Comments Subscribe to Personal Liberty News Feed Subscribe to Personal Liberty
 

Restoring The American Dream

January 7, 2011 by  

Restoring The American Dream

“Don’t talk to me about slowing down government growth,” he said emphatically. “We don’t want the government to grow slower; we want to cut it back dramatically.”

I was speaking with Robert Ringer, the author of several bestselling books. His latest is called Restoring the American Dream and if you care at all about the fight for freedom — and you must, or why would you be reading this column? — then you definitely want to own a copy. That’s good, because at the end of this piece I’ll tell you how to get a free copy. Even better, it will be personally autographed by the author.

What is the American Dream? How has it changed since our parents’ and our grandparents’ time? And what will it take to restore it to what it once was? Ringer has some very specific thoughts on the subject.

“The American Dream is about freedom. It’s about liberty. It’s about the opportunity to succeed or fail according to your own efforts and ability,” he told me. “It’s about self-responsibility and self-reliance. It’s being able to keep the fruits of your labors. In short, it’s about the individual’s right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness, without interference from others.”

According to Ringer, the American Dream began when the Founders of this country did something unique in history — something that had never happened before. They declared that the people were above their government; that the people they elect are their servants and not the other way around.

“You can argue about when things started to go wrong and who was most responsible,” Ringer said. “I blame Teddy Roosevelt for much of it, when he formed the American Progressive Party. Woodrow Wilson speeded things up and then they really went off the rails under FDR, followed by Lyndon Johnson’s Great Society schemes.

“Things slowed down a bit under Ronald Reagan, but most people don’t realize that the Federal government continued to grow during his presidency. It’s gotten so bad that many people think it’s a victory if we can just slow down the growth of government. I don’t accept that for a second. And I’m happy to say that many other people feel the same, as the Tea Party movement has shown.”

So I asked him, Are you a supporter of the Tea Party movement?

“I’m a big fan of the Tea Party,” he replied. “Frankly, it is something that I never thought I’d see in my lifetime. It is a truly spontaneous uprising against big government. At the biggest rally I attended, there were more than half a million people. Of course the media never admitted how large it was; they talked in terms of tens of thousands, but it was many, many more than that.

“Our enemies try to make it sound as though these are all cranks and crazies and some kind of dangerous extremists, but nothing could be further from the truth. They are just like your family, your friends and your neighbors. They are everyday Americans who got fed up with what they saw happening to their country. At the rallies I attended, I never saw a single person do or say anything inappropriate.”

Well, they certainly had an impact in the elections last month. But what happens next? Do you really believe the new Congress will not just slow the growth of government, but actually beginning cutting it back?

“I have a little bit of hope but a lot concern,” was his cautious reply. “Certainly there are many people in Congress — Jim DeMint, Paul Ryan, Michele Bachmann, Ron Paul and now his son Rand — who are really going to make that effort.

“I hope I’m wrong, but I’ve predicted for a long time that there is going to be a civil war in the Republican Party. I don’t believe you’re ever going to convert pseudo-conservatives like Lindsey Graham, John McCain and Richard Lugar. So if Congress doesn’t act decisively — if they start compromising and back-tracking — I think you’re going to see an enormous backlash.”

What will happen then, I asked?

“I think you’ll see an even bigger bloodbath in the 2012 elections,” Ringer said. “And out of that will come a new political party — a true Tea Party party, if you will.”

Ringer was very clear about how demanding this new political force should be. “No compromise!” is his battle cry. “For years the progressives have gotten away with always promoting more government. When they’re in power, as they have been for the past two years, there’s a mad dash to the left. But even when so-called conservatives hold the reins, somehow government keeps spending more, taxing more, and growing bigger. That has got to stop.”

One of the most encouraging signs Ringer told me wasn’t what’s happening in Washington, but the dramatic changes that are taking place at the state level. “Jan Brewer, the governor of Arizona, is definitely someone I want in a foxhole with me. I think she’s absolutely terrific. And there are a bunch of Jan Brewers ready to fight the Feds.

“There are what — 28 states now — that have sued the Federal government to block Obamacare? And that’s just the beginning. I think you’re going to hear a lot about the nullification movement in the coming months and years — the argument that the states can ‘just say no’ to the Federal government when it gets too bossy.”

So the good news is; resistance is growing. Advocates of smaller government have never been more determined or more active. But what happens, I asked the bestselling author, if Congress really does start cutting some government benefits? You’ve got a lot of union members and government workers who will be very unhappy. Are you worried about that?

“Absolutely,” he declared. “There will be violence, I’m convinced of it. Look at what happened in France when the president proposed raising the retirement age to 62. Or in Greece, when it became obvious that government couldn’t continue its spendthrift ways.

“The Left and violence have always gone hand in hand. Look at what happened in Pittsburgh during the G20 meetings. In fact, if you want to know what the Left is up to, just look at what they’re accusing the right of doing. They accused the Tea Party supporters of being radicals, racists and dangerous extremists. Happily, their smears didn’t work, as the last election demonstrated. But I’m very worried that what they can’t get via the ballot box, they’ll try to get through violence and threats.

“Remember, some people will kill for money. So if you tell some government worker or union member (and more and more often they’re the same thing) that the party is over — that he’s not going to get $150,000 or more a year when he retires at 55 — you bet there will be trouble. I’m afraid it’s inevitable.”

Ringer had a lot more to say about the battle to restore our lost liberty. But you’ll have to get his book, Restoring the American Dream, to savor it all. That’s easy to do, since just about every bookstore in the country carries it, not to mention Amazon.com.

But here’s an even better deal. You can receive a free hardbound copy of Restoring the American Dream, personally autographed by the author. To learn how you can get your autographed copy, plus more bonus features, click here.

There you’ll find plenty of ammunition to help you become a more effective fighter in the battle for liberty. I hope you’ll take advantage of it. Because the price of not winning this war is too high to contemplate.

Until next time, keep some powder dry.

–Chip Wood

Chip Wood

is the geopolitical editor of PersonalLiberty.com. He is the founder of Soundview Publications, in Atlanta, where he was also the host of an award-winning radio talk show for many years. He was the publisher of several bestselling books, including Crisis Investing by Doug Casey, None Dare Call It Conspiracy by Gary Allen and Larry Abraham and The War on Gold by Anthony Sutton. Chip is well known on the investment conference circuit where he has served as Master of Ceremonies for FreedomFest, The New Orleans Investment Conference, Sovereign Society, and The Atlanta Investment Conference.

Facebook Conversations

Join the Discussion:
View Comments to “Restoring The American Dream”

Comment Policy: We encourage an open discussion with a wide range of viewpoints, even extreme ones, but we will not tolerate racism, profanity or slanderous comments toward the author(s) or comment participants. Make your case passionately, but civilly. Please don't stoop to name calling. We use filters for spam protection. If your comment does not appear, it is likely because it violates the above policy or contains links or language typical of spam. We reserve the right to remove comments at our discretion.

Is there news related to personal liberty happening in your area? Contact us at newstips@personalliberty.com

  • Jeremy Leochner

    The first thing I noticed was the statment “The Left and violence have always gone hand in hand”. I am not an expert in ideology but my basic understanding is “The Left” is a general term for liberals, progressives and anyone whose ideology lands on the left side of the political spectrum. I apologize Mr Wood but your statment sounds like a suggestion that all people on the left are violent. The reason I say this is the term “The Left” is a very broad and general term that implicates and suggests many different groups and many millions of people. And since your statment is the left and violence go hand in hand it sounds like an accusation against anyone on the left or against left leaning ideology. I say this Mr Wood primarily because in your post you denounce those who disagree with you politically for smears against the tea party. The tea party is not filled with radicals or extremists but neither is the left side of the political spectrum. I am a liberal social democrat. I have centrist left leanings. I dont support the idea of massive government power but I see the authority of the government as something useful against those with money and power who might use their influence to take advantage of or hurt the people without wealth or power. I am entirely against violence and prefer to comprimise and debate. I have numerous liberal friends and I have seen many others on “The Left” who are kind people who are simply trying to improve their country in a way they think is right. And I know they would never condone or support violence. My point Mr Wood is you have every right to disagree with those with different views as you should. But please dont resort to portraying political debates as contests between good guys and bad guys where one side is the bad one and the other side must therefore be the good one as I believe you are.

    • http://naver sook young

      Ecclesiastes chapter 10 verse 2

      “The wise man’s heart is at his right hand; but a fool’s heart at his left.”

      Even God says that being conservative is wise and being liberal is foolish. Thank you

      Sook Young
      Wife of the Samurai

      • http://PersonalLibertyDigest Linda

        Thank you guess he never read world history and what it did to Germany, Russia, to name a couple countries.I am talking liberal leanings.

        • bob wire

          a~hmm? Oh Really? So Adolph,Gobble and their SS storm troopers were a bunch of peace loving, lefty tree huggers with unique ideas on how to acquiring and distributing wealth and Stalin was their greatest fan?

          • Lomax

            There is no difference between Nazis ans Commies. Adolph Hitler mentioned this fact in his book. Both are tyranny and that is that.

          • DaveH

            Adolf Hitler was head of the NAZIS — The National Socialist German Workers’ Party.
            Quit spreading myths, Bob, and learn some reality:
            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_Party

          • bob wire

            hmm? well that goes a long way to explain their fondness for each other, since they had so much in common and shared the same values and principals!

            Leaving me to assume that the Tea Party simple enjoys their “tea” or they might have chosen a more befitting “LABEL” that better represents them and the principals they champion?

            or

            The Tea Party is wanting to be see as a savage, ambiguously cloaked organized force, showing a willingness to commit civil disobedience to protest the dominion of ruling government.

            So you folks “label” away ~ and draw your lines in the sand for all to know and understand. ~ You must wear the label to gain entry into the mind and be accepted.

            This overwhelming pretense restricts your very thought process and has you like a dog chasing it’s tail.

            If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck and quacks like a duck, I call it a duck, regardless what it claims to be.

            Hitler was no socialist but a fascist, it’s not uncommon to wish to see and speak of ones self in the most flattering of terms.

          • TIME

            Bob,
            I will explain this yet again, The Nazi’s & Marxist / Communist are in fact one in the same.
            The NSDAP stands for the “National Socilist German Workers Party.”
            In Russia they were the “Soviet National Socialist Workers Party,” so other the word “German” even the names are the same.
            And in Germany pre 1936 when the German Communist were folded into the Nazi party they become good little Nazi’s keep in mind that {only the wacked out nuts that were just to stupid were sent to camps.}
            In plain words the ones that just could not grasp they were the same thing, that would be about than 2%.

            The facts are really quite clear a Nazi and Marxist both share the same base thats called a “Socialism” ~ thus no matter whom lays claim to there being differant in what they believe and what they carry out in actions, they are in fact “one in the same.” All are in fact Socilist. How easy is that to grasp?

            Contrary to the Rewritten rhetoric Post WW II by “The Progressive movment who wish the mass’s to remain ignorant” to the {TRUTH,} these two ideologies are in fact 100% in unison.
            Thus there is “NO DIFFERANCE.”

            Its no differant than if you have a scrambled egg or a plain egg Omelet, they are both eggs with a tad of water.
            Is that easy enough to grasp?

            Look I have spent countless hours researching this very venue, one of my hobbies is European History. There are few on this planet that have done the study I have in this venue.

          • Dale on the left coast

            Bob . . . wally-mart is having a sale today . . . they are selling “Clues” . . . why don’t you go and get one!!!
            Uncle Adolph was a devout Socialist . . . he is an amazing life parallel to the chosen “Won” . . .

          • JeffH

            Thank you TIME and DaveH. Bob, you might want to check out this link as a comparison to some very similar ideologies of the liberal left, the “Nazi Party” and socialists. The similarities between the National Socialist (Nazi) platform and the modern liberal/socialist agenda are truely astonishing.
            http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1141684/posts

          • DaveH

            I don’t care if they call themselves Left-Wingers, Right-Wingers, Socialists, Communists, Fascists, Christians, Atheists, or anything else. I don’t want them running my life. Period.

          • bob wire

            humm? ~ so the only difference is the smell?

            Thanks gentlemen for your input and indulgence.

            It seems that all cats are seen as gray in the dark, light is needed in such dark corners of the mind to illuminate and expose what is actually there. ~ Too many for us, think we know , think we understand, making the enemy ~ us.

            Your concerns are not without merit and I do appreciate such lively debate.

            I really mean that! I enjoy such thoughtful and well constructed banter.

            What we are attempting to address is nether horse shoes or hand grenades, ~ getting close is a “no score” ~ We must be exacting and accurate, there is no slop or margin for error.

            To ever turn this boat around will require time and tremendous effort and not a job for the weak of heart or those in a huge rush to see quick results.

            Taken back “power” is a very difficult thing to do and not suffer great losses in the process. I’m not willing to see great losses at this point, not yet.

            Believe it or not ~ I’m on your side. Over the months, you have earned my respect.

          • eddie47d

            Since you all love throwing your odd couple comparisons around about Nazi’s,Fascists,Communists and Socialism and put them into one basket. Since every country on this planet has some form of Socialism within it’s structure,including the USA then all nations (100%) are communistic or have little nazi’s running around.On the other hand every nation that has any private run business or trades with other nations should be considered Capitalistic. Since the majority of countries have somewhat free trade then we are all capitalistic countries. (Even North Korea trades with China). We all barter for something in order to get something back. In reality there are no true capitalistic or communistic countries but hundreds of Socialistic countries. Switzerland is not a true capitalistic country because they live off of other peoples money(banking).Cuba trades freely with numerous countries so they are not a true Communistic “utopia”. The world is a mixed bag but those who “make a living” out of bashing Socialism are against everyone. They like no one and are arrogant about everyone else. We (the world) have extreme corrupt capitalists who want to control the lives of all around them. They sit on their thrones like gods and throw the world scrapes. On the other side we an even darker element in corrupt communists. They also sit on their thrones and create misery for all they touch. I actually met about a half a dozen American communists back in the 60′s. There never has been many of them and they were nice people. I still wouldn’t endorse what they had to say(it all sounds good).Most think they are fighting for freedom and feel strong about their cause. I kept asking them how they were going to be different than how the USSR turned out. Never had a legitimate answer. I told them they have to embrace freedom after the Revolution or that battle for freedom meant nothing. Now in America we have capitalistic greed that is unprecedented,unwarranted,vicious,has a poisonous stench to it and swallows all in it’s path.

          • Vicki

            The fault mode is the 1 dimension that are most often chosen for the “political” spectrum with some folk on the “left” and some on the “right”. Libertarians realized long ago that there are at least 2 dimensions and as such they use the “diamond” test to try and describe the differences.

            I however think that we can and should look in an entirely different single dimension with some on the “left” and some on the “right” of the resulting single line. This is the dimension of government and this little video does a GREAT job of explaining the dimension and the signposts on it. The video even confirms much of Eddie47d’s claim about all the governments currently on earth.

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4r0VUybeXY

          • DaveH

            The stench I smell is coming from greedy Unionists who would rather drive their companies into the ground than accept a fair wage.
            There is crony-capitalism, to be sure, but we could cure that easily with Free Markets. The Unionists, although they love to whine about “Greedy” companies, would have none of that because they need that same Big Government to help them take the companies’ money through what should be unlawful coercive practices but are nevertheless supported by their Big Government bully boys.

          • eddie47d

            You’re too obsessed with union bashing or liberal bashing or whatever Dave H. You are oblivious to everyone else’s right and are one of those “it’s my way or the highway” types. You are correct in fighting for limited government in our Republic but beyond that you have become egotistical.

          • JeffH

            eeedddiiieee, what is most apparent is your obsessive mindless defense of the indefensable Marxist in charge. You hoot and holler, constantly making mindless and childish comments, name calling at anyone that happens to say something you don’t agree with. You can’t even decipher the fact that the majority here don’t even support the Republicans and can’t even tell the difference between a conservative or a Republican or a staunch libertatrian. Your “modus operandi” is all assumtive and factless and filled with very basic generalities.
            In other words eeedddiiieee, you’re so full of it your eyes are brown.

          • eddie47d

            Jeff H.; You never cease to amaze me with more personal attacks and childish comments. You and Dave H. love the name calling then accuse others of doing it. You say “The majority here don’t even support the Republicans and can’t even tell the difference,Etc” There are changed attitudes but to say they aren’t supporting or voting Republican is a crock.The elections proved that the majority of Republicans still vote for their party. That includes Conservatives and Tea Party folks. So what, but it only proves that you are the one who is “full of it”. Besides there is no” Marxist in charge”. More made up poppycock from the extreme right and you are the one making assumptions.You may someday drown in your lies and many distortions. You are so full of hate you will use any tactic to champion your cause and spread confusion. You are worse than anything that Alinsky wrote about and that is not a compliment.

          • JeffH

            eeedddiiieee, just a tad upset huh? the truth hurts doesn’t it! Waaaa, waaa, waaa!

          • Bruce D.

            I have to congratulate Time for his excellent post and Chip with another excellent article. My viewpoints of both pessimism and optimism lie very closely with that of Robert Ringer. There should always be optimism in the face of any adversity as without it little can be accomplished.

          • kate8

            BTW, bob wire – The TeaParty is named in honor of the original TeaParty held in Boston Harbor, protesting the unfair taxation by the King of England.

          • Denniso

            And just like the modern ‘tea party’, the first on ewas also a fraud. Read some actual history and you’ll see that it was done as a ploy in a turf battle between tea importers who were fighting for the colonies business. There were so little taxes paid back then that the supposed overtaxed reason for the tea party is a joke.

          • Vigilant

            Denniso says, “And just like the modern ‘tea party’, the first one was also a fraud. Read some actual history and you’ll see that it was done as a ploy in a turf battle between tea importers who were fighting for the colonies business. There were so little taxes paid back then that the supposed overtaxed reason for the tea party is a joke.”

            There you go again, Denniso. You must be reading “A People’s History of the United States,” Eric Bischoff’s favorite reference, and written by the outed communist Howard Zinn.

            “…in a turf battle between tea importers who were fighting for the colonies business.”

            There was no fight to be had between importers, son. King George and the Parliament had outlawed the importation of ANY tea except British tea. That’s called tyranny. Were John Hancock and others smuggling tea in to avoid this tyrannical edict? You bet your life they were.

            “There were so little taxes paid back then that the supposed overtaxed reason for the tea party is a joke.”

            Overtaxation was not at issue, and I’d be interested to know where you got that misinformation. The price of British tea was actually lower than the tea imported otherwise, and the tax was very small. The issue was one of representation. The colonists might have even acceded to the taxation if they had representation in Parliament, but they did not.

            Calling the original Boston Tea Party “a fraud” indicates a deep-seated hatred of this country that I find offensive. It’s not just that you believe the lies of revisionist historians, it’s that you obviously enjoy believing them.

          • DaveH

            So, Eddie, what do you think of the Sarah Palin’s Alaska series?

          • bob wire

            “eddie47d says:
            January 7, 2011 at 5:50 pm

            Since you all love throwing your odd couple comparisons around about Nazi’s,Fascists,Communists and Socialism and put them into one basket. ”

            NO! eddie, not me ~ I don’t do that ~ and it erks me that so many do! and feel they are accurate and correct.

            You are failing to follow my message if you think that. ~ that’s okay, Dave often misses my message as well or just enjoys attempting to twist it.

            It’s perhaps my writing style, I’m sorry.

            1600 to 1800 Eurasia was a proving or disproving ground for hundreds of hybrid forms of government, using all those label and many more! Even Catherine of Russia toyed with the idea of a Constitutional Monarch. The word “liberal” was thrown around a lot even back then. This is a very rich period in modern world history as empires rose to the challenges of dominion, security, control of the masses, new awaking in science and neighboring threats. ~ They were using marriage as a tool for politics, they were using everything they could use!

            These posters are throwing these labels around like sloppy painters, few really know what they at talking about as they attempt to convey their thoughts and judgments.

            These labels are not all that tangible and hold a true known quantity.

            They are only “words” ~ words with meaning that vary as much as the people that speak them. There is just too much being assumed with a shallow view.

          • Vicki

            Bob Wire writes:
            “(eddie47d says:): “Since you all love throwing your odd couple comparisons around about Nazi’s,Fascists,Communists and Socialism and put them into one basket. ”

            Bob Wire: “They are only “words” ~ words with meaning that vary as much as the people that speak them. There is just too much being assumed with a shallow view.”

            If you want to communicate to those who Bob Wire says have such different definitions it is good to provide cites to back up your assertions.

        • EddieW

          The DHS and FBI are pushing us even now into a Police State…they are doing exactly what both Hitler & Stalin did…asking people to spy on their neighbors, from there it’s a short jump to total Police state, and the loss of ALL Freedoms…yet…Americans are rolling over and playing dead!!! Walmart is even pushing the Americans spying on American program, the kids in our schools are also asked to spy!!
          They will make very subserviant slaves!!!

          • DaveH

            Convincing children to spy on their parents was a common event in the Communist USSR.

          • JC

            Gov. Jesse Ventura did an expose of an FBI sponsored group called Infragard. They are basically a group of business owners who are in place to report Un patriotic or suspicious activities.
            The Nazi’s called those “Block Captains”.

          • DaveH
          • DaveH
          • DaveH

            The GDP of the “workers paradise” is about $10,000 per person.
            Contrast that with the GDP of the United States which is about $45,000 per person.
            Isn’t equality wonderful?

          • denniso

            We all know which side in this country has been stoking the fires of violence for the past 10 yrs. During the last election cycle some Democratic workers were shot and killed. Now we have a Democratic Rep in Tucson shot and at least 6 people killed in the tragedy,one of the dead a 9 yr old girl. The inflamatory language of the right is responsible for these killings as they shout repeatedly that we need revolution,that ballots may not be enough,that liberals are traitors,that Obama is a marxist. All of that and more makes up much of the comments on this site and that’s all it takes to trigger and unbalanced person to take up violence. Everyone here and elsewhere who uses such language and makes thinly veiled threats on political leaders shares in the blame for these killings.

            Shameful for the rightwing extremists,Arizona and this country. Six dead, a little girl, and maybe more among the injured. Disgusting!

          • http://?? Joe H.

            Denniso,
            That would be very typical of you to want to stiffle freedom of speech! You say without ANY proof that the rights “hate” speech caused these deaths when for all you know these whack jobs would have attacked without any outside influence! I suppose that you think that the whackjob that killed John Lennon did so from right wing rhetoric??? Maybe the people that crucified Jesus did so from right wing rhetoric as well?? I am so tired of you left wing goofballs always blaming someone else for your short commings! You guys will never understand the meaning of two words, PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY!

          • Denniso

            You’re really not worth talking to…you really are clueless or dumb if you don’t think that words have serious consequences and that unstable people can act on what is repeated over and over about ‘enemies’ of the country and liberals being equated w/ Marxism and Communism and being called traitors to the country. THe rightwing has been demonizing the left like that for yrs, and that has an effect on people,especially unbalanced people.

          • libertytrain

            Denniso, “words are the source of much misunderstanding” – there will always be nut cases, always people who don’t know what personal responsibility means. But if we are denied the ability to speak or write or write books because someone might kill someone because they heard spoken words or read words that they then re-interpreted in their own twisted mind – what would be the point of living — all freedom would be gone.

          • kate8

            Denniso – You are responding to the shootings EXACTLY the way the PTB has counted on.

            This is all about going after conservatives, declaring them enemies of the state, restricting free speech and banning guns.

            You play your useful idiot role so well. One would almost think you are on the payroll or, at least, a member of one of the leftist anti-America groups.

          • Denniso

            I would guess that I’m more in favor of free speech than most here who fake it. But words can be used to incite riot and violence,which is a crime. Just as we can’t libel or slander w/o legal penalties and we can’t yell fire in a theatre,we have to take responsibility for the tone and words that we use in a society w/ thousands of unstable people w/ easy access to high powered weapons. None of us has to be perfectly tolerant of anyone,it’s a free country…but going a step further than lack of tolerance and using language that actually stirs up hatred and violence is far different.

          • kate8

            There has been far more inciting rhetoric coming from the Left than the Right, my dear.

            The Left has outright called for people to be killed, by name. And the tone is generally far more hateful than anything Sarah Palin said.

            She was only speaking about defeating the Congresswoman in the election, not calling for violence. Everyone knew that and, furthermore, there is NO evidence that the shooter was ever even aware of Sarah’s campaign talk. Why would he be? He was a liberal! He would not be among Palin’s following.

            Before you continue to bash the Right and call for curtailing free speech, I suggest you clean up the vitriol within your own ranks. We have here a case of pot calling kettle black.

          • libertytrain

            And Denniso – who was the first to proclaim yesterday’s schizophrenic killer in Arizona was surely an extreme rightist…before anything even had a chance to be discovered, oh, who? oh yes YOU WERE FIRST POINTING THE FINGERS ON THIS SITE.

        • Dr. Mabuse

          Ok, this is way beyond hilarious,
          Ecclesiastes chapter 10 verse 2
          “The wise man’s heart is at his right hand; but a fool’s heart at his left.”
          Even God says that being conservative is wise and being liberal is foolish.
          Well I would posit that Jesus is a card carrying member of the John Birch Society (with God’s approval of course).

          As far as Herr Schickelgruber being a socialist, well I’ll go along for the ride, but only for this post. But perhaps one of the more erudite amongst you could explain to me why George Herbert Walker, Harriman, Prescott Bush and Rockefeller invested so heavily in the Nazi regime during WWII? Perhaps they had an affinity for Socialists too? Additionally, why did the Dulles boys (Allen and John Foster) pave the way for so many ex Nazis, excuse me ex Socialists, (vis a vis Rheinhard Galen)to gain citizenship in the U.S. after the war?
          Can anyone shed some light on this?

          • kate8

            Dr. Mabuse – It has to do with truth. Politicians have sold out to corporate powers, including the Right, and no longer hold to conservative principles, which are based on biblical teachings.

            Only the masses hold true to their ideologies, whether for better or worse.

            What’s with you lefties going immediately to the Bush’s on EVERYTHING? They, like the left, are part of the political sham, and for some reason, you on the Left just can’t seem to grasp that. Using any Bush to justify your comments just doesn’t hold water. Not many of us on the Right like them either.

            Are you guys really so dense, or simply annoying?

          • Dr. Mabuse

            Well Kate, your erudition speaks for itself.
            In point of fact, I’m just slightly less annoying than you are.
            “What’s with you lefties going immediately to the Bush’s on EVERYTHING? They, like the left, are part of the political sham, and for some reason, you on the Left just can’t seem to grasp that. Using any Bush to justify your comments just doesn’t hold water. Not many of us on the Right like them either.”
            Are you really that brain dead? Ok, for the sake of argument, I’ll goas far left as I can. The Bush family are devil worshipping Luciferians (Skull and Bones) Its no sham my dear, they view you as cattle, canon fodder, a resource to be abused and discarded.
            My comments need no justification as history bears witness to all of my statements. What you can’t grasp is the fact that the Right is just as full of shyt as the Left.

          • kate8

            Dr. Mabuse, If you find me annoying, then I consider that a compliment. Thanks!

            Did you not read what I said? I am well aware of the Luciferian worship of the elite, but it includes elite on both LEFT AND RIGHT. The Clintons and Obama, and pretty much ALL of them at the top, belong also. They claim various smaller groups, but they are all part of the same larger group who dominate most everything and plan to own the world.

            The issue was the scriptural reference to Right and Left, and that was what I was addressing. I didn’t see a need to go into things that I, and many others, have commented on time and again.

            BTW, I wasn’t referring to you, specifically, as being annoying. I was referring to how all you lefties have a irrational obsession with Bush. As if he were someone the Right holds as an icon.

          • Dr. Mabuse

            The interpretation of the scriptural reference is whats so funny.(In a pathetic sort of way) The sheer hubris of Sook is indicative of most of the so called Christians in the country. By the way, I’m a retributionist, and trust me, its to the right of your position. Tell ya what, why don’t you adopt a “lefty” or better yet let a “lefty” marry your daughter. Then you might have more appreciation for a guy. LOL !!!!

          • kate8

            Dr. Mabuse, You, apparently, have an angry, spiteful and nasty attitude. Why you would wish the horror of a lefty son-in-law on me as retribution for some unknown infraction against you is a bit over my head, I’m afraid.

            It’s also apparent that you are yet another who hates and ridicules Christians, and your nasty comments toward sook young were disgusting and uncalled for. You should be so lucky to find such a devoted wife as she. But then, with your disposition, that wouldn’t be likely.

            So just go ahead and keep ridiculing those who quote scripture. You have no understanding of it, nor could you. None of us care what your opinion is, except to feel sad for you, because one day soon you will see how accurate scripture is in its warnings and admonitions.

          • eddie47d

            Most importantly Kate 8 why are you so obsessed with Obama? What is the difference with your comment or my comment. You may know history but you are always running from it or denying it. Both these Presidents are an important part of that history so learn from it.

          • Vicki

            Eddie47d writes:
            “Most importantly Kate 8 why are you so obsessed with Obama? ”

            Maybe cause he is the currently sitting President? Silly of us to notice that.

          • kate8

            eddie – You’re kidding, right?

            I could be obsessed with Clinton, scoundrel that he was. But he’s not in charge now, so what’s the point?

            I actually complained about Bush,too, when he was calling the shots. But how is he relevant now? Obama could have reversed Bush’s mistakes, but he hasn’t. He’s escalated them.

            Obama is clearly focused on destroying our nation and our freedoms. He has done more to collapse America in two years than all the presidents in history. OF COURSE I’M FOCUSED ON HIM.

            That last remark was foolish even for you, eddie.

          • eddie47d

            No I wasn’t kidding but we’ll let it go at that.

        • JeffH

          eeedddiiieee, you sound like a parrot, get some originality going… and how does it feel to know that you support the same ideals of an Adolph Hitler Nazi?

    • BigBadJohn

      The first thing I noticed was the statment “The Left and violence have always gone hand in hand”.
      *****************************************************************
      The biggest difference is that the left go for big publicity stunts that appear on television. Right wing violence usually is one guy trying to kill a liberal that he has a grievance with. Prime example are abortion doctors.

      Byron Williams set out to kill people at Tides Foundation and ACLU. On July 18,

      AZ federal judge threatened, Grijalva office fired on after ruling on

      AZ immigration law. Politico reported in July:

      Man arrested for allegedly threatening to kill Sen. Patty Murray.

      Members of right-wing militia group arrested for allegedly plotting overthrow of the U.S. government

      AP: Man arrested for allegedly making threatening phone calls to Pelosi.

      Threats made against Rep. Betsy Markey.

      Gas line outside the house of the brother of Rep. Tom Perriello was cut.

      Threats made against Rep. Stupak after he voted for final version of health care bill.

      Picture of a noose faxed to Rep. Clyburn.

      etc.etc

      http://mediamatters.org/research/201010260050

      • Lastmanstanding

        Mediamatters is hardly an objective source…

        • eddie47d

          Either is Dave H. anymore. So start challenging him.

          • DaveH

            Do you call your name-calling, personally attacking, illogical comments challenging, Eddie? Dream on.
            I welcome your mindless comments. I can think of no better way to alert people to the Liberal mindset.

          • eddie47d

            That wasn’t a challange to you from me or didn’t you get the drift? There is way too much that has been going over your head lately. Shape up dude.

          • DaveH

            Eddie,
            The only thing going over my head is the crap you sling my way. It will be a cold day in hell before you can outwit me.

          • eddie47d

            …or visa versa

          • DaveH

            If you had any real brains or talent, you wouldn’t have needed to join a Union gang to force an employer to pay you more than you’re worth.

          • eddie47d

            Please Dave quit dumbing down in your silly comments.

          • http://?? Joe H.

            DaveH,
            Actually I have to agree that that last statement was dumbed down. eddie was able to understand it so it must have been!! Good work!!!

        • http://yahoo Bob

          Media Matters, is a correct source.

          • Vigilant

            You mean “a POLITICALLY correct source,” and certainly not much else.

      • DaveH

        Give me a break, John. There are individual wackos in every walk of life. Chip is talking about institutionalized violence, that which is condoned by certain large groups of people against other people.
        One example is the Holodomor:
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor

        • DaveH

          Another was the Holocaust:
          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Holocaust

          Contrary to popular Liberal propaganda, Hitler was a Socialist.

          • eddie47d

            See Dave loves to play the Nazi card and does it often. Hitler was no socialists and it is unfortunate he belittled the name. The true Socialists rejected Hitler in the elections and were appalled he “stole” their title. Dave H. is taking you down a slippery slope of hate and division and apparently could care less that he is not telling the whole truth. Remember there are dozens of Republics in the world that are murderous dictatorships so that word Republic shouldn’t influence you in how you feel about our Republic. We should all be aware of the histories of evil governments but don’t let Dave H. force false historical comparisons or fear upon good judgement.

          • DaveH

            You don’t even know what a Socialist is, Eddie, and you slander me by saying my statements are a lie when in fact they aren’t even my statements. That’s why I provide the links, so people can judge for themselves.
            All you provide, Eddie, is your personal attacks and personal conjecture. Typical Liberal.

          • DaveH

            Eddie says “Hitler was no Socialist”. Maybe, maybe not. Only Hitler would know the true answer for that. But his followers were (unless somebody can convince us that all those members of the Socialist Party weren’t really Socialists but just wanted to belong to a party of that name). And Hitler could have done nothing without his followers, could he?

          • eddie47d

            Dave H. If you don’t believe the threads or even videos that you pull up then you are a hypocrite. Why use information and endorse it if it is not your view. There is no conjecture at all if you are using any information to bolster what YOU are saying. So don’t contradict yourself.

          • DaveH

            Can you even read, Eddie? Apparently not. That’s why my comments aren’t really meant to educate you. You are a hopeless cause. I am merely stopping you from spreading your mindless propaganda on this board to other unwitting dupes.

          • Vicki

            Eddie47d claims that hitler was not a socialist. Then again Eddie has not bothered to say what “socialist” means to Eddie47d. So maybe Eddies hitler wasn’t. Lets look at the hitler that was and what he did and what he said and compare that to what the rest of us think is the definition of “socialist”.

            And let us see if hitler was on the left (total government) or right (no government) or somewhere in the middle.

            Here is some research on the subject
            http://jonjayray.tripod.com/hitler.html

          • eddie47d

            Vickie; The right has nothing to do with “no government” that is anarchy. That is besides the point since since the extreme left and the extreme right are willing to have a police state. Actually there aren’t very many forms of government that wouldn’t endorse said police state. A Capitalistic government would eagerly support it to defend themselves also, and has been tried here on a few occasions.Communists countries that is a no brainer. Socialism,hardly. Canada is a Socialist country as is most European countries.and no police states. Spain under Franco was and Mussolini’s Italy were police states. Nazi Germany certainly was but never practiced socialism. They only hid under it’s banner. They were like some Americans for many years who said “all men are created equal”. Then went on to slaughter Indian tribes,enslaved blacks,stole land from the Mexicans, denied women the right to vote,manipulated the consumer at the market and in the stock market. There have been many Americans who” hid under our banner” also and took advantage of others. That would be a more legitimate comparison to Nazism. Capitalism,Communism,Nazism and Fascism were and can be evil.It’s a far stretch to blame even a few of the world’s ills on Socialism. Too much socialism can make a nation dependent and that seems to be the battle in America.

          • DaveH

            As usual, Eddie spouts his fabricated facts. It must be nice to have the kind of mindset where you can say whatever made-up stuff you want with no pangs of guilt. Ignorance is bliss.
            Look up the definition of Socialism.
            Canada is far from being a Socialist State, but then again we have already established that Eddie has no clue what Socialism means. Canada actually has more Economic Freedom than the United States has:
            http://heritage.org/index/

          • eddie47d

            Then why all the attacks against Canada right here about being socialist. Too many of you want it both ways to bolster your odd thinking. You have too many enemies in your mind and that is confusing you.

          • Vicki

            eddie47d says:
            “Vickie; The right has nothing to do with “no government” that is anarchy. That is besides the point since since the extreme left and the extreme right are willing to have a police state.”

            Actually Eddie that IS my point. I even defined my point. The axis of evil we need to address is a spectrum with total government on the left of the spectrum we are using to no government on the right. Here is a video better showing my point.

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4r0VUybeXY

            As you can see socialism is on the far left and why we conservatives object so strongly to democrat or REPUBLICAN people pushing us to the left on THIS chart. The chart that actually matters.

          • DaveH

            I’m not aware of “all the attacks against Canada”, Eddie. Maybe you could cite some references for that statement?
            As far as your misunderstanding of the word Socialism, what is keeping you from looking the definition up? Are you learning disabled? And why do you argue about things you know nothing about?
            Here, I’ll make it easy for you:
            http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/socialism

          • Vigilant

            eddie47d says,”Capitalism,Communism,Nazism and Fascism were and can be evil.”

            How can you expect us to consider that your arguments have any legitimacy whatsoever when you confuse economic systems with political systems? Hint: Capitalism is not a system of government.

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            eddie needs to use his real name, Lucifer.

        • DaveH

          And yet another was Mao Zedong’s Cultural Revolution:
          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_Revolution

          • Dr. Mabuse

            “Whatever the price of the Chinese Revolution, it has obviously succeeded not only in producing more efficient and dedicated administration, but also in fostering high morale and community of purpose,” declared David Rockefeller. “The social experiment in China under Chairman Mao’s leadership is one of the most important and successful in human history.”

            “Communism or more accurately, socialism, is not a movement of the downtrodden masses, but of the economic elite,” wrote the late Gary Allen. “If one understands that socialism is not a share-the-wealth program, but is in reality a method to consolidate and control the wealth, then the seeming paradox of super-rich men promoting socialism becomes no paradox at all. Instead, it becomes logical, even the perfect tool of power-seeking megalomaniacs

            Sound familiar?

          • Mike In MI

            Mabuse -

            “Sound familiar?”…you ask.
            Why strangely, now you you say it, it comes out rhyming with OBAMA!

