Comments Subscribe to Personal Liberty News Feed Subscribe to Personal Liberty
 

Conservatives Are Among The Critics Of Karl Rove’s New Book

March 15, 2010 by  

Conservatives are among the critics of Karl Rove's new book Former top George W. Bush adviser Karl Rove’s defense of his boss’ presidency has been facing criticism not only from Democrats, but also from Rove’s own party members.

Last week, the former aid’s new book Courage and Consequences hit the bookshelves, and in it the man who was dubbed "Bush’s brain" set out to defend the administration’s key decisions, including the war in Iraq.

Speaking with NBC’s Matt Lauer, Rove emphasized that 110 Democrats voted for the war, and that there was a "worldwide consensus" on the existence of weapons of mass destruction with former British Prime Minister Tony Blair being listed among the believers.

He added that given the subsequent "attacks" on Bush by major Democratic figures, and their accusations of lying to the American people, Rove’s only regret is that the administration did not "[respond] stronger than we did."

However, The Dallas Morning News reports that as Rove continues his publicity tour, former Texas GOP chairman Tom Pauken offered a different assessment of Bush’s eight years at the helm.

Pulken said that the Bush-Rove team "hijacked" conservatism and nearly destroyed it. "[As a result] Republican politics is barely recognizable to many of us who were grassroots activists in the early days of the conservative movement," he told the news provider.

He specified that Bush spent too much, increased the national debt and conducted a "reckless" foreign policy.
ADNFCR-1961-ID-19659219-ADNFCR

Special To Personal Liberty

You Sound Off! is written by our readers and appears the last Wednesday of each month. If you would like to submit an article or letter to the editor for consideration for You Sound Off!, send it to yousoundoff@personalliberty.com by the Friday before the last Wednesday of the month. To be considered, a submission should be 750 words or less and must include the writer's name, address and a telephone number. Only the writer's name will be published. Anonymous submissions will not be considered.

Facebook Conversations

Join the Discussion:
View Comments to “Conservatives Are Among The Critics Of Karl Rove’s New Book”

Comment Policy: We encourage an open discussion with a wide range of viewpoints, even extreme ones, but we will not tolerate racism, profanity or slanderous comments toward the author(s) or comment participants. Make your case passionately, but civilly. Please don't stoop to name calling. We use filters for spam protection. If your comment does not appear, it is likely because it violates the above policy or contains links or language typical of spam. We reserve the right to remove comments at our discretion.

Is there news related to personal liberty happening in your area? Contact us at newstips@personalliberty.com

  • http://www.tomdegan.blogspot.com Tom Degan

    Let me give you a crash synopsis of what the Rove book is all about (and this is according to Rove himself): The Bush Mob were wildly successful – in fact they were the most competent administration in American history – and President Obama is undoing all the good work they did with his filthy Socialist ways. Basically our boy Karl is hoping that the American people will once again exhibit symptoms of the mass amnesia for which they are justly famous. After eight six long years of the executive and legislative branches of our government being controlled by the extreme fringe of American politics, the very idea that the electorate is now seriously considering going back in that loony direction must fill Rove with joy.

    The revisionist history that is now being peddled by these clowns is astounding in its audacity. They are now trying to sell the fiction that it was the inattention of the Clinton administration that led directly to the hideous attacks of September 11, 2001. What is being conveniently ignored by the revisionists (They “conveniently ignore” a lot of stuff. Did you ever notice that?) is the fact that when Clinton’s National Security Adviser Sandy Berger had his first face-to-face interview with Condoleeza Rice during the transition in the winter of 2000, he bluntly told her that al Quida had been that his number one focus ant that it would be her’s, too. After the meeting Berger came away with the distinct impression that Dr. Rice didn’t even know what the hell al Qaeda was. George W. Bush, you might remember, thought that the Taliban was a rock ‘n’ roll group. Brilliant bunch, this lot.

    http://www.tomdegan.blogspot.com

    Tom Degan
    Goshen, NY

    • Norm

      Tom Degan
      A glimmer of light in a world of distortions. Tom keep the faith!

      • Marnee

        Talk about distortions! What’s even more amazing is the number of whacky leftists that believe THEIR propaganda and ideology! How blind you are to the errors of your ways. How pathetic that you really believe Obama is spending on Americans. You watch who will be owning your private property–on that’s right, with socialism we don’t want people to won anything and be independent…..

        • Harold Olsen

          Speaking of whacky leftists, are you aware that there is one left wing group who claims that George Bush and Dick Cheney, NOT Timothy McVeigh, were responsible for the Oklahoma bombing?

          • Charles Higgins

            actually they are a right wing group

    • Harold Olsen

      I voted twice for Bush. He was a lousy president. The only thing that I will give him credit for is that he kept us safe after 9/11 from further such attacks. I once commented that he was a much better president than his father, who was a terrible president. Within about six months, I changed my mind. He was worse than his father. I hope his brother doesn’t run. I’m not so sure we could survive another Bush.

      • DaveH

        Government is just too damn Big. Whether it is Bush, or Clinton, or Bush Jr., or Obama calling the shots, isn’t going to make much difference. They are costing us too much money, and in most cases they are not even accomplishing what we pay them all that money for.
        We need to get back to Constitutionally Limited Government. We need to get back to Freedom. We need to vote for the only party that supports Individual Responsibility, Individual Freedom, Limited Government, and Free Markets. That is the Libertarian Party:
        http://libertarianparty.org/platform

        By the way, George, this comment is intended for new readers of this site, not you. I know you’ve heard it before, lol.

        • DaveH

          Sorry, I meant Harold.

        • BillG

          100% correct DaveH! DC has abandoned the Constitution in favor of a democracy that uses slick wording to disguise the truth. It matters not who is at the helm at this point. We need term limits and until that happens DC will remain in disarray. WE must all insist on STATE RIGHTS. While I am not happy with the two party system, third and fourth parties will not help. Ross had more votes than Bill in the state where I live and nationally it allowed the worst candidate to win.

          I left the republican party after Daddy Bush’s read my lips thing and registered as uncommitted. Last week I switched back to the “R” party in order to vote in our state primaries. So few attend these that I believe (no I know)this is the place to make our stand. I invite all to participate in their primaries and force a change in DC!!!!!

          • California70

            At this point …. Think again about “term-Limits”! Even if Obama is a one termer, look at the damage he’s done! And, he not even half-way thru his first term!!!

            Good luck on term limits. How long does it take to impeach a sitting president. We should have started this process last year! By the time Obama finishes his first-term, no one will be able to recognize this Country.

          • DaveH

            Bill,
            Only the Libertarian Party stands for the same Principles that I do. I will never vote for anybody else. After all, the lesser of two evils is still just evil.

        • Robin from Arcadia, IN

          DaveH….I couldn’t agree more! Government has gotten way too big! We need less Federal Government and more State Government! We need the IRS abolished and the Fair Tax instated. We need to be able to know what the President is doing, and why, at any given time. They work for us! We need to know where our tax dollars are going!
          I sincerely hope that I will see a third party emerge in my lifetime. I don’t think either of the two parties that are in place currently are capable of running the government without corruption. I would like to think the Republicans can rise above it, but it doesn’t seem to be happening.

          • California70

            RE: Fair Tax,

            What’s fair about Fair Tax???

            The rich can afford to pay 20 to 30 percent taxes on everything they purchase.

            How about poor people or people living on social security, or a family of 3 or 4 living paycheck to paycheck, or the now unemployeed?

            15 to 30 percent tax on everything can be devastating. What’s fair about that?

            In Los Angeles Country, California, we are paying 9.75 percent sales tax on everything. Let me tell you, if you have to purchase any large ticket item, i.e., a new mattress for your bed, television, sofa, car or anything else over a $100.00 dollars, 9.75 percent tax is a large burden. You do the math.

            Now try the math at 15 to 30 percent. I believe the government wants to start with 15 percent.

            People with pick-up trucks go to Nevada (where there is no tax) to buy these things. But, if you are unfortunate and don’t have a truck… Oh Well! Your stuck!

            Please all you out there — REMEMBER….for the government, 15 percent would only be a STARTING point. They never lower a tax or get rid of it. It will only increase from that point, it certainly won’t stay the same.

            When are people going to learn???

