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Let’s Nuke the Environmentalists

October 28, 2009 by  

Let’s Nuke the Environmentalists

Greenpeace is running rampant across Alberta’s oil sands. In the past few weeks, 37 activists have been arrested in a spate of incidents targeting North America’s most important energy resource.

The most recent occurred on Oct. 5 when 19 activists stormed an upgrader in Fort Saskatchewan, Alberta. They tied themselves to equipment which is used to transform heavy oil into gasoline.

The protesters unfurled banners reading “Climate Crime” and “Climate SOS” to draw attention to an industry they say is killing the planet.

In September, two-dozen Greenpeace commandoes kayaked down the Athabasca River to intercept a Suncor bridge where conveyor belts move bitumen into an oil sands upgrader.

But my favorite is the protestors that drove a convoy of pickup trucks into the heart of Shell Oil’s massive open pit mine, halting production.

They came from Edmonton to Fort McMurray, Alberta, a 360-mile round trip. The irony of burning all that gasoline to shut down a facility that helps to provide affordable gasoline was apparently lost on them.

Greenpeace says that it is putting a spotlight on the “climate crimes of the tar sands.”

Meanwhile, trouble is also brewing west of the oil sands in the Peace River region, an area that encompasses the Alberta and British Columbia border. It is here that an eco-terrorist is on the loose. His target is EnCana Corp (NYSE: ECA), which is working the vast unconventional pools of sour gas that lay a mile beneath the countryside.

In the past year he has blown up six sour gas pipelines. EnCana is a preeminent natural gas company in North America. Yet the company is so afraid that the bomber is going to kill himself or somebody else they have posted an Osama bin Laden-like bounty of $1 million for information leading to a conviction. The newspapers are calling it the largest reward in Canadian history.

In a letter to the Dawson Creek Daily News the bomber wrote: “Return the land to what it was before you came every last bit of it… before things get a lot worse for you and your terrorist pals in the oil and gas business.”

The badly handwritten letter sent July 15 insists EnCana cease operations in the area. The bomber also promised to suspend attacks during a three-month grace period so “we can all take a summer vacation.”

All considered the oil patch is lucky to have a lazy terrorist on its hands.

From Elephant Fields to Real Elephants

I can already picture the hate mail, “Myers, not everyone concerned about the environment is a protestor or a bomber!”

True, but a lot of Greens just don’t get it. Let me give you an example.

In the early 90s I went to South Africa to report on the gold mines. There, my Uncle Richard and I joined a tour group. Our guide was an English conservationist.

He told our table how the South African government sold elephant hunting licenses for $20,000 a pop. Traveling with game wardens, hunters gladly paid this fee to stalk single bull elephants.

This, said our tour guide, allowed the South African government to cull the herds, thus preventing mass starvation of the animals. All of the funds were put back into the game parks allowing for their future expansion and the eventual growth of the elephant population.

For one woman in our group, this was too much. Right there in a Johannesburg restaurant she came unhinged. “You sell elephant lives for money!”

Sometimes I can’t help myself and this was one of those times.

I turned to my uncle and said, “What do you think Richard?”

I then explained that in 1957 my father Vern and my Uncle Richard had gone on safari and had in fact bagged an elephant.

I went on to defend Richard with the truth—saying that, in fact, elephants have always been endangered by poachers, not hunters; that licensed hunting had in fact created a windfall for conservation throughout southern Africa.

But there was no convincing the lady from Toronto. Once she knew that Richard had killed an elephant he might as well have murdered a baby. She told him that in her book, killing an elephant was worse than killing a person.

I knew then and there that some environmentalists were downright crazy.

Any lingering doubts were erased by a 1990s PBS program called, Can the Elephants be Saved? It should have been titled, Are the Environmentalists Crazy?

The program NOVA focused on Zimbabwe’s wildlife management, one of the most effective on the continent. In the decades leading up to the 1990s the nation’s elephant herd had doubled to more than 60,000 animals, twice what the Parks Department considered the optimum size for the country. Where there were just 3,000 elephants in the Hwange National Park in 1930, there were more than 20,000 by 1990.

To prevent the Park’s destruction and the mass starvation of thousands of elephants, Zimbabwe game officials would accompany high stake hunters who culled a limited number of elephants with high caliber rifles at short distances. For the Park Service it was a matter of the greater good since elephants could not be moved safely to other game parks.

Every elephant culled was immediately skinned and butchered. A full grown elephant can provide 2,000 pounds of prime meat. Dried, this lifesaving resource remains edible for up to one year and helps sustain some poor black tribes on the fringes of the game parks.

This utilization of elephants not only preserved the park but also the long-term existence of elephants and other game. It also contributed millions of dollars to the Zimbabwe economy—money that was used to expand the national parks, build needed infrastructure and improve the standard of living for the Zimbabwe people.

All for the good, correct? Not according to Cynthia Moss, then and still the head of the Amboseli Elephant Research Project in Kenya.

Moss told NOVA that shooting just one elephant, for whatever reason, is fundamentally wrong.

“I don’t call that conservation. I would rather see no elephants than elephants being culled, and that’s an extreme position I’ve come to hold, just because I think it is morally unjustified to kill elephants,” Moss said.

If that’s not an ideologue what is? I can picture Hitler slamming his fist upon a desk and declaring: “If Germany can’t win the war, it doesn’t deserve to survive!”

In case you think Moss’ outlook has evolved, guess again. In fact you can visit her Website at: http://www.elephant.se/cynthia_moss.php. There, she is asked who had the biggest influence on her life. Her answer: Echo.

If you want to know who Echo is you can see her picture at: http://www.elephant.se/database2.php?elephant_id=51.

The Hard Truth about Crude Oil

Greenpeace demonstrates that when it comes to the environment, it’s not just individuals that are off kilter.

Then there is the Environmental Defense Fund (EDF). Earlier this year the EDF proclaimed: “For about a dime a day (per person), we can solve climate change, invest in a clean energy future, and save billions in imported oil.”

Newsweek, no friend to conservatives, had this response in its April 27, 2009, issue: “(If what the EDF says) sounds too good to be true, it’s because it is.”

Newsweek points out that four-fifths of the world’s and America’s energy comes from fossil fuels—oil, coal, natural gas—which are also the largest source of man-made carbon dioxide (CO2), the main greenhouse gas.

This is a fundamental fact that isn’t going to change for generations, regardless of how many people chain themselves to oil sands sites or blow up pipelines.

Moreover, Alberta’s oil sands will remain the key to meeting America’s growing thirst for oil. Canada already supplies the U.S. with 22 percent of its petroleum, the bulk of which comes from Alberta’s oil sands. That share will climb significantly over the next 20 years as oil sands operations expand, Greenpeace be damned.

Yours for real wealth and good health,

John Myers
Myers’ Energy and Gold Report

John Myers

is editor of Myers’ Energy and Gold Report. The son of C.V. Myers, the original publisher of Oilweek Magazine, John has worked with two of the world’s largest investment publishers, Phillips and Agora. He was the original editor for Outstanding Investments and has more than 20 years experience as an investment writer. John is a graduate of the University of Calgary. He has worked for Prudential Securities in Spokane, Wash., as a registered investment advisor. His office location in Calgary, Alberta, is just minutes away from the headquarters of some of the biggest players in today’s energy markets. This gives him personal access to everyone from oil CEOs to roughnecks, where he learns secrets from oil insiders he passes on to his subscribers. Plus, during his years in Spokane he cultivated a network of relationships with mining insiders in Idaho, Oregon and Washington.

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  • Lloyd Scallan

    If you want to stop Greenpeace and other such types, kill them. If they show up on any site to disrupt any work progress, don’t call the
    cops, that gives them more exposure, just kill them. I will assure
    you within a few weeks, all of this anarchist movement will end.

    • Disgusted

      There are many other uses for that point of view. I believe our over crowded prisons could use it. If a person is guilty of murder, guess what his punishment should be. The way the system is now they can get for free – better health care, dental care and in some cases an education that I can’t even afford and I haven’t committed a crime. And here in Wisconsin we now have a murderer (who turned the shotgun on himself after killing his girlfriend)that will be receiving reconstructive surgery on his face at my expense….unbelievable. When and where does it end. Sorry to have gotten off topic, but man this stuff really makes my blood boil. This country is so out of whack its crazy. Why does it seem that thes specialists groups always get their way when they are only a small percentage of the population?

      • seeitgotohell

        The more scared that people are the more control that the government (federal,state, local) has over us.

        • CabotAR

          You are so correct. We all sit in front of the TV & are too lazy to step into the streets to protest as the colonist did just prior to the American Revolution.

          All I can suggest is vote in 2010 & send a strong message that we want govt. out of our lives.

          • johnk

            I really dont think its laziness that keeps most people from protesting its that most people have responsabilites and jobs and cant afford to take off and protest.It aint right that hard working Americans that take pride in what they do and in there country and contribute something to society keep getting pissed on by there elected officals beacuse these greenpeace loving fruits dont worrie about contributing anything and have all the time they need to protest and tell everybody just how bad oil,coal,hunting hell now eatihg meat is bad for the enviorment so they protest washington puts in new regulations and taxes to help save the enviorment from our evil ways which comes back around to take more money out of our pockets it just ain’t right.

      • Winginit

        BECAUSE THEY HAVE SOOOO MUCH MONEY!!!! ALGORE

      • http://Yahoo Dee D

        Disgusted – One way to stop the bleeding hearts from trying to abolish the death penalty is to make them take a couple of the offenders out of the prisons, take them into their home – feed – house and maintain a favorable living condition for them and I’d bet they would stop fighting for them.
        If they had to financially care for them and have them in their own personal life they would not want any part in it.

        • John

          Dee,
          I agree with you put the low-life’s in the lib’s homes and let the bleeding heart liberals be their care givers.
          We can also set up half-way houses in the most liberal states and neighborhoods.

          As for Greenpeace, perhaps we could secure the most vulnerable areas with guard dogs and let the dogs have them.

    • trut

      If the protesters are killed that would send the wrong message for all protests. Do you think the Tea Parties should have been rounded up and shot too?

      • seeitgotohell

        Protests are to be made on public, not private property. Especially not in a dangerous work zone. Those protesters are behaving stupidly. They are not changing anyones minds, they are just reinforcing the idea that they are loons. It’s like an innocent man accused of beating his wife yelling and screaming his head of in court that he is innocent, people will not believe him. If they want to have a bigger impact they need to quit behaving like children. Personally I believe that we need to find other means on powering our society than oil but right now it is necessary. What they need to do is put their energy into trying to get laws passed that require us to find better solutions to our energy demands than oil

        • DaveH

          Seeit,
          The free market will solve those problems when needed. As oil becomes scarcer and prices go up, alternative energy will step in to fill the gap. As the Liberals love to whine, those ‘greedy’ corporations will jump on the chance to make money when that opportunity presents itself. And what is wrong with that? It is the kind of greed that builds an economy as opposed to the type of greed that the Liberals possess which tears down an economy.
          Right now the other schemes still aren’t economically viable and should not be forced on us.

          • s c

            When it comes to ecoloonies, I never know if it’s time to laugh or cry. If these self-made retards are so responsible, then how can they have any time to protest or damage equipment or regurgitate the rotten pablum their ‘leaders’ demand they hurl at everyone else. DO ANY OF THESE LOWER LIFE FORMS HAVE JOBS?
            None of them have the guts or the brains to ADMIT that it will take a lot of time to see alternative energies be made available. WHAT HAVE THESE USELESS SLIMERS BEEN DOING FOR THE LAST 40 YEARS? In their primordial minds, it’s OK for us to live in a third world country (anything to make them happy).
            Isn’t it bad enough that they are detached from reality? These willing victims of their own RELIGION (first church of mama earth). HOW COULD ANYONE IN HIS RIGHT MIND LOOK UP TO SOMEONE LIKE al (don’t call me rich, call me ‘enlightened’ gore)? Gore
            still doesn’t know up from down or in from out.
            Ecoloonies, if they had any integrity, they’d round themselves up and live in their own concentration camps. That way, they could emulate FDR and his ‘compassionate concentration camps’ in WWII. Will they do it? OF COURSE NOT! They’re all mindless obamazombies and self-lovers. They’re too busy showing the world how easy it is to be terminally stupid. LOSERS! HYPOCRITES! LOVERS OF INSANITY!

