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Public Healthcare Option Rejected Again

September 30, 2009 by  

Public healthcare option rejected again Despite warnings of cost and competition issues, Democratic lawmakers continue to promote the idea of a government-run public option, although their latest effort was rejected by the Senate Finance Committee.

The influential committee is the last congressional panel to consider draft healthcare legislation before debate begins in the full House and Senate, and two of its members — Senators Jay Rockefeller of West Virginia and Chuck Schumer of New York — proposed two amendments yesterday that would create a public option that uninsured Americans could join.

In the end, the committee rejected the proposal during an afternoon vote, with all 10 Republican members voting against it as well as some Democrats, including chairman Senator Max Baucus of Montana.

After the vote, Senator Rockefeller criticized the outcome saying it will give free reign to private insurers to continue to raise premiums and put profits ahead of people’s health.

However, Baucus — who is known to be personally in favor of a public option — said he feared a bill including a similar provision would fail to win enough votes to pass the Senate.
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  • Norm

    It’s very surprising how much the private insurance companies fear a little competition. Is it not a fact that the government is incapable of doing anything right? If so, why not blow the public option off once and for all.
    On the other hand, when I look at the privatly run, government paid for, drug program (medicare part D), I see the biggest joke ever laid on the American public. It’s expensive, incredibly complex, and not particularly effective. The Medicare advantage plans, also privatly run, are preferred by many, but are costing the tax payer dearly.

    • Thurman Marcum

      Nom,

      You are right. These private insurance are expensive.They can refuse you health coverage.It about time they get a little competiton.

    • Nicola

      So let me ask all you people against a national health care plan this question: Do you see anything like even the beginnings of an effort to dismantle the universal coverage that most first-world nations enjoy? Are they begging to overthrow their national healty systems? Are their ordinary citizens flocking to the U.S. to pay huge sums to enjoy the privilege afforded to those who can pony up to get the bar-number-one care that isn’t available to anyone else?

      Isn’t it time to get real here? Why is the U.S. so BACKWARD? When I came here (in 1964), this country was the envy of the world because it had all the opportunity and none of the drudgery of cleaning up after WWII. Since the 1980s, U.S. cities have come to resemble Calcutta — at least in California (whree I live) Reagan’s closing of mental institutions has caused immense pain and suffering as well as “social blight” with people who have now become called “homeless” as if that means something to who they are, as suffering individuals. You and I could be among them, but for the grace of God. What happened to America? To the American Dream? At the macro-level, we’re in the dumpster. At the micro level, there are, thankfully, millions of us who still care about our fellow man and who are always going to be inspired to help each other out. Thank God for all of you who are among them!

      • Yvette

        Actually, the Brits are begging to change their National Health Care system that is killing many of their citizens with undertreatment and neglect….and yes, they ARE flocking to the US to pay more because with our health care now, they will live. There are so many coming from Canada that they had to add a wing to a hospital in Oregan just for the Canadians.

    • Yvette

      There are over 1300 insurance companies. I would say that is a lot of competition. We don’t need politicians who have no interest in our wellfare invovled. We need to have these 1300 insurance companies competing across state lines…that will be competition that won’t raise our premiums or our taxes.

  • John

    Typical liberal response by Norm. Since the government does not care about profits, it charges rates to lose money which in turn is supplemented by taxpayers. Private companies have to make a profit in order to survive. What will happen with a government run insurance company is that their rates will be so low, employers will switch to it and put private companies out of business.

    • Norm

      John
      If the government can beat insurance company costs, then so be it. If the taxpayers would stop subsidizing drug companies, and would be allowed to negotiate prices, we would see large savings there too.

    • Smilee

      John

      YOU SAY

      What makes you think they can manage your health care better than you can?

      Forty Years experience with Medicare and it is now better than anything the private sector offers the under 65 crowd today and few dispute these facts except those government haters like yourself, the vast majority of the seniors are completely satisfied with medicare except the complaints about the Bush advantage plans of which there are many complaints as it limits choice and coverages and legal protections at a much higher cost to the taxpayers than the B plans do. Private plans of necessity do not have to survive people should be allowed to and now with the new Harvard study showing 45,000 die each year because of no insurance availability it is time that people be given consideration over profits. I believe they have no much waste in the private sector they will have no trouble staying in business if they again become honest. There are many instances of private competing with government with great sucess Look at all the private colleges and public colleges existing side by side and have for years. There is no doubt it can work if we want it too and do not listen to the likes of you.

      • Smilee

        OOPS!

        Ed said that but this addresses both of you.

      • http://none wasadoc

        Smilee, what you did not understand was that those 45,000 would have died anyway. It was not “just because they didn’t have health insurance”.

        • Smilee

          WRONG, they all died before their time because they could not get medical treatments, that us what the report reported. Your spin does not change the that fact. Many news reports on this as well including discussions with the families who lost loved ones. Sad you do not want to believe the truth I guess you do not care.

          • Nicola

            The plain, sad truth, Smilee, is that there are those among us who truly have no heart for caring about their fellow man. I hope they never find themselves in need. And I’m glad that you’re out there, among the many who do care.