    • chas

      Just how many riots and how much violence have you seen from the “right”?…Even if extremely rare( the couple of murdered abortion docs come to mind[and McVeigh was a RADICAL leftie]) , it pales in comparison to the NUMEROUS Blue-shirted Liberal NAZI events!!( WTO/GTO, Code Pink,Enviro-NAZIZ, ad infinitum….)

      • eddie47d

        McVeigh was extreme Right and there is nothing that says anything different.

        • kate8

          McVeigh was nothing but a patsy set up by the PTB in another false flag, staged event. It’s main purpose was to set the stage for discredit the Right and set the stage for “right-wing extremists/terrorists”.

          In other words, he was a plant. In actuality, he was a registered democrat.

          • Dan az

            Eddiee
            Did you hear that? he was a democrap a lefty oh my God that cant be right,please eddiee go check it out ok?
            Kate your doing it again giving facts where they are not wanted whats wrong with you havent you learned yet they dont believe in that stuff only the things they make up.Shame on you!

          • Al Sieber

            Kate8, I’m with you on this one too.

        • Dale on the left coast

          What’s curious about the left’s current obsession with Timothy McVeigh is that it proves that — despite a frantic search for 15 years — liberals have come across no better evidence of burgeoning “right-wing extremist” violence than a drug-taking, self-described “agnostic” who was thrown out of the Michigan Militia and who proclaimed, “Science is my religion.”

          Who is burning down Greece, France and Britain today??? Why Leftist/Socialist/Anarchists . . . you don’t see Conservatives rioting in the streets . . . why do you suppose that is???

          • Mike In MI

            Well, Dale otlc -
            Obviously, they are having trouble scheduling a decent week with the cities where they can get media coverage. You know on the weeks the lefties are off the muslim berserkers are out berserking. What’s really revolting is that every third week somebody (them) has to clean up the mess from the other two groups. It’s always something like that why conservatives can never get a chance to make their case.

        • DaveH

          McVeighs only known political affiliations?
          http://www.answers.com/topic/timothy-mcveigh#Political_views_and_religious_beliefs

          Keep in mind that a New York Republican is about as Right-Wing as a Southern Democrat.

        • eddie47d

          Kate 8 Is that another one of your conspiracy theories? Keep em’ coming!

          • Al Sieber

            eddie, explain what a conspiracy theory is, there’s 3- parts, after the “Truck Bomb” went off why did they have to go in and diffuse more bombs in the building? ammo nitrate blows down, there was a big crater under the U-haul truck, no way could a U-Haul truck do that much damage.

          • kate8

            “Conspiracy Theory” is just a term that was intended to turn people away from looking for the truth. In order to be credible, we must swallow the story of the MSM. Questioning the “official” story labels one a kook. Same thing with “birthers”, “9/ll truthers”, etc.

            You never know if a thing is true until it’s been officially denied.

    • RHSchumann

      You are so very much correect in everything you say.

    • steve peterson

      A rose by any name would smell as sweet. A leftist by any name is a criminal at heart. Call yourself any name you wish – if you believe that you have any say in the disposition of another’s rights or property, you are a leftist.

      Anyone who attempts to utilize force or fraud to violate an individual’s right to life, liberty, or the pursuit of happiness is a criminal – whether he attempts to do so at the point of a gun, or through the commonly accepted “legal means” of voting his criminal agenda into law (this latter normally involving fraud).

      You STINK, Jeremy Leochner. Shower in the cleansing stream of individual rights and liberty,please.

      • BigBadJohn

        Anyone who attempts to utilize force or fraud to violate an individual’s right to life, liberty, or the pursuit of happiness is a criminal
        ***********************************************
        Do you think this also applies to GWB wire tapping the American population illegally?
        Or
        GWB eliminating Habius Corpus and holding people indefinitely with out charging them?
        Or
        how about his enforced “protest zones”?

        I hated Clinton because of his attacks on civil liberties, But George Bush carried it way past anything that Clinton did.

        • kate8

          You liberals are totally obsessed here.

          How often do you see any of us defending unConstitutional acts by GWB? Any time anyone mentions the offenses of the Left, someone shouts “Bush!”

          Bush/Clinton/Bush/Obama. And those are only the most recent. They all played there rolls in getting us to where we are, so give up the idiocy already.

          Bush is gone, and the tyranny still escalates. It ain’t Bush’s watch anymore. Try opening your eyes and living in the present. Being stuck in the past isn’t helping.

          • http://?? Joe H.

            kate8,
            These guys are priceless!!! they whine and cry about Bushes wire tapping and all the other things he did under the patriot act yey they ADORE Nobummer and he has only strengthened and widened the very things that they hate Bush for! was thoroughly disgusted at what Bush attempted and I am even MORE disgusted at how Nobummer has made what he did WORSE!!!

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            I wonder when they are going to come out and blame Bush/Cheney/Halliburton for the shootings in Arizona this weekend? You know its coming. They are already blaming the Tea Party. The hate that the left exhubes, and they accuse the right of it. Amazing.

        • Vicki

          Had you been around then you would have noticed that we DID object to the RINO Bush’s actions you commented about. Now about “protest zones” they have been around for a LOT longer than Bush or Obama. They apparently were created by the Courts and first used noticeably in the 1960s or so. Both democrat and republican administrations have used them. Are you as critical of the democrat use as you are of the republican use? Are you critical of the use by police without specific regard to the politics?

          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Free_speech_zone

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          They can wiretap my phone anytime Big Paranoid John. You got something to hide? At the time, which you need to put into context, there was a group of people in this country, and some still are, that communicated enough to blow up and bring down the World Trade Centers. A lot of this was made possible by one William Jefferson Clinton cutting our intelligence agencies in half. You know, the ones that monitor this kind of stuff. Cut them in half. So if Bush and his admin, needed to tap phones to make sure there wasnt some more chatter going on, where they were planning some more of this, more power to them. I could care less if they hear me telling my wife I love her, or if they hear me tell her Im going to the ball game. Big stinking deal. Only crooks and terrorists should be afraid of this. Me, Ive got nothing to hide and I could care less. You are paranoid, and have a left wing liberal agenda to push, and thats it. Clinton caused us to get bombed by doing nothing when they bombed the WTC basement the first time, and the USS Cole, and he didnt do a damn thing about. Couple that with him cutting our military and intelligence in half, and you see the reason for 9-11 happening. Get real Big Paranoid John. Your a moral leper.

      • Jeremy Leochner

        Steve I have no desire to violate individual liberties. I simply cant stand by when I see those with wealth and power take advantage of their status and violate the liberties of the less powerful. I have no desire to take from the rich to give to the poor. I just dont want to see people take from the poor to give to the rich.

        • Vicki

          Sorry I looked but did not find where you were providing evidence that some rich folk were takeing from the poor. Well other than government which takes a lot from the poor but even more from the rich. Kinda makes government the richest of the rich so is that what you meant. You object to government taking from the people? If so then we are in agreement.

          • Jeremy Leochner

            Vicki Im talking for example about the wall street executives who stole millions if not billions of dollars from unsuspecting people with lies about stock values. Im talking about lobbyists who give millions of dollars to senators and representatives who then support or push legislation that favors corporations or a specific industry. Senators who recieve millions of dollars from healthcare companies who then oppose any sort of reform or regulation. The top 2% of earners who demand that their taxes not rise back to the level they were at during the clinton administration. I know its very general and I guess I am being a little bit of a fear monger. I guess in general im talking about white collar criminals and who and what can stop them. I think the government is needed to make regulations so that white collar crime can be reduced or at least reduce the chance of it happening.

          • Mike In MI

            Good goin’, Jeremy. Just what we need -

            More Govrmint akshin ta doo more reg’ilatin’, n’at ‘l cur ‘t all…ev’rthin. jis’ skeep ‘em reg’iladers ‘n revmanures aut ah hyeer.

          • libertytrain

            Jeremy – it was the government that relaxed and eliminated all those regulations/ rules for banking etc, that then allowed all those white collar criminals to now prosper. This site gives a little rundown on some of the history of same – http://www.sierrafoot.org/civics/mortgage_crash.html
            Seems I recall some of it was done so everyone could buy house – no matter their credit – or ability to pay.

          • Vicki

            Jeremy Leochner says:
            Vicki Im talking for example about the wall street executives who stole millions if not billions of dollars from unsuspecting people with lies about stock values.”

            Misuse of the word “stole”. So let me see. You want to invest in a stock. To purchase a stock you have to READ and UNDERSTAND a contract that amongst other things warns you MULTIPLE times that the investment has risks and usually outlines those risks. How is that “unsuspecting”. How could they possibly lie? Why there are even laws against lying. So where is the “theft”?

            Jeremy Leochner: “Im talking about lobbyists who give millions of dollars to senators and representatives who then support or push legislation that favors corporations or a specific industry. Senators who receive millions of dollars from health care companies who then oppose any sort of reform or regulation.”

            Lobbyists are not the problem. The amoral people WE elect are.
            Our forefathers WARNED us that our Constitution was only for a moral and religious people and is wholly unsuited to the governance of any other. That senators and representatives support or push legislation that favors ANY corporation over any other and ANY industry over any other for ANY REASON AT ALL is the problem. They need to HONOR their oath of office.

            Jeremy Leochner: “The top 2% of earners who demand that their taxes not rise back to the level they were at during the clinton administration.”

            Why should they not demand relief from excessive tax? It is their RIGHT. See First Amendment.

            Jeremy Leochner: “I guess in general im talking about white collar criminals and who and what can stop them.”

            We have hundereds of laws to stop crimial behavior. Making a profit is NOT criminal behavior. Wanting to keep your own earned wealth is NOT criminal behavior.

            Further the definition of “white collar crime” is way to broad to be useful in discussions of what is and is not criminal behavior.

            Jeremy Leochner: “I think the government is needed to make regulations so that white collar crime can be reduced or at least reduce the chance of it happening.”

            The government DOES that already. The most useful focus is “fraud” so since there is already a law against fraud and as noted above for stock transactions there must be additional paperwork to disclose details (reducing the chance of fraud) what more do you think the government should do?

          • Vicki

            A link to a definition of white collar crime
            law.jrank.org/pages/11939/White-Collar-Crime.html

          • http://?? Joe H.

            Jeremy,
            You, no doubt, are talking about people like Charlie Rangle, right? I mean, he took TWO rent controlled apartments that could have been better used by someone that made less money than him and he had an expense account as well. He didn’t pay taxes on hundreds of thousands of dollars. This in turn takes money from the schools, welfare, free clinics, food kitchens, and a lot of other programs designed to help the very people that you claim to care about! doesn’t matter how much he cheats on, a crook of this nature is still a crook!!!

    • Karolyn

      You are so right. It’s just like saying conservatives are all religious bible-thumpers.

      • Mike In MI

        Karoly -
        As usual you’re right… no lef— um, correct. Some of them conservatives is religis “Origin of Species” thumpers.
        Not many …but, some.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        I am a conservative. I fully believe in Jesus Christ and I will fully acknowledge Him and give an account of myself to Him when He comes again. And I am ready for that. Thing is, you and all of us will also. Many, and I do me many, will not be prepared for that day, and many more, will be given their hearts desire, and sent to a place where they will never be bothered by hearing His name again. We all will reap what we sow.

        • Denniso

          That’s fine,you can believe in Jesus,the Muslims can believe in Mohamed,the Hindhus can believe in Krishna, and some of us believe in rational thought. No Problems…

    • DaveH

      Jeremy,
      I don’t recall Chip saying that ALL Leftists are violent. You put those words in his mouth. I define Leftists as those who advocate Big Government, so that would include many (if not most) Republican Leaders as well as most Democrats. And History has shown that the people in that camp have been guilty of extreme violence. They are responsible for the vast majority of purges in History.
      Mostly where I think you are deluded, though, is in your belief that “the authority of the government as something useful against those with money and power who might use their influence to take advantage of or hurt the people without wealth or power”. You are so wrong there. Big Government goes hand in hand with Crony-Capitalism where favored Companies get special protections in the form of subsidies, favorable regulations, tariffs, and other special protections against competitors.
      Even if we did away with private companies, there would be the Political Class (rulers and their favored followers) who would get special privileges and perks. That is true in every country with Big Government.
      Wouldn’t you rather have a system where people succeed because they work harder, innovate more, or sacrifice more? Voluntarily? Than to have a system where the successful people are those who float to the top through force, sycophancy or other political manuevers?

      • kate8

        All you have to do is look at the difference between liberal protests/gatherings and conservative ones.

        The liberals are the ones with the violence, rude behavior, heckling, profanity, and angry demeanor. Not to mention the trashy mess they leave behind.

        The Tea Party’s typify the conservative bahavior. The only ones who attempt to cause a ruckus are the liberal infiltrators. Conservatives are generally polite, accepting, respectful, and well behaved. And they leave the place cleaner than it was before they got there.

        And Tea party’s don’t have to pay people to attend, as do the libs. They are firmly convicted in their purpose, and willing to sacrifice for their cause.

        • Jeremy Leochner

          Kate what about Shirley Roper who lead a protest against homosexuality by leading it at the funeral of a soldier in order to make the statment that god was punishing us for tolerating homosexuality. Or Mr Terry Jones who wanted to lead a protest in the form of burning qurans to oppose Islam. The KKK who make numerous protests of burning crosses and making racist speechs all while preaching ultra conservatism. Or The Neo nazi movement who also call themselves conservative and make aggressive threatening statments. I dont suggest these represent conservative thought or feelings but thats the point. Extremist or violent groups dont represent an entire section of the political spectrum. Violence isnt a belief of “the left” or liberals. If people at liberal protests become violent they are idiots who are not honoring an ideology, their just being violent. I guess what im trying to say is violence comes from human agression and anger which is something just as prevalant in liberal extremists as it is in conservative ones. I just dont want people to treat liberalism as having more extremists then conservativism because neither ideology promotes such a thing but neither can they stop people from becoming it if those people are messed up.

          • DaveH

            Jeremy,
            Government is Force. Without that Force, the Liberal programs would not be accepted by most people. Force is violence. Why it is so hard for you to understand that concept is beyond me.
            Liberals would be nowhere if they couldn’t use Big Government to force their theft and failed policies on the rest of the populace.

          • DaveH

            And please don’t confuse Right-Wingers with true Conservatives (those who advocate the Freedom that formed the roots of our country).
            Right-Wingers’ policies do also consist of violent force. True Conservatives believe in voluntary choices and voluntary contracts, so it just stands to reason that they would not aggressively try to force other people to adopt their lifestyles. Only those who do not accept Freedom of Choice will try to force their way on other people.

          • Jeremy Leochner

            Dave I assure you I dont see right wingers as conservatives. I was pointing out that extremism exsists on both side not just the left. But as for force and stealing I dont want that. I want a tax system to be used to pay for our inferstructure and help mantain public welfare. If we elect people and they propose and push through taxes how is that force. Taxes are a system for maintaining our country and are our source of income for defense, inferstructure, and social security. Without them none of these programs would exsist. Im not saying lets raise taxes up high I just dont want government to be seen as or called force when we the people are electing the members of the government.

          • kate8

            Jeremy – While I don’t advocate what the protests at the soldier’s funerals or the Quran burnings, I could still make the point that those were peaceful protesters. Actually, if a group wants to burn a few Qurans as a symbolic gesture toward freedom, I see no problem here. No one was to be harmed, and this is America. Offending a group who seeks to dominate America doesn’t constitute harm but, rather, is a protest by those who oppose such intent. It was the media who turned a private gathering into a circus. Otherwise, we’d never have heard about it. The fact that we have to fear retribution by offended foreign radicals says it all.

            The issue was about groups who are violent. You can’t use the KKK as an example because they were ALL southern democrats, opposing the Republican party which was home for the freed slaves.

            None of the groups you mentioned were truly conservative. As DaveH pointed out, conservatism seeks to preserve liberty as intended by our founders. Anyway, anyone has the right to protest peacefully in America (so far). The issue was violence. Any extemists who seek to use force and violence are a problem. It’s just that it’s the Right that seems to keep getting accused of it, when it’s the Left who is actually doing it.

      • Jeremy Leochner

        Dave I never meant to put words in Mr Woods mouth. The reason I said that is his words were “The Left”. He made no distinction of anyone or any group from the left he simply said the left. Simply saying the left is little better then saying all on the left. Thats what im arguing.

        • DaveH

          Gee, I wonder where Chip would get that idea about the left? Could it have been from Adolf’s actions? Or Stalin’s actions? Or Mao’s actions? Or maybe the actions of these people:
          http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financetopics/g20-summit/6229141/G20-Pittsburgh-police-fire-tear-gas-at-protestors.html

          • DaveH
          • DaveH
          • Jeremy Leochner

            Dave Hitler, Stalin and Mao are people I would catagorize as perversions of leftist or liberal ideology. For one thing social democrats like me who are on the left were considered enemies by stalin and hitler, enemies to be killed. As for those riots they are terrible. But they do not represent the left any more then an party or group of people represents an ideology. The KKK fashion themselves christians and commit horrible atrocities but that is not a blight on all christians. Numerous right wing militias and other groups claim visions and beliefs on the hard right but that dosent represent right leaning ideology. My point is “the left” or liberalism are general terms describing broad ideologies and beliefs, not a platform of set shared beliefs or a specific ideology. Whatever fanatics and extremists say is their ideology dosen’t represent all people or groups whose personal beliefs are even remotly similar to the extremists. This isnt a question of parties or groups its a question of ideology about many different things and what your feelings are and how you deal with those you disagree with.

          • eddie47d

            In that one series of videos folks should watch the real police state in the arrest of Amy Goodman.

          • DaveH

            Jeremy,
            Those perversions oddly seem to occur whenever Leftists gain control. Why is that?
            Maybe you are just misguided. Maybe you are just sticking up for the wrong kind of people. I don’t doubt for an instant that you don’t believe in violence, but if you believe in the policies of the Left, please explain to me how their forcing those policies on the rest of us is not an act of violence? Without the threat of violence (jail, confiscation of property, etc.) the successful people would just ignore the Liberals.

          • Jeremy Leochner

            Dave when I say perversions I mean liars and betrayers. I see hitler and stalin as claiming to be for the people, or claiming left wing ideals but in fact behaving and implementing their own twisted ideologies. I dont catagorize hitler as a liberal or progressive. He had progresssives thrown into prison for speaking out against him. Same with stalin. I say this as my feelings, I see the ideal of leftism being equality as the main thing. Everyone should be treated equally, unfortunatly its hard to practically carry out such a thing and its easy for monsters like hitler or stalin to use such rethoric to trick people into voting for or supporting them. But that dosen’t mean the ideology is iherently bad.

        • DaveH

          I find it amazing that somebody would think the Left, the people who have no inhibitions about taking the money of others as their own, would eschew violence. The theft of other peoples’ money is in itself an act of threatened violence, as how else could they extract the money of unwilling donors without that threat of violence?

          • Dan az

            Dave some days it seems that we are all in the sherwood forest surrounded by bo of the hood and his jolly men.

          • DaveH

            For sure, Dan. It is my mission in life to not let Liberals take the moral highground at the same time as they are robbing us blind. Wouldn’t it be refreshing if they would just be honest and admit that they are immoral thieves?

          • eddie47d

            Dave H. there are too many immoral thieves in your corporate and capitalistic world. It’s hard to keep up with them. Money buys power and most of us just don’t have the resources/money to continually take them on.

          • DaveH

            You are a thief, Eddie. You vote for Democrats who are all about taking money from the owners of that money. Redistribution of Wealth. Theft. You belonged to a Union. How do Unions get their higher pay, or desired working conditions? By Coercion. They use whatever means they can get away with to extort money from the very company that was kind enough to give them a job to begin with. Talk about looking a gift horse in the mouth. They buy off legislators to get government to look the other way. To use any kind of coercion or force to get money from the owner of that money is just plain theft.
            How can I or anybody else debate with a person who just has no concept of morality?

          • kate8

            DaveH – You just summed up the whole problem in your last statement. The Left has no concept of morality.

            The loss of morality is what has driven the greed and corruption. And where does this loss come from? THE LEFT. Those who seek to impose a socialist ideology. Destroying moral values is the first step in destroying freedom, because without it, freedom cannot exist.

            And who screams the loudest about corporate corruption? THE LEFT. Because, having now created the problem, they are here with the solution. SLAVERY.

      • Vicki

        Here is a good video on crony capitalism and how it works.
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2sSg0xjzIec

    • Delores Smith

      JEREMY LEOCHNER,
      Look up the difference between a Leftist and a Liberal.
      Delores Smith
      Delores109@cox.net

      • Jeremy Leochner

        I am sorry Mrs Smith. I never meant to suggest that I think leftists and liberals are the same. That was just my understanding. After looking at various websites and sources from wikipedia to the dictonary I must say I still believe what I said. They all seem to state that the phrase or ideology of Leftism encompasses numerous belief systems some of which include those defined as social democrats, progressives and liberal or liberal leaning. Your right to be a leftist and be a liberal is not the case, but it is possible for a leftist to be a liberal and a liberal be a leftist. That is my view.

    • Ronald Johnston

      The liberal left who don’t want violence and rioting are as guilty as the rioters if they don’t do anything about their own doing the rioting. This no different than Muslims who don’t do anything about the radicals in their religion. They are as guilty as the suicide bombers.

      • Karolyn

        What do you mean by “doing something?” Wha t would you propose?

        • Vigilant

          Obviously, he means distancing themselves and condemning their actions publicly. What did you think he meant?

          • bob wire

            that’s the way I took it.

    • Fred

      I am definitely not left leaning in any way but I
      agree that we cannot unequivocally state that
      every leftist supports violence. I would prefer
      to say that as a group they may be varied in their
      degree of leftism and that that is not really saying
      that they are Constitutionalists. Following the God
      Inspired Constitution is very inmportant since that
      great document set forth sound principles of government
      that will insure the greatest amount of freedon for the
      greatest number of people, AND FREEDOM IS WHAT THIS COUNTRY
      IS ALL ABOUT. I can say with some degree of conviction that
      ALL LEFTISTS simply do not understand or wish to give free
      enterpise is true chance–and that is because to every progressive
      thinking person they rely on the government to lead their way
      to whatever they want–and that is UNAMERICAN,IN THE CONSTITUTIONAL
      SENSE. Let us have LESS GOVERNMENT AND MORE INDIVIDUAL RESPONSIBILITY
      WHICH TRANSLATES INTO A BALANCED BUDGET AND THE COMPLETE LIST OF
      FEDERAL AND STATE AGENCIES BEING ELIMINATED AS INTRUSIONS INTO
      FREEDOMS GUARANTEED BY THE BILL OF RIGHTS.

      Fred

      • http://yahoo Bob

        The constitution, is a flawed document.

        • Vicki

          True because it requires a moral and religious people to properly use it. However what kind of gods among men would be required to honor the rights of all under any other form of government?

          • kate8

            Vicki – Very wise words.

            Unfortunately, there are too many on the left who don’t understand this. They don’t value morality, so they see no way for a free society to function. Since the morally corrupt cannot possibly govern themselves, they see big government as the only answer.

            Sad.

          • Vigilant

            Vicki, you are 100% correct. When Bob says, “The constitution is a flawed document,” one wonders what point he’s trying to make.

            Of course it’s flawed. Nothing under the Sun is perfect, but so what? The difference is that the Constitution facilitates its own revision to a more perfect Union through the process called “amendment.” It is a document of the people, and if it remains “flawed” then the responsibility for that is laid clearly at the feet of the people.

            When the leftists claim that the Constitution is a “living document,” that means only one thing: that it’s OK to circumvent, sidestep and trash its provisions to get their way. The Conservative approach of “strict construction” is the ONLY way to interpret the Constitution and maintain the respect for rule of law.

            Our Constitutional Republic was given to us as one of the greatest gifts in history. Its very existence depends upon the its administration by a moral people.

          • kate8

            Well said, indeed, Vigilant.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      Those on the left are dangerous, and just proved it whole heartedly again. In the immediate minutes following the shootings in Tucson, the left right away used this for political gain, blaming this on the Tea Party, Sarah Palin, and the republicans, which they say causes hate and division, when in fact, if they would look in the mirror, they are the ones who are doing this crap. This kid was a wacko, an anti establishment, anti government wacko, and if anything, he is most closely tied with the left, as he obviously doesnt have any belief in God, which goes hand in hand with the beliefs of the left wing liberals. Those who willingly and knowingly suck live babies out of their mothers womb, murdering them, and think this is ok, and then go and put gays on a pedestal, and shove it down our throats as normal, are sick and demented, just as this kid was. Im sorry, it is not God like to murder infants, and it is not God like to sleep with your own sex. Its immorral, decadent, disgusting, disturbing and vile and perverted and all those things. Its murder and its an abomination to the Lord. As is this guy opening up shooting on people. Yet the left seems fit to try to use this as political gain. Just amazing. They are so out of touch with the common man, that by doing this, they are going to turn a lot of people onto following the Tea Party, because this is simply vile behavior on their part. Disgusting.

  • s c

    It’s not easy to communicate with people who think their party, their leaders or their ‘ideals’ make America a great nation. True greatness is a fact, not an illusion. The Founders were men who were educated, tended to see reality for what it is and knew from experience that some things work and some things can never work.
    Years before most of us were born, we were slowly sold into slavery by those who were sworn to keep us free. We can be optimistic, pessimistic or realistic, but I see no practical way to restore the American dream.
    Lincoln’s emancipation of America’s slaves was premature. Today, every man woman and child needs to be emancipated – again. The White House and Congress are our new slavemasters, and until Americans realize this, there is no way for the American Dream to be restored.
    It has been said the best form of slavery keeps slaves from seeing themselves as being in chains. Is this not a very accurate way to describe America?

    • mr. myth

      Well stated S C and just as I see it. I hope many others soon will.

    • TIME

      SC,
      Your last statment is the “TRUTH in FACT.” Its all a total illusion.

      Whats even more so sad is that many of the Youth today unless they have someone who aids in their education are completely lost within that ILLUSION.
      The Media is so BENT its more like living in Nazi Germany than most can even grasp, they all spout about the evil of the Nazi’s and yet act more like them then even the Nazi’s did.

      Saddly the United States is in its very last days soon will just be no more.
      Yes it will still be the same country in its land mass, but the mind set that built this country is completely DEAD.

      No one has any drive left. They have been drinking from the bottle of Stupid for so long that if its not given to them they can’t deal with it, as I hear from so many young folks “Man your stressing me out.”

      Thinking is DEAD, The LONE WOLF is DEAD, its now only SHEEP THINKING.

      It can’t happen here. WRONG!!!!!!!!!!! Its did and it has.

      What you knew as a child is DEAD, the American Dream is OVER.
      Welcome to room 101………..

      • DaveH

        Time,
        Man you’re depressing me. LOL. Don’t give up, Time. There is still much hope for people to wake up before it’s too late.
        We have logic and morality on our side. They have immorality and manipulation on their side. We can prevail.

        • eddie47d

          SOMETIMES Dave H’ you take a stand that is very illogical,immoral and you manipulate people and political parties.You SOMETIMES let your extreme right wing views get in the way of your past logical comments.There are dark sides on the left and right and you are sliding …to the …

          • Dale on the left coast

            The Progressive Left is “Bankrupt” . . . has been for decades. Their poster children USSR, Cuba, Venesula, the Euro Socialist States are all has-beens or fast becoming so. Here in the USA . . . why is it that the long-term Dimmicrap States are in the worst shape in the country?

          • DaveH

            Eddie,
            Anybody who has read your comments often knows that your primary means are personal attacks and other purely manipulative tactics. But then, what would one expect from a person with a Union background?
            You are just an annoying little Harpy.

          • eddie47d

            No I’ll be exposing your hate and hypocricy each and every time.

          • DaveH

            You apparently don’t even know what a Hypocrite is, Ignorant Eddie.
            Show me the evidence that I don’t practice what I preach.
            You, on the other hand, quite regularly whine about the Corporations taking from you, when in fact without the support of Liberal leaders they can take nothing from us against our will. And then you turn around and advocate taking from other people using the force of Government. You are truly a hypocrite.

          • eddie47d

            You have no clue of the real takers Dave H.

          • Dan az

            Eddie
            You always complain about corps.Yet you fail to recognize that the corp.USA is doing much more than the smaller corps in comparison.Why dont you complain about them?The District of Columbia Organic Act of 1871 this is the proof that not only are they a corp.but one that is constantly breaking the laws that we all agreed on.Why not complain about that.Read up and learn the truth and then maybe you can through that liberal book away and join the rebellion.

          • Dan az

            As we enter a new year in search of Heaven’s blessing and protection, let us remind ourselves that God always judges people who reject truth. Always! If we truly want Heaven’s blessing and protection upon our land, we will start–each of us–by being willing to seek and embrace truth, even if doing so costs us something; because, in reality, people who reject truth lose a whole lot more than whatever they had hoped to gain. Eventually, they lose, not only their own lives, but also the life of their country.

          • DaveH

            Logic, morality, and right-winger are three words that you just have no concept of, Eddie. It is hopeless to debate with a person who just has no grasp of the English language.
            But it is a good thing that you comment on this board so people that aren’t too far gone yet can see the mindset of those who are voting for the far-left. You are a good example of the kind of students that are being turned out by the Government school system.

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            Eddie, get this straight. You never have exposed Dave, because Dave speaks the truth in his posts. And this is from a Christian, speaking about an atheist. DaveH speaks the truth in his posts. While you eddie, you come across just like Lucifer, always prostituting the truth and telling your evil little lies. Eddie, son of Lucifer.

          • Denniso

            You’re not toning down your vitriol much,are you? I doubt that Eddie is going to worry about you calling him the son of Lucifer,but for people who believe in fairy tales,that’s kind of a mean thing to say,all because you don’t agree w/ his politics.

          • libertytrain

            Oh Denniso, if I had a nickel for everyone on this site and all the others and all the news stations, newspapers and politicians who have used the new word of the week “vitriol” in the last few days – I could buy a nice beach house on the coast – not that I want one –

      • kate8

        TIME – Sadly, the news IS depressing.

        Already the assinations of those opposing the NWO is in operation. Just look at the number of micro-biologists who’ve been murdered (as of several months ago it was at 84). These were people who worked with bioweapons without knowing the true purpose, and were at risk of coming forward.

        Law enforcement and military are being taken out, and replaced with those loyal to the NWO.

        Many others, too, that haven’t been reported. And recently, that Mr. Wheeler. These are all Red List. All known dissidents will be eliminated.

        This is happening NOW. And we will soon be hit with something biological on a huge scale.

        There’s no real good news here, folks. This is set to be a rough year. While I hate being doom and gloom, people MUST be aware of what lies ahead. In fact, it’s already upon us. And the only way to deal with fear is to face it head on, because denial and hiding won’t help you.

        I know I’ll catch flack for this, but the time for pretending is over. Things are serious, and if we don’t get ourselves in spiritual order we’ll never be able to withstand.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        The mindset in this country is in very, very bad shape. When enough people vote and elect a person who will take the enemy, and give them lawyers to protect their caught killers, who will promote tolerance of the enemy who has vowed to kill us, who by the way, will have zero tolerance for us, says volumes about the shape of this country. When one can stand on a street corner and openly attack and criticize a Jewish person, a Catholic, or a Christian, and that is ok, but dont you dare say a word against a Muslim or a homosexual, or it is deemed a hate crime. Yes, we have a problem. We are so off course, in our political correctness, that it is, just as it was written in the Bible around 2000 years ago, that in the end days, right will be wrong and wrong will be right. Father will turn against son and son against father, and many many more things, and they are all playing out right now. But no one seems to be paying attention, as we are circling the drain, and continually elect leaders that help us go down the drain faster. The mentality of “everything is alright” and “if it feels good, do it” is killing us slowly but surely.

    • wayne

      s c, I am one who agrees with this. The president and Congress works for the people. We are their employers, and they are our emplyees. We need to make sure they get this planted firmly in their heads. When they forget their role, they should be fired. This is why it is so important for the folks to find out what there Congress Members are doing, or not doing. If we can get the people in this coiuntry to take an active role, like the tea party members, we can get this done. Our trouble is that the people are not watching what their Congress members are doing. It is tme that Congress do the will of the people. I would like to see all foreign aid stopped. I would also like for our nation quit being the big world policeman, unless it involves our personal interest. I feel that the two above things, along with all the pork, that Congress Members are sending back to their respective state, to get reelected, is a big part of our economic woes. We all need to get involved, and try to encourage our neighbors, and friends, to vote. This is a must if we are to survive as a nation.

      • DaveH

        The real key is in the younger generation. The Liberal Socialists know that, and they have been succeeding in their brainwashing of the youth for many decades now. We have to reverse years of propaganda at the hands of the government schools. We need to push hard for voucher systems and other means to wrest their young minds from the dumbing-down they have been receiving. Without the youth we are lost.

        • Bruce D.

          That DaveH is the key to everything. Good post! The left fully understands that and the right is just beginning to catch on in places like Texas. There are a lot of important battlefields but none more important than the youth. The battle being fought will be handed over to the youth. We are not involved in a two or even a ten year battle. It will go on for our whole lifetime and that of our children’s lifetime if we our lucky. If we are not lucky they will give up. “The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.”

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          Indoctrination. That is what the liberal left has done Dave. They knew long ago, the key to the future was our youth, and they have taken the steps to overtake the public school systems, and use it to indoctrinate their future voters. More and more as the family systems crumbles, and more and more kids are not properly taught at home as to what is right and what is wrong, the schools are there to tell them what they should think and give them a perverted view of things. And it is no wonder why the public school system is also broke. That is the liberal way. Just look at the states the liberals have controlled for years, and the state of their economy, with California leading the way. Broke and bankrupted. And that is what they are doing to our childrens minds also, breaking them and leaving them bankrupt. I agree with your outlook on vouchers where the parents can use them to send their kids to schools of their choice. That would break the stranglehold the libs have on indoctrinating our children, since so many parents fail in teaching their kids right from wrong.

    • http://yahoo Bob

      The founders, saw black people, as 3/5s, and women weren’t recognized, at all.

      • DaveH

        That was wrong. Most of us know that. Our Founders weren’t perfect. But allowing the Political Class to re-enslave the people isn’t the answer.

      • Bruce D.

        That 3/5s was for determining wealth and woman were counted. They felt that a slaves production is only 3/5s of that of a freeman. That is a good example why socialism does not work. There comes a point where a man will lose his incentive to work under socialist policies. That is already happening with democrat social programs. We are coming into the age of a Federal Plantation in many ways. The left see those who make over $250,00 a year as their rightful slaves and those making under $250,000 a year as their future slaves. Really anyone who has to contribute to redistribution is being forced into slavery. Redistribution is not the same as paying taxes for roads and infrastructure in most cases but not all as in The Bridge To Nowhere.

  • Jennie

    sc

    You voiced my feelings exactly and stated it better than I could have. Thank You!!

    • bob wire

      I don’t know about you sc and Jennie, but I was born into this world that I live.

      From the being, there was never a conscience effort on my part, I was a “standard” child, “NO” was one if my first words to learn, but it never went much farther then that.

      Children want to please parents, I was no exception.

      I was late to ever become apolitical and by then it was too late, I was captive by overwhelming forces!

      • Al Sieber

        B.Wire, I grew up in in the “50′s” with ” Dick, Jane, and Spot”, and multiplication, addition, tables on cards, Nursery Rhymes,Pledge of Alliance, prayer in schools etc. and a Dad who didn’t trust the Govt.. I thank God for that. at least he made me aware, and made me question everything.

        • http://?? Joe H.

          Al Sieber,
          sounds like your dad was a lot like mine. He always believed that a man was responsible to himself first then others. He taught me to be self reliant and to always have a fall-back option! I have had a few rough spots, but I have never went under!!! don’t plan on it either!!

          • kate8

            My dad, too. He was kind, responsible, moral and as honest as they come. He was always ready to lend a hand, and he knew how to do everything. He raised all of our food. I am so grateful that he instilled in me the love for doing all of these things.

            I don’t see men like him anymore among the younger generation.

          • bob wire

            Hmm? ~ yea, I got through Dick and Jane. ~ For some reason, “Spot” I had a hard time remembering, ~don’t know why. ~dyslexia was unknown to us back then.

            My 22 year old father took me outside and beat me every time I failed to remember “Spot”. 4 times ~ Damn dog! I’m glad it was a small book.

            He’d catch all the women gone and find reasons to beat me. Pretty sure he didn’t care for my presence much, 1st born and hated sharing it seems.

            I’m glad you hold fond memories of your father, my grandfather was my mentor, a more kinder, gentler man never lived that couldn’t walk on water.

            I didn’t learn to not trust government until I got in the Army but never trusted father. Now, I trust everyone to be untrustworthy and avoid it as much as possible. I make it not matter and conduct myself accordingly.

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            Amen Joe. My dad also. He taught me to work hard and honestly for my money, and good things will come from it. I have found this to be true. He taught me to be fair and honest, and one of the things I remember most as a kid, as I played a lot of sports, was my dad telling me that he better never catch me blowing my own horn, you know, bragging. He taught me that if your good, people will do that for you. It seems now days, all you see is people bragging on themselves, or attacking others in an attempt to make themselves look good. He taught me to be responsible for my actions, and held me accountable for the things I did. Again, that seems to have gone out the window in this country. People are not held responsible for their actions, and mostly, instead, it seems folks get rewarded for bad behavior. Dont work, and get money, food stamps, welfare and all kinds of things given to you. People have made this a way of life. Have more kids you cant afford, the government will reward you by giving you more and more. Rewards for bad behavior. But then punish the successful, by taxing them more and more. I wish people that were like my dad ran this country, as we wouldnt have all these problems we have brought upon ourselves, due to failure of leadership.

  • Warrior

    1. There is no such thing as a free lunch.
    2. There is no such thing as a free lunch.
    3. There is no such thing as a free lunch.

    Will the left EVER understand this?

