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As opposition to healthcare reform mounts, Obama prepares address

September 4, 2009 by  

As opposition to healthcare reform mounts, Obama prepares address President Obama has come under fire from all sides for some of the provisions of the proposed healthcare reform, and he will appear before Congress to restate his case.

One of the critical voices has been raised by Americans for Tax Reform which says there are tax hikes in the House Democrat bill that would violate the President’s promise made during the electoral campaign not to raise taxes on families making less than $250,000 a year.

For example, page 167 of the proposed legislation talks about imposing a 2.5 percent tax on individuals who are not enrolled in health insurance.

Similarly, certain businesses that do not offer insurance would be compelled to pay a new payroll tax of 8 percent.

The organization may soon get an answer, as Obama is set to address lawmakers tonight in an effort to lay out his plan to overhaul healthcare and provide details many feel have been missing thus far. In fact, a new CBS News poll found that 66 percent of Americans are confused by the reform proposals.

However, most polls also show a majority agree the nation’s healthcare system needs major change.

Obama is widely expected to reveal whether the administration will push for including a public option in the final draft of the bill. He is also likely to highlight the elements most lawmakers agree on, including preventing insurance companies from denying coverage for preexisting conditions or dropping coverage when a person gets sick as well as capping out-of-pocket expenses and eliminating caps on lifetime coverage, according to the Christian Science Monitor.
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Spencer Cameron

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  • http://PersonaLibertyDigest Ralph avolo

    112 speeches on healthcare. Talk about an annoying salesman. I have to ask that old Nixon qustion,” Would you buy a used car from this man? The answer is a profound NO. He lies and he is the master of 3 card Monty. He could make David Copperfield disappear. Mis- direction is his game and my and your health never enters into the equation. Its all about the Narcissism. He is a terribly flawed man who is weak and cowardly. He is also a bully. He bullied Joe the Plumber but was a punk when contronted by Chavez. He was scared of the bigger dog. He, like Clinton brings shame to this nation. I hope we can stop this steamroller soon because he is so close to inflicting a wound to America that I don’t think she can recover from. He is a statist and cold man. He only cares about Himself, Obama the one he has been waiting for. I thought I hated Hillary whoa!

    • hopeforamerica

      Ralph… Ralph.. Ralph; If Offering All Americans the opportunity and the Freedom to CHOOSE… CHOICE…. OPTION of a Public Health Plan IN CASE you can’t afford your employer’s plan, and/or the benefits in the plan continue to evaporate year after year even as your co-pays and deductables increase, you’ve changed jobs or become unemployed, you have a pre-existing condition, or your private insurer decides to deny you benefits or simply cancel your coverage when you’ve been diagnosed with cancer, ……….
      You Will not have to Worry or sell your house to pay for health care.

      All of you who oppose the public Option Are Helping the Insurance Companies get richer as we get poorer!!!

      • DaveH

        Hope – fitting name, but let’s get down to reality. Big Government has caused the health care crisis through their free-market stifling regulations. Let’s not throw more government at it.
        I also don’t like insurance companies, but not because I think they are crooks and not because I envy their profits. I just don’t like the concept of a middle-man; I not only have to pay him extra over the years, but he also gets in the way of my doctor-patient relationship. And you can magnify both of those problems several times if government gets involved.
        It’s like saying you would be better off if the government made all your food-purchasing decisions. Sure it might be set up so you pay nothing out of your pocket at the point of delivery, but through taxes you or someone else will be paying dearly for all of the resulting bureaucracy and you probably wouldn’t be very happy with the food choices the government made for you.
        If you Liberals sincerely think the Insurance Companies are ripping us off, then get together with your buds and set up your own low-cost insurance companies. Of course, the first lesson you would get would be the stifling regulatory hoops that you have to jump through. The next lesson you would get would be the enormous complexity involved in insurance disbursement decisions.
        Of course Big Government will be happy to step up to the plate for you. After all, we wouldn’t want Obama and his cohorts to give up their extravagant lifestyles, would we?

        • Samuel

          DaveH, you are so right about middlemen…they only get in the way. The fed is the middleman in any exchange in OUR country and the biggest blight on this country. No cure will occur for America until this CANCER is purged. They are the cause of all imbalance. The scales are tipped in their favor. Restore hope by getting rid of the fed.

        • rodin

          So what you’re essentially saying is that you don’t want to see ANY health insurance. Basically nobody would have the ability to pay for expensive treatment without bankrupting themselves. That’s certainly in keeping with having America as the ONLY holdout in the civilized world without covering basic it’s citizen’s basic health care.

      • b-man

        This is not that complicated:
        1) Provide a tax credit of $5 or $6 thousand to be applied to a annual health plan of YOUR choice. The more private sector plans available the lower prices will be. Competition from other private people create a better product and lower prices.
        2) Provide a tax credit to private companies that open their plans to existing condition patients. (INCENTIVES) This promotes creativity and that is good for us.
        3) Stop giving free care to the 12 million illegals filling up our emergency rooms and using our operating rooms for free. I want them to come and enjoy the freedoms and opportunities here but they need to come through the FRONT DOOR, just like we have to in Europe and even in Mexico. It has to work both ways to truely be fair for all.
        4) The increadible amount of money– Billions will be saved that can be applied to the Seniors, and to health programs that incentivize companies to give better deals to us.
        5) Tort reform will let us purchase in any state the same opportunities for coverage so you can live anywhere.
        It is important to understand why it’s better to use private companies over govenment plans. If a company is mis treating you they can be voted out of business by not going into their place of business. The Government just keeps going on and on using more and more of your tax dollars trown into a plan that doen’t work and we all keep paying. Post Office, Medicare, DMV,. My God the IRS is being run by a person that defaulted on his own taxes not for one year, but four years he cheated. Wake Up damn it.
        We don’t need Government putting their waistful arm in this industry or any other. If they want more taxes then they need to let companies make money and employes have jobs. (Or does this confuse you?) Just go to the DMV, Stand in line at the Post Office and be greeted by that happy person who half the time can’t even look you in the eye. Look at how much money they have taken out of social security and deverted and lost. The program is about finished. 110 million baby boomers will be calling in their ticket next year and only 55 million kids working are paying into the program. They now have to pay for their parents and the seniors still living. People in this country need to prosper. 90% of all the money the IRS collects comes from only the top 20%. I thought that all of us lived in this country and all of us are protected by our military. We need to pay our fair share for our fair lives for all of this to be fair to everyone.

        • Aristocutionor

          I was with you (b-man) up until the last sentence.. There is NO law whatsoever requiring any US Citizen to pay Income Tax on wages earned in any of the 50 States.. That 20% that pay the majority of tax are suppose to be paying taxes.. Their incomes are not from trading time (labor) for wages, are NOT profit.. ONLY profit is taxable income..

          In all of this is the FACT that the Federal Government is NOT suppose to be involved in health care, at all !!
          The “general welfare” and “commercial clause” are both misappropriated here as well.. If one reads the Federalist and Non-Federalist Papers of the founding fathers, health care isn’t even close to what is being referred to.. Explicitly, the 9th and 10th Amendments PROHIBIT the Federal Government for being involved in health care, education and a whole lot more.. Only the ENUMERATED powers DELEGATED by the States are permitted – and the 10th Amendment says; And if we left anything out, you can’t do that either..

          Almost invariable, when so many people see the folly of the feds (Federal Government and the banksters), it is premised upon a violation of the Constitution..

          You have the RIGHT to CONTRACT.. The Government does NOT have the right to offer you any contract whatsoever.. Not social security – medi-care — NONE of it is Constitutional..

        • rodin

          b-man – you’re dreaming in technicolor if you think that offering incentives to private insurance companies will get them to take on existing condition clients. The current recession was the result of government providing incentives to private industry and guaranteed profits to mortgage insurers. There will always be smarter business execs who will find a way to plunder your tax dollars for their extravagant bonuses.

          • eyeswideopen

            Rodin, well said.

          • http://ahalbert@smart-technology.net Allan Halbert

            If you’re saying that certain politicians are looking for deals in pursuit of social reengineering and votes, then yes, there are businesspeople willing to take those deals.

      • Okfoz

        hopeforamerica
        All I have to say is you are misguided. The fact is I have friends who do not have health insurance. It is a couple who are married and in their 20′s, she works for a school system, and her husband more or less runs a small business. Neither of them are interested in President Barack Hussein Obamas Health care. This probably comes as a shock to you, but they do not want a hand out from the Govt. My friends know that once the govt gets it on board, it will be a bureaucratic nightmare. From your comments, I am sure you are on board for Free health care… well it is a little secret, we will ALL pay for it, this is far from being free.

        Another thing, I have yet to see locally any health care providers, such as those evil insurance companies that are opposing the bill at this point. I wonder who is really lining their pockets?

        With govt health care I am looking forward to having procedures denied because some bureaucrat decides I can wait, or I am too old, or too young, or too expensive… You know, like they do in Canada, UK, France, Germany and everywhere the government has its hand in govt health care… Little do you probably know that all these countries that have govt run health care, the majorities are wanting to get rid of it.

        I have to ask
        1) Where in the constitution does it allow our government to run a program like this. It could be run by the individual states, as I think it should, then we can move to a state that does not have it if we did not want it. It should be mentioned that every state that has attempted a plan similar to the one proposed has failed, and is simply sucking the life out of the People. HI comes to mind when they just tried to do children, in 6 months it was gone! MA’s plan is failing, as is either KY or TN I do not remember which one, but it too is in trouble.
        2) If this is such a great thing, then why? Why? WHY? is congress and the president opting out… I know the Pres said he would put his family on it, but the bill in the house pretty much forbids it. The Obama wants to tell you that it will be like the plan they have in congress… Really? I think that is lip service, as there is little similarity between the bills and what congress has. Congress actually has private insurance, they just have options, it is not government run.
        3) Why is it that this president aligns himself with so many Socialistic people like Van Jones, Bill Aires, Jeff Jones, Cass Sunstein, Rev Wright (sp?), and the list goes on and on and on… Is this part of the agenda that he wants this socialistic program shoved through. Just remember the Vimar republic? That started out with health care, then moved one thing to another, then they began to indoctrinate Children, and look where that got them. nationalsozialists took over if you want a translation National Socalist party, AKA NAZI’s
        4) The dollar is on the verge of collapse, the Chinese are becoming reluctant to lend us any more money, They are upset that all we are doing is printing more, and devaluing our dollar, the UN wants to make a new “World” currency rather than use our dollar as a basis, we are 11 thousand, billion dollars in debt, if that does not make sense, as of right now our national debt is estimated at $11,803,738,824,211.61 . The est population of the US is 306,889,449 so each citizen’s share of this debt is $38,462.51. Only 3 or so percent of the people in the US make 250K a year or more, so from the numbers above, roughly 9.2 Million people make more than $250,000 or more. If all of those 9.2M people made an average of a million dollars, we would be still short of 2 thousand billion dollars.

        http://www.ask.com/bar?q=how+many+people+under+the+age+of+18+are+there+in+the+US&page=1&qsrc=2417&ab=0&u=http%3A%2F%2Fquickfacts.census.gov%2Fqfd%2Fstates%2F00000.html

        While I am going, Lets do some fun math, The average wage in the US is $50,740 (2007 number). With that said, not everyone works, matter of fact if you do not include the population under 18, or those over 65 that do not work, you end up with about 37% of the people that technically do not pay income taxes, in effect you have only 193,033,464 people that are paying for the the almost 12 thousand billion dollars of our debt, so if you work your portion of our national debt is actually $61,159, but we make an average of $50,740. You add to the compounding interest that our $12T is accruing, even at 5% interest rates we are adding $600,000,000,000 that is 600 BILLION dollars in INTEREST A YEAR, think about what we could do simply with the interest. In effect WE CANNOT PAY for this, it is NOT POSSIBLE… The REPUBLICANS AND DEMOCRATS ARE TO BLAME for our debt, this is not a partisan issue.

        5) So you mention that you want coverage for existing conditions… Suppose you own a house, and you do not have insurance on your home, someone breaks in and steals everything, you call an insurance company the next day when you find that everything is gone, who is going to insure you. Or suppose you own a car that was stolen, but you do not have insurance, could you buy insurance for it to try and recover it? Heck even if you do have insurance, but do not have theft insurance you are just out of luck. So why is it that you feel that insurance is a right? Insurance is NOT A RIGHT, regardless of how many times I hear people quote “Life liberty and the pursuit of happiness.” People do not get it. Look it up, according to http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/happy Happy is 1) favored by luck or fortune. So more or less the constitution means, “Life liberty and the pursuit of fortune”

        Your desires are noble, and honestly the hopes of universal health care sounds very generous and noble. Unfortunately we do not live in a perfect world, and we can only hope that the worst does not happen to us. The reality is this same freedom that we apparently take for granted, is what allows any US born citizen to become president, just look to our current president. Being a capitalist is not a crime, yet at least. How about allowing us to become rich, many people start with nothing fail miserably and then try again, only a true failure will give up after only a failure or two, read what Hershey went through, he fought his way to wealth, failing and bankrupting himself several times if memory serves. We cannot allow this monstrosity of a health care bill pass, If you have not figured it out, I suspect you have not, but health care is not about health care, this is about POWER!. The sad truth is the third largest employer in the world is the British health Care system, it is only third to China’s red army and the India’s National Railway. Our government wants that kind of power, consider that the UK has about 1/6 of our population, that would make our health care bureaucracy 6 times larger than their bureaucracy. You think that Obama does not want that? I bet he does, the way I figure it the more the govt can employ, and put under his programs and make dependent, the more likely people are to vote for him.

