and your slavish attachment to it shows.

            If I hated the Constitution, was a neoconfederate or anarchist who wishes to dismantle the federal government, I might take time to read the propaganda.

            Since I’m none of the above, I’ll not waste my time.

            http://clarespark.com/tag/neo-confederates/

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Correction, Vigilant. If you weren’t a purposely stubborn ignoramus, you would read everything you could and make an intelligent assessment.

          • Bill

            Come on now, Dave,
            I have heard great comments from both you and Vigilant.
            From the words of a famous philosopher “Can’t we all just get along”

          • Vigilant

            Bill, I tried on three separate occasions to patch up our differences, but Dave never accepted. It always has to be his way or the highway.

            While I agree with Dave on some conservative issues, his anarcho-capitalist stance rubs me the wrong way. You can’t be an anarchist and defend the Constitution at the same time.

            Rather than do some independent thinking, he slavishly submits to everything produced by the mises.org website, including Thomas DiLorenzo’s Lincoln-hating screeds and denigration of the Constitution itself.

          • Bill

            Vig,
            At least we are all free thinkers and not slaves to political rhetoric, like our progressive posters

          • Dave

            Free thinkers… that’s rich Bill… What makes you a free thinker Bill as opposed to a progressive… Please elaborate…

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Vigilant says — “It always has to be his way or the highway”.
            Sure, Vigilant, whatever you say. Anybody, who reads enough of your comments, knows that you are like a rabid bulldog who will use any underhanded methods at his disposal to manipulate those who he disagrees with.

          • Vigilant

            I’m not the one who rejected the peace offering three times, Dave.

          • Vigilant

            ROFLMAO. The moment you read ANYTHING objective about Abraham Lincoln, you let me know. Then, after you’ve torn yourself away from Murray Rothbard’s “history” of America (as unbiased as Howard Zinn’s “history”), and read some actual source documents leading up to the Civil War, perhaps we might talk.

            Ideologue Dave, I assure you I’ve read and digested more than you will probably ever read in your lifetime.

            Practice what you preach, son.

      • nc

        VIGILANT. WHO VERY SUCCESSFULLY LEAD US THROUGH WWII? HOOVER? REAGAN?? THE BUSHES?? NOPE!!! IT WAS FRD AND TRUMAN!!!
        We elect Presidents not water walkers. THE FIRST THING FDR and Obama had to accomplish was to stop the HOOVER- BUSH SLIDES NOT PUT US BACK TO THE CLINTON TYPE DAYS!!! HOW DO YOU PUT 2.6 MILLION PEOPLE BACK TO WORK WHEN A LOT OF THE PLACES THAT LAID THEM OFF WENT OUT OF BUSINESS! MAGIC????? NOPE! TIME AND HELP OF ALL PARTIES! Not a “we will ruin the economy if necessary”” attitude!

        • Vigilant

          “VIGILANT. WHO VERY SUCCESSFULLY LEAD US THROUGH WWII?”

          (1) Eisenhower, Patton, Bradley, MacArthur, Halsey, Nimitz, Marshall, Doolittle, Taylor, 82nd and 101st Airborne, 3rd Army and many others.

          (2) FDR gave Eastern Europe away to Stalin and Truman caused the Korean War. Great track records.

          “HOW DO YOU PUT 2.6 MILLION PEOPLE BACK TO WORK WHEN A LOT OF THE PLACES THAT LAID THEM OFF WENT OUT OF BUSINESS [?]

          You encourage, rather than stymy the creation of new businesses, a lesson Obama will never learn. You stymy, rather than create, dependencies upon the welfare state, a lesson Obama will never learn.

          Howard Zinn was not an historian, he was a communist propagandist. Best to put his books aside and read some real history.

          Do you think that SHOUTING propaganda will make it any more palatable?

        • Bill

          Nc,
          Are you throwing a tantrum again?

          • NC

            Bill, what would I have to throw a tantrum over! My choice is in the White House! I am completely retired! Play golf and fish and play with the grandkids and still save money each month! I don’t owe a penny on a house or a car!”
            There are no troops, foreign or domestic, in my yard! No one has even asked about my guns much less CONFISCATED ONE!!! No friends or relatives in FEMA political prisoner camps! Have never seen one! Have you??
            What the hell would I be angry about? What does concern me are people who want to mess with my ability and my senor citizens friends ability to vote! And people who want to tell women what they can do with their own bodies!
            IF SOMEONE IS SCREWING WITH YOUR CIVIL RIGHTS YOU NEED TO CONTACT THE ACLU!!! THEY ARE EXPERTS WITH A HEL;L OF A RECORD IN COURT! THEY DO HELP CONSERVATIVES AND ULTRA CONSERVATIVES ! JUST ASK SEAN HANNITY, OLLIE NORTH, RUSH LIMPAW AND THE KKK!

          • WTS/JAY

            More like a nervous break-down, or it may just be his bottle is empty again.

        • WTS/JAY

          nc: VIGILANT. WHO VERY SUCCESSFULLY LEAD US THROUGH WWII? HOOVER? REAGAN?? THE BUSHES?? NOPE!!! IT WAS FRD AND TRUMAN!!!

          The war was engineered, you dummy, and Truman was a whore for the MIC. Wake up, grandpa!

          • Robert Messmer

            Engineered or not, it was a war and apparently nc is in favor of Obama starting WWIII in order to “save” the economy like FDR did.

          • NC

            WTS, if only you could prove it! You would never have to work another day in your life and monuments would be built in your honor!! BUT, ALAS YOUR POSITION DOES NOT PASS THE SNIFF TEST!
            THIS SITE IS FULL OF WORLD SHAKING REVELATIONS THAT NEVER SEE THE LIGHT OF DAY EXCEPT HERE IN TWILIGHT ZONE OF PLD! SORRY!!!

          • WTS/JAY

            You need not apologize to me for your stupidity, nc, for it is not i who reaps the benefits, but you. So go forth in your ignorance, my son, and remember; war is peace, freedom is slavery and ignorance is power.

      • KG

        If it were not for the economic policy’s of the New Deal, there would have been no ‘Arsenal of Democracy’.

        It was the CCC that help train an entire generation of young people how to live and work together in a common struggle – those same boys were the men storming the beaches of Guadalcanal and Normandy. It was the agricultural reforms and subsidies that kept farmers alive and able to feed that army that defeated worldwide fascism. It was the spread of unionism that created a well-trained and compliant workforce to build the planes and tanks that killed the Nazis and Japs. The WPA created thousand of jobs for creative people as well as trade craftspersons.

        My Grandfather spent almost 2 years building out-houses in the Mississippi and Alabama countryside for poor people. And besides furnishing a nice place to crap for people, it kept him and his family fed enough so he could join the Army Air Core and shoot=down German airplanes from his B-17.

        Roosevelt was the right man at the right time. Just ask anyone form the workingclass back then. My grandparents had two pictures on the wall of their home. One was a picture of Andrew Jackson, and the other was a picture of Roosevelt.

        • Vigilant

          “The Supreme Court took its stance from a legal viewpoint and in 1935 it effectively declared the National Recovery Administration (NRA) illegal.

          “In the following year it declared the Agricultural Adjustment Act (AAA) unconstitutional thus killing off the AAA. The point made by the Supreme Court was that any efforts made to help farmers etc. should come at a state level and not federal level and that these parts of the New Deal went against the powers given to the states by the Constitution.

          “11 out of 16 of the Alphabet Laws were decreed unconstitutional in cases heard by the Supreme Court. The argument of the Supreme Court was that Roosevelt had tried to impose the power of the federal government on state governments – and this was unconstitutional. If a state deemed that there was a crisis is farming then it had the right to tackle this crisis as laid down by the Constitution but the federal government did not have the right to impose its decisions onto states.”

          http://www.historylearningsite.co.uk/New_Deal_opposition.htm

          And what was Roosevelt’s response? He tried to pack the Supreme Court.

          Your grandparents should have appreciated the irony of hanging pictures of both Jackson and Roosevelt. Jackson stood against everything that Roosevelt stood for. Then, I guess intelligence doesn’t run in your family.

          • KG

            The supreme court of the 1930’s would have been called “ultra-conservative Activist”. The AAA was struck down by the court, but the Soil Conservation and Domestic Allotment Act of 1936 was passed shortly afterwards. While not in the same scope as the AAA, it’s goal of helping environmental concerns exacerbated by poor farming methods effectively did the same thing the AAA was intended to do. Despite having misgivings about receiving government subsidies, farmers overwhelmingly approved of the program. Unfortunately, the bounty did not trickle down to the lowest economic levels. Tenant farmers and sharecroppers did not receive government aid; the subsidy went to the landlord. The owners often bought better machinery with the money, which further reduced the need for farm labor. In fact, the Great Depression and Roosevelt’s reforms brought a virtual end to the practice of sharecropping in America.

            Jackson’s equal political policy became known as “Jacksonian Democracy”. This culminated into ending what he termed a “monopoly” of government by elites. Jeffersonians opposed inherited elites but favored educated men while the Jacksonians gave little weight to education. During the Jacksonian era, suffrage was extended to (nearly) all white male adult citizens.

            Jackson said that he would guard against “all encroachments upon the legitimate sphere of State sovereignty.” However, he was not a states’ rights extremist; indeed, the Nullification Crisis would find Jackson fighting against what he perceived as state encroachments on the proper sphere of federal influence. This position was one basis for the Jacksonians’ opposition to the Second Bank of the United States. As the Jacksonians consolidated power, they more often advocated expanding federal power, presidential power in particular.

      • Bud Wood

        WWII? You mean the “New Dealers’ War”!

        The New Dealers of the FDR administration set-up Japan so that they could guide the might of the USA into the war in Europe. They were successful and helped lengthen that war in order to support the Brits and the Soviets.

        I know; I was there as a WWII soldier. My feelings were similar to that of Gen. Patton who was killed because he was a political embarrassment.

      • Bill

        Vig,
        That’s a good answer

    • Debbie Hogan Tate

      Start to finish about 10 years!

  • Carlucci

    You could show those same groups of ignorant voters the statistics and they still would never believe it because they’ve given Obama “hero status” in their minds. It is obvious that anyone who voted for this clown does not have a working brain as they can’t see the forest for the trees, or that the emperor has no clothes.

  • nc

    Harold, since you think blacks are “ignorant morons” the number you “have spoken to” is probably no more than two! Then what do you do? You quote them for the truth of their answers.
    The histories of the black man and white man in this country are markedly different!! If whites can learn from history why can’t the blacks learn from history? Is one side always right and the other is always wrong? Let me guess which you think is the right side! The answer oozes out of you in every post!

    • Don 2

      Let’s put it this way, nc. Anyone, whether black or white, who voted for Obama because he is black, instead of his policies, is an ignorant moron, and a racist.

  • dan

    WMD….weapons of mass distraction….BRILLIANT,Wayne
    I always looked at the Middle East and thought : How can those people live with no jobs ? Now I know it was American Foreign Aid .
    Change you can believe in…but would rather not !

  • real talk 1

    Thanks Wayne for that great editorial about the damage Obama is inflicting on the blacks of this nation, There are a lot of blacks that realize the truth and a lot of blacks that still have hope a better life yet we have those that are still hoping that milk and honey will fall from the sky through the grace of Obama. Most black Americans are more educated than at the time DR. King pushed for civil rights but what blacks see as the real threat to their well being is this great liberal calamity being pushed to give amnesty to thirteen million illegal immigrants with a very real threat of their relatives coming bring the totals a lot higher and all this diminish the chance for better jobs, not only are the blacks outnumbered but they don’t have a nation to back them up as do Hispanics from south America , The black NAACP has been fighting for the rights of illegals blacks be damned.

    • TheOriginalDaveH

      The immigrants (illegal or not) are not responsible for our economic collapse — Big Government is.
      What else can we expect from a Government which consumes 40% of our wealth? Governments don’t produce wealth, they consume it. The bigger the portion of wealth they consume, the faster our economy declines.
      If you can understand the point of this article, you will be on your way to discovering truth:
      http://mises.org/daily/5277/When-Capital-Is-Nowhere-in-View

  • http://batman-news.com Jim B

    Obama supporters don’t know what they don’t know because they have no way of knowing i.e. ignorant and ignorance. They are the bottom of the education systems and they are a massive group of ignorance primed for serfdom, a destiny they embrace for lack of knowing anything better. Obama is the King of Serfdom and the millions of serfs in this country have become dependent on him for their next meal.

