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Romney Clones Bush Foreign Policy

June 27, 2012 by  

Romney Clones Bush Foreign Policy
PHOTOS.COM
Mitt Romney has called for increasing military funding.

If you loved George W. Bush’s foreign policy, then Mitt Romney is your man. If this fact wasn’t evident before last weekend, it should now be crystal clear.

During a weekend retreat costing donors $50,000 to $100,000 each for admission, former Bush foreign policy officials — mostly members of the Bilderberg subgroup the Council on Foreign Relations, a sack full of (self-proclaimed) neocons and a couple of hundred banksters — gathered to fete Romney and pontificate about American empire.

Former Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice and Bush’s former brain Karl Rove gave speeches highlighting what a Romney foreign policy would look like. Attendees included former Secretary of State (under George H.W. Bush) James Baker III, Senators John McCain and John Thune, Representatives Eric Cantor and Paul Ryan, Governors Bobby Jindal (La.) and Bob McDonnell (Va.), former Governors Jeb Bush (Fla.) and Tim Pawlenty (Minn.); former Bush staffers Mary Matalin and Michael Chertoff, and “chickenhawk” cheerleader Bill Kristol (a CFR member).

As The Nation noted May 2:

Of Romney’s forty identified foreign policy advisers, more than 70 percent worked for Bush. Many hail from the neoconservative wing of the party, were enthusiastic backers of the Iraq War and are proponents of a US or Israeli attack on Iran. Christopher Preble, a foreign policy expert at the Cato Institute, says, “Romney’s likely to be in the mold of George W. Bush when it comes to foreign policy if he were elected.” On some key issues, like Iran, Romney and his team are to the right of Bush. Romney’s embrace of the neoconservative cause–even if done cynically to woo the right–could turn into a policy nightmare if he becomes president.

Romney has called for increasing military funding. He has said he believes he can attack Iran — or anyone else — without first getting Congressional authorization. (Where have we heard that before?) According to a foreign policy white paper from the Romney campaign released last October, Romney has pledged to increase the number of warships the Navy builds per year from nine to 15 (five more than the service requested in its 2012 budget), boost the size of the military by 100,000 troops, place a missile defense system in Europe and station two aircraft carriers near Iran.

And Romney’s team is rife with Bush’s Iraq war chaff. It includes, according to The Nation:

Robert Joseph, the National Security Council official who inserted the infamous “sixteen words” in Bush’s 2003 State of the Union message claiming that Iraq had tried to buy enriched uranium from Niger; Dan Senor, former spokesman for the hapless Coalition Provisional Authority under Paul Bremer in Iraq; and Eric Edelman, a top official at the Pentagon under Bush. “I can’t name a single Romney foreign policy adviser who believes the Iraq War was a mistake,” says Cato’s  Preble. “Two-thirds of the American people do believe the Iraq War was a mistake. So he has willingly chosen to align himself with that one-third of the population right out of the gate.”

The United States currently spends more on its military than the next 10 biggest military spenders combined — about 40 percent all money shelled out for military spending globally, according the Stockholm International Peace Research Institute. But for Romney and his CFR/neocon cabal, that’s not enough.

Bob Livingston

is an ultra-conservative American who has been writing a newsletter since 1969. Bob has devoted much of his life to research and the quest for truth on a variety of subjects. Bob specializes in health issues such as nutritional supplements and alternatives to drugs, as well as issues of privacy (both personal and financial), asset protection and the preservation of freedom.

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  • Doc Sarvis

    I totally agree that this is a huge reason to vote against Romney. President Obama has spent much of his Presidency trying to get out of the conflicts Bush threw our military forces into and extracting us from the Bush “unpaid” wars economy. The neocons have done great damage to our country.

    As for your source “The Nation”; while I applaud your use of this as a trusted source I will point out that I have been ridiculed for my use of it. Maybe now your readers will see it as a valid place to go for good information.

    • Patriot II

      So Doc, did you get your monthly alotment of Kool-Aid Comrad?

      • Doc Sarvis

        So you make false allegations about where I get my income because you can’t dispute my argument. The easy way out.

      • MAP

        Doc, and Obama is, I suppose, for us? What a hilarious declaration! He’s a puppet on strings, just like all the rest of them. This is a plutocracy and Obama is a just better liar and pretender than most. At least, he has completely convinced the mindless liberals.

      • http://Yahoo Maynard

        So Patriot II Do you think Bob Livingston is taking the Kool-aid too? Is it really patriotic to bankrupt our country with foolish wars and military expenditures that only benefit the war profiteers? I think you need a nice drink of that Kool-aid too, if you really believe we can fight our way out of our problems at home by more wars abroad and a Police State here. That’s what we’re in for with Romney, the lick-spittle of Rove and the Neo -cons.

    • AirCav

      Tell me Doc, who then do we vote for? I am only voting for the lesser of the two evils, Romney.

      • Patriot II

        AirCav, right!

      • Doc Sarvis

        Your vote is for the 1%ers as opposed to a vote for the vast majority of Americans.

      • AirCav

        Then that is what I will do! Staying with Obama is a vote for Comunism, I spent time in 1971 fighting against it, no way will I vote for it.

      • The Harrytruth

        I just want to know what is so bad about Romney.

        • truesoy

          The Harrytruth;

          Well, if you are old enough to be on ‘medicare’, then your medical/health care is safe. But if you are not old enough, nor near the cutoff age, then you are in trouble because Romney and company, Paul Ryan, etc., are working at selling Social Security to the banks, and to sell medicare to the insurance companies (privatization).
          Social Security has been a victim of its success.The system has been treated by politicians as a bottomless source of money, and now don’t want to pay the money back (approx. 2 1/2 trillions. But ironically we’ll pay the chinese. But I guess its ok to default on the american people.is has given Paul Ryan and others the excuse to develop a plan to ‘save it’, but to do so it first has to be privatized.
          The scheme will involve issuing ‘vouchers’ for insurance purchase.
          OK, let me get this straight, they claim medicare is broke and in order to fix it they are adding a ‘middle man’ (insurance company) to the mix, really?.
          Keep in mind that ‘medicare’ is an insurance plan most people pay for 40 to 50 years of their lives before getting any of its benefits at age 65 for the next 10 to 15 years of the average life of the individual. Medicare is a true entitlement because you pay for it, even after retirement you still pay a monthly premium automatically deducted from your SS account.
          And what about Social Security? They offer a similar solution: privatize it just like Chile in South America did. Thats the model for SS they want to establish here.
          But how about when the banks go ‘belly up?
          Let me tell you how that works.
          In Chile the government guarantees the fund. The need for that became evident during the recent financial meltdown when a number of people that chose the private SS found themselves almost destitute. The people that had chosen to stay in the government SS were doing pretty good, though.
          What we would have instead, is a banking system of ‘privatized profits’ with ‘socialized loses’.
          Now, if you are the banks you’ll have the best of both worlds. But the people are left with the short end of the stick.
          Don’t allow those who tell you otherwise, fool you.

          Sincerely,
          Truesoy

      • The Harrytruth

        With Obama we know what we have a sinking and crashing country. It’s time to change. Romney will get us all back to work and where we stand in the global economy. We are falling behind with Obama and his job killing regulations. Under Obama it is cheaper to move out of the United States if your a manufacturer no regulation to hold you back, fine you, tax you, We need to compete and under Obama this is impossible. Romney knows this, Obama hasn’t a clue.

      • Joe Hammond

        This election only goes to show you how important it is that a “NONE OF THE ABOVE” position be placed on all ballots. I know I would place my vote there this election…..what a bunch of Wall Street syncophants we have for running President of the Empire!…But then again with electronic voting how do we know our votes are counted as we cast them rather than how we should have cast them….2 political parties which is really one oligarchical political party, the 1%……….

    • truesoy

      Doc Sarvis

      The people thtat will vote for Romney, didn’t vote for Obama the first time around for obvious reasons, and those same reasons remain today.
      Most of these people have issues that common sense and logic finds it difficult to overcome and will rather sink the nation than vote for Obama. And others will believe anything Fox and Friends says to them.

      Sincerely,
      Truesoy

      • Nadzieja Batki

        So you are a typical Leftie and you will follow your Master’s voice no matter what path he takes you even if it is to your destruction. How do I know? Because you lie about the posters who comment against O. You have not taken a tally of who listens/watches Fox.

