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Internet security bill continues to cause uproar

September 3, 2009 by  

Internet security bill continues to cause uproarA new draft of the Cybersecurity Act of 2009, which may give the President greater powers over the internet, appears to be causing as much controversy as the original proposal.

The bill seeks to determine when and how the President could intervene in public and private information systems by limiting internet traffic to critical networks for national security reasons or in the case of an emergency.

It has come under scrutiny from a range of first amendment advocacy groups, such as the Electronic Frontier Foundation (EFF), which have raised alarm about government interference. The new draft drops certain specific language, instead allowing the president to direct a "national response" to the cyber threat.

Meanwhile, Larry Clinton, president of the Internet Security Alliance, which represents a cross-section of IT companies including Verizon and Nortel, has criticized what he calls vaguely worded language in the latest version.

"It is [still] unclear what authority … is necessary over the private sector. Unless this is clarified, we cannot properly analyze, let alone support the bill," he states.

However, there are those who say the recommendations make sense. James Lewis of the Center for Strategic and International Studies compared the provisions to President Bush’s decision to shut down airlines after the 9/11 attacks.

"It seems foolish not to have the same authority for cyberspace," he said, quoted by TheHill.com. "It’s not that the president will wake up in a bad mood one day and implode Yahoo. This would apply only to severe national emergencies. … This is a great opportunity to blast us into a new level of discussion about cybersecurity."

The bill was first introduced four months ago by Senate Commerce Committee Chairman Jay Rockefeller, a West Virginia Democrat, and Republican Olympia Snowe of Maine.

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  • DaveH

    The government has been looking for ways to control the Internet since its inception. I’m sure you remember all the hand-wringing over the ‘children’ and their exposure to porn. Then the dangers of shopping on the Internet were blown way out of proportion (here tax revenues were part of the equation). They will try their hardest to come up with some plausible excuse to silence us. Dispite all the rhetoric, there is no doubt in my mind that their main goal is Censorship.

    • JeffH

      Well said DaveH!

    • keith

      amen,next is talk radio and then…….

  • Mike D

    Years ago the INTERNET was conceived as a form of military communication so it has already had been controlled by Gov.

    Taxes and censorship is exactly what they are after now and don’t think for a one minute that they will stop there.

  • s c

    Add the stimulus/bailout scam, cash for clunkers, unconstitutional czars, the health care ‘reform’ frankenstein and this latest internet outrage, and it is obvious that this administration is not fit to govern. It is not worthy. It is an abomination, and it is not to be trusted. No rational individual can make this many mistakes this fast and be considered a leader in any sense of the word.
    We have another FDR – or worse. Prepare the constitutional challenges. Let the word go out across the nation.
    America, this is yet one more declaration of war against the American people. No foreign invader would be tolerated. In this day and age, an enemy is an enemy is an enemy – foreign or domestic. This president thinks he is above the Constitution and America’s laws. We, the people, are obligated to preserve, protect and defend the Constitution. This non-leader’is determined to destroy the Constitution and America.

    • Patricia Henson

      Carolyn Tyler Reply, I agree witheverything you say except a foreign invader wouldn’t be tolerated. In this America foreign and domestic terrorists are not only tolerated they are felt sorry for and lauded as heros. Look at 9/11. They turned it around and blamed our own government and are complaining that we are abusing the people responsible. Lord knows they need their amenities and can not go without their beauty sleep. Obama and his minions will destroy this country and too many people are still behind him. I am scared for our children and grandchildren as they will never know this country that I grew up in and will be so far in debt that they will never climb out. I ask everyone to pray for this country. In the meantime we need to get these government officials out of office and make sure that they couldn’t get jobs as dog catchers in their cities.

    • http://msn agatha

      I agree with It Is time we the people stand up for the constation,
      and Stop this on staut of solions goverment befor it is to late.
      and if we have to sart our ownd movement. so be it the white house
      people work for us and can be replaced. we the people can stop them.
      if we stand togher so lets stop talking and do somthing about it now befor it is to late.

  • Linda Grace

    This is the New World order. They are taking over everything with Obama’s help. Where is the FBI? We need to clean out this government and send them all packing. Rockefeller is in the Illuminati.

