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Earthquakes, Hurricane Irene And Evolution

August 30, 2011 by  

Earthquakes, Hurricane Irene And Evolution

If you like excitement, it doesn’t get any better than this past week in Washington, D.C. — an earthquake and a hurricane in the space of five days. We already had our hands full with a manmade disaster known as the Federal government.

Though both of these natural disasters were highly unusual for the nation’s capital, the truth is D.C. and most of Maryland and Northern Virginia escaped two bullets. The earthquake did very little damage, and Hurricane Irene could have been much worse. We had a lot of rain and winds in the 25-mph range in our area; but, overall, we were lucky compared to what happened to the Outer Banks in North Carolina, New York City, Long Island and much of the Northeast.

What amazed me was how closely scientists and weather experts were able to track Hurricane Irene with almost pinpoint accuracy. People who experienced the Great New England Hurricane of 1938 could not have imagined sitting in their living rooms and watching a minute-by-minute update on the hurricane’s path for days on end. (Remember, only Joe Biden thinks television existed when FDR was President.)

As impressed as I was with how much scientists now know about hurricanes and how far we’ve come technologically (e.g., being able to able watch natural disasters unfold in minute detail on television), I also thought about how helpless we are when it comes to natural disasters.

What will we do when a magnitude 8.0 earthquake rocks Manhattan or a Category 5 hurricane hits the Big Apple head on? Such a disaster would bring the U.S. to its knees for months, and the economic effects would be felt for years. According to scientists, such major disasters will occur. It’s only a matter of when.

Hurricane Irene also made me think about the evolution question again. The feedback on my last article Is Evolution a Crazy Idea? was the kind of thing that makes writing a fulfilling occupation. I was expecting a lot of nasty comments; but, with the exception of a few out-of-hand dismissals of my irrational thought processes, the feedback was surprisingly civil.

A number of comments were so good that they could have been mistaken for articles in a major publication. Clearly, there was a lot of deep thought put into them. I bring this up because there’s a connection between my evolution article and last week’s earthquake and hurricane. They all relate to the question of whether there is a Conscious Universal Power Source at the controls or whether everything that happens here on Earth is random.

Those who believe in a random Universe really believe in what I would call “atheistic predestination.” That would mean that the so-called Big Bang — the massive explosion from whence evolved today’s known Universe — somehow happened without the aid of a Supreme Power.

If there was, and is, no Supreme Power in the Universe, everything that has been, is or will be said and done throughout the eons of time was precisely determined approximately 14 billion years ago by the nature of the Big Bang. At the first instant of that unfathomable explosion, every atom was sent flying on an eternal voyage that was predetermined by the intricacies of the explosion itself.

If there is no Supreme Power to intervene, then nothing can be changed by anybody or anything. Every detail of every event has already been set on an unalterable course. This is the ultimate fatalistic view of the Universe. There is no one in control and there is no purpose to life.

Thus, every aspect of last week’s earthquake and hurricane was predetermined by the Big Bang. Ditto with evolution. I get it. But logic always forces an intellectually honest person to get back to that annoying little question that refuses to go away: What caused the Big Bang? Maybe I’m too simplistically logical, but my mind cannot process the idea of a consequence without a preceding action.

Some readers argued that the first-cause argument doesn’t fly because it leads to the question of what caused the first cause. I see this unanswerable question as evidence of a Supreme Being — a Conscious Universal Power Source that has always existed and will continue to exist throughout eternity. How can infinity be explained away simply by saying that everything is random?

Did this Power Source intervene and cause last week’s earthquake or hurricane to occur? I have no idea. Though millions of people would never admit it, neither does anyone else. As I said earlier, it’s amazing what scientists know about earthquakes, hurricanes and other natural disasters. But, even with their vast knowledge of how these events occur, not one scientist has any idea as to why they occur.

For example, science can explain how gravity works, but it cannot explain why it works the way it does. We know that gravity makes the planets, stars, galaxies and other cosmic bodies act on each other in certain predictable ways, but this does nothing to explain how the principle of gravity came into being.

You can offer endless scientific explanations for a natural disaster like a hurricane — high-pressure systems, low-pressure systems, unusually warm ocean water, etc. — but eventually you get to what I call the “Why Wall?” Why do these phenomena occur?

It’s kind of like Jim Carrey in the movie “The Truman Show.” At some point in time, Truman managed to reach a wall with a door in it. After pondering whether to venture out of his capsule, he finally opened the door and stepped into the real world.

Could it be that we simply haven’t found the door that leads to the real world, so we continue to live in a secular humanistic world where we are more comfortable explaining away everything as “random?”

–Robert Ringer

Robert Ringer

is a New York Times #1 bestselling author and host of the highly acclaimed Liberty Education Interview Series, which features interviews with top political, economic, and social leaders. He has appeared on Fox News, Fox Business, The Tonight Show, Today, The Dennis Miller Show, Good Morning America, The Lars Larson Show, ABC Nightline, and The Charlie Rose Show, and has been the subject of feature articles in such major publications as Time, People, The Wall Street Journal, Fortune, Barron's, and The New York Times. To sign up for his one-of-a-kind, pro-liberty e-letter, A Voice of Sanity, Click Here.

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  • DaveH

    Well, if the hurricane or the earthquake had taken out the Capitol, I might have had to rethink my religious position.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      LOL. Thats funny.

      • People’s Rights

        Mr. Ringer I don’t believe in the Liberal theory of Evolution to justify their political agenda, but I do believe in God.

        Evolution is a theory of ATHEISTS and who are WARMONGERS. People tend to get MORE violent when they don’t believe in God. – “Thou shall not kill.”

        ** End of the world can be manmade as well by using nuclear weapons or biological weapons.**

        Robert Ringer said, “You can offer endless scientific explanations for a natural disaster like a hurricane.” These days any disaster can be explain by scientific evidence and facts. Manipulating of rains, causing fire and others were enhanced during the 1940s.

        Since you’re trying to convince us it’s a natural phenomenon, you should discuss about the natural disaster and the uses of weather weapons. Fair and unbiased is how it should be reported, YOUR’RE MISSING THE MAIN ISSUES.

        • Old Henry

          Well People’s Rights, we must ask: “Who created the science”?

          I believe you are correct in that evolutionists are atheists trying to justify their non-belief. Satan has been roaming the earth since the beginning of our Earth. And satan has been infecting the hearts and minds of man to differing degrees ever since.

        • Amy

          Peoples Right says – “People tend to get MORE violent when they don’t believe in God.” How untrue is that? Most wars are faught over religion. How many people have died in the name of religion? From the Christian Crusades to the Muslim terrorist, religion and the belief in God brings out the worst in people.

          • Robert Smith

            Anyone up for another inquisition?


          • Old Henry

            Yeah Rob, let’s play Cowboys n Muslims…

          • Bob from SoCal

            Yes Amy it must have been God that brought out the worst in Stalin, Hitler and Mao right? You can chalk up over a hundred million to their tally. So how many have been killed by Christians?

          • Christin

            Good one – Bob from SoCal.

          • Nadzieja Batki

            Religious people who believe the God of the Bible do not have the time or the inclination to harm other people.
            The “isms”known as socialism, humanism,etc., that are used as substitutes for God(also better known as man made religions) are the causes of all the horrors that have been perpertrated throughout the ages. These groups also have human leaders which people follow blindly and stupidly.

          • Altaica

            Bob From SoCal:

            Here’s part of the answer.

            You could also add up Numbers and is it Kings I think that also talks about the wars and numbers killed in them. I know Numbers has a lot.

            This link only details the crusades and the anti-semitism afterward. There is also the witch trials and the unknown numbers of people killed for being “heretics” typically other Christians. Recently I read about Pope Innocent III and his endorsement of a whole town of 1200 in France that the innocent and heretics were all killed, men, women and children, because they couldn’t determine who was who. What baby deserves to be slaughtered just because its parents have done something you don’t like? Such is the problem with wars. Innocents are killed along with soldiers.

            Is there really any large social group that hasn’t engaged in some form of violence?

        • Marie1

          “Thou shall not kill” that is good, so why are the republicans so much against gun control?

          • Old Henry

            And why are liberals so in favor of slaughtering the unborn inocents by chopping them into pieces as they struggle in the womb. Why are liberals so in favor of Death Panels to kill the elderly and infirm? Why are liberals so in favor of euthenasia? Why are liberals so infavor of the slaughter of Christians by the godless Muslims?

          • Currahee

            “Thou Shall not kill.” Is not the actual translation of the original texts. It is actually “Thou shall not committ murder.” The Bible is very clear about the diference. Jesus just before his crucifiction told his diciples, “Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.

            37For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me, And he was reckoned among the transgressors: for the things concerning me have an end.

            38And they said, Lord, behold, here are two swords. And he said unto them, It is enough.”(Luke 22:36-38)

            So don’t confuse yourself that it is wrong to kill in the defense of your own life or others around you who are in harms way, it is however wrong for the individual to kill as an act of revenge, that is left up to the state which is also clearly explained in the Bible as well. We are in modern times and we have invinted guns which if Jesus were here today he would have told his diciples to buy a gun if they did not have any. You need to educate yourself before you go on to blogs and try to slam Republicans who for the most part defend our “Natural/God Given Rights.”

          • eddie47d

            Why is Henry so obsessed with taking over Arab lands and thinking they are our sand box to play in. When you go out looking for trouble you usually find it. Time to keep our nose at home since our foreign adventurism isn’t working out too well. Those death panels come from the queen of hype,der Sarah. I don’t see where liberals approve of them and they seem to only be in Republican fantasies. Abortion is an individual choice which may be a bad one but hardly limited to any one party. Unless you can honestly say a conservative woman has never had one.

          • Karolyn

            Old Henry – “Why are liberals so in favor of Death Panels to kill the elderly and infirm? Why are liberals so in favor of euthenasia? Why are liberals so infavor of the slaughter of Christians by the godless Muslims?”

            Where do you get this crap from? However, what is wrong with euthanasia if the person wants to die?

            As far as abortion goes, I do not believe liberals are FOR abortion; they are FOR individual’s rights.

          • Kate8

            karolyn – No one really wants to die. What they really want is for things to get better.

            A person who ‘wants to die’ has just lost faith that they will get better.

            I’ll bet that if someone offered them a ray of hope, that suicidal wish would vanish.

          • http://smalltimebiggoverment Linda

            Marie1, Republicans are against gun control because all the bad guys will have the guns that includes the Obama White House. And remember guns don’t kill, the people who fire them at people do. It is also our right as Americans to bare arms to protect ourselves. If someone had a gun in Tucson that mad man would have been stopped and quickly. And I agree with other posts when they state Christians have not killed in Gods name, like Mao, Stalin, Hitler and others of their ilk who have killed millions to force their people into Communisum, Socialsim, Marxism and Islam. God’s word condems killings like these animals carried out for their purposes to be Gods by controlling the masses.

          • DaveH

            Karolyn says (right after admonishing Henry for 3 of the things he accused Liberals of wanting, yet admitting to at least 2 of them) — “they are FOR individual’s rights”.
            Karolyn that is so far from the truth that you should be ashamed of uttering those words. Liberals are not even close to being for individual’s rights. The only free choice they would allow individuals is the choice to abort their babies. After that, not much else. They don’t allow us the choice to keep our own hard-earned money. They don’t allow us the choice to forego health insurance. They want to control our energy choices. They want to control our religious expression. They want to take away our gun choices. They want to take away our automobile choices.
            Let’s face it, Karolyn, the Liberals are anything but Pro-Choice, unless you’re the mother of an unborn child.
            When it comes to forcing their way on us, Liberals make the right-wingers pale in comparison.

          • http://smalltimebiggoverment Linda

            Currihee, Thank you good post Murder is the Key as you said – To Murder,with malice. To Kill, the act of killing.

          • DaveH

            It is you gun-controllers, who want to deprive people of the right to self-protection, who are causing the deaths of innocents. It has been well-established by people like John Lott, that the incidence of murder goes up with gun control, not down. Essentially, you Liberals are, by virtue of depriving people the right of self-defense, accessories to murder:

          • iam

            Marie1, (some) Republicans are against gun control because it is proven on a daily basis that there are people roaming the streets looking for the opportunity to murder anyone who is handy, and the police cannot be everywhere at all times. We must protect ourselves and our loved ones, and we can’t do it by preaching “love” to the killers.

          • bob wire

            “A person who ‘wants to die’ has just lost faith that they will get better.”

            Right Katie ~ everyone want to go to heaven but few are willing to die to get there.

          • libertytrain

            bob – I’ve often wondered about that too. Quite the conundrum.

          • Karolyn

            Kate – Isn’t it possible that a person wants to die to be free? And why shouldn’t they be abel to? Especially that person sitting like a vegetable. Death is just a transition. What is wrng with wanting to die?

          • Robert Smith

            “Thou shall not kill” that is good,”


            Big difference.

            Self defense is allowed.


          • Kate8

            karolyn – A person sitting as a vegetable would be without hope.

            The Left seems so enamored with death. But then, since the Right values life, I guess that’s just how it is.

            We are wired toward survival. Otherwise, most of us wouldn’t stick around when things get tough.

            There are many teachings that we don’t just escape ourselves through death but, rather, just have to deal with the same issues elsewhere.

            In any case, it’s far better to resolve them here and now, and come to terms with oneself before checking out.

          • Dan az

            Thanks for the link!I had a buddy die of stomach cancer a few months ago that wanted to take his own life but when it came down to the decision to do it he changed his mind.Hospice gave him a month to live and offered him a way to go easily but he decided to see all of his grandchildren before he went and that took about a year and a half.He died a week later.

          • Altaica

            I know I see guns as a tool to protect myself and to also hunt food for survival. While I do not own a gun, I am for people’s rights to keep and bear arms. I’m not a republican though. But I do sign the anti-gun control petitions and fight for these rights.

            I have also read studies that when conceal carry licenses are more available to the public, crime does go down. It has been demonstrated to be very noticeable. You never know who is carrying a gun, so criminals are more cautious and less likely to make as many bold attacks. Now, I do have to wonder why you are allowed to carry a loaded projectile weapon but not conceal a weapon with a blade longer than 4 inches. This may be due to the availability of blades being more accessible, but I think all arms should be treated equally, as tools for our survival. Those who use the tools as they were designed and intended should not suffer the loss of their rights because some people aren’t able to follow the rules. It has always been my belief that we all have the rights of life, liberty, and the pursuit happiness so long as we do no harm. The moment someone does harm that person should be punished, not everyone.

            We don’t have all our other tools regulated like what is tried with guns. A nail gun is not a weapon, but you can kill someone with it. People have used chainsaws, hammers, crowbars, wrenches, screwdrivers, just about every tool has likely been used in the commission of some crime. It’s not the tool it is the user that needs to be looked at.

            And what that leads to is a reform of our penal system. This is where I am likely going to rile up some people. For one, no criminal deserves a luxury that many hard working American’s can’t afford. No cable in jails. They don’t deserve it, I’m sick of my tax money paying for it. Jail is a punishment, but I think too much is given to criminals. If jail sucked then maybe we’d have a lot less repeat offenders. I’m not advocating torture or starvation, but I do agree with the guy in Arizona’s approach. No AC, live in tents, work. Now that is a prison that sucks, and that’s the point. If it doesn’t feel like a punishment people are just going to go back to what they were doing.

            Prisoners should have to work, even if it is mindless repetitive tasks. Prisoner’s work should be used to pay for their necessities. Any money left over after paying for their food, clothes and shelter should be put into an account that is used to pay reparations to those who they have legally wronged. I personally think that if you steal something you don’t get out of jail until you have paid back your debt (no matter how good you act), i.e. if you stole 500 bucks of stuff, you stay there, work 5, 8 hour shifts, and you do this until that 500 is paid in full. The only segregation in jails should be between violent offenders and non-violent offenders. If you are a child molester you should be in with everyone else. None of this, preferential treatment. Maybe if they were scared for their life the whole time they are there they wouldn’t repeat their crimes.

            Just my thoughts. Some criminals live better than hard working Americans. Shouldn’t a criminal be considered lower than the general public. After all, to end up there they have violated someone else’s rights and broken our laws. On this same note I think it is ridiculous that if a person, trespassing on your property and committing a crime gets hurt that you have to pay for it. No, that is crazy. They were breaking the law and the owner gets punished. That is just a whole other level of BS that gets me riled.

          • Kate8

            karolyn – One more thing. People who think they want to die because they are depressed about life, often feel differently when actually being confronted with the reality of dying. Up until that point it is hypothetical.

            No one values life more than the person who is about to lose it.

          • Old Henry

            Well eddie, I was not referring to getting involved in the ME. I think we should get out of there, and everywhere ilse in the world.

            Cowboys and Muslims is a reference to cleaning house right here, right now. If we do not they will over-run this country as they have in Europe. They breed like rats and live like animals.

          • Gwen

            What? You don’t believe in protecting yourself and family? If someone comes in your house intending to harm your family, with a gun are you going to just watch? Or ask them to wait until you call the police?

        • Altaica

          “Evolution is a theory of ATHEISTS and who are WARMONGERS. People tend to get MORE violent when they don’t believe in God. – “Thou shall not kill.””

          Evolution is a theory of science. Science is not inherently atheistic or religious. Here’s a couple Christian Scientists, The head Abbot Gregor Mendel, Father of Genetics; Robert T. Bakker, paleontologist, evolutionist and Christian Minister, and many other religions, here is an example of just a small list:

          Science does not inherently make people warmongers. I’ve heard of all kinds of wars started over religion and over “Race” Or culture than over science. Science is a tool for understanding, like any tool, used by the wrong people a tool can be turned deadly, but it is no more inherently harmful than the knife you use to butter your toast.

          Wars are started by people, often over territory as justified by their religion or cultural norms. Why do the Isrealites fight with the Palistinians, because after WWII the Isrealites claimed that the land the Palenstinians were on was their land as stated in their religious texts. The Muslims lay the same claim. Who is right and who is wrong? Well that depends on who’s religion you want to prescribe to doesn’t it? History says that the land the ISrealites inhabite first belonged to the Phillistenes. The romans shoved the jewish people there and the Jewish people proceded to wipe the Phillistines off the map. At some point and for some reason the Isrealites left the land, probably the destruction of their temple and wars. Eventually the Palenstinians came to reside there and took their name from the extinct race of the Philistines. Now the Isrealites are back and claim the land is there and what do we have? More war? Over a territorial claim based on religious heritage.

          Now if you are one of those people that think the Isrealites are right in doing this, then I suggest you pack up your things if you have no Native American Heritage and go back to where you came from. The America’s have a very real archeological history that fully supports the Native Americans if they wanted to make the same claims.

          Answer me this, why are 80% of our country’s criminals Christian if having god makes you more moral. There are certainly a lot of people there that violated thou shalt not kill. Or thou shalt not steal.

          Violence begets violence, and if your faith teaches to hate another religion then it only encourages more of that. I don’t think having or not having a religion matters for morals. I think upbringing and societal and cultural norms matter. There are perfectly moral atheists and perfectly amoral Christians.

          • Karolyn

            Thanks, Altaica. I love your posts. Good to “see” you!

          • Bob from SoCal

            Where do you get your statistic that 80% of Americas criminals are Christian? Sounds like hog wash to me. Also, you really should study your middle east history a little better, because you sure are twisting your facts.

          • http://smalltimebiggoverment Linda

            Altaica, Yes there are perfectly moral Christians and Atheist that is not the issue. Just because someone calls himself a Christian or goes to church doesn’t make that a reality. One has to accept Jesus Christ as their savior. As stated in the Bible. Your 80% is really out of thin air or a liberal view of Christianity.

          • Jay

            Altaica , with respect to your understanding of religion, and the Israeli/Palestinian conflict? Anaemic at best! Btw, a typical, standard evaluation/definition of both, religion, and the I/P conflict as regurgitated by an intellectually, sanitized liberal. Surely you don’t believe the drivel you just posted, as having been borne from your own intellect, and not from the indoctrination, and that, from having spent way too much time in the liberal indoctrination facilities, do you? Where revised history is a major, bashing religion will earn you a credit, parroting your professor may earn you recognition, and putting your brain in a jar will guarantee you employment. Don’t you think it’s high time you started thinking outside your little box? Shake off your mental chains, Altaica, and think for yourself!

