Comments Subscribe to Personal Liberty News Feed Subscribe to Personal Liberty
 

The Caliph of Ground Zero

August 19, 2010 by  

The Caliph of Ground Zero

A thousand years ago, the Iberian Peninsula was under the thumb of the Muslim Caliphate of Cordoba, an offshoot of the Umayyad Caliphate. While responsible for cultural and economic developments, the Cordoba Caliphate was also particularly hard on what they called “infidels,” and everyone else called “Christians and Jews.”

The Caliphate’s method of dealing with Christians and Jews was to tax the living infidelity out of them. For those who couldn’t pay there were routinely fatal consequences. Religious sensitivity was decidedly NOT a part of the Cordoba Caliphate’s social programs.

In 1985, President Ronald Reagan visited Germany for the G-7 Summit. His itinerary included a stop at the German World War II cemetery at Bitburg. One problem: the Bitburg Cemetery contained the remains of several Waffen SS storm troopers.

Reagan’s purpose was to commemorate V-E Day and to honor the memories of all those who fought and lost their lives in the 20th Century’s greatest conflict. Polling indicated Americans would rather Reagan blew past Bitburg on Die Autobahn. And that polling was right, in a sense.

Though Reagan certainly didn’t support the Reich, visiting Bitburg was a bad call. With millions of opponents—and victims—of Hitler’s hardest corps still alive, the visit was… insensitive.

In 2009, a group of investors fronted by Imam Feisal Abdul-Rauf purchased the Burlington Coat Factory building just blocks from the site of the 9/11 attacks. Abdul-Rauf, a sharia-observant imam who has repeatedly made statements that the United States is to blame for the 9/11 attacks (including my fave: “…Osama bin Laden is made in America…”) named his part of the investment group “The Cordoba Initiative.”

A shadily-funded group (developers have repeatedly double-talked on the source of their nearly $100 million budget) want to put a mosque named for a brutal caliphate within rpg-range of the site where other Muslims murdered 2,700 people—for not being Muslim enough. Not exactly the textbook definition of sensitivity.

Of all the hot-button issues the Democrat Party is pushing this year, support for the Ground Zero mosque is one of the biggest head-scratchers. Abdul-Rauf is an imam who has repeatedly endeavored to blame 9/11 on America; he’s part of a religious movement which believes women should be neither seen nor heard (no Hillary Clinton jokes, please) and wants a mosque on top of the spot where the landing gear from one of the planes used on 9/11 by the terrorists landed. But Americans lack sensitivity? Compared to Feisel Abdul-Rauf, I’m Alan Alda, and the GOP is a sensitivity-training seminar.

But, in the spirit of multi-partisan accord, I’ve decided I CAN live with a mosque whose imam preaches hate, intolerance and the kind of respect for women that makes Joseph Smith look like Jane Fonda—IF—we infidels get something in return. Cordoba House construction can start tomorrow; and I will wield a shovel while standing next to some cat named Akbar bin Laden (or whatever).  But, construction on the new Basilica of the Blessed Crusaders has to start the same day in Riyadh. No? All right, but don’t say I didn’t offer.

Let’s take a clinical look at the chaos. According to CNN, 27 percent of Americans believe Obama was born somewhere other than these United States. Wingnuts routinely dismiss these 27 percent as crazier than Rosie O’Donnell in fat camp lockdown. Only 29 percent of Americans support the building of the Ground Zero mosque. Using liberal math… Obamacare had better cover psychiatric treatment.

The Constitution of the United States of America, written by what may well have been the greatest single gathering of intellect in human history, grants us religious freedom, from Muslim to Mormon. But I don’t see this as a matter of religious freedom. It IS a matter of sensitivity. I have sarcastically hypothesized the idea of a mosque-for-basilica tradeoff. But a church built in Riyadh under those circumstances might as well be named Our Lady of The Immaculate Thumb in Your Eye. It’s… insensitive.

Thousands met their end mere yards from the Cordoba House site. The perpetrators of that monstrosity (despite the statements by Imam Abdul-Rauf) were acting on behalf of their version of Islam. Supporters of the Ground Zero mosque are whining about religious sensitivity; although they’ll deny it to the folks who put up too gaudy a Nativity Scene at Christmas, or the 9-year-old who wants to bow his head in silent prayer before some National Education Association union wonk “teaches” him that 2+2=5.

Begging the question: You want sensitivity? How about showing a little?

Ben Crystal

is a 1993 graduate of Davidson College and has burned the better part of the last two decades getting over the damage done by modern-day higher education. He now lives in Savannah, Ga., where he has hosted an award-winning radio talk show and been featured as a political analyst for television. Currently a principal at Saltymoss Productions—a media company specializing in concept television and campaign production, speechwriting and media strategy—Ben has written numerous articles on the subjects of municipal authoritarianism, the economic fallacy of sin taxes and analyses of congressional abuses of power.

Facebook Conversations

Join the Discussion:
View Comments to “The Caliph of Ground Zero”

Comment Policy: We encourage an open discussion with a wide range of viewpoints, even extreme ones, but we will not tolerate racism, profanity or slanderous comments toward the author(s) or comment participants. Make your case passionately, but civilly. Please don't stoop to name calling. We use filters for spam protection. If your comment does not appear, it is likely because it violates the above policy or contains links or language typical of spam. We reserve the right to remove comments at our discretion.

Is there news related to personal liberty happening in your area? Contact us at newstips@personalliberty.com

  • dan az

    It spits in the face of all americans and what they stand for.how would they like it if we put up a catholic church on there holy ground and charged them admission? Enough is enough if they think this would really happen then they are sniffing to many camel butts.The unions are very strong are willing to bet that they will never put a shovel in the graves of so many americans to flaunt there beliefs for all the world to see. batter up the ball is in your court we are at bat!

    • http://?? Joe H.

      dan az
      I don’t have too much support for unions in me, but if they go and help build this monstrosity I will activly talk them down to all I meet and I don’t care if they do strong arm me!!! Anybody that would support this thing is CRAZY!!!!

      • dan az

        Joe
        the unions have baseball bats that say there will never be a mosque there ever!

        • Jerry D

          Unless, of course, the Muslims grease the palms of the union bosses with enough green. The unions have no real love for America.

          • Bob

            The unions are not for Americans. They sold us out on Nafta and Gatt.

          • Jana

            Question here, then how did all of the other Mosques get built there in Manhattan? There are over 100 of them on Manhattan. Was it the Unions or do they use other Muslims to build these things? I am sure they could have thier own workers and maybe even Unions?

          • eddie47d

            BOB: The Unions were against NAFTA and jobs going overseas.

          • coal miner

            Wrong Bob,

            Unions never did support Nafta,as matter of fact they were totally against it.They warn everybody about this stupidity. Bill Clinton listen to that idiot George Scab Bush Senior and we are all paying for it. You can come up with a better lie than that.Nafta was a right wing idea.

          • coal miner

            Wrong Jerry D,

            Years ago union workers were attacking peace-nics,because they were burning American flags.Unions always have been patriotic and majority of union mine workers suppot the war.I belong in the minority.I don’t support the war.Conservatives don’t care about people,unions do.Come down here,JerryD and tell a union worker he’s not patriotic,you may wind up going back in a steel casket.

          • Jerry D

            To Coal Miner: that day is long gone.

          • Lorri Cotton

            Jana, It’s not all mosques that are a problem. Only the fact that the proposed Ground Zero mosque is more than likely a poke in the chest, or a trophy. Islam is notorious for “conquering” an area and building a mosque on the site of the religious institution conquered. Any other building, of course union works on it. This one is so different though. God Bless you.

        • Steve

          The Democrats are in the hip pocket of the Muslims, the union bosses are in the hip pocket of the Dems, the union members (SEIU, AFL-CIO, Teamsters, etc.) are going to do whatever the bosses say. Union members are NOT concerned how their actions will hurt this nation, as it has been shown throughout recent history. I think that this mosque is a good 5 to 1 bet at being built before Obama leaves office.

        • Hugh Jordin

          I am no supporter of the Mosque, but to blame unions???!!! Please.

          Things have changed and unions have changed, but unions did create the middle class. fair work for fair pay. Do you really think industrialists, CEO. etc. actually want to pay employees? Why do you think they were so eager to outsource manufacturing to countries with cheap labor?

          Look at the history of mining, textiles, clothing, and even the film industry. Unions have done much good for the country in the past, despite their becoming over-powerful in some cases now.

          • James

            They outsourced manufactureing for cheaper labor against our laws then Washington allowed millions of illegals to come to our shores and take our jobs for cheaper labor also against our laws. Now Obama is trying to take power over our jobs useing the unions instead of allowing the private sector to flourish. You think when card check passes, if unfortunatlle it does, the people will have a voice. You will lose your job if you vote against Obama and his unconstitutional agenda. James Milligan

          • Granny Mae

            Hugh Jordin

            Where were the unions when Crysler took their business from Florida to Mexico? Lots of American union members went jobless. Where were the unions when McDonnell Douglas sold their passenger airlines to China and even went over there and taught them how to build these planes and closed their factories around this country? Thousands of union members jobless ! Wulerts in Lansing Mich closed and left workers without insurance and retirement income but where were the unions then? What happened to all those union dues that these people paid for years and years and got nothing for it? Unions are corrupt and that is a fact. Told to you by a former union steward and member for years. You have all been brainwashed about accepting unions. It is graft plain and simple. Can you remember Jimmy Hoffa? Why do you think that these guys fought so hard to keep their standings in the unions? Because they had all you union people on their minds and just couldn’t stand to see you all loose your representation? Heck no! They fought and even put their lives on the line for millions of dollars and it all came from your pockets ! Wake up and smell the coffee. I come from a long line of stedfast union members and they all ended up with nothing from the union and so blinded that they were still willing to give money for membership in union groups even after they were retired and living on social security. By the way why did they all have to count on their social security for their retirement if the unions were so great? And by the way all these union retirements that are now so underfunded that they are asking the government to bail them out, are going to have their hands in your tax pocketbook for long after you are gone . I resent having to pay for anyone elses retirement. I paid for my own and you all should have to do the same thing. If you are stupid enough to place your future in the hands of people you don’t know and never will know then you deserve what you get but don’t you dare think of taking from me so you can have. I have worked very hard all my life and saved for what I have and that isn’t anything extravagant. You can and should be doing the same thing right now yourself. I have a son that is out of work and his family is suffering and if it weren’t for me and my retirement paying for their place to live and electricity and food they would be living on welfare and that would be coming out of your pocket. I bet you would have a lot to say about people on welfare and food stamps now wouldn’t you? Well we don’t go on welfare or food stamps, we take care of our own no matter how hard it is and we survive the better for it. There isn’t any union coming to bail any of us out and don’t you expect them to do it for you either. These guys got hold of your paycheck by convincing you and people like you that you couldn’t improve your lot in life on your own. No it couldn’t be done without the union, well they are here to stay now and they control the government officials of every party especially Obama. He knows he doesn’t stand the chance of a snowball in H–l of getting re-elected without them so you bet your sweet bippy he will kiss mo to the end when it comes to unions. You don’t have to pay a union to get you wages or insurance or good working conditions. You just have to stick together yourselves and make the employers listen or shut them down ! Why do you have to pay some guy that never worked in your place to do what you could do better and for a lot less money? Kick the unions out and stand up for yourself, I did !

          • coal miner
          • Hugh Jordin

            Granny Mae-

            It is sad you are so bitter. You resent paying for anyone else’s retirement… you probably consider yourself a good Christian, but you may miss the point of Jesus’ teachings.

            Some unions are indeed awful, but others have lifted workers out of the equivalent of indentured servitude.

            I suggest you revisit the history of coal mining, textiles, garments and the entertainment industry.

            In the film industry, those who work non-union routinely work 16 hour days for very little money. The unions in this industry evolved to give stability to an industry that is inherently unstable as people work from project to project.

            I agree that in many industries unions have overstepped their bounds and have caused serious problems to the detriment of their companies, but other unions have also been a God send to people who were trapped in inescapable poverty.

            Like all human institutions, unions can be good or bad depending a variety of factors… so please don’t judge them all by the bad ones.

          • Granny Mae

            Hugh,
            I agree that some unions have been helpful to some people that don’t feel they can stand up for themselves. I guess I have just been a fighter not a lover too long ! I have held some very dangerous jobs at times and the company will never go the long mile for your safety so I have always been the one to stand in the gap. I didn’t take any nonsense from these people and I always did my home work first before going in to meetings. The worst thing any of the company officials could do when talking to me was to try to intimidate me or try to make me feel inferior to them. This old gal knew just how to handle that, and by the time the meeting was over they left red faced ! I guess I just have always felt that people can stand up for themselves if they just stick together however that is not what they want to do most of the time! They would rather put their name on a roster and pay their dues and let someone else do the work for them. Of course if the results isn’t what they want the will certainly bitch up a storm over that ! People say they will stand behind you but what they really mean is they will be about a mile behind you ! As for sounding bitter over spending my retirement to help my son and his family, I really am not. In fact that is the way I believe. Families should take care of their own. Everything I have is going to be his some day anyway so what does it matter if it is sooner rather than later? I believe that you should do your givin while your liven so your knowin where its goin ! There is no reason for a person to put themselves in the hands of someone else like the government ! When a person takes the hand out of welfare they are stepping into an existance of allowing someone to control every aspect of their lives. They can no longer say what they want to do or how they want to do it, because the money belongs to someone else and if they are going to give it tpo you they are going to make sure they have a say in how it is spent, plus it is never really enough to live on! It is far better to take control of your own life and and make something of yourself and know within yourself that youare someone unique and special and you deserve better than a hand out for the rest of your life. That unfortunately is what welfare becomes ! Am I a christian? Yes but like all of us I am not the christian I would like to be ! There is always room for improvement ! Do I fear God? Yes ! I know that one day I will have to stand before him and be judged. I worry about that sometimes. Does Jesus say we need to give to the poor? Yes and I do but you will never see me make a slave of them so that they will have to depend on me or anyone else for their existance. I have just helped my elderly brother get back on his feet. He is a Viet Nam vet and came home not the same person he was when he left. Since that time he has had to be helped several times by one person or another. I got word that he was homeless and I brought him to my house. He has had heart surgery now and gotten off the cigarettes and the booze. He is working now and in a place of his own and doing well. When he left our house we accepted a young mother and her son into our home and they were homeless too. Today she has her GED and a job and a car and her own place and is on her way to a new life ! I also support three young girls in the Sudan with their education. I pay their tuition every year so they can go to school ! I send shoes and clothing and food to a monastery in the Ukraine that has taken in orphan children and elderly men and women that have no way to live on their own. I raised my brothewrs 2 boys from the time they were 2 and 4 years old untill they graduated. They are today grown men with families of their own. I also took in my younger sister and her 4 children when her husband left her stranded in the country in another city with no transportation to get into town so she could get a job or find a baby sitter or get help of any kind. When she finally wrote to me to tell me of her situation she was living in a trailer with no electricity and no food and no way to get any. I went to her and brought her and her 4 children home with me . I sent her to the eye doctor and got her some new glases so she could at least see to fill out an application for a job. I sent her to vocational training so she could qualify for a good job. I helped her get back on her feet and into a place of her own. Am I a christian? I would say so but just because Jesus said to help the poor he didn’t mean to keep them poor but to help them up and out of the mess they find themselves in and help them to a better life and that is what I do. No there is no welfare in this house. We work hard and everyone that comes here to be helped works hard too. It is the only way up ! People must have their dignity and self respect ! So if I sound as though I am against helping people out it is just a lack of communication on my part. I don’t like telling people what I do because they then think I am bragging and that couldn’t be farther from the truth. So I hope you will forgive me for being so opinionated it is just a by product of my life experiences.

          • libertytrain

            Granny Mae – Nice post — thanks.

          • viktor leben

            God Bless You Granny Mae !

      • alpha-lemming

        OR…….
        If they’re anything like the Massachusetts unions, it’ll start falling apart barely upon completion. Do Islamists get their 72 virgins if they’re done in by raining temple debris?

        • 45caliber

          According to the Qoran, they don’t get 72 anyway. It says if you are extra good, when you die you will be given a dark eyed maiden for a wife. Paradise isn’t mentioned either.

