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More Fallout From Uncle Sam’s Heavy Hand

July 13, 2009 by  

More Fallout From Uncle Sam’s Heavy Hand

In the June 23 article, “Money is Scurrying Away From the Dollar,” I touched on the radical lurch to the left that our nation is experiencing as Congress and the Obama administration proceed in their piece-by-piece dismantling of our capitalist system.

As any student of history could have predicted, this trend toward a more socialistic system of government is having a number of unintended consequences. The most immediate of these, of course, has been the growing disdain for the U.S. dollar (and a corresponding growth in affection for gold) among the world’s investors and savers.

But more repercussions are now becoming evident. The recent selloff in U.S. Treasuries sent rates spiking higher and pushed the yield curve to its steepest slope in history.

The problem is that traders have had to sell Treasuries to hedge against rising rates in mortgages. But now that selling in Treasuries is rippling into the mortgage market. That is sending rates higher and endangering the fragile healing process in the nation’s housing market.

The Fed simply cannot allow this to happen. But again, there’s a problem: The Fed has been buying mortgages and Treasuries through their quantitative easing program to keep rates low. Now, they’re going to have to ramp up that program, to a very large degree, to keep rates at levels conducive to an economic recovery.

“You can’t have a spike in interest rates in the long end without it impacting the economy,” warned Brian Edmonds, head of interest rate trading at Cantor Fitzgerald. “That’s why the Fed has been a supporter of the quantitative easing. They have a choice. They could walk away from it or they could increase it to the point where it’s meaningful. The $300 billion is not effective….You’ve got to start to talk trillions.”

The end result, of course, will be double-digit inflation rates, a collapse in the dollar, and a correspondingly large increase in the value of gold. There will be other unintended consequences of this new, more socialistic America. The most frightening of these will be the significant erosion of our individual rights. We need to prepare for these events, not only as investors, but as American citizens.

Brien Lundin

is the editor and publisher of Gold Newsletter, a publication that has ranked among the world's leading precious metals and resource stock advisories since 1971. To learn more about Gold Newsletter, visit www.goldnewsletter.com. Mr. Lundin is also the host of the famed New Orleans Investment Conference, the world's oldest and most respected gold investment event. To learn more, visit www.neworleansconference.com.

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  • Roger R. collins

    Glenn Beck has been covering this for some time. All of those lending the US money are divesting themselves of our currency. Inflation, here we come. Once the
    Chinese stop lending to the US, this will come to a halt or Obama will print more money and create conditions for hyper-inflation. Anybody hear of Wymar Republic??

    • DaveH

      Roger,
      Yep, I believe we are doomed. Once the masses learned that they could vote for free money (and it isn’t free) we got on the slippery slope to destruction. I think the only possible way out of this is for the voters to put Libertarians in office. They are the only party left that believes in limited government and free markets. The Republican leaders are too worried about keeping their jobs to do anything serious about cutting back the size of government. And the Democrats have always loved big government.

      • Urban Underbrink

        I agree, we are doomed unless the folks against this Gangster Administration do as the people of Iran and demonstrate by the Millions around the Capitol! That is the only thing that will get those bastards attention. Hell even some of the Government run News Media would have to cover a few seconds of that sight. Our Military should have already stepped in and arrested these criminals for ruling against the laws of our Constitution.

        • John

          A march on DC is scheduled for 9/12/09. You can sign on at resistnet.com also check the 912project.com. Until the politicians see protesting crowds in the streets they won’t take us seriously. Hope you’ll join in and bring your friends & family too, the more the merrier!

        • Rob

          I agree Urban,
          The problem in America is this, While our leaders support political protest in Iran and other foreign countries, our leaders consider political protest in America to be a form of low level domestic terrorism. Dual standard? You bet.
          Political protest in America today can get you on a list of domestic terrorists. Imagine that.

          Our leaders in Both parties do not like actual freedom. They just like to give lofty speeches using the word freedom liberly.

          Time to flush the DC toilet. VOTE THEM ALL OUT.

      • DixieConnie

        What about the Patriot Party? or the Constitutional Party? Its amazing how many different parties we have out there.

        • http://fcernhart@yahoo.com Marian to Connie

          Dear Connie,

          For years - actually since Ross Perot got almost 20% of the vote in 1992 - I we have been convinced that: If all these

          Independent groups would shed their egos and join forces
          we could “blow them (Democrats AND Republicans) out of the
          water”! I am a member of the Pa State Committee of the Reform Party. Have you heard of the GOOOH movement?
          GOOGLE it and/or Tim Cox. This is a GREAT IDEA – check it out NOW.

        • DaveH

          Dixie,
          The Libertarians want what our forefathers wanted … individual liberty and limited government. And back to the government serving the people rather than the way it is now.
          Part of the problem is that people won’t fight for the freedom of other people who have uncommon pursuits. As an example, most people don’t golf, so if a law was passed banning golf, most wouldn’t bother to protest that. I know it’s a bad example being the sport of the rich so it isn’t likely to be outlawed, but you know what I mean. We need to change that. We need to stick up for other people’s freedoms, even if the loss of them doesn’t affect us personally.

        • DixieConnie

          marian to connie: I checked it out. Sounds like the Patriot and Constitutional party to me. All for the good of the people and all for the Constitution.

        • DixieConnie

          DaveH: The Libertarians sound like the same as the Patriot, and others. I like what they stand for. I am sick of the Dem & Rep. I’m not sure anyone in those parties even know what they are talking about anymore. All sounds like BIG BUSINESS to me.

        • http://www.meetup.com/Hernando912PROJECT/ Dave A.

          Connie, while your looking into 3rd parties, not long ago I came across a party that I had never previously heard of: the America First Party (AmericaFirstParty.org). It is a very small party apparently, but check out their party platform on their website.

          I have wondered myself why we have so many 3rd parties, many of whom have similar platforms. If those of like mind and similar platforms would unite by compromising some of their differences, they might be able to gain enough strength to become a viable 3rd party. We certainly need an alternative to the Republicrats. I realize that 3rd parties who favor Big Government socialism are not going to be able to reach a merging compromise with small government libertarians, but it seems that a merger of the Libertarian, Constitution, Patriot, and America First parties could result in a compromise under which they could all operate, at least long enough to form an electable coalition.

      • Patricia Henson

        Maybe we need to forget about parties period and put just everyday people in office. People with common sense and not-so-much the college degrees. In the beginning it was just humble people withthe nations best interests at heart. It has become dog eat dog and who can get richer the fastest. I feel all parties have let us down and we need to scrap the whole lot of them, turn back to God and start over. That is our only chance. We need to be out in the streets right now standing up for what is right. We need to pull the crooks out of office by their coattails if necessary and begin again.

        • Bill Hanson

          I agree. Maybe thats why the media and the Dems are so afraid of Sarah Palin. Seems they are constantly tearing her down. She is just common folk. Could that be they they know she is a huge threat? I agree that without God in the mix, all is lost.

        • DixieConnie

          I say YES, yes. I am gonna vote against anyone and everyone that is in office as of today. Start over and start fresh.

        • Patricia Henson

          Thank you Bill, I hope more peopl strt to feel like us. I’d like to see the biggest rvival that this country has ever seen be held bringing the people back to God. then we can work on putting this country back together. I’m not impressed with big fancy college degrees anymore due to the curriculum they teach these days. I much prefer a person who has a whole lot of common sense, but I am sincere when I say everybody has to go from Washington and we vote in a whole new crew. I think we need to forget about party affilliations as to me that is just another way to divide the country by which party you belong to. I just want people running who care more about the country than they do themselves. I think when you represent people you have to forget self. too many people are just out for what’s in it for them.

        • http://internetexplorer Rosebud

          I want to know how we can do that legally? I am ready!

      • Larry D. Crumbley

        Hello,
        Last yr. I made a bold statement that I can now back up with facts. The man Barack Obama is nothing more than a Liar, and a criminal. and most people that care about this nation understand that he is most likely not even a citizen of this once great nation. They have just about finished what they started when he came into power, and what is that you might say? THE TOTAL DESTRUCTION OF THE AMERICAN WAY OF LIFE. Now if that sounds a little harsh, look at what they have done since Jan. and then tell me what you think. My e-mail address is bearone7777@yahoo.com. I am not afraid of the truth, are you? This nation is going to hell in a hand-basket so to speak, and I do not mean that in a kind way either. I am not what you call a very religious man, BUT I AM NOT AFRAID TO SAY THAT GOD ALMIGHTY HAS IMPLANTED IN ME SOME VERY INTERESTING THINGS ABOUT AMERICA, AND ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT ONES IS THAT THIS NATION WAS SO BLESSED AT ONE TIME, AND WE AS A NATION WALKED AWAY FROM THAT LOVE, AND NOW IN THIS AGE WE ARE ABOUT TO SEE GOD ALMIGHTY TURN HIS HOLY BACK ON THIS NATION, AND MAYBE FOR THE LAST TIME. So if you are not ready you better get ready. It will happen sooner than later. Mark my words, this President mocks God Almighty, and He is not to be mocked by no one, and he has also taken on the Holy-Land of Israel, and for that we as a nation will be answering for his stupid sin. I just Hope, and Pray that this is all the so-called “HOPE AND CHANGE” that everybody wanted. IS IT????

        Thanks,
        Larry D. Crumbley
        bearone7777@yahoo.com

      • http://www.meetup.com/Hernando912PROJECT/ Dave A.

        Dave H., I think I have to agree with Dixie that the Constitution Party is a very good conservative alternative, and, according to their website, it is the 3rd largest political party in the U.S. based upon the number of registered voters. I, myself, left the Republican Party in 2006 after having been a Republican since I first registered to vote back in 1968. After seeing the shenanigans committed by a Republican majority Congress in cahoots with a Republican President, I decided they no longer shared my values of maximum individual liberties and minimally intrusive government.

        When I left the Republican Party, I signed on as a member of the Constitution Party, because their platform as stated on their website fits my political beliefs to a “T.” The problem I personally have with the Libertarian Party is that some Libertarian candidates believe that international boundaries should be abolished, and folks should be able to pass freely from one country to the next without limitations. I certainly do not believe in the concept of “open borders,” and don’t like the idea of having anyone who wants to walk in and out of my “home” without having to “knock on the door.” One such candidate (a female whose name I do not recall) ran for the post of President in the Libertarian primary, but was beaten out by Bob Barr, but such candidates who harbor ideas I think are just too extremely libertarian do exist within the Libertarian Party, and do have support from it when running for office.

        • DaveH

          Dave,
          The Libertarian Party claims to be the third largest party (who knows). And their stance on immigration is “minimally restricted” borders, not “open” borders.
          I do think they are the most freedom loving party. Certain of their freedom stances are scary, I know, such as legalization of drugs. Before I go on, you need to know that I am a health nut and think it is stupid to do drugs. But, the Drug Wars are just tearing our country apart, and enriching the most evil segment of our society, just as Prohibition enabled the growth of the Mafia. Most of the drug problems cited as excuses for the Drug Wars are a direct result of their criminalization and the resultant sky-high prices.
          I really don’t think the government has any business protecting us from ourselves. If, however, we harm someone else then they should be involved. And I don’t mean “the potential to harm” as there would be no limit to their involvement if that was the criteria.
          Wikipedia has a pretty good comparison chart for the 3rd parties.

        • DaveH

          Dave,
          One thing that really bothers me about the Constitution party is they seem to adopt Sotomayor’s interpretation that the Bill of Rights (amendments) only apply to the Federal Government, not to the State Governments.
          Wikipedia has a good comparison chart for the 3rd parties, but you will have to dig for it as this site can’t handle the link for some reason.
          And here is a link to a comparison of the Libertarian Party and the Constitution Party from a Libertarian webpage:
          http://www.lp.org/blogs/andrew-davis/libertarian-party-vs-constitution-party

    • Paul Connors

      I believe it was the WEIMAR republic after the city in eastern Germany where the republic was founded after the fall of the Hohenzollern dynasty and the end of Imperial Germany after WW I.

      • Roger R. collins

        OK, I got lazy and didn’t verify the spelling. The point is still valid.

    • FarRightWinger

      That’s WEIMAR Republic and that was under Chancellor Hindenburg, a jew-lover, which helped Germany to the 7 million unemployed and homeless state.

  • Aman

    Alright, all the news is doom and gloom. In the meantime Maobama is at war with the great nation of America. Forget contacting your representatives what good are they. There is a terrible lack of leadership like I’ve never seen before. Zero conscious, zero sense of duty to God and country, zero sense of shame! A completely one sided media that absolutely refuses to report the news square and true. Politicians who’s only sense of duty is to their financial and gift -giving, agenda seeking blood suckers. All, who are hellbent for power, money and control. These people are of the santanic feather who flock together. Don’t you see how these people are at war with christianity. Their position of the false and misinterpretation of the ” seperation of church and state.” See if you can find that written anywhere in the Constitution! Maobama, is a lost sole who never knew the love of his mother, a fallen woman, and never had a real father who taught him the rite and passage of becoming a man! Complete disregard for God and he was sexually abused by his mentors. And anyone who finds him smart, a leader, and a worthy president is either uneducated, on drugs, without family, hates America, as well as themselves, sexually divient, perverted and gay! santanic, or all of the above.

    • Edu-macated

      Learn how to spell you overly religious wack job. I think everyone here has convienently ignored the fact that our dollar was falling for a year before Bush left office. The U.S. has was borrowing from China like a college kid with a credit card to fund our well-planned and organized war (haha). Not only that but lack of regulation was a primary cause of this economic meltdown, not to mention the ‘Trickle Down’ theory that ran the Bush Administrations tax agenda. Guess what, the majority of the rich that got tax breaks kept it for themselves, I didn’t fell the trickle did you?? I find Obama a very smart leader, heck he can at least complete a sentence, unlike our last president (I can see why you probably have affection for Dubya). I’m getting straight A’s in college, not on drugs, I have three children and a wife, I love America as well as myself, I’m in great shape and couldn’t be in a better spot in my life. I would love to debate you in any and all topics, believe me, i would love to make you look more like a fool than you already do. Obama isn’t perfect, but he sure looks like he could be when you compare him to our last president.

      By the way, deviant, satanic are spelled this way and this is not a sentence:

      Politicians who’s only sense of duty is to their financial and gift -giving, agenda seeking blood suckers.

      Your ignorance is blatently obvious, stop posting to websites and go walk around on a freeway during traffic because America would be a heck of a lot better without close minded people like you.

      • Mormav

        Dear Edu-macated,

        I wasn’t really reading your post with the intent of proofing it, but I did happen to notice that in correcting and pointing out how stupid the other person was, you, too, spelled words wrong, used improper punctuation, had superfluous spaces, and left out hyphens. I thought your logic was flawed as well in that you implied that Obama was somehow an acceptable and “very smart” leader simply because Bush was not. (And, really, how hard can it be to finish your sentences when you’re reading them from a little box?) Bush? Obama? We’re in trouble.

        • Edu-macated

          And I was typing fast and was on a break at work. My point wasn’t that you can’t make mistakes, it was just when I read a post and can’t really understand what the heck a person is trying to write, then I have to point out that the person sounds crazy. I’m not an english major, however, I can read a sentence and determine if it makes sense, which obviously Aman can’t do. That was my point. If I had taken the time to proof my typos I could have perfected my work, however I do know that satanic does not sound like santanic. Read the words out loud and you can tell that there is no n before the t. Also I didn’t say he was a very smart leader because Bush was an idiot, I merely made a comparison.

        • Edu-macated

          again, I’m not a grammar whiz, there their, whose who’s, two too, I can see how errors can occur, however if you read the post I was referring to, it’s very hard to even understand a point in that huge mess.

      • Rorie

        Quite the diatribe Edu-macated! By the way blatantly is spelled like this. It’s whose not who’s- Aman made this mistake too. It’s conveniently. Not sure if you meant had been or was- regardless, it’s not has was. I also think you meant feel- not fell, perhaps you’ve had a fall though (head injury?). And it’s close-minded. Something you seem to have in abundance- with the emphasis on dunce! I’m usually not one for name-calling but you opened the door. There are a few other errors you’ve made but I’m assuming they’re the consequence of your haste in writing- not ignorance. You didn’t comment on a few other errors Aman made so I can only assume you’re not as literate as you might think. It’s one-sided. I think Aman might have meant zero conscience, although zero consciousness would be equally as apt. It’s separation, not seperation. It’s soul, not sole. Although he is referring to Obama who could be described in fishy terms- a fish out of water, a flounder- you get my drift. Lastly, I ‘m not sure though because I’m not a religious person, but I think Christianity should be capitalized. You’ve stated that you love yourself- I’m happy for you.

      • http://donthaveone Mark

        We will have to agree to disagree, hopefully like adults. I believe George Bush did an excellent job. The facts were, Bill Clinton let them punch us in the nose on the WTC basement bombing, and did nothing. Bill Clinton let them punch us in the nose when they blew up our barracks and killed a couple hundred in Lebanon, and he did nothing. Bill Clinton let them punch us in the nose when they blew up the USS Cole, and he did nothing. They drug our dead naked through the streets of Somalia beating them, and again, Bill Clinton did nothing. Republican or Democrat, this is a factual history that one cannot change. After Bill Clinton paired our military in half, and cut our intelligence agencies in thirds, the terrorists found it easy to mill about the country undisturbed, and set up their plans, then blew up the WTC shortly after Bush took office. Enough was enough, we finally had a man as a president, and he went after them, and I and millions of other American’s were finally glad someone had the balls in there to do something, other than grab another cigar. With Bush in office, again a fact, the United States had more people with jobs than ever before in our history, ever, and the lowest unemployement rate ever. What happened? The democrat propaganda machine of ABC,CBS,NBC,CNN and MSNBC did their bit in turning the public against Bush and the democrats so they could win the election, and it really worked. Problem was, business saw it coming to, and started holding on to their money to pay the rising taxes that they knew the democrats would bring. Thats a fact whether you want to admit it or not. The banks collapse was all the doing of the democrats, and you know it. Clinton set up this bank loan program with funds from Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, run by Franklin Raines and Jamie Gorelick, and overseen by Barney Frank, who by the way, would not allow an inquiry into this by the Bush admin two years before it collapsed, because as the oversight chief, he said all was fine. Meanwhile, Raines and Gorelick were writing million dollar bonus checks to themselves and their cronies. Bye bye banks. All democrats, all the way did this, and you low lifes want to blame Bush. That is just amazing. All your top democrats, Bill Clinton, John Kerry, Joe Biden, Howard Dean, and many more, I saw on TV screaming about Saddam Hussein having weapons of mass destruction and how he had to be stopped, and this was before Bush was even a candidate for President his first term. All of them received the same intelligence reports. So when Bush acts, and Im very glad he did, you all sat back and pointed the finger and blamed him, when hey, I think we should pin a medal on the guy for freeing a whole country. History will tell the tale, and years later when all the left wing liberal pacifist appeasing press has faded away and been changed over to some who will actually dare to report the truth, Bush will go down as a great President for what he has done. Ive been safe, how about you. I guarantee you, that while this clown you and your ilk elected, sleeps through his 4 years plundering our resources, these terrorists are allready on the move, planning and setting up. Obama and the democrats arent paying attention to this as Bush and his admin did, and you and I both know the democrats will tear down our safety walls like Clinton did, and we will pay again. We will be safe through Obama’s 4 years though, Bush made sure of that. Its the guy that follows thats going to get blamed, as Obama and his admin sleep and go around kissing the enemies butts like they do. Pacifism and appeasement are sure fire ways of defeat. No one, I repeat, no one has ever won or gained by being a pacifist. You get walked on. Tell me this pal, why did Al Queda want the democrats to win this election? Doesnt take a rocket scientist to figure that one out. I was born and raised a democrat, but I left them during Clinton’s 2nd term, when I saw what a sleazeball he was and how damning he was to this country. We are still paying for what he did, and what he didnt do. He should be in jail if nothing else for his Mena Arkansas drug involvement. Oh, maybe I shouldnt say anything, since EVERYBODY THAT HAD ANYTHING TO DO WITH IT ENDED UP DEAD. Cops, witnesses, players, attorneys. They all mysteriously died. Aint that sweet. Suicides with a bullet in the back of the head. Nice. Real Nice. And you want to call someone ignorant. Get educated my friend. Your president isnt even a citizen of this country, and he is weakening us everyday, and it amazes me, that you think the world of him. That my friend, is ignorance in all its magnificent glory.

        • David

          One thing one didn’t mention (unless I missed it) was that Prez Billory Had also set up the financing and loans from China to help pay some bills.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          Hey David, I also forgot that Bill Clinton also sold a lot of our business to Mexico with the NAFTA thing, thats why a bunch of them headed down there.

        • Robin from Indiana

          Wow! That was great! I was also a born and raised Democrat. Isn’t it amazing how clear things become when you realized that being a Democrat was not the way to go? I can’t imagine what I was thinking; actually I wasn’t thinking. That was the problem. Sheeple. Quite an appropriate term for the Democrats. I am not overly happy with the Republican party right now either, but I do maintain that President Bush (II) was a great president. He made a few decisions that I wouldn’t have agreed with, but all in all he did a great job. I cannot believe what is happening to our great nation. Any one who believes that our current administration is doing great things for America has to be living under a rock or only listening to the MSM.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          To Robin in Indiana, Im from Indiana also. I would also like to add, unlike our democrats on the other side, we will admit to something when our party does something wrong. They insist they are always right, even when its evident to all they are wrong. I also wasnt happy with some of the things our Republicans did. I fault them for not reigning in the spending, which they were supposed to do. Its not near as bad as what Obama is doing, I mean this jerk has spent more in 10 months than Bush did in 8 years. Thats how bad it is now. I was also upset when Bush was referring to the muslims as a peaceful religion. That is the one thing that he did that I resented. They are not a peaceful religion. The whole tenant of their religion is to kill anyone who dares to differ from their thought process. No peaceful religion will strap a bomb on their 8 year old daughter and have her walk into a crowded mall and blow up herself and innocent people they dont even know, other than they are jewish. Sorry, I dont care how you cut it, this is not a peaceful religion. But I do thank this man and his admin for keeping us safe for 8 years and for striking back at these guys that kept punching and punching and punching us in the nose when Clinton was president, and he kept doing nothing because he is a pants wetting left wing liberal pacifist appeaser who was too busy being a pervert to look out for the people of this country.

        • FedUP

          Bravo Mark…accurate & thorough recitation of some, if not ALL, the reprehensible FACTS that the self serving, hypocritical, truth-twisting, fact-distorting/ denying revisionist holier-than-thou, sanctimonious elitist power-lusting “PERMISSIVES” arrogantly DICTATING how the rest of US “SHOULD” pay their BLOATED overpaid salaries & benefits, along with their armies of minion staff’s, that only PRODUCERS actually create and EARN, which these criminal Constitutional traitors BELIEVE is THEIR money & the PONZI scheme they have been perpetrating against all the uninformed, ignorant or brainwashed propaganda induced American people for DECADES, literally exploiting, bilking, cheating, stealing and destroying individual prosperity overtly & covertly through excessive & punitive overtaxation (fed, State, local & all sales taxes, fees & surcharges on utilities, telecom, energy “services” on top of every business entity cost of production/sales & LEGAL expenses throughout the supply chain, costs EMBEDDED in the cost of goods consumers are gouged collectively confiscate OVER 60% of gross income – off the top – excluding the DOUBLE taxation on any puny interest “income” banks notoriously do not pay in any reasonable proportion to the rates they GOUGE for fees and loans (hence enormous PROFITS misusing OUR money they have the privilege of mismanaging, exploiting hundreds of times over in leverage) -
          rendering the “SHEEPLE” democrats persistently exploit, mislead and betray – failing miserably to actually SOLVE ANY OF THE PROBLEMS these Jack-Asses caused nothing but Indentured Servants – enslaved BY their WRONG HEADED, DYSFUNCTIONAL, FAILUREs, or dependent on these PARASITIC LEECHES bleeding the life blood from the ONLY productive sector remaining in their deliberate destruction of this culture, who actually WORK and PRODUCE anything of tangible value…unlike the WORTHLESS fiat currency the Fed is printing 24/7, flooding the world
          with our baseless paper backed by NOTHING, to “monetize” the prohibitive DEBT that can NEVER be re-paid – in less than 6 months, this illegitimate Marxist driven administration, run by over 32 CZARS NOT accountable to anyone nor approved by any process other than BO’s blatant croneyism -
          has SPENT MORE than ALL the administrations combined since George Washington – in FACT – has EXPLODED the DEBT more than ANY CIVILIZATION IN HISTORY.
          The patently bias talking heads in the tank media are as culpable as the criminals perpetrating the massive POWER GRAB for PURELY SELF SERVING, PARTISAN POLITICAL POWER & DESTRUCTION, SILENCING of ANY opposing views…Totalitariansim…in preparation for the imposition of Sharia Law by 2012, as declared in published Jihad against the US during Clinton’s disgraceful administration…
          The only question is: Will the Military adhere to it’s purpose and PROTECT our Sovereignty and defend the American people … against this overt COUP…OR… will they join BO’s version of Brown Shirts (the INVOLUNTARY ‘civilian army’ he is conscripting via mandatory service in exchange for bribes of woefully inadequate, insulting ‘student loans’) “enforcing” BO’s inevitable marshal law?
          Neither “party” will EVER be inclined to relinquish any power OVER the people…just as a third party doesn’t stand a chance against the K-Street lobbyists-Wall Street axis of Power without enormous financial resources…
          THAT is what the BO Spendulus was all about – stealing taxpayer money to fill the democrats war chest coffers – stack the deck to permanently destroy ANY opposition, beginning with the GOP.
          There ARE a precious few good men – and maybe women – serving and fighting FOR all of us – but they have been marginalized, trivialized and dismissively mistreated by BOTH parties leadership and the media cabal.
          They NEED our VOCAL support against the other Congressional crooks evading their own reckless, greedy accountability in the $10 Trillion destruction of “wealth” wiped out last year, the continuing eradication of ALL real estate equity the vast majority EARNED & PAID for the OLD FASHIONED WAY but are now being expected to “bailout” the Banksters & subprime borrowers & flippers who did NOT QUALIFY under necessary lending standards that Barnie Franks & Chris Dodd (dump the duplicitous SOB) FORCED BANKS To make – funneled billions of OUR money to their cronies at Freddie & Fannie…now BO is MISUSING SALLIE MAE, confiscating PRIVATE BANK student loans….without ANY notice whatsoever…no right to decline, opt out or have any say over – never mind it’s YOUR MONEY…
          Mona Charen wrote an extensive, well documented book titled,
          “How Liberals/Democrats Hurt The Ones They Claim To Help, and The Rest of Us Too” during Clinton’s failed administration – documenting 40+ years of idiotic, illogical, failed democratic “policies” – showing just how dysfunctional and destructive democrats have been for DECADES. It OUGHT to be required reading for ANY candidate…among other UNrevised factual economic, monetary and historical documents. Term limits and QUALIFYING TESTS of candidates are necessary but unrealistic given the self serving nature of Congress…teleprompter dependent BO is an INexperienced, untested, unproven, economically untrained & ignorant neophite with a dangerous, BAD agenda… who has plunged this nation into an irrevocable debt driven demise … the wealthy saw the writing on the wall and have already “fled”… corporations are leaving in droves…the people these synchophants falsely purport to “help” are the ones who are hit the first and hardest – they do not have the means or resources to survive the massive destruction of what little buying power is left never mind any means of escaping the inevitable…the “government” does not “produce” ANYTHING, does not “earn” anything – it confiscates OUR INCOME in the form of taxes taken from those who do EARN some, albeit ever diminishing and disappearing thanks to Clinton’s NAFTA, and inequitably, inefficiently re-distributes OUR money to pet pork projects and cronies…
          Health “care” has NOTHING to do with INSURANCE – they aren;t dealing with the problem because these not wits don’t SEE the real problem.
          The AVERAGE Federal employee – supported by OUR tax dollars – makes over $75K per year, excluding benefits…THEY CAN ALL AFFORD TO PAY for THEIR OWN health insurance…WHY should taxpayers whose median income is less than $45K per year SUBSIDIZE any of these paper pushing “federal” BUREAUCRATS health insurance…THEY pushed HMO’s under the guise of “lowering costs”…instead, they expanded the intrusion of insurance companies as middle men, forcing Doctors to hire staff’s of “administrators” just to handle the paper pushing…onerously imposing on patients the UNACCEPTABLE burden of “PROVING” each and every invoice or procedure was not only legitimate but necessary…WE DO NOT and Should NOT be forced to work for Insurers – nor report to them or the tyrannical IRS that demands not only reporting of any of OUR money used to pay medical expenses from OUR “health savings accounts” but onerously, invasively, provide copies of PRIVATE, CONFIDENTIAL invoices, proof of payment and the pluthora of documentation the brain dead Congress legislated the IRS COULD require from ANY citizen who uses any of their money from their health savings account to pay for medical care – voluminous files to maintain, on top of the ordeal insurers routinely subject everyone to that PAYS for this absurd ABUSE, for YEARS…an INVASION of the DOCTOR PATIENT PRIVACY rights none of us have anymore…

          Ron Paul has sponsored two piece of legislation EVERYONE ought to demand their Congressional rep’s co-sponsor: HR2630, insuring patients RIGHT to OPT OUT of any govt mandated “electronic database” and HR 2629, protecting patients RIght to privacy – which current Federal Law does NOT protect, in fact, facilitates anyone in govt obtaining your info without your knowledge or consent…

          Never in the history of this country have so many been so wrong about so many things. Unfortunately, the criminals devaluing our currency, recklessly rushing hastily and poorly contrived “legislation” dealing with the WRONG problems, putting the cart before the horse – without addressing the ROOT CAUSE – are the very ones who do not listen, violate the Oaths they took, betray all of us and arrogantly insult our collective intelligence by DEFYING what we explicitly express we EXPECT THEM TO DO and NOT DO.
          FYI: BO only received 31% of the total of all Eligible voters – hardly a mandate.
          More people watched the media hyped Michael Jackson exploitation than voted. Sad comment on the state of this corrupt, celebrity circus culture.
          Status symbols are poor excuses for values.