        • truesoy

          Nadzieja Batki;

          …you are totally ‘batty’, as most conservative republicans are, and if you thought for a moment that no one could tell the Fox and Friends faithful, or Rush’s Ditto Heads, or the wide eye demented look and speach of the Glen Beck crowd, I have news for you, then.
          Of course people can tell, for that way of expressing one self is a natural phenomena among conservatives. However, I see it more like having the abilitie of a parrot, therebys repeating the nonsenses they were led to believe in.

          Sincerely,
          Truesoy

          • RichE

            truesoy,
            “Ditto Head” I love it! Where’d you get it?

          • truesoy

            RichE;

            ‘Ditto Heads’ is what Rush calls his ‘devout listeners’, and it seems they are proud of it.
            Can you imagine what it must be like for a grown man or woman taking pride in being known as a a “Ditto Head”?.
            This speaks volumes about their maturity.

            Sincerely,
            Truesoy

          • RichE

            truesoy,
            Ditto Head, self-flagellation?

      • r.p.

        Here’s an epiphany for ya. Anyone who would vote for Obama would vote for Romney. Anyone who would vote for Romney would vote for Obama. As they are locked into believing in the “left right paradigm” and will continue to vote for the lesser of the two evils because that’s what they have been told to do. They will never look into the issues unless the issues are what corporate media tells you what they are. As long as they continue to support the two party cabal, we will continue to get the same ole sh!t. That is exactly what USSR had and it was called what it was, a “politburo”. One party that called itself two parties, with a national media who told the people who their “choice” was to be. Somebody needs to shake you awake!!!

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jay

        One thing’s for sure, truesoy, you’re persistent. And btw, your frustration is showing. Hope it doesn’t turn into a full-blown psychosis. Take deep breaths…

        • truesoy

          Jay;

          Don’t shoot the messenger just because you don’t like the message.

          Sincerely,
          Truesoy

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jay

        I have no intentions of shooting you, truesoy, i merely expressed concern for your well-being.

        • truesoy

          Jay;

          I appreciate you taking such an interest for my wellbeing.
          Thank You.

          Sincerely,
          Truesoy

    • Cliffystones

      While I agree with your assesment of Romney as a “Neocon”, he’s still the (current) lesser of two evils. Obama is still the absolute worst thing to ever happen to this country.

  • MAP

    The current far-left nutcase occupying the White House has been a such total disaster on every front that even the barrage of cover-ups, distortions, lies and blame-pointing have been unable to conceal the complete failure. His performance has been so utterly destructive and negative that ANYONE would have to be an improvement (how can you do worse than worst?). I would vote for Mickey Mouse over this joke of a leader. When you have been drug to the bottom, up is the only direction left.

    The problem with the Republican Party is that it is NOT a conservative party. Pat Buchanan in a recent column explains the problem:
    http://lewrockwell.com/buchanan/buchanan248.html

  • braindeadUS

    If you want out of this mess then vote for Ron Paul this election is not over

    • Patriot II

      Yes , I do beleive voting for Ron Paul would assure an Obama Victory,
      Apparently that is want you want.

      • more pissed off than you can wrap your little mind around

        You did it yourselves!

      • Average Joe

        Patriot II ,
        If Obama wins in November, it won’t be because we voted for Ron Paul. I will be because people like you didn’t vote for Ron Paul.
        Romney = Obama, One coin, two “different looking sides”, yet both spend exactly the same…a quarter is a quarter, no matter which side you are looking at.

        Ron Paul / Andrew Napolitano 2012!

  • Randy131

    Well, it’s quite apparent by this article that there is no love between George Bush and Bob Livingston, but probably a lot of hate, for which I could care less. The real question here, that we as Americans have, and must make a choice on by our vote this November 2012, is which foreign policy we would prefer for our government to display and use. If we re-elect Obama, we have his record of bowing and apologizing for America, for what is still a mystery to me, to everyone and his brother, while he promotes Islam and Muslims around the world, to the detriment of Christians and the forfeiture of their lives, all while condemning our long time allies, and promoting the goals of our long time enemies. If we elect Romney, we’ll supposedly get a continuation of Bush’s foreign policy, according to Bob Livingston. The question here is whose policies are worse, and whose policies do we prefer, and who will we vote for in November of 2012? Well this is a no-brainer for me, but apparently Bob Livingston is having a difficult time in deciding which he would prefer, since like it or not, these are our only two choices to choose from. Well, good luck on that decision Bob, and when you figure it out, please let us know, for you ‘WILL’ be graded on your choice.

    • http://boblivingstonpl.wordpress.com Bob Livingston

      Dear Randy131,

      You write: “Well, it’s quite apparent by this article that there is no love between George Bush and Bob Livingston, but probably a lot of hate, for which I could care less.” I do not hate George Bush. I do hate the fascist policies and unnecessary wars he embarked upon. I despise those who pulled his strings. BTW: They are now pulling Obama’s.

      You write: “The real question here, that we as Americans have, and must make a choice on by our vote this November 2012, is which foreign policy we would prefer for our government to display and use. If we re-elect Obama, we have his record of bowing and apologizing for America, for what is still a mystery to me, to everyone and his brother, while he promotes Islam and Muslims around the world, to the detriment of Christians and the forfeiture of their lives, all while condemning our long time allies, and promoting the goals of our long time enemies. If we elect Romney, we’ll supposedly get a continuation of Bush’s foreign policy, according to Bob Livingston.” Please point out for me–aside from Obama’s “bowing and apologizing”–the differences between Bush’s foreign policy and Obama’s. US troops remain in Iraq and will for the foreseeable future. The war in Afghanistan continues. It has spread to Pakistan, Yemen and Somalia. We attacked Libya, using al-Qaida operatives to overthrow Gadhafi. We are threatening Syria and Iran. We are doing the bidding of Saudi Arabia and Israel in the ME. We are now facing off with China and Russia over Syria and Iran. Guantanamo Bay remains open for business.

      You write: “The question here is whose policies are worse, and whose policies do we prefer, and who will we vote for in November of 2012? Well this is a no-brainer for me, but apparently Bob Livingston is having a difficult time in deciding which he would prefer, since like it or not, these are our only two choices to choose from.” So, again, tell me where our foreign policy, as it relates to the Middle East, has changed since 1990, regardless of which President occupied our House? You say for you it is a “no-brainer.” I have written about you. http://personalliberty.com/2012/05/14/the-lies-youre-told/

      You write: “Well, good luck on that decision Bob, and when you figure it out, please let us know, for you ‘WILL’ be graded on your choice.” You are deceived. If the choice is Romney or Obama, there is really no choice. If Ron Paul is not on the ballot, there will be no vote from me. That is my choice.

      Best wishes,
      Bob

      • more pissed off than you can wrap your little mind around

        Thank you Bob, I agree. And to Randy131: Are you even aware of who the Bushes are and their family history? Do you know Prescott Bush was a huge supporter of Hitler and how daddy Bush was so instrumental in bringing us Agenda 21 (read the bullet points! It’s NWO via crippling the US)? Are you really pro-fascism/slavery? Are you really happy that ALL THE CONSERVATIVE YOUNG MEN – OUR NEXT GENERATION- IS BEING KILLED OFF by foreign police actions? People talk about America being an armed population, but seniors packing doesn’t have the same effect as a nation which includes the young and the strong bearing arms. And who do you want them protecting, a foreign nation or OUR nation?

      • Scott

        AND NOW, the news says WE are in the planning “stages” to go into parts of Africa, to HELP those folks setup democratic govt.’s…… out of our 1,000+ bases around the world, WE (the neo-cons, those behind the throne) are planning OUR move into the last continent without MAJOR U.S.A. bases….. now the “blacks of Africa” can be added to the growing list of folks around the world who hate the USA, the NOW Evil SATAN of the world! And many of the negative ones commenting on B.O. or M.R., do not see that THEY are the TWO SIDES of the same coin! How sad, Bob L. is right……! YOU HAVE NO CHOICES!!!!