    • s c

      Linda G, the FBI couldn’t figure out that Madoff was a crook, and should have been arrested long ago. Comrade Obama’s Attorney General will predictably have ‘other’ priorities. For now, there is no justice coming from Washington.
      The best we can do for now is to document everything this half-@$$#^ administration does. When it’s time, the evidence for b o’s ouster will be overwhelming, and the ultralibs who put b o in office can gag on it. May they ‘enjoy’ every juicy mouthful.

    • C.K.

      lOOKS LIKE THERE IS NO FBI, CIA, ECT, ECT, AND NO LONGER AMERICA!!!!!!! THIS REGHIME DOES WHAT IT WANTS AND IS GETTING AWAY WITH IT, AND AMERICANS LET IT GO TO FAR. IF WE DONT IMPEACH ALL THESE COMMIES WERE DONE!!!!!!!THEY ALREADY TAKE POSTS OFF INTERNET, THIS IS ALL WE HAVE LEFT, AND THE WAY IT LOOKS, NOT FOR LONG. CHECK OUT FEM CAMPS ALL OVER AMERICA, AND THEIR NOT FOR THE TERRORISTS….. WAKE UP AMERICANS!!!!!!!!!

      • http://msn agatha

        your right he wants to open the door to more terist atacts we can stop them we the people, can do it lets do some thing about it not just talk

      • eyeswideopen

        C.K., it is considered rude to communicate using all caps. It is like you are screaming at us. Could you please not use all caps? Thank you in advance.

  • Robin from Indiana

    The government is looking for yet more ways to be involved in our lives. And I have to agree that taxes and censorship are one step away if this bill goes through. It seems this administration is very vague in their wording, which leaves interpretation of all their bills up in the air. Make no mistake, this is intentional.

    • Pat Rutland

      This is more evidence why the Bill to make every Member of Congress &
      Senate read every word of a Bill before they vote on it. This would
      keep so much of the BS from ever getting passed.

      http://www.DownsizeDC.org

      • DaveH

        Pat,
        Thanks for the link. I am a little concerned about the clause that says “Every bill to be voted on must be published on the Internet at least 7 days before a vote”. I think minimum should be 14 days. Imagine reading 1000+ pages of health-care bill and still having time to contact your representatives within 7 days.

  • Richard Pawle;y

    Always, ALWAYS, beware of any proposed law that is vague! Vagueness is an attribute of deception and goes back to the beginning of time. Satan, asked Eve “Did God really say you shall not eat of every fruit in the garden?” knowing full well what God had said. Lawyers have been using tricky words to achieve their ends ever since. Vague laws are written by lawyers to be interpreted by lawyers. “Thou shalt not steal” leaves little to interpretation. This would seem to include “Thou shalt not steal from the public” but Congress doesn’t see it that way. God felt ten commandments would cover it but lawyers and Congressmen (that’s pretty much one and the same if they are Democratic Congressmen) have added well a million new laws since the country was founded AND IT’S STILL NOT ENOUGH IN THEIR EYES. However, much of the garbage being passed unread by many in Congress, is so vague as to leave the country at the mercy of lawyers for generations to come. The so-called Health Care Reform Bill is many times longer than the Constitution and the Bill of Rights combined. Wake up America and let your Congress know that you do not want us to become another bankrupt socialist country or we will become the fastest socialist nation in history to go bankrupt and collapse. Seven years tops.

    • http://msn agatha

      you are right

  • ole hunter

    Repeal the Patriot Act, leave the Internet alone….. bring are forces home…. stop the conservatives nation building program…. enforce immigration laws…… Organize a third political party…
    get the United States out of the United Nations…..

    • Carol

      AMEN AMEN AMEN Go out and support your local tea party’s. Do all you can do to take this country back

    • DaveH

      There already is a third party that advocates most of those things, Hunter. It’s called the Libertarian Party. We need to greatly reduce the size of government thus saving ourselves and our children from impoverishment at the hands of the greedy politicians and their corporate supporters. Please read their platform at:
      http://www.libertarianparty.org/platform

      • eyeswideopen

        How are you going to maintain a military without taxes?

        • JeffH

          Why don’t you tell us EWO…?