            This is just another VAGUE scam sort-of like “CHANGE and HOPE”. Nobody had the good sense to ask a smart question, i.e., like just “what kind of change did you have in mind”? or “What exactly is it that you are hoping for”?

            We each put in our own thought of what “change and hope” was. Little did we know it meant full-blown socialism/communism. And, that the White House would be filled with Communists Czars by appointment from Obama. Buyer beware!!!!

          • DaveH

            California,
            The beauty of leveling the playing field (making the lower wage earners pay more of the burden) is that people would quickly decide that they didn’t want so much government if they had to pay for it. It’s easy to vote for Big Government when one doesn’t have to pay for it.

            However, the Fair Tax may not be the solution:
            http://mises.org/daily/1814

          • http://aol Don

            I agree with DaveH article – the Fair Tax is so stupid.

          • JeffH

            DaveH and California70…If there aren’t major changes in California starting with the elections in November, look for California to become the first state without a tax base funded by anyone but government employment. California is a welfare state, nothing more, without a future unless the liberals can be totally ousted and a conservative rooted, constitutionaly respectful state government can be put in place.
            As a lifelong resident, I too, like California70, make as many purchases online and talk to many others that cross into Nevada or Arizona for their purchases of groceries and any other major items they might need, all because of high taxes.
            Some might say, you should support your government, afterall, they support you! Well my answer to that is they don’t! I, like so many others are proud to have “paid our way” for a lifetie of work and personal rewards from that hard work. Now, as has been for quite awhile, there are no more rewards for hard work because there is so little work available, and if you do work, The taxes eat up a major chunk.
            California, like our federal government, believes it is much easier to take than to give, unless you are illegal or a welfare cheat!

      • Bob Stuhlmiller

        Don’t you, Mr Olsen, find it strange that a modern President (Bush) would do what the constitution says is his responsiblity for a full 8 year term?

      • Teri

        It makes no sense to only vote for the Libertarian party if they can’t get the win in the end. If we are going to take back the ground that the liberals and progressives (socialists and communists) gained it will have to be by consolidating efforts when it comes to the final push at the end of each race to get behind the “most” conservative and then hold them accountable. Otherwise, we just split the votes and keep throwing the win to the liberals and progressives under the cover of the Dems. Even though many Dems are conservative they don’t even know what it means because the media, liberals and progressives have made it sound like a bad word that they don’t want to be associated with.

        People are “afraid” to be labeled a conservative even if they have conservative values which allows the Dems yet another societal win. Yet if you point out their socialist agenda you become labeled a Nazi. That same ploy is used by the Dems to make Republicans feel bad about the trillions of debt Obama is racking up by blaming Bush (a Dem Rules Chairwoman w/Pelosi’s nod decided how the TARP bill would go even though bi-partisan opposition to her decision); by discouraging people from speaking out against Obama’s policies by calling them racist if they do; by accusing the Reps of walking in “lock-step” when the Dems are the ones in lock-step vote with sanctions and consequences if they don’t follow through with the party-line after they get their payoff. It’s a lot like the spouse who is unfaithful yet constantly accusing the faithful partner of having an affair. The more facts the better. There are no perfect presidents, but the better ones do the least harm and some good. That is NOT Obama’s train wreck agenda.

        • American Citizen

          Conservatives should not be afraid, but should be proud to be know as Conservatives.

          • Joe H.

            American Citizen,
            I am very proud to say I am conservative. Everybody that knows me knows I am a conservative and I don’t hide it at all!!!

    • Hersh

      Please read the book “LONE SURVIVOR” written by a HERO (Marcus Latrell) who is a Navy SEAL and was there. When you get the truth from the boots on the ground all this fringe left wacko stuff is…. well…. fringe left wacko stuff. With Obama Hussain we are a lot worse off and getting more so. Its time to stop these idiots from the president on down.

    • Charles Higgins

      Well said, well said indeed.

      Karl Rove = Joseph Goebbles

    • Steve

      Nice full page of nothing, Condolezza Rice was ahead of the mentally starved Berger. If I recall that particular person was known to have stuffed national classified secrets and papers into his person to save that other Clinton who was Impeached for lying under oath. We have a short weak memory sometimes called “selective”. Clinton allowed the main Al Quida leader to be allowed free because of ignorance or otherwise/ you call it. Karl Rove does not have a fan here and I do not disallow that he is as smart as Dick Morris. Morris got smart when he left the progressives and has been making everyone aware of that Manchurian Candidate that you most likely voted for, who is destroying this country with his Marxist plans. Bush had his faults, primarily the illegals and his social programming, but believe me….Obama is not fit to shine either Roves or Bushs’ shoes. The destruction Obama is creating will not be rectified for several generations..just remember your childrens,childre will suffer your leftist choices.

  • Ron Landon

    Juat one question why did Clinton refuse to take custody of Bin Laden when the Yemeni government offered, he was already accused of the bombing of the Cole.

    • Norm

      Ron Landon
      One question. Why couldn’t Bush nail Bin Laden after 8 years, thousands of american casualties, and nearly 1 trillion wasted taxpayer dollars? Oddly the total cost to Bin Laden for financing 9/11 was less than 1 million dollars. Some investment!!

      • George E

        Norm,

        Your logic escapes me. Do you know for sure that Bush and the U.S. government knew where Bin Laden was hiding, and chose not to capture him? (My source close to the intelligence service denies that claim, and says just the opposite is true.) If they knew where he was then, do they know where he is now? If so, why haven’t we captured him since Obama took office?

        Do you honestly think the U.S. invited the 9/11 attack as a way to make an “investment?” I don’t know how to respond to a statement like that……..

        • Harold Olsen

          Perhaps we can’t capture Usama Bin Laden because he doesn’t exist. If he existed we’d know where he was and be able to capture him.

          That’s the sort of logic that one left wing group uses to claim that there is no War On Terror. They claim that Al-Qaida doesn’t exist, that Bush and Cheney made them up so they would have an excuse to invade Iraq and Afghanistan. They claim that their proof that Al-Qaida doesn’t exist is the fact that we can’t find them. If they existed we’d be able to find them and capture them.

          • DaveH

            Regardless of whether Bin Laden exists or not, we are wasting our money and our resources. We need to retaliate harshly when they mess with us, and then just get out of their countries. No Nation Building. It doesn’t work! Let their leaders explain to their countrymen why it was worth it to mess with the United States.

          • California70

            I agree with Dave H,

            But, I must say…Do you all remember that Osama Bin Laden was a Kidney patient on a makeshift dialysis machine (an old wringer-type machine his group drug around in the mountains for him to do the dyalisis)???

            Any of you every work in a hospital and been around a dialysis patients?? If so you will know, without a shadow of a doubt, that Osama Bin Laden can in NO-WAY, be alive 9 years after 9/11!!!

            If he was on dailysis, he would have had to have a shunt in his arm or leg, or they had to do it through the stomach. In any case, he would have gotten some infection of some kind. This is not an optimum way to do dialysis i.e., running around the mountains and in caves. And, even if he didn’t get an infection, which would be doubtful, How long do dialysis patients live when they are on a machine for their life?

            Hey people – again … do the math. This one is not hard. I’m shocked that some doctor hasn’t written in to explain all this.

            No wonder our government thinks we are all a bunch of fumb dodo’s!! Duh!!!

        • eyeswideopen

          George, Norm, said that Bin Laden made a million dollar investment, not us.

        • JC

          George are you aware that the Bush’s and Bin laden’s have been in the munitions business as partners for many years? And that Osama and George have been friends sinse cildhood? Just something to think aboit.

        • JeffH

          George E…apparently someone else mis-interpreted your comment, although it was pretty easy to understand.

      • American Citizen

        If you think it’s so easy to capture Bin Laden, why didn’t you go do it? What do you know about the terrain over there? There was more than once they thought they had him, only to find he had once again escaped capture.

      • JeffH

        interesting that Norm said “Oddly the total cost to Bin Laden for financing 9/11 was LESS than 1 million dollars.”
        Witha just a little research, one would find the real info:
        THE 9/11 COMMISSION REPORT
        Financing
        The 9/11 attacks cost somewhere between $400,000 and $500,000 to execute. The operatives spent more than $270,000 in the United States. Additional expenses included travel to obtain passports and visas, travel to the United States, expenses incurred by the plot leader and facilitators outside the United States, and expenses incurred by the people selected to be hijackers who ultimately did not participate.
        http://www.9-11commission.gov/report/911Report_Exec.htm

        • JeffH

          Norm, by the way you were correct with that statement.