      • Yvette

        I’m sorry but you are wrong about Medicare. I am on Medicare and it denies more claims than any private insurance I ever had and I have had 2 claims where they paid LESS THAN $1. The best docs in our city (a major US city) and one large hospital system now refuse to take Medicare anymore because they don’t pay enough to cover their costs.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      That is the deal with the medi-care and medi-caid. The government is involved, so now the drug companies and the hospitals are allowed to charge more since the government is paying, which is really you and I. Just like when doing construction on a government building. The government is forced to pay more, because of what they called pre-vailing wage, to kiss the butt of the unions. We could do these jobs so much cheaper, but with twice the quality, because allthough it is true the union electricians here make 2.00 more an hour than our guys, our guys are driving brand new vans, 47 of them to be exact, with gas cards, paid vacations and paid holidays,and they dont get laid off, and the boss knows their wifes and kids names. But once again, since it is government, they are made to pay more, which means us tax payers pay more. Its not right, and it needs fixed. Why is it when using our tax dollars, everything is allowed to cost more? Bull crap.

      • Smilee

        I see your imagination is still running wild, reality is just not one of your beliefs is it

      • eyeswideopen

        Beber, the reason that the government cannot negotiate with the drug companies, is that it was written into the Medicare Advantage bill, by the lobbyists and committee Republicans. Someone? wanted to insure that the Big Phrma would make record profits from this bill. The average profit made by Big Phrma companies is 200 BILLION per year. It seems like when the effort to privitize Medicare failed, the next thing to be passed was this horrible bill.

      • Nicola

        All this “government” stuff baffles me, and pisses me off. YOU ARE THE “GOVERNMENT”!!! Fix YOURSELF! Running a democratic society requires the participation of everyone who wants to make the country into what they want it to be. If you aren’t getting things your way, stand for public office yourself or vote for someone who represents your views. Stop it with “the goverment” – okay?

    • DaveH

      John, don’t waste your time trying to talk logic to Norm. He is blinded by the light from the trough.

      • Smilee

        ALWAYS MAKING WEIRD STATEMENTS OF NO MERIT, YOU ARE THE MOST ILLOGICAL PERSON ON THIS SITE, AT LEAST NORM HAS HIS FACTS STRAIGHT, YOU PAY NO ATTENTION TO REAL FACTS AND CREATE YOUR OWN THUS YOU ARE FORCED TO LIVE IN YOUR FANTASY WORLD AND THE SAD PART IS YOU DO NOT SEEM AWARE OF THAT

        • Get it right.

          Sir, I am new to this site, but I tried to catch up, I believe that DaveH, said he has double majors. It is hard to believe that he is educated as he only expounds one statement continously. But it is apparent that the exwife caused severe damage. Too bad she wasn’t a Libertarian then he could just hate himself. I agree, that man is angry, hateful and very narrow minded. He doesn’t respect the Consitutation, and I suspect that the Libertarians would want to create a new one, in their likeness.

          • Smilee

            See Davie, how fast the new ones catch on to you and your baloney

  • Ed

    Norm,

    What has the government ever run right? Nothing, just look at the USPS, FAA, DHS, SS Administration, and just about any other government agency. What makes you think they can manage your health care better than you can? The test to look at to see if any of the 5 different health care plans being considered by Congress is if Congress will want to join the plan, too. They don’t. Congress has exempted their own health care plan from any of the bills.

    • s c

      Ed, it shouldn’t be possible for anyone to produce a long list of government failures. Medicare is but one of many failed social engineering pet projects. If it was done right, The Teleprompter Prince wouldn’t dare claim that health care needs to be ‘resurrected.’ BHO and his kind will never admit that big government specializes in doing 99% of everything it does wrong – and wasting America’s wealth in the process.
      Chicago’s Gift to Politics dares to claim that government will do health care ‘right’ (like it did with food stamp fraud, social security and wars on poverty and drugs?). I don’t know what his favorite recreational ‘smoke’ is, but I’ll bet that millions of people would line up to try it. Maybe he has access to California’s biggest cash crop (like, wow, man!) No wonder politicians are hooked on Washington’s many ‘perks.’

      • Smilee

        S C

        You are totally out of touch with reality and have no clue as to what is really going on and the saddest part I fear is that you believe you do know when in fact you do not.

      • DaveH

        Zombie attack! Shutter the windows!

        • Get it right.

          Tis better to shutter the windows, than to have a shuttered mind like yours.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      Theyve done a fine, fine job with our schools also, havent they? What a mess.

      • Smilee

        YOU DON’T BELIEVE WE GOT SOME GREAT COLLEGES?? THEY COME FROM ALL OVER THE WORLD TO GO THEM. I FORGET YOU ARE UNABLE TO SEE LIFE THROUGH A REAL LENS, YOU INSTEAD CREATE YOUR OWN FANTASY WORLD

  • http://personalliberydigest mark

    I have an idea for health insurance. The government should let the public option of having insurance that our senators and congresman/women get at their cost. I would surley jump on board for the same coverage that my reps to congress have. Lets have this for a public option

    • Smilee

      I.m sure you can talk the democrats into it but you will never talk the Republicans into it and that is why it is not there, even if the Republicans will not vote for it they have gotten many amendments to it and this is one.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        Dont think so. If there isnt something beneficial in it for the democrats, they wont do it. They only serve themselves and their agenda, not the people. Their vested interest is into special interest groups, killing babies, putting gays on a pedestal, appeasing the enemy, and giving billions to companies that dont know how to do business. And they want to take my hard earned income, and give it to those that are too lazy to work for it. No, homey dont play that crap.

        • Smilee

          I see your imagination is still running wild, reality is just not one of your beliefs is it. Your train of thought is really stuck in a rut

        • Get it right.

          Homey’s are smarter than you. They are getting educations and respect the country they live in. You on the other hand are a thug, who appreciates nothing.