      • Mimi

        Bob, if you believe that Mitt Romney is the same as Barack Obama, you somehow have missed what Obama stands for. You rightly said, that he’s bowed and scraped to our enemies, and alienated our allies (roughly speaking), and you think that Romney would do the same? Obama has clearly shown who he supports, and it’s not Christians or Jews, but the Muslims, because that’s how he was brought up, and what he truly believes. Making himself out to be a Christian, was just a political move. Certainly the good Reverend Wright is no Christian in any Christian’s mind. As for foreign policy, there I do not think any layman, such as you, myself, and most Americans, can know what’s really happening in the world, and the necessary things that have to be done to protect this country’s citizens, our borders, our allies. Therefore, it’s very easy to say that Obama is following the Bush policies, but in fact he’s done so, perforce, and superficially, putting us in graver danger than ever, by pulling out of Iraq, and Iran too soon, leaving the process unfinished, which simply made everything already accomplished, in vain. Just as was done in Viet Nam. All because of ignorance of the people and the inability of our leaders to spell out as much as possible what was and is, at stake. We shouldn’t have gone into Viet Nam, but that was basically started by President Kennedy, when the North Vietnamese fired on the Turner Joy (missing it by miles), but it gave Kennedy and subsequently, Lyndon Johnson an excuse to engage in a war. And it’s interesting that Richard Nixon ended it, though he never got credit for that. But had the U.S. finished that war, the North Koreans wouldn’t have become the threat they have. And it was the liberal left who betrayed this country then as they do now, in so many ways, thanks to their ignorance. Doing the right thing is sometimes the hardest way to go, but we can’t be accused of doing the right thing, when we have so many ingrown saboteurs. This administration goes further towards fascism and totalitarianism, than previous ones. If you, like many others vote for Johnson, Ron Paul, whoever, at least be aware, don’t deny you are voting for Barack Obama, an avowed Muslim (in his own words), who said in his book, “If the winds turn ugly, I will stand with the Muslims”. Your grand gesture of voting for someone else, will be stupid and tragic. Whatever else you may say about Mitt Romney, he is no Barack Obama, period.

      • Average Joe

        Mimi ,
        You need to watch the video link that I posted (just below) in response to Randy131.

        If Obama wins in November, it won’t be because we voted for Ron Paul. I will be because people like you didn’t vote for Ron Paul.
        Romney = Obama, One coin, two “different looking” sides, yet both spend exactly the same…a quarter is a quarter, no matter which side you are looking at.

        Ron Paul / Andrew Napolitano 2012!

        Best Wishes,
        AJ

    • Average Joe

      Randy131,

      You write: “The question here is whose policies are worse, and whose policies do we prefer, and who will we vote for in November of 2012? Well this is a no-brainer for me,”

      Please take the time to watch this video. Please take the time to listen very carefully to what they both say. If you still see any difference between Obama and Romney, then I would have to agree with your statement…for you, “it’s a no brainer”.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3lUs17azUFs&feature=share

      Best Wishes,
      AJ

      • Patriot II

        Average Joe, so you don’t care if Obama wins? Voting for Ron Paul, on and Independent ticket takes votes away from whom? I voted for Ross Perot on principal just like you are wanting to do for Paul. Look what happened. I will beat the Christmas rush and say “I told you so”. and God help us now that you helped re-elect Obama. Thanks for nothing!

      • Average Joe

        Of course I do…just the same as I am worried that Romney will win.
        You are free to think or say anything you want…it makes no difference to me.Repeating your diatribe over and over won’t change my mind. Instead of telling us not to vote for Ron Paul, tell us why we should get behind Romney ( beating Obama is not a valid reason), because I see no difference between Obama and Romney… policywise.
        As I posted above,
        “If Obama wins in November, it won’t be because we voted for Ron Paul. I will be because people like you didn’t vote for Ron Paul.
        Romney = Obama, One coin, two “different looking” sides, yet both spend exactly the same…a quarter is a quarter, no matter which side you are looking at.

        Ron Paul / Andrew Napolitano 2012!

        Best Wishes,
        AJ

  • Donna

    I VOTE FOR A MORMON-LOVES AMERICA, THE PEOPLE, THE CONSTITUTIONS OVER A COMMIE MORON AMERICAN HATING PIECE A GARBAGE ANYTIME!!

    ROMNEY 2012!!

  • Gea

    Barak Hussein Obama is endangering not only US soldiers but US and the entire Western civlization by his cavorting with Islamists of Muslim Brotherhood and Taliban,, extolling Islam and Koran while dissing Bible. Bush had held hands with Saudi King, while Obama bowed to this king in whose kingdom they behead witches, hang gays, promote pedophilia, polygamy and murder for allahu akbar, in addition to stoning women for adultery, and lashing them for driving or not wearing niquab. Obama bowed to this king whose subjects commited crimes of 9/11.

    I would rather have Romney hold hands than bowing to Saudi King, although, I would reather that US stops buying Saudi and Iranian oil, because money from this oil purchase by US goes to finance terrorism against WEstern civlization all over the world in mosques and other Islamic organization which are white washing Islam as a “peaceful religion”, which is oposite from truth. Obama is helping CAIR and OIC white wash Islam, which is incompatible with US Constitution and/or Universal Declaration of Human Rights.

  • TIME

    WOW – A case of the same old same old, lets see, War after war, Lie after Lie, BS and yet more BS stacked higher and deeper – election after election.

    When will you all get it, there is “NO Differance” between any of them!

    They all have been hand picked for your mindless
    “CULT of Personality Voting experience,” in that special BIG every four year Poll that displays just how stupid in most cases – and or just Ignorant in other cases – the people really are.
    Its really just a Poll for Dummies, are YOU one of them?

    All of these people you vote for are owned Lock Stock and what ever by the very 1% that so many of you like to rant about.

    People – this mindless event is really no differant than cutting off your head to be sure it will never be able to wear a hat again.

    A Single coin may have a head and a tail, – yet it has the same goal no matter what side you use.
    Its really no differant than the TWO Party system, when will you all get it?
    DIVIDE and CONQUER, this ploy is as old as TIME its self!

    You have been used, you have been abused as well, – this will never stop until you start using your gray matter for more than a filler between your bloody ears.

    The Political Thearter is working over time now to make you think that; #1, Your Vote counts, Its does not,
    #2, That there is a differance between the TWO Partys, – again theres not!

    Yet Americans wait with baited breath for these insaine events to unfold Time after Time, oddly Nothing Positive ever happens for YOU, now does it?

    Perhaps some day when its all gone – and you have left your Kids with mounds of debt that can never be paid off, they will understand what was lost.

    Yet All that so you could have a what ever that you think you need now and so you don’t have to think, { after all when all your thinking is done for you what could go wrong? }

    Hey here’s a clue, look around you for the answers,
    How about the Patriot ACT;
    How about, No Child Left behind ACT,
    Oh wait this one is really special, How about the NDA-ACT, you know that special one that makes you the BAD GUY! You know the one who pays these special people who are alledged to work for you…

    What will it take to get you to OPEN YOUR EYES?
    How about if per chance its you that faces an event like Waco or Ruby Ridge or perhaps you just grow a few Veggies in your back yard or have a Cow that gives MILK, when its your turn to face these special people what will you do?

    Google; The season of Treason 1 – 3 watch them all perhaps even Learn something…………….
    When your done then Google; William Billy Foust – watch more youtube hell all you have to do is sit still and watch and learn something about when this nation went bad, not unlike the apple with that rotten worm in it.
    Or will you just wait for the OMEN to unfold with your fingers crossed yet again?

    Peace and Love

    • Scott

      RIGHT on Time!!!!!!

    • Patriot II

      TIME;

      Ok, now that we unbdertand that it is Oone Worlders that are our enemy (I don’t disagree) what is your solution? I asked Bob Livingston that, and he suggested we all prepare to survive and let it happen. Is it mere education of every Patriot in this country to understand, so then we can move forward with …. what? -Do we just stock pile food and Gold and take care or our own and be armed so we can fight off our less fortunate neighbors who are starving and come to get our food?

      Is there nothing else to do other than that? Why do we torture ourselves with even discussing it?

      I suggest if that is all we do, then Bob close this chat room and quit his commentary, and change to helping others get prepared to “Weather the coming Storm”., or let them fend for themselves because they deserve the consequences of their ignorance.

      At Least that will wake up folks if we let this country fail. After all how do we learn if we don’t fail?

      God has turned his back on this World and has decided to let us fail, so we might learn our lessons.

