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More Assaults By The Food Police

May 4, 2011 by  

More Assaults By The Food Police

The fascist government elites continued their assault on American liberty last week with separate raids on an Amish farm that was committing the “crime” of selling raw milk and a natural supplement company that violated U.S. Food and Drug Administration labeling rules.

In Pennsylvania, armed Federal thugs wearing flak jackets swooped in on Rainbow Acres Farms and bashed in doors like they were raiding Osama bin Laden’s compound. The raid came after a months-long “investigation” that saw agents using assumed names and surreptitiously purchasing products from across State lines so they could apply the misused “interstate commerce clause” of the Constitution, according to a report in The Washington Times.

In Oregon, the FDA, IRS and FBI raided Maxam Nutraceutics, a company that produces and sells nutritional supplements primarily for autism spectrum disorders and Alzheimer’s disease.

Maxam’s “crime” was using customer testimonials about its products. According to the medical fascists in the FDA, repeating what customers say about your products turns those products into unapproved drugs.

So the FDA’s position is that natural products — like raw milk, which man has consumed as far back as time can be recorded — are illegal and harmful, but falsely marketed drugs from Big Pharma, with at best dubious research on their effectiveness, are perfectly okay for consumers. And falsely labeling food products by claiming they contain fruit, even though they only contain artificial fruit concoctions and contain no fruit whatsoever, is legal, but using the words of actual customers to promote products is not.

The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention and the FDA take the position that raw milk can be contaminated with harmful bacteria and that pasteurized milk provides all the nutrients of raw milk without the danger. The truth is, pasteurized milk is a dead food. All the benefits of the milk are removed in the pasteurization process. And there had been no complaints of anyone becoming ill from consuming Rainbow Acres Farms milk.

This is just another example of the medical tyranny and corporatocracy in which we now live.

Hat Tip: Naturalnews.com

Bob Livingston

is an ultra-conservative American who has been writing a newsletter since 1969. Bob has devoted much of his life to research and the quest for truth on a variety of subjects. Bob specializes in health issues such as nutritional supplements and alternatives to drugs, as well as issues of privacy (both personal and financial), asset protection and the preservation of freedom.

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  • Karolyn

    This just makes my blood boil! What can we do? I write to my congressmen every time I receive info from the ANH about pending bills, but what can we do to help people like these Amish? I wish the writers would have some suggestions for us when they write these articles. A while ago I read about a family in Washington (?) that was shut down because some of their cheese had been contaminated. The whole farm was shut down even though most of their cheese was just fine. They have a facebook page to raise awareness and take donations. I will have to try to find it when I can.

    • TIME

      Karolyn
      Well perhap when you do wake up it will be way to late, so just try and grasp this while you sleep; (if this makes your blood boil) just wait until your told when you can eat.

      As I have said it over and over again there is “NO DIFFERANCE” in political partys when they are in fact one in the same.

      Thus you like Barry who is related by BLOOD to GWB so to are the Clintons and on and on it goes.

      “YOU as well all Americans” Let alone “all Europen’s” have been PROGRAMED like trained MONKEYS to act as your told to do. To eat what your told to, To buy what your told to. To speak what your told to – thats called PC behavior.

      But its all ~ “Behavior Modification” by way of POLITICAL enforced LAWS, as well MEDIA brain washing that takes place every day of your life, rather it be on the radio or TELIE or printed matter.

      For God sake; Hitler was the Blue print to see how well all this would work and just look at what he was able to do by making the German Population all by Mandate of LAW – buy a People Radio, and Mandated MOVIES twice per week!

      He was able to bring a cultured country to the point of becoming MONSTERS.
      So what do you think the FCC, DOE, FTC, IRS, FED, DOJ, FBI, CIA, ABC, CBS, NBC, MSNBC, CNN, FOX, and all other Media formats combined let alone Government slave masters have done to your minds in the last 50 years. Its all for YOUR own good, to KEEP you safe from yourself!

      If everyone were to turn off your Telies, and not listen to the radio nor go to the MOVIES, Nor text, not call on a phone or even use a computer for just six months.
      Do you have any idea what would happen?

      You would all start to break the bonds that YOUR GOVERNMENT has placed on you.
      WE; as in the world have become JUNKIES for becoming SLAVES to the STATE.

      And don’t even try and tell me you not, I read your post you do!

      WAKE UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

      • Klaus

        Good point made. I was born at the beginning of WW2 in Germany, and from what my parents have told me of what really went on, we are not that far removed. I try to tell this to people, and all i get is blank stares. We are in huge trouble.

        • Bitter Libertarian

          Yeppers….I get the same…ZOMBIE STARE….I am going to be updating my Will (not that it matters) but, I dont expect to see social securitry for a number of reasons, the biggest is that I will not live without a Constitution. they suspend it as they plan…and the ZOMBIE BLACK UNIFORMED NAZI’s come crashing in, I will not go down quietly.

          • Al Sieber

            Bitter L, I’m with you I won’t go down quietly either, it’s our duty to fight against evil. we out number them.

          • DaveH

            If and when that happens, do not try to go toe to toe. You’ve got to be smarter than they are.

          • Al Sieber

            I know Dave, being smarter then them is easy, I’m not advocating starting anything just protecting me and mine.

          • guy65

            Rock on Man!!

        • karolyn

          I feel very fortunate in that I have met many people with the same view of this situation. However, the local man on the street here doesn’t have a clue about these health related issues and the FDA

          • Bitter Libertarian

            Why doesnt the “man on the street know?

          • karolyn

            Bitter – Well, because they are not educated or don’t care. I live in a rural SC county. Althugh our county is not as bad as some around us, we do have a lotof poverty. Of course, the people with money may very well be aware, but the lower classes are very apathetic. There’s not enough education. People live in their own little bubbles.

          • Bitter Libertarian

            I agree. so if I were to switch this issue to NYC…it would be safe to say then that a huge % of people are in a Bubble..clueless…or my favorite term…zombies. But how could that be if they are educated enough to read?

          • DaveH

            Think about what you said, Karolyn, “people live in their own little bubbles”. Be careful with those pins, Karolyn.

          • karolyn

            Bitter – I just wonder if the people in NYC might just be more informed. Of course, I knw you have the difference in the upper east side and the lower west side to consider. As far as reading, I would have to say that the majaority of the people are just plain too apathetic, and there’s nothing we can do about that.

          • karolyn

            I meant he upper westside and the lower eastside.

          • Ellen

            Most people are too busy with their jobs and responsibilities to have time to read about food and health. They rely on our govt to set up rules and keep us safe. I live in an upper middle class neighborhood and can easily say that most of the people I know are well educated yet are clueless about the FDA and its corruption. Several of my friends take statins and other drugs because they trust their doctors and the FDA. Maybe the poor don’t have access to health info, but others don’t have the time to question, or even a clue that they should be questioning, health issues. All anyone needs to do is look around to see our overweight population to realize something is wrong. If our food supply was properly regulated, we wouldn’t have trans fats, artificial sweeteners, and a list of other products in our food supply.

          • Kate8

            Being educated by BigBro has nothing to do with how aware one is. Aware people take it upon themselves to look beyond public indoctrination to find out what’s really going on. “Mainstream” education is more of a hindrance when one really wants to learn.

            karolyn, I applaud your ability to see into this monstrous scheme by government to control what we eat. If only you were able to apply that same discernment across the board…it’s the very same people who are doing the things you read about here everyday and, for the most part, support.

          • vicki

            Ellen writes:70
            “If our food supply was properly regulated, we wouldn’t have trans fats, artificial sweeteners, and a list of other products in our food supply.”

            The whole point of the article is that we have too much government regulation. Why would you then argue that we need regulation (implied government regulation)? A free people would regulate it themselves. So are you buying stuff with trans fats, artificial sweeteners and the list goes on? If so, why?

            To quote from a 1971 musical
            “Heal yourselves”

      • karolyn

        TIME – I am not who you think I am. I am not a “worshipper” of Obama; however, yes, I do “like” him. I have been awake to these issues for at least 10 years; and have an even longer track record of causes I have been passionate about. What I am against is extremism in any form, whether it be left or right.

        • TIME

          Karolyn,

          I am not an extremist, I am just a person who watchs, listens and learns. I see infringements, and BTW I do know who’s doing the deeds. I tell all of you when something is wrong, and rather than using deep brain tissue there are those that think they know something when they know really NOTHING, such as Manzire 47D cup.

          If everone gets their news from the same place, then no one can really know whats real and whats not. NPR is no differant that MSNBC.

          Again, I speak with meet with and know many of the people who all of us send to DC. I have to research daily for what I do thus I quite well understand how bent the system truly is.

          And for you folks that think that Wikipedia is accurate, let me just set the records straight. When I looked up myself I found over 35 totaly wrong statments. As in not even slightly true. They claim I invented a tec that I didn’t. They also claim I was born 3 years after I was was born. You have to ask how that works.
          So when I tell you that there is nothing you can trust I mean it.

          Our Government is and has been so bent for years as in when the World bankers & Progressives took control along with the aid of the Military Machine we all lost.

        • Bitter Libertarian

          Why is there extremism and why is it increasing?

          • karolyn

            You should know the answer to that, or are you just trying to bait me? Frustration breeds extremism.

          • Bitter Libertarian

            Bait you? Thats rather harsh suspecting me of that. Perhaps I’m asking to see whats going on in your head. Not Name calling…just curious…asking questions is how we get to know each other..yes?

          • DaveH

            “Frustration breeds Extremism?” Where do you get that stuff, Karolyn? You have been indoctrinated thoroughly. Maybe you need to join GLA (Government Lovers Anonymous) and deal with your addiction.

          • Kate8

            karolyn – Frustration breeds extremism? Sounds like a karolynism.

            Who can live through the insanity going on today and NOT feel a degree of frustration? Are you not frustrated with what’s happening to our food and health choices?

            And what is “extremism”, except people thinking in ways that goes against the prevailing, governing thought? Those considered “extremist” today were mainstream yesterday.

            Are we “extremist” for wanting to keep the liberties we’ve always enjoyed? Are we “extremist” for wanting to practice our faith with NO fear of government restriction? Are we “extremist” for NOT wanting to be forced into nationalized healthcare (something that, before now, could not even be possible in America)? Or for wanting to keep our right to bear arms? Or educate our children? How about grow a backyard garden, or choose our own lightbulbs?

            No, k, it’s those in control who are the extremists. The rest of us are just trying to find a way to restore some normalcy to our lives.

          • vicki

            Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice.

        • DaveH

          Okay, the first thing you need to get through your skull, Karolyn, is that the word “Extremist” is a manipulative word used by Big Government types to sway people who are ignorant of reality. As soon as you hear anybody use that term (including yourself) the red flag should go up.
          For instance, I have been called extremist for touting views that Government should leave me alone to control my own body and property. That’s accepted as Extreme these days? That alone should wake you to reality. If I am extreme for wanting to control my own body and property, what does that make them for wanting to control my body and property? If I am Extreme for wanting to keep my own money, what does that make them for wanting to take my money?

          Take those blinders off, Karolyn. You can do it! I promise you won’t go blind.

          • karolyn

            Dave, I know what you’re sayig. My problem is that going totally one way or the other to me is extremist. Like Ron Paul saying yesterday on Diane Rehm that people should not be helped in a disaster by the government. It’s either sink or swim. Well, that’s all fine and dandy to advocate, and there is merit to it; but it would be a sad day to see so many sink. I have always managed to swim, even if it was by the skin of my teeth; however, we are not all cut from the same cloth.

          • Kate8

            karolyn – “going one way or the other is extremist”? So, are you saying that we should all think the same? How very socialist of you.
            Socialism and communism don’t allow for individuality.

            “Extremism” is a very relative term. Our founders, thank God, were extremist in their day. Obama and his cohorts are definitely extremist in the face of traditional America, along the lines of Stalin and Hitler (he shares many of their ideals), extreme extremists.

            It is the “extremists” who wreak devastation, and install tyranny and misery. And it’s the “extremists” who leads to restoration and salvation. Most who are labeled such are not extremist at all but, rather, INDIVIDUAL.

            Without the true extremists, we are all nothing but lifeless sheep.

          • DaveH

            Karolyn,
            You listen to a few sound bites and make that determination about Ron Paul? He did not say that people shouldn’t be helped. He knows, as do I, that Voluntary help is much more effective than Government help. When Governors help, mostly they are helping themselves. With Voluntary help, you know their heart is in the right place. With Government help, they are inefficient because it isn’t their money, and they are more prone to using the event as a photo-op for re-election than they are prone to actually helping people.
            Read this ranking, Karolyn. These are countries ordered by their amount of Government. Those with Biggest Government last. Would you want to live in some of those countries at the bottom. Do you think for a minute that those Governments on the bottom don’t tell their citizens that they care about them?
            http://heritage.org/index/ranking

          • Harold Olsen

            “I have been called extremist for touting views that Government should leave me alone to control my own body and property.”

            Hell, all you have to do these days to be called an extremist is to say you believe in the US Constitution. The left considers it to be an illegal document.

          • Pat

            According to Hilary I am a ‘right-wing extremist’!
            It was Uncle Sam who gave me my first gun and taught me how to shoot it. It was the NYC public school system that taught me about the Constitution and what it means to be an American. It was the church that taught me spiritual values, and right and wrong. It was life that taught me what was really important. It was the government that taught me all about back-stabbing, lying, duplicity, greed, and lack of common decency and most importantly, lack of stewardship.
            Thank you, Hilary. I wear my title proudly (right next to ‘Patriot’!).

          • vicki

            Karolyn says:
            “Ron Paul saying yesterday on Diane Rehm that people should not be helped in a disaster by the government.”

            Correct. Not the job of government. We Americans have shown time and again (Just ask the Japanese) that we are VERY VERY willing to volunteer and help out disaster victims both here and abroad. As DaveH said we do not need nor want government meddling in this.

            “It’s either sink or swim. Well, that’s all fine and dandy to advocate, and there is merit to it; but it would be a sad day to see so many sink.”

            Fewer would sink if we kept government out of it. Recent example. Gulf of Mexico. An oil rig exploded and sank releasing a few million barrels of oil. Multiple private organizations rushed in to help. Most or all were warned away by our government. The same one that then did little or nothing for many days.
            http://www.examiner.com/scotus-in-washington-dc/obama-blocked-clean-up-of-bp-oil-spill-by-america-s-allies-failed-to-issue-timely-jones-act-waiver

            To quote (sortof) a past President. Government is not the solution. Government IS the problem.

          • Kate8

            Vicki – You said that far better than I could have.

            I’d vote for you.

        • Eddie47d

          Yes Time you are an extremist and a wanna be know it all. Mostly just a smartass towards anyone who isn’t as brilliant as you think that you are. So take your slanderous backstabbing and that one hell of an ego and put it to better use. Someone months ago said people like you who come across with your arrogance are “educated idiots”. I’m inclined to agree.

          • libertytrain

            Eddie is it so difficult to understand that you and your “friends” sound that way to the rest of us?

          • TIME

            Manzier 47 D cup,

            Lets face it your a 100% total MONKEY TOOL let alone truly as worthless as an old rusty bent nail.

            Thus you have a net sum of ZERO value, this is reflected within your post filled with mindless MONKEY TOOL dribble daily.
            Its one thing to have an opinion, it quite an other to be a so aggressively arrogant let alone totaly stupid.
            Thus in case’s like you I agree with the Progressives on the worthless eaters program.

            Go back to sleep Manzier 47 D Cup, when I need a MONKEY TOOL to amuse me I will rattel your cage.

          • Kate8

            eddie – You have to know that the posters of your ilk are considered fools by those who actually take an objective look at things.

            There are those of you who simply have your thinking downloaded by mission control, and there are those, including TIME, who are able to understand that there IS a “mission control” and take a look at just who they are and what they’re about.

            We’ve all seen too far into the smokescreen to even have time for your second-grade babble anymore.

            When this era is past, and before the next round of power-mongers manage to seize control of the new mind-crop and revise history again, your type will be remembered as no different than those who mindlessly supported the likes of Hitler, Stalin, Mao…and Obama.

          • DaveH

            As usual, the Union Troll Eddie’s first comment of the day is a personal attack.

          • JeffH

            …never a surprise to read a comment like 47D’s…

            “You differ from a great man in only one respect: the great man was once a very little man, but he developed one important quality: he recognized the smallness and narrowness of his thoughts and actions. Under the pressure of some task that meant a great deal to him, he learned to see how his smallness, his pettiness endangered his happiness. In other words, a great man knows when and in what way he is a little man. A little man does not know he is little and is afraid to know. He hides his pettiness and narrowness behind illusions of strength and greatness, someone else’s strength and greatness. He’s proud of his great generals but not of himself. He admires an idea he has not had, not one he has had. The less he understands something, the more firmly he believes in it. And the better he understands an idea, the less he believes in it.”
            — Wilhelm Reich

          • Eddie47d

            No Dave, you ignorant fool Time made a personal attack against me so pay attention if that is possible. Time with his head above the clouds attitude doesn’t take an objective view of anything. He’s an extremist in his views and that is his right. That doesn’t mean I have to buy it so stop defending his programmed thinking.(The real monkey) He needs to go back to his mountaintop and get a better view of things. His mind is far from clear and sometimes poisonous. Listening to him is like that old radio with constant static and his ego overflows like the Niagara Falls.

          • Eddie47d

            Thanks Jeff;You just described Time to a T.

          • JeffH

            Oh 47D, if only your mirror wasn’t broken!

          • TIME

            Manzier 47 D cup

            This old quote fits you to a tee.

            (“There is nothing wrong with you that reincarnation won’t cure.”)

            Oh BTW, thank you ever so much for all your complements, I can’t express how happy I am that I not only bring great joy to your day, but also seem to inspire your dull wit to even lower lows.

            Keep up the good work Manzier 47 D cup. Good On Ya.

          • DaveH

            Where did Time make an attack on you, Eddie aka. Union Thug? I mean before your comment?

          • Kate8

            TIME – You always know that when one of the token liberals attack you, you’ve said something right.

            Keep it up.

          • Jay

            Libertarian, eddie attacked you because you put one of his buddies, Karolyn, in her place! The commie regime that hang out here, stick together!

          • Jay

            The above post was meant for TIME.

          • Eddie47d

            Kate 8 and Dave H.; Go back and read Time’s 8:34am comment. Take the blinders off and see who he really is. I think it’s you righties who are the ones who stick together with your lynch mob and don’t see the forest through the trees. Karolyn makes comments that are very neutral yet some of you tear her apart. I will always defend the underdog when it come to unfair treatment or gang banging. If that is defending her then so be it. Time is certainly no underdog and loves chastising us “ignorant masses” and that includes you if you care to listen to how he says things.

