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Strange Things Afoot in the Golden State

October 19, 2010 by  

Strange Things Afoot in the Golden State

Actually, stranger than normal things are afoot in the Golden State. Considering they elected a governor who can’t pronounce “Golden State,” stranger than normal is a stretch in the land of fruits, nuts and O.J. jurors.

But, when Californians step into their voting booths on Nov. 2, they will face a choice which has drawn considerable interest from parties far and wide, most notably from U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder. 

California’s Proposition 19 is a ballot measure which would reclassify growth, use and sale of recreational marijuana as a legal activity, within certain parameters. (Sorry Spicoli, you still won’t be allowed to get baked in the bathroom before biology.)

Last week, Holder announced that while Californians might give Prop 19 the thumbs up, the administration of President Barack Obama will continue the decades-old tradition of giving it the Federal thumbs down. Specifically, the Feds will:

"…vigorously enforce the Controlled Substances Act against those individuals and organizations that possess, manufacture or distribute marijuana for recreational use, even if such activities are permitted under state law."

Does decriminalization really threaten a state in which the doddering Zen Master Jerry Brown is leading in the race for the Governor’s Mansion?  For that matter, does decriminalization threaten a nation in which Barack Obama is President, and one of the top rated programs on television involves the saga of halfwits called “The Situation” and “Snookie?”  Is it possible that we have more pressing concerns than either, or even “J-Woww?”

Of the massive taxpayer dollars dedicated to keeping taxpayers off drugs, about $15 billion go to marijuana enforcement. Marijuana-related arrests are closing in on 1 million annually. Law enforcement man-hours, criminal court calendar backlogs and those insipid “Ad Council” spots which try to convince you that lighting up now might keep you from being President (even though lighting up then didn’t stop Obama, George W. Bush and Bill Clinton) all cost time, resources and money. 

For many of you who regularly join me Outside the Asylum, the idea of decriminalizing marijuana is surely anathema. Let me be clear:  I’m merely suggesting that this is a debate worth having. I am NOT suggesting we roll a legal snowball down Narcotics Mountain.

Drugs like heroin, cocaine/crack and crystal meth should remain illegal, despite the potential Social Darwinian benefits of allowing the deserving members of the American herd to engage in self-culling behavior. Anything which makes stabbing yourself in the carotid with a dirty hypodermic needle, shooting the 7-Eleven clerk because he asked why your jaw was rattling like Jimmy Buffett doing a benefit show in Antarctica and washing your face with steel wool is a bad idea in the same vein as: “Don’t worry, our daughter caught a ride with Senator Kennedy.”

Consider legalization logic outside of the burden on law enforcement. This isn’t just an issue for slack-jawed frat boys, mouthy rock stars and the creepy guy with the dreadlocks who spends all day in front of the liquor store smelling like he rolled in something awful. 

Imagine the economic benefits if pot farming was legal. 

Pot is currently the top cash crop in about a dozen states, including Personal Liberty Digest’s home state of Alabama. In fact, it ranks in the top 10 in every state in the union except North Dakota (where it’s 11th).

Marijuana grows like a… well… weed. And I suspect those statistics understate reality. I somehow doubt every Farmer Brown in the hinterlands is entirely forthcoming with the United States Department of Agriculture inspector who drops by to check the sorghum fields.

Instead of $15 billion spent on the War on Weed, U.S. farmers could produce $115 billion in taxable commodity. Perhaps that explains support for decriminalization from Ron Paul, the late William F. Buckley and Nobel Prize-winning economist Milton Friedman. They recognize $42 billion in wasted total tax revenue when they see it.

In 1919, the 18th Amendment to the Constitution made booze verboten. For the next 14 years, organized crime grew from cottage industry to colossal enterprise. Getting tanked is legal again, while getting stoned is decidedly less so. But anecdotal evidence suggests alcoholics are much more likely to slide into a family of four while doing Mach 2 through the subdivision than the pothead who can’t find the keys to the minivan because they’re in… his pocket.

We’ve been fighting an intramural War on Drugs (marijuana division) for decades. We’ve spent billions on largely ineffective enforcement initiatives and put millions of otherwise non-threatening citizens behind bars, often turning them into hardened offenders by the time they get out. As unlikely as it seems, perhaps California has shown us a better way… dude.

Ben Crystal

is a 1993 graduate of Davidson College and has burned the better part of the last two decades getting over the damage done by modern-day higher education. He now lives in Savannah, Ga., where he has hosted an award-winning radio talk show and been featured as a political analyst for television. Currently a principal at Saltymoss Productions—a media company specializing in concept television and campaign production, speechwriting and media strategy—Ben has written numerous articles on the subjects of municipal authoritarianism, the economic fallacy of sin taxes and analyses of congressional abuses of power.

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  • s c

    If California is so strapped for revenue, Arnie might as well tell the hope and change wizards in Washington to hump themselves. Marijuana is California’s biggest cash crop. It’s entirely possible that Arnie could create lots of JOBS and do it sans any ‘assistance’ from Washington.
    Imagine that. New jobs, and no need for any estinkin’ stimulus lures from retards who whiz and moan about the need for jobs but are hesitant to do anything about it.
    Go for it, Arnie. Pick up the phone, and tell Holder and The Obummer to stuff it. You might even get some brownie points for acting like you have some integrity in a financial crisis.

    • dan az

      with all that barren land that they have now do to the lack of water they could state control grow all their debt into non existence.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      California could then grow it, and have the drug lords smuggle it into Mexico instead of them smuggling their inferior Mexican desert weed into our country, then we could suck the money out of Mexico like they have been doing to the United States for years. Im just saying……….

      • Bob Lanacane

        Beaners PAY for el toko? They wouldn’t know whether to laugh or cry. The state department and the DoJ would surely be great customers,observing most of the “decisions” of mammy toker Hillary and brain fried Holder. A lucrative market for sure, just ask anyone in Arizona[that speaks English, that is]

    • Ivy Vine

      Solve a LOT of problems at once: Legalize recreational marijuana. Tax the stuff, (state and Federal), like tobacco & booze. Put the enforcement force on the Mexican border to catch the illegals AND the TONS of drugs they are bringing in daily! Result: MUCH more efficient use of manpower, Increased state AND federal income, Less hard drugs coming in from Mexico and the raw materials, (ie: hemp fiber), for industry! This is simple logic, but whoever said that bureaucrats were logical? On the other paw, the drug war does bring in a lot of money from confiscations and fines, but I doubt that pays for the costs of incarcerating all those non-violent “potheads”. Isn’t the prison system financed from a different pocket than enforcement?

  • Anthony

    “is a bad idea in the same vein as: “Don’t worry, our daughter caught a ride with Senator Kennedy.”

    WOW…. and I thought I was the only one who had such attitudes.My grandpa once told me, when I was about 6 years old.. he said:
    “You always judge a man, but the size of fight he’s picking!”

    That comment and the attitude that goes with has always served me well when it comes to the friends I choose.

    The real truth about POT is multi-layered… like SHREK’s oinion.
    Sure, I have no doubt that it is a great medicinal for glaucoma. I’ve heard it waay too often for that to be bogus. I also feel it might be a great alternative treatment for cancer therapies and several other illnesses.

    But, more to the truth – try reading up on HEMP.COM to see just how wrong it’s been to have the non-cotton-industry replace the cannibus-clothing industry.

    Much like what we’ve always done with trees, HEMP.COM will alert you to how prior to this last Century, the Planet was using HEMP on many levels – not just for recreational smoking.

    You could treat a pot plant, just like a tree….
    - grow ‘em as tall as possible, for the stalk will start to turn to wood
    - you cultivate the the stalk, keep the roots, scrape the leaves off and re-create a former thousands of years old industry.
    - there was a report a few years back, where diggers had un-earthed an opening to an old mine-shaft. Once open, they found a pair of miner’s pants. They looked practically brand new, even after having been in there for almost 50 years. They were made of hemp. Now, how often do you need to buy new blue-jeans?

    All of this commentary comes from a 70′s guy who used to spend time playin’ like every day was Woodstock Day. Been there, dun that.

    There are some bad effects, as many will attest to…
    – smoking pot constantly appears to leave behind a layer of plaque inside the brain
    – pot burns hotter than cigarettes, which enhances the option of geting emphysema

    Immediate good side effect? It seems smoking pot causes the driver to always go no faster than 45mph – (LOL, which also comes with its own set of issues)

    BOTTOM LINE – If they legalize POT, the U.S. government (and the CIA) will lose a major source of funding. And, THAT, is certainly no joke!

    • TIME


      If we made pot legal, the first things we all would see happen is the drug wars would be stopped dead, they would be one for ever!
      As it was stated to me by a persons I know in the FBI, that pot is the “bread and butter” of the Mexicans cartels.

      Thus they would fall by the way side in no time, this would have two effects that would blow most of your minds, First off CRIME would drop by 95% along US / Mexican, and the amount of people in jails would drop by 63% in less than one week.