          • Dan az

            You get a A+ for that!Wow!

          • Nadzieja Batki

            Another Idiot that cannot think properly.

    • Al Sieber

      Dave, I think another one is coming we might get our wish.

      • Old Henry

        I hope not Al. My little girl lives and works in DC (much to my chagrin) as does her fianace. Maybe we can get DaveH to revisit his non-beliefs another way.

        • Kate8

          Al and Old H – Did you happen to view that video that Jay posted yesterday? OMG!!!!

          I keep getting the picture of Yeshau coming in the sky in a blaze of glory, with the sword of truth coming out of His mouth to defeat the armies of satan.

          I have always wondered if that was a literal event, or symbolic. Either way, He defeats the enemy with the TRUTH…isn’t that always the way?

          Well, this series of videos (I’m only at #7) is really blowing me away like nothing ever has!! Want to know B. HUSSEIN Obama’s true bloodline? Along with the bloodlines of ALL OF THE WORLD ELITE LEADERS, and how they connect?

          And guess what? IT’S NOT THE HOUSE OF ROTHSCHILD that is at the top!

          Take the time to watch this series. Someone has gone to a great deal of trouble to do this research, putting together all of the fragmented bits that we’ve been tossed, and coming up with a stunning…shocking…revelation. Actually, many revelations.

          I guarantee your eyes will open like never before.

          • Dan az

            That’s a keeper kate!

          • Karolyn

            Well, I watched part 1 and couldn’t find part 2. Is this supposed to be something secret? I mean all of the royalty of Europe is related, aren’t they? As far as having Mohammed’s blood, so? I have Tatar/Mongol blood because my ancestry is Polish, and my mother’s side of the family has Asian characteristics. Maybe I’m an ancestor of Genghis Khan. What does that mean? The Polish kings came from different countries, as they did in some other countries. Everything was planned so as to have the most power possible.

            Of course it’s interesting, and I will most likely continue to watch; however, what does it prove? The music is a bit dramatic. It reminds me of the music in that Scandanavian mass-murderer’s video.

          • Kate8

            karolyn – That’s a pretty rash judgment to make after watching only the first video.

            I guarantee you it gets better.

            But then, it doesn’t bother me if you skip it. You haven’t shown much of an interest in the truth so far, anyway.

          • Jay

            Kate, i specifically sent that to you because i knew you were one of the few people that would appreciate and understand it! Btw, have you heard of Joye Pugh? She has done extensive research on the “Shroud of Turin”. Her research will reveal the historical significance of the Shroud, and present day application. If you thought that the royal blood line was an eye opener, Joye Pugh’s findings in regards to the Shroud of Turin, will make the hairs on the back of your neck stand up! Ever wonder why princess Diana never pronounced prince William’s full name? She always called him Will. Why? I’ve pasted the podcast from coast to coast with Joye as guest. Find out, and hand on tight…


          • Al Sieber

            Dan, Kate was worried about you because you hadn’t posted in a few days. I told her I thought you were helping some people out because you posted that a while back. I took today off because of the high heat here, 115 degrees today. ain’t worth your life. I’ve only taken 2 days off since Oct..

          • Al Sieber

            Thanks for the link Kate, keep ‘em coming.

          • Kate8

            Jay – I’ve been feeling for a long while that we’ve had this whole Tribulation timeline wrong.

            There is so much evidence that WE are, in conjunction with Europe and many other countries, as well, at least part of the Revived Roman Empire, if not the head of it.

            Our whole nation is frought with Roman symbology, especially DC. Lady Liberty is none other than Columbia, or Mithra (Isis?), and she is everywhere, including a major motion picture corp.

            This Roman symbology is in the Capitol, on courthouses, monuments, and seals everywhere. Here in CA, our state seal is Roman.

            There are Roman names everywhere, too, including many places and streets called “New Rome”.

            This empire seems to be well established. All right under our noses.

            But, the “sword of Truth” is being brandished, and by this shall all abomination to God be overthrown.

          • Old Henry

            Thanks Kate8. I guess I missed it yesterday. It looks quite interesting, but I need to get my speakers, or sound card, fixed as I have not had any audio for about 3 weeks. I saved the link, however.

          • Al Sieber

            Kate and Jay, goggle “understanding the nine veils” Carlucci posted the link yesterday, it will give some insight about how and why people think and why we’re doomed.

          • Old Henry

            Polish kings came from different countries… Sounds like, ah, an American president…

          • Old Henry

            Thanks Jay. I used to listen to that program when it was hosted by the late Art Bell “from the High Desert” several years ago. I can no longer stay awake to listen to it now. I read the intro and saved your link for when I get my speakers working. I also passed both links along to several friends / relatives.

          • Old Henry

            Al, but it’s a dry heat! HA! 115 is 115 and that’s damned hot!

            In July most of the month we had 110 – 117 “heat indexes” with actual temps about 95 / 96. I would get soakin’ wet just sitting in the driveway. Stayed hydrated with Miller Lite,however.

          • Jay

            Old Henry, you can always download the podcasts, and listen to them at your leisure. Here’s where you can access them.


          • Dan az

            Al and Kate
            I was helping a friend from the service days that is now dieing from the agent orange we got into and from the island that they dropped us off on that was radiated and wasn’t cleaned up untill ten yrs later.They didn’t tell us about it I just stumbled across it while on the computer.I just hope that with all the information that I dug up will help him and his family.The only thing that I have been able to give him on the agent orange was that they conceded that we were there and are now going to follow the law suit that was won in 1994.If we live long enough to get the truth out there then I will be happy.

          • Kate8

            Dan az – Are you aware that zeolite powders remove all toxins from your body, including chemicals, heavy metals and radiation? They were used on children who were exposed to Chernobel. And they are completely safe and non-toxic.

            Check them out. Here is a site with good info and the best price.
            They are pretty cheap.


            I believe that the powder is the most effective. The liquids are just a tsp or so of powder in a bottle of purified water…kind of a rip-off.

            Just use a tsp in water 2 or 3 times a day. Worth a try.

            I’m sorry you are dealing with that. God has a remedy for everything on Earth that affects us, and it is always simple.

          • Christin


            As per your 3:12 pm post with the web site: prophesy-ufos-shroud of turin… do you think this is a reputable site and do you know if Joye Pugh has legitimate information???

            I found her thoughts about Prince William strange and don’t think he is cloned from the blood of Jesus… do you?

            I believe they will clone the Anti-Christ… so that after he is shot and probably dies, ‘they’ will pass off his (soul-less) clone who has no gun shot wound and present himself a God, but I can not see this person as Prince Will… what say you?

          • JeffH

            Kate8, I somewhat remember reading and posting something similar quite some time ago. Something to do with the Royal Crown never getting over our fight for independence from England. When I get back from the bay area on Sunday or Monday I’ll see if I can locate the website. I remember that it posed a very strong case of this nature.

          • JeffH

            Here is the 1 hr 30 minute video of THE ROYAL RED DRAGON BLOODLINES

          • Kate8

            Thanks for the site, JeffH.

            Being that the Crown is the home of Freemasonry, and nearly all of our leaders (including our founders) were Freemasons, I’m wondering if we ever actually were free from the British Empire (New Roman Empire).

            From what I’ve gleaned, there was a plan and a purpose for founding America, and it was carefully set up to follow a course. All of the symbolism in our hallowed halls, currency and official documents is Roman. It seems that we were destined from the outset to be New Atlantis, headquarters for the NWO (we were always called the “New World”). Or the new center for the Revived Roman Empire (which I believe has been in existence for centuries already).

            These are my own speculations, but I do feel that things are beginning to come together.

          • Altaica

            That video posed some very interesting theories and correlations I had never thought about. There are of course some statements he made that I don’t wholly agree with, but it was fascinating.

            A thematic connection I made but I don’t know if the video producer realized is the similarities between the story of Nimrod/ Baal that he presented and the Eqyptian story of Isis and Osiris. Set/Seth one of the dark gods of Eqypt fought and killed Osiris. He chopped up Osiris and spread his parts all over the place. His Wife Isis collected all the parts, except his reproductive organs to put him back together and resurrect him. I think in their story the crocs ate them. I’ll have to re-read it, it’s been awhile since I have read them. There are a lot of interesting similarities. I will definitely have to look into both stories and compare and contrast. I need to find my Mesopotamian books and see what is represented in them as well.

            Thanks for sharing the videos. While I do not agree with everything in the videos it did get me thinking about a lot of things that I want to look into now. I watched all 10 that were on youtube.

            The Constantine history and the Nicean council certainly correlates with information I read in the “Encyclopedia of Heretics and Heresies.”

            Some other information about Constantine you might be interested in if you are researching this information. Constantine, like many Romans also worshiped the Persian God, Mithras. Mithras was a sun god. This is a correlation to Apollo. The Roman’s called this Sol Invictus. This translates from the latin to Unconquered Sun.

        • OB1

          There’s a thought, Old Henry! I have tremendous confidence in DaveH. “Seek and ye shall find. Knock and the door shall be opened. Ask, and I shall come in, and I shall sup with you and you with me”. I’ve been thinking about how much I’ve learned in a few months from all of you on these posts, and how much I appreciate it. Humility and wisdom are the fruits of the spirit. I see much of that here as well as in Ron Paul. He doesn’t have to preach it because he has and is living it. Knowledge is great. Applied knowledge is beneficial, wise, and humbling. I suppose that is why the media and the elites are so afraid of Ron Paul. “Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall set you free. Whom he has set free, is free indeed.” Thanks again for all your posts, and for Bob Livingston giving us a forum to speak and learn from others!

          • Kate8

            OB1 – Godspeed, fellow patriot.

            Hope you stick around.

          • Old Henry


            Great post! I too have learned much in just over a year.

            It’s too bad that when TSHTF we will no longer be able to stay in touch, at least physically. Spiritually, howver…. And who knows – the Lord works in mysterious ways.

          • Christin


            That you OB1 Kanobe?!… just teasing.

            Loved your post.

            I have been reading and listening and taking notes since I found Bob Livingston’s Personal LIBERTY site last year. So many posters are very knowledgeable about one thing or another and have much expertise in water storage, electrical, and solar panels… we are all parts of the whole. I have learned SO MUCH from so many of them.

            Thank you OB1 and everyone. God bless.

        • Al Sieber

          Sorry Henry, we could use some of that rain where I live, no rain for 6 months and 115 degrees for 2 weeks. I hope your little girl is okay. I have some family and friends in upstate N.Y. and I worry about them also.

          • Kate8

            Al – That heat sounds dreadful.

            BTW, did you see the video I posted for you yesterday? The one where people in the SoCal desert are being ejected from their land on phoney, trumped up code violations?

            This is Agenda 21, universal coding. It is going to be everywhere, and they don’t like people living off the grid.

          • Kate8
          • Old Henry


            She if okay, but I heard of the quake on the WC right after it occurred and went into a panic as she lives in a basement apt. I could not get thru on my cell or my land line. Her mom finally “got er done”.

            So sorry to hear about your very adverse weather. Are you still “digging holes” in that heat?

          • Dan az

            Don’t let that Al fool ya he likes that kind of heat its sweater whether for him :) I read the article on the desert people and remembered why I left the communist state of kalif.Haven’t stepped in it ever sense. :)

          • Al Sieber

            You’re right Dan, anything below 80 is sweater weather, a few Miller Lites and plenty of water.

          • Kate8

            Dan az – I posted it because it won’t stop here. It is part of Agenda 21 and is worldwide. It is already spreading to other states. They want everyone on the grid, and they want everyone off the remote lands.

            Be watchful, and do what you can to fight.

          • Al Sieber

            Kate, it’s gonna cool down to 106 by Friday. I watched the video about S. Cal. it’s gonna happen all over the country, they don’t want you to be self sufficient. the closes town to me has about 80 people and none of them know where I live. I have 40 acres of mineral property (Panted by the Govt.) you own all rights mineral, water etc. and they are talking about trying to take it, I wonder if that’s what happened in Calif. go to I also lease 480 acres from the Govt., only the minerals rights. small mining is one of the last vestiges of free enterprises and they want to stop that. I have no problems here in Ariz. yet.

          • Kate8

            Al – Where I live, in the Sierra Nevada, the miners up in the remote canyons have been having their mines confiscated.

            It’s amazing how fast things are moving now, and quite under the radar for most folks.

            BTW, there is a huge uprising against Agenda 21 here in CA, and other states, as well. In fact, all over the world. People are getting it.

    • bob wire

      As I was reading this I was thinking, I wonder how Dave is going to weigh in on this one? ~ Humor is good! Wise move.

      Cause and effect is very predictable, especially over short distant and short time.

      Imperfection come into play the longer the distance and time.


      I don’t accept the notion of perfection in the physical world hence accounts for the random factor.

      Like every snow flake is the same but each very different.

      This random factor is the search for perfection, evolving and adapting.

      Time is the limiting factor.

      and time is all you might wish for, given the time, all wrongs might be made right, all disassembled made whole.

      There is only one time that can exist in the same place and at the same time. That time is “now” . We live in the now. “Now” is where you make your past and shape your future.

      To think you life or the world is predestined is to believe in perfection.

      I can’t see it , left only to consider it.

    • 45caliber


      I understand your feeling. However, I’ve always been of the belief that God tries to warn the sinners a few times before the hammer comes down. But I suspect that the ones He’s trying to warn won’t even realize they are being warned.

      • TomP

        I agree. Every time God judged Israel in the OT, it wasn’t a giant thumb that came out of the sky but he used nations around them to bring judgement. AND they were given many years to turn their hearts around. God is very patient but there will come a time when he will say “I’m done”.

    • wandamurline

      There will be more to come…these are just shots across the bow.

      • eddie47d

        Just to get your juices flowing. Could there be a connection to all the fracking going on in this country for that earthquake happening near Washington? Pennsylvania isn’t that far away and they are disturbing allot of cracks in the earth. I also don’t believe God is deliberately causing natural disasters so Christians can gloat about His amazing power.Now that is way too much wishful thinking on the part of the Faithful.

        • Old Henry

          Well eddie, it is not wishful thinking. It is facing reality. God used to do the same thing with the Israelites, and usually with the same success He is having with our nation’s populace.

          • Al Sieber

            Well Henry, God has to do a lot more earth quakes then this to wake people up in this country. this year alone there has been about 48 earthquakes north of me near Lake Meade, I think it has to do with HAARP. “Angels don’t play this Harp”

          • Kate8

            Al – Could very well be HAARP, but there are some who say fracking could also be causing quakes, including this recent one.

      • Kate8

        TomP., 45, Wanda – Watch the videos I posted above, which Jay posted yesterday.

        See if this doesn’t put it all together for you.

        Know the truth, and the truth shall set you free.

    • Dan az

      Now thats Funny!

    • OB1

      DaveH, you started the way this thread started! This is a utube clip from Ron Paul’s book Liberty Defined. This clip is read from Chapter 18 on Evolution vs. Creationism:

      Secondly, his statement of his FAITH. He lives it.

      For today, I choose to stay on the writer of this article’s topic. However, I appreciated your humor as I was born in Washington D.C. very near the capitol…..

    • Scott

      The reason you dont understand and have all these questions is because you dont know GOD, He is the answer to all these questions, God is knocking on your door open it and get to know him personally and you will have almost all the answers you are looking for,

  • Alex

    The way I figure, if folks can blame Katrina on the sin and wickedness of Louisiana, I can blame the earthquake and hurricane on Washington wickedness. It’s like the big guy in the sky is letting them know just how he feels about the way they are driving one nation under God into the dirt.

    But I tend to refrain from stuff like that, at least until Amsterdam gets punished for its prostitution, drugs, satanism, and general moral wickedness. Until they feel the alleged wrath of God, I’ll chalk these natural disasters as exactly that. Natural.

    • Keith

      The ‘small’ differance there is Amsterdam was not founded as a religious nation based on Christian-Judo values so maybe God is not interested in warning them like He might be warning us.

      • BOB

        GOD destroyed everyone on earth except Noah and his family with a flood because of wickedness (homosexuality etc.) HE said the next time he will destroy the earth with fire because of wickedness. Ezechiel 23, verse 25 and Luke 12 verse 49. They laughed at Noah just before they drowned and they are laughing now at the possibility of destruction. GOD is still in control and HE will not be mocked. Eternal torture by fire is reserved for those who mock GOD. (Revelation 20)Why take a chance??

        • Raggs

          Correct BOB….

        • Lost in Paradise

          Now thats a good one BOB! Why take a chance? It just isn’t worth it.

        • Forrest Gump

          Mama always had a way of explaining things so I could understand them.
          And with these solar flare conveyor belts we might not need a nuclear war.

          • Michael J.

            You are not a stupid man.

            Obama is apparently interested and reportedly asked NASA to send a probe to investigate the solar conveyor belt situation when someone said, can’t be done, the probe could not withstand the sun’s heat. Too which Obama replied, “how about if we go at night?”

            BTW, how’s the shrimp business?

          • Old Henry


            LOL! Dats a goodn!

          • Dan az

            Thanks Michael I needed that!

          • Forrest Gump

            The shrimpin’ business is good, but now Lieutenant Dan got me invested in some sort of fruit company and said “now we don’t have to worry about money no more.” I said “That’s good! One less thing!”

            I don’t know what’s gonna happen, but I do know God’s in charge. Come what may, if we trust in Him we can’t go wrong. But remember what Mama said:

            “You gotta do the best with what God gives you.”

          • Al Sieber

            Michael, I believe Obama would of said that.

        • eddie47d

          Okay BOB if the earth will be destroyed by fire by the hand of God then why are some folks blaming other natural disasters as God’s work when there is no future connection.(such as flooding or earthquakes).

          • Dan az

            This will answer all your questions.Its worth the time to watch it trust me!

          • Old Henry


            God is a loving and benefolent God. Did you not try to get your kids attention to correct them while growing up? How about your grandson? Do you not use consequences to guide him on the correct path?

          • TomP

            That is interesting, Eddie. It isn’t the fact that God uses natural events to judge it’s that God knows when and where they will occur. ie Elijah and the Baal prophets , He sent what looked like a lightning bolt, the long day of Joshua, He dropped stones, meteors, on the invaders heads. There are other examples in the OT. I have read one book that had a most interesting theory how these came about. “Catastrophism & the OT” by Patten.

          • Kate8

            Dan az – If you like that one, you MUST watch this one!!

            Sorry everyone. I’m just so blown away by this. Everyone needs to know this stuff. This is truly wake-up material.

            This could make all the difference in how we approach our situation.


          • Dan az

            I got it saved for later and plan on watching all the rest too.I’m low on megs until the 13th so I’m keeping it for later.Thanks ;)

          • Al Sieber

            eddie, it’ll be solar flares.

        • Old Henry

          Very well said BOB, very well said.

      • DonnieB

        This was not and is not a Christian nation. You remember Thomas Jefferson. He tells everyone that your premise is not true.

        For most of man’s history on Earth, just staying alive was difficult. It has only been the last few brief years (man has been around for many 1000′s of years) that it has been anything but keeping wild animals or bugs or germs or other creepy crawlies from killing us.

        Saying it’s magic “God did it” hearkens back to a time when God caused the rain, thunder, earthquakes and all of natural disasters although most in religion today give God credit for the good stuff and mean ole sinful man caused all the bad stuff.

        I tend to agree with the author most of the time but when it comes to “God created the Universe”, asking the question of who created God, well that is sacrilegious. If there was nothing there that meant that there was no God either. Why for example doesn’t the author believe in all the ‘other gods’ that MAN said started it all. Of the 10,000 or so gods that we ‘know’ about I only believe in one less god than him.

        • Old Henry


          God had no beginning, and has no end.

          As humans we can understand something never ending, but we cannot fathom something haveing no beginning. As true believers we simply accept it as a small child.

          Due in part to the easy life we have been able to create thru technolotgy we have become arogant and think we no longer need God as we can do it on our own.