  • Smilee

    Its pretty clear you are filled with hate, do you even know the real reason why, I doubt it is the reasons you expouse

    • John

      Do you accuse everyone of being filled with hate? It must have been your upbringing.

      • Smilee

        No John just those that express their hate, sorry , you can not tell the difference

  • s c

    Obama’s approach to health care ‘reform’ is no different than his core beliefs [what we see vs. what we're supposed to see]. He can’t hide his social engineering background. He has all the compassion of a hungry anaconda. He’s surrounded by unelected social rejects who live in a fantasy world of their own making.
    Beyond that, obama loves to preach, but he’ll never admit that what comes from his pulpit is raw, anti-American anarchy.
    I have a very simple test for him. The day he repudiates everything Margaret Sanger ever wrote is the day I’ll have a reason to respect him. OK, ultralibs, research the Sanger connection and why it makes comrade obama look like the world’s worst hypocrite. Good luck. If you need help reading and understanding the material, that can be arranged. Enjoy the shock of adoring someone who wouldn’t hesitate to use anyone or anything to get what he wants. He’s all yours.
    Let the explanations and empty defenses begin!

    • hopeforamerica

      The man is trying to give curtail rising health care costs which is unsustainable, and give Americans a Choice of health care options!
      The insurance companies are going to continue to increase health care costs to small businesses and individuals Unless we create more competition. A non-profit health option will give people an addtional choice besides their employers plan and help small businesses become more competitive when a competitive market will lower their healthcare costs! Time to get your head out of your arse, look beyond the color of our president’s skin or his political party, and stand behind him because He is Trying to Help you and me! He was elected to the middle class and that’s just what he’s doing!! I have great admiration and respect for our president. Finally, we have a president who was elected by the people and is truly working for the people! Without a public option, millions of Americans will be uninsured and die. I love our POTUS! He’s a Good man!

      • Beartrainer

        Keep playing the race card, hopefor… Face it, the death panels, rationing of health care, tremendous increase in taxes and overall cost of the government-run program, government access to bank accounts, fines for not buying insurance, abortion on demand, including illegal aliens in the program, etc. are what make up this smoke-and-mirrors attempt to control 1/5th of the U.S. economy and hand over all kinds of money to ACORN and the unions. Government is the problem, not the solution. Most people are really starting to recognize this proposal for what it is and are rejecting it by wide margins. Their decision has nothing to do with the color of our President, just the stench of this proposal!!

      • Okfoz

        hopeforamerica
        I think you may are the racist. By supposing that someone else is interested in someones skin tone only implicates yourself. I am not against anything that has to do with our presidents skin color. I have NEVER EVER voted for someone based upon the tone of their skin, I even voted for Alan Keyes in 2000, but he was “not black enough” as I think it was said by the African American community…

        Do you want to know what I am agains? I AM AGAINST HIS OBAMA’S POLICIES. His ideas appear to be socialist, and Communistic, and I am not going to let you tell me or anyone else that they are a racist when you are more so than anyone else here that I have read so far.

        Good day

        • DaveH

          Well said Okfoz. But I’m sure it will fall on deaf ears (and Sleepee ones too). They only see what they want to see, or hear what they want to hear. The most irritating thing is that after they ruin the country, they won’t even take responsibility. I guess it makes sense. Why should they take responsibility for the downfall of the country when they won’t even take responsibility for their own lives?

          • Donna

            There are none so blind as he who will not see.

            This is an e-mail floating around:

            Franklin Delano. Roosevelt (Terms of Office March 4, 1933 to April 12, 1945), a Democrat, introduced Social Security (FICA) Program. He Promised:

            1. That participation in the Program would be Completely voluntary, the only way he could get BOTH parties to agree to it.

            2. That the participants would only have to pay 1% of the first $1,400 of their annual Incomes into the Program

            3. That the money the participants elected to put Into the Program would be deductible from Their income for tax purposes each year

            4. That the money the participants put into the Independent ‘Trust Fund’ rather than into the General operating fund, and therefore, would Only be used to fund the Social Security Retirement Program, and no other Government program, and

            5. That the annuity payments to the retirees would never be taxed as income.

            Those who have paid into FICA for years and are now receiving a Social Security check every month — now find that they are getting taxed on 85% of the money they paid to the Federal government to ‘Put Away’ — you may be interested in the following:

            If I recall correctly, 1958 is the first year that Congress, not President Eisenhower, voted to remove funds from Social Security and put it into the General Fund for Congress to spend.

            If I recall correctly, it was a Democratically controlled Congress.

            From what I understand, Congress’ logic at that time was that there was so much money in Social Security Fund that it would never run out / be used up for the purpose it was intended / set aside for.

            Question: Which Political Party took Social Security from the Independent ‘Trust Fund’ and put it into the General Fund so that Congress could spend it?

            Answer: It was Lyndon B. Johnson Democrat (Term of Office: November 22,1963 to January 20, 1969) and the Democratically Controlled House and Senate.

            Question: Which Political Party started taxing Social Security annuities?

            Answer: The Democratic Party, with Albert Arnold Gore, Jr. (Al Gore) (Term of Office: January 20, 1993 to January 20, 2001) casting the ‘tie-breaking’ deciding vote as President of the Senate, while he was Vice President of the US.

            Question: Which Political Party decided to start giving Annuity payments to immigrants?

            ANSWER: That’s right! JAMES EARL CARTER, JR. (JIMMY CARTER) DEMOCRAT, (TERM OF OFFICE: JANUARY 20, 1977 TO JANUARY 20, 1981) AND THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY.

            IMMIGRANTS MOVED INTO THIS COUNTRY, AND AT AGE 65, BEGAN TO RECEIVE SOCIAL SECURITY PAYMENTS.

            THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY GAVE THESE PAYMENTS TO THEM, EVEN THOUGH THEY NEVER PAID A DIME INTO IT!

            Then, after violating the original contract (FICA), the Democrats turn around and tell you that the Republicans want to take your Social Security away!

            And the worst part about it is uninformed citizens believe it!

            If enough people see this, maybe a Seed of Awareness will be planted and maybe changes WILL evolve! But maybe not: some Democrats are awfully sure of what isn’t so. But it’s worth a try.

          • Smilee

            Donna

            You do not know what your talking about, I realize this is the official conservative talking points but they are not all true, Both parties are equally guilty of raiding SS, No one even illegals can draw SS unless they have payed in for 40 quarters, thats 10 years so this
            BS that someone who is 65 can dome here at that age and collect is bogus. Once a law is written it is not cast in concrete, any future congress can change it, to pretend what was done in the thirties if it has been changed is somehow not legal is pure baloney, your grasping at straws trying to prove what does not exist

      • Dickie

        You know,You sound just like this creep,hussein,Do you really believe that the rich people are going to foot the bill,For this garbage,You sound like pelosi,reid,They are going to take care of these people,Let the communist soerols,pay for it.It is not fair for one group of people to pay it all,Like the people makeing between $20,000.& $75,000.00,The way it has been for years,You are just looking for a hand out like all (WORD REMOVED FOR OFFENSIVE CONTENT),All they have to do is put these crooks for selling out the American people,Takeing bribes like axelrod,muthar,pelosi,reid,franks,kerry,& who ever else takeing money from these pharmarceutical’s,& Hospt’s to charge what in the hell they want,Look at the crap they waist on these building’s marble wall’s floor’s millon’s of dollars wasted just to look pretty,& put these thives in prison,They are stealing our money & getting away with it,If you think the rich is going to pay trillon’s for ever you are nut’s,And if you think your god hussein & his comrads are going to have the same plan they are trying to shove down our throat’s,You are so pittyful,The damn man would not even speak at school,With the name of jesus showing & now he is moking him by saying he is my brother’s keeper,What in the hell is wrong with you,When he first started sounding like a cheap car salesman,He even said [ I don't know what is in this bill,But it is great for you],Then you got that other (WORD REMOVED FOR OFFENSIVE CONTENT) [said i'm NOT going to read it,But i will pass it].You have got to be a member of acorn or freedie mac,Or his big brothers the black panters,The only hope we have in America is to get RID of these traitors out of office,And keep idiot’s from voteing,And COLOR IS NOT A DAMN ISSUE,I would have voted for condlisa rice with no dought,She has class,morals,ethics,respect,& a hell of a lot more experience than this clown,All he did was help the poor black people have hope,putting them in thousand’s of dollors houses they could not afford,After he bull s–t these people &made millons off the worst corrupt group of thugs,liers,thives,acorn,Hs has turned his back on them,I was told a long time ago,There is a sucker born every min,& seven to take it from him,& you my friend has proved that point very well,Keep watching the state own media,They need the rateing,So these sheep can keep their pathic little scard jobs.The (WORD REMOVED FOR OFFENSIVE CONTENT) are lieing to start trouble between people,To divide the people,But I hope smart people see through this s—,We are in this together,And have got to STAY TOGETHER,These socialist Tyrant’s will go down in the history book’s as the most corrupt scoundrel’s in American History for [THEIR] Children & grandchildren to see a be ashamed of,But they don’t even have the morals to care,As long as they have the power.So why don’t you open your eyes & join America,Not just a few people.A lot of true americans fighting for our & your freedom.

        • Smilee

          Dickie

          go sober up and then maybe try again

    • Michael

      Well I think he should be impeached and a recall the entire Congress….No one listens to Americans….So let’s peacfully thru
      whatever legal means we have as Citizens of the “Great” Country and have a clean sweep….just my opinion…does that include me as a radical??????

      • Smilee

        YEP

    • rodin

      Seems like EVERY Obama-hater on this site is very long on rhetoric and extremely SHORT on FACTS. All I hear is rant, rant, scared of socialism, rant, rant, scared of America being wiped off the planet, rant, rant, scared of not getting into heaven, rant, rant, scared of criminals plundering DVD collection, rant, rant, scared of wife being raped, rant rant….

      Wake up and stop being so afraid to have a LEGITIMATE dialog without the use of rhetorically loaded and bombastic words that you don’t even know the meaning of – like “liberal” and “socialism” and “capitalism” and “social engineering”. And if you can’t have a conversation on the facts then go back to school.

      • John

        Sounds like you’re the one doing the ranting. There are several facts listed here depends on whose comments your reading. I clearly understand what capitalism and socialism are. It appears that you need to go back to school to grasp a better understanding of the topics being discussed herein.

        • Smilee

          Jonny, you are so mixed up.

  • Smilee

    Wild, what have you got against birth control, (Margaret Sanger’s fame) what is the connection to Obama’s health care reform ideas. You know S C you obviously hate Obama that is clear but you make little sense about why or what you believe and say. You are so confused.

    • hopeforamerica

      Hey there Smiley. So that’s what the Sanger connection is… birth control? wow. Some of these people are….wow….nutso. In all fairness, there should be access to birth control for women. Birth control pills, and all that other stuff can be expensive.

      • Liberty

        I think the Sanger connection would be more along the lines of her being an avowed socialist, and strongly anti-capitalistic.

        • s c

          Ultralibs are afraid read and absorb the facts, so I’ll say it in plain English. Margaret Sanger HATED ethnic groups. In particular, she HATED blacks MOST. Her preferred ‘choice’ in dealing with the problem was ABORTION. How can an ultralib not understand what that means?
          This issue goes beyond abortion. Margaret Sanger preached ‘love’ and practiced RACE HATRED at the same time. The fact that ‘leaders’ like comrade obama aren’t willing to read or understand or admit their mistakes proves there is no difference between Margaret Sanger and comrade obama and all his willing stooges.
          Liberty, it is NOT possible to talk about hope and change and transparency and ethics or anything good when people have surrendered to Margaret Sanger and her CONTEMPT for all people who are not “RACIALLY PURE.” It amazes me that anyone can find ways to defend insanity, but I’ve seen people do it for years. Absolutely amazing.

          • rodin

            You’re nuts.

          • Smilee

            Rosin

            I noticed that too

    • b-man

      Listen numb nutts, you Idiots are so caught up in his bull s—- you can’t see the dammage he is doing to this country. This health care bill has nothing to do with health care is you would just read it. (Like I did) What the hell does $1.8billion monitoring intersection lights and paving roads and crosswalks have to do with health care? This like every other thing he has gotten involved with is only a front for total control of yours and your families lives. The medical industry and his involvement is only access to another $1 trillion of our money to throw into the pot and divy out as they see fit and nothing more. You can shut the hell up about he’s Black and you don’t like him shit. I’m married to a beautyful black women. This is about Government telling us how we are to live and taking away our abuility to take care of ourselves. But I guess in you case your just to stupid for that so he’ll take care of you. Let me know when you grow up and get your thumb out of your mouth and move out of your parents place. This is America and we take care of ourselve. Go get spoon fed in Europe.

      • DaveH

        B-man, I agree with your sentiment completely. And I am not attacking you, but please don’t lower yourself to their level with name-calling.
        We need all the clear-headed voices we can get to stop the Libs.
        They need to use the name-calling, ridicule, and other manipulative gimmicks because their arguments have no legs; we don’t.

        • s c

          DaveH, more than most, Musclehead understands why there is such a gap between those who want responsible government and those who want whatever is forced upon them. What we have now is anything but responsible, and it promises to get worse.
          Those who favor enforced, immoral, unconstitutional approaches to health care refuse to stop and think. To them, if it feels good, it has to be good. They believe everything comrade obama says (Hitler would be green with envy). They imply that comrade obama is perfection on two legs.
          It’s no accident that Nazis look at Hitler the same way. That is, you don’t argue with ‘perfection.’ You must ‘surrender’ to it. What can you say about people who make reasoning with a dirt clod look easy?