      These effects will be felt in the following formats, Less Tax money to run jails, and less TAX money to fight crime. Holy Crap Bat Man it just can’t be, yes Robin my friend thats the TRUTH.

      To start cloths industry’s would be something that would effect our bottom line in so many ways its crazy, it would create JOBS by the hundreds of thousands. What lower unemployment, why do such a cray thing? And as noted long lasting cloths!
      Also Car bodys can be made out of hemp as well, the good news is that when the car dies, the bodys if crushed will go back to the earth with zeroi effects. WOW, no rusting hulks.
      Oh and the car bodys will not dent either. WOW – how cool is that?

      But lets take it a few steps more. How about the food products from seeds alone, yes the little seeds have more protein than beef!

      But wait there more; the oils made for salad dressings will not clog your veins, cutting heart attack and strokes by 95%. No – please don’t take away of strokes and heart attacks, how can we live that way?

      But wait, there’s even more, yes how strange it is that skin cancer could be something you would never hear of again, you saw that one right, Hemp oil will removed skin cancer in no more than two weeks!

      What that just can’t be, when you can spend $6500.00 for a laser treatment, and guess what your skin cancer will be back in a few months!
      But with the hemp oil its gone for ever and for only a few dollars!

      Then we have Cancer, as long as its not a Gel like cancer Hemp oil will not just stop the cancer, it kills it!
      Thus your healed and for how much again, well if legal the cost of a pound would be about $100.00 if that, now it cost $5000 – and up to $7500 for high grade pot.
      But still to cure cancer for even $7000.00 can you get your head around that, we spend per year now 100′s BILLION’s of dollars on Cancer treatments that have only a 5% rate of success.

      But wait, as we all know Going GREEN is the big issue of the moment right?
      Well just one acre of pot will produce as much paper pulp as 10 acres of TREES! Yes – thats the TRUTH.

      It was the progressives that made this herb, / wonder plant illegal
      why is that again? Can you say MONEY, CHAOS, and CONTROL.

      • Al Sieber

        Right on brother!!!

      • BrotherPatriot

        Good to hear your read, Anthony. Spot on.

        I believe that Hemp can save America.

        It’s Common Sense…as strange as that sounds.

        • s c

          BrotherPatriot, there is much to what you say. The #1 problem is in having individual states do it better than Uncle Scam (not hard to do, but you know what happens when Uncle Scam spews his ‘righteous indignation’ crap).
          We know that even if states had higher standards than Uncle Scam, it wouldn’t be ‘good enough.’ Losers in Congress would be ‘alarmed,’ Big Pharma would put the arm on those human ‘toids,’ media whores would rush to aid the pimps and whores in Congress and we’d be warned that ‘America can’t tolerate a substance in the hands of those who can’t be trusted’ [the product hasn't been fully tested, it's not safe, people might evade being taxed, America would become a drugged nation, etc.].
          I’ll take my chances with individual states, and Uncle Scam can hump himself until he goes into a coma (the old fart needs a long rest anyway).

      • Pam


      • Bob Lanacane

        As was unabashedly displayed, being one of the main compositions of a certain van in the last half of C&C s’ 1978 classic, Up In Smoke. “Here, have a taillight, man.” “Ahh, no man, Sgt. Stedenko just put one out.” [not part of the script], they wasted dozens of double entendre lines, still, a sharp flick for the ages.

      • Bob Lanacane

        Here in Nova Scotia, Can. a guy was selling and/or giving away hemp oil and he had literally hundreds of people cured of various types of cancer, some of them given months or weeks to live. He went to court with affidavits,accompanied by dozens of those now cancer free and the judge would not even hear his evidence, all the old b*stard asked was are you or are you not growing an illegal narcotic. And the RCMP burned his field. His story can be found in under, I believe, “run from the cure”. This is nothing but a death sentence, a vicious criminal act perpetrated on the sick and the dying by pork-funded policing agencies, ignorant and/or criminally grasping politicians,outrageously promoted by huge international pharmaceutical interests, along with their puppets, the FDA and AMA. I have a vested interest,with 6 years waiting for the other one to drop with prostrate cancer. psa 106

        • Bob Lanacane

          Run from the cure is under the “Health” category. Rick Simpson, I talked to him, he was no longer able to just give it away , he sounded very sincere,even sad. He’d supply, given a months’ notice, it to anyone for what it cost him. Not much of a dealer, huh?

      • dan az

        Time that was great it sounded like an info Commercial,and if you order today we will through in the seeds for just 19.95 call now!

      • Christin

        I did not know all this about pot.

        If only we could be responsible and use that which is good about thing sin life and get rid of that which is bad… that would be the fruit of the spirit of Self-Control, I guess.

        But I also I do not want my boys getting stoned and all that comes with that… not getting their school work done and getting an “I don’t give a cr-p attitude.”

        I think the cartels would not go away… they push other drugs, too, guns & people and I think they would enter America to control and push some other things and be bullies like other gangs, mobs, mafias… anything for money.

        There is a guy from India who sells “synthetic pot” legally that gives the kids a high similar to regular pot in the country town near where we have our farm. The town is trying to get rid of him and his cr-p he sells to kids. Do any of you guys know anything about this?

        • Christin

          “things in life” (sorry typo)

          I think putting “legalization of pot” on the ballot is a political ploy to bring in Demo votes!

  • http://donthaveone Beberoni

    I dont think the Federal Government will ever want to legalize it, simply because lawyers and judges run everything on the legal and political fronts in this country, and these same lawyers and judges are making millions upon millions of dollar on marijuana being illegal. To legalize it, the states and the country would be making loads of money, and it would be going into the pockets of lawyers and judges who collect from payouts from drug lord defendants who buy them off, and from the states who pay them to defend and prosecute the guys with no jobs and no money who always get caught. Yes, sad but true, the lawyers and judges profit off of it being illegal, and it is in their best interests to keep it that way. They have no interest in the states and the country saving money and making money, as they want it all to themselves. These are just the facts in case anyone is interested.

    • alpha-lemming

      And don’t forget, how would you know who has the best stuff if you couldn’t buy from the local police.

  • http://donthaveone Beberoni

    That was a typo above. It should have read To legalize it, the states and country would be making loads of money, and it would not be going into the pockets of lawyers and judges.

    • coal miner



  • Barbara Humphrey

    Thank you for an honest look at the Prop 19 issue in California. Also please consider the harm that the War on Drugs is doing to people, families and neighborhoods, from the college kid who looses his federal loans following a cannabis conviction, to the erroneous bust that shatters not just doors but lives, to the overdose victim whose friends are afraid to take him to the ER. And consider this–for most kids, illegal drugs (such as marijuana) are easier to get than the legal ones (alcohol) these days. Legalization enables production and distribution controls, and could be a good thing for the harder drugs as well. But at least let’s start with marijuana. Just say now.

  • briceD

    One could equate pot to tobacco. The government spends millions telling us it is bad for us while subsidizing tobacco farmers then taxing the finished product. How screwed up is that? So if tobacco is OK, why not the same for pot? Just my opinion. I could be wrong.

    • Angel Wannabe

      briceD, thats Washington saying don’t do as I do, do as I say!___TAKE FOR INSTANCE booze and tobacco! They regulate booze and the consumtion there of, by having the cops sit outside of bars, waiting for the people who choose to drink more than three beers. They control tobacco, by taxing the sh*t out of it, telling us how bad it is for our health, but CONTINUE TO LET IT ON THE SHELVES FOR PURCHASE_ WHY?–because they can’t let themselves let go OF ALL THE REVENUES FROM IT!__-A NESSARY EVIL?!

  • Angel Wannabe

    Pros and Cons of Prop 19___Pros, well for years and longer, pot has been used for medicinal purposes whether in inhaled, like Bill Clinton said he didn’t do, or cooked up and made a paste as some suggest on here. I’ve done some reading, but I am by no means an expert on the subject of pot.
    I have however, moved more and more away from traditional medicines, and in favor of natural methods of treating ailments and diseases, after watching both my parents suffer major side affects from diabetes, heart disease, rheumatoid arthritis, asthma & stomach ulcers.
    Cons__The Government & Large corportions are gonna have to change, policies regarding urine testing for drugs and hiring practices. All “say no to drugs” advertising is gonna have to change to, “say no to drugs unless doled out by the Government” (since they know best & believe they’re God) Sadly I believe the illegal sale of drugs has become the new capitalism. All the rhetoric coming out of Washington, is going to change, it’s matter of the drug sales changing hands, from the criminals running the drug trades, to Washington running it. And quite frankly, as it stands now, one side is just as corrupt as the other. The only difference will the Goverment will regulate and collect the tax. Bottom line is, People outside the box, are still gonna grow it and participate, wether it’s legal or not.