          • DonnieB

            If God has no beginning and no end then why can’t the Universe be the same without the need to have a god at all? Still I didn’t hear why all them other gods are wrong and only yours is correct.

            I do agree with a fair amount of your (and others here), political opinions. Further, I would say many atheists are liberals, I am not. Many are Socialist, tree hugging environmentalist and other Utopian wishful thinkers.

          • Kate8

            Donnie – There is only one GOD, Divine Matrix, timeless and All in All. I AM THAT I AM.

            However, there are many gods, creator gods, who are probably advanced beings capable of planetary travel. When you realize that man is now capable of genetic manipulation, it’s not much of a stretch to the idea that Earth was somehow star-seeded and that we are all products of genetic engineering.

            As for time…that is a physical construct, marked by cosmic cycles for producing linear reality. Outside of linear existence, time does not exist.

            When it comes to the Divine, our minds are not capable of formulating the right questions, so we never get the answers we seek.

            I refer you to a link posted yesterday by Carlucci. I think I scared some people off by putting a somewhat religious spin on it, but that was strictly my interpretation.

            Here it is again:


            Happy hunting.

          • Dan az

            Really good stuff another keeper!Did you check out the haarp?

          • Kate8

            Dan az – I must have missed that one. There are so many.

            Did you post it? Yesterday?

          • Dan az

            No it was at the end of the one you posted for the nine vails on the right side at the bottom.More articles and good ones to boot.

          • Altaica


            I think it is interesting you mentioned advanced beings. That same terminology is in the book I am reading. Gods, Genes and Consciousness: nonhuman intervention in human history. The book has been very interesting. Have you read similar books?

          • Kate8

            Altaica – This idea has been around forever.

            Back in the 60s or 70s, there was a book by a renouned Danish author (can’t think of his name) who wrote a book called “Chariots of the Gods”, and he posed a very credible case for the extraterrestrial roots of Earth.

            I have since read hundreds of books on the subject, and I have no doubt that the universe is an intelligent, precisely designed body, interactive and energetically connected…by numerous energy grids. Just like our own bodies are made up of many differing parts, but all connect to a “matrix” and to each other, and in constant communication, whether we are aware of it or not.

            We are infants in the universe. The more we discover, the less we reaize that we know.

          • Altaica

            I think Chariots of the Gods is by Van Dannikan. I haven’t read that one, but I do want to. I certainly do believe there are other sentient life forms besides us. I find the correlations presented in the book I have been reading very interesting.

      • Brad


        That was exactly my thought when I read Alex’s reply. One nation under GOD my friend.

        • mark

          The phrase “under God” phrase was added to the Pledge of Allegiance and also put on U.S. coins in 1954 by the Congress as part of the Cold War religious crusade against “Godless Communism.” This was pushed by the Knights of Columbus. Prior to 1954 it was not in the Pledge or on any U.S. coins for that matter. This is a fairly recent development very much linked to officials seeking national unity during the most dangerous phase of the Cold War.

    • Karolyn

      What’s wrong with prostitution and drugs? They should be legalized here!

      • TheRealBob

        Karolyn: Every time you post you show just how stupid and evil you are.

        • Karolyn

          In YOUR “humble” opinion, Bob. :-)

          • bob wire

            I understand the thrust of you statement Karolyn and it’s merits.

            Why protect people for themselves as it’s becomes a full time job and interferes with other peoples lives.

            Allow them to move on and be done, enjoy the harvest of their folly.

            I think the thought is, ~ they might be worth saving and the interference unavoidable either way.

            Where is the line? To do or not do?

            Your right hemisphere is shining through this morning. ☺

          • Karolyn

            bob – To try to help those who don’t want help is futile, enabling, and, at times, self-serving, as well as exhausting. Let them live the way they want.

            Just think of all he money that could be saved and made if drugs and prostitution were legalized! And not just money but lives saved.

          • Nebraskadave

            Karlyn, I think you’re cool, I like you, and I’m probably one of a few thousand who like you. Don’t listen to crazies; you’re posting is well thought out!

          • Karolyn

            Thanks, nebraskadave. It’s always nice to find somebody new who agrees with me! (especially on this site!)

          • Kate8

            So, karolyn, you believe that society should be without constraints.

            While that might sound very tolerant and libertarian, it just isn’t conducive to a moral and ethical mindset.

            Actually, these things are, in essence, legal, as in they are rarely prosecuted these days. We all know that there is an agenda behind the drug wars… well, several agendas involving borders, universal ID and huge payoffs to our elected officials…but I digress.

            Anyway, we are in the state we’re in because of a move to a no-holds-barred society, where all manner of depravity is not only tolerated but elevated to moral equivalence.

            “Woe, woe, woe unto those who call good evil, and evil good…”

            But then, this is what we know to expect from the liberal mind.

          • Karolyn

            Kate – I don’t know where you get that “no holds barred” idea. I don’t know anyone who thinks that way. There has to be some regulation. As a libertarian, are you not for the legalization of drugs and prostitution? Laws will never stop either, but legalization can make them manageable – and profitable for the government as well. I know you are for less government.

          • Kate8

            karolyn – While I agree with much of the Libertarian position, I am primarily conservative.

            I do believe in less government, to be sure. But I also believe that communities should be able to establish their own ordinances regarding certain businesses which tend to attract a sleeze factor, degrading the whole community. I’m speaking of things like cat houses, tatoo parlors, gambling establishments, porn shops…

            In my town, we’ve had a moratorium on the adult media stores (you can get stuff in the back room of the video store if you want it), but the government has said that they have a right to exist, so after this year we have to allow them. I live in an older section of town, with much commercial zoning, so they will, no doubt, be coming to a location near me. Yuch.

            The point is, these are people coming from other places to impose their will and sleeze on us, changing the nature of our community. No one wants to live near them. Already, in the next town, the tattoo parlor has caused the deterioration of the area.

            It makes me sick.

            I do believe that a certain standard of decency is good for everyone, and it helps instill good values in children. It’s not healthy for them to have all this degenerate activity thrown in their faces. In today’s world, if someone wants that stuff, they can seek it out. It doesn’t need to create an eyesore that many find offensive.

          • Karolyn

            Kate – I have seen this happen over the years; and as a result many towns adopt new ordinances for those particular types of businesses, relegating them to a certain area of town.

            Theres a town near where I grew up in NJ that was known for its topless bars and bars in general. It is a blue collar town that grew up around one industry and was comprised of Polish-Americans who were very religious and moral people. I haven’t been there since I moved down here, but the last I heard that town was still a moral, middle class town with little crime despite the bars. BTW – There was no drinking in the topless joints. That’s against the law.

            I still maintain my stand behind the fact that more sexually permissive countries have less sex crime. That is a documented fact. And that’s not to say that everyone runs around screwing everyone. They just view sex with a more healthy attitude and aren’t repressed. Logically thinking, that might mean there is less repressed anger and rage, which is what rape is all about anyway. I haven’t heard any exposes about the children in France and Germany being especially delinquent or immoral. Have you? Hey, I may be wrong…. I certainly know neither I nor anyone else has all the answers.

          • eddie47d

            I’d like to see some rules/regulations to keep Wall Street from screwing us and our economy.They know all about extortion and prostitution.

        • Average Joe

          When you make statements such as this, I have to wonder if you left ut an “O” in your name.
          Who is responsible for your life? Who is reponsible for your actions (Good, bad or indifferent)?When you die and go to meet your maker, who will answer for your sins? In all of the above questions, the answer is YOU…and nobody else. So, if we are all reponsible for ourselves, what gives you, me or anyone the right to enforce yours or our beliefs and morals on someone else? The answer of course is….we don’t have that right…period. What we do with our own bodies (so long as we don’t infringe upon anothers rights) is perfectly within our rights to do. If you, me or anyone else does not like certain activities….don’t participate in those activities…..but do not…I repeat…do not try to enforce your morals on anyone other than yourself, you don’t have that right and neither does anyone else.
          The problem as I see it is that too many people (like you) firmly believe (wrongly) that somehow it is their right and responsibility to enforce their morals and beliefs on everyone else. The key is to learn to mind your own business and let everyone else do the same…worry about your own life and family and let others do the same. I am responsible for my actions and you are responsible for yours….learn this….file it in your memory banks and refer to it often.
          So long as they do not infringe upon your rights, it is none of your business…period.

          A man sooner or later discovers that he is the master-gardener of his soul, the director of his life.
          James Allen

          The shoe that fits one person pinches another; there is no recipe for living that suits all cases.
          Carl Jung

        • mark

          Karolyn isn’t stupid or evil. She is simply posting her opinion on a subject.

          • professor

            You mean, “simple-minded!”

          • bob wire

            No Professor ! Not simple at all. But willing to make a decision to not interfere.

            Kate8 says:
            August 30, 2011 at 1:27 pm

            So, karolyn, you believe that society should be without constraints.

            and no again! That not what she suggested, ~ she is offering you the question; at what point should government interfere to protect people from themselves?

            If they be Hell bound, they make others an enabler. Prostitution is one of the oldest profession know today. ~ and people have always enjoyed altered reality in it endless forms.

            If it could have be stopped, it would have happened by now don’t you think? Laws is what makes criminals. Some makes sense and some don’t. Why have laws that do not work and you can’t enforce? If you what to control something government need only to tax it like they do everything else.

            This is what Karolyn is saying and it’s not simple minded but dead on the button.

            It is you sense of morality that prevents you from coming to the same conclusion.

            You are most willing to tax only certain “sin” for a price.

            In truth we are all whores, it’s just a question of price.

            So remove Liquor, gambling, and tobacco tax and stand before us without sin or offer the notion consideration.

        • Old Henry


          Karolyn’s position is also Ron Paul’s position.

          • Kate8

            Old H – Good point. But I suspect it is because he knows it is an issue that should be left to the states, along with many others. He is against the Feds overstepping and intruding into state sovereignty.

            I must admit that, in today’s climate of mass deception, I am troubled by Paul’s membership in the Freemasons, making him a brother to the rest of the NWO pack.

        • RiverRobb


          Doesn’t it say in the bible that you can sell your daughter into servitude? That you can sell her into marriage? Isn’t that a form of prostitution? I mean someone is getting service in one way or another and they are receiving money for it, right? Seems to me that is the quintessential definition of prostitution and yet you condemn it? Just funny. And where does it say drugs are bad? I haven’t found that anywhere. Wasn’t it monks who discovered fermentation? You can bring God-given ingredients together; water, hops, barley, sugar and yeast, to create beer and other alcohol and that’s okay, but God forbids you to smoke a joint? To alter your consciousness in any other way? Seems to me like there’s a world of double standards here. Let nature work, it does so every time.

          • Kate8

            River – It actually does condemn drunkenness and drug usage.

            Where it commonly says, ‘They would not repent of their sorcery’, the proper translation for sorcery is ‘pharmakopaea’, or drug use.

          • Nadzieja Batki

            Just because people can do certain misdeeds does not mean that they should. If we are a nation of INDIVIDUALS, we treat each other as such. Prostitution is a form of using and abusing and manipulating another human being to get what you want. Someone always gets shafted.
            If humans cannot control their basest behaviors, there will be laws enacted by governments to control those behaviors. Making excuses because someone does not like the laws will not stop the laws but then law breakers do not normally want to be law abiding. If we had no laws, human existance would be impossible because of human predators.

          • bob wire

            “Kate8 says:
            August 30, 2011 at 4:34 pm

            River – It actually does condemn drunkenness and drug usage.”

            I believe it condemn bearing false witness as well.

          • bob wire

            “The unmistakable miracle recorded in John 2: 1-11 is of great importance for several reasons. This miracle of Jesus turning the water into wine was Jesus’ first miracle (Jn. 2: 11). This initial miracle prepared Jesus’ disciples for the great work they were to do.”

            Yepper, I bet it did !

          • Kate8

            bw – Indeed it does.

            And your point?

            I could also suggest you rethink your accusations of the TeaParty in that context.


      • SJvet

        Right, along with murder, armed robbery, extortion, and all other crimes. That’s not a world most people want to live in.

      • Lost in Paradise

        Well Karolyn do you have all day to read my answer? Anyway, if you need to ask it would evidently do no good to tell you, as you would not understand.

        • Thinking About

          You are a prime example of needing explanations Lost.

      • 45caliber


        I’m surprised. Considering what you have said about the problems you have had with drugs, I’d have thought you would prefer to keep others from the same fate.

        • Karolyn

          45 – No one can keep anybody from doing what they want to do. I have lost people to drugs and alcohol; and nothing anybody would have done would have changed them. Drugs and alcohol will always be used. I believe that man has gotten high ever sice he chewed that first leaf and liked how it felt. There will always be those who want to be high all the time. Maybe some day they will figure out why. Personally, I believe it’s because they are disconnected from their true selves and can’t handle life.

          • Dan az

            I agree with you.

          • 45caliber


            I also agree. I think the real reason most take drugs is because they can’t handle life. But I don’t believe I should be forced via taxes to take care of them.

      • DaveH

        Well, I think there is plenty wrong with both, Karolyn, especially drug usage (including alcohol).
        But should victimless crimes be a matter of Criminalization. NO. It is not our business to protect people from themselves. Government should not be allowed to punish people for things they do to themselves. By allowing Government to become involved we have opened Pandora’s box to the Leviathan Government we have today. Of course the leaders are happy to grow Government to solve every petty fear we have. They jump at the chance to grow their power and perks at OUR expense. But, as everybody who pays attention knows, the Government isn’t very good at solving ANYTHING!
        They have used the Drugs Wars as an excuse to confiscate peoples’ property (forfeiture laws), trample our 4th Amendment rights, kill many innocent victims, and cost the taxpayers tens of billions of dollars every year. It’s been 40 long years now. Has the War been won? Of course not, and it never will be. All they’ve managed to do is to drive the price of drugs sky high so that the losers who do drugs have had to resort to crime to pay for their habits, and in the process enrich the worst segment of society — those who choose to be Drug Lords.
        It’s time to get Smart, like Portugal did 10 years ago:

        • eddie47d

          Thank you Dave H.good post.

        • Kate8

          DaveH – While I agree on principle, these activities aren’t always victimless.

          Many people are killed or maimed by people who try to navigate life in a state of drug impairment. Not to mention the snowball effect of all those near and dear who suffer immeasurably.

          Perhaps there should be guidelines for their use, and situations where they would be illegal to use. But then again, someone under the influence isn’t likely to worry about guidelines.

          • Karolyn

            Kate – The point is that you cannot legislate a psychological or mental disorder, which is what addiction is. Why shouldn’t prostitution be legal? In countries where it is legal and sex is not so taboo, there is less sex crime.

          • Kate8

            karolyn – Sorry, but I do not believe that is true.

            All I’m saying is that there are ramifications not being considered here.

            There was a time when prositution was legal, and it proved devastating to many. When it’s considered a-okay to cheat on your wife at the cat-house, marriages fall apart. Just look at the devastation wreaked on marriages now, with the rampant pornography addictions.

            I believe that legitimizing these types of businesses is just another step in the degradation of our humanity, relegating us to little more than animals who are enslaved to their lusts.

            BTW, Jay had a great article on how the Left succeeds by making everything about sex. It was a good one, and true.


          • Kate8

            And then such ideas always lead to this:


            Throughout history, degrading, declining societies always begin to legitimize immorality, including the acceptance of pedophilia. Children lose value as human beings to be protected at all costs, and are left to the mercies of those who prey on them. And, this devaluation of children begins with people destroying their own offspring for their convenience.

          • Karolyn

            Prostitution, like drugs, will go on whether it is legislated against or not; and I don’t think every man would immediately run out and get a hooker if it was legalized, just like there won’t be a stampede when drugs are legalized. There are people who do and people who don’t no matter what the legal climate.

          • DaveH

            If a man is going to cheat on his wife, he doesn’t need a prostitute to do that. In fact, his wife would be better off if he did use a prostitute since it is more likely to result in relation-damaging feelings with a non-prostitute than with the prostitute.
            Prostitutes are more likely to get STDs treated. Non-prostitutes, who are ashamed of their sexual escapades, are much more likely to avoid detection and treatment thus passing the STD onto others.
            The crimes that are attributed to legalized prostitution — child enslavement, abuse of prostitutes, etc. occur whether prostitution is legal or not. And as far as the abuse goes, whether or not to incur that risk should be solely the choice of the prostitute, nobody else.
            Above all, it is legal for a man to have sex with a woman if no money changes hands. What’s up with that? If something is immoral, it is immoral whether money is traded or not.
            See Chapter 1:

          • Nadzieja Batki

            Good post Kate8. Thank you.

        • DaveH

          You’re talking about trespassing on the bodies and property of other people. Those acts have always been crimes, sober or not.

          • Nadzieja Batki

            Dave, Karolyn believes it is acceptable behavior to be predacious and to treat another human being as a prey animal.

          • Karolyn

            Nadzieja – How do you DARE to know that I believe any such thing? You will go to any lengths to try to discredit another, including placing your perceived characteristics on them. You just don’t like me, so you will take any chance you get to find something to say. It’s really sad and makes me chuckle.

      • professor

        Karolyn sounds like she is ready to “go into business!”

        • professor

          Maybe, she is already in “business!”

      • coal miner


        I agree!

      • Altaica

        I think there is some merit in legalizing both. The biggest merit would be tax revenue. I mean alcohol is perfectly legal and causes a hell of a lot of problems, but we have it. Prohibition didn’t work so well, made more crime. So if it is legalized they make money off it. I think there needs to be some rules in place. I know a bit about how the German’s run theirs having had a friend stationed in Stuttgart for years. I’d ask her a lot of questions about stuff out there. Turns out that prostitution is a viable career there, but that they also strictly utilize protection and health screenings.

        I don’t think it will completely eliminate the crime factor in some aspects, because there is crime associated with everything. Some people will want to get around the taxes, but I know a lot of the German run facilities are actually kept to a higher hygiene and professional standard then some of our businesses. I think it really depends on how it is handled, run and the business ethics that go into it as to how things happen.

        Certainly if they were to legalize it, there would have to be a determination by state and local officials whether they want to allow it in their area. We really don’t know how it will affect things until we try it and compare numbers. I know Nevada makes a lot of money off it is, and there are the higher class “Cat houses” and then there are the ones you call and they come to your door. And the advertisers of the later have no shame either. It doesn’t matter if you’re male or female they try and give em too you. They kept handing them to me and I kept throwing them in the trash.

        Ultimately the people have the choice whether or not to indulge in an activity, legal or otherwise.

        These same policies go for drugs. IF we treat them like any other drug and regulate them and tax them like Alcohol and booze even on a trial period, as long as we keep the government from stealing the money I bet we could erase a good portion of our debt. Hell if it is an imported drug it can be taxed even more! They have tons of the confiscated drugs in their warehouses right now, just imagine how much revenue could be made. They can force people to have a license to deal and if they don’t confiscate then sell it themselves for huge profit. Hmmm.

        I don’t know how all this will work, we would have to try it and “tweak” it to see. I think marijuana would be a good place to start. It’s natural, easy to grow and everywhere. Some say it makes people less ambitious, I know some politicians and big business people that we should try it on, some people need a little less ambition to screw us over.

        I think we should try it, and all the profits should go purely to paying on the principle of our debt. I think it would make for an interesting experiment. If it proves to be worth it we could keep it. I mean, the people that want it are going to do it anyway, why not cash in on it?

    • George

      Of course ‘natural disasters’ are precisely that, viz. natural. I happen to think that they are also predetermined (as is the fact that I am writing this). That doesn’t mean that God is not speaking to us through these disasters though I hesitate to say that someone such as Pat Robertson or any other person is correct in saying that they are the result of the violation of some divine ‘no-no.’ It may be that what God is saying is that we ought to take some very wise precautions and not risk our lives and property unnecessarily (or yet again something else). I’m simply not confident in any one person having the one and only answer to that question. Of course, since I’m a Calvinist you would expect me to come down on the side of predestination.

      • Marie1

        What language is God speaking?