          • Kate8

            eddie – My perception of people is based on far more than a single post. I have respect for TIME, and he sees things that most people don’t want to see. It’s frustrating at times when you want to share information gathered over many years and hours of research, only to be marginalized because others don’t want to believe it could be true, based on nothing more than emotional reaction.

            karolyn can hold her own, too. You libs know exactly what to expect when you come to a conservative site, so save your crockadile tears. You do your share of mocking and deriding and, often, we aren’t even talking to you.

            You know what they say…if you can’t take the heat. Personally, I have nothing against you or karolyn. I could almost think there’s some hope for you, if you’d just try to think outside of the box.

          • DaveH

            Eddie, I don’t understand why you hang around here. I would think you’d want to be on a site with people that share your morality and respect for other human beings (that is none), like on a Liberal site.

      • Al Sieber

        Good post TIME, keep spreading the word, but it’s too late to wake most people up. ever heard of Albert Pike and the 3 world wars? just “goggle Albert Pike”, this has been going on for years, and Obama is just another pawn in the game.

      • DaveH

        Time,
        Have you watched Judge Napolitano’s Freedom Watch? Or the John Stossel show? Both on Fox Business Network. I think you wouldn’t be dissing Fox if you have. Both have boldly told the people how it is. Shut up Fox and you shut up the only source of Freedom information to the ignorant masses.

        • TIME

          Dave,

          Don’t get me wrong, what I said is that {all Media gets their base intel from the same place.}
          On that note we all get no matter what form a of story line, it has been pre chosen for your viewing. As well worded in the way they want to express the message, its all on a telie that the news castors read from.

          Look we all can’t know everything, but if enough people who know something about areas that we are for a lack of a better term experts in. Thus when we see media corvage we can pick it apart, then we all aid each other in learning where the FLAWS are, or whats not the TRUTH.

          Such as Barry Sunday 5/1/2011 telie speach, He stated the following;
          We have “Proof Positive by way of DNA” and other methods that we have killed OBL.
          Look I may not be an expert but I know the guy who figured all the DNA issues out quite well, as in really well.
          As well have been working with others on this very topic over the last two years. So when I hear that a DNA test was done in less than 8 hours that proved beyond any question – I know thats 100% total Bull Sh*t.
          Be that as it may, I gave Fox the chance to tell the truth, they didn’t, no more so than any of the others.
          Glenn Beck even went so far as to make fun of anyone who would dare question what was fed to the American public.

          As to the Judge he seems like a good man, John I met him years ago he is a nice guy, I am sure he is doing the best he can.

          Dave I am just saying, people have to learn to read between the lines, whats not said many times is of a higher value than what is said.

          • Kate8

            TIME – I agree with you. (As for OBL’s DNA, that could have been in storage for a long time, especially if he was, as many say, a CIA agent. We’ll probably never get the real story.)

            I began quesioning FoxNews some time ago. Even the more conservative seemed to be slowly merging with leftist thought, falling in line, marginalizing conservatives who brough up politically incorrect questions…

            When the Saudis invested in Fox, I knew something was off. I heard that Fox was recently sold…Soros?…Not that Murdoch wasn’t already one of the elite club.

            I don’t get FoxBusiness. I always liked the Judge, but how long (or how much) can anyone hold out against BigBro? O’Reilly fell, Hannity, Beck…all of them. Who knows what pressure is put upon them. But anyone who thinks the PTB don’t play serious, and for keeps, is still living in lalaland.

          • DaveH

            Where did they get Bin Laden’s DNA? Did he register at the DMV? Or the local Blood Bank?
            I do not believe anything the Obama administration says.

          • Carlucci

            Me neither. As soon as Ovomit or any other federale or lame stream idiot starts blathering, I think to myself “it is probably just the opposite”, and then I change the channel to HGTV.

          • libertytrain

            Dave re DNA – the report I heard early on when they were first breaking the story – I think I was watching CBS initially – one of the reporters mentioned that they had gotten a court order to procure the brain of bin Laden’s sister who had died in this country of cancer and they were keeping it somewhere. So that is what this reporter was told by sources as to how they compared the DNA. I had not heard that on any other channel or since that one mention of it.

          • DaveH

            So it could have been her other brothers (she had 50 brothers and sisters), or maybe even other related people. Like I said, I don’t believe anything that comes from the Obama administration.

            Read this one:
            http://www.angelfire.com/home/pearly/htmls1/osama-bio.html

          • kodster5

            EXACTLY, Time! DNA tests are normally in the time frame of a minimum of a week. That’s why I read/heard that they took a week to come out with the raid and killing of Osama bin Laden, to make sure it was him that they killed, and not some poor other SOB, like al-Qaeda used before, in a cave that was bombed, to throw us off his trail. And THEN, they come back and said, we killed him today, when Obama made his announcement Sunday night?????

            That’s why I don’t believe anything that comes out of this administration’s mouth, collectively. And you’re right… Progressivism (pseudo-socialism) started in full strength when Teddy Roosevelt became president… more than 100 years ago. It has taken a very long time to get to this point, and it will not change back overnight. Everyone is blaming Obama for all our evils, but they have to start looking at themselves, for allowing it to happen.

            Karolyn, my eyes were opened, 12 years ago, to the evils of this world. That’s when I realized that I was raised with the common sense to question everything, and look beneath the surface of whatever was being presented to me. I was taught critical thinking… a sore lacking skill in today’s society. And I realized that my path was guided by a larger force than me… I call Him God… others may call it something else.

          • Harold Olsen

            “…all Media gets their base intel from the same place…”

            You are right. I do not trust ANY of the media to give us the whole truth. They just give us THEIR version of the truth. And that goes for this web side as well.

          • JKO

            Glenn Beck was being sarcastic – at least on his TV show. He encourages daily that we search and find the truth for ourselves.
            And FOX does break stories on occasion. Remember just before Bush was elected in 2000 a story broke about his using drugs earlier in life? Broken by Carl Cameron on FOX. He shared the story and said they did talk about waiting to break it but decided that the American public needed to know. And, according to Carl, Bush actually congratulated him on good journalism. There have been others as well. But time and space hold me back. I do get your point that most stories do come from AP and Reuters though. But FOX will be the station that figures out when something is wrong if anyone does.

          • Jay

            DaveH, you beat me to the punch! I was thinking about that all day. Off course, how else would they be able to confirm the DNA retrieved from, supposedly, Laden’s corpse, without an original sample to compare it to? The latest, Obama gave orders not to release the photographs of, again, supposedly, dead Bin Laden! How desperate is this Despot masquerading as the friend of the people?

          • libertytrain

            DaveH – liked your link and this was interesting as well re the dead sister – http://thephoenix.com/BLOGS/phlog/archive/2011/05/02/osama-s-sister-s-brain-the-boston-connection.aspx
            I must have heard that one on ABC; And I thought that as well – could have been any number of kinfolk in that “mansion” –

          • Jay
          • Void1972

            TIME,
            You are correct about the talking heads and how corrupt our media really is.
            Most of these over payed puppets are given a script everyday, and told what to say. By pleasing the left and pissing off the right, and pleasing the right and pissing off the left, they keep the sheep divided.
            As far as Osamas DNA goes, didn’t Obama make Osama his Terrorist czar?

          • DaveH

            The latest, according to Judge Napolitano, is that Bin Laden was unarmed, so there was no reason to shoot him. So we go into a foreign country without their permission, and shoot an unarmed man instead of apprehending him. I guess we know where that leaves us peons.

          • DaveH

            That is if it was even Bin Laden. For sure, if he was guilty, he deserves to die, but anymore I just don’t believe anything Government says. They have earned my distrust.

        • Carlucci

          And speaking of that, this article about clothes washers just came in to my email:

          http://mises.org/

          Oh, fabulous. Now they are going to regulate that and we won’t have clean clothes. Reminds me of what is happening in San Francisco, because the dummies there installed low flow toilets in PUBLIC restrooms! So guess what the obvious result is? Sewerage backup! I knew those people were crazy, but apparently they are also full of sh**…

          • DaveH

            It’s all about Power, Carlucci. I know you know that.

          • Kate8

            Carlucci – I know that when I got my energy-efficient front-loader, my clothes haven’t come out white since.

            They are also made to be remote-controlled by your smartmeter, so if they don’t want you doing your laundry in the afternoon, you won’t…

            Agenda 21.

          • kodster5

            LOL, Carlucci… full of sh** = sewerage backup! With those toilets, I always smile to myself… yea, right… you have to flush twice to get rid of the damned sh**! So what’s the point???

          • Carlucci

            DaveH says:
            May 4, 2011 at 11:51 am

            It’s all about Power, Carlucci. I know you know that.

            Yes, Darling, I DO know that. I was just making a joke about those people in California, a.k.a. the “land of fruits and nuts” (no offense to Kate8 or anyone who lives there – I love California) being full of sh** because of their lame idea to try to conserve water with low flow toilets installed in public bathrooms. By the way, I forgot to mention that now the dummies are polluting the water in the bay by pouring tons of chlorine bleach into the pipes to try to get rid of the poop and smell. Yep, leave it to the government – those people could screw up a wet dream….

          • Carlucci

            Kate8 – I still have a front loader that is a couple of years old. I did notice when my eighteen year old front loading Kenmore finally bit the dust that my new washer didn’t seem to clean as well. So now I use a detergent with baking soda, and I’ll pour some white vinegar into the wash and rinse water. For whites, I’ve been using Cheer Bright Clean, a little bit of Oxyclean powder, and then I put some bluing in the rinse water, so they’ll come out bright and white. This is all on a cold water wash cycle.

          • libertytrain

            I’ve recently been purchasing 20 Mule Team Borax to add to the laundry as Grandma used to do – I also do the vinegar as well on occasion.

          • Carlucci

            Actually, I meant that I have a top loader washing machine, not a front loader.

          • karolyn

            liberty – Are you aware that Borax is good for getting rid of fleas? You sprinkle it on carpets and let it sit to dehydrate the fleas and eggs and then vacuum it up.

          • Kate8

            Carlucci – Before you laugh too hard at California, surely you know that Agenda 21 is worldwide, already in place in some countries, and will be at your door very soon.

            This is UN policy, and is already mandated. They just hit California first, since most people here are already dependent on government for everything.

            Lots of us are resisting the smartmeter, even though the state has declared it law. If I lived elsewhere, I’d be forming citizen groups now to try to stop it. You can be sure that your state legislatures are on it, and your local governing bodys are being indoctrinated as we speak.

            Don’t wait until they arrive to install your smartmeter.

          • karolyn

            Kate – You don’t know South Carolina! It’s still the same as when it was the first state to secede from the Union. VERY independent – EVEN my moderate Democrat state reps.

          • libertytrain

            Karolyn, I was not aware of that. Good to know. I had a problem when we first moved to NC 14 years ago, but never since. I will keep it in mind in case it occurs again.

          • Carlucci

            Kate8 – Please don’t take offense. I really love California and have been there quite a few times. If money were no object, I’d probably choose to live in Big Sur or Carmel. I adore San Francisco and Sausalito, too.

            I don’t doubt the Agenda 21 deal, but being here in Texas, I have a feeling that the people of Big T will fight that big time.

          • Kate8

            Carlucci – LOL. No offense taken, especially not from you.

            Agenda 21 is a worldwide mandate. Don’t make the mistake of thinking your state can worm out of it…it can’t, unless you start making yourself heard. I’ll bet if you look into it, you’ll find it already in place.

            I was born and raised in CA. It hasn’t always been this bastion of liberalism. My county was, until a very few years ago, the MOST conservative in the state. I grieves me to see what’s happened here.

            Many years ago (when I was 15), I went to NYC to visit my sister. They called us fruits and nuts even then! In NYC! I couldn’t understand it then.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        You Get an Atta Boy, TIME!

      • Ellen

        Does anyone find this ironic? The Amish are the healthiest people in America and the corrupt FDA shuts them down for a health violation. They don’t have autism because they don’t use vaccines. They don’t eat food filled with additives, so they don’t have obesity, diabetes, and cholesterol issue like 2/3 of the rest of us. We should be using them as a case study for how to improve, instead we’re raiding them over bogus crap.

        • TIME

          Ellen,

          Thank You your post is brilliant! :-)

        • Kate8

          Ellen – That is exactly why they’re being targeted.

          The agenda is population reduction. Genocide. They need to control the food supply. People all over America, Europe, even India and the third world, are waking up to the fact that our food is being engineered to kill us, and the assault is being accelerated on all fronts.

          More and more people are seeking out wholesome, unaltered, food, and this interfere’s with the PLAN. So they’re going all out to shut down all producers of natural products.

          Just wait until Obamacare sets in. We’ll have no more freedom to make ANY decisions about our children, or our own bodies. O’care is nothing but the last push to encroach on us beyond the limits of our skin.

          I’m trying to get my veggie garden in, but the water rates are escalating so fast that soon none of us will be able to keep plants alive. Another part of the plan.

          • Marty S.

            Sink a well and don’t tell.

        • Harold Olsen

          I live in Seattle and if there was an Amish community nearby I’d try to buy my food from them. I’m allergic to nearly everything I eat and drink and I am sure it is the preservatives and other junk that is put in our food. I’ve tried eating stuff from health food stores, which is supposed to be natural, but I still sneeze and get a runny nose when I eat. Even taking a drink of water makes me sneeze.

          It amazes me that this same Nazi government does not believe we have a right to control our bodies when it comes to the food we eat, but they do believe in the right to control one’s body when it comes to murdering children in the womb.

          That, to me, proves they do not have our welfare in mind when they force themselves on our liberties, but that it is just about power. They just want to control every aspect of our lives. And it’s like someone on this forum indicated they will soon be telling us when we can go to the bathroom–or maybe IF we can.

          • Kate8

            Harold Olsen – I don’t know if you are aware that the military has been conducting bio, chemical and sonar experimentation over the west coast for the past few years, and accelerated it about 2 years ago. We are being bombarded with so much toxic stuff that we are all experiencing troubling health symptoms, even the kids.

            Check out this link, and find others. We are being poisoned on a daily basis, and in a big way.

            http://d1027732.mydomainwebhost.com/articles/articles/Weather%20Modification%20and%20Wildfires.htm

            I used to have the link for an actual government document stating the authority and intent of the military to conduct such experimentation on the population, but I haven’t looked for it lately. I think it’s already more than “experimentation”. More like mass depopulation.

        • Bitter Libertarian

          Excellent Point!!

        • DaveH

          Have you noticed all the movies about the Amish lately, Ellen? Some of them cast the Amish in a bad light. I wonder if that’s purposeful? Makes me wonder what their (the movie makers) angle is.

          • Kate8

            DaveH – Just like all of the movies that have come out about Christians paints them as backward, bigoted, mean-spirited and intolerant.

            Why do you suppose that is?

            Do you still not understand the NWO, and how insidious and pervasive they are? And how dedicated they are to controlling our minds and our very persons? And how long they’ve been working at it?

          • libertytrain

            You know you are right about that. Personally, I’ve always been a little in kind of an awe in how they lived the life they did and do.

          • DaveH

            Kate,
            I have never said anything about the NWO. No doubt there are leaders that want to control the world. That is nothing new to me. My question is what have you done about it? I have been pushing Libertarianism for 40 years now (mostly on propagandized and deaf ears). That’s how I know that your conspiracy theories are DOA. People just don’t want to believe such things. We need to stick to easily provable facts.

          • Kate8

            DaveH -Where on Earth have you been? The NWO is openly called for now by world leaders. You really need to read more.

            I try my best to open the eyes of all I know with information. Too many of them, like you, don’t want to hear it, though.

            You deride me for my “conspiracy theories” but, I’m here to tell you, I’m not the only one who knows about them. And the only reason you don’t is because you haven’t wanted to look.

            Will someone help me out here? I know many of you are aware.

          • DaveH

            Kate,
            Do you suffer from a reading disability?
            You said “Do you still not understand the NWO, and how insidious and pervasive they are?” (the operative word being “still”).
            I simply replied “I have never said anything about the NWO”. And I haven’t. So how do you come to the conclusion that I “still not understand the NWO” when I haven’t said a word about them? I don’t give a damn about the NWO, because with my political persuasion they are a non-event. The Libertarian solution is not to anguish about outside forces (we’ve got plenty of people who hate us), but to shrink our Government dramatically. Get it? I don’t care if there are people trying to institute a New World Order one way or the other. What I care about is getting our country back to the kind of Freedom that our Founders advocated. That would take care of the NWO problem, as well as many others.

      • Jay

        Time, how did you know what I was thinking? The truth you just stated is like Buckley’s cough medicine, it tastes awful, but it works

      • tyrannynot

        @Time: That was pretty rude answering Karole like that. Somebody who wants to do something & you’re a jerk about it. Morons like you think you know everything but you don’t. If you know so much tell me what kind of currency are we going to have once money colapses? How about giving some sulutions instead of being a problem?

        • JeffH

          tyrannynot, did you just wake up or sumpin? First post ever and you’re already name calling. Go back to the “KOS” where you belong or get a thicker skin.

          • Eddie47d

            So why ignore Time’s name calling. I’m not the only one who sees through him. Dave H. does the same thing and pretends it is everybody else. You have to keep both eyes open Jeff in who is saying what.It’s okay to defend your “buds” but don’t be a hypocrite in the name calling game.

        • Dan az

          tyranny afraid so
          A few decades ago, before the invention of computers and microchips, such a system would have seemed far-fetched, a product of science fiction. But now everyone knows about the existence of debit cards with which you can buy anything in stores, without the need to carry any cash on you, the amount of your purchase being debited automatically from your bank account. The avowed goal of the banks is to eliminate all cash, and to force people to use debit cards as the only means of payment.

          There is always the risk of losing one’s debit card, or of having somebody else illegally use it. So here comes the ultimate solution: to link people personally to their card, so there is no way they can lose it or have it stolen! And there you have it: a micro-computer chip can be implanted under your skin, or a three six-digital unit can be tattooed on your skin…just as described in Saint John’s Book of Revelation.

          Actually, the mark in the right hand signifies obeying the will, and the mark in the forehead implies receiving the doctrine of the “Beast”. The Beast will be the Pope of Rome who will be incarnate by Satan when he is cast down to earth at the close of the Gentile dispensation.

          Everything will be in place for a government that wants to control everybody’s move, since they will know everything about you: all that you buy, where and when you buy it, who you phone, how much money you have, will all be inscribed on this card. And if, for whatever reason, you are classified as an “undesirable person” or as an “enemy of the State” by the government, they will only have to erase your number from the central computer, and you will no longer be able to buy or sell (and thus be condemned to disappear before long).