      • http://none Glo

        Speaking of amendments- I was thinking today that if and when they decided on a health bill, I would suggest that it is read by every person in Congress, then walked and locked up in a safe, accompanied by guards and guarded twenty four hours a day for a week so that the Congressmen can really think about it and so that nothing is “slid” into it in the early morning hours of the night. The bill can then be taken out of the safe after the week is up and immediately signed while also recording the whole process from start to finish. And one more thing, I have not heard anything about investigating drug overcharges and profits..I have seen a list that would make you scream. Want to save more money, go after the drug manufacturers.

        • eyeswideopen

          Great idea.

    • Yvette

      The Democrats have rejected 11 amendments that would include Congress in the Health Care bill they are shoving on the rest of us. I guess some of us are more equal than others.

  • http://meanjoegreen59.wordpress.com Joe Green

    The Government alrady runs VA, Medicare,Tr-Care and Medicad(I know the states run medicad, but the US Gov. sets the rules). These plans are poorly managed, way over budget, full of fraud and for the most part give poor care compaired to main stream health care. Do we want to end up with a health care system(like Canada and England) where cost is what desides if you live or die! HELL NO! THIS IS NOT THE AMERICAN WAY.

    • Smilee

      Its clear Joe you do not understand Medicare, VA, Medicaid or the Canadian and English systems I agree that it was a mistake to give control of Medicaid to the states and now we have 50 sets of rules and some do not address the needs, not true of Medicare and VA, despite your claims and I do not dispute all of them but they still are cheaper, more efficient and give better care that most of the private insurance plans, There are ways to correct some of your concerns which the Bush administration refused to deal with and actually passed changes that drove the costs up with no advantage to seniors.this is how Obama wants to cut the cost of Medicare lower the fraud costs and the advantage overruns of 14%, It should be done but even if it is not it still is a better deal than the private plans.

      • Rod

        Sure Smilee that is very good thinking. Look how well the gov. has
        run Medicare!The G O P has tried to fix the plan, but special interest
        groups come in and the Dem. Congress stops it. How could you possibly
        believe with all the bail outs for big business comming from, you guessed it, a Dem. who calls himself the President, along with a Congress that is so far left, it’s a wonder they haven’t fallen off the left side of the planet, believe they have our best interest at heart????

        • Smilee

          What the GOP really wanted to do was kill medicare and SS, they failed at SS but the GOP tried to fix Medicare so they said, which wevnow know to be a lie, They tried to make it into a program that would not work so people would not like it and turn on it, but it has not worked, people just got mad about it and thus the current GOP demise. the 2003 changes they made drove the cost of their new private plans up 14% while lowering choices of doctors and hospitals and also gave seniors less legal protections. Us seniors can well do without their help and you could well do with an education about Medicare as it is clear you are clueless as to what it is and what really took place.

          • http://none wasadoc

            I have been in medicine since 1957, having just retired this past June 1st. I could tell you stories about medicare and medicaid, but from your posts, you would not believe them. I believe you told someone to get an education—-really?

          • Smilee

            I’ll bet if you were honest you could tell as many or more stories of the private plans we have today, we watched the costs go way up and the coverages go down, denials of coverages galore, existing condition denials etc. , much much less than Medicare and Medicaid, I know doctors who have been doing it as long as you and do not agree with you, I have had family continuous on Medicare since it started in 1966 with not one complaint and most lived into their 90ths one almost 105. All had some health problems.

        • DaveH

          Rod,
          That is why Congress is trying to sweep the Medicare mess under the rug of the Health Care Bill.

          • Smilee

            They are trying to fix the mess the Bush people created in Medicare but you are to dumb to see what the real facts are so you again make up what you want the facts to be and in reality they are not, dream on sucker

        • Get it right.

          You are so full of it. Bush wanted to reform Medicare and the Republican Congress would not let him, as special interest groups, ie> Insurance industry, Big Phrma, and the lobbyists laid so much money on the table the Republicans could not resist. You need to read some history dude and take some responsibility for your Congressman’s lack of caring and greed. President Bush tried to do the right thing and was disrespected by his own party.

          • Smilee

            He signed the bill, he didn’t veto it so I guess he was in on it.

  • http://www.nosmog.com Robert Sewell Sr

    I DON’T CARE WHAT THE CONGRESS ARE THINKING ABOUT THE “PROFITS OR LOSS”, I DON’T ABOUT HOW MANY PEOPLE WITH OUT INSURANCE OR HAVE “PRIVATE OR MEDICARE ETC.” . I DON’T CARE ABOUT WHAT WISE CONGRESS HAVE IN THEIR MINDS !! ETC.
    ALL OUR CARE TOWARD TO”OBAMA” HIMSELF PLANNED BECOME WORLD MOST “KILLER” HIM SELF, DON’T FORGET, DON’T FORGET HE IS OBAMA HIMSELF PLANS TO BECOME FAMOUS “KILLER” IN UNIVERSE HISTORY THAN HITLER, STALIN, HITLER, SADDAM AND OTHERS !. LAST SPRING HE ALREADY TOLD AMERICA CITIZENS AND WORLD HAD HEARD HIM SAYING,HIS DREAMS AN DPLANNED TO WIPED OUT ALL SENIORS CITIZNES AND DISABLED BABIES AND CHILDREN INTO DEATH COFFINS AND TOLD US TO PREPARE TO BUY OUR OWN COFFINS !, IS HE MAKE ANY GOOD SENSE OF KOKING OR SERIOUS ? . HE MEANT SERIOUSLY. HE WANTED TO SEE SAVE GOVERNMENT’S MONEY. REMEMBER NOT GOVERNMENT’S MONEY IT BELONGS TO ALL AMERICAN TAX PAYERS !!! NOT TO OBAMA OR GOVERNMENTS!. DON’T TRY TO BE WORLD THIEVERY!. MONEY BELONGS TO NATIONAL TAX PAYERS FOR EVER LAST LIFE TIME. REMEMBER THAT AND YOU OBAMA REMEMBER THAT.
    THAT IS WHY REASON WE WANT TO IMPEACH OBAMA RIGHT NOW HE IS VERY BLACK HEART AND CRUELEST MAN IN HISTORY.