    • 45caliber


      Amsterdam seems to be listening to something. They are changing up many of their laws on drugs, etc. now.

      • Average Joe

        Actually, Amsterdam decided (by vote) not to enforce the new Dutch mandate that took away the use of certain drugs from foreigners and tourists. So, Amsterdam will continue with the same policies that have been in effect for years…the issue will be revisted in 5 years…until then, in Amsterdam…it’s business as usual.

  • http://donthaveone Beberoni

    I kind of see it that way also Alex, except that I believe that those who believe are held by God as His children, responsible for their actions. Much like our earthly fathers would punish us when we did wrong, but they dont punish the neighbors kid, because they are not theirs. In accepting Jesus Christ as our saviour, we are now held accountable for our actions, whereas those in the darkness are exactly that, in the darkness without God’s light. And people have this misconception that God smacks us down with punishment. Really? I remember growing up, that my dad punished me for doing wrong, and he did it out of love to teach me the right way. I needed that discipline, and he gave it to me, and it shaped me into the person I have become. And he did it because he loved me, not to “put the smack down” on me. How much more so our Heavenly Father? As it is written, “He who hates discipline, hates his life”. Without it, were a lost mess, such as the mess in Amsterdam. But there will be a day coming when God does administer his wrath, and those who have rejected Him, will feel the burden of it. Thats just the way it is. Some may laugh now, but in the end, the laughing for them will be halted.

  • Al Sieber

    Good article Mr. Ringer, I don’t believe everything on earth is random, I think Haarp had something to do with it.

    • Dan az

      Hey Al
      Where ever there is an action there is always a counter reaction.My sentiments exactly.Did you watch that movie that kate posted?Outstanding!

      • Al Sieber

        How are you Dan? yes I did, good link by Kate.

        • Dan az

          Hey Al

          • Al Sieber

            I’d probably be wearing a overcoat over there.

  • dan

    …sometimes a natural disaster is just a natural disaster . I keep waiting for that giant Monty Python foot to stomp DC, but I suspect
    that if we all got what we deserved…

  • Iris

    On an individual basis, I can understand that bad outcomes occur to anyone who does stupid stuff, obviously asking for it! On the other hand when an entire community does stupid stuff, I am forever unsurprised when an act of God gives them a slap across the face.

    Are we surprised that Florida got off scott free? They have been turning conservative for awhile. Isn’t it a little odd that the most liberal of the eastern seaboard got whacked so unexpectedly? Vermont!



    • eddie47d

      Is that why all those fires and drought have hit Texas because they are so Conservative and Christian? or those tornadoes hit Alabama because that Christian state deserved it? Your analogy sucks as bad as mine if you can comprehend the drift.

  • Karolyn

    The energy put out by the collective consciousness has more to do with the weather and natural disasters than you think. The more negative energy is put out, the worse the resulting circumstances. Everything is connected. Everything IS energy. That’s why we never die. It’s all very logical.

    • Michael J.

      Wow, those Japanese folks sure must have a lot of negative energy.

      Nah, can’t be true, otherwise my mother in law would be six feet under.

      • Jeep

        You know, China tops the list of deadliest natural disasters in the last hundred years. Obviously they have lots of negative waves! Heck, the Indonesian tsunami comes in only at number six with about 210,000 dead. Maybe the negative waves there were not so bad…

        • Altaica

          Maybe it’s Karma kicking in for taking over Tibet and kicking the Tibetan Buddhists out of their land?

  • Henry Ledbetter

    I would recommend reading Romans 1:18 and then go to 2 Chronicles 7:13. Please read and study the context in light of what is happening in the nation and our world. Not even a sparrow falls to the ground that God does not know about it and He knows every hair on every head, regardless of whether you believe in Him or not. The evidence of a world wide flood is all around us but most have a hard. time accepting the fact that a loving God would kill the entire world population except for eight people. He knew that when sin is conceived it brings forth death and the sin was so ingrained in them that they would not repent. How has things gone since we kicked kicked God out??? Amsterdam was never a Christian nation but america was. “To whom much is given, then much is due.”

    • bob wire

      Well, not really Henry. It is true America was originally settled predominantly by Puritan and Puritan influence but by 1776 many other people from many nations had arrived. Some were fleeing religious persecution, some from the law, some had simply out worn their welcome elsewhere. The only common thread was the search for a new life but installing Christianity held no clear mandate.

      It is true that the church house was considered the center of social life at this point in history as the printed word was exciting news to all. And it was from these various congregations of churches where our leaders most often rose from. Any person that aspired to politics needed votes and recondition. The church house afford this in numbers large enough to make it happen. So in that sense, Yes! we are a Christan nation conceived in Christian values as elected leaders accepted political positions.

      But in drafting the Constitution, references to God name was used in generic terms.

      As I understand it, America is one of the few nations without a national religion.

      Today, it seems clear that many feel the need to proclaim Christianity and reintroduce it into political discourse. Suggesting we have become Godless and lost our way.

      If we might consider how the last openly and outspoken Christian president was treated while the halls of government became dysfunctional in the process,how political discourse failed to bear quality harvest, how Americans continued to bath in decadence while claiming to be Christians.

      I simply don’t see Christianity imposed into government as a silver bullet correct’all then or now.

      These self proclaimed Christians that I see running for office today are barely worth the shot to put them down as they make a Circus Act out of their Christianity. I find it reprehensible and disgusting to commerce in the name of the All Mighty. That’s never been what the life of Christ was about.

      If you know of a good Christian, worthy your support and willing to serve the people, run them for office. But don’t run on the coattails of Christ and expect my vote.

      America is filled today with too many different races, creeds and persuasions to attempt to shovel Christ down their throats.

      We long since grown past the point where that might be possible and be sustained for any length of time without trouble in the streets.

      • Dan az

        one word DEEP!

        • Average Joe

          That’s 3 words and a name :)

          • Dan az


      • Altaica

        Kind of makes me think of a bumper sticker I saw on a car, “The last time people mixed religion and politics people got burned at the stake.”

  • Tom

    Random does not mean arbitrary.

    Though an event may APPEAR random at the level at which we live and from where we observe, the active rules at the quantum level are rigidly defined by the laws of nature. So, who or what created the laws of nature? I believe your guess is as good as mine but then I also believe that my guess is as good as yours.

    There is a reality and there is just one version of reality. Reality is what it is. A truth is what it is. Each truth is a part of the whole truth. The sum of all truths is equal to the one reality.

    When we or our institutions–including our governments–try to cause something to happen that is in conflict with those laws of nature that we call the laws of physics we then get what the kleptoparasites in Washington call “The law of unintended negative consequences.”

    A socialistic government is in conflict with those laws of physics that prevent us having processes and systems that can operate with the properties and characteristics of a perpetual motion machine.

    Be concerned about offending Mother Nature but remain aware that when you mess with Father Time you can get your clock stopped!

    • BOB

      If there is no GOD and evolution came about by the big bang, then who created the atoms etc. necessary to create the big bang??

      • Karolyn

        There is no “who.” There is energy and universal intelligence.

        • bob wire

          Making illusions of a deity is less whom and more “what”

          When you finally shed your human form the view becomes much clearer.

          Send us a post card Bob.

        • Nadzieja Batki

          Where did the energy and universal intelligence come from?

          • bob wire

            The Divine from the void. Next question.

          • Kate8

            bw – Cleared that one right up, didn’tcha?

          • Altaica

            Conservation of Energy Law: Energy can neither be created nor destroyed, only transformed. Therefore Energy must have always existed and will always exist. Everything has energy in some form, we are all parts of the same system.

            This very simple fact, if more people looked at it, I think could help create a lot of understanding. The Great Spirit/ Divine Creative Energy/ Divine Spark. For me this is the answer. Energy was given to all things, the shared energy from the Energy. Energy follows patterns, manifests in different forms and ways, and exists everywhere.

            I think the answer to the God/ or any deity’s existence is staring all of us right in the face in a very simple, provable scientific law. I think the Great Spirit/ The Creator is the Energy. By the Energy transforming itself over billions of years, and sharing of itself, all of our wonderful varied lives are possible.

            Why are there so many paths and variants? Because we all do not experience things the same. I believe when I die my body will be transformed and returned to the soil and my energy will return to the creator and if I choose to want to experience more things I will return with a new body.

            Just my view, it is up to each and everyone to choose their own path.

      • American Conserative

        Big Bang – GOD spoke, let there be…

        • eddie47d

          Some question the Big Bang and some question God and they are fair questions. Who created God. Who were his “parents”? Where did he come from? We will never know the answer and there will be far more wrong answers than right answers no matter how hard we try.

          • bob wire

            The Divine came from the void before time and always was and always will be Eddie.

    • 45caliber


      But too many people want to dismiss any evidence that doesn’t fit their own little theory of what is and what is not.

    • Altaica

      All I know is that energy can neither be created nor destroyed, only transformed. So it stands to reason that energy has always been and always will be.

  • JC Thomas

    Just a heads up for all those who think that God is too tolerant with his creation or slack in dealing out the wrath that we all so rightly deserve. If what the Bible asserts is true then absolutely no one “gets away” with anything because in the end, each one of us will pass away and then receive Gods judgement. Each of us has an inescapable appointment with death and this should be a sobering reminder about who is actually in control! Food for thought.

    • American Conserative

      GOD is NOT tolerant! He allows. GOD gave the Earth to man (male/female) to have dominion over. The moment Adam bite into the fruit which GOD forbid, he lost dominion over the Earth and turned it over to the god of this world – Satan. GOD allows Satan to rule this Earth and evil abounds because Satan comes to destroy through any means available. GOD has provided a way of escape to everyone who believes the record GOD gave of his SON:Jesus the Christ and repents and confesses his/her sin and ask GOD for forgiveness. Male/female is GOD’s creation; but, not all are GOD’s children. GOD’s children are those whose name is written in GOD the SON’s book of Life. Natural disasters are determined upon the Earth and will grow in intensity as with a woman’s labor pains during child birth. Male/female hearts fail them for looking after those things that are comming upon the Earth. This means their resolve as well as the physical heart failing. As GOD at the time appointed sent CHRIST JESUS, GOD the SON into the world to save the world has appointed a time to judge the world by JESUS CHRIST the Righeous and as we see the day approaching – what kind of person/people should we be?. Even so come LORD JESUS!!!

      • Karolyn

        We are ALL sons of God. We are ALL ONE with everything. Everything is energy! It’s all really an illusion. How can the Bible be any more right than any other religion’s claims? It’s all in the perspective of the viewer. As Altaica posted on another discussion, her religion is 60,000 years old. Christianity is a lot younger than that! How can you say yours is right and hers is wrong?

        • Average Joe

          The truth of the matter is quite simple:

          Religion… beauty…is in the eye of the beholder.

          I saw a film documentary a few years ago that offered some very thought provoking questions concerning the story of Jesus. The film is called: “Did Jesus Die?”. It offered up three different scenarios concerning the life and death of Jesus. If you can find a copy of it, I strongly urge everyone to see it as it is very thought provoking and may change the way that you think…I know that it changed my thought processes in a big way concerning the Bibilcal version of events ( it did not dispute the Bible version, but looked at the story from different perspectives). I just found it free online and am posting the link:


          In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.
          Douglas Adams

          The universe never did make sense; I suspect it was built on government contract.
          Robert A. Heinlein

          • Average Joe

            BTW, scenario 3# seems to be the most plausible to me.

          • Karolyn

            “Religion… beauty…is in the eye of the beholder.” – No truer words have been said, Joe!

          • Kate8

            It would seem that religion (all of them) was created by man to keep humanity in a state of deception and/or confusion.

            Beliefs have a way of impeding our quest for TRUTH.

        • bob wire

          Religion is academic and only relevant to the Divine in showing the way to knowledge, closing the gestalt “making whole”. There is many other ways to obtain this knowledge as nature it’s self is an excellent teacher to receptive students with an open inquiring mind.

          Christianity has made Jesus it’s focus and for good reason, the history accounting affords us a large body of his work. He was but one of several later teachers inspired by the Divine that delivered the same message again and again.

          It is religion that is responsible for the variations in the message and not the teachers.

          What is the overriding message?

          Love your enemies as yourself is perhaps the most ignored and most difficult to comply with.

          If you can clear that bar, the rest of the “message” is a snap.

          We fail this commandment miserably absorbed in self ego and vanity.

          So then we must learn “Humility” ~ we don’t have much of that either.

          Humility or being humble is greatly misunderstood and it requires great strength to be “not proud”. It goes against man nature to be humble. Allow me to ask you, if you were God, the creator of all things, what is the need for pride? If you are a creation of the Divine, what is the need for pride? ~ ? There is no need for pride, Grateful perhaps but pride is unnecessary. Pride and ego are the two side of the same coin.

          It’s a full time “life study” requiring commitment, perseverance and mental discipline. It’s impossible to just be a Christian, you practice to be one and we all fall short everyday. (some more then others)

          a Buddhist or Hindu has much the same journey inward and required the same dedication.

          But the search is inward, don’t waste time looking outside yourself.

        • coal miner

          Karolyn and Average Joe

          How the universe bagan.
          According to the theory, for the first thousand … no gravity waves should exist from before the time the universe … greater than 1 TeV would give this theory weight.

          • Average Joe

            coal miner,

            “According to the theory”

            Therein lies the flaw in your post “theory”…is just that…it isn’t proven….and therefore has no validity or basis…. in “FACT”. Remember….there used to be a theory that the world is flat….how did that work out?

    • Rusticus

      Fortunately for all of us, the bible is simply a bunch of stories put together by a bunch of middle eastern mystics who had been out in the sun too long. There may be a few bits of historical fact but mainly it’s crap.

      This is indeed fortunate because the god described in the old testament is a narcissistic genocidal psychopath. The philosophy in the new testament is much more rational and loving which is why it is rejected by right wing fundamentalist Xtians in favor of the psychopathology of the old testament.

      • coal miner

        No part of the Bible is loving;the old and new testament are both astrological myths and their stories are based on brutality,slavery and down right lies.

        Aug 12, 2011 … If Adam is mythical, then the Bible is incorrect, not inerrant. … characters such as Adam and Eve, Satan, Noah, Abraham, Moses, Joshua, King David, … of his time, and that extensive biographical material would be available. …

        • Kate8

          coal – That presents one take on the similarities in creation stories of different cultures but, by no means, the only one.

          “Planet X and the End of the Age” is a very scholarly, well researched and thought out treatise on the roots of these stories, going into the various cultural “spins” placed on them.

          They are similar because they record the story of creation in symbolic form, per their own understanding. When they speak of gods and goddesses who are chopped up and made into varying parts of the cosmos, the understanding was not meant to be literal. It was to create a picture, in “right brain” symbology, if you will…meant to demonstrate the forces at work.

          Many will use cultural spins to discredit this idea or that, but that simply demonstrates their complete lack of understanding.

      • coal miner


        Apr 13, 2009 … It is recorded that Zeus is both the father and great-great- great grandfather of …. I have read much on Egyptian and Persian mythology, yet I don’t recall … different between Krishna and Jesus Christ than there are similarities. … -

    • Marie1

      The Bible was written by “men” not a God

      • coal miner


        (Kramer, Sumerian Mythology 58). Questions: 1. Compare / contrast this story of water and fertility with the story of Adam and Eve. In what ways is Eve like … -

  • Rexford

    Interesting analogy. My view point is that ” Katrina” was more a man made disaster with a lot of help from from a lot of unsavory charactors.
    Irene is part of nature. We are only 0.01 percent of the earths equation. We are not the creator nor do we have the power to change that.
    We are as far as I can figure out are a part of the whole. We are not the whole and the earth being a part of us. Ego has caused us to think we are more than we are but we are indeed unique. Figuring that one out is lots of fun.
    Al Gore put asside. We humans have a job to do while we are on this planet. Do it and move on. We are Born, We die and – is what ever it is we are supposed to accomplish while we are visiting this planet.
    Interesting no?

    • 45caliber

      When you consider the Earth and all in it along side of man, we are little more than ants building our ant hills and believing we are god rather than God running things.

  • Jeffer

    We tend to talk about what is “religious” vs “scientific”. We tend to think about this latter idea as “fact” (absolute). Science and the scientific method, however, are based on perception. The idea that what we perceive is what “IS” or “all there is” has no bases as fact. The nature of our existence is likely very different than we think it is (perceive it to be). My evidence for this is that I have seen the “laws” of this world (existence) suspended in answer to prayer. Someone is “listening”.

    • Karolyn

      Those prayers are energy, which causes change. “Thoughts are things.” Everything is energy. If people thought more about perception, there would be a lot more harmony in this world. Everyone’s beliefs come from their perceptions, and we all do not preceive the same. The African living in Nigeria does not see things the same as the American living in Nebraska!

      • Jeffer

        Hi Karolyn, Thank you for taking the time to reply. Although I have no fundamental disagreement with you, I think a debate about how energy and matter work is outside of our ability and unfruitful. I am getting to be old now and over the years have acquired, on occasion, help. The “energy” that helped me identified himself as a person and knew my name. That there are absolute truths should be self-evident. If it were not so, there could be no stability, and we are not. But we ARE. And there is stability above us, and he IS. This is my experience. My point is that there is no need for us to debate things about which we have so little knowledge. We can go directly to the source and learn truth, as much as we can stand in our present condition.

      • eddie47d

        Isn’t that the truth Karolyn. Nigeria has 2 million Lutherans and they are slowly losing their influence because Muslims are pushing into “their” territory. I’m sure they ask themselves many times “where is God”. Ethiopia also has 3 million Lutherans and Somalia refugees are pouring into their country.Is this God’s plan in testing their Faith or only an unfortunate natural occurrence?

      • professor


        How long did it take you to come up with the fact that Nigerians think differently than Americans…..

      • Altaica

        And boy are things seen in a different light here in Nebraska. Not wrong, just different. I do like it here even if some people get a little fanatical about their football.

    • Rusticus

      You are deluding yourself.

  • AJ

    Quote,”They all relate to the question of whether there is a Conscious Universal Power Source at the controls or whether everything that happens here on Earth is random.” That’s a great question as to who’s behind these weather conditions. My answer would be there is competing forces. Our Creator and the NWO playing their HAARP.

  • chris batton

    I think that these were for shore natural disasters caused by nature enabled by god I still believe that haarp could be a weather manipulating machine used for causing horrific disasters so crows in Washington and abroad can press the envelop to ofcourse set laws into play that would destroy our liberty but its still a open debate in my mind atleast I like these emails to a certain extent but some of these are far too fear mongering without any sense of hope that people can get out of this I’m in touch with reality as much as my feet are with the ground but when somebody talks most of only bad things to come with no solution there only building the fear fire and might make one mad enough to just say screw it and in modern day society our culture is filled with that all too well and is one of the key things that’s making it drown I still respect u and think your a great knowledge spreader and patriot but it would be nice to see a little more hope and will for the victory of freedom to win the day no matter how dim the present or the status cwo may seem

    • Karolyn

      Amen, Chris! There needs to be more attention paid to what good there is and to spreading the opposite of hate and fear, which is LOVE!

      • Jeep

        The problem with your type of “love” Karolyn, is that you and your ilk consider spreading welfare and higher taxes the same as spreading “love”. We vehemently disagree in that spreading “love” to me is allowing you the freedom to succeed or fail. You believe that “love” means to take other people’s money and “spread the lovin’”.

        • Karolyn

          Jeep – I don’t give a rat’s patootie what the rest of my “ilk”, whatever that means, think. I am not talking about giving anybody anything, but just spreading the energy of love. Love is the opposite of fear, and it’s what we need more of! Positive energy has a higher frequency than negative. Check out “Power Vs. Force” by Dr. Hawkins.

        • Kate8

          Jeep – I agree. Satan comes in many forms and guises, and one of his favorites is to spout about “love”.

          It all depends on what your interpretation of “love” is.

          • Jeep

            You’re right on target Kate8. I am afraid that the progressive form of “love” is more welfare and less freedom for all. All the while, progressives accuse Libertarians and Conservatives of hate. Wow! It must be a twisted mind that is encased in the progressive head.

