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No Room For Conservatives In The GOP

December 10, 2012 by  

No Room For Conservatives In The GOP
PHOTOS.COM

The Republican Party is no place for conservatives.

Conservatives reject statism, embrace small government and abhor confiscatory taxes. Conservatives believe in a strong military for the Nation’s defense (not military adventurism). Conservatives advocate liberty and personal responsibility.

The Republican Party is now ruled by CINOs (conservatives in name only). I have been telling you this for a long time. The recent Republican primary, in which a gun-grabbing, pro-abortion Northeastern liberal progressive was promoted and depicted to voters as a conservative, should have laid bare the party’s true nature for all to see.

It was a slap in the face to Tea Partiers (those not hijacked by the GOP and their corporatist masters) who battled against Obamacare and went to the polls in droves in 2010 to give the Republicans the House of Representatives, unseating several CINOs along the way.

In order to ensure their chosen liberal progressive candidate was the standard bearer for the Republican party, GOP elites and a complicit whore media propped up the candidacies of faux conservatives Rick Santorum and Newt Gingrich while preaching the inevitability of a Mitt Romney candidacy.

GOP insiders engaged in fraud, dirty tricks and outright assault (and these are only the tip of the dirty tricks iceberg) in order defeat the only true conservative in the race: Ron Paul.

Paul was too conservative for the GOP. It’s customary for the primary winner to grant a speaking slot at the convention to the second place finisher, as John McCain did for Romney in 2008. But rather than embrace Paul and his liberty army, the GOP pushed them off the floor and broke its own rules in ignoring their attempts to force a floor fight over rule changes that will make it even more difficult for the non-chosen candidate to make headway in future primaries.

Paul was denied a convention speaking slot. Paul and his supporters were disrespected, harassed and abused.

The GOP and its compliant whore media — especially FOX News — spent the next several weeks alternately wooing Paul supporters for their votes and denigrating them as “ensuring the election of Barack Obama” if they didn’t abandon their principles and toe the party line.

There are some 5 million liberty voters and many millions more true conservative voters. They didn’t for a minute buy the lie that Romney was conservative. Some, though, held their collective noses and voted for Romney (or against Obama) anyway. But many didn’t.

Fewer Republican voters cast ballots for Romney than they did for the statist neocon who preceded him, McCain. Many of those who did abandoned their conservative principles to do so. They were blinded by their “hatred” of Obama and his progressive/Marxist policies — so blinded, in fact, that they failed to recognize that the guy they were supporting held many of the same beliefs, as do many of Republican Congressional members who today masquerade as conservatives.

In doing that they have emboldened party elites to push the party further to the left. Listen to their words. They say – falsely — that the party lost because it had become too white, that it didn’t embrace multiculturalism, didn’t cater to minorities, didn’t advocate for amnesty for illegals. In other words: Romney lost because he didn’t sound enough like the Democrats. So the answer for the party’s electoral woes, according to the elites, is to become Democratic Party light.

It is evidenced by Weeper of the House John Boehner’s sellout to Obama on the issue of tax increases and miniscule spending cuts in the fiscal cliff negotiations. Weeper Boehner’s counterproposal to Obama’s request for $1.6 trillion in tax increases, additional stimulus spending and the power to circumvent Congress on the debt ceiling was to embrace Obama’s previous $800 billion tax increase offer. Surrender is his idea of compromise.

Already a fascist party (as evidenced by its embrace of George W. Bush’s “compassionate conservatism,” bailouts, big government and unlimited wars), GOP insiders are now culling the party of the few conservatives that are left. Last week, the Big Weeper initiated a purge of Republicans who opposed the budget proposed by Budget Chairman Paul Ryan earlier this year because it didn’t cut spending fast enough. The purge drove Justin Amash of Michigan, Tim Huelskamp of Kansas, David Schweikert of Arizona and Walter Jones of North Carolina from their committee assignments.

A source told Roll Call that Schweikert was told he was ousted because his “votes were not in lockstep with leadership.”

The Senate’s most conservative member, Jim DeMint, resigned last week to take the reins at the Heritage Foundation. Heritage is a “conservative” think tank (that supports U.S. military adventurism in the name of the War on Terror). DeMint said he believes he can have more influence spreading a conservative message from outside the Senate.

I wrote in the second paragraph the main tenants of conservativism. These things are now anathema to Republican Party elites, who embrace militarism rather than defense, bow to Israel and Saudi Arabia when it comes to foreign policy, and pass laws that destroy liberty and promote the police state.

That is why Tea Party favorites like Allen West were defeated and others like Michelle Bachmann struggled to hold their seats. They — and most others — voted for an extension of the USA Patriot Act and for the National Defense Authorization Act, which suspends habeas corpus and subjects all Americans to indefinite detention without trial. They and most of the rest of the Republicans in Congress are anti-liberty. It’s not that they were too conservative. It’s that their actions outed them as CINOs.

Militarism and a growing police state are not the things Tea Partiers thought they were voting for in 2010. Nor were they voting for Weeper Boehner and a “conservative” Congress to surrender on tax increases.

But bigger government, militarism, reduced liberty and tax increases are what the Republicans stand for. And despite the party’s brand (the small government, low taxes, pro-liberty party), it has been that way since its beginnings out of the ruins of the Whig Party.

Some Republicans are calling for Weeper Boehner’s ouster as head party Weeper in the Congress. That is a fool’s errand. Any replacement will only be more of the same.

It’s past time for conservative voters to stick to their principles and abandon the Republican Party. It’s past time for true conservatives to realize the Republican Party is the CINO party.

Bob Livingston

is an ultra-conservative American who has been writing a newsletter since 1969. Bob has devoted much of his life to research and the quest for truth on a variety of subjects. Bob specializes in health issues such as nutritional supplements and alternatives to drugs, as well as issues of privacy (both personal and financial), asset protection and the preservation of freedom.

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  • Marty S.

    Well written and worthwhile article. The Republican establishment should take notice and realize that they have left us. It is time for a replacement party worthy of liberty-minded freedom-loving Americans. We can replace them in the 2014 mid terms and stop this insanity.

    • Vicki

      And that party already exists. http://www.lp.org

      • Mikey

        Vicki,
        You are absolutely right, and the GOP will stop at nothing to suppress the Libertarian message. The good news, is that more and more people are waking up.

      • Jason B

        The problem is, that while many conservatives agree with a lot of the Libertarian platform, there are aspects of it that they just cant get behind, there for you have, http://www.constitutionparty.com/. That said, the two parties, along with real tea party activists, need to compromise, and form a 3rd party composed of all of them if they want to compete. There is enough common ground there, that if freedom loving people really want to make changes in this nation we have to come together, give and take and go at the corruption full force.

      • Bob

        Good idea Jason too bad the reps and dems are so paid off by lobbyist and just want to take our rights away! Don’t you just love how all competing parties are blocked out? That alone should be enough to dump our so called two party system (one party would be more correct since they have the same objectives). Lock down is coming soon at a FEMA camp near you might as well get in line for the holocost of americans. Does anyone give a sh……..t?

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          They don’t call them “FEMA Camps”, they call them “Human Habitats” – Agenda 21

      • Robert Smith

        Mikey says: “You are absolutely right, and the GOP will stop at nothing to suppress the Libertarian message.”

        And they are into supressing the vote with their antics thwarting registration to vote for minorities.

        What have they done to supress the votes of the extreme right? Please be specific.

        Rob

      • DaveH

        As usual, Robert, you make no sense.

      • old hillbilly

        Votes will be earned in the future. Any voting for Boehner leadership or humbling to lemming loyalty will lose my vote and public comments. For sure, any who chose Boehners cliff over the Obama abyss of more unrestrained trillions of debt spending to his brotherhood, illegals, etc. will be exposed & deposed by vote & opposition

    • http://www.facebook.com/shary.metrocavage Shary Metrocavage

      I do not agree that GOP has left us. We left them. I could not find anything in common with bunch of men and women who did not have the courage to stand for anything. I am sorry to say that we are also wrong about what we consider ourselves. I am very much conservative and do not believe in all its principals, however social conservatism means that do not ask the government to put regulation on family values. Therefore, we need to ask the government to get out. That includes car insurance, abortion, marriage, business license and host of other laws. I cannot walk ten steps outside my house without breaking the law. I have to pay so much money for water that God provides and cannot remove tree that destroys my house and make it impossible to grow food in my yard. Well intentioned people who have one fear; that is going when God has asked you to, are putting Marshall Law on others. I am for Liberty and Freedom; Use this slogan and you will get 75% who are for that.

      • Walt

        I am a 71 year young conservative and the essence of your article is exactly why my wife and I moved out of the country 3 years ago. We have more freedom living in an emerging 3rd world country than we did in the US. Not to mention the fact that living on our meager SS makes us rich in this country. If we stayed in the US, we would be living in a cardboard box under a bridge. We will continue to pray that God doesn’t finally say: Ok, you want Me to leave, then I will. We still love our country, but are disgusted with those that are running it. God Bless America!!!!

      • DaveH

        Chile?

      • Butch

        Walt, what country did you choose?

      • TIME

        Dear Walt,

        Good for you Walt..

        Whats really good to see is that anyone who drops out will find the same results as Walt has. The only draw back is {when} ~ the “SHTF” and it will very soon as any of you who have really researched into this mess know that’s true.
        The SS Funds will be cut off, ~ { so please watch your backs } if thats what you’re doing or have done.
        ( Get very frendly with the native people, like family close.)

        Dave,
        Chile is rather expensive for just SS payments, Chile a very well off nation ~ please do keep in mind that our >special Intel units < are down there working over time to disrupt that nation along with all other "FREE" ~ Nations of South America.

        ** Peace and Love ~ ** Merry Christmas, ** Shalom ~ Happy Chanuka

        Everyone Got your bus tickets yet? Its getting very close to the cut off point.
        The 7th King has noted he is going to "RETIRE" in April 2013 for health reasons, note that "two Trumpets" will sound before that event, and after the 4th Trumpet the Bus tickets get cut off.
        Please people, I not only implore, but beg you to understand what that means for your soul.

    • Robert Smith

      Marty says: “We can replace them in the 2014 mid terms and stop this insanity.”

      Ummmm…. May I make a small point here?

      It was the VOTERS who got rid of the right wing nuts in the last election.

      Rob

      • DaveH

        And which “right wing nuts” were those, Robert?
        What made them right wing? Because they attempted to stop your hand from entering their pockets?

      • Mikey

        Since it was posted by Robert Smith, the “right wing nuts” would be anybody that dislikes socialism or fascism.

      • Robert Smith

        Doesn’t matter.

        The VOTERS spoke.

        Rob

      • phideaux

        “It was the VOTERS who got rid of the right wing nuts in the last election.”

        RS nothing has changed. obama is president, the dems have a very small majority in the senate and the Republicans have a majority in the house all just like the last two years. If the voters have said anything it is that gridlock is preferable to the government being able to push through anything the government wants no matter what the people they supposedly represent want.

      • Vicki

        Robert Smith says:
        “Doesn’t matter.

        The VOTERS spoke.”

        This is why we prefer to live in a Constitutionally LIMITED Republic such as what was the United States of America.

        “Would you tell me please, Mr. Howard… why should I trade one tyrant 3,000 miles away for 3,000 tyrants one mile away” http://www.hark.com/clips/tqqkkllkfk-3000-tyrants-one-mile-away

        Tyranny of the majority is STILL tyranny.

      • Nadzieja Batki

        Thanks DaveH, my thoughts exactly.
        I doubt if the Leftists have any qualms that they are stealing from another human being who has a hard enough time suppoting his own family.
        Robert Smith thinks workers should believe it is a religious privilege to attach parasites to their backs.

      • Bob

        I guess the voting public is just a little dumbed down as well as most other americans including you possibly. We elected a dictator and gave him the Noble Peace Prize for what?

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          “We” did not give him the noble Peace prize.

          • Deerinwater

            Right! He was awarded it by someone other then Us. (With hopes he’d aspire to peace)

            Like everything else, ~you can find debate. It’s more difficult to defend what did not happen than what has.

            Example; 43 is offered credit for preventing more Terrorist attacks on US main land,

            while 44 is not offered credit for the avoidance of US troops on the ground in Libya.

            Both debatable, ~ while I enjoy debate, a winnable debate is more rewarding.

    • ALL AMERICAN

      AMEN !!!
      Let’s get’er done !

    • mudguy

      The only place we need gun control is for the GOP, CINO establishment because they keep shooting themselves in their feet and each other. There is no difference right now between the GOP,CION and the Democrats. I will not support the CINO’s any more. Until they realizes that you can not negotiate with the Liberal Democrats they will never save our country.

      • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

        What makes you think that they want to save our country? Both the Repbulican and Democratic parties have been corrupt for a long time, working against the USA and the American people.

    • http://wildblue.net Bungal

      We see some comments and they give 3rd Party candidate support. Why do we always have those that reject facts in elections? Obama is about as far left as Putin; Chavez; or Castro and yet, instead of seeing the light and seeing that supporting someone moderate could lead, someday to a third party Conservative elect, they toss their vote? I am fully sure that Obama won because some Republicans stayed home and many 3rd Party gave their vote away. The real shows that there was corruption and it was reported before the election. Two States were mentioned and it was Ohio and Florida. Now if this were for a Constitution supporting President and if it were shown as in the Gore vs Bush that it was totally legal by Florida and our own Constitution, great! No wrong done.

      The wrong was that we elected the worst of the worst as far as keeping our freedoms and I am not talking about finances or economy but our own Constitutional rights. We see the attack our our Second Amendment after the attack on our real freedom of choices with Obama care. It should be our choice and not some Fed reject!

      I have a good question for Republican candidates and that is simple. We heard from the Obama Election Committee and from Liberal Media that there was racism, correct? That many may vote against Obama for his race! Why did you not soak the media and the fact that Obama is not black? His mother was not black. You should of been with my ideas using the facts. We are voting to keep our Constitutional freedoms we all have given to preserve! If a President came from Altair 4, 350 light years away and was able to confuse the system, what only matters is our rights and freedoms! Race does not matter although I would love to see a women of honor of black decent become President. We do need that! A very honorable and Conservative lady!

      We note that the media is extremely bias in moving away from our free choices. We only have one and that is Fox News that support honor. If Conservatives want to be elected they need media support and we can only have this one way! We need to expose the lies of the Liberal Media and with total convictions to this!

  • Harold Olsen

    One of the reasons I quit the Republican party and became an Independent was the direction the GOP has been heading for more than a decade. They have been moving further and further left until they are almost indistinguishable from the Democrats. The Democrats are out and out liberals. Most of the Republicans are now liberals and the rest are, at best, left-leaning moderates. There are few, if any, conservatives left in the party, and that goes for the TEA party Republicans. The TEA party, this past election, showed themselves to be a mouthpiece for the Republican party when they made it clear they would support the Republican candidate no matter who it was or how liberal they were. I won’t have anything to do with either party nor the TEA party, who are no longer the independent grassroots movement they supposedly started out to be. Should the GOP field a truly conservative candidate for president (which is highly unlikely) I would probably support that candidate. Until that happens, I’m an Independent and I’ll stay and Independent and most likely vote third party. If that means the Democrats always win, so be it. The I way see it, it wouldn’t matter, since the two parties are just two sides of the same coin and are interchangeable. They may as well merge into a single party.

    • http://smoovious.wordpress.com Smoovious Laxness

      People are entirely too attached to party labels and slogans that they can’t even make their decisions based on the people and policies anymore.

      Election after election, just listen to how they talk… they act as if only 2 parties exist.

      The only time they acknowledge the other parties, is just long enough to dismiss them without any serious consideration, to push them back in their mind where they can continue to pretend they don’t exist.

      To me, this is classic programmed/conditioned behavior.

      They only see 2 parties, and no matter how bad the person in their own party may be, they cling to their party identity so tightly, they cannot even seriously consider that ‘their’ guy does not best reflect their own interests.

      They are a , and so they’re going to vote and that’s all that matters. It doesn’t matter if the person they voted for, is in opposition to what the party’s lip-service goals are, or even in opposition to that voter’s own interests.

      At the same time, the person in the party will always be evil who will destroy the country and everything their party pays lip-service to, and since they are the biggest two parties, by design (ever look at the separate sets of rules they get to play by, while the other parties have to play by a different set? rules set up that obstruct the existence of them, while the 2 gov’t parties not only get favorable rules, but are themselves gov’t subsidized? but I digress…)… by design, they play on your fears of annihilation, claiming if you vote for any other party, then you’re voting for the other gov’t party who wants to destroy the country.

      and… OMG… I don’t wanna destroy the country by voting for the better guy, MY PARTY NEEDS ME!!!

      What rubbish…

      We Libertarians kept trying to warn you Republican Chicken Little’s out there… but you just wouldn’t listen…

      It isn’t your fault tho, and I don’t blame you… you were programmed that way… and most of you just aren’t strong enough to break free of your conditioning so you can think for yourself.

      Not being strong enough isn’t your fault either… our schools created you that way.

      Years from now, as you find your party more and more disappointing you, breaking their promises, and not standing up for you like they’re supposed to… just remember…

      We tried to warn you… but you just wouldn’t listen… so stop looking to other people to protect you, waiting for someone stronger to come along and fix things…

      You’ll be much better off, trying to make yourselves stronger, and better informed… and one day, just maybe, you’ll find yourselves able to finally break free of your programming, and realize how life affirming it really is, to finally be able to think for yourself, and choose for yourself, and understand… this is what ‘living’ is supposed to be about… and you’ll never, ever, settle, for merely ‘existing’ ever again…

      Good luck, you’re going to need it…

      – Smoov

      • DaveH

        It’s just laziness, Smoovious. It takes initiative to do some studying and dispel the Propaganda. It’s much easier to let others guide them around by the rings in their noses.

      • JeffH

        Smoovious, well said. I feel fortunate, to a point, that I never felt any allegiance to the 2 party system mainly because I don’t believe in them. My political activism started just a few short years ago because I was too busy working & running my life to fully devote myself to the politics of this country. I paid attention and moaned but was never active…until 2008.

        Being raised in California and watching and experiencing the demise of this once rich state that always lead the rest of the country in everything…I’ve learned just how destructive the political powers are. How power, greed and selfishness trumps common sense, responsibility and the rule of law. I always knew it was there but never realized just how damaging the political elite have become. The feds have taken all of this to a higher, national level.

        Marxism/Progressivism is slowly taking the USA down that road to all-out communism. The Republicans are just using a different path than the Democrats to get us there…destroying our Constitutional Republic and our Constitution along with it.

        I’m afraid Jefferson may have been right when he said this:

        “The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. … God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion; what country can preserve its liberties if their rulers are not warned from time to time that their people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms.” — Thomas Jefferson to William Stephens Smith, 1787

        Most Americans may even be shocked to discover that Thomas Jefferson said such a thing and consider such a notion to be ‘treasonous.’

        Yet the Founders believed that traitors and tyrants have a penchant for slithering into positions in government unnoticed. There they engage in a covert, patient, and insidious course of action to gradually shift the government away from its core Constitutional principles.


        “Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect everyone who approaches that jewel. Unfortunately, nothing will preserve it but downright force. Whenever you give up that force, you are ruined.” — Patrick Henry, Virginia’s Ratification convention, 1788


        “It does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people’s minds.” — Samuel Adams

        “I have sworn upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man.” — Thomas Jefferson in a letter to Dr. Benjamin Rush, September 23, 1800. Inscribed in the Jefferson Memorial.

        “The right to revolt has sources deep in our history.” — Supreme Court Justice William O. Douglas


        Whenever the legislators endeavor to take away and destroy the property of the people, or to reduce them to slavery under arbitrary power, they put themselves into a state of war with the people, who are thereupon absolved from any further obedience.” — John Locke, 1690

        This is one of the reasons the Founders insisted on an armed citizenry as a means of keeping government power in check.

        “Perhaps it is time for the arrogant ones in government to back off, step back, take a deep breath, and carefully consider the consequences that their actions and statements may well produce among concerned citizens.”
        - Anthony Martin 4/2009

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          Awesome post! 5 thumbs up!

      • TIME

        Dear Smoov,

        Thanks for a really well done post. Indeed you are correct.
        Saddly the comsology of todays rat & roach infested house of whores that most think is a Government is not what they either think of believe it is.

        We who have researched this twist of words fully understand that there is no such thing as a Republican, nor a Democrat, its simply the hard hand or hard hand in a thin see through glove or perhaps better said the ~ “Fascist Corporate Pigs”
        All with the same goals in mind just a differant road to get to the very same ends, all the while vast amount of ignorant programed idiots follow like sheep to slaughter..

        Saddly most Americans still just can’t understand that we are owned by the IMF and have been since 1938. ~ Will America as a whole ever wake up?

        I don’t think so saddly, so to you who are awake, May The Christ look after you and your familys. Peace and Love, Merry Christmas, & Happy Chanukah.

        Got your bus tickets yet people? We don’t have long ~ and ~ No its not the Mayan long coun you need worry about, ~ again for the record the Mayan LC ended in October 2011, Its not 12/21/12.

      • Jason B

        http://www.constitutionparty.com/ Libertarians arent the only ones out there. Both parties should compromise and work together. I personally think you Libertarians take it a bit too far on some things. A blending of the platforms that suits everyone who wants smaller government and more freedom is the only way to put the 2 party good ol boys club down.

        • http://smoovious.wordpress.com Smoovious Laxness

          What’s the point of a Republican reboot?

          The Libertarians diverged for a reason ya know… merging with Conservatives will just once again alienate those who don’t agree with the social morality crap they’ve had to put up with already, which isn’t any of the government’s business in the first place.

          Those are the people who tend to lean Democrat, holding their noses while they vote for big government over and over, same as the fiscal minded people who hold their noses while they vote for the evangelical-backed Republicans.

          We _need_ to just focus on the fiscal issues and the limits our governments are supposed to stay within and not let ourselves continue to be repeatedly distracted over issues that should be left for free people to choose for themselves outside of governmental interference.

          – Smoov

          • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

            Nice Post!

      • America Rules

        Like Ron Paul, but distrust all Masons, and any party that allows the legalization of drugs, like the obamanation, is a total fraud to its people!
        You have all been played sheeple, and our time is running short.
        Embrace our Lord God, your family and all those you love.
        Fight against all evil so you and yours will survive, not here, but with our Lord.

      • GRusling

        It’s called “Herd Mentality” and republicans are as bad as democrats where it’s concerned. Too many on the right claim to be “individuals” with a strong desire to be left alone to make their own way, then scream like a stuck pig at the thought of losing their “Medicare” and “Social Security”, both of which are unsustainable and unconstitutional! What manner of “conservative” demands that their personal teat on the federal sow be maintained?

        It’s very difficult to discern any difference between the two wings of our republicrat political party, these days. Every Republican Senator (except Jim Demint, who didn’t vote at all) voted in favor of the NDAA and all supported renewal of the totally unconstitutional Patriot Act, so how can we tell them from the demonrats?

        We need a new conservative party and I don’t care what it’s called. We may not win much right away, but we can sure take the republicans out of the picture and eliminate the mess the GOP is making of everything. I don’t see how we have anything to lose since they don’t represent our viewpoint to begin with. I’d rather start something new my children and grandchildren can someday finish, to restore our Constitutional Republic…

    • Capitalist at Birth

      Try 1988 with the nomination of George H. W.

    • Melody

      What did Lenin say:
      “The way to control the opposition is to lead it”

      The Tea Party has been taken over just like the Republican Party.

  • Michael J.

    So what are we too do? Write a letter to our Congressman and complain? Wait two, or four years to cast votes that are not counted and serve only as a source of amusement to the elites peering down upon us with a great belly laugh?

    Is it the greatest fear Of Congress that voters will now see through the smoke and mirrors to realize that they are now just subjects, relieved of the ability to effect change in the way we are governed. Cattle to be steered and manipulated with the best interest of the world’s first family in mind?

    • Iris D. Lynch

      Do? Certainly not what we have been doing! Instead read the book The Miracle of Self Power which advocates in clear terms HOW TO empower the individual. Self powered people DO NOT vote Democrat. Education is the key to change!

      • Robert Smith

        I thought it was indoctrination with school preying and keeping kids ignorant about anything that has to do with sex or science.

        Rob

      • edrankin

        i’ve joined the libertarian party and intend to do what i can to strengthen it.

      • Randy W

        Lynch: Are you paying Bob Livingston for your advertisement on his blog?

      • DaveH

        Robert says — “I thought it was indoctrination with school preying and keeping kids ignorant about anything that has to do with sex or science”.
        “preying”? Freudian Slip, right Robert? I don’t think you meant Preying (what Liberals might do), but rather Praying (what Conservatives might do).
        What the Liberal Progressives purposely keep kids ignorant about is Economics, and for good reason. If the masses understood Economics, they would understand how the Leaders and their Pals are stealing from the rest of us.
        Those who would like to remove their blinders can go here:
        http://academy.mises.org/departments/economics/

      • DaveH
      • alpha-lemming

        For once you’re right Rob…… bad news is you don’t even know why.

        It IS all about the “school preying (sic)”…. on the kids that is.

      • TIME

        Dear Alpha,

        Thanks that was a beauty!

        Peace and Love

      • Robert Smith

        “It IS all about the “school preying (sic)”…. ”

        I know the difference between preying and praying. I said what I wanted to.

        If it ain’t their own kids they shouldn’t try to indoctrinate them.

        Rob

      • Robert Smith

        BTW, thanks for picking up on it so those who didn’t can see what I meant.

        Rob

      • DaveH

        Sure, Robert. You know you’re really kind of pathetic.
        Does “I thought it was indoctrination with school preying” sound like Robert meant anything other than “praying” to anybody else?

      • Robert Smith

        Awwwwwww DavidH, there you go trying to “interprit” what I post: ““I thought it was indoctrination with school preying” sound like Robert meant anything other than “praying” to anybody else?”

        You can go back through my posts over the last couple of years and see that when it comes to school praying I’ve often used “prey.”

        Like I said, you can indoctrinate YOUR kids any way you want, but when you prey on other peoples kids you are way out of line.

        The English language is my favorite toy. At parties it’s called “oralgami.” The folding of the English language. It’s a fun way to slip things by reich wingers while the rest of the room gets it.

        Rob

    • DaveH

      We could start right now by raising awareness for the 2016 Libertarian Candidate — Gary Johnson, and awakening people to the only truly Freedom Loving party — the Libertarian Party.
      Mostly the people need to be taught the concepts and benefits of Libertarian Principles, so they can make sure any future Libertarian Candidates aren’t sidetracked from those Principles.

      • DaveH
      • Capitalist at Birth

        Does Freedom loving include the violation of existing laws with an open border policy? If so I don’t think your brand of freedom will sell to the average American. That is exactly why the Libertarian party can never win a national election. Until they remove this policy from their party planks, people like me will never return.

      • Mikey

        Capitalist, If we return to a constitutional government, and follow existing laws, there will be no reason for illegals to come here illegally. When we remove incentives like entitlements, (free food and free medical care), educational grants (that US citizens can’t even get), not having to carry car insurance (like the rest of us), then they will be less motivated to come here illegally. It will then be in their best interest to play by the rules and migrate legally.
        Besides, if this were a more constitutional government, there would be more than enough jobs available, and the few that still came here illegally wouldn’t pose a threat.
        The illegal immigration issue is minor compared to the benefits of a Libertarian administration.

      • Capitalist at Birth

        Mikey, There will never be a Libertarian administration for the open border policy which is paramount to the Libertarian Party. They also are not in tune with the realities of the world. What would a Libertarian do about a Choking off of the oil supplies to the world economy? Absolutely nothing. This would devastate the world economic system and we would fall into a deep depression. If you don’t think that it is necessary to provide safe and free trade through out the world then you believe that we can exist and live without trading with the rest of the world and it will have no affect. Sheer fantasy.

        • http://www.boblivingstonletter.com/ Bob Livingston

          Dear Capitalist at Birth,

          You write: “There will never be a Libertarian administration for the open border policy which is paramount to the Libertarian Party.” I am not a member of the LP nor a shill for it, but I cannot let your lie go unchallenged. The Libertarian Party does not advocate open borders as you imply. I believe you have been corrected on this before. If so, and you continue to proclaim it, then you are a liar. From the platform:

          3.4 Free Trade and Migration

          We support the removal of governmental impediments to free trade. Political freedom and escape from tyranny demand that individuals not be unreasonably constrained by government in the crossing of political boundaries. Economic freedom demands the unrestricted movement of human as well as financial capital across national borders. However, we support control over the entry into our country of foreign nationals who pose a credible threat to security, health or property.

          That does not sound like an open border policy to me.

          Best wishes,
          Bob

      • DaveH

        Yes, Bob, Crony Capitalist has been corrected at least twice before by me.
        That is a pretty good indication that he has no interest in the truth.

      • DaveH

        There are some Libertarians who believe in unrestricted immigration, but to judge their views fairly would require learning what they really are and why. Libertarians long for a Free World, where the State plays a very minor role in our lives, and where people transact with each other voluntarily absent the Force of Big Government. We believe that we have a God-Given or Natural Right to control our own bodies and legally acquired Property. Given the Private Property Rights inherent in the Libertarian Agenda, no immigrants (or anybody else) would be Free to trespass on other peoples’ property. They would only be Free from the random harassment of the State.
        For a more in-depth treatment, read this:
        http://mises.org/journals/jls/22_1/22_1_3.pdf

      • Jason B

        http://www.constitutionparty.com/

        See thats why we fail. You guys think you are the only ones with the right ideas and the Constitution party thinks they are. There needs to be some give and take. I cant get behind the entire Libertarian platform but I can agree with a good chunk of it. Im sure you feel the same about the Constitution party, but at least if we worked together and formed one party we could be assured that we werent voting for pure evil.

      • DaveH

        The problem is, Jason, that we Libertarians are all about consistent Principles of Freedom. Our Principles can’t be compromised.
        So you’ll have to find somebody else to join your group.

    • Freedom Ranger

      Anyone who truly believes in the Declaration of Independence, the Constitution and the principles of individual liberty and is a member of the republican or democrat party should re-register as a Independent. There are millions of us who are registered as republicans even though the party embraces everything we abhor. If all of us drop out of the party, it will weaken it to a point where it will collapse within itself. The ugly truth is the republican party has been taken over by Marxists/Socialists and works in tandem with the Marxist democrat party to destroy anyone or any group perceived as a threat to the status quo.

      • Vicki

        Instead of hiding in “independent” or “decline to state” why not choose one of the parties that truly supports the Constitution. The most well known one being the libertarian party.

        http://www.lp.org

  • http://www.facebook.com/gregbeaty Greg Beaty

    The reasons I am leaving the Republican party and become an Independent is the direction the GOP has been heading for the past few years. Bye, Bye, GOP…

    • rick

      agree with you Greg,Iam leaving after 40 years to find a conservative party,I bet Republicans loose the House
      there are so many of us leaving

      • DaveH
      • Bob

        After what the republicans did to Ron Paul the don’t deserve to even be in existence and probably won’t be. How about a party that is physically conservative, socially liberal and respects the constitution?!!!! Quit taking our rights away and start giving them back please.

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          I agree. It is past time to do away with both the Republican party and the Democratic party. Both are corrupt. Both are assisting in the destruction of our nation making those who head it traitors.

  • Lindy

    I will no longer support the Republican party. My vote will be cast for a third party conservative from now on.

  • hipshotpercusion

    While a lot of people in this once great country are struggling to pay their bills and put food on the table, these Bastards in both parties are spending money like drunken sailors. With apologies to drunken sailors. Maybe 2013 will be the year when once again they will fire the shot heard round the world.Keep pushing,DC!

    • Paul Wells

      Heh, Ronald Reagan once remarked, that even “drunken sailors quit spending…when they run out of their own money!”. That sums our situation up nicely! Our drunken sailors will never quit spending (other people’s money!).

      • Marty S.

        They’ll have to quit spending once the rest of the whirled figures out they been duped by the Federal Reserve and the U.S. Central Government into believing the dollar is worth anything. Once this crooked scheme is exposed and the dollar is no longer acceptable as payment in full for any international transactions in the future and losing its reserve status, then game over for the Spender-in-Chief and all his cronies from both parties. Let them spend themselves silly as the greenback will quickly become trash not cash. The sooner this happens the better. Who cares if the Republican Party is a goner it has been nothing but an extension of the Democraptic Party for decades anyways. They have proven their incompetence based on their inability to stand up against bullies both foreign and domestic and do the things they were elected to do. They are our employees and now it is time to fire them and replace them with those who are willing to stand up for the principles this nation was built on.

      • nc

        Paul, neither did Ronnie quit spending “other peoples’ money” He tripled the national debt of all the Presidents before him without having to fight a war while the people were paying more taxes than ever before!

      • DaveH

        Isn’t it funny to hear a Liberal Progressive whining about the increase of the National Debt under Reagan but then turning a blind eye to Obama’s National Debt increase?
        Reagan’s per annum increase in the National Debt — $220 Billion.
        Obama’s per annum increase in the National Debt — $1390 Billion.

        Obama increased the National Debt 6 times faster per year than Reagan did.

      • Paul Wells

        nc, always the one with revisionist history. Sure, Reagan (almost) tripled the debt, but to build our military back up after Carter cut the military to the point we could no longer defend ourselves. The fact that you left out is our GDP increased by a whopping 82%, which enabled us to significantly reduce debt and increase jobs. Wish your pet President could say the same, but GDP has increased a paltry 3% in his tenure. Of course, you rabid Obama apologists will never accept the facts as they are!

    • Nobody’s Fool

      You should have said they are spending money like drunken democRATS. Then no apology is needed for the sailors.

  • Mark-John

    Many are finally figuring out what a joke this whole thing is. While it is folly to say that the dem and the “pube” are “sides of the same coin” (that is ridiculous), they work in concert as the “Elites,” and we comply as the sheep.

    Wake up, People; it is no longer about “democrats” and “republicans”…it is about the “Them” (Elites) and the “Us” (the serfs who fund their Golden Parachutes).

    We’re being HAD, People…we’re being HAD.

    • DaveH

      It is not Folly to claim that the Democrats and Republicans are different sides of the same coin — the Progressive coin. They are both building Government ever-larger (Progressivism). One party is mostly Liberal Progressive and the other party is mostly Neocon Progressive.

  • Paul Wells

    Here’s the deal, as I see it. You can walk away from the Republican Party, fine, well and good. Just remember, they got almost 50% of the popular vote this last election. The Libertarian party, well, it didn’t fare so well. Recent news article cites that Obama’s approval rating is now approaching 57%, in spite of Benghazi, endless expensive vacations that taxpayers pay for, capitulation on supporting Israel (at least in part), and a host of other unsavory behavior. So, in spite of this well written article, Bob, I and others ask, what shall we do to get the Conservative brand acceptable again, when so many weak willed Libtards bleat like little sheep for the next handout? I hate to say it, but we’re doomed, because we have lost our moral fiber. Still…I want to make a difference, but as I see it, it’s ALL uphill sledding!

    • http://smoovious.wordpress.com Smoovious Laxness

      Well, you can start by giving up the use of terms like “Libtards”…

      Honestly, whenever I try to engage with someone who ends up using terms like that, I just tune them out and stop wasting my time on them…

      Nothing screams “I AM NOT TO BE TAKEN SERIOUSLY!!!” more than some political hack spouting out stupid terms like that. That is not someone who takes himself, nor his politics, seriously.

      If you want to get real, on real issues, real problems, real solutions, then take yourself seriously.

      There is a lot of real problems that need to be taken seriously, by serious people, and using derogatory terms like that is counter productive.

      If you seriously want to make a difference, then start with yourself and take yourself seriously, first of all.

      Until you do? There’s just no point talking to you any further.

      – Smoov

      • Paul Wells

        Smoov, Please note that your many worded diatribe against my one snarky comment to describe liberals in general, pointed out no problem identification, no problem rectification, and was basically just a slam on me for using the term libtard. I would say grow up, and learn to take a little criticism (if you deserve it), but that point will surely be lost on you. On the other hand, if you really want to be part of the solution, pray tell advise what that might be.

      • Marty S.

        Great handle by the way.

    • nc

      Paul, you were comparing Reagan numbers to Obama’s numbers! Why do you Obama haters not have the ability to assess the difference in what Reagan and bush II started with as opposed to what Obama started with???? Do you really believe that Obama was not faced with a more expensive situation than Reagan and bushes I and II began with?????? Remember that adult independents who knew the situation are watching your answer!!!!

      What weapons did Reagan EVER need that he didn’t have when Carter left office?? Did he still not inherit the most expensive , best trained and technologically advanced military in the universe??

      • Vicki

        Why do you claim we hate obama? We don’t. We dislike and object to his POLICIES.

      • Marty S.

        What your hero did though was the equivalent of dumping gasoline on an already raging fire. Now it seriously out of control and it appears this is exactly the result he is trying to achieve.

  • http://www.edwinrankin.com Ed Rankin

    the GOPs treatment of ron paul and his supporters should have been a sufficient signal to conservatives that there is no interest in taking the party back to its roots. the GOP elite want big government their way. the only real difference between a republican and democrat government is whose patrons get rewarded with tax payer goodies.

    • http://mozilla robert e. lee

      you are absolutely correct;; probably would have won if Paul and the evangelical sit outs had played. I was shocked at them not allowing Paul’s delegates to be seated..solidified the existence of a progressive collaboration with obama; make a good show so we the people think “ALL IS WELL”;; there is NO TWO PARTY SYSTEM TODAY…..

      • Vicki

        It was an instructive example of why so many of us claim that there is no real difference between the 2 parties. For change that you can enjoy as well as believe in there is the Libertarian party. http://www.lp.org.

    • Robert Smith

      From Ed: “the GOPs treatment of ron paul and his supporters should have been a sufficient signal to conservatives that there is no interest in taking the party back to its roots. ”

      Let’s look at those roots. It began in 1860.

      Abraham Lincoln, the first Republican President (1861–1865): Freed the slaves and wasn’t much on religion.

      And we can jump to Barry Goldwater: Pro-choice, and didn’t care about gays in the military.

      But recently the current batch are just a bunch of reich wingers.

      Yes, go back to tradition when I was a proud Republican. They lost me when I figured out that the only thing from the voodoo “trickle down” economics was that they were peeing on America.

      Rob

  • http://mozilla robert e. lee

    It is time to form a cohesive ; inclusive broad based conservative movement;; repubs are no longer our representatives;;;;;Like it or hate it “THE TEA PARTY” IS the solution; they are fiscal/moral conservatives and they have the infra structure to reach millions through FREEDOM WORKS and all their auxiliary local chapters. The Tea Party candidates did very well at the local levels this recent election;; incidentally…we must take back America at the local levels to build our strong conservative base. I was in DC in 2009 and these people are for real, no matter what the radical left wing media says. We are not terrorists ; but we are a threat to obama and his agenda 21….

    • Marty S.

      Robert is on to something here. If there was ever a time in our nation’s history for this it is now. We must form a legitimate coalition of all these conservative and liberty political factions produce a solid platform from our commonalities and set aside less important differences and begin taking seats in both the House and the Senate in order to counter the progressives from both currently dominant parties. Their are probably a handful already in the legislature that would welcome reinforcements and are tired of the likes of Boener et al. We must or this nation is dead for good.

  • http://mozilla robert e. lee

    the internal bickering must stop and we must band together to save our nation from obama…and his 52% minions [free loaders].

    • Robert Smith

      Do you consider retired military to be “free loaders?”

      Rob

      • Bruce R Porter Sr

        Yes!
        We’re responsible for a ton of “off the table” payments the American people are indebted for. That alleged $16,000,000,000,000 WE owe is just the tip of the iceberg……there is another $200,000,000,000,000+ of “unfunded liabilities” of which we and Social Security are the majority portion…….yeah, they promised us…..but didn’t put aside any money! Another part of the ponzi scheme called government.

        Bruce R Porter Sr
        Major US Army retired
        Combat wounded, Airborne, Ranger, Special Forces

      • Robespierre

        That is a typical Liberal comment done to confuse the argument. Who, except for Liberals in this country( draft dodgers all) would label retired military in that manner? Of course we have retired triple dipper brass that could be labeled as dippers at the trough of public funds.

      • Robert Smith

        Robes: “Liberals in this country( draft dodgers all)”

        Not me. No draft dodging here. I did 4 years in the USN. 1968 – 1972.

        Why do you apparently feel so compelled to be absolute?

        Rob

      • Mikey

        Robert, there is a huge difference between those that served this country, and those that expect free food, shelter and medical care, and contribute nothing to society. You are intentionally confusing the issue, and typical Alinsky move.

      • Robert Smith

        Posted by Robes: “Liberals in this country( draft dodgers all)”

        My answer: “Not me. No draft dodging here. I did 4 years in the USN. 1968 – 1972.”