          • DaveH

            I’m sure that have ulterior motives. Somebody must be funding them. The question is what are those motives? Are they trying to hobble competition for another company? Are they trying to force us to use alternative energy which isn’t yet competitive? Are they working for government leaders who are seeking more power over the citizens?
            Somebody needs to thoroughly investigate these people.

          • http://www.pcelementz.com Mr. Bruce

            Dave, unfortunately you, along with many others will just have to learn the hard way that there is no form of greed that is “good”. Free market? Where was the “free” market when gov bailed out almost every institution in the U.S.? Laissez-faire economics is finished…. Whether you like it or not. You’re wasting your time debating the subject.

          • DaveH

            Oh, by all means, Annointed One, I shall give up my pursuit of freedom because you say it is useless. Get real.

          • BillyJ

            DaveH. Why is it that when anyone disagrees with your comments, you sink to the level of calling them names? Annonited one? Very few ever seems to call you on your disrespectful comments, when they do, you try to get the whole site to attack that person. It seems that if you deem someone to be a liberal, which will be anyone who disagrees with you, you use phrases and comments to degrade that person, are you so weak on your beliefs that you need to do that?

          • JeffH

            BillyJ, you need to look in the mirror after you made your comment to DaveH. Now who is calling others names.

          • BillyJ

            Jeff, I don’t think that Dave needs you to defend him. You are not reading the post correctly. I did not call him any names.

          • DaveH

            Billy,
            He told me “You’re wasting your time debating the subject”. My response was appropriate in that context.
            For Mr. Bruce,
            If you have read any of my comments on the other subjects you would know that I don’t condone the ‘bailouts’. But if you do some research you will see that the Congress was majority Democrat at the time of the bailouts. Bush should have vetoed the ‘bailouts’ but Bush is a fiscal Liberal if you don’t know that already. He was promoted by the MSM in the Republican primaries because he was one of the most Liberal of the Republican candidates, as was McCain in the recent elections. I don’t vote for either of those parties.

          • DaveH

            And Billy, your comment “you try to get the whole site to attack that person” is totally fallacious. Show me a single comment where I have called for help from anyone else.

      • http://Yahoo Dee D

        trut – No just the organizers of the tea party’s should be shot.

        • DaveH

          That’s right, they deserve death for their annoyance at being ripped-off by the Liberals. What right do they have to be protesting against their slavery?

        • BOE

          are you kidding? Do you have a white-hair grandma or grandpa? Because that`s who is at the tea parties. WW11 vets,hard working people who have saved and provided for their famlies. Not some sorry(WORDS REMOVED FOR OFFENSIVE CONTENT) with bunch of kids waiting for more hand outs.

        • JeffH

          So you are an advocate of violence?

      • John

        The tea partiers were not causing property damage. They were passionate but nonviolent gatherings.

      • BillyJ

        Trut, excellent point.

    • Thomas O. Nass

      Lloyd,
      It sounds like you are for unhampered and uninterrupted destruction of our environment by the many and sundry of our largest polluters. Who, as you probably know, are also our largtest employers.
      It is my guess you feel that it is better to have “no planet” than be a “planet of the unemployed”.
      Tom Nass
      5th Marine Division – WWII

    • Robert

      How about keeping the conversation sensible.

      • libertytrain

        Robert, excellent thought – let’s hope for it to become so.

    • http://www.YOUniqueWealth.com/WealthHealth Dr. Kevin

      “When they came for the environmentalist, I did nothing.
      …When they came for me their was no one to stop them.”

      Shame on you all. Why do you get to decide who lives or dies with off the wall calls to kill people? When so real nutcase reads your inflammatory article and then kills someone, are you willing to go to court and defend your call for murder?

      • BillyJ

        Dr. Kevin, after reading the comments on this site, it is not unusual to read about the call to march on D.C. to physically remove the people from office(armed of course), to start a civil war, or to incite harm against those that the right wing has decided is responsible for all the ills of the country. Your comment will not get a response, as they don’t want to acknowledge their own radical views. Instead of calling out Llyod, they just ignore him, and stay on track with their own agenda.

        • JeffH

          Why is it when someone mentions marching on DC to take our country back, with no mention of arms or violence that there is immediate reaction by some that the intent is a civil war by guns. Drop the fear mongering.

          • JeffH

            Sorry BillyJ, I missed Lloyds original post, but I see assumptions quite often on others comments elsewhere.
            Lloyd is an idiot and only represents himself and not the conservatives or the liberals.

        • BillyJ

          Jeff, why is it that no one will call out someone like Llyod who makes those types of statements? There were at least 12 comments after his, in which not one person addressed the comment, everyone just seems to ignore that type of response and don’t take the effort to confront that type of language. When good men so nothing, is why we have the situation in Calf, where approximately 24 people stood around and did nothing when a young girl was being raped for 2.5 hours. The people on this site should be up in anyones face who is promoting violence of any sort, for any reason.

          • JeffH

            eyes, because his comments are not even worth wasting the effort on.

          • Dr Kevin

            Actually, I was also questioning John Myers, who should know better! Of course calls to “Nuking” anybody are just fat hot air coming from someone UNLESS they actually posess a nuclear weapon…I sure hope John Myers doesn’t have political connections in a country with nuclear capabilities…Waite he does! God help us.
            Oh never mind he didn’t call for environmentalist in the USA (in his back yard) to get ‘nuked’ he was calling for someone to nuke the environmentalist in Canada and other places in the world…waite a minute maybe that was Osama Bin Laden;s message…I give up.

    • BillyJ

      What party do you belong to? I certainly hope you are not a moderate Republican, as that kind of radical thinking will damage my party.

      • BillyJ

        My comment was to Llyod.

    • denniso

      Lloyd..you shouldn’t be allowed on this post..Your solution to anything/anyone you don’t like is, ‘KILL THEM’??? Boy, I can imagine you didn’t get very far in school and that’s pretty simplistic,barbaric thinking. I wonder if anyone disagrees w/ you and feels the same way you do about the solution??

  • Thomas Bendoraitis

    Forget the environmentalists…Why are Canadians pay exorbitant taxes while Exxon, Suncor, Chevron etc. rape the country and siphon off all of the profits while we have hungry children in every city in the land and all our jobs are being shipped off to China and India. Think a little bit beyond your packaged ideology of give to the rich and rob the poor. Any kind of statement is better than just allowing corporate rape and pollution of the tribe’s assets. We need a Canadian Hugo Chavez style mentality to give the country back to Canadians and keep Canada alive and not simply falling into the NA Union trap with its Amero dollar, a feudal empire controlled by a Judas cult.

    • http://widne@facebook.com Sidney Wagner

      Today’s newspaper has an article about the state of the economy in Venezuela under Hugo Chevez. Central planning always fails, that is why they are having to ration water and suffer damaged electronics because of a lack of electrical power. The country is rich in oil revenue that Hugo is squandering on his thirst for power in the region.

    • DaveH

      The tax problem is the one you should be addressing Tom. But to replace the voluntary contracts of capitalism with the force of Big Government is a huge mistake. Restrictive government regulations strangle an economy. Do a search on ‘economic freedom’ and find out which countries do the best – heavily regulated (like Chavez’s) or those that adopt economic freedom.
      Big Government is the problem not the solution.

      • BillyJ

        Dave, you should warn people not to search Denmark, as they are rated the happiest in the world and they have many socialist programs, along with a high tax rate.

      • DaveH

        Read this article Billy.
        http://www.cato-at-liberty.org/2009/10/09/are-living-standards-higher-in-denmark-or-the-united-states/

        Keep in mind that every country has their own unique set of circumstances – heredity, work ethic, topography, etc., so it is difficult to compare one to the other based purely on their political structure. The true litmus test is when a country adopts a radically different political pathway than the past, such as Chile, or Hong Kong. If you really want to learn, type ‘economic freedom’ into your search field and start reading. Read several different articles from different sources, as admittedly, some are biased. You just have to read as much as possible, use your own life experiences, and come to your own conclusions about what makes sense and what doesn’t.
        For instance, if you explored the causes of the Great Depression, you would find that theories abound. So you have to read many different treatises and make up your own mind as to what makes the most sense.

  • Ted Christy

    Hi John,
    Enjoyed your article. You have the natural common sense of your father.Common sense seems to be a rare commodity these days.

    In the late seventies I subscribed to Meyer’s Finance and Energy which I enjoyed very much. He predicted gold to reach $1000.00 per oz. I took his advice and bought 20 oz at the 200.00 dollar range. I made out real well on that one.

    Keep up the good work.

    Ted christy
    Columbus, Ohio

    • John Myers

      Dear Ted,
      Thanks for your kind remarks.
      Warmly,
      John

      • Dr Robert Blease

        Envirnomentalsit, conservationalists and animal welfare supporters should be able to work together for the good of all. What makes sense for one, generally is good for all. Its to bad that sensationalism is what gets all the attention. Organizations like Green Peace and PETA have to resort to violence and civil disability for funding. Please look at our organization: common sense for animals .org and its six divisions. One philosophy covers all. We support farmers, sportsmen, companion pets, research animals, wildlife and the clean environment.

        • DaveH

          If you’re talking about voluntary solutions without the coercion of government, I applaud you.

      • denniso

        John Myers,
        Did you have to use such an incendiary title for your narrowly focused article.I guess you think it’s funny to talk about nuking people..What a great image in a world of spiraling violence.A little juvenile, don’t you think?

      • BillyJ

        With your use of such a title, it’s no wonder we have people like Llyod who respond with hate and are promoting killing. It is up to responsible journalists to avoid inciting the masses to the point of wanting to kill the subjects of your articles. I did find your article informative.

        • JeffH

          BillyJ, eyes…why don’t you list everyone that is promoting violence and killing on this site besides the idiot Lloyd. I don’t see it, but then I must not have my “eyeswideopen”!

  • Russell Skadberg

    They have said it themselves. People are not important to them. If they disrupt the production of energy (that provides a better life for everyone) they need to be taken out by what every means necessary. Not to say that the processing of energy should harm the environment but that they need to be reasonable.

    • DaveH

      The problem is, as previously pointed out, that they are trespassing.

      Most Liberals are all about force. They are perfectly capable of gathering large amounts of money (the same money they use to terrorize business) and using it to purchase large tracts of land which they can then preserve in whatever fashion they so desire. Some have done this. I applaud those people. The others are lowlifes.

  • http://www.jointhesolution.com/redriverd Walt

    I love all the do-gooders that have NO real answers to these and other problems in the world. Don’t they read? Don’t they know history? One of our great presidents Teddy Roosevelt, an acclaimed hunter, tried to stop hunting in the Grand Canyon during his presidency. It worked, except for the fact that there was not enough food for all the animals so they were dying of starvation (not a pretty site to be sure) and he re-instated hunting on a limited basis so as to keep the animals and environment in balance and it has worked ever since and not only there but throughout the US. Come on people, get real and LEARN.
    And on an additional note, I have come across a heck of a solution for some of our use of fossil fuels.
    But like anything else, people just don’t get it. Something is better than NOTHING! We have to wean ourselves OFF FOSSIL FUELS. Just 10% would be fantastic. But no one seems to be able to see the fantastic opportunity that this company has provided us. All I ask is that you visit the site and let me know what you think about it and why people aren’t taking an interest, either as a customer or as a business opportunity. Thanks for reading and giving me the opportunity to voice my opinion.

    • Vic Bailey, Auburn, Georgia

      I agree with you, the only thing is that people will NOT educate themselves they want to put it in the government’s hands which would be a disaster. We do need to take the responsibility that comes with the rights we want and have. Everybody wants their rights but don’t want the responsibility that comes with them!!!

