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Message To Obama: You Owe Us!

August 2, 2012 by  


Hello. I’m Wayne Allyn Root for Personal Liberty. My video commentary this week is in response to President Obama’s comments that business owners owe government and others for our success. My message to Obama?

We built it. We don’t owe you a thing. As a matter of fact, you owe us!

President Obama has it completely backward. Business owners don’t owe credit to government for their success. Government owes us credit for its existence. Government doesn’t enable or empower business owners. We empower government.

Business owners would do just fine without government. But government, government employees and the “takers” of society (those who take checks from government) could not survive without us: the creators, producers and taxpayers. Simply put, we pay all the bills for government. We’re the ones you ought to be thanking.

Let me paint a picture even an economic illiterate can understand. Let’s say you own a restaurant. Who needs whom? Do the patrons of your restaurant need you? No, they could choose any one of 1,000 other restaurants in your city. They could stay home and cook for themselves. Heck, they could even choose to not eat; most Americans could use a day off from eating.

But you — the business owner — could not live without customers. You desperately need their patronage. You need to be nice, genuflect and show gratitude. Without customers, you could not stay in business. Every employee of your restaurant is dependent on customers. Even ignorant leftists and socialists can’t intelligently argue with that.

Now let’s extend that “business model” to government. Government is the business. The taxpayers are the customers — just like that restaurant example. Government doesn’t survive if we don’t pay the bills. Government is dependent on us, our hard work, our taxes. If we go on strike and stop paying, government goes out of business.

The only difference is that in a free market capitalist society, the customer freely chooses to spend his or her money at the business of their choice. But in the case of government, the customer is limited to only one choice. If government can’t pay the bills, instead of being forced out of business, government just raises taxes and extorts more money (legally, of course).

So why does Obama think we owe him? Sure, we need the things that help our society and economy grow: infrastructure (i.e., roads, bridges, traffic lights, police, fire, garbage, sewers, hospitals, airports, schools) and national defense. Although, much of that could be handled by private enterprise. But Obama misses the crucial point: We (business owners and taxpayers) paid for that with our taxes. We built it! You owe us a debt of gratitude.

Without our business taxes, Social Security taxes, payroll taxes, workers’ compensation taxes, sales taxes, property taxes, income taxes and estate taxes (we even pay you after we’re dead), there would be no money for all those things that Obama values. Why would we thank you for things we paid for? When the customer walks out of the restaurant, or hardware store, or toy store, who thanks whom? The business owner thanks us for spending our money in his establishment.

Instead of telling us how much we owe government, the progressive leftists and socialists should be thanking us. Without taxpayers (especially high-income business owners), you wouldn’t be able to build roads, bridges, highways, schools or airports. Your infrastructure exists because of our hard work. Your schools exist because of rich business owners who pay huge property tax bills. Your Social Security, Medicare, welfare, food stamps and unemployment insurance exist because of business owners paying into the system.

Yes, President Obama, it all exists because business owners do, in fact, work harder and smarter. And you had better thank God we do it, or you’d be up the proverbial creek without a paddle. We’re not dependent on government. Mr. Obama, every government program, every government employee and every handout addict depend on us. If we don’t write the checks, you don’t get paid. Or do you think money grows on trees?


Like any smart small business owner, government should be treating its customers with honor, respect and gratitude. Mr. Obama, you need to learn to say “please” when you ask for our money and “thank you” after we pay. Learn how to treat customers well — or they will go away.

Ah, there’s the problem. You believe we can’t go away. But it’s happening right now, before your eyes. In response to the way you have treated customers (i.e., taxpayers and business owners), they are, in fact, leaving. American business is on strike. That’s why there are no new jobs, and there won’t be until after Nov. 6. The customers are on strike.

Many are scaling back. Some are going underground rather than work all day like slaves to pay 60 percent of our earnings to you. Some are retiring — or at least thinking about it seriously. A poll only days ago reported that 83 percent of doctors are considering retiring because of Obamacare. So you see, Mr. Obama, the idea of citizens being slaves to you doesn’t work out so well.

And then there’s the big one: Americans are leaving for places that treat customers better. Even Obama’s rich, elite, leftist crowd is refusing to pay the higher taxes he wants. One of the co-founders of Facebook renounced his citizenship and left for Singapore — where the income taxes are more tolerable at 20 percent or less and the capital gains taxes are zero. Even though he’s a latte-drinking, tree-hugging San Francisco Bay area liberal, he left America rather than pay Obama’s future oppressive taxes.

Denise Rich could be one of the top five Democratic contributors in America over the past 20 years. She is best friends with the Clintons. Yet she renounced her citizenship just days ago. She, too, refuses to pay the massive Obama taxes on the way.

So far it’s a trickle of ultra rich who are leaving. Soon, if Obama is re-elected, it will become a torrent. I personally know hundreds of business owners exploring their options right now, many ready to leave the moment Obama is re-elected. This is called running a business without any customers. The taxpayers are unhappy. The only ones left will be Obama’s voters: the takers. But there won’t be anyone left to take from.

And when that happens, Obama will learn an important business lesson: bankruptcy.

I’m Wayne Allyn Root for See you next week, same time, same place. God Bless.

–Wayne Allyn Root

Wayne Allyn Root

Wayne Allyn Root is one of America's leading Libertarian-conservative authors. Wayne's new book is The Murder of the Middle Class Wayne is a Capitalist Evangelist, serial entrepreneur, conservative media commentator, and proud champion of the middle class. He is a former Libertarian vice presidential nominee and Fox News regular. Follow Wayne on Twitter and visit Wayne's web site:

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  • DaveH

    Thank you for the Transcript, Wayne. I can read faster than most people can talk. Plus, referring back to a particular sentence is easier when it is written text.

    • Richard Pawley

      I wish this message could be read by all the dunderheads in the United States, especially those in the United States Congress. One of our founding fathers said it best and I quoted this even before the table of contents in my last book:

      “Society is produced by our wants, and government by wickedness; the former promotes our happiness positively by uniting our affections, the latter negatively by restraining our vices. The one encourages intercourse, the other creates distinctions. The first is a patron, the second a punisher. Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in the best state is but a necessary evil.”
      – Thomas Paine
      COMMON SENSE, 1776

      • Dan Harrell

        In 1957, Ayn Rand predicted Barak Obama. It’s a multi-million book seller. Buy it, read it, and find your own Galt’s Gulch, and do it quickly.

    • SamFox

      Wayne, you said “And when that happens, Obama will learn an important business lesson: bankruptcy.” That is true. True because bankrupting the USA is the GOAL of the collapse the system agenda. Cloward and Pivon wrote a book outlining how to do just that!

      Here is a response to a blog about averting a govt shutdown @ Yahoo News. It fits here very well–

      What the article is saying between the lines is that R’s & D’s have agreed to raise the debt ceiling. Voters didn’t get a chance to input this time, as far as I know.

      Raising the Debt Ceiling is something that needs to stop!

      Raising the DC means more deficit spending & then AGAIN, borrowing to cover the shortfall. The shortfall comes because fed govt spends more than it takes in. No crisis was averted, it was postponed, AGAIN. We are over 15 TRILL. in debt, & that doesn’t count unfunded liabilities. For a real shock, look up what our national debt really is! Be sitting down….

      If the DC were not raised there would be some financial pain, but nothing like what’s coming if we DON”T stop raising it. There would not be a total govt shut down. Govt would have to live by what it takes in. Cuts would have to be made, painful yes. But small potatoes compared to the wipe out of the USA that IS coming if we let business in DC go on as ‘usual’.

      WHY is the WH & Congress sinking US further into debt? Read about the collapse the system agenda in a book by Cloward & Pivon. Rules For Radicals goes along with it.

      The crisis that is coming is designed to totally collapse the US economy. Then the US can be transformed to a socialist/Marxist/communist/fascist form of govt where the govt centrally plans the economy & eventually the life of every citizen. Also our huge debt will be used as leverage to force US into vassal state status in the New World Order’s one world govt.

      This is why the RNC & it’s fellow CINO-RINO members & ‘progressive’ Dems & liberals work to collapse the US. This is also why the RNC, RINO-CINOs, progs, fringe media & every one who wants the US to fall tried to bury Ron Paul.

      Ron Paul is the only major candidate who is against the collapse of the US. He is the ONLY one who would take US back to the Constitution, the Bill of Rights & Founder’s intent & restrain the fed govt under Constitutional parameters.

      If you want to jump on the ‘bash Ron Paul’ bandwagon, you do so in concert with big brother & those who seek to destroy the USA as it was intended. If the one worlders have their way, we will have no Constitution, Bill of Rights or real freedom & liberty for anyone.

      Before getting on Ron’s case, PLEASE! do deep research. Look at what Ron himself says, how he has voted…don’t be fooled by NWO fringe media, Dems, RINO-CINO RNC or ‘progressives’.

      For more on what the prog movement really is, look up at YouTube,

      GB Shaw progressive

      Margaret Sanger progressive

      Hillary Clinton modern progressive

      Go to YT, then copy & paste the above 3 phrases in their search box.

      Unless you love Hitler, you won’t like these folks.


      • tlgeer

        “Voters didn’t get a chance to input this time, as far as I know. Raising the Debt Ceiling is something that needs to stop!”

        It is evident that you do not know what the debt ceiling is. Let me explain.

        When Congress approves a bill, and it is signed by the President, it becomes a legal contract that the US must abide by. It does not matter which Congress approves the bill, it has to be legally honored by ALL the Congresses. When funds are used for that bill, we (the US) are legally obligated to pay those funds. Our ff gave Congress the extraordinary power to raise money to pay those bills. The raising the debt ceiling is to issue bonds to pay those legally obligated bills.

        According to the SCOTUS, Congress does not have the right to NOT pay those bills.

        The GOP are threatening to NOT pay those bills (raise the debt ceiling) if the Democrats and the President do not give in to their demands. That is called blackmail, and it is also illegal.

        The time to reduce our bills is not AFTER they have already been run up. The time to reduce our bills is in the budget. Not after. If you do it after, you are doing it illegally because Congress already agreed, legally, to pay them.

        Do you have any questions about this process?

        • macgyver1948

          tigeer … Raising the debt ceiling might have to go but it has been done so many times for so many decades. It just seems lately to be used as a tool to scare us into thinking our Reps are working for us with their “pulling it out at the last second before mid night” each time. We also lost our AAA rating as a country (that something will hurt us more than we now now) and I think the “tool” has some degree of blame. It always felt like the government was holding us hostage with their shut down threats. I would say we should suspend their salaries and benefits for as long as they might follow though on that but many of them are so wealthy they might not care while they fiddle as they watch us burn from their behind-doors “sessions”.

      • DaveH

        Debt is one thing, Tigeer, spending is another. No Congress can tie the hands of succeeding Congresses. Congress can at any time stop the spending programs. They just need to have the will.

      • DaveH
      • SamFox

        tigeer, I didn’t define the process. And I said nothing about NOT paying our bills, which we in reality cannot afford to do now anyway, no matter how you or I feel about it, what ever the ‘process’ is.

        I was concentrating on the ‘bankrupt’ part & saying we must stop the deficit spending & ponzi borrowing to cover the shortfall. We borrow to pay the interest on the debt! How smart is that? Could YOU run your household finances the way the fed govt runs what they are respon$ible for?

        The other comments to this point are right on. They get it. I hope you soon also understand how dire the financial mess we are in actually is. We HAVE to cut spending or we die as a nation. There is NO ALTERNATIVE!!!



      • SamFox

        Again for tigeer. I forgot to ask. What do ya think of the stuff I suggested you look up at YouTube about the progs Margaret Sanger, GB Shaw & Hillary? The progs are scary to the max1 Eugenics, govt control of our personal lives …the whole 9 enchiladas of totalitarian govt.

        Thought I’d ask since ya skipped that part. :-)


      • SiliconDoc

        I’ve got to say Sam, long before a friend of mine gave me this site, I was learning and reading about the libleft’s agenda, and some of their ardent activists told me over and over again that I had it incorrect, and that true communism would follow the collapse of capitalism.
        So if barky and his minions are up to collapsing capitalism, it wouldn’t surprise me one bit, as they no doubt deep down inside, deem that a wonderful, wonderful thing.

    • TN4th

      To be fair, I believe what Obama said was that while each of us succeeds or failed based on effort (or lack thereof), we also succeed because of the opportunities and resources provided to us by our community, our country, and our fellow taxpayers. When I came up through public schools (paid for by my community’s taxpayers), I had access to an education that my low-income parents could not have afforded on their own. I got to school on a school bus. It drove on public roads. I worked hard, and was able to earn a scholarship to college. But that scholarship, and consequently my college education, was paid for by yet other taxpayers. When I started my business, it was protected laws about fair trading and contracts, enforced by people who were on the public payroll. My electricity goes on because of TVA, a huge taxpayer funded project, and is delivered by yet another public utility. My water arrives clean and plentifully, from a public utility. So yes, our own effort is important, but it would be an act of blind hubris to believe that our effort alone got us there, and it would be an act of extreme narcissism to think that we don’t owe back, or need to “pay forward” to provide resources and opportunities to our fellow Americans, so that we can continually renew our creativity and productivity.

      • macgyver1948

        Tn4th… Thank you so much for your voice of reason. Obama didn’t say what we are hearing here from those who only want to hate him, like Root and Wood with their distortions.

        I have done pretty well over the years but I would not have been able to afford college and grad school if I weren’t in the Air Force. Not totally true, when I worked for a university one of the perks included education but I couldn’t afford to take grad classes if it weren’t for “someone else”.

        I have posted the link on here several times for Obama’s speech so any who wanted the truth could both hear and read Obama’s words. My guess only those who wanted the truth, instead of what Root and Wood wants them to believe, went to that site or any others.

        “It takes a village to raise a child” has so many meanings on so many levels. I wonder how many “employees” who were promoted at times in their career feel they could have been promoted if their superiors didn’t ‘want’ to promote them. I knew many more deserving of promotions who were denied. The superiors might feel they want you closer to them but you can’t get there strictly on your own efforts. And all the successful projects I managed in my life would have been failures if it weren’t for my teams and my teachers before them. Donald Trump would be lying if he ever says he is where he is all because of only his own efforts. He couldn’t even say “you’re Fired” if it weren’t for the guy he was firing, LOL.

      • macgyver1948

        TN4th. I said to you “I have posted the link on here several times for Obama’s speech so any who wanted the truth could both hear and read Obama’s words”.

        I should clarify something in that because I do not mean to imply the ‘only truth’ but instead to attempt to see what might be the truth. Only those who are concerned with truth will explore for it. Those who aren’t concerned with truth will just take what they are fed.

        • truesoy


          …and the irony here is that Mitt Romney had said basically the same thing sometiime some weeks before Obama, yet no republican made an issue.
          (I saw it on one of Romneys campaign stops, and again saw the clip, I believe on MSNBC).


          • macgyver1948

            tuessoy…. Hate generally comes with specific GPS directions so there would be no need for the TP/GOP to say something against MItt. It does prove the point(s)…

      • SiliconDoc

        You mean macguy, thanks so little for the voice of CRAP.
        Every item outlined is the poor beggars whine, that without it, helplessness and incapability was at the door…

        Even if it didn’t in the form of tax dollars stolen by force and redistributed, IT WOULD IN OTHER FORMS, and your crybaby butts would be given a DIRECT HAND UP, without the government bureaucratic masters in the way, sucking half the booty for themselves and their rich associates.

        GET A CLUE.

        The man in the video has it correct, the thanks is owed TO THE BUSINESSES and associated TAXPAYERS, not the other way around…. but you god for saken fools HATE the big businesses and big time taxpayers…


  • FreedomFighter

    “So far it’s a trickle of ultra rich who are leaving. Soon, if Obama is re-elected, it will become a torrent”

    These are the same people that pay the lions share of taxes. Can you say “systemic failure”?

    IMHO Obama wants a failure of the system, then he takes control with martial law and becomes the dictator, and he can finally rid himself of that pesky constitution and congress.

    Laus Deo
    Semper Fi

    • Mike

      If the economy collapses and he declares martial law, he will most likely be fighting both sides. Those that take and those that no longer are willing to give.

      • John the Libertarian

        Mike- you mean those who are no longer willing to be coerced…

      • Randy131

        Mike, if Obama is re-elected, you’ll find out first hand who will be fighting who, and I’m telling you now when Martial Law is instituted by Obama, there will be many fogeign troops on USA soil to protect him and Congress, for most of American’s in the military will refuse to fire on citizens (their fathers, mothers, brothers, sisters, and friends), just as is going on in Syria with all the Army defections. It’s coming, you bettter be prepared.

        • macgyver1948

          Randy132… Although I will always hope you are wrong with “…when Martial Law is instituted…” I will also hope you are right about our troops refusing orders to fire on us. We do know of the madness in the Nazi military where the troops were more afraid of their superiors than God, for example, to disobey their superiors. I also think/hope if troops from overseas come here our troops will fight them on our soil along with us.

          Our Government belongs to us, “We The People”, so in the case of foreign troops coming here, at our governments request, the Government would become the domestic enemy and we would have the legal right to take it back. The Founding Fathers said something to that affect. Let’s just hope it doesn’t come to that.

        • truesoy


          …and have not you heard of the special forces from Mars that have secretly landed to protect the president in any event.
          Boy, it is all a secret, so don’t tell anyone else because this is only for you and I to know, and the little green guys too. By the way, I hear they are some really badass troops, and I wouldn’t mess with them.
          Well, I didn’t mean to scare you, just to let you know.
          Bye, for now.


        • truesoy


          ….and in other words, if Obama is re-elected, and he will, you’ll refused to accept the wish of the electorate, right?OHHHH, I love your love for democracy, and your patriotism and your respect for the Constitution.


    • tlgeer

      A failure of the system will most definitely happen if we fail to raise our income to a functioning level. IOW, taxes have to go up in order to pay the bills. Bills that Congress authorized. Once those bills are authorized, Congress CANNOT legally NOT pay those bills. That was a SCOTUS ruling, and it hasn’t been changed. Right now, taxes are at the lowest that they’ve been in 100 years. In what way do you believe that lowering them even more will HELP our financial situation?

      It is, also, the reason why our credit rating was lowered last summer. Because the GOP even, at the very least, hinted that our debt ceiling (which is to pay the debts that Congress ALREADY approved, and that we ALREADY owe) was not going to be raised. Legally this country does not have the right to default on our bills. At all.

      • Vicki

        I have an idea. Lets eat the rich.

        And as Bill says. Now what?

      • DaveH

        You know, Tigeer, even if you have no morality and advocate for stealing other peoples’ money, in the long run by doing so you will destroy our prosperity by depleting the system of Capital used to buy plants and equipment. The rich and even the not so rich are much more inclined to invest their financial resources in capital equipment and plants than are the Government or the poor who just consume them. The Capital Equipment and Plants are what makes it possible to have the high standards of living that we still have. And don’t kid yourself, that can go away quickly if we start succumbing to the Progressive Siren Song.
        Even if you can’t understand logic, surely you can understand experience? The experience is that the Bigger the Government is, the Smaller their Economy is. Read this Free Report:

        • truesoy


          Do you know that other people’s money (taxes) have:

          a) paid for your education
          b) paid for the research and development of many of the life’s saving medicines/drugs you or a member of your family has depended on and benefit from it.
          c) paid for the development / advancement of new medical procedures
          d) paid for the military to protect your interest and the interest of those 1oo times better off financially than you.
          e) paid for the police services you want
          f) paid for the Fire Dept. in case of fire, and for the fire rescue service in case of a medical emergency.
          g) paid for the Coast Guard to protect and save lives on the seas (even if you don’t have a boat, you pay) (they also do drug interdiction.
          h) Paid for you education so you would know how to write nonsenses on this blog (even people with no children paid taxes to educate you)
          i) etc, etc, etc……..


      • eddie47d

        Although Dave H can be financially savvy you can be assured he will deny everything on that list and many more items that are not on that list.

        • macgyver1948

          eddie47d… If Romney is elected his new GWBush induced tax plan, which lowers the wealthy’s tax burden again, will be paid for by raising middle class taxes. The GOP knows how to change the names of their stuff when they want to reuse it. Just as ObamaCare was blamed for fining people who do not have insurance until they get it. That too was a Romney thing when he was governor and it was not something Obama wanted in ObamaCare. With Romney we will get BAINed.

      • DaveH

        Truesoy says — “Do you know that other people’s money (taxes) have:
        a) paid for your education
        b) yada, yada, yada.

        What I know, Truesoy, is that I did not solicit those gifts, and that I did pay for them — about 4 times as much as the average taxpayer.
        You see how it works, Folks? The Liberals/Progressives take somebody else’s unwilling money to give you a gift you did not solicit, and then they use that unsolicited gift in an effort to guilt you into going along with their program.
        Truesoy, so am I to gather that you would take an unsuspecting woman to dinner with your Dad’s money, and then afterward reveal to her that she owes you sex?
        You Progressives are a joke, a bad joke.

        • truesoy


          OK, I’ll buy that that you did solicit those ‘gifts’, but then why did you accepted it, for it doesn’t matter how much you claimed to have paid, ti was not near enough to cover the cost of your education.
          And if you did not want it, then why do you accept medicines and medical procedures that came about for as you say ‘stealing’ other people’s money. You shoud have rejected it based on your ‘unshakable principals’.
          ….and I could go on, but I think you get the pictue, don’t you? (although I doubt your mind reaches that far)


      • SamFox

        truesoy, the biggest problem ‘progressive’ socialism has is running out of other people’s $$. Now that we are in bankruptcy [they just have yet to make it official] what is the govt gonna spend?

        Even if we took all the assets of those 0 wants to tax, we’d not make much of a dent in the nat debt, even without counting unfunded liabilities as part of the whole sum of what we owe.

        Don’t forget, the fed govt has over reached their LEGAL power many times over. Where in the Constitution does it give the fed govt ability to regulate most of what they seek to control? Where does the Const. say the govt needs to regulate education? What in the document authorizes the EPA, housing, giving out food stamps? That the POTUS can declare war all by himself? [List is much longer.]

        Just askin…:-)


        • macgyver1948

          Samfox, you said to truesoy, “the biggest problem ‘progressive’ socialism has is running out of other people’s $$. Now that we are in bankruptcy”.

          Jumping the gun a bit there are you? Or are you hoping we do go broke. You really should remember it wasn’t Obama who is the biggest spender since President Eisenhower, that dubious honor goes to Reagan and Bush in that order and Obama is the lowest spender since Ike. If you believe otherwise maybe it is because you were lied to and you choose to believe that lie too about Obama.

          So many people live from pay day to pay day because they do not earn enough to do any better, they are a month or so away from homelessness but most hold their own.

          We should also remember the spending levels have been raised for so many decades, perhaps over 100 times. Now we had our national credit rating drop from AAA and that takes longer than the 4 years Obama has almost had office for it to get that way. We are in a world off trouble because of that national credit rating drop as well as other things that are older than Obama’s admin.

          To borrow one of your tactics, “where in the Constitution” does it say to give Corporations “people rights”? In that and all the power corporate money has taken over our “Representatives” with it has for so long been one of the biggest causes for the situation our country is now in. And the corporate secrecy in “collusion” with government secrecy is killing us, IE, the betrayal of us by the SCOTUS with their support for groups like Citizens United – all for the benefit and protections of the Corporations’ need and wants over ours.

          There are other reasons for the fiscal shape our country is in but the notion that “Corporations are people” has been killing us about the most for a very long time. The Founders warned us of this.

          “I hope we shall crush in its birth the aristocracy of our monied corporations which dare already to challenge our government to a trial by strength, and bid defiance to the laws of our country.” – Thomas Jefferson

          Think about it and also start thinking for yourself. Stop blaming others just because they are not Republicans and let’s all do this together for the sake of our country. The real enemy is Corporate thinking and their self serving desires and their hold on our “Representatives”. Thomas Jefferson, and others back then, spoke often of their fear for corporations and their big money influence on the Government. We need to learn from them on that too.

          • truesoy


            …and without the intent to offend anyone, I will also add the church, for the church is also a corporation, and a most influential one because of its financial resources that coupled with its undue influence/control over their captive audience can tilt the balance of power one way or another in the political arena.


          • macgyver1948

            tuesoy… I kind of like the idea of the religions in our country but with out any of their influence on those who aren’t of their “church”. They should never be able to influence our government and if they do they, those who do, should lose their tax exempt status. The churches influencing Government was feared on by the Founders so the put “Freedom Of Religion” in the Constitution for our individual protection. They talked about putting “Separation Of Church and State” in but maybe they felt that too should be left up to the states, as they did with “Separation OF Corporation And State”.

            The Founders were mostly Christian but some were of different churches/beliefs and they knew the dangers. I just wonder if they were looking down at us today if they are regretting not putting both the two mentioned “Separations” into the constitution because without them there are so many problems today. I say that even though I want God back in school and Government but with no mention of any singular ways of worshiping, just silent prayer so all can pray to God as they believe they should. It is not working as it is without both the “Separations” in the constitution. Hopefully they would.

      • SamFox

        TO macgyver1948tireer. Had to find the nearest ‘reply’ thingy.

        DEAR MODS,
        No offense, I thank you for this forum. But if you could please, is there any way to do the reply thing different? So that we can reply & have it stay in a ‘run’ of comments & replies that stay in order. Thank you.

        mac’48, Is ’48 your birth year? It’s mine. Just curious. “Will you still need me, will you still please me, when I’m 64?” :-)

        Please note that I do not mean this as an attack. Just clarifying.

        Any way, 0 has spent more per year in office than GWB. It took GW 8 years to add 4-5+ trill., which is horrendous. I posted against GW before, he is a RINO-CINO, like John McManchurian, Mitt & many in Congress in both ‘parties’.

        0 in less than 4 years has added 5 trill+ as well. 0′s ‘+’ is a bit larger than GW’s but I’ll not quibble. Both suck. Also I have not included how much MORE 0 has added since HIS 5+trill or the Unfunded Liabilities of each. I betcha if ya looked 0 is far ahead of GW in the spending dept. & that 0′s ULs are much higher.

        So, we see that 0 is on track to add a total of around 11+ trill if he gets back in. Who’d ya say the biggest spender is again??? Does it matter who the worst is? WE are the ones paying…Let’s investigate Ron Paul, deeply. Ron WOULD turn this around.

        I stick by bankruptcy. Have you counted unfunded liabilities? How in the heck is it possible to pay just the
        $15,938,388,???,??? debt deficit

        we owe NOW? I changed the last few 0′s to ? marks as the debt clock is running too fast there to put up the numbers.

