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Cairo Coming To America

February 21, 2011 by  

Cairo Coming To America

For a time last week, Madison, Wis., resembled Cairo, Egypt as thousands of protesters descended on the Wisconsin capital to protest Governor Scott Walker’s proposal to strip some government workers of some of their rights to collectively bargain. Teachers called in sick and their students marched in protest. Union members bused in protesters for the occasion, and the media said there were as many as 25,000 protestors on hand.

Walker’s battle against the unions is his first step at getting a handle on his State’s budget. The State is short $137 million this year and looking at a $3.6 billion deficit over the next two years.

If Wisconsin were the United States, it would just fire up the printing presses to cover the deficit. But States can’t do that. They must balance their budgets or default.

A scene like the one in Wisconsin may very well come to a State capital near you very soon as States across the country grapple with budget shortfalls. Some State lawmakers are talking about raising taxes, but most of the elected elites on the State and local level recognize that they have pillaged their citizens as much as possible. The folks are bled out, as the saying goes.

So State lawmakers are beginning to make hard choices on cutting services, payrolls and state worker benefits — like the one Walker’s making — that won’t endear them to their constituency… especially the hand-out expecting “gimme, gimme” class.

The U.S., on the other hand, can spend at will, and it has done so to the tune of a deficit that President Barack Obama’s rosiest projections expect to be $1.6 trillion next year. Now a battle is brewing over the budget between Obama, Democrat lawmakers and Republican lawmakers. More and more, the mainstream media is glooming over the possibility of a government shutdown, which will come if the political elites can’t reach an agreement on how best to waste your money.

You can be sure that neither side will make hard choices about cutting spending like Walker and other governors and State lawmakers will have to make. Even the “toughest” Republican budget cutters — excepting those with the surname of Paul — aren’t really proposing cutting anything. Their “cuts” are mere window dressing, put up while the house burns down around them.

Due to pork barrel stimulus programs and bailouts for Wall Street, corrupt banksters and favored special interests, the Federal Government went from a deficit of $167 billion in 2007 to $1.8 trillion 2009 — an increase of 11,000 percent.

None of these did anything to help Main Street. Out here… outside of Washington, D.C., — one in five people are either unemployed or underemployed. For blacks, the unemployment rate is near 50 percent. Businesses are closed or closing, houses are going into foreclosure or stand empty and more and more people need assistance of some kind. Welfare and food stamp rolls are exploding.

So Obama says cuts are needed and he promises they’re coming… right after he spends more on failed mass transit systems (like the little-used AMTRAK and, a bigger boondoggle, high speed rail) and wireless Internet and after he taxes businesses even more, after he raises energy taxes and throws more fiat into the black hole called “green jobs.”

Keynesian economics is thriving, but people living under that failed system of deficit spending are not. They’re looking for a way out, and thought they elected some new leaders last November who were going to show the way. They thought elections meant something, but now they’re waking to the realization that elections mean nothing.

Washington is broken. Elected elites — even many of those newly elected — quickly see a way to enrich themselves and their corporatist sugar daddies and the cycle continues. Electing a bunch of new people running under a new banner just leads to a dashing of hope that makes a big splash but is as futile as a single wave against the sea wall of graft and corruption.

With Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke helplessly spinning his deluded pronouncements of green shoots (in a television interview in March 2009, Bernanke said the recession would end that year and a recovery would gather steam in 2010), quantitative easing (he said QE would reduce longer-term interest rates on U.S. Treasuries but the rates on 10-year notes have risen from 2.49 percent last November to 3.65 percent last week) and other equally moronic statements, you can be sure things won’t get any better as long as Obama follows his lead.

Watch for much theater out of Washington in the coming days. Elected elites will posture and preen. The press will wail and gnash its teeth over the “draconian cuts” that will lead to “starving children, displaced elderly and hardships for the weakest among us.” And the money printers will continue to churn and dollars will continue to fly out the door.

Meanwhile, when State lawmakers do make the hard choices, those who long sucked off the government teat — led by the thugs directing the government employee unions and egged on by the press — will march on their capitals demanding that its government rape the taxpayers one more time to ensure their cushy arrangement.

Hyperinflation is coming. Bernanke wants a little inflation and thinks he can control it once it’s started. But just as he was wrong about everything else — from missing the indicators of a coming housing collapse to missing the coming recession to the effects of the bailouts — he will be wrong again.

Americans have been pushed to the brink. To quote trends forecaster Gerald Celente, “When the people lose everything, they have nothing left to lose, and they lose it.” Once the line is finally crossed, a citizenry fed up with a pandering, do-nothing, wasteful government will rise up and throw it out. When that happens, the unrest in Egypt will pale in comparison.

If you have taken our advice and own gold and silver and have food and water stockpiled, you’ll weather the storm. Those who choose to depend on big daddy government will suffer.

Bob Livingston

is an ultra-conservative American and author of The Bob Livingston Letter™, founded in 1969. Bob has devoted much of his life to research and the quest for truth on a variety of subjects. Bob specializes in health issues such as nutritional supplements and alternatives to drugs, as well as issues of privacy (both personal and financial), asset protection and the preservation of freedom.

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  • s c

    Interesting. So, now Wisconsin taxpayers are so rich that they can afford to have overpaid LIARS (teachers) who are PAID to stay out of the classroom. In the REAL world, these “teachers” would be rounded up and FIRED.
    They “care” about students so much that they would invent a reason to walk out of Wisconsin’s schools and act like robotic shills for The Anointed One. Wisconsin, you can do better. Treat the airheads like Reagan did those air traffic controllers. That is, if you put yourself before the PEOPLE, you’re HISTORY! LOSERS! Organized vermin. Entitlement parasites!

    • Mick

      s c says:
      February 21, 2011 at 12:40 am
      Interesting. So, now Wisconsin taxpayers are so rich that they can afford to have overpaid LIARS (teachers) who are PAID to stay out of the classroom. In the REAL world, these “teachers” would be rounded up and FIRED.
      They “care” about students so much that they would invent a reason to walk out of Wisconsin’s schools and act like robotic shills for The Anointed One. Wisconsin, you can do better. Treat the airheads like Reagan did those air traffic controllers. That is, if you put yourself before the PEOPLE, you’re HISTORY! LOSERS! Organized vermin. Entitlement parasites!
      *******************************

      Damn sc, what a way to start the week !!

      But you’re totally right, what I love about you is your bluntness, we need more of that to regain some type of sanity in this country………

      • Vigilant

        How ’bout some some words for those cowardly Dem lawmakers who subverted the democratic process by boycotting the vote?

        It’s not just the lefties any more, it’s all Dems who disrespect the rule of law and are willing to sidestep it every time to get what they want.

        And is it any wonder that the lamestream media never reminds us of the close ties that unions have had with communism throughout history>

        • Mick

          Vigilant says:
          February 21, 2011 at 7:00 am
          How ’bout some some words for those cowardly Dem lawmakers who subverted the democratic process by boycotting the vote?

          It’s not just the lefties any more, it’s all Dems who disrespect the rule of law and are willing to sidestep it every time to get what they want.

          And is it any wonder that the lamestream media never reminds us of the close ties that unions have had with communism throughout history>
          *******************************
          Vigilant,,,,

          Although it’s an outrage it doesn’t surprise me one bit, the democrats have made the word degenerate look good for decades and it baffles me to see how long it took our population to see it and we’re not out of the woods considering the respect for our Country has been declining on a daily basis among our citizens.
          the only way for America to get back on track is enforced tough measures against any type of criminal behavior no matter who the offenders are………

          • Bruce D.

            I think being 14 trillion dollars in debt, along with State debt, woke more people up than abuse of power by government. The left are also very adept at mind control for the masses with politically correct thinking. People are realizing the fraud being perpetrated by the left more and more. This debacle playing in Wisconsin is an interesting scenario unfolding. We will see whether taxpayers will allow government to continue the fraud or stand stand firmly against government enriching itself off the backs of the private sector.

          • steve

            Americans have only respect and love for their country. We need to choose our words carefully. It is our government beauracracy for which we have lost our respect,Mick,and not our country. Don’t tell me there is no difference between those concepts of country and government, in the minds of Americans.If that is so, we are doomed.

            Also, if we wish to regain control of that entity, we must have a government that doesn’t pass laws that force us toward criminality. When the choice is criminality versus survival, based on laws that are contradictory and stifling of individual rights, hiring of more gestapo type thugs to enforce the laws is an exercise in futility, and not a plan that will garner much support from the populace.

          • Granny Mae

            Mick,

            It is past time to impeach the idiot in DC that is leading us into this mess more and more. Don’t tell me he thinks what he is doing is good for the country, only a brain dead idiot could think such things with the results already present from all his prior actions. Everyone in this country is against what he is doing and so are many other countries around the world. Obama does not have the best intrest of this country in mind. He is forcing people to have to go on his government assistance, stepping into the affairs of the states in a negative way and promoting unrest in any state that doesn’t do what he wants them too. It is long past time to impeach him !

          • Kate8

            It’s not like we didn’t see this coming.

            We get send some new blood to DC, and I’m sure they have the best of intentions. But nothing really changes, because as soon as they’re in, they get the ‘visit’, instructing them on how ‘things work’.

            Did anyone really think it would be that easy to wrest control away from the FED and the NWO PTB? There’s a big pool of ”crazed lone gunmen, or some other nasty event, ready to go when folks require an attitude adjustment.

          • Granny Mae

            Kate8,

            Isn’t that the truth. The more things change the more they stay the same ! It is disgusting. !

        • Warrior

          Amazing isn’t it? We in IL send jobs to Wisconsin and Indiana and they in turn send us more democrat politicians. Just what we need!!! Hey, maybe they can rent one of Rahm’s houses. Oh well, last one out turn off the lights.

          • JIBBS

            Warrior, you have to “escape” from Il. We did, it’s not a problem solver, but it helps.

          • Kevin N

            Hey ! Lets out source our Politicians.

          • Cliff

            I have to agree. I’m from Wisconsin and back in the 80s and 90s the tourist slogan was “Escape to Wisconsin.”

        • WayneT

          Vigilan, I agree with you. If I was a resident in that state I would not vote for any of these spineless idiots. I think the Democrats have showed their true color by not standing firm and voting one way or the other. They are certainly not doing the job they were paid to do.

          • http://oklahoma1 ajbokie

            obama would do the same thing go and hide like some little kids Demo need to go and their thug unions need the boot also

          • JR

            You can call em names all you want, from they’re point of view they did the only thing they could have done to prevent this bill from becoming law. No vote of theirs would have prevented it nor would have a challenge in court prevented it.

            If Walker pushes this (or any other) bill through without the democrats present, the bill will be thrown out by the courts on constitutional grounds in the blink of an eye and it is back to the drawing board for all parties involved.
            So, by staying away, they have won round one by default.
            If the shoe would have been on the other foot and the GOP would have walked out we would all cheer them on.

          • eddie47d

            I believe the Republicans in Wisconsin are showing their true colors. They are in the bully pulpit and attacking ordinary working citizens. Their arrogance is a brighter red than the fury of the folks they want to screw.

          • Rick

            Hey brother I figure the lights will be put out for us before many get out. Any country out there with any smarts at all will nuke a country with it’s own nuclear arsenal and an unsecured government and I believe that’s where were headed. Yes indeed the lights will be put out for us I do believe. As more and more wealthier American people with the means are taking thier money and running away from america the Babylon the dollar devaluates without Obama going gold standard. I believe gold standard is coming along with flat out worthless dollars and no government or at least a police state in Wich we as poor and desperate worthless Americans are at the bottom of the food chain. We will be utterly desolate in the end without a way to survive here at all. America the Babylon coming soon to a neighborhood near you. The people who protect america our wonderful police and such will be the first ones to go. It will be devastating. And it is near enough you should be preparing for it now less than two years from today america will no longer exsist. I love her but I partaketh not of her sins. I will flee in fear of the wrath of God.

          • Buddy

            Very few politicians do the job for which they are elected. Their big deal is to get re-elected.

            I understand that the people in Belgium are celebrating 240 days without a unctioning government. Evidently a government is not really required for a society to function.

          • barbm

            eddie47d says: “I believe the Republicans in Wisconsin are showing their true colors. They are in the bully pulpit and attacking ordinary working citizens. Their arrogance is a brighter red than the fury of the folks they want to screw.”

            why is it that, when the republicans push through their agenda without caring about what the dems want, we’re bullies? what do you call a democrat controlled congress and senate that pushes through obamacare over the protests of the reps and we the people? i call them bullies. what do you call them eddie?

          • JIBBS

            Eddie the TROLL, are you still here? Who pays you ?

          • Jana

            eddie,
            They are not attacking ordinary citizens. These people work for the state, they are then Gov’t employees. They are attacking the unions. These unions are taking advantage of the taxpayers because they have been allowed to do so.
            Most of the people in this country have been awakened to the fact that we are broke. We need to cut spending and we need to do it NOW.

          • Jana

            barbm,
            I agree with you. When the gov’t goes against the taxpayers wishes, and does what they want to ANYWAY, yes, they are the bullies.
            These teachers are the ones acting like bullies.
            Good post.

          • eddie47d

            Not when the Republican in charge created the Wisconsin deficit. He could have taken other measures instead of try to put this on the unions. He is dishonest.

          • Jana

            eddie,
            It doesn’t matter whose fault it WAS, it is NOW that counts and we are broke.
            This is a country that belongs to all of the people, not any union or just those that belong to that union. The taxpayers have to pay that bill, and the taxpayers need to be listened to.

          • eddie47d

            Union members pay lots of taxes too so stop putting the burden on their backs when the Governor himself created this problem.How much of a cut are you taking to help out?

          • Jana

            eddie,
            Mostly I don’t comprehend your question, but the part about the Governor I do. The Gov. did not create this problem. He was just elected and it was already mandated that he move certain money from the general fund. He had no choice.
            The main thing is the whole country is having an economic crisis. What part of this do you not comprehend?
            Many people are not employed or are under employed. There is no money.

        • Robin, Arcadia, IN

          Vigilant… I was wondering why something wasn’t mentioned about the cowardly state legislators. There must be some law against that kind of behavior. And what about the doctors who were standing on the corners writing excuses for the teachers. Talk about lack of morals and standards! That is a childish way to become involved in this mess. We have our leader telling us that we need to tread lightly because the teachers and other public employees are our friends and neighbors. That whole line of thinking could be turned around and we could remind them we are on the other end of the mess. My insurance went sky high this year, and I work for a school, only not as a teacher nor am I in the union. Concessions are going to have to be made. Starting with the unions is the best place to begin!

          • Christin

            Robin,
            I taught (past tense) years ago… first grade through college freshman for fifteen years… I did not know that dues or fees were taken out of my paycheck for many years. Then I started figuring out that the lady from AFT American Federation of Teachers, who was very nice to us and would ask us Teachers what we needed, was on the left and their organization was promoting a liberal (progressive) agenda.
            There was no way to get out of having our money taken or to stop them using our dues to promote the opposite way of thinking that I had, except to quit. I noticed the text books had an agenda and stories and information promoted diversity instead of American culture and exceptionism.
            The state education agency raised the retirement rate to 65 for Teachers and all Teachers had to be included in Medicaid payments in the mid 1980′s. We paid into a Teacher’s Retirement System, not Social Security and do not make near as much as WI Teachers, but their standard of living is probably more than ours is down south.

            If I were a WI Teacher I would just keep working and earning my paycheck and be glad THAT I HAVE a job in this economic down turn and world chaos.

            It’s amazing that the LEFT always CHEAT to win by illegally protesting and getting FAKE excuses from corrupt physicians.

            The governor’s proposal is simple actually to get Teachers to contribute a little more of their earned money to pensions and healthcare and to agree to vote yes or no if they want to be in the Teacher’s union each year. UNIONs are bullies and financially collapsing the states’ economies… which Progressives want and obamama, too.

            WI wake up and if you are on the Conservative side you’d better speak up, because your Progressive Union groups are screaming bloody murder.

          • Allan Halbert

            That’s part of the problem. Layers of laws that build in advantages for certain groups and create taxpayer obligations that would not have support from the majority of voters. House of cards crumbles with a modest breeze.

        • BUD

          Hi, Vigilant–

          I was heartened to read the editorial in the Madison, WI, newspaper telling the teachers to get back to work. In the “Comments” section, two-thirds of the “thumbs-ups” went to those agreeing with the editorial’s sentiments.

          Personally, they need to be fired. And why are they dragging their students through this partisan, self-serving mess? Boy, they really care…..

          • Jana

            Bud,
            And one of the teachers had the audacity to say they were fighting for the students. HA!!
            They have a very sorry rate of graduation in that state, 46%. That is pathetic.
            These teachers have a gravy train and they don’t want to lose it.

          • Jovianus

            Bud. Was that the online version of the newspaper? If so, the “thumbs up” wouldn’t be valid as it can be, and probably is, skewed.

          • Jovianus

            Jana…46% graduation rate you say/ Where did you get that number?

            Here is a paste from the MacIver Institute which tends to be just the oppsite of what you are insinuating. So your source for the 46% is from where exactly (I’d guess from Glenn Beck..it seems like the type of bogus information he’d spew)?

            The state graduated 89.6% of its incoming freshman from 2003-2004 in four years, according to National Center for Education Statistics (NCES) data. The NCES’s methods are thought to be amongst the most reliable for counting high school dropouts since they take a longitudinal view of a student’s entire secondary career, as well as a year-by-year breakout of when pupils are leaving school. This rate far outstripped the national Average Freshman Graduation Rate (74.9%) and led a top five effort that also included Vermont (89.3), Iowa (86.4), Minnesota (86.4), and New Jersey (84.6).

            The rise caps a six-year positive trend that saw Wisconsin’s average increase by nearly four points – showing gains in each year since 2002-2003 – while the national average only rose by a single point.

          • Jovianus

            Kind of interesting how everyone is concentrating on teachers when it affects every state worker, from cops and firefighters, to paramedics, to transportation to teaching etc.

            So i guess those guys who ran into the buildings during 9/11 are lazy, overpaid, greedy SOBs as well eh?

          • Jana

            Jovi,
            Those stats were in our liberal newspaper this morning.
            This does not affect the firefighters or cops. Get your facts straight.
            The NEA can certainly donates a lot to the Democratic Party so of course the Democrats and Obama are going to get involved. They want their money.

        • http://googlechrome.com Raymond Babcock

          no surprise winner always win losers always lose how can any one not understand we went from 167 billon to a 1 trillon 670 billon how can any one not understand what is going on i will work for nothing to save the country they only way i think to take care of this mess is to seize ever one assets to pay china of and never borrow any thing agin give are industral base the same support other countrys give theres disolve all treateys make it a crime to come here illegaly make ever one prove who they are just like have to if i can not prove who iam for law enforcement iam taken to jail

      • aspacia

        Many teachers work 10-15 hour days, albeit for 9 months per year. During the summer many must take classes to remain credentialed. Since I have been teaching high school English after a stint as adjunct, I have locked horns with administrators numerous times regarding grades. Please remember it is usually not the teacher who passes students through the system, IT IS ADMINISTRATION AND THE STATE’S SOCIAL PROMOTION POLICY.

        That said, at the beginning of each year students are given a placement test. Not one of my seniors and only 5% of my Freshmen scored at grade level. Most are reading at the 5th-6th grade level. I do the best I can, simplifying complex terms and explaining fallacies, but it is still difficult.

        Please focus most of your anger against administrators and not the teachers. Remember, some of us are patriots who really care about our land and freedoms, and who demand formatted, typed, logical essays complete with a thesis, cited valid support, and an interesting conclusion.

        Ple

        • http://personalliberty.com ladykroft

          So, who’s out there protesting. Administrators or teachers?

          • Bruce D.

            Good point!

          • don

            If Walker has his way, who will get a pay cut, teachers or administrators? Teachers.

          • Jana

            don,
            It should be all of them because all of them belong to the Union.

          • Jana

            Jovi,
            Again, The firefighters and the cops and the paramedics are NOT involved in this.

        • chow

          I’m sure there are a lot of good teachers out there…it’s just that they out there demonstrating instead of teaching. They maybe good teachers but they’re bunch of scumbags bleeding the taxpayer out to dry and that is issue we have.

          • Jana

            chow,
            They are not only out there demonstrating but they have an organized group falsifying Dr. sick patient forms. Turning in a falsified document to the state should be a firing offense.
            These teachers are supposed to be examples of good character, and this is an example of a liar and a cheat.
            Every one should have their pay docked for the days they have skipped school to go out and demonstrate their protest. This should be done on their own dime, not the taxpayers money.

          • Jovianus

            Jana…would you say that about the cops, the firefighters, the paramdeics..y’know, the type of guys who ran into the World Trade Center during 9/11…those guys are lazy liars and cheats who should be punished for wnting to retain their collective bargaining rights?

          • eddie47d

            Jana; Corporates falsify business reports all the time and they are the ones who pushed our economy over the edge. Maybe you’re wealthy but I get tired of folks who keep bashing their fellow Middle Class citizens and treat them like trash.

          • Jana

            February 21, 2011 at 7:11 pm

            Jovi,
            Again, The firefighters and the cops and the paramedics are NOT involved in this.

          • Jana

            eddie,
            Are you advocating dishonesty and cheating now? I really don’t think you are a dishonest man and I don’t think you meant this like it came across.

            It doesn’t matter who did it before, it needs to stop all the way around.
            And, by the way, I sure wish I were wealthy. Hey I would even settle for a not have to worry status, or a not have to save up for a new whatever. However, we do not purchase anything we cannot afford. Our country and our states need to get back to that too.

          • Bruce D.

            Eddie and Jovianus like to turn their backs on corruption involving the left and shift attention elsewhere. An old Marxist trick to avoid having to answer for a corrupt ideology. Most on the right ask for fair play from business and government and do not condone corruption from either. The left only sees corruption when government redistributes to business and turn a blind eye on corruption when money is redistributed in their direction. If we are all in this together private citizens making less than the public sector should not have to support pensions and expensive health care programs they cannot afford themselves. Obamacare is a slap in the face compared to the Cadillac plans of Unions.

        • Bruce D.

          The biggest problem is that Unions have made it extremely difficult to fire incompetent teachers and teachers voted collectively for this. This make the job of teaching twice as hard for the good teachers.

          • FireFly

            NYC has hundreds of teachers who come to work each say, some at salaries up to $100,000 a year, but aren’t allowed to have contact with students because of things like sexual molestation, but because of the unions they can’t be fired. HUNDREDS! Some sleep, some watch TV, some even run businesses from these so-called rubber rooms. What a racket and screw the taxpayer!

        • Patty

          If you really believe what you are saying, you must not be at the protests.
          This is the reverse of Egypt. It is not the people against the gov’t. It is gov’t. employees against the people.
          99.9% of teachers are just very overpaid babysitters.
          All are at fault. Parents, teachers, elected officials, administrators. We all let it get to this point by going against plain common sense and being “politically correct”. While the feds and administrators are mostly to blame, YOU as teachers followed this logic like sheepoles and as one who is on the front lines watched this happen, you let this happen and you did it for the very lucrative money you have been bought off with in your salaries and benefits. Teachers, like China, have produced a lot of bad cheap products and you expect more money to do this than your product is worth. Teachers should not be rallying for more money and benefits, if they truely believed what they spew, they would be organizing and fighting the administration to get our kids an education, not more political correctness.

          • eddie47d

            “99.9% of teachers are overpaid babysitters”Your whole article went down hill with that statement. I don’t always support what goes on in the public schools but throwing out blatant lies makes you look unreliable.

          • Jovianus

            99.9% of teachers are overpaid babysitters?

            betchya won’t say that to a teacher …

            BTW…do you say the same about firefighters, police, paramedics, etc?

          • Patty

            For eddy47d & Jovianua:
            Sorry. The 99.9% was me speaking from personal school experience. Anyone who can miss 1/4 of school per year while also getting out by 11 am on the work program and graduate in the top 5%, was not a challenged student. I made my son get a 4 year degree and he to this day at 32 years says that it was the biggest waste of his time and money. We both have our own companies today. And do I say the same about fire and police, since I was with a cop for more than 20 years I guess that I can say that from personal experience, they tend to not want to get involved unless they have to. And the reason they don’t get involved is because of the upper mgmnt. and they don’t want to lose their retirement. It is always about the $$$ and self preservation.

        • taxpayer

          Sadly even high educated people like teachers get buffaloed. Union leaders, administration and the government all fight it out for a piece of the tuff. The students become the secondary part of education. Well many students are confused and will follow the lead of the easy path. The easy path works at first but real hard work is needed. Checking private schools the teachers and students do better because the rules and structure are designed for teaching to those that want to learn. Schools have become baby sitting at it’s highest cost. If the union wins, the taxpayer loses but the system will fail. How many parents show up for PTA, meet the teacher, or other school functions? Most parents are single moms. Men have given up to the women’s movement and are confused on what it means to be a man. Men were made to be the servant putting women and children 1st. Most men now just want to party, have sex and play games or sports. There are still men in this country but they are a dying breed. We can always find someone to blame for our own short coming. The dropout rate in school is high for boys.
          Who is teaching boys to become men? The weekend dad? The rappers? TV and video games? The single mom? The drug dealer?

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            taxpayer the teachers Did get buffaloed, they’re useful idiots, on our dime!
            Not real smart I think.

          • SteveB

            Just to let you know “taxpayer”…..I am a sixty two year old single man with a fourteen year old son( an honor student and outstanding athlete). While his deadbeat mom was out partying, having sex and ignoring her son, I was the one exhausted at the end of each day….
            making meals….washing dishes….laundry….housecleaning….helping with school work…driving to all his events. No love life….no social life…trying to fit into a group of parents thirty years younger than I am. The sacrifices have been many, but I am raising a fine young man…….and you need to know…..there are still a few good men out here…and it’s not just a deadbeat Dad world.

          • Cliffystones

            WayneT,

            I agree with you completely. I’m not blaming teachers for the fact that my 14yo son isn’t a teachers dream come true. But he’s not anywhere near the level of delinquency that some kids display. Just a typical teenage boy who thinks he knows everything. I have noticed over the years that many teachers have a difficult time with boys (unlike my girl). It seems those teachers with sons of their own are much better at dealing with boys, at least that’s been my experience.

            We had a conference with his Vice Principal a few weeks ago because he just doesn’t get along with one of his teachers. He hasn’t learned how to pick which battles to fight with other people yet and he just basically stubborn. But the Principal was impressed at how both his Mother and I came to the meeting, and let our son know in no uncertain terms how lucky he was to have both parents and a loving family.

          • Jana

            Steve B,
            Yes, there are a lot of good men and women too out there. Being a good parent takes work, and a lot of it seems thankless at the time, but the rewards are great.
            Personally, I feel any parent that is single should not date until their child is up and out of the home. The priority needs to be the child.
            I know most people don’t agree with me on that, as they feel they need to go out all of the time. Sadly that makes the child left out, and we have too many children left out now.

            Congratulations on being such a good parent. You will reap the rewards of a great son.

        • grinch

          I could care less. Your profession has allowed the Unions to ruin it. You stood there with the rest of your peers during the last few decades and did nothing while good teachers got let go and bad ones got promoted because of the Unions. You collectively stood there and asked for more, and more and more when you were told there was no more to give. Administrators salaries have exploded, your pensions have contributed mightily to the downfall of almost every state and you run out onto the streets at a moment’s notice to protest your “unfair treatment.” No, I think you and the rest of the schoolteachers will rightfully ALL be remembered as whiney, rotten, selfish jerks who refused to compromise and who have their hands out constantly. No wonder our children accomplish so little-look at their role models! Its truly sad that teacher’s have gone from a respected profession to hated mindless, Union robots. Thanks for making that happen-our children appreciate your efforts.

          I’m sure all of you Teachers would run away from the benefits you get from “collective bargaining” if you were given a choice, right? Please. You made your bed, now lay in it please.

          • Kinetic1

            grinch,
            Let’s start with a view of the field. The average primary school teacher earns about $42,000 a year. A patrolman earns $50,000, a secretary $33,000, a fire fighter makes $43,000 and an accountant earns $44,000. The secretary and the accountant are not likely to have pensions, but the police and fire fighters sure do. The accountant and the teacher are likely better educated and have to make more of a commitment to continuing education than the others, and their pay reflects that.

            So grinch, what would you suggest? Have you looked at our schools lately? Art programs are being cut, leaving volunteer parents to come in and do crafts with the kids. Music programs are down to almost nothing. High schools are losing their trades classes. leaving many average and below average kids without any marketable talents, while advance classes are also being cut, depriving our best students of the education they deserve. In the mean time, Math, english and history teachers are being forced to teach kids how to pass a test (thanks “no child left behind”) rather than how to think. About the only thing still getting the sort of support it did 30 years ago is Football. God help us if they cut support for Football!

            The teachers in Wisconsin are willing to take cuts (again), but are not willing to give the Governor the power to dictate what those cuts will be. They want the right to sit down and work out a deal that helps the state but does not leave them struggling. What do you think will happen if the Governor is given the power to do whatever he wants? A Koch brothers controlled fund gave Gov. Walker’s campaign $43,000, and now we find out that this bill would also allow the governor to lease or sell off any state controlled power company in a no-bid sale at whatever price he feels is “best for the state”. Who would he sell to? How about someone like the Koch brothers who have several subsidiaries in Wisconsin, including coal mines! Does this give you some sort of idea how he might deal with the teachers? Or maybe this quote from Forbes, Feb 18,

            “This afternoon, Marty Beil, executive director of the Wisconsin Public Workers Union, sent a message to the Governor’s office agreeing to the cuts to pension & welfare benefits sought by Walker in his bill. The governor’s response was “nothing doing.” He wants the whole kit and kaboodle – the end of the collective bargaining rights of the public unions”

            Does that help you see the picture? This isn’t about balancing the state budget, this is about busting the unions, an idea that you clearly support. And why not? Each year some 5,000 workers are killed on the job and about 5 million are injured or become sick due to their job. Unions fight for safety laws and their enforcement, but it wouldn’t be too much worse without them, wold it? Unions fought for child labor laws, but having 12 year olds working in coal mines would be ok, right? Hey, some Republicans have even suggested it! And who needs those weekends, or lunch hours, or living wages? We can trust people like Gov. Walker to do the right thing, can’t we? And we know our corporate leaders will take our safety and our needs into account, won’t they?

            “While Koch controls much of the infrastructure in the state, they have laid off workers to boost profits. At a time when Koch Industries owners David and Charles Koch awarded themselves an extra $11 billion of income from the company, Koch slashed jobs at their Green Bay plant:”

            Yep, I’m sure they will.

          • Jana

            Kinetic,

            Reread your first two paragraphs and you will see you have made our point.

            *********
            You also state: ” Have you looked at our schools lately? Art programs are being cut, leaving volunteer parents to come in and do crafts with the kids. Music programs are down to almost nothing. High schools are losing their trades classes. leaving many average and below average kids without any marketable talents”
            *********

            Now why do you think all of these programs are being cut? Answer, for lack of funding. WE ARE BROKE. How is this so hard to comprehend? Our country and our states are all facing being broke. We have to cut costs.

            It does not hurt for a lot of these programs to have volunteers to come in and teach them. After all, our country has been full of volunteerism.

            *********
            Again you state: ” The teachers in Wisconsin are willing to take cuts (again), but are not willing to give the Governor the power to dictate what those cuts will be…”
            **********

            The state gave them the power in the first place to have collective bargaining, and has the power to take it away.

            They can reinstate collective bargaining again in the next two years but right now, tough decisions needs to be made. Either this happens or they will have to let around 5,000. employees go.

            Personally, I don’t think any government employee should have the right to collective bargaining.
            We are not talking about the private sector here, this is taxpayer money being taken from the taxpayer.

          • Kinetic1

            Jana,
            Funny, you see the facts reflecting a need to further cut our teacher’s salaries to balance the budget, while I see it as further proof that Americans want the best of everything, but they don’t want to pay the bill. I want the best teachers I can get for our children, and I expect to have to pay them a living wage. And truly, the pay is beside the fact. You make the point that the Governor can reinstate collective bargaining again in the next two years, but who’s to say he will? Once a politician has power, he’s unlikely to hand it back. This is a concept I would have thought people on this site would understand.

            As for the quality of American teachers, I agree with those who blame much of our educational problem on uninvolved parents. Whether this is brought on by the need for both parents to work to make ends meet, or single parenthood, or just a lack of proper upbringing, it has had a disastrous effect on our schools. There are other cultural and moral issues as well, but I don’t believe it’s fair to dump it all on the teachers. Yes, there are good ones and bad ones, but in over 20 years of dealing with teachers for my three children, I have met few I would consider truly bad.

          • Jana

            Kinetic,
            The state is broke. Actually it’s way past broke. This union thing is just a start. We all have to start somewhere. Obama keeps telling us we all have to sacrifice, but no one wants to do it. We cannot spend our way out of debt.

          • Kinetic1

            Jana,
            Reports over the last two years showed that the economy of Wisconsin was looking good. The state unemployment numbers were dropping and earnings were on the rise. Cuts may have been needed to keep things moving along, but nothing suggested anything like what Gov. Walker is up to. Now we see that he is also looking at a state fire sale!

            “16.896 Sale or contractual operation of state-owned heating, cooling, and power plants. (1) Notwithstanding ss. 13.48 (14) (am) and 16.705 (1), the department may sell any state-owned heating, cooling, and power plant or may contract with a private entity for the operation of any such plant, with or without solicitation of bids, for any amount that the department determines to be in the best interest of the state. Notwithstanding ss. 196.49 and 196.80, no approval or certification of the public service commission is necessary for a public utility to purchase, or contract for the operation of, such a plant, and any such purchase is considered to be in the public interest and to comply with the criteria for certification of a project under s. 196.49 (3) (b).”

            And as I noted elsewhere, who stands to profit from this? How about some of his biggest contributors, the Koch brothers. This isn’t about being broke, it’s about the rights on going campaign to bust unions and privatize everything they can.

          • Jana

            Kinetic,
            When did this Gov. take over? Just recently. When he took over he knew they were going to be in the hole because of funds that was supposed to moved from the general fund into another fund.
            the new Governor did not create this mess, he inherited it.