        The truth isn’t any kind of “move,” it’s simply the truth that puts the lie of “draft dodgers all” in place.

        Why are you so dismissive of the truth?

        Rob

        • Deerinwater

          “Posted by Robes: “Liberals in this country( draft dodgers all)”

          WoW! That must be one tall ivory tower that affects you vision so. So how is the weather up there today?

      • Vicki

        Robert Smith writes:
        “Why do you apparently feel so compelled to be absolute?”

        Perhaps for the same reason you apparently feel compelled to denigrate a certain religion?

      • Nadzieja Batki

        Why are the retired military your concern? Who made you their spokesman?

      • Robert Smith

        Awwwww Vicki: “Perhaps for the same reason you apparently feel compelled to denigrate a certain religion?”

        What have I said that is in any way untrue?

        BTW, are you part of that transsubstriation thing? Eat any good saviors lately?

        Rob

      • Vicki

        Robert Smith writes:
        “What have I said that is in any way untrue?”

        Robert Smith: “Your brutal god”

      • Deerinwater

        Hmm? Well that depends on ones own understanding of God and what one gives God responsible for I suppose.

        For example, if one believes in the ever-after and that we were created and product of God. It’s safe to assume, you belong to God is this world and the next. Why then would it matter wish world you abide to God?

      • Robert Smith

        Here goes Vicki again. I’ve corrected her before so in my humble opinion she is lying deliberately: “Perhaps for the same reason you apparently feel compelled to denigrate a certain religion?”

        Nope, not the religion, just the knuckle headed followers who think EVERYONE should be part of it because THEIR ticket is being punched to their version of heaven by increasing the flocking thing.

        Rob

    • eddie47d

      There is no 52% “free loaders” yet if Conservatives continue to act high and mighty about everything they may also go the way of the dinosaur. If there is no difference between Democrats and Republicans yet they garnered the majority votes you (Conservatives/Libertarians) will continue to be cold cocked at the polls. You have to be more than the angry white man if you intend to gain much traction.

      • Hedgehog

        For shame Eddie, a racist slur; “the angry white man”.

      • Robert Smith

        It isn’t a “slur” if it’s true.

        Rob

      • Mikey

        Rob, once again, your ignorance is showing.

        You claim something to be true, with absolutely no knowledge of the subject matter. I have many Libertarian friends who are members of “minority” groups.

        In fact, the Libertarian who started the motorcycle group “Sons of Liberty Riders” happens to be Hispanic.
        http://www.sonsoflibertyriders.com

        Then there’s always Bob Parks, the conservative journalist who often speaks about the lies of the Dem/Rep paradigm. He happens to be African-American.
        http://www.black-and-right.com/all-about-me/

        And unlike you and many of the other Left wing fascists that infest this site, I back my comments with links so you can verify my comments.

      • Robert Smith

        What part of “angry” or “white man” do you dispute?

        Rob

      • Mikey

        Rob:
        I contest the wrongful assumption that Libertarians/Conservatives consist only of “White Males”. Stereotyping is just as bad as racism. You fascist leftists stereotype far more than any group I’ve encountered, bar none.

      • eddie47d

        The majority of voters who voted for Romney were white males just like the majority of blacks voted for Obama. Nothing racists except in the minds of foreigner hedgehog well maybe Mikey.

      • Nadzieja Batki

        The Dems/Progs/Leftists are using a new catch phrase of “angry white males”, does this surprise any Conservatives or Libertarians?

      • Marty S.

        Assuming they are now a new minority then they are certainly an entitled group with special rights and privileges correct?

      • Marty S.

        Eddie make no mistake believing this was even close to a legitimate election. The real goal was to play like Obama won. The NWO got results no matter which candidate ended up as president. These “elections” are the biggest scam ever perpetrated upon the U.S. people in history and it has been going on for decades.

    • nc

      Bobby, your “52%” tirade, which includes veterans, retired folks, good Americans who lost their jobs under bush but still want to work and those too infirm to work, was uttered also by your man Mitten and where is he today?? Working for Morman motels!!
      When Conservatives come to grips with the reality that the American people HAVE NEVER desired to be governed by your “true conservative” concepts yet have reached the position of number one in the world, should tell you there is a better way!I It’s called having the common sense to compromise to survive in the 21st century instead of being hide bound to the 18th century!

    • Daveh234

      Robert E. Lee in calling the people of the 52% is a disgrace to the American people. What a bigoted thing to say and completely untrue. We are all “We The People”.
      Ignorance doesn’t help the argument along.

  • markdashjohn

    Wake up, People.

    One LAST TIME; we are being HAD. This is, I repeat, NOT about “party.” It is about the “Them” vs. the “Us.”

    THE CONSTITUTION is our ‘Party.’ NOT the already-corrupted Tea Party, not the pubes. NOT the Protectionists.

    “Us” vs. “Them,” folks.

    Take your pick.

    • Robert Smith

      Who am I? An “us” or “them?”

      I’m for freedom of choice in firearms.

      I’m for freedom of choice in reproduction issues.

      I’m for freedom of choice in medical issues (as opposed to being “in plan.”)

      I’m for freedom of choice in recreational drugs (as it has mostly been throughout history).

      I’m for freedom in choice in end of life issues.

      Rob

      • Vicki

        “I’m for freedom of choice in reproduction issues.”

        While I am also for freedom of choice in reproduction issues I STRONGLY object to the murder of children as a solution to WRONG choices.

      • Robert Smith

        From Vicki: “I STRONGLY object to the murder of children as a solution to WRONG choices.”

        But it isn’t “murder.” Why would you lie about such a thing? Abortion is mostly throughout most of America.

        Ohhhhh, I get it! You are trying to FORCE your religion through law upon Americans who don’t follow your brutal god.

        Shucks Vicki, that is unConstitutional.

        Rob

      • Howlingmad

        ABORTION is “MURDER”, PERIOD ! . . . that’s for YOU, Mr SMITH. When it comes to LIFE or DEATH of the unborn, ( because of a woman’s STUPIDITY ) I don’t give a “RATS ASS”, about “YOUR” Constitutional rights.

      • GregS

        Robert Smith says:

        “You are trying to FORCE your religion through law…”

        The RIGHT TO LIFE is NOT a religion. It’s one of the most basic rights in the Constitution, stupid, and it precedes ALL other rights.

        BTW, the unborn child is a totally separate LIVING human organism. That is also NOT a religion. It’s science, stupid. Any textbook in embryology will tell you this.

      • Vicki

        Robert Smith says:
        “From Vicki: “I STRONGLY object to the murder of children as a solution to WRONG choices.”

        But it isn’t “murder.” Why would you lie about such a thing? Abortion is mostly throughout most of America.”

        Well as it happens it is murder. (Dictionary says murder is the unlawful killing of…) Abortion is the unlawful killing of a person (child, most innocent among us.) who has done no wrong. Committed no crime. At the moment it is thought to be legal but since killing of innocent people is most certainly against the very essence of the Constitution, any law making such killing “lawful” must be unconstitutional on its face. Since an unconstitutional law is null and void from it’s inception, abortion is the MURDER of a child.
        __________________

        Robert Smith pokes at a certain religion by saying:
        “Ohhhhh, I get it! You are trying to FORCE your religion through law upon Americans who don’t follow your brutal god.

        Shucks Vicki, that is unConstitutional.”

        Can’t be unconstitutional since the Constitutions primary reason for existing is protecting LIFE, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. You are aware that children are people too?

        Think of it this way. That “brutal” God that you grumble about has convinced his faithful to not kill Robert Smith because he is an un-believer. That “brutal” God has convinced us to come to your aid if someone does try. Do you really want us to stop “forcing” our religion on on them?

      • Marty S.

        Choice in firearms as in squirt gun vs. super soaker?

  • Craig Wettstein

    If 16 Repubs were to “abstain” from voting for Boehner as Speaker, he’ld be gone. At which point a true “conservative could be elected in January!!!

    • Marty S.

      How about Justin Amash from Michigan?

  • michael

    There is a lot here I agree with. I believe that in the primary, you support the best available person, electable or not. As far as the last election goes, I for one am one of
    those who as you describe, gritted his teeth and voted for Romney as a less-damaging alternative to the worst president in history. History shows that this system is rigged to play out in a manner whereas BOTH parties get stuck with the worst available person, or lowest common denominator. What else can we realistically do but pick the “best” of the two available?

    • Steve E

      To get true conservatives, you need to elect them in the national primaries, but the sheeple don’t do that. They always pick the establishment which is too bad. However it is easier to get conservatives elected at the state and local levels. That is what is going on in my state in some areas.

      • Vicki

        “They (the sheeple) always pick the establishment which is too bad…”

        Judging from all the things the leaders of the Republican party did to keep out the quite popular Dr Ron Paul I think you would find that it is the elite and not the “sheeple” that always pick the “establishment”.

      • Jason B

        I voted for Ron Paul in the Primaries. I have come to the conclusion that as stated above, we have to make changes at the state levels. We have to elect people who will have the fortitude and will to take back the rights of their state. If we do that, the we nullify the idiots at the federal level.

  • Deerinwater

    Ouch! An indictment on solid ground. Try being a democrat to have an appreciation for their handy work. Foxed News media is a proxy extension of the GOP but where it’s for power or position, I don’t know and I guess that it really doesn’t matter.

    • http://www.facebook.com/tony.newbill1 Tony Newbill

      deer in water , Fox News Fox Business , Wall Street Journal , Wall Street in General is a proxy for ” Multi National ” Business right ? Thats why we see them saying Nothing about a change in the tax code that can help Small Business compete with these Market Flooding Multi Nationals who are Making the USA a SERFDOM Nation !!!!! The Multi Nationalism of the way the international businesses have Lobbied over the years is with selfish greed for control over their market and they have done this with unfair trade policy that gave them control and can’t help themselves because thats the way their Business Model is set up , it feeds on itself destruction . We need to find a way to enable small business to be a Bigger player in the process and what they could do is be a Bigger innovator and Parts Originator of New Innovation that can then be the ” Proving Ground for advancement of Technology for the Mulit national sector and a Tax Code that Rewards and Creates Incentives to drive this would also create more Jobs !!!!!

      The Tax Code needs to be adjusted to change the Unfairness that these Volume Importers of Manipulated values of Trade Goods that Small Business in the USA cannot access and Compete with on a domestic Production level and sell into the same markets and that is where the Problem is . Read this article , http://theintelhub.com/2012/12/09/how-to-create-20-million-jobs-in-the-us/ , it TOTALLY describes the Problem and the Need to change the Tax code to Level the Markets Playing field between Small Business and Tariff Free Importers who flood the Retail market and are Crowding out any opportunity for small Business to have any change at all !!!

      • Deerinwater

        You bet Tony, the “fix is in” ~ Status Quo is to be persevered while big business will make the claim that they suffer from Status Quo. ~ while many voters that would vote a Republican ticket would eat this “contrived message” up.

        It’s the damnest thing to witness as we see people vote against their own self interest and vote the vote of the entitled elite believing they are best served while making claims a poor man has never gave them a job as justification.

        Anyone, the wealthy, the poor, the elite, the working man will cut you out of any deal they find you as unnecessary. ~ That is life ~ it common sense and not political.

        If big business, small business or large or small government can finds us “unnecessary” , we can expect to be “left out” ~ while the markets are to be controlled ~ by supply and demand forces. ~ When an interest becomes large enough they attempt to corner markets and kill off completion with legislation via lobbyist and media appealing to the court of public opinion as we cut our own throats by defending this practice.

        Crazy but true.

        • edrankin

          yes…

        • http://www.facebook.com/tony.newbill1 Tony Newbill

          Deer in Water , without major changes in USA Monetary and tax code policies to the way small business or any business can value full production in the USA to be competitive with world producers and it be accepted by the International Banking cartel that controls the medium of exchanges in currency settlements for traded goods , I don’t see how the USA does not continue in decline and soon eventual default as we are being forced to devalue our labor costs now that credit is gone to be competitive in the world trade of goods .

          • Deerinwater

            Again, I agree 100%. ~ It appears that the illusion of being at the top of the Dung pile is what seems to matter the most with today’s Americans holds to the notion that rising water will floats all boats. ~ While I’m not so sure that this same water in rising everywhere.

            I say to today’s Americans, ~ look around , look outside our nation, look at the huge ambitious projects taking place all over Europe and Asia as they invest in their “people” and infrastructure. While today the US can boost of War on Terror, NASA and Boston’s “big dig” ( our last crowning achievement in civil projects) that I am aware of .

            America’s wealth is in her people, while this extreme far right elects views them as a liability and to be contended with in a begrudging fashion.

            If the far right plans and ideas are indicative of our future direction, indeed ~ we have lost our way as a nation of people with one God and liberty and Justice for All.

            This notion of a nations need to control the creation of it money is a sound one. I do not oppose creating the language to discuss it. Ron Paul has offered us a view, he has cracked open this door for that serious discussion might begin. ~ While this reformed whore attitude of willing to past harsh judgement on others in being slow to accept these views serves no one.

            I do not subscribe to all that Ron Paul puts forth, but many of them I most certainly do.

      • Deerinwater

        Thank you some very much Tony ~ I will look into this ~ It looks as if it might take me a while to absorb ~ it’s vast, it global.

  • Bob666

    Bob,
    I have to tell you that I have read this and as usual, I’m laughing my A*s off. What a bubble you live in! The GOP has only carried the popular vote in one out of the last six presidential elections because the party was hijacked by the extreme right. Those of us in main stream America don’t buy into the Tea Party and that does not mean that we are not patriots, it means that we respect the concept of democracy.

    “W” was a bumbling idiot and McCain is a good man who picked a pin headed bimbo with intellectual capacity of a cumquat as VP to appease a small but vocal group of extreme nut cases who want a world that looks just like they envision. The problem with that is; the majority don’t buy into that vision and in a democracy-you lose.

    If the GOP wants to survive, they need to shed off the pro-life, religious right and get back to the constitution. That is government of ALL people by ALL people for ALL people, not just old white people who go to a Christian church. If the GOP wants to survive, they will need to embrace ALL faiths and that includes those of NO faith and Islam.

    There are many of us who dwell in the middle who vote for the best qualified person without regard to the party they belong to. We tend to pursue true liberty and don’t believe that we have the right to tell your wife or daughter what choices they can make regarding their reproductive rights. And I guarantee you that we tend to be proponents of small and very limited government that have very limited rights to our wallets.

    You need to come out of the bubble and see the real world before you become extinct.

    • Warrior

      Boy oh boy bobbo, you are one conflicted individual! 666?

      • Right Brain Thinker

        And you are a perfect example of NOT being “conflicted”, Warrior—–you’ve got the answers and NOBODY is going to get you to listen to anything that you KNOW is wrong. How comfortable that must be.

      • Steve E

        Bob’s article is referring to people like Bob666 who just made that clear. Being in the middle is the same as being between good and bad with no conviction.

      • Right Brain Thinker

        Steve E says: “Being in the middle is the same as being between good and bad with no conviction”.

        Steve, looks like you missed the point. Bob is saying that he has enough conviction that he will sit in the middle and try to make good choices between good and bad, as have those folks who have swung the last two presidential elections to the Dems. Those who blindly adhere to dogma and think that pulling the GOP further to the right will learn that they will LOSE even more people in the middle if they don’t look to the middle. They may make more hits in the circular firing squad parties but they won’t win elections doing that.

      • Bob666

        Wow,
        Most of you must have read this before medication time. First, I don’t feel the least bit conflicted, I deal in the real world. Also, I use the 666 and an ectogram. I am amused by the number of people who read something into it and I have to believe that it is driven by fear. Finally, the world is many shades of grey, not Black or White, Right or Wrong, Good or Bad, it’s Grey!

        Our founding fathers desired a government that respected and promoted religious freedom without a state sponsored religion. I would reinforce this by observing the sheer number of various forms of the protestant church and even in every group, there are both conservative and liberal groups of each.

        As far as abortion goes, I personally believe it to be the very last choice that a woman cshould make, but also believe that it is the right and the choice of the individual, not the society that individual lives in. It is interesting to me that most of the people who preach liberty and freedom and small government are the first to desire to limit a woman’s reproductive rights. Kind of an oxymoron if you think about it.

        People need to operate and think out of mutual respect and freedom, not fear and ignorance.

        JMHO

      • Vicki

        Bob666 writes:
        “It is interesting to me that most of the people who preach liberty and freedom and small government are the first to desire to limit a woman’s reproductive rights”

        It is interesting to me that most of the people who preach liberty and freedom and big government and are for a woman’s reproductive rights are the first to desire to MURDER children that result when a woman fails to responsibly exercise her reproductive rights.

      • Robert Smith

        Here blathers Vicki again: “are the first to desire to MURDER children that result when a woman fails to responsibly exercise her reproductive rights.”

        Ain’t “murder.” Quit lying that it is. In most of America abortion is legall.

        In YOUR religion it might be “murder” but you ain’t allowed to force your religion upon me or anyone else. It’s unConstitutional.

        Please quit advocating against the Constitution and lying even if you worship of your brutal god calls it a “sin.”

        Rob

        • Deerinwater

          Please describe the victim?

      • Mikey

        Robert, let’s see if you can follow some logic:
        From the moment of conception, when the sperm fertilizes the egg, the cell changes. It now has it’s own DISTINCT and different DNA. It does not bear the same DNA as the mother or the father, a new and different human being. It is no longer simply a cell or group of cells in the mother, it’s DNA dictates that it is a separate human being, even if it has not developed at all.
        By committing abortion (removing the embryo or fetus), the embryo can no longer survive outside the mother, and quickly dies. Therefore, you are ending a human life. How is this not wrong? Just because it is legal, doesn’t necessarily make it right.
        Women should be able to make choices about their bodies, like choosing not to become pregnant in the first place. Ending another innocent human life should not be a choice they should make, (unless it somehow endangers them, then in can probably be considered self defense).
        And of course, their is always the choice of adoption.

      • Mikey

        Correction: THERE is always the choice of adoption.

      • GregS

        Robert Smith says:

        “Please quit advocating against the Constitution…”

        Defending the RIGHT TO LIFE is NOT “advocating against the Constitution,” Robert. In case you haven’t heard, the RIGHT TO LIFE is one of the most basic rights in the Constitution, and it precedes ALL other rights.

      • Vicki

        Robert Smith, having nothing useful to contribute starts with an ad hominem attack by saying:
        “Here blathers Vicki again: ”

        Then says: “Ain’t “murder.” Quit lying that it is. In most of America abortion is legall.”

        I grant you the definition of “murder” is the unlawful killing of…”
        http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/murder

        In most Islamic countries it is legal to terminate gay offspring. It is legal to terminate a disobedient child (usually female). It is legal to terminate a Muslim who has renounced their faith.

        Since our Constitution was created to protect Life, Liberty and the PURSUIT of happiness it is rather incompatible with Islam and with abortion hence the legality of abortion is unconstitutional.

      • Deerinwater

        Well Micky, DNA is not a person as you seem to suggest that it is.

        And Micky, men can make the “choice” to not plant the seed of life just as easily as a woman can.

        You would want for “smaller” government that has powers to overlord human body functions.

        I don’t think that’s a good idea for once allowed in, government will not stop.

      • GregS

        Deerinwater says:

        “Well Micky, DNA is not a person as you seem to suggest that it is.”

        The word, “person,” is merely a legal term of art, and it has absolutely nothing to do with SCIENCE. It is associated with an IDEOLOGY in force at the time of its definition.

        I did not get the impression that Mikey was even “suggest[ing]” that DNA is a “person.” All he said was:

        “…it’s DNA dictates that it is a separate human being…”

        This is scientifically correct, and it simply means the the newly formed cell (NOT just the DNA) is totally separate from her parents (because she has her own unique genome), and she is also human, beacuse of her DNA.

        • Deerinwater

          So an egg is a chicken or could be a chicken?

      • Mikey

        Once the egg is fertilized, yes, it is technically a new, individual, chicken….albeit not very developed, but nonetheless a new life.

        • Deerinwater

          Well, this attempting to locate and identify the very moment that separates the day from the night, we find there is no single event while you attempt to suggest there is.

          I know what a chicken looks like Mikey.

      • Mikey

        And yes, Deerinwater, men should be held every bit as responsible for their actions as women. I certainly understand desire, but it must be tempered with a little responsibility so that abortions doesn’t have to be a issue.

        • Deerinwater

          Nobel thought, but not very realistic where is comes to the animal instinct to mate up. Natures power overrides such notions of “noble”. It always has been and always will be so. For what need would there be of Jesus if it were not?

          To offer a cure where there is no illness makes little sense.

      • Mikey

        So are you saying, “if it feels good, do it.” and “to hell with the consequences of my actions”?
        I know personal responsibility for ones actions, is not a strong suit for liberals. Unfortunately, that type of selfishness effects everyone around them. And in this case, the selfishness takes the life of an unborn child.

      • GregS

        Deerinwater says:

        “I know what a chicken looks like Mikey.”

        No, apparently you don’t. Just because you can’t see the chicken embryo inside that egg, it does NOT mean that it’s not a chicken. The DNA dictates that a chicken (NOT a robin, or a dog, or a cat) is developing inside the egg.

        All plants and animals go through various stages of development throughout their ENTIRE lives. Different stages of devlopment do not dictate a plant or animal’s identity. DNA does.

        • Deerinwater

          Well? DNA is not a chicken either. Without getting into subject that your are not actually prepared to discuss while you seem to think so.

      • GregS

        “DNA is not a chicken…???” Where did you get that??? NO ONE ever said that DNA is a chicken.

        It’s quite clear that YOU are the one who’s “not actually prepared to discuss” the subject.

        • Deerinwater

          If DNA is not a chicken as you say, than too it is not a “person” which end the debate about DNA being a person. Argument concluded and no more discussion required.

      • GregS

        The fact is that NO ONE ever said that DNA is a “person.” If you recall, near the beginning of this discussion, I said the following:

        I did not get the impression that Mikey was even “suggest[ing]” that DNA is a “person.” All he said was:

        “…it’s DNA dictates that it is a separate human being…”

        Now tell me where in this thread did either Mikey or I ever say that “DNA is a person?”

        We said that DNA DICTATES what a chicken is, and what a human is, but we NEVER said that DNA IS a chicken or a human.

        With regard to the word “person,” if you recall, I said that it’s a legal term of art, rather than a scientific term.

        Now we can say that the argument is concluded.

      • Mikey

        Nice try Greg, but we’re dealing with people on this site who couldn’t pass high school biology to save their lives. I wouldn’t waste any more keystrokes on deerinwater, he’s unteachable.

        • Deerinwater

          Mikey! fear not! you have nothing to waste.

      • Deerinwater

        I’m just a key stroke from tying your ass in a knot and you elect to disengage , how quaint.

      • Mikey

        I’m sorry simple logic and biology escapes you, apparently selfishness does not. It’s just too bad so many innocent lives are lost because the laws are supported by illogical, selfish fools like yourself.

      • GregS

        Very well stated, Mikey!

      • Deerinwater

        Anatomy and Physiology 101 ~ with lab ~ is a basic requirement for anyone wishing to enter the health care profession. It’s a humbling monster that I managed to struggle through with less than flattering grades~ All of your questions are answered in this core study. ~ You clear this bar, ~ then you are looking at tackling Chemistry where a student finds out just how bright they really are.

        Go for it ~ smart person, educate yourself and quite spreading your manure about.

    • Cliffystones

      “If the GOP wants to survive, they need to shed off the pro-life, religious right and get back to the constitution. That is government of ALL people by ALL people for ALL people, not just old white people who go to a Christian church.

      Explain to us how an unborn child doesn’t qualify as one of those “ALL people”. I suppose you’re right. We should ALL just ignore our values and vote for the winning horse.

      • Deerinwater

        Well? ~ We can’t say this is the first time that people as yourselves have refuse the message.

      • Right Brain Thinker

        You illustrate the narrower “values” mindset when you focus on abortion and ignore the bigger picture painted by the article.

        My background in biological science tells me that a fertilized human egg will become a free-living human being if the development process is not interrupted. Same thing with a duck or a fish or a frog or a snake. I have more than a little trouble discovering where the “soul” is found in the body or when it “arrives”. So, I don’t approve of abortion except for the few “good” reason,s but I leave it to the religionists to say whether it’s murder or not. It’s between God and the parents and their consciences and should not be something the federal government involves itself in.

        The religious right needs to understand that they are being used by the plutocracy and the corporate oligarchy. The builders of the corporate fascist state have used social values as a tool to enlist you as their foot soldiers in their fight, just as they have coopted the Tea Party’s fight for smaller government and greater fiscal responsibility. What you are really fighting for is their right to be untaxed, unregulated, and unhindered as they take control of the country. Bob says some good things in this article but he is “thrashing” a bit in frustration—-I don’t have a much better answer for the GOP but forming a third party will NOT get it done.

      • nc

        Cliffy, are here any “true Republicans” and what do they stand for and when did it start? They claim to vote against Democrats because of the Roe V Wade decision like it is some sort of Democrat creation when, in fact, it is more of a Republican creation!

      • nc

        Cliffy, there are a lot of Americans, including me, that feel that an “unborn late term child” needs protection but also feel the woman bearing the child should have some “protection” also> Therefore we try very hard to make sure that those who would ban ALL abortions DO NOT GAIN the power to take away THOSE RIGHTS FROM AN ADULT AND GIVE THEM TO A HANDFULL OF CELLS! ESPECIALLY AN ADULT CITIZEN WHO HAS PAID HER DUES TO BE PROTECTED NOT TO MENTION HAVING ASSUMED THE RESPONCIBILITY OF CHILDREN SHE HAS ALREADY GIVEN BIRTH TO!

        DOES THE GOVERNMENT HAVE THE RIGHT TO TAKE AWAY THEIR MOTHER WHO HAS COMMITTED NO CRIME AND IS OF SOUND MINE??? YOU WILL ADMIT THAT THERE ARE THOSE BY THE MILLIONS WHO WOULD BAN ALL ABORTIONS IF GIVEN THE OPPORTUNITY!! NO??? WOULD YOU????

      • Robert Smith

        From Cliffy: “Explain to us how an unborn child doesn’t qualify as one of those “ALL people”.”

        Not a “child” except in the context of religion or the mother having defined it as such.

        Ain’t a “human being” until your brutal god breaths life in at the end of the birth process.

        Remember, he created the earth and sky, made it light, made the animals, and then finally after making the body breathed “life” into it.

        Rob

      • Robert Smith

        Ohhhhhhhh, Cliffy, I have more!

        “After God formed man in Genesis 2:7, He “breathed into his nostrils the breath of life and it was then that the man became a living being”. Although the man was fully formed by God in all respects, he was not a living being until after taking his first breath.

        Oh, and check this out: In Exodus 21:22 it states that if a man causes a woman to have a miscarriage, he shall be fined; however, if the woman dies then he will be put to death. It should be apparent from this that the aborted fetus is not considered a living human being since the resulting punishment for the abortion is nothing more than a fine; it is not classified by the bible as a capital offense.”

        So, the bible babble doesn’t count killing a fetus as “murder.”

        Sheesh… Can’t even get your own “reference” correct.

        Rob

      • GregS

        Robert Smith says:

        “Not a ‘child’ except in the context of religion or the mother having defined it as such.

        Ain’t a ‘human being’ until your brutal god breaths life in at the end of the birth process.

        …So, the bible babble doesn’t count killing a fetus as “murder.”

        Sheesh… Can’t even get your own “reference” correct.”

        From all of your rants about abortion, Robert, it’s quite clear that it’s YOU who are the religious zealot.

        As I’ve said before, the unborn child (fetus) is a totally separate LIVING HUMAN ORGANISM, as are we all. That’s NOT religion. It’s science, stupid. Look it up in any textbook on embryology.

        Furthermore, the RIGHT TO LIFE is the most basic right in the Constitution, and it precedes ALL other “rights.”

    • Right Brain Thinker

      Well said, Bob, even if the 666 makes me wonder a bit—I hope it means “devil’s advocate” rather than devil’s disciple. LOL

      Circular firing squads DO tend to lead to extinction—-the folks on the lunatic “right” may or may not learn that in time. We who hope for the survival of the nation can always hope they don’t.

      • Vicki

        The trick to a circular firing squad is to use low penetration rounds and be able to hit the target. Extra safety can be exercised by having an odd number of members of the squad properly positioned around the circle.

      • Right Brain Thinker

        Good one, Vicki

        And the last man standing after the circular firing squad parties is the one you run for president! Only he has been hit by so many “low penetration” rounds that he is punchy and can’t find any real ammo when the real battle begins—-he keeps mixing up his rounds and one goes left while the next goes right and the next is a dud.

        So, he ends up being hit by the high velocity armor piercing rounds of his opponent and becomes a KIA. (It’s like the contrast between a BB gun and .30-06 AP) LOL

      • Robert Smith

        Vicky,

        Why doesn’t it surprise me that you would “correct” someone about a circular firing squad?

        Rob

      • Vicki

        ???

        I made no correction to RBT. He said that they tend to lead to extinction and they do. I explained how to reduce the tendency. CFS still tends to lead to extinction, just not as dramatically if proper procedures are followed.

    • Jim

      I agree with Bob, Roe v Wade has dominated our supreme court appointments for over 40 years while our civil liberties have been taken away to help fight the drug war. We need to go back to the constitution of the 50′s and let people live as they choose if it dosen’t impose on another persons liberty.
      I don’t have a problem with letting the people that have controled our government and got us in this debt mess pay to get us out of it.

      • Right Brain Thinker

        And has anyone noticed that the Supremes have NOT overturned Roe v. Wade even when they had enough right-leaning horses to get it done?. Could it be that the right wing not doing so has kept the “social values” folks on their side? So that the plutocracy and corporate oligarchy could bury their real agenda?

      • Vicki

        Or it could mean that the court is not right leaning at all.

      • Right Brain Thinker

        Vicki,
        You are a laugh riot today—–ever think of doing standup?

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          It is not our Constitution that has changed (legally) from the 50′s. It is the unconstitutional, hence illegal bills, laws, etc that the corrupt representatives have been passing off as “law” while dumbing down the populace so that they cannot even critically think.

          Basically the jobs assigned to the President are the same. Just like being assigned to clean your room as a child, it matters not if your room is in a shack, in a house, in a palace or in a space ship – the tools you use to do the job might change a bit, but the job is still the same – get the room clean.

          So when a president is supposed to enforce constitutional laws, and not those that are unconstitutional – that NEVER changes. When congress is supposed to write legislation that is in pursuance of the US Constitution – that never changes what ever time period we are in. When the Supreme justices are supposed to make sure that every law, bill, amendment meets the requirements of the Constitution, individual liberty – that NEVER changes what ever the time period.

          When a president gives authority to the UN over the USA – that is treason on the presidents part (a power no one in the federal or state governments have). When he sends a letter that he has done so to Boehner – and Boehner does nothing,that is treason on both their parts. When Obama, Panetta, and Dempsey say that the UN has authority over the USA in front of and to the Senate. When the senate does nothing about the treason – then all have committed treason. When they have given authority to the UN over the USA as a nation and over the US Military – they have all overstepped any power given to them and need to be arrested and held for prosecution.

          When the representatives do nothing about treason, it is up to the state governments to arrest and hold them for prosecution. If those in the state governments refuse to do their duty, then it is up to the people to arrest and hold them for prosecution and to IMMEDIATELY replace all of the above.

          That is what our government, the Constitution of the United States of America requires of those who are a part of that government, including the sovereign people.

    • Hedgehog

      Bob666;

      So you believe in the concept of democracy! Then call it by its true name, Tyranny of the majority. The biggest gang in the country. In your 21st century government is certainly not by what is in the best interest of your country, but by force. Where in blazes did you get the idea that “Might makes right”, that is not democracy! True Democracy is government by consensus, not by force. Learn the difference or die! Your Republic is not a democracy, it operates by “consent of the governed”. Again learn the difference or die by the weapons of those who do not consent. By my reading of the statistics, you people are perilously close to civil unrest and bloody revolution. I hope I am wrong, but when I see someone boldly proclaiming himself a servant of the Antichrist (666) and prating of true democracy, I begin to despair.

      • Right Brain Thinker

        Hedgehog brings out more tired old axes to grind:
        “Tyranny of the majority”—-. “Might makes right”—–”Your Republic is not a democracy” I think Bob understand well that we are a representative democracy—-why doesn’t H-Hog?

        H-Hog says. “By my reading of the statistics, you people are perilously close to civil unrest and bloody revolution”.
        If it happens, it will be the fault of those who want to overthrow the republic and make it into a corporate fascist state “You people” are the 99%, H-Hog.

        H-Hog says “I hope I am wrong, but when I see someone boldly proclaiming himself a servant of the Antichrist (666) and prating of true democracy, I begin to despair”.
        When I see someone who can’t even entertain the idea that 666 means “devil’s advocate”, I wonder why they have no sense of humor. And I despair at those who would read into Bob’s words what they want to see rather than what Bob said—he did NOT come close to even mentioning “true democracy”, never mind “prate” about it.

      • Bob666

        Tyranny of the majority?

        defined-Democracy is a form of government in which all citizens have an equal say in the decisions that affect their lives. Democracy allows citizens to participate equally—either directly or through elected representatives—in the proposal, development, and creation of laws. It encompasses social, economic and cultural conditions that enable the free and equal practice of political self-determination.

        Mr.Hedgehog, just curious, what is your definition? in a demorcay, The majoriety rules.

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          Democracy: 5 kids on the playground want to play volleyball. 5 kids want to play football. 5 want to swing. 6 want to play baseball. All have to play baseball.

          Majority ruled. But it was messed with the rest who did not want what they wanted.

          Constitutional Republic (with no treasonous slimesuckers): You have the right to life. Because you have the right to life you may not take anothers life. You have the right to own property (land, cars, stuff). Because you have the right to own proplerty you may not take anothers property. You have the right to free speech as long as it doesn’t deliberately cause harm to another, etc. You have the right to own a weapon because you have the right to DEFEND yourself and your property – look at right to life… because most times peace officers do not get there until AFTER a crime is committed; and becuase sometimes those in government hate not being Kings and Dictators telling you how to life your life.

          Simplistic.

          PS Read Agenda 21 – what is going on here in the USA is much worse – it puts us all into slavery – literally. Progressive definition of “Freedom” is that you will be freed from the burden of making decisions for yourself. They will decide when you get up, when you go to sleep, what you eat, where you will lve, what job you will do, how many hours you will work, if you get a break, they will give you what you will be allowed to wear, only hear what they want you to hear, watch, etc; You will own NOTHING, not even the clothes they allow you to wear. Think I am kidding, READ Agenda 21, READ UN, did you watch Obama’s ‘Julia’? You should ahve. They put her thru school, gave her a job, when she retired THEY allowed her to work in the community garden – NOT her own garden – she owned nothing. Her whole life was decided by them. Romney is just as bad.

          • Deerinwater

            Kansas Bright says, “Simplistic.
            PS Read Agenda 21 – what is going on here in the USA is much worse – it puts us all into slavery – literally. Progressive definition of “Freedom” is that you will be freed from the burden of making decisions for yourself. They will decide when you get up, when you go to sleep, what you eat, where you will live, what job you will do, how many hours you will work, ”

            LOL~ ! Most fitting Handle, sound like a Kansas Dairy Farmer , just replace the word “progressives” with “Cows” .

            I think you might be a victim of the notion that the two parties, democrats and republican or conservatives and progressive are complete opposites and diametrically opposed to one another.

            While they are “in word” opposed to each other, it’s not due to just their deeds or behavior but the food chain, pecking order and setting arrangements.

            Cows and horses are no different, they know their place, know when it is under attack and have their own way of protesting. You ever see a cow put her back hoof in a milk bucket and kick it across the barn?

          • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

            Yes, I have. I have ridden many horses, attended many colleges that I paid for myself, including some of the “best” in the world.

            I make sure that I think for myself, and read what is being pushed so I know what it REALLY says.

            And you? Any schooling? Do you ride? Ever milk a cow? Read any of the great literature? Study anything or always let yourself be told what to think? Know more then one language?

            Never mind all that, got any facts for me? Like I handed to you?

          • Deerinwater

            Kansas say’s ; “Never mind all that, got any facts for me? Like I handed to you?”

            With such an education I would think that you would know the difference between facts and commentary .

            Forgive me for toying with your commentary but it was so tempting and just too hard to ignore.

            Don’t take it too serious, ~ I certainly didn’t. I am sure you are a bright opinionated man.

          • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

            You are wrong on the “man” part. Bright, maybe. More that I am willing to put in what it takes to learn, to read through boring bills, etc; track down information listen to the senate and congressional meetins (when we are alowed to), listen to parliament, etc. To be informed takes effort. To be well informed takes a lot of effort. Instead of TV, etc, I research, take classes, study on my own. I listen to those I like, and most importantly I listen to those I don’t like. I read every comment so that I learn from those who have learned things I have not.

            You are here, you are posting, you are learning as are we all, that is in itself important. We are all communicating.

      • Vicki

        Right Brain Thinker writes:
        ” I think Bob understand well that we are a representative democracy—-why doesn’t H-Hog? ”

        Perhaps cause we are not. We just happen to be (assuming you are talking about the United States of America) a Constitutionally LIMITED Republic. It is not enough to be a Republic as that just means we have a few hundred tyrants ~3000 miles away (assumes you live on the west coast :) ). The creation of a Republic with a Constitution to limit the powers of the government is the essential element of what made the United States of America both unique and very very successful for many years.
        http://michaelburns1963.wordpress.com/2009/01/12/what-type-of-government-does-america-have/

        Then the progressives came.

      • Deerinwater

        Kansas says, “To be informed takes effort. To be well informed takes a lot of effort. Instead of TV, etc, I research, take classes, study on my own. I listen to those I like, and most importantly I listen to those I don’t like. I read every comment so that I learn from those who have learned things I have not.”

        I say, Well said Kansas, I wish more were like you, even with your predisposition to think progressives are that much different from yourself and using unflattering and misinformed language in the attempt to justice your bias.

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          Progressives got its “hold” on the US federal government starting with Wilson. Roosevelt put many more progressive actions into ply then poor Wilson did. Truthfully, I could live with, not like, but live with both Wilson’s and Rosevelt’s concept of progressivism. Even though he brought the Federal Reserve into ‘life’ here – something he totally regretted, thought he sold his country out. Turns out he was correct.

          Todays “progressive” is not a true progressive, but a mix of Hitler and Stalin with a bit of Pol Pot using the Democratic, then liberal, now progressive name. Basically they are the tools of a group wanting world domination.

          How can I prove what I say without pages of notes? This way, Agenda 21. Let me teach you what it is, how it destroys our nation, and enslaves our people, and gives those who want world domination (One World Government, etc) the USA without a shot being fired. Showing what I will post below is true is a few of the states that have BANNED Agenda 21.
          The Alabama Senate Bill (SB) 477 legislation, known as the “Due Process for Property Rights” Act. Tennessee, New Hampshire, in Kansas a resolution was approved that quashed Agenda 21 from taking over the state. Arizona House of Representatives voted down a ban that resembles the NH ban, Louisiana, Texas, etc.

          UN’s Agenda 21 – a progressive movement started years ago and supported by Obama and his adminstration, and Romney.

          Agenda 21 is a plan to… , implement controls on how to govern the populous and make decisions for the people of the USA and the world through actions taken by the UN”. Their focus is on the global impact of use of land, education and depopulation through control measures including: eliminating personal property rights, private education (including home schooling) and eugenics (forced sterility) in order to have organized global harvesting of the planet under UN control.

          The UN is planning to take over conservation and management of the world’s resources for their developmental purposes. By abolishing personal property rights, the demise of rural area living, removal of personal ownership of natural resource; this will take away the power from individuals and place it firmly in the hands of the governments who have agreed to UN control.

          How is this being done here? What effects will it have in America and on all people living here?

          It is being done here through legislation, rules, regulations, zoning, planning and regional planning; things that impact individuals property rights through the use of the German based ICLEI programs. Some other private organizations in league with ICLEI are the: National League of Cities, International City/County Management Group, National Governors Association, American Planning Group and many more.They are implementing rules and regulations throughout the States, regions, and communities through zoning, planning and regional planning; things that impact our property rights.

          Also used is monitoring energy usage (SMART meters), behaviors, big brother style controls, and re-education (brainwashing with propaganda); as well as restricting local governments by installing their own leaders voted into office by a coerced consensus.

          President Obama, who supports the UN’s Agenda 21 initiative, signed the executive order Establishing a White House Council on Strong Cities, Strong Communities . He outlined plans to partner with local communities and the US government to “provide them with comprehensive technical assistance to use and compete for Federal resources”. Obama claims that only with regional collaboration and comprehensive planning with the US government will stabilize economic growth, create jobs, and lead to sustainable redevelopment of our American cities. This rhetoric is nearly copied directly from the Agenda 21 documents from past Earth Summits.