        • Smilee

          Mark Reply:
          July 14th, 2009 at 3:43 pm

          Mark

          You are so full of it, Clinton did NOTHING?, The WTC basement bombers were convicted and are in jail, Osama is still at large, Bush caught only a handful of the guilty and none have been convicted, he jailed a lot of innocent ones and has never charged them, charged one who was sitting in jail when the towers went down, now what the hell is there to brag about that, your imagination again Mark, you are so out of touch with reality, you and most on here are a bunch of angry, frustrated people filled with hate at those you disagree with or think you do. Nothing you are doing is part of the solution, in fact you are part of the problem in today’s world, we need problem solvers not whiners like yourself and others here.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          Thats right Smilee, he did nothing. He did not arrest the guys in jail, New Yorks finest did that. Clinton knew who was doing this crap, and did nothing because like the little sissy left he is, he was scared and hid behind Hillary’s skirt. Reality is exactly how I stated it, but pacifists appeasers like yourself, always have to point the finger at others, when you are the problem, and your boy Obama is a bigger problem. I cant believe you are so stupid to think that bloating the government, growing it when it needs reduced, that rewarding people for not working with giving them more money for a longer period to not work, and you think this helps? Baloney. Get a fricking job. They are all over if one really wants to work. You say, how do you know this. Well again, I speak the facts, yet again. My wife lost her job, (automotive industry again), and re-entered the force looking for work. One month, 6 job offers, weeded out which one to take, took it, back to work. Those who are sitting there month after month, drinking 40 after 40, smoking pack after pack of cigarettes sitting there on the porch, watching the working people drive by, dont want to work. They live off the sweat of my back, and I dont like it, and I wont accept it. Obama has cause millions to lose their job, well again, not so much Obama, but his democrat machine, and he is part of the problem with them. I cant do like you and point the finger at one guy, because the President is just a figurehead of his party. Its the democrats, who insist on taking my money and giving to the lazy crackhead on the porch so he can buy crack, beer and cigarettes, while I work. I dont like this, but the democrats fully endorse it. This is what makes me angry, and if it doesnt make you angry, then your no American. Bush caught only a handful? Geez, I know of at least 50 top cats they placed cards on, such as Saddam was the Ace of Spades. Yeah, we caught him. Bush caught more than anyone pal, get the facts straight and stop lying. Saddam funded these guys training, so dont pull the he had nothing to do with it line you lefties use. He had a lot to do with it. Osama is dead, and has been. You really think they would let us know that? Think again. I cant help it you are a soured person because your politics are all bad.

        • Valerie

          AMEN to you!!

          I too, used to be a democrat, glad I finally wised up….I started paying attention when Obama came on the scene. for the record, it wasn’t his color that made me notice, it was his character, his associations, & his ideology.

          I only wish I paid more attention earlier….but I am now!!

      • Rob

        Edu, while I agree with everything you say about the Bush Administration, I have to disagree when it comes to the Obama Administration.
        Obama is picking up where GW Bush left off. Bush drove the bus to the cliff, and Obama will take it over the cliff.

        The Democrats and the republicans are 2 sides of the same coin. They are both progressives. And thats bad. Conservatives believe in low taxes, limited government, and personal freedom. The Bush Administration, while giving us a tax cut, destroyed the second two concepts on the list, and that very fact has set us up for increased taxes in the future. You cannot expand government while cutting taxes. It doesn’t work. Obama’s big government social programs will also guarentee huge tax increases in the future.

        Thanks guys for the all out assault on my paycheck…

        • David

          Actually I believe they are both on the same side of the coin. Anyone with sense is on the other side.

          As president they only get to take the blame. While the president submits a budget request, Congress makes the determination of who gets what trying stay within the limits established by the President’s budget request. We should remember too, that we have had a democrat-leaning Congress since shortly after Bush was elected. Also we should remember that only for a short in the ’90s was there a Republican majority in the House in Congress.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          Exactly. Social Programs, ie, take my money that I work hard for and give it to someone who doesnt want to work for it. Social Programs, ie, a branch of the democratic party. Social Programs, ie, a leech on society. Social Programs, ie, people the democrats give our money to to make themselves feel like they are doing something good. All these people that are dependant on these social programs, are and have been all their life. They never rise above it, and are kept down by the democrats. But see, thats where the democrats want you people. If they keep you down and dependant on them, they will get your vote. Then you keep voting for them, and they keep on keeping you down. Its a vicious circle, and its high time you folks woke up and found that along with yourselves, these guys are the reason you never get out.

        • Rob

          Well mark, to be fair, there are a whole lot of people that are mentally defective, and do need some kind of assistance. The mentally insane, those poor souls unlucky enough to be born with low intelligence, ie Forest Gump types…ect.. those types of people. We can handle that. What we cannot handle, is the leigons of bloodsuckers looking for the easy life. Those idiots that think they are brilliant, because they are scamming a system that is set up to be scammed. now we got Obama ringing the dinner bell, “Come and get it!!!” It won’t work. He learned NOTHING from Johnson’s Great Society distaster. Perhaps we should put Obama on welfare….

          We can take care of the mentally defective.

          What we cannot do, is more big government social programs. Social Security is a vault of I.O.U’s, Medicare is just about bankrupt… The total debt obligations of this nation run in the excess of 100 Trillion dollars. When you account for everything.

          Forget it. We are done.
          Do not worry about Obama’s Stimulus causing your grandchildren to become indebted. I realized a while ago, all this debt cannot, and will not, EVER, and I mean, EVER!, be paid back. We will eventually go into default, and write it all off, in the face of a very angry world.

          And the very last thing we need to be doing right now is decreasing our nuclear arsonal.

          Defenseless against our enemys….

          I do not want DMV style healthcare.

      • wayne

        Let your ignorance show, keep it up. Why wasn’t there regulation to prevent economic failure, ask Barney Frank and Chris Dodd, ask the democratic majority who started it all. President’s don’t control the country not until this dictator with his czars got positioned, and a totally asinine democratic congress, but husein obama is the biggest idiot to ever buy public office.

        • Rob

          I’m telling you right now Wayne, If your not getting it today, one day you will. 2 sides of the same coin, both on the same side of the coin,… semantics. Given the chance, the President, congress, and the senate, no matter which party is in office or holds the majority, will fail the American people. Democrat or Republican. They have BOTH done substantial damage.

          Playing the blame game, will only allow you to see ONE HALF of the guilty ones in Washington.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          I agree Wayne, the anti american democrats caused all this bad crap that is going on to happen, from the bank collapse, to business fleeing to Mexico, to the enemy being empowered by their actions, to us having to go to war to stop them from punching us in the nose, and it goes on and on and on. The Republicans pissed me off also when they failed to reign in their spending, but at least they stand for a strong America and took steps to defend us, while these pacifist appeasing pants wetting democrats want to sit down and have dinner and a glass of wine with bastards that want to cut our heads off. They both need to knock off making the other look bad to make themselves look good, and take steps to make the country look good, and serve the people they are elected to serve. Obama is content to serve the enemy right now, and screws us right and left. When he goes around apologizing to them for us being such a successful nation, he is serving them, not us. The Republicans have to sling dirt back at the democrats though, I understand that, because thats all the dems do is sling dirt and lies, and when they own the propaganda machines of ABC,CBS,NBC,CNN and MSNBC, there is a lot of platforms for them to sling dirt from, and boy do they ever sling. They havent still come up with any solvent plan or course of action, and still are standing there pointing the finger at Bush and the Republicans, who cleaned up this terrorist mess Bill Clinton left us with, and we are still working on it, only the current admin is sleeping and letting these bastards rally again.

        • Smilee

          Mark Reply:
          July 15th, 2009 at 6:53 am

          Mark

          You keep repeating yourself subjecting us to the same malarkey over and over again, you are stuck in a rut and spinning your wheels, try coming up with some fresh new ideas that have some resemblance of thoughtful discourse. You may even learn what is rally going on in today’s world but I think the odds may be against it.

      • Rodhea

        Dear Edu-macated,

        Oh my! You are just so much smarter than the rest of us. We bow down to your intellectual capacity. We can see that you are just so far above us on the intelligence quotient scale. By the way, would you like to share you I.Q. number with us? I would like to know just how intelligent our god who can make us all look like fools on any subject really is.

        Oh, and congratulations on your straight A’s, three children and a wife (wow, you’re married). Also, you are in great shape and in the best spot in your life. Hmmmm, kinda makes me wonder how you got to be in such a great spot in your life under that Dubya guy you described. It sounds like he really screwed things up for us all, but you persevered and overcame despite him and those trickle down policies of his and the Dubyas before him didn’t you!

        And it’s so refreshing to know there is someone we can look up to who loves America. It never would have occurred to us those of us who aren’t in love with Mr. Obama that we could also love America and have opinions that differ with all of you who are gods.

        I do have one thing I would dearly love to know. Maybe you can ask Mr. Obama for me. Can you write or phone him and ask him why he has hired three teams of lawyers (and spent a million dollars so far) to fight the lawsuits filed in courts around the country asking to see his long form (original) birth certificate that is supposedly filed in Hawaii. And also his college records and medical records. There are three constitutional requirements to be President of the United States, but it seems Mr. Obama only meets one of them. He is old enough, but it appears he is not a U.S. citizen, yet alone a natural born citizen. Thus, he is fighting every effort to show that in court. Apparently, if he releases any of these documents it will show he is not a natural born citizen, and yes, not even a citizen at all because he was not born in the United States. He was in fact born in Kenya as his Kenyan grandmother says. She is just a lying #*%& isn’t she?

        Would you care to respond and enlighten us with your wisdom on these scurilous claims made against Mr. Obama. Or is it too much to ask you to question ‘That One’ because he is so far above you and the rest of us on the I.Q. scale. Heaven forbid if we should question a god if he is really as honest and upstanding as he says he is. Oops, sorry! I didn’t mean to imply that you aren’t as smart as you say you are also. Please forgive me! I didn’t mean to be so close-minded. I should be more like you. You are so open-minded that you even have a humane way of telling those of us who are so close-minded to take a hike on the freeway and maybe you will be rid of the fools who are so close-minded and don’t think like you.

        Hmmmm, or is it now that the shoe is on the other foot and your guy is being criticized for the way he does things, you just take the old fall back position and blame the guy who made things so easy for you to attain what you have. In other words, you cannot defend your guy so you continue to blame the other guy. Care to comment Mr. Edu-macated. Oh, and don’t forget to include your I.Q. It’s required to have at least a 120 to participate in any kind of sensible conversation with you. Don’t forget to bring your compassion and above all bring the ‘Yes, we can!’, open and transparent, bi-partisan, don’t wish your fellow American bad luck attitude. You never know. What goes around might just come around. Sincerely, Rodhea

        • Edu-macated

          All right, where do i start. First, I’m in a good spot in my life mentally and emotionally, not financially like most Republicans tend to judge success and happiness. I’m actually up to my ears in debt just trying to get through school. Actually things have gotten tighter since old Dubya took office and decided to spend a shit ton on securing oil rather than investing money in renewable resources, just imagine where we would be right now if we had spent that money on research instead of the measley $2 Billion a year on alternative energy. That’s a different arguement all together.

          Where in my post didi I claim to have god-like intellectual superiority over everybody else. You sound kind of like an upset child. Obama isn’t my boy, we don’t hang out together, and i really dislike a lot of Democrats as much as Republicans.

          in this sentence it appears you are perhaps confused and replying to a different posting: It never would have occurred to us those of us who aren’t in love with Mr. Obama that we could also love America and have opinions that differ with all of you who are gods.

          When did I question you patriotism? The only common thing I’ve read here is how the American hating democrats create all problems. I was trying to respond to that and the other crazy things Aman was trying to write.

          Anyways, I’m sorry for sounding arrogant and superior to anyone else besides Aman, because he sounded like an idiot. I’m not even sure what my I.Q. is because I’ve never taken an I.Q. test. You don’t need to be a Einstein to have a discussion with me, you just can’t make up crap. I have no problem debating and listening to anyones opinion, but I tend to make fun of the extremists who can’t complete a sentence.

          You end your post about some bi-partisan, don’t wish your fellow American bad luck attitude, yet your entire post was a sarcastic attack on me. Do you see how that can send mixed messages? You obviously have some issues with our current Prez that only you can work out. Don’t believe everything you hear.

          Remember, fool me once shame on you, fool me twice….well, it’s not nice to fool people.

        • Smilee

          Rodhea Reply:
          July 14th, 2009 at 4:09 pm

          Rodhea Reply:
          July 14th, 2009 at 4:09 pm

          Another mixed up frustrated and angry fool

      • http://google fogey60

        to rodhea obviously you done know scat from shinola we are headed for hell in a hand basket under the present administration we have to get rid of all of the incumbents with more than one term if we don’t want so be a socialist nation as for obama he is nothing but a mouth piece for the united nations the fed trying to bring in the new world order result ww3

        • Rjquick

          You are correct, they are all pawns, selected to bring in the New World Order. I think everyone here should go to Amazon, or one of the other book stores, and purchase the book, ” None Dare Call It Conspiracy” . It was written in the early ’70s. The whole plan was all laid out for everyone with the guts to know the truth written in it.
          RJQ

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          Thats what rodhea was saying.

      • http://google fogey60

        wake up sheeple, you are about to lose your country the whole congress and house should be held as traitors and all you want to do is kiss the a of the nearest politician who says what you want to hear and you believe. in the latter days the whole world will be deceived amen to that

      • Floyd

        Edu-macated,if the bufoon in the oval office is inteligent,I’d like to see what a moroon looks like. Chimps have more real brains that that dope has. Anyway if one hesitates when talking ,I think he is lying ,he has to think of his next story to BS us on.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          The dude in office now, well, its like this. He aint got no game. Bottom line, dude aint got no game.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          He doesnt think, and he doesnt have ideas of his own, and cant speak from the heart. He has to read what the teleprompter says, and when it screws up, he is done. This guy is as plastic as they come. He isnt an American citizen, or he would have proven it right out of the gate. He abhors Christians and tells other countries that we are not a Christian nation. He is a muslim, thus the conversion from Barry Soetoro to Barrack Hussein Obama. I mean, holy cow man, how can people not see what he is? He weakens us to our enemies, and apologized to the world for us being successful. Half of you wankers that voted for him dont even know who he is, and that is a sad state of affairs that uneducated people and illegal aliens can vote for our leaders and lead us down bad roads. Unbelievable.

        • http://google fogey60

          lose his teleprompter and he is lost great speaker maybe so was hitler

      • bj

        Actually the dollar has been falling since 1913 when our congress conveniently
        passed the Federal Reserve Act. Since 2002, it has fallen close to 40%

        • Aman

          Very good point bj.

      • Dora

        You are being very ugly to someone. Shame on you!

        • Edu-macated

          Sorry. But wasn’t this ugly?

          And anyone who finds him smart, a leader, and a worthy president is either uneducated, on drugs, without family, hates America, as well as themselves, sexually divient, perverted and gay! santanic, or all of the above.

      • http://naver Brady

        Well, well, well, edumacated sounds like some self centered arrogant fool! I have 4 children, 20 years with the military, speak 2 languages, etc., but I think that the “allah” Obama isn’t the right person for America. How can he be the right choice? The man foolishly doesn’t want to prove he is an American citizen, show any records about himself, downs Christianity (The belief of our founding fathers.), and the address he says they lived at in Hawaii was a bald faced lie. Does this sound like the right man to you? At least Bush cut our taxes twice to get our economy going, took it to the terrorists, and knocked a person like Saddam Hussein out of power. A man whose idol was Josef Stalin. Gee, he really was a good person wasn’t he? I agree with the person who said that Clinton practically started all this mess we are in now. I live in Korea, so I know about a possible situation. Kim Jung Il has many missiles and some of them may be pointed at the town I live in over here. Obama is talking about striking North Korea as a preemptive strike, but we did the same in Iraq with two different outcomes. In Iraq, were I went to 3 times, we were able to set up a democratic government, give people freedom, food, medicine, etc, and I’ve seen it work in person. If he attacks North Korea, he will not give up and will fight to the death. Their soldiers are better than any terrorist, can go without food longer than our boys can, and he has no qualms about firing his missiles and killing millions of people. Obama doesn’t have the training, experience, or know how on how to deal with him. I know our economy is in big trouble, but if has us continue down this path of destruction, there will be many more people dead than he could possibly ever count. At least Bush got him to come to the bargaining table. He may have left the table, but at least Bush got him talking. Comments are welcome, but only in good taste.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          Thank God for President Bush and all he did for this country. He sacrificed his popularity, for doing what represented us people, and kept us safe. To all those butt heads, that I kept hearing for years crying “this is Bush’s war for oil”, well, I would like to know, wheres the oil? Guess that was another left wing lie. Beat that dead horse to death didnt all of you. To those who say he isnt smart and cant complete a sentence, well I take that as racism against the Texas accent. Just because someone doesnt speak like you, doesnt make them dumb. The guy was very smart, very articulate, and when he spoke, it came from his heart, not a teleprompter. Your guy can read good from this electric device, but there is nothing good that comes out of his heart when he speaks, because when the teleprompter malfunctions, he is a screwed up mess and doesnt know what to do or say. Thanks, but no thanks, I will take George Bush’s intelligence and heart over this boneheads anyday. You all because of your political based agenda sit there and point the finger at this man, and your propaganda networks of ABC,CBS,NBC,CNN and MSNBC have soiled his reputation in this country to thousands of uneducated people that dont realize that this guy sacrificed his well being to save our hineys. Fact is fact, and no one can change it, to which i say, well done Mr. Bush, thank you sir.

        • Edu-macated

          I would argue that going into Iraq with a crappy plan, lack of essential equipment (i.e. the vest for the troops, IED proof vehicles, an idiot like Rumsfeld making the plans). Also all of the money overspent to Crook Cheney’s Haliburton with the no bid contracts. I love how people can overlook these things, or worse defend them. Not to mention the Hurricane Katrina blunder. We can afford to spend $50 a bottle to truck water across the desert, yet within our own borders, our American citizens were left to suffer.

        • FarRightWinger

          Obama is talking about striking North Korea as a preemptive strike, but we did the same in Iraq with two different outcomes. In Iraq, were I went to 3 times, we were able to set up a democratic government, give people freedom, food, medicine, etc, and I’ve seen it work in person

          “Knocked out Saddam’? Since Saddam is knocked out there is only chaoes, devastation, murders, rapes and no food, tainted drinking water and uncertain future… In any country the US Army entered resulted the same. Oh yes, your Evil Empire will offer to rebuild what they destroyed… I live in Asia too, escaped from IRS and other police-state tactics, but 1 thing is very sure: most Asians don’t understand how can be a country so abusive, so arrogant and so self-destructive as the USA? Really bro, stop watching CNN for your political refreshments…

      • B. Harris

        What a real jerk you are!

        I noticed a small spelling error in your statement of reply. So what! Most of us are here to comment on genuine concern for our country and families. Since you are happy and content, you should just be grateful, I guess, that Obama was born.

        We have a right to express our opinions without “lefty” wishing us distruction. But then the “lefties” in the world can not stand for anyone to voice an opinion different than theirs.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          You got that right. As they sit on their left wing liberal pacifist appeasing pants wetting pedestal, only the left is entitled to a thought and an opinion, and the rest of us are not. Thats how they are.

        • Edu-macated

          Ya, I agree, I was being a jerk. Did you read Aman’s post though, I mean seriously, is that the kind of fool you want to represent you??

      • http://windstream lea

        You wack head all Obama can say i uh uh uh uh uh uh uh i uh uh i uh uh i think uh uh uh. smart I don;t think so you jerk.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          Unless his teleprompter is working properly. Other than that, he’s got nothing.

      • mgm

        The rich kept their business which gave people jobs…the government
        never makes a dime…it will not supply jobs

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          You know, I just wonder how many of these lefties have ever had a poor man give them a job? Last I looked, the so called “rich” in this country pay over 80 percent of the taxes. The dumbocrats wont be happy until they run them all to Mexico and elsewhere, leaving us all to pay it all. If you let the so called “rich” business owners keep their money, they will expand and they will hire more people, and now you have more people working, more people paying taxes, the rich guys paying more payroll taxes, and its a win-win situation. For some backwards reason, the democrats think if they tax the shit out of everyone, they will have more money, but history shows it isnt so. Business cut costs and cut jobs to pay these taxes, and now less is being taken in. How and why they are so stupid, I dont know. Its as easy to figure out as 2 plus 2 equals 4, but for some reason this equation seems to elude them. I just dont get them, I really dont. And people vote for them. What they hell are they thinking?

      • http://www.pridestarsfamily.com chuck

        Reply to non educated32 czars give me a frigging break–take away his teleprompter and he is lost. He is lost with or without his teleprompter.Because of his payoffs to the union thugs and Acorn plus a deficit of 1 trillion dollars, Inflation soon will hit you on the butt. 20 bucks for a loaf of bread and 50 bucks for a gallon of gas,,Free advice start hoarding all the non perishible goods and get your hands on all the silver and gold that u can You had better move quickly too.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          Ever know any politician to come out of Chicago to be honest? They are all dirty mob related out of there, and this guy is no exception.

      • bigdog

        For being properly educated, you are not very smart. We have always had health care because you can go to a hospital and get treated and they can’t turn you away and you won’t get billed. The demos want heath care to take charge of everything in your life, including what you will drive, how much you will drive it, and with acorn taking over the census they will tell you how to vote and you know your taxes are going up, because the only thing the demos have ever done is raise taxes. Finally I will assume that being educated like you are that somebody else is paying your bills, maybe over extended welfare. I like working for a living but the BAMA only wants you to do what he says. The US as we have known it is gone and with the current set of politicans, we will be under the control of a foreign nation before long and ever right you ever had will be gone. Therefore your arrogance about your education don’t mean SHIT!

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          Well, its been my experience, when it comes to our so called houses of higher education graduates, that me myself, Id sooner higher a guy that has done the work for 2 years, than I would a guy who has read a book about it for 4 years, while being constantly exposed to left wing liberal pacifist appeasing philosophy. I never went to college, and I never will, but I will gladly sit down anyday and take an IQ test with these guys, and though I wont win them all, Ill stay above 50 percent in the win column. So you can waste all your money and time, and tell everyone how smart and properly educated you are, I agree with Big Dog, it dont mean squat to me. Heck man, 80 percent of you dont even work a day in the field you took in college. Dummy.

      • Aman

        You sound like a very angry person. Taking cheap shots and making insults is hardly a way to get your point across. You epitomize, as the saying goes, that the truth hurts. And you know that. What’s your ethnicity by the way…if you have the guts to answer that honestly.

        • Edu-macated

          actually I got the opinion that your a very angry person, making stuff up and talking about the end of the world. What’s my ethnicity??? If I have the guts to answer it honestly? Sounds to me like someones got some racial issues. Let’s see….I’m German, Belgian, kinda french canadian/indian (I get pretty tan in the summer). I’ll have to get back to though, because I’m sure I’ve got some other European ancestry I can’t think off the top of my head. Any ways, if you read your post you’ll see a whole lot of hate and cheap shots.

        • Edu-macated

          By the way, this sounds very angry: And anyone who finds him smart, a leader, and a worthy president is either uneducated, on drugs, without family, hates America, as well as themselves, sexually divient, perverted and gay! santanic, or all of the above.

      • SSG Prasuhn

        So, (in your ‘own’ words)….”I love America as well as myself”…which comes first, you or America? My guess (again in your own words)…”I find Obama a very smart leader”…’YOU’, because anyone with a brain knows that Obama and his ilk is out to destroy America (doing away with capitalism and going socialist).

        What a loser!!

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          Hey SSG, tell me, just how in the hell this person finds Obamination to be a smart leader? How can he possible deduct that? The irresponsible unqualified jerk has caused millions to lose their jobs, he has spent more of OUR

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          Oops, I bumped the wrong button, got all worked up there. Anyways, back to the point of how this jerk says obamination is a smart leader, I ask how. He has caused millions to lose their jobs, he has spend more of OUR money in what, not even 10 months than the previous admin did in 8 years, and his party bitched about the Bush admin spending? Excuse me? And if this guy is so smart, why does he require a teleprompter to tell him what to say? He has no ideas, no plans, no qualifications, just a line of lies and bullshit 10 feet long. He should have been a used car or snake oil salesman. As for me, Ill keep my guns, my money and my Bible, and you sir Mr. Obama, can keep your change.

        • Smilee

          SSG Prasuhn Reply:
          July 15th, 2009 at 9:10 am

          How would you know, you clearly lack a brain, well maybe not all that hate can turn your brain off and then it appears like you have no brain.