          • eyeswideopen

            Jeff,
            I’m asking for information, I certainly would not ask you, you are just hypnosised by the Nazi’s and their way of life. A sure way to have people discount what you’re saying is to keep sprewing Nazi crap.
            Intelligent people just automatically turn off, so if you have valid points to make, you lose them at the moment you start with your Hitler jargon. Why do you think ,Dave, preaches no name calling? Yep, he knows the psychology of how to make a point.

  • fdchief

    I will make this short because I no that AMERICANS are not stupid like Pelosi thinks.

    It is time to stop giving our Country away and giving them access to everything we have and do. There is no need for the RADICAL from Chicago to have the key to thr internet also. What does he want to just like the man from IRAN.We have had to many people die fighting for our Constitutional Rights and our freedom going back to the begining of this country THE UNITED STATES of AMERICA!!! Now we have the Green COMMY trying to take it away I don’t think SO!!!!!Write every Senate and Congress member you can and tell them how we feel.

    • Carol

      Speaking of giving away there is a bill right now where they want to give POLAND 5 MILLION $$$$$ to help them build a museum. Now I implore you, WHY WOULD WE DO THAT!

      • C.K.

        ALL THE STIMULUS SENT OUT IS A COVER UP FOR THE MONIES TO TRICKLE DOWN TO ILLEGAL ANTI-AMERICAN GROUPS IN AMERICA AND AROUND THE WORLD, AND GUESS WHOSE HANDS IT IS IN?(THE ENIMIE’S)!!!!!!!!!

      • C.K.

        ALL THE STIMULUS MONEY THAT IS GIVEN OUT IS A COVER UP,AND TRICKLES DOWN INTO THE HANDS OF MANY ANTI-AMERICAN GROUPS IN AMERICA AND ACROSS THE WORLD, MOSTLY TO OUR ENIMIES TO CONQUER US AND TO ASSURE ILLEGAL VOTES FOR THE NEW REGHIME IN PLACE ALREADY, WHOM ARE ALL OF DISCUSTING CHARACTER AND ALLOWED INTO THE AMERICAN PEOPLES GOVERNMENT. OOP’S, NO MORE “FOR THE PEOPLE” ” BY THE PEOPLE” AND NO WHER TO RUN, NO WHERE TO HIDE..

      • DaveH

        That’s funny (in a tragic way) Carol. That is less than they sent to Texas to help control the Drug Cartels.

        • JeffH

          That is just another sign of where this administrations priorities are.

  • Coco

    It just figures it would be Rockefeller proposing a new control over
    us. They just hate our ability to communicate, & have no doupt been shaking in their shoes about the Internet’s capacity, from it’s inception. Gee we might be able to learn from each other, buy & sell,
    or possibly ORGANIZE to overcome their facsist NWOrder dreams. National Security is ALWAYS the excuse. We’ve been under emergency war powers of the President since the Civil War. And they just keep looking for new ways to expand it. Our Constitutional rights are a
    myth. We’ve been incrementally tricked out of ANY rights. Research
    about Sovereign status verses 14TH Ammendment Citizen status. There
    is a lawful redemption from this BS. But it requires education & proper paperwork. And we are racing them for time. They keep coming up with new ways to attack us (taxes, regulations, health assaults,
    and other panics) to keep us distracted from learning about this.
    They know WE are the enemy of the State. But a lot of us don’t know
    that they really, legally regard us that way. But guess what? Human
    beings want to be free & sovereign! We just need to finish the revolution. We won it militarily, but not economically, & that’s
    how the NWO got it’s hidden grip on us. Research while you still can!

    • DaveH

      I have an idea Coco. Let’s mount a national campaign to redistribute Rockefeller’s wealth.

      • s c

        Not a bad idea. While you’re at it, include Soros, Gore, every lobbyist, every foreign-born special advisor to the president, everyone in Congress, every funds distributor who funnels money to groups like ACORN, every current and past official at the Fed and every retired politician who helped send American jobs overseas. The list goes on and on.
        Stand back, and let the money roll in.

        • JeffH

          Can the tax monies recovered from foreign Swiss accounts be included?

          • eyeswideopen

            Now, Jeff, that is an excellent idea.

  • John C. Davidson

    Any proposal made by the legislators must be dealt with cynicism.