    • FreedomFighter

      Islam the cause of WWIII?
      Certainly seems probable that Islam will precipitate, if not engineer events that will lead the world into a nightmare of biblical Armageddon. Events fueled by world energy demands, dwindling supplies of traditional energy will merge with global, regional, and local self interest, in turn this will strengthen the political Muslim invasion of Europe and the America’s, finance Muslim extremist terror and political intimidation at all levels globally.
      Events will culminate in global war, a war like no other since Von Dannaken’s alien gods walked the earth. A war that could decimate the earth, a war that will most certainly kill billions of human beings. Weapons never seen by humans will be deployed, soulless machines of death. Dull black and metallic machines of death in space, machines of death in the sky, on the ground or waiting silently in the ground, dealing death without remorse, without compassion with machine efficiency, killing, killing, killing.
      Crisping anything that moves from hundreds of miles away, death rays, lasers, and energy weapons will bring a horror never seen in the history of mankind. Engineered sickness and disease released by terrorists will kill millions if not billions. If all else fails, out of desperation western powers will release nuclear fire, scorching to melted glass the homelands of the enemy. Radiation sickness causing lingering death will plague any survivors, causing untold misery.

      If anyone actually survives WWIII, they will curse the ones that started it, Islam.

      Laus Deo
      Semper Fi

      • Paul

        I say do the same thing to them that they did to us, Drop as plane on the damned thing when it’s full of maslems. They do not see that that they are starting a feud and a religious one at that. These muslem bozos are doing the same thing to this country that happened to the Mormons back in the early days, that is they are trying to exterminate this country and everything it stands for. Just look at what this iran prez keeps saying about this country and I quote “the us is a country will burn in a nuclear fireball”.. is this a people we want as friends I think not this is a people that we should try to get removed from our country. If this mosque gets built then we should destroy it like they destroyed the world trade center. The prez mr.dumbama has no right selling this country to the muslems this is just another point where he should be impeached.

        Just look at all this prez has done the obamacare bill has precluded the muslems and many other religions it is directed at the white Christian people because these are the people that our prez wants to get rid of.
        where do you think obama got so much of his money to run for the office a large part came from the muslems. why do you think he gave them approval for this thing this is just another part of their invasion plan for this country. after all they want to take over and if we will not accept their religion then they will just lop off our heads………..
        Enough said. I said what I wanted. That’s all folks.

        • Kinetic1

          Paul,
          The President didn’t give anyone “permission” to build because he does not have the power. As President, all Obama did was speak to the issue and remind us all that, based on our constitution, Muslims have a right to build a community center and mosque on privately owned land. He did not say that it was a good idea, nor did he say it was a bad one, only that they have a right, granted by our founders. In fact, those same founders often mentioned “Mohammedans” when they spoke of religious freedom in our country. So, should the President of the United States come out against this mosque? Should he come out in favor?

          As for Mr. Crystal’s comments about the Imam responsible for this project, Abdul-Rauf’s comments are not out of line with many who understand the history of our fight with Al Quada. It is not at all uncommon for people of all stripes to believe that the CIA or other American government agencies were involved in the training and funding of Bin Laden and his forces during the Afghan war. The Government denies any such connection, but how many of you believe our government’s secret agencies? Then there are the Imam’s comments about our responsibility in 9/11:

          “I wouldn’t say that the United States deserved what happened, but the United States’ policies were an accessory to the crime that happened.”

          And the rest of the comment, left out by most reports;

          “Explaining is not justifying. … I want people to understand the things that have fueled terrorism, because if we address them, that’s how we eliminate terror.”

          I don’t like the sound of this any more than you do, but facts are facts. We take actions around the world that often put us in a bad light. Am I the only one who agrees with the Imam? Is it just the far left, “anti American” fringe?

          “They perceive double standards that allow Israel to violate U.N. resolutions, but not Iraq; that Israeli nukes are OK, but not nukes in Muslim hands. They see routine use of U.S. unilateral military power against Muslim targets that is unparalleled elsewhere in the world. ” “… perceptions matter mightily since they form the increasingly poisonous psychological backdrop against which distraught and angry Muslims end up championing those who overcome their impotence, stand up to the West and assert Muslim dignity.” Graham E. Fuller, former vice chairman of the National Intelligence Council at the CIA during, among others the Reagan administration and former senior political scientist for the Rand Corporation.

          Glen Beck made statements just like this on his show.

          “When people said they hate us, well, did we deserve 9/11? No. But were we minding our business? No. Were we in bed with dictators that abandoned or values and principles? Yes. That causes problems.” (Glen Beck Show, April 15, 2010)

          Where were you then? Why didn’t everyone on this site scream and yell about Glenn Beck the traitor? Maybe it was because you knew he was right. Nation building, aiding in military coups, covert assassinations, all these actions create enemies of the U.S. around the world. It was just a matter of time before someone struck back.

          So now we know that the Mr. Abdul-Rauf’s comments were not really all that inflammatory, but were downright mainstream. So how about the man himself? How about this history of hatred that talking heads like Sean Hannity suggest? Well, the FBI thought enough of the Imam to invite him to speak on U.S. Muslim relations, referring to him as “one of the city’s most respected Muslim voices” In November 2004, he discussed religion and government with a group that included representatives from other religions and U.S. Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia. In February 2006 he took part in a U.S.-Islamic World Forum in Doha, Qatar with then President Bush’s friend and advisor Undersecretary of State Karen Hughes. Neither of them said anything about his being a “Islamic radical.” And report after report quotes him as speaking out against radical Islam, suicide bombings and religious violence in general.

          You may not like the idea of a mosque just blocks away from “ground zero”, and it may be a bad idea for an Imam who is hoping to improve Muslim/American relations, but these attacks from the right sound more like political posturing than anything else. Remember folks, this is an election year.

          • Paul

            My answer to you Kinetic1
            U read the wrong authors!!!!
            Words have meaning and history has opinion. Some believe meanings are opinion.
            It is whether u know the truth or not.. whether u believe the lie or create it .
            I have some thoughts concerning the Muslim religion and culture:

            Muslims are the ultimate DOLTS (I like name calling). When a society has not developed past the Middle Ages in all the countries where Islam is in majority, leads me to believe that the people of that system are ‘the ultimate stupid’. They should be banned from entering our country by the mere fact that they are mentally challenged (retarded). Anybody who could be fooled by their methodology should be banned along with them from entering or residing in this country. To allow them to set up their high places here to sacrifice to their moon god is an abomination. Doubt me? Teaching children to be (suicide bombers) or cutting heads off in the name of Allah {their moon god}. The same quality of worship as their ancestors, the Philistines’(Israel’s neighbors) did. The worship of Baal the fertility god… but then they went to the temples to have sex in order to please it.
            The (Cordoba) Muslims are trying to access our freedoms in order to sabotage them, but of course, this will be labeled racist, intolerant and bigoted, but those of u using those characterizations are in the group of ‘the ultimate stupid’. (It is about awareness and perspective)
            I have heard that if we restrict religious freedom for their satanic worship, we would be just like them. I will put it to u this way “if we don’t, we will be just like them.” By their decree!! Wake up!

          • viktor leben

            Hold it just a second, let’s a thought experiment-like them EInstein physicist do ….

            Now Kinetic dude , you said they have a “right” to build a mosque anywhere they want to .. so does Prez Obama.

            SO let’s say a follower of David Koresh decides to build another “Branch Davidian” complex on that land on 5th or 6th avenue, y’know – where all the rich New Yorkers rent ….

            Now the Branch Davidians were practicing their religous beliefs. But it seems the President Clinton didn’t want them to practice in rural Waco Texas…..

            According to Prez Obama, David Koresh would have the right to practice his beliefs and build a Branch Davidian complex in downtown Manhattan ……

            Now Kinetic – do you see the contradiction ?

          • viktor leben

            Them thought experiments are pretty good ! Why do the muslims get to build their religous centers, but the Branch Davidians get their religous centers burnt to the ground ? And to top it all off, the Branch Davidians in Waco kept to themselves, they were in the rural area.

            Don’t forget also – The Zoning Board can stop from building, if your future neighbors can show if you pose a danger/hazard to their neighborhood. But according to Prez Obama – Damn the zoning board !

        • 45caliber

          Paul:

          They DO know they are starting a feud. They welcome it. If anyone of their people gets killed, he will be a martyr and they can complain to our government about it – and get more concessions.

        • William Barry

          Forget about moving “these people” out of our country, Paul. I’d be all for relocating them to another planet in the solar system, preferably Mars. Too bad we don’t have the means to send them there… they’d have a whole world to themselves and they wouldn’t have to bother anyone else.

          • Granny Mae

            Maybe we could wait till this place is complete and fully functioning and then they could experience their own 9/11 ! There is more to this place than a place of worship. I would bet the farm that it will be used to monitor all the comings and goings and bombings in this country. Why these a such peace loving human beings we should just trust them without question. They don’t like us and have the guts to say so in our country? I say ship them one way or another back to where they came from and make them stay there ! If it ever comes to this old woman having to wear a berka, someone should beware of what I have under that berka!!

          • dan az

            Granny I know I wouldnt mess with ya it would probably be a uzzi.

          • Granny Mae

            LOL,
            Smaty thinking. It probably would ! But at my age I would have to take some time to remember how to use it !!!LOL

      • Don Tremaine

        This sounds very scary but a definite possibility.
        Don

      • Hugh Jordin

        Good post… a sad likelihood.

      • eddie47d

        Freedom Fighter: Are you a science fiction writer for Hollywood?

      • coal miner

        Freedom,

        Not all muslims are the same.

        You have reached the cached page for http://ghadry.com/why-do-liberal-muslims-see-eye-to-eye-with-israel/

    • hflashman

      I know…where private property rights are at stake, and religious freedom … let’s turn a blind eye to those because they interfere with establishing a religious chrsitian theocracy in the US. Let’s talk strict constuction of the Constitution…and double talk by trying to do away with or minimize half the amendments. Let’s talk about the deficit, while asking for more tax breaks and seeking out every government program to soak money from 9been reading some of Chips solicitation lately?). And here’s a good one…Bragging about the failure of this admin to perform an amazing if not impossible turnaround of an economy which was driven into the ground by the last admin.

      Oh…and how about criticizing anyone who dares urge energy independence from oil and modernize our energy policy and infrastructure… and who warn about the growth of China…while they shop at WalMart and place our nation at greater risk and danger because of of oil dependence

      Yeah…uh huh

      Hate and fear…the common thread of TPers…

      • Jerry D

        Over 90 percent of the Founders were Christians by their own testimony. If they had wanted to establish a Christian caliphate they could have done so. But the truth was, they wanted religious freedom for all. The US was, however, established upon Judeo-Christian principles of law, justice, and freedom.

        • HHH

          You are incorrect, sir. The founders may have been believers, but the country was not founded on Judeo-Christian anything…….. you are listening to Beck a bit too much, and perhaps, becoming delusional as he his.

          • Jerry D

            Sorry, but it is you, sir, who are incorrect. As a matter of fact, all but two of the first 100 colleges started in the US were primarily Christian institutions. You need to stop listening and reading modern revisionists and seek out the true history of this country.

          • Jerry D

            In addition, the four major organic documents of this country are the Mayflower Compact, the Declaration of Independence, the Constitution and the Northwest Ordinance. The first two are uniquely Christian, the third is Christian in principle and the fourth actually mandates the establishment of “churches and schools” for the purpose of furthering education and good citizenship.

          • True Patriot

            Hey HHH. Don’t be like this administration and live in fear of Beck because he studies/reads etc. and knows ten times as much as this administration or you. Let your fears and hatred go, tune in and learn about reality, history, etc. You’d be surprised what you can learn if you open your heart and mind !!

          • Jerry D

            Oh, and by the way, I rarely watch Glenn Beck. I haven’t changed my politics for over 40 years.

          • Kinetic1

            Yes, Jerry, at the time of our founding higher education in the western world was church based. This does not mean that America was based on the Christian faith. Remember, it was the work of several of our founders that built the University of Virginia specifically to separate religious control from education.

            The Declaration of Independence is “uniquely Christian”? Well, I suppose when you note that Christ is not mentioned once in this document, and that references to “God” are prefaced by the term “nature’s” or are simply put as “their creator”, [standard Deist language] it’s impossible to suggest anything else (please note sarcasm here.)

            “…the Constitution … is Christian in principle” And what isn’t? (please note more sarcasm.) I won’t bore or confuse you with all the facts, but I suggest you read Jefferson’s letter to Thomas Cooper, where in he points to the fact that common law, on which the Constitution is based was established long before Christianity spread around the world.

            Finally, True Patriot. I often watch Beck, and I sometimes learn something new. I also research what is said on his show and, just as often as not I find the truth is not as presented. Point in fact, “professor” David Barton, a man who feels authorized to carry his title due to an honorary doctorate from Pensacola Christian College, asserted that Thomas Jefferson dated his documents “in the year of our Lord Christ” and that he had “thousands of examples” to prove it. Well, the documents he spoke of are preprinted forms required to be carried by ships leaving the United States. Our Presidents signed these forms in bulk, leaving the port officials to fill in the blanks. The language “in the year of our Lord Christ” was part of an agreement with other nations and was pre printed on the form. It proves NOTHING, other than christian leaders, in the past have and will forever try to convince us that America is a Christian nation and should be ruled by Christian precepts, damn the founding fathers. From the false truths of the first and second enlightenments, to the forged or misrepresented documents of our founding fathers, nothing will stop them from re-writing our history while claiming to restore it.

          • 45caliber

            Jerry D:
            You are certainly right about the revisionist history. My hobby for most of my life has been finding out what happened instead of what they tell you happened. There is a BIG difference! I read my daughter’s high school history book and was startled at just how much modern history is being rewritten – and that doesn’t even count the older history rewrites.

          • 45caliber

            Kenetic:
            If you spend as much time reading and trying to understand the Bible instead of trying to disprove something in it or in history, you might be pleasantly surprised at what you might learn.

          • Kinetic1

            45,
            What makes you think I don’t? I have read the Bible since I received my first communion copy. I have also learned that there are many different translations, some of which were altered to mesh with the beliefs/agenda of one group or even one man. Religious scholars discover new facts every day, so I choose to continue my education rather than accept the Bible at face value. The same goes for history and the same for Glen Beck. I am not trying to disprove what they say, I am looking for confirmation before accepting “facts”.

            The internet is an amazing tool for learning and may yet lead to our destruction. Case in point, how many of you have heard that English schools no loner teach the Holocaust because it would offend Islamic students? It’s all over the internet and Sean Hannity still repeats this story to prove that we are all at risk. It’s bunk. One school in Great Britain discontinued what would be considered an elective course in America. The Holocaust is still taught in English elementary schools as part of the standard curriculum. Had I taken Hannity’s word for it and not done any research, I’d still be as misinformed as most of his listeners.

          • Jerry D

            Kinetic 1, I appreciate the depth of your answer. However, a further study into Blackstone’s writings, which were extremely popular at the time of the Revolution, will show that the God of Nature referred to is none other than the Christian God. The Founders, as primarily Christians, would not have referred to some ambiguous natural god. Have to go, will be back later. Have to take my son to the doctor.

          • Carol

            This country WAS founded on Judeo-Christian values!!! Have you looked at the many DC Monuments and the courts? “IN GOD WE TRUST”

          • Kinetic1

            Jerry D,
            I hope your son is well.

            As to Blackstone, in the aforementioned letter, Jefferson addresses the claim that common law was based in Christianity. A misinterpretation of latin caused what should have been “ancient scripture” to be written as “holy scripture”.

            “Thus we find this string of authorities, when examined to the beginning, all hanging on the same hook, a perverted expression of Priscot’s, or on one another, or nobody.”

            This discovery, like so many others has been mistakenly or purposefully ignored by those who wish to prove our nations Christian foundation.

          • Kinetic1

            Carol,
            In 1814, Francis Scott Key wrote “And this be our motto: ‘In God is our trust.’” in the final stanza of the Star Spangled Banner. Later, in or around 1861 a campaign was started by eleven Protestant denominations seeking to add God to the U.S. Constitution and other federal documents. Needless to say, it failed, but Rev. M.R. Watkinson of Ridleyville PA succeeded when he wrote a letter to then Secretary of the Treasury Salmon P. Chase promoting the addition of “God, Liberty, Law” to our coins. In 1863, Chase asked the Director of the Mint, James Pollock to prepare suitable wording for a motto to be used on Union coins used during the Civil War. “In God is our Trust” was shortened to “in God we Trust” and a new motto was born.

            That this new motto was then added to or used in construction of government buildings is no surprise, given that the Union leaders felt that God was on their side in the fight for freedom. The fact that this motto was not adopted until almost 100 years after the founding of our nation would suggest that your argument, and the placement of these words on our buildings proves nothing regarding the founding of our nation, but only serves to reinforce the argument that will always be Christian leaders who will attempt to make their beliefs the de-facto foundation for our laws and governance.