      • Don

        And to think, I fought a war for Idiots like you and will be a criple for the rest of my life. If it was not for my faith in this nation and the patriotic Americans that still believe in it, I would blow my own brains out. If you are the product of our American education systom, then we are in worse shape than I thought. It is you that should not be posting on this sight. ( Better to be thought to be a fool, Than to open your mouth and remove all doubts)

        • Smilee

          Don Reply:
          July 15th, 2009 at 11:27 pm

          Don

          Thanks for your service, the bunch here are in the minority now, the majority truly appreciate your sacrifice, so you are loved by most of us in this country

      • richard cranium

        To Edu-macated: you sound like one of those wacked out over edumacated liberal socialist. Your position is illogical to a free American and those of us that wish we really were free in America. You can pick a person apart, insult them, call them names and state you have the right to do so under the guise of free speach. But let that same little guy try to stand up and be heard – and you try to step on him like a little bug because they don’t agree with your wacked values and goal of supressing Americans trying to be an American. Thats the whole problem with Washington and politics (and you) today – people are seen as a pesky bug that need to stomped on and squashed when they speak up against the status quo. When Obama cannot produce the proof that he is a natural citizen of the United States and flees back to his homeland – I hope you and your kind go with him…….

        • Aman

          And I’ll pay for his ticket!

        • Smilee

          richard cranium Reply:
          July 16th, 2009 at 9:57 am

          Richard

          It sound more like you are describing yourself, it fits your profile better

      • http://internetexplorer Rosebud

        Who’s closed minded? He has a right to his opinion just like you.

      • Aman

        Racist. So in other words my asking you what’s your ethnicity is racist? Please explain. Hatred? Again, please explain that one to me. As far as you being head over heels in debt, are you expecting a handout from Obama bin Biden? Think you’re poor now , wait! As far as alternative energy; Do you drive a car? Heat your home? And since I estimate that you do, what’s your idea of alternative energy?
        Also, many and most people on this site have shared feelings regarding the America we know and love which has a lot to do with God, family and country. Based on you’re anger and mysterious background, what would bring you to this forum? Is it that you like to argue and fight with people. So far that’s what it appears to me, because you haven’t offered anything of sustenance.Therefore, if you think attending college will mean that you’re smart, save your money and cut your losses now. While reading, riting, and rithmatic are essential skills necessary in becoming a problem solver and contributor to a productive society, some college degrees are not worth the paper they are printed on. There’s an old saying that goes ” everything I need to know, I learned in kindergarten.” Give that some thought.

      • Aman

        And here’s some more information for you. The Obama Admin. is full of perverts. One of his Czars is or was connected to the porn industry, Gay/Lesbian like Janet Napolitano, and some kind of anti police czar. Obama, who thought that there was 57 states, attends a so called church preaching hatred and anti American speech. He claims he never heard any such sermons. Obama’s connections with terrorist like Bill Ayers, and crooks like Resko. And what about partial birth abortion. Obama himself, it was revealed dabbled with homsexuality. I could go on, but do you seriously believe that behavior like this is a person of a sound mind, capable of making very important decisions. The deviant behaviors I described are snares that do contribute to a decline of a productive civilization. But, perverted and deviant as such behaviors are doesn’t mean that people aren’t capable of change. You claim to know so much. Have you ever heard of a group called NAMBLA! Look that one up.

        • B. Harris

          Hey guys,
          I think some of us are getting a little carried away here. We aren’t interested in fighting with each other are we? I like learning how some of our “Left” brothers feel about the issues, because it helps me understand what I am really up against. What is happening in our country is serious business and everyone who loves our country, right or left, needs to concentrate on what we share in common and stick together even if we differ politically. Obama and his Administration do not care a bit about us. Both conservative and liberals need to work together to get rid of the whole bunch this next election and vote for the person rather than the party.

    • Patricia Henson

      I think you underestimate Whoabama. He is sly like a fox and that is what makes him dangerous. He smiles at you the whole while plunging in the knife. I think he buys into the whole savior thing. He really thinks he is the second coming of Christ. If you listened to his first 100 days speech he made a remark that really bothered me. He said that during his second 100 days that he was going to work the first 72 and rest on the 73rd, making reference of course to Gods creating the world. I don’t think he is satisfied with being president of the U.S. I think he wants to be the king of the new world order. That’s why the dollar is being destroyed to usher in one world currency. A global coin was unveiled during the g-8 summit. Scary isn’t it? He is destrying our military so he can hand it over to the U.N. If there is no military then he has money for this new healthcare bill of his.The healthcare bill will give government the power to decide who gets healthcare and who don’t. You can bet that older Americans won’t be treated because most of them are Christians.(Can’t have that now can we?) He is destroying religion in this country to form his own one world religion. At first it will be just one big melting pot of religion(almost like it is now.)until he or someone like him decides that they are God. Can you see how it’s all coming together?Gore stated just today how the new cap and trade bill brings us closer to one world governance. They are not even trying to hide it anymore. I hope all of you will think about it seriously.

      • Aman

        Your points are indeed on the mark. Which is the reason why I frequent this site. Even those who’s opinions and beliefs are very different than mine, it’s necessary to hear people think out loud! Once that’s established, you can’t help to wonder who and what these people are. And since this occupant of the Whitehouse is terribly off his rocker regarding all America has risked and died for, I fear for our future.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          To which I say, Amen Aman.

        • Patricia Henson

          I fear for our future too, but more importantly I fear for the children and grandchildren. They will be put in a position to spy on their parents, grandparents,bothers, sisters,and friends.There is an organization called Americorps that young people ill be required to join if they want to go to college. It is supposed to encourage public service. It was put together by Obama and Acorn and I’m telling you it was created to form a type of secret police just like in the days of Hitler. You need to check it out as they do have a web site. All we can do is try and wrap our children up in the hand of God to keep them protected. You even have to be careful what church you attend today as some ministers are bowing to pressure from our government and aren’t teaching the true word of God. They are totally leaving Jesus Christ out of their prayers as that word is offensive. The Bible says that the Father won’t hear our prayers unless we go through the son. That’s important to know but it isn’t being taught because the name of Jesus is offensive to Athiests and Muslims. Military chaplins have been ordered not to pray in the name of Jesus for the same reason. I know of at least one who was court-marshalled and lost his pension for doing it. How sad.

      • http://donthaveone Mark

        Our days are numbered, whether it be one year, 10 years, or 100 years. This world order you refer to will come. In the Bible in either Daniel or Revelation, I mix the two of them up because they both prophesy about the last days, it is revealed about the one world government with 10 nations, and almost immediately 3 of them are removed leaving 7. All this crap going on now, with our dollar weakening, the muslims rising up, the Christians getting prosecuted, all are things that will pass to allow this all to come about, and sorry dudes, whether your a Christian, a muslim, a jew, an atheist, a buddhist or whatever, it is going to happen sooner or later. But do what you can while you can while you are here, and dont live in doom and gloom. Help others while you can, and do good for each other while you can. Obama is in it for himself and his ilk, whomever they might be. But he doesnt stand for me, or for the United States, or for Christians. That is obvious by his words and actions. Just hard to believe that people in this country are so gullible, that one party can own the networks ABC,CBS,NBC,CNN and MSNBC, and broadcast change-change-change so much for a couple of years, that people in mass buy into it without even finding out about they guy saying it is. Is he an American citizen like the law says he has to be to be president? I dont know. But I dont think so. Wouldnt you produce a birth certificate and put all this questioning to rest if you had one? I know I would. Is he a muslim? I think so, or he wouldnt have been able to tell George Stephanopolous in an interview that something was against his muslim religion, and George had to correct him and say, “you mean your Christian religion”. Sorry, those words could not slip out of my mouth, because as a Christian, that kind of thought does not exist. For him to say that, it has to be in him. But like I said, it is scary that this many people in this country are so gullible as to let the news networks on TV blindly tell them who to vote for, and like robots they followed it without getting educated as to just who they were voting for. That is a comment on the sad state of affairs in this country right now.

        • Edu-macated

          Well, its been my experience, when it comes to our so called houses of higher education graduates, that me myself, Id sooner higher a guy that has done the work for 2 years, than I would a guy who has read a book about it for 4 years, while being constantly exposed to left wing liberal pacifist appeasing philosophy. I never went to college, and I never will, but I will gladly sit down anyday and take an IQ test with these guys, and though I wont win them all, Ill stay above 50 percent in the win column. So you can waste all your money and time, and tell everyone how smart and properly educated you are, I agree with Big Dog, it dont mean squat to me. Heck man, 80 percent of you dont even work a day in the field you took in college. Dummy.

          Actually I’m a non-traditional student, I’ve worked for several years and went back to school. Don’t jump to conclusions so fast. I also see the education institution for what it is and sit next to people who probably shouldn’t graduate. I went back to school because I am interested in the field that I am studying and wanted to get a job I enjoy working at while getting paid enough to support my kids and give them an opportunity to do the same.

        • Smilee

          Mark Reply:
          July 15th, 2009 at 8:57 am

          ditto, ditto ditto

      • Urban Underbrink

        Obama would be nothing without Hollywood and the Media constantly talking him up and protecting him from the real questions we need answered. Last night I listened to a little of what he said about the “Health Care” plan. To me he appeared a complete idiot when he explained the need for his plan. How can anyone not understand how stupid his statements were? He actually said that our Welfare System ( of giving free Health Care to folks who don’t have insurance ) is breaking us. So his freaking answer to this problem is to give free health care to the entire Country! But he also is trying to get us out of debt by printing and spending lots more money! This fool is DANGEROUS!! He might just be a front guy for some really rich evil dudes. We will not save our Country by calling and writing with our concerns to the fools in Washington. It is going to take action by the Millions to get their attention. Don’t wait too long because they are preparing to stop all descent.

        • Patricia Henson

          He may have appeared to b a fool to you but there are thousands of people out there that look into his smiling face and buy into everything he says, especially people out there that are maybe having a hard time who want to beleive that our president is out there to help them. What they don’t understand is that thisbill will imprison every taxpayer for decades. This country will never recover if we let this healthcare plan and cap and trade to pass. We are in real danger hearfolks so please don’t fall for his smiling face telling his pretty lies. Just keep asking where the birth certificate is and don’t stop asking until it is produced.

    • Ted

      Bravo !! Bravo !! Osambama Heusein was born in Kenya, a Muslim, and is still a Muslim and no one will ever convince me otherwise. He was probably an Al-qaeda implant at a very early age, using the Hawaii gig as a cover.

      Think about it. It all make sense !!

      • Smilee

        Ted Reply:
        July 15th, 2009 at 9:18 am

        Thanks for making it so very clear for us that you have a completely closed mind, and its a known fact closed minds cannot function normally and distort reality.

        “…and no one will ever convince me otherwise.” here is the proof you give, if facts arise that prove otherwise those with open minds will accept and support the truth, closed mind ones h stick to their biases, like you claim you will, Ted

    • http://donthaveone Mark

      Never did our forefathers want God out of the equation. They wanted Him in the equation, where the government would not interfere with ones choice to worship Him. Now, under the disguise of separation of church and state, they have removed God and Christianity from so many places, yet they tell us to be tolerant of other religions such as Islam, and even make students at North Carolina and other colleges read the Koran as part of their curriculum. Why cant we have some tolerism for Jesus Christ, you know, the one that came and died on the cross for me and all, that we may have a bridge to God. Why isnt Jesus tolerated? I mean, I know he is a dangerous guy, what will all that talk of love thy neighbor, and share with others all you have, and to put others first. Geez, what kid of society would we have to live in if everybody did that? Woundnt need to strap bombs on our 8 year old kids and have them walk into a mall and detonate it then would we. Another case of looking for love in all the wrong places.

      • Aman

        Exactly right Mark!

      • Smilee

        Mark Reply:
        July 16th, 2009 at 1:00 pm

        Oh but Mark Jesus is tolerated, you just have not been paying attention, I can drive a mile from my home and find ten churches who worship and preach about Christianity without anyone interfering. You on the overhand feel you have the right to go into any public venue and force Christianity on anyone and then are so dishonest as to turn around and say Jesus is not tolerated. Separation of Church and State was put in the constitution in 1795 in the first amendment and to date has not been amended so it 214 years since it was made part of our supreme law, what happened was when some Christians tried to force others who where not Christians to tolerate their beliefs and the Supreme Court was called upon to resolve that dispute and from that time on we have been ordered to remove religion from public areas owned jointly by all. This in no way restricts anyone yourself included from worshiping Jesus but you just cannot force others to and from that you conclude you are being discriminated against for you religion and your position only reveals your closed mind and inability to understand the constitution that clearly separates church and state but also does not restrict you from exercising your religion only that you cannot infringe on other religions in a public venue. There are many religions, Islam and Jewish to cite only a couple. No one is forcing anyone to read the Koran or any religious material in any public education system. The TRUTH would be nice but from you I’m not sure that is a possibility as long as you are so filled with hate and so biased towards so many. Its really is clouding your thinking and preventing any objectivity and thus your inability to enter into real and civil discourse here. You are not the only one in this world you know so try and be more tolerant of your Islam, Muslim, Jewish, black, gay neighbors etc who do have the very same rights as you do.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          Again, you are a liar. The Koran is forced to be read by students at North Carolina University, and the Bible is banned from many place. My brother was fired for taking his to work at a grocery store, who after the fact denied it. And I am tolerant of my black neighbors, as they are the same as I am. I am not tolerant of Muslims, as they want me dead and have made it clear that this is true. I am tolerant of Jewish people, very much so, so again you lie. I am tolerant of gays, and treat them as anyone else, but again, I do not have to accept their lifestyle because it is wrong in the eyes of God. I do not attack them, I do not harm them, in fact I would say it is more the truth that I treat them better than they treat themselves in their own gay community. That is a fact. So Smilee, you are a racist liar, who once again brings the race card to the table. You know, Im white and I would bet I have more TRUE friends, disregarding politics and work, that are black, then your black ass has. Because you have a problem with seeing in color, and make it evident to all. I on the other hand do not, as I have been enlightened by my creator God, to know that all men were created equal, and that are all designed to become his children. You are in error once again, and you have spun the truth once again, and you have out and out lied, once again. You see, you group black into one group, black. I dont. There is black and black, and there is white and white. Black like in Dr. Harry Edwards, black like in Rodney King. Both are black, both are much different. White as in Billy Graham, white as in Bill Clinton, both are white, both are MUCH different. You cannot ball people into color. Please learn to judge by the content of character, not the color of skin. thank you.

        • Smilee

          Mark Reply:
          July 24th, 2009 at 8:55 am

          MARK

          You are one mixed up confused person, go back and read what I said and then try and respond to that not respond to your spinning of what I said, like I said before you have again demonstrated you are incapable of reasonable discourse and go off on a tangent again. Again more assumptions rather than fact, be honest Mark you have know idea what the color of my ass is and until now I did not know yours was white albeit you have talked like a white supremacist so I suspected as much. You have many posts in these blogs that indicate your hatred for blacks, gays, Muslims and others and on this post you deny that, like I said you cannot carry on reasonable discourse as you are all over the page one time you express hate for these people other times as here you claim the opposite illustrating your confusion and frustration with being confronted with these facts. You have never seen me say anything against the rights of anyone it is you that plays the race card and then try to blame it on others just like you blame all the destruction the republicans have done to this country on the democrats thus not taking responsibility of your actions in this destruction by supporting these people and we all suffer for that .

  • Roger R. collins

    I am closer to Libertarian views today than the Republican Party. The primary issue is the Libertarians keep nominating candidates who make the D & Rs look good. Get a good candidate and we could be in for a surprise when the next presidential election comes. (Sarah Palin?) Don’t know how they would accomplish anything with the lame Congress we have.

    • DaveH

      Roger,
      It takes time to build a party, but I think now is a good time to start since so many people are upset about Obama’s attacks on our liberty. If enough people understood the principles of the Libertarian Party and supported them, then I think the biased media would have to give them some coverage or risk becoming irrelevant.
      There is a chance that the Republicans could get back to their roots of smaller government, but I think they have lost their voice with the masses because they spend too much time worrying about people’s vices. And now, of course, they are not much more fiscally responsible than the Democrats. I lost hope for the Republican back in the 80′s when they hung all over Reagan preventing him from accomplishing any kind of rollback of government. I think Bob Dole was the leader in that effort. I remember him advising Reagon that he needed to compromise. Well, the Democrats idea of compromise is for you to agree to half of their socialistic agenda, which means even larger government. If he had been unhampered by his own party members, I think he could have succeeded in cutting the size of government rather than just stopping its growth temporarily.
      Maybe, if Obama causes this country enough pain while people can still remember how it used to be, then the voters might start getting together and do what it takes to get our liberty back.
      I was talking to my dental hygeinist yesterday (he was obviously liberal). He was advocating national health care, as he couldn’t afford good medical care for his family. I told him (true story) that I paid a little over $400 to have my first child delivered by Caesarian in 1972. I know that the dollar is worth less now, but that doesn’t come anywhere near explaining why health care is so much more expensive now. Yet, we have had ever-increasing involvement of the government in the health care field since that time. I’m sure you agree with me that Big Government is the problem, not the solution.

      • http://donthaveone Mark

        Government screws up everything they run. Done a wonderful job with our school systems havent they? Ever since they removed discipline in them, they have gone downhill, and cost more and more. That is the government solution, spend more money. Doesnt work. They get involved in this healthcare system, and its all over. Just like voting for Obama, those that want this have no idea of what they are voting for. Why does one think that others that live in socialized health care countries, come here for surgeries. Why do you think that is so?

        • Ted

          There is no such thing as an honest politician…
          Sara Palin comes closer than any of recent memory.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          Ted, I agree. And because she was good and honest, look what they did to her. What a shame, that fear of good would make people respond like that.

      • http://donthaveone Mark

        With the current state of our current political parties, especially the democrats, it should be easy for many of us to want to switch to the Libertarian Party. All they need are some quality candidates. You cant have guys with a pot leaf on their shirt saying lets smoke it, and stuff like that. Need some good legitimate people, that have shown they care, that have shown a respect for family, and a full respect for the people the represent. Ron Paul, Sarah Palin, Bobby Jindal, and Ill even throw democrat Evan Bayh from Indiana in there. Get him away from his lousy party and the guy stands head and shoulders above the rest of his party with what he has done in politics. This would be a good start. There should be some more disgruntled with their party that would like to stop towing the party line and start towing America. This is what we need. Business as usual isnt, and hasnt worked for a long time. Im a republican right now, but guys like Dick Lugar that have been in there so long and are all hooked up with the pork barrell network, the Arlen Spectres and Robert Byrd’s, Ted Kennedy, John McCain. Its time for all this old blood to go, and their beholdenment to the special interest groups. They all need to go. Lets make it happen please, for America, both sides of the aisle. We as Americans need it.

    • http://donthaveone Mark

      Sarah Palin and Bobby Jindal would be a good place to start.

      • http://google fogey60

        Ron Paul would also be a place to start we need accountability in govt.

  • Alvin

    I don’t know what is the best economic policy to follow, this is an unprecedented problem that we face. I don’t like the “stimulus” money going to people who screwed the pooch to begin with… I don’t think that the Republican’s would do any better.

    I don’t see a problem being more socialist. Canada, Australia, UK have free health care for everyone and I don’t see that as a bad thing.

    I don’t think that the economy’s related to “god” or “christianity” and bringing that into the conversation is a little irrelevant. The people that are coming up with economic recovery theories are of all religions, some have many gods, some have none… but they all want to see us emerge from the recession. And we will emerge, it might take longer then expected… or maybe it won’t??

    In these times though a little socialism might be a good thing, especially for those who don’t have enough money to pay for a trip to the doctor.

    • Harry

      There is no such thing as free health care. Everything needs to be paid for.The government is one of the poorest managers of almost anything they touch.

      • http://donthaveone Mark

        That is the stickler. We need to get the incumbants out on both sides of the aisle, and if we are to go independant, we need this party to arise some good people, other than the “lets smoke it” guys. We need some smart young people, some Sarah Palin and Bobby Jindal, and even some young democrats that havent been poisoned by the system, and maybe they could come together for the people and look out for us for a change, instead of just looking out for their political party. The two party system was good in the beggining, now it is poisoned. Kind of like the labor unions. They both got so big, they went bad.

      • Smilee

        Harry Reply: July 14th, 2009 at 1:10 pm

        Your right health care is not free but most countries can do it for about half of what we do with government regulations that don’t let the private sector rape you financially and why is it other countries show better outcomes than we do. We are rated 37th at present which means 36 countries are rated better on medical outcomes and their costs are about half of ours. Why is noone asking why can’t we???? I am on Medicare with a medigap plan and it is much much better than my employer furnished HMO I had before I retired which limited my choice of doctor, hospitals, had co-pays etc., all at double the cost, now I can go to any doctor or hospital, no costs beyond the premiums with no questions asked and I have health problems that requirea medical attention on an ongoing basis. I’ll take Medicare any day over the private plans we have today, better managed (did you know medicare has only an 8% overhead cost compared to up to 40% in some private plans this without their profit margin) than the private plans and at half the price. That’s my personal experience and as part of my employment I had to know and understand the private plans so am not ignorant of how they work and I watched them go down hill from a patient’s perspective and cost doubling several times from about 1980 on, I retired in 03. Rather than just throwing out statements like “The government is one of the poorest managers of almost anything they touch.” please explain why this is your conclusion????? Medicare is but only one of their successes albeit you can always find fault and they could do better but done by private is usually far worse How about Haliburten, the military did it much cheaper before they took over the duties they did that the military used to do. There are many others.

        • DaveH

          Smilee,
          How could you or anyone else possibly know how much Medicare is costing? The real costs are buried so deep that we would need coal-miners to bring them to the surface. There are several problems with national health care. One is that when anything is free to the consumer then the consumer will consume more. Another is that talented people won’t migrate to the medical field if the rewards aren’t there. And there are other distortions of the health marketplace that aren’t so obvious. If government involvement in health care is the solution, then how do you explain the ever-growing real costs of healthcare that have been occuring in the last 40 years? Those countries that have had national health care for a long while have experienced long waiting lines (I’m talking weeks and months), and reduced quality of care, and age-cutoffs, and treatment cutoffs (some bureaucrat deciding who should receive the limited health resources).
          This country became the wealthiest nation on earth on the back of freedom. And now we are losing that wealth rapidly because greedy people want free services which of course aren’t really free. Eventually, the real workers will tire of letting others ride on the back of their labor (I already have) and this country is going to grind to a halt.

        • Smilee

          DaveH Reply: July 14th, 2009 at 8:06 pm

          I never said I knew what the government costs of Medicare were, I doubt they are as large as you infer. What I said was my cost for Medicare and a medigap plan together was less than half in cost compared to my HMO when I was working and with better coverages. Ever rising cost of medical care in the private sector is in part managed care, HMO’s and excessive profits now is a big part why. When I was young, a large share of the hospitals where owned by churches and other non profit organizations, for profit hospital were bought out by large corporations and they drove this cost way up partly for profits to start with. Managed care hires doctors, nurses and others whose only jobs are to review recommend other cares or deny coverage and take up the time of medical providers to get information to make these decisions. As a Doctor friend of mine told me when he first started practicing medicine in the clinic he worked in he paid rent for his space, salary of one nurse and salary of one office girl. when managed care plans took over he now pays for one nurse and three office girls and spends about 1/3 his time talking to managed care doctors and nurses so he can get paid in addition to a reduced patient load of about 30% because of it and he said just get rid of managed care he could cut his prices about 40% as that is what he had raised them to cover their costs. What do you think it costs for the managed care plans to pay all these doctors and nurses. That’s one example of why they have risen, Medicare does not do this albeit they pay medical providers less. I know many people living in Canada,the UK and have over 200 relatives in Norway and have had this discussions with many of them and they adamantly deny that waiting or rationed care is a problem there. I have one friend in Canada that I grew up with in the US he was transferred to Canada about 40 years ago, he had planned to move back when he retired, he is 73 but did not do so simply because of our health care system, my cousin married a man in Canada and moved there about 20 years ago and actually works in a medical clinic and also disputes your claims, the people I know in the UK only said they love their coverage and in Norway they think they have the best in the world and think that we are crazy the way we deliver health care in this county. Weather you are aware of it or not many of the HMO’s and managed cares keep you waiting, I know of several, one of my coworkers HMO’s kept him waiting for five months for surgery on his foot, he was in a lot of pain and had to be maintained on pain medications and walk on crutches for five months until they could work him in,after the surgery he threw away the crutches and go off his pain meds. They did not employ enough surgeons to cover their patient load and refused to pay a surgeon out of network,, another treated a relative of mine and she got worse, finally they agreed to let her get a second opinion out of their network which they paid for, she went to the Mayo clinic, they said she has been misdiagnosed by them and recommended a different treatment plan. They refused at her HMO to pay for treatment at Mayo and she had to go back to them so it did her no good, the sad part it she is now terminal and had she been able to go to Mayo in the first place as she wanted to after first being diagnosed but could not. It is possible she could have been cured.
          She is 45 and not doing very well. I know of other horror stories with some of these plans. Oh by the way these all took place in Minnesota which is noted in the US as having about the best health care in the nation. I do not know where you get your information about other countries but I only hear this fiction from conservatives or conservative talk shows and blogs. Yes we did loose our wealth on backs of freedoms, the freedoms of the corporations, banks etc. to exercise their greed when regulations where removed and they where free to do business any way they liked. Did you know the top 5% of the nations wealth belonged to 21% of the population 30 years ago and now it is 4% that why we have so many more poor and that demands more government services, demand has grown a lot because of this. Those of us that are in retirement age remember when working people made enough on one job to make a living, today, many times it takes two people to do that or two or three jobs and together they make less than I did 45 years ago. Also In 1946 my mother was 36, and was sick and close to death and was rushed to the Mayo Clinic in Rochester MN where she had a kidney no longer functioning which they removed and the other kidney had a stone in it about 1″ in diameter (she brought it home, I still have it) they cut this kidney open and removed it and then sewed it up and then her. She was in the hospital there for a month. They had no insurance as many didn’t then, he went to the local bank borrowed the money and paid the clinic and the hospital, he made the last payment in 1952, that was what affordable health care in the private sector once was, today the private sector free of regulations has unashamedly exercised a immortal greed on the sickness of their fellow man and that sir is some of the reasons the cost of medical care has sky rocketed and has had nothing to do with your government except they sat back and let this happen. My mother died at the age of 82. My relative is not likely to make 50. Still think we have such a great system and other countries so bad. Our health care system is not good and is going to get worse, private sector will not on their own correct the system, if the government does not step it it will never happen and the horror stories will star to skyrocket down the road.

        • linda

          I am on Medicare. My husband and I have paid into Medicare all of our life. We are collecting Social Security and My husband still works full time. He pays into Social Security still and also Medicare. They deduct a monthly premium from our social security check every month for Medicare. Many of you confuse Medicare with Medicade.

          Medicade is the help for the poor., and illegal imigrants. Medicare is for the elderly that have paid into it for years and continue to pay a monthly premium. The new Health Care plan is talking about cutting Medicare. Page 425 of the plan talks about plans for the elderly to choose dying over long term care. So if I need a triple by pass, I can choose to die instead, because it would be cheaper for the government.

          Think all of you out there!!! If you are in your forties, in twenty five years you will be under Medicare or the new health care that is being voted on by the Idiots in Congress. This seems like a long time, but trust me you will wake up some day and look in the mirror and an old person will be looking back. Do you want the government giving you councilling on how to die gracefully. Or do you want them to give you good quality health care that you have invested in all of your life.

          I’m sure you all have families. Do you want them to tell your mother or father that it would be more cost effective not to have procedures that might save their lives. Here’s a pamplets on how to die.

          Don’t tell me about Canada’s health care. I know three people (from different families) that have come to the U.S. from Canada because of the health care. One said that the premiums were connected and collected along with your drivers license. That you had to wait on a list to get care and if you died before your name came up so be it. Canada is now having clinic”s starting up freelance, that people can pay out of pocket to go to, because it takes up to a year to get a MRI done. You can go to a clinic and get one within a week for $750.00, out of pocket. They are luring all the better doctors, because the doctors are unhappy with the government plans.