        I got my figures from

        At an article from 2010 puts the debt over 25 TIRILL by ’25. I imagine they have raised that projection since then.

        Go to CBS News’ site & look up

        National Debt Has Increased More Under Obama Than Bush

        I do agree that much is Bush’s fault. He does deserve blame for what he started. Problem is, 0 is doing the same things. Where has 0 corrected ANY of GW’s overspending habits? Mr. 0 has not changed the fact the govt now spends & borrows more than when GW was in. What many fail to see is that GW was bad, but 0 is just as bad, & I think even worse.

        I agree that giving corps people rights is UN-Constitutional & WRONG!! I have never said other wise.

        Jefferson was also against a central bank, like the privately owned ‘Fed’. We B on same page there about Jeff & corps.

        I am not happy with either Dems or Repubs. I like Ron Paul, though he is an R. But he had to be to get any where. The rules are slanted so that for any 3rd party it’s almost impossible to gain traction. Ron was 1st a Libertarian, but had to change to get any where.

        I’ll be flipping off the R half of the ‘progressive’ ‘party’ after I vote for or write in Ron Paul. They both suck!!! Almost as bad as the Dem ‘progressives’. Collapsing the system as out lined by Cloward & Pivon has been going since the ‘Fed’ came in. It’s a LOTTA prezes & Congresses at fault. It just got much worse under GW & 0.


        • macgyver1948

          SamFox… I appreciate the good nature and none of the childishness with the name calling. Yes, the “1948” is my birth year, I was born in march of that year.

          We can get conflicting figures depending from whom we get them. And you are right, it shouldn’t matter so much who spends because, as you say, it is We The People who have to pay.

          I have certain problems with Ron Paul and the Libertarian Party in general. I am not good with Paul’s foreign policies and his feeling, and his son’s, on Social Security and others needed programs we might need when we retire. I am not so happy for The Libertarian Party for supporting David Koch (Koch was the Libertarian Party’s vice-presidential candidate in the 1980 presidential election), of the Koch family industries, for his Vice Presidential bid. How could they call themselves Libertarians and not know the Koch family history? I just do not trust them either.

          You say “How in the heck is it possible to pay just the $15,938,388,???,??? debt deficit we owe NOW?”. Do you mean that as part of the Bush uncured war debt? I really do not know, I never had a budget/ expense quite that hih, lol.. I was a Project and business analyst and my budgets for large corporations were controllable by me. This government mishandling is way beyond my knowledge and training. We have to get people in there how can figure out what is best for us and we have to stop that “primarily for the benefit and protection of the big corporations” practice by our “representatives”. The do work for us but it doesn’t so often seem that way.

          So much for so many years what led us to where we are economically has been the huge corporate influence on the Government (along with other smaller reasons), for their benefit. The founders warned us about Corporations so it much be the “give me your money” attitude the politicians have when it comes to selling their influence. We need to get secrecy of this influence peddling (very much reverse what the SCOTUS did in favor of the corporations with Citizen’s United, a body of big money for big money) out and we need to outlaw one sided governing, such as with all the corporate influence. We need to remember what the founders said about those corporate dangers. I bet the Founders and TEA of today and Romney’s vision of the type of businessman we need in the Oval Office would cause great conflict between them.

          I am not crazy about Obama but he has helped so many of the Middle class and that is not liked by the TEA owned GOP. But I see Obama as the best choice we have. I see the need to shrink Big Government but I do not want our government to turn into the Corporate Government. That would kill us and I see Romney as the corporate puppet in there to do that for them, after all, he is so much of them and not of us.

          It so much is as you say “It’s a LOTTA prezes & Congresses at fault. It just got much worse under GW & 0.” Our current and future, if not dealt with correctly, economic situation has been in the making for so many decades. I believe not a lot happens in our country without Congress and other Government design. That too has to stop since we (still) own the Government.

          I believe the answer lies in total Government Reform and that is totally up to us but it has to be done before it is to late.

          I know what you mean about this site and how it is programmed to not have it so easy for us to respond but I do not believe it was done intentionally. Programs have to reflect their design and if it wasn’t in the design, all the details, it is not generally not in the program. Maybe how it is here, technically, is how it was “asked” for. That is how it generally works. We just have to do the best we can here or go some place else.

      • Steve

        Nope,sorry, credit rating was lowered because debt is out stripping income!

        • macgyver1948

          Very true… “Assigned” ratings are assigned by how the ability to re-pay is perceived. That is how it is for us and Governments. We lost it…

      • Butch

        tigeer is an idiot. how do we get out of debt? First, stop spending. We can start w/ the unneeded , unwinnable and unwanted wars. then stop giving “aid” to other countries. Also, write off the “debt” to these central banks, they STOLE that money WITHOUT the consent of the people. the only way this can happen is if we KEEP our guns. Thats why Billary Clinton is trying to sell out the US to the UN to make us easier to control. Even Ron Paul said he would forgive teh debt that we “owe” the Federal Reserve. Those demonic POS thieves and liars stole our gold from Ft. Knox and have been responsible for virtually every war fought in the 20th century. tigeer is eager for us to pay the plunderers of our once great nation. i say pay them with lead.

      • SiliconDoc

        You’re a lying lunatic tlgeer, claiming that our rating was lowered because republicans hinted about not raising the debt ceiling.
        If you people weren’t both so stupid, and such pathetic lying idiots, the USA would be in a lot better shape.
        I can’t believe you’re that stupid, but you are – you said it, as stupid as it gets, that’s you.

      • SamFox

        tigeer, if you think the fed govt will suddenly get real & honest & be responsible with the $$ from tax increases & won’t waste the new income on excess spending, I have some bridges I can let you have cheap. One is in Brooklyn, the other is the Golden Gate. I may even be able to get ya the arch & the bridge in Missouri. :-)

        Higher, MUCH higher taxes are coming! Thanks to 0socialist Care. Or is it 0communist…no, maybe it’s 0fascist Care. Nope…must be 0marxist Care…oh well, what ever it is, that SCOTUS swing vote came from hell. There is no way that 0bama Care is really legal under the Constitution.

        If you think that new revenue will suddenly get Congress & the WH to actually be wise with it…God help the USA!!


    • The Christian American

      Since the beginning of time three class societies have only existed until they become two class, Lords and Serfs. Either the serfs learn to become middle class squeezing out Lords or the Lords trample on the middle class until they become serfs.

      • truesoy

        The Christian American;

        A ‘serf” . I know what that is, that is what conservatives strive for, and want everyone else to become one too.
        That is a conservative in the making because they bow to anyone’s richness for that is the proof of their ‘holy wisdom’.


      • DaveH

        It must take some major rationality to convince yourself, Truesoy, that you have a right to steal other peoples’ money using Big Government as your Bully Boys.
        Ditch the green-eyed monster, he will bite you in the butt some day.
        No good can come from lusting after other peoples’ legally earned money.

    • Ed

      Just trying to reply to the misguided truesoy. No, Obama won’t be re-elected. The sheeple aren’t that stupid collectively, although some are, so your point is moot.

      • truesoy


        The sheeple aren’t that stupid collectively….
        Have you looked at yourself in the mirror, lately?


      • DaveH

        Looks like Obama is going to need to kill another “terrorist” to get his ratings back up:

      • SamFox

        Ed, it’s not always the sheep. Now days there is a lot of black box vote fraud. Look up

        Black Box Vote Fraud

        We need to scrap the electronic vote counters & go back to hand counting the ballots.

        Also look for articles on

        Vote Fraud by Devvy Kidd.

        She blogs a lot from

        Vote fraud is a very serious issue. We need to know about it. People can just copy & past the 2 phrases in a web search.

        WARNING!! Finding out just how widespread vote fraud is may really P ya off! And that’s not counting all the fraud in registering voters [Think ACORN & other leftist groups] who are dead & so on.


        • http://incerely, truesoy


          I’ll tellyou somethingthat is probably too difficult for you to comprehend;es, but here I go anyway:
          You live in a ‘liberal world’, and ironically you fight for conservative causes while enjoying the fruits of liberalism. And that is what’s wrong with conservatives; not because they don’t know, but worse yet. Because it is that they, conservatives, don’t know that they don’t know; hence the difficulty in having an intelligent dialogue with you, or the likes of you.


        • macgyver1948

          SamFox…Black Box Vote Fraud can happen only when unscrupulous, dishonorable, and criminal minded foxes are in charge of the hen house. The Diebold Voting Machines are a good example of this as well. When you want the voting results to turn out a certain way call those foxes. :-). The system that is used isn’t the problem when you have these foxes running around.

    • Winddrinker

      After he becomes dictator,
      the illegal foreigner can then start drilling for oil, gas, and restart the coal industry…he has been saving all those for himself! That would be a tidy bit of income, selling our natural resources out of country and poclketing the money.

    • Christin


      I Absolutely agree with you both.

      I ask: If obama wins the elction in Nov. (by voter fraud and corruption) and he kills what is good left in America… what is he a dictator of???

      America will be a mess of needy people and failed gov run businesses and gov policies, collapsed economically and people without basic needs (food, electricity medical and jobs) and none (except the few Elites on top) will be happy… it will be worst that a third world country… who wants to be king of that?

      • macgyver1948

        Christin… You are so right, who would want to be “king” of a collapsed society as you describe. Obama surly doesn’t and he is not wanting that.

        You said “ If obama wins the elction in Nov. (by voter fraud and corruption)”. Well it isn’t usually or recently the Dems who are guilty or assumed to be of “ (by voter fraud and corruption)”.

        Where the is smoke there is usually some fire. During the First GW Bush run for president there were accusations of hiding something with Hanging Chads” on the part of the Florida GOP. The recount wasn’t allowed to go to the end. Who was Governor of Florida during that time? :-))). Then there was the accusations of voting machines being preprogrammed to give the GOP candidate more votes than he deserved, Diebold voting machines anyone?

        Oh, and let’s not forget the fact that Al Gore beat GW bushy in the Popular vote (Gore had more votes) but lost the election, what most of those who voted wanted, to The Electoral College. Who ordered that loss?

        Start doing your own thinking and find out for yourself.

      • truesoy


        Wrong, Christin. Obama is going to win the election because we the people want him to.
        And, no Christin, he is not destroying ‘your’ country, unlike the last guy that just about destroyed it.
        If anything, Obama saved us from total collapse.
        He saved our country’s economy. And he is our best choice for president.


        • macgyver1948

          truesoy… We can only hope Romney loses but there is always the Electoral College to steal the election from the majority of voters and hanging chads and rigged voting machines and who knows what else to force Obama to lose as with Bush and Gore. We The People were cheated then and we lost big time with Bushisms because of that “theft”.

          • truesoy


            I hear you but, be advised the republicans have unveiled their ‘new’ version of the ‘hanging chad’ , it is called ‘voters registration expungement and it is normally done in minority areas, and/or heavely democratic areas.
            This is democracy Republican Style!.
            ….but they are still gonna lose!.


          • macgyver1948

            tuesoy…Yep, I know about the “ ‘new’ version of the ‘hanging chad’, it is called ‘voters registration expungement “. It very much is a GOP thing. I am not sure why the GOP doesn’t like fairness in elections but they prove they won’t take the chance of losing.  I wish we could have prove the hanging chad thing and the pre-preprogrammed Diebold voting machines were all the way to the GOP top but we can’t. Diebold took all the hit on that one pretty much. Again it is nice to have your brother as Governor so you can have needed recounts terminated before they are finished. So much for the people choosing their leaders – Go Electoral College, please ‘get gone’ too. I wonder who the EC works for.

      • SiliconDoc

        Sounds like obama the dope will be the king again of Chicago’s southside, only then, it will be pretty much the entire USA.

        As barky the two time foreigner traitor looks down upon his destroyed southsided nation from the teleprompter for some ad lib, he’ll blame his notional greedy republicans who worship money and the old boy racist agenda, and of course, BUSH.

        Yep, looks very plausible, probable even.

        • William Wiley Bolton

          Who do you think paid for those roads and rails? I don’t care what the traitor says or who get’s the blame as I believe he should be taken now in handcuffs and prosecuted as a fraud and traitor. Has everyone searched Choom gang, Obama?

          • truesoy

            William W B;

            I think somebody is off his/her medication.
            You should go and take it right now, before the nurse gets mad at you.


          • William Wiley Bolton

            Typical Demoncrap, slander the one that mentions the truth. You are probably a self medicating person like the prez.

      • SamFox

        Christin, that’s the plan. Collapse the system. It’s not the initial mess they are worried about. It’s that the govt will use the collapse to ‘re-boot’ the USA into a vassal state of the New World Order.

        As long as the handlers of the Bushes & 0 get Us collapsed, they don’t care what the nation looks like. As long as we are transformable to a totally centralized & planned all controlled BY the govt nation that they can shove underneath a one world govt they’ll be happy as pigs in poop.

        soybeans & a few others here are such out to lunch socialists/communists/ fascist/Marxist it’s very saddening. I guess those Homer Simpsons think big bro govt will give them a pass. Boy!! Do these useful idiots have a wake up call coming if their destroy the USA agenda succeeds.


        • truesoy


          Are you and christin inmates in the same mental institutions, or across the street from each other?


          • William Wiley Bolton

            Too bad you’re not in the military with me in command over you. I smell a rat, not a person looking for the truth. I served many years under both Democrat and Republican administrations and that is why I vote Republican. When you work for them both, you get to know the lesser evil.

          • http://incerely, truesoy


            Apparently you didn’t learn anything while in the military….maybe that’s why you are not in it anymore?


          • SamFox

            truesoy, we are in the same institution. It’s called GET THE USA BACK TO CONSTITUTION!!! NOW!!! institute.

            Going Rules For Radicals & using obfuscation won’t work. We have you mentally challenged progs figured out.

            Facts? You progs don’t need no stinkin facts. We know because you never use true ones.

            I believe in the US Constitution, not the one from Cuba, Venezuela or the old USSR. That I DO understand.

            What YOU don’t under stand is how those that take over a nation & turn it Marxist/communist/Fascist/socialist treat their fellow traveling useful idiot Homer Simpsons
            if they are successful in their over throw. I doubt the new govt will give you a pass…probably be jailed or killed. They know that if you support the govt over throw of your land that you may be a threat to them…especially if you find out you got screwed just like the rest of US. If you cheat on & betray US you will likely cheat on & betray them.

            What we are seeing IS an attempted coup of the USA. 0 put it this way:

            “We are just five days away from the fundamental transformation of the United States of America!”

            What’s the 1st thing that needs to be transformed? The slow fade away from our founding documents & Founder’s intents. Also you fools gotta get rid of Nature’s God. 0 didn’t start the plan. But he is working toward it’s collapse the system goal.

            For more on the plan, read the how to collapse the system book by Cloward & Pivon. I take it you already read Rules For Radicals.


          • http://incerely, truesoy


            What the heck are you talkingabout? you better read the Constitution by yourself for a better understanding and also read up on a little American history, it’ll do you good.


    • Wade Barracato

      Your so right ,more truer words are said in jest.

  • MAP

    This is far too much reality for the leftists/Marxists posting at this site. They will now appear with the ‘doctored’ facts, fabricated by the Liar-in-Chief and his administration of freaks, to prove the entire argument given here is false. After all, they’ll whine, the Obamanation is intent on destroying all existing order, a necessary prelude to utopia.

    Yet, these idiots fail to recognize that it is the taxpayer that pays for their insane ‘hope and change’ delusion and the parasite base they use for support. And many, many of these same taxpayers are becoming hostile at the radical agenda that is being crammed down their throat, against their will, at their own expense. How much longer before these taxpayers revolt? That day rapidly approaches. Those afflicted with the leftist mental disease better tread softly with the knowledge that they are a mere minority. I doubt this country will become another Soviet Union without a fight.

    • MAP

      Some of Obama’s support at our expense:

      These are dark days for America!

      • Bill sharma

        Hello MAP
        I dont know where or what state you live in, I hope it is better then soviet union where there no taxes,no rights , no free press and at best education. If you dont like our system, you are free along with your cronies to move another country. I am tired of your tea party (expletive deleted) about our government. If you dont like to pay taxes move some place else, I was employer and employed 15 people and at one time 40 people and gladly paid my share of the employer based taxes. And it is tyhose taxes that support the Road briges airports hospitals. It is rge same taxes that support your schools universities research and development of new technologies, would like to loose your cell phone, internet your ATM technologies and the people, such labor union,teacher,rtoadworker and lastly all the crooked politiciaN ON BOTH SIDES OF THE AILSES. Then lets not talk about the special interest like the mega farmers in the midwest, cattle farmers who milk the Government by asking for crop insurances. Then you want to talk about President Obama who got there by his hard work and community service, you want to be the president, you would not even last one day. People like you only know how to tear down some one, perhaps you and tea partiers should go and find cactus and embrace it with allof your might and leave people who don’t watch Fox News leave us alone. God Bless this country and alal of the people in this country, that includes you.

      • SamFox

        at Bill sharma, your initials are bs,. Coincidence? :-)

        No one is saying no taxes at all. We ARE saying we are Taxed Enough Already. Most of what fed govt spend $ on is illegal. You need to go the bottom line, not pretend what they are doing is legit.

        Another thing you miss: If the fed govt lived by the Constitution they would not need nearly so much of OUR $$$.

      • SamFox

        Let me finish the post. It got messed up & posted to soon.


        Bill sharma. Bill your initials are BS,. Coincidence? :-)

        No one is saying no taxes at all. We ARE saying we are Taxed Enough Already. Most of what fed govt spends in the 1st place is illegal. You need to go the bottom line, not pretend what they are doing is legit.

        Another bottom line you skip over & you miss: If the fed govt lived by the Constitution they would not need nearly so much of OUR $$$. If the US is not broke, why all the borrowing? Besides to collapse the system?

        Ron Paul has this figured out. That is one reason he is the best candidate running.
        Ron would take US & the fed govt back to the Constitution. That is WHERE WE REALLY NEED TO GO!!



    • Elaine

      I’m not so sure about fighting not to become another Soviet Union. Look at TSA, a mind control agency. They can do whatever they want and the air travelers pretty much have to take it. But those are the law-abiding citizens. At the same time, those coming in illegally aren’t subjected to anything like that humiliation or submissiveness. From what I’ve read, they aren’t even being sent back, but those are the places the terrorists will be entering our country.

      Further, “If we don’t write the checks, you don’t get paid. Or do you think money grows on trees?”. Isn’t the answer “Yes” when they just print more money or create more out of thin air by a flick of the wrists like the Fed Reserve does? And now we know that the Fed Reserve has nothing to do with our government, so I don’t understand their purpose or why they get to print money using our money. Oh, yes. It’s a debt repayment from the 1930′s, isn’t it? Or is it a duping by our government?

      • DaveH

        Their purpose? To enrich themselves, and to allow Government to easily grow bigger with money borrowed from them.
        We can thank Woodrow Wilson for paving the way for Big Government growth with the 16th Amendment, the 17th Amendment, and the Federal Reserve Act.

      • MAP

        Elaine, Pat Buchanan addressed some of your thoughts in a recent column. I’m not the diehard Republican he is. But his analysis is correct. The radicals have been slowly building their support of a parasite base and have drastically altered the very character of the country in the process. Those that actually pay the taxes are being disinherited as a consequence. We are becoming a third world country.

  • nc

    Mr. Livingston, all conspiracy theories are a “PERHAPS” until they are proved! Next to breathing, nothing comes easier to a conservative than creating a good conspiracy involving their enemies! See your video and Freedom Fighters beauty above

    • DaveH

      What do you think Obama’s going to do, NC, tell the truth?

      • don

        he’ll tell everyone what they wanna hear. all the way from running against hillary in08 till now. fool everyone as much as possible with big promises that will never be kept and answers to all problems. a true amatuer.

      • Elaine

        Have y’all seen that our “government” is trying to take over the water of NM?

        If that happens to NM, then who’s next? And in times of extreme drought, what do you think people would have to do to get water to even drink? What was the James Bond movie about that very thing?

        Systemic failure at the very core.

    • Rich Knoch

      NC . . . . have you checked out how much the National debt has increased under obama, how much spending has increased and how much unemployment has increased?

      To save you the keystrokes . . . . I assume you will blame it all on G.W.?

      • Chester

        Well, Rich, for a fact, a good bit of that increase can be dropped squarely in GW’s lap. Who started all the unfunded conflicts, then kept on with them? Who pushed tax CUTS for the upper class, with a little teaser tossed to the middle class? Reagan proved that trickle down doesn’t work, yet all you ultra-conservatives keep hollering taxes are too high on the RICH, kind of like your name. All trickle down economics does is make the rich richer, while the poor keep on paying for everything. Think I am wrong, go out and try living on what someone at the lower end has for income, after taxes and all, somewhere south of two hundred a week. If you can find a halfway decent place to live, some sort of an old beater of a car that won’t break down every other day to drive, and food enough to put on the table regularly with that income, you are cheating somewhere, or else you were EXTREMELY lucky in your available choices.

      • DaveH

        Chester says — “Well, Rich, for a fact, a good bit of that increase can be dropped squarely in GW’s lap. Who started all the unfunded conflicts, then kept on with them?”.
        Who kept on with them? Obama.

        Chester says — “Reagan proved that trickle down doesn’t work”.
        Reagan proved that “trickle down” (Liberal slang) doesn’t work? No, Chester, Reagan proved that no matter how much the President wants to cut the size of Government, the Free Spending Congress can thwart him.
        Reagan issued 78 vetoes, more than any other president of my generation, but 9 of them were overridden by the Rabidly Spending Congress.

        Chester says — “All trickle down economics does is make the rich richer, while the poor keep on paying for everything”.
        Certainly better than the Trickle up Poverty as promoted by Progressives. What keeps the poor, Chester, from getting together and starting their own companies?

        Chester thinks the poor live on $200 a week. Sorry, Chester, but of the official “poor” in this country:
        • 76 percent have air conditioning
        • 66 percent have more than two rooms of living space per person
        • 97 percent own at least one color television
        • 62 percent have either cable or satellite television
        • Almost 75 percent of households own a car (30 percent own two
        or more)
        • 73 percent own microwave ovens
        • More than 50 percent have stereos
        • 33 percent have automatic dishwashers
        • 99 percent have refrigerators
        • Virtually none lack running water or flushing toilets
        • 46 percent own their own home, the average of which is a three
        bedroom house with 1.5 baths, that has a carport and porch or
        patio, and the average value of which is 70 percent of the median
        American home.
        From “The Case for Legalizing Capitalism”, Chapter 7, page 313:

        Contrast that with countries who practice the kind of Socialism that the Progressives root for here.

      • MAP

        DaveH, these are far too many facts. Given facts or the dream, facts will be discarded, the dream embraced, and Chester will be back here tomorrow spewing the same nonsense. It was a good attempt, though.

      • DaveH

        Most likely.

    • Ladybug

      nc, aren’t you ashamed to show the whole world how absolutely stupid you are? where is the ‘conspiracy’ in the article above? What Mr. Root says is just the plain, naked, blatantly obvious truth! It has nothing to do with any party or political view, it is plain COMMON SENSE, but that POS in the WH, the Thief-In-Chief is too stupid to understand that or he does not want to understand it because it would not help him to steal more money from the American people. Without us, the hard working people he would not get paid either!! and his dumb wife could not steal all those millions for herself and her 22 assistants, because she is too stupid to do anything by herself or with 1 assistant, and all those professional moochers would not get their food stamps and checks for doing nothing. WE paid for all the infrastructure with our tax dollars; the government just took our money, they did not make it!

      • Winddrinker

        Both the illegal foreigner and his “fake” wife were beneficiaries of “Affirmative Action.”
        Neither are very smart, and still aren’t. Both lost their licenses to practice law. The illegal foreigner never tried a case, never submitted a Motion to the Court or wrote a brief.They are a disgrace to the Presidency and to this Nation. They have no class, but instead act like “trash off the streets” that just won the lottery!

        Limbaugh said that he had a caller from a Harvard graduate and was told that the foreigner set a record by having the worse grades of any student every attending Harvard. The professors covered for his bad grades, his not attending classes and not taking care of the Harvard Law Review responsibilities.. No wonder all his records have been hidden at a cost of Millions! By the way, how did the Barry (that got very poor grades, didn’t attend classes,because he was too busy doing drugs and alcohol) ever get into Occidental… This is how the foreigner described himself in his book during that time. Was it Affirmative Actiont hat got him into Occidental? And, with less than spectacular transcripts, how did he get into Harvard and supposedly graduate…

    • eddie47d

      There is room for debate on both sides Ladybug and not everything is as clear cut as it seems. Zuckerberg’s friend Edward Saverin who went to live in Singapore was mentioned. We live in a worldwide economy and business entrepreneurs from every part of the globe move to various countries. Saverin is an investor who’s main holdings happen to be in Singapore such as the Anideo Company. More importantly he is a Brazilian citizen who invested in Facebook and has no obligation to America. He has not given up his Brazilian citizenship to live in Singapore. Denise Rich was also mentioned as “escaping” America. Some of that had to do with political reasoning not financial. Besides she also loves Austria and can do her work as a songwriter from there. Some folks love visiting foreign countries and eventually move there and has nothing to do with hating America. My neighbor now has their house on the market and will be moving south of Guanauanto Mexico soon. They are as white as can be but love the easy going lifestyle that region has to offer and their decision has nothing to do with dislikes America.

      • Elaine

        I don’t think anyone mentioned that they were moving because they HATED America. They just don’t want to pay the high taxes and are moving to where they can keep more of their money. The same thing happened to GB when some of their top earners were paying 110% of their income years ago. Stupid of the British government, wasn’t it? They had the same philosophy that BHO has. Tax the rich more and more because they don’t pay enough.

        That’s a ploy, though. Our taxes have gone up tremendously and we don’t even make the $250,000 dollars mentioned as the basement amount. But for one thing, 85% of SS is taxed if they keep working and make “too much”. That is terrible to me.

        I doubt that the pensions of the House and Senate are taxed that much, if at all.

        I’m thinking about looking for another place to live myself. We already had to leave my home state of TX because of illegals taking over our neighborhood and seeing that it wasn’t get any better if we moved within the state. That was more than 2 decades ago.

      • Richard Pawley

        I had a chapter in my 2006 autobiography on the economy, the soon coming stock market crash, and such like. In in I mentioned that about 185,000 Americans a year were then leaving the country. We now know it was between 200,000 and 300,000 a year (one tenth of the number currently leaving). I was fortunate to be able to interview some of those who left and six out of seven said the reason was the economy. One out of seven said it was America’s declining morality. It would be interesting to see what they would say today.