    • chas

      They DO, but stealing “from the rich”until ther is NOTHING and collapsing the society for Gub-mint takeover is the end- box/ conclusion on their flowchart…..

      • bob wire

        You guys ideas of the left and whats being refereed to as “right” couldn’t get you guys talked out of a shopping mall.

        You’d be constantly cutting right and going around in short circles.

        • wayne

          Bob, you just don’t understand. Let me put it this way. If you and another person was assigned to a job, and the pay to do the job was $100. This money is to be split evenly betweeen the two of you. If you are a diligent worker and do 3/4 of the work youself while the other man does only 1/4 of the work, why should the man only doing i/4 of the work get as much as you? There is not any way that this can be justified. However, the left will try and justfy in some crazy way like they always do.

          • bob wire

            you make perfect sense Wayne.

            and I take it that you are to judge who’s pulling the load?

            ~ Wayne , I’ve been doing the same thing for 40 years.

            If I worked by the hour, I’d only cheat myself so I must work by the job to get fair pay for my efforts. ~ I sell results ~ not bolts , screws , wire and pipe.

            I understand such things, ~ it’s not that complicated.

            If you don’t like to work for cheap, ~ it’s your responsibility to change it.

            Is within your power to dissolve any working arrangement you find not to your benefit.

            Is that not so? ~ and if it’s not ~ it to you to change it.

          • DaveH

            Bob, this one sentence you said, says it all: “and I take it that you are to judge who’s pulling the load?”
            Exactly. Bingo! You win the prize.
            Nobody, but the man paying the wages from his own bank account, and the man providing the labor or services, should be involved in the decision of who should get the money and who shouldn’t. It should be between those two people and NOBODY ELSE! If, and only if, there is a written contract that has been broken, then, and only then, should a third party be involved.
            If the payer of the wages isn’t happy with the performance of the worker, he should be free to fire that worker. And if the worker isn’t happy with his wages, he should be free to quit that job.

    • eddie47d

      The Right has been taking from this country since it’s inception …and taking and taking. Taking land,taking rights away,limiting rights,cheating people out of money and property.Sure they love Liberty as long as they can take it away from others to enhance themselves. I know a lot of you like to say these takers were just smarter than the other person and may the best con artist win. Some of these Cons even got extremely wealthy off of swindling other people. Some of these takers are even in our history books as generous benefactors to our way of government or way of life. Right wing takers are good citizens and left wing takers are low life worthless citizens. There is a very thin line between immorality on the left and right and the takers are abundant.

      • Vicki

        Eddie47d writes:
        “The Right has been taking from this country since it’s inception …and taking and taking. Taking land,taking rights away,limiting rights,cheating people out of money and property……”

        Proof by bald assertion is still just a (bad) fictional story. Come back when you have some examples.

        • eddie47d

          You seem smart enough to know your history but I figured wrong. Southern slavery, Northern sweatshops,dangerous mills,confiscation of Indian lands(others peoples land). Denying voting rights,home ownership,vigilante justice.Wall Street scams,banking scams,Big Pharma scams,Private Healthcare scams,Big insurance scams,Derivatives,Hedge fund scams.Every nation has bad history and we are no exception and some things we keep repeating. Denying rights and market manipulations are biggies.

          • Vicki

            Eddie47d writes:
            “You seem smart enough to know your history but I figured wrong.”

            A bad attempt to hide an ad hominem attack. Point match. I win.

            Now for amusement let us examine some of your attempts to prove your assertion that “The Right has been taking from this country since it’s inception…and taking and taking. Taking land,taking rights away,limiting rights,cheating people out of money and property.”. For the purpose of this discussion we will guess that Eddie47d is talking about Republicans.

            Eddie47d: “Southern slavery,”

            Hardly proof of taking rights away since the right obviously chose to FREE the slaves. Or did you forget the “War of Northern Aggression”? Next.

            Eddie47d: “Northern sweatshops”

            For the purpose of this discussion I will use the definition of “sweatshop” provided by m-w.com. So how is working in a sweatshop taking
            land? How is it taking away or limiting ANYONES rights. ANYONE AT ALL? .

            Eddie47D: “dangerous mills”

            many human activities are dangerous. How is that taking away rights?

            Eddie47D: “confiscation of Indian lands(others peoples land).”

            That would be government not the “right”. More specifically most of the European governments. That is what they did. Most European governments were oligarchies with kings and courts. Not exactly what you might mean by “the right”. Here is a cite to prove my assertion that it was European governments.
            http://lawschool.courtroomview.com/acf_cases/8617-johnson-v-m-intosh
            You should study more of history.

            “Denying voting rights”

            False presumption of the existence of a right. Voting was originally for property owners only because they were the ones “at risk” thus had standing to have a vote. Everyone else was free to do what they wanted as long as they respected the rights of others. Then the government began to grow.

            Eddie47d: “home ownership”

            I do not see how the “right” owning a home is taking away rights.

            Eddie47d: “vigilante justice.”

            Illogical comparison of the criminal acts of a mob with the nature of a free people. How very Eddie47d of you (<— Ad hominem attack cleverly disguised as humor. I learned it from liberals :) )

            Eddie47d: "Wall Street scams,banking scams,Big Pharma scams,Private Healthcare scams,Big insurance scams,Derivatives,Hedge fund scams."

            Would that be scams or fraud. Scam is a word that implies judgment of actions the speaker doesn't like. (I thought liberals were against judgmental attitudes) Hardly evidence of your claimed point that the right is taking away someones rights.

            Eddie47d: "Every nation has bad history and we are no exception and some things we keep repeating. Denying rights and market manipulations are biggies."

            "Nation" does not equal "The Right"

            You have yet to prove any element of your attempted point.

            Next.

          • Richard Pawley

            Vicki, it’s not going to make much difference if we all don’t get back on the right (no pun intended) track. God is not concerned if a person is a liberal or a conservative. He is concerned with individual morality and He will soon be holding us to account as a nation. His blessing has been on this land and it’s peoples for a long time and He hasn’t abandoned us but we have abandoned him. Like the ancient Israelites in the Bible we have gone our own way and are each doing our own thing and given Him no appreciation for all He has done for us. Consequently unless we turn back to Him, to the basic beliefs of the founding fathers and the Judeo-Christian beliefs upon which this nation was founded then He has revealed some of what will happen and it is not pretty. The atheists will blame the unions or the NWO people or George Soros but they will only be the ones who are allowed to punish this nation, if we don’t turn back to righteousness. How? Major riots in the big cities, especially in the heavily unionized cities like NYC. Already in the recent snow storm the union members were ordered to not plow as fast or as much to punish the mayor for reducing their ranks. Three people are alleged to have died including an infant when the ambulances couldn’t get through. Can you imagine what the unions will do when they discover the city, the state and the nation is bankrupt and can only print money. There will be plenty of paper money but it will only be worth a fraction of what it is worth now. And if all those big overtime hours and fat pensions are so much nothing I’m afraid that some large numbers of easily led people will go bonkers, rioting, and looting on a scale far exceeding Watts in LA years ago. In my last book, “THE LAST DAYS OF THE LATE GREAT UNITED STATES and the Great Famine that Followed” I told of the 20,000 army troops that were being trained to quell these riots because the police and firemen either will not or won’t be able to do so. I recently read that the number NOW being trained is in excess of 40,000 so I suspect it is getting closer. If we have a Great Awakening like the spiritual revival that led to the American Revolution and the single minister, George Wakefield who the British tried to kill because they feared his message of freedom and salvation apart from the crown, then this can be averted but if we continue on the path we are on then our future will be rather frightening. Once the riots begin it will likely spread but the same year, 1992, that I was told while praying that there would be more than the 300% inflation I was predicting back then (“more like 450%” was what I was told – and we have a couple of hundred percent to go), well, that same year, a NYC minister of world renown, David Wilkerson, who has been in the city since the late 1950′s had a vision and he was even afraid to tell of it but every time he prayed he was told to tell it and that those who wanted the truth would accept it. Well, to long to tell here but after the thousands of fires out of control and business’s fleeing the city and billions lost NYC will eventually go bankrupt. Since the unions control the trucks that bring food to all cities I sort of figured out that was why Wilkerson was also told that it would be a good idea to have at least a month’s food on hand at all times. You can read of his amazing vision which atheists who know nothing of how God works will reject and true Christians will consider or at least pray about and it will be up to God to confirm to them what will happen and how they should prepare. Even some Christians who have not been fully trained in how God works don’t always accept visions and of course they have to be tested. In 1965 a Christian minister in LA had a vision that I write about in both my books and in it he saw a volcano erupt and LA virtually destroyed. A movie was made from some of his vision but of course the hero stops it from destroying the city but in real life, as I pointed out in my autobiography, LEAVING SOUTH CAROLINA the minister shared his vision with 3 three churches and as I recall 600 people quit their jobs, sold their homes and moved to Tennessee. It hasn’t happened yet but I believe it will happen in a little over three years (our scientists say it is overdue) in the summer of 2014. It was unfortunate that The Drudge Report came out a year or so ago and made Wilkerson’s vision sound like it was eminent because God always gives plenty of time to see if people will change and return to Him or he must take down the spiritual wall of protection from around his people so they may learn a lesson. Such warnings have been given before in the Bible and it was years later when they came about. Fortunately many of the things in the Book of Revelation have yet to be. This may all be somewhat unbelievable to those whose God is “up in the sky somewhere” and not living in their hearts, or who do not even know that GOD IS, and know little of similar things that are in the Bible, but I share it with you for your consideration. I’m not even a member of this church or denomination but I have no doubt that it’s not as far off as it once was and many of us will see this fulfilled in the future if America does not turn back to God, not religion, not church, but God. Check it out and see what you think:
            http://www.scribd.com/doc/16783193/DAVID-WIKERSON-Prophetic-Message-to-New-York-2 May God bless all who read this.

          • DaveH

            Excellent effort, Vicki. But probably wasted on Eddie. He is not intelligent enough to know that you slam-dunked him.

          • kate8

            Excellent work, Vicki. Your posts are becoming more and more outstanding.

            Richard Pawley, Thanks for the great post and site. I will check it out.

            I wholly agree that those who are relying on churches for guidance are in trouble. Churches have sold us out like every other human institution, and the only truth will only be found by accessing God in our hearts. And we will never understand scripture unless and until we do, because it is coded. The Holy Spirit – God within us – gives understanding, and then it comes to life.

            DaveH – I know you don’t believe in God, but I swear you are a saint. And you have the patience of Job with the leftys on this site.

          • Vicki

            Thanks guys. I really do try to read and understand what you guys say so that I can better respond to people who are not as far along in breaking the brainwashing we got from the media and the schools.

    • BigBadJohn

      AGREE!!!!!

      You can not give out tax breaks without also cutting spending!!!

      Borrow and spend is the republican form of free lunch.

      • Richard Pawley

        That’s not quite accurate. The Democrats have spent more in the past four years than the Republicans in the previous six. In fact while Nancy Pelosi reigned in the house for four years she probably spent more money (with Harry Reid’s help) than any woman in history! She spent either 5,150,000 or 5,170,000 MILLION DOLLARS which is 14 TIMES more than all the gold we have in the U.S. Treasury and that’s if we value it at 1400 an ounce. We can argue who is right and who is wrong but it will make little difference when the result of all this borrowing and spending by BOTH DEMOCRATS AND REPUBLICANS causes the price of food and fuel and everything else we really use to triple in price. When? I don’t know, but some smarter people than I expect this within two years.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        Though they did fail to reign in spending during the Bush admin, which ticked me off because I expected them to do that, you cannot possible accuse them of spending anywhere near what the democrats spend. When the dems spend, we pay for it forever. Like the Department of Energy Carter started way back when, to supposedly wean us off our dependance on foreign oil. Gee BigBad, we are using more now than ever, and we are paying over 200,000 people salaries in this ever growing Department of Energy, which never did do what it was founded to do. That is the kind of growth the democrats make. And guess who pays for it? Yes, it is, the taxpayer. All Obama has grown, is government jobs, and again, who pays for it? Us taxpayers. Dont even try to compare republican spending with democrats. A lot of the republican spending in their admins is paying for these social agencies and departments the democrats have built up. And thats a fact.

    • http://yahoo Bob

      I agree, that there is not a free lunch; however, I don’t worship business, as conservatives do.

      • Richard Pawley

        Well, I’m a conservative (in some things) and moderate in others, but I don’t worship business. I do realize that we have fewer manufacturing jobs today with a population of 306-310 million than we did in 1940 with a population half as many. It is estimated that we may lose as many as another million jobs this year if we keep buying Chinese goods and if we are so rich how come 43 million are on food stamps, unable or unwilling to work. The government’s new way of figuring unemployment is that when a person stops getting unemployment benefits they are considered employeed. Soon we will not be able to pay even the interest on our massive debt. Over 40% of those who do work spend more each year than they earn. We have a slim chance of stopping the collapse of the dollar (they are creating 70,000 MILLION out of thin air each month just like Germany did in 1921-23 and Yugoslavia did 20 years ago and Zimbabwe has been doing for a decade) but it will involve shared pain. If we are going to survive as any kind of a nation of importance we are going to have to stop borrowing and stop spending and free up business to operate in this country again or you will see povery in this country on a scale you cannot imagine. We already have the highest corporate tax rates in the world. Only Japan was higher and they are in the process of lowering their taxes. If you want to see a ten year old, but still excellent simplistic example of how the rich get bigger tax breaks just go here: http://www.youtube.com/user/HowTheWorldWorks#p/u/1/Xj7nRc3_EG0

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        Without business, we collapse as a society. Do you not understand that? Without business, we dont have jobs to feed our families. Do you not understand that? And yet you demonize business. Unbelievable.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      That is the lefts socialism thought tank at work Warrior. The dont realize that socialism fails as soon as you run out of other peoples money.

  • David

    S C just left out one point. “our” government are indeed the slave masters, but not the slave owners. They are just a couple links up the food chain. The slave owners are the international bankers, and businesses, the government does what these people tell them to.

    • wayne

      David, this is because these people pay off the crooked leader of Congress by some means. Why don’t they allow us to buy our prescription drugs from Canada, but will allow us to buy our food from all over the country? Why do they allow tax incentives to corporations to move abroad? These two things may may sense to some of you, but I could never understand it. We need to know why these bills never make it to a vote, or if they ever get that far, we need to know what Congress Member votes against them. These are some of the questions we need to ask our independent Congress Members. Congress Members works for themselves, not for the folks. We need to get this typoe of Congress Member out of Congress. The only way to do this is to know how they are voting.

      • Richard Pawley

        It used to be that rich individuals went to congress to serve but now some go to congress to get rich. That’s a big difference. We need to watch the new people who have just started and see that they don’t get seduced by the establishment. You have no idea of all the temptations that are on the table for these people and it takes those of high moral character to refuse them all. It’s why the founding fathers said that our nation was designed only to work for a spiritual people who were ‘self-regulating’ so to speak, those who would do what was right because it was right. Of course they used better language than I have but you understand what I mean.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        The corporations abroad is a slippery slope to me. On the one hand, if you move out the country, and want to sell your stuff here, you should have to pay a huge tariff on it. But then again, when I see what they do to successful business’s, taxing the living hell out of them, why wouldnt they want to leave. They reward failures like GM and Chrysler, and give them billions of dollars for not running their business’s correctly, but successful companies are taxed and taxed and taxed, and they are getting tired of it, and one by one they are leaving. As the liberal left demonizes success, more and more are leaving. Thus, this is why I call it a slippery slope, because many leave because of this. Lets get it right again in this country, and start rewarding success again, and dealing with failure correctly, not rewarding it.

        • Richard Pawley

          Certainly can’t disagree with that. We did have the 2nd highest corporation taxes in the world but I believe we are now in 1st place (not something to be proud of).

    • Disgusted

      Yeah. The Federal Reserve! That’s who runs this country – they dictate everything down to who will be the next president. I think they had a huge hand in getting Obama elected. They wanted him in that office in the worst way and we will never, ever know how much they put in his coffers to get him there.

      We need to abolish the Federal Reserve!

      • LimestoneFreedom

        AMEN!!!!!!

      • Will-CA

        Amen!
        The Money Changers
        Notice the similarity. History keeps repeating. Just the names/labels change.

      • Steve

        I don’t disagree with you in getting rid of the FED but then what? The idiots in washington are just as corrupt. Are you thinking that it would take them longer to print the money because they are more stupid?

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          Of the lesser of two evils, if the fed was abolished and the jerks in Washington were the ones fleecing us, at least most of the money would stay in the country, instead of all being controlled and taken by foreigners, which is what the fed is made up of.

      • Dan az

        Disgusted Me to!
        To rally the people, the people must have hope in the possibility. When we look at proposals others proclaim, we see nice rhetoric but no real hope in the proposals. The problem remains; how do we lawfully return control over the powers that be without interrupting commerce or the services that provide food on the table and fuel in the tanks?

        The perception others provide implies that the government is broken and cannot be fixed; thus, they promote radical change that can’t possibly be made without destroying our economy. Like politicians they are full of promises but when their promotions are reviewed in the face of the law, they fail. Following such paths will not save our nation, but it will destroy it. Rebellion, replacement or restructuring are not the answers. Only the people learning the law and applying it can resolve the woes our nation faces.

        The powers that be maintain authoritarian control over the powers of governance for one reason only—the people do not control them by applying the law. Thus, the remedy remains—learn the law and apply it.

        As the people learn the law with its history, they learn the difference between our actual original jurisdiction government and the corporate body in control of our nation today. As they learn the law, they also learn how to apply the law; and, as that happens, we begin to hold government to its constitutional limitations. We reseat our original jurisdiction government and return it to control over the powers of corporate governance. As that happens, our real money monetary system is returned and it naturally returns stabilization to the economy. As the people discover the reality of the relationships they control, their ability to control government and preserve their rights becomes obvious and balance is restored. The necessary element to this restoration is the people have to repent of their ignorance by learning and applying the law of our land.

        • Richard Pawley

          What you say is well and good but it takes a moral people who do what is right because it is right. The founders of our great nation had a sense of self-sacrifice “our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor” Many lost everything to build what we take for granted today because we are to much into Hollywood and sports. It takes interested people of high moral character as the founders knew and even said.

          • Dan az

            Then Richard it would be time for them to return to Gods laws.Sovereignty comes from God. God created mankind in His own image and gave man dominion, agency and possession, which are the three elements that together define “Sovereignty”. What God created no man can remove. Therefore, as it is with all mankind, your sovereign nature exists and you are responsible for it.

            You cannot contract it away or otherwise dismiss your personal responsibility to your sovereignty. When you enter into a contract your sovereignty is not bound; quite the contrary, it is the fact that you are sovereign that gives you the ability to bind contracts. In other words, if you were not sovereign you could not enter into a contract.

            Sovereignty, even as mankind received the same from God, is the ultimate source of all political power. Accordingly, as people gather together, they form governments by entrusting a portion of their respective individual sovereignty with the so formed government so that it can use the collective sovereignty to function. Of course, that entrusting action does not remove the individual from their responsibility to make sure the government uses their sovereignty lawfully and correctly. Each of the people remains responsible for their sovereignty and accordingly for their government’s use of the same. That is to say, the people remain responsible for their government’s use of the power the people granted government.

            To further address this very matter we point to Osborn v. The Bank of the United States 22 U.S. 738; 9 Wheat. 738, wherein the nation’s Supreme Court ruled it is impossible to pass political power through a contract.

            The bottom line: the only way anyone can possibly lose their sovereign nature is, God could take it from them and that will not happen in this lifetime; in fact, if you follow the Law of God that will never happen.

            Accordingly, it is impossible for anyone to give up their sovereignty.

          • kate8

            Dan az – Great post! And a great reminder of who we are.

            Wow. You guys are all really coming to life around here! I love it.

          • Dan az

            Thanks kate I thought you would like that!

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            I agree with Dan. The Good Lord gives, and the Good Lord will take away. And the way this country just keeps excluding Him and kicking Him out of everything, I would remove my hand from blessing them also. This is where we are at right now.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        Agreed.

    • wayne

      Bob, common sense would judge who done the most work. If you are working hard, and your buddy is sitting around in the shade drinking beer, or what ever, and not helping you, it would not take a genius to figure out who as doing all the work. In fact even you, Bob, would notice this. If I have not convinced you by now, I never will, nor would anyone else. This is the same thing our government is doing to us, not listening, or don’t give a darn.

      • http://yahoo Bob

        What about the business owner, who hires his son-in-law, who doesn’t do anything, either? I don’t worship business, as repubs do.

        Or how about the business owner, who hires his cronies?

        • bob wire

          Hmm? WELL, It’s hard to soar with the eagles and fly around with a bunch of turkeys.

          I never noticed it working for me.

        • Vicki

          Bob says:
          “What about the business owner, who hires his son-in-law, who doesn’t do anything, either?”

          What about it? The business owner can hire his son in law for any reason he wants. Its HIS business and HIS money, not yours.

          Bob: “Or how about the business owner, who hires his cronies?”

          Same answer. Its HIS business and HIS money, not yours.

        • http://?? Joe H.

          Bob,
          If you owned a business, would you not want the right to hire whom you want?? How would you like it if you were ready to hire your son and the government came along and said no you have to hire John Doe here???

          • Richard Pawley

            What Bob doesn’t seem to understand is when all our business is gone where is the money going to come from to support him or others who depend on government. There will always be those who like to lord it over others, control them and provide for them. We used to call them slave owners and we fought a war to get rid of that. However, if we don’t wake up there will soon be even less business than there is now, and there will be much higher taxes, and really high inflation, and few benefits because if they just print paper and call it money soon no one is going to want it, just like the foreigners who don’t want dollars now but have little choice, but they are working on getting something else, SDR’s or something other than dollars. We don’t have much time to wake up and straighten things out and I believe that this is one of the reasons why so many tens of thousands leave the US each year, hoping they will do better in a hundred other places. Unfortunately if we tank I suspect we will take the world with us. Hopefully we can postpone that for a few more years or even a decade? Don’t count on it but we can hope.
            By the way, are you the Joe H. who wrote something about how mediating on a flame had helped you lower your blood pressure back in 2009? If you are, well I answered something you said back then last year and thought you might be interested. Check here if you are:
            http://www.personalliberty.com/news/study-meditation-can-lower-blood-pressure-and-increase-coping-ability-19468858/#comment-272351

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          If a business owner hires a worthless son in law, and other friends who arent doing the job properly, they will lose their arse and the business will fold. Unless the government interferes with the free market, and props up business like they did with GM and Chrysler, by giving them billions of our dollars, you know, to buy future UAW votes and all. But point being, if a business does what you say, and hires a bunch of no doers, they arent going to succeed long, and thats just the way it is. So let them hire bad hires, and they will have to pay for it by closing down and losing money.

    • DaveH

      Slave ownership can only be had by force. Those Big Companies can force us to do NOTHING unless Big Government backs them up. It can and it does. The blame lands squarely on Big Government’s shoulders. And both major political parties are to blame. The only difference between the two is that the Democrats have successfully blindered their followers to that fact.
      There is only one way to end the relationship between favored Capitalists and their bought-and-paid-for Politicians. That is to get the Government out of the Marketplace. Restore the power to the consumers and end the competition-stifling regulations that are forced on businesses by the Government.
      I believe that few people understand the difference between regulation and harm done to the consumer. Regulations present obstacles that all businesses must overcome, whether those businesses are doing the consumer wrong or doing the consumer right. Presenting more hoops to those businesses costs the economy (and the consumer) more money. It also costs the businesses more money, so smaller businesses who can’t afford the hoop-jumping go out of business. Less supply results in higher costs to the consumer. Some regulations are promoted by Big Corporations for just that purpose — to stifle competition.
      Licensing laws also stifle competition resulting in higher prices to the consumer. Some Licensing laws seem logical, but what is keeping the consumer from demanding some kind of credentials and references before using the services of any provider? Nothing but laziness.
      Many of us, for instance, would be happy to seek the advice of certain health providers who weren’t highly degreed or licensed, but nevertheless knowledgeable and whose services were much more affordable. We usually don’t have that option because Government will come down hard on those who seek to provide it. If people choose to see a witch doctor, that should be their choice in a Free society. My choice is to avoid doctors like the plague they often are. So far, nobody has come along to force otherwise on me. At least not until the Healthcare Bill was passed.

      • eddie47d

        Once again Dave H. you are only partially right. You make it sound so simple yet it never is. It’s never as black and white as you want it to be. Big Companies can and do “force” us to accept their products.This has been true since the beginning of time. Buy from me or do without. Can you produce your own oil and gas for your car? I doubt it so you are “forced” to buy it from someone or park that car. Did you build your own computer? I doubt it! Can you make that pair of jeans that you are wearing or any other piece of clothing? Maybe,but unless you want to run around naked then you are “forced” to buy from someone or do without. I can’t make my own auto so I’m “forced” to buy it from someone and have to pay the price they want or do without. It was probably the same in pioneer days.If you wanted to move your family out West you had to buy a covered wagon or you just didn’t go. That covered wagon salesman also knew that the pioneer wanted to make a new life for himself but could charge whatever he wanted.That could make or break the wishes of the pioneer and “force” him to make a decision. Now if you don’t want anything life has to offer then you are correct no force needed.

        • DaveH

          As usual, Eddie trys to pass illogical statements as if they were logical.
          No, Eddie, it is not logical to say that an owner of a product must sell to you at the price of your choosing. Of course, you would like it that way. Only a Liberal would try to pass personal self-serving opinion as logic.
          If you don’t like their offer, then create your own product, bypass them. You, Eddie, are the one trying to make complexity seem simple. In your world, committees of uninterested middlemen (at our expense) get to decide politically what is fair and what is not. That is complex (and very expensive). What is simple is recognizing ownership of property (that includes money) and respecting that. If you want somebody else’s property, then earn it from them. Don’t take it from them (theft, the Liberal way). Your solution is Force, Eddie. Mine is voluntary choice.
          You have a very strange concept of Force, Eddie.
          Know, Eddie, that I don’t post these comments in an effort to change you. That is a lost cause. I wouldn’t even come close to presuming that I could reverse decades of your Union brainwashing. Rather I post my replies for others who maybe aren’t so thoroughly indoctrinated that they have lost the ability to think logically and learn.

        • Vicki

          Eddie47d writes:
          “Once again Dave H. you are only partially right. You make it sound so simple yet it never is. It’s never as black and white as you want it to be. Big Companies can and do “force” us to accept their products.This has been true since the beginning of time. Buy from me or do without. Can you produce your own oil and gas for your car? I doubt it so you are “forced” to buy it from someone or park that car. ”

          Well, actually I CAN produce my own fuel for my car. You may even have heard of it cause it is a popular “green” fuel. BioDiesel.

          Interestingly enough I could even produce my own oil and gas based on crude oil. Oh wait. There are all those government regulations.

          There you go. The problem is where it always has been. The government.

        • Dan az

          poor eddiee
          You really are a liberal cant do anything for your self but whine.I make my own power hence no bill!I make my own fuel and if I wanted to I would make my own clothes as well,Where do you think it all comes from?I’ll give you a clue Hard working people.If you dont need it dont buy it!No one is holding a gun to your head.We live the lives that we create So to have some one tell ME that I cant do that or I must buy that I say FY.very much. The problem that I see with you and your whining is that you dont know how to live or survive with out big brothers hand outs so you steal it as if it was yours in the first place.Well eddiee its not yours and its not the US corp. either its mine!

          • http://?? Joe H.

            Dan az,
            What eddie seems to forget is that if company “A” says buy my gas or do without, I’ll simply go to company “B” and buy it there! I company “C” says buy my car or do without I will simply go to company “D” through”Z” and buy theirs! None of the companies by themselves can make me buy their product as long as competition and variety exhists unless the government gets involved as in insurance! That, my friend, is the AMERICAN way!!

          • Dan az

            Hey Joe
            It always amazes me the facts dont mean a thing to them.The same old story day in an day out.I believe they refuse to look at any site that states the truth they just entertain them selves here by bashing us and believe what they say is the gospel.I had an uncle like that if I would say the sun was shinning he would say no it wasnt.It didnt matter what you said it would always be the opposite.Oh well another day.Hey how did you make out with that cold whether up there?There where places up here that reached 30 below with out the wind.So much for the sunny state and warmer climate.

        • eddie47d

          The majority of people Vickie and Dave are truly “forced” to buy the majority of products out there. Very few people have more than 2 0r 3 skills where they can survive on their own for life. We all depend on others and have to buy things from others. Dave always has the notion that 317,000,000 Americans can each have a business which is an impossibility but he keeps trying. That is just pie in the sky talk from him. Even survivalists have to buy plenty of supplies from others and aren’t really independent.Even a billionaire is forced to buy from others but that is immaterial to him since he could probably buy the business that is selling.

          • DaveH

            Apparently you have no understanding at all of what constitutes “force”. What I don’t understand is why a person of such obvious ignorance would want to engage in debates with people who have a clue?
            Your ears are bookends to a vacuum, Eddie.

          • eddie47d

            Your closed mind doesn’t need bookends.

          • Vicki

            Eddie47d writes:
            “The majority of people Vickie and Dave are truly “forced” to buy the majority of products out there.”

            Eddie the only people forcing you, me and 300+, million other people in the USA to buy a product is the Federal Government who threatens us AT GUNPOINT to buy health insurance.

            For our amusement, eddie, name something that you are “forced” to buy.

            The astute observer will have noticed that while the government has only just begun to force us to buy a product they have for many years forced us to NOT buy a whole range of products in multiple industries. Feel the chains yet?

          • kate8

            eddie – Sadly, when the doodoo hits the fan it’s going to be people like you, who can’t do for themselves, who will be rioting and looting to survive.

            I suppose it’s not your fault. Government has seen to it that people no longer know how to be self-sufficient. You feel at the mercy of those who produce products you desire, and you don’t really even understand the difference between what you truly NEED and that which just makes life more convenient. That will soon change.

            The time is coming when we will all see just how resourceful we can be. Those of my generation learned how to grow food, make clothing, and improvise whenever necessary. You’ll be amazed at how much you can do without.

            I would suggest that you get yourself a good book on survival, eddie. Otherwise, you are going to be just another problem prepared folks are going to have to contend with.

          • DaveH

            So there we have it folks. The Liberals have become so twisted now that they think it is force if we don’t sell them our property at the price they desire.
            There is just no reasoning with people like that. They’re too far gone.

          • http://?? Joe H.

            kate8,
            I could just picture eddie sitting by a campfire chewing on a hide to cure the leather!!! (the thought is so hilarious!!!)

          • DaveH

            Where did I say that “317,000,000 Americans can each have a business”?
            You aren’t the only Ignorant Liberal whining about unfair prices, are you? Get together, pool your monies, start businesses. What’s keeping you? Well, maybe Big Government regulations, which make it extremely difficult to start a business, but then you guys want all that regulation, so you can hardly use that as an excuse.
            You obviously think you are a capable man (I don’t, but that is beside the point), so what is holding you back?
            Start your own businesses. Give your product away. Pay your workers more than you can afford. Run those businesses any old way you want. Oh, yeah, I know, when you fail you will whine that the companies that made the effort to run their companies efficiently “forced you out of business”.
            There are no real excuses, Eddie. You are just a self-absorbed person who knows what he wants and thinks he should be able to force others to give it to him.

          • kate8

            DaveH – I actually know people who think the sole reason for business to exist is to provide jobs. They find it contemptible that business would exist primarily for profit.

            WTH? Does reason no longer exist?

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          Sorry eddie, your all wrong here, not Dave. Nobody, and I repeat, nobody is forcing me to buy a car, to buy gas, to buy a computer. None of it. Your insinuating they do, and your all wet. I dont even own a computer at home, and if I had to, I could ride a bike or run to work. But I CHOOSE to drive. I CHOOSE. Nobody is forcing me to buy anything eddie. Your wrong, Dave is right. You lose, AGAIN.

  • calan

    David summed it up in simple terms and few words
    It is the Bankers and greedy corporations who work the puppet strings
    of the government officials.
    We are conditioned to be distracted by arguring back and fourth about
    what party is a better slave master….when we need to find away
    to get our Bankers and greedy corporations to change their ways.
    We can only achive that by all…all…pulling together under on tent
    to do it.
    Together we can stand….divided we will surely fall

    • Vicki

      It helps when we understand that we ARE slaves and the chains that bind us are the millions of regulations that can be used at any moment to punish us.

      Pointing out that when the Democrats had full control of the House, Senate and Presidency and they did NOTHING to reduce or eliminate the chains should have made it clear to liberals here that conservatives are not their enemy. Big government is.

      • eddie47d

        No,The Democrats had the power but refused to use it.That is what angers other Democrats. Was Obama too cautious? Maybe! Did he give in or give up?Bush said “he is the decider” and made unpopular choices. I think Obama was trying to avoid that. He made some of his own mistakes but by not being decisive enough.

        • Vicki

          eddie47d writes:
          “No,The Democrats had the power but refused to use it.”

          That would be yes the democrats had the power to roll back big government but refused to use it. Thus agreeing with my point. Thank you

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          The democrats had the power, and the used it for what? To force health care down our throats that nobody wanted. And it will be rescinded later, count on it. All other things, they didnt use this so called power eddie, because they didnt have a clue what to do. They came into this thing without any plans, without any course of action, just paid millions upon millions on TV adds chanting “change, change, change”, and bamboozled millions of uneducated voters. And the republicans helped them by running 150 year old John McCain, a career politician, at a time when people are sick of career politicians. A big mistake. But like I said, Obama never mentioned any kinds of plans or course of actions, nothing. He didnt have to, as the liberal press never asks their own those kinds of questions. Thats how it was eddie, and thats how it is.

  • Jim

    Dave is correct. The international bankers are the core problem in this world. Either directly or indirectly they have the governments in their control. Therefore the real problem is money. Who has it and who controls it. Watch this, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U71-KsDArFM and tell me I am wrong.

    The Constitution for the United States of America does not authorize the federal government to be in the banking business nor to contract with a private bank i.e. the federal reserve bank. Whoever controls the supply of money has the ability to control everything.

    At this moment, across America there is a lively discussion going on about how to correct the banking issue. The individual States have the ability and the authority to set up and operate their own State owned banks. The federal government has the ability and the authority to issue currency without borrowing it from the privately owned “Federal Reserve Bank” on which they pay interest. That is to say you and I pay the interest. When the “United States” issues the currency there is no interest attached to it. In other words ‘debt free money’.

    If we can correct the money issue most of the other problems will disappear.

    • Will-CA
    • Dan az

      Jim your right!
      Sorry about the length of this but it needs to be read!
      The United States Code (USC) Title 22 § 286 reads:

      Ӥ 286. Acceptance of membership by the United States in International Monetary Fund.
      ”The President is hereby authorized to accept membership for the United States in the International Monetary Fund (hereinafter referred to as the ”Fund”), and in the International Bank for Reconstruction and Development (hereinafter referred to as the ”Bank”), provided for by the Articles of Agreement of the Fund and the Articles of Agreement of the Bank as set forth in the Final Act of the United Nations Monetary and Financial Conference dated July 22, 1944, and deposited in the archives of the Department of State. (July 31, 1945, ch. 339, § 2, 59 Stat. 512.) Short titles: … May be cited as the ‘Bretton Woods Agreements Act’.
      ”Other provisions:
      Par value modification. For the Congressional direction that the Secretary of the Treasury maintain the value in terms of gold of the Inter-American Development Bank’s holdings of United States dollars following the establishment of a par value of the dollar at $38 for a fine troy ounce of gold pursuant to the Par Value Modification Act and for the authorization of the appropriations necessary to provide such maintenance of value, see 31 USC § 449a.” (accents in red added).

      [It should be noted that recently, to cover-up the Bretton Woods Agreements (hereinafter ”BWA”) control and the quitclaim of the United States Government to the IMF, the United States Congress abolished the references in the USC referring to the BWA. Other than removing such references that abolishment had no effect on the BWA.]

      The Quit Claim Deed
      The agreement further transfers the assets of the United States Treasury to the IMF by stating words to the effect of: ‘the United States Treasury is now the Individual Drawing account of the IMF’.

      Think about it.
      “The President is hereby authorized to accept membership for the United States in the IMF”

      The President is authorized by whom? By Congress? No. According to the Act the authorization came from, ”the Articles of Agreement of the Fund and the Articles of Agreement of the Bank as set forth in the Final Act of the United Nations Monetary and Financial Conference dated July 22, 1944”, a.k.a. The Bretton Woods Agreement’s final act.

      Even if Congress could have authorized such a thing, where would they get the authority to so do? Certainly not from the Constitution, and Congress can’t lawfully do anything the Constitution doesn’t authorize them to do. Even under the President’s dictatorial authority of martial law, the President cannot lawfully do anything not authorized in the Constitution.
      http://teamlaw.org/

    • DaveH

      Article 1, Section 8 of the US Constitution:
      “No State shall enter into any Treaty, Alliance, or Confederation; grant Letters of Marque and Reprisal; coin Money; emit Bills of Credit; make any Thing but gold and silver Coin a Tender in Payment of Debts”.
      And Jim, although I share your dislike of the Federal Reserve, why would you want to give that power to the State Governments? Most likely they would abuse that power just as the Federal Reserve has.
      The only real solution is to insist that the Government get back to coining money out of precious metals. That way they couldn’t just arbitrarily flood the market with more money like they can now with paper money.
      One of our biggest problems is to educate people to the insidious nature of paper money. Very few people understand the workings of the fiat money system, and it really isn’t that hard to learn why it isn’t conducive to a robust economy.

  • Arlee

    I want to hear about answers and fixes. How do we wipe out “the shadow government” (the czars and like bureaucracies)? How do we squelch the entitlements and built in pensions that are breaking this country? What to do about Unions that are controlling our productivity? How do we encourage investors to back U.S. companies? How to implement “Made in the U.S.A.”? Can we back off the Environmentalists enough to get back to harvesting our own timber, drilling for oil, investing in new technologies and growing our own food?
    We CAN be a great nation again….but we need to get some people in charge that have common sense.