    • Bill

      Good Analogy, Jim

      I feel like a having a Big Mac

    • Ron r

      So, so, bitter.

      • JeffH

        You being an Obama liberal/progressive shill…I can see why you’d respond that way.

        • Ron r

          And you being a regressive/extremist explains you period.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            How is Jeff regressive, Ron?

          • Dave

            He certainly isn’t progressive DaveH… Correct?
            Should he be considered stagnate then?

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            That isn’t what I asked.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            If you’re implying that Progressives are progressive, I take exception. They are anything but progressive. They would be much better described as aggressive and regressive since they are taking us back to the days of feudalism.

          • Dave

            Please prove that assertion in your own words… without the tiresome theory of mises please…. The opposite of progressive is regressive and since you and Jeffrey hate progressives and consider yourselves the opposite of what they stand for, then you are regressive, or you stand for stagnation… Which is it?

          • JeffH

            The slogans of Big Brother’s ruling party in George Orwell’s 1984 included Love is Hate and War is Peace. Today’s leftists unwinding the country back to pre-constitutional poverty call themselves Progressives. They are truly Regressives, but perhaps truth is too hard for politicians.

            There is an old proverb that says “Who rides a tiger cannot dismount”.
            http://www.sodahead.com/united-states/are-the-liberal-progressives-really-are-regressive/question-1319617/?link=ibaf&q=progressives+are+really+regressive
            The Progressives have ridden statism so long that they can’t repudiate it; all they can afford is to keep riding so long as they can stave off public disaster, hoping that they will somehow escape before things finally hit the well-known fan.

            The rectification of names: progressive
            By Thomas Lifson
            http://www.americanthinker.com/2004/11/the_rectification_of_names_pro.html#!

          • Dave

            So I am clear… Ronald Wilson Reagan then was a progressive, not a conservative in your brain dead mind even though everyone besides the extremists here refer to him as one of the fathers of modern conservatism?
            George Bush 1 and 2….Those guys were conservative, Vietnam war supporters in the 1960’s but now they are progressives in your feeble mind..
            I see… well you have proved one thing yet again Jeffrey, you can’t fix stupid. And you are beyond repair.

          • Dave

            So I am clear… Ronald Wilson Reagan then was a progressive, not a conservative in your brain dead mind even though everyone besides the extremists here refer to him as one of the fathers of modern conservatism?
            George Bush 1 and 2….Those guys were conservative, Vietnam war supporters in the 1960’s but now they are progressives in your feeble mind..
            I see… well you have proved one thing yet again Jeffrey, you can’t fix stupid. And you are beyond repair.

          • JeffH

            Still cryin’ like a baby! Wah, wah, wah!

          • JeffH

            Ignoramus Dave47D, pure conjecture on your part.

            I find it quite telling that ignorant liberals and ignorant progressives like yourself have an affinity for words you are actually associated with, consciouslyy or subliminally, like the word “hate”, much the same way as with the word “racist”.

            Hate is a very strong word and I’ve never hated anyone in my life, including you. I don’t like you and I also know that I have a choice in whether to interact with you or not.

            I just don’t care for ignorant progressives shills like you who spend more time obfuscating, whining, moaning and groaning over things that you don’t like while stumping for more government force and control over those of us that want to live our lives as free men and women.
            ***(see your childish and obfuscated comments to Mr. Livingston and anyone else you don’t agree with)

          • Dave

            What does DaveH do when someone disagrees with him? (See Vigilant below)
            He calls them names, belittles them and that’s why your life partner is arrogant and annoying but because you buy into his BS with mises, you accept that same behavior from DaveH.
            Hypocrisy, thy name is Jeffrey Shootem up bang bang… now go get some warm milk…. DaveH will be home soon.

          • JeffH

            Such the little cry baby and still stuck with your man fetish! Wah, wah, wah!

          • Dave

            Cray baby, If my post are cry babyish then you just described your heroes BobL, W.A.R. John Myers etc…
            Nighty Night Jeffrey shootem up… Have nice dreams where you are not an idiot most of the time… You work hard enough at it… One day, it may come true.
            But come clean… You, BobL and DaveH all live in the same doublewide in AL don’t you? You can tell me the truth… I won’t tell anybody.

          • JeffH

            How old are you Ignoramus Dave47D? Is this what can be expected from a proffessed global progressive and international salesman?

            Do you really think your grade school level attacks and rants accomplish anything or have any effect on what the other PLD participants think other than that you are incredibly childish and a discredit to yourself and your own credibility.

            Keep it up, attacking the PLD staff and Bob Livingston, because eventually your feet will no longer fit in your mouth and you’ll be reduced to searching for another venue to do your blogging.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            The state of America before the Revolution was much as it is now with Big Government inhibiting Free Trade and taking as much as they could from the Citizens. Therefore, the politics you practice, Shill Dave, are regressive. As is the case with most Political trickery, the Progressives have adopted a Flowery name which is the opposite of the agenda they advocate.

          • KG

            It was actually Big business in the form of the East India Tea Company – the ‘Walmart” of colonial America. It was a tax ‘cut’ for the EITC that produced the outrage amongst the colonialist.

          • Dave

            Free trade? Oh you mean the trade that allows your corporatist friends to ship jobs overseas that pay their workers pennies on the dollar so that your handlers can make even more money than they are now at the expense of the good of the country?
            You have proved once again you are a corporatist shill.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            No, Shill Dave, I mean Free Trade in which your Crony Capitalists don’t get to buy special favors from your Big Government.
            Jobs are shipped overseas because nobody in their right mind wants to invest money in a country full of thieves like yourself, Shill Dave.

          • WTS/JAY

            That would be, “stagnant”, dumb-bell, like your brain. And you run a business? LOL!

          • WTS/JAY

            And you being a domestic-terrorist explains you, period.

          • JeffH

            You being an ignorant Obamaphile and a liberal/progressive shill…I can see why you’d respond that way.

            BTW, what’s an extreamist?

          • Ron r

            Extremist, domestic terrorist. No matter how its spelled you. Get the message. In your case Internet activist will do.

          • JeffH

            You being an ignorant Obama liberal/progressive shill…I can see why you’d think that way.

          • Dave

            Look in the mirror Jeffrey shootem up bang bang…
            Anyone who believes the birther nonsense, or that Obama is a muslim, or conveniently changes definitions of people who are conservative to neocon because conservatives NEVER EVER do anything wrong, anyone who disagrees with them are referred to as a socialist/communist/Marxist. Anyone who believes that Gov’s only role is for defense…people who try and force their religious agenda down other people’s throats in terms of social laws.
            How many of those items describe you Jeffrey? Quite a number of them I am afraid.

          • JeffH

            WAH, WAH, WAH ya crybaby!!

        • JeffH

          POLLY WANT A CRACKER? baaarrraaaacccckkkkkk!

      • WTS/JAY

        So so hateful.

    • Bill

      Jim,

      I have a great story to tell you about our edumacation system. My Wife and I went to dinner last night to celebrate her grandsons 20th birthday. He is 20 years old, a nice kid going to college and wants to be a sheriff. We also brought along my wife’s mother, grandma Juanita, who is 90 years old.

      Aaron, the grandson, said “Grandma Juanita, I would like to interview you for one of my college classes”. I am thinking what a great interview that would be

      Grandma Juanita came from a town of 500 in New Mexico. Her parents never spoke English, she had eight siblings and her father raised and grew everything that they ate. During WW2, she moved to Seattle, became a welder and this 100 lb woman was one of the original Rosie Riviters. She married a wounded Marine who was one of the first ones to hit the beach in Tarawa and they proceeded to create the wonderful woman who is my wife.

      I said to Aaron, What a great interview that will be. Are you going to ask about Juanita’s grandfather who was kidnapped by the Apache Indians, made a slave and escaped as a teenager? Or are you going to ask about Juanita’s father, Roman, who wanted to get away from the maddening crowds in this 500 population town so, in his eighties, he built a cabin in the hills to get away from it all? Or about how many wives have shot their husbands in her family (3)?

      Aaron said no, they want me to ask a senior citizen how gays have effected their lives. What a waste of this kids time and our tax payer dollars

      • Karolyn

        It really is a good question. I wonder if anybody can answer that gays have had ANY effect on their lives other than if they had direct contact with them, like having married one.

        • Bill

          Karolyn,
          So you would rather hear about the Gays in Juanita’s life over the colorful life that is Juanita’s?

          • Nadzieja Batki

            According to Karolyn’s views, the gays are more important than Juanita who is just an oldster taking up space and air and food.
            The human predators of the gay variety garnish more sympathy and compassion from her.

          • Karolyn

            You gotta be kiddin’ me! As usual, Nadzieja clouds the issue with claims of what she thinks my views are. I gave no such response. I happen to have a great deal of interest in peoples’ histories.

          • WTS/JAY

            Hey Karolyn, are gays born gay?

        • http://personalliberty.com/ Bob Livingston

          Dear Karolyn,

          You write: ” I wonder if anybody can answer that gays have had ANY effect on their lives…” How about the right to free association. http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2013/09/03/todd-american-dispatch-christian-bakery-closes-after-lgbt-threats-protests/

          You will see more of this.

          Best wishes,
          Bob

        • http://personalliberty.com/ Bob Livingston

          Dear Karolyn,

          You write: ” I wonder if anybody can answer that gays have had ANY effect on their lives…” How about the right to free association. http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2013/09/03/todd-american-dispatch-christian-bakery-closes-after-lgbt-threats-protests/

          You will see more of this.

          Best wishes,
          Bob

          • Dave

            Free association? No… this is a case of a bigoted business owner treating people differently because of a book of fables that some fools pass off as fact…People protested…
            And the question Bob is “YOUR” life… surely you can come up with something Bob besides emotional prejudice from your own experience?
            Your right to do anything stops with infringement upon others… You have yet to show anything of the sort.

          • WTS/JAY

            You, of all people, have no business pointing a finger at anyone, oh bigoted one. Now click your heels and go starch your sheets like a good little Nazi-boy.

          • Dave

            Sorry Jay, I am just not the racist you are… I don’t favor policy that keeps people down like you.
            The NAZIS hated communism, unions, thought their religion was right and perfect…. Sounds like conservatives to me there NAZIS boy.

          • http://personalliberty.com/ Bob Livingston

            Dear unhinged Dave the bigot,

            You write: ” I am just not the racist you are.” You may or may not be a racist. You are, however, a confessed bigot.

            Best wishes,
            Bob

          • Dave

            Please show the confession Bob?
            My distain for your bigotry and racism does not make me a bigot Bob.

          • http://personalliberty.com/ Bob Livingston

            Dear Dave,

            On multiple occasions you have expressed your disdain for “lazy” and “ignorant” southerners and have said under no circumstances would you live in a “pathetic” southern state, specifically mentioning Alabama. That is what makes you a bigot.

            Best wishes,
            Bob

          • Dave

            No Bob,

            Your selective memory fails you… I have a problem with “taker” states like those in the south being subsidized by states like CA, NY, NJ and IL then having the nerve to complain about the taxes you pay, and the gov that puts laws in place that provides you with all the “pork”you can take. Its called Hypocrisy Bob. You and the southern states are all steeped in it.

            I just call you on your steaming pile of bs and you don’t like it. Poor you… Conservatives have their considerable history of racism and bigotry that I am happy to illustrate… From the KKK, to Wallace, to todays conservatives in the GOP. You and your ilk try your best to cover up by calling me what you are but you fail again.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Oh but you do favor such policies, Shill Dave. You are no different than Hitler, who imposed his will forcefully on the German people.

          • Dave

            And you are a liar… again

          • WTS/JAY

            Dave: The NAZIS hated communism, unions, thought their religion was right and perfect…. Sounds like conservatives to me there NAZIS boy.

            Actually, you just described the obama-administration. I hope for your sake, obama is not reading your comments, as i would hate to see you placed in zee cooler, comrade. I couldn’t bare it, i tell you…:)

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Yes, Shill Dave, Free Association.
            Your Force is anything but Free.

          • Dave

            But Christian force is ok? Is that it Atheist DaveH?

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Where was the Force, Shill Dave?

          • WTS/JAY

            Dave: But Christian force is ok? Is that it Atheist DaveH?

            How can that be, since, according to you and your leprous-messiah, we are not, nor ever have been, a Christian nation? So where is this Christian-force that you speak of, Dave?