        • Cliffystones

          aspacia,

          On an individual and personal level, I completely understand where you are coming from. I have a teenage son who is very smart but can’t break through the goof-ball stage and get organized. I’m very thankful that for us at least, he has teachers who are essentially putting up with his s#!t.

          I’m inclined to agree with Bill O’Reilly when he says the main problem is the lack of discipline in public schools. The politically correct crowd has made any meaningful discipline or punishment for school children impossible. I know several teachers who have corroborated this.

          And before someone responds with “school choice” and private schools”, let me say this. Been there, done that. Both private schools our children previously attended had some pretty good teachers. But these schools cost money on top of the taxes we already pay. They also don’t want any child that’s not a little angel. The only boys they seem to tolerate are borderline gay and afraid of a mouse. But if they act like boys (as most do) they don’t fit into their grand scheme. Not to mention if your child’s parent is somehow “connected” with the school, those kids seem to get all of the attention at the expense of the rest. And what’s that you say? Home Schooling? There’s not enough Thorazine on the planet for the Ms.or I to attempt that!

          I like the idea of changing the system to remove schools from so much government control. But the way things stand now public schools are the only option most folks have. This goes for parents, students and teachers. This bs going in in Wisconsin is one more brush stroke in painting a bad picture of public school teachers. But remember they are people trying to make a living like the rest of us, and most are trying to do the best job they can under the circumstances.

          • WayneT

            Cliffystones, most of these problems in the schools begins at home with dyfunctional parents that are not raising their children right. It used to be if you got in trouble in school you were also in trouble with your parents. Now parents are raising hell with the teachers when their little Johnny, or Suzie, gets a bad grade, or when the teacher trys to manage their behaviour. Well mannered children that has good parents at home want a good education, but it is hard to get a good education when you have so many bad students disrupting the class. I also feel that most teachers are good teachers who have their hands tied behind that back by the administration, and the public.

            We have to get the president and Congress in check before we can do anything for the economy. People are going to have to take part in their government if we ever want to straighten this out. For too many years now we have elected our politician and have neglected to whatch what they are doing to our money. Foreign aid should immediately be cut and the money applied toward the debt. I will certainly be viewing my representative very carefully in 2012 to see which ones to fire. My vote will be against all the Zombies who supported Nobama.

          • Bruce D.

            Cliffy if you were a little bit better parent it would not be difficult for your son to get into a private school or to home school. You should take some responsibility for that. Your son’s lack of discipline is one of the reasons public school education is failing.

          • Jovianus

            So … the fact your kid is out of control is the fault of the teachers and public schools. OK…uh huh ….. sure it is….

            There’s an experimental program underway in a couple of school districts where the parents are graded as well as the kids. Home work done, etc. I believe it’s a good program. I know if my kid came home and I was standing there with a sub par report card on myself because of lack of their having their school act together … there’d be a ‘family talk’ after dinner.

            What would your grade be?

          • Michael J.

            Cliffystones,
            Your mention of political correctness and a lack of discipline falls short. Political correctness was designed to produce incidents like Columbine and the nearly weekly campus shootings by Jared Loughner types.
            It’s simply naive to expect anything but disaster to be gained from public education.

            Brainwashing the children is but one aspect of “Political Correctness”, for the whole enchilada, search:
            http://www.schillerinstitute.org/fid_91-96/921_frankfurt.html

        • Granny Mae

          This whole thing isn’t about the teachers it is about bankruptsy ! I don’t expect a educated teacher to get it ! My sister is a teacher and she is a good one but most are book smart only and can’t find their way out of a paper bag. If you can’t see that the problem here is a lack of money to pay teachers and the union makes it worse with their constant high wages and benefits then you are blind. Don’t tell me about working 10 and 12 hrs. a day because you don’t have a clue ! You sit behind a desk all day and think you are working, I would have loved to have you work beside me for a week and show you what it is like to really work 10 and 12 hrs a day and then you get a 2 week vacation once a year. I also had to take classes for what I did and also if I wanted to move up the ladder. From where I sit you got nothing to complain about baby cakes ! You don’t have a clue what it is like to really work for your living !

          • Jovianus

            Just to set staright the facts…Wisconsin was on path for a budget surplus until the governor gave two huge tax breaks to businesses and had a “conservative backed’ health plan pushed through that slashed the revenues.

            The workers did not create this deficit…the governor did. And now wants the working man to oay for his giveaways…as well as bust the unions, and place the working man back into slavery

        • Scott

          I applaud you for all the hard work you do, but you know as well as I do that many, if not most of your collegues would rather sit back and coast under the protection of tenure rather then make the effort to teach their students as you do. I don’t think that teachers should have the protection of tenure, nor do I think that they sould be state employees. They shoudl be employeed at the local level, city or county. They should be required to have a performance review every three years, and those that don’t perform should be terminated to make room for new teachers that are willing and able to perform up to community standards.
          That being said, I would also say this. GOOD TEACHERS should be among the highest paid of our public employees. Because it is they who will determine the fate of our most precious commidity, our children. A good education is absolutly necessary for them to succeed in life. But I don’t believe in these platinum plated pension plans that most teachers currently have. Their pension plans should be on par with private sector pension plans of people earning a similar income.

          I also believe that any union, be it teachers or plumbers or whatever, should be local, period. These national orginizations simply do not have any idea what is happening at the local level, nor do they care. To them, it’s all about the dues. However, if unions were maintained at a local level, they could address specific issues that affect them directly. These National organizations, and even worse, the Umbrella organizations that cover multiple unions, have become like mini-nations within the United States. They threaten economic warfare in an effort to extort the most money possible from the United States and it’s citizens. They have force most of the major businesses to move their operations overseas to remain competitive with the world market. Now, since they’ve lost the private sector, they are going after the public sector to make up their financial losses. They are driving our nation into bankrupcy, and need to be stopped.

          • WayneT

            Jovianis, don’t complain about businesses getting tax breaks. Remember, businesses are what gives you jobs. Lower tax rates for business will entice more business to your area. We need to give the business all the tax breaks we can. Remember, when these businesses are taxed you, the consumer ends up paying it because they just add it int their prices. If it were me, I would eliminate all taxs on businesses for that very reason.

          • Jovianus

            Wayne T : Actually, if you read Samuelson’s Economics, (a conservativce economist BTW)…the full tax hit does not get passed onto the consumer. Part of it may, but overall statisics show that most of any tax ncrease is absorbed and not passed on. What does hapen is that the business can absorb the increase in taxation by rasing volume and maintaining their profits, or take a lower profit margin.

            The capitalist system doesn’t allow very tax increase to be passed on unless their is a oligarhcical industry with each member industry working in tandem with the rest to price fix.

            Stating blandly that any tax increase is passed onto the consumer is showing economic ignorance. Sorry…but I can’t come up with a better way to describe not knowing the basics of the capitalist theory and taxation

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            jO, you obviously never owned a business, it shows!_If the Price goes up everyone takes a hit bud!

          • Bruce D.

            and he is obviously not looking for a job.

          • Jovianus

            Here…try this simple example (taken straight from Samuelson’s book):

            Company A and Company B sell widgets at $10. There is a tax increase of 10%. Company A passes the entire cost to the consumer and raises prices. Company B passes on half the tax inccrease and undercuts the price offered by Company A. Sales increase by Company B because it has a lower price. Though profit per widgt is smaller, the increase in sales increases increases the overall profit. Company A sees a decrease in sales and loses profits.

            Are you beginning to understand our capitalist economy yet?

          • Michael J.

            Jovianus,
            As was said by other posters,”you obviously have never owned or run a small business”. Myself however, having been director, purchasing manager, estimater and laborer of a small business for thirty years can assure you that the scenario you describe would never take place because I know exactly how much my competition charges for goods and services.

            I can also assure you that increases in the cost of doing business are always passed on to consumers by myself and my competitors as a result of the narrow margin in which we exist.

            Economic theory is no substitute for boots on the ground.

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            Well Put Michael J!

        • Buddy

          Certainly; there are many people in the teaching profession who sincerely try to do a job of educating what walks into their classrooms.

          The problem appears to be institutionalizing the teaching of children. Now, rather than simply teaching children, we have a bureaucracy whose “customers” are forced by law to participate, which is paid for by people on the basis of unrelated property ownership, and which is administered by those who are paid to run the system. Is it any wonder that such a system can (and does) break down.

        • barbm

          actually, teachers only work about 7 months after getting summer off, spring break off, Christmas off, and all the holidays off. i don’t know how they do it in other states but, in texas, teachers attend workshops throughout the year while students are out of school to keep up with credentials. many teachers these days use scantrons that can be graded quickly which cuts down on their after school work time. if only administrators had been out of school protesting, the schools would not have been forced to close. even the unions knew what the teachers were doing was counter-productive and pushed them to go back to work.

        • Jana

          aspacia,

          There are many people who get out and work hard physical jobs for 12 hours a day for a lot less pay than these teachers are getting.
          I have been involved in the public school system and I know that teachers do indeed work in their “off” hours too, but not every single day. Another thing is the teachers have to put up with unruly, impertinent, rude, and some out and out mean kids. This is what the unions ought to be haggling for is discipline in the schools. These teachers have no disciplinary privileges whatsoever. They ought to be fighting for rights against the frivolous and ridiculous law suits that we have seen over and over because a parent feels their child is being singled out because of his/her bad behavior.
          Now, they are ripping off the tax payers when we have to pay for their retirement when we can’t even afford to pay for our own. For every 50 Cents they put in the state pays them $57.00. Wow!!
          We all have to pay a nice chunk of change for our insurance, and the teachers have been spoiled for too long now. Let them be treated fairly, but equally. Wisconsin only has a 46% high school graduation stat., so maybe they aren’t working that hard after all.

        • Dale on the left coast

          At my son’s school the kids are nearly getting run over by the teachers leaving the parking lots . . . then there’s the PC nonsense they teach . . . in leiu of reading, writing and math.

      • marvin

        Mick
        100% right treacher and the great one forgot one thing who they work for,and it an,t the UNIONS,i have a saying you work for me you do what i say or hit the road,el presidenta and the teacher has forgot reguarding who they works for it is we the people, not yes i said we the people not 12% of the people UNIONS or just blacks and hispanic,but 100% of the people

        • WayneT

          Nobama needs to stay the heck out of the states sovereignty. He is screwing up the Fderal Government, and now he wants to screw up the states as well. Nobama wants to micromanage the states and cities. Look what he did to that police officer who arrested his friend and the many other things he stck his nose in where it did not belong. NOBAMA, STAY THE HELL OUT OF THE RIGHTS OF STATES, AND CITIES.

          State sovereignty states:

          State sovereignty is a legal principle that US states have the right to prevent the application of programs and regulations of the Federal government. The basis is the Ninth and Tenth Amendments to the US Constitution, which reserve to the states respectively, or to the people, all powers and rights not delegated to the Federal government by the Constitution and thereby prohibited to the states (e.g. the interstate commerce clause).
          How this principle is applied depends on whether the US can be shown to be applying laws and rules that would contravene these rights, i.e. exceeding the mandate of the Constitution. Because the control of “interstate commerce” is granted to the Congress by Article 1, Section 8 of the Constitution, courts have ruled that state or local governments may be prevented from enacting laws affecting commerce. This principle is the “dormant commerce clause” and has been used to prevent states from discriminatory commercial practices.

          In the legal battle over enacting a national health care plan, the application of the dormant commerce clause is a major counter-argument against legislation by several states under the principle of state sovereignty.

          Read more: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_state_sovereignty#ixzz1Ec6zpD2Q

          • Jovianus

            Wayne..go back and try to understand “state sovereignty” as it relates to our system of government and the US Constitution

        • Kinetic1

          marvin,
          It is clear, once again that either your teachers let you down, or you let yourself down.

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      sc, you took the words right outta my mouth!__ Reagan did toss the air traffic controllers out on they’re azzes, when they revolted.

      The big strong Unions are nothing but a bunch of whining cry babies!__and now they’re getting a doctors excuse slips, for being out of school??!__ Again, I think they ought to be “Pink Slipped”_”Oh yeah”, Teach_ It’s all about the students. Eh?, you mean its all about the students, as long as we get our own way first!!_ Wah, Wah, Wah!!!__As expected Obama with his organizational skills, bussed a bunch of his cronies up to Wisc. to help with the cause!!_
      Hang tight Guv-Walker!_ He ran and won on exactly what he’s doing trying to lower costs. We ALL have to swallow hard in this economy, what the hell makes Unions any different?__
      BTW, a music group named “The Eagles” recorded a perfect song for the Union Protesters ___ It’s entitled “Get over it!”

      • Jana

        Angel,
        Good post and right on!

      • Kinetic1

        Angel,
        You, like some many people on this post seem to be all tied up in teacher’s pay, when it’s not the real issue here. The teachers, as well as other state workers have agreed that they will have to take cuts for the benefit of the state, but they are opposed to handing over their right to bargain. If the governor can get the cuts he wants without this huge fight, then what’s the problem? Only one, and that’s that he wants to weaken the unions. As a paid operative of the Koch brothers, it’s his duty.

        • http://! Angel Wannabe

          Kinectic_-Don’t hand me ANY crap about the NEA. My half sister was a teacher 38 years_-I heard it all from her, and been on the taxpayer side of the protests, when she was on the NEA side.__I don’t wanna hear it!

          • Jana

            Kinetic,
            It is not about their pay. I wish everyone could earn a GREAT and humongous living, but the fact is they are BROKE. This fact seems to keep either eluding you, or you don’t want to see it.

        • barbm

          unions have far out-lived their usefulness. once upon a time, children were permitted to work, and both children and adults were forced to work inhumane hours and in inhumane conditions. they’ve turned into big bullies who sway elections and legislation. no organization should be that powerful. the people need to be free to vote however they please. their leaders make huge salaries and don’t lose a thing if the workers strike. when they no longer pay unions, they’ll get more take-home pay.

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            barbm__Ats what I say, Like everything else, the Unions and what began as a good idea has done its job, and its GONE, it’s nothing more than a corrupt money making power scheme.
            My sister used to tell me that as a union teacher, she “had” to vote as the Union voted.

          • Jana

            Angel,
            You are right. It is corrupt and a money making scheme. If it weren’t such a money maker, then they wouldn’t be such huge donaters to the Dem. Party. Give it back to the tax payer!

        • Kinetic1

          Jana, If it’s all about the states finances and their demand that the teachers accept cuts, then why is the battle still going on after they agreed to the cuts? The governor wants to break the union, period! He said as much himself. Even when offered the concessions he demanded, he will not accept anything less than the whole package, including the power to end collective bargaining. You can go on and on with how broke they are, but Gov. Walker’s refusal to accept the pay concessions made by the unions shows through all the smoke and mirrors.

          • Jana

            Kinetic,
            If he wants to break the Union, more power to him. But in collective bargaining, you cannot get rid of the bad teachers and the slouchers. There are too many problems right now to allow this to continue on.
            In two years they can renegotiate. They never should have allowed collective bargaining in the first place. It is a failed policy and Govt workers should not have that axe to hold over the public’s head.

          • Michael J.

            Kinetic1,
            Governor Walker is not advocating a total end to collective bargaining, and you know it! The Governor does advocate future wage negotiations to be based on the rate of inflation. After all, if inflation based increases are good enough for Social Security recipients, why shouldn’t it be good enough for unions?

            All this talk of “Union Busting” is just collective left wing spin submitted by AWOL senators, The White House and their darling media.

            The unions have brought this upon themselves, outrageous claims for benefits in the midst of an economic downturn has built them a crumbling house of cards.

    • Jovianus

      Let’s start with some facts. The article states “favored special interests, the Federal Government went from a deficit of $167 billion in 2007 to $1.8 trillion 2009 — an increase of 11,000 percent.”. What it doesn’t reveal is that 2008 budget doubled the deficit of 2007, and was projected to close in on $500 billion had 2009 been without the fiscal economic malaise brought to us by COnservative economics and the Bush crime syndicate. What it also fails to state is the 2009 budget deficit is that of Bush, not Obama. And third, the deficit figures cited are without including the two wars Bush brought us into…wars which were budgetred outside the “official” budget and funded by “emergency supplementals”. Add in the cost of raq and Afghanistan to the 2007 figures, and the 2008 figures..and the Conservative economic policies of 2001-2009 brought us from an almost even budget expenditure to closing in on $1 trillion.

      Next…do not gloss over the additional tax breaks given to the wealthy at GOP insistence where the wealthy enjoy their own tax bracket …which added $600 billion to our annual deficit over the next two years.

      Next…let’s look at why Wisconsin has a budget deficit projected. There was no sharp rise in collective bargaining, no major reforms of the labor laws, no dramatic change in how unions organize. And yet, the state budget faces a deficit out of a surplus. Revenues plummeted.

      Wht did the new “fiscally conservative” governor of Wisconsin do in his first five week of holding office? Did what seems to be apr for the course with the GOP. He called a “special session” and ramrodded through and signed two business tax breaks and a conservative health-care policy experiment that lowers overall tax revenues (among other things).

      Now he wants the woking man to pay for the tab and to bust the unions.

      Finally..a word on the protestors. Those which are against the governors attack against the working man of America are Wisconsinites. Those protestors supporting the war against America are for the most from OUTSIDE the state. Shipped in goons masquarading as patriots.

      Yes..this is Cairo American style. And the GOP is taking the role of Mubarak.

      Makes one want to puke to think this could happen in the country. That this is the road we have been brought down by Conservative ideologies and the lackeys to the powers controlling that ideology.

      • Ted Crawford

        Not familiar with the Constitution I see Jovianus. According to Artical 1, Section 7, Clause 1 of the Constitution the 2007, 2008, 2009,and if she would have done the job she was elecxted to do and produced one the 2010 budgets all belong to Nancy Pelosi, not Bush nor Obama!

        • Jovianus

          I’m not a Pelosi fan…nor a Reid fan. But anyoe stating the GOP and Bush weren’t the key players in the budgets isn’t playing with a full deck.

          • Jean

            Look to the foundation or is that fundation – Clinton / Carter / Johnson / Kennedy. Senior teachers and junkie junior teachers ones on Tenture hoping to retire and ones trying to get on tenture so they can kick back and smerk at their students. I have seen teachers who were not fit to teach get positions because of these unions. And heaven help the teacher in the grade ahead that cares about their students. They were hired to teach sixth grade, but because of the system – they have to teach half their students 5th – just to get them ready for 6th. They do the lackies job plus their own. And parents can not get rid of them (Union – Tenure) Bull Hockey. Fire them all – get the system wired to online classes.

          • http://deleted Claire

            I will not place the blame on any certain party–both parties have contributed towards this chaotic mess for decades and guess what? It isn’t going to get any better. Hang onto your wallets–the current members of our government will not cut back on their favorite pet projects-especially if people involved with their projects contributed towards their campaigns. I am curious to see what any of them will really do when they get down to the nitty gritty of cutting the budget deficit.

          • Jana

            Claire,
            The other day my Senator (Carter) from Texas had one of his often phone meetings. I like that. We can listen in and if we have a question we can hit the code #s and ask our question. At the very end we also have an opportunity to leave a question, and my question was, “With our economic hard times, why doesn’t congress stop the automatic cost of living pay raises that you are given each year?”
            Of course I haven’t heard back from him about that, but I got it out there, and I will continue to put it out there. After all, if we have to cut back so should our employees!

          • FireFly

            The president proposes but it is congress who signs the check. In 2006 the 111th Congress took over and it was Democratically controlled. Now the Republicans are no angels but the 111th was a Congress of mostly Democrats and they passed all the spending up until 2010. Now it’s mixed congress and the media is making out like their $60 Billion in cuts is a lot when Obama is promoting over a TRILLION in new spending. $60 Billion is like a 3% cut of an 97% increase! It’s a joke. All of this is going to cause horrendous inflation but no one wants to face up to it. Suffer you will! Blameless you are not! Sad this is!

          • http://deleted Claire

            Jana: I agree with you 100% regarding DC–in reality, they should all take a pay cut, no more raises, no more freebies, no more perks. They should have to pay for their own transportation just like we do. No more free airplane rides, their “staff” should be cut-who in the heck needs 26-27 staff members to “attend” to their needs? They should have the same hospitalization as the public. Look at all the paid holidays/vacation weeks they receive. It must be nice to come and go as they please, no one to answer to when they take off.
            The Illinois governor gave raises to “his” people within the past year and Illinois is broke. He also raised our taxes to take care of the deficit that he along with other politicians created. Fishy Rahm would never have quit his job in DC if he thought he “wouldn’t” be elected mayor of Chicago. I am on a rant. Sorry.

          • http://deleted Claire

            Jana–You are lucky, at least you have contact–they don’t bother to answer letters, nothing here.

          • Vicki

            Jovianus says:
            “I’m not a Pelosi fan…nor a Reid fan. But anyoe stating the GOP and Bush weren’t the key players in the budgets isn’t playing with a full deck.”

            Ad hominem attack. Debate win to Conservatives. Then again we did not need Jovianus to play the personal attack card to win. The Constitution is quite clear.

            The House writes the budget. The house votes the budget. The house signs the budget. The house can override the president if he vetos. The house was Democrat controlled starting in 2007. Funny that 11,000% increase was between 2007 and 2009. All democrat control. Bush and the GOP had only the power the Democrats allowed. Then in 2009 the house went from a slight majority to a super majority.

            “Democrats controlled both houses of Congress before Barack Obama became president. The deficit he inherited was created by the Congressional Democrats, including Senator Barack Obama, who did absolutely nothing to oppose the runaway spending. He was one of the biggest of the big spenders.”
            http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2010/09/07/political_fables_107026.html

            facts don’t lie. The GOP couldn’t even hide in other countries to block the budget. The Democrats created it. The Democrats own it.

      • chow

        I’m sorry but Obama ran for change. Where’s the change? It has got us more deeper that it’s now impossible to get out. Yes Bush created a deficit of $1.3T in 2008 but $700B of that is TARP in the last 2 mos. of Bush and only used $350B out of it, where’s the rest?

        Talking about budget for 2009 being blamed on Bush cause he created it, but who approved it? Again it’s Obama. The TARP was suppose to be one time infusion but now has become permanent and now called QE.

        • WayneT

          Chow, your right, Nobama ran for change we can believe in. That sure is a crock of crap. I don’t want any of his changes that he’s made so far. I just want to see him booted out of office in 2012.

        • WayneT

          You are right, chow. It’s been the Nobama administraion, and his Zombies that has done the most damage to this country.

          • barbm

            it’s not all obama’s fault. he did inheret a mess. the mess was caused by all including we the people who’ve been asleep at the wheel since women’s rights and the viet nam war. we had 2 choices. the first and the one obama chose is to throw more money at it. it’s not really working because as ronald reagan said, “I have wondered at times what the Ten Commandments would have looked like if Moses had run them through the U.S. congress.” it’s taken so long and nobody really knows where the money went, nothing has really been helped by it. the other is to rip the bandaide off fast and painfully. cut everything and make taxes flat rate with no deductions on individuals. legalize pot and tax it. save that money spent on narc officers to catch the rapists, pedophiles, and murderers. rep or dem, we’ll sink or swim together, so we better find a way to work together.

      • Bear

        Nice job Jovianus……….at pointing the finger. Obama does that well too. So, why didn’t you include the part about who creates the budget. Would that be the congress? And didn’t we have a Liberal congress during the last two years of Bush’s administration? Some of us are not mindless and some of us don’t forget…….but some of us convieniently fail to give all the facts. You’d better wake up and stop playing east against west and realize that both parties are for the elite and not us. Our two party system has been, in reality, a one party system because both have been salted with wealthy progressive/socialists oriented individuals to continue the ruin of the Republic. Their agenda to herd us into a New World Order was Hitler’s dream and tht dream is alive and well. THAT’S what we’ve got to see and stop!

        • Jovianus

          Bear…i agree. But to go TPer or Libertarian and hasten the drive to 3rd World status isn’t my idea of a good thing.

          • Bear

            The Tpartiers are not for 3rd world order. They are for restoring the Republic that our founding fathers created. This form of government is the most prosperous and the hardest to keep. It will always be under attack from those who want to control and dictate and that’s what’s going on today…..not just here but all over the world.

          • Jovianus

            Good idea..let’s restore and apply 18th century economics and theory to 21st century problems.

          • Dale on the left coast

            Jovianus . . . you sound like one of the very few on the planet . . . . that have Spent Themselves To Prosperity!!!
            What part of spending other peoples money is confusing to you? How do we pay back the 5 Trillion plus the Dimmicraps with Nancy and Bamster have borrowed since 07? And the pres has a solution . . . keep spending 1 TRILLION a year for the foreseable future? JUST Friggin NUTS!!!

          • Vicki

            Jovianus says:
            “Good idea..let’s restore and apply 18th century economics and theory to 21st century problems.”

            That’s the beauty of supply/demand. Like gravity it was here before there were governments. It will be here long after the current government is dust in the wind. It is the law. No government has EVER stopped it nor modified it.

        • Judy

          Very well said, Bear.

          • WayneT

            I agree too, Bear.

          • Bear

            Thanks Judy. And I’ll add this to the mix. In every other country where the people are rising up against the tyranny they despise, we see people being attacked, shot by police and government troops. We saw a woman of the press beaten and raped by Muslims in Egypt while trying to do her job of reporting. But, here in Ameica, we see Tea Party reallies in Washington and all over Amrica without one single person being shot by police or government troops. We don’t see our reporters being beaten and raped. WHY do you think that is? Do you think that it’s because we’re a civilized nation? NO! IT’S because we have a 2nd amendment and because of that, we have guns. The government and the police know what would happen if they started shooting at us. Those other countries though? They are the ones who will have to die in the streets at the hands of their dicataors. If we continue to allow this lunacy to continue here in America, we will be reduced to a third world country and we will be dying at the hands of our dictator. That’s a reality, I for one, will not allow to happen.

          • Vicki

            Bear says:
            “Do you think that it’s because we’re a civilized nation?”

            Actually YES. We (conservatives) are inherently more civilized. Liberals apparently are not. And we (conservatives) clean up after ourselves.
            http://politics247.wordpress.com/2010/10/04/big-differences-between-socialist-rallies-and-conservative-protests/

          • Jana

            Vicki,
            These last few posts were excellent and right on.

      • Bruce D.

        The 2007 and 2008 budget was from a Democratic Congress. The TARP money loaned to banks from 2008 was repaid which would lower the debt from 2008 but intern was spent later by another Democratic Congress. We also no longer have U.S. troops in combat so the cost should be coming down there. Iraq has a lot of oil and Obama should not be spending American money over there just so they can put there money in the bank. Also it was Obama choice to expand the war into northern Pakistan and for the serge in Afghanistan. You can say anything you want about Bush but you should not ignore the destructive spending spree by Democrats in the last four years. If Obama chooses to make similar chooses to Bush than shame on Obama, Bush is not president now and hasn’t been for a long time.

      • DOUG

        You speak of the tax break for the wealthy as if they dont pay the majority of thE TAX What you should be writing about the 51% of the American that dont pay any tax

        • Jovianus

          I’m saying the special tax bracket the GOP insisted on giving the wealthy will cause $600 billion to be drained from us in two years. They not only received our tx break..they got a special bracket on top of that.

          • momo

            Well if your boy Obama had a pair he would have stood up for his principles and not agreed to the GOP proposal on taxes. Oh, wait there was an election where the Dems got a “shellacking”.

          • Judy

            A man convinced against his will is of the same opinion still.

          • Bruce D.

            When you do not tax 51% of the population it leads to an irresponsible populous which creates greed and lust for other peoples money. Everyone should contribute something. The rich already pay most of the tax. You are just promoting progressive/Marxist ideology which is destructive to productivity. Productivity is not a word progressive/Marxists use a lot.

          • Mary Kay Andrews

            I love it when people say that a tax break is going to cost x number of dollars. A tax break doesn’t cost anything! It just keeps those goons in Washington from spending more of our money. It is our money not the government’s.

          • dave

            THAT IS TOTAL BOLONEY !! GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT!!

          • http://deleted Claire

            Jovianus—Obama had to go along with the tax breaks for the wealthy in order to get his tax breaks for the middle class. Now everyone jump on the bandwagon and call me a liberal but this is what happened.

          • Patty

            They did not “give” them anything. They are just not going to CONFISCATE as much from them. And that is because they are hoping they will invest it, create jobs, get this economy moving forward instead of backwards because as we all know, QE didn’t work. Our government has NO money except what it confiscates from people in the private sector. Jovianus, get it straight. IT IS NOT THEIR MONEY.

          • WayneT

            Your wrong, about this, Jovianus as well as when you said that businesses don’t pass on added taxes. Common sense tell me if the government makes me pay more for taxes, I’ll raise my price to offset it. There is not any law I know of that would permit me from doing it? This is human nature. You can also blame Congress for the $14,000,000,000,000 debt that we owe as they have to approve all this money. I blame Both political parties, but I think the Democrats are worse that the Republicans.

          • Bruce D.

            The only thing special Jo about the tax bracket for the rich is that it is the highest in the nation and they pay the most of the taxes. The real special tax bracket is for those 51% who pay nothing in taxes. A small percentage of the population cannot pay for run away spending by government even if you take 100% of what they earn.

          • barbm

            we need a flat-rate tax with no deductions for individuals. and we need to limit some of the business deductions. does anybody in the world not already know about coke? if you like pepsi instead, will anything coke says in an ad change your mind? they should only be allowed to spend ad money on new products and for a limited time and to advertise sales. they’d rather spend money on ads than give it to the govt to help our country. i’m talking about huge corps and monopolies, not small or local ones.

      • Patty

        Clueless? You must be.
        Don’t look at who was president, look at who was running congress. It was the dems all the way over that period of time and a few wayward republicans. Which, the tea partiers are systematically taking out the rhino’s and taking back this country. What is the dem side doing? Producing more ubber leftists.

        • WayneT

          Well stated, Mary Kay. I agree.

      • Bruce D.

        Jovianus the people of Wisconsin voted to reduce government debt as did many others in the 2008 elections. To reduce government debt they muct reduce the size and scope of government. These teacher are nothing more than Union Fascist going against the will of the people.

        • Jovianus

          Bruce..you live in Wisconsin? Know anyone there?

          The good governor lied to the people. Get that…he LIED as to what he would do and how he would do it. First three acts …business tax breaks and revenue reduction in health care. His fourth act? To attack the working man.

          • dave

            MR JOVI ANUS !! YOU ARE TRULY CLUE:LESS!!!! IT HAS BEEN LIBERALS THAT HAVE BEEN ATTACKING THE WORKING MAN FOR MORE THAN 40 YEARS BY ENACTING TAX & SPEND POLICIES THAT CONTINUE TO DRAIN MONEY OUT OF THE WORKING MANS POCKET. LIBERALS ARE THIEVES!!! , STEALING MONEY FROM HARD WORKING PEOPLE AND REDISTRIBUTING IT TO WELFARE CAUSES THAT ARE CONTRIBUTING TO THE DESTRUCTION OF THIS NATION LIKE PLANNED PARENTHOOD AND MANY OTHERS!!

          • Ruby

            Jovianus,

            After reading a few of your blogs, I’m wondering what your definition of “working man” is. Is it anyone that works? Or do you feel that the working man is defined by union membership? Is that what makes one a “working man”?

            I, like many others here, have a low opinion of “most” teachers. I have a niece that’s a teacher (one of the good ones…of course, she’s family…LOL). I also have a sister that works for a local school district (K-9). They both recognize that there are bad teachers, but due to union protection and tenure, they can’t be touched. What’s right/correct about that, pray tell?

            I also worked for my local county many years ago. I never saw such lazy people in my entire career. And they used to brag/boast about it and encourage others to be the same. “Don’t work so hard…spread your work out…don’t let the manager see you doing nothing…relax.” I left that job and mentality and went where hard work is rewarded, not frowned upon.

            Most of all…if you respond…I want to know what your definition of “working man” is.

          • independant thinker

            I saw a photo somewhere (perhaps on Jay Leno’s Headlines bit) that showed 9 street department employees standing around watching one man dig a hole. I cannot count the number of times I have witnessed similar instances when traveling down the highway.

          • Patty

            I don’t live there but my friend from Madison was here for the weekend and she totally backs what he is doing. She left to get back before the big storm so she can show up and protest on the other side. It is harder for people who have real jobs and cannot “just not show up” to run out and protest and demonstrate unlike the teachers whom care so much for the students. As usual, they left the parents of those students holding the bag on having to find day care, take personal days, etc. because the teachers had to go out protest for self interest. BTW, those teachers average 25% more in salary and benefits than the regular WI joe. They also retire 15 to 20 years before the regular joe. All while their students test scores are falling.

          • WayneT

            I think what the governor is doing is attacking the debt the state is in. When your in debt you need to take extreme measures.

          • Jana

            Jovianus,
            NO! The Governor did not lie! He ran on this policy and he is acting on this policy. He no more lied than Obama. Obama said fuel would NECESSARILY have to go up, and electricity would have to go up. All the people heard was hope and change. The only problem was the hope is for the “gimmies”, and the change is for the taxpayers, which is to redistribute their hard earned money.
            YOU ARE WRONG!

          • taxpayer

            “independant thinker says:
            February 21, 2011 at 11:44 am
            I saw a photo somewhere (perhaps on Jay Leno’s Headlines bit) that showed 9 street department employees standing around watching one man dig a hole. I cannot count the number of times I have witnessed similar instances when traveling down the highway.”

            The part that we forget here is the regulations and oversite. There are two workers. One person digs the other takes a break as you cannot work longer than so many minutes. Then you have the supervisor telling the workers to switch. Then you have another supervisor making sure the job is getting done right. Then you have the overseer making sure no laws are broken or shortcuts taken then you have…

            Why does it cost so much more for government employees to do a job then local businesses? Why is there so many administrators in schools? Maybe because people can’t be trusted or there are so many rules and regulations…

            You may beleive that it is a saftey thing, to keep people from getting hurt or killed. Maybe so as we are so dumbed down that if we make a mistake we expect it to be blamed on someone else and sue.

            We have learned not to take responsablity for our actions. Then we can get the real big bucks and be one of the rich! The easy way.

            How often do you think about sueing a business to cash in?