          It will end individual property ownership, business ownership, car ownership, etc. No one is to be allowed to live in rural areas, nor own any type of natural resource. All people will be moved to “communities” to live; leaving and creating more unpopulated areas for UN uses (stealing) of US natural resources, etc.

          No more owning property to raise animals, hay, food, etc. Our children will no longer have the family property to raise their animals, gardens for FFA, or 4-H, or any other activity that requires the individual use of property. We get to “contribute” it to the community. Yes, contribute it, all will be taken from us for the good of the “community” and the world.

          There will be “community gardens” as shown in Obama’s “Julia”. She gets to retire to work in the “community garden”. NOT her own garden, but the community garden.

          In Obama’s and the UN’s eyes – The community good is everything (think ant farm). Individual rights, wants, property ownership, human ownership of anything is bad as the government will provide all for you; all ‘individual needs’ must be changed to ‘community needs’ – no one needs to think of their self and what they need, but what they can do for the community good. Everyone will work for the community good; no more individual rights, cars, gardens, farms, koi ponds, horseback riding, etc. No individual business ownership as the UN corporations will handle all of that.

          The government will provide all you need. They will “free” you from every having tomake a decsion for yourself again.They will tell you want you can eat, and when. What type of work you will do for the community, how many hours, when and if you get breaks and lunches, all donated by you and overseen by a “master” .. sorry… overseer.
          There will be NO paychecks, as you are now working for the community/world good not your selfish wants.

          Do the research, it is all there.

      • deerinwater

        Kansas, ~ forgive me for being so slow to respond to you lengthy articulate posting. It was not an attempt to ignore you and your thought provoking post.

        You have indeed done the study and I’m willing to concur with much of what you present. For what you say is true, ~ if the human race is found sturdy enough to live that long, to thrive, prosper , develop and multiply much of what you offer will come to past.

        At some point in the far future there will be one overlord overriding government. What you failed to offer us is a time frame and the many stages and steps this with require.

        My guess it will be 500 to 900 years from now. By this point in time, what we see as important today will no long hold the same value or importance, notions of autonomy and sovereignty will shift away from what we think of today. It will not be today’s world but a world of tomorrow. ~ For better or worse. Much change is afoot.

        If we pause for a moment and think back 500 years. ~ Of the early 1600′s, there were only a small hand full of men in the world that knew how to circumnavigate the globe in small wooden ships. The act of sailing from Europe to China was an adventure preformed by few. It was a closely guarded secret kept by no more then 5 men. And even then , arrival to any sought destination was no guarantee.

        There was a time, I once enjoyed Science Fiction novels, ~ the things you speak of can be found there in their pages.

        The concept of “Mine” will go through some serious change as today you speak of an Ayn Rand’s “mine”. Tomorrows concept of “mine” will be different.

        Uncomfortable thoughts for 21st century man to be certain. Not to mention a Conservative 21st Century man. We might fight and attempt to delay it ~ it’s only natural that we should. We might well win some battle but in the end it will be a war we will loose, while of course both you and I will be long dead.

        I enjoyed your posting Kansas.

        Live long and prosper

    • Jibbs

      http://search.yahoo.com/search?fr=mcafee&p=is+the+uniteg+states+a+republic+or+democracy

      ARE WE A DEMOCRACY OR A REPUBLIC?

      Is the United States a democracy or a republic? Unfortunately, the answer is politically and definitively confusing. Our form of government is both a democracy and a republic. Fortunately, the debate is beginning all over again and it was started by ordinary people who feel that our government is out of control.

      Dictionaries contain slightly different definitions of a democracy and a republic. However, most dictionaries agree that a democracy is government by the people, exercised either directly or through elected representatives.

      A republic has two forms and definitions. A republic can be a form of government with an elected president instead of a monarch, or a form of government with an elected president and elected representatives responsible to the people.

      Webster’s Encyclopedic Dictionary of the English Language brings a democracy and a republic closer together by defining a republic as “a form of government in which the sovereign power is widely vested in the people either directly or through elected representatives.”

      Cuba’s President Fidel Castro, Iraq’s President Saddam Hussein and the presidents of many totalitarian governments fit the first definition of a republic. However, they are tyrannical presidents that wield the sovereign power of monarchs.

      The United States fits the second description of a republic, which, combined with the definition of a democracy, makes us a republic of representative democracy or what some call a democratic republic.

      In the definitions of both a democracy and the second definition of a republic, however, the supreme power is supposed to be widely vested in the people. But in our democratic republic, the power of the people has been compromised by those who have assumed greater powers.

      The word “democracy” is not contained in the Constitution, yet it begins with the democratic statement, “We the people of the United States. do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America. The only place the word “republic” is mentioned is in Article IV, Section 4. “The United States shall guarantee to every state in this union a republican form of government.”

      Most people think of America as a democracy. However, social, educational and economic powers, and the unbridled growth of government have diluted the meaning. The public education establishment, colleges and universities have revised history. They have demeaned the word “democracy” as being majority rule, “mob rule” and the tyranny of the majority. The academic, political and media elite quietly condemn democracy and endorse the republic as a powerful central government, which must rule over us because we are unsophisticated and too ignorant to decide for themselves.

      Indeed, the United States has become weaker on democracy and stronger on a republic of consolidated government power in Washington. Anti-democracy zealots detest majority rule by the people, but they believe in the majority when it comes to electing representatives, and they believe in the majority of those representatives who rule the Congress and state legislatures with laws passed by the majority. Indeed, the word “majority” is used and referred to in the Constitution several times.

      Clearly, the irony of our so-called representative democracy has come to fruition. James Madison is considered the “architect” of the Constitution. He proposed a scheme of representation that would control the effects of factions and demagogues. But society is now inundated with factions, and government is controlled by the tyranny of the minority. Of course, the most glaring examples are the dominant Republican and Democratic Party factions, which control elections and government with the “two-party system.”

      Prior to the adoption of the Constitution, the Articles of Confederation were the laws of the land and they were filled with democracy and the sovereignty of the states. The confusion about democracy stems from the Founders of the Constitution. Madison, Hamilton and Adams argued in favor of federalism as opposed to state power and the “pure (direct) democracy” of ancient Athens, the birthplace of democracy. Now, like then, the power of the aristocratic elite frowned upon the sovereign power of the people. And now, like then, they demonize democracy with lies, distortions and half-truths.

      Madison and the others followed Plato’s negative views on democracy and his positive views on a republic. But those views were elitist and wrong. Thomas Jefferson was considered the architect of the Declaration of Independence, and his dream for America was based upon the direct democracy of 5th century BC Athens, Greece.

      Democracy detractors conveniently focus on the extreme violence of ancient times, which were simply uncivilized ways of life throughout the ancient world. But they purposely fail to evaluate the democracy of Athens fairly. The democracy of Athens was much less violent than anywhere else. Athenians built the greatest early civilization with pure democracy. Without the democracy of Athens over 2,500 years ago we would not be enjoying anything remotely like democracy or a democratic republic today.

      The “politically correct” and “historical revisionists” have contaminated America with subtle but destructive tyrannies that have seriously damaged our free democratic society. Politicians use the word democracy when they want something from the people, and they use the word republic when they don’t.

      By definition, a Republican believes in a republic, and a Democrat believes in democracy, which can only lead ordinary people to believe that there is too much hypocrisy, too much power, and too little common sense in government.

      Lest we forget, the word “republic” identifies some of the worst of dictatorships, authoritarian and tyrannical governments. The Union of Soviet Socialist Republics and the People’s Republic of China are two glaring examples.

      And even though the word “democratic” is used by small dictatorships around the globe, “democracy” is nowhere to be found.

      Frustration with society and government leaves most people feeling ambivalent or helpless. But we must not forget that the only thing standing between liberty and tyranny is the freedom to participate in democracy. We must use it or run the risk of losing it entirely.

      • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

        “The word “democracy” is not contained in the Constitution, yet it begins with the democratic statement, “We the people of the United States. do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America. ”

        Actually in a Republic, the sovereignty resides with the people themselves. In a Republic, one may act on his own or through his representatives when he chooses to solve a problem. The people have no obligation to the government; instead, the government is a servant of the people, and obliged to its owner — We the People.

        A Constitutional Republic has similarities to democracy in that it uses democratic processes to elect representatives, etc. The difference is that a Constitutional Republic has a Constitution that is the blueprint of the government. It defines the government’s structure, assigns its duties and limited, listed powers, plus creates checks and balances that power between the different branches.

        Hope that helps to clarfy it for you.

      • Vicki

        A Constitutional Republic does not necessarily limit the powers of government. A well written Constitution such as ours does. Thus I usually call our form of government a Constitutionally LIMITED Republic.

        This video helps explain the concept and explain how left vs right is used to keep the populace distracted.

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4r0VUybeXY

    • Mikey

      Correction: THERE is always the choice of adoption.

  • http://mozilla robert e. lee

    Allen West was defeated by liberalism and millions of hate ads ;; he was the right choise;; but liberalism/hate ruled the day;; it will not stand, I am going to give it my all to take down the scum…..

    • Daveh234

      Allen West is a throwback to McCarthyism. Communists are running rampant…the sky is falling…who needs an idiot like that in government?
      Not this country.

      • Craig Wettstein

        U ignorant —, McCarthy was right!!!

      • http://www.boblivingstonletter.com/ Bob Livingston

        Dear Daveh234,

        You write: “Allen West is a throwback to McCarthyism. Communists are running rampant…” McCarthy was correct. You must be a communist.

        Best wishes,
        Bob

      • Warrior
      • Right Brain Thinker

        Craig and Bob are correct. Anyone who thinks rather than blindly follows the dogma of the right is a communist! And all those communists are voting for a communist-socialist-Marxist government. The country is doomed!

      • barry

        Yes, McCarthy was correct & has been proven so at the time the Soviet files were opened.
        He was brought down, his message ignored, and now we have an Alinskyite Communist in the White House & a Congress which is implementing the Communist Manifesto.

        Thanks for agreat article, Mr. Livingston. You are a wise man.

      • DaveH

        Lizard Brain Thinker delivers his usual nonsensical comment.

      • Vicki

        DaveH yes RBT is speaking oddly but happened to hit upon something when he said
        “…all those communists are voting for a communist-socialist-Marxist government. The country is doomed!”…

        All those communists really are voting for a communist-socialist-Marxist government and if not stopped will doom this country. So in trying to use argument to ridicule he accidentally spoke truthfully.

  • http://mozilla robert e. lee

    choice [sorry]

    • eddie47d

      All politicians lie and tell tall tales to get elected and Allan West was no exception. He supported the War On Terror which has been mostly smoke and mirrors for the Military Industrial Complex. He supported our military adventurism and quick trigger policies which keeps us embedded in foreign entanglements. He is no friend of civil liberties anymore than some Democrats or Republicans by widely endorsing the Patriot Act and NDAA. His “convictions” allowed our local communities to be militarized in thought and in action. (SWAT teams for one ).

  • Joe

    This quote came from the Czech Republic and was translated into English from an article in the Prague newspaper, Prager Zeitungon.

    The danger to America is not Barack Obama, but a citizenry capable of entrusting a man like him with the Presidency. It will be far easier to limit and undo the follies of an Obama presidency than to restore the necessary common sense and good judgment to a depraved electorate willing to have such a man for their president. The problem is much deeper and far more serious than Mr. Obama, who is a mere symptom of what ails America . Blaming the prince of fools should not blind anyone to the vast confederacy of fools that made him their prince. The Republic can survive a Barack Obama, who is, after all, merely a fool. It is less likely to survive a multitude of fools, such as those that made him their prince!

    • Steve E

      At least the Czechs know what’s going on. They probably saw and remember when they were under communism in the past. And they didn’t forget.

    • Right Brain Thinker

      Thanks for the quote. I really learned a lot from it. Mainly that the Czechs apparently have their own wing nuts that write mindless articles that are perfect for copying and quoting by the folks in this country that are always looking for EVIDENCE to support their own brand of mindlessness.

      • Paul Wells

        Of course anyone who doesn’t see things from your leftist view point is a “wing nut” and couldn’t possibly be right. Nice diversity, good open mindedness for differing opinions….NOT!

      • Right Brain Thinker

        Paul,

        You may not have seen any of my posts on other threads where I said people should stop calling me a socialist-marxist-leftist-communist because I was none of those things. I described myself to them as someone who used to be a “progressive moderate Republican” who contributed triple digit $$$ to the McCain campaign early in 2008. McCain’s choice of Palin as veep was a signal to me that the GOP was “going crazy” and everything that has happened since has just convinced me more and more of that “truth”. I have actually stood still in the right middle as the GOP has run screaming past me into wing nut land. I HAVE moved a bit more left as the wing nuts have taken control of the GOP, as anyone with a truly “conservative” wish to save the country has done—and that’s what the voters are doing, in spite of the wishful thinking on the right.

        Of course, anyone who doesn’t see things from your rightist view point is not entitled to their opinion and couldn’t possibly be right anyway. My opinions are based on rational analysis of facts—-that’s one definition of “open-mindedness”. My analysis of your comment here is that you have little tolerance for “differing opinions”. Prove me wrong by arguing against my my “message” rather than attacking the “messenger”.

        And an opinion article written by a Czech and printed in a Czech newspaper (and had to be TRANSLATED) somehow has relevance to American politics? I’ll say it again—–”only for copying and quoting by the folks in this country that are always looking for EVIDENCE to support their own brand of mindlessness”. Are you mindless? If so, I can probably dig up a quote from some right wing nut Eskimo with an opinion on what the Samoans should do with their palm trees so you can copy that out to us as if it meant something……NOT!!!!!

      • Rocketman

        Right Brain Thinker: In the interest of honesty in labeling, you should change your name to “No Brain Thinker”

    • Jibbs
  • Glen

    I believe one important difference between the Libertarian Party and the Conservative Party is a focus on God-based standards. We believe that marriage is between one man and one woman. We also oppose obortion. Below are the Basic Tenets of the Conservative Party. You SHOULD leave the Republican Party and consider the Conservative Party at http://conservativepartyusa.org/home/

    1. Principal of Subsidiarity – Government works best at the local level. The closer the control of government is to the people, the more interest citizens hold in political proceedings and operations.

    2. American Exceptionalism: Conservatives believe that America is a country of a distinguished founding, historical experiences and a unique path to the future. We do not take lightly these characteristics. Thus, we do not believe that American institutions should be imposed upon nations of dissimilar origins and experiences.

    3. Government cannot legislate a perfect life for its citizens. Government’s role is to make life tolerable and to allow citizens to achieve their best. Legislation has limited ability to change our true social condition. Politicians have unethically preached to the public they have a right to steady economic betterment.

    4. Citizens have a contract with the past, the present and the future to:
    a. Preserve the best of our ancestors and change only that which leads to a
    better civil and social existence.
    b. Voluntarily assist those less prosperous.
    c. Conserve natural resources for our posterity

    5. Government should not “do.” Government must have limited intrusion in the marketplace. Government actions should pertain to fair and just competition.

    6. The Federal government has reduced the citizens responsibility in life by overextending its participation in education, economics, food and housing. Americans should be active citizens, not subjects.

    7. Taxation, a free grant from the citizen to the government, has become extortion and the two national parties have used taxation as a means to create division among the citizens of the United States. Government re-distribution of wealth creates a covetous nature in the recipients. Spending of citizens ethically and legally earned money and consuming our posterities resources are not signs of a virtuous political organization.

    8. Conservatism has been mistakenly defined as a philosophy of avarice and consumerism. Nothing could be further from the truth, as conservatives believe that success is to be shared in a voluntary manner with poor and less fortunate. The primary benefits of charity is ascribed to the voluntary donor and the recipients of material goods from a central authority show no gratitude.

    9. Those who believe that redistribution of wealth is an entitlement will themselves cause detriment to their posterity due to a lack of restraint much like consumerists believe our natural resources are purely for present consumption.

    • Robespierre

      I must say that your post is refreshing as in a breath of fresh air, however I do not have any illusions that our uneducated majority will embrace your ideas given that they will need to do something.

      • Steve E

        Yes, the uneducated are the ones that are taking this country down.

      • Daveh234

        So you guys think they shouldn’t be allowed to vote?
        American citizens?
        What do you call that kind of government?
        Not “We The People”.

      • DaveH

        Nobody should be allowed to vote to spend Other Peoples’ Money.

    • Robert Smith

      “3. Government cannot legislate a perfect life for its citizens. Government’s role is to make life tolerable and to allow citizens to achieve their best.”

      ROFL… Yet you will use the government to deny marriage to consenting adults if they don’t obey your god’s rules.

      And you won’t allow a woman to make her own reproductive decisions while you figuratively stick your collective noses between her legs.

      You are either IN the lives of Americans, or you are out.

      No amount of jabbering will fix that contradiction.

      And that double standard is what Americans see about the extreme religious right and don’t want to vote for.

      Rob

      • DaveH

        This coming from a Liberal Progressive whose sole concept of choice is whether a woman can or can’t abort her unborn baby.
        How do you rationalize those inconsistencies of yours, Robert?
        You disdain Slavery, but enslave others.
        You advocate Choice, but deprive others of their choices.
        You disdain personal theft, but vote to steal the money of others.

        Robert, you are just a typical example of a colossal Liberal Progressive Hypocrite.

        • Bob666

          “Robert, you are just a typical example of a colossal Liberal Progressive Hypocrite”.

          Dave,
          Have you had a good dump lately ? you are clearly reading things into the statements that other are making based on your own perceptions of others. You need to find Jesus or Allah, get laid or take a laxative because you are working yourself up something fierce.

      • DaveH

        Another Liberal Progressive joins the fray.
        Thank you, Bob.
        It’s beginning to appear that all you guys have are manipulative tactics. Maybe if you spent some time reading and thinking you could present some factual and logical arguments. But then, if you did that you would have no reason to be Liberal Progressives.

        • Bob666

          Well Dave,
          after three hours of Masterdebating, you must be plum worn out. Did you google the second amendment yet?

  • Cliffystones

    I’m changing my affiliation from Republican to Libertarian. The label “independent” I feel has been tarnished in the last election cycle. I’m reminded of people who can’t make up their minds, even at the last minute. People who will be too busy watching Monday Night football and Jersey Shore when the jackboots kick in their door. People who respond “not sure” when asked if murder and child molestation should be legalized. The same door knobs who vote “present”. You get the idea.

  • Wayne

    Yeap the RINO’s CINO are alive and well this last election prove it . Romney caved in and cut a deal long ago. This election was full of corruption and misleading poll numbers plus you had some of your own Wayne Allen Root stating that Romney wining in a land slide yea right. He Rove, Morris and sadly Michael Baron all got it wrong Mr Root based his misstep on some study down in Colorado, Rove & Morris both proved they are not worth the big money people were paying them to make these outlandish predictions. We the voters demand a refund for the time we wasted listening to them. Next Romney knew from the get go he was not going to win. We kept hearing how successful he was and how rich he was Ok. Then why did the GOP & RNC keep asking me for money hummm? If he wanted the job so bad let him spend his own money I will keep mine for other things like Food and Gas. After 31 plus yrs of being a Republican I am in the process of removing my name from their lists and will reregister for the next elections. I and many of us are sick and tired of the Blue blood country club deal cutters telling us who we need to support.

  • boyscout

    About 20 years ago when I noticed how often I had been splitting my tickets or simply voting third party I re-registered independent. Looking at the present scheme with the wolves on one side of the aisle dressed in white sheep regalia and those on the other side dressed as black sheep, I must ask to what purpose am I ticket splitting? As it seems that the whole electoral process has gone to the canines (completely over, with the only responsible candidate black balled), I now wonder if freedom in this country is actually saveable.

  • James Maxwell

    When you look at the GOP and its leaders over the past 12 years you can see that they have turned their backs upon conservatives. That was one of the reasons that the TEA Party came into existance. We have see the so called leadership of the GOP moving more and more to the left in their thinking and when you look as the candidates they have
    put forth the represent the Conservatives and Christians in the party they have been saddly lacking. Of the last two presidential candidates John McCain was a warrior in Viet Nam who was a POW for a long time and I respect him for that. I was in Nam when he was
    shot down and heard the tapes. Romney is a good business man but neither either knew or care about connectign with Conservative members of the party or putting forth a real
    effort to take the White House. We have had two really good VP candidates but they
    wer stiffled by the party especially when they started to get traction with the voters. It seems as thou they were handcuffed and not allowed to campaing to win the race but
    were stymed at ever turn by the party. We have two years to prepare for the next
    race in 2014 and will have to work long and hard to recover from the total lack of
    response by the partyleaders. The TEA party will have to step up and replace these
    obsolete and out of touch so called “leaders” that have failed Americans miserably.

    • edrankin

      as boehnersrecent purge demonstrates, the GOP will ostracize any tea party members who reach congress.

  • Dean bartlett

    The Libertarian party is not the answer I am a registered Independent and the party of Ron Paul turned me off from the start while Ron Paul had some good ideas he is not a strict constitutionalist and his rabid followers are just as acidic as the progressives.
    Now that said so me A viable alternative to the Republican party and I will support it.

  • Deerinwater

    All of this relabeling and abusing the meaning of words carries with it consequences that we must now attempt to overcome. You can make the claim that you are anything, a Constitutionalist, a Conservative . You can spent you hours attempting to define and relabel your opposition. But until you are making an attempt of being accurate and articulated with your language, you only create confusion.

    And as you should be able to see by now, this confusion has failed to work to your benefit while today you feel betrayed and disenfranchised

    Notions of Us and Them, of Libatrard and commies, pinko’s, plubs etc , The condescending derogatory slurs, the debasing and demonizing will be forever your downfall in the court of public opinion.

    Make a serious attempt to say what you mean and mean what you say. Allow your thoughts and sentences to stand on their own and not require a decoding system to be clearly understood.

    A lynch mob has never been noted for it’s fine points in language. This “Bring he out here sheriff. We are going to give him a fair trial and then hang him” simple does not command the day.

  • NVRAT

    Some body needs to prepare a list of the Republican Elite or the Power Brokers that run the party. Then we can start picking off each one as applicable.I always hear about the ones who make the decisions or the elite or powers to be etc. Some are obvious but, there has to be more in the background who are they and how do we get rid of them.

  • Corkey

    The embedded story about the upcoming nomination by Livingston from Jan 2012 is entirely accurate. Santorum and Gingrich were nothing more than blockers in a Ron Paul Prevent Defense. Stoooooopid idiots

    • http://www.facebook.com/tony.newbill1 Tony Newbill

      Corkey and Right Brain Thinker , If we would have followed the Ron Paul Plan and Pulled out of the Middle East what would the Price of the World oil market do to the USA Economy ?
      And what about the use of Sarin gas in Syria do you think that would destabilize the region to the point of a Global conflict that we would be able to ignore and it not destabilize our economy ??

      • Steve E

        If we followed Ron Paul we would be doing a lot more drilling in our homeland and wouldn’t have to import oil. As far as the Middle East conflicts, no one has and will ever fix that. If they attach the U.S. just wipe them all out with nukes. We CAN do that easy.

        • http://www.facebook.com/tony.newbill1 Tony Newbill

          Steve it would not be that simple . The War against Fracking thats coming even Ron Paul would be mired in a Legal war for years that would outlast his time as president . I just don’t see the Isolation you say Ron Paul would have brought the USA as far as Oil use being anything sustainable . And here is the Argument NOW taking place between the Different Groups regarding the Energy Production from Fracking :

          http://www.cattlenetwork.com/e-newsletters/drovers-daily/Cattle-in-fracking-areas-showing-side-effects-181545721.html

          ht tp://truth-out.org/news/item/8740-gas-rush-fracking-in-depth ,

      • Right Brain Thinker

        Tony,

        My crystal ball is all muddy where you look for what’s going to happen in the Middle East. I do think that if it wasn’t for oil and the creation of the state of Israel, we wouldn’t care about the Middle East beyond it being a source of camels for our zoos and rugs for our floors.

        I think Ron Paul would have MANY impacts on our entire way of life but I DO think that he would have been like all the rest after he got elected. Look around and say, “Well, I got elected and they can’t throw me out for four years so I can do what makes sense rather that what I promised”. I think he would have done exactly what O’Bama is doing, but maybe a bit faster.

        “And what about the use of Sarin gas in Syria do you think that would destabilize the region to the point of a Global conflict that we would be able to ignore and it not destabilize our economy ??”
        See “muddy crystal ball” above. My guess? Global conflict unlikely Don’t see that happening—-things might get pretty messy for a short while but the world would likely sit back and watch if Sarin is used in any quantity—-if Assad steps over that line, everyone but the Iranians will abandon him, and even they might back away some.

        • http://www.facebook.com/tony.newbill1 Tony Newbill

          Right Brain Obamas funding of the rebels in Syria to over throw Assad I think if Obama thinks they will stay loyal to him will go the same way as the Benghazi fiasco . The prize in Benghazi was control of weapons , and in Syria it will be the control over the gas , so this will result in full destabilization of the Regine because along with the control of rouge weapons the Rebels Obama has enabled with support now Control the Military Might of Egypt . http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2012/dec/6/muslim-brotherhood-inherits-us-war-gear/?utm_source=RSS_Feed&utm_medium=RSS

        • http://www.facebook.com/tony.newbill1 Tony Newbill

          Right brain Thinker these rebels Obama is funding in syria will not choose him over controlling the sarin gas .
          This is a graphic video in this Link , but the story and links in the story prove that Obamas policy of trying to use these guys as the squad to bring change is going to bite him in the foreign policy and this could bring down the world oil market because 60 % of the worlds Oil flows through this part of the world , 40 % through Egypt’s Suez , think about this it will become the end of the world oil market and the bringer of Nationalization of the USA Energy market !!!!! http://theintelhub.com/2012/12/10/video-syrian-rebels-make-child-behead-prisoner/

      • Right Brain Thinker

        You may be right, Tony. Like I said, my crystal ball doesn’t work too well for the Middle East, just as most everyone else’s hasn’t either. The Washington Times and intel hub have their OPINIONS, but don’t seem to see things all that clearly either. We shall see. One thing my crystal ball tells me is that O’Bama is not any more to blame for the crazy crap that occurs over there than his predecessors, perhaps even less than W. Of course, if one is an O’Bama hater, they won’t accept that.

      • http://www.facebook.com/tony.newbill1 Tony Newbill

        Right Brain Thinker Why is it that this Google out fit that Obama I believe has a Working relationship like has appointed the CEO to a Jobs counsel along with GE , why is it that Obama is not willing to make changes to the Tax code during this Fiscal Cliff negotiations to find ways to repatriate these funds back into the USA and be put to work ??
        Doing Nothing will crash the Economy again and while Democrats and Republicans point the finger at whose fault it is we the people suffer !!! that is Unpatriotic , so please find common ground to allow this Money to come back to USA and be put to work !!!!

        Google Revenues Sheltered in No-Tax Bermuda Soar to $10 Billion

        http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-12-10/google-revenues-sheltered-in-no-tax-bermuda-soar-to-10-billion.html

  • Bruce R Porter Sr

    Old saying…”we all have a price”.
    Most of us appear to be saying “not me, them”. “take their’s, not mine”

    There have always been elites. They have almost always ruled. The US became that rare exception…….But, only a few really want to “rule”. They are the predators, we, the prey. So, that few learn how to “game the system”.
    And, of course, those elites that believe they should rule….fund them.

    So, the US has reverted. We are back to the mean. We are just another dictatorship with a powerful military……go check the history books and see how that has worked out for the people………And how well it worked out for the elites.

    God bless

    • markdashjohn

      As I have said:

      There is the “Them” (Political and powerful Elites) and the “Us” (the fools and serfs who FUND THEM with our hard-earned Tax Dollar).

  • Deerinwater

    I love the young ladies womanly attributes on the right border promo while her Tee shirt is kick a$$ and goes to the very core of my argument.

    “misuse of literary makes me figurative insane”

    I think it has the same effect on everyone. If by some chance you are blind to this abuse and misuse, found clueless than you have been assimilated and part of the problem that plagues us today.

    • Daveh234

      at least get the quote correct. What you wrote is meaningless.
      “Misuse of Literally makes me Figuratively Insane”

      • Deerinwater

        If the shoe fits. ~

      • Right Brain Thinker

        I didn’t see the ad but it looks like it may have been some word play with the real quote (?)
        As in “figurative insane” makes one think “figurativeLY” which leads back to “literaLLy” and VIOLA—-pretty clever actually.

  • lioness50

    I’m sick and tired of hearing about who is a “true” conservative and who isn’t! I suspect these labels mean different things to different people anyway. I’m a mixture: conservative about most things, but a little more liberal about some other things and most people I know are the same way. The fact of the matter is that Washington operates in a firmly entrenched manner that is rife with cronyism and corruption and that isn’t likely to change anytime soon, no matter whom we elect. Instead of yearning for a perfectly conservative candidate who probably doesn’t exist, we must face reality and sometimes that just means voting for the lesser of two evils.

    • http://www.edwinrankin.com Ed Rankin

      decades of voting for “the lesser of two evils” brought us to where we are today. it’s time to end the two party autocracy. i’m supporting the principles i agree with. i’ve joined the libertarian party.

    • Right Brain Thinker

      Read “Winner Take All Politics” for a good look at the truth of what you say.

  • Motov

    We simply need a smaller Government, Both parties only know how to grow government, and FUBAR this great nation. Their evil puppet handlers have absolutely no conscience, no loyalty, no morals, no hearts nor souls.They make the most evil horror flick monsters look like novices. To speak against them, one risks his own life, they get away with being above the Law.
    I hope some day soon they are exposed for all to see and their greed does them in..

  • DaveH

    Yay, Bob.

    • Right Brain Thinker

      Yay, Dave!

  • Louis Lemieux

    Libertarians favor unfettered markets and oppose government regulations more in the name of human freedom than in the name of economic efficiency. The fundamental right to liberty is the right to do whatever we want with what we own, provided we respect other people’s rights to do likewise. Libertarians rule out any law that requires helping others, including taxation for redistribution of wealth.

    The problem I have with this is the following: Capitalism is a kind of legalized pyramid scheme, in the sense that the more money you make the more your possibility of making more and thus concentrating the money supply. It’s a system that needs to be kept in check by socialistic measures. Relying on individual virtue to keep people from using their freedom to step on their neighbor’s freedom is just utopian and silly.The top 1 percent of Americans now have greater collective net worth than the entire bottom 90 percent. The top 10% hold 71% of all wealth. Economic inequality is worse in the US than any other country that has free elections.

    Unbridled capitalism is for those who believe that people exist for money instead of money existing for people!

    • edrankin

      i dont think the concentration of wealth is due to “unbridled capitalism”. in fact, real capitalism hasnt existed in the united states for more than 150 years, in my opinion. i believe the supreme courts decisions in the 1800s giving corporations the same rights as individuals under the constitution and the creation of the federal income tax and the private, federal reserve bank in 1913, put mechanisms in place allowing the ruling elite, funded by taxpayers through the central bankers, to create monopolistic control over the government and shut down competition.

    • Right Brain Thinker

      Libertarians live in a past that this country can never return to. However, I don’t think that their view of “unbridled” and “unfettered” free market capitalism is the same as the view of the plutocracy and corporate oligarchy that want to move us toward corporate feudalism. The Libertarians may be a bit “romantic” about what they see as a path to follow, but they certainly don’t see LESS freedom as the way to go.

      (Did an RBT get that reasonably correct? Libertarians please chip in if I didn’t)

  • http://wildeyguns.com The Christian American

    At the end of the 19th century and beginnnig of the 20th, the democrats were conservatives by todays standards. Marxism or involuntary socialism found its way to America’s shores. It was flat out refused by the American people so the socialists took a different approach. They labeled themselves Democrats and joined the Democratic Party. With time they changed the definition of Democrat so it became involuntary socialism. Lenin, one of the founders of socialism in Russia, spelled it out. He said: “People think in words and how the interpret words is who they are. Let us change the definition of words and invent new words so we can mold people into what we want”. Basically, the democratic party is the blue collar party and the Republican party “was” the white collar party. It was hard for the socialist to sell their ideas to the Republicans, but that’s changed. The socialists are chameleons. They are what they have to be to propagate their ideas. Bush Sr. knew that when he pioneered the dumbing down of America. He donned the clothes of a republican but was a socialist through and through. Who can produce a statement of principles that defines a Conservative or a Republican or a Tea Partier? If no one can define one, how can they be one? we must define the enemy before we can fight the enemy. Who wants to “conserve” this political mess? Who wants to be “liberated’ from this mess?

    • Jim

      The old yellow dog Democrats or Southern Democrats were more conserative than the mainstream Republicans but social issues pushed them to the Republican party and now they toe the line like all good party members do. The yellow dogs served the same purpose as a third party and now they are sorely missed.

      • nc

        Jim, as a life long Southern Democrat and a Yellow Dog Democrat to the extent that I will always vote for the candidate who best supports the Democrat Platform, I would like to inform you that we are those things because we had a choice between the Democrat Platform and the Republican Platform, the same as we do now! Reality was AND IS that we were going to have one platform- or the other since no third party has ever gotten off the ground! I like what the Dem. Platform says about aiding the working class and the less fortunate and what the history of the party has been in that regard! After all, we are ALL citizens!

        While Americans have always been promised by the Republicans , since the 1920s at least, that Democrats are socialist, Marxist,etc: and if elected to the White House they will RUIN our economy because they do not know how to manage a free market society I have the OPPOSITE to be the truth!!!!!!!! The last two deepest recessions have been with Republicans in he White House and bush I and Nixon weren’t much better! SEE “BULLS,BEAR, DONKEYS, and ELEPHANTS” for the Democrats in the White House figures! Truly amazing at the difference! You WILL NOT EVER see this chart on Faux Noise!

  • Suzie

    How does leaving the Republican Party and becoming an Independent fix anything? Hopefully, it’s not too late, but we have allowed the party to stray from what we expect them to be. People state that we shouldn’t have voted for Romney, but not voting for him was a vote for Barack Obama. While people may not have liked Romney, chosing Barack Obama, not voting or voting for a third party only gave us four more years of the worst President ever. If you were all making a statement to the Republican Party in the last election, you did so at too high a price. Another four years of Barack Obama could destroy this country and our freedom. Should we give up and run from the Republican Party? We could have a Libertarian Party or Conservative Party, but do you see a candidate of either party winning the Presidency any time soon? Let’s fight to incorporate the best of the Libertatian and Conservative Parties into the Republican Party. We should stand together and fight for what we want the Republican Party to be.

    • http://smoovious.wordpress.com Smoovious Laxness

      > We could have a Libertarian Party or Conservative Party, but
      > do you see a candidate of either party winning the Presidency
      > any time soon?

      Not as long as people like you continue to cling to a party that has no interest in serving the people, preferring to make subjects of the people.

      Attitudes like that, are what keeps you in check. You get in your own way, choosing to support the status quo instead of making the changes you claim you want.

      As long as people like you, keep refusing to support alternatives that better fit you, the alternatives that better fit you, will never gain the support you are waiting for, before you will give them the support you should have been giving them all along.

      Attitudes like that, to me, is for cowards.

      If you want change, then stand up for it. If you’re not willing to do that, then accept the consequences of your choice.

      You’re dreaming if you think beating the same horse for a few more elections is going to finally give you the results that beating that horse never gave you before.

      – Smoov

    • Craig Wettstein

      After being a registered Libertarian since 1980, I have a tendency to agree with u Suz. That’s what Ron and Rand Paul have done. They’ve laid the inroads along with the Tea Partiers. In reality, right now, (this January), if 16 Repubs “abstained” from voting for Boehner as Speaker on the 1st vote. A true Conservative could concievably be voted in as Speaker.

    • http://wildeyguns.com The Christian American

      With Romney’s postion on foreign affairs, we’d be at war already. He might’ve bought us a little time domestically but wasn’t a Ron Paul. Paul said, to run as a third party would be useless. We have a one party system now-a-days. Do what we can but be sure to save yourself. Paul’s working with the youth. If there is any hope it’s with them. Their going to have to carry load older people have saddled with and once they are enlightened to it they can get America back on course, if the Lord hasn’t come back first. Read and believe John 3:16. If you come to that realization, you’ll know your real ife hasn’t even begun.

    • nc

      Susie, which of the two Romneys do you think would have served better? The Romney we heard and saw before he became a candidate and after he got the nomination OR the Romney we heard and saw when he was playing kiss a$$ to the right wing to get the nomination?? Are you as conflicted over that as the voting public seemed to be??

    • Motov

      The GOP made a huge mistake in backing Romney, he is too liberal to even be called a conservative. His flip-flopping messages left him looking like a follower and not a leader.
      Ron Paul’s numbers were growing, because Ron Paul stuck to the Constitution as his foundation. Something that has long departed from the GOP platform. Granted Obozo is the worst ever, Romney wouldn’t really improve our situation. His war mongering stance is what people don’t want. More and more people are starting or already believe 9-11 was an “inside” job, to take away our freedoms, and go to war with who they wish to blame the catastrophe they cooked up in the name of “patriotism”.

  • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing WTS/JAY

    With exceptions, America’s problem is its ignorant population who haven’t a clue and do not recognize that its “plutocratic- politicians” are in essence “mobsters” with Harvard degrees in embezzlement and racketeering! Negotiating terms and conditions with the “crime-syndicate” is the definition of insanity!

    • Right Brain Thinker

      Right on, Jay! But it’s only insane if you keep doing it and expect different results. (So, on second thought, I guess you got it right the first time)

      • http://wildeyguns.com The Christian American

        Julian Assange said it: His and the rest of the worlds enemy is ignorance. There’s no mention about education in the Constitution. Why? Because the Founders knew government is an opinion and all people would be taught the prevailing political opinion if government got involved. When we started government schools under Horace Mann, that was a turning point in America. All the Ivy League schools were private and started to teach ministers. The motto of Harvard is John 17:3 “And this is eternal life, that thay might know thee, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent”.

    • nc

      Jay, another self evident truth is that plutocrat with a Yale MBA and trickle down policies is not the way to Utopia! Better to have a good old country boy from Hope!

  • harleydavidson

    It’s time to move to the Libertarian Party.

    • Capitalist at Birth

      The libertarian party left me in 1986 as they adopted and open borders policy as part of their party philosophy. Are you for open borders?

  • Capitalist at Birth

    Blah Blah Blah. Typical response from Bob. Ron Paul could never and can never be elected to any national office. Get over it.

    • http://wildeyguns.com The Christian American

      Your right. Ron Paul could never have been elected, but then America could never been saved because it didn’t want to be saved, only deck chairs.

      • Capitalist at Birth

        Ron Paul can and never will be elected to any office above the congressional district he has represented, because of his isolationist foreign policy. Where would world trade be without the United States insuring the free flow of goods and ideas across the globe? Isolationism leads to worse wars. Just look where isolationism got us in the 1930′s. Very few people are aware of the Libertarian Party platform that to this day includes open borders which is another reason. Sure he mouthed the words that he would enforce the laws. Yeah right!!

        • http://www.boblivingstonletter.com/ Bob Livingston

          Dear Capitalist at Birth,

          Does Reince Priebus sign your check, or is it Weeper Boehner?

          Best wishes,
          Bob

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          You let the corporate media form your views on Ron Paul. Thinking for yourself is a good idea. Did you know that lobbists did not bother with Ron Paul? He was for the US Constitution, period. Did you know that all of those in the government knew he could not be bought, and respected him. But of course that is why the cartel owned corporate news was against him. If it was not constitutional Ron paul did not /does not stand for it.
          You have bought into the foreign policy plans. But if you really knew what they were, would you? Read Agenda 21, get an idea of exactly what this means. Plus read the Free Trade (which is anything but).

          Let me tell you something, this time research it on your own since I have posted it many times here and other places before. I have read CAFCA, NAFCA, Free Trade, NWO, UN, Obamacare – now 4 times as they changed it again and it is a long boring miserable read, etc.

          What they mean by ‘foreign policy” is that yo uwill soon be a third world worker here in the USA. It was deliberately done and still going on. After that you will be (thanks to Agenda 21 and the progressives) a “community worker”. You will work for the good of the world, no wages. They will decide where you will work, how many hours, if you get a break or food. When you are off they will tell you where you will live, what you are allowed toeat and drink, what entertainment is availble to you. They will tell you what type of exercise you will do, for how long, and how many times a week. You will be allowed to own nothing at all, not even the clothes on your back as all will be supplied by the government. When it is time they will “assist you peacefully into death”.