          • Bill

            Dave,
            How about a business’s right to refuse service to who ever they want. My wife and I both fire clients that we do not wish to do business with

          • Dave

            They have to right to refuse service like that. equal rights under the law you know…. Not that conservatives like that law…
            I fire client’s as well but I don’t do so because of sexual orientation, race etc… I fire clients because they do not give me the revenue I am looking for or do not pay within 30 days… strictly business reasoning…

          • WTS/JAY

            The business in question is not government owned or government subsidized, but rather, it is privately owned. Therefore, no one, including the government, has any right to dictate/enforce any policy concerning the operation of that business. If you don’t like the way the business is run, and find the service not to your liking, you have the option to go elsewhere, rather then whining and crying like a baby to big-mommy government. I’ve exercised the option on many occasions, others have exercised the option, except for progs, that is; who soil their diapers and cry bloody-murder. Grow up!

          • http://personalliberty.com/ Bob Livingston

            Dear unhinged Dave the bigot,

            You write: “No… this is a case of a bigoted business owner treating people differently because of a book of fables that some fools pass off as fact…” No. This is the case of a bunch of thugs preventing a business owner from conducting business. I will ignore your blasphemy, but the One who counts will not.

            You write: “And the question Bob is “YOUR” life.” Your reading comprehension skills remain inadequate, but your ability to obfuscate remains intact.

            You write: “Your right to do anything stops with infringement upon others.” My right is to associate and do business with those whom I choose. Those I do not choose are free to do business with someone else. That in no way “infringes” on anyone else.

            Best wishes,
            Bob

          • Dave

            The funny part of the article Bob the homophobe is this line….

            “Christians who live and work in Oregon must follow man’s law instead of God’s law.”
            The bible was written by men, not god… So the irony here is delicious….
            Why do homophobes and bigots like BobL always need to project their issues onto others? Typical with conservatives unfortunately.

          • http://personalliberty.com/ Bob Livingston

            Dear unhinged Dave the bigot,

            You write: “he funny part of the article Bob the homophobe.” I suggest you look up the word. It does not apply. Therefore, in this case it is ad hominem. I direct your attention to the comment policy.

            You write: “The bible (sic) was written by men, not god (sic)..” Your denial of Him in no way diminishes the fact that He exists, as you will learn to your chagrin.

            You write: “Why do homophobes and bigots like BobL always need to project their issues onto others? Typical with conservatives unfortunately.” Talk about irony. Who is projecting?

            Best wishes,
            Bob

          • Dave

            I didn’t realize you were royalty Bob… the rules of the road simply don’t apply to you… Well, at least we get insight into the kind of gov we would be inflicted with if you ran the country…You can attack all you wish and its ok… people you disagree with? They better watch out… you are a good conservative.
            I don’t deny god because I have no proof that he doesn’t exist just as you or any of the other believers in man made religion like Christianity, Judaism or Islam…
            I do not support treating homosexuals like second class citizens Bob… that is your bag baby….

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            But you do support Forcing your way on other people, Shill Dave, not unlike an average rapist.

          • http://personalliberty.com/ Bob Livingston

            Dear Dave,

            You have been given broad latitude because you are useful in demonstrating the illogic and cognitive dissonance that affects and infects progressives and statists. However, you will not come into my house and call me a racist or a homophobe. If this rule is difficult for you to follow I suggest disappear yourself. But if you don’t abide by it, you will be disappeared through moderation. I will gladly engage you in a rational debate, but you must understand that a line has been drawn that you will not be allowed to cross. And I suggest you drop your whining about the way the policy is enforced.

            Best wishes,
            Bob

          • Robert Messmer

            The bakery shop did not infringe upon others, it simply said we do not wish to bake your cake. Unless you are saying that no business in the US has any right to ever refuse anybody, the reason they refused isn’t germaine.

          • Dave

            Its not germaine to you perhaps… to the couple on the other hand… they may have a different thought.

          • Jeff

            Bob:
            So, your right to not have gay people in your vicinity trumps the right of gay people to freely associate, marry, etc.? A generation ago, the same argument might have been made by George Wallace concerning Blacks. In an open society, there has to be compromise. You don’t have a right to have others live according to your personal dictates. If your right to swing your fist ends where my nose begins, where does your right to be free of gay people end?

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Did you even read the article, Jeff? There is nothing about the bakery’s refusal to bake a wedding cake for a gay couple that “trumps the right of gay people to freely associate, marry, etc”.
            The mob, on the other hand, was clearly interfering with the rights of the bakery owners to Freely conduct their business.
            Your nose doesn’t begin (or belong) on the private property of the bakery owners. You are just a pushy, thieving controller who has no moral compunctions about Forcing your way on other people.

          • http://personalliberty.com/ Bob Livingston

            Dear Jeff,

            You write: ” In an open society, there has to be compromise.” There was apparently no compromise for the business owner in this case. It was the way of the gay crowd and government enforcers or no way.

            You write: ” You don’t have a right to have others live according to your personal dictates.” Nor have I ever tried.

            You write: ” If your right to swing your fist ends where my nose begins, where does your right to be free of gay people end?” Nonsensical non sequitur. If you are trying to make a point, please rephrase and restate.

            Best wishes,
            Bob

          • http://personalliberty.com/ Bob Livingston

            Dear Jeff,

            You write: “So, your right to not have gay people in your vicinity trumps the right of gay people to freely associate, marry, etc.?” I missed this in my initial response. It is a non sequitur.

            Best wishes,
            Bob

          • WTS/JAY

            With Jeff, its always non-sequitur. The boy wrote the book on non-sequitur.

          • Jeff

            The question was how gays have affected people’s lives. Your answer was “How about the right to free association?” Is there another way to interpret that other than the way I did? Are you saying that allowing gay marriage impacts you more than prohibiting it affects gays who want to marry each other? It’s not a non-sequitur at all. The non-sequitur in the whole debate is the pivot from the marriage question to the question of raising children when gays, with or without the benefit of marriage, can adopt children in most states.

          • http://personalliberty.com/ Bob Livingston

            Dear Jeff,

            You write: ” Are you saying that allowing gay marriage impacts you more than prohibiting it affects gays who want to marry each other?” You have now asked a different question. The answer is No. Let me provide for you a similar scenario:
            A neo-nazi skinhead with visible Swastika tattoos enters a Jewish-owned bakery. He orders a birthday cake so that he and his group can celebrate Hitler’s birthday and the holocaust. Should the Jewish baker be required to serve him under threat of prosecution by the state or harassment by a group of neo-nazi thugs? Please explain the reasoning behind your answer.

            Best wishes,
            Bob

          • Jeff

            No, I wouldn’t, but I also would not “force” any minister to perform a gay wedding or any other ceremony he felt uncomfortable with. A government clerk is a different story. I may think it’s dumb for anyone to own a gun, but if I work for a state agency charged with issuing gun permits, my personal feelings shouldn’t enter the picture.

          • http://personalliberty.com/ Bob Livingston

            Dear Jeff,

            You write: “but I also would not “force” any minister to perform a gay wedding or any other ceremony he felt uncomfortable with.” Yet this conversation began with my example of a Christian bakery being persecuted for choosing not to serve a lesbian couple. Your response to me indicated you believe the rights of the couple trumped the rights of the business owner. Or am I misunderstanding your point?

            Best wishes,
            Bob

          • Jeff

            As I understand the bakery story, the government has nothing to do with it. Some people are angry at the bakery and are boycotting its anti-gay policies. Certainly it’s a closer question than your hypothetical as the lesbian couple was never a threat to the Christian bakery while asking a Jewish baker to work for someone who wants to exterminate him is a bit much. Frankly, I think the people getting up in arms over the Christian bakery are over-reacting unless the bakery is situated in a largely gay area like the Castro District in San Francisco. I wouldn’t be surprised if the bakery’s owners sue the organizers of the boycott for tortious interference with business.

          • http://personalliberty.com/ Bob Livingston

            Dear Jeff,

            You write: “As I understand the bakery story, the government has nothing to do with it.” They are under investigation by a state agency for discrimination. http://www.oregonlive.com/gresham/index.ssf/2013/08/lesbian_couple_refused_wedding.html That was my point from the beginning.

            You write: “Frankly, I think the people getting up in arms over the Christian bakery are over-reacting unless the bakery is situated in a largely gay area like the Castro District in San Francisco.” Then please explain to me your initial comment to my response to Karolyn: http://personalliberty.com/2013/09/12/the-damage-obama-has-done-to-black-americans/#

            Best wishes,
            Bob

          • Jeff

            There’s a big difference between state action and people getting their backs up about their “right” to discriminate. Certainly a bigot has the right to be a bigot. That doesn’t mean his cause needs to be adopted by others. What do you think of what Ted Cruz (I assume one of your favorites) had to say about Jesse Helms?

          • http://personalliberty.com/ Bob Livingston

            Dear Jeff,

            This remark is non-responsive.

            You write: “What do you think of what Ted Cruz (I assume one of your favorites) had to say about Jesse Helms?” I am not familiar with anything Cruz has said about Jesse Helms, nor is it relevant to me.

            Best wishes,
            Bob

          • Karolyn

            That is a very sad situation. However, the behavior of the gays can almost be understood given how they’ve been treated for so long. That being said, I do not agree with their behavior, nor the government interference. It’s a case of people taking themselves too seriously.

        • Bill

          Karolyn,

          Who cares about how gays have affected any ones life.

          Wouldn’t you rather hear about how Juanita felt when she heard that her grandfather, who escaped the Apaches, was killed by a runaway team of horses.

          Or, about how Juanita felt being an 18 year old girl from a small town that spoke no English to go to Seattle, learn how to be a riveter and be one of the original Rosie Riveters to help our country during the war effort

          Or how Billy Joe (Juanita’s husband, my wife’s father) felt about being one of the first Marines to hit the beach in Tarawa, one of our most bloodiest battles in WW2, and being shot.

          Quit wasting your time with PC BS and learn about the people that sacrificed to make our country great

          • Karolyn

            It sounds like a wonderful story and would make a great book or even movie. There was a point to be made with the assignment – maybe opening some eyes.

          • Bill

            How about opening your eyes to the values that made this country great and the people that sacrificed to do so.
            My second father was a concentration camp survivor that taught me what it was like to have a bad day. If you asked me how gays affected my life I would tell you that everyone I met that was gay seemed like a nice person but their gayness had no affect on my life.
            Why not have a class on who affected your life and in what ways instead of wasting our tax payers dollars on a politically protected class of people that just happens to in vogue right now.
            Aaron’s parents have taught him well and he does not need a college professor to tell him how to be nice to people

          • WTS/JAY

            That is not something children should be looking at, and people, whether gay or straight, should keep their sexuality where it belongs, in the privacy of their bedrooms, and not flaunting it in public, which is a clear indication of moral-degeneracy.

          • Karolyn

            I agree to a certain extent; however, I do not believe a simple kiss, hug or holding hands is a sexual display. On the other hand, in countries where sexuality is more accepted, there is less rape.

          • WTS/JAY

            Karolyn: I agree to a certain extent; however, I do not believe a simple kiss, hug or holding hands is a sexual display.

            Ever been to a gay-pride parade, Karolyn?

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Rape is a crime of Violence, Karolyn, not a crime of passion:
            http://abstractnonsense.wordpress.com/2006/12/16/rape-is-a-violent-crime/

          • Karolyn

            I know Dave. That was my field in my last job. However, the fact remains there is less rape in countries where nudity and sexuality are more commonplace and accepted.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Clearly, Karolyn, there are numerous factors which would influence the rate of Rape in any country. The question is — Are those factors Causal or Coincidental? And do they work in conjunction with other factors? It would require a very thorough study to come to the conclusion you have come to.
            Logically, I would say nudity would be a factor, if rapes were indeed crimes of passion, but they aren’t.

        • TheOriginalDaveH

          As Bob Livingston indicated below, the special privileges given to Gays does indeed affect other people’s lives. As a Libertarian, I would never advocate Government suppression of Gays. It is a matter of Freedom. But what the Gays are largely seeking these days is the right through special Government privileges to impose themselves on people who don’t want to associate with them.
          Imagine for instance, knowing how I feel about your Pollyannaish views, if I could get special Government Protection allowing me to impose myself on you and your friends? I’m sure I could make myself unwelcome in short order. Would that please you? Do you think it would be right?
          Take the marriage issue for instance. I could care less if Gays can marry each other. But do we need a Government law for that? Of course not. The laws they seek would allow them to force a Minister or some other religious functionary to marry them. This goes directly against the concept of Freedom of Association.
          If Gays truly just want Freedom (absence of Government coercion), then we need simply to get Government out of their business.

