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How States Can Protect Themselves From Financial Collapse

April 17, 2012 by  

How States Can Protect Themselves From Financial Collapse
States can protect themselves by adopting metals like silver, gold and copper as recognized methods of payment within the State.

The States of America are, truly, children of the Constitution. The legal framework that is the foundation of State sovereignty and internal administration was unprecedented when the United States won its independence. States were designed to decentralize and keep in check the power of the Federal government. They were meant to be the guardians at the gate, the barrier to the formation of oligarchy or outright dictatorship. This, of course, has changed drastically.

The battle over centralized versus decentralized authority and economy has been going on for quite some time. It is undeniably critical in our current climate of crisis, under a government that is bankrupt in every sense and a currency that is on the verge of calamity.

A vast shift in State independence was definitely caused by the reformations of the Civil War, but the progressive erasure of financial sovereignty in the States was really placed on the fast track after the Federal Reserve Act of 1913. That’s when the enforcement of new taxes fueled the establishment machine, including Social Security (from which the government constantly steals). Also in 1913, the income tax (which does not pay for any State infrastructure) came to life. By the end of that year, the Federal government could borrow fiat money created at will by the private central bank from thin air and it could tax the populace to feed the Federal Reserve in a cannibalistic circle of doom. This dynamic has grown our government to a size so massive that it is now forced to monetize its own debt just to survive.

Setting aside the inevitable collapse of the dollar and our economic system as we know it, a considerable goal has been achieved by centralists: With so much free money at the disposal of the Feds, they could wipe away the last vestiges of State sovereignty by simply buying State compliance. Through agencies like the Environmental Protection Agency; Food and Drug Administration; Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives; etc., 10th Amendment checks and balances are trampled constantly without any regard for local laws or the will of the people. State governments and citizens would be in a far better position to deny such agency intrusions if they didn’t gobble every dollar that Washington, D.C., waves in their faces. In our era of tenuous fiscal stopgaps and imploding economies, the need for Americans, and especially States, to decouple from the Federal government and the mainstream system is more important than ever.

The following is a step-by-step method that States could use to accomplish the task of insulation from financial crisis and Federal control. Much of it hinges on a willingness by State governments to actually pursue independence, which might seem like a naïve dream to most of us. But in the wake of a major breakdown and the fall of the greenback, I believe many States will seek a way to weather the storm, if only out of a desire to survive. This includes walking away from their ties to Washington:

Step 1: Stop Accepting Federal Funding

For States already drowning in debt, this is probably an incomprehensible idea (there is no financial escape for California or Illinois that I can see). But for those States that have some responsibility and lower debt levels, Federal funding is not necessary. Much of the money the Federal government collects comes through State cooperation. The money is then handed back to the States through various avenues with strings attached. The rest of the capital Washington pumps into States is attained through printing without even the pretense of originating at the State level. The fiat money carries the high price of dollar devaluation and the hidden tax of inflation. The fact is States are not required by law (yet) to accept Federal funds. As long as States do so anyway, they expose themselves to Federal influence. As the dollar goes, so shall all those tied to it. States should take a lesson from Asian bloc nations like China or Japan and begin distancing themselves as far away from U.S. currency and debt as possible. In the long term, those that do will endure. Those that don’t will be dragged under the water along with the sinking ship.

Step 2: Enforce 10th Amendment Nullification

Once States are no longer beholden to Federal monies, they have more leeway to obstruct intrusions by alphabet agencies and to deny dangerous legislative programs (like Obamacare) that put them at financial risk. Nullification takes many forms, and numerous issues have the potential to become vehicles for the assertion of 10th Amendment rights. One very fascinating political method was devised by Idaho State Representative Phil Hart (R-Hayden), who used the power to declare emergencies by States themselves to devise a piece of legislation which would allow Idaho to trump Federal and EPA restriction of the local wolf problem. As the bill flew through the Legislature, interestingly, Congress delisted the wolf as an endangered species. Obviously, the Federal government did not want the issue to become a success for 10th Amendment rights, so it defused the situation by pulling back the EPA. Essentially, the Federal government blinked.

This strategy could be used for multiple State conflicts with the Federal government to effectively nullify their ability to lord over and interfere with specific needs of the people of a particular region. The future economic prosperity of the various States will depend greatly on their ability to take decisive fiscal action without constantly having to ask permission from the Feds.

Step 3: Set Up A State Bank

There is certainly some controversy over the idea of a State bank. In the end, any institution can be twisted for devious ends, and a State bank is no different. However, this system has worked well in North Dakota, where a State bank has been in operation for more than 90 years. Some from the “left” (whatever that means anymore) often attempt to use the institution as an example of “socialist banking,” which is not exactly accurate and gives the strategy a bad name. Yes, the bank is State-owned, but its purpose is to invest in and encourage free market enterprise within the State, not create a State-owned and -operated economy.

A State bank would be especially effective in a resource-rich area, where a State government can invest in local projects run by local companies that employ local people. This is the opposite of what we see so often today, where international corporate entities are given monopoly over resource development within a State. They siphon away most of the profits and jobs from the region, while the Federal government thwarts the growth of competing small businesses through concerted taxation and regulation. This goes on because States often do not feel they have the funding capability to encourage local business efforts. The problem diminishes drastically with a State bank, if done correctly, honestly and with oversight from the citizenry.

Step 4: Resource Development

As mentioned above, resource-rich States will have a noticeable advantage in the event of a primary system collapse. As the dollar continues to tumble and inflation rises, trade methods will eventually revert to raw goods and materials. This has taken place in nearly every recorded modern economic crisis. It was especially prevalent during Weimar Germany, when debtor nations began refusing the hyperinflated deutschemark as payment and demanded natural resources from the Germans instead. States with heavy resources will be in a perfect position to decouple from the failing establishment and build their own systems (which is probably a main motivation behind Obama’s National Defense Resources Preparedness Executive Order).

Step 5: Adopt Alternative Currencies

There is a lot of debate over the “legality” of a State coining its own money, so I recommend cutting out the debate entirely and merely adopting metals like silver, gold and copper as recognized methods of payment within the State. Many State governments are considering measures for alternative currencies. Some States, like Utah, have passed bills on precious metals. The problem is that most of these bills do not go far enough. States are going to have to complete the economic chain by paying out precious metals into the system and encouraging businesses to do likewise. It’s not enough for residents to be allowed to pay in.

States that rely on the dollar as their only trade mechanism will fail. States that decentralize currencies by adding other options into the mix will survive. It’s really that simple.

Step 6:  Encourage Localized Markets

States will be only as healthy economically as their individual communities allow. Small communities can become independent trade networks on their own, but the right State help and encouragement would make the process move along much faster. The more self-reliant towns and counties become, the more insulated they become from wide-spectrum disaster. During any national breakdown, redundancy is the key. It will mean the difference between a total nightmare scenario and large-scale tragedy, or a minimal system shock followed by rapid rebuilding. Barter must be reintroduced to the American lifestyle, and States have the ability to help nurture network growth. Trade skills and micro-industries can easily be promoted through State programs.

This is the kind of constructive government involvement that is needed. It seeks to open doors and then gets out of the way, rather than closing doors and grasping for more control. Unfortunately, policies like this are not possible under the current Federal construct, but they still could be possible within the States.

In the event that your State government is not receptive to the idea of independent economy, not all is lost. Each of the steps above can be accomplished in reverse at the neighborhood, town and county level. Over a period of time and with relentless drive, solid alternative networks will spread, link and take over a State regardless of what the local government approves of. The secret is this: If you provide for yourself and others what the mainstream system will not, eventually, it will either have to conform to your logic because it works, or it will try to stop you with violence and expose its inherent tyranny, building greater resistance. In either case, you win.

–Brandon Smith

Brandon Smith

is the founder of the Alternative Market Project, an organization designed to help you find like-minded activists and preppers in your local area so that you can network and construct communities for barter and mutual aid. Join today and learn what it means to step away from the unstable mainstream system and build something better. You can contact Brandon Smith at:

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  • Vicki

    The OP writes

    Step 5: Adopt Alternative Currencies

    There is a lot of debate over the “legality” of a State coining its own money, so I recommend cutting out the debate entirely and merely adopting metals like silver, gold and copper as recognized methods of payment within the State.

    Since the supreme law of the land specifically says that states are NOT allowed to coin money they would be very wise to not do so. HOWEVER the very same supreme law orders the State to use NOTHING but gold and silver Coin as Tender in Payment of Debts. Nothing to adopt. Just enforce the law.

    Article I section 10

    • GALT

      “For every subtle and complicated question there is a perfectly simple and straightforward answer which is WRONG!” H.L. Mencken

      Good observation Vicki in pointing out the “constitutional” conflict which appears to exist……but attempting to “enforce” your solution, effectively would put the states out of business……since gold and silver coins are not in common circulation, and while such coins are minted by the government as legal tender, the actual value of the metal content far exceeds the “dollar” equivalent of U.S. currency.

      The Federal Government completed the process of doing exactly that, in the late fifties…….when all of the states finally adopted the Uniform Commecial Code in its entirety, from Federal Statutes.

      Federal Reserve Notes in 1955 contained the following: This note is legal tender for all debts public and private and is redeemable in lawful money at any Federal Reserve Bank.
      After the adoption of the UCC by the states, this was no longer necessary, and the notes became legal tender……which might or should appear somewhat strange……because “tender” is a voluntary act………and is one of the “benefits” you get as a citizen of the UNITED STATES. ( it is a compelled benefit, but since you are considered a “voluntary participant” within the “jurisdiction” currently operating in the UNITED STATES……VICKI…and the STATES are complicit in this, proposed solutions…..must account for this “reality”…..which means that ……any proposal by a STATE must maintain the “illusion” as best it can……and you can see, that this is not easy.

      But as long as the question How is this possible or how was this accomplished? is not asked…….those who are Master’s of this illusion, have nothing to fear.

      “The most common of all follies is to believe passionately in the palpably not true. It is the chief occupation of mankind.”H.L. Mencken

      In the spirit of “limited government” and “equal JUSTICE under law”,

      Where are the common law and equity courts?

      • Tom W.

        It SOUNDED like a win/win to me but I’m not going to pretend to know how to fix what we are wittnessing right before our very eyes, (I’ll leave that up to you DEEP thinkers! Me thinks that you thinkers are the ones who have gotten us ALL in this mess in the first place!!!) I only know that we CAN NOT continue down this same path to economic ruin!!!

        “We are free today substantially, but the day will come when our republic will come to impossibility because it’s wealth will be concentrated in the hands of a few. When that day comes, then we must rely upon the wisdom of the best elements in the country to readjust the laws of the nation to the changed conditions.” – James Madison

        The foresight of our forefathers amazes me continuously!!!

      • DaveH

        The case for a 100 percent Gold Dollar:

      • GALT

        Then we have the case against the gold dollar:1920- 1929

        See; Lords of Finance

        sorry Dave, no links available but they do have libraries, book stores and e-books?

      • DaveH

        1920-1929 and the resultant crash are the case against the Federal Reserve, and there are plenty of links available for those who want to learn. Does that include you, Galt? I doubt it. Here is one such book:

      • DaveH

        And here is another book similar to that written by Murray Rothbard, but probably much more readable to most people as Murray tends to get a bit heavy in the Economic jargon:

      • Tom W.

        Keep up the GOOD fight DaveH!!!

      • GALT

        Since he has no knowledge, there is no fight…….but we will try this again, The Federal Reserve System did not operate as it does now….individual member banks, set policy…it was not unified……..The New York Federal Reserve Bank, under Benjamin Strong along with his counterparts in England, France and Germany essentially were responsible for what happened in this period, as was the gold standard, with the United States controlling
        75% of the World’s Gold supply. It did not prevent what happened, it CAUSED what happened……and as for the four economic transitions since Adam Smith got the first one wrong, you are still in the second one…….so you have a choice, either bring yourself up to date….or invent a time machine so you can go back to a time when the world around you matches your understanding.

      • DaveH

        Anybody who reads the books I linked to will see that it is you, Galt, who has no idea what he’s talking about.