    • Smilee

      Robert Sewell Sr

      YOU ARE VERY SICK!!

      • Get it right.

        He is more than sick, he is really mentally challenged. How can he be running lose in society?

        • Nicola

          The awful fact is that there are thousands, perhaps hundreds of thousands of our fellow Americans who feel the same way. They’re not remotely interested in problem-solving all of the differences that exist among us. All I ever hear from them is that they’re ready to buy up all the guns and bullets to protect their incredibly selfish views. I honestly don’t see any hope for them, or for integrating them into the new America, which is increasingly populated by people with different life experiences and perspectives than the old-world view of America as the white man’s new frontier. God help them! God help all of us as we try to deal with them!!

    • Thurman Marcum

      Robert,
      Man you are out for lunch.That is got Joe Barns beat.

  • Merl Elton

    The reason why the Dems are promoting this disasterous plan is that they are idealogues and academics who could not run their own businesses if they tried; because many are against the private sector, private property, or individual liberty because they are socialists. However, the US is and always will be a conservative country that values freedom and personal liberty including the right to own your own house and run your own business. Americans smell socialism and the loss of individual rights, benefits, and freedoms
    in this plan as part of a socialist framework that is being built and they do not like it. We need to fight so that our children will know how to defend this country and their rights and freedom. We need to fight to protect this country and the Constituion and to honor the blood that young soldiers have shed to preserve our liberty.

    • Nicola

      Most of you who shout about the Constitution have either never read it or only have the vaguest idea about the complexities that were deliberately incorporated into it. You just want to fight (isn’t everybody TIRED of hearing about how that’s all you want to do?!)

      Guess what, this is NOT a conservative nation, in spite of how many conservatives keep trying to spin that yarn. Look who just handiliy won the last election. What’s your evidence that we’re not basically a liberal nation, founded on the liberal ideas of our founding fathers (who were definitely NOT conservatives!).

  • Merl Elton

    The government does many things very well and we need the government; however, I think the government should stay out of healthcare.

    • Smilee

      Merl, The government has been in it since 1966 with Medicare and it is widely recognized as a very successful plan. I have it and what an improvement over what I had before I retired. Much better coverage at a much less cost. Some employers are now asking their employees when the became 65 to go on Medicare and they will pay the premiums for them, It gives them much better coverages and saves the employer a lot of money.. My sister is on this and still working and her Company claims they save a $150.00 each month because she agreed to do this. She had a 70/30 plan before with a $500 deductible and $3500.00 OPM each year and co-pays are not included in them. Now she has full coverage without deductibles, co-pays and no out of pocket expenses. Would you really turn this offer down just because it is a government plan. I assure you I believe few would not even you.

    • Thurman Marcum

      Mel,

      Medicare is a government run program,I am on medicare.Ilke it.

      • eyeswideopen

        What another person who likes a socialist government run program, staple your mouth shut. That’s three of you, Jeff, American Citizen and you. But I’m sure you are against anyone else having the kind of care you get right?

  • Rod

    Baucus needs to enjoy his last days in Washington! He forgot who he is representing! He now thinks he represents Obama. The people of his
    state have long memories!

    • http://none wasadoc

      Rod, the Aussies have a saying—”Good on yer, mate”.

  • Skipper

    I finished reading randomly down through the bill and thank God! it was rejected! I spent 30 years as an RN. Working in an ICU for 6 years, Psych for a year, Chemicql Dependency for 6 years, Home Healthcare a year, as an ADON and DON for several years, and ended up working part time in a nursing home as a charge nurse. I was 72 yrs. old when I retired. My children are scattered across the country and have had exposure to medical areas for some time! There is nothing wrong with our medical system as it is, that a few insurance changes cannot fix! The poorest of the poor have been able to get care from any public hospital in this country whether they walk into an emergency room or are carried in on a gurney. Hospitals have funds for indigent people!!! Any of the problems that the medical community has incurred has been due to the government interference they have foisted on it for a number of years. Nurses noticed it first in this area around 1982. They need to get their hands out of it and stay out of it. It would be a disaster if they are allowed to meddle any more! They do not call it the best healthcare system in the world for nothing and the people who come here every year for life saving surgeries and treatments are just as concerned as we are, because the rest of the world is pretty well socialized and are trying to get it changed back to a way most like what we offer! What do politicians know about healthcare anyway? Why would you choose a politician to do anything that has anything to do with healthcare? They are clueless! To SMILEY: I do not know where you live but the VA’s around here are not good! I have had to get people on Medicaid at nursing homes, and they get the very same care and attention from nurses and doctors, and if needed hospital care, as any of the rest of us would get with insurance! I am now on Medicare and what Bush did to lower costs on medication for the elderly was a godsend! You do not seem to have a clue either so I would be careful how you attack others!