        • b-man

          DAVEH, your so right. You know when your reading something and it hits a nerve? I can’t comprehend how seeing someone break into your home, beat your family and steal from you and you can just sit there and say but he’s a nice guy and he didn’t really do it. These osama fans can’t see the dangerous things he’s doing. We must raise the pressure on this group that want to take us down.

          • DaveH

            I know B-man, I too get very frustrated with them. But way back, when I was in my 30s, what really turned me against Democrats was their behavior in a political forum or debate. They would name-call, ridicule, roll-their-eyes, interrupt constantly, or whatever other manipulative gimmick that they could conjure up. I know now that they had to do that because their ideas couldn’t measure up.
            I do believe in using their own words against them though. So, if they call you names first, give them back their own bullshit.
            I would like to wise up those people who are sitting on the fence, and if we call them names that will only serve to make them more stubborn.

          • s c

            B-man, I’m probably older than you, and I’ve had a long time to look into what passes for political wisdom. Check this list, and tell me how accurate it is.
            1) ultralibs always tell the truth 2)no ultralib can do anything wrong 3) big government is always good. it is our savior 4) the current denizens of the White House are gods 5) conservatives are to blame for everything bad all around the world since the beginning of time.
            And we’re supposed to get a reasoned debate with these people? With the possible exception of the leaders of the USSR and China, I have never seen any group of people that demands that we knuckle under to their every whim. I suspect this is what they really mean when they say ‘bipartisan.’ They never learned the difference between government force and choice. Is it wonder that their role models refuse to READ any legislation they expect America to swallow and enjoy?

          • DaveH

            I know. But we aren’t going to change the flaming Liberals like Sleepee because their minds are closed like steel traps. I am trying to wake up those people who do have hope of learning from well-presented arguments.

        • rodin

          So having someone stand up in Congress and call the president a “liar” during his address is what you stand for!! Total f@#$ing disrespect.

          • Smilee

            The republicans despite all their lies are getting frustrated and ridiculous as it is starting to sink in they are going to loose this fight, president made it pretty clear he will listen to any solutions they may propose but not their BS. The republicans looked on TV last night like they had been taken to the woodshed, especially Baynor

          • John

            He was wrong and at least he admitted it.
            What about the way you libs treated Sarah Palin and her family ? Talk about a lack of class. And lets not forget your Van Jones, your President’s Jeremiah Wright, Bill Ayers. Should I continue???

          • Smilee

            John

            You don’t know what you are talking about, Sarah was her own worst enemy and put her own foot in her mouth and to then all you conservatives in her defense blamed the innocent for her own stupidity. I admire that he apologized but I also know to not do so would have been a bigger mistake for him and it was really only about damage control.

          • eyeswideopen

            John, I hate to inform you of this but Sarah Palin is not the President. Hell, she isn’t even a governor. She is a quitter. The Office of the Presidency should command respect, even if you don’t like the man. When your general gives you an order do you shout back at him? No. When you preacher states something you don’t like, do you scream at him that he lies? No. For you to try and equate Sarah with an actual President is just too much. LOL.

          • http://ahalbert@smart-technology.net Allan Halbert

            Let’s see…

            We’ve watched this president insult SCOTUS justices in the same setting!
            and police in Boston,
            and business leaders,
            and voters in Arizona, etc.
            The President lied and deceived to get his healthcare bill. So what else is new?

        • Smilee

          Davie you hold the record here for name calling that is what you are all about, you know what they say if you live in a glass house know that it is risky to be throwing stones

      • DonnaH.

        Well said!

        • DonnaH.

          Let me clarify on whom I said “Well said” to. It was for b-man!

          • John

            Thanks because Smilee doesn’t make any sense. He needs to go to his liberal site, where nobody makes any sense.

          • Smilee

            John

            Statements like this and many others you make only illuminate your ignorance, biases and hatreds and thus make it impossible for you to comprehend any intelligent statements from anyone.

  • Tamra

    I do not believe Obama nor anything he says. He says one thing and either avoids his commitment or does something different. I believe he is not too smart, confused as to how to make good on his promises and enlisted so many radicals into his administration that even a good writer can put the shine back on. Also, good try with the kids and where you were trying to go with that show!!!!!

    • hopeforamerica

      Tamra; Ooh, Scary… telling our kids to stay in school, work hard, take responsibility for your life, don’t give up on yourself.
      Oh… yah… Scary. LOL.

      Your prejudices have clouded your judgement.

      • DaveH

        We needed Obama to tell our children that? I’m not worried about my grandkids though, they are intelligent enough to know when they are being spoon-fed.
        Have some more pabulum, Liberal.

        • eyeswideopen

          Dave, Obama, was just doing the same thing your idol, Bush did. Same type of talk. If you are going to attack someone, lets at least deal with facts. Run you facts for the past 8 months, and then compare to the past 8 years… don’t use excuse “well it’s in the past”, as today people are trying to fix the problems, caused by the “past admin”. Don’t forget to mention that the deficit was passed on by the fiscally responsible Republicans who grew this government to new high’s never before seen. Might also mention that since we passed the law to balance the budget, only Clinton has done that. You don’t like to deal with name calling, only facts, get busy, you have a couple of years to account for..Hell, just try justifing the Medicare Advantage bill in 2003. Someone anyone tell me why my party would pass a piece of crap like that?? Oh, yea, we needed to give money to Big Pharma, they were needing 200 billion a year profits, so we thought we’d help them out. You keep saying that the Dem’s are thief’s taking money from you, what in the hell do you think we did, give you a present? Facts, Dave, Facts, just the facts.

          • DaveH

            Okay Eyes, let’s deal with the facts. My idol is not Bush, where did you get that info? Show me a single comment where I said Bush was great. You could find a comment that says he is past history, so let’s move on. If you’re going to put words in my mouth, make sure they are words I spoke, not words you made up.

          • eyeswideopen

            Is that all you are going to comment on, the fact he isn’t your idol? Come on Dave, you know I was joking calling him your idol, you are always insinuating that Obama is mine,,, just thought I’d give you a little sh t!!

          • Smilee

            Granted davy you have never said he was your idol, but you defend so many of his destructive beliefs we sometimes forgets you do not like him as a person and you seemed to have a lot of people whom you do not like

          • http://ahalbert@smart-technology.net Allan Halbert

            Progressive strategy du jour…when nothing is working…blame Bush! Since Obama’s polling continues to drop as he spins current economic and strategic failures, all dem strategists are now focused on the blame Bush message. We’ll see if the American people are as gullible as dems think they are.

      • Liberty

        Seems his ‘take responsibility for yourself’ comment would be in direct opposition to everything he’s trying to do. HE wants to be the source of everything for people. You seem as confused as he is. You say personal responsibility is good, yet you fight for the government being responsible for your healthcare. Can’t have it both ways. Pick one.

      • Okfoz

        Hope,
        It is your prejudice that is clouding you. People do not want this President to have anything to do with their kids. I do not think you understand.. It was not the speech, it was the homework and the lessons that they wanted the children to do to write how they can help the president. I am sorry but my job is NOT TO HELP THE PRESIDENT OR THE GOVERNMENT, our job is to help our country… You are so misguided if you think we should help the president. Help him with what?

        • John

          Okfoz that is exactly what people don’t understand. This was to be the beginning of the indoctrination of our children, the homework assignment. Not the speech. This guy will stoop to any level to get what he wants. We were going to pull both of our children from school on Tuesday but as it turned out there was so much controversy over the President addressing our children that our school wisely declined to show it.
          It’s ashamed that it has come to this, that we do not want our children exposed to our President. And please don’t play the race card that is irrelevant. I just don’t like radical socialist, wantabe dictators.

          • Michael

            The children are being indoctrinated in Socialism from kindergarten through college and have been for quite some time now. Notice in Obama’s speech that he sets a goal for our country to be the world leader in college graduates by 2020. And why not, it’s easier to implant his goals for America in young unsuspecting minds than it is to fool adults. Both in Hitler’s Germany and Russia the children were coerced into informing on their parents which in itself had a chilling efect on family life. Imagine having spies in your own home who share your blood type. Your tiny loved ones turned from inocent infants to brazen betrayers.
            As heartbreaking as this may sound it is just the tip of the proverbial iceberg when it comes to what this Godless man has in store.
            My ancestors first landed on the shores of this continent in 1680. Proud people who hacked a living out of the wilderness. My great grandfather 10 generations before me lived here, raised family here and died here before this country was even named America. Since then we have been knee deep in every struggle, every local dipute, every world war and fist fight that was required to build this nation into what it is today that makes people from around the globe seek to make this their home. We did not come this far just to let this two bit usurper, liar, manipulator create his own private country club.
            We all know what we have to do, write letters, write faxes, e-mail and shout it out to any one who will listen. And for God and Country’s sake, politics is no longer a game we play once every four years on one day. From now until we are out of this mess it needs to be a full time concern.
            Remember, “The price of Liberty is eternal vigilance”

        • eyeswideopen

          I’m sure everyone of you know exactly what and how your childrens teacher is teaching on a daily basis. That’s just wonderfull and it’s a lie. The speech the Pres. gave and the Speech George Bush gave are very similar. Oh that’s right, actually George started us down the socialist road with all his big spending, on the socialist government run Medicare program, Homeland security office, etc, etc… but we can’t admit that, noooooooooo, what kind of good little follower’s would we be then? Our mantra is deny, deny, deny. But let’s burn the books just in case somebody wants to read the records!!

          • DaveH

            Eyes,
            There was no mention of Bush in the comments you were responding to.
            Alright we get it, you hate Bush. But Bush is out, and in case you haven’t noticed Obama is the here and now. If we think Obama is bad, must we go back in history and complain about every other president’s actions?

    • Robin from Indiana

      Tamra… I agree. I told my teenager if the speech to the children was televised at his school, I would support his decision to walk out. None of this would have been an issue if it would have been televised in the evening so parents could answer any questions children might have.
      I do not believe Barry either. He is making a mockery out of our great nation, and hopefully I continue to pray that everything he is messing up will be fixable. Scary times we live in. I fear more for my children and my granddaughter. All we can do is stay active in politics, keeping up on what is going on, and making sure those around are educated as to who is running for what and what their beliefs are. It’s going to be tough, but in the end I believe right will win over wrong….

      • rodin

        Again Robin, you show us that you are from an extreme fringe… not a single fact to support your argument but a lot of hate and fear.

    • rodin

      So Tamra – you got a lot of accusations without a single FACT to back them up. You’re so full of rhetoric, you’ve forgotten how to think.

      • John

        Rodin you’re the one that is full of hate. You’re attacking everyone on this site with a vengeance. It’s ashamed what this country is coming too. People like you so full of hate and haven’t a clue what you’re talking about.

        • Smilee

          John

          She is not showing any hate, I think that those of you who say that just have a guilty conscience because it is you who deep down know you are filled with hatred and rather that acknowledge that transfer it to any innocent you disagree with

          • John

            Funny how you guys play the hate-card over and over, just because we do not agree with him. I’ll try again I do not hate the President, I do not like what he stands for.
            Got it?
            Or what socialist countries language do you understand and I’ll try again?

          • DonnaH.

            Smilee, I bet you was dropped on your head alot when you was a baby, right along with Rodin.

          • eyeswideopen

            Donna,I can see why we can’t get anything done, if anyone makes a comment that you rt-wingers don’t like the name calling starts right away. Girl it doesn’t bother us, and it just take you to a belittling position. I really wonder what all of your mothers taught you about anger and name calling. You guys must have been the bullies in school as that seems to be your knee jerk reaction to any statement made that you don’t like. ( I’m gonna call you a bad name and maybe you’ll go home.) That attitude is so juvenile and denotes a weak cause.

          • Smilee

            DonnaH. says:
            September 11, 2009 at 9:10 am

            No, Donna I was never dropped on my head at any time and such a statement by you say more about your character or the lack thereof than it says about me.

  • musclehead

    Margaret Sanger…birth control? is that what you think she stood for? you’ve got to be kidding, right? She was a radical abortion advocate! for you “numbskulls” out there, this procedure is the Murder of an innocent human being that has commited no crime…just murdered for the convenience of a unwilling Mother to-be, & don’t give me that “in the case of harming the Mothers’ life” bullkwap…the incidence of death in childbirth is so rare, with the “modern” techniques & acute care, but who needs all that nonsense.
    As far as Obama, he is the embodiment of all that is wrong with America today, he was raised in a radical environment with an underlying theme….destroy the infidel…He is a manipulator that thinks that the White House is his playground.. He does’nt understand the scope nor does he have respect for the Office of the Presidency, he is so incredibly under-qualified…If we ever get a chance to look into his hidden past, i.e. school, travel, association records, etc., we will finally see that he along with the so-called “main stream” media, had pulled off the biggest scam on the American people in history…remember, what goes up must come down…

    • hopeforamerica

      Musclehead; I’d not heard of Sanger before. Abortion is personal… no one particularly a man, can make that decision for a women!

      As for Pres. Obama, what the hell do you mean by, “destoying the infidel”? And Why are you so angry ? The fact is, Obama is a great man and a great president. He’s progressive which is what we need. Progress (Innovation) will get this country back on its feet and make us energy independent utilizing sustainable clean energy technologies. For America to become competitive and create jobs that cannot be outsourced to other countries, we need to create clean energy jobs right here in the good ol’ USA.

      It’s always technology and innovation in our capitalistic society that has spurred a healthy and prosperous America.