          • eddie47d

            Jana; Even as President, Obama has little control over the price of oil/electricity because of the Petroleum Export Organizations. You need to go on the attack against them and the Wisc. Gov.for he is indeed a dishonest person.

          • Vicki

            eddie47d says:
            “Jana; Even as President, Obama has little control over the price of oil/electricity because of the Petroleum Export Organizations.”

            Good. Tell obama to stop bowing to them and “drill baby drill”.

            Eddie47d: “You need to go on the attack against them and the Wisc. Gov.for he is indeed a dishonest person.”

            You have some evidence? Or is this another infamous Eddie47d factoid?

          • Jana

            eddie,
            You said below, “eddie47d says:
            February 21, 2011 at 6:49 pm

            Malkin doesn’t tell the truth anymore than Gov Walker does!*********

            Hmm, that statement makes me really doubt your credibility.

          • eddie47d

            Gov Walker had a 125 million surplus and then lost it with tax cuts. Businesses get those cuts and the economy is still screwed. So who has credibility?

          • Jana

            eddie,
            Definitely not you, as Walker is a new Governor.

      • marvin

        Jovianus
        your number are off a dollar or two 1n dec 1999 we were over 5 trillion dollars in the red in dec 2006 8 ,5 trillion dollars in jan 2011 14.5 trillion,liars can figure,but figure don,t lie

      • http://! Angel Wannabe
        • http://! Angel Wannabe
          • Jovianus

            Malkin? You cite Malkin as a reliable source ???? Jeesh

          • Jana

            Jovi,
            Truth hurts, and Malkin tells the TRUTH! Boy we can tell you are a lefty lib. extremest.

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            Here, Here Jana!

          • Bruce D.

            Jovi and the left do not think anyone credible who fully understand Marxist ideology and what they do to impose on the feeble minded.

          • eddie47d

            Malkin doesn’t tell the truth anymore than Gov Walker does!

          • Vicki

            Jovianus says:
            “Malkin? You cite Malkin as a reliable source ???? Jeesh”

            Argument to ridicule, ad hominem attack against a source AND proof by bald assertion. Nice job Jovianus. Classic fail. Debate win to Angel.

          • Vicki

            eddie47d says:
            “Malkin doesn’t tell the truth anymore than Gov Walker does!”

            Proof by bald assertion. No supporting documents. Debate win to Angel.

          • Jana

            Vicki,
            AMEN!!!

          • eddie47d

            Vickie; Bruce didn’t prove anything so debate win to Jovi. Right!

          • Vicki

            eddie47d says:
            “Vickie; Bruce didn’t prove anything so debate win to Jovi. Right!”

            The only debate wins I have announced in this thread were to the conservative team in general and later to angel specifically. No mention of Bruce. Another eddie47d factoid bites the dust.

        • Warrior

          I find it amazing that the demo-rat legislators run and hide and give way to the commie thugs to do their bidding. If this situation doesn’t sum up today’s party of progressive communists, I don’t know what does.

          • Jana

            Warrior

            That’s because they really aren’t for the people. They are for BIG Govt.
            They are for keeping the poor enslaved and under their thumb, and making more people poor.

      • dave

        YOU!!MR JOVI ANUS HAVENT THE FIRST CLUE WHAT YOU ARE TALKING ABOUT. FIRST OF ALL LETS GET A FEW FACTS STRAIGHT !!! DEMOCRAPS WERE IN CONTROL OF THE LEGISLATURE IN 2007 NOT REPUBLICANS!! THE DEFICIT SPENDING HAS BEEN DONE BY DEMOCRAPS FROM THEN UNTIL NOW . BUSH WAS AN ENABLER OF BIG SPENDING FOR THE BETTER PART OF 6 OUT OF HIS 8 YEAR TENURE BUT THE DEFICITS NOBUMA IS RESIDING OVER WITH HIS MINGIONS IN THE LEGISLATURE ARE ALREADY LARGER THAN THE DEFICITS RAN UP BY THE BUSH ADMIN AND EVERY PRESIDENT BEFORE HIM IN US HISTORY COMBINED!!!!
        YOU CONDEM CONSERVATIVE ECONOMICS SIR BUT IT IS OBVIOUS TO ME THAT YOU DONT HAVE A CLUE WHAT CONSERVATIVE ECONOMICS IS BECAUSE IF YOU DID YOU WOULD REALIZE THAT BUSH DIDNT PRACTICE PURE CONSERVATIVE ECONOMICS AND WASNT A FISCAL DICIPLINARIAN. INSTEAD HE GOVERNED LIKE A BIG SPENDING LIBERAL MORE TIMES THAN NOT DURING HIS TENURE.
        YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT CRIME SYNDICATES !!!! IT IS THE NOBUMA (chicago)CRIME SYNDICATE AND NOT THE BUSH CRIME SYNDICATE!!! THERE HAS BEEN NOTHING BUT MOB STYLE THUGGERY AND SLEEZE GUSHING OUT OF THIS NOBUMA ADMINISTRATION IN A MANNER NOT SEEN ON THE WORLD STAGE SINCE HITLER .
        YOUR COMMENT ABOUT THE WEALTHY ENJOYING THEIR OWN TAX BRACKET IS A LAUGHER BECAUSE THEIR OWN TAX BRACKET IS ONE THAT PUNISHES THE TOP 10% OF WAGE EARNERS TO PAY WELL OVER 50 % OF THE TAXES IN THIS COUNTRY. SEEMS TO ME THEY ARE DOING A GREAT JOB OF PAYING THEIR WAY AND THEN SOME!!
        NEXT ARE YOUR TOTALLY MISINFORMED COMMENTS ABOUT THE WISCONSON LEGISLATURE RAMMING THRU (as you put it ) BUSINESS TAX CUTS AND CONSERVATIVE HEALTH CARE POLICY AND EXPECTING THE WORKING MAN TO PICK UP THE TAB. IT IS ONCE AGAIN OBVIOUS YOU BHAVENT AN ECONOMIC CLUE. THE GOVERNOR OF WI KNOWS HIS STATE IS NOT COMPETITIVE AND IN ORDER TO GET HIS ECONOMY MOVING HE HAS TO REFORM THE STATE HEALTH CARE SYSTEM AS WELL AS ATTRACT BUSINESS TO HIS STATE TO BRING JOBS TO THE STATE ECONOMY WHICH WILL BROADEN THE STATES TAX REVENUE BASE AND LEAD TO HIGHER REVENUES FOR STATE & LOCAL GVT.THE WORKING MAN IS NOT PICKING UP THE TAB . THE UNIONS ARE NO LONGER GOING TO HAVE A FREE RIDE WHERE THE PRIVATE SECTOR IS FORCED TO PAY FOR THE UNION WORKERS CUSHY RETIREMENT., INSTEAD THEY ARE GOING TO HAVE TO START CONTRIBUTING TO THEIR OWN RETIREMENT AND I GUESS THE UNION THUGS DONT LIKE THAT THEIR FREE RIDE IS BEING TAKEN AWAY SO THEY RIOT AND COMMIT ACTS OF THUGGERY AND CALL THE GOVERNOR OF WI EVERY NAME IN THE BOOK. IT IS YOUR LACKEYS THAT ARE RIOTING IN THE STREETS!!! , NOT CONSERVATIVES . TEA PARTIERS ARENT RIOTING NOR HAVE THEY EVER RIOTED !!. IT IS YOUR BOY NOBUMA AND HIS LACKEY DNC OPERATIVES THAT IS BUSING IN RENT A MOBS TO STIR UP VIOLENCE AND THEN TRY TO PIN IT ON THE TEA PARTY WITH HELP FROM WILLING CRIMINAL ACCOMPLICES FROM THE LIBERAL MEDIA WHO IS ALL TO WILLING TO DO THE NASTY FOR THEIR BOY NOBUMA. ITS IS THE LIBERAL IDEAOLOGY THAT IS DESTROYING THIS COUNTRY LIKE A CANCER , TEARING IT APART AND EATING IT AWAY FROM WITH IN AND IT IS ENABLERS LIKE YOU WHO HELP IT ALONG AS YOU CONTINUE TO DRINK THE LIBERAL COOL AID AND THIS NATION HEADS DOWN THE LIBERAL PATH TO DESTRUCTION!!!!!! ITS TIME FOR THIS NATION TO WAKE UP FROM ITS LIBERAL STUPOR BEFORE IT IS TOO LATE!!!!!!!!!!!

        • JR

          Written in all CAPS…means 99% of all readers will just scroll right over you rant.

          • Ruby

            Wrong. I read the whole thing.

          • independant thinker

            Ruby you are in the 1%. I read the first line or two and gave up. I will not read more than a 3 or 4 line paragraph when it is written in all caps.

          • Patty

            I read the whole thing, but I must admit, it was difficult. I have not checked, it there a spell check on this? Many voicing could use it or is it just more proof of our public school system lacking?

          • Robin, Arcadia, IN

            JR… The caps only mean that the poster is feeling intense about the post. It was really a good one. I read it and glad I did!

          • AMJ

            I read the whole thing too.

          • Vicki

            I tried to read it. Got thru about the 3rd line and gave up. Got the sense that he was agreeing with conservative posts before his.

            Using all caps should be used with discretion to draw attention to a specific point. E.G.

            Our Constitution codifies a Constitutionally LIMITED government.

            Thus drawing attention to what we are saying. Had the sentence been in all caps

            OUR CONSTITUTION CODIFIES A CONSTITUTIONALLY LIMITED GOVERNMENT.

            not only would you miss the key point but as JR said a lot of people will skip right over a point that might have been good.

          • Jana

            Well, I read it too, and agree with the whole thing.

          • Jana

            Some people write in caps because they cannot see the smaller letters. I forgot how to tell them to enlarge the page.(There is a way). —Or maybe he WAS mad. But I did read it and do agree with him, and yes it is difficult to read all in caps.

          • Kinetic1

            It’s like listening to Mark Lavin. If I try and listen, the shrieking gives me a headache, and what’s said only confirms my suspicion that it’s not worth my time.

          • Vicki

            Jana writes:
            “I forgot how to tell them to enlarge the page.”

            Ctrl + (control and + key)

            Though some websites have a text size button usually at the top right of the page or column.

          • Vicki

            Kinetic1 says:
            “It’s like listening to Mark Lavin. ”

            I’ve listened to Mark Lavin. He doesn’t shreak. Are you sure you weren’t listening to Howard Stern?

          • Jana

            Thanks Vicki,
            I have written that down (Control and plus key)

          • Vicki

            Jana says:
            “Thanks Vicki,
            I have written that down (Control and plus key)”

            Welcome :)

      • Void1972

        “THE BATTLE IS NOT BETWEEN LEFT AND RIGHT”
        In the 1960′s British-born Dr. Anthony Sutton was a Fellow at Stanford’s Hoover Institute when he discovered that, in spite of the Cold War, the US was supplying the USSR with its technology, including weapons used against American soldiers in Vietnam. Sutton dug deeper and discovered that Wall Street had sponsored both the Bolshevik Revolution and the rise of Nazi Germany. The resulting books which are on line cost Dr. Sutton his academic career.
        In 1983, Dr. Sutton received a list of Skull and Bones members and immediately recognized the names of many men who controlled American policy. He published a book entitled “America’s Secret Establishment: An Introduction to the Order of Skull and Bones” (1986). He updated and republished this book just before his death last June at age 77. Here are some of his conclusions.
        • “The Order” is ” a purely American phenomenon with German origin.” Dr. Sutton compares it to the Round Table, Cecil Rhodes’ secret society at Oxford also known as “The Group.” The American and British entities consist of 20-30 dynastic families each. Jewish banking interests connect them.
        “The links between ‘The Order’ and Britain go through Lazard Freres and the private merchant banks… ‘The Group’ links to the Jewish equivalent through the Rothschilds in Britain… ‘The Order’ in the US links to the Guggenheim, Schiff and Warburg families.” (23)
        As Dr. Sutton notes, the “Order” had definite anti Semitic tendencies but by the 1960′s, many Jewish names started to appear among the 15 annual inductees. See list of Skull and Bones members.
        • Dr. Sutton believes the “left” versus “right” split is fraudulent and used to control the debate and condition citizens to think along certain lines. Left-wing magazines like the “The Nation” and “The New Republic” and right-wing magazines like “The National Review were “artificially set up.” The former were financed by Whitney money while the latter by Buckley. Both are “The Order.”
        Dr. Sutton states: “Sooner or later people will wake up. First we have to dump the trap of right and left. This is a Hegelian trap to divide and control. The battle is not between right and left; it is between us and them.”
        Similarly, in the international field left and right political structures are artificially constructed and collapsed in the drive for one-world synthesis, i.e. authoritarian socialism controlled by monopoly capital.
        College textbooks present war and revolution as accidental results of conflicting forces. This is nonsense, says Dr. Sutton. They are created and financed by Wall Street to create a new world order. But you won’t read this in history books.
        “Our Western history is every bit as distorted, censored and largely useless as that of Hitler’s Germany or the Soviet Union or Communist China…” (122)
        • Dr. Sutton believes The Order has many weaknesses resulting from an inbred gene pool, a shallow power base and a limited worldview. In any future conflict between the authoritarian state and the individual, he believes opposition will take “a million forms.”
        ” No one is going to create the anti-The Order movement. That would be foolish and unnecessary. It could be infiltrated, bought off, or diverted all too easily. Why play by the rules set by the enemy?
        The movement that will topple The Order will be extremely simple and most effective. It will be ten thousand or a million Americans who come to the conclusion that they don’t want the State to be boss, that they prefer to live under the protection of the Constitution. They will make their own independent decision to thwart The Order and it will take ten thousand or a million forms.”

        • Buddy

          Quite a lot of (possibly true) information. Will require some thought and some research. However, the above could be true – - except it just doesn’t seem that political leaders are that smart nor the taxpayers quite that stupid.

          • Void1972

            Buddy,
            ” Quite a lot of (possibly true) information. Will require some thought and some research. However, the above could be true – – except it just doesn’t seem that political leaders are that smart nor the taxpayers quite that stupid.”

            Sorry, our political leaders are puppets, and the taxpayers are that stupid!

        • Patriot

          Good Work Void1972, I agree and wrote this below, I thought it appropriate for your post:

          The time has come for all of us to ban together, we are all Americans and we need to Stop the bickering and educate ourselves to the real manipulators. This started long ago with the Federal Reserve Act 1913, the CFR (Council on Foreign Relations) in 1922, the IMF, the Bilderberg Group 1954. All administrations since this time have been filled with the New World Order people part of these groups. Until the chain is broken nothing will change, this is not about Republican or Democrats, it is about the Rockefellers who have been running our country since. Wake up and band together read “The Rockefeller File” by Gary Allen and then “The True Story of the Bilderberg Group” Estulin. Bickering is all part of their plan; we need to wake up before it is too late! We can change course we need all of us to see, we can make our founders proud, the work will be hard and long, We Can Do This, education of these truths starts with you! These books changed my life and have brought tears to my eyes and I will never look at things the same way again! Think this below is approprate for President’s Day!

          One of my favorite quotations from Thomas Jefferson: “To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves is sinful and tyrannical.”

          • Vicki

            Void1972 says:
            “THE BATTLE IS NOT BETWEEN LEFT AND RIGHT”

            True however the battle is not between crony capitalism and crony capitalism either. The battle we fight is for limited but necessary government. The scale has 100%government on the left and 0% government on the right. We are fighting for a small government that protects the rights of the people. Here is a good video describing the battle

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4r0VUybeXY

          • Void1972

            All fact Patriot, but it goes even deeper then that. Read “To Eliminate the Opiate” by Marvin Antlemann for a deeper understanding.
            Everything that is happening now in our world has been planned for decades, and this is the middle game of the new world order. The world is their chess board, and we are the pawns, problem- reaction- solution, and the end game (solution ) will not be pretty.
            We can beat them if the millions organize, take a stand and bring justice to those who have created this insanity.
            God Bless America, and those who fight for her!

      • barbm

        walker is doing exactly what he promised during his campaign. that’s why he was elected by a large majority. if you didn’t like what he promised, you should’ve worked harder for the other side. apparently most wisconsinites disagree with you.

        • Jovianus

          Barb…you from Wisconsin? Are you aware of what Walker and the state GOP said before the election (and before he ws sworn in) and what he and the state GOP has done?

          • barbm

            nope, texas here. but i do have friends who live in wisconsin and who voted for him in an effort to balance their state budget. i know what they said because it’s all over the internet. he said he was going to get rid of these unions. and, golly gee, he’s doing it. nice to have an honest person around for a change.

          • Jana

            Jovi,
            Why don’t you enlighten us. However barb, beware, as he might have listened with his leftist ears and not really heard the truth.

    • http://www.jimbernard.org Jim Bernard

      it ain’t as simple as that, people are entitled to reasonable salaries
      for work done.

      Not everyone can make money simply by speculating on shares etc (how much work is involved with that ?)

      The states are under financial pressure because of the big interest payments owed to private banks.

      But who needs the Banks ?

      Better to do what pres Lincoln did during the civil war and instruct the treasury to supply its own finance and credit and give out loans at low interest in competition with the banks.
      Soon the financial problems of the states would dissapear.

      Tell me where I am wrong

      • Ted Crawford

        Okey, YOU ARE WRONG!!

      • chow

        The only thing you’ve eliminated is interest payment but if the State continue to issue funds much more than the taxpayers can afford, the result is the same disaster.

      • Bruce D.

        Who issues the money is one part of the problem. Congressional spending is just as big a problem as they spend more than can be justified in relation to productivity. Overspending is in itself is a burdensome tax on the poor and middle class in the form of inflation.

      • marvin

        Jim Bernard
        800 billion off money we did not have for GM /AIG and so on ,fed employs got 2% raise i got none,you are not entitled to any thing work or get fired ,remimber public servents ,work for the public ,when an employe makes more then the employer and starts telling their boss how to run there business,then it is time to stop and think,this an,t right i,m the boss,as in we the people

      • Patty

        Gees Jim,
        Where to start. #1 you are entitled to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Money is something you earn, not something you are entitled to. If you want to feel empowered, start your own company. Find out what you are really worth, not what some union tells you that you are worth.
        Interest rates? Are you kidding? WHY are all levels of government living so above the means of the people as to have to borrow money?
        That credit card bill is now due. We need to spend what we take in and no more. If projected revenues are not there, you stop spending and get back to square one. You don’t just keep spending year after year above your means without consequence.

      • Vicki

        Jim Bernard says:
        “Tell me where I am wrong”

        As patty says. Where to begin :)

        Jim Bernard says: “it ain’t as simple as that, people are entitled to reasonable salaries for work done.”

        Wrong. You are entitled to NOT work for a salary that is lower then YOU consider reasonable. That’s it. (Extra brownie points for anyone who knows what part of the Constitution acknowledges the above right)

        Jim Bernard says: “Not everyone can make money simply by speculating on shares etc (how much work is involved with that ?)”

        Not relevant. I can cook. I can write programs. I can drive. I can make (and lose) money buying and selling stock. I choose which I want to do.

        Jim Bernard says: “The states are under financial pressure because of the big interest payments owed to private banks.”

        Wrong. The states (Calif and Wisconsin to name 2) are under financial pressure because democrats spent all the money and then borrowed much more and spent that. The people who loaned government that money ARE entitled to get it including the interest the government promised.

        Jim Bernard says: “But who needs the Banks ?

        Better to do what pres Lincoln did during the civil war and instruct the treasury to supply its own finance and credit and give out loans at low interest in competition with the banks.”

        Too late. It’s called the Federal Reserve.

        Jim Bernard says: “Soon the financial problems of the states would dissapear.”

        When the states disappear :) Btw it is unconstitutional for the states to coin money. Just in case you haven’t read the Constitution recently.

    • ONTIME

      Agreed, the Reagan approach to this kind of civil disobedience was clear, we the tapayers, are the employers and we want adminstrative responsibility to be doled out. Civil servants are already a pampered bunch and having a illegal government union is just another way that weak kneed politicians have corrupted a once honorable career choice. The air controllers were given a ultimatum and they decided that their principle of demand was more important than their jobs and their security, this caused them to attempt to make the boss kiss their feet, that just doesn’t happen in the real world. I hope Christie, Walker and Kasic are the men of the hour to put reality back into civil service and get the government unions decertified and banned. If they are uncredentialed Barry’s way of thinking will be morte della and the unions will have taken the beating they now deserve.

      • Patty

        Amen.

    • terry

      sc it is a sad sad thing you have spoken about the teachers in wis, with every thing known to man going completely out of site price wise, for the life of me i do not understand how you or anybody else for that matter could make such a stupid comment. wages for middle income and lower income Americans and humans around this planet are at least 30 years behind inflation and cost of living alone. take into account how the banks have all the so call laws set in favor for legalized stealing at any given minute. oh lets not forget our tax burden, list goes on and on and on. for me i tell you this much your comment and others like you who could even think as ya’ll do is just so out of line it makes one want to puke

    • Kevin Nelson

      No! Its idiots like you who handed our country over to foreign governments and sold out the next generation, for their quest of GREED. It was Ronald Reagan who started the free trade with these so-called communist countries that took our jobs away from us so these treasoness bastards could get wealthier.

    • Kevin Nelson

      Lets outsource some more jobs to China! Maybe they will start paying IMPORT taxes (tariffs). That will pay for our welfare!

    • http://googlechrome.com Raymond Babcock

      the dept has increased by 11.000 percent if you do care about this you are ignorant or you are stupid greedy

    • Dan az

      What I find amazing is that when there is no money and it seems to be left to the workers to cut there pay, instead of the gov. to stop spending.How is it that if you make less then you pay less in taxes to fund the over spenders?Is it just me?Where is the money going to come from?Sure the unions are trying to rule the situation like always and aren’t going to give up their sugar daddy like the mess obumer has gotten us into,his idea is to unemploy everyone and just print money until the country folds.Not unlike the unions that keep demanding more and more until even the jobs leave the country.The only thing that this mess is going to do is borrow the money from the morons in office so as to just increase more debt.Which is where I will leave this bit of information that I feel that even the libs need to figure out.
      Suppose you want to spend more money this month than your income. This situation is called a “budget deficit”. So you borrow (ie; use your credit card). The amount you borrowed (and now owe) is called your debt. You have to pay interest on your debt. If next month you don’t have enough money to cover your spending (another deficit), you must borrow some more, and you’ll still have to pay the interest on the loan. If you have a deficit every month, you keep borrowing and your debt grows. Soon the interest payment on your loan is bigger than any other item in your budget. Eventually, all you can do is pay the interest payment, and you don’t have any money left over for anything else. This situation is known as bankruptcy.
      So the game goes on and on I think this bottomless pit has got to end some where and I feel that it just may be the start of the NWO.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      Dont be shy and hold back, tell it like it is. Oh yeah, you did. And the real shame of it all, is that this imposter in the white house, would actually round up people, that arent even from there, and have no vested interested in what happens there one way or the other, and sends them there to perpetuate fear into people. Just what kind of a man do we have running this country that would stoop to gangland type of rhetoric? What a shame this country has become so in-attentative, to one, elect someone like him president, and for two, to let these unions have a free ride for so long on the taxpayers back, that now they feel they are above the rest of us, and we all should pay for their things. Excuse me people, you can pay premiums like I do, and pay your portion like I do. Join the real world. Ive got to give you credit, at least your working unlike the remainder of the democratic voters, but still you want that old left wing handout. Time to pay up, and join the real world. We all have paid for you unions far too long. And furthermore you selfish bastards, you would rather quite a few of your own union brothers get the ax and lose their jobs, than to all pony up a little bit and pay like the rest of us do. Greedy, greedy guts, thats all Ive got to say, and your actions prove it.

    • Al B Tross

      When you mean taxpayer, which end of the spectrum? The upper 1% or the bottom 90%?? Since the former makes 1000 times that of the latter, please make the distiction in you future propaganda, excuse me, “statements” just to keep thing in context, of whom you really support.

      It ain’t the working man!!

  • Mick

    The Unions have been undermining the true meaning of the word work for decades and created a so called work force of overpaid do nothing in the process, our services have suffered from it and our products quality has declined drastically as for the doctors handing out the excuse slips should be stripped of their licences for committing fraud for ever.

    • Bruce D.

      The worst part about the Unions is the difficulty in firing incompetent workers. This has done more to destroy work ethic than anything over paying then could do. That is the foundation of their socialistic success.

    • WayneT

      All the Unions have done is drive up prices on goods that the rest of us poor souls, that were not in a union, which we had to bare the brunt of these higher cost. I can see using the unions for getting safer working condition and geting fair treatment, but the unions have protected their members even when they were wrong, and should have been fired. It’s time to change a few things around.

      • Jovianus

        Wayne..read a bit of Upton Sinclair then get back to us…

        • WayneT

          Jovianus, I have only been around for 73 years. I have a lot of first hand knowledge about most of these things I have mentioned. I have worked in a union, and without a union. My biggest concern is that unions protect deadbeats that are too darn lazy to work. I can assure you, you are not talking to a snot nosed kid here. You are the one who needs to wise up.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      You are more correct than you know. I have first hand knowledge of how they work, having worked in them for 13 years. What a joke. Im so glad I am not a part of that anymore. It was destestable actually. What a scam.

  • Barb

    Take your kids out of public school. There are alternatives and surely you can use one of them……private school, christian school, home school. It’s not easy but it can be done. You have to decide if they are worth it or not and yes they are. We did it. You just have to cut back on other things.

    • Bruce D.

      I agree Barb. Public schools are political in nature and helping to destroy the fabric of America. They are more concerned about producing non educated socialist in masses and a small elite group of leaders that are able to twist truth and facts.

      • Ted Crawford

        How true Bruce! As Aspacia pointed out above, none of the Seniors and only 5% of freshmen were anywhere close to grade levels. They are however out in the streets with these teachers who have clearly failed to educate them protesting. As one student pointed out they are trying to get “some dude to do something”! It seems they have been successful in making them good little comrades!

        • Bruce D.

          Ted it is always like late night comedy when they ask some protesters on the left to explain what their signs mean.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        The public schools are teaching our childred to strive for mediocracy. They are teaching them that hard work gets you no where, as they now are giving the same reward for failure as they do for a kid that gets A. They teach you everyone is the same. There is no reward for excellence anymore. That is frowned upon, because it makes the failures feel bad. Kind of like the real world. Those that dont feel like working get money freely given to them by social government handouts, because they feel bad because us working folks are getting paid money and they arent. What a bunch of crap. Nothing is right or wrong anymore. Its all ok if it makes you feel good, and dont dare tell some kid is is failing and needs to work harder and apply himself. That makes them feel bad. What kind of society are we going to have in the future, where no one cares to excel, because they are taught all their childhood to just be average? What a scam our public school system has become. Thanks liberals, its all your fault.

    • marvin

      Barb
      you are right only trouble is you still have to support the public system

      • Patty

        No you don’t. Unless the status qou is just fine with you.

        • Patty

          I meant quo (dang, where is that spell check???)

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          Oh yes you do. That is what property taxes are for. And they are unfair. Whether someone makes the conscience decision not to have children, and another guy decides to have 12 kids, you still pay the property tax for the school systems. Quite unfair if you ask me.

    • WayneT

      Barb, that is a good idea when you can afford it, but it’s rough when some one does not have the money, and can not afford it. Remember, your not only paying for the private school, but you are also paying the taxes to send your kids to the public schools.

    • barbm

      if you don’t like the public school system, which is ours by the way, then you should be working to change it rather than abandoning it. when my kids were in school, i spent time there with them. i helped the teachers in the classrooms and had lunch in the cafeteria. that’s how i found out they weren’t putting any salt in the food they served which made it unpalatable. i was working and attending college at the time, so i didn’t have time to try to make them change it, but i did start making my son’s lunch so he wouldn’t come home starving. hard to concentrate on your schooling when your tummy is rumbling. i also found out one of his teachers was picking on my youngest son who was hyperactive. if i gave him his meds, he wouldn’t participate in class, and if i didn’t give it to him, she marked him off for being disruptive. she almost lost her job over it. and i was there the day he got paddled for skipping school. when he got home, i got him too. quit defending your little brats and go to the schools and find out what’s really happening. i think every parent should spend at least one day a semester in their childrens’ classrooms. you can bet johnny isn’t going to act out if mario’s mom is there watching.

      • Jana

        barbm,
        Super good post. I agree with you. Every parent needs to spend time at school. They need the help and we need the experience. I have learned a lot of things too. I even started subbing and its an eye opener.
        At one particular school no matter what teacher I was subbing for that teacher had duty. Lunchroom duty, bus duty, etc. until I found out where the duty roster was posted.

        When you work in the schools, volunteer or paid, you learn who the caring teachers are, and who is just pulling a pay check. Your children also know you know what they are up to and they act better and try harder. My daughter said she could always tell when I was coming down the hall. I asked her how and she said the way my keys rattle on my purse. I hadn’t realized they even rattled. LOL

  • Michael

    Cairo ain’t coming to America it’s already here !, heck down here in Texas they are trying to set up classes in elem. school’s to start teaching ARABIC language as part of the new globel movement and trying to share Christen and Muslim church’s under the same roof, why do i get the feeling i’ve lost my building lease and the new tenants are trying to move in before i’ve gotten all my stuff out?

    • Carlucci

      A friend of mine sent me an article about this (teaching arabic in the public schools) last week. It is the Mansfield ISD up near Dallas, I think.

      Arabic is a very hard language to learn to speak, let alone write. My husband and I took arabic classes when we lived in the middle east. It takes a lot of effort to learn it. The only thing that comes to mind is that this school district might use teaching methods like Rosetta Stone to teach arabic. I believe Rosetta Stone uses the same principal as “Your Baby Can Read” – word and picture association.

      I have to wonder why they are pushing arabic instead of spanish. Of course, both cultures are very prolific and have plans to take over from caucasians by “outbirthing” them.

      • Don

        you have to wonder why they are teaching arabic instead of spanish??? my lord, open you eyes, all i can say is,, i hope your not one of the teachers

        • Carlucci

          No, I’m not a teacher. I think I answered my own question anyway. The arabic classes were to be sponsored by a federal grant of $$$$. When in doubt, follow the money. There is always an agenda at the end of it.

          The good news is that parents in that district became very angry and created an uproar about it.

          I’m with some of the people on this blog. If parents really care about their kids and how they learn, take them out of the public schools and either home school them or send them to private schools. In addition to that, parents should insist that their kids read as much as possible. Public schools are the pits and have been for many years. Most teachers in the public schools are just going through the motions to collect a pay check.

          • Jana

            Don and Carlucci,
            I will tell you why the Mansfield ISD is going to teach Arabic. They are running a deficit and the Obama administration says if they need money they can have it as long as they teach Arabic as well as immerse themselves in Arabic culture all through the day up to and including some of their foods that they eat as well as their deserts that they would have during parties. It was very Arabic culture inclusive. When the plan was announced the parents were outraged.
            They are still going to do this, but they are going to restructure the classes with parental involvement, but it will still be Arabic language and culture. It was BIG news last week around Texas.
            I am just wondering how many other schools are going to do this.
            The Obama admin. says Arabic is the language of the future. Scary!

        • Bear

          Hey Don,
          I do wonder why……..and I wonder why not. I once had a military officer tell me, “keep your friends close to you but keep your enemies closer.” That IS wisdom. When I was in high school, the languages of Spanish, German, French and Latin were offered. I elected to take Spanish since I lived in Texas and, in my mind, I would be more likely visit a neighboring country as opposed to one on the other side of the world, and Latin was considred a dead language. A good decision THAT turned out to be as I now visit Mexico an average of two times a year. While in Mexico, I met a local in one of their small villages who could speak five languages. Here we are in what we egotistically refer to as the greatest country on the planet and most of us can speak only one language. Here I was in Mexico, talking to a Mexican who could speak five languages and he wasn’t even half my age. Most of the world sees us in this light. Learning another languages only broadens us and our interests. It doesn’t mean that we are preaparing for a culture take over or an invasion from Bahrain. Back to keeping your enemies closer. Right now, we know that the terrorists are not school teachers or 80 year old grandmothers going to Florida to see the grandkids. They ARE middle easter Muslims between the ages of 23 and 36 years and are the instrument of ALL of the Muslims in the world. We know that Islam is not just a religion, it is a phylosophy, a way of life that includes its own set of rules and laws. Muslims in every country want to impose their law to all. As I see it, learning their language can only serve to help disarm them in that effort.

          • Jana

            Bear
            This is more than just learning a language. This is akin to being politically correct. Learn their language and their culture and wear their clothing and become empathetic to the Islam religion. You cannot get into their culture without learning their religion and young children are like sponges and can easily be swayed. They of course will have Muslim teachers during the day also. In the paper they showed a Muslim woman with her ha-jib on who was going to be one of their teachers. I think this is way too much. Yes, learning the language is great. But the other is to me very objectionable.
            This is another step towards Sharia Law.

      • WayneT

        Maybe the Muslim folks in our government, and country as a whole, are saying, what the h—, we will be taking you over sooner, or later, so now is a good time to learn it. With a Muslim President, and several Muslims in Congress, I think they are on their way.

      • WayneT

        I guess they want to keep Muslim Nobama, Happy.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        Because of political correctness by the left wing liberals who have for years run our school systems, and thats why they have failed, and no one can contest that. And no one can contest that the left wing liberals run them. If they do, they are deadbeat liars, just like a left wing liberal. They are not smart enough to see, that when they empower our enemies enough, that these enemies will take us over, and these polly coddling left wing liberals will be as quick to be put to the sword as anyone else, but they are too damn arrogant and proud of them selves and their “Im saving the world”, to understand that they are the leading cog in destroying the world as we all know it here in America. Unbelieveable.

    • Jovianus

      source please. Claims like that should be sourced as they are so far removed from rality as to be laughed at unless sourced by valid reports.

      • Jovianus

        Iwas asking Michael for the source…in case this is mis read.

        • Carlucci

          Jovanus, Here is a link on the Mansfield ISD that wants to teach arabic in the schools:

          https://mail.google.com/mail/?hl=en&shva=1#search/marcar713%40aol.com/12e14bd334adea85

          • Jovianus

            Bad link

          • Bruce D.

            It has been on the news enough times Jovanious. What is your problem? It is not that hard to find on the internet.

