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A Message To The ‘Left’ From A ‘Right-Wing Extremist’

January 15, 2013 by  

A Message To The ‘Left’ From A ‘Right-Wing Extremist’
PHOTOS.COM

Some discoveries are exciting, joyful and exhilarating, while others can be quite painful. Stumbling upon the fact that you do not necessarily have a competent grasp of reality — that you have, in fact, been duped for most of your life — is not a pleasant experience. While it may be a living nightmare to realize that part of one’s life perhaps was wasted on the false ideas of others, enlightenment often requires that the worldview we were indoctrinated with be completely destroyed before we can finally resurrect a tangible identity and belief system. To have rebirth, something must first die.

In 2004, I found myself at such a crossroads. At that time, I was a dedicated Democrat, and I thought I had it all figured out. The Republican Party was to me a perfect sort of monster. It had everything: corporate puppet masters, warmongering zealots, fake Christians, Orwellian social policies. The George W. Bush years were a special kind of horror. It was cinematic. Shakespearian. If I were to tell a story of absolute villainy, I would merely describe the mass insanity and bloodlust days of doom and dread wrought by the neocon ilk in the early years of the new millennium.

But, of course, I was partly naïve.

The campaign rhetoric of John Kerry was eye-opening. I waited day after day and month after month for my party’s candidate to take a hard stance on the illegal wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. I waited for a battle cry against the Patriot Act and the unConstitutional intrusions of the executive branch into the lives of innocent citizens. I waited for a clear vision, a spark of wisdom and common sense. I waited throughout the campaign for Kerry to embrace the feelings of his supporters and say with absolute resolve that the broken Nation we lived in would be returned to its original foundations and that civil liberty, freedom and peace would be our standard once again. Unfortunately, the words never came, and I realized he had no opposition to the Bush plan. He was not going to fight against the wars, the revolving door or the trampling of our freedoms. Indeed, it seemed as though he had no intention of winning at all.

I came to see a dark side to the Democratic Party that had always been there but which I had refused to acknowledge. Its leadership was no different than the neocons I despised. And many supporters of the Democratic establishment had no values or principles. Their only desire was to win, at any cost.

There was no doubt in my mind that if the Democrats reoccupied the White House or any other political power structure one day, they would immediately adopt the same exact policies and attitudes of the neoconservatives and become just as power-mad, if not more so. In 2008, my theory was proven unequivocally correct.

It really is amazing. I have seen the so-called “anti-war” party become the most accommodating cheerleader of laser-guided death in the Mideast, with predator drones operating in the sovereign skies of multiple nations raining missiles upon far more civilians than “enemy combatants” — all at the behest of Barack Obama. I have seen the “party of civil liberties” expand on every Constitution-crushing policy of the Bush Administration, while levying some of the most draconian legislation ever witnessed in the history of this country. I have seen Obama endorse enemy combatant status for American citizens and the end of due process under the law through the National Defense Authorization Act. I have seen him endorse the end of trial by jury. I have seen him endorse secret assassination lists and the Federally drafted murder of U.S. civilians. I have seen him endorse executive orders that open the path to the declaration of a “national emergency” at any time for any reason, allowing for the dissolution of most Constitutional rights and the unleashing of martial law.

If I were still a Democrat today, I would be sickly ashamed.

However, it is not my intent to admonish Democrats (at least not most of them). I used to be just like them. I used to believe in the game. I believed that the rules mattered and that it was possible to change things by those rules with patience and effort. I believed in non-violent resistance, protest, civil dissent, educational activism, etc. I thought that the courts were an avenue for political justice. I believed that the only element required to end corruption would be a sound argument and solid logic backed by an emotional appeal to reason. I believed in the power of elections, and I had faith in the idea that all we needed was the “right candidate” to lead us to the promised land.

The problem is, the way the world works and the way we wish the world worked are not always congruent. Attempting to renovate a criminal system while acting within the rigged confines of that system is futile, not to mention delusional. Corrupt oligarchies adhere to the standards of civility only as long as they feel the need to maintain the illusion of the moral high ground. Sometimes, the only solutions left in the face of tyranny are not peaceful. Logic, reason and justice are not revered in a legal system that serves the will of the power elite instead of the common man. The most beautiful of arguments are but meaningless flitters of hot air in the ears of sociopaths. Sometimes, the bully just needs to be punched in the teeth.

This philosophy of independent action is consistently demonized, regardless of how practical it really is when faced with the facts. The usual responses to the concept of full defiance are accusations of extremism and malicious intent. Believe me, when I embarked on the path toward the truth in 2004, I never thought I would one day be called a potential “homegrown terrorist,” but that is essentially where we are in America in 2013. To step outside the mainstream and question the validity of the game is akin to terrorism in the eyes of the state and the sad people who feed the machine.

During the rise of any despotic governmental structure, there is always a section of the population that is given special treatment and made to feel as though they are “on the winning team.” For now, it would appear that the “left” side of the political spectrum has been chosen by the establishment as the favored sons and daughters of the restructured centralized United States. However, before those of you on the left get too comfortable in your new position as the hand of globalization, I would like to appeal to you for a moment of unbiased consideration. I know from personal experience that there are Democrats out there who are actually far more like us Constitutionalists and “right-wing extremists” than they may realize. I ask that you take the following points into account, regardless of what the system decides to label us.

We Are Being Divided By False Party Paradigms

Many Democrats and Republicans are not stupid and want, above all else, to see the tenets of freedom respected and protected. Unfortunately, they also tend to believe that only their particular political party is the true defender of liberty. The bottom line is that there is very little, if any, discernable difference between the leadership of the two parties. If you ignore all the rhetoric and only look at action, Republican and Democratic leaders are essentially the same animal working for the same special interests. There is no left and right, only those who wish to be free and those who wish to control.

Last year, the left and the “right” experienced an incredible moment of unity after the introduction of the NDAA. People on both sides were able to see the terrifying implications of a law that allows the government to treat any American civilian as an enemy of war without right to trial. In 2013, the establishment is attempting to divide us once again with the issue of gun disarmament. I have already presented my position on gun rights in numerous other articles, and I believe my stance is unshakeable. But what I will ask anti-gun proponents or on the fence Democrats is this: How do you think legislation like the NDAA will be enforced in the future? Is it not far easier to threaten Americans with rendition, torture and assassination when they are completely unarmed? If you oppose the NDAA, you should also oppose any measure that gives teeth to the NDAA, including the debasement of the 2nd Amendment.

Democrats Are Looking For Help In The Wrong Place

Strangely, Democrats very often search for redress within the very system they know is criminal. For some reason, they think that if they bash their heads into the wall long enough, a door will suddenly appear. I’m here to tell you: There is no door.

The biggest difference between progressives and conservatives is that progressives consistently look to government to solve all the troubles of the world, when government is usually the cause of all the troubles in the world. The most common Democratic argument is that in America the government “is what we make it” and we can change it anytime we like through the election process. Maybe this was true at one time, but not anymore. Just look at Obama. I would ask all those on the left to take an honest look at the policies of Obama compared to the policies of most neocons, especially when it comes to Constitutional liberties. Where is the conflict? And before you point at the gun control debate, I suggest you look at Obama compared to Mitt Romney and John McCain; there’s almost no difference whatsoever.

If the two-party system becomes a one-party system, then elections are meaningless and government will not help us.

Democrats Value Social Units When They Should Value Individuals Instead

Democrats tend to see everything in terms of groups: victim status groups, religious groups, racial groups, special interest groups, etc. They want to focus on the health of the whole world as if it is a single entity. It is not. Without individuals, there is no such thing as “groups.” And groups change and disperse without notice. Groups do not exist beyond shared values. Even within a group, the individual is still more important in the grand scheme of things.

As a former Democrat, I know that it is easy to fall into the trap of collectivism. It is easy to think that what is best for you must be best for everybody. This Utopian idealism is incredibly fallible. Wanting the best for everyone is a noble sentiment, but using government as a weapon to force your particular vision of the “greater good” on others leads to nothing but disaster. The only safe and reasonable course is to allow individuals to choose for themselves how they will function in society if they choose to participate at all. Government must be left out of the equation as much as possible, and its primary job should be to safeguard the individual’s right to choose how he will live. You have to get over the fact that there is no such thing as a perfect social order; even if there were, no government is going to make it happen for you.

Democrats Can Become As Power-Mad As Any Neocon

I think it is important to point out how quickly most Democratic values went out the door as soon as Obama was placed in the White House. You cannot claim to be anti-war, anti-torture, anti-assassination, anti-surveillance, anti-corporate, anti-bank, anti-rendition, etc. while defending the policies of Obama. This is hypocrisy.

I have heard some insane arguments from left-leaning proponents lately. Some admit that Obama does indeed murder and torture, but “at least he is pushing for universal healthcare.” Even if it did work (which it won’t), is Obamacare really worth having a President who is willing to murder children on the other side of the world and kill citizens here at home? Do not forget your moral compass just because you think the system is now your personal playground. If you do, you are no better than all the angry blood-crazed Republicans that bumbled into the Iraq War while blindly following Bush.

There Is A Difference Between Traditional Conservatives And Neocons

Neocons are not conservative. They are, in fact, socialist in their methods; and they always expand government spending and power while reducing Constitutional protections. The liberty movement, of which I am proudly a part, is traditional conservative. We believe that government, especially as corrupt as it is today, cannot be trusted to administrate and watch over every individual in our Nation. It has proven time after time that it caters only to criminally inclined circles of elites. Therefore, we seek to reduce the size and influence of government so that we can minimize the damage that it is doing. For this, we are called “extremists.”

Governments are not omnipotent. They are not above criticism or even punishment. They are merely a collection of individuals who act either with honor or dishonor. In the liberty movement, we treat a corrupt government just as we would treat a corrupt individual. We do not worship the image of the state, nor should any Democrat.

Liberty-Minded Conservatives Are Not Terrorists

There will come a time — very soon, I believe — when people like me are officially labeled “terrorists.” Perhaps it will be because we refuse gun registration or confiscation. Perhaps it will be because we develop alternative trade markets outside the system. Maybe it will be because some of us are targeted by Federal raids and we fight back instead of submitting. Maybe it will be because we speak out against the establishment during a time of declared crisis and speech critical of the government is labeled “harmful to the public good.” One way or another, whether you want to believe me now, the day is coming.

Before this occurs, and the mainstream media attack us viciously as conspiracy theorists and monsters, I want the left to understand that no matter what you may hear about us, our only purpose is to ensure that our natural rights are not violated, our country is not decimated and our republic is governed with full transparency. We are not the dumb, redneck, racist, hillbilly gun nuts you see in every primetime TV show. And anyone who acts out of personal bias and disdain for their fellow man is not someone we seek to associate with.

Many of the people I have dealt with in the liberty movement are the most intelligent, well-informed, principled and dedicated men and women I have ever met. They want what most of us want: to be free to determine their own destinies; to be free to speak their minds without threat of state retribution; to be free to defend themselves from any enemy that would seek to oppress them; to live within an economic environment that is not rigged in favor of elitist minorities and on the verge of engineered collapse; to live in a system that respects justice and legitimate law instead of using the law as a sword against the public; to wake up each day with solace in the knowledge that while life in many regards will always be a difficult thing, we still have the means to make it better for ourselves and for the next generation; to wake up knowing that those inner elements of the human heart which make us most unique and most endearing are no longer considered “aberrant” and are no longer under threat.

–Brandon Smith

Brandon Smith

is the founder of the Alternative Market Project, an organization designed to help you find like-minded activists and preppers in your local area so that you can network and construct communities for barter and mutual aid. Join Alt-Market.com today and learn what it means to step away from the unstable mainstream system and build something better. You can contact Brandon Smith at: brandon@alt-market.com

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  • Harold Olsen

    A lot of people, myself included, become disenchanted with the Democrat party. They soon realize what a bunch of phoneys the Democrats are. I quit the party two years into Carter’s presidency and became an Independent. Two years into Reagan’s presidency I became a Republican. Four years ago, I became disenchanted with the Republicans and again became an Independent when I realized they were moving further and further left until there is very little difference between the two parties. The Republicans keep forcing liberal, or, at least, left leaning, candidates on us and we are stuck with a bunch of losers. I firmly believe the Democrat party is out to destroy the country and the Republicans do not have the courage or the desire to stop them. The Republicans used to be the party of ideas. These days they are totally clueless and no longer seem to have any principles. I refuse to have anything to do with either party.

    • Craig Swift

      They Republicans party and conservatives are in fact extremist and terrorist. Everything from women’s reporductive right, voting rights, economic policies that seek to punish those with the least and supporting war with Iran. Conservatives are a joke. Some claim to be “fiscal” conservatives but it only seems to happen with there is a Democratic President. Conservatives hae ran up more debt and the deficit than any Democrat ever. And their social policies are outrageous. hey claim individaul freedom by that only seems to apply when they are talking about guns and their devotion and love of guns is pathetic. I live inTexas and own guns but conservatives take it to the extreme. I will never vote a anyone who carries the label of a conservative including so called conservative Democrats. This past election showed what Republicans and consrvatives are about and it has no good intentions for the country as a whole. oter suppression making it harder for American citizens to vote yet they go out of their way to make it easier to get a semi automatic weapon.

      • Paul Wells

        So, let me get this straight. In Craig’s world, women’s reproductive rights trump the murder of fetuses that have no ability to protect themselves. Hmm…and here I thought murder was murder, period. I guess one your (lack of) moral compass makes it okay to murder (only IF the circumstances are right), then a whole ream of other fallacious reasoning can occur. For example, Craig likes to castigate economic policies which in his very limited view, “punish those with the least”. In other words, keep the hand-outs coming, because he doesn’t believe that there could be a “hand-up” approach to pulling people up by the boot straps. I guess he’s just in love with the government being his mommy, and taking care of all the problems that he is too lazy, spineless, or bereft of common sense principles to solve. Fail!

      • FreedomFighter

        “NDAA. People on both sides were able to see the terrifying implications of a law that allows the government to treat any American civilian as an enemy of war without right to trial. In 2013, the establishment is attempting to divide us once again with the issue of gun disarmament. I have already presented my position on gun rights in numerous other articles, and I believe my stance is unshakeable. But what I will ask anti-gun proponents or on the fence Democrats is this: How do you think legislation like the NDAA will be enforced in the future? Is it not far easier to threaten Americans with rendition, torture and assassination when they are completely unarmed?”

        DHS and other government agencys have purchased appox 2 billion rounds of ammunition, thousands of fully automatic military assault rifles”, sniper rifles, hand guns, armored vehicals, drones, they have activated double bobwired fense FEMA camps (the fense points in, not out), guard dogs, hired personel, purchased OVENS to cremate bodies, millions of coffins, setup special buses, train cars to transport Americans to the camps, declared American homeland a war zone, and IMPLENTED NDAA so Americans can be held and/or killed.

        WTF do you thinks going to happen when Americans are disarmed?

        Genocide of those that dont accept whatever is planned – NWO communist takeover.

        Laus Deo
        Semper Fi

      • flyovercindy

        Sadly Mr. Swift, you didn’t comprehend this article – if you even read it at all. Try again, read slowly and then re-read what you wrote. After that, try seeking out real truth instead of listening to talking points. If you can’t trouble yourself to do more than listen to main stream media headlines, then please stand back and try to stay out of the way of those who are trying to save the America we love.

      • Robert Smith

        Paul says: “Hmm…and here I thought murder was murder, period.”

        What you “think” and what is are two very different things.

        The term “murder” in American society is very carefully legally defined. Remember, abortion is mostly legal in most of America. It is only “murder” in the context of your own belief. That belief is not shared by all Americans. For some an abortion is a simple medical procedure.

        One is speculating about an unborn fetus being a “person.” When a born someone is shot there is no speculation about their status. That’s why those on the left argue so (misguidedly) for gun control. They see real people. You see imaginary ones.

        Rob

      • Steve E

        Craig, you are one of the kind of people this article is talking about. You should try reading the article.

      • Jeanette

        So … is it the conservatives who are trying to brainwash our children by teaching them that Allah is God in our schools? No, it’s Barack Obama, about as far as one could get from conservatism as Vladimir Lenin was. So much for the lily-white left.

      • alpha-lemming

        I love it when you guys show your true colors….. and Constitutionalists are the bane of the planet. The 4-F litany in your 2nd sentence can more accurately be described as “Free” everything, “Fraud” in the voting booth, “Failed” EVERY TIME IT’S BEEN TRIED in the history of the world Communist government, and “French” military prowess.

        Look no further than the Dems, Dem Al Gore who determined the radical Islam mouth-piece al-jezeera to be less oppressive, less misogynistic, greener, and more in line with Current TVs mission statement than prospective buyer (love him or hate him) Glenn Beck. Thanx again for hi-lighting YOUR level of hatred and driving home the point that any compromise with you is futile.

      • DaveH

        Robert says — “One is speculating about an unborn fetus being a “person.” When a born someone is shot there is no speculation about their status”.

        Robert, you are speculating. You are arguing semantics. Your opinion on what is a “person” is no more valid than anybody else’s. You might have legs on the issue of whose choice it is, since the fetus is contained in and part of a woman’s body, and women still do die regularly in childbirth. But to argue that the unborn fetus is not a person requires a large amount of mental gymnastics.
        Personally, I think those things should be between a woman and her God, and the Forcers (through Government) should butt out. But for you to take that course would be a huge contradiction, since you, like all Liberal Progressives, believe in Forcing your choices on others.

      • Ron

        I guess you explained what kind of socialistic democrat you are!! We wonder why this great country is going down the tubes.

      • trustworthy

        Craig your one naïve democrat! You were born into a free society and have never been restricted of your rights. This is where the naïve part comes in, if you think your freedom can’t be reversed by a tyrannical government your naïve. Experiences gives us warnings to heed. Would you place your wallet where it was just stolen? No, you learned there are thieves so you put somewhere to avoid the theft. Same with any government you can’t trust your neighbor with your wallet but your going to trust the government (who has less interest in you) to protect you and your life! America has the longest (was richest) reigning country/government for 237 years. How? All of these other countries where rich and had guns too! What happened to these countries? History says they turned in their guns and the government crushed the people not once but every time! Russia, China, Australia, and Germany all went thru that cycle of life. There is evil in this world!

      • Robert Smith

        DaveH says: “But to argue that the unborn fetus is not a person requires a large amount of mental gymnastics.”

        Really… Particularly early in pregnancy what’s there just kinda drips through one’s fingers. Ooooooy gooooooy. That’s a “person?”

        Again you are trying to portray another as they are not. Government OUT of the abortion issue is the ONLY way I see it, except to maintain standards as should be done in any medical facility.

        Your slimy effort to twist others into something they are not clearly demonstrates your inability to discuss issues. Thanks for such a fine example of right wing “logic?”

        ROFL…

        Rob

      • navyjr

        We are only “extremists” to those of an amoral mindset; who seek to control based on lies, deceit, and general evil.

      • Speak2Truth

        Let’s set the record straight on GW Bush.

        Soon after taking office, he ordered his Justice Department to investigate and prosecute corporate crooks. Enron, Tyco, Global Crossing and others had the crooks exposed and prosecuted. This began the process of restoring integrity to American business.

        Bush began the process of weaning the US off petroleum and making Hydrogen fuel, generated by Geothermal power, into the nationwide replacement. He had corporations such as Shell, GM, Boeing, Ford and others spend their own money on developing the fueling systems and vehicles, since they would be profiting from this clean, carbon-free, infinitely sustainable fuel. Shell began putting fueling stations in major cities. GM built H-powered trucks for the military. Ford put F450 commuter buses on the streets. Even Jay Leno and others bought and still drive H-powered vehicles. The news media kept absolutely silent about this. And that’s when Democrats went ballistic to put a stop to it. They had been developing schemes to pillage the US and other nations with carbon credits, carbon taxes, special fees for emitting carbon. Bush’s Hydrogen transition was yanking the rug out from under them. They trotted out Al Gore’s “Inconvenient Truth” and a faked hockey-stick graph to make sure they controlled the conversation. They forced our tax dollars into environmentally devastating “alternative” bio-fuels, like corn ethanol, and Al Gore spearheaded that movement (after setting up an investment company to profit handsomely from it). Once Democrats took control of Congress in 2007, they actively derailed the Hydrogen development and when Obama took office he personally defunded what was left of it, so they could get back to pillaging our nation in the name of Carbon.

        What about the Iraq war? Are you some kind of amnesiac? Saddam started the war in 1991. After the Gulf War drove his forces out of Saudi Arabia and Kuwait, he was granted a generous temporary cease-fire under which he had to turn over all his chemical, biological and nuclear weapons and manufacturing equipment and plans. He continued defying that order year after year. President Clinton bombed Iraq repeatedly to try to force Saddam to comply. Finally, Clinton called off the temporary cease-fire in 1998 with the Iraq Liberation Act. With Congressional approval, he committed the US to complete destruction of Saddam’s regime and its replacement with a democratically elected government. Clinton’s massive bombing campaign in Dec. 1998 failed. That’s why Al Gore and GW Bush, in their campaigns, BOTH promised to finish the job. Bush was elected, finished the job, and everyone on the Left (including the mainstream “news” deceivers”) suddenly developed amnesia and screamed like ninnies that Bush was somehow “starting” a war in Iraq. OMG!! The sheer STUPIDITY of half our population, falling for that, is galling!

        And what about the Patriot Act?

        For years, the Left screamed and hollered that Bush should have taken extreme action to stop the terrorists of 9/11 before they could ever strike. They blamed Bush for “failing” in some vague way. They created the 9/11 commission, even put Jamie Gorelick on the commission. She was responsible for creating the wall of separation to prevent government agencies from communicating with each other about potential terrorists, such as Mohammed Atta. Once this dog and pony show was over, the Left had already prepare the list of recommendations for the Patriot Act. It was delivered to Bush, via Congress, amid much more screaming that he must “do something!” to protect us. And the President signed the Will of The People on the matter and has been blamed for “trampling our Constitution” ever since.

        Now try to comprehend this. If Bush was NOT taking extreme action, even before 9/11, not trampling your liberties, Democrats scream that he’s the BAD GUY. And if he signs that bill AFTER 9/11, allowing the will of Congress (your representatives) to subject you to the sort of liberty violations that Democrats claim should have come even WITHOUT a terrorist attack… they scream again that he’s the BAD GUY. Do you see the INSANITY? Are you so easily manipulated by it?

        I have nothing but contempt for the puppets of leftist manipulation, who have no recollection of events and are therefore easy pawns to be herded in anger against Republicans on completely FALSE assertions.

        If you want to condemn Bush for not securing the southern border, go for it. But nearly every other negative slam hurled at him was a LIE!

        Just think – you could have been driving a Hydrogen car by now, our nation could be weaned from dependence on foreign oil, the financiers of terrorism could be begging at the door of the UN instead of sucking money from your pocket at the gas pump – if only Democrats had not derailed Bush’s work to fundamentally transform our nation to Hydrogen Power.

        There is a HUGE difference between Democrats, devoted to “de-development” and pillaging of the United States (look that one up), and Republicans who struggle to free us to prosper as an independent nation.

      • Average Joe

        Robert Smith,

        “One is speculating about an unborn fetus being a “person.”

        Actually, the more pertinent question is whether or not the unborn fetus is ‘Alive”.
        It the unborn fetus is ‘Alive’…then abortion still amounts to murder…I don’t care how “you” define it.

        “What you “think” and what is are two very different things.”

        This applies to you as well.

        AJ

      • Speak2Truth

        One More Comment on Bush

        One more thought has come to mind. Bush’s successful prosecution of corporate crooks, along with across-the-board tax cuts for all taxpayers, infuriated Democrats. There’s a reason Barack Obama selected a major corporate crook, Rahm Emanuel of Freddie Mac, to be his Chief of Staff. Obama shoveled tens of billions of our dollars into the accounts of those corporate crooks to keep them away from courtroom scrutiny and then made them his Administration. They’ve been pillaging this nation ever since.

        But GW’s approach, with a cooperative Republican Congress, had worked wonders towards national recovery from the late-1990s Dot-com bubble burst, then the financial meltdown from the 9/11 attack. By the end of 2006, Bush policies had lowered unemployment to 4.4% and had boosted Federal tax revenues to the highest in the nation’s history.

        Then, Democrats took Congress in the 2006 elections. Then they took a wrecking ball to the nation.

