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Court Rules State May Seize Private Land For Columbia Campus Development

July 1, 2010 by  

Court rules state may seize private land for Columbia campus development A New York court has ruled in a controversial case to allow the state to take over private land for the purpose of allowing Columbia University to expand its campus into the Harlem neighborhood, according to media reports.

The ruling overturned a decision by the Appellate Division from December 2009, and will allow the state to take advantage of eminent domain so Columbia can build 16 new buildings in West Harlem that will house classrooms, research facilities and student and faculty. Eminent domain allows authorities to seize land when its use can be justified as serving public good.

However, since 2005 some 43 states have tightened the requirements for eminent domain use, although New York has not, according to The New York Times.

The news source cited Norman Siegel, who represented the affected property owners, as saying he was "extremely disappointed" and promising to appeal the decision to the United States Supreme Court.

Meanwhile, Columbia claims the neighborhood was "blighted" and that its $6.3 billion construction project will create at least 14,000 temporary and 6,000 permanent jobs, Reuters reports.
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  • Roy Duncan

    Just a sign of things to come. America is now a communist dictatorship. Obama has already taken over car manufacturing companies and banks and going for oil companies now. Everytime you hear obama demonizing something, rest assured he’s about to take it over. Private property is just another step in his plan. Fools still refuse to see it.

    • eddie47d

      Your the fool;emminent domain has been around for eons. This also has nothing to do with Obama so that makes you a double fool. Looks like just another excuse to bash him. Maybe you’ll blame him for the rain tomorrow or your stubbed toe. Although emminent domain should be used sparingly it’s almost always a necessity. As our population grows we need wider roads and bridges (our love affair with cars).We need sports stadiums recreation centers and even larger college campuses. I’m sure the residents in Harlem will be rewarded handsomely.Even at that would you want Columbia University to have to move and spend many more billions for that? Maybe you’d like our colleges or universities to stay small scaled and not be able to compete with the world. That would be just dandy for our future. Better yet,next time your sitting in traffic think about all the homes that could be torn down to get you where your going.

    • 45caliber

      When he takes over car companies, banks, and oil companies, he IS already taking over private property.

      At least in Texas we have a state law that requires that they pay for it as long as it isn’t a federal group that wants it.

      During Clinton’s time, the feds seized 70,000 acres outside of Austin – because some bird MIGHT become endangered because the birds liked to stop in that area to rest during migration. They gave themselves 30 years to pay for the land IF they felt like it. The price of the land dropped from $13,000 an acre to less than $1,000 an acre.

      So how are they getting the land? If a person living there dies, his heirs must pay an inheritance tax of 49% based on the value of the land – at $13,000 an acre. Or they can give it to the government in lue of the taxes. So in affect, the government is seizing the land without paying anything for it at all.

      During Bush’s time in office that was stopped but it runs out this year. You can bet the government will be going back to it now.

      • http://?? Joe H.

        45caliber,
        Did you hear the news about Ford today?? Even though they took no stimulus money, they are poised to pay back all outstanding loans to the union almost 10 years early AND pay a dividend this year. The real good thing about it is THEY didn’t have to borrow from others to do it!!!

  • s c

    Are the British still here? I thought we gave them reasons to depart America about 200 years ago.
    I have great sympathy for Mr. Siegel and those property owners who are expected to suffer via ‘the public good.’ Is this New York’s way of having to compensate for two White House boobs who couldn’t care less about creating and preserving JOBS?
    This prez, it seems, knows how to stick his growing nose (and inflated head) where it doesn’t belong (the rest of the job isn’t that important to him?). Eminent domain is the Americanized version of the ‘divine right of kings.’ So, did some disturbed people elect a prez or a king?
    Eminent domain sucks, as do all who use it as a tool to benefit the few at the expense of those who can’t rely on a functional Supreme Court, state courts or true LEADERS in Washington. Once again, America is expected to endure the effects of the ‘best government [and worst 'leaders'] that MONEY can buy.’ Yet once again, thanks for NOTHING, progressives. You are truly consistent.

    • eddie47d

      What crap you sprew are you related to the tinman?

      • JC

        Good comeback eddie. You really shot him down there.

        Emminent domain is exactly that…the right of the Kings to usurp land rightfully owned by others. Legalized Plunder.

        • http://?? Joe H.

          JC,
          You know better than to befuddle edduh47 with facts!!!!