          I can tell you alot of ways to cheapen Medicaid, and all our health insurance. Make more clinics, like the nurse practioners that are at Wal greens and other pharmacy stores. Require the Red Cards of Medicaid to go there first for the treatments of sore throats, colds, cut fingers, and all other small problems. instead of going to the ER at hospitals, where they cannot be refused. It is expensive. If I go to the ER for a cold it would cost me between $2000.00 on up. Our Insurance in this country is so high because we have to pay the hospitals for the ones that do not pay. The hospitals cannot asorb these cost.

          I do not know what Congress or Obama are thinking. But I would place a bet that neither of them have read the over eleven hundred pages of the Heath Care Plan that is before them. I know they didn’t read the Stimulus plan. I also know that I do not want to be governed by a plan that is not complete, and will be passed then a Committe of his Czars will rule it and tell all of us how we will be treated. He has state that if it passes or not he will still set up a committee for Medicare (No mention of Medicade) to determine how it will be changed and run.

          You don’t want to hear my feeling on Cap and Trade. If this is passed all Americans will suffer. Not just the rich. We will all be taxed on all energy. Gas at the pump and Utilities. All individuals and companies will pay higher fuel bills. All companies, will raise cost of production to cover the increase cost to them. All delivery companies will raise cost, raising everything that is delivered to the stores of your choice. Clothes, Food, Medicine etc. etc. etc.

          The Rich (or large companies), will move their companies to China, India, Mexico. Cheap labor and no new taxes. This will happen also if the Health Care bill is passed, because it will cut into their profits (which I am not against a company making a profit). This will create more unemployment. Less taxes for government to use on these plans, and destruction to America.

          Please don’t critisize my spelling. I don’t pretend to be a schollar, but I was smart enough not to vote for Obama.

    • http://indytealover.blogspot.com Robert

      Absurd

    • nana

      You don’t see a problem with Canada, UK, and Australia healthcare. Obviously you don’t know a lot about it. Free health care. Like everything else you get what you pay for. You have no health care. Wait in lines to see a government doctor, can’t get your medications, (gov will decide if you need it), wait for surgical procedures. Elderly people will be dead (which in these countries is what they want) before they get to see a doctor or get medications. Canadians now come to USA for surgical procedures. Where you gonna run to.

      • Smilee

        nana Reply: July 14th, 2009 at 1:18 pm

        I do know a lot about it know many people in Canada and UK and Norway, In a friend of mine moved to Canada early in his career and had planned to retire here but because of our health care system he retired there. I know of no one in these countries that tell the horror stories you but have witnesses many in this country under the private plans. You get what you pay for, yes, but why is it our health care costs are about double most other countries are???? I know many people in this country who have been on waiting lists, an example I once worked with one guy who had to wait five months for surgery while popping pain pills and had to walk on crutches all this time because his employer furnished HMO did not have enough surgeons to cover its patient load and refused to pay a surgeon out of their network to it. Managed care and HMO’s very much limit your care, deny coverages limit your choice of doctors, clinics and hospitals and yes make you wait for services if this is not your plan consider your self lucky. See my post above to Harry about my experiences with Medicare and Medigap these are a government plan coupled with a private plan and these have been in effect since in the sixties and except for the changes in 2003 by the Bush administration no policy changes have been made to Medicare an Medigap when he added what he called advantage plans which gives seniors an opportunity to use managed care and HMO plans under the state regulations in the state you live in, the cost on these plans now costs the government and additional 13% more than the original Medicare Plan with more risk and possible denials and waiting that is not a part of the original. Did you know that Blue Cross is considering covering surgeries etc in India and will pay for plane and hotel for you and family member because it is only about 1/3 the cost with outcomes rated better than ours. People are already going there and I even know people who have gone to Canada for medical services (not medicine although some do that to). Except for the Mayo clinic I personally have know noone from Canada come here and people come from all over the world there but cost is not the reason. Some one obliviously has given you a real horror story without any reality to it. Medicare is almost 40 years old and none of the horror stories you cite have ever been the reality in Medicare.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          The same reason an Aluminum baseball bat costs more than a wooden baseball bat, its better.

      • Alvin

        In Canada you don’t have a “government” doctor. You have a doctor that has the same training and ethical values (or higher) than American doctors. They get paid by the government, but don’t have to “report” to the government. And if you need anything you get it… medication, massage, etc. For some procedures there is a wait, but if you just don’t feel great and want to see a doctor, you go down to your local clinic, and see your doctor… usually with in an hour or so?? And if he prescribes meds… you go next door to the pharmacy and get them. Some people will go to an American hospital if they have the money to pay for a procedure…. just as Farrah went to Germany to get a procedure…

        In Canada you would never get turned down by a hospital or doctor for any procedure. And the wait for life threatening surgery is minimal… you may have to wait a couple months to get your knee replaced or hip surgery, but not much longer.

      • Smilee

        Mark Reply:
        July 15th, 2009 at 10:27 am

        The same reason an Aluminum baseball bat costs more than a wooden baseball bat, its better

        ANOTHER STUPID STATEMENT FROM MARK !!

    • granny1

      Hey Alvin,
      Under B. O.’s government run health care plan, how long are you willing to wait to be seen by a doctor and then MAYBE get treated?

      • Smilee

        reply to: granny1 Reply: July 14th, 2009 at 4:41 pm

        Medicare has been in effect close to 40 years, I am on Medicare since 2003, I have full choice of doctors, hospitals, have never waited to be seen and always get treated, have health problems and require ongoing medical care, no questions asked, its our government run health care plan for seniors. I buy an addition government regulated medigap plan from the private sector to pay for all Medicare does not pay and guess what the cost to me for premiums on both total are less than half of what my HMO cost while I was employed and there I also payed co-pays as well and had a limited choice of doctors and hospitals but not my government plan, I can go anywhere. If it works this good for seniors why not for all, save a lot of money would we not, I know I am. My uncle had the same plan for 29 years he went on Medicare at 65 in 1975 and died in 2004 at 94 and never paid any other than premiums always got care and treatment promptly. You old enough for Medicare yet, granny.

        • DixieConnie

          And there in lies the answer, you worked well over 50 years and paid into the Medicare. What about those that don’t work, have not worked and have not paid in. Who, I ask you WHO is gonna pay for this? I sure as hell don’t want to. I have my own to pay for.

        • Smilee

          DixieConnie Reply:
          July 15th, 2009 at 3:17 pm

          I pay in $96.40 per month premium for Medicare B and $185.00 for a medigap supplement plan now, do not know how much I paid in over the years but it will probably not be enough to cover my medical costs of Medicare A which is paid for by Medicare. Who can get through life without working except those who have disabilities etc and are not able to work, they are now most likely on medicaid now which is 100% tax paid now. So if your working you are paying for it now. I so not know about you but I’d hate to see these people go without health care because they are unable to work.

        • granny1

          No, I’m not old enough, but am Knockin’ on the door. By the way, I’m happy that you’ve been blessed enough to have received the benefits of immediate health care. But, I hope you also realize that as soon as this plan is implemented that it will change the picture entirely. There are millions of Americans that don’t have and cannot afford health insurance. This will require them to buy it whether their budget will allow it or not. A little tidbit I learned just days ago is that our elected officials including Mr. O., is that they are all exempt from this wonderful catastrophe.

        • http://internetexplorer Rosebud

          It doesn’t work for seniors. I had a problem and the government refused to let me have the newest medical advantages. I had to wear a cast instead of the new cam boot when my tendon in my foot was torn loose and I could not walk and had to have some seriouse surgery. They also refuse to pay for a lot of things. It cost me thousands in meds I have to take each year. Government medicare sucks.

        • Smilee

          Rosebud Reply:
          July 16th, 2009 at 12:22 pm

          Medicare never paid for any medications until 2003 and congress and Bush then developed Medicare D program which is actually a private sector plan under government regulations and I agree its a joke and it sucks, only good that can be said for it is better than nothing. What Medicare plan do you have, original and if so what supplement plan if any do you have or do you have one of the what is called medicare advantage plans of which there are several types which also was enacted in 2003 by congress and Bush and heard many say it sucks but this is also a private sector plan that the government pays for part of the premium and you pay part. Medicare does not administer these plans. I have the original plus a Medigap “F” plan and my uncle had this combination for 29 years he had no problems and the last ten years of his life he had serious heath problems and they paid for all but meds. He died at age 94. His wife is living and 91 and has Alzheimers and I am her power of attorney since 2004 and handle all her affairs including medical and medicare and she has the same medicare as her husband had and I have had no problems there either, my mother and dad when they lived had no problems, dad went on Medicare in year one (1965). * Medicare is much better than most private plans today and at half the cost. It is by comparison to them that Medicare is far superior this can not be said of the new medicare advantage plans they are similar and in a lot of cases worse than most plans out there to day for those under 65.. My sister went on a year and a half ago, went from her regular plan of 70/30 plus $500 annual deductable, $15.00 co-pays with a $3000.00 put of pocket annual maximums to full coverage under Medicare + a “F” medigap plan, she has not retired yet and her employer pays her premiums and she still gets her dental and vision plans and her employer saved $150.00 a month, it was at their suggestion (she was not required too) she could have deferred medicare and remained on their plan but they wanted to save this money and she wanted the superior coverage. In total context I have to disagree with you, It is definitely superior to most plans available to you before age 65 today, I heard many say they can not wait to get off their plans and get on Medicare because of this. I’m sorry about your problems and as I do not know why you have these problems*

          It doesn’t work for seniors. I had a problem and the government refused to let me have the newest medical advantages. I had to wear a cast instead of the new cam boot when my tendon in my foot was torn loose and I could not walk and had to have some seriouse surgery. They also refuse to pay for a lot of things. It cost me thousands in meds I have to take each year. Government medicare sucks.

      • http://donthaveone Mark

        About as long as a guy I knew from fishing in Canada, that had a heart problem and went in to be seen. He signed up, and was sent away, told to return in about 15 days, as that was where the waiting time was at that point. He never made in to the 15 days, he died 4 days later. I dont know about you, but I dont want this crap. No way, no how. I still believe in paying for what I get, and Im not asking for any hand outs. No thanks. Obama, you keep your change. I dont need you.

        • Smilee

          Mark

          I known a couple of guys who did the same here, one actually the day following seeing the doctor one about a week after so he could have been here in the US and had the same outcome. Your comparison does nothing to compare the two countries health care systems and only defines your prejudices about Obama and your lack of knowledge about health care systems in general.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          Difference being here, your not told that they cant see you, because your on the waiting list to be seen. Here you go in with a heart problem, they will see you right now, not tell you to wait 3 weeks. Thats a big difference. Sure you could go in and be seen, and walk out and drop dead of a heart attack right then and there. Thats not what I was saying. I said they will have you sign in and tell you when to come back, because you have to wait your turn. And dont bring the race card up, thats bullcrap. I have no prejudices about Obama, as I could care less what color he is. It has nothing to do with anything. His lack of knowledge is what Im concerned with. The dude cant even talk to the public without some wanker writing him crap on a teleprompter to read. And when the prompter falters, this dude is lost. I want to see some stuff come out of his heart when he speaks, and it just doesnt happen. There is no plans here, other than what weve seen, which is give those that dont know how to run a business billions of dollars to screw up some more, and they will. Im sorry you have health problems Smilee, I dont wish that upon anyone, I really dont. But then again, your health problems should be paid for by me. Thats the problem I got with this social health care. Its not free. Taxes will be jacked up to pay for it, and Im against that. If I got a problem, let me pay for it. If you got one, you pay. Dont make me pay for all these hypochondriacs that are going to be in there all the time, and that will happen too. We will lose the quality doctors we have now, and less and less will study to become doctors, and soon we will have a shortage of them. Its not a good thing, unless one wants a hand out, and I dont want and need my government giving me anything, not anything, except that of which they are supposed to give, and that is a military protection from us being attacked another nation.

        • Alvin

          I call BS… what is the guys name? What hospital did he go to? What doctor sent him away?

          Spreading lies doesn’t help the problem. If you go to a hospital in Canada with heart problem you are taken in immediately, no questions asked.

          People who blindly believe your kind of propaganda will tear America apart, that is part of the problem and not part of the solution. You need to work together with real information to ensure the health of America and all the people in America.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          To Alvin. No BS here pal. I was fishing at a Lake Nagagamissi, 16 hours north of Fort Wayne, Indiana, just north of a couple of little towns called Hornpayne and Yellow River. I talked daily with these guys out there that were fishing, and found out they were from up there. Now this was some 7 or 8 years ago, when there was some rumblings back then about Hillarycare, or national health care. I asked these guys about how it was working for them, and at the time I thought it sounded like a great idea. I was told by all 4 of them in the boat, “You dont want it”. Thats when they guy told me the story. They told me of having a bad cold, and going in, and not getting seen, but put on the list and given a date to come back, and the one guy ended up with what is called “walking pneumonia” which Id never hear of before, and he almost died before he got in and got antibiotics and medicine to treat it almost 2 weeks later. Dont know pal, but if it wasnt true, Im really not sure why these guys would tell me this. They had nothing to gain, and I have nothing to gain by telling these stories, other than maybe to save my life if we can keep the best system we have in the world right now. And I dont know where Smiley comes up with we are 37th? Baloney. Maybe cost wise, but of course its cheaper in Somalia than here. That is the BS

      • Smilee

        granny1
        They (elected officials) will have the plan they have always had, adding fifty million people will increase the pool size and will lower the costs, there will be transition costs and and then there will be savings. The idea of reform is to make it affordable for everyone and in transitioning to this there will be a cost but in the long term it will be a lot cheaper. Every other country except one pays 50% of what we do, the real question is why can’t we??? and that one is about 20% less than us. We have the most expensive health care costs in the world. Those who have a vested interest in keeping things the way they are are spending a lot of money to lobby and spread fear based on lies. If they do not succeed we will get a lot cheaper and better health care. It is doable if we have the will to do it.

        No, I’m not old enough, but am Knockin’ on the door. By the way, I’m happy that you’ve been blessed enough to have received the benefits of immediate health care. But, I hope you also realize that as soon as this plan is implemented that it will change the picture entirely. There are millions of Americans that don’t have and cannot afford health insurance. This will require them to buy it whether their budget will allow it or not. A little tidbit I learned just days ago is that our elected officials including Mr. O., is that they are all exempt from this wonderful catastrophe.

      • http://donthaveone Mark

        Until you die, and that will happen, I guarantee it.

        • Smilee

          Are you really sure Mark???

          Another intelligent statement from Mark.

    • B. Harris

      Have you read the various comments from members of the legislature in Canada, Australia and the UK? All of them have cautioned the US on going down the road of National Health Care.
      Having worked in the Health Care Field, I have never seen anyone really need health care that could not get it. All children in the U.S. are eligible for CHIP. All adults can get it if they need it. Some people just want to spend their money in other ways.
      Believe me, it will not be cheaper than what you are paying for health care now. Can you name one program that the Federal Government has established that has saved money, provided the service promised, or was ran efficiently?

      • Smilee

        Boy are you a phony, worked in the health care field and do not know this, why is most countries health care costs about half of ours per capita. Our Medicare operates at 8% overhead and most private plans 25-40% plus profits, I am on Medicare and it is the best managed plan I have been under since the seventies and when I retired in 2003 my Medicare B premium and my medigap premium together is less than half my HMO when I was working and it covers all. Haliburten sure drove costs up when it took over what the government used to do and manage. So my Medicare is less than half of what I was paying the private sector health care plans and no 800 numbers as before no arguing with them, not once, I have had family members in it since day one and myself since 2003 and many of my closest friends and we love this change to Medicare far better, more efficient, no questions asked, in fact I have never talked to Medicare or my medigap provider on the phone but receive a slip in the mail that shows the costs and that my balance is always ZERO. This info is available to all on line or from Medicare if you are really interested in what is really going on.

        • Rjquick

          Rationed health care (ie, Canada, Great Britain,) is always cheaper. Besides, Medicare is going to go broke in a few years. There is no such thing as a free lunch. The legislature is filing peoples heads with garbage, so that they will be re-elected. All these Gov’t run programs are nothing but huge Ponsi schemes, and all will eventually break down, when the Gov’t takes the last dime of the last working person in this country, and that guy, like everyone else decides it is a better idea to get on the dole.
          RJQ

        • Smilee

          Social Security is about 75 years old, Medicare is almost 40 years old and they have been saying for 50 years (mabe more, I recall this for fifty years myself) SS was going broke and now they are saying Medicare will, well they both will if left as is, but the legislature always fixes it in time before that happens and they will or they for sure will not get reelected. I can remember most people when I was a young man, myself included, said and felt we never would see these benefits and we believed it, well guess what now I am retired and It didn’t go out of existence. They have had Medicare for forty years and never rationed care why are you so afraid of that happening here? Rationed care in Canada and UK is conservative fiction to keep people like your supporting their conservatives big corporate Greedy friends. Besides what do you think all the managed care and HMO’s etc are doing in this country now is ratiioning care and making you wait in some cases. Health care is the easiest way for them to financially rape the american public of their money as health care is mostly a need and they will say and do anything to keep their supporters in line so they do not lose this easy money. But when push comes to shove the legislaters in both parties will do what it takes to keep them from failing, sad part is the longer wait the cost is more but they will save these plans they dare not. Corporate greed is far more fearful than the government care and that is where the real ponzi scheme is, why do you suppose they spend all those millions on their lobbyists and why do you think our health care system is so expensive and out of reach for millions to the point they know they have to do something soon or the public will vote them out. People vote their pocketbooks except for maybe conservations who can’t figure that out, but their numbers have been dwindling in the last few years and this is why they will soon do something, the real fear is, will they do enough to really correct the problem or just enough to kick yhe can down the road. The corporate lobbyists are trying now to minimize their losses that will result when any plan finally passes and one will.

        • http://personallibertydigest Bell

          OK, folks we need to distinguish between medicare and medicaide. Those of us who are retired are on medicare. Those of us who are on welfare get medicaide. Do I have this right? I know people who are the latter. When they start talking about socialized medicine I tell them you are already on socialized medicine, how’s it working for you? They always say OH. The discussion ends than. I guess it isn’t working very well for them.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          I do see a Medi-Care deduction coming out of my check everyweek of my life that I work. I guess its good that I can be of service in helping you pay your medical bills. At least I know where some of it is going. But I have to believe that this will get all screwed up to if they go to this socialized medicine. If Hillary Clinton is behind it, No thanks, I want to stay as far away from it as I can. Far far away.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          Smilee, on your post below this, you told someone that for 50 years youve been told social security was going broke. What? Dude, come on man. I get a statement from them every year, showing how much Ive paid in and what my estimated payments will be when I start collecting and at what age, and until about 2 or 3 years ago, everyone of them said how solvent and safe it was, and that there was more money in it than ever before, then all the sudden in the last couple of years, poof, they dont put that statement on there. But they do still show what my monthly payment will be worth depending on when I retire and start drawing it. Im really not counting on it being there, as Im only 51. But I sure do wish this would have been a privatized account, as President Bush proposed to do. Id be a very rich man right now, and never have to worry about a thing in retirement. Id be loaded. But the government instead has my money, took the interest from the investments of my money, then spent my money somewhere, I dont know. They say that all these baby boomers are a strain on it and draining it out. To which I say, BS. These same baby boomers paid into it for 40 to 50 years, so where did it all go. If we could really get to the truth of it, I do know one guy that knows. Mr. William Jefferson Clinton. Thats a fact. If we could ever get someone not afraid to die to investigate him for this, we would get one hell of a lot of answers.

        • Smilee

          Mark Reply:
          July 16th, 2009 at 1:56 pm

          People said 50 years ago they did not expect SS to be there when they got to be of retirement age, not the government, I also got statements from SS and I was sure the last twenty years or so before I retired that it would be, but I knew better by then, “Disappeared in a poof the last couple of years”, where have you been, they have borrowing from it for years, Clinton turned that around and when he left office we had a surplus and a plan to start paying it back from the surpluses but Bush scraped that and we never saw it implemented or any more surpluses and by time he left our economy was in the tank, 401k plans lost big time when this happened as would of your privatized SS plan had Bush been successful in that, these type of plans tanked big time when the economy tanked. I do not have a 401k but lost quite bit on other investments when that happened, I have a defined benefit pension + SS and my defined plan cannot go down thanks to my Union, I receive about $1000.00 more in pension each month than by former coworkers who where nonunion. Nice people though they are happy for me and not jealous. You are one mixed up guy your SS will be there unless the conservatives again get the change to finish the damage they almost succeeded at, Those who lost in their 401k plans that are younger will probably gain it back in time for retirement,
          (hoping we do not have another recession when they get older) those in retirement or your age or older most likely will have little pension beyond SS so you better hope SS will be there if you have a 401K unless your one of the fortunate ones with a defined pension plan assuming you even have one as it is becoming more common for employers to not offer pensions of any kind too.

        • frodnaps

          Tell ya why, smilee. Their tax rates are more than double ours, for everyone!
          If this plan’s so good, why did all the politicians exempt themselves? I agree we need to do something about medical costs in this country, but when I see the ones in Germany (where I lived for nine years) and other countries, it worries me. Their programs are in serious financial trouble. The fact that they want to “fast track” this bill as well is the height of foolishness. Short suspenses always degrade the results, and this one is, in my opinion, at least, too important to screw up. So we need to shelve the rhetoric and really discuss this issue. Just to save you time if you can’t help yourself, I’m a libertarian. Our government is failing the people, not this party or the other party. Label maker supplied on request. We always want the quick answer. Judging by the bailout, I would say that’s not working out for us too well.

        • Smilee

          Our tax rates plus your private sector medical premiums together are quite higher than their taxes that pay for their health care,and they do not pay premiums hence a net savings for them. Simple arithmetic. Their taxes are higher but not double ours that’s a stretch and you know it.

          Fast Track this?? It has been studied and been on the table for over forty years, fast tracking is a myth thrown out by those who want to protect the status quo for those who have a vested interest and are only interested in their potential losses and care nothing about your health care which those with the vested interest have inflated and forced on us over the years and in effect is nothing more that legal theft because we failed to adequately regulate this abuse and now we have a mess on our hands that effects everyone’s pocketbook.

    • http://www.pridestarsfamily.com chuck

      reply to Alvin ?? death rate in Canada is 16% higher then ours . Wait time for an MRI or Cat Scan runs 2 to 3 months. In addition they do not have the tax base to support the demands for service so the only thing they can do is to ration health care. Get the point–I doubt it

      • Smilee

        Chuck
        All conservative fiction, you know nothing of the reality of the Canadian health care systems.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          Smilee, you made some good points in your reply back to me, and boy do I ever agree about the greed in both the pharmaceutical companies and the doctors and hospitals. It really should be much better, but unfortunately just like anywhere else, when you get large amounts of money, corruption is there. However I do have to disagree with you, in that I think we still have the best health care system in the world. But you are correct that it should not cost so much, the premiums should not cost so much and the portion the patient is left with should not cost so much. I have also found out something disturbing about this money thing with these doctors and hospitals. I know a guy that was in between jobs and had no insurance, and had to pay for it himself, had the same knee procedure I had, and because I had insurance, they billed my insurance company 3 times the amount the guy that was paying for it himself had to pay. Why then do they have the legality to triple bill the insurance company? It shouldnt be allowed, but I checked other things out and found out this is standard practice. What a bunch of crap. Its like having a license to legally rip off the insurance companies, whom Im sure know about this, and thats why our rates keep going up. Greed and corruption screw up an awful lot of stuff here, and guess what, you and I get to pay for it. Its not right. Of course we cant have our politicians correct it, because they are more corrupt taking money than these guys. Where does it stop.

      • http://donthaveone Mark

        The only thing Canada has that is better than what we have, is Labatt’s Blue Beer. Thats it. Even their hockey teams cant beat ours anymore. Good beer though, eh?

    • http://donthaveone Mark

      Ever looked into and studied countries that went to the socialism state? It didnt fare to well for them. Just a thought, that you might want to look into that before you think of having it here. They all failed.

    • http://donthaveone Mark

      Yes I agree, this is chasing bad money with good money. Our government is rewarding those who have proven again and again that they cannot properly run their business. On the other hand, if someone is really successful and does it right, the government declares them rich, slanders them in the public eye as an evil rich type, then taxes them to death. Its all wrong. What ever happened to rewards for achieving excellence? They are even doing to to our children, where they play a game and no one wins and no one loses, because they dont want to keep score and one team loses because the kids will feel bad. What? Whats the matter with the ones that win feeling good? Its all gone wrong, because of this stupid left wing liberal pacifist appeasing philosophy of political correctness, and its ruining this country. Some schools are banning having valedictorian’s and salutatorians, because instead of rewarding these students for excellence, they cite that it makes the other kids feel bad. Geez, when we get to be adults and go into the work force, maybe my employer should have to pay me what Alex Rodriguez makes, because I feel bad that he makes more than me. Its the same thing. Idiots.

    • DaveH

      Alvin,
      We already have a little socialism, in fact a lot of it. The mess we are in right now is because the government was leaning on the banks to lend money to marginal borrowers. The result was people paying prices for homes that they couldn’t really afford and then defaulting on their loans. I am sure they will ram national health care down our throats. After they have, pay careful attention to the results. Hopefully, it will be a learning experience for you.
      I have had Chronic Fatigue Immune Dyficiency Syndrome since I was 26. I worked 25 years being flu-like ill about 2 days a week on average. Did the government take any mercy on me?
      No, they taxed me big as they do anyone who works hard and makes a decent living. I worked contract labor most of my career which meant often times working far away from home. So, I had to pay to keep my place of residence and pay for shelter (usually motels) wherever I worked. There is a law allowing deductibility of temporary living expenses if your temporary job has a “definite” time span. But very few temporary jobs have a “definite” time span. Guess whose temporary jobs have a definite time span? Senators, Representitives, get the picture? The people in government almost always look out for themselves first, then their rich contributors next. This is true whether they are Democrats or Republicans.
      Another story …. I live in a fairly affluent neighborhood. I myself am struggling (with the help of my life partner) to keep our home. Anyway, it is a forested area, and the association is harassing people to keep their properties clear of underbrush. So, My neighbor found out that the fire department will clear his property for $100. The crew doing the work consists of about 10 people and it took about 8 hours to accomplish the task. I’m guessing they make about $10/hr or more so that amounts to about $800 worth of work leaving about $700 for the taxpayer. Ironic, isn’t it, that the affluent are getting help from the government? This is how it is with big government. The affluent people got there by working hard and/or being very resourceful. They are going to be the ones who know how to pull the right strings to get goodies from the government. The rest of us can eat cake.
      Don’t expect any more from national health care. There will just be more middle-men with secure enough jobs that they won’t need to worry about pleasing the customer. And the people who think they are going to get all that good care free are going to get a big surprise. If you don’t care enough about yourself to do what it takes to survive then why would you think someone who doesn’t even know or care about you is going to give a rats butt about you?

  • Gerald Romsa

    Unfortunately this expenditure of money and the consequent negative results have their root in past poor management. The ill conceived war in Iraq has been very costly without any real gains for America. America did not gain stronger ties for oil and gas deliveries from the Caspian area. The high oil and gas prices have revitalized Russia.
    Reduction of taxes with increasing expenditures have generated deficiets. Then their was the subprime disaster led by capitalism not socialism. The world suffered from the subprime bank failures. Chyrsler and GM problems arose from not rising to the challenge of more energy efficient vehicles. This is now compounded with massive bailouts for the banking and auto sectors. China has benefited from massive American investment which has weakened America and strengthened China. Two new adversaries and a debt ridden nation. Administrators, legislators,capitalists and the voting public are all at fault.

