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A ‘Turning Point’ Election?

October 29, 2012 by  

A ‘Turning Point’ Election?
PHOTOS.COM

We are eight days out of another “turning point” election. Like the one before it, the one before that and the one before that, we are told by one camp that the election of candidate A will bring ruin upon the Nation, while the election of candidate B will bring us salvation; and from the other camp we get the inverse.

But what will the election turn?

Certainly not the growing totalitarian police state. The liberty-stealing USA Patriot Act was such an important part of the 2008 campaign that Barack Obama had a campaign position paper on it (since scrubbed from the Web) that promised to seriously amend the act and install provisions to protect civil liberties. It stated, “As president, Barack Obama would revisit the Patriot Act to ensure that there is real and robust oversight of tools like National Security Letters, sneak-and-peek searches, and the use of the material witness provision.” Yet in 2009, Obama signed a Patriot Act extension that removed the few civil liberties that remained in the bill.

And rather than pass legislation to provide Americans some protection from warrantless searches and seizures, the Obama Administration and a complicit Congress (so much for a Republican Congress preserving liberty) passed the National Defense Authorization Act — signed by Obama on New Year’s Eve — that suspended habeas corpus and sanctioned the indefinite detention of Americans. The President also decided ad hoc that he could be judge, jury and executioner and slay anyone — Americans included — with drones; trials not necessary. He has simultaneously claimed he didn’t support it while sending out an army of lawyers to have it upheld in court.

During last week’s Presidential theatrical presentation in Boca Raton, Fla., Mitt Romney confirmed ad nauseam that he agreed with the President’s policy on NDAA, drone strikes and targeted assassinations. It’s one of the few policy positions that Romney hasn’t flipped on. Invoking boos from the audience during the GOP debate performance in the South Carolina, Romney staunchly advocated for the President’s right to targeted assassinations. He essentially said, “You can trust us Presidential guys. We never lie or do anything illegal.” Right.

Federal spending? Hardly. Both Obama and Romney spent several minutes trying to out-macho each other on military spending. Obama even went so far as to say that sequestration — across-the-board military cuts that were part of a policy he pushed through Congress (his protestations that he didn’t notwithstanding) — would not happen under his watch. Romney has promised to increase military spending by $2 trillion. Both have promised to cut the growth in government, but neither have made significant cuts part of their plan.

Foreign policy? Perhaps by degrees. Romney spent almost half his talking time agreeing with Obama’s Afghanistan timetable, his Iran sanctions, his Syria policy and his “Pockkeeston” policy. Both demonstrated that America’s foreign policy is subservient to Israel’s. Obama mentioned Israel 17 times during the debate; Romney 14. Obama has carried on George W. Bush’s foreign policy on Afghanistan, Iraq, Pakistan and Africa during his more than three years in office. Romney has employed many of Bush’s foreign policy advisers. Beyond Romney’s more aggressive stand against Iran, not much will change there. Oh, yeah, Romney says he won’t apologize for America.

Socialized medicine? Not likely. Obamacare is, essentially, Romneycare (Robamneycare?). Romney once claimed proudly that his first day in office he’d repeal it. Then he sort of, kind of said he’d repeal it — but maybe not all of it because, after all, 26-year-olds mooching off their parents’ insurance is a wonderful thing. There’s really no need to grow up prior to age 27.

Now, Romney says he plans to repeal and replace Obamacare. Republican lawmakers say they like many of Obamacare’s provisions: especially those that provide a sop to whatever aggrieved class — like worthless 20-somethings who vote? — they happen to be targeting while lining the pockets of their corporate masters with your money.

The Federal Reserve? Fed Chairman Ben Bernanke has all but sealed the fate of the fiat dollar with quantitative easing to infinity. Bernanke was a Bush holdover re-appointed by Obama. Using Obama’s words and policy decisions as a guide, it’s a safe assumption that Obama would welcome the demise of the dollar and its replacement as reserve currency by some worldwide World Bank-backed fiat money.

For his part, Romney has alternately praised Bernanke and condemned him. Now, Romney says he won’t reappoint him. Not so fast, says Bernanke, I may quit. It’s a crime that he didn’t quit before he destroyed the world’s economy and Bush “abandoned free market principles to save the free market system.” Romney says he wants to appoint someone who shares his “economic views.” That means money printing and bailouts and a continuation of bubbles and busts.

Tax policy? We may be onto something here. Obama is a “spread-the-wealth-around” kind of guy. He has said so, and he was mentored by communist Frank Marshall Davis and raised by his socialist mother, stepfather and grandparents. He advocates trickle-up poverty. He loves to use high-minded phrases like “fair share,” which is progressive code for thievery.

Romney is a “free market” kind of guy — well, at least as corporatists see the free market. That is one that is over-regulated, overburdened and tilted in favor of those who buy off the most lawmakers and bureaucrats. In other words, a fascist corporatocracy. He did, after all, benefit from the system.

But are their plans really that different? Obama’s tax plan would negatively impact nearly 1 million companies: small businesses that employ about 60 million Americans. He wants to let the so-called (and misnamed) Bush tax cuts expire at the end of 2012. He wants to raise the top two tax brackets from 33 percent and 35 percent to 35 percent and 39.6 percent. He insists it will only affect the wealthiest Americans: those earning more than $200,000 per year ($250,000 if married).

Romney wants to reduce tax rates but limit deductions. He says the top 5 percent of taxpayers will continue to pay 60 percent of the taxes. Sounds reasonable, right? That is if you’re a socialist distributionist and until you learn that Romney has now changed his definition of middle class. Where it used to mirror Obama’s $200,000, now it has dropped below that threshold. The top 5 percent includes those earning slightly less than $200,000 adjusted gross income. Obviously, there’s more to Romney’s plan and, in fact, much of it remains nebulous; but to think that Romney’s plan is strikingly different from Obama’s is fanciful dreaming. He isn’t advocating a tax overhaul that would make accountants and tax attorneys unnecessary or setting a flat rate for everyone or anything else beyond a tinkering around the edges of the regressive tax structure now in place.

Gun laws? Difference by degree. Responding to a nonsensical question about “assault weapons” from an uncommitted nincompoop in the audience during the second debate, Obama said: “We’ve done a much better job in terms of background checks, but we’ve got more to do when it comes to enforcement. But I also share your belief that weapons that were designed for soldiers in war theaters don’t belong on our streets.” Reductio ad absurdum. But it reveals, in living color, Obama’s belief that law-abiding citizens shouldn’t have guns.

For his part, Romney claimed: “I’m not in favor of new pieces of legislation on guns and taking guns away or making certain guns illegal. We, of course, don’t want to have automatic weapons, and that’s already illegal in this country, to have automatic weapons.” So Romney also fails to understand the phrase “shall not be infringed.” As Governor, his record on gun rights was poor. He’s since flipped on the issue so much it’s difficult to anticipate where he will go next.

I know my Republican friends don’t want to hear these things — especially this close to the election. But Romney is better than Obama in only a few areas and only by degrees. He likely won’t, as Obama has, hand over fistfuls of dollars to failing “Green” industries. But it’s not because he doesn’t believe in corporate welfare; he does. It’s just that those failing Green industries aren’t Romney contributors. But the big banksters are.

I understand you can argue that, as a Republican, Romney will nominate better Supreme Court Justices (John Roberts, Anthony Kennedy, David Souter and John Paul Stevens notwithstanding) than Obama. And I understand the neocon wing of the Republican Party — which is now the dominant wing — appreciates Romney’s bellicosity toward Iran and Islamofascists around the world. And I understand that Obama’s policies have been disastrous and four more years of them — especially as he’s unfettered by re-election concerns — will only be worse than the past three and a half. And I understand that Republicans don’t want to hear any criticism of Romney (and haven’t since he secured the nomination because “anything is better than Obama”).

But can’t Republicans at least admit that if Romney ran his current campaign but called himself a Democrat they’d be calling this a “turning point” election and saying that if Romney wins, the Republic is doomed? And can’t Democrats admit that were Romney their standard bearer this election cycle, they’d be defending him like there was no tomorrow?

Until the majority is willing to admit these truths, there will never be a true “turning point” election.

If we remain on the current path (whether guided by Obama or Romney), the dollar will crash, liberty will continue to be eroded and fascist corporatocracy will continue to grow. Neither candidate has put forth a single policy proposal that takes us on a different path, and it’s probably too late anyway. One hundred fifty-one years of increasing centralization and 99 years of fiat money has taken too big a toll.

Oh, I almost forgot. Unlike Obama, evidence seems to indicate Romney is a natural-born citizen. I’ll give you that. And since he’ll have an “R” after his name, everything will surely be OK. After all, Republicans have never fixed prices, increased entitlements, raised taxes or grown government. They are, after all, advocates of small government, lower taxes and free markets. Just ask them — or, better yet, listen to their stump speeches. But then watch what they do.

Maybe in four years or eight years or 12 years or 16 years or 20 years we’ll be ready for a real liberty candidate. Maybe then we’ll quit settling for the “lesser of two evils” just this one more time — if there’s a country left to govern by then.

Addendum

I had finished writing this column when I learned of the new double entendre Obama campaign ad cut by Lena Dunham. I linked to it, but I urge you to spare yourself from watching it and enduring an “I-just-threw-up-in-my-mouth” moment. Dunham starts by talking about how “the first time” should be with a “great guy.” By about 15 seconds in, it’s obvious she’s talking about voting, not sex. But the ad is childish, crude, creepy and boorish, especially coming from the campaign of a man with two young daughters.

This from the party advocating abortion on demand and up until the moment of birth. This from the party that booed God.

Also showing how low the Obama campaign has fallen is the softball Rolling Stone interview in which Obama tells Executive Editor Eric Bates that kids can recognize that Romney is “a bullshitter.”

These items reminded me of just how immaturely the whole Obama camp has carried itself for more than three years — sort of like a group of overprivileged frat boys on a long bender. So I have to admit that one thing will change if Romney’s elected: There will finally be an intelligent adult in the White House.

Bob Livingston

is an ultra-conservative American who has been writing a newsletter since 1969. Bob has devoted much of his life to research and the quest for truth on a variety of subjects. Bob specializes in health issues such as nutritional supplements and alternatives to drugs, as well as issues of privacy (both personal and financial), asset protection and the preservation of freedom.

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  • DaveH

    Now we sit back and wait for the Liberal Progressives to explain that they’re the good guys, so it’s okay for them to steal other peoples’ money, and for the Neocon Progressives to explain that they’re the good guys, so it’s okay to kill other people who haven’t attacked us.

    • Vicki

      And steal their oil. :)

      • FreedomFighter

        Nobody is stealing oil – paid for in blood and treasure…the question is:

        Why dont we use our own oil and gas/coal reserves?

        Mitt is my selection for the oval office, he has the background, experiance and education to take America out of the [expletive deleted] of Obamas socialist communist dreamworld.

        Laus Deo
        Semper Fi

      • don

        please please we at one time or another had cotrol of 66% of all the oil remenber all the burning oil wells in desert storm? we had cotrol of all in last war there. what did we do gave it back did not collect a dollar. fixed all burning well have not stole a gallon of oil we leave all better that they were an never get a dime in money back that their rescurture costs

      • http://YAHOO hangman

        you say steal their oil? We pay outragious prices for it, while giving, yes ,giving them billions of our moneY in all kinds of aid. And what happens with that moiney? They use it to get weapons to shoot the hand that feeds them. We should take the oil, with all the money we have sent over, WE OWN THEM.

      • Stuart Shepherd

        Vicki- it would be nice to establish some facts before you make such a vicious accusation, but maybe you’re just like that. I don’t think we should have gone to Iraq, but once we did, I definitely think we should have made arrangements for some oil as a “thank you” from the new non-dictator administration we enabled them to establish (but probably won’t keep because of Obama’s precipitous withdrawal to make himself look politically good to the left) using the lives of so many of our men and women!! I guess they’re just the military to you and are beneath your superior sensibilities and tastes!

      • Kate8

        FreedomFighter – We CAN’T drill for our own oil. It’s all been hocked to countries like China and Saudi Arabia for buying up our debt.

        The dirty little secret.

      • http://Yahoo.com Maynard

        We know how to use artificial photosynthesis with FREE sunlight to extract HYDROGEN. We know HYDROGEN is in every drop of water. We know HYDROGEN causes NO harmful byproducts when used as fuel for vehicles and shelter.
        On the other hand it is very harmful to continue to use filthy fossil fuels polluting land, air and water, is very expensive and will harm future generations’ health.
        We got a man to the moon largely using HYDROGEN. Burning it causes one byproduct – pure water vapor. If we can move mountains for coal, waste clean water and pour expensive chemical poisoins into the land, air, and water WE CAN learn to mass extract HYDROGEN. Even bacteria can do it using waste biomass. The reason we are not? It cannot be monopolized and provide eliminate massive profits for corporations. It still can provide profits and oil resources can be used for BETTER purposes than auto fuel. Let’s insist on it.
        Romney is harmful to our workers and corporations, has the Bush Neocons who did massive harms ready to come back into the government (Papa Bush and Jeb both came to congratulate Obama when he passed the bipartisan NDAA 2012) but it is ruthless Romney who will be more likely to enjoy using it. He was a bully, impersonated a traffic cop, dodged the Viet Nam war he supported, enjoys dismantling corporations, firing workers and hiding his money abroad where it does US absolutely no good.! I have criticized Obama, but I know Romney will put us right back where Bush left us, and WORSE

      • DaveH

        Kate8,
        A week or so ago, a person was commenting as “Kate 8″. Was that you or an imposter?
        Example:
        http://personalliberty.com/2012/10/16/does-gary-johnson-matter/#comment-732917

      • http://www.facebook.com/RagesFury Rage Fury

        We didn’t steal their oil, we forced them to continue the Petrodollar. Iraq was using Euros in place of Dollars prior to the invasion, afterwards they went back to Dollars. Iran has the nerve to sell oil for gold to China in recent years. We cannot have this of course, so we beat the drums of war…

      • Gordon

        Certainly there is no reason for a 26 yr old graduate not to move out of momma’s house and live alone paying his own bills (and insurance) especially on the $160 week he makes working as a cart pusher at WalMart or burger flipper at BurgerCity. Unfortunately MOST of the middle USA is in a situation that jobs are not available…. like it or not. People with sufficient money cannot comprehend what not having any is like.

      • Gordon

        Bob LIvingston said “So I have to admit that one thing will change if Romney’s elected: There will finally be an intelligent adult in the White House.”

        AMEN, and maybe he will appoint somewhat conservative Supreme Court Justices…… which is the most important issue that we are voting on next week.

      • Murph

        @Maynard – “We know how to use artificial photosynthesis with FREE sunlight to extract HYDROGEN.”
        No, we don’t. In theory it should be able to work, but so far, no dice. There are costs.

        “it is very harmful to continue to use filthy fossil fuels polluting land, air and water, is very expensive and will harm future generations’ health.”
        Although the jury is not actully in on this, despite the media touted “consensus”, I can readily admit that burning fossil fuel by very definition produces harmful gases, regardless of whether or not the envoronment can cleanse polutants with no detriment, an argument that it is harmless would be foolish.

        ” We got a man to the moon largely using HYDROGEN.”

        Not even remotely true. The Saturns used RP-1, a mix of kerosene and liquid oxygen, which is still used for lift offs. Hydrogen is only used in the upper aptmosphere. The vast majority of rocketry today uses mixes of Nitrogen tetroxide and hydrazine, a highly toxic form of fuel so you won’t hear much about it unlwess you research.

        “WE CAN learn to mass extract HYDROGEN. Even bacteria can do it using waste biomass.”
        I agree, but we haven’t yet. At this point, the science has only been able to manufacture hydrogen as a storage fuel, meaning it takes as much energy to produce as it will provide, so effectively, you must generate power with fossil fuel and will create a match of energy, however in so doing, you will also have increased the storage requirements to the point of uselessness. If we use current cryogenic technology to decrease storage, we will open up an entire new hazard as the cryogenics are inevitably fatal to life in close proximity to storage.

        “It cannot be monopolized …”
        Probably in play, but I think they could find a way to regulate it enough to create the “needed” power elite control.

    • ableton

      ….and steal our money too!

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        Another words, Mr. Livingston; Nothing has changed since 2008, except that things only got PROGRESSIVELY worse! “Hope and Change”? Semantics…!

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        What money; oh, you mean the “debt-notes” that we carry in our wallets that we call cash?

      • TIME

        Dear Jayson,

        No, ~~ its not been only since 2008, ~~ it all started in 1840,~~ but hell why fret over the small stuff ~ the very ROOT’S of the problems we face today.

        Centerlized waste materials ~ are only ~ { waste materials } afterall now that the Mass media is all owned by the same~ 6 ~ Corporations that also oddly own the United States Corporation, You get the daily ~ Load of ” Waste Materials” ~ that these special people so wish you to eat, ~ then Parrot back,~~ like good mindless sheep.

        So in fact any Election is of the most ~ ” Important” ~ as well dire ~ when it’s based on waste materials, rather than ( TRUTH or FACT.)

        Evil ~v~ Evil ~ whats the real differance?

        So what about as on 12/12 ~ when most of the Companys left in the US will be reducing their work force by an average of 35%, ~ just how many jobs will be around for say the 2013 Colledge grads?
        How about the folks who have been UE now for over 3 years, 6 years ~ or even 10 years in some cases?

        So ~ YES 2012 elections will be just one more time that the American people act on worthless intel ~ and do as they are so comanded to do by the Corporate Machine.

        On that note did any of you hear of see anything about the { $43 Trillion Dollar Lawsuit } filed against the “”Global Bankers”" as well many within the {United States Corporation?}

        How about the CNBC guy who broke this story then ~ his 2 year old and 6 year old children were found stabbed to death ~ oddly ~ just after he broke this story?

        I am sure its just an odd coincidence, not unlike ~ after JFK said he was going to remove the FED.

        Peace and Love be with you. Got your BUS tickets yet? You don’t have long.

        • tony newbill

          Time I think the real evil that was cast down upon our nation and world was in 1913 …. and its almost been 100 years , and that is Biblical time frame about the 100 year war scripture

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        Time says: No, ~~ its not been only since 2008, ~~ it all started in 1840,~~ but hell why fret over the small stuff ~ the very ROOT’S of the problems we face today.

        Yes Time, i’m well aware that our crafted-demise began in earnest long ago. But we are discussing if there are any differences between the two candidates running for the oval-office, not when did our troubles began…peace and love to you as well!

      • Gordon

        The Japanese culture is laughing at the USA because we as a “people” spend great amounts of time and energy searching for someone to blame and expounding upon that, rather than concentrating on a solution. Since the great social experiment of the 60s the USA has become a world-joke…… ya reap what ya sow.

      • TIME

        Dear Jayson,

        Saddly there is no differance between either one. So ~ what are you left with, but a sack of crap in both hands ~ and nasty shoes.

        If Americans so wish to save what they think they have ~ then its TIME to do just that,
        The longer Americans wait the stronger the~ Fake Government we have ~ and by the way ~ have had ~ so I say this yet again, 1840 is when it began.
        { Thus America under the “ORIGINAL” Constitution ~ lasted only about 50 years.}

        What we all live under is nothing more and nothing less than the “Coporation known as the United States” thats owned lock stock and barrel buy everyone but AMERICANS ~ this platform { fails to cover any person living in the 50 states.}
        “We as in ~ all Americans ~ are little more than “GOYIM.” To the Global Bankers.”