      • DaveH

        Your last sentence is correct. But this country has prospered under Capitalism in spite of Big Government (until the last decade at least).
        What we will have under government-controlled energy choices is higher energy costs and more special-interest corporations getting rich with Big Government’s aid at the taxpayer’s expense.
        Al Gore will think of you lovingly as he is jetting around the world polluting our atmosphere and enjoying his new-found riches.

        • rodin

          Dave, when you get an economics degree I might give some credence to your argument of prospering under capitalism. As it is there are very few Americans that understand what capitalism is and how it relates to our economy. Yes we have one of the least regulated economies, but we also maintain huge subsidies, protectionist trade barriers and regulatory and (yes) bureaucratic oversights for all types of industries. If you study a little bit of history, you’ll see the Republicans have actually been responsible for more subsidies and trade impairments than the democrats. And as far as BIG GOVERNMENT – take a look at the setup of homeland security – one of the biggest nightmarish big brother setups EVER. Face it you got hood-winked and you don’t even know it.

          • Michael

            Rodin, I know when I smell a rat and my sniffer alarm is now going off after reading a couple of your previous post. Your type accuses others of spreading hate and fear when that’s exactly what you, yourself are doing now. Accuse people of organizing at town hall meetings and calling them angry mobs when your guy Obama is the king of organizing.
            You are a victim of your own indoctrination. They must have spiked your Cheerios with Saul Alinsky while you were still a child, last week.
            The jig is up. The cards are all on the table now. The annointed one has become a mere mortal now. After he is gone we’ll just hose out the pen and forget about it.
            As far as being an economist goes, I don’t think you are qualified either. Besides, you don’t need to be an economist to know that things started to suck on Nov. 7th 2008. That’s when people stopped spending because they new soon the fit was going to hit the shan.(intensional dislexia)
            And another thing, I trusted Bush with Homeland Security and The Patriot Act because he used these tools effectively to capture and ward off all enemies of the United States while he was President. Your guy, on the other hand has turned these agencies inward on our own citizenry with remarks like that of Janet Napolitano who said that our returning soldiers/heros had all the earmarks of domestic terrorist.

            So I will close with saying that if the true feeling in your heart is that of hate for this country then why do you stay here? there are plenty of established socialized regimes such as Cuba, Venezuela and on and on.

          • Smilee

            Oh Michael things have sucked for the last thirty years and to say it started nov. 7th is an out and out lie and rodin makes a whole hall of a lot more sense on any issue she talks about than either you or DaveH do and all you do it put her down for telling the truth

      • eyeswideopen

        We prospered until some bright no regulations for capitalism idiots, removed the laws safeguarding us from greedy crooks. It passed in 1999. History shows that capitalism cannot be self monitored,or self restrained, it is a wonderful system with regulations. In the 80″s (Regan’s time) the Congress deregulated the Savings and Loan industry, guess what happened? Yep, the Savings and Loan crisis, which cost us 283 Billion dollars. History shows we just paid that off, when low and behold they deregulated the Banking industry. Can anyone say how much did that cost us??? Sometimes government has a function, which is to protect us from ourselves, and to protect those trusting souls who invested because our “leaders” told us to invest in America!!! and we did, and we did, and we did,. What do you mean my IRA and 401K plan are worth dirt??

      • musclehead

        “HOPE” what a word….hope is an empty word, nothing ever gets done by “hope”, You self-righteous Liberals love to scowl at us “Normal” people just because we use common sense…Hopeforamerica says we need the “Progressive” Obama! You just don’t get it…history proves you wrong. If being “Progressive” means that we can Murder babies at will, push for Homosexual marriage, throw away the Constitution, stop defending freedom by using deadly force, legalize marijuana, take God out of Public view, rely on non-proven junk science to push the Green agenda, well then you can count me out… You Libs are so self-absorbed in your cause that you throw away all the God given common sense that you were born with. History, which is of no use to Libs, proves that a society that follows your “idea” condemns itself to extinction. Radical leaders such as Obama are Narcisictic, his background and his own words, i.e.(The Audasity of Hope, etc) give us an insight to his extreme view of America. Many leaders throughout history have taken the same approach and all the affected societies have met the same fate. Trying to build the perfect society always means to take from the “rich” and give to the “poor”, what a beautiful concept! except that in the real world it does’nt work that way…no matter what you do there will always be the “poor” and there will always be the so-called “rich”. Obama and his “Ilk” demonize the wealthy yet the weathy are more apt to employ, create jobs, donate to charity, than the down trodden… Political policies cannot possibly find a way to make everyone “equal”, we all have different IQ’s & abilities, etc. trying to “level” the playing field always has a “loser”, and its usually the guy who works the hardest, he gets punished for excelling, while the guy who benefits by anothers’ hard work just gets lazier & expects more & more, his initiative is squashed…and that is what we have today, a society of people who have been taught out of their initiative to achieve. Enough said for now, I have to get back to “crackin” the whip on my employees.

      • eyeswideopen

        Dave, what do you think happened in the last ten years?

    • John

      We loose our insurance period. What is so hard to understand about that? Our employers can opt out of the insurance/healthcare (for less $$$) that we currently have and bingo we’re in socialized healthcare. Ever been to a county or general hospital? Well that’s what we’re in for but much worse. If their plan is so great then why doesn’t Pelosi and company want any part of it? This is a power grab its not all about healthcare. Don’t be fooled.
      Yes we need to do something about healthcare but to make this a socialized country is NOT the answer. Again it’s a power grab.
      Also, I didn’t see where Ralph made any racist comments. I’m tired of people playing the race card. I thought that after Obama was elected we wouldn’t be subjected to that garbage anymore. Was I ever wrong. We have a president who appears to be a dictator wantabe. His Czars, the people that he surrounds himself with, going after the CIA, and yes kissing Chavez’s ass, and not too mention everyone in the middle east, specifically the countries that hate us. Everyday its’ something new, Van Jones, addressing our children in school. Sure no big deal they say, but what about his original message to our children, remember they had to change his curriculum.
      PLEASE WAKE UP!!! If not for yourself for your children.

      • Smilee

        Newsflash. Your employer can dump your health insurance right now if he wants to unless you are covered by a union contract, but I think you know that but want to spread this BS based on all the hate that you posses

        • Michael

          Well let’s see now, Which is the greater of two evil’s, Big Insurance or Unions? That’s a cinch, Union’s are the greater of the two evil’s. Don’t get me wrong though, I am no big fan of Big Insurance however, at least there are some benefits to be gotten from insurance companies. And I never had an insurance claims adjuster threaten to break my leg if I didn’t agree with him about card check.

          The fact’s are that employers will drop employees like hot potatoes as a result of the government incentive to do so. The incentive will be in the form of a so called fine for not covering employees. But here’s the clincher, it’s going to cost the employers less to pay the fine than it would to cover employees with health care. Once dropped, employees will have no choice except to opt for government health care.

          • Smilee

            Cut the BS michael, Go on the labor department site and you will find that union members make over $200 a week more than non union people and that does not address the greater benefits. Where I worked those in the union retired with about $1000.00 a month more pension that the non union people, I actually draw about $1200.00 a month more and of course more SS because SS is based on you income when you worked (40 best quarters) so all total I make about $1800.00 each month more that them, Still sound like unions are all that evil, ask any retired union member or do the research on line and you will discover how devoid you are of the truth on most issues here

        • John

          Newsflash. Ok how immature. I’ve had health insurance for over 40 years; and really I could loose my health insurance at any time? Thanks for the Newsflash.
          Health insurance is NOT the issue that I was discussing.
          No I don’t possess hate, but it’s obvious that you libs do. Either you people play the race-card or you turn too the hate-card when you can’t come up with anything better

          • Smilee

            Can the BS john

  • Robin from Indiana

    So the libs think a public option is what this country needs. Wow… If it was that simple, how come Hilary couldn’t pull it off? I am content with the health care I have. I do not want to be responsible for those who do not have health care. If this actually makes it through, which I sincerely hope it does not, it will be the biggest mess ever. Anything that is connected with the government brings a mountain of paperwork. If you thought dealing with the insurance companies is a nightmare, it will seem like a sweet dream once you have to deal with the government! If you have doubts, try calling the government for help with anything! Have you ever tried to get help with finding out tax information? What about those of you who have served in the military? Paperwork, paperwork, and more paperwork. And for those who have no patience or are challenged by having to mess with getting answers to questions about how to go about filing papers, etc., do you think it will be better with the government smack dab in the middle of it all?
    Obama is not out to help the middle class. If you really think that then you are disillusioned. He wants the personal friends he has to jump on the White House band wagon with him and enjoy the high life while they can. And… yes… what goes up must come down….

    • DaveH

      Well said Robin.
      I am under the gun of our wonderful IRS right now. I had no income in 2007, but I did have a bunch of stock sales that year with a net loss.
      So, I took them at their word in the tax booklet (no income, no filing necessary). So 2 years later they informed me that I still needed to file my Schedule D with the transactions listed. So, I complied with that showing on paper that my net income was zero. Then I received a letter 4 weeks later saying they were still considering my filing and would let me know within 45 days. Now I am wondering if the thieves are going to find some way to steal my money with a non-filing penalty.

  • hopeforamerica

    NEWS FLASH! Insurance Companies are going to continue to take away benefits, increase their rates, co-pays and deductables.

    The Public Option is the only way to keep insurance companies from taken advantage of hard working people!!!

    And by the way, the GOP … Coburn are liars. Have you seen how much money the insurance companies have lined their pockets with campaign contibutions?? The GOP is blinded by Dollar Signs and forgetting about us the people who elected them to office!!!

    • DaveH

      News Flash! If the Federal Government’s plan doesn’t break even, they will just dip into the tax till. So they can set whatever low premiums they want, as they won’t have to worry about going out of business. Hardly fair competition! As someone I know once said “Get your head out of your Arse!”

    • larry

      I DON’T KNOW JUST WHAT KIND OF INSURANCE YOU HAVE BUT MINE HAS BEEN GOOD TO ME FOR OVER 30 YEARS .. THE ONLY PROBLEM I EVER HAD WAS NOT WITH INSURANCE COMPANIES .. IT WAS WITH DOCTORS CHARGING TWICE FOR THE SAME SURGERY .. I AM VERY GLAD THEY WERE THERE FOR ME .. THE DOCTORS ARE CHARGED A LOT OF MONEY SO LAWYERS CAN FILE SUITE AGAINST THEM … IT ISN’T INSURANCE THAT IS THE PROBLEM .. IT IS THE LAWYERS THAT CAUSE INSURANCE TO GO UP … NO INSURANCE COMPANY IS GOING TO COST MORE THAN WHAT THIS HEALTH PLAN IS GOING TO COST …

      • Smilee

        How much has your premiums gone up and I do not mean your share of it and how much has your coverage and choices changed during this time. If you have good insurance you can choose your doctors so if thats the case why did you stick with doctors you describe as being crooks.

    • Liberty

      One of the best ways to bring insurance costs down, would be to allow the insurance compnies to cross state lines. THAT would truly increase competion among health insurers.
      To set the record straight, President Obama received more in campaign contributions than McCain did.
      I do understand your problem with Senator Coburn though, since he pointed out that there IS no constitional authority to do ANY of this healthcare stuff, (as well as all the czars, cap and trade, taking over private industry, and the bailout itself and the list goes on and on) because in doing so, he indirectly points out that your hero has violated his oath of office, ‘to protect and defend the Constitution’, but after all, he IS just a politician.

      • DaveH

        I would say one thing positive about Obama. He is not doing this alone. Liberals say that Congress has no right to ‘vet’ his Czars. They not only have a right, but an obligation to vet them, as the Czars are involved in making policy for FCC, or DEA, etc., and the power to make policy (law) is reserved for duly-elected representatives of Congress. The executive branch is only supposed to enforce the laws that Congress passes. So Congress needs to get off their dead-donkeys, quit passing on their responsibilities, and start doing their Constitutional duties. They aren’t, so we as responsible voters need to relieve them of their duties and put people in office that will do their jobs right.

        • eyeswideopen

          You aren’t telling Repubs to vote out Repubs are you,,, never happen. LOL, LOL, LOL!!! Ok, Dave, I want to know what kind of drink you had prior to signing on.

      • Smilee

        Liberty says:
        September 9, 2009 at 10:13 am

        Health insurance in most cases except Medicare and the VA are mostly regulated by the states Any insurance company can apply for the right to sell insurance in any state if they want to and are willing to meet the regulations of that state, many are not so they do not apply or are denied because they will not, You imply they cannot sell in any state now and that is not really true, what you are really suggesting is get rid of these regulations and only have it regulated at the federal level and let them sell you a policy with oodles of small print that will end up shafting the patient and to date this has happened a lot despite the regulations states have albeit some states do a much good job others do.

        No where in the constitution does it prohibit health care and it is clear that you lack understanding of insurance regulations and also the constitution. We have a lot of conservatives today making false claims about what the constitution is and can do and interpret it as they would like it to be rather than what it really is. I have listened to Senator Coburn many times and this man has little regard for the truth and often misrepresents the constitution for I believe reasons known to only him. Do you really want us to believe he believes that Medicare, Medicaid and the VA are all unconstitutional. Believe me if conservatives really believed that they would file suit to get them stopped but they know if they tried they would end up with egg on their face and they also know to keep the support of the far right wingers they have to tell them these lies to keep them inline.

        • DaveH

          Just in case some of you are inclined to get your knowledge of the Constitution from Sleepee (I’m still trying to figure out the name of the dwarf that he really reminds me of – you know, the mental one) here is a link to the Constitution of the United States:

          http://www.cato.org/pubs/constitution/constitution_en.html

          Amendment 10 says “The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.”