    • Doc KJR

      Yes, we have some of the least capable people in D.C. that could be elected, but that is just what can be expected when the majority of those who vote do not care about how much anything costs but just what they can get back from the government. The only way we can change things would be to go back to the way it was in the beginning of this country…only landowners voted, though now we could make it taxpayers…but this is exceedingly unlikely to happen. The subprime disaster was not capitalism at work, but election politics…those in power wanted to make sure voters could get a home and they adjusted lending rules and banks/lenders went along…it was not good capitalism to do this as it fell thru, and many people, including the most exposed banks lost a lot of money. Best to blame our system of electing those who promise the masses of freeloaders the most freebies than to blame the capitalist system which has made the USA the only country where you can earn your way out of poverty by hard work.

      • http://donthaveone Mark

        You know Doc, Ive never had it presented that way, but you are absolutely correct. Only those that pay taxes should be allowed to vote. Those that dont pay have to stake in it, as they just sit there with their hand out, and shouldnt be allowed to vote for the guy that is taking what I have and giving it to them. If you dont pay, you shouldnt be allowed to play. I agree totally. Good stuff.

    • http://donthaveone Mark

      When you brought up the subject of oil, it make me remember, how all I heard for years was Bush-Cheney and this war for oil. I dont see the oil, and I dont hear the lefties crying that anymore, and I never heard an apology admitting that they cried that just to get the American people mad at the Republicans. It was all political agenda, that the democratic press used to get Obama elected. Bush and his war for oil. What ever happened to the lefts cries about that. Hmm. And I for one, despise war, but Im all for this one. A sadistic torturing dictator has been put away and millions of people are free in a forming democracy. That is a good thing.

      • Smilee

        How about Iran, N Korea, Syria and others are you saying we should invade them as well, Mark the reason that Bush didn’t do that is that two did not have oil and the other would have been a much bigger war and he could not have possibly gotten the go ahead on the cost of that war from congress. Knocking off a old beat up dictator with no real military defenses left was a cake walk but he was dumb enough to not be able to figure out the bees nest he walked into and the bottom line is we are still in there making excuses for all that stupidity that resulted from his actions.

  • Jerry Lamason

    Now that the Obama administration has placed the country in an irreverseable debt, assumed the management of the auto industry, control the lending practices of the banks and a free economy, and put the unions back in the forefront of our capitalist business, I would recommend that the administration also manage the expanding evil muslim financial activities connected with the 3000 mosques and 30 terrorist camps in our country, and equally frightening the 300 madrassas that teach our children the islamic agenda and shariah law.

    • http://donthaveone Mark

      He may have a hand in them allready, who knows. Nobody knows who this guy really is. Thats the scariest part about him, Mr. Barry Soetoro.

  • Michelle

    it looks to me that we are becoming more UNAMERICAN AS THE DAYS GO BY, Obama is the most unamerican poor excuse for a president beside Jimmy Carter that I have ever seen, I for the first time in my life am scared to death for the future of this country, if a real american doesnt step in soon, we are doomed, I cant understand how socialisn and communism is okay in the Liberal Democrat mindset???? they just call it something else to be policically correct, what is it ?? oh yeah “PROGRESSIVE” talk about American haten SOB”S, If I had the money these SOB’s have I would give them a run for their money, unlike the spineless same mind set so called “REPUBLICANS” – I keep hearing about Joe Arpaio (I think I spelled that right) in Arizona he is a sheffif down there, Now that’s a real American, we need someone like that to run this country instead of running it into the ground.

  • http://personallibertydigest sherry

    I don’t know who told Alvin that Canada, UK,etc, have FREE health care, but he should check out the facts himself. They ALL pay for it, but have no control over it.

    • Smilee

      What control do you have on your plan here?????????

      • http://donthaveone Mark

        Pretty good Smilee my man, how you doing? I go where I want, when I want, whether it be a hospital, an emergency room, a doctors office, a stat care or redi-med, anyone I want to. I pay a 10 dollar co-pay, do my business, then leave. Insurance pays 80 percent of the balance, I pay 20 percent, all my needs are taken care of and met. Best health care in the world. No other country can touch what we have. In fact, many that live in countries with free health care, Canada, Austrailia etc, come here to the good Old US of A to have a surgery. Why do you think that is? Im not the sharpest pencil in the stack by no means, but its pretty easy for me to understand why. Also, after my 2000.00 yearly deductible is met, if Im unfortunate enough that year to incur this much, then 100 percent of it is paid, so nothing medically can devastate my finances. And I dont have to worry about dying while Im on some waiting list to get in, like what is going to happen if we go to socialized health care. Its a fact. It is presented as free, but dude, nothing is free. Someone is paying for it, and its my taxes as a working man that will be funding it, so all of us that are working be prepared for quite a tax rise on our income to fund this if it goes through. Its a fact. Thats how it is.

        • Smilee

          Mark

          Hello, you have much the same plan I had up to the year before I retired except no deductibles, same co-pay at doctors, more at urgent care and emergency rooms but it was managed care, although I had to go to network doctors and hospitals. Before the last year my plan had no deductible, co-pays but still network doctors but went without referrals as the last year. Now, I am on Medicare and pay $96.40 per month premium and I have purchased from the private sector a Medigap plan regulated by Medicare that costs me $185.00 per month I can go to any doctor, clinic or hospital including Mayo and Cleveland Clinics if I want, Pay for nothing but the premiums, I have health problems and have ongoing medical costs which are fully paid for by these two plans, no paper work. I just get statements from both giving the costs and what each paid and at the bottom a balance due of zero. It is the best coverage I have had in my life before HMOs and managed care programs I had Insurance but with mega paperwork I had do myself but the coverages where about the same as I have now. Other countries are better than ours, they also pay everything which makes it far superior to yours especially your plan with your high deductable + 20% and you do not mention your total premium costs that would be in addition to that. Rich persons in some of those countries come to places like the Mayo Clinic but thats about it and only because of their reputations few come here through.
          Did you know that Blue Cross is considering giving options for patient to go to India for surgery because it costs about 1/3 the cost of the surgery in the USA. Blue Cross will pay for transportation and hotels for patient and family member and they expect to save a lot of money by doing so. Other plans are also talking about it. The US is rated 37th in medical outcomes, that makes 36 countries showing better outcomes than our country. Most other countries medical costs per capita is about one half of ours and most cover all medical procedures and 36 including India with better outcomes. I know many people in Canada, UK and have over 200 relatives in Norway, my friends and relatives in Canada say your take on their plan is bogus, The ones in England only said they very much like their plan and Norway which has the best plan of the three rave about their care and think we are nuts the way we deliver health care here. A lot of plans today have gone to 70/30 with deductibles about the same as yours but with an out pocket maximums which your plan does not seem to have. Your plan is at best an average plan today but much worse than the plans we had 25 years ago and they where affordable premiums which most of these don’t. Family plans today are in the neighborhood of $2,500.00 per month, (That’s $30,000.00 per year albeit the employer often pays half or more of this) people pay taxes in other countries for many of their plans but no premiums and their plans cost to administer about half of ours. Wouldn’t it be better to pay $1,250.00 per month in taxes for full coverage and pay taxes in lieu of $3,000.00 per month for limited coverages here to the private sector, no its not free but much much cheaper. You are in total denial about our health care systems although 37 may be considered good by some and this is better than most countries it is still below 36 countries in quality and quality outcomes and about double the costs demonstrates clearly that far we are far from the best health care in the world. Corporate control of our private health care today has driven the costs up from affordable to no longer affordable and driven down coverages and quality and thus millions without any health care costs which the government has picked up on many of these with a big cost to the government and thus us taxpayers. Reform will bring down the costs after transition costs but of course that will also lower the excessive profits and administration cost by the private sector and thats what motivates thier lies and huge lobby costs to try and minimize their losses because they know change is coming. Medicare administration costs are about 8%, private plans range administration costs range from about 25%-40% before profits. Conservatives in their worship of corporations thus blindly support these polices and the corporate greed that goes with it. Medicare went into effect in the sixties, my dad retired in 1965 and went on medicare at no time since have I not had family members on Medicare and in 2003 I went on it, no waiting ever, no questions asked with a supplement plan no costs beyond premium costs. Medicare funding needs attention but is very manageable with modest changes but conservatives want to kill these plans as well thus all the horror stories from them that those of who use Medicare services no full it is all BS. Are you really happy to pay so much more for health care just so the corporations can make mega bucks on the suffering of so many. I see the issue as corporate greed vs the individuals health care and today many in our society find themselves in this boat and many are employed full time.

        • Smilee

          Mark Reply:
          July 16th, 2009 at 7:44 am

          Smilee, you made some good points in your reply back to me, and boy do I ever agree about the greed in both the pharmaceutical companies and the doctors and hospitals. It really should be much better, but unfortunately just like anywhere else, when you get large amounts of money, corruption is there. However I do have to disagree with you, in that I think we still have the best health care system in the world.

          Explain why you think it is the best when we are now rated 37th, we have some serious quality concerns in our health care system, as well as access etc.

          But you are correct that it should not cost so much, the premiums should not cost so much and the portion the patient is left with should not cost so much. I have also found out something disturbing about this money thing with these doctors and hospitals. I know a guy that was in between jobs and had no insurance, and had to pay for it himself, had the same knee procedure I had, and because I had insurance, they billed my insurance company 3 times the amount the guy that was paying for it himself had to pay. Why then do they have the legality to triple bill the insurance company? It shouldnt be allowed, but I checked other things out and found out this is standard practice. What a bunch of crap. Its like having a license to legally rip off the insurance companies, whom Im sure know about this, and thats why our rates keep going up. Greed and corruption screw up an awful lot of stuff here, and guess what, you and I get to pay for it. Its not right. Of course we cant have our politicians correct it, because they are more corrupt taking money than these guys. Where does it stop.

          If not politicians then who, without laws and regulations that only they can make then these private sector payers and providers are totally free to keep ripping us all off and making it impossible for many to have health care at all, if you do not think there is mega corruption in the corporate health care world that runs the private sector health care system your badly mistaken, You get a vote for your representative but no say or vote in the corporate world except through your representatives in congress. As Barrack (I’m paraphrasing) said in his inaugural speech, it isn’t big government or small government that matters it is good government. To me being against government is like being against yourself as it is the only venue you have to air your grievances through. We need to restore better government and it does not help if all people want to do is destroy it, its not what government is doing to you it is what you are doing to government, bad government reflects a bad people. Trust me if congress does not reform our health care system then it will not get done and we all will surely pay dearly for that.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          As much as I mistrust the doctors, hospitals, lawyers and insurance companies, I mistrust congress and the democrats even more Smilee. Their actions have continually been detrimental to this country, and everything they touch expands government, taxes the people more, and keeps the poor people down. They want to give the impression that they are the poor guys and the republicans are the rich guys, but if you look at them, they are filthy rich and own everything, and they step on the poor guy constantly, by giving them these little hand outs and this keeps people down. Sorry, you can like them and trust in them, but I cant. Maybe back in Kennedy’s day, but not now.

  • http://www.MicahPeak.org Jeff Brodhead

    Of course the obvious outcome indicates the obvious intent.
    I understand Obama taught Constitutional Law (easy to forget, when his actions speak so loudly), so he is educated enough to see the obvious.
    Since this is obvious AND he obviously knows it to be so, doesn’t that constitute an intensional attack on the USA.
    If you and I say the wrong thing, we can be jailed. Soon, if “Hate-Crime” legislation is enacted (a violation of our rights to equal protection), our only defence will be massive rebellion, to overwhelm the ‘legal’ system. As far as the liberals are concerned, that legislation seems to be a done deal.
    The potential for Cap & Enslave, plus supposed government imposed health insurance, plus every other destructive imposition the Obamites can dream up, will grind America to financial dust. This proves intent.
    Putting an idiot in charge of DHS, who calls Americans “Right-Wing Extremist” and potential terrorists, because they speak out against abortion, or homosexual marriage, etc. proves intent.
    Obama calling the Quran ‘holy’, while calling the Bible obsolete, proves intent.
    Obama refusing to participate in the National Day of Pray, but hosting a party for the homo-activists in the White Whore House, proves intent.
    Majority in the House, majority in the Senate, the white house…total control of the FERAL government. This is a takeover by hostile forces.
    If you are a business owner and you know which employees voted for the Obamites, they should be first on the list for discharge (not race, not sexual deviancy, etc..) simply profile based on their vote, or opinion, just like DHS recommends.
    [If you are a business owner and you voted for Obama et al, welcome to your self-made hell.]
    If America is going to have to put our collective foot down anyway, why wait?

    • http://donthaveone Mark

      Dude, its like this. All Obama knows is what his teleprompter tells him to say. Thats it.

  • Rodolfo RiveraSandoval

    You affirm that among other consequences “…will be the significant erosion of our individual rights.” How?

    • DaveH

      Rodolfo,
      The bigger government gets, the more laws get passed, the more they tread on everyone’s life choices.
      I’ll give you an example. Many states have passed helmet laws for motorcyclists. Do you know what the main excuse is for those that advocate helmet laws? “Why should we pay for their medical costs when they get their brains bashed?”.
      Already some localities are banning trans-fats for the health problems they are believed to cause. And the excuse for this intrusion into our personnal choices? Of course, “Why should we pay for their health care costs when they don’t take care of themselves?”
      If National Health care gets passed, expect a lot more of the same. As a professor of mine once said “We can abstain from caffienated drinks, cigarettes, candy, and other detrimental but enjoyable habits. We may not live any longer, but it sure will seem like it!”.

  • s c

    America will suffer until enough people (especially b o backers) learn that this crap isn’t about politics. This is the result of minds that have no clue. As wacko as Washington can be, we still have many airheads who think nothing is ever bad, and that life goes on without consequences. When China and Russia tell us ‘not to go down that path’ (and our elected weasels won’t dare listen), the option list gets short fast. On the whole, b o doesn’t know squat about anything, or he doesn’t care. This time, America will learn a bitter lesson about tolerating another FDR/’dear leader’. The first one made the Depression worse. This one will gladly destroy America’s economy, and expect us to keep him and his merry band of useful idiots in office.
    Where’s Robin Hood when you need him?

    • Smilee

      Robin Hood was a fictional character and so is conservatism here in this country at the present time.

      • http://donthaveone Mark

        And that is so, so sad. I miss our country having morals. We have digressed so much. We used to be able to turn to the Republicans for conservatism, but they have gotten away from it so much it makes me sick. The democrats are so liberal, I cant even bear to think of dancing with them. I guess my hope now is that the Libertarians or some other third American Party would form, where candidates would actually represent America, and not just do things to make the other party look bad. Or even worse, say false things to make the other guy look bad. Democrats are the master of that. But when your lineup card features names like Kennedy, Pelosi, Reid, Feinstein, Boxer, Dean, Edwards, Kerry , Clinton, Shummer, Daschle, Dodd and Franken, what do you expect.

        • Smilee

          Mark Reply:
          July 16th, 2009 at 2:05 pm

          GREAT GREAT THINGS!!!! Dry your tears, Give it time you will see things get much much better, I too use to be one of those conservative republicans until the far right extremists hacks took over the party and it looks like they are the only ones left still in the party now and they are blaming all their mistakes on those who left or have been forced out and many are even such cowards that they deny they are republicans so it make it easier to blame those they disavow and blame. When the big shots of the party have Cheney saying Powell has left the party and Powell says Hell no, I am still here, so as long as you people fighting amongst yourselves you will be in the wilderness for a long long time. Suits me find, I spend 7 years on the GOP executive board in MN before I saw the error of their ways and left. I was a republican until age 52 then left it and have never been sorry and now am active in the DFL party and found real practicing Christians and loads of people that do not hate everything and everybody they do not agree with it. These people do not whine or bitch about their opponents all the time but when you listen to conservatives define us you would never know it. I can honestly tell you I have found only a handful in this party who act or think as the conservatives define them. When I was in the republican party (after the mid eighties when they stole the old republican party and it took them about twenty years to destroy the party) hate talk was all they would talk about and their actions where horrible except when the press was present then they acted like good little kids. You seem also very unhappy too, that’s what most of the republicans in charge when I quit the party where too albeit I doubt they missed church on Sundays.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          In reply Smilee, no, you misread me. I am a very happy person, who has Jesus Christ in my life, and I know all in all, He is in control, not the republicans or the democrats. But in my human flesh, yeah, Im angry at what both parties have become, looking our for themselves, instead of for our country and the people, which is what they were elected to do. Yes, that makes me angry, and thats why I for one, am going to use my right to vote, and vote against every Republican incumbant I can, and I hope that those that call themselves democrats, will bring themselves to do the same thing, as these career politicians have overstepped their bounds, and have set up bad things, and it is high time they go.

    • http://donthaveone Mark

      And what a lot of people, especially old democrats like my parents who think FDR was the best ever, was that the guy was a lying cheating squandrel that lied to congress and the people over and over to get his way, and we are still paying today for his misdeeds, especially federal income tax that was never signed into law, but because of FDR, we are paying it every week. He appeared like he save this country, and what he did was mortgage its future for many many decades. I dont care what ones politics are, Ronald Reagan straightened us out, set our course straight, stood us upright, and made us strong again, and no one has tried to follow the correct course that he showed us to use to make things good. Why?

  • Terry

    I’m afraid the genie is out of the socialistic lamp. Once elected by a dumbed down electorate (see our school system) we, the responsible generation are going to be shown the exit (see government rationed healthcare). As far as the socialist mindset goes, we’ve had our time, now it is theirs. The biggest problem with that mindset is the individual willing to take risk for financial gain, hire people to help him earn his dream and battle through the burocracy, is not included in the socialist plan.(see China, 25% unemployment, Russia, similar numbers.)
    The old addage “Life is not fair and then you die” is being accellerated with this administration. Their idea for saving social security ( that they have been explicit in raiding for years) is kill off the old folks, so we don’t have to pay them. Where is AARP? Oh! Sorry, they lean pretty heavily to the left as well.
    Wake up America. You’ll barely recognise what you see when you awaken from your passive slumber.
    I love the ideals of America! Don’t let us be robbed of them!

  • Vernie

    I am a woman…white, straight, fiscal conservative, but moderate on some social issues. I was raised in a Christian home, with conservative Democrats, taught to love my country, respect the military, the flag and the American way of life. I am a registered Republican and did not vote for Obama in the last election.
    I too, am disturbed by what’s happening to our beloved country under this current administration. I detest the mainstream media and what it’s allowed to get away with.The average American, who does not get their news anywhere but from that kind of media, is not getting the straight scoop….period! So there are a lot of Americans who are being lied to on a daily basis. They don’t realize that this country is quickly becoming a socialist state….that under this president, we will be part of a global world order. Our great military will be dismantled and we will be “sitting ducks” for the many terrorists countries and organizations around the world. Our health care system will be government controlled and yes…it might be just wonderful for every citizen to have medical coverage, but if the care we get is poor, and we must wait for tests and surgical procedures, and people die while waiting for something that could have saved their lives a year before….what’s the point? I was once married to a physician. I know what top notch medical care looks like. I also know what less than excellent care looks like, and it often happens when people are solely on Medicaid or Medicare, without supplemental insurance. That my friends, is government controlled medicine, and I’m not saying it’s a required policy, it just is what it is. My thinking is, that good, conscientious doctors will get out of medicine, and that those kinds of people will not go into medical schools. We’ll be getting second or third rate physicians, and our care as we’ve known it will no longer exist.
    In commenting to what the prior person, Aman, wrote regarding Obama’s childhood and upbringing….I read everything available to read about Obama’s background, and I was very disturbed to know who many of his mentors were, and suspicious of how a poor mixed race child of a single white mother, was able to end up going to the best schools and colleges, and was obviously groomed and primed for the position he is in today. I mean, who has a relatively unremarkable professional history, speaks at the Democrat convention and becomes president of the United States four years later? Who’s doing the grooming, planning and controlling? That all said, I never heard he was sexually abused by his mentors, or that he has complete disregard for God. He has different views on religion, hence the 20 years in Rev. Wright’s church, but I think that’s a bit extreme. What’s even more extreme is, the comment about, “if anyone finds him smart”, they’re uneducated, on drugs, sexually deviant, perverted and gay. I think he’s much more educated than I am, but I don’t think he has any more intelligence than I do. I don’t trust him to be our president, and I don’t agree with him on much at all, but I can’t say he’s not smart. I’ll have you know that I am none of the things that you accuse people of being if they think he’s smart. AND….I am sick to death of people putting gay people in the same catagory as satanic or perverted. I have some wonderful gay friends who are better people than many straight people I know. They are dear friends and I love them as I do any other dear friend.They’re responsible, decent, talented and caring Americans. They don’t prey on little children, and they’re not having sex on every street corner. There are perverted people out there who might be, but they’re straight, gay, black, white, brown, male and female. Gays are not automatically perverted anymore than straight people are. Perversion is not exclusive to gays. I have never publically spoken out on the gay subject, but I felt I had to in this case. Incidentally, I am totally convinced that a gay person is born a gay person. They have no more control over that than any of us who were born straight. Many of them try to “be straight” since it’s socially acceptable, but eventually find the truth. Sometimes they can handle it and sometimes they cannot. Parents who disown their children who “come out” to them, should be ashamed. Granted, maybe it isn’t what you had hoped for in your child, but they need your love and understanding as much or more, than your so called normal children. Disowning your child because they’re gay is extreme. Extremes are what create the problems we have in this country….actions and reactions. I’ve never liked extreme anything. (other than extreme disdain for the current mainstream media)Things that are unbalanced don’t operate well, and that includes everything, without balance…..which takes me back to politics. That is why we have always had at least, a two party system…..so there’s balance. This current president and his administration are so far left….and have recently become fillibuster proof, which allows them to try to shove as much as possible down the throats of the American citizens as quickly as possible. They’re certainly taking advantage of that, and it’s frightening. When Obama was elected there were almost as many Americans who voted for someone else. Right now there are many people who regret having voted for him, and are seeing the outcome of that choice. In the midterm elections in 2010, I’m sure they’re will be signifigant changes, and in 2012, Obama and the far left will be unelected. It is my hope for….. change.

    • Robin from Indiana

      Vernie… I agreed with everything you said except your opinion on gays. I do not believe they are born that way. God has given us choices and they have not made a good choice. The Bible calls it sin. Your political views were great. You articulated the Obama issue very well. I also believe he is educated, but not smart. He is a puppet. As a Democrat turned Republican, I am fearful for our country. I only hope this wide road he is leading us down can be corrected when he gets voted out of office. I don’t even know if America can take four years of his administration!

      • http://google fogey60

        i am a 60 year old retired veteran(disabled) and in my earlier days was also a democrat. but i am not blind as the younger generation seems to be. i can see the progressive erosion of the Constitution and our way of life and it makes me sad for my children and grand children to see our country the way it has become
        we are now slaves to the new world order that will be ushered in probably before 2012 .both democrat and republican each one head of the two headed beast the book of revelation tells of. remember in the last days the whole world WILL be deceived and it sure seems we are there the only chance we have is to put our trust back in god and be independent and vote foe someone who would make a good leader, if any exist any more.

    • http://donthaveone Mark

      Dont fear Honey, 2012 he will be gone. However, the left wing liberal pacifist appeasers own ABC, NBC, CBS, CNN and MSNBC, and your are right about them lying. The general public will never get the truth from these guys, because they only have one interest, and its not delivery the news as they are supposed to do. Their interest is to spread propaganda about the republicans, and to make the democrats look good. The second part is hard to do, and cant be done. The first part, well, they spread enough propaganda about WMD’S, War for oil, False war for oil, losing the war, Bush did this, Bush did that, that the uneducated American public bought into it, then they raised up this young decent looking guy shouting change, change, change, and again, the uneducated American public bought into it, and now look whats happening. Its downright terrible. A lot of his own are turning on him, but most are so stubborn that they wouldnt admit to their guilt if you filmed them doing it. Diehard left wing liberal pacifist appeasers will go to their graves being wrong and never admit it. Its always someone elses fault. Its so easy to play the victim, and thats what lefties do. But relax, 2012 will get here in time, and these bozo’s are gone. Heck, I truly believe his own kind will devour him and try to get Hillary in there, and then it will be even worse if America drinks that kool-aid. The only hope is if the Republicans find their way back to being the consevatives they are supposed to be, or a new party rises up. Either way though, Obama is gone. I guarantee it.

      • Roger R. collins

        I keep hoping you are right. The only problem is if the economy is destroyed and our Healthcare system has been dismantled, what do we have. 2010 is critical to slowing down the castastophe of a train. About the only thing I agree with “Smiley” is I believe the Medicare system works well. Too bad despite his extensive blathering his health care will suffer along with the rest of us. Medicare/Medicaid is the real goal of Obama’s group. If this program goes forward along with Cap and Trade we are lost for decades. Haven’t seen anything regarding Congress and their families being exempt from the Kennedy plan. Probably wants good coverage since he has serious medical conditions.

  • ONTIME

    There is nothing unintended about the agenda for the policy of this administration to be implemented, they want control and they will go to any extreme to achieve this plan they have in store for the control of American and it’s destiny. The Cap and Trade scheme is a control freaks dream, the National Healthcare fraud is a way of making you a dependent on this huge growing goverment and ingesting tax money at a phenomenal rate thereby stealing from the ability of this country’s security and debilitating the military, Climate change is a natural documented historical occurence, these socialistic yahoos are making it out to be a hysterical moment and that only they can fix the climate and the CO2 because they are much smarter than everyone who disagrees with them. Should you disagree, you will be put out of the way in order for them to continue to make your life quality miserable.

    • http://donthaveone Mark

      But please dont underestimate God in this my friend. Obama and the democrats arent in control. God is. It’ll be allright. This should be a wake up call to Americans to start paying attention to things, lest we do something one day and it will be too late to change it.

  • Allan

    All Americans who dont want to be Socialists, dont want to be part of an international order and want a sovereign nation need to start discussions about revolution and or secession whether it be by peaceful or violent means, preferably the former, although the latter can not be ruled out. Our constitution is being attacked from the inside and we have the right to defend and live by it. I served in the military and I took an oath to protect and defend our constitution and country from all enemies foreign and domestic Never in my wildest dreams did I think the enemy would turnout to be domestic. We have been complacent about the education of our children. We let the liberals take over teaching (brain washing) and then wonder why college graduates cannot name their own senators and representatives, but can extol on the virtues of Marxism. Barack Obama has still not provided a birth certificate proving he is a natural born citizen and his family in Kenya still asserts he was born there!! whats up with that? He may be president in violation of the constitution. The left leaning Media is not going to report anything on this issue and in fact has hid it from the American people. You can bet if anyone other than a far left liberal couldn’t prove his or her birthright the media would still be screaming and would have been out with steam shovels to unearth the truth. It is possible, that eventually, a physical division of this country may be the only solution short of a revolution and violent overthrow of the current status quo. Too many americans have fought and died to keep our constitutional freedoms safe, for them to be given up, so meekly now. The media would call me mean spirited and so be it, but I do question the Patriotism currently in Washington and it is not only on the left of the aisle that I do so. (Arlen Spector aka me, myself and I) Where are the Patriots to speak out against the unamerican activities taking place at this time in Washington. The people want the Fed looked at and we are being told we are not allowed to? The Fed is a PRIVATE consortium of Bankers who have Americas financial life in their hands and for all we know, they could have and I say, most likely have, ripped us off and continue to do so. The situation is just too ripe for abuse and to think none has taken place is absurd. I mean the current financial shape of our country should tell us as americans that congress and the banks cant be trusted, need to be checked on, and the Media for the most part is just another wing of the democratic (is that an oxymoron) party and is not doing its job. God Bless, stay strong
    The only difference between Liberal and communist/socialist is the name. It is also why the left liberals are so hell bent on disarming america. We can not let this happen. An armed American populace insures a strong, free country and the reason the framers put the right to bear arms is in the constitution.