    • BigA

      I work in energy for a living and have done a lot of research in “alternative” fuels. Even to use these “alternatives” cost more in fuel than just using hydrocarbon fuels. For example, until recently, batteries for a hybrid used more fuel to make than a years supply of gasoline. Where an internal combustion engine can be 60% efficient (40% of the fuel energy is lost in heat). At the most, the electricity used to charge an electric vehicle is only 40% efficient at your home outlet (60% of the fuel energy is lost in production at the plant and though heat as it is transported to your home) and that does not include the losses in the car. I have found the most efficient energy sources are the simplest. I agree that we need to reduce our use but not so much to change fuels, but to use less. We plan our outings to coincide with other things. For example, we take one car, drop “mom” off at the gym, go shopping with the kids to get our weeks worth of food and other items (visit stores in a circuit so we do not back track at all in our path), maybe visit “grandma”, then pick “mom” up at the gym. I will have to say that compared to friends of similar family makup, we have cut our gasoline consumption by half.

      • DaveH

        Nice comment, Big, thank you.

      • http://www.pcelementz.com Mr. Bruce

        Let me hear you say my ev I charge from a 1kw solar array on my roof is 40 percent efficient….

        Now whats the excuse?

        • DaveH

          This article is a year and a half old, so we may be there by now:
          http://reason.com/blog/2007/02/21/solar-power-too-cheap-to-meter

          If the costs of solar energy are comparable to that which we get from our electric sockets, then it would make sense to go in that direction. If the price of solar power is economical and environmentally friendly (unlike the giant wind generators), then the consumers will buy it willingly without the force of government being involved.
          As far as Electric Vehicles go, the initial price and the inconvenience so far outweigh the savings. I personally would love to have a hybrid vehicle, but the upfront costs currently would not be recouped by the gas savings. And I figure that the next environmental calamity will be what to do with all those batteries as they wear out.
          I am all for clean energy, but it has to be cost-effective and willingly embraced by the citizens rather than being forced down their throats by Big Government and its host of Corporate benefactors.
          If our nation is impoverished by Big Government waste, then we won’t have the money to do the right things for the environment.

  • Vic Bailey, Auburn, Georgia

    It’s just like the overpopulation of deer right here in the United States, some people would rather see them starve, than have hunter take it home and put it in a freezer.
    Just like this global warming CRAP, winters are getting colder, it’s because of the solar flares are on the decline, it’s just another way to steal money from the taxpayer, the government knows , you can’t fix stupid, and they know fear tacitcs work, if it were so bad would Al Gore be waisting so much energy every day, no, but he has a lot of money tied up in all kinds of businesses that will profit from this green house cap and trade policy. He’s not by himself, a lot of wall street is on the band wagon. Just remember people the bigger the lie the easier it is to believe.
    Like the old saying goes, wake up and smell the coffee!!!!

    • American Citizen

      You’re right on, the climate depends upon the actions of the sun, man can do nothing about it. Why the do-gooders try to play God is beyond me. They only make things worse. Idiots!

    • trut

      When the solar flares return we may see increases in temperature that are almost unimaginable.

      • http://www.pcelementz.com Mr. Bruce

        So these solar flares never happened in the past 10,000 years before now?

    • David

      Yes and China is just praying that we adopt cap/trade so nat gas and coal will become cheaper for them to buy as their new fossil power plants go online!

      I do agree with Lloyd at the top…”was that someone strapped to my bulldozer? Oh well they should not have been on private property. Then the idoits will stop.

      It is about time for the majority to stand up and take this country back.

      • DaveH

        David,
        My cousin was elk hunting in Wyoming. As he was driving down a narrow dirt road towards elk country, a small group of radicals were blocking the road. He got out and asked them to move. They refused, so he told them “fine, I’m going through, stand there if you want”. He got in his car and started driving; they moved.

        • Rod

          Gosh Dave, I sure wish they hadn’t moved!

      • http://www.pcelementz.com Mr. Bruce

        Great, let’s take it back and get rid of government! Let’s get rid of the police, fire, military, schools, libraries, evil bankers and post office and all of our laws other than the constitution.

        When you get rid of all those things, I’m just begging to know what you plan on doing when someone breaks in your home while you’re away and steals your life savings…. ah ah ah… Can’t call the police, that would be socialism. We tried that in europe right?(parrot)

        What happens if something happens to you that disables you? Does anyone here actually believe if you were dying you wouldn’t ask for help? I guess you would rather die off than have a public aid option right? This would be socialism too.

        Everyone here knows that in a fit of rage, you would reverse your position on government/public programs if you got knocked on your a$$.
        Can’t you guys show just a little bit of restraint and humbleness instead of being so damn cocky?

        I really want to know what you guys plan on doing once you get rid of the government, the bankers, and the liberals. Will you appoint like rush limbaugh as prime minister and glen beck as secretary of defense?
        Then maybe just nuke iran? Get rid of all the muslims in the world maybe? Or maybe have barack hung for some deranged idea that somehow he caused all these problems? Or anytime someone comes up with a conspiracy theory online, assume it’s real and take aggressive action?

        Reality check:

        Lets take back the country! Oh yeah… we already did…
        We elected barack obama and he won by a landslide…. doh!

        I’ll give you a good analogy of “taking back the country”.

        General Lee at the battle of Gettysburgh.

        Lot’s of good hearted southern men fighting against morality and reason, cocky as hell, were sent to their death, trying to defend principles that are unjust and sound. Things haven’t changed much.

        Do you “take back the country” folks know who or what you are after?
        And Why are you after them? Yes, we’re all pissed that the country and most of us are broke as hell while bankers get bailouts and bonuses. So I guess barack is part of the evil banking clan, along with bush for keeping the U.S. banking system solvent and not causing national and probably worldwide financial collapse? Seriously? Is it even possible to be angry at the banks and believe in the free market 44:1 buying on margin bullsh1t that caused this at the same time?

        Do you have any real evidence of some of your silly claims? Or is all this just for attention?

        I’m really curious…

        • BillyJ

          Mr. Bruce, you pose some interesting questions.

        • DaveH

          All you have to do is watch your TV (commercials) to see that private police forces are already working for many homeowners (who apparently don’t feel they get enough protection from the police) – Broadview Security, ADT, etc.
          But your argument is fallacious because most people aren’t complaining about the police, fire department, military, libraries, or the bankers. They are complaining about our tax money being given to organizations like the corrupt ACORN, or the SEIU, or the UAW, all examples of vote-buying by Obama. They are complaining about the money that is wasted by the government on pork-barrel projects that really aren’t needed. They are complaining about the debt that the government is forcing on us and our children and grandchildren.
          They are complaining about the money that is being taken from hard-working citizens to be given to those who aren’t making an effort.
          When this country is impoverished by all the wasteful spending, the leaders and their cohorts will be fine as they were in the USSR, and as they are in China, or Cuba, or Venezuela. The rest of the citizens can eat cake.

          • JeffH

            DaveH, you can’t begin to reason with these fools. They just can’t see the bigger picture. If they really did their homework and realized what this guys intentions are, then they are either stupid to the facts or just want government to run every facet to their lives. And I thought the Bush administration was bad, who am I trying to kid. Who needs freedom anyway!

        • American Citizen

          If you can’t see what they’re trying to do to our Constitution, then you are intellectually blind. They now want to do away with the 1st Amendment, our freedom of speech. Obama is as thin skinned as you can get and has no business being the president of this country. As presidents before him have said, “The buck stops here” and “if you can’t stand the heat, get out of the kitchen.”

    • Thurman Marcum

      Vic Bailey,

      I agree with you.It is solar activities,that is creating climate changes.In nineteen-seventies, we were about to enter the ice age.Today,its global warming.Al Gore is full of it.
      We need to start working on alternative energy sources,without jeopardizing our economy.This global warming theory is nothing but hot air.I am from the left.Have a good day.

      • libertytrain

        Thurman, I agree with you wholeheartedly.

        • Thurman Marcum

          Liberty,

          How do they explain the planet Mars?It is getting warmer. I like to ask that conterfeit liberal Al Gore that. I am a true liberal,he is not.We keep a open mind and if we are proven wrong,we will be the first ones to admit our mistakes.

          • libertytrain

            Thurman – I don’t know about Mars getting warmer but I’m sure it has something to do with George W. Bush – (Ok, you were supposed to smile.) I’ll be happy to keep an open mind on this global warming issue – - I have to be able to admit my mistakes, I’m not that bright, I make many.

          • DaveH

            You’re a good man Thurman.

          • American Citizen

            True climatologists who do actual research claim we are in a cooling period. They do not rely on those computer models which are built on opinion.

      • BillyJ

        We were promised in the 70′s that we would come off of oil, and that we would upgrade our electric grid. We did neither, due to the influence that the Oil companies have in this country. If a terrorist wanted to stop this country, our electric grid would be the place to strike. I have never liked the idea of being dependent on another country for our fuel, and had hoped that we would be smart enough to invest in other sources. Today, I must state that our officials must have been taking pay offs, as we have done nothing to stop pollution or our dependence on oil.

      • JeffH

        I have to agree with you also. I duck hunt so I have watched the climate change since the late 60′s to the point that we, in California , lost our Indian Summers and Santa Ana winds in late September and the heavy rains didn’t start until Feb. or March. Now it is starting to rain in October again. Have we gone full circle? Global Warming is just a guess at best, man hasn’t lived long enough to make an accurate study, but an educated guess is the best that can be done give or take 10,000 years.

        • DaveH

          Jeff,
          The debate isn’t whether or not Global Warming is occurring. The debate is whether it is man-made or not. More particularly, even if a small portion is man-made, is it worth government intervention to stop that small portion? There is a lot of money to be made by certain alternative-energy corporations if the government can force their products on the citizens. Another aspect is that many other countries of the world see it as a way to hobble the United States and redistribute our wealth.

          • JeffH

            I do understand that and I agree.

  • Snowbird In New Hampshire, USA

    Question: Why did Obama evict the Christian Bible from our WHITE house? Pray tell…

    • DaveH

      Religion stands in the way of those who aspire to totalitarianism.

  • Snowbird In New Hampshire, USA

    Quote: “In everything both great and small, we see the hand of God in all…”

    • David

      By 2011 our children will all be saying the pledge of allegiance again….just wait and see.

      • Snowbird In New Hampshire, USA

        Well Dave ~ Money won’t do a darn thing for ya; but then again neither will therapy… (smile)..:-)

        • Snowbird In New Hampshire, USA

          Oop’s that was meant for David!!!

        • David

          I think you missed my point…is it already too cold up there?

          • Snowbird In New Hampshire, USA

            It’s 42 degrees here now but it will be down to 30 this evening.

      • JeffH

        I sure hope so.

  • Alan

    It is obvious Greenpeace and its ilk are interested in rational discourse on the matter. Nor are they interested in mitigating what they see as a problem in the consumption of petroleum. These people should be treated in a manner commensurate with their tactics. Perhaps imprisonment in some place above the Artic circle would be appropriate.
    That these people are interested in raising money for disruption rather than solutions reveals they are not up to the task of solving a problem they seem not to be able to identify clearly to begin with.
    It would be intersted to learn just how money they have consumed to be irrational when they could have been doing the honest work of creating intelligent solutions to the problems they perceive.

    • DaveH

      Because it takes work and innovation to pursue positive solutions.

      • BillyJ

        Something, that neither party has wished to do. It took gas going to $5.50 a gallon for the people in this country to get concerned. Which is not as much as the europeans are paying. We are definately spoiled and selfish, and only respond when a situation reaches a crisis.

  • Tim

    I wonder if they relize that if they are blowing up sour gas lines, there is the danger of Hydrogen Sulfide killing numerous inocent lives. There is more at stake than just their STUPID agenda. Yes we do need to curtail or dependency on fossil fuels but till there is an dependabe alternative LEAVE THE PRODUCTION FACILITY’S ALONE.

    • DaveH

      Tim,
      For them it isn’t about Reason, it is about Force.

  • http://none Dale

    This is for the extreme environmentalists, if they have guts enough to read it. Environmentalists are hypocrites with Obama and Gore as their supreme leader gods.

    In the videos I saw the protestors wearing T-shirts, Jeans, shoes, and watches. Bet they drove their cars to the protests, communicated with their cell phones. The ones that protested on the water were in boats that consumed energy to manufacture. Bet some had gas or electric motors too.

    To be a true environmental one would have to shun all forms of energy consumption. Run naked, build their own shelter without tools, grow their own food using a stick to till the ground, make their own medicine from nature, no doctors, no products made by man.

    Everything takes energy to produce, even the books and computers used to train doctors, Using energy’s benefits violates the environmentalist’s code. Come on Environmentalists you cannot have it both ways. You cannot ask or expect others to do what you also don’t do.