          Now, see if you can find anywhere in the Constitution where it says that the Federal Government has the power to force us to buy insurance or the power to take over the health care system in this country.

          • eyeswideopen

            Show me where is says I have to buy car insurance in order to drive?? Where does it say I have to pay a universal user’s fee to the phone company to help off set costs in rural area’s? Why do I have to pay a surcharge on coal being used for my electric company? Why do I have to pay school taxes,when I don’t have children? Why do I have to pay for Parks when I don’t go there? Why do I have to have a driver’s license? Why do I have to pay for highways? and Red Lites? Shall I go on? None of these things are addressed in the Constitution, yet we concede that is what is best for this society to function. It is age discrimination to expect the younger generation to cover the cost of Medicare, when it will not be there for them in their older years. Why should any of us pay into it, just give the old people back their money, it’s not that much anyway, and let them try to figure out how to pay for healthcare. Easy, You don’t want reform? Fine !! Let’s cancel it. What your parents have it and like it?? and you don’t want to have to pay for their healthcare? TOO BAD. Reform it, or Cancel it.

          • Smilee

            DaveH says:
            September 9, 2009 at 2:10 pm

            Medicare, Medicaid, VA, social security and numerous others are done by the Congress of the US and if you were right don’t you think the far right wingers would have challenged this in the courts, fact is they would have egg on their faces when they fail because the constitution does give them this power and we will do health care reform at the federal level and it will be legal, your saying different does not make it so.

            The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defense and GENERAL WELFARE of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States.

            I get my knowledge from the constitution and the supreme court interpretations of it and do not go off on a tangent and interpret it as I would like it to be like you do and then try to pass it off as you know what you are talking about.. Far right wingers always have their own meaning of the constitution and try to convince everyone they are right when it fact the supreme court time and time again proves them wrong, they have been screaming for years about this and have not been able to prove their point anywhere

          • DaveH

            Eyes,
            I think the auto liability insurance requirements are State laws. To be sure they were coerced by the Feds with highway fund bribery.
            But if you must know, I don’t think the government has the right to force us to buy any product. It doesn’t work anyway. The irresponsible people, who are the problem, ignore the law and don’t buy auto insurance anyway. However, with auto liability insurance the argument can be made that we are endangering other people and their property. No such argument can be made for Health Insurance.

          • DaveH

            Sleepee,
            Then why would the framers of our Constitution have bothered to put in the 10th Amendment if the Federal Government had the power to do whatever they want? Get real, you are clutching at straws. People in power are never going to willingly constrain themselves. We the people have to ride herd on them and make sure they obey the Constitution. Only the most starry-eyed Liberals think that “the pursuit of happiness” or “the General Welfare” gives the Federal Government unlimited power. You know nothing of Constitutional law. Don’t pretend otherwise.

          • Smilee

            How do you explain they have been doing this for years davie, fact is you are the one who is wrong you claim to be right and guess what we do have many of these programs at the federal level and they are perfectly legal and if we succeed in getting what Obama talked about last night it to will be legal to so can the BS as you are one grasping at straws the courts have not struck down any of these plans despite you claiming to know better than them, it only illuminates your ignorance and arrogance

    • Smilee

      hopeforamerica says:
      September 9, 2009 at 7:30 am

      You are right insurance costs have been going up for the last thirty years, more premiums with less benefits if you can get coverage at all. Isn’t it amazing how so many here want to keep the status quo and thinking people know without government intervention it will continue to go up and the longer we wait the worse it will get, at some point in time it will happen but the longer the wait the more expensive it will be and the more pain people will experience. Listening to most of those here makes it clear to me they really to not understand how health care works or how to fix it and DaveH constantly keeps me aware of this with his silly statements.

      • DaveH

        Your ears are still bookends to a vacuum, Sleepee.

        • Smilee

          You still are not able to make an intelligent statement of any kind are you davy, is there hope that you will ever goow up????

          • DaveH

            About as much hope as your learning to spell or think.

          • Smilee

            Thinking is a skill set the good lord neglected to give you that is why we get all those stupid statements from you

        • eyeswideopen

          Dave, what happened to your mantra of no name calling?? Smilee, must really be making some points. Facts, Dave, Facts, nothing but the facts,remember? No name calling, except, I give you permission to call me LIBERAL. LOL. just type in my name and let it rip.

          • DaveH

            Eyes,
            I have said before that I will give an individual the same type of treatment they give me. Sleepee insists on using Liberal tactics, so I am just responding in kind. Unlike Jesus, I don’t turn the other cheek.

          • Smilee

            Davie

            I espouse the truth and if you wish to call that liberal tactics I’m ok with that but it has more to do with the truth than any liberal belief

          • eyeswideopen

            Dave, using liberal tactics and name calling is two different things. Don’t you preach to these kids that get out of hand to not name call?
            You have a lot of people in this site who are influenced by you, you always need to be the bigger person and not cave into to juvenile antics. When you do that, it just gives them the ok, to go off on some tangent and then an exchange of ideas is lost.

      • DaveH

        Then don’t buy it dummy. Most states mandate that you buy auto liability insurance. But gee, dummy, that isn’t government is it?

        • Smilee

          Davy’s frustrated again and when that happens he can make no sense as opposed to little when he is normal. Your name calling again

  • http://www.seawaysengineering.com Craig

    “Although investing in tobacco while selling life or health insurance may seem self-defeating,” the authors write, “insurance firms have figured out ways to profit from both. Insurers exclude smokers from coverage or, more commonly, charge them higher premiums. Insurers profit – and smokers lose – twice over.”
    1 New protections will ensure you get the care you paid for.
    2. Pre-existing conditions will be covered.
    3. No cost for preventive care.
    4. No exorbitant charges
    5. No lifetime caps.
    6.You can’t be dropped if seriously ill.
    7. Renewal is guaranteed if your premiums are paid.
    8. Young up to 26 can continue on parents policy.
    9. Those on Medicare and Medicaid no changes, except seniors will save money when doughnut hole is closed. Overpayments to insurance companies in Medicare Advantage will be ended.
    10. VA and Tricare no change.
    11. The number of family doctors will be increased.
    CEOs will see their average hourly pay of $8000 (eight thousand per hour) change, hopefully downward.

    • DaveH

      I see you’ve been smoking (but not tobacco).

      • Liberty

        Nah, I think he’s just been drinking the koolaid.

        They talk about saving all this money from medicare, why don’t they just do it. Why do they need to institute a whole new system? When they show me they can fix what they’ve already messed up, maybe I could find their promises to be a little closer to a possibility than a fantasy. They start all these programs, that don’t work, then continue to fund them and insist that they need MORE programs to fix the earlier ones.
        War on drugs – there’s still a major drug problem
        War on poverty – there’s MORE folks in poverty NOW
        Stimulus package – they claim victory even though there are MORE people becoming unemployed. The rate has shot past there “ceiling” of 9.4%, and they aren’t even counting them all.
        It’s gonna take a lot more than koolaid before I can swallow any more of their hogwash.

        • DaveH

          Liberty,
          Have you ever known a Liberal to throw in the towel? After their policies fail they just want to try more of the same. One five-year plan after another. Even after the country has collapsed into poverty and tyranny, I am sure they will still be blaming the problems on too little government.

        • Smilee

          Your as mixed up as davvy is

          • DaveH

            Sleepee,
            Where are your other 6 dwarfs?

          • Smilee

            WHAT??

            How come you never make any sense??????

          • DaveH

            I spelled it out for you in another comment, Sleepee. Must I do all your thinking for you?

        • John

          Maybe we should drink the Kool Aid too. This might help us too gain a better understanding of where they’re coming from. Because they sure as hell don’t make any sense too me.

          • eyeswideopen

            John, all of us Repub’s already drank the koolaid, while Bush was in office, Just go back and look at the bills passed in Congress from 1995 to 2006. Don’t argue, we had control during Clintons admin, you will see where we (Repub’s) grew the government enough to leave a deficit that was history making…Did you vote in 2004? If you voted for Bush, you had already had your koolaid spiked…it wasn’t your fault.

          • Smilee

            Try it John, I doubt it could get you anymore confused than you are now, who knows, it might even improve things for you

        • eyeswideopen

          Cuz,Liberty, they passed Medicare Advantage in 2003,the biggest bill in history and now they have to ammend it through Congress and the Republicans want the Big Pharma companies to still get the 200 billion per year profit from it. You know our “Free enterprise system” where we give a 400 million to IBM, for their retired employees for Pharma meds….and we do that for 6 years starting in 2006. Free enterprise for the multi million dollar companies means our tax dollars underwritting their profits. You know like the NIH grants to universities to do research for Big Pharma, who then patent those discoveries, while making 200 billion profit a year!!! Medicare Advantage (what an ironic name) is a law.

      • Smilee

        Davvy,

        These are being considered he is only quoting much of what is going to happen and maybe all will happen, only proves he is paying more attention that you are or maybe you are not capable of paying attention

  • BABUSHSKA

    It will be over for this country if Obamacare passes because it will give us $11 trillion in debt at the end of 5 years and $17 trillion after 10 years. (source: Politifact.com) That kind of debt is unsustainable and he knows it and so does Berhnake. The value of our dollar is plummeting so much that the U.N. and IMF have already called for a universal currency in just the last few days. Obama’s real agenda is to abandon all that the US holds dear, turn America into a socialist state which will become the poster nation in the “new world order”. Ultimately he will assume leadership on a global stage. You wait and watch. When he said during his campaign that he intended to transform the face of America, he meant it…to this country’s detriment, but to the advancement of his personal global agenda. And you bleeding liberals full of such hatred for Bush, chanted “change, change” and never thought to ask what kind of change? The democrats went to the polls and pulled the lever blindly, like a herd of swine racing toward the cliff’s edge, unaware of impending catastrophe. Obama has people behind him, who hold radical ideologies (shown by his czars) who are not in line with middle America, who are paving the way for this new world order. Who knows…Obama and Blair may just be the anti-Christ and his false prophet.

    • John

      Well said Babushka. We could write a journal about this guy. There are just too many issues to list. His past radical political associations and now his present actions are more radical than anything I’ve ever witnessed in my life and I’m 55 yrs. old.
      I renounced my association with the Democratic party 3 months ago, I am now a Republican, I terminated my AARP membership and renewed my membership to the NRA.

      • Rod

        Good for you John! I have been a member of the N.R.A. for many years.
        I have also talked to alot of “former” Dems. that are saying, if they
        had known what Obama meant when he said he would bring “change”, they
        would not have voted for him! (Better late then never)!Well, now we
        have 2010 elections comming up. If we all get out there and VOTE,
        maybe we can rectify what we have brought on to our selves!

        • John

          Thanks Rod. I also enrolled my brother in the NRA.
          This is BS what is happening too this country. I don’t want any part of the change that Obama is proposing for this country. I really enjoy my freedom and have nothing but respect for our military. I could go on about the things that I love about this country, the things that this President is trying too CHANGE!

    • chuck byard

      YOUR ASSESSMENT OF OBAMA IS RIGHT, UNFORTUNATELY WE HAVE A BLOCK OF 44 MILLION PEOPLE IN THIS COUNTRY WHO WOULD LIKE TO SEE OUR GLORIOUS LEADER RULING THE WORLD. THE PROBLEM IS A LOT OF PEOPLE BELIEVE THIS GUY IS AN INTELLECTUAL, IN MY ESTIMATION HE’S A PUPPET OPERATED BY DANGEROUS PEOPLE BEHIND THE SCREEN. THEY HAVE IN OBAMA A PERSON WHO SPEAKS GOOD, NOTHING MORE, A CON MAN, ONE THEY CAN USE TO PUSH AN AGENDA THAT WILL EVENTUALLY TURN THIS COUNTRY INTO A LIBERAL MARXIST TYPE NATION SOMETHING LIKE WHAT HAPPENED IN RUSSIA IN 1917. I BELIEVE SOME OF THE PEOPLE BEHIND OBAMA ARE DESCENDANTS FROM THE RUSSIAN REVOLUTION, THEY THINK THEIR PAST MISTAKES CAN BE RECTIFIED AND THE NEW PARTY CAN AND WILL RULE THE WORLD.

      • DaveH

        Chuck,
        Well, he is smart enough to fool the Liberals. But then, I guess any carnival barker shouting “get your free food” could do that.

      • eyeswideopen

        For, Goodness sake, Chuck QUIT USING CAPITAL LETTERS, IT IS LIKE SCREAMING.. HARD TO READ AND RUDE. A LITTLE FOR EMPHASIS IS FINE BUT TO TYPE THE WHOLE THING IS NOT NICE.

        • chuck byard

          IF YOU HAVE YOUR EYESWIDEOPEN SHOULDN’T BE A PROBLEM. MOST LIBERALS TAKE ME AS BEING RUDE. NOW QUIT PICKING ON ME.

        • chuck byard

          Don’t get up tight, just kidding with you. i have a hard time seeing and it makes it easier to type in caps, since i am not a good typist, you know hunt and peck and its easier to see my mistakes (i make quite a few)

          • eyeswideopen

            Ok, chuck if you have a problem, I will just grin and bear it… sorry, for your problem. In most sites they don’t allow all caps, as it is hard on eyes. But for you…..You can pass on thru… lol

      • eyeswideopen

        Chuck,
        no wonder us Repubs are in trouble, you need to check your facts. 66.8 million people voted for Obama or 53%. 58.3 milllion voted for McCain or 46%. Only 125 million people came out to vote, but it was the highest total ever. Where in the heck did you get 44 million from? Oh, that’s right about 45 million are without healthcare. Easy mistake.
        By the way, the next time you pop the top on that Budweiser beer, you need to know you are helping to fund a socialist country,Belgium has three parties, Rt-wing Liberals, Social Conservative Christian Democrats and the Socialists. You need to change your beer as you are helping to fund a socialist country. How about also deciding if he is from Russian or Africa, or an Arab country. You all need to get coordinated in your hate, looks stupid otherwise. Also, once you become a Marxist, in a Communist state, you are no longer a liberal,, you have no rights. There are no social classes to aspire too. So you can call him a liberal or a Marxist but he can’t really be both.