            BTW, dosen’t the OT describe Satan as being as beautiful as diamonds and rubys?

          • Kate8

            Jeep – Yes, his beauty was celebrated among all the angels.

            He was also ruler of music and the arts (he still uses them).

            And he still tells people that, if only they stop trying to follow Gods Ways and follow him instead, they will become gods unto themselves.

        • Marie1

          Jeep didn’t Jesus say “love thy neighbor” and” help one another” if you believe in the bible, I guess you probably call it socialism, of which you know nothing about.

          • Al Sieber

            Marie1, doesn’t God help those that help themselves? that’s not Socialism.

          • Kate8

            Yeshua said we should love the Lord Thy God above all else, and love thy neighbor as thyself. And then he says to do unto others as we would have them do unto us.

            He tells us to be kind and charitable to those we see who are in need.

            He doesn’t tell us to be suckers.

            “He who does not work, does not eat.”

      • professor

        Tell me Karolyn, how much does “love” cost these days?

        • Karolyn

          You are a perverted person, “professor.” I doubt that you can come anywhere neara to being a professor. Love costs nothing but being true to one’s real self.

        • eddie47d

          Love costs in every relationship. We always make demands on those we love and they make demands on us. Love can be very expensive.

    • Jeep

      Chris, do not mistake the posting of negative opinions and contrary facts for a loss of hope. In battle, one must go through a hail storm of bullets and fire back to reach the objective and win. But, that does not mean that a soldier is without hope for complete victory. The fact that many of my friends here and elsewhere are posting, quoting, arguing and complaining gives me hope and confidence in that I am not alone.

      • eddie47d

        The problem is Jeep that there is a constant barrage of fear and negativity coming from the Right. That negativity brings about a lack of will and hopelessness that our nation has failed and will collaspe. Too many of you want victory from total destruction and are willing to allow that to happen. The same scenario does play out on the Left in trying to destroy certain basic principles so that they can enact their way of doing business. I don’t think either side considers the ramifications of their actions. It’s good to battle for the benefit of our nation but not by eliminating the rights of others in the process.

        • Rick

          Eddie you are spot on and I hope some others will start thinking for them selves, keep the good work up!

          • Kate8

            You guys are funny.

            You accuse the Right of spreading fear, yet who are the ones shouting “the sky is falling!”, i.e. global warming, shortages, unsustainability, overpopulation, certain annihilation because of our use of oil, coal and anything else that makes life easier.

            Not to mention the hopless plight of the “poor”, those who are dying because they can’t afford medical “care”, forcing restrictions of everything we do lest we suffer some dire consequence.

            You guys are a joke.

          • eddie47d

            Since there are several survivalist on this site shouting that the end is near, yourself included you ought to rethink that topic. Fear wins in getting folks to listen and as I said the left and right both do it.

          • Kate8

            Again, nice try, eddie, but I was responding to your assertions of negativity coming from the Right. Which btw, is in resistance to the tyranny coming from the left.

            At least we conservatives address ACTUAL threats, in the form of power mongers and even idiots. When we challenge your camp on your treachery, you make stuff up and then accuse us of being negative.

            Most of us would feel really positive about things if we could just live our lives in peace, without some liberal do-gooder breathing down our necks trying to regulate and tax every breath.

          • eddie47d

            There is also right wing tyranny and their forces who want to dominate others. There are a few who want a religious theocracy and be able to excludes everyone else. That would hardly be free choice now would it. Some on this site are loud and proud of their hatred for Muslim Americans. Some are equally proud of wanting laws to make homosexuality a crime of punishment. Some states want to throw woman who get an abortion into prison.Now I’m not going to say one word about the left this time because you seldom if ever go after the right.

        • Dan az

          The way I see it is that there is an opinion and a opposing opinion,Positive and negative and the result is a conclusion.Not evil but a positive.Like Karolyn says that positive will always succeed,rule of natural law.We are pounded with negative daily but the outcome will be positive if we all can come to the conclusion.Now I’m sounding like Bob Wire lol!Deep!

          • Kate8

            Wow, Dan az! Were you gone to a weekend retreat or something?

          • Dan az

            No I think it was just gas :)

        • Jeep

          It’s funny eddie how you try to squash “hope” in one breath and tout the left wing approach to liberty in the other. Sorry, but left wing politics are completely incompatable with liberty and freedom. Granted, it can be argued that right wing politics are incompatable as well. I mean after all, by “forcing” people to be independant, with freedom to fail or succeed, that sure puts a damper on those “freedoms” the left offers…like being a slave to taxes, forced “public” education, the collective mindset, you know, all that freedom stuff.

          • Karolyn

            But, Jeep, doesn’t the religious right want to impose religion into everything? They want a person of a particular religion to be in office for one thing. That doesn’t sound so freedom-loving and American. It sounds restrictive to me.

          • Jeep

            Here’s a tip for you karolyn…read carefully. I don’t believe I have ever equated right wing with religious right wing politics. Ever. After all, “left-wing” or “right-wing” means very little. They are just titles, and as such they are starting points for discussion on the true political bent of an individual. As a Libertarian with a Conservative bend myself, I believe that a mixing of politics and religion should be tempered with a notion and understanding that the Constitution implies a freedom to worship or not to worship, as one sees fit. But, we should protect some traditions. Putting a manger in front of the state house, the Ten Commandments on the court house and saying a prayer at a high school prep rally are examples of “good” traditions. In my humble opinion. The problem of stopping these traditions is that you infringe on the rights of those who like to observe them.

            But, as I have stated often, progressive policies play well in the simple mind. Free health care, welfare for the poor, and food stamps are all “noble” sounding pursuits. However, in a truly free society these “programs” are simply not possible. Why? Because you MUST infringe on the rights of some (usually through taxes) to pay for these programs. It is odd to me that progressives who tout the mantra that we are all in this together and we should “help” our fellow man, forget that their programs are paid for by someone else. They are paid for by another American. When you received govt handouts did you ever once stop to think about where the money was coming from? Did you ever consider that every dime was taken away from someone elses children? Which leads to the final point of all of this, progressives take programs too far, true conservatives believe in helping out, but I do not think it is right or fair to allow the govt to take my income and give it to someone else.

          • Karolyn

            Jeep – I do get the concept. However, even with the programs now in existence, there are still people, even little kids, starving in this country. How would you propose our hunger problem be solved other than by the government helping? There are food banks everywhere, but they all fall short.

            When I got Food Stamps and years ago also was on a public health program in NJ, I did not think about where the money was coming from. My only thoughts were that I am an American, have worked and contributed to this country for many years, and why should I not partake of a little help. I’ve never thought about it before, but thinking back, I remember at first feeling badly and not really wanting to take “charity;” however, at the urging of others, I applied for help and was extremely grateful for what I got. Having a physical condition that required a certain amount of care, it was a relief that I was eligible for health care. I am far from a taker; however, if the help is there and is needed, why not? During both time periods, my income was very minimal, although I did work and have always been a hustler. No man has ever taken care of me.

          • Kate8

            karolyn – That mantra about the Right wanting a theocracy is wearing thin, too, just like the accusations of racism.

            No, we don’t want religion in everything. Besides, there are so many different doctrines among Christians alone, they’d never agree.

            But there are certain principles that just make society work better. The fact that they are also principles of Judao-Chritian ethics doesn’t change that fact.

            You know, things like telling the truth, standing by your word, conducting yourself ethically in business and in personal matters, going the extra mile, considering someone besides yourself, not taking things that belong to another, being faithful, loyal, responsible and dependable…respecting the sovereignty of others…

            I realize that some of these things can be woven into rules and some must be instilled at a young age. But these days, they aren’t given consideration at all, and it’s become an every-man-for-himself world. And if it’s too tough to steal other people’s stuff, just get the government to do it for you.

            It was said that freedom only works with a moral and ethical people.

            Nuff said.

  • Raggs

    oblama needed the hurricane and the earth quake as a crisis in order to blame the poor economy on something or someone other than himself.

    • eddie47d

      That must be it Raggs. What else could it be?

      • Jeep

        Didn’t your hero Rahm say something like, “Never let a good crisis go to waste”? I think Raggs was just speculating based on a proven track record.

  • Richard

    Also look at DNA, it’s software in a helix strand form. Is sofware randomly produced? NO The reason man’s “sience” made up the theory is to replace God, if there is no God, we are in the position of little gods or the governments as a collective god. There is reason for that.
    I call it the who’s your daddy thing. lol Is it a supreme God, or a bunch of greedy selfish human beings that call the shots here for now?

  • chuckb

    raggs, you say it right, barry was gearing up for the big crisis and it didn’t happen. the media was sitting it up for him. he could see a light at the end of the “funnel”, instead he got nothing but rain in the face.

    • Raggs

      Exactly!!! That is why ALL media stations ran the rain storm 24-7 for two weeks!!! Even the media was hoping for massive damage and lose of life in order for oblama to fly in ( walk on water ) and save the world…

      • Karolyn

        Sick thinking! It happens with ANY disaster-in-making, no matter who the President or where in the world it is happening.

        • eddie47d

          Now Obama is running the weather channel. The plot thickens!!

        • Raggs

          Are you telling me that oblama would not use a crisis as a political gain??? WOW!!!!

          • eddie47d

            No but you would use nonsense to score points in the political process.

          • Thinking About

            Raggs you are probably right Obama sent in a request and was granted an earthquake and hurricane to improve his political standing. Now this sounds like intelligent. Must have been Perry prayer gathering and results was misguided and Obama will get the gain and not Perry.

  • Eric

    The one thing that disallows me to believe in anything but God, and I have thought a lot about it, is consistency. Take your example of the huricane and the earthquake. Every time those forces which make up each of those occurances come together you will get the same result. Like gravity, if one throws something up in the air it will fall to the ground. Everytime. It’s the same with our government. Throughout history, whenever the political elite try to control everything and everyone, and spend more than they take in by promising everything TO everyone just for reelection, the country will fall. Everytime. I pray that we can stop the inevitable.

  • bill garlitz

    Sliding Plates cause Earth Quakes.,Wind Direction colide and merge,along with water temperature, current’s,cause Hurricanes..Working 40 hours a weak,allowes survival for middle class.and very little change in Washington, Bickering, obstruction and partisonship produces little results..Mitch McConnell refuses to accept a Black President.George Bush and Ronald Regan Talk to God for Advice.Rich get Picher selling jobs to China..Middle Class,can’t afford Gas or Morgages.Kissingers Buildeburg Group Keep Getting Rich.Farmers bought out by Big Corperation’s..Obama,Saves the auto Industry and looks for Middle Class Jobs..Maby 2012 will be better.

    • eddie47d

      I had to chuckle when Ringer said “that scientists don’t know where earthquakes or hurricanes come from”. So thanks bill for bringing that up and we are to take these articles seriously?

      • DaveH

        Eddie, you are paraphrasing Robert Ringer. You don’t put quotes around paraphrases. Here is exactly what Robert said:
        “Did this Power Source intervene and cause last week’s earthquake or hurricane to occur? I have no idea. Though millions of people would never admit it, neither does anyone else. As I said earlier, it’s amazing what scientists know about earthquakes, hurricanes and other natural disasters. But, even with their vast knowledge of how these events occur, not one scientist has any idea as to why they occur.”

      • coal miner


        Earthquakes or hurricanes? Where did they come from? He better stop smoking that stuff and he should start smoking Coal Miner’s Golds.Ringer,we will pray for you.Ha ha ha

        • coal miner


          A 10 percent drop in water vapor ten miles above Earth’s surface has had a big impact … Get the latest science news with our free email newsletters, updated daily …

          • Al Sieber

            c. miner, thanks for the link.

          • eddie47d

            Thanks coal miner for the link. The global warming mystery continues as it should. Both sides have “proof” and dismisses the other sides point of view. A good scientist will look at all angles instead of ignoring the facts from opposing scientists. I have seen absolute “proof” from both sides of science and they are all stubborn as mules in insisting they are right.

          • Al Sieber

            It’s solar flares eddie.

      • Jay

        Obviously you take the articles at PL seriously eddie, in fact, you take them very seriously. As you are always reading, and responding to them. Also, you’re always here, hovering, like parasitic vulture!

    • DaveH

      Obama certainly did not save the auto industry. He saved special interests within the auto industry (Unions mostly), and he screwed others (bondholders, taxpayers, Ford).

      • Thinking About

        Yea yea yea waa was was Obama will never get credit for any results of his actions and there are WMD in Iraq. Results are auto industry is doing well and revenues are being received from those workers but war based on lies has cost this nation lots in money and lives. Which had a positive outcome?

  • Zed

    Um, excuse me but television DID exist when FDR was president. Mechanical television was first demonstrated in 1923 and broadcasts began in 1928.

  • Roland

    Don’t forget entropy. The Biblical worldview posits a fallen world, expressed in the physical as well as moral spheres. Decay. Also, What Richard just said above. A British biologist was interview for TV in the 50′s, and was asked why he thought the public had embraced the theory of evolution so rapidly as fact. He said, “Why, it means they can do whatever they want!”

  • Linda

    FYI, in defense of Joe Biden, the first commercially made electronic television sets with cathode ray tubes were manufactured by Telefunken in Germany in 1934,followed by other makers in France (1936),[105] Britain (1936),and America (1938). An estimated 19,000 electronic television sets were manufactured in Britain, and about 1,600 in Germany, before World War II. About 7,000–8,000 electronic sets were made in the U.S. before the War Production Board halted manufacture in April 1942, production resuming in August 1945, and skyrocked after the war. I remember having our first TV in 1947.

    • Nadzieja Batki

      Lefties/Liberals/Socialists are you aware that before the mass production of televisions, it was the evil rich who could only afford to purchase them and eventually everyone else could have them.

      • Thinking About

        So what is your point. Statement was made tv was not available during FDR and post has determined when tv was started which was before FDR time. You just have to throw out evil right wing statements without cause.

  • Rayma Dorsa

    As I see it 9/11 was a warning from God..He lifted the hedge of protection and no one repented so 7 years later the stockmarket fell at the very place George Washington made his ignaguaral speech when he became president the church he went into to “commit” the United States to God was there at ground level…so it is fitting that is the first place God would send his wake up call..

  • Richard

    To whom much is given much is required. Much has been given to us and much is required too.

    • Jeep

      Absolutely Richard…like requiring the govt to follow the Constitution and requiring illegal aliens to follow the law. How about requiring the president to get authorization before committing troops to bomb another country for six months…should we expect that requirment to be followed? And, since we have been given so much, should we not be required to leave a viable economy that is free of debt to our chlidren? I certainly agree that to whom much is given, much is required.

      • bob wire

        “and requiring illegal aliens to follow the law.”

        just the illegal ones?

        • Jeep

          Whatever, Bob Wire, if you cannot fathom what it means to be an American, perhaps you should spend a little more time in contemplation. My meaning was clear, even if I “failed” to mention all the wrongs of this current administration. Normal people have no problem looking at a few examples with the understanding that there is a deeper concern. However, flat, single-sided lefties are always one-dimensional in their approach to difficult analogies and situations. Your miopic view is duly noted and cataloged.

          • bob wire

            Oh! I see ~ Your are more American then I am so you can say stupid things and it’s okay.

            I Got it! but ~ how did you get to be more American then me?

            Exactly how does that work? ~ Let’s see, ~I was born into an American WWII GI family, I was a boy scout, eagle scout, I pay taxes ~ all of them since I was 14 some that 49 years of taxes , ~2 years in the Army Infantry, 1 drawing combat pay. Three bronze stars, GI bill privileges and education, Raised and supported 4 four little Americans that now pay taxes and are making more little Americans that will pay taxes. I employ 5 Americans who pays taxes . I serve America and her interest. I vote for Americans. I live in America.

            So just how am I less American then you Jeep?

            Let’s face it, you say things without thinking them completely through.

      • DaveH

        The President already is required to get authorization, but being the dictator that he is, he ignores the law.

        • Al Sieber

          That seems to be his M.O..

      • Thinking About

        Does anyone stop and remember citizens are not obeying the laws when they hire workers without papers? Why did Perry ask for 350 million to close the borders when he is not going after the illegal employers. If jobs was not given the population coming in illegally would beuch lower. You hire them and they shall come.

        • Al Sieber

          They’re coming all right, a army of 350,000 coming to take back the S.W.

  • DaveH
  • DaveH

    This is a great video. I am re-posting it today for those who may not have watched it yesterday:

  • momplayer

    All I can say is Mother natures a B%^$# and she’s P%$^&&.I’m sure though that all the other countries in world will step-up and come to our aid like we have for them in the past. Did anyone catch the air-lifts coming from China,France,Mexico landing in Washington?Oh wait I must have got a bad dose of bad drugs from mexico and am dellusinal.GOD HELP US ALL!!!!!!!!!!!!

    • Nadzieja Batki

      Now if we could get back all the money from foreign aid and charities that have been wasted on all the hellholes of the world, America would never have economic problems ever again.

    • Jay

      moonplarey, at present, there are approximately 450,000 foreign troops on American soil. The majority of which are Chinese.

  • Old Henry

    Well Bob, the civil discourse on your evolution article was due to the fact that at this site you are dealing with good, upstanding, moral people – for the most part.

    If you had been at a liberal site the discourse would have been, ah, ugly. Who knows, Maxine Waters might have shown up and incited posters to murder as she did against the TEA Party.

    I have heard that the earthquake was caused by a little known fault in the area named Bush’s Fault.

    On a more serious note if we take a step back and look at what has, and is, going on in this country – massive draughts, heat waves of massive proportions, floods, crop failure, fires, earthquakes, hurricanes – it would appear that God Almighty is attempting to get our attention, so far without success.

    God Almighty is not random and as you stated Mr. Ringer the question remains – what caused the original bang and who created the substances that went bang.

    As it currently stands there are going to be many surprised people in the very near future as things are coming together fro the final days.

    • ValDM

      Old Henry,
      I agree with you about the final days. About a year ago I was listening to a pastor on Moody broadcasting. His thoughts ran along the same lines. His perspective was this : that the world is tired; winding down, if you will. Since this supports what’s happening throughout the world (natural disasters, wars, rumors of wars) that the Bible has warned us about, I can see it no other way. The earth is having its “birth pains” and nothing will change the outcome, as God has given us prophesy regarding these events so we will be prepared for what will come.

  • Chas

    As I think for a moment about the construct of the physical law of nature, specifically regarding the force of gravity and its relation to the density of matter, I have to conclude that if all matter in the entire universe was concentrated into one place prior to the “big bang,” such an explosion could never have occurred without being initiated preemptively somehow, simply because all of that concentrated cosmic material never would have been able to escape its own gravitational force without a divine catalyst.

  • Thor

    I just finished a book on Kindle entitled “An Eternal History of Time” that makes some salient points about this subject, among them:

    Science and religion are equally useful tools for finding ultimate truth but unless they are used together, one is getting only half the picture.

    Both require equal faith. Most of our science is based on a theory of matter and that theory is predicated upon belief in something no scientist has ever seen—an electron. Needed to complete the atom and, as a result, it is needed to hold up the entire theory of quantum mechanics—the existence of the electron is predicated on the observed behavior of other particles of matter. We have seen protons and neutrons by bombarding them with electrons in an electron microscope but we do not have anything small enough to bombard an electron with so that we can see it. In addition, the electron is less cooperative, if we believe Heisenberg, and will not stay in place long enough for us to locate it and, if it did, we would have to destroy it to see it. Yet there is ample evidence of its existence because we have the whole of material existence and our knowledge and ability to predict its behavior to vouch for it.

    Theologians have equally compelling evidence that God exists in thousands of years of observing human behavior—in addition to the presence of the material universe— and in the absolute and compelling compunction of human beings to need God and to behave in predictable ways with or without belief in Him.

    Both intuitive notions—the existence of God and the existence of the electron—are based on evidences seen and unseen; and both are equally necessary to human existence as well as understanding.