        • Carlucci

          Sorry. Try this: http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2011/02/07/mandatory-arabic-classes-coming-to-mansfield/

          Looks like it may not happen. I forgot to mention in my last post that this ridiculous idea is a FEDERALLY funded notion. Like that’s a surprise. Must be because a mooslim is in the white house.

          Can this country get any crazier?

          • Jovianus

            Ahhh…I thought this was the program. It’s dead for lack of funding. It’s a good idea though. Much like when schools offered laguage and culture classes about Russians during the Cold War. Gave us talented people who spoke the language and understood the Soviet culture.

            BTW…the language s an option offered along with several others.

          • Jana

            Jovi,
            It is not dead for lack of funding. It is on hold for now because the parents got upset about it. It was quite intensive in its structure and the parents did not want it. They are going to reevaluate if they are going to accept the grant money.
            Learning many different languages truly is an asset, but taking middle school children and immersing them in the culture is another matter.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Jo, who the hell died and left you boss?__ Ya want a source go find it!_-You don’t like our kind of truth anyway, your only here to get paid to rile the sheep!

        • Jovianus

          Angel…unlike you, I try to stay away from the Weekly World News sites.

          Besides…you’re correct in stating one thing…I don’t want your kind of truth. Because it’s not truth. In the short time I’ve been here, I’ve read you misstate, mis quote, take out of context and outright lie. Do you really believe you have any credibility at all other than being laughed at by your peers and everyone else?

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            Jovianus__Your a comedian BO BO, WE all can sit here, call up a site in another window, manipulate numbers, specs and facts, point fingers and call people liars,to win a debate, especially sitting behind a faceless computer screen, do you know what a COWARD is???

          • Jovianus

            Angel…I’d say you epitomize the definition of the word. Tell you what…you read Hobbes (The Leviathan)and Locke (Two Treatises og Government)…then get back to us as to which political philosophy you agree with. My bet is Hobbes.

          • marvin

            Jovianus
            your insults are only out weighted by your moronick after thoughts,please tell me why i need to learn a language i have no need for i ,we do not need you or el presidenta telling me what to eat drink or wear,or speak ,i have got by for 66 years with out you or obama, telling me how to or what to ,and their is one hell off a good chance i won,t need your help

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            Hey Jo, GFY!

          • Jovianus

            Marvin…it’s an OPTIONAL language course. Jeesh. isolationist policies never led anywhere but war.

            Angel…nice comeback. Let me guess..you don’t even know who Hobbes or Locke are do you? Your response is a common refrain by uneducated fear driven people who need to be told what to think.

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            Jo, lol, Your gonna have to do better than that to intimidate me bud,(by the way ya studied alinsky well, twisting someone else words and throwing it, I get it??) ya sound like a lil’ punk who thinks they know it all__ my guess is your one of the pissed off Unionites that gettin some flack about the free ride you’ve been gettin’ off tapayers backs, and ya might have to pay the piper like the rest of us,_Well wah wah wah!_Thats tough isn’t it!!!

          • Dan az

            Angel your still my girl!

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            Dan Az, ;)

          • http://donthaveone Beberoni

            From what I see, between the banter of Jovianus and Angel, is Jovianus is consistently wrong, and when he demands links or information, and provided it, he cannot admit to his arabic loving agenda, and insists that Angel and everyone else is mis-informed, when in fact, it is people like Jovianus who are weakening this country and bringing us to our knees to our enemies, and he doesnt realize, that his little head will be chopped off just as quick as Angel’s or mine when these satanic Arabs take over. And sick people like Jovianus are enabling this with their liberal tolerance of those who have vowed to kill us, and they fully mean it. Only some, (insert left wing liberal here), are so stupid they cannot see it right in front of them.

    • barbm

      that’s obama’s fault. he set up a fund that gives schools a lot of money if they’ll start language programs. it’s called Foreign Language Assistance Program (FLAP). the languages include Arabic, Chinese, Korean, Japanese, Russian, and languages in the Indic, Iranian, and Turkic language families.

  • TalkRadio

    Coming to America. It appears that the “color revolution” around
    the world feins similar logos and artfacts not consistent with the
    local “color”. Could it be that the controllers in our country
    have more to do with this than first believed? Please check out this
    link:
    http://www.infowars.com/cia-coup-college-recycled-revolutionary-props/

    • WayneT

      Angelwannabe, Jov is not a very good sleuth is he? When you read any article you have to be able to separate the truth from friction by using common sense that you were born with. He is most likely reading that stuff written by the Liberal writers who the bombards truth with fiction.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Wayne T, Thats my guess too!

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          Im just wondering, as we keep empowering Arabs and minority states in this country, that when the white race becomes a minority, will we be “tolerated” to have a White American College Fund, and a White Miss America Pageant, and a White Preachers Alliance, and a White Entertainment Network, and a White History Month, celebrating the achievements of White People in American History? Or will we be labeled racists for wanting what others before us have had? Im just wondering.

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            Beberoni, Can ya just imagine that, sadly I can?

  • Bruce D.

    The walkout of lying overpaid government workers has shown how much power government has assumed and how much deceit it will use to keep that power. To diminish government power you have keep taxes low. The more money government has the more power they have over non government citizens. It is particularly disturbing that these people are doing every thing the media falsely accuses the Tea Party of doing without much condemnation from the left. The mainstream media itself is dirty politics at work.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      Thats because the mainstream media, is owned wholly by the left wing liberals, and they have become nothing but propaganda networks for the democrats. They dont report the truth, and have no interest in the truth, as its all about supporting the agenda of the left wing liberal democrats. Remember how whenever they did war updates, all they wanted to show was civilians that got wounded, not even knowing fully if we did or they did it to their own, but that is all the media wanted to report. I assure you, as we do strikes and go into villages, it still happens, but gee, I havent seen this on the news for, oh, maybe since Obama got elected. Isnt that amazing. No collateral damage since then. Right. And remember how they got on Bush when they brought in more troups, and just crucified him, all crying to get out, get out. But yet, Obama sends in what, 5 to 10 thousand more, and not a world against it. Huh, what happened. And they dont even try to cover up their allegiance to the democratic party and hide their indescretions and dont seek to report anything. I guarantee you, had a republican had ties with a domestic terrorist, Randy Ayers, muslim ties as Obama has all over the place, a six figure salary that Michelle drew from the Chicago hospital, for part time work, the birth certificate, missing college papers, well, we all know, the press would not cease to report and seek and destroy and discover on all these issues, but since its one of their own, they dont even investigate, they try to cover it up. Its sick, and it truly is no wonder that the ratings of ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN and MSNBC are lacking so far behind Fox News. One of these alphabet networks should get smart, and start reporting the truth, and to some actual investigative reporting on these guys in power now, and they would blow the others guys off the map in ratings. People are hungry for the truth, but its being kept from us, by these liberal news agencies, who are in bed with the democrats. Not good for the country.

  • Victoria DeLacy

    The dollar is going down and that is why you see so many companies advertising the sale of gold on Glenn Beck’s program on Fox. Beck has been warning about this coming for a long time now and so far he has been right on target with the majority of his predictions. Regarding the educational facet of changing times, it has been a fact that for decades now the only really safe places for today’s students in preventing a brainwashing in political correctness is in the other two options, either homeschooling or sacrificing to make a private Christian school education available to our young people, which is a great investment in their future.

    • eddie47d

      That depends if you want to be brainwashed in public schools or private schools or on the Glenn Beck show. Now Beck get’s paid a bundle to tell you what to think. That’s very expensive teaching and he preaches a dose of fear as an added bonus.

      • Bruce D.

        Nothing could be further from the truth. Beck encourages people to do their own thinking, their own reading, and their own research and many do. That is why Beck’s popularity is gaining and the progressive socialist mentality is weakening.

      • marvin

        eddie47d
        i would say if beck was in the class room your post may have some credibility but he an,t like all radio /tv they have a shut off or channel button ,if you don,t like it turn the demm knob,un like the un fair document an,t no one makes you leason to beck or obama or even you

        • mark

          Glen Beck and his friend Rush are RACIST! They like to sterotype black people as welfare rats and the dis-respect of Beck having his speech at the Washington Monument on the anniversary of the MLK speech was just terrible.

          • Jana

            mark,

            Sure it was. That’s why some of the King family was not only present but they were speakers at this event.

            Hmmm the one to call racist is generally the racist.

      • independant thinker

        “That depends if you want to be brainwashed in public schools……..”

        I think that pretty much says it all. If you want your kids brainwashed in public schools then do not seek alternate education sources.

      • WayneT

        I’ll take Glenn Beck any time over those lying Liberal Democrats. At least Glenn can back up what he has said over the years with videos. Democrats would never want you to see what they have said in the past the way they lie.

        • mark

          BECK IS A RACIST!!!

          • Jana

            mark,

            Yelling it doesn’t make it true. You are a typical liberal, lie often enough someone might believe it.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        Only fear eddie, if you fear the truth. Me, I live in the truth, and I know it when I hear it. Glenn Beck speaks the truth, and thats why your liberal leaders hate him. He exposes them for the phonies that they are, with factual truth about them, and brings it to the public, and they are undressed before the public as to who they really are, and they do not like it. And if you would stop blindly following them because of some sick left wing agenda they have brainwashed into you for years, you just might be appalled at the things they say and do. If your an American that loves America, as you should be, then you should listen to him, and actually investigate and look into what he says, and you will find he is telling the truth when he speaks, and it should make you want nothing more to do with these left wing liberal anti American boneheads that your defending eddie. Come on man. Truth is truth is truth. The guy speaks it, and brings it, and if the truth hurts, you better change your way of life, because your doing something wrong. And if you fear the truth, again, your doing something wrong.

    • WayneT

      I agree, Victoria. Glenn tells it the way it is going to be, but some of these folks will not admit it, even though they know he is right on.

      • bob wire

        give me a break! Glenn explanation of gravity!

        ” when a shoe drops,you will heard a thud!” ~ okay! I’ll buy that!

        “You can expect to hear “two” thuds!” ~ WoW! this guy is bright!

        Just because he is brighter then you don’t make Glenn bright!

        Glenn Beck is a person from a very dysfunctional family that has learned to make a good living for himself talking to people that are blind to his character and deeds over an audio media, a voice! and now he has visual props and a Howdy Doody, titty sucking boy face to add to the mix, ~thanks to Rupert. He is still only an immature child with an amplified “voice” that amazes and amuses the most simplest of minds.

        He’s good at it! He likes to eat and enjoy “things”, he offers up what he’s got to keep the checks rolling in, it no more complicated the that.

        Much like Souppy Sales and his FINAL (thought to be an off mic) broadcast to his eager and loving tiny audience; “That should hold the little bastards!”

        • WayneT

          Bob, your not very bright, or you would see that Glenn tells the truth. How many of your Liberal Democrats will play videos of what they have said in the past to back up their current statements. I have never heard of any doing it. Josh, they tell so many lies they cannot tell you what they have said the day before.

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          Bob it is obvious as to what ails you. You have an acute case of cranalanalitus. Im sorry, but you have revealed over and over to all of us, that the truth is not only not in you, it is no where near you, nor is it allowed to even penetrate the zip code you live in. You can spew your hatred and anti American agenda at Glenn Beck and other purveyors of the truth all you want, but it doesnt change the fact that they speak the truth, and expose the anti American baloney that your left wing liberal democrats propagate to their sheeple, and any of us who live in the truth, all know the lies and hatred that the left spreads throughout the world. They even sell our country down the road to foreign countries in an attempt to make the other guys look bad and themselves look good to them, and that is pretty disgusting. Its vile, and Im sick of it, and America is sick of it, thats why over 60 of your co-horts got sent home bob. America woke up, but evidently, your still snoring. You bore me bob, your lies and putrid stale statements are typical left wing liberal rhetoric, that your leaders have told you, and like a good sheeple, you blindly follow them to the slaughter. Shame on you for not thinking on your own, and getting educated as to who these anti Americans are that are selling you down the road with the rest of us bob. That is who the left is, and you better realize it sooner than later.

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      Victoria, Agreed, Beck has been pratically dead on!

      • Jovianus

        Angel…you wouldn’t care to list anything Beck has been correct on would you? LOL ….

        • http://! Angel Wannabe

          Jo or what ever the hell your name is__, Go find find your own sources on Beck, ring wingers aren’t crediable in the world according to JO, or did have a moment and you suddenly switched sides?

          • WayneT

            Angel, Jov is a person who does not have any of his facts steaight. All we can do is feel sorry for him, and ignore his statements, unless he can provide a good Conservative website to back up his facts. Please Jov, no MSNBC, or any of those Liberal Websites that only has hatred and fabricates lies againt folks who actually loves our country.

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          Get thee behind me, Jovianus satan.

      • Jovianus

        Angel … you wouldn’t care to list anything Beck has been correct on would you? LOL ….

        • Dan az

          jojo
          Its apparent that you dont watch beck,and find that he is reaching millions of viewers that this site cant and it is obvious that it is bothering you.So why not do the same as you do with beck turn it off and stop bothering us.I dont even have a tv anymore but I research the truth and find that statements like yours are meaningless and with out any FACTS you will be over looked in the future like all your progressive comrades.seek hell or is that hail?

          • Jana

            Dan az,
            Jovi already stated he doesn’t like “our kind of truth”. Probably because it is based in facts that he doesn’t like.

          • WayneT

            Very well explained, Dan. I guess we have to feel sorry for Jov as he just does not understand what the facts are.

  • artie

    Saw a great sign about this: “Stop leeching– start teaching!”

    This also makes me think, “Walker, Wisconsin Ranger”

    • Bruce D.

      Both are short and effective. Good post.

  • Jack Gordon

    Personally, I can’t wait for Madison-style protests to break out all across the US. It’s time to tell the plutocrats and their water boys in the GOP (Greedy Oligarchy’s Party) that we have had enough of their politics. Since at least the time of Ronald “Old-Forgetful” Reagan, we have watched this plunderbund bankrupt the American middle class. Even after the disaster of late 2007, caused entirely by their insane fundamentalist capitalist doctrines, all the intellectual drivel about “self-regulating markets” and “trickle-down economics,” people like Walker continue trying to ruin our country. The Republican Neanderthals in Washington, soul brothers of the ‘C’ student governor of Wisconsin, want to cut everything in sight — except, of course, the Republicans’ sacred cow, the military and its far-flung empire of bases, military socialim, the only kind these so-called conservatives like. The motto of the plutocrats’ party today seems to be, “Everything for ‘defense’ but not one red cent for anything decent!”

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      JG, It’s a Little Early for a comedy routine, I’ll give ya an Atta Boy though! :)

    • Loyde Williams

      What a dim-wit, talk about closed eyes? Who wanted (and got it)the Obama care crap,but we couldnt know what was in it til they got it Passed? Thats the kind of action we get when liberal dim-wits have the controls. I thank God I’m able to think and bargain for my self. I dont need a bunch of “head Knocking goons” to do my thinking for me. How decent was the bills Pelosi ran up with her fuel bills in the plane at public expense? Did she really earn those plane rides? Get rid of the self serving cry babies and put some honest people in office, whether they are dems or gop dosent really matter–right is right and wrong is wrong. Put Good people in office and you will have good Govt.

      • Jovianus

        You could know what the Health Care reform bill contained…if you read it and not went off like some wild teenager assuming rumors and wild accusations. Pelosi, when she said that sentence, is quoted out of context as she was referring to the overall impact and calling into question the wild accustations of the GOP and TPers…

        • DadO9

          You could know what the Health Care reform bill contained…if you read it and not went off like some wild teenager assuming rumors and wild accusations. Pelosi, when she said that sentence, is quoted out of context as she was referring to the overall impact and calling into question the wild accustations of the GOP and TPers…
          The bill contained 16000 pages and was given to Congress less than 24 hours before they rammed it through. Can you read 16000 pages in 24 hours? They could not have read it, besides they have been adding to it ever since it passed.

          • independant thinker

            Even if a person could somehow read the bill in 24 hours no one could digest what was in it and comprehend what it actualy said between all the lawyer doublespeak.

        • WayneT

          You are wrong, Jovianus. I heard Nancy Pelosi make that statement, and it was not taken out of context. I am retired, and I have a lot of time to donate to watching TV. Nancy Pelosi and her followers are ruining our nation and the jerks in her district are just like her.

        • Robin, Arcadia, IN

          Jovianus.. What wild accusations are you referring to? The ones that nobody read it and they were pushing to pass it? Pelosi said what she said, and she was not quoted out of context. Nice try!

        • Patty
          • Jovianus

            Patty…exactly. Just as I stated. She wasn’t talking about the direct contents of the bill and what was in it … she was talking about the future and how the benefits will pan out as far as increasing health care to our people.

        • patty

          OK. If you actually listened to the words coming from her own mouth, you would be able to understand what everyone was so angry about. So you flunked comprehension. If you truly believe what you are saying, then I have some great land in FL for you. Not much swamp.
          How can you fall for all the utopia talk and think that it is OK to pass something you have no clue what is in it. You just bought a silk purse made from a sow’s ear. And Pelosi got the cows hormones for injections.

    • Joe Cross

      What does promote the general welfare mean from the constitution?

      To the authors and signors of the Constitution, it was limited to the acts necessary to maintain the citizens’ rights to life, liberty, and property under Natural Law. The 10th Amendment limits the scope of activities allowed by both the “General Welfare” and “Necessary and Proper” Clauses. Courts have expanded the federal government’s authority to subjects not enumerated under the Constitution through individual Judges’ loose interpretations of the “spirit” of the Constitution. Upon comparing the rulings with the official records from the Constitutional Convention, one can easily see that any ruling expanding the role of the Federal Government beyond its intended scope is in direct conflict with the Founders’ vision. The Founders repeatedly voted down language that would have allowed Congress to determine the scope of its own responsibilities because it defeats the purpose of enumerated powers and checks and balances.

      Thomas Jefferson wrote extensively about the limits purposely imposed on federal power. A few quotes:

      “The policy of the American government is to leave their citizens free, neither restraining nor aiding them in their pursuits.”

      Thomas Jefferson further described the Tenth Amendment as “the foundation of the Constitution” and added, “to take a single step beyond the boundaries thus specially drawn … is to take possession of a boundless field of power, no longer susceptible of any definition.” Jefferson’s formulation of this doctrine of “strict construction” was echoed by champions of state sovereignty for many decades.

      James Madison, objected to loose interpretations of the General Welfare Clause, arguing that it was inconsistent with the concept of a government of limited powers and that it rendered the list of enumerated powers redundant. He argued that the General Welfare clause granted Congress no additional powers other than those enumerated. Thus, in the Founders’ view, the words themselves served no practical purpose other than to avoid repeating the enumerated powers.

      Hopefully The Federalist Papers are still required reading in school. It’s the Founders’ own words that answers this and many other questions.
      Source(s):
      http://avalon.law.yale.edu/subject_menus…

      • Patty

        They do not teach it in most k-12 grades. They are too busy trying to re-write history (and making them out to be bad guys) than to teach it.

    • Bear

      Jack, Jack, Jack……Where did you come from? You call maintaining our defenses not decent? If Clinton hadn’t disassembled our intelligence structure while in office, we might still have the twin towers. If he hadn’t insisted on Mohammed Atta’s release, we might still have the twin towers. It is because of the soldier that you are still speking english in this country that still bears some resemblance to a free country. It is because of the decayed thinking like yours that we are where we are today. Go to the airport and become a subject for the porn and grope show that your liberal Obama and Nepalitano have put in place for us under the guise of being necessary for national security and tell me that profiling should not be implemented. We know what the foreign enemy looks like and we can pick out the domestic ones too.

    • Ted Crawford

      I see you’ve been reading comrade Alinsky again Jack. He would be proud of that unsubstantiated rant!

    • marvin

      Jack Gordon
      are you stuped or just acting that way

    • Stan Smith

      Jack The Libtard! seething your hate for America?? Well your Libtards buddies show their hate to disable War Vet
      http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/manhattan/hero_unwelcome_Zi3u1fwtRpo87vXAiAQfSN
      You must have fell off the beanstalk so many times, Wear your tin foil helmet next time!

      • Dan az

        Stan
        thanks for the site just reminds me of vietnam days of returning and being spit on.Sounds like not much has changed.I think if there is any funding coming from tax payers it should be withheld until they get the socialist teachers out of there.

    • Patty

      I am watching a host of my friends participating in trickle up poverty. Not a pretty sight.

    • Robin, Arcadia, IN

      Jack Gordon… Have you really compared the two parties and looked at their platforms? I didn’t for years. My parents were Democrats, so that’s what I was. Then I grew up and was able to figure out that the Democrat party was not the side I wanted to be on. Perhaps you should do the same… It isn’t right versus left. It’s right versus wrong!

      • Bob

        Robin, I have looked at the different platforms of both parties, and I’ll support the Democrats. I will not support Repubs, who support Corporate America, and their selling of America, for 0.02 cents profit.

        I’ll vote for a “Yellar dog,” before I vote for a repuke.

        Additionally, I whole heartedly support, the GREAT UNION AMERICANS, in Wisconsin, and Columbus.

        • Dan az

          Bob
          I dont blame you not liking the rep. party but there is another party on the ballot rather than democraps which got us here in the first place try checking out this site.
          http://libertarianparty.org/platform

    • WayneT

      Come back, come back from the land of Oz, Jack. You are another dreamer.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      I got news for you Jack. All these protests do is expose the greedy unions and their connection to the democrats, that they will willingly have a large number of their very own get their jobs cut, than to all pony up and pay premiums like the rest of America does. Why should others have to pay higher taxes so that they can have all their benefits free? Just how is that Jack. How can you reconcile to the general public, who has been paying for them all these years, that these guys are better than them and deserve to have others pay their way for them? This just gives unions and the democrats another black eye, and the rest of the country is laughing out loud at the audacity of how wrong they are in doing this, and yet are insisting everyone else is wrong. The country is watching Jack, and the unions are giving themselves two black eyes on this one. They have show their greed, and their contempt for their fellow man, that they think themselves better than anyone else, that the rest of them should pay their way. Typical liberal think tank junk. And you wonder why America is waking up and voted over 60 of them to the curb. You guys keep exposing yourselves, and its pathetic. Union greed makes them not even care if their so called union brothers lose their job, as long as they dont have to pony up any money to pay for their benefits like the rest of us. Gimme a break. Once again, the liberals and unions have been exposed for who they really are. Black eye, self given.

  • http://aol.com sean murrey

    the progessives are the ones that are running this bs they like thier kind in egypt.This has been predicted for some time.

  • B. Holmes

    If you are interested in why Islam is negative, read the Koran. Within a few minutes you will see the over 160 times that Good Muslims must kill infidels. That is anyond who is not Muslim. They get an immediate entrance into heaven.
    Next study the evil man who started the idol-worshipping joke.

    • JR

      There is actually no difference in the amount of hate between the original bible texts and the Koran.
      Did you ever read bible texts…no I don’t mean the sanitized political correct version that is pushed these days. Go and buy a translation of the original bible texts including the not so PC texts that where conveniently removed and tossed away. You will be surprised to read them. When I grew up, one of the studies we had in school was called the bible now and then. We compared the texts of bibles and translations from Latin and Hebrew texts to the modern sanitized bible.
      One thing I can tell you, the modern bible is a weak, very weak version of the older bible with only about 1/3rd of the original texts and books. Any older version reads just as the Koran with with hundreds of reverences and descriptions to kill non believers and even believers for minor infractions.

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        You are a liar. I have read old Bibles, and I have the Greek and the Hebrew, which I use in studies. Text has not been removed, or added. Wording has been changed for understand purposes. Such as this, I present the facts. In the King James, people talked with the classical original English, such as “Thou artest giveth thyself a reward in the eyes of the Lord.” Well JR, you tell me, do people really talk like that these days, here in the United States. No sir, they do not. Rather, we would say something like ” Jesus will reward you in the eyes of the Lord”. Its not removing text, its making it easier for people to understand and to apply to their lives. Only real difference, is in the Greek, sometimes they have 3 or 4 words for one word, which make the application different. Like the word love. In the Greek, there is Agape, which is a brotherly love or a true love. There is Eros, which is a passionate love with sensual desire and affection. There is Philia, which is friendship, loyalty to friends, family and community. And there is Storge, which is affection, like that of a parent to a child. But you are wrong in saying that text was taken out, to as your seeming to try to say, hide things. This is just not true. Though it is true, the Koran tells its believers to kill those who dont think and believe as you do, as they are labeled as infidels. But the True Word of God, tells us to pray for our enemies, as God doesnt want any of them to perish. He doesnt tell us to kill them. He says pray for them. And for those who reject Him, one day, He will free His fury against them, and it will all be done. But your statements are a flat out lie.

        • Dan az

          Thanks Beberoni
          I learn something everyday here.

    • WayneT

      This tells me that all who are supporting Muslim Nobama are also Muslims. Who else would want their head cut off by the Muslim extremist. Muslims would not have to worry about this, but Christians would. Now we have the Nobama backers figured out.

  • wsulecki

    Jack: you’re right about the neocon corporatist elites!

    • Ted Crawford

      Yet another Alinsky deciple heard from.

  • Charles

    “The more we count the blessings we have, the less we crave the luxuries we haven’t.” William Arthur Ward I fear for America in that unless we are careful, we could/will loose all we have. May I be of the spirit to often say thanks for even the small things I have. I believe I have a paper and a verbal trail for that.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      You are correct sir. Whether you know it or not, you were addressing the sin of envy. We are told to be thankful for what we have, and not envious or anxious for the things we dont have. So many people waste their whole lives in search of another dollar, accumulating their wealth on the earth, where moth and rust will destroy it, and it will be left for another to enjoy when we are gone. Rather, we should invest our treasures in heaven, where they can be enjoyed forever. So many have failed to understand, the measure of a mans wealth isnt by what he accumulates on this earth, its by what he gives away to others. That is a true rich man, the one who gives.

      • Dan az

        Beberoni
        for a minute there I thought of obumer but then it came to me that it must be your own money not everyone else’s.You had me worried there for a minute.lol!

  • Paul Steffas

    Why are the people protesting only their issues. They should look at the cushy benes the feds get and tell the congressmen to cut their pork as well. What is wrong with people only looking at themselves and not the future. Fair is fair to be cut the FEDS!!!

  • Mick

    Bruce D. says:
    February 21, 2011 at 7:35 am
    I agree Barb. Public schools are political in nature and helping to destroy the fabric of America. They are more concerned about producing non educated socialist in masses and a small elite group of leaders that are able to twist truth and facts.
    *********************************************

    Bruce D. ,,you hit the nail on the head with that one !!

  • TIME

    The Youth are the future of any nation thats a fact.
    But if the teachers are not teaching and thats also fact in well over 65% of the cases in so far as public schools.
    Then this resource we have is being squandered. Thus the question is why?

    I have spoken with lots teachers who feel that they work with a many other teachers who should not be allowed near Kids for any reason. Why is that?
    Due to their being self absorbed butt heads, {Please do keep in mind thats not my opinion – thats teachers views of many of the people they work with.}

    So whats that say?
    What it say about how our Youth are looked at is beyond reason.
    When we have the DOE who dictates to states by way of the NEA that if the state wants Federal funding, the state’s must have a large swath of kids on Mind control drugs? Why is that again?

    Why would anyone parent allow such?
    Mostly due to just ignorance as well intimidation from the School’s Teachers / Adminstrations, School Borads who are dictated to and controlled by the DOE by the NEA who then get “KICK BACKS.”
    What’s the NEA again? A UNION.

    All you need to do is open YOU’RE EYES – Please wake up.

    The FEDS have been breaking the backs of the TAX payers for years, now you are just starting to see the results of these ramifications from allowing UNIONS to run crazy games over and over again.
    These events will keep unfolding over and over again until all the UNIONS are either broken up and done away with, or they destroy the nation from within.

    Saddly the FEDS have destroyed countless youth over the years with the mind control drugs they dictate must be given out, and the American public has stood by watching. Why is that?
    Why is it that they don’t care about the kids they claim they so love?

    Collective Bargaining is a Right? Really – Based on what?
    You have no rights to such, thats just utter and complete rhetoric from the UNIONS to force themselfs into you’re Bank Accounts.

    YOU as a parent have a responsibility to your children to get them the best education you can, if the States wish to follow the federal money rather than educate you’re children, all the while allowing UNIONS to make Billions off you. “There will be no FUTURE.”

    You can not educate idiots.

    And Idiots who repeat what they are told have not been educated.
    They are little more than talking birds who make a lot of noise.

    • marvin

      TIME
      tell a lie long enuf and to the young enuf and it will be fact in time enuf,and that is fact enuf

      • JR

        AM radio talking heads and the conspiracy theorists in this country know this principle very well.

        • http://deleted Claire

          JR— Agreed.

        • http://donthaveone Beberoni

          Since you brought it up JR, about AM radio talking heads, when it comes to the game of politics, if it wasnt for the AM radio talking heads of Rush Limbaugh, Michael Savage, Sean Hannity and Glenn Beck, no one, and I mean no one, would get the truth about anything. I have caught Katie Couric telling more lie in one week, pretty much every week, and Ive yet to catch any of these guys tell anything but the truth. Sometimes it isnt pretty, but truth is truth is truth, and we all need to hear it. In fact, your boys are so scared of the truth JR, they are trying to shut these guys down, so that no one can ever hear any opinions ever, except for those of the left. Now that my friend, is the most dangerous slippery slope one could ever walk on. When they seek to silence the opposition, they are sure on the path to communism, and that is todays left wing liberals. No doubt about it. They do not want anyones ideas or opinions to even be voiced, except for their own. They are communists.

  • Loyde Williams

    I think we are all missing the BIG point! As Israel suffered when they disobeyed God, so do we.We let one atheist and a liberal Supreme Court get God dismissed from our schools and most of our Public life.We chose instead to race for the prizes of money,fame and fortune. When God asked King Solomon to choose what he wanted he wisely asked for wisdom to rule the Nation. Todays rulers seek only self promoting Power. We can “wild guess” tomorrow but only God knows the Future, and His Name is not “allah”. Keep it up people,put “self” first and you will wind up at the Bottom of the well. “seek ye First the Kingdom of God and His Righteousness and all these things will be added unto you” Matt. 6:33

    • Marilyn Van Natta

      Thank you,Loyde,for pointing out the similarities between what has been transpiring in our beloved,free country,and the judgements of a holy and righteous God.Blessed is the nation whos God is the Lord!I’ve lived long enough to see a deterioration of moral values,common sense,simple thankfulness.I pray that God,who knows the heart of every man,will have mercy on us,for this Nation has fallen into a great deception.It is amazing to see so many Bible prophecies coming to pass in my lifetime. Even so,come Lord Jesus!

      • marvin

        Marilyn Van Natta
        god gave man domenion off the earth and he blew it gave man a garden that needed no tending he blew it gave man a free will to choose good over evil/right from wrong and all have blew it all save but one and we hung him on a cross,all that evil needs to win is for good to do nothing

      • Jovianus

        Oh jeesus save us. The religious American Taliban are out in droves today …

        • Robin, Arcadia, IN

          Jovianus… Your post is no surprise. I would have expected nothing less from you…

    • Dave

      Just Like Governor Walker of Wisconsin seeking his self promoting power.

      • marvin

        Dave
        would you care to tell why the gov is doing as you say ,he was elected by the people [voters tax payers]not the unions or obama or the news,to do what they [tax payers]want ,stop the spending and give aways,he is saying work ,do the job you where hired to do or get fired,not good or even smart to pay someone 2 to 3 times what the boss in making,and you can not fire them

      • Robin, Arcadia, IN

        Dave… Gov. Walker was voted in. I don’t like the fact Barry or Obama whatever name he goes by, is our president. I didn’t vote for him, but I am stuck with him, at least until the next election.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      Amen brother, and its a shame so many waste their whole life away chasing money and material things, when the example was previously set for them, way back in the Bible. Solomon, was given the key by God to ask for anything, and he asked for wisdom to govern his people the right way. In doing this, all other things were added to him, and Solomon was the richest and wisest man in the world, and didnt waste his life seeking riches, they were given to him as he sought God first. But I have to add, just to show you how simple and fallen us mere humans are, even the wisest man in the world, Solomon, disobeyed God and kept foreign women for himself that God had told him to destroy, and he let them keep their idols and fake gods. And later in life, all was stripped from him because of his disobediance. And still today we pay for this, because out of his disobediance, and allowing these women to keep their gods and idols, for if he would have obeyed God, we wouldnt have the murdering muslim influence all over that we have now. It would have been done with.

  • http://AT&TYAHOO Mauro Arrieta

    The headline “Cairo Comes to America,” is sensationalism or hyperbole.
    Except for the crowds, there is little, if any comparison, between
    Cairo, where physical violence has been experienced and Wisconsin,
    where protests are loud and clear, but without the violence seen in
    Cairo.

    • eddie47d

      That is deliberate on the part of Mr Livingston. When you can put Union bashing and Cairo protesters in the same sentence it spices up the hatred instead of common sense. You know-it get’s the juices flowing.

      • marvin

        eddie47d
        you know if i was on your blog and did not like what you wrote i would just leave,i don,t know how old you are but i have saw black people destoy cars, bussiness, over what was called race riots i have saw union member do the same thing over turf wars and yes people were hurt and killed to,so never think this can not happen here,it has and will,get your head out of obamas ass and breath some air the assgas has distroyed what little brains you have

      • Robin, Arcadia, IN

        eddie… take off your blinders. There is a similarity going on here!

        • eddie47d

          Robin; You are right! That is, right wing = union bashing. Not much fresh air coming out of your side.

          • Robin from Arcadia, IN

            eddie… If the unions had remained what they stood for and not gone on to the greed and power, they wouldn’t be bashed. They have overstepped and it is now time to bring them down. They need to get back to their roots. They were needed and they did so much good for our country. But that is no longer true. You would have to be blind not to see that.

          • Jana

            Robin,
            You are so right.
            Everyone is so against corporations. Unions are just a large corporation with Socialistic and Communistic powers. Look at the Union bosses. Unions are notorious for their thuggery.
            This particular Union is no different.

          • eddie47d

            Not all unions are bad and some are still needed. Now Corporates Have screwed America and are allowed to still do so. Who is the bad guy? Because we need jobs we are forced to put up with Corporate dishonesty.