      • Joe H.

        norm,
        That’s typical libber action. To answer a question by deflecting away from the question with a question. Answer the original question. Why did Clintoon refuse Bin Laden??? do you have an intelligent answer???
        as far as Bush not finding him, it’s a wee bit harder to find someone in a cave among thousands of caves than it is to accept someone served up on a platter to you!!!!

    • American liberal

      Osama was never offered to Clinton… That was shot down longago… And the country was supposed to be” Sudan”.. Not Yemen… Don’t believe me?… Go check Factcheck.com or Snopes.com.. Of course I’m certin your new excuse will be Liberals run both sites … Or some other nonsense..

      • Joe H.

        And as a matter of fact they do!!!

      • Joe H.

        American(?) liberal,
        As a matter of fact Clinton himself confirmed the fact and said that Bin Laden had done nothing he could hold him on a few years back!!! See that’s the problem with making a half baked statement here, some people have longer memories than you!!!

  • D. Mindock

    The eight years of Bush-Cheney were one long continuous daylight nightmare. I feel that the new regime merely seems to be the “Lite” version of the previous. Nothing really has changed when it comes to the big issues.
    As far as Bin Laden (a CIA agent) is concerned, he was needed to justify future actions. 9/11 was pinned on him and was used to justify the invasion of Afghanistan.
    The Downing Street Memos must have been conveniently overlooked by Rove. I haven’t read his book, but I bet he says nothing about the outing of Valerie Plame. Yep, revisionism is alive and well in the USA.

    • s c

      DM, Plame’s neighbors knew she worked for the CIA. If she couldn’t keep that from her neighbors, she was useless as a CIA agent.
      America endured 8 long years of a Twilight Zone Bubba Clinton administration. Thank God he didn’t manage to entirely demoralize our military – though he tried.
      As far as Rove is concerned, the man reason why you don’t have any use for him is because he’s on the other side of the aisle, acting like Rahm Emmanuel’s alter ego. FYI, almost everyone knew Iraq had WMD. Not being able to find it (there was plenty of time to get it out of the country) doesn’t give ultraliberal progressives a free pass.
      You can’t always have everything your way. Get over it. Grow up – while you can.

    • American Citizen

      You liberals Just don’t hear right. Carl Rove has explained that it was Richard Armitage who “outed” Plame, although it was already well know she worked for the CIA. That whole thing with her husband was much-ado about nothing. A total waste of our taxpayer money. He even had it in his book that she worked for the CIA. Scooter Libby was imprisoned for nothing. Democrats are not happy unless they’re looking for somebody to prosecute, even if innocent.

  • Boo T

    I hate being a pawn in someone’s big chess game.

    • DaveH

      That is exactly how I feel, Boo. I have people trying to run my life who aren’t nearly as well-equipped as I am to run my own life. That includes people in both major parties.

      • California70

        Well said Dave H.

  • Katherine

    I am so overwhelmed by the blatant lies and irresponsible people in the BUSH administration, the blame on Clinton and anybody else they can point to is utterly amazing that supposedly well educated people act like this and the best they can do when asked to explain bad policy. THEY BLAME EVERYONE BUT THEMSELVES……What a shallow and
    egotistical bunch.

    • Norm

      Katherine
      What’s even more amazing is that there are a large number of right wing radicals who agree with the Bush/Cheney/Rove twisted view of history.

      • JC

        Norm I think this article points out that not only the left is full of lies and deciept…it’s universal now as the whole system is rotten beyond repair.

    • Joe H.

      Katherine,
      And what the heck is the Obummer admin doing????? bush this, Bush this,I had to clean up from bush, I inherited a bad economy. Sound familiar???? Obummer is the king of blame it on others!!!

    • DaveH

      Speaking of Blatant Lies! Obama probably makes Bill Clinton blush.

      http://newsgnome.blogspot.com/2009/03/official-list-of-obamas-broken-promises.html

      • JeffH

        DaveH, I’d bet you won’t get any negative liberal responces to that link.
        Oh, I forgot about Bush. but I will save them the troublehttp://www.americanprogressaction.org/issues/2004/broken_promise.html of crying foul.

        • JeffH
        • JeffH

          Well, I guess the libs will now blame Bush, Cheney and Rove from now on. I relly don’t give ahoot! Do any of you?

          • California70

            What I care about is that we as a Nation, learn what the actual “truth” is and know-it-when-we-hear-it!

            But I doubt that will ever happen with all our kids going to State Run PROGRESSIVE schools that don’t teach anything of substance.

            Hope you people out there are teaching your children how to personally recognize their own “value system” and what a value system is, where it comes from, and why. Only then, when a child understands his own value system, can the progressive schools NOT indoctronate his/her mind.

          • Bullhead

            Sandy Berger-hmmmmmmmm Isn’t he the one that got a slap on the wriswt for STEALING paperwork from our National Archives????
            think he stuffed tham down his pants legs. Thought so.

          • Norm

            California70
            There are still plenty of good schools, good teachers, and fine young people. All we hear about is the bottom of the barrel.

          • JeffH

            I’m hearing that more and more people are opting for home schooling and it would be really nice to see a run on affordable private schools. Once again, the federal government has no business governing education, they just screw it up!

          • Joe H.

            JeffH,
            I don’t know about you, but I don’t see so many of those “good” schools abnorm talks about!!!! I know most of the big city schools, if not all are flunking students left and right with no end in sight as we don’t have any more teachers that look at it as a calling, they look at it as a job! Far too many teachers are letting their political lean bleed into their classes! when a parent who has little college can do a better job of teaching their kids than a teacher with a four year degree then there is definately something rotton in our schools. When a teacher that parks her kindergarten class in front of a T.V. for half the day gets caught and the board tries to fire her but the union says they can’t and if they try the union will call a strike then the schools SUCK!!!!

          • http://certus-certus.blogspot.com Raymond Harbin

            I CHANGED MY MIND–WHY SHOULD I WASTE THIRTY MORE MINUTES ON A COMMENT AND HAVE SOME ILLITERATE BOZO CAN DELETE TO GET HIS JOLLIES, AS HAPPENED TWENTY MINUTES AGO ???

          • http://certus-certus.blogspot.com Raymond Harbin

            HAVE YOU EVER “MIS-SPOKE?”
            ( OR “MIS- WROTE?) VERBAL SHOTS THAT MISSED THEIR TARGETS..

            A 12 YR BOY TRYING TO CONVINCE A NEIGHBOR THAT HE WAS PERFECTLY CAPABLE OF CUTTING THE NEIGHBOR’S GRASS FOR $25.00.

            “ YEAH, I’M YOUNG, BUT I AIN’T NEARLY AS STUPID AS I LOOK.”

            16 YR, GIRL TO 17 YR, DATING SUITOR “I THINK YOU ARE NICE, BUT I DON’T WANT A BOYFRIEND WHO QUIT SCHOOL IN THE 4TH GRADE FOR A CAREER IN PICKING UP ROADSIDE CANS. WITH PERFECT SINCERITY, THE BOYS REPLY:

            “ MORE WON’T HELP ME NONE WITH YOU; THE WORDS BIGA NUFF TO TELL YOU HOW MUCH I LOV U AINT BEEN INVENTED YET!”

            CHURCH MESSAGE MAILED TO LOCALS. BOTH CHURCH AND NON CHURCH MEMBERS;

            “MONDAY NIGHT IS OPEN CONFESSION NIGHT, COME AND CONFESS– BUT LEAVE YOUR LYING TALES ABOUT OUR MEMBERS OUT OF YOUR STORIES. THESE WILL BE HANDLED AT A LATER DATE, IN PRIVATE, AT A CONFESSION BOOTH LIKE CATHOLICS. ”

            A LOCAL NEWSPAPER FRONT PAGE, ON THEIR CHAMPIONSHIP FOOTBALL TEAM ( THE TROJANS) OF THE 2010 SEASON, LOOKING FOR REPLACEMENTS FOR GRADUATING PLAYERS:

            “TROJANS FILLINGS THE HOLES”

            SOMETIMES IT’S BEST TO JUST BE SILENT

        • Bob Wire

          What union thugs?