      • DaveH

        From History of Money and Banking:
        “After the United States entered the war in the spring of
        1917, Benjamin Strong, as head of the Fed, obligingly doubled
        the money supply to finance the war effort”.
        “Benjamin Strong and the Fed began their postwar inflationary
        policy from November 1921 until June 1922, when the Fed
        tripled its holdings of U.S. government securities and happily
        discovered the expansion of reserves and inflation of the money
        “During 1924 the Fed purchased nearly $500 million in government
        securities, driving up the U.S. money supply by 8.3 percent during
        that year”.
        Even though, ostensibly, we were on a “Gold Standard”, the Federal Reserve got around that limitation by pyramiding credit (thus creating money) on top of their gold stores with their Fractional Reserve System. Thus for the same gold, there could be several noteholders. If there had been a run on the banks they could not have in any way redeemed all notes in gold as a result of their Fractional Banking scheme. But the Government ran interference for them to prevent such runs by declaring bank holidays and other methods.
        It would be like if you gave a contract of sale to your car to several people, only in that case Government would throw your raggedy butt in jail, unlike the treatment they gave to the Politically Connected Banks.
        If not for the Gold Standard, it would have been even worse than it was.
        By increasing the Money Supply dramatically, the entrepreneurs were fooled into thinking there was a legitimate market for their goods, so they expanded recklessly and invested recklessly and after the Federal Reserve could no longer expand the money supply those mal-investments came crashing down.
        But don’t take my word for it, and by all means don’t take Galt’s word for it. He is simply repeating Propaganda, not logical reality. Read the book:

      • DaveH

        For those who would like to get about as good an explanation as I’ve seen of the Fractional Reserve System that got us into trouble in the 1920s and many times since, pull up this book:
        Then read the section in Part 2, chapter 3 called — Central Banks: Creators of Money “Out of Thin Air”.

      • Tom W.

        Galt,,, Galt… Galt… Hey! where’d he go?!!

    • Vigilant

      “The fact is States are not required by law (yet) to accept Federal funds. As long as States do so anyway, they expose themselves to Federal influence. As the dollar goes, so shall all those tied to it.”

      I’m afraid the toothpaste is already out of the tube. Sadly, movements to decentralize and deglobalize our economy may be the last gasp of a dying Don Quixote. Expecting the states to wean themselves off the Federal tit is a fantasy that won’t come true unless there is an economic debacle of Biblical proportions.

      Nullification was effectively killed by Andrew Jackson, and secession put out of the question by Lincoln. You could expect another bloodbath if that were to occur.

      I reject, to some degree, the idea that “resovereignizing” the states would make everything hunky dory. As Mather Byles, the Boston loyalist said, “Which is better – to be ruled by one tyrant three thousand miles away or by three thousand tyrants one mile away?”

      I live 20 miles away from Albany, NY, and believe me, the tyrants in the state legislature are no better in the People’s Republic of New York than they are in Washington, D.C. If anything, they are MORE repressive of individual liberties than the Feds.

      • Tom W.

        “Tolerence is the last virtue of a dying society.” – Aristotle

      • Windrinker

        It is about time for people to realize that this country must decentralize power, so that it can survive the tyrannical foreigner squatting in the oval office! What I read in some posts is FEAR of trying to solve problems that we are going to have to face! There is no way around them.

        Either we try to survive, anyway we can, or accept what is being organized by the foreign powers in charge. I do not “buy” the posts of some that are very negative and find all the reasons that decentralization and State sovereignty would be impossible. Don’t underestimate America and its “CAN DO” attitude! It is totally possible! Those that want to make decentralization, impossibly complicated, can wallow in their decision and go to California. But, States that have their financial houses in order, and have the will to survive… CAN!

        I agree with the author, this is the only way for the States to protect themselves and to survive the coming disaster. I have been ranting about States taking back the powers usurped by the Feds. Bring this rouge government to a halt! Governors need to regain State Sovereignty and take control of their own economies. Keep the money out of Washington! The States need to keep their money instead of sending it to the criminals, and letting them divide it up and send it back as they see fit, with the many “strings” always attached to Fed money. States, like individuals, must be responsible for their own spending and balancing their own budgets. This cannot happen with the Federal mandates coming out of D.C.

        The people of each State can decide what programs they want to fund, and how they spend their own tax money…The people of States that have their houses in order, should benefit, rather than being robbed to pay for the States that have been irresponsible. No State that has been frugal and adhered to their budget should be told they must pick up the tab for irresponsible, progressive States like California.

        Decentralize government and tell the Feds to “get lost.” Washington cannot declare war on the entire country, especially when they no longer are “fed” by every tax payer in the country.

      • Hey You

        I agree with Windrinker, but to be practical, he, I and the author (plus a few others) are a small minority against the massive numbers of those whose excesses are expected to be financed by “government” largesse. Meaningful changes will only come about after a total breakdown. But with between $15 trillion and $100 trillion debt, that can be sooner than later. It just won’t be fun.

        Anyway, who can comprehend what a trillion is? None of us could even count to a billion if our entire life remaining were to be spent counting.

      • amagi

        On nullification – I recommend Thomas E. Woods book “Nullification”, subtitled ‘How
        to Resist Federal Tyranny in the 21st Century.’ A word from Judge Abel P. Upshur
        in that book (p.219) “Is it not opression of the worst sort, to coerce obedience to
        usurped power ?”
        If the Federal Government violates the Constitution, is it not the States’ duty to
        nullify such action in order to save that same document; our system of law ?

    • Tom W.

      Does not a tyrannical federal government make those laws null and void Vicki?!

      Now that was what I call a WOLF!!!

      • longbowelk

        Actually, this is a reply to windrinker, there was no reply button. Well said Windrinker. Our only chance is to fight these criminals from the State level. I say, if we can survive this big mess, we can stay independent, form smaller unions, or clean the whole slate in DC along with the jillions of BS laws that were created, install term limits, etc. Go to for the latest of what is happening in our country that MSM and Fox News does not report.

      • Tom W.

        Well said both of yas! longbowelk, we frequent quite regularly on this sight! Stick around you’ll see!!! Windrinker, I hear ya Bro!!!

      • Vicki

        longbowelk says:

        Actually, this is a reply to windrinker, there was no reply button.

        Welcome aboard longbowelk. When there is no reply button all you have to do is go UP to the nearest “reply” button to have your comment included in the part of the thread that you wish to respond. For instance to reply to windrinker and have your reply appear under his/hers you would go up to the “reply” button at the end of vigilant’s post.

    • FreedomFighter

      IRS To Revoke Citizenship: RED ALERT!

      Laus Deo
      Semper Fi

      • Tom W.

        Good lookin’out FF!!! What’d I tell ya longbowelk?!!

      • Vicki

        Oh no. Little timmy g won’t be able to run around the world any more. If they revoke your citizenship then you are no longer a slave to their empire. You get to take your place in the world as a sovereign.
        note the links in the article about Capital Control measures expected to be implemented in 2013.

        What this is actually about is not the revocation of your citizenship by stealth or any other. It is an open declaration that you are, as many have warned, merely chattel.

    • Vicki

      GALT says:

      since gold and silver coins are not in common circulation, and while such coins are minted by the government as legal tender, the actual value of the metal content far exceeds the “dollar” equivalent of U.S. currency.

      Galt needs stop quoting Mencken and pay attention to his (GALT) namesake get the “can do” attitude that made this country great.

      There is nothing stopping PEOPLE from minting coins as long as they are not counterfeit CURRENT US coins. (Article 1 Section 8 of the Supreme LAW of this land). STATES are not allowed to coin money but the PEOPLE have always had the power. The power delegated the federal government to coin money in no way prevents citizens from coining their own money. For obvious reasons they can not coin money that is counterfeit. Helping to prevent fraud IS one of the duties of government.

      Btw counterfeit means to have lessor value than. So Von Nothaus was erroneously convicted even had he exactly duplicated CURRENT coin since his “coins” were silver and not junk metal like zinc

      What we really need to observe is the attitude of the federal government to the states (or people) actually daring to obey the Supreme LAW of the land.

      Obeying the law is terrorism?

      • Vicki

        Grrr. anyway a quick side note. There IS a federal law that supposedly makes it illegal for people to coin their own money ( but I can’t find any constitutional basis for it. No big surprise there :) This is probably the law that Von NotHaus was convicted of violating.

        As with most such laws it fails by intent or stupidity to cover making coins of things that are NOT metal so if you made coins out of some particularly valuable material that is not metal or alloy, they would not be able to stop you.

        And of course if your local, state, or federal government gave you permission. (“Whoever, except as authorized by law, ….”)

        Another interesting consequence of the law is that barter remains legal as long as no metal/alloy is involved?

  • Sirian

    All five points are good but there remains to many people that simply will not understand the importance of the present day attempt directed towards the total destruction of our economic system. Between the guidance followed by this administration – Alinsky, Cloward & Piven, Marx and Mao is it not more evident than what has been seen before? Yes! Couple this with how cleverly we’ve been fleeced for so much since the establishment of the Fed in 1913, should it not be obvious as, shall we say, proof in the pudding? With these suggestions as an alternative route that may be taken to protect states individually, as well as on a whole, is it not also in a way inferring the ultimate – succession? Possibly so, possibly so. I pray that it may never have to come down to that but with the lack of understanding as I mentioned above, it could very well end up in that arena easier than may be anticipated.

    • nc

      Sirian, can you imagine the choas if the militias of 48 different states had stormed the beaches of Normany? Or if states, with all their power, decided they did not want THEIR roads to match where the adjoining state roads met the state line? If a state rich in resourses could buy up weaker states and own their state banks and militias?
      or if the states with all their power were to say a citizen of that state first obligation is to serve in the state militia and not in theFederal army. How much power did the founding fathers wish the states to have?

      Why did they not name it The Individual States of America? How did we reach the position of number one COUNTRY the world and miss what the founding fathers intended us to be? When you want so much to lead the number one country in the world, but your plan has only 8% support from the Republican party and less than that from the Democrat Party you come up with weird plans like this one by Mr. Smith! Maybe in the next world!!!!

      • Sirian

        You’re making about as much sense as a dog running out in front of a semi. And oh yes, LIMITED Federal government, as so prescribed by our founding fathers.

      • Ted Crawford

        ” How much power did the Founding Fathers intend the States to have”?
        If the entire fourteen pages is too time consuming to read, try at least this small portion: Artical 8 and the Tenth Amendment of The Constitution of the United States. To more fully understand their original intent, it is also helpful to read their interpersonal correspondance and the discussions that took place within the Congress as these Documents were being created.
        While this is difficult and time consuming, it is far more rewarding than suffering under the tyranny of administrations that usurp them due to our ignorance and indifference!

      • Ted Crawford

        My bad! Should read Artical 1, Section 8

      • Tom W.

        The federal government had three original responsibilities , as I understand it nc, to protect our borders (LOL!), to maintain our interstate roads (LOL!), and to furnish us with a fighting force to protect us collectively (We the People now feel threatened by that same fighting force!!!)

      • DaveH

        NC says — “can you imagine the choas if the militias of 48 different states had stormed the beaches of Normany?”.
        48 States wouldn’t have stormed the beaches of Normany. It’s likely that most of them would have butted out and let the Leaders of Europe stage their own power struggle with their own citizens’ lives.
        NC says — “Or if states, with all their power, decided they did not want THEIR roads to match where the adjoining state roads met the state line?”.
        If that was their choice, then so be it.
        NC says — “If a state rich in resourses could buy up weaker states and own their state banks and militias?”.
        What have you got against Voluntary Choice, NC?
        NC says — “or if the states with all their power were to say a citizen of that state first obligation is to serve in the state militia and not in theFederal army. How much power did the founding fathers wish the states to have?”.
        The Question is — “How much power did the founding Fathers wish the Federal Government to have?”. The answer is right here in Section 8:

      • Vicki

        nc writes

        If a state rich in resourses could buy up weaker states and own their state banks and militias?

        You mean like China and other foreign countries are doing? Or do you mean like the Federal Reserve does with all banks in the US?

    • Tom W.

      I join with you in that prayer Brother Sirian!

    • GALT

      And pray tell, what is the economic system that you think that is being destroyed and by whom?

      Are you afraid of losing “free market, unregulated, capitalism”?

      Because that is exactly what you have had since 2000 and it is also the cause of the current crisis, and those that caused the first one, have been bailed out and are still at it and NO GOVERNMENT can control them…….( because they OWN the government of the UNITED STATES…….and thru it, hold the fate of the world in their grip. )

      Do not confuse ” free market capitalism”, with the unregulated use of capital, where profits from speculation and fraud masquerade as growth……when for every one dollar of growth,
      five dollars of future debt obligations was incurred.

      Engineering financial instruments is neither productive nor production… is illusion and in the end DELUSION……it is theft and fraud and criminal, and governments are the only entities that have the potential power to keep them in check…….but in corrupting this potential check…….you are now giving them exactly what they need to continue….because you think government is the problem……..

      But the PROBLEM is CORRUPT government, which at the behest of its corruptors, removed the regulations that were holding them back……..and HERE you ARE!
      The solution is ending the corruption, not ending the government or weakening it further…to do otherwise, is to invite what you presently experiencing, to get even worse.

      Unfortunately many people are under the impression that “economics” is a science or a rigorous discipline……….it is neither……and any understanding regarding it, is based on history…….so the solutions are always based on the last “problem”, not the present one…and economics has gone through four major transitions since Adam Smith got the first one wrong.

      This final transition requires the understanding that “growth” is not the solution, because
      “growth” is not possible any longer……..U.S. productivity numbers have not changed much, but the number of people required is considerably less, as is the pay for those fortunate enough to have a job, or two, or three………

      Solutions require understanding and if you would actually like to understand the REAL CAUSE…..of THIS CRISIS…..Extreme Money: Masters of the Universe and the Cult of Risk:
      Satyajit Das.