          • http://gunner689 gunner689

            HHH: Ever hear of the Ten Commandments? They seem to be the basis of Law in the United States and in all of Western Civilization. Must be a coincidence. At the time the Constitution was written islam was the enemy. Ever hear of the Barbary Pirates ? I know, just another coincidence.

          • Al Sieber

            This country was not founded on Judeo- Christian teaching, it was the teaching of Jesus Christ only, read the history.

          • http://naver samurai

            I hope you understand what we are telling you here, before you start feeling the heat!

        • Hugh Jordin

          Please read Thomas Paine’s The Age of Reason – 1795 – to get a perspective on what some of our founders thought. Like today many politicians have one religious view for public perception and the religious views they really have but keep to themselves.

        • Kinetic1

          Oh Gunner689,

          Ever hear of the Treaty of Tripoli?
          Art. 11. As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquillity, of Mussulmen; and, as the said States never entered into any war, or act of hostility against any Mahometan nation, it is declared by the parties, that no pretext arising from religious opinions, shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries. Treaty of Tripoli, 1797 passed by the Senate and signed by President Jon Adams.

          Note that we not only pronounce that we are not at war with “any Mahometan nation”, but that we are also “…not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion..” I believe that covers the 10 commandments as well. For more on that, refer to the Jefferson letter mentioned above. And if 20 years after the signing of the Constitution is too long for you, consider these words from our founders.

          “True freedom embraces the Mahomitan and the Gentoo (Hindu) as well as the Christian religion. ”
          Richard Henry Lee, motion in Congress on June 7, 1776

          “…in proof that they meant to comprehend, within the mantle of its protection, the Jew and the Gentile, the Christian and Mahometan.” Thomas Jefferson on his Bill for Establishing Religious Freedom.

          Once again, our government was not hostile towards Islam, but some of our Christian leaders were. In another prime example of the wisdom that is the separation of church and state, our political leaders spoke of unity and religious tolerance while an evangelical Baptist spokesman denounced “Mahomet” as a “hateful” figure who, unlike the meek and gentle Jesus, spread his religion at the point of a sword.

          And what about the educated? A Boston columnist, comparing the similarities between Christian beliefs in the here after and Islamic tradition wrote, “A Mahometan is excited to the practice of good morals in hopes that after the resurrection he shall enjoy the beautiful girls of paradise to all eternity; he is afraid to commit murder, adultery and theft, lest he should be cast into hell, where he must drink scalding water and the scum of the damned.”

          I could go on, but my point is clear: Then as today, it is only the narrow minded and religiously intolerant who would proclaim all of Islam to be evil, murderous and untrustworthy because of the acts of a few extremists.

          • viktor leben

            Let just think about what you said, very good post Kinetic – are you a college professor ?

            Let’s say for argument sake – the Founders didn’t want a theocracy.
            A theocracy is run by theocrats – so no theocrats are allowed in the State government.

            Theocrats use a religous jurisprudence – a theocratic law. Thus Moses was a theocrat as was Mohammed …..

            In order to have the seperation of church (theocracy) and State (secular government) we cannot have any state sanction religous influences.

            So here is the contradiction – Some of our Founders documents allude to God, wouldn’t this be a violation of Jefferson’s seperation of church (theocracy) and state (secular government) ?

            If Jefferson mentions “Creator” as one who “endows” rights, Doesn’t that make Jefferson a Theocrat ?

      • Conservative at Birth

        Are you totally blind or just ignorant? Obama has intentionally set in motion the aparatus to destroy our economy. Have you not heard of Cloward and Pivens? It will take AT LEAST ten years to correct all the problems the Totalitarian Socialists like you have created in the last four years. The corrections will begin in January 2011 when the new Congress and Senate take control and begin repealing and defunding the insanity of Obamaland. By the way, what exactly does this have to do with the topic?

        • Bob

          Don’t put too much faith in Republicans. They are all puppets of the same master.

          • TeresaE

            Amen.

            I don’t know how Bob draws such a diverse group, but one commonality is strict adherence to their own party’s propaganda and beliefs.

            BOTH sides have done this. BOTH sides continue to screw us. BOTH sides end up richer than our wildest dreams, and their kids, ON our families’ backs.

            BOTH sides. Neither is completely evil and neither is even close to being good for our country.

          • 45caliber

            Bob:
            At least it isn’t the same puppet master the Dems follow. And we conservatives follow no one except our own beliefs.

          • Jeep

            45, that’s the part that Bob and his ilk will never understand. Just as Dems vote 98% of the time with Pelosi, Reid and the other “leaders of change”, people like Bob will take the progressive side every time, right or wrong. There is no conscience, just a lock-step mantra that is usually accompanied by vitrolic hate speech wrapped in “compassion”. Bob could probably cite every progressive “talking point” with mind numbing abandonment of principle. They will never comprehend the conservative concepts such as liberty, freedom and justice as we know them. And, they will never understand that conservative voices are raised with an eye towards our inner beliefs and values, not what “our party” selects as the “soupe de jour”.

          • JC

            And now Pelosi wants an investigation into:

            Nancy Pelosi wants some answers.

            The house speaker is calling for an investigation into groups protesting the building of the Ground Zero mosque.

            “There is a concerted effort to make this a political issue by some,” she told San Francisco’s KCBS radio on Tuesday.

            Pelosi added that she joins “those who have called for looking into how is this opposition to the mosque being funded.”

            Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/2010/08/18/2010-08-18_nancy_pelosi_house_speaker_wants_investigation_into_ground_zero_mosque_oppositio.html#ixzz0x6c7cQak

        • Bob

          Jeep When people don’t like what you have to say they try to figure out your politics and label you. You haven’t the slightest idea what I am. If someone doesn’t agree with you they are either a Liberal or a Progressive. You are wrong.

          • Jeep

            Really Bob? And, geeze, I thought I had all the answers. I guess not, well thanks for pointing that out. I was just saying that “if the shoe fits…”

          • Bob

            Anybody with a name like jeep can’t be too smart.

      • Michael J.

        hflashman,
        Unbelievable Ka-Ka, you should wash your hands (and the keyboard) after exuding such excrement. I bet you have a photo of Kieth Olbermann taped to the wall in front of your computer so that you may occasionally look up for an inspirational fix.

        Why and how is it, that you people hate this country so much? I bet you have every episode of “Life after People” in your DVD collection.

        OK, I know why, and I probably know how as well. People without religion and spirituality also lack a moral compass. The closest thing you people have to religion is Mr. Alinsky’s “Rules for Radicals” and the communist mantra of political correctness which was sewn into the fabric of your DNA by college professors hell bent on creating Marxist foot soldiers for the coming collective.

      • 45caliber

        flash:
        From your remark, I’m not sure what your point is. “… let’s turn a blind eye to those because they interfere with establishing a religious chrsitian theocracy…”??

        Are you trying to say that we should turn a blind eye on them? Or on the Christians? Or what?

        The rest of this seems to be a rant against everything. I certainly support the Consitution – AS IT WAS WRITTEN WITH THE INTENTION THEY WROTE IT UNDER. That means the 1st Amendment means no government interference in religion. It does NOT mean no religious person in the government. The 2nd Amendment means everyone can have a gun if they want one. Not only selected types after you register. I’m against payroll tax but not against taxes as a whole. I take no money from the government now except tax returns. There are many who take money that don’t deserve it, I agree – and all the ones I know vote Democrat. I also agree that the Democratic CONGRESS under Bush started this slide and I insist that this administration has only steepened the slide rather than try to stop it. You might say the last admin drove the economy into the ground – I say that this one has installed a drill to drive it even deeper.

        I’ve no problem with energy independence from oil. Actually, I think all oil ought to be saved for plastics. But I do want to know just what we are supposed to use for energy right now if we stop using oil. So far none of you libs have answered that question. All your suggestions have been for something that takes ten to fifty years to build. What about right this moment? And China? I don’t buy Chinese unless I have no other choice and must buy. I will buy American if I can. Can you name a single American company in the US that makes clothing? I can’t.

        Try being a little more realistic instead of blaming everyone for something you feel is wrong. And try to come up with solutions that will work instead of some feel-good idea that hasn’t got a snowball’s chance in h3ll of success.

      • Anne

        “Republicans made mistakes when we were in charge, yes, but Democrats pointing that out doesn’t absolve them for the mistakes they are making today.” Mitt Romney We need to stop pointing fingers in this country and get back to running the country. Pointing fingers does nothing. We in the Tea Party are trying to make this simple point. Stop blaming someone else for your own failed policies. Grow up, grow a pair, and lets get our nation back from the precipice.
        As an aside, how perfect would it be if a Jewish deli opened up next to the Hamosque (to borrow a phrase)?

  • s c

    The word being tossed around is sensitivity. The method is pc. The goal is control. The result will be bad blood between Muslims and everyone else.
    Mr. Obama is wrong. Bloomberg is wrong. Abdul-Rauf is wrong. How is it possible that these people can be so stupid or arrogant or mentally lame at the same time?
    People, when you can’t tell the difference between a friend and an enemy, the game is rigged. Get out
    of the game, and let the users, abusers and manipulators play it. They seem to enjoy such things. They’ve had plenty of experience, but they just don’t get any smarter.

    • 45caliber

      I think one of the reasons they want this mosque built IS to create bad blood between Muslims and everyone else. I think they would be perfectly delighted if some radical American group was to attack and kill some Muslims. That would give them the right (they feel) to establish a police state and – to recompence the Muslims – give them whatever they want.

  • DaveH

    That one sentence “Supporters of the Ground Zero mosque are whining about religious sensitivity; although they’ll deny it to the folks who put up too gaudy a Nativity Scene at Christmas, or the 9-year-old who wants to bow his head in silent prayer before some National Education Association union wonk “teaches” him that 2+2=5″ says it all Ben. Welcome to the upside down world of Liberals.

    • libertytrain

      DaveH – exactly -

    • 45caliber

      Dave:
      I agree. And the libs can’t understand why we do.

  • viktor leben

    The Founding Fathers screwed up on the Constitution. They should have made it clear that we have no King but Jesus Christ. They should have also added that our government will be handed over to King Jesus on his return to Earth (Second Coming). The Republic is just a temporary government until Jesus returns ….

    Obama is right, because our Constitution is flawed in this respect, we are no longer a Christian Nation. So be it. Now the radical moslems will build their mega-mosques and you people will suffer ….

    If we don’t want Jesus for our King then don’t expect to be blessed with the fruits of Liberty. A songwriter once wrote “You want all the benefits that righteousness brings, but you don’t want to toe the line” ….

    We need to ammend the Constitution and get this matter over with. The Reasonableness of Christianity, with it’s concomitant of life, is the only rational course we have to preserve our freedoms … Thank you John Locke .

    • http://msn ps

      can I just say AMEN!!!! and thank you. for your reply. Jesus Christ is our only hope. and our only answer. we the people of the united states better weak up and see who it is that they have voited into office. no one prays about anything anymore. they just vote for someone. because its a change in history. or they think they will get rights of thier own. or because they have always been demcrat or republican. GOD HELP US ALL. What about just what is the right thing to do. like vote for a GODLY man or woman. who will lead this nation back to it founding, freedom to worship God. the one and only true and living God. if you wont to worship a piece of wood, or a fat man stutue. or the sun or moon, go ahead, but I tell you those things cant answer your prayers. they cant heal you, God. Jesus christ is the only answer. those things did’nt give their life for you. how could they they are not alive. so they dont care about you. but I tell you Jesus loves you so much that he laid down his life, and shead his presious Blood for you ,and died. that you might have eternal life. with him. thank you.

    • Jerry D

      As a matter of fact, many of the constitutions of the original 13 states had clauses that held that one could not hold office if they were not a professing Christian. The majority of the Founders did not believe that one was “religious” if they did not confess Christ as Lord and follow the God of the Bible. When they referred to other religions, they called them pagans or infidels. If you were religious, you belonged to what we call “Christian denominations” today. There has been change in the meanings of words. Reading our founding organic documents with an early 1800′s version of the Webster’s Dictionary in one hand and those documents in the other is an eye-opener. Meanings have changed subtly, though significantly.

      • DaveH

        So, you want us to behave like the Muslims, Jerry?

        • Jerry D

          Absolutely not. Just making the point that it was Christians who established religious freedom, not Muslims, Buddhits, Hindus, etc. The country with the greatest religious freedom was founded upon Judeo-Christian principles. You do not find religious freedom in countries that do not have a strong Judeo-Christian history.

    • Jerry D

      Another quick note: the Founders did not consider one to be religious who was not a Christian.

      • Doc Sarvis

        Where, pray tell, do you get that idea?

        • Jerry D

          It would take too long to go over that and I don’t have the right to take up that much space. However, as I said later, a reading of the Constitutions of the original 13 colonies and our major organic documents with an early 1800s version of the Webster’s Dictionary handy will open eyes.

          • Doc Sarvis

            That is a skillfull way of answering my question with; “I have no idea”.

          • Jerry D

            Not so, Doc. It’s an honest answer. A lot of it has to do with the change in the meaning of the word “religious.” Most people assign the meanings of the words in the organic documents as we understand them today. In addition, the vast majority of the Founders were Believers and had a uniquely Christian world view. We all operate in this temporal realm on the foundation of our personal world views. To truly understand the thought and intent of the Founders, we have to know what they meant by what they said according to the meaning of the words in their time. Furthermore, we have to understand their particular world view which, as I said, was uniquely Christian.

          • Bob

            It was solely a Christian country until the late 19th century.

          • Doc Sarvis

            Bob,
            Come on now. You can say that there were NO Jewish people here in the late 1800′s, no people who did not believe in any God at that time, no people who were muslim or hindu? Get real.

          • Al Sieber

            It was founded on the teachings of Jesus Christ, not the Jews. “Goggle” Ben Franklin, quotes on the Jews.

        • Doc Sarvis

          Jerry D
          From Thomas Jefferson’s writings; “Where the preamble declares, that coercion is a departure from the plan of the holy author of our religion, an amendment was proposed by inserting “Jesus Christ,” so that it would read “A departure from the plan of Jesus Christ, the holy author of our religion;” the insertion was rejected by the great majority, in proof that they meant to comprehend, within the mantle of its protection, the Jew and the Gentile, the Christian and Mohammedan, the Hindoo and Infidel of every denomination.
          -Thomas Jefferson, Autobiography, in reference to the Virginia Act for Religious Freedom
          Much more good insight into the “author” of the Declaration of Independence at:
          http://nobeliefs.com/jefferson.htm

          • viktor leben

            Precisely the point I was trying to get across ! If what you are saying is correct then the Christians are the fools, duped by a master propagandist writings ! Jefferson’s “Declaration of Independence” has the line “endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights” – A 18th century theologian would believe Jefferson is talking about the Logos (Jesus Christ) as the King of kings, who endows us with these rights as opposed to the King of England.

            SO ALL those Christians, who fought for the cause were USED by the secularists. The Logos ( Jesus Christ) was not EXPLICITLY written in this document ! Even though the Christian fighting for the USA, to this day, believe in some implicit type of implicit Christianity…..

            There you have it … the mold was set. Dupe the Christians into subservience and then screw them later, just as our Federal government is doing today…..

            Thank You Founding Fathers ! Even though you all had copies of the Bible, all of you couldn’t make an explicit stand for the Lord Jesus Christ, that Jesus was God incarnate and the Creator. Not even an explicit mention of Jesus’ Ressurection(!) in your laws !!

            Wake up Christians ! You’ve are being used !!!!

            I have an eternal hostility to , Mr. Jefferson ! My erternal hostility is against those who deny the reality of the Lord Jesus Christ !

          • Al Sieber

            Viktor, you are right, most people are brainwashed on this subject.

          • http://naver samurai

            Don’t forget doc, Jefferson had religious services in the White House every Sunday during his 2 terms in office. He also signed everything with “In the Year of Our Lord.” This is a reference to the year after the birth of Jesus Christ, so what don’t you understand?

  • THINKING ABOUT

    I understand the sensitivity of the situation but the ruling factor is our freedoms we take so seriously, religious freedoms are important just as freedom of speach and right to bear arms, what seems to be so easy to say is let’s stop the community center but do we want to open this up to ceasing the other freedoms we enjoy. We do not control the laws of other nations, their laws does not follow the laws of the USA. If your thoughts are correct in disallowing the center because it is from the muslim religion and muslims attacked the Twin Towers, then how should the Iraqi feel about “christian” attacking their country. Should all christian people be condemned as grouping all muslim into one group. We have had our own terrorist right here in the USA, such as a doctor being killed in his church, Mcvey, need I go on with the list. Should we condemn all gun owners because so many has been killed by people possessing guns, I don’t think so. I think we should consider what can of worms we are opening up when we attempt to forbid our rights.