          What weak minds? which ones?

          What heath care reform? where did many of these reform ideas spring from?

          Quote;>>>>” L.USA says:
          March 13, 2010 at 2:12 am

          Bob Wire, Come out of the stall man. Pelosi, the house speaker, would not even consider any of the Republican ideas, as good as they are. It’s all democrat throat cutting socialistic beast. Get your facts straight first, then post. God bless and good night.”<<<>>>”HAND: GOP’s ideas in health bill

          MIKE KIRBY: Making headlines

          Democrats such as U.S. Rep. James McGovern claim the health care legislation pending in Washington is a bi-partisan bill with lots of Republican ideas in it, even though every single Republican U.S. senator voted against it.

          How can that be?

          Well, one answer can be found in a Kaiser Foundation study of the bill.

          The independent, non-partisan group found that most of the big ideas in the Senate bill are identical to those pushed by Republicans since 1993.

          Back in 1993, Hillary Clinton was advocating her own version of reform. Republicans such as Claiborne Pell and Bob Dole came out with what they called a “conservative” alternative.

          Some of the co-sponsors included current Republican Sens. Chuck Grassley, R-IA, Orrin Hatch, R-Utah, and Bob Bennett, R-Utah. Both bills mirror the Massachusetts health care reform in 2006 that was supported by Republicans Mitt Romney and Scott Brown.

          The federal legislation from both parties had the goal of extending health insurance coverage to about 94 percent of Americans.

          The old Republican and new Democratic bill would mandate that individuals obtain health care insurance. It would also require large employers to offer coverage to workers.

          Both would ban insurers from dropping customers for pre-existing medical conditions and would create state-run exchanges for obtaining coverage.

          Both would provide subsidies to families that need help buying insurance and would help pay for it by reducing increases in future Medicare spending.

          Six Republicans who are still in the U.S. Senate supported those ideas in 1993.

          They kept supporting them right up until Democrats adopted them as more moderate alternatives to their own cherished ideas of a single-payer system or at least a public option.

          But the second Democrats adopted the Republican ideas and President Barack Obama seemed on the verge of a historic legislative victory, Republicans did an about-face.

          They labeled the ideas “socialist” and “unconstitutional.”

          Grassley was one of the last holdouts. He negotiated with Democrats over the bill until a Tea Party group threatened him with a primary opponent.

          He then started saying the bill would result in death panels that would decide which elderly people get to live or die.

          U.S. Rep. Barney Frank, D-Newton, said Republicans felt they had to move hard to the political right to avoid primary election challenges.

          McGovern, D-Worcester, contends the current bill also includes 100 Republican amendments that were adopted during the committee review process.

          Obama said he wants even more Republican ideas added to the bill, such as additional measures to crack down on Medicare fraud.

          The compromises have not accomplished anything.

          If and when the Senate bill goes before the House and corrective measures are offered in the Senate, not a single Republican will vote for the bill they largely wrote.”<<<>>>”JIM HAND covers politics for The Sun Chronicle. His commentaries appear in this space on Saturdays. Contact him at 508-236-0399 or at jhand@thesunchronicle.com.”<<<

          ( seems we have two separate commentary sources is direct conflict, so how might a person as myself get their "facts" straight?)

          (does anyone else have information to offer that might shed light on this matter? )

          Is this simply a matter of "not the right " Republicans or when ? ~ Now I will agree that it's seems perfectly clear, no "present" republican wants to stand up and take any responsibility for their input to the present senate bill. But their silence or absence of boosting should not be misconstrued that they didn't. To do so, we would be projecting beyond knows facts. They have chosen behave as if it might be political suicide to stand up for their own ideas in the matter of comprehensive health care reform, little short of political cowardice it seems.

          How do you get straight facts in such a political climate? This impasse reminds me of 1980's Ronnie's stances of " Plausible undeniably " in the "arms for hostages" debacle ~ people not shooting straight with us about what they been doing. ~ but in this case, it appears to be documented fact that some wish to ignore ~ because ???? It sounds better? It validates "desired" opinions? It's in fashion with the "times"

          From some reason I can't post again on Senator Stupid thread ~ I got too close to the truth I suppose, maybe I can get it in here ~ Germain is the sense ~ Who keeps making this stuff up ~ and calling people brain dead for not sharing their views?

          You guys can make stuff up faster then they can be dis-proven. And then the powers that be with block the facts.

          Now if this will even post?

    • California70

      Katherine,
      Kinda sounds like the Obama bunch, doesn’t it?

  • Vera Vaupel

    I thought your article was going OK then I realized you were quoting Rove. I am a strong believer that we should revert back to the Constitution. The brilliance and foresight of that document is astounding. Normally I don’t waste my time reading something a Socialist writes as I believe you will reap your rewards in due time if you get your way. You didn’t mention that Clinton did nothing about attacks on the USA other than talk. I believe a strong response shows strength and intolerance at least we got that out of Bush. The most important job our government has is protecting the US citizens period.
    Correction on your statement about (just a little fuzzy eight six long years of executive and legislature control). If you look at charts of debt, GDP, etc you can see when the Democrats “took over” legislative powers in 2006. Debt started skyrocketing and hasn’t quit. Bush’s problem he didn’t VETO. As it stands now the Socialist are making great strides in their quest to take over our Government. If you read and follow reasonable outlets of news you soon realize what is happening to our country as we knew it. The housing for poor is a remarkable success story in itself for the bad guys. It’s sole purpose was for the socialist to take over private property. Anyone with any common sense knows if you don’t have income to support the loan for a house it shouldn’t be mandated they get a loan. Do you not know that your dream team has allotted unlimited funds to Fanny and Freddy for that very purpose? They are transferring bad loans from banks to F & F so banks can adapt to Commercial bankruptcies coming. F & F then are taking over the title of those properties and going into the rental business.
    This Health Care plan is another means of collecting taxes to support more spending and debt increases back door style. Why would Obama state that if we don’t pass the H.C. bill our country will go bankrupt? It’s a means of taxing now without having to pay out benefits till 2014. You don’t really think they will bank those taxes. You do realize the people that do pay taxes will be further strapped because they will have to pay the new H.C. taxes plus the premiums they are paying. Health Care will play out no different than Social Security and Medicare. We will be taxed starting now, and Obama and company will be spending. Only difference is up until this lot the take over has been slow. My question is why do you want Socialism?

    • Norm

      Vera Vaupel
      Just a few comments on war:

      ” I abhor war and view it as the greatest scourge of mankind.”
      ” I have seen enough of one war never to wish to see another.”
      ” One war, such as that of our Revolution, is enough for one life.”
      “The most successful war seldom pays for its losses.”
      “War is as much a punishment to the punisher as to the sufferer.”
      ” War is an instrument entirely inefficient toward redressing wrong; and multiplies, instead of indemnifying losses.”
      Tom Jefferson

      The constitution vests the power of declaring war in Congress; therefore no offensive expedition of importance can be undertaken until after they shall have deliberated upon the subject and authorized such a measure.
      George Washington

      There was never a good war, or a bad peace.
      Ben Franklin

      http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul57.html

      • George E

        What’s your point? We all (normal, sane people) abhor war, but sometimes feel a military response is appropriate. Even Obama appears to agree with this point, I believe. At least his actions seem to bear that out.

        • Norm

          George E
          Some people seem to believe that the constitution, and founding fathers, serve as a free pass to attack anybody in the world, for any reason, and at any time that suits us. Nothing is farther from the truth.

          • DaveH

            Norm,
            If you’re going to hide behind the Constitution, then would you at least be consistent in expecting it to be obeyed by the Democrats?

      • DaveH

        Norm,
        It is funny to me that you apparently are against what your illustrious leader is currently doing.

        • Bob Wire

          It is true, one man didn’t get us to where we are today, ~ It took many men and women and it was done over time in many ways. ~ Government “should” guide and direct and has many tools and resources to do so. ~ The creator of such “tools” ( like NAFTA ) can not always control how they are used. ~ They are just tools, much like a hammer. You can drive nails with a hammer or hit your thumb. The person that’s “in charge” is responsible, you shouldn’t blame the tool maker for unskilled craftsmanship.

          Rove, Chaney and Company ~ steered our “ship of state” into shallow waters where grave pearl and sharp rocks threaten us form all direction with little room to navigate. ~ OB is attempting to steer us out into deeper, open waters, ~ requiring drastic measures and maneuvers that under normal circumstanced might be seen as unwise is true.