        If anyone in America wants to really fix the problems, then First you have to know whats broken,then address it with a PEN. ~ Of what is far mightier than the sword.

        As I noted in my post, { a $43 TRILLION DOLLAR ~ Thats “TRILLION” DOLLAR ~ Lawsuit } has been filed to start to address the ROOT of this very problem

        But in so far as changing: B Omen for M Omen it will do nothing, as in there will be no change for Americans, we all still will be nothing more nor less than “GOYIM.”

        ** > Please don’t take what I have posted personaly, {its only a Message} but one that all Americans must learn, ~ only then can we as a nation address whats broken and FIX the problem.
        We can no longer allow blood to be spilled in the name of the American people by these Criminal BANKERS from the IMF and the United Nations TRC, CFR, etc…
        These insane war’s on Islam and everything else is really only a war on the American people’s freedoms. Mitt is no differant than Barry on any of these topic’s!

        Peace and Love be with all of you. Got your bus ticket yet? There not much TIME left.

      • TIME

        Dear Tony,

        Please NOTE: I said the “ROOT: ~ of the problems we face today started in 1840.

        Peace and Love be with you, Got your Bus Ticket? There’s not much TIME left.

        • tony newbill

          TIME we are hunkered down and raising a little beef here with this feeding system http://foddernw.com/Whatisit.html , I figure the elite will need to eat too and they don’t know jack about creating food …..

          • http://none ron

            O.K. I give. What happened in 1840?????

      • TIME

        Dear Gordon,

        I am not sure what value your post has in so far as the Japanes people’s thinking patterns, afterall we are using the Japanese people’s leaders ~ to Piss off the Chinese at this very moment ~ Oddly ~ they are playing along just like good little “GOYIM” should.
        So whats your point again?

        Peace and Love be with you. Got your Bus ticket yet?

      • TIME

        Dear Ron,

        Thank you for your question, please see below.

        1840 was the starting point of what can be noted as the {” take away” ) there are a number of flat tires from this date, that in concert with the issues of 1860 -1861 ~ and the advent of EO #1, that being Martial Rule or the restructuring of the Government ~ AKA as in the formation of a NEW Government ~ ( But ~ the first and formost from 1840 was the “CENTERALIZING” ~ of Government, ) or ~ the first step in removing the form of rule noted as > ( ” for the people by the people. ” )

        The next step was to allow in (” a CENTRAL BANKING SYSTEM” )
        Though not the one we have now, > but it was in fact how the door was opened for what we do have now as in the “Federal Reserve Act of 1913.”

        The next step was the changing of the following, if you understand the LAW, then this should be easy;
        We went from this form of wording being: { the United States of AMERICA} ~ To the following platform: { ” THE UNITED STATES of America” }
        Again ~ prove it to yourself, what the Legal meaning of words are when in { all ) in CAPS.
        It transends the power to the lesser.
        In fact taking away the power from the people ~ thus it went to the “Federal” level only thus by passing the people, saddly they don’t teach this in school, ~ so the logical question is why is that?
        The logical answer is ~ ” They really don’t want you to know ~ nor figure it out.” Thats how these criminals keep you as GOYIM.

        Thats why we now face what we face with people like Barry OMEN, ~ If we still had the system of power by the People for the people ~ than ~ Barry Omen would never have been able to conceal his records, nor could have GWB done so either.

        As I keep saying if the system is not fixed from the first flat tire, then it leaves the door wide open ~ for more of the same old same old. In plain words it just will never change it will be the same fight all over again.

        Please do yourself a big favor and google the following video:
        { Russel Means – we are all on the reservation now,}

        This is the best explaniation of whats going to happen to all Americans very soon, if the American people don’t get with the program really quick. By the way Mr. means also made a number of other super videos so please do watch them all.

        Also please watch this youtube video also: {A wake up call, } after that then this one ( Invisible empire_full movie a New World Order defined.) ~~ Also: ( Project ENOCH 2012)

        All of These should wake up even the bloody dead, If your an American and believe in what this nation was founded on, then this single coin crap of D v R should make you quite ill.
        We as Americans were born to be “ROGUES” ~ thats the very nature of all of us.

        Peace and Love be with you, Got your bus ticket yet?

        • http://none ron

          Thank you.

      • Peter Sagi

        Ah, but you don’t have to let them steal your money or participate in RomNutcare or Obummercare. All of that ties into use of a socialist slavestate number, which the slave enumeration bureau aka the Social Security Administration states plainly, in writing, is 100% voluntary and “not required to live OR WORK in the United States.” The income tax, according to the US Supreme Court in the earliest of decisions upolding the tax as being within the bounds of the Constitution, is an excise tax, i.e., a tax on privilege. It is only MEASURED by the income DERIVED FROM the taxable activity. For most Americans, the privilege taxed is that of “employment.”

        Employment is not always the same as simply being hired. The difference? SSN use on the job. What would otherwise be a 2 party contract is now a 3 or more party contract. SSN use on the job invites in the federal govt. You are then going thru the federal govt. as if it was a temp agency. How else could they demand on your behalf minimum wage, overtime regs, maternity leave, etc? None of that applies to mere hire without an SSN, which, again, is totally voluntary by law. If you are forced into SSN use on the job, that is due to the policy of your employer who refuses to hire without an SSN and not govt. In otherwords, the private sector is duped into doing the dirty work of the IRS. No SSN on the job means no FICA, no payroll tax for the employer, no medicare tax, no federal income tax, no state income tax, no local income tax, and no Obummercare/RomNutCare.

        True enough, what Bob Livingston states about the RomNut and Obummer both being evil jerks who shill for the international banksters and/or Israel is true. But what Bob Livingston never seems to want to discuss is an effective counter-measure to these b’tards. The way I see it, every dollar sent their way is a vote for more of the same bee ess. A massive refusal to use socialist slavestate numbers for ANYTHING by, say, 5% of the public … with the movement rapidly spreading … would set back the statist agenda by many decades at least and would be an indirect although very effective counter to the Federal Reserve as well.

        THE effective counter-measure would be to get laws passed locally that would require a plain language full disclosure of all rights waived and liabilities incurred anyone anywhere anytime for any reason asks for an SSN. Said disclosure should be both oral and in writing, initialled off point by point, signed by both parties, and three 3rd party witnesses or a notary public.

        Pete

    • eddie47d

      The thing is is that Romney is a [expletive deleted] and changes his mind for convenience. I’m surprised he believes anything he tells himself considering how often his mind shifts from position to position. Obama can sometimes run a close second (Patriot Act) yet Romney has always held first prize. .

      • JC

        Extending the Patriot Act is all you could point out for the Kenyan’s bad side?
        How about NDAA, or implementing the use of drones as tools of assasination not only here but in the Middle East in countries we’re not at war with. How about denying help to the people working in the embassy at Benghazi? The CIA says that directive came from the White House. How about spending more and putting us further in debt by an amount greater than all previous Presidents combined? How about Fast and Furious and illegally exporting guns into the hands of drug lords resulting in the deaths of several Americans and perhaps hundreds of Mexicans? Would you like me to go on, or is that enough for now?

      • Dennis48e

        JC don’t confuse eddie with facts they make his head hurt and he gets grouchy.

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        I don’t think romney changes his MIND about anything! He just changes what he SAYS! You gotta tell the people what they wanna hear, so when you’re with one group, you say one thing and when you’re with another group, you say another thing! Isn’t THAT how politics works?!?

        • tony newbill

          Nancy this describes what you are saying to a TEE , This video has a twist to its explanation of Policies , you have to watch it all to hear the twist about Obama , its 7 mins
          Obama Supporters Actually Hate Obama’s Policies
          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Skw-0jv9kts&sns=fb

      • Dano Hern

        We did steal Iraqis oil. It is piped through Jordan and Israel sells it to China But, the UN and elite have stolen our federal govt and our pentagon and Military,. No matter if Diebold lets you select a prez[sic] of your choice, unless you vote Gary Johnsonu will end up with another enemy of this great country, O or R no difference. Our country will be swallowed into Great Wars and Death, and the depression will grow by 1000%, only by design. So go vote for your best enemy.

    • Warrior

      After this episode in Libya, I personally, will be at a loss to comprehend how any AMERICAN could give this regime a vote of confidence. Like all good little “progressives”, there are NO consequences for their actions. This regime is filled with dispicable whores, thiefs and traitors. The body part that needs to be employed in this election is your brain. OUT WITH THEM.

      • eddie47d

        Good morning Warrior I see you had your daily “fix” and are ready to rumble. With your analogy then G Bush and administration would be bigger whores for the NWO. (Iraq war) Cheney would be a much bigger thief with Halliburton and a traitor to American principles. You know those 5 deferments and gleefully advocating for torture. Oh yes those 900 million dollars that Halliburton lost track of with the Bank of Kabul. Were the mismanagement of taxpayer money a traitorous act under the Bush presidency or only under the Obama administration? When Conservatives are corrupt does that make the pain more tolerable to taxpayers just because they are Conservatives? I think you have body parts that are backing up so please stop in at the closest auto shop and get a complete flush!

      • http://--- Edd

        Best Bob Livingston article yet…..encompases all areas in excellent fashion. I remember when the NDAA act was passed, I called office of McCain & was told this did not apply to Americans! Of course not…just 90% of them! Keep up the good work Bob, hope we’ll still be able to see these articles & posts if OB returns & FCC head Mark Lloyd dosen’t do a ‘China’ on us where ALL articles & posts are monitored & removed if anything inflammatory is said about our honorable leader. As to the ‘ Ron Paul write-ins’, do these folks still not understand that a vote for him will be one less for Romney (the lesser of 2 evils), and we’ll be set for a 4 year nightmare (assuming we’ll still here after 4 years) with the other one?

      • Warrior

        Edda, the one attribute you always display is consistency. As long as your team does it, it’s acceptable to you. There is NOTHING admirable about this regime. NOTHING! Grab yourself a set and be the first on your block to say, ya know, I don’t agree with this debt, I don’t agree with sacrificing my employees and fellow Americans for my personal well being, I don’t agree with your race baiting and generating fictitious wars on women, rich people and the elderly. Edda, that’s all the donkey’s have to offer. Misery and More Misery. Go ahead, stand up and say, I’m mad as hell and I’m not going to accept these attitudes and governing principles any more.

        Go ahead Edda, you may realize you don’t have to act like you’re indentured.

      • eddie47d

        Apparently Warrior you are very indentured to those Fascist Corporatocracies.By the way stop ignoring all the racists in your party and being so biased in Your blind loyalty. I’ll call Obama out but don’t be so shy about calling Romney out!

      • DaveH

        Edd says — “Best Bob Livingston article yet”.
        and then says — “As to the ‘ Ron Paul write-ins’, do these folks still not understand that a vote for him will be one less for Romney (the lesser of 2 evils)”.
        Apparently, Edd, you didn’t really read the article. Try again.
        You have drunk the NeoCon Progressive Kool-Aid, Edd.
        In at least 3 states where such polling has been done, Gary Johnson (Libertarian Candidate, Ron Paul surrogate) pulls more votes from Obama than from Romney, as if it really matters anyway whether Obama or Obama-Lite represents the Crony Capitalists who want nothing less than our servitude.

      • Dennis48e

        “In at least 3 states where such polling has been done, Gary Johnson (Libertarian Candidate, Ron Paul surrogate) pulls more votes from Obama than from Romney, ”

        What polls, by whom, in which states?

      • DaveH
    • Deerinwater

      David , they are “stealing” if you will ~ from everyone, ~ and not just conservatives. The people that have the most to gain from big government are the people that are employed by government, ~ That the GOP enjoys a disproportional amount of support from military and government employee is no accident, while you elect to be blind with your single sided view`of what is happening today.

      During W’s 8 year term the ranks of government employees swelled 900,000 new government jobs. Look it up ! That is a fact. ~

      David, this constant claim that you are being stolen from like maybe Conservatives are the only victims of this theft is bogus, we all suffer from this theft where it be by taxes or inflation or predatory government defending crony capitalism.

      That the current disparity in the taxing system is not producing the jobs needed while the claim was that lower taxes would produce jobs. ~ If you don’t want to tax capital gains, you don’t want to pay people a livable wage, you don’t want a welfare nation, Tell me ~ why are you only placing blame on a single side of this debacle for clearly there is enough to share among both conservatives and progressives. Why alienate half of the people that could be part of the solution and pander to people that are part of the problem?

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        Deer say: Tell me ~ why are you only placing blame on a single side of this debacle for clearly there is enough to share among both conservatives and progressives.

        Deer, i think if you re-read Dave’s comment, you will note that that is exactly what he is saying.

        DaveH says: Now we sit back and wait for the (Liberal Progressives) to explain that they’re the good guys, so it’s okay for them to steal other peoples’ money, and for the (Neocon Progressives) to explain that they’re the good guys, so it’s okay to kill other people who haven’t attacked us.

      • DaveH

        Deer says — “David, this constant claim that you are being stolen from like maybe Conservatives are the only victims of this theft is bogus”.
        Why is it that the Liberal Progressives are always trying to put words in my mouth?
        Where did I say only the Conservatives were being stolen from, Deer? If you guys can’t find anything legitimate to criticize in my comments, you just make things up, don’t you Deer?

      • Deerinwater

        Well, it read from a prospective of “YOU” David and you claim to be a conservative David. You imply it is you that are being stolen from. ~ and why the neon con acronym ? Why not the neo-conservatives? For I know you are not lazy on the keyboard. ~ You can type. ~ If this plumber can wear the letters off and holes in the keyboard keys every 8 months, a few extra key strokes for a academian like yourself should not be a problem. I believe that you did not want to type the word Neo- Conservative.

        Most all working Americans, ~ are victims ~ there is not one group that is winning at everything ~ Even the wealthy must lord over their empire and defend themselves from the greed of government and every Tom , Dick and Harry trying to make a buck.

        I got a certified letter from the IRS , I plan to open today, ~ not sure what it’s about ~ I doubt that it’s an invitation to their annual Christmas party. I just noticed that one of my trucks has the drivers window busted out this morning ~ and the radio is gone. ~ there no telling what else might be missing. Glass is everywhere, must have happen last night. Security is a big problem these days with anyone that has property.

        One of my brothers is attempting to pull a business move on me, ~ telling me some-kind of lame story as to “why” he feels the need to do what he says he is thinking about doing to “hide the fact” he just needs a 1000 dollar loan. His intending is to make it my idea and my responsibility. After listen to his [expletive deleted] for 15 minute I ask his, why don’t you just admit you are in a bind and needing a little help?

        Life is a three ring circus in a minefield of liability for anyone attempting to aspire and enjoy any success. But it beats hanging out waiting for some rich man to pat you on the head and throw you a bone, something I’ve never done and never will do.

        I don’t care for Willard, ~ he is not my kind of people, he has no plans I find interest in, I don’t trust him. It not so much what he might do, but what he will allow to be done under his adminstartion.

        I like you David, ~ and find you inspirational at time. ~ but the polarizing banter does not help you with your cause.

      • DaveH

        More double-speak from Deer.
        Deer says — “Well, it read from a prospective of “YOU” David and you claim to be a conservative David”.
        I claim (and AM) a Libertarian, Deer. I do believe that we are the True Conservatives, but that is not to be confused with the commonly accepted definition of Conservative. And what difference does that make anyway, Deer, since the subject at hand is whether or not I claimed only Conservatives are being stolen from?

      • Deerinwater

        Funny ~ as I see it as more double talk from David ~ and it disappointing to hear. ~ it seems there is not a rational bone in your body.

        We both want the same things ~ but our language interferes making us mortal enemies. ~ it’s a shame this is the way it must be.

        We are left to live and dead with it. it’s sad. ~ it really is. So be it, ~ you will never see your dreams because you live in a world of ideas while I only ask for people to show me their best and I’m willing to make up the difference by adjusting my position.

        We are left to work with what we have to work with David and build from that. ~ A person can not give what they don’t possess. Something can not be created from nothing.

        If you want to remove the Federal Reserve, you start by pruning it’s limbs and overreach slowly.

    • Nancy in Nebraska

      What’s really a HOOT is that the sheeple have NO idea what their candidates stand for!!! “We Are Change” took to the streets and asked obumass fans what they thought of romney’s terrible policies (which were actually obumass’s policies). They ranted and raved about how awful romney was, then when they found out that they were really obumass’s policies, they had to back peddle! Very amusing to watch, but sad how reflective they are of BOTH sides!!!
      http://www.theblaze.com/stories/obama-supporters-slam-romney-policies-then-find-out-theyre-actually-obamas/

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        Nancy, Howard Stern did a similar interview prior to 2008 elections. Check it out…

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GqAiarOhC2U

      • http://alsina846.wordpress.com millie

        To nancy,
        Howard Stern did a similar interveiw in 2008 and another a few weeks agos this year and the out come was the same. The obama supporters show they have no understanding of what obama stands for. It cleary shows that they are only supporting obama because he is black, nothing else.

      • Kate8

        millie – Black…yes. But mainly because he’s a democrat. The black part was really just to rally the minority vote.

        Democrats have a blind loyalty to their party. Obama could give a speech telling them outright that he will take their homes and put them in FEMA camps, and they’d still vote for him. It goes right over their heads.

        Everything he’s said and done has made it painfully clear that he plans to destroy America. And remember how he promised to “skyrocket” energy? Mention it, and you get a blank stare. The Left is so conditioned and brainwashed that they will keep cheating in any and every possible way to insure their treasonous party stays in power, no matter how bad things get.

        I’m reminded of the communist statement of how communists HATE leftists. Oh, they will use them… because they are easy. They hate them because they are ideologs, and when they realize what they’ve been helping to put in place (when it inevitably bites they, themselves, in the b*tt), they get upset and make trouble. They are too fanatic and ignorant of the facts to discern the true agenda until it’s too late (always signing on to fake causes in defense of some underdog, not seeing the bigger picture), so, once they wake up to it, it’s far too late. So, they are the first to be eliminated once their usefulness runs out.

        Those in control fully understand the psychology of the Leftist mind. That is why they use them.

      • deerinwater

        “It cleary shows that they are only supporting obama because he is black, nothing else.”

        Hmm? so your are voting for Willard because of his “ideas” or because he is not black?

      • Kate8

        deer – My guess would be it’s because he’s not Obama.

    • Walter & Renee Agard

      No it is not ok to kill people who don’t attack us. That is not what AMERICA is all about: Abuse of power,and a bulley, WE are the most powerful nation in the world,and very decent

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        “We” kill people who don’t attack “us” all the time! Read about drone use!!!

    • Doris Carman

      Then whats the answer?That NDAA is more worrisome than obamacare.

      • Kate8
      • Kate8

        https://sites.google.com/site/trutherswitzerland/

        Obama’s plans to terrorize America.

      • TIME

        Dear Doris,

        Please google the following videos ~ these will help you to understand whats coming our way if the American people don’t wake up very soon.
        Get your news from the following ~ and stay up todate on whats really going on,

        Redice Creations.com

        Before its news.com

        Steve Quayle.com

        Info Wars.com

        Viedos please do watch them its well worth the TIME and effort.