      Unfortunately People like you and I are passionate about educating the masses who still think politics in the country actually matter. Are we wasting out time? How can we be effective?

      • Nadzieja Batki

        NWO will happen whether people believe it or not. The governments of all the nations on earth are jockeying for their spots in the lineup.

  • http://yahoo.com Robert T Willis

    PEOPLE, the bottom line is this, WE CAN NOT AFFORD 4 MORE YEARS OF OBAMA!

    • Patriot II

      Robert: It does not matter according to Bob Livingston, Obama is no different than Romney apparently. So they want us to vote for Ron Paul.

  • Patriot II

    Bob, what is your point? Are you tryiing to give the Libs and the communists ammunition?

    Not a good thing to say ANYTHING negative at all about someone who can defeat the current regime, I think you messed up here.

    • http://boblivingstonpl.wordpress.com Bob Livingston

      Dear Patriot II,

      You write: “Bob, what is your point?” To point out the false choice you are given. Do you not realize that the power elite control both Romney and Obama? Do you not yet realize that the power elite do not care which one wins because either will do their bidding of advancing their march toward one world government?

      You write: “Are you tryiing to give the Libs and the communists ammunition?” Do you think the “Libs” did not know this already? This is written for the benefit of true patriots who are being duped.

      You write: “Not a good thing to say ANYTHING negative at all about someone who can defeat the current regime, I think you messed up here.” It’s disappointing that you don’t approve of the truth. Perhaps you should reconsider your moniker.

      Best wishes,
      Bob

      • Patriot II

        So Bob, Good Point, but let’s be Clear here. Do you want NO President? Do you want a Revolution?

        We have to choose don’t we, or take up arms FOR the Constitution against all of “them” becuase all are controlled by the One worlders. How do we determine who “Them” are in
        Government? How do we make a distiction of who we are. I tend to think in terms of
        States rights and the fact that the Fed does us more harm than good now.

        I agree with you about the One world Order, so which one of the two do you want to be the Puppet Obama or Romney?

        It’s a fair question I think don’t you?

        How do we declare War on the World Powers.

        Are the OWO that are controlling Obama of a different ilk than the ones who are controlling Romney. Should we Choose the Muslims over The ?

        Can we make distictions of factions of One worlders? Are there oposing Factions within the Extreme elite Rich who make it up?

        Now we are discussing what is the REAL ISSUES which is far above most in this country who can’t even fathom the thought. Yes I understand exactly what you are saying.

        Do you have a Solution?

      • Scott

        Patriot II , I agree with Bob L. what do we want…? GET YOUR GUN, get in the street, like the folks in other parts of the world do…. get a revolution going…. until that happens here in the USA, all you and we get, is the same old SH**

      • http://boblivingstonpl.wordpress.com Bob Livingston

        Dear Patriot II,

        You write: “Do you want NO President?” I have made clear who I would like to see as president and how it could be achieved. Unfortunately, too many people bought the MSM’s and Republican Party’s lies: That Ron Paul was not a viable candidate.

        You write: “Do you want a Revolution?” No. But I see that day coming.

        You write: “I agree with you about the One world Order, so which one of the two do you want to be the Puppet Obama or Romney?” It makes no difference. Their “solutions” to our “problems” are mirror image. The only difference is which set of elites get choice seats at the table and which have to settle for the table scraps.

        You write: “Can we make distictions of factions of One worlders? Are there oposing Factions within the Extreme elite Rich who make it up?” No and no.

        You write: “Do you have a Solution?” We must pick up the pieces after the collapse that I am calling the Great Reset. Until then, we can only be sure we are prepared to survive the ensuing chaos.

        Best wishes,
        Bob

      • Jimmy The Greek

        Hay bob the more i read your writings the more i like you , even tough you got it wrong when you thought you had me all figured out ,

        • http://boblivingstonpl.wordpress.com Bob Livingston

          Dear Jimmy The Greek,

          I’m not sure whether to be flattered or angry.

          Best wishes,
          Bob

  • Elaine

    Question: Regarding meeting above with many from Bush administrations — Are we back
    to the “New World Order” crowd that will ultimately require International Court, World Bank,
    open border crowd??? How about we work towards a unified United States of America!!!

    • Patriot II

      Elaine, do you remember Ronald Reagan? What Romney is doing is the exact same thing after another idiot Liberal who got us almost taken over by Russia. Jimmy Carter,
      very similar to Comrad Obama.

      • more pissed off than you can wrap your little mind around

        Ronald Reagan did the best job he could under the circumstances following Jimmy Carter, but he was far from infallible. Do you remember when he told America that HIV was NOT in the blood supply? I was only 20 years old and even I knew better.

  • http://centurylink.com EllenM Smith

    Republican are all WAR MONGALS.

    • MAP

      Ellen, we have been at war for the last 3 1/2 years and the wars have even expanded during the period your peace-loving, communist leader has been in office. Where have you been? You really should try returning to earth occassionally. Bogus propaganda is just bogus propaganda.

    • Patriot II

      Ellen, I think the terminology you want there is War “Mongers”.

      You must be a Democrat. Do you want war Mongers……..Or to be ruled by Muslims and have freedom of Religion made illegal when they and their leader take over.

      Make a Choice. Pull you head up (out of the sand) and start really investigating this stuff rather than just listen to the ABC, NBC, CBS, CNN, MSN who just regurgitate API (the Liberal Propaganda Machine). Tune into Fox News for fair and balanced, you may learn something rather than just repeat that old 60” democrat stuff. You sound like my Dad who was a Blind Democrat. He used to say stupid stuff like “Oh those Republicans are all for Big Business”….. lol! God Bless him, he was an old FDR Democrat, but was misled by FDR who started the current thought process of depending on Big Government……………………………….which is really Socialism. Are you a Socialist? The current leadership of the Democratic Party is, do you realize that?

    • Nadzieja Batki

      It seems that you do not know history. For all of our world history we could probably add up to about 200 +/- years of what could be called “peace”.

    • Average Joe

      EllenM Smith ,

      You write:
      “Republican are all WAR MONGALS (SIC)”

      George W. Bush did NOT order 241 drone strikes,launch FBI raids on antiwar activists, expand the Patriot Act, authorize the assassination of US citizens abroad and appoint Monsanto executives to the FDA….

      You’re thinking about Barack Obama.

      Best Wishes,
      AJ

      • truesoy

        Average Joe;

        The Patriot Act was a Bush creation.
        Obama did not expand the Act. What Obama did was extend it so as not to expire. No one uses ‘drones’ against antiwar activist. I can not even imagine where you’ve got that idea from, Glen Beck, maybe?, though I think not even he could conjure up such an idiotic idea.

        Sincerely,
        Truesoy

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jay

        Truesoy, Viet D. Dinh, who served as an Assistant Attorney General of the United States from 2001 to 2003, under the presidency of George W. Bush. was the chief architect of the USA PATRIOT Act.

      • Average Joe

        truesoy,
        Reading comprehension problems?

        Best Wishes,
        AJ

  • enough

    I am tired of voting for the lessor of two evils. Doesn’t look like Ron Paul is going to make it so Gary Johnson will have to do.

    Gary is 100 times more conservative than Romney and a million times more than odumbo.

    Just remember that when voting for the lessor of two evils, you are still voting for evil.

    • Mimi

      Evil can be translated to a deliberate act of hurting one’s country. That’s what Obama and his people have done. He will not deliberately hurt this country. That’s a big difference. His feeling for this country is a world of difference from Barack Obama. The president has made that clear, again and again. That Romney believes in a stronger military is exactly what we need to protect ourselves from an increasing Islamist threat. Don’t you get that?

      • Mimi

        In my last comments, I meant to say that “Romney” will not try to harm this country the way the Obama administration has.

      • Karolyn

        Puhleeze! You don’t think we already have the strongest military in the world? It’s called the DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE, not the Department of Offense. We do not need to have our soldiers in any other countries. Look at all those who have been ruined for life because of the wars they’ve been in. People like you would have it continue and even expand!

      • r.p.