          Your whole life, your childrens grandchildrens etc will be worse then slavery. The bills have already been passed here in the USA that all people regardless of age (infants to elderly) will be used in clincal trials if needed – for the good of the community of course.
          You keep being ignorant and assist them in this coming attempt to enslave us here in the USA, first by taking the guns so that we cannot fight them. This started a few decades ago. It was not Wilson’s idea, nor was it Roosevelts progressiveism. But because they brought back the Na_i’s with them who were working on experiments on people that they thought might come in handy later, and Kissinger was put in a high position in our government, things have changed more so.

          What is really funny is that Obama the tool, will not be allowed to live when this is over. But he is narcistic enough, and a socialpath to think that HE is needed, not a tool. History is important because the terrible things that happened then can happen, are happening again now.

          Read the Opening Statement by Justice Robert H. Jackson, Chief of Counsel for the United States, Nuremberg Trials – just the openiong statement will educate you

          Does this sound familiar?
          This takeover from within the German regime itself did not just happen; it was planned and prepared for over a long period of time and with no small skill and cunning. Their seizure of the German State, the takeover of the legitimate government there, their subjugation of the German people, their terrorism and extermination of dissident elements, all these are ends for which they acted in concert; and all these are phases of the conspiracy, a conspiracy which reached one goal only to set out for another and more ambitious one. The intricate web of organizations, which these men formed and then utilized to accomplish these ends of destroying the legal government there and installing their own.

          {Happening here – how much of our Constitution, our legitimate government is now being followed? Is Obama following the blueprint for the Executive branch? Did Bush or Clinton follow it?}

          A separate government was set up within the legitimate government within the Party to exercise outside the law every sanction that any legitimate state could exercise and many that it could not {Obama’s “Czars”, TSA, DHS}.
          The Party had its own secret police, its security units, its intelligence and espionage division, its raiding forces, and its youth forces {DHS, TSA, look up “Obama youth”, etc on youtube.com and other places}.
          It also established administrative mechanisms over time to identify those who supported the legitimate government. {Patriot Act, NDAA, warrantless searches, warrantless spying, TSA, etc}
          They “encouraged” the populace to inform on their own neighbors, friends, family {“See Something, Say Something”, and other videos the DHS put out here in America}.
          {Familiar yet?}

          “Uncontrolled search and seizure is one of the first and most effective weapons in the arsenal of every arbitrary government. Among deprivations of rights, none is so effective in cowing a population, crushing the spirit of the individual and putting terror in every heart.” Justice Robert Jackson, Chief U.S. Prosecutor at the Nuremberg Trials

          A presidential decree was created suspending the extensive guarantees (decrees)of individual liberty contained in the constitution of the Weimar Republic.
          Those decree’s were restrictions on personal liberty, on the right of free expression of opinion – including freedom of the press, on the right of peaceful assembly, the right of association,
          And violations of the privacy: postal, telegraphic, and telephonic communications; And no need for warrants for house-searches, orders for, confiscations as well as restrictions on property, etc all taken away under the guise of “keeping the people safe”. {much like what is happening within the USA today, as all of the “restrictions” on our freedoms are “for our own safety”}
          Many were arrested as “belligerents” – no real crime committed, just disagreeing with the destruction of their legitimate government.

          Secret arrest and indefinite detention; without charges, without evidence, without hearing, without counsel, and no court could issue an injunction, or writ of habeas corpus, or certiorari. The German people were in the hands of the police, the police were in the hands of the Nazi Party, and the Party was in the hands of a ring of evil men who wanted to rule the world.
          {Sound familiar??????}

          The N-zi conspiracy, as was shown during the Nuremberg trail, always contemplated not just about overcoming current opposition but exterminating elements which could not be reconciled with its philosophy of the state. It not only sought to establish the Nazi “new order” but to secure its sway, as Hitler predicted, “for a thousand years.”
          {US Army Re-Education Camp Manual – describes how political activists in prison camps will be indoctrinated by specially assigned psychological operations officers. US detention camps will have PSYOP teams whose responsibility will be to use “indoctrination programs to reduce or remove antagonistic attitudes,” as well as targeting “political activists” with such indoctrination programs to provide “understanding and appreciation of U.S. policies and actions.” It applies to citizens detained within the USA, whether they be DCs (displaced citizens) or “civilian internees,” in other words citizens who are detained for, “security reasons, for protection, or because he or she committed an offense against the detaining power.”
          It’s the responsibility of the PSYOP officer to “control detainee and DC populations during emergencies.”
          “Resettlement conducted as a part of civil support operations will always be conducted in support of another lead agency (Federal Emergency Management Agency, Department of Homeland Security)”. Page 13 notes how “U.S. citizens will be confined separately from detainees,” meaning they will be separated from foreign prisoners in the camps.
          On page 146 of the manual, we learn how prisoners in the camps are to be identified: “The prisoner’s last name, first name, and middle initial are placed on the first line of a name board, and the prisoner’s social security number is placed on the second line.”
          The document clearly shows that the policies outlined in the manual can be applied domestically. The language makes it clear that so long as the President passes an executive order to nullify Posse Comitatus, the law that forbids the military from engaging in domestic law enforcement, the policies “may be performed as domestic civil support operations.”
          The manual states, “These operations may be performed as domestic civil support operations,” and adds that “The authority to approve resettlement such operations within U.S. territories,” would require a “special exception” to The Posse Comitatus Act, which can be obtained via “the President invoking his executive authority.”}

          Anything familiar yet?

      • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

        Actually you are incorrect about Ron Paul. Ron Paul “lost” due to election fraud. Then the RNC (GOP) pulled a DNC (2008 – The 2008 Democratic Nominating Committee (DNC) document did not include language stating that Obama was qualified to be a candidate. The 2008 Republican Nominating Committee (RNC) document did, as is normal. This shows that the DNC knew that Obama was not qualified, or why change the form?) with robo calling to tell everyone that everyone EXCEPT Romney dropped out as candidates but that it was still critical for them to go vote for Romney. Then they changed the bylaws, etc.

        Actually, all legit, unbiased polls showed Ron Paul was the choice for most American citizens over all of the candidates including Obama. Oh yea, plus they went AGAINST the law and did not let a big part of our overseas military vote. And the over 100% voter turn-out – impossible. ETC.

        You have been fooled and this POTUS was put into place. As has this adminstration (congress, senate). READ Agenda 21. Have you read Obamacare? Patriot Act – what we are allowed to read? NDAA? UN? NATO? Free Trade?

        If not, then you are voting blind and your opinions were made FOR you.

    • Motov

      That’s because of years and years of conditioning Americans through “education”, “entertainment”, “political correctness”, and alienating those who try warn what’s going on.

    • Howlingmad

      Its CLEAR, Kansas . . . their comments ALONE, should have shone you what they “DON’T” know ( Which seems to be a “LOT” ) They just “DON’T GET IT” . . . I would think , this would be the PERFECT example, of our current educational system ( So Called ! )

  • Michael Quontez Murray

    The Republicans no longer support freedom than the Democrats. The Republicans are amoral, cowards. They don’t have any principles to stand on. The Republicans didn’t lose this election because of conservatism, they lost the election because they couldn’t communicate the conservative message in a practical way. If we had someone to articulate how conservatism works and what it can do from them and the country, then we wouldn’t be talking about an Obama second term. The only way that we going to take back the Republican Party is at the State level and local level. Where there is a God there is a way. We only need the courage to stand and take action for what we believe. We can do this is we really want to. Where there is injustice we must pursue justice. Democrats pursue a envious and covetous ideology. This poison will eventual destroy the whole nation. We must viciously oppose such ideology. We can win but there is no time for complacency.

    • http://smoovious.wordpress.com Smoovious Laxness

      The Republicans didn’t lose because they couldn’t talk conservative…

      They lost, because they wouldn’t BE conservative…

      – Smoov

    • http://wildeyguns.com The Christian American

      They didn’t and don’t try. Their nothing but involuntary socialist wearing conservative and republican clothing. That’s why they rejected Ron Paul. He wan’t one of them.

    • Howlingmad

      Ya THINK ? . . . sigh . . . “BOTH” parties, use the SAME HANDBOOK.

  • http://gabrielalanking.wordpress.com gabrielalanking

    Both parties are entirely controlled by the “CROWN”, “District of Colombia”, and “Vatican” corporations independent city nations who answer to no one outside of Lucifer himself and a sub pantheon of demon Gods and Kings.

    The republican party is just a wolf in sheep’s clothing. And the democrat party is just a FOX guarding the hen house.

    The only real solution is a candidate NOT like Ron Paul, who will speak the truth without “playing politics”, and go straight for the throat of the Satanic New World Order exposing this vast conspiracy for what it really is.

    Both parties are complicit for their roles in carrying out the inside job of 911, which has been used as the EXCUSE to EVISCERATE all of our Constitutional rights, and perpetuate endless global bloodshed a profiteering on a mass scale. Further, they are complicit for collusion and treason with the Federal Reserve, and the phony “bail outs” and derivatives fraud scam which has permanently robbed future generations of any hope of freedom or prosperity. US debt+obligations now exceeds 202 trillion, while the derivatives black hole expands well into the quadrillions….. as our current Caeser does everything in his power to liquidate the country and drive us into perpetual slavery.

    Keep playing these games- and you can look forward to a future of AGENDA 21, Carbon Taxes, GMO foods, drones everywhere, transhumanism, a brutal expanding militarized police state, endless taxation, your involuntary enlistment in the global democratic nanny dictatorship, the Mark of the Beast, and WWIII.

    • http://midcontent brand inspector

      The Rep. party is still in touch with reality than the socialist/marxist democrats any day or at any time. Since the Dems want the government’s hands in your pockets and will alwayys spend more than the taxpayers keep giving to the socialists. Go back and see what the Hag Hillary was spouting a few years ago, all of our earnings went to Washington and a commettee would decide how much money you could have, not hpw much you earned or worked for. Thats why The Hag and The Congential Liar get along and work together. A typical union mindset, Can not do a job they are hired for, but have other book trained idoits muddle thru, and always hide out and be a F-up. Dems always embrace anything weird,abhorant, and preverse. That goes back to the formation of the corrupt organization, that has embraced genetic selection, total control of what you think, eat, and speak. Ron Paul and other Liberatarians do have some great ideas but , ebrace the same crap as dems, suck all the druigs you want and let everyone else take care of their sorry azzs and their freaky offspringwhen things go to hell. Dems and progressives want the morons in the beltway to plan out every ones existance, from day to worm food. It would help if states took control of what goes on inside its borders, instead of unelected theorists in the beltway, and clean houses with term limits, the WH inhabent can only serve 8 years, a senator can only serve 9 years and a Congress person only 7 years, and they can not have anything to do with federal contracts or livw in the beltway, for the number of years served. Sitting on your haunches with an inserted digital member complaining will not solve anything.

      • http://wildeyguns.com The Christian American

        We had Nancy Johnson, a republican, for a congresswoman and she authored medicare and other socialist programs.

      • Nadzieja Batki

        the Christian American, the woman ran on the Republican ticket among the population that is mostly Republican. She wouldn’t have won as a Democrat.
        The difficulty seems to be that people do not realize that Democrats lie to win elections, pretending to be Republican is the least of their lies.
        The trust factor always kicks in, Americans believe that Americans do not lie.

      • http://gabrielalanking.wordpress.com gabrielalanking

        Republican cheerleading brand inspector? That’s not only sad, it’s pathetic. CLEARLY, you are clueless as to the values of the Libertarian party- outside of some flaky biased clap trap you must have soaked up off the flat screen via FOX News and the rest of the so called “conservative” mainstream media. lol

        The Republican party isn’t the solution- IT’S THE PROBLEM. Same as the mainstream 501c3 “Christian” denominations.

        It’s not about “parties”, it’s about REAL candidates not groomed or purchased by the bankers. We need candidates with BALLS, who will speak the truth and not back down to pressure or threats. A candidate who will fully restore the Constitution, and bring America back to it’s founding Christian principles.

        A candidate who won’t “play politics”, but attack the Satanic New World Order head on, restore US sovereignty, sound currency, secure borders. A man who won’t rest until the truth of 911 is exposed, and the culprits delivered IN CHAINS where they and their co conspirators shall face the full force and penalty of the law.

        • Bob666

          Yo Gab,
          Well said and a big picture observation of the real problem. But, I do have a question and that is; who do you believe is the culprit for 911?

          • http://gabrielalanking.wordpress.com gabrielalanking

            There is a lie circulating that “they” are Jewish. When most of them are about as “Jewish” as Mickey Mouse. “Jew” implies that they are descendants of Jacobs 12 sons, thus successfully demonizing true israelites.
            At best, some NWO can claim lineage through Solomon’s pagan wives, who worshiped demons. Yet as Solomon’s mother was Ammonite herself, they could only at best claim less than 1/4 “Jewish” lineage.

            The ruling families of the Satanic Luciferian NWO are the ancient snake/dragon lines of Draco. Some descendants of the “fallen” of Lucifer- the SS shaped like lightning to honor Lucifer’s fall, who descended upon Mount Hermon the 33rd parallel of earth same as Roswell.
            The double head Phoenix represents Lucifers dominance over both the political and religious orders, maintaining full spectrum dominance over every thesis and anti thesis they both create and destroy, the Saturlinian priesthood pre dating Samaria to Atlantis.

            The NWO fund Israel according to the plan outlined in Pike’s letter to Mazzini- in which it is clearly stated their final objective is to destroy Israel, and half the world in the cataclysm.

            Here is a list of some families involved:

            THE ARCHITECTS OF THE SATANIC GLOBAL NEW WORLD ORDER….. A LIST OF THE MOST POWERFUL FAMILIES ON EARTH.

            House of Borja
            House of Breakspeare
            House of Somaglia
            House of Orsini
            House of Conti
            House of Chigi
            House of Colonna
            House of Farnese
            House of Medici
            House of Gaetani
            House of Pamphili
            House of Este
            House of Aldobrandini

            The Li family of China Van Duyn
            The Houses of Rothschild Krup
            The Rockefeller’s Disney
            The House of Warburg McDonald
            The Oppenheimer’s Taft
            The Windsors (Saxe Coburg Gotha) family Bush
            The Capetian family Harriman
            The Collins family Weishaupt
            The Dupont’s Luxembourg
            The Habsburg’s Plantagenet
            Vanderbuilt’s Drakenberg
            Kennedy http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/esp_sociopol_dragoncourt.htm
            http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/biblianazar/thefamily.htm#Additional_Information

            Onassis House of Orange / Nassau
            Stuarts House of Guelph (Britain) Sinclair
            House of Wettin (Belgium) Forbes
            House of Bernadotte (Sweden) Christi
            House of Liechtenstein (Liechtenstein) Stuarts
            Fraser
            House of Oldenburg (Denmark) Cambell
            House of Hohenzollern (Germany) Caldwell
            House of Hanover (Germany) Gordon
            House of Bourbon (France) Leslie
            House of Orange (Netherlands) Usmanov
            House of Grimaldi (Monaco)
            House of Wittelsbach (Germany)
            House of Braganza (Portugal)
            House of Nassau (Luxembourg)
            House of Habsburg (Austria)
            House of Savoy (Italy)
            House of Karadjordjevic (Yugoslavia)
            House of Wurttemberg (Germany)
            House of Zogu (Albania)

            Morgan Chase
            Schiff
            Goldman Sachs
            Lehman
            Kuhn Loebs
            Stillman’s
            Lazard’s
            Israel Moses Seifs
            House of Bourbon (King Juan Carlos of Spain)
            Astor
            Bundy
            Freeman
            Reynolds
            Russel

          • http://gabrielalanking.wordpress.com gabrielalanking

            THE MYSTERY OF THE PENTAGRAM, AND THE 5-1 CONSPIRACY.

            5-1 The official birthday of the illuminati conspiracy, who’s founders (Windsor sax Gotha, and Rothschilds) now run the world. Including the US Federal Reserve. Order of the Garter, UN, Bank of international Settlements, etc

            Exactly 50 States in the US. A pentagram of “10’s” the number of mastery.

            5-1 The Pentagon (gram) Began construction exactly 60 YEARS TO THE VERY DAY of 911.
            9-11-1941

            5-1 Area 51. Officially christened in satanic ritual by disciple of Aleister Crowley OTO NASA scientist Jack Parsons, opening an inter dimensional portal through which demons could come and go.

            5-1 WACO human sacrifice. Murder of Christians including children exactly 51 days stand off.

            5-1 The 501c3 (51, 33) tax exemption muzzle on the churches. A satanic strong hold.

            5-1 Adolph Hitler and Nazi’s apparently “suicide” on May 1st…… 5-1

            5-1 Osama Bin Laden apparently killed by seal team 6……. 5-1 May 1st!!!

            5-1 2008 DC Madam Deborah Jean Palfrey “suicided” before she could testify.

            5-1 Official celebration Communist “international labor day”.

            5-1 United States declared National “Law Day” (signifying Satanists as the law makers)

            5-1 Known as BELTANE, an ancient pagan Satanic sabbath aka “Walpurgis night”. When human sacrifices and blood rituals are performed to honor Lucifer.

            5-1 PRESIDENTIAL DIRECTIVE 51. Signed by Satanist George Bush junior. Gives the standing president undisputed dictatorial authority for 10 years in the event of “emergency”.

            5-1 5150= Police code for the “criminally insane”

            5-1 Year 1900. Over 200 miners die in horrible “accident”.

            5-1 Launch date of the demoralizing “Howard Stern Show”.

            5-1 SNAKE= numeralogically adds up to a perfect 50. In divisions of 10, the number of “mastery”

            I could go on forever, but just look for the pentagram, it’s more of their ID. Texaco, Wal Mart, On Star, every military on the planet……. the “five points” only achieved upon the first calendar day.

            The pentagram, has five “points”, representing the physical temporal elements. EARTH, AIR, FIRE, WATER, and CONSCIOUSNESS.

            The key point “consciousness” pointed downwards in Satanism, representing the physical “fleshly lusts” elements dominance over spirit.

            The cross of Malta worn by the Nazi’s, the Queen of England, and the Pope- representing the four winds of the earth or compass- from the isle of Malta where ancient human sacrifices were offered to a pagan “mother earth” fertility goddess.

            This is why the Windsors (Sax Gotha), and Rothschilds sponsored Adam Weishaupt to create the Illuminati, the modern evolution of the ancient Satanic orders and bloodlines under the direct supervision of the IHS Jesuit Order. The Vatican, a front for Satanic worship, each noble member from a member dragon bloodline family, descended from the 33rd parallel at which the fallen angels under Lucifer descended upon Mount Hermon, same as Roswell- 33rd parallel.

            The “New World Order” a combination/alliance of ancient pagan bloodlines, Druidic, and witchcraft lines. Dominated by hard core generational Satanic bloodlines such as descended through families like the Bush family, from Vlad the impaler.

            Rothschilds brag of their lineage through companies such as “NIMROD holdings inc”. Who descended through Solomon’s pagan wives when he turned from God to worship Ashtoreth and other Gods. Thus, the Star of David hexagram, originally from Ashtoreth.

            The machinery and framework/skeleton of the conspiracy is directed under the demon Gods and high worshipers of Lucifer who believe they are evolving Gods- through the “Empire of the City” (Vatican, London city, WA DC) which are each their own independent sovereign nation, Freemasonry, and other classified secretive institutions. The double headed phoenix a symbol of their continuity of power through every thesis/anti thesis they have created and destroyed, dominance of both the political and secular realms, throughout all recorded history.

          • Bob666

            Yo Gab,
            not quite what I was expecting, but thanks for the answer.

          • http://gabrielalanking.wordpress.com gabrielalanking

            THE ARCHITECTS OF THE SATANIC GLOBAL NEW WORLD ORDER….. A LIST OF THE MOST POWERFUL FAMILIES ON EARTH.

            House of Borja
            House of Breakspeare
            House of Somaglia
            House of Orsini
            House of Conti
            House of Chigi
            House of Colonna
            House of Farnese
            House of Medici
            House of Gaetani
            House of Pamphili
            House of Este
            House of Aldobrandini

            The Li family of China Van Duyn
            The Houses of Rothschild Krup
            The Rockefeller’s Disney
            The House of Warburg McDonald
            The Oppenheimer’s Taft
            The Windsors (Saxe Coburg Gotha) family Bush
            The Capetian family Harriman
            The Collins family Weishaupt
            The Dupont’s Luxembourg
            The Habsburg’s Plantagenet
            Vanderbuilt’s Drakenberg
            Kennedy

            Onassis House of Orange / Nassau
            Stuarts House of Guelph (Britain) Sinclair
            House of Wettin (Belgium) Forbes
            House of Bernadotte (Sweden) Christi
            House of Liechtenstein (Liechtenstein) Stuarts
            Fraser
            House of Oldenburg (Denmark) Cambell
            House of Hohenzollern (Germany) Caldwell
            House of Hanover (Germany) Gordon
            House of Bourbon (France) Leslie
            House of Orange (Netherlands) Usmanov
            House of Grimaldi (Monaco)
            House of Wittelsbach (Germany)
            House of Braganza (Portugal)
            House of Nassau (Luxembourg)
            House of Habsburg (Austria)
            House of Savoy (Italy)
            House of Karadjordjevic (Yugoslavia)
            House of Wurttemberg (Germany)
            House of Zogu (Albania)

            Morgan Chase
            Schiff
            Goldman Sachs
            Lehman
            Kuhn Loebs
            Stillman’s
            Lazard’s
            Israel Moses Seifs
            House of Bourbon (King Juan Carlos of Spain)
            Astor
            Bundy
            Freeman
            Reynolds
            Russel

          • http://gabrielalanking.wordpress.com gabrielalanking

            THE ARCHITECTS OF THE SATANIC GLOBAL NEW WORLD ORDER….. A LIST OF THE MOST POWERFUL FAMILIES ON EARTH.

            House of Borja
            House of Breakspeare
            House of Somaglia
            House of Orsini
            House of Conti
            House of Chigi
            House of Colonna
            House of Farnese
            House of Medici
            House of Gaetani
            House of Pamphili
            House of Este
            House of Aldobrandini

            The Li family of China Van Duyn
            The Houses of Rothschild Krup
            The Rockefeller’s Disney
            The House of Warburg McDonald
            The Oppenheimer’s Taft
            The Windsors (Saxe Coburg Gotha) family Bush
            The Capetian family Harriman
            The Collins family Weishaupt
            The Dupont’s Luxembourg
            The Habsburg’s Plantagenet
            Vanderbuilt’s Drakenberg
            Kennedy http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/esp_sociopol_dragoncourt.htm
            http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/biblianazar/thefamily.htm#Additional_Information

            Onassis House of Orange / Nassau
            Stuarts House of Guelph (Britain) Sinclair
            House of Wettin (Belgium) Forbes
            House of Bernadotte (Sweden) Christi
            House of Liechtenstein (Liechtenstein) Stuarts
            Fraser
            House of Oldenburg (Denmark) Cambell
            House of Hohenzollern (Germany) Caldwell
            House of Hanover (Germany) Gordon
            House of Bourbon (France) Leslie
            House of Orange (Netherlands) Usmanov
            House of Grimaldi (Monaco)
            House of Wittelsbach (Germany)
            House of Braganza (Portugal)
            House of Nassau (Luxembourg)
            House of Habsburg (Austria)
            House of Savoy (Italy)
            House of Karadjordjevic (Yugoslavia)
            House of Wurttemberg (Germany)
            House of Zogu (Albania)

            Morgan Chase
            Schiff
            Goldman Sachs
            Lehman
            Kuhn Loebs
            Stillman’s
            Lazard’s
            Israel Moses Seifs
            House of Bourbon (King Juan Carlos of Spain)
            Astor
            Bundy
            Freeman
            Reynolds
            Russel

  • Suzie

    Whatever we want to call ourselves Republican, Libertarian, Conservative, Constitutionalist, etc. None of us will probably get the perfect party that we agree with 100%, but we must remember this, “United we stand, Divided we fall”. If we don’t want the progressive, socialist, Marxists running this country we had better come together for everyone’s sake. If we don’t think this country is worth fighting for, we will lose it. And when we fight amongst ourselves, we play into the hands of those who believe this great country should be “fundamentally transformed”.

    • http://wildeyguns.com The Christian American

      Benjamin Franklin when asked: What kind of government did your give us Mr Franklin? He responded: A constitutional Republic madam, if you can keep it. John Adam said: “This Constitution is for the governance of a moral and religious people. It is UNFIT for the governance of any other”.

      • Deerinwater

        Well? That leaves a good 30% out doesn’t it? ~ The thing is, ~ morals is not something to Legislate but something to practice and teach.

  • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

    We do not need one party with two “names”: Democratic and Republican. We need AT LEAST two parties, preferably more. So it is time to do away with the RINO (Republican in Name Only) party that espouses the same things as the dems do.

    Personally, since both parites are corrupt, I would prefer we dump them both, have NO PARTIES, just candidates who stand on their own merits and policies.

    • matforce

      What are your thoughts about a labor party or working man’s party, or party for the Commoner, whose premise is to fight for policies that promote the prosperity of all USA citizens?

      • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

        Define what you mean when you say that a “… whose premise is to fight for policies that promote the prosperity of all USA citizen”.

        Do you mean that they decide what all citizens need? Or…
        Do you mean that they let the citizens decide what the citizens need to “prommote the prosperity of all USA citizens”?

        I am all for individual freedom to decide what they want to do with their life, and to take the consequences of their decisions. (decide to steal, get caught, get prosecuted. decide to open a business – few regulations to stop them instead of the myriad of regulations that actually has more to do with creating more, and sustaining those already in place, bureacracies then anything else.

        I believe that all US citizens have the right to catch the type of life they want themselves.
        Benjamin Franklin said: “The Constitution only guarantees the American people the right to pursue happiness. You have to catch it yourself.”

        A good government is one “which shall restrain men from injuring one another, shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread that it has earned. Thomas Jefferson

        What is happening in the USA today is a deliberate destruction of jobs: Free Trade where those in our gov PAID businesses to leave the USA and set up in foreign nations (corporate welfare – still going on), etc. This was deliberate destruction of our way of life – do the research – though reading all of those: Free Trade, NAFCA, CAFCA, Agenda 21, everything to do with the UN and NATO, WTO, etc and that will open your eyes quite a bit as to just how organized this has been over decades.

        But then what happened in Germany (Read the Opening Statement by Justice Robert H. Jackson, Chief of Counsel for the United States, Nuremburg Trials to get an idea), about the length of time to take over the legitimate constitutional government there, and you will see that this has been tried before. Though this time they took over what used to be the mainstream media and is now owned by a cartel to be able to direct public opinion. They took over our schools.

        ‘When an opponent declares, “I will not come over to your side,” I calmly say, “Your child belongs to us already…. What are you? You will pass on. Your descendants, however, now stand in the new camp. In a short time they will know nothing else but this new community.’ Adolf Hitler, German dictator. speech, Nov. 6, 1933.

        “If they can get you asking the wrong questions, they don’t have to worry about the answers”. Thomas Pynchon

        ”Good intentions will always be pleaded for every assumption of authority. It is hardly too strong to say that the Constitution was made to guard the people against the dangers of good intentions. There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters”. Noah Webster

        Pol Pot was a consistent practitioner of the philosophy of altruism-collectivism – the widespread view that the individual is sacrificial fodder for the so-called “good of humanity” – the same philosophy that underlies our health-care system, welfare programs and countless other altruist-collectivist schemes. Glenn Woiceshyn

        Every collectivist revolution rides in on a Trojan horse of “Emergency”. It was a tactic of Lenin, Hitler and Mussolini…. The invasion of New Deal Collectivism was introduced by this same Trojan horse. Herbert Hoover

        The art of leadership … consists in consolidating the attention of the people against a single adversary and taking care that nothing will split up that attention…. The leader of genius must have the ability to make different opponents appear as if they belonged to one category. Adolf Hitler

        “The federal government knows how to break your legs, hand you a crutch, and then say, ‘If it weren’t for the government, you wouldn’t be able to walk.’” Harry Brown

        “As societies grow decadent, the language grows decadent, too. Words are used to disguise, not to illuminate, action. (you liberate a city by destroying it.) Words are to confuse, so that at election time people will solemnly vote against their own interests” Gore Vidal

        ”You always write it’s bombing, bombing, bombing. It’s not bombing, it’s air support”. Air Force Colonel David Opfer, complaining to reporters about their coverage of the Vietnam War.

        “Our yearning for democracy is accompanied by a no less profound yearning for peace. And the media also faced the task of historical engineering to establish this required truth. We therefore have phenomena called ‘peace missions’ and the ‘peace process’. These are terms that apply to whatever the United States happens to be doing or advocating at some moment… in short, ‘War is Peace’.” Noam Chomsky, professor of linguistics at MIT, in a lecture given in 1988 entitled ‘Necessary illusions’

        “Hitler and Joseph Goebbels understood that if you say something loud and long enough many people will believe it. A good journalist’s first priority should be to separate propaganda from fact — but sometimes its very hard to do that.” Bill Oreilly, The Oreily Factor, Jan 24, 2000

        “The advance planning and sense stimuli employed to capture a $10 million cigarette or soap market are nothing compared to the brainwashing and propaganda blitzes used to ensure control of the largest cash market in the world: the Executive Branch of the United States Government.” Phyllis Schlafl

        ”I’ve come to understand that a cultural war is raging across our land, in which, with Orwellian fervor, certain acceptable thoughts and speech are mandated.
        For example, I marched for civil rights with Dr. King in 1963 – long before Hollywood found it fashionable. But when I told an audience last year that white pride is just as valid as black pride or red pride or anyone else’s pride, they called me a racist.
        I’ve worked with brilliantly talented homosexuals all my life. But when I told an audience that gay rights should extend no further than your rights or my rights, I was called a homophobe.
        I served in World War II against the Axis powers. But during a speech, when I drew an analogy between singling out innocent Jews and singling out innocent gun owners, I was called an anti-Semite.
        Everyone I know knows I would never raise a closed fist against my country. But when I asked an audience to oppose this cultural persecution, I was compared to Timothy McVeigh. From Time magazine to friends and colleagues, they’re essentially saying, “Chuck, how dare you speak your mind. You are using language not authorized for public consumption!” Charlton Heston, Speech to the Harvard Law School Forum, Feb. 16, 1999

        “If Congress has a right under the Constitution to issue paper money, it was given to them to use by themselves, not to be delegated to individuals or corporations”. Andrew Jackson

        ”If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their money, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them, will deprive the people of their property until their children will wake up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered”. Thomas Jefferson

        Inflation is the one form of taxation that can be imposed without legislation. Milton Friedman

        When the President signs this act, the invisible government by the money power will be legalized. Congressman Charles Lindbergh, Sr. to Congress after the vote on The Federal Reserve Act

        “Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power”. Benito Mussolini

        “I think there is a world market for maybe five computers.” Thomas Watson, chairman of IBM, 1943

        “Computers in the future may weigh no more than 1.5 tons.” Popular Mechanics, 1949

        “There is no reason anyone would want a computer in their home.” President and founder of Digital Equipment Corp., 1977

        “640K ought to be enough for anybody.” Bill Gates, 1981

        So you can see with small examples that I use a wide variety to form my opinions. And you?

      • matforce

        Kansas, I knew as soon as I entered that post someone would smell socialism. No, what I mean is that there should be a party that votes in favor of policies that further the prospects for job opportunities for all of our citizens. Don’t know if you read my rant below, but it speaks about the policies that have been incessantly lobbied for by BIG $$$ that benefits BIG $$$, and time has shown that they have been toxic to the middle class. FTAs were sold to a reluctant Democratic party as a way to increase jobs in the USA. It is obvious that these policies have done nothing but grease the skids for jobs to be set up abroad, with the blessing of our legislature. Why? Because they have benefited BIG $$$. Another example is the tax code that practically incentivizes the offshoring of jobs. See the fate of Bill S3816; it speaks volumes. That is my thrust. I realize I’m painting with a broad brush, but I see my Beautiful USA being torn apart for the benefit of our Plutocrats and it makes me want to spit! I’m simply advocating for an America that offers opportunity in a level playing field for those who have a vision, skill, energy and are willing to work their way, earn their keep in a land of opportunity.
        For example: I’m sure you heard about the human rights violations and working conditions (if not you should look into it) that exist in Red China’s sweatshops, but many figured, “That’s China’s problem. No skin off my behind!” Now these very sweatshops, operating under inhumane conditions, are bringing the mighty USA economy to its knees. Measures should have been taken long ago to prohibit this massive jobs exodus with tariffs, a tax code, or some type of punitive measure to level the playing field and keep our USA manufacturing sector home. Germany, a member of the WTO, imposes a 19% tariff and levels a VAT (value assessed tax depending on how much of a product was manufactured/assembled in Germany or outside) on imports to protect their industrial base and keep Germany’s middle class wages high, and doesn’t get so much as a raised eyebrow from the WTO. We don’t do any of that here.

        • Jim

          You hit the nail on the head, Germany’s government works to keep their middle class wages high and our Government works to lower our wages so the top 2% can increase their profits, after all that’s who puts them in office with mega buck donations
          .

      • matforce

        By the way, Kansas, that’s an impressive list of quotes and axioms! I may, with or without your permission, copy, paste, save and file them in a document for reference if you don’t, or even if you do… Thanks just the same!

      • matforce

        meant to say, “if you don’t or even if you do MIND” Thanks again.

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          You are welcome. I tend to write a lot, and research. I found sometimes it is really nice to keep a quote and use it to make a point, or many points. Friends send me them also.

          I love these, they seem to fit today very well.:
          “I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of them.” Thomas Jefferson

          “History records that the money changers have used every form of abuse, intrigue, deceit, and violent means possible to maintain their control over governments by controlling the money and its issuance.” James Madison

          “It is incumbent on every generation to pay its own debts as it goes. A principle which if acted on would save one-half the wars of the world.” Thomas Jefferson

          “If Congress has a right under the Constitution to issue paper money, it was given to them to use by themselves, not to be delegated to individuals or corporations”. Andrew Jackson

          “The Constitution is colorblind, and neither knows nor tolerates classes among citizens.” John Marshall (That does not account for the peoples attitudes then anymore then it does now. It applies to the document that is our government.)

          ”I wish it were possible to obtain a single amendment to our Constitution. I would be willing to depend on that alone for the reduction of the administration of our government; I mean an additional article taking from the Federal Government the power of borrowing”. Thomas Jefferson (This one is the BEST!)

          “There is no nation on earth powerful enough to accomplish our overthrow. Our destruction, should it come at all, will be from another quarter. From the inattention of the people to the concerns of their government, from their carelessness and negligence. I must confess that I do apprehend some danger. I fear that they may place too implicit a confidence in their public servants and fail properly to scrutinize their conduct; that in this way they may be made the dupes of designing men and become the instruments of their own undoing.” Daniel Webster

          “America’s glory is not dominion, but liberty. Her march is in the march of the mind. She has a spear and a shield: but the motto upon her shield is, FREEDOM, INDEPENDENCE, PEACE. This has been her Declaration: this has been, as far as her necessary intercourse with the rest of mankind would permit, her practice.” John Adams

          “It is to be remembered that the general government is not to be charged with the whole power of making and administering laws. Its jurisdiction is limited to certain enumerated objects…” James Madison, Federalist Essay No. 14

          “Never forget that everything Hitler did in Germany was legal.” Martin Luther King (after he took over the legitimate government)

          King quoting the Italian poet Dante, that “those who sit on the fence in times of moral crisis and maintain neutrality have the hottest fires in Hell reserved for them. Protesting while one is aware that wars have never been brought to an end or prevented through protest yet not calling for their prosecution can be seen as in effect only trying to look like one is not sitting on the fence”.

          Sorry, got carried away.

      • Howlingmad

        Never CONFUSE them, with the “TRUTH”, KANSAS . . . just his comment alone, PROVES he has “NO CLUE” about the MAN, or what he either THINKS, or KNOWS about. Stupidity “ABOUNDS” . . . what happened in “THIS” election, PROVES IT !

      • matforce

        You’ve been ominously warned by ‘mad, Kansas… In CAPS!

  • DrRGP

    No problem with your argument, but what do “we” do? We are, in fact, dying out as a (political) constituency. Demographics are against us; time is against us; and, all too often, we ourselves act against us interests.

    • Carl Manning – Sic Semper Tyrannis

      The best political message you can send these goons in the District of Criminals is to vote with your feet and get the hell out of this country under the divine Judgement of Almighty God if you have the financial wherewithal to do so. America is no longer a land of “Liberty and Justice” and with the criminal cabal running everything now will never be a land of opportunity ever again. Our forefathers left lands of oppression and inopportuntiy; our time has now come. The system as it is now can only be thwarted with an educated population, a billionaire running for office, and a billionaire starting a brand new tv network that embraces wholehreartedly the unabashed truth. This combination almost happened with Ross Perot, but there was no network of truth. Perot had to pay for several 30-minute infomercials to introduce himself and educate the American People on what crimes the District of Criminals were up to back then. They threatened to kill Perot and his own daughter; Perot has remained practically reclusive ever since. They would have done the same to Ron Paul if the CFR/NWO/globalist/Neocon propaganda media ever were to have allowed him to gain any political traction. That, of course, explains why they only gave him 48 seconds of airtime in one of the debates. Imagine what Ron Paul could have done had he gone Third Party and if he had been a billionaire and if there were a tv network in America similar to RT.

  • ALL AMERICAN

    When I say get’er done,…I’m speakin’ about the enema Capitol Hill needs.

    • http://midcontent brand inspector

      That starts with all the unelected, paper pushing, book trained theoryists, whoes brain smarts if it was fuel, couldn’t start a piss-ant’s moped. Same goes for most of the legalized leech lawyers that write up the so called rules and regulations, that screws the voters, but gives the pukes a pass. The Greasy Rangel , Whimp Daschle, Weiner Boy, John Corizine( who embezzled a few billion), or Whorehound Willy that lied under oath, all should be in Levenworth being somebody’s goat. Of course it might be like any closed door dem gathering!.

  • Hey you

    What did you expect? People who run big political parties are politicians.

    Any questions?

    • Deerinwater

      Correct, and politicians are usually attorneys that are schooled in the craft of “interpretation” of language, possessing the ability to tell someone to go to hell and they looking forward to the trip.

  • matforce

    The GOP has resorted to “blame the victim” mentality, and needs to formulate a plan to return the USA to the land of opportunity. There are certainly those who abuse the entitlement system; I know them and you know them. But those who have chimed in on this talking point, “More apply for disablity than jobs” a typical mantra from the Right (Allen West, Bill O’Reiley, Fox News, et al.) fail, as usual, to mention the real reasons for this tragedy; namely, the 9 million jobs that have been offshored/sent south, and the boarding up of 50,000 manufacturing facilities that once employed our hard working middle class citizens (Midwest “Industrial Belt become “rust belt” in just 18 years). It is much more convenient for them to blame Obama and push the, “Obama WANTS to enslave the masses by making them dependent on BIG BAD GOVERNMENT!” propaganda cries. They and the Right wing are apparently pushing for a new form of America that is no longer one of opportunity, but one where those who’ve been kicked to the curb and displaced by large scale Plutocratic greed, just lay down any defense against this “economic treason,” accept their fate, and martyr themselves for the sake of The Divided States of Plutocracy.

    The fact is, corporations are making record gains and are sitting on over $5 Trillion of cash garnered mostly from a declining middle class consumer market that is witnessing more and more of its constituents slipping into poverty in recent years. The nation’s wealth isn’t being “redistributed” from the wealthy to the poor through a burdensome tax code pitted against the rich, quite the opposite. Here’s why I say that:

    The great wage disparity that has occurred over the past 30 years has consolidated wealth at the top like we haven’t seen since the days of the Robber Barons a century ago. Maybe you think that there’s something wrong with a USA that promoted all of its citizens’ prosperity, but I don’t; it’s smart business. A middle class with disposable income will bolster retail sales and crank up the economy (this is if this increase actually boosts production in the USA and results in paychecks going into the pockets of USA workers like it used to do before the middle class was kicked to the curb for sweatshop labor on foreign soil.) Even so, during the past 30 years real output in the business sector grew by 140%. Real compensation per hour (includes wages, benefits, pensions, and health insurance) increased by only 38% for the middle class worker.
    Post WWII, 1947-1979 America shared equally in the increase in output. During those years the increase that the bottom 20% received was 116%, the top 20% got an increase of 99%, and the middle quintiles increased somewhere within that range.
    Then the world flipped! From 1980 to 2007 the rich took practically all the increase in income. Over those decades, the poor received only a 15% increase and the middle three quintiles got a 25% increase, while the top 20% got a 95% increase and the top 1% received a raise of close to 300%, and they were compensated fabulously before this trend began (Paul Heise, PhD, Economics).