    • Lomax

      You mention entitlement programs eating up a lot of government money and I presume that you are talking mostly about Social Security. Social Security, when it was set up, was sold as an insurance program that was to be administered by the government but not be part of the government. It is a Ponzi scheme, but in 1964 when Lyndon Johnson and his rubber stamp Congress illegally passed an unconstitutional law to tap into Social Security funds to cover the expenses of the Viet Nam war and his “Great Society,” the government began to steal funds from Social Security every year until now Social Security is broke. The Federal Government has stolen trillions of dollars from Social Security. If that money were replaced and the Federal Government paid a reasonable amount of interest over the years, say 6% average, there would be no problem today. Also, the system has been abused by putting many thousands of people on the rolls that have paid nothing into the system and don’t belong in the system. Also, many people are not included in the system that should be, government workers for instance as well as union members. Social Security should not be broke at this point in time, but incompetent air headed corrupt politicians have put an unsustainable drain on a system that would probably fail anyway at some point in time although that point would not normally be now.

      • Disgusted

        And now they want to run our Health Care! How can anyone with the knowledge of what they have done to SS be agreeable to Government Run HealthCare? Too many SHEEP drinking the government koolaid – everyone needs to wakeup!

      • DaveH

        Excellent comment, Lomax, but it has one flaw. Where did any man get the right to take his neighbor’s money away for his own good? If your neighbor told you he could invest your savings more wisely, would that give him the right to forcibly take it from you? And in fact, our neighbors in Government (as you pointed out) haven’t even invested that money wisely. Social Security is a travesty that should not be forced on any more young people. We need to get our Government out of the business of protecting people from themselves.

      • BigBadJohn

        Also, the system has been abused by putting many thousands of people on the rolls that have paid nothing into the system and don’t belong in the system. Also, many people are not included in the system that should be,
        ******************************************8

        It is my understanding that you must have paid into social security to get any out of if. Even if you are disabled, unless you paid into the system, you can not collect social security disability.

        Please prove me wrong.

        • Dan az

          BBJ
          Would be glad to!
          The United States has some 20 such agreements with other nations, including Canada. Totalization allows a wage earner from one nation who lives in another country during part of his career to get retirement earnings credit for the time spent abroad. In general, such arrangements amount to a reciprocity agreement between two nations, whereby retirement taxes are reconciled for the benefit of a noncitizen worker with his home country’s government retirement system.

          However, the Bush administration’s deal with Mexico has drawn extensive criticism. A congressional hearing in 2003 revealed that the Mexican totalization agreement vastly underestimated the costs to U.S. taxpayers. Mexicans who worked in the United States, their dependents, and survivors could draw Social Security benefits after only six quarters of U.S. work (compared with 40 quarters for an American worker to qualify), and Mexican illegal aliens could get Social Security credit for unlawful U.S. work.37
          Bush signed the treaty along with clintoon and if you need any more proof then I would suggest you look it up!Prove me wrong!

      • j.McConnell

        An other problem is that some indigent individuals with illnesses, real or alleged, can collect
        from Social Security.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        On speaking of social security. Im sick and tired of hearing that the baby boomers are such a draw on it, that this is why it is broke. Really? So I need someone to tell me, for the 40 to 60 years all these baby boomers were working, and dumping incredible amounts of money into it, when not that many were drawing out, should there not have been a huge, huge surplus in there from all these millions of baby boomers dumping money in there all these years? We never hear them talk about that. The government stuck their sticky little fingers in there and raped it, and gave it away to illegal aliens and other people who never paid a time into it. They screwed it up, just like they did the school system, medi-care, medi-caid, the U.S. Post office and everything the government runs, including the federal budget is broken and bankrupt. And it is so damn scary, that there are so many people that in lieu of knowing all this, want them to manage our health care system. Lunacy. Complete lunacy.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        And now they are trying to blame in on the baby boomers, the same ones that dumped billions into social security for 40-50 years or more, to where there should be huge, huge amounts in there, except Lyndon Johnson and Bill Clinton spent it all.

    • wayne

      Yes! we can. We are the silent majority, and have the power, we just need to get the grass roots folks of this nation educated on what is happening to this country. We need to get them stirred up enough to to get off their duff, and go out and vote for the candidate that will do the right thing for the country.

      • Dan az

        Wayne
        The best way to do that would be give the laws that have been broken by all in guv and repeat it on the air nightly!The laws where ment for us to hold them accountable Not the other way around.Use the laws of the constitution and bill of rights we signed them they signed them and they broke the laws.
        http://teamlaw.org/
        Use these laws look them up its not that hard to see how we have been used.

  • Lomax

    I have been writing my Senator frequently and telling him that we need to do away with whole bureaucracies in the government, and naming a few of the worst, such as IRS and replace it with a reasonable sales tax of about 6% with an absolute cap of 10%, NEA, all government unions, Dept. of the Interior and let the control of all lands that the Federal Government has control over go back to the states, (such as all National Parks which the Federal Government had no right to take over to begin with), public radio and television, National Endowment of the Arts, and it goes on and on. I don’t know if they have paid attention or not, but maybe if enough of us do that maybe they will.

    • wayne

      Good job, Lomax. I write my Congress Members a lot too. We need tens of thousands of other people who will do the same thing. At times I think to myself, what good does it do for me to write my Congress Members. My little individual message will not do any good. We need some way to make contact with everyone, nationwide, to urge them to write their members of Congress on things that we most of us can agree on. I hoping that we have enough people in this country with enough common to see what is happening to this nation.

    • DaveH

      Even better would be a real Flat Tax. I’m not talking about a Flat Rate Income Tax which is often called “flat tax”. I’m talking about every adult being liable for the same amount. Let those, who due to some accident or misfortune can’t pay, jump through the paperwork hoops. The rest of us would just cut the check and be done with it. We all (under the Constitution) have equal protections, so why shouldn’t we pay equally? Of course the leaders wouldn’t want such a system, because obviously the people would demand less and more efficient government if we all had to pay equally for it. So we would have to nudge our representatives more than gently to institute such a system.
      For those who haven’t pondered the other side of the story about “Fair Tax” (sales tax), consider this:
      http://mises.org/daily/1814

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        Flat tax with no loop holes. That way, say it is 10 percent for easy figuring here, I would buy a 400.00 boat, and pay my 40.00 tax. My fair 10 percent. When John Kerry goes and buys a 4 million dollar yacht, he can pay 40,000.00 tax on it. His fair 10 percent. No matter how you look at it, 10 percent is 10 percent, and it would be equal across the board. That is the only way your going to get fairness in it.

  • http://yahoo Len Giddens Jr.

    Mr. Leochner you have wasted a lot of words. People on both sides know what you have just written. So if you are what you say you are join the fight, leave the petty stuff to the hard leaning left. Your action means more than any million words you can write.

    • bob wire

      I think ,”throwing grandmaw under the bus” was a shot that came from the far right somewhere! When it comes to trite, pettiness, the far right is superseded by no one. They have turned the practice into an art form.

      As for myself, I’ve enjoyed it, as I enjoy left handed humor that leans to the right. Bob Newheart, Barney Miller and Cheers kind of humor hit my funny bone and keep me in tears of laughter until my body hurts.

      The only time it ceases to be funny is when some of you speak of guns, of lock and loading and such, suggesting and inferring bodily harm to people with opposing ideas. That’s not funny, that’s simply sick ideas from sick people. The hillbilly, red neck far right is loaded with such individuals, much like the far left is loaded with a different kind of sick freak.

      To be hated and despised by such people is a great compliment and testament to sanity.

      • marvin

        bob wire
        i am not a hill billie a red neck or far right i am thou an american citizen with rights given to me at birth ,one is the right to protect my self my famly and country from any that would do me harm by hook or crook ,the democrats in congress spent day after day naming post office and taking over healt care giving gays more rights ,more unelected czar,the deficit whent for around 8 trillion in 2006 to over 14 trillion in 2010 with 3 trillion in the last 2 years after obama was elected,now the demicrats are crying the repub won,t let them put any amendments in on repelling obama care, i am one of the 60% 0r 47% depending on the pole that want this boondoggle repelled and replaced with something that don,t take over healtcare and bankrup this country,you may be your brother keeper but i am not no virginia their an,t no santa and no free lunch and most evil rich pay more tax in one day they all the poor that pay no tax or vary few,what gives you or anyone the right to say if i die and have 100 million in assets that the federal goverment can take over half, or i should pay for your healt ins or help you buy you a car or spend hundreds of billions on illegals that are not citizen and have no rights ,but to be arrested detained and deported, the dream act it all for the children,watch ,which way home a documentry from hbo on illegal children coming here on their own not by their mom or dads

        • wayne

          I think Bob is a nut case, and does not know any better, Marvin. We will over look him.

        • bob wire

          When it comes to “pettiness” the far right excels and little completion.

          But! I look forward to changing that and consider it a challenge.

          That you might not like the message is understandable.

        • bob wire

          Oh Marvin ! you brought forward so some much, with no spacing and little punctuation. let me see what I can do here. ~

          First, ~ while you perhaps are not the hillbilly/redneck ~ we have them in the far right and left ~ they are in your rank in file. ~ there is nothing you or I can do about it ~ but to deny it would be foolish. And they say and think the most off the wall things, the “right” has enjoyed a bumper crop.

          “i am one of the 60% 0r 47% depending on the pole that want this boondoggle repelled and replaced with something that don,t take over healtcare and bankrup this country,you may be your brother keeper but ~~”

          well, we are our brothers keeper, but it does have it limits ! ~

          and if it’s free ! why are so many complaining about being “FORCED” to pay? ~~ That makes little sense Marvin! And if it not free and we complain about paying ~ how is it to break the nation while we pay?

          WHAT am I missing ? ~ What are you missing?

          as far as inheritance tax ~ while I’m with you on that ~ but we need to be aware dead people need little money ~ and that 500 million dollars is only spitting in the ocean compared to what the truly wealthy are working with.

          It’s easy to have 500 million tied up in asset and have trouble meeting a payroll. ~ In today age 500 million while wonder to consider having ~ is truly small change in big play.

          The tax codes need serious work!

          I don’t know if you are a poker player or not ~ but if you and I sit down to play ~ and you have brought 10,000 to play with and I 250,000. I will have your 10,000 before you need to get up an go pee. Even if my luck was bad, ~ I could use the rules and the power of my money to force you out.

          That’s just the power of large amounts of money at work and the way things fall.

          This characteristic of money, is but one reason for an inheritance tax.

          It’s to keep the few wealthy from completely taking over the world. Much like Grant took Richmond. Like water through a screen door, they’d be otherwise unstoppable.

          • DaveH

            Bob,
            Marvin’s grammar may not be the best, but you of all people have no legs to stand on when criticizing such.
            Some of your comments appear to have been written while under the spell of a hallucinogen of one sort or another.
            And most of your comments are obtuse, to say the least.

          • bob wire

            no criticism intended my friend ~ but merely stating, I felt at some disadvantage while wishing to respond in a meaningful manner as I thought his posting most worthy consideration and full of rich substance.

            And yes ! I take great “liberties” with both structure and syntax !

            and it’s to get only worse if I don’t get a raise soon!

            what more might you expect from a tired old war horse dyslexic plumber that’s still running an empire and got people waiting in the wings?

      • DaveH

        Get one thing straight, Bob. Most of the people who are saying such things as “lock and load” are talking purely about Defensive actions. People have every right in the world to defend against aggressors.
        I would like you to explain to me why it is right for Liberals to advocate forcibly taking our money, but wrong for people to talk about defending themselves against that action?

        • eddie47d

          Lock and load has been heard numerous times on this site and with few exceptions says “be prepared to take over Washington”. I have not heard it being used as a metaphor to defend ones home or loved ones.

          • DaveH

            And why do they want to take over Washington? Because Washington is helping themselves to their money and property.
            Personally, before you put words in my mouth as usual, Eddie, I think violence is not the answer. Education is much more appropriate. But if it comes to the point where a small minority of people are trampling the rights of the masses and refuse to quit that trampling, I can certainly see why some would want to resort to that. And in that case, make no mistake, it would be a defensive action, not an offensive action.

          • bob wire

            Well Dave, Lock and Load, is no joke to anyone that’s been there and done it. ~ You might as well draw down on me. My reaction is is very close to the same.

            The Talking is over and I’m left take you out. It’s very final talk David.

            Don’t taunt with such words, it’s foolish and unwise.

            It’s like saying, “I’m gonna pop a cap in your a$$” ~ it’s a serious threat and not to be taken lightly.

          • DaveH

            Bob, it sounds like you are putting words in my mouth. But your sentence structure is so disjointed that I’m not sure what you’re saying.

          • Al Sieber

            I’ve only heard that phrase”Lock and Load” used on this site to protect one’s life and loved ones also.

          • bob wire

            “I’ve only heard that phrase”Lock and Load” used on this site to protect one’s life and loved ones also.”

            well , I have, several times ~ and it’s always been out of place. I don’t like it that such phases are being used here. They serve no purpose here and need not be said by anyone.

            It is where it leads to, it’s inflammatory ~ a veiled threat.

            You are saying, “I got a gun and ready and willing to use it.” “I’m a element to be feared”, “I’m upset”

            It’s superfluous and need not be said.

            and on a side note ~ it’s most unwise to share all your thoughts that can be used as a potential material in future legal proceeding.

            anyone with any world experience and half a brain KNOWS THIS.

            It only show everyone how truly stupid you are.

            Do what you wish,~ I resister my disapproval with it.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        Your mind is a twisted wreck pal. You say the right is petty? Really? Your crazy. Plumb crazy. The left will do things, then stand there on their soap box and blame the right for it. That is petty. Like the left has caused so much hate and division in this country these last two years, more than any admin has ever caused. Yet when some whacked out gunman comes shooting up people at Sen. Giffords gathering, the left jumped on the political bandwagon right away and blamed the hate of the right for it. This nutty dude was just that, a whacked out dude, anti society, anti government, anti everything. Yet the petty left jumps on the political bandwagon right out of the gate. And you all on the left need to be aware, America is awake and listening now. When then see the evil in the left, as the continually do stupid stunts like this, more and more are turning against you, and seeing the evil from which you are made up. But being baby murderers that you all all, we pretty much already knew that. Your party is the party of petty, of lies, and of downright support of satan and his evil ways. You dishonor marriage and you honor perverted sexual behavior between the same sex. You suck live children out of their mothers wombs, and you have sex behind your wives backs and lie on national TV about it. The democrat left is the immorral party, a direct representative of satan himself. You go ahead a be a part of that, me, no sir, I want nothing to do with those evil cats.

        • Denniso

          You seem a bit cranky. And are you that upset w/ Bob,or who is it addressed to?

  • bob wire

    Myself, ~ I’d like to see the American Dream to be viewed world wide as a myth! ~ Maybe that would keep their a$$ at home. We don’t need anymore doctors we can barely understand,taxi drivers, laundry and convince store owners.

    There is no American Dream, ~ we are poor, hungry , armed, dangerous and very short tempered.

    • DaveH

      Don’t project your tendancies on the rest of us, Bob.

      • eddie47d

        Ditto to you Dave H.

      • DaveH

        As usual, Eddie follows me around like an annoying little gnat. Anybody got some bug repellent?

        • libertytrain

          I notice that as well. He seems to have some sort of envy problem with you.

          • eddie47d

            No, I’m trolling for a little more truth from Dave H. and it keeps slipping away. You know that nasty little Nat(the truth).

          • DaveH

            Eddie, the truth is that you are twisted beyond repair.

          • libertytrain

            no eddie, you’re an envious troll.

          • eddie47d

            NOT of you or Dave H. Get real.

          • libertytrain

            Of course not of me. But…..

    • bob wire

      I qualified my statement David. If you feel differently. I don’t have a problem with it.

    • http://www.mohanarun.com Mohan Arun

      I second ‘bob’… The last thing that we need in America is ‘immigrants’… Can do without them. The idea that ‘immigrants help to create jobs for Americans’ is a myth, immigrants are actually stealing jobs meant for Americans, and contribute to rich-poor divide where Americans end up on the poor side while immigrants drive around in swanky cars buying properties in Ocean Drive. The idea that ‘immigrants contribute to maintaining our technological and idealogical superiority’ is another myth. We are indigenously superior in all counts, and that came about ‘without needing’ immigrants. We can stand for ourselves.

      • Richard Pawley

        This used to be true but our high school students today are not even in the top 15 in math and science. It’s true immigrants on the lower end of the scale will do jobs that others will not. A multi-millionaire returned to the USA after living in France for 15 years and his teenage son asked him how come all the crossing guards and janitors and kitchen help at his school in Maryland were all Hispanics and this gentleman said, “I don’t know, when I left they were all black.” The scientists and physicists and engineers we let in get paid the same and we simply aren’t training enough of our own people in those fields. It’s not immigration that is the problem but illegal immigration. Both parties pretend they don’t want them but the Democrats want the votes and the Republicans want the cheap labor (or so I have heard). I know a friend of a friend in Texas who has a business and he says the Hispanics he hires are much better workers because they appreciate what they have, have a better work record, etc. I worked with some from Thailand and they would put up with things, live ten to a house, take two jobs until they could buy the house, and then the one next door. Anyone can do the same and I’ve often wondered why I didn’t myself. I don’t have the answers but we had better figure it out pretty soon. In THE LAST DAYS OF THE LATE GREAT UNITED STATES I said that after the Los Angeles Earthquake which I thought would happen last year but which I now believe will happen in the summer of 2014 that many will return to Mexico. If we destroy the value of the dollar by overprinting the result might be the same. Of course if we hadn’t have aborted 50,000,000 babies in the past 38 years there would be more than enough Americans, and even another million teacher jobs to teach them, but that is history now. Besides except for the Native American Indians we are all immigrants.

        • Richard Pawley

          Ha ha! It just dawned on me that you were making a joke. It’s late and I’m a little slow. Just got it. It’s past 1 a.m. so I’d better call it a night. Well, I needed a laugh before sleep anyway.

        • bob wire

          with all respect gentlemen, My statement came off as racist ~ and I really didn’t mean for it to be.

          BUT at this point and time in history ~ there’s “NO ROOM AT THE INN” We are booked up! we really don’t need any NEW immigrants.

          Immigration has stepped up deporting proceedings since “O” has taken office and still they are far behind.

          We must make room for our soldiers as they come home, ~ In my eyes , they come first! All these other people needs to find accommodation elsewhere.

          It’s not complicate , it’s not racist , it’s taking care of our native born.

  • Bill Martin

    I have thoroughly enjoyed and been informed by the articles you post. Thank you Bill Martin

    • Carlucci

      Bill Martin, I’m just wondering if I might know you. Do you live near the Rockies now but used to live in Texas?

  • RHSchumann

    The American dream started more than 200 years ago when we were a largely agrarian society living in an expanding country. That gave all who wanted to and were able to work plenty of opportunity to realize their personal dream. And that dream attracted the adventorous from all over the world, especially Europe. And the laws of the country made it possible. That dream ended with the Great Depression after 1929. There had been other bank crashes in the past but these were buffered because most people were able to support themselves in a rural environment. Even so, many suffered and some perished.
    To restore the dream of yesteryear would be the same as the dream of some to return to a hunter-gatherer way of life, like the Native Americans had done for millenia. That is no longer possible and neither can we return to an early 19th Century way of life.
    To do so would mean that millions of our citizens become destitute and many would die – so a few can live comfortably.
    Is that the dream you mean?
    To survive as a nation, we must learn to take care of the unfortunate and less able. Otherwise we will have a popular uprising of the ever larger underclass. Already one out of six Americans is living in poverty. Shameful for the richest nation in the world.

    • Conservative at Birth

      B.S. It is not the responsibility of GOVERNMENT to allocate my resources and property to take care of some one else. It is my responsibility to donate voluntarily those assets I deem affordable. It is none of your business how comfortably I live. If you come to steal my property you had better be armed, because I will defend it to Death.

      • Carlucci

        The churches used to take care of the impoverished, and many still do in the form of Christian ministries, charities from all Christian denominations, shelters, food banks, etc. The government has no business in charity and due to their interference and incompetence, look at the hot mess they have created with welfare.

        I don’t know why anyone looks to the government for answers, because they have caused all the problems. Like Ronald Reagan said “Government is not the solution to our problems. Government is the problem.” A friend of mine puts it another way – Bbureaucrats can screw up a wet dream”.

        I agree with the article. Fedzilla needs to be on a very strict diet and pared down at least 40%.

        • http://yahoo Bob

          reagon was an idiot.

          • JIBBS

            your way too funny……….

      • http://www.mohanarun.com Mohan Arun

        >>B.S. It is not the responsibility of GOVERNMENT to allocate my >>resources and property to take care of some one else. It is my >>responsibility to donate voluntarily those assets I deem >>affordable. It is none of your business how comfortably I live. If >>you come to steal my property you had better be armed, because I >>will defend it to Death.

        True. I am adding these: “I got my resources because I chose to put in hard effort” “I shouldnt be “required” to give any resources in cash or kind, or be required to put in efforts to help any one in the name of charity, donation, service, volunteering, social service, whatever…” I would also rewrite second sentence as “It is my OPTION whether to choose to donate voluntarily any assets of my own choosing.” A double thump-thump on the bench for this sentence “It is none of your business how comfortably I live” -> Which to me registers as “You cant tax the rich just because they are rich.” “and just because there are other people who are poor. “The poor are poor because they are poor” “That doesnt mean, as a rich person, I should be *obligated to help anyone out of their ‘misery’” I am adding this to give it additional meaning: “because my fate is of my own making. I earned it all because I got stuff and merit. Just because you didnt put in effort, doesnt obligate me to give you my money. Just because you were born with a certain ‘color’ or ‘sex’ (read: reservation for women?) doesnt entitle you to any ‘special’ treatment – this is ‘reverse discrimination’ – just as no one can be discriminated against, constitutionally, on the basis of caste, creed, color, race or religion or marital status or sexual preferences etc etc. it also follows that no one can get specialty or preferred treatment just because they belong to particular ‘class of society’ or race, etc. (unless they got real merit stuff to back it up). But I do believe someone is within rights discriminating on the basis of someone’s national origin, that comes under immigration headache, because if you are not from here, you have no right stealing our jobs… jobs meant for us. (Unless we have surplus jobs for you – which we dont, and if we have job deficiency ourselves, we cannot continue employing immigrants – they will have to seek their ‘greener pastures’ elsewhere)

    • Lomax

      Many of the “less fortunate” that you refer to are people who are in their position because they chose to be there, by dropping out of school and by other obvious bad decisions on their part, and by those that deliberately take advantage of the system, for instance those many women that have many babies that they can’t afford to have and we have to support and eventually in many instances support in prison (did you know that about 10% of our population is in prison?) and of course the illegal aliens that we are forced to put up with for political purposes (votes). The American Dream has evolved with time, but idiot politicians have made things much more difficult to attain it.

      • Angel

        If you really believe that clap-trap, you are more deluded than the socialists! Ever tried to live off of $300 a week? Not quite the life of luxury that you may think it is.

        • Disgusted

          Kenny, Is that $300 a week money they earned by working a job? If so, I would have no problem supplementing that with my tax dollar to help that person make ends meet. Or is that $300 a week money they were given for doing nothing because they are on welfare or disability? I do have a problem with that unless they are truly disabled. I know many people who know how to “work the system” and are on welfare only because they are too lazy to work! I know people who are receiving disability and are drug addicts, too fat to work, live in an environment that is damaging their health to the point that they can’t work and it is just because they are too lazy to make a change. It is easier to take free money for doing nothing that to work for it.
          I have no problem with Welfare if someone has fallen on hard times, but it should not be an unlimited way of life. It should be limited and drug tests should be administered before and during receiving the benefit. Same goes for disability benefits.
          These are not rights – they are BENEFITS.

          • BigBadJohn

            I have no problem with Welfare if someone has fallen on hard times, but it should not be an unlimited way of life. It should be limited and drug tests should be administered before and during receiving the benefit. Same goes for disability benefits.
            These are not rights – they are BENEFITS.
            **********************************

            Amen – I thought that Clinton and republicans ended “welfare as we know it” By putting a time limit on it with absolute total of month an individual can collect. If there is loop holes and ways around this – they need to be closed.

          • DaveH

            Please, Disgusted, don’t supplement their income with taxes (other peoples’ money). Supplement it with your money if you so desire.

        • DaveH

          Then quit supporting Big Government, Kenny, where the Government spends 37% of our GDP. Where the Federal Government workers have total compensation packages that are double what their private sector counterparts get.
          In a Free Market (which we are far away from) anybody that wants to work could find a job. Wages would probably go lower, but buying power would increase to a point where those lower wages would buy more goods and services.
          There are very few people who are actually in dire straights through happenstance. And those who do suffer misfortune through no fault of their own would have no trouble getting help in a prosperous free society.

          • JIBBS

            Kenny, are you still thinking ?

    • wayne

      Has anyone ever wondered why our young country has come so far in just a little over 200 years, when some of the other countries are still still lagging way behind us. We all know that it took ingenuity and a lot of hard work by Conservative people. Obviously, the folks on the left will not understand this. It certainly wasn’t the government that caused this to happen. All the government does is to stymy growth with taxes, and over regulations.

      • DaveH

        Wayne,
        There is an old saying that goes something like this:
        The Grandfather earns the fortune, the Father maintains it, and the Son spends it.
        That somewhat relates to your comment.

        • Richard Pawley

          Yes, you are both right, unfortunately.

    • chow

      Reading your name I can see that you attend the same church as Karl Marx and I’m sure you have the same belief that “For every man according to his ability and to each according to their need”.

      • http://www.mohanarun.com Mohan Arun

        That cannot be understood to mean ‘those who have the ability should be required to support those who are in need’. The only thing those with ability can do, optionally at best, is provide ways and means for those in need to build abilities for themselves. You can only teach a man how to fish, but if you want to give him a fish, give it from your own money, not from public taxpayer money! This is where socialism fails. ‘Those who are in need’ will always be aplenty, they can feign disability when they are in fact too lazy, when their intention is to live off others, and if you keep on requiring money from the ‘able’to support your definitition of ‘needy’ the able are going to lose interest and motivation because their efforts are not feeding themselves – it is going for ‘someone else’. This is why I am for ‘scrap the tax system itself’ – Let government earn its money only from establishing businesses of its own and competing with other private business in a free market – may the one with the best value for money win – the market will take care of that – Government is too easy spending money and wasting money because it all comes without ‘effort’ and when Government is made to feel the ‘effort’ that goes into earning money, it will be more careful when spending it. ‘Government should be made to earn for itself just like any other private business’ then they will know the money they give out so freely is ‘not theirs to give’.

        • DaveH

          Good thoughts, Mohan, but the last thing we want is for Government to have its own businesses. That would be a huge conflict of interest and a very obvious incentive for them to use their force to unfairly compete, and to force people to buy their products (directly or indirectly).
          Government should exist only to protect people from the force of others and just a few other functions such as coining money (from precious metals). We need to get them out of the marketplace and out of peoples’ personal choices.
          For Individual Liberty, Personal Responsibility, Free Markets, and Limited Government, Vote Libertarian:
          http://libertarianparty.org/platform

    • DaveH

      Do not confuse Charity, Schumann, with Theft. It is Theft when you Forcibly give the money of others. It is charity when you give your own money, something that Liberals are weak on.
      For those who have bought into the myth that Liberals are the generous class, watch this:
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Otl2RSe60ZY

  • Dave

    The Nazis were socialists, Nationalist Socialist Party, as well as the Russians. Full blown statism is the end result of socialism.

    • bob wire

      Yes, you are right! that was their “LABEL” anyway.

      So they loved each other and shared the same fan mail?

      Dave, you get lost in labels. ~ The powers that are attacking us know and use this, making you a willing player in the attack.

      • chow

        You hate to be reminded of what you are. He’s just reminding you of your roots.

      • bob wire

        I hate little ~ but people that assume and continue to make the same labeling mistakes becomes most annoying to put up with.

        Like You, CHOW assume far too much and knowing very little.

        Is assuming a prerequisite to be a member of this inclusive club?

        “assume and label” ~ it should be “identify and qualify” that’s a more appropriate approach to reasoning and political discourse.

        It’s gets sooo old ~ Chow. ~~~ don’t be such a mental light weight.

        • DaveH

          Uh oh, here comes the name-calling and personal attacks. Bob is coming out of the closet.

          • bob wire

            perhaps you should read it again. ~ That’s twice you’ve misread or attempted to twist my posting David.

          • DaveH

            Duh, Bob said “It’s gets sooo old ~ Chow. ~~~ don’t be such a mental light weight”.
            Do you even read your own comments?

          • bob wire

            “Myself, ~ I’d like to see the American Dream to be viewed ”

            that’s qualifying David ~

            and label all you want too ~ but it don’t make you any smarter or you ideas any brighter.

    • JeffH

      “We ask that the government undertake the obligation above all of providing citizens with adequate opportunity for employment and earning a living. The activities of the individual must not be allowed to clash with the interests of the community, but must take place within its confines and be for the good of all. Therefore, we demand: … an end to the power of the financial interests. We demand profit sharing in big business. We demand a broad extension of care for the aged. We demand … the greatest possible consideration of small business in the purchases of national, state, and municipal governments. In order to make possible to every capable and industrious [citizen] the attainment of higher education and thus the achievement of a post of leadership, the government must provide an all-around enlargement of our entire system of public education … We demand the education at government expense of gifted children of poor parents … The government must undertake the improvement of public health – by protecting mother and child, by prohibiting child labor … by the greatest possible support for all clubs concerned with the physical education of youth. We combat the … materialistic spirit within and without us, and are convinced that a permanent recovery of our people can only proceed from within on the foundation of the common good before the individual good.”

      – From the political program of the Nazi Party, adopted in Munich, February 24, 1920

      “We are socialists, we are enemies of today’s capitalistic economic system for the exploitation of the economically weak, with its unfair salaries, with its unseemly evaluation of a human being according to wealth and property instead of responsibility and performance, and we are all determined to destroy this system under all conditions.” –Adolf Hitler

      Hitler was intent on having a community of mutual interest that desired mutual success instead of one that was divided over the control of money or differing values.

      The official Nazi platform is an almost word for word copy of what leftist parties around the globe are promoting TODAY.

      I’ll ask the big question. How does it feel to support the same tyrranical policies promoted by Adolf Hitler?
      http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1141684/posts

      It all just sounds so familiar doesn’t it?
      Eddie, before you start your name calling, these quotes have nothing to do with the holocaust or genocide of Hitler and the Nazis, this is the ideology of how it all got started…duping the masses, curtailing economic liberty and discouraging individual achievement, controlling the airwaves, the internet and the news sources that do not agree with the same ideologies. The left is determined to silence their “opposition”.

      • eddie47d

        Oh,Yes;The CONservatives have done a splendid job of duping the masses into war and into a police state,stealing economic liberties and abusing the system,taking away individual liberties and rights and controlling and manipulating their own airwaves.Stop with the pandering Jeff or are you the Propagandist in Chief.

        • DaveH

          Those are not Conservatives that you speak of, they are Right-Wingers. True Conservatives stay out of other countries’ business.
          And it’s you Liberals that stifle peoples’ economic freedom. Show me a single reference where even a Right-Winger has stifled anybody’s economic freedom? Let alone a True Conservative.
          You spout a lot of BS, Eddie. Give us some references.

          • Dan az

            Sounds of crickets

          • eddie47d

            Companies are always gobbling up other companies and ruining lives. Companies can be doing well and still be “forced” out of business. There again FORCED to sell. Some good companies don’t have the legal resources to fight back against these corporate pirates. You need to pick up a newspaper more often and see what is going on.

          • JeffH

            eeedddiiieee has nothing to offer except hyperbole, generalities, contradictions and a huge imagination.

          • DaveH

            Eddie, you ignorant Liberal, I have studied the stock market for over 30 years. No company is forced to sell. There is no such thing as Corporate Pirates. There are only people who have been labeled as such by Corporate Insiders and their Big Government Cronys. The company officers did that, pulled the wool over ignorant peoples’ eyes (such as your own, Eddie), so they could be firmly entrenched in their high paying positions whether or not they were running their companies efficiently. The so-called “Corporate Raiders” were merely people that recognized the companies weren’t being run efficiently, so they bought the stock from willing stock owners of those companies until they reached the point where they had a controlling interest in those companies.
            I realize, Eddie, that you are far too ignorant to grasp what I just said, so my comment was really intended for other, thinking people on this board.

        • JeffH

          eeedddiiieee, how does it feel to support the same idealogies as the Nazis and Hitler?

          Read it again and again and understand what you have chosen in your life to support is exactly the same thing. History has a way of repeating itself when the people refuse to understand it.

          • Vigilant

            JeffH, I don’t expect eddie to address your posting head on. Like most leftists, when confronted with the facts, they’ll attempt to take the discussion off to some remote place that’s not even related to the subject.

            So I’ll ask the same thing: eddie, how do you feel being confronted with the historically accurate posting of the aims of the NAZI Party? Will you man up and say that you subscribe to many of those same “ideals” or will you continue to spout off about corporate greed?

            We’re waiting…….

          • kate8

            chirp…chirp…chirp…

  • Teresa

    F Y I
    VERY QUIETLY OBAMA’S CITIZENSHIP REACHES THE SUPREME COURT

    VERY QUIETLY OBAMA’S CITIZENSHIP CASE REACHES THE SUPREME COURT
    AP – WASHINGTON D.C

    In a move certain to fuel the debate over Obama’s qualifications for the presidency, the group “Americans for Freedom of Information” has Released copies of President Obama’s college transcripts from Occidental College . Released today, the transcript school indicates that Obama, under the name Barry Soetoro, received financial aid as a foreign student from Indonesia as an undergraduate. The transcript was released by Occidental College in compliance with a court order in a suit brought by the group in the Superior Court of California. The transcript shows that Obama (Soetoro) applied for financial aid and was awarded a fellowship for foreign students from the Fulbright Foundation Scholarship program. To qualify, for the scholarship, a student must claim foreign citizenship.
    This document would seem to provide the smoking gun that many of Obama’s detractors have been seeking. Along with the evidence that he was first born in Kenya and there is no record of him ever applying for US citizenship, this is looking pretty grim. The news has created a firestorm at the White House as the release casts increasing doubt about Obama’s legitimacy and qualification to serve as President article titled, “Obama Eligibility Questioned,” leading some to speculate that the story may overshadow economic issues on Obama’s first official visit to the U.K. In a related matter, under growing pressure from several groups,

    Justice Antonin Scalia announced that the Supreme Court agreed on Tuesday to hear arguments concerning Obama’s legal eligibility to serve as President in a case brought by Leo Donofrio of New Jersey . This lawsuit claims Obama’s dual citizenship disqualified him from serving as president. Donofrio’s case is just one of 18 suits brought by citizens demanding proof of Obama’s citizenship or qualification to serve as president.

    Gary Kreep of the United States Justice Foundation has released the results of their investigation of Obama’s campaign spending. This study estimates that Obama has spent upwards of $950,000 in campaign funds in the past year with eleven law firms in 12 states for legal resources to block disclosure of any of his personal records. Mr. Kreep indicated that the investigation is still ongoing but that the final report will be provided to the U..S. Attorney general, Eric Holder. Mr. Holder has refused to comment on the matter…

    LET OTHER FOLKS KNOW THIS NEWS, THE MEDIA WON’T !

    While I’ve little interest in getting in the middle of the Obama birth issue, Paul Hollrah over at FSM did so yesterday and believes the issue can be resolved by Obama answering one simple question:
    What passport did he use when he was shuttling between New York , Jakarta and Karachi ?

    So how did a young man who arrived in New York in early June 1981, without the price of a hotel room in his pocket, suddenly come up with the price of a round-the-world trip just a month later?

    And once he was on a plane, shuttling between New York , Jakarta and Karachi what passport was he offering when he passed through Customs and Immigration?

    The American people not only deserve to have answers to these questions, they must have answers. It makes the debate over Obama’s citizenship a rather short and simple one.

    Q: Did he travel to Pakistan in 1981, at age 20?
    A : Yes, by his own admission.

    Q: What passport did he travel under?
    A: There are only three possibilities.
    1) He traveled with a U.S. .. Passport,
    2) He traveled with a British passport, or
    3) He traveled with an Indonesia passport.

    Q: Is it possible that Obama traveled with a U.S. Passport in 1981?
    A: No. It is not possible. Pakistan was on the U.S. .. State Department’s “no travel” list in 1981.

    Conclusion: When Obama went to Pakistan in 1981 he was traveling either with a British passport or an Indonesian passport.

    If he were traveling with a British passport that would provide proof that he was born in Kenya on August 4, 1961, not in Hawaii as he claims.. And if he were traveling with an Indonesian passport that would tend to prove that he relinquished whatever previous citizenship he held, British or American, prior to being adopted by his Indonesian step-father in 1967.

    Whatever the truth of the matter, the American people need to know how he managed to become a “natural born” American citizen between 1981 and 2008..

    Given the destructive nature of his plans for America, as illustrated by his speech before Congress and the disastrous spending plan he has presented to Congress, the sooner we learn the truth of all this, the better..

    If you don’t care that Your President is not a natural born Citizen and in Violation of the Constitution, then delete this, and then lower your American Flag to half-staff, because the U.S. Constitution is already on life-support, and won’t survive much longer.

    If you do care then forward this to as many patriotic Americans as you can, because our country is being looted and ransacked!

    • Conservative at Birth

      Where can this information be found on the Web? Can you provide a link please?

      • Angel
      • Teresa

        not the point…the point here is the website!…http://www.fas.org/sgp/foia/oip_guidance.html
        That is what we need to be demanding from our congressmen…these records..ALL of them….

        • bob wire

          It been very quietly done because when they flame out, few will be there to see it. , ~ it’s more of political damage control then anything else.

          of course, Teresa ~ I suppose you wish to see it differently.