    • Smilee

      I know many doctors who disagree with you, Medicaid now is administered by the states and can very from state to state, I have always believed this was a mistake when the republicans voted to take it out of the federal domain when all had the same rules. It has been more costly and caused more problems. Bush did not lower costs he subsidized the advantage plans and it now costs the government 14% more on these plans as well as limiting choice of doctors and hospitals as most have networks and this says nothing about the legal protections senior lost in these plans, states now regulate them and vary greatly from sate to state and complaints to Medicare has skyrocket because so many seniors have gotten ripped off by these plans, both the plans and their salesmen. When I was deciding on which plan to take I talked to many salespeople, studied everything I could get my hands on and attended many sales meetings put on by the Advantage Plans and it became clear to me that Bush made a big mistake with them and I chose the regular Medicare with a supplemental Gap Plan and because of the legal protections I can never be dropped and can live in any state with the same coverages which are fully covered and cannot be changed, the Advantage plans can drop the group anytime and many have announced they will next year. Advantage plans despite that fact in some cases, and not all, cost you less where also a big costly mistake and another republican goof.

      I trust you know your nursing but you do not understand much of the medical plans out there today.

    • s c

      Skipper, thanks for telling it like it is. This site always attracts rock heads who praise the government 24/7 and couldn’t find any fault with power-mad Washington puppets if they were insiders who had 50 years of first-hand knowledge.
      The VA is to be applauded. However, that doesn’t mean they do everything right. On the whole, the government is responsible for most of America’s woes – especially health care. Try and ignore the government apologists. They are the American version of Hitler’s brown shirts [NO ONE can argue with the fuhrer!].
      When civilization comes crashing down around them, they might start to get a clue. Until then, all we can do is to try and inform – and hope they learn to read and/or understand English.

    • http://none wasadoc

      Skipper, you and I have both seen it. These people cannot understand what is involved. I was almost 70 when I retired.

      • Smilee

        I was 63 when I retired am 68 now and I do very well understand it, I still wonder if you are who you say you are, a lot of statements without anything to back them up, if you are so knowledgeable why not share your experiences?

        • Nicola

          As someone who grew up, healthily, in a system of socialized medicine, I wonder at all the uproar. The system here is appalling! Incredibly expensive, bloated with insurance company payments that have absolutely NOTHING to do with health care, and US health ranking among the worst of all first-world nations. Jeez! What’s it going to take to get the truth out here? Seems to me it’s blind ideology that’s driving all those who would deny US citizens the same right to real health care that other nations have been enjoying for decades now. Why would I be interested in continuing a system that creams 25-30% off the top of my premium payments to profit from people’s illness when I could have a single-payer, non-profit system that would be 100% focused on providing for health care?

    • http://personalliberty.com Dorothy

      Skipper Amen i agree with all you said. I would just add that if the private insurance did away with preexistent clause and took everyone no matter their health it would be a great plan glad to see someone with a brain and use it

  • Melody

    Just wanted to say, nothing the government is doing addresses the issue of making Americans healthier. This is nothing but a tax collecting effort, and the cost is too much. This is none of their business and forcing people to buy insurance that is not needed and is not affordable. If people would negotiate their payments with their health care professionals directly, and eliminate the insurance companies altogether, that would make things more competitive. I for one don’t want to buy insurance, because it is a waste of money and takes money out of the economy, investments, and my quality of life. My dad is 82 years old, never had a health problem and is still going strong. Imagine if he would be forced to pay insurance all his life, how much money would that be?????? He will probably die in his sleep, never being in a hospital and have to see a doctor. Government would punish the healthy for the people who abuse their health and don’t take care of themselves. Address good health practices and education, not tax us to death!!!!!

    • DaveH

      That was a very brave statement Melody. Now you better batten the hatches and shutter your windows, the Zombies are coming!

    • http://none Glo

      Not only a brave statement but very true. Some people I know have never been sick. Also, I do not care to pay for people who are stupid enough to put themselves into harm’s way by acting like their life didn’t matter. Let them foot their own bill. There are enough reality shows to show you how idiotic they can be. I like our system. I am retired and support myself on my Social Security and Medicare. I don’t have a lot, nor do I need a lot, but I do need help once in a while with Medicare. But already we are not getting a raise for the next two years, for that, I want to thank the Government for making my life a little more miserable and harder to live.

      • eyeswideopen

        Glo, does that mean you won’t be friends with DaveH anymore as he doesn’t have insurance and will eventually cost both you and I, money?

  • Barbara Michalski

    I have said it before amd I will say it again” I WANT TO KEEP WHAT I HAVE RIGHT NOW!. Any time the government gets involved there is too much red tape, long waits, wrong information and I will not put up with that. Obamba wants to make us a socialist country. We do not want or need that.

    • Norm

      Barbara Michalski
      You’ve got it backwards. The private sector wastes 20% of your and/or your employers premiums on administrative costs alone. The red tape is outrageous, and the insurance co.s are constantly thinking of ways of not paying claims. My mother, who’s over 90, has medicare and a BC/BS supplement that together pay every dime of her meds except drugs. I handle her affairs, and I’ve never had a problem with medicare.