      • David169

        Galt, Of all of the contributors here I believe you are the closest to hitting the mark on our economy. I believe we have two factors to the economy. A monetary factor and a political factor. The political factor is manipulating the monetary factor bringing down our country. The politicians have bought votes with entitlements to the point that the productive sector of the economy cannot produce enough to support their giving for (buying) votes. Once the country was off the gold and silver standard the door was opened to just print money. So much money has now been printed that when it is fully absorbed into the economy and it dilutes the buying power of the dollar we will be looking at $10. gasoline. Yesterday silver was about $31 per ounce. US coins are 90% silver so the quarter dollar that used to buy a gallon of gas contained $31 – 10% X .25 =$6.975 in silver which leads me to believe we have massive inflation coming which will collapse the economy. $7 gasoline will stop this country in it’s tracks. We now have to print almost half of the federal budget. So $7 gas will be followed by $10 gas. I don’t believe there is any single act or bill that has brought us down but the economy has been destroyed by “economic hysteresis” or the sum total of all the entitlements.

      • Vicki

        Massive inflation is guarenteed by the simple law of supply and demand. This law affects EVERYTHING including the fiat paper currently used for money in the US. The massive increase in the supply of this paper will cause a massive reduction in its value.

        This will be seen in a lot more areas than $7 gas.

      • DaveH

        As usual, Galt hasn’t a clue what he’s talking about. We haven’t had anything close to Free Markets since the late 1800s. The Leaders work hand in hand with their Crony Capitalists to hobble their competitors with sweet sounding lies (regulations), quotas, tariffs, and other protective gimmicks which are anything BUT Free Markets. And the consumers lose. The Bigger Government Grows, the more Corruption Grows. And ignorant people like Galt buy the Propaganda.
        People like David169 need to read books like this and get a clue about reality:
        They have a Kindle version for people with Kindles. The Leaders are counting on ignorant people who won’t learn what’s really going on.

      • DaveH

        Anybody else who buys into the easy emotional fix of Propaganda, that Free Markets are responsible for our present crisis, needs to read this and learn something:

    • MAP

      Here’s a very ggod analysis of the nature of our Republic by a former Secretary of State, written in 1868. He cuts to the quick and leaves no questions remaining on the subject. What we are led to believe today are mostly lies and distortions. The Union as it stands today was never ratified into existence.

  • jakob

    actually the constitution is the child of the states

    • Vigilant

      The Articles of Confederation were the child of the states.

      The Constitution created a federal form of government as a Constitutional Republic. It was intended to provide the central government with substantial (but limited) powers while retaining the sovereignty of the states and the people.

      The US would not have become so economically powerful on the world stage in the absence of a strong central authority. It would have remained a squabbling and disjointed collection of individual states.

      The problems arising from the abuse of power are not the fault of the Constitution. They are the fault of greedy politicians and an apathetic public that faled to maintain vigilance over the lofty principles established by the Constitution. It has been fed by an indolent electorate whose major concern is how to get something for nothing.

      • Tom W.

        The US was never an economic powerhouse till after the civil war and the Industrial revolution that followed 10 years after.

      • http://AOL MadIrishman

        Thank You Thank You, Someone other than me saying this for years, it’s a shame people don’t have a clue what our Constutition contains or means. But then the education system in our country don’t even try to educate students any more. They have become Baby Sitters, unless of course the student is playing sports. But that’s another topic isn’t it?

      • DaveH

        Vigilant says — “The US would not have become so economically powerful on the world stage in the absence of a strong central authority. It would have remained a squabbling and disjointed collection of individual states”.
        That is only true to the extent that the Federal Government enforced Free Trade among the States which was the original intent of the Commerce Clause. Government absence from the Voluntary Trading of Free People is always the best solution to Prosperity.
        Read this to learn more about Real Capitalism (especially Part 3, Government Control vs. Free Markets):

      • MAP

        Very good point JohnH. There is no proof that the forced (and unconstitutional) consolidation of the states were responsible for any of our economic growth. It is a position that can not be proven either way.

      • MAP

        I’m sorry. I meant DaveH, not JohnH.

      • Vicki

        The industrial revolution would have happened with or without the civil war.

        The more interesting question is what would the federal government be without the central bank (FedReserve) and without the IRS?

      • Tom W.

        That could be argued Vicki. The IR began around 10 yrs. following the Civil War and changed life for everyone in the WORLD FOREVER!!! Just look at all the LIFE CHANGING discoveries that happened in this, arguably the most glorious period in our nation’s history! But along with all those great discoveries came what is known as the “sting of progress”, i.e. pollution and the depletion of our natural resources.

  • steve

    until you get corruption out of the way, the system will continue to fail and go bankrupt. that is the first and only step that needs to be taken, get er dun

    • Ted Crawford

      November 6, 2012, A good beginning!!

    • Tom W.

      And the GSA is the PERFECT example steve!!! I understand our Bill of Rights, but if you work for our federal government (paid by the tax payers), you shoudn’t be allowed to evoke the 5th when questioned by a congressional oversight committee concerning corruption in whatever function you serve. ESPECIALLY If your the head of whatever administration is in question!

  • Stanford

    CHeck out Freedom Reigns Radio : according to it, the movement is underway to nullify the Central Powers and the illuminati (wealthy elite, 1%): and it’s supported by the military. We may be able to grab back our freedom yet!

    • Ted Crawford

      Yes, of course! That has worked out so very well for the Bolsheviks, hasn’t it!

      • Tom W.

        That was then, this is now Ted.

      • Vicki

        For amusement you should read what the loyalists said in the late 1700′s.

  • Capitalist at Birth

    I sincerely believe it is too late to stop the total destruction of the U.S.A., because of the ignorance of most of the population, and their unwillingness to be an informed electorate. Where is John Galt when we need him. I for one, am going to leave this country an head to Central America, as soon as possible. Otherwise I will be murdered by the Totalitarians who are now in charge. That refers to Republicans and Democrats alike.

    • Flashy

      Have fun camping out with those “Freedom Fights”, the Contras! You recall those guys. the thugs reagan funded illegally even as they butchered women, children, farmers, priests and nuns….all in the name of ‘freedom” !

      • DaveH

        And of course you have references to back up your claims, Flashman?
        You know we can’t just take your word for anything.

      • Flashy

        Historical fact DaveH..something you are very weak in… will someone please enlighten this buffoon? I’m getting tired of educating him on every little issue of substance…

      • Tom W.

        Flushdouche! Do you know how much we missed you this weekend?!! People were askin’ about ya! Ben was awesome, you shoulda Ben there! LOL!!!

      • Vicki

        Flashy says:

        Historical fact

        Then you should have no dificulty providing links

        I’m getting tired of educating him on every little issue of substance…

        You have remarkably low stamana then for none of us have ever seen you try. Hint. Proof by bald assertion is not a good source of anyones education.

    • mark

      Good luck in Central America, Capitalist at Birth. You will find a wonderland of good government there: no corruption, absolute honesty among public officials, excellent security, no crime, great infrastructure and traffic organization, zero pollution. I lived there for several years and I can assure you all will be wonderful for you there. I also have some Brooklyn Bridge stock I want to sell to you.

      Seriously get used to electricity every other day in some of the countries there. Water you cannot drink from the tap. Many days with no water whatsoever from the tap. But you can line up to get in from buckets at the watertrucks that is if you can habla alguno espanol to the drivers and officials. Journalists who criticize these problems and the crimes of officials are routinely arrested and put in jail. Oh, and in most of these countries private gun ownership is illegal. Good luck in the courts, too where English Common Law and Constitutional rights are as omnipresent as jaguars in Alaska. Pero no se preocupe. Usted estara bien. Muy buena suerte, amigo.

      • Flashy

        but…but..they have “State’s Right’s” !!!

      • DaveH

        Actually, Chile is now more economically free than the US:
        Pick a country name to get particulars on their ranking.

        As Government Grows, Corruption Flows.



    • eric

      I hope you find no totaltarians in cental america , I supose there is no chance you could be murdered there too ?

  • http://None Dave Huff

    How on earth would we deal with the diversification of our investments. It’s like a web of interdependance on so many areas of the globe that would inhibit any effort to isolate any one state. A good idea for some reasons, but bad for others!

    • Windrinker

      Dave, you are worried about your investments! In the face of the country being totally dismantled and our way of life completely destroyed….you are worried about your stocks, your investments! Do you really think that you will be able to keep what investments you have…. Try worrying about the day you will be grubbing around in the garbage for rotting leftovers to eat.

      No wonder this country is in the “shetter.”

  • Flashy

    “States were designed to decentralize and keep in check the power of the Federal government. They were meant to be the guardians at the gate, the barrier to the formation of oligarchy or outright dictatorship. ”

    Errrr…not exactly correct. Missed the mark by about 1 billion light years. (i expect to be attacked and denigrated by the “revisionists” and those not knowing their history…but that’s nothing new on this site).

    The opriginal framework for the Nation was the Articles of Confederation. That worked so well that a few states came close to war with another, the federal framework was non existent, and the nation was dangerously close to splintering into small state fiefdoms. thus, they went back to the drawing table and our Constitution was written and, after a bitter battle between the states, agreed to and signed (it was very close to being rejected).

    Now…other than Article 10 and the 10th Amendment, what Clauses in the Constitution are addressing state power and make up? C’mon all you “Constitutional scholars”. What ‘limits’ does the Constituion contain by the States over the Federal government?

    Answer…none. That document is a FEDERAL document. What the People do not give the Feds as Governmental Power, the States have. As far as the US Constitution is concerned, a State may have a governmental makeup quite literally in any way or form it chooses. Subject to federal powers and the powers and Rights retained by the People.

    the growth and use of the Federal powers expanded, and had three identifiable “periods” of growth. Up to the Civil War, Post Civil War, 1913 and 1933. it wasn’t anym ‘new’ power the Federal government exercised..the Power was always there. it was the Federal government deciding to exercise that power which was unique. . Nothing ‘new” was created except as ratified by Amendment and approved by the States and the People..

    But the malarky that the States were a “check the power of the Federal government”? Marlarkey and pure wishful revisionism. those who state it is, are smokin’ something and it ain’t tobacco. And if they aren’t smoking anything and still hold that belief? Serious mental issues concerning mental stability.

    here’s a thought which will give insight as to what it would be like to have a State Confederation…something to think about.

    Let’s race from Disneyland to Disneyworld. I’ll take the federal roads…you take the state roads.

    • George E


      I enjoyed your post right up to the point where you accuse people you disagree with of having “mental stability” issues. Aside from that, this country has serious financial problems and probably can’t survive if something doesn’t change, and soon. What’s your solution to this serious problem since you don’t like the one proposed by the author?

      • Flashy

        George…to do this, i have to give my perspective on the future. As i see it…unless we get rid of the internet and all it offers, be it 50 years, 100 years, 200 years …it is an inescapable conclusion the world will coalesce into the next phase of societal organization and inter-relationship.

        Man has gone from tribal wanderer, to walled city, to religious empire (the head honcho was the god), to city state, to empire, to nationalism, and the next step is a one mankind identity and structure. Either that or when this system breaks apart, we’re blowing ourselves up and starting back at the tribal wanderer stage.

        So, in essence, the goal is to keep our values and society at the forefront so as the world draws together, it is our values and code it adopts, and not that of another culture.

        that means, keeping the economic empire humming and taking out all comers. I don’t see China as a threat after 2015-2018. They’ve shot the bolt and even now if you listen you can hear the creaking as the Chinese house of cards begins to give way. India is the one we should be watching with care. I see India as giving us one heckuva run for the money. They have it all. labor, educated workforce, natural resources, modernization well underway, and wise enough to begin switching over to non-oil energy reliance. And a centralized form of government.

        So…we need to look ahead and realize the new world of the 21st century will have wars fought by computer, tech. and modernized industry. Economic warfare. For that we need to stock our arsenal. infrastructure, education, social welfare, retraining, more focused on emerging industry and leaving the old to fend for themselves.

        So i advocate first of all, balancing the budget. The economy can’t take a huge hit so we’ll have to have a period of transition. Thus, increase revenues slowly, and decrease the rate of spending slowly until they merge and balance.

        The reality is, investment capital in the future won’t go where taxes are low. fact of the matter is…countries with low taxation aren’t conducive for industry. Lack of resources, political instability, labor isues with education or numbers. In the balance sheet review…industry will gather where the elements of a strong base will be available.

        Taxing the wealthy and Big Corporations won’t effect much by way of investment. Investment will always be. no one will want their money sitting on the sidelines so they will invest. What makes an attractive investment? Educated and trained workforce, modern infrastructure, targeted tax incentives for R&D and new emerging industries, a level laying field where the small guys can compete with the big guys, a social structure conducive to keeping the masses rested and not in civil chaos.