      • StephenP

        Don’t forget FaceBook! They are hounding anyone they don’t agree with.
        Jan Morgan and Glenn Beck to name a few. I have tried to access something they have posted, or read something that requires going to another link, just to have it blocked. The message usually reads: Information unavailable. I’ve tried several times and get the same message.

        Also, they recommend FB people for me to friend. When I did, they signed me out and kicked me off from requesting any friends for two days, just for starters.

      • Gregg Weber

        If we turned all communications off we would not “break the bonds that YOUR GOVERNMENT has placed on you.” What we would become is receivers of GovNews in whatever form they control. We wouldn’t know of anyone else who disagrees. We couldn’t organize anything to speak of. Then we would become “SLAVES to the STATE.”
        Communications is needed.

    • Lastmanstanding

      I’ve got to jump right in with TIME. When are you going to wake up Karolyn? They probably were selling milk to your lib/prog co-horts for their children/infants. We drank it as kids.

      I grew up in Amish country so I know who buys their products…EVERYBODY! Right ,left, center, black, white, red, green, blue, etc. Why? Because there are folks out there that have a brain of their own and are making their own decisions without govt. regulation.

      But then again, Americorps keeps you on the “left track”…for Gods sake, be your own woman free from govt bonds…you have a choice.

      • karolyn

        You guys just don’t “get” me. Recently, I emailed my Representative (Mulvaney, a teapartier) about a bill regarding supplement companies/health-associated entities being allowed to use scientific claims about their products. This process is currently not allowed under FDA. I actually got a call from his office!! I am happy to say that he seems to be onboard. I am NOT a proponent of the “nanny” state.

        • Bitter Libertarian

          Why is there a Nanny state?

        • DaveH

          Yes, Karolyn, we know that you have awakened to one aspect of Government self-dealing. Now, how about awakening to all the others?

          • Bitter Libertarian

            FEAR..keeps people from seeing the FACTS & TRUTH of matters..FEAR makes them afraid to look…INCOMPETENCE enables them to only digest one problem at a Time and the LACK of Critical Thinking inhibits their ability to put a puzzel together.

          • Kate8

            Very well said, BL!

          • kodster5

            You nailed it, Bitter! Even my own husband exhibits those characteristics… and I think he’s finally starting to put the pieces together… I’ve been pounding it into his head for over 3-1/2 years now (since we’ve been married!) about what’s going on in this world… telling him that things were going to get sooo expensive. He kept denying it, but now, the light bulb is starting to get brighter, and he wants to start doing the things that I wanted to start doing before we met. The problem is, he thinks he’s come with them, and wants to take credit for them. Little does he know, I’ve been doing these things behind his back… like stocking up on heirloom seeds, storing food items, survival gear, etc. I’ve already started my garden… especially since where I live, the ground is still too cold to plant them… and have them in an indoor greenhouse, ready to plant.

        • Eddie47d

          It’s our capitalistic system that allowed Big Pharma to grow and get out of hand. They had more power than the government and were able to get by FDA rulings quite easily. Thus controlling what we put into our bodies when we become ill or in wanting healthy supplements. I say leave the producers of raw milk alone in selling their product. If their product is tainted it should be easily traced and the business can be closed down.Lawyers love unregulated products because these companies don’t have the supply of opposing lawyers that Big Pharma had for years. That’s why the big boys fought for years against generics and lower prices. Keep the pressure on these corporations that think they are too big to lose… or our own government who couldn’t even control Big Pharma’s shenanigans.

          • TIME

            Manzier 47 D cup,

            Not quite, if people really VETTED the persons they send off to Congress and the Senate. These companys would never have gotten a strangle hold on the system.

            But again you take the easy road and follow like a well trained MONKEY TOOL. Thus again you prove my point over and over again.
            Hell you do a better ob of displaying how well trained the MONKEYS really are. Spit out more of the programed mindless rhetoric over and over, heys how the music from that grinder working out.

          • DaveH

            No company has the power of force. Only Government has that power (unfortunately too much of it). It is not the Capitalist System that is the problem, but Government’s meddling in the capitalist system.
            Without the complicity of Government, no company could force us to buy any of their products.
            Blaming Capitalism for the Government’s actions is like blaming water for piranha attacks.

          • Kate8

            eddie – Actually, our medical industry was started, and is still owned, by the Rockefellers, who are also prominent in government, and memebers of the NWO elite. It was begun, not as a system for healing, but as a huge funding project for the elite, and a means for enslaving the world population. It is about total control.

            Before doctors became so ruthlessly controlled and regulated, when there was more market freedom, they had more incentive to look for alternative healing measures. The were actually allowed to THINK. Now that government has set strict procedural guidelines…well, as one good doctor (who got in trouble for healing a patient using non-standard prodedure) was told, “We don’t care whether the patient gets better or worse. We only care that you follow the scientific protocol”.

            When my kids were young, and before the lawyers and insurance co.s too over medicine, an office visit cost $7.00. My husband spent a week in intensive care following a head injury: $300.

            This was not the free market that did this. It was government, working through lawyers. It was all just another step in the slow creep of government control.

            Stop popping off leftist talking points, eddie, and do some real research. You are just making yourself more and more irrelevant.

          • Eddie47d

            Maybe when some of you stop spouting your right wing nonsense. Now I know that will be a dark day in hell but I see many comments from the right that are beyond irrelivant. When you have Time spewing his cloroxed comments like he’s God almighty and occasionally Dave H. you get extremely leery.That is why I loved Jeff’s comment because it did describe Time and how Time always thinks he knows it all. He’s so “smart” he lectures everyone on to think like him. If you don’t follow his advise you get taken to his padded room and reformed or lectured to death.

          • JeffH

            Well, well, well! Now capitalism has surpassed corporatism in 47D’s world of illusion. “You can lead a horse to water but you can’t make him drink” just doesn’t get it with this guy.

            Lawyers love “unregulated products” so they can sue them? Why then do we see on the boob tube daily class action lawsuits against “Big Pharma’s” FDA(government)regulated drugs like Paxil, Prozac, Zoloft, and Effexor, and the atypical antipsychotics, that include Zyprexa, Risperdal, Geodon, Seroquel, Clozaril, and Abilify?

            Big Pharma is Big Dollars and the biggest source for funding Big Pharma is Big Government! The pharmaceutical industry has a giant “revolving door” through which corporations and government agencies frequently exchange key employees, just like Big Banks, Big Oil and Wall Street.

            The problem is that private industry and government health offices such as the CDC or FDA should never be so cozy. When they are, it creates an environment of collusion between Big Government and Big Pharma. We’ve already seen this with the government-led push for swine flu vaccines that are manufactured (and sold) by drug companies like Merck.

            Remember when “Big Pharma” agreed to pony up $80 billion over the next decade improving drug benefits for seniors on Medicare and defraying the cost of President Barack Obama’s health care legislation? $80 billion? Where are they going to get a pile of cash like that? Well, it’s not exactly a pile of cash! Big Pharma is essentially giving up a 10% discount, in the donut hole only, in order to reap their 100% windfall when the taxpayer is on the hook.
            Medicare can’t negotiate with pharmaceutical companies on price, despite being their largest bulk customer.

            Someday I’d hope you would be able to figure all of this out on your own 47D. You can fight to stop crony capitalism till you die, but until you fight to end Big Government’s participation you’ll never stop crony capitalism.

          • Kate8

            eddie – One of the reasons you don’t learn anything is because you are so caught up in the exchange of personal attacks that you miss the whole point.

            Stop ridiculing us and, instead, look objectively at what is being said, and you won’t be attacked, either. This is a conservative site, so expect to read conservative viewpoints here. If you want people who will agree with you, you know where to go.

          • DaveH

            Well I’ll give you that point, Eddie. You don’t mask your ignorance. It is very apparent.

          • Jay

            Eddie, take the bitch slapping you just received and think of it as an expression of our love, as our intent is not to hurt you, but to free you from your bonds!!!

          • Eddie47d

            I actually liked Jeff’s comment.I see he is finally coming around and noticing the evil in corporate America. His emphasis is more on how government works hand in hand with their corruption and allows it to happen. I never said that wasn’t happening but corporations have been influencing government since our inception.(railroads and shipping come to mind)At least we are on the same page with big government and big business. Our approach of coarse has differences but corruption should be fought no matter which element is doing the corrupting.

      • karolyn

        AmeriCorps doesn’t keep me on ANY track. It’s a job, plain and simple, and I am oh so grateful to have it after not having had a job for four years! Would you turn down a job with AmeriCorps if you were hanging on by a thread?

        • DaveH

          I would, Karolyn, but I don’t blame you for your choice. Just please, please wake up to the fact that they are just a band-aid. Don’t sell you soul to the devil.
          Ask yourself this? Did the Government produce your dish-washer? Or your house? Or your food? Or …….?
          Yet they spend 40% of our GDP. 40%!!!! Twice as much as in 1950. Was our Society collapsing in 1950? A Big Fat NO! Not even close. So they spend nearly half of our money and for what? They produce little (if anything). That money is almost entirely Consumed.
          Oh, sure, someday when they have completely taken over, we will be able to buy Yugos or some similar pile of junk from them. Look how already they are trying hard to push the Smart Cars (and similar death-traps) on us. They want us to get used to mediocrity because they know that is what they are bringing.

          Sniff some smelling salts, Karolyn. Wake up!

        • DaveH

          And by the way, Karolyn, your last sentence says it all. That is exactly what they want — for us to be hanging by a thread, so they can come along and “rescue” us from a situation that they created in the first place.
          Think about how whenever the taxpayers scream about high taxes the first thing Government and their advocates warn about is cutting Fire Fighters, or cutting Police. Or now, for instance, with the debt ceiling coming up, many of them are threatening the Social Security recipients. Is that all they do with our money? Of course not, but they pick the things that scare the most people. MANIPULATION. And that is exactly where they want all of us to be — Under Their Thumb, so we no longer can stop them. Think of the Big Bad Corporate officers that Liberals love to hate. Think of them on STEROIDS. That is where we’re headed with Big Government.

          • Kate8

            DaveH – You are so right. They cut the fundamental services, when they should be cutting things like Americorps.

          • kodster5

            Or like Obama threatened if they didn’t come to a budget agreement this last time… cut the military’s payroll.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        LMS, HEAR, HEAR!!! :)

      • Harold Olsen

        Now, now. Don’t be hard on Karolyn. Perhaps she is just incapable of thinking on her own. Perhaps she NEEDS the government to lead her around by the nose and tell her what to do and when to do it. That way she does not have to take responsibility for anything she does in life. She can always blame someone else.

        I used to work with someone who not only liked the idea of the government controlling every aspect of his life but bragged about the fact that he did not have to make any decisions on his own. He always blamed other people when he screwed up. Nothing was ever his fault.

        • kodster5

          Typical narcissist… it’s always someone else’s fault for their troubles.

    • Mick

      Karolyn
      ‘It doesn’t happen often but for once I tend to agree with you.
      The FDA authorize the use of the poisons the pharmaceutical keeps on feeding us but will try to stop us from the good wholesome food previous generations lived well on and with no intervention from the medical profession out to enrich itself and they are putting the small people out of business in the process.
      Our Government is out of hand and is only acting on what’s beneficial for the bucks they can rake on every level.

    • karolyn

      Here’s a link about the Estrella Farm shutdown
      http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2013257593_cheese26m.html

    • Bitter Libertarian

      karolyn..you noted the other day that I was paranoid..allow me to point out that events such as this is what started me QUESTIONING WHY…and when I spent months seeking answers from Govt Officials and got no where…One is left with only one choice but to determine that I am not Important enough to DESERVE an answer. Yet I pay my taxes…abide by laws..why cant I as an American get an answer? Allow me offer to you the 14th amendment as the answer.
      The 14th Amendment is the ONE amendment I would remove/change from law…its the reason WE THE PEOPLE have little to no authority, we became subjects of Congress, IE: Legal term; The 14th created a US Citizen who is subject to the Jurisdiction there of. If you note…before the 14th you had inalienable rights, after the 14th you only have what the laws allow. :) So ANYTHING that they write into the laws..you are SUBJECT to…remember England..the King has Subjects as well..
      So your outrage is Justified, however you are only on the tip of the Ice berg….

      • DaveH

        Our Founders (Jefferson, Madison, Washington) knew the score. They tried to protect us, but after they were gone, people like Lincoln were able to subvert peoples’ minds and allow Centralized Government to take hold in America. Jefferson warned about the dangers of Central Government (Empire Building, Mercantilism, etc.), and here we are, experiencing the ill effects of the very things Jefferson warned about.

      • Kate8

        karolyn – BitterL makes a very good point. You have also called me paranoid on several occasions. I assume that, on this subject, you don’t consider me so because I agree with you.

        Yet, one who wasn’t aware of gov’t interference in our food and health might, likewise, accuse you of being paranoid.

        Thus, it really all boils down to one’s level of awareness. Belief is only belief, and is subjective. It has nothing to do with whether a thing is true.

    • Bruce D.

      I am glad that you appear to be on the right side of the issue for a change Karolyn.

      • Nadzieja Batki

        She is not.

    • Cribster

      Karolyn,

      This is a great resource for many things health related, exposing FDA atrocities and providing action alerts.

      I don’t have the time right now to search for anything concerning raw milk but here’s the link;

      http://www.anh-usa.org/

      • karolyn

        I am well aware of the ANH and have been receiving their emails for some time now. I always follow up on any critical issues they promote.

        • Bitter Libertarian

          We are a “Free nation” why are there Critical Issues?

    • Bitter Libertarian

      Why do you think this is happening?

    • DaveH

      What can you do, Karolyn? Wake up to the fact that Big Government is taking on a life of its own. You need to start facing the fact that Big Government is working with its Crony Capitalists to suck the money out of our pockets and into theirs. Honestly, by now with the Social Security ponzi scheme in full bloom, I’d think even the most die-hard Hopers and Dreamers would be able to see that Government doesn’t really care about the people. They care about themselves. And they will promise you Arpege, but give you Toilet Water.
      Quit throwing away your votes on people who just want Bigger Government.
      Big Government is the Problem, Not the Solution.

      • Kate8

        DaveH – The Lefties have pinned all their hope on the democrats for so long, and have been so convinced that everyone else is to blame, that if they see the truth they’ll have NOWHERE ELSE TO GO.

        The Right has been hijacked by the Left. What will you do, BTW, when the Libertarians fail to deliver?

        At least there are those of us who still have a source of hope when all human systems fail, as surely they will.

        I’ll be praying for you DaveH. (If I knew how to make a smiley-face, I’d put one here.)

        • libertytrain

          kate8 do this with no spaces between as I have done for demonstration purposes only colon and parenthesis : ) :)

          • Kate8

            libertytrain – Thanks, but it doesn’t work for me!

          • libertytrain

            it should – a space after your last word or punctuation then a colon and immediately a single parenthesis. Try it a few times every now and then. Can’t imagine why it wouldn’t work.

          • JeffH

            libertytrain, who says you can’t teach old dogs new tricks. :)
            Thanks.

          • libertytrain

            All of a sudden all I am seeing is smiley faces – :) :)

        • DaveH

          Thanks, Kate :)
          If they fail to deliver then they aren’t Libertarians. Sure our party could be infiltrated like any other, but if enough people start realizing the simplistic beauty of our platform, we will keep them in line.
          First, though, we need to give them that chance. Vote Libertarian!

    • http://Illinois'17th Old Henry

      Karolyn:

      What can we do? Recruit, support and vote TEA Party candidates.

      We will take this country back by:
      1) Soap Box
      2) Ballot Box
      3) Ammo Box

  • http://aol.com sean murrey

    Here in ilinios they trying to police our food i told them to stick it.

  • Polski

    The FDA is the “KGB” arm of the sick industry, called the health industry by the media crooks. The sick industry clique is the AMA, FDA, FTC, BIG PHARMA, the various medical industries (the cancer industry profits $220 BILLION a year, do you think it would let a cancer cure be known? What would all these people do if a cancer cure was found and ALLOWED?) The AMA doctors own the clinics that do tests, the pharmacies that sell drugs, are on the board of directors of the BIG PHARMA companies and the FDA and the FTC. Did you know that MONSANTO is deliberately ruining the USA’s food so it can force GMO’s, (Genetically MOLESTED Organisms) on everyone in the USA? Do you know that Europe will not accept USA food because of GMO pollution?

    • Disgusted

      You could live on raw milk alone if you had to. It would sustain your life in a dire situation that is how nutritious it is in its raw state. Pasteurized milk is dead. As long as the farm has not had any health problems reported from the drinking of its milk, why is there a problem? We can make up our minds about what we put in our bodies can’t we?
      If you watch TV now there are so many ads for legal firms asking us if we have had issues due to taking a drug that the FDA and Big Pharma pushed on us 20-30 years ago. All of a sudden we are finding that they have side effects that weren’t predicted. DUH!! Who didn’t see that coming?
      Now Monsanto and the FDA have approved and are distributing GMO Alfalfa. I wrote and wrote and called and called all my representatives in state and federal government to ask them to push for the FDA to not approve this abomination, to no avail. Monsanto and the FDA studies show there will be no “significant” ill effects. Want to bet! They can’t predict what nature will do or how this abomination will effect the plant life and the meat of the animals that consume it…….which includes us!!
      Disgusting and I am just Disgusted about it!

      • karolyn

        Here’s a good article about the US going against Codex wanting to label genetically engineered foods.
        http://www.anh-usa.org/codex-to-consider-labeling-for-genetically-engineered-foods/

        Support the ANH’s effots!

      • William

        Disgusted. me too. you see eric holder cant be bothered with real crime. which there is plenty. I am 75 years old and grew up on raw milk. Mom made her own Butter and the buttermilk was delicouse unlike the crap they call butter milk now,

        • Kate8

          This is all because Congress is answerable only to the UN, and it’s a WHO mandate that they pass all these laws in order to desecrate our food supply and remove all health products.

          For those of us who have been writing and calling our congressmen for many years, and having them turn their backs on us (more so recently), we are realizing that it is all up to us. Congress is not going to be on our side, probably ever again.

          Time for another Plan B.

          • kodster5

            Actually, Kate, I doubt that… it’s been going on for years between the US and Canada, and Europe… Europe has actually banned GMO seed, as well as growth hormone and antibiotic injected livestock products. They won’t let it in, because they know that it’s bad stuff… yet the US government, with the backing of the commercial corporations like Monsanto, Merck, etc, have pushed it down our throats. All in the name of capitalism (yes, eddie47d, it’s true…) and greed. We’ve all been one big guinea pig experiment, and they can’t stop it now.

          • Kate8

            kodster – Sorry, but I stand by what I said.