  • Robert

    This is a tragedy. I laugh at Columia’s claim that it is a blighted area. What everyone needs to know is this. The majority if not all the buildings in the area that are abandoned and not maintained and are in shambles are owned by Columbia University. They intentionally let these buildings go to hell with the intention of using the claim of the neighborhood being blighted as their reason for eminent domain. They have been conspiring on this for the past ten years. A federal investigation should be held and bring the criminals of Columbia University and their in the pocket political cronies to justice. But it will never happen. That is unless you are the owner of the building in the area and happen to be either an illegal immigrant or a native of India or Pakistan. Then all the politicians would be outraged at what Columbia and that farce of a state court has done. Let’s take back our country and city and vote out all these incumbents and put real Americans in office.

    • s c

      Robert, progressives and assorted airheads won’t understand this point, but Columbia was originally known as King’s College. Apparently, this negative influence still lives and breathes there.
      It may seem trivial, but some things are based in reality. We’re not supposed to see it that way, especially when ‘elites’ are trying to please their masters via false appearances and by grooming public opinion. It takes a lot of money to create ‘reality.’
      ‘Knowledge’ is theoretically best left to those who “deserve” it (in the minds of would-be controllers, that is).

      • eddie47d

        Listen up,An “airhead” has something to say to Miss negativity.I bet the people of Detroit and many other American cities wish alot of emminent domain comes to their areas. If it builds more factories or a bigger university and provides a greater return in jobs then I put that in the win category. Now that’s reality!

    • Tony

      So, when Columbia builds these new facilities, they will be public? Anyone will be able to just walk on an use the facilities? They won’t collect any profit from this? The answer is NO on both, therefore, emminent domain should have been denied. They only have the “private good” intention- the public will in no way be served. They are a private college that is trying to force private land owners off their land….so they can make even more money. 6000 permanent jobs? Where? And when they don’t create 6000 permanent jobs, will they be forced to give the land back? Yeah, I didn’t think so. They used this claim to support the use of emminent domain, but have no burden to prove where these jobs will come from. The jobs created for the construction are temporary and cannot be used to show they “served the public good”. This decision needs to be appealed immediately; and when it is reversed, the court needs to be handed a harsh dressing down from the SCOTUS for this BS ruling.

  • bill

    Could it be that the above article about “imminent domain” be a reprisal
    against Atlah Worldwide Missionary Church” Harlem N.Y. for their involvement and convictions in the “CIA Columbia Obama Treason Trail” ?
    Have a look at the video link below,and you decide !

    http://atlah.org/atlahworldwide/?p=8723

    • Al Sieber

      Thanks for the link bill.

    • ROY

      If the Atlah Church is in that area effected, I would not be surprized.

    • 45caliber

      It could be. A college my son in Arkansas attended had all the land in several blocks around it except a church that was about 120 years old – the oldest one in the county. The church members refused to sell it due to the age of the church, etc.

      They got a new pastor in. The college made an offer direct to the pastor. He took the money, gave them the deed, and left the state along with all the church funds. (There is a warrant out for him now.) But the college insists that it was a legal purchase and they have the right to tear the church down. It’s still in litigation.

    • eddie47d

      Bill, I hope so! Rev. Mannings mock trial is a farce and doesn’t deserve the respect that he so eageerly wants. He comes across as an Ayatollah looking for unwarrented fame.He must be related to Louis Farrekann.

    • Pat R

      Bill:

      I have been thinking along these same lines. Rev. Manning p*ssed off the people at Columbia and this is his “reward”. They will probably take the Church property just to get him out of the area. Totally disgusting what the criminals can get by with. (Covering for Barry while he was training the Taliban in Pakistan and running drugs to fund the exercise! All of this during the time frame that he was supposed to be attending Columbia University.)

  • slickporsche

    Eminent Domain is how our west was built. This is what is claimed. I was not there! Mostly for the railroads and other infrastructer. No matter, I feel it is wrong for a free people and does not belong in our republic.

    • eddie47d

      How would YOU move masses of people and goods from Here to There?

      • 45caliber

        If the owners didn’t want to sell, I’d go around them to someone else’s land. And I’d pay the price they deserved for it.

        • eddie47d

          Okay that’s fine some of the time but not always. Why do you think so much farmland is disappearing? We have to build roads where nobody lives because we can’t buyout a few houses that are closer to where the road is needed. I see that all the time and that only makes it more expensive to transport anything.