    On second thought, even plants and animals consume energy so it is impossible to be a true environmentalist. It even takes energy to commit suicide so it is impossible to be energy free.

    • s c

      What irks me most about ecoretards is their absolute rejection of common sense. To them, all that matters is whether or not something sounds good or feels good. What they really have is a false god (gore) and a religion based on hypocrisy. They REFUSE to admit that their “god” got a nobel peace prize because he lost an election. He probably can’t change a light bulb by himself, and they have the gall to see him as ALL-KNOWING! Gore will NEVER admit that he’ll do ANYTHING to get rich via the global warming HOAX. Ecozombies have a world-class loser for a god, and he has mindless, economy destroyers for followers. They deserve each other.
      I’ll take my chances with common sense. Gore and his tree-groping ecozombies can catch the next star cruiser and move to another universe – NOW!

    • denniso

      Dale,
      you’re a bit off the wall,fella. Environmentalists know that human populations need energy..we just think we should use less and cleaner energy rather than the dirtiest. We don’t want the earth and our children’s future ruined by gluttinous over consumption. The U.S. uses 25% of the worlds energy and we have only 5% of the population..something’s wrong w/ that. If the rest of the world starts consuming like us, the world won’t support it.
      NO one is saying to give up all energy use..get real!!

      • BillyJ

        denniso, I agree, our greed has also landed us in the financial crisis we are now trying to dig ourselves out from under. Americans need to adhere to our Chrisitan values, and be more concerned about our brothers in other countries. Greed is usually the downfall of the greatest civilizations. We have a very selfish and greedy attitude about the worlds resources and it is a little ironic and hyocritical to profess that this country is Christian, without honoring those Christian beliefs. The preachers,priests and rabbis need to minister to the people, they seem to have forgotten the little phrase about “brothers keeper”.

  • James Corbin

    Vic, You are exactly right and Al Gore also!!!! They speak oF globel warming——–in my state, we have had a cool summer!! It’s all about money for Al Gore. Doesn’t stop him from using his jet with all the pollution, plus all the electricity!!!

    • DaveH

      Make no mistake, this is not about environmentalism. It is all about the Liberal Leaders making money on their alternative energy schemes. What else would explain all the environmental hypocrisy that they exhibit? And their blindered followers just keep following. Baa a a. Baa a a.

      • BillyJ

        Dave, what are your views on conversation, the environment and our high usage of the earths resources? Just curious.

  • DaveH

    Have you noticed how the Libs have replaced the phrase ‘Global Warming’ with ‘Climate Change’. That way they can go both ways (both sexually and ideologically now). Tricky suckers, they are.

    There is nothing wrong with having moral convictions such as “an extreme position I’ve come to hold, just because I think it is morally unjustified to kill elephants,” Moss said”. When it becomes wrong is when you force those moral convictions on others. Isn’t it ironic that the same Liberals who want to eradicate religious morals from public life have no problem trying to force their ‘green’ morality on the rest of us.
    Big Government is force, not reason.

    • David

      You know what’s sad…..our local chamber of commerce is trying to decide whether or not to back this legislation. They are leaning towards supporting because of the pressure from the big utilities. So we sent out an email to no less than 100 area companies…many with smokestacks. Now I am having to spend a huge amount of time explaining to them what cap/trade will mean to them, even if they are not subject to the actual cap tax. Unreal!

  • AntonioSosa

    More and more scientists and thinking people all over the world are realizing that “man-made global warming” is a hoax that threatens our future and the future of our children.

    More than 700 international scientists dissent over man-made global warming claims. They are now more than 13 times the number of UN scientists (52) who authored the media-hyped IPCC 2007 Summary for Policymakers.

    Additionally, more than 30,000 American scientists have signed onto a petition that states, “There is no convincing scientific evidence that human release of carbon dioxide, methane, or other greenhouse gases is causing or will, in the foreseeable future, cause catastrophic heating of the Earth’s atmosphere and disruption of the Earth’s climate.” http://www.petitionproject.org

    If man-made CO2 really increased the earth’s temperature, we should be burning more oil and producing more CO2 because the earth is really COOLING.

  • Thomas O. Nass

    Just wanted to let you know that we in the proces of filling your Order for more crayons. Thank you for your Order.

  • CR Engelking

    Ever notice that when a conservative decides he/she doesnt like something he/she doesnt use it/do it?

    Ever notice that when a liberal doesnt like something he/she tries to prevent everybody else from using it?

    • DaveH

      Yep, misery loves company.

    • JeffH

      That theory doesn’t float with the lefty libs. They can’t see the forest for the trees. Look how screwed up California is. The environmentalists and tree huggers have virtualy destroyed Californias’ industries through regulation. They would rather see wild animals die from disease because of overpopulation than die at the hand of a hunter who puts that meat on his table and helps to keep the game healthy through game managment, a proven success that has game numbers exploading in the US. The dollars spent by sportsman are what sustains and enhances the habitat so we don’t lose this important resource.

      • DaveH

        Jeff,
        I guess I am going to quit trying to educate the people to reality, because MR.BRUCE says it is useless.

        • http://www.pcelementz.com Mr. Bruce

          No answer huh? Where was your free market, when corporate bimbos begged congress for bailouts? That is reality dave… Unfortunately to prove that free markets don’t work millions of people have to die off, and for most people that would go on their conscience, so don’t expect someone to prove it to you.

          Not that everybody has a conscience…

          • DaveH

            Search using the phrase ‘economic freedom’ and read about the realities of free markets vs. heavily regulated markets. Get some education.

          • http://www.pcelementz.com Mr. Bruce

            Really? Kind of like Enron in California in 1999 right? You mean that free market?

            This one right here?

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dm61gVae-I&feature=player_embedded

            This is what men do in “free” do want thou wilst, markets…

            How can you be mad at the “free market” banks and support free markets at the same time?

            Do you understand why it’s kind of an oxy-moron?

          • DaveH

            Did I say we have a free-market? Of course there are companies that feed at the government trough. They couldn’t force their way on us without the Big Government as their bully-boys.

  • ole hunter

    Its interesting how Myers only tells the facts as he sees them.
    Enviormental Terrorist recruiting is on the rise around the world because of “Corporatists” like Mr. Myers.

    How much of Canadas oil and Natural gas stays in Canada?… dont the Citizens of Canada own the oil that Foreign owned corporations are removing from Canada and selling to China?????
    Why doesnt ALL the Oil Produced in Canada stay in Canada?
    If all the oil produced in Canada stayed in Canada there would no more Mr. Myers and there would never be a energy crisis in Canada.

    How much of oil produced in the United States stays in the United States?

    Does Myers and others like him hold hands with China, while Chinese made Weapons kill Canadian an U.S soldiers and CONTRACTORS in Afghanistan and Iraq?

    Mr. Myers and other “CORPORATISTS” like Mr. Myers are very similar to The Enviromental Terrorist. Both Group types are control freaks and use other peoples money, greed and even fear to gain fame fortune and control.

    And Mr. Myers Elephant story, kinda makes my point… the end justifies the means as long as its for his means and way of thinking.

    The Enviro Terrorist is Nuts and so are the people that think like Mr. Myers !!!!

    • John Myers

      Dear ole hunter,

      Canadians don’t own the oil in Canada; the shareholders in companies own the oil. The Feds and provinces get a royalty on production and tax the companies and resident shareholders on profits.

      These same private companies want to maximize profits and thus sell their production to the United States or any other buyers, thus not keeping it locked up in Canada’s tundra.

      As for the United States, every last drop produced in the nation is burnt by Americans. U.S. oil imports are now at a record high, with production at the same low levels it was when Truman was President.

      As for being a “Corporatists”, I don’t even know what that word means.

      For where I stand on other conservation ships, I stand against them endangering human life in the effort to make political points.

      John Myers

      • ole hunter

        Mr. Myers,
        A Corporatist; is a individual that must use others money to make their own living but makes nothing, produces or contributes nothing useful to society but yet suggests they are useful….

        Corporatism; is the belief in using others money , property, business or countries natural resources to obtain personal gain.

        Mr. Myers, I to am against human lives being lost to promote a political veiw point or being lost for financial gain!!

        • John Myers

          A Corporatist sounds like a Capitalist. What you say against that sounds very much like Marx, in The Communist Manifesto.

          I say this without malice; rather it is just my observation.

          And I do appreciate that you hold human life sacred.

          Best,

          John Myers

          sacred.
          Best,

          John Myers

      • http://www.pcelementz.com Mr. Bruce

        So, do you believe that this has to do with peak oil? Or is this all the politicians fault for not letting us drill in anwr?

        What are the odds of a shell geologist in 1950, predicting peak oil in 1970 and then oil peaking in 1970 if it doesn’t have to do with peak oil?

        • john

          Just a short note. The global warming bs is soley for the purpose to destroy the US. There is plenty of oil available within our borders. At last count to my knowledge we have ANWAR, Bakken oil reserve which has about 508 billion barrels of light sweet crude and a whole heck of a lot of oil in Florida. The total amount is somewhere about 200 years worth of oil to supply us. Now stretch that with wind power, solar power and a few other sources yet to be considered, we have more energy within our borders to power our country for at least 500 years or more. One such source has an estimated 1,4 peta watts of energy ready to be tapped. That is one billion megawatts of power which is capable of powering the entire planet for 100 years.

  • Dr. John A.

    Vic, I agree with you! In the ’80s’ the alarm was Global Cooling, once proven wrong it became Global Warming. Now that this is also being proved wrong, the new alarm statement is Climate Change.
    My nephew, who is in his 2nd year of college, is an aspiring Environmental Scientist that was just telling me about being taught about the dwindling number of polar bear in Alaska. Me being a scientist myself, challenged him to produce the documents that he got these facts from. To which he stated, “My teacher is teaching us this.” My advice to him was to research these facts online because the exact opposite is true!! It seems that our colleges and universities are being poisoned with idiological principals and are teaching our youth similarly. And, what a better trumpeter for this ill cause than Al Gore himself. Let us also remember, that while he was Govenor of his state, before he became this country’s Vice President, his state ranked last or near last when compared with the other states, in many environmental issues!! Something that one would’ve assumed would have hurt President Clinton’s efforts with the environment, but didn’t.

  • ONTIME

    Green Peace is run by a communist, same can be said for the ACLU, they do work hand in hand to push for legislation that will impair the normal flow of free market business done in this country and interfere with the rights of victims that have suffered from criminal abuse and then label it freedom of civil rights for a smoke screen. The courts time is used and abused the citizens suffer inordinate persecution due to misapplied law and bought off jurisdiction. Sweetheart justice is a mainstay of the environmentalist, they influence the courts by pushing for activist judicial appointments, thereby extending their socialistic idealolgy and making life difficult for those seeking jurisprudence by presenting real evidence and fact in a court of law.

    The NAZI’s were especially adept at using envvironmental issues to deny justice and then putting the free market into to a spin by indulging a collusion by corporation and government complicity. Prices were set the market controlled and competition was reduced to a bare minimum….Does all this sound real familiar? Well you do know what happened to the NAZI’s.

    • http://www.pcelementz.com Mr. Bruce

      Since you must be an expert in the field of socialism, can you name two types of socialist societies that have existed in history and give us all a comparison on how they are like our society in the U.S.?

  • Carol

    We all have to step up and save Mother Earth or there will be no Mother Earth to save and that is a fact.

  • ole hunter

    DONATE TO GREEN PEACE>> SEA SHEPPARD AND FLAMING ARROW, ALF, ELF and the IRA… Check their web sites out!!!
    USE YOUR VISA CARD or MASTER CARD

    ITS INTERESTING HOW GLOBAL CORPORATE BANKS ARE USED TO FUND TERROR!!!!!!!!
    WHERE IS MR. MYERS ON THAT ISSUE!!!!!!!!

    DOES MOBIL OIL SPONSOR SEA SHEPPARD??????????????????

    DOES VISA SPONSOR TERRORISM.

    • Robert

      Stop using all capital letters. Protocol considers it rude and yelling. I skip over all replies that are all in upper case. Consider the responder as illiterate.

  • michael

    Elephants never forget. They will come for their revenge sooner or later.