          You people that scoff ~ need to attempt to get your mind around this position the nation finds itself in today. ” Look Around you” Obama didn’t Commandeer us here. Government should guide ~ and every course correction is not necessarily the direction we wish to take but one we must take at that moment to save “all” cargo and crew from harm.

          I didn’t enjoy the last administrations cruise up swamp water creeks myself. America is a mighty ship of state and must sail in blue water with plenty of room for opinions and that’s where OB has plotted a course for. ~ If you can’t see or understand that ~ I’m sorry ~ just accept it ~ like I had to accept 43′s, just an unwilling passenger in a train wreck, watching it all unfold in slow motion before my eyes ~ hanging on for dear life!

        • Norm

          DaveH
          While I still have the ability to think logically, I will do just that. Unlike the right wing lock-step Nazis, I don’t idolize or follow anyone like a mindless lamb. Obama is not my hero. But compared to my party (I’m still a registered Republican), he makes a lot more sense.

          • American Citizen

            There are times we are left with no other choice but to go to war.

    • American liberal

      Nice try, but you’re very wrong about the 2006 democrat congress being responsible for this economy…. First off , the economy started going in the dumps before 2006…thats why the republicans were thrown out… Also the 2006 congress was called the ” Do nothing congress” because of the lack of bills passed…look it up.. They passed the least bills of the 20 previous years of any congress… And don’t forget president Bush had ” veto” power… Their is no blaming the economy president Obama got on the democrats…and the spending that you want to blame on President Obama started before he was even elected.. The Wall street bailouts started while Bush was still in office…..theirs also the diffrence in Bushs spending and President Obamas…. Bushs spending was on Iraq…. Obamas spending is on America , for Americans…our country has been neglected far to long by Republicans… Our infrastructure is in horrible shape thanks to Bush

      • George E

        Liberal,

        To say that the problems in the U.S. economy are the result of one person or one political party is just plain shortsighted. For instance, which political party did the Federal Reserve favor when it changed interest rates so dramatically and left them too low for too long? When did that start, and which President or Congress told them to do this, or failed to get control of this situation? Deficit spending didn’t just start under GW, it started a long, long time ago. The most recent example of extreme deficit spending started under Lyndon Johnson as he tried to fund the Vietnam War and his war on poverty (which has been an expensive and abject failure).

        The TARP fund was initiated under GW to bail-out the big banks by giving them government “loans”. The thought was if they let these firms fail, there would be a domino effect which would taken down the entire economy. This can be debated after the fact, but I don’t think anyone can prove this wouldn’t have happened if this program hadn’t been implemented. At the time, both Republicans and Democrats supported this measure. As it turned out, most of this money has been repaid to the government, unlike all of the other social give-away bail-outs that Obama has been responsible for.

        Regarding out deteriorating infrastructure, this has been going on for a long, long time. It didn’t just start under George Bush. Our noble politicians (of both parties) would rather build new structures rather than maintain old ones. They might get the new ones dedicated to themselves, but they get no recognition for maintaining old structures.

        Regarding spending our money for war or social programs, wars are a necessity, social programs are a luxury. Also, wars do come to an end, social programs don’t ever end, they just keep growing and growing over time. While the money we spend on our national defense is substantial, it is dwarfed by Medicare and Social Security. Add the new healthcare program to it, and we’ll be so broke within a very few years that we won’t be able to make the payments on our debt alone, even without “any” money going to the defense of this nation.

      • DaveH

        We can blame Republicans or Democrats until we’re blue in the face. Who cares whose fault it is? We just need to roll up our sleeves and get this country back to the Freedom that our Founders tried to establish for us. This country became great because the Government was too small to ‘protect’ the citizens, so they had to protect themselves. Through voluntary contracts, our ancestors built this country into the richest country ever. And now, Big Government is doing their best to turn us into an impoverished mediocre country.

        Study the History of Argentina and learn something. In the early 1900s Argentina was ranked among the 10 richest countries in the World. Now just a hundred years later they are ranked 30th in the world. What happened? Big Government is what.

        • George E

          I totally agree with you.

        • JeffH

          Once again, well said.

        • California70

          Dave H.
          Good Post.

        • American Citizen

          It explains everything. The young people of this country are not getting good history lessons from those liberal teachers and textbooks.

          • Fontilla Laudermilt

            To learn more about the history of our founding Father’s you could watch Glenn Beck on the Fox News station. His program has a lot about this history of our county, especially on Friday’s. And you could also learn about much more about our country on his great show. Fontilla

      • American Citizen

        We need more do-nothing Congresses. When they’re in session, lock up your wallets and bank accounts.

    • California70

      Vera,
      Extremely well said.

    • American Citizen

      Exactly!

  • Jan Bennett

    Why do the opinions of one man (Pulken) imply that “Conservatives” (PLURAL) are critics of Rove’s book?
    The author of this article said that “Speaking with NBC’s Matt Lauer, Rove emphasized that 110 Democrats voted for the war, and that there was a “worldwide consensus” on the existence of weapons of mass destruction with former British Prime Minister Tony Blair being listed among the believers.”
    This may be news to Dems, the party of hate, but it’s not news to me. I’ve read this for years from both national and international analysts.
    So Tom, you prove Rove’s point well. Clinton’s man Berger “bluntly told her that al Quida (sic) had been that his number one focus ant (sic) that it would be her’s, too”. This is the main point. Clinton knew this and it was passed on to Bush’s staff. Berger’s impressions of the new Secretary of State’s knowledge are irrelevant.
    Ron, as to why Clinton acted or did not act regarding Bin Laden is wide open to speculation, especially in light of his National Security Advisor’s blunt briefing of Rice.
    We all know that the Democrats who elected Obama did so out of hate and revenge. They didn’t care who was elected (or what he stood for) as long as it wasn’t Bush (who wasn’t even running) or anyone from “his” party. Hate is a lousy motivator–even irrational. Yet you still cling to it. ~sigh~

  • American liberal

    Bush and Roves focus was on Iraq and ” nothing else”… They even went so far as saying Saddam( Iraq) and Al qaeda both in on 9/11…it’s also well documented that Bush said before he was president that he intended to attack Iraq…

    • Norm

      American liberal
      Yes Bush did want ot attack Iraq because he felt Saddam embarassed his father and helped to cause his 2nd term defeat.

      • Harold Olsen

        Maybe Bush decided to attack Iraq because he felt his father left the job unfinished. I thought that before we pulled out of Desert Storm our troops should have gone after Saddam Hussein. Even General Schwartzcoff felt we should have done that, though he did not express that opinion until after he retired. Junior just decided to finish the job his father failed to do. Had Junior come out and said he was going into Iraq to remove Saddam Hussein, I’d have agreed with that move. I think it was the right thing to do.

      • George E

        Norm,

        George Bush Sr. didn’t lose the election because of Saddam Hussein. He lost because Ross Perot ran as a 3rd party candidate splitting the conservative vote and because the economy was dipping into recession. Even with all this going against him, Bush Sr barely lost to Bill Clinton.

        If GW had wanted to go after Saddam Hussein to vindicate the attempted assassination on his father, don’t you think there would have been more subtle methods other than attacking Iraq with over 100,000 military personnel? Also, if that had been the only motivation for going into Iraq, don’t you think GW would have pulled the troops out right after Hussein was captured and executed?

        • DaveH

          Ross Perot wasn’t any better choice than his two competitors.
          So, George, what if one major party just wanted all your money, and the other major party just wanted to make all your life choices? You still would prefer not to split the vote?
          By the way, I think I summed up the Democrat and Republican parties pretty well.

          I don’t care if I split the vote or not, I will never vote for somebody that I don’t believe in. The rest of you can fight it out with the two evil major parties.