        Let’s not forget, the housing market melt-down was one of their special projects, over a decade in the making. Barack Obama, as a lawyer for ACORN, was personally involved in crafting it. He sued Citibank to force it to make bad loans to people of color. He trained the ACORN activists to storm the banks and bully them. Then the Clinton Administration “responded” to the staged show of “anger on the streets” by Democrat operatives with a Federal decree forcing the banks to make bad loans. Here’s Clinton’s HUD secretary boasting about it:

        “Affirmative Action” forced on the home lenders by Clinton Administration, leading to eventual disaster
        Video of Clinton’s HUD Secretary boasting of victory in forcing lenders to comply
        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lr1M1T2Y314

        Just remember – nearly every negative thing you hear about Republicans is an outright lie crafted by Democrats and propagated by their minions in the “news” media. The lies are crafted to cover for Democrats who are the true perpetrators of the evils we see.

        THERE IS A DIFFERENCE between the parties. You can be sure, only one of them worships our Communist enemies and works to fulfill the Communist agenda in the US. It was only Barack Obama who had the Communist Party USA working hard to put him into power to “fundamentally transform” the USA.

        Think about it.

      • JC

        Craig Swift says:

        January 15, 2013 at 7:23 am

        They Republicans party and conservatives are in fact extremist and terrorist. Everything from women’s reporductive right, voting rights, economic policies that seek to punish those with the least and supporting war with Iran.

        ________________________________________________________________________

        Curious…why is abortion important to you personally?
        Are you thinking about having one?

        And voting rights? In what sense? That we don’t want illegal aliens voting?
        Damned straight we don’t and neither should you.

        Economic policies? You mean that fiscal conservatives are “extreme” when we want a balance budget and responsible Government?

        And who says that Constitution loving conservatives support unConstitutional wars?

      • DaveH

        Robert says — “Your slimy effort to twist others into something they are not clearly demonstrates your inability to discuss issues. Thanks for such a fine example of right wing “logic?””.

        The fact that you would call me “right wing” shows clearly your profound ignorance, Robert. The fact that you advocate “choice” when it comes to taking a human life, but ignore peoples’ rights to personal choices about things which are none of your business, Robert, affirms your extreme ignorance.

        It’s no wonder you’re “ROFL…”, Robert, [comment has been edited]

      • UpLateAgain

        It’s really this simple. I don’t want to tell you how to live your life, and I don’t want you telling me how to live mine. You want me to use up a portion of my life so you can have things you think are ‘fair’, and support a government putting a gun to my head to make your world view happen.

        Only you are going to have to go ahead and kill me… because I am NOT going to give you what you want. In the end, we all have choices, and I choose to not succumb to you and your ilk. e.g., I’ll neither pay-for, nor use Obamacare under any circumstances. It’s immoral, unethical, theft, and the fact that it’s law is 100% irrelevant. All that means is you have managed to pass a law that is an abomination of everything the government created solely to protect the rights of the individual was created-for. Revolting against the king was a violation of law too. When laws are unjust, civil disobedience is the only course any man of conscience can follow.

        And when you try to take my means of self-defense, you’d be wise to have your insurance paid up.
        ]
        By the way…. F you and the horse you rode in on!

      • rose

        Craig,
        I don’t know if you actually read the article thoroughly. He is saying the government is corrupt, no matter what the party. He is also saying individuals who identify with either party aren’t corrupt. All of us have been led very carefully down the garden path. Both parties are liars. But there are very good and courageous people in the US that are very hurt by the betrayal. We need to stand together and believe in what was the very beginning of this country. We can’t let the a$$holes conquer and divide. And that is what they are doing.

        • Nick Czudy

          Hi Rose. It is a common method to reply to our current woes in Congress and our government to blame both parties equally. This used to be true many years ago, but really, you cannot do this today. It is more like the GOP should be blamed 80% of the time and the DEMs 20%. It is not an equal blame. the GOP are far more likely to lie and cheat. Look at the election process for the last 18 months. In the current fiscal cliff and debt ceiling fiasco. We have extreme tea partiers are willing to put the whole world in a recession instead of caving in to their ideals. But their ideals are not our ideals. What ever happened to the GOP #1 goal is jobs and the economy? Now that they lost the election, they are back to naying anything that the DEM’s are trying to do. How is this good for our country?

          • dianiline

            Nick Czudy said:

            –”Hi Rose. It is a common method to reply to our current woes in Congress and our government to blame both parties equally. This used to be true many years ago, but really, you cannot do this today. It is more like the GOP should be blamed 80% of the time and the DEMs 20%. It is not an equal blame. the GOP are far more likely to lie and cheat.”

            I would put those numbers exactly opposite. But I would also say that the Democrats are better liars. They boldly say things that diametrically opposed to the truth, and when confronted they say them louder and more vehemently, with roiling indignation that one has dared to speak the truth against them. Also when Republicans lie, it is often in chasing Democratic ideas that are bad ideas in the first place, but instead of saying they are just bad ideas, the Republicans meet them halfway. This is less bad, and closer to the truth, but still bad and still a lie.

            –”Look at the election process for the last 18 months.”

            Yes, do. How did the current Post Turtle get to the White House? If the Republicans were the ones lying and cheating, he would not be there and we would not be having the National Day of Mourning on Monday. Don’t forget to wear black. It’s a sin that Martin Luther King day should be so sullied.

            –(snip)” We have extreme tea partiers are willing to put the whole world in a recession instead of caving in to their ideals. But their ideals are not our ideals.”

            What, small government, low taxes, and federal restraint aren’t your ideals? What in heaven’s name are then?

            –”What ever happened to the GOP #1 goal is jobs and the economy? Now that they lost the election, they are back to naying anything that the DEM’s are trying to do. How is this good for our country?”

            Well, it should be blatantly obvious how opposing anything the Democrats are trying to do is good for the country. That’s practically a definition.

            Dianiline

          • Nick Czudy

            Hello Dianiline, we meet again. It is clear that you have been living under the GOP Right wing bubble. It is their common slogan to accuse the Dems. of exactly the things that they are doing.

            The Dems have not been lying. In this past election as you suggest. We had the pundits, giving the wrong poll results, to try and bolster the Right Wing sentiments. Guys like Livingstone here, know they are lying. they do it to further their causes and fatten their wallets. It is the Right Wing way. the problem is that you believe them without researching the truth. Then you buy it hook line and sinker.

            Look who won the election. It is because most Americans are not stupid and know a lie when they hear it. take Romney getting desperate in Ohio and then saying the Jeep was going to relocate a plant to China. Then he even double downed on it later. I am sure that the right wing bubble all believed him. The majority did not. See the results.

            Lies were one of the problems with the Romney campaign. He would contradict himself a day after swearing something was true. I understand that in the Right Wing GOP it is necessary to lie and tell the base followers what will get them fired up. I understand that. I do not think that it is very ethical or christian. But I understand desperate people do and say desperate things.

            You said…..”What, small government, low taxes, and federal restraint aren’t your ideals? What in heaven’s name are then?”. This is a conservative policy. Obama has actually decreased government, over the last 4 years. There are statistics in Politifacts. The whole mantra of Obama as being big government is a lie and mistruth to try and show the dems as always being spenders. Now there is a time for spending. It is during a recession or depression. Bingo. OBama came into office when the economy crashed. If he followed the idea of cutting spending like Europe did, then we would still be in the dumpers. Instead he spent and stimulated. He also, without the help of the Right Wing congress managed to get the economy growing and reduce the debt every year for the last 4 years. So he has a plan to balance the books and it will happen when the economy recovers. We are not there yet. So spending cuts, especially when it is on the backs of the poor and old, is not right. He did a good thing to rebalance the tax payers. The wealthy did not suffer at all during the recession. Everything was slanted in their favor. They did well. He reduced the taxes on the middle class that really drive the economy. It is working.

            Apposing everything that the Dem’s are trying to do it now good policy, it is obstructive. We should impeach any Congressman that thinks and acts like that. We are not paying them to obstruct. That is strictly a political policy that has back fired on them. Look at the recent caving in on the debt limit threats that they made. Now the markets are responding with the highest levels in 5 years. Don’t be sore losers. You lost, because of your bad and ideological policies, now do the right thing and cooperate. Maybe just a little?

          • Bob666

            Nick,
            I have read a lot of your post and while I do not agree with everything that you post, I do respect your effort to make a sound argument and present well thought out facts. As you have experienced now, there are some on this board that change the rules, the point or subject to give you a moving target to debate and pull “facts” out of thin air to support their position.

            For every fact that you provide, they will recite some propaganda they received in an email (as we know that stuff is always true) and even if a site like snopes has proven it to be a fabrication or altered state of reality, will, it’s the liberal media that is to blame or the left wing Marxist democrats and we all know that Michele Bachmann is playing with a full deck.

            At risk of being a chauvinist, for a couple on this board, the saying my dad had as a kid really does apply; you can tell a woman, but you can’t tell her much because she knows everything, just ask her.

          • Nick Czudy

            Hi Bob. Pleasure to meet you. thanks for your comments. I can say that I support your dads comments. I can get away with it now, as I am single and will not get slapped or suffer shunning in bed from a wife. haha.

            But you are correct, what every is said here in a factual way, there will be a way to turn and twist and come back with a altered fact.
            I guess that I just hope that enough people espouse the truth or an unbiased opinion, that some of the others will eventually absorb a little of it and this will be a better country.

            I just wish that the GOP were good sports and try to cooperate just a little and the USA will proper like it never has. We would get out of this recession and debt in record time. One needs to be a good loser. Pouting and obstructing will not help the situation. It would also be helpful to come up with good policies and not be too close minded.

            The USA will really prosper in the next 4 years. How fast will be determined by the GOP right.

          • Bob666

            Nick,
            I believe that we have the opportunity over the next four years to make great things happen in our country. Those of us who think in the middle without the baggage of the extreme right or left see opportunity.

            What drives the fear that you see on this board is many of these people are facing the reality that the world is not centered around the USA anymore and it has not for over ten years now. There are other forces in this world that we (the USA) must compete against and many in this country don’t get this (right and left) because they get wrapped up in the details. Neither side is right, nor are they wrong because truth always lies in the middle.

            I suspect that I am at least old enough to be you father and probably your grandfather and I hope that I am not perceived to talk down to you or anyone else, but I have been around this world more than once and seen a great deal in my life. There are a lot of people in this world who are going to try to bury America, not by military action, but as a result of economic growth.

            The sad thing is, until Americans looks at the reality of the rest of the world, our country is at risk and many of the issues discussed on this board while important, are not what Americans should fear the most. While this does not sound optimistic, the one thing that I have witnessed several times in my life time is; when our country bands together and unifies to a challenge, America is a formidable competitor in any game we choose to play.

            We have to evolve as a society and as you have seen, not many people deal well with change or reality, but both are unavoidable. Keep posting, I enjoy reading your work.

          • Nick Czudy

            Bob. Your words have much wisdom and I am totally in agreement. But I am 61, so I am not sure if you could still be my father. haha.

            One thing that always made me cringe is when politicians made the claim that we are the best country in the world. Mitt likes to use it in his many speeches and it has been used by both sides for a long time. But Bill Mahr brought it up in one of his shows.and said that it is baloney, as the USA has been way down the list for many decades. Our education has fallen down to the point of our students being around 28th in the world and less than some 3rd world countries. Our factories have mostly shipped to China and other places. So we are no longer the industrial might of the world. We are still the #1 consumers in the world. China loves us and needs us. They know where to butter their bread. They will be happy to lend us money as they know that they will get it back in exports. We still have the largest number of guns in the world and the number of deaths as well. We have the most jails and criminals in jail. We have the mightiest military forces.
            we are now #2 to the world’s wealthiest people. We are second to the GDP. There was an arragance a few decades ago that our lifestyle was the best and we could force other couuntries to be like us and force our opinion on other countries. I think that we now know that we are not nation builders. We are no longer the best country in the world and we need to get our troops back and concentrate on building our infrastructure up again. We will not be able to compete with the building that China is doing, but we could be #2.

            best regards Nick Cz

          • Bob666

            I could be you dad, starting early.

            this will be China’s decade as well as the last decade. India’s will follow.

          • Patriot

            I was prepared to answer each one of those massive delusions one at a time, but I figured that this would be enough.

            http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/whoops-politifacts-lie-year-turns-out-be-true_696223.html

            I would also suggest that you do some actual research on debt, the value of our money, the welfare state, and numerous other tragic events that have been accelerated under your hero. The last criminal in the White House was a nightmare, and then this guy takes office and shows us all what TRUE economic destruction looks like.
            I have rarely seen anyone present this ridiculous argument with such a cool disposition, but you have only demonstrated the depth of your delusion by the manner in which you have articulate the belief you so firmly have in your religion.
            Romney is a liar and a Neocon. So was Bush. And so is Obama. And I have never seen one as slick or as so widely regarded as Obama….since Mao…

      • GregS

        DaveH says:

        “You might have legs on the issue of whose choice it is, since the fetus is…part of a woman’s body…”

        Wrong! Any textbook in embryology will tell you that the unborn child is NOT part of a woman’s body: He/she is a totally SEPARATE LIVING HUMAN organism with his/her own sex, blood type, genome, etc.

        Therefore, Robert has NO legs to stand on.

        DaveH says:

        “Personally, I think those things should be between a woman and her God, and the Forcers (through Government) should butt out.”

        1. The RIGHT TO LIFE is one of the most basic rights in the Constitution, and, as such, all innocent human life should be protected by the Government. However, if the woman’s life is in danger, most on the pro-life side of the aisle agree that abortion is justified.

        2. Regarding abortion being “between a woman and her God, and the Forcers (through Government)…butt[ing] out,” the same could be said for virtually any law that is currently on the books today. Are you implying that there should be NO laws at all? If so, then you are, by definition, an anarchist.

      • GALT

        GregS says: January 16, 2013 at 4:24 pm

        Wrong! Any textbook in embryology will tell you that the unborn child is NOT part of a woman’s body: He/she is a totally SEPARATE LIVING HUMAN organism with his/her own sex, blood type, genome, etc.

        WRONG? Which textbook(s) would tell us this? Would this be similar to a “parasite” or “virus”?

        Would not the following be more accurate? That the fetus is POTENTIALLY a totally “separate living human organism”?

        If you believe your statement to be true, there are a number of remedies available for you to pursue. Simply petition a court for the right to surgically remove the “fetus” from the mother, repair any damage caused by the process, plus pay all expenses involved, on the claim that this (now) child, is a separate human being, according to law, and if death or injury results you will accept liability for both civil an criminal penalties, to include homicide, if the child dies. The procedure must be performed within the first trimester.

        1. The RIGHT TO LIFE is one of the most basic rights in the Constitution, and, as such, all innocent human life should be protected by the Government. However, if the woman’s life is in danger, most on the pro-life side of the aisle agree that abortion is justified.

        Again, to be accurate, the RIGHT to LIFE, is cited in the Declaration, as one amongst many, which government assumes the responsibility ” to secure” as one of its legitimate functions.

        Having stated this, it follows that those things that are required to sustain life are essential to the “responsibility for securing it” and there is no specified qualification that, that life be “innocent”.

        Unfortunately, in the intervening 250+ years no legal determination has been made regarding those things essential to “securing” this right, so it would seem that this “govenrment” has FAILED to meet it’s self declared responsibility to secure it, thus far. It might be appropriate to consider that NOW might be time to do so, provided there is sufficient understanding that this has as yet, NOT BEEN DONE?

        2. Regarding abortion being “between a woman and her God, and the Forcers (through Government)…butt[ing] out,” the same could be said for virtually any law that is currently on the books today. Are you implying that there should be NO laws at all? If so, then you are, by definition, an anarchist.

        In response to the portion of this comment which is relevant, and not previously addressed; use of the word “God” would seem to bring this matter within the scope of the first Article of the Bill of Rights and “freedom with respect to religion”. As you should know, many meta-physical philosophies do not employ god, nor is any “specific religion” cited as being excluded or included with regard to “securing this right”, therefor it would seem reasonable to conclude that the relationship that exists, is one which involves “a person and their beliefs”, in all matters which have no connection to, or conflict with any legally established precedent that might be coincidental with those beliefs.

        • Nick Czudy

          To Greg Smiths comments. I agree that the GOP has become an irrelevant party. They seem to represent everything is that bad in politicians. Look at the extreme party members that they have fielded in the last few years. Michelle Bachman, Governor Ultrasound, Murdock, and on and on. They are putting members in Congress that are more extreme. They are doing everything possible to disrupt the normal workings of government. Also, with the voting obstruction and the redistricting of many districts, they seem to now have an conscience to use any dirty trick to win, instead of the basic concept of a fair election and the winner goes on to govern. They will also try to change the Electoral rules in states that are run by the GOP. Can’t they spend their energy and money on coming up with policies that get them elected? They use any devious trick to try and win. I have not seen this type of activity coming from the Dems. Also there is a propensity of taking money from wealthy donors (Adelson, Koch brothers) and lobbyists, like NRA, HMO’s, medical industry, to keep them in power and to allow them to keep making of their profits. They are the party of the 1% elite and to keep them in power and rule over the masses. They are more interested in being labeled as “A” under the NRA, rather than represent their constituents. They are the perfect example of the typical politician. that lies, cheats and will kiss babies and then steal their lollypops. (Quote stolen from Hunt for red Oktober) Now the right wing pundits are crying that Obama is trying to destroy the GOP. In fact, if they disappeared over night, I do not think that the USA would miss them, as their actions only seem to be geared for keeping them in power rather than governing wisely for the USA.

          Galt, The only problem with “person-hood” as the GOP are trying to describe it, is that no one deems a live human being, when they are just a few cells. That is a debate that has been going on for decades. It should be a decision between the mother and her doctor. A demented extremist that gets elected because he stimulated his fanatic base during the primaries, should not make that decision for the mother. You campaign about freedom, yet want to take fundamental freedoms away from women. Hypocrites.

      • GALT

        Nick…I am a bit confused.

        Are you disagreeing with the legal remedy that I have proposed? assuming
        a successful suit on those grounds?

        “limited within the parameters of this discussion? “

        • Nick Czudy

          Galt. I apologize that I did not reply to your question. I did not recall, what it was that you were referring to and I tried to go through this blog to find your comment and suggestion and I came up blank. The comments are long and varied. If you tell me again, I will look out for any comment from you. best regards. Nick Cz

      • Alex Frazier

        Robert Smith, I have to disagree with you. There is a man on trial right now that I keep seeing on the news. Two counts of murder for killing his pregnant girlfriend. And he’s by no means the first or last to be prosecuted for a multiple homicide for killing a pregnant woman.

        Unborn children are children. They are living human beings, and the law recognizes them as such. The only time the law seems to have difficulty with this reality is when a woman finds the pregnancy, or the prospect of raising a child, to be inconvenient. Depending upon the current inclinations of congress, they even allow “abortions” after a child is born. It’s called partial birth abortion. And they’ve been fighting about the procedure for years.

        “An abortion in which the person performing the abortion, deliberately and intentionally vaginally delivers a living fetus until, in the case of a head-first presentation, the entire fetal head is outside the body of the mother, or, in the case of breech presentation, any part of the fetal trunk past the navel is outside the body of the mother, for the purpose of performing an overt act that the person knows will kill the partially delivered living fetus; and performs the overt act, other than completion of delivery, that kills the partially delivered living fetus. (18 U.S. Code 1531)”

        Clinton vetoed Republican efforts to ban this practice.

        The ban was later passed in 2003, and upheld by the Supreme Court in 2007.

        The District Council repealed the entire thing for the District of Columbia during Obama’s administration using delegated congressional authority, and it was later replaced in 2012 with a lesser ban that only prohibited the practice after 20 weeks gestation (6th month). So rather than being a banned practice altogether, you’re now allowed to kill the baby up through the sixth month.

        But, hey! They’re working hard to expand that horizon and get us back to the Clinton days of being able to kill it right up until the day it’s born … which happens to be Obama’s position on the matter. It’s not a baby until it comes out of the vagina all the way.

        Our laws are hypocritical. When it comes to justice, we all know what is right. But some of us lose all sense of common sense when it comes to the responsibility of the offspring we create through recreational sex.

        I’m not one of those people. Life is life.

      • GregS

        GALT says:

        “WRONG? Which textbook(s) would tell us this?”

        As I said in my post, ANY textbook in embryology will do, as well as any scientific dictionary, which defines embryological terminology, but since it seems apparent that you have NO background in science, I’ll give you a few references to start you out:

        1. “The development of a human being begins with fertilization, a process by which two highly specialized cells, the spermatozoon from the male and the oocyte from the female, unite to give rise to a new organism, the zygote.”
        [Langman, Jan. Medical Embryology. 3rd edition. Baltimore: Williams and Wilkins, 1975, p. 3]

        2. “The development of a human begins with fertilization, a process by which the spermatozoon from the male and the oocyte from the female unite to give rise to a new organism, the zygote.”
        [Sadler, T.W. Langman's Medical Embryology. 7th edition. Baltimore: Williams & Wilkins 1995, p. 3]

        3. “Human development begins after the union of male and female gametes or germ cells during a process known as fertilization (conception).”

        “Fertilization is a sequence of events that begins with the contact of a sperm (spermatozoon) with a secondary oocyte (ovum) and ends with the fusion of their pronuclei (the haploid nuclei of the sperm and ovum) and the mingling of their chromosomes to form a new cell. This fertilized ovum, known as a zygote, is a large diploid cell that is the beginning, or primordium, of a human being.”
        [Moore, Keith L. Essentials of Human Embryology. Toronto: B.C. Decker Inc, 1988, p.2]

        4. “Embryo: The developing individual between the union of the germ cells and the completion of the organs which characterize its body when it becomes a separate organism…. At the moment the sperm cell of the human male meets the ovum of the female and the union results in a fertilized ovum (zygote), a new life has begun…. The term embryo covers the several stages of early development from conception to the ninth or tenth week of life.”
        [Considine, Douglas (ed.). Van Nostrand's Scientific Encyclopedia. 5th edition. New York: Van Nostrand Reinhold Company, 1976, p. 943]

        5. “Although life is a continuous process, fertilization is a critical landmark because, under ordinary circumstances, a new, genetically distinct human organism is thereby formed…. The combination of 23 chromosomes present in each pronucleus results in 46 chromosomes in the zygote. Thus the diploid number is restored and the embryonic genome is formed. The embryo now exists as a genetic unity.”
        [O'Rahilly, Ronan and Müller, Fabiola. Human Embryology & Teratology. 2nd edition. New York: Wiley-Liss, 1996, pp. 8, 29]

        GALT says:

        Would this be similar to a “parasite” or “virus”?

        No! Embryology has NOTHING to do with parasites or viruses. If you had even a single course in high school biology, you would know this.

        GALT says:

        Would not the following be more accurate? That the fetus is POTENTIALLY a totally “separate living human organism”?

        Again, NO! The references, which I’ve given above clearly point out that the unborn child is a separate living human organism from the moment of conception.

        GALT says:

        If you believe your statement to be true, there are a number of remedies available for you to pursue. Simply petition a court…

        My statement IS true, because it’s based on scientific fact. Furthermore, you are mixing oranges and apples with your so-called “remedies.” The fact that the unborn child is a separate living human organism has absolutely NOTHING to do with when that separate living human organism can live outside of the womb. The living human organism inside the womb is SEPARATE because of his/her own sex, blood type, genome, etc., NOT because of his/her location.

      • GALT

        Greg S……..So if location doesn’t matter, then petition the court to separate
        the fetus ( parasite ) from the mother……and make a human?

        Tons of fertilized eggs ( frozen embryo’s ) in storage, free them and make a lot
        of humans…….can you afford it?

        Why is it that you seem to care about (parasites) but have no consideration
        for actual humans?

        BTW you seem to be concerned that God has some designs here…..so I guess
        you must be displeased about something? Do you not trust God’s judgement?
        Are you afraid that God will abandon the fetus or not punish the murderer?
        Are you of the position that eternal damnation is insufficient punishment?

        Parasite: Biology. An organism that grows, feeds, and is sheltered on or in a different organism while contributing nothing to the survival of its host.

        Since as you say the fetus is a separate entity, how does it differ from
        the above description? What does it contribute that is beneficial to the host?