  • ONTIME

    Actually this can be a good tool for security if the proper diligence and restrictions can be followed. There is a great need to guard the industrial and economic computers of this nation from cyber attack and if I read this correctly that is the aim of what is being ask for. Bush and his staff was looking for the same kind of ability but the wording will have to be very well stated for acceptance.

    • ole hunter

      hello ontime, interesting comment.
      american citizens and business need to spend some coin to defend themselves. I could not care less if Walmarts, BofAs, Honda motors, Toyota motors computers are infected and distroyed,their problem.

      americans are turning into a nation of pussys, old saying..
      “there is nothing more dangerous than a pussy with a gun”
      US citizens need to learn how to defend and protect themselves without the help of the tax payers or any previous or current congress or presidents stupid ideas.

      just a thought, whom or what should provide the security for our electric power grid since it is publicly owned?…. The public owned corporations should provide, pay the cost for the security not the goverment, otherwise it needs to be nationalised.

      ole hunter

      • Carol

        Are you all aware that any explosion of oa nuke as close as 200 miles above one of our power grides would totaly destroy the gride for perhaps up to even 3 years. Imagine life back in the 1800′s. This could happen. Iran and North Korea are working very hard on it right now and we do nothing to stop it, nothing to protect against it, nothing to repair our grides if it happens. We have sent all the jobs that manufacture our parts for the grides to China. We have nothing here to repair not can we make any parts to repair. We would be at the mercy of the world. You should also all know they new automobile run off of electrical systems that will also be shut down when the grides go…..of course you couldn’t pump any gas either but oh gee the really older cars would at least run…..but hey, didn’t we just crush them all. Oh my what timing AKA Cash for Clunkers

    • DaveH

      Private enterprise does address these internet issues. And there is little doubt that they do so much more efficiently than a panel of government-appointed know-nothings would.
      I have a question. If this Internet terrorism is indeed a problem (and I do believe it is), then why don’t they expend their efforts passing laws to punish these hacker clowns to the extent of the damage they have caused? I say that someone who through their hacking has cost society millions of dollars should be given the death sentence when caught. It sounds harsh, I know, but how many people for the lack of that same money are starving or missing out on life-saving medical help?
      I believe the Internet Bill is just a foot-in-the-door for government censorship. They can’t stand for us to be able to communicate so freely.

      • eyeswideopen

        WE are in a bind as we let China build all of our computers that have to do with our security interests. Dumb move, but hey, what can you say about our politicians? They aren’t too bright. Just look at the trade agreements!! This has become a big issue as Americans high and low are using the internet to check on the government. This makes the computers vulnerable to virus’ via our domestic computers. Any ideas on how to isolate but still give us access?

      • JeffH

        It has always been easier for the “out of touch” goverment legislators
        to create legislation that would punish law abiding citizens rather than enforce and or create legislation that would target and punish the criminals. Just look at gun control! Continuous attacks to strip law abiding citizens of their 2nd Amendment rights only strengthen the criminal element in America. It is a proven fact that gun control does not effect criminals, but does increase crime.
        That way, new agencies can be created, more taxpayer money can be spent and only honest people would become criminals!

    • Loredana

      I trust George Bush with Internet security but definitely not Obama and all his looney cronies. I believe they will just take over everything and Obama will be the dictator, a socialist/marxist one.
      I feel so sorry for Glenn Beck also and i pray for him and his family that they will keep safe. Why must he be the only one who raises these issues of utmost importance in the media. I know Sean Hannety
      does too, but Glenn is making a bigger effort now than any of them.
      Thank God for Glenn Beck…he is hated by the liberal media and others with their own agendas. Rush Limbaugh calls a spade a spade too and thats why Obamaland, with another crazy czar in charge of the communications committe is trying to close down all conservative radio and television. This czar is a nut job too and loves Chavez and delights in the way Chavez stifled free radio and television in his Country. Now there is only the propaganda machine. It reminds me of the White House propaganda machine who daily talks to the media.
      I also believe that true journalism is dead in America…it died when the liberal media houses went to bed with Obama and the democrats. Also Newspapers like the New York Times are also in bed with the White House. This is an absolute disgrace. How are the people to be advised of what is happening to our Country if most of the publications are leftists loons. Only Fox gives an honest and true slant. May God save America and her people.
      Loredana

  • Cherie

    The only way to help stop this from becoming law is to share the info. with friends and family AND write plenty of letters to congress and legislators stating we are against it. Blogging helps too, but we need to write them directly and tell them NO WAY!