    Plus, the middle class contributes to the national treasury (revenue) right off of their paycheck through a payroll tax. By gutting the middle class and depriving it from decent paying jobs by employing a cheap labor force on foreign soil, I hypothesize, you kill the goose that laid the golden egg. The wealthy that have remained super solvent in this 30 year trend of wealth consolidation at the top, have too many methods of hiding their wealth and keep it from being taxed (research “Top Ten Ways the Rich Escape Taxation), including parking it in offshore accounts. Is it any wonder why the debt is snowballing? The combination of a decimated, underemployed/unemployed middle class, and a privileged upper class that has been provided a myriad of means to hide their fabulous wealth, makes no sense anymore. To ask the privileged to put their shoulder to the wheel and chip in with this national crisis has been propagandized by some as “class warfare.” Disgusting!

    Republicans complain about the 35% corporate tax being the highest in the world, but have you looked into all the “corporate welfare” available to our “multinationals” that have taken tax subsidies to offset the cost of setting up shop offshore ($30-40 BILLION/yr. by some estimates; GE’s profits exceed $14 BILLION, but submit 24,000 pages of exemptions written by a team of ex-IRS employees, and pay zero taxes, for example, look into Exxon/Mobile, etc.) then park their profits in offshore accounts with impunity to escape contributing anything in taxation to their nation of origin. See the fate Bill S3816, it speaks volumes. http://www.opencongress.org/bill/111-s3816/show

    http://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/reports/pd/histdebt/histdebt.htm Click on this USA treasury record of national debt. It shows the accumulation of debt in the national treasury.
    During the last half of the 20th Century (1950s-2000) debt accelerated a in the $Billions (a few years in the 1950s there were actually surpluses). Then after the 60s it grew by the $tens of Billions. But after 1980, the advent of supply side economics, it grew by $100s of Billions/yr. Then during the Clinton years, when he raised taxes, it slowed to the $10s of Billions again.

    But once the FTA’s were introduced (actually it took a few years after their introduction), deficits reached the $100s of Billions from then on. Here’s my point: The increases in debt from 2001, when China joined the WTO, reached over $500 Billion/yr. from then on out and have not diminished. Google trade deficits: (over $600 BILLION avg. in trade deficits over the past 10 years).

    I have come to the realization after voting GOP for 30 years that they will use deceptions like kicking the hornets’ nest of social issues including but not limited to: reproductive rights, Evangelical Christians, gun rights, homosexuality, color, sable rattling, and a myriad of alleged “personal freedoms,” a type of fear mongering and the use of practiced cries of panic and outrage to divert their base’s attention away from the fact that their first and only true love is to the top, who are using their influence in our legislature to turn American the Beautiful, land of opportunity, into a mere Plutocracy. They have pitted us, one against another with this fear mongering, fanning the flames of our worst human instincts, inciting divisions along party lines, socio-economic lines, and racial lines to keep their base’s attention diverted from the fact that they serve only the top. When this can no longer be denied, the GOP will be in big trouble with the electorate, because they will feel used like yesterday’s newspaper and “hell hath no fury like a woman scorned,” or an electorate that realizes they’ve been used to craft their own demise.

    • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

      Actually corporate welfare is muchhigher then welfare for people. I will have to go through my notes to get the exact figures.

      • matforce

        I see you have read my rant. Please, if it’s not too much trouble, post your findings about corporate welfare, and if possible your references. I would be very grateful. I would like to compare notes. Celebrating an anniversary tonight, gotta go.

    • Right Brain Thinker

      This is not a “rant”, matforce, but one of the best-reasoned and deliberately truthful comments ever posted on PLD. Nice job. Did you consult the Who Rules America website for some of the data? If not, take a look there for more ammunition.

      • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

        Let’s talk about the REAL welfare problem. It’s about handouts to the uber-rich, the corporations, banking, and foreign nations (including China).

        The bottom line is if you’re a Fortune 500 company, banking, a member of the wealthiest 1%, or a foreign nation, you’re getting welfare, and a hell of a lot of it.

        Definition of “welfare” might include both housing assistance and food assistance, which comes to about $160 billion per year. If you were to add unemployment and the so-called “social exclusion” category – both of which most Americans don’t consider welfare — the amount in next year’s budget reaches approximately $400 billion. (from John Atcheson, Common Dreams) … if you were to add unemployment and the so-called “social exclusion” category – both of which most Americans don’t consider welfare — the amount in next year’s budget reaches approximately $400 billion. A total that is much less than the bailout for banks.

        Basically we spend $356 Billion plus on corporate welfare a year. Then there is banking.
        $700 billion bank bailout – to rescue banks from problems they themselves created. ‘Bank Bailouts:
        Then there’s the $700 billion bank bailout – to rescue banks from problems they themselves created. Yes it got paid back; and yes, we had to do something. But the reason this money was little more than welfare was because the banks got to do what they wanted to with it. It could have come with strings – we could have insisted that they write down mortgages to market value or allowed refinancing at lower interest rates or longer amortization periods. We could even have given the money directly to stressed homeowners, instead of the banksters who caused the problem. Any of these approaches would have prevented defaults, slowed – or even reversed – the precipitous declines in real estate values, and given low and middle income consumers some ability to consume, which, at the end of the day is the real “job creator.” And we most certainly could have insisted that banks money loan out the money to small businesses and home buyers.

        But we did nothing like that. Instead, we allowed the banks to play a high stakes game of pump-and-dump – complete with flash trading – with our money. Instead of loans designed to jump start the economy, we got risky investments underwritten with our tax money that paid off only the Wall Street elite’ (from John Atcheson, Common Dreams)

        Then there is the $9 Trillion in Low and No Interest Loans from the Fed, loaned at below market rates – some of it as low as .5%. Here again, this money disappeared into the money vaults of the select few, rather than benefiting the common good.

        Two years ago I spent almost a full year tracking foreign aid, economic aid, and military aid (not the others) to foreign nations (BIG pain sicne most of it is hidden, renamed, etc).
        We give foreign aid to over 140 nations. I personally tracked 25 foreign nations to the tune of close to $2 Trillion. Research it for yourself. Don’t go by what they list in the released for the public Foreign Aid figures, they are WAY low.

        Plus, if we are not going to get the $1 Trillion China OWES the USA from the mid 1940′s and 50′s back (plus interest – NOR is it ever brought up or subtracted) shouldn’t that be added to foreign aid? (No, I didn’t count it).

        But if they get the poeple mad and blaming each other, they keep us separated. It is not, nor has it ever really been welfare that is the problem with our nation. The problem is we have corruption at the top who are willing to commit treason and destroy our nation all to line their pockets – and it is EASILY visible to those who will quit watching TV and LOOK.

      • Right Brain Thinker

        Keep it coming K-Bright! The truth shall set us all free (if we can turn off the TV and look at it, that is)

        PS Do you really live in Kansas? Does anyone there think as you do?

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          You have never heard “Kansas” as a name?

      • matforce

        Thanks, Right Brain, always enjoy reading your even, well thought out posts. No I didn’t use that site, but I visited that site about a year ago when I began looking into what’s going on in the USA, might have been when I first began to investigate the wealth distribution. And thanks Kansas for sharing your findings; a wealth of information. Appreciate it!

      • Right Brain Thinker

        Kansas Bright says: “You have never heard “Kansas” as a name?”

        Frankly, no. Georgia and Virginia, perhaps. Though I must admit that “Kansas Bright” is a bit more euphonious than “Rhode Island Jones” or “New Hampshire Smith”.

  • Bob666

    Mr Lee,
    I live in Florida and I can tell you that Mr. West was defeated because left a great deal to be desired when it came to representing his Constituency. He was far more consumed with the TEA party that representing the people who ellected him.

    I know this might be dificult for you, but even TEA party folks can be worthless.

    • http://midcontent brand inspector

      Bob666,
      I think you have drinking too much pond water coming from the socialist/marxist democrap club house. I wonder if you have ever been to any Tea Party meetings? Most socialist/marxists can not say anything that is not rote spoken, which is at special ed 2nd grade level. They always slasm anyone who tells them they are dumber than ddirt, and dirt is useful for putting manure on it, where as dems spout manure and creates only problems and confusion. I have been in the democrap party aago, and left the gatherings, because the party;s MO is to seperate everyone in groups, just all socialist/marxist they beleive in. For ebery dumorat gathering should require a prostitution permit, of course since they are of the same mental bent infected family, it just normal behavior that has went on from day 1.

      • Bob666

        “not say anything that is not rote spoken” and you made it out of third grade?????

      • http://midcontent brand inspector

        Bob666,
        When I say rote spoken, it just like the pedophile worshipping rrug scrubbing freaks, repeat the Moohmeed’s mental BS rambings over and over till they can not think for themselves, np wonder demorats a mulim pervs are such good buds. Repeat the same dung ever time someone tells them, they are women and goat abusers.

      • nc

        Brand inspector, Did you ever go to any of the hundreds of Republicans rallies where you were told the “way” to good government which were conducted by the perverts Mark Foley, Larry Craig and that holy Roller right wing Christian preacher who was doing dope and playing root canal with his male trainer! Man was it great to hear the remarks of those wonderful CONSERVATIVE Repugnut LEADERS!!

  • http://freedomfromthepress.net Steven Thompson

    I gave up on the Republican party in 1992. The GOP and the Democrats are one in the same when it comes to big government and fiscal spending.

    We’ve all heard the saying, “Politics is Local.” When I think of local-government-spending I’m reminded of taxes being used to build shopping malls in Seattle and Spokane for the mega wealthy Cowles and Nordstrom families. Dig a little deeper and you’ll find millions of taxpayer dollars that were spent to build arena’s and mega stadiums for professional athletes to play their chosen games. Has the National Football League and Major League Baseball become so destitute that they require their franchise teams to pander for public money to subsidize their multi billion dollar industries? Just this year, the City of Wenatchee pleaded in Olympia for additional tax money to subsidize a failed arena.

    Washington, Jefferson, Lincoln, Adams, Monroe would all be shaking their collective heads in total disgust if they saw what modern day “fiscal liberals” had done to their union.

    Oh, and I’m proud to announce that I wrote-in Ron Paul for President in the 2012 general election. Those of you who call yourselves “conservatives” who support big government spending are what I refer to as “fiscal liberals” and for that, you can KMA…

    • http://midcontent brand inspector

      Steve,
      You are a other pee brained idoit who beleives in Onumnutts for voting a 3rd party canidate. It only give thre chump in the WH a free pass. As for KYA, no can do that, tooany socialist/marxists are in line trying too rescue the clown that is implanted in that region, because his ears wouldn’t fold back. A demorat is easy to spot with their pistol grip ears and fold back heads.

  • http://yahoo.com Irish19

    Why is it that some conservatives live in a closet. I truly believe if a constitutional party was put into play in local and national elections, then we would see more school boards, city and town councils, mayors , governors, senators, congressmen and yes a President win elections. Think of the base we as conservatives already have. Tea Partiers, evangelicals, libertarians, and for the most part social conservatives. It is not improbable that this third party, completely void of liberal republicans and democrats can win with at least 40% of the vote while the other 2 parties split the remaining 60%. Why is there so much angst about leaving the 2 parties and forming a third. I believe if we do not seriously do this we will lose our country. Our children and future generations will only read of what liberty and freedom were all about. of course that depends if they were handed down such American history, given that the government, teachers unions and radical left wing statists are dumbing down America and replacing it with marxist and statist thought. The biggest change through a society is through the children. Brainwashing can be achieved simply by not offereing any choice. If we are not ready to take our country back by forming a constitutional conservative party today, then when? Big government is the staple of most all our politicians today. An R or a D after their name does not and will not change our society for the better. RINO’s have become CINOs and I blame true conservatives for allowing the wolves dressed in sheeps clothing to get in office. Look at John Boehner Mitch Mcconnell, Eric Cantor, Lindsay Graham, John mcCain, Collins, and even pundits like Bill Krystol, Charles K(I cnnot spell his name), These people all are not what we need to help in our very survival. These people are also in leadership positions, which is a double whammy. Those who vote FOR a compromise plan are not and never will be true constitutional conservative. Watch who votes for any compromise. We are at a point where our so called elected officials need to put their feet to the fire and vote for America and not for some watered down compromise which does nothing to reduce debt and everything toward spending more. Obama does not have a mandate and these republicans either need to get on the train or get off. We will sort them out at election time and send only those who promise to really uphold the constitution and give government back to the States. All federal dept’s need to go back to the states. The States need to step to the plate and vote for States rights. It will take 37 states to ratify such an event, but if we get enough constitutionalists in office across this country it can happen. Not overnight but in time. The liberals took 100 years to get universal health care and we now have it. It can be repealed. with 60+ in the senate and a majority in congress. We have spineless politicians in Washington who just want to hold on to power. They will sell their souls and sell out American citizens to do it. If we are not ready to take this country back, then when?

  • Bob666

    You need to go and read the letters of Mr. Franklin and Mr. Adams at that time. If you do, your statement would be very different. Both sought a belief in god, but it is well doccument that both DID NOT want god in government.

    While there were many of our founding fathers who did (most were Quakers), most of the founders recalled the the Tyrantical influence of the church on the various kings and queens of europe like the Crusades and the rift between the Pope and the church of England.

    Fact is: more people have been killed in the name of god than for any other reason through out the history of man.

  • JeffH

    We[the people]petition the obama administration to:

    Remove Barack Obama as President of the United States on the grounds that he does not meet Constitutional requirements.

    https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/remove-barack-obama-president-united-states-grounds-he-does-not-meet-constitutional-requirements/PysRVyGC

    • Bob666

      Jeff,
      That just don’t hunt, in fact, he is stiff and cold. Are you suffering from an altered state of reality? take your meds and everything will be OK.

      • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

        I don;t just want to see Obama removed from office, I want to see him arrested and prosecuted for treason, murder, war crimes, mass murder, and various other criminal and civil activity he has been doing that is against our laws.

        Even more I want to see both Bush’s, and both Clinton’s also arrested and prosecuted for the same crimes (some of the ‘various other crimes’ are different). (And all of their adminstrations also).

        Election Fraud – all. I will just show treason, okay? (if necessary and proper the Militia’s can come together to enforce the arrests for the crime of Treason)

        Title 18 US code section 2381 – Treason: Whoever, owing allegiance to the United States, levies war against them or adheres to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort within the United States or elsewhere, is guilty of treason and shall suffer death, or shall be imprisoned not less than five years and fined under this title but not less than $10,000; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.

        18 USC § 2382 – Misprision of treason: Whoever, owing allegiance to the United States and having knowledge of the commission of any treason against them, conceals and does not, as soon as may be, disclose and make known the same to the President or to some judge of the United States, or to the governor or to some judge or justice of a particular State, is guilty of misprision of treason and shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than seven years, or both.

        18 USC § 2383 – Rebellion or insurrection: Whoever incites, sets on foot, assists, or engages in any rebellion or insurrection against the authority of the United States or the laws thereof, or gives aid or comfort thereto, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States. (That would be “change” and using propaganda, lies, misinformation, and a corporate media cartel, Agenda 21, UN).

        18 USC § 2384 – Seditious conspiracy: If two or more persons in any State or Territory, or in any place subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, conspire to overthrow, put down, or to destroy by force the Government of the United States, or to levy war against them, or to oppose by force the authority thereof, or by force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States, or by force to seize, take, or possess any property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof, they shall each be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both. (Fast and Furious, Benghazi, UN, Agenda 21, etc)

        Whoever knowingly or willfully advocates, abets, advises, or teaches the duty, necessity, desirability, or propriety of overthrowing or destroying the government of the United States or the government of any State, Territory, District or Possession thereof… assassination of any officer of any such government; or
        Whoever, with intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of any such government, prints, publishes, edits, issues, circulates, sells, distributes, or publicly displays any written or printed matter advocating, advising, or teaching the duty, necessity, desirability, or propriety of overthrowing or destroying any government in the United States by force or violence, or attempts to do so; or
        Whoever organizes or helps or attempts to organize any society, group, or assembly of persons who teach, advocate, or encourage the overthrow or destruction of any such government by force or violence; or becomes or is a member of, or affiliates with, any such society, group, or assembly of persons, knowing the purposes thereof… (UN & NATO with the assistance of this administration, the Bush administration, the Clinton adminstration, the Bush 1 adminstration…)

        Remember that Obama has said numerous times that he does NOT represent the US, that he is a representative for the UN and NATO. That Panetta, Dempsey, Obama said to the senate that they gave authority OVER the USA to the UN. That they gave authority over the US Military to the UN. In a letter to Boehner, in front of the senate, its on video, etc.

        That is TREASON. All in the Senate that day also committed Treason. Boehner also committed Treason.

        Yet, I got the feeling they were waiting to see if anyone said anything about those treasonous acts when they happened. Few did, so they committed more crimes against the people of America.

        • Motov

          I’d like to see the Shrub charged with 9-11, One of the biggest crimes ever committed.
          Including those who intimidated witnesses there to change their story to align with their “official report” or else!

      • JeffH

        Bob666, you prefer to insult with ad hominems rather than check the validity of the facts…simply put, if you knew or understood the Constitution and it’s history as well as the 4 Supreme Court cases that have defined who can and cannot be a “natural born citizen” and actually understood the difference between a “citizen” and a “natural born citizen” and how the “Framer’s” arrived at and came to insert “natural born citizen” requirement into the Constitution, Article II, Section 1, Clause 5.

        Educate yourself.
        http://www.federalistblog.us/2008/11/natural-born_citizen_defined/

        • Bob666

          Jeff,
          “No Person except a natural born Citizen, or a Citizen of the United States, at the time of the Adoption of this Constitution, shall be eligible to the Office of President; neither shall any Person be eligible to that Office who shall not have attained to the Age of thirty five Years, and been fourteen Years a Resident within the United States”.

          Short, sweet and to the point. Everything that you have provided is pure conjecture.

          • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

            Actually you’re incorrect in that the courts decided who is a “natural born” citizen.

            As a protection against foreign influences and intrigues, the founding fathers carefully worked to draft a constitution that would protect this from happening. Strict requirements were put in place for anyone who wished to get into elected positions in the national government.

            The President, Vice President, Senator or Congressman must have reached a certain age as well as had residency in the US for a number of consecutive years prior to attaining election to office.

            The president must be a ‘natural born’ citizen or a citizen of the United States at the time of the adoption of the constitution, however, Senators and Congressmen merely need to be a citizen.

            Think back to England; the feudal form of government that the British adopted did not allow for natural rights for all citizens. All rights were granted to the people by the government of the Monarchy, the Monarchy was the sovereign not the people.

            .The first US Supreme Court decision, Chisholm v. Georgia, written by Chief Justice John Jay, hods the first clue as to the type of citizenship the founding fathers adopted for the new nation:

            “The sovereignty of the nation is in the people of the nation, and the residuary sovereignty of each State in the people of each State…
            At the Revolution, the sovereignty devolved on the people; and they are truly the sovereigns of the country, but they are sovereigns without subjects…”

            Chief Justice John Jay was also the person who sent this letter to George Washington the summer of 1787 before the constitution was finalized:

            “Permit me to hint whether it would not be wise and seasonable to provide a strong check to the admission of foreigners into the administration of our national government ; and to declare expressly that the command in chief of the American army shall not be given to, nor devolve on any but a natural born citizen.”

            Justice James Wilson, 1791, writes:

            “The law of nature, when applied to states and political societies, receives a new name, that of the law of nations. This law, important in all states, is of peculiar importance in free ones. The States of America are certainly entitled to this dignified appellation…But if the knowledge of the law of nations is greatly useful to those who appoint, it surely must be highly necessary to those who are appointed…As Puffendorff thought that the law of nature and the law of nations were precisely the same, he has not, in his book on these subjects treated of the law of nations separately; but has every where joined it with the law of nature, properly called so…the law of nature is applied to individuals; the law of nations is applied to states.”

            The law of nations about who were the citizens of a nation:

            “The citizens are the members of the civil society; bound to this society by certain duties, and subject to its authority, they equally participate in its advantages.
            The natives, or natural-born citizens, are those born in the country, of parents who are citizens. As the society cannot exist and perpetuate itself otherwise than by the children of the citizens, those children naturally follow the condition of their fathers, and succeed to all their rights. The society is supposed to desire this, in consequence of what it owes to its own preservation; and it is presumed, as matter of course, that each citizen, on entering into society, reserves to his children the right of becoming members of it. The country of the fathers is therefore that of the children; and these become true citizens merely by their tacit consent. We shall soon see whether, on their coming to the years of discretion, they may renounce their right, and what they owe to the society in which they were born. I say, that, in order to be of the country, it is necessary that a person be born of a father who is a citizen; for, if he is born there of a foreigner, it will be only the place of his birth, and not his country.”

            According to natural law which is that of the law of nations children follow the conditions of the father. The 1866 act passed by congress stated:
            “All persons born in the United States, and not subject to any foreign power excluding Indians not taxed, are hereby declared to be citizens of the United States.”

            In 1885, US Secretary Of State under Grover Cleveland, Thomas Bayard, decided that ‘the son of a German subject, born in Ohio, was not a citizen under the statute or the Constitution, because “he was on his birth ’subject to a foreign power,’ and ‘not subject to the jurisdiction of the United States’ Thomas Bayard was the fourth generation of his family to serve in the U.S. Senate and was considered a prominent Bourbon Democrat.

            George H. Yeaman, constitutional scholar from the mid-late 1800’s who certainly would have been familiar with Kent, Story & Wilson’s works which were the only American works for law students to study during that time. Yeaman was the US Minister to Copenhagen from 1865-1870 and was also a professor of law at Columbia College. In 1867 Yeaman wrote a thesis titled: Allegiance and citizenship: An inquiry into the claim of European Governments to Exact Military Service of Naturalized Citizens of the United States. In the thesis, Yeaman writes of the unconstitutionality of dual citizenship and its ill effects on sovereign citizens & the continued existence of our sovereign nation.

            To quote from American writers and statesmen who maintain the liberal view on this subject would be to incur the objection of attempting to sustain our position by our own authorities. To accept as law the opinions of those modern European writers who have maintained the theory of indissoluble allegiance and continuing, unavoidable duty to serve the crown, would be to yield the contest for truth and right, to those who discover a supposed interest in. maintaining what we hold for error. It will be far more satisfactory to rely upon general principles, and, so far as authority is invoked, to seek for it in the works of those great European masters of the Laws of Nature and of Nations who built up and illustrated the science of which they are the acknowledged fathers…

            Vattel discusses the matter more explicitly than any who had preceded him in the science of natural and public law and international jurisprudence…
            “every man, on coming of age, may determine for himself if his interest is to remain a member of the society in which he was born…
            writers, statesmen, diplomats, and legislators who have treated allegiance, which is imposed by the accident of birth, as an indestructible tie, have labored against reason, against nature, against the highest authority and against common sense practical to mankind. The states which adopt this theory are far municipal regulations, an extraterritorial effect, in this, that though they may enforce them against those who under the laws of nations does not subject a foreigner to any but the command of his own government…”

            The constitution requires that the President shall be a natural born citizen, or a citizen of the United States at the time of the adoption of the constitution, and that he shall have attained to the age of thirty-five years, and shall have been fourteen years a resident within the United States. Considering the greatness of the trust, and that this department is the ultimately efficient executive power in government, these restrictions will not appear altogether useless or unimportant. As the President is required to be a native citizen of the United States, ambitious foreigners cannot ; intrigue for the office, and the qualifications of birth cuts off all those inducements from abroad to corruption, negotiation and war, which have frequently and fatally harassed the elective monarchies of Germany and Poland, as well as the Pontificate at Rome… James Kent, Commentaries on American Law, Part II: Of the Government and the Jurisprudence of the United States, 1826 (Often deliberately mistated out of context by progressives.)

            Breaking it down, Kent said:
            “As the President is required to be a native citizen of the United States, ambitious foreigners cannot; intrigue for the office (here he is speaking of the grandfather clause (a citizen at the time of the adoption of the constitution)”,
            Then he goes onto part II:
            “and the qualifications for birth (natural born citizen) cuts off all those inducements from abroad to corruption, negotiation and war”,…

      • JeffH

        Conjecture? Au contraire. What I have provided is recorded historical fact.

        http://www.fourwinds10.net/siterun_data/government/us_constitution/news.php?q=1308252582

        Your conclusion is based on pure conjecture and a complete misunderstanding of the Framer’s intent. If you would honestly care to know the truth I can only provide you with that path. Whether you choose to take it or remain ignorant is your choice.

        • Bob666

          Jeffery,
          “Your conclusion is based on pure conjecture and a complete misunderstanding of the Framer’s intent. If you would honestly care to know the truth I can only provide you with that path. Whether you choose to take it or remain ignorant is your choice”

          You draw up a bunch of hyperbole to support an agenda that you hold dear, but the bottom line is; the doccument is short, sweet and to the point. Your dog is dead, cold and stiff and he really sucked at hunting anyway.

          To continue to engage you in this discussion is akin to engaging in a battle of wits with an unarmed person, or let me be blunt. I was taught not to pick on the retarded kid.

      • JeffH

        Bob, you’re awfully good a parroting what you hear but you’re very short on substance…typical of an ignorant progressive.

        “He who joyfully marches to music in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would surely suffice.”
        -A.E.

        “Being ignorant is not so much a shame, as being unwilling to learn.”
        -Benjamin Franklin

        • Bob666

          Jeff,
          I love guys like you that have to impress us all with your patriotism and knowledge of our founding fathers and the American Flag as your symbol and you probably are an expert on just about everything. Hell, you probably knew what god was thinking personally and if we don’t believe you, well you’re going to tell us if we like it or not. I bet you have an American Flag on the back of your Nissan truck.

          You have the inside track on what church we should all belong to, how or economy should work and who should be the ruler of the universe. Yes Jeff, any path that you don’t take is obviously the wrong path and we can all count on you to let us know that.

          How many times have you been married or do you still live at home with your mother?

      • JeffH

        Bob, excuse me while I LMAO at you. It’s so easy to read you progressive hacks…when all else fails you just can’t control your emotions. Seems you have a few issues that get under your skin just a tad…the church, patriotism, the American flag, facts, morality, honesty and the inability to accept the overwhelming fact that Obama is not and never has been a “natural born citizen”.

        Oh,and thank you for responding and argueing with me…guess I’m not a retard afterall. But YOU?

        “Stupidity is a talent for misconception.”
        - Edgar Allan Poe

        • http://smoovious.wordpress.com Smoovious Laxness

          > Bob, excuse me while I LMAO at you. It’s so easy to
          > read you progressive hacks…when all else fails you
          > just can’t control your emotions.

          That’s just a failsafe reaction that commonly happens when their programming/conditioning is failing them, unable to cope with the concepts at hand.

          Unless it is a topic where they can parrot back phrases according to the keywords that trigger them, their conditioned thought processes just break down and their programming kicks them into self-preservation/defense mode.

          This is a pretty common occurrence, you’ll get accustomed to it.

          – Smoov

          • Bob666

            Jeff,
            So we should take that you still live at home in your Mothers Basement? and I bet you own at least one cat-named after a founding father, no, your a Dog guy-big dog to over compensate for someting.

            Mom must be so proud.

          • http://www.edwinrankin.com Ed Rankin

            When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser.”– Socrates

          • Craig Wettstein

            Jeff….you’re a condescending A–!!!!

      • JeffH

        Craig Wettstein says “Jeff….you’re a condescending A–!!!!”

        Wow, you must have put some really deep thought to come up with such a profound statement.

        Condescending? Perhaps you should re-evaluate your own comment and re-read childish Bob999′s meaningless and Alinsky-esk drivel then take a long, hard look at yourself in the mirror. That is if the mirror isn’t broken.

        • Bob666

          Jeff and Smoov

          Let me squash your perception like a bug. I have been a Libertarian for twenty years now, long before the TEA party existed. Along with writing checks to Ron Paul, I have supported people in both parties based on what they stand for and the majority have been republicans.

          Personally Jeff, I could give a rats a*s what your views are, only that you have the right to express it here or anywhere else you care to. If I don’t agree with you, it’s my right to express it as well and the rest of the world can judge us if they care to. I read the Federalist papers in junior high school and yes there are some good points made by the various authors, but the constitution is rather specific. I get that you don’t like the current president and that’s really OK with me as he was not my first coice. But the whole birther concept is dead and you can debate all of the intentions of what you perceive our founding fathers had, but Obama is in office for another three years.

          Jeff, you use an avatar that is generally used by the US Marine Corp. If you are a Marine, past or presen, I commend you for your service. If you are not past or presently a Marine, that would connect the dots for me regarding you living situation. The difference between us is: I respect your right to exist, practice a different religion, belong to and vote for different party or own a gun, it’s your deal.

          This site has been a real insight to human nature.

          • Smoovious Laxness

            Well, not being quite sure why you mentioned me in that post, while not addressing anything you said to me, I went back to see just what post if mine your reply was underneath…

            and then I re-read your post that preceded mine, re-read again the one where you mentioned me, and one after…

            and I didn’t find anything of substance in any of them…

            so if you’re just going to keep blathering on like you’ve been doing, then yeah, my sniping comment still stands… otherwise, show me something that demonstrates you’ve gotten something out of your “20 years” as a Libertarian…

            I’m a Libertarian… and I have better things to do with my time than getting into pissing-contest flame-wars like you seem to be doing…

            You’re going to have to do better than this, Mr. Bob.

            – Smoov

      • JeffH

        Smoov, ignorant progressives like Bob999 are a dime a dozen.

        Ed Rankin, exactly!

        • Craig Wettstein

          Jeff…I sometimes get confused on who said what. I apoligize to you, as my comment should have been directed at Bob666. Again….Sorry!

      • JeffH

        Craig Wettstein, all is good, thanks. :)

      • JeffH

        Bob, you can say anything you want…it’s just blathering at this point.

        You have been acting like an ignorant progressive, that’s what you’ve portrayed yourself to be with your childish name calling and ad hominems.

        Feel free to continue on…it’s a good show for others here to see just how an ignorant progressive actions can come back and bite them.

        As far as you “Marine” avatar observation…you’re not even in the ballpark…the current avatar on display is the image of the “Gadsden flag”.
        Here, I’ll help you out.
        http://www.gadsden.info/history.html

        • Bob666

          “You have been acting like an ignorant progressive, that’s what you’ve portrayed yourself to be with your childish name calling and ad hominems”.

          Written from you moms basement, you probably have a subscription to Soldier of Fortune magazine as well.

      • JeffH

        Bob999 says “The difference between us is: I respect your right to exist, practice a different religion, belong to and vote for different party or own a gun, it’s your deal.”

        I say to you Bob999, with that statement, you are an outright liar!

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          I can tell you have never read Obamacare. You are going to be in for a big surprise…lol.
          Yes, I CAN say that, I have read it multiple times.

          The question I have is have you studied progressivism? Or are you just accepting what they tell you it is today – with all that government clarity we are also getting? First, it is NOT what Wilson or Roosevelt had planned. Todays “progressivism” is not even what LBJ had in mind.

          One more question, why would you accept the word of a man who has lied publicly to you and the rest of the people here multiple times about things that actually do affect your daily life? Or did you just “brush -off” the lies like corporate media tells you to?

          What lies, is that your question? /rolls eyes … sorry.

          Taking office Obama said, “In the next few weeks, I will sign an Executive Order clearing away the red tape that slows down too many construction projects”.

          Ending the Patriot Act.

          He also said earlier, “Between 1.2 million and 3.7 million full-time-equivalent jobs were created last year because of the stimulus”. {“Economists debate whether the stimulus lived up to its promise or was worth the cost, but no one seriously argues that it created no jobs.”
          And by doing simple division 814 billion/ No one seriously argues that it was worth the cost. Considering you could pay people $50,000/year for 5 years to stay home for the cost of the jobs that were “Created”. If there are any economists that think that would be “worth the cost” either they have single digit IQ’s or they are being paid by the administration.}
          Remember this? With unemployment hovering near 10 percent nearly two years after President Obama signed his economic stimulus package, Mr. Obama is acknowledging that, despite his campaign promises, “there’s no such thing as shovel-ready projects.”
          When the president campaigned for the stimulus package at the start of his presidency, he and others in his administration repeatedly insisted the investments would go to “shovel-ready” projects — projects that would put people to work right away.

          First LIE – and an education for you.
          The US Constitution is the supreme law of this land, not the federal government. The Constitution requires a specific legally binding Oath from those who serve as president. A different oath is required by the three branches of our government, the military, all law enforcement, the heads of the States, and all federal employees as they are required to take an Oath to support and defend the US Constitution, not an individual leader, ruler, office, or entity.

          The first law statute of the United States of America, enacted in the first session of the First Congress on 1 June 1789, was Statute 1, Chapter 1: an act to regulate the time and manner of administering certain oaths, which established the oath required by civil and military officials to support the Constitution.

          The wording of the Presidential Oath was established in the Constitution in Article II, Section 1, Clause 10: “I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States.”

          They are bound by their Oath to support the Constitution, and should they abrogate their Oath by their acts or inaction, are subject to charges of impeachment and censure.

          Solemn: “Legally binding, Common legal phrase indicating that an agreement has been consciously made, and certain actions are now either required or prohibited”, “The other requirement for an agreement or contract to be considered legally binding is consideration – both parties must knowingly understand what they are agreeing to”.

          Consideration: “Consideration in a contract is a bargained for exchange of acts or forbearance of an act”.

          Bound: “Being under legal or moral obligation; to constitute the boundary or limit of; to set a limit to; confine”.

          Require, Requirement, Required: “To claim or ask for by right and authority; Mandated under a law or by an authoritative entity. That which is required; a thing demanded or obligatory; something demanded or imposed as an obligation.”

          The Framers specifically placed the presidential Oath of Office between preceding clauses that set forth the organization of the executive department, and the succeeding clauses specifying the President’s executive power. The President takes the oath after he assumes the office but before he can execute it.

          There is more then one clause that requires an oath, but the presidential is the only clause that specifies the language of the oath for that specific position. Article VI’s Clause requires the persons specified therein to “be bound by Oath or Affirmation, to support this Constitution”, while the Presidential Oath requires substantially more than an oath of allegiance and fidelity. The President is required to swear (or affirm) that he “will to the best of his Ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States.” This phrasing ties the Presidential duty directly to the “preservation, protection and defense” of the Constitution; plus the location and phrasing of the Oath creates limits on how the President’s “executive power” is to be exercised. The relationship shared between the Oath of Office and Article II’s Clause (requiring the President “shall take Care that the Laws be faithfully executed”) with the duty to faithfully execute the Constitution as supreme law; plus the “preserve, protect and defend” language of the Oath of Office places a specific duty on Presidents to fight for the US Constitution’s survival.

          NDAA – Second lie, he would veto it because it had an inclusion that went against the American people on US soil. The lie is that he and his adminstration were fighting to have that “inclusion that went against the American people on US soil” put INTO the NDAA.

          3nd lie – Then he said “he had to”. Then to pacify people he made a “signing statement” that legally means nothing but propaganda.
          Which shows that all the rest was POSITIVELY lies – Judge Forrest found the NDAA (part that Obama fought to have put in that he could use against the US people on American soil) unconstitutional, Obama put his treasonous attorneys to work finding a judge that will obey his orders and get it put back as he fought to get it inserted into the NDAA – usable against the American people on US Soil.

          Fourth lie: Fast and Furious – Obama fought for the funding of it rolled into the stimulus package a month later. H.R.1 American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009. Basically he supplied arms to illegal gunrunners for foreign nation that was later used on American soil to kill US citizens and in 47 other crimes; plus over 150 were murdered in Mexico. He had a press release, remember it?
          Project Gun Runner (Fast and Furious) was launched under the orders of President Barack Obama with the knowledge of Attorney General Eric Holder. Deputy Attorney General David Ogden announced the Obama Administration’s new and aggressive ‘comprehensive plan’ on March, 24, 2009. The plan was aimed at disrupting gun trafficking between the United States and Mexico.
          The first words were: “The President has directed us…”

          Compounding that lie of when he knew about it he assisted in covering up whern Holder knew about it. Both thought that they could put the Arms Trafficking Convention in a hidden place. This is where Holder gave a speech in Cuernavaca, Mexico, on April 2, 2009, where he boasted about Operation ‘Gunrunner” and told Mexican authorities of everything he was doing to insure its success.

          In Cuernavaca, Holder not only acknowledged the program, he bragged that he was in the process of expanding it:

          “Last week, our administration launched a major new effort to break the backs of the cartels. My department is committing 100 new ATF personnel to the Southwest border in the next 100 days to supplement our ongoing Project Gunrunner, DEA is adding 16 new positions on the border, as well as mobile enforcement teams, and the FBI is creating a new intelligence group focusing on kidnapping and extortion. DHS is making similar commitments, as Secretary Napolitano will detail.”

          Hmm, look who else knew, even funnier, watch the news release and see who all was there for it. Can you say, “cover up and lying”?

          More lies
          Senior ranking U.S. military leaders so distorted the truth when communicating with the U.S. Congress and American people in regards to conditions on the ground in Afghanistan that the truth was unrecognizable. This deception damaged America’s credibility among both our allies and enemies, severely limiting our ability to reach a political solution to the war in Afghanistan.” Lt. Colonel Daniel Davis

          On September 8th, 2011, General William Shelton told lawmakers during a highly classified briefing. The four-star general is in charge of Air Force Space Command. According to the Daily Beast, “Pressed by members, Gen. William Shelton said the White House tried to pressure him to change his testimony to make it more favorable to a company tied to a large Democratic donor.”

          He violated the law and the provisions of the Constitution by seizing control of GM and Chrysler without proper authorization from Congress.
          Although his unlawful cronies in Congress granted him the authority after the fact, his action to seize corporations was a violation of the law at the time it was implemented.

          Sheesh, Clinton was going through impeachment over lying about an affair, Nixon had not even known about Watergate until after the fact and he was being impeached.
          Obama has done much, much worse and …

          nevermind /shakes head sadly
          Go watch sports, or “reality TV” or whatever you watch. If we lose this battle – when you are a slave (UN Agenda 21), pat yourself on the back, you deserve it for being too lazy to even bother to see if you are being told the truth.

          I will not apoligise for saying that. Ever!

          • Bob666

            Kansas,
            I going out on a limb here, but I am willing to bet that no one has accused you of brevity? but that being said, you have some very specific beliefs, some of which I share and many that I do not. If you have read my post and you have responded to many of them. I don’t feel the need to go through your statements piece by piece, but do you really believe that both Obama and Clinton (the only two recent you mentioned other than Nixon) had less virtue than say Nixon, Ford, Bush Sr. or Bush Jr.? let’s go to Regan verses Carter, I believe those two were polar opposites.

            At the end of the day, all of these men were extraordinary in their own way and some were far better leaders than others, but one common thread is; they are /were all Politicians and Politicians by their nature are liars and have moral flexibility of a well worn spring.

            If you have paid attention and with your level of detail, I believe that you have, you know that I don’t subscribe to the DNC or GOP as both are corrupt-bought and paid for by special interest groups. Obama was not my first or second choice in 2008 or 2012, but quite frankly, the opposition was lacking as well. I laugh at the liberal -progressive comment made about me.

            As for where I get my information, I look at the multiple sources and all with a great deal of suspicion. Fox is no less bias than NBC, it only gets down to the direction of that bias. I get a great deal of information off of the web and I have two papers delivered to my home seven days a week as I have for over 40 years, but even the Wall Street Journal leaves something to be desired today. You are correct, it is all corporate media and it lacks 100% credibility.

            I’m going to guess that we are not far apart in age and experience. While I was born after WWII, I was around for Korea, Vietnam and saw the cold war end. While I was not around for WWII, my father was a decorated veteran of WWII, Korea and Vietnam and the Gadsden flag hung in our living room growing up. I also hung in our bomb shelter 180 miles north of Cuba. Most of those posting on this site might have little recollection of the cold war, but I suspect that few lived it as I lived not far from the Berlin wall as a child. As far as presidents go, I remember Eisenhower growing up and went through Johnson and Kennedy and got to vote for Nixon and Ford. I believe that Ford might not have been the sharpest knife in the Oval drawer, I do believe that he was one of the most honorable men to be in the oval office. Up through George “H” Bush, those who ran for president were far more honorable men.

            I agreed with my dad, as it pertains to Watergate, Nixon was the one who got caught and that where we differ, he may not have know the details, but I believe he was complicit.

            As for the term progressive, you did inspire me to do a bit of research of the term as it applies to political orientation. Personally, I believe that you read far more into the history of the progressive movement than most people today who call themselves progressive are aware of, but you do have a tendency to be very detailed in your approach. You probably are far more accurate as the term Progressive applies to political parties in Europe.