        Romney hasn’t hurt the U.S.A.? Are you serious? What is it that you don’t understand. The Democrats are different than the Republicans? Only if you make that judgment by the degree of evil they represent. Ron Paul is THE only candidate given to us by the remnants of the true conservatives of the Republican party. And Americans are eager to cast him away by believing the propaganda swill the corporate media is pumping into their brain on a minute by minute basis. You really want to make a change for the better? Stop whining that everyone should vote for your pre-programmed “choice” and cover your collective arse so you can feel guiltless about the choices you make. Evil IS still EVIL. You want to make a difference? DO NOT VOTE FOR ANY DEMOCRAT OR REPUBLICAN PERIOD!! If it’s not Dr. Paul then it’s not going to be a Democrat or Republican!!! Short of an actual armed revolution this is the only way to reset our Constitutional government. If now is not the time then we are already sunk for supporting the two party cabal. We’ve been choosing option “A” or option “B” of the SAME EVIL for as long as I can remember, look how well it’s been working for us! This should not only apply to the presidential race but also for the seats in both houses. That’ll take the starch out of their shorts!! And by the way Mr. Livingston. I‘ve only withheld my vote once and was ashamed for doing so. So I will always try to make sure MY vote is properly applied to the person of MY choice.

    • Average Joe

      You Write:

      “I am tired of voting for the lessor of two evils. Doesn’t look like Ron Paul is going to make it so Gary Johnson will have to do.”

      FYI, nobody is going to “make it” unless we vote for them. Seems that you would rather get the cheap “knockoff”, rather than the designer “original”.

      Ron Paul 2012, In it to win it!

      Best Wishes,
      AJ

  • Laith

    If Ron Paul does not run as third party, I am voting Gary Johnson, I voted for Bob Barr last time. I stopped wasting my vote since 2004. The only way the Republican party come their senses is if they lose because they lost the Libertarian/conservative vote

    • Mimi

      Don’t bother Laith, just vote for Obama, because that’s what your vote will count for.

      • r.p.

        A vote for Romney is an endorsment for the two party system of corruption. It wont matter then who you vote for. they are the same coin, and last I heard,…Heads will not split from that coin and take a different path. It’ll go down the same path as Tails does.

      • dufas magnet

        You idiots talk as if every vote for an alternative to the two asswipes would ordinarily vote for Mittens.. There are just as many Dems as Pubs who would be willing to vote 3rd party if the word from the common man would over ride the millions pumped into ads that hypnotize the weak minded. Why do you think one party (say the dems) are nagging that the Pubs will defeat them if people don’t contribute enough money to out do their coffers? Quit being distracted by shiny things and vote your choice, not the choice the media pushes.. Do not believe any mud slinging political ads as even those with truth behind them are blown completely out of proportion.. Money rules in this election and it seems the piper has a crowd of rats following them and all of us into oblivion.. I will NOT vote for either party but the alternative had best be worth it as well. Oh, and I’m NOT a Romney supporter.

  • http://opineonthis.wordpress.com gsmullennix

    For better or worse, we have a two party system. Were it not for the inchoate use of Executive Orders, I’d be happy to leave the incompetent Obama in office with a Senate and House controlled by the GOP. He’d have the veto, little else, and we’d have a straw man president on which to blame numerous ills.
    HOWEVER, the crucial point is the coming appointment of numerous Federal Judges and Supreme Court Judges. We cannot allow politicians to act conservatively. The won’t do it because they want to be elected and reelected. The only means is to add ‘Young’ conservative judges to as many positions as possible and hope they will, as they swear to do, ‘defend the Constitution’. It has been undefended since 1937.

    • Laith

      Executive and recess appointments have a very limited scope, he cannot appoint federal or supereme court judges by executive order. We will never get out of that vicious cycle of voting for the lesser of two evils if we kep doing that.

  • Nan

    Regardless the similarities, the differences are enough that voting for Romney is a better option. Bama is a communist and we don’t want communism. Right?

  • Ron

    Wow, thanks Bob for a really great, thoughtful article. If the information you’ve cited here isn’t proof of the influence of Ike’s “Military-Industrial-Complex”, I don’t know what is. And I think it’s driving our policy and setting the agenda no matter who’s in office. And I’m not sure how far back it goes, depending on how you look at it. After all, Washington was a surveyor and real estate speculator who stood to benefit handsomely from a revolution to get us out from under George III’s Proclamation Line of 1763…so maybe big money’s always driven our war-making decisions. And I admit that’s pretty cynical.

    I’m not sure how to reverse that, short of an EMP that completely collapses the C-and-C infrastructure of government and the corporatocracy.

    The good news about EMP (whether man-made or solar storm induced)? The second after it happens, EVERYONE has a job again.

    People who know how to use slide rules and abaci would be particularly valuable, I’m guessin’.

    • MAP

      Ron, I highly recommend Albert J. Nock’s 1935 classic, “Our Enemy the State”. It is not a cheerful read, but it is very rewarding. I believe you can get a free copy online.

  • http://loboviejo.wordpress.com loboviejo

    Romney should have listened to his father when he woke up from the spell of McNamara. There is no foreign policy difference between the candidates–shall we have Puppet 2 or Puppet 3 invading Iran? That is a really disturbing question and we do not have the same level of awareness that we had when LBJ and Nixon were in Vietnam. It’s like establishment Republicans support the “crusade” and the left worships Obama as a reincarnation of “the Sun King.” If the Republicans want to return to the party of Taft or even Ike, they need to wake up–unfortunately too many Republicans neither remember nor care about those issues because they were either not yet born or were Democrats at the time.

  • Mimi

    Mr. Livingston, I disagree with your premise and your facts. You seem to believe that Mitt Romney is no better than Barack Obama. I’m rather stunned by your assessment. As for the cost of upgrading and maintaining our military, that is the primary responsibility of our government. The facts are, the funding for our military has been decreased over the last decades after Ronald Reagan. And now Obama wants to gut it more, to leave us more vulnerable than ever. If that is what you want, I am truly amazed at your short sightedness. In which case, I guess you are an Obama supporter. I didn’t realize that about you.

    Iraq was freed from a brutal despot and his sons. If you believe we have a responsibility to a free world (which includes our security). Everyone, including our Congress, our intelligence, Europe, believed Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction. By the time Bush got the go ahead from Congress, Saddam had ample opportunity to have those weapons moved. That doesn’t mean they didn’t exist. We can not remain isolated by what is going on in the world, especially now, that Obama and his administration, have undermined our military strength to a disastrous degree, and will continue to do, if he’s reelected. Remember his conversation with Putin over the live ‘mike’ saying he’ll have more flexibility with regard to the missile defense system, after he’s reelected. This nation has and is being duped by another type of ‘Hitler’, and is blind and deaf to the reality happening right here. Control over our first and second amendments, and so much more.
    What this administration is doing to Arizona, and anyone who questions it. From healthcare to banks, corporations, hospitals, and businesses of all kinds and creating higher and higher taxation, which affects us all. This is what you want? I am very disappointed in you. I thought you were aware of how important our military strength is, at least. Wow, was I wrong. You have disappointed me profoundly.

  • truesoy

    Years ago the people of these nation were warned by outgoing President Eisenhower they’d be days like these, and to be mindful of the danger posed by the military-industrial complex for they will get us into unnecessary wars.
    I also think that I now understand Thomas Jeffersons distrust and contemp for the banks.
    He had a valid point.

    Sincerely,
    Truesoy

    • MAP

      Jefferson was opposed to Hamilton’s entire system. Hamilton’s system was actually the British system of corruption, where a collusion exists between the government and the money powers. This is exactly the system we live under today, thanks to Lincoln, a former corporate lawyer. I can not ascertain whether Hamilton was corrupt (as Jefferson thought) or whether he was just naive. I understand he made no profit from his system and remained poor throughout his life.

      • truesoy

        MAP;

        The banking system should be tightly regulated while we still have the ability to do so, otherwise it morphed into ‘a great white’ that will devour nations into submission, including ours.

        Sincerely,
        Truesoy

      • MAP

        A national bank is a tragedy. It’s one of the few things that Andrew Jackson did I agree with. When he vetoed its continuance, the bank proved just what sort of dangerous enemy it is. Sadly, Wilson was a leftist and a fool, but I repeat myself.