      • Patriot

        In other words, Craig didn’t read any of this article. He also believes the silly labels created by the media and the insulting demagoguery spewed from the mouthpieces of his favorite party. Craig is a mindless drone, and a cheerleader for whomever shows him the shiniest goodies that carry the labels that he will most identify with as what he believes, rather than understanding that slogans and terms like ‘women’s reproductive rights’ are crafted carefully by experts in advertising, sociology, psychology, and political science, and are paid very well to create outcomes like what we have seen here in the embarrassing comment left by Craig.
        This, ladies and gentlemen of America, is why the government on both or either or all sides of the fence have been so successful in dividing us, and in plain view eroding our liberties until so precious few remain, and what does remain grows thinner and more delicate than they have ever been.
        Craig, you go right ahead and keep believing what has been purchased and sold for your consumption. Politicians and their incredibly wealthy, and powerful employees, lobbies, statisticians, professors, pundits, advertising executives and bankers have worked very hard to ensure that you parrot the very crap that you have just posted here. So in a strange way, your narrow and painfully obtuse comments are a product of capitalism at its best. For you to believe and to repeat that expensive rhetoric, it was born as someone’s pitch, a sales rep’s idea, and was capitalized, slickly produced, sold, then provided to every possible outlet available to ensure that you do what you just did.
        Welcome to the Machine.

        • rtaylortitle

          Actually, you’re wrong. This is not “capitalism at its best”. This is fascism where big corps. and big govt. are joined at the hips…crony capitalism. True competitive capitalism would not allow lobbies to earn more points with the politicians than their own constituents. It would not allow a private cartel (monopoly) to manage the currency with fiat “money”.

          • Patriot

            You misunderstand me, I was talking about the process of capitalizing the idea of mass brainwashing that is paid for by the political machine. The outcome and the intent is fascism, yes. I was attempting to demonstrate the irony through sarcasm.

      • GALT

        Nick, I was actually responding to your comment to me, because you have
        a paragraph that begins with my name and seems to be regarding abortion
        and personhood/fetus’.

        The text you are seeking is my response to Greg S. and I am unclear as to the
        point you are trying to make regarding my response to him, which is why I asked the questions……..

      • Gordon

        Robert Smith and all others===== go to barnhardt.biz and scroll down to Nov 6. Look at that picture of the aborted fetus with its head sucked flat, decapitated, and arm severed. Stare at it a while and see if your heart and head tells you it is NOT a human baby. If you still believe it is just a blob of flesh, then you are already a souless entity and a waste of life yourself…….. Look at the bodies at the nazi death camps…….. Soon you liberals will have “old people” murdered for your political convenience.

        • Nick Czudy

          Gordon. It took a while but I saw that photo. It is disturbing. It was a fully formed baby of almost full term. It should have been birthed and put up for adoption is it was being aborted that late in term. By the way, the right wing are adamant pro-lifers, but I have never seen or heard of any attempts by the right to form adoption agencies to take the babies, that they want to prevent from being aborted. Rather than forcing a young and poor mother into a life of hardship, they should take all of these babies and get loving families for them.
          I agree to a certain gestation period after which abortion should be denied. But the idea of being denied from the moment of fertilization is absurd as well. We need to pick a reasonable half way point. Was the mothers health in jeopardy in this situation? It did not have the pertinent information. This site was a religious blog and most of the articles were absurd and irrelevant to me. So I would not be taking anything that they said there as gospel. Pardon the pun.

      • http://personalliberty.com OJ Eastwood

        1. The national debt has never ever been increased as much since the start of our country than it has been in the last 4 years. 2. National Health Care forced through congress not to give better care but to make a slave out of every american citizen. 3. 23 new gun laws are not to make it safer for kids but to allow for govmt control of all us. 4. Drones flying over the USA is to allow govmt to spy on you. 5. Dems, Repls and media team together to keep true american patriots out of washington. 6. 45 new czars are 45 new govmt departments to rob states of there rights and give control of all things to the washington elites. 7. DOJ stopping voter ID is not to protect voter rights but to allow for massive voter fraud. 8. Voting machines that automatically change your votes in no way give true results but planned fraud. 9. A election where every state that has voter ID laws vote for contestant #1 and #2 ends up winning is crooked. 10. A election that has more money spent than any other election in history and a turn out of more people than ever to vote and the next morning we are told 13 million less people voted has the smell of something wrong. 11. New CIA appointee happens to be owner of voting machine company that furnished voting machines that automatically changes names, what goes? 12. Washington allows for law to pass giving govmt right to pick up any body without a reason or warrant and hold forever. 13. DOJ and all czars given presidential pass not to answer to congress. 14. NSA directors that follow the constitution to protect the privacy of citizens removed and directors installed that will collect info on everyone. 15. Pipe line that can give americans thousands of jobs stopped by govmt that receives large donations from firm that will make millions from investment in company that will transport oil. 16. Global warming preached by people that are invested into company that will collect large fees paid into the carbon exchange by cap and trade, why is this allowed? 17. Last week was there not a report out that more soldiers have commited suicide than killed in action? 18. CIA, State Dept and Military told to stand down on help to ambassador, then proven lies for weeks given by govmt and to date no answers given. 19. Real automatic weapons given by DOJ to real crooks in Mexico and used to kill thousands of good innocent people and no answers given. 20. DOJ drops charges against black panther caught on video, not only doing voter intimation but preaching in the streets with a megaphone to also kill all white folks, his reason to congress is that they are his people is why the charges dropped! A DOJ employee had to quit his job because he has never seen such misuse of power and racism. 21. The list goes on and on and on……but the same ending…no answers from anyone (they hope in time we will forget) and if you belive in the Jesus, guns, constitution, laws and love your neighbor than you must be the terrorist and the problem! 22. Is their any thing you might think of to add? I pray that God will bless this great nation again and true american patriots will lead us once again.

      • famousfatman

        Obama owns all the records for spending, lies and breaking the oath of office. Both sides have did their damage but Obama has an agenda to destroy this country. You, like most miss the point and ignore the burden of the working tax payers that carry the country is unsustainable, at the rate Obama spends. The money he sends to our enemies in the Middle East and his love of the illegals coming to this country.by the millions. $ 16 Trillion dollars is the money you see in the hand spent but the slide of hand is the $ 109 Trillion you don’t see of US assets abroad, the gold exchange being manipulated, all that has to happen to destroy the solvency of the USA!! A rise in interest of 3.5 to 4.0 percent and we are a third world country. No one will lend to us, the rest of the world have their own problems financially. I write here and on other blogs but I mail, email and call our elected politicians. You can pick country over party or continue to spout untruths and carry the progressive flag. If you had accounting you would understand moving the decimal both parties contribute to the lies and financial fraud.

    • http://printing-for-profit.com Gary

      Harold,

      You are so correct. As an independent (non US resident or citizen) observer I can only comment using hearsay evidence. The big difference as I see it is the Democrats have no morality and the Republicans have no guts

      • To Tell The Truth

        Well put Gary

      • Robert Smith

        Hey Gary, one point…

        “morality” can’t be legislated.

        Rob

      • Steve E

        Rob, “morality” can’t be legislated. But immortality is legislated in many of our laws today.

      • Robert Smith

        You are correct Steve.

        The war on women…

        The war on those who participate in recreational drugs…

        The war on those who believe in a graceful exit from this life…

        Rob

      • Nadzieja Batki

        Robert Smith, but the Democrats have been legislating morality by the social programs, aka welfare, medicaid, medicare,SS.

        • navyjr

          Nadzieja, legislating morality would be more like the Civil Rights laws of the ’60s; what the SSA, and other “social welfare” programs legislate is organized theft of the earnings of the producers to GIVE to the non-producers, with the only legitimate recipients being those who actually paid into Social Security. What we see being legislated now is AMORALITY, not morality at all!

      • Sol of Texas

        To all —

        Legislation is always an attempt to establish morality.

        • navyjr

          You don’t, can’t, legislate morality; only behavioral limitations!

      • JC

        Open message to all left wingers…

        “conservatives” are generally NOT represented by the Republican Party.
        The GOP (most) cast its lot with the Globalists and left us behind long ago.
        We American conservatives are the core of the nations morality and don’t appreciate your labeling us a right wing when it’s always been up to us to protect your rights for you.

        We’re still Americans and you’re welcome to join us. :)

      • DaveH

        [comment has been edited] Robert. You want abortion choice, drug choice, and euthanasia choice. But then you turn around and advocate for a group who Forces Health Care Insurance on those who don’t want it, and Forces Automobile choices on those who don’t want them, and who even want to tell us what toilets to buy or what light bulbs to buy.
        [comment has been edited]

      • Wil

        Steve, I digress. Most of the present immorality is bypassing,or being passed despite,congress, through executive actions and an activist judiciary.

      • GALT

        Of course, there is the possibility that you have no real understanding of
        what morality is, because you do not have a common foundation upon
        which to proceed?

        BTW that was a question……the proof of the premise suggested, will be in
        the answers given…….which will all be different and claim a different source
        of authority.

        Anyone want to start? Brandon?

    • texasoltimer

      The problem is talking about Republicans and Democrats as though each were the party of the 1960s – when Kennedy said “Ask not what your country can do for you…” Back then the two parties pretty much came together in the middle with the moderates from both sides there. Being a Communist or Socialist was BAD! Today the Democrat party as such as moved to the very far left. Instead of holding to their principles, the Republicans have moved to the left as well. It’s about winning elections (note that the candidates only visit the “swing states” and the rest of us do not see them at all).

      However, this administration is not a Democrat party administration. It is way too far left for that.

      Read Saul Alinsky’s Rules for Radicals. You can apply the twelve rules (sometimes more than one) to everything this administration is doing. It allows for lies, made up statistics, false stories and anything else needed to accomplish their goal (the end justifies the means) to remake America in their image.

      Back when Hillary was graduating from college, Alinsky offered her a job (which she turned down in favor of one with a law firm). She has publicly stated that she is a proud Progressive of the 1920s. Seventeen years later (Alinsky was then dead) devoted followers of his offered a job to Obama organizing the south side of Chicago and studying Alinsky’s teachings.

      This is about control and bringing America down. Rahm Emanuel stated “Never let a good crisis go to waste.” Want to rid law abiding citizens of guns? Take an event, use emotion, create fear, divide with ridicule, blame others for what you are doing and get what you want. Hitler stated (to paraphrase) that to conquer a country, one must rid the citizens of their arms otherwise the conqueror is opening himself to defeat. Step by baby step they are taking our freedoms. Look to have a registry of all our weapons (nothing grandfathered in) and having to register when you personally sell a gun to another individual, including a gift to your child. Once they know where they are, they can take them.

      You can’t use logic and common sense in listening to the left – you have to read the Rules they follow and see what they are doing. We have to turn this on them to defeat them rather than running along in their wake and trying to keep up with the rhetoric they expound. That’s what the Republicans are doing.

      • Bill

        Well said, Texas

      • Bob666

        Texas,
        you sir might just have a clue, an reading some of this stuff tonigh tells me that you might also be alone with few of us to agree with you.

    • Sandra Lee Smith

      You’re on the right track, sir; we have only one party which shows 2 “heads” as if if’s 2 distinct parties, when it’s not; and that party is a TOOL of those who do intend the destruction of this nation, in establishing the NWO! Mr. Smith’s article is spot on as far as he goes; but this is MUCH larger, more insidious and a great deal more EVIL than most are willing to see or admit. Letting go of everything you’ve lived a lifetime believing to be true is difficult, but it’s the ONLY way to see the truth here, painful as it is to see. In this case, the political and fiscal power, globally-speaking, are concentrated via a maze of front groups directly into the control of one person, and that one is not in the US; neither is he someone you would likely suspect in this. The old adage “all roads lead to Rome” still holds true.

    • Nick Czudy

      Harold. I wonder if you made a typo. that the
      “GOP has forced so many extreme left wing candidates on you.” What has happened in reality is that the GOP has entered so many extreme right wing candidates. They then get them elected by redistricting and once in office, They do everything possible to make the government fail. They force their extreme personal views on everyone and do their best to force government to a standstill. If they are so against our government as it stands today, then they should get out or exercise one of their rights. That is the right to leave. Go and try and live somewhere else. There is the constant belly aching of loss of freedoms. The GOP actually wants more restrictions on us them anyone else. Look at the homeland security, two wars, forced ultrasound on women, forcing women to carry pregnancies, unleashing wall street to screw with our economy with no oversight, and more war mongering against Iran and Syria. I do not see the ill intentions that the author has charged the Dems with. Most of this blog is poppy cock.

      • navyjr

        There hasn’t been an “extreme right” candidate run at the national level in my memory, which goes back to Ike’s first run. Back then “extreme right” used to mean “John Birch Society” and others like them, but the truth is the term, as applied here by you, is referring to anyone who stands on and for the Constitution as written, which is not “extreme” anything; but sound conservatism, but an enemy to those who wield the power, so “demonized” as extreme where none is, and which you’ve clearly swallowed without thought.

        • Nick Czudy

          Hi Navy Jr. what I am referring to as Right wind extremist is the likes of Michelle Bachman., Jim Demint, Scott Brown, I am 60 and my memory is poor. I have never been good at remembering names. But if I looked at a list, I could come up with about 40 names in the current Congress. Most of the tea party members are what I would call extreme right. You say that if you support the constitution that makes you is only conservatism. Well even left wing democrats respect and follow the constitution. I though that right to vote is in the constitution. I call as extreme all of the governors and politicians that were trying to make voting hard and skewed to enable a higher GOP majority. Wanting to clarify the 2nd as to what kind of arms are meant is something that could use an updating. The SCOTUS had ruled and even by a conservative judge that it did not mean tanks, and RPGs and missiles and many types of guns that are used by the military in fighting wars. Are you trying to say that restricting assault weapons is infringing of the 2nd? This seems to be the debate that is waging now. The polling that I saw tonight on some of the political and news shows, indicated the majorities of the USA wanted some form of restrictions and it would not go against the 2nd. This is a debate that will continue for some time. I do not begrudge anyone for guns for hunting, recreation or collecting. What scares me is the people that feel that they need to amass weapons to protect against the government, police and any appointed or elected authority. regards Nick Cz

          • navyjr

            Ah that would be because only those bent on communistic NWO under LUCIFER have the right to do ANYTHING like that, I presume?

          • http://roberttitle.wordpress.com roberttitle

            The day I heard Michelle Bachman had gotten involved with the Tea Party was the day I realized the Tea Party had screwed up. She is an Israel-lover first and foremost before being an America Firster, Second and Third.

          • Bob666

            Clearly, this country has elected some very odd people to office, but how Michelle Bachman was voted back into office is beyond me. it’s not that she is a republican, if she were a democrate, she would still be a nutcase.

          • http://twitter.com/deftdaft Robert Taylor (@deftdaft)

            Both major parties are on par with each other when it comes to nut cases and money-junkies that sell their souls to lobbies…especially AIPAC.

          • Nick Czudy

            Robert, There seems to be a common reply when we are criticizing our government to blame both parties. But lets be realistic. The blame goes 80/20. 80% of the loons and nut jobs come from the right. They are so idealistic over common sense. They seem to be willing to cause harm to the country in keeping to their beliefs. We do not need law makers making decisions for the country on their personal beliefs. They are married to the nostalgic past, when we all rode around with guns strapped to our belts. I do not know of one left wing politician that fits the bill of a crazy zealot.

          • http://twitter.com/deftdaft Robert Taylor (@deftdaft)

            Al Gore, Barney Frank, Chris Dodd. Hillary Clinton and our Atty. General all come to mind. You are very one-sighted. The GOP and the Dems. are basically a two-headed single monster that switches governance from time to time. Opposite sides of the same coin of the realm.

          • Nick Czudy

            HI Robert.
            Barney Frank. He is gay. But his views are sound and well balanced. Are you labeling him extreme because he is gay? He has had a long career in the Congress.

            Hilary Clinton. extreme? I do not understand where you are coming from with her. She has been recognized on both sides of the aisle as being a good Secretary of State and a future president. Newt Gingrich has even made a statement, something to the effect of “If Hilary runs in 2016, there is no GOP that can win against her. If she was so extreme, then how is there this respect for her?

            Al Gore. He was VP and is an environmentalist. Is that why you have him listed here? He is a sane and positive influence in this world as we do need to be conscious of the human effect on Global warming. I would need to know your views on Global Warming to understand why her is on your list. The GOP have two extreme zealots that think that the earth is 14,000 years old and the world was created in 7 days, that was put on the Congressional Science committee. Another one on that committee said something to the effect that Science was the work of the Devil and that no one should believe any of them. These are great people to put on a Science committee. If you insist, I will be able to come up with their names.

            Eric Holder, I assume that you included him here because of “Fast and Furious”? that was a which hunt from Rep Issa. they were not interested in finding out what happened. They were only interested in seeing all of the correspondence between the director and everyone else to see if they could pin a coverup on the affair. they did not care how it happened and who was responsible. There was nothing bad or illegal done by Eric Holder and he was vindicated by an impartial panel. Do you have some other problem with him?

            Chris Dodd is the one politician that I know the least about. I know that he co-authored the Dodd Frank bill with Barney. I have not heard him spout any insanities or crazy comments. You will have to tell me what he did to get on your list.

            All of these people that you have listed have not acted in an irrational and demented manner. If you disagree with their policies and politics, then you can do that.

            What I was talking about was real crazies. the latest is the GOP Congressman that spoke against abortion and then was tape recorded telling a mistress to get an abortion.
            The Todd Murdock fiasco is famous. That in a real rape the woman can secrete some chemical that prevents pregnancy.
            Then there is the Indiana Congressman Richard Murdock, that says if a woman gets pregnant from rape it is God’s will that she is pregnant and it is OK.

            There is Scott Brown in Mass. that regularly speaks with royalty and Kings and Queens ans he ridicules Elizabeth Warren, because she was of Indian ancestry.
            There was Alan West saying that there were 79 t0 81 Democrats were members of the Communist party.

            Rep Steve Stockmen of Texas is threatening Obama with impeachment for suggesting gun regs. He is the one that defended the Waco and Idaho standoffs. He is claiming that Obama is like Stalin and Hitler. Timothy McVeigh faxed him a letter telling him what he was going to do in Oklahoma Federal Building bombing.

            Rep Paul Broun from Georgia.
            Evolution, embryology and the Big Bang theory are major underpinnings of mainstream science. And Georgia Republican Rep. Paul Broun, a physician who sits on the House Science, Space and Technology Committee, says they are “lies straight from the pit of hell.”

            Joe Walsh – Rep. IL. He rants constantly against Obama and swears that he will not vote a single dollar to the US budget. He rants about Obama’s fiscal irresponsibility while he has not paid his ex wife since 3008 alimony and support for her and his three kids. But you really need to listen to him ranting to get a feel for his extreme views.

            Senator Mitch McConnel. Leader of the minority in the Senate. “My purpose in this Senate is to keep Obama from getting a second term.” His job was not to govern wisely for the American public or to do his job, with fair and debated and compromised bills, but to block anything from passing during his 4 year term.

            Renee Ellmers: Cracking down on Monarchy and Mosques
            Tom Marino: Plagued by Corruption Charges
            Tim Walberg: A Birther Goes to Washington
            Vicky Hartzler: Missouri’s Anti-Gay Zealot
            Lou Barletta: America’s Anti-Immigrant Mayor Heads to Congress
            Tim Griffin: Karl Rove’s Man in Congress
            Allen West: Fanatical Opponent of Muslims, Immigrants, Progressives & Obama
            Alan Nunnelee: Mississippi’s Newest Member of Congress is on a “Crusade to Save America”
            Raul Labrador: Bryan Fischer’s Favorite Tea Partier
            Sandy Adams: Conspiracy-Theorist, Religious Extremist

            Any way, I could stay here all night and keep coming up with more members to this list.
            Can you come up with any Democrat that comes close to these guys?

          • Bob666

            Interesting response Nick,
            for the record,’ Allen West: Fanatical Opponent of Muslims, Immigrants, Progressives & Obama” is all that you say and a whole lot more. I live in Florida and he was voted out because he put his personal agenda above that of the people who voted for him.

            We are glad that he is in the rear view mirror.

          • Nick Czudy

            Bob,. I am sure that you know him better than I. I also did say that he kept saying that 79 to 81 members of the democratic Party were members of the Communist Party. there is no doubt that he was far right wing tea party, only representing his ideals in Congress. I am glad that you turfed him out. By the way, he did get one vote for Speaker of the House.

          • http://roberttitle.wordpress.com roberttitle

            Shame on you for playing the “gay” card. His politics is what I was referring to. Why does you mind automatically bring up sexual proclivity? Maybe you have a problem there as do racists when they bring up the “race” card. Hillary, again, is an excellent example of one strange, odd individual. Do you remember Vince Foster, Whitewater, her shared responsibility with Benghazi? No, you are obviously wrong, she is NOT highly regarded on both sides of the aisle, but the mass media loves her and I guess that’s what really http://www.wnd.com/2013/01/west-point-far-right-dangerous-to-u-s/

          • Bob666

            Robbie,
            “Shame on you for playing the “gay” card. His politics is what I was referring to. Why does you mind automatically bring up sexual proclivity? Maybe you have a problem there as do racists when they bring up the “race” card”

            Let’s get this straight, you are replying to things that I did not post?

            “Why does you mind automatically bring up sexual proclivity?”

            Homophobic and poor sentance structure?

          • Nick Czudy

            Robert. I read that long article about the extreme right wing as being demonized for wanting what they want and being compared to terrorists. There are some good points there. But the one thing that I wonder is what is the old patriot ways that they want to go back to. I know that family life was better in the times of my parents. The world is moving much faster and getting to be harder instead of better. But I also, do not know of what the good old ways were that most Patriots want? Please tell me.

            If you reread my comment on Barney Frank. I said that I did not know of any controversial political policies that he espoused except that he was gay. I did not make it a race card issue. I was leaving it open for you to tell me what you did not like about his politics. I still do not know of what you dislike on his political views. I know that his big bill was the Dodd-Frank bill on Wall street reform. It was long overdue, as the greedy Wall street bankers brought the whole world to a recession from their unregulated greed. Are you against this?

            As far as Hilary, the two cases that you mentioned were as follows. the Whitewater affair they were cleared of any wrong doing. that was when Ken Starr, was desperately trying to find something on them. they were cleared. In the Benghazi affair, it was a Fox news and Rep Issa, that one can compare to Ken Star. He was desperately trying to find out that there was some conspiracy issues instead of the causes of how the security failed. It was another witch hunt that was GOP pressured. It smacked of a desperation to try and find some scandal to pin in Obama and his admin. Most Americans saw it for what it was and ignored it. In both cases the parties were found to not be conspiring to hide info or defraud the people. These were witch hunts. They stunk of partisan zeal. Issa did the same with the Fast and Furious case. I as most Americans saw it for the politically motivated witch hunt that it was. it did not make the GOP look good.

            Have you got any really serious flaws or policies that you can sight?

          • dianiline

            Nick Czudy commented on A Message To The ‘Left’ From A ‘Right-Wing Extremist’.

            in response to Robert Taylor (@deftdaft):
            (snip)”Any way, I could stay here all night and keep coming up with more members to this list.
            Can you come up with any Democrat that comes close to these guys?”

            Oh please! Have you not noticed the charming man currently inhabiting the White House?

            Thinks you can spend money to get out of a financial crisis. Thinks you can take from the competent to give to the lazy and not convert the population from the former to the latter. Thinks that somehow society will survive after he’s accomplished that.

            Thinks there is science supporting climate change caused by humans.

            Thinks that must be a bad thing.

            Thinks the government knows what is good for us, better than we do. Goes to Washington to swear to protect our second amendment rights, then tries to pull that rug out from under our feet. Sees the evidence that the only gun laws that reduce crime are concealed carry laws; tries to make our children less safe by pushing for gun reduction laws that only protect criminals.

            Thinks the great United States of America would somehow be improved by turning it into a failed European social democracy. You know, if you want that, you can always just move. Where do the sane people have to go when you’ve turned the US into that? Because there isn’t any other backup US for us to go to. And of course, the failed European social democracy experiment would work even less well without the actual US to defend and support it, and, you know what? When “we” go the way of “them”, there will be no “us” to defend us.

            You may disagree with young earth proponents, but a very great many people agree with them. It is not an extreme position. It may be wrong, but it is not extreme. And, of course, though it seems likely that the earth is very old, science only shows that this is possible, not that it is true. Science is a poor place to put your faith. It goes right on representing what actually is, but we keep accusing it of representing what we believe.

            Al Gore, of course, can’t count and is a sore loser. You may recall an event a few years ago where he lost an election, but the count was close in one small place, so he quite reasonably asked for a recount. It was pretty exciting actually.

            He still lost.

            He did not then do the right thing, but asked for another recount, and lost again.

            Still unable to see the writing on the wall, he again failed to do the right thing.