        IF we do that, our culture and society will remain at the top and leading, our economic empire will remain at the peak of the mountain, and we will lead the world into the next era for mankind. If we don’t? we’ll have to learn a new language to deal with the Power that does.

        • George E


          I can agree with much you have said. The one thing that jumps out at me that I have a little trouble with, however, is your statement that “Taxing the wealthy and big corporations won’t effect much by way of investment.” I believe that may be more wishful thinking than reality, but I can’t say that I’ve actually ever seen any data that I agree with, other than the “Laffer Curve,” that shows a relation between taxation and tax revenue. Art’s theory is that lower tax rates stimulate higher economic growth which generates higher tax revenue, so I would assume the reverse is also true. That is, higher tax rates slow down economic growth. While none of these theories can be proven to be absolutely correct under all conditions, this one does meet with my sense of reality. Increasing taxes on anyone simply means there’s that much less money to spend on other things. If the government spent the money more efficiently (getting more value than the citizen that was taxed) than citizens, then I might change my mind, but I just don’t see any evidence of that. The one thing the government can do is take a little money from a lot of people and focus a good part of it on a few expensive projects to get things done that might be tough for private citizens or companies to do. At times that sort of thing might be something we feel we have to do (space program, for example), but even then the government rarely gets the same amount of value per dollar spent as the private sector could/would do. So, my predisposition is to keep taxes as low for everyone as possible so the maximum amount of money is spent by the private sector getting the most value for our economy.

          As you say, there are many factors involved in making investment decisions. You’ve cited many of them. However, I believe taxes and regulations sometimes play a major role in this decision and can increase or decrease investments. Obviously, political stability, property rights, infrastructure, due process, and educated workforce are major factors as well. Without these in place, any amount of taxation won’t matter.

      • Flashy

        when i wrote “leaving the old to fend for themselves. ” i referred to outmoded industry and tech…not people.

        • George E


          That’s fine. I understand. But back to my question. What’s your solution to the country’s financial problem?

      • Flashy

        Increase in revenues by getting the freeloaders on the top income scale and the Big corporations to pay their fair share..and a slow decreae in spending so as not to disrupt the economy as well as funding/tax credits in specific targeting of industrial, social and R&D sectors to have a favorable financial climate to experiment in.

        I think it would take about 20 years to reverse the damages done by Bush/Cheney/GOP

        • George E


          Thanks. What do you define as “fair share?” What if we don’t have 20 years to balance the budget? Do you really think our financial problems started and ended with the Bush/Cheney administration?

      • Vicki

        Let’s skip the fair share nonsense since flashy doesn’t really believe in it anyway. Since the top earners already pay the great majority of the revenue, lets just cut to the chase and take it all.

        Here is how well that will work.
        Now what to do for 2012. Any ideas there flashy?

        • George E


          I just want to know if Flashy can express his understanding of what “fair share” is. If not, he’s just repeating Obama administration talking points. End of discussion. If he can explain what “fair share” means, then we have something to discuss and possibly debate.

      • Flashy

        by ‘fair share”, i mean just that. the wealthy (not Big Corporate) receive a huge amount of benefit living in our society as compared with other societies. Outside of other countries, ever look at what decent houses on up are surrounded by ? Walls topped with broken shards of glass.

        Ever walk into a public place which services the upper incomes in another country? Stay around and you’ll see soldiers armed to the teeth meandering around. Know what the highest cost vehicles are sold in another country? Armored and bulletproof. Security guards are the norm, not the rarity when dealing with the upper incomes overseas.

        How about good roads which are used to transport goods and services…not just for work. Education facitlities. and on and on. For the most part, when you talk about the benefits received by the wealthy for living in this society we have…they are fortunate to live here…just as we are. To maintain it…is it asking too much to peg their tax rates a little higher since they receive a large portion of the safety and luxury this society offers them?

        Compare that to the lower income brackets. They pay taxes, indirectly. And thoe are a far larger portion of thier income than a welathy person. take the bus to work and commute. Is that fare a tax to commute? I would argue it is. License fees, sales tax, and on and on. Add it up. Income used for necessary purposes in existing in this society take up a far higher percentage than the wealthy. Do the math.

        $48,000 a year income. $4,000 a month. Say 35% in state and fed taxes withheld. You’re down to about 2,500. Housing..say $1200 a month for rent or mortgage? 1300/month. Insurance for car. let’s make it easy…$100/month. 1200 left. Food? 100/week. 900 left. Clothes…say 50/week 850 left. oops…foprgot homeowners insurance…200/month 650 left. got kids? there’s an easy 100 /week …200 left. Out of $4,000. Do away with the car insurance becaus you’re using a bus. $2.00 for a trip…or $80/week, and don’t forget phone, elec, cable and gas, health insurance etc….

        So..disposable income for someone earning $4,000 a month ain’t that great. At the end of the month, there is barely enough for a pitcher of beer and a night bowling.

        now…do the math for someone making 250,000 a year…or $20,000/month. There’s a helluva lot more disposable income remaining at the end of the month. So your argument is the guy earning 250K a year can’t afford a small tax hike? Seriously?

        now..cut gov’t programs. Which ones would you cut? The GOP is talking those programs which…direct or indirectly…affect the guy making 48K a year. if those are suddenly cut…you really will have social unrest flaming up. if social programs are scaled needs to be down slowly, wisely and not haphazardly. Let people adjust…and if adjustment is not possible, they pace is slow enough to counter- balance out the injustices.

        On the othr hand, scaling back programs subsidizing the wealthy won’t hurt them. As a small tax increae won’t hurt them.

        that’s what i mean by fair share. We need to raise revenues and cut back on spending increases until it balances out. right now, the little guy has been smacked around for 30 years. And the bill is coming due. Time for the wealthy to step to the plate for the wealth and provision of benefits we’ve transferred to them those 30 years.

        • George E


          I do appreciate the time and effort you took trying to explain what you think “fair share” means. I agree with you that most folks on the upper end of the economic scale probably do cope with living expenses better than most people at the lower end of the economic scale. I believe that’s pretty much a fact of life. Likewise, folks on the upper end of the economic scale should be able to cope with a higher tax bill than people on the lower end of the economic scale. Having said that, when we say things like “they should be able to pay a little more” we’re not being very precise, and it reminds me of some past business negotiations where I agree to such things as “a little more” only to find out that eventually this became “a lot more” because it’s a relative term, and sometimes has a creeping effect over time. Also, I’m reminded that even if we took all of the income from the wealthiest folks in this country in taxes, it wouldn’t close the deficit gap, so we’d still be facing the same problem, although maybe not as great (for a while). Finally, since the wealthiest people are also the ones that own and invest in our businesses and hire the rest of us to work, they wouldn’t have the money that we took from them in taxes to build those businesses and buy the capital goods they need to expand. Some might even close their doors and lay-off their workers if we took all of their income. So, what’s the magic level of taxation we can take from these folks and not constrain the economy so the rest of us really don’t get hurt by increasing their taxes? I don’t know the number, but it’s probably irresponsible and naive, I think, to say any additional amount taken wouldn’t have some level of negative impact on the economy. So then, is imposing an additional tax on the wealthy a good idea, especially now that the economy is struggling? I don’t think it is. There must be better ways of fixing our financial situation. Also, since “fair” is a relative term, and has a different meaning to each of us, we can argue for ever over what is fair and what is not, and degree of fairness. Is this a good use of our time as we try to fix our financial problem? I’m not persuaded that it is.

          You asked me what I would do. The first thing I would recommend is for the government to create a plan which would take us to a balanced budget within the next 5 years, and then one that would actually start paying down the national debt after that. Since politicians aren’t very good about following through on “promises” , I believe we must pass into law a requirement that this be done regardless which Congress and President is in power at the time. Then we should close down and significantly scale back several federal departments. We could save about $1T/year and reduce a bunch of regulation enforcement at the same time. This would almost close the current deficit gap and free up the economic system to grow again. Then I would open federal lands to drilling and exploration, on-shore and off-shore, and share the royalties with the American people either in the form of direct payments (checks or credits) and/or funding of entitlement programs. I would encourage development of natural gas fueled vehicles by giving tax credits for a 10 year period to companies investing in the development and commercialization of this technology. (About 50% of our trade deficit is driven by importation of crude oil, of which about half of that is used to make fuels for motor vehicles which can be fueled by natural gas cheaply if the infrastructure was in place to support this business. By reducing the trade deficit, the value of the USD would strengthen and reduce the impact of inflation.) Finally, I would simplify the tax code by removing many/most taxable deductions and lowering rates, but requiring everyone to pay something as their responsibility as a citizen of this country. Doing these things should get the economy growing again, and this should generate much more tax revenue. Then I would recommend restructuring Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security so that we can limit our future liabilities. We also need to clean up the waste, fraud, and abuse that infects all of these programs RIGHT NOW. Everyone knows this is going on, but no one has been willing to dive into the quagmire and do the heavy lifting to clean it up.

          I can go on, but these are the major actions I think we ought to take to get our financial house in order. Does any of this make sense to you?

    • DaveH

      Right, We should take our Historical Facts from Flashman, a well-known fact-fabricator.
      For those who want to know what really transpired at the Constitutional Convention and after, read James Madison’s notes from the Convention:

      • DaveH

        And the Federalist Papers which were written to persuade New Yorkers to ratify the Constitution:

      • Flashy

        So dave…you are saying it was all kumbuyya gathering eh? no big State Small State friction, no threats to pull out over slavery, trade, defense, federalism, etc? you’re staying the walkout just a month or so before the signing was all a staged event for the cameras?


      • DaveH

        As usual a Progressive, lacking for a factual comment, is trying to put words in my mouth.
        No, Flashman, I’m trying to say that people should get their information from the source, not from dishonest people like yourself.

  • bigjeff1

    What a great idea! Let’s move toward 50 independent states or maybe even add 10 independent major cities. Or city-states! And we could have emperors!

    • George E


      If you don’t like this proprosal, what’s your solution to avoiding financial collapse? I may not like the idea of decoupling state finances from federal finances, but I can understand why some states might be tempted to do this in a country where there are so many states and a federal government that are managing their finances so irresponsibly, dragging everyone under.

      • Eric Bischoff (@ericbischoff)

        Here are some alternatives for those of you who maybe are starting to feel the repetitiveness, limited and sometimes flawed thinking of mises from you know who.

        DVD – Capitalism Hits the Fan by Richard Wolff

        Book – Free Lunch: How the Wealthiest Americans Enrich Themselves at Government Expense (and Stick You with the Bill) by David Cay Jonston

        Book – Freefall by Joseph Stiglitz Winner of the Nobel Prize in Economics

        Book & Website – Greedy Bastards by Dylan Ratigan

        Book – Living in the End Times by Slavoj Zizek

        Book – Pitty the Billionaire by Thomas Frank for those who want to take this country back, so that you know what you are up against.

        Book – Agenda for a New Economy by David C. Korten who also publishes the excellent and uplifting magazine “Yes”

        • George E


          Please summarize your position for me. I’m getting the impression that you think we ought to make the wealthy pay for the public debt, including our entitlements. Is that your position?


      • DaveH

        They should read the books from Mises and then read the books that you recommend, Eric, so they can see the difference between reality and Propaganda promoted by those in Leadership positions who want to Power and Wealth at the rest of our expense.
        The Green-Eyed monster is only good at tearing things down. Mises promotes a better way — Voluntary transactions, Free from Government meddling (usually to aid their Crony Capitalists), which result in positive economic Growth and Prosperity.

      • Eric Bischoff (@ericbischoff)

        DaveH as usual you are assuming I don’t like mises because you just full of hatred for any one who thinks different than you. I happen to like the Austrian economists. I’ll take them over the Chicago boys any day. I am just not only drinking that Koolaid.

      • DaveH

        When Progressives talk about Greed, you can be sure they are really Greedy for other peoples’ money. No doubt there are Crony Capitalists aided by Government thus having an unfair advantage over other companies and their consumers. But lumping all Rich people and all companies together under the same banner is just plain ignorant. What we need to do is get Government out of our Marketplaces, so they can’t aid their favorite Political Businessmen with their assumed Force, and get the US back to relatively Free Markets where Government’s only involvement is to enforce against Fraud and Force by others. People would make their own voluntary choices about how much risk to assume when they buy their products. Of course, in this information age, there is absolutely no excuse for people to not do their own research before they buy products from or contract with others.
        The reality of Progressivism is that they want to Force you to pay for a middle-man (Government) to make your choices for you. Some people, for sure, would like to delegate their choices to others, but those people should certainly be Free to do that if they’d like. What they shouldn’t be Free to do is Force their choices on the rest of us, like Eric’s people want to do.
        Government now spends over 40% of our Gross Domestic Product to “protect” us. It would be much cheaper for the risk-averse to just buy private insurance in Free Markets from people who have to please you or lose your business — Unlike Government people.