    There is other evidence as well. Both human sentience (self-awareness) and intelligence are totally unnecessary for human survival—as evidenced in animals that survive very well which possess neither. Ordinarily natural selection would have selected either of these unnecessary qualities out of existence long ago or the creature who possessed them—unless of course they were ‘intended’ for another purpose entirely. And yet the creature which possesses these two worthless qualities manages to survive at the top of the food chain and with relative ease and with an irresistible impulse to observe and understand all things. A random system, tuned to produce and maintain only those characteristics necessary for survival would not have produced such qualities and circumstances.

    Furthermore, human beings are located in precisely the right spot in the so-called ‘Goldilocks Zone’—the crucial location within the galaxy and within the universe that allows them to view the Cosmos—while there are other places otherwise conducive to life but from which observation is not possible due to Cosmic gases or temperature. The wisdom of so many coincidental advantages converging in one place as a random cause is a mathematical impossibility.

    The text goes on to give examples of logical and theoretical weaknesses in Darwinian theory, which is generally applicable but, like Newtonian physics, is limited in application. It cannot account, for example, for the fact of ‘irreducible complexity’—a situation in which an organic system like the flagella of a single celled organism is comprised of a number of a number of parts that cannot work unless all the parts work together and none of them are useful alone; the system cannot be reduced and yet Darwinian theory predicts they could not have ‘evolved’ simultaneously.

    Nothing in Darwinian or any evolutionary theory can account for DNA, which not only stores information but imparts that information in a non-random way that produces absolute variety. DNA was just here, the supreme product of irreducible complexity.

    Human beings are incapable of coming to the logical conclusion that anything is ‘random’ in the sense defined by science for the simple reason that the entire species and every member of it would have to live throughout infinity to be able to testify to the fact that any given event never happened a second time—which is the fact necessary to make anything ‘random’ or prove it‘non-random.’

    In the end, the conclusion is this—and I quote:

    “To take all we know and suspect and reverse-engineer it back to its very first cause, we find ourselves standing intuitively in open space, viewing that first cause, frozen in time, a tiny rip in the void with a single particle of plasma speeding away from it; and we have to wonder—and this is why the ultimate mystery will never be revealed during organic life—if we could tear back the edges of that rip to stick our heads through to see what’s on the other side, what will we find there?
    And, again, there are two possible answers, either of which will have to be accepted in an act of faith. We will either find more of the same, a continued continuum, with no beginning and no end; or we will see, finally and irrevocably, the eternal face of God.”

    • bob wire

      We’ve got our Jesus mojo working today.

      “So what do Tea Partiers have in common? They are overwhelmingly white, but even compared to other white Republicans, they had a low regard for immigrants and blacks long before Barack Obama was president, and they still do.

      More important, they were disproportionately social conservatives in 2006 — opposing abortion, for example — and still are today. Next to being a Republican, the strongest predictor of being a Tea Party supporter today was a desire, back in 2006, to see religion play a prominent role in politics. And Tea Partiers continue to hold these views: they seek “deeply religious” elected officials, approve of religious leaders’ engaging in politics and want religion brought into political debates. The Tea Party’s generals may say their overriding concern is a smaller government, but not their rank and file, who are more concerned about putting God in government.”

      parcel Commentary bases on research studies beginning in 2006 to 2011, Leave each of us to pick and choose what is true and what is false. It won’t be the same for each of us.

      The Christian Right has changed it’s name and reinvented itself for mass consumption. After backing Bush to the edge of ruination and refusing to listen, refusing to see, bashing any descenting voice of reason. What was left for them to do? Confess and apologize? Fall on their sword?

      Not these guys, they just changed their label and kept on being “right”. and Yes Jeff! I have a problem with it, it’s at the core of my disgust and 8 years in the making. You should be glad I visit ~ I’m keeping an eye on what happening here after that 8 year detour into insanity.

      I just angry with you. I’ll cool off with I reclaim a 8 year loss. Like “never”

      • JeffH

        …so says the Jabberwocky…of ourse you will never see the Tea Party as a positive American, pro liberty, pro-constitutional force…you much prefer to denegrate them, define them as racists and bigots and predominately made up of old white men…8 years and that’s all you got?

        Stay angry bobby, stay angry. It shows well on you!

        Of course you, along with Paul Krugman, Nazi Pelosi, Ed Shultz, Kieth Olbermann, Chris Matthews, NPR’s Ronald Schiller and Rachel Maddow.
        Who could forget the “Reports of racial slurs at health care reform”
        protests in March 2010 where the Tea Party was accused of shouting out slurs and spitting at black congressional members…funny thing though…$100,000 dollar reward was offered to anyone that could provide one irrefutable shred of evidence, video or audio…and guess what? Video and audio proof of racial slurs against Lewis and Carson had yet to emerge! Imagine that.

        “Tea Party supporters”, says Patrik Jonsson of the Christian Science Monitor, “have been called neo-Klansmen and knuckle-dragging hillbillies”. Jonsson adds, “demonizing tea party activists tends to energize the Democrats’ left-of-center base”. He notes that “polls suggest that tea party activists are not only more mainstream than many critics suggest, but that a majority of them are women (primarily mothers), not angry white men”. Jonsson quotes Juan Williams saying that Tea Party’s opposition to health reform was based on self-interest rather than racism.

        Matthew Continetti of The Weekly Standard has said: “There is no single Tea Party. The name is an umbrella that encompasses many different groups. Under this umbrella, you’ll find everyone from the woolly fringe to Ron Paul supporters, from Americans for Prosperity to religious conservatives, independents, and citizens who never have been active in politics before. The umbrella is gigantic.”

        Mark Mardell of BBC News, who has “spoken to many supporters of the Tea Party and been to lots of rallies” has said that when he talks to Tea Party supporters for more than a few minutes, “fury tends to dissolve into concern, worry about the economic direction of the country, worry about the size of the government and the level of taxation”. While “many” supporters of what Mardell calls the “hydra-headed” Tea Party combine their fiscal and constitutional concerns with social issues associated with their Christian beliefs, the unifying focus is on fiscal conservatism and the constitution.

        Ned Ryun, president of American Majority, an organization that offers training for many Tea Party activists, believes this movement is not about political parties, stating, “It’s very much anti-establishment at both parties … They don’t care about party labels.” He has also said that “I think we’re getting to the point where you can truly say we’re entering a post-party era. They aren’t going to be necessarily wed to a certain party — they want to see leadership that reflects their values first … They don’t care what party you’re in; they just want to know if you reflect their values — limited government, fixing the economy.

        So bobby, I just have to say patooie…yer boats a bit off course, of cours!

        • Dan az

          That was awesome,can you hear my feet stomping?Take a bow dude!

          • JeffH

            Brother Dan, thank God it wasn’t your “hands clapping”. :)

        • Al Sieber

          Good one Jeff, you “Ripped” Bob a new one, chewed him up and spit him out.

        • Kate8

          Bravo, JeffH.

          bw bites the dust again.

          When you think of it, the accusations of racism are ridiculous. When it comes to liberty, it’s ‘come one, come all’. There’s no color when it’s a matter of freedom. All must stand together, and the more, the more…

          The Left can’t prove a single incidence of racism. What it really is is sour grapes.

          • JeffH

            Kate8, it’s always the same thing over and over. Zero creativity…it gets old real quick. Hey, I wanted to tell you that you’ve really stepped up your A game…your comments are always intelligent, honest, interesting and perceptive but I think you’ve taken them to a higher level. I may not comment as much but man, I’d say the level of non-progressive posting has really improved this website…yourself, DaveH, vicki, Jay, Dan, Angelwannabe,Jana, Al, Old Henry, libertytrain, QB1, Bob from SoCal, JC, sc, Jeep, jibbs,45caliber, Brother Patriot, Carlucci, Cawmen Cents and some I may have missed. That’s a pretty strong “army” I’s have to say.

          • Jay

            Jeff, you forgot to include yourself to the list. The list just wouldn’t be complete without you!

          • JeffH

            Jay, we’ve all got a stake in reclaiming America…thanks!

          • Kate8

            JeffH – Thank you for the compliment. And yes, you must include yourself in that list.

            I hope you had a chance to watch the bloodline video. We thought it the Rothschilds were at the top, but they have never been anything but financiers. Wealthy and powerful, to be sure, but not actually of the royal bloodlines.

            The European and Arab bloodlines are all intermixed!

            I’m still reeling over this new info. It’s really putting more pieces in place. This is huge.

          • JeffH

            Kate8, I’ve been pretty usy the last few days but I plan on watching them when I get back from the Bay Area…heading up tomorrow, going to hunt dove in Winters with some buddies, season opens Sept. 1st, then gonna spend a couple of days with my pops in Vallejo.

          • libertytrain

            Thanks Jeff – and you enjoy yourself hunting and visit with your dad — “see” you when you get back – :)

        • Thinking About

          Maybe it has been the mobster signs which have influenced opinions or maybe the history lessons from Perry, Palin and Bachmann. To needs some new spokesmen.

        • bob wire

          Well Jeff, you have got quit a cheer from your “cheering section” with your thoughtful rebuttal. But not one denial do I hear in your response, these are the same bunch of hard headed Christians that supplied the wind under 43 for 8 long years.

          In earlier postings, I have manage to get a personal denial from Chip Wood but I can’t seem to pry that out of you. I have spoken with both you and Dave long enough to know neither of you are disingenuous, that you both have been a constant with your message. I will give you that and the respect it deserved.

          But these “many disclaimers” you offer about what people are attracted to, support and defend the Tea Party and it activities has been shown to be erogenous over and over again. There is precious few Negros engaged in the Tea Party. There “might be” a lost democrat or two, a handful of Latins perhaps.

          This composite makeup by itself is not the problem actually but it’s the history that Tea Party is attempting to separate themselves from.

          The new label, the new stated purpose, the new image, anew face while hiding the same old hard headed people, their ideas about what is best for America and they are right, they are righteous, they are loud, they are bullies and God is only on their side. It’s, ~ don’t back down, don’t compromise if it hair lips the devil himself. They don’t care about about any “ideas” but their own. If you don’t agree with them, I was called, pinko, tree huger, no balls, anti-Christian, Un-American. non-believer, Satan’s child, pussy, no guts, fagot, fairy and the list goes on. For simply saying, “Wait a minute, This ain’t right, American soldiers don’t need to going there! ”

          They helped carried us to war and ruin and damnation in just a 8 years period of time and then have the audacity to blamed the next administration for the sorry state of affairs they themselves helped create.

          Well, ~ Jeff, Dave, 45, Jeep, Jay, Katie and all the rest, we need a serious come to Jesus meeting. As I’m very much in line with much of what you “openly” say that you want to see changed and address.

          Government is my largest enemy in my line of sight today. I’ve always considered government a necessary “evil” and that we have too many laws the restrict the average citizen and small business owner, too much government interference in our personal lives.

          It is your hidden agenda that concerns me most and of course you can only deny that one even exist ~ all day long!

          Every state that got a new Tea Party Gov, started attacking the freedoms of Americans, from voting privileges to women rights to “fairy issues” to right to organize when some twisted self-righteous moral compass.

          You have behaved like a puppet of Corporate America. As you “use” a failing economy to address moral issues and nickel and dime matters.

          Moral issues are important but best left up to church and family and not matters of state to be “imposed” and regulated. Let the Church do it’s work inside the framework offered by the Constitution.

          To use a failing economy as a ruse to address you pet moral issues is simply wrong and a disservice to America and American principles.

          You are left to deny it all you wish but until I get a full disclose of what’s behind the curtain, you will find me in opposition.

          What’s happen today in the Tea Party today simply doesn’t fit the stated purpose unless you include “this history”

          • Kate8

            b w – Wow. You sure to have a fixation on the TeaParty. What is the problem with you, other than it finds the Leftist agenda abhorrent?

            It is obvious that you have no clue about the TeaParty, and that you only read Leftist rags and listen to Nancy Pelosi’s slander.

            Might I suggest that you attend a gathering and see for yourself. Otherwise, you are simply parroting the Leftist propaganda (lies).


          • JeffH

            Kate8, thank you. You said everything that can be said. bw chooses to believe what he wants and I’ve no real problem with that…HE”S WRONG plain and simple.

            I’ve attended a few of these Tea Party gatherings, they’re not religeous gatherings and there not racist gatherings despite what bw wants to believe…they are simply plain everyday people from ALL walks of life and ethnicities. Yeah, they do have an agenda…individual liberty, limited government, and economic freedom.
            Sounds evil to me! NOT!

            But beware says the Jabberwocky, they’re evil warmongers and racist!

            Sorry bobbie, I’ve been there and seen and experienced the Tea Party first hand and have yet to hear the hoots and hollers of “hang” Obama and “white is right”…just genuine concern for our constitutional republic.

          • Kate8

            JeffH – Being that the Left is all about hidden agendas, they just can’t comprehend that anyone really says what they mean.

            What you see is what you get.

          • bob wire

            I know there are times that it would be nice if we could be separated from our past mistakes and deeds.

            There been times that I too wished that I was born into another family or simply hatched rather then accepting the path I have traveled and mistakes myself or my family has made.

            But, alas, I cannot deny where I came from or my history, thus left to live with it and make humble amends in some gracious manner for all to bear witness and accept my concession.

            The Tea Party is comprised of people that refuse to do either.

            They seem to have fell from the sky somewhere around 2008 with no past, no regrets and a mandate from the Lord, carrying words spoken from the burning “Bush”

            While it’s true that I was born in the early morning, it wasn’t this morning.

            Your hypocrisy is superseded only by blatant arrogance in thinking I might be fooled by your attempt at sincerity. You lie to yourself with ease and comfort, lying to me is no stretch. Your words and deeds fail to balance out.

            That said, ~ I once too believed. ~

            You fight your fight and I’ll fight mine and may we never met. I didn’t fall to earth in 2008. I’ve been around the block a few times and I recognize you. I’ve seen you before.

          • Kate8

            Geez, bw. What on Earth are you smokin’. You are delusional.

            Like I said. Attend a TeaParty gathering and see for yourself. They are just regular folks, lots of grandmas and grandpas, and people who value liberty.

            Your assertions of them are ridiculous.

            You’ve gone off the deep end, man. You are obsessed.

            And besides that, you are just plain wrong.

            But you won’t see for yourself. It’s easier to ride on the Leftist bandwaggon. Gives you a place to belong.

            BTW, how about all the attacks on whites being perpetrated by blacks here lately? How about all the racial epithets being hurled against them? These are truly racist riots and attacks. Do they get a pass from you?

            I guess it’s just more politically convenient to hurl accusations where they don’t belong. Wouldn’t want to burst your bubble of delusion and race-baiting.

      • Jeep

        You are way too funny Bob Wire! Why a would you be so concerned with such a fringe element? If, as you say, the average Tea Partier is just a rehash from the “Religious Right” then what is there to worry about? And, since the average Tea Partier is apparently white, what concerns are there? Are you that “spooked” by a bunch of white guys getting together? Personally I find your musings tiresome, but I do get a little perk from your apparent fear. After all, your guys have been in charge for going on three years and last time I checked things are much worse (that’s right, if Bush hadn’t been so bad this would never have happened, whatever…)

        This may be a strange concept for you, but how about we try this…First, we go back to Constitional Principals, next we eliminate non-Constitional federal agencies, stop trying to re-distribute the wealth and give back the power to the people.

        • JeffH

          Gee whiz Jeep, you sound a lot like a rightwing old white Tea Party constitutionalist. By golly I think you’re on to something too!
          Good at ya’ :)

      • Jay

        You have no intellectual integrity bw. You’re a flop, a boob! Rather then argue the points that Thor laid out, you instead attack the messenger. Brilliant. But of course, we both know that you can’t argue the points Thor laid out. Can you? Of course you can’t, you indoctrinated old fool! So you respond with a personal attack so as to disguise the fact that you are intellectually challenged, and full of hate! Crawl back under your rock, bw.

        • DaveH

          Oh, I think Bob could argue the points, I just wouldn’t be able to understand what he was saying (as usual).

          • Kate8

            That’s very funny, DaveH! LOL. :)

          • JeffH


        • bob wire

          “Jay says:
          August 30, 2011 at 7:01 pm

          You have no intellectual integrity bw. You’re a flop, a boob! Rather then argue the points that Thor laid out, you instead attack the messenger. ”

          Hmm? I had to look back to see who Thor was. ~ To be most candid with you Jay, I didn’t read it through. More then likely , I spot read Thor’s posting, catching key words, conflict and circular reasoning. “The bible says” kind of statements and found it void of any original thought or ideas.

          “yes Jesus loves me, the bible tells me so” kind of stuff.

          I seen “no points” to argue, ~ other then the fact that the TEA Party is baptized in the Christian faith and they have plans to promote it at every opportunity.

          This comes from the Evangelical arm of the Christian faith as they see it their duty as a Christian to spread the “Gospel”

          So! are you going to try to convince me that I am “wrong”???????????

          I would enjoy having such a debate Jay.

          Perhaps you see no “intellectual integrity” for that reason? I’m not obliged to follow someone down a rabbit hole and discuss the merits of which direction “down” is.

    • coal miner


      You will find this ineresting.

      smaller particles: the electrons, protons … (The name quark comes from the … Atoms have nuclei containing protons and neutrons, and have electrons in the …

      • Thor

        Thanks CM, but I am well aware of all the latest findings in quantum physics, the “M-theory”–all of it is still based on theory. All the particles aforementioned are all–every single one–theoretical. No one has ever seen one. They are all predicted by mathematics and deduced from scratches on films of various metals, etc in particle colliders. No one is saying they don’t exist. The salient point here is about the nature of the evidence we use to make our deductions–that the existence of such particles must be accepted on faith and that theologians have equally as good evidence of the same dialectic quality as scientists.

        • Kate8

          Thor – The thing is, scientists like to make stuff up. They do it all the time.

          Funny thing is, they can see what they expect to see, whether they actually see it or not.

          Remember the studies which show electrons moving randomly until you observe them, and then they come together to reflect that which you expect to see?

          The fact that things happen this way is a really big clue, I’d say.

  • Rick

    Wow, there are a lot of crazy comments on here I gotta go>

    • professor

      My thoughts exactly, Rick, I am leaving too. There is some nutty stuff going around today.

      • Karolyn

        (Sigh) Try thinking outside the box.

  • KAB

    The atheist view is simple: In the beginning there was nothing – then it exploded!

    Romans 1:20-23
    For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, [even] his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:
    Because that, when they knew God, they glorified [him] not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.
    Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools,
    And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.

    We have the answers, we’re just too smart to see them.

  • Mirage

    I’m an apathetic agnostic … I don’t know, and I don’t care.
    In that vein, I’d like to see a clear seperation of church and state – a secular nation!
    Experiencing life as I have, it has been my observation, that if an active god exists, he or she, is a mean sob, and anything but loving.
    Of course, it is possible that; an active god exists, an inactive god exists, no god exists – who knows, anything is possible.
    We’ll never know the true answer, at least not in this life time, so why spend valuable energy arguing over who is right?
    At the end of the day, pick your faith i.e. Christianity, Taoism, Agnosticism etc., appreciate the freedom you have to practice your “religion”, don’t impose your faith on others, be consistent in following ALL the tenets of your faith (or you’re a hypocrat), and, most importantly, live and let live … religion shouldn’t breed hate.
    IF JESUS CHRIST WERE ALIVE TODAY, I don’t think his message would be, minimize taxes to historical lows (in modern times),don’t regulate the powerful, hate those with different opinions, and screw the poor if they cannot fend for themselves.
    There are alot of things I don’t know, but I’m pretty sure Jesus would be interested in helping those who cannot help themselves.
    You don’t agree, well then, guess you’re not a true Christian.

    • coal miner

      I go one better.

      I like to see all slly religions go.

      • coal miner


    • Kate8

      Mirage, Since you don’t know and you don’t care….

      Do you know what God says about the lukewarm?

      “I will vomit you out of my mouth”.

      • Mirage

        Spoken like an intollerant Christian … nice H8 Kate8. Don’t forget to take some Pepto before bed to hopefully cure you vomit problem.

        • Kate8

          Mirage – Typical Leftist reaction: shoot the messenger.

          These aren’t my words.

          The only hate I see here is coming from you, Mirage. That was a very nasty slur on my name.