          • 45caliber

            Farmland is disappearing because 1) we have too much of it, 2) corporate farms are subsidised and privately owned farms aren’t, and 3) because the government is buying up the land. In fact there is a HUGE amount of money spent every year buying land, particularly in the East where the government didn’t get control of the land early. Recently there was a group here that wanted the government to buy 50,000 acres of “old timber land” for a bird sancuary – where of course only their private bird club could go.

  • slickporsche

    The truth is, we simply have too much government. You cannot be truly free with all the laws, and statutes that are on the books. It was not that many years ago that if city inspections came to your property and told you to do this or that, you could tell them, to shove off. Now they are the so powerful you have no choice, because the Health dept.,fire dept., the police, and human services will gang up on you and force you to comply. I know this for a fact. Is that a free country. NOT!

    • eddie47d

      If you have so many authorities coming to your house then you must have something to hide. Criminal activity,weeds,trash in yard,unused cars or too many cars being repaired,too many animals? What could it be. How about the Freedom of your neighbors who would like to live in a clean respectable neighborhood. Maybe if we all police ourselves this wouldn’t be as much of a problem.

      • 45caliber

        In other words, your freedom is more important than that of your neighbor. You insist you have rights that he doesn’t. And you are willing to get the police to agree with you by getting laws passed so you do have more freedom than he does.

        • eddie47d

          If he has no respect for my wellbeing then maybe so.

          • 45caliber

            Well, you certainly have no respect for his well-being, do you?

        • eddie47d

          Depends on what he is hiding since he seems a little paranoid.

          • http://?? Joe H.

            edduh47,
            My wife and I have three vehicles so one may not get used for two to three months at a time. They are all titled and registered with current plates. My neighbor complained and the police came out and checked. now why should I have to be subjected to the police on my property just because some nosey neighbor with his head up his azz complained? All the police had to do was check with the BMV and they would have known that they were current!

  • spoonerist

    Another example of communism and organized crime running wild because too many average citizens have been intellectually poisoned by the scourge of cividolatry.

    • eddie47d

      Emminent domain does more good than harm and it would be nice if there is a better way. I don’t think you’d be happy in one of the many old and bleak communist countries.I like a country that improves it’s self and moves forward with a more livable community. So equating expanding a university with communism is rather shallow. In China they bulldoze whole neighborhoods with little compensation.At least in the USA they try and preserve the character of the community.

      • 45caliber

        They try to do a better job here than they do in most other countries, I will admit. I saw an article in a magazine not long ago (National Geographic, I think) about some government offical in Gaza deciding he needed a new “office building”. He sent bulldozers in and cleared 300 acres, most of it as the people who lived there tried to get some of their belongings from their house before the bulldozer hit it. He fenced the area and built an “office building” for only about $400 million. It contained over 170 bedrooms, so that should give you an idea of the “office building”‘s size. He also had such things as gold bath fixtures, etc. installed. The majority of the money was foreign aid from the US.

        But that also doesn’t mean that we are correct in what we do or the way we do it. The Constitution says that the government must pay for the land. When building a freeway in AR, the government seized over half a farmer’s land and refused to pay anything for it on the grounds that the price of the remaining land would go up more than his loss of the property. He could sell it to some developer. The only problem was that it wasn’t near any roads. 30 years later no one has shown any interest in buying it.

      • http://?? Joe H.

        edduh47,
        Tell that to the people of Eastlake Ohio. The mayor wanted a minor league stadium built here and told the people that he had all the funding in place. He took about two dozen residential properties as well as a few commercial one of which was a funeral home. One lady wanted to live out her life in her home where she had raised her children and held her dying husband in her arms, she was about 68 years old and didn’t want to sell. The owner of the funeral home didn’t want to sell either. The city took the ladies home at about 70% of worth and the funeral home took them to court. The court said the business was worth more than the city and county said it was and then they tried to make a deal with them. they promised a piece of property at a greatly reduced price. The owner was an elderly man and he died as, I believe, a direct cause of the city! now the city is in debt to the tune of about 8 million dollars, there have been layoffs, our police are down to about 75% of normal and our fire department can’t answer more than two calls at a time because they don’t have the personnel to man the vehicles. Now you want to tell me that this was to the GTOOD??? You are a mental midget!!!!

      • Claire

        eddie47d–I bet you would change your tune in a heck of a hurry if something like this happened to you.

      • libertytrain

        Now those in the USA seem to be protecting neighborhoods somewhat – but think of all the incredible places that were razed until about the late 80′s — some of these city planners etc. were slow slow learners.

  • alpha-lemming

    Kelo vs. New London redux. Is (or has it already become) “Eminent Domain” the new “Commerce Clause” for the this millenium?? Twould certainly seem so.