      • DaveH

        Eric says — “you are assuming I don’t like mises because you just full of hatred”.
        As usual, Eric must resort to manipulative tactics in lieu of an honest debate.
        Such a child.

      • Eric Bischoff (@ericbischoff)

        It’s hard to remain civil Dave when all you do is put words in ones mouth and pretend to understand and translate for others what I put forth when you really don’t have a clue. But I’ll try again today!

        Maybe you should take your own advice and go read all of your stuff and mine again hopefully with an open mind this time.

        Dismantling the government and letting the robber barons have their way with everything is not what the founding fathers had in mind.

        Getting rid of the greed, the crooks and the corruption on the other hand, I believe is something most Americans would rally around.

        Sharing and cooperation is what we should all be striving for.

      • DaveH

        What words did I put in your mouth, Eric? Be specific, please.
        As far as the trite phrase “Robber Barons”, anybody who wants to know the truth can read this book:
        As is usually the case, the “Robber Barons” were simply out-competing and out-producing their rivals, the result being cheaper goods and services for the consumers, and the Government came marching in to save their favorite Crony Capitalists by hobbling their superior competitors.
        The question is — Is Eric aware of this reality and just Propagandizing the ignorant, or is he just innocently ignorant himself? I suspect the former. Why else would he fight so hard to keep people from learning the truth?

      • DaveH

        After I chide him for his manipulative efforts, Eric says this — “you really don’t have a clue”.
        If it wasn’t so pathetic, it would be funny.

      • Eric Bischoff (@ericbischoff)

        Dave says “When Progressives talk about Greed, you can be sure they are really Greedy for other peoples’ money’

        No Dave when progressives talk about greed they are merely talking about greed as in intense and SELFISH desires. That’s it! nothing more nothing less. The love of money and nothing but more money.

        The empire is crumbling because of greed. And it will not be go out with a bang, it will merely whimper out and that’s fine and none too soon.

        PROGRESSives merely like to learn from experience and try and do it better the next time around. Why go back? And go back to what? I can’t remember a perfect time worth going back to!

      • Eric Bischoff (@ericbischoff)

        You’re right Dave. You win, I am ignorant. I am sure there is nothing to learn from me or anyone else. Only you ole mises guru meister can teach us anything. Please save us Dave!

      • Eric Bischoff (@ericbischoff)

        ONe final thought for today and then you can own the place Dave as you usually think you do.

        If it wasn’t for government meddling in the marketplace, you wouldn’t have Google because the free market would have never built the Internet. You wouldn’t have the airlines or Fedex because the free market would not have built the FAA and airports.

        There’s nothing free about the free market. It’s an illusion. The market place has made all of it’s gains and progress by riding on the back of government produced services, like the courts and an infrastructure like ports, highways, airports that have allowed them to massively prosper and grow. Your arguments are about as intelligent as killing the golden goose.

      • DaveH

        Eric says — “If it wasn’t for government meddling in the marketplace, you wouldn’t have Google because the free market would have never built the Internet”.
        Typical Progressive conjecture.
        The personal computer industry thrived precisely because it flew under the radar of Government intervention. It’s ironic that Eric would think anything could not have existed without the Government, considering the fact that Government did its best to hobble Microsoft, one of the key innovators in the Personal Computer industry.
        We all know the great successes of the Government — the Post Office (well, no) — Amtrak (well, no) — Medicare (well, no) — Fannie and Freddie’s oversight of the mortgage market (well, no) — ….. I guess somebody’s going to have to help me out here. Eric must be right that I haven’t a clue, because I can’t think of anything the Government does well (besides destroying wealth that is).

      • DaveH

        One final thought before I give up bashing such an easy target.
        Who is Richard Wolff? A Marxist of course:

        What else can we expect from Eric the Red?
        I love how Progressives pervert a system, in this case Capitalism, and after their new system (which they dishonestly name Capitalism) fails, they blame it on “Capitalism”.

      • DaveH

        I will repeat this link from an earlier comment, for those who would like to know what Real Capitalism is, not what Eric and his Progressive misinformants have labeled as “Capitalism”:

      • DaveH

        Here is a sampling of Eric’s manipulative phrases just from this thread –
        “you just full of hatred”
        “robber barons”
        “you really don’t have a clue”
        “Your arguments are about as intelligent as killing the golden goose”.
        It seems that Eric doesn’t really have much to say unless he’s trying to Mentally Bully you.

        And this one is classic:
        “PROGRESSives merely like to learn from experience and try and do it better the next time around”.
        He capitalizes the PROGRESS in Progressive as if to subliminally convince you that Progressives are about Progress. What Progressives are about is Force and Big Government. Because most people won’t voluntarily accept the Progressive agenda, they must Force it on you, and the only accepted agency of Force in this country is Government.
        And here is experience (Economies grow inversely to the size of Government):

        Eric and his crowd love to insinuate that harkening back to Freedom is a Primitive Pursuit, but what was and always has been the most common form of Government in the World? –Big Governments trampling Freedom. The real Primitive Pursuit is Progressivism.
        But the Leaders love it when people like Eric can convince you otherwise.

      • Jay

        The Russians and American Progressives: Together Again

        The Russia Today (RT) Moscow-funded propaganda channel, which is backing the murderous regime of Syrian President Bashar al-Assad, aired a special program on Tuesday night on how progressives in the U.S. can “Take Back the American Dream” by defeating Republicans. The propaganda effort was broadcast throughout the United States and produced in collaboration with major liberal groups such as the Campaign for America’s Future, and Demos, all of them Soros-funded.

        The host was Thom Hartmann, who regards himself as the nation’s number one progressive radio talk-show host.

        The “National Teach-In to Take Back the American Dream” featured Robert Reich, former U.S. Secretary of Labor; Heather McGhee of Demos; Leo Hindrey, a businessman and self-styled “Patriotic Millionaire;” Natalie Foster, the co-founder of Rebuild the Dream; and Robert Borosage of the Campaign for America’s Future.

        Nobody on the program, which also aired on DISH Network, DirectTV and the Free Speech TV Network, demonstrated any concern about appearing on a Moscow-funded channel to promote the “American dream.”

        The Russian regime, which has a habit of murdering journalists and political opponents, has a covert and overt program of manipulation of the Western media, similar to what the old Soviet KGB used to specialize in. Interestingly, Russian Prime Minister Vladimir Putin has just posted a blog on The Huffington Post, one of RT’s official “partners” in the media business.

        However, demonstrating sensitivity to the charge that he is a paid Russian agent working in the progressive movement, Thom Hartmann has refused to discuss how much the Russians pay him to air his program “The Big Picture” on RT. When I questioned him about this, he actually grabbed my camera recording his response in order to avoid being seen stonewalling.

        RT is the same channel that recently announced it was going to host a show with WikiLeaks founder Julian Assange, now under investigation for espionage against the U.S. The alleged WikiLeaks source for the largest theft of classified documents in U.S. history, Pfc. Bradley Manning, is being formally arraigned on February 23 on charges that include aiding the enemy.

        In this video, produced by Accuracy in Media, several Soviet-like broadcasts are shown on RT featuring denunciations of the U.S. This is fairly typical of the fare offered by RT.

  • Dick

    I suggest adding a point 7. Understand the “Income Tax.” IF, as this and many authors suggest, the 16th amendment authorized some new and different tax on ordinary citizens, WHY, as late as WWII, did less than 4% of Americans pay any “income” tax?

    Two recent and excellent books, worth the read, at least, are “Income Tax: Shattering the Myths,” by Dave Champion; and “Cracking the Code: The Fascinating Truth About Taxation In America,” by Peter Hendrickson.

    If you think this is referring to another tax scam, it is not, but Hitler was very successful because he understood what he said publicly, early in his political career: “People will believe a lie, and the bigger the lie, the more likely they will believe it.” (Paraphrased).

  • KG

    The Great State of Texas – A bastion of true Americans and Patriots. NOT!
    Texas would go bankrupt if it weren’t for the federal dollars it receives. And on top of that, Texas gets most of it’s income from a very regressive sales tax that disproportionally hurts the poor by forcing them to pay a larger percentage of their income in taxes compared to the wealthy. And let’s not forget all of those retires who get a government check. Would they be cut off in this scheme? We are the UNITED states. And whose fault is it for the woes we have? Grow a pair and take the blame – WE ARE! We, as citizens have abdicated our duty to be informed and VOTE. Believe me, if everyone who could vote did vote we would have a different country. States rights were done at Appomattox court house. Get over it. It is individual rights – the social contract we have as citizens that makes our government work. And it’s only with a strong central government that we as individuals can enjoy the freedom we have.
    “Man is born free, yet everywhere he is in chains.” J.J. Rousseau

    • noel

      OK KG, How about the GREAT and former REPUBLIC known as Texas stop supplying the US w/ oil/gas and only refine for itself and other sovereign countries? Would that make you feel all warm and fuzzy @ $1o a gallon gasoline? We refine about 85% of the fuel for the US, so go take your simple minded notion that somehow WE are reliant on DC for anything, and stick it up your rather substantial arse!!! Perhaps Texas should return to the days of The REPUBLIC of TEXAS!!! I’m ALL in for that. The US does nothing more than hold US back from reaching our true potential!!!
      “Techsas can do w/out the US, but the US cannot do w/out Techsas.”
      Thomas Jefferson

      • Flashy

        Tell you what…you give us those refineries we, as part of the federal government, helped pay for..and you keep those that the state hlped pay for.

      • Windrinker

        noel, Texas should be the first to declare its independance!

        And to flashy, anything the Feds can do…Texas can do BETTER!

    • Windrinker

      It is very tiresome when progressives keep trying to take credit for America being the greatest country the world has seen!

      Progressives have been nothing but a hindrance to this country, and we have succeeded IN SPITE of progressives! So, don’t keep trying to tell the real Americans who made America great. This country isn’t
      about your communism. Name me a communist country that is “free and prosperous.” You can’t. Your ways don’t work and they never have, it is an old, backward, unsuccessful way of trying to rule the lives of people. It has been tried over and over, so just, “give up!” Our forefathers escaped from people like you because no one wanted what you offer! And your agenda is about as “progressive” as obamacare is the “affordable healthcare act.”

      Government, once departed from the Constitution, has NOT been responsible for the greatness of America and neither is your forever failed agenda! Roads would have been built without the Feds, free trade would have emerged without the Feds, and America would have been greater without interference from an over zealous group of politicians intent on gaining money and power. Once government was taken out of the hands of true representatives of the people and replaced with professional politicians, it became at odds with the “Will” of the people.

      When given freedom the first Americans became the innovators, the thinkers, the entrepreneurs, the brave of heart, the liberators, the stubborn individuals that made this country what it has been. The first Americans were the troublemakers, the political priisoners, the ones that refused to “be subjects of tyranny.” So, don’t think for one minute that just because we have tolerated your insane ideas and your gibberish about socialism, and bought into that PC nonsense, that we will sit by and let you have your way, so easily.

      You can infiltrate our government with your lackeys, you can seat your judges in our courts, you can even put a fraudulent, illegal president in our White House, but you won’t win… In the end, it will be the “true American people” that are the last ones standing! You know why….because we love what we fight for and we know we are right. And not to forget that we have GOD on OUR side.

  • Henry Ledbetter

    THANKS FOR A very good and thought provoeing article. I wish I could see a way to clean up and transform the FED but in my opinion it is to corrupted to be saved. It is almost to the point, if not already, more tares than there is wheat and “a little leaven leavens ( or corrupts) the whole lump.” Let the tares die of their own accord.

  • Deerinwater

    Hmm? Considering that you would have to put a gun to the “states” head to stop them for accepting any kind of money, what is plan “B”?

    Oh,I know that some Governor’s stated that they would not accept stimulus money but at the end of the day, correct me if I’m wrong but everyone of them that needed it did take it. Some begrudgingly, some cheerfully , some graciously and some on the sneak.

    Some states put it to good use, some tried to lock it away and hide any positive affect it might create. In the run up to the 2008 general election. “O” stated Wall Street got their Bail Out, it was time Main Street got theirs. This was only a rhetorical stumping statement intended to stir the crowd, tell people that he understood the average American’s struggle and the disparities that have been created and witnessed over the last 8 years.

    We see that the “main street” stimulus was largely directed to the “states”, is was intended to serve as a Main Street “Bail Out” . That perhaps you nor I didn’t receive any of it, that your neighbor didn’t lose his job is to be found as Main Streets “reward”. ~ Indirectly the American Joe, got it’s bail out by propping up the states. ~ It only bought them time, time to get their house in order and come up with solutions for budget shortfall.

    By no means all,~ but most states are little better then the Fed when it comes to money and the spending of money. Governor Walker of Wisconsin while facing budget short falls, made the decision on his own to give money away to select large concerns, without so much as a single written assurances of any future returns to the people of his states. Speaking only in “generalities” while what he asked for in concessions to the people very specific, $40,000.00 a years employees was to do with 8 to 12 thousand dollars less per year to pay for his plan that he didn’t even bother to try to sell. There is little wonder that he is up for a recall and has a revolt on his hands.