          We get what we bring on ourselves. All of us. The hatred coming from the Left toward Christians is very much like Islamic hatred. It is a hatred toward God and His people. Yeshua tells us that this would happen during these times, that men would hate us for His sake.

          It is you on the Left who are obsessed with things like hate, racism, religion, etc…You use these things as a battering ram to attempt to control, silence and discredit those who disagree with the Leftist(communist) cause. You are very much like spoiled children who believe that you are entitled to more than what you have, even if it means taking from others to have it.

          In the end, it will be people who think like you who will suffer the most.

          I am sad for you.

          Have a nice day.

    • DaveH

      This is a secular nation, Mirage. It’s just that some of the people are dead set on ramming the Religion of Liberalism down our collective throats, in the process taking Freedom away from others.
      The way I see it, Religion doesn’t breed hate, Liberalism does. And that’s coming from an Atheist. Things were much more peaceful in this country before the pushy Progressives came along and decided that their one-size should fit all.
      Nobody is screwing the poor. They are doing that job quite fine all by themselves. While many of them were partying and avoiding education and sacrifice, the people, whose backs they want to ride on, were working long hours, doing whatever they could to make a living (enjoyable or not), spending every free moment improving their job prospects through education, and risking their money and pride in capital ventures.
      Minimize taxes? That’s a joke. This country’s Government now spends more money (relative to GDP) than at any prior time in history except WW2. And regulations aid the very people you Liberals claim to hate — the Ultra Rich. They can easily afford to hire the cadres of lawyers and accountants to jump through the ridiculous paperwork hoops, but their smaller competitors can’t. The result? Fewer competitors, higher prices, fewer goods, and fewer jobs. The taxpayers foot the bill for the bureaucrats who cause less productivity and higher prices, a double-whammy for the taxpayer.

      • Mirage

        Well DaveH, it is nice to know there is a man on earth who can explain the source of ALL our problems and asign blame to essentially One Source.
        Thank you for being brilliant in figuring out the demographic that is responsible for America’s decline!
        Now, if we could just get rid of those progressives who are ruining it for everyone.

    • coal miner

      Jesus wasn’t alive then.He was copied off a pagan myth.

      Nov 14, 1999 … Web site logo. Jesus-Pagan links. Parallels between the stories of. Jesus and Osiris-Dionysus. horizontal rule. Sponsored link. … -

      • Kate8

        coal – Remember, these are just books. Books with an agenda to erase all trace of Christianity from the world. This, too, was foretold by scripture.

        Why do you find Christians such a threat? You certainly don’t have that zeal against other religions.

        These writers are no more privvy to the truth than any others. Stories of our origins have been intentionally interpreted a zillion ways in order to keep us confused and lost, without hope of EVER learning the truth. That is why you must go only to the Source. But, even then, it is likely your own agenda which will come through until you’ve learned to transcend beliefs.

        ALL creation stories are presented in mythological form. I suspect there is reason for this. The common, literal, and clueless will read any of them without comprehension, as they’ve come to rely on “priests”, “gurus” or “scholars” to tell them what they mean.

        Another simple case of the blind leading the blind. Some day you will discover this, if you keep at it.

        • coal miner

          Kate8 says

          “Why do you find Christians such a threat? You certainly don’t have that zeal against other religions”
          Remember Nazi Germany?It was a Christian nation.
          Try the Spanish inquisition too.Christianity has committed genocide and destroyed entire cultures.The American Indians are an example.It seems we are having another repeat and this time we are doing it again in the name of religion, this time to the Arabs.I am oppose to Islam and Judaism also.

          • Mirage

            I’m in agreement with you Coal, for many of the reasons you mention. Unfortunately Christians (not all) like “K8-H8″,cannot tollerate people who do not believe as they do … they feel a burning need to impose their faith on others.
            Apparently radicalism doesn’t know just one faith. Wish they’d practice their religion without the preaching, and without the blowing up of the occational abortion clinics in the name of their god.
            Live and let live.

        • Kate8

          coal – That was so twisted I can hardly comment on it.

          Do you know who were exterminated in greater numbers than Jews at the hands of the German NAZIs? CHRISTIANS.

          It just serves no political purpose for the PTB to bring that up.

          Do you know who have been persecuted and murdered at least as much as the Jews in the world’s various countries? CHRISTIANS.

          Hitler was not a Christian. He was a member of the occult. He worshiped Lucifer. He was funded by the same ruling elite families that we have still today. And they are still manipulating the minds and lives of the world’s people.

          Why don’t you try reading some real history. It might help you.

          • coal miner


            He was a Christian.

            He hated atheists, and did a lot to force Christianity in school to protect the state from the evil atheist communists. A brief look at history can tell you this. He often spoke against atheism and spoke strongly about his belief in God and his son Jesus.

            He often spoke against the Christian church, something that a lot of Christians today even do, so like many Christians today, he was a Christian not as a religion, but as a personal relationship with Jesus and God.

            Adolf Hitler: Secular Schools Cannot be Tolerated
            Secular schools can never be tolerated because such schools have no religious instruction, and a general moral instruction without a religious foundation is built on air; consequently, all character training and religion must be derived from faith …we need believing people.

            - Adolf Hitler, April 26, 1933, speech made during negotiations leading to the Nazi-Vatican Concordant

            Adolf Hitler: We Will Fight the Atheistic Movement
            We were convinced that the people need and require this faith. We have therefore undertaken the fight against the atheistic movement, and that not merely with a few theoretical declarations: we have stamped it out.

            - Adolf Hitler, Speech in Berlin, October 24, 1933 Associated Press Story: “Campaign against ‘Godless Movement’”
            “A campaign against the ‘godless movement’ and an appeal for Catholic support were launched by Chancellor Adolf Hitler’s forces.”

            - Associated Press story, February 23, 1933,

            He also used Theistic Darwinism, using social darwinism to weed out unwanted people and beliefs based on religious bias instead of allowing natural selection which atheistic or biological darwinism uses.
            And I love how Christians say that him saying bad things against the church makes him an atheist. Protestant Christians say a lot of bad things against Catholics, so that must make Protestants atheists too!!! And Muslims must be atheists since they say bad things against Christians, and Jews are atheists since they can say bad things against Christians.

            OMG !! WE ARE ALL ATHEISTS NOW! 100% of the world population has now become atheist. =D

  • Amy

    Dear Mister Ringer,
    Although I do understand the point you are trying to make, you do not have the mental capacity to understand such things as earthquakes and hurricanes and nature in general.

    First, Mr. Biden’s remarks about FDR on television are wrong. However you are wrong too. FDR was the first President to be on Television. It was at the New York World’s Fair on April 30, 1939. The first Presidential address given on Television was by Harry S. Truman. Not only was FDR the first President to be on TV he also owned one. If you tour his home in NY you can see it. So you see television did exist when FDR was President.

    Second, scientists do know exactly why earthquakes and hurricanes happen. They know what causes them, and they can look at weather and determine if a hurricane could develop. However they can’t yet predict a earthquake, but they do know why they occur.

    You do however have some of the same questions I have. What caused the big bang? How can you get something from nothing? Where did gravity come from? What’s at the end of the universe? When you think of these questions it’s hard to believe that there is not a supreme being. But what if we are all just in a test tube? What if one day god was messing around and all of a sudden BANG! Can you imagine god saying, Hummm, I didn’t think that would happen. What if we aren’t real? What if we are just computer generated in a matrix? Does god really care? Why do bad things happen to good people?

    Your theory is backwards, if there is no supreme being then everything would be random. If there is a supreme being then that being would have a predetermined path for us to follow. Your belief in the Bible and the book of Revelations would be proof of that, Right? In fact Christians are looking at world events and expecting the end to come and know there is not a way to change it. If there is no supreme being then there would be no rhyme or reason to why things happen.

    What is the purpose of life?

    • Karolyn

      The purpose of life is to BE in joyful, loving harmony will everything. I have always felt that our primary purpose is to share and help one another.

  • Dan az

    Copper Heads!

  • Amy

    It’s hard not to believe in a supreme being that created the universe. However, it’s easy not to have religion. Religion is nothing more than man’s way of trying to control man.

    • Marie1

      Amy, you are so right

    • Kate8

      I do agree that religion was man’s attempt to control man. And it’s worked pretty well for the most part.

      However, religion has nothing to do with God. So what you are doing is throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

      • Karolyn

        Kate – Amy didn’t say she didn’t believe in a Supreme Being.

    • DaveH

      Then the Liberals must be very Religious, because they sure do want to control my choices.

      • Amy

        Like your choice to have an abortion, marry someone of the same sex, vote for your own senator and make sure you have a little bit of money and healthcare in your elder years no matter how poorly you planned. (All things the Republicans would like to outlaw)

        • Kate8

          Amy – In other words, you feel that other people should pay to have your bases covered, no matter how irresponsible, careless and immoral you choose to be.

          The thing is, that requires some people to actually BE responsible and work hard, so you don’t have to.

          This is, essentially, the credo of the Left. You demonstrate perfectly the entitlement mindset.

          • Amy

            I see nothing wrong with gay marriage. making something illegal doesn’t make it go away. For as long as there have been people on earth there have been homosexuals. You don’t truely understand them and that is why you are afraid of them. Or, as in most cases, those that are most offended by homosexuals are the ones most likely to be homosexuals, they just refuse to admit to themselves.
            Abortion certainly isn’t the best form of birth control but there are those that are better off not being born than being born and living a horrible life. What about an AIDS baby, born with AIDS, theres a good life, or the crack head mother that gets pregnat from turning tricks and really doesn’t want a baby and ignors it. How much public money will be spent on foster care, legal fees, jail time, police calls and so on because she was forced to have an unwanted baby? People that typically adopt babies don’t want black babies either so don’t say she can put it up for adaoption. How much welfare money gets spent on unwanted kids or unplanned for kids? You worry about public money funding abortions yet there are laws against it. Of course abortion activist have expanded to now be against birth control and to deny women care by not funding planned parenthood. If a woman can’t have an abortion and can’t afford the proper medical care chances are the baby will be born with birth defects and cost even more money, or will be sick in other ways and die. You want to cut government spending, but yet the things you want to cut will only create more need.
            You talk about government healthcare and how you don’t want to pay for someone else, guess what, you already do that. Every year you spend money in insurance premiums, if you are healthy you spend more than you get out of it. You money that you pay in goes to pay for other people that are unhealthey. If someone can’t afford to pay their hospitol bill, who pays it? The hospitol doesn’t, it’s all of us that have insurance. That’s why it cost so much because we cover the cost of those that don’t pay.
            If the government had public healthcare that was paid for by a tax then it could be taken off the resposibility of the employers and the employers could increase wages and plus still have extra money left over. But here in the US we tell employers to cover their employees health care. in other counties employers don’t have to pay millions in healthcare and they are more competitive.
            I have no problem with helping people that need help, I do have a problem with those that take advantage of program. Your response is to hurt everyone and just do away with them, mine is to revise them so they work better. The biggest problem is corruption on both sides. The best way to fight corruption is get rid of politicians and make sure they don’t spend a life time in Washington as many do now.

          • Kate8

            Wow, Amy. I guess I hit a nerve.

            Me thinks thou dost protest too much.

    • coal miner

      It’s hard not to believe in a supreme being that created the universe. However, it’s easy not to have religion. Religion is nothing more than man’s way of trying to control man


      • coal miner

        Amy says,

        “It’s hard not to believe in a supreme being that created the universe. However, it’s easy not to have religion. Religion is nothing more than man’s way of trying to control man” I forgot to put your name to the post.Amen

  • George Halepis

    Intellectually, humanity is still in it’s infancy. After all, people still believe in gods and governments! We’ve just scratched the surface of science and technology. As infants, we have a psychological need to believe in these things [gods and governments]. Dare I suggest Freud’s Future of an Illusion? We do know that the universe is expanding at a decreasing rate. So, what does this mean? It means that eventually the universe is going to stop expanding and will start contracting. Can you guess what happens happens next? That’s right! Another Big Bang! Astrophysicists guesstimate this as occurring in another 15 to 20 billion years. Long before that, however, our own sun is scheduled to go Red Giant in about a billion years, wiping out the known solar system including us, if we’re still around. Anyway, this has been going on and will continue to go on forever [eternity]. If this doesn’t sound somewhat random yet somewhat predictable, I don’t know what does. Since we feel uncomfortable trying to deal with this, we ascribe consciousness to this process and call it god. In any case, I leave you with one final thought: If there were a god, how could there possibly an atheist?

    • FreedomFighter

      Freedom of choice.

      Laus Deo
      Semper Fi

      • Karolyn

        You have that right. And it should be freedom of choice without fear of persecution and recrimination.

        • Kate8

          Then why is Christianity becoming the target for persecution?

          • Karolyn

            I still say in this country it ain’t happenin’, especially not here in the Bible Belt!

          • Al Sieber

            Kate, “Goggle” Albert Pike that will explain everything, the NWO want a one word religion, Lucifer.

          • Jay

            Persecution of Christians Growing in the United States
            Tuesday, February 6, 2001 (12:00 am)

            by Thomas Horn

            More Christians died for their faith in the twentieth century than at any other time in history, says Christian Solidarity International. Global reports indicate that over 150,000 Christians were martyred last year, chiefly outside of the United States. However, statistics are changing: persecution of Christians is on the increase in the United States. What’s happening to bring about this change?

            According to some experts a pattern is emerging reminiscent of Jewish persecution in post war Germany. “Isolation of, and discrimination against Christians is growing almost geometrically” says Don McAlvany in The Midnight Herald. “This is the way it started in Germany against the Jews. As they became more isolated and marginalized by the Nazi propaganda machine, as popular hatred and prejudice against the Jews increased among the German people, wholesale persecution followed. Could this be where the growing anti-Christian consensus in America is taking us?”

            Tolerance of anti-Christian attitudes in the United States is escalating. Recently, a woman in Houston, Texas was ordered by local police to stop handing out gospel tracts to children who knocked on her door during Halloween. Officers informed her that such activity is illegal (not true), and that she would be arrested if she continued. In Madison, Wisconsin, the Freedom from Religion Foundation distributes anti-Christian pamphlets to public school children entitled, “We Can Be Good Without God.” The entertainment industry and syndicated media increasingly vilify Christians as sewer rats, vultures, and simple-minded social ingrates.

            The FBI and the Clinton White House brand fundamentalist Christian groups as hate mongers and potential terrorists. The Council of Religious Leaders of Metropolitan Chicago warns that plans by Southern Baptists to hold a convention in the Windy City next year might foment “hate crimes” against minorities, causing some Christians to fear that speaking openly about their religious beliefs will soon be considered a crime. All this, while Christianity itself is often a target of hate-crime violence. We remember the students at Columbine, and the United Methodist minister who was fatally beaten and burned in a remote part of Chattanooga, Tennessee, to name a few of the recent examples of interpersonal violence aimed at believers.

            THE REAL ENEMY

            Manly P. Hall once wrote, “They are the invisible powers behind the thrones of earth, and men are but marionettes, dancing while the invisible ones pull the strings.” Satan’s string pullers have patiently manipulated unregenerate architects of American society for over five decades, networking both visible and invisible principalities to discredit Christian causes. Indicators reveal the propaganda blame-game against western believers is working.

            Even a casual observance of the facts reveals growing isolation of Christians as a people group, especially school age believers. Faculty and peer efforts to convince public school children that America was not founded on Christian ideals, and that our forefathers actually wanted a secular society, permeates public school interaction. History revisionists labor to eliminate any and all contradictory historical evidence from public school curriculum, and mockingly stereotype Christians as unenlightened fringe.

            A few years ago, Dr. Paul Vitz, then professor of psychology at New York University, worked with a committee that examined sixty social studies and history textbooks used in public schools across the United States. The committee was amazed to find that almost every reference to the Christian influence of early America was systematically removed. Their conclusion: the writers of the commonly used textbooks exhibited paranoia of the Christian religion and intentionally censored Christianity’s positive role in American history.

            Intolerant, Christ-hating censors of religious expression target the media and public school curriculum because this is the best place, outside of the churches and families, to indoctrinate children and thus manipulate the future political and cultural landscape. If one succeeds in separating Godly principles from public education and the media, they deny citizens the knowledge of good and keep them from embracing the laws of God. To that extent, they are pawns of evil and subvert and destroy both the message and the messengers of righteousness.


          • Jay

            Danger of Christian Persecution in America
            Orthodox Forum | by Pastor Symeon | Nov. 24, 2009

            On the one hand there are those who find it [the Manhattan Declaration] “shocking” and part of the culture war, etc. These are frightened that the document will be perceived as harsh and unloving, etc.. God forbid that anyone Christian ever stand in public for Truth. And on the other hand those that are relieved to see an Orthodox Pastor with backbone to stand with others and speak truth to error, truth to power, and truth to the politically correct stricture in our society that is choking free speech and seeking to criminalize Truth. – If this much sets you off, don’t bother to read further.

            My Bishop, fifth generation Orthodox priest, survived the Holodomor, the systematic starvation of between 10 and 20 million people mostly Christians in Ukraine by the communist in 1932 and 33. His father was forbidden to celebrate divine liturgy – all Christian worship was forbidden. He celebrated liturgy anyway and at the end of the service the local commissar showed up and told the congregation to return at 3pm that he had a wonderful surprise for them. He asked the priest to remain behind to help him prepare it. At 3pm the people returned and the priest was hanging upside down on the church doors. They held the crowd at gunpoint and slit the priest’s throat. My bishop at age 14 watched his father bled like a pig on the church doors.

            He escaped the communist on the way to “reeducation camp” and in the fifties made his way to America. About ten years ago, at least before 9/11 he asked me one day, “Father tell me, why are all these news people constantly painting everything that is good about America as evil and everything that is evil in society and is killing this country as good.”

            I told him what I knew to be true. “It is the spirit of the anti-christ trying to snuff-out the brightest light on the planet.” He said, “These people are sitting on soft couches in a grand cathedral God has ordained, throwing bombs at the foundation walls. And still they are going to be the most shocked when the entire edifice comes tumbling in around them.”

            I have for more than fifteen years, been beating the drum about Christian persecution around the world. Until 9/11 no one would listen, and then they only listened for a very short time. Now every news media is as silent as they were on 9/10, as silent as they were for two generations. The death toll is in the millions. We think it isn’t about to happen here?

            If something truly drastic does not happen shortly, it surely will happen here. Stricture of “laws” keeps slowly closing on free speech and soon, very soon it will be illegal to preach the Gospel. Oh yes, it will be legal to preach “some sort of feel-good inspirational gospel of all inclusion love and antinomian heretical grace, but the second you add that salvation comes also by living Jesus’ moral teachings, you will be in violation and the second you say that Salvation is by Jesus the Person, and not through feel-good inspirational all inclusive antinomian love, you will be in violation.

            We are already crossing the lines of ‘political correctness’ to speak the truth and political correctness is constantly being incorporated into law. It is an all out assault on truth in this country and Truth is a person, Jesus Christ.

            - Archpriest Symeon

          • Karolyn

            Jay – I guess I just live in a rural Bible Belt bubble. I do not back the types of behaviors against Christians written about. I may not be a Christian, but I do love everybody.

          • Kate8

            Al – Yes! Yes! I am very familiar with Pike.

            In fact, the video on the bloodlines has a segment on him.

            I have been shouting about the Luciferian agenda for months now on this thread. Lucifer, Allah, Apollo, Osiris, Nimrod…and dozens of other names…all the same entity.

            Soon to add another: BHO.

            And the name ‘Hussein’, given only to those of this bloodline (meaning “he is with us”)…well, you-know-who…it is a signal to the Islamic nations that he is, indeed with them.

          • OB1

            Kate8, I am going to post this link because it seems that many people on here today have some very weird ideas about Christianity. It seems to me the “problem” starts with Jesus. Seems to me this has been a problem for quite some time:


          • Kate8

            OBl – Yes, many here have weird ideas about Yeshua. They are ideas that are spawned by the evil of Progressivism, and have been indoctrinated into our youth to the point where they have no respect nor reason.

