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Despite Climategate, Republicans Remain Divided On Global Warming

December 16, 2009 by  

Despite Climategate, Republicans remain divided on global warming As the controversy surrounding the leaked emails from environmental scientists casting doubt on the validity of the data behind global warming continues, there are signs that there is substantial disagreement on the issue within the GOP.

Based on the leak, the United Nations (UN) announced a probe last week that will look into the allegations that some of its climate change research has been manipulated. Some lawmakers in Washington have called on the Obama administration to do the same, but it has so far refused to follow suit.

Among those pushing for an investigation in the United States is Representative Darrell Issa (R-Calif.) who said the government is failing in its responsibility to "ensure that U.S. policies are not driven by corrupted science and data," quoted by TheHill.com.

However, Senator Susan Collins (R-Maine) has said the content of the emails has not changed her views on global warming. She added that "[scientists she consulted] tell me it does not change their own conclusions or their own research [showing that global warming is a man-made phenomenon]," according to the news source.

Meanwhile, Roger L. Simon and Lionel Chetwynd, who are both conservatives and members of the Academy of Motion Picture Arts and Sciences, have demanded the Oscar that former Vice President Al Gore won two years ago for the environmental movie An Inconvenient Truth be rescinded.
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  • Dave McK

    The IPCC will investigate itself.
    Already 1700 subjects (scientists) have been compelled to sign a loyalty oath affirming the outcome of it in advance of its completion, so you may be sure consensus will emerge in due course.

    Meanwhile, the world turns without their help or hindrance. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFbUVBYIPlI

    http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/jamesdelingpole/100019821/climategate-with-business-interests-like-these-are-we-really-sure-dr-rajendra-pachauri-is-fit-to-head-the-ipcc/

    A confluence of interest.

    • s c

      Screw the IPCC. Flush the UN. Those losers had their chance. This topic concerns the GOP and what they’re going to do about fence-sitters, RINOs and all other in-house vermin who don’t have the guts to defect to ‘the other side.’
      Any ‘scientific’ group that can’t/won’t abide by the strictest scientific procedures is NOT WORTHY of being thought of as scientific. Call it what it is. The IPCC is just another overpaid, under-worked political WHORE.
      If the GOP doesn’t have any plans for cleaning its own house, then scrap the GOP. Screw the big tent theory. It hasn’t done anything for progressives.
      DO IT RIGHT! Nothing else matters.

  • J C

    Great! The UN is going to investigate one of its own. They’ll investigate with the same style they edited the IPCC panel’s findings.
    Which is to say it will be so doctored up as to be unrecognizable.
    But that doesn’t matter, just believe whatever they tell you and drink the damned Kool-Aid!

  • Peter

    Regardless of the veracity of the science or not, mankind has been defecating in our own backyards for far too long. We wouldn’t live in a house where nobody bothered to flush the toilet. Why are we content to live in a world where pollution remains unchecked? It’s our home and our children’s home, regardless of the cost to business to clean up their own mess.

    • J C

      Responsible stewardship of the environment and the Global Warming / Tax hoax are two very different issues. One we should all be on board with the other should have us firing our so called leaders.

    • George

      Certainly, we need to be careful not to pollute the planet. I’m 60+ years old now, and over my life I have seen a significant effort in this country to abate pollution. Our water and air are both much cleaner than they were in the past. The issue is what we think of as pollutants. Most of us agreed to pay to clean up man-made chemicals from the air and water that were harmful to wildlife, plant life, and people. But, you can’t really put CO2 in that category. CO2 is non-toxic, not a particulate like ash or soot, but is essential to healthy plant life. Sure there are limits to anything. I guess it’s possible to have too much oxygen in the atmosphere, but we haven’t classified that as a pollutant yet. The questions are “how much CO2 can the planet handle?” and “can we economically use alternative fuels that don’t create man-made CO2 without creating other more significant problems?” The answer to the first is “we don’t really know,” and the second is “not yet.” So, let’s be diligent about keeping our planet clean, but not jump to conclusions before the data is conclusive, especially if jumping to conclusions means wrecking havoc on our economy and turning over more control to our government. If the government was really interested in abating CO2, they would encourage a transition to flex-fuel vehicles that are capable of burning both gasoline or diesel and compressed natural gas. Natural gas is much cleaner than either gasoline or diesel and is abundant here in this country. Since they don’t want to take that step, it makes me wonder just how serious the rest of us ought to be about moving to electric vehicles which are more expensive, and use electricity made from coal (while cleaner sources of fuel are much more expensive and/or not yet sufficiently available to meet this kind of demand). By the way, this would also reduce our dependence on crude oil which would improve our trade deficit and increase the demand for workers in this energy industry…..good paying jobs….

      • Dan-o

        It’s always good to listen to our elders with good wisdom, not saying your real old just old enough to know.

        • George

          Thanks, Dan-O.

    • http://lightrnod1.blogspot.com Lightnrod

      Peter

      It is two very different issues.

      Environment yes.

      Global warming or Climate change – no. There is no real science behind it, the “evidence” of recent increasing temps is questionable, there has been historical evidence of changing temps much greater over long period of time, and then there is lacking evidence that man is creating any change in temps.

  • George

    97% of “greenhouse gases” are water vapor. Only a portion of the remaining 3% is carbon dioxide (CO2), and only a portion of that is man-made. Does it really make sense that the man-made portion is driving earth’s temperatures?

    Carbon dioxide is a naturally occurring substance in our environment. All animals, including human beings, expel CO2 in their breath and other bodily functions. Plants rely on sufficient levels of CO2 to survive, and in that survival create oxygen which animals rely on to survive. This is all part of the natural cycle.

    Even if man-made CO2 does impact the earth’s temperatures, what price are you willing to pay, and how much of your personal liberties are you willing to surrender to the government to try to correct this problem? How sure are you really that this will have any impact what so ever? Do you think the government will ever admit it overstepped its boundaries and return your liberties if it is eventually proven that the climate models are incorrect? Just how accurate are all those climate models anyway? (Why can’t they predict the cooling that’s been occurring since 1998?) How accurate is the data that the scientists use in their climate models? (Much of it has been shown to be very poor, and sometimes manipulated to give them the results they want.) Which of the scientific reports are truly unbiased by grants or loans provided by either the government, corporations, or special interest groups who have a specific outcome they want to see? (Most are paid for by one of these groups.)

    You can believe anything you want, so long as your belief doesn’t infringe on my liberties. When you start taxing and regulating my life to satisfy your belief, then you’ve crossed the line. Until you can answer my questions above, don’t “ask” me to sign-up to your religion, and I’ll do the same.

    • Dan-o

      Bravo! your the man.

      • George

        Wow! 2 attaboys in the same day. I think I’m dreaming. Ha. Thanks.

    • denniso

      George…wrong numbers. I’m not surprised because it’s become common for you non scientists to just make them up for your benefit.
      Water vapor and clouds account for 66% to 85% of greenhouse gas..not 97%. You people are all the same..when the gov’t has pushed for clean air and water in the past,you’ve spouted the same dogma..your personal freedom to pollute, you’ll go broke,it’s not proven to be harmful,etc..the same old crap. You’re worried about spending money to clean up 250 yrs of human mess and think it infringes on your freedom..what about the freedom of the next generations to live in a decent world? If you’re wrong about global warming,and you probably are,you sentence billions of people,including your grandchildren,to an increasingly hostile climate and tenuous existence. You’re willing to take that chance w/the fate of the world because you want to be able to drive a hummer w/ 400 hp and not pay another few dollars in taxes or energy costs. Disgusting!!

      • denniso
      • George

        Denniso, thanks for the clarification. That is helpful. I assume you “are” a climatologist since you fault me for not being one….. Even if my facts are off a little, I think the central points of my argument are still sound. You are correct in that “we people” (conservatives) don’t just accept emotional arguments like you’ve just made to surrender our money and liberties to the government in the name of a “good” cause. Like they say “the road to hell is paved with good intentions.” We would like to be convinced our tax dollars will be well, and productively spent (which is almost never the case when government gets involved), and that surrendering our liberties is necessary to preserve our way of life before we agree to it. That doesn’t mean we’re not for a clean environment, it just means we’re usually not going to be the first ones in line to support these programs because they may be reckless (especially to the economy which we all depend on for jobs, income, etc). I believe you as much as admitted that you aren’t convinced man-made global warming is a fact of life either. So we’re basically on the same page there. The difference is, you’re apparently willing to follow politicians into the abyss to save the planet (because they say we’ve got another “crisis”. (How many times have they said that to get us to agree to something without fully examining it first? Does stimulus spending or health care reform come to mind?) The rest of us want more proof that this is something we just have to do before getting in that line. We have no problem abating CO2 and other substances to keep the planet clean and livable, if that’s really necessary, right up to the point where you want to tax us (heavily) and relinquish our rights and liberties over to the government or the UN. We’ll agree to let our tax money be spent on research to develop viable alternative non-hydrocarbon fuels and other methods of reducing our hydrocarbon fuel consumption. Is that the action of a dedicated polluter? I think not. The case for man-made global warming hasn’t been made sufficiently yet to us, so we’re not ready to turn over our hard earned money and liberties to you or the government or the UN to solve a problem we’re not convinced really exists. However, when that argument is made and the “theory” proved, we’ll get in line with you if that’s our best option. Please understand, we’re conservatives, not whackos. We’ve worked hard to get the things we have in this life. We’re cautious about giving up those things, especially to politicians (or any other slick salesman). We generally don’t trust them to have our best interests at heart, regardless what flavor or party they come from. We’ve seen too many examples of how they waste our money, constrain our industries and economy, and incentivize our citizens to make bad choices with their social engineering schemes, all in the name of good intentions. Come on now, do you really think we’re all that selfish and narrow minded? Keep in mind if this theory turns out to be a misguided boondoggle after all, we may have saved you a lot of money, inconvenience, and misery. How about an attaboy for that? (only, in my dreams….I suppose….ha).