    • dan az

      Its time to try it.It really is a herb that does all that an more the quality makes all the diffrence.

      • Angel Wannabe

        I don’t doubt it Dan, that pot has healing properties. I guess if my Daughter didn’t start out on pot, and end up on heroin ata size 0. I’d be all for it. She’s clean now with no thoughts of looking back. But What concerns me, if they legalize pot, what will they legalize next_I have Grandkids, like everyone else I worry about the little ones too?!

        • dan az

          not knowing your daughter I would guess it was pier pressure that got her on the drugs that where addicting.Im glad to see shes clean Im sure you had allot to do with that.

  • Al Sieber

    I remember not to long ago here in Ariz. you could go in to the drug store and buy a bottle of tincture of opium for digestive problems, or codeine cough syrup no problem, now you need prescriptions. they’re also trying to outlaw vitamins and herbs, then you’ll need a prescription. we’re voting on a medical marijuana law here also.

    • Joyce from Loris

      Don’t forget the sulfur pills! We took them at the beginning of summer, to purify our blood so that we didn’t get infections and skin diseases. Those were great pills. Now, you can’t get them except at some health food stores, and you are going to pay good money for them. THEY took the sulfur pills off the shelves of the drugstores because they WORKED so well. Now, they have all these drugs for infections and skin diseases that cost so much money and our bodies can build up immunities to the drugs, rendering them useless sometime down the road.

    • dan az

      Hey Al
      this time there better not be any judges saying if you sell it over the counter then you go to jail.Whats funny is it has taken 60yrs for people to realize to benefits from an herb that has been used for thousands of years.

      • Al Sieber

        You got that right dan, whats the weather like there? you might want to visit me in the middle of winter, the coldest it gets here at night is about 40*, I only have a bunch of old miners staying here off and on and you’d have a lot of fun since I live miles away from civilization and we have enough of anything that will take care of any pain you might have.

  • FlaJim

    Marijuana should never have been put on the Schedule One list of drugs alongside of heroin and other truly dangerous drugs. Goofy movies like ‘Reefer Madness’ helped demonize a mostly innocuous weed. In many or most jurisdictions, it’s now only a misdemeanor to be found with a small amount in one’s possesion.

    I quit smoking the junk 40 years ago when I became old enough to legally purchase alcohol. This latter was less expensive, for one thing.

    In brief, I’m with Bill Buckley and other conservatives in asking, “What’s the harm?” I’m not going to start smoking it again, millions would get it at a lower price, the taxes might take some pressure off of us smokers and drinkers, Mexican gangs would go broke along with a number of street punks, and I can’t really see a downside.

  • Bruce

    As many have alluded to here, FOLLOW THE MONEY! As with many other issues on the table this election for the country, moving something to the private sector (or keeping it private and out of the government’s purview) cuts the government power. That’s why the liberals are fighting so hard against the limited government Tea Party movement. I’m not sure this is one that will make it but Libertarians have argued for it along with a lot of other extreme limits on government, many of which I totally agree with. The more limits on government, the better. Would love to see the new conservative Congress actually eliminate huge chunks of the bureaucracy, like Departments of Education, Energy and Agriculture. Any bits that need to be saved within there could be rolled into what used to be HEW, or Interior or Defense. Eliminate entire Cabinet posts and all their staff, and all those bureaucrats that shuffle papers within it, and all their interference with commerce.

    • DaveH

      Right on, Bruce.

    • Marten

      Way to go Bruce

  • Teresa

    The system makes to much money w/it illegal, they can take your car, money, pot, land (if your growing)….there is more to the story than they are telling you….did anyone ever stop to think that the border issue may have something to do with it?????? or that this is just another political story to keep the drug lords of that area pasified for the time being????? Everyone needs to see the big picture here…open your eyes, this is being tied up in court and keeping peoples attention away from the REAL issues…OPEN YOUR EYES…and realize also that CA’s governor is an idiot…you do NOT go to a commi country and negotiate your states or country’s future w/them!!!

  • Bill Raddatz

    Two comments:

    1) Imagine a government that recognizes an individual’s right to ingest or consume whatever an individual chooses. It’s about time.

    2) It is unlikely that the federal government will let this happen considering that billions of dollars flow into the fed’s coffers by way of the illegal drug trade.

    See: Dark Alliance by Gary Webb; Drugs, Oil, and War by Peter Dale Scott; Cocaine Politics by Peter Dale Scott and Jonathan Marshall; The Politics of Heroin: CIA Complicity in the Global Drug Trade by Alfred McCoy; The Strength of the Pack: The Personalities, Politics and Espionage Intrigues That Shaped the DEA by Douglas Valentine; Defrauding America: Encyclopedia of Secret Operations by the CIA, DEA, and Other Covert Agencies by Rodney Stich; The Underground Empire: Where Crime and Governments Embrace by James Mills; and Drug War by Dan Russell

  • shannon

    just what we need. stoned voters. the land of milk and mary jane. teh new theme: vote for me i smoke weed just like you. have a joint or two and vote for me , i’ll make it cheaper! that sould be a real vote getter. just what we need either drunks or stoned on mary jane voting. look what we get now, and think of what we could get afterwards!

    • John McClain

      Dear Shannon, you should really keep your opinions for issues you have some knowledge of, and not just spout off the top of your head. As far as I know, there is no documented problem with drunk voters, with the singular exception of those rounded up by ACORN, and vouched for in the voting booth by those who pick them up, and I don’t expect there would be a sudden influx of marijuanna smokers showing up at the voting booth, without people from ACORN picking them up, leading them to the voting booth, and explaining several times why it’s important to vote, and to vote for this one person. Drunks can’t be bothered to go vote without being practically forced to, and the idea there would be a sudden rush of marijuanna smokers heading for the voting booth is a rather ludicrous idea if it were not so stupid. You aren’t by chance a member of ACORN, or supporter of the same are you, Shannon? Maybe you just missed that corner of the action last election, maybe you just listen to what you are told, and believe all of it. Have you ever considered studying an issue? It has a long history of improving one’s grasp of a subject and providing facts that stimulate thinking, and coming out with coherent answers to complex questions, it might help you understand this rather simple one, maybe.
      John McClain

      • Vicki

        Besides pot smokers would be far more rational than Obama voters.

      • Eric Bischoff

        Same to you John. I am so tired of people regurgitating crap they know nothing about. Acorn was never a problem. It’s only crime was that it was successful at getting poor people to vote.The real problem was the crooked bunch who made fake doctored up videos which Fox paraded around and which turned out to be false information. Karl Rove is a criminal thug who engaged in many deceptive and despicable practices. Win at any cost and the end excuses the means is not what this country should be about.

        • DaveH

          You can take the word of a Liberal or you can see the words coming out of their mouths:

          • Eric Bischoff

            As usual DaveH you are a few steps behind the times. The people who made this fraudulent video got arrested and the media actually had to rebuke it.

            Fox has perfected Nazi Propaganda Minister Goebbel’s techniques of If you repeat a lie often enough the fools will buy it and you do. I feel sorry for you. And I feel especially sorry for people who are so greedy that they stoop to attacking the poor to create a distraction when in reality they are the criminals.

            Mean and stupid that’s a wonderful combination.

  • william e zimmerman

    the Government has no business telling you what you can put into your own body
    for example,fats from McDonalds,Hardees
    you should be able to go to any fast food store and order a milkshake cup full of cooking fat to drink if you so desire

    • DaveH

      If we can’t control our own bodies, we have no Freedom.

    • Eric Bischoff

      So if I read you correctly. You want to eliminate the FDA and let processed food producers (which use to be the cigarette industry) feed us anything they want under the guise of it’s a food. You don’t think we should check for pesticide or toxins in our food and you don’t care if the meat has ecoli or mad cow. Let them sell it and let us eat it. It’s a free country and they reserve the right to be greedy morons and we reserve the right to eat the poisoned crap if we choose to.

      One giant step for mankind.

  • Soldier

    If pot was legalized, criminal drug lords would go out of business. Just imagine, no more screaming raped women every night, no more child labor….

    During prohibition, many guys used the tommy gun as a form of persuasion, and until pot is leaglized, the AK-47 will be a form of persuasion in the name of pot….

    • 45caliber

      I seriously doubt that the criminal gangs will go away. There are still people making moon shine and running it to Chicago to sell despite the fact that alcohol is legal. It will just mean that the govenrment won’t be as active in finding the gangs as they are now.

    • independant thinker

      The drug lords would not go out of business. Legalizing pot will only take away their easy money the cocain, meth, ice, etc. will still be around and they will still be importing and selling it.