    Check out the firearms laws while you are at it…that’s scary!

    • JeffH

      Finding the links to write to your legislators is easy, but as with most, only their links can be used. Most don’t accept emails or letters from non-constituents. I have been hard at work writing to my repesentative from senators, cogressmen/women, the governor and The White House. Most send generic responses, but my local reps have responded in kind with actual letters.
      Do not let up, let them all know of your concerns and most of all, don’t stop writing or calling. Don’t be threatening but let them know they work for YOU and they can be replaced in the next election.

      • JeffH

        Don’t be threatening but let them know they work for YOU and, if need be, they can be replaced in the next election.

      • eyeswideopen

        Jeff, I do the same thing you are doing, I make a point of sending somnething out everyday. Excellent advice.

    • JeffH

      Check out the firearms laws while you are at it…that’s scary!

      As a lifelong law abiding sportsman, hunter and shooter I still can’t understand why someone has the right to force me to give up my guns. I always thought we had the freedom to make our own choices. The anti-gun (Democrats) movement would rather use the “common sense” line and allow the criminals to break the law. These types of laws force legal, law abiding gun owners to make a choice between their freedom of choice(2nd Amendment) or breaking a law to preserve their own safety. I prefer the latter because my safety is far more important to me than the criminals.
      In 45 years of gun ownership I have never commited a crime or hurt anyone with my guns. I hope I never have to, but if that day comes, I intend to be prepared and no government is strong enough to deprive me of the ability to protect those I care for the most.

  • Dee

    What, do they think our enemies can bomb us over the internet? It’s just more bull, they want to stop us from hearing and spreading the truth. They can’t have that now, can they?! They are moving into every aspect of our lives. Enough is enough.

    • Carol

      They want us silenced, they are not the least bit worried about a cyber attack……Just another smoke screen. The internet and American’s are going aganist their agenda. Only way to shut us up is to get rid of it and our grassroots movement against them will be much harder to organize. This group of commies in power are just plain evil and will stop at nothing to obtain the power they crave.
      Get out and get involved. I just came back from the Tea Party express as it came through Dallas. AWESOME….get out there join them when they come though your town. You will laugh & cry but you will come home inspired with hope, patriotism and a general sense of well being. It will do your heart good. Get out to any tea party you can get your body to.

      • DaveH

        I applaud your efforts, Carol, thank you.

      • JeffH

        You can be sure the internet and any informative web site is already being monitored…They don’t like what they are reading and the only way to stop it is to make internet discussions illegal or shut them down.

        • JeffH

          This is also a way to get information to strategise and try to appease the naysayers. Toss a bone to the dog once in a while and he will soon be following you!

  • Aline

    Someone in the RNC needs to STOP giving Snowe money. She’s the female version of Arlen Specter. Why on God’s green earth do we need another liberal especially one that we give money to. Can you say “no more liberals in the Republican Party”? Dang it all!

  • http://aol.com carolyn tyler

    obama ran his platform on “CHANGE’ little did we know, what he meant.
    he needs to be impeached NOW!!!!!!!!!!

    • keith

      amen

  • Mike D

    It’s funny how an Administration claiming to be driven by the principals of LAW, can be so quick and indiscriminate at braking the law!

    It is second nature to them all.

    • s c

      I’m no longer in the university info ‘loop.’ You are being very polite when you say that this administration wasted no time in breaking laws and trying to protect its posterior at the same time.
      I don’t know if academics ever settled the issue of Shakespeare’s remarks about lawyers, but I suspect that the bard was not being figurative when he made his comments. He had the true gifts of language and communication. Comrade obama’s ‘gifts’ include bs, an unnatural hatred for America, a most curious penchant for spending other people’s money and (on a good day) only one foot in the real world. What a ‘winner’ we have.
      In general, lawyers have done a great disservice to America. What we have now – especially in the White House – is but one more chapter in the unwritten book concerning the many reasons why lawyers can’t be trusted with power. I can’t prove it, but I suspect that comrade obama got his credentials through the mail (from a pulp magazine ad). Wanna make a bet?

      • DaveH

        SC,
        Prepare yourself for the Eyes attack, lol.