    • Johnnyrite

      Great comment Michael!

  • Blondi 2

    On the so called Cap N Trade dill,it doesn’t have anything to do with the enviroment!It has to do with a one world government! Obama is sopose to go to Copenhagen in December,said he isn’t because he is picking up his Nobel Prise.Not! He is going to sign this treaty with the UN and when he does our constitution will not mean zilch anymore.We will be beholding to the UN from now on! We will have lost our American soverenty forever,no matter who we vote in!!!! We will not be able to withdraw from the treaty,because all of the countries would have to sign us out and they will never do that! Why you say? Because we will be the ones giving the biggest amount of money to the UN,third world countries etc.China and India,our biggest polluters are not signing on to this treaty! So what sense does it make that this is for the enviroment?It has nothing to do with the enviroment and everything to do with Americas Soverenty!!!!!!!!! They are keeping this evry low key because they know what will happen if the people find out! Call your Senators and Congress!NOW! If this isn’t a reason to empeach the president then please tell me what is!!!!! He is giving our freedom away for nothing and we and our children will be paying our big money to the rest of the world for the far future.We will be a One World Government!!!! In case you haven’t figured it out yet our president doesn’t like the America we love!!!! We will have lost our soverenty and our freedom to who ever is running the world government,who ever they decide that he will be. I know this sounds like something totally unreal,and I wish it was,but it’s not!!!!! Please get the word out as fast as you can because it is less than 6 weeks from now that this is going to happen!!! Please if you don’t believe me do your research and find out for yourself!!! THIS IS TOO IMPORTANT TO IGNORE!!!! THIS IS OUR FREEDOM WE ARE TALKING ABOUT HERE! Please get the word out ,because we don’t have very much time at all.

  • DaveH
    • BillyJ

      Isn’t that foundation a Libertarian Think Tank? I get the drift that you hate the liberals, but shouldn’t you be referencing independent sources for your arguements? It would be more conducive in making your point, if you weren’t using prejudiced material.

      • DaveH

        You bet Billy, as is Cato, and Mises. But there are plenty of other sources to read for honest information. Find your own. I have read from many sources over my 40 years of adulthood, and I trust these people more than most.
        Do you think for an instant that the people and companies who feed at the government trough aren’t just a little biased? The first requirement for any totalitarian government is to reign in the media.

    • JeffH

      DaveH, take a close look at BillyJ’s comments. Do they have a somewhat familiar sound to them? I bet if you had your “eyeswideopen” you might see a familiar technique being used.

      • eyeswideopen

        I guess I will have to ask him where he got his education, what field he is in, and how old he is. I take that as a compliment, as BillyJ doesn’t sound like a complete idiot. Jeff, you are funny, you see a boogie man behind everyone who guestions you.

        • libertytrain

          Eyeswideopen – I can imagine why BillyJ doesn’t sound like a complete idiot to you – I don’t think Jeff is seeing a boogie man, I think he is seeing someone trying to be clever.

        • DaveH

          Eyes, it’s pretty cool that you actually read an article by Thomas Sowell. Did you put on your necklace of garlic first?

          • eyeswideopen

            Dave, I have been reading him, since you recommended him. I just don’t agree with him. I am also reading about other countries and how they are handling the situation that our market brought upon them. Due to being smaller they are finding recovery to be faster and easier, however, most have tightened their banking regulations. As I said before, some of Sowell’s ideas, I agree with, however alot, I don’t.

          • eyeswideopen
  • Rod

    Blondi, your right! This peace of manure is going to try to get a treaty. Ya know, it may not be that simple!

  • http://www.pcelementz.com Mr. Bruce

    I have a question. Please answer it.

    Why should people and cultures be exposed to cancer causing toxins, rivers, forests and lakes damaged beyond repair so that people in the U.S. can drive around in hummers and gmc yukons and take vacations every month to vegas?

    This is the main argument here. What kind of people believe this is justified?

    America needs to move away from being “fat and sadistic” to
    “slim and enlightened”.

    • Mr.G

      You’re a moron!
      Always go after the aspec of people with big cars and taking vacations.
      Well Mr Hermit, I guess you want your steak to cost about $150
      and your chicken to be $250 per pound and I can assume you don’t eat any vegatables or use or buy any products that are shipped from coast to coast. And next time you want to go visit someone in Florida or San Diego “WALK”
      Alot of other countries pollute just as much or more so their people or goverments can have what they want!
      It’s just reported or recorded!
      China doesn’t even admit or aknowledge that they pollute.
      Russia offsets it’s pollution by buying up carbon credits from all the other countries.
      I Taiwan the only 1/4 inch deep of the rivers there have been tested to be alive because of all the waste that they dump directly into the rivers from the chip industries that they don’t even bother to filter out.

      But you’re too stupid to realize this, Right!

      You probably don’t even live here in America, but if you do you should leave!!!

      • BillyJ

        Did you ever stop to think, that if we keep doing what we have been doing for the past 60 or so years, that we will be just like Twaian, Russia and China? What is wrong with being repectful of the earth and allowing our children to see clean streams and reducing their chances of getting cancers like the children and Marines have gotten at Camp LeJune in North Carolina? Why all the resistance to not polluting?

        • Robert

          I believe the majority of Americans including those who wrote comments on this article agree that we need to address pollution. What we don’t need is the federal government getting involved. Most local governments can address this issue very competently. They have more experience working with businesses to solve many social issues that effect their residents and surrounding communities. The federal government’s answer is more taxes. That’s not the solution, that’s the problem.

      • denniso

        MrG,
        Mr.Bruce asks a good question and you reply,”you’re a moron”. I think most people here,even those who disagree w/ Mr. Bruce, can see who the actual moron is. Try a little harder to be civil and a bit smarter..OK??

      • http://www.pcelementz.com Mr. Bruce

        Replying to my question with ad hominem doesn’t convince or prove anything. My 9 year old son could come up with a funnier response than “your a moron”.

        I’ll bet you a grand, you can’t answer my question. Now what does that say?

        I’ll ask again:

        Why do the indigenous people down stream from the tar sands have to drink from polluted water so most of us in the states can drive trucks with empty beds around? How do you justify destroying someone elses backyard so yard so you can live with extra luxury you don’t need to survive?

        What kind of person does that make you if you find justification in this?

        Every single person here knows we have total moral breakdown in this country. Let’s fess up to it and change. It’s like trying to get an alcoholic to admit he has a drinking problem.

        • BillyJ

          Mr. Bruce, you are correct, we are a greedy nation.

          • DaveH

            Yes, I can agree with that. How else could Obama have been elected?

        • http://PersonalLiberty Jeffrey Barker

          We have more oil in one state, (North or south Dakota, I forget which one.) than all of the middle east put together. Add that to all the oil in the other states including Alaska, Plus the offshore reserves. The U.S. has more oil than it knows what to do with and will for a long, long time. It’s all a game….

        • Mr. G

          Well why am I not surprised that you had to resort to an infantile response like “my little child can come up with a response better than yours”.
          Well if you would like to be that way, if you’re teaching your son he’s probably as stupid as you!
          This definitely shows your lack of intelligence!!!
          As usual you and most of the other liberals that responded to the comment missed the whole point of my post.
          I have absolutely no problem with stopping pollution or cleaning it up or preventing it in the first place.
          My problem is with an idiot like you blaming the common American people for it and everything that goes wrong in the world today. Because you too much of a coward to confront the government who says they do it in the benefit of the American people, which is a lie.
          Actually I’m sick and tired of it and hearing the like of you blaming the American people!!
          And don’t claim you aren’t because every time you constitute blame to America you’re referring to us the common Americans which have little or no control at over it.
          And voting for different issues do not do anything!
          So again Mr. America basher, I’ll say it again if you didn’t understand it the first time around “if you don’t like America and Americans pack you and your sons bags and leave the country”!!! You and your criticism will not be missed at all as far as I am concerned!
          Oh! And feel free to come up with another infantile response! “MORON”

      • eyeswideopen

        Mr. G, We are trying to discuss our responsibility for our share of pollution. Every weekend, I have to pick up trash that boaters leave in our lake. Personal accountability is something we need to emphasize. We have the tendency to not respond until a situation reaches a critical boiling point, then we get motivated and spring into action like our butts are on fire, as they ususally are by the time we react.

        • DaveH

          A wealthy nation of people have more leisure time to do those kinds of things. So don’t be part of the impoverishment if you truly care about the environment.

    • Boudro

      My husband works in the oil industry and it does not cause cancer, this is one thing that Obama and all other greenpeace and Democrates want you to believe. We can drill here in the United States and not be holden to foreign oil but the goverment lies and won’t let the companies drill like the people wanted. There is not enough power no matter how many solar systems wind systems, we need nuclear systems and the greenies won’t allow that either. If you think things will get better under cap and tax (oh I mean trade) think again you won’t have any say over your power. We have a right to drive our cars and to use natural gas and oil for our homes and cars. If you don’t like it here move to a third world country we don’t need you or want you in our country.

      • denniso

        Boudro,
        Great comment!! I see we’re back to, “America,love it or leave it”. So you don’t think fellow citizens have the right to give good criticism about what’s wrong w/ our country? You think everything is perfect,and there’s no room for improvement? Then I guess you have nothing to complain about either?

      • eyeswideopen

        Boudro, who died and left you boss? Maybe some of us like to be able to have conversations with people who don’t agree with us. Sometimes you find that you aren’t right and will change your mind. You sound like you are the one party, one religion, one thought type of girl. What makes this country great is the diversity. Please rethink your attitude about those who force you to think about things in a different way.

        • DaveH

          And therein lays the problem – force.
          Big Government is Force not Reason.

      • JeffH

        Boudro, you are absolutely correct. Technology is so good today that we need to tap into the sweet cude that has been dicovered in the states but is being blocked by the enviros, government and the rich and powerful. There is too much profit left to be made in the middle east.

    • DaveH

      Read the article link that I posted in my above comment. Get some education.

  • Merl Elton

    Greenpeace and PETA employ many very wealthy, well-educated, well-informed and highly intelligent people. However, these agencies need to abandon some of the crazy ways that scare and alienate some people who would help them. They need to fight disrespect for God’s beautiful earth and her creatures in more mature and conventional ways. No good person wants to see animals suffer for food. No good person wants innocent harp seals, whales and calves; or any other animals killed inhumanely for products that are not really needed– except for vanity. No good person wants animals inhumanely killed for inhumanely; no matter what. With education and empathy, humans are slowly evolving into a more humane species. Anyone who has lived with pets knows that animals are highly intelligent; can communicate; and have feelings much like our own. Every sane and intelligent person wants a safe, clean, and green planet; because if not, we will all perish. Many people get cancer because meat animals are fed high amounts of antibiotics and dangerous hormones to counteract these animals being raised horrible conditions; and to feed the masses. Industrial pollutants carelessly tossed into the land and seas pollute fish and greens; and these toxins also build up in human systems where they cause cancer. Exhaust from millions of vehicles causes cancer. There are far too many us to afford the folly of abusing the planet that nourishes and sustains us. The principles of conservatism and restraint can be also applied to preserving the enviornment and the earth and their self-cleaning and perpetuating mechansims for future generations. Greenpeace and their allies; therefore, have the impertive to act wisely.

    • JeffH

      Greenpeace and PETA are nothing but self serving thugs.
      The modern animal rights movement is not what it seems. Today’s activists have perverted once-sensible animal welfare goals by putting animals ahead of human beings and employing a “by any means necessary” philosophy to achieve their goals of “total animal liberation.”

      Led by PETA, the Humane Society of the United States, and other activist groups, the animal liberation movement does not seek to improve animals’ lives. Its goal is to place unnecessary restrictions on ordinary people like you.
      “Ethical” Defined
      According to PETA’s own filings, in 2004 PETA killed 86.3 percent of the animals entrusted to its care. PETA took in $29 million in tax-exempt donations. It simply has other priorities for the funds, like funding terrorism (yes, really). http://www.PETAkillsAnimals.com
      After more than 100 dead dogs were dumped in a trash dumpster over four weeks, police in Ahoskie, N.C., kept an eye on the trash receptacle behind a supermarket. Sure enough, a van drove up and officers watched the occupants throw in heavy plastic bags. They detained the two people in the van and found 18 dead dogs in plastic bags in the dumpster, including puppies; 13 more dead dogs were still in the van. Police say the van is registered to the headquarters of People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals, and the two occupants, Andrew B. Cook, 24, and Adria Joy Hinkle, 27, identified themselves as PETA employees. An autopsy performed on one of the dogs found it was healthy before it was killed.