    I hate to hear, that his recall is still in contention. Walker needs to be tared and feathered and ran out of town. A little salesmanship could have avoid all of this recall business, but Walker is working “On the Sneak” much like D1ck the snake Chaney and the contemptible attitude he has shown us for the average American. Like a 14 years old child, they seem to think that they are somehow “invisible” and we can’t see them. They are going to do what they want to do and avoid the voters wishes.

    Nice write up Brandon Smith, I hope to read more of your work.

    • George E


      Thank you for injecting partisan politics into an otherwise intellectual discussion of a truly serious subject. Your comments will probably stir the “hornet’s nest” and invite counter incendiary comments from those who disagree with you. If your objective is to turn this discussion into a childish “mud-slinging” contest, you’ve probably achieved your goal. THANKS.

      • George E

        Sorry “Flashy.” I guess my response was to “Deer.”

    • Ted Crawford

      ” All Government employees should realize that the process of collective bargaining, as usually understood cannot be transplanted into the Public Service. It has it’s distinct and insurmountable limitations when applied to Public Personnel Management ” FDR

  • EndTheIllusion

    Alternative currencies are legal, have been used in the past, and are even being used now. In upper state NY they are using one called Ithaca Hours.

    Alternative currencies can be used to jump start a slow economy. Think of this: if you have people who want to work as well as local resources, the only thing holding back progress is the lack of money. An analogy could be if an airline had airplanes ready to fly, passengers who wanted to fly, but there were no tickets and so nothing happens. In the previous case, money took the place of the tickets.

    Regarding public banking, it is NOT socialism. What we have right now with all of the bailouts is corporate crony socialism. The founding fathers explicitly said that only congress shall have the right to coin money. Why have we given this right away to a private cartel of bankers (the Fed)?

    • Windrinker

      EndTheillusion,….”Why have we given this right away to a private cartel of bankers?..”

      Great question!

      And, this “cartel” is made of the global elitist, all private citizens of foreign countries and the U.S., like George Soros and his Bilderbergers. Why were our enemies, NWO advocates, given control over this country…ever.

      More than likely, all our problems, the coming disaster in this country, has been the fault of those in control of the FEDERAL RESERVE BANKS. The first thing this country needs to do, as a country, or as individual States, is to ABOLISH the FRB! These elitists are our worst enemies…..and our devaluing our dollar at lightening speed. They are stealing the wealth out of this country by the use of increasing inflation.

  • Steve E

    I believe that when the dollar does collapse. Gold and silver will be used by default. It will be one of the few things people will use to trade. They won’t use the dollar because it has collapsed. There are people that now have gold and silver, so they will be the new rich people. The millionaire with dollars and no precious metals will at least have a good supply of toilet paper.

    • noel

      Yep, guns, ammo, silver, gold, platinum, copper, palladium, iron, alcohol, and aluminum will be the things folks will barter. Ask folks who lived through the great depression in the rural areas. Eggs, wheat, beans, corn tambien. Lots of lower denomination silver coins would also be a good idea. Better have a good supply of most of these.

    • Windrinker

      Steve, before the dollar collapses, there will be an attempt to confiscate gold owned by private citizens. Obamacare has within its many pages, the power to do this, without any further mandate… The government will say that this is a “last ditch effort” to save the economy before it collapses. And, all good citizens will have to give up their gold to save the country…

      The progressives realize that “gold will be king” and they will not leave it in the hands of individuals. Just my opinion.

      • Steve E

        Good theory. That’s why you have to hide your your gold and silver. And your guns and ammo too.

      • Windrinker

        Steve, you are right about that. Anything you want to keep will have to be well-hidden.
        Just hope the Gestapo will be nice when they come looking.

  • noel

    This is exactly what Lincoln’s tax war was about. Allowing the federal gov’t to extort the states. Especially those in the south. When Texas changed its drinking age to 21, it did so under the threat of the feds to w/hold several hundred million in highway funds. That IS what the war was really about. Lincoln’s vision of a super powerful, centralized gov’t in DC. Read about the Morrill Tariffs and understand the slavery issue was nothing more than an afterthought for Lincoln. He was repulsed by blacks, and only engaged slavery to have the opportunity to hold the moral highground, NOTHING more.

  • Jonathon Galt

    Repeal of the 16th and 17th amendments would go a long way towards restoring government to what it should be.

  • noel

    Q: Doesn’t the Texas Constitution reserve the right of Texas to secede? [BACK TO TOP]
    A: This heavily popularized bit of Texas folklore finds no corroboration where it counts: No such provision is found in the current Texas Constitution[1] (adopted in 1876) or the terms of annexation.[2] However, it does state (in Article 1, Section 1) that “Texas is a free and independent State, subject only to the Constitution of the United States…” (note that it does not state “…subject to the President of the United States…” or “…subject to the Congress of the United States…” or “…subject to the collective will of one or more of the other States…”)

    Neither the Texas Constitution, nor the Constitution of the united States, explicitly or implicitly disallows the secession of Texas (or any other “free and independent State”) from the United States. Joining the “Union” was ever and always voluntary, rendering voluntary withdrawal an equally lawful and viable option (regardless of what any self-appointed academic, media, or government “experts”—including Abraham Lincoln himself—may have ever said).

    Both the original (1836) and the current (1876) Texas Constitutions also state that “All political power is inherent in the people … they have at all times the inalienable right to alter their government in such manner as they might think proper.”

    Likewise, each of the united States is “united” with the others explicitly on the principle that “governments derive their just powers from the consent of the governed” and “whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends [i.e., protecting life, liberty, and property], it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government” and “when a long train of abuses and usurpations…evinces a design to reduce them under absolute despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government, and to provide new guards for their future security.” [3]

    • George E


      Thank you for your logical argument. I agree that common sense says if states can join the USA voluntarily, then they ought to be able to secede voluntarily as well. Likewise, the USA should be able to de-annex certain states from the union if those states chose to not follow the laws of the USA and/or manage their finances irresponsibly. But, regarding secession, didn’t the Civil War settle that issue?

    • Windrinker

      Texas had considered or there has been some discussion of secession, in the past.
      Your info makes perfect “common sense.” When any “Union” becomes a threat to individual entities, it should be dissolved….

  • DaveH

    Why even create the potential of just another Central Bank (Centrally in a State)?
    The Government needs to be kept out of Banking at any level.
    Please read this and learn about money from one of the foremost economic thinkers of our time:

  • FreedomFighter

    I would like to add to How States Can Protect Themselves:

    Vote out all the progressive liberal socialist communist POS’s in office — stomp out Agenda 21, that steals tax payer dollars and vote in conservative or libratarian statesmen that look out for the people.

    Laus Deo
    Semper Fi

    • mark

      Agenda 21 is a complete joke that was never enacted by the U.S. Congress and has no power anywhere in the world except in the pipe dreams of a few UN officials. But it is an excellent device for right-wingers to stir up their cuckoo base – along with the non-existent NAFTA highway, Amero coin, and FEMA death camps, and ObamaCare death panels. The UN also voted for the Israelis to withdraw from the West Bank. Israel has laughed at them for 45 years on that one! The UN is a complete joke ridiculed all over the world – except by nutso U.S. survivalists and libertarians who are actually loony enough to take the UN seriously.

      • FreedomFighter

        Agenda 21 For Dummies

        It is being implemented non-the-less Mark, proof is more than obvious in both local, state, federal law and regulation

        Laus Deo
        Semper Fi

      • Windrinker

        FF, you bet Agenda 21 is being implemented! In the largest city close to me, there are City Council Meetings to discuss how to implement Agenda 21! The local radio show host was imploring citizens to attend and resist any parts of Agenda 21 being incorporated into their city!

        Very stupid people are taking Agenda 21 seriously, as if it were legitimate Law! Why would any one do what these criminals and human rights abusers tell them to do… United Nations has nothing to do with the Sovereignty of the United States and has no part in our government or authority to make Law or Mandates for Americans!
        But then, why does anyone pay attention to what an illegal foreigner tells the country to do!!

        We need to kick these bas-turds out of our country, put them on a bus, with only the clothes on their backs and send them back to their third-world countries, some of which we never hear about. Confiscate their bank accounts, their expensive cars, their holdings, and property… We need to take back at least some of the money we have wasted on their projects and supporting them in the manner to which they have become accustomed to living, “on our dime.”

      • Sirian

        Both FF and Windrinker are correct, you are misinformed or simply don’t care. There are substantial sources to explain Agenda 21 and it’s side actions (ICLEI) that have been in place and action since 1992. Recently, EO #13575, “White House Rural Council” is prescribed by Agenda 21! For a simple read, go here:

      • Jay

        Attention Comrades…U.N. AGENDA 21

        WARNING: Any comrade referring to Agenda 21 as Agenda 21 will be severely disciplined. It is henceforth to be called ‘Smart Growth- Sustainable Development’

        The United Nations Millennium Papers (page 5) says of Agenda 21 and smart growth:

        “Participating in an UN-advocated planning process would very likely bring out many of the conspiracy-fixated groups and individuals in our society such as the National Rifle Association, citizen militias and some members of Congress. This segment of our society who fear ‘one-world government’ and a UN invasion of the United States through which our individual freedom would be stripped away would actively work to defeat any elected official who joined ‘the conspiracy’ by undertaking LA21. So, we call our process something else, such as comprehensive planning, growth management, or smart growth [emphasis added].”

        UN Agenda 21 – Coming to a Neighborhood near You, Scott Strzelczyk and Richard Rothschild, American Thinker, October 28, 2009 provides an explosive report and analysis. As of today, almost 600 local governments in the US have signed onto this Trojan Horse, United Nations International Panel on Climate change assault. Do you live in one of them?

        Briefly, ‘21’ is the internationalist one world plan to quietly extinguish your property rights and force you to live in concentrated planned communities. Dose this ring a bell? Didn’t the Russian and other communist regimes concoct and die by ‘central planning’?

        Obviously, the socialist intelligentsia of the world with your billions of dollars pumped into the UN, and fellow travelers ranging from the visible Hillary Clinton, Al Gore, king O, and there invisible minions, embedded in every level of American society and governments, believe collectivization and domination will lead all you unfortunate brain dead folks into the final one world solution.

        Remember what Saul Alinsky said, “The organizer’s first job is to create the issues or problems,’ and ‘organizations must be based on many issues”, …the greater the number of issues, the greater the confusion, thus allowing the opportunity to slip their intellectually superior plans past the dummies. Mass attack is effective, so much so, that most of our representatives know little or nothing of the individual components of the attack, in this instance, year after year, our congress appropriates obscene amounts of your tax dollars to the United Nations.

      • DaveH

        Mark says — “Agenda 21 is a complete joke that was never enacted by the U.S. Congress and has no power anywhere in the world except in the pipe dreams of a few UN officials”.
        Yes, and Alexander Hamilton argued that the Bill of Rights didn’t need to be included in the Constitution because they are inherent God-given rights that Government could never encroach on. We all know how that went.
        Liberals like Mark are either terribly naive (thinking that Leaders aren’t always thriving for more Power) or they are assuming the rest of us are just too ignorant to question their Propaganda.

      • Jay

        While liberal journalists continue to claim that Agenda 21 is just a “conspiracy theory” being advanced by right-wing crackpots, the International Union for the Conservation of Nature (IUCN) and the International Council for Environmental Law (ICEL) have released their fourth Draft of the International Covenant on Environment and Development.

        This document was designed from the beginning to convert the “soft-law” non-binding Agenda 21 into firmly binding global law – enforceable through the International Criminal Court and/or the dispute resolution features of the Convention on the Law of the Sea.

        Read the entire 242-page document here.

        Few people understand that it is standard operating procedure for the U.N. to issue a massive non-binding policy document to test the water and make adjustments to its plans before introducing the real, legally-binding treaty. For example, the 1948 Universal Declaration of Human Rights, a “soft-law” instrument, was the precursor to the two 1966 U.N. Covenants on Human Rights.

        The 1992 U.N. Framework Convention on Climate Change called for “voluntary” compliance. But at the first meeting of the Conference of the Parties to the Convention, the group agreed to create a Kyoto Protocol to the Convention that would set legally-binding targets for all member nations.

        Noah M. Sachs, a University of Richmond law professor and environmental expert, said: “Agenda 21 has been a dead letter for 20 years, its recommendations have not been implemented by most governments, and the U.S. has largely ignored it.”

        Mr. Sachs is either ignorant of the facts, or is deliberately trying to mislead his readers.

        President Clinton’s President’s Council on Sustainable Development operated between 1993 and 1999 expressly for the purpose of implementing the recommendations in Agenda 21. At the 11th meeting of the PCSD, Ron Brown, then- Secretary of the Department of Commerce, said that his department could implement 67% of the recommendations under his jurisdiction by rule, without the need for new legislation.