      • DaveH

        Elaine says — “But for one thing, 85% of SS is taxed if they keep working and make “too much”. That is terrible to me”.
        It’s not only “terrible” but it’s downright ignorant. It surprises me how many of the ignorant Progressives really believe that the old people are taking their jobs, when in fact those old people are adding to the overall productivity of the country, thus producing more and cheaper goods and services. There is no such thing as a fixed number of jobs. If we had Free Markets with the Government’s nosy nose out of them, everybody who wants to work would be able to work.

        • truesoy


          There has never been a ‘free’ market in the image you pretend to see. The government of the United States has always been an active participant, either regulating the market, or putting money into it. And that is how we’d been as successful as we have.


      • eddie47d

        There are many more worldwide opportunities for Americans so their is nothing unusual about people seeking their fortunes or comfortable lifestyles elsewhere. What wasn’t mentioned is the hundreds of thousands of foreigners who still come to America to prosper. Our colleges are filled with students from India and China etc and some choose to stay. Not EVERYTHING is hunky dory in in those two countries and we still have opportunities here.

      • DaveH

        Truesoy says — “There has never been a ‘free’ market in the image you pretend to see”.
        There has also never been perfection, Truesoy. Does that mean we shouldn’t strive for it?
        Do you Progressives ever tire of repeating your same old nonsensical talking points, Truesoy?
        There were very nearly Free Markets in the late 18th century and early and late 19th century and they were times of great prosperity.
        Read this book to learn more:

        Also, in 1900 total Government Spending was 6% of the GDP. Now Government spends over 40% of our GDP. What do we get for 13X bigger Government? Bad economies and less Freedom.

      • DaveH

        And there have been many examples of what the Progressive Dream of Socialism brings to countries. Socialism isn’t moral, it stifle the human spirit, and it results in bad economies. What exactly is it about Socialism that attracts you Progressives, Truesoy? Is it that you feel kinship with failure?
        All anybody need do is study this ranking of countries based on their Government’s involvement in the economy to see that your Socialist Dream is a Wet Dream:

        • truesoy


          If socialism is ‘not moral’ as you claim, are you then implying that the ‘State of Israel’ is not a moral State? you are aware Israel is a socialist state with a thriving economy, aren’t you? , and just like other socialist countries in Europe have thriving economies.
          And how about their health care system? The other day while visiting Israel, Romney heap praise on their outstanding health care system. I guess Romney doesn’t know yet that Israel has ‘socialized medicine’.
          This is more proof that conservatives believe in thing they don’t understand.
          Just food for thought, DaveH!!!!.


  • hipshotpercusion

    O-Bozo hasn’t got a clue because unlike some of us, he has never run a small business or spent any time in the real work force. At least Mittens and Dr. Paul have held real jobs an ran a business.

    • Chester

      Hate to tell you this, but our friend Mitt has never actually WORKED for a living a day in his life, outside of the time he spent doing missionary work, and that was NOT working for a living. He has done NO manual labor, done NO one on one customer service where the customer’s complaint could cost him his living. Servicing accounts for people with multiple millions of dollars to play with is nothing like doing customer service at the retail level. Far less risk to him, and the potential for a lot more gain. As far as Dr. Paul, I will give him credit for having earned that title, and having served in an area that too few doctors are willing to take on. Oh, he did REFUSE to serve the poorest people, unless they could lay cash money in his hands. It is reported that he would reduce his rates for people who couldn’t afford to pay the full load, but he would not take the guaranteed money from Medicare and Medicaid. So you have two people named there, one of whom you claim has a work history, and the other of which doesn’t even have a right to speak at the Republican convention.

      • Elaine

        Chester says:
        August 2, 2012 at 9:46 am

        Hate to tell you this, but our friend Mitt has never actually WORKED for a living a day in his life, outside of the time he spent doing missionary work, and that was NOT working for a living. He has done NO manual labor, done NO one on one customer service where the customer’s complaint could cost him his living.
        Wow!!! What is your definition of working? Manual labor only? My husband is a programmer with tremendous abilities but with your definition, he’s never worked a day in his life. What he does is basically what you describe as Romney’s job. He services accounts for other people who have more money to pay him for what he does. That is a JOB. That is working for a living. No accounts serviced, no money coming in. No money coming in, no job.

        Some people are just so obtuse.

      • DaveH

        Venture Capitalists provide or secure the funding for start-up companies, many of whom were responsible for the electronic gadgets that we can’t live without today. Without those Venture Capitalists we wouldn’t have anywhere near the standards of living we have today. If you think what they do is so easy, why don’t you and your Progressive buddies pool your money together and have the easy life (sure).
        As far as Ron Paul goes:
        First of all I don’t just take a Liberal’s word for anything since they have a regular habit of fabricating facts. So how about backing that claim up with some references? But even if Ron wouldn’t serve people who couldn’t or wouldn’t pay, why not? How many of you Liberals would work for free? In fact, many of your kind don’t even want to work for their money, they just want to steal it from others.
        As far as Medicare goes, many doctors just get tired of jumping through the Government hoops, and putting up with meddlesome busybodies who interject themselves between the Doctors and the Patients.
        Of course it’s easy for you Liberals to say what they should or shouldn’t do. It’s always easy to make somebody else’s choices.

      • Paul Wells

        Oh, don’t try to explain anything to Chester, his brain (if he even has one!) would explode. All the left can understand is take, take, take, and give no credit to anyone who has built something of value in this country, and lay around with their freakin’ hands out!

      • eddie47d

        A few like to brag up Venture Capitalism but some were the gamblers of Wall Street who milked our economy to death and exploited the wealth of our nation. A more appropriate name would be Vulture Capitalists. Not all was right in that dream world of excess.

      • DaveH

        Eddie, you’re an uneducated envy-driven man who doesn’t have the slightest clue what he’s talking about. If you’re going to denigrate a whole category of people, at least have the dignity to post some references even if their facts are fabricated like yours are.

      • eddie47d

        Bingo! You never bring up the vultures on Wall Street so why is your word worth anything. Maybe when you stop being so selective .

    • Elaine

      O-Bozo!!!! I like that!!! :-)

  • Sgt. York

    where does this eightball think the money comes from to do all these Great Projects that have,as he says, given private business all the help provided by the dang GoV? its time to wake up Pres your just a figure head and a poor one at that. We made our own way no thanks to you.

    • 2centsworth

      Yeah, where does he think the money comes from that the elite, and bankers, and Obama and the Senators, and Congress keep ripping off from us? Where does the trillions of dollars for the black ops, secret budget for underground facilities for the elite to escape to come from? (Besides the Government drug dealing, arms sales, and child trafficking) Anyone who votes for this Arab sand n needs to go with him to his home in Costa Rica which he has bought with “secret” money hidden in his various offshore accounts.

      • Elaine

        2centsworth says:
        August 2, 2012 at 9:52 am

        Anyone who votes for this Arab sand n needs to go with him to his home in Costa Rica which he has bought with “secret” money hidden in his various offshore accounts.
        Amen to that.

        That $49.2 million with matching funds for much of it was his seed money for the $73 K he gets each month just in dividends. And he talks about the rich as if they are different from him. He’s one of those rich but he’s trying to stir up a class warfare. But the ones who can’t understand that probably won’t ever read anything about it. Those here who read it and won’t understand it have to be delusional or co-conspirators in arms.

        Someone with a lot of power had to have been there to put him in charge of those Chicago school grants, though. But look at the background for Chicago. And then for the government to give those grants to Chicago and not require any results from it was typical government inadequacy and /or corruptness, also.

      • moonbeam

        Elaine says “Anyone who votes for this Arab sand n” Was that really necessary? I don’t like Obama either, but damn you racist mofos just can’t keep that awful word out of your putrid filthy mouths. Your tongue needs to turn black and rot right out of your mouth or maybe your fingers need to swell and curl up for typing that crap.

      • DaveH

        Elaine was quoting 2centsworth, although she did say she agreed with it (but maybe didn’t think about the racial slur?).
        At any rate, there was certainly no call for it, but if I let the name-calling from every ignorant poster get to me, I would have been off of here a long time ago.


    My guess is that not one of the lefty libs who attempt to defend their ridiculous ideology will not respond to Wayne’s assertions, as it is impossible to argue against his logic in this article. Instead they’ll settle for calling him names like racist, uneducated, hater, etc. Any takers libs?

    • Chester

      Don’t HAVE to call him anything, as he does enough of that without MY help. Before he says another word, I want him to swear on the stack of bibles he wants me to use that he will never again use a government supplied commodity or resource. I have no idea what he is going to walk on or drive on, where he is going to go to take a dump or get a drink unless he moves far out in the country where he has to dig his own well and septic system, and walk only on private land to get to the nearest store to buy those things he is unable to provide for himself. We use so many things supplied by the government and think nothing about it, but let a pothole develop in the paved road in front of your house, and who is the first to go crying to the city council, or the local roads and bridges committee to get it fixed. Who gets screamed at when your water system fails, just as long as it is not on YOUR side of the meter. In a lot of towns, lights and heat are supplied to the customers by the city as well, and bet your bottom dollar that if something goes wrong with the power or the gas, you are going to be on city hall. Without all those things, how does anyone build anything, let alone a business? I saw one man put it right, although he was the one with the idea, it was the CUSTOMERS who built his business, and without some way of getting to him, usually something provided by the government, the customers would NOT have been there.

      • Curt

        Chester Mollester
        All paid by TAX DOLLARS. Or did that point escape your narrow liberal/demoncrap mind? The government did NOT pay for any of it. Damned straight, if I lost water or anything else you whine about, I am gonna be calling to get it taken care of. My TAX DOLLARS pay for those services. Do you REALLY think government provides those services free of charge? If you do, then you’re as brain dead as O’crap.

      • Oneguess

        Morons unite!

      • DaveH

        Okay, Chester, first you help yourself to other peoples’ unwilling money to implement your own pet programs, then you try to tell them they shouldn’t get some of it back when they satisfy the requirements?

        Chester says — “We use so many things supplied by the government and think nothing about it, but let a pothole develop in the paved road in front of your house, and who is the first to go crying to the city council, or the local roads and bridges committee to get it fixed”.
        Why shouldn’t they expect what they were forced to pay for? And in fact they almost always pay more than they could have aquired the same services for from the Private Sector. Except they can’t use a private service because the Government has a Monopoly.

        Chester says — “Without all those things, how does anyone build anything, let alone a business?”.
        Without the interference of Government they would have those things, they would pay less for them, and they would get courteous service.

        Chester says — “it was the CUSTOMERS who built his business …, and without some way of getting to him, usually something provided by the government, the customers would NOT have been there”.
        No Chester, the business owner built his business, the customers just shopped around and chose his business for their own personal reasons (cheaper prices, better service, etc.). It’s a mutually beneficial relationship. The business couldn’t exist without pleasing the customers, and the customers wouldn’t be pleased if the business didn’t exist. If the Progressives get their way, we will be stuck with the latter.
        And before Big Government, businesses did build the roads for customers to access them more easily:

    • Karolyn

      This is just a replay of the blog from a few days ago. Why should we waste our breath? Tired of beating a dead horse. Doesn’t Root have anything better or newer to blog about?

      • Oneguess

        Don’t YOU have anything better to do than spew your leftist cr@p here? Get a life.

      • Karolyn

        Na-na-na-na-na! Why don’t you?

      • DaveH

        Where’s the love, Karolyn?

  • DaveH

    Wayne says — “Even ignorant leftists and socialists can’t intelligently argue with that”.
    I haven’t seen them argue intelligently about ANYTHING on this board.

    • eddie47d

      Your “facts” aren’t always a grand slam Dave H but you have gotten good at the name calling in various comments. I enjoy some of your information but don’t pat yourself on the back too hard.

      • Oneguess

        Why don’t you look in a mirror?

      • JeffH

        eddie, you’re just a Marxist tool fool. Obama’s latest fundraising video was specifically targeting people just like yourself…not a clue Marxist tool fools.

      • DaveH

        I would not pat my back, Eddie, at anything I do to keep you around.

      • Paul Wells

        Eddie is just a “useful idiot”, a great term coined by none other than Lenin himself! He wouldn’t recognize the truth if it hit him between his crossed eyes!

      • eddie47d

        I knew once Ron Paul was out of the picture Jeff and his gang would lower their standards and become bitter old Republicans. Didn’t take much time for you to slide down a couple of notches and join their dark side. . Yes Paul Wells there are plenty of “useful idiots” to go around.

      • JeffH

        eddie, you’re just a simpleton and an ignorant one at that. I know you haven’t any proof to your statement, so that make you a liar…again!
        FYI, you don’t no squat, never have and never will.
        Polly want another cracker? baaarrraaaccckkk!

      • eddie47d

        Don’t kid yourself Jeff there are plenty of Libertarians who will vote for Romney just to keep Obama out of another term. Deal with reality Jeff and lay off the sheep ranching!

  • dan

    DON”T FEED THE BEAST….some might call me passive aggressive,but when you get locked-up for being a tax protester or speaking your mind,then you are reduced to voting with your feet….not that leaving will let you escape the long arm of the BEAST …it just makes things as difficult as possible.

  • Jonathan

    Look you guy’s, you think Mit is going to do any better? Think again, he’s just as bad as Obama. THE REPUBLICANS ARE JUST AS BAD AS THE DEMOCRATS!!!!!!! Things aren’t going to get any better with Mit Romney in office than they are right now. The One World Order wants this country to fail and it’s not just Obama that they control, it’s all of them but a precious few.

    • DaveH

      For Personal Liberty, Individual Responsibility, Limited Government, Free Markets, and PEACE — Vote Libertarian!

      • vieteravet

        ueah, you vote libertarian and Obama will be president again! A vote for Ron Paul is a vote for Obama!~

      • DaveH

        A vote for Romney is a vote for more of the same.

      • SamFox

        Actually, a vote for Mitt is the real vote for 0. These 2 phonies are the same. Just like 0 & GWB. 0 is doing what GW did. Nothing has changed but the brand. We went from R to D. That’s all that changed. OOOPPPS! A correction….

        0 is different in that he is doing the Bush thing faster. Not a good difference.

        Mitt will do the same as 0. That’s why the RNC, fringe stream media, CINO-RINOs,Dems & progs tried to bury Ron Paul. Ron is the only major candidate who is outside the establishment system box.

        Ron is still in the race. He changed tactics, but he is still in there fighting for the restoration of the Constitution as the guide for US govt.


    • Power To The People

      I agree…the parties are irrelevant, the cause is what matters to the progressives that are part of the NWO. Obummer is a pawn of the movement and his actions are meant to reduce the US to a third rate player just as he noted he father wanted in his book.

      No surprise here!

    • moonbeam

      You’re right, Jonathon. Mitt is absolutely no good for this country. What gets me is people are calling for Marco Rubio to be his VP. Rubio is not a natural born citizen and can not be anybody’s VP.

      Mitt is lying to people when he says the first thing he will do is repeal obamacare. He will do nothing of the sort. He will do like all others before him. He will serve himself and ram his beliefs down our throats. And we will do just as we are doing now. Standing with our thumbs up our rear ends bitching, moaning and complaining how we don’t like this or that.

      We keep forgetting, for some odd reason, that We the People have a Constitution that gives us the POWER to get rid of tyrannical governments. What are we waiting for, or shall I say what are we afraid of?

      • DaveH
      • truesoy


        Rubio is a natural born citizen and no less than Romney whose father was born in Mexico.
        Rubio was born in the U.S. But what makes him not qulify are his lousy ideas., that’s all.


      • JeffH

        truesoy, try educating yourself on “natural born citizen”.
        Rubio is a 14th Amendment citizen..a citizen “by the pen” and therefore could never be “natural born”.

        The Court in Minor did make a direct holding that Mrs. Minor was, in fact, a US citizen. The Court established her citizenship by definining the “class” of “natural-born citizens” as those born in the US to “parents” who were citizens.

        Obama’s father was a British subject and was never a US citizen and therefore Obama could never be a “natural born citizen”.

        The independent ground the Court used to determine that Virginia Minor was a US citizen is stated as follows:

        “Additions might always be made to the citizenship of the United States in two ways: first, by birth, and second, by naturalization. This is apparent from the Constitution itself, for it provides that ‘No person except a natural-born citizen or a citizen of the United States at the time of the adoption of the Constitution shall be eligible to the office of President,’ …

        “The Constitution does not in words say who shall be natural-born citizens. Resort must be had elsewhere to ascertain that. At common law, with the nomenclature of which the framers of the Constitution were familiar, it was never doubted that all children born in a country of parents who were its citizens became themselves, upon their birth, citizens also. These were natives or natural-born citizens, as distinguished from aliens or foreigners. Some authorities go further and include as citizens children born within the jurisdiction without reference to the citizenship of their parents. As to this class there have been doubts, but never as to the first. For the purposes of this case, it is not necessary to solve these doubts. It is sufficient for everything we have now to consider that all children born of citizen parents within the jurisdiction are themselves citizens. “

      • Jay

        Marco Rubio was born in Miami, Fla., on May 28, 1971, to Mario and Oriales Rubio who were born in Cuba. Therefore, not “natural born” citizen. Case closed!

        • truesoy


          But if Rubio, though born in the US is not a natural born citizen because his parents were born in Cuba, then neither is Romney a ‘natural’ born citizen because his father was born in Mexico.
          What do you have to say about that?


          • bobgood1

            his father was born in Mexico, but it was on us government property ( ie like a military base or embassy )

          • truesoy


            Negative Skippy, for 1) we have no military bases in Mexico and 2) his grandfather was not in the military and 3) his grandfather was fleeing american law against poligamy.
            Are we clear now?


      • Jay

        George Romney was born in a Mormon colony in Chihuahua, Mexico, to American citizen parents which bestowed American citizenship upon him (Jus sanguinis).

        Although a citizen, George Romney was never a “natural born” citizen.

        When George Romney’s parents fled the United States with their children because of the federal government’s opposition to polygamy they did not lose their American citizenship.

        Gaskell Romney, George Romney’s father, was born on September, 22 1871, in St. George, Washington, Utah. He’s an American citizen by birth.

        Anna Amelia Pratt Romney, George Romney’s mother, was born on May 6, 1876, in Salt Lake City, Salt Lake, Utah. She’s an American citizen by birth and marriage — remember this is pre-19th Amendment, when a woman’s citizenship was derived from her husband’s.

        Mitt Romney’s parents were both American citizens when Mitt was born in Detroit, Michigan on March 12, 1947.

        One thing that ther Mormons get right is genealogy.

        Mitt Romney was born in the USA (jus solis) of American citizen parents (Jus sanguinis) and is eligible to serve as POTUS.

        • truesoy

          ..and still does not change the fact he remained a Mexican citizen in accordance with mexican constitution.


      • Jay

        Regardless, the original focus of your inquiry was mitt romney’s eligibility. Mitt Romney is eligible…period! Is he my choice? Not a chance, and neither is obama my choice. I consider both to be; wall-street-puppets.

        • macgyver1948

          Jay… It doesn’t have to be Obama but… WHY would anybody want ROMNEY? Romney is eligible to run for president, not argument there. But he kills what wont benefit himself and his investors as his primary objectives.. He says he participated in the baptisms of dead people (something very anti-Constitutional), even Jews, so that proves he is against “Freedom Of Religion” unless it meets his religious choice. He speaks to the audience of the moment and he is a puppet of the far right wing, big money. He takes his insult and vocal slips act on the road in order to insult other countries. His just released tax plan is a BUSH plan in drag so the middle class will pay for the tax cuts for the wealthy – his kind – AGAIN.

          I would be very nervous if he had to chat with leaders of Russia, China, Iran, Egypt and Israel (Yeah Israel, they too know he is anti other religions which do not match his and that he is a phony as well) so I ask again. WHY would anybody want ROMNEY? I know you said you wouldn’t so good for you even though you are also against Obama.

  • peter

    Is the President really that stupid when he doesn’t have a scriptwriter or a teleprompter? He absolutely needs to curb his tongue when he opens his mouth to try to fool folks that he knows what he is talking about on a lot of subjects. Cannot think of one at the moment where he would qualify as being completely competent or knowledgeable He really needs to join the bufoons in Hollywood who also know nothing about being a real person. That is where he really feels at home – with all the folks who actually haven’t a clue who they really are because they are always pretending to be what they are not. Sound familiar?

  • Joe the Rag Man

    Mr. Root, while most all you say in your speech is true, the premise is incorrect. Most ‘support’ is given without the expectation of repayment. While it is true that if you watch the edited versions of President Obama’s speech you could easily come to the conclusion which you reached, if you watched the actual event you would not. The media spins everything said or done by any of the candidates to their own view regardless of the real action. I didn’t see anywhere the claim that business owners OWE the government, only that those who feel that they did everything themselves should re access those feelings and acknowledge that through school, bank loans, tax breaks etc. they were ‘helped’ in their endeavor. Romney has run a business but I’m sure that the degrees he earned at Harvard helped him do so. Parents either through encouragement or even sometimes scorn (reverse encouragement) influence the paths of their children. Very few people act without any type of influence and that influence should be recognized. That is the message I got from the speech.

    • DaveH

      The entire speech for those who care:

      Why would he be saying those things? Could it be that he’s trying to soften people up for more redistribution of the wealth? Nah, Obama wouldn’t do that, would he?

    • DaveH

      Joe says — “Very few people act without any type of influence and that influence should be recognized”.
      Why? Those were either voluntary gifted actions with no strings attached, or they were voluntary contractual actions in which both parties exchanged something (money for knowledge, etc.).
      Progressives are great at giving people something they didn’t ask for, and in the case of Big Government many didn’t even want, then making everybody pay for those things that many didn’t want, and then using those unsolicited gifts to the users of the Government programs to guilt them if they resist further intrusion into their pocketbooks for even more Social programs.
      Resist the Progressives!

    • listener

      Joe, you don’t have a clue ! If all the businesses in the USA quit paying taxes to the fed,how long would it take the imposter to figure out a fast way to leave the country and hide?

      • eddie47d

        Maybe if we didn’t have the Irwin Schiff’s in America cunningly conning us into breaking the law we wouldn’t be in such as mess. The right tried to make Schiff an anti-tax champion when he was nothing more than a thief and now a felon (12 years). He could have committed tax fraud all by himself but no he had to drag others into his false schemes.

      • JeffH

        eddie says “…he had to drag others into his false schemes.”

        Ah yes eddie, the same way you’ve been drug into the Marxist schemes? Class warfare, class envy, crony capitalist, redistribution, anti capitalist, facts are lies and lies are facts, two party system, anti-American dream.

        You are just another of many Marxist/socialist/progressive/communist tools being used to destroy American freedom and American sovereignty.

      • DaveH

        So trying to keep the Government from stealing your money is now Theft, Eddie?
        Only in twisted Progressive minds.

      • eddie47d

        So Dave H are you saying a tax cheater and felon is your hero. A man who’s actions caused millions more to have to pay more because of his cunning. There is a difference in keeping what is yours and refusing to pay anything.

      • eddie47d

        I never cheat on my taxes Jeff so your rambling ca ca bull is getting boring. Maybe you are the one with something to hide?

      • JeffH

        eddie ramble on incoherently and says DUH! “I never cheat on my taxes Jeff so your rambling ca ca bull is getting boring. Maybe you are the one with something to hide?”

        Now show me where I or anyone said you cheated on your taxes. You’re one sick puppy eddie…seek help!

      • eddie47d

        Your the one defending a known tax cheat Jeff. Shouldn’t that explain it all. Wolf Wolf!

    • Jefferson Thomas

      @eddie47…how could he (Schiff) commit tax fraud when the fraud he was supposed to have committed is against a fraudulent, illegal, unconstitutional theft called the income tax? What a chuckle head. You seem to think that because you state an erroneous premise that all people automatically accept it.

      • eddie47d

        Nothing erronous about what I said and you have every right to not like the Income Tax. The place to do that is at the Supreme Court so where is that organization doing that for you or anyone else? Schiff was doing it more for personal gain than some high moral principle.

      • Jefferson Thomas

        @eddie47….Producing something of value for exchange in the FREE ENTERPRISE MARKET that people voluntarily exchange values for in which a person makes a profit is one of the highest moral values. Not only does that person enrich themselves, they enrich others around them by increasing the quality of human life.

        The biggest thieves are in the US senate, CONgress, and executive branch who want increase their power base and wealth at the expense of others. The supreme court is made up of political appointees. Almost all pretense of an independent judiciary is gone.

        Here is your free clue…government is force, coercion, and fraud when it has severe limitations removed from it. It still operates by these methods even when severely limited. Can you come to a logical conclusion from this information eddie?

        Tell your fairy tales to someone who doesn’t know any better.

  • Betsy Elling

    I’m not a business owner but you are DEAD ON!!! This little arrogant, Petulent man-child does have every thing completely backwards and upide down. He Should be thanking everyone of us who pays taxes. I wish we could take his salary and perks away and see if MUCHelle buys a 7000.00 dollar jacket on us anymore. There all criminals and should be jailed. That,s how I really feel!!

    • Nadzieja Batki

      Mr. and Mrs. O would say that they are putting people to work when she buys expensive jackets. The farmer, the designer, the sewer, the thread makers, etc., etc.. We don’t see things the same way as the O couple do.
      Play the Devil’s Advocate in your own mind and you may see how the Leftist mind works.

      • Karolyn

        Aren’t you the one who always talks of liberals being jealous when speaking of the rich spending money?

      • DaveH

        Their own money, Karolyn, which they earned from voluntary customers, not money taken by force from other people.

    • eddie47d

      Anyone in power should tone down their arrogance whether a fat cat on the right or the left. Those who brag about earning their wealth while shafting those who have lost their jobs are pathetic souls. Too many of the 1-2% have done just that. Small business owners should be weary of them also for they could just as easily be taking you over and they wouldn’t be losing any sleep over it either.

      • DaveH

        I don’t know who they are, Eddie. I do know who you are. A guy who belonged to Unions his whole life. Unions who advance by coercing their employers at the expense of the employer, replacement workers, and their customers.

      • eddie47d

        Use your noggin Dave! Think of the Walmarts who go into communities and shut down small businesses. All is not good in that paradise world you keep invoking.

      • Jay

        noggin: a small quantity of liquor, typically a quarter of a pint.