          • Jana

            eddie,
            I knew you would pounce on that one.

          • Dan az

            So eddie
            You think we should get rid of the corporations because they make to much?But then wouldnt the unions have to go then to?Awhile back someone I know was watching the news when this interview of some guy on the GM line was standing there with remote controls in his hands wearing tennis shoes and shorts while loading cars on to a conveyor,stated that he made $75 an hr.Is this what you would call reasonable wages?and thats not counting the bennies.You think that if the corporation had oh say 1000 people at these kind of wages that they actually make much of a profit?And you wounder why the price of every thing is so high,pass it on to the consumer and then lets try to take whats left in taxes to help pay for those that dont want to work anymore.Sounds fair to me.NOT!

      • http://donthaveone Beberoni

        Time to light a fire under eddie’s butt. They are protesting in Cairo, and now in Libya eddie, because they want the freedom we have in the west. They have seen it started in Iraq, thanks to the Bush admin. And didnt Bush say, that if we could get Iraq going, and other Arab nations saw the freedom there, that they would all want it? Im sure Im right. And even in Iran now they are raising up, and all these countries want these dictators out, and they want to be free. It is inherit in all men to want to be free. So give credit to the Bush admin that you so freely bashed for years eddie, as his movements have inspired these people to stand up and fight for their freedom. Gee eddie, didnt this country do the same thing, oh say maybe 2011 years ago, you know, stand up and fight for our independance and our freedom. Yeah, its kind of like that. Blame all the freedom on Bush eddie, go ahead and point the finger at him some more.

        • Cawmun Cents

          That would be a good thing were it true Mr.Beberoni.However the people behind these civil unrests that we are witnessing have little to do with real freedom.They use these “democracy and freedom” slogans and banners at their protests,but they are insidiously planning something to the contrary.Their stated goals are quite different than you see on the surface.They intend to enslave the populace either to a government or a religion that will keep freedom from actually becoming possible.So all this talk of freedom is masking the reality of the end situation,which is radical control by one means or another.

  • Raggs

    obama is quick to stand behind the unions and at the same time he is willing to cut medicare and SS. Something is very wrong with this picture.

    • Red

      Not if you really understand what is going on. This is radical revolution spearheaded by our president who is an expert trainer in the various tactics they employ. That is what “communty organizers” do. He was one for ACORN. His role model, Saul Alinsky, was also a community organizer. This is not a school board spat.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Red, your right, Wisc. is not just a school board spat, its a power struggle. As long we continue to put up with this kind of cronyism, were enabling it. Jersey Guv Chris Christie started it, and its gonna grow like the plague. So they better get ready.

        • WayneT

          We must unite, and fire Nobama as quickly as possible.

    • marvin

      Raggs
      it is called dance with the one that brought you, i don,t have to explain that,most on here know why,the hand out bunch give me free free free thank obama allmity it,s all free

  • patrick H.T. paine

    “To conquer, first DIVIDE”

    But children, you are missing Bob’s point.

    “There are some things you can do to protect yourself. And if you play your cards right, you can even prosper in this Great Recession. To learn how to not only protect your wealth in these hard times, but actually use the current economic climate to your advantage, get a copy of our newest book, The Great Recession Handbook, Survival Strategies For Trying Times. It’s at the printer right now on a limited run. To be one of the first to get a copy,”

    Of course, some will prosper first…..so much for “enlightened self
    interest”…….

    Ever consider the fact that, identifying a “problem” and representing yourself as the solution to it, sets up an interesting contradiction
    whereby the actual solution, now becomes a direct conflict of
    interest…..because the actual solution ( cure ) ends whatever power
    influence and authority you gained, promising to solve it?

    “Hope and Change. Yes, we can.” ( but we probably won’t because
    where’s the future ( profit ) in that!” )

    Ever wonder why the “Paul” dynasty, the bastion of truth, has never
    brought up 26 CFR 3402 ( p ) while constantly railing about the
    IRS…..yet failing to mention, the simplest solution of all,
    available to every employer and employee in the U.S. if they were only
    made aware of it? ( even the “real?” Tea Party is blissfully
    ignorant of this “established precedent” )

    “The END is NIGHER!!!!”

    How much rice and beans can you actually store? How many guns and bullets to defend it?

    If NIGH ever comes……..it will not be pretty…..

    But “nigher”, well that has “marketing possibilities”…..

    • JR

      Get used to it,
      99% of articles on this site are nothing but clever designed advertisements to buy something, Gold, Silver, Herbal medicine, Books.
      Its a get rich quick political action forum.
      The ones that want to get rich quick are the one writing the “opinion” (advertising)piece and the ones paying for it are the sheep buying the merchandise. Many sites on the web…and that is true for all political directions are masquerading as political sound pages but are nothing but instruments of gaining personal wealth. And that’s o.k. because at the same time they provide an outlet for the frustrations of the average citizen. Like minded people are getting together, preaching to the choir, attacking the occasional opposition like starving wolfs attack the prey. Its human nature. And at the same time its one of the great things the internet has done for us. We all can be smart, big, strong, patriots, communist, experts, independent of who we are or what our background really is. The anonymity of the internet makes all this happen. The downside is, that most people that spend they’re time on the net pretending to be a big bad wolf in reality are nothing but a social outcasts incapable of social interaction in real life.
      Real people don’t use the internet to preach to a choir, real people are out and doing things…just like the protesters and counter protesters in Wisconsin, the volunteers for the different organizations around the country, volunteer firemen and more, the people that “do” have no time to spare to rant on the internet.

      • dstk

        exactly! I am glad someone finally said it!

      • Robin, Arcadia, IN

        JR.. You post on this blog… That puts you in as one of us! If you don’t like it, there are others you could find to rant on.

  • http://None PA Gal

    We are headed for a financial disaster unless the spending is cut dramatically. As a former federal employee, I have seen the wasteful spending firsthand. I will say the federal employees always had to contribute 7% of their salaries to their pensions, and that is much more than these teachers in WI.

    How would you like to wake up one morning and find your savings is practically worthless. We are on the road to being Greece if something isn’t done. It makes me sick when I think of all the stimulus money wasted. They may as well been standing on the street in Washington and throwing dollars into the air by the handful. Maybe its time the citizens went to Washington and tarred and feathered this bunch. I can think of a few I would have on the list like Obama, Reid, Pelosi, Schumer, Frank and a few others. I hope to see other governors do as Gov. Walker is doing. We have a big deficit here in PA, and I will be contacting our governor and state representatives to see what can be done with our teachers’ unions. They are taxing us out of our homes with their salaries and benefits.

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      Pa Gal__I’m hearing that too!

  • Robert Read

    The Middle East cancome to America

    To corporate america andall corrupt politicans, see what your failure will be if you continue down the path that you are currently on of abusing We th People of the United States.

    Amrica is on the road to being a Third World Nation.

    NOW, Change Must Come To America!!

  • Robert Read

    The Middle East cancome to America

    To corporate america and all corrupt politicans, see what your failure will be if you continue down the path that you are currently on of abusing We the People of the United States.

    America is on the road to being a Third World Nation.

    NOW, Change Must Come To America!!

  • http://hotmail.com Hank

    As a pilot I have to tell you that with the firing of the PATCO worker that the airways became very very unsafe. I cannot tell you how many neer misses that there were. So sometimes a knee-jerk reaction is not the best. I have no problem with union give backs,I do however belive that collective bargaining is a freedom that every true AMERICAN has a right to. Another question that I have would be,have the Wi lawmakers cut there pay. This is AMERICA, people,the greatest country in the world. We have been through tough times in the past and we will get through this. Lets stop the name calling,the teachers are not commies or socialist. They are just AMERICANS trying to make it. GOD BLESS AMERICA.This is for sc

    • Kevin

      You believe collective bargaining is a RIGHT?
      So you believe you have a right to another mans hard work! (money)
      Collective bargaining has DESTROYED American industry through it’s thuggery and “bargaining”

      • Dave

        Kevin, You are ignorant of US History of the late 19th and early 20th centuries. The abuse of workers was prevalent – 12 hour days, 6 days a week and no child labor laws. Protesting workers were gunned down by their own state militias. If unions never existed there would be no middle class.

        • ValDM

          Can you cite something a little more in tune with OUR CURRENT times? History told us about gross abuses by employers. But is that happening today in the classroom? secretarial pool? roadworkers? These people have not been abused as the historical instances you’ve cited. WHY do they need collective bargaining? Please, please tell us WHY?

      • Robin, Arcadia, IN

        Kevin… I agree with you. Collective bargaining is NOT a right. The unions came about for a good reason. They helped form America and yes, saved many people in the process. Then they got power hungry and greedy. They have went from the right side to the wrong side. They are no longer the ‘good guys’. They have crossed that line that should have never been crossed.

    • http://oklahoma1 ajbokie

      have you taken a pay cut if not maybe you need to go join the teachers they should fire every one of them just like reagan did with the faa how many unemployed teachers are they plenty

      • http://hotmail.com Hank

        A little history lesson Patco was a union the FAA is a federal agency. President Reagan fired union members and it was the only thing that I fault him for. You see,it made my job more stressful and when you have the responsibility to keep a couple hundred people safe and have to deal a rookie,well you should try it sometime. Now as far as my pay. I consider myself a true AMERICAN,I love this country and I fought for it. Therefore, if asked to take a pay I would do so gladly. Every AMERICAN has the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. I therefore feel that as time changes everyone has the right to better themselves and if that means collective bargaining so be it. After all it is part of the AMERICAN way of life and it gave life to the middle class. The middle class is one of the main things that makes this country great and you should be proud to be an AMERICAN,I know that I am. I did not sweat and bleed in Asia so that some politician could destroy this great country.GOD BLESS AMERICA. Its been fun but I have pushback in two hours.

        • Patty

          There is only one little problem here Hank. The people footing the bill at this collective bargaining table are missing. The taxpayer. The table consists of all gov’t. people and how much can they get away with screwing the taxpayer.

    • marvin

      to Hank
      your right but you have no right to my bank account,same as i have no right to yours ,a public servent is just that a servent of the people,if you own a company and make 200,000 and have 5 worker making 40,000 plus benifits ,their are a few things you can do one close the doors two borow money,three cut spending,this is like the old joke of buying apples at 5 dollars a bushel hauling them fifty miles and selling for 5 a bushel ,what do you do just get a bigger truck??

    • Scott

      Collective bargaining can be useful, if done at the proper level. As I have stated before, unions should never grow beyond a local level. that way they can deal with issues that directly affect them. No group, however, should have the ability to hold an entire industry hostage in an effort to force thier wishes on an employeer.

      That is exactally what the Teacher’s Union is doing in WI. And because the Umbrella unions are forcing “solidatrity” amongst the unions, we now have multiple unions involved, including police and firefighters. How many of these people are off the job because of these protests. From my layman’s point of view, they are in violation of their contracts, and as such, those contracts should be rendered null and void. How would these teachers like to try bargining from the unemployment line, where they belong.

      Get it people, these unions are nothing more then terrorist orgainzations that use numbers and money to force their way on the American People. And, on occasion, they’ve been known to use violence, just like any other terrorist orgainization. But “our” Unions are protected by their puppet in Washington, Mr. Obama.

  • Nancy

    Teachers encouraging truancy and teaching their students that it’s okay to lie when you call in sick. Setting a nice example for the people who are teaching our kids, wouldn’t you say?

    • Carlucci

      I was thinking that same thing, Nancy. It didn’t sound like parents had given their permission for those teachers to take them off campus.

      All unions are a racket. I can see how they were a necessary evil in the past, but they should all be abolished. Speaking of rackets, unions remind me of many charities out there, especially the ones allegedly looking for “cures”. Most of the time, they really don’t want to “cure” anything because the focus is always about the money.

      • Dave

        Do you abolish the police if you live in a crime free community? Unions still serve a purpose, they bring everyone’s wages up.

        • Don

          Dave, unions are like the fed. gov. they have grown to have to much power, no one is against people having a decent wage, unless it is at the expense of others, and this is what is happening now, when the States can’t pay the bill cuts have to be made, if you don’t understand that i suggest you move to china or somewhere else and get an education, you probably think 2+2=5 !! have a nice day !

      • independant thinker

        “It didn’t sound like parents had given their permission for those teachers to take them off campus.”

        If that is in fact the case it would be poetic justice if some of the kids were injured as a result of being off campus at the protest (and no, I do not wish for that to happen). I know if that happened to my kid I would break the union with a lawsuit so big they could never pay it off.

    • Jovianus

      Nancy..they are setting a VERY GOOD example. If the elected officials lie their way in, then push through one sided legislation wthout allowing for hearings and public opinion to weigh in, and such legislation is an attack on the very core of the rights of Americans…yes…they are setting an example which should not be castigated. Standing up against thuggery of politicians running amok.

      When the daughter was in HS, I received a call one day from her asking to be picked up asap. She was supposed to be inschool but had skipped out to attend an anti-war, anti Cheney demonstration when the war criminal came to town for closed talks with industry. The demonstration was going peacefully…until right wing thugs attacked the demonstrators. It’s all on camera…and in the news at the time. Right wing thugs atacked the demonstrators and started the riots. Police came, tear gassed everyone and my 16 year old daughter was in the midst of that melee’.

      I was never so proud of her as I was that day. She stood up for what she believed in. And that was also the day that I became anti TPer. Bunch of thugs who can’t stand Americans having rights and a different opinion other than what the TPers say one should have ..

      • Robin, Arcadia, IN

        Jovianus… You are totally screwed up. Did you do a lot of drugs in high school?

        • Jovianus

          Let me guess … You’re wondering why I’m not a thoughtless burned out unthinking robot like the usual poster here? What part of the above post are you disagreeing with?

          • Robin from Arcadia, IN

            Jovianus… I have children and I would never encourage them to ‘break rules’. I am a rule follower. Nobody is perfect, but I believe rules are meant to be followed. I have always told my kids that you break a rule, don’t expect me to bail you out. I also expect them to be respectful of their elders and those in authority.

    • dstk

      No… they are teaching that, It’s Ok to fight for your rights when you backs against the wall and the governor is stealing them right out from under you feel, there is no other choice.. (it isn’t about the money or the benefits it’s about freedom of speech and the right to gather) On one hand you scream about our rights to speak out and government having to much control, on the other (when to you it is seems all democrats) you cry out rage for them speaking out and fighting for their right. You (repubs) are going to have to figure out what you really are about because you can’t have it both ways.

      I completely agree with Jovianus
      “Nancy..they are setting a VERY GOOD example. If the elected officials lie their way in, then push through one sided legislation wthout allowing for hearings and public opinion to weigh in, and such legislation is an attack on the very core of the rights of Americans…yes…they are setting an example which should not be castigated. Standing up against thuggery of politicians running amok.

      • Judy

        To dstk:

        Their backs are against the wall??!?! Who are you kidding?

        They have ridden roughshod over the private sector and it is now time for them to look to the common good. It is the private sector’s taxes they are trying to extort.

        Don’t try to tell me the unions care about their rank and file. It is all about power and money.

        It is time for the teachers to wake up.

      • Robin, Arcadia, IN

        dstk… You are as screwed up as Jo! What is the matter with you guys? How are you so blind?

      • eddie47d

        You’re right Judy,Corporates and their executives have run roughshod over the American public and it is time we stop taking a beating from them. Darn right that the working men and women (union and non-union) better stand up to corporate thieves. We better do it before we are left with nothing and they gain even more. We know which side the Republican politicians are on and it’s not for fairness in the work place.

        • Jana

          eddie,
          Right now the Unions are trying to run over the taxpayers.

          • eddie47d

            I know what the few bad unions do and I also know what several evil corporations do. Pollution,false advertising,high interest rates,out of bounds CEO pensions, Actual thief from their own companies which is hidden under mountains of paperwork, Wall Street scams and outrageous Hedge Fund Managers salaries.That effects our economy far more than union demands. Unless you are in upper management then you don’t seem to have a clue of what is really going on. The lives of those on top of our economy are not always honorable and certainly not just the elites everyone loves to mention.

          • Jana

            eddie,

            I do see what you are talking about, and we are witnessing it every day. Funny though, Unions sound just like corporations.

          • Jana

            eddie,

            —And I am not being facetious here. I do see the very bad in these corporations. They have high priced lawyers to help them skirt around the laws and flaunt these laws. However, I truly don’t see any difference in Corporations than Unions. They have the same type of lawyers, they give themselves heft bonuses and do many dishonest things. They FORCE those working in certain fields to join, and make them pay dues. In many places if you don’t join the union you don’t work or are bullied.
            Unions are just not Lilly white and they cheat, steal and corrupt too. They have become too powerful in many many ways.

    • marvin

      Nancy
      well said and bring your students with you to see first hand

  • Henry Ledbetter

    Loyde I agree with you and we all need to remember that “the wicked flee when no man puresueth.” The heathen rage and the people imagine a vain thing because we have kings and rulers in the earth that that council together against The Lord and His Anointed (JESUS), God is laughing at their foolishnesness and He will break them with a rod of iron and dash them to pieces like a broken vessel. “Blest are all that put their faith in Him.” Psalm two describes the condition of our world today and What God is going to do.

  • Patriot

    Teachers and all public service employees, when people lose their jobs, homes and are doing everything they can to hold on; guess what? There is less money for property taxes and that means you need to learn to live with less and sacrifice like the rest of us! When people vote for social change instead of fiscal responsibility we all suffer, it just took these guys 2 years to notice what the rest of us have been feeling for that long. Welcome to The Great Recession! Everything is all well and good and until it affects you, now please join the rest of us for commonsense solutions until the whole damn thing collapses!

    • Ted Crawford

      So very true Patriot! Many world lesders have been saying the same things for years!
      “To tax the community for the advantage of a class is not protection, it’s plunder” Benjamin Disraeli
      “Most people seek what they do not possess and are enslaved by the very things they want to aquire” Anwar Sadat
      Related to those statements is the fact that Medi-care, inacted by the Johnson Administration has now grown to be larger than the entire Federal Budget when it was passed! That pratice is clearly unsustainable!

    • Judy

      Well said, Patriot.

  • Wlmitch1

    The radical Left and its allies have been revolting off and on since the 1960s. They will always have grievances until no one disagrees with their Liberty-robbing ideology. We on the “right” have numerous grievances against them and their dishonest, oppressive actions.
    _________________________________________________________________

    A Litany of Grievances Against the Statist Politicians and the
    Radical Left

    by William L. Mitchell

    February 10, 2011

    Here is some history, along with a litany of legitimate grievances against the Marxists, Globalists, and RINOs (Republicans-In-Name-Only) who are in power today, and the radical Leftists who are destroying our Nation, our Liberty, and our way of life. The year was 1620 when the Pilgrims landed on Plymouth Rock. From 1775 to 1783, our Founding Fathers FOUGHT AND WON A REVOLUTION to banish tyranny from our shores, and successfully established the United States of America as a Constitutional Republic. But BECAUSE of the deeds the Marxists, Globalists, and RINOs in power do today, the rock has been landed on US! All of the promise of equality, tolerance, brotherhood, and everybody sharing all the world, which the Marxists speak so beautifully about, is NOT intended for We The People. Their words are a LIE! Their evil, gutter ideology has brought on the vicious disarmament, torture, slaughter, and even genocide, of more than 150 MILLION innocent men, women, and children by heathen Fascist, Nazi, and Communist regimes worldwide in less than 90 years’ time!

    When We The People remind the Marxist, Globalist, and RINO politicians that We The People send our elected officials to Washington D.C. to work for US, WHICH WE DO, they look upon us with hubris, hostility, and unfriendliness. The Statists no longer intend for us to be Citizens, but subjects and wards of the State! They impose unconstitutional laws on us against our will. They unconstitutionally tax, spend, and regulate us into deep recessions, EVERY DAY of which businesses struggle to survive; and many decent, honest, hard-working Americans must work two very-low-paying jobs, or two or three part-time jobs, with few or NO benefits, just to support their families. They work from before sun-up until past sun down! From can’t see in the morning until can’t see at night! And these are the Americans who are able to find jobs at all! Then the Statists take a quarter or more of what these Americans earn, in FICA, Medicare, and Federal Income taxes, and when they die, the Statists take even more of their hard-earned money in Estate Taxes! WHEN THEY DIE, they are taxed EVEN MORE! Those Marxist and Globalist politicians HATE America; and they do NOT try to hide it ANYMORE!

    And what is it that has awakened Americans to such a degree that we now demand our country back? It is the past 50 years of the radical Leftists having taken over and bastardized the “Mainstream” News Media, Public “Education”, the “Entertainment” Industry, and the “Democratic” Party. It’s a SHAME!! And it is for these 50 years, IN WHICH, they have stupefied and indoctrinated our youth, expelled God from public life, infringed on our right to keep and bear arms, consistently appeased – and even allied themselves with – the enemies of freedom, murdered our unborn, and imposed immoral and deviant lifestyles on We The People. They slander, libel, intimidate, and try to silence those of us who are TEA Party members and sympathizers, Constitutional Conservatives, and other American Patriots of ALL races and religions by falsely accusing us of being “far right” bigots and sellouts. They try to criminalize us for opposing THEIR criminal ideology, and telling the TRUTH! Radical Leftist, activist judges at all levels legislate from the courtroom. They do NOT INTERPRET our laws like they are SUPPOSED TO! Those Marxist, Globalist, and RINO politicians do nothing to secure our borders and deport those who have entered our country ILLEGALLY. They impose so many laws on us, with a few hidden loopholes, that it is becoming almost impossible for the average American to NOT break the law! THAT is not Liberty! IT IS OPPRESSION AND SLAVERY!

    Under Obama, Holder, Napolitano, Clinton, and Reid, the destruction of our once-great nation has accelerated drastically. They impose their deadly poison known as Political Correctness on us against our will! They have hauled a sovereign U.S. State before the U.N. Human Rights Council for enforcing our immigration laws! They appease and apologize to the Islamic terrorists who want to kill us, and the regimes which sponsor them. At our airports, travellers in full Muslim dress are given a free pass while the rest of us are treated like criminals and terrorists. They violate our First, Second, Fourth, Sixth, and Tenth Amendment Rights incessantly. They are so ARROGANT and incompetent that they refuse to understand why we American Citizens are frustrated and angry! They accuse us of being ungrateful for all they do “for” us when they KNOW that they are doing their unrighteous deeds TO us! And NOW we have a “President” who ignores his Constitutional duty to protect our Nation, betrays our allies, bows and kowtows to foreign tyrants, appoints militant America-hating Marxists to his Cabinet, and rules by Executive Order and through “czars” when he does not get his way! It’s a disgrace! We The People MUST FIRE all of the Leftist, Globalist, and RINO politicians in 2012, replace them with REAL American Patriots, and finish taking our country back! God save America and GOD BLESS AMERICA!
    _________________________________________________________________

    • Don

      Well said WImitch 1, and how true.

  • Cliff Moone

    Everything I’ve read written here shows how many of you have been completely hoodwinked by the very corporatists some of you claim to be against. In Wisconsin, as I write, the Gov. keeps claiming that it’s about balancing the budget;however, the union has agreed to the cuts. What they do not agree to is the government taking away the right of workers to democratically negotiate some of the conditions of their employment. The people in the streets of Madison are not the wealthy, big business plutocrats who funded this governor’s election. They are regular, hard-working middle class people. They are the people who teach our children,pick up our garbage, and protect us from crime. None of these people will ever get rich doing what they do. Like most of the folks who follow this site(I assume), they think DEMOCRACY is worth fighting for. If Gov. Walker had been serious about balancing a budget, maybe he shouldn’t have just given around 140 million in tax breaks to big business interests in his state. If you really believe everyone should share in the sacrifices needed to fix our fiscal mess,then don’t just balance budgets on the backs of working class people.

    • chow

      The union members are walking out not because they agreed with benefit or pay cut it’s about their lose of pillaging the taxpayer tomorrow that the governor is suggesting.

      And why is it that the middle class is now the government workers when they don’t produce anything for profit to be taxed? These people doesn’t pay taxes because they’re paid with taxes and they don’t produce for profit.

      • JR

        So, what you in essence are saying is: None of the people that get paid with taxes really pays any taxes or does anything productive for this country?
        None of our soldiers, none of our LEOs, none of the millions of workers in the defense industry building the equipment, none of the doctors and nurses, the maintenance workers in the community hospitals, none of the millions of workers and engineers in research and development organizations, none of the bakers, plumbers, construction workers building roads and buildings, or any other workers that get state or federal contracts are doing anything productive for this country? None of the municipal workers that clean and fix the roads and yes none of the teachers do anything productive for this country? And there are many more…. just how simple minded and short sighted, how unreal and hateful can someone get?

    • eddie47d

      Thanks Cliff; Some on here may not realize that Wisconsin had a $125 million surplus in 2009/2010. Yet Governor Walker came in and gave those businesses two large tax breaks. That wiped out the savings and the Governor blames the Unions. Talk about sneaky back door politics;reward your voters and then attack the workers.Also those “nasty teachers” and other State workers agreed on Friday to take a pay cut and pay more of their own money into the pension fund. Walker isn’t budging and is making this an issue about collective bargaining. When collective bargaining is just a process like any negotiations. If he had dealt with the deficit issue up front he could have kept his credibility. That emperor is shedding his clothes and we can clearly see the cards he is holding.

    • Stephan F

      “The people in the streets of Madison are not wealthy, they are regular, hard-working middle class people.”

      Cliff, you must be kidding. These people are not average Americans — they are a special ‘privileged’ upper-middle class political elite that make on average twice as much as their private-sector counterparts! (Govt jobs pay well, haven’t you heard?) The private sector has (finally) awoken and they are simply saying, “we’ve had enough, and we will no longer allow the public sector to enslave us.” Period.

      • Dave

        Since when is making 60,000 a year considered upper middle class? Maybe five decades ago, but now it is barely middle class. The problem isn’t that teachers are overpaid, The Problem is that the rest of us are underpaid, while CEO’s make 633% more than the average worker they employ.

        • Patty

          Dave,
          You need to start your own company. If you think that you don’t make enough money, go out, start your own company and make YOURSELF what you think you are worth.

      • Patty

        Sorry, you are wrong. The hard working middle class are not on the street. They are at work. But, they are mobilizing and I hope to see them come out on Tuesday and counter demonstrate against these gov’t. employees whom wages they pay.

    • marvin

      Cliff Moone
      only trouble is that between the unions and the elected we the people are gettind screwed THEY WORK FOR US NOT THE OTHER WAY,to serve is not to dictate or make demands but to work or go home do the job you where hired to do if you won,t or don,t your FIRED

    • Patty

      Why is it that all of the “hard-working” people you mentioned are gov’t. employees? You seem to be missing the real problem. How can you collectively bargain when the one who is footing the bill is not sitting at the table?

  • BigBadJohn

    Due to pork barrel stimulus programs and bailouts for Wall Street, corrupt banksters and favored special interests, the Federal Government went from a deficit of $167 billion in 2007 to $1.8 trillion 2009 — an increase of 11,000 percent.
    ************************************

    09/30/2006 8,506,973,899,215.23
    09/30/2007 9,007,653,372,262.48
    HMMM wonder where Chip gets his numbers???

    Bush’s last year:
    12/30/2007
    12/30/2008 10,699,805,000

    • Jovianus

      John…Bush’s last budget was the 2009 budget…and don’t forget there are two wars not included in the “official” statistics used by the author.

      • chow

        Yes again it’s Bush’s 2009bbudget but it’s Obama who signed it. Why can’t you get that in your head. If Obama didn’t like Bush’s budget he could have demanded the congress to revise it even if it means shutting down the government. What about the 2010, 2011 budgets which are much larger than the 2009?

        • Ted Crawford

          Actually by Constitutional mandate it was neithers, but instead Nancy Pelosis’

      • Bear

        Jovianus,
        Go to Colin Powels speech where he expresses his regrets for delivring the information to Bush about the weapons of mass destruction. Clinton had effectively disassembled our intelligence network and we were relying on reports from our allies as well as one individual in the middle east who had it in for Saddam. His reports were, as it turns out, all lies. The intelligence that Bush had to rely on was crap at the very best and you can only blame the previous administration for that. Bill Clinton did more damage to the oval office and to this nation than any preident I can think of during my lifetime right until Obama. Stop pointing your finger at Bush. You fail to see that the liberals have played a huge part in all of this crap that is taking us apart right now. The president right now IS a DEMOCRAT. He has had two years to make a positive difference and all he has done is create more debt, more unemployment and created Czars that cost you and me more tax money. Wake up! Stop blaming someone else for liberal failures.

        • Jovianus

          I know…I know…the UN Inspectors weren’t competent, and when Rumsfeld said ‘we know where they [WMDs] are’ and yet refused to tell the UN Inspectors.. that wasn’t a lie? And are you suggesting we didn’t have Iraq completely covered by satellite and tapped into every phone of the military as well as Sammy? And the Niger yellow cake story wasn’t a total fabrication? Jeesh

      • WayneT

        Jovianus, there you go again, going backward Why don’t we just go back, and blame FDR for all this current BS. We can’t gain anything by going backward. We need to go forward. Nobama has been in the drivers seat for two years now, and we are worse off today than we were two years ago. That should be as plain as the nose on your face.

    • marvin

      to BigBadJohn
      in dec 1999 national dept over 5 trillion in dec 2005 little over 8 trillion now feb 2011 14.5 trillion dems took over both house in 2006 white house in 2008 we went from 8 trillion in dec 05 to over 14 trillion thats around 6 trillion in 5 years bush from jan 2000 to jan 2006 3 trilliom thats 5 years liars figure but figure don,t lie, fact bush and repubs raised the dept from 5 to 8 trillion in 5 years dems and obama 6 trillion in 5 years [google national dept]their was no serplus in jan 2000

  • Al Sieber

    I think hyperinflation is already here, 2 months ago it cost me $75 a day in gas and diesel to to run a small mining operation, now it’s $120 a day. the price of bread went from 2 loaves for $4 to $6. gas from $2.63 a gal. to $3.09, diesel from $2.80 to $3.50. a hundred dollar bill disappears like a $10 bill when you break it, luckily gold is back up over $1400. since I live in a remote area with no TV reception I didn’t know what was going on in Wisconsin until this a.m. I believe the “dollar” is crashing big time.

    • WayneT

      Of course it’t already here Al. This is Nobama’s inflation for printing all that stimulous money and the quantitave easing 2. better know as QE2. We all will have to suffer at the hands of the idiot who voted this wacko person in office. Do you remember Nobama’s (change we csn believe in) I’ll bet that that all the folks who voted for him never asked the question, what change is he talking about??? If I hired some one to work on my house and he came in and said, I am going to make some changes to your home. Wouldn’t you at least ask, what changes are you talking about?

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      Al, yeah gas is high here too $3.17__Coffee was $10.?? large can, $8 store brand, Reg soups $1.39__

      • http://deleted Claire

        Angel–our gas is $ 3.29 per gallon.

        • http://! Angel Wannabe

          Claire, the suckers are crafty at price gouging, the price goes up on the weekends.

          • http://deleted Claire

            Angel–Greedy —–!! We get gas on Tuesdays because it always goes up by Wednesdays. I read that clothing is going to be more costly, and the price of groceries certainly has increased. I am not surprised, money talks and honesty walks.

          • libertytrain

            I just spent 10 days at Ft. Bragg in Fayetteville and I can tell you, when I got there gas ranged from $3.04 – $3.09, when I left last Friday it had jumped to $3.21. I was terrified that gas would be that much or more when I got home. It wasn’t oddly, it was $3.08 though I expect it will raise up. I think in that area they raised it so much because most of the soldiers had 4 day weekends and paid for it in gas money.

  • Jim C.

    Having worked non-union manufacturing 35 years, I always believed there were good reasons for unions. I wonder if some of the despicable things done to me would have happened if I had had a union looking out for me.

    For instance. As a non-union county highway worker, I was laid off (without any compensation) solely because I had passed two tests for promotion. I told them they didn’t have to promote me. I just wanted to keep my job.

    Lacking any other options, I joined the Air Force to earn the GI Bill so I could complete my fourth and final year of engineering college. For the next four years, I worked 80 hours per week at an undermanned post. One month after I honorably discharged, the government changed the terms of the GI bill! All the schools I applied to told me that after 4 years in the military, my credits were too old. I had to start over. But the government’s new rule prohibited payment to retake courses, even if I had paid for them myself the first time! (I never did get the funding to finish my degree, and chronic health problems further interfered.)

    I applied my electronics education as a tech for a flight simulator company. Working on a device sold to the Navy for submarine navigation under the polar ice cap, I refused to falsify testing that would have put our sailors at risk. I quit during the middle of the project. The employer retaliated by telling employers all over town that I was fired for poor job performance. Meanwhile, I couldn’t get unemployment, because they told the unemployment office I had quit.

    I finally found a job as a tech at a medical electronics manufacturer. After getting sterling reviews and increasing responsibilities over the next two years, I was suddenly demoted. Not because I did anything wrong, but because the supervisor’s girlfriend (who worked for him) thought she deserved more than me. So they demoted me to accomplish that! They claimed the girl had filed a complaint about her pai with the EEOC, and couldn’t afford to fight it.

    A few years later, working for another electronics manufacturer I was laid off because the US government gave the company a research grant! The expectation was that the company would hire more people. But the grant required the company to come up with “matching funds”. They got the matching funds by laying off 30 people. To add insult to injury, they stole the $3500 in “matching funds” they’d put in my 401K, arguing I was still one month short of the three year vesting requirement. It was not my fault I didn’t complete the vesting requirements. That plea fell on deaf ears.

    Over the years I’ve also had THREE pensions taken from me. (US manufacturers don’t even offer them to people anymore.) I never had the money to hire a team of lawyers, and never found any interested in helping. Small potatoes I guess.

    Despite all this, I don’t believe that public employees unions should have the right to vote on their budgets, salary, or benefits. I don’t get to vote on those things in my private sector job. I take what they give me. I make $35,000 per year with 35 years experience in product development engineering. Benefits are poor to non-existent. But that’s what the market will bear, given competition from China, India, Korea.