        • chuck b

          eyeswideopen

          i just threw out the bud. when i say liberal marxist state it means just that, if you took heed of the clintons or jane fonda this is exactly what they wanted, a mixture of liberalism and communism. they planned on making a perfect government in their notion. the only thing that stopped them was the 94 elections when their cronies got voted out of office. mr. obama has the same situation now and if the demo’s win in ’10 you can bet we will be standing in line to get our rice ration.
          by the way i think belgium has four parties not three. a couple of people writting on this comment page are really engrossed with their intellect and calling people stupid and liars only shows their own ignorance. the comments everyone makes about this healthcare bill is just an opinion, obama stands at the podium making all these claims about what is in the bill and whats not is pure bs. they don’t have a bill. have you read the house version? i tried.

          • eyeswideopen

            Chuck, yes I read the bill, took too many hours, but I read it. That is not going to be the bill, That is why Obama stated exactly what he wants in it. He was letting the Congressman do their jobs, however he really didnn’t know this would get into a situtation where fear and lies were being used to scare the elderly. He really thought that we would all play nice. I bet we, you and me won’t even recognize the bill to be the same when it finally comes out for a vote. If it is not what he promised, then I start calling and rasing hell.

    • Smilee

      No one has estimated in ten years for the cost to be over 1.3 trillion and you think its going to be 17 trillion, the president said last night that it was going to be 900 billion about 7% of what you claim, where did you come up with this baloney. I will not address the rest of your post as it is just to ridiculous and stupid

      • John

        The President said, you’re not very bright are you? When will you wake up and stop believing his lies??? You think you’re smart but if what the President says is your basis for argument it is no wonder that this country is in bigger trouble than ever before.

        • Smilee

          Silly boy, I was using the CBO figures and not the presidents, in fact I never mentioned the president it was you who brought him into this conversation, you certainly seem obsessed with him and bear a lot of hatred for this guy, does him being black have anything to do with it?? The president used 900 billion dollars in his speech and the BABUSHSKA post I was responding said it was 17 trillion dollars and he must have pulled that figure out of his butt as not even the most idiotic far right winger has gone that far in their exaggerations . I see you are calling people liars again, just thought I would point that out as you accuse others of this when they do not call anyone liars but you do. You seem like a very unhappy and confused person.

  • s c

    Musclehead, you proved my point! People who hate to READ [politicians, ultralibs, etc.] can NEVER justify their love for ignorance. Hate-filled is a polite way to describe Margaret Sanger and her camp-followers.
    Imagine that! America has compassionate, loving, responsible pillars of the community who’ve NEVER heard of Margaret Sanger. What’s that tell you about these people, Musclehead? Margaret Sanger singled out ethnic groups (blacks in particular) as the lowest forms of life! Her ideas were adopted by HITLER in WWII.
    Thanks, ultralibs. You did it again! You had a perfect chance to see through comrade obama, and you took the easy way out. Anybody who thinks that a ‘compassionate intellectual’ is going to give them a health care program that works is beyond irresponsible.
    We have in our midst people who won’t read, can’t think, hate everyone who doesn’t act like sheep, and they’re going to ‘give’ us the health care we need? Musclehead, these pretenders need to be in an asylum.

    • DaveH

      SC,
      Hopes and Dreams are a powerful combination. They don’t want to hear reality in their Utopian world. Don’t worry, we will get another 5-year plan in 5 years.

  • Rod

    The lefties listen but they don’t hear, they look but they don’t see.
    They are however, beginning to trip over their own mouths.

    Obama can stand on his head. He can blow it out of— oops,well, you
    know what I mean The real Americans know what he is up to. Problem
    is: The real Americans are not running the country, (right now)!!!!

  • Rod

    The Obama/Palosi (so called health care plan) has nothing to do with
    yours or mine health care! It’s about taking over our lives, taking
    away what freedoms we have left. Their not looking for answers, their
    not looking for questions and most of all their not looking for ideas!
    their looking for world wide domination, starting in our back yard!

  • Rod

    By the way, Thanks S.C.

  • Rod

    I have said it before and I will keep on saying it! Obama needs to
    go back to Kenya (where he was born) and take Palosi and his 33 czars
    with him. He could start a revelolution back there- – - I hear they
    are not as particular as we are!

  • http://www.seawaysengineering.com Craig

    http://screencast.com/t/LtVRy1E99
    This is an interesting graph. I’d like to hear the comments on it.

    • DaveH

      Something is wrong with the graph. If the GDP in 1929 was approximately equal to the GDP in 1940 in 2009 dollars, then the GDP in 1929 would be approximately equal to the GDP in 1940 in 2000 dollars. But it isn’t.

  • DaveH

    I could figure out the ridiculous nature of insurance when I was only 20. You pay a middle-man money which he promises to give back to you someday (minus his cut) but only if you suffer misfortune. If you are disciplined and not reckless, your probability of suffering that misfortune are even less than the average man. But even if you are average you will still lose, because that middle-man gets his cut. So, you are betting ‘against’ the odds (unless you are reckless and undisciplined) that you will suffer misfortune. That is the only way you will get paid. Kind of a ‘half-empty’ glass kind of thing. I prefer to bet ‘with’ the odds that I won’t suffer misfortune. That way I keep my insurance premiums (including the middle-man’s cut). And in the long run, I will be far ahead of those people who succumb to fear and buy all that insurance.
    Now, let’s get to the government’s plan. Not only are all the above conditions still true, but on top of that the middle-man (the government) is surly because he has no fear of losing you as a customer. And also, because he is in power and looks at your choices with contempt, he has no problem interfering with your doctor/patient relationship to make your choices for you.
    I won’t get into the ways that government has gotten us into this current health-care mess as this comment is already too long. But, rest assured, we are in this mess because of Big Government. To me it is just common sense that if you turn your choices over to the government, whose people have nothing to lose if they are wrong, you are going to suffer much more injustice than you would at the hands of the free-market health care providers.

  • s c

    DaveH, you did something that our ‘mental giants’ in Congress can’t do. In less than 1 page [LET ALONE 1,000+ PAGES], you explained the health care mess. That puts you at the head of the class. So much for WAXMAN. So much for comrade obama. So much for ALL of comrade obama’s czars. So much for the deluded masses who confuse love with ramming a totalitarian government POWER SCAM down our unwilling throats.
    You have proven that America doesn’t need this Congress. As far as I’m concerned, you can pick your replacement, kick the nearest congressional bum out of office, go to the White House and tell those
    what’s what, and then get on with the business of solving the mysteries of that which is utterly beyond their combined abilities (taking care of the American people, no matter whose power-mad feet get stomped).

    • DaveH

      Thank you SC.

      • Smilee

        Davy You toss out a big heap of bullshit and S C sniffes it and says it smells good and they you say thank you, WOW rational people are laughing their asses off at you two

  • Dickie

    I,just wish the young people & some old,Would read & look back in history,Not listen to their parents on just this one part in life,Like I told me children,To look at these people we put in office for theirselves,It is not hard to do,Like my dad told me son listen & try to see how they voted on ideas,Even though they lie to you because they will not pass an accountability law,So I have been trying to keep up with the lesser of evil,For 40-yrs,You can believe this or not buy it is the truth as I see it,Fact I am 61-yrs old,Been paying social security,since 1966,every wk,Been paying fed tax,Then medicare,then madicade,When I started listening to these thugs,EVERY TERM,AGAIN LISTENING TO THESE THUGS,The same old lie,same old smile,same old baby kissing,same old jeans tee shirt,hand shake,The same old speech tried of big goverment,I WILL LOWER TAX’s,I WILL TAKE CARE OF SOCIAL SECURITY,I HAVE MORALS,ETHICS,I AM A FAMILY MAN,I AM A CHRISTIAN,I LOVE THIS GREAT LAND,I don’t know how they can say fix their mouths to even say these thing’s,But it musy be hard but they do,And for 40-yrs they have ALL LIED,The reason we don’t haves jobs now is THEY gave them all away to other countrys for kick backs,Now pelosi & reid are pushing hard to make illeagles leagle,To take more jobs jusy for votes,They have stolen our social security,How am I going to retire at 62[crap],Retirement was 55-60-62-65-now 68,Because they have stolen it all,They take pay offs not to persue these doctors,hospt’s for robbing medicare,& the people flieing false claim’s,Setting foreign people up in hotel’s,gas station’s resturant’s,& many other bussiness’s,And not paying taxes for 10-yrs.Have you been in vets hospt,My GOD it is damn well pittyful,But they care of sport players,movie actors,& politituions,athiest’s muslum terroist ,Better than our MILITARY,They vote for their own rasies,While they held us back,Bush tried to pass a law that when an election comes around,that lies,false hoods,family’s left out of the dirt,But they & mostly demon-craps said hell no,Just look at this trash we have in their now,All were proven taxs cheats,moral issue’s,Just look at what in the hell bill clinton did,& cost the american people,Damn people love to get screwed,He is still robbing us,They even draged out his impeachment to the end,But he is still their.WE THE PEOPLE NEED TO STOP THESE CAREER SCOUNDREL’S.The first year is $1,000,000,000,000.00,I think this is right,But it is one trillon dollars,FOR THE FIRST YEAR, JUST THE FIRST YEAR,They have SCREWED ALL THIS I HAVE SAID IN THE PAST,[FACT] AND NOW YOU WANT THIS IDOIT TO TAKE OVER HEALTH-CARE,DAMN REMEMBER PEOPLE PELOSI-REID-BOTH CLINTONS,TRIED THIS CRAP THEIR TERM,THEY HAVE NINE DAMN YEARS TO GET IT RIGHT,AND [NO]ONE KNOWS WHAT IS IN STILL,EXECPT PELOSI-REID-& THE CLINTIONS,& THEY [WILL NOT]EXPLAIN IT TO NO ONE,HUSSEIN DON’T EVEN KNOW!!!.YOU TELL ME,Have you heard anyone of these thugs tell the people in these town hall meeting what is ALL in this garbage,HELL NO.& They won’t,There is one thug[SAID HE WAS NOT GOING TO EVEN READ IT[HE DID NOT HAVE TIME!]Damn I would love for those suckers to give me his job,These career thugs,Did throw us a few crumbs,But THEY HAVE NOT DONE A DAMN THING FOR US,BUT LIED TO THE BLACK PEOPLE,& WHITE PEOPLE.They NEAL TO ALIENS,LEAGLE & ILLEAGLE.But when your country try’s to ask questions & these tyrant’s call American people nazi’s & un-american,Because we want answer’s,& they won’t give them,And see we don’t want it, Why can’t WE vote on it,They can always fix that like the election.You please tell one good thing that the demon-craps have REALY DONE FOR THE BLACK AMERICANS,BUT LIE TO THEM OVER & OVER.

  • Vicki551

    The left keeps saying “If you like your current plan, you can keep it.” That would be true for only awhile until the provisions written into HR3200 kick in that do not allow your insurance company to sign up any new customers. How long will your private plan be able to stay in business as customers inevitably die or businesses leave it and opt for public because it’s cheaper or less trouble? If your insurer is driven out of business or your policy is changed in any way, you will not be able to “keep your plan or insurer” even if you liked it. The proposed House bill, HR 3200, specifically states that you will be required to go to the public plan and will not be able to just move to another private plan or change plans within the same insurer.
    Also, you’ll only be able to keep your current doctor as long as he is able to stay in business. If the mandates from the government become so oppressive as to drive good, American trained doctors out of the profession, there will be fewer and fewer qualified practitioners for more and more patients. Soon, we’ll be raiding third world countries of the few doctors they have left (as the other socialized medicine countries have been doing for years) because they will be the only ones willing to work under the draconian conditions spelled out by the government bureaucrats. New innovations in medicine will no longer be cost effective to pursue and the entire world will suffer as a result.
    If the American medical system is so terrible, why do people come from all over the world (especially from countries with socialized medicine)to partake of it? Why would they pay for inferior, expensive care here when they could get ‘superior care’ for free at home from their own government? Why aren’t Americans fleeing our so-called overpriced and inferior system to obtain their medical care from those much more ‘enlightened’ and efficient government run systems found in such countries as Cuba, Canada, Great Britain, France or…?

    • eyeswideopen

      Vicki, do you really think poor or middle class people can afford to come here for treatment?? Please! We do have people leaving this country and going to Mexico, Canada, Cuba, Sweden, France to get healthcare. Our doctors have been leaving medicine for years, it is normally because they have to pay so much for insurance. They feel as though they have to run more tests than necessary due to the lawsuits they can incurr. This in turn drives up the cost of everything associated with the healthcare industry. It is a fallacy that you always get to keep your healthcare provider. If your company decides to change providers your network of providers changes. Most companies change providers about every three years, looking for one with lower rates, so you lose your Dr. anyway. When the HMO’s took over this country, Dr.’s stopped making medical decisions and the HMO’s started. This is when rationed healthcare started. My Dr. who is only 53, just had to hire 2 more assistants just to handle the insurance paperwork. He stated he spends more time dealing with paperwork than being able to speak to patients. He is taking early retirement as he feels as though the people he see’s without insurance is causing him to become depressed and he will just teach.