      As Nobel laureate Norman Borlaug warns, Greenpeace’s actions threaten the health and sustainability of the world: “I now say that the world has the technology — either available or well-advanced in the research pipeline — to feed a population of 10 billion people. The more pertinent question today is whether farmers and ranchers will be permitted to use this new technology. Extremists in the environmental movement from the rich nations seem to be doing everything they can to stop scientific progress in its tracks.”

      • JeffH

        Exclusive: PETA’s Pet Killing Program Set a New Record in 2008
        Public Records: PETA Found Adoptive Homes for Less than 1 out of 300 Animals
        PETA has a $32 million annual budget. But instead of investing in the lives of the thousands of flesh and blood creatures in its care, the group spends millions on media campaigns telling Americans that eating meat, drinking milk, fishing, hunting, wearing leather shoes, and benefiting from medical research performed on lab rats are all “unethical.”

        • American Citizen

          They think they’re holier than God. Even Jesus was a meat eater. He also drank wine, so was not a teetotaler.

          • denniso

            NO ONE KNOWS if Jesus ate meat or drank wine or if he even existed.I’m afraid your comment is utterly pointless.

          • JeffH

            denniso, why don’t you tell us all the good things that Greenpeace and PETA do for animals and the environment. Ducks Unlimited has done more than all of them, Because they make partnerships that work together instead of lies.

          • JeffH

            denniso, your comment was typically pointless!

      • http://www.pcelementz.com Mr. Bruce

        “The more pertinent question today is whether farmers and ranchers will be permitted to use this new technology”

        That’s interesting, I didn’t know oil, tar sands, natural gas and coal were new technologies. Thanks for informing us….

  • Chris

    How dare your corporate loving ultra right wing fearmonger site advertise as though you are collecting polls on issues. You have your own agenda. Stick to your own kind and stop pretending you are anything but corporate apologists. (WORD REMOVED FOR OFFENSIVE CONTENT)

    • DaveH

      And you don’t have an agenda?

    • American Citizen

      Another McDonald’s worker heard from.

      • BillyJ

        American Citizen, you are demeaning the people who are working for a living. Some have to work at McDonald’s and who are you to degrade that work? You obviously must be wealthy and look down on anyone who works at such a place. Sad, very sad.

        • eyeswideopen

          Billy, she is not rich, sometimes, she just gets caught up in the rhetoric on the site. I don’t think she realizes what she said. Now for you:
          How old are you? Where do you live? and what college did you attend?
          Jeffie, thinks we have similiar styles, just wondering where you get your delightful style from, LAMO. I think he sees me in everybody he dosen’t agree with. lol.

          • libertytrain

            Eyes – are you being clever again?

          • JeffH

            Libertytrain, just a split personality. Not a clever one though.

          • libertytrain

            JeffH- I think split personality means different personalities – in this case we are just dealing with the same personality more than once.

          • JeffH

            libertytrain, I think you are correct.

          • eyeswideopen

            Hey, I like American, and sometimes I think she just doesn’t realize what she has said that could be hurtful. She is in her 70′s and I will always give the older citizens the benefit of the doubt. So both of you can just eat beetles. I will defend her if I want to!!. You are both very cynical, quit projecting your issues onto me.

          • JeffH

            eyes, you are the fool for trying to sham us with the split personality.

    • American Citizen

      I was not demeaning those who work at McDonald’s, I was commenting on your demeaning corporations who provide the high paying jobs and help those of us who invest in them to complement our SS. We all know those who work at McDonald’s don’t receive more than minimum wages If McDonald’s had to pay what those who work for corporations pay, no one could afford to eat there. That’s why you see mostly teenagers working there as well as at most fast food restaurants.

  • DaveH

    It’s interesting to me that the same people who rail about animal rights want to increase the populations of Grizzlies and Wolves.
    Have you seen what they do to their victims? Not nearly as humane a death as they receive from humans.

  • Robert

    I’m a hard core environmentalist. I believe that we should round up all the muslims throughout the world and drop them all down an oil shaft. Just think of all the CO2 emissions that would be reduced.

  • American Citizen

    What the enviros won’t admit is that God put all things on this earth for humans to use. Yes, we should use them wisely, but use them. Every time the government tries to fix something, they make it twice as bad. Every action has an opposite and equal reaction. Also, unintended consequences are not even considered.

  • Wayne Keel – V Vet

    Greenpiece would be the correct spelling for these idiots. They resort to violence? Hell, they haven’t seen violence like is coming ahead in the oilfields. The oilfield is a dangerous place to work and these nuts are about to learn just how dangerous it is. I believe enough is enough of these creatures. I would turn my head and gas it if I saw one of them standing in front of my progress, and cover them up just like a minor oil spill. People can easily get killed trying to blow up a pipeline, either by flying lead, debris, or by the fire. It’s odd that there’s never a fire extinguisher around when some idiot is on fire, after all you must put out the source first. The war of words is over, now it’s about survival of the fittest and they will lose. They are terrorist just like the ones in DC and will be dealt with accordingly. I’ve been begging veterans and patriots to go to DC and deal with these people now before it’s too late, but haven’t gotten much positive feedback. I’m trying to get my congressman to schedule more THM’s so we can discuss mobilizing across the USA to march on DC. Cap and Trade will kill us in the oilfield and make us even more dependent on foreign oil.

    • Robert

      It’s not Cap and Trade. It’s Cap and Tax. If it passes, Wall Street will have a field day conjuring up all sorts of crap they can sell and trade.

  • American Citizen

    I have often wondered if the so-called pollution man makes even goes high enough to affect the environment. Years ago they said manmade pollution caused acid rain. That’s something you don’t hear about any more.

    • Robert

      Pampers! There’s the real menance. They are not bio-degradeable and it costs a fortune in fossil fuels to produce them. And that’s “An Inconvenient Truth” that big Al forgot to tell us about. Damn pampers. They’re killing us.

      • libertytrain

        Robert – you are absolutely right on this one – somehow using real diapers became too inconvenient –

    • denniso

      Am Citizen,
      I think you’d better stop typing and start reading real books.Acid rain was real..rivers and lakes were so acidic that life within was dying off. You don’t hear about it now because ENVIRONMENTALISTS pushed the Federal gov’t to force power plants to scrub the sulfur dioxide from the smokestack emissions and cut acid production in the atmosphere.
      As to your comment that you wonder if pollution can reach high enough to cause a problem..Jet planes fly at 30 to 35,000 ft,that’s 6 to 7 miles up.Military often fly even higher. What do you think is comming out of the rear of those planes? Carbon dioxide and other greenhouse gases are lighter than air..that means they rise until they reach a point where the atmosphere is the same density they are. Quite high.

      • DaveH

        I remember in the early ’90s reading an article on a Scientist who worked for a government agency that was promoting the concept of ‘acid rain’. He was convinced going in that it was indeed a problem. As time went on and he studied lakes from all over the world some of which had excess acidity in locations where there were no human pollutants, and other lakes that were alkaline in locations that had excessive human pollution he started becoming skeptical. What was the agency’s response? They not only fired him, but followed him around the country trying to discredit him. Government scientists at work!

        http://www.cato.org/pubs/regulation/regv9n2/v9n2-1.pdf

        I know, Liberals, it’s from Cato. So don’t read it. I don’t post these for you anyway. I post them for people who want to learn.

  • Wayne Keel – V Vet

    And another thing I would like to share with the oilfield masses. The government decided to do away with earthen pits completely on all federal lands whether lined or unlined about five years ago. They call this a “closed loop” pit system where no fluids touch the ground and eliminates contamination. I believe in saving the environment as much as anyone, so I decided to find a more economical and efficient way to separate cuttings from fluid, dry the cuttings, and recycle the fluids. Being a drilling supervisor for 29 years, I have a good process that will save 5-10% of the total cost of the well on all closed loop systems. No fluid will get on the ground and marginal wells can be drilled within budget.
    The only problem is that when Obama got elected the price of oil fell along with my job and many others. That was a year ago and I spent all my savings just to survive. I applied for patents on my process and a “GREEN” environmental grant to finish my system, so I could save the oil companies money and create a few jobs. I found out that the government is not interested in my “GREEN” process, because they don’t care about saving money on energy and they don’t care about drilling anymore wells on government lands. What a bunch of hypocritical SOB’s we have in DC. That’s all the more reason we have to rid this country of these parasites. Van Jones opened his mouth about his STORM revolution taking place in America. Let’s give him his wish Americans!!

    • denniso

      Hey V Vet,
      Now you’re blaming Obama for dropping gas prices..read some recent history. The price of oil/gas has been down for a year or so..Obama’s been Prez for only 9 months. And I hate to tell you this, most people are pleased prices are down…$4/gal and more for gas was choking off the economy and probably aided in the collapse. Falling prices are a direct result of our market system responding to a slower economy.
      Don’t be absurd by blaming Obama.

    • BillyJ

      Wayne, you are blaming the President for not being granted a patent? I am not sure I understand your logic here. Could you please expand your concept? Thank you.

      • Wayne Keel – V Vet

        I’m not blaming Obama for the patent, I already have that. I’m blaming him for all the changes made to our economy which has shutdown oil and gas exploration in this country in the name of global warming or climate change. China and India will laugh all the way to the bank, expand their use of carbon fuel, and shove it up our rear ends in the process. I did a drilling project in Belridge, Calif back in 1989-90, where the land was subsiding at the rate of one inch per year, as a result of pumping more oil out of the ground than they were replacing it with water. Exxon shut all their wells in for a period of time while injecting water to fill the void left by pumping the oil out. Guess what, Shell and Santa Fe, who were on each side of our lease, just sped up their pumping units to produce more oil. This is about the same thing China and other countries will do when we back off on our CO2 emissions. Our emissions are significantly lower than theirs, because of better efficiency in place to do the same job. My beef with this prez is all this talk about GREEN JOBS, which I have a process that will clean up the environment, make it cheaper to produce oil and gas, and put more people back to work. They don’t give a damn about any of that, all they want to do is send this country into a tailspin which we will never recover from. Obama, Gore, Pelosi, Reid, and the rest of those anti-Americans should be jailed for being traitors to this country and abusing the system.

  • Homer

    Your poll about who do you think caused the economic crisis is really a question that does not pertain to any of your answers. Why don’t you attempt to educate the readership, and stop asking misleading questions. Tell them which bankers who control all of Washington are responsible for which candidates (all of them) and that all of the shenanigans are for the benefit of the banker owners….this all goes back to 1913 and the beginning of the FED. Stop misleading people….educate….educate….educate. They own the Universities too, and that is why nobody knows anything.

    • http://www.pcelementz.com Mr. Bruce

      Ok, so lets say we get rid of the banks. Now what? Do we go back to hunting and gathering? Like bartertown in mad max?

      I have devised a theory that gives a person an idea of whether or not there really is a conspiracy here:

      http://thevent.org/?p=26

      • DaveH

        No doubt that currency greatly facilitates free trade. The problem here is that our current currency is not backed by collateral of any kind, and is therefore subject to politics. Currently there is excess money being produced which results in the outstanding dollars being devalued. This hurts anyone with cash savings. Time will tell, but I believe we are due for massive inflation. In that case those people who worked hard all their lives to save a nest egg for their future are going to see the buying power of their savings greatly decreased.

  • http://www.aynrand.org Paul Beaird

    If some human beings do not know the value of their lives, as human beings, well, then, take them at their word, but don’t doubt the value of your life. Protect the value of your life against their hatred of the good in any way you can. That is only an act of self-defense.
    If you are not sure why your life is a value and all other things are values only in so far as they contribute to your life, I invite you to learn this not-complicated reason by paying attention to the writings of America’s moral philosopher, Ayn Rand, author of The Virtue of Selfishness and of Atlas Shrugged, the most inspiring novel ever written. . .if you love your life on Earth.

    • denniso

      Ayn Rand was not a philospher..she was a story teller and propogandist for her immoral view of the world.