            I think he still thinks, somehow, that if given enough recounts he would have won.

            I *know* that he has supporters who think this. These are the lunatic fringe. You may claim that some Republicans don’t believe in science, but many, many Democrats clearly don’t believe in math.

            None of them realize that, if successive recounts come closer and closer to changing the outcome, it implies that somebody is doing some monkey business with the ballots. Not that the first outcome was wrong.

            We joked, at the time, that 5,000 votes against Gore was too close to call, but if he ever got enough recounts to make it +1 in his favor, he’d claim it was a mandate. Would +1 votes for Gore have made him win? Why, if +5000 votes against him didn’t make him lose?

            And then there are all those Democrats who support both of the above. Way more crazy people on the D side.

            Dianiline

          • http://twitter.com/deftdaft Robert Taylor (@deftdaft)

            Democrat = a person with both feet planted firmly in the air.

          • Nick Czudy

            Hi Dianiline. Interesting reply. Let me address some of your comments.
            1) Obama is the extreme guy that you are referring to. He has been called a middle conservative this morning by a conservative who voted for him because the rest of the GOP have gone extreme right. taking money from the creators and giving it to the masses. “Thinks he can spend money to get us out of this financial recession”. Ah Dian, guess what. we are out of this recession due to Obama and his policies. You spend in a recession to stimulate and when times and the economy are good, you pay off the debt. The USA has the best growth in the whole world at this time. And the Europeans who tried the austerity approach have been languishing are moving towards Obama’s method. They will copy the USA, not the USA copying the European method. All of this has occurred with the GOP trying to block everything. The only reason the USA’s growth is not much higher is the GOP obstruction. Their demented idea is that if the economy fails, then they can blame it on Obama. It has back fired on them. Idiots!

            He is also taking back from the 1% wealthy that have been engorging themselves on the backs of the middle class and giving some of it back to the middle class, who will spend it and stimulate the economy instead of sending the money overseas to banks in Switzerland or the Caymans. Look at the graphs of how income has been over the last two decades. The 1% were doing fine and influencing elections to keep their taxes lower than the middle class. That is why their shills like Romney wanted to lower taxes even more for them to keep making more money on the backs of the income producers IThe Middle Class)
            The Science of Climate change is accepted by the vast majority of people. We humans, do have an effect on how it accelerates or declines. this years weather should give you a few hints that it is happening and is not some left wing conspiracy. What is it with the right wing, everything is a conspiracy. Obama and friends would not even think about some devious plan. It is always the right that looks for some malice in the bills that are pushed by Obama. Why is it, because if they were in power, they would be doing something clandestine, so they think that Obama and the Dems are.

            Obama is protecting the 2nd amendment. He is not taking guns from the masses. he is trying to implement some changes, to cut down on mass killings. There is a way that the 23 changes will not go against the 2nd. One of the problems with knowing, if the concealed carry laws are beneficial, is that the last government made it illegal to do any research and to disseminate it. The CDC and the ATF were muzzled by GOP and the NRA. Why? Why would they want these statistics to be barred if it showed positive results for guns? That answer is easy, the results do not make the massive gun movement a positive thing. Other than the Travane Martin case in Florida and the driver shooting 4 teenagers in cars. Having people with strong opinions (that may be wrong opinions) carrying around concealed firearms, could be more of a problem, than a benefit.
            I guess the main thing is who is allowed to carry the concealed weapons. Some may be good and some may be a mistake.

            The earth is about 5 billion years old. the dinosaurs have not been alive for 65 million years. That is a far cry from the 5000 to 14,000 years that the right wing religious folks are suggesting. That is an extreme difference. This is not something that is questioned in the Scientific and mathematical circles. It is clear. the creation museum and their followers have a credibility gap. I do not intent to insult you if you are one of these believers. You need to trust scientists and scholars more than believing in the bible. Did I mention that the bible was produced about 325 years after Jesus died and was assembled by the pagan emperor Constantine? It is amazing how many people in this world trust what is written there as a life long occupation. That is sad.

            As far as Al Gore losing in Florida. That was a travesty and shows just how much the GOP rig the elections. It was truly amazing that Democratic districts that would normally vote for Gore about 87% of the time were mysteriously reversed and having Bush win by that margin. truly amazing. Also that is where there were questionable voting machines. The voter suppression and fraud was so rampant. Gore was gracious to back out and not have a bigger investigation. The answer would have been another example of the GOP’s massive voting suppression. It seems if you can’t win fair and square then rig the votes.

            Your examples of extreme dems falls short of any evidence.

          • dianiline

            Nick Czudy said:
            (snip)”Obama is the extreme guy that you are referring to. He has been called a middle conservative this morning by a conservative who voted for him….

            Hi Nick,

            You can bandy the words about how you like, but anyone who calls Obama conservative is far enough left to fall of the page. You should preface comments like these with a warning: “Put down your coffee and swallow before reading on”!

            (snip)”Ah Dian, guess what. we are out of this recession due to Obama and his policies. You spend in a recession to stimulate and when times and the economy are good, you pay off the debt.”

            Oh. Good to know. I’ll tell all my friends. And maybe put that house back on the market that we didn’t manage to unload before the first inauguration of the Financial Disaster.

            (snip)”He is also taking back from the 1% wealthy….”

            That would be called theft. Actually the really wealthy pay the lion’s share of taxes.

            (snip)”The Science of Climate change is accepted by the vast majority of people.”

            Yes, it is. That is because the vast majority of people are not scientists.

            (snip)”Obama and friends would not even think about some devious plan. It is always the right that looks for some malice in the bills that are pushed by Obama. Why is it, because if they were in power, they would be doing something clandestine, so they think that Obama and the Dems are.”

            Oh! Coffee disclaimer again. Please. It’s a good thing I’m not drinking any.

            “Obama is protecting the 2nd amendment. He is not taking guns from the masses. he is trying to implement some changes, to cut down on mass killings. There is a way that the 23 changes will not go against the 2nd. One of the problems with knowing, if the concealed carry laws are beneficial, is that the last government made it illegal to do any research and to disseminate it.”

            Not really true. Mass killings tend to happen in gun-free zones. Not complicated.

            If we wanted to prevent school killings, we would institute rifle teams in every middle school and high school in the country. Then some yoyo who wanted to step in and kill people would know that at least some of the student body and faculty would have access to weapons and know how to use them.

            For elementary schools not associated with a middle or high school, there could be armed guards, or designated teachers who are capable of handling weapons. The latter would be difficult though, because many teachers are nice people but not the type who could be trained to do this.

            (snip)”The earth is about 5 billion years old.”

            You don’t know this, although clearly you think you do. You believe it because it is the theory that best fits the available evidence, and it is probably closer to true than the 14,000 year theory. In the opinion of many, if not most, people who believe God created the earth, He can as well have created it a very long time ago as yesterday. That is part of the definition of a three-O God–omniscient, omnipresent, omnipotent. And He can have created it 14,000 years ago looking very much like it is 5 billion years old.

            Scientists sometimes forget that science is not really a process of knowing about things like the age of the earth and the mechanism or existence of evolution. It’s a process of formulating models that best fit the data available, and always being open to new models that fit better. What would you think if tomorrow evil space aliens landed in Washington and announced that we were their science project and what we think is the universe is really a cleverly constructed Habitrail for Humans?

            (snip)”You need to trust scientists and scholars more than believing in the bible.

            Oh, you clearly haven’t read much science. Some of it is quite good. Much of it is very poorly designed. All of it is political. Scientists and scholars are human beings and they have careers and have to compete for funding. When I was a little girl, I thought that scientists were all interested in finding the truth and that science was the best way to do it. But science really seldom gets to “true”. It has to be content with “likely”.

            (snip)”As far as Al Gore losing in Florida. That was a travesty and shows just how much the GOP rig the elections.”

            It shows just how much the Democrats rig the elections. We got to watch them make several attempts, each falling short. And I repeat, if you recount five times with the same result, and on the sixth the result changes, who would be the winner? It seems to me it’s still the first, with five out of six wins. If the original loser wins by one vote in the sixth count, why would you accept that when you didn’t accept him losing by 5000 in the first count? Isn’t it still too close to call? And if he wins by 5000 in the sixth count, doesn’t that look peculiar that things were off by 10000 in the first count? I would think that would look quite suspicious that the new “winner” was tweaking the vote.

            If the first recount had gone for Gore, I think it would have been reasonable to go for one more and take two out of three. But after multiple counts for Bush, it was just an exercise in voter abuse to keep going and Gore just didn’t have the decency to bow out gracefully.

            (snip)”…that is where there were questionable voting machines.”

            Now we have questionable electronic voting machines. In Florida there were punch cards and paper ballots, which at least can be hand counted.

          • Irish Love

            AWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW WTG dianline…… I am soooooo tired of all the false rhetoric thrown around by Mr Crusty! Amen Darlin!! TY TY

          • Nick Czudy

            Dear Irish love. To quote words spoken by your most favorite president today. “Calling people names is not a substitute for meaningful debate.” I really does not endear you in the minds and hearts of both sides.

            Most parties on both sides see Obama as a centrist and far from the extreme left that you like to call him. Just look through the media or on the talk shows. Even Bill O’Reilly basically said that tonight. Come out from the bubble and see the world as it really is.
            Regards. Your favorite admirer Nick Cz

          • Irish Love

            Right on Mr Crusty……… So True & I totally agree, HOWEVER, it might behoove you to look back at your previous responses to me and others and recognize YOUR own part in this exact claim. The pot callin the kettle black?? ……. hmmm just doesn’t fly!! As Jesus said, “those without sin throw the first rock……” G’Day Mate!!

          • Bob666

            Yawn………………………..

          • Bob666

            Yo Nick,

            it would appear the you and I and Financially Insecure John are Dr Strangeloviedovie’s favorites here. I will applaud you on your civility, but with the queen of cut and paste, it will get you no where.

            Remember, you can tell a woman, but you can’t tell that woman much because she knows everything.

            I am sure there is a rock out there calling for here to crawl back under it

          • Irish Love

            I rest my case Nick…… your “posse” has spoken….

          • Irish Love

            OMG Nick….. YOU are such a Bill Clinton dawg LOL God love ya Lad!!!!

          • dianiline

            Hi Nick,

            I have seen, somewhere, a left wing person claim that the right is trying to move the center by portraying centrist Obama as a lefty.

            I think the left is trying to move the center by portraying Obama as a centrist.

            He has foisted socialized medicine on us. I don’t know any medical people, including myself, who think that’s a good idea. I have spent part of my life unable to afford health insurance, and it infuriates me that if that were the case now the government would simply TAX me for what I could not afford. Whether I needed it or not. And it would just be my problem how I was going to pay for food for the kids, after the government stole that money.

            He claims to have thought long and hard about the Sandy Hook shooting and comes up with left-wing ideas that only wishful thinkers could believe will help prevent another such tragedy. (Will it be less tragic when the next psychotic teenager kills a bunch of schoolchildren with bombs?)

            He has said repeatedly and often that he wants to steal from the working to support the lazy.

            No, that’s not how he phrases it. Probably he thinks that isn’t what he’s saying. But the pro-aborts don’t think they’re championing a right to murder either. “Redistribution” is theft. He was willing to tank the economy to do it.

            Socialist, fascist, and communist. How much more left-wing can you get?

            Dianiline

          • Nick Czudy

            Hi Dianiline.

            You previously said.”He has foisted socialized medicine on us. I don’t know any medical people, including myself, who think that’s a good idea. I have spent part of my life unable to afford health insurance, ”

            How about the rest of the world. The US medical system, as it has been, is the worst and most expensive in the world. IN other countries, when there is universal health care, the gov. pays for everything at cost. What you are doing now, is paying for your health by private insurance that has a mark up and profit and the hospitals that are run for profit. Have you seen the paychecks of the board and CEO’s of these institutions?

            That is why the health costs are 2 to 3 times the cost of any other country, in the world. This is fact. Look it up on the net. This is a known fact. See the movie,”Sicko” by Michael Moore. ( I know, he is a lefty) How he showed the medical systems in Canada and Europe is true. I know. I have family in Canada and I have lived there for 20 years.

            What will happen is that eventually, Obamacare will reduce the cost of health for eveyone.

            In Canada, a working person, pays 3.5 % of a typical paycheck for health care. If he was to make say $1000.00 per week, that is $35.00. So that is $140.00 per month. That covers his whole family, even if he had 20 children. There are no pre-conditions, no maximum limits for cancer or other extreme injuries or illness. You will not lose your house and go bankrupt if someone in your family gets a serious injury. You can walk into any hospital or doctors office you want anywhere in the country. anyone can afford to have full medical coverage. It would solve your problem.

            What I cannot understand is why so many people, that have been raped and pillaged by the medical system in the USA is so adamant to defend them. I understand that insurance is about $300.00 or more for an individual and more than $1000.00 for a family per month. There are conditions and many things not covered.
            Now the system in Canada, is self funding. If they fall short they can always adjust the amount taken by a half a point or two. wach province operates its own system. Think of it, no insurance payments, no hospital bills, no hassle, less cost to administer. The faster the USA moves over to universal healthcare the lower the costs will be to everyone.

            THE SYSTEM IS BROKEN!!!

            Obama-care is a big step in the right direction. I guarantee that in one year, even the most abstinent of you will love it.
            You have to understand that the GOP politicians have been taking money from the Medical industry for decades to keep the status quo. I understand why they are fighting for it…………………. But what I cannot understand is why all of you are fighting for them. They are stealing money out of your pocket and you are defending them!
            Are they also giving you money as well? I didn’t think so.

            You talked about “redistribution.” Government redistributes. They have done so since 1787. Now this is a popular mantra of the GOP and right wing. Mitt used this slogan as if this is something new and unique to Obama. we all know how desperate he was.

            Well I will just say this. All of the Red States are the biggest takers of money that the FEDs have redistributed from Blue states like NY, NJ and CA. These are facts. There are lists with the percentages on many websites. You can look it up.
            What I do not understand is why you all keep pushing this point. It is fairly hypocritical to keep harping on this point when the Red states are the biggest takers.
            For you that are religious, isn’t there quote from the bible that says something like this…”Let him who has not a sinned, cast the first stone!”

            As for Sandy Hook and Obama’s 23 points. It is not the lefties that have come up with these gun grabber ideas. It is 72 to 93 percent of all Americans. Look at the polls that have questioned this. Take any poll. even 72% of NRA members want background checks.
            Americans are just starting to get tired of the old NRA type of gun controls. It is time for a change. You keep calling this as going against the second, but it is not. All of those 300 million of guns with law bidding and sane owners will be able to keep guns. For their patience, sacrifice and understanding, because they might not be able to own and use, certain models of guns, there might be thousands of Americans that will not be killed.
            Last, why would the NRA and their shills, of the “A” rated congress, have passed a law that prevented the CDC from releasing and publishing all of the studies that they had made over the years on gun deaths? Why? Don’t the American people want to know the truth? Maybe the results will not be too supporting of the Gun Lobbies policies if they were made public.
            Obama needs to open up this information. What kind of free Republic, hides information for the people?

          • dianiline

            Nick Czudy said:”

            (snip)”IN other countries, when there is universal health care, the gov. pays for everything at cost.”

            And sets the cost, because it is the only customer. So medical professionals will not be paid what they deserve, and they will not have any recourse because the government insurance is the only option. I will not be able to go to medical school, but I think this is the worst time in history to study medicine. Medical school is expensive because in the past medicine was a lucrative profession, recognizing the extensive preparation and dedication required of doctors. However I believe it will be much cheaper–even free–in the future, when doctors are essentially government workers and make minimum wage. Medical students of today have the high costs but won’t make the big bucks.

            (snip)”See the movie,”Sicko” by Michael Moore.”

            There’s a likely source of information for you. I have had a good medical care experience in Canada, but we were paying privately. They did seem to have a hard time figuring out what to do with us, since we weren’t part of the government insurance. I have known people who lived under socialized medicine in other parts of the world, who regarded it as care for the poor–anybody who could afford to would pay privately because the care was better.

            I think socialized medicine could be done well, but it would not be cheap. Either you give people all the care they want, which will be expensive, or you give them what the government thinks is appropriate, which is not fair.

            (snip)”What will happen is that eventually, Obamacare will reduce the cost of health for eveyone.”

            That’s a nice thought. Not an experiment I want to try. I think Obamacare will increase the cost of health care, make it poorer, and remove the incentive for talented people to go into health care. Yes, health care as a profession is rewarding, but it should also be lucrative.

            (snip)”The faster the USA moves over to universal healthcare the lower the costs will be to everyone.”

            I can say that my own healthcare has become much more expensive since the Obamacare debacle was enacted. I do have different, but similar, insurance from what I had in the past. But since Obamacare, under two different health care plans, I have been charged for things I never had to pay for in the past. Of course when Obama said that those of us with private insurance could keep it if we were happy with it, we knew that in fact the insurance we were happy with would tend to go away once there was Obamacare. So it is.

            (snip)”THE SYSTEM IS BROKEN!!!”

            Well, yes, it was, because it was way too heavily regulated by the government. Health insurance should only cover major disasters. Insurance is not for routine expenses. Everything that insurance pays for is more expensive than paying for it yourself, because the insurer incurs administrative costs and is entitled to a profit. If the government is the insurer, it will not make a profit, but being the government it will steal right and left.

            (snip)”Obama-care is a big step in the right direction. I guarantee that in one year, even the most abstinent of you will love it.”

            Yes, the most abstinent of us will love paying for the thousands of condoms required by the least abstinent. Exactly.

            The most obstinate of us, on the other hand, doubt we will love it.

            Furthermore, there is a steep moral cost to taking responsibility out of the hands of adults and putting it in the hands of the government.

            (snip)”You talked about “redistribution.” Government redistributes.”

            It’s theft, and it’s wrong. Whenever you find yourself thinking, let alone saying, that “taxes should be raised on this group, and not that group”, remember that you are talking about theft. There should be tax exemptions for a certain amount of money for the necessities of life. Then everyone should pay the same rate.

            You seem to be talking about variations in federal spending state by state, and that’s not the same thing. Federal taxes raised in the US and spent in the US is not redistribution, and if you think some other state is unfairly favored, you can always vote with your feet.

            Raising taxes on you to give money to me, that’s redistribution. Raising taxes on people who work to give money to people who won’t, that’s just crazy. People respond to incentives. If you tax work you’ll get less of it. If you pay laziness you’ll get more of it.

            This has been a fun discussion, but I will be unsubscribing and getting back to my regularly scheduled life. I wish you all well, without necessarily wishing for you what you want.

            Blessings,

            Dianiline

          • Nick Czudy

            Hi Dianiline. thanks for your reply. You have mentioned some talking points that the RIght that have been supporting the HMO’s and the Medical industry have been making that are just not true. I have a brother and my daughter that are doctors in Canada.

            Initially, many Canadian doctors were lured south because of large salary offers to work in the USA, Us doctors do get paid more than the Canadian doctors.

            In that last 10 years, many of these doctors have returned to Canada. They realized that with the higher pay came other issues. They had to pay much more for health services. This clawed back a lot of the increase in pay.
            The life style was different, which took away a level of security and safety. Higher crime, more guns. This is just not an issue here. Violent crimes in Canada are very low.
            The education system has been compromised from decades of funding decreases. The USA had slipped to 28th in the world in education.
            So after trying living in the USA, many doctors have returned to Canada.

            I will address your comments specifically. I will copy your main points and reply to them.

            (snip) So medical professionals will not be paid what they deserve, and they will not have any recourse because the government insurance is the only option.

            The government insurance is not like what you are used to. Once the government gets its deductions from paychecks and for annual payments for self employed people, the hospitals are open door and free for all Canadians. There is no in between insurance bureaucracies. There is no need to get competing quotes. It is already run at cost. Not for profit. I once saw a US hospital bill where a tongue depressor and a pair of latex gloves was billed at $14,00 each. They cost $8.00 for a box of 100 pieces. This is the markup that US medical institions charge for their services. Cdn Hospitals would pay the cost. .08 cents each. Not $14.00. That is what I mean that the costs are paid at cost.

            Doctors are paid a fair wage. They have unions like teachers, firemen, police etc. they keep their wages at a good level. The doctors are far from hurting. They are not paid at minimum, wages. the typical wage is about $400,000.00 a year. This is a very livable income. Their income is at the higher levels of the middle class. It is not as much as they are paid in the USA, but that is why US costs are higher. Going to school is no problem either. Cdn. schools are similar and not run for profit. So costs are kept low and teachers and professors are paid less than the USA. No I am wrong. Cdn. teachers after 6 years make about $92,000 per year. This is more than twice what US teachers are paid. They also have the gold plated pensions.

            (snip) I have known people who lived under socialized medicine in other parts of the world, who regarded it as care for the poor–anybody who could afford to would pay privately because the care was better.

            Dianiline, This is another fallacy that has been perpetrated by the US medical system to try and justify the high costs. Any Cdn hospital is first rate and not a budget health for the poor. Some hospitals in a region have more elaborate facilities than others. If a specialized service is not at a hospital, ambulance service will take them to the next nearest one that does. This makes sense to make the maximum use of valuable resources. In your case, them not knowing how to bill you was a problem because all Cdn’s get free service and they are not used to billing for care. That is not an issue when you walk in the door. In the USA, until they get your credit card or insurance card, they will not talk to you. Some hospitals are designated as specialized centers like “Sick Kids Hospitals, burn centers, cancer centers etc. Not all hospitals are all things to everyone. Any large Cdn hospital can match any of the best US hospitals. Why is it that Canadians have a higher mortality rate and lower infant deaths? You can not justify the higher US costs as having that much better service. We all pay more here because of greed and profit, throughout the system. They are run for profit.

            (snip) Either you give people all the care they want, which will be expensive, or you give them what the government thinks is appropriate, which is not fair.

            The government does not make decisions on what health care is given. You are thinking of Insurance companies in the US, that will not cover expensive procedures or the myth of death panels making decisions. Doctors make the decisions what is needed at each hospital. Not some board of directors, but each individual doctors does what ever he deems is necessary for each situation. Government officials do not make medical decisions. That is a myth given out from the US Medical industry. Again, I know it is difficult for you, but look at the movie, “Sicko” everything that they said about, Canadian, British, French and Cuban hospitals was true. It was not a conspiracy. That is how medicine is handled world wide. It is only in the USA where it is done for profit and that is why the costs are sky high.

            (snip) Yes, health care as a profession is rewarding, but it should also be lucrative.

            In Canada it is lucrative. Nurses are underpaid everywhere for the thankless job that they do. But it is relative. I think in the USA the lower jobs are not what you would call .lucrative. The CEO’s, board members, administrators and rocket scientist doctors get huge fortunes. The average workers do not. How lucrative does it have to be? Is 4 years in med school worth more than a $400,000.00 income? Should it be a million dollars? Who is to decide. How about the market. An Architect also goes to college the same time as a doctor. How about them? Do you want to pay for these salaries?

            (snip) Everything that insurance pays for is more expensive than paying for it yourself, because the insurer incurs administrative costs and is entitled to a profit.”

            How about removing the whole insurance level out of the system? This whole level of profit taking is why the insurance rates are high. You will always pay more if you pay more out of your pocket, then if it was a volume covered procedure, by people working on salaries. It does not have to run that way. The Universal system is in all of the rest of the world. It is only in the USA that medicine is run for profit. Like everywhere competition keeps costs low. How much leverage do you have when you are dieing and you either pay the high costs presented to you or die? Is that fair negotiating for services rendered? They have you over a barrel. That is why thousands of citizens have gone bankrupt or lost their homes from a simple case of getting sick or having an accident. This does not happen in the rest of the world. Only in the USA does this happen. what is today, while crossing the road, you get hit by a car and break every bone in your body. You will need more than a year of healing and care. How much will it cost you? Will your insurance stop paying when it passes $100,000.00? Only in the USA does this happen. No where else. Be honest. Do you worry about this?

            (snip) Yes, the most abstinent of us will love paying for the thousands of condoms required by the least abstinent. Exactly.

            You make a big deal of abortions. How much does an abortion cost? What is the cost of a young teenage girl getting pregnant and how her life changes? The cost (at cost, not marked up) of condoms is nothing. It reduces cost of overall healthcare. Organizations like family planning can look after that. Oh yeah, the GOP congress want to stop funding for these type of social organizations. Cut a few million for something that will reduce health costs and put more money into the Defense Dept. Where are your priorities?

            (snip) Furthermore, there is a steep moral cost to taking responsibility out of the hands of adults and putting it in the hands of the government.”