        • J. Swallow

          George:I would like to give you a real “Atta boy” for your post of 12-17 at 09:41. It is refreshing to see that people can still think and don’t have to get their information from sources like Wikipedia which is generally biases and; therefore, flawed. I would like to present you with, in my mind, the reason for this anthropogenic global warming scam being perpetrated and it has nothing to do with saving the planet for most that are the leaders in the scam and not the sheep that blindly follow them and don’t know why other than it seems to fulfill their liberal, neo-Marxist agenda.

          “We need to get some broad based support, to capture the public’s imagination… So we have to offer up scary scenarios, make simplified, dramatic statements and make little mention of any doubts… Each of us has to decide what the right balance is between being effective and being honest.” – Stephen Schneider, Stanford Professor of Climatology, lead author of many IPCC reports

          “Unless we announce disasters no one will listen.” – Sir John Houghton, first chairman of IPCC

          “It doesn’t matter what is true, it only matters what people believe is true.” – Paul Watson, co-founder of Greenpeace

          “We’ve got to ride this global warming issue. Even if the theory of global warming is wrong, we will be doing the right thing in terms of economic and environmental policy.” – Timothy Wirth, President of the UN Foundation

          “No matter if the science of global warming is all phony… climate change provides the greatest opportunity to bring about justice and equality in the world.” – Christine Stewart, fmr Canadian Minister of the Environment

          “The only way to get our society to truly change is to frighten people with the possibility of a catastrophe.” – emeritus professor Daniel Botkin

          “We require a central organizing principle – one agreed to voluntarily. Minor shifts in policy, moderate improvement in laws and regulations, rhetoric offered in lieu of genuine change – these are all forms of appeasement, designed to satisfy the public’s desire to believe that sacrifice, struggle and a wrenching transformation of society will not be necessary.” – Al Gore, Earth in the Balance

          “Isn’t the only hope for the planet that the industrialized civilizations collapse? Isn’t it our responsiblity to bring that about?” – Maurice Strong, founder of the UN Environment Programme (This is the same SOB that is partnered up with Al Gore, whose company, Generation Investment Management, which is now worth over $200 million. Strong spends most of his time in China, the worst polluter on the planet, (CO2 is not a pollutant but an essential ingredient for life on earth). & he is doing what he can to make this communist country the world’s next superpower.)

          “A massive campaign must be launched to de-develop the United States. De-development means bringing our economic system into line with the realities of ecology and the world resource situation.” – Paul Ehrlich, Professor of Population Studies

          “The only hope for the world is to make sure there is not another United States. We can’t let other countries have the same number of cars, the amount of industrialization, we have in the US. We have to stop these Third World countries right where they are.” – Michael Oppenheimer, Environmental Defense Fund

          “Global Sustainability requires the deliberate quest of poverty, reduced resource consumption and set levels of mortality control.” – Professor Maurice King

          “Complex technology of any sort is an assault on human dignity. It would be little short of disastrous for us to discover a source of clean, cheap, abundant energy, because of what we might do with it.” – Amory Lovins, Rocky Mountain Institute

          “The prospect of cheap fusion energy is the worst thing that could happen to the planet.” – Jeremy Rifkin, Greenhouse Crisis Foundation

          “Giving society cheap, abundant energy would be the equivalent of giving an idiot child a machine gun.” – Prof Paul Ehrlich, Stanford University

          “The big threat to the planet is people: there are too many, doing too well economically and burning too much oil.” – Sir James Lovelock, BBC Interview

          “My three main goals would be to reduce human population to about 100 million worldwide, destroy the industrial infrastructure and see wilderness, with it’s full complement of species, returning throughout the world.” -Dave Foreman, co-founder of Earth First!

          “A total population of 250-300 million people, a 95% decline from present levels, would be ideal.” – Ted Turner, founder of CNN and major UN donor

          “… the resultant ideal sustainable population is hence more than 500 million but less than one billion.” – Club of Rome, Goals for Mankind

          “If I were reincarnated I would wish to be returned to earth as a killer virus to lower human population levels.” – Prince Philip, Duke of Edinburgh, patron of the World Wildlife Fund

          “I suspect that eradicating small pox was wrong. It played an important part in balancing ecosystems.” – John Davis, editor of Earth First! Journal

          “The extinction of the human species may not only be inevitable but a good thing.” – Christopher Manes, Earth First!

          “Childbearing should be a punishable crime against society, unless the parents hold a government license. All potential parents should be required to use contraceptive chemicals, the government issuing antidotes to citizens chosen for childbearing.” – David Brower, first Executive Director of the Sierra Club

          Maybe one of these quotes can be attributed to denniso

    • J. Swallow

      I know that there are some out there that realize the atmosphere is made up of 78.08% nitrogen, 20.95% oxygen, ( 99.03% of the atmosphere is made up of these two gases) .93% argon and .0001% neon, helium and krypton for constant components and .4% water vapor that constitutes 95% of what cause the green house affect and we had best not forget CO2 at .038% and the rest is made up of trace gases such as CH4,SO2,03 and NO, and NO2.? These trace gases are very important, H2O being the most important because it contributes 95% to the green house effect, and with out these gases the surface of the earth would too cool/cold to support life as we know it.
      I know that most on here other than perhapes denniso realize just how complex and ever-changing the earth’s climate is; therefore, computer models are unable to deal with all of the variables and make accurate predictions about the future, as shown in the fraudulent emails from the Climate Research Unit (CRU) at the University of East Anglia. It is a fact that CO2, at present, makes up .038% of the atmosphere yet there are ones on this thread that argue that it is the one, the only and sole trace gas and is responsible for the earth’s climate being what it is and that to me is just plain stupid and if they can explain how this is then they should do so with facts and reasoning and cut the BS.

      If they do not want to understand that water vapor makes up 95% of what constitutes the green house effect then consider that the coldest nights of the year occur when there is, guess what, no cloud cover to hold the radiated heat in. This is why the deserts, that have almost no humidity and clear nights, can be 130* during the day time and drop to near freezing at night. I lived for over twelve years 140 miles above the arctic circle ( You should see the Aurora Borealis from up there, you can look south and see it as well as over head, especially when that main contributor to the earth’s climate, the sun, is having a big hic-up) in far north western Alaska and I now, because of that experience, I now live in the tropics where living is easy.

  • Bill Fox

    The earth has been warming for nearly 150,000 years. We are at the end of the previous 250,000 year Ice Age cycle. If Antartica’s ice melts (90% of the world’s fresh water is locked up there) then sea levels will rise 200′ to 300′! There is no real evidence humans were around 150,000 years ago to trigger this global warming.

    Carbon Dioxide makes up 0.03% of the atmosphere. If all available carbon were oxidized, CO2 would “leap” to 0.04% of the atmosphere. CO2 does not cause Ice Ages or warming trends. CO2 is coincidental to them. The activity with in the Sun and the proximity of the Solar System to the core of the Milky Way Galaxy, causes global warming and cooling, not CO2.

    Ice melts at 33 degrees F. The average global temperature is 54 degrees F. The ice on the planet will continue to melt until the temperature of the Earth drops to 32 degrees F. An Ice Age will then be forthcoming. The cycle is 250,000 years.

    1,000 square miles of the Earth’s surface generates more energy in a year than all of the activity of humans since they first walked on the planet. We have no understanding of the cycles of the planet. We don’t know what is even five miles under the surface. We have no inkling of where our little home is in Universe.

    Humanity and politicians have no idea what is coming in the near and distant future. Be assured, it will be somewhere between the wildest dreams paradise and the worst nightmares of our imaginations.

    • denniso

      Bill…i suggest you actually read some science. “we have no idea about the cycles of the planet”? Wrong!! “We don’t know what is 5 miles under the surface of the earth”? Wrong!!!

      • J C

        And your point is? Should we assume that you are actually silly enough to believe that “money” would solve the problem even if there actually was one? Ok then, I have a suggestion…rather than just paying all the rich people in poor countries to help them fight a non existent problem…why don’t we just start putting 100 dollar bills in orbit around the planet? That way we can finally establish that American currency is actually becoming worthless in a very real sense, AND we can block out the sun that is supposedly going to fry us. Sound good denniso? Radical enough for you?

        • J C

          PS…Let’s start with YOUR money. :)

  • madmary

    Hey Peter
    If we lived like we should defecation would not be a problem. You see, Peter, everything reverts back to organic form and becomes a part of LIFE. Do you really think humans can do anything to change Mother Nature? Your ego is way too large if you do.
    The Global Warming Scam, is just that, a scam, and just one more way for rich banksters to take your money because that is where it will go, to a group of rich elites who want the planet back to Nature, all for themselves. They care nothing for YOU, Peter, or for me.