    • Staying Afloat

      Your response is reasoned and based on evidence which is almost totally lacking in this debate. The man who is behind the Islamic Cultural Center project in NYC actually worked with President Bush following 9/11. The fear and ignorance campaign is sad and relies totally on lumping all Muslims into the terrorist group that was responsible for 9/11, on selective misuse (without citation) of verses from the Quran, and just plain silly errors of fact. Thank you for mentioning The Constitution which many of the people against this project are willing to trample at any given moment.

      • Conservative at Birth

        The Muslims who do not agree with the Nazzi Islamists can live. The ones who do shall be dported or killed. I do not fear nor hate them. I will kill them in self defense. Mohamed was a General and created a false religion to create a cult.

        • DaveH

          Religion has been used by leaders throughout history as a means of controlling their subjects. In the modern day United States, the Government “scientists”, and the MSM fill that role.

          • Kinetic1

            Scientists and MSM? Perhaps you would like to speak to Hamilton’s blatant use of religious fear and intolerance for political gain? Not modern enough. Your right, we should be talking about the attacks on JFK’s Catholicism, or Romney’s Mormonism. How about Liberty University, the “Moral Majority” and “Focus on the Family”? Religion is, perhaps THE most divisive issue of all history, and to suggest that science and the media have taken it’s place is disingenuous at best.

          • DaveH

            Kinetic,
            Try rereading my comment. I was talking about leaders using religion to cow the masses to further their power.
            What you said has nothing to do with that. Disingenuous? Do you even know what that means?
            What is with you Ignorant Liberals and your personal attacks? Can’t you ever make a comment without disparaging somebody?

          • Kinetic1

            Dave H,
            My point is that Religion is still being used by leaders both Political and Religious. Yes, I consider your assertion that our government has replaced religion with science and the media as insincere and calculating. Since we have seen members of the Republican party use Romney’s religion against him in the primary and raise questions about Obama’s faith in the 2008 election, clearly religion is still the tool of choice for the right, though I’m sure that FOX would be happy to provide “evidence” to the contrary. Ok, you have a point there. You may have specified “main stream media” but there is little doubt that Fox is the mouth piece and propaganda tool extraordinaire for the right wing, but they have been used more as a tool to focus the message than to replace religion.

            Given all that, I can only assume that what you are really saying is that LIBERAL government is guilty of using science and the media to replace religion. Jump in the right wing pool, the waters fine! “Abortion is the sacrament and Roe v. Wade is Holy Writ [of Liberals]“.[ Ann Coulter}. "In the Religion of the left, the God of Global Warming is Mother Nature, the Earth is Heaven, and mankind is the Devil and should be cast out from paradise." [globalwarminghype.com] So is that your point? Is this just another claim that Liberals are godless cretans out to remove all traces of a Christian God from America, dragging it to the gates of hell?

            By the by, I simply claimed that you were not being straight forward with your claim. If you want to read some pointless name calling, try reading the posts of MANY of the more right leaning members of this site.

          • coal miner

            DaveH,

            You are absolutely right about religion.Have a nice day.

      • Richard Pawley

        There are already over a 100 mosques in NYC and Americans are so incredibly naive when it comes to Islam and their goals and even their modus operandi. There are almost no Muslims who live within a reasonable distance of this new “cultural center” so why must it be built there? This has nothing to do with religious freedom or the constitution whatsoever, although this will be the politically correct argument that those who favor Sharia law will use. One thing should be pointed out and that is that there are no moderate Muslims, there are non-religious Muslims just as there are non-religious Christians and Jews but the god of the Muslims is most assuredly not the God of Christians and Jews. In fact they are diametrically opposed to each other. Islam is a great religion for those who have surrendered their personality and uniqueness and want to be cast into a mold where they are just doing what they are told. Islam even means “Surrender.” Christianity and Judaism on the other hand exalt the individual to be, with God’s help, all they can be. Women are not always considered equal by those who profess to be Christian but they are less than a dog in Sharia law and that is why they can be raped, or beaten at a whim, or have their ears and nose cut off, as in the recent Time or Newsweek magazine cover of the beautiful girl who simply ran away from home. How about the “good Muslim father” in Texas who killed his two high school daughters because they went to the mall and actually talked to some boys from their high school, or the ‘devout Muslim’ in upstate New York who owned a TV station and had a program to help create understanding between Islam and New Yorkers. When his wife, thinking she was an American and could divorce him, hired a lawyer to do so, she found out that even in America the Constitution and the law will not protect you from Sharia law. Her husband simply cut her head off, a very Muslim thing to do. Sharia law, by the way, is the stated goal for America, of the guy who pushing to build this “Cordoba” mosque. Muslims have one goal and one goal only, world domination. They have already established Sharia law in England, so far just for themselves, and a Democratic judge in New Jersey has already decided that a woman who was trying to escape her husbands beating had to submit because it was their “religion”. Nancy Pelosi in her submission to the idea of destroying the dollar and the economy of the USA thinks anyone who opposes the building of the Mosque “should be investigated”. Personally I think Nancy Pelosi is a greater threat to freedom in the United States than Hamas or Al-Quaida. Of course those who know no god greater than themselves will support such things. Those who reject the God of the Bible will live under tyrants said William Penn the founder of Pennsylvania and that is what the politically correct seem to want for this country. Those who cannot see the reason why this mosque must be built ONLY by the former World Trade Center do not grasp that we are in a war between good and evil and you had better know the difference. Those who hate the Jews and who hate Christians and who hate Jesus Christ and even hate the ten commandments would of course support the Mosque. They are the blind leading the blind. The only place that would be an acceptable substitute to those who want build this mosque would be to build it right on GROUND ZERO, and I think that even Nancy Pelosi would oppose that, or at least, I think she would. When Muslims conquer they always build their mosques, which are not just places to pray but places where political intrigue is carried out, on top of what was the holiest site of those they conquer. The Catholic church was torn down in Cordoba, Spain, centuries ago and a mosque was raised over it and that is why they want to call this new one “Cordoba.” Islam tolerates no religion but Islam. All else must be destroyed. Only the god of the ancient primitive Bedouin Arabs is to be worshiped. Worship and politics are one and the same to those who follow the god of Islam. They cannot be Republican or Democrat although their religion encourages them to do whatever will advance their cause of world domination. They already have a hundred mosques in NYC and have no interest whatsoever in building this mosque anywhere else. It must be next to the site where those poor deceived souls from Saudi Arabia destroyed thousands of lives in NYC nine years ago to show their billion plus followers all over the world that even in the United States they rule and conquer. According to the foundational principles of the universe those who did the horrible evil on 9/11 must experience all the pain and terror they caused. There will be no heaven for such as those. This is why Jesus taught that you should not even hate your enemies. You might have to kill them but if you hate them you are ultimately harming yourself. No other site for this new “Cordoba” is acceptable. If you would like to learn a little about how the world of Islam operates then take eight minutes to view the following video and you may be shocked. I did not call my most recent book, “The Last Days of the Late Great United States” to be shocking. At least one Russian think tank thinks that when Congress gets through destroying the dollar and the economy that the United States will break up into five countries. I hope they are wrong but it would be much easier for the followers of the god of Islam to take over if that happened. America needs to wake up. I don’t know if the Tea Party alone can save the USA. I think it is going to take a divine miracle. Divide and conquer is an ancient technique and as I said in one of my books, “Nuclear weapons and laser guided missiles alone are not sufficient to defeat those who believe that their god will reward them for their atrocities.” The following video was made in Sweden by a group named ‘White Roses’ named after the student resistance group “Die weiße Rose” in Nazi Germany who became known for an anonymous resistance campaign against Hitler in the early 1940′s. The enemy we fight today is far more dangerous than Nazism although many Muslims greatly admire Hitler and in some Muslim countries his autobiography is on the best seller lists. Progressive Americans (both Democratic and Republican) may not wake up until we lose an entire city, and some believe it is only a matter of time until that happens, but when it happens it will not be just a failure of Homeland Security but of the ignorance of average Americans who tolerate sin and vice and corruption in themselves and in their representatives. A scripture from the book that all the founding fathers believed in says, “Be not deceived, whatsoever you sow, that also shall you reap”. We may not always see that fulfilled but it is a principle of the universe like gravity. We can still change things and vote out those who think freedom is passe’ and that we need a government who will do everything for us and to us. The government of Islam will be glad to oblige. We have one chance, and one chance only, and that is to replace all in congress who would see us swept away into the dust bin of history. Vote out all (Democrats and Republicans) who have trashed our dollar by squandering them and assuring horrible inflation in food and fuel in the not-to-distant future, and while there is still time, learn what you can about the truth of Islam. A good place to start is this short video:
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ib9rofXQl6w&feature=player_embedded

        • Jerry D

          Quite honestly, the vast majority of people need to do just what you said: learn about Islam. They need to learn what the Koran really says and learn about the violent history of Islam. On the other hand, Muslims have also made some significant contributions to this world. But no other religion on earth has the potential for violence so much as Islam.

          • coal miner

            JerryD,

            You forgot about the history of Christianity.

        • American Conserative

          Islam is a Government. The Koran is the Constitution. Shira Law is the Legal System. Mosque are the Centers of Islamic Government Operations. Citizens/soldiers of the Islamic Government call themselves Moslem (Moslim). The god of Islam is Lucifer (Satan).

      • 45caliber

        Staying:
        I can’t see that Thinking had any more “evidence” than any of the others you are complaining about did. All he did was give your own argument. Perhaps you should look up the definition on “evidence”.

    • Paul

      thinking about
      I do not think you do know about the sensitivity of the this problem. If is obvious you where never in the military or came from a military family, the muslems want world domination and control of the entire planet.the iran prez has already said that the only people that can bring peace to the wghole world is the muslem nations, that sounds a lot like world domination to me. If we let them build there mosque nexst door to the trade center then they are one step closer to their goals. Is that what you want because if it is then you are as anti-American as the prez we have now with his agenda if destroying all that this nation stands for. You probably voted for him did you not, if you did then you have no right to talk because that makes you anti-American as well. The iranians have said that the towers where moved not destroyed just packed up and moved, they also claimed that the towers where hollow inside and that5 no one really killed, it sounds like you are one of these types “thinking about” you need to wake up and smell the flames this country is already starting to go the question is are we going to stop it before it is to late, or like you are we just going to let it burn. Many of the people in iran hate the US and everything we stand for so does this prez we have so why don’t you get your butt behind the lines and get ready for the fight that is coming. Maybe not today and maybe not tomorrow but one day we will be in a fight for our lives and the life of this country. Here’s the question ARE YOU GOING TO STAND UP AND FIGHT FOR THIS COUNTRY? OR ARE YOU GOING TO HID UNDER YOUR BED?

    • Brad

      Having the mosque build just blocks away from ground zero, where Muslim radicals flew two aircraft into the world trade center is insensitive. Your argument is indeed misguided; it’s not about the constitution it’s about religious extremism and what building the mosque would be in the eye’s of the extremist. All over the Muslim world it would be seen as a victory over the infidels, bolstering support for their cause against us. The argument goes back to Saudi Arabia where Mecca stands, will Muslims allow Christian center w/church just blocks from their holiest place, the answer is a resounding NO, it would be insensitive to build one there. Again you cry over the constitution and freedom of religion, well I’m all for it but let them build their mosque somewhere else. The day the mosque is started is the day I start protesting online if St. Nicholas isn’t rebuilt, which was destroyed when one of the towers collapsed on top of it. If their imam is so moderate why doesn’t he renounce the 9/11 attackers and radical Islam, he won’t because he teaches Islam is the only religion and sharia law is the law of Islam. What a backwards religion. I’m sorry but I can’t in good conscience support the building of this mosque, it is just too insensative to our religious beliefs.

      • DaveH

        The Constitution merely says that Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion. Congress is making no law. This is a local issue that should be decided by the people of New York City.
        While I think tolerance is very important, it is a fact that the Muslim religion is very intolerant. There are very few Muslim Majority countries that allow religious freedom.
        While I think legally they can build the mosque, it is unbelievably insensitive of them to put their place of worship so close to the site of that abhorrent attack by fanatical Muslims.

      • Bob

        Brad Did they also fly planes into building 7. I’m so confused.

        • Brad

          Bob,

          What’s your point, building 7 was destroyed in direct relation to the towers being struck by planes flown by islamick radicals. Just like St. Nicholas the church sitting accross the street from the twin towers, it was destryed when one of the towers came down on top of it.

          Again what’s your point Bob!

          • Bob

            Building 7 was Demo just like 1 and 2

          • Al Sieber

            Brad, Bob’s right, building #7 was a controlled demo. check out: “loose change, final cut”, classic demo.

          • Al Sieber

            Brad, Bob’s right, building #7 was a controlled demo. check out video: “loose change, final cut”, classic demo.

    • Rick

      ” We do not control the laws of other nations, their laws does not follow the laws of the USA.”

      Tell that to the 8 Christians arrested in Dearborn, MI for simply passing out pamphlets at some sort of Muslim celebration. Ist Amendment be damned in MI thanks to the influx of Muslims there. The officers doing the arresting should lose their jobs. Sharia is here in America already and one need look no further than Dearborn.

      • mickey

        I thought it was MI that now had (or will have) Sharia law outside of US law. I kind of look this mess this way. We separate church and state and believe in religous freedom. Islamic states Islam is the government. Therefore arguing Islam (Muslim, whatever) is futile. Europe is struggling with the same problem–the spread of Islam. It isn’t the religous part I take issue with, it is the combined Islam/government.

        Then, looking around the world, I don’t see much in the Islamic states that I would covet. They have elite and poor. Not much in between. The US was unique in the broad middle class that we used to have.

        I look at the mosque as an attempt to use our “religous freedom” to usurp our laws and make it look as though we are not in the religous freedom.

        On the other hand, we have been sheltered in hearing about all the CIA interference in other countries. We have interferred in politics, created devastating dictatorships that cost thousands of needless deaths.

        Does the ends justify the means? No. I am not for becoming another Islamic state. I view it as a power struggle among warring political powers to rule the world (ignoring the religous part). I think we are in the mist of just which country will shape the future.

        Quite frankly, I think obama (Pelosi included) was chosen for the US to accoomplish this. I do not believe he is an American qualified president. My children have a foreign parent and I knew none could be president. Their children, just not them. However, since obama sits in the white house, we have our first non American qualified leader–or an excuse as a new world leader.

        If we are to unite, we need to unite against the corps taking over countries entire economies, including those in LA where we are taking their fresh water. Take a look at what happened to Argentina (youtube).

        This has been coming on for years, well past Bush, Clinton, and obama. We have all been guilty. We need to accept our blame and get on with solutions.

        One, we can use Youtube for getting information on getting rid of our dependence on foreign oil (we have in land reserves here and plenty of it). Two, alternative energy is available and cheap but will cost many jobs until the corps take over and start charging us for the convenience. The economy is not a small matter–each move affects something else.

        We can grow our own food. There is no need to use “killer seeds” or enhanced GM foods. We all have a plot of ground to do so or we have greenhouses. Reduce the size of farm land to small farms. Buying food locally may be inconvenient but we need to do it.

        Read, read, read on the causes of cancer and diabetes. Find out just what medicines are doing to us.

        Contact any and all latins (in other countries) and see what they are saying and translate the information.

        We are the solution. If we don’t want it and don’t think it is within our laws (change them), then fight for right to deny it.

        I think we forget that the world is not looking to our leaders for answers but the American public to see how they handle what is going on. Other countries are watching our immigration policies because they are also inundated with illegals and want us to serve as the example so they have the excuse to put forth their laws to solve the problem.

        We are the solution.

    • Proud to be a Christian

      I agree with the article, that when we can build Church or Synagog in any of the Muslim countries, then they can build mosques here. The only reason they are here in the first place, (they are not being persecuted in their own countries) is to take over the world. No. 1, they can have four wives and usually have 10 children each so you an see how they can take over quickly. I lived for three years in a Muslim country and I know all what the Quran says and I wish that more americans knew. This is how we are going to collapse within. The reason they are getting so many converts is that how men can treat women. When they want a divorse all they do is repeat it three times and it is over. They can have prostitutes and their wives have no say so. This all started back with Ismael. I wondered besides taking us down financially how they were going to conquer American, now I know. However, it has all been predicted and they will have their comeupance shortly. We can protest, but we cannot fight it. What a wonderful way to get money into the country to support terrost activities when legitimate business have to sign their lives away.

      • mickey

        I’m glad someone weighed in with lst hand experience. Mine was with two muslim kids that said Afgannis were their migrant workers and theives would still have their hands cut off. I can’t see how Sharia law would be limited to muslims but can see how the law would extend to infidels that went against Sharia law.