    Teachers in NY State get $70 – 80K per year and incredible benefits after only a couple years. State Police TRAINEES get $70K WHILE TRAINING! I’m not allowed to work overtime, but State police in Syracuse get DOUBLE and TRIPLE OVERTIME to teach late night department classes so they can “boost” their baseline salaries, and increase their pensions. School administrators move from one district to another, and get bucked from $90K to $160K, at the whim of the school board.

    I knew a lot of air traffic controllers when I was working those 80 hour shifts in the military. Never met a bigger bunch of “prima donnas”. They were assigned a mere 4 hours duty per week, and exempt from all barracks cleaning details. The civilian air traffic controllers are mostly pulled from military ranks. I was so happy when Reagan fired the lot of them.

    Obama should show some hutzpah and start firing the “deadweight” in Washington. And the courts should get out of the way and let the Governor fire a bunch of state workers. Starting with the “bigshots” at the top of the heap, not the lunch ladies and janitors. They’re not going to balance their budgets by axing school music programs.

    • patricia

      obama is helping them, he is a BIG UNION MAN, what planet have you been living on??

      • Jim C.

        If you had read my whole post, you’d have noticed that although I think a union might have stopped some of these things from happening to me, I also said I thought the unions are out of control.

    • chow

      Man, what a sad tale you have? Your college credit were not credited because they’re too old? Which colleges did you apply to? I didn’t think college credits has expiration dates which means I can’t go to graduate school because my undergraduate was 30+ years ago.

      You were fired from your job because you passed the promotion exam? Wow, that’s really sad. I guess your message is actually saying let’s support the government employee union and bleed the taxpayer some more.

      • Jim C.

        It’s not like a liberal arts program! All the engineering schools I applied to after I got out of the service wouldn’t accept my old credits towards an engineering degree. They said engineering training, being highly technical, changes constantly, and the credits I earned my first three years were too old. They told me I had to start from scratch. Maybe I went overboard telling my life story, but I was trying to make several points. 1. Government promises aren’t worth the paper they are printed on. 2. Without a union to fight for your rights, or a good team of lawyers, you’re on your own dealing with employers, and 3. Employers will screw employees to improve their bottom line.

        Finally, if you had read my entire post, you’d have noticed that I objected to out of control wages, benefits, and bargaining power of the public sector (union) workers.

    • mickey

      I can agree with some of this, however, it just shows it is up to the individual to look out for itself. I can’t say any union did much for me excepting for one time when a stupid supervisor thought she could fire me for taking sick leave. I had over 1000 hrs on the books and only requested 1 day for 2 doctors appointments. Other than that, we have all gotten used to the corp should match funds. For what? Take the money out of the 401k’s because they will find a way to take it from you–whether you can ID your local or it happens at the FED level.

      As far as the WI unions, the teachers were asked to contribute to their retirement and HC. Big deal, I’ve always had to pay. As far as I can tell, there is no “strike” so why are there demonstrations? And these are backed by POTUS’s own people, literally?????

      They talk about 9 months pay but in reality it is only about 7 months considering the paid days at Christmas and Spring Break plus others. And take work home? I took work home, unpaid, for nearly 30 years.

      I have to laugh at the credit hour denial. I, too, got that run around. However, those classes were figured in my GPA.

      We only have the “pursuit of happiness” not the guarantee. Union or no union, there will always be a “threat” to someone who can influence decisions to the negative, leaving us with less that a better product.

    • Patty

      FIRING???? He is hiring. Not as many as John B. says but just look at all of the new Czar’s. And what is with that title. Czar? WT…

  • patricia

    the teachers Lied and called in sick, then had a doctor sign a form letter to excuse them individually without ever laying eyes or hands on them. each teacher who used one of these forms had to sign and date it. this doctor should be fired and then have her medical license revoked, as each teacher, and the union member who handed out the forms. who wants their children being taught by people who think it’s ok to lie,cheat,steal and falsify a legal document, because they evidently think they are above the law, what kind of medical facility or medical insurance company wants a quack like this on their rolls? and who wants to belong to any union with this much corruption going on,that their not afraid to commit crimes right out in the open? Is this what we want the next generation to learn, do we want our children and grandchildren to be educated in the fine art of CORRUPTION????

    • mickey

      Pretty poor leadership to have teachers line up and other professionals to lie when a child would get suspended. How many kids are in jail for the same thing?

      It’s time to redistrute those education funds to charter schools and private schools. This is the only type of redistribution of funds I agree with.

  • Angel

    ALL government employees as well as the union thugs need to take a pay cut. I am sure with all of the money they have ~ahem~ “earned” in the past, will get them through. Oh…so they have to cut a few posh luxuries…to bad. What do they think the middle class does all the time just to make it through?

    I think if we can make it on 35-50K a year…they can get by as well. How fast do you think we would recover then? Obama doesn’t have to pay rent or pay for his vacations…I think he can be the first to start with a pay cut and start paying his own vacations too as well as paying into SS and Medicare like the rest of us. Ya think? These high payed politicians that “do nothing” but protect themselves…let’s cut they pay…demerit them and start giving them warnings. After all. WHO do they work for?

    I heard it said, and I truly wish it would catch on…if NO ONE (for the exceptions of government employees) showed up for work for 3 days…and NO ONE bought anything for 3 days…would they get the hint?

    • mickey

      Exactly. And we can stay home and not buy anything for a week. Sort of a sympathy vote for justice.

      I hope these union teachers get their deserved “rights” because our state shut down schools. Never to return. Put lots of teachers out of work. Sorry, poor performing schools went “bye bye”.

    • JR

      Gee Angel, ENVY is such an ugly trait to have,
      Just because you did not bother to get the education others have and have to scrape by at 35k a year means others should not be able to do so either?

      Being envious of others is not the way Christ commands us to live our life’s.

      • Robin, Arcadia, IN

        JR… You are very mean spirited and you have no idea what anyone who posts here has been through or their circumstances. Your sarcasm is out of line also. You do not post to add to this ‘conversation’ but to hurt people and flaunt what you think is your intellect. Most of us can see what you are doing and simply dismiss it. But, I decided to tell you. You may not even know how you sound.

    • Robin, Arcadia, IN

      Angel..
      I work for a school. I am staff, not faculty. The teachers and administrators have all gotten their raises every year. Staff has not had a raise in 3 years. We are not unionized, for which I am grateful. I just wanted you to be aware that not all public employees are in a union and not all of us are paid at a high rate of pay in comparison to the private market. I really like my position and I am good at it. I don’t really want to look for something else, and at this time, there isn’t much else to look for.
      I read a lot of your posts and I know you are a fair person. I am not telling you this to put down anything you have posted, but just to let you know there are a few of us ‘little guys’ mixed up in this mess, but not really belonging there…

  • http://getgrassfedwheyprotein.com James go here for grass fed whey protein

    Calling the teachers and state workers the ‘gimme’ class is a good name for them. I resent anyone on a government payroll who goes to the capital and takes over the legislature like Egypt to protest cuts. They get paid by the government using coercive force to collect taxes for their wages. Unlike the public sector, we in the private sector can not hold a gun to our customers heads to collect money for our pensions.

  • BigBadJohn

    Due to pork barrel stimulus programs and bailouts for Wall Street, corrupt banksters and favored special interests, the Federal Government went from a deficit of $167 billion in 2007 to $1.8 trillion 2009 — an increase of 11,000 percent.
    ************************************

    09/30/2006 8,506,973,899,215.23
    09/30/2007 9,007,653,372,262.48
    That looks like 500 billion to me…
    HMMM wonder where Chip gets his numbers, or does simply make this stuff up to fit his agenda????

    Bush’s last year:
    12/30/2007 9,229,173,000
    12/30/2008 10,699,805,000
    Due to the banking industry crisis and the following bailouts.

    As far as pork goes it DECREASED from 2006 levels.

    http://www.cagw.org/reports/pig-book/#trends

  • bob wire

    Well it’s not about the money ! It’s about the money!

    Campaign finance money to be concise. ~

    This is an attempt to weaken “Unions” and their ability to support candidates, to defeat democrats nation wide by the starving of funds.

    While the Supreme that ruled Corporate American can remain ignominious and back any candidate with unlimited funding.

    Clever hmm? ~ You’re ability to select are voted for “your” candidate has been compromised yet once again. Unions are the single biggest democrat contributor while the GOP enjoys many.

    If was just about one state budget short fall and need for wage and pension concessions by these employees it would be over today as labor has agreed to these concessions.

    Wisconsin , gave your a 40 hour work week. Wisconsin gave you overtime pay. Wisconsin gave us unemployment insurance, Wisconsin gave you these things by setting standards.

    You enjoyed these things without “having” to pay due, supporting or even being a member.

    So, ~ celebrate boys and girls

    • BigBadJohn

      Nazism is nothing more than corporatism.
      Welcome to the rights vision of corporate control of the US government.

    • Scott

      Yea, unions give us so much. Like forcing companies to pay wages so high that they price the products out of the market, which in turn forces business to move overseas to bring their prices under control to stay in business. But that doesn’t matter, because the union go us a great deal on wages and benefits.

      Wages and benefits don’t means squat when the company that the unions were extorting goes out of business here.

      • Robin, Arcadia, IN

        Scott.. I agree. I grew in Michigan. Unions were big stuff there! Look at Detroit now. They got greedy and power hungry. They started out as a good thing, but not any more!

        • Patty

          Same thing for the mines in northern MN. Although I believe they are back up and running on a smaller scale.

        • bob wire

          hmm? Well I’d be the first to admit Unions played a part in this demise,but do you really think in was only union pressure and not more to it?

          • Jana

            bob,
            I am sure there are a lot of politics involved too.

          • Jana

            Both sides.

  • leeS

    Before STATES start cutting services to States citizens how about kicking out all the ILLEGALS in the state…wisconsin LUCKLY does not have many but many other state are swamped. Get rid of ILLEGALS and open up jobs for americans!

  • BigBadJohn

    Something to consider, I have been working in Canada for the couple months. Workers are still protected by unions, everyone is gauranteed health care and government has a virtually balanced budget.

    So how does this socialism affect the economy – they are kicking the USA’s rear end!!!!

    Their dollar is stronger, their exports are surging and they have some of the most stable banks in the world.

    So you can buy the bull that US workers are to blame for our problems while the republicans open the treasury to corporate welfare. I choose to think corporations are their own worst enemy.

  • Stephan F.

    “The elected elites on the State and local level recognize that they have pillaged their citizens as much as possible?” This is hardly the case — government’s will always try to bleed their constituents dry until they start hearing the screams & protests, and that’s what’s happening now. But the real point here is one of union power, so read on.

    Labor unions have been one of those taboo subjects that polite people aren’t supposed to talk about – sort of like asking how much your co-workers make or talking about another person’s race or religion. And most people consider the subject too complicated & boring. They believe unions are just one of those things in life you have to tolerate, like an occasional toothache, or indigestion. However, I can assure you there would be massive interests in the story if they knew the ‘facts’ about how these evil & immoral entities came into existence, the source of their power, how they operate, and what real negative economic & moral consequences they have inflicted on society. It’s been an untold story that’s totally ignored by the lame-stream media (naturally), and surprisingly by most of those who advocate for a free market. Why? Well, besides being politically incorrect to talk of such things, there hasn’t been a lot of easily accessible data or in-depth information about it simply because it’s a convoluted topic that’s been, more or less, kept under wraps by, guess who, the government & unions. But that needs to change.

    Just as the sheeple are beginning to wake up to the tyranny of the state, it’s vitally important they need to hear the full story about unions. Not one person in 10,000 understands the history & background of these shady & parasitical organizations and how they came to be. Once exposed for the fraud they are, and the dishonesty, corruption, illegal activity, violence, nepotism, malfeasance, racketeering & unscrupulous action they do (get the picture?), look-out for Tea Party-Act II.

    If anyone knows the story of unions better than Mr. Armand Thieblot, I’d like to know who they are. I’ve listed a link to a short six-minute video that gives a lead-in to an essay he wrote recently entitled: Unions, the Rule of Law, and Political Rent Seeking. It’s the best piece I’ve come-across (and I’ve read a ton), and it’s packed with mind-provoking facts & figures that give the reader the stark & unbiased naked truth. The beauty of it is that it condenses the subject down to a manageable size that even a non-scholar like me can understand.

    The time has come to shine light of day & expose these frauds for what they are, once and for all.

    Stephan F.

    http://www.cato.org/weekly/index.php?vid_id=158

    http://www.cato.org/pubs/journal/cj30n1/cj30n1-2.pdf

    If ever there was a blatant lie, the statement “This is not about us” ranks right at the top of the list. The teachers, police, firemen, and all government employees could easily take a pay cut or a benefit cut. Instead they want to suck the taxpayers dry. – Mike ‘Mish’ Shedlock, Sept 2010

    • bob wire

      “If ever there was a blatant lie, the statement “This is not about us” ranks right at the top of the list. The teachers, police, firemen, and all government employees could easily take a pay cut or a benefit cut. Instead they want to suck the taxpayers dry. – Mike ‘Mish’ Shedlock, Sept 2010″

      well, while I might wish to agree with you in part, ~ Tell me what’s to happen to me at 30,000 per year if the 50,000 per year labor crowd is knocked down to 40?

      Do you believe this will not have any affect on me?

      It seems at if labor is being pitted against labor in this zeal to correct disparity of budget short fall while offering concession to special interest and Robber Barons.

      So the plan is to bring the middle down to the working poor level and this is somehow going to make things better?

      That we have being financing a 10 years war that offered me and you few benefits or equity has been the single largest reason for these “short falls” ~ We have been exporting American Green backs like there was no tomorrow, greenbacks that never return back to the US.

      So today the GOP far right is going through Americans couch cushions, looking for nickels and dimes.

      I do want to agree with you, ~ I think it’s time the Public sector deal with the same budget short falls that we in the private sector have been enjoying since 1982.

      BUT! ~ this doesn’t really correct as much as you might hope it will.

      The top 2% wages earners and their army of bought off politicians, yes man and butt boys are taking over this nation.

      I’m not sure if that’s your vision or intentions but that’s where this is headed.

      It’s their plan to do to the public sector what they have done to the private sector. Release themselves of their their commitment and responsibilities to the work force with what ever means that is available to them. To lay off those employees soon to retire, to lay off those that approach their vestment time. ~ To lay off full time employees and replace them with part time employees, deny employees privileges such as vacations, overtime part, sick time, etc.

      This Right wing movement is going to reduce public workers to be like “ME”. To enjoy the same life that I have had to live since the mid 80″s

      Should I be happy about this? this sharing of the pain plan? Maybe? ~ But we need to realize, these people are going to pay less taxes, they are going to spend less money in the states that they live in. ~ This affords me even fewer customers as I struggle to capture my share of a market that is already receding.

      So where is our government going to get it money when the middle classes are diminished to just a shadow of themselves and can no long be sheep with a fine health coat of wool to shear?

      So we are basically fighting among ourselves over bones and scraps.

      Before this is over, We are going to be just like the Republic of Mexico. The few wealthy living inside gated communities and the majority left to do ~ whatever! ~ live a peasant life and make do the best you can to provide and protect your families while corruption, drugs, human trafficking of young girls, black markets and violence flourishes.

      That’s where we are headed today here in the US.

      I always enjoyed Mexico, ~ and up until about 1998, spent a lot of time enjoy the freedom a white man with a little money might have there, finding “justice” to be within my small budget. A comfortable life style that I couldn’t afford in the states. ~ But today , Mexico has exploded from years of enjoying a “small government” that allowed people to do anything they felt that they were big enough to pull off.

      These same forces are at work here today in the US.

      I think it wise to be careful what you wish for, for my might get it.

      • Jovianus

        Y’know…those guys who ran into the World Trade Center on 9/11…they were just lazy bums being paid too much and bleeding the taxpayer dry. Seems to be the sentiment on this board.

  • tahnee

    I have been reading the 2011-2012 perdictions from the site halfpasthuman.com
    It is a computor generated site. the download is 49 pages and has been accurate in the past. It is 10.00 but worth it. The things they said are already enfolding.

  • http://charden@neo.rr.com Charles

    You can go back years and you will see unions have been run by thugs.
    What ever happened to Jimmy Hoffa? The leaders, along with thier army of
    thugs have brutilized their rank in file. They got their members benefits,
    they knew down the road could`nt be paid for. At the same time they gained
    power for themselves and could threten anyone who got in thier way, including goverments.Communism and unions have gone hand in hand for a long time. Find out who the union Presidents are and pay attention to
    what they have to say and what they really stand for. Andy Stern President
    of the union SEIU, made more trips to the White House in the past two years, than you would like to know about.It`s no wonder, Obama and the
    the unions have such a great love afair.Now get this, Andy Stern has since
    resigned as President Of SEIU, leaving his union 85 million indebt.Through
    SEIU he spent 60.7 million dollars in helping Obama get elected. In helping the Democrat Party along with what he spent on Obama he spent close To 90 million. Some of that went to help getting Obama care passed.
    Now since he left SEIU where do you think he ended up? Thats right, he
    was appointed to the Deficit Commision by none other, than the dictator
    himself, OBAMA. Now if I was his rank in file, I would be pertty pissed,
    that he spent my hard earned dues in this manor. What about the Republicans that he represents, giving all that money,their money,to the Democrats. This is just one example of union abuse and goverment hooking
    up.Unions have no part in any type of goverment, city, county, state, or federal. In the past 20 years, they damn near ruined this country through
    their greed and power.

  • h. kirk rainer

    Deferring on whose to blame; “the right”, “the left” or anything in between….

    The truth is being displayed before our eyes; as Mr. Livingson echoes the present and possible parallel between the want for democracy over there (Middle East…) and the waywardness of democracy over here, we are able to realize that differences seem do diminish, even end, when personal and public life becomes intolerable or unbearable.

    The irony is that “public servants” are protesting–with their potential losses being benefits, security, etc. But these “potential losses” have been a prevailing reality for much of the private sector. (Yes, pensions and benefits, wages and job security has been diminishing for decades in the private sector).

    Not only is the government “teat” drying-up, but it looks as though the chickens that have come home to roost…have discovered that the farmer is a fox…and the farm, for what remains, is being privatized.

  • RiverRat2U

    Both Parties of Professional Politicians want a strong central government. If truth be known both want a one strong centralized party all the wany down to “Big Daddy” block captain. All the crap that is going on in Washington is a way to bring the independent business owners and those not under the perpetual care of Big Government to their knees. There is no shortage of JOBS,MONEY or Benefits for those employed,paid,sponsored or in “The System” by the Federal Government. This is not about socialism, democracy or a Republic. It is about raw controlling power for the POLITICAL ELITES.

  • Wayne in TN

    Teachers who are good teachers do not need tenure!
    Our school system was the best in the world prior to the NEA becoming involved, which took the focus off the students and put the focus on teachers!
    When unions first begin, they did a lot of good for workers. When they realized the power they had, they begin to abuse the system.
    Absolute power, corrupts absolutely.

    • mickey

      Yes,and teachers were given lead way due to length of service–without union involvement. Some states had good schools, others not so good, but the decline went much faster when the bottom became the standard, not the top.

  • Thomas Murray

    I wonder how much The Union Bosses paid those people (they bused in) to show up. Typical Socialist, wake up. There is no Money!!!!!!!

  • http://yahoo richard

    bob: until you editorial writers realize that it’s soros that is calling the shots not bernanke you will never stop them

    • eddie47d

      The Koch Brothers have far more influence in Wisconsin than your whipping boy Soros.

  • Don

    After I retired I wanted to do something. I graduated from college with a minor in secondary education so I applied for a substitute teaching certificate, which I got. If you want your eyes opened about our union hack teachers just join a table of them at lunch and listen, they are much more interested in what they can refuse to do rather than in any extra effort they might be asked to contribute for the good of the kids. Perhaps I’v been living in the past but these mutts don’t deserve the tirtle of teacher, they’re thugs. Very importantly, I want to make it absolutely clear that my comments DO NOT apply to the young new teachers or the those that are nearing retirement; the new ones are still idealistic the more senior teachers still have pride in their profession and are dedicated to educating the kids in their charge.

  • Larry Shepherd

    This is truly the ultimate in selfish misguided idealism for those in the unions and on government payroll. I worked for the government in Idaho a right to work state. I was a Probation Parole officer and often put in hours not paid. It is only through this venue are we able to keep the reality of America alive. I and my fellow workers have given up money and time to serve the people whom we have signed up to serve. It is irresponsible of these union people and the federal government to pander and cottle this people. They should be unemployed and see what it is like to struggle and scratch for our lively-hood. This kind of selfish action is appauling and demeaning. For teachers in a profession to teach and guide our children behave as they are doing. This teaches nothing about responsibility, to take their profession and degrade the purpose. I hope that Americans everywhere begin to realize that this is truly a fight for America and freedom. Obama has distroyed the American dream and put people, brother against brother. Oh what a legacy he will leave. He has demonstrated that our freedom is fragal and it doesn’t take long to put it on the road to distruction.

    • Dave

      So Larry,
      You are saying that everyone who works for government should be abused like you were, and not be allowed to join a union to fight it? It sounds like you didn’t get your piece of the pie, so no one else should either.

      • ValDM

        Somehow, yo’ve come up with a unique interpretation of his statement. You got “abuse”, and what I got was a statement of pride in work well done. No wonder we can’t communicate. You don’t have the ability to THINK.

      • Don

        dave people like you are the problem.

        • Patty

          Amen. He must be in the legal profession. Loves to put words in your mouth while his hand is in your pocket.

  • OKAY

    Obama once said that he owed the unions. Problem is that he’s expecting taxpayers to pay his debt to them. I think the teacher’s should be fired and the doctor’s handing out sick slips should loose their license. They had signs up indicating they were open for business to give out sick slips, which indicates to me that the union hired and brought them in to furnish the slips. Very unlikely they just showed up. Too bad there’s not a law in place to override what the Dem’s are doing. First of all, the cowards shouldn’t be shirking their duties but if they stay away for over a day, they should automatically be relieved of their seat and their pay should certainly be docked for the time off. Since it was a walkout, they shouldn’t be able to use vacation leave either. I’d venture to say that they’ll probably not be penalized monetarily. I guess Gov. Walker could call for a truce and once he gets them back, he could lock the doors and not let them out until the Repubs cast their votes. It wouldn’t be any worse than what the cowardly Dems are doing. They’d squeal like pigs.

    • 45caliber

      If my representative was to walk out to stop any legislation, then he isn’t representing me. And he can bet he’ll never get a vote from me ever again.

      • Robin, Arcadia, IN

        45 caliber.. I can’t imagine that every single voter in Wisconsin isn’t feeling this way, but I know I am wrong. There are some that have applauded the actions of these cowards. I cannot understand how this can not be against the law? Isn’t that like not doing your job, insubordination?

  • WayneT

    I listened to this audio at http://www.stansberryresearch.com/pro/1011PSISBBVD/LPSIM268/PR and they are predicting the collapse of the dollar within 12 month. It just may be a sales pitch, but it is still scary. At least it is sosmething to think about. This counry is in bad shape financially which we all will agree. Thanks to Nobama, and th other spend thrifts in Congress. The first important thing we need to do is get rid of all the spend thrift RINO’s and Democrats in Congress, or we are sunk. After we do that I feel that we will all have to bite the bullet, and get this huge debt paid off. I doubt that most of us will ever see it paid off, but we have to start some where if we want to leave out childen and grandchild a better place to live.

    • Dave

      They use scare tactics to sell their products. They were also fined 1.5 million for fraud in 2007.

      • Lastmanstanding

        Dave, and obama, geithner and bernanke don’t??? I’ll take my chances with someone who is a businessman anyday. The Stansberry report is on the mark.

    • Lastmanstanding

      Wayne T, you hit the nail on the head. It is, “something to think about.” The normalcy bias is a common thing. Lots think that an economy crash in the US just can’t happen. Well, make a decidion on what is happening right now. Do you feel comfortable with your position, life, where you live,finances, etc? What if it does happen, can you weather the storm? You must make a choice.

  • eddie47d

    Blame the workers,Blame the workers! Most banks are flush with money and refuse to lend. CEO pay is up 3-7% and they are getting tax breaks yet the economy is going further into debt. The anti-union folks are sticking it to the wrong side so who are their masters? The unions built the strong Middle Class and everyone benefited. The unions leveled the playing field for almost everyone and helped America prosper. The anti-union folks bring up a few bad apples over the years and end up shooting themselves in the foot. Corporations became respected many years ago also and payed good benefits. Now the corporates get the bonuses and golden parachutes and the workers get left in the dust. So who is really bringing America down?

    • ValDM

      Spoken like a true union guy.

    • Patty

      I am my own master. I run my own business. You should try it sometime instead of waiting for a union hand out.

      • eddie47d

        Do you employ hundreds of workers who may need bargaining rights or a mom and pop outfit? Not everyone needs a union and that is great but there are plenty of jobs out there whose workers do need a union or collective bargaining.

        • patty

          Mom, no Pop. I have worked for the “big guys”. Didn’t like it. Started my own company, set your own schedule, make as much as you want if you are willing to work. If you don’t have the balls to make it on your own, then I guess you are at the mercy of “the man”.
          People want good workers, and they are willing to pay for them. That much I have experienced myself. I am one of those employers. There have been tight times of late when I have not taken a check to make sure my employees get theirs plus bennies. But then, I haven’t hung myself with debt, so I can make it through some lean times unlike others including our gov’t. If a company is employing 100′s, you have no idea the cost for gov’t. mandated taxes on them. FUTA, SUTA, wk. comp. and I can tell you, my SUTA tripled thanks to giving people unemployment for 99 weeks. I have not laid anyone off, and as usual, I am picking up the tab for the slacky’s.

          • eddie47d

            Thank You

  • Laurie, Haslet, TX

    the democratic senators have tried to say that HIDING is doing their job for the “PEOPLE” of Wisconsin. The MAJORITY of which are NOT IN THE UNIONS!

    I hope that the REAL PEOPLE of Wisconsin again the MAJORITY have started those RECALL ELELCTION petitions in those Democratic districts and have them ALL RECALLED and new elections to have them replaced…

    • bob wire

      We in Texas have seen this GOP power grab and state congress quorum play before.

      In fact ! It gave the world “W” ! ~ That right! same part.

      It was about voter redistricting here in Texas and if a house vote was pasted, the GOP would gain 3 seats and the DNC lose 4 ~ or something to that effect. ~

      It was a cleverly crafted GOP power play, DNC state congress person hide out and denied them a quorum. Today the GOP speaks of the democrats shoving things down “their throats” seems to want to forget about these events.

      The end results was offered by the weakest link in the chain and the GOP got their way. ~ This allowed “W” to defeat a well liked Governor (Ann Richards) and to take over a state that was in excellent economic condition.

      This was the stepping stone on the march to the White House and America has never been the same.

      • mickey

        While I am no Bush lover, the results ended the same as it began. In other words, the redistricting took place anyway. To use a walk out, especially to another state, to spend one state’s money in another is just cause for dismissal. If I took money from my state’s treasury and decided to spend it in another state–to avoid doing my duty to my home state–I should be fired. Just another type of corruption, if you ask me.

        • bob wire

          Yes, in this case, someone blinked.

          and Yes it’s hardball politics. ~

          This could have be avoided if Governor Walker have approached it differently. ~ That he has chosen this course of no talks , no consideration, showing no consideration or respect, he’s has forced their hand.

          The outcome of this particular event is far form certain. Like I said earlier, it’s not about state money, it about the unions support of the DNC across the nation and the collective bargaining process.

          I do personal thing, many American are greatly over paid for they services. But this is not just labor. ~ When has CEO’s, bankers, and elected officials offered any concessions to shoulder the load other then the present “freeze” ordered by presidential decree?

          We have people stealing by the double hand full while we are calling out the crumb police to lord over scraps and bones.

          As for myself ~in the private sector, I’ve gave already and have little more to offer. This government is in deep trouble if it’s depending on me to spend.

          What bother me most I suppose is, ~ I keep hearing about un-funded pensions. I’m not exactly sure as to what that means , but it doesn’t sound good at all.

          Unions, need a good house cleaning, but tell me of what system of American institutions of any size that doesn’t. ~

          The DNC “allegedly” attempted to clean out banling and this notion of too big to fail. ~ It’s said , that the RNC blocked any meaningful change.

          I tend to think, the DNC and the GOP are playing “Good Cop , Bad Cop” with us and key figures of both parties are preventing any meaningful change.

          If there’s to be a bottom line, I don’t wish all working American to live as I have had to live. I assure you, being in the 27 to 35% tax bracket can’t be all that bad in comparison to what I’ve gone through.

          and what to happen when all the middle is dried up?

          • Jana

            bob,

            bob wire says:
            February 21, 2011 at 11:11 am

            We in Texas have seen this GOP power grab and state congress quorum play before.

            In fact ! It gave the world “W” ! ~ That right! same part.

            It was about voter redistricting here in Texas and if a house vote was pasted, the GOP would gain 3 seats and the DNC lose 4 ~ or something to that effect. ~

            Selective memory must be nice. This power play was first enacted by the Democrats in Texas by redistricting. They in fact sure had our county all messed up. The Repubs. were correcting the situation and if they could come out even better than before then that is what they did.
            Neither party is Lilly white in this situation.

      • 45caliber

        Ann Richards may have been “well liked” to you but certainly not to me. Nor to most of the people I know. She almost doubled the number of people on the state payroll without any increase in job quality. If anything, it has gotten worse.

        • bob wire

          And there you have it 45! How much concern should “we” have for other peoples “Job Quality”? If you cared then , why not now?

          Ann put the State of Texas to work and diversified our economy base in a few short years. Ann got us ahead of the curve and 43 enjoyed a comfortable ride and seems to enjoy taking the credit.

          Perry on the other hand did exactly what Gov. Walker has started out of the gate doing, ~ rewarding tax credits to the people that have put him in office and shifted the tax burden onto other to carry.

          The only problem with D1ck Perry’s plan has been a reoccurring 5 billion dollar short fall since 2006. It’s seem that he failed to steal enough for Peter to pay Paul and failed to expose or address his blunder, leaving us to where we find ourselves today under “conservative leadership” and sucking sewer water.

        • Carlucci

          Like the dyed-in-the-wool alcoholic, cigarette sucking, looney liberal that she was (Ann Richards), she also exponentially increased fees for all professional licenses. I went from paying $150.00 every two years on my real estate broker license to paying $500.00 every two years. Virtually all of it went to the general revenue fund, and hardly any of it went to anything having to do with real estate.

          To quote Bette Davis – “Only good things should be said about the dead. She’s dead. Good.”

          • bob wire

            Well, considering you are working with 2.5 % of 7 % percent of the biggest ticket item most American’s will every buy in their lifetime ~ I consider you a big cry baby for whining about it! ~ So what do you think about that? ~

            There is an anti up to be paid to be a part of the game King Fish! You want to be a part of the big league ?, show us your openers or work by the hour. Get yourself a paper hat and a 7.50 per hour job.

            You have no ceiling! no limits in what you can do, unlike most. I suggest you get busy and make it happen! ~ so your deal went south with financing? ~ Do you really think that you are the only one this is happening too?

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      Laurie, the Dems in Wisc, that are hiding out oughta have they’re pay docked as well!

  • Ken in Florida

    You rightwingnuts just care about the wealthy. When will you bother to consider the other 90% of the population?
    It’s time for the rest of us to wake up and realize the shenanigans you guys have been trying to pull. It’s time to bury you!

    • Scott

      This is all about the “other 90%”, you idiot. It’s about the people who pay taxes having to fork over more and more of their income to people who don’t deserve a paycheck. It’s about union terrorists using scare tactics and threatened state/nation-wide work stopages unless they get their way.
      The American people can no longer afford to support deadbeats and neglience in our public sector simply because these people have union seniority. Unions have to be held accountable for the quality of their people. And if they can’t, then they are worthless.

      • Patty

        Amen. Hey Ken – I’m locked and loaded. How about you? Don’t be too sure about who will be burying whom.

    • 45caliber

      Why should I be worried about the wealthy? I’m not wealthy myself. On the other hand I pay many thousands of dollars every year so others can sit at home and do nothing. If you consider me wealthy because I pay the taxes, then why are you asking me why I support them? Obviously from your stand point, I am wealthy and SHOULD support myself. If you don’t consider me wealthy (and I certainly don’t!) then I have no reason to support them. What I DON’T support are those who refuse to work themselves. And that includes union people who are featherbedding.

    • Robin, Arcadia, IN

      Ken… What are you talking about? I am far from wealthy and I only stand on the side of the right, not the wrong!

    • Lastmanstanding

      Ken. It’s obvious that you have given no thought to this issue. Do you realize how much the “rich” contribute to the local economies? They build homes with money that they have made. Do you know how many people, jobs, suppliers, merchants, etc. benefit from these folks? They do this “after” they have paid 30-50% of their income to the govt. Good God man, wake the hell up!!! Any one of us could give you an economics lesson, but it would be a waste of time.

      Guys like you will be the first to go. All you have to offer the progs is your vote, and that is all they need.

  • Patriot

    The time has come for all of us to ban together, we are all Americans and we need to Stop the bickering and educate ourselves to the real manipulators. This started long ago with the Federal Reserve Act 1913, the CFR (Council on Foreign Relations) in 1922, the IMF, the Bilderberg Group 1954. All administrations since this time have been filled with the New World Order people part of these groups. Until the chain is broken nothing will change, this is not about Republican or Democrats, it is about the Rockefellers who have been running our country since. Wake up and band together read “The Rockefeller File” by Gary Allen and then “The True Story of the Bilderberg Group” Estulin. Bickering is all part of their plan; we need to wake up before it is too late! We can change course we need all of us to see, we can make our founders proud, the work will be hard and long, We Can Do This, education of these truths starts with you! These books changed my life and have brought tears to my eyes and I will never look at things the same way again!

    • dstk

      @ Patriot” you are absolutely right! the powerful corrupt want to divide and unfortunately it is working. The people need to stand together, we are really not all that far apart except for a few of the wacko fringe…

  • Ron Szczotka

    I say fire them just like Raegan got rid of the traffic controlers.These unions are way out of hand.They are willing to see the State broke which is already in the red and they can care less.Get rid of the unions and the bad apple teachers period!!!!!!!!!