    I love to defecate outside in my yard because the sewer systems were designed a hundred years ago. It is the way we live Peter, that is off balance. You need to listen to George Carlin for a reality check. Even he knew the ‘Acid Rain” Global Cooling The Ozone Layer Global Warming, even he knew these are all LIES from the power hungry control freaks.

    I would think you would care more about the bogus Federal Reserve printing dollars out of thin air. That is our real problem.

    • denniso

      Very enlightened and genius like comment. Thanks for helping to continue to screw things up.

      • George

        Speaking of enlightened comments, thank your for your words of encouragement and wisdom….

        • cr747

          encouragement, wisdom, DENNISO? You surely don’t believe anything this person says!!!!!!!!!!!! If you do then you are the only one that I have seen agree with him. I think he is Obama’s illegitimate child. Neither one of them knows what they are talking about.!!!!!!!!!!!

          • George

            Ha, ha, ha. I made those comments to Denniso in jest. No, I don’t agree with him at all. I was trying to point out that his comments weren’t all that enlightened either. Sorry about the confusion, but I did enjoy your retort…………thanks.

  • JuliBMe

    Oh, brother! Who wants to “defecate” in their own house? Who wants to destroy the world’s environment? Not one reasonable person, is the answer. However, you can’t just mandate “regardless of the cost” to someone else, “it must be cleaned up!” YOU clean it up! YOU invent the solution! The “cost” you are referring to is greater unemployment, much higher energy costs for “solutions” no one has invented yet, much higher taxes that go to Obama’s friends and not to “clean energy”. Obviously, there is a market for “green”. So, let the businesses do what they do best, innovate. Get the government the hell out of the way. You will see solutions much faster that way.

    You also need to check your facts. The poverty-stricken countries are the worst pollutors of this planet. More people die because of their abject poverty in those countries than in the rich countries. Making this a poverty-stricken country to atone for OUR supposed “sins” of pollution. As we get richer, we will invent more ways to do business cleanly. Obama picking winners and losers in this game will only put us back into the dark ages. We don’t need to LOOT money from the producers of this country to give to Obama’s friends, the dictators of the poor countries. We need to EXPORT capitalism and freedom along with free enterprise! Sheesh, wake up, and get some REAL information, Peter!

  • Bob

    CO2 is not the cause of Global Warming and it is time smart and unbiased scientists present in an open forum their validated research so the truth be known. I do not believe in man-made global warming, but, different that those that support such, I am willing to hear the facts to prove my stand as truth rather than stand behind lies and falsehoods saying it is fact and no further discussion is needed. The scare tactics and threats normally used by the left will not work in this case for the costs are too high in the economic harm this hoax will cause for America and other nations. Let there be open and fair presentation of the FACTS so we all know the TRUTH.

  • Robin from Indiana

    It doesn’t hurt to be aware of what is not good for our world/environment, but the scare tactics of global warming are only created to help those who steer this ‘theory’ in the direction they want it to go to make sure their investments will grow. It’s really too bad that they have the ways and the means to control the media and wall street.

    • American Citizen

      With the revelation of those e-mails proving the global warming theory is a hoax, it validate what I have thought all along. Those computer models are only as good as what the scientists put in. This world does not work on theory but solid facts. Mother Nature is laughing at them.

  • The truth

    It’s all B.S. so the new world order can squeze us for more money and gain more contol. Wake up people!!!!

    • George

      I’m inclined to think most people know the truth, or at least aren’t ready to play follow-the-leader as they try to take us to the cleaners. Unfortunately, it seems the people have lost control of their government. We need to figure out how we can correct that problem….

  • http://victorbarney@embarqmail.com Victor L Barney

    No body in governments actually cares about global warming, it’s all about power and control for Satan!

  • Ron

    I am going to digress to the original premise of the story, the inability of GOP to agree on anything. I personally will forever remain a conservative, but believe the GOP is practically irrelevent. The leaders of the GOP cannot agree on anything,and can only put forth old worn out candidates for office, which have, and will continue to get their conservatives butts kicked each election. Plus, the current bunch of Republican in the House and Senate have taken as their strategy a clammed up silence or ignoring of the problems. I would like to see a Republican Senator or Representative who has the guts to jump right in the middle of Nancy Pelosi and the rest of the Democratic leadership, yet all we hear is a deafening silence. I know we here in Texas have representative and Senators who haven’t uttered a word against a Democrat in their political lives. Why hasn’t a Republican ever questioned Obama’s legal right to be President, or the constitutionality of many of the things done recently by him, are they so afraid of him ? What we need are some conservative leaders who will fight back and that are not afraid of losing their jobs, which they are going to lose anyway, if they don’t change their tactics.

    • American Citizen

      You’re right, the last two elections, who did the Republicans run for President? Two old men who should have retired completely from politics, Bob Dole and John McCain. We need young blood with fresh conservative ideas who are not afraid to buck the establishment. That’s why I’m for Sarah Palin as president and Michelle Bachmann as vice-president. Two strong conservative women who have proven they have enough experience to choose good people in the cabinet to help. Just think, as the Democrats have the first black president, the Republicans could have the first woman president. Do you think the world would turn over on its axis?

      • Claire

        You betcha. Oh, I heard a guy threw a couple of tomatoes at Palin during one of her book-signings. I heard it once on TV–they sure hushed it up quick.

    • George

      I agree with much you say. However, while we conservatives have been disappointed with the Republican Party for their lack of conviction and leadership in a number of areas, especially on fiscal matters, I have concluded that our choice is usually between bad and worse, not good and bad. I’d rather vote for someone who is a half-hearted conservative than someone who is a half-hearted liberal, or worse yet, full-blown liberal. Also, as one who threw his vote away a few years ago by voting for Ross Perot and helping to elect Bill Clinton, I’ll never do that again. I’m convinced that our best chance of getting control of our government again, is to try to find good candidates and get them elected within the Republican Party. The real work comes in finding good candidates and getting them nominated in the primary process, not waiting for the general election to make our voices heard. Third parties just don’t have much of a chance in this country. The journey is often aggravating, and sometimes even disgusting, but I’m convinced that’s the shortest path to success. If we’ll just find candidates that are fiscally conservative right now, and keep the pressure on them to stay that course, I think we might just get through this mess. Otherwise, the government could fail under the weight of all this debt within a few years, and there will be major change, but not after going through significant upheaval.

      • Chuck

        While this seems the best way – the truth is all this does is slow the process down, and has no chance of reversing it. We have to vote out the ones who are not conservative and vote in the ones who are. If that means we destroy the republican party and replace it with a party that is actually conservative, that is fine.

        • George

          I agree with that, but I believe it’ll be faster getting where you want to go by changing the Republican Party rather than starting a new conservative party. While conservatives split their vote, liberals will be busy running our government and driving us down the short road to hell. We can’t afford the luxury of giving the liberals a free ride for another decade or more. This country is going down the drain fast…… I believe we have the numbers to take over the Republican Party and take it in the direction we want to go. If we don’t, we won’t have the power to do much more than split the vote, where the only winners will be the liberals. I’m pretty sure given the option of having a RINO or a liberal in office, you’d reluctantly vote for a RINO because he/she will listen to you while the liberal won’t. Yes, we need to vote for as many Reagan conservatives as we can, but in the process we may have to temporarily accept some RINOs because they will more often than not vote with the conservative majority since that’s where they get their votes. Just another opinion to think about…..

          • Joe H.

            George,
            Get ready….. Athird attaboy for today!!!! I’ve been saying the same thing forever! The vote split was what got O-man elected in the first place!!! In the next presidential election, if we split the vote we are just going to have 4 more of O-man!!! voting for someone who hasn’t a chance in hades of winning is just another vote for O-man by default!!!! Can we afford 4 more years of him? Can we afford to let him take us further down the pit of desolation???? We need to convince someone like Hunter who is a patriot and is against the open borders to run and then go door to door if need be to convince people to vote for him!!!! We need to run a better than average conservative and get him elected!!!

  • david kolbinsky

    Paa…leeeeezze! What you white european males want to do is to continue in your centuries long crusade to oppress native peoples. But we who are brown, red, yellow and black have fought back, and now are in a position to control the economics of your military industrial complex. You can’t stop Barak Huesein Obama. He has the world on his side! We will wreck the economy that you have built on the backs of the poor, and return the stolen wealth to it’s rightful owners!!!!

    • American Citizen

      That’s so much bullfeathers. Every citizen of this country has the same opportunities to become successful. What you people of color want is to have it handed to you instead of working for it. Nobody gives white people unearned riches. Look at how many black millionaires there are today. But they earn it by their sweat equity.
      All white people did not become rich overnight. It takes time and hard work. In fact, most of us would not be considered rich. We are mostly lower and middle middle class if not on welfare. The poorest in this country still have it better than a lot of people in those third world countries and that’s where Obama and his ilk want to take us. For you to say you want to steal what others have worked for shows just what kind of person you are.

    • Warrior

      Absolutely white! We’re going to return it to government employees and unions.

    • J C

      What color is the sky on your planet?

    • George

      That kind of Communist crap will get this country in trouble if enough people succumb to it. God forbid.