        #1, Russell Means we are all on the reservation now.

        #2, Project ENOCH 2012,

        #3, A wake up call

        #4, Invisible Empire_full movie a New World Order Defined

        Peace and Love be with you, Got your bus ticket yet?

    • Nadzieja Batki

      The adage that people get the leadership that they deserve is very true. So in essence this nation is telling on itself that it has drifted toward evil because we are down to choosing the lesser of two evils.

      • http://smoovious.wordpress.com Smoovious Laxness

        Can’t say I find much fault with that interpretation… sounds about right…

        – Smoov

    • J. Howard

      Who Really Caused the Country’s Financial Mess? Please check this out!!!
      We often here from democrats that say President George Bush caused the financial mess the country is experiencing today. Anyone who looked into the facts on this subject knows the real truth.

      Facts to point out:

      1. The Bush debt was 1.5 trillion dollars and that debt took 8 years to accumulate during his time in office (Including the wars). The wars were approved by the democrats and the republicans.
      2. President Bill Clinton in 2000 repealed the Class-Steagall act by signing the Gramm-Leach-Bliley act. If Class-Steagall act was still in force, then the Financial institutions bad behaviors would have been illegal (Financial institutions using depositor’s money in risky market investments).
      3. President Bill Clinton in 2000 signed the Commodity Futures Modernization act. This act exempted credit-default swaps from regulation.
      4. President Bill Clinton in 1995 by rewriting the Community Reinvestment act forced the loosening of Housing rules. The new rules put pressure on the banks to lend in very risky low income neighborhoods. This increased the bad loan portfolios of lending institutions.
      5. All of the above acts allowed most financial institutions to package high risk mortgages with low risk ones – bundled them together as securities. Financial institutions were floating home titles and made them very hard to trace back to the owner.
      6. President Bill Clinton, just before he left office, pardoned over 149 people. One criminal he pardoned was Marc Rich, who gave Hillary Clinton about 2 million dollars in exchange for the pardon. Clinton’s own justice department had spent a fortune in this tax fraud case trying to extradite him from Europe. Marc Rich is an international commodities trader and entrepreneur. He was indicted in the United States on federal charges of tax evasion and illegally making oil deals with Iran during the Iran hostage crisis. He was in Switzerland at the time of the indictment and has never returned to the U.S. He received a presidential pardon from U.S. President Bill Clinton on 20 January 2001, Clinton’s last day in office.
      7. Other crimes: a) FBI File Gate, b) Travel office Gate, c) White Water Gate, d) Vince Foster Gate, and e) Ignoring all Congressional and court subpoenas on the White Water case (You and I would go to jail for ignoring subpoenas). Even Dick Nixon answered his subpoenas.
      8. After President George Bush took office he warned many times about the lacking regulation in home mortgages, but every time he brought up the subject, the democrats pounced at him for not letting everyone have the ability to own a home. Because of the democrats, now many of these poor people are out of their homes and the tax payers had to bail out the banks and financial institutions.
      The Obama presidency has spent over a trillion dollars a year for 4 years totaling over 4 trillion dollars. He claims the massive US debt was still caused by President George Bush!
      Just the GAO’s budget went from 6 billion to 12 billion dollars under Obama’s watch. Maybe a lot of that money was spent on the GAO scandalous parties in Las Vegas? Where did extra 6 billion go?
      Six billion dollars alone could help a lot of poor school students or fix up our ailing schools. I wonder how much more the Department of Education is spending before a single cent is spent on a student or on our schools.
      Much of the above information can be found in the February 16 2009 Time Magazine article. This Time issue was on “who caused the 2008 financial crises”. Of course Time Magazine waited until after the 2008 election to print the article.

      Subject: Obama’s Record to Date:

      They say “Voters have bad memories”. OK, print out and post it on your mirror….read it EVERY DAY and REMEMBER IN NOVEMBER!!!!

      Has the economy improved since Barack Obama became the president of the United States? Of course it is not. Despite what you may be hearing in the mainstream media, the truth is that when you compare the U.S. economy on the day that Barack Obama was inaugurated to the U.S. economy today, there is really no comparison. The unemployment crisis is worse than it was then, home values have fallen, the cost of health insurance is up, the cost of gas is way up, the number of Americans living in poverty has soared and the size of our national debt has absolutely exploded. Anyone that believes that things are better than they were when Barack Obama was elected is simply being delusional.

      • tony newbill

        J Howard They screwed with the Interest rates starting in 2006 when the Democrats took over control of both houses Manipulating the LIBOR Rate Tim Geirtner did this when he was at the NY FED and that screwed up Interest rates being able to Self regulate credit use , Interest rates were on the rise and the Lending was Slowing down before this CABAL of manipulation by the Democrats took over and like a Horse eating to much Grian they allowed the Financial Sector to FOUNDER then turned around and Blamed them for the Crash when they were only using the tools the FEDS were allowing , and this was also where the Biggest LIE of who was In the Treasury at the time comes out too , Hank Paulson was a Trojan Horse , a FRAUD that Bush appointed as Treasury , But Why would he appoint a Marxist Liberal posing as a Conservative who is the Founding Chairman of the 2nd biggest Environmentalist Marxist Bolsheviks Organization in the world next to the Sierra Club , nature Conservancy group , Because the Democrats were Controlling BUSH from 2006 on and thats when they put Hank Paulson in place to Create the appereance of it being Bushes fault , all because they Threatened Bush with Cutting off the Money that IRAQ War EFFORTS NEEDED , this all was the Perfect Storm that the Liberal Progressive machine needed to bring down the WHOLE THING capitalism and the USA sitting on the edge of a Dependency of Parts production that had been Out sourced to the HILT , they had seen their Plan come to Fruition , read this article , it explains the method they been using to Bleed the self reliance our Industrial manufacturing gave us and the wealth , all for a sinister Environmentalist Plan is what this is about , This is Bolshevism at its Finest !!! http://cnsnews.com/node/75388

  • windisea

    As for me, my family and friends, our last stand for liberty in 2012 will be to write in RON PAUL!

    “If all else fails, I will retreat up the valley, plant my flag on the Blue Ridge, rally around the Scotch-Irish of that region, and make my last stand for liberty amongst a people who will never submit to tyranny whilst there is a man left to draw a trigger.”

    - George Washington

    • danny

      windisea, !! “IF” the rest of our votes fail to get Obama out of the Whitehouse. Then I hope you enjoy another term of obama’s destruction of the American Constitution,and economy. Let me offer you thanks for “NOTHING” As for the rest who have the good sense to vote for Mitt Romney and rid our Nation of the obamanation. Thanks for your efforts to save our Nations freedoms and opportunities. God Bless America.

      • ableton

        Danny, It is the folks like yourself that have no good sense but to support NEOCONS who will be no better than Obama. Why waste the funds to hire another New World Order elitist who represents the same tyranny as the last 4 years. Just save the expense of pretending. So, in short, a vote for Romney is a vote for Obama. Mitt will lose this one
        because as with Dole and McCain, they are born to lose.

      • eddie47d

        Its been that “Fascist Corporatocracy” that has ruined the USA in the last few decades. Every President has climbed aboard that train but Romney is one of the ring leaders. He has applied that trade in every bussiness deal he has concocted and has spit on the American workers all the while making dubious buckets of money in doing so. Romney and Obama have their Wall Street pals who fiddled with our economy with disastrous results. Yet there again Romney wins first place because he has been practicing those manipulative traits much longer than Obama. Obama has tried to put the reigns on the Banksters and not always with good results yet Romney will say full speed ahead and the Middle Class will get hammered again.

        • tony newbill

          Obama can’t give us what he promises as far as Higher quality of living because his Environmentalist Supporters are ANTI growth and that is a major conflict of interest for Obama .

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        eddie says: Obama has tried to put the reigns on the Banksters and not always with good results…

        Really? If that is true, why would Obama appoint a former Federal Reserve Board Chairman Paul Volcker to head a White House advisory board to oversee the new administration’s policies for stabilizing financial markets? The selection of the 81-year-old Volcker puts an inveterate enemy of the working class at the side of the new president, and demonstrates the class character of the right-wing government that Obama is assembling.

        If what you say is true, why would Obama appoint, to his economic team; Timothy Geithner, former president of the New York branch of the Federal Reserve, as secretary of the treasury; Lawrence Summers, former Clinton treasury secretary, to head the National Economic Council, the chief White House group for coordinating economic policy; and Peter Orszag, as budget director. Summers, Geithner and Orszag are all protégés of former Clinton treasury secretary Robert Rubin, former CEO of Goldman Sachs and now director and vice chairman of Citigroup.

        Hope and change? I think not!

        • tony newbill

          Tim Geitner is who Fixed the LIBOR rate to enable the Mortgage lending that crashed the Markets , so create a crisis that then they can fix their ideological way ??? remember the term don’t let a good crisis go to waste ?

      • John

        Romney is more of the same. He was for gun control before he was against it. He created Obamacare. He works for the same globalist bankers that Obama works for. When is someone going to stand up to the unconstitutional Federal Reserve board?…Ron Paul oh yeah… I’m voting for Gary Johnson because it really does not matter between democrats and republicans anymore. They are both co-opted by globalist bankers. End the Fed!!!

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        danny, GOOD GRIEF!!! Did you even READ the article?!? Did you watch the debates?!? Do you educate yourself AT ALL?!? If you did, you would UNDERSTAND that there is almost NO DIFFERENCE between obumass and romney!!! What on earth makes you think that ANYTHING will change if romney gets into office?!? We are on a collision course with disaster and people like you don’t seem to understand that WE need to CHANGE what WE are doing!!! We expect change from those in government yet WE are unwilling to change what WE’VE been doing for years and years! It is so blatantly obvious by now that BOTH parties are DOING the SAME thing!!! And yet, we all line up behind the candidate with the right letter behind their name!!! Unless we RECOGNIZE and ACKNOWLEDGE that BOTH parties are controlled by the SAME people(?) WE ARE DOOMED!!! This may be out last chance to save our country! And it won’t be done by doing the same thing that we’ve BEEN doing!!! If WE want anything to change, WE must change!!!

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        Jayson, eddie47d just lies and MAKES UP crap!!!

      • eddie47d

        Actually most environmentalists are pro growth without the destructive practices of the anti- environmentalists. The greens want it done right with strong corporate responsibilities in place. Fairly easy concept to grasp Tony Newbill!

        • tony newbill

          Thats not true Eddie47d they want ZERO GROWTH initiatives to stop the destructive practices that Capitalism enables is what they think , sustainability = Zero growth .

          Eddie47d lets dive into the biggest Organization in the world and see the Obama supporters who Influence economic , social and international policies , http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dan_Becker

          Some critics of the Sierra Club have charged that the club’s views on population growth, and the efforts of some club members to restrain immigration, are a continuation of aspects of the Eugenics movement.[37][38]

          In 1969, the Sierra Club published Paul R. Ehrlich’s book, The Population Bomb, in which he said that population growth was responsible for environmental decline and advocated coercive measures to reduce it. Some observers have argued that the book had a “racial dimension” in the tradition of the Eugenics movement, and that it “reiterated many of Osborn’s jeremiads.”[39][40][41]

          In 1978, John Tanton, former Chairman of the National Sierra Club Population Committee and former President of Zero Population Growth, founded the Federation for American Immigration Reform.[41]

          During the 1980s, some Sierra Club members, including Paul Ehrlich’s wife Anne,[39] wanted to take the Club into the contentious field of immigration to the United States. The Club’s position was that overpopulation was a significant factor in the degradation of the environment. Accordingly, the Club supported stabilizing and reducing U.S. and world population. Some members argued that, as a practical matter, U.S. population could not be stabilized, let alone reduced, at the then-current levels of immigration. They urged the Club to support immigration reduction. The Club had previously addressed the issue of “mass immigration,”[42] and in 1988, the organization’s Population Committee and Conservation Coordinating Committee stated that immigration to the U.S. should be limited, so as to achieve population stabilization.[43]
          Eddie47d you been drinking the koolaid too long , WAKE UP before you are part of the HERD of TURDS

      • eddie47d

        For such a smart lady Nancy you seem to be in denial about what happened during the economic meltdown in 2007 and resort to petty accusations. Now Jay (Jayson) Obama did try and enact more regulations to keep the banksters in line and to keep the consumers from being shafted. What I was saying is that those laws didn’t go far enough and some are already being ignored.

      • Patriot

        Danny is correct. The only hope now is Romney, at least he shares the same values as a true American and will listen to reason and has business sense. If not, we change direction in 4 years again! There is much work to be done, I understand that Romney is not the optimal choice, but he is the only choice. Let the hard work for the next 250 years begin now, I for one, will not look back at history knowing that I did not do everything possible to help my country reverse our devastating direction. A vote for anyone else is a vote to destroy our future and give us no chance!

      • DaveH

        Patriot says — “at least he [Romney] shares the same values as a true American”.
        Crony Capitalists are “true Americans” now? I must have missed that memo.

      • Sunshine49

        If you think that this election isn’t fixed already, you have another guess coming. There is NO reason that Obama should be doing good in the polls except manipulation of the numbers. There can’t be that many “useful idiots” that still back Obama!

        Everybody needs to watch the video called “The Obama Deception” which is about two hours long. It will give you the FACTS on WHO is running this country and where we are headed. Of course you could just read the Bible and you would know the TRUTH too.

        God bless and keep you safe during the Hell that is coming.

      • JeffH

        Excellant article Mr. Livingston…extremely appropriate and well though out. I felt one little snippet was most telling.

        ***Obama has been petty and vindictive, wandering from odd slogan to odd slogan, attacking his opponents relentlessly.

        ______________***ALERT***_______________

        My God, that sounds so familiar. Could eddie be a clone of Gibbs and Carney or even Obama? Eddie47D has been doing all of this for 3+ years on PLD…
        ________________________________________

        I agree that Romney is far and away the nore intelligent of the two and there’s no doubt that Romney will bring adult maturity back to the White House as well as re-establish some form of respect for the office of the President…all sorely lacking by the disresectful and disrespected current resident in the oval office.

        If Romney is elected, look for an immediate surge of entrepenuers and job creators stepping up in support of and to renew some hope for “The American Dream”.

        Guess we’ll all have to wait and see what lies ahead…”if there’s a country left to govern by then.”

      • JeffH

        FYI…that little snippet was”…if there’s a country left to govern by then.”

    • RivahMitch

      Personally, windisea, I’ll lock and load and stand with George, but I’ll NOT be voting with you. While I would have preferred another (in fact, several other) candidate(s), it would ill behoove any of us to ignore the opportunity to avoid, or act to hasten, the coming conflagration which will result from the Kenyan Marxists continued grinding down of America. Semper Fi!

    • OLD MAN

      Some people sound like idiots at election time. Go ahead be a “useful idiot” for Obama. Write in Ron Paul. You have just cast a vote for Obama. We all know that Ron Paul (as well meaning as he is) would not have one chance in hell of being the winner. Your write in vote and maybe thousands like yours would assure the Republican candidate could lose. Then your grandiose stand would put Obama back into office. Thanks IDIOT.!.!

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        It would seem to me that the REAL useful idiots are the ones who keep doing as they’re told! You’re TOLD to vote for the republican or the democrat, and YOU do it!!! THEY choose your candidates and you succumb by voting for the “lesser of two evils”! How long are you going to fall for it?!? It makes no difference whether you vote for the r or the d! Nothing changes! The agenda goes forward! There are none so blind as those who REFUSE to see!!!

      • DaveH

        Did you even read Bob Livingston’s article, Tony?
        It’s been that time (according to the Propagandists) ever since I became of voting age 40 years ago. I realize they have super-glued your blinders on, but get some Acetone and remove those blinders. We can never hope for Freedom unless we QUIT voting for those who know nothing about it.
        There is only one candidate who promises to shrink Government dramatically, and who actually has a record of doing that while Governor of New Mexico. Gary Johnson doesn’t just hold his finger to the wind and make idle promises that people want to hear like the other two candidates do.
        For Freedom — Gary Johnson.
        For a continuation on the Road to Serfdom — Vote Obama or Romney.

        • tony newbill

          Now is not the time Dave

      • Walter & Renee Agard

        Why you people go and vote. Think who you would vote for,without listening to the media,and other peoples influence-like ROMNEY-but your own intelligent mind-Without HATE,and sit back and wait for the results.I know that I am voting for OBAMA,because he is the main man.not because of prejudicial or a racist because I was’nt brought like that Every one is equal.No one is better than the other.

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        tony newbill, I looked at he article you linked to about “trade”. Here’s what I KNOW! All trade agreements will be those that benefit the corporations! The corporations will have CHEAP goods manufactured elsewhere and shipped to the US, because they PROFIT from it!!! They will NOT create jobs here, regardless of trade agreements because they make more profit, the other way! Only two things will leave this country in any substantial way. Those are FOOD and OIL!!! They will continue to make contracts with other countries, which will cause food prices to go UP and will cause food shortages for US!!! They will continue to sell the oil from this country to the highest bidder. No amount of oil production in our lands will lower the price of gasoline here. It will ALL go to the highest bidder! Things ARE the way they ARE because THEY want them that way!!! It is all about MONEY and MORE MONEY!!!

        • tony newbill

          Nancy you talk as if the money is a object that even these people you hate are not the creators of this Money , so with that thought if Private Business is back in control over the Resources supplies are made with don’t you think that a Romney administration will do a better job of directing that Money towards Private sector Supply creation , expansion and that effect Jobs rather than a Obama Top Down Government thats Obsessed with Population Control and Consumption Control all in the name of saving earth from Mankind ??????

      • Nancy in Nebraska

        Walter and Renee Agard, when you call obumass your “main man”, you make it absolutely clear that you are supporting him because of his race, regardless of your denials!!! Have you ever ONCE studied the issues and taken a good hard look at where your “main man” stands on them? Look up and read what Larry Pinkney (one of the original founders of the Black Panther Party) has to say about obumass!!! He sees and speaks the TRUTH that there is NO difference between romney and obumass!!! Do some research!!!

    • DaveH

      Don’t write in Ron Paul, Windisea. Vote for Gary Johnson, who is a viable candidate on your ballot. And Gary is far more like Ron Paul, than any other candidate except Ron himself.
      If Gary get just 5% of the vote, it will change a lot of other minds who have never been afforded the opportunity to hear Libertarian Principles. Whereas, a Ron Paul write-in will likely be no more than a wasted vote.
      http://www.garyjohnson2012.com/

    • TML

      If Ron Paul had decided to run as an independent, I would be doing the same as you no doubt about it. Yet as it is, he is not. Therefore I will vote for the next best candidate, as far as I can tell – Gary Johnson. But I won’t sit here with any collectivist mimicry and ask you to vote for him also… it’s enough for me to know that even by you writing in Ron Paul, we are making our “… last stand for liberty amongst a people who will never submit to tyranny whilst there is a man left to draw a trigger.”

      “Always vote for principle, though you may vote alone, and you may cherish the sweetest reflection that your vote is never lost.”- John Quincy Adams

  • GALT

    Why does flat = fair?

    In the non cherry picked version of Adam Smith, he offers two interesting observations that illustrate the natural tendencies of men engaged in business:

    “A man must live by his work, and his wages must be at least enough to maintain him. They must even on most occasions be somewhat more: otherwise it would be impossible for him to bring up a family and the RACE of such workmen could not last beyond the first generation.”