    • Floyd

      Allen,well spoken. I to have taken the oath to defend the constitution from all enemies. But what is going on now ,I expected to happen. Don’t give up on this country yet.

    • Rjquick

      Take a look at who owns the various media. I am sure you can find info on one of the search engines.
      RJQ

      • Smilee

        Big corporations now own all the media outlets except PBS thats why you get corportate BS from all of them including Fox

      • http://donthaveone Mark

        Come on man, the democrats own everything. They are ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN and MSNBC. There are 10 times as many rich democrats as there are republicans. Through their lying media and big city newspapers also that they own, ie the LA Times and the NY Times to name a couple, they have convinced the poor black community that they are for the poor and down trodden, and that the Republicans are all a bunch of rich white guys. It couldnt be farther from the truth. Republicans have done way, way more for folks of color that the Democrats have ever thought to do. Way more. A republican president freed the black man. Republicans let the way to civil rights, that the democrats fought to not give you. The only reason Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson proport to be democrats, is because these guys line their pockets with cash to keep you following them. Those two should not be followed by anybody, I dont care what color you are. They are scumbags, and the things they say and do prove it. They have so called “love children” running around. They are Reverends? Hows that work? They stir up racial strife everywhere they go, collect a bag of money, then head out of town on the first bus they can find, with the bag of money. Where it comes from that the Republicans are the rich guys and the Democrats the poor guys, I dont know. Even back to Kennedy’s days, he was born a rich white boy, a child of privilege, and someone you folks related to him because he spoke well and looked good. I just dont know what the connection is that the black community continues to vote democrat, when they have done nothing for you. They never have, and they never will. They want to keep you down, and dependant on them, and they always have and always will. Thats what they do. Look at the track record. I rest my case.

  • http://yahoo.com clsygrm

    My take on all of this is: our country is going to hell in a handbasket! Our elected officials don’t give a rats ass about the people who voted them into their offices from the president down! Obama was born in Kenya, got a legit Hawaiian birth certificate while the state was in the throes of becoming a state, and is still a Muslim! Shari Law, as written in the Koran, is demeaning towards all women regardless of age, gives men total control over them and condemns them w/o due process if they err – are raped, molested, etc, etc. The men who rape, molest, etc, are not prosecuted as that isn’t what is written in Shari Law. Unless there are 7 witness’s who SEE the rape, molestation or whatever, the woman’s tale is just that – a TALE to be ignored and she is sentenced to ‘stoning until dead’. I had a hard time finding it, but I did find a very good article on Shari Law.

    Obama is hell bent for leather to turn our country into bedlam just like he did with Kenya when he visited and started his ‘change’ rhetoric. He doesn’t have any love for the country of his birth and non for this – his adopted country. I don’t think he was ever really ‘nationalized’ so, in my opinion, he is still a Kenyan British Subject who lied repeatedly to the population of this country and others about his birthright, father, step-father and life in general. He was adopted by his step-father – Soetoro – used that name to enter Occidental College in CA as a non-citizen so he could get a free education! Shows he knew how to play the welfare game enough to get his start in education on the tax payer $$’s. Then, he goes to Pakistan on someone else’s visa and passport and comes back and enters Harvard on somebody’s $$’s!

    As President of this country, Obama has consistently lied to the public and our legislative body has condoned his every move! Shows just what spineless elected officials we have in Congress. Just a bunch of self-made pork barrelers who don’t care about us and are just in it for the ‘money’, free medical and perks that come with their offices!

    As Obama takes away our freedom, some of our population put their heads in the sand as they don’t want to know as if ignorance is bliss! Socialism has no freedoms for the people, no representation for the people and the people are slaves to the tax platform that has to be paid or face the penalties of jail or death or both. We won’t be able to go to church as those will be absolved as unnecessary – look at Russia. Guns will be outlawed as people with guns can rebel against the government. Free speech won’t be tolerated as that would be allowing the public to speak out against the dictator of the socialism government – look at Russia, China, Cuba, etc.

    Medical will only be for those rich enough to buy an appointment. The rest of us will be just so much ‘chopped liver’, but we’ll still be required to pay taxes for insurance that we won’t be able to afford to use as we won’t have enough money left for the office visit. Operations will only be performed for the ‘select few’ that are deemed ‘curable’ so the rest of us will have to ‘just tough it out’ and die! Sure gets rid of the elderly and infirm in our country. Great way for genocide to be accomplished w/o guns! When we can’t speak out against this genocide of our elderly and anyone else who gets cancer, we will only be able to wail and lament our grief!

    So people, take a real good look at past history and review how socialism got its start toward communism. It’s all there in the ‘old’ history books that used to be taught in our schools.

    As for our $$’s, the dollar hasn’t been backed by gold since Lyndon B. Johnson. We have been very lucky that our dollar has been stable for so long. With Obama printing tons of paper money to choke our economy to death, the dollar is going to fail and inflation is going to skyrocket! Those who are rich enough to buy gold will be the truly lucky people as that is going to be the ‘real’ currency of the ‘New World Government’ that Obama, Pelosi, Prince Charles and other world leaders are working their collective butt’s off to put into place. A One World Government, One World Healthcare System, One World Currency, One World Ghestopo – Police Force is what we are looking at being formed. As far as I can discern from reading articles, Obama is part of “The Great Deception” and “The Great Deceiver”. It is written in Revelations that the Eagle’s wings will be clipped. Our great country is going downhill and we won’t be a ‘super’ power anymore. We are being relegated and subjacted into a 3rd world super poor country with no freedoms, no jobs and no money. And Obama still allows the illegal immigrants amnesty – but that is due to his idea of boundaries starting at the bottom of Mexico and ending at the top of Canada with Kansas City as the main terminal point in the hemisphere.

    We need to protest, protest and protest and do it in Washington in front of the White House so that we are noticed, not ignored. Our media is in Obama’s bed, or so it seems as they don’t report the truth, just what their owners tell them to!

    • Dora

      Hi: Could NOT have said it better no matter how hard I tried! AMAN!

    • http://donthaveone Mark

      And as far as these 3rd world countries go, we have allowed them to suck the life out of us ever since we got into the United Nations. We pay for all this crap. Why? All the shit they decide to do, the US funds it, with our money. Why? This is insane. We sit there with all these little terrorists bastards, and the decided to do this and to do that, then tell us to pay for it and we do. Unbelievable. We need to get out of the UN last year.

  • http://yahoo.com clsygrm

    Vernie: I am also a white woman and went to college on my $$’s. I raised 4 kids by myself and no just how hard it is to keep food on the table and a decent roof overhead and make sure kids keep the rules and have good friends. I haven’t found anything to say that Obama had such a bad life – he was adopted by his step-father, sent to the best Jihead schools, doted on by his white grandparents and seemed to have a rather normal life. At age 12 he became ‘anti-white’ when he found white people had more rights than he where he was being raised at that time.

    Rev. Wright preached anti-white hate in his Church of which Obama was a member for 20 yrs, according to his rhetoric. If that had been a ‘white’ church, the Rev. would have been jailed for his ‘hate’ crimes! Preaching hate is not just a ‘white’ crime, it is also a ‘black’ crime!

    I don’t feel that Obama had a bad life while growing up. I know of many other children in different parts of this country who have lived through much worse and came out on top! Loretta Lynn came from very humble beginnings and made it big. Kids from my school who weren’t rich made it big. I came from a poor household and I’m ok! I have made lots of money and not-so-much money in my lifetime, however, I don’t begin to say that I was abused, neglected or whatever to get ahead in life. I worked hard, went back to school, worked harder and kept my kids off the streets and out of gangs – that’s not always easy.

    With the New World Government that Obama and other world leaders want, our way of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness is going down the toilet and will never be allowed back. If you want a Socialistic Government, Obama and the rest of our money grubbing greedy legislators are your ticket to poverty and worse!

  • http://none Rod

    OK and her is one – Michelle on a world tour that is costing the American people
    MILLIONS. We can and will beat these lefties by voting in a Republican Congress.

  • http://none Rod

    The Republican party needs to stand up and fight back. Even the Dems. that
    voted this dude into office are protesting. They say they didn’t know this is what
    he meant when he said, “change”? Well, it’s late but, NOT TOO LATE!

  • kimberly13

    Totally agree with ED. You people are crying over spelling? No wonder your in a huff. I mean spelling is so important. joke. Bring all the guns to church, maybe you can have a shoot out. Maybe you can kill Wolves and Bears while your at it. The Constitution has be written and re-written over and over. Grow up, get over it. It’s a shame that instead of worrying about the Planet and what’s important for the next generation your spending time crying about guns. America still has to put up with cave dwellers. Instead of being the leader of the free world, after the Bush League finished, we’ve become the joke. Oh wouldn’t it had been great if McCain and Palin were in office. We probable would have had a civil war. It seems Palin’s priest/witch doctor couldn’t cast the demons out. It’s a new day people, deal with it. Think about the children and what’s happening to the Earth. Thanks big time to the last administration. The one that God talked to. There’s medication for that. Bush was probable on when he sat for 5-7 minutes while we were under attack. What’s wrong with you people? Was Bush your god? So extremely sad that there are still people that refuse to acknowledge that it’s a very different time and everyone must work together if we are to save the Earth for future generations. Or doesn’t that matter to cave men and women? So keep crying about guns, oh that’s so important. Never mind that the Planet is in big time trouble, you just keep on the road your on. Remember the old saying “what goes around, comes around?” We folks like you unfortunately are the one’s that saying was made for. Don’t bother knocking me, cause your really not worth the energy to answer back to. I feel so sorry for you and yours, your priorities are backwards, but then a lot of you know that, your just scared to admit it. So while you praying to whom ever you believe in, (besides yourself) ask if you really know the answers. Or better yet, ask what medication Bush was on when he sat while we were being attacked, maybe it’ll work for you too.
    Kimberly13

    • Dora

      Hi: The reason this country has not already gone to communism is because of the private citizens owning guns and those dirty RATS are planning to take that away so they can cram those communist/Marxist/Socialist ideologies down our throats. You need to be concerned about them too.

      • kimberly13

        Hi,
        Sorry I don’t believe in what you said. If Socialism was the way to go it would have happened along time ago. I still believe in America and her people. It’s not going to happen. It’s when people make comments like that, that intend to scare folks. Fear is the first step in taking away freedom. I’m not scared, I’m free and I doubt that the American people would ever allow that to happen. Get off the fear tactics and start working for the next generation and our Planet.
        Kimberly13

        • Urban Underbrink

          You are not paying attention to what is happening, and soon it will be too late to do anything about it. Not “scare tactics” just Common Sense. Read the book!

    • Robin from Indiana

      I’ll bet you believe Al Gore and the Global Warming hoax, too.

    • kimberly13

      To whomever,
      your no named comment about my not believing Al Gore and Global Warming?
      Who were you talking too? I’m the one who said the Planet needs help not guns. If you don’t know what your talking about, don’t. You made a complete fool out of yourself and didn’t even leave a name, coward.
      Kimberly13

  • Roro

    Rob makes sense, he is correct and to add to that thought The Republicans haven’t paid for a single tax cut since 1981, coupled with outragious defense spending has Ballooned the National debt from a mere 900 billion dollars in 1980 (managable)to 12 Trillion..(Nearly impossible to pay down now)…Tax cuts for the top end and massive spending increases lead to massive deficits, thereby cutting the spending power of the dollar..The US dollar is worth 15 cents because the fed has been over inflating the money supply drastically since 1981..(that is one of the reasons most things have to be offshored because you cannot afford to build anything anymore here in the good ole USA…the dollar is worthless !!!)I am not saying the Democrats are much better, but since then every time they get into the white house they have to deal with a martket manipulated Boom Bust cycle < the latter usually the case..(Interest Rate manipulations to create housing booms and credit expansions).To say Bush did a good job is insane….When Bush took office the United States budget was 1.6 Trillion Dollars, when he left office it was 3.2 Trillion. This crew doubled the size of the Fed (homeland securtity/ prescription drug coverage/ military spending/ Tax cuts (UNFUNDED) with a slight majority for 6 years….They also doubled the size of the National debt, no surprise…Wake up people stop listening to the Media and educate yourselves, we live in a 1 party system now, it masquerades as a 2 party system…A corporate controlled corprotacracy, merged into one to cover for each others massive corruption…John F. Kennedy had tremendous forsight with regards to these matters, that is why they killed him… He was already printing united states notes over the Federal Reserves head,(even though the debt wasn’t a problem then, he could see what it would eventually lead to) was to expand that massively..He stirred up so much shit behind the scenes in three short years that he even said he was a marked man and planned to drop LBJ from the ticket and bring Bobby in as his Vice so they would think twice about doing away with him… Just the tax loophole he intended to take away from the Oil company monopolies alone would have cost them Trillions….NOt to mention ending the CIAs covert worldwide manipulations of dictatorships to put corporate friendly murderous puppet dictators in place…Rush savage and the like are all paid for by the same people that control things, although sometimes they make sense they really are only trying to get us to fight amungst ourselves and to blurr the real truth so that the gravy train continues while the rest of us are too busy working our brains out to make that 15 cents on the dollar cover the 21 percent interest they are charging you on your credit card LOL….

    • Smilee

      Don’t know about all of your theories, but agree it is corporate control of the government at least congress that is ruining our country and not the fictions the conservatives want us to believe, they believe the little man is doing it when if they could think would realize the little ones never have power.

  • DaveH

    I don’t know why the people on this board (including myself) bother responding to those who advocate bigger government. They are basing their comments on Hopes and Dreams and it is a waste of our time to debate them. We aren’t going to change their minds. Meanwhile the resulting tirades are just clouding the discussions of freedom that this board was created for. I really enjoy reading the discussions on freedom but I have to wade through so much chaff from the Dreamers that it is wearing me out. Of course, that is what the Dreamers probably want — to drown out the voices of the freedom-lovers.

    • Michelle

      AMEN Dave H xoxoxo

  • http://www.obamacrimes.com Chase

    I am a Michael Savage Fan and Liberalism Is A Mental Disorder he had on his show last year before the election he had Phillip Berg on from Pernnsylvania an Democrat Attorney who showed the Microsoft Word which 47 years ago there was no computer Obama’s false birth certificates in Microsoft Word, when Obama went to visit his Grandmother who raised him before she died he paided off 2 Hawaiian Hospitals too never reveal those false birth certificates, Rusty Humphries is in Hawaii now trying too get at the truth, Anne Dunham, Obamas radical mother her water broke in Kenya, so that is where his real birth certificate is Mr Berg took this to The Justice Dept they ruled against the truth and said there would be rioting in the streets if Obama did not take office so we are stuck with a man who’s Term Paper at Columbia was on the USSR Stalin and Lenin he also was fascinated with Hitler and believe me all The Jewish people who voted for him I bet they are regretting there votes everyone I have spoken too is petrified of the way our Country is headed,and Marizm is close st hand I have friends who have left the Country. The health care sytem is horrible in Canada my best friend lives there her father waited 8 months to fid out he had a brain tumor they told him 8 months before surgery he would have been dead but they took him to Buffalo New York he had it removed they are attempting to sue the Canadian Gov .They are planning on taking duel citizenship also the cancer death rate is 50% higher in Canada than America that was on the news and the Canadian medication is not always the same as ours is the quality is old and poor.

    • Smilee

      The lower and appeal courts dismissed Philip Bergs lawsuit witch he filed against Obama and others regarding his Birth Certificate, he appealed it all the way to the US Supreme Court and they voted to refuse to hear it and let the dismissals of the lower courts stand.. Thus his argument is over and done with.No lawsuit, He failed!!!!!!!!!!
      I read his law suit (its on line) his arguments where very poorly written and produced no sources of evidence only allegations of some very weird stuff. Never mentioned what you say he showed on TV not can I find any evidence posted anywhere on the internet to support any of his claims. If it existed I have no doubt you would find it all over the Internet. Until you produce it I conclude Its all fiction. I will not say more all the fictions you espouse are so unbelievable only and idiot could believe them.

      • DaveH

        Smilee,
        You don’t find it interesting that during Obama’s campaign he denied the Muslim unbringing that he was being accused of. And then, after being elected, he recently talked about his Muslim roots in a speech in Egypt. At the very least that is equivocation.
        I have been trying to restrain myself from name-calling as it brings nothing to the debate, but since you have drawn first-blood, I will say this: You will be in luck when National Health Care comes, because then you can afford to have a doctor do a colonoscopy to find your head.

        • Smilee

          DaveH Reply:
          July 16th, 2009 at 6:57 pm

          Dave

          Barrack mother and grandparents raised him and they were not Muslim and raised him Christian and this is what he claims he is, his father left him when he was two. His dad was Muslim and he did recognize his roots, why do you expect to lie about that???? “equivocation”. are you so ignorant to not know the difference between ones roots and how one was raised when the two very different, but you by this statement equate Christian and Muslim as the same,again shows your ignorance. I am on Medicare and this is a national health care for seniors now and its a great improvement in coverages and at half the cost. You say “…because then you can afford to have a doctor do a colonoscopy to find your head”. Gee, I had one of these last fall (paid for my medicare) and to improve your knowledge on this procedure, they do not go in that far so when you get old enough to require one don’t worry about having your head injured in the procedure.

    • Roro

      Seriously now Obama is doing the very same things Bush and Company were doing….Tarp was the largest rippoff of American taxpayers in the history of the World…LOL …His strings are pulled by the same Banksters that pulled Bushes…So much Debt has accumulated that the powers that be are monetizing it, just printing money to spread the pain, they were doing that the entire 8 years of the last administration…The only thing that kept the economy chugging along then were the manipulation of Interest Rates(the manufactured housing boom) and Deregulation that set the stage for more astronomical borrowing and these massive bailout ripoffs…Its not about Conservative or Liberal, left or right…Don’t you get it, thats what they want you to think and do…..Presidents are mere puppets to these people, I hate to say that but it is true, I love my country dearly but whoever is president matters little anymore, none of them have the courage to stand up to the String pullers…

  • Jack

    Found new Fuel to add to the fire under Obama to show BIRTH CERTIFICATE!

    link text

    • Smilee

      The fire has gone out.

    • DixieConnie

      Jack, what? where? help, I couldn’t find it.

      • Smilee

        Smilee Reply:
        July 15th, 2009 at 5:32 pm

        DixieConnie Reply:
        July 15th, 2009 at 3:36 pm

        Jack, what? where? help, I couldn’t find it.

        Its all fiction, this issue is dead after the Supreme Court refused to heat it. Its been a joke all along

  • Rorie

    I’d like to add my comments about socialized medicine. I’m Canadian. I make reference in my comments to issues specific to where I live but they are still relevant, all the same, in describing what goes on in a socialized healthcare system.

    40% plus, and increasing to 50% by 2020, share of each of our provinces’ (states’)total budget expenses are devoted to healthcare. People who wait in an emergency ward unattended for over thirty hours, and die without anyone noticing. Sure it’s an isolated and extreme example- but it happened/happens. Healthboard officials, whose numbers increase exponentially, and who answer to no one. And who describe a patient’s death after waiting over thirty hours, as being “irrelevant”. Who shift the blame. Who ignore problems. Who hide behind the government and vice versa. Who resort to distraction- e.g., telling the city it has to clear the streets immediately after a freak mid-winter freezing rain to avoid the increase in hospital visits due to slipping on the ice. A private citizen who donates $30 million for a state of the art research centre but then health officials can’t attract any researchers to it- resulting in the building being underutilized, not used for its intended purpose, and populated by mid-level bureaucrats instead of researchers. Lying. Withholding information. Our top healthcare bureaucrat who states that waiting lists are good because it means that there are no redundancies in the system. And on and on……

    It’s a scam and a sham- and a shame. And I speak having had close dealings with the healthcare system for a couple of years now because of a serious heart problem. The stories I could tell!

    Defenders of socialized medicine point to the crisis in the US’s supposedly freemarket system. But the current system in the US is not a freemarket system. I’ve gone on too long but I’m passionate about this. Following is something that highlights the truth about socialized medicine:

    What if Canada had a Canada Auto Act tht was designed the same way as the Canada Health Act?

    There will be a universal car.
    No options will be discussed. No one is entitled to a fancier car than the poorest person can afford or the government is willing or able to provide.
    All carmakers are equal in quality: the same price will be charged for every car and the government will set the price.
    The price is the same for each car regardless of the car’s comfort, convenience, safety, fuel efficiency, or aesthetics:and regardless of the location of the dealership and the time the dealer spends with the client.
    If you get an option or a different level of service and the dealer accepts a payment for this option or service, he or she can be fined up to $10,000.
    Although there is only supposed to be one level of car, wealthy athletes, car dealers, politicians and influential people inside the system can get a better quality of car. The only difference is that they don’t pay extra for it (even though they can afford to pay more, it is illegal for them to do so). The result is that this select group gets the better quality car, but we all get to pay for this service from our taxes.
    If you are under a certain age you may be able to buy a longer lasting car, but only if the politicians say so. People over a certain age cannot buy a longer-lasting, better-quality car because statistically they are not going to live as long or require the improved quality.
    If a different political party is elected, one of three things may happen: your choice of car may remain the same; it may be reduced in quality; or you may get a better quality car if the party decides to take money out of education or other social programs.
    If there is an economic downturn or if interest rates go up on the public debt, the quality of car will go down (unless the government decides to borrow money from your children to pay for your vehicle, with no obligation to repay the loan).

    With the G in GMC now standing for Government not General and the Big Three becoming the Beg Three maybe once you’ve got your socialized healthcare you’ll get “free” automobiles and you can apply the above literally.

    • Smilee

      Sober up and try again!!!!!!

    • JDR

      I’m Canadian and wonder where you are from and what incidents you are referring to. I don’t believe you are Canadian, tell me what you pay monthly and what province you are in. I doubt that you know either.

  • Rorie

    Nasty! But then most socialists are. Certainly bitter. As you’ve made clear.

  • James Holbrook

    I have seen the comments on this page regarding the “conservative fiction” of rationed health care in Canada and the UK. As an American who actually does live in the UK, I can assure that it is not fiction, but a reality. I have had elderly inlaws awaiting operations for months at a time only to have the bed space in hospitals taken away at the last minute. Compare this with my elderly relatives in the US who just go in when necessary. Also, the standards of hygiene here in the UK are appalling, I remember better facilities in the US during the 1970s, despite being on Medicare. I grew up in a poor family and we always went to the doctors for checkups or injury and were never turned away. As for Canadian health care, see Mark Steyn who constantly comments on it. The fiction is what liberals have to say about the US system. Mostly rich liberals I might add who won’t have to use any system they devize.
    They eat at the top table and to salve their consciences, chuck us the leftovers.

  • David M Christmas

    Hello follow americans I heard and read everything you’re concern about,please even go there! when president nixon sold us out to the chinese socialism was born.It simple the rich get richer the poor gets poorer then who does the poor people turn too oh that’s right the federal government.Why is it a surprise because nobody was paying attention.During the bush years they thought they would get away with again like the 80′s but when the economy started to fail so fast in his last year he didn’t have enough time to hand it over to the DEMs so they can say socialism oh no but it didn’t and he had no choice but for the government to bail out everybody and the american people saw that and said to themselves.we mind as well put a Dem into office.The american people have spoken and don’t be afraid. the biggest Democrat to ever sit in the white house is george w bush. Welcome to New World Order…pay attention.We need a third political party. My name id David M Christmas Co-founder of G.A.N.D.E.O.R party stay tune

  • Aman

    Oh! and permit me to address my horrible spelling and english. You talk about slaughtering the Queen’s english, you got that right. You see, I was absent on the days I had spelling and english. And besides my mother always said ” Once you write and talk english good, can’t nobody change that. So I thought I was good to go. As far as being overly religious, I wish I were! I’m working on that one though because I’m terribly humbled by God, experienced his mighty hand only two days ago, and I never want to risk using him as needed.

    • Roger R. collins

      Those who critique your spelling are merely opposed to your point and message. That is what is important, ignore the clowns.

      • Aman

        I appreciate your support Roger and your point is well taken.

        Aman

      • Edu-macated

        Actually I was just being an ass, and I do disagree with the crazy mans point of view.

      • DaveH

        Right on Roger!

  • http://Hotmail Mark

    I may be a Canadian, but if nessecary, I will die to fight for America. Socialism is (and always has been) based out of central Europe. Germany, France, Italy, Spain and Portugal. All of these countries signed on with the Russian “Bolshevik” movement in the eighties to combine their forces to undermine English North Americans. The North Americans calling themeselves Liberal Democrats ALL have deep ties and loyalties to this region. They fund the new FREE media promoting English Mistrust to millions of newcomers while deceptively self promoting their five countries. Its really quite simple…they see the control Moscow and Bejjing have on their people, and these EUROTRASH FASCIST ASSHOLES truley believe they can move North America from Capitalism to Socialism to Communism. They want total european communist control of North America now that the baby boomers are dying off leaving no one else to protect the English foundations of North America. This is why in all large cities across North America, you will find mostly immigrants from these areas tightly knit. They’ve been planning English Americas downfall for a long time and we need to stop them from achieving their deceptive agenda. Hitler would be proud of the New European Liberal Democrats flooding North America. If he were alive, he would probably want to start up the ovens once again and this time encourage throwing in the English with the Jews this time.

    • Roger R. collins

      Interesting how Smiley is so right and yet those using the Canadian/UK medical services all agree that our system is the best. Further the statements regarding how well Social Security and Medicare is working obviously don’t read the impending bankruptcy due to the political actions over the past years. You can not add 50 million people to our system and reduce the cost without serious rationing services. This will go directly to the elderly who Tom Daschle says should get used to the infirmaries of age. If this plan is so good, why is Congress exempting themselves and their families?? Most of the proponent of Universal Healthcare see only the benefits to them and not how the majority of the population is effected. They will also get the pain.

      • http://Hotmail Mark

        I disagree that Government controlled Health Care is so good. I am a Canadian and I will tell you that Medicare is designed for one purpose, to redirect billions yearly to socialist so they can create more 80K per year jobs for friends and family. Average Canadians continue to receive horrible health care, and most are now flocking to the US for better service, willing to pay extra. As everyone is aware, adding burocracy to a system NEVER SAVES MONEY!

        Health Care is nothing more than an elaborate SLUSHFUND for wealthy SOCIALIST FASCIST ASSHOLES!

        • http://Hotmail Mark

          PS…it’s usually deceptive SOCIALIST ASSHOLES that comment on how well these systmens work, because they are the ones profiting from it. Me thinks you may be one of those deceptive fascist. Am I close Pierre…or is it Adolph?

      • Smilee

        DixieConnie Reply:
        July 15th, 2009 at 3:36 pm

        Jack, what? where? help, I couldn’t find it.

        Its all fiction, this issue is dead after the Supreme Court refused to heat it. Its been a joke all along

      • Smilee

        Roger R. collins Reply:
        July 15th, 2009 at 8:57 am

        ALL Canadians, I suppose you want us to believe you also know everyone of them too!!! lol!!! I now many from Canada that like their system. The only place I hear this BS is from angry person like yourself and/or conservative fiction whose lies are designed by them to protect the corporate greed in this country. They will not let Medicare go bankrupt they will find a remedy, they dare not let it fail, they then would get voted out. People vote their pocketbooks. You clearly do not know how health care works either here or in other countries. There is solutions if there is the political will. How do you account for Medicare’s coverage with a Medigap plan that covers all at about half the premium price to those on private section plans which do not cover all?? There are several ways solutions can be had, but I do not think your capable of understanding any of them.

    • Smilee

      # Mark on July 15th, 2009 at 8:24 am:

      Which is it, You have said you live in Indiana and now say you are a Canadian, Which lie are we to believe Mark.