          The dark forces are gathering and the righteous shall prevail or something along that line.

          • http://deleted Claire

            I have my suspicions concerning many web sites, media, etc. I believe half of what I see and not much of what I hear.

          • kate8

            Claire – At least that’s better than the MSM. What little factual reporting they do is so drastically spun that it bears little resemblance to the truth.

            I’ll still go with the internet. At least there are a number of different sources, so one can piece together a better idea of what’s going on. And you can find things the MSM will never even mention.

        • Mike In MI

          Umm, Teresa -
          There’s nothing there but a written statement of Obama’s intention to seem like he wants to have an Open and Honest – Transparent – administration. I guess “transparent” to him must mean some way of getting rid of the kids while Michelle is being fitted for a new foundation, so he can go golfing…er sumpthin’?

    • http://MSN.com Alice

      Obama should be impeached. But he is a black man and therefore all black people in U.S will protect Obama.

      • ValDM

        Unfortunately, he isn’t a a balck man either. He’s 1/2 white, with a little black thrown in for flavor, and the rest Arab. BTW, I don’t like his white 1/2 either.

      • DaveH

        So, after the expense and turmoil of an impeachment, will the Big Government Loving Liberals go away? I think not. That is our real problem.

      • eddie47d

        Bush is a white man and all the whites defended him and covered up his misdeeds. That of coarse is not true but the Alice’s need to get over their prejudice comments.

      • http://yahoo Bob

        I’m white, and I support President Obama.

        • bob wire

          I did too Bob, I was left no choice!

          Did you hear about Randolph the brown nose reindeer? He was every bit as fast as Rudolph ~ he just couldn’t stop as quick.

          and that bring us to McCain the “UN-MAVERICK”, WHAT A JOKE!

          We dodge a serious bullet wound with his failure to capture the 1st chair position. But He and like minds are still at large! They haven’t left the building yet!

          You didn’t make a mistake, while I wish he’d been “received” better.

          If I could paint him white to please a few, I’d be glad too. I want their support. But it’s not to be. They don’t hunger or hurt enough yet.

          So be it.

          • kate8

            bob wire – Your accusations of racism have long worn out.

            I wouldn’t support Obama if he was snow-white. I didn’t support Kerry, Hillary or Bill. What’s your take on that?

            As a matter of fact, I don’t support McCain, either. And a whole lot of other politicians of all stripes.

            And there are some great black politicians I would, indeed, support, and some other OTWs as well.

            We’re all wise to the race-baiting, and it doesn’t scare us anymore.

          • kate8

            The only color I object to is the blackness of Obama’s heart. And there are black-hearted deceivers in every skin color.

        • http://MSN.com John

          I don’t support Obama. Obama is trying move U.S into wrong direction. U.S economy already collapsed, and a federal government continues print low value dollars. Inflation is very high now.

          • Richard Pawley

            John, the serious inflation has hardly begun. You can count on food and things we really need at least TRIPLING in price. Althought I can’t tell you when some very good sources say quite possibly by 2012 and some think it will start before the year is over. Buy the things you really need, when they are on sale, an extra pair or two of shoes, extra towels, sheets, shirts, toothpaste, in fact I could list a hundred things you may need that will all cost more in a year, much more in two years, and way more in the future. Most important is non-perishable food. It’s not going to be the end of the world but in a few years it might seem like it.

      • Mike In MI

        Alice,
        That’s a dumb racist statement and you should apologize. How did you get the fingers of your front paws high enough off the ground to reach the keyboard?

    • Angel

      Word-for-word e-mail hoax from April 2009. Birther-nuts like this will cost us any chance of a true conservative victory in the 2012 election.

    • Angel

      April Fools!!

      Analysis: Hoax. The original April 1, 2009 posting date suggests it may have been intended as an April Fools prank, but given that the text does little else but parrot actual tenets of the so-called “Birther” movement (the folks who claim Barack Obama is ineligible for the presidency due to a forged or invalid birth certificate, etc.), it barely qualifies as satire.

      Is it really an AP news story?
      No. The Associated Press (“AP”) never published such a story. It didn’t run in any real newspaper, nor on any real wire service. It can, however, be found posted and reposted on hundreds of anti-Obama blogs and websites.

      Did a group called “Americans for Freedom of Information” release Obama’s Occidental College transcripts?
      No. The organization doesn’t exist — or didn’t at the time the above message first began circulating, at any rate. A similarly-named website went up after the fact, but there is no evident connection between the website and the fake news story.

      Has anyone released Obama’s Occidental College transcripts?
      No, the transcripts haven’t been released, nor has any court of law “ordered” them released. (Source: Occidental College)

      Did Obama attend Occidental under the name “Barry Soetoro”?
      No. Soetoro was the surname of his stepfather, but there’s no evidence Barack Obama used it when he attended college. Fellow alumni quoted in the press remember him as “Barry Obama.” According to an Occidental spokesperson quoted on FactCheck.org, the college has no records showing Obama used his stepfather’s last name.

      Did Obama attend Occidental under a Fulbright Scholarship for Foreign Students?
      No. Obama did attend on a scholarship according to various news sources, but it wasn’t a Fulbright scholarship, let alone a Fulbright scholarship for foreign students. The Fulbright Foreign Student Program accepts Master’s Degree and Ph.D. candidates only. Obama was neither. He couldn’t have been awarded a Fulbright scholarship for foreign students even if he had been born outside the U.S. (Source: Fulbright Program)

      Did the Daily Mail discuss these revelations in a news story entitled “Obama Eligibility Questioned”?
      No. No such story turns up in a search of the London newspaper’s archive.

      Did the Supreme Court agree to hear arguments on Obama’s eligibility?
      No. The Supreme Court refused to hear the Donofrio case, not to mention every other Obama citizenship case submitted to date.

      Did Gary Kreep of the United States Justice Foundation release research showing Obama has spent $950,000 or more to fight litigation over his legitimacy?
      I’ve found no record of any such study being published. The Justice Foundation does exist and its Executive Director is indeed a man named Gary Kreep, but he is on record saying the above story is a hoax.

      • kate8

        All Obama has to do is release his records, and the issue would be resolved.

        Why won’t he? Why is he spending so much (of our) money to keep them sealed? And why are you lefties all okay with this?

        • Richard Pawley

          My guess is because it draws many away from the things that we really should be paying attention to and discredits those who might be able to help keep us from going down the tubes. The thing that convinced me years ago that this was ‘much ado about nothing’ is that if anything could have been found and proven, Hillary Clinton and John McCain would have done so. Think about it. They wanted to be president and they had sources that most of us do not.

          • kate8

            Richard, I would count on McCain or Hillary exposing Obama. They are all part of the same club, and very much in on the game.

            On the other hand, some very credible people with no personal ax to grind (except for preserving our Constitution) have done a great deal of work on this, and have turned up very conclusive evidence. It’s not that they can’t prove Obama’s illegitimate. It’s that the courts are corrupt and won’t allow the issue to be presented.

            Those in power have made it known that they no longer consider the Constitution an impediment to their agenda. In fact, the quickest way to find oneself in grave peril with the “law” is to bring up one’s Constitutional Rights. This now labels us enemies of the state.

    • bob wire

      Back to the “Grassy Knoll”

      That he was a Senator for several years, how far do you wish to back up?

      If you want to make such a stand, fine ~ but it can and does work both ways.

      Yesterday,~ the first day of 112th Congress, we seen two GOP congressmen voting on issues while not being yet sworn in!

      Should we ask for another vote as their vote not truly valid.

      Let us understand, whatever you can throw, can be returned.

      You wish to nullify a lame duck congress? ~~ okay ! but someday the GOP will find itself in the same position and think maybe it was a bad idea.

      Whatever “DOOR” you wish to open, it’s for any and everyone to walk through.

      • Mike In MI

        You’re right Bob -

        But it will probably be a long time before anybody beats Pelosi’s record of a 13% approval rating – state that 87% disgust. I don’t think too much disapproval will be forthcoming from the people if things get overturned. Maybe disapprobation will be registered by Rachel Creutzfeldt-Jacob and Keeled Overman. By the way, do you know how much Obama has spent getting everything – including his old underwear sealed?

        • bob wire

          ” do you know much Obama has spent getting everything – including his old underwear sealed?”

          No, I don’t , but do you know all recent history Presidents have had much of their records sealed and not just “O” ?

          • kate8

            Hey, bob wire. Why don’t you tell us how many presidents have had their record sealed?

            I surely don’t recall any, other than Obama, having failed to produce proof of citizenship. Or even having reason to question it.

            This is a MAJOR issue, and he still chooses to withhold it. Why?

            None has ever left so many questions unanswered, been so protected by the media and the entire system, and has so staunchly refused to answer the most basic of questions.

          • kate8

            Hey, bob wire. Why don’t you tell us how many presidents have had their record sealed?

            I surely don’t recall any, other than Obama, having failed to produce proof of citizenship. Or even having reason to question it.

            This is a MAJOR issue, and he still chooses to withhold it. Why?

            None has ever left so many questions unanswered, been so protected by the media and the entire system, and has so staunchly refused to answer the most basic of questions.

            The America people have a right to this information. It is grossly appaling that we are being told that we have no standing. If we have no standing, then our whole system has truly been overthrown and our Constitutional government is no more.

    • wayne

      As much as I would love for this to be true, I don’t believe it. At times I think the Socialist Liberals, or those loyal to Obama, are putting this information out just to play mind games with us.

      • eddie47d

        The right spreads the rumors and then blames the left whether it is right or wrong. That way they can play Checkmate no matter which way the wind blows.

    • BigBadJohn

      Very Quietly Obama’s Citizenship Case Reaches Supreme Court
      Submitted by sjidaho on Sun, 11/15/2009 – 21:26
      in

      * Current Events

      Editor’s Note: This article has been reported to be, and is widely understood as a hoax. Don’t believe everything you read on the internet! Full scoop at Snopes.com

      • Dan az

        Wow look who you believe no wonder!
        For the past few years (http://www.snopescom/), has positioned itself, or others have labeled it, as the ‘tell-all final word’ on any comment, claim and email. But for several years people tried to find out who exactly was behind snopes.com. Only recently did Wikipedia get to the bottom of it – kinda makes you wonder what they were hiding. Well, finally we know. It is run by a husband and wife team – that’s right, no big office of investigators and researchers, no team of lawyers. It’s just a mom-and-pop operation that began as a hobby. David and Barbara Mikkelson in the San Fernando Valley of California started the website about 13 years ago and they have no formal background or experience in investigative research.

    • DaveH

      Our problem isn’t whether Obama is a citizen or not. Our problem is — how has our great country come to this? Obama may well go down in History as the turning point for our Country’s reawakening to Freedom, which we have been ignoring for a very long time.
      In that respect, he may inadvertently be the best thing that has happened to this country since its founding.

      • Richard Pawley

        Strange as that may seem that’s a hopeful possibility! More people are interested in the Constitution and what is really going on in Washington than in any time in memory.

  • CJM

    Obama cannot be a US citizen; he stated, at a townhall meeting during his campaign that he was NOT born in the US, but was born in Kenya. This was on a news clip–and no one said a word about it. He claimed that his mother was born in the US; however, there is a question as to her status as a citizen since she renounced her citizenship while in India. When he was interviewed in Jan 2008 while in San Francisco that he wanted to dismantle the US Constitution; again, no one said a word about this statement. These are two of the major reasons why I voted against Obama; I still wonder how he was able to be named a candidate and put on a ballot as a contender for the US Presidency. There are members of the establishment who know Obama’s true status, which is why they do not want public comments made. By his own admission, Obama is NOT a US citizen. As for the American Dream, exactly what does this mean today? The middle class no longer exists in America and hasn’t for some years now. Today we have the poor, the working poor, upper middle class, wealthy, and elitists (multi-billionaires, if you will). The upper middle class is showing signs of dwindling in numbers and, if our economy doesn’t change for the better, they will join the working poor.

    • wayne

      The Dumacrats did not vet this man. I don’t think they care one way or the other whether he is a citizen, or not. This is why we need to get Obama and the Dumocrats of in 2012. If Congress want to they cold force Obama to provide his birth certificate. With a Democratic Senate that wold not be possible.

      • Teresa

        yes, but what about “transparency” for:
        *Complete files and schedules of his years as an Illinois state senator from 1997 to 2004
        *Obama’s client list from during his time in private practice with the Chicago law firm of Davis, Miner, Barnhill and Gallard
        *Illinois State Bar Association records
        *Baptism records
        *Obama/Dunham marriage license
        *Obama/Dunham divorce documents
        *Soetoro/Dunham marriage license
        *Adoption records
        ******ON TOP OF HIS LONG FORM BIRTH CERTIFICATE!

    • Karolyn

      I’ve seen that “news clip” on Youtube, and it is obviously edited.

      • eddie47d

        YouTube is notorious for misinformation or at least those who put those videos on there. The rest is entertainment.

  • bob wire

    “The upper middle class is showing signs of dwindling in numbers and, if our economy doesn’t change for the better, they will join the working poor.”

    SHOWING signs?

    We’ve been in a stall, spin ,crash and burn for 30 darn years!

    showing signs? ~ Golly Gee Wally!, mother is not going to like that!

  • DaveH

    We don’t need a new “Tea Party”, we already have a political party that has stuck unwaveringly to its message of Freedom for over 30 years.
    We don’t just offer to you “freedom our way”. We give you the Freedom to live the way you want with control over your own body and your own property. And with that comes the responsibility to respect your neighbor’s body and property. No free rides on somebody else’s unwilling backs when your choices turn out to be mistakes.
    We hold the Political Class to the same standards that the citizens are held to. Stealing is still stealing when the political class does it. Murder is still murder when the political class does it. The Government gets NO special exemption from morality.
    Watch John Stossel and Judge Napolitano on Fox Business news to learn more. Or better yet, start reading the articles on mises.org, reason.org, and cato.org. You can learn about real economics at all three but especially at mises.org. I’m not talking about the Political Economics that the masses are propagandized with by most of the news media, where the larcenous ways of the government are excused away.
    http://libertarianparty.org/platform

  • bob wire

    “We don’t just offer to you “freedom our way”. We give you the Freedom to live the way you want with control over your own body”

    The women will be happy to hear that!

    I’ve come to enjoy and see some upside benefit from the Tea Parties efforts.

    I hope you guys tear John B and Mitch a new one! ~ they are going to disappoint you and early.

    You have my support with that.

    • JeffH

      bob wire, don’t think for a moment that the Republicans are getting a free pass…the eagle eye is upon them too.

  • Bert Cundle

    Until next time, keep some powder dry.//////////////\\ The only powder we have; is talcome Powder!

  • Delores Smith

    CHIP WOOD,
    I’m researching Robert Ringer. This is what I am very concerned about. Americans must remain united. There are too many people trying to tear the Republican Party apart…too many people wanting to be President
    (DeMint, Ron Paul, Thune, etc.) I have written all of them to let them know that the #1 purpose is to get Obama out of office. He is evil. This is what Obama is doing:

    Cloward-Piven video

    apathetic-usa.com/

    Obama is collapsing our economy and moving us to a dictatorship, along with George Soros. Ringer has been a supporter of Ron Paul who also wants to run for President once again. Americans can only remove Obama through a united Rep. Party. Ringer wrote that book 31 years ago. If we play games and destroy ourselves, Obama will achieve his evil goals.
    Delores Smith
    Delores109@cox.net

  • Delores Smith

    AMERICANS,
    For those who have been concerned about the dead birds falling from the sky, this is the response I received from CDC.
    REPLY
    Thank you for your submission to CDC-INFO. In response to your comments on dead birds falling from the sky in Kentucky, Arkansas and Louisiana, we can provide you with the following information.

    It is important to remember, birds can become sick and die for various reasons. Causes could include:
    * trauma,
    * poisoning, or
    * infectious diseases such as West Nile virus (WNV) and avian flu.

    Bird illness and death can also be a seasonal occurrence. As a general rule, the public should observe wildlife, including wild birds, from a distance. This lowers your risk of being exposed to diseases. It also minimizes disturbance to the animal.

    If you notice a large number of sick or dead birds in the wild, contact your state or local health department and your state wildlife agency.
    Note from Delores: This has occurred before with many birds falling. My guess is that cold weather had some-thing to do with it. Sorry, no global warming.
    Delores Smith
    Delores109@cox.net

    • http://deleted Claire

      I have never heard of birds dying in that large of a number. I have my own thoughts. Do you really think you will receive honest answers from the CDC or the government? I don’t.

      • DaveH

        Who knows? I have so far heard only conjecture. Somehow, I think we will survive those events.

        • DaveH
        • http://deleted Claire

          DaveH–I pulled up your link. As I have already posted, I am suspicious. Chemical warfare? It is not impossible to think such thoughts with all that is going on in this world.

          • DaveH

            It was stated that the fish were of the same species, and while not stated, it appears from the pictures that the birds were all starlings. I know of no chemical warfare that would be so selective.

          • http://deleted Claire

            DaveH–True, but it still makes me wonder.

          • Karolyn

            Dave – The birds that died on News Year’s eve were redwing blackbirds.

          • DaveH

            That’s why I used the qualifier “appears”, Karolyn. I didn’t see any point in specifically identifying the species. It was just the fact that they were of the same species that was pertinent to my comment.

      • libertytrain

        I agree Claire. Their excuses were just that, excuses – and illogical.

        • http://deleted Claire

          libertytrain–Thank you! I am highly suspicious of the entire matter. I am inclined to think something more devious caused this.

          • kate8

            Claire – A guy on the radio last night was talking about this very subject. He said that the military has the ability to target species specific (and race specific in humans) DNA, in order for selective killing, and they have been conducting experiments.

            They have also been triggering earthquakes along the New Madrid fault.

            I found this link so far. I’ll keep looking for more.

            http://www.stevequayle.com/News.alert/11_Global/110105.alert.one.specie.dieoff.html

          • http://deleted Claire

            Kate8–I simply think “something” is going on. I can’t shake that feeling. Birds roost at night. And for that many birds of the same species to die like that…well, I don’t buy the excuses for one minute. I have edited too many manuscripts on terrorism, chemical warfare, etc. to think otherwise. And these manuscripts are written by people that KNOW what the heck is going on in this world of ours. We are not told the “truth” about a lot of things that have happened.

          • http://deleted Claire

            Kate8— Too many cover-ups.

          • libertytrain

            Claire, particularly with the work you do, it becomes difficult not to take more things seriously or suspect things might not be as we are told just by virtue of that which we have seen/experienced with your/our own eyes and from credible sources -

          • kate8

            Claire and Libertytrain – There is so much more going on than we can even conceive of. I know a man who recently retired from Raytheon. He said we’d be blown away by the technology and weaponry they have developed. Most people would never believe what they have and can do.
            It’s like science fiction.

            What they’ve passed off on the sheeple as science is nothing more than junk science. The real stuff, they don’t want us to know about. They have long been working with ways of controlling and “cleansing” the Earth of “pests”, playing with our DNA and using frequencies and other forms of energy to destroy us. These things can also be used to heal, and there are some people who are working on this, too. But, as always is the case, whatever can be used for good can also be used for evil. And it always is.

          • kate8

            More on dead birds: Victoria, Canada. A river turned a bright green for about an hour. Scroll all the way down and there is a photo.

            http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1344345/Animal-death-mystery-Jackdaws-Sweden-fish-Brazil-New-Zealand-crabs-England.html

          • http://deleted Claire

            Kate8–I am glad you posted that site!! I had heard about Sweden but did not know about the others. Maybe the people that do not think our enviroment and wildlife (including the human race) are in danger will wake up. Something IS going on. Experimentation? I think so. I have heard this for years and where there is smoke, there is fire.

      • Richard Pawley

        Many would agree with you Claire but these ‘occurrences’ have been happening for 30 years. One I didn’t know about until recently was some 200,000 ducks that died in Canada. I suspect it could be a combination of things. Rats got ill eating American genetically engineered corn in England. We use a lot of poisons and just as all the electronic signals from cell phones seem to be affecting the bee population (along with two foreign mites) they might affect birds. Of course when it is only one species there is likely a specific cause. Not much we can do about it but make sure you eat locally grown organic foods if you possibly can, and eggs and meat and not the stuff sold in most super markets. One big potato farmer made the comment that he would never eat the potatoes he grows for the public and showed he plot where he grew the potatoes for his own family. That is when I started eating less potatoes and only organic ones.

        • kate8

          Richard – What makes this particularly strange is that an entire flock falls from the sky all at once. If it were poison or GMO food, they’d drop at least a few at a time, not all at the same time.

          Also, it is affecting fish all over the globe, and some other animals as well. And also trees and other plants. I’m seeing some of that here.

          • Richard Pawley

            I’ve always assumed the fish kills were from some kind of poison but as for flocks of birds falling from the sky, well, the thought occurs to me that it has been recently discovered that a form of radiation that previously had only been thought to come from exploding stars has been found right here on earth, is some massive thunderstorms. It is now known that passengers and pilots flying through such rare storms get exposed to as much radiation as a hundred X-rays, and it strikes me that a flock of birds could easily be wiped out if they were in such as storm. I’m not saying this is the cause, only that I have not seen anyone else suggesting this and I believe it’s quite feasible. The important thing to remember is that Jesus said not a bird falls from the sky that our Father in Heaven doesn’t know about it, so He is truly in charge, no matter what man thinks. Additionally God doesn’t want man to fear. In fact I think He said somewhere that fear is an enemy of man, and I’m reminded of the great Gen. George Patten who when asked if he wasn’t afraid made the statement, “I never give counsel to my fears”. My suggestion: Don’t you either!

  • http://AOL.com Ephrem Johnson

    Bob Livingston should be ashamed of his self. Pres Obama is to blame…com’on! The country has a lot of problems but he’s not one of them. Where was his voice when the Bush administration was rapeing this country profiting off of the war. Where was his voice when wall street was rapeing this country. Greed is just like cancer…It’ll get you in the end.

    • http://www.boblivingstonletter.com/ Bob Livingston

      Dear Ephrem Johnson,

      First of all, the opinions expressed in the article are those of the esteemed Robert Ringer, who was the subject of the interview. Second, nowhere in the article is blamed placed on President Obama. Ringer makes a point that the slide began in the early part of the 20th Century, but that the modern-day progressives (Obama-Pelosi-Reid et al) have accelerated the slide. I suggest you take off your liberal blinders, calm down and re-read the article. Finally, you ask: “Where was his (Bob’s) voice when the Bush administration was rapeing this country profiting off of the war. Where was his voice when wall street was rapeing this country.” Obviously you are not familiar with my writing. I have been very critical of the Bush administration and neocons regarding their war policies, efforts at establishing empire American and the laws they’ve promoted that steal our freedoms. Our site is just about 2 1/2 years old and there is a lot here for you to read. If that doesn’t convince you, please go to http://www.boblivingstonletter.com and read the archives there (subscription required).

      Best wishes,
      Bob

  • http://com i41

    Eph Johnson, Onumnutts was licking his purple lips because democraps and Wall Street go together like s–t and sewage. Just look at all the Wall Street crooks he has in his cabinet and that surround him. The marxist muslim moron, and his rear end licking pukes of the Soros Socialist Party idoit supporters who voted for the ruination of the USA. So that classifies all supporters of dumbocraps as the enablers of the mess we are in. The democrat party is now the New Nazi Soros Socialist Union Party, let us know where it isn’t a fact. Onumnutts has always hated and has disparaged the USA every chance he gets, espically if it is over seas. Ephram, you must not read or listen to the marxist muslim moron and what he has writen and over load his bird brain any time his purple lips are moving.

  • calan

    Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!!
    The great O.z. has spoken.

    The man behind the curtain played by:The big bankers,corprations and super rich

    The graet O.Z.played by:Most of or Senators,Congressmen and Presidents from both parties

    Special effect by;T

  • calan

    Special effects by;The Smoke and Mirrors co.

  • http://com i41

    Delores Smith, there has been die offs of birds and fish all the time. When sudden downpours occur over a large area the sudden influx of dead grasses and material, fish in reseviors or dams usually causes a die off. Black birds are pests and damage tons of grains and a sudden die off usually means that they got overwhelmed with massive numbers in a flock. Same thing happens with rabbits, deer and other wild game. Usually caused from “wildlife management”, all book trained idoits who think they are smarter than mother nature, just like thew global warming crap!

  • DaveH

    The Constitution and the people who swear to uphold it:
    http://gunowners.org/a010711.htm

    • Will-CA

      Thanks DaveH
      I’ve signed it and have forwarded it to friends and relatives.

    • Dan az

      I not only signed it but left them a comment and a site!
      http://teamlaw.org/

    • kate8

      DaveH – RE: AZ shooting.

      They’re already talking about going after guns.

      Another false flag? Why have they been warning of shootings and other attacks happening this year? All of a sudden we’re having attacks.

      Amazing how these things are always on cue. Right when they’re ready to push for new attacks on our freedom.

      • Dan az

        Hey kate
        I saw that tonight on the site you left and that was the first thing I thought of to.Hyper speed comes to mine when thinking of the NWO it looks as if there going for it this year.

      • DaveH

        I wasn’t aware of the shootings, Kate. I quit taking the newspapers years ago as they are loaded with propaganda. Remember that black guy that had the assault rifle on his back near an Obama venue? I’m pretty sure that was another Liberal dirty trick.
        I looked it up and the Liberals are already trying to make a big deal of it. Truth is that he could have done similar damage by driving his car into a large crowd.
        If we should ban things based on the actions of a few wackos, then we should be able to ban Liberalism (more than a few wackos there).

        • DaveH

          And to me, that is yet another example why we should all be concealed carrying so we could stop random acts of violence before they take so many lives.

          • kate8

            Yes, DaveH. But we’re dealing with liberal logic here. And an agenda.

            What better way to spur Congress into action than to make it personal for them by attacking a Congresswoman, especially when we have new ones who are fired up to buck the status quo.

            This is how they brought presidents into line. Seems to work well for them.

  • Guido

    Some people here sure like to see their name in print. How many times can one say the same thing over and over as if the repetition makes it true. Documented sources don’t mean much if they all say the same thing. While the left is no stranger to violence it is diverse and its most effective protests have been non-violent. This makes sense because the State is defined by violence and is only too happy to engage those who do protest violently. Has anyone here heard of “Operation Gaudio”? Right-wing elements in the security forces of many European nations in alliance with the CIA carried out terrorist operations that were then blamed on leftist groups. This contributed to “law & order” policies that increased the budgets of these very same State sponsored terrorists.

    • Raggs

      LOON…

      pretty much a basket case like you…

  • DaveH
    • libertytrain

      thanks Dave – that was a nice change of pace back to the “good old days”

  • Irene Schweitz

    I just want to say that all of you can keep on talking about the right and the left, but I hear nothing about taking control to try and stop what is going on in our world. It should have not gotten this far. It all started with the Billenberg Group and everyone should read about it first and then you will see were the control comes from. We need to clean up the mess and get our world back to being normal by using common sense. Help each other and come from the heart and speak the truth and be honest in all our dealing. Only then will be get back to basics. The government is out of control and they should never have been in control. It is “We the people” who need to be in control and have everything going our way. They are taking away what we “Seniors” have worked so hard to accomplish. We were not spend thrifts, we saved for the rainy day. Now they want to take it away and leave us poor, and we cannotwork anymore. Every generation has worked to support their Mothers and Fathers so they can retire, now they don’t want to do that anymore. We raised you guys, cut back on expenses and our personal items to make sure our children got to have everything they needed to make an respectible adult out of them and this is what we get in return. Take a good look at what this government is doing to all of us and it’s not theirs to do, it is our rights that are being violated. Both the Republicans and the Democrats are out of line and they all need to have their mouths washed out with soap, thats how bad they are. It’s time to clean up American and get our hearts back to the right place and quit being so selfish and into one’s self that they don’t care about anyone else. We should all love one another and want each to have the American Dream, not take it away. So grow up, be responsible, pay your debts, and live a simple and loveable life and lets all be happy. Let’s all change this world back to being the Great America that our Father’s gave us to cherish. Make a commitment to do something right in your life and step up to the plate and make a stand to get back to what our great “Constituition” was created for and do it NOW!!!!!

  • Dave

    I have a feeling that many people who are for liberty on this site don’t understand libertarianism. You say you support Ron Paul but in the same sentence you are for the “Big State” be it left wing or right wing. In the end both are the same and both will steal your freedom.

  • Barney Murrell

    To JeffH and others who know little about history,

    First, the freerepublic is a rightwing publican that has little to do with truth.

    Second, action speaks louder than words; thus, socialism is just a name and does not apply to Germany because, under the Nazis, it was a totalitarian dictatorship – corporations generally remained under control of their plutocrat owners as long as they did nothing to disturb Hitler

    And it would be stretch of credibility to say Stalin’s Russia was socialist for the same reason, because it was a brutal dictatorship where citizens had no rights whatsoever. Nothing socialist about that.

    • Dan az

      Blarney
      Is that the best you could do? Did you by chance ever look at the sites with proof? Thought not!

  • http://PersonalLibertyDigest Wiselady

    Wiselady says:

    1-7-11

    Irene Schweitz’ points are well taken…but, how do you rid the late 50-60′s generation of their greed and me-ism attitude? Their liberal mentality has cost us an immense amount of dollars and anguishment with their political views throughout education, elementary through college. It was not easy living through that era. The biggest example are the Clintons. The Rose Law firm papers, White Water Gate, Impeachment trial, sex scandals, had to return items they took from the White House, who paid for all the inventory and the tranportation of the moving vans with the stolen goods which had to be returned? More cost to tax payers when investigations took place. All this was selifish, carelessness and, greed. To this day, no one knows where $400,000 went; presumably it was for education. Where were their values, caring spirit and humility.

    With all the money they now have, we should demand that they compensate the Treasury Dept and let’s start with that to begin paying the debt of $14,000,000,000,000. Frankly, any US President who is careless with with our money and/or has to be investigated for misconduct, ought to pay back all those costs and reduce their benefits to be similar to the average senior retired citizen; speech money should be taxed 75% and should go for paying our hugh debt or put it into education, after all they gained the speech making privilege because WE put him there as President. Their salary should be reduced as well as their retirement. Look at the mess they left behind. I am tired of hearing that Clinton balanced the budget. Where is the $400K? I know, Pres. Dwight Eisenhower blanced it.

    Pelosi, as well as others should also have their salary and retirement reduced; she’s rich; she spent trillions without caring for the retired citizens stuck with high medical costs in a poor economy. Good grief, how much do they need? Greed is a hard thing to overcome when they have lost common sense

    • Richard Pawley

      Pelosi and Reid and others are not just responsible for high medical costs for seniors but their squandering of trillions is one of the major reasons we are just creating money out of thin air and why prices of things we need and use are all going to at least triple in the future, and maybe sooner rather than later. Gold and silver are the canary in the coal mine of our economy and they have more than quadrupled in recent years. Food and fuel and clothes will be next.

  • arthur anderson

    A new bill requiring all presidential candidates to publicly show proof of citizenship in order to be nominated. If the Republicans would pass such a bill it would be most interesting watching Obama and the Democrats soft shoe around that (can’t you just imagine their consternation ?) especially if it was attached to a bill that he really lusted after. And if it was done this year it could be in place for the next presidential election. Just a dirty rotten thought from one really pissed off real American….who does not like either Kenyans or Muslims !!!!!!!!!

    • Mick

      Arthur,,,,They need to pass quite of few bills parallel to the constitution and torch many amendments that have been put in place to replace the true meaning of this same constitution.
      This so called president has a lot of skeletons in his closet, the population has the right to know who is leader their country and everything in a leader should be disclosed to make sure that integrity wins over the army of crooks we’re plagued with in our Nation’s capital.

      • Denniso

        Another joker! Disclosed? Like the fact that Bush had done cocaine? Like the fact that he thought Jesus talked to him and told him to kill 100,000 civilians in Iraq? Like his cowardly hiding from the Vietnam war in the ranks of the National Guard and not even showing up for that? Like the fact that Cheny was the real president and Bush was the figurehead?

        Get real Mick…

        • Richard Pawley

          We elect men to be president (and someday women) not saints. He’s an ex-alcoholic. Have you kicked any really bad habits? The purpose of life in the physical dimension is to grow. Some do, some don’t. If Al Gore had become president we would probably already be paying $5 a gallon for gas or more. Of course the way congress has been squandering money for the past several years we will get there soon enough, like next year perhaps? It’s congress who spends the money but the president who gets blamed. Not a bad deal for congress.

        • Mick

          Denniso says:
          January 8, 2011 at 8:23 pm
          Another joker! Disclosed? Like the fact that Bush had done cocaine? Like the fact that he thought Jesus talked to him and told him to kill 100,000 civilians in Iraq? Like his cowardly hiding from the Vietnam war in the ranks of the National Guard and not even showing up for that? Like the fact that Cheny was the real president and Bush was the figurehead?

          Get real Mick
          ********************************************************
          Denniso …………Wow,,, Mister one track mind telling me to get real ! Get over yourself and try to think rationally instead of putting everything that’s wrong with America on bush’s back, we have bigger fishes to fry………..

        • kate8

          Denniso – What about the fact that Obama not only used cocaine regularly, but was a drug dealer? What about his homosexual liasons and his hanging out in gay bath houses? And that’s just for starters. He’s part of the Chicago mob, and that’s the least of his crimes. He is the most criminal and despicable of anyone who’s resided in the WH.

          This is all stuff that’s been uncovered about him, that he’s got media cooperation in keeping covered up. The media was salivating to smear Bush at every opportunity.

          • Denniso

            You’re hopeless and very badly informed and swallowing any lie that pertains to Obama and Dems. You clearly can’t think for yourself and are just a rightwing stooge. I can guess that you have no actual education and only live to regurgitate what your handlers spew.

          • JeffH

            Denniso, wow you really made a contribution with that hate filled comment…happy now?

  • Palin12

    The Dumbocrats still haven’t gotten the message from the November elections. Just this week, Harry Reid proclaims “the Tea party movement will die as soon as the economy gets better”. And then MINORITY House speaker pelosi says, get this ha hah….”the Democrats lost the House because….of Bush!”

    • Richard Pawley

      Just another proof that they are out of touch. Sadly the economy is not likely to get better in this decade, maybe a little, but you had better batten down the hatches. Pelosi and Reid oversaw the spending of at least 5,150,000 MILLION DOLLARS over the last four years and that’s 14 TIMES more than all the gold in the U.S. Treasury. They spent so much the treasury is now just creating 75,000 MILLION dollars a month out of thin air because we are broke – and if this keeps up we are going to be a lot broker!

  • denniso

    OK dummy…Pelosi specifically said in an interview that the house was lost because of the economy. We could assume that the crash was the fault of Cheny/Bush and their intentionally hapless regulators in the SEC…

    Reid is right,the so called tea party is toast as soon as the economy improves sufficiently, which is ocurring as we speak. All they care about is their ‘right’ to carry guns and money.

  • http://deleted Claire

    Another gun-toting nut out there. A Representative from Arizona shot and battling for her life, and I think 5 other people and a child were shot and killed. And why? Too damn many nuts out there with a short fuse and mental issues.

    • Denniso

      All of the incendiary and violent language of the past several yrs from the rightwing extremists surely doesn’t help. Continual talk of revolution and carrying guns to rallys and putting out campaign stuff w/ congressional candidates ‘targeted’ like Palin did during the election all add up to someone doing this kind of thing. This AZ Representative was among those w/ a target placed on them by Palin.

      A 9 yr old girl killed…many injured. sick!

      • http://deleted Claire

        I believe all politicians should be talking about America’s issues and discussing solutions and forget the political crap. Why do they continue to demonize? The politicians themselves have contributed to some of the hate talk and actions that are happening. Sorry folks, but if there is any “blame” it should be based on both parties, not one single party. A number of them should be taken behind the barn for a good ass-whipping. It is way past time to grow up. It is time to straighten up and do what is right for America and all Americans. Some politicians do spew a lot of derogatory statements and their insert own little “innuendos,” especially if they have a “following.” I apply this sentence to a lot of the radio talk show hosts as well as the MSM. They continue to “stir the pot” and it is obvious in some cases they are consumed with their ego. I actually think some of them think they are so powerful that they are using this idolatry, and laughing all the way to the bank. Talk about pied pipers–there are plenty of “sheeple” on both sides.

    • kate8

      Claire – Doesn’t it ever strike you that, whenever Congress wants to pass a new law limiting another right, an event such as this occurs so conveniently?

      If you look over the past century, there is one false flag after another, right when they need it. They are becoming more and more frequent.

      The fact that this AZ Congresswoman is a gun-rights advocate, a republican-turned-democrat, and supported AZ immigration laws against Obama’s stand, is highly suspect. The Left is perfectly willing to sacrifice one of their own (especially a moderate) to further their cause.

      They couldn’t target a real conservative because the media wouldn’t care. It had to be a situation where they could blame the Right, to strengthen their ‘homeland terrorist’ stance against them.

      I’m sorry, but this brings back memories of the Kennedy assassinations, among other things. I smell a rotten fish here.

      • Denniso

        Kate8…YOU HAVE GOT TO BE KIDDING ME, or you’re just plain stupid. What a dumbass comment to make,that the ‘liberals’ assasinated one of their own in order to do what? God above,save us from this kind of stupidity. I guess the evil liberals had to kill the 9 yr old girl and the other 4 people and injure more so it would look ‘real’. You should get the hell off this site and keep your moronic musings to yourself.

        • kate8

          Wouldn’t be the first time, Denniso. We’re dealing with ruthless, power-mad people here. And collateral damage means nothing to them, except to further inflame the issues. It’s no use explaining to you how they use little people, because you don’t get it. In fact, you are one of the little people they use. A useful idiot. That’s you.

          Sticks and stones and so on.