          • Jeff

            What you are advocating is overly simplistic. Government can’t just get out of everyone’s life. What about veterans? Are they no longer entitled to the benefits they were promised when they signed up? And if those benefits include spousal benefits, why should a gay spouse be excluded? Because some local functionary doesn’t want to recognize the marriage? You have a warped view of freedom when it allows the “freedom” of one’s views to trump the tangible rights and freedoms of others.

            For example, does a pharmacist have the right to refuse to fill a prescription for birth control because he has a moral aversion to it? Whose freedom controls? The pharmacist’s or the patient’s? In a city, it’s purely an academic argument as there’s another pharmacy up the street, but in a rural setting, it can be a real issue.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            No, Jeff, what you are advocating is overly complex. People who seek advantage over others strive for complexity in order to mask their lack of productivity, morals, and other human failures.
            Jeff says — “You have a warped view of freedom when it allows the “freedom” of one’s views to trump the tangible rights and freedoms of others”.
            Your views require the Force of Government, Jeff. Mine require voluntary cooperation and contracts with fellow human beings. You are the “warped” one, Jeff, as well as pushy and aggressive.

          • Jeff

            Nonsense. When have the rights of minorities ever been protected without a government? You might as well advocate learning to breathe under water and living there. People can, and always will, differ as to the role of government in the economy, but it will never disappear. You may call it overly complex; I call it reality.
            I guess it was just fine and dandy with you if pre-1964 a Black family couldn’t stop at a gas station in the South and couldn’t go to the bathroom. After all, it wasn’t you doing it (or being the victim of it) and your theory says such discrimination is perfectly fine if done by private citizens. Thank God that creepy philosophy was rejected though, like Freddy Krueger, it’s never completely dead.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Jeff says — “Nonsense. When have the rights of minorities ever been protected without a government?”.
            Nonsense? Because you say so, Jeff?
            What rights do the minorities have that the rest of us don’t? Special privileges for certain classes of people is not the role of a legitimate Government.

            Jeff says — “I guess it was just fine and dandy with you if pre-1964 a Black family couldn’t stop at a gas station in the South and couldn’t go to the bathroom”.
            I think that’s a bit of an exaggeration, Jeff. But I’ll answer it as if it was true.
            No, I think it is tragic that such ignorant people exist (those who would judge somebody by the color of their skin), but it is even more tragic for ignorant do-gooders to give special privileges to certain groups of people which obviously creates resentment among the non-privileged classes and leads to even more bigotry, NOT less.
            If I were Black, I would start smart businesses that catered to all customers and as such would soon out-compete those ignorant business owners who practiced prejudice.

            Jeff says — “Thank God that creepy philosophy was rejected”.
            Yes, we have such a color-blind society now. I am in awe of the results of Jeff’s “creepy philosophies”.
            Creepy philosophies will always be Forced on citizens by Big Government which is backed by Creepy people like Jeff.

          • Jeff

            Explain how permitting minorities to do the things others can do (attend school, vote, use a public bathroom) constitutes “special privilege.”
            Now, you can use the term “special privilege,” perhaps, when it comes to affirmative action or the attempt to right historic wrongs, but with reference to the 1964 and 1965 Acts? Hardly.
            It’s interesting how you rank your villains. So, in the DaveH World, the “do-gooder” civil rights workers (e.g. Goodman, Cheney, Schwerner) are even worse than those who killed them?
            As for Blacks starting businesses, they did that, but without protection from the “evil Government,” the “good,” free, white people made sure they couldn’t thrive. Remember what happened in the Greenwood section of Tulsa, Oklahoma? Do you really think things would be different now had the Government not stepped in in the 1960s?

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            There are two sectors at play here — The Public Sector, and the Private Sector. If we are talking about the Public Sector, then obviously it is due to a Government Law or Regulation, in which case that Law or Regulation should just be removed.
            If we’re talking about the Private Sector, it is NONE of your business who the owners of that Private Property choose to associate with — Right or Wrong.

            Jeff says — “As for Blacks starting businesses, they did that, but without protection from the “evil Government,” the “good,” free, white people made sure they couldn’t thrive”.
            How did the “white people” do that, Jeff? Did they keep the Blacks from frequenting those businesses? Did they keep the Whites from frequenting those businesses? If so, where was your Big Government to stop them from Forcing their way on other people? I think, Jeff, that your argument is fallacious, because if the law was being applied evenly to all people, the actions you claim couldn’t have taken place. If the law wasn’t being applied evenly, what makes you think a new law would solve that?

          • Jeff

            I said:

            Explain how permitting minorities to do the things others can do (attend school, vote, use a public bathroom) constitutes “special privilege.”
            Now, you can use the term “special privilege,” perhaps, when it comes to affirmative action or the attempt to right historic wrongs, but with reference to the 1964 and 1965 Acts? Hardly.
            It’s interesting how you rank your villains. So, in the DaveH World, the “do-gooder” civil rights workers (e.g. Goodman, Cheney, Schwerner) are even worse than those who killed them?
            As for Blacks starting businesses, they did that, but without protection from the “evil Government,” the “good,” free, white people made sure they couldn’t thrive. Remember what happened in the Greenwood section of Tulsa, Oklahoma? Do you really think things would be different now had the Government not stepped in in the 1960s?

            DaveH, your silence is deafening. For your edification, I have attached a link to what my post mentioned about Greenwood (http://digital.library.okstate.edu/encyclopedia/entries/t/tu013.html)
            and that was in Oklahoma, not Mississippi or Alabama. Do you really think that without the intervention of the Federal Government and the passage of the Civil Rights and Voting Rights Acts that Blacks could have opened businesses in the Deep South? You don’t think they’d have been treated even worse than the kids fire-hosed by Bull Connor? I appreciate how much the southern bigots offend you personally, but if you’re willing to say the Government has no business protecting the victims of such violence from an angry mob of “private” citizens, then how does it benefit anyone that perhaps you’d make a better neighbor than a Klansman? If you’re willing to say the Government has no right to prevent discrimination (as Goldwater did), then your policies are just as repugnant as those of the actual bigot.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Jeff says — “Do you really think that without the intervention of the Federal Government and
            the passage of the Civil Rights and Voting Rights Acts that Blacks could have
            opened businesses in the Deep South?”.
            Unlike you, Jeff, I believe that Blacks are capable of starting their own businesses without the Force of Government. You really ought to do something about that bigoted opinion you have of Black people’s abilities.

            Jeff says — “but if you’re willing to say the Government has no business protecting the victims of such violence from an angry mob of “private” citizens, then how does it benefit anyone that perhaps you’d make a better neighbor than a Klansman?”.
            As usual, being a typical Liberal Progressive, Jeff puts words in my mouth. I have never said that the Government has no business protecting Black people from violence. In fact, I have stated often that Government’s only legitimate role is to protect people from the Force of others.

            Jeff, I think from your comment that you are the bigot.

            A local example of Jeff’s mixing apples and oranges would be to imagine that a Black man lives in a neighborhood of Whites. I would arrest anybody who dared to harm those Blacks in other but self-defense. Jeff would Force the White neighbors to invite the Blacks into their homes whether they liked them or not.

          • Jeff

            Do you, on any level, understand what life was like for Black people in the South prior to Federal intervention the mid-60s? For you to say you would have opened a business is the height of pie in the sky thinking. First, who would finance you? Second, what would have been the reaction of the Bubbas? They didn’t exactly confine their expressions of their dislike of competition or “uppityness” at Chamber of Commerce meetings, you know. Jim Crow was not enforced at debating societies, you know, but through mob violence not only tolerated but actually led by local law enforcement. Without Federal law enforcement involvement, there would have been no justice for minorities at all.

            For you to make your creepy comments accusing me of bigotry because I point out the obvious in the face of your head in the clouds cliches simply illustrates a lack of understanding on your part. I feel like the arguments you are making are so foolish in light of our recent (half century old) history that pointing out their foolishness is akin to your opposing the economic ideas of an actual communist who believes the Government should own all the means of production.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Talk about clueless, Jeff. People start businesses on a shoestring every day in this country. And for larger endeavors they can pool their money which is also done everyday in this country. You are a Bigot, Jeff, because it is you who is claiming the Blacks can’t perform, not I. I believe they can do anything that White people can do (oftentimes better) and that you so-called “concerned” people are actually holding them back by giving them a free ride on other people’s unwilling shoulders. Your kind are giving them excuses for lack of effort as well as teaching them (and whites also) that it’s okay to help themselves to other people’s money. In other words, you’re creating Moral Hazard, the very thing that is always the downfall of Socialistic Societies.
            Here’s a Black lady who escaped from the bounds that Liberal Progressives use to hold down the Blacks:
            http://www.urbancure.org/book/biography.html
            You, Jeff, are the creepy guy.

          • Jeff

            If you think a Black man could go into business in the Deep South in the 1950s or early 60s without a visit from the Local KKK, you’re dreaming. Black men and boys got lynched for making eye contact with white people. Do you know anything about the Greenwood Riot in Tulsa, Oklahoma, not even a part of the Deep South? I sent you a link but it’s not Mises so it’s out of your comfort zone.

            It is you who side with the bigots who just want to be left alone to discriminate, CB. What did “states rights” mean in the 60s anyway? To everyone not a bigot it meant leaving Mississippi to do things as it saw fit no matter how poorly or unconstitutionally it treated, and permitted to be treated, its Black citizens. According to you, that was just fine. In fact, in your creepiest comment to date, you implied the “do gooders” are even worse than the bigots. So, Goodman, Cheney, and Schwerner (I’m sure you’ve heard of them.) were worse than those who killed them?

            Frankly, Dave, I couldn’t care less what a CB like you says about me, but calling me a bigot because I say a Black Man couldn’t start a business that really competed with White-owned businesses in the pre-Civil Rights South should be laughable even for you. It would be like calling me a bigot for saying Blacks can’t sprout wings and fly.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            I’m dealing with a Bigot right now, Creepy B Jeff. And that bigot wants to help himself to my money and my Freedom. If I don’t comply, he will have his hired thugs beat me and throw me in Prison. I don’t know why you think you’re any different than the KKK thugs, CB Jeff. You aren’t. You just hide behind the coat-tails of somebody else you hire to do your dirty work.

          • Jeff

            I’ve given you way too much credit for brainpower, Dave. I knew you had some kooky ideas, but I thought you had some basic intelligence. I was wrong. You can’t even stay on topic without a creepy personal attack. I’m pointing out the need for Federal action in the south in the 60s. I have no idea what you’re talking about.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            I wouldn’t expect you to have any idea, Jeff. You have been too busy name-calling those who you disagree with to learn anything. You are just the typical Creepy Liberal Progressive who can’t disagree with somebody without resorting to adolescent manipulative techniques.
            I think you dropped your binky.

          • Jeff

            Dave, I have assiduously tried to keep our communication substantive, but you insist on calling people who disagree with you murderers, thieves, shills, and bigots. Virtually every post of yours engages in name-calling so don’t get so high and mighty when I call a creep a creep. BTW: you still haven’t responded to anything of substance I’ve stated. You can pretend you can engage in substantive dialog because you can always link to a mises article, but the reality is you haven’t a clue about the real world.
            Anyone who examines your posts will conclude, as I have, that you really are a creepy name-caller pretending to be a high-minded intellectual. Excuse me, but while I rarely agreed with Bill Buckley, I don’t recall him calling anyone a shill or a thief for believing we pay taxes for common projects. I can’t imagine him, on his worst day, saying anything as dumb as you have about the “do-gooder” civil rights workers being worse than the bigots or calling someone a bigot for believing if the Government hadn’t stepped in in the 60s that nothing much would have changed for Blacks in the South.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            poor widdo jeffy. he is so undeserving. I am a bad man.

          • Jeff

            Bad man? No, too ineffectual to be really bad. Nutcase? The evidence kind of points that way.

    • Don 2

      Kudo’s to Rush Limbaugh, Glenn Beck, and Hannity listeners who knew who this community antagonizer was long before he ever got elected by the low-information voters.