      • libertytrain

        denniso – yes, she was a storyteller – and, she was a very good one – and the rest is just your opinion. And that’s ok.

        • denniso

          liberty..
          When I was a kid, i loved Ayn Rand and her novels..as I did more reading and thinking I came to see that her entire philosophy was based on greed and selfishness and she thought those human traits would maximize human and social potential..Well, Alan Greenspan was a follower of her up to the end of his term,just before the great collapse. He has aplologized for his blindness in thinking that self interest would work for the economy, be self correcting and bennefit us all. We see the result..so does Greenspan. Rand should go into the trashbin of failed ‘philosophies’ and only survive as a pretty good story teller.

          • libertytrain

            Denniso – I’m just not as bright as you. I enjoy her books.

          • eyeswideopen

            denniso, She has been proven wrong. I too enjoyed reading her books, and during 1988, I even voted for a Libertarian, however since then my faith grew and I realized that good Christians cannot endorse the teachings of Rand as they oppose the teachings of Jesus. Greed and selfishness is not what us Christians are all about,. You can’t run your business in a non Christian way, and then at 5:00 become a Chrisitan.

          • libertytrain

            Eyeswideopen – I think you misinterpret – there are those who think being here means someone is to take care of them rather than taking care of themselves – I like the old adage “The Good Lord helps those who help themself.” That’s what I glean through reading Ayn Rand – but again, I’m not very bright.

          • DaveH

            Libertytrain,
            What do you mean? The Liberals do want to help themselves – to other people’s money.

          • libertytrain

            DaveH – I’m with you.

          • JeffH

            DaveH, I couldn’t agree more.

          • ole hunter

            the bible also says, its easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter heaven.

          • ole hunter

            at that time in history, the word rich meant “greedy”

          • DaveH

            All human beings are selfish. Some are honest about it, others aren’t.
            The ultimate greed is that which drives people to take the property of others by force.

    • libertytrain

      Thanks Paul Beaird – interesting thoughts – Always appreciate Ayn Rand.

  • Claire

    PETA is an abomination. A couple of years ago they went to some dog shows, and released show dogs from their crates. Needless to say, one of the shows was ajacent to an interstate. Numerous dogs were killed. PETA despises dog shows, they would rather see dogs killed instead of living in a loving home. PETA does not have the right to conduct themsleves the way they do. I cannot believe they get by with their evil antics. You never know when or where PETA will be. They are scary! You can bet I am damn careful when I show my dogs. I always have another person with me, and I never leave my dogs unattended. My husband also hunts with our dogs, and he believes in taking care of the environment, and the natural habitat for animals. As far as the environmental issues, a person has to use common sense, not radicalism.

    • libertytrain

      Claire – interesting comment – how sad the methods PETA resorted to.

    • DaveH

      Liberals are all about Force. They fancy themselves to be the great benefactors, but true benefactors give away their own property, not the property of others.

      • libertytrain

        Dave H, interesting point -

      • eyeswideopen

        DaveH. you are the only one who keeps quoting “force” all the time. I reviewed the posts where anyone dared to have an opinion differing from yours and I couldn’t find where they were trying to force you to do anything, except have an honest debate. Didn’t see them trying to raise taxes, force vaccines for your kids, force religion, etc. I did see that they wanted the market to function without monopolies that were subsidized by the taxpayers, some wanted you to explain how the Libertarian platform would work (me too), most didn’t want to blindly accept some of your statements, as you didn’t offer any backup, or their ideology is not Libertarian. You accused me of using the word hate so much, which I quit doing, how about you stop using the government is force verbage?

        • JeffH

          That is what is happening with the Health Care Bill! This government is going to FORCE everyone, except all their buddies to take it on. Deny that!

  • marie davis

    to http://www.personal liberty.
    I just had a wild thought. while i am a constitutionl freedom supporter, i beleive without impinging anyones right to free speech
    MAYBE someone could draft some pieceof legislation that keeps speech and protesters from obstructing capitalism.
    it might solve many problems
    such as the strong arm tactics powerbrokers put ACORN slaves up to some years ago with the banks.
    perhaps it could be set up as an ammendment-
    just a thought–i havent thought thru yet.

    • http://www.pcelementz.com Mr. Bruce

      I’m still waiting on an answer on what you guys wanna do when we get rid of the banks…

      Pick one

      1. Bartertown
      2. Hunting and Gathering.
      3. The tally stick?
      4. silver/gold

      I hear a lot of ranting about banks and conspiracies but no solutions on what to do once we get rid of them…

      Well?

      • ole hunter

        Mr. Bruce,
        Banks are no longer Banks, as I am sure you know our banking system was changed By the Fed.
        Banks are now just nothing more than corporations suggesting that they are banks.
        A few thousand small independent banks still exsist and operate like banks should, the kind of banks and ethical people we need.

        A system based on Cash, Gold , silver and bartering would be a great system, however it would cut out all the middle men, speculators ,lawyers, terroist orgs, goverment regs and unions.
        It would be a put up or shut up system. no 60 year notes that will never be paid off. no need for write offs or the S corp folks.
        no need for tax shelters, no madoffs or Enrons, Bear Stearns, Goldman Sachs or Fed Reserve etc etc etc. just you, your gold and your guts.

        A Liberal will give you the rope to hang him.
        A moderate will not be able to decide if he wants to sell or give you a rope.
        A libertarian will smoke the rope
        A conservative will sell you the rope to hang him.
        A Independent will ask, what kind of rope do you need , how long does it need to be and what is it to be used for.

        The billionare and terrorist Bin Laden warned his followers, beware of the independents, love the liberals and use the conservatives. he also said a conservative will sell you the gun that you would kill him with at a wholesale price.
        Being Bin Laden was educated in the US and the UK, he learned the langauge and ways of the people he hates, he used this knowledge against them.
        If it had not been for commercial banks, investment brokers and hedge funds, Bin Laden would have never become a billionare.
        When Ethics went out the window in the banking world , bin laden and others climbed in the window with gold and oil for you to buy.

        • DaveH

          Where did you get that Dumbass statement from? I am a Libertarian, and I have never smoked Marijuana. I also don’t drink alchoholic beverages. The difference between the Libertarians and the rest is that we don’t believe in forcing our way on others.

          • ole hunter

            Dumb ass statement came from Glenn Becks lips.
            Ever listen to Ron Paul or his Kid. Nothing against your party, but the only issues that separate your party from the conservative is your partys stand on hookers, pot and the legalizing of all drugs , other wise not much difference.

          • ole hunter

            Dave H, also have you ever heard John Stousel speak on legalizing pot hookers and drugs? John is a purist libertarian, guy is almost 70 years old and still tells it like it is ……

  • Claire

    In our state, we can have a gun in the glove compartment of our car, but it cannot be loaded. The magazine/bullets can only be placed beside the gun. Now I ask this–what good is having an unloaded gun in your glove compartment? Unless you are a darn good bluffer maybe you could scare the would-be assailant. Who knows. If a person was being mugged, hijacked, etc. it would take TIME to load your gun and protect yourself. I guess I’ll have to keep my pepper spray and my trusty old crowbar handy. Just in case.

    • DaveH

      There is a case headed to the Supreme Court right now that may change that:
      http://gunowners.org/mcdonaldvchicago.htm

    • DaveH

      As a friend of mine once said “It’s better to be tried by 12, than to be carried by 6″.

  • al

    Why are the conservatives so dumb about the environment? We don’t need oil to live. All we need is clean air, clean water and clean food. How long is it going to take to teach you that? No wonder Bush got elected with all these idiots voting for him. How dumb are you guys?

    • JeffH

      about as (Word removed) as your mama and papa (words removed for offensive content)

    • Robert

      You need to get a grip. If that was all we needed to live then we could all expect to see our life expectancy cut in half. Let me ask you this, before we used fossil fuels what did we use to heat and cook food? Wood. And how many forests were cleared and how much CO2 was released into the atmoshere? Let’s get real. Take a look at what is going on in the Amazon rain forest. You don’t think that is adding much CO2 to the atmoshhere? I rest my case.

      • al

        I’m serious man. We don’t need oil to live. Oil isn’t going to be around forever so we have to get off this oil mentality and start reducing our dependence on oil, reducing our energy use and looking for alternative sources of energy.

    • American Citizen

      If wr weren’t supposed to used the oil God wouldn’t have created it.

    • DaveH

      This is the kind of thinking that enabled Obama to get elected. The Liberals must be getting really desperate to send this guy out.

      • JeffH

        Some might be totally astonished at the positive contributions that conservative American sportsmen make to the environment. But then, the liberal left thinks of us as environmental abusers.

        • ole hunter

          you mean like, more roads, atvs orvs lead pellets in clean water lakes and springs, empty cases left on the ground, beer bottles, and camp sites left with buried garbage , yeah most hunters are nothing more than animal exterminators and antler hunters, canned hunts,old circus animal hunts on fenced in land in texas.
          there are very few real hunters in the states, canada and the world.
          take away the atvs orvs and the gps, not much left, however a back pack, tent bow or gun , compass and skill, 5 days on foot tracking the prey, thats hunting…. meaning non sci type hunts and hunters.

          • JeffH

            America’s hunters, through special
            federal excise taxes, provide about
            $280 million annually to help
            pay for wildlife conservation. Hunters’ private
            donations of $300 million annually
            to conservation efforts, that’s nearly
            $1.3 billion hunters directly invest
            every year to preserve, protect and
            enhance not just wildlife but also the healthy environment that makes their sport
            possible. Across much of the country, hunter dollars are the primary funding source for
            protecting and improving wildlife habitat, public access and conservation education.
            Hunting, and the powerful economic effects it creates, would not be possible
            without wildlife. Those same game animals and birds would not exist without suitable
            habitat, which makes clean and healthy
            forests, fields and marshlands essential to
            the bottom line.
            The amount of federal, state and local
            tax revenues—about $9.2 billion—
            generated by hunters in 2006 is
            equal to nearly 90 percent of the
            entire budget for the U.S. Department
            of the Interior ($10.5 billion).
            http://www.dnr.state.md.us/wildlife/AFWA_HuntingReport_2007economics.pdf

          • JeffH

            ole hunter, you say: “there are very few real hunters in the states”
            The number of U.S. hunters age 16 and over—12.5 million—The U.S. Fish and Wildlife Servicereports roughly nine percent of all hunters (more than 1.1 million)are female.
            U.S. HUNTING FACTS
            • 12.5 million hunters
            • $24.7 billion retail sales
            • $66 billion in overall economic output
            • $20.9 billion salaries and wages
            • 593,000 jobs
            • $4.2 billion in state and local taxes
            • $5 billion in federal taxes

    • American Citizen

      I guess you want to go back to the horse and buggy days. You have to feed the horses, have a barn to keep them in, pick up after them as you do your dogs when you walk them, keep the buggies in good shape, etc. I’ll keep my automobile, thank you.

  • Earl, Queens, NY

    John Myers: Good article. However, a better title might be: Just say NO to the environmentalist wackos. IMO this one area in which the GOP is still weak. Many are wising up to the fact that they need to get back to conservative principles to win back control and save America in 2010 and 2012 – i.e., stop profligate spending and earmarks, and cut taxes and regulations to cure the recession and grow the economy. But many in the GOP are wimps when it comes to the greatest threat to America and its liberty and economy – the enviro-statists. And in some cases they go along with this fringe group. It’s not about clean air or water. It’s about protecting kangaroo rats, cutting off water to protect fish; not to mention the high price of Cap & Trade to deal with the global warming hoax!! Republicans need to stand up, and expose the radical anti-American and anti-capitalist agenda of this fringe group, and hopefully flush out this fringe movement.

    • denniso

      Earl..
      There are some extreme environmentalists..just as there are some extreme anti-enviros..read the top post.
      You should realize though,w/o people like Rachel Carson,a biologist and early enviro, who raised the first serious concerns about all of our food being sprayed w/ chemicals like DDT, you may very well already be dead from cancer. She alerted the world to the danger of contaminating not only food suplies,but all creeks,rivers and lakes w/ carcinogens from widespread use of lingering pesticides/herbicides..now,the EPA tries to ensure that the worst and persistent chemicals aren’t used on food.
      Rachel Carson was scorned and pilloried for her warnings..by whom?? that’s right, the chemical industry!! I wish you anti-enviros would show a little appreciation for what people like her did and are doing to protect you and your kids from the ravages of unfettered corporate power over your very life and death.