    “The subjects of every state ought to contribute towards the support of government, as nearly as possible, in proportion to their respective abilities; that is, in proportion to the revenue which they respectively enjoy under the protection of the state.”

    In terms of the two primary functions of government, national defense and “the law” or
    “justice system” there is no way one can make a reasonable case equating a flat tax as being a fair one.

    In terms of “protection”…….and potential loss, the Buffet’s of the world have far more to lose than your every day average median wage worker……….from any threat, foreign or
    domestic………and in terms of the “legal system”, their very existence requires and consumes far more legal resources than your average median wage worker……..a system
    which they often employ to escape or avoid responsibility when their actions cause harm.

    Because of this rather obvious tendency of the amoral approach to business to seek profits regardless of consequences…….protecting average citizens from these predatory
    practices……..using various agencies and regulations to attempt to prevent this…….and
    all of these costs are incurred simply because this is “business as usual” and access to
    the legal system has allowed them to compound these tendencies…….circumvent, delay or
    deny the very justice the system was designed to establish.

    In insurance cases the common practice has become to deny claims for those who can not
    afford to wait for the protection they paid for and now need……..and the more they need it, the less likely they are to get it……….so much for the “obligation of contracts”……..

    The phrase “job killing regulations” for your common every day average american
    with just a little more “liberty” can simply be changed to “killing” which is part of the
    strategy and the result of denying certain types of claims…………in the above example,
    and far more directly in other areas of “business as usual”…….

    For most business that benefit from this environment, these tactics are profitable not
    only because they work……..but the expense of insuring that they do, is a deductible one……..another benefit not available to your ordinary average every day american….

    What I find interesting is that a great many ordinary average every day american’s fail
    to grasp the fact that they are indeed, exactly that……

    So the words liberty and freedom have a nice ring but they are simply words without
    substance or context……..to believe that flat = fair will result in more liberty or freedom
    you might want to consider “from what”? and be very careful what you wish for……

    “To conquer, first DIVIDE!!!!!!” ( and then HANG, separately. )

    • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

      So what you’re saying; mankind is corrupt, YOU included. Not exactly a revelation, Galt!

      • GALT

        No……..that is what you are saying……..Functional illiteracy is a serious problem and
        quite common……….but keep practicing………I’ll let you know if you ever get close to
        comprehending what has actually been said……..Jayson.

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        I read between the lines, double-agent Galt, however disjointed they may be…

      • GALT

        Interesting claim……..and an amazing skill……but you chose to create a conclusion
        which has no support……..since it was not said by me…….nor offered by me……

        You are of course welcome to make the attempt………but that would just provide more
        evidence of what you have already demonstrated………

        BTW since you seem to think that your invented conclusion was no revelation,
        at the very least admitting that YOU MUST BE ONE OF THE CORRUPTED PEOPLE.
        Thank you for sharing that piece of honesty, because that is the only thing in your conclusion that you could possibly know for certain, Jayson…….and I believe you.

      • Walter & Renee Agard

        Yes,yuo’ve got that right.Some of us are corrupted and dont even knows it.

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        Galt: Interesting claim……..and an amazing skill……but you chose to create a conclusion
        which has no support……..since it was not said by me…….nor offered by me……

        I beg to differ. The only thing you didn’t offer, is to include yourself among the hopelessly-corrupt…

        Galt: You are of course welcome to make the attempt………but that would just provide more evidence of what you have already demonstrated………

        And what would that be, discernment?

        Galt: BTW since you seem to think that your invented conclusion was no revelation,
        at the very least admitting that YOU MUST BE ONE OF THE CORRUPTED PEOPLE.

        I used the term, “mankind”. Last time i checked…hmm, speaking of reading comprehension…duh!

        Galt: Thank you for sharing that piece of honesty…

        My pleasure. The least i could do for your edification…

        Galt: because that is the only thing in your conclusion that you could possibly know for certain…

        Yes, mankind is corrupt, including YOU…!

        Galt: Jayson…….and I believe you.

        I’m glad we agree on something…atta boy!

      • GALT

        Well again Jayson that you lack comprehension has already been noted……..I believe that you are corrupt…….your conclusion makes that clear……

        That all men are corrupt is however your claim, not mine, nor is it available in the post you were attempting to respond to…….no matter how rich your imagination…….

        So if your claim is to be believed as a statement of TRUTH in that you believe it
        to be TRUE………..

        Then we are in agreement that You are corrupt. after all, you have confessed
        so no further evidence is needed in your case…….

        As for the rest of the “men”…….you will need to provide evidence……and you
        probably can…..so get to work……..because there are 7 billion others ……….
        you may want to start with those who have wealth and power…..since those things
        usually go hand in hand with “corruption”……..or at least the opportunity to
        succumb to the temptation of it………….

        Are you done embarrassing yourself for today?

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        Galt: Well again Jayson that you lack comprehension has already been noted……..I believe that you are corrupt…….your conclusion makes that clear……

        Of course! We are all corrupt, Galt, in that we are all susceptible to corruption, therefore, we are all corrupt; including you, dare i say!

        Galt: That all men are corrupt is however your claim, not mine, nor is it available in the post you were attempting to respond to…….no matter how rich your imagination…….

        It has always been your premise, Galt.

        Galt: So if your claim is to be believed as a statement of TRUTH in that you believe it
        to be TRUE………..Then we are in agreement that You are corrupt. after all, you have confessed so no further evidence is needed in your case…….

        Yes, of course. Again, we are all corrupt, including you…i have read most of your posts, after all!

        Galt: As for the rest of the “men”…….you will need to provide evidence……and you
        probably can…..so get to work……..because there are 7 billion others ……….
        you may want to start with those who have wealth and power…..since those things
        usually go hand in hand with “corruption”……..or at least the opportunity to
        succumb to the temptation of it………….

        You prove my point, Galt. All, are susceptible to corruption, except not all have wealth and power.

        Galt: Are you done embarrassing yourself for today?

        How long will you resist my help?

      • GALT

        Jayson,

        If that was my premise…….then you would be quoting me……you are not.

        I am quoting you…….

        How is it that you are “helping” here?

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        Here we go again…playing peek-a-boo…

    • DaveH

      The only truly fair tax would be one equally administered to all adults. Similar to that which was the case before the 16th Amendment where the States paid for their Federal Government equally based on their population sizes.
      The Progressives in 1913 knew that to grow their Leviathan Government, the 16th and 17th Amendments, and the Federal Reserve Act were indispensable.

      • GALT

        A very simplistic explanation for an extremely complicated conspiracy involving disparate elements and causes whose historical connections are so remote from one another that
        the “conclusion” offered can in no way be demonstrated to have been continuous or
        orchestrated………and certainly not by the ephemeral and somewhat imagined “group”
        named here………..of course, the naming of names as well as a continuous lineage might
        improve the claim……..but not by much.

      • DaveH

        That is an awful lot of disjointed phrases to say basically nothing, Galt.
        Do you really think your double-speak influences anybody?

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        Galt, give the hookah-pipe a rest.

      • GALT

        So you have no names or a continuous lineage to identify these Progressive conspirators
        from 1913 to date?

        Nor do you have any explanation for how these “parts” get you to the present whole….

        The IRS code, nor any codification of U.S. Statutes, had any history prior to 1938…..
        wages were not “income” prior to that……..and the Federal Reserve Bank, operated
        under a completely different structure, until roughly the same time frame.

        The 14th ammendment was far more critical to establishing the present centralized
        federal government…….but the real cause for what you are experiencing, is and will remain…….

        http://www.supremelaw.org/authors/freeman/freeman4.htm

        and your unwitting yet VOLUNTARY COMPLIANCE…….

        your efforts are wasted and you are simply distracting everyone and diffusing the
        available energy away from the source of the problem…….

        “The way out is through the door. Why is it that no one will use this method?”
        ― Confucius

      • DaveH

        See Bonaventure’s comment dealing with the United States Corporation:
        http://mises.org/community/forums/p/385/2899.aspx#2899

        You can spout your nonsense all you want, Galt. I am not worried in the least that you will convince a lot of people.

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        “Only foolish man try run down hill with pants falling down.”
        ~ Confucius on meaning of reality~

      • DaveH

        Galt says — “So you have no names or a continuous lineage to identify these Progressive conspirators from 1913 to date?”.

        So you have no evidence to contradict my claim, Galt?

      • DaveH

        For those who are interested in the history of Progressivism in our country:
        http://mises.org/daily/364/The-Legacy-of-Progressivism

      • JeffH

        DaveH, excellant link!
        I’d like to add another link about progressivism…the European roots that has influenced American Progressivism.
        http://freedomlessons.net/freedom-101/progressives-and-tug-o-war/
        What does it mean to be a progressive? What is the importance of the term relative to our lives today? Who were the progressives, the political ancestors of the today’s Democrats? Most importantly is whether or not progressivism is hostile to individual freedom; understanding so helps clarify what is in store for us when we hear politicians and activists tell us they favor progressive policies.

        Progressivism was a major reform movement that began in the late 1800s. The movement shared the intellectual roots of European state theorists such as Hegel and Marx. In 20th century Europe their ideas came to fruition in the forms of communism in Russia, national socialism––that is, Naziism––in Germany, and fascism in Italy, respectively.

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        Interesting article, Dave. This, in particular, among others, caught my eye:

        Quote:

        “In fact, it seems that one of the most insidious things to come from the Progressive Era was the wedding of mainstream journalism and statism. The formerly independent journalist now became a flack for expansion of the power of the state, as the chief “beat” of news reporters became the various government agencies.

        The above quote, prompted me to share this, with you.

        http://www.transnationalterrorism.eu/tekst/publications/WP4%20Del%206.pdf

      • GALT

        DaveH says:

        October 29, 2012 at 7:23 pm

        Galt says — “So you have no names or a continuous lineage to identify these Progressive conspirators from 1913 to date?”.

        So you have no evidence to contradict my claim, Galt?

        Only if you are a blind man, because there appears to be an entire post full of
        evidence……and/or or counter point………and I didn’t bother to include a complete
        analysis of the 16th ammendment or the transitional phases that took place regarding
        it prior to 1938……..

        You also seem to have a problem with the meaning of YOU………the purpose of links is
        to support what you have to say……….which means you have to say something first, and in this case…….it should a relevant response to the “questions” regarding the
        continuity of your claimed “conspiracy of progressives” from 1913 forward……

        Such a conspiracy would need to have had remarkable foresight…..anticipating a
        world war, women’s suffrage, the effective inheritance of the world’s industrial
        engine, accumulation of 80% of the world’s gold reserves, the crash of 29, severe
        worldwide depression and the restructuring and codification of U.S. law in1938….
        with this last part alone……..totally altering the entire effects of the 16th amendment
        regarding a “tax on income”………because it didn’t apply to anyone who did not
        realize a “profit or gain” of at least $6,000……..

        Not to mention that you use the term “progressive” in a perjorative sense
        without explanation………so taking this brief exerpt

        Progressivism also was imbued with strong political overtones, and it rejected the church as the driving force for change. Specific goals included:

        The desire to remove corruption and undue influence from government through the taming of bosses and political machines

        the effort to include more people more directly in the political process

        the conviction that government must play a role to solve social problems and establish fairness in economic matters.

        from this link http://www.u-s-history.com/pages/h1061.html

        These goals do not appear to be all that malevolent……..and the first one seems to
        represent our current problem to a much greater extent NOW, so much so……that any
        concern you might have with the third one……..can be ignored, since the mechanism’s
        of government have been so completely corrupted to other ends, that any
        efforts in this regard are simply “crumbs” which are dropped for political purposes
        without any regard to results…………and if this is a “conspiracy” it seems to be having
        precisely the wrong effects…….since the condition of the bottom 80% seems to
        be on a steady decline and has been for thirty years………..( longer, actually )

        What ever was planned in 1913…….doesn’t seem to have been planned very well.

        The results do not appear to be very “progressive” or the result of a “conspiracy”,
        but maybe it’s just me………still you now have another response……..

        Do YOU have anything to offer that would make me even slightly interested in
        checking your link for confirmation?

      • GALT

        With regard to your “bonaventure” link……it is an irrelevant response to an irrelevant
        post which mentions “common law”…….so what……

        It contains nothing that deals with anything in the link posted by me…….

        It says nothing about “jurisdiction”……..

        It does not explain why there are no “common law and equity courts”….

        It does not explain what type of courts do exist…..or what the constitutional authority
        is for them……..

        It does not explain why a “reservation of rights” is required by the UCC……

        It does not explain why the bill of rights provides for your right to suits at common law, or a right to a jury trial that are cited there……yet would be meaningless if said courts were not
        in existence…….

        And to have any knowledge of this as a lawyer, he would have had to attended law school
        prior to 1938………

        That you have the ability to actually frame your OWN thoughts in a logical manner
        and engage in a debate or a discussion in a relevant way has never been evidenced……and posting equally irrelevant links does not alter the end result.

        One which you are paying for and complaining about……and which I am NOT PAYING for…..

        But the ultimate irony is…….you are concerned about other people paying attention,
        ……….what is to be gained from paying attention to you…….you are just a kvetch….
        but I guess if they did pay attention, they would have the knowledge to free themselves……….if they acted on it, they would pay less…..and you would pay
        even more………..seems to me to be a reasonable price to pay for your consistent
        willfull ignorance……….self induced justice.

        Here practice up……..Rand Paul in 2016…..and you can YELL LOUDER!!!!!!

    • alpha-lemming

      Regarding flat=fair????
      I’ll give you a nice set-up here to pratice your condescending verbal acrobatics and admit to being “not very good at math”. A rich person…. by definition 250K, paying a 15% tax rate (a nice flat tax figure I’ve heard thrown about for a while) has a $37,500 tax burden vs. a regular guy, say 50K at that same 15% rate, owes $7,500. And in the world of “not paying your fair share”….. $7,500 > $37,500. Help me out here ‘cuz I’m obviously forgettin’ to carry the 1 something……

      Secondly, all those rules and regulations in the legal system to protect the little guy from the moneyed?? The little guy is irrelevant and secondary. All that’s important is the taking to line governments’ pockets…. and the proof is:
      There are 3 ways to sue (legal system) a person/entity for their pricing policy….
      1) You can sue them because they charge more than everybody else…. this is called gouging.
      2) You can sue them because they charge less than everybody else… this is called predatory pricing.
      3) And finally, you can sue them because they charge the same as everybody else…. this is called collusion.
      Pick the avenue of your choice to steal what you didn’t earn….. it’s all there for the…. what’s the word????…. oh yeah…. TAKING!!!!

      • GALT

        Can you sue them? Have you tried?

        You didn’t mention fraud, and you are also neglecting a bit of information regarding
        your actual right to sue or seek damages if you have signed any kind of agreement….

        because in that agreement, you have probably given up any right to sue, but in exchange
        you have agreed to “mandatory arbitration”……..you have no control of who is selected
        to hear this “case” or where it is going to take place………..and it is not going to be
        anywhere close to you……..so in order to avail yourself of this “right”…..you will have to travel hundreds or thousands of miles, pay the expenses…..and legal representation
        if you so choose……..to participate in a “rigged” system………

        While your presentation seems to suggest that the “victims” are taking advantage of
        those poor business men……..the facts do not support that reality……..if that were true, no wealthy people would exist……..how could they survive all those greedy parasites and
        their lawyers………..of course poor people don’t control the media either, so what scenario
        or representation of reality do you think it is in their interest to promote…….

        The above is just one small piece of how you don’t stand a chance…….but if you
        want to believe they are the ‘victims’…..you go right ahead……I’m sure they appreciate
        your support……….

  • http://mozilla robert e. lee

    let handed swipe at the conservative congress is misguided as usual;;;;;;;;;;we did not control the congress in 2009 buttkiss;; we took over in 2011;; but obamadick-tater used executive orders;; they will be repealed by Romney;;;;;;;;

  • http://mozilla robert e. lee

    obam controlled the executive and legislative branches for 2009 and 2010;; he passed all kinds of Marxist social junk ;; REMEMBER??????

  • Janice Garlish

    As Billy Graham would say, vote for the man that has the principles of the Bible.
    No abortion, union of man and woman only, no euthenasia, no human cloning and no embryonic stem-cell research. God should be at the top of the list each day.

    • don

      i agree but good luck on that

    • Kim

      Janice:

      I couldn’t agree more.
      Yet your voice, mine or the few others who write on this ….are either silently ignored considered to being inconsequential…. to what so many on this sight consider as the core causes to the decay of politics, political machines, strategies or revolts.

      If it isn’t ignored, then religious discrimination comes pouring out to be put “into play.” By others attacking that person personally as a result of sighting faith. They are being portrayed as one of “those!” One of those “Bible Thumping” or “Bible Thumping Radicals,” that has lost their mind to packing that revolver or 22. Yup they’re ready to lock load and shoot um up… if you don’t agree with them. Sounds like what I picture as a Middle Eastern picture in a hot zone doesn’t it? You can’t have faith then! Why surely it has no relevance to choosing political convictions, parties or the candidates presented to be President.

      As I get older, driven more so by self-accountability to be educated both by academia and school of life. I’m not whipped into a frenzy by what majority of the rest of you are on this sight write about….or see as your strongest convictions to the numbers of destruction to America today. Oddly enough, that individualism, which used to be respected and revered as most important to powerful guide in one’s life… is what is actually slipping away. I know where my convictions and compassion comes from. I can assure it gives me great peace, strength and the ability to see truths. If I get derailed, personally it is I pays that price of self.

      I can agree with Bob in one differing perspective aspects. It’s been years and years in the making that United States of America let itself become culturally corrupted by destroying, marginalized, attacking ….to making “it” oh so irrelevant. Why one can’t be guided by their principles to have Faith to live daily life to those life choices??
      .
      What majority of this country is either blinded, brainwashed or culturally corrupted by…
      Are the lies we tell ourselves, by our thoughts, lack of personal faith convictions and what’s worse for me to see…those of faith not taking their stands for themselves. You don’t get those minutes, moments, options or decisions back.

      If God is in there, core to the makeup of that person’s free will of spirit. It will be their main strength, peace and guide. You’d better bet that person will anguish over making that difficult decision(s). That decision that needs to be made for the right reason after considerable thought. Whether that decision needs to be rapid fire to time or allowing more deliberation of time. If time… to brainstorm with deliberations to taking in various differences of opinions, to branches of government, but more importantly the masses that you serve who put you there to begin with. You find in God’s truth, by those actions of common good. More brutally…, God didn’t fail the Libya Ambassador and those that fought endlessly and senselessly to be abandoned and out numbered to protect him. Faith does not abandon you. They cried out for back up support that was needed. They were denied not by God but by man.

      Faith is a choice of free will and discipline…and in today’s world it takes a lot of it to live it cognitively per second. By the way, before you start that religious bashing to one’s political machines….Those that misuse their personal faith to attack others unjustly in regards to bullying others politically…That’s not good faith principles either. I don’t have to hit you over the head to find and seek truth for yourself. Truth is easy to see if you have faith guiding you. Besides, you have no ideal the amount of tolerance it takes to deal with others who lost their way, choose not to have faith whatever their self serving gain or addiction.