        The International Council for Local Environmental Initiatives (ICLEI) was created at the behest of the U.N. expressly for the purpose of advancing Agenda 21 around the world. They claim more than 1200 cities around the world have joined their organization for assistance in implementing “sustainable development”—defined to be the recommendations contained in Agenda 21. More than 600 of these cities are in the United States.

        Agenda 21 is not a dead letter!

        A few organizations, Freedom21, Freedom Advocates in California, and the American Policy Center have been teaching Agenda 21 to people since the mid 1990s. In the last few years, Tea Parties, 9/12 and property rights groups have seen how ICLEI and liberal local officials have been converting the recommendations in Agenda 21 into binding law, by incorporating these recommendations into comprehensive land use plans. Dozens of cities have terminated their membership in ICLEI after local groups showed their elected officials how their plans actually reflect the recommendations in Agenda 21.

        Those who like to ridicule by pointing to an imaginary global plot to rule the world, are either ignorant of the facts, or don’t want people to know that the IUCN and the ICEL have been working since 1995 to get Agenda 21 converted into binding international law.

        It is not a plot. It is not a conspiracy. It is a fact.

        The IUCN is not going to stop until they are successful. Virtually every environmental treaty adopted by the U.N. in the last several decades was written by the IUCN.

        The IUCN consists of governments, government agencies, and non-government organizations. Seven federal agencies pay more than $500,000 per year to be members of the IUCN. Many of these people are the same people who are delegates and attend the U. N. meetings where these treaties are adopted. Federal employees helped write this fourth draft of the International Covenant on Environment and Development.

        President Obama is on the Agenda 21 bandwagon. In addition to challenge grants offered by federal agencies to entice local communities to create comprehensive land use plans, he, like Bill Clinton, has issued Executive Orders to advance the agenda without interference from Congress.

        Obama issued an Executive Order to create the White House Rural Council last year. On March 15, he issued another Executive order creating the White House Council on Strong Cities, Strong Communities. The next day, another Executive Order, National Defense Resources Preparedness, vastly expanded the President’s power to control virtually all resources in times of emergency.

        In view of the facts that are readily available and undeniable, whenever a journalist or a politician, or an ordinary environmental extremist claims that Agenda 21 is not real, or is just a “conspiracy theory,” or the imaginations of right-wing crackpots, their comments can be dismissed and their motives challenged.

        The U.N., the IUCN, and the ICEL—are working as hard as they can to get Agenda 21 converted into binding international law

        The international community—the U.N., the IUCN, and the ICEL—are working as hard as they can to get Agenda 21 converted into binding international law. It will happen unless informed Americans stand up—as they have begun to do across the country—and kick out ICLEI, Agenda 21, and realize that use of the term “sustainable development” is nothing more than a sound-good substitute for Agenda 21.

        Everyone should learn all they can about Agenda 21 and sustainable development, and join the battle to keep it away from America.

  • http://AOL MadIrishman

    I just want to point out that several early Ameican city’s & states made their own coins, out of pewter, brass, & copper, states included New York, Massachusetts, Connecticut, even Kentucky, who’s coins were minted in England and shipped to America, even New Hampshire was the first state to consider coinage after the Declaration of Independence.
    Several of those states also used silver. So, there you have it, if some states who are not over burden by ties to the Federal Govenment would like to have their own coinage they might consider doing so. By the way some states also had their own script of state owned banks….

  • FreedomFighter

    IRS Coup: The Absolute Enslavement of All Americans

    Laus Deo
    Semper Fi

  • TIME

    A few points to ponder, First, Money does not = WEALTH.

    Wealth can = Money as one can trade their holdings in real tangible WEALTH such as silver, gold, land, water, minerals, oils, gas, etc. for {money of the moment.}

    Wealth of the Sprit / Soul can not be bought with either MONEY or WEALTH of tangible items.

    Peace and Love,

    • Karolyn

      Amen, Time!

  • Jay

    The Left Wing Circular Firing Squad

    Liberals have set themselves up for failure primarily because, as the rest of us all know, liberalism does not work. The fact that liberalism does not work stuns liberals.

    They disbelieve this fact because they so religiously believe in liberalism. And as liberalism fails, every piece of it falls like dominoes because liberals always align themselves into a circular firing squad.

    When “moderates”, i.e. liberals who do not want to be associated with the toxic ideals of liberalism, get into the circle and start shooting things go downhill even faster. This is simply unavoidable.

    For the uninitiated, a circular firing squad is an analogy for a bunch of people who have the same goal. Perhaps it is a common enemy. But in pursuit of that goal everyone is required to harm those that have the same goal as they do. Thus the hilarious concept of a bunch of people standing around in a circle, each with a gun pointed at the back of the head of the person in front of them. When the triggers are pulled everyone in the circle drops dead.

    Do not believe me that liberalism is like this? Oh, then you do need to pay better attention to what is going on in the world. All liberals have a common enemy. That enemy is limited government, liberty and the United States of America as it was founded to be.

    Let us start with any liberal in the circle. For the sake of argument, let’s look at one that promises the elderly Social Security to gain votes. Social Security requires, however, that there are younger workers generating paychecks to put money into the system in order to write these promised checks.

    Behind the liberal promising Social Security, however, is another liberal. This liberal spends and spends and spends government money like it is in infinite supply. He even dips into the Social Security funds and spends more money than is being brought in. This leads to massive deficits. These deficits put a strain on the economy. The economy starts to slow because of this. As the economy slows, wages of existing workers are depressed. This leads to less money coming in to pay the promises of the first liberal who promised Social Security.

    Behind the liberal spending money hand over fist is another liberal. This liberal loves regulation. She regulates and regulates and regulates. These regulations, however, cost business money. These expenses reduce revenues. These costs drain resources. These resources being drained leads to fewer employees and again, fewer workers to pay into the Social Security coffers.

    Behind this liberal is the liberal who loves to conduct social engineering. This liberal, for example, thinks that it is unfair that some Americans do not have homes which they own. So this liberal starts to tinker with the business models of banks. He even uses the liberal at whose head he has pointed a gun and who loves to regulate to help him in this goal. He forces banks to make loans to people who cannot reasonably be assumed to be capable of paying them back and does so through the power of government persuasion and threats. When, however, these bad loans start falling apart, the economy sags further putting more workers, the ones needed to pay the promises of Social Security, out of work.

    The next liberal in the circle, with gun cocked and loaded, promises poor people medical insurance, food assistance and a check each month to help them out. This of course puts more strain on government resources already depleted by the suppressed economy.

    Behind this liberal is yet another. She is in charge of educating the next generation of workers. But she is also burdened by the rules of the liberal who has regulated what schools must do. Dismayed at standards which are at times silly and the fact that there are many students who are not capable or willing to learn what has been mandated to be learned in the way it has been mandated to be learned, she gets other liberals together and starts cheating the system. She gives the students the answers to the tests ahead of time and perhaps even changes the answers of the students after the fact to make sure they pass the test.

    Now these students, liberals themselves, enter the circle. To the back of their head is the gun held by the liberal promising Social Security whom we started with.

    These students are too uneducated to know that this demand is out of bounds with the Constitution. But they know how to put a condom on a cucumber and how to properly file a grievance in court for not getting their way and blame their maltreatment on their race, gender or sexual orientation.

    Unprepared to enter the workforce and incapable of holding down a good paying job and contributing money to the Social Security, medical insurance and food assistance programs as well as the Welfare system as demanded these students, once they graduate, wind up taking money out of the system instead of putting money into it.

    Now with money short, and recognizing that his fellow liberals are the ones draining the money he so desperately needs to make good on his promises, the first liberal resolves to action. If he shoots the unqualified liberal worker in front of him and ends his demands on the system that will mean more money for him to spend on his promises.

    But little does the Social Security-promising liberal know that while he has this thought, so too do all the other liberals in the circle. Then it happens. BAM! All the guns go off at the same time. And no liberal is left standing.

  • Jay

    For all practical purposes, the Democratic Party no longer exists. Its leadership has been taken over by the Progressives. That the Progressives themselves are in fact thinly disguised Marxists / Socialists & Communists is only now beginning to be recognized by any significant portion of the American public. Unfortunately for all of us, the Progressive movement has deep roots in the GOP establishment as well.

    The Progressive’s political philosophy is based on a foundation of lies, three of which are the cornerstones upon which virtually all of their other lies are built. Those three big lies are as follows:

    I. Progressives claim to be the only ones who care about the have-nots, the poor, the weak and the helpless

    The first big lie is that the Progressives claim to be the only ones who care about the have-nots, the poor, the weak and the helpless. In fact they don’t give a damn about the have-nots. Their one and only objective is to gain and exercise as much power as they can over others in order to satisfy their own massive egos and their own personal greed.

    When the effects of the Progressive’s policies of the past are viewed by any objective study, one will see that it’s their own policies that have actually turned the poor into a permanent welfare dependent underclass of citizens. Their continuing efforts to control, stifle and suppress the free market by taxing and regulating the business community to death, has severely limited any chance that the poor have for upwards mobility in order to achieve their own slice of the American dream.

    One of the most pernicious ways in which they have managed to do this, is through the American educational system, which their current leaders, the former radicals of the 60’s have totally hijacked. Many of them originally became teachers simply to avoid the draft.

    Over the last several decades, they’ve rewritten and twisted the history of capitalism and the free market in America which is what made us the richest country in human history, and a force for good throughout the world. Their revisionist history is such a blatant pack of lies that they’ve even managed to convince the people that the democrats and the left are responsible for the Civil Rights revolution.

    The average American today believes that concern for civil rights is exclusively a liberal or Democratic Party virtue when in fact the first civil rights legislation and a big part of subsequent legislation was introduced by Republicans, and voted into law by Republicans over the hard fought objections of the Democratic left.

    II. Convincing the American people that the rich and their “greedy” corporations have attained their wealth by ripping-off and unfairly exploiting the poor

    The Progressive’s second big lie is convincing the American people that the rich and their “greedy” corporations have attained their wealth by ripping-off and unfairly exploiting the poor. Nothing could be further from the truth.

    On a superficial level it’s an irrational argument, because the rich obviously can’t get rich unless the masses can afford to buy their products and services, so it’s simply not in their best interests to keep the masses poor. As it turns out, that’s the Progressive’s job. As any student of Austrian economics will tell you, everyone benefits in a free market system.

    Upon deeper analysis, it can be seen that the primary reason why the left continues to promote this philosophy of class warfare, and to actually believe the lie themselves, is that they simply don’t understand the nature of wealth itself.

    When Obama talks of “spreading the wealth around” the key word is “the”. They think of wealth as something that exists in a static quantity in the universe, and that all of the ills of society could be fixed if only “it” was distributed more fairly. Of course they see themselves as being the only ones morally and intellectually trustworthy of being put in charge of the distribution.

    What they don’t understand is, that wealth is created by hard working and ambitious people who choose to use their intellect and other abilities as the tools needed to take what nature gives us and shape it to suit our needs. They don’t understand this primarily because most of them have never participated in the process.

    III. Human activities are destroying our environment and indeed the earth itself

    The third big lie is that human activities are destroying our environment and indeed the earth itself.

    The driving force behind the extreme environmental community is a Marxist / socialist political con game designed to fool the people into giving them power over the world’s industrial community.

    They’ve done this not out of any real concern over the environment. Their motive is simply to enrich themselves and their political supporters and aid & abet the globalists and their parent organization the UN, which has morphed itself from an organization dedicated to maintaining world peace into an international cabal of sociopaths intent on literally ruling the world.

    Environmental campaigns are a convenient front for the Marxists to hide behind because it’s politically dangerous to attack anyone in the environmental movement.

    Just as anyone who attacks or even questions Obama is painted as a racist, anyone challenging the EPA is accused of being in the pay of those evil and greedy oil companies. They’ve learned that they’re virtually immune from attack as long as they’re hiding there, and that it’s easy to fool people into believing that our environmental problems are all caused by greedy capitalists who defile nature and hog all of her resources for themselves.

    Their methodology has been simple but effective. They simply lie like hell.

    Our environmental problems have been exaggerated out of all proportion and in many cases totally fabricated by the eco-fascists and globalists who call the shots. The global warming / climate change hoax is the best current example, but there are many others.

    The globalists at the UN have authored and adopted a plan called Agenda 21. They describe it as their plan to save the world, when in reality it’s their plan for achieving power over the entire world during the 21st century.

    It’s based on a grossly distorted and exaggerated theory of “sustainability” which claims that the primary cause of all of our world’s problems is man himself. The main problem is that there’s just too many of us by far according to their view of the world.

    Their bogus “sustainability” theory contends that the earth cannot sustain a population of more than roughly 500 million people. With a world population approaching 7 billion people, this means that more than 90% of us have to go. They’re well on their way to achieving that goal, and they aren’t trying too hard to hide it. Absurd you say? Au contraire.