            Again. There are not death panels. Doctors make all of the decisions. In the current medical system, a greedy HMO and executive is making the decision. I do not know about you, I do not want my life in the hands of a executive that is thinking of the money coming out of his pocket, for every procedure that he allows. really? Who do you want to make decisions on what care you and your family will get?

            (snip) aying, that “taxes should be raised on this group, and not that group”, remember that you are talking about theft.”

            What has happened over the decades is that the wealthy have found many loopholes and exemptions that have made their taxes much lower than say a working family making $50,000 a year. Mitt paid 13% with his income of millions and middle class families pay closer to 36% or more. they do not have expensive accountants or cayman Island banks. they have been getting too many breaks and as a result their incomes have gone up and the middle class incomes have come down. So this is just leveling the playing field. Yes how about everyone just pay the same percentage and get rid of all loop holes. That would be fair. Mitt wanted to give the 1% tax breaks. that would amount to taxes repaid up hundreds of thousands of dollars. For a middle class family it would mean paying a few thousand more. the tax breaks that Mitt would have gotten would have been more than 100% of most middle class families.

            (snip) Federal taxes raised in the US and spent in the US is not redistribution,”

            What I was saying that the Right Wing complain and wrongly call the left wing and democrats as takers. In reality, the Blue states all have paid more money into the federal coffers and the Red States have taken more than they paid into the system. This is what government does. This is what you like to call “Redistribution” This is trying to make it sound evil and unjust. It is what government does even when Bush and Reagan were presidents. So please stop demonizing the government paying for things that level the playing field or as in FEMA, they help areas that have had bad tragedy. So to call the left as takers and the right as makers is in fact turned around. I would not press that point.

            (snip) Raising taxes on you to give money to me, that’s redistribution. Raising taxes on people who work to give money to people who won’t, that’s just crazy. People respond to incentives. If you tax work you’ll get less of it. If you pay laziness you’ll get more of it. ”

            Yes I agree with you. But if a factory closes because the factory has been shipped to China. For the people to get unemployment insurance is not evil and bad. The last 4 years have been bad with a lot of unemployment. It is a good social plan for the government to assist in these transitions. Where the truly lazy people never want to work , I agree they should not be paid. But you never know when you will be in that situation. What is some one in your family just got diagnosed with Cancer? You might be the one that will need some help in the future. That is what makes The USA and other well to do countries great is that they help the unfortunate. Isn’t that what all of the religious people here believe in? Isn’t it right and moral to give a helping hand to the unfortunate. Isn’t this the Christian way?

            I also have enjoyed your replies. thanks for your civil discourse. I hope that we met again. I cannot take the time to make these long replies. It does take a long time. But your replies warranted a full reply.

            warm regards

            Nick Cz

          • http://gravatar.com/dalene44 dalene44

            There is an aggressive campaign to turn citizens against the NRA and the second amendment. Holder called it a need to “brainwash” the public. The sooner we’re disarmed the sooner the power elite can take over and everyone will wish we had our guns back.
            Incidentally crime rises when guns are banned:Chicago, DC and Oakland are obvious but in Australia where guns were confiscated armed robbery, home invasions and rape make the crime rate even higher than Europe’s highest crime country, England. Yes, our crime is lower.
            http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1196941/The-violent-country-Europe-Britain-worse-South-Africa-U-S.html#ixzz2HBEojRRV

          • http://N/A CintiCB

            If Obama, in his wisdom, was REALLY concerned about guns/gun violence he would do something about the main gun problem-ghetto gangers. They (the literate ones, anyway) voted for him EN MASSE , so why would he ‘punish’ them by letting citizens defend themselves during home invasions, carjackings, muggings, armed robberies, ETC.

            It’s the same with the so called ‘entitlements’. The only ones that are threatened are the ones who have paid into it for their entire lives! Welfare in NOT EVEN MENTIONED!!!

          • Irish Love

            AWWWWWWWWWWWWWW YOU are tellin the TRUTH!! I wanna ask for an “amen” right now!! WTG…. cut to the chase Darlin!!

          • http://N/A CintiCB

            Your reply is a nice surprise. I, kind of, expected to hear ‘victim’ whining. Anyway, what do the initials WTG mean? W-probably, stands for What and the T-The. I can’t figure out the G. Thanks, CB.

          • Irish Love

            WTG = Way To Go!! I loved ya!!

          • Nick Czudy

            dalene.
            Thanks for the link. I looked at it. It was very interesting. It showed our country to the north, that we usually think of as milk toasts to be 5th or 6th in crime. The US did not make the top ten.
            The kill list was close though to what has been claimed by Piers Morgan and I have seem repeated here as wrong many times.
            What I got out of it, was there were more crimes there, but less fatalities. It reminds me of the incident in China where a disgruntled and loon went in to a school and knifed over 20 children. Similar incident as in Sandy Hook School. The only difference is that there were no fatalities in that incident. The difference was that Sandy Hook had a loon that had more lethal weapons.

            the USA is a unique country as it has the most guns in the world. How has it been so far? There have been around 12,000 deaths in 2011.
            I do not think that has been that good.
            Can we do better?
            How about a debate with facts and not emotions and politics?
            How about a fair discourse with out biased lobbies infecting the result?
            How about a debate on just the points that Obama has made in his 23 points?
            Can we debate those points and not what the fear mongers have spooked everyone with?
            EVERYONEs GUNS WILL NOT BE TAKEN AWAY!!

          • Irish Love

            DAMN Nick……. WTF……. do you really NOT see what she is talking about???? C’mon Lad I use to admire YOU!! lol

          • Bob666

            Nick,
            your efforts are gallent, but take away the following three:

            How about a debate with facts and not emotions and politics?
            How about a fair discourse with out biased lobbies infecting the result?
            How about a debate on just the points that Obama has made in his 23 points?

            And their three legged stool is just a piece of wood laying on the floor.

          • Nick Czudy

            Hi Bob,. You said….”Nick,
            your efforts are gallent, but take away the following three:

            How about a debate with facts and not emotions and politics?
            How about a fair discourse with out biased lobbies infecting the result?
            How about a debate on just the points that Obama has made in his 23 points?”

            WHY?

          • Nick Czudy

            Ho Robert. I do not know about her being a Israel lover, and that does not make any difference. She is extreme. She believes that the earth is about 10 to 14,000 years old and that man was intermingling with the dinosaurs. She wants this to be taught in our schools and to outlaw Darwinism. She takes bad info and about inoculations and blurts it out without any research. She demonizes people as being Muslims in the white house and causes a lot of problems. She injects her religious beliefs into the government. She makes up conspiracies and caused some problems for our diplomatic corps. She is good looking but is an air head. People like this should not be in our government, shaping policies that will govern Americans. We need Congressmen and women that do intelligent research and use this to make sound decisions. Nut jobs, should not be governing us. Just my opinion.

          • http://twitter.com/deftdaft Robert Taylor (@deftdaft)

            You obviously haven’t studied her very much…perhaps too much sloganeering. She’s said repeated how infatuated with Israel she is…as did Romney.

          • Nick Czudy

            Robert. So what. Come to think about it, I do recall her talk of Israel. But that is a common theme in the GOP. They all are infatuated with Israel and the Israel y lobby. That does not make her extreme. She has so many other bizarre ideas. Nick

          • dianiline

            What scares me is the people that feel that they need to amass weapons to protect against the government, police and any appointed or elected authority. regards Nick Cz

            Hi Nick,

            That is exactly what the second amendment means, though. It is the people who uphold the Constitution who scare you.

            Dianiline

      • Kate8

        navyjr – The only reason the JBS were called extreme was because they were warning of the encroachment and infiltration of communist factions in our government.

        My in-laws were JBers and, at the time, I thought they were nuts. But then, I was young and more liberal at the time. Since then, everything they warned about has come to pass.

        The Left has made an art form out of ridiculing those who tell the truth. They didn’t want us to see what was really happening in America, because their success depended upon us not seeing it. Anyone who spoke of “communism” was labeled a loon, so people became silent as the enemy took over every American institution as well as our government.

        Now, here we are, a one-party system. The Right has been successfully neutered and now bows to the Left. We have no more statesmen, no heros, no one who even listens to the voice of the people.

        BTW, I just ran across this message from a soldier. He sees that war is brewing on American soil, and that soon our worst fears will be realized. I strongly suggest that any Lefties here read it, as well, as much of it is directed to the oblivious.

        It’s time to take a stand.

        http://ncrenegade.com/editorial/a-time-to-kill/

        • navyjr

          i know; I grew up with that being “taught” me also about the JBS. They were crazy like foxes. That link you posted is spot on as well; we are facing a very real shooting war on OUR soil, any day now.. I’ve been seeing the indications for well over a year too…

      • Vicki

        Left vs right. All illusion. The REAL political spectrum is 100% vs limited vs 0% government.
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4r0VUybeXY
        It’s only about 10 min long but well describes the fallacy of the left vs right paradigm.

      • Gordon

        Wow Nick…… your thinking is totally screwed up. You’d be humorous if it weren’t so pathetic.

    • http://www.facebook.com/benjamin.fox.98892 Benjamin Fox

      I was a demo-rat for years until, I realized everything God said, the demo-rats hate, so I became a Republican and then the Tea Party and I’m considered a terrorist by the marxist left? I served in the Marine Corps for 12 years, to protect the rights of even the left to say what they want but, I took a oath and took it seriously that I would defend the Constitution from those without and those within. Obozo has gone against the Constitution at every move, if he writes a EO against guns, that is destroying the Constitutional Right of a free people and I will defend the Constitution over all those marxist who would have voted for Hitler if he was alive. They are the name callers but, try to attack those who disagree with them, they are the haters of real freedoms and prove it every day. They want to control the marxist plantation and have already dumbed people down to become dependent on them and the government on that plantation. Many say they don’t want to be slaves again, so why do they vote for a person who wants to destroy what makes us free and disarm us as Hitler did to enforce that control and power? “Live Free or Die” isn’t just a saying just like once a Marine, always a Marine. I for one won’t live on the plantation of the marxist demo-rats and if they want to call names that is fine, I consider the source and it is all evil and demonic and they are the children who took God out of the schools so that evil could replace him and it is they that made it open season on the children, not guns, not citizens, it was there evil all along. Obozo said if gun control would save just one person it is worth it, that has been said on the left for years while evil run unchecked. If they really believed that they would be against abortion which kills babies without a gun. They lie and don’t care, they cheer ever thing evil. A Congressman gets caught sleep with a underaged teen and asked her to bring a friend next time and he gets a standing ovation in the Congress by all the leftist. Slick Willie used his power to have sex in the Peoples Office, Obozo has been proven to be a homosexual and he champions homosexual life styles. Wake up people, your on the plantation, it’s a matter if you wish to stay on it or be free, it’s a choice one that is used to take life, only this time the choice is to save life. Yours.

      • navyjr

        Semper Fi, Marine! Your wisdom is true also.

      • Nick Czudy

        Mr Fox, I assume that when you say Obozo, you are being cute in cutting up the president. I really just says that you are biased and small minded and tells us that your writings will be rants and not to have any credence. I assume that you are a god fearing, homo hating, bigamist. Can you tell me the proof that Obama is a homo -sexual. You have proof on this and it is not that you are just repeating Right Wing bubble rants?

        I am not aware of a Congressman that had sex with an underaged girl, Please enlighten me.. So Bill Clinton got a blow job in his office. Big deal. You don’t like getting blow jobs?
        You said ” Obozo has gone against the Constitution at every move,” where had Obama gone against the constitution? I am not aware of anything. You do not mean the 2nd amendment. He has not done anything against the 2nd. It just seems that everything that you have said is right wing heresay and it is a pile of bull. Prove your paranoia.

      • Gordon

        Look up “infringed”.

        • Bob666

          Gordon,
          look up “regulated”

      • Irish Love

        RIGHT ON Lad……….. TELL the TRUTH… NO BS anymore!! I am lovin it!!! GOD BLESS AMERICA & YOUR SERVICE!!!

    • Matrix

      The Democratic party of the 60s is now the communist party of our time, as the republican party of the 60s is now the Democratic Party.

      General Powel stated today, as many before him, “If the Republican Party wants to be a player in the future, they must change with the demographics.”

      That being said, these corruptors are transforming America into one devilish party by allowing all sorts of illegal immigration and by creating impoverished dependants of our middleclass.

      Those who are dependent on government will be the first executed as in Russia, China, Germany and any nation falling to an anti-God, anti-human form of government.

      We as Americans come together now as a people and impeach the most divisive president and the most corrupt government in the history of this once great nation, or continue to be slowly exterminated and lose the only hope for freedom in the world!

      • navyjr

        “Changing with the demographics” is code for abandoning our morals; and that is something we MUST NOT do; there’s far too much amorality now, and it’s at the root of the rest of the woes in this nation! On the other side of the coin we the people can’t impeach Obama, and the Congress who could do so WILL NOT! Neither will Chief Justice{?} Roberts do so even if the Senate WOULD hear the proceedings and declare him guilty! But since they’re all in the pockets of the CFR, and the CFR wants O in office, that’s where he’ll stay, ’til they’re done with him and then, I suspect he’ll die suddenly and mysteriously. He’s too much of a loose cannon to keep around when they’ve finished using him.

        • Nick Czudy

          Navy Jr. Farrrrrrrr out. You are really wacked out. what is it that Obama did that he needs to be impeached. Can we impeach all of the GOP right wing to impeding our progress? Who is the CFR? You lost me there. thanks Nick Cz

          • navyjr

            Start with major fraud and go from there; the list would choke a giraffe!

          • Nick Czudy

            Navy, What is the major fraud. I will make it easy for you. Just name three things. thanks Nick

          • navyjr

            Fraudulent “certification” to elitigiblity; fraudulent claim of citizenship at all, fraudulent “registration” at selective service; fraudulent use of over 80 SSNs, and then there are the multiple counts of straight up treason against this nation, the Constitution you claim to follow, and from there it goes madly downhill! And don’t even try telling me a single one of those “documents” he showed was legitimate. His last known citizenship is INDONESIAN and he’s never been a US citizen; even the Kenyan Parliamentary record shows he was born in KENYA, not HI!

          • Nick Czudy

            Navy Jr. Ok I see, all of the grevious wrongs that justifies Obama to be impeached is due to the birther issue. OK. Now I know what I am dealing with. I would think that you and your fellow beleivers would have obtained and circulated this Kenyan document showing his real birth. Can I see it? I have seen the official hawaiian birth certificate. It looks pretty authentic. I would think with the way that the right wing GOP in congress would have taken this document and had it vetted intensively. They oppose everything that they can. If they could have found any problems with Obama , they would have. They have resources that none of us have. Can you give me some of these “multiple counts of straight up treason against this nation, the Constitution?” I am not aware of any. I am trying to take your opinion seriously. Is it pure hate that drives you and your followers to rant about this issue without any proof? thanks Nick

      • Vicki

        Let us reset our moral compass.

        First Principle: Your Creator gifted you with Life and free will. How you use these gifts and how you honor these gifts in others is how you shall be judged.

  • Warrior

    NY, LA, Chicago, DC, Detroit. All broke and run by “progressives”. Need anyone say more. Blue will have you feeling “Blue”. Good story: So two years ago, IL increases state taxes 66% (yes 66%) because the state has $8.2 bil in unpaid bills (deadbeats?). Well today, the state has over $9 bil in unpaid bills and it’s credit rating is being lowered again. Let’s see now, the prez received his political education in crook county. Does anyone REALLY believe this regime is fiscally responsible? REALLY?

    • redhawk

      I lived in Illinois through my childhood years and went to college there. I can also claim to have been a democratic leaning individual for a good part of my life. The schools taught me to me a progressive thinker and that through science and new ways of doing things we would come to the “promised land”. I was proud to see “Star Wars” come into existance as a defendive policy and gave a lot of credit to the system that allowed it develop. I even credited the government with the collapse of the Soviet Union because that system just couldn’t keep up with real unhibited thinking fresh ideas of the capatalistic system. George Bush, Sr. didn’t seem too far off the mark but there were things that just didn’t seem right be he seemed at least in touch with America and really wanted his “thousand points of light”. It was in the Clinton years that I really became to question progressive ideology and after the absolute nonsense at Wack, Texas and worse at Ruby Ridgemy allegiance began to change and startyed to think about how the supreme law of the land fit into the values of both sides. I was happy to see the Billary administration go and embraced George Bush, the younger. But the terrible things that happened during that administration once again set me on a course of disillusionnment. Today, neither party appeals to me as the all seem to be looking out for their own best interests. In my home state of Illinois, I have seen elected officials jailed for their actions while the state slid further and further into bebt. I left there in 1985 and am only sorry because much of my family is still there. But the political machinations there were apparently a forerunner to the national scene. Call me a right wing nut if you want but I do beleive in our Constitution and still beleive it can point the way to recovery in dark times, if we will only honor it.

      The meaning of the second ammendment has been tested again and again in the courts and its relevance to personal ownership of firearms upheld every time. Last time byonly a 5 to 4 decision. I am sick to death of a system now seeks to denegrate that time honored document and replace it presidential decrees, special interests and spends our tax money like its their personal lottery winnings. 200 million on first family vacations? Billions of tax dollars on the likes of GM, AIG and Solyndra? So much pork in hurricane refeif that even a cursory glance makes it unbeleivable.And this was all approved by congress? Now I understand we’ve been spending more money by far that we take in and they want even more? Who the hell is minding the store? Washington has become a den of theives and murders and parallels with similar fast moving regeimes with fiat moey systems are becoming clear. Now, by presidential decree, they want to take infrnge on a basic right of self protection because some stupid kid with serious mental problems used an inanimate object to kill others. This is madness and it appears that there is no end in sight.Well, my end has come and am VERY critical and VERY distrustful of those who walk the halls of power. They now want to at least restrict my ability to own guns or even give them up entirely? What they hell? It ain’t gonna happen. Pass any “law”, make any decree do whatever you want. It’s just not happening. If I could find a way to close my checkbook to these theives I woulod do that, too. Where is the “Evil Empire” these days? That evil is loose in America and unchecked. I reel with sickness when thinking about how it happened in my lifetime! A bumper sticker I recently saw comes to mind, “Don’t vote! It just encourages the Bastards!” Got a chuckle out of then……. now I know what it meant!

      • Bill

        Hi Redhawk,
        Is your name based upon the model of Ruger that you like?

      • http://google rose

        From what I’m seeing from media footage and photos. I seriously do not think that there was a mass shooting in Sandy Hooks. I believe that it was staged and not in the least bit real I will not fall for the propaganda. How is it that a website was set up on December 11, 2012 for donations for the victims of Sandy Hooks shootings, when it didn’t happen until December 14, 2012. Everybody needs to google. this and see for themselves before the government removes it. Also photos of people who supposedly were killed during the shootings who were photographed after the shootings. You can’t fake this stuff. Google Emille Parkers name. Photos of her with Obama two days after the shooting, the aunt who can’t get it straight weather Emilee had two younger or bigger sisters, the news clip of her Dad laughing and then psyching himself out to give an emotional news statement. People better wake up before it is too late. Obama will most likely make an executive order to take away the right to bear arms.

    • Robert Smith

      “NY, LA, Chicago, DC, Detroit. All broke and run by “progressives”. ”

      Really?

      Don’t you think in places like Detroit where CORPORATIONS have moved jobs to China so they can make more money have had an impact?

      It’s GREED that has undermined much of America.

      Rob

      • Steve E

        Speaking of greed. AT&T and Microsoft are big donors of the Presidential 2013 inauguration. I wonder what favors they will get from the government in return. I bet it’s government contracts.

      • Liberty Lover

        Or they have moved those jobs to right-to-work states that favor individual freedom and thus lean Republican.

      • BillB

        The corporations didn’t move those jobs to Asia.The unions produced carts that were too expensive and less reliable than foreign cars. The American car buyers voted with their dollars and the unions didn’t adapt. So our government changed the game by rewarding the unions with a bailout with your tax money for lousy performance. Our government is developing a pattern of handouts to irresponsible companies like GM and Solyndra. But then look at the campaign cash and votes they get back!

      • navyjr

        You sound JUST like my kid brother; so far off the mark it’s really disturbing to see you posting, simply because some may actually believe your lies and errors! First, every baby is a genetically complete and separate human being at the moment of conception, so abortion IS murder of an innocent; and there IS no such thing as a “simple” medical procedure; WOMEN DIE during abortions too, far more often than the media or Planned Parenthood will admit! Maybe morality can’t be legislated, but BEHAVIOR certainly can be! And if you want to know who drove those jobs off shore LOOK to your UNIONS; they forced the conditions onto the corporations which left the the alternative of folding entirely and hurting even MORE people in the doing, or moving to a friendlier climate in which to operate. STOP spewing the regurgitated leftist propaganda and try thinking with the BRAIN God gave you, for a change; you might be surprised at what you’d see more clearly!

      • JC

        Robert Smith says:

        January 15, 2013 at 9:02 am

        “NY, LA, Chicago, DC, Detroit. All broke and run by “progressives”. ”

        Really?

        Don’t you think in places like Detroit where CORPORATIONS have moved jobs to China so they can make more money have had an impact?

        It’s GREED that has undermined much of America.

        Rob
        ________________________________________________________________________

        I don’t necessarily disagree with you, but I’d like to point out that Unions and Welfare played their part in Detroit as well. You can’t dump non English speaking immigrants in one place for 30 years and expect the place not to change. You can’t keep pandering to Union demands and expect the companies not to move on to greener pastures…especially when you tax the hell out of them too.

        Greed? yeah it plays a part…in the motivation of everything that “produces”.

      • DaveH

        [comment has been edited] Robert:
        Robert says — “Don’t you think in places like Detroit where CORPORATIONS have moved jobs to China so they can make more money have had an impact?
        It’s GREED that has undermined much of America”.

        No Robert, it’s not Greed. It’s common sense. Why would any business person want to continue to have their wealth stolen by Greedy Liberal Progressives, when they can move to a more hospitable environment?

        If you don’t like what they’ve done, then pool your monies with your equally Greedy and ignorant fellow Liberal Progressives, and show us how it should be done by starting your own companies. You know, Robert, do something unusual for Liberal Progressives — Put your money where your mouth is.

      • GALT

        Ah, so it would appear that “crony capitalists” are now DavidH’s hero’s.

        Robert, didn’t I tell you, that of you followed the ” ad hominem” KING,
        he would eventually contradict everything he has said…..and that you could
        construct and entire argument, simply by quoting DavidH v. DavidH?

    • Irish Love

      I HEAR YA DARLIN! Incredible huh!!??

      • Patriot

        Now, wait for either the smug, dry, superior comments of your BamaBuddies, telling you how those numbers are cooked up by right wing nuts, or when they are unable to refute them, they ignore the comments entirely. Watch these message boards for awhile and the obvious patterns emerge. Those are tactics #1 and #2. #3 is where you get the attempts at insults and sarcasm. I say ‘attempts’ because so far I haven’t seen anything that was worth more than a yawn and some pity.

        • Irish Love

          OH YEAH….. I see all these percentages thrown around about this & that and I am wondering who the hell is taking all these surveys becuz no info of the source is provided. I truly appreciate your STRAIGHT-UP no nonsense responses………. I am sooooooo tired of the “smoke & mirrors” the extreme Left provide in order to make a point. FACTS are FACTS…… TRUTH is TRUTH….. however, both can be manipulated to support a cause. I choose to believe the forefathers INTENT for this GREAT Nation and OUR Constitution!!

  • flopsflops@yahoo.com

    It is too late for the blame game … Our hyper-pro-Israel policies got us into Afghanistan (Osama Bin Laden said the attack was revenge for the Palestinians) and Jewish advisors around Zionist George W. Bush got us into Gulf War Two.The Jews of Wall Street fleeced this country to enrich themselves. Total price tag for the Jews? Ten trillion dollars. So what does it matter now … Democrat or Republican … we’re sinking as a nation.

    • Warrior

      Hmmm, Big Pharma likes opium and Big Oil likes…. oil! Sound strategy, wouldn’t you say?

    • navyjr

      First of all, Osama was another “tool”, the whole MB is, in fact, of the PTB, second, at the time of the attack, Osama claimed it was in revenge over Americans “defiling” their “holy lands” in pushing Hussein back out of Kuwait. But either one is nothing more than a facade excuse; they were following the orders of those above them, all part of the vast NWO plans! Thankfully there’s another plan at work as well… because the NWO bunch is too near their goal to be stopped by us now!