  • DaveH

    Van Jones is out of there! One apparatchik down, many more to go.

    • s c

      I’d like to look on the bright side (if there was one), but experience tells me we’re not dealing with normal people. I would not put it past comrade obama to saddle us with someone just as bad as – if not worse than – Jones. Comrade obama needs all the wackos he can find, if he plans to continue flushing America down the nearest toilet.
      Comrade obama is a classic example of someone who was ‘groomed’ early in life. Until he understands what happened to him, there is no way he will change his ‘beliefs.’ Besides, he’s committed to his masters, and they will find ways to teach him a lesson if disappoints them. You know it. I know it. People who are a certain age have suffered through enough useful idiot presidents and useless congresses know it. It is part of the price of having ‘the best government money can buy.’

  • DaveH

    I want to take this time to warn readers of something I’ve preached about for half my life.
    When we build government, it doesn’t matter if it’s built in the right-wing image or the left-wing image. The fact is that the resulting over-sized government can be easily subverted to tyranny by either side. Once all that apparatus is in place, it is not that difficult to establish Communism or Fascism or any other ism. The bureaucrats will mostly bend to any ideology that will keep their jobs.
    We are headed to almost certain tyranny if the voters don’t wake up to that reality soon. It will be a crap-shoot as to which side ultimately controls that Leviathan. So whether you believe in rule from the left or rule from the right, it is in your best interest to shrink the size of government.

  • DaveH

    This is a series of 4 videos. David Boaz speaks before Freedom Fest 2009. I am breaking the videos into 4 comments (hopefully in chronological order). I think even Eyes will like these:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tdrug5wr5Wc&feature=related

    • DaveH
    • DaveH
    • DaveH
      • eyeswideopen

        I had trouble with sound on the last one. What was I doing wrong?

        • DaveH

          Don’t know. I replayed first 2 minutes and it played fine for me.

          • JeffH

            Thank you!

    • eyeswideopen

      You need to post these on all of the sites… Ok, how do we educate the Republicans and Democrat’s. How do we get these changes made?

      • DaveH

        Well, I think all of us are off to a great start, thanks to Bob Livingston providing us a soapbox. It would be nice if we would treat dissenting opinions with more respect.
        I don’t mind reading things that may have been exposed on NBC, ABC, CNN, or CBS. I haven’t watched those channels for years, except on accident. I’m sure they come up with valid beefs at times. And one of my favorites, John Stossel, is on CBS. But most of them lost their credibility with me years ago. I started paying attention to their exposes and noticed that even though many were very controversial, I was hearing little or nothing from the opposition’s point of view. And even worse, they would sometimes present issues with supposed arguments from both sides on issues that I was very familiar with. So, I knew that they were leaving some very crucial arguments out of the debate.
        I absolutely love Glen Beck (not in a gay sort of way). I fear for him though, because he digs too deep into the power-elite. Probably they would love to off him, but then he would be a martyr and all hell might break loose.

        • eyeswideopen

          Dave, just some more questions re libertarian. They condemn bigotry because it is irrational and repugnant? Does that mean they won’t support that type of person in their political arena?
          Is there no caps on lawsuits?
          Do they really mean freedom of choice for us women?
          I am really liking what I am reading so far… more research to do though.

  • Loredana

    Oh i forgot another thing…Obama mentioned that he was going to put together a Civilian National Security Force who is going to be apart from the military. He said that this force will be as good as the
    Military. They will be looked after real good…maybe they will be like the KGB or the Brown shirts..to spy on the people and squash dissent. Just a thought everyone!!

    Loredana

    • JeffH

      You can bet his Army will be like Hitler’s special Gestapo/SS.
      He realizes that he might not get full cooperation from the US Military or local police to execute is plan of dictatorship.
      Heck, the BATFE, FBI might not end up in his corner. BATFE?NOT!
      I just hope that there is a deep, unbeknownst to Obama, investigation taking place that would fully uncover his plan to destroy America.

  • http://ordy@fedtel./net Eric g

    I dont like over exagerated political swipes , Such as Jones is a communist or Obama and the democrats want communism . I didnt think Bush or Chenny were just like Hitler either . I’am in favor of a government option on healthcare . Maybe run by the states and backed by the federal government . Already the government pays for more than 50% of all health care spent in the United States .