    • 45caliber

      At least most states, including Texas, now have a law that restricts what reasons they can take land. Commerce isn’t one of them.

      • alpha-lemming

        I’m movin’ there after they secede and become the new nation of “Freedonia”!!

        • 45caliber

          It won’t be named “Freedonia”. It will remain Texas.

      • eddie47d

        Not every state has “endless” land like Texas and can not afford to turn down a business that will provide alot of jobs. The loss of a few houses “might be” worth that greater good.

        • 45caliber

          Have you seen what happened to the land seized in the Kelso case? They gave the land to the company to build a factory there. Two years later the company began selling off the houses there.

  • jopa

    Eminent domain’What crap Who needs universities,railroads, interstate highways, airports, medical centers and whatever else comes along.Ooops I guess most of us do.It’s not a new Obama idea it has been around longer than you have.So unpucker your sphincter and get real.

    • JC

      Another trained seal…or hamster maybe.
      You think it’s about Obama? Not unless we put the issue directly to this administration.
      Emminent Domain is anti American in nature and is a systemic problem.
      Many Presidents have used it to further their agenda, but today we have the Commie Kenyan using it so we’re talking about it today.
      Don’t like it? That’s too bad.
      There’s always the solace of your Hamster wheel.

      • eddie47d

        Your a trained seal for the Right Wing so you have alot more getting over than Jopa does. Maybe we should all live in log cabins and get our drinking water from the rivers. Emminent domain gives us water treatment plants and new subdivisions for Americans to grow and prosper.No wonder we can’t move forward in the U.S. with all your anti-Obama bellyaching.

        • 45caliber

          Subdivisions are supposed to be owned and set up by contractors since it is a For-Profit affair. We had a local case right after the Kelso case – and one reason Texas passed the law limiting Eminent Domain. The city of Freeport tried to take land from a company to give to a person wanting to build a marina. They ended up with most of what they wanted and gave it to the contractor. That was about ten years ago. They still don’t have a marina but the contractor is a lot better off because he “borrowed” several million from the city. I think the city has taken over the land now but they don’t have the money to build anything. The one thing that was built was built on state land – which the city had to buy.

        • JC

          Yeah right, sure….if you really believe that your precious Kenyan or your precious all knowing and benevolent government is doing these things you’re a real idiot. Your precious government produces “nothing” and if it did it would be an inferior product that was built by incompetent people and forced on us at an expense which nobody can afford.

          I’m an advocate for Americanism and our Constsitution. When you’re old enough, I’ll explain what that means eddie.
          Till then sit their and eat you commie flakes and wait for the Kenyan to change your diaper for you.

          • eddie47d

            This Columbia article has precious little to do with Obama but go ahead and blow more hot air out of your rear.

          • http://?? Joe H.

            So says a real pro at blowin’ hot air out of his rear!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • http://mac.com Stutz

    This is why the Kagan hearings are so important. They are loading the courts, at all levels, with liberal (progressives) who loath this Country and everything it stands for. The first in that line is the Prez himself. Why do you think attorneys like Mr. Seigel can’t get a proper verdict from these courts? The courts support an ideology which despises our freedom and will do all it can, in a most stealthy way, to remove our freedoms one by one. They are patient and while we (the silent majority) are sleeping, our way of life is evaporating. The “folks” should be screaming at the top of their lungs at their elected officials to turn Kagan down. It won’t happen! They are all in the tank. Anyone who votes for her nomination (Democrat or Republican) should be turned away in November. We the people have the ultimate say at the polls. Shame on us for those we have elected and continue to elect over and over again. Ultimately we will get more of what we deserve if we don’t take charge and throw these bums out.

  • 45caliber

    If Columbia (or any other group including the government) wants to build something, let them buy the property at the price the owners want … or buy a place somewhere else and swap with the owners.

    The problem is that Columbia doesn’t want to pay much for the property. Note the “blighted” comment. The owners want enough to be able to at least buy a similar place somewhere else – and Columbia won’t give them that.

    Further, they may provide 14,000 temporary and 6,000 permanent jobs, but the displaced people won’t get them.

    • JC

      Yeah “blighted”…what the hell does that mean?
      It’s run down after years of government welfare intervention?
      After years of government killing any hope of free enterprise or urban renewal? It’s “blighted” because the area may be populated with black people? Is it a thinly veiled term for a racist policy?