            I’m going stick with the label for myself as a libertarian since that is what I tend to believe in even if many on this site live by a different definition, mine is from Marion-Webster.

            Does that shed some light on your questions?

          • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

            Yes, it does shed some light.

            Some of my comments you might have missed is that I have been fighting to have both Bush’s, the Clinton’s, and Obama arrested and prosecuted for Treason, Murder, War Crimes, Mass Murders, and various other criminal and civil offenses that they have committed. Plus their corrupt adminstrations who had much to do with what happened during those “terms of office”.

            Actually I have found your comments to be enjoyable, though I do not always agree – thankfully. But I did wonder if your comments comes from living, or from education – or best – both.

            But as a stated progressive – which progressive are you? The true ones from Wilson’s and Roosevelts period (and before), or the current ones which is a mix of Stalinism, Hilterism, Pol Pot, etc and not progressivism.- but using the ‘progressive’ name to keep people following and supporting them just like they used the Democratic party name.

            If you do not believe me then read Agenda 21 for a start.

            Take the free online college courses (202) at hillsdale.edu – 202 is more about progressives vs constitutionalists – and the different periods of progressivism – very enlightening. The courses is taught from source material, and are not difficult. Time will not matter as you can do them anytime. (I found the student discussions to be the best!)

            If you are for todays “progressivism”, which they used to call “Democrats” to fool people; (and now the communist party here in the USA is out in the open right after Obama’s second fraudulent win – look it up) then we are on different sides.

            I will never let this country become communist, nazi, or anything else similar. You, or one like you (if you are fighting to destroy our legitimate Constitutional Republic government) will have to kill me as I will never stop DEFENDING our legitimate government and fighting to get more to join me. As much as I enjoy debating you, I will always fight you if that is your goal. if you are supporting this current government, then sadly, we are enemies.

          • Bob666

            Yo Kansas,
            To answer your question, a lot of education and experience and just so you know, I have been on the Hillsdale mailing list for a very long time. as for which “progressive are you”:

            Characterized by such progress, or by continuous improvement-going forward or onward; passing successively from one member of a series to the next; proceeding step by step.

            Our founding fathers were wise beyond their years and left us a living document in the constitution as it can be amended to change with both Society, Technology and Global conditions, but do not believe for a minute that my libertarian ideology would allow compromise to the constitution for the freedom and liberties it represents.

            We are not enemies.

          • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

            Awesome!

      • JeffH

        Bob999, that’s twice you announced you were finished…you even lied about that. Thanks for showing the rest of the board participants just how an ignorant progressive will respond when he/she has nothing of sunstance to say…that and you’re still a liar and this column of comments by you supports that fact!

        Would you like a little cheese to go with your whine?

  • paul rampley

    more and more it semes to me that not many americans know any thing about the fact that God has a plan. He revealed it to King Nebuchadnezzar in about 605 B.C. In essence He said o king. I am alloting a specific length of time for you Gentiles to rule My World. it will be many years running its course.you saw in a dream I gave you a giant image,with a head of gold,a breast of silver,a torso of bronz and legs and feet of iron and ten toes of iron mixed with clay. My most beloved prophet Daniel will inform you the meaning of this symbolic measure of time and the devolving values.. In the days of these ten kingdoms; Iwill destroy this godless way of governing and set up my kingdom that will never pass away..the question now is.Where do you suppose we are on this symbolic length of time??read for your self Daniel chapter two

  • Bob666

    Very predictable, we start to lose a debate and we bring god into the equation. Let’s not deal with facts or reality, lets operate on blind faith and fortell the future based of loose interpretation on YOUR book and to hell with anyone else’s beliefs, because we all know that your faith is absolute and right.

    • Jocko

      Hey, you are catching on… there is only One Way to heaven.

      It takes some of you a long time to catch on, doesn’t it?

  • Bob666

    “You are a other pee brained idoit who beleives”

    I was wrong, you could not have possibly made it into the second grade.

  • Bob666

    Cliff,
    I would try to explain, but you would not listen, so why waste my time and yours. I would bet that once that child is born you would not lift a finger to support it and chock it up to a lack of personal responsibility. You would then take the unfortunate child and preach his right to have a fire arm and let him become a danger to society all in the name of the second ammendment?

    And then your would refer to that child as one of the 47% that are “takers”. Yes Cliff, we know your type real well.

    • Nadzieja Batki

      Bob666, if you know enough to stick your willie into a woman then know enough to take responsibility for what occurs afterwards.
      What you and the woman in the equation want is to have your “fun” but let someone else clean up the messes you make. If you want your fun dog, spay yourself first.

      • Karolyn

        Nadzieja = You know that despite your high-minded solutions, there really is no solution. You cannot force people to be responsible, and you cannot legislate morality. Your answer is no answer. The question is valid. If there were no abortion available, there would be many more children to care for and not enough people to care for them. There would be even more on the welfare rolls and even more crime due to children being born into horrendous conditions. Then, throw into the mix self-induced abortions ad increased medicalcosts.

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          I have to agree with her. If you are going to “play” and cannot or will not take responsibility for not having child, and/or take responsibility (due to your ‘nature’ or due to financial constraints) for the child afterwards if one happens – then get fixed.

          So far I have heard many (not on this debate) blame the “welfare moms”. I am not sure of my facts on this, but I would say that about 3% (probably too high) use Artificial Insemination. That means do NOT go off on the females, there was a male involved in this ‘mess’. When men take responsibility for their actions and quit blaming women this situation will be solved.

          ALL courts should hold both accountable and each be REQUIRED to support the child – unless the child is adopted out.

    • DaveH

      The only problem, Bob, is that you have it backwards. More Guns, Less Crime:
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QJ8L7nqL1rs&feature=related

      • Bob666

        Dave,
        For the record, I own guns. but I dont know a cop, state or federal agent that wants to see everyone in society packing. It’s like a bumper sticker that I saw yesterday; How can you trust me with a child if you can’t trust me with a choice? better yet, how can you trust them with a choice, a child and a fire arm?

        find a cop that will agree with you.

      • DaveH

        As you can see from this chart the rate of violent crime has been dropping since 1992:
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Violent_Crime_Rates_in_the_United_States.svg

        • Bob666

          There’s a catch, though. No one can convincingly explain exactly how the crime problem was solved. Police chiefs around the country credit improved police work. Demographers cite changing demographics of an aging population. Some theorists point to the evolution of the drug trade at both the wholesale and retail levels, while for veterans of the Clinton Administration, the preferred explanation is their initiative to hire more cops. Renegade economist Steven Levitt has speculated that legalized abortion caused the drop in crime.

          (Fewer unwanted babies in the 1970s and ’80s grew up to be thugs in the 1990s and beyond.)

          The truth probably lies in a mix of these factors, plus one more: the steep rise in the number of Americans in prison. As local, state and federal governments face an era of diminished resources, they will need a better understanding of how and why crime rates tumbled. A sour economy need not mean a return to lawless streets, but continued success in fighting crime will require more brains, especially in those neighborhoods where violence is still rampant and public safety is a tattered dream.

          The Lockup Factor
          In his book Why Crime Rates Fell, Tufts University sociologist John Conklin concluded that up to half of the improvement was due to a single factor: more people in prison. The U.S. prison population grew by more than half a million during the 1990s and continued to grow, although more slowly, in the next decade. Go back half a century: as sentencing became more lenient in the 1960s and ’70s, the crime rate started to rise. When lawmakers responded to the crime wave by building prisons and mandating tough sentences, the number of prisoners increased and the number of crimes fell.

          • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

            The other factor that also should be taken into account is that the information might be skewed.

            There is a warning when entering Chicago about how dangerous it is there. Other big cities are considering doing the same. Crime dropped is sort of like the information that there are more jobs – distorted.

            I believe neither is true because if you travel trough our nation you see more crime bing committed (not including the crimes committed by “our” elected representatives) and more companies shutting down. People getting mugged, and people lining up around blocks for even seasonal jobs.

      • DaveH

        What else has changed since 1992?
        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Rtc.gif

      • DaveH

        Isn’t it coincidental that the rates of violent crime were increasing during the period of fanatical anti-gun advocates and restrictive gun laws, and then they started decreasing when concealed-carry laws became increasingly common?
        My state Arizona, for instance, has seen almost a halving in violent crime rates in the last 30 years, and we have the right to conceal-carry without any Government-issued permits.
        If you want to teach your kids to be victims, Bob, I respect that. But Butt out of my decisions.

      • DaveH

        Bob says — “I dont know a cop, state or federal agent that wants to see everyone in society packing”.
        Of course Government Leaders don’t want the citizens to pack. How can they rob us blind when we can defend ourselves?
        I ask you this, Bob. If you can carry a gun, are you going to go out and kill somebody except in self-defense? If not, then why would you assume anybody else would? And if they did, that’s what courts are for.
        I maintain that those people, who would deprive others of a right to self-defense, are accessories to murder when the defenseless people become victims.

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          I know a lot of cops who prefer to have trained individuals packing, specially concealed carry, because it stops criminals from picking on those considered “helpless” since they do not know who is packing.

      • DaveH
      • DaveH
        • Bob666

          “More gun myths:”

          Computer $800.00
          DSL, $30.00/month
          Education, ask your parents

          Defining credibility by getting your pro gun stuff off of a pro gun web site, priceless!

          • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

            The Constitution of the United States of america is the supreme law of this land.

            “A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed”. 2nd Amendment to the Constitution of the United States of America

            This has many quotes from throughout the history of USA and decisions from court cases. Hope this helps to clarify this misunderstanding and educate.

            ”Laws that forbid the carrying of arms… disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes… Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man”. Jefferson’s “Commonplace Book,”

            Strict gun laws are about as effective as strict drug laws…It pains me to say this, but the NRA seems to be right: The cities and states that have the toughest gun laws have the most murder and mayhem. Mike Royko, Chicago Tribune

            ”There already are 20,000 federal gun laws and regulations on the books. If those laws haven’t made America safe by now, why should we think 20,001 laws will suffice”? Harry Brown, Libertarian

            “Americans have the right and advantage of being armed – unlike the citizens of other countries whose governments are afraid to trust the people with arms.” James Madison, The Federalist Papers

            “Before a standing army can rule, the people must be disarmed; as they are in almost every kingdom of Europe. The supreme power in America cannot enforce unjust laws by the sword; because the whole body of the people are armed, and constitute a force superior to any bands of regular troops that can be, on any pretense, raised in the United States” Noah Webster in “An Examination into the Leading Principles of the Federal Constitution”

            “Congress have no power to disarm the militia. Their swords, and every other terrible implement of the soldier, are the birthright of an American… The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state government, but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people” Tench Coxe, Pennsylvania Gazette, Feb. 20, 1788

            “The prohibition is general. No clause in the Constitution could by any rule of construction be conceived to give to Congress a power to disarm the people. Such a flagitious attempt could only be made under some general pretense by a state legislature. But if in any blind pursuit of inordinate power, either should attempt it, this amendment may be appealed to as a restraint on both.” William Rawle

            “The best we can hope for concerning the people at large is that they be properly armed.” Alexander Hamilton, The Federalist Papers

            “That the said Constitution shall never be construed to authorize Congress to infringe the just liberty of the press or the rights of conscience; or to prevent the people of The United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms…” Samuel Adams, Debates and Proceedings in the Convention of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts

            “To preserve liberty, it is essential that the whole body of people always possess arms, and be taught alike especially when young, how to use them.” Richard Henry Lee, 1788, Initiator of the Declaration of Independence, member of the first Senate, which passed the Bill of Rights

            “The great object is that every man be armed” and “everyone who is able may have a gun.” Patrick Henry, in the Virginia Convention on the ratification of the Constitution

            Wilson v. State: “To prohibit a citizen from wearing or carrying a war arm . . . is an unwarranted restriction upon the constitutional right to keep and bear arms. If cowardly and dishonorable men sometimes shoot unarmed men with army pistols or guns, the evil must be prevented by the penitentiary and gallows, and not by a general deprivation of constitutional privilege.”

            Bliss vs. Commonwealth: ”For, in principle, there is no difference between a law prohibiting the wearing of concealed arms, and a law forbidding the wearing such as are exposed; and if the former be unconstitutional, the latter must be so likewise. But it should not be forgotten, that it is not only a part of the right that is secured by the constitution; it is the right entire and complete, as it existed at the adoption of the constitution; and if any portion of that right be impaired, immaterial how small the part may be, and immaterial the order of time at which it be done, it is equally forbidden by the constitution.”

            Nunn vs. State: “The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.’ The right of the whole people, old and young, men, women and boys, and not militia only, to keep and bear arms of every description, and not such merely as are used by the militia, shall not be infringed, curtailed, or broken in upon, in the smallest degree; and all this for the important end to be attained: the rearing up and qualifying a well-regulated militia, so vitally necessary to the security of a free State. Our opinion is that any law, State or Federal, is repugnant to the Constitution, and void, which contravenes this right.”

            People vs. Zerillo: “The provision in the Constitution granting the right to all persons to bear arms is a limitation upon the power of the Legislature to enact any law to the contrary. The exercise of a right guaranteed by the Constitution cannot be made subject to the will of the sheriff.”

            State vs. Kerner: “The maintenance of the right to bear arms is a most essential one to every free people and should not be whittled down by technical constructions.”

            Cockrum v. State: “The right of a citizen to bear arms, in lawful defense of himself or the State, is absolute. He does not derive it from the State government. It is one of the “high powers” delegated directly to the citizen, and `is excepted out of the general powers of government.’ A law cannot be passed to infringe upon or impair it, because it is above the law, and independent of the lawmaking power.”

            According to the National Crime Survey administered by the Bureau of the Census and the National Institute of Justice, it was found that only 12 percent of those who use a gun to resist assault are injured, as are 17 percent of those who use a gun to resist robbery. These percentages are 27 and 25 percent, respectively, if they passively comply with the felon’s demands. Three times as many were injured if they used other means of resistance. G. Kleck, “Policy Lessons from Recent Gun Control Research”

            Our most conservative estimates show that by adopting shall-issue laws (concealed carry laws), states reduced murders by 8.5%, rapes by 5%, aggravated assaults by 7% and robbery by 3%… While support for strict gun-control laws usually has been strongest in large cities, where crime rates are highest, that’s precisely where right-to-carry laws have produced the largest drops in violent crimes. – “More Guns, Less Violent Crime”, Professor John R. Lott, Jr.,The Wall Street Journal, August 28, 1996

            “If gun laws in fact worked, the sponsors of this type of legislation should have no difficulty drawing upon long lists of examples of criminal acts reduced by such legislation. That they cannot do so after a century and a half of trying … establishes the repeated, complete and inevitable failure of gun laws to control serious crime.” Senator Orrin Hatch, in a 1982 Senate Report

            ”Gun control advocates used to claim that more guns meant more crime. Research demonstrated, though, that more guns meant less crime. As the criminology argument faded, gun control advocates began arguing guns were a public health problem.”- Steven Milloy (www.junkscience.com), “Gun Control Science Misfires”, Friday, Apr 13, 2001

            ”Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the American people’s liberty teeth and keystone under independence. From the hour the Pilgrims landed, to the present day, events, occurrences, and tendencies prove that to ensure peace, security, and happiness, the rifle and pistol are equally indispensable. The very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference – they deserve a place of honor with all that’s good”. George Washington, in a speech to Congress

            ”The strongest reason for the people to retain their right to keep and bear arms is as a last resort to protect themselves against tyranny in government”. Thomas Jefferson

            That rifle on the wall of the laborer’s cottage or working class flat is the symbol of democracy. It is our job to see that it stays there!” George Orwell

            ”No free man shall ever be de-barred the use of arms”. Thomas Jefferson

            ”The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed, and this without any qualification as to their condition or degree, as is the case in the British government. – “One of the ordinary modes, by which tyrants accomplish their purposes without resistance, is, by disarming the people, and making it an offence to keep arms, and by substituting a regular army in the stead of a resort to the militia. The friends of a free government cannot be too watchful, to overcome the dangerous tendency of the public mind to sacrifice, for the sake of mere private convenience, this powerful check upon the designs of ambitious men”. Joseph Story

            “This may be considered as the true palladium of liberty… The right of self-defense is the first law of nature; in most governments it has been the study of rulers to confine this right within the narrowest limits possible. Whenever standing armies are kept up, and the right of the people to keep and bear arms is, under any color or pretext whatsoever, prohibited, liberty, if not already annihilated, is on the brink of destruction”. St. George Tucker

            ”The prohibition is general. No clause in the constitution could by any rule of construction be conceived to give congress a power to disarm the people. Such a flagitious attempt could only be made under some general pretence by a state legislature. But if in any blind pursuit of inordinate power, either should attempt it, this amendment may be appealed to as a restraint on both”. William Rawle, “A View of the Constitution of the United States of America” (1829)

            What does the Militia have to do with the Second Amendment? All able-bodied US citizens and those legally allowed to be here between the ages of 18 – 45 are the Militia – and can be called to serivice by their state to defend it against anything attacking it, including the federal government.

            “A militia, when properly formed, are in fact the people themselves …”
            Richard Henry Lee

            “I ask, Sir, what is the militia? It is the whole people except for a few public officials. To disarm the people is the best and most effectual way to enslave them.” George Mason, Co-author of the Second Amendment

            St. George Tucker, a lawyer, Revolutionary War militia officer, legal scholar, and later a U.S. District Court Judge, wrote of the Second Amendment:
            “The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed, and this without any qualification as to their condition or degree, as is the case in the British government.”
            (The Supreme Court has cited Tucker in over forty cases, in the major cases of virtually every Supreme Court era.)

            “The right is general. It may be supposed from the phraseology of this provision that the right to keep and bear arms was only guaranteed to the militia; but this would be an interpretation not warranted by the intent. The militia, as has been explained elsewhere, consists of those persons who, under the law, are liable to the performance of military duty, and are officered and enrolled for service when called upon. . . . If the right were limited to those enrolled, the purpose of the guarantee might be defeated altogether by the action or the neglect to act of the government it was meant to hold in check. The meaning of the provision undoubtedly is, that the people, from whom the militia must be taken, shall have the right to keep and bear arms, and they need no permission or regulation of law for that purpose”. Thomas Cooley

            “Under every government the last resort of the people, is an appeal to the sword; whether to defend themselves against the open attacks of a foreign enemy, or to check the insidious encroachments of domestic foes. Whenever a people … entrust the defence of their country to a regular, standing army, composed of mercenaries, the power of that country will remain under the direction of the most wealthy citizens.
            And that the said Constitution be never construed to authorize Congress to infringe the just liberty of the press, or the rights of conscience; or to prevent the people of the United States, who are peaceable citizens, from keeping their own arms; or to raise standing armies, unless necessary for the defense of the United States, or of some one or more of them; or to prevent the people from petitioning, in a peaceable and orderly manner, the federal legislature, for a redress of grievances; or to subject the people to unreasonable searches and seizures of their persons, papers or possessions”. Samuel Adams

            William Rawle, whose work was adopted as a constitutional law textbook at West Point and other institutions, and was United States Attorney for Pennsylvania, describes the scope of the Second Amendment’s right to keep and bear arms: “The prohibition is general. No clause in the constitution could by any rule of construction be conceived to give congress a power to disarm the people. Such a flagitious attempt could only be made under some general pretence by a state legislature. But if in any blind pursuit of inordinate power, either should attempt it, this amendment may be appealed to as a restraint on both.”

            Justice Story, Associate Justice, Supreme Court wrote: “The next amendment is: “A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.”
            “The importance of this article will scarcely be doubted by any persons, who have duly reflected upon the subject. The militia is the natural defence of a free country against sudden foreign invasions, domestic insurrections, and domestic usurpations of power by rulers. It is against sound policy for a free people to keep up large military establishments and standing armies in time of peace, both from the enormous expenses, with which they are attended, and the facile means, which they afford to ambitious and unprincipled rulers, to subvert the government, or trample upon the rights of the people. The right of the citizens to keep and bear arms has justly been considered, as the palladium of the liberties of a republic; since it offers a strong moral check against the usurpation and arbitrary power of rulers; and will generally, even if these are successful in the first instance, enable the people to resist and triumph over them”.

            Pennsylvania Gazette, Feb. 20, 1788, Tench Coxe wrote: “Who are the militia? are they not ourselves. Is it feared, then, that we shall turn our arms each man against his own bosom. Congress have no power to disarm the militia. Their swords, and every other terrible implement of the soldier, are the birth-right of an American…The unlimited power of the sword is not in the hands of either the federal or state governments but, where I trust in God it will ever remain, in the hands of the people.”

            Tench Coxe, ‘Remarks on the First Part of the Amendments to the Federal Constitution’, in the Federal Gazette, June 18, 1789, on the Second Amendment where he asserts that it’s the people with arms, who serve as the ultimate check on government: “As civil rulers, not having their duty to the people duly before them, may attempt to tyrannize, and as the military forces which must be occasionally raised to defend our country, might pervert their power to the injury of their fellow-citizens, the people are confirmed by the next article in their right to keep and bear their private arms”.

          • Bob666

            Kansas,
            Before I go any further, I must comment you on a very well presented and indepth view of the second amendment and for the record, I believe that you are about 95% accurate. I asked another individule to state th second amentment and I doubt that he could as very few can (very sad in my opinion).

            The diferance being; if our founding fathers were around today and observe the advancment in technology, urbanization and population, they might take a different approach. The second amendment and third amendment were ratified at the same time and were heavly influenanced by the build up of british troops after the boston tea party.

            Keep in mind, that is my observation and it is subject to great debate, but I also believe that those who signed the constitution would take a different approach to many other amentments if that doccument were being written today.

          • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

            I disagree with you on that point.
            Why?

            Because the framers did not just go by the Brithish Government when making our Constitution. What they were well educated for any time period, definately better educated then most in our own time period. They studied all the classics, histories of government, etc way before coming up with ours.

            You may not be aware of this but there have been only three governments like ours, including our Constitutional Republic in the (writings of) the history of mankind. the other two were around 100 plus years before that.

            For example, Thomas Jefferson was familiar with almost every book there was at that time.

            They got much from Aristotle – Ethics; Natural Law, Natural Rights…
            Ciscero (Rome) – True law is in accordance with nature. What is the grand scheme of things? “In nature there is a standard to tell whether or not a law is good”.

            Thomas Jefferson, Constitutions author, mentioned four thinkers for their contribution to molding “the American mind”: Aristotle, Cicero, Algernon Sidney, and John Locke.

            America’s Declaration of Independence, Thomas Jefferson said, was the product of “the American mind.” Our Constitution was made with the same purpose as the Declaration – to establish a regime where the people are sovereign, and the government protects the rights granted to them by their Creator.

            Three new principles were made with the Declaration of Independence
            All men were created equal
            That they are all endowed with certain inalienable rights
            Therefore the source of the just powers of government must come from the consent of the governed

            Letter to Henry Lee – Thomas Jefferson
            “This was the object of the Declaration of Independence… Neither aiming at originality of principle or sentiment, nor yet copied from any particular and previous writing, it was intended to be an expression of the American mind, and to give to that expression the proper tone and spirit called for by the occasion.”

            “Discourses concerning Government”, Algernon Sidney
            “But nothing can be more absurd then to say, that one man has absolute power above law to govern according to his will”

            So you see, you are incorrect to think that the concepts that created our Constitutional Republic came from one source, one time period. They studied governments, what worked, what didn’t, “played” around with different ideas – the pros and cons of it. This country was the creation of some brilliant minds, but also taken into consideration was the people. They were not cowed, used to being ruled; but here making their own life, taking responsibility for themselves. Were they all good men, no – all at this time were like the people now, human – good and bad.

            But because they also had studied human nature they knew that if the populace let those in office rule with no oversight, they would start grabbing (illegally) more power for themselves.

            “America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.” Abraham Lincoln

            “Rightful liberty is unobstructed action according to our will within limits drawn around us by the equal rights of others. I do not add ‘within the limits of the law’ because law is often but the tyrant’s will, and always so when it violates the rights of the individual”. Thomas Jefferson

            John Adams, letter to Thomas Jefferson, July 16, 1814
            The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
            If Virtue & Knowledge are diffused among the People, they will never be enslav’d. This will be their great Security.

            “Let the American youth never forget, that they possess a noble inheritance, bought by the toils, and sufferings and blood of their ancestors; and capable, if wisely improved, and faithfully guarded, of transmitting to their latest posterity all the substantial blessings of life, the peaceful enjoyment of liberty, property, religion, and independence…Republics are created by the virtue, public spirit, and intelligence of the citizens. They fall, when the wise are banished from the public councils, because they dare to be honest and the profligate are rewarded, because they flatter the people, in order to betray them.” Joseph Story, Commentaries on the Constitution

            “Be courteous to all, but intimate with few, and let those few be well tried before you give them your confidence”. G. Washington

            Thomas Jefferson explained, “The care of human life and happiness, and not their destruction, is the first and only legitimate object of good government.”

            Benjamin Franklin said: “The Constitution only guarantees the American people the right to pursue happiness. You have to catch it yourself.”

            The Main thing you are wrong about is: “if our founding fathers were around today and observe the advancment in technology, urbanization and population…”

            They preferred immigrants who came from countries that did not have dictatorships or tyrant governments because they could ‘handle’ the concept that they wre responsible for their own lives here better. They were more likely to distrust those who are in “ruling” positions as to not misuse power.

            The Constitution is NOT the living document the progressives are trying to say it is. Why do I say that?

            Because it is made to be timeless. A simple example:
            Your duty is that you need to keep your house clean. It does not matter if your house is a shack, an apartment, a house in the suburbs, a farmhouse, a castle, or a spaceship – the tools you use to clean it might change, but that DUTY will not.

            Example: all presidents are REQUIRED to enforce the law (constitutional laws – but that is posted here somewhere earlier). The means they use to enforce it, or get information to those they use to enforce it ight differ (used to be sending a person, then a telegraph, telephone, now emails, etc) – but the DUTY is the same.

            Understand?

          • Bob666

            As I said Kansas, A differance of opinion, but very well presented on your part.

          • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

            True, you did write that.

            You now have an idea on what my opinions are based on.

            What are yours based on? I agree you have a right to your own opinion, I just would like to know if it is an informed opinion. If you don’t mind.

        • Bob666

          So Dave,
          have you taken one and feel better? the second ammendment, word for work, we are all waiting…………………………………..

      • Nadzieja Batki

        Bob666, you are a hypocrite, Why do you want a good life for yourself but condemn others to a life of being wastrels? So you can pretend that you are so caring by using the government to support them.

      • DaveH

        But Bob, wasn’t the Gun Control cited as necessary to prevent violent crime? And isn’t it a fact that the violent crime not only stayed level but increased with the increasing gun control? And isn’t it also a fact that when the gun control was lessened the violent crime rate coincidentally decreased? Both facts fly in the face of what the Gun Controllers warned us of.
        Your argument doesn’t wash, Bob.

        • Bob666

          Let’s see, I own guns, I’m giving my kid a 12 ga. pump for Christmas and somehow you have read that I support gun control? Did I miss something here Dave????

      • DaveH

        Bob says — “Defining credibility by getting your pro gun stuff off of a pro gun web site, priceless!”.
        And where do you get your anti-gun information, Bob?
        Expecting a rational argument from a Liberal Progressive — Priceless!

        • Bob666

          Did you miss the part where I said that I own guns? Dave, could you please post the second amendment with out googling it.

      • DaveH

        And I own a car, Bob. But then, that has nothing to do with the debate, now does it?

        • Bob666

          dave,
          The only person that you are debating is yourself. Would we say Dave is materdebating? I could really care less if you own guns. I am sure that law enforcment cares and that is why the silent black Helo is outsite your living room window recording your every key stroke.

      • DaveH

        Bob says — “Dave, could you please post the second amendment with out googling it”.
        Why is it that whenever I try to engage one of you Liberal Progressives in a rational debate, you start going off on irrelevant tangents?

        • Bob666

          Dave,
          you can’t recite the second amendment can you………word for word.

      • DaveH

        Like even a Liberal Progressive retard couldn’t look up the Second Amendment, Bob.
        Again, what does that have to do with the debate?
        But thanks for yet another exposure of Liberal Progressive logic (or lack of).
        You guys are your own worst enemies. I would even wonder if Bob wasn’t planting fakes on the board to make Liberal Progressives look bad, except that I’ve seen enough Yahoo article comments to know that indeed you are representative of childish and illogical Liberal Progressive thinking.

        • Bob666

          Dave,
          There is no debate. Your Masterdebating again and in a public forum. You acuse all of us of going of on a tangent (bet you don’t know the meaning or origion of that word, like the second amendment).

          Go to bathroom and take your meads, it will all be OK in the morning. Just dont look outside, the black silent Helo is listening outside your window – you will work your self up again.

  • jimbo72

    Just one — OK, maybe more than one — question for those who are against mandatory car insurance: what happens when someone hits me who isn’t insured and has no money? What do I do if it wasn’t my fault? Take him to court? Have my insurance pay for it — and see my rates go up? I am serious about this because this could be a major problem. And I don’t trust the courts because they make up law!

    • DaveH

      What happens now, Jimbo, when somebody in a state with mandatory liability insurance who hasn’t complied with the law runs into you? If you’re afraid of those possibilities then you could pay extra for no-fault insurance. But don’t Force me to buy something that I know is not economical because I am a careful driver.
      There are few certainties in life. But it’s much more likely that we all suffer economic loss when the Force of Government enables noncompetitive companies to survive in the Marketplace.
      Imagine how much more we could buy if Government wasn’t taking 40% of our money (on average) every year to “protect us”? And that isn’t even counting the extra money that Government costs us by meddling in the Marketplace and stifling competition.
      See here for the costs of all that Government Protection:
      http://www.scribd.com/doc/93023823/Wayne-Crews-10-000-Commandments-2012

  • Motov

    The real impediment is the hidden people (Bilderbergs) Who are deep into the fabric of government, and its peripheral machines. You cannot vote these people out, they own the government, they choose who we vote for, they manipulate whatever is at their disposal so people like Ron Paul will never see the light of day. They are probably behind assassinations of leaders throughout this planet, And I bet they masterminded 9-11 to bring on these wars in the Middle East, and give the government an “excuse” to take away our Bill Of Rights.

    • DaveH

      The Crony Capitalists have no Power of Force without the facade of Government Leaders. So yes, we do have the Power to vote them out. But first the majority of us must want that.

      • Motov

        To get them to want that they must first realize that these people pulling the strings don’t really care about them. The only time Jesus got “violent” was when he threw out the money changers in the temple. He thought of them the lowest of the lowlifes, by comparing them to vipers. These are the very people pulling politician’s strings. They use their ill gotten wealth to promote their politician’s image and make the “Ron Pauls” look bad.

  • Bob666

    Nadzieja,
    Just to make you aware, one wife, two children by that wife, college is paid for and they were planed. I don’t breed what I can’t feed and NO ONE has contributed a dime towards my children.

    Do you feel: (check one of the following)
    Completely Stupid:
    A little Stupid:
    Too stupid to understand:

    And by the way, my kids have been raised to respect those in society that are less fortunate, Socially, Economically or in your case, Intellectually.

    • DaveH

      Have they been raised to know that taking money from other unwilling donors is enslavement and theft? Or have they been convinced that “voting” somehow elevates common theft to something more noble?

      • Bob666

        WTF? perhaps you might clarafy?

      • DaveH

        After you, Bob. I took your sentence — “my kids have been raised to respect those in society that are less fortunate, Socially, Economically” — to mean that you advocate supporting those people with other peoples’ money. Am I wrong?

        • Bob666

          Very much so. We live, teach and promote personal responsibility. we don’t breed whaqt we can’r feed.

      • DaveH

        You didn’t answer my question, Bob, instead preferring to go off on a tangent.

      • Deerinwater

        David, ~ do you not use my money? Who;s money was it before you laid claim to it? Can you say that you have never engaged in the practice of using things and services that was not purchased with money besides your own?

        The very nature of money is to use in countless ways, money is a note of intent. Money is negotiable. Money is to circulate . Please explain to us you understanding of money and what purpose it posses for you personally.

  • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing WTS/JAY

    Have you noticed that the US Government no longer seriously pursues cases involving Anti-Trust or RICO? Monopoly is now OK; premeditated criminal activity is OK, too. For all practical purposes stealing billions of dollars is OK and has happened many times over the past 20 years or so.

    Can you envision how avoidance of anti-trust and RICO might be part of the same strategy? How might one achieve that? Simply, get control of the government so prosecution is waived, laws are changed to legalize the criminal activity.

    Have you ever wondered why they do nothing with white collar crime escalating to the point that the markets, banks, corporations and Congress are glaringly corrupt and engaged in unethical, immoral and illegal activity as ‘business as usual’?

    You see, Bernie Madoff made the mistake of stealing from the cabal members and had to go to prison. It really pissed off the cabal when a Jew steals from other cabal Jews. Corzine should be headed to prison but he only stole from normal citizens, not the cabal. His egregious actions at MF Global benefitted the criminal cabal. Get the distinction straight in your head because your financial future and quality of life is riding on it. The only time they invoke anti-trust is when someone is stepping on the wrong toes with an attempted takeover. The only time they invoke RICO is when they wish to silence someone they do not like. They can, have and will apply the law backwards to protect their criminal enterprise.

    For example, RICO has been applied to free speech and those pro-life people that picket abortion clinics. There is nothing inherently illegal about that or remotely racketeering in nature. The pro-life people were certainly not profiting from the abortions they are against. However, they have been targeted with RICO to block them from being pro-life activists. In this instance the application of the law was 180 degrees from its intended use.

    Many Americans refer to the ‘criminal cabal’ that rules our nation but most truly do not grasp to what extent our government and corporations are truly controlled, influenced and directed by criminals. They enact law after law to line their pockets and stifle any dissent or ability to fight back. This is not by accident, it is by criminal intent that the CEO slots, the board of directors and even Congress is littered with people who are mere fronts and puppets of the criminal cabal that really runs the pelf and plundering.

    There is a simple explanation and even a trail to follow that explains how our nation has devolved from being a nation truly built on equity, equality, justice and rule of law to one nothing more than a sleazy specialized mafia syndicate that is sucking the life out of America and you.

    In 1970 the US Congress enacted the RICO Act as part of the Organized Crime Control Act. It was a good idea at the time but like everything else Congress and Washington DC have done since Vietnam they managed to screw it up.

    The article available at the following link will provide some background if a reader is truly interested in knowing how this started and how DC did what it always does, screw things up royally. http://www.thirdamendment.com/rico.html

    Oddly enough, the implied Third Amendment provision of right to privacy is what they have taken from you and have wrapped the cabal in as the ‘flag’ and ‘patriotism’ and ‘defending America’ from the boogeyman that truly wants the members of this criminal cabal dead. Yes, indeed, the real criminal cabal has many enemies and they cannot run the risk that Americans wake up and put an end to their RICO Empire.

    The purpose of RICO was to break up the penetration of legitimate businesses and corporations by racketeering and criminals. Hence the name of the law: “Racketeer Influenced Corrupt Organization”. The law had a criminal part that could be used by federal and state prosecutors and a civil part that could be used by citizens to put an end to illegal activity, profiteering and plundering in illegal ways.

    As the article link above reveals, there were only 300 criminal RICO actions between 1970 to 1980 and the number of legitimate actions has continued to drop as the criminal elements have taken full charge of our government and the fascist corporations that now control every nuance of policy, expenditures and who benefits by lining their pockets at the expense of the American people.

    The idea was headed in the right direction until the criminals proved to be much smarter than the prosecutors and had penetrated major corporations, banks, Wall Street, Big Pharma, Big Defense, Big Oil, Big Energy, and even Congress, the judiciary and even the prosecuting attorney’s office in many parts of America.

    This ‘criminal cabal’ that calls itself the US Congress has even gone so far to pass laws that legalize stock fraud, grant immunity to defense contractors and Big Pharma so the money flow is not hampered by lawsuits and having to pay large damages. Under the Clinton Administration RICO was modified so that it could not be used in blatant stock fraud cases and shareholders utilize the anti-racketeering law to punish those who harmed them finically through premeditated stock fraud.

    One has to consider the irony of Congress when they talk and pretend to be all about rule of law, good governance and transparency, yet cloak their every move in veils and lies.

    They have indeed turned stock fraud into a legitimate industry in America by tweaking the laws to prevent justice, punishment and disgorgement of what was stolen by plan and by action. The reason that the ‘Congressional investigation’ of Global Crossing CEO Gary Winnick (a Michael Milken co-defendant) was such a comical farce is almost every person sitting on the committee and asking all of the softball questions with easy outs had received considerable campaign contributions from the very persons they were assigned to ‘investigate’. Gary Winnick was not sent to prison because his actions lined the pockets of the criminal cabal rather than make the “Madoff Mistake” of stealing from them.

    Williams Communications Group and Global Crossing were two cases I was directly involved in as high bidder in bankruptcy. We had amassed considerable evidence of how companies are created, financed and then premeditatedly forced into bankruptcy to move the assets into just the right hands for pennies on the dollar. Certain parties were shorting the debt (bonds) to create a debt covenant default while others were shorting the stock to keep the companies headed into bankruptcy and literally the theft of the assets from the equity shareholders.

    You should not be surprised or shocked that it was Wall Street and their most favored clients that were conducting this illegal activity offshore and stealing hundreds of billions, trillions from unsuspecting investors.

    Most Americans are not aware that in New York and Delaware where most bankruptcy cases are filed for publicly traded companies, the attorneys, financial advisors and others involved literally refer to themselves as The Bankruptcy Mafia.

    The Clinton Administration and Congress also amended the US Bankruptcy Code in 1994 so that shareholders were further pushed out and reduced to not having a financial stake, standing or interest in the bankruptcy.

    This was all planned and has amounted to trillions of dollars of investment money being stolen from unsuspecting investors by what is a racketeer corrupt influenced organization otherwise known as Wall Street, Congress, Big Telecom, Big Pharma, Big Oil and Big Defense.

    That $2 trillion that Ben Bernanke refused to tell Congress where it went is not hard to figure out. Major governments, pension funds, corporate and private investors were launching a civil and criminal action against DC and Wall Street due to the egregious levels of fraud that was and is the US subprime mortgage fraud. It was criminal intent that created that problem and when parties decided to take action Helicopter Ben paid them $2 trillion in hush money.

    The ‘troika’ is especially egregious in the triangle formed by Big Oil, Big Defense and Wall Street, and aided and abetted every step of the way by the Congress Critters we have all come to hate with a passion. There is truly nothing to love about them or even like about them, yet idiot Americans refuse to flush the toilet and start over with real leadership that would fix what the real problems are in the United States.

    It does not take foreign or war policy to fix what is wrong inside of America. The laws are there, need to be amended and bring this criminal cabal to the halls of justice.

    The Afghanistan War was conceived and launched with criminal intent. The Iraq War was conceived and launched with premeditation of aforethought and criminal intent in nature.

    How do you feel about criminal elements affecting their bottom line to your detriment and affecting the course of America to their benefit and your detriment? Worse yet, that many of those who are elected or appointed are criminals and part of the larger scam to line their pockets and put the screws to you?

    Seriously, how do you feel about that America?

    What is even more sinister is how criminal elements have now penetrated our FBI, CIA, DOJ and every vestige of the last line of defense that could take these matters to court and clean up a lot of the fraud that has come to define America. It is no longer the bastion of liberty, freedom and democracy and the last thing these criminals stand for is the Rule of Law.

    Too many Americans are failing to grasp that what Sibel Edmonds discovered inside of the FBI was a criminal cabal working against the best interests and security of America. Entire investigations were thwarted, such as Dancing Israeli Dominik Suter and his name surfacing on a European bank account that was used in the financing of 9-11. He fled back to Israel where he is still protected to this day from extradition to face questions and possibly criminal charges in the United States AS A PERPETRATOR OF SEPTEMBER 11, 2001.

    Across the entire spectrum of ‘free America’ inequality is now the norm and it has fractured society in some very serious ways. That was planned by a criminal cabal.

    Across the world those nations where equality is closer in real and economic terms, there is better education, better economic opportunity, less drug and alcohol abuse, lower infant mortality and teen pregnancies, less crime, lower homicide rates, lower imprisonment rates, lower instances of fraud, more social capital in the form of trusting others, better health and health care, better mental health, higher educational scores, and infant mortality and teen pregnancies are less in more equal nations.

    America can now be defined as being severely unequal from top to bottom as the Middle Class is being crushed by the Criminal Cabal, AIDED AND ABETTED BY THE US GOVERNMENT, and more Americans are forced into poverty.

    Most readers know I now live in Europe and it is comical that most people I have met around the world think all Americans are wealthy. Little do they know that a full one-third of Americans are living in poverty and that number will continue to grow as long as the Criminal Cabal continues to loot America in any manner they can.