            We just need to remember that He will choose His Own. “Many are called, few are chosen”. Because they must choose Him, as well. Scripture tells us that the harvest is small.

            Thanks for the link. Perhaps some without understanding will take a look, but they are pretty poisoned in their minds.


          • Amy

            Because it’s been planted into your mind and you are weak so you you believe it. You are free to worship any way you want and to any god or not at all. Worshiping God isn’t putting a cross on the town square or praying in school. It is in your own heart and soul. If you need these symbols to prove to yourself that you are a good Christian then in fact you are only fooling yourself. Worshiping God can be done at home, work in the woods. You just do it, it’s not a big production like you think it should be.

          • Karolyn

            Amy – Very good point! Symbols really mean nothing. It’s what’s in the heart and right actions performed that count.

          • Kate8

            Amy – I have no argument with anything you just said.

            The truth is, I believe religion is a creation of man to control man, and I don’t belong to any.

            I have studied all major (and some minor) religions and philosophies in my life. In fact, it has been my life quest.

            I have come to the understanding that belief gets in the way of Truth.

            That being said, I do believe that the instructions for life laid out in the OT and NT are there to make life function on a higher level, and insure that, no matter how many obstacles we face, things will work out for our good. They help us to make the right choices, so the damage can be minimized (for example, to make the choice NOT to cheat on your spouse or succomb to other earthly temptations that will cause hurt and harm to others and wreak devastation in all lives involved). They are really just common sense.

            We are all magnificent works in progress.

          • bob wire

            Thank you Amy ~ little is more.

          • bob wire

            “Then why is Christianity becoming the target for persecution?”

            I’m so sorry that we can’t give you the keys to the candy store. Attempt to find comfort knowing that no one is allowed the key except over my dead body.

            Me and people like myself will forever, as long as we breathe guard the door key.

            So rest well, you are safe, you are protected like all others. It is an American idea, it is a sound idea and has worked well for 235 years,99 % of the time.

            While the Morman’s, American Indians, Baked Dividian’s, Snake Handling Jehovah Witnesses do have a valid argument to the contra, we work hard in this country to afford everyone the liberty of worship of their choice without outside interference with occasional “mixed” and sometimes less the desirable results.

            As the nation take in more outside religious influence, we are left to honor the spirit of our commitment to the US Constitution and the power separation of church and state.

            If you expect a Christmas Tree display on government facilities, be prepared to accept some other religion to adore government facilities with a dead goat or something you might consider odd or take acceptation to.

            There is no recognized seniority privileges associated with US Citizenship that I am aware of. But there should be !

  • Thomas Avery Blair

    Along the line of your article, I would care to share this real life experience with a die-hard evolution believer this past February 2011.

    I am a tax preparer and was working with this fellow on his 2010 tax return. As I did so I engaged in conversation with him about the economy and he related to me the following commentary…as best as I can remember it, he said…

    “I really don’t worry about the economy much. I have skills that will permit me to survive when others won’t. No matter what happens I believe in evolution and survival of the fittest. I have military training and served two tours, one in Iraq and the last one in Afghanistan.
    Trust me, there really is no god…a true god would never permit what I saw over there to happen. I also worked as a butcher at **** ***** and can render almost any kind of meat into food. If the store shelves are ever empty I will still find food. I do not believe in any kind of sanctity toward human life or of the human body. If I need to, I will “harvest” a weaker human and feast upon them as the need arises. I am not married and have no kids to worry about. The law of the jungle is kill or be killed…and we now live in a jungle. Now, are you going to finish my return for me? I have some shopping to do at Wal*Mart.”

    This fellow told me in so many words that he is a cannibal. I asked him point blank if he really thought he could eat human flesh in an emergency. His reply as he paid his bill was this: “Just look at it this way, my idea of ‘Love Thy Neighbor’ is simply to recognize my neighbor as a ready source of protein ‘on the hoof’ and I will do what it takes for me to survive.”
    I watched his eyes…he was not joking or kidding around. He meant every word he said. He lives four miles away from me…now I make certain my doors are locked each and every evening and my guns now stay loaded 24/7. I never ever suggest anyone to ever again spit out the words “bite me” because this guy, when given the need or the chance, probably will!
    At least food (no pun intended) for thought, is it not?
    Bottom line: All true believers of the evolution theories taught in public schools just may all be “closet cannibals” when the chips are down. Sleep well and stay locked and loaded, in NE Florida at least! :)
    Respectfully submitted,
    Thomas Avery Blair EA

    • Karolyn

      You certainly cannot judge all evolutionists by this man. No wonder he’s not married! It reminds me of a recent history lesson in which I read the story of some of the Jamestown colonists turning to cannibalism in the 1600s during the winter when there was no food. A story is told of a man who killed his wife for food. They also dug up dead bodies.

      • Kate8

        Sometimes people do desperate things in desperate situations. Scripture even tells of women eating their children during extreme famine.

        However, these people didn’t plan for it ahead of time, and they didn’t view their neighbors as ‘protein on the hoof’, and talk about ‘feasting’ on them.

        Sorry, karolyn, but this is another result of the devaluation of humanity. Some will just go to more extremes than others, but you can bet those folks will be there.

    • DaveH

      You run into one psychopathic evolution believer and you think that applies to us all?
      More brother is an outright sociopath, and he’s religious. May I lump you into the same group with him?
      Unbelievably ignorant.

      • DaveH

        Should’ve been “My brother” not “More brother”.

    • Jay

      Thomas, you cannot draw the conclusion that all who believe in evolution are crazed psychopaths based on one encounter with a psychopath who happens to believe in evolution. I know many who believe in the theory, including my two brothers, who, one happens to be an airline pilot, and part-time flight instructor, and the other, works for the United Nation as a systems analyst and developer. Neither one, would i consider insane. However, they are both, staunch, and firm believers in the theory!

      • Kate8

        I didn’t get that Thomas was saying that all evolutionists are potential cannibals.

        What I got was that, since the evolution THEORY relegates us all to being nothing more than evolved apes, there is bound to be less reverence for the sanctity of our humanity. Such a person is bound to be less constrained from placing his own survival before that of his neighbor.

        I’m not saying that a believer wouldn’t do that, as well. But Yeshua tells us it is blessed to lay down your life for another.

  • The Wolf

    Well lets see did any one call Mother Nature and ask her what was going on.we have devices that track and detect things.Mother Nature has the last call on it and she can change her mind in a milsec.

  • Peter Locke

    So, in the Truman Show, Truman reached a wall with a door in it? That door could be infinite distance, infinite time, bigness, smallness, even the Gig Bang itself. Mentally at each of these doors, we can ask, “what’s after the door”. Science is continually opening doors and staring into the new unknown. Could the Supreme Being have a Supreme Being, so on infinitely? I mean, after all, if it took a Supreme Being to create the universe, wouldn’t a Supreme Being be even more necessary to conceive of the Supreme Being?
    Gosh, I’m getting a supreme headach!

  • Headed for Hell

    Cheers to the 1 percent of you that go to the “right” church and belong to the “right” religion that will take you to “your” God in the sky. The other 99 percent of you are all going to hell. Not very good odds are they?

    Ask a Jew what he thinks and he will tell you the Christians are going to go to hell. So will the Muslims. I guess they don’t want to share their virgins.

    Ask a Baptist and he will tell you that about why the Lutherans are damned.

    Heaven is a very selective place, and running it is the God that created the Holocaust, and the Guy that saw too it the first Christians were thrown to the lions.

    Seriously, I envy all you that really keep your fingers crossed and pray your big lotto is going to come in when they close the casket.

    As for me I am more like Bill Maher who said this about President Obama who prays during times of crisis:” I feel so relieved that the President has a telepathic communication with his imaginary friend.”

    God forgive me for not using my real name. In his God’s some of you would want to hang me for “not believing.” That would teach me!

    I met some Mormon missionaries on the street the other day. Of course they tried to convert me. I told them why I like the Jews: it is because they have an exclusive club and they wouldn’t let me join even if I wanted to. As Groucho Marx once said, “I would never join a club that would have me as a member.”

    • Bob from SoCal

      God will never reject you, it is you that reject him. It is true that the Bible says that narrow is the way that leads to Heaven and wide is the path that leads to destruction. That is because there is only one way to rid yourself of your sin that you have committed in your life. There is only one man that lived a perfect life to become a perfect sacrifice to once and for all rid you of sin and the power of death. If you have sinned once you are going to hell. That is if you don’t take the free gift of God the pardon his son paid for. You have to have faith in Jesus and accept what he did for you to make it to heaven. Otherwise there is no way to get rid of your sin. If you are so confident that you are right just do one thing for me. Ask God to reveal himself to you and be honest. Please don’t go to hell. Don’t die in the darkness of your ignorance of God. Just because you don’t understand him doesn’t mean he doesn’t exist. Proof of God is all around you if you just look for him.

    • bob wire

      Bring in the clowns.

  • Jay

    Perhaps folks, what we are witnessing is the deterioration, or the 2nd law of thermo dynamics. Another words, everything is breaking down!

    Second Law of Thermodynamics

    Second Law of Thermodynamics – The Laws of Heat Power
    The Second Law of Thermodynamics is one of three Laws of Thermodynamics. The term “thermodynamics” comes from two root words: “thermo,” meaning heat, and “dynamic,” meaning power. Thus, the Laws of Thermodynamics are the Laws of “Heat Power.” As far as we can tell, these Laws are absolute. All things in the observable universe are affected by and obey the Laws of Thermodynamics.

    The First Law of Thermodynamics, commonly known as the Law of Conservation of Matter, states that matter/energy cannot be created nor can it be destroyed. The quantity of matter/energy remains the same. It can change from solid to liquid to gas to plasma and back again, but the total amount of matter/energy in the universe remains constant.

    Second Law of Thermodynamics – Increased Entropy
    The Second Law of Thermodynamics is commonly known as the Law of Increased Entropy. While quantity remains the same (First Law), the quality of matter/energy deteriorates gradually over time. How so? Usable energy is inevitably used for productivity, growth and repair. In the process, usable energy is converted into unusable energy. Thus, usable energy is irretrievably lost in the form of unusable energy.

    “Entropy” is defined as a measure of unusable energy within a closed or isolated system (the universe for example). As usable energy decreases and unusable energy increases, “entropy” increases. Entropy is also a gauge of randomness or chaos within a closed system. As usable energy is irretrievably lost, disorganization, randomness and chaos increase.

    Second Law of Thermodynamics – In the Beginning…
    The implications of the Second Law of Thermodynamics are considerable. The universe is constantly losing usable energy and never gaining. We logically conclude the universe is not eternal. The universe had a finite beginning — the moment at which it was at “zero entropy” (its most ordered possible state). Like a wind-up clock, the universe is winding down, as if at one point it was fully wound up and has been winding down ever since. The question is who wound up the clock?

    The theological implications are obvious. NASA Astronomer Robert Jastrow commented on these implications when he said, “Theologians generally are delighted with the proof that the universe had a beginning, but astronomers are curiously upset. It turns out that the scientist behaves the way the rest of us do when our beliefs are in conflict with the evidence.” (Robert Jastrow, God and the Astronomers, 1978, p. 16.)

    Jastrow went on to say, “For the scientist who has lived by his faith in the power of reason, the story ends like a bad dream. He has scaled the mountains of ignorance; he is about to conquer the highest peak; as he pulls himself over the final rock, he is greeted by a band of theologians who have been sitting there for centuries.” (God and the Astronomers, p. 116.) It seems the Cosmic Egg that was the birth of our universe logically requires a Cosmic Chicken…

    • Kate8

      Jay – Well now, that would really suck, wouldn’t it?

      Did you ever have the feeling that there really may be nothing to know?

      All this, and in the end we dissolve back into the Matrix. The Grand Finale. Poof!

      The great Cosmic Joke.

      • Karolyn

        Energy never dies.

        • bob wire

          Die? ~ destroy

          But it can be and is gathered, stored, transferred or manifested making life and all that surround us always different and exciting !

          • Kate8

            karolyn, bw – You guys are to funny.

            But, carry on,

          • Kate8

            You are also too funny.

            Should have skipped that last cup o’ joe.

          • bob wire

            “funny’ is a great place to start.

            Whatever it take to reduce the “heaviness” of “importance” and disarm your guar, your “filters” is “good”.

            There is little that you can actually change or control anyway.

            So enjoy a good laugh. ! ☺

            Learn to change what you can ~ your “response”!

  • Jay

    “But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men. But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with Yahweh (the Lord) as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day. Yahweh (the Lord) is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. But the day of Yahweh (the Lord) will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness, Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of Elohim (God), wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?

    Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness (2 Pet 3:7-13).”

    Kate, there are other scriptures that state the earth shall never pass away, but endure for ever. So obviously Peter does not mean a literal destruction, or extinction, dissolution of the earth. What he means is the destruction of the world, or system, satanic. The new Heavens, and the new earth is of course, God’s system of Righteousness, or, the new earth. The Holy city of Jerusalem coming down from Heaven. “Behold, says God, I shall make everything new”.

    • Kate8

      Jay – the Earth has gone through destructive forces time and again. The process of creation is a violent one. And yes, she always comes through to begin anew.

      Here is a video where they talk about the cosmic activities which are upon us, and what they likely mean. I haven’t watched the whole thing, but I plan to. Thought I’d pass it on.–o&feature=related

      • Dan az

        How high did you say you were?

        • Kate8

          Sorry, Dan az. I don’t partake. :)

          Oh! You mean elevation wise? I didn’t say.

          Around 2500 ft., give or take, at my immediate location.

      • Jay

        Thanks for the link Kate. It looks very interesting! I’ll be sure to watch it.

  • Earl, QUEENS, NY

    Just yesterday in a local newspaper (8/30/11 – amNewYork, page 6) we read that Michelle Bachmann said she was only being humorous with her comments. Apparently she suggested that two events (earthquake and Hurricane Irene) within one week were God’s warning to the politicians in Washington, DC. IMHO, there’s no need for apologies or disclaimers by Bachmann. Her recent comment makes far more sense than the drivel we hear from leftists/democraps, who suggest that natural disasters are the fault of GW Bush, the GOP, etc. I find it frustrating that many people believe the democraps’ stupid remarks. Even many kids know better than that!! As for man-made disasters, I’d have to say that perhaps the worst one occurred on 11/4/2008. On that infamous date, you made One Big Awful Mistake America!!

    Look at what’s happened in DC over the past several decades. School prayer banned, while the LGBT lifestyle is being defended and promoted – even to kids as young as kindergarten age!! Big government and socialism seem to be a God for drones and liberals/democraps. The environmentalist wackos seem to worship earth and nature as idols. Our first amendment rights to speech and worship are being threatened while legalized abortion kills nearly a million innocent infants each year. And as for class envy, the Democraps want us to hate anyone who has a dollar more than we do …..never mind the fact that so many democraps themselves are rich phonies. Is it not also a sin to covet or envy???? Given Washington DC’s behavior in recent years, it’s probably a miracle that we have yet to see God’s real wrath!!

  • Amy

    So many people here claim to be good Christians, yet many are hateful and uncareing towards their fellow human beings. Who among you is willing to go into a senoir home and tell those people that you don’t want them to have medicade, they should have planned better, and to pack their things, we aren’t going to care for them anymore?

    • Jay

      Are you talking about obama-care Amy? I, myself don’t want it, and most Americans don’t want the damn thing! And here’s a shocker, not all of them are Christians. Nice try! How about you go on the “guilt trip” all by yourself. I think you packed enough stupidity, so your good to go!

    • OB1

      Nobody here claims “to be good Christians”! Are you mental or a paid poster? Most of those I know who work and live in nursing homes here have not been able to get aid without a battle for years! My state is BROKE! Bankrupt! Should we borrow it from China? What part of “no money” do you not understand? The bureaucracy of progressive liberalism is killing my state! Over regulation! Every day is a battle for those who work for those in our nursing homes! Here, we try and support them through private donation and volunteerism! And right now, giving is down! We do fund raisers! Wake up!

      • Kate8

        OB1 – Gets frustrating, doesn’t it?

        The liberal world is so small, they just can’t see beyond government. They think it is the only answer to everything.

        It’s also painfully apparent that it’s so thoroughly ingrained in them that they will never be able to see beyond it.

        It will be the death of America. Maybe already is.

        Do you live in CA?

        • bob wire

          Conservatism (Latin: conservare, “to preserve”)[1] is a political and social philosophy that promotes the maintenance of traditional institutions and supports, at the most, minimal and gradual change in society. Some conservatives seek to preserve things as they are, emphasizing stability and continuity, while others oppose modernism and seek a return to the way things were.[2][3] The first established use of the term in a political context was by François-René de Chateaubriand in 1819, following the French Revolution.~

          Hhhmmmmm????? sound like a smaller world then “liberalism” to me.

          Let me read it again! Maybe there is something that I missed.

          • Kate8

            bw – You know what you can do with that?

            STUFF IT.

          • Kate8

            bw – The only thing conservatives want kept small is government, so that we have the freedom to grow unfettered in our economic, familial and spiritual lives without the overintrusion of “authority”.

            It’s liberals who want to have to answer to government for EVERYTHING, allowing it to get bigger and more intrusive, thereby limiting us more and more in every aspect of our lives. In fact, their favorite answer to any question is, “you can’t”.

          • denniso

            Look at this chart…our gov’t is smaller compared to the size of the economy than that of France,Germany and the European Union. Given the fact that we have higher ‘defense’ spending than all of them combined,that seems rather amazing.

            So,what about our more than 500 billion $ military budget and all the gov’t that goes along w/ it? What about the tens of billions that go to our multiple spy agencies every year,not to mention their intrusion into our privacu and lives?


        • denniso

          Define ‘small’…w/o reference to specific things and comparing gov’t size to population and modern requirements and desires of the people,’small’ has no meaning. One could make the argument that we already have a ‘small’ gov’t in proportion to our 310 million people,and when compared to other govt’s around the world. The rightwing has gotten away w/ using the term ‘smaller gov’t’ for decades w/o giving specifics or alternatives. We don’t live in the 1800′s anymore and have to function in a drastically changed global society that has much more complexity than we all may like.

          Liberals favor ending the hugely wasteful drug war…more than a trillion $$ spent since the 70′s,millions locked away,lifes wasted,society impacted…where is the ‘smaller,less intrusive gov’t’ that you say you want in one of the most egregious policy in our history?

  • Jeri Smith

    Has anyone heard of Dr. David Van Koevering He’s a Quantum Physicist also one of the inventors of the moog synthesizer. He explains about Einstein’s original Math on Relativity, which actually proves the speed of Light has been slowing down. That very proof means the universe isn’t as old as we think!

    • denniso

      If the speed of light is slightly slower than just after the Big Bang,there would be very little actual effect on anything. The universe is millions of times older than the supposed age determined by the Bible.

      • Jay

        You’re so thick headed denniso, a nail would not penetrate your skull. It is a well known fact that the Bible clearly reveals the earth is much older then 6000yrs. Although it doesn’t specify the exact age of the planet, it does point to a pre-Adamic era. However, the Bible does not concern itself regarding that period of history, rather, it picks up from Adam an Eve to present, which, according to the genealogical history, from that point to present, is approximately 6000yrs! Do you get it now, professor?

  • sunshineIQ

    Regarding hurricane Irene: They were seeding clouds in the 1950s. Not a word about it today. We just get these killer hurricanes. Yep, the models say the earth is warming and is causing it. But what if it’s people causing it? Where’s the science at on seeding clouds to cause rain in drought areas? Reporters? Check it out. Never hear about the HAARP project in Alaska either. Don’t forget to search Popular Science.

  • Jack

    The mistake you are making is in thinking that the universe we are living in was the target that the big bang was “aiming” for when it happened. Untold trillions of encounters have happened to get the universe to where it is now. You cannot look backwards and think the road is straight as an arrow all the way back to the beginning. There are many more branches that will forever remain unknown to us because they were “the roads not taken.”

  • Jack
  • Luci Tomlin

    Bob! I like your style! FAIR and FEISTY! Where do I send my VOTE?


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