        • Bob

          If people know if they break the law they will have their hands cut off and steal something anyway they deserve it.

    • john

      that doctor was’nt killed…he was aborted…tell me the differance,because he made it out of the womb?Abortion is murder..it is killing a human child no matter what form plain and simple.If scientists were to find a frozen ameba on some distant planet the media would proclaim “life found on another planet” yet they don’t want to recognize life in the womb…so the aborting of that serial killer that called himself a doctor while wrong is what it is if you want to use pro-death terms..an abortion.

      • 45caliber

        It is wrong to murder – regardless of who does it. It is wrong for the doctor to do it and it was wrong for the man who killed him. But two wrongs don’t make a right.

        • http://gunner689 gunner689

          At least Dr. Tiller the Baby Killer won’t be killing any more babies. We should thank the man who killed that monster. Unfortunately he had to sacrifice his freedom to do it. Is the concentration camp prisoner wrong when he kills his guard when like abortion, the concentration is legal?

    • 45caliber

      Thinking:
      I’m not sure we should forbid them to build – but I am certain that if we allow them to build at this site that we also allow the rebuilding of the Christian chruch that was already here. If we forbid one, we should forbid the other. And we should have a good reason to forbid them.

      BUT … I also believe that it should be possible to limit the land use in this area to commemorate those who were murdered here. And I don’t count the deaths of the hijackers as being murdered. They can build their church at some other location.

      Further, if it is wrong for Christian churches to ring bells, etc. it should be wrong for the mosque to use loudspeakers outside to call the worshippers to prayer – and it certainly should be wrong to allow them to block the street so they can use that too. If any Christian church tried, they would get all sorts of fines and be told to build somewhere else where they could have enough room.

      • http://gunner689 gunner689

        Since it is highly unlikely that the gvt. will deport the Muslims in this country, then we as individuals and American citizens should shun all muslims. Ignore them as human beings. Don’t buy or sell or trade or communicate with them. Don’t hire or employ them in any capacity. Also shun anyone who does deal with them. If the gvt. wants to support them they do so at their own peril. Maybe they’ll get the hint and go back where they came from.

      • Bob

        It’s never going to be built. It’s just something else to get the people fighting amongst themselves while they pick our pockets clean

    • viktor leben

      Let’s do a thought experiment …

      Your view is because some radical muslims terrorist destroyed the World Trade Center we should allow radical muslims to build a massive religous complex in NYC …..

      But the moslem world disagrees with you !

      The Moslems were attacked by radiacl Christians during the Creusades – because of what the radical CHristians did the Christians are not allowed to build massive religous buildings/complexes in Mecca.

      So if the Moslems will not allow the Christians to build , why should the Christians allow the Moslems to build ?

  • BigBadJohn

    I think the mosque should be allowed – on the same day that Muslims allow a Jewish synagogue to be built right next to the Dome on the rock.

    If it is built, there will be a booming street vendor business for pigs blood…..

    • Conservative at Birth

      Destroy the Dome on the Rock and replace it with another Temple Mount.

      • Hugh Jordin

        perfect way to start WW III

        • American Conserative

          BREAKING NEWS!!!!

          WWlll has already begun!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

  • d williams

    build a synagogue , church , temple , etc. next to the mosque to show
    religious freedom to the world

    • FlaJim

      There’s a Greek Orthodox church, destroyed on 9/11, that needs rebuilding but NYC and the Port Authority has thrown one roadblock after another to that happening.

      Why is a radical moslem (redundant term) building project for recruiting more ‘holy’ warriors put on the fast track when real Americans can’t get approval?

      Even more maddening is that this moslem ‘spiritual’ leader is headed to the Mideast on our dime to raise funding.

      What in blazes is going on here?

      • Jerry D

        Because the only persecution that is legal in the United States is of Christians. It’s time Christians stood as a group and made their true political power known. And, no, it’s not illegal for Christians to vote according to their religious convictions. As a matter of fact, if we are truly faithful to Christ, our religious beliefs will guide our lives in every way.

        • Conservative at Birth

          Are members of the Democrat Party truly Christian, when they have foght for the rights of Planned Parenthood to murder over 43 million Children in the womb?

          • DaveH

            That is a thorny issue at best. I believe that is a decision that is best left to the woman who is carrying the baby, since it is her life at stake also:
            http://www.boston.com/news/nation/articles/2007/08/25/us_childbirth_mortality_rate_increases/
            Let God judge her in the afterlife.
            Ideally, Religious people should encourage them to avoid pregnancy in the first place. They should stick to counseling the pregnant women, and providing services such as adoption counseling for those that choose to birth the baby but don’t want to keep it. If you force her to carry to term and she does die during childbirth, her blood is on your hands.

          • Jerry D

            I don’t believe any political party is truly Christian, per se, but the Democrats are certainly further from it than other major party. On the other hand, I’m not so concerned that they be “Christian.” but that they hold to the original intent of the Constitution and not how it has been skewed by the Leftists.

          • mickey

            Yes, abortion is a thorny issue. My auntie died in botched abortion. She had no means of supporting the child, especially in the 30′s she would have been shunned.

            We still do shun those that choose to have children. The fathers are not held responsible–haven’t seen any demonstrations outside those clinics decrying this. We force them on welfare, limiting their lives, moms and children alike. Condem single heads of households, divorced moms. Women are forever branded for having a child or for not having a child. Change the tune of society to reflect the honor of moms and you might have an ear.

            I have yet to see any one in the crowd of demonstrators volunteer to take personal financial responsibility for any of the children–it’s passed onto welfare.

            So, as it stands, prochoice is the only thing a woman has. Take the consequences either way.

      • dan az

        Fla Jim
        when you have a muslim in office inviting them in what do you think is going on.I would like to know how a radical muslim got there in the first place!

  • Warrior

    It just seems like such a long distance from the United Nations Complex. Why make the flock travel so far? I guess the imam just isn’t on board with the “Green Movement” yet. Shame.

    • Michael J.

      Warrior,
      Majic flying carpets expel zero emissions which makes them green compliant.

      • Warrior

        Are those carpets canary yellow with black markings?

  • Bob L

    A mosque by any other name would smell. Period. Sorry Will S., but needs must. Scene from the lowest basement in the Cordoba monstrosity: Hmm de dum de dee ALLAH AKBAR, humm mmmm INSHALLAH , gotta mix dat ammonium nitrate, almost ..ahh…….whoops……Extremely LARGE, Economy sized Explosion. Silence, except for the sounds of various building items falling to the ground intermingled with shredded robes,soiled loin cloths, sandals, bits of flea infested beards[gotta hand to those fleas, real survivors]. And not a police car nor fire truck in sight. Oh yes, they’re all watching tv , waiting to see if the newest “stimulus”package, in the form of union raises has been passed yet by the Barack,Reid, Pelosi come and git it, crowd. Humm de dum de dum.

  • TIME

    At the risk of making many here very angry, saddly Religon has been preverted by everyone for what ever rational they use of the moment.

    Thus this Mosque is a preversion, if any of you do the mind numbing task of reading the truth about this “CULT,” YES thats what Islam is, its a CULT, it’s not a Religon.

    Its a way of CONTROL of every aspect of ones life from politics to whom you have sex with, what you eat, when you eat, how you can eat, what you drink, what you wear, its a classic textbook CULT nothing more nothing less.

    Muslims HATE Freedom, thus they HATE YOU, can I make that any more simple.

    They HATE the United States from its core, they feel we are EVIL, yet they would kill their own mother if she spoke when she should have had her mouth closed. Now I ask how is that normal in any form.

    They would also kill they sister just by way of someome making a off handed statment about having sex with her, {even if they never did,} she still would be doomed to death by “STONING.”

    My God People wake up, these people are no differant than Jim Jones and if you feel he was ok then what can I say. You need mental help and lots of it.

    Try building a Jewish Temple on Muslim land, yea thats going work out just fine.

    Oh Nancy Pigosee is going to dig to the bottom of the restiance of this abomination.
    Anyone with one single brain cell can clearly see this is just one more waste of Tax Payers money for her to gain political favor with our enemy by way of outlandish rhetoric.
    Watch the other hand.

    • Paul

      Time
      I have to agree with you on that you said some things that are very true. it’s time we stand up and fight back lets take this mosque down along with everyone init.

    • Jerry D

      Agreed to this degree: religion is the single most causative factor of war. Religion, by the way, is only mentioned once in the Scriptures in a positive light. Even Christian religionists are dangerous.

      • ValDM

        Jerry D.

        You are only partially right. Power and Greed are the base reasons for
        war. Read a little history and you’ll find out that some of the worst
        war-mongers had no faith or creed. Check Ghengis Khan, Attila the Hun,
        Hitler (renounced his faith), and many, many more. Please get off the
        “religious” kick. You’re promoting secular humanism and not even aware of it.

        • Jerry D

          Religion is usually a product of power and greed. Christianity, as a religion, has been guilty of atrocities just like any other religion. However, true Believers don’t have a religion, as such, they have a relationship with a living Savior. As far as promoting secular humanism, you’ll have to explain that one. Secular humanism is as far from true life in Christ as the east is from the west.

          • 45caliber

            You are right. The Crusaders were excellent examples. But I can’t think of any examples in the last several hundred years. And I can think of a lot of Islam examples within the last several years.

        • Jeep

          I think what Jerry meant was that war in the “name of religion” was the primary cause. Religions do not call for war, well, except the 109 some odd verses in the Qur’an, and the Old Testament verses calling for war, but otherwise, religions do not call for war.

      • alpha-lemming

        God said… “Here is the truth”

        The Devil said… “Let me catagorize that for ya” That is organized religion.

      • 45caliber

        Jerry D:
        You are wrong. Greed and power but particularly greed are the reasons for war. Religions are used to get soldiers who are willing to die and give all the wealth to those who started the war in the first place. It is okay for the army to take wealth but only if those in charge get it. And religious soldiers can be encouraged to do just that. The soldiers fight for the religion – but it wasn’t started due to religion.

      • mickey

        Yeah, they mask all those power grabs behind religion. This is nothing more than modern day Crusades.

    • Conservative at Birth

      Exactly correct! The supreme court will need to hear arguments as to what actually defines a religion. Can Sadists, Child Molesters, or any other Cult claim to be a religion?

      • Jerry D

        To be honest, they can claim it. Religion is the external manifestation of an inward belief system. That’s why religion is only mentioned once in Scripture in a positive manner.

      • 45caliber

        That’s already been decided. When someone pointed out that that attack at Waco on the Branch Davidians was an attack on a religion, someone in the administration stated, “We can’t attack religions. But we can attack cults. And we are the ones who decide which is which.”

  • Phoenix

    Many people immigrate to the U.S. every year.
    Many will fit in, learning to speak English, and
    trying to associate with other Americans in a civil
    manner. They will honor, and respect the laws of
    this country.
    Others will come here only for economic opportunity,
    and will scorn, and shun the rest of America. They
    will move into enclaves of people like themselves,
    continue to speak their native language, and if possible
    work to destroy the America that the rest of us know.
    Far too many in the Islamic community fits this
    into this category.
    People who do not like America as it is, and who
    refuse to fit in, should not be granted citizenship.
    They should be deported to the land they came from
    upon discovery that they do not want to fit in, and it
    should happen swiftly.
    This is America.
    Accept it, its people, its laws, its popular customs,
    its language, etc, or leave it !!
    Go back to where you came from, and live there like
    you want to live.

    • Eric Bischoff

      Geez for a minute there I thought I was reading Chief Red Horse!

      • Brad

        Get a clue Eric, Phoenix has a point, the early immigrants to this country assimilated, learning our language, customs and finally our culture, they became prosperous. Today we have immigrants who refuse to assimilate, i.e. what Phoenix posted and let me include the illegal mexicans, they aren’t willing to assimilated, they just to take over the entire SW region of the US.

        • viktor leben

          I think our American culture has been cursed by God ! God is giving our land to another people. Hopefully they will do better ….

      • 45caliber

        Eric:
        As part American Indian, I don’t appreciate comments like this. We are now AMERICANS.

        • Bob

          Which part?

      • (WIA) Wild Indian in Action

        Eric B.
        I am a full blood American Indian, legally enrolled with my tribes, I here by give you an Indian name that you can register on this site when you comment, from now you will be know as “Chief One Dog (offensive words removed)”.
        You are one sick mammy jammer, and I want your scalp on my belt.

        • viktor leben

          That sure isn’t a lot of “hoya” !!!

    • Awokenone

      Could not have pointed that out better myself, a country divided will not stand! Learn English, stand with, defend & give loyalty to our country and liberty or leave, simple!

      • viktor leben

        Is what you mean is to defend our leaders ? and follow them ?

    • 45caliber

      I agree with you, Phoenix.

  • patrick

    I read a blog yesterday and i now think i understand how it works! All this muslim, terrorist, radicals, infadels, etc. Well the blog explained how Obammy can legally lie and decieve the public about himslf and his true religion of being a muslim. It explains in the kuran and other terroristic manuals that is within reason for a muslim to decieve and lie to others about their true radical muslim beliefs if that technique is used to promote mulims and their mission to take control and to overthrough the world. So wake up people, Obammy is lying and decieving us daily. Now he clearly is, once again, supporting the radicals, muslims and terrorists.

    • http://msn ps

      amen! again. plainly put! and rightly so. thank you

    • Jerry D

      Yep, the end justifies the means – just like socialism. All evil has common ground.

      • 45caliber

        You are right. And all politicians believe it too.

  • Eric Bischoff

    As far as I am concerned, so far only “Thinking About” has it right. Everyone else is operating from fear and propaganda. This is just another nail in our coffin.

    We covet other people’s resources on earth and act like this is our given right. The wars in the Middle East are about oil and to make the masses obedient they make it about religion. Hook Line and Sinker. I realize speaking truth to power can never be popular on this subject especially when each side is looking at this with their inflamed religious blinders on. I especially love the one about how now unions will be useful.

    You are all so willing to give up one freedom after another all while claiming you want your country back. The patriot act was an act of war against the American People and it passed UNREAD in the middle of the night and most of you still think it was a great idea. You should be ashamed of yourselves.

    Did you happen to notice that your favorite news organization Fox/News Corp, which is owned by a foreign Australian and a foreign Saudi Dictator Prince just gave a million dollars to the Republicans!

    Your willingness to go along with all of this madness is how we got to the following dastardly deeds: You, an American, are now guilty until proven Innocent. Look it up! You can be arrested and held without due process indefinitely. All of you Drill Baby Drillers will like this one. The Govt can put an oil well or gas well in your backyard, right next to you kiddy swing and pollute the air in your house and your water well and you can’t say or do anything about it because you don’t own your mineral rights. And by the way this is happening all over the country as we speak. They now use eminent domain to take your house so that a developper can build a Mall.

    You can be labeled a terrorist with secret proof and assassinated by your own govt. The govt can now secretly enter your house and plant recording devices and they don’t have to tell you they have done this. You can be kidnapped, renditionned and tortured. If they don’t like your politics, this govt can and has put people on no fly list and you can never get off that list. They’ve used this on journalists and political activists they didn’t like. But hey it couldn’t happen to you right!

    The supreme court after deciding who won an election, not the people’s vote, has now given a corporation the right to spend any amount of money to get candidates elected. Your vote no longer counts. Banksters and Corporations are running this country and they have you poor suckers volunteering your money and your children to fight their wars.

    So let me see if I have this right. Freedom of speech is ok as long as you are saying what we want to hear. And freedom of religion is ok as long it’s the right religion, you know, the Jesus one! Do you think that’s what the founders meant!

    The govt has done all of these things because you the people have let them. You are complicit in the desecration of the Constitution.

    As long as you keep operating from Fear and Cowardness, you deserve everything you get.

    Ship of Fools.

    • Brad

      Eric,

      Your argument is pure leftist propaganda, it has already been proven that News Corp donated a million dollars to the RGA Republican Governors Association. As for the Saudi Prince, well he owns less than 7% of the company, I suggest you do some home work before posting your type of propagamda.

      By the way, when was the last time this country was attacked since the inception of the Patriot Act? I’m willing to give up a few freedoms to keep you and me safe from radicals bent on our distruction.

      • Al Sieber

        Brad, I’m not willing to give up any rights or freedom to be safe. “Those that sacrifice their freedom for security deserve neither” Ben Franklin. Brad, I’m not giving up $hit. why would you be willing to do that?

        • Brad

          Al,

          That’s your right,

          (I’m not willing to give up any rights or freedom to be safe. “Those that sacrifice their freedom for security deserve neither” Ben Franklin. Brad, I’m not giving up $hit. why would you be willing to do that?)