  • Ron

    You have got to be kidding. Does anyone in their right mind want more of W’s failed foreign policy? Weapons of mass destruction turned into fighting a 3rd grade army and being stalemated by Al Quaida who wouldn’t have been in Iraq but for our attack on Iraq. We will never get our deficits under control unless we realize we just can’t fight everybody all the time. If anything should be clear it’s that W’s foreign policy is in large measure responsible for our massive debt. How much treasure and how many lives must be squandered before we realize that we can’t war our way out of these deficits!

    • http://NONE COFHOPP

      HI RON, I DEFINATELY AGREE. LOOKING BACK AT HISTORY IT HAS ALWAYS BEEN THAT WAY, THOSE WITH SPECIAL INTERESTS GET RICHER EVERY TIME WE GO TO WAR. IT DESTROYS THE VERY FABRIC OF OUR EVERY BEING NO MATTER WHAT COUNTRY IS AT WAR. I’VE READ ALMOST EVERY COMMENT AND WHILE WE GO BACK AND FORTH WITH WHO’S RIGHT OR WRONG, WE NEED TO REMEMBER ONE THING. OUR ENTIRE EXISTANCE IS AND HAS ALWAYS BEEN A FIGHT BETWEEN GOOD AND EVIL OR RIGHT AND WRONG IF YOU WILL. WE HAVE LOST SIGHT OF WHAT IS MORE IMPORTANT, OUR RELATIONSHIP WITH GOD. EVERYONE HAS THAT “LITTLE VOICE” THAT TELLS THEM THIER MAKING WRONG CHOICES, BUT SOME HAVE IGNORED THAT “LITTLE VOICE” SO LONG TILL THEY CAN’T HEAR IT ANY MORE…. WE ALL KNOW WHO THESE PEOPLE ARE…… IT WAS SAID IN ONE OF THE COMMENTS I READ THAT ” GOD HAS TURNED HIS BACK ON AMERICA SO WE COULD LEARN A LESSON ” WELL LET ME CORRECT THAT STATEMENT, GOD NEVER TURNED HIS BACK ON MAN; MAN HAS TURNED HIS BACK ON GOD; WITH DISBEDIENCE AND IGNORING THAT “LITTLE VOICE” THAT COMES FROM HIM. NOT TO WORRY THOUGH; GOD HAS HIS REWARD FOR THE WICKED AND WITH THIS NWO CULT; HE WILL SEPARATE THE SHEEP FROM THE WOLVES….. NO MATTER WHO THINKS THIER IN CHARGE GOD “WILL” DESTROY THE WICKED….. 2nd CHRONICLES 7ch; 14 vs. says ” IF MY PEOPLE WHO ARE CALLED BY MY NAME, SHALL HUMMBLE THEMSELVES, AND PRAY, AND TURN FROM THIER WICKED WAYS; THEN I WILL HEAR FROM HEAVEN, AND WILL FORGIVE THIER SINS, AND I WILL HEAL THIER LAND” WE HAVE BECOME SPOILED SELF RIGHTEOUS POEPLE WHO DON’T EVEN DESERVE GOD’S GRACE AND MERCY BUT YET AND STILL MERCY ABOUNDS AND GRACE MUCH MORE ABOUNDS; DOESN’T MATTER WHAT COUNTRY IT IS; WE ARE ALL CALLED TO ACKNOWLEDGE, HUMMBLE OURSELVES, OBEY AND SERVE THE LORD…….

    • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jay

      Ron, it wasn’t W’s foreign policy, it was the establishment’s foreign policy; a foreign policy, btw, comprised of nothing more then “False-flags”.

  • Jimmy The Greek

    Obama and Romney are tools of AIPAC ! And the zionist .

  • RichE

    Mr. Livingston,
    Did you really think you could convince plastic it is a natural substance? Do you like beating your head against the wall? Come to think of it you are a Birther. When’s your birthday Bob? I’m buying you a helmet.

    • Patriot II

      RichE; I’m a “birther” and I am very pround to be Politically Incorrect! (PI) Do you want to see the evidence that shows Obama is not a US Citizen, or are you content to believe the Liberal Mediaand keep your eyes closed?. Don’t tell me you believe Obama becuase he is a proven Pathalogiocal Fabricator, as everyone on the planet knows by now.,,,,,,,,,,, don’t you agree?

      • RichE

        Yes, I agree, Birthers need helmets.

        • truesoy

          RichE;

          If birthers are right and Obama was able to pull all that that he is accused of, then Obama must be a genius, and therefore I think we better hurry up, before he changes his mind, and re-elect him to another four year term because it is not everyday a genie comes our way..

          Sincerely,
          Truesoy

          • RichE

            truesoy,
            I don’t think a genius would stop at two terms. Where’s the challenge?

            Obama, the genius lawyer, is hired by the Birthers and proves their claim that his BC is invalid, but he produces another BC allowing him to run for president as another person thus becoming the first four term president.

            Now that is Shakespearian.

          • truesoy

            RichE;

            That was a good one…LoL.

            Sincerely,
            Truesoy

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jay

        Obama is not a genius, obama is a well protected and financed puppet. You two are much like obama, except for the protected, and financed part!

        • RichE

          Sorry Jay, you lost me. Are you saying Patriot II and I are of the same assembly line?

        • truesoy

          Jay;
          Maybe you’re right. But if you are then it could be that the ‘birthers’ elevator don’t go passed the second floor. Yeah, I think birthers are a few cans short of a six pack.

          Sincerely,
          Truesoy

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jay

        truesoy, while I personally believe that Mr. Obama is a citizen of the United States, history is unclear if he is a natural born citizen due to the very simple fact he was born a dual citizen.

        It is unclear because there has never been a Supreme Court decision stating that the child of an alien even though born in the United States is a natural born citizen capable of holding the office of President. If you wish we can discuss this, as I am sure this topic is important to millions of Americans.

        Btw, “birthers” are dedicated to the renewal of our constitutional govenment, starting with insuring that the President and Commander in Chief is a natural born citizen.

        • truesoy

          Jay;

          1) No one born in the United States is born a ‘dual citizen’. There is no such horse.
          2) even if born overseas from an american parent he’d be an american; e.g., Romney’s father was born in Mexico, yet, because his parents were americans, he too, was deemed american, so much that he ran for president of the U.S.
          3) don’t allow your bias get in the way of intelligently expressing yourself, with logic and common sense.

          Sincerely,
          Truesoy

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jay

        Assuming that Obama was born in the United States, he was not only born a dual national of the United States and Great Britain, but at present he continues to be such.

        Some maintain that American law on citizenship cannot be subjected to any foreign law. But such an argument does not resolve the question of Obama’s dual nationality, for each nation has the sovereign right to make its own citizenship laws and one nation cannot deny another nation that right.

        This point can be better understood when we consider that McCain was born in Panama to U.S. citizen parents and U.S. citizenship law declared him a U.S. citizen even though he was born in Panama and Panamanian law may have declared him a citizen of Panama.

        Neither Panama nor any other nation questioned the United States’ right to pass a law that gave McCain U.S. citizenship by descent from his parents even though he was born in Panama.

        Great Britain, being a sovereign nation, has the same right as does the United States to pass such citizenship laws. Now let us examine the British law that applies to Obama and his father and which makes Obama a British citizen not only at the time of his birth in 1961 but still today.

        The British Nationality Act of 1948 provides in pertinent part as follows:

        “4. Subject to the provisions of this section, every person born within the United Kingdom and Colonies after the commencement of this Act shall be a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies by birth:

        Provided that a person shall not be such a citizen by virtue of this section if at the time of his birth—

        (a) his father possesses such immunity from suit and legal process as is accorded to an envoy of a foreign sovereign power accredited to His Majesty, and is not a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies; or
        (b) his father is an enemy alien and the birth occurs in a place then under occupation by the enemy.

        5.—(1) Subject to the provisions of this section, a person born after the commencement of this Act shall be a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies by descent if his father is a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies at the time of the birth ….”

        Under the British Nationality Act of 1948, Obama’s father became a British citizen under Section 4 by being born on the soil of an English Colony, Kenya. Under Section 5, when Obama was born in 1961 in Hawaii or some other place, he automatically became a British citizen by descent from his father who was a British citizen under Section 4.

        Obama has deflected attention to his British citizenship by focusing the public’s attention on his former Kenyan citizenship.

        Notwithstanding what Obama may lead the public to believe, this British citizenship is not a type of citizenship that he has since lost. Moreover, this citizenship did not expire with Obama’s 21st birthday nor is it one that had to be registered in any specified period of time.