  • http://ordy@fedtel./net Eric g

    When one considers over 80% of americans are covered by insurance ,and insurance companies in this state are allowed to charge about 20% more than they spend on healthcare to cover their expenses . If you than add in the doctors and hospitals also have to have insurance to cover their libility . We probabley have 40 % of our health care costs being insurance rather than health care . Insurance and health care our two of our most lucrative services that I feel take to much out of our economy already .
    United States has about half as many doctors per patient that some other developed countries have , becuase the AMA runs the schools and they dont like competition . So I feel our health care is probabley being rationed right now by the absolutely outrages charges and the insurance companies . Can it get worse ? yes , but it could get better and cheaper too . I have hope and why not try some changes .

    • s c

      Eric g, you need to ask yourself three questions. First, did social security get better? Second, did medicare get better? Third, do you really think comrade obama’s health care ‘reform’ will be good for America and then somehow get better?
      I don’t know how old you are, but you need to realize that with the flunkies and paid-off criminals who have infested Washington for 100+ years, NOTHING gets better. Everything they touch turns into CRAP. They can’t be trusted. Are we not still paying for the Spanish American War via our phone bills?
      Trust these people at your peril, Eric g. People who hate balanced budgets are as trustworthy as a thief who controls your bank account.
      Don’t fool yourself. The stakes are too high to use good intentions or
      a ‘maybe we’ll get lucky’ approach. This current blend of fascism and communism belongs in a third-world country – NOT in America. Open your eyes, and keep them OPEN.

  • keith

    thank god,the elections in 2010 are less than a year away,IT’S TIME TO CLEAN HOUSE! i served in the corps for 18 yrs and was brought up in school memorizing the constitution and the founding fathers,saying the pledge of allegiance,obama and co are a VERY REAL THREAT to our country as we love it and know it now.he is doing everything he can to CONTROL the flow of information and block the dissimination of info to those who oppose him.WE ARE THE ENEMIES TO THEM!it’s OBVIOUS even to the most dense that they are seeting it up so they can CONTROL EVERYTHING FROM FIREARMS,INFO DISSEMINATION,MONEY AND SO ON AND ON.damn i sound like a conspiracy kook,but it’s happening right before my eyes.never would i have beleived what is happening now.it’s got to be stopped!they want to be able to get control over the one thing that everyone is using who opposses them to spread information,the internet.the internet is a very real threat to them and they are going after it as well as anyother form of media that dispences the truth.it alarms me to no end!the founding fathers if they were alive today would be labled as trouble makers and thuggs and called right wing extremists by these left wing loons we have now in control of our nation.think about how obama n co would react to jefferson davis,noah webster,samuel adams,etc.they would be quickly deemed nazis and be put on obamas ”snitch” list.we are in for a fight folks,the very fabric of our nation as it was envisioned by the founding fathers is under assault and is being remade into a obamination that resembles nothing like it was SUPPOSSED TO BE!

    • keith

      MEANT THOMAS JEFFORSON! WE HAVE TO GET AS RADICAL AS THE LIBRALS ARE TO STOP THIS TRAVISTY AND PRAY TO THE GOOD LORD HE WILL DEAL WITH THESE LOONS AND KEEP OUR POWDER DRY! SIGNED:A CONCERNED PATRIOT.

    • JeffH

      Keith…you are spot on! We are labeled “right wing extremists” because we believe in America, The Constitution and Freedom. Most of us have guns, so we are a threat to their “cause” even though it isn’t illegal. We speak up and question and are labeled as “thugs and mobs”. Our parents and grandparents are concerned about losing what has been promised and paid for their whole working lives and Democrats have called them unruly and un-American and dangerous. Policemen, firefighters, and military personel are as concerned about the direction this administration is taking us as you and I are.
      This administration has already shown a penchant for lying and name clling(their credo), as has most administrations. The differance is when they are caught in a lie they just deny, deny, deny or try to change the focus onto something or someone. They did it to Palin because she scared the snot out of them and they refuse to let up. This country has been going to hell in a handbasket for a long, long time yet the Dems only talk of 8 years of Bush. What about his predessessors and the affect they have had on this countries problems. Denial is an excuse for addicts.
      Somehow someway everything will come to a head and the ruling party will not play fair.