      Just keeping pooh palling away that Faith doesn’t matter. That it doesn’t matter in one’s directives to life, families, education, careers or of service. By the way, don’t even try labeling me a conservative, republican, democrat or libertarian. I am instead a learner and thinker to God and faith. Faith is my God… not politics my God.
      You choose as to who you put in those “positions” to serve you, govern you, to not deciding, to burying your head in the sand by writing in a candidate that doesn’t have chance. Life is about choices… that you have to make ….with what is given you.

      And, yes, Bob, I would agree there is one adult in this mix who does stand out for the most important decisions out of politics for me. I clearly don’t need to have the waters muddy to see. For faith and morality can’t be compartmentalized to fit into a box, instead it is in all areas and walks of life. ..whether we want to admit to be honest to God and ourselves …first and then collective responsibilities.

  • Kenny

    GALT: You’re on the wrong blog. Try posting your drivel on one of the “Progressive” sites or Obama’s Facebook page.

    For your information, flat IS fair. The more you make, the more you pay, but at the same rate. It is the goal of the left to convince the gullible that a limited pie produces only winners and losers. In fact, the wealth of the rich does not harm the poor. Only government excess and misguided policies harm the poor. The “Great Society” did more to destroy the black family unit than years of slavery. Read Walter Williams:
    http://www.creators.com/opinion/walter-williams/racism-or-stupidity.html

    • GALT

      Why would this be the wrong blog…….is the presentation of evidence which can be
      used to reach different conclusions or discern the truth of things not welcome here?

      How did the evils of the great society do more damage to the black family than slavery……all slaves were property and subject to sale at the owners pleasure……..I was unaware that any attention was paid to family integrity with regard to these transactions?

      In fact, after the ban on importation, only four states were primarily using slaves for
      cotton production……..the rest were engaged in “breeding”…..to fill demand, and no
      regard was paid to “families”………when these “slaves” actually gained freedom when the
      war ended…….they went in search of their “families” because they had been broken up.

      Of course, if you don’t actually have families, I guess you can’t cause damage to them….
      was that the point you were trying to make?

      As for the subject or flat = fair, you missed the point of the evidence presented…..because
      while the math appears fair……..from a naively realistic perspective, the wealthy are in fact responsible for most of the costs of government and receive most of the benefits and protections and cause most of the damage and harm…………

      A flat tax based on the same percentage of “income” does NOT reflect the above reality
      nor would it be fair………by any accounting, unless you choose to ignore it or deny it,
      and the examples offered do not even begin to address the scope of this REALITY.

      But you are correct……if you are easily moved by words like freedom and liberty,
      which hold no relevant contextual meaning…..and you do not want to be troubled
      with having to actually consider this……….( because that is what this blog is about )
      then I imagine that responses, such as yours……will be a common reaction……
      unfortunately, for you………it also means I am in EXACTLY the RIGHT PLACE!

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        Galt: Why would this be the wrong blog…….is the presentation of evidence which can be
        used to reach different conclusions or discern the truth of things not welcome here?

        How did the evils of the great society do more damage to the black family than slavery……all slaves were property and subject to sale at the owners pleasure……..I was unaware that any attention was paid to family integrity with regard to these transactions?

        In fact, after the ban on importation, only four states were primarily using slaves for
        cotton production……..the rest were engaged in “breeding”…..to fill demand, and no
        regard was paid to “families”………when these “slaves” actually gained freedom when the
        war ended…….they went in search of their “families” because they had been broken up.

        Of course, if you don’t actually have families, I guess you can’t cause damage to them….
        was that the point you were trying to make?

        Slavery was a universal problem, Galt, not just in America. Btw, nothing has changed, as we still have slavery; Slavery via debt! So your point was?

        Galt: As for the subject or flat = fair, you missed the point of the evidence presented…..because
        while the math appears fair……..from a naively realistic perspective, the wealthy are in fact responsible for most of the costs of government and receive most of the benefits and protections and cause most of the damage and harm…………

        A flat tax based on the same percentage of “income” does NOT reflect the above reality
        nor would it be fair………by any accounting, unless you choose to ignore it or deny it,
        and the examples offered do not even begin to address the scope of this REALITY.

        For all your braggadocios-bragging about not being a tax-paying-stooge…listen to yourself. Confused much…or just a double-speaking, double-agent?

        Galt: But you are correct……if you are easily moved by words like freedom and liberty,
        which hold no relevant contextual meaning…..and you do not want to be troubled
        with having to actually consider this……….( because that is what this blog is about )

        Typical babble from the babbling Galt, who couldn’t find his behind with both hands and flashlight.

        Galt: then I imagine that responses, such as yours……will be a common reaction……
        unfortunately, for you………it also means I am in EXACTLY the RIGHT PLACE!

        I agree! Stick around, you may actually learn something of profit…

      • don

        galt got a lot of hot air an boy has he been drinkig the cool aid.you got to rember we fixed slavery a long time a go you think the blacks had it bad you should have been a red man. back then if you was red you was dead. let get this country back on track to freedom.

      • GALT

        Typical Jayson; wasting time and space…..while attempting to continue your functional
        illiteracy, deficient memory skills, and irrelevant commentary…….

        Lets clear that up;

        Slavery was a universal problem, Galt, not just in America. Btw, nothing has changed, as we still have slavery; Slavery via debt! So your point was?

        What was your’s? 1.) the response was not directed to you, nor did it state that slavery was confined to the United States…….but slavery in the United States was unique……
        and the breeding program was a unique solution to the supply problem……every other
        nation using slaves shipped from west africa, required continuous importation to solve the
        attrition problem.

        2.) The correct term for debt slavery is “peonage”, not slavery……and if you had read
        Debt: the First 5000 Years, as recommended you would know this and a lot more.

        There is however an exception to “debt” which by law is now eternal, transcending death
        and that is “corporate debt”……..which dies with the corporation, along with a lot of
        other things………but this has no effect on the “wealthy owners”, who are not liable
        for anything or responsible for the damage done…….ask Willard.

        Did you have anything else to offer that we can all profit from?

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        Galt: Typical Jayson; wasting time and space…..while attempting to continue your functional illiteracy, deficient memory skills, and irrelevant commentary…….

        Its called, mirroring, Galt…

        Lets clear that up;

        Slavery was a universal problem, Galt, not just in America. Btw, nothing has changed, as we still have slavery; Slavery via debt! So your point was?

        Galt: What was your’s? 1.) the response was not directed to you, nor did it state that slavery was confined to the United States…….but slavery in the United States was unique……
        and the breeding program was a unique solution to the supply problem……every other
        nation using slaves shipped from west africa, required continuous importation to solve the
        attrition problem.

        Unique? I think not!

        Galt: 2.) The correct term for debt slavery is “peonage”, not slavery……and if you had read

        Tomato, tomatoe…

        Galt: Debt: the First 5000 Years, as recommended you would know this and a lot more.

        A fine read, btw.

        Galt: There is however an exception to “debt” which by law is now eternal, transcending death and that is “corporate debt”……..which dies with the corporation, along with a lot of
        other things………but this has no effect on the “wealthy owners”, who are not liable for anything or responsible for the damage done…….ask Willard.

        That’s a bit racist, don’t you think. That’s like saying all poor people are humble and honest…

        Galt: Did you have anything else to offer that we can all profit from?

        Apparently you’re the only that is having difficulty profiting…

      • GALT

        Galt: Typical Jayson; wasting time and space…..while attempting to continue your functional illiteracy, deficient memory skills, and irrelevant commentary…….

        Its called, mirroring, Galt…

        No, that’s only what you imagine it is……after all if this

        “Typical babble from the babbling Galt, who couldn’t find his behind with both hands and flashlight.”

        was an accurate description, it would not have provoked a response or required one………..and certainly not one that sought to “mirror” that which was described.

        Lets clear that up;

        Slavery was a universal problem, Galt, not just in America. Btw, nothing has changed, as we still have slavery; Slavery via debt! So your point was?

        Galt: What was your’s? 1.) the response was not directed to you, nor did it state that slavery was confined to the United States…….but slavery in the United States was unique……and the breeding program was a unique solution to the supply problem……every other nation using slaves shipped from west africa, required continuous importation to solve the attrition problem.

        Unique? I think not!

        Very compelling and convincing argument…..clearly what you think does seem to be a compulsion you have not learned to control….however it is a standard which has no weight…….or value.

        American Slavery 1619 – 1877: Peter Kolehin

        on the other hand does. Complete with sources that you are free to test and challenge v. what you think. ( but mostly imagine. )

        Galt: 2.) The correct term for debt slavery is “peonage”, not slavery……and if you had read

        Tomato, tomatoe…

        Unfortunately not…….
        pe·on·age
        n.
        1. The condition of being a peon.
        2. A system by which debtors are bound in servitude to their creditors until their debts are paid.

        Mexico had no problem with peonage, yet had outlawed slavery……. Peonage is far more insidious in that while the peon is help by debt service he has to maintain his own upkeep as well as pay the debt.

        This was far more advantageous to the creditor, which exploited worker’s in coal mining, share cropping, etc. and is more representative of current conditions……..

        Galt: Debt: the First 5000 Years, as recommended you would know this and a lot more.

        A fine read, btw.

        with no evidence that you have….or got much out of it, if you have………because this was covered in there also.

        Galt: There is however an exception to “debt” which by law is now eternal, transcending death and that is “corporate debt”……..which dies with the corporation, along with a lot of other things………but this has no effect on the “wealthy owners”, who are not liable for anything or responsible for the damage done…….ask Willard.

        That’s a bit racist, don’t you think. That’s like saying all poor people are humble and honest…

        It might be something…..but it is hardly racist…..

        Galt: Did you have anything else to offer that we can all profit from?

        Apparently you’re the only that is having difficulty profiting…

        Clearly you have nothing to offer me………and I suppose it is possible that other’s might profit from your “foolishness” indirectly, but that is hardly worth my time…….

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        Galt: Typical Jayson; wasting time and space…..while attempting to continue your functional illiteracy, deficient memory skills, and irrelevant commentary…….

        Its called, mirroring, Galt…

        Galt: No, that’s only what you imagine it is……after all if this

        Imagined or perceived?

        “Typical babble from the babbling Galt, who couldn’t find his behind with both hands and flashlight.”

        Galt: was an accurate description, it would not have provoked a response or required one………..and certainly not one that sought to “mirror” that which was described.

        More babble.

        Lets clear that up;

        Slavery was a universal problem, Galt, not just in America. Btw, nothing has changed, as we still have slavery; Slavery via debt! So your point was?

        Galt: What was your’s? 1.) the response was not directed to you, nor did it state that slavery was confined to the United States…….but slavery in the United States was unique……and the breeding program was a unique solution to the supply problem……every other nation using slaves shipped from west africa, required continuous importation to solve the attrition problem.

        Unique? I think not!

        Galt: Very compelling and convincing argument…..clearly what you think does seem to be a compulsion you have not learned to control….however it is a standard which has no weight…….or value.

        To you, perhaps.

        American Slavery 1619 – 1877: Peter Kolehin

        on the other hand does. Complete with sources that you are free to test and challenge v. what you think. ( but mostly imagine. )

        Galt: 2.) The correct term for debt slavery is “peonage”, not slavery……and if you had read

        Tomato, tomatoe…

        Galt: Unfortunately not…….
        pe·on·age
        n.
        1. The condition of being a peon.
        2. A system by which debtors are bound in servitude to their creditors until their debts are paid.

        Mexico had no problem with peonage, yet had outlawed slavery……. Peonage is far more insidious in that while the peon is help by debt service he has to maintain his own upkeep as well as pay the debt.

        This was far more advantageous to the creditor, which exploited worker’s in coal mining, share cropping, etc. and is more representative of current conditions……..

        Call it what you will, or describe it as you wish; it is still slavery!

        Galt: Debt: the First 5000 Years, as recommended you would know this and a lot more.

        A fine read, btw.

        Galt: with no evidence that you have….or got much out of it, if you have………because this was covered in there also.

        I’ll make the final determination, and it matters not, if you agree with it.

        Galt: There is however an exception to “debt” which by law is now eternal, transcending death and that is “corporate debt”……..which dies with the corporation, along with a lot of other things………but this has no effect on the “wealthy owners”, who are not liable for anything or responsible for the damage done…….ask Willard.

        That’s a bit racist, don’t you think. That’s like saying all poor people are humble and honest…

        Galt: It might be something…..but it is hardly racist…..

        I beg to differ.

        Galt: Did you have anything else to offer that we can all profit from?

        Apparently you’re the only that is having difficulty profiting…

        Galt: Clearly you have nothing to offer me………and I suppose it is possible that other’s might profit from your “foolishness” indirectly, but that is hardly worth my time…….

        Is your time really worth anything?

      • GALT

        Since you seem to be very concerned that I am spending it here, and you are spending
        lot of your time, attempting to convince everyone that I have nothing to say……the question would appear to be rhetorical.

        Seems rather strange to be spending all your time on that which is meaningless.

        Yet you can not seem to stop……not to mention the fact that whatever it is you are
        attempting to do…….you are doing so ineptly.

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        Galt: Since you seem to be very concerned that I am spending it here…

        Concerned? Not at all…

        Galt: and you are spending lot of your time, attempting to convince everyone that I have nothing to say……

        I think you have a lot say, Galt. Your problem is; you are a horrible communicator. You speak in riddles loaded with ridicule, and marinated in arrogance…is it any wonder you get blow-back?

        Galt: the question would appear to be rhetorical.

        Off course! Are you an arrogant twit?….

        Galt: Seems rather strange to be spending all your time on that which is meaningless.

        So why do you?

        Galt: Yet you can not seem to stop……not to mention the fact that whatever it is you are

        attempting to do…….you are doing so ineptly.

        Projecting, Galt?

      • GALT

        Jayson, is this the blow back you are referring to?

        blow back: noun
        the unforeseen negative consequences of an action or decision

        “More babble.”
        “Unique? I think not!”
        “To you, perhaps.”
        “Tomato, tomatoe…”
        “Call it what you will, or describe it as you wish”
        “I’ll make the final determination, and it matters not, if you agree with it.”
        “I beg to differ.”

        I guess the effects of this must be “extremely time delayed”………

        and there is no need to “beg to differ”, unless you intend to actually
        produce a difference……….

        But you did inspire “don” to comment……..the effort seems to have exhausted him…..

        “To be wealthy and honored in an unjust society is a disgrace.”

        In a country well governed, poverty is something to be ashamed of. In a country badly governed, wealth is something to be ashamed of.”

        ― Confucius

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        More babble and gibberish from Galt…

    • DaveH

      Kenny,
      A Flat Tax (really Flat Rate Income Tax) would certainly be better than the current byzantine Income Tax system, but it would still be an Income Tax, and thus would still allow Big Government to snoop into our personal lives, and extract enormous taxes from us for the foreseeable future.
      If it was truly a “Flat Tax”, then it would indeed be a very “fair” tax, because every adult would pay the same dollar amount for the Government he votes for. So voters would be voting to spend their own money as much as anybody else’s money. In such a case, you can bet the voters would do much more research on which parts of Government really are necessary and which are not.
      The Fairest tax system of them all would be one in which the Users paid for their consumed Government Services, and only those Government Services which could not be easily assigned to the Users (such as National Defense) would be paid for by a General and Equal Tax for all adults. Of course, the Leaders would never go along willingly with such a scheme, because the citizens would quickly discover that they could get the same Services in the Private Marketplace and they would be cheaper, better quality, and more politely administered than those of Monopoly Government.

      • GALT

        And then there is the REAL world, where none of that is true, or even remotely fair.

        But why would things like defense, the justice system or anything connected to these
        things be paid for equally…….their use doesn’t provide equal benefit, protection, access or reliability of service.

        Table 1: Distribution of net worth and financial wealth in the United States, 1983-2010

        Total Net Worth

        Top 1 percent Next 19 percent Bottom 80 percent
        1983 33.8% 47.5% 18.7%
        1989 37.4% 46.2% 16.5%
        1992 37.2% 46.6% 16.2%
        1995 38.5% 45.4% 16.1%
        1998 38.1% 45.3% 16.6%
        2001 33.4% 51.0% 15.6%
        2004 34.3% 50.3% 15.3%
        2007 34.6% 50.5% 15.0%
        2010 35.4% 53.5% 11.1%

        Financial (Non-Home) Wealth

        Top 1 percent Next 19 percent Bottom 80 percent

        1983 42.9% 48.4% 8.7%
        1989 46.9% 46.5% 6.6%
        1992 45.6% 46.7% 7.7%
        1995 47.2% 45.9% 7.0%
        1998 47.3% 43.6% 9.1%
        2001 39.7% 51.5% 8.7%
        2004 42.2% 50.3% 7.5%
        2007 42.7% 50.3% 7.0%
        2010 42.1% 53.5% 4.7%

        It would seem that based on these numbers FAIR could easily be determined
        by those who have the most to protect……..but just to be really FAIR, we could
        average the differences between the top total net worth and bottom financial
        net worth for the top 1% and the bottom 80% so that the final fair TAX…..would be allocated as………..38.25 for the top 1%, 53.5% for the next 19 % and 8.75 % for the
        bottom 80 %……..which is slightly more than 100% but close enough…….pay a little debt
        off with the surplus………..

        Just a thought……in the interest of FAIRNESS

      • DaveH

        Yes, unfortunately the Real World is composed of people like Galt whose self-interest is all that matters.

      • GALT

        And my self interest would be?

        Keep in mind, if you decide to actually attempt to produce a substantive response…..

        I am not here to constantly complain about the governments hand in my pocket
        since they do not have and have not had their hands in my pocket since 1980….
        so at the very least, I am not paying for my own subjugation, by the tyranny that
        you all imagine exists, by whomever the conspirators are……..and the impending
        doom you all claim we are facing………and this information has been continuously
        offered to all of you to do the same……….

        So my self interest is?

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        The question is for you to answer, since only you have access to the twisted-labyrinth, otherwise known as your consciousness, [comment has been edited]

      • GALT

        I realize Jayson that as a functional illiterate…..you do not understand that David was not asking a question……..but making a declarative statement…….and trust me, he doesn’t need your help in avoiding substantive responses………

        A gathering of “illiterates” are still “illiterate”………maybe if you guys each took 100 words and learned what they meant yourresponses might consist of something other than
        buzzwords and logical fallacies……….

  • http://mozilla robert e. lee

    HOG WASH;; 20% OF THE PATIENTS GET 80% OF THE BENEFITS;; NO ONE IS EVER DENIED TREATMENT;; GO TO THE er AND TELL ME YOU ARE TURNED AWAY;;;;;;;;pre-existing conditions are a reality. so those people need to get insured in a large high risk pool; why should those who seldom use their insurance pay for the abusers? social justice I suppose[hah]; why do you suppose [profether] hospitals/care givers double bill for services given to the insured?? to pay for the services given to the UNINSURED; now that is not hard for you to grasp is it????let the private insures go nationwide without government interference and costs will moderate….