    • Elaine

      Betsy Elling says:
      August 2, 2012 at 8:21 am

      The jacket reminds me of the following:

      The Philippine government today is still paying interest in public debts incurred during Marcos’ administration. It was reported that, when Marcos fled, U.S. Customs agents discovered 24 suitcases of gold bricks and diamond jewelry hidden in diaper bags and in addition, certificates for gold bullion valued in the billions of dollars were allegedly among the personal properties he, his family, his cronies and business partners surreptitiously took with them when the Reagan administration provided them safe passage to Hawaii. When the presidential mansion was seized, it was discovered that Imelda Marcos had over 2700 pairs of shoes in her closet.

      Also, with all the travel mentioned for the “O or S or ?” family, I’ve not heard of the trip to England for the Olympics, but there she was sitting front row at the swim meet on the first day. By front row, I don’t mean with the audience, but down in the pool area, not that that’s the important point. The important point was no mention that I’ve heard that she had gone. MSM still at it in hiding things from us or had I just missed it?

      • DaveH

        No, they wouldn’t hide it. They want to give her lots of face time, because so many people cast their votes based on such superficial things.

  • Winddrinker

    obumscum hasn’t a clue how Americans think since he is an illegal foreigner with no idea what this country is about or how it was founded. He grew up speaking arabic and going to a madrassa, and living in a muslim country… Personality is complete by the time one is seven years old and that is formed by “parenting tapes” recorded in one’s mind. He took in what was going on around him in a different country, with a different culture. He is the culmination of those experiences. He is not one of us and must depend on his handlers. Who made the decisions for hundreds of thousands of sets of riot gear, and four Million rounds of hollow point ammo. Troops are being moved back into this country and being armed for …what! We may just find out in the next one hundred days.

  • Lee Krupski

    Obama has lied since he took office, and no matter the amount of proof available, the libs still deny it’s existence, they just keep their head in the sand and their hands out, won’t, can’t last forever. too bad libs, keep telling yourself lies like Obama, the truth will hit you soon! Believe it or not, I feel for you.. No wealth, no money for your social agenda, just keep telling yourself how rich people are “bad” while you rummage through their trash, trying to find something to eat, at least it’s a job!

    • Power To The People

      Those rich people didn’t get it themselves….they owe the unions, the feds, Obummer, progressives, all the special interests that support redistribution.

      • Nadzieja Batki

        It is not to our benefit to lump the “rich” together in one catagory because it is easier than having to distinguish between the rich who created their own business by their own volition or the rich who became rich because the government put their competitors out of the running.

      • DaveH

        Good Comment, Nad.

  • Wes McKay

    An Open Letter to … mr. obama

    You stated … ” If you are successful … you did not do it on your own ”

    Well sir, please explain to me, what you did in the success of Our Olympian Athletes, that gives you the right to ‘ TAX ‘ the Medals They Won ?

    You are charging them:

    $ 8,986 … for Gold
    $ 5,385 … for Silver
    $ 3,502 … for Bronze

    So Please explain to me … as a Hard-Working-Tax-Paying-American …

    What part did you play in their …

    Years of Grueling Training
    Sacrifices of … Time, Family, and Life Style
    Expenses for Training, Special Diet, Equipment, and Medical Expenses
    Dedication to a goal of being the Best They Can Be
    Travel Expenses to Various Training Facilities
    Travel Expenses to Various Competition Events

    Where were you while all this was going on ?
    Where was your Financial Support ?
    Where you there Supporting and Cheering Them on and I just didn’t see you ?

    OR … mr. obama

    Do you just come in at the end and … Collect On The Achievement of The Results ?

    That is … ” Taxation Without Representation ”

    Remember … what happened to England !

    WE … will not start a revolution to correct your … GREED !

    But WE Will Use the Most Powerful Weapon in the World Today !

    The ‘ VOTE ‘ in November … and Retire You and Send You Home !

    God Bless America, Our Military, and Our Olympian Athletes, and All Who Love Them

    • Power To The People

      Yea….change is coming for the golfer-in-chief as he exits “his house”!

    • Karolyn

      income is income. The Olympic athletes are paid by the government for winning. Why should they not be taxed? Taxing of income is not Obama’s fault. The medals themselves are really not worth much.

      • Elaine

        Why would someone be taxed for being better, though? Tax on actual income is one thing. Tax on rewards or merits is another. It seems to me that would be like “Teacher of the Year” award would be taxed for being a better teacher.

      • Karolyn

        Elaine – The better they are, the more money they get.

      • DaveH

        The only “fair” tax would be a head tax (every adult pays the same). The Income Tax was developed to take advantage of human nature since so many people suffer from the deadly sin of envy, thus allowing the Politicians to gather more money from the people.
        The bottom line is that we all pay the taxes directly or indirectly through higher product prices or services, lost jobs, or taxes.

        • macgyver1948

          DaveH… You say “The only “fair” tax would be a head tax (every adult pays the same)”.

          If you are referring to a flat tax where everyone pays the same percentage of all income, including Capital Gains and all other ‘income” for the year, that would be cool. It would, however, have to mean all eliminations of loopholes and deductions or it wouldn’t be fair and it wouldn’t really work.

          For example, the guy who makes $25,000 a year pays the exact same percentage, whatever is decided on for the flat tax, as Sam Walton’s heirs or Bill Gates, NO EXCEPTION. If you, as an individual or a corporation, earn it you pay the (flat) tax. I also would like to see that earned money being taxed only once.

          It has been suggested before and I do not see it happening because to many very wealthy people complained and their “influenced”, very wealthy or not, “representatives” helped to deny it. I guess they felt it wasn’t fair to their “wealthiness”.

          Then you say “The bottom line is that we all pay the taxes directly or indirectly through higher product prices or services, lost jobs, or taxes”.

          I am not exactly so sure how you mean this. We do not pay taxes, our selves as consumers, through “higher product prices or services”, we just pay the dealer’s higher prices and they should pay the additional differences in taxes on what they earned from us. The only other difference to us is the higher the cost of the “product or services” the higher the sales tax. But if Corporations can pass on their increased expenses to the consumer so can Government I guess. We do not have a lot to say about it. I know it is a small point of difference from what you say but I wanted to comment since I wasn’t sure of your intent.

      • Winddrinker

        What about taxing that huge solid gold necklace that hung to obumscums waist, given to him as a gift by the king of saudi arabia! There were photos of him wearing it, and I want to know if that was that Taxed!!

        By the way, the illegal foreigner is nothing but a product of “affirmative action!”
        Limbaugh had a call from a Harvard graduate that told him about this muslim. First off, the person wanted to know how the foreigner every got into Occidental because they had tough qualifications for admissions. The students admitted must have been in the top 15% of the class, and needed to have been “class president” or “captain of a sports team” or other such accomplishments. In toher words, Occidental took only the best students, especially at that time.

        Since the illegal stated in his book that he was a bad student, had poor grades, and was into drugs and booze, how did he qualify to be a student at Occidental. Affirmative Action or a big donation from mentors was the only he could have gotten into Occidental..take your pick. THAT is what this foreigner means when he says that “nobody does it on their own” because HE sure didn’t do it on his own! There is no explaination as to why he left Occidental, either. One day he was just “gone.”

        The person went on to say that this illegal foreigner had the lowest grads of any Harvard student, ever!! The professors covered for him when he didn’t come to class, fulfill the Law Review responsbilities or make the grades.There it is again, He couldn’t do it on his own, and get his degree like everyone else. No wonder all his transcripts, admission information, and everything else has been “lock-up tight” by the Court!! Everything that Americans have been told has been lies…it is all fiction! But, it is no wonder that this uneducated cretin has the idea that “people are not successful because of their intelligence and business acument.” That is not his personal experience…he was propelled to the presidency with no education or qualifications. And, the group behind his ascent to the throne are not going to sit by and watch their “boy” lose an election.

        • truesoy


          I think you are drinking more than just wind….!
          …and you quote from Rush? now I really know you’re nutsssssssssss.


      • Karolyn

        wind – Anybody can make a phone call and say they are whoever they want to be; and the listener will sop it up if it furthers his agenda

    • flipped54

      Wes, here is an assessment of the tax by PolitiFact on the winnings of gold medalists. It is not a tax on the medal but a tax on the cash winnings. They are taxed just like any other American is taxed. I worked very hard when I was farming for over 23 years and did alot of hard, dirty work with long hours. I paid taxes on those earnings up to a 90ish% progressive tax back then. I now own enough property to have a comfortable retirement along with Social Security and Medicare. I would like to play the world’s smallest violin for them. Here is the assessment and the link to the article. It would be best to read the entire article to dispute your misleading claim. I also added a link to the benefits for a country with a progressive tax system.

      “Americans for Tax Reform is correct that gold medalists’ winnings are taxable, and it provides some leeway by saying that U.S. winners could be taxed up to $9,000.

      Still, it’s not likely that anyone would pay that much per medal in taxes — even if the winner was fortunate enough to have annual income well over $380,000 and refused to deduct any business expenses on their winnings. Any accountant worth their salt should be able to get the rate of tax on medal winnings much below $9,000, and maybe even to zero. We rate the statement Mostly False.”

    • Elaine

      Wes McKay says:
      August 2, 2012 at 8:42 am

      gives you the right to ‘ TAX ‘ the Medals They Won ?

      You are charging them:

      $ 8,986 … for Gold
      $ 5,385 … for Silver
      $ 3,502 … for Bronze

      This is appalling!! Has this ever happened at any of the other Olympics by any other administration? If so, was it the same values? Do other countries do the same? I really doubt that they would want to ever sell them.

      • Karolyn

        Elaine – As I have already posted, they get taxed on what they are paid by the USA. The medals are not worth that much on their own. Please see the link I posted that gives a rundown of how much the countries pay their winners. Britain doesn’t give them anything.

        • macgyver1948

          Karolyn… Also it was not Obama’s doing to tax the winning medals. That dubious honor we can bestow on the Gipper’s admin.

    • eddie47d

      Wes McKay is trying to turn the tax on the Olympic Medals into an Obama issue. The tax code for those medals was established under Ronald Reagan in 1986 .and in today’s dollars the Gold Medal is worth about $675. Why have some of you fallen for his misstatements?

      • macgyver1948

        eddie47d… You said “Wes McKay is trying to turn the tax on the Olympic Medals into an Obama issue. The tax code for those medals was established under Ronald Reagan in 1986 .and in today’s dollars the Gold Medal is worth about $675. Why have some of you fallen for his misstatements?”.

        True but to answer your question “Why have some of you fallen for his misstatements?”. Well, maybe because TEA thinkers are told what to believe. Just as they are told Obama is the biggest spender when in fact, since President Eisenhower, Reagan and GW were hugely 1 and 2 respectively in spending and Obama is the smallest spender since IKE. I wonder why too.

        See the chart and the story at so we can all wonder why.

  • freelarrysinclair

    Yeah. Are you folks honestly going to run the whole campaign on quotes taken out of context? I don’t doubt that you can sell those lies. But don’t go whining about how 1984 presaged the current climate while you’re actively engaging in doublespeak.

    “But the most brilliant propagandist technique will yield no success unless one fundamental principle is borne in mind constantly and with unflagging attention. It must confine itself to a few points and repeat them over and over. Here, as so often in this world, persistence is the first and most important requirement for success.”

    Good luck with that, Skippy.

    • DaveH

      Which quote was that, Skippy?

      • JeffH

        Skippy? Don’t you mean free larry-curly-moe?

      • JeffH
      • DaveH

        The stooges were the ones who voted for them.

      • Jay

        JeffH, priceless!!! ROFLMAO…

      • JeffH

        Jay, It’s because of you that I remembered seeing that picture before…I just haven’t figured out how to resize it for an avatar.

        “Calling Dr. Howard, Dr. Fine, Dr. Howard!”

    • DaveH

      Haven’t we heard, JeffH, that Obama’s quotes were “taken out of context” over and over again by the Progressives? Yet, they never provide any proof. And now this stooge is trying to turn the tables and accuse us of Propaganda.

      • JeffH

        Yep…and they consider themselves to be “independent thinkers” and how often do you “hear” a liberal or a progressive refer to O’man as a moderate…yeah right, Bush was a conservative too and we’re better off now than 4 years ago. You just can’t fix stupid.

        • macgyver1948

          I continue to read on here remarks such as “Haven’t we heard, JeffH, that Obama’s quotes were “taken out of context” over and over again by the Progressives? Yet, they never provide any proof”.

          “Yet, they never provide any proof”. What is the point to provide proof, as in URL links, if people refuse to follow up on it and choose to believe only what they are told to believe. Why waste time looking at potential proof when it is easier to let others to think for you.

          I have offered the URL link to Obama’s speech maybe 6 times here but I am now assuming you just do not want to know the truth. Listen to animated people such as Root because it is easier to support his hate, and yours, for Obama. Truth and proof will just waste your time and get in the way. Root is an out-of-context hate monger and to watch him all I see is animation. Just like Goofy from Disney but not nearly as honorable. Have some TEA and relax…

      • JeffH

        I’m still waiting for the proof free larry-curly-moe has gathered to prove his accusations directed at Mr. Livingston.

      • Jay

        Don’t hold your breath JeffH and DaveH, poor moe is still trying to figure out what double-speak means, much less provide proof for his idiotic drools.

  • the big easy

    Not only is he the ‘FOOD STAMP’ president,but now he is also ‘the PINK SLIP’ president,almost 20% of the country is UNEMPLOYED.————What a flea-infested flea-bagger puke————————-

    • Elaine

      Well, why would anyone want to work if they can get unemployment for almost 2 years when gas is higher than many make to be able to pay for it? Then to get unemployment with no taxes taken out, food stamps, no baby sitter expenses, no car expenses, no extra clothes, etc. Welfare figures would be higher if the true unemployment rate was reflected as intended. We’re now subsidizing a higher welfare payment under another name.

  • Scott Foy

    Wayne while your political attacks on Obama are warranted he is a sell out, teleprompter reader everyone`s focus should be on something called (Comprehensive Annual Financial Report) all GOV agencies, states, municipalities, pension funds etc submit these once a year and it shows the enormous empire that has been built by collective GOV through global investments with tax payer money. If everyone would open their eyes and read these reports they would realize that we are being mislead as our wealth is being systematically stolen from us. These reports are not reported to the public but can be accessed on line and will show that collective GOV is crying short falls & deficits when in reality there is TRILLIONS in surplus from investments to cover these. AND THIS IS OUR MONEY

  • john

    He (King Obuma)wants to bring America to it’s knees so he can become dictator (Anti-Christ). He want’s everyone stupid and dependant on government (Anti-Christ). Can you say Moooooooooo. It’s too late now, there’s no stopping the one world government (Anti-Christ), It’s here! Better find the LORD! He will be our FINAL KING!!!

    • eddie47d

      Hey John did you think of that verbiage all by yourself or did you have government help? LOL! At least you did get the final sentence correct.

      • Nadzieja Batki

        Who are you referring to? Possibly you would want to disregard the Constitution and make the country a Monarchy.

      • eddie47d

        Nadzieja seems to have bought into the sleaze talk line hook and sinker.

    • flipped54

      Yes John, there will be a worldwide Kingdom and it will be ruled by Jehovah God and His Son. The present “System of Things” will cease to exist when this happens. Study His Word and we will be able to identify the signs and events leading to the culmination of His Kingdom.

  • Melody

    I also would add… government seems eager to get their greedy hands on the profits from successful businesses and want to be worship that they ” allowed” you to be successful… which is a crock…. but then with that viewpoint… shouldn’t government then be blamed for when your business doesn’t succeed??? Then that is the governments fault????? How come they don’t take the blame for everytime a business goes under???? Don’t exactly hear the government stepping up to take the blame!!!! Can;t have it both ways….. but then again these are stupid liberal socialist…this is what they do…. they don’t know how to do anything else…. trashy people.

  • bobgood1

    I have noticed, in the last few years that the Left-Winged Liberals quote Obama’s talking Points word for word like a flock of Mocking Birds. It’s like Liberals have no original speech of their owm. Someone in an earlier post says it won’t make any differance which candidate. One World Order group is directing OB’s policies & plans. He is surrounded by Communists, marxists, Muslim radicals in Key Gov. jobs. Progressives have taken over the DNC and is trying to infiltrate the RNC. Obama doesn’t understand the American people. He and his handlers are trying to create European Socialism here in this country. As his recent statement, trying to convince us that we need Big Gov. and can’t exist without it, is falling on deaf ears for the most part. We aren’t all gullible or sheep. Some Groups in this country have never been Patriotic. There may come a time when you choose Freedom or Socialist domination by Government. One thing for sure, Romney is not a Communist.

    • Elaine

      And he is definitely a citizen and who he claims to be. We know who he is and what he’s done. He’s not my first choice, but neither do I think he’s under the thumb of Soros and others like him who are trying to make us into a slave / Marxist / Socialist / Communist people.

  • Don

    King odumbo is a mad dog, what do you do with a mad dog ?

  • Howard Roark

    To save the Nation we must concentrate on wealth producing jobs. (not all jobs produce wealth)Real wealth is created in three basic ways. 1. Farming (includes agriculture and aqua culture) 2. Mining (incluides oil abd natural gas) and 3. Manufacturing.

    The miner gets paid and buys a house (wealth producing) gets a haircut (not wealth producing) etc. You see trickle down economics has been working well throughout the history of man.

    Lets look at Nevada. we have all three wealth producing activities here. the State produces enough real wealth so that our citizens can live our lives, plus pay all of our various taxes. (city, county, state and federal) Now lets look at the federal Govt. All around the country you have Military bases.military shipyards, depos etc. these activities do not produce wealth. they are in fact liabilities. Now lets look at the District of Columbia (ten miles square) their major product is Politicians and Government workers, both liabilities. They could make money by charging to see the various monuments. (monuments they would not have if the States did not srnd the money to build them

    Governments do not produce wealth. they never have and they never will. Governments consume wealth. How many times have you heard one of the clowns from the Fed. Govt. say how the Fed. Govt is going to help someone. The truth is that they can not even help themselves say nothing about helping someone else. the truth is that Government can not help anyone because they do not have anything. the only way the Govt can help a citizen is to steal the mony from another citizen.

    If the States stopped sending money to the Federal Government the Fed. Govt. would dry up and blow away.The States can exist without the Fed. Govt. but the Fed Govt. can not exist without the States.

    • charlie

      Mr. Roark has a good understanding of the subject that government cannot and does not help people. PEOPLE HELP PEOPLE! I am dumbfounded by the ignorance of the American electorate that believes that government is the provider for people. Obama is waging a good campaign that is telling these “dumbed down” folks that it is government that makes America a success, not the rich who make the investments, provide the jobs by which the economy is made strong. It has been said countless times: “I never had a job working for a poor man”. Government if we permit it, will leave us all poor, and totally dependent on government. That philosophy is pure Marxism.

      I have known for a long time that there was two major obstacles to a Marxist style takeover of America. The first is that religion is what made America what she is. I don’t care if that is denied, even by those who are supposedly on the right. It is a fact. Read and learn our national history. Secondly, we still have the right to “keep and bear arms”. That means that we can still resist any, MAY GOD FORBID, any military encroachment on our freedoms. Our religious faith is being constantly attacked, and our gun rights are under seige. Remove these two, and you will be kissing America good bye!

    • http://Aol Ken Bennett

      I’m sick and tired of all the have nots complaining about the rich. They need to turn off the TV and get up off of their lazy ass and work as hard as the rich and see if they can surpass them.

      Also, How poor is O’bummer and how much tax has he paid? The jerk has never had a real job.

      • Kent

        I LOVE IT Google Barry Santos
        The muslim anti american Hitler

        • macgyver1948

          Kent… You have no idea what real evil is in a Hitler but I bet the Koch family knows and they are using it here in their new ways with all kinds of TEA.

          For you to call Obama a Hitler clearly shows you are a little know-nothing who drives himself on temper tantrums and hate. Have a cup of TEA and relax…

    • David

      Greats words. Truth all the way. We need to put this kind of thinking into the schools.

      • macgyver1948

        David. “To save the Nation we must concentrate on wealth producing jobs. (not all jobs produce wealth) “. You like that and the rest and I do too but we should be realistic and address what is.

        People need enough wages so they can afford the house and the hair cuts. There will be not much spending if people have very little disposable money because what they do have will go toward living. It is a fact that minimum wage jobs are life struggling entities, unless you are living off of mommy and/or daddy as well. People should do the minimum wage thing while working toward bettering themselves because not many will help us with that unless we are trying. When I went to college I worked for a bank as a lousy wage earner but I had goals. Yeah right, good for me and who cares but me?

        Now from the execs point of view concerning low paying jobs and minimum wage. This is not my opinion because I worked with execs of some very large corporations as well as some small corporations in my time.

        Payroll is in fact an expense. Payroll is the easiest expense to control. Execs’ main goals are to increase the bottom line and keep expenses down along with protecting the Corporations reputation. In other words, put as much money at the top as they can and keep it there along with having the public love them. It is all for the benefit and protection of the corporation.

        In order for execs to continue their huge salaries and bonuses and perks they must do the above so the huge corporate investors and their boards are happy. If the execs do not keep their bosses happy their contract renewals may never come. So jobs are created and waged only as needed to accomplish the Exec goals.

        Questions. Where is the incentive for execs to create jobs when they really can? Which political party seems to be protecting what execs want more than the other party?

    • Kent

      Are you backing a Prrsident that is who you think he is?
      Google Barry Santos Barack Obama and see what you get. Then convince me that all of that is correct.

    • Abraham Douglas

      if the gov is not producing wealthy people why are sooo many of you sooo rich, why not
      quit your job and let some poor person have a job. the very people that try to control our live’s and keep us poor are getting rich of the same gov. that they hate!!!
      you are owed nothing!!! you are getting rich by keeping others poor and dependent.

    • Stan Heitbrink

      This country can only be put back together the way it was originally created. God, Bullets, citizens willing to die for what they believe in, and willing to lose everything if necessary for true freedom; as well as taking the taxing reins off big business; which creates small businesses. Looks kinda hopeless, doesn’t it ?

    • Bill Fox

      Wealth is an illusion. All things belong to the next generation, even the molecules that make us up. We determine how this wealth is passed. Wealth is finite. There are only so many molecules available on the planet. We determine how they are distributed. Historically, the very view have possessed the most wealth, but a great many have had very satisfactory lives with what they received. As the population of the earth increases and we waste more and more resources on things that deprive the least able of the basics of food, water, clothing, shelter, and good health, then collectively, we suffer physically, as well as spiritually. I choose to share my resourses because I am blessed. I do not have the right to force others to share their resources. I do not envy the rich. I may want some of the things they have, but all I want is the honest opportunity to earn it. The wealthy do not owe me anything. I am not really a conservative, and I certainly am not a liberal. Collectively we have to solve the issue of how the wealth will be distributed: voluntarily or through force. To the best of my ability, I choose voluntarily. You must choose, because, one way or the other, the basic needs will be satisfied.

    • Boib Moore

      At last someone spoke the truth. The government (and politicians) are parasites that live off of productive efferts of the private sector. Politico’s are not public servants but leaches
      who vote themselves more salary than most of the people they represent. Because we have put up with it, I guess we get what we deserve!

    • Marti Zettel Thelma

      Obama does not owe us!
      Without control by a government, big companies abuse the rights of employees, or as in the case over the past twenty years and more, kicked American employees off of their payrolls, and placed their companies overseas for cheap labor and still keeps the cost of the products at a high rate of return for themselves. How sad that the nation of fools exist that think other wise!

      • macgyver1948

        Marti Zettel Thelma… Obama owes those who voted him in and are supporting him and he would say that too. You are so right about corporations though and the Founders screamed about corporate influence and their power over Government if left unchecked. The Founders feared Corporations. The Founders spoke of “Separation Of Corporation and State” but I think they might have left that up to the states and I also believe that was a mistake. Here is one of my favorite quotes but there are so many speeches and letters by the Founders concerning the corporate menace.

        “I hope we shall crush in its birth the aristocracy of our monied corporations which dare already to challenge our government to a trial by strength, and bid defiance to the laws of our country.” – Thomas Jefferson

        “This corruption we speak of comes from corporate greed and the eagerness of many of our politicians to take corporate money in order to support them”. Macgyver1948 – :-))).

        That was fun.

    • SJJolly

      ” All around the country you have Military bases.military shipyards, depos etc. these activities do not produce wealth. they are in fact liabilities.” The same can be said about police stations and fire stations, schools, hospitals, banks, air traffic control terminals, etc., etc. They don’t produce wealth, as Mr. Roark so narrowly defines it, no. But, without them, the wealth producers would have to perform the functions themselves, or be severely handycapped doing without. I.e., without police business would have to maintain an armed security force or pay protection money; without a national military, business would be open to seizure by foreign invaders (ala the American Indian experience).

    • B Lank

      You are out-of-your-mind nuts (literally) to even say the states can do just fine without the federal government, let alone promote it. To ignore history is just plain stupid and idiotic. Jeez!

    • afdbghq

      How very true. The only money the government has is what it takes from the citizens. I get so angry when I hear someone say it the governments money. There was one government program that actually paid for itself. That was the space program. This program returned two dollars for every dollar spent because of all the innovations invented and developed to support the space program. Computers, microwave ovens, VCRs, are just a small example of technology developed from the space program and converted to civilian use. People bought these items which generated taxes. Companies were begun to produce the technology which hired people who received a paycheck and paid taxes on their earnings. Stores who sold the items had to hire additional people with knowledge of the new technology to sell the items. They got paid and as a result paid taxes. The list of companies that either expanded or were created is extensive.

      The bottom line was that many companies were started which required hiring workers which resulted in other companies being expanded or started. So what was the only federal program this president gutted? The space program.

      Yes, federal tax dollars are spent on the program, but as a result much of the technology and knowledge gained is translated into civilian use and sold to the public thus expanding the tax base and as a result garners increased base which pays taxes.

      • macgyver1948

        afdbghq…. You said “I get so angry when I hear someone say it the governments money”. I do not get angry about it because it is so laughable. I remember a talk show in the 90s where the subject was Welfare on some level. Many were complaining about the many who did not deserve welfare either at all or past a certain point. One (silly) woman stood up and said something like “I do not know why so many here are hating the giving of welfare money since it isn’t your money, it is the Government’s”. Well, I fell of the couch when I heard her say that. WOW was she jumped all over for being stupid.

        I think a point to welfare should include education and how it is used and managed. We really need a welfare program for those who really need and deserve it but we must get rid of all welfare fraud at all levels. I feel we need it because we should be compassionate but not suckers. We should not be as apathetic as some in government are in order to support whom they are supporting to save their puppet masters the money.

        The space program is a great program for so many reasons as you say and it needs to be supported for our futures.