  • no pot head

    This issue is all about money. It has nothing to do with the drug itself. The money is needed to support the court system and of course the prisons. The prisons need customers. MJ produces a significant volume of customers. One only has to look at the prison union to understand why they are against any notion of legalization.Then there is the America Money Association. Hell no to any thing healthy that does not require a DR visit and their drup treatments. The cotton industry would go crazy if there was a cheap marketable cloth.
    Then there is the major objector. Organized crime! Imagine the impact on every aspect of our life if we were to limit the ammount of money available to fund all of their other illegal actives. How much of this money goes toward elections?
    We are living in a dream world if we believe the FEDs are going to allow legalization! MONEY MONEY MONEY!!

    • DaveH

      Yep. I can’t imagine the mindset that makes somebody a hero for attacking a person who is doing drugs, minding his own business, and not harming anybody else physically. In my book the Government is the aggressor. Sure, if somebody harms someone else or their property, they should be held accountable. But until that occurs, those people that harm others (using the Government as their bully boys) are the true aggressors.
      I have taken no illegal drugs in my entire life. I have rarely even taken aspirin, as I shun putting unnatural substances into my body. But I would rather hang around with the drug users than with those who back the the drug police who are the true aggressors.
      Government at its most evil:

  • Rob Alexander

    I say legalize everything. Anyone who thinks that either A) people aren’t doing drugs simply because they’re illegal, or B) laws are keeping those who want to do drugs from doing them, is not living in reality.

    REALITY is just as none of us posting here would suddenly get the desire to smoke as much crack as we could get our hands on just because it was legal, neither would the majority of people not posting here.

    REALITY is anyone who DOES have the desire has no trouble getting whatever they want from criminals right now, despite all the idiotic laws.

    If YOU wouldn’t suddenly become an addict just because drugs were legal, don’t assume everyone else would… You’re not that special.

    • 45caliber

      The drugs at one time WERE legal! The reason that they were made illegal in the first place was because the drug use was affecting families and crime.

      You could sell drugs at a penny a dose and the addict would still commit crimes to get the pennies. Crime will not go away. And a drug addict wanting a dose will ignore the needs of his/her family to get that dose.

      Most ex-wives of drug addicts will tell you that taking drugs DOES harm others than just the addict. The family will suffer and will be mistreated. Sometimes they will even be killed. We need to make it a LOT harder on the users instead of easier!!

      • Rob Alexander

        Actually that’s complete crap – everything about drug prohibition mirrors alcohol prohibition.

        There were a lot LESS drug problems BEFORE prohibition and the petty crimes committed by addicts are NOTHING compared to the crimes committed by the gangs and cartels that deliver the illegal products… Just like with alcohol during prohibition.

        Addicts need to steal a whole lot less to buy legal products than those that are inflated 1000x due to prohibition. It’s simple economics.

        Companies that sell legal substances don’t engage in turf wars, drive-by shootings, they don’t buy off or kill cops….

        You have an opinion like everyone else who gets their knowledge about drugs and drug use from television and propaganda and has no clue in the real world…. Obviously you haven’t come across too many people who use drugs. The laws are NOT making it any more difficult for ANYONE who wants crack, meth or anything else to get and use them. What they ARE doing is making some very bad, violent people rich and powerful, and making it possible to finance all kinds of terrorist activity.

        Freedom is the only thing that works, period, without exception.

        • DaveH

          Great comment, Rob.

        • Vicki

          I have to agree with Rob. The experiment with Alcohol prohibition shows us exactly what happened. ANY criminal activity around legal alcohol is the fault of the criminal not the alcohol. Quit blaming inanimate things and blame the actors or the government trying to force control on a free people.

          If a person steals to buy alcohol they are not more moral than a person who steals to buy pot. The action that is criminal is STEALING.

        • 45caliber

          Not according to the old reports by the FBI. And I doubt if you can get copies. The files were sealed by Congress back in the early ’20s according to the report I read.

          On the other hand, suppose you are wrong. If you legalize drugs and then find out you are wrong, are you willing to go back to what we have now? I sort of doubt it.

          • http://none Mike

            Thoes files were sealed for a reason. Look up the history channel documentry on cocain and pot use during the 20′s and 30′s these laws were enacted to control a large part of the black community not to control the drugs themselves.

      • DaveH

        So does alcohol affect families. But the drug laws were created mainly because Government Leaders always have and always will look for any available excuse to grow their power. Have the drugs wars solved the problem? No. And they never will until the Government totally takes away our Freedom. Is that a viable alternative? I think not. Don’t be a Big Government enabler, 45.

        • 45caliber

          My preferred solution is simply to hang anyone who is on drugs and abuses his family. That way the governmet isn’t involved at all. And the drug user doesn’t bother others.

          • DaveH

            There are plenty of laws for family abuse, whether on drugs or not.

          • Vicki

            Why? Is it more moral to abuse the family when NOT on drugs?
            The problem is the abuse.

            Someone, Liberals I think, use the same kind of argument against gun possession. They have all these laws that make committing a crime while in possession of a gun somehow more evil than committing the same crime without possessing a gun.

      • Karolyn

        Have you ever seen “Reefer Madness” the propaganda movie made in the 30s. They knew nothing about drugs in those days. They portrayed people going weirdly insane on pot. Very strange movie.

    • alpha-lemming

      My Libertarian leanings say “Go go go”!! but experience has shown there are some things that should remain illeagal. The 2 that immediately come to mind are crack (documented deaths on first time users) and PCP (when used in the customery manner/amount, the effect of the drug is to make you violently insane). Otherwise all your observations are valid and Constitutional.

      • Rob Alexander

        As stupid as I think trying crack is, it’s people’s RIGHT to do stupid things and that includes playing the odds with crack and killing themselves.

        I personally do not understand why anyone would put crack or meth in their system even one time… Well actually I have a guess. I would imagine it’s because of all the complete LIES and false PROPAGANDA about pot, that anyone who’s ever used it knows are complete BS… They probably assume the same is true about crack and meth…. Which they could be, but IMO it’s not worth finding out.

        • Karolyn

          Rob – They do it simply because it feels good.

          • Rob Alexander

            I get that, but I meant the first time when trying to decide to try it or not to try it, what the HELL were they thinking….

      • DaveH

        Life is risky, Alpha. Certain activities are very risky. Riding motorcycles, for instance. But each individual should make that determination for themselves.
        After all, we could put everybody in rubber rooms, and they would be perfectly safe. They may not live any longer, but it would sure seem like it.

        • Jeep

          Rob and DaveH, I (gulp) hesitate to say this, buuut there are many activities that are illegal because of the harm these activities have on society as a whole. Taken in context, even “legal” use of alcohol has a negative effect on society. Normally I am all libertarian when it comes to social issues, but coming from a large family of mostly alcoholics I have seen my fair share of “incidents” from abuse and neglect to DUI’s resulting in innocents being harmed.

          With that background in mind, it leaves me to question whether, or not it is an “inidividual choice”. The fact is, it is not an individual choice when it affects others. As an easy example, it is apparent that an alcohol addled brain that gets behind the wheel can and will cause harm to others. So, do you try prevention (making it illegal), or punishment (tough penalties for the results), or both? Currently, it is illegal to toke up, and to drive (both). With alcohol, it is illegal to drive drunk (prevention). Obviously, I do not have the right answer as neither prevention or punishment works very well. And, don’t even get me started on the effects that hard drug use has on health issues, that we will all eventually pay for.

          With that diatribe out of the way, I will state emphatically that I believe MJ should “probably” (lol) be legalized. But, I cannot support the notion that it is an individual right to try hard drugs. There are limits that our individual freedoms are when it comes to living together, and those limits are right about the area when your activities begin to cost those around you.

          Just my thoughts.

          • Vicki

            Jeep writes:
            “The fact is, it is not an individual choice when it affects others. As an easy example, it is apparent that an alcohol addled brain that gets behind the wheel can and will cause harm to others.”

            It IS individual choice. When that individual affects others in an appropriately bad way THEN a crime has been committed. Claiming “for the good of society” is how most of our unconstitutional laws have been passed (Can we say “Health Care”).

            If a person chooses to drive they take on the responsibility to drive well. By your reasoning they have ALREADY affected others. In California, before some stupid politicians decided to write another law to justify their existence, it was illegal to drive while distracted. (Note the period there.)

            That one simple little law covers EVERY CASE we have discussed here and some we haven’t. Holding a cell phone. texting. Watching a DVD movie. Doing makeup.

            That one little law allows good drivers to drive on while punishing bad drivers REGARDLESS of why they were bad.

            Its not why you were distracted it is the fact you were that is the crime.

            All the laws punishing us for what MIGHT be are unconstitutional “prior restraint” upon our natural freedoms. Think of all the laws forbidding law abiding people from possessing firearms. EVERY ONE of them is there because of what someone MIGHT do.

            All the proposed laws we here about where the government plans to control what we eat are clearly unconstitutional “prior restraint” based on what MIGHT happen to us.

            Laws against possession of drugs is just an early battle in this long war to control all that we do. The very way it is referred to shows the intent. “Possession of a controlled substance”

            For a truly free people the possession of anything bought or created (or grown :) ) can not be illegal.