          • Denniso

            You’re a mindless fool if you really believe that liberals killed those people for political purposes, and if you can’t understand that all the hate and vitriol spewed by the rightwing extremists against Dems and liberals and Obama for yrs now can lead to this,then you’re either a liar or dumber than I thought.

            The rightwing wants to incite people to violence for political use and then when it happens like clockwork they denounce it and are SO shocked that anyone could possibly take their inflamatory rhetoric and act on it. The right may be that dumb but the rest of us are not.

            Demonizing the ‘left’,liberals,Dems,Obama,government in general, can and does result in these sort of violent acts. And, I know that there are people who will privately call the death of the 9 yr old little girl ‘colateral damage’.

          • JeffH

            kate8, denisso is one sick puppy.

          • Mike In MI

            K88 -
            Just look at what D-O has done. He obviously is a fan of msnbc’s Rachel Creutzfeldt-Jacob and Keeled Overman, those Soros-of-misguided-lives blatterers who can’t manage to gather a listener base except the likes of D-O. If it weren’t for those like D-O we probably wouldn’t have to put up with the likes of B-O. Just remember, back in the day, the orginal Chicago mobters had a loyal following of people who just loved them and thought they we dashing, romantic and gay. So, the Mafia and others owned the government – just like today.

            Well, today that’s D-O and B-O. Keeled Overman and R. Creutzfeldt-Jacob would just swoon, I’m sure if they met D-O, to know they had a fan. And he in that situation would no doubt blow grits all over the set.

        • Dan az

          So Denniso how does that toe jam taste?
          One user on Twitter, Caitie Parker, wrote she went to high school, college and was in a band with the gunman. She said she hadn’t seen him since 2007.

          Parker wrote of Lougher, “As I knew him he was left wing, quite liberal and oddly obsessed with the 2012 prophecy.”

          She also described him as “more left.”

          Lougher also left a trail of bold political statements.

          Read more: Assassin’s politics lean ‘left wing, quite liberal’ http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=248829#ixzz1AVeaOTJk
          Some times it just dosent get any better than this!One of your own and you still blame the right for this amazing!

          • JeffH

            Dan az, just this one sentence surely says volumes about the liberal socialist morons and Lougher; “The Communist Manifesto” and Hitler’s “Mein Kampf” were among the favorite reading materials of Jared Lee Loughner.”

            It is a terrible, despicable tragedy that happened in Arizona today but all of the cat calls blaming the violence on “right wingers” will still come from liberals as some have already started to do…It is just a given.

          • http://deleted Claire

            All I know is that it could happen to any congressmen/women. I don’t know if the creep was left wing or right wing–there is no excuse for this hatred. Left or right wing– it is wrong! What a pathetic waste. And for what? What does it accomplish? Nothing, not a damn thing but more hate. There is no rhyme nor reason for anyone to kill someone whether you agree with them or not. I hope this bastard rots in hell. And if anyone else pulls a massacre like this, I hope they suffer horrific pain and agony for the rest of their lives. I am tired of all the hate and vitrol from both sides. I am sick of the MSM and their constant stream of innuendos. This will no doubt be another situation where we will not learn the whole truth, just more hints at the one/ones responsible which will be finger-pointing at one party or the other. It will depend on “what” news channel is for “what” party. Left or right–I think either one is capable of wrongdoing, even such as this that happened today. Both parties have people in the “background” that are of debatable character. All it takes is for them to talk to a wacko and the foul deed is done.

        • libertytrain

          Denniso – this is just a little comment that is neither right or wrong, just a fact of my life. Some years ago, about 20, my extremely left wing sister sent me information from an extreme left organization, based in NY, that was seeking new members for their plans to assassinate and blow up many prominent people, one was the Pope. It was a very detailed newsletter – it so grossed me out and made me ill – I’d never heard or seen such things, and I tossed it (I wish I still had it for reference to the groups name). Of course, my sister still grosses me out. Another frightening nut case of the extreme left, as this fellow in Arizona apparently was according to his friends and ex-schoolmates. It is not about liberals, it’s about the extreme left, or extreme right for that matter, people that just are so irrational they believe that whatever they do and to whom is ok.

  • kate8

    Turns out the guys a liberal. So now they’re blaming Palin.

    Why is the Left so into blame, anyway? Oh wait. They have to demonize others to further their own causes, which won’t stand on their own merits.

    Something doesn’t add up here.

    http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=248829

    • Denniso

      Palin sends out campaign crap showing this woman along w/ other Dems in crosshairs…rightwingers say they’re ‘going to take someone out’…rightwingers constantly repeating that they may have to resort to guns rather than ballots…rightwingers carrying guns to political rallies…rightwingers shout down and threaten Dems at meetings on healthcare…

      Even if it turns out this killer isn’t a rightwinger, there is no doubt that all the violent language and talk of violence and revolution to ‘take back our country’ can instigate unbalanced people to do what they think is acceptable by so many rightwingers. Disgusting and shameful for the whole country. Rightwing hatespeech and violent talk are responsible for this despicable act,and that includes people on this site.

      • kate8

        Denniso – You are just another rabid lefty. And how dare you tell me to get off this site. If you don’t like what I have to say, do what I do with most of your posts…skip them. I have little interest in anything you have to say.

        You leftys always need to cast blame somewhere for the actions of radicals. There is no one on Earth who can predict what some unbalanced person will do, and there is no blame except with the person who commits the act.

        If we all had to restrict our words to those which couldn’t possibly be misconstrued by someone, we’d have no speech at all. Regardless of what the truth is here, we’ll probably never know what it is. It will be spun to suit the overall agenda, which in this case is to take away guns.

        • Palin12

          kate8,
          several regular posters here have told me they skip over dumniso’s comments, so don’t feel alone! If you’ve heard him or her once you’ve heard ‘em enough. Same old crap all the time about rightwingers and shrub. You’re right, who gave that jackass the authority to tell you to get off this site?

          • Denniso

            Kate8, how dare I suggest you get off this site? Why not? Reread your comment above and see if you don’t agree w/ me. That is one of the stupidest comments I’ve heard here,though I admit it’s got a lot of company. Next,I suppose you and Palin12 will be suggesting that Obama is behind this killing spree. You should stick to some rational thought before you type out such absurd and nonsensical statements.

            Do I have any authority to suggest you get off of here? Of course not, so why worry about it? I see you think it was done to take away your pretty little guns…more stupidity. The NRA and it’s flock of blind sheep is the entity that is pushing the country toward more surveilance,police state tactics and less freedom,by helping to ensure that any wacko can get a weapon that can kill and maim a dozzen people in a few minutes.

          • DaveH

            You know, Dumniso, that both major parties are pushing us away from Freedom into that police state you fear. Or at least you claim to fear it. Yet, you regularly stick up for immorality and force exhibited by the left. You can’t have it both ways.
            By the way, this is a board established to discuss Personal Liberty which you obviously don’t understand or want, so if anybody should leave, it should by your type. But, I don’t want you to do that because there is a large portion of the population that has been blindered to the reality of Liberals, and people like you help to wake up those who are not too far gone.

          • Dan az

            Thats a fact Dave the more I hear them the less they make sense.They do more harm to the democraps then we could have ever thought possible.

        • Eric Bischoff

          Incitement is Reprehensible. It’s a Crime. It’s Base

        • Eric Bischoff

          You are both right. But still we’ve reached pretty despicably low levels in our treatment of each other in this country. So this is not really surprising to anyone now is it!

          • DaveH

            So then, Eric, are you saying you are going to make an honest effort to carry on a debate free from ridicule, condescension, personal attacks, fabricated facts, and other manipulative methods used by Liberals when they have no honest debate points?

      • Dan az

        dipsoid
        How can you ever see the truth when your head is so far up your azz?
        The truth is he was a lefty just like you I hope its not contagious for your benefit.
        As we enter a new year in search of Heaven’s blessing and protection, let us remind ourselves that God always judges people who reject truth. Always! If we truly want Heaven’s blessing and protection upon our land, we will start–each of us–by being willing to seek and embrace truth, even if doing so costs us something; because, in reality, people who reject truth lose a whole lot more than whatever they had hoped to gain. Eventually, they lose, not only their own lives, but also the life of their country.

        • Karolyn

          The guy is obviously against the government, which is what you guys so vehemously espouse. After all, he shot a democrat.

          • libertytrain

            well, it’s possible, it seems, as is being reported by his friends/acquaintances, that he was from the extreme Left. In any case, he was a genuine nut case.

          • DaveH

            According to this report, Karolyn, his favorite books were “Mein Kampf” and “The Communist Manifesto”.
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g8Rx51cA3qM

      • JeffH

        Kate8 and Palin12, No one person, and I do mean no one else, has consistently cast as much or more hate than denisso has on this website. He/she just wreaks of hatred in every post he/she rants in and it’s obvious once again here today.

        • Denniso

          Mindless…

          • JeffH

            The shoe fits you to a “T”.

        • Karolyn

          Jeff – What about all the people talking about “locking & loading” and advocating violence against those they don’t agree with?

          • DaveH

            Can you find some comments to back up that claim, Karolyn? I’m talking about them wanting to shoot others because they don’t agree with them?
            There is a vast difference between people protecting themselves from a lawless, immoral, out-of-control Government and shooting others because they don’t agree with them.
            I expect more thoughtful comments from you, Karolyn.

          • Denniso

            Come on Dave, you know as well as I do that right here on this site people have been threatened,me included. I’ve had people tell me they can ‘find me’ for instance. I’ve had people suggest we meet face to face to ‘settle’ an issue.SOme have said I’d better watch out when the time comes for armed revolution… If you haven’t seen these comments then you’re either blind or intentionally ignoring them, but there have been many many the past year. Neither me nor anyone else is going to spend the time to search through thousands of comments to prove a point. Objective people here,the few there are, are aware of what goes on here. Maybe you should be asking Bob Livingston’s staff to do the search. I’ve complained to him directly a few times about specific threats of violence and he states that he’s ‘sure the person doesn’t mean it as an actual threat’.

          • JeffH

            K, most that use the term “lock and load”, just as Chip does, means to “be prepared”! Now the fact is that every reference to “lock and load” will be misconstrued as “load your guns” by the liberals who spend a lot of time misconstruing most everything they don’t agree with. The liberals have a record of promoting volence and unrest.

            Leftists, Liberals, Progressives & Democrats Promote Violence Towards Others (including children) In New Global Warming Video by Greenpeace.
            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vgvnqv1-_D4&feature=player_embedded

          • kate8

            Denniso – You make much ado out of nothing. You know as well as I do that what you’ve described as “threats” are not threats at all, but expressions of frustration with your ignorance and twisted statements. There is no possible way to anyone to even know who you are, so grow up.

            This is exactly how you Progressives work to incite people. You exaggerate people’s words and intent, you assign maliciousness where none exist…we all know what you’re doing. Right out of Alinsky’s manual.

            Conservatives sometime use metaphors such as “lock ‘n load”. These are not threats, but a statement in preparedness. The last thing anyone on the Right wants is violence. In fact, for all your loud protesting about what conservatives say, it is always the Left who carries it out. And the Left that benefits by furthering their agenda, while blaming the Right for “inciting” it.

            We all know that the Left never takes responsibility for their own actions.

          • JeffH

            Kate8, you know and I know that if you look for something hard enough with a closed mind, you’re liable to find it. Has not denisso been that way since you arrived here? Been that way since I arrived here, always “reading” violence into every word, including Bob L and the rest of his staff and contriutors. As I and some others have said more than once, nobody projects hate with any more vigor than denisso, nobody!

          • kate8

            JeffH – Dave said it a few days ago, about one of them. Don’t remember if it was Denniso, but it could have been.

            Gnats. They are like gnats, always pouncing on any word or phrase they can twist out of context, or counter with an idiotic comment.

            They don’t care about being truthful, accurate or even if they make sense. They are just out to stir the pot, and then cast blame for it.

            I already know the Leftist mind, so it’s no surprise to me. And they seem to all work about the same. They have a hive mentality, like ants. Or gnats. Pesky, persistent, and programmed to serve the matrix.

          • JeffH

            Kate8, The gnat comment was in reference to the constant buzz of E47d.

          • kate8

            I know, because he buzzes around his every post. I got that. I just couldn’t remember who it was.

            In any case, it still struck me that several of the lib posters do the same thing. They are all gnats, buzzing around this site, always in our cyber-faces.

        • Palin12

          JeffH,
          …haven’t seen EyesGluedShut or AmLibtard here for awhile. Maybe they realize that the Nightmare Act has failed and there is NOT going to be amnesty and 12 million new dumbocrats on the rolls. Maybe they realize Card Check has failed also and with it the hopes of enlisting new union suckers. Maybe they realize that global warming is a hoax whose only real goal is to enrich Al Bore and his ilk. So we are left with dumnisso to try and convert us. Sorry it ain’t gonna happen. BTW, I believe the Statute of Limitations has run out on Bush.

          • JeffH

            Palin12, I hear you loud and clear and completely agree. Don’t depaire though, some things have a way of resurfacing now and then.

    • Karolyn

      You do the same damn thing, Kate!

      • kate8

        Karolyn – You don’t want to go there with me. I’ve been purposely staying away from your posts, because the temptation is just too great…

  • Eric Bischoff

    Base as in no moral principles.
    Crime, an action or omission deserving prosecution and if found guilty punishable.
    Reprehensible is deserving condemnation.
    Incitement, to encourage or stir up violent or unlawful behavior.

    • DaveH

      Yet, you stick up for people that desire to trample the main law of the land — The Constitution.

  • Will-CA

    ‘Never let a good disaster go to waste’
    Rahm Emannuel

    This morning I was traveling down the fwy when I heard about this horrible event. Immediately my heart felt like it was in my throat, it wasn’t pleasant time. Didn’t know or care weather this WACKO KILLER was Dem/Rep or whatever it was just horrible and warranted Morning, Prayer, and desire for Justice.

    I wonder how many of those on the left thought like Rahm Emannuel after learning of this disaster.

    I’m sure most on the right had close to my experience earlier today.

    May God Bless all those who have suffered today.

    • DaveH

      In a just country, they would just string him up in the town square (after a fair trial of course).

      • DaveH

        But they won’t, because there is big money to be made off this guy (Loughner). The news corps will make money, the jailers will make money, the lawyers will make money, the Liberal politicians will use it as an excuse in their never-ending battle to turn the people into helpless sheep, and many others will benefit by his long-term incarceration.

        • Denniso

          What a brilliant observation!! The jailers,media and lawyers are all going to make money off of the shooting? You aren’t aware that jails are overflowing,so are already ‘making money’? Lawyers also have their schedules full given all the crime and corruption we have ongoing. And why would you begrudge the media,which is a part of the market economy, from getting higher ratings from a story like this? You prefer that we get no news and info about the tragedy or that the news medis have their profits controlled so they have no incentive to stay w/ a national story of immense interest? You’re fake libertarianism has turned you into a walking contradiction filled w/ overt hypocrisy.

        • Will-CA

          Thanks DaveH for your comments I couldn’t agree with you more.

  • e.poet

    Bob Wire, and Denniso,
    You two are really something! You know, we all get it, BUSH is responsible for everything for all time! How boring and small (as in microscopic) minded. We all get it because of your endless ad-nauseum repetitions. Now that that has been said, are you now in a sufficient state of self-satisfied bliss? Enough so, that a possible mind-bending discussion may take place? It may interest you to know that “the RIGHT” and the “Tea Party” hardly have a corner on violence, or potential violence. I live in UBBER-LEFT Seattle, in one of the most LEFT of the Left areas, the University District (University of Washington). At my favorite coffee -house, I have heard a number of very unpleasant conversations, statements being made to me right to my face, that though the person speaking is “Normally anti-gun”, they would have no problem with personally going out and rounding up all Christians, Jews and Conservatives, lining them up against a wall and shooting them. Now that is just so open minded and tolerant of diversity that it just makes my head spin. Now what makes this even more LOVELY, is just a couple of years earlier, the EXACT same statement was made to me while I was working as a deli-clerk in a grocery store just about a half a mile away from the coffee house. The statement was made to me by what appeared to be middle american regular everyday people, my frequent customers, not just once at the grocery store by by three different people on three separate occasions, and none of the three knew each other. It really became sickeningly amusing to watch these peoples faces, and watch the body language squirm on all four times this occurred, when I informed these people that I hope they realized that they had just murdered me, my husband and my daughter, as we fit the bill of the condemned on all three counts, we are Jewish by blood-line inheritance, (our ancestors) Christian, by chosen faith, and conservative by political principle. At the time of the fourth occurrence, the first, at the coffee house sometime in late February or early March 2009, I was moving on out to the even stronger principles of the “TEA PARTY” because I felt such a revulsion and deep-seated resentment of an over-weaning government invasion of the sanctity of sovereign individual rights of the progeny of the Founders of these United States of America, the recipients granted by our CREATOR of certain unalienable rights. WHO are these usurpers who claim to themselves the power granted and derived from the ALMIGHTY? They are petty snivelers, who deem themselves wise in their conceits. I KNOW one thing, those who believe they may usurp from G-D what is his alone to grant, are on a serious collision course with Author of the Universe! It is my job in life to stand with and by my creator! Can I hear an AMEN Brother ! Sister!

    Hey Kate 8, thanks for everything this last year, and you too Grannie Mae, Beberoni, and Dave H… It does ones heart good just to know you are all out there! happy New Year!!! May it bring restored blessings!
    G-d Bless Us Everyone! To quote a small character from one of the great authors.

    • Denniso

      Though your comment is addressed to me,there’s not much there to respond to,other than you must be hanging out w/ some real idiots. They aren’t liberals though,so your example doesn’t say much except your ‘friends’ sound like the killer from Tucson. Liberals are almost neurotically tolerant and non violent,which is partly why the rightwing is doing fairly well in the political arena.

      • e.poet

        Sorry Denniso , but these people ARE indeed Liberal/PROGRESSIVE persons. They DO know where they stand and why!— Just too bad you are so out of touch with what is going on in the baseline of the progressive movement. When was the last time you visited a college campus? When was the last time you talked with all the bright young people Democrats, Socialists, Communists, Progressives walking the streets, hanging out in the coffee houses, and cafes in whatever campus area they are attending? You are either out of touch completely, or you have some form of mental blinders on which prevents your actually taking in information as espoused and expressed, and examining it for what it is, OR, you are a liar to yourself and others. I don’t know you, so I can not say which one you fall into, only you know, unless you fall into the category of one who lies to themselves. If the last is the case, then there is absolutely no point in discussing anything with you, as all is shifting sand. See videos of Francis Fox-Pivens, and Van Jones, (among others) if you really doubt the liberal left agenda for revolution and violence. Read “THE COMING INSURRECTION”.

        • libertytrain

          I haven’t noticed Denniso being at all tolerant of those who do not think as he thinks they ought.

          • Denniso

            There’s a big difference between not tolerating someone’s obvious bigotry or racism and hate speech, as compared to people here and other places being intolerant to the point of making violent threats,sometimes thinly veiled.

          • libertytrain

            there is a difference, however, you have attacked people for things that do not include the above. But like all people, your memory too, is selective.

      • DaveH

        The Dumniso comedy act returns by unpopular demand.

    • Richard Pawley

      “G-d Bless Us Everyone! To quote a small character from one of the great authors” A nice way to end your comment. It was of course Tiny Tim from a Christmas Carol and I ended one of my comments a few hours ago with the same quote although I think your’s is more accurate. I don’t always get to these on the same day and sometimes just go down the list and see if I can add anything that I perceive as helpful. Some of these are thoughtful, some are funny, some are sad, and some are better off left unsaid if we take Jesus seriously when he says we will be held accountable for every idle word. Everyone has something to say but arguing and trying to prove who is right as some do has no value and sounds to much like the hell that Dr. George Ritchie saw in his after death vision. I gave the web-site above on that and I’m to tired to look it up but you might appreciate it. I hope you have a good year too and I appreciate the people you appreciate as well but didn’t think to thank them as you have. We are entering one of the most tumultuous times in the history of this nation if we do not turn back to God and I covered that above as well. There is some good and useful information to be found on this site from time to time but I think you already know that. I would say however that I have to disagree with you about the Tea Party because I have not come across a single genuine incidence of anyone in the tea party being violent. A few people with signs not family oriented have shown up at a Tea Party rally and were asked to leave them behind or leave but the accusations of violence are mostly propaganda from those who do not support pay as you go and being out of debt and the Constitution itself. I’m not saying there hasn’t been an incident because people are people but I know those who have attended rallies of 10,000 or more in various cities and I have not heard of any. The Tea Party may accomplish what the Libertarian Party has not because they have Libertarians and Democrats and Republicans and Independents in it. It’s not actually a third party but if the Republicans don’t get back to conservative principles it may become one in the future. At least that is how I see it. The Democrats and Republicans have been to much alike although they don’t see that and think they are widely different. Sort of like your Jewish ancestors might have looked at Catholics and Protestants. Americans have been slumbering but now we have awakened. We are going to have hard and difficult times ahead but there is hope. Have a blessed and prosperous New Year yourself.

    • Karolyn

      I guess extremism is extremism no matter which side it comes from. I have neve known any liberals to portray these characteristics. My experience with exteemists has always been with blue collar, right-wing people, especially with “rednecks” down here in SC. This is all news to me.

      • libertytrain

        And your SC “rednecks” as you have labeled them, are just hard working folks trying to enjoy their lives in SC before all the Northerners who know the right and proper way to do things came and felt the need to enlighten these poor “rednecks” as you have labeled them – go back to New Jersey, SC would survive without your labeling of its people.

        • libertytrain

          Perhaps back in New Jersey you will be able to use your new education to help those poor misguided souls – seems to be some need of education on – what is called – “Jersey Shore” ??

          • Karolyn

            God, I hate that show! A total misrepresentation of what Jerseyans are in general. People think of Jersey; they think of “The Sopranos” – a mere fraction of the populace.

          • libertytrain

            only you would know being an expert on society and all…. :D

        • Karolyn

          Get a life Liberty! The people I’m friendly with have no problem with being called rednecks here. They are not so PC!

          • JeffH

            Well Karolyn, maybe not…but I find it as offensive as using the “N” word…it might be appropriate in your circles, but it is not appropriate in a piblic forum…just sayin’ it’s a tool of bigotry.

          • libertytrain

            I do too Jeff. Tired of all those Northerners tossing out that racist word like they’re entitled to. And funny what is written now about her new best friends is contrary to so many she has written about those SC people — hmm. while a foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, inconsistency in folks remembering the tales they previously told in posts is also somewhat annoying.
            PC is not my concern. Racist remarks about your SC neighbors is just not nice.

          • Karolyn

            I am of total Polish descent, and when a woman I know was incensed 10 years ago about an incident involving a politician using the term “Polack”, I laughed in her face. I KNOW who I am and could care less if people called me a “Polack”. Now the term “white trash” is another story. Do you think it’s OK to take “the N word” out of Huckleberry Finn?” The “rednecks” I have been acquainted with are proud to be called that. Do you know any? Do you know what it means? Here is a definition from a good ole’ redneck:
            http://www.angelfire.com/sc2/andrewturner/

          • libertytrain

            I am not offended if someone who is Polish calls me that name – I come from 100% of that stock as well. It’s not anyone elses right to call me that. I do not agree with the removal of that word from Twain’s book. It is ridiculous to try to be “politically correct” over words that Twain meant as an example of what was not quite right about society. And I’ve only heard that word up North, never here in the South. About White trash. Seen a lot of that – North, South, East and West. I live in the South; and deeply respect the people that made this their home long before the rest of us showed up once some of us were fortunate enough to discover the real paradise and tremendous history, and culture these American’s had going for themselves. There are a few that don’t come here insulting the people and wanting to change their world into ours. It shows our relative own ignorant self-importance when we who are “immigrants” from the North keep posting about how ignorant SC is. Why do you do that?

          • Karolyn

            Jeff – Well, I don’t care who calls me Polack. It’s just a word! I would bet that I’m older than you. As far as ignorance goes, there’s a difference between that and stupidity. A great many people really are ignorant, though they are not stupid. They just don’t know. Where I live, a fairly large segment of the older population never got through grade school. They may be ignorant of many things because they can’t read. That doesn’t make them stupid, which I believe is a more vicious word. And there is a large segment of the population here, old south, who are worse than we northerners in wanting to keep down their own people – to keep the status quo, as it were. I don’t look down my nose at anybody. I take each person as an individual, whether they be redneck or southern “aristocracy.” However, I do believe that they need to come into the 21st century and bring this state out of the mud it’s been in for 8 years with republicans at the helm. Now we’re stuck with another four years!

    • kate8

      e.poet – Thanks to you, too! I’m so excited to see all of the sharp and informed minds on this site, and those who still value morality.

      The Left is out to utterly destroy the Right in any way possible. This is a given. And being that those on the Right are basically peaceful, freedom-loving, God-loving and honorable folks, it takes a lot to rile them into action. That’s why we’ve been so slow to come to the table.

      It is an understood and self-stated tactic of the Left to blame the Right for what they, themselves, are guilty of. As the accusations of right-wing terrorism start to gain traction from the Left, we must all stand firm and reject what they are doing. It is all a ruse to fulfill their dream of eliminating the oppostion, and installing themselves permanently into power.

      We know what’s up with the violence. It’s being incited, but not by the Right. And yes, I am aware that, at the top, Left and Right do not exist in any meaningful way. I am speaking of the manipulated rank and file, who unwittingly move to carry out the programming of the elite machine.

      • Denniso

        I wonder why your glorious leaders Limbaugh and Michael Savage have talked about ‘eliminating’ liberals for years? Funny, I don’t hear any Dems spouting such crap about conservatives. You’re as off balance as the killer apparently is.

        • kate8

          You don’t, Denniso? Gee, I remember reading about Bill Ayers saying around 25million of us would have to be eliminated (the number is much higher now), and that wasn’t rhetorical. And have you heard some of the rhetoric from Van Jones, or Francis Pivvens, and many others? Calling for revolution, violence, collapse? And how many on the left have called for the killing of whites?

          These calls for violence go unchallenged by you leftys. In fact, they are pretty much ignored. Yet this is what you accuse the Right of doing, in a systematic attempt to turn mass sentiment against the Right and to incite violence aganst us. This is the same tactic Hitler and every other despot in their quest for absolute power.

          The right speaks to gaining numbers through reason and common sense. Of course, with those firmly on the Left, that is a lost cause. But never is there a call to kill anyone. The Right believes in man’s freedom to think, and the exchange of ideas. They don’t believe in FORCE as you do.

          Whenever Leftist governments gain control, there is always mass genocide. They always attempt to eliminate the opposition. This time they’ve been employing mass mind-control methods, but they still have plans to eliminate those who are immune to it.

          Go spout your mindless attacks elsewhere. You are, simply put, full of it.

          • Denniso

            You’re deluded and paranoid and I wonder why you respond to me. I have nothing to say to someone so clueless and hopelessly out of touch w/ reality. You’re obvious lack of any sort of rational mind is sad and pathetic.

          • kate8

            Denniso – Again, right out of the Alinsky manual.

            When you have no argument, ridicule and name-call.

            That IS what you do best.

        • JeffH

          NPR Producer Wishes Death for Limbaugh
          you were in the presence of a man having a heart attack, how would you respond? As he clutched his chest in desperation and pain, would you call 911? Would you try to save him from dying? Of course you would.

          But if that man was Rush Limbaugh, and you were Sarah Spitz, a producer for National Public Radio, that isn’t what you’d do at all.

          In a post to the list-serv Journolist, an online meeting place for liberal journalists, Spitz wrote that she would “Laugh loudly like a maniac and watch his eyes bug out” as Limbaugh writhed in torment.

          In boasting that she would gleefully watch a man die in front of her eyes Spitz seemed to shock even herself. “I never knew I had this much hate in me,” she wrote. “But he deserves it.”

          To be fair to Spitz, Limbaugh does articulate conservative positions. That’s enough to justify wishing for his death … isn’t it?

          • Denniso

            Limbaugh doesn’t just spout ‘conservative’ positions…that’s a joke! I listen to the demagogue and he is mostly a purveyor of hate,lies and calls for the eradication of all liberals. He says specifically that liberalism is a mental illness. He uses the tactics of tried and true liars and manipulators. He demonizes environmentalists and femminists,equating them to Marxists and Fascists. He is a very harmful person to the country and is one of the most responsible for the polarization and terrible tone that exists. He’a a hate monger,pure and simple and he has 30 million blind sheep following his every word all the way to the bank. He’s a pig in the guise of a human. Though pigs are far better ‘people’ than he is.

          • libertytrain

            Denniso, so you are saying that one can wish him dead and laugh as he dies because you don’t think he’s a good person. How do you determine who can be given such a gloating death wish. Some feel the same about Obama or Bush. Where do you draw the line – your comment wreaks of approval for this NPR “representatives” death wish. Say it isn’t so -

          • JeffH

            Denniso, YOU are an exact example of what you hate! You are nothing more than a sick and twisted hypocrite, a hatemonger extroardinare. Your every breath is filled with hate.

          • kate8

            JeffH – Pathetic, isn’t it?

        • JeffH

          Leftist Issues Death Threats to Palin and Family on Twitter

          On Twitter, a fellow calling himself Jason Brown has been posting since May 10, 2009, and has a total of 379 messages posted so far. He is a fan of Keith Olbermann and Rachel Maddow.

          Here are just a few of his twisted posts.

          @sEaTtLe_MeTrO Death 2 Palin family them retarded hillbillies take teabaggers w/ you hateful bi tch
          and this:

          We cant expect gov to intervene we must shoot Gen. Palin on site be 4 her troops strike again!

          and this:

          @interactionswst one word racism choose sides plain and simply that bitch Palin launch an attack, she need 2 b shot on site!

          and this:

          @Palin360 you need 2 b assassinated soon we ll settle 4 one of the family if not u!

          and this:

          maybe it takes a murder or 2 2 get the point across take aim at radical TP members

          and this:

          @BRIANGLAD Palin will b met with gunfire her or her family

          http://patterico.com/2010/03/25/leftist-issues-death-threats-to-palin-and-family-on-twitter/

  • e.poet

    Dear Richard Pawley, I am so sorry not to have included you among those I wished to thank, and there are more of you out there as well, Dan of AZ, TIME, and others.
    But back to Richard,
    Please, I think you may have misunderstood my meaning when I said in my earlier post, ” It may interest you to know that “the RIGHT” and the “Tea Party” hardly have a corner on violence, or potential violence.” What I meant was a sarcastic jab at the perception, or worse the INTENDED perception of the TEA PARTY by some members of the left, and most assuredly by the media elite, of intent to do violence. I am well aware that Tea Party people are not in any way aching to do violence. I love the energy, the passion, the deep-seated desire to root out government usurpation of the Constitution of these United States of America. I deeply admire the quest to learn and drink deeply of the waters of remembrance, and not of the waters of LETHE (forgetfulness). Though I am not a “joiner”, I formally joined the Tea Party in October 2010, and have been attending rallies since April 15th, 2009. My 82 year old mother in Denver, CO. who has held many offices in Republican politics in the past, and remains very politicly active to this current day, is also quite impressed with the principles of the Tea Party, and is ready to Bail Out of the REPUBLICAN PARTY IF THE POLITICIANS ON THE HILL, HAVEN’T LEARNED THEIR LESSON, AND GROW A SPINE AND STAND UP FOR WHAT IS RIGHT AND TRUE. Either they GET IT this time around or they will be on a scuttled ship, we will all bail for a new party created out of the Tea Party. To quote a line from an old 70′s song by another Englishman, “WE WON’T BE FOOLED AGAIN!”

    Again, so sorry Richard, that I didn’t make myself more clear in my earlier post. May you have a wonderful New Year!

    • Richard Pawley

      Thanks for the kind word and the clarification. Here’s something a friend in South Carolina just sent me. It’s not new but it’s certainly true. Hope you enjoy it:
      Today we mourn the passing of a beloved old friend, Common Sense, who has been with us for many years. No one knows for sure how old he was, since his birth records were long ago lost in bureaucratic red tape. He will be remembered as having cultivated such valuable lessons as:
      - Knowing when to come in out of the rain;
      - Why the early bird gets the worm;
      - Life isn’t always fair;
      - and Maybe it was my fault.

      Common Sense lived by simple, sound financial policies (don’t spend more than you can earn) and reliable strategies (adults, not children, are in charge).

      His health began to deteriorate rapidly when well-intentioned but overbearing regulations were set in place. Reports of a 6-year-old boy charged with sexual harassment for kissing a classmate; teens suspended from school for using mouthwash after lunch; and a teacher fired for reprimanding an unruly student, only worsened his condition.

      Common Sense lost ground when parents attacked teachers for doing the job that they themselves had failed to do in disciplining their unruly children.

      It declined even further when schools were required to get parental consent to administer sun lotion or an aspirin to a student; but could not inform parents when a student became pregnant and wanted to have an abortion.

      Common Sense lost the will to live as the churches became businesses; and criminals received better treatment than their victims.

      Common Sense took a beating when you couldn’t defend yourself from a burglar in your own home and the burglar could sue you for assault.

      Common Sense finally gave up the will to live, after a woman failed to realize that a steaming cup of coffee was hot. She spilled a little in her lap, and was promptly awarded a huge settlement.

      Common Sense was preceded in death, by his parents, Truth and Trust, by his wife, Discretion, by his daughter, Responsibility, and by his son, Reason.

      He is survived by his 4 stepbrothers;
      I Know My Rights
      I Want It Now
      Someone Else Is To Blame
      I’m A Victim

      Not many attended his funeral because so few realized he was gone. If you still remember him, pass this on. If not, join the majority and do nothing.

  • JMichael

    Dear bob and chip,since I’ve been introduced to this blog, I’ve found it to be very much a propaganda tool. Now I’m not saying you don’t have some insight, because you do. What I am saying is, in some ways you’re no different than the politians you rant about. Some of the people that come on here really have nothing to say worth hearing. So, let’s here what you think about what happened in Texas.

  • JMichael

    You know I actually started reading some of these responses. It doesn’t get any better. The baseless, pathetic, statements are just that. lefty’s, right’s, stupid BS. Not a damn one of you know why this wacko did this, but you all seem to have a judgement. You are all worse than any media jackwagons, spewing puke. you should all be ashamed of yourselves.

    • bob wire

      it seems his rights to “FREE SPEECH” was being compromised

      “In postings on the social media sites YouTube and MySpace, Loughner railed against government “mind control,” being surrounded by people he considered illiterate and the illegitimacy of the U.S. government. In class, McGahee said Loughner accused him of violating his free-speech rights: “And of course free speech is limited in the classroom.”

      One such outburst was “the straw that broke the camel’s back,” and McGahee — who had already raised concerns about Laughner with administrators — had him removed.

      Laughner “needed psychological help,” and McGahee said he was not surprised to hear his former student was the suspect in Saturday’s bloodbath.”

  • jopa

    All this lock load and keep some powder dry crap does have consequences.Even Palin realized her part in these murders and took down the crosshair images of people she wanted dead.Including the congresswomsn from Arizona.Do you people think it’s funny when you say “lock and load” or “keep some powder dry” and so on.Well there are some crazies out there and seem to take things literally.Freedom of speech is wonderful but it is time for people to be resposible and don’t be rattling the loonies into action with negative messages repeated over and over.

    • Denniso

      This was a political assasination and the scrambled kid had defintely become fervently anti gov’t. Ms Giffords had her office windows shattered after voting for the healthcare plan. Every day for the past 30 yrs we have had mostly rightwing Republican politicians and idiots like Limbaugh and Michael Savage excoriating,dehumanizing and demonizing the gov’t and liberals/Democrats…how can we be surprised or shocked when an unbalanced kid acts on the continual stream of invective and vitriol and talk of armed revolution?

      Are we really that stupid that we would expect any other result?

      • kate8

        Denniso – Nice try, but let it go. The guy was a radical leftist. I doubt he EVER listened to Rush or any other talk show.

        I stand by my first impression until proven otherwise, which will be difficult since truth is not something we have much access to. The guy is a socialist/Progressive patsy, part of the mind-controlled legion set to go off at this time. There are lots of them, and we can expect more of these incidents. He was on a mission, set into action by one of the radical leftist groups.

        Scoff, snicker, ridicule, call me names. You are just another tool, and have no credibility, anyway. So give it your best shot (uh oh. There I go inciting you to violence), you and your comrades. No one’s listening.

        • Denniso

          If you really believe what you wrote then you are truly deluded and paranoid…try thinking for yourself for a change and quit looking at every Democrat/liberal as the enemy. Your comments play right into this angry,partisan fearmongering.

          • JeffH

            Look, the pot calling the kettle…what a waste!

          • kate8

            JeffH – I guess I could be considered partisan. I’ve always been clear about being conservative, but have also acknowledged corruption in both parties. I support neither. I’m for freedom and a return to Constitutional government.

            Denniso clearly supports the Leftist Democrat machine. Now that’s truly partisan.

          • kate8

            Oh, and I also see that the plan to bring down America originated from the Left. And they are the ones using the premeditated, devious and deceptive methods to demonize conservatives as part of their destructive plan. They are the main tools used by the elite in furthering their goals, as they more readily subscribe to useful tactics such as class-envy and the social welfare state.

          • JeffH

            kate8, if partisanship includes the freedom to choose life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness then I’m guilty as charged too. Look, it’s obvious that Denniso is just a bit off his/her rocker and any participation ny Denniso will include an embracement of hate talk.
            Really though, I don’t give a damn about people like Denniso…they’re a dime a dozen. Remember, we live in California and who runs California?…Nothing but a bunch of ignorant liberals that put spending far above a balanced bank account.

          • Denniso

            I also could care less for you two,but I’ll make a point. Kate8 is trying to play partisan politics w/ the tragedy. You and anyone can be ‘partisan’ if you’re not a complete hypocrite and you draw the line at advocating violence. Partisan as the main aspect of one’s thinking and ideology is not thinking. It’s stupid and shallow and utterly non iitellectual and dishonest.