    • manuel rosa

      you should listen to the freedom fighter cause thats a wise well informed individual.
      It is the new world order communist take over and the government wants to disarm the people to recuce the blood shed.
      they will come for your gun one of these days and if you don’t surrender they will kill you.
      there is no more justice in the system. If you want you can fight for your dignity as our forefathers did when they fought for freedom. just maike sure you take a banch of goons when they come for you. don’t let them take you cheap. Honor Yourself!

      • Kate8

        manuel – I agree with you except for the part of them wanting to reduce the bloodshed.

        It’s blood they want…OURS. Once disarmed, we would be slaughtered.

        There are hundreds of thousands of guillotines waiting at the FEMA camps. Death by beheading best preserves the organs for transplant and experimentation.

      • GALT

        Kate, they have no reason to do that…….they have everything they want,
        you are in “eternal debt”, you have “free market” labor, you have an economy
        whose primary means of generating profit and source of jobs, is directed
        at poisoning you, sickening you and killing you, slowly and expensively,
        while you clamour for more of it………and blame the people who are not
        employed by it, as the cause of your problems………why would they possibly
        care if you have guns…….you do not know whom to shoot, you are not
        organized…….and you are wasting all your energy, posturing about how you
        are going to “die” when they come for your guns…….they know where you
        are and you are no threat.

        Seriously, what possible reason do they have to be concerned.

        And forget the “slavery” thing……debt is a stronger chain and far cheaper,
        and YOU are picking up the tab.

      • Kate8

        GALT – All true, but the bottom line is, they are already past their endgame timeline, and they want FAR FEWER of us to manage. The soft kill methods have paid off for them very nicely, but now they want their personal paradise with only enough of us to serve them.

        To disarm is to disempower, as much on a psychological level as a mortal one. It’s all about fear and dominance. They have the ability to wipe us out with or without guns.

        It’s a great game to them, and they love watching us bite on every bit of scare media they throw out there. It’s all about keeping us confused and attacking each other.

        GALT, you’ve already made it clear that you don’t think the NWO exists, nor do you believe there are conspiracies afoot. You don’t believe in anything beyond the realm of matter and appearances, so there is no point in going any further with why I see things as I do.

      • GALT

        You’re absolutely right Kate…..I don’t pay fees, fines or taxes, I have laughed at
        judges in courtrooms, taped the IRS, have a secret service file and live in
        plain sight…….so yes, complex international conspiracies regarding whatever
        you are concerned about don’t make much of an impression.

        Whatever you imagine the goal is, you will do it to yourselves and it will
        be self inflicted…….you are killing yourselves now…..simply by lifestyle
        choices…….and while you are all prepare to die to defend your guns,
        the person you are most likely to kill, is a person seeking warmth….or
        food……and since you are primed for killing something…….your imagination
        will do the rest.

        We can’t kill people fast enough and if population is the concern, bullets
        aren’t the answer…….

        If “these conspirators” thought you were capable of “reason” or
        “revolt”……..I would have been DEAD a long time ago.

        “To conquer, first DIVIDE!” ( and then HANG, separately. )

      • Kate8

        GALT – I have to agree with everything you just said. In fact, I couldn’t have said it better.

        What you describe is nothing less than… wait for it… A GRAND CONSPIRACY!!!

        The word “conspiracy” does not imply fiction. It simply means that two or more persons conspire to manipulate the course of events toward some goal.

        I have never claimed to have the answers. All I have is some clues from years of digging and observation. All I really know is that nothing is as it seems, and that we are hapless sheep.

        Good for you for figuring out how to remove yourself from the system. It takes guts.

        • Ted Keller

          Sorry to say that your site comes with too much data, and for that reason please cancel my subscription!!!!!!!!!!!!

          On Thu, Jan 17, 2013 at 10:05 AM, Personal Liberty Digest™ wrote:

          > ** > Kate8 commented: “GALT – I have to agree with everything you just said. > In fact, I couldn’t have said it better. What you describe is nothing less > than… wait for it… A GRAND CONSPIRACY!!! The word “conspiracy” does not > imply fiction. It simply means that two or” >

        • Ted Keller

          *Good morning to all who know me and to those who aren’t so sure. My name is Ted Keller and I am trying to bring awareness of a hideous practice that is going on right in our own back yard, literally. The idea that slavery is in the distant past in our society is false. It exists today right under our own noses and we have ignored it for too long. Little children, pre-teens and teens are being sold into the sex trade and pornographic business every day. Right here in the USA there are estimated 300,000 children being tortured, traumatized, victimized, sodomized, and then discarded (murdered) as they outgrow their worth to the sick minded people who commit these heinous crimes against these helpless children. Won’t you join me, no matter where you are living, and try your best to make more people aware and committed to eradicate this miserable practice from the face of this earth. It won’t happen over night, but with your input, it will be a start. If only 1% of the people you forward this e-mail to will react in a positive way, this could go viral, and be a message to those criminals that we are watching!*

      • GALT

        Kate……you are familiar with the saying that the “only way three people can keep
        a secret is if two of them are dead?”

        We have spoken briefly regarding this and that, and I can find no fault with you,
        in that you seek to “do no harm”.

        At this point in my life, I have found no other standard by which to judge or
        cooperate with anyone, except by this one.

        We the living are faced with the ultimate test of our character and meaning of it
        all, not in our ability to do the right thing, but in determining what the right thing,
        IS.

        Sadly, we may err, for whatever reason, but who is to say the right or
        wrong of it?

        But what standard can we judge, should we judge?

        First, seek, to do no harm?

        Now I admit, this may be the highest standard of all, almost impossible
        to make sense of, or comply with………

        BUT….if you comprehend and agree……..it shouldn’t be difficult, for those
        the who share this “philosophy” to be able to discern this intent in others?

        ( NOT a rhetorical question )

  • Jim B

    I have posted similarly before that the United States government plutocracy has created a bureaucracy beyond anything imaginable just a few short years ago. Make no mistake, the government for the people, by the people is corrupted, an inept criminal organization whose primary function is to usurp the earnings and wealth from the citizens of this once great nation. This government is now a lawless organization and the worst of the worst, more ruthless than any known mafia or terrorist organization, more corrupt than any Ponzi schemer could have ever devise, and the largest extortionist organization ever to exist, or be imagined on the planet. The United States decent will be the fastest in all historical times. This is the state we now live in, this from a country that had no equal just a few short years ago, whose liberties and freedoms where the envy of all the world. And now, we rank 17th in the world’s freest nations. And even though they have stolen from its people hundreds of Trillions of dollars in our short history, they have amassed a debt of 16.5 Trillion in debt, that’s over 50,000 dollars for every man, women and child (perhaps some unborn as well) living in this country. But the credit card has run out, they, for untold countless time, need another infusion of money that no one has and so another fraud is about to be perpetrated on the American populous once again. They will counterfeit (create money from nothing), in order to pay for the socialist bureaucracy which they have created for themselves, of which no citizen can benefit from.

    The second amendment was created not so we can own a gun to hunt and feed our families, it was created to protect us from government tyranny, ours or anyone else’s. We need no more evidence, the once land of the free, has been expunged from our history (in less than a few decades) and we will suffer dearly for that grave misstep, of over trusting our government to do the right thing. The time may be soon, they are desperate to keep what they stole, and that makes them very dangerous. God help us, for it will take a divine intervention to stop the tyranny that has bestowed itself upon us.

    • Steve E

      My brother works pretty high up in the Washington bureaucracy. He tells me that all the bureaucrats in DC laugh at the American people as to what fools they are for allowing this racket to keep going on. Even the bureaucrats in DC know how corrupt the system is. They won’t admit it to the people, but they will admit it secretly to other fellow bureaucrats.

      • Flashy

        Steve E … methinks you tell a tall tale.

      • DaveH

        Flashshill,
        Do you have any evidence to back up such slander?

      • Steve E

        No tales here. My brother is a G15 level 10 government employee for DHS, and he doesn’t lie to me.

      • Chuck S

        Co9uld you name some of those abuses? Maybe ones that are big, flagrant, and/or easy for people to understand.

      • JC

        I absolutely believe that Steve.
        You would have to be incredibly naieve about Government and Bureaucrats…not to.

      • eddie47d

        Steve E ; That doesn’t say much about your brothers credibility now does it?

      • http://N/A CintiCB

        As I said to a friend yesterday, “If I was in history class learning about what is going on, right now, I’d be thinking, why in the hell didn’t anyone do anything about it!?!” Starting with the three guys, who were in some kind of homosexual group with Obama in college, who turned up dead right before the first election. Including the Mafia like threat to a polling place (Gallop, I think-not sure) when they didn’t like the numbers that were being reported. Someone from Os’ administration told them to change the numbers, regardless of what the real numbers were. Mafia part; The call was concluded with, “You have a REAL nice polling company. It would be terrible to see something bad happen to it!” This is a threat. There are many other things, too. A business owner insulted (or donated to the other side-O got ‘revenge’ on both-two diff. cases + two diff. ‘punishments’) Obama, so, Mr. Mafia sicked the IRS on the guy with ‘trumped up’ charges. He/his business had never had any problems with the IRS, the law, or anything. This has, so far, cost him hundreds of thousands in legal fees. Hell, I wouldn’t be a bit surprised if these mass shootings, of late, have been orchestrated (? drugs, threats, blackmail, payoff, or mind control-note the bulging eyes on both the theater + school shooters) by the Oval Office narcissist (have to get ‘my way’ NO MATTER what happens to anyone else ie: so what if a few parents lose their child-I MUST get what I want!!!). I thought that this could have accounted for the reporting of the shooting BEFORE IT HAPPENED. Now, having recently heard a different theory of why/how it was reported before it happened (that the whole thing was fabricated), I don’t know which it is. Maybe
        they’re just psychic (sarcastic).

        As far as printing money-how stupid are they!!?!! I was taught, IN GRADE SCHOOL, that if the gov. just prints more money, when it needs it, this would create more of a problem as it would lead to inflation. My young mind, at the time, could not comprehend why. I understand, now. Apparently, the geniuses in Os’ little club have the same brain power as a fifth or six grader!

        WE ARE IN TROUBLE!!
        WHERE ARE THE HEROES?
        WE DESPERATELY NEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEED ONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    • navyjr

      You, sir, are the first person I’ve come across who has actually recognized the extent of the destruction wrought on this nation, sufficiently to see that we the people can’t stop or turn it, that it requires direct Divine intervention. And that is where we are; all those rights we took such pride in, that some think are being taken now; have been nothing but a convenient illusion under which we’ve been living for well over a century, at least, while the “leaders” have been quietly setting all this in place behind our backs; and those are NOT in the US or in the least concerned with our Constitution except as it’s stumbling block to their objectives; as is the Nation of Israel, both of which must be eliminated, in order to achieve their ultimate goals!

    • manuel rosa

      Hey Jim what can I tell you. You said it better than I could ever say it. The qwestion is we are stock with it at the moment and what if any can we do about it.
      a democrat on Sawn Hanity asked what’s wrong with moving the retirement age to 70?
      I’d like to ask that democrat. What’s wrong with the democrats pay back social security the money that Linden Johnson stole from it.
      CONCLUSION: Get the thieves out of washington and every thing well take care of itself.

      • navyjr

        This is a much larger problem than the crooks in our government; it’s a global conspiracy, which has been being worked seriously since the 1540s; with a goal now in clear sight, to their minds… a mere 5 years down the road from now. I honestly don’t believe we, the people could stop it now, even if we had the organization with which to do so, as our Founders did when they opposed the Powers of their day; and which we DO NOT have today. I honestly believe the ONLY way this will be stopped is by direct Divine intervention. And I believe there IS a “counter plan” in operation as well as the evil one we’re seeing unfold so clearly now.

    • manuel rosa

      I have a plan that will straighten the whole mass up faster than Obama ever knew what hit him and without bloodshed but there is a sacrifice. the sacrifice is you have to take a short vacation without pay.. This plan worked in my old country and destroyed the communist take over. It will work even better in the Usa cause of some laws that are still in place and the communist take over in the USA is not as advanced yet as it was in my old country..
      If your interested in restoring our constitution to freedom and as the constitution was intended by our forefathers and return the USA to the proud loveliness that it once enjoyed while washington tirany goes down the drain.

      If anyone is interested email me in private at manuellrosa@att.net

      • manuel rosa

        there is of course no charge and no donations are needed at this time. however if we develop into the size of organization that is required to excecute the plan then expenses will start running in the thousands and a voluntary donation will eventually be needed to cover the expenses as the plan is being excecuted.

  • Flashy

    “The Republican Party was to me a perfect sort of monster. It had everything: corporate puppet masters, warmongering zealots, fake Christians, Orwellian social policies. The George W. Bush years were a special kind of horror. It was cinematic. Shakespearian. If I were to tell a story of absolute villainy, I would merely describe the mass insanity and bloodlust days of doom and dread wrought by the neocon ilk in the early years of the new millennium.”

    Change Republican Party to “today’s so-called conservatives are in reality extremists wrapped in the cloak of the Tea Party’ and…wow..nothing has changed !

    Brandon m’lad…you are young and wet behind the ears yet. You are dissatisfied and looking for the “perfect answer’ and have latched onto an unrealistic ideology seeking the answers for which there aren’t any.

    You use the catchy phrases coined for misleading attractiveness giving the aura of being on the cutting edge of something new and exciting…when all they are are traps to mislead and ensnare. carefully you have been coached, led, and finally encouraged to “the Cause’.

    Step back and examine:

    False Party Paradigms
    Social Units
    Power-Mad
    Traditional Conservatives
    Liberty-Minded Conservatives

    These are not new. these are the same denials and false auras of legitimacy that have been used by every minor extremist group since time immemorial dressed in today’s language. if you know your history, these same terms (different names) were used by the radicals of the Civil war to legitimize their cause, by the anarchists of Europe during the latter part of the 19th century, by the communists in the 20′s and early 30′s when they were in favor in the dissenters circles, by the McCarthyites of the 50′s, by the far left in the 70′s, and now by the tea Party and American Taliban in the early 21st century.

    Mr. Smith…today it may seem exciting, and give you a sense that you are in the font ranks of some revolutionary movement. Reality is, you are doing great hurt to your career and will carry the taint as the years progress. branded as being an extremist, tainted by the ending conclusions that the past few years are a phase of extremism in America that led us down a wrong path. Your resume will be reviewed and the hidden thoughts will make themselves known in the final rejection. Too radical, too extreme, unable to separate fiction from reality.

    For throughout history, in this nation, one lesson stands out. Crazy never wins.

    • Warrior

      Flashman, you REALLY should move to chicago, they need more people like you. Oh, and I recommend you bring a lotta money and some guns with you. “Progressiveland” is kinda rough.

    • Flashy

      Paul…actually I’m taking a vacation in a week. first time off in a long while. The Keys for a week of self time then down to Barbados to get an onsite progress update on a project.

      I’ll wrap up by attending the Inauguration and celebrate the end of the beginning of the demise of the radical extremists aka Tea party and American Taliban. Come 2014, the Deep South, the area which has created the gerrymandered districts leading to the core of extremists in Congress, will be regionalized and ineffective in having any say in national affairs.

      By restricting the vote and doing away with true representation, the gerrymandered districts have stifled democracy and shown just exactly what the extremists are all about…dictatorship.

      • Jeanette

        What is someone who approves of a President who signed an Executive Order that allows a foreign police force (Interpol) to commit any kind of crime against any American on American soil, and to operate totally above U.S. law (even Congress cannot question Interpol) … what is that person doing on a site by the name of “Personal Liberty”? Isn’t there a site by the name of something like “American Communists Unite” that would be a better fit for you?

      • Steve E

        When you go to the Keys, stop by Sloppy Joe’s in Key West and have a beer for me.

        • Flashy

          Steve…believe it or not, I will. And give toast to your name. And after tipping that beer in your behalf, back to calling you a knee jerk nut case. I am so looking forward to a vacation …

      • DaveH

        Self-time?
        When have you ever been about anything but yourself, Flashshill?
        Or are you just referring to being away from the Boiler Room for awhile?
        http://lunaticoutpost.com/Topic-I-Was-A-Paid-Internet-Shill

        • Robert Smith

          Hey DaveH… !!!!!

          A little projection comes to mind. Yup, sure does.

          Can you get Mr. Livingston to proclaim that you are not a shill?

          Rob

          • JeffH

            Mr. Livinston has in the past refuted that claim…and he’s also pointed out the multiple personalites of the real shills and the majority of the the posters here do recognize the other progressive shills like you RS.

            FYI, if you can’t counter them with facts, ridicule the man and his sources.

          • http://wildeyguns.com The Christian American

            Hey Robert Smith. Wouldn’t you guys spend your time better by educating yourselves about our socialist enemy and fighting them instead of each other?

          • Dave67

            CA, wouldn’t your time be better served by understanding what socialism is as practiced in countries like Norway, The Netherlands?

          • navyjr

            From Nazism on the far right to Communism on the far left, and whatever falls in between on the spectrum, socialism is socialism and it ALL has the same essentially evil agenda! Doesn’t matter how you try to sugar-coat it!

          • pissed of & liberal

            Better to remain silent and have others think your a fool then to say things like that and prove them right.

          • Kate8

            p’o’d and liberal – So, are we to get from that that you intend to remain silent on these threads?

            Thank you.

          • navyjr

            Really? I’d rather be a “fool” in your eyes, than something worse than that in the eyes of my Creator!

          • Nick Czudy

            Dave. I lived in Norway for 4 months and was surprised when 3/4 of my pay was docked in taxes. But on the other hand, all medical, dental, education( Including college) and accident insurances and more were covered. The life style there is very open and easy going. The Norwegians are one of the most balanced and happy people. Their country is always in the top 5 countries with the best life styles. believe me, I would rather live there than in most US cities. the women are hot also.

          • Kate8

            TCA – Robert Smith is the socialist enemy.

      • nc

        Flashy, I wish you good weather and relaxation! When you’re laid back in the sun close your eyes and envision this> The “BUS” pulling off and leaving DaveH behind AGAIN! There he is running along behind the “BUS” waving his book bag full of Mises books yelling “Hey, world, wait for me!” ENJOY!

      • JC

        That’s too whacked out to even respond to…
        But I will say we’re a Constitutional republic, not a Democracy.
        Democracy means we get to elect Dictators…see how that works…

        Naw…never mind. Too deep for you…

      • http://gravatar.com/dalene44 Justin57

        Flashy, It appears your own extremists are about dictatorships. Dictatorships always disarm their citizens and frequently eliminate their most adamant turned disillusioned followers first. Next come the lemmings. Very scary you can’t see it. You should do some real unbiased research.

    • Bill

      We could have expected no less from you Flashy

    • Hedgehog

      C’mon Flashy, “Crazy never wins”! What about Obama? Can’t you see it, that man is completely loco, Insanity claws personified. If you really think that Obama is sane then you are too far gone to save. Even Obama’s political handlers know he’s a raving lunatic and the only thing keeping him from assassination is Joe Biden. Obama, Nobel peace prize winner. He’s got so many wars and shady deals running even he and all his merry men can’t keep track of them. It’s a wonder he hasn’t got American troops attacking each other, yet! Wait for it, it’s coming! CRAZY NEVER WINS, that hit about 222 trillion on the B.S. meter!

      • Flashy

        hedgehog…what you write is exactly why the nation looks upon the Tea party and American Taliban with suspicion, distrust, and partly in questioning sanity of the followers. Birthers, referring to a moderate president as “scocilaist”, “marxist’, “corrupt”, etc… even when he puts forth proposals which the conservative movement first proposed a decade ago! (Obamacare is the best example). War heroes are torn apart if they speak but one nice word about this President, distinguished and honored conservatives are dnigrated and cursed if they so much as say anything but wild haterd for this president or his policies. People who are held out as promising leaders, embraced by the TPers and American taliban, are suddenly deemed traitors and low life forms if they say or support anything of this administration.

        Charlie Crist, Chris Christie, Colin Powell, Chuck Hagel, Richard Lugar, Arlen Specter, John Huntsman, Robert Gates, Michael Bloomberg, Christopher Buckley, David Petraeus, Chief Justice Roberts …the list goes on and on. All praised at one time or another by the extremists. then denigrated and cursed and ostracized for the “crime” of supporting some program or policy of this administration.

        by gerrymandering ‘safe’ seats which have no reason to be a moderate, to savaging anyone daring to support a program of policy from this President no matter what their credentials, by insisting no compromise and acting like petulant children unless they get their way, by insisting everyone else take a back seat to their wants and desires, to extremist readings of the Constitution… you guarantee a regional party for the GOP. You leave the Democrats in control, and the true battle will be between the Moderate and the Liberal.

        The reaction from the extremists as the realization they’re being sent to ‘time out’ like the petulant children they act as? Restrict the vote, gerrymander districts, usurp the democratic process, lie, yell, scream…and the ultimate..promise to have this nation default on its obligations and become a deadbeat nation if they don’t get their way.

        think about that road you are choosing. Soon…I’d say by the 2014 elections for certain, the extremists, the Tea Party, the American Taliban…will be rejected and treated as the crazed relative no one wants to invite to the reception

      • DaveH

        It is obvious from your conjectural equivocal unsupported comments, Flashshill, that you are the Extremist.
        Non-Extremists can back up their conjecture with articles from learned transparent authors. Shills can only spout Propaganda.

      • GALT

        Money in the Land of Oz

        The 1890s were plagued by an economic depression that was nearly as severe as the Great Depression of the 1930s. The farmers lived like serfs to the bankers, having mortgaged their farms, their equipment, and sometimes even the seeds they needed for planting. They were charged so much by a railroad cartel for shipping their products to market that they could have more costs and debts than profits. The farmers were as ignorant as the Scarecrow of banking policies; while in the cities, unemployed factory workers were as frozen as the Tin Woodman from the lack of a free-flowing supply of money to “oil” the wheels of industry. In the early 1890s, unemployment had reached 20 percent. The crime rate soared, families were torn apart, racial tensions boiled. The nation was in chaos. Radical party politics thrived.

        In every presidential election between 1872 and 1896, there was a third national party running on a platform of financial reform. Typically organized under the auspices of labor or farmer organizations, these were parties of the people rather than the banks. They included the Populist Party, the Greenback and Greenback Labor Parties, the Labor Reform Party, the Antimonopolist Party, and the Union Labor Party. They advocated expanding the national currency to meet the needs of trade, reform of the banking system, and democratic control of the financial system.7

        Money reform advocates today tend to argue that the solution to the country’s financial woes is to return to the “gold standard,” which required that paper money be backed by a certain weight of gold bullion. But to the farmers and laborers who were suffering under its yoke in the 1890s, the gold standard was the problem. They had been there and done it and knew it didn’t work. William Jennings Bryan called the bankers’ private gold-based money a “cross of gold.” There was simply not enough gold available to finance the needs of an expanding economy. The bankers made loans in notes backed by gold and required repayment in notes backed by gold; but the bankers controlled the gold, and its price was subject to manipulation by speculators. Gold’s price had increased over the course of the century, while the prices laborers got for their wares had dropped. People short of gold had to borrow from the bankers, who periodically contracted the money supply by calling in loans and raising interest rates. The result was “tight” money – insufficient money to go around. Like in a game of musical chairs, the people who came up short wound up losing their homes to the banks.

        http://www.webofdebt.com/articles/

        Whole website for you, DavidH.

      • JC

        Flashy says:

        January 15, 2013 at 9:18 am

        hedgehog…what you write is exactly why the nation looks upon the Tea party and American Taliban
        ____________________________________________________________________

        You’d like to “think” the nation does…but the reality is that it’s just a minority of left wing whack jobs.

      • eddie47d

        Yes they are!

    • TML

      You seem to prove Mr. Smith’s point about viewing people in groups. Not one word was mentioned about the Tea Party by either Smith or hedgehog, but you seem to have placed them in that label (mentioning it no less than 5 times) to make them easier to attack by simply calling it extremism, while not really addressing anything thing they said directly. That’s a classic strawman. You like to consider yourself, and this president as a moderate, and by so doing attempt to take some moral high ground, but moderate is a relative term. Is it extremism to desire freedom to determine one’s own destiny? Is it extremism to want to speak one’s mind? Is it extremism to defend one’s self from oppression? Is it extremism to defend the natural rights of the individual? Is it extremism to oppose the policies of Obama or any other president that violates the Constitution that they swore to uphold and defend? No… these are natural things. A moderate opinion may be that you are indeed the extremist. Not the people that are naturally getting angry about waning liberties as a result of increasingly heavier regulations from what can only be rightfully defined as an imperialist government through its current policies. You seem to think it’s crazy to fight for one’s freedom and doing so should put them as a fringe of society and be phased out. I think it’s a foregone conclusion that many of the signers of the declaration of independence, you would have called extreme.