      • Dale

        Really Norm . . . didn’t have anything to do with the 17 odd UN resolutions. Or all the whacky-leftists from Albright, the Klintons, Kerry, Kennedy and virtually every Dimicrap that could move their mouths had declared Sadam a possessor of WMD’s and a threat to mankind. Rewind back to 1998 to 2002 and revisit all the quotes of these loonies.
        Didn’t Sadam fund terrorist bombers families in Palestine, did he not harbor Al Queda folks? And of course it was a lot easier fighting in Iraq on the desert, the terrorists came from far and wide to take on the great satan, and the cult of izzzzlam lost the battle.
        Bush lied??? Creation of the leftist media . . . Bush did a lot of things I didn’t like, but that was because he spent like a liberal and certainly could have read the Constitution. But now the present crowd makes Bush look like a cheapskate. Over the next few years . . . handouts will disappear, as the devalued dollar and inflation rule. Been watching Greece? This is the future!!!

        • California70

          Greece is being dumped by George Soros, the Hedge fund manager. He is the guy that funds the Daily KOS and a lot of other socialist/communist organizations and also, backed the Obama for Pres. and still continues to fund him.

        • Claire

          I wouldn’t walk across the street to buy Rove’s book. If I purchase a book written by a politician you can bet it will be written by a politician that I have respect for.

          • Claire

            This post is from Claire in Illinois–

      • California70

        Nobody ever said that GH was a mental giant.

        • Norm

          California70
          Compared to H, GH surely was a mental giant. Maybe H got his mom’s genes.
          The first Iraq war did exactly what it was intended to do – oust Iraqi forces from Kuwait. Most of the war was financed by the Arabs and American allies, casulties were very small, and it was quick and surgical. I liked GH and was sorry to see him go.

          • JC

            GH was a globalist like the rest of them.

    • Joe H.

      A lib,
      If it was so well known then why didn’t you libbies keep him from getting elected??? you guys brag that you did it with McCain/Palin!!!

  • Harold Olsen

    I haven’t read Rove’s book and do not plan to. The Texas GOP chairman claims Bush and Rove hijacked conservatism and nearly destroyed it. I don’t know if they hijacked it but they certainly twisted it into something that did not resemble in any way shape or form conservatism. As Charles Krauthammer on FNC said in November of 2008, Bush was the most socialist president in the history of this country. However, Obama has quickly beaten Bush’s record on that.

  • Bob Wire

    Karl Rove is indeed very successful man having pioneered, Texas voter redistricting, then the over throw of a beloved and endeared Governor, Ann Richards, installing ” I’m a uniter not a divider” Geo. W. ~ and then to the White House where the administration carried out it’s “own brand” of conservative policy and rewarded friends and allies in the plot as “they” (Rove, Chaney, Wolfiwitz, Rumsfield,etc) circumvented all prudence of constitutional law, over-sight, ways and means.

    Mr. Rove (coupled with his friends)has been very successful and effective in duping the American People, while today believes that he still can. That someone would bother buying anything that he has written, suggest he is correct yet again.

    I think his work more suitable for bird cage material or hung from a nail in the “out house”

  • eddie47d

    Jan Bennett;thanks for joining the rest of the loonies on the right. You must be a proud graduate of the Rush Institute.

    • JeffH

      eddie47d, give me your unbiased opinion on this. Please?
      I know you believe in President Obama and his plans for change, I’ll await your response.

      Soros-Funded Democratic Idea Factory Becomes Obama Policy Font.
      Thanks in part to funding from benefactors such as billionaire George Soros, the Center for American Progress has become in just five years an intellectual wellspring for Democratic policy proposals, including many that are shaping the agenda of the new Obama administration.
      Withdrawal of Troops

      These include the center’s call for a gradual withdrawal of U.S. troops from Iraq and a buildup of forces in Afghanistan, a plan for universal health coverage through employer plans and proposals to create purchasing pools that allow small businesses to spread the cost among a larger group of workers. Obama has endorsed much of a CAP plan to create “green jobs” linked to alleviating global climate change.

      CAP also is advocating the creation of a “National Energy Council” headed by an official with the stature of the national security adviser and who would be charged with “transforming the energy base” of the U.S. In addition, CAP urges the creation of a White House “office of social entrepreneurship” to spur new ideas for addressing social problems.

      To help promote its ideas, CAP employs 11 full-time bloggers who contribute to two Web sites, ThinkProgress and the Wonk Room; others prepare daily feeds for radio stations. The center’s policy briefings are standing-room only, packed with lobbyists, advocacy-group representatives and reporters looking for insights on where the Obama administration is headed.

      `Premier Progressive’

      “The center is the premier progressive think tank in Washington,” said Mark Green, head of the New Democracy Project, an urban-affairs institute in New York.
      http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=washingtonstory&sid=aF7fB1PF0NPg

  • eddie47d

    George E.;The motivator for George W. was oil,unfortunatly it backfired just like WMD’s. He probably wouldn’t have used nukes since that would have contaminated the region and the oil fields. The Republicans also believed in HOPE. The hope of finding cheap oil so they didn’t have to take responsibility for developing other sources.

    • George E

      Eddie,

      I believe your logic and reasoning is flawed. Bush Sr did send troops to drive Iraqi troops out of Kuwait to protect oil supplies in that region for world consumption. That was probably prudent since the world depends on oil and Saddam threatened illegal control of a substantial portion of it (Kuwait, plus potentially Saudi Arabia). He could have driven the price of oil up several times the price at that time if he had wanted to and that could have had huge impact on the world economies. This strategy did not backfire on Bush Sr. The world applauded our efforts in the first Gulf War, and Bush Sr’s job approval rating soared for awhile.

      • American Citizen

        Kuwait asked for our help in turning back Sadaam’s troops. It seems everyone is forgetting that little fact.

  • ONTIME

    I have just picked up a copy of Rove’s book and I have heard him touting it on several shows, he does sound sincere but i tend to disagree with him so far in certain areas.

    Bush was no conservative, which was why it was so easy for his beleagured administration to succumb to confusion, allowing the Jackass party to complete the sabotage of this economy by colluision, complicity and fraud. Bush threw up his hands as he left the office and thought he was going to be able to hide in retirement by keeping quiet. Rove has now made that impossible.

    There is no way Rove can defend the Bush amnesty push or the failure to present a coherent plan to readjust SS, his administrations policy of not defending it’s position caused nothing but grief and the laxity of not cleaning house of the Clinton vermin during his first administration was probably the top mistake made, these people undermined any attempt to change policy for the better and kept our intelligence gathering in a state of dissaray. Liberals do not care what the cost is as long as they can achieve their delusional agendas.

    I am looking forward to reading this Rove opinion and defense but I am going to wait a long time before I hear any explanation of so many vital errors made by the Bush administration.

  • Claire

    It’s nice to see someone from the GOP concede to the grievous errors. It would have been interesting to see Pauken grill Rove instead of Matt Lauer, but Lauer did a nice (hilarious) job. http://bit.ly/bVqz5a

  • http://PersonalLiberty Judy

    Have you seen where our tax dollars are going from the Stimulus Package that was signed by our Great President last year (102 pet projects). Do some research to see where all that money is going. It makes me sick to think that our children, grandchildren and great-grandchildren are going to pay for all this foolish spending. Right now it is costing us $40,000 and rising. In 10 years it is going to be $133,000 for each and every citizen. Are we going to blame Bush, Clinton, Senior Bush, Reagan, Carter, Johnson and Kennedy for this? Do you realize what path this president is taking us on. We our losing our AAA as we speak. And they want to pass this horrendous health care bill. People need to wake up, our freedoms and liberties are going to be in the history books. Or they’ll remove that, too.

  • JayKay

    I’m amazed that Tom Degan apparently is not too embarrased to mention Sandy Berger, the national archive burgler, after the stunt he pulled. Because he stuffed selected documents in his underwear and socks and smuggled them out of the archive to destroy them, we will never know what he hid from historians and the American people. How can anyone believe anything a dishonest crook like this says? Tom, you must be a complete idiot to quote Sandy Berger!

  • California70

    Tom Degan,
    I agree with most of your comments except like it or not, The Clinton administration did a lot to leed us into the hideous attacks of 9/11.
    Have you forgotten the the blowing up of the barracks in the Middle East, or the Cole? The Clinton administration did absolutely NOTHING when it came to these attacks, except to say that they would bring whoever did this to justice. What a crock-of-crap that is – something akin to bringing to justice a common street criminal like a bank robber or something. Pleeeeeeze!!!

    Anytime you delude yourself and think we are not in an actual war with Islamic Fundamentalists…think-again! These people remind me of the Japanese in WW-II (yes, I am old enough to remember WW-II)! How old are you? That means my friend, I happen to LIVE the history, not just learn about it some book that was written last year by some snot-nosed little kid that wasn’t there, and only knows what he’s learned in some progressive school room.