    The reason the US government does not prosecute the Mafia with RICO is the
    government, the major corporations and the Mafia are now one.

    • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing WTS/JAY

      Author of above article -Carl Shwarz

    • DaveH

      Monopolies can only exist in Unfree markets, Jay.

      • DaveH
      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing WTS/JAY

        True! But, by free-markets, if i understand you correctly, you mean, a market unfettered, free from Government regulations, where presently, excessive regulations only impede economic growth,(not to mention corruption) and that the Government should indeed be involved, but, its involvement be limited to providing a criminal justice system for acts of force and fraud, and little else…Another words, the main task of government is to protect the smooth functioning of the market economy against fraud or violence from within and from outside the country.

        The theory is relatively simple to understand. It is in the application of theory where the rubber meets the road; hence the disagreements between those who espouse that Government should micromanage every aspect of economy (socialists) and those who advocate for minimal involvement, or limited to as per articulated in the Constitution (Libertarians).

        Now, both agree to Government involvement, but its in the degree to which the Government should be involved where disagreements arise. Clearly then, the issue is boundary lines, and where they should be placed. But in order to even begin this process, establishing the proper limits of Government, and granting licence, we need a Government unfettered and free from corruption, to begin with. This, clearly, is not the case, and until that is a reality, the idea of a free-market economy will always remain, just that, a theory, or an abstract for lively discussions.

      • DaveH

        Which came first, Jay, the chicken or the egg?
        The fact is that Government involvement in the Marketplace IS the source of corruption. So you are creating an impossible situation. The only chance we have to end the corruption is to take away the Power that Politicians have to pass out favors in the first place. And that means getting them out of the Marketplace. Free Markets are self-regulated by voluntary purchases.
        The only role Government should have (if any) is to protect people from Force or Fraud which is really just a form of Force since consumers can not make voluntary choices if they are lied to.
        You can disparage the concept of Free Market viability as being just “theory”, Jay, but in the end Unfree Markets have Proven themselves to be unworkable around the world. I’ll take the potential success of “theory” over the failure of actual practice any day.
        But having said that, for the first 100 years of our country’s life, we had very Free Markets, and they worked. Real incomes were growing. Productivity was increasing. And the buying power of the dollar was growing, as one would expect absent the sucking sound of Big Government.
        Federal Government Spending for the first 100 years of our country was 3% of GDP. Now it’s 24% of GDP. Explain to me, Jay, how we now need 8 times as much Federal Government as our “primitive” forefathers needed?
        Do yourself a favor, Jay, and read this book:
        http://library.mises.org/books/Kel%20Kelly/The%20Case%20for%20Legalizing%20Capitalism.pdf

      • Deerinwater

        I feel you are both correct, Jay and David ~so ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~one of you lead off. I am most interested an open to brisk debate

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing WTS/JAY

        DaveH: Explain to me, Jay, how we now need 8 times as much Federal Government as our “primitive” forefathers needed?

        I didn’t say we need 8 times as much Federal Government as our forefathers. What i said was that, the role of Government should be limited to protecting people from force and fraud. Naturally it follows that we need a Government free of corruption, or, as you rightly stated, “The only chance we have to end the corruption is to take away the Power that Politicians have to pass out favors in the first place.” Are we not on the same page? I’m agreeing with you that markets be free from Government-meddling, and that Government’s “involvement” (not, implementation of Government stifling policies/regulations) be limited to its specified role(protect from force and fraud). Isn’t that the proper role of Government? However, i do have serious reservations that that will ever happen. Call me a pessimist if you like, but please, never suggest that i support big-Government, or that Government should micro-manage every aspect of our lives; this, i would consider the ultimate insult!

      • Right Brain Thinker

        Deerinwater says: “I feel you are both correct, Jay and David ~so one of you lead off. I am most interested and open to brisk debate”
        I hope Deerinwater doesn’t mind my butting in to any “brisk debate” that may ensue. Jay and David are indeed both correct but to a somewhat greater degree wrong in what they have said in this exchange. Wrong in that they are busily grinding the wrong ax, i.e., looking at the question of government spending from a biased viewpoint.

        DavbeH says. “…for the first 100 years of our country’s life, we had very Free Markets, and they worked. Real incomes were growing. Productivity was increasing. And the buying power of the dollar was growing….Federal Government Spending for the first 100 years of our country was 3% of GDP. Now it’s 24% of GDP”.

        All true enough, and if we add the 8 or 9% of GDP that states spend and 10% of GDP that local governments spend, we find that “government” spending at all levels accounts for around 40% of GDP. If we look at the bigger picture, we find that our government spending is certainly not out of line when compared with other countries, particularly those in the developed world with economies and standards of living similar to ours. To cite a few:
        Canada 40% of GDP
        Denmark 52% of GDP
        Germany 44% of GDP
        UK 47% of GDP
        USA 39% of GDP
        All from 2011 data—Dave’s data may be from a few years back when government spending was higher—it has dropped a bit mainly because of big cutbacks at the local and state levels since—not relevant for this comparison. (and the data comes from the WSJ and The Heritage Foundation, so don’t even think of questioning “sources”)

        A more telling figure is what is termed the “tax burden as % of GDP”. 2011 figures for the same countries, with the above “government spending as % of GDP” figure in parens:
        Canada 32% of GDP (40%)
        Denmark 49% of GDP (52%)
        Germany 41% of GDP (44%)
        UK 39% of GDP (47%)
        USA 27% of GDP (39%)
        What do the figures show? First, that the USA’s government spending is not a bigger percentage of our GDP than that of countries like us and in fact does not even fall very near the top end of any such ranking. Two, most countries like us “work harder” at supporting their government spending, i.e., the taxes levied at the local, state, and national levels in the US place a lower “tax burden” on the citizenry. Thirdly, most governments in the developed world “regulate” as much or more than the U.S.

        Dave also asks, “Explain to me, Jay, how we now need 8 times as much Federal Government as our “primitive” forefathers needed?”, and gets Jay to go off on a “I hate big government” tangent. Let me try to answer Dave’s question. It ought to be obvious, Dave, that we are in fact no longer the “primitive” country we were back in our forefather’s day. First, we have gone from 3 to 4 million to over 300 million today—a hundred-fold increase. We’ve actually done pretty well to have held our spending on government down to only an eight-fold increase (if that’s what the figure really is).. Secondly, life is a lot more “complicated” today, for governments as well as individuals, and governments have a much bigger part to play than they did in “primitive” times. To make an analogy, you and I spend a lot of money on electricity, natural gas, telephones, gasoline, automobiles, and air travel than we did in “primitive” times—-and government at all levels has to get involved in “regulating” such things, particularly those that cross state lines.

        Compressing Jay’s and Dave’s comments a bit leads to the following

        DaveH says, “The fact is that Government involvement in the Marketplace IS the source of corruption. Free Markets are self-regulated by voluntary purchases…..in the end Unfree Markets have proven themselves to be unworkable around the world”. But having said that, for the first 100 years of our country’s life, we had very Free Markets, and they worked”
        Perhaps true to a point, although the signs of a corrupted free market were starting to appear around the time of the Civil war with the rise of the war profiteers. And things certainly came to a screeching halt with the Gilded Age and the rise of the Robber Barons. Free markets worked around the world until they became “unfree” in the sense that they were taken advantage of by the greedy and the manipulators—think tulip bulbs and tea.

        Jay says, “….in order to even begin this process (of) establishing the proper limits of Government, we need a Government unfettered and free from corruption, to begin with. …where presently, excessive regulations only impede economic growth….in other words, the main task of government is to protect the smooth functioning of the market economy against fraud or violence from within and from outside the country….it follows that we need a Government free of corruption, or, as you (Dave) rightly stated, “The only chance we have to end the corruption is to take away the Power that Politicians have to pass out favors in the first place.”

        I would suggest to both Jay and DaveH that they perhaps have it a bit backwards in spots? That the corruption of government that all three of us see and have agreed on in past comments on many threads is due to the “free markets” buying the government—-that the plutocracy and the corporate oligarchy have corrupted the intent of the forefathers by buying the politicians that “pass out the favors” to the 1% at the expense of the 99%.. That “excessive regulations” are not in fact impeding growth but are impeding the ever-accelerating accumulation of wealth by the greedy rich—-and the greedy rich have hoodwinked the “conservatives” into fighting their fight for them. No, Dave, what we need to take away is the Power that the plutocracy and corporate oligarchy have to BUY favors in the first place.

        We need to go back to the Constitution and rethink the “secure the blessings of Liberty” part that has been corrupted by the greedy rich and their bought and paid for politicians. We need to “regulate” our way back to “promoting the general Welfare”, “establishing economic Justice”, and “insuring domestic Tranquility”.

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing WTS/JAY

        RBT: That the corruption of government that all three of us see and have agreed on in past comments on many threads is due to the “free markets” buying the government—-that the plutocracy and the corporate oligarchy have corrupted the intent of the forefathers by buying the politicians that “pass out the favors” to the 1% at the expense of the 99%..

        More or less, yes. Except, on the “cause” for the corruption in Government; “Monopoly” not free-markets!

        RBT: That “excessive regulations” are not in fact impeding growth but are impeding the ever-accelerating accumulation of wealth by the greedy rich—-and the greedy rich have hoodwinked the “conservatives” into fighting their fight for them. No, Dave, what we need to take away is the Power that the plutocracy and corporate oligarchy have to BUY favors in the first place.

        If, as you say, the corruption of government is due to the “free markets” buying the government—-that the plutocracy and the corporate oligarchy have corrupted the intent of the forefathers by buying the politicians that “pass out the favors” to the 1% at the expense of the 99%..from where, then, are these “excessive regulations” coming from? Are they not in essence coming from a Government controlled by the “plutocracy and corporate oligarchy ” who purchase the favours of Government to write “excessive regulations”, “excessive regulations”, btw, that always result in massive profits for the “plutocracy and corporate oligarchy”?

        This is a clear contradiction! First, you posit that the “plutocracy and corporate oligarchy” controls our Government via generous payola, and then you suggest that the same payola-loving-Gorvernment will draft legislation/regulations to discourage the heinous behaviour. So which is it; is the Government corrupt and under the control of the “plutocracy and corporate oligarchy” or not? It can’t be both.

        RBT: We need to go back to the Constitution and rethink the “secure the blessings of Liberty” part that has been corrupted by the greedy rich and their bought and paid for politicians. We need to “regulate” our way back to “promoting the general Welfare”, “establishing economic Justice”, and “insuring domestic Tranquility”.

        Naturally, but first, we need an incorruptible Government. One can only dream…

      • Right Brain Thinker

        To Jay,

        I said, that “excessive regulations” are not in fact impeding growth but are impeding the ever-accelerating accumulation of wealth by the greedy rich—-and the greedy rich have hoodwinked the “conservatives” into fighting their fight for them”.

        Jay says, “If, as you say, the corruption of government is due to the “free markets” buying the government—-that the plutocracy and the corporate oligarchy have corrupted the intent of the forefathers by buying the politicians that “pass out the favors” to the 1% at the expense of the 99%..from where, then, are these “excessive regulations” coming from?”

        You are following me so far—-your question is a good one.

        Jay says, “Are they not in essence coming from a Government controlled by the “plutocracy and corporate oligarchy ” who purchase the favours of Government to write “excessive regulations”, “excessive regulations”, btw, that always result in massive profits for the “plutocracy and corporate oligarchy”?

        You are losing it a bit here. Read my comment again. I did not say that the plutocracy cum corporate oligarchy “controlled” the government. We can be thankful that it hasn’t gotten that bad yet. The plutocracy does have enough influence to often succeed at getting regulations written that favor their bottom line or block regulations that threaten their bottom line.

        Jay finally says, “This is a clear contradiction! First, you posit that the “plutocracy and corporate oligarchy” controls our Government via generous payola, and then you suggest that the same payola-loving-Government will draft legislation/regulations to discourage the heinous behaviour. So which is it; is the Government corrupt and under the control of the “plutocracy and corporate oligarchy” or not? It can’t be both”.

        You have followed the path of faulty logic into a deeper misreading of my comment. Note the “….” around “excessive regulations”—-a “qualifier” that should alert you to the fact that I may not be saying exactly what the words seem to say. What I AM saying is that the “excessive regulations” are only excessive in the eyes of the plutocracy cum corporate oligarchy—-that they DO impede the growth of the obscene profits that the greedy ones want to bleed from the 99%. I am not suggesting that the “greedy rich” controlled part of the government is writing the “excessive regulations”—-rather the exact opposite, that the part they DON’T yet control is doing that—-the remaining “good guys” who are still working for the 99%. If anything, the good guys need to write even MORE regulations to “discourage heinous behaviour”, and any regulations they write will not be excessive in my mind or yours . It is not the “same” government—-is that any clearer?

    • Carl Manning – Sic Semper Tyrannis

      Madoff also went to jail to suppress evidence of his funding of Mossad operations directly related to 911. Why did the US government refuse to release the evidence from his trial “for security reasons”…???

      “MADOFF MOSSAD AIG 911

      Russian intelligence has weighed in on the Madoff scandal and reported today that ~ ” Madoff was the chief financier for a vast Israeli spy and sabotage network ( Mossad ) set up by former Israeli Security Agency (Shin Bet) director Jacob Perry (Yaakov Peri) who ‘transformed’ himself into one of America’s most powerful businessman and led what FSB sources call the “Murderous/Fatal Gang of 7″ which references the leaders of this American-Israeli cabal who besides Madoff and Perry include:

      Henry Taub, Hungarian born American-Israeli who created the giant United States payroll company ADP which continues to funnel to Israeli intelligence services financial records for nearly every US citizen.

      Maurice Greenberg, American-Israeli who was the former chairman and CEO of American International Group (AIG), the World’s 18th largest public company and its largest insurance and financial services corporation which has (so far) funneled over $180 billion in US taxpayer money directly to Israel.

      Larry Silverstein, the American-Israeli billionaire who secured a lease for the World Trade Center buildings in New York on July 24, 2001, insured them for $3.55 billion spread among 24 different insurance companies, and after their destruction 2 months later on 9/11 collected $4.55 billion for Israel.

      Mort Zuckerman, Canadian born American-Israeli billionaire who through his vast publishing empire has direct control over 70 percent of the news reported in the United States.

      Edouard de Rothschild, French born American-Israeli member of the all powerful European Rothschild Banking Empire and director of the Rothschild & Cie Banque reported by the FSB to hold nearly 80% of the wealth stolen by Israel from the United States Government and its citizens.

      These reports further state that Madoff was ‘convicted’ in a ‘one of a kind’ designed trial in which his guilty plea kept all evidence against Israel’s betrayal of the United States from being entered into official American records as it was deemed by the Obama administration as ‘too incendiary’ for the American people to know about and would, most certainly, unleash an Israeli backlash many Russian Military Analysts state would leave ‘many US cities in ruin’. ” [link]

      With that in mind, it most certainly seems to appear that the prosecution is playing along with Madoff to protect other conspirators involved in this massive fraud. If so, who are they and why are they being protected ?

      Here’s a clue ~ Madoff has long standing ties with two of Israel’s largest banks ~ Bank Leumi and Israel Discount Bank ( IDB ) ~ which has a history of money laundering and illegal money transfers.

      Jacob Ezra Merkin is a part owner of Bank Leumi and has funneled billions of dollars to Madoff’s fund ~ suggesting that Madoff’s scheme was, in reality, a massive theft being disguised as a Ponzi scheme. A theft that involved many high level Zionists.

      If this is indeed the case ~ The Madoff fraud is a Zionist fund raising scheme in which billions of dollars have been not only been stolen but it would explain why they are still totally unaccounted for.

      The missing link in this cover up would be a Zionist agent playing the role of the Government prosecutor and that is indeed the case with Lev L Dassen, U.S. Attorney ~ one of the insiders in the judicial game surrounding the possible false-flag terror attacks that changed America and brought U.S. troops into the Middle East on a permanent basis. [link]

      Once again, the Madoff scandal is a red flag which cannot be ignored and must be investigated. Just follow the money and it could be the key to opening a Pandora’s Box of Israeli influence and the 9/11 cover up. Madoff is part of the Billionaires club which has wrought havoc on Wall Street and that includes AIG’s CEO Edward M. Liddy. The AIG debacle is another red flag that demands a criminal investigation ~ not Obama administration stonewalling ~ for its derivative trading schemes involves trillions of dollars of debt which cannot possibly be paid and could well be the greatest financial scandal in US history.

      Follow the money starting with Madoff’s missing billions and let’s fully open Pandora’s box.”

      Allen L Roland

      http://www.newciv.org/nl/newslog.php/_v308/__show_article/_a000308-000465.htm

  • Lawrence

    All of these things which have happened to our beloved country are the result of one thing. America has prgressively for the last over 100 years slowely abandoned the God which gave us this country and the freedom and liberty we had until now and we have thrown it away just as Enoch did in the bible for a bowl of beans.

  • Hank DdeVries

    None of the domestic or world wide political conditions will make sense unless one understands Bible Prophecy. Prophetic events are occuring daily and God’s plan for mankind is being fulfilled. It will culminate with the return of Jesus Christ. John 14:3–’If I go away and prepare a place for you, I will come back and receive you to Myself, so that where I am you may be also.’

  • Bob666

    Mr, Smith,
    You clearly have an IQ over 100.

  • alfromfl

    That’s all well and good, however those who didn’t vote for the republican voted in Obama – that’s progress? As for where conservatives will go? They can join the liberterians but they’re lacking in defense; you can join another but all those choices are sticking to principle but voting, by default, the democrats into power. If conservatives (their split during the primary was just as dumb as the RINO’s running the campaign) want to have a voice and don’t want to fight it out in the republican party, they they must start a new party using the tea party and libertarians but it’s almost too late to start even now for a 2016 run. Neither the conservatives nor the republican message was effective in convincing the people why they should not vote for Obama and the goodies.

    • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

      “however those who didn’t vote for the republican voted in Obama ”

      Actually you are incorrect on this. First both the Republican and Democratic parties practice Election Fraud. Proof is in other posts on this site.

      If you had NOT voted for Romney – who has most of the same policies of Obama – but voted for another party – plus fought election fraud we would not have had either of those two corrupt lying individuals.

      Instead you did as trained – voted “party” or for the “lesser of two evils”.

      To use a trite phrase, Wake Up! Both the Democratic and Republican parties are assisting in the destruction of the USA. They are “bought and sold”. You are a huge part of the problem. If you ahd researched Romney you would have seen that his policies varied VERY slightly from Obama’s. That is one of the reasons they got together and signed an agreement on what they would debate on.

      You should be aware of all the election fraud happened in 2012 GOP candidate race, but probably forgot what happened in 2008.

      Here is a start:
      The 2008 Democratic Nominating Committee (DNC) document did not include language stating that Obama was qualified to be a candidate. The 2008 Republican Nominating Committee (RNC) document did, as is normal. This shows that the DNC knew that Obama was not qualified, or why change the form?

  • slickzip

    The time has come to clean house and dump all the RINO from the Republican Party

    • Deerinwater

      Hmm? All fine and good I suppose and I must confess among my dearest beloved dog friends it’s hard to tell ~ if the dog is wagging it’s tail or that the tail is wagging the dog.

  • cmae

    maybe we are libertarians now.

    • FreedomFighter

      No RINO’s

      • NativeBlood

        No, NEOCONS.

  • akmac65

    The author makes a number of good points, even though I am usually 180 degrees opposite in viewpoint. What is disturbing to me are the number of those posting who are willing to embrace the most extreme positions based on nothing more substantial than opinion. As soon as we resort to labeling as a debate tool, we have lost. It is these fringe positions that deprive legitimate Conservatives of the attention their ideas deserve. The so-called “social conservatives” have distracted the country from the needed fiscal conservative message. That is a shame.

  • Mike

    A lot of bitter rhetoric. What a shame we can’t cut back on name calling, degradation of character, and negative encouragement. Sure it is important to expose the unjust and the harbingers of our demise, but what about the positive. My dad used to tell me that if I made a negative statement about something I’d better have a positive to fill the space left by the acid of negativity. So, not “where’s the beef”, but “where’s the positive”. Now that the trust of existing office holders (and the also-rans) has been dashed, where do we Americans go from here? The article burned the cabin down, now, build us a house we can all live in.

  • Dennis

    Way ahead of you. I wrote to my local Republican Party and National Party that I had severed my 47 year affiliation with the GOP. I then went on-line and took my name off the GOP voting register with the state.

    Although the Conservative Party seems like the right choice, it is not really a viable political party with a very small membership. The only other choice is the Constitution Party.

    I urge others to drop their GOP membership and voters registration also. Just maybe those (too) ‘senior statesmen’ of the GOP will get the message. I am totally disgusted with the GOP and told them that Nancy Pelosi has more backbone than the entire GOP.

  • Howlingmad

    It has to be the “REAL” TEA PARTY, that SPEAKS for “US”. The sooner its made into a TANGIBLE PARTY, the “BETTER” ! STRUCTURE, is what’s needed, that structure is “RON PAUL” . . . it has to be “HIM”. No one else, has either the EXPERIENCE, or KNOWLEDGE needed, to make it RIGHT. It “HAS” to be READY in 4 yrs, so we can run “RAND” PAUL for “PRESIDENT”. .

    • Deerinwater

      Well ~ hopeful thoughts spring eternal.

    • Right Brain Thinker

      So, the answer to the need to “improve” the GOP is bailing out and joining the Libertarian or Constitution or Conservative parties or yet-to-be-formed Tea Party? And thereby splitting the already-in-a-minority “conservative” vote? As Deer says. “hope springs eternal”.

      The folks on the left have been so frightened by what nearly happened in November that they will never do such a thing—–even the Greens voted for Obama because they are not suicidal like some on the right—-you will never see another Nader on the left because the left has learned to not engage in circular firing squads.

      The only thing that the left need fear is a resurgence of the “PARTY-PARTY Party, which might appeal to the young folks and the moochers of the 47%.

  • Bob666

    been watching FOX news a while?

  • Bob666

    “I know a lot of cops who prefer to have trained individuals packing, specially concealed carry, because it stops criminals from picking on those considered “helpless” since they do not know who is packing”

    First, I own guns and could care less if you do or don’t own a gun. It is not my right to tell you that you can or can’t own a gun nor is it your right to tell me if I can own a gun.

    The problem with your statement is; criminals don’t get training and sometimes they look like you or me. I also can’t tell you what cops in Kansas say, But here in Florida, they say something much different.

  • Bob666

    Smoovious Laxness says:

    December 12, 2012 at 6:16 am

    > Bob, excuse me while I LMAO at you. It’s so easy to
    > read you progressive hacks…when all else fails you
    > just can’t control your emotions.

    That’s just a failsafe reaction that commonly happens when their programming/conditioning is failing them, unable to cope with the concepts at hand.

    Unless it is a topic where they can parrot back phrases according to the keywords that trigger them, their conditioned thought processes just break down and their programming kicks them into self-preservation/defense mode.

    This is a pretty common occurrence, you’ll get accustomed to it”.

    Was this not directed at old Bob?

    • http://smoovious.wordpress.com Smoovious Laxness

      Nope…

      Mr. Livingston hasn’t said anything that I haven’t already been saying for myself.

      That is a part of why I said earlier that people are too invested in party.

      No matter how far their party diverges from their own interests and what their party is supposed to be standing for, they won’t vote their own interest, instead continuing to vote for their own party over and over, simply because they are “Republicans”…

      They’re voting for the name… not what the candidates stand for… and they time and time again, only listen to what the candidates say, at times when they will say anything to get you to vote for them, instead of looking at what the candidates have actually done.

      They repeatedly dismiss the real test of what the candidate stands for, in favor of the lip service, which is so much easier to fake.

      – Smoov

      • Bob666

        And that is why I dont below to the GOP or DNC-No substance.

  • Bob666

    A shooting at a Connecticut elementary school Friday left 27 people dead,
    including 18 children, an official with knowledge of the situation said,
    according to the Associated Press.

    Another official said the gunman was among the dead. It wasn’t clear how many
    people were injured. The killings happened at Sandy Hook Elementary School in
    Newtown, about 60 miles northeast of New York City.

    The story is still developing. Local police are expected to begin a news
    conference shortly.

    OK,
    Before you guys get wound up by the “Yellow Bellied Socialist-Marxist progressive communist”, who also happens to own guns and agrees with your right to own a gun, I believe that one has to ask the question: should everyone be packing? Keep in mind that most of us (who were born with exactly ten digits) now need both hands to count the number of school shootings and please don’t say that we should issue guns to hormone raged junior high school students.

    I welcome rational responses and Kansas, I know that you are already typing.

    • NativeBlood

      Already the corporate controlled media is insinuating the complete grabbing of weapons to save our kids from the murderous nuts. Just what the NEOCONS are calling for for total control of the unworthy masses.

    • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

      Bobb666 at this time I really cannot say much except I want to extend my heartfelt sorrow for those who are going through through this latest nightmare. I have very few facts about this, if any at all at this time.

      It does make me wonder if he also was under “psychiatric” care or in those (clinical) “trials” like most of the other shooters were before it all happened. The answer to that will be out in a few weeks no matter how tight a lid they try to put on it.

      All I can do at this time is guess. I do not believe it is beyond those in our government to murder young children to try to get gun control seen as the problem rather then the people themselves.

      If America ever finds out that those in our adminstration WERE responsible – we will be lucky to get them alive to be arrested and prosecuted.

      Why do I say that those corrupt individuals would not be beyond murdering children? Because that is a big part of “depopulation” (Agenda 21) and the vaccination programs basically echo that with was 90% of those who came down with the disease the vaccination was supposed to stop were the ones who got the vaccinations.

  • Bob666

    I heard nothing abou grabbing your weapons. I was just looking for a rational response.

  • Paul Wells

    NOW, that more of the story has come out. The 20 year old gunman who had psychiatric problems, managed to get his mothers guns, and go shoot up a school. He first shot his mother at home, then he went to the school to finish him rampage. Truly sad, and terribly disheartening. First…I’ believe in the 2nd amendment will all my heart. BUT…if one houses a family member that is mentally unstable..it totally behooves the owner of the guns to keep them under lock and key and out of the hands of someone who is looney tunes. Just remember all you frothing at the mouth anti gun nuts…the guns did not hop down off the shelf, load themselves, hippity hop down to that elementary school, and just start shooting. A deranged gunman did. End of story.

  • Peter Watson

    There is no place in the Conservative Party in England for conservatives as it has been taken over by Fabians such as David Cameron and his Bilderberg attending Chancellor George Osborne. Conservatives are a minority and now are threatened with extinction via ill conceived and malicious legislation. Your system no longer works because the Supreme Court has become a politicians plaything so your checks and balances no longer check, and balance.

    • http://www.edwinrankin.com Ed Rankin

      i just wonder why americans are just as incensed about the scores if not hundreds of innocent children killed by president obama’s drone strikes as they are by the shooting in connecticut?

      • Deerinwater

        Do you now? So what is your major concern, the killing of children, the American people or Obama?

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          How about all of those murders, plus the “murderer”?

          “More than 30 top U.S. officials, including presidents G.W. Bush and Obama, are guilty of war crimes or crimes against peace and humanity “legally akin to those perpetrated by the former Nazi regime in Germany,” the distinguished American international law authority Francis Boyle charges.
          “In international legal terms, the U.S. government itself should now be viewed as constituting an ongoing criminal conspiracy under international law,” Boyle said in an address Dec. 9th to the Puerto Rican Summit Conference on Human Rights at the University of the Sacred Heart in San Juan. Boyle is a Professor of International Law at the University of Illinois, Champaign, and the author of numerous books on the subject.

          Besides the presidents, Boyle identified as war criminals Vice Presidents Dick Cheney and Joseph Biden; Secretaries of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, Robert Gates and Leon Panetta; Secretaries of State Colin Powell, Condoleeza Rice, and Hillary Clinton; National Security Advisors Stephen Hadley, James Jones, and Thomas Donilon; Director of National Intelligence John Negroponte and James Clapper and Central Intelligence Agency(CIA) Directors George Tenet, Leon Panetta, and David Petraeus.

          In the Pentagon, war criminals include the members of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, and some Regional Commanders-in-Chiefs, especially for the U.S. Central Command (CENTCOM), and more recently, AFRICOM. Besides Chairman General Martin Dempsey, U.S. Army, JCS members include Admiral James Winnefeld Jr.; General Raymond Odierno, Chief of Staff of the Army; General James Amos, Commandant of the Marine Corps; Admiral Jonathan Greenert, Chief of Naval Operations; and General Mark Welsh, Chief of Staff of the Air Force.

          Those who have headed the Central Command since the U.S. invasion of Afghanistan include Lt. General Martin Dempsey; Admiral William Fallon; General John Abizaid; General Tommy Franks; Lt. General John Allen; and current commander General James Mattis. General Carter Ham of AFRICOM bears like responsibility….

          The serial aggressions of the U.S.violate such basic documents of international law as the Nuremberg Charter, the Nuremberg Judgment, and the Nuremberg Principles, Boyle said. As well, they violate the Pentagon’s own U.S. Army Field Manual 27-10 on The Law of Land Warfare, which applies to the President himself as Commander-in-Chief of U.S. Armed Forces under Article II, Section 2 of the U.S. Constitution.

          U.S. administrations since 9/11 may be charged with “crimes against peace” for their attacks in Afghanistan, Iraq, Pakistan, Libya, Somalia,Yemen, and Syria, “and perhaps their longstanding threatened war of aggression against Iran,”
          Boyle said.

          The eminent international authority went on to charge that the war crimes included “torture, enforced disappearances, assassinations, murders, kidnappings, extraordinary renditions, ‘shock and awe’ (bombings), and (the use of) depleted uranium, white phosphorus, cluster bombs, drone strikes,” and the like.

          Boyle said Americans “must not permit any aspect of their foreign affairs and defense policies to be conducted by acknowledged ‘war criminals’” but must insist upon “the impeachment, dismissal, resignation, indictment, conviction, and long-term incarceration of all U.S. government officials guilty of such heinous international and domestic crimes.”

          Boyle said the so-called “targeted killing” of human beings in a non-battlefield situation is “pure murder” under basic principles of Anglo-American common law and international criminal law. And in this case, where these murders are both widespread and systematic, these murders constitute a Crime against Humanity under Article 7(1)(a) of the Rome Statute for the International Criminal Court.

          Although the United States is not a party to the Rome Statute, Boyle said, “nevertheless President Obama is subject to the jurisdiction of the ICC and its Prosecutor for murdering people in ICC member States.”” By Sherwood Ross
          Global Research, December 12, 2012

          Now consider the “depopulation” of humans here in the USA and in other places (Agenda 21 – you really ought to read it, and LOOK-UP the words you do not understand – which has been being put into action here in the USA over a couple of decades.) Which Obama (and Romney) completely supports and plans to finalize as much of it as he can.

          You know, the “CHANGE” he promised. The new “FREEDOM” he promised which is the freedom FROM having to make any decisions for yourself, the government will decide literally EVERYTHING and as a good citizen you will follow orders and be freed – into SLAVERY)

      • edrankin

        are not as incensed, i intended to say….

      • Deerinwater

        Kansas, ~ I’m not saying that you are wrong. I’m telling you that you that your are kicking a dead horse and wasting your time with the argument that 44 or any president is a war criminal.

        We could not get any traction with this argument with 43, in 96,97, 98, you won’t with 44.

        The Presidential position, ~ is KING OF THE MOBS ~ deciding every morning who stands in harms way and what forces must be neutralized.

        The slot is not a School teacher slot but CEO over all CEO’s. Presidents make the hard calls that others refuse too or the gravity just above their pay grade.

        You can’t get you local city government to stand accountable for fail to act and your house washing away. So what outcome might you expect dealing with the Fed?

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          That is because we have allowed it. Do you know anyone in the military or a LEO? Remind them of the LEGALLY binding Constitutional 0ath they took (my understanding is that some are now taking oaths to the UN – this is NOT verified!).

          Military discipline and effectiveness is built on the foundation of obedience to orders. Recruits are taught to obey, immediately and without question, orders from their superiors, right from day-one of boot camp. Military members who fail to obey the lawful orders of their superiors risk serious consequences.

          The Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ), require the obedience of LAWFUL orders. An order which is unlawful not only does not need to be obeyed, but obeying such an order can result in criminal prosecution of the one who obeys it. Military courts have long held that military members are accountable for their actions even while following orders — if the order was illegal.

          “I was only following orders,” has been unsuccessfully used as a legal defense in hundreds of cases, most notably by Nazi leaders at the Nuremberg tribunals following World War II. The defense didn’t work for them, nor has it worked in hundreds of cases in the USA since. Even if it was a US President who made the unlawful order they can be held accountable for following it as they Oath makes them know the truth – the difference between a lawful and unlawful order.

          Pursuant to the President’s instructions, a U.S. Navy captain seized a Danish Ship (the Flying Fish), which was en route from a French Port (President John Adams wrote that Navy ships were authorized to seize any vessel bound for a French port, or traveling from a French port.) .The owners of the ship sued the Navy captain in U.S. maritime court for trespass. They won, and the United States Supreme Court upheld the decision.

          The U.S. Supreme Court held that Navy commanders “act at their own peril” when obeying presidential orders when such orders are illegal.

          The Vietnam War gave the United States military courts more cases of the “I was only following orders” defense than any previous conflict. The decisions during these cases reaffirmed that following manifestly illegal orders is not a viable defense from criminal prosecution and it does not matter from whom the order originates.

          The same for LEO’s (Law Enforcement Officers), they can be held for criminal, or civil offenses and “just following orders” or “just doing my job” are not legitimate defenses.

          Basically every Military person of whatever rank that is following Obama’s (and had followed Bush’s) treasonous orders (Panetta and Gen Dempsey’s also) are committing criminal acts – up to murder, mass murder and war crimes.

          More than 30 top U.S. officials, including presidents G.W. Bush and Obama, are guilty of war crimes or crimes against peace and humanity “legally akin to those perpetrated by the former Nazi regime in Germany. U.S. officials involved in an “ongoing criminal conspiracy” in the Middle East and Africa who either participated in the commission of the crimes under their jurisdiction or failed to take action against them included both presidents since 2001 and their vice-presidents, the secretaries of State and Defense, the directors of the CIA and National Intelligence and the Pentagon’s Joint Chiefs of Staff and heads of the Central Command, among others, Boyle said.

          “In international legal terms, the U.S. government itself should now be viewed as constituting an ongoing criminal conspiracy under international law,” Boyle said in an address Dec. 9th to the Puerto Rican Summit Conference on Human Rights at the University of the Sacred Heart in San Juan. Boyle is a Professor of International Law at the University of Illinois, Champaign, and the author of numerous books on the subject.
          Besides the presidents, Boyle identified as war criminals Vice Presidents Dick Cheney and Joseph Biden; Secretaries of Defense Donald Rumsfeld, Robert Gates and Leon Panetta; Secretaries of State Colin Powell, Condoleeza Rice, and Hillary Clinton; National Security Advisors Stephen Hadley, James Jones, and Thomas Donilon; Director of National Intelligence John Negroponte and James Clapper and Central Intelligence Agency(CIA) Directors George Tenet, Leon Panetta, and David Petraeus.

          In the Pentagon, war criminals include the members of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, and some Regional Commanders-in-Chiefs, especially for the U.S. Central Command (CENTCOM), and more recently, AFRICOM. Besides Chairman General Martin Dempsey, U.S. Army, JCS members include Admiral James Winnefeld Jr.; General Raymond Odierno, Chief of Staff of the Army; General James Amos, Commandant of the Marine Corps; Admiral Jonathan Greenert, Chief of Naval Operations; and General Mark Welsh, Chief of Staff of the Air Force.

          Those who have headed the Central Command since the U.S. invasion of Afghanistan include Lt. General Martin Dempsey; Admiral William Fallon; General John Abizaid; General Tommy Franks; Lt. General John Allen; and current commander General James Mattis. General Carter Ham of AFRICOM bears like responsibility.
          The serial aggressions of the U.S.violate such basic documents of international law as the Nuremberg Charter, the Nuremberg Judgment, and the Nuremberg Principles, Boyle said. As well, they violate the Pentagon’s own U.S. Army Field Manual 27-10 on The Law of Land Warfare, which applies to the President himself as Commander-in-Chief of U.S. Armed Forces under Article II, Section 2 of the U.S. Constitution.

          U.S. administrations since 9/11 may be charged with “crimes against peace” for their attacks in Afghanistan, Iraq, Pakistan, Libya, Somalia,Yemen, and Syria, “and perhaps their longstanding threatened war of aggression against Iran,”
          Boyle said.

          The eminent international authority went on to charge that the war crimes included “torture, enforced disappearances, assassinations, murders, kidnappings, extraordinary renditions, ‘shock and awe’ (bombings), and (the use of) depleted uranium, white phosphorus, cluster bombs, drone strikes,” and the like.

          Boyle said Americans “must not permit any aspect of their foreign affairs and defense policies to be conducted by acknowledged ‘war criminals’” but must insist upon “the impeachment, dismissal, resignation, indictment, conviction, and long-term incarceration of all U.S. government officials guilty of such heinous international and domestic crimes.”

          Boyle said the so-called “targeted killing” of human beings in a non-battlefield situation is “pure murder” under basic principles of Anglo-American common law and international criminal law. http://www.globalresearch.ca/more-than-thirty-top-u-s-officials-guilty-of-war-crimes/5315289 By Sherwood Ross

          They have made ,any of the Military and LEO’s criminals.

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          I cannot alone, but together we can. It does not take all of us, jsut a determined group who is willing toeducate the masses.

          Most important is to educate those you know in the military and LEO’s.

          It is also important to educate those who are behaving like sheep that THEY will be made into slaves via Agenda 21 or depopulated. Then they may not act, but they will not believe the lies by those representatives when they are arrested and held for trial within the states, and later the feds.

          Right now, much like Germany in the past, it is much easier for them to believe “that it could never happen here in the USA” then to face the fact that it can happen anywhere when the people do not do THEIR duty as the sovereign of this nation.

  • JohnR

    I’d like to point out that most of this article is inflamed oratory, spiced up with rhetorical blasts. And, sadly, it all rings true, or very close to true.

    IMHO, the corruption in both parties stems from their capture, on a grand scale, by monied interests. Lobbyists writing legislation; special favors; regulation capture; a crazy, non-progressive tax code; a historically terrible do-nothing Congress that has been captured by an incredibly incompetent, partisan Tea Party-strangled House; massive, and increasing, income inequality that continues to gut the middle class; a Wall Street casino that continues its deadly ways post-2008, though you and I rescued the financial elite with trillions of our tax dollars in 2008; a SCOTUS that has no qualms about legislating from the bench; and on and on. What a mess.

    As if the money wasn’t massive and corrupting enough, SCOTUS gave us Citizens United to really jack our recent elections. The Koch brothers just told Forbes – 12/24/12 print edition – that they’re already planning how to do a better job of buying an election in 2016.

    So, as people often observe: “Follow the money”. How repair/replace the GOP? Election finance reform? Any ideas? Anyone?

    Thank you.

    • Deerinwater

      Good post John R. ~~ How to get the money out of politics????? I don’t believe that we can.

      • Marty S.

        Don’t fret they will spend the money until it is worthless and that will remove money from politics quite well. Hang on because the demise of the dollar the and the coinciding ride down is sure to be a thrill indeed.

    • Right Brain Thinker

      You nailed it quite well, John. Campaign finance reform is our biggest hope. Overturn Citizens United via legislation or a Constitutional Amendment, pass laws that require disclosure and transparency (and hope that knowing the truth about who is working to buy the country will convince the voters to do the right thing). We need to rein in the lobbyists and corporate special interest groups also—-they have too much influence over the legislative process.

      (Restoring greater progressivity to the tax code will also help in a roundabout way).

  • richard brooks

    the children continue to fight over who gets to spend the money and who is going to pay for it.

    liberty and freedom are not liberty or freedom if you are forcing your personal definitions of those terms on others.

    if you are unwilling to find a common ground that the majority can agree with you will continue to find yourself being left out and ignored.

    we will never return to the principles of the founders of this country. why would you want to.

    personally, i would prefer we gain control of our govt officials and got out of mandating personal morals and ideologys.

    if you continue to make abortion, drugs, gay marriage, etc., your major argument, then you will never have the time or support to fix the problems our politicians have created.

    if you want to know who is to blame? the answer is simple.

    look in the mirror.

    • Bob666

      Very well said Richard, Very well said.

    • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

      I can answer that. Because in individual liberty is where you can find ‘if you have a right to life then you have NO right to take anothers life. If you have the right to own property, then you DO NOT have the right to take anothers property from them. Etc, all important reasons.