            I read recently where the European countries were also having GMO shoved down their throats, whether they want it or not. It is the agenda of the WHO, and there is NO opting out.

            Yes, it’s been going on for many years, and it is now becoming law.

          • Kate8

            And, kodster, it’s NOT about capitalism. It’s about the corporatist takeover of government and, indeed, all governments.

            If we had a free market, we’d have choices, and those choices would determine what our supply would be. With government controlling and limiting our right to choose, we will have only what they allow us to have.

            You, obviously, have no understanding of what capitalism is all about. It is only when government and corporations merge that greed and power come out of monopolies. Government should never enter into our markets.

        • Lawrence Freeman

          That right there is the problem!!!!!!!!!! people live to long on uncontaminated food, so the government add their poisons to shorten life. That makes it better for them because they tax all you leave behind so your servivers pay them for the remain you leave behind.

      • kodster5

        Correct! What about ALL those growth hormones and antibiotics they put into beef, pork and poultry production? To increase getting livestock to market? They started that back in the ’50s. Where did they think those hormones and antibiotics were going to end up? They wonder why our children started puberty earlier and earlier, why obesity levels have gone up, cancer rates have increased? It’s simple enough to point out and make a correlation. The same time the FDA approved it, you can see the trend. And they said it wouldn’t affect us? How can they say that, since no long term tests had been conducted? We all became guinea pigs, with no approval/releases signed!!!!

    • http://LibertyAlert Bud

      The FDA is run by and controlled by attorneys, not scientists. All the FDA health decisions are not scientific but decided by attorneys in closed rooms that impact on small companies and seek large fines from big companies to justify their existence.

      • Eddie47d

        That isn’t right of coarse but I suppose they have to have lawyers to take on the multitude of lawyers that the big companies have.The government is outgunned when it comes to challenging the Monsanto’s out there.Monsanto’s GMOs keep winning because the FDA doesn’t have the resources to take them on. In some cases I’m sure the government is just too lazy to deal with these companies. Either way the consumer/taxpayer looses.

        • Thamera

          Eddie47 puhleaze…the government is never “outgunned”. lol

          • Eddie47d

            These lawsuits against Monsanto cost in the hundreds of millions. Few farmers can challange them and few taxpayers are willing to give that kind of money to the government to take them on. So Monsanto keeps winning by default.That’s what I meant by being outgunned.

          • Kate8

            That’s because Monsanto has government backing. Many of our politicians are heavily invested in Monsanto.

            No one has enough money to win against them. Besides, the judges are part of the government.

        • kodster5

          Again, Eddie, you’ve got it mixed up. It’s not the government that has the lawyers to fight against the likes of Monsanto, etc… the government is in collusion with Monsanto, etc. It’s the little guy, the small company, the farmer, etc, who does not the deep pockets to fight the government and Monsanto. So, that’s why the government continues to crack down on the little guy, because Monsanto, etc, have the lobbyists on their payroll, to twist the arm of the government representatives (IRS, Commerce Dept, elected representatives, etc.) to get them to do it!

          • JeffH

            kodster5, you’re wasting your breath. That’s been explained over and over so many times. If he ain’t figured it by now, he’ll never figger it out.

          • Kate8

            kodster – forgive me if I misunderstood you earlier. I see that you are pretty aware.

          • Eddie47d

            Jeff the smart azz. Where’s your solution to the power of the Monsanto’s. When you are willing to take on these big corporations then let me know. I’ve signed petitions and have written to Monsanto and have always defended the small farmer so how about you. If you think just calling me down is a solution no wonder these companies keep getting away with their monopolies. Actions speak louder than words and words is all I hear around here. How many letters(E-mails)have you sent to your Representatives to take action against these corrupt banksters or big Pharma or United Healthcare or Goldman Sacs? …and that’s the short list!

        • Dan az

          Eddiee
          We all know how monsanto is just looking out for our best intrest remember!Monsanto manufactured Agent Orange from 1965 to 1969.I dont think after that I have ever used or needed any thing else from monsanto.

          • Eddie47d

            Dan; You are correct but Dow(napalm),Uniroyal,Diamond Shamrock,Hercules Corp.,Thompson Chemicals and TH Agriculture also had a hand in this development. What a tangled web these corporations weave and who has their fingers in the agent orange pot.

    • Carlucci

      There have been safe natural cures for cancer for years. Most sheeple never hear about them because they are too lazy and clueless to help themselves. So they turn to their allopathic doctors who prescribe cutting (surgery), burning (radiation), and poison (chemo”therapy”).
      That’s why most people ultimately die – not necessarily from cancer, but from the “treatments”.

      • Kate8

        Carlucci – You are so right. Cancer is fungal in nature, and occurs when the body is overly compromised by toxins and acidity. It is one of the most easily cured problems, by simple things you can do at home, for pennies, if you know what to do.

        Yet, BigBroMedicine claims exclusive rights to cancer treatment. One can go to prison for curing cancer naturally. After all, cancer is the biggest cash cow for Medicine – usually costing upwards of $100,000 per patient, and it reduces the population by huge numbers every year.

        What amazes me is, even people who have figured this out, when confronted with a cancer diagnosis, will most often submit to conventional treatment. That is how brainwashed we are. Lemmings marching in line off a steep cliff…

        BTW, I realize that there are those who have survived cancer treatments and are doing well. However, this is more the exception than the rule, and probably has more to do with a will to live. Our minds are the most powerful of medicine.

        • Carlucci

          Hey Kate8 – I knew a little bit about cancer from a tape I watched about a beautiful orthopedic surgeon from San Francisco named Dr. Lorraine Day, who had breast cancer. She basically healed herself by juicing. After I lost my husband to pancreatic cancer, I started learning a lot about it, and the reason people get cancer is not a mystery at all. It is primarily caused when people eat too much cooked and/or processed food. At least half of our diets must be raw. That is why people are encouraged to eat a great big raw salad before they consume any cooked food.

          One thing that blew my mind while I was reading “Beating Cancer with Nutrition” by Patrick Quillen, was that he wrote about how cancer disguises itself in the body as a pregnancy so the immune system will not attack it and kill it (because a strong healthy immune system is always attacking and killing cancers every day). He said that a man could take an over the counter pregnancy test and it would come up positive if the man was suffering from cancer. Is that incredible, or what???

          • Kate8

            Carlucci – That is pretty amazing.

            Another amazing thing is that it is said that we all get cancer all the time, and our bodys deal with it. It is when we get diagnosed and begin treatments that our body’s ability to fight back is destroyed.

            It’s also amazing that medicine would try to convince us that the way to treat such an illness would be to poison and weaken it further, overwhelming its own defenses. We are so convinced that we are helpless without medical intervention.

            Simply raising one’s pH close to 8 will stop cancer.

            I heard about a 90+ year old man who died and had an autopsy. He was found to have cancer throughout his body, and he never knew. Had he gotten treatment he probably would have been long dead at a much earlier age!

            I once heard a doctor say that with colon cancer, if one didn’t treat it he might live 12 years or so. If he treated in (conventionally), maybe 18 months.

            Stuff to consider.

    • JeffH

      FDA and CDC Bias Against Raw Milk–No Facts Provided in Recent Reminder about Raw Milk Consumption.

      WASHINGTON, March 12, 2007 – The FDA and CDC provided no facts to back up claims of widespread illness from raw milk in a recent press release, “FDA and CDC Remind Consumers of the Dangers of Drinking Raw Milk.”

      The joint FDA /CDC reminder claims that between 1998 and 2005, raw milk was implicated in 45 outbreaks, 1007 cases, 104 hospitalizations and 2 deaths. Yet the reference cited, the CDC’s Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report for the week of March 2, 2007 (MMWR for 03-02-07), provides no such information; nor is any such information found in any other FDA or CDC document. Numerous requests to the FDA for clarification have not been answered.

      The nation’s largest recorded outbreak of Salmonella was due to PASTEURIZED milk contaminated with antibiotic-resistant Salmonella typhimurium.
      http://www.realmilk.com/press-release-12mar07.html

  • Polski

    In Washington state the raw milk farm that was attacked by the FDA and shut down is Estrella Farms. Did you know that the FDA (KGB)raided Dr. Jonathon Wright, who got his pre-med at University of Michigan and MD at Harvard, and who has been prominent in fighting the sick industry for 40 years, about 10 years ago, for giving vitamin B-12 shots?

    • 45caliber

      Did you know that morphine is non-addictive IF you adjust the dosage to the pain it is supposed to surpress? The doctor who found that out was also surpressed.

  • Richard

    At least we live in the land of the “free” and the brave right? We are free to comply and obey. This article shows how free we are. lol

    • DaveH

      We have been propagandized all of our lives. Unfortunately, a vast number of us haven’t awakened to that reality. To get a very strong wake-up call, just read the book “Lincoln Unmasked” (it’s an easy read).
      It may be too late, but we need to push hard for School Choice and get our children out of the Government schools where they are being heavily propagandized to love Big Government. That is our best chance at recovering our Freedom.
      And Vote Libertarian!

      • Carlucci

        I want to read that book “Lincoln Unmasked”. I just finished “Manhunt” by James Swanson about the search for John Wilkes Booth. I also want to read “Bloody Crimes” about the manhunt for Jefferson Davis, by the same author.

        • DaveH

          I don’t read many books. Mostly I have gleened what I know from magazines over my 40 years of adulthood. But when I read “The Real Lincoln” (precursor to “Lincoln Unmasked”), I was amazed at how thoroughly I had been propagandized by the public schools.

          • Carlucci

            The only thing I know about him (Lincoln) is that he didn’t like black people at all, and wanted all of the freed slaves to get on a boat and go to the Dominican Republic. Then he decided that he could use them to his advantage and that’s why we have the myth that the Civil War was fought to stop slavery. I actually saw this on a program about him on PBS, of all networks.

          • Kate8

            What I want to know is, how do we know what is the truth about Lincoln? Anything we read is going to be biased, depending on what the author’s agenda is.

            Was Lincoln all bad? Was he a hero? And just who do we believe?

            There are those who seek to discredit all of our early leaders, including our very founders. Were they saints? Of course not. But were they well-intentioned, or were they diabolical?

            Maybe some of the reason that we’ve lost so much American spirit these days is that we’ve surrendered our heros, our role-models. Our youth are convinced that we are the bane of the world, and that our heros were corrupt to the core.

            Growing up learning about Honest Abe gave hope for humanity. Now he’s gone into the dustheap of American mythology…it seems that we have little left to hold on to.

            Sounds like part of a plan to me. Destroy faith in our goodness…Is is any wonder that America is collapsing?

          • 45caliber

            DaveH, Kate8:

            I own about 30,000 books. I have more history books than any of the local libraries although I don’t care much for biographies and won’t read an autobiography at all. (Who wants to read about how much someone loves himself?)

            I grew up in Arkansas during the Central High School fiasco. What got me started on histroy was: how does the real thing compare to what they tell you in school?

            We were told by TV and later in schools that most of the people accepted it and the kids certainly did. One photo in the newspaper supposedly showed the black girl sitting with white girls at lunch. However one of the white girls was the daughter of a friend who had a fit when he saw the picture. She insisted she didn’t sit with the black girl – and a careful study of the photo showed two empty tables between them. They used a camera trick. There were some other discrepencies – like insisting that they had removed all the checkpoints when a friend had to go through 11 of them to pick up his daughter for a dental appointment.

            So one of my hobbies (and part of the reason I have so many history books) is to see what happens vs. what you are told happens in schools. And there are some major differences that go as far back as history is kept. So I am constantly watching for new books, always check them against other books, and try to find the oldest accounts of anything I can.

            That’s one reason I say that the South did not leave the Union over slavery. The majority of them didn’t. That is why I laugh about Pearl Harbor attack – the government and the Pentagon knew the attack was coming two weeks in advance … and chose not to warn those at Pearl. They wanted to an excuse to convince the people to allow them to go to war. They did the same in WWI. Most of the “news” that came out of Vietnam was faked or straight out lies. One of the maddest times I’ve ever gotten was reading my daughter’s school history book about Vietnam and finding they were teaching the students that “the military lost the war in Vietnam but the heroic (their word) Senators under HH Humphrey were able to form a truce long enough to save the soldiers.” Yeah, right.

            There is an old saying, “The victors write the history books.” And it is mostly true. So everyone is told that the terrible people of the South wanted to keep the blacks as slaves and the heroic North under that wonderful President Lincoln saved them all.

          • kodster5

            Dave, I have that book “The REAL Lincoln”, by Thomas J. DiLorenzo. Boy, that was an eye opener, and that’s where we ended up losing our “inalienable” rights, because Lincoln wanted a centralized, BIG government. That’s about the time the 14th Amendment was instituted, as well. Andrew Jackson vetoed the Civil Rights bill of 1866, because he was against centralized government, because “he was opposed to ‘civil rights,’ only to the federalization of the judiciary, which he feared would be harmful to ‘everyone’s’ civil rights.” However, Congress blacked the southern states into passing the 14th Amendment by “prohibitng congressional representation by those states unless they ratified the amendment.”

            So, folks, we’re looking at over 150 years of getting to where we’re at now. It’s folks like us who are digging in our feet, screaming to high heaven, at the injustice that is being done to us, and our country. Remember, it took the Israelites over 400 years of slavery to the Egyptians, to break those bonds! We’ve only just begun!

          • DaveH

            Kate,
            If you read either of Thomas DiLorenzo’s books, you will see. He has an extensive bibliography backing up all he says.

          • Kate8

            DaveH – That is my whole point. One can find backing, or “proof”, to prove anything they want.

            There are many authors who hail him as a hero. Maybe the truth is somewhere in between. It seems that history is portrayed according to how they want to shape the future.

            The fact that he was assassinated shows that he wasn’t on board with some powerful people, just like JFK and Reagan.

            There is simply no way to prove history, because everyone along the way has had an opinion. The most we can hope for is an interpretation.

            All I know is that, as a child, stories of Honest Abe made us want to be better people.

          • DaveH

            Kate,
            It is well-documented (even by Lincoln’s promoters) that certain atrocities definitely took place like the North’s war against women and children (blacks too), basically anybody that got in the way as whole cities were shelled and burnt to the ground. Those that claim Lincoln didn’t approve are beyond ignorant. He was well-known to visit his field officers often. Do you think he could not have known about whole cities being razed?
            Read the book, Kate. Exit the fairy tale. Be a good example for Karolyn.

          • Kate8

            DaveH – I’m not saying that you are wrong. I’m just saying that history has been so messed with these days…it’s just hard to know what to believe anymore.

            When you devastate a nations heros and values, well…you see what happens, especially when you replace them with what we’ve got now.

          • DaveH

            I have never been one to worship people. But I think the knowledge that we have been systematically brainwashed to accept Big Government is much more valuable than any “hero”.

  • newspooner

    The full truth about raw milk production, distribution, benefits, and problems is seldom publicized. It is not as simple as most people think. Ideally, raw milk should be the best, but the potential problem of bacterial contamination should not be ignored. Of course, this is true of almost any food. Even carrots should be washed well before eating.

    The biggest lie about milk is that what people routinely buy today is the best. First, “reduced fat” (1%, 2%. skim, whatever) milk is nutritionally inferior and is a big reason why so many people are needlessly ill or not as healthy as they should be. A large part of the population has vitamin deficiencies, for a number of reasons. One of the reasons is because of an irrational, government-sponsored fear of natural fats. Just consider the total farce of substituting margarine for butter. Vitamins A,D, and E are “fat-soluble” vitamins, and many people are deficient in one or more of these because their digestive systems are not getting enough natural fats to absorb these vitamins sufficiently.

    Second, there is validity to the claim that pasteurized milk is “dead” milk. Nutrients are destroyed or altered, even at the somewhat benign temperatures of the process. The legitimate question is really about whether that sacrifice is worth getting some protection from possible bacterial contamination. That decision should be left to the individual buyer, not to the “food police”.

    Third, there is a problem caused by the homogenization process that is rarely written about, certainly not in the Establishment Media. If you were around before the late 1960′s, you might remember milk in bottles, with three pasteurized choices for purchase: skim, whole, and homogenized. Skim milk had no noticeable fat (and was yucky). Whole milk had the natural fat still in it, and it floated and separated to make up approximately the top quarter portion in the bottle (Didn’t you just hate it when Mom and Dad used that top portion for their coffee and expected you to use up the remaining skim milk before opening a new bottle!) Standard proceedure was to shake the bottle about a dozen times (good exercise) to make the milk uniform throughout. So, in the late 1950′s homogenized milk became popular and is just about universally the only way it can be purchased today. With homogenized milk, you didn’t have to shake the bottle to mix the two layers. They stayed permanently mixed. Great convenience, especially if Mom and Dad were top layer thieves. But research that is seldom seen in the Establishment Media has shown that this is not as healthy as the unhomogenized milk. The reason that the two mixed layers do not separate again is that the homogenization process breaks down the natural milkfat globules into much smaller particles than manual shaking does, allowing them to be more or less permanently suspended so they do not separate. This has been found to be not so good because these much smaller particles pass through the intestinal linings too quickly, before they can be fully processed as nature intended. The larger natural fat globules do not pass through until the natural digetive processes have had enough time to do their thing. So the problem that many people have with milk that causes them to go to the unhealthy “reduced fat” milks or substitutes (yucky) is not the milkfat content; it is the homogenization process.

    My personal conclusion is that the sensible best choice comes down to raw milk if you are willing to accept the higher potential risk of bacterial contamination, or properly pasteurized but unhomogenized whole milk if you are not. Isn’t it weird that our benevolent government essentially prevents us from practically being able to exercise those two options? (I confess, that lamentation is sarcasm.)

    • karolyn

      I only buy organic whole milk. I have investigated finding raw milk available here in SC and have found a couple of sources. Of course, I’d have to drive at least an hour to get it, but I do plan on taking that ride. The other option is goat’s milk, which is even better for you than cow’s. That, I am sure I can get around here because everybody has goats. However, I am not much of a fan.

      • Carlucci

        karolyn – I don’t like goat’s milk either, but I drink it because it is good for me. I cut it with almond or coconut milk to kill the “goaty” taste as much as possible!

      • independant thinker

        I have a source of “pet” (raw) milk for my cats. If I want to drink it to keep from loosing any to spoilage that is my business and no one elses. By the way, over-processed store milk only lasts a day or so longer.

        • Kate8

          Not only that, but much higher levels of contamination are allowed in pasteurized milk.

          I read that there is a lot of dead bacteria and, get this, large quantities of pus in pasteurized milk. Gag.

          Just as in the water supply, dead bacteria isn’t good for you, either. And don’t forget chemical contamination, as well.