      • Smilee

        Norm I have the same plans and find the same to be true, My dad was retired when Medicare first took effect in 1966 and had the sane results my mother and uncles and aunts have had the same experience, I have only one aunt left living and she is 91, and I also manage her affairs and she also has the same experience. Her husband had the same and was on it for 29 years when he died and he too told me the same and he thought it was the greatest thing our government ever did. What was interesting to me is that he always voted republican all his life he died two weeks after the 2004 election and shortly before he died he told me for the first time he voted for a democrat, he voted for Kerry, said he had had it with Bush. I was real surprised. He was 94 the week before the elections and sharp as a tack and died fast when he died,

        • John Creighton

          Smilee:Do you know how all of your family got on their Medicare plans? They paid into Social Security during their working years. Medicare Advantage Plan takes $100 from your S/S and gives to an HMO. You have a copay for drugs and medical.An actual person has cancer but had to stop infusions to get a hip replaced and is now back on infusions with very little paper work. How do you know how much paper work private carriers require? Personal experience??
          James Corbin has it right-so relax smile and look at all sides of this big picture–you may learn something interesting.Nothing in this world is perfect– yet we have something that is Damm good and as always good things need constant tune-ups End of story!!!

          • Smilee

            Personal experience?? That’s were I got it, 40 years of it. Your right nothing is perfect but James Corbin is dead wrong, government definitely can be improved but it is already doing far better than the private sector in health care and needs to be reined in if the people are going to be protected from these thieves and be able to get health care, Harvard studies recently released said 45,000 a year die early because they can not get health care and go without and left to die. Are you OK with that.

      • Thurman Marcum

        Norm,

        Good for you. I am on medicare.I am 66 years old.I have never had a problem with it,only the private ones.

    • DaveH

      There are many ways the high costs of the healthcare system could be addressed. They all involve less government, not more. So of course, those feeding at the government trough will attack these comments.

      The Federal Government could use power that the Constitution actually does give them (Interstate Commerce Claus) to allow insurance customers to buy out-of-state insurance.
      The states could reign in the ridiculous medical malpractice lawsuits.
      also:
      http://mises.org/story/3737

      • Smilee

        I see you are still reading propaganda sites that only lead you astray, nothing you suggest here will solve the health care problem and will only make it worse. We are lucky you will have little influence on the final outcome.

        • Nicola

          Yesssss!

      • eyeswideopen

        Dave, two states side by side, one major company and how does that drive down costs? You just can’t admit that the insurance companies like the Corporate raiders have got us by the neck and will not stop choking us. Your free market, unregulated ,is the insurance monoplies that we are praying to every night not to cancel us or raise our rates. Dave your concept does not work, greed stops, self regulation.

      • eyeswideopen

        dave, many of us keep asking you, how do you propose to shrink government? Just a little hint would help, not asking you to write a detailed platform, What do you think should be cut?

  • Becky

    Me to I also recieve Medicare and also have BC/BS AND IN over 6 years never have had to pay a dime. But if the FEDS take over we all will be dead. Because we will not be able to see a Doctor when we want. Think people real hard. Do you want the Goverment telling you when you can go to the doctor???

    • s c

      Becky, keeping matters simple and to-the-point is the best way to make it crystal clear to the American people why government can’t be trusted with health care. That is, the same wonderful, swell, caring ‘elites’ who gave us WWI, WWII, Korea, Vietnam, Medicare, wars on poverty and drugs AND airport security expect us to believe that they will ‘save’ health care for America.
      Failure is failure. When people see failure after failure and dare to claim that failure is the same as success simply proves that politics can sugar coat anything and almost get away with it.
      Comrade obama and his bunch offer America the same compassion and leadership Hitler gave to Europe’s Jews in WWII. Those who can’t recognize the same ‘compassionate hatred’ in obama’s non-plan will condemn themselves to having to learn some lessons again and again.

      • Smilee

        Still so so confused S C

    • Norm

      Becky
      Medicare is run by the feds. So is the VA, which is run quite well.

    • Smilee

      Another person who likes her government Medicare Plan and BCBS plan as she has to pay nothing and I have the same and pay nothing, this is something none of the private plans today offer and what they do offer most could not afford on their own. The vast majority of experts that have looked at the plans say it will actually improve Medicare and I have seen many articles saying that, the Last was in the AARP newspaper I got yesterday and have seen it in many other publications and my own reading of the bills tells me this is so. You are listening to all the lies the conservatives are spreading as they want to keep the status quo so their buddies can keep making that easy money at the peoples expense. Your medicare is safe I guarantee it, Medicare has been here since 1966 and until 2003 was basically the same until 2003 when Bush and company added on the Private Advantage Plans and D which has been very costly and not any better, in fact worse, than what the under 65 crowd gets albeit it is not as expensive as the under 65 crowd as the government subsidies it and the cost increased for the taxpayers 14%, you never hear the conservatives talking about this fact but then they voted it in.

    • eyeswideopen

      BECKY, the government is running it now, and you have no problems? So soon as someone else gets in the system, it will crash and burn?

    • Nicola

      What have you been smoking, Becky? Nothing in any of the Democratic solutions to our health-care crisis that have been proposed so far does anything remotely like what you’re saying!

  • Becky

    Barbara, you hit it right on the head. Like I posted before, if he (obama)takes over (goverment) to we will all be dead!!!

    • Smilee

      The private plans have so much more paperwork and their overhead costs are almost five times greater than the Public Plans, you Becky should know this as you get very little paperwork from either BCBS and Medicare, Conservative rhetoric sure has frightened you by its lies when in reality you have nothing to fear, or does anyone, It will only get better, how much better it will get remains to be seen as the conservatives are try minimize the improvements and have to use oodles of misinformation and lies to accomplish this as the truth would play positively into the democrats hand and heaven forbid if they succeed and do something so very much needed by all of us. When this is all over and done with you will see what I say is true. RELAX

    • http://none wasadoc

      Becky, ya got it right. The bad thing is that IF he gets it passed, it will be to late for any of them to say “Wait, that was not the way it was supposed to be”. I don’t think any of them believe it, but that’s the way it is on the 7th of October, 2009.