    Let me enlighten you a bit….

    The Japanese and the Islamics have something in common…In the war with Japan, the troops fought knowing that the war would end only when one side annihilated the other. That’s why we had to drop the Atomic bomb, and why it has never ever been used since. America dosen’t like that kind of fighting. To us, it’s inhumane.

    We prefer the kind of war we had with Germany where it was understood that one side would force the other to surrender. But, unfortunately, that is not what we have with the Islamics. Japan at that time, killed solely for the sake of killing, without hope or higher purpose. They would have never stopped.

    I do agree with you, we should not have gone to Iraq. My belief, and I’m sure a lot of other people agree with me, is that we should have immediately gone to Saudi Arabia, and done everything in our power to win the war there once and for all.

    The Bush administration screwed everything up by choosing to go to Iraq. They did an “sales-job” on the American people. They came up with first one reason after another to get the American people to buy-into going to war with Iraq. Nothing worked until they came up with WMD. I really didn’t think that would work either; unfortunately it did.

    By the way, isn’t Sandy Berger the guy that smuggled out classified papers from the CIA or the Pentagon???? Did he ever get any jail time for that?? I don’t think so!

    They are now trying to sell the fiction that it was the inattention of the Clinton administration that led directly to the hideous attacks of September 11, 2001. What is being conveniently ignored by the revisionists (They “conveniently ignore” a lot of stuff. Did you ever notice that?) is the fact that when Clinton’s National Security Adviser Sandy Berger had his first f

  • cerebus23

    The republican congress did more than their fair share in hijacking the party and acting like democrats spending like drunken sailors, not insisting on fiscal responsibility and limited government.

    Bush and clinton were mediocre presidents two sides of the same coin, bush had ok foreign policy with his huge blunder clinging to rumsfeld for dear life when everyone especially the generals on the ground were insisting on more troops to get the situation under control. His domestic policy was mixed at best, expanding government and spending spending spending, and when he had indications and freddie and fanny were a house of cards and wanted to try and reign then in before it was too late he sat on it and let the congress allow everything to collapse.

    Clinton had nothing but one foreign blunder after blunder after blunder. There is little or nothing on the foreign side you could look at under clintion as a great success. Domestic side he had moderate success, lest after he ran left and failed miserably then the mid term elections gave him a republican majority and he had to camp in the middle and rule like a moderate for the majority of his domestic presidency.

    The bush recession started under clinton, recessions are cyclic you have good times and bad, it hard to hang the blame on presidents and congress since there is only secondary things they can do to correct a recession. one thing about recessions is it is a hell of alot easier to make them worse than it is to make them better. but the great left lie that the recession was all bushes fault, when the downslide started under clintion and tech bubble was entirely created under clintion and bush inherited both. then you got the housing and financial collapse that started way back under carter and every president and congress had a hand in to help create. barney frank and his pals were telling anyone who would listen everything was fine about the same time mccain was saying the same thing, yet only mccain gets the blame for being out of touch and ignorant.

    Far as the iraq thing goes tell you what find any evidence that a majority of the world did not believe saddam hussein had wmds? how come it is only bush that made it up when most intelligence agencies around the world believed he had them? saddam sure acted like he was hiding something when he kept interfearing with the inspectors, kicking them out and running boxes of documents and crap out the back doors when inspectors were coming in the front.

    And lets be clear on another point, saddam had the knowledge to make chemical weapons that was more or less his speciality. he had the scientist he had the equipment and it does not take much time or money or equipment to make chemical weapons if you got the scientists, meanwhile saddam was bribing council nations to lift the sanctions against his country. it not like he would have had to deal with inspectors for much longer he could have gone right back to making new batches of chemical weapons.

    but i guess it is all right to have revisionist history when dealing with bush.

  • Dick Gazinia

    Rove adheres to the Nazi dictum: Shout a lie loud enough and long enough and people will believe it.

  • JeffH

    You sure you don’t mean Obama?

  • California70

    Cerebus 23,
    Good post. You’ve got your facts correct.

  • Dick Gazinia

    absolutely sure. Rove is a lying sack of fecal matter.

  • ColinCody

    I have enjoyed reading some unusually knowledgeable and insightful posts here today.

    Our American government has been corrupt and hopelessly incompetent since I was born (1934) and probably long before. I suspect that most of us could not point to a president that we really admired. However, this ludicrous nonsense has got to come to a screeching halt immediately because we are entering into the life and death phase of our long descent into the bowels of national destruction.

    For a very long time, we have been observing the natural results of profound immorality playing itself out in the life of our federal government. It will necessarily continue and get even much worse until the basic problem is corrected. Politics alone cannot deliver us from the full effects of this now rapidly developing immense catastrophe. I do not advocate establishing a theocracy, but we must have men of absolute moral integrity in leadership at every level of government if we are to survive as a free nation. Otherwise, kiss your liberty, all hope of prosperity and even your life a fond farewell.

  • Bob Wire

    AMEN brother Cody, amen,

    and it’s up to us, the American people if this happens or not. The Hall of Government are not self policing has been my experience.

    We have failed too many times, allowing friendships, partisanship, favoritism, nepotism,cronyism self-serving interest and greed to rule the day.

    Pretty faces like John Edwards or Shara Palin seems to cloud peoples better judgment ~ Edwards lacking moral compass and Palin any grasp of the issues or cognizant of Us History much less world history, none starters from both sides of the isle, yet we seem to listen to them, God only knows why.

    Unqualified, lacking in education, experience and moral fiber people is high places are killing us.

    Karl Rove could sell a keg of rust nails to the right “consumer” People that buy labels and do little research , that what he is, that what he does “Create Markets” and sells. ~ He knows little about little else. But we seem to think him bright on many levels.

    As far as the Iraq invasion, yes, 43 was holding a grudge ~ but my feeling on the matter is that his inner council suggested it would be a win/win for the American people, having no comprehensive energy policy in place, the minerals deep in the sands of Iraq were tempting while settling old scores and throwing the military complex a bone, all in one movement. The Iraqi’s would throw roses at us for all our efforts.

    Sounds like a good idea ~ doesn’t it? Well top brass didn’t think the administrations plan realistic and they proved to be correct. Many Generals retired early wanting no part of it.

  • ROSEBUD

    LET US NOT FORGET THAT CONGRESS VOTED FOIR & CLINTON SIGNED THE IRAQ LIBERATION ACT IN 1998 WHICH CALLED FOR REGIME CHANGE & THE TRANSITION OF IRAQ INTO A DEMOCRACY. OF COURSE DEMOCRACIES DON’T REALLY WORK & THAT IS WHY THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, AS A REPUBLIC, IS THE MOST SUCCESSFUL GOVERNMENT IN HISTORY. UNTIL NOW AS OBAMA HAS TAKEN OVER THE MINDS & HEARTS OF THE WEAK.
    CLINTON NEVER DID GO AFTER SADDAM BECAUSE HE WAS TOO BUSY WITH IMPEACHMENT BUT NEITHER DID HE GO AFTER BIN LADEN 8 TIMES AFTER BOMBING OUR VARIOUS INTERESTS. HE TREATED EVERYTHING AS A POLICE MATTER. WHY NOT? HE DEPLETED OUR MILITARY CUT THE BUDGET IN HALF AS WELL AS THAT OF OUR INTELLIGENCE EVEN AFTER THE WORLD LEADERS ALL SAID SADDAM HAD WMD. WELL, WHERE DID THEY GO? FOR ONE, HIS SONS MADE VARIOUS SHIPMENTS OUT OF THE COUNTRY & INTO SYRIA FOR 6 MONTHS BEFORE THE MILITARY ACTUALLY WENT INTO IRAQ. DON’T BLAME BUSH FOR CLINTON’S INADEQUACIES. DON’T BLAME BUSG FOR CLINTON SIGNING THE COMMUNITY REINVESTMENT ACT EITHER WHICH STARTED THE WHOLE SUBPRIME FINANCIAL COLLPASE. CLINTON FORCED THE FED TO LOWER CREDIT STANDARDS SO POOR PEOPLE COULD OWN HOMES WITHOUT A DP, CRDEIT CHECK OR EVEN A JOB. OBAMA WAS WORKING FOR ACORN AS A COMMUNITY ORGANIZER FORCING BANKS TO GIVE LOANS TO THE POOR AS WELL. BLAME THE DEMOCRATS IN CONGRESS WHO ALLOWED THE BANKS TO CONTINUE THIS ATROCITY FOR OVER 10 YEARS. BUSH WENT BEFORE CONGRESS 17 TIMESTO REIN IN FANNIE & FREDDIE BUT THEY DEFENDED THEIR ACTIONS BECAUSE FANNIE & FREDDIE WERE CORRUPT & THE CEO OF FANNIE MAE WAS CONTRIBUTING TO THE COFFERS OF OBAMA, BARNEY FRANK, CHRIS DODD & MAXINE WATERS. WHEN THE DEMOCRATS TOOK OVER BUSH SHOULD HAVE USED HIS VETO PEN. FUNDING TWO WARS WAS ENOUGH. NOW WE HAVE ONE WORSE WHO IS FUNDING A SOCIALIST AGENDA WITH OUR TAX DOLLARS. HE SHOULD BE IMPEACHED FOR EXECUTIVE MALFEASANCE, HIGH CRIMES & MISDEMEANORS PERPETRATED AGAINST THE TAXPAYERS OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA FOR PUSHING HIS SOCIALIST AGENDA AS A MEANS OF PAYBACK TO ACORN & THE UNIONS WHO GOT HIM ELECTED. THE HEALTHCARE REFORM ACT IS A UNION WRITTEN & FINANCED AGENDA WHO ARE NOW SPONSORING TV COMMERCIALS TO SUPPORT IT. WAKE UP ALL YOU FENCE-SITTERS & WATCH OUT FOR THE
    UNION THUGS. THEY WILL STOP AT NOTHING!