    • Hardtoremember

      I now know that nearly everyone who has read comments from this person knows it is a clear set-up. What would happen if everyone just stop doing exactly what he expects daily… stop responding to this person, no matter what name this person uses… ignore it…permanently. I do believe it would be much more effective than wasting any of your time.

    • Brandon Smith

      @Flashy

      That’s quite a diatribe, and yet, you said absolutely nothing. It’s sad really when a person feels the need to revert to an Ad Hominem position out of weakness. I always hope that people like you will present a valid argument but it never seems to happen.

      Basically, the entire gist of your rambling post is that “I’m crazy”. Wow. So, you went with the oldest and most overused Alinsky tactic then?

      Don’t just call me crazy and act like a coward; show me how my position is wrong. Show me tangible facts, not a string of meaningless opinions. If you believe that the leadership of the Republican and Democratic parties do NOT have almost identical policy initiatives, then say so, and show me why you believe that. I can easily present fact after fact to support my claim. Can you?

      And, by the way, you obviously know little of history. It is ALWAYS the people who fight for truth who are called “crazies” or “extremists”, and those are always the people who end up changing the world. I can name thousands of them.

      • Bill

        Good comments, Brandon

      • GALT

        Would you admit that YOU were wrong, Brandon?

        Still more elitist diatribes from Galt and not a word of sense backed by tangible evidence.

        Excellent beginning Brandon, unfortunately that would be a “conclusion”…….and as it stands a logical fallacy……but let us see if your “evidence” gets you to your claimed “conclusion”?

        What you are espousing is essentially the Blank Slate theory coupled with non-determination, which has been proven incorrect in nearly every scientific field. There is far more to the human mind than animal instinct.

        As much as appreciate your help in telling me what I said and what it means and why it is in correct…….you would actually have to be able to comprehend and respond to what I said:

        Of course the main myth is that “minds” are actually capable of “intelligent reasoning”, which unfortunately has no empirical evidence to support it.

        You are ruled by your “biology”, your brain is structured as massive parrallel processing unit, whose primary function and ability is “pattern recognition” for the purpose of threat assessment response ( survival ) where the proper application is to react to “potential threats” whether all not they are real or imagined, and if you manage to do this well enough, to reproduce by whatever means necessary, which brings into play the use of deception and self deception to realize these goals.

        Intelligent reasoning is possible, but it is not inherent or required, and the primary step in this process is the acceptance of the REALITY just stated, or the product of other attempts of “logically reasoned” intellect, will be isolated and ultimately self contradiction………….because this reasoning will be forced to comply with whatever mythology one has chosen…….to DENY…….the REALITY, you have just been confronted with.

        That doesn’t look like a blank slate, but you are more than welcome to demonstrate any aspect of what is described as being NOT TRUE?

        I recommend the works of MIT professor Steven Pinker. Read them thoroughly because you are WAY behind the curve. He proves without a shadow of a doubt that human thought is far more than purely a reaction to environmental conditions.

        Pinker addresses many specific ‘blank slate’ arguments throughout the text, but his main point remains consistent – experience cannot substantially alter the basic structure and functioning of the human brain.

        Doesn’t seem to be any conflict there, Brandon, since what I describe is the structure and function of the brain, which I simplified and repeated as:You have a BRAIN……..what it evolved to do is described above, and this evolution was completed 50,000 years ago.

        But you may find the Social Conquest of Earth by E.O. Wilson and the Folly of Fools: The Logic of Deciet and Self-deception in Human life by Robert Trivers useful in expanding your present understanding of what has been said and its implications: rather than attempting to transform it to that which your own very creative interpretation which is FALSE, in order to “argue” against it………( didn’t you have a name for this? )

        Jung found that archetypal symbolism was inborn, and that it included dualities. Meaning, good and evil are inherent functions of the human psyche, not products of environment, and the existence of these dualities gives us the inborn ability to CHOOSE, rather than being dominated by pure instinct or environment.

        That is very inventive of him and is the problem…….which is actually the point……….but it may take you awhile to sort out what it actually means………because you do have an understanding of the damage and harm that can result from their manipulation…..but you have to keep in mind that the species is 195,000 years old…….so takng the “mechanism” and “function”…….feel free to describe “good and evil” or any other “duality” as they would exist, say for the first 185,000 years?

        As for your narrow questions:

        Not narrow enough it would seem, as you were asked to identify which of the myths listed you believe in, and/or argue why they were not myths if you did “believe” them. A simple task, no?

        ” That all men are created equal? ”

        ” 1) Are you saying that all men should NOT be treated equally under the law? Are you saying that some men should be treated unequally? And if so, who?

        HHHMMMM…..so are you saying it is a myth? It seems to be…..since you are suggesting that “the law” is necessary for men to be equal? I wouldn’t want to put words in your mouth if that is NOT what you mean. ( a distinction you obviously do NOT recognize? )

        ” That economics is valid? ”

        2) The “validity” of economics is an existential question that you will never be able to answer. What remains is that which is natural, and human trade is a natural function of human life. Even the most primitive of social systems utilizes trade. So, my question to you is, show me a human system devoid of economics.

        But is has been answered see “Economics Unmasked”, “Debt: The First 5000 Years.”and “Econned.”……if you have evidence of trade for the first 185,000 that would be useful……and you are correct…..it is inextricably linked to “humans”……..and it doesn’t work.

        But your answer is: You don’t know if it’s a myth or maybe it is impossible to know? The books will help you decide.

        ” That capitalism works? ”

        3) Who said anything about capitalism? I promote free markets. Unfortunately, you are too uneducated to know the difference. “Capitalism” is a catch phrase started by Communist pundits, not free market proponents. Besides that, we haven’t lived in a free market system since 1913, so unless you are over 100 years old, you have no experience of it.

        I’m sorry Brandon for not structuring the “exercise” in a form which is familiar to you….I should have said….the following is a list of commonly accepted “truisms”, please identify which ones are “myths”, which are not, and explain your answer.

        Is 1913 significant to free markets? By the way there is an excerpt of “Econned” below……which deals with “free markets”…..

        What part of whatever it is you mean by “free markets” was not in play in 1929 or 2007?

        ” That humans are intelligent? ”

        4) I suppose intelligence is relative, including one’s definition of what intelligence is. Some people prize logic and rationalism, but what about emotional intelligence, artistic intelligence, physical intelligence, etc?

        So your answer is maybe it’s a myth?

        You may have your own idea of what intelligence is, but really Galt, who cares?

        Funny you should say that Brandon, because I read this article by this guy who said:

        “Acknowledge The Power Of Symbolism And Myth”

        One wonders by what magical mechanism one would determine that? And if myths ( thing that are not real? ) have POWER, would those who believed in them be “intelligent” or “untelligent”?

        ” That religion is required for morality ? ”

        5) Who said that religion is required for morality? I certainly didn’t.

        Who said you did? So, it would be a myth?

        ” with liberty and justice for all ? ”

        6) Liberty and justice are inborn archetypes. They have always been sought after by humanity and they always will be. They are ideals that we strive for. Don’t you want liberty and justice for all, or are you a totalitarian?

        So, not a myth? Evidence for this in the first 185,000 years? And just for fun……in which condition would one expect to find more “liberty and justice”…….pre-agricultural conditions or post?

        By the source of this is the pledge of allegiance……equal to the claim on the Supreme Court Building of “equal justice under law”…….how’s that going?

        ” That we are civilized ? ”

        7) A civilized society is one which abides by inherent individual conscience. Our moral compass is inborn, as Jung and many others have proven. But, because we also have inherent choice, we are able to abandon that moral compass. It may be because of ignorance, or because of malice. Therefore, man is civilized when he respects and understands his inner contents. He is uncivilized when he ignores or disregards his inner contents.

        So, yes and no? Well you have a marvelous imagination, especially when it comes to hearing what has actually been said……..because all I have done is provide a very simple an accurate description of your brain and it’s evolution to perform it’s primary function.

        If you can disassociate any aspect of human behavior from this description……..be my guest. To assist you, I will add another very simple an irrefutable and universal idea………and TRUTH!

        “You have the single unalienable right granted you by the fact of your existance to continue to attempt to survive.”

        So we share a common mechanism and a common right…….directed at a common purpose……….why is it that, civilization has not produced a beneficial result for all concerned?

        Could it be that “mythologies” have misdirected us from this “common reality” to replace it with “another” which denies this simplicity and that we are not intelligent enough to see it?

        Do you understand the question?

      • GALT

        a brief excerpt from the book Econned.

        “In 1776, Adam Smith published The Wealth fof Nations. In it he argued that the uncoordinated actions of large numbers of individuals, each acting out of self interest, sometimes produced , as if by “an invisible hand,”results that were beneficial to broader society. Smith also pointed out that self interested actions frequently led to injustice or even ruin. He fiercely criticized both how employers colluded with each other to keep wages low, as well as the ” savage injustice ” that European mercantilist interests had “commited with impunity” in colonies in Asia and the Americas.

        Smith’s ideas were cherry picked and turned into a simplistic ideology that now dominates university economics departments. This theory proclaims that the “invisible hand” ensures that economic interest will always lead to the best outcomes imaginable. It follows that any restrictions on the profit seeking activities of individuals and corporations interfer with this invisible hand, and therefor are “inefficient” and nonsensical.

        According to this line of thinking, individuals have perfect knowledge both of what they want and everything happening in the world at large,and so they pass there lives making intelligent decisions. Prices may change in ways that appear random, but this randomness follows predictable and unchanging rules and is never violently chaotic. It is therefore possible for corporations to use clever techniques to reduce and even eliminate the risks associated with their business. The result is a stable productive economy that represents the apex of civilization.

        This heartwarming picture airbrushes out nearly all of the real business world.”

      • Brandon Smith

        @GALT

        I would just like to point out to everyone the hilarious amounts of energy Galt is expending in his attempt to argue that Individualism is not a reality. Collectivists are DESPERATE to deny inherent individualism because if it exists, and people understand the implications of it, then collectivists fail.

        Collectivism cannot exist without convincing people that they are blank slates, and that they “need” the system which the collectivists provide to give them their identity. The more independent and self aware people are, the less power the system has over them.

        Galt is making a very old stock argument for tyranny. The denial of individualism is part and parcel of every despotic regime of modern times. I am not going to play Galt’s game of circular Alinsky debate tactics. But what I will suggest is that if anyone wants to study scientific proof of inherent individualism, I suggest they look into the studies of Carl Jung and Steven Pinker (for starters), and by all means, make up your OWN MINDS who here is presenting facts, and who is presenting disinformation.

      • JC

        Brandon Smith says:

        January 15, 2013 at 3:36 pm

        @GALT

        I would just like to point out to everyone the hilarious amounts of energy Galt is expending in his attempt to argue that Individualism is not a reality. Collectivists are DESPERATE to deny inherent individualism because if it exists, and people understand the implications of it, then collectivists fail.
        ________________________________________________________________________

        Good point Brandon, and don’t mind Galt. [comment has been edited]
        But he’s good for entertainment in small doses. ;-)

      • DaveH

        Galt says — “What part of whatever it is you mean by “free markets” was not in play in 1929 or 2007?”.
        Surely you kid, Galt? And you’re the one who constantly calls me “functionally illiterate”?

        Those who want the answers to Galt’s ignorance, need to read this:
        http://library.mises.org/books/Murray%20N%20Rothbard/Americas%20Great%20Depression.pdf

        Government was anything but inactive in the Marketplaces throughout the 20s and especially in the 30s.

        Galt would know that if he spent any time at all reading books that weren’t written by Court Economists or outright Communists.

      • DaveH

        Here is Galt’s idea of Free Markets:
        http://www.scribd.com/doc/93023823/Wayne-Crews-10-000-Commandments-2012

        It’s no wonder that somebody with [comment has been edited] would embrace Socialism.

      • JC

        DaveH…have you noticed that Non Obsene free speech is being edited on this thread?

      • DaveH

        Yes I have, JC, and it’s rather irritating given that I can’t even treat the Liberal Progressives as disrespectfully as they treat me. Also it gives the impression to unaware readers that I am being nastier than I am.

      • DaveH

        Imagine that. A site that supposedly promotes Liberty but edits out benign comments that are certainly not as nasty as comments like this from Galt:
        “Of course the main myth is that “minds” are actually capable of “intelligent reasoning”, which unfortunately has no empirical evidence to support it”.

      • Karolyn

        Dave – i guess your insults will have to be a little more subtle anymore.

      • DaveH

        I treat people like they treat me and others, Karolyn.
        Don’t get too high and mighty, since you are nothing more than a common thief who rationalizes her theft as being “compassionate”.

      • GALT

        Well it would appear Brandon that you are incapable of following the
        topic of a discussion, or restricting your self to what is actually being
        said…….choosing NOT TO RESPOND, using a “label” as argument
        and raising “individualism” which is not mentioned here or anywhere else,
        except in the ‘context” it was intended……..below, and only relevant
        to the following which I will repeat again.

        You are ruled by your “biology”, your brain is structured as massive parrallel processing unit, whose primary function and ability is “pattern recognition” for the purpose of threat assessment response ( survival ) where the proper application is to react to “potential threats” whether all not they are real or imagined, and if you manage to do this well enough, to reproduce by whatever means necessary, which brings into play the use of deception and self deception to realize these goals.

        Intelligent reasoning is possible, but it is not inherent or required, and the primary step in this process is the acceptance of the REALITY just stated, or the product of other attempts of “logically reasoned” intellect, will be isolated and ultimately self contradiction………….because this reasoning will be forced to comply with whatever mythology one has chosen…….to DENY…….the REALITY, you have just been confronted with.

        I understand the simplicity of this does throw a wrench into the complexity
        required by your various “mythologies” in order to explain the “special place”
        you believe “humans” occupy in the universe…….but all the evidence indicates
        is that you are simply a “talking monkey” and like most do not understand
        that you are completely out of the element, for which you are suited.

        Since you have no argument or evidence to counter this, and since it explains
        all of human history and it’s failure to adapt to “civilization”, we really have
        nothing further to discuss……but you knew that……so you hide behind
        “collectivist” which impresses your “willfully ignorant, functionally illiterate”
        fan, DavidH so much, that he forgets himself and easily succumbs to
        the “monkey see, monkey do” mode, and abandons his
        “liberal progressive” label, in favor of a whole new word, and then
        uses it in a question.

        Ironically, since you raise the word individualist, and describe the
        characteristics of one below………there does seem to be one here,
        and it’s not you.

        Since you appear “finished”, I guess I will see you when you reveal
        your next “opus about nothing”………..although what would really be
        cool is if, just for fun, you trotted out your “free market” stuff, and
        the “history” you believe supports it……something with substance,
        there are two “excerpts” on this page which will give you an idea
        of what you are walking into…..so make it good. ole DavidH
        still hasn’t been able to comprehend the “econned” one, let
        alone respond to it………ole “von mises” just ain’t there when you
        need it…..his history ain’t too good either…….hopefully you’re not
        that far gone………..although it’s not looking good?

      • Vicki

        Brandon Smith says:
        “I would just like to point out to everyone the hilarious amounts of energy Galt is expending in his attempt to argue that Individualism is not a reality. Collectivists are DESPERATE to deny inherent individualism because if it exists, and people understand the implications of it, then collectivists fail.”

        Sad for the collectivists. God didn’t create them as collectives. He did that for bees and some insects. The “collective” part of humans is the body. All those cells working together. Then God gave to man the greatest gift possible. Free Will. The ability to INDIVIDUALLY choose to believe. Or not. The individual ability to think, therefore to be. To have each his/her own identity. No man-made collective can survive the free will of individuals cause they will not need the collective for identity.

        - Brandon Smith: “I suggest they look into the studies of Carl Jung and Steven Pinker (for starters), and by all means, make up your OWN MINDS who here is presenting facts, and who is presenting disinformation.”

        That’s easy. Those presenting facts often provide links to the facts. Those presenting disinformation rarely do.

      • GALT

        So true Vicki, that Jungian link was easy to find, not to mention the
        copy and paste portion……Pinker too…….

        Do you think Brandon will pay attention to you?

      • GALT

        P.S. Brandon, that didn’t require any energy at all………it was simply a re-post
        of one you didn’t respond to from last time……and didn’t respond to this time.

        You see the way this actually works, is if you pretend to have the ability to
        engage in an intelligent logically reasoned discussion, which you seemed
        to have claimed to be able to do, then one simply keeps track of the dialog,
        points raised, if any, questions, answers to questions, and of course all
        the logical fallacies, and deflections employed to avoid that which you have
        claimed to be able to do.

        I gave you the benefit of the doubt the first time around, because of the
        moderation and the fact that things appeared out of order……..unfortunately
        there is no longer any need for that……..and you performed even more
        dismally this time…….I wouldn’t take too much comfort in your unqualified
        support, what you see here is the best they can manage……..

        I on the other hand, can take any one of your posts at will, even a response
        to someone else……and hand you your head, using just your own words….
        which I will do just for fun……just because i don’t like the stupid things
        you all try to get away with……..and for some reason, they tend to get
        frustrated and allow themselves to be distracted…….

        In any case, as you can see, none of this is really difficult to do….so if
        you got game…….you might want to dust it off……..of course, education
        doesn’t really prepare you for this……hell I’ve seen D.A.’s that have
        decades of experience and still can’t ask a question in the proper form,
        to avoid an objection…….

        Until next time, when and if…….

        “The Master said….If names are not correct, language is not in accordance with the truth of things. If language is not in accordance with the truth of things, affairs cannot be carried on to success……..Therefor a superior man considers it necessary that the names he uses may be spoken appropriately. What the superior man requires, is just that in his words, there may be nothing incorrect.”

        “The Master said,…..Without knowing the force of words, it is impossible to know men.”

        Confucious 551 -479 B.C.

      • GALT

        Before we begin this little journey DavidH., I wanted to inform you that Gary S. took “issue” with some of your comments regarding abortion, and that I took the liberty of responding to it in a logically reasoned and intelligent manner. In doing so, I removed any reference to you, for OBVIOUS reasons……..

        DaveH says: January 15, 2013 at 4:13 pm

        Galt says — “What part of whatever it is you mean by “free markets” was not in play in 1929 or 2007?”.

        Surely you kid, Galt? And you’re the one who constantly calls me “functionally illiterate”?

        I never kid, DavidH, unless I’m kidding, and I never “kid” where YOU are concerned as I’m about to demonstrate…AGAIN!

        Those who want the answers to Galt’s ignorance, need to read this:

        ( link omitted for the purposes of avoiding moderation restrictions (multiple) and because it it is irrelevant! ( non sequitur )

        Government was anything but inactive in the Marketplaces throughout the 20s and especially in the 30s.

        Since the years cited were specific, and in reference to “free markets” this would seem to indicate that you are illiterate? You are, of course, free to argue the EVIDENCE! ( bulldog GALT )

        Galt would know that if he spent any time at all reading books that weren’t written by Court Economists or outright Communists.

        Non sequitur: The only book that I have read and would endorse as being a factual representation of my position is “Economics Unmasked”, which demonstrates that the entire subject as invalid. If you have proof to the contrary, by all means, please present your evidence.

        With regard to the specific years cited here and their reference to free markets the following points would need to be addressed by you and/or addressed by the link you have cited.

        When you say “free markets” you mean “unregulated”, yes or no? If no, what does “free markets” mean?

        For the specific years cited, which of the following constituted or corresponded to your or “von mises” definition of “free market”?

        1.) The Federal Reserve 2.) Banks 3. ) Wall Street ( your mission if you decide to accept it ) Answer: Yes or No for each, and explain your answer.

        My position, again: The only unregulated free market element exists with regard to Wall St. For 1929, it is the leverage of 90% available through “margins”! For 2007, it is the leverage provided by ‘derivatives’ applied to a sub prime mortgage market, of 1.5 trillion or the entire mortgage market, since these involved “tranches”. ( as in tens of trillions )

        If you or your link have anything to dispute MY POSITION, you are free to post it. I haven’t seen it yet and I do not expect to, but surprise me. ( your description by me as being a ” willfully ignorant, functional illiterate” would appear to be intact at this point, NO? (rhetorical)

        DaveH says:January 15, 2013 at 4:15 pm

        Here is Galt’s idea of Free Markets:

        Link deleted: non sequitur, et al

        It’s no wonder that somebody with [comment has been edited] would embrace Socialism.

        DavidH, am I the author of that link? Endorser?. ( your description by me as being a ” willfully ignorant, functional illiterate” would appear to be intact at this point, NO? (rhetorical)

        JC says: January 15, 2013 at 4:25 pm
        DaveH…have you noticed that Non Obsene free speech is being edited on this thread?

        My that is a curious developement, JC is it not? I mean you did have “such freedom” before, no? To tell you the TRUTH, I am shocked that such a thing could occur here? SHOCKED!!!!!! But never fear, because “I HAVE A PLAN”!!!!!!!! sssshhhhhhh.

        Simply list all those things that have been deleted. Just the specific phrases. Then explain how they were crucial to your contribution, in that ” because they were deleted” they altered or diminished the importance of what you had to say. Mr Livingston is no stranger to the importance of ” intelligent logical reasoning” or its rules…….and I am sure that if you can present your case in a manner that demonstrates that he is in “error” in this regard, he will correct his error.

        Do you have such a case? Best get to it then……I got your back, bro….in case you haven’t figured this out yet…..I AM FEARLESS!!!!

        DaveH says: January 15, 2013 at 6:44 pm
        Yes I have, JC, and it’s rather irritating given that I can’t even treat the Liberal Progressives as disrespectfully as they treat me. Also it gives the impression to unaware readers that I am being nastier than I am.

        DavidH, in the realm of “logically reasoned intelligent” argument, how would your ability to engage in “disrespectful behavior” add or detract from the “logically reasoned intelligent argument” you were making? Why would someone who was capable of “presenting” such an argument, resort to “disrespectful comments”? or need to? or complain that they weren’t being allowed to? ( rhetorical, several times )

        Could it be that such a person was a “willfully ignorant, functional illiterate” and was not capable of ever producing an “intelligenty reasoned logical argument? ( extremely rhetorical )

        DaveH says: January 15, 2013 at 6:48 pm

        Imagine that. A site that supposedly promotes Liberty but edits out benign comments that are certainly not as nasty as comments like this from Galt:

        “Of course the main myth is that “minds” are actually capable of “intelligent reasoning”, which unfortunately has no empirical evidence to support it”.

        I am sorry DavidH but how is that nasty? Are you offering yourself as evidence that it is false? ( unbelievably rhetorical ) Brandon Smith? Sorry Brandon but you have also earned the “willfully ignorant, fuctionally illerate” designation.

        For your edification and enlightenment we shall now proceed to define what that means:

        Willful ignorance is the state and practice of ignoring any sensory input that appears to contradict one’s inner model of reality. At heart, it is almost certainly driven by confirmation bias.

        It differs from the standard definition of “ignorance“ — which just means that one is unaware of something — in that willfully ignorant people are fully aware of facts, resources and sources, but refuse to acknowledge them. Indeed, calling someone “ignorant” shouldn’t really be a pejorative, but intentional and willful ignorance is an entirely different matter. In practice though, the word “ignorance” has often come to mean “willfull ignorance”, and indeed, in many non-English languages, the word based on the same stem actually mean “willfull ignorance”.

        Depending on the nature and strength of an individual’s pre-existing beliefs, willful ignorance can manifest itself in different ways. The practice can entail completely disregarding established facts, evidence and/or reasonable opinions if they fail to meet one’s expectations. Often excuses will be made, stating that the source is unreliable, that the experiment was flawed or the opinion is too biased. More often than not this is simple circular reasoning; “I cannot agree with that source because it is untrustworthy because it disagrees with me”.

        In other cases, slightly more extreme cases, willful ignorance can involve outright refusal to read, hear or study in any way anything that does not conform to the person’s worldview. With regard to oneself, this can even extend to fake locked-in syndrome with complete unresponsiveness. Or with regard to others, to outright censorship of the material from others.

        and next:Functional Illiteracy

        Hidden Illiteracy: The Ignorance of Ignorance

        Twentieth-century philosopher Alfred North Whitehead once said, “Not ignorance, but the ignorance of ignorance is the death of knowledge.”