      • Smilee

        I’m starting to think you are a phony either that or you are like some people despite their experience never get it.

  • DaveH

    Ask yourself this (not you Sleepee, you are a hopeless zealot):
    Who has given you more respectful treatment during your life, Government workers or private sector workers? Who has been more considerate of your time (shorter waiting lines, etc.), Government workers or private sector workers?
    For my entire adult life I have heard the Liberals whine about monopolies and their dangers. Now what do they want? They want a monopoly of course. They will deny that but what do you think will happen when private insurers have to compete with the deep pockets of the United States Government? The government can run their business as badly as they please. They can’t fail. If they run out of money they will just raise taxes, or borrow money at the expense of future taxpayers. No private company can compete with that. So the private insurers will go out of business. Voila! A government monopoly.
    Then brace yourselves for all different forms of rationing and tax increases.

    • Norm

      DaveH
      The government doesn’t pay administrators 7 and 8 digit salaries.
      As far as how well one is treated; people are people and there are good and bad everywhere.

      • John Creighton

        Norm: Please tell me which private health care administrators draw down 7 and 8 figure salaries per year and where you get your informatiom.People are people,true it is how they are trained to deal with the public that makes the difference and in MOST cases you find that in the private sector.

        • Smilee

          John

          The papers are full of these stories all the time, many lawsuits on stock options for them have taken place and this information on them has been revealed there to. Pay attention!

    • http://none wasadoc

      Ah, yes, Dave. The magic word “TAXES”. Nobody seems to understand that the federal government has no money, except with TAXES.

      • Smilee

        So whats your point Doc.

        • keith

          if you need it explained your so dense you would’nt understand it anyway!

          • Smilee

            keith says:
            October 11, 2009 at 2:36 pm

            if you need it explained your so dense you would’nt understand it anyway! Reply

            I didn’t ask him to explain it, I asked him what his point was, apparently you are to dense to know the difference. If you have so much intelligence why not explain it just so we know you do understand it, you have not appeared to be smart in your other posts.

  • LISA D

    NOTHING IS FREE. I THINK THE GOV. SHOULD PUSH THE HEALTH INSURANCE TO LOWER THERE PRICES ACCORDING TO A PERSON INCOME. ITS A WIN WIN.COMPARE THE COUNTIES THAT RECIEVE FREE HEALTH CARE EUROPE AND U.S. SHOOT THEY COME TO U.S. TO GET BETTER. MY KIDS HAVE MEDCAID AND THE SERVICE AT THE CLINIC LOOKS AT ME WIERD CALL MY SON “A WALFARE KID” (IT KINDA BOTHER ME BUT TRUE BUT THE DR. IS GREAT)AND PERSONNALY IM GOING TO SCHOOL TO GET OUT THE SYSTEM I HATE THEM RUNING MY LIFE ASKING STUPID QUESTIONS. I THINK THERE SHOULD BE A TIME LIMIT ON PEOPLE WHO RECIEVE BENFITS CAUSE THERE PEOPLE THAT ABUSE THE SYSTEM. MAYBE THEY SHOULD FIX THAT.

    • DaveH

      Good for you, Lisa.

  • James Corbin

    We can’t trust this president! He says he isn’t a socialist—-But who can believe him? Look at all his associations and his hand picked czars! I don’t thing the government needs to be running anything! They control our lives too much now! They should open states to compete with one another and put a limit how much lawyers can sue!!
    Obama said he didn’t know Acorn was receiving federal money—-LIE–
    He was with Acorn all the time—-Their lawyer

  • James Corbin

    Government, can’t run anything!!!! Medicare is bankrupt!! 85% of americans are pleased with their insurance.

    • keith

      yep!i’m happy with my PRIVITE plan,go republicans,lets keep the socialists at bay till 2010 and we won’t have to worry about this socialist manure any more!

      • Smilee

        Hope you do not loose it and find you cannot get it again as has happened to so very many in the past 30 years, you will not be so smug then especially if it forces you into bankruptcy. You appear like one of those who think they can never encounter these problems and we all are just one breath away from living this.. Recently, a relative of mine got run over by a car and disabled and her employer let her go and she now has no insurance and has the injuries so she has a pre-existing condition and cannot get medicare for two years. DON’T THINK IT CAN NOT HAPPEN TO YOU, AS IT VERY WELL CAN.

  • James Corbin

    Barbara, you are exactly right! Medicare is fine–But it has been borrowed from and is broken—All they wasted money should have been put into medicare!

    • Smilee

      James

      You finally said something I can agree with, money needs to be paid back and should go to a trust fund and not to the treasury as well as all future money, It can and should be fixed as today it is the best plan available in the us today but only to the over 65 crowd and the disabled, It works so well if fixed it should be there for all, shared expense. You, pay, private sector supplement pays and government pays some. A balanced plan that has forty years of experience that proves it.