      • Smilee

        A doctor friend of mine initially hired one nurse and one office gal, today he has three office gals and not only that he spends about 40% of his day talking with insurance companies and managed care people himself so he had to cut back his patient load about that same amount and also increase his charges about that much with no added income to himself, this is not true with the Medicare patients as you do not have to that with them because the government does not require that but the private sector does and it has been costing us dearly but most who post here do not seem to care how the private sector does things and after 45 years Medicare experience that demonstrates they do better they still say the government will only do it worse despite this proof

      • DaveH

        My girlfriend’s Dermatologist quit accepting Medicare patients (she was one) because the government was interfering too much with her (Dermatologist was a woman) doctor/patient relationships.

        • eyeswideopen

          That is really sad, as the poor elderly now lose another specialist, seems as though they keep getting the bad end of the stick.

        • DaveH

          That is because government, not being subject to market-place forces, is not as efficient as the private sector. If the free market can’t do it cheaply and efficiently, the government sure can’t. Mind you, we have not had free markets for a long time.

          • Smilee

            DaveH says:
            September 10, 2009 at 11:20 am

            First Medicare operates on less that 8% overhead, while the free market insurances operate at 20-40% overhead and require a lot more time and paperwork from the providers so they can get paid and that cost is not figured into that figure, Medicare’s paperwork is far less so your statement is totally incorrect, government is more efficient as it does not get involved in looking over your doctors shoulder near as much as the private sector and does not have to make a profit. Wait until you get on Medicare and you will see for yourself how much better you get treated, I sure found that out as have most others when they get to that point in their life. Slightly over half of the health care is provided solely by the free market and mostly regulated by the states which have a wide variety of regulations and some states do a good job and some are terrible. I totally do not understand where you are coming from when you say “we have not had free markets for a long time” you seem out of touch on this.

        • Smilee

          Davie

          I have had immediate family members on Medicare since day one (1965) and I now am on it myself and also many friends and your statement here is total BS, Medicare never interferes as it does not manage care in any way like insurance companies do and yes a few doctors do not accept Medicare but most do. (they do pay less) In fact the government does not even manage making the payment or do the paperwork on the claims, Mine is done in Fargo ND by BCBS and they is sent to MN for my Blue Cross there for the supplement claim and I get a notification from both. You obviously know nothing about Medicare and if someone told you what you say here they are pulling your leg.

  • Rich

    Wow I read a lot of comments how the Democrats were fiscally responsible during Clinton, which if memory serves was a Republican Congress/Senate, so in reality it was the Republicans who were fiscally responsible with a Democrat as president. They also seem to forget the fact that during most republican presidential terms it is Democrats in charge of Congress/Senate and many stupid things happen when one party is in control of all 3 (Presidency, Congress and Senate). Proof in point Republicans passed the abomination to liberty called the Patriot Act, spitting on the constitution in the process and opening doors that to be blunt should never have been opened. Democrats always raise taxes on everyone when they are in power, if not directly then indirectly by allowing tax break incentives passed by republicans expire. I am not saying this is right, and am only picking on the Republicans above, but I am saying look at history of just the past 50 years and you will see the complete corruption of both political parties here in the US. I am no conspiracy theorist, the government is NOT out to get me. I do believe that government is a necessary poison to liberty and only in moderation can liberty remain alive. Big government, weather local, state or national will always become corrupt when the citizenry allows it to take too many of the liberties they enjoy away through any means. Gun Control only removes guns from the hands of law abiding citizens, I mean you don’t put locks on your doors to keep honest people out, it is to make it harder on criminals, but they still get in.

    The biggest problem with Democrats in power is they LOVE to create new and creative bureaucracies in order to confuse and hide what their real agendas are, Republicans are well Van Jones said it best ‘Ass Holes’ and ya know what at least I know where I stand with (WORD REMOVED FOR OFFENSIVE CONTENT), can I say the same about a person who hides behind paperwork. Can I say the same about someone who creates new government agencies with no, 0 , knowledge of how they will be funded? I may not agree much with Van Jones on ideology or anything else but at least he had the balls to state what he believes, until tonight listening to the president talk about health care reform to congress I had NO clue what he stood for other than the empty statements of ‘Hope’ and ‘Change’, well hoeep for what and change what?

    I am sick of the race card Obama could be purple with green polka dots and antlers and i still would be against any government ran option. It is asinine to think that a government that has created a deficit as large as ours could ever be financially responsible. It is ludicrous to think that health care rationing will never and could never become a reality. they never thought that Social Security could go broke and look at what is happening now with that.

  • DaveH

    The smooth-talker-in chief has spoken. All our problems are solved. He will fix the problems with Medicare (hmmm, is that an admission that the government can’t run things) and then add new government duties. Of course this 5-year plan will work, trust him!

    • eyeswideopen

      Dave, you profess to want smaller government, if this reform reduces the amount of oversight required by government agencies, is’nt it a step in the right direction?. What or how would you like to reduce it? What agencies should be disolved?

      • DaveH

        Eyes,
        Reduces Government oversight? Where did you get that? Read the Bill!
        You know I remembered now that you said something once about banking deregulation. I forgot to answer. Read this:
        http://www.reason.com/news/show/130348.html

        • Smilee

          Davie

          This is another far right propaganda site and as you should know propaganda sites do not tell the truth, Its interesting that you keep referring us to all these type of sites. If you went to all sites you would get all views and only then could you make objective conclusions but as long as you only read these types you will be kept in the dark and will never know the truth. Try opening your mind it can do miracles as the truth is always enlighting

      • DaveH

        Eyes,
        Most of them. I would start with the FCC. Then the Department of Education. Then the Department of Homeland Security.

    • Smilee

      He inherited that mess too, in the preceeding years Bush and the republicans did nothing about it at least he is trying, funny how this drives you up a tree

  • DixieConnie

    If in fact this is such a GREAT plan, why is there such a HARD BALL approach, the used car sales tactics. If is were that good, wouldn’t it be just that: a good plan and really no selling is necessary. It seems that the wolf is crying so loud he can not hear himself. I would not buy anything from anyone that won’t allow me to think about it but just trust them its good. What is wrong with this picture?

  • BABUSHSKA

    Obama IS a liar and Joe Wilson was right to call him out. How can he expand health care coverage to millions more people and also cut costs at the same time? He’ll do it on the backs of senior citizens by cutting medicare over 10 years through the “elimination of waste & fraud.” Ha! Well, why in the world hasn’t that been done for the last 45 years?!!

    He says if HC isn’t passed now, millions more will die. Ha! What about the millions of seniors who will die because they’re judged too old for a pacemaker, surgery, or whatever it is that will be too costly for the system? Just give them a pain pill as he said earlier. The SOB!

    Why isn’t Obama working to keep medicare and social security solvent? That’s the real crisis here!!

    And if illegal aliens are now NOT going to be covered, what is his plan for them?

    What is his plan to pay off the deficit?

    He is lies, deceives, omitts, and misrepresents the truth. I want to see him go down!

    • Smilee

      BABUSHSKA says:
      September 10, 2009 at 10:53 am

      You are pathetic and so not informed. The last 45 years?? Bush and his republican buddies gave us this expensive addition to Medicare in 2003 (isn’t that just 6 years ago) by adding Parts C and D and increased the costs of Medicare by almost $600 billion for the next decade and beyond even more and these plans he added are from the private sector that that medicare pays the premiums for it caused this increase over and above what it would have been had he not messed with it and it gives the individual less choice and managed care that limits your doctors choices which the original medicare does not do and the original has all the legal protections such as not being able drop you or deny coverage etc that the Bush plans can do, What Obama is proposing is to pay these providers the same way all other Medicare plans are paid and this will bring it back to how things were done pre 2003 and produce $600 billion in savings to help pay for Obama’s new plan this is not BS and very attainable. BABUSHSKA, you are the liar about this not Obama, there are many ways to cut waste out of the system if there is a will to do so, of course the insurance companies do not want you to know that and will tell any lie to avoid the ability to make this easy money they now make and make them go back to earning it the old fashion way or the honest way. Wouldn’t that be nice.

      • chuck b

        IT’S GOOD TO HEAR SOMEONE AGREES WITH OUR GLORIOUS LEADER’S PLAN AND NOW THAT HE HAS CALLED EVERYBODY A LIAR WHO REJECTS SOME PARTS OF THE BILL, WHAT BILL IS HE TALKING ABOUT? THERE ARE SEVERAL VERSIONS BEING CONSIDERED AND THE LIBERALS CAN’T AGREE ON ANYTHING. SO WHAT BILL IS OBAMA TALKING ABOUT, FURTHERMORE I PERSONALLY DON’T THINK HE’S GOT ENOUGH MUSH BETWEEN HIS EARS TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THIS IS ALL ABOUT. I THINK HE IS EVEN A BIGGER LIAR THAN BILL CLINTON. CAN YOU SEE THE STRINGS DANGLING DOWN FROM UP ABOVE THAT THE PUPPETEERS STEER HIM WITH. BY THE WAY YOU SAID YOU REMEMBER $.16 PG GAS AND $.20 CIG’S, I CAN BEAT THAT AND ALSO REMEMBER FDR WHO STARTED FEEDING ALL YOU LITTLE LIBERAL’S WITH THE NRA AND WPA, THATS WHERE IT ALL STARTED.

        • Smilee

          Your post is totally devoid of any facts, only name calling etc, that tells me you are incapable to converse on an intellectual level, so calling the most intellectual president we have had in a while names etc. is laughable if it wasn’t so sad and untrue. Do you realized what it says about your character, not much, you seem t lack any. If you had facts to support your stupidity I’m sure you would rub them in out faces without any facts you come across as just another far right hack devoid of any intelligence.

          • chuck b

            smilee
            please tell me how you arrived at considering yourself such an intellectual? you judge others as less and call them liars. you ask why i didn’t state any facts, “what facts” do you have facts that obama knows what he is talking about? he doesn’t, that might hurt your liberal feelings to talk about our less than intelligent leader this way,but he sure has suckered a lot of you good people. let me know when you get the facts on this health care bill i will be more than happy to write your leader and tell him, then we can discuss it more intelligently. have you bothered to read this garbage bill? at least i tried.

          • Smilee

            YOUR FIRST POST:

            chuck b says:
            September 10, 2009 at 9:27 pm

            IT’S GOOD TO HEAR SOMEONE AGREES WITH OUR GLORIOUS LEADER’S PLAN AND NOW THAT HE HAS CALLED EVERYBODY A LIAR WHO REJECTS SOME PARTS OF THE BILL, WHAT BILL IS HE TALKING ABOUT? THERE ARE SEVERAL VERSIONS BEING CONSIDERED AND THE LIBERALS CAN’T AGREE ON ANYTHING. SO WHAT BILL IS OBAMA TALKING ABOUT, FURTHERMORE I PERSONALLY DON’T THINK HE’S GOT ENOUGH MUSH BETWEEN HIS EARS TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THIS IS ALL ABOUT. I THINK HE IS EVEN A BIGGER LIAR THAN BILL CLINTON. CAN YOU SEE THE STRINGS DANGLING DOWN FROM UP ABOVE THAT THE PUPPETEERS STEER HIM WITH. BY THE WAY YOU SAID YOU REMEMBER $.16 PG GAS AND $.20 CIG’S, I CAN BEAT THAT AND ALSO REMEMBER FDR WHO STARTED FEEDING ALL YOU LITTLE LIBERAL’S WITH THE NRA AND WPA, THATS WHERE IT ALL STARTED.

            MY FIRST POST:

            • Smilee says:
            September 11, 2009 at 7:30 am

            Your post is totally devoid of any facts, only name calling etc, that tells me you are incapable to converse on an intellectual level, so calling the most intellectual president we have had in a while names etc. is laughable if it wasn’t so sad and untrue. Do you realized what it says about your character, not much, you seem t lack any. If you had facts to support your stupidity I’m sure you would rub them in out faces without any facts you come across as just another far right hack devoid of any intelligence.

            chuck b says:
            September 11, 2009 at 12:26 pm

            YOUR SECOND POST:
            smilee
            please tell me how you arrived at considering yourself such an intellectual?

            MY RESPONSE:
            I’m flattered that you assumed I an intellectual as I have never characterized myself that way or ever used that word to describe myself.

            YOUR SECOND POST:
            you judge others as less and call them liars.

            MY RESPONSE:
            Show me where I called others liars and now look at the FIRST post of yours that I responded to you called our president a liar twice that is your style not mine

            YOUR SECOND POST:
            you ask why i didn’t state any facts, “what facts”

            MY RESPONSE:

            I think you answered your own question, you simply to not have any, you called him a liar and failed to tell us what he lied about and that was why I asked you to give me the facts and you ignored my question and went off making wild and untrue accusations. The closest you came to a reason he lied is you said “I PERSONALLY DON’T THINK HE’S GOT ENOUGH MUSH BETWEEN HIS EARS TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THIS IS ALL”. From this you assume he lies, What a stupid statement. What bill is he talking about? You ask that, well, if you had listened to him you would have known he was not talking about any specific bill he was talking about what he wanted to see in a bill. You apparently do not understand how the process works and both parties when they have been in power do it that way, It is a work in progress, cannot you even understand that. Your problem appears to be a closed mind incapable to listening to anyone other that your self. You go ahead and talk to the president if you can arrange it but he made it pretty clear he would only talk and listen to those who are interested in solutions and as you are not and worse you seem totally confused about what this is all about and clearly show your ignorance with these idiotic posts of yours that make little or no sense. An intelligent discussion?? I doubt you can accomplish that and I conclude that from your posts as in them you demonstrate that.