      What I think you have problems with:
      is the way people, with their own interests at heart, and wanting more power (since almost the beginning of our country) have destorted the US Constitution.

      Remember the Preamble? The declaration of Independence? They are all part of the US Constitution and it’s meanings, the framers said so. But they all knew that corruptness lurks in every human because it was also in them, not just from being WELL LEARNED in history.

      That is why they put in so many checks and balances; but the GREATEST check was the oath of office as it is those who serve within the federal governments accountability to us, “We the People”. That they can be removed from office, arrested and prosecuted fro committing a criminal act, plus some civil offenses.

      That education is what has been denied the sovereign people. Not only denied it, but the opposite taught to them so that they would accept that a person who is a temp worker in the government has power over us other then what we agreed to let them have. They so NOT, not legally.

      All of the regulations (commerce clause taken way out of what the duties were specifically listed and were assigned to them), Federal Reservve, etc, that congress set up are all “null and void” not legal here in the USA. But it gave – and still gives – them much power which is hard to give up.

  • Dad

    Taxes are irrelevant in this argument with 40 cents of every dollar being borrowed. We need to blabce the budget by cutting spending. Let Obama veto such a bill…
    My prediction is that only his supporters will suffer in the long run… which is befitting.

  • Jess Phelps

    uptil I saw the paycheck saying $9974, I accept …that…my friends brother had been truley receiving money parttime from their computer.. there neighbor has done this 4 less than twenty months and at present repayed the mortgage on there place and got a new Nissan GT-R:. we looked here, FAB33.COM

  • Donray

    The problem is that the minority Christian Right has taken over the Republican Party. The vast majority of people are pro-choice but not pro-abortion while the minority Christian Right thinks anyone that is pro-choice are pro-abortion. They forget that one of most Christian (Majority Catholic) countries (Italy) voted to keep abortions legal. “Abortion in Italy became legal in May 1978, when Italian women were allowed to terminate a pregnancy on demand during the first 90 days. A proposal to repeal the law was considered in a 1981 national referendum, but was rejected by nearly 68% of voters”. So, considering the vast majority of Americans are pro-choice why have the minority Christian Right that call themselves conservatives bring up abortion as an issue in the last few elections? This same Christian Right that calls itself pro-life is for the killing of people by the government (the death penalty) so they are hypocrites.

    This same group that I will call the Christian Taliban (because like the Muslim Taliban) they want to have woman subservient to men, want government operating with the bible as its source of laws, they would like blaspheme prosecuted. These Christian Taliban are the ones responsible for Obama winning the last election. The problem is that they don’t think that was the reason that Obama won. You have idiots saying they think a woman controls if she gets pregnant, that they have no idea if the world is 5,000 old or millions like the vast majority think it is. What is wrong with saying you are pro-choice, but personally I am against using abortion for birth control. Of course you also better be for providing birth control. The majority see the hypocrisy of being anti-abortion and anti-birth control. I don’t understand how the Christian Taliban thinks that being against birth control and abortion is a good moral idea.

    Another hypocrisy of the Christian Right is “family values” these Christians want everyone that cannot afford a kid (don’t supply birth control) to have many kids and not one abortion. These same Christian idiots don’t want to have taxes raised to support all these kids and the mothers. Good thing there is a no God or these people would be the first going to hell. Why is the Christian right against supporting and having medical care for all these kids?

    They want to put any woman that has an avboriton in jail, most likely without a trail. Wake up, the vast majority are pro-life and not anti-abortion.

    These Christian Taliban have no problem with torturing a girl or woman with carrying a baby that is the result of rape to term. They don’t care that a 15 year old rape victim would drop out of school to have this unwanted baby. Yet they don’t want the government to take care of these unwanted kids. Why don’t these good Christians want the government to spend more on welfare to take care of unwanted kids, single mothers that have little education, rape victims and their unwanted kids. There are millions of kids in foster care and these good Christians don’t adopt them. Where are all these Christain wanting governmnet funds to pay for college for and child that is alive because the mother did not have an abortion? Instead these hypocrite Christians want less government care for children and mothers.

    So, the problem is the Christian Taliban hypocrites on what they think are family values and moral issues.

    Second, what are the attributes of a conservative? Does religious enter into the attributes?

    • http://smoovious.wordpress.com Smoovious Laxness

      > Second, what are the attributes of a conservative?
      > Does religious enter into the attributes?

      Personally, I don’t believe so at all…

      When religion enters the picture, conservatism takes a back seat to theocracy…

      Then, the Theocrats (ie: Evangelicals), toss conservatism aside in favor of the gov’t imposing their theocratic policies on the rest of us, and if they have to make the gov’t bigger to do it, they will.

      The linear left-right scale has always been a flawed way to gauge politics, lumping people who are opposed to each other together as if we are the same, and we are not.

      Religion is a very personal thing guiding our personal lives (or not, as the individual chooses)

      The gov’t should be maintaining our infastructure, our defense, our roads, and a handful of other municipal services, most of which can be done at the state and local level (and many already are)

      A free country’s government has to stay out of the way of the citizen’s freedom to make their own choices, and leave the dogma to the religious institutions where they belong.

      – Smoov

    • Paul Wells

      Donray,
      On posts such as yours, I tend to read until I spot the first lie, and in your case, it was right of the bat. You state “The vast majority of people are pro-choice…”. Incorrect. The majority of folks in this country are NOT pro-choice.
      http://www.gallup.com/poll/154838/pro-choice-americans-record-low.aspx

      Then I know to pretty much disregard anything else, for only the devil and a fool mixes the lies with truth.

      • Bob666

        Paul,

        http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/current_events/abortion/54_are_pro_choice_38_pro_life

        We could throw polls at each other all day, but I really believe that you need to ask yourself, Should I be calling people a lier?

        “Then I know to pretty much disregard anything else, for only the devil and a fool mixes the lies with truth”.

        If you wnt to disagree, that is fine. But While I would tend to agree with Donray, I would never call you a lier if I have a poll that diagrees with your poll. Let me seperate this for you, I am not pro abortion, but I am pro choice as I have not right to tell you what church to go to or what political party to vote for and you dont have a right to tell my wife, daughter or sister what they can do with their body.

      • Paul Wells

        Bob666, Where you and I differ, obviously, is when life actually begins. Whereas you see a mass of living, growing “tissue” as just tissue, I see a fetus, a human being. While your fence straddling may seem admirable to you, I find it’s the root cause of why things are so messed up in America today. I am against the murder of innocent humans, and you don’t get more innocent that those that have NO PROTECTION from being destroyed. I find it most ironic that while you may find murder of a child once born as abhorrent, you don’t accord the same protections to those even more vulnerable. Of course, you do it under the guise of being a decent human being so as to not impose your will on your wife and daughters.

        As for the other business, I think Gallup is a pretty accepted poll, and it was the first one google brought up, so apparently others think so too. I think what I object to most, is that your prevarication on moral issues is the root of the decay of western civilization, but you don’t see it that way, from your progressive liberal perch. You take me to task for calling someone a “lier” (sic), but you basically do the same to me, but somehow feel all righteous and justified in so doing.

        Typical liberal response. When the facts don’t match, get all emotional. Sad.

        • Bob666

          Paul,
          Where does one start?

          “I think what I object to most, is that your prevarication on moral issues is the root of the decay of western civilization, but you don’t see it that way, from your progressive liberal pe
          rch”

          You are are obviouly one of those guys who knows what is best for everyone with a direct connection to god and the abilty to judge everyone around you. What I find amusing about people like you is that when you dont agree with someone, they fall into the catagory of “Progressives, Liberals, Morons, Liers, Etc”.

          As for your claims, I could match you poll for poll because it is close on Choice-Anti Choice. But I would suggest that if you were correct, we might have a different president right now, unless your one of those who is convinced about wide spread voter fraud?

          Notice how I did not resort to calling you names?

      • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

        Paul, I disagree.

        Besides: “Make the lie big, make it simple, keep saying it, and eventually they will believe it.” Adolf Hitler

      • Paul Wells

        Bob666,
        I’ll say it again.

        ” I am against the murder of innocent humans, and you don’t get more innocent that those that have NO PROTECTION from being destroyed.”

        It’s as simple as that. You will likely disagree, that is your prerogative, it’s still a free country…for now. Murder is still against the law…for now.

        • Bob666

          Paul,
          “it’s still a free country…for now” It still is and I suspect it always will be.

      • GregS

        Bob666 says:

        “…you dont have a right to tell my wife, daughter or sister what they can do with their body.”

        The unborn child is NOT part of a woman’s body. He/she is a SEPARATE living human organism with his/her own genome, sex, blood type, beating heart (@22 days), functioning brain (@42 days), etc. Any textbook in embryology will tell you this.

        The issue is NOT about a woman’s body. It’s about the RIGHT TO LIFE of the unborn child. The RIGHT TO LIFE is the most basic right in the Constitution, and it precedes all other rights.

    • GregS

      Donray says:

      “They want to put any woman that has an avboriton in jail, most likely without a trail.”

      Wrong! There has NEVER been a law that would put a woman in jail for having an abortion, and I would never support such a law, if there was. All laws concerning abortion have been directed against the abortionist, NOT the woman. In fact, there are pro-life organizations all over the country, which help women who have had abortions. The woman is the second victim of every abortion.

  • Dexter L. Wilson

    Very simple, in the state of Texas, back when Pat Robertson ran for president, we pro-life people were trained by Christian Coalition how to take over the Republican Party in Texas. We have as you know a very conservative state. Please Tea Party people must go to their respective precinct conventions and caucuses. This is where you begin to take over the party and tell the party bosses where to get off. We must have the NUMBERS at the precinct, county and state conventions in order to get our people in the top national positions. It ain’t going to happen in the Democrat Party and a third party only gets a democrat in the White House. If you control the County elections you control and make sure the machines are accurate. You must defeat incumbent democrats who have been controling the elections.

  • http://tiny.cc/technonetabc2 Danilo Smith

    The changes are noticeable. The demographics of this nation is rapidly changing and any political group that wants to be successful must adjust. I am just being real.

  • Terry Bateman

    I agree that the “leadership” of the republican party lacks conservative spine and
    usually backs the most liberal republican candidates.However, I do believe that
    Mitt Romney could have won this election had he responded vociferously to
    democratic attack ads in the early summer and run massive amounts of attack ads
    of his own in the summer and fall. He also should have kept right on campaigning
    after hurricane Sandy.

    • Paul Wells

      Terry, You bring up some interesting points, and ones I have wondered about also. It almost seems like Mitt tried to be “too nice”. He really should have come out swinging early in the campaign and defined Obama for who he is, a narcissistic, socialist nationalist hell bent on bringing poverty to all. Instead, he kind of held back, and let the Democratic propaganda machine define him as a rich, out of touch with the common folk preppie. I too think the campaign strategy sucked, and I even thought so at the time. The Dems were busy running national ads back in May, and the RNC waited until August or so. By then, it seems, or at least my perception is, the misguided of the Dems was pretty ingrained, and I believe they lost the election at that point. At any rate, whoever it was that ran his campaign was very short sighted. Sad, just sad.

      • Bob666

        Could it be remotely possible that Mitt Romney just blew as a presidential candidate?

      • Paul Wells

        No surprise that we disagree, Bob666…I thought Mitt Romney was a GOOD candidate. Probably not the best out there, but a damned sight better than Obummer. However…we now have become a nation of whiners and takers, and class warfare apparently works. People are very short sighted, it appears. “Once the general populace realize they can vote themselves largesse from the government coffers, the democracy is finished!”.

        • http://smoovious.wordpress.com Smoovious Laxness

          Oh please…

          The entire field was better than Obama…

          Comparing against Obama is a cop-out. The GOP counted on anti-Obama sentiment alone to carry them through, and they were wrong.

          The GOP counted on, that the conservatives/libertarians would fall back into line and get behind Romney, because the alternative was Obama. (and yet another only-two-parties-exist attitude :eyeroll)

          Romney didn’t lose because of Obama, he lost because of Romney.

          If all you’re focusing on is Obama, and not willing to deal with the candidate the GOP wanted us to vote for, you’re going to keep getting more of this. People are less and less likely to vote the ‘lesser of two evils’ anymore. We have so much information available about candidates than we have had historically, that the public face the parties keep putting out as if we’re still in a controlled-information era, that their efforts are falling flat more and more every election.

          We didn’t vote for Romney, because of Romney… not Obama…

          Romney wasn’t a guy we could get behind. We were screaming for someone to oppose government expansion, and instead, the GOP manipulated the convention process, and put up the inspiration for the government expansion we were screaming to oppose.

          The GOP committed political suicide this year, and they’re still running with it in congress, by yanking out all of the tea party backed people from their committee assignments.

          The GOP isn’t interested in smaller government, personal liberty, and fiscal conservatism… only big government, blind loyalty, and evangelicalism…

          Quit comparing Romney against Obama… it is a meaningless comparison… hell, Carter is better than Obama. At least Carter respected the office and what it stood for.

          “at least Romney was better than Obama” is a meaningless comparison…

          Now, don’t get me wrong here. Romney, on the surface, seemed like a decent enough sort, but so did Carter. There was something likeable about both of them, personality-wise.

          But I’m not voting for my next friend, but for the top office of a tough job that needs someone that has the will and fortitude to stand against the flood and turn it back.

          Romney just wasn’t that guy… and as long as the GOP keeps pushing through candidates like that, we libertarians and fiscal conservatives will go elsewhere.

          – Smoov

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          Your comment when comparing Romney to Obama (…sight better than Obummer) was incorrect.

          Except on small issues, they were running on the same platform.

      • Paul Wells

        Smoov….let me see if I have this straight. Using your own logic, even MITT ROMNEY was a better candidate, because you pointed out that the entire field was better than Obama. Yet, I’ll presume you voted for a third party candidate that you KNEW would not win, just to make a point, and in so doing let Obama back in???? This actually boggles my mind, it’s like a Japanese Kamikaze pilot, I’m takin’ the whole thing down, if my candidate doesn’t win, the destruction starts!

        You can say all you want that Romney shifted his position, etc. etc. One thing he was absolutely clear on, was to work on the economy and get people back to work. Maybe I’m missing something here, but that does seem like the goal.

        Sure, Romney wouldn’t have been my first choice, and I too, DID NOT like what they did to Ron Paul at the convention. But I’ll be damned if I would vote for someone I knew couldn’t defeat Obama just because “voting for the lesser of two evils just doesn’t work anymore”.

        You show me a libertarian candidate that can effectively compete and has a snowballs chance of winning, and I’m voting for him. In spite of the fact that there is one plank of their platform that just agitates me to no end, and that is: protect our borders only, and the rest of the world can go to hell. Dangerous, in my way of thinking.

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          Then you are doing just as you have been ‘trained’ to do, even using the same words to describe the ‘trained action’ ““voting for the lesser of two evils…”.

          Yet, if all of you who voted for the “lesser of two evils” had voted for a third party candidate.
          Or, even better, called the RNC/GOP and told them what they did to Ron Paul showed exactly how corrupt they are and that you cannot trust them anymore so are leaving the party. That you are leaving because they are selecting a person most did not want (that is why the election fraud prior, and that RP’s group was so strong they did what they did at the convention) – so you have to assume by their actions that they are complicent in the treasonous actions being done against our legitimate government.

          Treason? Yes, treason.

          18 USC § 2382 – Misprision of treason: Whoever, owing allegiance to the United States and having knowledge of the commission of any treason against them, conceals and does not, as soon as may be, disclose and make known the same to the President or to some judge of the United States, or to the governor or to some judge or justice of a particular State, is guilty of misprision of treason and shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than seven years, or both.
          RNC/GOP and the DNC (The 2008 Democratic Nominating Committee (DNC) document did not include language stating that Obama was qualified to be a candidate. The 2008 Republican Nominating Committee (RNC) document did, as is normal. This shows that the DNC knew that Obama was not qualified, or why change the form?)

          18 USC § 2383 – Rebellion or insurrection: Whoever incites, sets on foot, assists, or engages in any rebellion or insurrection against the authority of the United States or the laws thereof, or gives aid or comfort thereto, shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.

          18 USC § 2384 – Seditious conspiracy: If two or more persons in any State or Territory, or in any place subject to the jurisdiction of the United States, conspire to overthrow, put down, or to destroy by force the Government of the United States, or to levy war against them, or to oppose by force the authority thereof, or by force to prevent, hinder, or delay the execution of any law of the United States, or by force to seize, take, or possess any property of the United States contrary to the authority thereof, they shall each be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both.

          18 USC § 2385 – Advocating overthrow of Government: Whoever knowingly or willfully advocates, abets, advises, or teaches the duty, necessity, desirability, or propriety of overthrowing or destroying the government of the United States or the government of any State, Territory, District or Possession thereof, or the government of any political subdivision therein, by force or violence, or by the assassination of any officer of any such government; or
          Whoever, with intent to cause the overthrow or destruction of any such government, prints, publishes, edits, issues, circulates, sells, distributes, or publicly displays any written or printed matter advocating, advising, or teaching the duty, necessity, desirability, or propriety of overthrowing or destroying any government in the United States by force or violence, or attempts to do so; or
          Whoever organizes or helps or attempts to organize any society, group, or assembly of persons who teach, advocate, or encourage the overthrow or destruction of any such government by force or violence; or becomes or is a member of, or affiliates with, any such society, group, or assembly of persons, knowing the purposes thereof—
          Shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both, and shall be ineligible for employment by the United States or any department or agency thereof, for the five years next following his conviction.
          If two or more persons conspire to commit any offense named in this section, each shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than twenty years, or both, and shall be ineligible for employment by the United States or any department or agency thereof, for the five years next following his conviction.
          As used in this section, the terms “organizes” and “organize”, with respect to any society, group, or assembly of persons, include the recruiting of new members, the forming of new units, and the regrouping or expansion of existing clubs, classes, and other units of such society, group, or assembly of persons.

          Obama, Panetta, Dempsey, and his adminstration, the Senate who heard them, congress, and Boehner (letter from Obama) fiving the United Nations authority over the USA. Giving the UN authority over the US Military. Agenda 21 being implemented here in the USA (UN’s), UN laws to take “precedence” over our government, US citizens to pay taxes to the UN, etc

          ALL TREASON. Ready to start fighting it now?

        • http://smoovious.wordpress.com Smoovious Laxness

          I don’t vote against candidates, I vote for them.

          Sure, Romney may have been marginally better than Obama, but he was still an unacceptable choice. The differences were superficial at best.

          The purpose of voting, is not to cast for who you think will win, but who you think is the best person for the job.

          By that criteria? Romney didn’t earn my vote.

          – Smoov

      • Paul Wells

        Smoov & Kansas….
        Well, all I can say to that is, I’m open minded enough to consider what you have both said. You raise interesting points, and amongst close friends of mine, I’ve already confided (even before this) that I didn’t know if I could stay in the Repub. party any longer.

        I have to say though, that I despise the ground Obama walks on, I believe him to be a human cancer, and thoroughly and keenly bad for our Nation. And now we have the blankety-blank for another 4 years. He will continue to implement his plan of destruction for the US. And…if he is successful … he will succeed, then all of this is a moot point.

        I’m smart enough to know that had Romney gotten elected, it would have only slowed the conversion to socialism, certainly not eradicated it. I fear for our country. This indeed, are trying times.

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          The problem is, like a lot of others, you are accepting that the corruption practiced in this election has to be tolerated.

          It doesn’t. The more corruption we tolerate the worse it gets here. Election fraud is both a state and a federal crime (when elections has to do at the federal level) and it is past time to pressure those in law enforcement about why nothing is being done about the election fraud done in your state.

          Every state that voted had election fraud committed, every one.

          Personally, I have been calling for a re election with all of the candidates who were running – Romney got the pres candidate position through election fraud – NOT legally. But then Obama in 2008 got to run as a presidential candidate for the same reason – election fraud. (The 2008 Democratic Nominating Committee (DNC) document did not include language stating that Obama was qualified to be a candidate. The 2008 Republican Nominating Committee (RNC) document did, as is normal.)

          Print up the ballots with big boxes at each selection, and hand count in the USA at every single count with citizens watching and videos on.

          It is PAST time that we took our part of running our government back – the elections. NO MACHINES.

          The oath is the second part of our duties as assigned by the US Constitution. It is a check the branches can use against corruption, and it is a check the states can use against federal corruptio. But if they both fail us, it is a criminal act to break the oath. That is OUR duty to hold them responsible. Besides taking and keeping the oath is a REQUIREMENT of all those positions/offices.

          President Truman relieved MacArthur because MacArthur did not support the requirements of the Constitution and did not faithfully discharge his duties.
          Precedent.

          Washington court-martialed Thomas Dewees, finding him guilty of two offenses: (1) not taking the oath of office.

          Clause 2 of Article VI of the ORIGINAL Constitution: “This Constitution, and the Laws of the United States which shall be made in Pursuance thereof; and all Treaties made, or which shall be made, under the Authority of the United States, shall be the supreme Law of the Land; and the Judges in every State shall be bound thereby, any Thing in the Constitution or Laws of any State to the Contrary notwithstanding.”

          The Constitution of the United States of America IS the Supreme Law of this land, NOT the federal government.

          The first law statute of the United States of America, enacted in the first session of the First Congress on 1 June 1789, was Statute 1, Chapter 1: an act to regulate the time and manner of administering certain oaths, which established the oath required by civil and military officials to support the Constitution.

          The wording of the Presidential Oath was established in the Constitution in Article II, Section 1, Clause 8.

          Before he enter on the Execution of his Office, he shall take the following Oath or Affirmation: “I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my Ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States.”

          The requirement for all Federal and State Civil officers to give their solemn and binding Oath is established in Article VI, Section 1, Clause 4.

          They are BOUND by their Oath to support the Constitution, and should they abrogate their Oath by their acts or inaction, are subject to charges of impeachment and censure.

          Once given, the Oath is binding for life, unless renounced, refused, and abjured. It does not cease upon the occasions of leaving office or of discharge.

          Solemn: “Legally binding, Common legal phrase indicating that an agreement has been consciously made, and certain actions are now either required or prohibited”, “The other requirement for an agreement or contract to be considered legally binding is consideration – both parties must knowingly understand what they are agreeing to”.

          Bound – “Being under legal or moral obligation; to constitute the boundary or limit of; to set a limit to; confine”
          “Blacks Law Dictionary” states that a contract is
          1. An agreement between two or more parties creating obligations that are enforceable or otherwise recognizable at law.

          Require, Requirement, Required: “to claim or ask for by right and authority; Mandated under a law or by an authoritative entity. That which is required; a thing demanded or obligatory; something demanded or imposed as an obligation.”

          The Framers placed “Oaths of Office” in the Constitution. These Oaths are to function as “checks” on the powers of the federal government and protect us from usurpations. Each Branch of the federal government has “the check of the Oath” on the other two branches.

          The States, whose officials also take the Oath of Office, have the same check on all three branches of the federal government.

          And “We the People”, the “original fountain of all legitimate authority” (Federalist 22), have the Right to overrule violations of the Constitution by elected and appointed officials.

          Webster’s 1828 Dictionary says for “Constitution”: “…In free states, the constitution is paramount to the statutes or laws enacted by the legislature, limiting and controlling its power; and in the United States, the legislature is created, and its powers designated, by the constitution.”
          If any Branch fails to obey the “supreme Law”, then, in order to preserve the Rule of Law, the other Branches, or failing that, the States or THE PEOPLE, must overrule them”.

          Federal law regulating oath of office by government officials is divided into four parts along with an executive order that further defines the law for purposes of enforcement.
          5 U.S.C. 3331, provides the text of the actual oath of office members of Congress are required to take before assuming office.

          5 U.S.C. 3333 requires members of Congress sign an affidavit that they have taken the oath of office required by 5 U.S.C. 3331 and have not or will not violate that oath of office during their tenure of office as defined by the third part of the law,

          5 U.S.C. 7311 which explicitly makes it a federal criminal offense (and a violation of oath of office) for anyone employed in the United States Government (including members of Congress) to “advocate the overthrow of our constitutional form of government”.

          18 U.S.C. 1918 provides penalties for violation of oath of office described in 5 U.S.C. 7311 which include: (1) removal from office and; (2) confinement or a fine.

          The definition of “advocate” is further specified in Executive Order 10450 which for the purposes of enforcement supplements 5 U.S.C. 7311.

          One provision of Executive Order 10450 specifies it is a violation of 5 U.S.C. 7311 for any person taking the oath of office to advocate “the alteration … of the form of the government of the United States by unconstitutional means.”

          Congress (and the other two branches) committed a second criminal violation of their oaths of office regarding an Article V Convention call. 5 U.S.C. 7311 clearly specifies it is a criminal violation for any member of Congress to advocate the overthrow of our constitutional form of government (because only congress is supposed to write legislation – but both the president and courts have been doing this illegally).

          The definition of the word “advocate” is to: “defend by argument before a tribunal or the public: support or recommend publicly.”

          The single intent of the federal lawsuit Walker v Members of Congress (a public record) was to compel Congress to obey the law of the Constitution and call an Article V Convention as peremptorily required by that law, the original intent of which has never altered by constitutional amendment. The lawsuit was brought because Congress has refused to obey the law of the Constitution. Such refusal obviously establishes the objective of the members of Congress to overthrow our form of government by establishing they (the members of Congress) can disobey the law of the Constitution and thus overthrow our constitutional form of government.

          Since the executive branch and the courts have also greatly deviated illegally from the Constitution they have also committed treason and can be replaced immediately – plus arrested and held for prosecution.

          Way more then you wanted to know I am sure. But we are not helpless, nor do we need to allow this to continue. Start with your state(s) clean it/them up.

  • Bob666

    Paul,

    “I thought Mitt Romney was a GOOD candidate. Probably not the best out there, but a damned sight better than Obummer”

    Those are your two problems.

    First, I remember watching the right wing media talking about the land slide victory that Romney was going to have and shaking my head. If you have the ability to do simple math and are somewhat objective, It was painstakingly clear that Romney was going to lose. Lord knows that it is not because Obama was that strong (fist reelection with unemployment at 8% or above since FDR), it really is because Romney blew as a candidate. He connected with no one! I remember when Rightards would criticize Bill Clinton for flip flopping and Romney made Clinton seem true and consistent. No one really knew what Romney stood for because he told you what he believed you wanted to hear -period and the only reason that most people voted for him is because he is not Obama.

    Finally, with the GOP being hijacked by the religious right, the GOP has alienated, Gays (7%), Hispanics- the fastest growing-segment of the population. Their share of the vote expanded from 9% in 2008 to 10% in this election. Obama won 67% of that vote four years ago and he increased that to 71% this year. Latinos were crucial in helping Obama win the battleground states of Colorado and Nevada, and in putting the president in the lead for Florida’s 29 electoral votes. And they were just as important in turning the former swing state of New Mexico into what appears to be an increasingly safe state for the Democrats.

    Reuters/Ipsos exit polling found that 51 percent of Catholics (Pro-Life) favored President Barack Obama, compared with 48 percent for Republican contender Mitt Romney. A report by the Pew Forum on Religion & Public Life had a similar finding, with 50 percent of Catholics for Obama and 48 percent for Romney, the same as the popular vote in the general population. Hispanic Catholics were far more likely to favor Obama – by 76 percent to 23 percent – than white Catholics, who favored Romney by 56 percent to 43 percent.

    And my all time favorite group, single women. The GOP must confront the reality that the ranks of unmarried women are growing rapidly and they have overwhelmingly backed Democrats for decades. Women increasingly are graduating from college and joining the workforce, and postponing marriage. From 2000 to 2010, the number of unmarried women have increased 18%. The GOP has been adding up all their demographic weak spots, including Hispanics and Asian-Americans. But single women, are already one-quarter of the electorate and they represent the most serious threat to the GOP’s viability.

    So Paul, Keep on living in the bubble telling yourself that the majority of Americans are prolife and alienating the fastest growing voting blocks in this country and I will be LMAO when you are wining about Hillary or Joe getting sworn into office in January 2017. By the way, before you start the name calling, I vote for the person and not the party and that has run about 80% republican for over 30 years now. People like me decide elections, people like you use to.

    Reality sucks my friend.

    • Paul Wells

      Bob666,
      You cannot honestly think that the pro-life/pro-choice made that much difference in this election, can you? It’s not what is at the top of most peoples minds when choosing a candidate, although some will vote solely on that stand, I suppose.

      But some of your other points made sense, but here is my prediction on what will happen. You will see the Repub. party move even further to the left, because it would appear to leadership there, that the reason they lost the election is because they are still too conservative. That is a double edged sword, sure it moves them philosophically (perhaps) more into the pro-choice camp, but it also puts them more in the tax and spend camp.

      My question is…is that what you really want? Two identical parties, and a smattering of third party candidates who never pull more than 2 ~ 3% of the vote? Cuz that my friend, is what you are gonna get!! You watch, if you don’t believe me.

      • Bob666

        Paul,
        the pro -life issue was one of about fivr reasons why Obama fo relected.

        • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

          Actually you are incorrect. The corporate media news (owned illegally by a cartel) would loves for you to buy that line.

          It was election fraud knowingly and deliberately committed by the Democratic party and by the Republican party, from the beginning in *2008 till now.

          *The 2008 Democratic Nominating Committee (DNC) document did not include language stating that Obama was qualified to be a candidate. The 2008 Republican Nominating Committee (RNC) document did, as is normal. This shows that the DNC knew that Obama was not qualified, or why change the form?

          Too many places had substantially over 100% votes, dead voting, machines “messing up” as programmed, etc.

          Research it.

          Neither the Democrats (now communist/nazi mix), and the republicans (communist/nazi mix) are groups we can trust. The rot starts at the top. It is past time to dump both parties, arrest and prosecute those who deserve it for assisting those outside our nation in destroying the USA and her people.

          It is up to us. Write to the party you belong to and tell them they have 30 days to start arresting the treasonous dogs at the top in the party. That they are no longer wanted here in the USA because they have been working with foreign interests to destroy this country. That you are spreading the word, pressuring law enforcement – local and federal (though the loca can be trusted more then the federal at this time), and will leave the party and encourage others to leave it by presenting others with the facts.

  • Donray

    Can someone list the attributes of a Conservative?

    What about a Republican>?

    • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

      Sure.
      The Republican party is the same communist / N-a-z-i party mix as the Democratic is with extremely small differences between them. That is why Obama and Romney had to meet to draw up an agreement on what they would debate. They had to fidn somehting that would make it seem to the people that there was a difference – but NOT in policies.

      True Conservatives follow the Constitution of the United States which limits government involvement in our lifes. About 65% of the self perpetuating “bureacracies” we currently have thanks to the federal government are against our legitimate government (US Constitution – not the people put into office to carry out the duties assigned to each branch).

      Half or more of the regulations you are hit with by your state and the federal government are not legal, up to and including the IRS (just because it was added later, much later does not make it legal anymore then the Patriot Act, NDAA, Obamacare, warrantless searches etc is legal).

      Just because a law enforcement agency or military “enforce” it does not make it legal here in the USA. What it does do is make those who do the enforcing criminals – much like what was done in N-a-z-i Germany – and they are STILL being hunted for prosecution until PROVEN dead. That will also happen to the enforcers who took legally binding Oaths to support and defend the US Constitution from domestic enemies (and foreign ones) working from inside to destroy our legitimate government, our nation. We will hunt them for the rest of their lives for prosecution until they are PROVEN dead.

      That does include all of those aiding and abetting thsoe traitors in this adminstration (also bush 1 & 2′s, and both the Clinton’s and their adminstration) without whose help in taking care fo the day to day stuff would have made their attempts to destroy our nation from within much more difficult.

      “Just doing my job” is no more a defense then “just following orders” – and will not be allowed as a defense.

    • deerinwater

      Hmm? ~ that’s a hard one!

      A Conservative desires stability (the same) if they view themselves as on top and they become very unhappy and difficult to get along with if they don’t see themselves on top and in charge. It is only then that they approve and support change of any kind. They are fearful of tomorrows, the unknown and uncertainty. Their glass is seen as always half full and it might only be filled if someone was not getting something that they did not earn at their expense.

      A Republicans of today can be just about anything really, a Dixiecrat, a Globalist, a Constitutionalist, a True Conservative, an Elitist, a Christian, a Sinner, a Liar and a Thief, a Hypocrite, and a Saint. A Cowboy, a Rock Star , a criminal or a Judge. Your neighbor, your Husband ~ a walking contradiction. They can be , cleaver, bright or as Dumb as a sack of hammers.

      The only consistent thing that the two have in common, is the “Fear” of someone getting something they do not deserve . This will stop them in their Tracks. They will sit on their hands and do nothing for 4 years before giving in to this “Fear”

      Just an short opinion of course, since you asked.

  • Bob666

    Yo Deer,

    “a Sinner, a Liar and a Thief, a Hypocrite, and a Saint. A Cowboy, a Rock Star , a criminal or a Judge”

    The more I read your work, the more I like you. We need to have a beer some day.

    • Deerinwater

      LOL! well ? a few sets of 16oz. curls builds strong arms and a large table muscle.

      It’s 4:10, I know that it’s 5 o’clock somewhere. You not in Fort Worth I suppose?

      • Bob666

        No, Here in Florida, better known as “gods waiting room”. if you ever down, we watch the sunset in the keys and knock a cold one or two down along the way.

        • Deerinwater

          OH $ ~ t God waiting room. ~ that’s funny ~ ~ I think I’ve got a girlfriend visiting in Pensacola cheating on me as we speak. ~

          I think, ~ I’ll go get even ~

          And same offer to you, if you make it to make it to Cowtown aka Panther City , Fort Worth. Like Florida we are now overwhelmed with people that talk funny and claim to know everything worth knowing.

          in as far as the thread, “No Room For Conservatives In The GOP”

          I wondered when they would figure it out? Sure took’em long enough.

          The GOP doesn’t have much room for anyone.

          • Bob666

            Yes Deer, if we did not have those trolls living in their mother’s basements to show us the way, we would be so lost!

      • Deerinwater

        I certainly would not call them trolls as they call this forum their home, ~ you and I are well behind enemy lines and a guest here. They are defending their territory. What they seem to enjoy most, is singing to the choir songs of affirmation, while someone such as myself enjoys offers them question and doubt. ~Naturally they don’t like question and doubt ,so strong opposition is to be expected. They demean, debase, diminish, demonize and scoff while some do offer excellent banter and there is where we will find golden nuggets of truth and wisdom. It’s a mining expedition. We both walk away wiser.

        While I hold no claim to being a troll, much less a paid one. However, I will admit to playing the devils advocate and most willing to ask a hard question or challenge a statement if I find a statement so far out of line that I just can’t ignore it.

        I’m just a laboring working man, a working boss, at 65 my body will no longer old up to 6 to 10 hours of what I do. ~ and I don’t have too, ~ I spend half my time in the hot seat, making a small empire run and keep the money flowing through. I delegate a platoon of men and women and when I find the time, I attempt to offer worthy opposition. It’s no mystery. I enjoy Mr. Livingston Forums much more then Huff Post as they are doing much the same, singing to the choir. ~ while I enjoy taking the battle to the perceived enemy, finding more disagreement here and much work to be done. The GOP needs help!

        I enjoy everyone here, ~

        Back to the thread; The GOP is a mess today but it’s been a mess for a good 15 years, while today it’s worse than ever ~ some people are finally willing to recognize it as being a harsh reality and begrudgingly willing to say so, for the first time ever. I commend Bob Livingston for applying a much needed Slap in the Face, wake up call.

        When your party leadership (Mich McConnell) sets about a 4 years path to success to where it’s only goal is to insure the oppositions failure by obstruction tactics alone and fails to offer leadership founded in merit, the GOP is doomed.

        Where a party alienates 50% of voting American with their “Language” they are doomed.

        When a party honors a promise made to some man that few of us know named Grover Norquest and ignore a promise made to the American people , they are doomed.

        When a party goes about attacks School teachers, fireman and policemen & women simply to launch an attack on Public Unions, they are doomed. Bring working men and women down without bringing the top down as well will not elevate the rest of us! The top will only absorb it! Oh they will tell us otherwise ~ but it will be a lie. A lie that will take you and I five years to figure out just how we’ve been screwed and then it’s too late.

        When a party hides behind a vale of coded phrases to get their message out , they are doomed.

        There are only so many Goldwaters you can place in a single party and expect constructive work to be done.

        I could go on, ~ but no need to rant.

        I’d like to see the GOP go back to it’s roots and quit behaving in such an overt ,”in your face” prostitute like fashion for the most affluent , the special interest, the rich and powerful. ~ At least the democrats knows how to clean up after an encounter before they return to the room and not have 100 dollar bills falling out of their pockets leaving a trail behind and crap all over their face.

        • Bob666

          Very much agreed Deer, Both parties are bought and paid for by different opposing forces. I was happy to see in this past election that most voters were not influenced by the money. What our founding fathers wanted was government by the people-for the people, not for the rich and powerful. That said, they also wanted limited government and that breeds power hungry men who want to hold onto that power. The sad thing is; both parties had a hand in creating that big government.

          I would like to see a limit to the super Pac money as I believe it has made a corrupt process even more corrupt. If the GOP were to be less influenced by the religious right and get out of the abortion business, I might switch from being an independent, but as long as people like Karl Rove are involved, I will stay neutral.

          • Deerinwater

            People die off, leaving their ideas behind and then someone will come along and digs them back up. ~ An idea is a hard thing to kill.

            I’ve got maybe 15 to 20 years ~ hopefully 10 more productive years. ~ I’ll fight as long as I can and then the All Mighty with have it to sort out.

            Stick a fork in me , I’m done.

          • http://freedomfromthepress.net Steven Thompson

            Bob666 says, “Both parties are bought and paid for by different opposing forces”.

            Really? You mean forces such as Wall Street? K-Street? Council On Foreign Relations? World Trade Organization? Federal Reserve Bank? Mainstream Media’s manipulation of U.S. Elections?

            I’d argue that both parties are one-in-the-same. Especially when it comes to spending more and more money with no real solution for paying any of it back… They’re, if you will, nothing but a herd of “FISCAL LIBERALS”… When it come to Federal PORK, especially at the state and local level, both parties are crying, “where’s mine”?

            Certainly, with the exception of the Campaign For Liberty effort, nobody has truly come out with solutions that honestly address the problems that Americans are faced with.

            Just this week, Bloomberg had an interview with Professor Larry Summers. Summers stated that the United States has an economic advantage over European countries due to the fact that The FED can simply, “print more money.” He went on to say that over time our nation will simply, “work its way out of debt”…

            That’s very optimistic… We’ll work our way out of debt… But, will this not require a surplus of good paying jobs? With employers cutting back on the number of employees they employ and, a reduction of benefits for those who still have jobs, where will all of the required jobs come from? Oh, yes, The Government has jobs… But, where is the Government going to get the money to make payroll? Oh, will simply raise the Debt Ceiling and get The FED to print more money…

            Why didn’t I think of this simple, novel concept. Sure, we’ll borrow more from our Chinese brethren to make Federal payroll… It’s, like, party time!

            Will Mr. Democrat or Mr. Republican ever agree to write and pass a Federal Balanced Budget Amendment? You know, since they’re not disciplined enough to only spend what they have in the bank… Well, why would we ever want to do anything like that!

            Steven Thompson is the current editor of: freedomfromthepress
            And, one of many who wrote-in Ron Paul in the general election… Sorry Wolf Blitzer and Shaun Hannity, as Clint Eastwood once said, your mouthwash ain’t makin’ it!

          • http://www.facebook.com/kansas.bright Kansas Bright

            Awesome post. Obviously you bother to get informed.

      • deerinwater

        “I’d argue that both parties are one-in-the-same. Especially when it comes to spending more and more money with no real solution for paying any of it back… ”

        Well, from a far distance perhaps ~ but if you get up close and listen to them both closely ,one of them is telling you what they want to do and one of them is telling you what you want to hear.

        I call that a difference, ~ slight perhaps but no less a distinct difference. One employ’s “hope” while the other “fear” to stir you into action. One’s glass is always half empty, the other half full.

        One make an appeal to the spirit of man, the other make an appeal to the power of the dollars .

        But from a distance ~ they do look very much the same.

  • Bob666

    Well, OK then Mr. Thompson, we know where you are coming from.

  • Guillermo Deras

    The wealthy, the 2%, must pay taxes. Taxes are a little part of the profits that belong to the government to run the administration. The working class should never pay taxes.

    • Financially Insecure John

      agree 100%, the rich should pay more than working people!

    • http://smoovious.wordpress.com Smoovious Laxness

      _ALL_ citizens should pay taxes… across the board… no exceptions…

      – Smoov

  • Pingback: The Whores of Babylon: Just What does the GOP Have Against Reason? | The Arkside of Thought | Poetry, Philosophy, Politics & Life

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