      • Ron r

        Russ, Hannity, and Beck , and you call 51%of the population ignorant? Boy have you been had. Three of the biggest degenerates on the air waves. Three a//wipes who should be hit with s//t!!

        • TheOriginalDaveH

          Care to tell us anything they have said that you disagree with and why?
          Yeah, I know, that would take some effort and facts — Neither of which agrees with Liberal Progressivism.

          • WTS/JAY

            That’s too much work for Ron, DaveH. His contribution to society is nervously waiting for his “check” and hoping it arrives before the liquor-store closes.

        • Don 2

          Who is Russ? Once again, Ron r shows that he doesn’t have a clue. LMAO

          • Ron r

            My bad , but you knew which idiot I was talking about.. So how about Rush the recovering (?) addict . Or the guy who got draft deferments (3) with the uncle on the draft board. Same as D.Chaney who got six because he did Not want to be the only father in Vietnam . At least that’s how it looks. Regressive’s !!!!!

          • Don 2

            Let me get this straight. You are going to be critical of a powerless private citizen radio talk show host who was taking prescription pain medication for severe back pain, but you’re going to give a pass to Barack Obama, an admitted cocaine abuser and pot head who got high for kicks, who is President of the United States and who controls the most powerful military in the world. Please do me a favor Ron r, and justify Obama’s cocaine use. I want a really big laugh.

          • Ron r

            Yeah both he and Bush. You can’t be serious about the fat junkie. He set his maid up, and he is a recreational druggie. Damn man you got it bad. You feel sorry for a fat millionaire who can afford all the drug treatment he wants. Or is it you just feel for the millionaire. Typical love the rich hate the poor. Poor Rush, you gotta be kidding or on drugs yourself. Please don’t play those crakhead games I’m trying to watch fooball

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Ahh yes, another “compassionate” Liberal Progressive outs himself.
            These are the people who think they know best how to run your life, Folks.

          • Don 2

            Rush fat? Shows how much you think you know that don’t know.

            You did make me laugh though, by completely sidestepping Obama using cocaine and pot just to get stoned out of his mind, and then ‘attempt’ to change the focus to a rich vs. poor issue. At least you’re using your copy of “Rules for Radicals.”

            By the way, you obviously have something against fat people? Does that include fat black people, or just fat white people, or just fat white conservatives?

          • Ron r

            Or maybe he dislikes fat black women named Oprah. Other than that I also dislike beck, Hannity,and Cain . So what’s you point. Mad because your man crush is a junkie.

  • real talk 1

    As long as we as a nation continue to make Obama the only focal point in this mess the country is now in we are going to continue to allow the same old same old. we have people like REID PELOSI who are wielding the gavel in the chambers term after term year after year they are the ones that keep this garbage in the forefront they are the perpetrators of lies distortions and scandals and they need to get our attention and be removed forever . amen

  • real talk 1

    As long as we as a nation continue to make Obama the only focal point in this mess the country is now in we are going to continue to allow the same old same old. we have people like REID PELOSI who are wielding the gavel in the chambers term after term year after year they are the ones that keep this garbage in the forefront they are the perpetrators of lies distortions and scandals and they need to get our attention and be removed forever . amen

    • Robert Messmer

      Without term limits, they will never be removed forever. The names and faces will change but not the spirit. Look how long Strom Thurmond, Byrd, Ted Kennedy were there. It is the whole “political elite class” that must be done away with.

  • TheOriginalDaveH

    Why would he do that? The answer is simple:
    http://dissidentvoice.org/2008/05/beware-the-psychopath-my-son/

  • GiveMeLiberty,OrGiveMeDeath

    OK, Wayne Allen is correct, so what needs to happen is for all conservatives to band together, just like the 2 million bikers did, make it our goal to eliminate every republican that has been ignoring We The People. Bring in a new guard, and preferably people that are average everyday people that are not of the old big money of government. We need people that are Of the People and will not go to congress like Tom Cotton of Arkansas did, Tom spoke like a real person that would listen to those he was to represent, but turns out WE were wrong about him, (Tom Cottons’ first big move was to ignore Arkansas and to go along with Obama’s war on Syria). So People we need to really know the hearts of our people we choose to elect to any office. When we elect someone it is not for their ability to decide for themselves, it is the ability to listen to us, and then take the action needed.

    • TheOriginalDaveH

      Why are you so dead set on perpetuating the Party of Crony Capitalism, the Party of War? There is a very real choice — The Libertarian Party, the Party of Freedom:
      http://www.lp.org/platform

      To understand what Libertarianism is:
      http://library.mises.org/books/Murray%20N%20Rothbard/For%20a%20New%20Liberty%20The%20Libertarian%20Manifesto.pdf

      • KG

        Libertarians are anything but ‘freedom’ loving people. They are closet Fascists and National Socialist at heart.
        “Remember, it’s not about ‘freedom’, it’s about ‘morality’.”

        • TheOriginalDaveH

          Feel Free to back that up with logical facts, KGB. Or you can just utter your usual Socialist Progressive nonsense that we have come to expect from you.

          • Dave

            When do you use logical facts DaveH? You use mises.org that is stuck in the 1800’s with no accreditation… or the corporatist heritage foundation that helped lay the foundation of Obamacare…
            You have no leg to stand on when it comes to logic.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Shill Dave. Here for more thumbs down?
            I could beat you at any mental contest except those contingent on lying or ad hominem attacks. You would beat me handily on those.

          • Dave

            Nope, just pointing out that you are full of it and a paid shill for mises and Bob…

          • WTS/JAY

            Don’t you have a fictitious business to run, Dave? LOL!

          • jon in san jose

            mises does not have enough clout to pay any shills.

          • WTS/JAY

            Wasn’t the Constitution written in the 1800’s?

          • Dave

            Does your mom have a history book? Things have changed somewhat since the early 1800’s Jay…

          • WTS/JAY

            Things have changed? Most certainly, Dave…progressive-dogs like you and Adolph in the White-house no longer respect the Constitution and would like nothing more then to burn it and be done with it. So yes, in that respect, things have most certainly changed, Dave.

          • Dave

            As if conservatives (Patriot Act) and anti-liberty laws like ones against same sex marriage cares about the Constitution. LOL

          • WTS/JAY

            Then maybe you should have a sit down with your president and ask him why he didn’t scrap the (Patriot Act) and all the subsequent anti-liberty laws borne out of it. But i think that if you were to do so, he would most likely think of you a “domestic-terrorist” and lock you up indefinitely; for after all, he’s all about freedom and liberty, is he not?

          • jon in san jose

            Good government has only gone out of style since 1800. Attempts to dictate are as in fashion as ever.

          • jon in san jose

            And democracy was invented by the Greeks Before the Christian Era. Age obviously has nothing to do with good.

          • WTS/JAY

            Are you saying democracy is a good thing? If so, what caused the collapse of the Greek-empire?

          • Jeff

            I guess 1789-92 is close enough to the 1800s. It’s as close to correct as you’ll ever get, anyway!

          • WTS/JAY

            Picky picky, numb-skull, aren’t you?

          • Dave

            You are the idiot Jay-bird..Jeff is merely straightening you how like we all have too from time to time…

          • WTS/JAY

            Hmm, seems i have you and your girlfriend, Jeff, all upset. Or maybe its just that time of the month for the both of you, huh? I hear Midol is good for the cramping. Good luck with that, ladies..

          • Jeff

            Actually, there are 2 history questions you just might get right. When was the War of 1812? and Who’s buried in Grant’s Tomb?

          • WTS/JAY

            Say, that’s very clever, Jeff. Something i would expect from a 12 year old. How old are you, by the way?

          • Jeff

            It doesn’t matter. Even at 12 I’d have found you incomparably dense.

          • WTS/JAY

            Of course, it matters, Jeff, since you still have the mentality of a 12 year old. Proof? Whenever someone disagrees with you, you pout and throw a temper tantrum typical of a 12 year old. So go suck on a lollipop and go play with your grandson’s choo choo trains, like a good little boy.

          • Jeff

            Off the charts stupidity. Show me one post of mine evidencing anger. And were I ever to get angry, it would be with someone I think knows better but is being purposely obtuse. You are simply not very bright.

          • WTS/JAY

            How would you, being a stupid person, recognize stupidity, Jeff? Therefore, yours is a stupid statement.

          • jon in san jose

            An organization needs no accreditation to teach logic or preach good; the people or org. that comes first certainly would have no accreditation! What was your parents’ accreditation to teach you adult behavior?

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            You have no credibility on this board, Shill Dave. Isn’t it about time to change your identity?

        • jon in san jose

          Before you can teach or preach morality, you must convince your fellow human beings that they have the FREEDOM and power to choose. Freedom is a pre-requisite for good. First God gave us freedom of choice, THEN he said “Choose good.” Those who are not given freedom of choice (like in a dictatorship) have not chosen their behavior, so good behavior cannot be expected — only conformity can be expected.
          Do not be fooled by the means whereby autocrats implement socialism: label it Democratic or label it National, its still government from the elites, and not government by the people Since LIbertarians reject government from above, they are the only TRUE opposition.

          • KG

            Morality is nothing more than an ability to distinguish between good and evil. Since it is dependent on whom is making the judgement, I need to ask ‘Whose Morality?” I mean Adolph Hitler had morals, Pinochet had morals, Franco, Mussolini, Margaret Thatcher, Ronald Reagan – they all had morals.

            G-d did not say “choose Good” because that would have not been a choice. He said:

            Genesis 2
            King James Version (KJV)
            16 And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:
            17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

            What G-d was offering Man was MORALITY. In other words, to be as G-d judging right from wrong. Once you have that power (or believe you have that power) you have become G-d. And one thing we learn from the Old Testament is that G-d hates competition.

            quote:Since LIbertarians reject government from above, they are the only TRUE opposition.

            Yes, they are as G-d in their own eyes. And as G-ds they have the power to rule themselves as they see fit.

            Isaiah 14:13-14
            King James Version (KJV)
            13 For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north:
            14 I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High.

            No wonder the most evil dictators in history were really Libertarians at heart. Pinochet, Hitler, Stalin – George W, etc.

      • GiveMeLiberty,OrGiveMeDeath

        Say What, I am not, If you read what I said, I was saying to throw out the old and bring in the new.
        Good Greif read dude.

    • Robert Messmer

      Part of the reason he ignored Arkansas–you don’t sign his paychecks. They come from the Federal Government so no matter how much he “votes his conscience” instead of what the folks back home what, he still gets paid.

    • Cathy Hovey

      Why are you only attacking the Republicans? I believe the House would vote to impeach the faux pres but KNOW that his dumbocrats in the senate would stop it. NONE of them are any good to anyone anymore. ALL of them go with the flow, unions that pay them off, and gay rights org. that pay them off etc. That leaves the FEW that are there that WANT to stick with the consitution, but are outvoted every time. Like them or not, when the next election comes up in 2014, you need to vote Tea Party, and get rid of ALL the ‘old guard’. Some of them are already ancient (pelosi and reid are both 73) and need to be put into a nursing home. Rangel is 83!

      • GiveMeLiberty,OrGiveMeDeath

        I am attacking Republicans, due to the fact that Repub. is no longer doing as they should, and we expect crap out of Democrat’s, but not out of our Republicans.

    • jon in san jose

      While Obummer studies how to do wrong, and makes things worse for his party, the nation, and the world, it is actually possible that Cotton believes he did right. After a few years in the belly of the beast (DC), he may learn that he was duped like so many Congresspeople before him. It IS unfortunate he did not come prepared for this vote and recognize the GOP ring in his nose.

  • Terry Bateman

    Actually, Aid to Families with Dependent Children has been ruining black
    people and black neighborhoods for many years prior to Obama by
    keeping fathers out of households that receive welfare benefits.

    Improving worker productivity through technological advances is the
    major major reason for the mega trend of steep employment losses
    of recent decade. Yes, Obamacare makes it worse by discouraging
    creation of full-time jobs with health care benefits. However, employers
    will eventually figure out it is in their own interest to provide healthcare
    benefits to all long-term employees full and part-time if they want to
    have healthy people on the job and low employee turnover. Yes,
    even Wal-Mart will figure out they will make more money with less
    employee turnover when they pay better wages and health care
    benefits to full and part-time workers and raise their prices 1% to
    pay for it.

    If Obama had not shoved Obamacare down our throats, history would
    judge his administration much better than it will now.