  • American Citizen

    No one has mentioned, (at least I don’t think so), that Hussein did have WMD. He proved it by using it on his own people. The big question has always been, “What did he do with it before we came in?” Our troops found traces, but not the stuff. And Sadaam would not let the inspectors into certain areas. Highly suspect.

  • JeffH

    Declassified: More WMDs Found in Iraq.
    Since 2003 Coalition forces have recovered approximately 500 weapons munitions which contain degraded mustard or sarin nerve agent.
    http://www.sundriesshack.com/2006/06/21/declassified-more-wmds-found-in-iraq/

  • JeffH

    I stand corrected. Obama has shouted so many lies that only a few of his believers still cling to his dingleberries. The rest of us don’t like the smell it omits…socialism/marxism/facism/communism..stinky stuff that Obama shouts out.
    Just a note, Rove doesn’t run this country and neither does Obama. Care to take a guess who the “real leaders” are? I’ve got a pretty good idea and I think they were influenced by a guy named Alinsky. Saul Alinsky, but I’ sure you’ve already studied his writings.

  • Marion

    In regard to Carl Rove and Iraq. Mr. Rove recently gave a lecture that was open to the public at Goucher College in Towson MD. He painted a rosy picture of how much things had improved in Iraq since we attacked and after the surge. After Rove finished, he was challenged by a brilliant 18 year old Iraqi student who had received a scholarship to attend the college.

    This young man told Mr. Rove that his family had to flee Iraq to Syria because of sectarian violence. He mentioned the ruined lives, the multiple health problems, and the day to day horrors the Iraqui people have had to deal with. He said that life today in Iraq is a living hell.

    He knew Americans only as soldiers who dropped bombs on innocents and who invaded their homes looking for enemy combatants. He told Rove that he has since talked with veterans who have returned from Iraq to the states who were damaged physically and emotionally. He asked these men, “Was it worth it to you?” None of them had an answer. His words to Rove were “These soldiers are hurting too.”

    Carl Rove tried to tell this student that he was wrong about his country. The more Rove tried to deny what he was hearing, the more the young man challenged him. It was interesting to watch Mr. Rove grow testy and dismissive as he turned away.

    We Americans don’t seem to be getting the whole truth from the media about what is really going on in Iraq or in Afghanistan for that matter.

  • JeffH

    ..who’s to say that this student isn’t here for something more than jut an education? For that matter, did the student mention what the time frame of his departure was? Does this stusent speak for the Iranian people of just his family. here are too many unknowns to base an opinion on one students rebuttle.
    I’m not saying this student is wrong, but is his experience that of all of Iraq?

  • Joe H.

    Marion,
    And life was a bowl full of roses under Saddam?? Gimme a break !!! that kid was a plant!!!

  • Claire

    Claire—apparently there are two Claire’s???

  • Dick Gazinia

    never heard of him… I’ll do some research

  • Dick Gazinia

    Questioning Rove’s truthfulness does not make me a radical, or even a liberal. I don’t care for truth twisters no matter what side they purport to be on. Rove is on Rove’s side and is trying to rewrite history to absolve himself of chicanery.

  • JeffH

    …now I’m confused…will the real Claire please stand up…

  • Joe H.

    bob wire,
    If you compare the education our founders had to today, then they were very uneducated!!! ook at what all that “knowledge” has gotten us! Perhaps what we need is a normal educated un-fancy person this time. Obummer is supposed to be so educated but we are closer and closer to the brink of oblivion!!! I for one aren’t impressed too much by ivy league degrees if they don’t come with a respect for our constitution and our country!!! But if you want me to give it back to Obummer in a statement type vote, then don’t look for it!!!

  • Claire

    JeffH—Claire from Illinois here—this is all I need, someone with my name. I will just have to wait and see if she posts again. I have never posted a website for someone to look up. I posted at 4:59 p.m. and at 5:04 p.m., stating I would not but Rove’s book. It shocked me to see someone else with my name. From now on, I’ll just put “from Illinois.” I believe everyone knows I am from Illinois.

  • Claire

    would not “buy” Rove’s book–sorry.

  • Bob Wire

    Mr. Rove feels that he is still in the game. And in fact , he is!

    Early on, both him and Chaney have been in ‘damage control’ attempting to rewrite history.

    This is just more of the same, an unending attempt to sway hearts and minds, their conduct, intent and purpose to be found noble and justified.

    Rove is a behind the scene personality for the most part and has a long history of being very effective creating both conditions and candidates to spring board from with the Christian Evangelical Right wind under their wings

    Both Rove and Chaney feel they still have some cards to play and the games not over.

    Unfortunately, I believe they are correct. There is just too many American’s still willing to listen to them and buy his book, much the same people as the Palin crowd. People that shoot from the hip and maintain the same notions and convictions they held 25 years ago. People that buy “labels” ~ They don’t questions any discrepancies between Labels and content or update opinions with new or current info. ~ Stuck in “time warps” ~ Karl Rove and Dick Chaney love such people and use them.

  • http://google DJB

    Remember this folks———Our great? 2 party system let us choose between bush and the great wannabe john kerry. AND NOW WE COMPLAIN? Before that, we were offered algore, the biggest wannabe thief in the history of the world. Now whobama looks unbeatable, cause most eveyone getting a guvmint check, or food stamps,works for guvmint, or in a union, or are black, or mexican, or yellow dog democrat, maybe the remaining sheep, will probably say to self, well, it’s working for me now. THE ONLY ANSWER I SEE IS A NATIONAL SALES TAX,WITH LIMITED EXEMPTIONS FOR BASICS TO MAKE SURE EVERYONE, EVERYONE ! PAYS SOMETHING. This includes the 40+ % who pay nothing, the so called rich who pay nothing.(not many),drug money, bribes, kickback, under the table, gambling,etc, etc. SO MASSIVE, THE % CAN BE SMALL/

  • Steve

    It will take perseverance to right the wrongs that this Kenyan reject has wounded this country. But with the Tea Party, there is that light and its like a lazor to make this clown a one term nothing. The only one that can boast any gain is Jimmy Carter, He, can now boast that he is not the worst president of these United States and lay that wreath on the Marxist and his Ilk.

Bottom
close[X]

Sign Up For Personal Liberty Digest™!

PL Badge

Welcome to PersonalLiberty.com,
America's #1 Source for Libertarian News!

To join our group of freedom-loving individuals and to get alerts as well as late-breaking conservative news from Personal Liberty Digest™...

Privacy PolicyYou can opt out at any time. We protect your information like a mother hen. We will not sell or rent your email address to anyone for any reason.