  • http://Hotmail Mark

    **OBAMAS HOODS MASTER PLAN**

    'STEAL FROM THE POOR AND GIVE TO THE RICH'

    SOCIALISM LEADS TO OPPRESSIVE COMMUNIST CONTROL AND THAT IS PRECISELY THEIR INTENTIONS AGAINST ENGLSIH NORTH AMERICANS.

  • RJWalker

    Yeah!!!!

    We gotta fight this creeping socilaism.

    I say we start by getting rid of public fire departments. And public parks and swimming pools and beachs.And the interstate highway system- in fact,all the roads built at public expense.

    And get rid of the 40 hour work week. And unemployment compensation. And public libraries. And public and work place safety laws. And segregation.

    And airports and the FAA and air traffic controllers. And bridges. Let’s go back to the transportation God intended for us, canoes and rafts on the waterways.

    Darned socialists have been ruining our country ever since the Public Gardens were created when the Plymouth colony was settled in Massachusetts.

    The folks who used to use “liberal” as a scare word have realized it was ineffective. Now they’re trying “Socialist.”

    Like a boogyman under the bed.

    Pure, unrestricted capitalism has proved to lead to major problemsas has pure socialism.

    A healthy mix, when accepted, has lead to the US being the most powerfuland advaned economy in the world.

    As a country,we have embraced the pwoerful concept of checks and balances in the political arena. This was long before the industrial revolution and the growth of massive industry and business concerns.

    I believe that the same checks and balances which are so important inpolitics are equallyimportant inthe world of commerce.

    • http://Hotmail Mark

      As usual…your typical Socialist ranting, attempting to cause so much confusion to a situation, hoping people will just give up on challenging them.

      Your shit may work on others ADOPLH, but it dont work on me!

      • RJWalker

        Very impressive response.

        • DaveH

          RJ,
          How many failures of Socialism do you have to witness before you get the picture? Russia, China, North Korea, soon France. It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to figure out that if you take money from the hard workers (that includes those that educate themselves to learn what it takes to be successful) and give it to those who don’t want to work hard, the hard workers are going to quit working hard and those others certainly aren’t going to start working hard. So, the obvious result is less productivity and fewer goods produced, which is much more likely to drive us back to canoes and horses then the free enterprise system that you rail against.
          And I know that you are going to say “but China is growing fast”. That only started after they acquired Hong Kong and listened to good free-market advice from the Hong Kong leaders.
          In the system that you advocate, the way to get ahead is by jaw-boning the people in power, that or being a sycophant. A free enterprise system separates bull-shit from reality because the consumers pay their dollars for the product they most desire, rather than to have their choices made by some all-knowing elitist bureaucrat.

      • Michelle

        I’m with you Mark, I bet he wishes he could go back to the FORMER Soviet Union

    • DixieConnie

      RJ What are you writing? I agree Mark, RJ is smoking something funny. Watch out RJ the men in white coats are right around your corner.

  • Rick Casey

    There was a time when “one nation under God” was so important we founded this nation rooted in this wisdom and our actions were guided by this truth.We flourished and the world took notice.

    Today money is our God and we calculate most our live’s, our own value in this world in attracting this “God”.

    Wisdom is timeless. Beyond debate.

    “The greatness of a man’s power is the measure of his surrender”

    “Money is the root of all evil”

    Socialism,capitalism croonism….are NOT our salvation. God is not a crutch,for the weak minded,based in a lack of scientific understanding, nor a religion. Salvation is not for the next life. The answers lie at your fingertips for this day if only you will wake up from being selfabsorbed and seek the truth.

    From a lifelong aethest, successful businessman I am neither brainwashed,stupid, or accepting of anything without proof. Wisdom remains timeless.

    • RJWalker

      There was a time when “one nation under God” was so important we founded this nation rooted in this wisdom

      The phrase “one nation under God” was added to the pledge in 1954.

      The nation was founded a bit before then, and in founding the nation, the drafters and adopters of the Constitution said two things about religion and government:

      “no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States.”

      and

      “Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof”

      And in 1797 the US Senate unanimously adopted the Treaty of Tripoli, in which it is proclaimed: “”As the government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian Religion…”

      • Smilee

        RJWalker Reply:
        July 15th, 2009 at 5:29 pm

        You are right, the majority of the founding fathers did not practice Christianity. If they had why would they have designed it originally to put the vote in the hands of rich white men only, allowed it to be legal to import slaves until 1808 after which slave importation became a black market industry. Women were considered property, could not own property or have custody of children if divorced, and did not get the vote for 131 years later. Slavery was left legal to be decided by the states but still legal. It was even though a very good and wise document that has evolved to provide much more freedoms for most people and admired and envied by people all over the world, but it did not arise out of Christian principals nor has our country ever been a majority of Christians albeit a majority are religious. This founding fathers Christian fiction is again just fiction believed mostly by the conservatives today who are very religious and seem to worship the founding fathers and look at them almost God Like when many of the founding fathers were only rich white men uniting originally to collectively build a defense to protect their riches realizing it was risky and they could have lost all if they failed, so even through you do have to take your hat off to them and admire them as they did start a county that has evolved into one of the best ever for a lot wider class of people.

        • DixieConnie

          RJ: Your view point is bent by your agenda. You were not alive at that time nor have you obviously not studied that era very much. How would you think these men would feel, that you have so conveniently condemed them for their morals, about us as a country that allows the killing of unborn children, and whole segments of our society to be a burden on the citizens with initiative?

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          But what you dont understand or state here about slavery, is that slavery started in Africa, with black tribes subduing then making slaves out of other black tribes, then started selling them to white men. It is always made out like white man went over there and started imprisoning black people. That is a lie. They bought black slaves from black slave owners. Fact. Check your history. White mans stain is what they did to the American Indian, and the prejudice they still slam on the Indian today. It is a shame, and I for one am embarrased to no end about it. This black talk of reparations make me sick, and Ill tell you why. My great, great great grandfather was a very rich man with a castle in German. He had to surrender it and all he had to the Kaiser then flee the country and come here. The way I see it, those germans dont owe me a thing. Those alive now didnt do it, and it wasnt done to me. I have no stake it in. What was done, was done, and its over, and Id be a fool to hold on to it and feel ill towards the germans, because the ones that did it are all dead and gone. By the same means, dont hold my white butt responsibile because your great great great grandfather being sold as a slave, because seriously man, I didnt do it, nor would I do it. And it didnt happen to you either, and Im glad of that. We all need to let go of the past and move on and put ugly chapters away. But it seems we are tontent to dig them up and use them to get what we want, and its not right. However, with the Indian thing, I will stand beside them shoulder to shoulder, hand in hand, because they are still being crapped on to this day, and it isnt right, because this was and is their land, and I dont care who you are, fact is fact, this is the American Indian’s land, and what was done to them was atrocious, and continues to be that way. Slaves were brought over here, and many of them actually had a better life than before. Some didnt. But its over. Black men and white men enjoy the same rights and same freedoms. If we didnt Barrack Obama wouldnt have risen to the office of President. I do not ever want to hear a black man again tell me that whitey is holding him down. If Barrack Obama can do, so can any man of any color, here in the United States. Meanwhile, we continue to herd the Indians onto reservations. Shame. My peoples shame.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          And they were Christians. Many, many of their original documents cite God, and following God, and under God. And all men were created equal by their maker………. Yes, they were Godly men. They knew this new nation needed God’s protection and God’s guidance, and they prayed and turned to Him. They didnt seek out John Smith, or a big brass buddha, or turn towards Mecca and look for Mohammed. Nope. None of these. Jesus Christ was and is, and will always be. You can disagree, and I fully support your right as an American free man to do so. But I do propose that your arms arent long enough to box with God, so I wouldnt try it. But then again, thats just me.

        • Smilee

          Mark Reply:
          July 16th, 2009 at 3:16 pm

          And they were Christians.

          *How do you know, Billie Graham on David Frost some years back said we never have been a Christian nation and I see it as he does, *

          Many, many of their original documents cite God, and following God, and under God.

          Neither the Declaration or Independence or the Constitution contain the word God, in fact it separates religion from its controls

          And all men were created equal by their maker………. Yes,

          Actually the word in the Declaration was creator but it does not define the creator as God or Budda etc. What makes you think you know what was in their hearts, but do can know thier acts and do your think their acts were those of Christians, I don’t think so, by their fruits ye shall know them

          they were Godly men. They knew this new nation needed God’s protection and God’s guidance, and they prayed and turned to Him. They didnt seek out John Smith, or a big brass buddha, or turn towards Mecca and look for Mohammed. Nope. None of these. Jesus Christ was and is, and will always be. You can disagree, and I fully support your right as an American free man to do so. But I do propose that your arms arent long enough to box with God, so I wouldnt try it. But then again, thats just me.

        • Smilee

          Mark Reply:
          July 16th, 2009 at 3:11 pm

          But what you dont understand or state here about slavery, is that slavery started in Africa, with black tribes subduing then making slaves out of other black tribes, then started selling them to white men. It is always made out like white man went over there and started imprisoning black people. That is a lie.

          Well isn’t interesting that I never mentioned who captured them, I said nothing about Africa, only that they being brought here and sold them as slaves to white men. I see both the Indian and blacks as being treated very badly by these you call Christians, remember some of our founding fathers owned slaves

          They bought black slaves from black slave owners. Fact. Check your history. White mans stain is what they did to the American Indian, and the prejudice they still slam on the Indian today. It is a shame, and I for one am embarrased to no end about it. This black talk of reparations make me sick, and Ill tell you why. My great, great great grandfather was a very rich man with a castle in German. He had to surrender it and all he had to the Kaiser then flee the country and come here. The way I see it, those germans dont owe me a thing. Those alive now didnt do it, and it wasnt done to me. I have no stake it in. What was done, was done, and its over, and Id be a fool to hold on to it and feel ill towards the germans, because the ones that did it are all dead and gone. By the same means, dont hold my white butt responsibile because your great great great grandfather being sold as a slave, because seriously man, I didnt do it, nor would I do it. And it didnt happen to you either, and Im glad of that. We all need to let go of the past and move on and put ugly chapters away. But it seems we are tontent to dig them up and use them to get what we want, and its not right. However, with the Indian thing, I will stand beside them shoulder to shoulder, hand in hand, because they are still being crapped on to this day, and it isnt right, because this was and is their land, and I dont care who you are, fact is fact, this is the American Indian’s land, and what was done to them was atrocious, and continues to be that way. Slaves were brought over here, and many of them actually had a better life than before. Some didnt. But its over. Black men and white men enjoy the same rights and same freedoms. If we didnt Barrack Obama wouldnt have risen to the office of President. I do not ever want to hear a black man again tell me that whitey is holding him down. If Barrack Obama can do, so can any man of any color, here in the United States. Meanwhile, we continue to herd the Indians onto reservations. Shame. My peoples shame.

          Isn’t interesting that this part of your post does not address anything from my post, but is does reveal a lot of hate and identifies you as a racist, why is it you hate the black man so much more than the Indian, Yes things have gotten better and Barrack did as a man with black blood get elected but it took 232 years for it to happen and it is not likely it would have happen before now and maybe not now if he was not such an extra ordinary individual, blacks not as talented still suffer discrimination and from these blogs there is a lot of hate of this man and you can bet with some it is stems from their racist heats

    • DixieConnie

      We spend time and exchange money.

    • American Citizen

      You’re right, Rick, this country was not founded on Christian principles, but God principles. It’s people who don’t follow them that are the problem. If you don’t study history and learn from it, you’re doomed to repeat it. We see it happening over and over. That’s why I listen to people who have a more advanced study of history than I do, as they see what will happen if we keep going the way we are.

      As for being an atheist, there are so many questions science cannot and will never be able to answer. It shows just what a great intellect God is. In the bible, is the story of Babel, men who thought they could build a tower so high, they would reach Heaven. Now comes our many languages, God confused them by instilling in each of them a different language so they could not understand one another. That’s one explanation, do you have another?

  • American Citizen

    If anyone of you thinks that government run health care would be free, you are an ostrich with your head in the sand. We senior citizens are already on government health care called Medicare. Between me and my husband, our insurance premiums are about $500 a month and that doesn’t include my long term care insurance. There is no such thing as a free lunch, someone pays for it. You would be paying for it with taxes of 70% or more plus rationed care. Anyone who thinks there are no problems with England’s or Canada’s health care systems hasn’t done their homework. We get warnings all the time not to go that way from people who live in those countries. If you are young and don’t have major health problems, of course you’d like those systems. But there are waiting lines for anything major (if they don’t die while waiting) which is why people from those countries who can afford to pay for the care themselves come to this country. We already have the best health care system in the world and Obama and his cohorts want to screw it up big time.
    There were those of us who paid attention to the campaigns who tried to warn others about Obama and his hidden agenda. We knew he was a snake oil salesman with every word that came out of his mouth.

    • DixieConnie

      American Citizen: It was like watching the Pied Piper and the rats (children) in the fairy tale. Only its not fairy tale.

  • DixieConnie

    I hope all of you that voted for Obama are very pleased with all of the changes cause I personally think they stink.

    • Jack

      It is now there item # 36

    • RJWalker

      I hope all of you that voted for Obama are very pleased with all of the changes cause I personally think they stink.

      As a liberal who has known all along that Obama isn’t, I haven’t been ecstatic about all that he has done, but I didn’t really expect his to do much liberal stuff.

      • DixieConnie

        RJWalker: Just exactly what is a Liberal. And what makes you such a Liberal? Do you really believe your thinking is that much better? And why don’t you think Obama is a liberal? And if he is not a liberal, then how do you classify him?

      • Michelle

        OHH PLEASE JUST WHAT DID YOU EXPECT???????????????

    • http://donthaveone Mark

      Ill keep my Bible, my guns, and my money. Obama can keep his change. To him I say no thanks, I allready have a Messiah.

  • Jack

    Sorry the link did not work but things are happening so fast I now have two stories about the same thing one posted on July 11 at 12:05 am Eastern and the second posted July 14 at 9:53 pm Eastern time.

    http://www.wnd.com/index.php?pageId=103626

    http://www.wnd.com:80/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=104009

  • Roger L. Jones

    Last week, Chevron gave earnings advice that it’s foreign earnings would be impacted by the fall in the value of the dollar overseas.

    This looks like Jimmy Carter style stagflation to me.

  • http://none Rod

    To: edu macated – It’s plane to see you are not the top rung of the latter!
    Better learn enemy identification. your setting on your last rights and
    not even smart enough to know it. Why don’t you check out whats going
    on in Dearborn MI.

    • Roger R. collins

      Rod, Smiley and not so edu-macated live in a different world that most of us do. They see everything in a D & R perspective. The majority of these posts make it clear they are for a stronger America, not just political rhetoric. Both of these clowns (if they are not the same person) are using words by the pound to make the point they believe in, even though they are incorrect in most instances. Most people like them use a few accurate facts inserted in reams of BS to make their point. They both trust the government if the Dems have the reins. Some on earlier named a line up some of the cast of characters who will destroy our way of life with the current agenda.

  • http://none Rod

    Great for you AMERICAN CITIZEN! The effects of Obama’s so called health care
    plan STINKS! I know it may not do any good but, call your Congressman and
    Senators and let them know how bad it is. Lets VOTE a new congress into office.
    Obama wants a Socialist government . With that, we lose all of our freedoms and
    gain a dictator! GUESS WHO?

    • DixieConnie

      I have yet to see that it martters what the people want. I have called and called and I hear things on the news that what ever is not going to pass cause the people don’t want it to and then BOOM it passes. So what the heck. I am going to vote on anyone that is not in office as of today on the next election.

  • http://none Rod

    Your right R.J.Walker! I have been talking to alot of Dems. who voted that DUDE
    into office and they are telling me they didn’t know this is what he meant by CHANGE!
    Then get off your DUFFS and lets do something about it. VOTE FOR A CHANGE–
    IN CONGRESS!

  • Bosco

    The consequences you mentioned are not unintended. This is an intentional trashing of the middle class in order to get the socialist/progressive(regressive)/communist agenda established

  • Free American

    Just got a moment after working my long hours trying to earn a living.

    Now I see Obama wants to take over the education system. Doing a little research some of you may find out that history books have been distorted for some time and truth really doesn’t have anything to do with most “facts” taught in school. It takes long hard hours to do the research and sometimes travel to find orignal documents.

    Just remember… Absolute power corrupts absolutely. That is what we have in Washington right now. Get out the brooms and lets clean house!!

    Bring back someone that can read the constitution and take it at face value. Let’s teach people how to fish instead of handing out the fish. Our young people are losing all sense of personal responsibility and initiative. They don’t even know what an honest debate is. Let’s go back to finding out real history instead of what is being printed in many textbooks this generation has read. Clean out the universities. Our kids don’t have a chance to get the education they deserve. Too many liberal college professors with an agenda.

    I am also the poor white woman that struggled to get out of poverty, starting to work at 14 and go through college. I learned hard work and education would be my ticket to have the house with a bathroom instead of an outhouse, shoes on my feet that did not have holes. I didn’t blame anyone for our families plight and was glad for some of the “rich” folks that gave me jobs and let me do an honest days work. I grew up in the midwest and have always been proud to be an American. We never looked back or blamed anyone. We just worked harder to get ahead. People tend to forget that we need the rich to give the rest of us jobs. Thank heavens most are good honest mean.

    I am still proud of America, but very ashamed of our leadership – or lack of it. Yes, the hair is grey, but I am ready to take up the fight. It is very encouraging to read what some of you true Americans think. Keep up the fight!!

  • JDR

    This site is full of reactionary people with a very strange world view. It is a bit scary to see such extreemist viewpoints.

    Anyhow back to the topic at hand. I am a Canadian and have had extensive experience with our health care system, it is nor perfect but it blows the doors off the corporate insurance in the US. The biggest difference is that in Canada we are covered for all health issues other than dental. Get cancer – you are fully covered no additional costs. Have a heart attack you are fully covered no checking to see if your policy covers it. On top of that the premiums are fixed and equal for everyone in each province in BC where I live it is $54 a month. Medication is not fully covered, if you choose a brand or product not on the approved medications list you can purchase it yourself. personally I have private coverage that I pay for that covers all my medications and dental, my choice as I want the extra options. I can also go to the private care facilities if I want for additional services.

    My mother had breast cancer so I had a very close look at the system in operation, it was brilliant, from diagnosis to surgery just over two weeks, Chemo and radiation all first class, my father had a mild heart attack, emergency and after care outstanding. I fractured an arm a few years ago, ambulance, and emergency great, after care – I did not like the first or second orthopedic surgeon the third guy was great.

    Like I said the Canadian system is not perfect, a bit more private mixed in would in my opinion make it better. The US system, where once you are sick the insurer is looking for ways to reduce its loss by limiting or excluding treatment – there was a lawsuit just a couple of weeks ago regarding this – is the worst. For all the middle class folks who go on about wealthy outsiders coming to the US for treatment, well if you want a system that is effective for only the wealthiest in you society it seems a bit stupid.

    • DixieConnie

      And how much do you pay a month or how much is taken out of your paycheck each month for this health care? Do you get to see the doctor of choice? I read that you did not like the first or the second orthopedic, so did you choose the third?
      I agree, the health Insurance of this country is messed up, not the health care. What ever happen to the days, you go to the doctor, pay for the visit, get the care and go home. When did it become the insurance responsibility to pay for your visit? I believe we need major medical insurance but not for monthly visits or yearly visits. This is crazy.
      We found an insurance policy that we only pay $700.00 per month for (2) instead of $1,700.00 per month. This is crazy. Pay for the visit, pay for the medicine and save $700.00 a month on insurance. I don’t understand the thinking. I don’t go to the doctor each month and I have not had to go to the hospital so maybe that is why I can write this.

      • http://donthaveone Mark

        700.00 a month? And you say only 700.00 a month? Holy crap batman. I feel better about my coverage now. I thought I was paying too much, and I only pay 60.00 a week, which is 240.00 a month, for the whole family. If I didnt have to carry my wife, which I wont soon when she reaches 90 days at her new job, I will be able to drop this, because mine is provided free by my employer. So maybe Im one of the lucky ones. Im also one of those, that doesnt see a doctor unless I need stitches or something. Other than my every 2 years CDL drivers license physical, I havent seen a doctor for 25 years. Im 50, I feel like Im 18, and it if aint broke, dont fix it.

        • Smilee

          Mark Reply:
          July 16th, 2009 at 3:26 pm

          How much of your premium does your employer pay, were I worked before retirement the employee paid 15% and my employer 85% and a family plan cost the employee about the same as you pay now but our plan did not have deductibles like yours did and I’m sure the total premiums were more

        • DixieConnie

          Mark,
          and that 700 a month is cheaper cause until we found that it was $1700.00 for just my husband. I know it is crazy. If it were up to me, we would not have health insurance, I hate it. But I do it for the Major part. We too do not go to doctors. I had to in order to drive a school bus and they said I have high blood pressure. I don’t believe it but I have to take it in order to drive (the cdl thing for me too.) but you know Obama says it ain’t gonna cost us very much if we take his plan. Right !!!! ????.

      • JDR

        Nothing is taken out of my pay check other than provincial and federal taxes. The percentage of GDP spent on healthcare by the Canadian governments is about 10% compared to about 15% in the US where you still have to pay for your own private coverage unless you don’t want insurance. So I think this means that you are paying more in taxes than we are?? For a system that ranks 37th in the world statistically.

        I have a great GP who has been my doctor for about 25 years and I have never had a problem getting a referral to whoever I want. The orthopaedic surgeon was a referral that my doctor gave me after I talked to some friends about my surgery. Incidentally My mother was allowed to pick her oncologist, the guy is world class look him up Klimo in North Vancouver.

        If you think that seeing a doctor on a regular basis is a waste you don’t understand that prevention reduces costs.

        Frankly I don’t care what the US does I just think it is really interesting to see all this propaganda being spit out about a system that though far from perfect is light years ahead of yours.

        Like I said I would like to see more of a two tier system because I think that you should be able to pay for premium service if you can afford it.

        To the reactionary dope that commented on my first post. I live in a two million dollar home own two business’ employ 20+ people and make a pretty good living. I am more than happy to pay additional taxes to support a universal health care system, it makes society better. What kind of bizarre threat is sitting on me? What are you a fat pig that threatens to sit on people – it is not to intimidating, you might want to work on that.

        Good luck with your future you folks are certainly not helping to make your country the beacon it once was.

    • Smilee

      JDR on July 15th, 2009 at 9:52 pm:

      Thanks for the great insight, this is what all my relatives and friends in Canada tell me about your health care system as well. We have people here and most on this site who hate their government and worship the large health care corporations and cannot see that the later is the more corrupt and that they can never have any control over the corporations and government except through their representatives in the government through the ballot box. Thanks again for enlightening us but I fear it will fall on a lot of deaf ears and closed mind here.

    • DaveH

      JDR,
      You are good with the name-calling. I wonder if I sat on you, and you started screaming, how you would feel if I then called you an extremist and reactionary?
      It is always easy for the takers to have calm demeanors. And then when the involuntary donors speak up about it, they are “extremists” and “reactionary”.
      I will do a little name calling to you. Thief. Checking a ballot box to vote for someone else to do the thieving for you makes you no less a thief.

  • Rorie

    Rorie here. Someone doubs that I’m Canadian and has asked me to prove it by answering two questions. Here are my answers.The province I live in is Manitoba and Manitobans pay no (zero) medical premiums. They say you get what you pay for- pay nothing, get nothing. Although the hidden costs (taxes) are steep. The horror stories I described are true- check the Winnipeg Free Press and Winnipeg Sun newspapers’ archives from a few months ago (February, I think). I can defend every comment I made. Beware government healthcare!

    • Rorie

      I know there’s a “t” in doubts.

      • American Citizen

        Rorie, what you say about Canada’s health care is what I have heard from others. If people in this country think they wouldn’t have to pay anything for health care, they are sadly mistaken. There will be co-pays and deductibles plus a premium. Obama wants to take $400 billion from Medicare to help pay for nationalized care. So we senior citizens would have to pay more than we do now. All Americans had better pay attention, you may just get what you wish for with its unintended consequences. One of these would be no treatment the government bureaucrats don’t OK. That happens now with private insurance, the bureaucrats playing doctor. It’s the insurance companies that need to be fixed, not our health care itself. In the 53 years I have been married, having had 6 children, none of us has ever been denied care. Hospitals have to give thousands of dollars in free care to those who can’t afford to pay. There are low cost state insurances out there, my Indiana being one of them. I see insurance companies advertising their low cost health premiums on TV. We don’t want the Feds telling us what kind of care we can have. They already do with Medicare.

    • http://donthaveone Mark

      I have also heard this, but then why does the writer JDR say he pays 54 bucks, but he says its good. Most people I have met up there, talk about it like you do, and I have heard absolute horror stories. So where does this JDR’s story fit in? Think maybe he is a democrat liar trying to convince people with false stories, kind of like ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN and MSNBC?

      • Smilee

        Mark Reply:
        July 16th, 2009 at 3:29 pm

        What a nasty response!!!!!!!!!!! No wonder we are thought of as arrogant by some people in other countries, I have many in other countries tell me this as well.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          Not meant to be nasty or arrogant. Im just confused that one canadian here, along with many I have talked to in person, which when I say many is just in double digits, tell me we dont want it and how bad it is. Then this one guy here, says its good for him. So Im getting mixed feedback here, but its still at least 15 saying bad, and 1 saying good. Im wondering why 1 finds it good, and 15 bad, thats all. Not nasty or arrogant, I dont know where you get that from. When 15 say one thing, and 1 says another, I have to believe that 1 has an agenda, and I kind of believe the 15. One on One could go either way, but 15 to 1 says something to me. I just dont want to chance it. And where you get this 37th rated thing, is beyond me. But if its a poll that Obama and the democrats did, forget about that. I could talk to the right people and make us be 147th if I wanted to.

      • Smilee

        Mark Reply: July 17th, 2009 at 7:07 am

        Mark

        It is not a poll but an in depth study done by an international group that is respected by all countries, cannot recall the name but is is accepted universally as accurate. If you do not have the answer blame Obama your favorite whipping boy, you outright dismiss anything he say as BS without facts. This is a conservative blog that espouses the conservative point of view, its nothing more than rhetoric you need to open your mind and listen to all sides, I fully expect reading on this blog to see this lopsided fiction presented as truth. The rhetoric espoused here is nothing more than the conservative talk shows talking points, in other words just ditto head prattle. A far cry from reality as they want to kill any health care reform in this country and will tell you anything in hopes of making that happen.

        • http://donthaveone Mark

          Sorry for you, but if it comes to socialized medicine, I will do all I can to kill it. We dont want it, and we dont need it. The only ones I see that want it are those looking for a handout. Ive never had a cent handed to me, and I like it that way. Ive never collected a cent of unemployment, welfare, foodstamps, medicare, medicaid, social security, any of it, but boy oh boy I sure have had quite a bit of my money taken from me to pay for it, so that someone else can spend their life not working, getting free medical, and I see them sitting there 20 years younger than myself, with a bottle in a brown bag, 10 and 15 at a time sitting on the porch day in and day out smoking cigarettes and drinking 40′s. You bet your sweet ass I got a problem with it. These government handouts are screwing up a lot of stuff, not in the least, these guys sitting on the porch drinking and smoking everyday on my dime. Its not right, and no, I wont accept it. And Obama aint my whipping boy, the democrat party is. He just happens to be their figurehead right now, and he does and says what they tell him, until it all comes crashing down, and its heading there allready. And I will do you a favor Smilee, just so you’ll know and say “damn, Mark was right.”. You think these democrats are so good, how you gonna feel about them when they throw your black brother Obama under the bus? They will, you watch and see. They will seek to save their own asses and will distance themselves and throw him under the bus. At that point it will be recieved by some as racism, just because his skin is black, but it wont have nothing to do with racism. It will have to do with the democrats not caring about anything but their political future, and they will hang this guy in time to save theirs. You watch and see. Its coming soon to a live theatre near you, and its called life.