    • johno

      10 people get together and start pooling their money in case of emergency. No great emergencies so the pool grows. The people hire someone to manage the money. The manager becomes more powerful than any of the 10 individuals and starts making rules to keep the original investors in line. He then starts selling shares in the money pool to outside investors. Soon the original 10 become pawns to the investors and are expected to keep contributing to the pool. The new investors start receiving dividends. One of the originals get sick and expects something from the pool he’s been paying into for years. He gets some but not all and told he’s a bad risk and will have to pay in more from now on. Modern insurance in a nutshell.
      Once the insurance companies started using lobbyists and started controlling the medical profession to achieve profits they became nothing more than another government bureaucracy.
      If a 100 million wage earners put in $1000 a year it would be $100 billion. Shouldn’t that be enough to supply health care to everyone if the bulk of it wasn’t going to Wall Street?

  • Paul Wells

    Bob,

    Great article! It was painful to read (as a Republican), but spot on.

    If there is a take away from all of this…campaign weary though you may be…NOW is the time to start getting out the word about Gary Johnson for 2016. He needs name recognition, grass roots activism, and the time to start for the 2016 election is NOW! That is the only way we’ll get meaningful change in government. Also…fire a few senators and representatives from Congress for good measure. It will send the message that they work for US, not the other way around!

  • Rusty

    Brother Livingston: While I agree with some of your points, do you really think that Obama will be ok for another 4 years? Please, we cannot take another 4 years of him! Just as in the ’08 campaign season, “I’m not thrilled with Romney, however, the alternative is unacceptable!”.
    Now, if you truly want to rectify this, and, get our Country back to our Constitution, then look at nebraska republic dot org and pick on “WATCH VIDEO”. Let me know what you think rd6475 at hotmail dot com.

    • DaveH

      Did we survive Lincoln?
      Did we survive Wilson?
      Did we survive FDR?
      Can we survive much longer if we don’t remove the Propaganda Blinders and start voting for Candidates who truly do understand the concepts of Freedom? Not likely.
      A vote for Romney will be a vote for more of the same on the Road to Serfdom.

    • DaveH

      Here is a link to Rusty’s suggested video for those who are interested:
      http://www.indeprise.com/republic/our-nations-history-3.wmv

      • DaveH

        And no, Rusty, I didn’t watch the video. I could care less about the United States Corporation conspiracy, as it would an impossible sell to the people (even if true). If indeed there is such, the facts are that the Politicians don’t acknowledge it, and thus the truth to the people is that they are abiding by the Constitution. So we need merely to convince the people that the Constitution the Politicians swear to uphold is not in truth being upheld by them. I say “merely” in a relative sense, because I’ve been trying to wake people up to the reality of the Constitution for 40 years now and it mostly falls on deaf ears. So how in the world do you expect to get the people to accept a concept much more complicated than that?
        It would be a total waste of my time to pursue such a course.

      • DaveH

        If there was such a Conspiracy perpetrated unknowingly on the citizens, who would be more interested in such than the Libertarians who advocate much smaller Government than we have now (some even advocate no government)? Yet I have seen virtually nothing about the United States Corporation in any of the Libertarian books and articles I have read.
        I think this guy (bonaventure) explains the issue about as well as anybody:
        http://mises.org/community/forums/p/385/2899.aspx#2899

        And please don’t bug me about this in the future as I have no interest in it, and will most likely ignore any such comments.

  • Dbear

    A difference in this election is that so many of us (Teaparty) have finally realized we’re going to have to do the job ourselves. We’ll hold Romney’s toes and the toes of our teaparty-elected Congressmen to the fire and keep them, at least somewhat, in check. Then we’ll vote replacements for the bad ones again in 2012, 2014, 2016. Eventually we’ll have a government that is once more doing its intended job, and we can look things over and perhaps develop some policy that will better prevent the corruption that’s taken place over the last hundred years. It’s a big job and a long term job. Keeping people interested in doing it will be tricky. Complacency will set in as we have some success. But we’ve awakened a remarkable number of people and we can now capitalize on that.

    • DaveH

      The Tea Party has already fallen down on the job with nearly half of their candidates voting to raise the debt ceiling. Their views are too diverse and incohesive to effect any significant changes.
      Only the Libertarian Party offers a Principled agenda for those who wish to get the kind of Freedom back that the majority of the Founders of this country envisioned for us:
      http://www.lp.org/platform

  • Flops

    Yes, both Obama and Romney (with the enthusiastic support of the Congress) will
    continue to pursue the Israeli agenda at the expense of Gentile America’s interests.
    Ironically, it is because of our radical pro-Israel policies that we were attacked on 9/11.
    This then resulted in the wars in Afghanistan & Iraq and also the so-called Patriot Act and other liberty-curtailing laws. Somewhere, Hitler must be approving of both Israel’s racist “democracy” and its domination over American foreign policy which, by the way, has added at least 4 trillion dollars to the national debt.

    • Kid

      9-11 was not because of our alliance with Israel!! Late in Billy Clinton’s last term, he could have had Bin Laden. Laden was out in the open, but went underground. Billy had intel that Laden was in a certain area. Instead of send Navy Seals to take him out, he got the Navy to fire 50 Tomahawk missles into that rgion, hitting a school full of CHILDREN!!! THIS is why Laden hit the Twin Towers. It had NOTHING to do with Israel and all to do with Clinton’s totally irresponsible use of our Naval Missle arsenal. Clinton also was responsible for BLACKHAWK DOWN in Somalia. The commander of that effort said he needed tanks to get the job done. BILLY BOY said he wanted to keep it low profile. Hence, we got BLOWN AWAY!!! Another Clinton Blunder that caused Bin Laden to hit the Twin Towers in revenge.

  • Louis Lemieux

    Bob, I would like you to make an effort and tell us those positive things you see in both the Republican and Democratic Party. If everything is so negative as you say, how can you love this country when you hate so much of it?!

    • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

      Hating the corrupt-political-system of a country, does not mean one hates the country, Louis. Conversely, loving the corrupt-political-system of a country, might well mean one hates the country, Louis.

    • http://boblivingstonpl.wordpress.com Bob Livingston

      Dear Louis Lemieux,

      You write: “Bob, I would like you to make an effort and tell us those positive things you see in both the Republican and Democratic Party.” I have looked and see none.

      You write: ” If everything is so negative as you say, how can you love this country when you hate so much of it?” The Democrat and Republican Party is not America. You have a misguided sense of what the country is.

      Best wishes,
      Bob

      • Louis Lemieux

        According to the wishes of Americans the Republican and Democratic Party is the majority of America.

      • DaveH

        That is because, Louis, most of them have only been exposed to the choices as offered by Democrats or Republicans, and their sycophantic media.
        Bob is trying to change that, and for some reason people like you, Louis, are doing their best to keep people ignorant.

      • Bert Cundle Sr.

        Louis Lemieux says:

        October 29, 2012 at 10:04 am

        According to the wishes of Americans the Republican and Democratic Party is the majority of America.
        ______________________________________________________________________

        That is the New Problem! Americans Other than U.S. Citizens ARE NOT Suposeto VOTE in our Elections! ( Just beacuse they don’t have elections… ( Or fair ones eather)

  • http://loboviejo.wordpress.com loboviejo

    The United States went through a series of one-term presidents from 1837 to 1861. In 1840 more people knew who Gen Harrison was than President Van Buren. At the same time the industrial North expanded tremendously without a strong national industrial policy which would have, in the view of fairness, have dragged the entire economy down to the performance level of the mercantile South.

    The best hope is that the electorate can limit a series of Presidents to one term in order to limit their interference in the economy and maintain a gridlock against action. Unfortunately we will probably be plagued with someone on a white horse who will screw it up.

  • http://alfredrferguson alfred

    Yes, “windisea’s” idea encapsulated in the quote from General Washington is inspiring indeed. But it is also impractical. Brave words engender stirring emotional responses to be sure; but do not account for necessary changes in either tactics or strategy necessitated by today’s other voices, other rooms. Admirable though Ron Paul is, a vote for that admirable man is–ultimately–a vote for Obama, for it is a vote against the single hope we have of replacing Obama’s disastrous term in office: Romney.

    I have yet to encounter a winning tactic or strategy predicated on brave words. Henry V’s speech before the attack at Agincort was, inspiring, and, ultimate inspiration to a winning tactic.

    The winning arc was the English Logbow, and the English longbowmen

  • Reykool

    Was America better of 4 years ago,after 8 years of zionist neo cons infested BUSH administration and its financial fiasco ? So now you want to replace OBAMA fake change by a Zionist neo con infested ROMNEY administration ?(Dov Zakheim is behind his campaign) ROMNEY is obviously a George H Bush (Papa Bush) front man, If you call “Intelligent man” in the White House a man who FLIP FLAP and say anything to get elected then he is smart…but so was John Kerry… REMEMBER ????.
    MITT ROMNEY (BUSH 3rd term) NO (IQ 90)
    OBAMA (CARTER 2nd TERM) NO (IQ 130)
    NONE OF THE ABOVE YES
    I rather waste my vote on libertarian considering that Ron Paul is out and that these elections will be rigged in favor of Mitt Romney anyway,and then get ready for another staged 9/11 type of false flag attack to justify the bombing of Iran and WW3 for Israel
    Hopefully I am wrong..

    • Jimmy the Greek

      Your not !

  • Tazio2013

    RE: “So I have to admit that one thing will change if Romney’s elected: There will finally be an intelligent adult in the White House.”

    So, Bob, why such an inane final sentence? No matter which of these two clowns gets selected by TPTB, the growth of AmeroFascism will continue to accelerate as the 1% Republikrat Rothschild Zionists get richer and the 99% get screwed.

    Momento mori
    Semper fortis

    • http://boblivingstonpl.wordpress.com Bob Livingston

      Dear Tazio2013,

      You write: ” No matter which of these two clowns gets selected by TPTB, the growth of AmeroFascism will continue to accelerate as the 1% Republikrat Rothschild Zionists get richer and the 99% get screwed.” I believe I said that.

      Best wishes,
      Bob

    • eddie47d

      That was indeed an odd last sentence in the article Tazio. Like all Presidents Obama has made gaffs and also needs a stronger backbone. If you stand for something then explain it upfront and don’t let it fester which Obama occasionally does. Romney has learned very well how to manipulate people in his business dealings. He’ll sell you skunk cabbage and tell you its caviar. In other words he’ll make 92 million off of a deal and tell the worker who was disposed of that it was a fair and honest trade. I believe Romney can be very cold hearted,dishonest and immoral and puts on a phony front. If that is intelligence then we are in bigger trouble than ever and the banksters win.

      • tony newbill

        We have spent 7 trillion bucks trying to train Obama and he has proven UN-TRAIN-ABLE !!!! Instead of Leaning Forward we need to MOVE ON .

        At least we will get the private sector back to work with Romney because he is Not Hamstrung by a Environmental group that is ANTI growth like Obama is .

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        eddie, your attempt at trying to convince us that one turd is less offensive than the other, or more pleasing, is becoming tiresome…flush them both down the toilet!

      • eddie47d

        Tony is wrong because Obama has never been anti-growth. He does want it done without cannibalizing Obama administration. He hasn’t stopped any business from releasing the piles of money they have and hiring more people. If we’ve got a problem in Washington look to congress1

        • tony newbill

          Eddie47d you are dreaming man , you are supporting a LIE a green facade

      • http://alsina846.wordpress.com millie

        eddie you are a bum

      • DaveH

        Disclaimer — I do not in any way support Romney.
        However, I sure do get tired of Eddie’s conjecture.
        Show us where, Eddie, in any deal Romney has engaged in, did he Force people to buy or sell their companies?

      • JeffH

        I just can’t resist reposting these similarities between Obama and eddie.

        Obama has been petty and vindictive, wandering from odd slogan to odd slogan, attacking his opponents relentlessly.

        ______________***ALERT***_______________

        My God, that sounds so familiar. Could eddie be a clone of Gibbs, Carney or even Obama? Eddie47D has been doing all of this stuff for 3+ years on PLD…

        POLLY WANT A CRACKER? baaarrraaaccckkkkk!

    • DaveH

      Bob’s comment was taken out of context. To get the full context, please read the article.
      But at least read the whole paragraph:
      “These items reminded me of just how immaturely the whole Obama camp has carried itself for more than three years — sort of like a group of overprivileged frat boys on a long bender. So I have to admit that one thing will change if Romney’s elected: There will finally be an intelligent adult in the White House”.

  • http://gcodom.wordpress.com gcodom

    Yes, sure you are basically championing a LP type of candidate. But until the vote for that kind of candidate means more than being a spoiler for the Republican candidate, in order words, throwing the election to the left what is the point? At this time a vote for the LP makes the odds more favorable for the Democrat. When we work out that dilemma then there is promise for real change. Rather a vote for one of the two major parties will actually be counted. I know it sucks, but it is what it is.

  • Howard Roark

    The progressive income tax idea came directly out of the communist manifesto. it is in fact one of the ten planks of copmmunism and was said by Carl Marx to be a way of destroying the middle class,

  • Average Joe

    After reading these rebuttals (?) to Bob’s article…..and then watching this video : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CI8UPHMzZm8&feature=player_embedded
    I have come to the conclusion that we as a species are doomed to extinction…….

    Great article Bob and spot on as usual.

    Best Wishes,
    AJ

  • Mike A. Bozarth

    I respect your opinion Mr. Livingston, and understand your points. As long-time supporter of Congressman Ron Paul, I will be casting my vote for former Governor Gary Johnson, the Libertarian candidate. I live in Missouri, and all polls are showing Romney will handily carry my state–so I do not see my vote as helping reelect Obama. But even if the race in MO was as close as it is in Ohio I would still vote for Gary Johnson because I want the establishment to know I will not settle for the lesser of two evils. I’m going to vote for who believes in the same principles I do.

  • Now and Then

    I Agree gcodom,its like going down the same old road over,and over again,some what like a YO-YO!!!

  • Steven Goldstein

    Mr. Livingston, You have time and time again proved your adeptness at scaring the public. FACT; whether an incumbant Democrat is re elected or a Republican takes the white house history has shown that the stock market has rallied for the next year. Mitt is
    no savior, just another puppet of big biz. BTW everyone speaks of creating jobs but no one really mentions what jobs or how. You want jobs? Tax the hell out of all the sons of bitches who have outsourced jobs to India,China et al. Bring the factories home, thats where to begin. I’m sure you and your die hard followers will disagree claiming that businesses have the right to put their workers where ever they want [ its a free country isn't it?] even if it means putting Americans out of work.

    • http://speedle speedle

      Steve, have you ever heard the term “free enterprise”? The word “free” means something here. The government should not dictate where a business locates and who it employs. The market always corrects itself, and protectionism is the short cut road to hell. Eventually (in fact it is already starting to happen) the labor market in China will dry up as people tire of working for $10 a day over there. Jobs are a “market” just as consumers are a market. If you have a skill that is not in particular demand you would be best served developing another skill instead of whining about your job being outsourced. No president (Obama, Romney or even the sainted Paul) can do anything about the will of people to seek financial gains. All a government can do is create a landscape (usually tax laws) that make doing business in its domain attractive. That’s the way it is.

      • Jimmy the Greek

        Speedil The time for the government to step in is when a corp tries to do something that is not in the best interest of the nation ( like moving a plant to a cheap labor market ) or outsourcing jobs . Imports should be taxed at a rate that would make the domestic product the one that would be the less expensive to buy . to hell with the stock market we need to do away with the stock market system . if you want to invest go to were you want to invest and buy a piece of the company without going through the zionist system .

      • http://speedle speedle

        No Jimmy, that’s wrong. The government cannot “step in” because the politics du jour of a particular interest group call for it to do so. That’s what cronyism is all about. Let’s buy labor votes with this and business votes with that, and the gay and lesbian vote with this, etc. The government is there to protect the citizens from physical harm, not to shield them from inefficiencies in its economy. Don’t you see? To do any different makes us the same as the failed economies of western Europe.

    • DaveH

      Steven says — “whether an incumbant Democrat is re elected or a Republican takes the white house history has shown that the stock market has rallied for the next year”.
      Do you know the difference, Steven, between a real Market Rally and one induced by the Federal Reserve’s creation of money which causes stock prices to rally only because newly injected money causes all prices to rise, especially those Companies that are direct recipients of Big Government and Federal Reserve largess?

    • Jimmy the Greek

      Steven you are right !

      • tony newbill

        Jimmy what do you want Big Business or Big Government running the trickle down System because whatever way we go its a matter of Trickle down that crap about Bottom up has to Come trickling down from Government and Government don’t create Profit that taxable income needs to come from to balance government debts , and in this scenario higher taxation balancing the Governments debt is just a MYTH ????

    • Nadzieja Batki

      Those factories and jobs may just come back to America, manufacturing is getting too expensive in China so quite a bit of manufacturing is outsourced from China to lesser nations.
      We are constantly reminded that we are a global economy so each country of the world will be producing what they are good at.The US is good at everything so the globalists suppress the US so the rest of the worthless nations can catch up.

      • tony newbill

        Nadzieja listen to what this Bill Northey, Iowa’s Secretary of Agriculture and co-chair of Farmers for Romney, outlined the candidate’s positions on trade, estate taxes and other issues of interest to farmers and ranchers. and listen to Obama’s Ag Sec too , there is a Very Big Difference and one you will find Interesting to say the least as far as Resource and wealth Consolidating into the control of the FEDs versus letting the private sector handle the domestic and international growth of GDP . This Proves that Obama and his Minions are the Ultimate NANNY in state Versus Federal Rule , http://www.cattlenetwork.com/e-newsletters/drovers-daily/Northey-makes-case-for-Romney-election-175992361.html

  • COCKED AND LOADED

    The single most important difference between Obama “the fraud” and Romney “a true american” Obama has dedicated his entire life to milking money from the united states threw the guise of community organizing, under handed realestate deals and most recently illegal oversea’s contributions. Romney on the other hand, saving viable businesses before they collapsed creating jobs, NOT PULLING A SALARY AS ELECTED OFFICIAL, my favorite, absolutly not one direct social tye to radical communist social terrorist groups EVER!!

    • Carol

      You are severely misinformed or have a vivid imagination!

      • Nadzieja Batki

        Desperation language from you will not make voters who do not want 4 more years of O to change their ideology. Why should they?

  • Fed up

    Bottom line – only a moron or communist would not see Romney as a helluva lot better choice than scumbag Muslim communist Obama!

    • Carol

      Who the heck are you listening to? There is so much propaganda out there and the uninformed voters are going for it hook, line and sinker. What’s the communist remark? Do you have proof? Or are you listening to the fringe?

      • http://Aol.com Ed Weber

        No,,just listening to the man and reading his books. Looking at his history of himself and family and the people that he surrounds himself with. Socialist, communist, whatever you want to call him,,,he is not good for America.

        • tony newbill

          Carol This video has a twist to its explanation of Policies , you have to watch it all to hear the twist about Obama , its 7 mins , but it explains everything about the way the Obama supporters are as 2 faced
          Obama Supporters Actually Hate Obama’s Policies
          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Skw-0jv9kts&sns=fb

      • Nadzieja Batki

        So you can recognize propaganda but then why are you following O and his ideology? So you are of the same mindset as O and his minions.

    • Walter & Renee Agard

      YOU just have a lot of hate in your mind, that is why you cant think,it poisons your mind.People have to control you with influences-A switch. You are just like a robot.

      • Nadzieja Batki

        I would ask you both to act and think like mature adults but if you vote for O that is an impossibility.