          • alpha-lemming

            Very good!! It’s the societal equivalent of… Government mandating govenors on every vehicle limiting them to a top speed of 5 mph to reduce highway fatalities.

          • DaveH

            If potential damage to others is grounds for punishment, then we should all be in jail.
            I think you should be put in jail for damaging my psyche. Oh, my head hurts so bad. LOL.

          • Jeep

            DaveH, very funny, ha, ha! Not to sound sarcastic (but, what the hay!) Keep in mind all that I was very clear in that I do not have the right answer. But, I suppose then that we have the personal “right” to make any number of decisions regardless of the consequences. In my humble opinion, there are just some extreme behaviors that have long reaching consequences that should not be tolerated.

            Allow me to make an extreme (and hopefully amusing) example. It is the law in this country that we should all drive on the right side of the road. However, it is my personal “choice” to drive on the left side. This “choice” is not a big deal, unless there is oncoming traffic. But, since it doesn’t harm anyone to drive on the left until I make contact…well, can you see where this is going? Then, really the law is infringing on my “right” to drive on the side I choose. And, since it doesn’t harm anyone, then it shouldn’t be illegal unless I hit someone. Right?

            While I agree that driving and drug useage are perhaps too disparate to make for a prime case, hopefully you can see my point.

          • Rob Alexander

            Vicki, I love how you think… I’ve said this so many times, “why the HELL do we have so many laws?” We need one law that says “it’s illegal to steal” with a graduated scale for penalties depending on the degree of the theft (which would actually be stated as a “not less than 30 days and not more than 30 years” type of clause and then decided by a judge or jury at trial). That covers ALL situations. We need on law that says “it’s illegal to initiate violence against another person”, with a graduated penalty scale to allow sentencing to fit the degree of the attack….. And the repeal of all redundant laws to either effect.

  • 45caliber

    Making something legal just because people like it is not right.

    I’ve seen people who use it regularly. They have some serious mental problems such as getting all upset about making a single small decision. Considering the people and things that receive votes in CA, I would say that the proof on why it should NOT be legal is right there.

    • Vicki

      Making something illegal just because some people think it should be is not right.

      Making something illegal just because a majority of people think it is does not make that law right either.

      Founding principals. Where in the Constitution (or state constitutions for that matter) is there the authority to forbid the possession of alcohol or drugs or guns to the free people of the US?

      There is even a specific amendment denying the fedgov the power (not a right) to forbid the possession of firearms. Not that the fedgov is particularly good at reading as we all have noticed.

  • Fred Rehders, Sr.

    The legalization of pot will not stop the drug cartels, as they will just shift to, or place more emphsis on meth, herion, cocaine, etc. It will give local government more tax revenue, some age specific control and maybe even keep users from ingesting herbicides and other toxins, via quality control. Obviously, there are a lot more dangerous products, including legal drugs, on our retail shelves, now.

  • coal miner

    A case for pot.

    Time to Legalize Marijuana? – 500+ Economists Endorse …
    Should the U.S. government legalize marijuana? Over 500 economists sign a letter promoting marijuana legalization.

  • Jennifer

    Since I was married to a man who was addicted to pot, I know first hand the problems it can cause and not because it is illegal. For some reason everybody thinks that pot is not an addictive substance, I beg to differ. For many, it may be an occasional “thing” but for others it is an everyday use problem. Why would we think that making it legal to grow in California will stop the drug cartel, or solve all of California’s cash flow problems? Won’t CA still be over-spending? Won’t the drug cartels still be carrying on with cocaine? Maybe it would make it worse for the drug cartels because it would start to squeeze them out of the market and they would be much more willing to kill over it? As for the “ruined life” of a college student because they lost their funding – sorry, if it was that important to them to keep the funding, maybe they shouldn’t be smoking the pot. I am amazed that people lack self control. How can we expect our congress, our judges or even our president to have self control and do what is best for us and our country when we can’t have a little self control to not smoke it. My biggest concern is for my children. Legalizing MJ makes it seem, like alcohol and tabacco, that it is “okay” to use, that in effect there is nothing wrong with it, but there is. Next thing people will be saying look if we made our own cocaine then we could sell it and create revenue, because we can’t seem to have any self control over what we spend. This is aweful.

    • 45caliber

      This is a good comment. I’m sorry for your trials but experience is something that people can’t ignore.

    • independant thinker

      I have read that smoking one joint is as bad for your lungs as smoking a pack of cigaretts.

      • s c

        Independent, while ‘recreational marijuana’ would have to be addressed at some point, medical marijuana will most often take the form of a pill (concentrated THC). Hence, this is not an issue that will make it possible to rush to a WalMart or a neighborhood ‘bag it and drag it’ so people can get legally stoned 24/7.

    • alpha-lemming

      Blessings and prayers to you and yours. An addictive peersonality is an addictive personality, and the indulgence can be pot, alcohol, gambling, sex, or every other pusuit that requires a modicum of temperence. You said yourself you know (are aware) of infrequent users and chronic (stone-oids). MJ is exactly like alcohol in that the “addict” can’t have 1 or 2 drinks but won’t stop until they’re blowing a BAC of .25%. And also, like alcohol, chronic use will require higher dosages to receive the desired euphoria. Bottom line… I’d still rather live in a country that celebrates free-will demanding personal responsibility with consequences, than having the stupidest and most irresponsible among us being the societal “speed limit”.

      • http://none Mike

        I find myself agreeing with that Alpha. I was once married to a woman who in my opinion was an abuse addict. I felt sorry to hear her story we dated a while then got married. Everything was fine for the first couple of years in our marriage. Then she started to change on me we fought more and more usually over the stupidest things. The more I tried to reason with her the harder she fought me. I finally figured out what she really wanted me to do was hit her. Since I was raised by a father who if I had would have climed out of his grave and drug me back with him I would not. Needless to say it ended after 9 years when she met her new bad boy boyfriend (who is now doing 25 to life for attemted murder) She is now liveing in a motel room with his chiled. My point being is if you dont like the abuse there are allways ways to remove yourslf from it.Its your choice to either stay with the abuser or move on. There is no help for an addictive personality if they do not want the help. This goes for any drug leagle or illeagle.

    • DaveH

      Are your children alcoholics, Jennifer?

    • Karolyn

      If pot is “addictive,” as you state, then self-control is of no use. There is no such thing for an addict. I tell you that from experience. In my youth I was addicted to drugs and alcohol but never pot. The only thing that can possibly alleviate the drug problem in this country is education and rehabilitation. Instead of spending so much on the “war” against drugs, the government should be spending on prevention. There will be drugs and addicts forever. I would not be surprised if the caveman had found that the smoke from his fire made him feel good. Legalizing pot would save the government that is spent on prosecutions and incarceration.

  • Jimmy Jones

    Who among you are going to want a doctor/surgeon/dentist working on you stoned or how about a airline pilot or even your bus driver or people that use heavy machinery etc. I opens the flood gates so everybody who wanted to try it will but haven’t because it is illegal and is risk to being caught when you go out to score. Then every business will then have to do random drug testing because of the liabilities of people being stoned and being hired and possible hurting others with company equipment vehicles. You can argue people are stoned now that are out and about that you may not detect but why open the flood gates. There is reasons on both side I just think the down sides for everybody is greater.

    • Rob Alexander

      Do you honestly think that doctor can’t get pot, crack or meth if he wants it? Do you think he couldn’t get legal narcotics either?

      Sorry, but your belief that laws are what’s keeping you safe is completely wrong. The ONLY thing protecting you is that fact that your doctor DOES NOT WANT TO work high. If he wanted to, rest assured he could.

      • DaveH

        It is so nice to hear a voice of reason. Keep it up.

    • Jeep

      I am sorry to disagree with you Jimmy, but a bus driver, airline pilot, doctor, or whatever, is going to do whatever their personality and morals dictate. A very few pilots fly, or doctors work while drunk, and they eventually get caught. If MJ is legal, then it follows that flying or performing surgery while stoned will probably happen, but what is the difference? It is still wrong, and these few individuals choose to ignore this. Those “professionals” probably ignore the other responsibilities that their job requires, as well. And, it follows that those same “bad eggs” will find some way to bend the rules anyway.

    • Vicki

      We don’t want them working on us while drunk or distracted either. What was your point again?

    • Karolyn

      It’s not like everybody is going to run out and try it. Most people who want to smoke it already have.

  • BrotherPatriot

    Hemp should be legalized for all the obviously good reasons stated above and more…

    • Craig

      There is a difference between hemp and marijuana. One can get you high the other is good for rope paper and oil.

  • Lou

    I have three concerns with drugs, legal or not. One is highway safety, People get killed or injured by impaired drivers. Two, is long term health problems which become a social cost. Three is impaired people do not function up to their potential which becomes a collective drag on society. Can’t be measured but it has to be holding us back.