          • kate8

            Denniso – You accuse me of politicizing the tragedy? Excuse me, but you were one of the ones pointing fingers at conservatives for inciting it with “lock and load” statements.

            The shooting was, in fact, a political statement. How does one NOT politicize such an event?

            It will be YOUR side who uses this to further their diabolical agenda. Every time something happens, liberals spring into action passing ever more freedom-restricting laws. Never let a good crisis go to waste, and all that. If that is not an opportunistic attitude, I don’t know what is.

          • JeffH

            kate8, there is only three things that can help this hack, a straight jacket, a gag and a padded room! One crazy fanatic!

          • Denniso

            You two are too dense to understand that actions like this slaughter of innocents by a kid w/ a brain scrambled by all the hate speech and talk of violence and ‘taking back our country’, and armed revolution, is what is causing our country to become less free and more of a police state w/ more cops and security guards and spying on us. You’ve helped saturate our country w/ guns w/ little or no restriction on ownership so that even mentally ill people can easily get a gun, then you whine that we have too much curtailment on freedom. It’s not rocket science folks,but I guess it’s too deep for you to get. 2+2=4?

          • JeffH

            Can it denniso, you’re like a broken record…yada, yada, yada…call the NY Times and give them an interview or something and stop with your hatefull jabber. Go listen to the voices in your miniscule mind or something…please! Oh, and keep some powder dry! Don’t forget to LOCK the door and LOAD the dishwasher before you snap!

          • libertytrain

            And now he is a psychiatrist as well. Good grief.

        • Richard Pawley

          Kate, he also hated God. The fact that he was a raving leftist will be quietly dropped by the media or not mentioned. I prayed for the congresswoman from the first I heard of this and I believe many others, conservative and liberal, did as well and are still doing so. The Bible says God is no respecter of persons and from all I heard she seemed to be one of the better members of congress although she is on the other side of the aisle. Where does the 8 come from? Are you one of eight? I’m the oldest of eight and was just curious. Hope you are aware of the big time troubles that all the waste of the 111th Congress is going to cause us and the tripling of the prices of food and things in the future as a result of the trillions they squandered. Don’t know when but I know of people in 12 states who have put away several months worth of non-perishable foods (mostly freeze dried fruits, vegetables, meats and grain that can last from 10 to 30 years. Someone, maybe the government, seems to be buying up all the large cans of powdered eggs). Can’t tell you when but count on it. Hope the new Tea Party can stop the spending or it could be worse. Some think it will hit us big time next year, but learn all you can while there is time and may God bless you.

          • kate8

            Richard Pawley – Yes, I am aware of things that are barreling down at us at and increasing rate. I spend a lot of time in prayer.

            8 is simply my favorite number. It is my life number, and the number of God. It also represents power and fruitfulness.

            Remember that dehydrated and freeze-dried foods require water to prepare, and water will be the biggest shortage. And it will become more expensive than fuel.

            I do so appreciate your posts. We’ve got some great minds (and hearts) on this site.

          • Denniso

            Richard, if the killer is a ‘raving leftist’, then why did he try to assasinate a Democrat? You’re not making sense and I have to believe it’s because you have a political agenda.

          • libertytrain

            Chapman killed Lennon because he thought he had become a “phony” – John Hinckley’s assassination attempt on Reagan to try and win Jodie Foster’s heart.
            Insanity is insanity. No logic that a “normal” person could even fathom. You can not try and assign your logic to an insane person’s logic – there is no commonality unless you too are insane.

          • Denniso

            That’s why we have brain scientists and psychologists/psychiatrists…sane people can actually study and understand insanity to a large degree. Some of us pay attentiona and learn as well and make an attempt at trying to understand all sorts of behavior,including a killer’s mind. To just throw up our hands and say there is no way we can figure out motivation and intent even in the unstable,is a prescription for going back to the dark ages of ignorance and superstition. We are not as clueless as you may think.

            It doesn’t take rocket science to imagine that the unstable can be provoked into actions by what goes on around them and how they interact w/ society. If you want to live as though it’s all beyond your ability to analyze,so be it. Most thinking people don’t choose that way to live and it doesn’t lend to improving our society and country.

          • Palin12

            Speaking of Mark Chapman, I would have loved to be his executioner. God bless John Lennon.

          • Denniso

            That’s very Christian of you,and I believe you have indicated you are one,supposedly. Your lust for vengeance sounds exactly like what’s wrong w/ the country. Chapman was mentally ill and to wish for revenge on a mentally ill person is somewhat sick. Would you also wish to be the instrument of death for a 10 yr old who kills a parent w/ a gun? I will make a guess based upon your ‘profile’ and say that, yes,you believe in executing little kids who commit murder.

          • Palin12

            denniso I could fill pages about Chapman but why waste time on this scum? Don’t give me that liberal bleeding heart crap. Chapman did not allow his lawyers to plead insanity, he voluntarily pled guilty to Second Degree Murder, the highest possible crime in New York for murdering a non-police officer. There is no death penalty in New York so it’s all hypothetical. I am glad I’m not paying taxes in NY to feed, clothe, give free shelter to, and free medical care to this worthless mass of protoplasm. John Lennon was very nice to him just a few hours earlier, autographing his album and asking if he wants anything else. He did not deserve to die a painful death, among other things having his trachea crushed. Chapman now lives in solitary confinement at Attica Prison. Guards are afraid if he mingled with the population he’d get the Dahmer treatment from a fellow prisoner who happened to like the Beatles.

          • libertytrain

            YOU Denniso the FIRST person on this site pointing fingers at the Right as being responsible for this horrible event minutes after it occurred and you have the audacity to write this attempting to pretend some sort of moral compass within you: “… Some of us pay attention and learn as well and make an attempt at trying to understand all sorts of behavior,including a killer’s mind. To just throw up our hands and say there is no way we can figure out motivation and intent even in the unstable,is a prescription for going back to the dark ages of ignorance and superstition. We are not as clueless as you may think.”
            You are so bogus – and fraudulent.
            And you are correct – ‘some of us do pay attention and learn as well, and make an attempt at trying to understand,’ however it certainly is not something that you have been evidenced in your comments as doing.

  • Anthony

    #1 – rushing to wikopedia as a source – is desperation.

    #2 – http://rtr.org/

    • JeffH

      Thanks Anthony, I’m going to explore rtr.org a bit.

  • JeffH

    On May 18, 2010 Vice president Al Gore gave an incredibly depressing commencement speech at the University of Tennessee. According to Gore, doom was imminent, even if he had to fudge the climate data to make it sound frightening. Then on September 1, an environmental extremist named James Jay Lee took hostages at the Discovery Channel’s office in Silver Springs, Maryland. He was armed and claimed also to have explosives with him. Lee made some very extreme demands which he posted on the web.

    In the world most of us live in we are accountable for our own actions and beliefs. While some have unfairly suggested that gloomy, depressing, hateful speeches by Al Gore may have influenced Lee’s actions, however that would be as easy as it would be wrong. Nobody made Lee kidnap those 3 people in the Discovery Channel’s building, nobody made him threaten their lives, and nobody forced him to write his extreme manifesto. Unquestionably, however, there are many in the environmental movement who hold the same extreme views as quoted directly from his manifesto:

    How people can live without producing more filthy children.

    All programs on Discovery Health-TLC must stop encouraging the birth of any more parasitic human infants

    talk about ways to disassemble civilization

    Civilization must be exposed for the filth it is. That, and all its disgusting religious-cultural roots and greed.

    Broadcast this message until the pollution of the planet is reversed and the human population goes down! This is your obligation. If you think it isn’t, then get hell off the planet!

    • JeffH

      The bottom line is that we should all realize is that “extremism” has no boundaries and shouldn’t be attached on one group over another, whether a man, woman or child, a righty or lefty, liberal or conservative, Democrat or Republican. Violent acts such as those Loughner has committed are acts of very sick individuals.

      Every person on earth is responsible for his or her own actions and should suffer the consequences of said actions. To place the blame elsewhere is just ludicrous and irresponsible.

      extremism
      1. the condition or act of taking an extreme view.
      2. the taking of extreme action. — extremist, n., adj.

      • Richard Pawley

        Jeff, how can you say “Every person on earth is responsible for his or her own actions and should suffer the consequences of said actions” Don’t you know that we are all victims. The government owes us other peoples money. We deserve it and if they are foolish enough to work for it then it is only right that a socialist or Marxist or fascist government should take it away from them. After all Karl Marx was the one who invented the Progressive Income Tax. It’s only right that they bankrupt the county and force all to buy health insurance from the company of the government’s choice. Hey they wouldn’t be our rulers if they weren’t smarter than we are, would they? MY TRY AT SARCISM! Don’t think I’m very good at it. You mentioned California. Hope you don’t live within 100 miles of LA? They have a few more years but not many. Wrote all about it in my autobiography. Oh, by the way, one of the laws of the Universe is called the Law of Reciprocity, and it is as inviolable at the Law of Gravity. Some call it Karma, the Bible says “As you sow, so shall you reap” but ultimately we all are held responsible. I think it’s why Jesus said to not even think ill of your enemies. You don’t want to be tied to them in any way. Check out Dr. George Ritchie’s site for the most interesting experience of his life and you will see where some on this site may end up where they can argue forever: http://www.near-death.com/ritch.html

        • kate8

          Richard – It isn’t always easy to think well of those who are evil. This morning I was reflecting on this and on forgiveness and how these things are crucial to healing on all levels. I was reminded that, through Christ, God has separated sin from the sinner. Therefore, it is not so difficult to love the person while despising the evil that has been committed. That is true also in regard to forgiving ourselves.

          In order for the Christ Spirit to recognize us, we must have something in common with Him. He said of many, that even though they fed the hungry and clothed the naked, “I never knew you”. This means that their hearts are not in resonance with Him.

          Only by releasing the “sin” (blockages caused by wrong thinking and unforgiveness) that is stuck in our spiritual/physical bodies, can we allow the Light of His Love to enter our hearts and raise our vibration into resonance with His. The wages of sin is death. Sin is anything that is out of harmoney with Life. The Spirit of Christ releases us from sin, and cleanses us of ALL our wounds, bringing about not only spiritual healing, but physical, as well.

          Wherever we have pain (physical or emotional), fear, or illness, that is the key to our healing, and that is where we explore as our pathway to Love.

          • Richard Pawley

            Kate, I’m not sure it’s ever easy to love the unlovable or to turn the other cheek when someone insults you, or physically hurts you. It may not even be possible in your own power, but with God all things are possible. I’m a bit more traditional than you perhaps in my understanding of how God works. I don’t believe that God hides from us or tries to make it difficult. If we want to know what is required and we have no preconceived notions of how it must be and if someone explains it to us in simple terms with a common sense approach (or course it’s illogical that the Creator of all that is should know us and love us, but thankfully He does) well it’s all explained in the gospels and ACTS right after them how it should be. There is more than the gospels and ACTS but they give us the essentials of what we need. In fact I heard a funny story (true) of a tribe in Africa who only had one of the gospels translated in their tongue when the missionaries got out because of the invading Nazi’s in WWII. After the war the missionaries returned and wondered if any of them were still Christian or if they had reverted to their former primitive ways. Not only did they find a much larger group of Christians but they were astounded to find healings and miracles that were taken for granted by these people who accepted it because Jesus said that His followers would do the same as He did and they didn’t have enough sophistication to know that He didn’t mean it. The part that I found funny was that this particular church didn’t believe in miracles and healings until they were faced with them! I’ve heard it said that if we take one step towards God He will take ten steps towards us. I’ve always been a believer even when I was three years old. In LEAVING SOUTH CAROLINA I recall how I prayed to find some scissors I had lost (that I knew I should not have been playing with at the age of three) and I knew I would get a spanking if I didn’t return them and how I searched and searched and prayed while I searched and how they suddenly showed up where I was convinced I had already looked). Can’t be absolutely sure what happened back then but I remember what happened that day like it was yesterday and it was well over half a century ago. Still, I was a grown adult and didn’t know that an ordinary believer could have a personal relationship with Jesus until I read PRISON TO PRAISE by Merlin Carothers (only 106 pages) and was invited to a prayer meeting where for months I had heard of healings going on. To long to tell here but I devoted a chapter all this in my book and my encounter with a former religious who was, I believe, possessed. Something like right out of The Twilight Zone. All I did that night though was say a private silent asking Jesus to give me what all these other people of over two dozen different denominations had (this was after I investigated and asked questions for three weeks to ascertain if it was all that it seemed. When I determined it was and they showed me that all this was in the Bible I asked Jesus to come into my spirit and forgive my sins and give me this extra measure of the Holy Spirit that all these people had. I was even prayed over and although I actually saw miracles happen when that happened to others nothing of note happened when they prayed over me at that church or in that town but in a nearby church in a different town the following week I had an experience very similar to the one the apostles had in the book of ACTS. In fact it was almost identical except that instead of tongues of fire coming down from the sky it seemed to like a sun brighter than the sun descended upon me except it was dark and at night when it happened, and after that I no longer believed God loved me and forgave me, I KNEW HE DID. Even so I prayed a lot more for Gabrielle Gifford and her husband Scott and the parents of the nine year old who was killed than I did for her killer. I think that’s only natural and that guy will have to pay for his crime but God does not hate him, only what He did. I hope you have looked at the web sites I’ve mentioned from time to time as I think you would find them helpful and if you get a chance to read the books I recommend you would find them beneficial too, easy to read and not complicated. Incredible perhaps but not difficult. It is men who make things difficult. Jesus once told a woman in England some 80 years ago, “In all things simplify” Remember there is nothing you can do to make God love you more than He already does. All you can do is draw near to Him and He will draw near to you. You have to ask Him to forgive you for all your wrongdoing but I suspect you have already done that, and ask Him to bless you with His Holy Spirit that He promised so long ago, and with which He has blessed millions. There is no particular affiiation of men YOU MUST JOIN, all have value and some are better than others but it is God and our relationship with Jesus that counts, not where we happened to meeet Him. However, we can usually reach others who are more like us and if we are to be leven it would normally be easier (maybe not) in our own denomination. I just thought of two men who came to know God personally and got thrown out of their respective churches because they didn’t believe that at the time. Must close. May God continue to bless you…Richard.

  • JeffH

    What is really sad is that the Left has not wasted a moment trying to blame this weekend’s tragic shooting of Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords — which killed 6 and wounded 11 — on conservatives, especially Sarah Palin. Watch the video below as Sen. Lamar Alexander, R-TN, tells CNN’s Candy Crowley to stop spreading this toxic blood libel.
    http://cajunconservatism.wordpress.com/2011/01/09/gop-senator-tells-media-stop-blaming-tea-party-for-az-shooting/

  • kate8

    JeffH – Have no doubt. The Progressives will play this for all it’s worth. And they will keep on until they’ve dismantled our Constitution and our entire way of life.

    Unless we stop them.

    • libertytrain

      I’m posting here re the comment you made below this one about the Judge not getting much attention. Interesting article here – ok, ABC but the article is still interesting about the poor Judge, yes he was Republican and had received death threats as well in 2009.
      http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/federal-judge-killed-arizona-congresswoman-shooting/story?id=12573597

      • Richard Pawley

        Her 75 year old father (in NYC which is ultra-liberal) made the mistake of saying he thought it was the TEA PARTY. I can understand a bereaved father saying that about his daughter because he just wants to lash out at someone, and didn’t know the killer was a gung-ho progressive from what I heard reported. He can be forgiven but those on the left who want to crash the country and ‘fundamentally transform it’ as has been said, will take advantage of every opportunity. “Let no crisis go to waste” Sadly some on the right want the same thing, a bankrupt USA that won’t have to pay it’s debt and that is why the US Treasury is creating 75,000 MILLION DOLLARS a month out of thin air. We all are going to pay dearly for this and to the tune of nearly 300% inflation. Some of my sources say by the next election but I don’t know for sure. Those who are believer’s and who care about the country should pray for Gabrielle’s recovery and that of all in congress. The latest reports say we have 40,000 trained troops to quell the future riots in this country, not just the 20,000 I said in my last book. Let’s hope that Congress beccomes a bit more security minded. There are ten’s of millions of citizens who have been taught that they are victims and the government owes them and they will be most unhappy when the inflation finally hits. You don’t want to be in any big city at that time, in my opinion. May God help us!

        • libertytrain

          Her father, being obviously in shock, can be forgiven for accusations like that. It’s sad. I pray for all of them.

          • Denniso

            Richard…the killer was not a ‘gung ho progressive’. He was a hater of gov’t and swallowed the pap from the rightwing about our currency being worthless because it’s not backed by gold. He was clearly mixed up, and I would say a lot of that could be ascribed to all the conflicting and often bald faced lying ‘information’ out there. Most of it coming from people w/ a vested interest in fearmongering and scapegoating.

          • Richard Pawley

            Denniso: Why is talking about how our dollar is steadily losing value “right wing”? I read my first book on currency devaluation in 1979, and published my first article on it in 1990. I published my autobiography in 2006 and in it I warned of the coming stock market crash and suggested that gold at 500-600 would be a much better investment. Was that right wing? Two people who read LEAVING SOUTH CAROLINA wrote and thanked me for saving their life savings but I only shared what I knew. If saying that the dollar is going to lose two thirds of it’s current value right wing, is it left wing to say all is well, and there’s nothing to worry about, and the stock market is safe? I’m more interested in truth than in wings, right or left. One of my sources said after last Thanksgiving that there were 1600 CEO’s selling stocks for every one that was buying. One of my sources believes that some of the 75,000 MILLION DOLLARS that the Treasury is creating every month is partly going to keep the stock market up. I have no way of verifying this but since they kept the price of gold down for so long I see no reason to disbelieve it. Admittedly those with mental or psychological problems can be manipulated but Americans have begun to wake up to all the manipulations that have been thrown at them over the past decades. If the Republicans do not shape up in the next year the Tea Party could become a third party. On that I cannot say with certainty but our country in approaching the greatest danger it has ever been in since it was founded. A time is coming when it will make little difference if one is right wing or left wing but I suspect that will not be for some time yet. In the mean time a wise person would at least consider preparing as I have recommended. Gold will still go 20% higher and maybe more but non-perishable food will eventually triple.

          • Denniso

            Scaring people about our currency and making them think that it’s worthless because it doesn’t have gold behind it,as it hasn’t fo 40 yrs,is part of the fearmongering agenda of the right. It’s also wrong. Our currency is staying up w/ all the major currencies and that is the measure of it.

            The fearmongering about the Fed and lack of gold backing is part of the political agenda of the right, and used to make the gov’t and Obama look like tyranny. Most of what the right says about the economics of the country is way of base and they just want to pin blame on Obama and Democrats. That’s how it’s right wing. No major economists echo what the rightwing says about the economy and currency and gold.

  • kate8

    JeffH – I also find it extremely interesting that, while much has been reported on Congresswoman Gifford, and much commentary about her, her family, and her character, the death of the federal judge has received virtually nothing but the briefest mention in passing. Even the 9 year old girl has gotten more attention than he.

    He was, I believe, a Republican. She is a Democrat.

    Need I say more.

    • Denniso

      You just can’t help trying to make some partisan points, can you. That’s another juvenile comment from you looking to distract from what actually happened…an assasination attempt on the congresswoman and an assasination of a federal judge. People have talked about him, maybe just not on the phony ‘news’ network you watch. I don’t think the little girl has been discussed enough as well as the other dead and wounded. You’re a clear partisan looking for a partisan advantage in a tragedy.

      • JeffH

        …and Denniso never uses partisan tactics or places any blame, such an open mind? NOT!

        denniso says:
        January 8, 2011 at 4:53 pm
        “We all know which side in this country has been stoking the fires of violence for the past 10 yrs. During the last election cycle some Democratic workers were shot and killed. Now we have a Democratic Rep in Tucson shot and at least 6 people killed in the tragedy,one of the dead a 9 yr old girl. The inflamatory language of the right is responsible for these killings as they shout repeatedly that we need revolution,that ballots may not be enough,that liberals are traitors,that Obama is a marxist. All of that and more makes up much of the comments on this site and that’s all it takes to trigger and unbalanced person to take up violence. Everyone here and elsewhere who uses such language and makes thinly veiled threats on political leaders shares in the blame for these killings.”

        “Shameful for the rightwing extremists,Arizona and this country. Six dead, a little girl, and maybe more among the injured. Disgusting!”

        Denniso you are exactly what you accuse others of, an extremist by all accounts. Such the hypocrite and you should be ashamed!

        • Denniso

          Thanks for re posting my entire comment,w/ so little contribution from you. For your information,I shun violence and have spent my entire adult life working for peace and community. Arguing,debating and refuting nonsense and bigotry/racism is not advocating violence. We can all engage in spirited and heated discussion w/o resorting to violent terms and threats…there is a difference. Do a little thinking for a change.

          • JeffH

            You are nutso, an extremist to the nth degree…get some phyciatric help for your own good and for the good of those around you!

          • JeffH

            As for this comment: “For your information,I shun violence and have spent my entire adult life working for peace and community.”

            You accuse every Tom, Dick and Harry of being or promoting violence and based on your comments, past and present, there is nothing peacefull about you unless you find “hatred” peacefull.

            Get some help, you need it!

            If you want some peace…leave this website and don’t return, you’ll probably add years to your life.

          • Richard Pawley

            Sorry, I would have to disagree with what you say here. The kind of arguing you do could easily enrage a weak minded person and bring about just the kind of thing that happened. Arguing for the sake of arguing is pointless.

          • Denniso

            JeffH…sorry you can’t put together a coherent thought or comprehend someone else’s. I’m angry as hell at the murders,especially the little girl who was the most innocent of all. I’m also angry at people like you and Kate8 and others here who are playing politics w/ the slaughter because you’re terrified and too cowardly to admit that all the hate and violent language could be partly culpable. So you and your type have to go on the attack if anyone dare make a possible connection between the hate spread on the airwaves and murders like this. There is blame on all sides,but there is no doubt at all where most of it comes from and you and others are lying to yourselves if you claim that Limbaugh,Savage and Beck are not the prime movers behind the hate and division.

        • libertytrain

          I thought it particularly interesting this “good fellow” the big “D” was the first to jump on this site and make his accusations against the rightist conservatives for this unfortunate and sad event done by someone with mental illness – hmmm.

          • JeffH

            Sounds remarkably like the MSM alphabets, attack, attack, attack then deny, deny, deny. No wonder more and more people turn to FOX for news and information.

          • kate8

            JeffH, libertytrain, Richard Pawley makes a good point. Denniso would be one of those “weak-minded” persons who would become enraged at being challenged and go off.

            Unfortunately, this is all leading to futher restrictions on our free speech. The Left would have us believe that we are all responsible for the outbursts (of those who’ve been indoctrinated by the LEFT, BTW). Pretty soon we’ll be being arrested for any kind of metaphor if they can tie it to a possible act of violence, no matter how far the stretch.

            They are already talking about banning guns. We knew this was coming.

            I still think this is another planned event. Ms. Gifford was a gun-owner and a proponent of border control. She was not walking in total lock-step with the agenda. I think this was a warning to any other members of Congress who don’t tow the line. Banning guns is a big priority for the NWO this year.

    • Karolyn

      When I watched the news yesterday morning, they had plenty about him. He was Bush appointed and appears to have been a very fair judge and a good man. He was friends with Giffords. This is one thing I found online: “Roll received death threats in 2009 after he denied a southern Arizona rancher’s motions to dismiss a lawsuit filed on behalf of illegal immigrants who alleged that the rancher detained, assault and threatened them, the Arizona Republic reported.”

      • Denniso

        Also, the judge was not part of the event. He stopped by to thank Ms Giffords for helping to get a judicial budget increase to better deal w/ all of the immigrant cases. Ms Giffords was pretty clearly the intended target and as an elected repsentative of the people she took the risk of being out in a public venue.

        • kate8

          So, because he wasn’t part of the event, this renders his death less consequencial?

          What is your point?

          • Denniso

            God, i wish you would think a little more before you type. The point is that the news coverage is focused on Ms Giffords because she was almost certainly the target. She is a rep of the people and it’s big news when an elected person is assasinated. We have only had one rep killed in our history and that makes it a shocking rarity and impacts our very democracy and how our gov’t functions w/ the people. It’s a tragedy for all the victims,especially the little girl.

            Why aren’t you as concerned for the 9 yr old girl as you are for the judge,who you say is a Republican? You’re desperate to point out the ‘unfair’ coverage because you’re a partisan and nothing more.

          • Richard Pawley

            Kate, you are wasting your time. Can you convince a wall or a tree? You are dealing with what longshoreman author Eric Hoffer called “A True Believer”. “There are none so blind as those who will not see” Really! I’m not going to write much more in these columns because it does take a lot of time and I believe this will be the last year I will be able to easily prepare for the hard times that our financial mess is going cause us all. A lawyer friend has said I should write another book on how to survive the really hard times that are coming, how to prepare food and store it and use it but I’m not an expert at that and I’m still learning. I wrote my first 16 page paper on “The Coming Financial Crisis” 20 years ago, and in my autobiography I warned of the then coming stock market crash two years before it hit but only a couple of readers pulled their money out of the market on my advice and bought gold at 600. What I called then “the Greater Depression” has not hit yet but it’s coming and “it will make the Great Depression look like a walk-in-the-park” (to quote myself in 2006). I never met anyone who read the whole book who didn’t get something out of it but the effort doesn’t seem to be worth the few who were helped because I know nothing about promotion. You can go to any major book store and they will tell you they have in their warehouse but I think of all who could have been helped it they could have read it in time. It’s the same now that I am telling them of what is coming but since I can’t say exactly when most prefer to wait and see. I prefer the old saying that it is better to be years to early than one day to late. I heard the term ‘normalcy bias’ recently that means because something hasn’t happened before the majority believe it cannot happen, yet it has already begun. At least we can hope the new TEA PARTY in congress can slow down our demise but only time will tell. Watch what new bills get pushed through and make sure you learn about non-perishable food. I believe they will go up more than gold (percentage wise, that is).

          • kate8

            Richard Pawley – Never feel that your efforts have been wasted if you have been following God’s urgings. He will see to it that your work gets into the proper hands where it will fulfill His purpose.

            I know that many here appreciate your words. It isn’t ours to judge where they will do the most good. Just keep on keeping on.

            I have done as much as possible to store food and water with my very limited resources. As we don’t really know God’s timeline, I, like many others, must choose whether to buy provision or plan how long I can keep a roof over my head and keep afloat. I can only trust in God to show me the way, or perhaps I will perish. My family is not wholly on board with the idea…yet. What I have will go for them first.

            God bless you for all you efforts. I feel that the most important thing now is drawing as close to God as possible. If we abide in Him, whatever comes won’t really matter.

          • Richard Pawley

            What you have just said is true Kate. Trust in God. He ways are not our ways, but He loves us. We have some time yet, and it won’t be the end of the world (but it will seem like it with prices tripling). I hope you live away from the big cities. If you need the addresses of places to buy things, well there are several. Not to go overboard or crazy but just think like a pioneer woman of 1850 who has to get through the winter and you’ll be in much better shape than those in the city. Still if you must be in a city you can pray about that too. The main thing is not to fear as there is more than enough of that going around.

  • http://deleted Claire

    libertytrain—How about those Packers??? Hooray!!!

    • Denniso

      The people on here who are essentially defending hate speech,demonizing politicians and preaching violent resistance and armed revolution can’t be as dumb as they sound when they plead innocent to inciting unbalanced gun nuts to violence…can they? If they are smarter than their comments make them sound then they are cynical manipulators knowing full well what they are doing. Trying to get unbalanced and brainwashed people to commit violence for them because they are actually cowards themselves. Sit at a computer and play at revolution while some dumb kid takes their advice and ‘stands up’ for his country. I can only hope that someone is watching and taking down names…

      • JeffH

        Denniso, I’ll guarantee you that if they are monitoring and reading your unbalanced comments they are roaring with laughter. If you think, as you do, for a minute that “we” don’t take this senseless slaughter seriously you’re sadly mistaken. None of us advocate violence of any kind and we sure as hell won’t start it. Being prepared for violence is far different than inciting violence, but I wouldn’t expect that you could understand that based on your hate based comments. What can’t be taken seriously is your obsessive behavior and hateful rhetoric and delusions. The man that did this was sick and crazy, nothing more…now go call the DHS or the FBI so they can put you on the crazy list.

        • Denniso

          No one on this site advocates violence? Now, that’s funny. You’re either blind or lying. The ‘man’ was a kid indoctrinated by constant hate speech and anti gov’t railing. Almost nothing happens in a vacuum,and this didn’t either. You want to pretend that he is just a sick kid so you and your ‘side’ can evade any responsibility for creating the conditions for this to occur within. Plead ignorance all you want but anyone w/ the ability to think can see right through the pretense and cowardice of the rightwing extremists.

          • Denniso

            Here’s a photo of all the victims including the 9 year old girl along w/ her story. Born on Sept 11,2001.

            http://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/10/us/10green.html?src=ISMR_HP_LO_MST_FB

          • JeffH

            “Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote.” Ben Franklin

            “A fanatic is one who can’t change his mind and won’t change the subject.” Churchill

            “You won’t get gun control by disarming law-abiding citizens. There’s only one way to get real gun control: Disarm the thugs and the criminals, lock them up, and if you don’t actually throw away the key, at least lose it for a long time… It’s a nasty truth, but those who seek to inflict harm are not fazed by gun controllers. I happen to know this from personal experience.”
            —Ronald Reagan, 1983

            “Government is not the solution to our problem. Government is the problem.” Ronald Reagan

            “How do you tell a Communist? Well, it’s someone who reads Marx and Lenin. And how do you tell an anti-Communist? It’s someone who understands Marx and Lenin.” Ronald Reagan

            “It isn’t that Liberals are ignorant. It’s just that they know so much that isn’t so.” Ronald Reagan

            “When governments fear the people, there is liberty. When the people fear the government, there is tyranny. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.” Jefferson

            “The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots & tyrants.” Jefferson

            “One loves to possess arms, though they hope never to have occasion for them.” Jefferson

            “Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the American people’s liberty teeth and the keystone under independence.” George Washington

            “A people armed and free forms a barrier against the enterprises of ambition and is a bulwark for the nation against foreign invasion and domestic oppression.” James Madison

            Lock N Load and Keep Some Powder Dry

          • Richard Pawley

            Jeff: Do you recall the Japanese Admiral (who graduated from Harvard I think) who in WWII said he would never invade the USA because there would be a gun under every blade of grass. Kind of proves your point but as I told Kate, don’t waste time arguing. Speak your truth quietly and take seriously what I have written about getting ready for really hard times ahead. Can’t tell you the month they will start but this nation has not seen anything like what we are headed for if there is not a big change and a return to morality and responsibility. You cannot keep going when you have to print money just to pay the interest on the debt. It’s why I recommended buying a thee year supply of things you need (if you can afford it), getting out of the big cities, and if you are a believer, praying for guidance. God said “No one who turns to me will I ever turn away” if they are sincere and mean it but only He can judge that. Everyone is going to be affected by what is coming and being rich will be of little help if all you have is paper stocks and paper bonds. Must close. Past 3:30 a.m. Take care and keep on keeping on and the best to you.

          • Denniso

            So you guys just continue to spread inflammatory words and engage in fearmongering,suggesting to the unbalanced that they are about to be involved in revolution or total armageddon. Richard,despite your softer tone compared to others here,you are doing the same thing. No one knows the future w/ any certainty and you should know that every generation imagines they will be the one to see the end of civilization. It obviously doesn’t happen as all the adament forecasters preach it will, and it only leads to increased fear and irrational behavior. The talk in the past few yrs of ‘end times’,total collapse,utter chaos,armegeddon,blood in the streets,dictatorship,collapsing currency and more,only serves to further disturb already disturbed people w/ guns and scare people into making bad personal and political decisions.

            If you are a writer of any merrit adn know any history,you should know this as well as anyone.

          • kate8

            Denniso – You are the one railing the loudest. And nothing you say changes the fact that the only organized efforts to overthrow our Constitutional government are LEFTIST groups, and they are advocating violence, rioting and mayhem in order to create chaos.

            It doesn’t change the fact that those committing these acts are LEFTIST. Why is it that it is always those indoctrinated by the LEFT that are so mentally unbalanced? Well, liberalism is a mental disorder, after all. It spreads hate of all things good.

            You may as well give it up, Denniso. No one’s buying what you’re selling. It’s taken us awhile, but we all are seeing through the smoke and mirrors and mind games coming out of your camp, and it’s just not going to work anymore. We will fight to the end to preserve our freedoms, including freedom of speech (no matter how you try to twist it) and our right to bear arms.

            It is so pathetic that you who scream the loudest about “hate speech” are the most guilty of it. You have ZERO credibility.

            Your mind is hopelessly lost. I am really sorry for you.

          • Denniso

            You’ve clearly gone off the edge of sanity…you don’t remember the so called ‘Republic of Texas’ guys who tried to secede and killed people in the process? You don’t remember the so called ‘militia movement’ that was resisting Federal laws and got people killed? Was McVeigh a leftist when he bombed the Federal building and slaughtered a couple hundred little kids in their day care and hoped to start a revolution?
            There have been extremists on both sides but what’s been going on for 30 yrs is almost exclusive to the right. Read some history before you spout your nonsense…please.

          • Denniso

            Thanks for your sincere concern for my well being…and isn’t it just like you and your fellows to quote your leaders mantra,’liberalism is a mental illness’. Right out of the mouth of the very sick Michael Savage and the buffoon Limbaugh. You could try to be just a little original, but no, I guess that’s not possible for blind sheep following their bellowing masters. Sorry that I forgot that.

        • bob wire

          “The man that did this was sick and crazy, nothing more…now go call the DHS or the FBI so they can put you on the crazy list.”

          correct, you are right, he is a sick man with access to the public and media where he can read you telling him to lock and load and all the other things, ~ nifty saying you offer to present a powerful pro gun manifesto.

          Just know you have done your part is spreading a manifesto when at times wasn’t unnecessary and not even in dispute, but more like a Pirate with this overwhelming urge to say, RRrrrrrr! ~ a verbal announcement to all non-Pirates, claiming presence.

          We could all do without superfluous threaten veiled statements, they serve little constructive purpose, unless intimidation is some goal or it’s a secret Bubba password and opens closed doors.

          This man bought this gun in November of last year ~ didn’t take him long to use it did it? Now he’s killed several people and shoot a congresswoman in the head.

          These kind of event does “nothing” to help and defend our rights to bear arms.

          Do you know what turned Lenin “Vladimir Ilyich Ulyanov” into the man he became? It was the killing of his brother.

          • Denniso

            People have used all the violent and anti gov’t rhetoric and fear mongering to further their specific political agenda,and this is what it can result in…senseless murder and now our society will be closed up and tightened down more. Is this what ‘freedom’ is about? The right to shoot 20 people in one minute? Are these the sort of guns the founders imagined when they wrote the 2nd ammendent?

          • bob wire

            Yes they do Denniso! ~~ and if we don’t fight it when we see someone spreading the seeds of gun play ~ when do we fight it?

            This is not a Gun forum and the thread does not address 2nd Right amendment issues.

            I love sex, money and all things well designed, built for speed, effective and of use to me.

            But I don’t feel require to advocate them without due cause.

            I see no due cause at this point ~ and if you do, we have a serious divide.

            I know that this divide does exist among 3 or 4 poster here and consider them hazard to themselves and anyone that might get in their way. They are a lite fuse and it will only take their perception to trigger them into action. They are predisposed. All they need is affirmation and not very much of it.

            Thanks goodness their numbers are small, but one is one too many as we read the New this morning.

            The first process in creating any reality is “Think it” and the “Second” is to speak it.

          • Denniso

            There are already restrictions on ‘arms’ in this country and every other country except the worst. It’s a matter of what limits and laws we have on guns,just like anything else. We can’t own bombs,machine guns,grenades or missile launchers. We can’t own nuclear tipped artillery rounds…If we are to follow the 2nd ammendment then we have to define what an ‘arm’ is,since that is the word used. Does it mean canon, or is it confined to pistols and rifles? The founders only knew of single shot,muzzle loaded weapons,so if we are true to the constitution then we would have to stick w/ only those being legal. If we open up the definition of ‘arm’ to more than that, then where do we draw the line on what an ‘arm’ is?

            It’s reasonable to draw the line at high capacity clips or semi and automatic weapons because of the huge damage they can do in a single minute. Just as it’s reasonable to draw the line at amour piercing bullets. When one person can slaughter 6 and wound 12 or 14 more so easily we should think about the weapons we allow in public.

            This has happened before w/ one shooter killing many. If we think we need these sort of guns and clips for self defense,then something is very wrong w/ our society.

          • bob wire

            I don’t know Dennis , ~ for all the right reasons, I’m a strong supporter of the 2nd amendment. ~ and it’s those very reasons to be found under gunned is a very undesirable position.

            Potential threats has greatly exceeded my personal preference, a heavy frame S&W 357/2″barrel.

            I’m not going to get into a personal arms race and have no plans to starting a war, I’m left finding myself depending largely on digression, wit and what professional training I’ve acquired over a colorful life time.

            But there is some cleaver “stuff” out there to be had that I’d sure hate to go up against.

            I’m going to refer to a higher power on this matter.

            People carry guns because policemen are just too heavy.

          • Denniso

            Bob…I grew up shooting, but think that in a modern, large and complex society, that some restrictions and laws to balance the right of self defense and the danger to others is a reasonable path for reasonable people. Many of the true gun nuts are not buying guns for self defense but rather for a war w/ the gov’t or liberals.

          • Palin12

            Wrong again denniso. I own a gun for protection against home invaders, which are prevalent in my area.

          • Denniso

            You could move to a better area. There are more accidental killings of children and adults w/ guns in the home then there are instances of self defence. The odds are against you. I believe in self defense but also know how many kids are killed by those guns in the home,or a spouse shooting another in a rage.

          • Palin12

            no rug rats in my house….anything else to worry about??