      I agree with 45….let Columbia buy it with their own money at market rates or maybe they could move themselves out of this “blighted” area.

      • eddie47d

        You bring up the racist card-Not! Your saying a black neighborhood can’t improve itself by this addition? bullpucky!New restaurents,parking lots and maybe new housing,ect. I drove through Harlem and Columbia back in the 80′s and both needed alot of improvement then so I say go for it.

        • JC

          Well that’s a typical socialist / liberal knee jerk reaction if I ever saw one. I ask what the word “blighted” might mean and offer several possibilities. YOU in your typical liberal induced hysteria
          go straight to the race card issue. Totally missed the point.
          Then you go further by advocatting that only the Government can
          improve things. You really are a pathetic waste of time.

          • eddie47d

            Hey, you brought up the “racist policy”. There is alot of private money that goes into universities and I never said a word about government in my last post. Read right,so you don’t comment wrong. So go ahead and grandstand on you pathetic knee jerk comments. Typical of many of your hysterical talking points.

          • http://?? Joe H.

            JC,
            In some cases, if the standard for the area was three bedrooms and two baths and one had two bedrooms and one bath, it was considered “blighted”! A lot of things can be worded blighted!! These claimes I make can be researched, checked it out!!!

  • Delores Smith

    PERSONAL LIBERTY NEWS DESK – EXCELLENT ARTICLE -
    Eminent Domain is an issue that Americans will do away with soon. Columbia University, if you’re having a problem with space, build UP. Stop the land-grab! It is not justified, because it does not serve the public good. Too much of what comes out of Columbia is not for the public good. I’m not impressed with the number of jobs that you predict will be created (14,000 temporary jobs and 6,000 permanent jobs). President Obama predicted that he would save or create 3,000,000
    to 4,000,000 jobs. He didn’t deliver, and he was educated at your college. Does that tell you anything?
    Norman Siegal, attorney for the property owners, take it to The Supreme Court.
    Delores Smith
    Delores109@cox.net

    • JC

      Good points Delores….do you know, was the Kenyan still a foreign exchange student when he went to Columbia? He was in California, under a different name though. I wonder which social security number he’s on now…15? …16?

      • eddie47d

        You just proved my last comment. Now you say Obama was at Columbia or was he in California or was he a CIA agent in Pakistan. So little credibility in all the spin,doesn’t make anything you say very reliable.

    • alpha-lemming

      Breaking Headline………
      Talk about doubling down!! Bela Pelosi said earlier… and I quote..
      “We will create more jobs this year than in the entire 8 years of GWB” Better hurry… the year’s half over!!

      • 45caliber

        Hey, don’t urge her on! She’s talking about government jobs, not producing jobs.

      • Bob Wire

        What’s a promise? I was understanding all these years of the highest earners getting huge tax breaks were to stimulate economic growth and create jobs. What happen to that? Where’s the growth? Where’s the jobs? Where is the Entrepreneurial Venture Capitalist spirit? Was it out sourced to China as well?

        Imminent domain has been around a very long time and the victim list long and sorted.

        I really don’t think many of you understand the realities of the world you live in. ~ Being free or owning anything besides your name is more an illusion then a reality. The only thing you truly own is your name and that’s just because they need to know to whom to address the bill or they’d take that too!

        Once you understand this and understand a good day for the snake is a bad day for the frog, you are well on your way to being a grownup. Or one day looking into the mirror and wonder who’s that stranger in my house! I enjoyed being a child better myself and don’t blame anyone for hanging on to such ideas as long as they possibly can.

        But until this revelation is revealed to you, your little more the children playing grownup a fretting over nothing for there’s little you can do about it.

        Sorry to bring you such bad news, I never liked it much either, really popped my bubble. But life is still very wonderful, you must learn the word “mine” has several meaning and the truth is you are just “borrowing” or “renting” with maybe one excepting “a living trust fund” that’s big enough to be self sustaining. If you manage to reach such a point, only then does you understanding of “mine” apply. But the chances of you being long dead quite good.

        I know these notions alien to many of you, ignore them and fret away or use them to your advantage. Your choice.

        Wouldn’t it be nice to live in the days of Daniel Boone or Kit Carson and claim “mine” as far as the the eye might see. Any disputes settled with knife, hawk and musket. I am such a person as I sit meekly hidden in my house with overdue property taxes and interest growing daily.

        • http://?? Joe H.

          Barb Wire,
          so all of us that have busted our asses all our life and saved all we could and paid our property off and AREN’T behind in our taxes should just sit idley by and let them take our property for the next developer that comes along without a fight??? Sorry guy but I have a bigger set than that!!!