  • diane

    Get the community organizer idiot out of the white house and out of our once great nation….We need to put a stop to seiu , the muslim in charge’s pet group that voted dead folks, multiple times, etc to get this impostor elected illegally….You pool of fools that elected this idiot, do NOT vote again…What have you got from obozo anyway???ZZippeedoodah from what we see

  • http://msn.com Wizzer

    Gotta bust these worthless public sector unions! Privatize, privatize, privatize = competition & better results for all at a lower cost! It’s just a fact!
    Good thing I don’t live in WI, cause I’d arm myself for my own protection and go down to the capitol and piss off the top of the building… maybe bring a carton of eggs too. Revolution is coming, keep your powder dry! I’am not goin to take any BS from these whinning teachers… period! If they keep this BS up watch out! There are plenty of people who I have talked to who are fed up! We will shut down these schools one at a time until you leaches get the message. You won’t see it coming…

    The Wizzer

    • Anti Government

      Wizzer, you would be in the minority in Wisconsin. It is always the “right” that makes the treat of violence and it is the left that are willing to take to the streets risking their jobs to stand up for the their rights. The actions of Governor Walker is going to backlash on all the Republicans in Wisconsin. It is not about the budget it is about union busting. The Unions have all agreed to Walkers cuts.

      • 45caliber

        You must have a different union group than those we find here in the South. They are known to shoot people during strikes, destroy equipment, particularly cars, etc. But I’m sure your union is better, right?

  • Marvin Chapman

    Your comment about an 11,000 percent increase in the deficit is wrong.

    The actualy increase is a factor of 11 – or 1100 percent – which is bad enough!

  • kilrntex

    Cairo? One must think about what’s going on here as compared to the rest of the world. The Democratic Party was hijacked by the forces of evil in the late ’60s and now control the country. Look where it’s taken us. They made our educational system stupid with their idea of the perfect world where the haves give to the have nots. We slowed down the brighter students in order to give the illegals and the not so bright ones an advantage. The dumbing of America was the result. Wisconsin will be the first of many states to make a stand against the outdated unions. Let them pay for their own benefits like the rest of us do and be paid the same wages as the non union workers. If they were as intelligent as other Americans, they would not need a union. Trumka is a pig and even looks like one. He’s getting rich off all those idiots that pay him to eat and drink on their(and our) money. Fire all the Demo cowards who left town to demonstrate the vote. The lefties are on the wrong side of a real protest if it comes to that, such as in the Mid East. They want freedom and “we want it back”. There’s one other difference between us and them. They have rocks and we have arms! Many of them! Van Jones and Ron Gochez are calling for a revolution in America. That would be a stupid move on their part. Socialist are truly idiots. There are millions who would welcome them to try.
    Another thing, if Barak Hus”N”sane Obama would send the illegals back across the border, about 20 million Americans could go back to work. There are no unemployed illegals in Texas. They are living high on our hog. The Drug Cartels are starting hundreds of new businesses in the oilfield and guess who gets the jobs? More illegals get the jobs. Repubs and especially the dems are turning their heads, because they don’t want to lose the vote of latino. There’s even latinos pissed off about this! I would love for the unemployed in Wisconsin and other depressed states to come south and take up the illegals jobs. At least I could communicate with them, even though they talk too fast for us. LOL!!

  • Anti Government

    Governor Walker’s focus is on breaking unions. All of the unions have approved the pay cut Walker is asking for. The unions want to keep their collective bargaining. This not good enough for Walker.

    In its Jan. 31 memo to legislators on the condition of the state’s budget, the Fiscal Bureau determined that the state will end the year with a balance of $121.4 million.

    To the extent that there is an imbalance — Walker claims there is a $137 million deficit — it is not because of a drop in revenues or increases in the cost of state employee contracts, benefits or pensions. It is because Walker and his allies pushed through $140 million in new spending for special-interest groups in January.

    Walkers move is galvanizing the Democratic opposition. Since I live in Wisconsin I have seen people who have always voted Republican are now mad at how this governor has handled this manufactured budget deficit. There is a growing movement to recall the Governor and some of the Repulican Senators.

    As for the Democratic Senators who are out of state, they are demonstrating their civil rights and the rights of the unions. Since the Governor is willing to take the rights of its people, Republicans having both houses of the legislature, the Democrats are using the only power they have left to save the rights of the people and that is to deny the Republicans of a quorum in the Senate. If this is what the people of Wisconsin voted for (in a low turn out election) than put the striping of the peoples right to a referendum and lets get back to work.

    Even in Green Bay (a strong hold of the Republicans) when the Packers addressed a sell out crowd, Governor Walker was “booed” off the stage. He seems to have very little support of the average people of Wisconsin. Ironically he may be the best thing that has happened to the Democrats.

  • pilot007

    Welcome to the Obamaland of “change”. We the People need to continue to share and educate the rest of our citizens and adjust the course. We shall “change”our Nation for the better, and while we are at it dump the (un)Civil servants unions

  • Bob

    If your family of 4 brings in $60,000 a year and spends $76,000 a year with credit card debt of $110,000. What would you do? You would be FORCED to cut spending!! In Washington DC, the politicians who do this get reelected.

    If a company in the private sector loses money, it goes out of business. If a program in DC performs badly, it gets more funding.

    It is time to treat government more like a business and get rid of the programs that do not work!!!

    • Anti Government

      It is not like the State workers of Wisconsin have not, in the past, excepted pay cuts because they have. It is also a fact that all the unions effected by his new budget have also excepted the cuts. Make no mistake, this move of the Governor is about union busting not budgets. The Governor is in trouble. The state is on the verge of a major shutdown that is avoidable. The Governor also is forgetting that the National Guard is sympathetic to the workers plight. Governor Walker is insuring future Democratic dominance.

  • Patriot

    Why do Public Employees need a union?

    • Anti Government

      Good question. (I live in Wisconsin) My neighbor who is a Republican works for our local electric utility, he and 2 other workers went to the Village board to get a raise. These 3 pointed out that they were getting paid half of other local utilities were getting paid. The Village Board told these workers that they had had no right to come to the board for a raise. The board said they were only entitled to the cost of living increases. These employees then unionized and then were able to collective bargain and get a FAIR increase in their rate of pay. It is like the old saying goes “no bad employer ever got a union they didn’t deserve”. If employers bargain in good faith with their workers there would be no need for unions.

      • 45caliber

        As I understand it, if someone else is being overpaid, then you should be too. Pay depends upon work and the money available to the employer. If the city didn’t have the money, then why should they be insisting they need three/four times as much? If they didn’t like the pay they could go get a job somewhere else – and not take that job in the first place. When I take a job, I don’t expect to triple my pay in a few months or sit around all day taking things easy. I’ve seen people who take a job and then insist they are only being paid enough for them to work two hours a day. As far as I’m concerned they hired on by lying when they said that the pay was fine for the work. The sad thing is that if they do get a raise, they STILL won’t work more than the same two hours a day.

  • Hercy

    Governor Scott Walker: Bring this mob mentality to an end.
    The situation is expounding the already deceitful nature of these Doctors and Teachers.

    The attitude is contagious. America is harmed by so MANY in the Union
    disregarding integrity. Fill their positions from the Private Sector.

    Governor Walker: Warn, then FIRE every last one of these creatures.
    The USA is waiting.

    • Anti Government

      If Governor Walker were to fire all these union positions he would be looking at unrest like has never been seen. The Fire and Police Unions (not effected by this budget) have said they will go on strike. The Governor is in the process to destroying the middle class in Wisconsin. Wisconsin has ACT scores that rank in the top 10 in the nation so not all the teachers are doing a bad job. I do believe that unions need some reform and have like any other organization have not always worked for the benefit of the whole.

    • Robin, Arcadia, IN

      Hercy… That would certainly get the attention of every governor in the nation! I know this is coming to Indiana soon. Gov. Walker will set the pace for the rest of the nation. It would be interesting if he were to fire them all and then rehire them WITHOUT THE UNION. I don’t even know if that is possible, but wouldn’t it be interesting? Where I live, our teachers are not forced to join the union. Since I am not a teacher, I am unsure of how this all works. But from what I have seen of the unions, they are the ones causing the problems, not the teachers.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Robin Thats what I’m sayin, and will repeat, Chris Christie started it in Jersey, this is gonna keep going!_This isn’t all about wages & benefits, the Liberals never got over losing the election in Nov, so they’re bringing out the Union thugs!

  • Bob

    If the teachers and other public employees think that their jobs are so bad, they should get another job!!!!!

    Grow up people.

    • Anti Government

      Most teachers are committed to our kids education. Since the teachers have agreed to the pay cuts (in Governor Walkers budget), it is really about taking away the teachers right to collective bargain. I am surprised, I thought that a Conservative is in favor of peoples rights. Why do you want to take rights away from the people? Is it like in “Animal Farm”, “some are created more equal than others.”?

      • Robin, Arcadia, IN

        AntiGovernment… Collective bargaining is not a right.

    • 45caliber

      Exactly. But they can’t find a job with as good of benefits and as little hard work.

  • barbm

    teachers in wi make between $85,000 and 89,000 a year. for the 7 months they’re actually in the classroom working, that’s a minimum of $10,800 a month or over $7000 monthly for the 12 months. they can take a part-time job during the summer as tutors, waiters, whatever, they can teach in summer school which gets them more $, or they can save their money and take the summer off. i have to live on my social secuirty of $1060 monthly, so don’t ask me to feel sorry for the poor teachers.

    • Anti Government

      Again, why is it that I have to defend the teachers? I have had my fair share of problems with teachers that teach my kids but I can’t let the misinformation continue.

      Teachers in Wisconsin have an average salary of $49,051 in the 2007-’08 academic year, the state’s teachers ranked 21st in pay nationally. That was a slip from the year before, when they averaged $47,901 in pay but ranked 20th in the nation, according to the NEA annual survey.

      I am not asking any one to feel sorry for anyone. I just want everyone to keep the rights they have and that is to collective bargain.

      Barbm, I will also stand for you on your social security. You are getting screwed on the CPI that gives you raises in SS payments. This CPI is figured with-out the cost of gas or food. The real inflation is around 10%. This figure was changed years ago and should be changed back.

      • Patty

        If you want to keep collective bargaining, then let the one footing the bill also sit at the table. The taxpayer.

    • http://deleted Claire

      Sorry folks, I have a relative in Wisconsin that is a teacher and she makes no where near $85,000.00 per year. Try 42,000.00.

      • http://deleted Claire

        Regarding Wisconsin teachers–I found this on the Internet–

        Average Teacher Salary rank – 20th
        Starting teacher salary rank — 49th
        Average salary – $ 46,390
        Starting salary — $ 25,222

        • barbm

          i found this on the net. “Lechleiter-Luke makes $54,928 in base salary and $32,213 in “fringe benefits,” which include health insurance, life insurance and retirement pay.” that’s a total of $87,141. you MUST add in the bennies. here’s another. “Jim Nelsen, a teacher at Hamilton High School in Milwaukee who attended the union protests in Madison, told the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel that he thought it was “time we had to move and we did.” He earns $62,877 in base salary with an additional $26,492 in benefits.” total with bennies, $89,369. this is from a story about the current protests, these are not 2008 figures. tell the truth.

          • http://deleted Claire

            barbm–Tell the truth? Who in the hell do you think you are? I stated a fact about the salary of my relative. I did not go into detail about the benefits. What I posted was base salary and rankings. A lot of jobs do have benefits, I have benefits. Get off your high horse and find someone else to go after. I am not interested in squabbling with you or anyone else. I post what I want, the same as you–if you don’t like my posts, then by damn don’t read them.

          • Anti Government

            barbm,
            The problem with your example is that you have picked a school district in the wealthiest part of the State. If I had to teach in some of the areas of Milwaukee the $87 would not be worth it for me. You are using the high end of wages and inferring it to be the average. I could do the same because I know a teacher in Adams Friendship that has a base salary of $28K but this does not further the discussion. What about the non-union administrators that gobble up 30% of some school districts labor budget. I will remind you as I have others that collective bargaining works in both directions like what has been done in Wisconsin with the State Workers who are took a 5% pay cut 3 years ago. The truth is that we are in this together and to demonize one group does nothing to fix the problems. Governor Walker is part of the problem and he will be the reason that the Republicans will lose Wisconsin in the next election.

        • 45caliber

          Claire:

          Let’s keep things in prospective too. A $42,000 is for nine months of work. If they worked for 12 months their pay would be $56,000 – far more than anyone in my field can get in starting pay. That is the BASE pay and it goes up from there. Bad teachers as well as good ones get it – and they also get the same pay raises. So they aren’t really making that poor a salary. In fact, many who start work, even in engineering, start at 12 months at about $40,000 a year – less in some areas. I’m afraid I don’t cry for them. I also pay my own retirement – I don’t have a government entity paying it for me. The only thing I get as bennies is vacation (2 weeks a year), and insurance. It isn’t quite as good as government insurance and costs me about 4 times as much. I get no sick leave. I have to take vacation to cover it.

          • http://deleted Claire

            45calliber–Keep things in perspective? Good grief, all I did was post base salary and rankings. Common sense tells us that not all teachers make $85,000.00. And neither does anyone else in other fields of work. The “higher ups” are the ones hauling in the money. Benefits? I get 6 sick days a year, 2 weeks paid vacation, and I have been at this publishing company (family owned) for 45 years. I work a four and a half day work week. I receive 11 paid holidays. They pay my supplement along with several other older workers. They do this because they pay hospitalization for the younger employees. I realize that the benefits I receive add into the overall picture of what I earn. The money is decent but remember it took me 45 years to get it. I like my job, and I do a good job and I have been asked NOT to retire. I stayed all these years because I enjoy my work, plus I have an expensive hobby. About 30 years ago, a union representative approached the employees–we decided not to be represented by a union.

        • barbm

          but we the people must pay for our insurance and retirement. it’s just as though it were your mortgage payment. it’s not the tax payers’ jobs to pay that for you and you not count it as part of your compensation. you get the money to pay it, so it’s part of your salary.

      • Patty

        The average of 80k whatever includes their benefit package per year, not just their salary. The average private sector WI employee earns 62k per year. You need to compare apples to apples. You forgot a piece of their pie.

        • bob wire

          62.000 is? ~well~? high , TWICE above high for private sector here in Texas Patty.

          At least for an employee, someone with few deductibles, such as only interest and auto mileage.

          Now I admit I “touch” 90 thousand per year today , while back in 78 I was “touching or grossing” 175 thousand dollars per year.

          I’m very surprised that so many make as much as they seem to claim.

          • patty

            That is because you have the mexican border, and low cost labor. We have super liberals that love to spend other people’s money.

  • Astral

    It is way past time that OBAMA be impeached! He has been destroying this country and should never have been allowed to even run for President! Let’s see that birth certificate as all government workers have to furnish. Why would that idiot think he does not have to do the same? He and his wife have done so much disservice to the United States. Why don’t we impeach him? Why has the process not started? By 2012 the US will be gone — it so far gone now I doubt the country can be saved from total disaster. Why is the US meddling in foreign governments and providing funds when this country is broke , broke, broke by those theives in Washington who did it to us all!!!!! Sad thing is the taxpayers have the paying the screwing we’ve been given — how sick can this be??? IMPEACH OBAMA and toss out all congressmen and senators who have been in office thru the demise~!

  • Jay81

    I have about reached the conclusion that it’s time the American people stopped looking to Washington, D.C. for the solutions to our problems. The liberal democrats don’t have any solutions. Obama doesn’t have a clue as to how to address the string of problems that are plaguing our country and our world. He is totally inept and his administration is corrupt. His liberal allies on capital hill have no idea of what they are doing or of the world they live in. The mainstream media that supports him have long ago betrayed their responsibilities to the American people and are no more to be trusted than the news organizations TASS and Pravda in the old Soviet Union.

    If the United States is to survive as a nation, it will be because the fifty individual states force the federal government to wake up and take responsibility for its actions. The Obama White House, the majority of the Democratic Party, the unions in this country and the mainstream media are doing a number on the 300 million plus citizens of this country. For a start, we need to emasculate the unions. This needs to be done for a number of reasons, not least of which is that they are funding the liberal democrats. Wisconsin seems to have started the ball rolling. Good for them!!!

    Governor Walker is 100% correct in what he is doing in Wisconsin and the other 49 states need to follow his example. All the States need to get serious with the State’s Rights issue and with Nullification. The divide in this country is too great for the Republicans and the Democrats in Washington to bridge their differences. The American people sent Obama and Washington a clear signal last November and the administration didn’t get the message. The fifty States are going to have to take on the problem that the Conservatives, the Tea Party, and the Republicans are struggling with and losing. If forty or more of the States tell Washington, D.C. to “go take a flying jump,” what do you think they will be able to do about it? Sure, the MSM will scream bloody murder. They will tell us yet again that the Supremacy Clause means that Federal law overrides State law, but how will they force forty or more of the states to listen any more — especially when they have proved so corrupt, so inept, so downright stupid?

    No, the Federal government has gone too far down a one-way street to ever get itself back on track. It is now time for the fifty individual States to lay down the law to the Federal Government in words and deeds that they cannot possibly misunderstand. This is our only hope.

    • Anti Government

      Walker is the best thing that has happened to the democratic party in Wisconsin. His over reach will insure a democratic victory in 2012. The Unions have kept wages up for the working class not just union but also non-union workers. Your premise that the Unions are to blame for where America is, is preposterous. They are to blame for keeping the working mans wages at a livable level. Do they need some reform, yes! Should we get rid of them, No!

      I too don’t like the health care bill because it is a give away to the wealthy insurance companies. Obama, is far from liberal, he is closer to you conservatives than to us liberals. Most of his actions have benefited big business not the poor that you so want to keep down. The Dow Jones went from 7,000 to upper 12,000, not to bad for the fat cats. The rest of us have lost 40 to 50% of the value of our house. We have had to cash in our 401K’s just to survive. Yes, I am as angry as you but I cast my lot with freedom. Freedom to join a union, freedom to collective bargain with a bad employer. It is as been said, “no bad company ever got a union they didn’t deserve”. We are being divided by the wealthy elite that want all of us working at minimum wage.

      I to don’t like this mainstream corporate media. We in Wisconsin have been protesting this Governor for 5 days before the Corporate media even looked at it. Then the coverage is so “right wing” skewed. The unions gave into wage cuts days ago and it is still being reported that this is about wages that the middle class is making. It is class war fare waged by the corporate elite and the media is in their pocket.

      • Jay81

        With due respect for your opinions, your response to my response shows that the divide in this country between the left and the right is as wide and as deep as the Grand Canyon. I know that the far left doesn’t like Obama because they perceive that he is not carrying out their agenda fast enough and thus he is in bed with big business, etc., etc.. But be assured that we on the right don’t think that he is closer to us than to you. Most of us think that he is an absolute disaster.

        Your response seems to be aimed more at supporting unions; mine was broader and was aimed at the severe damage that the liberal agenda as a whole is doing to this country. Both the unions and the media are supporting the liberal democrats in undermining the foundation of this country. Be careful! We are all in the same boat. If you on the left manage to chop a hole in the bottom of this boat called the United States, we are all going to go down together.

        You liberals seems to adore European culture. But it is ironic that at a time when Europeans are beginning to reject multiculturalism, global warming, and the welfare state, the Washington crowd hasn’t even noticed the divergence.

        You said that you are as angry as I am. But anger isn’t my primary emotion; sadness is. I see the greatest nation that has ever existed being destroyed by those who act like greedy, petulant children and it really saddens me. I stand by what I said about the individual states having to reign in the Federal government.

        • 45caliber

          I agree.

        • Anti Government

          Jay,
          I was making a point that not all of us agree. I do think that with civil discussion and argument that compromise can be made. I don’t believe that there is only one road to success. I also don’t think if any of us were to sit down and talk that we would not come to core principal agreement on issues. I am in no way one that wants to scrap all that has come before us for a matter of ideology. You make it sound like I would embrace the European model and I do not. I do think that we can not with stand 20 and 30% increases in our health care costs. The question is what do we do about it and what Obama has done as I see it is more of the same and we expect that different results. Obama bailed out the car makers. Time will tell if that was a good idea but the car makers are in much better financial position after they screwed pensioners and bond holders (screwed both the conservative and liberal).

    • 45caliber

      Oblama’s idea of correcting a problem is the progressive’s only solution – throw money at it. If that doesn’t work, throw more. If possible, at the same time you also bribe those who appear to be in power so they will give you some money back in the next election. But just keep throwing money at it. Sooner or later, if you throw enough, it should get better. After all, no one is greedy, right?

      • Anti Government

        45,
        Throwing money at problems is not a solution but with the devastated economy that Obama was left with a stimulus was appropriate. I did not agree with wasting money but do agree with investing in assets only if the private market is not functioning. I am in construction in Wisconsin and I do know that after Bush was done there was “0″ private investors doing any new subdivisions. Is this Bush’s fault or Democrat’s fault, I don’t care! I do know that there is NO private work. So, how do you get the private sector going. I would argue these private developers need confidence that the economy is worth investing in. So, to that end someone has to get the economy going and the spender of last resort is the government. The government spending only softens the down turns but what it does is to is keep whole industries intact until the economy straitens out. The one problem is that if the government saves an industry that is obsolete this is a big waste of money and resources.

  • http://herringtons.home.mindspring.com lighterknot

    Reading this long thread I find no one has awakened yet …same old BS. You’re a bunch of sheepal lead by lynch mob organizer Rush Limbaugh, Glen Beck and Fox News. You don’t have a clue that the world has changed you would think by now that even a moron could see what’s going on ; 45 years of reckless devastation by big oil ,coal and other conglomerates and still the GOP is recklessly pursuing Lassie Fair winner take all politics. Which in turn violated the source of our health and security by destroying the habitat on which we depend. If the GOP returns to power and continues the Cheney /Bush polices …well I might live to see a bloody revolution …So wake up… what corporate America is doing to the American people is no less than treason.

    As far as jobs are concerned; we live in a totalitarian state of automation – robots and robotic decision making plus outsourcing …and if I stood in the church soup line I’m sure some pious ass Christen would say…“You look healthy why aren’t you working”?

    • Alfred E. Neuman

      Don’t worry. Someday you may actually have a HANGnot. Then you won’t need to visit a soup kitchen or be concerned about all those nasty corporations & politicians who have made your pathetic life so miserable. By the way, if a revolution does breakout, there’s one thing for sure, you’ll be one of the first to go!

    • 45caliber

      Go back to your boss in Washington and tell them you couldn’t get us stirred up into doing something you can arrest us for.

    • Robin, Arcadia, IN

      lighterknot… Nice try. You are confused sweetie… This is a right wing blog. Oh… we get a few left wing odd balls on here, but for the most part we are all of the same mindset. You must really have a bad life, or you really must be trying to rile up the folks here. Either way… have a nice day…

    • Carlucci

      lighterknot – FYI, I don’t listen to any of those “commentators” you mentioned, and you should never assume that others on this blog do, unless they say they do.

      And it is “Laissez Faire”, not “Lassie Fair”.

      Why don’t you subscribe to a blog filled with looney liberals like yourself, instead of attacking the people on this one?

  • spitfire

    I’m from Wisconsin, and the democrats have basically turned it into a police state. Nit pick everything. Force retired people to spend money they do not have. Then turn around and take their house and property. You do not want to get old in Wisconsin, they will sit you down interview you, ask you many stupid questions and if you miss one,you are then said to have demencia. This allows them to take control of you and all your assets. You are now a ward of the state.

    Now we have a Republican Governor, with a good idea about unions, and it is causing quite a mess. Any teacher that is not in class and doing their job needs to be fired. All of the legislators that left, should also be either fired, or lose some of their benefits. It seems treasonous to me that a government employee, would act like a spoiled child, and run and hide, because they cannot have their own way.

    Today, more than ever, the left is showing its true colors to everyone, who can see.

    • Raggs

      It’s going to get much worse.
      FEMA camps are the next step.

    • Anti Government

      Thank God for the us Progressives in Wisconsin. We have a proud history of progressive ideas that have come out of Wisconsin. We have been high-jacked by an extremist. For the most part people in Wisconsin do not support this extreme actions taken by this Governor. If it is an ideological fight to get rid of the government unions as has been said then why did Governor Walker exempt the fire, police and state trooper unions that supported him in the elections?? This is plain and simple political mischief or hypocrisy. I will say again that Governor Walker is the the best thing that has happened to the democratic party. The liberals could not have a better call to service than what this Governor has done and for that I thank him.

      • Raggs

        How in the world did you manage to wrap your head around that crap?

      • Robin, Arcadia, IN

        Anti Government… Your governor was elected in the same manner the governor of Indiana and every other state was elected. You better get used to it. He will be your governor until the next election, anyway….

        • Anti Government

          If a public servant is not doing work in the interest of the people he serves he or she can be recalled in Wisconsin. This can not be done until the official has been in office for 1 year. So, two things: 1) If it is the will of the people to take the right to collective bargain away then the Governor would embrace putting the question to a referendum. 2) If it is that all unions are bad than the Fire, Police and State Troopers Unions who supported Governor Walker in the election and are exempt, does this not look as political payback? The only reason the Unions are being gone after is a two pronged approach. First, the unions typically support democrats, and Second, it allows industry to lower wages to workers that will devastate whole communities.

    • 45caliber

      I agree. If they are going to strike, let them – along with the point that if they don’t work they don’t come back either. There are ways to make a point without causing others harm. Further, if they try to insist they are ill, they automatically get fired unless they can prove they are really ill – and I don’t mean by a union doctor’s excuse. They have to remain at home in the house or in the hospital. No walking a picket line.

      I pay the salary of my government employees. I don’t like to see that money wasted while they root for more money. With over half of all employable people in the US working for the government (feds, state, local, schools) how are the rest of us going to make a living and pay their wages too? Particularly when they usually get paid a lot more than I do!

      • Robin, Arcadia, IN

        45caliber… Great post! I agree!

  • http://com i41

    Claire, base salary may be $42,000, be sure to add all the benefits and also there is 3 months to work another job. Who in the hell else gets to work a job 9 months and take off 3 months vacation time in the summer. Most people that make $42,000 work 12 months a year, pay their fair share of insurance and don’t have close to the vaction days. Plus don’t forget the coaching positions at schools that add $2000-$6000 a sport, and there is ahell of a lot more time wasted on sports than learning needed skill. I was a transportation direstor in a school, and over half of my fuel budget went to shipping kids all all over hell for a hour game. If parents wanty Billy and Suzy to play sports, then they can pay the freight, most the time they go there any way. I started school the year before the schools were nationalized, very few teachers were unionized. We sure didn’t go to school and take basket weaving bull s–t classes. Every year scores and more lessss basic skills are taught. At least 30% went to college for energeeing, medicine, teaching and tecknology, and this was before student loans and afferminative action crap, and there were minorities that went to college at about 37 percent of graduating classes. Of course the more the government meddles the worse things go to s–t. It took untill the 70′s before unions got all teachers and test scores really went to hell. Unions protect sexual deviatants and has seen several leave with their liecenses and go to big s–t schools in Kal. or back east. The only queer teacher that every voluntary left on his own, had a couple of students who he had tried to assult, put a few rifle rounds thru a tree he was leaning on, waiting for a freshman boy. Unions in any feild protest the most worthless,lazziesty , and fraudlant group of workers. The “doctors” writing fake sick excuses should be barred from every practing medicine and all teaches that have got a fraudulant sick slip should have their liecenses pulled permantly. In the real world lying at work will get you fired, Wal-Mart and any business where you concont a story and cost the company money you toast, exept for overpaid union dinks.

    • Anti Government

      i41, If you are as passionate about the problems the schools have than you would be out front in reform. If I don’t like what is going on, I get involved. To say that one person can’t make a difference is wrong. I do agree that sports are EXTRA. I don’t agree that $42K or even $48K is to much for what GOOD teachers in Wisconsin. I as many of you would agree that we have no problems with Good workers. But remember the Governor’s budget includes all State, Municipal, Teacher and Prison Guard Unions not just the easy teacher targets. What about the Wisconsin Pension fund that was devastated by the actions of wall street speculators. No, don’t look at these criminals lets just take more away form our neighbors.

      • 45caliber

        A teacher’s $42,000 salary is equivalent to someone else’s $56,000 salary. It is fair for a GOOD teacher, as you stated. Unfortunately, due to unions, they also pay the same to the BAD teachers since it is almost impossible to get rid of them. Tenure is another bad thing; why should the schools be forced to retain bad teachers simply because they worked there a couple of years? Why should union officials even want to represent a bad teacher? Once a teacher gets tenure, many don’t even bother to try to teach; they are little more than highly paid baby sitters. They will present the material but don’t try to teach it. No wonder many of the students don’t learn and/or lose interest in learning.

        • http://! Angel Wannabe

          45 __My half sister was a teacher 38 years, her pay just before she retired was $81,000 a year___ and ya haven’t lived until, a protest ensued at our school district, and your on the taxpater side, and your half sisters satring atcha on the other, it makes for lousy conversation at family gatherings.

          • http://! Angel Wannabe

            45 WOW!__sorry for the errors typing too fast, Grand kids here today!

        • Anti Government

          45,
          So you agree that unions could and should be reformed?

          • 45caliber

            Yes

  • jopa

    My MY MY the Koch brothers have you all where they want you.Take away some more rights from the citizens.The right of collective bargaining.I thought most of you didn’t want your rights taken away.Sit back and think about this how the Koch brothers were able to convince you people the demons in America are school teacher, firemen and police.I think the union members need to get to the table and talk rather than have a dictator of a governor saying it’s gonna be like this so take it or leave it.You people should be ashamed of yourselves.

    • Raggs

      Do you really think that a taxpayer like me wants to support your retirement when I get squat?… I don’t think that I will support anyone regardless of what job title they have… Damm it I have to support myself and no union worker gives a flying crap about me! Who gives a damm if your special because you work for the state?

      • Anti Government

        How in the world did you manage to wrap your head around that crap? Depending on your profession your wages are directly determined by what is being made by your union counterpart. State retirement benefits are invested in the stock market much like your 401K. The problem of pensions are that they are paid as an open ended obligation and not fixed like your 401K. There is an argument to be made that this open ended payment needs to be closed but when it is in a contract like in any business it is a legal obligation. It is important to me that my neighbor does not lose his or her rights to organize, just like it is important that you don’t lose any of your rights.

        • Raggs

          Sounds good in print but as we know it doesn’t work in the real world when the unions gain political power instead of power by the people.. And don’t try to feed me with “The unions represent me” crapolie hogwash lie… The unions reprsent dough in thier pockets that come from my paycheck in the form of taxes.

    • Dale on the left coast

      Jopa . . . No govt employees should be allowed to Unionize. The said unions bribed the Dimmicraps with campaign donations . . . and surprize . . . got sweetheart contracts. Been going on for decades. But now the chit has hit the fan – states are going broke.
      In the Private Sector (aka Real World) . . . Union demands are limited . . . get over zellos and the Wealth Provider GOES BROKE!!!

      • Anti Government

        Wisconsin’s problem is not due to the workers salary or benefits. It is due to economy slow down. These workers have taken benefit cuts in the past and will in the future. It is a fact that all the unions that the Governor is going after have agreed to these cuts. The Governor wants nothing short of abolishing all unions. Remember, true collective bargaining works in two directions like what has been done in Wisconsin. It is not about the Money with this Governor, it is about busting unions. This is PROOF of why unions are important!

        • 45caliber

          Fine with me. Unions outlived their usefulness many years ago, particularly when they got the Syndicate and the Mafia involved.

        • Raggs

          So let me guess…. You like the unions because… you can spunp off of me when you retire at 50 and I have to work until I’m 90?
          You pat yourself all the way to the bank don’t you?

    • Robin, Arcadia, IN

      jopa.. Collective bargaining is not a right!

    • patricia

      when progressive socialists don’t get their way they babble like the idiots that they are. they don’t see the corruption in anything “they” do, but twist and manipulate the other side of the story. grow up, put your big pants on and suck it up, like the rest of us have already had to do. when you act like little brats you should get treated like little brats. calling in the socialists and communist groups shows us who you really are. those protestors could care less about their jobs or the children, its about union money for socialist politicians. stop throwing your money away on crooked politians and union bosses so the and rest of us don’t have to foot the bill.

  • American Citizen

    Every teacher and Senator who did not show up for the work they contracted to do should have their pay docked for every day they were not on the job. Then each teacher should be evaluated by the local school board and fired for not complying with the contract.

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      Yepper American Citizen, Docked pay or fired, johnny on the spot!

  • http://charden@neo.rr.com Charles

    lighternot,
    Why aren`t you working? I`m sure you have stood in many a soup lines.
    Just remember who are feeding you and keeping your Progressive sorry
    ass from starving to death. It sounds like your mad because you had hot dogs and wanted and demanded steak. If I went to the university of Wisconsin, I would`t be to proud about the Progressive movement starting
    there. You people don`t understand, there is no more money. All you progressives want to do to pay the bills is either print or borrow more
    money untill the dollar collapes. The world has changed. wE let you left-
    wing loons take God out of everything,Well,the majority of people are
    about to take this country back before you people destroy it.

  • Harry Sothern

    Don’t be fooled by these union protests – they aren’t just about helping teachers or any other union workers. Remember, Gov. Walker wants to make union dues voluntary – this doen’t sit well with the greedy union bosses. Neither are they happy about losing some of their bargaining power, better described as bullying.

    So they send out their thugs and get some foolish teachers to stay out of work in an effort to intimidate Gov. Walker and the Republicam senate. Not to mention the Dems in the senate who ran out of state in a dereliction of duty.

    Also their corrupt buddies from Obama’s group – Organizimg for America – most who don’t even live in Wisconsin – who helped in this circus.

    This whole thing is staged to keep the unions in power and try to demonize Gov. Walker from doing what’s right and necessary to keep his state from going bankrupt.

    Keep it up Gov. Walker, and don’t be bullied. Way to go, Gov. Walker and Republicans!

    • Anti Government

      Again, This is a power grab by the Governor to take collective bargaining. It is not about the budget. The unions that are being singled out by the Governor have conceded on the wage issue. The only thing left is collective bargaining issue. Governor Walker is the one doing the demonizing. There are no thugs at the protest in Madison. I took my family to it this weekend. The crowd on Saturday was 60 to 70 thousand. The protesters have been well behaved. What Governor Walker is doing is handing the Democrats the State for the 2012 elections.