    • TheOriginalDaveH

      Terry says — “Improving worker productivity through technological advances is the major major reason for the mega trend of steep employment losses of recent decade”.
      Hardly. Productivity increases boost economies by providing more goods and higher paying jobs for skilled workers. People will never run out of desired goods and services, so the more there are, the more jobs there will be. Read this, Terry, and see what I’m talking about:
      http://mises.org/daily/5277/When-Capital-Is-Nowhere-in-View

      Job losses are strictly the result of Big Government meddling in the economy. Remove the Government from the economy, and we will get a robust economy with employment for anybody who really wants to work.
      Government spends 40% of our GDP.
      Imagine a family of 5 working age people, 2 of them who do nothing but consume the production of the other 3, and harass them to boot. You have imagined Big Government.

      • Bill

        Good analogy, Dave
        If the government was out of the marketplace, imbalances would naturally correct themselves

        • nc

          Bill, when the government was out of the marketplace it was the Unions that corrected the imbalance! The same would be true if there were no controls today!
          The working man is forever having to fight the big businesses money to hold his place!
          management has never voluntarily corrected imbalances! It is they who create them!

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            There was no imbalance, NutCase, only advantage-seeking people pushing for special privileges.
            If you don’t like your employer, NutCase, start your own business. Only Government is keeping you from Freely doing that.

          • Dave

            The above post is not me DaveH… I essentially have my own business. I work under the name of my company but I support my clients (all private firms) in the way my clients need me too… and its funny that I am making more money today than I ever have before… With awful Obama in power… must be very confusing to you.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            System glitch. But nothing about you confuses me, Shill Dave. I know you as a self-serving advantage seeker who is here to deter people from learning about the concepts of Freedom. You are, beyond a shadow of a doubt, a Shill Dave.

          • Dave

            And you are a corporatist beyond a shadow of a doubt… you support the freedom of the wealthy to continue to transfer more wealth into their pockets.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Actually, Shill Dave, you are the corporatist. The small Government that I advocate would never be able to aid their Crony Capitalists like the large Government that you advocate. Obviously you are here to mislead and confuse ignorant people who might otherwise learn about Freedom and stop your Crony Capitalists from getting their special privileges from their Crony Politicians.

          • Dave

            Lets see… you have NO example of the country you advocate in the modern industrial global economic world to illustrate how well your theory works….
            It is you that is perfectly fine with big money in the political arena and that big money buys the crony capitalism you say you are against. You are not fooling anyone corporatist DaveH.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Here is a whole list of Countries based on their level of Economic Freedom. Those at the bottom (the most Socialistic) are clearly much worse economies than those at the top (the most Capitalistic):
            http://www.heritage.org/index/ranking

            We may have no purely Capitalistic countries, but we have had several purely Socialistic countries and they have been miserable failures.
            Leaders naturally seek special privileges so of course they resist purely Capitalistic systems in which they would have little power.
            Socialists can only exist by riding on the backs of Capitalists. They are parasites.
            Shill Dave wants to take us back to the pre-revolutionary days when Leaders suppressed everybody but their Crony Capitalists.

          • Dave

            And DaveH once again plays word games because he loses the argument…. Of course if I disagree with DaveH’s theories, I am a socialist in DaveH’s lying world.
            I believe in a hybrid system of capitalism and socialistic aspects…. Its the system that made this country great.
            Again, Corporatist Dave supports unlimited money in the political process and I do not… Crony capitalism does not happen on a large scale without that money…
            Sorry DaveH, you are exposed as a fraud yet again.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Shill Dave says — “I believe in a hybrid system of capitalism and socialistic aspects…. Its the system that made this country great”.
            Newsflash, Shill Dave, we’re in a recession thanks to your hybrid (and immoral) system.

          • Dave

            No, its your corporatism that is doing the damage corporatist DaveH

          • WTS/JAY

            No, you’re not a socialist, Dave, you are a lying Marxist. See, i stick up for you. :)

          • http://cowboybyte.com/ Alondra

            His business is Parasitism.

          • Dave

            if only you had the synaptic connections to know what a Marxist is…I might differ with you on the point…. but since I know you are a conservative, well… pity seems more in order.

          • WTS/JAY

            I understand why you are so upset, Dave; believe me, i do. You are angry because I exposed you for the liar that you are, and that does not sit well with you. But seriously, how long before people figured out that you do not run a business as you claim, for how could you, when you spend all day blogging? You really did it to yourself; you, were the one who made the claim that you run a business but didn’t’ have the sense to curb the time you spend on PLD so as to give, at last, the appearance that you were busy running a fictitious-business. So don’t get angry at me for pointing out the obvious, rather, you should be angry at yourself, for how could you be so stupid? Actually, you, should asking yourself that question; Dave, how could you have been so stupid? Or, Dave, did you honestly think that no one would notice? Seriously, you are not too bright.

          • Dave

            I’m not upset… I just laugh at idiots like you who drink the Kool-Aid of WAR, BobL and think the BS that DaveH throws up is based in fact.
            You are a sad person because you never have anything of value to say. But that what a little boy from his mom’s basement has to offer I guess.

          • WTS/JAY

            So i was right, you don’t have a business, and you lied about having one. Don’t you think that’s really pathetic? But you know, you could easily prove me wrong. Does your high-profile business have a web-site? All of them do, you know. Does yours, Davey…? :)

          • WTS/JAY

            CDW? That doesn’t prove anything. All that show’s is a company that provides technology products and services for business, government and education, and bla bla bla…it doesn’t actually prove that you work there or for them in whatever capacity. You don’t expect us to just take you at your word, do you, Dave? We are going to need more information than just the name of a company, before we take you at your word. Because in case you haven’t noticed, your word ain’t worth spit! So until you can actually prove it, we’ll just have to continue assuming you are blogging from your mommy’s basement.

          • WTS/JAY

            Good point! That’s why i don’t brag about what i do for a living, as most here, Dave, because it cannot be verified; so why would you, knowing full well that you can always play the privacy-card if challenged to prove it? But i’ve noticed that its the left-wing on PLD that brag, or assume any role they wish, knowing full well they are under no obligation to prove it, since, like you, can claim it would put their privacy at risk. Oh, we’ve had teachers, professors, brain-surgeons, scientists…ect…but what need is there for all this bragging and posturing from the left-wing, Dave? Are you people compensating for something? Are your opinions so weak and feeble that they need to be fortified with fiction?

          • WTS/JAY

            Dave: I believe in a hybrid system of capitalism and socialistic aspects…. Its the system that made this country great.

            Are you aware, dumb dumb, that this country is completely broke and bankrupt?

          • Dave

            yes it is… thanks to corporatism, tax cut and spend policy and stupid wars like Iraq, Vietnam etc…
            Bob, are you going to warn your pupil Jay about the comment policy? Oh yeah… I forget… Bob is Mr Double-Standard….

          • WTS/JAY

            Dave: yes it is… thanks to corporatism, tax cut and spend policy and stupid wars like Iraq, Vietnam etc…

            So why would you refer to this country as great?

          • Dave

            because unlike you conservatives, I love this country. I love the fact that when we all work together, we can solve big problems like civil rights, create infrastructure. I love this country for it can be… But you conservatives are bound and determined to take this country back to the bad ole days in the name of corp wealth redistribution.

          • WTS/JAY

            You just can’t make up your mind, can you, Dave? First you say that both parties, together, conspired to exact the downfall of this country, and now you lay the blame at the feet of these “mysterious” Conservatives. And you wonder why no one takes you seriously, and in fact, consider you to be, but a joke? Consistency, that will garner you respect and credibility, and not constantly flip-flopping. Capish?

          • http://batman-news.com samurai

            You love this country, meaning you are a patriot? Ha, ha, ha, ha! Tell me Dave, would a patriotic country do this?
            http://www.wnd.com/2013/09/d-c-throws-up-roadblock-for-patriotic-bikers/
            Would it even think about doing these things?
            http://www.christianpost.com/news/christian-food-pantry-refuses-to-give-up-jesus-loses-government-food-contributions-104186/
            http://www.christianpost.com/news/california-oks-same-sex-weddings-for-prison-inmates-104131/
            FOR GOD AND COUNTRY! 하나님하고 나라를 위해서!
            You need both love of country and faith in GOD to be a patriot. This leaves you out.
            “Better to fight for something than to die for nothing.”
            General George S. Patton, Jr.
            Great American General

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            I remind you, Shill Dave, that the “bad ole days” were those before the revolution when Leaders took advantage of their citizens. And now the morally-bankrupt Liberal Progressives have taken us back to that.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            How much do your handlers pay you to spread your misinformation, Agent Dave? Of course it would have to be taxpayer money, because nobody would pay out of their own pocket for the nonsense you deliver.

          • Dave

            You need to ask yourself that question DaveH. You are the only one between the two of us peddling unproven theory as fact put forth by an un-accredited institute…
            So how much does your handler BobL pay you?

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            For those who might be ignorant enough to believe anything Shill Dave says:
            http://mises.org/page/1448/About-The-Mises-Institute
            http://mises.org/Faculty

          • WTS/JAY

            Let’s see…you have no working experience, except in spreading your BS, and you live in mommy’s basement. Hmm…is it any wonder that everything you say is regarded as poppy-cock?

          • Dave

            Yawn….

          • WTS/JAY

            Yes, i know, after a long and hard day of blogging, you need your nappy. Maybe your mommy can call all your imaginary customers and tell them her little boy is having a nappy. Sleep tight, dumb dumb…

          • Jeff

            Have you EVER had an original thought or have you always been a parrot? Now I’m sure you’ll cut and paste the same question to me. God, what a moron.

          • WTS/JAY

            Hey Jeff, have you EVER had an original thought or have you always been a parrot? Now I’m sure you’ll cut and paste the same question to me. God, what a moron.

          • http://cowboybyte.com/ Alondra

            Each morning he is receiving the daily mantra & talking points.

          • WTS/JAY

            And you’re the biggest bull-sh**ter on PLD, Dave, living in your mommy’s basement, collecting welfare.

          • Dave

            Your mom called… dinner time little boy

          • WTS/JAY

            Your fictitious customers called…they would like to know if the fictitious contracts are still valid?

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Polly want a cracker? Baaaraaack! You Liberal Progressives are so clever.

          • WTS/JAY

            That sounds like a lot of BS, davey boy, since you spend all your waking hours here on PLD…just when do you have the time to run your business, at night?

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Shill Dave, I have a hard time imagining you doing any real work at all, since you’re on this board all day long. There’s little doubt in my mind that your “work” is spreading misinformation to confuse ignorant people.

          • Dave

            As I believe you are here as a paid corporatist shill by BobL and Mises that you try and peddle here so hard… Even some of your conservative brethren here are turning on you because they are starting to realize like I have from the beginning, that you are an arrogant, lying corporatist shill. I do my work and make you look like the fool you are… Its called multi-tasking.

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Sure, Shill Dave, you make me look like a fool, and the readers are accidentally hitting the thumbs down button on your comments, right?
            Multitasking? You mean you’re shilling on more than one website?

          • nc

            ABORIGINAL, that the dumbest post I have ever read! Are you sure there is not a gas leak in your mother’s basement! How many coal miners and textile workers et al with families can just walk off their jobs and start a new business! Did your mommy get you a job too? Was that for memorizing mises or drawing his picture lefthanded??

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            You must not read your own posts then, NutCase.

          • WTS/JAY

            Put down the bottle, nc.

      • Robert Messmer

        Would not a truer picture be with 3 of them doing nothing?

    • Ron r

      Both of you need to sit in a corner and give your talking points back to R. Phibis and the RNC. I won’t address ADC because more whites remain on the rolls than blacks and the single parent black home has been surpassed or is being surpassed by young white single parents. Though some of your arguments are sound , you are off base with the ACA. You also seem to have never seen a black person work.