          I’m not abdicating all my rights, I want a free America just like you do, sometimes we need to do things that are distastefull or go against our way of life just to keep all of us safe. Ben was wise for his time and his words reasonnate today, but times are different and we need to protect ourselves against an enemy bent on our distruction. Whether it’s through religion, politics, warfare, or whatever if we don’t protect ourselves we are doomed.

          • 45caliber

            Giving up freedoms or anything else only tempts them to add more things to the list of what they want you to give up. You either stop and refuse ANY loss of freedoms or you give up all of them.

            One of our real problems is that too many people in the US are too complacent about violence. “It will never happen here!” There was an incident in Israel some years ago. Several terrorists decided to drive to a market, kill a bunch of people, and then drive to another market to do the same thing while the police ran to the first one. They jumped out of their car with guns – and a dozen or more Israelis immediately pulled their own guns and opened fire. No one was killed but the terrorists … while being treated at the hospital for bullet wounds … complained that it wasn’t “fair” for others to have guns. Tell me, if someone in a mall here pulled a gun, how many others could he expect to be pulled to stop him? Thanks to our government, probably not a one.

          • Al Sieber

            Brad, the enemy is from in.

          • viktor leben

            As for “enemies”, what country has Congress declared war on ?

      • Al Sieber

        Brad, Eric is right about the Patriot Act, it goes hand in hand with Hitler’s “Enabling Act”, so you see history repeating itself. give up your rights and we’ll protect you.

        • Brad

          Al,

          You are wrong about Germany’s “Enabling Act” read the link http://www.britannica.com/EBchecked/topic/186351/Enabling-Act It was a way for then Channcelor Adolf Hitler to bypass the Reichstagg Germany’s form of Parliment to enact laws against the people. The Patriot act does no such thing. Get your facts strait my friend.

          • Jerry D

            On the other hand, Obama and his minions have lately been working on ways to institute his “changes” without having to go through Congress.

          • Bob

            What about executive orders.

          • Al Sieber

            Brad, I’m not getting on your a$$, look, get a hold of the book:Rise and Fall of the 3rd Reich and read life in the 3rd Reich, 1933-1937 and see if we’re not there. we are, from the economy, on up…… a perfect repeat of history.

          • Al Sieber

            Brad, the Enabling Act, and the Patriot Act, are a means to a end.

        • Brad

          Here’s another resourse link about Hitlers Enabling Act

          http://www.historyplace.com/worldwar2/timeline/enabling.htm

      • BigBadJohn

        Brad so you are willing to give up a few freedoms because of Bush’s 9/11 false flag operation?

        Look it up, Bush was warned that AL Queada was planning an attack using airplanes as missiles. How much more detail he had we will never know. But considering WTC was bombed in 1993, it’s a pretty good guess that that also knew what the target was!
        However, in spite of the warning, Americans were never warned, airport security was not notified and even the pilots themselves were not warned about a possible attack/hijacking!

        The Bush administration let it happen!
        Why? To take away those freedoms you are so willing to give!

        • Brad

          BigBadJohn,

          You may not want your freedoms infringed upon, neither do I, but since the Patriot Act was enacted have we been attack at the same level as 9/11, NO. Has there been attempts, sure there has been and we have stoped further more attacks before thay could have reached our shores.

          So tell me what could the Bush administration have done, 9 months into office and having to undo 8 years of the clinton administrations mess. Clinton left our military weak, our national security teams under funded to conduct proper survailance. SO tell me were the warnings credible to have the Bush adminstration warn against a possible terrorist attack using planes or missiles? It would still of happened because in a nut shell we were weak and unprepared for it. To say the Bush administration let it happen is wrong, it’s like FDR let the Japanese attack Pearl Harbor on Dec 7th, there were events leading up to each eventual attack. You can try your conspiracy theories elsewhere, don’t try to pawn them off on me.

          BigBadJohn, what freedoms have you lost due to the Patriot Act?

          • DaveH

            Maybe, Brad, this article will answer your question:
            http://reason.org/news/show/122613.html

            You’d best hope that once our government becomes totalitarian (and it will unless we all wake up) your phone call isn’t monitored by some government agent who doesn’t care for your political opinion and decides to do something about it. Don’t tell me that can’t happen here. We are no more immune to freedom loss than is any other country.

          • Al Sieber

            Brad, calling someone a conspiracy theorist, is like calling someone a racist. to say everything is a conspiracy is lunacy, to say there are none is extremely ignorant.

        • Jeep

          Funny how you leftists so willingly believe that Former President Bush would willingly sacrifice over 3,000 American’s for a power grab, and yet, you cannot wrap your mind about the current administrations blatant usurpation of power through non-constitutional means. Opression is opression, my friend. I am willing to look at your conspiracy theory, if you would be willing to consider mine.

        • Jacque

          Clinton was warned first, when HE was president. He chose to ignore the warning, and Bush takes the bashing for it. Don’t get me wrong we’ve been warned way before either of these presidents, but nobody would listen. Israel warned the US a long time ago that the terror would reach our shores. THEY WERE RIGHT.

      • mickey

        So, Brad, when was the US attacked before 911 and no Patriot Act?

        • dan az

          Mickey
          It was wakco oh wait that was the government killing church goers how about oklahoma bombing of the federal building that had no feds working in it at nine in the morning oh wait the conspiracy theory is that, it was our government, who knows for sure.but it did give us the beginings of the patriot act according to janet reino.Now we have janet nopalatano that believes that all US troops are the terrorist so we better not bring them back here what rights did we lose when old ladies get stripped searched at the air ports and the lactating mothers have to drink there own milk co as to make sure its not poison or a bomb.maybe its just me but I think we lost a few rights.Now with the threat to shut down the internet ya think that might be a right lost?

    • Al Sieber

      You’re really full of $hit Eric if you believe we all think like that. I know who’s running this country and the world, and so do a lot of other people on this site, so don’t catagorize us all in to one group, it makes you look ignorant. I own my mineral rights on my property, it’s called patent land. so what have you done for your country and rights lately, you accuse us of doing nothing.

    • Jerry D

      Actually, I spent the first 18 years of my life living next to an oil well in East Texas. I never got the first drop of crude on me. It came on for eight hours hours per day (four hours at a time), including in the middle of the night. Since the pumps were electrically driven, it didn’t even wake me up. I, for one, am against deep water (more than 500 feet). However, we have nearly 2 trillion barrels of shale oil reserve in the western US that hasn’t been tapped. It could be done so extremely safely, but the leftwing wackos are afraid we might displace a minnow, or make a moose take a detour. You really need to see life for what it really is.

      • Jerry D

        I meant that I am against drilling for oil in water deeper than 500 feet.

      • Conservative at Birth

        What about ANWR

        • Jerry D

          I’m for drilling in ANWAR so long as it is done carefully and a restriction is placed on how many wells may be drilled. That is, come up with a relatively non-invasive number of wells per unit of land.

          • Jeep

            Jerry D, I agree that “drill baby, drill” in ANWR is the right answer. And, I fully agree that an ecologically sound plan should be mandated. But, lest anyone not know, ANWR has a whopping 200-300 visitors each year. It is very remote, and dark for much of the winter. However, the potential is up to 25% of our current domestic production. That is only an estimate, as the liberal weenies allow for almost no exploration.

          • Jerry D

            Absolutely right, Jeep. On the other hand, I would rather they start developing the vast shale oil reserves in the far west. They could plan it well and extract billions of barrels, freeing us from Middle Eastern oil.

          • 45caliber

            I don’t know how many of you remember the accusations about the Alaskan Pipeline when it was built. It was going to cover Alaska with oil. It was going to prevent caribou mirgrations. It was going to harm all wildlife. It was going to ruin the tundra. I can’t remember all the liberal arguments about not drilling and not piping it.

            Not a one of those arguments came true. I doubt if any they are now making about ANWR will come true either.

          • Bob

            That’ll keep the engines on all your toys running for a long time. How much of the Alaskan oil is used in the US? None. It is all sold to Japan because they pay alot more.

      • mickey

        45, yeah, I remember this. lol. It didn’t happen. While I agree with protection our soil, as it is the only way we eat, I agree we have inland oil to substain us. There is no need to drill offshore. Anyway, has CA given up all their oil rigs? When did this happen, just saying, all the liberal jive and all.

    • DaveH

      A Liberal talking about Freedom! Amazing. So the corporations by airing their ads are taking away our votes? How? Because the people that would vote for Liberals are too ignorant to make up their own minds? Where were the Liberals when the absentee ballots from military people overseas were not counted? Where were the Liberals when ACORN was practicing voter registration fraud? Where were the Liberals when dead people and convicts were voting?
      You did get the Patriot Act accusation right, but when you surround that correct statement with all the unsupported Liberal trash talk, you severely weaken your credibility.
      You talk about the Freedom Loss at the hands of Right-Wingers, yet I have not once heard you condemn the Healthcare Bill which directly assaults our Freedom of Choice. Most Liberals would argue that Healthcare Insurers are taking advantage of their policy-holders, but they turn right around and force us to buy that very same insurance. Liberals are Big Time Hypocrites.
      You are a victim of that propaganda that you rail about.

      • 45caliber

        DaveH”
        You are right … and the liberals are too dense to even understand it. It doesn’t fit with their fantasies of the perfect world so it MUST be wrong and ignored. They never once stop to realize their perfect world is what is wrong. If any of them start talking about how great that world is going to be, ask if they are going to be the ones to volunteer to clean out the sewer lines.

      • DaveH

        And, Eric, riddle me this: How come Obama hasn’t rescinded the Patriot Act? It’s certainly not because he’s afraid. And the Healthcare Bill has proved that the Congressional Democrats certainly aren’t afraid of the American people. So, why haven’t they rescinded that onerous, unconstitutional law?

    • Bob

      Eric You are wasting your time trying to educate these brainwashed people. While our country is going down the drain they are worried about a Mosque. I’ll bet none of them ever had a conversation with a Muslim. They all follow the Fox News Mantra.

      • DaveH

        Bob,
        Here is a list of Muslim Majority countries. Look up each one and see how many allow religious freedom:
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Muslim_majority_countries

        People have a darn good reason to fear Muslims. They are even more controlling and ruthless than the Liberals.

        • coal miner

          DaveH,

          theuglytruth.wordpress.com/2008/10/23/attacks-against-iraq’s-christians-genuine… · Cached page

      • dan az

        bob
        when your country is going down the drain because of your decisions is not what I would call the ones trying to stop it brainwashed.I think you nay have a mental issue and should have it check out soon!

    • 45caliber

      Eric:
      You have definately soaked in the liberal fantasy of war in the Middle East.

      Tell me, if all the wars there are due to oil, why don’t we get 100% of all that is there? According to the libs (and you) we should be bathing in it.

      Actually the only real place we get oil is from Iran – which we consider an enemy. Iraq oil goes to Europe. So does Saudi oil.

      Actually in the near future oil won’t be an argument any more. According to the figures I’ve seen on what oil is there, they have only about 10-15% of what they started with left.

  • john

    The reason Obama is all for this mosque is that now he’ll have a place to pray when he visits NY.As for unions..they helped put this pos in office..unions are not what they used to be…they’ll gladly build it because the new god that rules this land is the almighty dollar..which by the way is’nt so almighty anymore.

    • Jerry D

      I’d be willing to bet he does just that when the mosque is completed.

      • 45caliber

        Of course. He needs to show that he is PC, right?

        • DaveH

          That will be his excuse anyway.

    • Carol

      There are already many, MANY mosques in NYC. They don’t need another there. They just want to slap our face and look good to the Muslim world all over the world, to thumb their noses at us.

      Our county was founded as a Judeo-Christian country. Have you seen the many monuments in DC, our courts, our MONEY? “IN GOD WE TRUST”. The tablets of the 10 Commandments held by Moses. They even had church services in official government buildings. They did not want a forced country-wide religion such as what they left behind in England.
      There were many Christian religions in the founding colonies.

      You want Sharia law? GADS! Stone to death anyone who commmits adultry, or any WOMAN who is even seen “TALKING” to a man not in her family?!!! Daughters killed for becoming “too American” after being raised here. This imam has said he wants Sharia law to be the law in the USA.

      I say it is not smart to allow the women in the USA to wear burkas in public, especially when boarding a plane. Any terrorist can put on a burka. Let them wear them in their own home if they wish. If they do not want to assimilate and be Americans, go back to a country that has Shirea law, get out of here!!! I don’t believe men in turbans should be allowed to pass security at the airports without removing the turban to have it inspected, either. Is our safety flying not to be assured?

      I want my country back. We have bent over backwards WAY too far!… to be kind, and politically correct. Enough already! We are Americans.
      Our laws are to be enforced. we are not supposed to allow Sharira law, “honor killings”, etc. Follow our laws or leave.

      God Bless America.

      • libertytrain

        Good post – I agree with much of what you say.

  • patrick

    What is going on in India? The first country to send in help is once again, the United States of America! Now the terrorists and muslims are complaining about us not giving them enough help fast enough. So America continues to support Hati, India, Iraq, Afganistand, Korea, Japan China, Russia, etc. every other country in thr world, and then when we ask for their support to fight the radical muslims terrorists, few if any offer their support. What we need to do is when these world acts of God happen and they come running to the USA for aid, we should ask them to sign a contract that they will support us totally if the fight against terrorism and they pay back all the moneys it cost the USA to help them. Any country that does not sign these contracts will be denied any and all aid. Just watch how fast the world politics will change folks!!!

    • Eric Bischoff

      Actually Patrick It’s Pakistan is in trouble. 20 Million people have been flooded and displaced from their homes, more than 10% of the population. Did you happen to notice how we did not rise up to help them. No marathon fund raisers. No we are the World. Why do you think that is? Have we made up our minds, has the propaganda done it’s job. All muslims are bad screw them.

      And you might be surprised to learn that Americans are good at giving aid but our govt actually has not been honoring their pledges. That means they say they will give this much but then they don’t pay it. Also the aid the govt gives is mostly military aid. That money must be spent on weapons. And the biggest recipient of military aid, the one that gets more than all others combined, is Israel.

      • libertytrain

        And leading by example the penurious Hillary Clinton:
        Clinton pushes flood relief for Pakistan, donates $10
        By Jordy Yager – 08/04/10 02:50 PM ET

        “Secretary of State Hillary Clinton pressed Americans on Wednesday to donate money to flood relief efforts in Pakistan, saying she is leading by example and just made a $10 donation herself.”

        • Claire

          libertytrain–We can’t even take care of America, why in hell do we have to take care of everyone else? I have compassion and I have a heart, but right now in these economic times, my compassion and my heart belongs to America—first and foremost.
          $10.00???? If that is all Hillary gave, she is useless as tits on a boar. She wants to spend OUR money, not hers. How cheap and disgusting.
          Sorry, folks, but I am certainly angry tonight.

          • libertytrain

            Well Claire – she just had to fork out $2 million for a wedding – what can we expect from those who expect that we follow their example — do as I say not as I do – again.

          • http://gunner689 gunner689

            Maybe Bill will donate his used underware and socks, but of course he’ll want a reciept for tax deductions.

      • Bob

        Do you remember when old man Bush and Clinton were taking donations for the Tsunami and last year for Haiti. How much money do you think ever got to the needy. It would be interesting to know. Also their Fox News hero Hannity runs fundraisers for children of slain servicemen. They’d be surprised to know how little goes to the kids.

        • Jeep

          Bob, perhaps you have not looked at the financial statements from the Freedom Alliance. Or, is it that you “heard from an unnamed source” about big misdeeds? Did you know that (according to the records of the FA as reported to the IRS) 79% went to program activities, 14% to fundraising and 7% to management. And, according to the FA, Hannity receives no funds whatsoever, period, nada, zilch, zip.

          • Bob

            Who runs the freedom alliance?

      • 45caliber

        Eric:
        You are again quoting the (wrong) liberal doctrine about weapons and Israel.

        Back in 1947, yes, we helped them with weapons. In 2010? The only time they use our weapons is to take them apart and see if we’ve come up with something that might be as good as their own weapons.

        The Mirage jets are superior to all in the world, including ours. The Uzis are the same for the ground troops. And they have a killer tank design. Why should they want to use our trash?

        • Jeep

          Hold on now 45cal, the Isrealis are masters at improving technology, but they do rely heavily on arms purchased from the US and France to keep their soldiers supplied. While it is true that Israeli some arms are superior to our own, they are modified to support a specific context. As an example, you can run an M1A3 through the arctic or the Sahara, but take a Merkava to Barlow and it won’t make it. Not really disagreeing with you, but give our own arms a little credit, will ya!