    • Smilee

      Rorie on July 16th, 2009 at 5:07 am:

      Sorry, I’m still not convinced you are nothing more than a US citizen right wing conservative extremist posing as a Canadian.

      • American Citizen

        Smilee, get your head out of the sand. We’ve been hearing horror stories not only about Canada but about Enland’s health care system for quite some time. Just because something comes from a Conservative, you Liberals and Democrats push it to the wayside. Unfortunately, you will have to learn from experience instead of listening to those who do their homework or have acquired some wisdom. By then it’s too late. I don’t know if we’ll ever be able to fix all the crap the Democrat Congress and this Administration are forcing on us. We senior citizens have been through a lot and have gained some knowledge of what will happen because we’ve already lived it or through it. In Asian countries, the elder citizens are thought to be wise and are respected. In this country, we’re told to shut up and called no-nothings.

        • Smilee

          American Citizen Reply:
          July 16th, 2009 at 5:11 pm

          Smilee, get your head out of the sand. We’ve been hearing horror stories not only about Canada but about Enland’s health care system for quite some time. Just because something comes from a Conservative,

          Apparently you did not understand what I said or just added your biased spin to it, my information came from people who live in Canada, England & Norway and actually use these health care systems there, What I said was the horror stories I hear about these plans only come from conservatives in this country and being it conflicts with those who actually know and whom I personally know and this is the basis for why I find the conservative prattle biased and without credibility

          you Liberals and Democrats push it to the wayside. Unfortunately, you will have to learn from experience instead of listening to those who do their homework or have acquired some wisdom.

          As a Medicare user and this is government plan and one who in their employment years had to know how our health care systems work I believe I am wise in these matters, in other words by homework has been extensive over many years, its to bad you shoot your mouth this way as it only demonstrates your ignorance in this matter

          By then it’s too late. I don’t know if we’ll ever be able to fix all the crap the Democrat Congress and this Administration are forcing on us. We senior citizens have been through a lot and have gained some knowledge of what will happen because we’ve already lived it or through it. In Asian countries, the elder citizens are thought to be wise and are respected. In this country, we’re told to shut up and called no-nothings.

          Whose has told you to shut up etc?? Its seem you sure did not have any trouble shooting your mouth off here. It is the private sector who has forced this health care problems on us all in addition the Bush administration and the republicans in 2003 added private sector plans to Medicare and drove the price of government share costs in these medicare programs up 13% over the original medicare and the price of prescription for seniors up dramatically albeit the plan does pay some but on inflated prices you seem to have your head in the sand about this or maybe it is just more of your ignorance showing. The problem has been the republicans and their corporate buddies who have inflicted this pain on us

      • http://donthaveone Mark

        What a mean and nasty thing to say. No wonder the world thinks we are arrogant. See Smilee, one that lives in a glass house should not throw stones. You want your opinion, but dont want me to have mine. Not fair of you at all. That is the democrat way, I know it, you know it, and God knows it.

        • http://internetexplorer Rosebud

          If you have not watched Sicko by Mike Moore, watch it, it really was a peice of work. Almost shocking! What our government is trying to push is not going to do what you all think it will. It is only going to help 41% of our country. Then the business’ will start dropping what they used to pay on employees insurance. We have some cold hearted medical hospitals in this country. Profit is their only concern. Myself, I think putting some regulations on these Hospitals and Drug Companies would do more good than what they are doing. Some of the pills they push for $10 a piece they only take 5 cents to manufacture. What ever happened to you can’t have a monopoly? The breaking up of Ma Bell shot things all to h–l in the telephone business. Now we have HUGE Conglomerates that regulate everything they own and fix prices on them. Big business owns our government. Lobbiest buy our reps. votes. Who owns the lobbiests? Business’!

  • American Citizen

    David, President Bush had to deal with a Democrat Congress the last two years in office. I’ve often wondered what his administration would have been like if 9/11 hadn’t happened so soon after he took office.

    Also, to Rick, it’s not money itself that is the root of all evil, but the LOVE of money, in other words, GREED. Far too many people are not content with a nice living, they want it all, as lavish as it can be. But having a lot of money brings its own problems. You can be rich one day and poor the next as a lot of them have just found out.

    As for me, I’m content with my normal, lower middle class life. My worries are mostly about my children and grandchildren that they have a nice life and are good citizens.

    • http://donthaveone Mark

      All the money in the world will not fill up ones cup. Fact. We are all born with a JESUS shaped hole in our heart, and until you fill that hole with JESUS, you will forever be in want. A guy gets a million, he wants 2 million. He gets 2 million, now he wants 3 million. Its never enough, because Im telling you, it will not fill you.

    • http://donthaveone Mark

      President Bush did a wonderful job, and I am one American that has often thanked God for giving us a leader with courage to do what is right for us, and not worry about his political future or appeasing the anti war movement. He kept us safe, and has us safe today, until these dummies undo the precautions this man set in place to provide us future safety. And they will undo it.

  • http://Hotmail Mark

    Obamas so called change…

    Still keeping the Kennedys wealthly and in control in the senate
    Still raising taxes to feed the rich and take from the poor
    Still growing bigger government for more control and even
    more high paying jobs for friends and family
    Still attempting to create a trillion dollar slushfund with
    Healthcare (same shitty service but more money for them to
    spend on themselves using poor people money.)
    Still allowing illegals into the country to illegally marginalize their
    their honest american votes.

    Obama Hood….Steal from the Poor and give to the Rich.

    Hitler would be proud of his deceptions.

    • DaveH

      Mark,
      It seems odd to me that the liberals are even messaging on this board. But since they are, the other thing that seems odd to me is that they are so distrustful of corporate america, but think that somehow, people with higher morals and compassion seek government positions.
      Corporations cannot force us to buy their products. Only one group in this country has that power and that is government. And yet they would blindly put their faith in a bigger government.
      Personally, I don’t think they are that stupid. I think that they are either in government positions or so blinded by their greed to get something for nothing that they are willing to say anything to achieve their goals.

  • American Citizen

    As I said, you Liberals and Democrats have a lot to learn. Everything I’m hearing this evening about the health care plan the Democrats want to foist on this country is scary. They keep throwing good money after bad, it’s all going down a rat hole. Now they’re also talking about a second stimulus bill. The country is already in deep doodoo. Put your waders on, you’re going to need them. If you don’t have any, you’d better get some. It’s getting deep folks.

  • American Citizen

    Smilee, it’s obvious you don’t really listen to what Liberals say. We conservatives are told in couched words to shut up. They even want to bring back the fairness doctrine. I didn’t say you said that, read my post again. I will use any way I can to get the message out that what the Pols are doing is bad for this country.

    As for shooting my mouth off, the same can be said of you. It’s like the pot calling the kettle black. I didn’t call you any names or castigate you in any way. I just responded to what you and some others are saying here. This country is in for a really hard time. People are still getting laid off by the thousands every day. Every thing Obama and Congress are doing is only making everything worse. We’re worried and have every reason to be worried. I’m especially worried for our children and grandchildren. I’m also worried about what Congress is doing to Medicare and what else they want to do. It’s going to cost us even more and we’re on a fixed income as are most senior citizens. The pittance raise we get every year doesn’t begin to cover the raise in the cost of living. Utilities go up, food prices go up, medical goes up, and what Congress has done is lowering our investments. We own a small home and have to keep it up also. Congress seems to think we’re all rich. Social Security wouldn’t be in trouble if Congress didn’t keep raiding it over the years. It owes hundreds of billions to Social Security. Just the word “politician” leaves a sour taste in my mouth.

  • American Citizen

    It boggles the mind why so many people want to become slaves to the Federal Government. So much of what it is doing is unconstitutional. The politicians keep making more laws and taxing, taxing. it would be good if they went on permanent vacation. Our legislature sits 4 months one year in which it sets a 2 year budget. The next year it sits for 2 months to take care of whatever has come up in the past year otherwise. It works fine most of the time. Once in a while it has to call a special session as it did this year.

  • http://yahoo Forrest Chambers

    I believe that the status quo will be maintained. So far, housing in WY has not come down, unemployment is low, even though there are no jobs here, (people just move out when they loose their jobs) and everyone just keeps buying and buying. The elitists in D.C. have kept this dog and pony show going for close to 100 years now. I suspect they can keep it going for quite a while longer.

  • http://Rorie Rorie

    Smilee still doesn’t believe I’m Canadian. Do you want my social insurance (not social security) number? I know it’s hard to believe that there are Canadians who prefer individual rights and personal liberty to big government/Big Brother but we do exist. Did you check out the Winnipeg Free Press/Winnipeg Sun stories Smilee? Or do you want to remain a narrow-minded leftwing reactionary? If you check the newspaper coverage you’ll know that my story is true. A man was found dead after waiting more than 30 hours unattended in a Winnipeg hospital emergency ward. Our health authorities (authorities- this should tell you something right here) blamed the victim. The VP said the patient did not report to anyone when he arrived. They also denied that anyone had approached him- until a video surveillance camera showed that he had been approached. But still ignored. The President of the Health Board (government appointees) in commenting on the incident described the man’s death as “irrelevant”- also reported in the newspapers. I find this abhorrent! The Provincial Minister of Health, Health Authority, and Health Board circled the wagons (an American term I’m hoping won’t call into question that I am Canadian- eh). They lied, covered up (and covered each others asses), blamed the victim, made light of the incident, used diversionary tactics (also reported in the media). It’s a huge bureaucracy that answers to no one. They are only concerned about their own survival- not the patient’s. Also true (I heard it myself but it was also reported in the news)- the Head of the Health Authority has said that waiting lists are good because it means that there are no redundancies in the system. I repeat what I said before- it’s a sham, a scam, and a shame!

  • DaveH

    I was on my way to retiring at about age 50. I should add that I have been ill for most of my work life. I worked hard anyway and studied the market in my spare time so I could invest my earnings wisely. Then my wife took up with the next door neighbor. She filed for divorce and lied and cheated in court to take advantage of me. I had paper proof of her lies but my lawyer said the District Attorney would not want to deal with a perjury case as his hands were full with worse crimes. I asked her (the lawyer) how the Justice System could be “just” if people weren’t held accountable for their lies. She looked at me strangely and said “David, it isn’t just”.
    So, now I am 60, still sick about 2 days a week and it is looking very much like I will have to work until I die. Damn, I love Socialism. Without it, I wouldn’t be so happy for the end to come.

  • Myke

    The object of taxing millionaires will achieve what Obama the puppet wants. It will kill small businesses and all other businesses will be owned by the government. And they will pick and choose who gets the jobs available. Millionaires will either rebel and not pay these outrageous taxes or they will find a way to hide it or loopholes to gt out of paying it. These people will not be happy till they have turned America into a third world country. Write to your Mayor. Or your Chief of Police. Ask them what they think their role will be in the New World Order.

  • Suford

    I just subscribed to the newsletter and started to get the emails about this.

    Were there this many yelps about the deficit and fiscal policies when W spent all the surplus he was left by Clinton and dug us into a huge hole or did you just notice that we had a big deficit when we needed to do something about the unregulated sub par mortgage melt down that also happened under W?

    I don’t like a lot of the non-financial sense displayed by congress, either, but let’s put the blame where it belongs. W sold us to the Chinese long ago. I never did like the Republican analysis of his virtues back when he first ran: He’s good with the special interests. THAT was PRAISE?

    Besides marching and complaining, what should we be DOING? or asking our congress-critters to do?

    • American Citizen

      Suford, go back up and read some of the posts here and your questions will be answered. Clinton did not leave office with a big surplus. That was on paper only and touted by the dinosaur media as truth. We were headed into a recession when President Bush took office and was then hit with 9/11.

  • American Citizen

    The most terrifying words in the English language are, “I”m from the government and I’m here to help you.” – Ronald Reagan.

    “It’s not that Liberals are ignorant, it’s just that they know so much that isn’t right.” – Ronald Reagan

  • American Citizen

    What will happen with national health care is what is happening now with Medicare. At first, doctors and hospitals would write off what Medicare did not pay, that was in the contract. Right now, Medicare pays 80% of what it approves which is seldom the whole charge. Our medigap insurance picks up 80% of what Medicare does not pay. We may or may not get a bill from a doctor or hospital.

    Congress is looking at lowering to 71% payment of what it approves. That means the insurance companies will most likely do as Medicare does and lower their payments to 71% of what Medicare does not pay. It will also mean that the doctors and hospitals will most likely send a bill to the patients for the remainder. We’ve been getting some lately. They’re never really big, not more than $100 at the most. But I look for that to go up, too. That’s on top of the $500 a month we pay in insurance premiums. Then comes the drugs. I am on a drug for cancer which costs over $800 for 90 pills. Insurance picks up $600 and I pay the other $200. Now, once the total for my drugs reaches $2700, (the donut hole) that’s with what the insurance and I pay together, i have to pay the total until I have paid the next $3700 myself when the insurance again kicks in. All the while I have to pay the premiums or the insurance will drop me. I also take two pills for my heart, one a generic and the other not. The generic costs $20 for 90 pills and the other over $100. So insurance pay 6 months on the costs and I have to pay full the other 6 months even while paying premiums. So Medicare is not perfect nor free. It works fine if you don’t have serious medical problems or take expensive drugs. It still picks up a great deal of the costs, but we also end up paying quite a bit. So you young people had better have something more than Social Security to live on after you retire if you don’t want your standard of living to go way down. We’re doing OK so far as my husband was wise enough to do some investing with the legacy left to us in his dad’s will. We’ve used up one investment as he’s been retired for 11 years now, and have not had to touch our annuities yet. But do to age, we’re going to have to start withdrawing there, too.
    Just a warning to those of you who wish for socialized medicine. It will not be free. It will not only cost an arm and a leg in taxes, it will cost in jobs lost. Businesses will cut back due to the rise in taxes.

    • http://internetexplorer Rosebud

      to American Citizen
      Another thing that is never mentioned is any insurance you have as a supplement will not pay on anything that Medicare won’t pay on. Believe me when I say there are a lot of things Medicare doesn’t pay or the treatment you get is from the middle ages. You can’t get modern medicine from Medicare.

      • American Citizen

        We have never had a claim denied. Medicare even paid most of the cost of a lift chair for my husband. Even though we may have to pay something for medical care, I don’t think it should be entirely free anyway. That way, people will use it responsibly and not go to the ER for a cold as some do now. We need to use some common sense in our medical treatments. For the government to force us to do anything is wrong. What nationalized health care will amount to is legalized euthanasia for people with a catastrophic illness.

  • http://internetexplorer Rosebud

    Here is a piece for all of you to read. I found it very damning to the people who you all think help you. Democrats have done more damage to this nation and it’s people than anyone.

    Our Social Security

    Franklin Delano. Roosevelt (Terms of Office March 4, 1933, to April 12, 1945), a Democrat, introduced the Social Security (FICA) Program. He promised:

    1.) That participation in the Program would be Completely voluntary,

    2.) That the participants would only have to pay 1% of the first $1,400 of their annual Incomes into the Program,

    3.) That the money the participants elected to put Into the Program would be deductible from Their income for tax purposes each year,

    4.) That the money the participants put into the Independent ‘Trust Fund’ rather than into the General operating fund, and therefore, would Only be used to fund the Social Security Retirement Program, and no other Government program, and

    5.) That the annuity payments to the retirees would never be taxed as income

    Since many of us have paid into FICA for years and are now receiving a Social Security check every month — and then finding that we are getting taxed on 85% of the money we paid to the Federal government to ‘Put Away’ — you may be interested in the following:

    Insert by Vincent Peter Render,
    If I recall correctly, 1958 is the first year that Congress voted to remove funds from Social Security and put it into the General Fund for Congress to spend.

    If I recall correctly, it was a democratically Controlled Congress.

    From what I understand, Congress logic at that time was that there was so much money in Social Security Fund that it would never run out / be used up for the purpose it was intended / set aside for.

    Question: Which Political Party took Social Security from the Independent ‘Trust Fund’ and put it into the General Fund so that Congress could spend it?

    Answer: It was Lyndon B. Johnson (Democrat, Term Of Office: November 22, 1963 to January 20, 1969) and the democratically Controlled House and Senate.

    Question: Which Political Party started taxing Social Security annuities?

    Answer: The Democratic Party, with Albert Arnold Gore, Jr. (Al Gore) [Vice President Term of Office: January 20, 1993 to January 20, 2001] casting the ‘tie-breaking’ deciding vote as President of the Senate, while he was Vice President of the US

    Question: Which Political Party decided to start giving Annuity payments to immigrants?

    AND MY FAVORITE:
    Answer: That’s right! James Earl Carter, Jr. (Jimmy Carter) (Democrat, Term of Office: January 20, 1977 to January 20, 1981) and the Democratic Party.

    Immigrants moved into this country, and at age 65, began to receive Social Security payments! The Democratic Party gave these payments to them, even though they never paid a dime into it!

    Then, after violating the original contract (FICA), the Democrats turn around and tell you that the Republicans want to take your Social Security away!

    And the worst part about it is uninformed citizens believe it!

    If enough people receive this, maybe a seed of Awareness will be planted and maybe changes will Evolve. Maybe not, some Democrats are awfully Sure of what isn’t so.

    But it’s worth a try How many people can YOU send this to?

    Actions speak louder than bumper stickers.

    Thomas Jefferson
    3rd. President, Democrat
    Term of Office: January 20, 1777 to January 20, 1781
    ‘A government big enough to give you everything you want, is strong enough to take everything you have.’

  • Dale

    Many of you may already be familiar with this former
    Scottish History Professors timeline of a democracy.
    But if not, here it is. And sadly, it’s quite telling if not
    prophetic.

    About the time our original thirteen states adopted their new constitution in 1787, Alexander Tyler, a Scottish history professor at the University of Edinburgh , had this to say about the fall of the Athenian Republic some 2,000 years earlier:

    “A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as a permanent form of government.”
    “A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury.”
    ( Hmmmm, that sure sounds familiar )
    “From that moment on, the majority always vote for the candidates who PROMISE [ like Obama ] the most BENEFITS from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to LOOSE FISCAL POLICY, which is always followed by a DICTATORSHIP.”
    “The average age of the world’s greatest civilizations
    from the beginning of history,
    has been about 200 years.”

    “During those 200 years, those nations always progressed through the following sequence:”

    “1. from bondage to spiritual faith;
    2. from spiritual faith to great courage;
    3. from courage to liberty;
    4. from liberty to abundance;
    5. from abundance to complacency;
    6. from complacency to apathy;
    7. from apathy to dependence;
    [ this is where the U.S. is currently at ]
    8. From dependence back into bondage

    The question is, are Americans ready for the NEW
    economic SLAVERY to the government?

    I don’t know whether to laugh hysterically at the irony or cry because of the ABSURDITY. Maybe Obamas book should have been titled “The Absurdity of Hope”. What’s that old maxim about “robbing Peter to pay Paul”?

    I guess as long as we all get to…”share the wealth” we should all be happy. And as we all know being a happy idiot is better than being a miserable prophet. The former doesn’t know he’s doomed until it’s too late to care. The latter KNOWS he’s doomed…BECAUSE of the happy IDIOTS!
    Lenin called them “USEFUL IDIOTS”.

  • American Citizen

    I was listening to Cincinnati, Ohio’s radio station WLW this morning. The program’s host was Eric Deeters who has some words of wisdom for us. Being a businessman, a restaurant owner, he knows what’s what. He said, and I quote, “If there is no profit, there is nothing to tax.” Take that you politicians and people jealous of “the rich.”

    He also said that debt enslaves you. Think about it, when you owe money to anyone, it enslaves you. That’s why I pay everything off as quickly as possible.

    A caller said, “The stimulus was never meant to work, it’s a power grab.” How true.

  • DaveH

    Any of you who don’t want to be Guinea Pigs for the United Nations’ WHO need to read this webpage:
    http://elist.healthfreedomalliance.org/display.php?M=148075&C=9622f62ce8a3321d159f4466b22427e4&S=125&L=1&N=125

  • paul

    Regardless of how you feel about these issues, it doesn't do any good to call each

    other names. Stick to the discussion.My thinking is if anyone wants my vote in the next election this is what I want.
    1. health care that is afforadable that the patient and physicians make the dicisions, not some government fluncky.
    2. No amnesty for illegals and deportation of those that are here.
    3. If we send our troops to fight, give them the ability to do the job and the permission to finish the job. This is where Bush screwed up. If he had let them finish
    we wouldn’t be in the situation we are in.
    Stop this idea of globilication and hopfully get out of the U.N. which we should have done long ago.Don’t even think of forming the NAU[north american union}
    4. Foremost any laws passed,include the congress and governmemt employees
    and not be extempt.Make them be part of social security and any other things they
    enjoy.
    5. Finally, stop giving cititizenship to babies foreign parents, legal or illegal. Also
    do away with dual cititizenship.Require immigrants to learn english to become cititzens.

  • FarRightWinger

    Uncle Sam is getting a bit nasty on destroying family values. Read this note from the American Family Association’s (www.afa.net) what Sammie is up to:
    “National Education Association’s top lawyer touts their real purpose and says those who promote traditional values are a group of “right-wing b**rds”

    July 21, 2009

    Dear XXXX,
    The National Education Association’s (NEA) top lawyer, Bob Chanin, recently made clear the goal of the NEA. He called those who believe in and work for traditional family values are “b**rds.” He also praised the NEA because the organization has “power” and “hundreds of millions” of dollars from dues to spend in promoting their agenda and political candidates.

    I have included an article which shows, in their own words, what the NEA is doing. It is time for Christians who are members of the NEA to get out. We are funding the demise of Western Civilization. Please read this article!

    Chanin’s volley left no doubt where the NEA wants to take the public education system, and our children. It also served as a wake-up call for those who might be considering taking their children out of public schools.

    If you are a member of NEA, I suggest you contact some more teacher friends and discuss this matter with them.

    If you need legal help, I suggest you contact one of the two organizations listed below:

    Liberty Council http://www.lc.org
    Alliance Defense Fund http://www.telladf.org

  • DaveH

    We have gone from a nation of rugged pioneers to a nation of whining beggars in just 230 years.

  • American Citizen

    Socialism has never worked because it levels the playing field and all become poor. Those who would have worked say, “why bother” when the proceeds will be taken away anyway. There will always be those who won’t work and wait for the handouts. Where is it written that what I earn can be taken away by the government and given to someone else? I can’t find it in the Constitution.
    We once again have taxation without representation. The whole Congress and Federal Government need to be turned out and replaced by people of integrity and common sense. The problem is in finding decent people who want the job.

  • American Citizen

    It took me a while, but after reading the posts here and listening to them on TV and radio, I have reached the conclusions that not only are the Dems and Libs averse to truth, they have a comprehension problem. I worked with children for 15 years who had a comprehension problem. It’s bad when they can’t comprehend what they read or hear. They have no ability to see into the future and see unintended consequences of what the government wants to do to us. Wake up America before it’s too late. You have only your freedoms to lose.

  • Rod OH

    Brtien (author), I have never read such inspired “fear mongering” garbage in my life. I do not know where you got your “facts”(?) but I would suggest you start your next article with different sources. When are you people who support the greedy, capitalists – who just about brought down our nation – going to wake up? Oh, I forgot…that is who pays you isn’t it?

    • American Citizen

      Rod, who pay you? What poor person gives you a paycheck? Have you looked at your paycheck to see what the government forces you to pay in taxes? It’s legalized theft.

    • American Citizen

      For that matter, it was not the corporations that brought us to our present dilemma, it was the loan companies who were supposed to be overseen by the Democrats. And the Democrats are only making it worse with their so-called remedies. You can’t dig yourself out of a hole by making the hole bigger.

      Also, it was not Wall Street’s fault. Stocks are not only owned by the “rich” but also by millions of ordinary citizens like us. Stocks rise and fall as companies rise and fall. Yes, there are some greedy people who make a lot of money off them, but for the most part a lot of people rely on them to subsidize their Social Security as we do.

      • Rod OH

        American Citizen, if you are going to live up to your “Blog Moniker” I suggest you get yourself a tad more “educated” on these subjects before you open your mouth. We aere in this mess because the REPUBLICANS were in control from 2000 to 2006 at which time from ’06 to ’08 they still cintrolled the Senate. So do not hand me that garbage about the Dems. And quite simply, we are in this mess because all the good smart regulations were stripped away by Republicans/Conservatives because their argument was “businesses and the free market will police itself”. We’ll it does not take a “rocket scientist” to see the results of those theories does it?

        • American Citizen

          The Democrats were in charge of overseeing Freddie and Fannie. President Bush tried to tell Congress there were problems, but Rangel and Dodd, both Democrats in charge of overseeing those companies, promised Congress that all was well when it obviously wasn’t. Also, the Democrats have been in charge of Congress that last 2 1/2 years. So, yes, it was the Dems who were the overseers of the current situation which they are now making worse. There were even warnings over two years ago on the internet by economic gurus of the coming housing downturn. Educate yourself.

  • Rod OH

    American Citizen, the proverbial “horse getting out of the barn” on bad loans occurred when the Republicans had control of both houses. When the Dems took over the House in the last two years of W”s “debacle”, the damage had all ready been done. Let me ask you one to see if you are as “educated as you think you are. What political party pushes the “free market concept and self-regulation of businesses”? It cetainly is not the Democrats.n And don’t try to argue with me about the “lending crisis”. I know far more about that than you do.

    • Valerie

      Rod, you may want to read the article from Rolling Stone regarding the tangled web of Goldman Sachs & who’s involved & where some are now employed.

      I was a democrat until early 2008……now I’m just a very concerned American,
      scared of what change will take my rights & liberties away on a day to day basis.

      I’m still a free American but I fear for my children & grandchildren. I hope they may be able to say the same thing even in the next decade.

      • Rod OH

        Valerie, I have voted Republican 90% of my voting life. I am still a registered Republican but let me tell you why. I want to be able to vote against (and work against) the next “right wing, wing nut” they send our way. A party that could actually run and endorse an incompetent, rambling, incoherent airhead like Sarah Palin does not deserve my support. That was the “last straw” as far as I (and evidently a lot of fellow moderates) were concerned. I can no longer support these old dinosaur relics of the past, these conservative clowns who call themselves “leaders”.

        • Valerie

          Rod, do you like Obama & his socialist agendas?

          I’m a democrat by party but couldn’t vote for his radial left wing ideas. I’m hoping a third party forms & there is someone who has a clue what to do to strighten this country back out. I value all my freedoms & liberties like a whole lot of other people do….it’s getting pretty scary anymore.

        • Rod OH

          Valerie, I assume it was you that replied to me. The “socialist” label is so unfair and right out of the “conservative playbook”. I watch, I listen, I read (all kinds of publications) but most of all I observe what is going on. Mr. Obama and Harry Reid have “welcomed” the Blue Dogs onto the scene. These two leaders – that conservative Republicans mislabel as “socialist” – are moderates. They will bring about needed changes to the middle class, who have been abused by conservatives (who are really plutocrats in concept and philosophy). They just know how to push your “emotional hot buttons” on grey area concept issues such as freedom, liberty, guns rights etc. It is called “sleight of hand” misinformation so that you do not focus on the issues that really affect your life more (i.e. energy policy, health insurance, sound and fair financial systems etc.) I fully support our current President to make the changes our society (with its 300 million population) needs.

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