          • 45caliber

            Kate8:

            Try your canned vegies. Years ago when I was still invovled at the farm, I found out that they had a “bug meter” at the canning factories. It was especially important for greens like spinich. They would measure certain enzymes that came from bugs in the food. Supposedly if it exceeded certain amounts they couldn’t can and sell it – but they could cut it with cleaner crops until they could. It is much harder to see the bugs in the greens than in, say, corn.

            I seriously doubt if things have changed. That’s one reason my wife and I prefer frozen vegies.

          • Kate8

            45 – Yes, bugs and allowable quantities of rodent droppings.

            This is true in most all commercial foods.

    • Bitter Libertarian

      I just cant wait for the fatso police to be formed….logically that the next Federal Agency…..the OCU “Obeisity Control Unit”

      • JJM

        That won’t work – Fatso Police would be arresting/fining 65% of our grocery store suppliers, 75% of restaurants and 95% of fast food!!
        My choice of what to consume is my choice and my risk. Don’t tell me what to consume. Educate me with truths but don’t restrict me with lies and laws.
        The only problem I ever had with raw milk was when the cow got into wrong weeds resulting in bad taste; or as a child, having to hand crank the butter churn.
        If testamonials are not allowed, why do we suffer thru commercials all the time? Perhaps I’m not supposed to post comments?
        Waiting for them to attack my backyard garden – they may be shot for trespassing, theft and damages.

        • 45caliber

          I know what you mean by the “wrong weeds”! One of my jobs as a boy was to go over the pasture and pull up all the bitter weeds to prevent the cow from eating them.

    • William

      newspooner. that top layer was the cream that Mom made our butter from. the rest of the milk was much better than the crap you buy in the stores now, mj job as a boy on the farm was milking the cow every morning and again every evening,sure it was work. but we had good wholesome food,

      • newspooner

        I once tried to start an organic bakery, but I couldn’t raise the dough. I wanted to be a prison executioner, but I couldn’t get the hang of it. But when I was a taxidermist, I really knew my stuff. Now as a farmer, I am outstanding in my field.

        • Carlucci

          LOL – !! Very clever.

    • http://LibertyAlert Bud

      Pasteurization destroys nutrients in milk, but homogenization of fat globules is more dangerous. The milk is forced through an oriface that breaks the fat globules into very small chylomicrons (fat blobs) that are more easily abosrbed into the blood vessels to cause plaque in vessels and leads to atherosclerosis.

      • newspooner

        Yes, when the fat microglobules are absorbed into the bloodstream before there has been sufficient enzymatic action on them, the risk of risk of improper agglutination and copolymerization along the surfaces of the blood vessels and elsewhere increases to a dangerous level. Are there any honest biochemists in the Dept. of Agriculture? Or are they just not as up-to-date on health research as some of us ancient polymer chemists?

        • kodster5

          Oh, the honest biochemists are there, but they suffer from the same contamination of our freshmen congressional representatives. Toe the line, become a trained monkey, or else. Since they came onboard to change the system, like Scott Brown’s intentions when he was elected, they were quickly indoctrinated to not buck the system, but comply.

          • newspooner

            Scott Brown was a 50%er from the beginning. He claims to be “independent” of political pressures, but it is really a case of mixed philosophy and lack of understanding. He only got elected because of 3 things: 1. What Libertarians did in the election campaign. 2. Funding from national sources finally coming after much string pulling by people that Brown doesn’t even know about. 3. Most importantly, the election became a de facto referendum on Obamacare, and even in Taxachusetts the majority of people were so upset about it that they voted for Brown to be the “41st” Senator. On election day, most of the people holding Brown signs weren’t even Republicans, and most of them would not have even bothered to vote if the above conditions didn’t exist. We hope someone better can be elected in 2012, but don’t count on it.

    • DaveH

      Very good, Newspooner.

    • Eddie47d

      Thanks newspooner I enjoyed your story. I know I have bought into homogenized milk like most and will consider what you said when I head to the dairy section.

    • 45caliber

      newspooner:

      Consider where the food comes from. It comes from factories – not farms. Farms produce it but then it goes to factories to be “prepared” for the stores.

      Factories are seldom as meticulous as you are when it comes to what cleaning and preparing food picked from a garden.

      Margrine had two things going for it as far as the factories are concerned. They can produce it artificially in greater quatities than they can butter (fewer raw materials for butter) and it meets the government requirements of taste without nutrition. Polyunsaturated fats (margrine) cannot be digested. It simply passes through your system. You could starve to death eating it if that was all you had.

      • Carlucci

        That’s why bugs won’t eat it (margarine). You can set a tub of it out for days and they won’t go near it.

  • Les

    My mom was born in 1930 and lived through World War 2 in Berlin. She has repeatedly told me that this country is following in the foot steps of Nazi Germany. Hell we even have the brown shirts now in the airports and soon to be at every train station, bus stop and also driving thru your neighborhoods with their portal scanners. On the bright side they will be the first to die from the continuous exposure to all that harmless backscatter radiation. I love people that are so stupid that they believe everything government peddles their way. Personally the radiation is their massive sterilization program. Which was just as completely tested as those radar guns that the police use every day. But then what harm can brain tumors do to the brainless?

    • Al Sieber

      Les, you’re right, we’re in 1930′s Nazi Germany now.

    • 45caliber

      Les:

      You do have a point. If you don’t have a brain, brain tumours shouldn’t cause you a bit of trouble.

  • bob

    Are you kidding me, the Amish get raided? I think the gestopo can go after people who are acutaly hurting people. The Amish bother no one and live off their land. When the dollar collapses these people will be the only ones that will be able to feed their familes, but then again the gov will come in and take everything they have to satisfy their own greed.

    • Former Walmart person

      Exactly. Our ultimate fate is in the hands of the US military. They either act like Nazis and screw us all or act like revolutionary minutemen and give us a fighting chance. Handfuls of Red necks in the woods with AR-15s just aren’t going to cut it when the military has depleted uranium rounds, apache helicopters, tactical nukes, and bio head laced artillery rounds. Indeed, our military could just shell towns from afar with chemical warhead laced artillery rounds. Instead of the terrible battle of Gettysburg in Civil War 1, we will have the checmical assult of Austin, TX where hundreds of thousands will collapse on the streets convulsing hard enough to snap their spines in a chemical warhead attack in Civil War 2. Last time I checked, you can’t buy artillery guns or chemical warheads at your local arms dealer, so our fate is in the military’s hands.

      So how about it US military? Nazi storm troopers or minuteman? Just remember, that you will answer to God, and know that the bastards in power will turn on you in a heart beat when you are no longer useful. Indeed Henry Kissinger called our military “poor dumb animals to be used as pawns for foreign policy”.

      • newspooner

        Are you aware of the Oathkeepers organization? It sounds like you should be. They could use your help and financial support.

        • Raggs

          I have heard of them… however I tend to agree with FWP.. our military will indeed shoot to kill civilians if ordered to do so.

          • DaveH

            I think most of them will. But not all of them.
            Remember how effective the determined Vietnamese were against our powerful military? There are always solutions against evil people.

          • Kate8

            Raggs – Please, check out Oathkeepers. We need many more of them.

            I sent their site to my nephew who is in the military at least a year ago, but never heard back. The young ones are the most vulnerable to the turning on civilians. Last I heard, though, he was very alarmed by the things O’s been doing.

          • 45caliber

            Raggs:

            Back during Clinton’s time in office there was a study made of military and police. They determined that not only would they NOT shoot at civilians if ordered, they would stop others who might.

            BUT … they also decided that if at least 10% of them did shoot at civilans the rest would have to do it too or the civilians would overrun them. So Clinton wanted to bring in about 100,000 Chinese police who would shoot to mix with our own for that purpose.

            The military has about 10% who would shoot if ordered – but they have about 90% who wouldn’t. And many are Oath Keepers. If the 10% there start shooting, it is almost certain that they would simply institute a shootout with the rest of the troops – and I doubt if 10% would win.

            The big problem is the officers. They are the ones more likely to shoot if ordered and shooting them is a capital offense.

          • DaveH

            For whatever it’s worth, 45, I have read that the Officers tend to be Conservative. More on that:
            http://www.lewrockwell.com/ips/lobe43.html

      • 45caliber

        FWP:

        Keep in mind that 1 of 8 soldiers are from Texas (according to what the military told my wife as a member of Military Moms a couple of years ago.)

        Trust me, if soldiers start firing on civilians under orders, those Texans will object. And I’m certain that others will as well. Now if the civilians were shooting back, that could be a different story.

        • Raggs

          Yeah… I think that is it in a nut shell, I know damm well that if the military tries to coral people there will probably be very serious issues. I don’t figure that everyone will just be like a good little sheep and do as told….

          • kodster5

            NOT I!!! I’ll go down fighting, all the way. I also know that I’ll be on the winning side, when I do!

          • DaveH

            There will be no winners, Kodster. Only different degrees of loss.

          • newspooner

            Yes, and ancient polymer chemists like myself often are part of the largest army in the world — American deer hunters. We might be able to save the sheeple, in spite of themselves.

    • Carlucci

      The Amish don’t pay federal income taxes, either. That’s probably why Fedzilla is going after their “milk money”.

      • independant thinker

        I thought they paid income taxes but not SS taxes. I remember a court case about them and their refusal to pay SS because they said (and it is true) we take care of our elderly ourselves and they do not need SS. I believe they won an exemption from SS in the court case.

        • http://! Angel Wannabe

          Independent Thinker, The Amish have Elders in charge of a Treasury, which I believe all the Amish pay into. The Elders make the decisions & are in charge of doling out what money the community needs.

        • Carlucci

          thinker – I read in a book years ago that the Amish didn’t pay any federal taxes unless they were employed by a non-Amish employer.

        • independant thinker

          This question was asked couple days ago…..my answer is the same….Yes they pay fed and state income tax..also property tax. They do NOT pay social security or medicare tax. Their communities take care of their own in old age or disability.
          To Tax prince yes they pay income tax for both fed and state.
          Source(s):
          H&R Block

          I just looked it up and found several sources that said basicly what is posted above,

    • 45caliber

      bob:

      I fully expect that when things to to H3LL, the government will indeed decend upon all farms and gardens to confiscate the food “to feed the hungry”. It must be “shared” – but they will sort of forget that you are to get a share too.

      • newspooner

        Remember that many of us farmers are part of the largest army in the world — American deer hunters. Maybe we can save the sheeple, in spite of themselves.

  • Former Walmart person

    The amish should say they are bisexual muslums with African descendants. That way, they fall into two protected classes of people. The worst thing they can do is remain white, christian, middle age to old males.

    • Gaye

      You are so funny Walmart person, or they can paint themselves black put on tea towels and get a boat to Australia to be well looked after..

      Has anyone noticed that our fruit in the shops no longer smells like fruit, and that most of our fruit and veges no longer go brown when it is grated, or cut. I have been told that that is because there is no longer any nutrients in our food so there is nothing to oxidize. years ago when we grated carrots, cut fruit they went brown in seconds, not anymore..
      No nutrients we die faster… I am amazed at how sick our children and adults are now days, we are constantly told that our medicines are curing people fast now, yet kids are sicker than they have ever been, yes they do not get any of what used to be called the mild childhood diseases but now they get cancers, autism, asthma, diabetes, arthritis, etc, things that 99.9% of kids never got, so perhaps the mild child diseases were preferable eh.. did they actually build up the immune system…

      • karolyn

        About 10 or so years ago I had a tomato sitting on the windowsill that sat there for quite a while without rotting. When I cut it open, it had little tomato plants growing inside it! That was really weird. Well, a lot of the fruits and veggies that are not organic are lacking because the soil they are grown in lacks nurients. They just keep dumping man-made fertilizer in rather than enriching the earth and rotating crops.

      • Eddie47d

        Gaye; Some fruit we buy in the store is unnatural. Blackberries the size of a mans thumb and darker than the ones picked in the wild. They are plumped up with “steroids” and colored and some do loose their nutritional value. They sure look good but what are we really getting?

        • independant thinker

          Not dissagreeing with the rest of your post but you cannot get any darker blackberries than the ones we pick each year. The wild berries grow in profusion around here and they are dark as the inside of an unlit coal mine at midnight.

          • Carlucci

            I hope you are eating lots of those wonderful wild blueberries, as they are full of antioxidents and enzymes. Enzymes are the key to life.

        • Kate8

          The produce we get now is not just poor in quality, but has been irradiated. This kills any enzymes, which is why we eat food raw in the first place. When we no longer get these enzymes, we will slowly deteriorate and die. Enzymes assist digestion, and help protect us from cancer and other disease.

          Enzymes are what cause fresh produce to turn brown and decay. If it does not, you know it’s been irradiated, and you may as well eat everything cooked.

          Unless it’s been labeled “certified organic”, any organic labeling is meaningless. Try to make sure it hasn’t been irradiated, which may not be easy. Even almonds are required to be irradiated, when they pose absolutely no risk raw. I assume it’s because, raw, they are powerful, nutrient rick food, and help protect against cancer.

          • Carlucci

            Kate8 – I take digestive enzymes along with nattokinese (which is another fantastic enzyme/blood thinner). Serrapeptase is an incredible enzyme that prevents cancer. I can really tell a difference in the way I feel when I run out of them.

            I’ve also started taking nascent iodine as everyone is lacking in that very important mineral. My energy level has gone up doing this, and I don’t feel tired when I wake up in the morning.

        • 45caliber

          Eddie:

          Not sure how old you are but have you noticed the younger girls lately? When I was a kid, a B-cup breast was normal for high school girls and they seldom went above a C-cup after marriage. Now? Many are D-cups when they are still in junior high!

          The reason? We emphasis drinking milk to the kids here. And the cows are treated to produce more milk – which is passed along to the children. The girls show it.

          Last I heard the bra industry was up to H-cups.

          • Carlucci

            That’s because of all the hormones that are put into milk and meat by the dairy and beef industries. That’s why there is all of this early onset puberty with little girls needing bras at age ten or younger. Government propaganda wants you to believe that is due to “better nutrition”, but that’s just nonsense.

            Over one hundred years ago, girls did not start to develop or have periods until they were sixteen or seventeen years old.

          • Kate8

            Carlucci – Just look anywhere in nature. The faster and earlier a living thing blooms and reaches it’s reproductive cycle, the faster it declines and dies, as well.

            Shortened life spans.

          • kodster5

            Kate8, that remains to be seen. One of the reasons why they keep raising the retirement age to qualify for social security is because our life spans are getting longer. When they created social security, the average life span was 62. Now? It’s 75. So, they were hoping that most of the ones to qualify for it, after putting into the program for years, would be dead by the time they started drawing on it, or be drawing on it for a short time period.

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            Carlucci, (sorry guys just ignore the girl talk) you are so right about a young girls development. Our Daughter was 2 months prior to her 10th birthday, when she got her period. I still say, it’s all the hormones they shoot into our slaughtering animals for meats!

      • 45caliber

        Gaye:

        Also consider that we are now being vaccinated against all sorts of diseases. A hundred years ago there were deaths due to lack of vaccinations for some things but not that many. Even small pox wasn’t a total disaster for the white people. But it was for the Indians here in the US because they had no natural immunity to it.

        Now we have had a half dozen generations of vaccinations to “Keep kids healthy”. And very few die. BUT … as a result those natural immunities have been bred out of us. If small pox or a similar disease were to come along today we could expect about 99% of us would die from it.

        • Carlucci

          Personally, I think most vaccinations (not all, but most) are slowly killing people. I’m convinced that vaccinations are maiming children in the form of autism.

          BTW everybody – I read a fascinating article yesterday about extra virgin coconut oil (which I eat every day – most delicious on toast and in smoothies) bringing people out of dementia and Alzheimer’s disease.
          Extra virgin coconut oil is a medium chain fatty acid that, according to this article, the brain must have to function at it’s best.

          • karolyn

            Ah! Coconut oil! One of the best and also attacked because it is a saturated fat. It has many great attributes. Great for cooking too!

          • Carlucci

            karolyn – yes it is fantastic, but it’s gotta be extra virgin coconut oil. Have you ever tried it on cornbread, biscuits (with/without jam), whole wheat toast, and in oatmeal? I also use it to scramble eggs.
            And of course it is awesome in smoothies.

          • Kate8

            Carlucci – I agree about the vaccines. In fact, I’ve seen it…kids that get their 12 month round of vaccines and…are never again the same.

            My grandson had 2 rounds, and then my daughter learned about them and he never got another. He nearly died of the Hep B vaccine when he was born.

            Still, the “authorities” try to tell us otherwise.

            I also love coconut oil! In fact, coconut anything.

          • Karolyn

            Carlucci, Never tried it on biscuits – Just cooking and smoothies. the only problem I have had with the smoothies is that they are too rich! – but delicioso!

          • JeffH

            Carlucci, Korolyn and others. Thanks for sharing all of this stuff. I’ll be looking for some EV Coconut oil now.

          • Carlucci

            Jeff, you should be able to find some extra virgin coconut oil at any health food store. I like the Vitamin Shoppe brand, which is a chain of stores all over the USA. You can also buy it online. Just make sure it is extra virgin and hasn’t been adulterated in any way.

        • newspooner

          Has anyone noticed that Dr. William Campbell Douglass has recently found some research that indicates that the cause of autism could be in large part because some vaccines are grown in aborted fetus cells, causing some DNA contamination that can lead to autoimmune irregularites that can lead to autism. You all should read the article. Check his website http://www.douglassreport.com for his May 1 article.

          • Carlucci

            yes, and I just read an article that said if you take autistic kids off of wheat and dairy, and put them on a special diet, many of them “come back”. Some start talking normally right away. It is like they’ve been “in there” all the time, but could not escape until the proper diet was given to them.

            There is a link between autism and digestive problems. this makes sense as the lower bowel is known as the “second brain”. Jordan Rubin, the founder of the Garden of Life, was severely injured by a series of vaccinations when he was a teen and he subsequently developed Crohn’s Disease at the age of 19 when he was in college. If you have ever known anyone with that disease, it is absolutely a terrible way to live. Anyway, he figured out what caused it and how to recover from it, and the answer was not pharmaceuticals, but pure whole FOOD and supplements. And guess what? One of the foods that is extremely healing to the digestive tract is….drum roll….EXTRA VIRGIN COCONUT OIL -!! Anyway, Jordan Rubin’s book is absolutely amazing and I highly recommend it.

    • 45caliber

      Former Walmart person:

      There is no penalty if you claim some race on any government papers. They can’t prove you AREN’T that race. My wife is a decent from the “Black Dutch”. Her mother was quite proud of it – without realizing the Black Dutch were decendents of Negros from Africa brought into the Netherlands over a hundred years ago. She’d have died if she had known. Many who have ancestors who have recently come from most parts of Europe are the same. So claim them if you want! All the government workers can do is give you a funny look and take your word for it.