          • Denniso

            Kids never come over to your house? You might have a spouse…friends,family…

          • Palin12

            Visitors to my home do not go upstairs where my gun is. In fact, I have a doggy gate on the stairway to keep the dogs downstairs. Any more lunatic suggestions why my 2nd Amendment rights should be taken away?

  • jopa

    Richard Pawley;There never was a Japanese Admiral that said ” He would never invade America because there is a gun under every blade of grass.”I think it may have been admiral Hirohiito that said after the attack on Pearl Harbor.” I believe we may have just awaken a sleeping giant.”

    • Palin12

      That quote is from Admiral Yamamoto. Hirohito was the Empirer of Japan. My dad served at Pearl Harbor shortly after WW2. I was born 8 miles away from the attack site, in Honolulu, oddly enough in the same hospital Obama claims to have been born in. Funny, my birth certificate looks quite a bit different than the document he has shown.

      • Denniso

        I wonder if it’s at all possible that you were not born in the same time period as Obama and that just maybe the form and style of the certificate’s may have changed? I know you have trouble,but it’s just a thought.

        • Palin12

          Wrong as usual. Yes Hawaii was a territory when I was born. They merely changed the words on the document from “Territory of Hawaii” to “State of Hawaii”. Do you really expect there would be less bureaucracy on a state form than a territorial form? My oldest niece was also born at Tripler Hospital in Honolulu. She is younger than Obummer. Her birth certificate looks more like mine than your messiah’s.

          • Denniso

            Unlike you, I have no messiah. Obama is worth supporting because he has some smarts and is trying like hell to save the country from predatory capitalism that got us into this economic mess. He isn’t perfect in my eyes and I and other liberals are free to critique him and we do on many issues…unlike the slavish loyalty of the Repubs to their leaders like Cheny/Bush. We don’t have ‘messiahs’,we have leaders who we try to support to make this a better country for all of us,not just for the rich.

          • Palin12

            Please document where I have ever said anything good about Bush.

          • Denniso

            I’m not going to look back to try to nail you down. You sound like all the other rightwingers,and your name would indicate that,I would think. I would be willing to bet that you NEVER trashed and smeared Bush or Cheny the way you and your bedfellows do Obama.

          • Palin12

            Come on Denniso, I’ll make it worth your while. I’ll pay you $1000 cash if you can point to a single time that I have praised Bush. Everyone here is my witness. Your problem is you like to stereotype people you disagree with. Didn’t you read my post last November wherein I admitted to voting for one democrat in the last election (county treasurer)?

          • Denniso

            Well that’s big of you,voting for a Democratic candidate for treasurer! I’m not very impressed,I’m afraid. It isn’t worth $1000 to have to look through the archives of comments from this site,if they even exist. But,even if it is true that you never said anything good about Cheny/Bush,the real question is whether you ever attacked them for all the crap they did? Phony war that killed tens of thousands,illegal surveiling of Americans in this country,busting the budget,never paying for the wars,not finishing the wars,no bid contracts to Haliburton,breaking the law w/ torture…That I doubt very much. If so,show us.

          • Palin12

            Not to belittle the deaths in Iraq, but they are all volunteers, unlike Vietnam where young men were drafted involuntarily. 5,000 or so deaths in Iraq compared to 58,000 in Vietnam. Vietnam War was started by JFK and LBJ, both democrats. Reviewing 20th Century wars in America, we find Woodrow Wilson, a democrat, got us into WWI; FDR, a democrat, got us into WWII; Harry Truman, another democrat, got us into Korea. Where is the outrage from you liberals?

          • Palin12

            BTW, regarding my county treasurer….her Republican opponent made a comment that Treasurer is a man’s job and that’s why he was running to unseat her. That comment was a bit over-the-top for me and he is one republican that did not get my vote. Nor will Sen. Ensign in 2012.

  • jopa

    I thik the actual quote was “I fear we may have just awaken a sleeping giant.”

  • jopa

    Denniso: I believe Jeffyh has been on the crazy list for some time now along with several others on this site.They have a tendency to say things over the line and when people get killed they try and come back the next day and say how peaceful and kind they are to their fellow man.Beneath all their jibberish today they are all saying wow the revolution has begun.We all know what they say about loose lips and there are plenty of them here.

    • Denniso

      jopa,you’re right and I have no doubt that there are many people in the country and aome on this site who are licking their lips at the prospect that this murderer has begun the revolution they have been waithing for,much like Tim McVeigh’s massacre. Fortunately for the country and even for them,there will be no violent revolution anytime soon as more rational people will prevail.

      • Richard Pawley

        The only people who want revolution are those who feel that Karl Marx and the radicals from the 60′s who are now running the government are right. What drives down-to-earth ordinary citizens bonkers is that people like OBAMA are brilliant but it’s all theoretical knowledge. His administration has the least practical experience of any administration in the past century. Like Hitler, who clearly said in Mein Kampf what he was going to do, so Obama stated clearly what he intended to do. No one should be surprised that he is trying his best to “fundamentally change the country” into the socialist mecca that he believes will make this a heaven on earth. If this was a brand new idea that had never been tried before I could understand intelligent people thinking it was so wonderful, but it has been tried, over and over again, and it has always failed. There is not enough wisdom in the world or money either to let everyone sit back and live off the rich. Everyone wants a free lunch. I know of millionaires who have gotten out of this country just like some of the Jews got out of Germany in the 1930′s. Now Obama is no Hitler and what is going to happen to us will be different than what happened to Germany but there are eerie parallels. Some 200,000 a year leave this country each year (maybe more by now for all I know). They don’t want to be stripped of their wealth by an increasingly Marxist society. I was personally shocked that the Pelosi-Reid Health care bill passed. I didn’t think that Americans would put up with the death panels that Sarah Palin warned about. OK, she should not have called them that. It sounds so not-nice but she is not one to sugar coat things in pretty words. No one will every accuse her of being politically correct. “Shocking” the talking heads screamed on TV. “Never happen” the Krugman’s of the government media kept saying. Now even the guy who is head of the new Pelosi-Reid health care says of course there will be rationing and someone who will have to decide who gets treatment and who doesn’t. JUST DON’T CALL THEM DEATH PANELS. That is Sarah Palin’s word. They are just people loving socialists who are helping the people so give it a nicer name. They will be just as dead but call it something else. Even a fifth grader could see that we could not possibly include paying for 30,000,000 more people’s health care and save money. 46% of doctors said they would quit, change professions, or move out of the country, if we went the route of England and others. Of course they didn’t mean it, right? Well, there are 45 partially built doctor owned hospitals that have been canceled in the past eight or nine months across the country so I guess those 45 meant it. Well, hospitals should be run by the government anyway. What business does a doctor have running a hospital? They are now admitting it will be a thousand billion dollars more expensive than they thought for all this free heath care. It’s all insane. From now until twenty years from now we are going to have 10,000 people a day retiring and collecting social security and the government will likely just do what it is doing now, printing 75,000 Million Dollars a month, creating it out of thin air. Great idea, just print all the money you need – hey, I could use a few mil myself. Great idea. I wonder why no one ever thought of that before. Wait a minute, didn’t Zimbabwe do that for the last ten or twelve years and they have had chaos ever since. Yugoslavia did that too. A loaf of bread cost a dollar or two and when they couldn’t pay their bills they just started printing money. They even made it a law that everybody had to take personal checks. Last I heard it was Eleven Trillion dollars to buy a loaf but I lost track of it. Of course there is no Yugoslavia any more. YEAH, BUT WE WILL DO IT BETTER! Germany couldn’t pay their bills either so they just started printing money too back before the last Great Depression. I have two stamps in my desk. One is for one and a quarter Mark and the second was issued two years later for one and a quarter million Mark. They are the only two stamps in my collection. After that they had serious inflation, a collapse, and a new leader, a charismatic figure who united the people and promised to give them all jobs and stop those evil businessmen who had done this to them. I worked for the son of one of those businessmen. He was one of the lucky ones who got out of Germany while he could. His son was my boss for nearly four years and he told me that when his dad left Germany he had a quarter of a million dollars (equal to $15 to $20 million today) and by the time the ship reached New York his money was worth about $2,000, still a tidy sum back then but only between $30 and $40 thousand in today’s watered down dollars. So printing and spending is not new and a couple of dozen countries have tried it this past century and every single one of them ended in collapse and as far as I know every single one of them ended in war. OH, BUT WE ARE DIFFERENT. WE HAVE MEN SMARTER THAN GOD AT THE HELM. THEY WON’T MAKE THE SAME MISTAKES and yet for all appearances they have done just that. It makes no difference if you are Democrat or Republican, they just build bigger and bigger bureaucracies, more and bigger government. GOD IS THE STATE, THE STATE IS GOD, and all that. So yes, I have an agenda as you said a while back, it’s to tell the people who will listen what is coming. You are gravely mistaken if you think no one can know the future. I could give examples but I have been at this to long as it is. There are always some who know what is going on. During the last Great Depression when many lost everything there were at least 10,000 who became millionaires. The only thing I can’t be sure of is exactly when all this will happen but smarter men than I have said that by the next election the best gift to get for Christmas, or to give, will be food. We have one slim chance, and that is if The Tea Party can succeed and stop the national debt from growing bigger, and to curtail the 112th Congress from copying the insane spending of the Pelosi-Reid 111th Congress. Even Obama when he was a senator opposed increasing the national debt. He was against it before he was for it. If we just keep going more into debt no one will loan us the money to do all that the inexperienced community organizers want for the whole country. In fact our overseas bankers have already slowed down considerably, and if the Tea Party can’t stop the ever weakening dollar then we will have at least 250% inflation, prices more than tripling. Why are the Marxist progressives so blind that they can’t see it? I don’t know. In “THE LAST DAYS OF THE LATE GREAT UNITED STATES and the Great Famine that Followed” I likened it to the weather forecasters who warned of the hurricane that they said was going to slam into Rhode Island in 1938. There had not been a hurricane in the memory of anyone then living and they just couldn’t believe it. One of my mom’s friend’s decided he had better put his car in his garage when the wind picked up to over 60 miles and hour. He got the garage door open and got the car in but couldn’t close the door and lost both the car and the garage. Others were not so lucky because of something called “The Normalcy Bias” the fact that if something has not happened before most believe it cannot happen. Well, I believe that the present financial crises may be averted but that if we don’t get our economic and moral house in order then we will all suffer together. From my point of view the Republicans are no angels, there are a few good ones just as there are a few good Democrats, but they are both spending us to death. Strip every person in this country of everything they earn that is more than $50,000 a year, tax them at 100% and all that money would not be enough to keep spending the way we have been. It’s this refusal to face facts and to admit that we cannot keep giving away trillions to the owners of the FED or the masses of people who have been taught that they are owed a living. The money isn’t there. It doesn’t exist. It’s why they are just making it up or creating it. This refusal to see things as they are is why Democrats and Socialists and Marxists are considered to be like a cult. They can’t be wrong. It has to work. Just spend more and it will work, 800 Billion didn’t work so spend a TRILLION and when that didn’t work spend a couple of TRILLION. Blame it on Bush, no Clinton was the one who signed the 1999 bill that enabled the banks to loose the chains that had kept them from creating another economic calamity for 70 plus years and it only took them eight years to create economic chaos. Wait it a minute it wasn’t Clinton’s fault. It was a Republican Bill (Gramm-Leach-Bliley) that did away with the Glass-Steagall Act that protected us for those 70 plus years. Yes, it was a Republican Bill but Clinton signed it. Without his signature it wouldn’t have mustered a 2/3rds vote. Bush did it, no Obama did it, no Clinton did it, blah, blah, blah. Who cares who did it! We are all going to suffer. Every living person will be affected. No one will be immune! We have one party made up of all lawyers (the vast majority of Democrats) who have the idea that 35-40% of the country are their clients, and the rest are the enemy. Then we have the Republicans, The Tea Party, the Libertarians, and the Independents. Men have created a problem bigger than they have a heart to fix. Without men turning to God in a big way and crying out to Him to save us, inspire us, forgive us, I see little hope of a recovery. I have always lamented that I had no children but among the last words I heard from my dying 92 year old mother less than 3 months ago were these: Aren’t you glad you don’t have any children who have to grow up in what the United States is becoming?” I could not think of any truthful answer to give her. There is so much more but there are none so blind as those who will not see, and as Herbert Agar once said, “The truth that makes men free if for the most part the truth which men prefer not to hear.” I will continue to prepare as I can and warn those who will listen. Those whose reality is somewhere else will suffer the most. May God help them. Dum spiro spero!

      • Denniso

        I guess you don’t have a job! You’ve just done what can spark a loose cannon like the killer in tucson,equated our president to Hitler. That’s not the way to have a constructive discussion and it can set off an unstable guy w/ easy access to guns w/ 30 round clips. You’re also totally wrong! Try to think logically about this for just a minute. IF OBAMA WERE A MARXIST/SOCIALIST,WHY ON EARTH DID HE RISK SUCH POLITICAL BACKLASH TO BAIL OUT THE CREME OF THE CROP CAPITALISTS?
        WHY DIDN’T HE SHOVEL MONEY OUT TO THE LOW WAGE EARNERS INSTEAD?
        Your and the other’s thesis about this Marxism baloney is so far off base it’s laughable. You write w/ a little calm and reason,but you still repeat the nonsense of the rightwing extremists.

        Please think about it.

        • Richard Pawley

          What does my having been forced into an early retirement have to do with anything? The foreign owned company I worked at for many years pulled out of the United States as have some others along with some 200,000 Americans each year. I answered a number of your comments through out this discourse but I won’t continue. You have no desire to learn, only to argue. However, I’m supposed to be afraid and not speak the truth? I think not! There’s a simple answer to your question but you will not get it from me. As I said before you are gravely mistaken. You say I am totally wrong? No one is totally wrong, not even you. I hope you heard the president’s speech tonight. He said that no one can know the reasons why the crazed gunman did what he did, and he said we should all work and live to see that America lives up to the ideals of 9 year old Christina Taylor Green who was killed along with the others. It was probably the best speech that Obama has ever given and those who enjoy attacking each other in this area should head it’s reasonableness. Those who are filled with hate will accomplish little, even for themselves. You know little of American history or foreign history or you wouldn’t laugh at the growth of Marxist ideals in this nation, and if speaking the truth about the continued destruction of the dollar and the economy is right wing extremism than a concerned person had better become a right wing extremist. I am not an extremist of any kind. Actually I took a test recently in two different places and was surprised to discover that I was closer to the Libertarian Party than the Independent I had thought I was. In LEAVING SOUTH CAROLINA (my recently updated autobiography) I tell how during the administration of FDR and during the Great Depression my recently deceased mother who had come from a long line of Democrats had become a life long Republican (except for when JFK ran for president, but even he would not fit in today’s Democratic Party). Sadly even today’s Republicans are for the most part not the conservatives they once were. My concern for you and others is not that you change your views but that you learn to prepare for what is coming, the result of the breakdown of morality, and the destruction of our credit, our dollar, and our economy. Chapter eight of my latest book is entitled “The Great American Famine” and while it won’t be exclusively American and while it won’t happen until some time after the tripling of food prices that I have warned about for several years now, you and all here, will be affected. If you insist that it could never happen here because it has never happened here (the normalcy bias) and you refuse to prepare in any way after all I have shared about the coming ‘disturbances’ then you will be shocked when the riots begin and the food is not in the stores for a month. I am not God so I can’t tell you the month or year that this is likely to happen but there is a high probability of it happening. Why is the US Government increasing the number of troops they are training to quell the coming riots if there are not going to be riots? I first learned of this years ago from a vision that God gave to a Christian pastor who I’m sure did not understand the full impact of what he saw but I had already written about the coming financial crisis and the parts just came together. I read about the increase in the troops being trained in the Army Times. What have you got to lose if you have a few months supply of food on hand of a kind (non-perishable) that will last for decades? The actual inflation of food prices is at least Five Times what you would receive from money in the bank so how can you lose in any way unless you live in a room or a shelter and have no kitchen or basement or cool dry place to keep it? There is time enough to learn about these things but the longer you wait the more you will have to pay. Things may get better for a season but we are far to gone, morally and economically, without a miracle to bring us back. I believe in miracles and am certainly hoping for one, but I’m not counting on one in this area because I know that God is just.

        • Denniso

          I was trying to be a little funny,that you must not work because your previous post was so long. I didn’t mean anything malicious by it.

          What I did mean to say is that you are doing the same thing as all the rightwing…preaching doom and gloom and feeding into the paranoia and fear that is rampant,some of it pushed by the gold industry,some pushed by ‘conservatives’ for pure political gain. Not surprising,since it works w/ a large number of people.

          Essentially every generation thinks that they will see the end times or a major catastophe and yet it doesn’t seem to happen. It’s part of human nature and enhanced by religious stories of Armegeddon.

          I do appreciate your civility on this site,where so many are lacking it.

  • JeffH

    Daily Kos ‘Bull’s-eyed’ Giffords for Defeat

    Liberals may be making the wild stretch of blaming Sarah Palin for Saturday’s shooting of Arizona Democratic Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords, but one of the Internet’s most popular progressive activist sites targeted Giffords for electoral defeat in 2008 in much the same way as Palin’s “cross-hairs” map did in 2010 — with Daily Kos founder and publisher Markos Moulitsas even using the term “bull’s-eye.”

    On the day of the shooting, the Hillbuzz.org website reproduced screen grabs of Moulitsas’ posting, noting that “Daily Kos targeted Gabrielle Giffords with a ‘bulls eye’ back in June of 2008.”

    Another Daily Kos contributor on Thursday — two days before Gifford was shot but one day after Giffords, along with 18 other House Democrats, voted against keeping Pelosi as Democratic leader — wrote a posting blasting Giffords entitled, “My CongressWOMAN voted against Nancy Pelosi! And is now DEAD to me!”

    The Hillbuzz site also reproduced a Democratic Party U.S. map using bull’s-eye symbols to denote vulnerable states that were almost identical to the cross hairs denoting vulnerable congressional districts featured in the SarahPac U.S. map for which Palin is being criticized.

    “Democrats use ‘bull’s-eye’ targets extensively in their political graphics,” the website noted. “This map shows states Democrats want targeted. Arizona, which Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords represents, is surrounded by these targets.” On the Palin map, three Arizona congressional districts featured targets.

    http://www.newsmax.com/InsideCover/Daily-Kos-Bullseyed-Giffords/2011/01/10/id/382350?s=al&promo_code=B6E7-1

    • JeffH

      Sarah Palin to Left: “Quit making things up”
      The imperative going forward is to show the American people exactly what they are dealing with when it comes to the Left. For whatever reason, they have never seen that before. It’s time to think outside the box about ways to expose the Left for what it is, so they can no longer make things up and get away with it.

      http://hillbuzz.org/2011/01/09/sarah-palin-to-left-quit-making-things-up/

      • kate8

        JeffH – They know we’ve caught on to their tactics, and they’re freaking out. They will continue to draw us into these idiotic debates, accusing us of the very thing they invented and spew everywhere possible. The more we try to reason with them, the louder and crazier they are going to get.

        No radical leftist nutjob is going to be listening to right-wing pundits. Besides, there are more than enough treasonous creeps on the Left truly advocating, and organizing, REAL violence, in order to “fundamentally change America”.

        We must stand in TRUTH and not waver. The enemy of truth will get louder and angrier as we stand firm, but in the end will self-destruct. All things which are out of harmony with TRUTH and LIFE will be destroyed.

        He who lives by the sword must die by the sword. This includes lying words as well as weapons.

        Keep the faith.

        • JeffH

          kate8, you are correct and we’ve crossed this bridge so many times before. It’s almost comical what a few well placed words can do to somebody. It’s like feeding the sharks, they just help themselves without any thought. None of us want to listen to a radical nutjob, right or left, and we’ve certainly seen our fair share of them but to have the audacity to believe that the “right wingers” are responsible for the actions of a nutjob like Jared Loughner is a real display of an ignorant and narrow mind. Another fine example of putting the horse behind the cart by the leftist media, the Democrats and the masses that have been indoctrinated by them.

          • kate8

            JeffH – These people are playing from Hitler’s own playbook. You demonize the opposition, then round them up.

            I’m serious about my post that the elimination of the Red List has already been underway. Of course, it’s not being reported in the media. Have you heard about all the microbiologists who’ve, tragically, had accidents or committed suicide? How about the journalists who were trying to expose the underworld elite? And there are others. Any who are considered dissidents by the NWO, including those in government.

            Ms. Gifford was not a “team player”. This is a loud message to anyone in Congress, especially democrats, who might have a notion to crawl out from under Reid/Pelosi’s vice-grip and listen to the people. Watch how fast these new Congresspeople begin to see the “wisdom” of the ruling elite.

            This also serves to make members of Congress afraid of the people, and not in a good way. Things are, I believe, being set up, creating a wider divide among all Americans and more distrust of government.

            We will, most likely, see more of these events. Maybe if we pray hard enough, God will take these horrible acts, which were meant to destroy us, and use them to unite us.

          • JeffH

            kate8, as bad as it is to have reservations obout the intentions of others, up to and including the proponents of a “NWO” and those initiating it is that we have learned that anything is possible. JFK and all of the witnesses to his assasination is but one example. I don’t and won’t live in fear but by God I’m not going to make myself an easy victim either. When I used to bowl, and I got pretty good at it, I lived by the mantra that “trust is a must or your game is a bust” and learned that it holds true in real life also.

            Is it just another coincidence that another “tragedy” happens on the heals of a big “Democratic” loss in the mid-terms, weakening their foothold in Congress and their ability to push their agenda thru without a real fight?

            Also, I read a report that: “It’s interesting to note, and I don’t yet know the significance, but on the Congresswoman’s YouTube page, she subscribed to only two other YouTube channels. One of which belonged to Jared Lee Loughner.” Go to the Congresswoman Gifford’s YouTube channel and there, at the bottom left of her home page, is a section with the heading, “Subscriptions (2),” with two photo boxes below.
            http://www.youtube.com/user/giffords2?ob=0

            The photo to the right turns out to be former Democratic Congressman Ike Skelton of Missouri, who lost last November to his Republican opponent, Vicky Hartzler.

            The photo box to the left is blank (no photo inside), and the caption underneath simply says “Classit…” It is not until you click on the photo box and land on the page that you see it identified as: “Jared Lee Loughner. Classitup10’s Channel.”

            The anonymous nature of the listing on Gifford’s home page undoubtedly explains why this has not come to the public’s attention—until now.

            In light of the subsequent assassination attempt, all of this is downright spooky. What is Loughner’s YouTube channel doing on Rep. Gifford’s YouTube channel? Did she “subscribe” to his channel, or did someone on her staff do so? Either way, WHY? Didn’t anyone bother to check on what was on his channel, and realize he was a nut job? It also makes me wonder what other contacts there might have been between Loughner and Gifford, or at least her office. And whether we will ever know the truth about that.

          • JeffH

            …click the box without the photo and you end up at Jared Lee Loughner Classitup10′s Channel.
            http://www.youtube.com/user/Classitup10

          • kate8

            JeffH – Another thing Hitler did was promote the idea that anyone who questions the government or the “official story” of anything was insane.

            Even Glenn Beck is calling “birthers” and “truthers” insane. I feel like he is trying to steer conservatives on a path…what’s up with that?

            You, I and many others now fit that category, simply because we question the status quo. Isn’t that the American way?

            I really feel like there is more behind this shooter than we know. I’m sorry, but I just have come to the point where I don’t ever believe the official story. We are too easily herded right down the chute they want us to take.

            I don’t want to feel this way. It makes me sick to my stomach that such evil has a stranglehold on America. But this has happened time after time in history, and we mustn’t be so easily manipulated this time. It never ends well for anyone, not even those who go along with it.

          • Karolyn

            Loughner is and was a total nutjob from a very dysfunctional family. His neighbors were all afraid of him, and he was kicked out of college because of his mental instability. He also was too unstable for the Army. He thought the government was using mind control. He appeared in court with his head shaved and a big smirk on his face. He is definitely enjoying all of this. No word from his parents as of yet.

          • Denniso

            I haven’t heard that Beck said that so called ‘birthers’ and ‘truthers’,both of which sound like a 3rd grader made them up,are insane. But if he did,good for him since he’s right to point out that they are at least menatally unstable,if not actually insane.

          • Richard Pawley

            Well, let’s hope that the FBI got it because it only said (1) subscription when I went to it. Someone must have taken it off. Very interesting. I only know that I am praying for her to recover and I’m sure others are too. God is bigger than the plans of men and when they choose evil they are harming themselves beyond belief because “As you sow, so shall you reap” is a principle of the universe like gravity. “Ask and you shall receive” Jesus said and Gabrielle seems to be one of the good Democrats. Sadly there are fewer and fewer of them.

          • Palin12

            JeffH and Kate,
            A little off-topic, but I see Jerry Brown’s first act as governor of CA extend a state tax increase. Also, all traffic fines fron CHP went way up. Who would have guessed it?

  • bob wire

    Jeff & Kate, you guys need to lighten up with the left/right thing.

    It’s getting to where it’s blinding you.

    Kate;”I don’t want to feel this way. It makes me sick to my stomach that such evil has a stranglehold on America. ”

    well Kate it’s what you are consuming that makes feel so bad. I would feel the same way if I swallowed that much poison. That you can’t seem to see Beck for what he is, is misfortune. I watch him a bit tonight myself. He’s good! The same qualities you find in a good TV preacher. He has a message to demonize and create great fear with theatrical voice and props for a purpose you have yet to accept.

    It’s up to you to continue being sick or heal yourself. How can you heal the world if you, yourself are sick?

    “and we mustn’t be so easily manipulated this time.” If I’m not mistaken, that what this “shooter” was saying.

    “Even Glenn Beck is calling “birthers” and “truthers” insane. I feel like he is trying to steer conservatives on a path…what’s up with that?”

    Ruppert has asked him to let it go, ~ and move on to other issues that might offer better political gains. You know?, the guy that signs his check wants him to drop it. ~ Ruppert had accepted that they are kicking a dead horse and he won’t ever move again regardless how long and hard they kick him. Besides, the window to use it to advantage is now pasted.

    Must like the talk to impeach 43, ~ by the time it was seen as needed and the grounds might be produced, it was too late and any attempt to try would have ended up nonproductive on many levels.

    Kate;– Jeff,Another thing, Hitler did was promote the idea that anyone who questions the government or the “official story” of anything was insane”

    well? I’m not sure about “insane” Kate ~ I would say he offered people “encouragement” to accept the governments story. Lamp shades made of human skin and their colorful tattoos would work for me.

    jeff;”It also makes me wonder what other contacts there might have been between Loughner and Gifford, or at least her office. And whether we will ever know the truth about that.”

    Hmm? as I understand it, Loughner had asked her a few questions months prior that were not answered to his satisfaction. The only thing that is clear is Loughner considered himself informed and politically active. I find it hard to avoid such a conclusion.

    Jeff;”Is it just another coincidence that another “tragedy” happens on the heals of a big “Democratic” loss in the mid-terms, weakening their foothold in Congress and their ability to push their agenda thru without a real fight?”

    Hmm? DNC midterm losses has nothing to do with it or makes it anymore or less a “tragedy” Jeff. ~ and Yes, the DNC is short one vote today. I wonder how that will be address? ~but I will not worry about it Jeff, it will work out, ~ if not today, some other day. I have faith. That’s the beliefs of faith ~ to not worry.

    As far as any “coincidence” ~ the timing of the shooters actions were dictated by his “sickness” and “opportunity”, running on a time table independent of anything anyone might hope to understand.

    These shooting will not diminish GOP gains or effectiveness.

    They will feed anti-gun interest and make us all be required to defend our 2nd amendment rights, one more time.

    I would hope to see less public inference statement to the glories of being an armed population when they are not solicited and out of context.

    Such a unnecessary waste of life.

    • Karolyn

      bob – You always put things so well and logically. I always look forward to your posts. I wonder if people like Kate and Jeff even read all our words and give them any consideration at all? They are so blinded by angst. Thank you.

  • Eric Bischoff

    Deniso,
    “they” are not interested in an alternative point of view. They are only interested in their own myopic viewpoint and anyone else’s is inconsequential. They are so angry at anyone that has another viewpoint that they circle the wagons and regurgitate the same arguments over and over ad nauseam.

    Don’t you know there isn’t anything worth learning from anyone that thinks different than you. Sad and scary, how could you go though life this way, what a waste.

    They have convinced themselves that they know what the progressive left is and worse yet they have convinced themselves that they know who the progressive left is. Unfortunately they have been duped by mainstream media and make no mistake Fox is part of the mainstream media, and they have bought in to the corporate owned and controlled media propaganda.

    They are also convinced that the progressive left has ruined this country. Never mind the fact the progressive left has never governed this country. It must be a coincidence that all powerful potential national leaders of the progressive left have either been assassinated or have met untimely deaths.

    They are convinced that the progressive left is in favor of big government. Somehow they are not capable of distinguishing between a well run government of the people that would protect us and our planet from corporate abuse and one that does the bidding of corporations as facilitated by the Reagan revolution, the RepublicRats and now the Billionaire funded hypocritical Tea Party minions.

    Isn’t it a bit strange that the only Billionaire they absolutely can’t stand is the only one who has pledged to give away his entire fortune before he dies in order to help the underdog, promote tolerance and democracy, help under priviledged students, etc, etc…

    I am sorry but I don’t want to ever go back to your twisted american dream. It is an ugly dream that is still too full of bigotry, mysogyny, hatred, violence, oppression, hegemony and ignorance.

    But I am still hopeful and interested in Martin Luther King’s I have a dream and John Lennon’s give peace a chance.

    • JeffH

      Eric Bischoff, you prove over and over your a few pennies short of a nickel yourself…welcome to denniso’s world.

      • Karolyn

        Jeff – Have you ever tried reading the words posted before posting a response?

        • JeffH

          ,,,and you are knocking on the door trying to get in…the asylum…

  • bob wire

    I couldn’t have say it any better and find it worth repeating again.

    Because they are so WRONG! They don’t really know us at all! ~ they know they feel pain and something is badly wrong! We’ve had to shoulder the same burdens for 30 years of poor government that they helped create but they only blame progressives. And it’s with this same mindset they want control! AGAIN ! The 23 years when they had it , what did they do with it?

    “They have convinced themselves that they know what the progressive left is and worse yet they have convinced themselves that they know who the progressive left is. Unfortunately they have been duped by mainstream media and make no mistake Fox is part of the mainstream media, and they have bought in to the corporate owned and controlled media propaganda.

    They are also convinced that the progressive left has ruined this country. Never mind the fact the progressive left has never governed this country. It must be a coincidence that all powerful potential national leaders of the progressive left have either been assassinated or have met untimely deaths.

    They are convinced that the progressive left is in favor of big government. Somehow they are not capable of distinguishing between a well run government of the people that would protect us and our planet from corporate abuse and one that does the bidding of corporations as facilitated by the Reagan revolution, the RepublicRats and now the Billionaire funded hypocritical Tea Party minions.”

    • JeffH

      Bob, for all the wisdom you exude sometimes, you exude as much ignorance. You’re really not much different than that lunatic denniso. I’ve got a label for it if you want it.

      • Denniso

        JeffH…You just can’t stand to have anyone trying to get you to think,even a little,can you?

    • JeffH

      bob, spit it out…who is the “they” you speak of? Go ahead, put a label on it! You really don’t know squat about “they” but you can lower yourself enough to realize that “Somehow they are not capable of distinguishing between a well run government of the people that would protect us and our planet from corporate abuse and one that does the bidding of corporations!” You are delusional to even make a statement like that…LMAO!

      • Denniso

        I’ll help you out JeffH…it’s obvious to all who can think objectively that the rightwing powerbrokers are using you little people as pawns to further corporate control of the gov’t and the country. ‘They’ hide their clear intentions behind cliches like ‘freedom’,liberty’,'family values’, ‘traditional values’, all the while fooling you followers into believing you are ‘patriots’ as ‘they’ push gov’t policy to benefit them solely and leave the middle class to lag behind. It’s no great conspiracy,just the way the ‘free market’ and ‘democracy’ work if left to it’s own devices.

        • Richard Pawley

          The free market has not been free in 50 years, maybe longer. With the exception of the banks this is one of the most regulated countries in the world as far as corporations go. We have the highest taxes and the most regulations for business and a good reason why many of them have gone overseas. One of my sources say that another million jobs could be lost as we continue to buy cheap and imported. There are good people on both sides of the aisle but you would never admit that there are any good Republicans, and some on this discourse would never admit that there are any good Democrats. As I answered you some hundreds of comments back, a time is coming when it isn’t going to make and difference if the TEA PARTY can’t get the squandering waste of money by both sides under control. I am already convinced that food and fuel will triple in price because of all that has been wasted. Who will loan us the money to keep spending? It’s one of the reasons the Treasury is just creating money out of thin air so it will be worth less and they can keep up with the interest payments. There is no easy solution to the mess we have created and all are going to have to do their part and pay their share. We can’t even consider having tax reform until we can get the out-of-control spending under control. Seeing prices triple is going to be a hard lesson for those who think they can just tax the rich to pay for everything. Over one million and seven hundred thousand people have left New York State since the Y2K Census and New Jersey has lost many of their rich too. I hope you will not dismiss my warnings about all this because while there is time enough to prepare there is not time enough to waste. I thank God I don’t have to live in the big city but I know many who do. In any event I hope all who have read this comments here will learn all they can about non-perishable foods and begin stockpiling a few months supply at all times. Those who are independent enough to think like a pioneer will likely be much better off than those who are hoping that a bankrupt government will ‘take care of them’.

          • Denniso

            Like I said, there have never been ‘free markets’. If left entirely alone, markets quickly move monopolies w/ the largest few companies taking control of most of the market. Modern people have learned this lesson from centuries of trial,which is why EVERY 1st world economy has regulations and controls to moderate what happens ‘naturally’ in a capitaist system. We try to learn from history and move foward,not go back to failed ideology and policies.

            You talk of living like a ‘pioneer’…we are way past the time when any sizable number of us can exist in that way…310 million people,interconnected,high tech,global economy. If we really ever crash,everyone is in big trouble,even ‘pioneers’. We are all dependent upon one another and tied together,like it or not. If the millions who are preaching the ‘end’ would use half their money and energy to help the country get through these tough times,we would already be past them and the whole country would be more prosperous.

          • Denniso

            I meant to write,’markets move to monopolies’…They quickly are taken over by the largest companies and controlled for their benefit,smaller ones are driven out or marginalized.

  • BOBBY

    Brief Summary: GLOBAL WARNING

    The Bright Morning Stars will restore
    the Bio-Electrode Magnesium Levels in our Atmosphere will restore by
    producing Molly Cellulite
    That life will rebuilt itself and we can maintain our planet with
    light, care, and reduce the energy required .With Seven Satellite it
    will require and the cooperation of all cities and every nations
    within range not use Public Lighting unless need.
    The start up cost is enormous, but the cost is low to preserve the
    only earth we have and give all children what is their better
    existence.

    look at the moon it.s not and elclepe,s

    Robert Steneck

    1995the norther hemisphere is risen temp do to ring of fire and
    activity and more
    ROBERT
    STENECK.
    WITH (GOD LOVE)
    (AID,S AS WELL AS HEPATITIS C )

    IT,is & (MULEFICTIONS}} (>DISEASE )//[(POST /
    =CRYOGENIC`-0}`-/'CROH=;LESION'''}}* And many OTHER
    DISEASE NOT KEEP IN CONTAINMENT OR CURE" WITH EN}}

    With the treatment two use for above with (SEROMYCIN) . as the
    toxin,s in water very do not exceed more then
    ((TWO GRAMS SODIUM NITRATE'S TOTAL INTAKE}} OR EAT BEFORE REMOVE ALL
    SALT FROM DIET FLESH AS WELL FOR CANCER PATIENTS AS WELL FOR TREATMENT
    THAT CONCEDE
    As the body finds and aborts foreign subs tents and recovers ENHANCAEIVLY
    lab test will not be culsive all lesion thay refer to as cancer breast
    cancer as well and more
    the I can name
    AND POSIBLE OVER NINE HUNDRED MILLION LIVE ; S Saved GOD BLESS

    FEMALE NEED REQAUR THAT NEED RINSE BREST.S VALVE TO RINSE TO CLEANSES
    AS GOD INTENDED GRATE ANTIBODY'S WILL PRO SEED

    HEART MURMUR,S

    {(BISCOE TREE PRUNUS PERICA}}
    Eat one hand full of pick leaves for top of trees eat quarterly at one
    time to elasticate arteries
    for full body and give.s energy and remove pain an mobility and youth.

    {{ CURE FOR ALL, DE.COLI/S DISEASE,S]]

    MELATONIN LEG EXTRACT;” IN ARMOR ONE IN COLI,S GIVE TO ALL CANCER
    RESEARCH

    IN MEMORY OF BOBBY KENNEDY
    A GOOD MAN
    GOD BLESS THE UNITED STATE OF AMERICA

    READ PAGE 30-31 53 AND 78 JAMES.D WATSON (DNA) THE SECRET OF LIFE THANK YOU AND
    SEE DC GET,S IT [TABER,S CYCLOPEDIC MEDICAL DICTIONARY REPORT

    PAGE.S 55-57]] HIV NOT APPLICABIE [[HIVE,S]] RAIN FOR PEACE if im
    wrong concening the little body issues then I would be with all
    BIBBLE
    god grace.

  • jopa

    Bobby: Is this the republican answer to global warming or is this their health care plan??

Bottom
close[X]

Sign Up For Personal Liberty Digest™!

PL Badge

Welcome to PersonalLiberty.com,
America's #1 Source for Libertarian News!

To join our group of freedom-loving individuals and to get alerts as well as late-breaking conservative news from Personal Liberty Digest™...

Privacy PolicyYou can opt out at any time. We protect your information like a mother hen. We will not sell or rent your email address to anyone for any reason.