        Chapter VI, Section 87 of the Kenyan Constitution specifies that: “1. Every person who, having been born in Kenya, is on 11th December, 1963 a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies or a British protected person shall become a citizen of Kenya on 12th December, 1963…2.

        Every person who, having been born outside Kenya. [sic] is on 11th December, 1963 a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies or a British protected person shall. [sic] if his father becomes. [sic] . . . a citizen of Kenya by virtue of subjection (1). [sic] become a citizen of Kenya on 12th December. [sic] 1963.”

        These provisions made Obama’s father and Obama citizens of Kenya, respectively. But neither Kenya’s independence from Great Britain nor the Kenyan Constitution caused Obama to lose his British citizenship with which he was born.

        Obama concedes that his citizenship converted from British to Kenyan but he adds that he then lost this Kenyan citizenship when he did not confirm it upon reaching the age of 21.

        There are no known statements from either Obama or his campaign contending that he eventually lost his British citizenship. Rather, the statements have been that his British citizenship converted to Kenyan citizenship when Kenya obtained its independence from Great Britain in 1963 and that he then lost Kenyan citizenship under the Kenyan constitution and laws when he did not renounce U.S. citizenship at age 21.

        But since Obama never lost his British citizenship, it does not matter that Obama may have lost his Kenyan citizenship as he contends.

        Let us now see how Obama did not lose his British citizenship. The Kenyan Constitution which came into effect in 1963 at Article 97 provides the following:

        “97. Dual citizenship

        1. A person who, upon the attainment of the age of twenty-one years, is a citizen of Kenya and also a citizen of some country other than Kenya shall, subject to subsection (7), cease to be a citizen of Kenya upon the specified date unless he has renounced his citizenship of that other country, taken the oath of allegiance and, in the case of a person who was born outside Kenya made and registered such declaration of his intentions concerning residence as may be prescribed by or under an Act of Parliament.”

        Hence, while the Kenyan Constitution prohibits dual citizenship for adults, it allows dual citizenship for children.

        Kenya’s Constitution does, however, specify that at age 21, Kenyan citizens who possess citizenship in more than one country automatically lose their Kenyan citizenship unless they formally renounce any non-Kenyan citizenship, swear an oath of allegiance to Kenya, and in the case of a person who was born outside Kenya made and registered such declaration of his intentions concerning residence as may be prescribed by or under an Act of Parliament. It may be true that Obama did not take any action to preserve his Kenyan citizenship as was required by the Kenyan constitution. But there is no evidence that Obama ever renounced his British citizenship which he originally acquired at his birth under Section 5 of the British Nationality Act of 1948. Whatever his father may have done regarding his Kenyan and/or British citizenship did not affect Obama’s British citizenship with which Obama was born.

        Hence, under the Kenyan Constitution, Obama presumably lost his Kenyan citizenship by not renouncing his U.S. (assuming he was born in the U.S.) and British citizenships, by not taking an oath of allegiance to Kenya, and by not registering his declaration to take up residence in Kenya. But under British law, he did not lose his British citizenship because he never renounced that citizenship.

        The fact that Obama still has British citizenship is further supported by the following:

        “Under United Kingdom law as it has been since the British Nationality Act, 1948, the acquisition of another nationality by a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies, of whatever age, makes no difference whatever to his status as a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies, and, therefore, he remains a British subject.

        Moreover, it is not possible, under United Kingdom law, for the nationality of a child who is a citizen of the United Kingdom and Colonies to be changed by the decision of his parents.

        Only the child, when he reaches the age of 21, can renounce his citizenship of the United Kingdom and Colonies if he is then in possession of another nationality, but during the child’s minority neither the child nor his parents can do anything to forfeit his birthright of British nationality.”

        Children Bill [Lords], HC Deb 27 June 1958 vol 590 cc743-830.

        “It is now the law that all persons born in the United Kingdom or its Colonies, or in countries which were Colonies at the time when they were born, have British nationality whether they are legitimate or illegitimate. . . .

        Also, it is part of our law that children of a British male born abroad can have British nationality.”

        British Nationality, HC Deb 16 July 1963 vol 681 cc341-3.

        Additionally, if one examines the British Nationality Act of 1981, there is nothing there which shows that Obama, once having the British citizenship that he acquired by descent from his father at the time of his birth, automatically lost it at age 21.

        On the other hand, the act contains provisions concerning “declaration of renunciation” at Section 10, 12, and 13. Not that doing so would make Obama an Article II “natural born Citizen,” there is no evidence that Obama ever filed any “declaration of renunciation” of his British citizenship.

        What does this mean? Under the Kenyan Constitution, Obama is presumably no longer a Kenyan citizen because he did not renounce at age 21 his British citizenship and his U.S. citizenship (assuming he was born in the U.S.).

        Obama is still however a British citizen not only under English common law (in the words of Coke and Blackstone, a natural-born subject of the United Kingdom) but also under British citizenship statutes.

        Neither Kenya’s 1963 constitution nor any statute erased the consequences of the British common law and nationality statutes that were in effect at the time of Obama’s and his father’s birth.

        Obama’s continuing British citizenship is further confirmed by English law which provides that persons born in countries which were Colonies at the time when they were born are still British citizens. Hence, Obama continues to be a British citizen despite Kenya’s independence and new constitution.

        This all leads to the question of how can Obama be an Article II “natural born Citizen” if he was at birth both a U.S. citizen (assuming he was born in the U.S.) and a British citizen which alone disqualifies him from having that status?

        But to make matters worse, Obama continues to be a British citizen at a time that he is currently the President of the United States.

        Can we reasonably conclude that the Founding Fathers, who had just fought a war with Great Britain and who did not want a foreigner to occupy the Office of President, would have allowed a British citizen, who carries that status not only from birth but also to the time he occupies the Office, to be President of the United States and Commander in Chief of its Military?

        Another question is how can a would-be President and Commander in Chief of the Military with current dual citizenship obtain a security clearance which he
        would need to access classified U.S. government information needed by him to carry out the sensitive functions of that Office?

        The “natural born citizen” clause of our U.S Constitution requires that both of the child’s parents be U.S. citizens at the time of birth:

        http://puzo1.blogspot.ca/2009/09/natural-born-citizen-clause-requires.html

        • truesoy

          Jay;

          That is a mouthfull you’ve got there.
          But if by some crazy aidea what you believe was to be true, then more than have the people of the United States would be citizens of another country, and not just McCain, but also Romney, since his father was born in Mexico and therefore would be disqualified from ascending to the presidency of the United States.
          I suggest you take an aspirin and call the doctor in the morning.

          Sincerely,
          Truesoy

    • r.p.

      Although I dislike answering a question posed to editor personally. This “bait” had so much stink to it, I couldn’t resist. Then again, maybe you know something I don’t know. Like maybe there was some ancient civilization that three or four hundred million years ago pumped their black sludgy waste into the ground for no other reason but to get rid of it. And then we came along and discovered their dump sites. “WOW!!!” We said: “How did all this unnatural black gooey stuff get down here?”….Or maybe we realized that this “black crude” was the result of a natural phenomena and a by-product of all the carbon based organisms that have been living on this planet for approximately one billion years. And maybe we discovered that this elongated polymer could also be extracted from all living organisms which now reside on this planet. That does include us also, you know. “Natural as corn starch”

      • RichE

        Rr.p.
        Sorry, my bad, I keep forgetting conservatives are literalists.
        How about “Sour’s Ear to Silk Purse”?

      • r.p.

        Golly-gee RichE!!! Is your head getting ready to explode! Too much to think about so you resort to babbling. Take a break and go out and smell the flowers. Clear your mind and get rid of the automaton sound bytes that are cluttering it.

        • RichE

          “babbling” Golly-gee r.p. I didn’t mean to dumb it down that much.

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jay

        RichE says: Sorry, my bad, I keep forgetting conservatives are literalists.

        As opposed to progressives, being relativists?

        • RichE

          Jay,
          Not absolute relativism. I believe there’s a line, but sometimes you have to cross it to find it.

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jay

        RichE, you just provided the correct definition of “Relativism”.

    • r.p.

      Now as for Obama!! The only thing “natural” about him is the lies that come out of his pie hole. The evidence is overwhelming.