  • Raggs

    If you are growing a personal home garden for yourself and your family make sure that you don’t tell anyone about it…
    If you have chickens or hogs that your raising for your own consumption you may want to raise them in your house instead of out doors.. If you hunt or fish you will probably need to give that up..

    Do you see the common denominator yet??????

    TAXES TAXES TAXES…. according to our fine government EVERYTHING is ILLEGAL unless you are taxed for it.

    • karolyn

      Rggs – This is what I call extremism and alarmism. There is no way you can convince me that people will not be able to garden.

      • Raggs

        Nobody said that you could not plant a garden. I’m just saying get ready for the gestapo to pay you a visit.

      • Bitter Libertarian

        I agree, you couldnt be convinced because the water temp is increasing slowly….things dont seem so bad yet the America of Today is far worse off then the America of 120 years ago…and no I dont hold anyone blameless…the PEOPLE have to stop being lazy & clueless.

        So if you know your history, (assuming you do) you have to ask yourself why do we need thousands of laws created every year against people, restricting thing like MILK?

      • Raggs

        Last year there was an old man that had a garden in Illinois.
        He grew a large yeild of cabages, he was fined several thousands of dollars for growing more than he would be able to eat and he was not allowed to give any of the cabages away to his neighbors…

        • karolyn

          I simply cannot believe this without seeing proof. If it is true, then the people of Illinois have a responsibility to change it!

          • Raggs

            http://eatdrinkbetter.com/2010/09/14/georgia-man-fined-for-growing-vegetables/

            Here is a link… I got the state wrong it is Georgia….

          • DaveH

            As you’re eating that Crow, Karolyn, think about all the times that you have called people “Extremist” because they spout opinions that you disagree with. You should be ashamed.

          • Raggs

            Dave… She can’t have Crow the food police told her that it is unsafe for human consumption unless she pay’s a tax on it.

          • karolyn

            Raggs – So it’s zoning that’s the problem. The way you were talking, I thought it was just a takedown without any basis. Not that I’m for zoning, although it does have its pros. I moved here in ’05, and they hd just started instituting zoning laws. They still don’t know what they’re doing.

        • TIME

          Ragg’s that was in Georgia as I recall.

          • Raggs

            Your correct it was…

        • Kate8

          karolyn – You are okay with zoning away veggie gardens?

          Wow. We should be able to grow all the cabbage we want.

          • karolyn

            Kate – I never said that. Please don’t try to misconstrue my words. I said that there is a place for zoning. When it comes to someone wanting to put an inappropriate business into a neighborhood, it does come in handy.

      • Raggs

        karo.. You seem that you do not have a grasp on how the government is trying to control every aspect of our lives via regulations..

        • karolyn

          Yes, I do Raggs; however, I also do not believe in there being absolutely no controls at all. It is a very difficult line for me because I can see the benefits on both sides. I am afraid if there was absolutely no governmen control, there would be chaos. However, I do see that there are too many controls now. I don’t use a seatbelt if I can help it. Hate the damn things! I am not a namby-pamby government sheep by any means and am a rebel at heart.

          • DaveH

            Chaos? Because you would be making your own Free Choices?
            What would be chaotic about Government allowing you to make your own Free Choices?
            If you want to see chaos, you need look no further than Mexico. What does Mexico have even more of than we do? Bigger Government!

          • 45caliber

            karolyn:

            Of course there is some good on both sides. That is the only way they can get away with things. Consider the manta: “It’s for the good of the children!”

            The problem is – like the above statement – what might be good for on person may be very bad for a hundred others. So why should we force everyone to do what is good for one and let the hundred go to wherever?

            We need to do what is good for the majority and then do what is good for the one WITHOUT causing problems for the rest. Unfortunately, when you consider the government’s track record, they can’t do that.

          • Kate8

            karolyn, karolyn…chaos is precisely what the government DOES want.

            There was far MORE order when government left us alone. When people are taught to be honest and accountable, they are.

            Why do you think government has flooded us with third-world cultures, and has done everything possible to corrupt our own?

          • 45caliber

            Kate8:

            The only solution to pure chaos is a police state. If the people can be placed in a position where nothing is safe due to chaos, they will agree to almost anything to end it – including a police state.

          • Kate8

            Well said, 45, and right on target.

      • TIME

        Karolyn,

        Look into MONSANTO, all your questions will be addressed.

        Look, I don’t dislike you, I just am really wide awake so I see everything like I am sitting on top of a 18K Peek on a very clear day.

      • DaveH

        Karolyn,
        You are an Extremist. You come on this board constantly admonishing people to not think about the possibilities. That is Extremism in its purest form. If you want to remain ignorant, do so, but don’t try to shout others down who don’t.
        By the way, couldn’t happen? It has already been attempted, and by people like John McCain, who masquerade as Conservatives:
        http://lifesgreatclues.com/outlawing-home-gardens-are-you-kidding-me/

        • karolyn

          Dave – I was well aware of S510 and signed petitions about it. The Food Safety Act was signed into law in January. It ended up being amended and not as bad as originally written. I went over it briefly and saw no mention of “backyard gardens.” As a matter of fact, there is an exemption for producers who make less than $500,000 from the sale of prodce. This is the kind of scare tactics that bother me.

          • DaveH

            They tried, Karolyn. So, the fact that they failed leads you to believe we have nothing to fear?
            Yikes, you are in for a big surprise some day.

      • Kate8

        karolyn – It’s true. Laws are being put in place to completely outlaw organic food. Most produce is being cross-contaminated by GMO crops, and Monsanto is claiming patent infringement…

        It’s all a big ruse to prevent us from access to proper nutrition. Get ready for the garden police to come and cite you for growing organic food.

        We are all being watched by satellite at all times, so don’t think you can get by with them not knowing.

        Go ahead. Call me paranoid again. But you’ll change your tune…

        • DaveH

          Kate,
          It’s about money and power. The Government and their Crony Capitalists don’t like competition. That’s all.

          • DaveH

            And Kate, I know for a fact that there are people out there that would like to shrink the earth’s population. But, whether you are right or wrong, you are touting a line of thought that is just too much for most people to bear. Thus, you make yourself an easy target for people like Karolyn who don’t want to believe anything bad. I just think it’s better to stick to the basics — things that are much easier to prove.

          • Kate8

            DaveH – I realize that people don’t want to hear what the PTB really have in mind for us. But is helping the process by keeping silent the answer?

            The only chance we have of overcoming is by spreading knowledge. “My people perish for lack of knowledge”.

            Here in CA, our beautiful skies are being sprayed until the sun is gone, on a near daily basis. If I point this out to someone, I’m a nut case? It would seem that many think so. Yet, the information is out there, for all to find. The evidence is in the air! And once they do, a whole new perspective opens up.

            Until people are willing to open their eyes, we will remain helpless. Or is it hapless?

            In any case, DaveH, I have little patience for those who simply don’t want to know the truth because it is too scary. We no longer have time for that. It’s time for humanity to grow up.

            If we care at all about our children, we’ll do whatever it takes to insure that they have a chance at life. Which is more important, our children’s future or keeping ourselves from seeing that which scares us?

          • DaveH

            Kate,
            You’re missing my point. Think about the Lincoln thing, about how badly you don’t want to believe it. This from a lady with a relatively open mind. Now think about Eddie. Would you believe anything that man has to say, right or wrong, if you weren’t aware?
            That’s what I’m talking about. You are a lot more valuable to us if you stick to things that you can prove. Otherwise you just cause people to mistrust you, and we lose your valuable voice.

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            Kate8, I’ve been through a lot of rough stuff in almost 55 years, been afraid at times, but is Courage is being afraid and doing what ya gotta do anyway!

          • Kate8

            DaveH – I really have no attachment to the Lincoln thing, but I do have a passion for the truth. It just seems that everything good is being trashed these days, and our nation and people are in a mess.

            You can’t PROVE anything, either, DaveH. You have your set beliefs, and your mind is closed to any other possibilities. While there have been things I believed in, I stay open to new revelation, because I recognize the beliefs are just that…beliefs. Links and other opinions are just someone else’s beliefs. We need to learn the heart test.

            I may be right on some things, and I may be wrong on other things, like everyone. I have been at this for a very long time, and am convinced that some very untoward things are going down. The evidence I have seen and gathered has been overwhelming, and I am not afraid of the truth. I’d rather know what’s true than live in blissful ignorance and be caught off-guard.

            What I do believe in is that I am accountable to something greater than myself, and I follow where I am led. It is to that Supreme Being alone that I aspire to remain true. Nothing else is of any real importance to me.

          • Kate8

            AngelW – You are exactly right. And we just can’t worry about what others think.

            Those in true quest for truth will be drawn to one another.

          • DaveH

            That’s at least twice that you’ve insulted me on this page, Kate.
            My mind is a lot more open than yours. I don’t change my mind unless people can convince me I’m wrong. I have no problem adopting new ideas when that happens.
            As I told my brother once (after he called me a Know-it-All), what if I did know it all? Am I supposed to just keep my mouth shut and say nothing back, so that the insecure people around me are happier?

  • Gaye

    Gidday from Australia.
    I am disgusted at your government, and although we are about 15 to 20 years behind, ours is heading the same way, and of course our government is also left. Unfortunately like in America, the left have also infiltrated the right, (we call them white ants), they eat away at the very fabric of the right and democracy..
    I suggest that everyone look up, “The Pharmaceutical Drug Racket” and see what is really going on. The third or fourth cause of death in America is drugs, Drs, and hospitals..but they do not march on them eh..

    I have read that if they have control of our food they have control of us..
    The Amish people are very, very welcome here in Australia, they are fine people, and I think it would be a safe haven for them and the Jewish people, North side of Brisbane of course where we are.
    I was brought up on raw milk, and my grand daughter who is very sick on processed milk can drink raw milk till the cows come home with no trouble..
    They are killing us from the inside out, it is called Eugenics, Take a look at what Bill Gates says about Eugenics..
    Why do they not raid the pedophile Judges, and lawyers, or the real crims, makes one sus eh, and we allow a dead government do go full term, why??? they can break laws and we cant.. Watch out America, they WILL take your guns off you, they did here.. it is now illegal to have a gun, and of course the crims didnt give up theirs but no one raids them eh..

    • newspooner

      Since they have already advanced the anti-gun agenda and confiscation in Australia a few steps further than they have here yet, I would say that you are not 15-20 years behind us (in the path to totalitarianism) but probably somewhat ahead of us here in USA. My prayers are with you.

      • Gaye

        Yes, you could be right in that way… Thanks for your prayers, and I think that unless we do something soon we will need more than prayers..
        Most here seem to be aware of what they are doing to all DEMOCRATIC countries… and the people just keep sleeping.. sad eh..

        • Kate8

          Gaye – Bless you for your post.

          I have been heartened by some things I’ve heard coming from Australia, and saddened by others. We are all in a mess.

          People have always looked to America for stability, but we have been eaten from within. Well, from without, as well.

          I have no doubt that the world government will fail. Evil will fail, as it ultimately always does. Really rough times are ahead, and many of us will not make it. But many of us will go on to something better, and we will again be blessed. Meanwhile, we must do all we can to comfort and uplift one another, and to also spread the truth as we find it.

          Godspeed, friend.

    • DaveH

      Thank you for your valuable input, Gaye.

    • Dave M

      Gaye,

      We just finaly got a majority Conservitive government in Canada on Monday. One of the first things they are doing is abolishing the gun registry.

      I heard they banned CROSSBOWS in Australia a few weeks ago. You people need to grow a set and kick the bums out you have leading the country instead of throwing up your hands and walking away.

      • Kate8

        DaveM – I hope they do better than the ones we have here. We pinned some hope on them, but they are waffling…

        The NWO is a tough group to stand up to. Please keep us posted.

    • JeffH

      Gaye, it always good to hear from other’s that are not in America. Thanks for the support and best of luck to you “down under”.

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      Well put Gaye!

  • http://com i41

    Poloski, you forgot the worst government food conttroller, The Dept of Agriculture. Since most all USA corporate food producers have their land in several government programs As well as the madatory enrollment of beng under the government control to get a permit to sell your produce. A agency created by the communist FDR and his registered communist Sec of Ag. Weather you farm 40 acres of 40,000 acres you have to report what you are planting, what brand are approved, what amount of seed is used, and when harvested what storage vin it is going into even if it is on your own land, and how many bushels were harvested and the weight. As for GMO foods or people that are artifically implanted or fertalized, EU has the most lax rules. When a beef is crossed with another breed, that is generticlymodified. Onumnutts is a classic example of genetic modified organism, with bad results. Cross wheat with rye is a GMO food scource. It is the government wonk f–k ups being on your place and making you only use approved seeds and varities, as well givingthe smucks control over your operation is the food police that is making marxist/communism control possible here in the USA. Eu will not accept some of our grains , but they will allow medications to be used on animals and sell us produce that is impossible to use in the USA, but the food is in our food chain. S American countries send meat products that are produced and handled so crudely, it would have trouble being made into dog or animal feed, like downer livestock, slaughter houses that would be shut down and razed in the USA. Since the late 60′s every governmeent program created has given more control over to the beltway s–t birds with a cart gut degree. We are only now starting to see what the dumbocraps have in the pipeline since Congress went under dem control and has really raped up the bs in the last 2 1/2 years. The idoits in Onumnutts adminstration like Vilsack and Salazzaar a classic slub radical libatards who spout s–t and know nothing about what they are supposedly are experts on.

  • Jeff in OH

    FDA, EPA, NAACP, ALL PHONY, ALL OUT OF TOUCH WITH REALITY. THEY SHOULD GET THE ATF TO RAID THE FDA AND THE NRC TO BLOW UP THE UAW WHO IN TURN BATTLE THE NEA FOR THE PROTECTION OF THE NRA. AND ALL THE WONDERFUL GOVERNMENT PROJECTS NOT MENTIONED CAN GO TO HELL

  • Elvira

    The FDA is actually an agency for big pharma. What they are doing is somewhat like the Mafia. Big pharma wants to eliminate ALL competition so they can continue peddling their poisons to the public. The medical profession is in concert with this whole charade by recommending these poisons to their patients. Have you noticed the commercials on TV for many drugs being advertised? The punch line is: “Ask your doctor” concerning the drug being pushed. Why would the drug company tell you to ‘ask you doctor’ unless they KNOW what the doctor will say? The government, the medical profession and big pharma are all in bed together and this cannot be good for you and me.
    This question needs to be asked: Is there any difference between so called ‘legal’ drugs and illegal drugs? They both will do you more harm than good. No wonder the FDA and Big Pharma want to eliminate any possibility that someone may get well using natural herbs and vitamins.
    All three, the government, medical profession and big pharma want you on the edge of death to propagate your dependence on them. They DO NOT want you in a state of good health. WHY? The government wants to seize ALL your lifetime assets when you die. The medical profession does not want you in good health, they want you sick and visiting your doctor every two weeks or in the hospital. Big pharma wants to continue raking in billions in profit from selling their poisons.
    All of this is National Socialism, you exist for the propagation of the state. They don’t give a rat’s ass about you or me.

  • FreedomScribe

    The Fed thugs treating these peaceful, self-sustaining people like they are criminal drug dealers should be a wake-up call fro all true freedom-loving Americans. The Brownshirts are real and worse than this will soon occur. Amazingly, we hear nothing about this from the liberal left who have championed organic farming, natural foods, and natural cures since the 60′s. The Amish don’t even burn gasoline. With one in seven US citizens now receiving food stamps, the FEDS should be applauding what these people do instead of ripping through their lives and homes like the Navy Seals. Wake up America.

    • Raggs

      There is a company in Canada that has produced sterile plants in order to corner the market.. If a plant will not reproduce the farmers will have to buy their seeds from this company each year.
      I wonder how long it will be until the US has this type of monopoly.

      • karolyn

        Isn’t this what Monsanto is doing?

        • Eddie47d

          Absolutely Karolyn and they are a terror on farmers who don’t buy their seeds.

          • Kate8

            karolyn and eddie – Are you at all beginning to get the picture that this fascism is not just limited to agriculture?

            Surely, you can’t think that.

        • Raggs

          Yeah I think thats the one….

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Raggs, if I’m not mistaken, I believe most of the corn you buy for planting today is mostly all hybrids, aren’t they? I did get local seeds that are heirlooms, with the exception of the corn at $13.99 a pak, in which I d*nm neared flipped!__Anyone, know if corn is all hybrid now or not??

        • Kate8

          Angel W – What I have heard is that corn is now universally contaminated.

          Likewise soy, and alfalfa soon.

          The problem is, the GMO crops will contaminate your organic ones. And the GMOs are killing the bees, which we need for pollination.

          My yield was way down last year on many things. Plus the spraying of the skies to block out the sun, which reduces crop yeild.

        • Eddie47d

          Norway has a massive seed bank which stores almost all original crop seeds from all over the world. Monsanto probably wouldn’t allow this in our country.

    • DaveH

      There are many on the left as well as on the right who have just been mislead by those who benefit from Big Government (mostly the leaders).
      It is our task to awaken them.

      • 45caliber

        I agree. But it sure does get frustrating when all they can do is constantly quote what they are told rather than listen and think for themselves.

        • Raggs

          Amen to that .45… They feel as if it is safe following the herd rather than getting outside on their own once in a while.

          • 45caliber

            If you go out on your own, you can be picked off. They forget that the followers in a herd also get picked off. Only the leaders get to eat the good grass. The rest have to eat the stuff the leaders defficate all over.

            But if you do go out on your own, you can get the good stuff too.

    • Lawrence Freeman

      The Amish like the poor class does not contribute to the government enough to let them live in peace. the government killed off most Indian population because they lived off the land, the government didn’t get money from the Indians, Just like each of you are stating, history repeating it’s self.

  • Dave M

    On Monday, in Canada, we just had a federal election and finaly got a majority conservative government. One of the first things they are going to do is abolish the gun registry.

    Voting and organizing DOES make a difference, even in a socialist country like Canada. Try it…it works.

    • TIME

      Dave, Wise words!

    • DaveH

      Thank you for your experienced input, Dave.

    • 45caliber

      Congrats.

      • Carlucci

        I just read about that on another site. Good on the Canucks, eh?

    • JeffH

      Dave M, I heard this in a “gun” website forum and I think it fantastic…Kudos to the conservatives in Canada.

      • DaveH

        Let’s just hope that their newly elected “conservatives” behave like they promised (unlike ours).