  • Pat

    Since everything is a crisis for Obama, and the democrats have gone ballistic on anyone who apposes them, I do not believe this bill is a good idea and could very well be used to silence apponents of this administration and limit freedom of speech.

    They need to vote no to this bill.

    Winston Churchill said “For a nation to try to tax itself into prosperity is like a man standing in a bucket trying to lift himself up by the handle.”

  • Susan Nichols

    Speaking out on the internet is as vital as speaking out at town meetings….. Do not take our Freedom’s away……………….

  • Determined in TX

    Yesterday Rush read on air excerpts from Sen. Max Baucus’Health Reform Bill delivered yesterday before the speech. On Rush’ website are the Table of Contents and Section 5 of how to pay for it. You can download the PDF of the full 41 Pages. Read Section 5 to see how they say this will be ‘revenue neutral’ with massive tax increases and penalties. I guess at least Joe Wilson read Baucus’ bill. Control of the Internet would stop us from getting the facts. HB3200 was downloaded and read by more Americans than by Congressmen (or media!).

    We cannot impeach anyone without control of Congress. I fear their displayed arrogance shows confidence they have so corrupted our electoral system we cannot vote them out. This is where we need to use our power. The stimulus money is being saved to spend on ‘pliable’ Congress members next year. We also need to financially support those brave enough to run against incumbents in 2010.

    Our founding fathers wrote the Constitution with a great deal of effort. They carefully designed checks and balances to prevent abuse of power, especially by the executive branch, given their experience with monarchies in Europe. They left it to us to rise up and take back our country, believing that we would find the fortitude to fight for freedom like our predecessors.

  • Determined in TX

    http://senateconservatives.com/index.php?p=races&c=EV01W
    is a link to show Senate seats we could win in 2010 and candidates running.

  • Determined in TX

    http://www.drudgereport.com/flashwc.htm
    This link provides the “Whip Report” of the U.S. House of Representatives status update on 44 Democrats against HB3200, 57 who demand the public option or nothing, and quotes from many of them.

  • Determined in TX

    Be advised our Internet is already compromised. Last night I wanted to say thanks to Joe Wilson but his site was and is still shut down.
    I found another Congressional site and sent him a message titled
    “Please Run for President”. Today that site is GONE from Google. In other words, there is no way those who thought Joe Wilson a hero for telling the truth last night can tell him so.

    • eyeswideopen

      I suppose you are teaching your children to show no respect for the office of the President? When you do that don’t be surpised if they show disrespect for a President that you happen to like.. Yes, I am so impressed that a Senator from the Republican Party cannot restrain himself during the time that a President is speaking. Such a class-less action. This is why the Repubs are losing membership, who wants to be assocaited with men acting worse than children?.

  • http://www.truth1.org Scott Ervin

    I understand everyone’s displeasure with a regime clearly despotic and capable of anything. and I speak about the overall continuity of the gov, not the current in particular. But I would also say it is far too late to do anything about it. They have been carefully developing technology in secret for many years and organizing society as they wanted it to be able to cope with anything. They have a large standing army and can call upon other nations and their large armies as well. To quote the Borg on Star Trek Next Generation, Resistance is futile.

    You are all only kidding yourself if you think you can stop this now. There is no law and never had been any law. Judges and opposing lawyers all work together. Nothing you can do in court will work, either. Your gov long ago gave up representing you or caring about you. And in a short matter of time the internet will be shut down, internet businesses will die and you will all be isolated and vulnerable.

    I hope you all have white flags ready to wave. The illusion of freedom, democracy, and justice is gone. It was a lie from the beginning.

    There would only be one hope but I know there are few that would accept of believe it. But God foretold all this long ago. You can get on His good side and be spared or you can die with the rest to be killed off by the elite before God gets to them.

    But know this, if you resist, you will die. Join God or eventually die anyway. Not many choices now. Just 2.

  • http://1sttimebuyerinformation.com/ GoldDigger

    An additional of the reasons to buy precious metal is always that it’s a physical item that you don’t have to trust others to secure its value. While this is nevertheless better than losing purchasing power, a single from the best reasons to buy precious metal is always that it’s sensitive to inflation and reacts a lot more quickly than, say, prices at the grocery store or the vehicle great deal.

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