          • Bob Wire

            and as you should Joe, fight! with every ounce of you being!

            Never lay down and never quit! but you gotta do it smart!

            It no time to play foolish, the stakes too high.

            Bureaucrats don’t care! My property paid for long ago just makes it a more worthy target for the vultures. ~ It’s title free and clear or was anyway.

            The point I make , is be aware of what you fight, ~no time for crying “not fair” like a school child. Comply and engage the system.

  • http://gmail i41

    i DON’T SEE WHY EDDYEE HAS SUCH PROBLEM WITH USING AND OF TAKING ” INDIAN LAND” TO PUT IN ROADS AND RAILROADS. THE SLACKARDS WERE JUST WASTING WILDLIFE AND EACH OTHER, AS THEY STILL ARE. BUT THE PROGRESSIVE IDOITS IN NEW YORK AND WASHINGTON THOUGHT THEY KNEW WHAT WAS BEST, LEFT THEM FREE LAND AND NEVER ENDING PAY CHECKS FOR DOING NOTHING, THEY STILL DON’T USE OR PRODUCE A DAMN THING ON. IF THE OVEREDUCATED IDOIDS THINK MORE COLLEGE SPACE IS NEEDED, BUILD IT UNDERGROUND. COLLEGES ONLY PRODUCE MORE EDUCATED DUMAZZES. THEY ALL ARE WORTHLESS AND COSTLY TO EVERYONE. LOOK AT ALL THE FEDERAL AGENCY MORONS WHO STILL HAVEN’T DONE A DAMN THING IN 70 SOME DAYS. STILL HAVE A DOUBT ABOUT THE WORTHLESSNESS OF DEMOCRAP PROGRESSIVES?

    • Bob Wire

      >>”COLLEGES ONLY PRODUCE MORE EDUCATED DUMAZZES. THEY ALL ARE WORTHLESS AND COSTLY TO EVERYONE. “<<< I take it, you're not a Princeton Grad?

      LOOK AT ALL THE FEDERAL AGENCY MORONS WHO STILL HAVEN’T DONE A DAMN THING IN 70 SOME DAYS. STILL HAVE A DOUBT ABOUT THE WORTHLESSNESS OF DEMOCRAP PROGRESSIVES? How so? which ones? Just the Givemecrats? or all of them?

      I was thinks more along the lines that 80 billion and 100 million more then chump change and worthy consideration. I was thinking more along the lines of a Nation stalled in amazement and disbelief. ~ " You mean to tell us you can't cut this thing off?" "I thought you assured us that you could?" ~ 70 day to assess and reconsider for government is quick! Regardless who's running the show. Who knows more about oil wells then oil people? If you of someone, let us all know.

      "A Whale" a huge skimmer vessel made land fall this morning just south of New Orleans. ~ She's huge and she's new, she was being built to carry cargo and refitted at the last minute by it's owner as a skimmer and sent to the US. They say, she's capable of skimming 250 time more then anything currently working in the gulf! It's my hope more will follow. But such things does take time to create and respond. ~ There's got to be a "need" for it. Otherwise, it cost an owner 7,000 a day to just tie it to the pier and it sit, doing nothing but rusting.

      • http://?? Joe H.

        Bob,
        Once again the greenies have put their finger in the proverbial pudding!! They say that since the water that is pumped from said spearator is not 100% clean, it shouldn’t be pumped back into the Gulf!!! Never mind that it’s much cleaner than it was when it was pumped INTO the ship!!!!

        • Bob Wire

          hmm? well hmm? well we need to get passed this and soon.

  • bill

    Well folks,I reckon I am just an old dimwit that still believes in our
    Constitution and Bill of Rights else I wouldn’t feel I had the right of
    self determination or free speech.Now if you are a citizen who doesn’t believe in our Constitution then I would say it would be pointless for you to download or read these files.It is entirely up to you and does require a bit of effort.cheers

    http://www.4shared.com/photo/u4dGSVb3/whoisAmericanGrandJury.html

  • joan beisler

    To eddie47d

    Fool or not, based on your writings it is obvious you have never been a party to eminent domain. This is too bad as you would see inevitably that it is only governments way of taking privately owned land for the “subjective uses” that please those in office. They do not pay “fair” value for the land but the lowest value they can and get by with then the land is resold commercially by the parites involved – fair, no I think not. My mother and many of her elderly, widowed neighbors, were victims to eminent domain (as will these victims in Harlem be) Black or White, we are ALL simply “Americans” fighting for what we have worked hard for all our lives. Fair, no. Not when it is subjective as eminent domain is. Value is in the eyes of the beholder or the taker, let the people vote on it. Kentucky, with a child at Columbia.