  • http://none ron

    Romney does not support drone strikes. He said openly he would not violate the airspace of another sovereign country. Terrorism will grow exponentially under Romney.
    As for foreign policy Romney has trouble getting both feet in his mouth but he tries hard.
    As for health care , Romney will only tweak it to cause more suffering to the poor and elderly infirm.
    The federal reserve is controlled by the jews. At least Obama stands up to the jews. Romney sucks up to the jews.
    Tax policy??? Lyin Ryan and Romney will make sure the poor pay more taxes so the rich don’t have to.
    As for Free Market, well Bush rammed corporatacracy down our throats and Romney will take it to the next level which is a complete Plutacracy. No doubt about it.
    Gun Laws??? Obama has eased restrictons on gun laws. Guns scare Romney to the point of constipation. He does not want anybody using them , especially his sons. He will , however , have no problem starting another war for the jews and send thousands of other Americans sons and daughters to die in lands far,far away.
    As for romney being a [expletive deleted], well that’s about all this article gets correct.
    Romney will flip-flop, skip and hop and stand on his head and suck his own cock if you’ll just vote for him.
    Romney will downsize America by taking from the poor and giving to the rich and there will be republican politicians hanging from light poles within a year.
    This should act as an anti-acid for all of you out there that have had republican/conservative [expletive deleted] rammed down your throats so much for the last 4 years that you don’t even know that you are full of [expletive deleted].

    • http://speedle speedle

      “taking from the poor and giving to the rich”. A simple minded slogan for a simple minded mindset. Congratulations.

      • Nadzieja Batki

        If the poor are poor what is there to take from them. Before using cliches think about them.
        O and his cronies want to meddle and tax the “middle class” to pay for their government programs.

        • tony newbill

          What we need to enable every Class is GDP above 3 % and headed towards 5 % , but Obama is Hamstrung by the ANTI Economic growth Squad called Environmentalist Marxist Bolsheviks , so he is a Lame DUCK president of Western Civilization and he cannot even generate a robust western economic fundamental that will help the 3rd world but instead the factions of the 3rd world who are radical and totalitarian by nature and Oppressive to their own societies are growing in Power , is this the Goal ???

      • Nadzieja Batki

        Sorry speedle, the comment was meant for ron.

      • http://speedle speedle

        I know it was. You make a good point

    • DaveH

      Speaking of Liberal Progressives claiming “that they’re the good guys, so it’s okay for them to steal other peoples’ money”.

    • http://Aol.com Ed Weber

      Ron,,,did you take an overdose of STUPID pills this morning??

      • alpha-lemming

        If “stupid” was a nickel…. he’d be the First National Bank of Tokyo !!!

  • steve

    how come no one is talking about what is in obama care. you really need to understand what’s in it . bob, how come you haven’t made a list of what is really going to happen with obama care . here’s a web site you need to read . it has the first 1100 pages and it brakes down what is coming. go to; informationliberation.com/?id=27020 page 59 is a big one.

    • http://boblivingstonpl.wordpress.com Bob Livingston

      Dear steve,

      You write: “bob, how come you haven’t made a list of what is really going to happen with obama care . (sic)” Use the search function at the top of page to search Obamacare and you will see dozens of articles about “what is really going to happen with obama care.”

      Best wishes,
      Bob

  • http://alsina846.wordpress.com Linda from NYC

    what a choice we got, we are in deep dooy, one is pure evil and the other lesser evil. I think I will take my chances with the mormon then with the muslim commuinst, they both bad, either way we loose.

  • http://wildeyguns.com The Christian American

    It seems all that politicians have to do to get elected is lie and promise people they’ll replace God in their lives by caring for them from the cradle to the grave. Regardless which one of them, the people are asking things that would be impossible from a mortal man. To make matters worse, they respond as if they were God. The problem is, as they are sworn in they prove themselves to be liars of the highest order. When’s the last time you heard a president say he will bound by the Constitution so you’d know where you stand? In my opinion these two are the most dangerous candidates America has had. There’s been more dangerous but the people were a little more cognizant of their actions, had a better rope ring in their noses. The legacy of Bush and Obama is that they have ushered in the new century with a government structure that is ripe for a Tyrannt’s / Satan’s will and appetite to be fostered on them. And the two candidates want that power more than anything else.

  • Carol

    Orwell wrote a line that would make a fine epitaph for Romney’s candidacy: “Apparently nothing will ever teach these people that the other 99 percent of the population exist”

    • http://speedle speedle

      Maybe you should concentrate on what Obama’s presidential epitaph will be.

      “From each according to his ability, to each according to his need”

      It would also be great if someday when his time comes to place him in a clear glass vacuum sealed casket and he can lay in state for the next 200 years, maybe in Cuba or somewhere.

    • Ted Crawford

      You are aware, aren’t you Carol, that Orwell was writing from the perspective of a victim of a society exactly like the one Obama dreams of aren’t you?

  • Jimmy the Greek

    No matter who wins in November , One thing well not change, The Zionist well still be calling the shots .

    • Nadzieja Batki

      God of Heaven is calling the shots and you just don’t like the fact.

  • http://www.facebook.com/christopher.cozzi Christopher Cozzi

    Does Obama actually think “kids” read Rolling Stone? Looks like he’s not as hip as the image! Oops.

  • Carol

    Romney’s admiration goes to Sheldon Adelson who is worth $25 billion. Adelson’s money is dirty. He has casinos in Macau and Singapore with bribed Chinese officials an
    dprostitution and supports the immediate bombing of Iran. This dirty money, $100 million, has been promised to Romney to defeat Obama.

  • krp

    The age that a child is able to remain on a parent’s insurance.’s family, is merely an arbitrary line that is decided by the insurance company.

    Many of the major insurance companies have stated that if ObamaCare is repealed that they would retain that policy. They may use that as an excuse to raise the premiums on family plan but that is their business decision.

    Your point about children growing before the age of 27 is then moot. It just shows how uninformed you are.

    And to add, if they students, children are allowed to be classified as a dependent for tax purposes until they are 26 as well.. There is precedent of the government lumping 26 year olds in a “family plan” until they are 26.

  • Mike

    I’m sick and tired of hearing about Israeli influence. The truth is that the US is nothing more than a surrogate for Saudi Arabia in fighting Shiites in the Middle East and beyond. In return they continue propping up our dollar by accepting it for their oil. Once the Sunni caliphate is established, the Saudis will dump US.

    Agree there’s no real difference between obama and romney or the democrats and republicans. They’re all just sucking the country dry for their own gain and the benefit of their cronies.

    • Jimmy the Greek

      Mike A jew and a muslim are two sides of the same coin !

      • Nadzieja Batki

        That comparison only works in that sewer that passes for your brain.

      • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

        Actually Jimmy, the muslims and the mormons are two sides of the same coin. The Jews are something else, entirely!

  • Joe Hammond

    Neither candidate will make any major changes in the way business is done within this dying empire that uses the initials USA. The very fabric of our society is no longer worth fighting for. Why challenge the corporate rulers when the very people you would be trying to free from the plutocracy have been turned into obese, digital junkies that have little or no concept about the structure of the nation nor the precepts of liberty? Sports facts are more important than facts about Civil Rights. Fear is the predominant emotion of the wage-slaves of the USA rather than a fierce desire for continued liberty. The quivering jello masses will willing sell their freedom from search and seizure without warrants in order to “feel” better about riding public transportation. They are giving away their abilitiy to choose a course in life designed by themselves in order to become “safer’ and keep putting the Big Macs into their triple chinned maws while working for a dollar that is losing value as you read this. They are flocking to the African-American Fuhrer or the Magic Underwear Commissar without asking “how” when promises are made that do not add up because they feel comforatble with the new “father”….God is invoked by used religion salesmen who preach from pulpits of gold usually with some scandal kneeling behind it hedonistically and the people close their eyes and sway to the sales pitch while emptying their pockets is a hopeless quest for immortality. The children are fat, greedy, lazy, and ignorant. The parents are frazzeled, lost, and afraid of losing their position in the pyramid of wage-slaves. The leaders are greedy, cunning, and willing to send everyone else to their death for a buck but not the members of their seed. The politicians are whores. The culture is dying with celebrity poisoning. History is whatever is acceptable at the moment and quick to be re-written to suit the god of money…….

    Change will come with pain and suffering. With death and despair. With a great die-back and at the end of an age of darkness. Then, and only then, will a new chance for liberty begin for mankind…….

  • spark300c

    Romney is indeed the lesser two evils and not clue about crisis that is comeing. this crisis greatly change Romney. Romney will awake form his sleep start question alot of things.

  • Ted Crawford

    If the times weren’t so deadly serious this would be hilarious! From both ends of the spectrum, the far left and the far right,EXACTLY the same disingenuouse tactics! The same old, tired, frayed, self-destructive rhetoric! “It must be exactly my way or, the “status quo” ! Only be being absolutely faithful to the full letter of the cultish manuel can quality results be atained!
    It would be far simpler that way. No need to elect anyone! Simply program a computer with the manuel and let it govern! At Last Utopia! WOW !
    have a good day, I need to find some adults to talk with!

    • Joe Hammond

      Just head back to the men’s room at the local YMCA…….You know the way…..

      • Ted Crawford

        Thank You Joe! It only took three minutes for an Ultra-Right, the same would have been true for a Progressive, to put an exclamation point to my post! Using, again as would a Progressive, an Alinsky tactic to, feebly attempt to demean and belittle, without even a hint at any substantive arguement to the point made in my post!

  • Rex

    Unfortunately, This Political junk has been going on for way to long. I’ve seen this stuff so many times ( I’m 70) that I could almost quote the redo rick! It’s not about to change and we are going to have a long, long haul in turning this big baby ( America) back to what it was originally designed to be. What makes anyone think that Politicians want to? A Republic not Democratic ” A REPUBLIC” ! There is a big difference. Bet you can’t inform me what they are?

    • Joe Hammond

      Democracy is mob rule that can do anything to anyone (see Socrates) while a Republic has rights that are immutable and relies on representation (see Bill of Rights/Constitution). Simplist answer I could give……

  • Alex Frazier

    People believe in the change expected in each election for the same reason liberals vote for Democrats and conservatives vote for Republicans; people are programed. They are told what to think. They are told what to say. They are told what to believe.

    And they obey.

    The real thinkers who take the time to do the research, to watch the debates, to follow up and fact-check rumors, etc. are an unfortunate minority in this country, and therefore ineffectual during the election cycles. Candidates like Ron Paul, who really did have the mind, experience, and education to give this country back its identity, didn’t have enough support in the face of the media onslaught. There were people ready to vote for Romney at the beginning of the primaries who didn’t know the first thing about him. Their vote wasn’t going to “Ron who?”

    I talked with my mother (ultra liberal) not too long ago. She was all full of that “Paul Ryan is against women” nonsense right after the convention. Of course, what she was saying was almost word for word what was said on the news, which is full of ultra-liberal nonsense. So I called her on it. I asked where she got her information … and she claimed to have listened to his entire speech. Although, she couldn’t tell me anything he actually said.

    Like many, she’s just a media puppet. She believes what she’s told to believe. Contradict it, and she shuts down the conversation.

    My cousin, a resident of Ohio, baited me with talks of politics. She is thankfully unable to vote this season because of registration issues, but she told me she would have voted for Obama. I asked why. Her response was that Romney wanted to give all the money to the rich people.

    Once again, just mindless blather. No president can “give” the wealthy anything. All they can do is reduce the amount the government “takes” from them. But ignoring that, she was completely ignorant to why Romney wanted to cut taxes, and she was oblivious to Romney’s statement that he intended to keep the wealthy paying the same amount. And despite me educating her in the past, she was ignorant of the fact that Obama is spending us into inflationary destruction.

    So the problem is a lack of knowledge, a lack of motivation, and a lack of patriotism. Voting has become all about what the individual can “get” out of the election, not which man is going to do what is best for the growth, prosperity, and future of our nation.

    Ron Paul should have been president. Personally, I think we’re all screwed. I will vote Romney because the morals and ethics of the Republican party more closely match my own. I’ll also vote Romney because he’s a businessman who understands what businesses need to survive and even flourish. But I don’t see many other advantages. He’s a liar and a panderer, and while his business acumen might be on target, he doesn’t understand economics worth a darn.

    The fact is, the behavior of the last two presidents has put us into such a financial bind that there’s no way out. We’ll either suffer hyper-inflation, or we’ll suffer depression. If they keep deficit spending, the more money they print, the higher the inflation gets. If they balance the budget instead, it will cause a massive reduction in the money supply, which will lead to deflation, lower prices, and ultimately layoffs, bankruptcies and depression. There’s no solution to our problem that doesn’t involve a lot of pain, and no president wants to be the one to lead our country through that. It’s not conducive to reelection. Our country is like a kid getting a shot. Most people won’t comprehend that it’s for our own good in the long run. They’ll just whine about the pain until it’s over and they have an icecream cone.

    But don’t expect intelligent votes. This article was appropriately placed … it’s in a blog. Because the only thing we can do about this problem is complain.

  • Now and Then

    It would be better to rule the world with a computer,but the next question would be”Who would program it?’there is,and always be,the human factor to consider !!!The only thing we have to fear is ourselves!!!For people who love freedom,such an ideal is out of the question!!!!!

  • http://Aol.com Ed Weber

    Unless Romney steps up to the plate to be a great President, which he has the opportunity to do, he is just a stopgap measure. We CANNOT have another four years of Obama. I would vote for Johnson, but not with Obama in the mix. Can’t risk losing to Obama.

    VOTE ROMNEY !!

    • Sun Rising

      That is where I am as well. Sadly!

  • Sun Rising

    This commentary needs to be unbderstood by all conservatives and republicans going into the voting booth. This is dead on and it also defines what our role will need to be with a Romney Administration.

    We will need to wartch Romney like a Hawk. We cannot liet him iplement the neocon version of socialism, nor can we allow him to rack up any more debts.

    He needs to do to the federal workforce what he did to the private sector workers. Companies he put out of business, were doing far better fiscally than the federal workforce!

    • Nadzieja Batki

      What you are saying is that Romney will have to implement the trimming of the deadwood in government.

  • Munnster

    Bob, while I normally agree with you, I think you are wrong on this issue. Although Mitt is far from the ideal candidate, he is not an extreme radical like Obama is. I can’t imagine the problems that will be unleashed upon us by Obama in a second term. Our Constitution will be shredded by Obama, we know that. Also, the next President will appoint up to three new Supreme Court justices. Look at the hacks that Obama appointed in the first term, can you imagine the appointees in a second term? Obama has to go for there to be ANY chance of saving this country.

  • Humpty Dumpty

    Though there may be an intelligent guy in the White House if Romney is elected–count the ballots twice, please–we still will be getting someone who has strings pulled by others, e.g., One World governance and World War III warmongers. If Romney really has the testicles to stand up for what is the American, way and Constitution, he will cut those ties as soon as he takes his hand off the swearing in Bible, otherwise we get the same old, same old, in my opinion.

    • Abigail Beutler

      All this discussion of who believes what and who can/will or cannot/ will not do what is irrelevant. The election will go to Romney, simply because his family owns the business which supplies the voting machines. These machines can and will be pre-programmed, so that Obama will not have a chance no matter what the voters want. Only in states, if there are any, who do not use voting machines will reflect the desire of the people.

      • Nadzieja Batki

        If as you say O doesn’t stand a chance to win the reelection how did he get elected the first time? You say nonsense just because you can?

  • Don

    obunhole, how can you say romney is a [expletive deleted] your first presidential campaign was nothing but [expletive deleted]. you made a pile of promises you never kept. you got elected by telling everyone what they wanted to hear. you are nothing but a big blowhard. things were’nt very good under bush. the hell of it is that its worse now. do we need 4 more years of you anymore. 4 more years of you should give this country third world status with your huge spending and debt. you promised you would cut the deficit in half. made promises on the debt. under your administration you were the biggest spending president ever. blame bush for everything. i don’t think romney would use you as an excuse for all the problems of this country. its been a long time coming. your pal, billy clinton who would stab you in the back did plenty of damage wit his wonderful free trade which would make more jobs and would make level playing field in trade was promised. i don’t remember when the government started helping companies move elsewhere happened. the level playing field is huge trade deficits to the usa and everyone buying all the cheap crap sent here. our former companies are getting super wealthy. it wasn’t all bush. its what happens when big business and big bankers decide every thing. obunhole we know you belong to their club just like a lot of the past presidents. everyone should view the “obama deception” online. it talks about our elected officials and who decides who becomes president. obunhole, i’m convinced you are the phoniest and the worst president ever.

  • http://none ron

    A lot of republicans think they live in a republic.
    Anyone with more than two brain cells to rub together can tell you that is not true.

    • http://boblivingstonpl.wordpress.com Bob Livingston

      Dear ron,

      You have–inadvertently in your case, I’m sure–hit on the crux of the problem. Article IV, Section 4: “The United States shall guarantee to every State in this Union a Republican Form of Government…” Anyone with more than two brain cells to rub together can tell you that is not true.

      Best wishes,
      Bob

      • http://none ron

        AHA!! So you are paying attention.
        You “expletived” some of my words in my comment but they were in your article written by you.
        Why can you write them in your article and I cannot in my comment????????????????

        • http://boblivingstonpl.wordpress.com Bob Livingston

          Dear ron,

          You write: “Why can you write them in your article and I cannot in my comment?” Context.

          Best wishes,
          Bob

          • http://none ron

            Here’s one for you Bob.
            That’s a bunch of “Malarky”.

    • tony newbill

      Ron why do you think we are fighting so hard to get it back from the progressive Ideologues who think they are the only smart ones in the world .. let alone the nation ???

  • Neil Swan

    What we have to do is get the Republicans out
    of congress and senate. and reelect Obama.
    That will help the people, but not the
    tea party and religious right who want to do
    nothing but ruin the country.

    Neil

  • Ol504Troop

    Very interesting things coming to light as late: Last Thursday- the 25th, a federal lawsuit was filed by Spire Law Group LLC, citing major banks and ‘banksters’, and naming high ranking Obama associates, and implicating his campaign in the $43 TRILLION dollars in mortgage fraud and non-repayment of TARP bailouts Obama’s administration are now trying to cover up. Named as defendants in the suit: Timothy Geitner, Eric Holder, Valerie Jarrett, Anita Dunn, and a host of others.
    The financial news network CNBC ran a headline regarding the lawsuit, and curiously, the very next day it was pulled after one of the executive’s two children were murdered by their nanny.
    in the last week, two military commanders have been relieved- David Ham, in charge of AFRICOM, was relieved and supposedly ARRESTED after being told to stand down on sending help to Benghazi and refusing the order. No info has came out yet regarding why carrier task force commander Admiral Gaouette was relieved two days later in the middle of a deployment.
    Could it all be related? Search “Can it All be Coincidence” and you might find some answers.

  • Jim Crawford

    I believe the ultra-conservative ‘elite’ and libertarians are off-base trying to make a point. They are merely telling us their guys are the only ones right…just like they accuse dems and repubs of doing. All political parties need to just weed out those that want an elected office purely for personal gain. We need people of all walks to employ honesty and common sense, God given gifts, to do what needs to be done for the general welfare of our country. No more accusations, no more lies to advance themselves…just plain ole dedication to doing a good job for the people that elected them. Voters should stand back and see who thinks for themselves and who just follows party lines. America needs thinkers who show no partiality and aren’t ‘beholdin’ to anybody or any entity. Following Christian principles of honesty, not being a false witness, not worshipping money or power above God and thinking more of others than yourself are characteristics that could fix Washington…that and a LOT of prayer.