    • truesoy

      Howard Roark;

      Stop for a minute and read your comment, again.
      “If the States stop sending money to the Federal Gocernment the Fedral Government would dry up and blow away”
      Good. Now lets see what happens then, Skippy.
      a) the States will become ‘independent nations with a central governmentthat you and everyone else in the State will have to pay TAXES to support. In essence what you would have done is reduce it to State size. And now pitty the red States like Mississippi with a non-sufficient production to stand financially on its own. And that is not the only State that depends on the federal government.
      The irony in what you, conservatives want to do, is that the most liberal states like California would be able to stand on its own.
      Any other bright ideas there, Mr. h. Roark?.


    • Bruce Sutton

      Who stole my line? I’ve been saying that for almost 2 years. The states should control the federal spending by each state deciding how much to remit to the feds and the feds have to make do with what they get and NO more.

    • Jurgy

      The Federal Government was created for only two purposes – the common defense of the states, and to facilitate commerce between the states. Everything else was left to the states – laws, education, tax collection and spending, etc etc etc. Nowadays, the Federal Government should still have only 2 purposes – the common defense (not war), and to facilitate a common infrastructure (commerce, transportation, communications, power, water) – stuff that is for the common good of all the states. The Federal Gov’t was never charted to do any of the other stuff it does today (like mess with the economy) – and the only reason it does “the other stuff” is because of the Congress, whose members act in their own self-interest. And it is our fault for allowing our elected officials to use and abuse the power we grant them.

      • truesoy


        The Federal Government was not found, as you assume, with such limited scope for if you read our Constitution you will finde such thins as the ‘necessary clause’ and also things like to provide for ‘the general welfare’. Also you should be interested to know that at the beginning of our nation there was a Federal Government property TAX. Also there was a whiskey tax, etc.
        Just food for thought….


    • Mrs Smoak

      A real job if they say your fired,No birth certificate A for real one,you can’t or I should say use to,you can’t even marry,work etc. Many ETC.! he is a want a be dictator We don’t need more government! They would be in debt with a lemon aid stand,Oh I don’t doubt there honestly Extremely gun laws,because then only criminals would get them,jobs sure they care so much what a joke.
      And health care his,oh yes spread the wealth,IF he AND OTHERS CARE SO MUCH,WHY DO THEY EVEN TAKE PAY? ITS NOT A POOR MAN THAT WOULD EVER HAVE A CHANCE AT ANY TITLE IN government! PRAYER out This country was built on Gods Word.And God is in full control not any human!Other countries someone found there,they kill us,& this what use to be America is not america? Supreme court,put in there 4 life should not be! IN GOD WE TRUST NOT Man!

    •;; Enternaught

      Let’s use an alternative approach. EXAMPLE: If a child gets rotten teeth from eating candy, what do you do ? Instead of taking the kid to the dentist, & treating the symptom, TAKE AWAY THE CAUSE – ” the C A N D Y “…??
      Referring to OUR MONEY = Candy / the rotten teeth are the Federal Agencies, & the government is the child.
      How about this “PARENTAL APPROACH” ?
      Demand your employer allow you to change your W-4 status. Change it to EXEMPT ! STOP PAYING THESE TAXES (?) created by the Federal Reserve & IRS, from GROUND ZERO = Your Paycheck ??? …
      FOR ALMOST 100 YEARS THEY HAVE TOLD US TO DO THIS….why are we listening to them, in regards to this
      If you wanna still pay any taxes after a year- DO IT THEN. You will have had all year to accumulate interest on money you let them take out each week (/month). The whole sysytem was established on Vountary Compliance. IT’S ONLY MANDATORY ONCE YOU’VE SIGNED YOUR NAME !
      ya feel me ? The “ROTTEN TEETH” need to be extracted, NOT FILLED, CAPPED, OR CROWNED,….. to save the child.{ & no, I’m not a dentist ! }

    • http://yahoomail Joseph

      This administration scares me.

  • sugar

    Bravo!! That was the single most brilliant response to obama’s
    ignorant comment I’ve heard yet!

    • Elaine

      On the surface, it does sound good. But that happened 140 years ago, didn’t it?

      Texas even tried getting rid of the TSA. They’ve been bullied into not pursuing that any more, haven’t they? TSA is one of the things I blame W for. I don’t think he came up with the idea or got it started on his own, though. BHO didn’t come up with ObamaCare on his own. It was written too quickly, and no one person could have come up with all of that, which is one reason it is so hard to decipher. There are so many references in it to other passages in it, there is no telling what it will loop back.

      As Pelosi inanely said, “We have to pass it to see what’s in it.”. What’s more inane is that the Congress and Senate bought that lame reasoning. Now the liberals are still saying, just wait until 2013 when we will see what’s in it. Yeah. All government programs and agencies work so well, right?

  • Deerinwater

    “President Obama has it completely backward. Business owners don’t owe credit to government for their success. Government owes us credit for its existence. Government doesn’t enable or empower business owners. We empower government.
    Business owners would do just fine without government. But government, government employees and the “takers” of society (those who take checks from government) could not survive without us: the creators, producers and taxpayers. Simply put, we pay all the bills for government. We’re the ones you ought to be thanking.”

    And Wanye Roots has owned and operated many successful business and actually got tried of counting all that money that he’s retired and graces us with all his insightful wisdom writing for Mr. Livingston is only a passion of love and sense of duty to country.

    Well, I will admit Mr. Root, you have stirred up to pot so well, it’s not really clear what it contains.

    If you are turning over a new leaf and seeking recovery in accounts receivable’s, start with “W” and work your way current.

  • jakob

    Maybe we should shrug?

    • Rogue Elephant

      Which way to Calt’s Gulch?

      • Rogue Elephant

        Sorry – bad eyes and fumble fingers – that’s Galt’s

  • Laura Schlegel (@mondovibe)

    Health Care Law Repeal Efforts By House GOP Cost Nearly $50 Million: CBS Report

  • dcjdavis

    Go on strike and not pay ‘em….I like that!

  • B rian

    This is the exact same arguement I’ve had in this forum previously…. The issue is that someone was in fact willing to actually argue with the point! I don’t have a Phd in economics….. Nor do I have a bachelors degree….. Really it doesn’t matter…. It doesn’t take a high school graduation certificate to understand where the infrastructure comes from…. Or any govt services period…..

    I’ve been reading up on the TSA…. I have yet to read a positive review….. Apearantly every American regardless of political beliefs, believes their constitutional rights are being infiringed.

  • Johnny

    okay let me get this straight, people who started a business started it on their own with NO HELP at all from government. They had all of their start up money on their own because they worked at a job to save to start their business, They didn’t get a grant or low interest LOAN from the government to get started. They built the roads that leads to and from their business to access it to the highway system that THEY built. The government didnt do any of that!!!!. They are able to market their products and services through the internet because THEY created it right, the government had nothing to do with creating the internet. The problem is you only see black and white….I see it working hand in hand….when you talk about this increase, it is going back to where the taxes WERE before George Bush gave all the money away. OH, they have water and expectricity because THEY built the grid and the water lines leading from wherever water can be had to their business. I think you forget all of the things that government actually does because you take it for granted. People would do the things government doesnt do…and then you say THIS

    So why does Obama think we owe him? Sure, we need the things that help our society and economy grow: infrastructure (i.e., roads, bridges, traffic lights, police, fire, garbage, sewers, hospitals, airports, schools) and national defense. Although, much of that could be handled by private enterprise. But Obama misses the crucial point: We (business owners and taxpayers) paid for that with our taxes. We built it! You owe us a debt of gratitude.

    NO ONE is going to spend their OWN money to do these things if they are not profitable. The reason we pay taxes is so someone can build them where profit is not their motive. You want to starve the government of money so it cant do the things we expect it to do and then complain that government is the problem. OBAMA is not spending our money, CONGRESS spends money, OBAMA is not writing checks with our tax money. It is like this EVERY time we have a President….a democratic president. I didnt hear anyone complain about BUSH starting two wars that were not paid for while at the same time cutting taxes which is NEVER done….they usually have a war tax or something along those lines to pay for the extra expenditures that go along with being in conflict

  • Pritty Brains

    Obama never EVER said we owe him!

    He never EVER said, small businesses owe him!

    These are pure-flat-out-unadulterated LIES… and it’s amazing how you all get so soooo frothing at the mouth over these lies and all the others that come from Root’s mouth (or any republican/tea partier with a perverted agenda). Root is a broad-faced-liar and you people lap it up like ravenous dogs. That’s incorrigible and extremely pathetic if it weren’t so dangerous.

    It’s a shame you all have to spread twisted lies so in order to win the game. You just can’t win on honest merits, tis why I loathe republican party and changed my affliliation when I began to see how deceitful, selfish and hate-filled the party genuinely is.

    If anybody owes anyone, it’s Root and you people, and your ridiculous republican/tea party leaders who owe him an apology for the lies you all gleefully spread.

    Obama actually said “The point is, is that when we succeed, we succeed because of our individual initiative, but also because we do things together.”

    Romney, his allies, the republicans, conservatives and Tea Partiers etc etc pounced on the “you didn’t build that” portion and COMPLETELY IGNORED THE REST. Which is par for the course… you all take a portion of anything he says out of context, then twist it up a bit and start spreading the fear mongering lies.

    There’s no question Obama inartfully phrased those two sentences, “If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen,” but it’s clear from the context what the president was talking about. He spoke of government — including government-funded education, infrastructure and research — assisting businesses to make what he called “this unbelievable American system that we have.”

    In summary, he said: “The point is … that when we succeed, we succeed because of our INDIVIDUAL INITIATIVE, but also because we do things TOGETHER.”

    The entire speech of what President Obama actually said:

    OBAMA July 13: “There are a lot of wealthy, successful Americans who agree with me —because they want to give something back. They know they didn’t — look, if you’ve been successful, you didn’t get there on your own. You didn’t get there on your own. I’m always struck by people who think, well, it must be because I was just so smart. There are a lot of smart people out there. It must be because I worked harder than everybody else. Let me tell you something — there are a whole bunch of hardworking people out there.

    “If you were successful, SOMEBODY ALONG THE LINE GAVE YOU SOME HELP. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. SOMEBODY HELPED TO CREATE THIS UNBELIEVABLE AMERICAN SYSTEM that we have that allowed you to thrive. Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen. The Internet didn’t get invented on its own. Government research created the Internet so that all the companies could make money off the Internet.

    “THE POINT IS, IS THAT WHEN WE SUCCEED, WE SUCCEED BECAUSE OF OUR INDIVIDUAL INTIATIVE BUT ALSO BECAUSE WE DO THINGS TOGETHER. There are some things, just like fighting fires, we don’t do on our own. I mean, imagine if everybody had their own fire service. That would be a hard way to organize fighting fires.

    “So we say to ourselves, ever since the founding of this country, you know what, there are some things we do better together. That’s how we funded the GI Bill. That’s how we created the middle class. That’s how we built the Golden Gate Bridge or the Hoover Dam. That’s how we invented the Internet. That’s how we sent a man to the moon. WE RISE OR FALL TOGETHER AS ONE NATION AND AS ONE PEOPLE, and that’s the reason I’m running for President — because I still believe in that idea. YOU’RE NOT ON YOUR OWN, WE’RE IN THIS TOGETHER.”

    Click on the below links, I dare you. But I bet you won’t because then you’ll have to deal with the lies you believed from your deceitful, feral leaders and the lies you went around telling others without fact checking yourselves. Then again, that is ONLY if you all have any kind of redeemable conscious.

    Unbelievable that you all can’t research the truth for yourselves, but rely on the lies told by your republican leaders. The truth is out there… it’s not considered ‘cheating’ to educate yourselves.

    Rise up, wipe the froth off your mouths, and try it sometime.

    Let’s look at some of the other smelly horse caca Root is spewing:

    ROOT: “Denise Rich could be one of the top five Democratic contributors in America over the past 20 years. She is best friends with the Clintons. Yet she renounced her citizenship just days ago. She, too, refuses to pay the massive Obama taxes on the way.”

    *rolls my eyes*

    I suppose Root conveniently forgot that Clinton recently ENTHUSIASTICALLY endorsed Obama and will be the key speaker at the Democratic National Convention coming up…

    Said Michael Heidt, a lawyer in Hollywood, Florida, who represented her in a recent lawsuit, Rich had dumped her U.S. passport “so that she can be closer to her family and to Peter Cervinka, her long-time partner.” Rich’s two daughters live in London; Cervinka, a wealthy property developer, is an Austrian national. Rich plans to make London her main residence and does not intend to acquire other passports, Heidt said.

    However, I will concede she will no longer have to pay US taxes along with the other 1800 recent expatriates… and Root applauds this? The American people staying behind behind with their beloved country will just have to pick up the slack as they have to do when any wealthy person loopholes and off shores their taxes. That Obama is cracking down on this is highly comendable and if these people want to leave, by all means, don’t let the door hit them on their way out. Roll down the red carpet, this country does not need anti-patriots such as these selfish, greedy, useless people. Did I say useless?

    I find it interesting how out of one side of Root’s crooked mouth he claims it’s the taxes that built this country and how out of the otherside of his crooked mouth he extolls the virtures of those who refuse to pay their taxes. What a bloody hypocrite this man is.

    ROOT: “Instead of telling us how much we owe government, the progressive leftists and socialists should be thanking us. Without taxpayers (especially high-income business owners), you wouldn’t be able to build roads, bridges, highways, schools or airports. Your infrastructure exists because of our hard work. Your schools exist because of rich business owners who pay huge property tax bills. Your Social Security, Medicare, welfare, food stamps and unemployment insurance exist because of business owners paying into the system.”

    Again, I point out: OBAMA NEVER SAID ANYTHING WHATSOEVER ABOUT THE PEOPLE OWING HIM OR THE GOVERNMENT. This is a complete fabrication on Root’s part. That it was allowed to be published is a slanderous travesty.

    So if the Almighty Business Owners and their taxes provided all there is in this country, why when anything goes wrong with any of it, from the lousy infrastructure, the lousy pay for our teachers, firefighters, police, the Chinese provided steel for the bridges etc etc etc etc etc do you all blame Obama? You can’t have it both ways.

    If the Almighty Business Owners are the ones who created this country, if the Almighty Business Owners are the ones who built this country from the ground up, if the Almighty Business Owners provided SS, Medicare, welfare, foodstamps, umemployment insurance, etc etc etc then why is the government/Obama blamed for everything that goes wrong? I reiterate, you can’t have it both ways.

    If the Almighty Business Owners built the bridges and they fall, it’s the fault of the Almighty Business Owners . If the Almighty Business Owners pay the teachers’ lousy salaries, and don’t repair the crumbling schools, the lousy education is the fault of the Almighty Business Owners. If the garbage piles up, it’s the fault of the Almighty Business Owners.

    So, the next time the cops take an hour to arrive after your windows were shot out; your loved one dies before the ambulance gets there; the next time your kid brings home a failing report card; the next time you ride over a pot hole to hell, blame your Almighty Business Owners.

    Again, I recapitulate, you cannot have it both ways. Like Obama actually pointed out, we’re ALL in this together: The people, the business owners and the government.

    • Linda Turner

      Pritty Brains–you nailed it. I was about to jump into this fray and den of iiars and deniers when I read your post and thought, “She’s said it for me.” When you can only “win” an argument when you distort your opponent’s position, you really have nothing to offer to the conversation. The short-sightedness of Republicans (mostly old white men) isn’t a thought-out position. That’s why they can be manipulated so easily. It’s a gut anger over having a black man in the white house, and their fear over America becoming a majority minority nation–which it will soon be. That’s why they want to control the government and change the rules before more people get wise to their tricks. Thanks again for your post, Pritty!

      • Elaine

        Linda Turner says:
        August 2, 2012 at 11:59 am

        It’s a gut anger over having a black man in the white house, and their fear over America becoming a majority minority nation–which it will soon be.

        There goes the race card again. Those who play it are the racists.

        I would have loved to have seen Powell run for President. There are others I would liked to have seen get the nomination who actually did try to run.

        But they (Powell and others) were real and not figments of a biographer or speech writer or the MSM. They also weren’t puppets for the socialist who do want to take over our country.

        BHO talks like he’s part of the solution, but he’s part of the problem and not on the side of middle class America or the poor at all. He never has been.

        And to me, his true sadistic nature was shown when the planes went through the streets of NYC just after he was elected to “take needed pictures of that city”. With satellites able to do that from thousands of miles away?!! I can see satellite pictures of my house on the internet by just putting my address in a required field.

        And as Commander-In-Chief, how would the Coast Guard fiasco on 9-11-2009 not fall under his responsibility? If he truly didn’t know what was going on, somebody should have apologized or taken responsibility, but nobody did so I’m not sure he didn’t know about it.

        Just so much going on where he either should take responsibility or sticks his nose in when he shouldn’t.

      • Deerinwater

        “There goes the race card again. Those who play it are the racists.”

        Hmm? ~ well Elaine , you can deny it until until the snow-caps peaks of Kilimanjaro melts but no other motive for such blatant disregard for the merits of truth explain these rabid attacks directed to a single person.

        Looks like you have got maybe 20 years

      • Deerinwater

        Elanie; You really are not fooling anyone, Powell is a conservative republican and a very good one in my book. He will say what must be said to represent the truth regardless who it hurts or helps but he would not run for office as a republican much less a democrat for the simple reason he is not one, while fashion and political convenience offers little appeal to person(s) of such caliber of character.

        And you need to read your supporting link before you offer it. As your link fails to support you’re opinion of Obama.

        “The training exercise was run of the mill, the Coast Guard said in a hastily called news conference – but it was conducted with no advance word to the White House, the Secret Service, the media or other law enforcement agencies.

        Now why you want to demonize Obama is perhaps “fashionable” as we find even Military officers doing much the same thing. ( or do I need to offer you a history lesson) I will concede that it’s your business and you can do as you wish. But to use this behavior by others as some kind of support for your behavior is the kind of thinking that is drain this nation dry. We are circling the drain sister.

        Why not accept the responsibility for your own thinking and actions and be a single voice rather then give in to “fashion” like some member of a rabid lynch mob?

        You watch too much television Elaine, learn to read your “Current Events” ~ It takes less time, no or few commercials and any “spin” is more apparent. Read of the same event from several sources, ask questions, look up your answers, dig for the truth.

    • Elaine

      Chester says:
      August 2, 2012 at 9:58 am

      Don’t HAVE to call him anything, as he does enough of that without MY help. Before he says another word, I want him to swear on the stack of bibles he wants me to use that he will never again use a government supplied commodity or resource.

      People on welfare and illegals use those same roads and systems.

      And actually, roads and bridges were built before the government decided to take them over. There were committees in the different areas who took that on.

      Even in rural America, neighbors bind together to put new gravel on the roads in the spring that they pay for as a group just as it was done in the 1700s and even into the 1800s. I know this to be true on my in-laws’ Bi-Centennial Century farm in MO. I also know that some years they were paid to plant certain crops and not plant certain crops in the same year on the same acreage decades ago. That’s probably still going on, except big corporate farms are probably benefiting now.

      As far as screaming to the bureaucracies to get things fixed, they would probably be fined or thrown in jail if they did try to fix them themselves.

    • tlgeer

      PB, from most of what I’ve read, the majority of posters, and authors, on this site prefer the rumors and lies to the truth. One person even posts things off of, which is completely radical.

      When we point out facts, real facts, we are called names and told that we don’t understand what is happening. We do understand what is happening, we just don’t agree with them, and we use facts to point out where they are wrong. If that makes us liberals (WHEN did this become a negative word? George Orwell anyone?), then so be it. At least we are able to do our own research when we make a statement, rather than just tell people to look it up if we pull random facts out of the ether.

      • macgyver1948

        tigger… you are so right as many on this site are reactionary to only what they are told to believe. The insults and name calling is in place of intelligence. No one has to agree with us but their way is one reason a mature and intelligent person might not want to TEA or GOP themselves.

  • SJJolly

    “Business owners would do just fine without government. ” There are a bunch of business owners who do without some government services — the illegal drug rings. It they have a dispute with customers, suppliers, or other drug rings, they can’t take it to court, so they call out their gunmen and take it to the streets. But, even they rely on government to provide streets, airports, banks, fire protection, utilities, health inspections of local food shops, etc., not to forget keeping foreign countries from comming in and taking over. Any business owner who had to provide all those services him or her self would have very little time to operate the business!

  • Elaine

    Johnny says:
    August 2, 2012 at 11:18 am
    George Bush gave all the money away

    That’s rich. Tell me who hasn’t done that? Clinton certainly did that. So has BHO. Tell me who creates a multi – billion dollar stimulus without putting some kind of requirement on it? (Probably someone who wants to funnel a lot of it into his own accounts off-shore as well as those of his supporters, friends, and family.)

    Look at Solyndra. Bush had passed on that company because they weren’t solvent enough. Look at all of the other green companies BHO has contributed to who have been insolvent, meanwhile capping our actual wealth producing resources like oil and coal. Take over the infra-structure, Socialist Economics 101. (Or is it 102 with healthcare being 101?)

    • Pritty Brains

      No, Elaine, Bush passed on Solyndra because he’s into BIG OIL. If Solyndra survived along with other Green Energy businesses, Big Oil would shrink and god forbid should that ever happen while any Bush is alive. Bush is about padding his pockets and the pockets of his upper crusty 1% buddies, to hell with the earth or the country… They’re growing old and decrepit and are not going to be here and reap the sorry repercussions of their polluting, their days are numbered… They don’t care and that’s the bottom line.

      Obama, on the other hand does care and is thinking about the furture, even when he is not here to reap it. He is about trying to replace toxic, dirty polluting energy (coal, oil etc) with energy that is not toxic and polluting to the earth… Yes, it’s gonna take a few strike outs, yes, there will be some failures, of course! That’s to be expected when anything new is being developed. How many rockets exploded before the first one flew straight? How many automobiles failed before the first one was deemed road worthy? How many vaccines killed before any prevented diseases?

      You all deliberately try to make Obama sound like a bloody crook in his searches for green technology. If you’d work with him, we might actually get somewhere, clean this polluted country up, stop destroying the land in the quest to mine for coal, stop having to rely on other countries for toxic energy producing oil. Be the first in the world to do this.

      But noooooo, you all prefer to be part of the polluted problem.

      • Pathfinder

        Love your comment … “he searches for green technology”. He is like a gambler throwing money on a roulette wheel. Obama, the community organizer and Acorn patsy, is searching because he is LOST

      • Elaine

        Pritty Brains says:
        August 2, 2012 at 12:44 pm

        long with other Green Energy businesses, Big Oil would shrink and god forbid should that ever happen while any Bush is alive.
        While I respect your viewpoints, I do have to wonder about your sense of priorities in capitalization even and remark about how you don’t capitalize the one word in this sentence that should have been. The word “God” is always capitalized unless referring to a non-deity, which may have been your actual intent.

        Now, as far as to the caring of BHO, he “cared” with public money. That’s easy to be a concerned and caring person in those circumstances. Also, the owners of Solyndra were some of his largest contributors, so – deep pockets here, too.

        I think GWB was also too entrenched in the oil business, too, so I don’t blame you for your thoughts there, but oil is a natural resource that we do actually need, as proven by the continued importation from other countries. Why import from other countries and block our own resources of it? Is that not insane and stupid at the same time? The same thing with coal and water.

        All of our natural resources being sabotaged by BHO and this administration.

        Yes, we do need to be less dependent of those resources, but not sabotage the utilities and other industries before we are. Have you noticed all the blackouts this year due to the trouble the electric companies alone being forced to face in the wake of the resource problems? And this is only the beginning unless the restraints on them are halted.

  • pete

    It would appear that Obama is making a critical mistake, he’s underestimating his opponents, the American people. Myself, as well as many people,are asking the question, “am I better off today than 3+ years ago?” Most know the reality. Let’s go in the right direction……it is time for a change, don’t water down the vote with other candidates….nail it, with Romney.

    • boyscout

      LOL. You crack me up.

    • tlgeer

      WE THE PEOPLE are the ones that elected Obama, by quite a large margin. From everything that I’ve been seeing, he will be re-elected. What about this makes Obama our enemy?

  • truesoy

    Allyn Root;

    Why is hypocrisy becoming a repulican trademark?
    To find out the answer we don’t have to travel far; we just click on one on the many ‘conservative’ blogs and you can see ‘hypocrit written all over.
    And just like Romney decries the enactment of the health care law, once upon a time he was for it at the national level, and so was Newt, and so was the Heritage Oundation in th 1980′s, and Just like oBama said that no one does everthing 100% without some input from someone else, and/ or by the collective financial effort of society, so Mitt Romney said the same a few weeks earlier before Obama did. And whre was the outcry, then? Exactly, I think I’ve made my point and therefore I rest my case.


    • MAP

      A liberal accuses conservatives of being hypocrites. That’s rich coming from the very definition of hypocrisy!! Har! Romney is NOT a conservative, not that this fact will mean one thing to your liberal, lost-in-space mind.

      • Pritty Brains

        Doesn’t matter what you claim Romney is or isn’t, MAP, the fact remains he is a republican and the conservatives, the republicans, the tea baggers support him financially, in the media and on blogs like this one. Therefore it is logical to say Romney is a conservative, embraces conservative values, even if he can’t get his point across in an organized, coherent manner.

      • MAP

        Biddie Brains, the Republican Party is not, nor has it ever been, a conservative party. Conservatives have no party. If you knew anything about what defines conservatism, you would know this.

      • truesoy


        Look around you. Most of every benefit you enjoy is a product of liberal ideas. Yes map, you are the typical head in the sand conservative for you fight for conservative causes while enjoying the fruits of liberalism.
        And that is the problem, because conservatives believe in things they don’t understand.
        Now take your medicines……… and relax…..!


      • Pritty Brains

        Liberalism is a broad political ideology or worldview founded on the ideas of liberty and equality. Liberals espouse a wide array of views depending on their understanding of these principles, but generally liberals support ideas such as capitalism (either regulated or not), constitutionalism, liberal democracy, free and fair elections, human rights and the free exercise of religion.

        Liberalism first became a powerful force in the Age of Enlightenment, rejecting several foundational assumptions that dominated most earlier theories of government, such as nobility, established religion, absolute monarchy, and the Divine Right of Kings. The early liberal thinker John Locke, who is often credited for the creation of liberalism as a distinct philosophical tradition, employed the concept of natural rights and the social contract to argue that the rule of law should replace absolutism in government, that rulers were subject to the consent of the governed, and that private individuals had a fundamental right to life, liberty, and property. (Wiki)

        See, MAP? TrueSoy is right… you most definitely enjoy liberalism in your life… so don’t knock it.