    • barbmiller

      if you’re stoned on pot, you’ll be doing 40 or so in a 60 mph zone. seems like you’re going 100!! by slowing down, there’s more time to react, so, as we say in texas, that dog don’t bark. i smoke cigarettes which could cause health probekms, but nobody tells me i can’t. how fat are you? causes more health problems than pot would. adults know better than to get high before the work day ends.

      • 45caliber

        Yes, you’ll slow down under mj. But you will also have very slow reaction time and pose a problem for other drivers.

        • dan az

          before you say that your reflex’s are slower you should try it.Its not poison its an herb nothing more.Things may appear slower but your reactions are more acute.I never work stoned as I would never work drunk they just dont work well together.precision and time dont mix well either.I dont care what some say that its addictive That not the truth thats the lack of trying it and listening to others that have never tried it either.The use of good medical pot is much safer for your body then any pill with all of its side effects and by the way you never hear of any pot heads robbing anything for a fix.Whats amazing to me is the relief you get from pain instantly not that it takes it all away but takes the edge off and makes it easier to live with.Know one needs to force anyone to try it but if a decision of ones self wellness is an issue than by all means try it.If you dont smoke then take the pill form.

          • 45caliber

            I don’t have trouble with mj as a medical drug as long as it is in the pill form. But then I seldom take medical pills even when the doctor tells me. But I have no intention of “trying” it or any other drug. I saw enough of it among my team mates in Vietnam (and all were on it BEFORE going there.) When I say their reactions slowed down, they did. Even though my team mates insisted it didn’t affect them at all. All you are doing is fooling yourself. Take it if you want but I’ll pass.

        • Vicki

          Any other car on the road poses a problem for me. Your “slower” vehicle is just a rolling road barrier for me to avoid. :)

  • DaveH

    The real question here is not whether it is smart or dumb to do drugs (my opinion is that it is dumb), but whether or not we should allow Government the power to protect people from themselves.
    I think Government should be strictly limited to protecting people and their legally acquired property from others. If somebody wants to ruin their life, what better education can their friends and neighbors receive than by witnessing the ill effects (if any) of doing drugs? People learn best by experience.
    If they harm others while under the influence, they should be held fully responsible for restitution or otherwise punished appropriately. But, in fact, I think that should apply whether they are under the influence or stone sober.
    When I was a teen (in the 60s), my friends and I were oblivious to the existence and usage of drugs. That is until the Drug Warriors woke the ignorant teens up with their Free Publicity. Then the teens learned more ways to flaunt the system. Many (if not most) people who do drugs are attempting to escape the realities of our modern day Big-Government-created complex lives. We do not help that by throwing even more Government complexity at the citizens.

    • Vicki

      DaveH writes:
      “The real question here is not whether it is smart or dumb to do drugs (my opinion is that it is dumb), but whether or not we should allow Government the power to protect people from themselves.”

      Since that power is prior restraint on us based on what we MIGHT do I say NO.

  • barbmiller

    the marijuana pilicy project pushed their members to vote for obama because he said he’d keep the feds out of state business when it comes to pot. surprise!!! he lied just as he has about a lot of things. i dropped my membership when the mpp did that as ron paul was the only candidate who would’ve kept his word. it’s the best thing in the world for a hangover (college days). :) i can’t use any medications that are derived from heroin including vicodin and morphin. after surgeries, the best they can do for me is tylenol. as soon as i walk through the front door, somebody has a joint waiting for me. completely kills the pain. it’s GREAT medicine and beats booze all to heck and gone for a safe high. not only won’t you be able to find the keys in your pocket, you won’t be looking for them. you’ll be sitting in front of the tv with a box of twinkies. i smoked in college and would now if it was legal. great way to relax after a hard days work.

    • Vicki

      barbmiller writes:
      “surprise!!! he lied”

      Of course he lied. He is a politician. (Might be a Muslim which also allows him to lie to the infidel.)

      You an always tell when a politician is lying cause his lips are moving.

  • chuck b

    why not legalize pot. our country is headed for the 3ed world status and if you travel to some of these type countries you will find they love pot and smoke it freely, could that be why they live in lala land and unable to take care of themselves and most of them haven’t invented the wheel yet. that’s why they call it dummy dust! california is well on it’s way. if you want to see the effects of pot on people just take a look at california and how they vote and it’s getting worse by the year. pot will not improve the financial position of this state it will probably make it worse. mexico and other latin countries use a lot of pot and you can see how industrious and self sufficient they are.
    i would be willing to bet jerry brown has several pot plantations ready to go, the browns did well with the smog control business. if you have ever used these monster gas dispenser’s on the gas pump, think jerry brown and the damn things are a joke just like he is.

    • DaveH

      Blaming Liberal behavior on pot is quite a stretch. If anything, the stoners wouldn’t bother to vote while under the mellowing influence of pot.

  • LarryS

    Let everyone who wants to grow for pleasure or profit pay for a local permit, with the fee based upon output. This automatically gives us a record of who is growing and where. To enhance the situation, let anyone with a permit who is caught with synthetic drugs or heroin products be granted a minumum of five years in the federal hotels and loss of permit status for life.
    This will stop the mule trains coming from Mexico and the cash from flowing back down there by the truckloads.

  • DaveH
  • http://PersonalLibertyDigest Naomi

    If marijuana becomes legal, where will people be allowed to smoke? And given its side effects, why is it better than cigarettes? I personally, would rather have a cigarette smoker driving a car, than a pot head doing so. Talk about distracted and dangerous!

    • DaveH

      I don’t think anybody drives more safely than I do. Therefore, I would like to ban all other drivers.

      • Vicki

        Agreed. DaveH and I live far enough apart that we will not interfere with each other :) Thus society benefits. Outlaw driving for everyone else ;)

  • Demitri

    THC is the safest drug known to man.

  • chuck b


    THC has mild to moderate analgesic effects, and cannabis can be used to treat pain. The mechanism for analgesic effects caused directly by THC or other cannabinoid agonists is not fully understood.
    marijuana intoxication can cause distorted perceptions, impaired coordination, difficulty in thinking and problem solving, and problems with learning and memory. Research has shown that marijuana’s adverse impact on learning and memory can last for days or weeks after the acute effects of the drug wear off.2 As a result, someone who smokes marijuana every day may be functioning at a suboptimal intellectual level all of the time.

    • dan az

      chhuck b
      I dont know where you got your info but its not true.Fact, I have a friend that has smoked every day for the past 40 years not at work but at home after work and has no side effects mentally or other wise except for relief of migraines.The doctors have never came up with a cure for what he has that he got as a child he was not supposed to live.If I could spell it I would say what it was insifelitus anyway he is an intellectual that has no problems resulting from the use of pot.The point is not everything that you read is true.

      • chuck b


        the information i provided was pasted from this link

        liquor has different affect from one person to the other so i imgine pot would do the same. i have had a different experience with two of my friends, one a dentist, graduated from usc, and the other just a construction worker and pot destroyed both their lives,

        • Barbara

          I’m 70 yrs old. I tried pot when I was 30. I hated it. First of all, I do not enjoy not being in control of myself. Secondly, it made me throw up. So that was the end of it for me.

          However, I have been aware of many arguments for the use of it. What I think is that we should find an honest research lab to test the effects thoroughly. Of course, finding an honest lab will be a real problem as their interest is only in producing money, money, money. They certainly don’t care about the people who are conned into taking those poisons they produce. Even the doctors don’t realize how deadly these “medications” are. (I worked for 27 years in a pharmaceutical house and I refuse to take any of it until I have researched it.)

          The use of the plants for creating cloth is interesting. But again, finding an honest lab is the problem.

        • http://none Mike

          The problem with that is the .gov friend they have been feeding us bull for years over drugs. And I might add that pharmas such as vicoden and other opiates are far more addictive that MJ could ever be. Not to mention the barbs they have created in their labs that will kill you if you stop useing them

    • Vicki

      You should read the warnings on aspirin sometime. Some of the side effects are much worse than pot.

  • http://com i41

    chuchb, it is rightly refered to dumby dust for another reason. The moitivation to do anything productive goes up in smoke, I have worked and lived around enough rope jumpers. They need some one to be kicking them no stop in the a$$ all the time. When I first started drywalling the bosses son was supposed to be the boss, by mid morning a a couple of smoke breaks, work got sloppier and slowed way down, after working for his dad for a couple of years, and the 6 months under his son, the dad reallized his 34 year old Cal. son was a pothead and a non leader. I was the youngest crewmember and finally was told byy the old man to run the crew, first thing to go was non-stop smoke breaks, and when his son got squirrely, we settled it man to man, and his dad fired him. Pot just slows mental sharpness, thinking, and consentration on safety or what is going on around in their surroundings.