      • DaveH
      • http://PersonalLiberty Jeffrey Barker

        When the “world” banned DDT, Once again millions died, and still are from malaria. DDT almost brought malaria to a stand still. Now it’s back with a vengeance. Long live the mosquito!! That little guy has brought more death than all the wars, famines and natural disasters put together. But hey! you saved a few pelican eggs.

  • thomas armitage

    I have to agree that talk radio host Michael Savage (Weiner) is right about his description of Liberalism. It is definitely a mental illness. Would any sane ,educated person hate being born in the freest and most prosperous nation in the history of human existence? Of course not, but in the halls of academia and outlets of pop culture trash, the same message is never ending. “America was founded by evil white slave owners and land barons who acquired their wealth by genocide of indigenous peoples.” Shame on you were born white and raised learning the “poison” of the 10 Commandments. How dare you speak ill of their Messiah Barak Hussein Obama.
    No doubt about it, the lunatics are running the asylum and ruining America.

    • denniso

      thomas,
      Savage and you both need professional help. He for his lunatic rants that are piling up millions in his bank acct.. and you for listening to such a destructive and dangerous idiot like Savage. He is no better than hitlers’ minnions..Goebels,himmler,etc. He has clearly read them and is aping their technique for demonizing people he disagrees with. The only difference is that Hitler and his ‘people’ acted on twisted,sick principle. Savage is only acting in his self interest and using his followers,like you, to line his pockets. SHAME!!!

    • JeffH

      denniso, and you want equality for all, no matter if one has earned it or not? You want government to control your wealth, your health, and the exhaust of your automobile. Don’t eat meat or any animal products, as it is inhumane. Heat and cool with alternative methods other than nuclear or fossil fuels. Stop raping our planet. You can have your Obama and his ilk, the twisted environmental terrorists that believe they have the right to decide for others about what we drive or the type of fuel that is used to get us there. There is a fine balance between use and abuse of our environment. Extremism is part of that balance!

      • JeffH

        …is not part of that balance…correction.

      • eyeswideopen

        Jeff, since you live in Ca. it is interesting that you don’t see that pollution has caused a definate lowering of your quality of life. Why can’t anyone admit that we pollute and we need to find ways to stop it? What is wrong with caring about the environment? We should have started changing our dependence on oil thirty years ago. We went along with paying for the Alaskan pipeline to give us our own oil, but as usual the majority didn’t benefit from that investment.It was an outright lie. I don’t want to continue to make the Arab countries rich off of the citizens of this country. We have the talent to become diversified and self sufficient, we need to promote those many sources of independence.

        • JeffH

          Have you ever lived for any length of time in California? I doubt it.
          There has to be a fair balance between man and the environment, but enviromentalist see it only one way, their way. They have forced their ideas into government and now California is bankrupt and industry is virtually dead. Corporations and businesses refuse to invest in California. California has lost its tax base and now we all must suffer the effects. The Delta Smelt is another scam by the environmentalists that has destroyed this years agricultural base in the central valley. Maybe the grand plan is to let Californians die on the vine and have to rely on government. Afterall, Pelosi, Boxer and Feinstein are Californians. No, the poeople have just allowed these idiots to ruin California with their do all, spend all approach to government without checks and balances. We have allowed our government the same liberties, and look where we are at. At some point, all the madness has got to stop and the people are the only ones that are stepping up to the plate to stop it. Will it ever end? We will see.

  • Merl Elton

    As we will notice from the rapid recovery and massive bonus distributions of “troubled-financial entities” on our dime: these bailouts were not necessary. Why then were the bailouts not vetoed? What is going on; we should keep asking these questions. This outrageous situation is one reason way taxpayers are furious.

    • JeffH

      Merl, so true.

  • Merl Elton

    Trying the same thing over and over and expecting different results is one definition of insanity. The ecoloons who currently are running Greenpeace and other econuts should learn that definition and change their tactics. All ecosystems are related. When industries and farms pour toxins in the water, the sealife becomes poisoned; and so do we overtime by eating toxic seafood. Crops that intake polluted water are also toxin laden. It all adds up to high cancer rates. So, it is very important that those who seek to guard the enviornment act wisely. We do not need to kill ecoloonies; just educate them. We need to kill terrorists and other killers.

  • eyeswideopen

    Liberty, I mean watching out for others, not taking responsibility for their lives and actions. Here is a link that explains. http://www.steppingintothelight.net/the-blog/2008/11/4/my-brothers-keeper-intolerance.html

    I don’t need anyone else’s money, I have a great life and beautiful home.
    Here in America, our taxes are not that high compared to other countries, and since the country was founded we have had taxes, most people accept the fact that civilization requires taxes.
    People that have been helping themselves to my money, are those companies who are monopolies and participate in price fixing. You, know like my health insurance company. Oh, and all those banks and investment companies who function in dark with no accounting to anyone.

    • libertytrain

      Eyes, I’ve noticed over the years that those who really and truly succeed in life tend to be benefiting others along the way by way of their success – without necessarily trying. Not the hangers-on, the gimme, gimme people – but the people that get shuffled along with them, because they too work hard. Probably by them being an example to others, their children, etc.

      • eyeswideopen

        My husband and I have a very high work ethic. We demonstrate on a daily basis to our employees that they have choices, both moral and fiscal daily. We expect them to make the right choices when they are representing us. We have seen the effect of expecting the best and rewarding (not always with money) those who didn’t let us down. We have a motto, that we should try to make at least one person we come in contact with smile and feel good about themselves. You can find something about everyone to compliment them on. We are not pushovers, however when we first moved into our new home, 6 yrs ago, our neighbor three houses down had a fire, we let them and their two children move into our home, until they could get situation under control. We had only known them for 6 months, but as Christians we knew that’s what we were supposed to do. We hope that during their lifetime, they will pass on our kindness and help someone else who needs it. I don’t believe in giving people an easy life, but I do believe that at times, you can and should help your fellow Americans.

        • libertytrain

          Eyes, re the fire: I expect that almost anyone, including Ayn Rand, would do that (at least just about everyone I know). That wasn’t the point she was trying to get across in her books – as per your earlier comments discrediting her –

          • eyeswideopen

            Liberty, I was merely pointing out that the group called the Collective, of which Alan Greenspan, Rand and others were a part of, theories have been proven wrong with our present situtation being the reason. Until, recently, they had no bias of real comparrison. I am sure you remember Greenspan giving speach stating that he was wrong in his beliefs?
            Altruism is central to the teaching of Jesus found in the Gospel, Sermon on the Mount and Sermon on the Plain. Ms. Rand promotes, ethical egoism which is the position that people should do what is in their own self interest, regardless of the effects it produces for others. Ethical egoism is the philosphical basis for Libertarism. It is at odds with the majority of religions as it is a lack of spirituality and shows total submersion in greed. It divides people into two types-themselves and others. The main question being, what makes one more special than the other? The answer is nothing, each is special in their own right and is not more special than the other. We should care about the interests of other people for the very reason we care about our own, for their needs and desires are comparable to our own. Thomas Jefferson, who I greatly admire, believed that ethical egoism was the basis for immorality.(see letter to Thomas Law) As I explained earlier, when my faith became stronger, I knew Libertarianism was probably not for me. Jim Powell from the Cato Institute considers Rand, one of the most important women of modern American Libertarianism, even though she rejected the Libertarianism and the Libertarian movement. Ayn, believed in reason, I merely stated that her concepts on captialism running unregulated have been proven wrong. Reason would dictate that to be fact. What I use on this site is reason, and few people like it. From reading her books, I learned that if you make a statement, reason must back it up, not emotion. Facts provide logical sense for a premise or occurrence. When people on the site, give emotional, illogical statements that can be disproven, their immediate reaction is one of anger, which prompts name calling and the instinct to band together to right a perceived injustice. The ego is so tied into being correct, that many people cannot admit when they are wrong, or say they are sorry when they unjustly do harm,to another, either by word or by deed. Just because I don’t follow Ayn’s beliefs doesn’t mean I can’t admire her work or the thought process, it is not what I choice to do. I am doing exactly what she preaches/teaches, what is best for my interests, which are Christian.

  • DaveH

    This is my last post on this subject. So you will have to attack someone else or wait until the next subject pops up.
    Even if I didn’t know that individual freedom would lead this country to prosperity, I would rather live free in a poor country than to be a subject in a rich country.

    • libertytrain

      DaveH – good point

    • Johnnyrite

      DaveH,
      I think you points are well made.

  • BillSoCal

    The environmentatlist and The Trilateral Commission have worked hand and hand to bring this country down. It started under Peanut Brain Carter with his classifying the Gull Island oil discovery up in the North Slope of Alaska. There was enought oil in that one field to keep to US self-suffiance in oil for over two hundred years or more.
    Back in 1972 Rep Morris Udall D-AZ was able to pass a bill that clamped down on the development of natural resoucres in Alaska. This of course means AWR. The environmnetatlist the lied to the Alaskan Indian tribe about what would happen if development of oil fields in AWR were to happen. So what you have is one tribe the doing well because they allowed development of the oil field and the other tribe living in ghetto like conidtions because they didn’t and followed the environmentatist. Then you come down to the lower 48 states. In 2008 the Long Beach Press Telegram ran a front page article that there is still 7 1/2 billion barrells of oil still under the city of Long Beach, CA. I grew up in So Cal just north of Long Beach. In the 60s all we heard was that the oil was drying up, then why is there still 7 1/2 billion barrells of oil still under Long Beach. When there is talk about opening the oil fields for drilling. Guess who is right there to fight against any drilling, the environmentatist. They are closing down operating oil wells in fields that they want to turn into nature reserves. I have lived my entire life in So Cal. I don’t ever remember skunks and raccoons in the nieghborhoos like there are now. I saw a pair of raccoons early in the morning about 3 am in Sunset Beach. They are not suppose to be there. California was off shore oil fields that would stop our need to import oil from the Middle East and the Arabs. But the Democrats and the environmnetatist say no. Even thought now at this the time the major cause of oil spills is mother natural not man. We have more than enought coal to supply are energy needs. But Comrade Obama wants to put the coals industry out of business. One thing that no one knows about. After WWII the US Govt built to two plants to check out the German process of turning coal into oil. The Gov’t found that it would cost about $.15 more to turn coal into oil and gas than using oil itself. The Govt shut down the two plants. It can be done and we can gain economicaly form it. Just think instead of the money going overseas it stays right here in the states, and increases the money for everyone.

  • steven jeffries

    to All who have responded on this article someone mentioned how there funded well its good ole George Soros who’s having a very profitable crises i suggest a good book to read The Shadow Party by richard poe and David Horowitz

  • http://PersonalLiberty Jeffrey Barker

    I am sure you all know each other and have “chatted” before. I have enjoyed your ongoing tit for tat.

    Have a good night…

    Jeff Barker

  • Bernie

    con⋅serv⋅a⋅tive  [kuhn-sur-vuh-tiv] Show IPA
    –adjective
    1. disposed to preserve existing conditions, institutions, etc., or to restore traditional ones, and to limit change.
    2. cautiously moderate or purposefully low: a conservative estimate.
    3. traditional in style or manner; avoiding novelty or showiness: conservative suit.
    4. (often initial capital letter) of or pertaining to the Conservative party.
    5. (initial capital letter) of, pertaining to, or characteristic of Conservative Jews or Conservative Judaism.
    6. having the power or tendency to conserve; preservative.
    7. Mathematics. (of a vector or vector function) having curl equal to zero; irrotational; lamellar.
    –noun
    8. a person who is conservative in principles, actions, habits, etc.
    9. a supporter of conservative political policies.
    10. (initial capital letter) a member of a conservative political party, esp. the Conservative party in Great Britain.
    11. a preservative.
    (The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition)

    Take a look at #6- How ’bout let’s conserve the Earth God gave us and quit bashing on people who are trying to do just that? Everything just seems so convoluted these days when folks who say they’re looking out for God’s interests are just helping further big businesses who would gladly make another Love Canal to make a buck.

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