        • macgyver1948

          Pritty Brains. A fair assessment of Liberalism but you box it in to much. We libs are mostly individuals who see issues and try not to conform to the party rule. I disagree with the Dems now and then, for example. I also believe law should be blind as to who is committing it and law must serve the better good of society. No one, not even the POTUS, is above the law so he/she shouldn’t be able to break the law and get away with it. Any politician who breaks Constitutional and federal law, even those who when asked if they “did it” say “I have in the past but I haven’t in a long time” show should never be allowed to run for public office. I am speaking of Romney but that is another story that should be brought up often until the election but I will say he proves he is against “Freedom Of Religion” unless it conforms to his religious beliefs. We cannot have a man like that as anything.

          You also said “…and that private individuals had a fundamental right to life, liberty, and property”. You left out the pursuit of happiness. I bring that up not to criticize because it is important and I have enjoyed that part of the our heritage as much as the rest. I also do not want hand outs and welfare and Charity, except to give, unlike how many UN-knowing right wing conservatives have accused us liberals.

          I also enjoy my first Amendment rights so I can say how much I feel Romney is a far right wing big corporate puppet who will bring back the Bush tax cuts and that is so evident in how he shows his proposed Romney tax plan. We, the middle class, will be further BAINed with Romney if he is elected.

          How is that for Liberalism?

      • Jay

        pritty brains says: the fact remains he is a republican and the conservatives, the republicans, the tea baggers support him financially, in the media and on blogs like this one.

        Wrong, pretty brains, obama – his campaign contributors are almost a carbon copy of Mitt’s. Goldman Sachs, JP Morgan, Citigroup, Morgan Stanley, USB and many of the same players donated heavily to Obama’s campaign in 2008.

        It should be obvious by now that the dog and pony show known as the “election cycle” in the United States is a musical chairs affair with the same gaggle of bankers and transnational corporations calling the shots.

      • eddie47d

        Your a hoot Maps! Make that a double hoot! So Ronald Reagan and Barry Goldwater weren’t Conservatives because they belonged to the Republican Party?

    • Elaine

      truesoy says:
      August 2, 2012 at 12:12 pm

      Allyn Root;

      Why is hypocrisy becoming a Repulican trademark?

      And just like Romney decries the enactment of the health care law, once upon a time he was for it at the national level, and so was Newt, and so was the Heritage Foundation in th 1980′s,

      That may be so about Romney and Gingrich, but there are different visions for the same thing. That doesn’t mean that what was accepted into law was what they had envisioned.

      It’s not what I want. I wanted Medicare and Medicaid reform. And I would like for people to be able to go to a doctor without the requirement of an ER visit that would pay for several more visits to a clinic to help many people. We spend enough now to cover everyone who’s not covered without a non-medical person deciding on what each person is to have and how much the service will cost, AND without the time lapse that will have to be involved in those non-medical arbitrators deciding on emergency treatments too late. But this is all part of government programs that can’t work right even now, and a bigger bureaucracy that involves many more agencies taking our taxes through at least 21 more taxes is going to improve their abilities?!!!! How naive of those who buy into it?

      • truesoy


        i would much rather have medicare for all, or at least a ‘public option’. Either plan would be better and cheaper but the republican opposition wouldn’t let it be.


      • Jay

        It’s part of the script that republicans play the role of villains, and democrats play the role of champions of the under-dog. But what the script doesn’t reveal, is that they both want the same thing. That’s right, even though Democrats and Republicans may not always agree on taxes, they do appear to want the same things, regardless of their political identity.

        Researchers asked individuals to read a fictitious news article on an “Umbrella Aid Plan”, i.e., a generous welfare plan, and a “Comprehensive Assistance Plan”, i.e., a stringent welfare plan, and indicate which they preferred. The plans were presented as proposed by Democrats in some conditions, and were presented as proposed by Republicans in other conditions.

        Among the researchers’ findings was a very intriguing pattern. Although participants reported that they were not aware their judgments of the plans were influenced by the political party proposing the plans, participants were in fact influenced by such.

        How so? Well, participants preferred the generous welfare plan when the fictitious news story indicated it was proposed by politicians from their preferred party.

        Specifically, the participants in the study who identified as Democrats showed a stronger preference for the generous welfare plan when the news story indicated the plan was proposed by Democrats.

        The participants in the study who identified as Republicans showed a stronger preference for the generous welfare plan when the news story indicated it was proposed by Republicans.

        Participants in the study who identified as Independents showed no preference for the generous welfare plan if proposed by Democrats or Republicans.

        In addition to highlighting the truly impartial nature of Independent’s thinking, results such
        as these suggest that despite their political posturing, Democrats, Republicans, and Independents appear to want the same thing — redistribution of wealth.

    • Pritty Brains

      Of course, MAP has to resort to name calling to get his point across…

      Awwwww… Isn’t he sweet?

      *rolls my eyes*

  • tlgeer

    You didn’t build your businesses by yourself. Your customers helped, the government helped by using the taxes collected to let you be able to transport your items on public highways.

    Your straw man arguments are not compelling. In fact they have very little fact in them.

    This country has charged and collected business taxes since the beginning of our country. You see, our ff knew that a country/government/whatever does not run on the goodness of peoples hearts. They run on money. Our country overthrew the English because they were being charged taxes without being represented. Not that they were charged taxes. That is, thankfully, not the case now. The case now is that you wish to ignore history (and common sense) and try to pay NO taxes. It’s not going to happen.

    In fact, the main reason that we are so deeply in debt is because taxes were lowered to below a functioning level. In other words, we deliberately cut our income to a level, and in such a way, that we no longer have the income to pay our debts. The taxes (income) need to go up in order for this country to survive at all. That is basic economics. That so many people don’t understand this is, to me, mind boggling. In fact it is basic math, if nothing else.

    If you agree to give 4 apples to Sam, but only pick 3 apples in the first place, then you still owe Sam 1 apple. Then deciding to only pick 2 apples just makes the matter worse, because you owe Sam even more apples. That is what is happening right now and it is stupid to do so.

    • The Christian American

      In the beginning there were Customs duties and Federal Excise taxes. They took us to 1910. If the government only did what it is suppose to, those taxes would suffice on a federal level. What the States do is up to the States.

      • truesoy

        The Christian American;

        …and in the beginning there were also whisky tax and federal property taxes; just to let you know.


    • truesoy


      Your argument will never get through their minds. Conservatives have the things they have and enjoy the things they have without knowing how they got there; much like a small child in xmas. He/she will play with his / her toys not knoing how they got it.


      • tlgeer

        I was hoping that reducing it to an elementary school word problem would help clarify it. I guess they are not that bright.

        Truesoy, when I do genealogical research and I am not able to “find” a family in one place, like on a census, I go to the tax tables for that area. I know, for a fact, that there have been business taxes all along. Where are these people getting the insane idea that there hasn’t been? Is it just because they don’t want to believe it?

  • chuckb

    don’t blame barry, he’s really innocent for our predicament in the country. really, give this clown that much credit, he has no idea what’s going on, he’s a broken record. every time he opens his mouth on the teleprompter it’s the same old pitch.
    look no further than the bolshevik party, people like george soros, peter lewis are just a few who pull the strings, barry gives the party members a thrill from the sound of his voice and he sounds really intelligent reading from the teleprompter. he is nothing but a puppet and the the control board is operated by george soros and company.
    go back to the gulf oil spill, do you remember barry acted as though he wasn’t concerned for weeks before the outcry hit him, he didn’t have a clue what was happening. it took pressure from the people in louisiana to wake him up, i still think there was something very fishy about the gulf oil spill, this event triggered a lot of things, energy shortages, prices and future drilling, this along with the market and housing struck a blow to the country, now the bolsheviks want to blame the past administration for many things to get the blame off them, however, as much as they try it still stares them in the face and we are faced with a depression. the un-employment figure is higher this week and we are starting into the fall month’s. the bolsheviks want this country to fail, this is how they get complete control of the people, it worked for the communist in soviet russia, but, like jane fonda said, we can do it better this time. it took seventy years for the soviets to fail and they were lucky, we may never recover.

    the bolsheviks are using class and race warfare to achieve their agenda, that’s why we have the clown in the white house, he has the black vote and most of the would be bolsheviks of the so called democratic party. he controls the mexican vote with amnesty thru exec order, they sell out easily, just offer them something for free. he has many bleeding heart liberal republicans, so i say the outlook is not good for conservatives, i hope i’m wrong.
    the time will come when someone will expose barry soetoro for what he is, his records if any, will eventually come to light and i believe there’s going to be a lot of vey surprised and disappointed people.

    • Pritty Brains

      I find this amusing, on the one side you all call President Obama a socialist and here you’re calling him and his supporters communists. You did look up the meaning of bolshevik before using here, didn’t you, Chuck? As I said in another post, you can’t have it both ways. Obama can’t be a socialist and a communist at the same time. In any case, both are wrong. He is neither socialistic nor is he communistic. If you want to know who the most socialistic president we have had look it up, do your homework, but for the sake of this discussion I’ll go ahead and do your homework for you. The most socialistic president we have had was Nixon.

      As to class and race warfare,that rests solely on the broad and mighty shoulders of the Greedy Old Party. They are the ones who are so bloody /p/i/s/s/e/d/ off that Obama made history as the first black President of the United States. They are the ones who are frothing at the mouth that Obama broke that Good Old White Boy veneer that’s shrouded the White House since old George sat in office in his powdered wig. Go on any blog that includes conservatives and you’ll see the nasty racist name calling, the racist screams . The class warfare *laffs* is a result of the republicans allowing their upper crusty 1% buddies to get away with loopholing and off shoring their taxes, making the lower classes take up the slack and now Obama is trying to put an end to that and again the republicans are screeching in agony at such fairness. The republicans are pitting the 1%ers against the 99%ers.

      As to the Gulf oil spill, I lived in Florida when this happened, St Petersburg, and I know that Obama sent the Coast Guard within a day of this explosion. What more could he do besides further bash British Petroleum? As White House press secretary Robert Gibbs showed the administration’s frustration at a briefing:

      “If jumping up and down and screaming were to fix a hole in the ocean, we’d have done that five or six weeks ago,” Gibbs said.

      “We’d have done that the first night.”

      But this further enhances Obama’s desire to develop green technologies. This isn’t the first time British Petroleum has run into trouble. In 2005, a massive explosion occurred at the company’s Texas City, Texas, refinery, killing 15 workers and injuring 170 others. The company was fined $87 million for negligence. A year later, the company ran into problems again when it was cited for leaking around 4,800 barrels of oil into Alaska’s Prudhoe Bay, due to a corroded stretch of pipeline. The company was warned about the corroded pipe four years earlier but did nothing to fix it — and was fined $20 million for ignoring opportunities to prevent the spill. In fact, the BP spill may already be larger than the Exxon Valdez spill.

      Let’s look at that spill a bit closer:

      The Size of the Spill

      127,000 barrels: Amount of oil BP’s containment cap has collected since its installation on June 5. (Source: Press Association)

      60,000 barrels: The amount of oil believed to be gushing from the spill. That’s twelve times more than the original estimate of 5,000 barrels a day. In all, 60,000 barrels a day means an estimated 2.5 million gallons a day is leaking into the Gulf. (Source: Business Week)

      11,300 miles: The distance around the world the current amount of leaked oil would stretch if it was placed in milk jugs lined up side by side. To quantify, that’s farther than New York to Buenos Aires, Argentina, and back. (Source: New York Times)

      102: The number of school gymnasiums that could theoretically be filled floor-to-ceiling with oil from the Gulf of Mexico oil spill. (Source: New York Times)

      130 miles long and 70 miles wide: Size of the oil slick as of May 17. The slick continues to grow and move. (Source: New Orleans Times Picayune)

      11: Number of workers missing and presumed dead following the BP rig explosion. (Source: Huffington Post)

      Less than 4: The number of hours the millions of barrels of oil that have spilled into the Gulf of Mexico would have powered the U.S. Economy. (Source: NPR)

      The Clean Up:

      436,000 gallons: Number of gallons of dispersant sprayed on the oil spill to break it up. Thus far, around 4 million gallons of oily water have been recovered. (Source: AP)

      50,000 barrels of “heavy mud”: Amount of mud used in BP’s “top kill” method of stopping the flow of leaking oil. The mud is to be forced into the leaking well in order to overcome the oil and stop its flow. This method has been used before but never at the depths of the Gulf of Mexico oil leak. (Source: Guardian)

      The Cost:

      12,000: Number of Louisiana residents who have filed for unemployment since the spill, most of which have come from the southern part of the state most closely impacted by the spill. (Source: Daily Finance)

      $1.6 billion: The confirmed cost of the Gulf oil spill to BP, as of June 14, 2010. (Source: Press Association)

      $5 to $42 million: Range of BP’s estimated fines, per day. On the low end, is the cost based on BP’s conservative estimate of 1,000 barrels a day being lost. On the high end, an estimate of 14,000 barrels a day, which is generally considered a more accurate estimate of the leak. As of May 26, this means that BP could be fined anywhere between $37 million to $1.5 billion. (Source: House of Representatives)

      $75 million: The government-mandated cap on oil company liability. Some representatives are calling for the cap to be lifted and a new $10 billion dollar cap be put in place. (Source: Los Angeles Times)

      $1.5 billion: Amount in insurance claims experts believe the BP spill will cost insurers. (Source: Business Week)

      $62 million: Amount paid out in claims to 26,500 Gulf residents, as of June 14, 2010. (Source: Press Association)

      The Threat to Life:

      400: Number of wildlife species threatened by the spill. Threatened species include sea life such as whales, tuna and shrimp; dozens of species of birds; land animals such as the gray fox and white-tailed deer; and amphibians such as the alligator and the snapping turtle. (Source: New Orleans Times-Picayune)

      At least 30: Species of birds the Audubon Society says are potentially threatened by the oil spill. These include marsh birds, ocean-dwelling birds and migratory songbirds. All reside in “Important Bird Areas,” according to Audubon, designated because of their “essential habitat value.” Among the most vulnerable species is the brown pelican — the state bird of Louisiana — which was only recently removed from the endangered species list. The spill is especially devastating for bird populations because it coincides with the beginning of breeding season. (Source: Audubon Society)

      25 million: Number of birds that traverse the Gulf Coast per day, and which are potentially at risk from the oil spill. According to the LA Times Greenspace Blog, “Late spring is the peak time for neo-tropical songbirds moving from the Yucatan Peninsula to make their first landfall in Louisiana,” and “more than 70% of the country’s waterfowl frequent the gulf’s waters.” (Source: LA Times Greenspace Blog)

      11 million: Number of gallons of oil leaked into Alaska’s Prince William Sound in 1989 by the Exxon Valdez oil leak. It is widely considered the worst oil spill in U.S. history, although a number of larger spills have happened around the world, most notably the 2002 Prestige spill off Spain. (Source: CBS News)

      400: Number of oil projects illegally approved for operation in the Gulf of Mexico under Interior Secretary Ken Salazar. According to the Center for Biological Diversity, the oil surveys and drilling operations threaten marine mammal life in the region. (Source: Center for Biological Diversity)

      Background on the Gulf Oil Spill:

      27: Number of offshore gulf drilling operations approved since the BP spill. Two of those were awarded to BP. (Source: Center for Biological Diversity)

      30 percent: Percent of the nation’s oil production derived from the Gulf of Mexico. (Source: E2 Wire)

      1 billion: Number of gallons of oil spilled into the oceans each year, Gulf of Mexico spill notwithstanding. (Source: Union of Concerned Scientists)

      137.8 billion gallons: Amount of gasoline Americans consumed in 2008, down 3% from 2007. (Source: U.S. Energy Information Administration)

      19.5 million barrels: Amount of oil consumed in the United States per day. (Source: CIA Country Handbook 2008)

      2,300 square miles: Number of miles of historic Louisiana coastal marsh and cypress forest (out of 7,000) that have been compromised due to oil drilling. (Source: Environmental Defense Fund)

      So yes, Obama has been on his toes about this, in trying to develop other sources of energy. And if you all would work with him instead of against him, we’d be further along in the trek for cleaner and less dangerous energy sources and companies like British Petroleum wouldn’t be in our country making such horrific messes. Instead you all focus and blame a single person, the President of your country, for this situation, creating chaos, dissension and more problems.

      I rest my case.

      • Frank

        Actually the bolshevik’s were the party that became the Russian comunist party. You might through your ignorance think that means they could not be socialists however, if you know what socialism is and know the truth about Russia you will know they are the same thing. Russia never was communism by definition (everything owned by all the people for the good of the people), it was State ran socialism (everything owned by the government and apportioned to the people for the good of the government). It might seem like a very fine distinction but the Russian government took everything (stole) from its people and then gave things back to them as they saw fit. In true communism everyone works for everyones needs not for the governments. The governments interferrence with rules and regulations nullified the communism idea. It is the same as saying we (the U.S.) have a free market economy. That is not true because our government has interferred with rules and regulations that hinder, if not cripple, our capitalist economy and destroyed the free market idea.

        • truesoy


          Socialism is an economic system, just like capitalism is an economic system
          No communist system can hae a solcialist economic system because communism destroy the means of production which socialism depends on, thereby killing socialism.
          Some example of socialist nations, are:
          etc, etc, etc, and they are not communist. You understand that, right?.


          • Frank

            Although I might, minimally, agree that communism destroys productivity that is a moot point since Russia was not communism in anything but name. Their socialism is marked by its free school and medicine system, as well as the government owning all foods produced. And I say free with tounge in cheek because only the bare necessities were provide free by the government but that is socialism. As far as communism destroying productivity is concerned that is wrong in theory. IF, humans were alturistic or followed Gods teachings then communists would be very productive. Everyone would work hard to produce as much as they could for the good of the COMMUNity. That is not the case though. Communism could never work because of two things: 1. Humans are not all willing to give their best to help others. 2. Many humans are greedy and want more than their fellow humans, forcing them to want control of resources. These two things are mutually counter productive. The first one reduces the productivity needed for socialism, and the second one forces communism into socialism. Also, while communism has a specific economy (basically Barter system) it is not so much an economic system as a lifestyle / government system, much like a Democracy, Republic or Monarchy.

          • truesoy


            You make an interesting point in that communism will not work because humans are not alturistic nor follow in Gods work, because as I see it what you just said is more prevalent among the most christians. They’ll demand that others do as much or else they are undeserving, no matter whats the circunstances and thus the justification not to do for others, in other words the perennial question of , what’s in it for me. All because we are greedy.
            On the other hand, Russia was a communist country as defined for what we know it to be a political system and certainly it was not socialist, otherwise we would have to consider Europe as a whole to be communist, and so Israel too, because they happen to be ‘socialists’.
            About you assertion on humanity not willing to give their best to help others leaves us with a sad prognosis for the future of the human specie.


          • Frank

            I think there are many on this blog site who will understand me when I give this next example to refute your uninformed opinion. Calling Russia communism is the same as calling the United States a democracy. We are a Republic which is very different than a democracy. Russia (who formed the United Soviet SOCIALIST Republic USSR) was a Totalitarian Dictatorship that instituted Socialist programs for its citizens. If you have any Russian, Ukrainian, Bellarus citizens you can speak with ask them what type of government / economy they had. And, if you are having a problem with understanding what true communism is I suggest you do some research. Communism is closer to a republic in its governing than what a totalitarian government is. It is a governing councel of the members of the commune that helps to coordinate allocations of the things the commune produce. It does not make laws that make its member incur the death penalty for. Russia outlawed GOD, made it a death sentence to worship. Stalin killed more Russians than died in WWII. They called it the stalin terror when over 9 million were killed.

          • truesoy


            The old Soviet Union did not outlaw God, that is the self-serving victimhood that the christian church always like to play. What communist governments do is indoctrinate its citizens from an early age not to believe in God, and to also ‘infiltrates’ the ranks of the church to plant the seed of ‘mistrust among the faithful for no one would know for certain who is the government agent and thus they would have to be careful with their spoken words . They teach in some communist societies that Jesus was not a prophet, nor that He was the Son of God, but that he was a ‘communist revolutionary’ that was a threat to the Roman elite and therefore he waas killed.
            Furthermore, you can’t base your opinion of what a country is by its name, or must I remind you that communist Germany called itself the ‘Democratic Republic of East Germany’?.
            Also I know we are not a democracy in the sense of the word, or as you perceive it, but we are a ‘representative republic’, and it is by way of a democratic process of electing our leaders that we accomplish it.


          • Frank

            I am sorry, I forgot that I am talking with someone who believes the truth about propaganda lies. You are correct in saying that the Soviet Union did not outlaw God. However, they did through subterfuge attempt to eliminate the worship of him. Many priests were imprisoned or killed. The reason that the people were afraid of infiltrators is because people who were reported as worshiping God disappeared. Most of those who disappeared never returned as they died in gulags (prison). They were not officially arrested for worshiping God they were subversives that spread lies about the rulers of the Soviet Union. There were many CRIMES that were made up charges piled on religious people. And, you should stop your portrayal of CHRISTIANS as the bad people in this instance since all religions including they Jewish faith (not christian) and followers of Buddha were persecuted. These policies and ideas were present with the Stalin era. I originally learned about the death sentence for believing in God from my Russian friends but, I researched it also and am including a link for you to use.


            Just because the Proletariat said they allowed freedom of religion does not mean they did. Russia made Atheism the official government stance on religion. To believe in God was almost an act of treason to them because you spread anti-Russian views.

            Now, as to the word Socialist in the name of the USSR. The real name in english letters is Soyuz Sovetskikh Sotsialisticheskikh Respublik which comes from the Cyrillic alphabet Союз Советских Социалистических Республик which translates to The Union of Soviet Socialist Republics. I seem to be wandering but in any event both the U. S. and the Soviet Union calls them SOCIALISTS. If you research reliable sources on the internet you will find most if not all say they had socialism in their government.

          • truesoy


            Just because the old Soviet Union called itself a ‘socialist republic’, doen’t make it any more socialist thatn East Germany calling itself the Democratic Republic, makes it a democracy.
            About persecutin christian believers for beliving in God, had it been true the Ortodox Church wouldn’t be around today. What communist do is divide the church congregation in the same manner they devide society where no one trusts anyone. They do this by ‘planting’ government agents within the church, and yes, arresting those in the church that pose a danger, real or imagine, to the regime. Many times this is done by entrapment wherby the ‘the priest’ or a ‘faithful’ from the congregation lures you into what the government considers a form of ‘subversive’ conversation, and then arrest you. Now, if you want to describe this as persecution, fine, but not just for eybeing christian. Poland had strong catholic foundation too.
            See, I don’t have nothing against religion as long as religion keep it real, but I know it is hard for organized christian religion to do so because they don’t have a sense of purpose unless they feel they are being persecuted.
            Ps.- it is helpful for you to understand that we have a secular government, and there is a reason for that.


          • Frank

            You have achieved it finally, I will require negative personal attacks on your IQ. Twisting my words does not help your insane stupid argument. I DID NOT SAY THEY WERE SOCIALISTS BECAUSE OF THE NAME. I said they were socialist by design. Everything they did was from a socialism point of attack. Russia took control of ALL food, industrial, health care and residential aspects of the country. They even controlled who was allowed to attain what educational degrees were available. They acquired (confiscated) all items of wealth from their citizens to force them into state controlled poverty. They acquired (stole) the livestock of the citizens then sold them back the meat. Only the wealthy (members of the communist party) received top line medical care for free. The common citizen got free cold medicine and minimal free dental care. Communism was never a part of their society, it was all socialism. Take everything from the masses and give them back a bare minimum to survive. My Russian friends laugh at me when I say they were lucky to have free medical. They say, yes if you enjoy freedom to die in hospital. Medical care was paid for by the government and their payment was even worse than our medicare. It was so small amount that the health care providers gave small care. If you insist on being devoid of intelligence that is your right. Stating your personal opinions and theories as fact is stupid. I will not label you as liberal because I dont think that stupidity is a trait that defines a person as liberal. I will not accuse you of being an atheist because you have a demented view of Christians. I do however laugh at your pathetic attempt at logic, you obviously either dont have any or you chose to leave it out of your thinking process. What you call the Orthodox church, which is really the Russian Orthodox church is a form of the catholic sect of Christianity. To attempt to state empirically that it would have disappeared because of the Russian persecution of its followers is so wrong it hurts. Did Christianity disappear because of the persecution of the followers of Jesus. Did the Jewish faith disappear because of all the persecution of them? NO!!!!! They kept their religions. The same is true of the Russian Orthodox in Russia, no matter how hard the Soviet Union tried to stop them they kept their FAITH. It survived because they believed in the word of God and the promise of salvation through Jesus Christ.

            You have the right to voice your opinion, it would however be nice if you had some kind of rational process of validating that opinion. I am willing to find and provide sources for my statements about the socialism of the CCCP (USSR). I will be happy to read any and all documents you provide in support of your opinion.

            PS: what does our government being secular have to do with what we are discussing?

          • truesoy


            Socialist governments do not confiscate private property. I’ve been to Europe and I did not witnessed their socialist government confiscating private property. I’ve also met people from Israel, and it does not appear their socialist government is confiscating private property there either.
            Needless to say that I’m at loss with your argument. Are you alright?


          • Frank

            You will not win this argument because my statements are correct and valid for Russia. What they instituted, because of the Marxist theory was State Socialism wherein the state owns the means of production and allocation of goods and services.


            The idea of their form of communism was around the fact that they believed that Socialism was the first stage in the development of communism. Unfortunately they stopped at the point of State Socialism and never progressed into true Communism.

            Your argument about Israel being socialist is valid only in the socialism aspect. Socialism is the centralized ownership of production and the distribution of goods for use in the needs of the population without exchange for profit or gains as in a market system. The ownership does not need, nor is it preferable to be by the state (government), so even though Russia and China have socialist economies they were handled differently as to ownership of production. It is something like the difference in the U. S. and Mexican governments. We are both republics but we are a democratic republic and they are a federalist republic. I won’t go into the staggering differences in them but to say we are the same because we are both republics would be insane. So, if you want an intelligent discussion about Russia’s socialism quit trying to sidetrack the conversation by talking about other countries having socialism that proves something about something I am having trouble understanding..

          • truesoy


            I do agree with the last line in the last paragraph of your post.: you do have trouble understanding!.


          • macgyver1948

            tuesoy… We very much need to have God invited back. I hope it is not to late. But with that in mind, and with so many objecting to the removal of God, whey would anybody want to elect a man to the Oval Office who objects to “Freedom Of Religion” except for how it is approved by his religion? And to force his rituals on others is and should be illegal, both Constitutionally and federally.