      • RichE

        r.p.
        1+1 doesn’t have to add up to 2 in your head. It’s interesting how you cope with that.

      • r.p.

        RichE: Citing more autonomous sound bytes that have no bearing on the topic neither support your arguments or reinforce them. You have no idea what’s in my head, yet alone yours.

  • RichE

    Friends, Romans, countrymen, lend me your ears:
    I come to bury Bush, not to praise him.
    The evil that men do lives after them;
    The good is oft interred with their bones;

    Your followers think you Brutus Mr. Livingston, I think you Anthony.

    • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jay

      I think you Judas.

      • RichE

        Jay,
        Well, higher learning isn’t for everyone. Brutus justified his actions by vilifying Caesar then Anthony undid it. Typical Shakespeare.

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jay

        Don’t you mean; learning while high?

  • Deerinwater

    I’m in total agreement Mr. Livingston while we might disagree as to why.

    As I see it, ~ the very same powers that put the wind under 43′s wings will supply Mitt Romney all the lift that is at their disposal in exchange for his ear.

    There has been little to no change in GOP leaderships ambitions at the top, they want the same things they wanted 1984. ~~~~~ More of everything, including that big stack of money we call Social Security.

    Today they tease us with notions of privatization of everything which according to them will somehow make government smaller, taxes less and “free markets” would reconcile as supple and demand forces will do their magic. ~ Sounds great doesn’t it! I like it!

    But here is what will be the final end results to such a great plan even if we are very careful, Americans will trade one thief for two thieves and government will get no smaller but it will take Americans 10 years to realize just how bad they have been screwed over once again. There will be no one around to hang or tar & feather and there will be no going back.

    • r.p.

      You paint a dismal, scary, and true picture. What are you? Some kind of realist or something????

  • JerryWheelerSaidThis

    MeMe sez:

    “We shouldn’t have gone into Viet Nam, but that was basically started by President Kennedy, when the North Vietnamese fired on the Turner Joy (missing it by miles), but it gave Kennedy and subsequently, Lyndon Johnson an excuse to engage in a war.”

    Do you actually think a pissed off Oswald went to all that trouble (and I might add, ingeniously orchestrated covert assassination) because he didn’t like Kennedy? How naive.. Fact is, just like the Russian nuclear scare, he was going to resolve the Vietnam incident diplomatically but the warmongers didn’t want another U.S.S.R. embarrassment so they put THEIR plan into action where the protection was lax, the mapped out schedule was changed at the last moment, messy investigation where detectives without gloves were picking up evidence everywhere and if the patsy couldn’t do the job then plan ‘B’ was sure to succeed. Then the warmongers ganged up on Johnson (who vowed to follow JFK’s policies) and forced him into a war by assuring him it wouldn’t last two months.. Read up on THAT and learn a bit.. It’s o you tube if you can wade through the rhetoric without bogging down.

    “And it’s interesting that Richard Nixon ended it, though he never got credit for that.”.. Ended it my ass hairs! He prolonged it.. In his fist shot (after several losses where he vowed to retire from politics like some spoiled brat but never really meant it) he promised to end the ‘conflict’ within two years if elected, well the people believed him.. made him the POTUS and as the time to leave expired what did he do? Used the very same war as a platform for his SECOND term.. The people again believed him so, as not to be remembered as the ‘lying’ president, at the given time he PULLED us out with our tails between our legs and left the Viet’s to fend for themselves.. Yeah, he ended the war alright but definitely not in the most patriotic, moralistic way. Then because of his treachery (even toward his own ilk) they came up with a scheme to rid the white house of a proven crook. You would have had to have lived through those turbulent times and if you did (revealing your age) then your eyes were definitely closed and your ears were plugged by ear phones.

    • http://Yahoo Maynard

      Wrong. Jesse Ventura’s book about 63 documents the government does not want you to see, clearly shows through Freedom of Information documents that JFK was ordering our troops out by the end of ’63. That and other things, like standing up to the CIA and the Fed got him ASSASSINATED. The fatal bullet hit him in the right temple and exited the back of his skull. The Parkland hospital doctors all demonstrated that by placing their hands on the back of their skulls. Pieces of JFK’s skull were recovered on the street behind the limousine.

      • http://Yahoo Maynard

        I forgot to mention that in the government’s cover-up autopsy, the drawing of JFK’s skull ,shows a small entry wound in the back of his head. This fakery proves government involvement.
        They also shot RFK, the fatal wound entering his skull point blank behind his right ear. At no time was Sirhan Sirhan that close or behind RFK. This enabled Nixon to win in ’68. RFK would have beat him in a landslide and enabled Nixon to drop more bombs on neutral Cambodia at Christmas than were dropped in Japan. Merry Christmas!

  • chuckb

    jerry wheeler, i lived through those times and your conception is warped. apparently you don’t want to talk about the democrat congress and senate, you don’t want to remember the likes of ted kennedy, leahy, carl levin, you talk about “ilk” these are the people that shaped our departure from vietnam. nixon had no choice. too bad, some of us where there and know the real truth. sell your oswald conspiracy to someone else, it’s shear baloney.

  • revnowwhilewecan

    Okay. One last post before Vegas……
    Remember. al-Assad was the peoples choice. F@#$ what you heard from the lying ass mainstream media. Syria had a higher percentage of people vote Assad into office than did Obama in ’08 and that’s truth.

    I’ll be on t.v. with a Ron Paul shirt on!

    • truesoy

      revnowwhilewecan;

      ….and that guy in North Korea could get elected with more votes than Jesus could. I also hear that Castro was confirmed with 98% of the vote the last time they had a referendum.
      So what’s your point?

      Sincerely,
      Truesoy

      • revnowwhilewecan

        trueso,
        My point is that there is a proven track record of the US removing heads of state who don’t play ball and replacing them with radicals whom agree with anything the US says until they get power. My point is lets not spend American lives to replace leaders whom we will later spend more American lives to replace yet again. I thought you being a big Anderson Cooper fan you might like saving American lives but reading a lot of your posts I just realized you march to the beat of NATO policy. The point is that if you believe in the American “democratic process” (Bwahaha), then you are asleep and have NO business whatsoever pointing out flaws in other voting processes because you cannot recognize the ones here at home.

        My final point is that please, don’t be that good neighborhood cop that responds to domestic calls, breaking up fights, taking people to jail, splitting up families and then go home and slap your wife around. This is way of American foreign policy.

        • truesoy

          revnow…

          Look, I don’t think we should get involve either in other countries affair by our military might or otherwise, unless they represent a very genuine threat to us, because as you said the next guy in line will be no different from the last guy. And I agree with you on that.

          Sincerely,
          Truesoy

  • Patriot

    Romney, with 5 sons, none of whom is in the military, will be the one sending YOURS, NOT HIS, sons and daughetrs, husbands and wives and cousins, nieces and nephews to fight wars in foreign countries, if he is president. It is time to bring these warmongers to task, although they will do nothing, who sacrifice OURS but not their OWN children.

    • Joe Hammond

      Romney is just another “chickenhawk” like Rush and Sean; and Karl Rove and Norbert; and Cheney and Wolfowitcz….without a draft (which should include women) we have no control on the unhealthy for the middle-class desire to be a “war president” that seems to be an addiction problem of the Neo-Cons and their wealthy masters from Wall Street……….but war profits are numero uno in the Empire……

      • http://Yahoo Maynard

        Joe. You are so right. Why sell comodities when war gets you much bigger profits? Plus, with the volunteer army, the people don’t get as concerned about the men and some women who die for their trumped up attacks for “freedom.” Along with their “freedom” comes kidnapping people off the street, prolonged detention, torture, massive destruction of innocents’ property and lives, disruption of food supplies, education, business, ancient artifacts, cultures. Get ready for another round if Romney, Rove et al get in. If they can disrupt Iran they will be able to more completely monopolize oil supplies and the prices will skyrocket, giving the oil companies even higher profits than their already record take.

  • http://nowebsite Robert

    The Bible sayes,the scarlet whore that sits on many waters will be destroyed. That couldn’t be the Usa, because we only have military inabout 3/4′s of the world. It also states that if man will turn from his evel ways I will hear from Heaven and heal yor nation. nay dont vote for Ron Paul that might just give us a chance .

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