  • Norm

    INSURANCE CEO COMPENSATION

    United Health Group
    CEO: William W McGuire
    2005: 124.8 mil
    5-year: 342 mil
    Forest Labs
    CEO: Howard Solomon
    2005: 92.1 mil
    5-year: 295 mil
    Caremark Rx
    CEO: Edwin M Crawford
    2005: 77.9 mil
    5-year: 93.6 mil
    Abbott Lab
    CEO: Miles White
    2005: 26.2 mil
    5-year: 25.8 mil
    Aetna
    CEO: John Rowe
    2005: 22.1 mil
    5-year:57.8 mil
    Amgen
    CEO: Kevin Sharer
    2005:5.7 mil
    5-year:59.5 mil
    Bectin-Dickinson
    CEO: Edwin Ludwig
    2005: 10 mil
    5-year:18 mil
    Boston Scientific
    CEO:
    2005:38.1 mil
    5-year:45 mil
    Cardinal Health
    CEO: James Tobin
    2005:1.1 mil
    5-year:33.5 mil
    Cigna
    CEO: H. Edward Hanway
    2005:13.3 mil
    5-year:62.8 mil
    Genzyme
    CEO: Henri Termeer
    2005: 19 mil
    5-year:60.7 mil
    Humana
    CEO: Michael McAllister
    2005:2.3 mil
    5-year:12.9 mil
    Johnson & Johnson
    CEO: William Weldon
    2005:6.1 mil
    5-year:19.7 mil
    Laboratory Corp America
    CEO: Thomas MacMahon
    2005:7.9 mil
    5-year:41.8 mil
    Eli Lilly
    CEO: Sidney Taurel
    2005:7.2 mil
    5-year:37.9 mil
    McKesson
    CEO: John Hammergen
    2005: 13.4 mil
    5-year:31.2 mil
    Medtronic
    CEO: Arthur Collins
    2005: 4.7 mil
    5-year:39 mil
    Merck Raymond Gilmartin
    CEO:
    2005: 37.8 mil
    5-year:49.6 mil
    PacifiCare Health
    CEO: Howard Phanstiel
    2005: 3.4 mil
    5-year: 8.5 mil
    Pfizer
    CEO: Henry McKinnell
    2005: 14 mil
    5-year: 74 mil
    Well Choice
    CEO: Michael Stocker
    2005: 3.2 mil
    5-year: 10.7 mil
    WellPoint
    CEO: Larry Glasscock
    2005: 23 mil
    5-year: 46.8 mil
    Wyeth
    CEO: Robert Essner
    2005:6.5 mil
    5-year: 28.9 mil

    TOTAL 2005: 559.8 mil

    TOTAL 5-Year: 14.9 billion

    • Thurman Marcum

      Norm,

      Thank you,you are a breath of fresh air.I am for public option.The private insurance companies can’t be trusted.They are all in business for profits.We need to drive health care cost down.Private insurance is too expensive.

    • eyeswideopen

      Norm, I posted that info with a link, and DaveH, our local Libertarian who is for no controls for the market place,( which includes banking, Wall Street and corporate companies), kept saying Government is force, socialism doesn’t work,and the government is in his pocket. How can someone that educated not grasp that middle class is dying under the yoke of non-regulation? Maybe I should have printed it like you did. Sometimes seeing things in black and white works. Thanks for your effort.

  • Smilee

    Looks like you left them speechless Norm, of course most here only believe lies so they may not believe you, but good job revealing the truth.

  • http://none Glo

    Yep, they borrowed from Medicare, but never put it back. Well, in my book, that is stealing. Just put it back where it belongs. Hey, maybe we can just not pay our taxes. We should follow the government’s lead. I’m just saying…

    • Smilee

      Not only that Bush and and his buddies in 03 tried to privatize Medicare and succeeded in making that an option and also succeeded in upping the cost to taxpayers by 14% with less choice of doctors and hospitals as most are in networks and added co-pays and less legal protections all this on top of continuing the robbing of the Medicare dollars. You are right it has to be paid back but this stealing of it does not make Medicare a bad plan in fact it is now superior to the private plans available to the under 65 crowd in both legal protections and coverages. The problem is no Pay as you go, heaven forbid we find a way to pay for things rather than go into debt. Going to take years to turn it around but we better start down that road while we can.

      • JeffH

        Unfortunately, any payback of the Social Security and Medicare funds that were stolen by government would come out of the taxpayers pocket anyway. I researched for several months to decide which type of Medi-Care coverage I would choose. In my area, I picked an Aetna Advantage plan, chose a PC family physician and after 1 month I feel I made a solid decision. I had always had Kaiser Permanente coverage in the past. My co-pays are affordable and the meds I use are covered under the plan.

        • Smilee

          Your research was not very good as there are many superior plans to that one. Did you look at the legal protections it gives you and what are the limits on doctors and hospitals and area’s in the plan, what happens if you want to move to another state? Many are finding answers to these questions the hard way, through experience, these are the plans that Medicare gets the vast majority of complaints on.

  • keith

    at least the crap is being stopped!thank god for that!

    • Smilee

      Dream on!! THERE WILL BE REFORM AND IT WILL NOT BE STOPPED!!

  • Warriors

    There are two major purposes to this democrat government run plan. 1.) capture the private health care dollars to assist with the shortfalls in Medicare/Medicaid and social security. 2.) construct a patronage army of government health care management personnel to keep the Dems in office. Chicago politics is constructed the same way. It works! We haven’t had a non-democrat in control for over 50 years. Who knows, if the politicians can actually gain absolute control over health care maybe this will become America’s leading export. Of course, with reduced payment for services, there will be no such thing as a not for profit because everyone will be covered. The providers will just have to get by with whatever the government will pay them. Possibly less payment for physicians will attract less qualified physicians. When we get to this point, we can unionize everyone in the provider industry including physicians. just imagine, now 50% of this countries workers can call themselves union affiliated and democrats. Brilliant!

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