      • http://batman-news.com samurai

        Speaking of Negros, not blacks, I have served with many in the army and I can tell you that they do not like Obama bin Laden either. Here are 2 articles about your “buddy” Obama bin Laden.
        http://www.eaglerising.com/1684/obama-gives-shout-muslim-brotherhood-supporters/
        http://www.eaglerising.com/1702/herman-cain-mocks-obama-kerry/
        The second one shows Herman Cain blasting Obama bin Laden, and very well also. FOR GOD AND COUNTRY! 하나님하고 나라를 위해서!
        You need both love of country and faith in GOD to be a patriot. This leaves you out.
        “Governments could not give the rights essential to happiness. We claim them from a higher source: from the King of kings, and Lord of all the earth.”
        Rev. John Dickinson
        Signer of the Constitution
        Governor of Pennsylvania
        Governor of Delaware
        General in the American Revolution
        Devout Christian

        • Ron r

          Is there a difference between the two? Now take your dumb a//to bed. It would be someone like you to come up with some dilly sh!! Like this. Look meathead, blacks /Negros can think independently of each other. I thought even a religious jihadist like yourself would know that. How did you escape the TDP?? Did you discharge soldiers if they had no religious preference on their tags?? 2am and you post BS like this. Hell I bet there were some Negro/ Black soldiers who hated your crazy a//!!

          • http://batman-news.com samurai

            Argument to ridicule and personal attacks. Just like your less intelligent ilk. Tell me, Rn, what tyrp of discharge is on your DD214? Dishonorable? BCD? What did the doctor say on your DD62? Did I discharge soldiers for not having any religious preference? No, for that was not my decision. I did have solders stand at courts martial for violating the UCMJ. I’ll bet you have at least one posted on your 2-1 and 2A. Sheesh! 3a.m. and this is all you post? Neeeeed to roll over and go back to sleep. FOR GOD AND COUNTRY! 하나님하고 나라를 위해서!
            You need both love of country and faith in GOD to be a patriot. This leaves you out.

          • Ron r

            Like I ask before, what’s the difference between the two. (Negro/Black) as far as anything else. Talk to the V A doctors about changing your meds.

  • alanjo

    Blacks now can’t say, ‘Da white man a-holdin’ m-down,’ anymore because they say Obama is black and he’s the one hurting them the most. Blacks foolishly voted for Obama because of his half-breed blackness and they ignored his ineptness. Black people don’t understand the world and can’t run a nation as Obama has proven. Watch this video for more on the subject http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=17m8OnHC7dQ

    • Deerinwater

      Well, ~ they can say it ~ but it don’t have the same sting as it use too.

      44~ has not hurt ~ people of color ~ any more then 43 did. ~

      • TheOriginalDaveH

        Oh, I think he has. He has succeeded in polarizing the races. No good will come from Obama’s Political machinations.

    • KennyLLC

      I think he may turn this place into another Zimbabwe if he isn’t impeached.
      He tried to start a racewar in the south over a self defense case, and STILL has a racewar monger, Ayo Kimathi, on paid leave to spew his hate from his home-based operation on the internet. A DHS employee sworn to kill all whites !
      What’s next with this Muslim usurper is something that may never make it into the history books.
      WWIII ?

  • Kathy

    WHAT? 12 million undocumented – NOT!!! 12 million ILLEGAL aliens – YES. Could you try to learn to type in English? That is a big part of the problem in America. Some immigrants come to this county, learn English and assimilate to our values and laws and become citizens LEGALLY! Go back to where you came from if you want to still live your old ways.

    • Robert Messmer

      Kathy how about a little kindness? So the poster used the pc term “undocumented” instead of labeling them as the illegal criminals that they are, so what? The government is going to grant amnesty no matter what they are called. Her post is in English as I am able to read it and do not read or actually speak any foreign languages. No where in her post does she mention live in the old ways. In fact, she states that not only has Obama hurt his own race but has also failed to keep his promises to the illegals. As far as we know, she could be a 10th generation (or more) American.

    • TheOriginalDaveH

      I certainly don’t condone illegal actions, but the vast majority of the illegals are good human beings who are just trying to make a decent living here that they can’t make in Mexico due to their crappy economy which is due to their oversized Government. The real irony is that so many people are calling for even more Government here to remedy the situation. That will work but not for the reasons most people think. It will work because as our Government grows larger, and more corrupt, our economy will suck like theirs and they will no longer desire to come here.

      • jorgaone

        So why wait for this solution? Simply send them back home NOW–and let them reap the “benefits” of their bloated government, as we are having to do.

    • MargaretJacobson

      This most recent batch of illegals here are not really interested in assimilation. The (for the most part) came for welfare, they DEMAND we accept the fact that they disrespect our laws, customs. Hispanics are not the only illegals here. There as millions of Muslims that by their own admission CANNOT accept living in a society that grants equality and justice to all. The recent past group refuses assimilation. Example government firms in a multitude of languages ( California ). Even many food items are written in more than one language. Tests for drivers licenses are in several foreign languages! I ask myself questions like : how can these “lawbreakers” come to our country and DEMAND welfare, free education etc when they disrespect our laws, customs etc? Then demand we bring all their welfare grabbing relatives here? They cry out for “family reunification” …..I believe in family reunification too! GO BACK TO WHERE YOU COME FROM !! THAT’S FAMILY REUNIFICATION !

  • TheOriginalDaveH

    The Black Americans have been used as Pawns by self-serving Politicians since the mid 1800s. The Republicans used them as pawns in the Republican suppression of the South during the Reconstruction Era, and both the Republicans and the Democrats have continued to use them sporadically since then to grow their Power and Perks:
    http://mises.org/journals/jls/16_2/16_2_6.pdf
    We would have learned to get along with each other many decades ago if the Government wasn’t granting special privileges to Blacks and other minorities, thus creating resentment among the non-privileged classes. The Politicians don’t care what messes they make as long as they get re-elected.

    • peric

      It is even worse now with our president (the great divider) who went on national television and stuck his big racist mouth over the microphone to let everyone know just whose side he was on. I hope this ignoramus gets impeached and the day after his impeachment he gets mugged by a thug in the night… And black people call white people racist; they should all look in the mirror.

    • jorgaone

      It’s another case of the government making the Blacks “special” for so long that they have learned to EXPECT this–while all the while crying that they are ALL better than the ONLY 13% of the population that they are…

  • KingKen

    President Strangelove embellishes everything he
    proposes. This sly cretin couldn’t lead me to a picnic. I’m positive there
    would be arsenic in the potato salad.

    The proof is the arsenic in Obamacare, the NDAA, the TSA, and Homeland
    Security. We have an enemy in the White House leading us into American Tyranny.
    I’m suspicious that it is too late to escape.

  • WTS/JAY

    Richard Dawkins Endorses Pedophilia…

    Blogger Ray Comfort said: “This society in which we live is radically changing. What previous generations saw as evil is now embraced as being good. It is a dangerous and slippery slope upon which we stand when we reject what Solomon called the beginning of wisdom—the fear of God.” The world goes through waves of radical change. We swing like a pendulum in a grandfather clock, never standing still. The pendulum swings in one direction for long periods of time, lasting hundreds of years. As we swing further and further away from our ideological beginnings, we move into deep, uncharted water. What happens when we do this is a change in the fabric of our morality. The farther away we move, the more ties are broken, leaving us unable to remember, or care about the past. There are many people who argue that the slippery slope cultural argument is invalid. This is because they are afraid of its truth. But the slippery slope argument is as strong as they come. Once we fall down the slope, we must continue to fall until we reach the bottom.

    The subjective morality we create for ourselves is what gets us by, but it lacks any grounding.

    According to Salon: “In a recent interview with the Times magazine, Richard Dawkins attempted to defend what he called ‘mild pedophilia,’ which, he says, he personally experienced as a young child and does not believe causes ‘lasting harm.’

    Dawkins went on to say that one of his former school masters ‘pulled me on his knee and put his hand inside my shorts,’ and that to condemn this ‘mild touching up’ as sexual abuse today would somehow be unfair.

    ‘I am very conscious that you can’t condemn people of an earlier era by the standards of ours. Just as we don’t look back at the 18th and 19th centuries and condemn people for racism in the same way as we would condemn a modern person for racism, I look back a few decades to my childhood and see things like caning, like mild pedophilia, and can’t find it in me to condemn it by the same standards as I or anyone would today,’ he said.”

    In essence, Dawkins is endorsing pedophilia. He looks back to his childhood with a different judgment than he would use today. In Dawkins’ view lies the inherent idiocy of subjective morality. According to Dawkins’ perspective, because his abuse took place decades ago, it cannot be judged. Why? Is there a statute of limitations on perversity of which I am unaware? No, he holds this view because he cannot hold any other without violating his personal subjective morality…

    Read more at: http://lastresistance.com/3185/richard-dawkins-endorses-pedophilia/#GOjs3ceRvkw6SErh.99

    • http://cowboybyte.com/ Alondra

      It should not be surprise.
      Did not you know that he is disabled not only physically, but mentally as well?

      • WTS/JAY

        More precisely; he’s morally-incontinent.

        • http://cowboybyte.com/ Alondra

          Morality is based on the mentality

          • WTS/JAY

            Of course, the two are connected.

        • jorgaone

          “Morally incontinent” HeHeHe
          AND correct!
          AND Mentally incontinent too…
          Prostate AND brain problems. huh?

    • http://batman-news.com samurai

      Well said and keep up the good fight fellow patriot. The man is a liar and cares nothing for his fellow man. He doesn’t care if he burns or not. The man is insane and has no chance of recovering his right state of mind. Here is something that he would support.
      http://www.freedomoutpost.com/2013/09/precious-little-girl-dismembered-still-alive-obamas-psychotic-syrian-rebels/
      FOR GOD AND COUNTRY! 하나님하고 나라를 위해서!
      You need both love of country and faith in GOD to be a patriot.
      “Greatful to Almighty God for the blessings which, through Jesus Christ our Lord, He had conferred on my beloved country of her emancipation and on myself in permitting me, under circumstances of mercy, to live to the age of 89 years, and to survive the fiftieth year of independence, adopted by Congress on the 4th of July, 1776, which I originally subscribed on the 2nd day of August of the same year and of which I am now the last surviving signer.”
      Charles Carroll
      Signer of the Declaration of Independence
      Delegate to the Constitutional Convention
      Framer of the Bill of Rights
      U.S. Senator
      Devout Christian

    • Dave

      What a sad little boy you are Jay…
      What is with you and your fellow psychotic Alondra posting this which has NOTHING to do with the WAR babble…
      Idiots like you won’t ever go to the original article or hear the original interview… No, morons like you only like lifting crap from your fellow extremist sites… and twisting what the man said.
      And while I don’t agree with atheism any more than I do man made religions like Christianity, Judaism or Islam… For Christians to come out and cast a false stone like this when you consider the history of child abuse in the Catholic fairytale just exposes more conservative hypocrisy.

      • http://batman-news.com samurai

        SSDD, eh Dave? Your post is nothing but argument to ridicule, but that’s OK. We have come to expect that from you and your ilk. What happened with certain, not all, priests was a tragedy and either been takeb care of, or is under investigation. The ones that were found guilty in America are either in jail or have served their sentences and have been released. Always willing to perform the old duck and cover, eh Dave? Speaking of which, here is an article dealing with the Catholic Church in Syria. A real patriotic American would want to help them out.
        http://www.ijreview.com/2013/09/76796-catholic-patriarch-syria-obama-criminal-attack-will-benefit-muslim-extremists/
        FOR GOD AND COUNTRY! 하나님하고 나라를 위해서!
        You need both love of country and faith in GOD to be a patriot. This leaves you out.
        “The great, vital, and conservative element in our system is the belief of our people in the pure doctrines and the divine truths of the Gospel of Jesus Christ.”
        Congress, 1854
        *Ergo, we are a Christian nation.

        • Dave

          Idiots want to get tangled up in Syria theocrat…the Catholic church has plenty of money from fools like you willing to give it. Let the Vatican deal with their own issues…Let them petition the UN or the Arab League.

          Dumb Jay’s post is as moronic as it is having no place in this thread. But then again, you and Jay are not too bright like that.

          Enjoy your day theocrat.

      • WTS/JAY

        Are you a pedophile, Dave?

  • Warrior

    Well, well, well, it appears “benghazi” is finally catching up to hillary. The “dots” have finally been connected and as it turns out the whole fiasco is laid directly at her doorstep. BOOM, there goes 2016!

    Now here’s the situation. We have the “janitor n chief” who looks so stressed he just needs to step down for the sake of his own mental well being. He’s actually so close to jesse jr’s “bi-polar” disorder if he has to give another “talk” to the nation I don’t believe he can survive it without crumbling to his knees at the podium. So where does this leave us? Glad you asked. Ya see, “plugs” will become the “lead” candidate for 2016. I say, give it to him right now and let him take it for a “test spin” for the next 3 years. Ms. pants suit is toast and the rodeo clown has now lost all entertainment value. “Plugs”, i’m pluggin for ya brother. I wonder if he could name al gore-vp? SUPER IDEA EH?