  • http://! Angel Wannabe

    As a person who lives, not far from and occasionally interacts with the Amish in Pa, I like to personally invite the food and drug administration to mind they’re frickin business and leave the Amish and the rest of us alone.
    I liken you bunch of FDA’s to the “Planned Obsolescence Crew”, when there is nothing around any longer to regulate, you create a panic or a scare, just to look like your worth your pay and to keep your d*nmed jobs!
    “Oh, How did our ancestors ever live without you?”__I’ll tell ya how they did it. They used the common sense the Good Lord gave them. They didn’t have to exercise, they got enough of that in fields, working til dark plowing fields with horses, just like the Amish. And just like the Amish they grow, can food, milk cows, and butcher they’re own meats, make they’re own clothes, just like my Dad and his family did, they were Pa Dutch too.
    The Amish don’t need governing or regulations, they done well by themselves, and thats your problem with them, FDA, they don’t need ya and you don’t like it!__Because you know best!___Bull Shyte!!!!

    • 45caliber

      Angel – I agree. If you notice, the FDA always comes up with something that is bad for you just before a new budget is authorized.

      Actually, they need to send about 90% of their crew overseas to check on the produce and other items sent here to insure it’s safe – but no one wants to go. So they create reasons to keep their jobs here.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        45, Actually I thought the only thing they were suppose to regulate is, food import and export, larg food companies in the US, and Medicine. I had no idea the b*stards were living in my refrigerator & Medicine cabinet and watching what I throw down my gullet!_ Ah, they make sick in the arse!

        • 45caliber

          Angel:

          Not that long ago they ruled that red hair dye was bad for you. It could cause cancer. They had given rats so much of it that it was surprising to me that the rats didn’t die of starvation for lack of good food. (this is their preferred way to “prove” something is bad for you.) They had to back off since 1) there was no known cases of cancer caused by red dye, 2) too many women wanted red hair, and 3) the dye manufacturers objected.

          It gives you an idea of just how deep they are.

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            45__ oh yeah they’re deep alright, deep in our friggin wallets for more money, and too far up our giggy’s in regulation!

        • Kate8

          Angel W – I have thought about this many times before. When the grid goes down, and we are all left unable to function…nothing will have changed for the Amish.

          The powers that be don’t want anyone being self-sufficient. We could learn a great deal from the Amish. They haven’t allowed themselves to be lured into the lust of havin’ things, nor have they forgotten what’s really important.

  • DaveH

    You want to make your own decisions about what you put in your own bodies? So do I. There is only one Political Party that champions your natural (or God Given) right to make those decisions. Quit throwing away your votes on Republicans and Democrats who care only about staying in power.
    Vote Libertarian — For Real Freedom:
    http://libertarianparty.org/

    • 45caliber

      If you want to put something in your body, as far as I’m concerned, go ahead. BUT … the minute you get out on the road with that in your body or you decide you need a little more cash to buy more and decide to rob the next door neighbor – as many do – then there should be an immediate firing squad.

      • Bitter Libertarian

        I agree with the firing squad!

      • DaveH

        I think people should be rigorously punished whenever they take a life or hurt somebody, drunk or sober.

      • DaveH

        By the way, 45, putting punishment aside, almost all of the drug-related crimes result from the illegality of the drugs which drives the costs sky high, creates an aura of excitement (getting away with something), and enriches the most evil segment of society — the Drug Lords.
        Portugal has done just fine after finally ignoring all the dire warnings and decriminalizing drugs. Note that I have taken one puff on one joint in my entire life. I don’t even take aspirin. So, I’m not exactly in favor of doing drugs. I just know that the drug wars are counter-productive:
        http://www.cato.org/pub_display.php?pub_id=10080

        • 45caliber

          DaveH:

          Do a little checking for the info on the problems they had prior to outlawing the drugs in the first place. Most are still under lock and key but a few are out. Also on how they stopped the illegal dealing then. The reason they outlawed them was because too many people were using – and destrying their families when not out robbing someone for the five cents or so it took to buy another dose.

          • DaveH

            Do likewise, 45. I lived through the times when it all started (sensational drug busts, then the drug wars). There was nothing of the sort of trouble you describe until after the Drug Wars were being fought in earnest. I would think people would have learned from the folly of Prohibition. I would think wrong:
            http://www.drugwarfacts.org/factbook.pdf
            Especially look at the chart on page 18. Is this worth losing our Freedom over as well as Government Spending of $15 Billion dollars?

          • DaveH

            That’s $15 Billion a year.

          • Karolyn

            I heard an interview with a former drug pusher on NPR today. They interviewed him regarding legalizing drugs. He said that he would not have liked it because the prices would have gone down too much.

          • DaveH

            According to one article I read, Karolyn, there is good evidence that the marijuana growers (illegal) in California were lobbying against the marijuana legalization bill on the California ballot. Legalization would decimate those who are illegally growing marijuana in the national forests and other places where the ground isn’t very fertile.

  • Robert Morrow

    I will start with a quote from Herbert Ley,M.D., Former FDA Commissioner. “The thing that bugs me is that people think the FDA is protecting them. It isn’t. The FDA is protecting the profits of the corporations that pay US and the POLITICIANS!” With that information we can see the Corruption of the FDA and your Politician, like the Senators from New Mexico who just voted increased powers to the FDA. I suggested that we change the FDA name to MURDER FOR PROFIT AGENCY. Do you know that the FDA approves poison drugs to increase the Profits of the Pharmaceutical Co. Murdering thousand each year? Do you know that the FDA approves over 15,000 toxins to be put in your processed foods, even your toothpaste. Take toothpaste and read the label and you will find SODIUM LAURYL SULFATE, which is highly toxic and used to clean grease garage floors. Another is ASPARTAME like in Splenda. Do you know that this chemical is highly addictive similar to cocaine or heroin and once hooked try to stop taking it. It is in sodas and many other things and if you do not get it you will feel bad and depressed and need more. Of course this ensures their sales. What are you and your children drinking. Aspartame to help lose weight, another lie, these artificial sweeteners make you gain weight. On milk, did you know that Pasteurized milk caused 200,000 case of food poisoning & over 600 deaths. Check it out on real milk.com, Raw milk is not the problem, the FDA and your Corrupt Elected Official are as they have sold there souls for the blood stained 30 pieces of Silver. This is just some of the things going on. A Quote “If people let the government decide what foods they eat and what medicines they take, their bodies will soon be in a sorry state as are the souls who live under TYRANNY.” Thomas Jefferson. Let us stop this Tyranny and put these murders behind bars in jail. Chef Robert Here in the Land Of Enchantment.

    • Carlucci

      Not to mention the fluoride put in toothpastes, and everyone knows fluoride is a poison. I switched to a fantastic product called “Tooth Soap” and I cannot believe how clean and strong my teeth and gums are. The best thing about it is I no longer have gum or tooth sensitivity.

      Speaking of artificial sweeteners, one of my best friends almost died a few years ago from aspartame poisoning. She had been drinking about 5 to 7 Diet Cokes a day, every day for years, even though I warned her repeatedly that she was drinking poison, not to mention that was why she was so fat. One night she started throwing up and could not stop, so her husband took her to the emergency room, and fortunately there was a decent doctor on duty who figured out that she had aspartame poisoning. He told her never to consume it in any form ever again. And then guess what happened? She dropped over fifty pounds in just a few months and looked and felt fantastic.

      When I see the fat dummies at the grocery store buying cases of diet soda, I just shake my head in disgust. People are so stupid…

  • Freddie

    These clowns are going to be surprised when THE PEOPLE rise up against them with force and push them back down where they belong. Good luck on getting all of the military behind them too; 100% will not happen. These clowns are going to tear our country apart in every way possible. Can you say Civil War?

    • DaveH

      Where the South went wrong was not bringing the fight to the Northern Leaders in Washington DC. Leaders are good at sending their underlings to die. Only a few will actually be brave enough to lead the charge.

      • 45caliber

        Lead a charge? Most of those in Washington – if not all – would be down on their knees begging and pleading for mercy rather than risk scratching their hands in combat.

    • Raggs

      I like you guys but you should be carefull of what you say, many here will turn you in to the FBI if you talk of a revolution or such.

      • DaveH

        Who is advocating revolution? I don’t even think it would be a good idea. And for those who don’t know, the North were the aggressors in the Civil War. The South just didn’t want anything more to do with the Northerners who were stepping all over the Constitution, so they seceded. It was much the same situation as what our States fought against in 1776.
        I would like to see the Conservative States secede though. There would only be violence if the Liberal States launched it.

      • 45caliber

        There have been some on here who I believe were actually government agents trying to get someone to start something. I accused a couple of them of just that – and I’ve never seen them on here under that name again. I don’t want a civil war. I would much rather see the country break up than have a civil war. With the technology we have now a civil war would be very ugly and there would be millions of deaths.

        • DaveH

          The question is “Why should there be any deaths at all if a free people no longer want to be part of the Union?”. The odd thing is that the aggressors usually are the ones who want to take something from the others. I would think it would be the other way around.

  • Freddie

    BTW, we did drink whole milk right from the cow growing up, and my children too, and we never once were sick from it.

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      Freddie, I did too on my Grandmothers Farm and guess what, I lived to tell about it.__Imagine that FDA!

  • Daniel

    This is just another example of Big Government run amok. It is the exact kind of thing our Founders were trying to break away from and they would be weeping if they were alive and saw events like this taking place. This is one reason why many departments in the Federal government should be eliminated; plus they don’t have any constitutional authority whatsoever to do what they have done on numerous occasions.

    • 45caliber

      I agree.

  • Thamera

    Notice how many of the liberal posters remain silent on this issue? Especially the ones that like to label us “extremists” haha. I grew up drinking raw, unpasteurized milk. Thank you government for looking out for me! LOL And I agree Daniel, the founders would weep.

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      Thamera. Yepper, Only eddie!

      • Eddie47d

        Nice try Angel darling and Ms Thamera. Liberals love organic products and have been pushing for more of them for years.They are strong supporters for allowing chickens in the city too. So why do you have to always get nasty about Liberals. Why don’t you take on ” big beef” who have been pumping steroids and unnatural hormones into their meat for decades. I’m sure you knew that most cattle ranchers are conservative. Monsanto is another conservative company and so is Tyson who use unhealthy methods to raise chickens. Now Conservatives like yourselves might raise your own food and watch what you buy but don’t blame the liberals for lousy foods in the markets.

  • http://com i41

    When libertarians want to put what ever in their bodies, that is just fine. But when they get fired for having illegal drugs residue in their systems, don’t whine and moan. Same as for smoking, smoke all you want, but the self inflicted damage to your carcuss should not be taken care by the general population. Same goes for the queers and sexual behavior or drug use of people, welfare rolls are prime examples, cure is if sire will not take responsiblility casterate the peice of s–t. Vote libertarian and give to the marxist/communist socialist dumbocraps.

    • DaveH

      Thank you, i41, for being a great advertisement for the Libertarian Party.

  • Freddie

    I41 – Please clarify, your intended message. I read as if we take raw milk into our bodies, we will have illegal drugs. Was that your intented message?

  • 45caliber

    The FDA when originally set up was necessary to insure we weren’t poisoned and to get rid of the quacks selling their “medical” concoctions.

    They did that. But the big drug companies (and others) realized it was a great way to get rid of small compitition. All they had to do was come up with a way to get the FDA to raid them. If someone wants to sell a drug or vitamin suppliment, they should sell them to the drug companies so they can get the profits.

    And heaven help any farmer who tries to sell produce direct to the consumers. First, they get the profits. Second, the big farm produce companies can’t sell as much in stores. Third, the farmers are SUPPOSED to sell only to the farm produce companies – not to the consumers who save money. The fact that it is the same stuff doesn’t matter.

    We had our own cow growing up – and I drank raw milk for many years. It tastes a little different and doesn’t last as long but it is excellent. Further, you can get the cream to make good butter or cheese. It isn’t as easy to make with the processed milk.

    • meteorlady

      I have absolutely no faith that the FDA is non-biased and is doing their job. If they were, we would have safer drugs from big PHARMA. Have you actually read the labels of these drugs or listened to the side affects when they advertise them. “In some instances death can occur”…. what does that mean? Is a few death OK with the FDA and do they value human life that little.

      Fact is the drug companies build in the price of lawsuits when they price their drugs for market. The very last thing the drug companies want is an efficient and non-biased FDA.

      • DaveH

        How could we expect people with guaranteed jobs, and who are unaccountable to the consumer, to do a good job of it? Those of us who are afraid or unwilling to do the necessary research would be much better off to join private consumer organizations to do the research.
        And the idea that any company (especially the Big ones) would be willing to risk poisoning the consumers, and losing their business as a result, is ridiculous. Government, in fact, provides cover for those that are errant companies, as the general population is under the delusion that Government is looking out for them, so they don’t look out for themselves.
        What all those agencies (FDA, BATF, etc.) do is waste our financial resources that would be much more efficiently utilized to protect us in the private sector. The bigger Government gets, the worse the Crony Capitalism gets, and the less safe the people get.

        • 45caliber

          DaveH:

          One thing I’ve always wondered – why do we need an agency like the BATF to regulate tobacco? Alcohol I can see – they want to insure the government gets their taxes. Firearms, they want to make sure they can control who gets them so they know where to go to take them away again. But tobacco? I’m missing something there.

          • DaveH

            Same ol’, same ol’ — money and power. Look at gambling, for instance, they are dead set against it, unless they are profitting from it (Lottery, etc.).
            Government is so transparent to me, that it is difficult to understand why there are so many clueless people out there.

          • 45caliber

            I’m sure you are right – but where are they getting it?

          • DaveH

            If you’re talking about tobacco:
            http://www.rjrt.com/taxpays.aspx

      • 45caliber

        meteorlady:

        The FDA originally were of use – but like most government agencies, they outlived their usefulness. Besides it was nice to get those “donations” from the various companies to find they were right and everyone else was wrong. But they actually ran out of most things that needed to be checked. And they had all these people employed. If you lay off a number of people under you (in a government job) you can actually cut your own salary since they have these salary levels that depend upon how many people you supervise. Since they didn’t want to do that, they have to find things that show how badly they are needed to keep you safe so they can keep that payroll up.

    • DaveH

      45,
      Long before the FDA, there were laws against Fraud. The excuse used to create the FDA was for the “protection” of the people. But nobody cares about you like you care about yourself. If we the people aren’t going to do the necessary research to care for ourselves, we certainly can’t expect somebody else to care about us. Goverments create agencies for one main reason — More Power.

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      I’ve made my own butter for the last couple years. Used Raw milk a couple time too. In the stores, It’s a dollar cheaper than a pound of butter. Use heavy cream, add a teaspoon of salt(opt) and high speed kitchen aid, and ya got butter in less than 10 minutes. Wrap a towel around the mixer, when the butter finally seizes, the buttermilk splashes everywhere.

      • 45caliber

        Angel:

        It works – but it is still not as good as the real item. You get raw milk straight from the cow and let the cream rise. Then you dip off the cream. Make the butter from that and there is no comparison.

        If you let the cream go sour and then press out the whey through a cheese cloth (called that for a good reason) you can make cheese. The initial product is cottage cheese (you have to flake it up) but if you let it “ripen” you can get other kinds of cheese. The most common from cow milk is cheddar; swiss cheese and similiar white cheeses comes from goats milk.

        Always leave some of the cream in the milk, though, or it doesn’t taste as well. You have to shake it up or stir it up to drink it but it is worth the effort.

        • http://! Angel Wannabe

          46 and carlucci, All do respect 45, I like mine better, I salt it to my taste, MAKES GREAT GAAARLIC BUTTER TOO! LOL. _-anyway, Let the heavy whipping go out date about a week, then MAKE IT it has a better bite, my opinion. WHATEVER YA DO, DON’T FORGET TO WRAP A TOWEL ALL THE WAY AROUND THE MIXER, OR MAN YOU’LL GET A BATH WHEN THAT BUTTER SEIZES!

          • 45caliber

            You can do the exact same thing with the real stuff. We always added salt. And sometimes honey as well.

          • 45caliber

            We use a blender on low if we make it your way. The top prevents it from splattering. We used a churn to make it the other way. There are two good types. One is a big crock with a plunger/paddle you use. The other actually is a gallon jar with a crank.

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            45, the jar churn is a good idea to have on hand, in case the electric goes out. I saw a good one for around $98.00. But I’m sure there are probably cheaper ones available.

        • http://! Angel Wannabe

          45, I’m getting ready to do some barrel dill pickles. I helped my Grandmother as a kid, guess I’ll teach my own Grand kids now.

          • 45caliber

            I love sour pickles. And bread-and-butter ones. Kerr canning has an excellent recipe for sour pickles.

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            45, Kerr canning__ hmm_ have to check that out thanks!

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            45, My husband likes sour pickles too, but my fav is, the big fat dills, ya know the ones, that ya used to get at the grocery stores with a pair of tongues to get them out of the barrel?! My Grandmother used to make those too!

        • http://! Angel Wannabe

          45, made easy cottage cheese last year, in a few weeks I’ll be making mozzarella good recipes on line, gonna experiment with flavors a lil’.I love smoked cheeses too!
          Also experimenting with creating my own perfumes with essential oils.
          C’mon, Get creative folks, times a wastin! :)

          • JeffH

            I’m just enjoin’ all of this.

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            Jeffh,lol!

      • Carlucci

        Angel – Can I make butter in the food processor? I have a Kitchenaid fp. This sounds intriguing….I want to try it.

        • http://! Angel Wannabe

          Carlucci , all I can say is try it. It may go too fast, I don’t know maybe Bing or google it, to see if someone else has tryed it.

          • Carlucci

            Ok. I’m going to look it up on the web and see what I can find. Thanks! :)

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            No Probs Carlucci! :)

          • Carlucci

            BUTTER UPDATE – !! I just saw some videos about how to make butter at home. One guy made it real fast in a mini-Cuisinart food processor just like the one I have. He made garlic and herb butter in a jiffy.
            I’m excited. Can’t wait to try it. When I do, I’ll post a butter report. Thanks for giving me the idea, Angel W.

      • karolyn

        Somebody told me once that their grandmother used to mae her butter rocking in the rocking chair for hours! There’s a little store here that sells fresh made butter from the North Carolina mountains. I’ve always wanted to make butter in an antique churn, but I think that takes too long! And too much work! :-)

        • http://! Angel Wannabe

          Karolyn, you can make it in a jar if ya wanna, shake it for about 30-40 minutes perhaps and hour!_-If ya have even a hand mixer at top speed should do it__all i can say is do it some place your not gonna make a mess, salt it to taste and try it!

        • 45caliber

          It takes about 45 minutes in the old antique churns. But it also depends upon how much is in it. We had about a gallon or so sour cream.

  • FreedomFighter

    It is incremental slavery.