      • Carol

        You don’t know what you are talking about. We have always been the country who has rushed to help everyone in the world, and still are.

      • DaveH

        Come on Eric. Try being a little more factual. Who has the most voting power in the World Bank (15%, twice as much as the next country – Japan)? The US of course. And who supplies a disproportionate share of the UN funds? The US of course. Now read this article for real facts:
        http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100817/ap_on_bi_ge/as_pakistan_floods

    • Bob L

      Not a bad idea at all Patrick. Spoken like a true son of Erin. Enough of pouring unaffordable aid to unappreciative countries that know nor care less for the infestation of islamic atrocities. Patriotic Americans, Stand Tall while you can and fight the good fight. John Wayne: “Whaddaya mean I gotta press 1 for English?”

      • Jerry D

        Well said.

      • 45caliber

        I saw a list of countries that receive aid from the US a few years ago. At that time, if we had kept the money, we could have easily balanced our budget.

        The first was India – we sent food there. The second highest to claim aid was Russia. The third was Red China. In fact India was the ONLY one in the top ten that was not Communist. Europe fell into the top twenty countries. Isreal was further down the list – AFTER Palestine.

        In fact there were only two countries in the world that did not receive funds. And both of those were tiny.

        As far as I can tell the only reason we give it all away is to try to buy friends. And that never works!

  • http://SAMVP Ida Snow

    I have been in a couple Moslems homes enjoyed their beautiful friendship., Always, I saw a picture of the Virgin Mary holding baby Jesus right in Dineing room. I did’nt comment.I was very aware they were Muslim were very faithful to Allah/God.. As I became more comfortable I asked why do you have Mary & Jesus. Do you worship them. There response was very beautiful and yes they revere Mary & Jesus. Their reasoning was better than I could have realized if I had not asked.. This is how I feel. Bush has demonised the Muslim world. Because he had a much uglier plan being concocted by the 3% Zionist population that pull the strings with Presidents. And the Powerful Corporations making War equipment from Guns, tanks, bombs, & drones. already being racists against Moslems wearing Burkas it made them different. The Corrupt and powerful needed a reason to have a war, they want more control of Middle East. They already have their Ace “Israel” set up there.They have provided Israel with weapons of Mass Destruction, We have all been witness to the atrocities Israel has committed against Palestine & Lebanon as well raising a generation of citizens who do not believe there was ever a nation of palestinians,, Their aim is to wipe all Indiginous people of the land as well occupy it all “What a foothold”.. I believe 911 was just another scheme in their nasty plan. Anyone who read details know the cream of the top in the offices were not in the towers that day. The workers and visitors were the sacrificial lambs and they did not plan or realize the firemen would also be victims of their hideous plan, and all the families . This worked in their favor even moreso, giving their creation an even stronger reason to want revenge on innocent peoples…..This horrible crime has let too many guilty parties come out looking clean and the misery, hatred brought upon Moslems is incromphrensible.But, sadly Americans have only to look in their own back yard and see the truth of this horrible connocted, devised, evil plan. LB Johnson was in cahoots with “Israel” when they tried to sink the USS Liberty do not forget.This also was an attempt to get Americans to hate the Middle East. So I will finish saying I believe with every cell in my body 911 was devised through orders from Bush.And one day just like the USS Liberty.. The truth will find its way into the light. So I am sure a Mosque would be a dam sight better than trying to promote hatred against innocent people a world away who did nothing to bring this on.

    • Paul

      While it’s true that not all muslems are terrorists, it’s also true that all terrorists are muslems, you also appear to be one of these people that believe that the towers were brought down by the then Prez Bushm, that is not true I had a friend mine who was ceo of a company was killed in the trade center, there whwere some high ranking officals that where murdered in the towers by these muslams they are not as innocent as they claim.

      • john

        Every religion has its extremists but only Islam calls for the forceful conversion of non believers or to kill them.Muslims when the majority of the population will impose sharia law upon the people whether you are Muslim or not they will force you to abide by their rules.Momar Qudafi said it outright…the Western world keeps killing their babies in the womb or have small families,where the Muslim has many children..therefore it will not be necessary to invade by force..we will invade the West through the womb.This is the danger that America faces and that Europe has already succumbed to.Europe with their zero population growth through abortion,contraception and fertility problems will be predominately Muslim within 5-10 yrs.We need to start having children,turn back to God and force out the godless leftist liberals bent on destroying America and handing her over to her enenies in the name of political correctness and re-establishing American values,ethics and morals based on our Christian-Judeo pricipals which the founding fathers based the laws of our land on.We also need to root out all the leftists from our educational system.This is where the poisoning and control of minds starts..with our children.

      • http://SAMVP Ida Snow

        Paul .. I guess your memory is fading “your comment not all moslems are terrorists. but all terrorists are Moslems” how do you explain your own Timothy McVeigh, Or is it just as most of us know he was part of the horrible behind the scenes of home grown activity.Then used as the scapegoat….

      • dan az

        Paul
        sorry for your loss but how do you explain ferite pouring out of the buildings?I am not saying that the pilots where not muslims that may or may not have been coeherst what i am saying is that there maybe more to it than meets the eye.

  • http://none Hazel

    I pray ( To the only God –Jesus Christ ) that our legislators will wake up before it it too late. With a Muslim in the WhiteHouse, we
    can only expect more hell to follow. God Bless America and keep us
    safe

    • Jerry D

      Amen to that!

    • Bob

      If McCain was president we would be at war with Iran already.

      • Claire

        Bob–I am inclined to agree with you. McCain is a warmonger. Maybe it is because he was tortured. Who knows.

        • Bob

          He wasn’t tortured. He was injured when he ejected from his jet. Do you know he demolished four jets while in the Navy.

          • Claire

            Bob–Sorry, I was under the impression he was a POW and was tortured. I believe this is what I read.

          • dan az

            claire
            you are right he and many others where tortured daily and as far as the four jets that bob is talking about was not his fault he was on deck in his jet when a missile from another jet launched on board at his jet which distroyed the other ones next to his he was lucky to survive.

  • Lewis Munn

    Unfortunately, lots of the negative things said have elements of truth in them.

    Our education has been systematically degraded so that, as in Orwells “1984″, the words our founders would have used cannot be uttered.
    If more thinking people really read “1984″ we might be better off.
    I oppose the Mosque, because I see it as being a provocation that some under-educated redneck is going to blow up in retaliation, or something of the kind, to put our nation into major moral debt to Islaam.

    I think it foolish we should tempt extremists to the right to retaliation.

    I believe the Muslims know that there will be retaliation by non-thinkers, which will give them “rights” against our whole nation.
    So allowing this to be built where it is a continued provocation is foolishness.

    We should be wise and think ahead, not emotional, uttering slogans and nonsense. We need to remember our education has been compromised by educators playing to the emotions and “progressive” ideas, so much of the ability to think carefully has been lost to the ideas of do what the desires and emotions dictate, without thought of long-term consequences.

    We are already losing whole towns to Muslim takeovers and Sharia Law. Time NOT to dangle the bait for far right actions that compromise our moral position in the world, and leave us in moral debt to the Muslims, in the eyes of the rest of the world.

    • Conservative at Birth

      And Animal Farm by George Orwell.

    • Jerry D

      I’ve been an educator for over 30 years and what you said about our schools no longer teaching students to think is absolutely correct. Public schools are more concerned about teaching them what to think than how to think.

    • http://gunner689 gunner689

      direct action always works better than endless retoric

      • dan az

        gunner
        you got that right!!!!

  • William H. Hayes, Jr.

    We have let Saudi Arabia put a muslim in the White House, so why do we object to where they put their mosque? There is only one God- the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

    • Jerry D

      Absolutely.

  • James

    All of the Founding Fathers were Christians. The ‘Christian’ term wasn’t used in the Declaration of Independence or the U.S. Constitution because that was just understood. The First Amendment’s “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,” was always understood to mean Christian religions. However that has been lost sight of, now, any religion may operate freely here.
    We recently saw the result of that policy. At Ft. Hood, Texas, a major (raised as a muslim), rather than to go overseas and shoot his fellow muslims, turned his guns on Americans, shooting 40 and killing 13. One’s culture will always take precedent when the chips are down.

    • Jerry D

      Actually a few of them were deists (about five percent of them). Thomas Paine became reprobate and was deserted by the vast majority of his American friends. With the exception of Paine, however, the few deists had Judeo-Christian values and principles. Benjamin Franklin is a good example.

    • http://gunner689 gunner689

      he was a doctor; he wouldn’t be shooting anyone. What he is is an enemy agent and should be treated accordingly…. the noose

  • J.M.R.

    JUST LET THEM KEEP BUILDING THEIR HOUSES OF WORSHIP THEN THEY CAN LET THE KILLERS OF AMERICANS ROAM THE STREETS TILL THEIR READY TO TAKE US OVER, BECAUSE THE DICK-TATER WILL NEVER CHECK THEM FOR HIDDEN WEAPONS, BUT THEY WILL COME FOR OUR WEAPONS. JUST ASK HILLARY.

  • Jim

    Anyone investigate Pelosi’s birth certificate. Now this crazy B_ _ _ _
    wnats to invstigate – not the ones that are finanacing the mosque but where the people that are fighting the mosque are getting their financing! It’s time America!

    • http://gunner689 gunner689

      Is anyone surprised ? It should be evident by now that Pelosi, Reid, Obama, and most of the Democratic Party and officials are the internal enemy of America. Reid and Dean are against the Mosque for political cover. Reid is losing badly in his home state and is trying to show he cares. There are some dummies who will fall for it, hopefully not many.

    • dan az

      Jim
      if they investigate then they would know how the people of this country feels about that idea.What else is there to investigate?

  • atlas reborn

    to start lets get this straight, saint patricks basicila was destroyed and the city is blocking its building. the imam is going to build a community center that only muslins can use which is prejudice, and the left wants it built. the greek church is open to all, but the muslim is not. the muslims can build mosques in america but americans can not build a church in any muslin country. the muslims are allowed to prostitise in america, and we can not do the same in their countries. islam faith says try to convert and if they do not kill them. christianity says teach the word of God and live a good christian life and they will covert. there is one that allows free choice america and one that promotes murder islam. do you want murdrers here? I think that this shows insanity in its blantent ugly ways.

  • http://www.gunthorp,com Gardner Behrends

    To be human, and less than perfectly informed, will always manifest in hypocrisy, irony, and other unintended consequences. As we all know, for the sake of religion, Christianity, Islam, and Judaism especially, many provocations and horrors have been perpetrated. Nevertheless, many of each faith would willingly live in peace and harmony, but for the efforts of agitators, both emotionally charged individuals as well as the wealthy elite, financially motivated by the profits of conflict and the prospect of world order (dominion).

    No mater what we think or say, Saudi petro-trillions will have sway, through politicians, bureaucrats, and ,yes, construction union bosses. What signal is sent to Muslims and the rest of the world if we refuse to allow it there, and thereby bring ourselves down to their level of religious intolerance? Yes, they are noted throughout history to tear down churches and build mosques in situ to symbolize their conquest. This may symbolize a conquest through our foreign oil dependency and immense transfer of wealth to them, but not of the American spirit.

    That spirit will manifest when we develop our own resources, nuclear, coal, oil, and gas. Let them try to grow their own wheat in the sand.
    This whole mosque provocation is distracting us from the real threat to freedom, our own wastefully corrupt government and godless culture. Are we too big to fail?

  • http://groups.yahoo.com/group/brierpatch/ Paw Possum

    We may have freedom to hold any religion of our choosing but we are not free to do things which are not allowed to other people even though a person’s religion allows it. What is a person claimed to believe in a religion that promoted sex between adults and children? Would we allow it? Of course not. Just like Rastafarians are not free to smoke ganja. Not everything permitted by a religion can be practiced freely. So why is it that we must allow this mosque? That says nothing of the establishment of a religion. It only says something about the establishment of a new building which of course is completely regulated already. It looks to me like the supporters of this mosque are trying to create a much wider scope for the “freedom of religion” than has ever been practiced before and I have to ask why. Do they want to bring about their own conquest? Yes, I think this is part of a conspiracy.

    -Paw, Doomer in Chief
    http://groups.yahoo.com/group/brierpatch/

  • Yousef Ali

    Perhaps we should stop wearing graduation robes at graduation ceremonies too? Those are actually Moorish robes that date back to the time of the Caliphite at Codoba, back when the Moors brought Europe out of the Dark Ages with their advanced learning, now taught in our schools. Maybe we should stop teaching most of our sciences, al-gebra, sociology, and all those “Arab teachings” while we are at it and go back to the Dark Ages. Judging from most of the horrible spelling and grammar in the posts above, these “students” should have never graduated anyway.

    • Jerry D

      Actually, I agree with you about the robes. I’ve always hated those things. Reference the spelling: most of them are so used to texting that they’ve forgotten how to spell. That doesn’t mean, however, that their ideas aren’t valid.

    • http://gunner689 gunner689

      great, Ali. Now what has your 6th century cretins done for the good of civilization in the last 1000 years, other than to bring barbarity, slavery, and conquest to much of the third world.

  • Yousuf (Muslim)

    And they say the KKK is inactive. Sounds like they’re alive and well in here. All you guys need now is some rope and torches. Since most of you dimwits can’t accurately recall history, the Jews were running away from Christian Europe for fear of being burned, forced to convert or die, and of-course the infamous inquisition, not really in the spirit of tolerance in that era either, were ya’ll (and there’s the irony). Factually, Judaisms “golden age” of literature, poetry, religious works, all happened in Spain, under Islamic rule. Secondly, the tax this author and facilitator of education speaks of that was imposed on Jews and Christians, or the infidels as he groups it, was not an infidel tax (lol), no, it was a tax that ALL who didn’t join the army had to pay, sort of like in America where if you’re in the armed forces you don’t pay tax on produce/product/service (if on base)and the rest of us sheeps pay. Thirdly,whenever/wherever a Christian community, or Jewish, came under Islamic rule, they were not forced to CONVERT or DIE. This usage is derived from the blessed crusaders and their Pope’s, archbishops and the like as they were raping, pillaging, and murdering the holy land with “blood up to their knees” because their God (Jesus supposedly) commanded it. If it was the case, the Jews and Christians of Spain should have disappeared… they didn’t, they thrived, prospored, and became an interwoven part of Cordoba’s society.

    The word insensitivity is misplaced in the authors article. He meant to say intolerance, bigotry, undefined fear. And no it’s not the same to put a church in Mecca for a mosque in ground zero ( I think that’s what the simple author meant) why? Unless your pope or pastor, father, whatever decrees it a holy site of Christendom, the arguement doesn’t hold water… like apples and oranges.

    I know you guys are venting out because your confused and frustrated and everyone is pointing to the Patsy (Islam). Will you actually blame a whole religion that billions follow globally for something that other confused, frustrated, angry people did in its name? When some right winger Christian terrorist blows up the Oklahoma city building, where’s all the hoora and fanfare about extremist Christian/Christian terrorist? Or if they bomb medical facilities because they think the doctor’s and people there are ungodly. or target and kill doctors who they believe aren’t following their “godly” laws I’ll tell ya, not as prevelaint and targeted as Islam and its followers are.

    Do you really want to know about 9/11… watch loose change. No it’s not Muslim directed or propagated to put a spell on you…its a accounts of those who were there that day and from chemical and building engineers worldwide as live footage of the towers, which may catch your eye of something odd going on. Good night and good luck!

    • Jerry D

      First of all, do not make the mistake of confusing the Crusaders with true Christianity. The majority of them were misguided bullies who went for fame and fortune, not for a true cause. As a Believer and a student of history, I am convinced that the Crusades were just as evil as that being done in the name of Allah when Islam took over the Middle East. It was not a “peaceful conversion.” They would have done the same to Europe had it not been for Charlemagne (one of my ancestors, by the way). But, you are correct about the Crusaders.

      As for the peaceful existence of Christianity and Judaism under Islam, that’s a farce. In many Muslim countries, it is a capital offense to attempt to convert someone to either Christianity or Judaism. It is also often a capital offense to be a Muslim converting to Christianity or Islam. So, if Islam is so tolerant, why do those countries not have real “religious freedom” rather than limited “tolerance?”

      As far as having a Pope or “father, ” – I believe in neither. As a Christian, I believe in the individual priesthood of the believer. The same Holy Spirit that guided me from atheism to Christ can also guide me as I study the Scriptures to learn more about Him.