    • s c

      David, paaaleeeeze, take your pills. Your comments are more of the same worn out pig schmuck that “obligates” ultraliberal, progressive zombies to continue to whiz and moan about Bush being in the white house (he’s no longer there, by the way).
      Paaaleeeeze, stop smoking whatever it is that makes you so predictable. Paaaleeeeze, get a new routine. Paaaleeeeze, exchange that silly putty for a functioning brain. Paaaleeeeze, get a life, and try to act your age (paaaleeeeze tell us you’re at least 18). Look at yourself in a mirror, get some new friends, and try to act like someone who may (someday) be an informed, responsible adult – paaaleeeeze!

      • Smilee

        paaaleeeeze, address the content of the posts you are responding too and quit the name calling it makes you look and sound totally without any having any intelligence

    • Dan-o

      David a nother lazy give me person. What your Daddy never taught you to work hard.

    • Michael J.

      David Kolbinsky, The present occupier of the White House is not your friend either. He is preoccupied with his own agenda. While his campaign to be POTUS may be over, he now campaigns to be United Nations Secretary General (King of the world)and has already forgotten about you except in matters relevant to his own future.

    • Joe H.

      david k.
      Would you rather EARN your way or be beholden to someone that gave you your way? Would you rather be proud of what you have accomplished or be given everything and not have any pride? I can tell you are not Native American for they are a fiercely proud people and will fight if you tell them they aren’t. Even after all the time on the res, they are just looking for a chance to EARN a living not have it handed to them!!!! If you think O-man is your friend then you are sadly mistaken. He wants to take from others and GIVE you a HANDOUT!!! All this is to BUY your vote nothing else. He has NO RESPECT for you, believe that!!!

  • Earl, QUEENS, NY

    IMO, it is on the environment in which the GOP is weakest. In some cases, Republicans even go along with the Democraps and environmentalist wackos, instead of standing up and asserting that global warming is a hoax!! The environmental fringe group is one of the greatest threats to our liberty and prosperity. In California, cutting of water supplies to farmers to protect a fish species is just one of many things the GOP should emphasize, and try to correct as part of its campaign. As for government spending, many Republicans wandered off the conservative field during Bush’s last few years. (But why were so many voters in 2006 and 2008 stupid enough to think the Democrats would do a better job?) THE BOTTOM LINE, HOWEVER….the GOP has good plans, but simply does not presently have the votes now to stop the liberals or undo their damage to America. The way to correct this is for ALL VOTERS TO WISE UP IN 2010 AND 2012!! THE DEMOCRATS NEED TO BE VOTED OUT OF POWER – PERMANENTLY!!

    • Gary Cody

      Earl,
      I am afraid we cannot have much confidence in the pubs offering any real leadership. Except for a couple of notable exceptions, they historically have not.

      In fact, I see no real difference in the pubs and the dems. I think both parties have outlived their usefullness. It is all about the MONEY, unfortunately.

      For example, the pubs do not even seem to be able to take advantage of the unpopular dem proposals like “cap & tax” and “Medical reform”. Which makes me wonder just how much money is being thrown around by the special interest groups in d.c.

      I would like to suggest a few changes that I would hope will improve things:

      1. Impose term limits on all 3 branches of the federal government:
      a. senate one 6 year term and out
      b. house two x 2 year terms and out
      c. supreme court justices one 6 year term and out
      d. After serving their terms, or any portion thereof, in one office, they would not be elligible to hold any other federal office for a period of 10 years
      e. Maintain the two x 4 year term on presidents
      2. All senators and reps shall reside in their home districts (or states). There will be no formal deliberations such as we now have in the house and senate in d.c. All voting will be done via a secure internet connection so that no senator or rep will need to be present in d.c. for any reason except for special meetings like the “state of the union” address, etc.
      3. Each state shall establish a review process which shall consist of a 5 person committee which shall maintain an ongoing review of the candidates income and expenses once they are elected and for a period of 10 years after leaving office.
      4. Any politician found taking money or favors from any special interest group will be forced to serve a minimum 10 year jail sentence with no chance of parole.
      5. Eliminate the Federal Reserve and dictate a gold and silver based currency in lieu of the fiat currency which is now undermining our country.
      6. Amend the Constitution to force a balanced budget. Any deficit will require a 75% vote in favor of the specific expenditure.
      7. Establish an independent committee of Constitutional experts (not judges) who shall review each and every law prior to it passage in congress to determine if it is Constitutional.

      • JP

        How about a mandatory sunset provision on all legislation, every 7 years after original passage? Re-approval requires review and re-vote on all legislation.

        • Gary Cody

          JP:
          I like that idea. I would also add that any NEW law would require the repeal of an existing law since there are laws on the books now that are so outdated they are hardly ever noticed, much less inforced.

      • George

        Sounds like some good ideas to me. I’d focus on 1) reducing the amount of money Washington has to spend, 2) better control over regulating authorities to try to prevent unnecessary, inefficient, and/or unconstitutional limits on our liberties, 3) limiting the amount of time our representatives can continuously serve in office, 4) closer scrutiny over the financial condition of our representatives during their term and for some prescribed period after they leave office, and 5) try to take the politics out of our judicial system and select judges who merely interpret the law, rather than making it. I especially like JP’s idea of letting laws sunset so they are required to be reapproved after some prescribed time. I suppose, however, if we did that, after awhile all our lawmakers would be doing is reviewing and approving old laws…..hummm.

        • Joe H.

          George,
          I’d be real careful about legally passed term limits!!! It takes an act of congress to pass them and all kinds of nasty things could be tacked on. Like say all private weapons must be under a certain caliber. Or like it takes an act of congress to react to an act of war, like a nuke threat! (with these idiots you never know!!!)

          • Gary Cody

            Joe,
            Actually it would take an amendment to the Constitution if I am not mistaken. That would generally get a lot more scruteny than the normal legislation which, as you note, often get a lot of baggage tacked on.

    • Claire

      And Republicans must be voted out of power–permanently!! Both parties are at fault.

      • George

        Do you want liberals to take their place?

        • Claire

          you didn’t read my post correctly–I included the Dems too by agreeing with Earl/Queens/NY so don’t get in an uproar.

          • George

            OK. Sorry about that. Have a pleasant evening.

  • Steve Coy

    Talk Talk Talk, if any of you have’nt noticed both sides have sold us out for power our money and one world Government. There is only one way to get our Country back and that is to pick up our guns and march on Washington D.C. and hang them all. Our Founding Fathers gave us our guns so Government could not do what they are attempting to do. Waiting for the spineless Republicans and the so called Conservatives to do something will only guarantee that Obamanation will suceed. I will be out front, I was willing to fight in Viet Nam I am certainly willing to fight here to save the greatest Country on earth. I took an oath when I entered the service to protect this country from foreign and Domestic enemies and our Half White President, Senate and House are our enemy. Voting does not work, look at the people we have elected since Ronald Reagan and you can see we are Screwed!

    • Gary Cody

      Steve,
      I have to agree with you and I seriously believe events have already been set in motion that will end up in a Civil War. I can think of no other explanation for what the islamobama administration and “our” congress is doing to our financial system. I believe they are attempting (with absolute success) to cause a financial crisis that will allow islamobama to declare martial law. Their purpose is to take dictatorial power of the US. I believe they are counting on the assistance of the military who will be used to enforce the dictates made by “our” government. I can only hope that the majority of the military will refuse to kill American civilians.

      • http://myronjpoltroonian.blogspot.com Myron J. Poltroonian

        I’ve heard about something being called “The Oath Takers” that is being subscribed to by many rank and file solders and policemen across the country. Their “superiors, of course, are much more reticent to publicly take the oath. What it basically says is that the “Promiser” will not take part in any disarmament of the general population of America, nor any abridgment of their freedoms, including the right to freely move about the country and not be “rounded up” and be placed in FEMA “Security Camps”. If this is true, I have a warning for those who do not feel inclined to make the promise. 1. If you wonder what these reports are ginning up, go to the government’s Army Jobs page and look up “Internment/Resettlement Specialist”. I did. It upset me so much I sent the following to them: I find this ad for “Internment/Resettlement Specialist” today? August 15th of 2009, 65 years to the day Emperor Hirohito conceded defeat, ending WW II? I’m an ex GI (06/’59 – 06/’62) living next door to an 88 year old WW II vet, a survivor of the “Battle of the Bulge”, and I find this? This is not the “My country, right or wrong, my country” I learned to love as a child, youth and adult. This is what I went into the service to, if necessary, sacrifice my life to protect us against. Shame on you. “I was just following orders” was not, is not, nor will it ever be a defense for crimes against your fellow countrymen. I call it treason. Plain and simple. 2. Then: “Give me liberty, or give me death!” was enough. Now: “Give me liberty or I’ll give you death!”, should be closer to the truth. Then: “You can take my guns from my cold, dead fingers!” expressed an attitude I always considered defeatist. Now: “You may not take my guns from my cold, dead fingers. Rather, they will take my bullets from your cold, dead bodies!” is my version of an American survivalist attitude. Now that’s an attitude Americans can live and survive as freemen with. As Doctor Savage has noted: “It is coming”. Unless, of course, we’ve already crossed the Rubicon into defeatism. My advice? “Aim just below the blue helmet – no matter what color it is”.

        • denniso

          You apparently listen to Savage,the crazed kook. Not good to form opinions based on a hatemonger and moron getting wealthy off of his
          fearmongering.