  • http://jyrine@comcast.net George

    Unions have done good things in the past for the workers in the U. S. but now they have become too powerful and they are abusive. They are one of the reasons manufacturing jobs have left our shores anlong with this abusive goverment and their regulations and taxes.
    This Muslim an illgeal occupant of the white house from Kenya is doing what he planed to do from the get go. I have him on video tape telling that he is a Muslum, also telling that he was borne in Kenya and is not an American citizen. I am telling what I saw him say on video himself and I am not slandering him just reporting the facts. He planes to turn this country into a muslum nation and take all of our freedoms away. That is what he was saying when he said we need change. I am afarid that we will see what is going on in wisconsin all over the country soon and sooner that we might think. The quikest way to overthrow any nation includeing this one is ruin their ecconomy. He has done a outstanding job of that so far. Then violent and bloody reveloution will follow, and the muslims will take control of the society. Looks like things are going like they planed them to at this point. I hope that we the people will be able to stem the tide of all of his evil and take our great nation back.
    One last thing I am a Marine from yester year and I love this great country and my freedoms that I have. I am not as mean and not as lean but I will die on my feet fighting for my wonderful country and freedoms cause but I will never live on my knees.

    • Anti Government

      Since the fall of membership in unions high in the late 70′s the workers of the United States have seen a real decline in their wages over the same period. All of you are willing to make radical changes in respect to the unions but the out come may not look like what you want. It is common for people to hold down multiple jobs to make a living so now as income falls what are these people to do? All the while the wealthy have made huge gains. The productive gains made by business have not been shared to the workers. This model is not sustainable.

  • crystal

    My son is taking U.S. History in school. Even he can see the difference between Unions at the turn of the 20th Century compared to now.

  • Raggs

    Union employees are pissed because they can’t have lobster with thier caviar… I say F-UM!.. They retire at 50 and are set for the rest of thier lives, I have to work until I’m 90 to pay for it.

    • Anti Government

      I’d hardly say that $42 per year affords you lobster. I can agree with you Raggs that retirement at 50 is not sustainable and has been changed already in most unions.

      • Raggs

        So… Why do you gripe when the private individual makes less and pay’s more? not to mention all of the benefits that union members get.
        What grounds do I give the unions? It’s an entitlement program much as the same as our elected officials. What the hell does it take for people to understand that we have a sorry excuse of a president and a people that think that they are too good to wipe thier own ass.

  • Jeremy Leochner

    Personally i’ve always believed more in the idea of more taxes and less spending. I figure more goes in less comes out our budget will be better balanced. Of course the trick is what to cut and how much to raise. We must be carful with cuts such as education, police forces and other sorts of services essential for the general welfare of the people. Perhaps it might be possible to lessen funding for programs like Ametrak if first some alternative were found. One intresting idea i’ve heard going the rounds is both the possibility of Legalizing Marijuana and placing a tax on it. As a student of the DARE program I have always been an ardent opponent of legalizing or allowing drugs that are unpredictable, unregulated, taboo, or risky. However I have come to see the capacity to develop better methods of consuming THC in forms that are less harmful or risky to the body provided of course rules are in place to ensure that those under the age of 18 cannot consume them as potential risks to such young bodies Id rather not take a chance on. If it could be legalized perhaps less funding would be needed, at the very least less would be needed in that field, and perhaps it could be dedicated to other more harmful drugs. Combined with the possibility of raising taxes on the substance, revenue could be gained. Those who support the legalizing of the drug and who use it medicinely and responsibily would I think welcome the tax so long as they can legally obtain that which they use for their own health benifits. For those who dont partake in the substance any tax on it would I think be no skin off their nose financially provided the Civic and Medical authorities do all they can to ensure proper reasonable use of the susbstance by lawful adults. Perhaps such a scheme could lessen the budget problems and reduce the risk of protests and riots by fearful people trying to make a change in their lives. If things could be improved there would be no need for fear and anger towards the national or state governments or the economic system.

  • MiHood

    Bob,

    I’ve been reading your blogs for a few months now. Why do you call yourself an “ultra conservative”. Why not just a “constitutional conservative.” Isn’t that what many of the signers of our constitution were? Just because much of the media uses contrived terms to put people in a box so as to discard them, doesn’t mean we need to embrace their definitions. Just wondering? Have a good day.

    MiHood

    • Jeremy Leochner

      I agree MiHood.

  • http://hotmail LittleChikin

    Collective bargaining by the Union is a violation of the individual rights to make their own decision.

    The Keynesian economics practiced here by which every individual under the same banner are made to pay dues and there’s no alternative around that.

    Private companies are forced to comply with the union rules and often pay workers for their healthcare which is not bad since they do experienced cutbacks and paycuts when the going is not good. The workplace under a union has no creativity you normally find under a normal workplace.

  • Dennis

    Funny how everyone wants fiscal responsibility, until that is, it hits them personaly then all of a sudden its ,yikes lets protest ,its hurting my pocket book.These teachers used their students to protest.They had no idea what was up.Hey its a day out of school right? They should be ashamed.If we want some change then your going to have to give a bit sheesh.Wake up America

  • Raggs

    The biggest issue here is that the union workers think that they are entitled…. Entitled to what?… Sence when are they any better than anyone else?

  • Raggs

    For all of you union workers….
    Quit sucking a dry tit!

  • Henry Ledbetter

    I know a few teachers in our neck of the woods that refuse to be a union member and I have all the respect in the world for them. I pray that many teachers will see the handwriting on the wall and refuse to be a part of the corruption that unions have become. Some teachers are so obsessed with the prospect of not getting tenure.that they are driven to kill those that might vote against them. It happened in our state last year. Of all people, teachers need to be terminated if their teaching is detrimental to our children.

  • http://PERSNNELLIBERTYDIGEST paguespring

    After 3o+ yrs living in the USA and watch what LIBERALS/DEMOCRAPS/PROGRESSIVIST doing I must say liberalism is really a mental disease…Even former head of KGB PUTIN gave warning to OBAMA…..

    • Jeremy Leochner

      Paguespring How is ones political or ideological leaning a mental disease. If someone is advocating extremist policies simply for the sack of action or proposing ideologies with no basis in reason or reality that could perhaps be called evidence of mental instability. However one who believes in liberalism or believes in the idea of progress or one who believes in the ideas of the Democratic party are not mentally diseased. No more than anyone who believes in conservatism, steady status quo, or the ideas of the Republican party or any political party can be called mentally diseased. While people may disagree with basic methods of or certain policy proposals or stated beliefs of certain people or parties that disagreement alone dose not mean that those parties are mentally or emotionally or intellectually inferior. Unless you wish to fundementally question the integrity of or the basis of those ideals you cannot call them a disease. Unless you believe the desire for liberty is a disease you cannot call liberalism a disease. Unless you believe the idea of progress is a disease you cannot call progressivism or progressives diseased. And unless you believe every single member of the democratic party and anyone who agrees with their ideas is mentally diseased you cannot call them mentally diseased. Just as belief in conservation, status quo and the republican party are not diseased so arent the liberals or progressives or democrats. Individuals can be mentally diseased not parties, political groups, or political leanings.

      • chuckb

        huh? are you for real?

        • patty

          No. He is just an ubber leftist trying to dazzle with complete BS, as usual.

      • Jeremy Leochner

        Chuckb, Patty, with all due respect I am stating that a political ideology is not a measure of insanity. In my mind the argument that liberalism is a mental disease makes as much sense as an argument that conservatism is a mental disease. I say this because it seems to make sense. If you can present an argument conclusive enough to prove that all liberals-since all liberals by definition believe in liberalism- are mentally diseased I would be happy to discuss it and perhaps understand the argument I posted against. Until then I stand by my argument that unless you can prove that every single person who even remotely believes in a particular ideology is mentally diseased you cannot successfully make the case that an entire political ideology is nothing more than a mental disease.

        • patty

          Why does it take you so long to try to convince someone, in too many words, that you are not mentally deficient? It is like you have a term paper that has to be so many words, and you ran out of thoughts, so you kept repeating the same thing.
          It seems to me that liberals have this imaginary utopia through “social justice”, but yet, for all of the social programs that trillions have been spent on, not one of those programs have accomplished the task they set out to do. Not one. The definition of insanity is repeating the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. Maybe that is what they were getting at when insinuating your thought process was mentally deficient.

          • Jana

            Patty,
            Have you ever noticed that liberals manipulate the truth even when facts are presented to them? It’s just like Clinton, when you lie about something often enough you can actually fool some of the people, and maybe most of the people.
            I agree, there is something inherently wrong with someone who practices lying, believes lies, and lives and pushes those lies forward. The truth is just not in them and they see truth as twisted.

      • Allan Halbert

        It is a mental disorder when one wants a world that is different from reality, expects others to want the same thing and pay for it, and is willing to force them or bring down the system to do it. Significant irrational checkpoints have to be passed to go down that road.

        • Patty

          Like in a sociopath?

  • JeffH

    Muslim Cleric Plans Protest in Attempt to Spread Sharia Law
    Anjem Choudary, who once said “the flag of Islam will fly over the White House,” says he will lead a demonstration in March rallying Muslims to establish Sharia law across the United States.

    “The event is a rally, a call for the Sharia, a call for the Muslims to rise up and establish the Islamic state in America,” Choudary told London’s Daily Mail in an interview.

    Choudary, who is the former leader of the outlawed British-based group Islam4UK, says the March rally at the White House is being organized by the extremist group Islamic Thinkers Society, which is based in New York.

    The East London-based cleric’s anti-American stance is well-documented. Last year he led protesters in burning the American flag outside the U.S. embassy in London on September 11.

    Two other British extremists, Abu Izzadeen and Sayful Islam, have also been asked to speak at the demonstration.

    Izzadeen is the hate preacher who caused fury last year when he called British soldiers ‘murderers’ the day he was released from jail after a three-and-a-half year sentence for inciting terrorism.

    However, whether the three will be able to enter the U.S., especially Izzadeen, remains to be seen. Even a tourist visa requires applicants to answer questions on whether they have been involved in acts of terrorism or plan to commit crimes in the U.S.
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1358792/Anjem-Choudary-lead-White-House-protest-calling-Muslims-rise-up.html

  • Tinman

    The little boy b1tch is using these piss ants to move us away from the real problems! As the dollar is falling from the world reserve, muslims goat (offensive word removed) are starting to take over, jews are selling us out in N.Y., Inflation is revving up, minorities think that because there is a goat (offensive word removed) in the white house they deserve more freebies and all this while the dollar is fiat. He is a thug and will call for Martial Law when he starts one of his fires. Remember in one of his speeches “if they bring a knife, you bring a gun”. America deserves better then a ghetto thug(like al and jesse). Soon is the time for all you talkers to Put Up Or Shut Up. If you do not serve to right America then you do not belong here after.
    As for spell check and grammer
    Blessed is the Oath Keeper.

  • independant thinker

    Here is a little something that might be of interest concerning one or our more famous presidents.

    “The employer [of government workers] is the whole people,” FDR wrote in a 1937 letter. Government employees, he continued, have
    “the obligation to serve the whole people, whose interests and welfare require orderliness and continuity in the conduct of Government activities. This obligation is paramount. Since their own services have to do with the functioning of the Government, a strike of public employees manifests nothing less than an intent on their part to prevent or obstruct the operations of Government until their demands are satisfied. Such action, looking toward the paralysis of Government by those who have sworn to support it, is unthinkable and intolerable.”

  • chuckb

    ind. thinker, be careful in what you say, you are relating to the god of liberalism. if the progressives of today find out their god was against gov employees having collective bargaining they could have serious reactions.

    • independant thinker

      Maybe it will put them into anaphalatic shock (or however the heck you spell that). And I mean no disrespect to those who have serious allergies and are suseptable to it.

  • Infidel

    What was the Phrase “For the KIDS”

  • Infidel

    Why not have choices? The LIBS refuse to allow Choice! You can have
    a choice in Doctor,Attorney and Dentist in America! Why not a choice
    of Union or Nonunion?

  • suzanne hunter

    Wow, we really did see this coming. Kudos to Wisconsin’ governor for holding his ground. Let the bastards get fired. I’m sure there are plenty of out of work teachers who would love to have a job. I teach at the college level part-time. I would love to have a full time job and I really do care about the kids. Sure hope California’s teachers union is next. The unions are way too powerful nowadays. I don’t think Governor ‘Moonbeam’ will help our cause here in the late great state of Calimexico.

  • Anti Government

    Republicans – the original Unionist!!!!!!!

    Presidents Day 2011: What GOP Executives Knew That Scott Walker Does Not

    MADISON-On Presidents Day 2011, we remember what Republican executives from history understood that Scott Walker does not.

    We start with the original Republican, Abraham Lincoln, who, by the way, tried to prevent a quorum in the Illinois Legislature in 1840 using the exact tactics currently being used by Wisconsin’s Democratic senators.

    Lincoln said, “Labor is prior to, and independent of, capital. Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if labor had not first existed. Labor is the superior of capital, and deserves much the higher consideration.”

    As governor of California, Ronald Reagan, meanwhile, actually SIGNED legislation establishing collective bargaining for California’s municipal and county employees. In 1968. Reagan had served two terms as president of a union, the Screen Actors Guild.

    Teddy Roosevelt said in 1914 that, “It is essential that there should be organizations of labor. This is an era of organization. Capital organizes and therefore labor must organize.”

    And then, of course, there was Ike, Dwight D. Eisenhower, who may have anticipated Wisconsin’s current governor when he said, “Only a fool would try to deprive working men and working women of their right to join the union of their choice.”

    • patty

      You said it. Choice. Those teachers do not have a choice to be in a union or not. If they want the job they are in. So, exactly who took their choice away?

  • Bob

    The private sector makes things. The government does produce anything. It hinders the production of everything. That is why so many jobs have left the USA. Big government people want more and more people to be dependent on government. Pretty soon we won’t produce anything and most of America will be waiting in line for a bailout. That is bankruptcy. Is that what you want lefties?

    • Anti Government

      Bob,
      Business’s are going aborad for cheap labor. These business’s have chosen profits over patriotism. Companies like Halliburton moved their head quarters to a Muslim country Dubai, UAE. This way they can work with Iran with out interference of the US. Traders!! Companies have sold their own workers down the river and moved whole factories to China. Traders!! You can say it is due to big government, I say it is GREED.

      • patty

        Maybe if the gov’t. didn’t tax and regulate companies out of this country, more would stay. Do you have a 401k or any stocks personally? Those companies answer to stock holders, yes probably you yourself are a stock holder in many of the companies that have left. So, you need to count yourself in that greed pot. If you had 100.00 to invest and your choice was a 10% return or a 1% return, where would you put your money?

        • Anti Government

          My investments are in land and livestock in the USA. I am not part of this greed!

          • patty

            Ditto here except for the livestock. I have not put dime 1 into my 401k since 2001. Cash, gold, silver and if I could get my $$ out of that 401k I would have done it a long time ago.

  • chuckb

    anti gov.

    i say it was the cause of environmental laws and unions.

    hopefully walker will put a stop to this nonsense and this will spread across the nation and we can get our schools out of union control. if the private sector wants and needs unionism, fine. they don’t belong in the fed and state employment.

  • Allan Halbert

    Good points. One earlier comment by Kinetic, I believe, said that teachers deserve more pay because they’re “more educated”. What we do is a choice in our free country. Pay is related to market value, not liberal priorities. Police may be less well educated or not, but the fact that they risk their lives makes them at least as important to my pocketbook. And how about performance? Most teachers don’t want to hear that word. I submit to teachers that if their performance was better today than it is, the public would be more sympathetic to their position! This issue is on many Americans’ minds — value for their dollar, especially when every dollar counts. If teachers think administration is the problem, they need to work elsewhere or organize against the administration. They’d probably get a lot more support when it came to their pay and benefits. Where in the private sector can workers come in and set their own priorities? Is it any wonder that the popularity and respect for unions is at a low? People can’t relate to that behavior. And stop whining please! Dealing with parents is dealing with the public, which many students’ parents do every day in some form. Talk to a landlord about how some tenants behave. There’s people with low standards everywhere, but some of us don’t feel it is productive to spend so much time complaining about it. We remain landlords if the pros outweight the cons. We accept reality and try to make the most of what we have, rather than gripe about what we don’t have – the standard liberal mentality. And why is there a lack of discipline in schools? I think liberals have liberals to thank for that, and their liberal lawyer friends who encourage those litigations. Liberals eventually undermine themselves. Unions, aside from their systemic corruption, have stacked up too many unsustainable benefits, and that is the issue in Wisconsin and potentially quite a few other states. What is always humorous to me is the solution given by union folks to the unsustainability built into state constitutions, workrules, etc. They always think that if government spends MORE, people will be happier and change their behaviors, eliminating the problems. One example is the Honolulu Symphony, 7th oldest in America, which just went out of business. When the symphony reached nearly $1 million in actual payroll arrears, management suggested cutting some combination of pay, number of musicians, or number of performances. Unbelieveably, the union head’s response was that management should RAISE pay, making the musicians happier, the music sound better, and attracting more concertgoers. Such folks always know how organizations ought to spend their money.

    • Jana

      Allan H

      Great post.

  • http://charden@neo.rr.com Charles

    Allan Halbert,
    Very well spoken. You covered it very well.

  • http://charden@neo.rr.com Charles

    Jermy,
    There isn`t a Democratic party anymore. It`s been hijacked by
    the progressives, so don`t call yourself a liberal Democrat
    any more. Call yourself a Marxist, Socialist, Communist Progressive.

    • Al B Tross

      No, the Dems are the center-right, and the Repubs are Right, and the Tea party is Fascist. I know because I am a REAL socialist

      We believe in hard work, we believe EVERYBODY WORKS, especially the fat cat property owners, since when does “owning” mean you actually WORKED for it? Just because you were lucky enuff for Mommy and Daddy to leave you rich is no basis not to get you hands a little dirty.

      What are you going to sell when you have no means of production? Mortgage Derivatives!! Look how great that worked out you Capitalists…

  • http://charden@neo.rr.com Charles

    Chuckb >>>>>>>>>> AMEN

  • http://Illinois'17th Old Henry

    On Saturday, 2/19/11, I got to wondering WHO is paying for these “teachers” expenses. Meals, motel rooms, etc.

    If the Wisconsin taxpayer is footing the bill for this nonsense via state credit cards he needs to immediately pull the plug on that b*ll sh*t.

    How about doing like the police did back in the 60s and use high pressure water hoses on thes dirt bags? How about rubber bullets?

    Govenor Walker nees to have his Attouney General’s office begin copiling a list of names of who did not show up for work and who was protesting in Madison and then FIRE all of them.

    They also need to go after the “doctors” who have been writting those fraudulent sick notes. Those doctors need to be prosecuted and stripped of their license to practice.

    • Jana

      Old Henry,

      Any teacher demonstrating like this should be docked their pay for these days. Those phony Dr. slips that they are passing out are falsified documents, and should also be a firing offense.

  • jopa

    The way the polls are looking it looks like Walker will be taking a hike soon.This is what happens when people don’t take the time to vote.They end up with a dictator in office and then have to go through the process to boot him out.This is a wake up call for all hard working Americans union or not to get the republicans out of office before our country is totally destroyed.They give tax breaks and take all regulation away from the big banks insurance companies and big oil and call our teachers, police and firemen the demons that ruined America.I don’t think so.Wake up America

    • Jana

      jopa,

      What polls?
      Talk about blind to the truth!

  • American Citizen

    @jopa, boy are you wrong. All the people are asking is that the governments get their fiscal houses in order. That’s what the governors are trying to do. Do you really want to pay more taxes? Why should those who work in the public sector get a free ride? We had to provide for our own retirement and also paid part of the health premium. Get real.

    • Al B Tross

      You and Jopa agree, fiscal houses must be in order, it is just the means that you are debating.
      If you look at the numbers, Jopa’s argument holds more water, more is being given away by the taxpayers, to subsidize private ventures, than is saved by cutting state workers benefits.

      But you choose not to do the research, and ignorance of reality is your right.

  • mark

    You want to cut the budget. Cut the defense budget by at least 70%. How about getting out of Afghanastan, Iraq and all foreign countries. Tear up all defense treates, quit being the world policeman. Eliminate foreign aid! Only American citizens can get gov. services Build a strong border. Expell all illegal alliens! Make USA, Fortress America and only trade with ourselves. Bring back manufacturing and have economic and social justice for all American Citizens!

    • Jana

      mark,

      Thank you, that’s exactly what we have been saying!

  • http://charden@neo.rr.com Charles

    jopa,
    Wrong again, The Rausmuten Poll which is the no 1 poll in America has
    Gov.Walker ahead by 10 percentage points. ( 48% to 38% )Why can`t
    you progressives get anything right? You must be reading the
    Huffington Post Or New York Times again. Jopa, who do you think
    is spending all the money in Wash. Obama is the first president
    we ever had who is a Marxist. Like I told you before do your homework.

    • Al B Tross

      Rassmussen has been found to slant the wording of the questions to favor any outcome the sponsor of said poll desires.

      Just pleasing the customer, it all good business, eh??

  • jopa

    Charles;The poll you are talking about is always leaning towards the conservative side do some real research.Mark: You are 100% right but the republicans want to even add more to the defense budget.70% may be a little high.

  • jopa

    American Citizen;Girl are you wrong, they also want them to give up collective bargaining.

    • patty

      They should lose it. The people who are footing the bill (the taxpayer) are not sitting at the table. It is a bunch of gov’t. employees sitting there figuring out how much they can screw the taxpayer and not make them squeal.

      • Al B Tross

        so, these workers are not also taxpayers?? are they not citizens either? do you not consider them even human?

        These are you neighbors and fellow citizens of which you speak, show some respect.

  • http://charden@neo.rr.com Charles

    jopa >>> You allways say that after a Conservative victory.,which they
    have had quite a few of late.

  • Tim

    Shouldn’t teachers be paid for the peformace of their students. In any job I ever had, if you do do well you get canned. I dont ask for raises becuase I have been at a company for a long time or feel I just deserve one. Do good work, make your Company money or in this case teach the kids so their GPA is 2.0 or higher and it will flow back to you.

    • patty

      Sorry Tim, but tenure takes precedence over quality. Wished it worked that way and we wouldn’t all be discussing this.

  • http://herringtons.home.mindspring.com lighterknot

    Don’t know why you cinder blowing morons want to act as the bellows for the GOP and spread that firry hate. It’s obvious why you hate teachers they obviously failed you in school. Grant you there’s lots of government employees that need the boot. But what’s the privet sector producing in this country besides throwaway garbage built in obsolesce and environmental hazards? Pills and diseases…well maybe a few things.
    Amusing how you got the idea that I was liberal, I hate sweet do-gooders telling me what’s best fore me even when I know they have my best interest at hart. But I do love them better than those know it all fascist who want to force me. I’m truly an ultra ultra conservative. I believe so much in the constitution that I know it must be policed at the autonomy of the individual. It is therefore unconstitutional for my government to own a weapon that I can’t have.
    Why are you idiots so down on communism instead of fascism when we are frozen solid in automated totalitarianism?
    And why shouldn’t I bring some light to this stupid thread I’d love to torch it… fight fire with fire?
    I hear the oligarchy is made up of the nicest richest people on earth; and they have been controlling it since 500 ad they control the banking industry, agro-business, the medical and drug industry, transportation and the media. They have tentacles in every vital power structure on earth but operate in the shadows. They thrive on dissent and up-evil… all extremes war and peace. Their primary grip in this country is the Federal Reserve. But wide spread and well orchestrated – the GOP the main support in this country may or may not know it’s working for them.
    To believe this turns all our serious politics into theatrics staged and conducted and following a well written script. We can only hope they know better than to kill the hen that lays the golden egg.

    • http://donthaveone Beberoni

      The biggest, richest, and most rotten businessman in the world, is George Soros, and he owns the democrat party, so all you say is moot. Your democrats are the rich guys, and have been for years, and shame on you for being so gullible that you believe their lie that they are the poor guys for the poor man. It couldnt be further from the truth.

  • http://donthaveone Beberoni

    So many posts here miss it, but some hit it. The whole point of this is the unions forcing people to have to be in them, forcing them to pay the dues, then giving millions to democrats to make laws in their favor, and this has bankrupted many business’s and states. How they think they should get free everything, and not have to pony up premiums, while we are paying their salaries, is beyond me. The very fact that they would rather watch hundreds of their union buddies get laid off and lose their jobs, instead of all of them paying a percentage of their health care premiums like the rest of us, says a load about their greed to themselves. I worked union shops for 13 years, and I watched them hold companies hostage, cost them millions of dollars, and made me do without work because I wasnt allowed to cross the picket line, or it is a fact, I would have had my car tires slashed, and would have been kicked out and castigated. So I took a job elsewhere until we got back to work. Now these last 15 years, Ive been with a non union company, making much, much more than I did in a union. And then, when things got tight when Obama got elected, because everyone stopped building to save their money for the impending democrat tax increases, our company told us that we were all going to take a 10 percent pay reduction for the company to stay solvent. Try that in a union. Right. So we all did, for almost a year, then things started picking up. Some companies around that wouldnt do this, just laid guys off, and some closed up shop permanently. Now, we are so busy, all our wages have been restored, and we have at least 20 guys from other contractors that are laid off, working temporarily with us. You see, we all care about our company, and they care about us, where they told us they wanted to keep everyone working, but to do it, we would all need to take a 10 percent pay cut, temporarily. We all glady did it, to keep our company strong. First time this has happened in 15 years. You see, when things are good, they also split the profits equally with all the employee’s, determined by how many hours you worked that year and the number of years of service. So we share in the good, and we share in the bad. When I was in the union, the one union would have surplus funds in a good year, that were supposed to be distributed to ALL the local members. Instead, the union president and 5 or 6 of his buddies, would go to Bermuda or the Bahama’s for 2 weeks and spend it up. Yes, this is true, I watched them do it 3 years in a row, and they even bragged about it. To me, they should be in jail, because it was blatant stealing, but hey, thats the union way. The unions want power, and they want to force people into them, force money out of them, and give it to the democrats who then give them exemptions to pay them back. Its wrong and corrupt, and it needs to be stopped. And I applaud Wisconsin for doing what is right for all in their state, not just a few select unions who are corrupt. Well done Wisconsin, and may all other states follow your lead. We may just get back on the right track in this country after all, if we follow the things that Arizona and Wisconsin are doing to make us strong and solvent again.

    • libertytrain

      While unions probably didn’t have this problem when they first began; Google union embezzlement and there are: About 1,160,000 results (0.18 seconds). That’s just info on those that got caught, not about the trips to the Bahamas and Las Vegas and fancy cars and clothes, etc. by those running the unions.

    • Al B Tross

      Ronald Reagan said that workers being able to Unionize is a human right.

      How quickly we forget The Polish Solidarity Union, whose labor protests shut down the shipyards, and began the end of Soviet control in eastern Europe, and the end of Communism.

      I cannot fathom a single Conservative that would entertain the notion that working Americans do not deserve the right to Organize. Are we to return to the days of Railroad Barons and Company towns?

      Barry Goldwater defined Conservatism as facing the challenges of the future, with the SUCCESSES of the past.

      http://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~altemey/

  • jopa

    libertrain;Had a little spare time so I googled “unions making America great.” Came up with 190,000,000 results (0.34seconds).Thats just when I put in great and didn’t type in really great.

    • libertytrain

      Good for you. Unfortunately it doesn’t negate what I found.

  • Paul Roth

    Scott Walker will be convicted of multiple crimes. His actions are far worse than the governors of Alabama and Illinois, who are now in federal prison. If he is not prosecuted, then he will surely find his life at risk of aasination by a local gun owning mentally deranged person. He needs to resign ASAP. This bully has sold his sole to the company store . Cook Btohers. Soon there will be a boycott of the products made by Cook Industries. I am now boycotting Cadbury owned brands for example Motts because of its abuse of its unionize employees at its Motts subsidary. Iwas a Reblican Club officier, no longer and as a repbulican I wa the president of a union of employees who worked for the city and transit authority. ssome titles same work tasks , loong history of same wage rates,, but the transit authority refused to negotiat until they were found guilty of violting the Public employee labor Board guidelines. Also without the Union promotion exams were held to fill vacancities base on merit. after agapof 8 years. Because of management failures , there are many grievances. Union contractsprove mechanisms for justice to be done. No uniions = no merit = policial hacks= low performance = no accountability for management.

    how many kids in a classroom ? Why not hold class in the auditorium and close the small class rooms 500 kindergarden kids at one time in the gynasium I have given absurb examples. The question is what are the appropriate standards. Need more class rooms save on costs by using Tents. No neeed to be concerned about the fire safety standards or snow load and wind dangers. Instead of milk serve water
    End master’s degree mandate for teacher, , Then you can pay theem less. In 1960 I got my teachers license without a degree with more than 128 credis. In 1915 you went to normal school for 2 years

  • fedup

    I just wish the UNION BASHERS would go after THE SIX FIGURE SALARY MANAGEMENT. LEAVE THE 40k and UNDER ALONE>
    you could curtail a shitload of waste by eliminating TOP HEAVY MANAGEMENT.
    Too many CHIEFS not enough INDIANS.

  • jopa

    libertytrain: My findings are 189,000,000 more reasons why we need unions.

    • libertytrain

      Ok, however my million plus gives you a vast amount of monies that was embezzled from the union and was actually discovered to be embezzled; how many were not caught; how much of the millions and millions of dollars was recaptured by the “good guys” – how much is out the door, how much is being spent in Las Vegas right now as we waste our time trading punches; and how many of your millions of people are funding the endless number of union member/bosses embezzlers – oh, that’s right, all of them. The percentage of embezzlers per legitimate union honchos is probably 1-1 or maybe one thief to every two union biggies. I’m not in a union myself. Just been around enough of these folks to understand the game, and view the game, and game it has become. There may be a decent union “leader” still out there. Would love to meet him or her. :)

  • Maurice

    Start here – turn off your TV’s and do some reading. Download a free copy of probably the most important book written about eduction in the last 100 years: If you persevere, so many lights will go on in your head – the dots you connect, and keep on connecting, will astound and horrify you.

    http://deliberatedumbingdown.com/

    OK, now any freedom loving person should be pretty angry and might for one second realize that all the political labeling, name calling and finger pointing is pointless. The constitutional republic so carefully crafted and hard won by the Founding Fathers died a very long time ago. The political circus is nothing more than pantomime, it works to distract everyone from reality and serves only to give the illusion of freedom of choice and opposing views. You have not had a real president for decades. You do not have elections but rather “selections” and they are certainly not yours.

    Every single government you have had since the end of WWII has furthered and enforced the policies and sick agendas documented in that book. EVERY one.

    The western industrialized world, the Anglo-American empire, is owned and controlled by a banking elite and their corporate sidekickss who own the money supply, the mainstream media, and pretty much the key to the life of every individual on this planet. They instigate wars for profit, they decide when economic crashes are desirable, they decide how much you pay for everything from your groceries to your house payment and decide when you will lose your job or your home too. They have ultimate power over the lives of millions.

    Your taxes do not go to government – they go to the bankers who issue the money to governments at interest. National debts can never be repaid, and Obama is nothing but the latest in a long line of puppets, all of whom do nothing but enforce the will of the corrupt and evil men who own them.

    Keep that TV off. Stop being lied to and controlled by fear of imaginary enemies. Educate yourself about who the real enemies are, where the real threats to your freedoms lie.

    I’m going to give you a very short list of respected resources now. They only scratch the surface but will set you on the path to thinking for yourselves and help you to understand how the industrialized world works, for whose benefits, and exactly how and why they have followed the same paths for centuries.

    The Money Masters How International Bankers Gained Control Of America (3 hour documentary)
    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-515319560256183936#

    Want To Know Info – documented facts on everything from the food you eat, the politics of fear, the lies and scandals of everything from political assassinations to wars and why we die in them and have done for centuries.
    wanttoknow.info/

    Follow your nose from there, you’ll be amazed at how much solid and documented information there is on the web. Sort the kooks from those who back up their information with documented facts – it’s not hard.

    Forget the mainstream media – it’s entertainment and propaganda, nothing more, nothing less and they laugh at you for your gullibility.

    There are a few independent journalists worth seeking out – strongly recommend John Pilger – Google him or do a video search – some truly outstanding documentaries which will show you the massive lies that you are constantly fed by your “news reporters” and “government”. I hope you will be shocked because you should be and you need to understand before you can do much at all. Forget his socialist leanings – as I say, none of this is about the pantomime of politics in modern day America and Britain.

    Take time off from your journey of discovery and read George Orwell’s classic work of fiction, 1984. Just Google it for a free PDF you can read on your computer. Remind yourself that really, Mr Orwell was far from a fool, and think about the relevance of his novel today.

    For the sake of yourselves, your kids and granchildren, at least read the first book I recommended above because soon, with the total control of your children’s minds from cradle to grave, you’re shallow political rhetoric will be even more meaningless than it already is and everything that separates us from the animals will be gone and the path to global economic slavery will be a reality. It’s really not a pretty picture at all.

  • jopa

    libertytrain;Money wasted in Vegas.The people of Nevada don’t think it’s a waste at all.You trying to say if it is not spent in your state it’s a waste.They just happen to have convention centers big enough to accomodate the people they represent.All things that happen in Las Vegas are not bad.

    • libertytrain

      jopa – sorry I was referring to the non-convention trips done on union folks money. Some union officials in Charlotte (and other places) did a lot of that sort of thing. Apparently it’s common. I like an occasional bit of Las Vegas, but I spend my money to get there and pay for my own expenses with my own money.

  • Dee

    I was totally shocked by the very poor behavior by those who we look to for good examples for our children. Critical lesson were missed about how our republic works through the ballot box and not like other countries who cast stones instead of votes. Teachers, along with some police and firemen and union strong arm measures, by their example, said to the children of america; if we win through the ballot box,we’ll demand more from the tax payers. If we lose through the ballot box, we’ll take it to the streets. Having public worker unions are a very bad idea as the facts prove. They represent a segment of the people with greater treatment under the law then the rest. Its proven to be a money pump for political people who in tern priviledge them more and more. Privet unions are another story.

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