  • chuck b


    years ago i helped a couple of guys sit up a small busines, they were anxious to make it on their own. they took a coffee break at 10 am each morning and when they got back sometimes an hour later they were completely out of it, i thought they might be drinking, but, there was no odor of liquor around them. this went on for a couple of days and then i found out they were smoking dummy dust instead of drinking coffee. it was a waste of my time so i left and as you might expect their business didn’t last long, it was manufacturing and they couldn’t control the quality of their product or produce it on time.

  • jrdru

    I hope and pray Prop 19 passes in California…the rest of the country LOVES watching the left coast slip further off into the haze.

  • chuck b


    it’s really hazy right now. and the idiots are in the process of voting in a major environmental whacko,”moonbeam brown”. you think pelosi is nuts, this guy makes her look like mother teresa.

  • http://none Mike

    Allright Time to weigh in on this. I think the point made in this article is being missed. The fact that a state for good reason wants to leaglelize a farm product or a product of any sort should not be the FEDRAL GOVERNMENTS business. The fact that these people in this adninastration should have a say in what goes on in any state(outside of interstate commerce which has been distorted to mean anything the government wants to control)That they would threaten California with fedral intervention if this passes SHOULD SCARE THE CRAP out of you.If this passes then that should be an issue for the people of that state to decide not the fedral government. They have used this tactic before I belive Kentucky tried it at one point it passed by ballot referendum and a fedral judge struck it down. I belive its an indivigueals choice what he or she consumes(But for the life of me I will never understand meth which kills your nervous system i.e the high is a slow death from chemical poisioning)But my point here is that a product that is grown and not really refined in any way either added too or taken away from should be perfectly leagle for consumpton. That the fedral goverenment should threaten or subvert the will of the people is my main issue with this. As for the other Hard Drugs as they are called you have to refine them in some way to create the effects of the high and are not therfore a natural product and should be regulated in some way( cocaine is cut with everything from bakeing soda to fiberglass not to increase its effect but to make the amount go farther)Alchahol is regulated in such a way as to insure safty of consumption (refined). Not nessasaraly to reduce its use. Note that during the prohabition era any one who wanted to break the law and distill spirits(refine) did so without thought to the safty of the consumer such as filtering it through raidiators cast iron pots and old refrigerator tubeing That added many chemicals and metals as a byproduct of production. Also did this law stop consumption? No as a matter of fact it didnt it actually raised it by a large amount. People who once might have tought they would like to try it but never did were lured in by the fact that it was adventurous and concidered in Vouge at the time of prohabitions passage. Another one is Herion(think I might have missspelled that)during the late 50′s earlie 60′s this drug was made illeagle. That was before the advent of AIDS.People still consumed this drug even though it was illeagle to do so. Which drove the price of it from a few dollars a pound to thousands of dollars a pound. Thus addicts were forced into shareing needles and passing uncleaned medical equipment around. This led to a major hepititus break out as well as the new drug resistant strain of C . Fast forward to the earlie 80′s the first cases of aids were just beginning to surface here in the U.S . I think people associated this diseas with sexual promiscuity. I think that may have just been one area of spreading of this diseas. people shareing needls in a back ally might just have caused the spreading of this diseas into the hetrosexual community and the balloning of the cases here in the U.S Therefore how many lives lost can be attributed to the illeagleization of this drug? No matter where you stand on the legalization of this drug had it been leagle and controlled we might have avoided the death of Millions. Just a few side points to ponder. What if the next thing they decide we are not responsible enough to do is bear arms. Are you going to be one of thoes folks that say just because one person in hundreds use a gun irresponsibly that no one should have guns or are you going to be one that stands for personal liberty and responsibility and says we wont give up this liberty. Watch closely what happens in California and you will see how far liberty has eroded in this country. More power to them if they do. More fear for us if the feds step in and stop it. Mike

  • http://com i41

    Mike, government regulate all farm product rather harshly. Any feild that is flooded, the grain even if just feed grade and salvaged cannot be feed to livestock of any type. People who feel sorry for alcoholics, needle using drug addicts, pot heads and pill poppers, or prescription pill junkies is caused by not having will power and more than likely started by having too much f–k off time. I have realities that were given MIT scholorships which they earned when around parent riding herd to keep the focused. But out on their own and plenty of free time and plenty of cash only were able to last a year. Same goes for all races or even our chocolate muslim Prez, too much free time when using and selling drugs, his books never said if he ever quit using, but play basketball and screw off, travel and vacation. Every one of my realitives whined nonstop if they had to work over 40 hours a week. A 6 day work week was a crime and all want more freebies from the government and also vote democrat and supportted healthcare.

    • http://none Mike

      Not really saying I feel sorry for them just pointing out some realities that are out there one way or another its the persons willpower that is the largest culprit. If an addict cant get his fix of whatever it might be he is going to do anything in his power to get it. Just pointing out that it becomes a issue when public helth is involved. And like I said before this is a states rights issue as much as anything else. That the federal government is willing to use force to overturn a states right through dualy elected process scares me have we slid so far down the road to socialist/Federalisim that a state no longer can put in a ballot initive means we are no longer an independent body from the Federal Government. Next thing you know they will select our representives for us and give us 2 people to vote for(Oh wait thats allready happend)

  • Lawrence Edward Calcut

    The Fluride in the water all these years has sure done a number on America. But what do you get/expect when you have a population of perhaps 200 million people whos IQ hovers around the 99 to 100 mark. Casting a vote for the legal use of the weed will not raise anybodies IQ even 1 point. so America it to be, controled by the 99ers and the weed. What a wonderfull future we are going to have.
    God help us.

    • Eric Bischoff

      Well at least pot makes you less angry. We could certainly use more of that.

  • Eric Bischoff

    It;”s amazing to me how the crowd that is so much for freedom and liberty often leans towards telling people how to live their lives.

    Will we ever learn. Prohibition has never and will never work.

    You want smaller less intrusive government, let people live.

    If there is ever an area that needs deregulated this is it. Let’s stop the hypocrisy. We will never stop people from doing what they like to do. Decriminalize all drugs. Personally I am more offended with our pharmaceutical industry than I am with recreational drugs. Not all are addicted.

    Addiction is a disease that needs/deserves treatment. Addictions obviously are not restricted to just drugs. Lately we seem to have a lot of video games, porn and gambling addictions.

    Decriminalize prostitution already, it’s only the oldest profession and it isn’t going away. And this is the big one in America – let women and only women control their body. When it comes to abortion men should just shut up. It’s a personal choice period. Oh and while I am at it offending some of you I might as well go all the way. Who are we to tell who someone can and should love. Government needs to get out of our bedrooms and give equal rights to all and that promise will only be complete when we finally include gays.

    This is where I want government out of my life.

    Government or the police should only be involved to protect us from others. We’ve certainly overcomplicated things and we need to go back to the basics and it all started from these 2 laws.

    Do what you have agreed to do.
    Do not encroach on others or their property.

    It seems to me we are guilty on all counts.

    • Rob Alexander

      Thank you, thank you, thank you… very well put.

      Mayberry sure nailed it with his Chaostan theory and the 2 laws.

  • Eric Bischoff

    Another point often missed about hemp is that it could revitalize our farmers. Hemp milk is a good omega3 product and is much healthier than soy milk which seems to mess with hormones. Hemp oil is healthier than corn oil. Hemp makes better paper than wood pulp, Hemp makes better cloth than cotton.

    And if you do some research you”ll find out that William Randolph Hearst appears to have created a fear tactic to eliminate hemp, a competing product to his tree plantations to produce paper for his newspapers. It wasn’t because marijuana was so evil. It’s a plant like many other plants that god has put on this earth for us.

    Everyone in California knows where it is grown. There is a billion dollar industry around Eureka. The government could have shut it but it hasn’t.

    What’s criminal is the locking up of non-violent drug users. But it appears that this is a good way to keep the black population from voting. Since they are the largest numbers in jails even though white people actually use more drugs. Once arrested you lose your right to vote. How convenient.

    • http://none Mike

      Amen though I do have an aversion to abortion. One day we will all have to stand before god and account for our actions. There again though it is not for me to be the judge and jury only one has that power.Maby though It might be for me to ask the woman to think about it first though(all I can ask ) You wont get alot of people to agree with you though. They seem to want to legislate some behaveyours and not others. I say legislate none of them that do not affect others directly I.E. Theft,Murder,Abuse Just to name a few. God says Hate the sin not the sinner. Thus he forgave the harlot that was willing to anoint him with oil and bathe his feet where the Pharacies were not.

    • coal miner


      Hemp milk is legal.
      Though its name might be a bit misleading, organic hemp milk is a perfectly legal, not to mention healthy, alternative for vegetarians or non vegetarians. Produced from the seeds of the hemp plant, this milk has only begun to be sold in the United States within the past few years.

      • Eric Bischoff

        Yes but made from Hemp plants grown in Canada. How stupid is that.