          • George

            Denniso, are you referring to Savage or Al Gore? humm…….help me out.

        • Curtis S

          Will you guys be flying the Confederate Flag while you’re at this revolution/civil war?

      • Claire

        Why do you think this? Give me an explanation.

        • Claire

          This was for Gary.

        • Gary Cody

          Claire,

          Well, I believe:
          1. We are headed for a financial crisis caused by ever increasing debt and deficit spending on the part of this congress and administration.
          2. I do not trust our “leaders” from either party and I especially do not trust islamobama and his gang of thugs.
          3. Based on the little that I know about the current “president”, I am scared for the future of the Country:
          a. We know less about obama than any public servant I know.
          b. We do know his “friends and associates” all seem to be anti-American, Constitution hating, communist leaning, radicals.
          c. Obama’s history is cloaked in secrecy and we cannot even get him to produce a valid birth certificate to prove he is constitutionally eligible to hold the office of President.
          d. He has no respect for the founding principals on which our country is based.
          f. He takes every opportunity to “bad mouth” the country to foreigners.
          g. He supports every anti-gun legislation ever proposed.
          h. He is probably a muslim deep down but politically claims to be “Christian”.
          i. Basically, the little that is really known about obama leads me to believe he is a communist and hates the U.S.
          4. It seems to me this “president” is purposely trying to create a crisis and the collapse of the dollar would seem to be the goal.
          5. The crisis would present a perfect opportunity to assume power and control of the government to create a NWO type of government.
          6. Taking advantage of the crisis to declare martial law would allow him to do just that.
          7. I believe there will be enough resistance from a large percent of the population unwilling to surrender guns and ammo that we will end up fighting a civil war.
          8. I believe it will happen before the 2010 elections because islamobama and the dems cannot take the risk of losing the election.

          • Curtis S

            What you believe? You can believe in anything, what can you prove? What is true and what is simply your mistaken belief?

      • denniso

        Gary..you’ve become paranoid and freaked out. The collapse started under your buddy Bush,yet you think Obama is using it for gov’t control purposes. Was Bush likewise trying to enslave you? Has it ocurred to you that Obama,black though he may be, is trying like hell to save your rear,along w/ the rest of us?? NO?? Think about it.

        • Gary Cody

          denniso:
          Whatever. But for your info, I believe the collapse started long before bush. And I doubt most rational people would call me a bush supporter. And what’s the big deal about obama being black? Do you have a problem with that?

          My beef with islamobama has nothing to do with the color of his skin. And no, it seems obvious to me that he isn’t trying to save me. On the contrary, he seems hell bent on destroying the U.S.

          • Curtis S

            Again, if it’s not what you “believe” it’s what it “seems”. Before you get all crazy could you quote some facts? Could you lay out a plan based on something other than half-truths and misconceptions?

        • George

          Denniso, while I might not go quite as far as Gary has, he basically is speaking for a lot of conservatives. We haven’t been comforted by Obama’s actions so far. Obama hasn’t reached out to the right, and probably won’t as long as he has sufficient allies on the left to get what he wants, regardless what the American public says they want in poll after poll. He says nice things like “transparency, inclusiveness, lower the debt, etc, etc, but we haven’t seen the actions to support those promises. So, no don’t expect the right to reach out to Obama to blindly trust him that he’s going to do anything that aligns with conservative values. You can trust him if you want, but we won’t until he starts following through on some of these promises. Just as a start in that direction, we’d surely appreciate it if he would fire all the card-carrying socialist and communist in his administration, start talking about the virtues of this country instead of apologizing for them, release his birth certificate, quite taking shots at Christianity, and get the Dems to pay their back taxes. Oh, and if the Republican Party runs a black person for President, I’m sure we can count on your vote because he’s black, right?

  • cerebus23

    I have never believed in global warming. I mock and hate the people that run around screaming that the theroy of global warming is scientific fact when it is not. i hate the fact that back in the 70s the same people were running around screaming that global cooling was going to kill us all. i hate the fact that most of these experts and wackos totally ingnore the tiny fact that when i was in school not all that long ago we learned the last ice age was still receeding, so you might expect ice caps and glaciers to melt just because of that.

    but a few facts i do not dispute that we need alternative cleaner forms of energy, that oil is not going to last forever, that coal might last a lot longer but is not an infinite resource either. that we need to look at biofuels and nuclear energy for the future and research them earnestly.

    but shoving cap and trade down our throats, kyoto treaties, and carbon offsets and other sky is falling tomorrow measures because al gore and other non scientists tell us we are all going to die because of the climate change we started and yet have not one solid scientific fact to back up that claim.

    GOP is no better than the democrats period, when they had power they acted just like democrats, spending and stealing as they saw fit. We need at worst divided government, we need term limits on all congressional seats, and at best we need a total revolution in this country to take back power from washington and get back to the framework of the constitution.

    • George

      Here, here…..except to the part that the GOP is no better than the Democrats. Here’s my assessment on that. We, conservatives, don’t often vote for Democrates because we know they aren’t usually going to vote for conservative ideals and values. We know they are liberal, and that’s what we generally expect from them. So, we’re not surprised or disappointed when we get liberal results from the Democratic Party. That’s who the are, and that’s what they do. On the other hand, we expect better from the Republican Party. They claim to be conservatives, but sometimes don’t live up to our expectations as conservatives. I think this is sometimes because there are different “flavors” of conservativism. One can be conservative on fiscal policy, but liberal on some social issues, for example, and so forth. Just keep in mind that it’s the Democrats that are pushing healthcare reform and cap-and-tax right now. Republicans are standing almost 100% in opposition. The problem they have is there aren’t enough of them to flatly vote these bills down, so they’re hoping to sway a few “moderate” Democrats to their side. This is tough since those Democrats hold no allegence to the Republican Party or conservatives, in general, but they do to the Democratic Party from which they receive a large amount of their campaign funds and chairmanship assignments in Congress right now. The Republican Party has its warts. That’s for sure. However, they are much closer to conservative positions on most issues, and they do listen to conservative supporters because that’s where they get many of their votes and support. Think about it…..

  • http://milmag.com Johnny5

    I don’t mean to rain on everyone’s parade but let’s face the fact that our current system of government is broken and corrupted. It’s pay to play and everyone is on the take. An honest politician is an oxymoron. They are only there to enrich themselves and get only what’s in it for them, they flatly don’t care about us anymore. Soon we will have only two classes of people in the U.S., the very rich elite who run everything and the very poor (that’s us) to whom will have to answer to the rulers for every mere crumb we receive. The masses will all be equal alright, all equally poor. The fact is no one has the backbone to really do what needs to be done, everyone is too afraid to stand up and do what is right. Many years ago I recall my parents jokingly saying that the only thing the government hasn’t taxed yet is the air we breath. Well that is no becoming reality as the government does want to tax the very air we breath with this Cap and Trade scam they want to impose on us. I can’t believe how ignorant people are to believe a former vice president who hasn’t any knowledge of earth science, and doesn’t hold a degree or a PHD in earth science, but is an expert on climate change! The man is a moron and this global warming is just B.S. to make himself and his envirowhacko friends rich off our backs. Now I’m all for taking reasonable action to curb pollution but not with draconian laws that destroy our economy and jobs here in the U.S. I think the poster George said it all in regards to this climate change crap, it’s all fairly elementary if people would just look at the facts and not the manipulated and manufactured data being use to scare people into believing this lie. It’s a big lie being used to bankrupt and destroy our way of life and enrich those in power.

    • J C

      And that’s why they want to disarm us.

  • Michael J.

    About 10,000 years ago the climate stabilized into roughly what we see today. prior to that cold and hot weather came and went like the tides of the ocean. This is what shaped our ancestors. They were hunter gatherers. They had to be. They, as well as their prey animals were always on the run from the weather. When the climate stabilized and the animals we humans hunted were not on the move as much, men were able to stay in areas for longer periods of time and establish groups of people which became villages. Villages became cities and cities became metropolises. It’s no coincidence that 10k years ago marks the beginnings of both civilization and agriculture. Populations grew and people learned to domesticate animals and grow the plants they once gathered because they were no longer on the run from climate change.
    This ten milenium stabil weather period is not the norm, rather it is the oddity in earth’s climate history although the powers that be would seek to persuade the sheeple otherwise.
    Truth is, that the one world government is behind the push to propagandize the masses into global warming acceptance. You see, wars were the way to profit for the one worlders for the last few centuries but the problem now is that in order to transition into a true one world government, wars will no longer be profitable. Where as the likes of the banking elite were once able to create conflicts and loan money to each oposing foe to purchase bullets and bombs, once the one world government has been implemeted, world wide peace will result and the need for war estinguished. A replacement for war was sought.
    In the 1960′s a study was requisitioned by JFK to investigate what would happen if world wide peace were to break out. The result of this study became known as the Iron Mountain Report. A fascinating read that mirrors the events of our times right down to pressing ecological concerns to generate revenue in the place of warring conflicts.
    We are being manipulated, time is short. The infrastructure they need already in place, they have become emboldened and is the reason things are moving forward at such an unprecedented rate.
    It is my hope that this brief summary will be helpful and inspire people to search the net in an effort to learn the truth while this resource is still available.