      You are certainly right that all of Islam should not be blamed for the actions of the radicals. The thing that bothers me, however, is that moderate Muslims are not as vocal as they should be in the condemnation of those radicals. They ought to be thrown out of the mosques and ostracized. There ought to be a concerted, public effort on the part of moderates to counter the influence of the radicals. Perhaps moderate Muslims secretly support the idea of a worldwide caliphate, though admittedly hating the Jihadists.

      As for Christian terrorists: for every Christian terrorist, there are 1,000 Muslim terrorists. Additionally, most Christian acts of terrorism (albeit evil acts) are directed toward small targets and are rarely ever directed toward large groups of innocents. I, and the vast majority of Christians, condemn the radical actions of those few who claim to be Christians and do violence in His name. And we do so loudly and publicly.

      Finally, we would say that any true believer would not resort to violence to further the aims of our God.

      • DaveH

        They are “tolerant” and “peaceful” only until they reach majority. Then watch out.

      • john

        There is no such thing as a Christian terrorist..that is an oxymoron..if you are a terrorist you are not a Christian(a follower of Christ)Jerry good for you in your conversion but you have a long way to go in your theology keep praying to the Holy Spirit to guide you.

    • Jerry D

      By the way, just a modern american history is skewed to favor pluralism rather than its Christian roots, Middle Eastern history is skewed to favor the Muslim conquerors. Sadly, history is always written by the conquerors with little consideration of the views of the conquered. You might remember that when trying to teach a history lesson to us.

      • Al Sieber

        Half of writing history, is hiding the truth.

    • john

      and let me guess…the holocaust did’nt happen either I bet

    • http://gunner689 gunner689

      Bugs Bunny makes more sense than Fatty Moore; funnier to.

  • Bob L

    Such vitriol, such an invective saturated discussion.Peace be unto y’all and yers.Annnd,cheer up y’all, next week is Dunk an Imam in Bacon Grease and Hawg Grabbin’ week. [Makes an excellent plumbers helper as a bonus] Thar, don’t thet make ya just wanta git up and line dance? Mark Twain might even snort.

  • john

    What I’d like to know is why are Muslim nations afraid to allow other religions to openly worship in their lands…because they’re religion could not stand up against Judaism or Christianity because it is a religion of man,founded by a man who borrowed from Judaism and Christianity..it is a hateful and enslaving religion and God is not hateful nor a slavemaster..He also would not approve of men overiding His Will by destroying others and His creation,therefore it is the religion of Satan..we Christians do not fear ,we already know the outcome at the end.Islam will be destroyed as all other false religions and Christ will be acknowledged by all.

  • 45caliber

    Watch the money.

    You can bet that the Muslims are paying someone off. But even more, they expect to have thousands and perhaps millions of Muslim pilgrims coming to visit the victory of their “warriors” over the tyrant, American.

    And all the politicians in New York and Washington can only see that money coming in.

    • Bob

      They are actually Mexicans wearing Muslim masks.

  • ruth

    Take heed….All muslims believe and obey the koran… Research the word town in the Koran and see how many times Mohammed advised (all) muslims to destroy complete towns and steal their possessions and their lands.. repeatedly…And they positively obeyed this command for 1400 years…Their synagogue of satan mosque at ground zero is a victory comfirmation to muslims…New Yorkers, beware…
    The murders of 9-11 was based on koran teaching…
    Did not satan say, “Fall down and worship ME as the god (of Abraham) and I will give you the world (in jihad).””””Rev. 3-9,10 Satan is tempting the world to worship him as the god of Abraham today..

  • ruth

    Any blame for the insanity of 9-11 and other terrorist events lies squarely on the koran and Mohammed.. The terrorists are merely following the koran and mohammed’s example he set forth..
    1 Timothy 4-1 prophecy of the koran…Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;

  • atlas reborn

    al seiber and brad the quotation is and means “he who gives up a right to for safety will surely lose both and deserves neither”

  • chuck b

    kinetic 1

    so the founding fathers were church goers but not christians. you must be reading from one of our revised history books. the founding fathers were christians, they were not catholic, they were not jewish, they were christians. made up of different denominations.
    you read into your history what you want to believe. this country was built on the christian faith and they did not demand we hold to that, it was there wish we would hold to those principals throughout our history.
    you liberals have tried to undermine this fact, through ignorance or to install your belief by changing the facts. it doesn’t work!!

    • chuck b

      correction: i meant to say they were not “muslims” instead of catholic.

  • atlas reborn

    Ida snow you did not give the reason why, you said they revere them. revere means honor but I can honor president bush or I can revere the anglican bishop, but believe in is totally different. when in a islamic country you beleive in allah and in you do not your head and body become seperate things. Islam is not peaceful nor holy. it is total dictatoriship and ruthless bloodthirsty in their beleifs.

  • 45caliber

    One thing I thought was interesting about this. They are the Cordova group. Their web site (for awhile, not there now) stated that during the time that the Muslims controlled Cordova they welcomed Christians and Jews and got along well with them. This showed their tolerant life.

    However, in history, the Christians and Jews were taxed so highly for living there that many starved. If they couldn’t pay the tax they weren’t run off – they were killed, usually by torture.

    I thought that it was interesting that the present group called this a “tolerant” way to get along with Christians and Jews.

    • Bob

      45 You must have been in Kotter’s class.

  • atlas reborn

    chuck b I must differ with you there were catholics also, in fact catholics are christians. Maryland was Catholic. It was their religion. the first admendment says congress shall make no law resprcting the establishment of religion nor phohibiting that parctice of religion. the reason it was worded that way is because they could not agree on a national religion, and to what was to say we do not have a national religion as europe and countries do. their were jews, catholics, calvinists, lutherns, deists, and anglicans. so go back to the history of our republic, and the federalist papers and you will see the truth.

    • chuck b

      atlas reborn

      if you look under my comment to the next comment you will see i made that correction. the founding fathers did not want the the rule of the church of england or the roman catholic church to be imbeded in this country. that was the intend of the people who fled england and europe to escape the tyranny of both those churches. i would suggest you read the history of the pilgrims in england and france.

  • Tom

    “…I CAN live with a mosque whose imam preaches hate, intolerance and the kind of respect for women that makes Joseph Smith look like Jane Fonda…”

    Why the cheap shot at Mormons?

  • Forray

    Its a shame that Christians cnanot bow there heads and pray before ball games or in school , but muslims are allowed to get down on ther knees near the twin towers or the new site they want without being chased off. They already are controlling our country with requiring employes to let them eat durning ramada and have there own room on the job and in hospitals to bow down to allah.

  • Angel

    They shouldn’t build that mosque near Ground Zero because a clear majority of Americans oppose it.

    And, they never should have recognized former slaves as citizens with equal rights because a clear majority of Americans opposed it.

    They never should have allowed women to vote because—a clear majority of Americans opposed it.

    Blacks and whites should never have been allowed to intermarry—

    Workers should never have been allowed to form unions—

    We should simply stick with policies that the majority of citizens support, like the internment of all those Japanese during World Was II and invading Iraq because they “knocked down our towers” and had “WMD’s”.

    • DaveH

      Yeah, sure. If a clear majority of Americans opposed anything, it would not become law.

    • http://gunner689 gunner689

      WOW, finally someone on the left gets it. Way to go Al !!!

  • chuck b

    the white house just issued a statement saying barry is a christian and he prays every day and this is not an important issue with him, what you wanna bet he’s got a rug under his knees while he’s praying!!!

    • Claire

      chuck b — Right now I am so mad at this administration I could scream. I have one word for all of them–Liars, stinking liars.

  • Claire

    This is off the subject but I am angry. BP and our lying administration have been telling us the oil is gone. Now I find out there is a 22-mile-wide plume under the surface of the Gulf. I bet there are more of them too, not just one. There has to be, with the amount of oil that was spewing. I kept screaming about these plumes but no one would listen to me. Now pray tell, what is BP and this administration going to do about it? It is still a lethal situation. Dear God I wish I could bash some heads together. I am so sick of the lies, the cheating, the corruption, and everything else that this government represents.
    Liars, the dirty, stinking, rotten liars. All of them.

    • http://YouTube.com/CanadaLarry Lawrence Edward Calcut

      Clair RE: Liars, The people who are telling us what they want to do in and will do with the “””Mosque AT Ground ZERO””” are also liars. Big time!. What they are telling us is nothing but a pack of lies.
      If you only know what the real truth is it would send you off to the Hospital with heart pulputation or whetever.
      The new secret docturins of the new re-written Quran tells the Moslems its ok to lie to other Moslems and Non-Muslems any time they must, so long as the goal is achieved.
      And what is the Goal?
      To make Amereica a total Moslem Nation, and to do that they must have a focus point in North America. They have one in Mecca in Saudi Arabia and they need to have a Mosque in every city and town in North America, Canada and Mexico. The Mosque at “Ground Zero” will be just the same as the one in Mecca.
      The new Quran calls for the complete disstruction of all Christian and Jewish people who will not honour Allah and lies are condoned and must be used to bring the laws of the profit and Sharia to the whole world.
      Try and find a video on YouTube about the “Three Secrets of the Quran they don’t want you to know”… That’s if its still available.
      Take heart dear lady, remember, ‘It’s not over until the Fat Lady Sings.”

    • http://SAMVP Ida Snow

      Anyone interested in learning something. 20 000 moslems converted to christianity since 2005 and 70 000 since the Gulf war, and by the way there are many christians and christians churches in Iraq…

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zuf_NSE0hYg

  • atlas reborn

    chuck b I thank you for the info. I am a constitutionalist. Jefferson and Franklin the smartest ones. the people now days can not connect the dots how do we expect them to understand the brilliance that was left to them and they are following false leaders. I hate to say this but I think we now have a stupid society that is beyond help.

  • chuck b

    atlas reborn

    i agree with you. it starts at the top. we have an inept administration and a congress on the same par. our country will suffer until we remove these marxist and clean out the congress and i doubt this will happen for the same reason you offered.

  • viktor leben

    Don’t forget what happen to Lebanon, a former Christian nation ….

  • http://gmail i41

    Lebanon had a Constitution that was model after ours, but the goat humpers moved in with their 5 wives and in a few short years put their muslim representives in office and Lebanon went to hell, and is a sh-t hole place to be. Which is what the marxist muslim moron and his radical socialist idoit democrats want for tje USA. Omoron core beleifs are muslim, marxist and anti USA. Of course if it does get build by the pedohile military ideology group called Islam, there might be a person with a live threatening illness like the man who wants to go hunting Obamee doat humper uncle Osamee. You just never know,

  • http://none Alex

    No Catholic churches within 1000 yards of schoolchildren—we must protect our children.

  • http://gmail i41

    But boys aren’t men until they turn 10, before ten they are nothing just like women and girls. Alex are you a muslim marxist like Onumnutts?

  • http://www.lubedealer.com/Partsmans-Site Glen

    The problem is they are sensitive….to their Muslimcounterparts….history shows that building a mosque at the site of a victory is a goal they work hard to accomplish. It is strange that the city continues to block the rebuilding of the Greek Orthodox church that was destroyed during the 9/11 disaster. I feel that is about as two-faced as you can get.

  • http://gmail i41

    Glenn, yes they are sentive, to figuring out ways to dominate Christians and the world be under Sharia rule. Islam is a military ideology, not a religion. As for not rebuilding the Greek Orthodox Church, it is because we have followed the PC crap, and the politicions are spineless and don’t want to piss off the 2% of goat humpers and the muslim marxist moron in the WH. Also the socialist democrats wants every stinking freak in the world to have love for us. Since the koran tells muslims to lie especially to non muslims and now even other muslims, so now Nobody should be surprised Onumnutts is such a compulsive liar, even though the media and dips sticks think he is convert to Christainity. All muslims are indocterinated to be 2 faced and liars, even centuries ago.

  • sciteach4202

    The Constitution NEVER gave anyone the right to any religion they wanted. The Constitution just stated that the government could not create a “state” religion. To shed some light on a common misconception in America, the word religion in the 1776-1787 era meant the same as “denomination” in present day English. So in essence, the Constitution only limited the government from establishing a state “denomination” of Christianity. The founding fathers made it more than clear that Christianity was not only the religion of America but expected of our first elected officials and appointed Supreme Court Justices. All of early American history and documents supports this in abundance. We have a tidal wave of Constitutional ignorance in America which has brought us to this foolish insanity. Throw out the wisdom of God, the Bible, for our foundation and instruction and we reap the agony of folly which has encompassed our nation and our freedoms.

  • Robert Pgh Pa

    sciteach4202 few of the people on this internet are as perceptive and inteligent as you. Understanding what the founding fathers said and wrote is easy if you want to know you read history, and read the federalist papers which explain what was written and said in the constitution. they even left a way to improve it, but it has only been used 27 times. since the first violation by lincoln in 1860 when lincoln made the federal government superior to the states congress and the presidents have used the supreme court to do most of their handy work by enshrining it a power it had not. the supreme court was to adjudicate cases brought to it and rule based on the facts of the case. the courts were not to be allowed to cteate law. when another case similar to the previous case would it would still need to be heard and ruled on by the case before it on the facts in the present case not the previous case. the inferior courts were to rule on cases simaliar to the supreme court case and see if the merits of the case were the same and if not then send it to the supreme court. they were not to then say are similar and do we what we please and create law from it.

  • Hope777

    Just a bit of information: My friend and her sister were driving by a building in our rural,midwest, area, where the muslims in this area gather. The friends peered into the window of this muslim, gathering place. On the walls were maps. They thought that that was rather strange. But the more i read, the more i do believe that their agenda is dominance over our country without even firing a shot. May God help us as a nation!!!!!

  • Retired US Army

    We are told again and again by “experts” and “talking heads” that Islam is the religion of peace, and that the vast majority of Muslims just want to live in peace. Although this unqualified assertion may be true, it is entirely irrelevant. It is meaningless fluff, meant to make us feel better, and meant to somehow diminish the specter of fanatics rampaging across the globe in the name of Islam.

    The fact is that the fanatics rule Islam at this moment in history.

    It is the fanatics who march.
    It is the fanatics who wage any one of 50 shooting wars worldwide.
    It is the fanatics who systematically slaughter Christian or tribal groups throughout Africa and are gradually taking over the entire continent in an Islamic wave.
    It is the fanatics who bomb, behead, murder, or commit honor killings.
    It is the fanatics who take over mosque after mosque.
    It is the fanatics who zealously spread the stoning and hanging of rape victims and homosexuals.

    The hard quantifiable fact is that the “peaceful majority” the “silent majority” is cowed and extraneous. Peace-loving Muslims have been made irrelevant by their silence.

    Peace-loving Muslims will become our enemy if they don’t speak up, because like my friend from Germany, they will awaken one day and find that the fanatics own them, and the end of their world will have begun.

    Peace-loving Germans, Japanese, Chinese, Russians, Rwandans, Serbs, Afghans, Iraqis, Palestinians, Somalis, Nigerians, Algerians, and many others have died because the peaceful majority did not speak up until it was too late.

    • TAKE BACK AMERICA

      A post that makes sense, grounded in reality with no discernible direction or plan. A true statesman, someone you can trust, a politician perhaps? Or just playing one on your friendly, over the top, right wing, tea drinking “Conservative site”. You be the Judge, post a reply, it’s all you can do. Just like the rest of us, you’re powerless to the Lobbyist’s.

  • Maria

    Wow,
    I guess this what the the Jews went through with Hitler, yet most of them instead of learning from what their ancestors had to go through they support the oppresors, to think America the so called country of “religious freedom” would one day go against there own policies, of religious freedom”. How sad. And this is done not by Americans but by christians, I guess after so many changes in the Bible it’s can now be called the anti-Muslim book. Not only that but it’s practially filled with porn stories like the “remodified” version of the story of David, Natheniel, and Bathshiba, and is that what you read to your children, no wonder your people are in such a state of immorality. “…one nation under God” so this is what the christian god has told them to do, judging from the state of immorality, drgs, violence, etc. this is what yor god has tought you.
    O, and another thing if what I say angers you, then maybe next time you should support your accusations on Islam and Muslims with hard Facts instead of just typing what ever comes to your mind.
    And if you have any comments or responses
    I’ll be waiting for yor response, and dont forget I want facts not an ameture’s oppinion. Until then.

  • Maria

    From previous post, typo on line 12 meant to say (drugs).

Bottom
close[X]

Sign Up For Personal Liberty Digest™!

PL Badge

Welcome to PersonalLiberty.com,
America's #1 Source for Libertarian News!

To join our group of freedom-loving individuals and to get alerts as well as late-breaking conservative news from Personal Liberty Digest™...

Privacy PolicyYou can opt out at any time. We protect your information like a mother hen. We will not sell or rent your email address to anyone for any reason.