  • http://google redbull

    Swan did you read any of the “books” the maddrass educated, marxist loving/socialist put into print, of his communist totalation veiws? This rug rubber want government to own all properity, paper pushing morons with book training thinking, to decide what you are allowed to think, eat, say, and how much you can make. Veiws of the Clintons, and going all the way back to the socialist/communist demopcrat paryty creation. The 1972 democrat in the Presidental race was a registered communist democrat and a former professor. Media never covers the socialist/communist democrats, no matter how corrupt, their crimminal activities they have been involved in. Whore hounds Clinton, Kennedys, Frank Dudd, Greasy Rangel and Blarney Flanks, all didn’t pay taxes, cheated on what special deals they and other party scrotts they slumbed with. Janet Reno got her job because of info and was ready to prosecute him for drugs and other activities he was involved in. Abdulla Obama can not tell the truth, and several people have died because he was either golfing or he was loping the lizard!

  • ClaraJune

    RE: People with sufficient money cannot comprehend what not having any is like.

    Oh yes, we can! I grew up POOR and have worked very hard ALL my life (I’m now in my mid-60s) to get where I am today. I am by no means rich, but I finally have enough money in my paycheck to pay my bills, give some away, and save some. Not that that’s going to do me a whole lot of good with the economy crashing, but it’s there today! Not everyone who is wealthy inherited it either. I am pleased to know many self-made entrepreneurs who are now wealthy, but put in years and hours of hard work to accomplish that.

  • r.p.

    Dear Bob: Surprisingly you haven’t been hit with hate for delivering your message, as it’s usually the norm to “kill the messenger” when they don’t like the message they are hearing. Well done for you today. This is a very good article, and one for those that continue to rant that we have to hold our noses “just this time” and we must “vote them out”. Or we have to vote for the “lesser”, but we will hold their feet to the fire again “just this time”. I’ve been hearing that garbage since I first voted in 69. We have to understand that the content of the character of these two candidates changes everytime they take a dump. But it still smells like [comment has been edited] We need to pay attention to who we elect. If we can’t get any information as to who their backers are, or no information on their past acheivements, they should not be elligable for the position they seek. This election I did not support either major party. The continued support for fascism, sosialism, and communism has ended for me today. And I feel pretty good about it. I know…. the trolls will be on the attack. So What!!!

    • r.p.

      “eligible” oops!

  • Bonnie Parmenter

    I love this article because it is the truth. Unfortunately, I have to totally support Mitt Romney at this point, but he certainly was not my favorite candidate running. I am a Ron Paul kind of person who truly supports small government and protection of our freedoms. Our laws are to protect our freedoms not take them away. It is discouraging that again, I am voting for the lesser of the two evils. It would be nice to have a candidate that has no evils but of course we are all human so that will never happen. get out and vote and Please vote for Mitt Romney!!!!!!!

  • Bimbam

    THE CURSE OF OBAMA

    We have an ILLEGAL president the first 4 years. Never showed any BC or any credentials.

    Now he will be re-elected through FRAUD! The Demoncrap party is commiting massive VOTER FRAUD and deceit!

    Now we will have a FRAUDULENT president the next 4 years.

    • ehancock

      Obama has showed both his short form birth certificate and his long form birth certificate, and the facts on them have been repeatedly confirmed by the officials of both parties in Hawaii, and by the public Index Data file and by the birth notices sent to the Hawaii newspapers’ “Health Bureau Statistics” sections by the DOH of Hawaii in 1961.

      Some evidence that Obama was born in Hawaii:

      1. Obama’s two official birth certificates, with the state seals on them. (The official physical copy of the long-form birth certificate was handed around in the White House press room, and one reporter said that she had felt the seal and took a photo of the document. http://turningthescale.net​/?p=541)

      2. The confirmation of the facts on the two birth certificates (short form and long form)—-that Obama was born in Hawaii—by THREE Republican officials in Hawaii and several Democrats, and by the public Index Data file. The acceptance of the written confirmation of the facts on Obama’s birth certificate by the conservative secretary of state of Arizona.

      3. The notices of Obama’s birth in the Hawaii newspapers in 1961 that were sent to the papers “Health Bureau Statistics” section by the DOH of Hawaii—-and only the DOH could send those notices. (Also, the claim that the DOH could have been influenced by lying relatives turns out to be false because whenever there was a claim of a birth outside of a hospital, Hawaii insisted on a witness statement.)

      4. The absence of a US travel document for Obama in 1961. Nor has there been an application for such a travel document found.

      5. The teacher, who recalls being told of Obama’s birth in Hawaii in Kapiolani Hospital in 1961 and writing home about it (about the birth to a woman named Stanley to her father, also named Stanley).

      6. Obama’s Kenyan grandmother said repeatedly in the taped interview that he was BORN IN HAWAII, and she said in another interview (Hartford Courant) that the first that her family in Kenya had heard of Obama’s birth was in a letter FROM HAWAII.

      7. Hawaii is thousands of miles from any foreign country, and it was rare for women to travel late in pregnancy in those days. WND has proved with a FOI Act request that Obama’s father remained in Hawaii throughout 1961, which would have meant that she would have had to have made that long, expensive and risky trip without him—and that is hardly likely at all.

      • tony newbill

        Ehancock Because of this Obamas GOTTA GO !!!!!! http://therealrevo.com/blog/?p=86350 ,

      • Bimbam

        The BC document released by the White House was confirmed FRAUDULENT by three forensic experts.

        The document was rife with errors, including the wrong hospital name, odd sequencing numbers, signature errors or manipulation, and on and on.

        No one remembers a black boy born by a white lady there. NO ONE has come forward to remember something or say something..

        The grandma in one interview stated Barry Saetoro was born in Kenya.

        So you see, anyone can say anything. But where’s the proof????

      • SJJolly

        Nice posting, Ehancock. However, a wasted effort, as fanatics are impervous to logic.

      • ehancock

        Re: “The grandma in one interview stated Barry Saetoro was born in Kenya.”

        Answer. No, actually she did not say that at all. She said repeatedly in the taped interview that Obama was born in Hawaii; the birther site simply cut off the tape just before she was asked “Whereabouts was he born?” And she said in another interview, with the Hartford Courant newspaper, that the first that her family in Kenya had heard of Obama’s birth was IN A LETTER FROM HAWAII.

        SO, she did not say it. Moreover, only 21 people came to the USA from Kenya in 1961 and the Kenyan government has said that it investigated the claim that Obama was born in Kenya, and it is not true.

        The “born in Kenya” story is the height of the loony side of the birther movement. It is based on forgeries like that of Lucas D. Smith, and falsifications–such as the claim that Obama’s Kenyan grandmother said that he was born in Kenya—when she actually said right on the same tape that he was born IN HAWAII, and she said in another interview that the first that her family in Kenya had heard of Obama’s birth was in a letter FROM HAWAII.

        Lucas D. Smith, a convicted felon, claimed that he went to Kenya and got Obama’s birth certificate at a hospital in Mombasa. But Lucas D. Smith has constantly refused to show proof that he, Smith, had ever gone to Kenya. All that he would have to do would be to show a Kenya stamp on a page of a passport, but Lucas D. Smith has refused to do that, constantly, and he has also constantly refused to say why he will not show that proof. (Moreover, his “birth certificate” uses US date formats [month/day/year] and not the day/month/year format used in Kenya.)

        Laying aside for a moment the overwhelming proof that Obama was born in Hawaii, the evidence that Obama was NOT born in Kenya is also very strong. There were a grand total of 21 people who came to the USA from Kenya in 1961. Of these only seven were US citizens. And the birther myth has always been that Obama’s parents went there and returned by plane, but only one person came to the USA from Kenya in 1961 by plane and that person was, wait for it, NOT a US citizen. And Obama’s father did not go to Kenya in 1961 either (making it unlikely that his mother did, since travel late in pregnancy was rare, and even more rare without the husband going along). WND has proved with a FOI Act request that Obama senior stayed in Hawaii throughout 1961.

        And the Kenyan government investigated the “born in Kenya” story, and found that it was not true.

        “Jon Chessoni, a first secretary at the Kenyan Embassy in Washington, can’t understand why his office gets so many baseless questions about whether Barack Obama was born in Kenya.

        “It’s madness,” said Chessoni on Monday.“His father, in 1961, would not even have been in Kenya. When this matter first came up, the Kenyan government did its research and confirmed that these are all baseless claims.””

        http://washingtonindependent.com/53654/forged

        Obama has a Hawaii birth certificate that says that he was born in Hawaii, in Kapiolani Hospital, and the officials of both parties in Hawaii have confirmed that fact. It is also confirmed by the birth announcement in the Hawaii newspapers in 1961, which were sent to the papers only by the DOH of Hawaii.

        Obama’s birth announcement appeared in a section of the newspapers called Health Bureau Statistics. As the name indicates, and as the papers and the DOH also say, ONLY the DOH of Hawaii could send birth notices to the Health Bureau Statistics section of the paper. And the DOH only sent out those notices for children that it had issued birth certificates for, and in 1961 the DOH was not allowed to register the births of children who were not born in Hawaii.

  • Bimbam

    Warning to the American People.

    IS OBAMA A PSYCHOPATHIC JUDAS?

    It is obvious that oBama hates America. These people in Benghazi saw the danger they were in and despite repeated request for assistance they were denied. They were all slaughtered with reports the ambassador himself may have been sodomized, just like the way Khadafy died.

    After Bin Laden was killed 26 Navy Seals died in mysterious circumstances. Radical Islamist have been seeing going in and out of the White House. A price to pay for killing a man he admired?

    What does he do next? Party, appear on talk show after talk show grinning ear to ear. He seems to have a penchant for killing our top soldiers, Navy Seals!

    He was caught in with an open mike telling a top Putin aid he will be more “flexible” when he is elected when it comes to our nuclear arsenal. What the heck does that mean?

    He has appointed communist after communist and radicals who then appoint un-vetted Muslims as aids.

    Why am I telling you this? Because after Benghazi, what’s next? Your town, your city, your state becoming the next target of a nuclear or biological terrorist strike? Courtesy of oBama and his radical Muslims seen going in and out of the White House, with who knows with what under their arms and a wink from oBama?

    And with that Alfred E Neumann grin ear to ear? Can you trust what his explanation will be? Do you see what is going on? Do you see the setup that Ambassador Stevens failed to see? Do you see the setup the 26 Navy SEALS failed to see?

    Will you be the next sheep to be slaughtered by this psychopath and his sycophants to bring America down? A dream many tyrants have held for years.

    Do you see why he grins ear to ear like a Cheshire cat every time something like this happens and then he parties?

    (or do you think he just being negro?)

  • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing Jayson

    A bit off topic, but…

    The leader of the Environmental Party (Miljöpartie) in the town of Vingåker, Pernilla Hagberg, ignited a discussion in the Swedish mainstream media about chemtrails. A broad public discussion about the mysterious trails forming artificial clouds over our heads is long overdue. In Sweden as well as here.The discussion started when this courageous politician commented on a photo depicting a chemtrail but titled condensation trail.

    Here is the translation of the newspaper article that started the discussion:

    http://www.unhealthyearth.com/2012/10/chemtrails-spraying-of-poison-over.html#.UI78wI7R5tH

  • Carl Manning – Sic Semper Tyrannis

    Have any of you warmongering Neocons, 911 Kool-Aid drunks, and gullible goyim slaves of Israel, many of whom dare to call yourselves Christians, ever thought about whom God would vote for??? Would God approve of sending your young men and women off to wars based on the 911 lie perpetrated by the CIA and the Mossad??? Would God approve of voting for political parties that have no intentions of following the Constitution and preserving your freedom??? Would God approve of voting for political parties that either support abortion openly or tacitly by their constant refusal to do anything about it???Would God approve of voting for two chronically insane political parties that have completely lost their mind with runaway socialist Santa Claus spending and bloodlust imperial spending on despicably evil warfare of aggression a la Hitler. Would God approve of voting for any man who would justify killing and terrorizing innocents with drones over incessant lies and fictitious, fabricated intel??? Is that the Christian thing to do to your fellow man??? Is that the way to convert Muslims to Christ??? Would God approve of voting for a political party that supports Israel even when she is committing hideous evil??? God said, “I am as far from evil as the East is from the West.” The Lord would NEVER accept the lesser of two evils because He knows the end result is ALWAYS evil. JUST LOOK AROUND YOU. This isn’t rocket science; it’s COMMON SENSE!

    • Carl Manning – Sic Semper Tyrannis

      Dod God not punish Israel Himself when she misbehaved countless times in the Old Testament??? So, why then do so many of you Christians give Israel a pass over the crimes of 911 and the USS Liberty slaughter??? Is your God Israel??? Is the US Military your God??? Is the GOP your God???

      • Deerinwater

        Their God is the dollar Carl and there no need of asking evil about evil. What sort of answer might we expect? ~ The GOP is depending on the evil in the hearts of men for a victory. Sad hmm?

        Willard Romney does not impress me as being all that mature, ~ I’m sorry, ~ I just don’t see it. While clearly Mr. Livingston is attempting to tell us that a man can rise up and become the President of the most power nation the world has ever know and “not be” an intelligent adult. That is a most profound statement to offer. I for one, simply refuse to buy it, finding it baseless and void any support what so ever.

    • Carl Manning – Sic Semper Tyrannis

      How do you think God feels when our evil President or wannabe Neocon Nutjob or other ignorant “America worshippers” say “… and God bless America”??? They might as well be saying “and God bless evil”. Almighty God is extremely repulsed and insulted by having His name associated with hideous evil. Not much longer will He tolerate these indignations.

      • deerinwater

        After your post Carl, it’s rather comical that “darkangel” would post right below. ~ appearing to celebrate the demonic in title as well a deed.

  • darkangel

    I couldn’t have said any better myself Bob:)

  • SJJolly

    Mr Livingston: Your article was a rare voice of sanity on Personal Liberty.com ! As to Presidential rhetoric vs. reality, one can sum it up as, “He who pays the piper calls the tune.” And it’s not the POTUS or the American voting public who has been “paying the piper”, it’s been the special interests that benefit from a growing national security state.

    • deerinwater

      Well Sir, ~ it is a personal decision to listen to the music. ~ So why defer the blame to some other? ~ while I get your drift ~ the lobbyist sing the song of money and incitement. ~ So do we blame the lobbyist or the politician? If we blame both, should we include ourselves?

      • http://none ron

        The two of you seem to have lost sight of “The Golden Rule” in this country.
        In the United States of America , Those with the Gold Make the Rules!!!!!

  • Newspooner

    Election of Romney will make things worse 5-10 years into the future. Reelection of Obama will make things worse 0-5 years into the future. From 10 years on, it will make little difference which one was elected. Liberty will be vastly diminished. We missed our opportunity with Ron Paul. I am voting for Gary Johnson. Get the US out of the UN, and get the UN out of the US. Otherwise, all liberty will be lost.

    • deerinwater

      The most thoughtful post of the day.

  • Theresa Kelly

    Unfortunately, conservatives don’t vote their principles they vote for a party that continually betrays them!

    • http://none ron

      This Theresa Kelly appears to know what she is talking about!

  • JohnR

    You say “Maybe in four years or eight years or 12 years or 16 years or 20 years we’ll be ready for a real liberty candidate. Maybe then we’ll quit settling for the “lesser of two evils” just this one more time — if there’s a country left to govern by then.”

    Here’s to hope! Let’s hope that by 2016, we can at least weaken the stranglehold that the two monied parties have on our system. Meanwhile, who to vote for in 2012? You made me chuckle, as “lesser of two evils” is exactly where I’ve landed. As a new reader, I’m most happy to see many well-informed views in your column, and in these comments.

    I wish to add two brief references that I believe every voter – across the political spectrum – should see, plus a third optional article.

    (1) The first is a short video on YouTube that is entertaining, yet packed full of valid, important statistics. It is titled “American Economy 2012 Crime Scene”; I would have titled it something like “The Big Picture: What Ails the Country, and How to Fix It”. It was created by a 74-year old retired scientist and modern renaissance man; I’ve corresponded with the videographer, and he strikes me as a very intelligent guy who has no particular axe to grind. I was surprised by the ending, and the case it makes is pretty tight. You’ll find it at

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_qaOC30A2CQ&feature=youtube_gdata_player.

    (2) I am well aware that the New York Times tends to the left. However, whatever your political bent, I suggest that everyone read the 10/27/12 New York Times editorial that supports Obama at

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/28/opinion/sunday/barack-obama-for-president.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1&nl=todaysheadlines&emc=edit_th_20121028.

    (3) The optional read is “Obama’s Squandered Advantages”, by Frank Bruni in the New York Times on 10/27/12 at

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/28/opinion/sunday/Bruni-Obamas-Squandered-Advantages.html?nl=todaysheadlines&emc=edit_th_20121028&_r=0.

    What I’ve read in the past from Mr. Bruni was quite critical of Obama; you’ll find that Bruni isn’t Obama’s best buddy in this article, either.

    I’ve done a lot of reading, especially right wing thought. While I agree nearly 100% with Mr. Livingston’s analysis here, I somewhat reluctantly come down on the other side in voting for the lesser of two evils. IMHO, the Times evaluation is wider and more balanced that that found here – or any others that I’ve seen. Should you read the Times, and still vote for Romney, you will at least have a better idea of just what exactly you’re supporting, sans rhetoric, and the dangers involved. Rather than get into the many arguments over the candidates, I simply urge you to view the video and read the Times.

  • http://www.livingstonwebsitedesign.com brighton mi website design

    Who ever win on this coming election I hope all her systems was GOOD.

  • lizitiz

    Great article, Bob…post it to my FB page.

  • Carl Manning – Sic Semper Tyrannis

    What will be interesting to watch for is how many defectors leave this country when Obama nullifies the results of the election and retains his de facto dictatorship indefinitely. Donald Trump, Orly Taitz, Jerome Corsi, Joe Farah, Maricopa County Sheriff Joe Arpaio, Ron Paul, Chuck Baldwin, Timothy Baldwin, Gary Johnson, Virgil Goode, Jesse Ventura, Alex Jones, Bob Livingston, and countless other true patriots will likely be on the run getting the Hell out of Dodge. In a way, it will be hilarious to see all of these idiots who voted and clamored for Romney and Obama finally get their just reward for supporting two parties that have comitted High Treason in broad daylight for the last 4 years. They will pull the plug on Talk Radio, kill this website and many countless others, and start their Communist purge in earnest. They will come after the pastors, the churches, and your children. They will assist the Russian and Chinese armies in a massive nuclear attack and military invasion of the American homeland to secure their power against any resistance they encounter. This is what you have voted for not just by supporting Obama b ut by supporting the treasonous GOP that refused to stand up for the Constitution when they had the chance for 4 years now. YOU GET WHAT YOU VOTE FOR.

  • Bert Cundle Sr.

    I refuse to get cought up in the B. S. of “MORE JOBS”… The news papers are full of job openings… & Hiering Halls… & Bulition Boards with Job Listings! Not Governments duty to get jobs for people!

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