    • Gary Cody

      Michael,

      I believe we have less time now than I would have told you a few weeks ago. I seriously doubt that there will be another “free” election in this country since we are staring a financial catastrophy eye ball to eye ball. I do not believe islamobama will run the risk of allowing another election that the dems may well lose.

      The problem is not so much about desire and resources as it is about organization. I believe there are lots of people with arms and ammunition who are willing to fight for what we all know is right. But, if the military or some other well armed and well organized group gets involved, it will be a real battle to overcome.

      The way I see it is that the feds in the form of ATF agents and possibly local and/or state police authorities, etc, will target individuals that they suspect will offer some resistance. Or that are known gun owners.

      They just use the declaration of martial law to declare all gun ownership illegal. After a certain date, if you have not turned over your firearms and ammo, they will show up in the middle of the night and take them. And possibly you and your family too. Hey, it happened in pre-WWII Germany.

      I am fairly confident they have a good feel for who does and who does not own firearms.

      So, what needs to be the response? Well, we need to organize and have a recognized spokesman to tell the government that we are not going to stand by and watch them come to my neighbor’s house and take his guns and throw him in jail. (remember, next week maybe it will be your house). We need to make sure that our local police know they will suffer some consequence if they take part in this. And we would need to have some way to make sure the BTF agents get the same message.

      I cannot imagine that there is not some nationally known patriot willing to stand up and take the lead in this effort. If there were, and if he would stand up right now and let the idiots in d.c. know what is going to go down, we maybe could head it off.

      It isn’t going to be pretty, regardless. I am sure islamobama is following orders from someone up the line since he obviously does not have the intellect to make these decisions. But he is an idiot, and that makes him dangerous.

      Live free or die trying.

      • denniso

        You’re paranoid and not well informed..take a break and read something worthwhile rather than these comical posts by your fellow rightwing loons.

        • Markus

          Dennisso: Still at it, huh? Calling everyone names, why don’t you take your boring ideology responses to your left wing brain dead websites and engulf yourself in your own think alike, hate everyone who doesn’t pudding. You people are so predictable. Wake up, Bush and Obama are one in the same!!!! We had Mickey Mouse, now we have Donald Duck!!! They are all the same!!!! They are puppets doing the bidding of the Elites. Your ideology consumes and leaks out of every pore of your body, you can almost smell it. You are exactly what they want, a feeble minded, like thinking robot. Follow your boy of a cliff and while your in free fall, remember these words. Your sad.

        • Gary Cody

          Denniso,

          Well, you may be correct. Maybe I am paranoid but just based on the facts and what little we know about islamobama, I do not believe I am.

          On the contrary, from my perspective, you are naïve if you believe that this administration and dem congress has the best interest of the country, much less you and your fellow lefties, at heart. The only freedoms you have as a citizen of the USA are those guaranteed by the Constitution of the US. And I believe, if you look at the facts, you will find the constitution does not mean much to islamobama and the band of thugs with whom he has surrounded himself.

      • Michael J.

        Gary, As I have stated in recent post,just enough TARP funds will be injected into the economy to facilitate the re-election of Dem’s in the upcoming mid-term election. After having accomplished this feat, the economy will again tank because a financialy depressed population with ever increasing fear and dispare is what they need. At that point just prior to the 2012 presidential election it will take only one spark to ignite panic that they are inviting, to enable them to enact martial law and suspend voting rights.
        As i said in the previous post, infrustructure is already in place, they are ready. You mentioned ATF, however you should search MJTF and FINCEN. Then you will see that they need not rely on our regular military and police force.

        • Gary Cody

          Michael J:

          Thanks for the info. Very interesting stuff.

      • Michael J.

        Gary, Ignore Denniso, he is destined to drown in the water that Obama walks on.

      • coal miner

        Gary,

        That is what they said, when Blli Clinton got elected. The last free elections.When are you guys going stop calling Obama a Muslim?According to radical Islam it is death to anyone who changes his or her religion.You guys can’t get over the fact a black man got elected.

        • George

          We don’t care that Obama is half black. We don’t like his policies and actions. Will you vote for a black Republican when one is nominated? If not, can we accuse you and the left of being racist as well?

        • Gary Cody

          coal miner,

          As you know, islamobama is half white. And believe it or not, my beef with him has nothing to do with the color of his skin. I have a hard time understanding why libs have to resort to calls of racism when they have no other facts to argue.

          The facts are that islamobama went to an islamic school in Indonesia and can still recite the muslim prayers very well. But, in my judgment, his actions toward Christianity and rejection of the principles which form the basis for our Constitution and republican form of government, speak much louder than anything else he may say.

          It is true that the koran tells muslims to kill any muslim that chooses to leave islam for another religion. But depending on which branch of islam we are talking about, leaving Islam may or may not initiate a “fatah” which could result in a death sentence. In fact, the muslim faith practiced in Indonesia is far more flexible and forgiving than, say, Saudi Arabia. And a death sentence is fairly rare, especially for a non-native like islamobama.

          I cannot tell you that islamobama is a muslim just because he once was a muslim. But I can tell you he strongly dislikes our Christian heritage, our Constitution, our system of government, and just about everything else about America. In short, he acts much more like a muslim than the Christian he claims to be.

          So, if that, in your mind, makes me a racist, then so be it.

          And by the way, I don’t recall the accusations you made about Clinton. But regardless, Clinton didn’t attempt to destroy the economy, undermine the Constitution, and did not go around the world bashing the U.S. He just stayed in his office and messed around with Monica.

    • Curtis S

      The Iron Mountain Report? The book listed by the Guiness Book of Records as the greatest literary hoax of all time? Quoting a hoax, doesn’t usually help one’s argument.

      • Michael J.

        Curtis, Is Department of State Publication #7277 also a hoax? The only problem with this so called hoax is that the vast majority of everything in the original book first published in the 1960′s has turned out to be true. So whether the Iron Mountain Report is a hoax or not is irrelevant. The book has so far been a blueprint for past, present and most likely future events.

  • Isirio Abelon

    AL GORE STATED THAT THE ARCTIC WILL BE ICE FREE IN 5 TO 7 YEARS… IS THIS A LITTLE BIT EXAGGERATION OR SIMPLY TRY TO RE-ENFORCE HIS LIES TO THE PEOPLE WHO INITIALLY BELIEVED THIS HOAX. If you care to fine out that in 5 to 7 years ice will melt is not true. GO TO: “www.accuweather.com” THIS SITE WILL SHOW YOU THAT THE TEMPERATURE THROUGH OUT THE YEARS back since the Global warming was born. One part of the world in South Pole, Antarctica,the temperature remains almost constant below Zero F. Example in June/2009 during summer, the temperature was -75 deg. Windchill factor is -100 deg.F. (Search back since 1971 to present).
    Therefore, if the temperature never rise above freezing point, the ice will never melt!!!.
    You never know what is fake or pure now a days, thanks to our advance technology. However; if you get caught lying such as Al Gore’s Global Warming Hoax… At the end, no one will believed you anymore. In other word you are finished. I work in Metrology/Calibration laboratories for 35 years. Believe me, water freeze at 32 deg. F. Adios.
    Isirio

    • Curtis S

      Isirio, you talk about the Arctic and then make some blatantly wrong statements about the Antarctic as if the two were interchangeable (they’re not, they are at the opposite ends of the earth).

      You said “One part of the world in South Pole, Antarctica, the temperature remains almost constant below Zero F. Example in June/2009 during summer, the temperature was -75 deg. Windchill factor is -100 deg.F.”

      The Antarctic is in the southern hemisphere which would mean June temperatures would be the COLDEST as they occur during the WINTER in the southern hemisphere. You mention windchill like its relevant. Windchill is simply a rate of cooling and only affects living things. If the temperature is -75 with a windchill of -100, to a “living thing” if would “feel” like -100 but a thermometer, in that same wind would still read -75.

      However, I strongly agree that people should visit the “www.accuweather.com” website then click on “Interests” and from that pull down menu click on “Global Warming Center”. Reporter Katie Fehlinger interviews the US scientist involved in the true hoax, which is “Climategate”. See for yourself what happened, see why “Climategate” is a hoax perpetrated by spin doctors to give the scientifically challenged, “Intelligent Design” crowd a reason to be against Climate Change.

      • George

        Curtis, please back off of the arrogant “I’m smarter than you” attitude. If you’re a climatologist please share your credentials with the rest of us, otherwise drop the pious attitude and try to focus on the real issue. I believe Isirio is saying that he can’t see how the ice will melt at the poles in 5-7 years as he’s heard Al Gore claim. If you think Al Gore is correct, please offer your logic and/or evidence. Otherwise, stop the innuendo and name calling.

        • Curtis S

          Yo George… Isirio thinks that June in the Antarctic is summertime. It’s not, it’s winter. Isirio seems to have his poles confused. That’s not arrogant, that’s not innuendo, it’s fact. You guys spout so many factual errors it’s hard to keep up. It’s not about Al Gore. It’s about going to Glacier National Park this year and hardly seeing any glaciers. It’s about Greenland and the massive disappearance of glaciers. Credentials?? I don’t think global warming/climate change is a political issue. I don’t dismiss Global Warming/climate change because I don’t like Al Gore (all I know is that Al Gore was Tommy Lee Jones roommate in college and that’s all I know or care about Al Gore). So, step back George, re-read my post and go to the accu-weather website and see how the biggest hoax is the BS that is the “climategate” nonsense.