  • clay cannon

    marijuana is no better nor worse than tabacco or alchohol,more than likely less. alchohol destroys more homes and families from adults than pot ever could! abuse,violence,domestic blow ups and the such, and the kids are there in the house! tabacco,…cancer,diseise,second hand for kids,fire etc! I smoked a lot of weed when I was younger,guess what i grewout of/ got tired of it! still smake cigs and drink! how bout trying it,legalization that is, hell they tried prohibition and it didnt work and went back! Im not saying that all drugs should be legal by no means,ie: heroine,crack,pharm pills,huffing, thats silly these drugs show bad metal and physical effects, but burning a doob doesnt make one hillucinate and kill their best friend. not to mention the industry plus and load off of our police depts and criminal system! IMO!!!

  • Dave from Ohio

    While the article mentions Obama, Bush, and Clinton as person who “tried” the drug during college days, many Harvard alums who lived in one the “river houses” know that Al Gore was a regular user during his time there and his daughter Karenna was a heavyweight in that scene during her time there.

    • Eric Bischoff

      Yes and the point is?

  • coal miner

    Health benefits of hemp milk:

    Organic hemp milk is also a great alternative to toxic cow’s milk and those who cannot consume dairy because of dietary issues.

    One 8-Ounce glass contains the following healthy nutrients:
    900mg Omega-3 Fatty Acid
    2800mg Omega-6 Fatty Acid
    All 10 Essential Amino Acids
    4 grams of Digestible Protein
    46% of RDA of Calcium
    0% Cholesterol
    Vitamin A
    Vitamin E
    Vitamin B12
    Folic Acid
    Vitamin D
    And also a great alternative to soy’s milk:

  • coal miner

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    Industrial Hemp Facts

    North American Industrial Hemp Council, Inc. (NAIHC)

    Hemp has been grown for at least 12,000 years for fiber (textiles and paper) and seed (food and fuel). It has been effectively prohibited in the United States since the 1950s.
    George Washington and Thomas Jefferson both grew hemp. Ben Franklin owned a mill that made hemp paper. Jefferson drafted the Declaration of Independence on hemp paper.
    Because of its importance for sails (the word ‘canvass’ is rooted in ‘cannabis’) and rope for ships, hemp was a required crop in the American colonies.
    Hemp was grown commercially (with increasing government interference) in the United States until the 1950s. It was doomed by the Marijuana Tax Act of 1937, which placed an extremely high tax and made it effectively impossible to grow industrial hemp. While congress expressly expected the continued production of industrial hemp, the Federal Bureau of Narcotics lumped industrial hemp with marijuana, as its successor the United States Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA), does to this day.
    Industrial hemp and marijuana are both classified by taxonomists as Cannabis sativa L., a species with hundreds of varieties. Cannabis sativa L. is a member of the mulberry family. Industrial hemp varieties are bred to maximize fiber, and/or seed, while marijuana varieties seek to maximize THC (delta 9 tetrahydrocannabinol, the primary psychoactive ingredient in marijuana) through several budding sites for its flowers and leaves.
    While industrial hemp and marijuana may look somewhat alike to the untrained eye, an easily trained eye can easily distinguish the difference.
    No one would want to smoke industrial hemp. Industrial hemp has a THC content of between 0.05 and 1%. Marijuana has a THC content of 3% to 20%. To receive a standard psychoactive dose would require a person to ‘power-smoke’ 10-12 hemp cigarettes over a very short period of time. The large volume, high temperature of vapor, gas and smoke would be difficult for a person to withstand, much less enjoy.
    If one tried to ingest enough industrial hemp to get a buzz, it would be the equivalent of taking 2-3 doses of a high-fiber laxative.
    No marijuana grower would hide marijuana plants in a hemp field. Marijuana is grown widely spaced to maximize flowers and leaves; hemp is grown tightly-spaced to maximize stalk and is usually harvested before it goes to seed. It is also the first place where law enforcement officials would look.
    If hemp does pollinate any nearby marijuana, genetically, the results will always be lower-THC marijuana and will contain unwanted seeds. When hemp is grown, nearby marijuana growers will be upset due to the pollination by hemp fields; thus causing marijuana growers to flee the area or grow indoors under lab-like conditions (to keep pollen outside).
    When U.S. sources of ‘Manila hemp’ (not true hemp; rather sisal and jute) was cut off by the Japanese in World War II, the U.S. Army and U.S. Department of Agriculture promoted the “Hemp for Victory” campaign to grow hemp in the U.S.
    While the original ‘gruel’ was made of hemp seed meal, hemp oil and seed can be made into tasty and nutritional products. [Recipe for Hemp Seed Porridge]
    At a volume level of 81%, hemp oil is the richest known source of polyunsaturated essential fatty acids (the ‘good’ fats). It is quite high in some essential amino acids, including gamma linoleic acid (GLA), a very rare nutrient also found in mother’s milk.
    Hemp can be made into quality papers. the long fibers in hemp allow such paper to be recycled several more times than wood-based papers.
    Because of its low lignin content, hemp can be pulped using less energy and chemicals than wood requires, resulting in less pollution and energy consumption. Its natural whiteness can obviate the need to use chlorine bleach, which means no extremely toxic dioxin being dumped into streams. Rather, when required, hemp can be whitened with hydrogen peroxide. Therefore, hemp paper is acid-free, which can last 1,500 years. Wood-based papers have a shelf life of 25-100 years.
    Kimberly-Clark (a Fortune 500 company) has a mill in France which produces hemp paper preferred for bibles and cigarette paper because it lasts a long time and doesn’t yellow.
    Construction products such as medium density fiberboard (MDF), oriented strand board, and even beams, studs and posts can be made out of hemp. Because of hemp’s long fibers (bundles of 7 feet long can be common), the products will be stronger and/or lighter than those made from wood (a Douglas fir tree’s fiber is at best 3/4 inch long).
    Hemp can yield 3-8 dry tons of fiber per acre. This is four times what an average forest can yield.
    The products that can be made from hemp number over 25,000.
    Hemp grows well in a variety of climates and soil types. It is naturally resistant to most pests, precluding the need for pesticides. It grows tightly spaced, out-competing any weeds, so herbicides are not necessary. It also leaves a weed-free field for the following crop.
    A 1938 Popular Mechanics article described hemp as a “New Billion Dollar Crop.”
    Hemp can be made into variety of fabrics, including linen quality.
    Hemp can displace cotton which is grown with massive amounts of chemicals harmful to people and the environment. fifty percent of the world’s pesticides are sprayed on cotton. “Cotton, the natural fiber;” think again.
    Hemp fibers are longer, stronger, more absorbent, and more mildew-resistant than cotton. The original Levi Strauss jeans made for the Sierra gold miners were made of hemp sailcloth.
    Fabrics made of at least fifty percent hemp block the sun’s harmful UV rays more effectively than other fabrics.
    Hemp can displace wood fiber and save forests for watershed, wildlife habitat, recreation and oxygen production, carbon sequestration (reduces global warming), and other values.
    Many of the varieties of hemp that were grown in North America have been lost. Seed banks were not maintained. New genetic breeding will be necessary using both foreign and ‘ditch weed,’ strains of hemp that went feral after cultivation ended. Various state national guard units often spend their weekends trying to eradicate this hemp, in the mistaken belief they are helping stop drug use.
    Henry Ford experimented with hemp to build car bodies and interiors. He wanted to both build and fuel cars from farm products. [See Popular Mechanics “Pinch Hitters for Defense.”]
    BMW is experimenting with hemp materials in automobiles as part of an effort to make cars more recyclable.
    Seeking to put more environment-friendly materials in its cars, Daimler-Benz may replace fiberglass matte with industrial hemp. [See Popular Mechanics “Putting Cannabis Into Cars.”]
    Rudolph Diesel designed his namesake engine to run on vegetable oils, including hempseed oil.
    Hempseed oil once greased machines. Most paint, resins, shellacs, and varnishes used to be made out of linseed (from flax) and hempseed oils.
    Much of the bird seed sold in the United States has hempseed (it’s sterilized before importation), the hulls of which contain about 25% protein of which is more easily digestible than soybean protein.
    The U.S. Drug Enforcement Agency (DEA) classifies all Cannabis sativa L. varieties as ‘marijuana.’ While it is theoretically possible to get permission from the government to grow hemp, DEA would require that the field to be secured by fence, razor, wire, dogs, guards, and lights, making it cost-prohibitive.
    The U.S. State Department must certify each year that a foreign nation is cooperating in the war on drugs. The European Union subsidizes its farmers to grow industrial hemp. Those nations are not on this list, because the U.S. State Department distinguishes the difference between hemp and marijuana.
    Over 30 industrialized democracies do distinguish hemp from marijuana. International treaties regarding marijuana make an exception for hemp, and trade alliances such as NAFTA allow for the importation of hemp.

    Aug | Sep | Oct
    September 24, 2005
    Event thrown for groups hoping to legalize h

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