    • eddie47d

      My city wanted to build baseball stadium and it was approved by voters at a resonable cost.This one family owned a building and some land next to it. The land was only 1/4 acre and was worth about 1 1/2 million. They balked and demanded 5 million after the fact. They didn’t need the land for their business and were out to milk the city. The stadium was built and the taxpayers got stuck with the bill. I look at both sides of the scammers and I see private developers and businesses screwing the taxpayers all the time. Our city wanted to build a new airport and had to sell bonds and the cost of the airport was “set in concrete” so everyone knew how much was needed. Before the ink was dry on the cities upfront obligations realitors went out and bought up large parcels of land and tripled the cost of the land to the city. That’s the taxpayers folks and we got screwed by these land jumpers and a much bigger tax bill. You can say government is not honest but our free enterprise system will shaft the government at every turn. If the government steals one dollar you hate them,but if these capitalists steal $10.00 you all think you got a good deal. I don’t care what side of your pants you carry you wallet in a crook is a crook.

      • meteorlady

        So I worked for an attorney and he represented a little old lady who happened to own about 1200 acres. They local government needed some of her land (the part with her home) for a road that they really didn’t need that much. They offered her money and she said no – it was her family home and she had lived there her entire life. She wanted them to move the road to another part of her property but they would not because it would not benefit one of the local businessmen in the area. So they took her house and land using eminent domain and gave her about 1/2 of what the property was worth. She was moved under great duress and she dies two weeks after they moved her.

        The road was never built, but the land was made into a shopping center.

  • Allan

    The scope of eminent domain in the Constitution grew from concerning itself with municipal functions like transportation and waterways, to assorted power-grabbing backroom deals. 42 of 50 states smacked down this abuse after the shameful Kelo decision in 2005.

    More than ever, government seeks tools to create a post-national, post-individual rights culture in America. That determination will be mostly in the hands of our children. Hope we raised them with great character and love of country.

    Speaking of real hope…here’s 25 seconds that will lighten your day.

    BOB HOPE ON DEMOCRATS: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oHK-ioV8UE8&NR=1

    • http://?? Joe H.

      Allan,
      Real Hope and real true!!!! I was fortunate enough to see Hope twice while in RVN. He was one I had REAL respect for!!!

      • Bob Wire

        Yea Joe I seen him as well, on ammo boxes stacked some ten high. I was so far away, he was less then 1/8inch tall, so about 300 to 350 meters my guess. But we could hear! with speakers. ( I hungered for a good look at a full sized, round eyes woman with hips and breast and rich voice!!) ~ Bob had a sharp wit, great writers, a steel trap mind and an unassuming face that served him well through out his career. We all miss him.

        But , I don’t see that ‘clip” as a political statemented but simply witty humor. Reagan was much the same way with his “delivery style”. And someone has got to carry the butt end of each joke.

        It was a cute skit.

        Now we know the GOP of 69 is not the same as the GOP of 99, don’t we?

        I41, Have you caught a viewing of any of the current TV series, “America, a story of us” ? If not, you really should. I promise you, you’ll enjoy it. While it skips around quite a bit, jumping from topic and time while showing the pressures and processes of how America came to be what it is today. The answers to the questions you ask are in the process of evolving and presented well in this presentation.

        At one time there was a “good reason” for the 18 amendment! America was being over ran by immigration. Most of these new immigrant was poor people and use to hard times and a hard life. They brought with them their habits of drink, drinking to excess. It was a rough life and made only rougher on the women and children as they were being beaten by men coming home from work and wanting to kick the dog around. The New York and Chicago slums swelled with their numbers.

        the 18th amendment was governments response to a “existing conditions” that required address in real time. ~ The 18th amendment put out a fire that was raging out of control and brought social awareness to an “issue” and broke a pattern of “wide spread” unacceptable social misbehavior. But it was only in “that sense” that it worked, for as we all know today, it brought on whole new set of problems “organized crime” but the upside was, that is was “organized” and not as random, allowing government fight something that had a face.

        It was a fight that society had a chance of winning! as before, there was no chance. This raging uncontrollable fire was slowly brought under control.