          • George

            Hi Curtis. If I read anything into your earlier response that was incorrect, or if my response was viewed as inconsiderate, I apologize. I understand the glaciers in Glacier National Park are melting. That’s unfortunate for everyone that would like to enjoy the beauty of these glaciers. However, for me, and a lot of other folks, I think, the core issue is whether the warming is due to man-made actions. I’m not convinced that it is. In any event, I’m for taking preventative actions to protect our planet, right up to the point of drastically increasing my taxes, constraining the economy with unnecessary eco burdens, and taking my liberties (like telling me what products I can and can’t use, etc) without sufficient proof that all this is really fixing a critical problem. By the way, it would help if the politicians who are pushing these programs, would live by the same rules they want us to live by. In other words, lead by example….. Take care.

          • Gary Cody

            Yo curtis:

            You don’t see global warming as a political issue? I must be missing something.

            The argument is not whether or not we are having global warming. Or, global cooling? It is what it is. But, the whole global warming issue is that we are supposed to believe it is man made. Some people (like algore) profess to believe it is caused by man. Of course, the fact algore has become a billionaire acting as a spokesman for the believers probably had no influence on which side of the fence he came down on.

            But, unfortunately, the believers (in general) do not seem to be able to convince the non-believers.

            And that, in itself, would just be a point of debate where you may choose to take either side. But, to be honest, if it is so clear cut, why is it we cannot get more people to agree?

            The crux is the proposals being made by the greens (and others) to fix the problem will have an enormous cost to the economy of the US and the world. And before we basically trash our economy and turn a bad recession into a really bad depression with many millions unemployed, most sane people are just asking for proof and an analysis of alternatives.

            For example, what are the alternatives to using hydrocarbon fuels? Well, in lots of places in europe and elsewhere, nuclear power has proven to be a safe, reliable, non-polluting, relatively cheap, alternative. But, why is it that the nuclear alternative is not even on the table in the US? Why is it not being pushed by the environmentalist?

            That brings us to the critical point: What exactly is the agenda the global warming believers are trying to accomplish? If it is to reduce hydrocarbon emissions, why do they fight the nuclear option? I would think it would be welcomed.

            I am not talking about the soldiers in the street who are believers that global warming is caused by CO2 emissions. I am talking about the policy makers, the movers and shakers, that establish goals and develop plans to get where they want to go. It is their agenda that concerns me.

            And that agenda is? I can only guess. But, I have often wondered why it is that the environmental groups who are pushing the “global warming” issues do not just come out and say what their true agenda is?

            What is obvious, to me at least, is that this issue has nothing to do with the environment, and is certainly not a proposal based on concern for mankind.

            If some rational world leader (I wonder if there is one?) were to address the issue honestly and straight forward, and tell us what, in fact, their concerns are, and why they are proposing the radical, costly, job killing, plans being put on the table, with clear evidence to support the facts, and with true, scientific data that is accessible to everyone that may want to see it, they would have a better chance to sell it to the world.

            But, instead, we are only left to guess what their true agenda is and why they believe as they do.

            I believe the real agenda is, first, to reduce the world population and to return to the world as it was prior to the industrial revolution. I believe they think that the only way to accomplish this is via a World Government with absolute power, where a few elites make all the decisions and dictate policies.

            Obviously, they feel that, if the concept is revealed, it would be met with significant resistance. I wonder why?

          • Michael J.

            Yes Gary, now you got it. It’s funny how none of their moves make logical sense until you stumble upon their real agenda. Then you realize the method to their madness.

  • Gary Cody

    I don’t think we should get sidetracked with any serious discussions about whether or not global warming is caused by man-made pollutants. In my mind, it is clear that it definitely is not.

    In fact, there is even serious debate about whether the earth is heating up or cooling down (which it has been doing for the past decade or so).

    However, regardless or whether the earth is heating up or cooling down, regardless or whether you believe the polar ice cap is going to melt and raise the sea level 26 feet (or 1 foot or 2 feet or whatever), I believe we should not lose focus on the actual agenda which is driving this whole issue. It is, in fact, not about the environment at all. It is all about POWER, the global government, and their unchallenged CONTROL. And, of course, MONEY, and the transfer of wealth into the hands of a few elite and their special interests.

    So, by the time we have a consensus about whether or not there is a global warming problem, whether or not it is created by man made emissions, and whether or not we can, in fact, do anything to change it, the global government will have been firmly established and the vast majority of us will find that we are on the slave side of the Master-Slave relationship.

    When you look at what is going on in the US today, it is obvious we are headed for a financial crisis of gargantuan proportions. I cannot believe that our “leaders” do not see this also. If they do not see what is happening, they are hopelessly incompetent. And if they do, they are beyond the definition of traitorous.

    Either way, the results are going to be the same. And this financial crisis will open the door for islamobama (or maybe his replacement) to assume dictatorial power in the US.

    That is what we should be discussing, not the hoax of global warming and whether mankind has any control over it.

    • cr747

      HEY GUYS YOU HAVE HEARD THE OH SAYING MONEY TALKS AND BULLS— WALKS. “WELL AL GORE” NEED I SAY MORE?

  • James Corbin

    Thanks Steve Coy! I think more people are with you than you think!
    I have never been a rebel rouser but, it is getting to the point —
    where something has to be done!!! Obama and his left wing are ruining our country. KEEP SPENDING is all they know.

  • http://myronjpoltroonian.blogspot.com Myron J. Poltroonian

    I have several observations: 1. Can anyone, here- anyone – please explain the scientific “principle” of taking the “raw data”, messaging it for whatever laudable reason (clarity, whatever) and then destroying it so that those who follow you cannot duplicate your extrapolations to either prove or disprove your conclusions? Wouldn’t a competent researcher openly welcome skepticism and dare others to use their data to either prove, or (if they’re “pure”, non-agendized scientists) disprove their hypotheses? 2. How can anyone argue with this post by someone who’s knowledgeable? To Wit: Al Gore’s Fantasy
    By Joe Cascarelli, Westcliffe CO
    Now that Al Gore’s Inconvenient Truth has been officially embraced by Hollywood and the Nobel Prize committee, the debate on “global warming” is finally over. The only question that still remains unanswered for me is, “How did such a large portion of the American public become so gullible?” One of my theories is that Americans have become intellectually lazy. Another theory is that schools may not be spending enough time on the sciences. A passing grade in high school physics should be enough background knowledge for any thinking person to shoot dozens of holes in former VP Gore’s fantasies as presented in his “documentary.”
    I wonder how Mr. Gore would explain this data. Colorado’s record high temperature was 118 F, set on July 11, 1888. Yes, that’s 1888 not 1988. I wonder how the New York Times missed that opportunity to predict the melting of polar ice caps. Maybe they planned to write that story, but the famous blizzard of ’88 earlier that year was a bigger crisis particularly in New York City where several hundred New Yorkers froze to death. Nearly three decades later on June 27, 1915, Alaska set its current record high at 100 F, recorded at the US Weather Service’s station at Fort Yukon.
    Now, the summer of 1936 was one for the record books. The states of Maryland (109 F), Indiana (116 F), Kansas (121 F), Louisiana (114 F), Minnesota (114 F), Nebraska (118 F), New Jersey (110 F), North Dakota (121 F), Pennsylvania (111 F), South Dakota (120 F), West Virginia (112 F) and Wisconsin (114 F) all set record high temperatures in July/August that year. It is funny how Al missed 1936 in his film. How could a divinity school drop-out, non-practicing lawyer and life long politician miss this opportunity to show that man caused “global warming” started decades ago? He is no doubt an expert in the field of climatology. Does anyone in America know what his academic and experiential credentials are? Maybe 1936 is a bad year to use to make a point because in February of that year the Dakotas, North and South, also set their current state record lows of minus 60 F and minus 58 F respectively.
    Here is why I don’t believe Al. If a self-proclaimed climate expert doesn’t have a theory about the Medieval Warm Epoch (400 years of record high temperatures in the northern hemisphere, 900-1300 AD) or if they don’t know that water vapor is earth’s most abundant green house gas or if they can’t explain sun spots, I have no faith in their ability to predict the climate 100 years from now. Weather and over time the climate just doesn’t seem to want to cooperate with Al Gore and his unquestioning followers. Unpredictable climate will be around for another 2 or 3 billion years. Fortunately for humanity, Al and his fantasies will not.
    I can only hope that the portion of the American public that fails to question the arguments for “man caused global warming” before economy destroying public policy decisions are made will wake up and pay attention. This will require some reading, analysis and critical thinking. They must get a grasp on reality.

    Dec 10, 2009 @ 08:35 AM
    Joe Cascarelli, Colorado

    • s c

      Myron, gore has but a single item on his credential sheet. That is, his father was a senator and represented Tennessee. Sonny gore seems to be about as talented as a mush-headed, jet-setting do-nothing.
      His father, by the way, was dead set against integration back in the ’60s, and he would have stopped it if he was able.
      I have nothing against the wonderful people of Tennessee, but between father and son, that great state can do much better when it comes to sending political “talent” to Washington.

    • Joe H.