            I don’t mean you but for any who enjoys the part of the Constitution which includes guarantees such as “Freedom Of Religion” equally for us all why would any want to vote for Romney?

            When Romney was asked by an interviewer if he ever participated in immoral baptisms, along with outer Mormons, on the dead, primarily dead Jews, his response was “I have but it has been a long time”…

            In another article site when this issue came up one commenter responded with “sdchokers • Bolton, Connecticut • 2 hrs 37 mins agoReport

            sdchokers says… “I’m mormom and participated in baptism for the dead. I felt a little wrong about it because we would baptize many Jewish people and they look at Jesus as a false Messiah. It’s odd to baptize those who have no choice whether they agree with the church or not”. I say he is guilty of violating The US Constitution and Federal laws. Also I say it is not that we have no choice, we very much do, but we go by what God tells us in our bible.

            I wrote this comment because you mentioned religious restrictions within Communism. it is not only the Communists who “indoctrinate its citizens from an early age”.

          • truesoy


            You’ve made a good point. It is not only ‘communism’ that indoctrinate from an early age, the church does it as well. And each religious denomination wants you to believe they are the ‘true’ followers of God, and all others are not.
            It is like the ‘free’ market of faith, and I can see why. It is a question of money for which the church needs a congregation, and the bigger the congregation is, the larger the accumulation of wealth(money).
            Although I believe in God but not in religion because I take with a grain of salt most of what the bible says, if not all, because it all sounds more like story telling to get one to do by fear in the same manner some adults scare children with the non-existent gogeyman to have them do as we tell them to.
            The problem with certain religious groups is that they fail to understandthat the Constitutional guarantee of ‘freedom of religion’ has an inplied guarantee of ‘freedom from religion’ as well.


          • macgyver1948

            tuesoy…. Yep, I do not know any religion or denomination who doesn’t claim they are the “ ‘true’ followers of God, and all others are not”, as you wrote. What would be the point for all the different protestant denominations and the few differences between them and the Catholic Church for their church’s existence if they didn’t claim that?? I always wondered why there were so many and with that application of “us” in them. But it is their right to be who they are, it just isn’t their right to inflict what they believe on others who do not want to be “them” or for any religion to do so.

            I am a huge supporter of “Freedom Of Religion” not only because of the obvious meaning of that but also because it means “Freedom From (your- or any for that matter) Religion”. The Founders were so wise with that and so many people do not understand it.

            For example, The Romney admission in an interview. “Yes, I did that but not in a long time”. I am referring to the Mormon practice of, and other Mormons have talked about their doing it, performing immoral baptisms on dead people, primarily Jews. This is not only highly insulting and disrespectful but it is also against the Constitution and Federal law. Romney belongs in a federal prison for this. This is one of so many reasons I cannot trust Romney.

            An example of another Mormon admission from another web sitre when this was a topic.
            sdchokers • Bolton, Connecticut • 2 hrs 37 mins agoReport

            sdchokers says… “I’m mormom and participated in baptism for the dead. I felt a little wrong about it because we would baptize many Jewish people and they look at Jesus as a false Messiah. It’s odd to baptize those who have no choice whether they agree with the church or not”. I say he is guilty of violating The US Constitution and Federal laws.

            This and other insults and legal violations has to stop but those who are already guilty must go to jail so it can stop but those who think they have morals.

      • DaveH

        I usually don’t bother reading past the first statement of a commenter that is blatantly false unless I have lots of time on my hands.
        In your case that statement was “Obama can’t be a socialist and a communist at the same time”.
        Sure he can. Communism is an extreme form of Socialism where the Government owns not only the means of production but also all property.
        But forget the commonly accepted definition of Socialism, because the root of the word is Social — to make Social, that is, for example, to spread the costs among the citizens (Socialize). So really, although we don’t have pure Socialism where the Government owns everything, we do still have a form of Socialism because there are many Government programs that involve spreading the costs of Government mistakes over the whole population.
        Obama is no doubt a Socialist at heart, by any definition. Just because the realities of Politics keep him from fully expressing his desired policies does not change that.

      • chuckb

        pritty brains, your comment relates to your name.

        your hero did not respond to the oil spill nor did the agency overseeing the gulf oil drilling, remember elizabeth binbaum, head of the mineral management service, the bolsheviks don’t like to talk about her, nor, do they want to revisit this tragedy they have changed names of the mms and try to find info on this woman, they have really done a scrub job on this event.
        i don’t care where you lived or if you were siting on top of the bp platform, your comments are nothing but plain baloney!
        you paste a bunch of statistics that have nothing to do with the conversation. barry and his band of bolsheviks failed all the way around on the clean up, and like i said before i believe it was intentional, they refused help from other countries to recover the oil, they refused the coast guard to set up barriers for the spill. all in all it was a disaster for barry, he either didn’t have a clue or the bolsheviks were waiting for some kind of disaster such as this to alter our oil supply. it took barry and his band of comrades to three weeks to make any effort to stop the spill
        and as far as the term bolshevik, maybe you should look it up, it fits the current democratic party

      • eddie47d

        Be careful Brains for you brought up facts and Liberals aren’t allowed to bring up facts. If we do Conservatives will still deny them for only they have facts.

      • Pritty Brains

        Replying to DaveH:

        Had to reply to myself to be able to reply to you… dunno why some comments have the reply button and some don’t. Yours didn’t.

        Anyway, in response to your comment:

        I don’t usually bother reading anyone who is absurdly arrogant and narrow minded in their approach to discussion and you fit the bill. I had initially decided to write out a thoughtful documented response, but decided to follow your lead and simply say, You’re blatantly wrong.

        Socialism is an economic movement whereas Communism is more political.
        Communism is the distribution of goods and services that takes place according to the individuals needs. Socialism is the distribution of goods and services that takes place according to the individuals efforts.

        Capitalism cannot exist in a communist economy. Capitalism can exist in a socialist economy. Communist economy does not require many people to control the economy.
        Many people can control the economy in the socialist society. In the communist economy, the power is concentrated in the hands of the people centrally. In the socialist economy, the power is mainly in the hands of the workers.

        In a Socialist economy, the means of producing and distributing goods is owned collectively or by a centralized government that often plans and controls the economy. On the other hand, in a communist society, there is no centralized government – there is a collective ownership of property and the organization of labor for the common advantage of all members.

        Etc etc etc etc

        While I do agree there are some small similar aspects between the two, they are miniscule enough that to say the two can exist together cohesively in the same philosophical ideologies or the same political movements is ridiculous.

        And I must point out that you have no idea what Obama is at heart… you don’t bother to take the time to listen to him. You focus only on what your republican leaders tell you. Like *rolls my eyes* Wayne Allyn Root. But so what if Obama is socialist? He wouldn’t be the first president nor the last and at this time in our economic nightmare, some socialistic qualities wouldn’t hurt and could very well help.

      • Deerinwater

        “Frank says:
        August 2, 2012 at 3:05 pm”

        I would suggest only; That you become a student of not world history but early Russian history and only then might we talk in depth of such matters.

    • Elaine

      chuckb says:
      August 2, 2012 at 12:58 pm

      and he sounds really intelligent reading from the teleprompter.
      Unless the prompter techs mess up. Then it becomes so funny!!! :-)

      • Pritty Brains

        This entire republican teleprompter scheme is meant to give the impression that President Barack Obama is a mindless puppet. If that’s true, then every President is a mindless puppet, be it to the teleprompter or their prepared remarks they use on notecards.

        EVERY PRESIDENT has used the teleprompter, god knows Bush should have used it each and every time he spoke. That you republicans have to stoop so low to rely on stupid /s/h/i/t/ like teleprompter usage is quite telling on your characters.

        Keep trying.

        • truesoy


          It must be really, really dumb for the president to use a teleprompter when every republican knows that there is nothing like writing your notes on the ‘palm of your hands’ before any major speech. Now that’s high tech!!!


      • jopa

        Elaine & chuckb;I don’t know if you have noticed lately however the teleprompter is no longer an issue.Ever since Mutt Rummy came on the stage it was discovered that he was totally dysfunctional without a teleprompter.We have all heard his message when there was no teleprompter.I even heard something about a frickin horse that could dance.What would John Wayne say about that one” pardner”.

      • eddie47d

        That’s like Republicans gloating over Flip Flopping a few years ago but now Romney is one of the biggest one of all. What a dilemma for them!

      • Jay

        You people just proved that all, presidents have been/are tele-promter-guided-puppets. Typical dysfunctional-progs, always stating the obvious!

      • tlgeer

        Elaine, EVERY public speaker uses either written notes or a teleprompter. This is not new. There has only been one that wrote the notes on their hand that I know of.

    • truesoy


      I believe you’ve got Bush and Obama mixed up, for if I remember correctly, and I do, Obama acted promptly to the oil spill, and not only that but had BP commit $20 billion to the clean up and for the indemnity of the area; and as you -might not want- to remember, the republicans called this ‘blackmail’, and they even apologized to the oil company.
      Yes, chuckb, there is the ‘tooth fairy’ in ‘chuckbland. Go on, continue to keep that tooth under your pillow and maybe one day……


      • JeffH

        “…if I remember correctly, and I do, Obama acted promptly to the oil spill…”

        “He said he’s been fighting from day one – you decide…”

        This video provides us with a timeline of events that occurred since April 20, 2010 when a fiery explosion on an oil platform in the Gulf of Mexico killed 11 BP platform workers and sent the platform sinking 5,000 feet to the ocean floor. The explosion ruptured n oil well on the seabed, allowing 19 million barrels of crude oil to escape into the sea.

        This timeline follows US president Barack Obama’s activities since that fateful day 7 weeks ago. Accoridng to online reports, Obama knew about the devastating potential of the oil spill from Day 1.

        BP (Barack’s Problem) Obama’s Gulf Oil Spill Timeline of Events
        Saturday, June 5, 2010

      • JeffH

        Obama oil response: Timeline of Gulf oil spill, government response

        Thursday(April 29) the administration’s team participated in a news conference at the White House, followed by Obama in an appearance in the Rose Garden, where he(Obama) commented publicly for the “first time” on what he characterized as “the worsening oil spill.”

      • eddie47d

        Jeff forgets it was BP who insisted they were in control of the situation and the government did not have to intercede. Jeff also sides with private companies who don’t want the government to be involved in what they do. Now Jeff is acting like the government should have raced in and saved the day. So which is it Jeff to be allowed to jump in as soon as a tragedy strikes or wait until they the the okay from a private company making promises?

        • truesoy


          Those are the two standard of a republican schizophrenic brain.


      • JeffH

        Quite an imagination you have eddie. All I did was refute truesoy’s claim that Obama was on the BP/gulf spill from day 1.

        You made all that up from what I posted? WOW!
        Seek help eddie, you’re delusional and very sick in the head!

      • eddie47d

        Those of you who won’t tell the whole truth are the sick puppies. Wolf Wolf…now you run along and seek help.

        • truesoy


          Things are the way they are and not the way you wish they were.
          Accept them for what they are and you’ll feel better.


  • L Cota

    Here is a good question, How many Muslims can you cram into a three bed room ranch home? another good question why are these people just sitting and waiting for it all to drop into their laps?
    What was promised to them when they came here illegaly to live.. We now are getting higher ratio of Muslims voting then citizens.
    The stage has been set for many years in preparation for this event. What are the people in this sad Government thinking do they not see that they will be on the bottom end of the food chain.?
    I for one will not give up my civil rights and Maine is soon to pass a new medicaid bill that will stop this free loading on our state system. This will cause a mass migration of these illegals to another state that will support them.. Like a stampede of parisites they will flee. We are tired of it up here have a hard enough time to help out own citizens. I say never tick a Mainer off they are a stong lot and will retaliate.

    • truesoy

      L Cota;

      Not many came here illegally. During the Bush adminisration thousands were allowed to come here, although I’m sure that conservative republicans hate it to be remind of it.


      • Pritty Brains

        Of course they hate to be reminded of any of their hypocrisy, TrueSoy. They loathe it so much they beat their heads to a pulp over it. So please continue to point it out.

        This reminds me also of how the republicans conveniently forget that the Bush’s have had a very close relationship with King Abdullah.

        Actually, I find it a stunning twist of irony that conservatives and Tea Partiers haven’t once mentioned the close proximity of the Bush family and King Abdullah for the past eight years but now they are filled with ridiculous outrage over a symbolic gesture of respect from Obama to the Prince recently.

        Pure horse caca hypocrisy.

        *rolls my eyes*

        • truesoy

          Pritty Brains;

          Although my intentions are not to insult, I must say that conservative republicans are fast becoming the modern version of a ‘serf’.


      • jopa

        I still have that vision of Bush walking hand in hand with the Sheik like it was his new girlfriend.Then he kisses the guy that bailed out his failed oil company.At least he was greateful I suppose.

        • truesoy


          I could see how Bush broke the United States; but breaking an oil company?, now that takes talent.


      • jopa

        I still have that vision of Bush walking hand in hand with the Sheik like it was his new girlfriend.Then he kisses the guy that bailed out his failed oil company.At least he was grateful I suppose.

      • Jay

        End the Bush era! Vote Obama out!

    • eddie47d

      Yes L Cota it was Bush who created two unnecessary and protruding wars and very expensive at that. Wars create refugees and the war makers have to bring them here. Now do you get it?

      • Jay

        eddie says: Yes L Cota it was Bush who created two unnecessary and protruding wars and very expensive at that. Wars create refugees and the war makers have to bring them here. Now do you get it?

        Yes eddie, he did it all by himself. Such power he must have possessed as president that he could do willy nilly as he wished, start wars without any opposition from the opposition. Hmm…i guess obama possesses the same power to start wars as he sees fit, without opposition? Afghanistan, Egypt, Libya, Syria, Iran…i suppose you going to blame bush for those wars. Silly man..

        • truesoy


          did you say Obama statrted Afghanistan? really?
          and did we invaded , what under Obama?
          Please explain.


      • Jay

        Correction truesoy, obama adopted the war in Afghanistan. However, the rest; Egypt, Libya, Syria, and soon to be Iran, will be attributed solely to obama.

        • truesoy


          We are not at war with Iran, but guess who wants one?
          I’m waiting….for an answer….


        • macgyver1948

          Jay… Obama didn’t “adopt” the wars. Saying it that way is very misleading. He inherited it from the bush just like Obama inherited the crumbling economy from the bush. Obama is trying to get us out as he promised but even the president cannot do it all by himself, he needs help as we all do if we want to succeed in anything. Blocking him does not mean he is failing.

      • Jay

        truesoy: We are not at war with Iran

        Soon we will be, and you can bet the farm on that.

        truesoy: but guess who wants one?

        The ruling-corporate-elites and the military-industrial-complex, who just happen to own obama’s azz. By the way, just so you don’t get teary-eyed, they owned all previous presidents, except for the one’s they assassinated, as well as mitt romney.

      • Jay

        macgyver1948 says: Obama is trying to get us out as he promised but even the president cannot do it all by himself, he needs help as we all do if we want to succeed in anything. Blocking him does not mean he is failing.

        So conversely, you are saying that Bush received considerable assistance/cooperation in fomenting the war in Iraq/Afghanistan, and destroying the economy. I tend to agree.

        • macgyver1948

          edie47d…You asked me “So conversely, you are saying that Bush received considerable assistance/cooperation in fomenting the war in Iraq/Afghanistan, and destroying the economy. I tend to agree”.

          You can bet the farm I agree with that too….

          The Bush war bill is currently, and raising by the second, well, find it at

          Whether Gw wanted revenge for daddy or more control over oil or better positions in the middle east he had loads of help. Besides, that dolt couldn’t tie his shoes by himself.

          With how his terms were disastrous, with the first an unearned one, meaning he got the be prez even thous he lost the popular vote, even more so than the second I can still remember he said something during his second run during a debate. He said “ …I have no regrets from my first term”… WOW, this man sucks as a human being. I bet he had help with that debate speech-ette as well and we might get him for a third term as Romney..

      • eddie47d

        Jay in all your confusion there is no American war in Egypt or even an Egyptian war as yet.

    • tlgeer

      The majority of Muslims that I know were born here. What’s your point?

  • SamJ

    This article is such nonsense and is for those who don’t think but are just emotional. How could anyone build a tirade by editing the President’s statement? This is no credibility. I may have differences with many of the President’s views but I don’t just react emotionally. I believe we are under God’s judgement because the choice is between a member of a cult religion(Mormon don’t recognize Jesus as the son of God) and a Christian who have some anti-Christian beliefs)

    • Pritty Brains

      This article goes far beyond nonsence. If this were about me, for every article he writes, I’d sue Root for every penny he has for libel. Tie his sorry arse up in legalities he’d have no time for more of his lies. Root is the epitome of blatant evil because he knows what he is doing and is relishing it.

      • jopa

        SamJ & Pritty;You are both right however most of the readers here don’t check the facts or take the time to listen to the whole speech.Usually what the author writes they actually believe because they think it’s illegal to lie on the Internet and nobody would do that.So many are so clueless.

      • Nadzieja Batki

        Denying people their Freedom of Speech, threats to deny them employment (Murdering them), harassment, etc., etc..

      • truesoy


        Please, understand that Allyn Root is preaching to the choir. Most of this people have bought into this type of nonsense because they want to believe and not because they did some deep/critical thinking in order to arrive at a sensible conclusion. They want to believe, and they are just looking for someone like Root to reinforced their beliefs; that’s it.
        The conservative ‘flock’ lacks independent and critical thinking, and they believe in things they don’t understand.


      • Jay

        truesoy, are you describing Wayne’s audience, or obama supporters? The reason i ask is that, the same description you provided for Wayne’s audience, was first penned shortly after obama’s election win for the presidency, and was ascribed to obama’s supporters.

  • The Christian American

    As President Washington said: Government is FORCE. It doesn’t produce, it regulates. It’s OVERHEAD, the thing business people try to get rid of. In that regard, for every dollar government extracts fro the tax payers, only 30 to 40 cents is actually used for it’s intended pupose. The rest the rest is absorbed to pay government people’s dainties, things that the producers in the nation can’t afford. There are more people in government than there are in all industry combined. That insulting comment made by the “president” exposes his communist think.

    Society is the word that describes social orders. There are voluntary societies, societies where the people take care of their own, without government intervention. Then there are involuntary societies. In Involuntary societies the people are forced to give their wealth to government with the government doling some of it back to the people planning their live for them, like it or not. We were an voluntary society and became an involuntary society. We have been taught to rob our neighbor with a politician being the hit man but we seem to forget the politicians robbing us at the same time. If we just eliminated politicians and government employees, we could solve our economic problems in no time. Government should provide and maintain an infrastucture and even that could done by private companies. I could go on and on but this makes me sick.

    • truesoy

      The Christian American;

      Are you sure George Washington said as much, or is that another attributed quote that he never made?


  • jopa

    So Mitt Romney wants to be the new sheriff in town.I can just picture it now, the bank gets robbed and he runs out to grab his horse and join the posse.However his horse is nowhere in sight.It trotted off to the saloon to go dancing,Do we need this??

    • Nadzieja Batki

      Are we supposed to think that you are so bright or on something that alters your mind?

      • jopa

        Nadzi;Mr. Root is working on your thinking.

    • Jay

      Unfortunately jopa, mitt will, be the new sheriff. You best get used to it. Of course, nothing will change for the better. In fact, the plundering of the nation will continue as was with the bush-administration, and is with the obama-administration; proving that larry-curly and moe were all using the same play-book.

  • macgyver1948

    WOW, here we go again, We are once again at the Root of the problem. Root hates Obama, and has since their days at Columbia U, and his hate speaks for him through his distortions of the truth. Once again if you listened to Obama’s speech on this you will see Obama doesn’t even hint that we owe him. His message was so clear in saying we all depend on others for something along the way.

    In it Obama said “If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive. Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you’ve got a business — you didn’t build that. Somebody else made that happen. The Internet didn’t get invented on its own”. Listen and read along for yourself.

    More examples of far right extremist thinking and talking for others and lying to justify their BS position.

    “Facebook co-founder Eduardo Saverin denied Thursday that he renounced his U.S. citizenship and moved to Singapore to avoid paying capital gains taxes on his approximately $3 billion stake in Facebook”.

    Saverin, who was born in Brazil, denied any wrongdoing. He said he owes and is willing to pay “hundreds of millions of dollars in taxes to the United States government.”
    “I have paid and will continue to pay any taxes due on everything I earned while a U.S. citizen,” he said. “It is unfortunate that my personal choice has led to a public debate, based not on the facts, but entirely on speculation and misinformation.”

    Saverin filed to give up his U.S. citizenship in January of 2011, but the news didn’t surface until late last month when the federal government released the information in a routine report. According to Talking Points Memo, Saverin may be barred from re-entering the U.S. if authorities decide he left the country for tax reasons, and Forbes reported that Saverin’s exit would actually increase his immediate tax bill.

    Ok, this is a great example of how Root distorts reality. Saverin didn’t have to lie about this, he is filthy rich and gone. He left for his own reasons.

  • B rian

    Exact number of checks I’ve recieved from the fed in my lifetime……


    17 tax returns of less than $800 every time
    2 stimulas at $300
    1 first time home buyer stimulas less than $5000

    Number of checks the federal government recieved from me in the last 17 years……


    For a total of $132600

    Number of times I’ve been unemployed in the last 17 years…..


    Number of times I’ve been employed within a week of being unemployed…..


    Number of unemployment checks recieved…..


    Social security is expected to fail in 2037…… Expected retirement year if nothing changed between now and then…..


    American, registered independent, Single, hard working, homeowner, white, male, 35….. Generation Screwed, previously know as generation X.

    Things I’m guilty of…..

    Making good decisions in my life, not getting married before I was ready, not popping out kids inadvertantly, paying taxes regularly, never giving up, believing in the American dream, obeying the law, leading by example, helping other people, meeting financial obligations, drinking beer, not being an addict, believing in the constitution of America, suffering the consequences of poor descisions I’ve made, being a contributing member of society……..

    National deficit……

    $15,000,000,000,000. Yeah! That’s trillion!

    Deficit per capita…..


    Average american income per capita…..


    So…….. If every single person in America, worked a complete year, and paid everything they earned on average to the us government to pay off the national debt……. It still wouldn’t be paid off…. But it is a huge undertaking considering…… You haven’t paid any debts, mortgage, food, fun…… Or even taxes…. That’s just assuming you gave all your money to the government…. You would still owe 25% more if you had to pay taxes on the money you hypothetically already gave the government!

    Considering….. Children don’t work, elderly don’t work, prisoners don’t work, some common everyday citizens don’t work, the disabled aren’t required to work, 50 percent of Americans break-even on taxes at the end of the year, 30 percent receive more money than they paid in……

    But who cares about money right?! When push comes to shove…… I’m the minority…… I’m the person that pays for all these issues! All of these infrastructures that the president wants to take credit for….. I paid for! All of these entitlement…. I paid for! Do the math!

    132,000 divided by 17 years….. Equals 7765 paid per year!

    $7765 per year x 350,000,000 Americans = $2.7 trillion/year

    If every American was me…. And the deficit wasn’t goin up….. It would still take 5.5 years to pay off this debt! Assuming….. You were in good health, employed consistently, and made good decisions!

    If you would like to point out things I’ve described in general….. Go ahead! I’m not sure why you feel the need to justify your life on average! If you think things are goin great in America right now….. Please move to Mexico! I’m presenting the facts, on average! If you think Obama is gonna fix it…. Your wrong! The constitution is the play book….. No exceptions! If you believe this not to be the case….. Move! This is my country……. And I’m not giving up on it! I believe that you have the right to believe what u like, and I’m willing to lay down my life for you to do so, even if you disagree with me! Unless you are willing to do the same…… Move to Mexico!

    Your grandkids are screwed! Your great-grandchildren are screwed! They will be suffering the consequenses of decisions you have made, and those elected to represent you have made! But…… What do you care….. It doesn’t affect you! It affects your grandkids and great grandkids! I don’t even have kids! But I know it affect my girlfriends kids, grandkids, and great grandkids! And I will instill in them that they are not to give up either! Never die! Welcome to America!

    • chuckb

      easy there B rian, you hit these bolsheviks with figures like that and it will confuse their brain, this is contrary to their way of thinking, i doubt if the mexicans would want anymore bolsheviks though, they have plenty as it is.

      • B rian

        you’ll have to excuse the public-school educated, American raised, information that I received from the united states census from a .gov website! Usually they try to dumb things down a bit, to look a little better! The US constitution is just a really old piece of paper contained in glass derived from really old people that didnt have to die to earn the right to present that piece of paper! These libra-crats don’t understand basic numbers! Even the public school educated mathematics! I’m not an american, but I was raised by one!

      • B rian

        Im not an American vetran….. But I was raised by one! Stupid spell check….. It’s worse than a libra-crat, and has worse timing!

    • oblivia888

      “When push comes to shove…… I’m the minority…… I’m the person that pays for all these issues! All of these infrastructures that the president wants to take credit for….. I paid for! All of these entitlement…. I paid for! Do the math!”

      Actually the top 10% of income earners in the US pay around three-quarters of all income taxes at the moment, so if you’re not in that bracket, you probably aren’t even paying your way.

      “The constitution is the play book… No exceptions!”

      I’m always amazed by people who say things like this. The constitution was created in the same way as all political agreements in history (well, before the Tea Party came along, anyway): negotiation, haggling, compromise and horse-trading. Not a single one of the drafters got their own way entirely, which is to say that none of them thought it was a perfect document. And that was on the day it was finalised. Today, it takes a firmly closed mind to think that the constitution is perfect — or ever was.

      • B rian

        yeah….. Your right…. Pretty closed minded on the constitution subject considering……. It has been properly ratified how many times since creation? So…. Even as imperfect as it was, or you claim it is…. The writers of the proverbial “toilet paper” that u are claiming that I’m supposedly closed minded about….. even allowed for its proper ratifications, contained within the text of it! Therefore………. Making it the perfect document!

        The president has two jobs…..”I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States.”

        According to you…. Every president including the current ones job, is to totally disregard his oath to protect ur “toilet paper”

        Here is another example of how imperfect ur preverbal “toilet paper” is…..

        “I, XXXXXXXXXX, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God.”

        Did u miss the “foriegn and DOMESTIC” part?!

        As I originally said….. You have the right to have, and share your opinion. And I’m willing to lay down my life for you to oppose my beliefs! But I do recommend that you go back to 6th grade social studies and relearn this basic information, just move to a country where their constitution actually is “toilet paper” and see how much you enjoy your life! And you better decided quickly before you cause the rest of us, not to be able exercise our first amendment right here in this forum, so that we can call you unamerican! I recommend that you move to Syria, Mexico, Uganda, or Yemen! I hear their constitution is two-ply and less abrasive on your bum! And please….. Never claim to be an American…….. You don’t have what it takes, and I wouldn’t want foreigners to misunderstand our values!