        By 1933, America broke, government seeing a need for the revenues, the fires now under control, the 18 amendment resended and regulation put in place. Society now in a better position to police itself with churches, help groups and pier pressure. We don’t get drunk and beat on women and children ~ very, very uncool and you will answer for it in this world and the next, and that’s a promise not a threat.

        It is stories like this one that help us to understand why things are the way the are. ~ We can’t legislate morality! but we can address “issues” ~ We can change, bend and shape for a greater purpose.

        Being “popular” is a rare quality in sound leadership. If you are affecting change or administering to hard issues, you are not going to be beloved by many.

        My accounting is just hitting the high spots and one human drama story about how America has grown.

        These men that you condemn, second guessing their actions and judgment were under great pressure, pressures you could easily make light of today. It’s only on the shoulders of giants you are able to see so far.

        Every President in history has been confronted with a unique basket of unaddressed issues as his predecessor has been bogged down in the “Wars’ he chose to address and the methods used, along with all their encompassing side “issues”

        Our enemies watch this process unfold and wait for their moment to strike, 43′s administration was a victim of such events. That he was a shot from the hip kind of guy and placed in the position “no accident”

        As young boy allowed to go bird hunting alone for the first time, I swelled with great pride of early manhood. I jumped a single Bob White and she squawked as she flew away, I fired and missed! But she didn’t fly far and I raced after her. ~ This was repeated seven or eight times, she sometimes flying as if she was wounded over 5 acres of rugged Texas countryside as on and on she lead me away for her nest of tiny fledglings. This story offered testimony to my poor gun skills and her cunning to out smart me.

        It takes time and experience to develop the skills to understand what your eyes and ears are telling you. And so it is for all of us, president’s and state-person’s no exception.

        i41, I can offer you many names of wise men, but it’s up to you to find the wisdom.

  • http://gmail i41

    bob wire, name one democrap progressive that was or is worth a damn. They all want government to control everything.When FDR appointed the first socialist communist to Sec. of Agriculture, showed the democrap mind set, since FDR was a doink, who was with Woodrow socialist Wilson, still have doubts? This muslim pin head, refered by idoits, who they call the Prez, is another dick-tater in the making. He is just rehashing of more of Freakface Dipstick Russianwannabe’s plans, as all democraps do. They cannot and will not follow the Constitution ever, so give us all an example of a sence able democrap.

    • http://?? Joe H.

      Barb Wire,
      you going to answer i41????

  • mehoward

    THIS IS ANOTHER SCREW UP BY THE SUPREME COURT. NO GOVERNMENT SHOULD BE ALLOWED TO CONFISCATE PROPERTY OF A PRIVATE CITIZEN UNLESS THAT CITIZEN
    IS WILLING TO SELL. HOW MANY PEOPLE DID THEY RUN OUT OF THEIR HOMES?
    HOW MANY PROMISES DID THEY GIVE TO BUILD NEW HOUSING? i SAY STOP THE TAKE OVER OF PRIVATE PROPERTY BY CITY, STATE & FEDERAL GOVERNMENT NOW!!!!!!!!!!!!MEHPENSACOLA,FL

  • Robert

    just another example of dork up decisions, stupid laws, and oh yeah, another in a long line of grievances that oh-my-gosh, the same stupidity precipitated action that formed our country way back; people finally got fed up with the stupidity, injustices, and downright illegal behavior of the ruling class. and so here we are in 2010 and the list has been piling up once again for many decades, because the past always repeats itself for people who choose to ignore it at their peril. wonder when the final straw will occur in america when people have finally had enough and start kicking some butt!

  • meteorlady

    Eminent domain – legal theft and certainly not a good example of freedom in this country.

  • Bill

    eminent domain:
    We suffered great pain from eminent domain. Eminent domain as been around for many years and Obama has nothing to do with it. Eminent domain was generally used in the pasted to build highways and other like projects for the public good. But it seems in the last few years the states want an easy way to take lands from people by expanding the intent of the law to anything they want to mean. This case is not for the public good it is to benefit the university. The interstate highway benifts all the people in Balitmore not a select little group. The university now does not have to go in and bargain with the land owner and give market value for the property.
    We had an 8 bedroom house in Baltimore Maryland in the 1950′s. The government moved in and took the house by eminent domain to build an interstate. We had not recourse when the amount they wanted to pay was questioned. They said tough, hears what we will give you and then destroyed a wonderful home we lived in.
    Ownership of Private property is a constitutional right. If we are not careful and let the local and national governments run wild it won’t be long before we will not have the rights to own property.

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