            YOUR SECOND POST:

            do you have facts that obama knows what he is talking about? he doesn’t, that might hurt your liberal feelings to talk about our less than intelligent leader this way,but he sure has suckered a lot of you good people. let me know when you get the facts on this health care bill i will be more than happy to write your leader and tell him, then we can discuss it more intelligently. have you bothered to read this garbage bill? at least i tried.

    • eyeswideopen

      He’s planning on doing it different from Bush, who made 1.885 trillion in tax cuts, while passing a Medicare bill at a cost of over 800 billion, this in addition to paying for two wars!!!. Do you not get it that, other than our wonderful wars, Medicare costs us more than another expenditure? It didn’t use too, but hey 2003 came and when it left we had a deficit that is trying to strangle this country. Where were you? Were you complaining at that time? Didn’t you care about our kids then?

  • DaveH

    When Income tax law was passed in 1913 only 1% of the population paid taxes. When Social Security was passed in 1935 the payroll taxes were only 2%.
    Make no mistake, once government gets their foot in the door, the costs always go up.

    • Smilee

      Gee Davie I remember when pop was a nickel a bottle, cigarettes $.20, a pack, candy a nickel a bar, gasoline sixteen cents a gal. etc etc etc. Isn’t kind of naive of you to not expect cost of government not to go up too, are you capable of understanding that. We have changed the income tax many times over the years so the comparison you make is BS too. You mentioned up the page a ways and asked did if you had to do my thinking for me, davie I’m not convinced you even know how to think for yourself much less me and as for thinking for me thats way above you abilities, so be smart and give that up, I hope I did not offend you by asking you to be smart as I know how hard that is for you

    • eyeswideopen

      Oh, for God’s sake, Dave, we cannot go back 200 years and live like that again. Get in real world, use your intelligence and help resolve these horrid problems that we have. Talk about living in the past, at least I only go back 8-10 years to review and remind that we don’t want to follow the same path. You are trying to take us back so far, we can’t even phatom it.

  • Rod

    Well, Obama,s at it again and again and again. His lies are getting bigger and looks like a jack in the box when he begins his lies.
    The people are no longer buying his lies. He wants socialism and
    sees himself as dictator. He wants our freedom and our lives. We
    have to fight back!

    • Smilee

      People are listening to Obama but few if any believe your lies that your kicking out here, of course there are a few here who do especially davie he believes anything that makes no sense.

      • eyeswideopen

        Smilee, what in the heck do you think these people will do, when the economy turns around and everyone has healthcare? What will they do when we start rebuilding our infrastructure? What will they do when we are no longer so dependent on oil? What will they do when America regains our standing in the world? What will they do? It is sad when over 37 million of them are routing for failure, isn’t it? History won’t be very kind to those who are trying to obstruct success.

        • http://ahalbert@smart-technology.net Allan Halbert

          What will progressives do when the economy doesn’t turn around? Blame Bush, of course.

  • raymond f dobbins

    comments removed for offensive content

  • s c

    DaveH, experience is a great teacher. Only those who don’t understand the English language pretend that medicare and social insecurity are not classic government failures. Now, we’re being told that our wannabe fascist government will do health care “right,” and that this loving, compassionate government will be our savior.
    Beyond that, we are expected to believe that everything that erupts from comrade obama’s mouth is a fact. This is supposed to be some kind of ‘proof’ that America will benefit from the many ‘changes’ he wants.
    If he and his doting stooges would be willing to pay for these ‘changes’ out of their own pockets, I might give it a try. However, since these multi-faced con artists specialize in spending other people’s money, they hate accountability, their words get re-defined daily and we’re supposed to see the new prez as something of a potential god, common sense says we’re about to be had – again. DaveH, how many medicares, social insecurities, wars on poverty, drugs and paranoid great societies are enough?

    • eyeswideopen

      S.C.
      every time I state that we should get rid of them , the people on this site act like I’m trying to kill their babies. If you truly believe they are socialist programs, let’s repeal them.

  • BABUSHSKA

    Smillee:
    I normally don’t resort to name calling because it typically denotes a weak cause, but if your response to my posting indicates anything, it is that your education, or apparent lack of, is obviously pathetic, to use your own word. Nothing but run-on, non-sensical sentences, no punctuation, missing words and certainly no coherent or valid points made. When I posted the question, why hasn’t the govt done anything about the waste and fraud in the last 45 years, I was referring to another one of our “great” entitlement programs besides social security and medicare, MEDICAID — which began in 1965, (OK, so it’s actually 44 years) and has had tremendous amount of corruption, fraudulent billing and a total lack of federal oversight. You are so naive to think that Obama speaks the truth….someone whose personal and professional associations like that of Rev. Wright, Van Jones, Wade Radke, Cass Sunstein and Obama’s 29 other czars make it apparent that “like associates with like.” They hate this country and the free enterprise it stands for. Their fascist goals are to make the private sector serve the state. It’s obvious that Obama, along with the despicable filth that come out of the mouths of his liberal friends, needs to be judged by the company he keeps!!!!!! Touche’.

    • Smilee

      YOUR FIRST POST

      BABUSHSKA says:
      September 10, 2009 at 10:53 am
      Obama IS a liar and Joe Wilson was right to call him out. How can he expand health care coverage to millions more people and also cut costs at the same time? He’ll do it on the backs of senior citizens by cutting medicare over 10 years through the “elimination of waste & fraud.” Ha! Well, why in the world hasn’t that been done for the last 45 years?!!
      He says if HC isn’t passed now, millions more will die. Ha! What about the millions of seniors who will die because they’re judged too old for a pacemaker, surgery, or whatever it is that will be too costly for the system? Just give them a pain pill as he said earlier. The SOB!
      Why isn’t Obama working to keep medicare and social security solvent? That’s the real crisis here!!
      And if illegal aliens are now NOT going to be covered, what is his plan for them?
      What is his plan to pay off the deficit?
      He is lies, deceives, omitts, and misrepresents the truth. I want to see him go down!

      • MY RESPONSE TO YOUR FIRST POST

      • Smilee says:
      September 10, 2009 at 6:01 pm

      BABUSHSKA says:
      September 10, 2009 at 10:53 am
      You are pathetic and so not informed. The last 45 years?? Bush and his republican buddies gave us this expensive addition to Medicare in 2003 (isn’t that just 6 years ago) by adding Parts C and D and increased the costs of Medicare by almost $600 billion for the next decade and beyond even more and these plans he added are from the private sector that that medicare pays the premiums for it caused this increase over and above what it would have been had he not messed with it and it gives the individual less choice and managed care that limits your doctors choices which the original medicare does not do and the original has all the legal protections such as not being able drop you or deny coverage etc that the Bush plans can do, What Obama is proposing is to pay these providers the same way all other Medicare plans are paid and this will bring it back to how things were done pre 2003 and produce $600 billion in savings to help pay for Obama’s new plan this is not BS and very attainable. BABUSHSKA, you are the liar about this not Obama, there are many ways to cut waste out of the system if there is a will to do so, of course the insurance companies do not want you to know that and will tell any lie to avoid the ability to make this easy money they now make and make them go back to earning it the old fashion way or the honest way. Wouldn’t that be nice.

      • BABUSHSKA says:
      September 11, 2009 at 10:11 am
      Smillee:
      I normally don’t resort to name calling because it typically denotes a weak cause,
      BABUSHKA, YOU FREQUENTLY CALL PEOPLLE NAMES NO CAN THAT BS.
      but if your response to my posting indicates anything, it is that your education, or apparent lack of, is obviously pathetic, to use your own word. Nothing but run-on, non-sensical sentences, no punctuation, missing words and certainly no coherent or valid points made.
      I DON’T BELIEVE FOR A MINUTE YOU FOUND MY POST COHERENT AND MY POIINTS ARE TOTALLY VALID. I CAN NOT HELP THEY ARE BEYONG YOUR ABILITY TO UNDETSTAND.
      When I posted the question, why hasn’t the govt done anything about the waste and fraud in the last 45 years, I was referring to another one of our “great” entitlement programs besides social security and medicare, MEDICAID — which began in 1965, (OK, so it’s actually 44 years) and has had tremendous amount of corruption, fraudulent billing and a total lack of federal oversight.
      HERE IS WHAT YOU POSTED: Why isn’t Obama working to keep medicare and social security solvent? That’s the real crisis here!! JUST WHERE THE HELL DID YOU MENTION MEDICAID OR DO YOU SEE MEDICAID, FACT IS YOU NEVER MENTIONED MEDICAID AND I DIDN’T ADDDRESS IT EITHER AS I STAYED ON TOPIC. I WILL NOT RESPOND TO THE REST OF YOUR POST BECACUSE IT IS TOTALLY IRREVANT TO HEALTH CARE AND IS NOTHING MORE THAN AN EXPRESSION OF YOUR HATE AND STUPIDITY. IT WOULD BE NICE IF YOU PEOPLE HERE COULD STAY ON TOPIC AND QUIT GOING OFF ON THESE IRRELEVANT TANGENTS.

      You are so naive to think that Obama speaks the truth….someone whose personal and professional associations like that of Rev. Wright, Van Jones, Wade Radke, Cass Sunstein and Obama’s 29 other czars make it apparent that “like associates with like.” They hate this country and the free enterprise it stands for. Their fascist goals are to make the private sector serve the state. It’s obvious that Obama, along with the despicable filth that come out of the mouths of his liberal friends, needs to be judged by the company he keeps!!!!!! Touche’.

      • Smilee

        SORRY I HIT THE SUBMIT BUTTON BY MISTAKE, WILL FINISH IT HERE, MY RESPONSES TO HIS POST ARE IN CAPS, THE OTHER IS babushska’s ALSO SORRY ABOUT THE DUPLICATION

        BABUSHSKA says:
        September 11, 2009 at 10:11 am

        Smillee:
        I normally don’t resort to name calling because it typically denotes a weak cause,

        BABUSHKA, YOU FREQUENTLY CALL PEOPLE NAMES NO CAN THAT BS.

        but if your response to my posting indicates anything, it is that your education, or apparent lack of, is obviously pathetic, to use your own word. Nothing but run-on, non-sensical sentences, no punctuation, missing words and certainly no coherent or valid points made.

        I DON’T BELIEVE FOR A MINUTE YOU FOUND MY POST WAS NOT COHERENT AND MY POINTS ARE TOTALLY VALID. I CAN NOT HELP THEY ARE BEYOND YOUR ABILITY TO UNDERSTAND.

        When I posted the question, why hasn’t the govt done anything about the waste and fraud in the last 45 years, I was referring to another one of our “great” entitlement programs besides social security and medicare, MEDICAID — which began in 1965, (OK, so it’s actually 44 years) and has had tremendous amount of corruption, fraudulent billing and a total lack of federal oversight.

        HERE IS WHAT YOU POSTED: Why isn’t Obama working to keep medicare and social security solvent? That’s the real crisis here!! JUST WHERE THE HELL DID YOU MENTION MEDICAID OR DO YOU SEE MEDICAID, FACT IS YOU NEVER MENTIONED MEDICAID AND I DIDN’T ADDRESS IT EITHER AS I STAYED ON TOPIC. I WILL NOT RESPOND TO THE REST OF YOUR POST BECAUSE IT IS TOTALLY IRRELEVANT TO HEALTH CARE AND IS NOTHING MORE THAN AN EXPRESSION OF YOUR HATE AND STUPIDITY. IT WOULD BE NICE IF YOU PEOPLE HERE COULD STAY ON TOPIC AND QUIT GOING OFF ON THESE IRRELEVANT TANGENTS.

        You are so naive to think that Obama speaks the truth….someone whose personal and professional associations like that of Rev. Wright, Van Jones, Wade Radke, Cass Sunstein and Obama’s 29 other czars make it apparent that “like associates with like.” They hate this country and the free enterprise it stands for. Their fascist goals are to make the private sector serve the state. It’s obvious that Obama, along with the despicable filth that come out of the mouths of his liberal friends, needs to be judged by the company he keeps!!!!!! Touche’.

  • BABUSHSKA

    BTW Smilee: touche’ is pronouced too-shay. It means the making of a successful counterpoint in an argument.

  • Bob S

    I have a couple of comments. One,Pres. Obama will be re-elected For a second term, without a doubt. TWO He will get all the Democrats, Blacks, Illegals in the country, plus any Muslims. Mark My word and there are many more of them than there are REPUBLICANS.

    • eyeswideopen

      Bob, the majority of the new voters (young people) are who put Obama in office. But yes, you are right, the moderate Republicans don’t like our elected officals making an ass of themselves and trying to scare the elderly. I still think we should pass a law that when an offical speaks, they are under oath. This would stop all the lying and misconstruing of facts. We can’t trust our elected officals as they are all just trying to either stay in power or regain power.

    • http://ahalbert@smart-technology.net Allan Halbert

      I agree. The reason Obama doesn’t represent the majority on issue after issue is that his entire strategy is to build a coalition of disenchanted minorities.

      He will do everything possible to buy those votes with entitlements. He will walk on as many small businesspeople as it takes, or until their goodwill and money are exhausted. The sad thing for all is that small businesspeople are the ones who could help and inspire minorities more than govt ever could.

      Forget the lawyer. Forget the community organizer. Forget the professional politician. Vote for a small businessperson if you get the chance, for they are the backbone, the problem-solvers, and innovators of America. The more payrolls and govt. regulation they’ve dealt with, the more successful their reform ideas will be. Give them extra credit if they have military or true volunteer experience. We desperately need these well-rounded people in place of the politicians in Washington.

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