        As far as not paying my part in american society….. Youre right again…. In my lifetime I will have never paid in my fair share of the amount being spent at the current rate. I’m counting on my girlfriends great grandchildren to accomplish that! Because there is no way it can be done in my lifetime! But I pay in anyway! Even tho it can’t be done…..

        Any other American born “foreigners” wanna have a go at this?! Cause the last one just failed miserably! And is the major part of the problem in this country!

        Welcome to my country!!!!

  • chuckb

    macgyver1948, if you are going to quote the muslim in the white house, try getting your story straight.

    Look, if you’ve been successful, you didn’t get there on your own. You didn’t get there on your own. I’m always struck by people who think, well, it must be because I was just so smart. There are a lot of smart people out there. It must be because I worked harder than everybody else. Let me tell you something — there are a whole bunch of hardworking people out there”

    does that sound like someone had to help you along the way?.
    this was off the teleprompter, so i guess you have to forgive him, when everything else fails engage the brain. if you have one.
    barry doesn’t understand this, he has lived off the government all his life anyway that part we know about and i have to agree that’s very little.

    • macgyver1948

      Chuckb… If you can refer to Obama as “the Muslim” I have as much right to refer to you as I choose. We both can do that because of the First Amendment but most likely we both would be wrong because I do not know you and you do not know Obama.

      You too must really hate Obama to go that far out of your way to miss his message points and bring in something so trivial as the teleprompter. It is only a tool used by so many who do not have the time to memorize every word of every speech. So many politicians and successful business people, and not so successful, use teleprompters so what is your trivial pursuit point? I can tell you this. I have seen Obama at several sessions, some were at the invitation of GOP and he did very well with no teleprompter. They truly tried to trip him up but they couldn’t. Just wait until the debates between him and Mitt because that will be funny to watch Mitt The Twit swallow his tongue.

      I will tell you this. After college I was a programmer analyst for the Federal Reserve Of NY and we all depended on others for some of our success. I went on to be a systems Analyst, manager of Programming for a fairly large university and then a business analyst for a huge employer in their home office. I designed some pretty hefty systems and managed my teams all the way though. I worked with high level execs and I can tell you this. Never could any say they were successful on their own, not even the CEOs. That was Obama’s message and not that they didn’t deserve their successes. For you to believe he said all those negative things would mean you are TEAed, even if you are not a card carrier. Enjoy your evening…

      • chuckb

        macgyver1948, as you note your employment was working for someone else, you never invented a business, so who are you to say barry is right. he never created a job on his own and was, as the little info we have on him never earned a nickel the hardway.
        you can defend him all you want, you evidently get that tingle chris mathews experienced.
        no one assisted me in starting my business as i stated before, so barry doesn’t have a clue what it takes to start a business and i don’t see any indication you have that ability either. unless you rode that horse don’t tell me how to ride it.

        to me barry is a fraud perpetuated by people who do not have the best interest of this country.; you may admire his debating ability, he didn’t show that success when he debated mccain and i don’t think anyone could consider him a great debater, however, i do agree romney is not my idea of a great spokesman. one thing romney has is a successful business record and an open honest biography, can you say that about barry? you don’t have the slightest idea of this mans background, so i can only surmise from the rumors that surround him that most are true, otherwise, i’m sure the bolshevik party would have laid them out for everyone to see even if they were counterfeit like the bc they exposed.
        i see a person that hates white people and resents this country, his heart supports the muslims, so as a man thinketh a man doeth..

        • tlgeer

          “you don’t have the slightest idea of this mans background, so i can only surmise from the rumors that surround him that most are true”

          Actually, we do know Obama’s background. It has been covered extensively for 5 years. Just as the lies that you are repeating have been around for 5 years.

          “they were counterfeit like the bc they exposed”.

          The birth certificate has never been found to be counterfeit. In fact, he has shown both Hawaiian issued bc’s, as well as Hawaiian officials stating that the documents are valid. The bc’s have been submitted to around 6 different courts, in an attempt to get Obama off of the ballot. Every one of those courts has stated that the bc is valid, and that Obama is eligible to be on the State ballot.

          i see a person that hates white people and resents this country, his heart supports the muslims,

          What facts lead you to believe that Obama hates white people? His Mother was white, as were her Parents, who raised him.

          What facts lead you to believe that Obama resents this country?

          My heart supports American Muslims, too. So what? Does that mean that I am Muslim? Or does that mean that I agree with the 1st Amendment in the freedom of religion? I will tell you, I believe in the 1st Amendment.

          • truesoy


            If the black population of the US was to treat a ‘white’ president in the same manner these folks are treating Obama, I’m sure they’d be singing a different tune…


        • macgyver1948

          chuckb… What you do not know about me and many on the left you and other TEA-like thinkers continue to prove each time you open your TEA stained mouth. Continue to make stuff up about people you know nothing about and you continue to prove all you have for brains is TEA. It is a waste of time to try to correct you about me on all your “ASSumptions” so why bother, truth wont let any reality in if the truth and the facts disagree with your desired beliefs. Stay TEA-like, it suites you.

  • dan joles

    my comment back in 2007 was AMERICA be careful u are putting a fox in the hen ahh white house.

  • oblivia888

    “Business owners would do just fine without government.”

    It’s funny that Wayne makes a big deal about his economic literacy. Government isn’t just roads and bridges, or even police and the military. During the past four years, government has stepped up in a massive way to create demand. Wayne likes to use facile business analogies to make his point, so let’s continue the theme: how many customers would Chick-fil-A have if the government didn’t hand out welfare checks? What would happen to Chick-fil-A’s business partners, suppliers and service providers if those welfare checks didn’t exist? Times that by the whole economy.

    Of course, it’s not surprising that business owners like to pretend their success is a product of their own hard work and dedication, but the truth is that life is a crap shoot, even in America. Anyone who believes that people succeed purely on merit is, to use Wayne’s words, economically illiterate.

    One of the most important roles of government is to help create equality of opportunity, which is something Ayn Rand did not understand (she was an atheist Hollywood screenwriter, by the way, which is an odd choice for a Tea Party hero).

    We all benefit from the creation of broader opportunities because we don’t know where the next Einstein or Steve Jobs will come from (both were the product of immigration, in fact). We increase the chances of finding him (or her) by casting the net as wide as possible, and that means making sure that everyone is healthy, well educated and has a route to success.

    Basketball and football used to be played just by white guys. Imagine what American sports would be like if they’d remained that way. It’s the same for the economy. The more people who are allowed to participate, the stronger the economy is.

    It’s scary how few people understand this, even among those who have benefited most.

    • SiliconDoc

      Your named is fitting as that where that giant wad of stupid and incorrect and self contradictory spam belongs oblivia, in oblivion.

      ” Of course, it’s not surprising that business owners like to pretend their success is a product of their own hard work and dedication,”
      ” Basketball and football used to be played just by white guys. Imagine what American sports would be like if they’d remained that way.”

      ROFL – imagine what your mind would be like if you had a clue as to WHY our sports are now 90% black.

  • chuckb

    tigeer, so you know so much about barrys background, please inform us. tell us where and how he got a passport to pakistan? you state his bc is legitimate, i say you don’t know what you are talking about too many people examined the last bc the bolsheviks presented and verified it is counterfeit, so i’ll take their word. please inform us of his background from hawaii to the mainland, inform us of his scholastic record, his draft status, you don’t have a clue about barry soetoros life. in barrys own words he claimed he hated his mothers race, the white race,. stated in his book “dreams of my father” he stated many things in the book that comes back to haunt him. he’s a fraud and you don’t know what you are talking about. you support the muslims, i say deport everyone of them back to where they came from. there’s no such thing as a good muslim, if they believe in the quran, they believe everyone converts to the raghead colony or off with their head. if they claim otherwise they are liars and i believe the quran gives them the leeway to lie when confronted on that question so save yourself the trouble of denying.
    so when you start calling people liars when they speak of your hero, maybe you should be prepared to confront their accusation with some facts.

    • macgyver1948

      For chuckb… I see you are determining other people’s hero’s now. And, WOW, you are the very definition of bigotry as you include your statements hate such as “ you support the muslims, i say deport everyone of them back to where they came from. there’s no such thing as a good muslim, if they believe in the quran, they believe everyone converts to the raghead colony or off with their head. if they claim otherwise they are liars and i believe the quran gives them the leeway to lie when confronted on that question so save yourself the trouble of when you start calling people liars when they speak of your hero, maybe you should be prepared to confront their accusation with some facts”.

      Not only bigotry but also so much UN-Americanism is in you. You insult the Constitution with your words.

      Where do we end with your kind of hateful thinking “i say deport everyone of them back to where they came from. there’s no such thing as a good muslim”.

      With your BS generalizations about people who do not agree with you and your beliefs I bet in Ireland Irish Catholics said that about Irish Protestants so to use your kind of thinking we here in America should deport all Irish because they are all drunks and potentially violent. Then we should deport all Italians because they are all MAFIA. and Then The Japanese because they bombed Pearl Harbor…. You deserve to be alone on your own planet only with your hate…

      First they came for the communists and I didn’t speak out

      First they came for the communists
      and I didn’t speak out because I wasn’t a communist.

      Then they came for the trade unionists,
      and I didn’t speak out because I wasn’t a trade unionist.

      Then they came for the Jews,
      and I didn’t speak out because I wasn’t a Jew.

      Then they came for me
      and there was no one left to speak out for me.

      pastor Martin Niemöller

      Oh Chuck,, You do not like God either , do you?

      • SiliconDoc

        macguyver1948 you’re the very definition of stupidity and self retarding conspiracy.
        I stopped reading your other post when you proclaimed that reagan and bush spent the most, more than obama, and anyone not knowing that has believed the lies….

        You’re an idiot, and not to be ever taken seriously on anything at all. As Reagan should have said, “Don’t believe them, then verify why”.

        • macgyver1948

          Hay Doc…. There is nothing worse than someone who doesn’t want to learn what might be true. Insults coming from a TEA like brain are meaningless. :-)

          • http://incerely, truesoy


            What’s up with ‘silicon brain’, woke up on the idiot side of the bed, again?


  • Ron r

    Wayne, you are a class A+++ idiot.

    • macgyver1948

      Ron ..Ain’t that the damn truth… and a liar too…anks for you so-true comment…

  • juanita lyons

    I think Obama is just trying to healh the ones that can’t help themselves, and I think that is good. Some people are struggling, Didn’t you learn as a child : Do unto others as you have others do unto you? Extrend a helping hand. If you were in need wouldn’t you want someone to help you? I do and I would love to be able to help people!

    • B rian


      Of course we would like to believe that people that need help recieve it. I commend you for being empathetic to fellow Americans.

      I voted for Obama because I believed he was going to change the US…. Why I voted for him was very simple….. Because I couldn’t believe Obama could abuse the constitution of America more than president bush jr. Boy was I wrong!

      The Obama administration is widely regarded as the most lawless in U.S. history. This much you already know.

      Not enough votes to pass Obamacare? Bribe senators. Don’t like the Defense of Marriage law? Refuse to defend it in court. Congress won’t pass the “Dream Act” granting amnesty to a million illegals? Do it yourself by executive fiat. Don’t want to defend America’s borders? Sue states that do. Don’t like congressional inquiries? Ignore their subpoenas.

      On July 6, 2012 Obama signed a executive presidential order declaring that he could seize all communications in the united states for any crisis….. This includes……. Your cell phone, land lines, Internet, shortwave radio, ham radio, cb radio, satellite communications, satellite tv, cable tv, Internet providers including privately owned companies (google, yahoo, aol, etc.) us postal services etc. etc. Of you don’t believe me….. Look it up!

      This wouldn’t have been a problem if it was vetted properly, through congress and the normal processes…. He never gave them the opportunity to veto the order….. He says….. That govt needs the ability to communicate with itself in time of crisis….. Please evaluate this completely…… This is something a dictator does to suppress the people’s ability to communicate and organize in time of political unrest! By political unrest I mean that he has overlooked the constitution of America like it doesn’t exist! And the people are going to revolt…..

      He has buried your kids, grandkids, and great grandkids with debt and is still spending out of control!

      Indeed, President Obama did make that promise that day, saying , “today I’m pledging to cut the deficit we inherited in half by the end of my first term in office. This will not be easy. It will require us to make difficult decisions and face challenges we’ve long neglected. But I refuse to leave our children with a debt that they cannot repay – and that means taking responsibility right now, in this administration, for getting our spending under control.”.

      At the time he said this….. The deficit was 6.4 trillion dollars! The deficit now is over 15 trillion dollars! He borrowed over 2 trillion dollars from social security to pay it down to 15 trillion.

      Who is he helping? He has already broke his promise to cut the deficit in half and has sunk the US financially instead…. He’s ignores the constitution like it doesn’t exist! He ignores subpoenas from congress!

      I’m responsible for putting this man in office! It’s my fault….. And he has destroyed my country….. I voted for him….. I’m not making this mistake again…..!

      He promised smaller government….. And he’s made it bigger!

      I help people by going to the store and putting food in their freezer, fridge, and pantries! This money comes out of my pocket! People that have been affected by this poor economy! The economy was in his hands and he has done nothing! Everybody is feeling the weight of the economy! The economy is the number one issue in this election……

      President Barack Obama has not met with his jobs council for six months because he has too much on his plate, White House press secretary Jay Carney said on Wednesday.

      But he has attended 100 fundraisers to get re-elected in the same amount of time! Who’s job is he concerned about? Yours or his own?

      I will vote for anybody but Obama at this point….. I had to do the same thing with bush jr. For the same reason!

      Obamas track record so far financially was to cut the deficit 3 trillion dollars….. Instead it went up to 15 trillion…. His goal versus where we are today is a difference of 18 trillion dollars…. Add the 2 trillion he borrowed from social security and his track record goes to 20 trillion…. Can you go another 4 years at this rate…… Because your great grand kids will not have paid this off at 15 trillion!

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  • clemens harmon

    Romney, is full of hot air. He will do and say anything to become President.
    I still am going to vote for Obama no matter bwhat anyone says.

    • macgyver1948

      clemens harmon…. You say and I very much agree “Romney, is full of hot air. He will do and say anything to become President”. Romney is in there to do the bidding of the Koch-like and his hot air reflects that. How can you PROMISE to create 4 million jobs? How can you do the Tax cut program he is offering without lowering the very wealthy’s taxes by increasing ours? His tax cut plan is basically the same as Bush’s – give to the wealthy by taking from the unwealthy.

      With Romney we get bush in drag – To benefit and protect the very wealthy, as he sticks to his own kind in that regard. Romney will be the BAIN kind of businessman he claims we need in the Oval Office and he will be that for the Koch-like pretty exclusively.

    • William Wiley Bolton

      At least Romney is a businessman with experience instead of an “AMATEUR”.

      • http://incerely, truesoy


        Government is not a business, nor was ever intended to be one.
        Wise up!!!!


  • John Beach

    All true, and for the “rich people and patriot Americans who would be willing to pay more in taxes,” if they are so willing to pay more taxes, nothing is preventing them from voluntarily writing great big checks and sending them into the IRS as gift contributions, is there? Are the biggest, Democrat, fat-cats writing out huge checks because they appreciate so much what government can do for Freddie Freeloader or simply because they are feeling particularly “patriotic?” The media is not reporting it if the IRS has made it known. Speaking of the IRS, if some rich person had not paid his legally-owed taxes in a decade or so, don’t you think the IRS would have sent them notifications of taxes due? We don’t hear about that either, even if they are running for President!

    • truesoy

      John Beach;

      Yep, John, nothing is more patriotic than for a super rich amn that wans to be President of The United States than to hide money in offshore accounts.


      • William Wiley Bolton

        That is what is good about America, you can legally put your own money where you want. If you had anything you had earned you would have an off shore account. The only reason I don’t is I fought to defend the rights of morons to throw away liberty. Thank God there may be enough reasonable people to stop the train wreck. In a free country you are able to invest where you want to. What do you mean hide? It is his RIGHT!

        • http://incerely, truesoy

          WilliamW B;

          So then, for the man that wants to be president and while at it live off the taxpayers is ok to hide money in offshore banks and avoid paying taxes.
          But you oppose Obama, right?
          Boy, talking about having your priorities in order…


  • Richard

    You are 110% right! This is all about Government Greed. Even Attacking the Rich is wrong these people are investors, They invest their money create jobs power the Economy. Just as our Resources when we went to foreign oil and the elevated taxes on it everything got higher. This causes transportation cost to go up a loaf of bread goes up lets go back 12 years and look at the cost of everything. The only way to fix all of this is to go back to where this all started. Not 1973 look at the taxes everyone had a job if they wanted it. Taxes were low on fuel we were self efficient. This is why I believe in the right to work No Unions, Those union guys pay someone to work and they do nothing for them, been there done that, it didn’t take me long to figure out what was going on. Obama needs to read what he is saying he is lost. We need someone to run the country like a business. And the government needs to stay out of Businesses, let them do their thing and let them grow hire people to work. Go back to drilling and Mining here in the U.S. and find another way for energy the right way. Now Ethanol this in made from grain, that cuts into the food for people and feed for cattle and horses this is a shortage and it is record high now. The price of Beef Chicken and Pork is record high. Don’t believe it go to the store and see for your self. Again this is all about Greed it is time to clean house in Washington and get the people that will work for us because they got it in their heads we work for them. The words are WE THE PEOPLE. not Us Here In Washington. We still need to Audit the government and see where the money trail goes, Don’t you know they do that and most of them will be packing their bags and catching a flight out of here on the run.

    • truesoy


      No one is attacking the rich. What has been done is to demand for the rich to pay their fair share. This is no different ot President Reagan saying the same in 1986. He even use the analogy of the bus driver who paid a higher percentage of his income than the very wealthy. And no one thought his comment meant class warfare; the contrary is true for the republicans applauded.
      The bottom line is that rich does not mean above the law. It also doesn’t mean they can purchase the government, though they are buying it a bit at a time with your support.
      And yes, Obama made the comment about no one getting to where they are without some sort of help and/or contribution from society. Not much different from what Romney had said a few weeks prior; now, you are aware that Romney said just about the same, right? And you kept silence, and so did the mouth pieces of the republican machine (Fox, Rush, etc). But you want to twist the intended message of what Obama said, but if you do you’d have to do the same for Romney.
      Bottom line is this.: because of Government participation in the market (the collective financial effort of society) it pave the way for many people to make large amount of money, some even to become part of the 1%. And there is nothing wrong with that. But what is wrong is for them to ‘ungratefully wanting to pull back the plank once they’ve made it.


      • Kent

        I am replying to global warming
        I live in Ohio our heat records did not meet or xcede records set in 1911 and other years were hotter.
        But our crops are a total loss im most of Ohio Indiana Illinois and so on.,

  • Jenny McDermott
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  • William Wiley Bolton

    Too much talk about being unable to pay the national debt. Sure that is the plan of those that want to destroy the USA, but WE the people don’t have to take that. WE can mine the moon, the asteroid belt and do more than all before us. WE can be so successful and out work all the rest of this world. WE proved it in WWII. WE can get back everything that has been taken and be better than before. Don’t give in! Don’t give up! Beat their game and do it by cleaning up the government and the piss ant parasites of our society. WE the people can do it, just like we have again and again. WE just have to get out the American Spirit, dust it off, keep our faith in God and ourselves and throw out our dead weight, “kill the Constitution” populace, that has no part in us. My people used to say if you won’t work, you don’t eat! Time to bring that back. Even the most disabled can work and there is plenty of proof from decent disabled people. There is proof also of LAZY people that want anyone else to “pick up the check”.

  • Clement Falzarano

    when will the pepole understand that obama did not mean that the busness did not build there own but if we did not have roads and raile that they would have a hard time getting there pruduct to be sold

    • truesoy

      Clement Falzarano;

      Tecnically Obama is right, for without the ‘collective financial effort of the people’ (taxes) the interstate highway wouldn’t have materialize andthereby many businesses will not be there today. Same with the ‘electrification program’ from the Federal Government that allowed farmers and others access to different markets. Etc, etc…


      • William Wiley Bolton

        The only time Obama has been right is when he misread the teleprompter.

        • truesoy

          William W B;

          Believe it or not, I know why you feel the way you do. It is because facts are irrelevant to you, for it is what you have been led to believe by those who share the same political ideology as you that it is important, and that in order to arrive at their promised utopia you must believe it even if something in the back of your mind (the little voice of reason) tells you otherwise.
          And that is the difference between you and I, for I know why I believe in the things I believe in, while you don’t, because you believe in things you don’t understand.


          • William Wiley Bolton

            Listen boy, I know the difference in the field of being betrayed and having the extraction team show up. That is why I vote for Republican candidates. The Democrats both betrayed us and left us where we were after we accomplished the mission they asked for.

          • http://incerely, truesoy


            Oh really, democrats stood you up, how is that?


          • William Wiley Bolton

            Now I see, you’re a simple minded person. They asked us to go overseas for a private security operation and we parachuted into an area and performed the mission asked. Then we found the administration had forewarned the enemy and they never sent in the extraction team as agreed after we accomplished the mission anyway. We had to sign nondisclosure pacts, but a lot of the wikileaks have removed those restraints. To prove it I can do something to scare you. You can go skydiving with me. I am a life member of the United States Parachute Association and you can read the parachute riggers oath so you won’t be quite so scared. Since my father, an Officer in the Army Air Corps during WWII had told me not to trust anyone in covert ops, but to always prepare another way out, I’m here to tell the story along with my team. We can guarantee you’ll have fun. But we don’t put up with (expletive deleted) from pretenders.

          • http://incerely, truesoy


            So you were part of an overseas ‘private security covert operation’ for the United States government. Well, that is centainly plausible, but, and with a capital B, somehow your story has some holes that you are seemingly trying to plug with make believes. And I’ll tell you why I say that, because for one, how do you know who gave you guys away, and 2) how did you get out of the tight ‘pickle’you found yourself in?, and 3) why would our government, that ordered the mission will dime you out? And this is the most perpleing of your asertions, for if it was such a ‘covert’ mission, don’t youthink that disclosing it to the enemy, or to anyone else for that matter, defeats the concept of ‘covert’. And if the enemy was already on ‘noticed’ I find it very hard to belive you would have been successful in your mission unless the enemy was an incompetent bunch of retards, in which case you wouldn’t need a mission anyway.
            However, there can be another logical explanation if you were really on a ‘covert operation’ and no one came for you. Maybe you guys never showed up a the rallying point because you or somebody else in your group was either to stupit to read the compass properly and led you to the wrong place, or there was never a mission and you’re just repeating a story someone told you,and that you feel repeating it makes your point. OK.


          • William Wiley Bolton

            You obviously haven’t read wikileaks. Fact is I don’t need help to come or go anywhere in the world. It is simple to track down info given out when the list is small of those that knew the plan in the first place. Covert ops are always known by a group of people and that is how operation Anaconda was let out just before it went down to the killing of more than 20 of our troops. There have always been rats. As for who I am. Here is a partial list of my skills. Pilot, Fixed Wing and Helicopter, Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic, Parachute Rigger, Jumpmaster, HALO and HAHO Master. Inventor of the HANO ( for people like you) system, Parachute Test Jumper, (flew the first wing ever sewed together, the Jalbert Aerial Sled), you’ll find my photo in “The Parachute Manual” the technical manual worldwide for lofts and manufacturing of parachutes, Open Water Scuba Diver, EOD Master, Weapons Master, Covert Operations Engineer (planning, equipment and personnel selection and implementation) and commanding officer of operations. Never said I was part of a “private security covert operation”. That kind of crap came out since the 1970′s when we were doing the job that was working. The nondisclosure pacts were ruined by wikileaks so nothing is covert since the liberals leak everything they get their hands on. Yes the enemy and their friends in the USA are a bunch of retards, so you were right on one point. Many missions that both types of administrations came up with were useless and the reasoning behind them was incomprehensible. The reason they didn’t keep their end of the mission up was they expected us to die. There is no rallying point? We always know our areas of operation completely, both topo and by landmark. Most of the areas in which I operated for 11 years still have the same NDB navigational beacons and I know a lot of them by heart. I have nothing to prove to someone like you and I could by showing face to face. We stayed true to our agreements and most of our bosses did. Others didn’t. More than happy to leave you here drowning in your own piss of lies while I live on my yacht and try to forget how I lived while serving my country. Only people like you “make up” things for political agendas that are anti American. You can tell the truth from the teller. I don’t talk of something unless I was there and knew what went on.

  • Bert Cundle Sr.

    If You didn’t Support him… ( & YOU DIDN’T.) You have No Claim ! He owes you “0″!!!
    Keep looking for something you, can be successfull at!

  • Bert Cundle Sr.

    Your Social Security, Medicare, welfare, food stamps and unemployment insurance exist because of business owners paying into the system.
    //////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\ Wrong! They Exist beacuse of the Need! With out them… Capitolism would destroy the working class of people. The Communism ( UNIONS) Save the Working Class of people! From Labor Catasterfes… PEOPLE PAY INTO THEM WHEN THEY WORK … & COLLECT FROM THEM WHEN THEY DON’T !
    I think your Sight of things, is only to your nose!

    • SamFox

      Yo Bert, say hello to Ernie for us wouldja…

      Capitalism would destroy America & the unions save the workers? Are you from the Bizzaro world or what? :-)

      Without free market capitalism you would most likely not have a vote, a car, electricity, your computer…under socialist/communist rule there have been long lines for a loaf of bread, many more poor created, draconian regulations chocking off job growth, people disappeared, spun stats, indefinite detention, a huge national debt….so what great communist nations have arisen that could at any time in history be compared to the USA?

      How many times has Hugo C been legally elected? How about Castro?

      Social Security, Medicare, welfare, food stamps and unemployment insurance are not legal for the fed govt to get involved in. The govt’s take over of these is not allowed by the US Constitution. If the fed govt were not sucking the citizen dry, had not wrecked the free market with cronyism, to much regulation & taxes we would have many fewer poor & no need for big bro nanny central planning to usurp power they don’t legally have.

      So how good a job did the strikers at Hostess do at protecting all those jobs their UNION caused to be lost? In this economy the union peeps had a job. But they chose to strike & cost a lot more than what the union thugs were after or Hostess could afford.

      Man, those strikers had jobs! They had jobs! That’s kind of a big thing these days…



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