    Their bogus environmental campaigns are the justification they use to force us to put a substantial percentage of our corn production into our gas tanks in the form of ethanol. Corn is a critical part of the world’s food supply because it’s a primary component of animal feed. The fact that ethanol is a lousy fuel in comparison to gasoline is never mentioned.

    They claim that they’re doing it in part because the world’s supply of petroleum and other fossil fuels is getting perilously low, but that’s another of their outright lies.

    America actually has the largest fossil fuel reserves in the world, more than enough to last us at our present rate of consumption for over 200 years.

    Starvation is a legitimate and accepted tool to be used in their planned depopulation. Diminishing our corn production is an effective way achieve that goal. Remember, to Progressives, the ends always justify the means.

    • DaveH

      Great posts, Jay. Thanks.

  • dick motta

    Revenue sharing became a way of life for State Legislatures in 1986. In Montana, federal revenue sharing is $2.6 billion of a $5.7 billion total State budget. The Federal government is bankrupt and must reduce spending. Federal revenue sharing decreases will become a top priority on the hope that States will pick up the balance. Mr. Smith has offered some excellent ideas for restoring State sovereignty. I questioned a panel of State candidates on sovereignty and revenue sharing. They all praised State sovereignty, but the blank looks and responses were that the “State had to get the money”. Don’t vote for any candidate that won’t defend State sovereignty.

  • chuckb

    Written by former Mayor of San Diego and nationally syndicated radio talk show host.


    Written by Roger Hedgecock
    Wednesday, 25 January 2012

    I live in California. If you were wondering what living in Obama’s second term would be like, wonder no longer. We in California are living there now.

    California is a one-party state dominated by a virulent Democrat Left enabled by a complicit media where every agency of local, county, and state government is run by and for the public employee unions. The unemployment rate is 12%.

    California has more folks on food stamps than any other state, has added so many benefits and higher rates to Medicaid that we call it “Medi-Cal.” Our K-12 schools have more administrators than teachers, with smaller classes but lower test scores and higher dropout rates with twice the per-student budget of 15 years ago. Good job, Brownie.

    This week, the once and current Gov. Jerry “Moonbeam” Brown had to confess that the “balanced” state budget adopted five months ago was billions in the red because actual tax revenues were billions lower than the airy-fairy revenue estimates on which the balance was predicated.

    After trimming legislators’ perks and reducing the number of cell phones provided to state civil servants, the governor intoned that drastic budget reductions had already hollowed out state programs for the needy, law enforcement and our schoolchildren. California government needed more money.

    Echoing the Occupy movement, the governor proclaimed the rich must pay their fair share. Fair share? The top 1% of California income earners currently pays 50% of the state’s income tax.

    California has seven income tax brackets. The top income tax rate is 9.3%, which is slapped on the greedy rich earning at least $47,056 a year. Income of more than $1 million pays the “millionaires’ and billionaires’” surcharge tax rate of 10.3%.

    Brown’s proposal would add 2% for income over $250,000. A million-dollar income would then be taxed at 12.3%. And that’s just for the state.

    Brown also proposed a one-half-cent sales tax increase, which would bring sales taxes (which vary by county) up to 7.75% to as much as 10%. Both tax increases would be on the ballot in 2012.

    The sales tax increase proposal immediately brought howls of protest from the Left (of Brown!). Charlie Eaton, a sociology grad student at UC Berkeley and leader of the UC Student-Workers Union, said, “We’ve paid enough. It’s time for millionaires to pay.”

    At least five other ballot measures to raise taxes are circulating for signatures to get on the 2012 ballot in California. The governor’s proposals are the most conservative.

    The Obama way doesn’t end with taxes.

    The governor and the state legislature continue to applaud the efforts of the California High Speed Rail Authority to build a train connecting Los Angeles and San Francisco. Even though the budget is three times the voter-approved amount, and the first segment will only connect two small towns in the agricultural Central Valley. But hey, if we build it, they will ride.

    And we don’t want to turn down the Obama bullet-train bucks Florida and other states rejected because the operating costs would bankrupt them. Can’t happen here because we’re already insolvent.

    If we get into real trouble with the train, we’ll just bring in the Chinese. It worked with the Bay Bridge reconstruction. After the 1989 earthquake, the bridge connecting Oakland and San Francisco was rebuilt with steel made in China. Workers from China too. Paid for with money borrowed from China. Makes perfect sense.

    In California, we hate the evil, greedy rich (except the rich in Hollywood, in sports, and in drug dealing). But we love people who have broken into California to eat the bounty created by the productive rich.

    Illegal’s get benefits from various generous welfare programs, free medical care, free schools for their kids, including meals, and of course, instate tuition rates and scholarships too. Nothing’s too good for our guests.

    To erase even a hint of criticism of illegal immigration, the California Legislature is considering a unilateral state amnesty. Democrat State Assemblyman Felipe Fuentes has proposed an initiative that would bar deportation of illegal’s from California.

    Interesting dilemma for Obama there. If immigration is exclusively a federal matter, and Obama has sued four states for trying to enforce federal immigration laws he won’t enforce, what will the President do to a California law that exempts California from federal immigration law?

    California is also near fulfilling the environmentalist dream of deindustrialization.

    After driving out the old industrial base (auto and airplane assembly, for example), air and water regulators and tax policies are now driving out the high-tech, biotech and even Internet-based companies that were supposed to be California’s future.

    The California cap-and-trade tax on business in the name of reducing CO2 makes our state the leader in wacky environmentalism and guarantees a further job exodus from the state.

    Even green energy companies can’t do business in California. Solyndra went under, taking its taxpayer loan guarantee with it.

    No job is too small to escape the regulators. The state has even banned weekend amateur gold miners from the historic gold mining streams in the Sierra Nevada Mountains.

    In fact, more and more of California’s public land is off-limits to recreation by the people who paid for that land. Unless you’re illegal.

    Then you can clear the land, set up marijuana plantations at will, bring in fertilizers that legal farmers can no longer use, exploit illegal farm workers who live in hovels with no running water or sanitation, and protect your investment with armed illegal’s carrying guns no California citizen is allowed to own.

    The rest of us only found out about these plantations when the workers’ open campfire started one of those devastating fires that have killed hundreds of people and burned out thousands of homes in California over the last decade.

    It’s often said that whatever happens in California will soon happen in your state.

    You’d better hope that’s wrong.

    Roger Hedgecock is the former mayor of San Diego and a nationally syndicated radio talk show host.

  • James

    The reason States are beholden to the federal government is because they accept federal handouts with strings attached. The national government imposes more taxes than it needs to carry out its functions, then offers some of it back if States do thus and so. U.S. Congressmen then vie with each other, through the frenzy of ‘earmarks’, to see which one can get the most kickbacks to their favorites back home. The most successful, then get re-elected. Through this process the feds have taken control of the public school system, and an ever increasing amount of the economy.


    Americas problems seem to stem from a belief that no one should pay taxes and that all government departments should close down except for the military and the police. No one wants to pay any tax and Republicans supporters most especially dont want to share their wealth with anyone. They believe that they have worked hard using their skills to build and operate a business which is earning them an income and profit and why should they have to share that with others and strangers at that, as afterall our profits are due to our hard work and skills at using cheap labor in America or the Asian countries and not due to government policies or the poorer being given money to buy our food and goods using food stamps.

    Oh No, our businesses run independantly to the American economy and we dont need others to steal our money through taxation. We want the lazy unemployed masses to beg and sleep under bridges or the streets and not be supported by government handouts. We want poor americans to camp out in our bus stations and parks and beg for food and if they get too desparate and dare to try to steal food then the police can put them in concentration camps where they can earn their keep and food by breaking rocks for road construction companies who charge tolls for using their roads. Why should your poor be offered work for a reasonable wage if we can employ workers from China at $1 per hour. We only want to sell cars to other business people who can afford our high priced Ford motor vehicles and the poor can just learn to walk instead or get a bike. Charity is only optional if the churches themselves can get donations from other silly people who want to offer food and shelter to the miilions of poor who will be sleeping in doorways and camping along rivers and parks and really who cares if they die freezing to death…they not our problem and certainly not the American way and certainly not the Christian way of doing things…nowhere in the bible does it say we should help the poor and disadvantaged, the lazy and the weak. Oh no we want to keep our money in gold.and not houses which might have desparate and dangerous squatters living in them who cant afford to pay rent because they cant even afford to buy food after the Republican government scraps the food stamp program. .

    Income taxes are paid out of a proportion of the profit any businesses make after deducting all expenses whether funded by cash or non funded depreciation. All businesses and private individuals should pay taxes if they make a profit after trading or working.. I cant imagine any USA company putting capital into making widgets if all you have to do is import them from China or India where they use very much cheaper labour than even the cheapest wage rate in the USA. No bank will lend in such circumstances of stupidity unless you offer some other form of property or asset as security, as some banks might not mind if you get competed out of business by another operator who imports those similar but cheaper widgets. Some types of services cannot be imported except cheap labor from Mexico perhaps, and some specialty products or services need to be made or performed in the USA.

    Everyone needs to pay taxes to keep your economy going and its up to your representatives who you been voting in for the last 300 years to do what the majority wants them to do even if you as an individual or a group do not agree with the results.. That’s life, but some of you guys can’t accept the results of every one of your elections and continue to be bad losers when your party does not win.You act in a treasonous way with what some of you and your representative do against the good running of your elected or part majority elected government. I don’t blame you for being that way as it is the nature of men who have strong political beliefs and I myself do it sometimes too. Every time you have an election the losers complain that they could do it better and when they do win…THEY DO LITTLE to improve your economic situation.

    Taxes cannot be apportioned according to some fair sharing system…it does not work that way. , Unfortunately your economy is not structured to suddenly cut expenditure programs to counterbalance lower taxes, that instant program will put your economy into a much worse situation than your in now…it will nosedive and gold prices will rise substantially for the benefit of traders and the major holders of gold such as the Chinese.

    Those of you who might like to make more money out of such a scenario would in my opinion be unpatriotic to wish to profit from the demise of everyone else in your community IMO. i SUGGEST THERE ARE OTHER PROVEN WAYS TO MAKE THE PRICE OF GOLD SKYROCKET WITHOUT HAVING TO WRECK YOUR ECONOMY IN THE PROCESS BUT IT MIGHT NOT BE THE AMERICAN CORPORATE SECTOR. WHO WILL BE ABLE TO CAUSE THE PRICE TO RISE.

    IMO the Chinese seem to own or control most of the gold and one way to increase the price or manipulate the price of to simply close down all the gold mining operation in which they have a management control in ….how long? Maybe a month or more? Any traders out there could work out what would happen to futures prices? Example EXTRADA did it with the price of Copper many years ago by closing down some Australian copper mines…

    The reality is that your economy cannot operate without more people or corporations paying higher taxes…and so get on with it and pay more income taxes or pay more by losing everything in your financial collapse..I CANT PUT IT IN ANY OTHER LANGUAGE. iF YOU PAY MORE TAXES, THEN YOU WILL MAKE MORE MONEY AND GET TO KEEP WHAT YOU OWN NOW. LOOK AT THE SO CALLED SMART GREEKS…HOW SMART ARE THEY NOW??? DO YOU WISH TO FOLLOW IN THEIR FOOTSTEPS TOO?? JUST THINK ABOUT THE CONSEQUENCES OF YOUR CONTINUAL EGO BICKERING IN CONGRESS. ITS A TOTAL DISGRACE…IMO but you might think the Republicans are being clever, but i doubt it.

    • George E


      Just because conservatives want a small, lean government doesn’t mean they don’t want to pay any taxes. We just want our taxes to be as little as necessary for the government to efficiently do the things government should do. We do not want government getting into areas where it is not chartered by our Constitution or where the private sector can, and should do things better.

      Conservatives don’t want the government getting too heavily involved in trying to manage charitable programs. We want charity to go to the truly needy, not the masses. We want the masses to learn to fend for themselves using their wit and hard work to provide for themselves. This is how human beings have always learned to survive and thrive in a competitive world. It is also one of the basic instincts that helps economies to grow and thrive. We think charitable programs (for the truly needy) are something that non-profit organizations can do better at lower cost. While conservatives complain about government programs like this, conservatives typically give to non-profitable organizations much more than liberals do. Liberals tend to depend on the force of government to take money from us to fund these programs, and extend them to the masses. Aside from the morality of forcing people to pay into these programs, the government wastes a lot of the money they get from its citizens.

      The economy does not thrive and grow as a result of paying higher taxes to the government. Quite the opposite. Economies do better when the government is small, lean, and least intrusive. However, it is necessary to maintain political stability, civil rest, sound infrastructure, and protect individual property rights as a basis for a sound economy. It does take some taxes and regulations to do all of this.

      “Big” government is not the answer to our problems, but “good” government can enable us to solve our problems.


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