    • http://batman-news.com samurai

      Well said and keep up the good fight fellow patriot. I can agree that Benghazi has finally caught up to Hitlery and her chances at 2016 are slim to none. Slim is walking out of the door. Here are some articles about Obama bin Laden, his administration, Benghazi, and Syria.
      http://www.freedomoutpost.com/2013/09/white-house-chief-of-staff-denis-mcdonough-comes-apprehending-benghazi-suspect-ahmed-abu-khattala-incompetent/
      http://www.freedomoutpost.com/2013/09/white-house-chief-of-staff-denis-mcdonough-admits-that-syria-evidence-is-not-irrefutablewants-to-bomb-them-anyway/
      http://www.freedomoutpost.com/2013/09/like-other-wars-syria-is-about-oil-because-it-equals-power-for-the-global-elite/
      http://www.freedomoutpost.com/2013/09/barack-obama-bad-really-bad-ugly/
      FOR GOD AND COUNTRY! 하나님하고 나라를 위해서!
      You need both love of country and faith in GOD to be a patriot.
      “…that all nations may bow to the scepter of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and that the whole earth may be filled with his glory.”
      John Hancock
      Signer of the Declaration of Independence
      President of Congress
      Revolutionary General
      Governor of Massachusetts
      Devout Christian

      • TheOriginalDaveH

        “This is not a court of law. And intelligence does not
        work that way”.
        Of course it doesn’t. We aren’t talking about normal people here. We’re talking about a Criminal Gang.

        • http://batman-news.com samurai

          True that! True that! Keep up the good fight fellow patriot. Here is an article that was first said by Representative Joe Wilson, but still holds true today.
          http://www.freedomoutpost.com/2013/09/rep-joe-wilson-right-barack-obama-lie/
          FOR GOD AND COUNTRY! 하나님하고 나라를 위해서!
          You need both love of country and faith in GOD to be a patriot.

          • Dave

            What an idiot theocrat Samurai is… On one sentence, calls atheist DaveH a patriot, then in his signoff tells use you need love of country and faith in “GOD” to be a patriot….
            But this is typical conservative thinking for you.

          • http://batman-news.com samurai

            Nice attempt at misdirection, but you have failed miserably. So I cannot call Dave H a patriot? Why not? Do I not possess the same God-given right of free speech, written in the 1st Amendment, as you do? Can’t I decide who I think is a patriot and who is not? Neeeeed to be making that popping sound. Better yet, just go home and stay there. Here are some articles about your “friend” Obama bin Laden.
            http://www.visiontoamerica.com/15836/record-number-not-in-labor-force-up-almost-10m-under-obama/
            http://www.visiontoamerica.com/15843/suspicious-treasury-says-debt-up-0-in-august-cbo-says-deficit-was-146-billion/
            http://www.americanoverlook.com/911-commemoration-cancelled-muslim-rally-allowed/103704
            FOR GOD AND COUNTRY! 하나님하고 나라를 위해서!
            You need both love of country and faith in GOD to be a patriot. This leaves you out.
            “Had the people, during the Revolution, had a suspicion of any attempt to war against Christianity, that Revolution would have been strangled in its cradle. In this age, their can be no substitute for Christianity. That was the religion of the founders of the republic and they expected it to remain the religion of their descendants.”
            U.S. House Judiciary Committee
            Congress, 1854

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            Samurai knows, Shill Dave, that although I am an atheist, I have more morality in my little finger than you have in your whole body.
            Samurai knows that you are the stuff that legends are made of. Bought any souls lately, Shill Dave?

          • Dave

            Sure you do DaveH. Of course you can show proof…. What am I talking about???? DaveH is always right in his mind. A legend if you will.

          • Quester55

            Dave,” A FOOL says in his heart, there is no GOD, ”
            may you find Jesus, before you DIE!

          • Dave

            Hey crackpot… What if I lived in an isolated spot where I never heard the “word of Jesus”? I guess those people go to hell even though I lived a more honest and loving life than you..

            Ah but such is the life of a controlling religious person.

          • Quester55

            EVERYONE, At One time or Another has had the Opportunity to Know about Jesus, even the likes of You, SO TELL US ALL, What Drives You into Such a HATE for Other Peoples Rights, To Believe in Whom they please?
            You ATHEIST are all alike, Quick to Speak & Ultra Slow to Think!
            May you find Jesus, Before He Finds You!

          • Quester55

            Your Mirror? your right, Thanks for Admitting that simple fact!

          • jorgaone

            Methinks I smell a Liberal among us…

          • Dave

            I know you conservatives hate it when you have dissention..
            That dung smell… that comes from conservatives who blindly follow was garbage W.A.R and his crackpot minions “throw up”

          • Jeff

            Does the ability to think make one a traitor in your gang?

        • MargaretJacobson

          The gangster from Chicago . Modern day al Capone . Chicago gangland in Washington, D.C. Bathhouse Barry. Devout Muslim. He is the worst thing that has happened to the USA in a long time!

          • TheOriginalDaveH

            As Clifford Thies says — “To say governments were formed to protect the rights of men would be historically incorrect. Almost all governments were formed by ruthless men exerting their will over others through the use of force. Some governments, over time, evolved toward the rule of law, perhaps only because their rulers saw that this would sanction their own continued enjoyment of the wealth that they possessed. In some instances, this evolution involved one or more “revolutions” in which those who were governed were able to better establish the rule of law”.
            http://mises.org/daily/3427

          • peric

            How true.

          • jorgaone

            “Bathhouse Barry” Gotta love that! HeHeHe…

      • TheOriginalDaveH

        Good posts, samurai.

        • http://batman-news.com samurai

          Thanks and keep up the good fight fellow patriot. FOR GOD AND COUNTRY! 하나님하고 나라를 위해서!
          You need both love of country and faith in GOD to be a patriot.

    • Carlos

      warrior, Think about what you are saying, if Obomber steps down guess who will step up, do you want that blithering idiot sitting in the White House. Better we get rid of the whole administration, a bloodless coup.
      We must get the congress straightened out, get rid of the RiNO’s

      Boehner has to go.

      • MargaretJacobson

        Bloodless coup? Empty congress!

      • Warrior

        Axually, the most stearn comments all week out of d.c. has been from jay carney. If oblamacare is not funded this class, class will be closed! You may have to admit, the entertainment value of these nincompoops is endless!

  • KennyLLC

    Well said.

  • Quester55

    Please don’t get me wrong, but this time I muse set the Record straight, We Don’t need another White man, to tell us that OBAMA has done sever damage to our Race, We’re not that Dumb! And Yes, Many of us are ROCKET SCIENTIST!

    However the Writer’s report is correct, We have all been Betrayed from this Black Pretender, ( & the school is still out, on him being black or not)

    No the damage is done, it’ll be a cold day in 4377, before we ever trust another zebra to be president again, especially if they are Muslim!!

    • peric

      And they call White people racist???

    • Nomad

      You all voted for him based on color. Black. Now you are making excuses that he may not be Black. What a pathetic cop out. Your comment sounds like soothing Obama would say. I’d say he’s Black based on your response.

      • Quester55

        THANK-YOU, Jeff H., And to Nomad, my vote was for Mr Romney, not that it’s any of your business!
        WE put our Faith & Trust in the Lord Jesus, & not in a Muslim, preaching hate for our lord!

    • JeffH

      This is specifically for Nomad & peric.

      Neither one of you have a clue as to what Quester55 meant or said in his/her comment and you both show just a bit of your own pre-concieved racists thoughts with your responses.

  • brazzos

    Another white bigot, who’d destroy America for his own greed, Wayne Allyn Root thinks he knows what is better for African- Americans.

    • jorgaone

      No, just reporting FACTS–and allowing ANY American to make his own decision about the interpretation of them…Whatever made you think he was being selective here? The STATISTICS he reported cover everyone, not just Blacks. Go back and read this IN DEPTH this time…

  • JeffH

    Is this not eddie47D all over again? Too stupid for their own word and whine, whine, whine!
    Adios Ignoramus Dave47D! Exit stage left!

    • Dave

      Take your meds Jeffrey shootem up bang bang….DaveH will be home soon from his mises sales meeting to give you a cuddle now be still…

      • JeffH

        Wah, wah, wah!

  • WTS/JAY

    Did you not understand the question, Dave?

    • Dave

      If you are like every other dumb-azz conservative, you think homosexuality is a choice… reality and science prove something different. ( over 100 other species are proven to have homosexuality in their behavior) but it is idiot religious conservatives that assign a morality judgement to it.
      Like your dimwit cousin Alondra for instance.

      • WTS/JAY

        Do you believe that for some sexual preference/identity is genetically predetermined?

        • Dave

          In most cases yes… If you were smart enough to look up genetic dispositions (like the odds of getting blue eyes from one parent with blue eyes and the other with brown)
          In the case of sexuality… 15% of the population is 100% heterosexual, 15% of the population is homosexual… the 70% remaining is combination of both but shows heterosexuality… If 15% is heterosexual, you combine that with the social pressure to be straight, then you have about 8% of the population that reports itself as gay.
          Sounds about right….
          Homosexuality isn’t right or wrong… it just “is” but moron conservatives assign morality to something that is scientifically proven to occur naturally. Because conservatives don’t think… they react emotionally to anything they don’t understand. They are scared little rabbits who need religion to protect them from the big bad unknown.

          • WTS/JAY

            Are you opposed to violence against gays, Dave?

          • WTS/JAY

            Ate you against abortion, Dave?

          • WTS/JAY

            How about wars? Are you against wars, Dave?

  • MLM

    Politics bring out the very worst in people. Obama should have never been elected, should have been impeached a long time ago.

  • vietnamvet1971

    like a mushroom The Great ONE the Savior of the Black people has used, abused & confused the Blacks BUT they think he is for them, what a Joke on the Blacks.

  • dan

    Wayne…even better the second time through….I always come back to check
    and enjoy. could you have known Barry by his alias of Harrison J Bounel during his “college’ experience ? Just thinking that he he was using that name after he was Barry Soetero and before adopting the Obama identity….

  • Petemer

    A great article but I think another reason for Syria is to distract what they are doing with amnesty. S 744 will have a greater affect on Blacks and Hispanics by giving 11-20 million illegal’s the right to take their jobs or drive down their wages even further also through reform it will give an additional 22 million new immigrants over the next ten years the same rights. Obama is not the only politician to push this the LIAR Rubio is also in favor of this. Protecting and serving the American people seems to be lost by too many of our elected officials, only their own personal wealth is important to them.

  • jdn

    Reporting on facts is fine and all , but the black community will not care or complain as long as the wrongs are committed by another black . This is why gangs , pimps of underage girls , drug dealers , thieves and assorted criminals thrive in black communities . Let a white man go into a black community and commit a crime and witness’s and outrage will pour out of the wood work but black crime has a blind eye followed by pure silence and never a witness .

    • Mikeyoung6

      Violence is an integral part of black culture. Lefties know this and would not intefere in that culture. Hence the high homocide rate within the black community.

  • Ed Burns

    If you’ve wondered why America has been falling apart from within, and if you value America and our way of life, this is the FREE full length Movie you and your family should watch… “AGENDA: Grinding America Down”. This movie shows you that the Communist are alive and well, better that well, as many are in congress, as well the president and his administration are members or deciples of Socialism. Socialism = Communism/Nazism/Fascism. It is estimated that the Communist have slaughtered 500,000,000 people throughout the world during in its short history as an ideology! A film that finally puts the pieces of the puzzle together. Please share with everyone you can
    WATCH this FREE Movie here: http://vimeo.com/63749370

  • Carlos

    Everyone should read the Russian history, starting with the revolution in 1917.
    The off springs from some of those revolutionary party members are serving in this Administration. They have migrated to this country and infiltrated the FDR administration and the Democratic Party .

    We have a bad mix in the Capital, Muslim and Marxist. I believe their are some in the Republican Party that know this, however, being afraid of the media and the ridicule , they are afraid to speak up.

  • TheOriginalDaveH

    Here is an article that I ran across from 20 years ago that illustrates how Liberal good intentions can actually do more harm than good:
    http://www.mises.org/journals/fm/fm785.pdf