      Myron,
      I could have used some gorbull warming here the last two summers!!! We only had a week of 95* weather and not one day of 95*+ weather!! We always have half a dozen days of close to 100* weather and about 3 to 4 weeks of 85 to 95* weather in Ohio, even next to the lake!!!

    • Gary Cody

      Myron,
      The libs definition of science appears to be: Decide on the conclusion that supports your overall agends and goals, and then consider only the data that will support that conclusion. Otherwise, if the data does not fit the “model”, then you adjust/delete/modify the data as necessary to make it fit. Damned facts!

  • cerebus23

    I think washington politicians are at best incompetent and at worst malicious in destroying the nation that our founding fathers invisioned.

    The banking collapse was not caused by bankers out of control or predatory lending it was caused by presidents starting with carter and moving right along thru george bush jr. The fedral government required by law that bankers give loans to low income people peaking under GB that 55% of all loans banks handed out had to go to lower income high risk people. Incidently we also had a massive bubble in housing prices, so banks were giving loans to low income people for houses that were grossly overvalued.

    How could all these brilliant people in washington not see that this was a house of cards that was doomed to collapse over the last 20 some years that these federally mandated programs were in place? Especially when your forcing lenders to give more and more risky loans out?

    It is staggeringly hard to believe that barney frank (banking commission chairman, who said the system was fine about the same time john mccain said the same thing) and others had absolutely no clue that what they were doing was going to lead to financial ruin. GB actually had a rather weak effort (practically non existent) to say that the financial system was going to fail.

    Common sense would say that the thing was doomed to failure. It does not take a degree in economics to say this system is very flawed. Just like it does not take a genious to figure out any program peddled by washington dc is a cesspool of waste fraud and corruption.

    Which was exactly the reason why the founding fathers made the federal government so obtouse and unwieldy, they never intended for all these programs to be centralized in the federal government with endless layers of bureaucracy and red tape filtering down to the states and the local districts.

    They never wanted that power centralized in DC where special interest and bribes could effect the entire nation. They never even allowed for the federal government to levy taxes, which maybe be going too far since they were expected to maintain a standing army.

    So the question remains are our federal politicans, and economic experts and lawyers and all the other “smart” people we supposedly have in DC that galacticly stupid, or just so corrupt and selfish that they do not care one bit about you the commoner.

    People should not fear their governments, governments should fear their people. Its about time we hold all these peoples feet to the fire that take an oath to defend the constitution of the united states and go about shredding it at every opportunity. There is no doubt in my mind that you could prosecute most of the politicians over the last few decades with outright treason for breaking their oath of office.

  • ONTIME

    I would have to say that Real Republicans can deal with this matter in a logical fashion and make those who seem to have some sort of proof present it in a convincing manner. So far all that has been said and done is not verifiable and not convincing in fact a lot of it is emotional and has little or no logic to accompany any of the argument to be made.

    Climate is world wide and the suface of the earth is going to vary through out the year for all time as it has in the past. CO2 is a poor indicator of any real problem but a emotional way to bilk the populace and play upon ignorance to induce hysteria. To stampede people with a Haley’s comment mentality is criminal and to try and pick their pockets is a jailing offense. It’s high time we have a major investigation and make the information public and put the politic aside.

    • denniso

      “Climate is worldwide”…I wonder, are you a scientist?? What a profound comment!!

      • George

        Denniso, are you a scientist? Please don’t pick at words. Address his point. What profound arrogance on your part?

  • realbigal

    There is only one answer:

    While there still are free elections, vote only for candidates who clearly support lower taxes, less government, and more individual freedom.

    • George

      Well said. I would only add “be accountable to you and other conservatives for their votes and conduct while in office.” I think this is important because politicians are pulled in different directions once they move to Washington DC. The longer they stay there the more liberal they seem to become as they are influenced by the establishment. They need to understand what got them in office and what keeps them there.

      • Joe H.

        George,
        I think if you are going to vote for a certain man tell him and let him know if he doesn’t represent the conservative values that got him elected that you will not only not vote for him next time you will openly campaign against him!!!

        • George

          Yes indeed. Oh, and thanks for the attaboy.

          • Joe H.

            George,
            Nothanks needed you earned it. I’d give you an aw shite if I thought you earned it too!!!!

  • Mark

    Irregardless of the lack of verifiable data to “prove” their contentions, Global Whoreming will be forced upon us and “Law Enforcement” will be proud to “do their job” and ensure compliance. Those fine individuals will most likely let Al Gore investigate “Climategate”. After all, who could possibly dispute that he is a disinterested observer? They will bow and scrape before their Masters, and then do whatever they’re told. Just like they’re doing now in ACORNgate under the direction of Master Moonbat. Investigate ACORN? Hell, no! Gotta go after those brave journalists who exposed them instead. The pigs are NOT your friends. No more than the fine German police were under the Nazis.

  • James

    A little global warming history. Around 12,000 BC, the earth’s land masses were largely covered with ice. The northern ice mass extended down over the Aleutian Islands and North America, down to about where the Ohio River is now. Since then it has been melting off, not steadily but sporadically, that is, the ice could have increased for a few decades but overall still be in a warming trend. The sun isn’t a constant source of heat, it spurts, sputters and has flareups.
    As evidence of this, some deep sea divers were exploring off the southeast coast of India, around where that island is, and discovered the ruins of an ancient temple about 250 ft. under water. Obviously that island was once part of a peninsula. If you calculate the volume of a 250 foot layer of water over 2/3 of the earth, you have one helluva lot of water. Also, off the east coast of South America, there are still the remains of stone roads running out under the Atlantic Ocean. Clearly, we have been in a warming trend for 14,000 years, we are just seeing the faster end of it.
    Galveston, Texas is still 8 feet above sea level, just as that island was hundreds of years ago. The remaining ice is melting rapidly but the sea levels are not rising by any significant amount. It is measured in fractions of an inch.
    Will we all drown, of course, unless you send all your money to me.

    • George

      Thanks for that educational reminder. By the way, isn’t Al Gore telling us something similar;ie, send me your money or you’ll drown? ha.

  • U.N. Owen

    I am sure many of you have heard about this Carbon Capture Project (CCP) (http://www.co2captureproject.org).

    Here is the cold hard truth of the matter. The company I work for is a company that generates power and pumps natural gas. We then sell it to the utility companies. Therefore I know how these things work and I know what effects they have. Now that Obama and his lackeys have passed that “carbon capture” bill, this is what everyone is going to be seeing soon. It will take more electricity to capture that carbon. So, all generation plants will have to use about 35% of their power to capture it. They will have to build more power plants to make up for that demand. Companies, when their utility bills go up by 35%, will send their offices, work, labor forces, etc. over seas where they do not have “carbon capture” regulations. That will very seriously drive up unemployment in the U.S.

    Then what? India will have a huge influx of employment?

    • George

      I believe you’re right on the money with your comments. If cap-and-tax passes, a lot of our remaining manufacturing will have to move offshore to compete with factories located in countries not implementing such eco laws and regulations. If this happens, I just hope people understand what’s really driving this change, and don’t stoup to blaming greedy businesses for hording profits at the expense of the working class. (More liberal rubbish.)

  • http://none Roger

    Did you see the news that Obama has promised $100 billion of OUR tax money per year by 2020 to go toward containing “the threat of an overheated world.”

    Someone (perhaps George) commented on our troops or police corraling us – did you know that GB signed a pact with Canada and Mexico to allow foreign troops into the U.S.? With our loyal troops fighting Al Queda will Obama use that permission against us?

    • George

      Oh my…….. I’m sure the Senate will approve that, especially right now while their trying to figure out how to get us to agree to all their other spending programs………….ugh…..

  • http://none Roger

    Three other things I forgot to write about:

    1. USA Today reported that before the recession started, the Department of Transportation employed only one person earning more than $170,000 a year. Today, more than 1,690 people there earn more than $170,000. Do they belong to Acorn? Who are they anyway?

    2. Have you seen the Christian Action Network (CAN) site? Here’s the link:

    http://www.christianaction.org/

    They have a video (not the best quality) taken in a Muslim training camp in New York apparently teaching them how to slit our throats etc.

    According to CAN, there are about 35 jihad sites in this country. Do you think Eric Holder will investigate these compounds like our government did the Branch Davidians?

    3. One investment advisor whose info I read thinks that the U.S. dollar will drop in value next year by about 55% or more – especially if China decides to act. Also, have you heard of the “Gulfo”? Apparently some of the Middle East Gulf states have decided to print their own money like Europe did with the Euro. I recently read that they will not accept our dollars for crude any more – not sure if that is true but other countries are wondering if our paper money will be worth anything the way the Fed is printing it – have you heard the term: “toilet paper money”?

    • Claire

      Roger–seems like I have heard they have training camps in the state of Virginia also. Have you heard this too?

  • James Corbin

    I don’t think there is a thing to global warming! I think it is just a
    way for people to get rich and countries to get money from other countries. In my state we have 18″ of snow and still coming down.
    Washing D.C. is getting crippled with snow also!!

    • Gary Cody

      James,
      Global warming or global cooling or whatever cycle we are in is way beyond the control of man. CO2 has nothing to do with it. And you are absolutly correct about the transfer of wealth. That is one of the primary goals. However, what it is really all about is a New World Order, a Global Government, and concentrated POWER in the hands of a few elites. Global warming never has had anything to do with the environment.

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