    What happens when a totalitarian goverment has complete control of the food supply?

    Social engineering by food, want a more obediant public – use additive a-4, another country threatening the totalitarians they introduce substance c-7… because you are what you eat.

    How about lowering quality of food nutritional value to produce smaller less intelligent workers…

    and my favorite — starvation to induce political will — see Russian history for a good example.

    Some controls are needed to maintain public health, control should end at this point. IMHO the goverment could have handled the situation of raw milk sales in a far better and cheaper manner.

    Laus Deo
    Semper Fi

  • 45caliber

    Actually, where we need the FDA today, they won’t cover. We need them to check the imports of food, toys, medicines, etc. But they don’t want to go to check factories in other countries or check the produce as it comes in. It is easier to check the paper work and accept it at face value. That’s why the BIGGEST crime you can commit is to either fail to do the paperwork or to make a mistake on it when you turn it in to them.

    For instance, did you know that there is a $10,000 fine for each mistake if you misspell a work or misplace a comma on a DOT bill of lading?

  • Grady

    There is one truth we can trust, and that is Gods truth. The word of God says the Holy Spirit leads us into all truth. As a kid I told people about the things that are happening now. I didnt know anything, I just knew what the spirit said. Everyone thought I was crazy, but God is the only one we can truly trust.
    God Bless

  • meteorlady

    So when I lived in Washington State I went to Dr Johnathan Wright who is known and respected all over the world. He has great success with allergies and treating various disorders and deseases with supplements and balancing the body chemistry.

    Seems local Drs were “concerned” about his practice and reported he was using unapproved FDA “drugs” and unapproved practices in treating people. The FDA and ATF appeared at is offices, dressed in combat clothing and guns at ready, and kicked the door in. There were 43 patients, most elderly in his clinic at the time. They were rushed out, all his computers and some of his equipment was confiscated. There was a Grand Jury hearing and he was not allowed to attend. One year later, they returned all his records and equipment without one single word of apology and he was able to continue his practice. Oh, there was a small article in the forth section of the newspaper reporting the return of his things. To this day he has a sign that indicates they are not allowed to enter and gives his attorney’s phone number and address.

    This is our federal government. There is nothing of greater threat to big PHARMA than the fear of natural vitamins, supplements, and treatments. It takes BILLIONS out of their pockets each and every year so they will lobby the federal government to stop regulate at every opportunity. One item is Lipator… the natural use of Red Rice Yeast has been found in Europe to be as effective. Those people that have side affects from Lipator, have the same side effects from Red Rice Yeast. Funny……

    I grew up on dairy product from my grandmother’s farm…. raw milk, butter, eggs. Never got sick and am disgustingly healthy today. Isn’t it my right to purchase something without government interference? Even if it might hurt me, it’s still my right to take that chance.

    • Grady

      Well said meteorlady,
      Its your right under the constitution. But our govt. hasnt respected the constitution for a long time.

    • DaveH

      So true, meteorlady.
      Government has absolutely no business trying to protect us from ourselves.

    • Carlucci

      meteorlady – I am very familiar with Dr. Jonathan Wright and other healers like him (Dr. Julian Whitaker, Dr. Stephen Hotze, etc.). I get Dr. Wright’s newsletter. He totally rocks.

      As far as the Red Yeast Rice, it is a natural statin that the drug companies copy. I’ve heard that people have had reactions to RYR, too.

      I think all of this high cholesterol nonsense comes from consuming trans fats, like margarine and anything hydrogenated like franken phude that comes in boxes and packages on the shelf.

  • http://com i41

    Hell now I have no problem with raw milk, my family and I ran a 300 hd dairy and we all drank milk. I just don’t like the libertarian attitude of anything goes bs, and then when behavior wheather being a drunk, a drug head, a smoker, generational welfare smuck, or a whorehound or queer, don’t expect the rest of us to tail your sorry azz up with medical care and pensions for not being able to produce anything useful.Government should own property or anything, and private property should be the owners right to do with as they like, not to have some worthless puke to decide use and if it is acceptable to them! As for the 2 parties there sure is a difference, dems are just generational marxist/communist who beleive in government control everything, reb have too many rinos which are close to slipping into complate dumbocraps. After having to work with .city,county, and state officals, dems hold true to more regs and more control, reps will release the regs if the people being controlled put up a fight. My experience with libertarians has been people who beleive in the Clower and Pivens bs of using all the government programs untill they are broke and were always talking about Ron Paul from the mid 80′s. Plus most of them were always fudging to get a little more money in shady ways. Like claiming livestock was in one state, when really they were in another state only 60 miles away and seen no problem with gaming the system to gain $20 a head of tax benedits. Kind of like the bankers that had livestock that were close to us, stretch the facts and round up the numbers and were just on the edge of being crimminal acts.

    • DaveH

      It is right-wing do-gooders such as yourself, I41, who have (in conjunction with the left-wingers) allowed Government to get so damn Big. You have absolutely no business telling anybody else what they can or can’t do with their own bodies and property. If they trespass on yours, then it is your business.
      We are in this mess right now because people like i41 and Denniso each want to force their pet agendas on the rest of us. We need to wake up and realize that Big Government has done little to better society and a lot to make it worse.

      • Bitter Libertarian

        “private property should be the owners right to do with as they like, not to have some worthless puke to decide use and if it is acceptable to them!”

        LOL He gets it on one hand and then NOT on the other LOL Amazing that both sides came out of the same person…(Guess he forgot his body & life is PRIVATE) I guess this is what the 2 party system does to people..makes them experience BIPOLAR disorder symptoms.

        • TIME

          BL, & Dave
          Man you guys hit the bloody nail dead on the head. Great post!

    • Bitter Libertarian

      just don’t like the libertarian attitude of anything goes bs, and then when behavior wheather being a drunk, a drug head, a smoker, generational welfare smuck, or a whorehound or queer, don’t expect the rest of us to tail your sorry azz up with medical care and pensions for not being able to produce anything useful.

      Libertarianism is Global, its NOT just a political party. The short answer is this….If you do it (what ever it is) YOUR 100% responsible for it. If you think Libertarians want anything goes and then have the Govt Pick up the pieces your way off target pal!
      I can say accurately that Libertarians DO NOT SUPPORT WELFARE in any form.

  • http://com i41

    Dave H, no it is simple minded idoits who vote for off the wall idoits that don’t stand a chance of winning and then give itto the dumbocraps. It will not change a hell of a lot to elect a Pres of the Libertarian Party, if there isn’t a Congress to approve what you wnat to change. Which means you had better have 2 senators and what ever reps each state is allowed of the same mind set. Tea Party is the group that put the rep on notice to get their heads out of the rarified air of the beltway, and I bet there will be some that got elected in the House did not have the back bone to stand up and will leave. Dumbocraps have one mind set they hold on to and that is to grow regulations and government all they can. Best thing is to work in the system in each state and changes will happen. As the life long rinos and all the get alongs are kicked out, things will improve. Rand Paul shows how things can get done working with the reps as his dad keeps registering as.

    • DaveH

      i41,
      Like I said earlier, you are the best advertiser on here for Libertarians. Keep on posting, you will get us more recruits.

      • DaveH

        Einsteins definition of insanity — Doing the same thing over and over hoping that it will produce different results next time.

      • JeffH

        DaveH :). I took a peek at FOX Business and saw that John Stossel is supposed to have quite a show tomorrow nite. I believe the core of the show is to expose the takers as just that…taking and never improving their position. It should be a good and informative hour, as most of his shows are.

        • DaveH

          I love John Stossel.
          Have you watched Judge Napolitano? He does not pull his punches. I worry for his life. Long live the Judge!

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            jEFFH< AND dAVEh, I love the judge too, as you say, he does not pull punches! How are ya gonna agrue with him, he's a Judge, knows the law and the Constitution. I agree, The rest have becomes sellouts, I guess they have to play by the rules or get ousted. AND_ Speaking of ousted, I'm hoping G.Beck will open up more once he's off of Fox, there is alot not being said, that could be!

          • JeffH

            Oh yeah. The Judge is one of my favorites…watch his show when I can. He doesn’t mince his words either, I really like that in anyone.

  • Harold Olsen

    One of the reasons why the Amish sell raw milk is because their religion opposes modern technology. For them to be arrested like this violates their religious beliefs. In doing so, the constitutional right of the Amish have been violated. But then, they are Christians and it is the sort of thing I would expect from that Muslim extremist in the White House.

    • karolyn

      Now, see, this is what I object to. The problem was that the Amish were selling it, not that they were using it themselves. You cannot place the blame for EVERYTHING on Obama. It wouldn’t have mattered if they were Southern Baptists, if they were found out, Big Brother was gonna come and get ‘em. As much as I am not real happy where I live, I know that that kind of thing would not stand a big chance of happening here in SC.

      • 45caliber

        And why should they be arrested for selling “raw” milk? It is only considered “raw” since it didn’t go to the big companies to be homogenized and pasturized. Could it be – horrors! – that these poor companies were forced to lose sales to these terrible Amish farmers?

        • karolyn

          45 – I didn’t say they should. I was responding to the previous post’s assertion that it was all Obama’s fault, etc.

          • DaveH

            Did Obama stop it? He is the head of the Executive Branch, you know. He got the credit for Bin Laden, why should he not get the credit for the raid?

          • Lawrence Freeman

            Don’t you know if Obama was a republican,Karolyn would be douning him, she doesn’t get it, it’s not the party it’s the person repusenting the party. Some families have criminals in them, but that doesn’t make the whole family, criminal.

      • TIME

        Karolyn,
        Thats granted to them under the FIRST Amendment freedom of speach and religion, its the very STANDARD this Nation was founded on.

        So why would you object to their freedom to do as they wish? Afterall they are not hurting anyone.

        • karolyn

          I didn’t say that. I was just responding to the previous post’s assertions.

          • TIME

            Karolyn, are you talking about 141? If so Forgive.

          • karolyn

            No, it was Harold Olsen. I rarely respond to i41 unless I really let him get to me!

          • DaveH

            I can rarely understand what he’s trying to say. I guess it’s because I’m an “idoit” like i41 says.

          • JeffH

            i41 can be amusing when he not being a complete…..?????

          • Kate8

            JeffH – I can’t always figure out what i41 is saying, but I always enjoy whatever it is.

            I think his heart is in the right place.

      • Raggs

        karo.. I have already told you why it is illegal to the government.
        It is not taxed plain and simple… If it is taxed uncle muslim would be more than happy to accept it.

  • Kate8

    Info on eugenics, and if you scroll down from the videos, there are listed 8 articles by James Corbett, who has done extensive research into depopulation plans, the NWO, the Rockefellers, and much more.

    “The technology that (today) is attempting to enslave us is the technology that will (ultimately) free us”.

    James Corbett is about finding solutions. Are we?

  • Kate8
    • TIME

      Kate,

      There are so few of us that see the TRUTHS that I can only hope that we are all wrong. But when WW III starts as thats all well in the works now and there can only be one outcome.

      Closeing your eyes will not make it go away. YES it can happen here!

    • JeffH

      Kate8, to think that the “benevolent” eugenicist Bill and Melinda Gates and their foundation are using the poor and oppresed as guinea pigs under the disguise of “good” vaccines.

      • Kate8

        So true, JeffH.

  • TIME

    Not going to far off here.

    But do you all recall years ago the FDA claimed that SALT was bad for you? How many fo you knew that the report was flawed and the . was off? As in way off, and due to the cost of reprinting they just left it be. As in the AMA the FDA, & the CDC felt it was better to just keep the lie going.

    Think about this; What is it that give you when you go to the the EM after you get hurt and loose blood?
    What do we have in our blood naturaly?

    What are you born in? What did you live in prior to being born that is while still in your Moms belly ~ also known as a womb with a view.

    What aids in your personal electric system in working? AKA; your brain and nervous system

    What aids you when healing from bad cuts, anyone ever try sitting in the warm gulf of Mexico’s waters filled with what was that again?

    What do you clean your sinus’ out with?

    Ok I just figured I would ask questions so Manzier 47 D cup can hold himself together for the rest of the day. Hey no one here really want’s him to split a brain cell, OMG that could harm him.

    • 45caliber

      If he split a brain cell, wouldn’t he then have two of them?

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      Time, Our bodies are comprised of salts, sugars and water.

      • TIME

        Angel,

        Thats the ticket, salt is a key factor in all of us being alive, if we didn’t have it we would all fail to live.
        Sugars are also a part of what makes us work as an energy sourse.
        And as we all know water is something that non of us can live without for more than a few days.

        Foods sure we can go for a while perhaps even a month or two, depending on how much fat we have stored.
        By the way salts aid in that storage.

        • http://! Angel Wannabe

          TIMe, If folks don’t like using refined sugars, WHY NOT use one of natures most perfect food__HONEY!_Don’t wanna use regular Salt, then use sea salt!__I’m not sure what all the hype is with salts and sugars.___ BTW__Quite frankly I was on a diet about 15 years ago and used Nutrasweet, (before I began to read the labels obviously) turns out I was one in several thousand women, who it attacked my reproductive system, and I started to hemmorage from it. The Dr.told to me stop using it right away, within a week it stopped. I made up my mind if I became diabetic I’d do without sweetners period or just use sugar sparingly!

          • Carlucci

            Have you ever put raw honey on a cut or scrape? Heals it up just fine. As good as aloe vera.

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            Yes it does Carlucci!

        • http://! Angel Wannabe

          TIME, I don’t know everything but what I learned essentially, taking care of ourselves, (and I don’t mean running to the doctor everytime you have a hang nail) Medicine is nothing more than a lil’ common sense. YOu do have to think. If you know a Lil’ about what makes our bodies tick, and know herbs & plants and what they do, thats a good start. I try to learn something new everyday. Sometimes its from someone on here, that I haven’t thought of. We need to learn to think for ourselves, its obvious the Government doesn’t have our best interest at heart. Its up to us alone and then share what we know!
          Sorry I’m rambling.

        • DaveH

          Anything taken in excess can be harmful. Like too much Government.

    • Kate8

      TIME – What we want to avoid is sodium chloride, or table salt.

      Whole sea salt, on the other hand, has the same mineral composition as blood! It is used to restore, and maintain, health.

      If you like salt, use whole sea salt to your heart’s content.

      I like the Celtic sea salt. It should be slightly grey in color, and contain moisture.

      • Carlucci

        I love the pink Himalayan Crystal salt. It has all of the minerals and trace elements the body requires. Last summer I was adding it to my spring water to get my adrenal glands back up to normal, after suffering from adrenal fatigue for many, many years. :(

        The cheapest price is available through the Swanson supplement catalog. They have great prices and products. Right now I think they are doing BOGO:

        http://www.swansonvitamins.com/

  • Raggs

    But really… The amish are a testing ground…

    This is a reactionary government not a proactive government.
    This is a test to see the fallout from the citizens…

    If this is allowed to be done in one state it will soon snowball.

    • 45caliber

      And the Amish aren’t really that many so – divide and conquer. They can get a good preceedant to do at they please while at the same time most people will ignore it since “it can’t happen to me … those are just Amish”.

      • Raggs

        Absolutely.. Just like a car accident you see on the road everyone say’s as they pass by that “I’m glad that wasn’t me” so it’s not my problem.

      • DaveH

        That was Profound, 45!
        It is exactly why they can get away with so much. They just keep picking on minorities and most of us turn our gaze away because it doesn’t directly affect us.
        We need to change that behaviou and stick up for each other.

        • TIME

          Dave,
          I will agree with that 100%…………….

          • Kate8

            45, That was very perceptive.

            It’s the same game Hitler played. O is following his playbook to the letter, and laughing at us all the way.

    • karolyn

      Well, have you joined the citizens at least bringing this kind of stuff to the attention of their congressmen?

      • Raggs

        Oh karo.. are you learning something here? I hope so.

        • karolyn

          Raggs – When it comes to natural health issues, I’m all over it and have been for over 10 years.

          • Raggs

            Ok so maybe your not yet in the boat…

            You cannot make butter from water!
            When I grew up we had a cattle farm a few miles from home and we always produced our butter from FRESH cow milk, we drank FRESH milk.
            So if I died from that someone forgot to tell me.

  • http://mitchmathias@att.net mlmbttm1961

    interesting but not very informative i am all for homeopathic remedies and vis-a-vis raw milk if you want it buy a cow not illegal to have just to sell i know in eastern ohio where i grew up some amish just put out eggs and then you left money as you were able or not no selling

  • karolyn

    Everone who has posted here if they aren’t already, should sign up with ANH-USA (Alliance for Natural Health) http://www.anh-usa.org/ and support their efforts. It’s the least we can do.

  • http://yahoo Red Horse

    This is where the local sheriffs dept should be arresting these so called agents (storm troopers) and put them in the slammer !
    But alot nof the Sherrifs of this contry havent got the B—- to do this !

  • Karolyn

    This whole discussion has me wanting to get some raw milk. I found a place where I can get it about an hour from here. Anybody interested in finding raw milk can go Real Milk http://www.realmilk.com/where4.html#nc. There’s also a wealth of info at the Weston A. Price Foundation. http://www.westonaprice.org

  • Karolyn

    Well, this is very interesting. I just visited this site that lists showas a map and indicates what the laws are regarding the sale of raw milk, and according to it, retail sale in PA is legal!
    http://www.farmtoconsumer.org/

  • Karolyn

    Oops! Sorry. It was transported into Maryland. The FDA had planted a spy in the group purchasing the milk!

    http://www.farmtoconsumer.org/FDA-Sting-Amish-Dairy-Farmer.htm

    • Raggs

      So now you are seeing the truth and that is a good thing…
      I’m actually starting to like you…

      • karolyn

        Wow! Don’t speak too soon, Raggs. I’m sure we will disagree on something again! :-) (although I really am a likeable person)

  • Raggs

    The biggest thing that I seen on msnbc was that michelle obama did a boogie dance today.

    WOW… I’m really impressed with a show like that? I wonder if she got any splinters?

    • Kate8

      The lack of class coming from this WH is astounding.

  • Lawrence Freeman

    1996, four different doctors told me I have cancer and I was going to die. I doctored myself with herbs, I have been free of cancer sence.

  • Debbie Nuciforo

    He who controls the food and money, controls the people! I believe good ole Henry Kissinger made that statement. Sick man that he was.

    I basically think that this is the most corrupt government body all the way up to the Supreme Court that this country has ever had so desperately against its own people. What we all seem to forget is that there are alot more of us than there are of them! Shouldn’t be too hard if we all stood up for what is right for this country and the rest of the world and booted these monsters in government right into prison cells for crimes against humanity and animals! We need to take this country back and we need to do it now. Another year and I’m afraid it will just be too late.

    God Bless us all!

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