        There is a type of illiteracy that threatens us all. It is not the illiteracy where a person is unable to read. It is, perhaps, the most dangerous and destructive of all the illiteracies.

        We’ve heard the terms illiterates, semi-illiterates and functional illiterates, and we have a good understanding and awareness of the problems associated with these types of illiteracy. If you have observed illiterate and functionally illiterate individuals, you are aware of the frustration, upset and disappointment caused by their lack of literacy. These individuals are painfully aware of their problem.

        There is, however, another type of illiterate—one who can be very dangerous and destructive because of his or her type of illiteracy—the hidden illiterate.

        There is, however, another type of illiterate—one who can be very dangerous and destructive because of his or her type of illiteracy—the hidden illiterate.

        Hidden illiterates are ignorant of their own illiteracy. Their illiteracy is hidden from themselves. And, because it has never been identified, it is hidden from others as well. Hidden illiterates are ignorant of their ignorance; they do not know that they do not know. They do not fully comprehend the information and ideas being received, studied, or applied and are not aware they do not understand. Their actions, feelings and beliefs are founded on their unknown wrong suppositions, ideas and understandings. The problems and results of being a hidden illiterate can range from humorous to disastrous.

        In fact, what we are talking about here is the phenomenon of the misunderstood word, something which American author and educator L. Ron Hubbard discovered is the cause of much social and personal difficulty.

        “What has not been studied previously or known,” wrote Mr. Hubbard in 1980, “is that the flow of ideas in any message or field of learning can be blocked in such a way as to suppress further understanding or comprehension from that point on. Further, the misunderstood word can even act in such a way as to bring about ignorance, apathy and even revolt. And it will definitely depress productivity.”

        http://www.appliedscholastics.org/education-issues/hidden-illiteracy-the-ignorance-of-ignorance.html

        and now this word from our sponser, especially for Kate…..

        “The Master said….If names are not correct, language is not in accordance with the truth of things. If language is not in accordance with the truth of things, affairs cannot be carried on to success……..Therefor a superior man considers it necessary that the names he uses may be spoken appropriately. What the superior man requires, is just that in his words, there may be nothing incorrect.”

        “The Master said,…..Without knowing the force of words, it is impossible to know men.”

        Confucious 551 -479 B.C.

    • http://gravatar.com/dalene44 dalene44

      I always wondered what a brainwashed person sounded like. Read a little bit. Get educated. Turn off the government/corporate media. You’ll become more enlightened with time.

      • Patriot

        I will respond to this with the same reply I posted in response to Craig’s ridiculous post on this topic, but I will replace the original posters name with Flashy’s.

        In other words, Flashy didn’t read any of this article. He also believes the silly labels created by the media and the insulting demagoguery spewed from the mouthpieces of his favorite party. Flashy is a mindless drone, and a cheerleader for whomever shows him the shiniest goodies that carry the labels that he will most identify with as what he believes, rather than understanding that slogans and terms like ‘women’s reproductive rights’ are crafted carefully by experts in advertising, sociology, psychology, and political science, and are paid very well to create outcomes like what we have seen here in the embarrassing comment left by Flashy.
        This, ladies and gentlemen of America, is why the government on both or either or all sides of the fence have been so successful in dividing us, and in plain view eroding our liberties until so precious few remain, and what does remain grows thinner and more delicate than they have ever been.
        Flashy, you go right ahead and keep believing what has been purchased and sold for your consumption. Politicians and their incredibly wealthy, and powerful employees, lobbies, statisticians, professors, pundits, advertising executives and bankers have worked very hard to ensure that you parrot the very crap that you have just posted here. So in a strange way, your narrow and painfully obtuse comments are a product of capitalism at its best. For you to believe and to repeat that expensive rhetoric, it was born as someone’s pitch, a sales rep’s idea, and was capitalized, slickly produced, sold, then provided to every possible outlet available to ensure that you do what you just did.
        Welcome to the Machine.

        No other response to this kind of crap is ever necessary. What further confounds those that steep themselves in alliances with their favorite liars and thieves is when you take away their only weak and sad weapon by agreeing that the previous president was a criminal and guilty of the destruction of our Constitution as well. He too should be brought up on charges of treason and stand beside the current psycho-in chief before the American people to explain his lies and distortions. Soon we will all faces potential warnings and charges from our police state governing bodies when we express ourselves here on boards just like this one. That is not terribly far away.

        • Bob666

          Big Yawn…………………………..

      • Bob666

        as the shining example……………………

      • Irish Love

        Altho educated, I am NOT politically correct lol I say it how it is…… NO BS… I luv ya dalene44 ya make me heart smile!!

  • Elda

    I wish with all my heart someone could come up with a fair in depth test that everyone could take that would tell them in terms all could understand which party truly represents their beliefs and principals. I believe there are many that vote Democrat simply because they believe what the press tells them and are as frustrated as the rest of us with the results. I cannot believe most Americans really do not want freedom. I understand many vote Democrat because they believe it is the only way to keep their disability checks and Social Security. What they don’t see and the media will not tell them is that only a strong economy will ensure that and the Democrats (and many Republicans), are trying to destroy it all the while telling the retired and disabled that they are doing it for them. I am disabled and fear what the Democrats are doing. In all fairness, I am scared by what the Republicans are doing now because they have moved so far to the left we no longer have a constitution loving party in America. We must get back to our roots if we ever hope to be a stabliizing force in the world and able to work for ourselves and make choices for our families to keep us safe and healthy. Right now we are loosing our freedoms to a pile of lies from Both major parties.

    • Paul Wells

      Elda,

      As alluded to by others, and by the article itself to a pretty fair degree, the answer would resoundingly come back as neither of the major parties truly represent, “truth, justice, and the American Way” any longer. They have become corrupt and criminal in their ability to legislate that which is not in the best interest of democratic, peace loving people, and are now basically in full assault mode on the Constitution. We obviously deserve better, and I fear that it may come to armed revolution at some point, to throw the despots out. And believe me, in my view, there are more of them (despots) than there are of democratic, peace loving leaders.

      • Elda

        I GREATLY fear you are right. I am getting old and wish to die a free person. I guess in order for that to happen I must learn how to shoot a gun. Fact is that if that is what it will take to stay free I will as my fore fathers…..and mothers learn to shoot and use it for freedom as my constitution gives me the right to do.

      • GALT

        If they are criminals, it is by virtue of their corruption…….you might
        want to concern yourself with who is DOING the corrupting??????

        Then again, maybe you are working for them…….and this would represent a
        conflict of “interest” with regards to that question?????

      • DaveH

        Government is an inherently corrupt organization. Their only legitimate function is to protect people from the Force of others. [comment has been edited] they have been allowed to become the Forcers from whom we need protection.

      • GALT

        But David, this is not just any ‘government’…….this is one which “derives its
        just powers from the consent of the governed”.

        Now you wouldn’t be suggesting that those revered founders were corrupt
        at the outset would you?

        Also you need to demonstrate that the beneficiaries of corruption, are
        those elected officials in government presently…….and while it is true
        that their status raises their standard of living above that of most
        citizens…..they are hardly at the top of the food chain.

        Then, of course we have to consider Lew Rockwells 1% who make
        all things possible ( but not named ) and your list of crony capitalist’s
        ( also not named )……….so you seem to be “confused”?

        So once again, government may be corrupted…….but that is an EFFECT,
        not the CAUSE, of the problem……..

        BTW I do not have the time to correct, your convenient relapse, regarding
        “history”, the causes of the 29 and 07 crashes, and your fantasy regarding
        the ‘gold standard”……..although you do have an entire (new) website to
        explore……which again challenges ‘your von mises history’……or rather
        your claim to comprehending it……..and then hiding behind the “links”.

        Since you do not engage in actual debate, I am going to strongly
        suggest that you either do not bring this up again, or start learning
        how to engage in “logically reasoned argument”.

        You see Kate got the pit bull thing right…..she just neglected the
        FACTUAL part of it……and all that is required is repetition, and
        your continued failure to respond. ( with facts )

    • JC

      World’s Smallest Political Quiz:

      http://www.theadvocates.org/quiz

      • Vicki

        It’s a pretty good quiz too.

      • GALT

        Yuh think? So are you a quiz aficionado, Vicki?

        Can you name the the “founding father’s”?

        If not, how many were there?

        If not, what are the qualifications?

  • Elda

    Perhaps it is time for the far right leaning states to split and get their own Senators and House Reps so we can get our constitution back. If we can’t fight the lies maybe we can just out number them.

    • JC

      If you actually want “the” Constitution back…the left will also have to go.

  • Bill

    So well said Brandon,
    It is very similar to the conservative and progressives that post on this sight. There is an old saying that if you are not a liberal at 20, you have no heart. And if you are not a conservative by 40, you have no brain

    • GALT

      At what age do you become a human being, or does that require a lobotomy?

      • Bill

        Very intelligent remark, Galt

      • GALT

        Actually it was a question, and it wasn’t rhetorical.

      • JC

        Does that require a lobotomy?….wasn’t rhetorical?
        You expect to be taken seriously?
        [comment has been edited]

      • JC

        Edited again…Ok. I’m done here.

      • Kate8

        JC – What’s up with all of the editing? Seems lots of removed comments by people who don’t really say things that cross the line.

        They must have tightened up the restrictions.

        Hope you don’t leave, JC. I, for one, value and injoy your input.

      • GALT

        You could consider it a challenge to your intelligence, since only YOU know what
        you wrote………think of it as a feedback clue, like in Mastermind!!!!!

        What did get through was completely irrelevant, so be grateful, you are not
        being held to any serious standard, regarding logical fallacies or actual
        “ad hominem” comments………

        It is probably ridiculous to suggest that you consider the possibility that
        if you have nothing to say, that you resist the urge to say it……????

        Now that question WAS rhetorical!!!

      • GALT

        and NO JC is wasn’t rhetorical……..”pattern recognition” questions are common
        for IQ tests………( not to be confused with logical reasoning questions )

        There certainly seems to be a pattern suggested……in fact two patterns,
        in corresponding ascending order ( actual validity is irrelevant )

        My question inserted a third object into the first set, and offered a choice
        regarding the nature of it’s inclusion or exclusion.

        ( hopefully the words and meaning, thus far are NOT beyond your comprehension?)

        So there are a bunch of permutations available.

        To be rhetorical, the answer would be implied in the question, and no
        response would be necessary. ( self evident )

        Clearly there are multiple paths to pursue, for we are now imposing
        logical reasoning, onto a “value statement” which suggests validity,
        of the conclusion based on the corresponding pattern of ascending
        values.

        ( am I going too fast? )

        In any case the inclusion of the object in the first set requires a
        determination of placement in the pattern established.

        If all that wasn’t clear……when I stated that the question wasn’t rhetorical
        it should have been a CLUE….that the answer was not what you assumed it be
        be……..see definition of rhetorical.

        A further clue, would have been, that since I was not the poster of
        the original statement…….I could not possibly know, what the result
        of the inclusion of the additional object in the first set would be in the
        pattern established.

        Do you require further assistance?

    • Brandon Smith

      Galt often confuses his own pithy remarks with legitimate questions. It’s a rather bad habit.

      • GALT

        Wow, that would be impressive, except that you don’t seem to know what
        a question IS, Brandon?

        At least your responses are getting shorter……

        So you gonna do the “free market” 1913 fantasy stuff or what?

    • Paul Wells

      Yeah, I have to say that I am as well…I’ve had two or three comments removed that were not that inflammatory, so it’s obvious that full censorship is in full play here. Pretty sad, for a site that professes liberty as a desired principle.

      • GALT

        Or maybe, what has taken place is that “liberty” in the real world, comes with
        the responsibility one assumes with its exercise?

        Of course, there is always DavidH’s observation that, since this site is
        Mr. Livingston’s, site andhe is free to do what he wants……..

        Given his recent comments, however, it would seem that, he might have not
        been entirely honest when stating that belief, or principle…….that it was
        truth, convenient to THAT moment……..which has become an
        INCONVENIENT TRUTH, for this one?

        Ironically, this behavior seems to occur with EVERYTHING DavidH has
        commented upon….and least for those who have observed him,
        objectively, over time.

  • http://theconservativecrawfish.wordpress.com reelman1946

    The most tiresome national political situation is the constant
    stream of bold lies from Obama that go unchallenged by the pawn media
    and the pantywaist Republicans. This must stop. No nation should be led
    silently into fiscal ruin and a virtual dictatorship of E. Orders. (theconservativecrawfish)

  • http://wildeyguns.com The Christian American

    That’s why their called Republicrats. There is no statement of principles on either side, repubican or democrat. The true democrats by any real definition are Involuntary Socialist and the true republicans mirror Ron Paul. The Socialist are hiding behind the democrat label while true republicans are hiding behind the Tea Party label but even then there is still no statement of principles that can be nailed to telephone polls.

    When Yuri Gegeron, the Russian Cosmonaut, returned to earth he was awarded with honorary membership in the Communist Party, just to show how few Russians were actually communists. Samething here. Probably less than 1% or 2% of the people actually know what’s going on. The rest are reacting to what they hear. Truth is swallowed up in lies, deceit and propaganda. How many who say they are on the right actually read the Constitution, Bill of Rights and Declaration of Independence? Go to lexrex.com. There all there, plus.

    Lenin said: People think in words and how they interpret words, is who they are. Let us add knew words and change the meaning of words so we can mold a people we want. Lenin was a teacher before he became head of the communist party. Unless you have some knowledge of what your fighting for how can you expect to win a war? Four letter word conversations only show the ignorance of the speakers. They certainly don’t create good fighters for the cause.

    • http://n/ fred

      I have a couple of questions, along with a couple of comments.
      To begin with it seems to me that naive is an understatement. Who are these corporate puppet masters of the Republican Party? Seriously, I’d like to know. George Soros certainly isn’t one of them. What illegal war took place? The Iraq war that the UN and the US Congress approved, and had a coalition of foreign countries involved surely wasn’t illegal. Who are these private citizens that had their civil liberties taken away? A person born in American who rejects the American culture, and Constitutional principles, but clings to a foreign culture, adheres to radical ideals and believes in the destruction of the American way of life, probably should be under some form of surveillance.
      When it comes to pregnancy, the woman is one member of a three person phenomenon. A little Biology 101: There was a father involved in the beginning, and then comes the third member, the baby. I would like to point out that the human female is the only species on Earth that will knowingly end the life of her offspring, or more bluntly, kill her baby. This is, of course, quite readily condoned by men mostly of the left leaning persuasion.
      I will have to say, I never have been enchanted with the Democrat Party. They, far more than Republican, would infringe on our liberties, and tell us how we must live. They think what we earn belongs to the federal government, they dictate what businesses must produce, they would tell us what type of car we can own, they would tell us how warm we can keep our houses, they would force us to belong to unions we do not agree with. They will reject judicial nominees who believe in the Constitutions and promote those who will do for them what they cannot accomplish through the legislative process. They fear law abiding citizens having the right to bear arms and the Second Amendment was enacted precisely to protect the “people” from what the Democrats would do to us if unrestrained, which appears to be headed our way.
      The Democrats with their willing partners, unions, have destroyed American competitiveness and driven more American jobs off shore than anything or anyone else.

      I’ll finish, although I’ve barely scratched the surface.

      fred

      • http://wildeyguns.com The Christian American

        NO, congress never approved the invasion of Iraq. For American troops to engage in a war requires a declaration of war by the majority of congress. Korea was the first undeclared war America went into and none of the wars since then have been declared. What’s more interesting is, America has never won an undeclared war.

      • DaveH

        We’ve never won the Declared wars, either, unless you can call the loss of tens of millions of lives and Trillions of wasted Wealth — winning.

      • DaveH

        Wars are simply devices whereby Leaders get more Power and more Wealth at the expense of the rest of their citizens:
        http://library.mises.org/books/John%20V%20Denson/A%20Century%20of%20War%20Lincoln,%20Wilson%20and%20Roosevelt.pdf

  • GALT

    Without individuals, there is no such thing as “groups.”

    Without the “group” there would be no such thing as the “individual”.
    It’s an evolutionary thing.

    And groups change and disperse without notice.

    A recent phenomenon, and you have to ignore almost all of the previous
    195,000 years…..which you seemed to have managed quite easily.

    Groups do not exist beyond shared values.

    Survival of the group being the primary value of the previous 195,000
    years.

    Even within a group, the individual is still more important in the
    grand scheme of things.

    And interesting goal…..might even be possible, provided you do eventually
    acknowledge the “primary” importance of the “group”……and it’s need, since
    it is an absolute requirement to achieve the luxury of “individual expression”
    whose behavior and its consequences, have no affect on the needs of the
    group, since they have all been met?

    Still it is an evolutionary thing, and as you have indicated, you have changed
    in the past, hopefully this process will continue for you…….unfortunately,
    circumstances have conspired to make your present iteration and position,
    precisely the wrong one, in the wrong place, at the wrong time. Not only
    is the welfare of the “group” of primary importance, but it includes EVERYONE,
    just when the conditions offer the “illusion” that “individuality” could ever
    supercede or precede the meeting the needs of the group, first!

    Clearly your present efforts present a certain contradiction to
    the points you have presented here, as you are attempting to form
    “a group”, are you not? Even stranger, that it’s focus is precisely
    directed at the very reason for “the group” in the first place, and
    while presently decentralized, if your stated reasons for doing so
    are realized, you will be right back to the initial conditions noted,
    and the need for the group will be local ( and centralized )!

    Of course the conditions you find yourself confronted with may
    not be tenable for long term prospects……and they are constantly
    deteriorating as you prepare…….so it might be more useful as you
    proceed down this path……to be a more specific in the identification
    of the actual SOURCE of this deterioration……rather than using
    terms like “elites”, etc………in an effort to attempt to correct the
    “problem” even though the prospects are not promising? After
    all, without specific identification, the is NO prospect of correction.

    Of course it is possible that, like these long meandering
    essays, you really have no sense of what the problem is…….
    which would seem to leave us with the impression that it
    is “your group” and its shared interest which is the primary
    concern…….which is certainly a choice available to you,
    but it doesn’t seem be an intelligent choice or one that is
    directed at common solution, or any solution at all for that
    matter, but no doubt, this could just be me, especially if
    history is any indication.

    • FreedomFighter

      Even the smallest of persons can change the course of history.

      Laus Deo
      Semper Fi

      • Irish Love

        AMEN Lad!! The 3 percenters……… UUUURAAAAAAAH Semper Fi MY friend!!

    • alpha-lemming

      Almost slipped into a coma weeding through all that….. but your mind-set is clearer.

      The “group” is the alpha and the omega in respect to your favorite tag-line whereas it’s your desire to divide and conquer me…… why I don’t know but it’s abundantly clear that I am an object of conquest. So…. to forstall this fate, we (I) must become one with a homogenous, tepid, eternal morass devoid of anything unique. No exceptionalism permitted…. and since it’s impossible to make a moron a genius….. all the stars must be reduced to the level of the sub-par lowest common denominator. Know what other eco-system operates this way????… a septic tank…. and the crowning glory, apex of evolution will be an earthworm. Quite the Shangri La you’ve got planned for us…. kindly accept my apologies if I refuse to participate.

      • GALT

        Not only are you a participant, you are a driving force, and you clearly didn’t get
        the tag line……since it would be inconsistent with your brief grasp of what
        you manage to discern above, and then promptly lose. Always nice to see
        you compelled to weigh in, which if nothing else is reassuring in that we have
        no cause to be concerned with your genius becoming an actual threat to
        anyone in the near or even distant future…..which depending on your
        actual location may give you the opportunity to experience that “septic
        tank” environment, up close and real personal like…….and if you are in a
        real hurry, simply vote for the privatization of all public services, as the
        opportunity presents itself. Always glad we could spend this very special
        time together……..especially if you have achieved individual status…..any
        further divisions, from this point forward, will make you a group unto yourself
        ……..hopefully you’ll be able to ” all get along”?

      • DaveH

        Explain to us, Galt, why your Collectivism always fails when practiced?
        Are you saying that we should listen more to your jawboning than actual experience?

      • GALT

        Since I am not a “collectivist” I can’t help you.

        However, you can explain why “economics” fails?

        Or provide those lists?

        How many more months do you think you will need?

    • Brandon Smith

      @GALT

      “Without the “group” there would be no such thing as the “individual”.
      It’s an evolutionary thing.”

      Wrong. Individualism is inborn, as is our uniqueness. It is not evolutionary and is not dependent on environment. Groups are an abstraction created by other people, and we have the choice to not associate with any group at any time. Our individualism is a product of something greater. Something we do not yet fully understand. Groups are temporary. Individuals are eternal. I suggest you look into the studies of psychologist Carl Jung and learn something.

      “A recent phenomenon, and you have to ignore almost all of the previous
      195,000 years…..which you seemed to have managed quite easily.”

      Show me a “group” (a group formed by relative values) that has NOT changed or dispersed without notice within the past 195,000 years.

      “Survival of the group being the primary value of the previous 195,000
      years.”

      The desire of the individual to “survive” comes long before the survival of the group. Group survival values are predicated on individual desires. Therefore, the group cannot exist without individual need. You still have not made a single meaningful point.

      There is no such thing as a “group need”. We are not ants in a hive. There are only individual needs that happen to coincide with OTHER individual needs. The existence of ANY group requires that the individuals involved share coinciding values and coinciding objectives. Otherwise, the “group” cannot function, and usually cannot even form.

      Individual expression does not require the approval of the group. In fact, it often occurs in the face of disapproval. There is no such thing as “group evolution”. Only individual awareness. This awareness is not a biological process but a spiritual and psychological one. I suggest you study the works of MIT Professor Steven Pinker to learn more.

      Again, all groups are an abstraction of the human mind. They cannot exist without the individual believing in them and voluntarily participating in them.

      There is no contradiction, because I never claimed that “groups” are wrong. I said COLLECTIVES are wrong. The problem is, you haven’t learned the difference yet.

      Collectives are created by force of law, or force of arms, and require the suppression of inherent individualism. A collective is a “group” of like-minded people holding a gun to the head of an unlike-minded person and demanding they conform.

      I do not endorse collectives. What I do endorse is voluntary community. Individuals working within a group by choice; a group which acknowledges and respects their individualism and does not seek to supplant it. This is exactly the kind of value system America was founded on; a philosophy which the founders hoped our country would grow into. Unfortunately, collectivists like yourself have derailed the design, and turned it into just another experiment in feudalism.

      • GALT

        “Without the “group” there would be no such thing as the “individual”. It’s an evolutionary thing.”

        Wrong. Individualism is inborn, as is our uniqueness. It is not evolutionary and is not dependent on environment. Groups are an abstraction created by other people, and we have the choice to not associate with any group at any time. Our individualism is a product of something greater. Something we do not yet fully understand. Groups are temporary. Individuals are eternal. I suggest you look into the studies of psychologist Carl Jung and learn something.

        Wrong? What is that argument by declarative assertion? The first problem you have is chicken and egg, which will be dealt with eventually, and then the rather obvious and impossible task of identifying an “eternal individual”….anyone from 10, 000 years ago or earlier will be just fine. But for now lets take a brief look at Jung

        Although Jung’s research found commonalities in the archetypes revealed in mythologies, religions, and other cultural expressions throughout the world, this is not conclusive proof of their universal or innate character. Jung himself noted that there is not a fixed number of distinct archetypes, and that they do not follow the usual logic of the physical world but rather appear to overlap and merge into each other. Thus, the concept of archetypes, along with the collective unconscious itself, can be criticized as essentially theoretical, or metaphysical, and not substantiated by empirical data.
        On the other hand, archetypes have proved useful in the analysis of myths, fairy tales, literature, artistic symbolism, and religious expression. It does appear that there is a limited number of stories and characters in human experience, indicating connections among human beings throughout history and the world. Thus, even if Jung did not have the correct explanation of the exact nature of these connections, there is value and some level of validity to his notion of archetypes.
        http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Archetype

        With the “not empirical”…..and the inclusion of the identifiers of “theoretical and metaphysical”……we seemed to have found another of your MYTHS from above…….

        His work, which is an extension of Plato, produces twelve common archetypes which suggest a similarity to “astrology”….all of them require evolution of the group to the point where, the luxury exists for such differentiation…….I suppose you might manage one or two, for groups 50, 000 years ago, simply as a function of hierarchical structure, but they do nothing to support your assertion that they are eternal, and seem to require “civilization” for actual developement.

        Of course, one can forgive Plato and Jung, since the evidence for pre-history was not available, so as with all mythologies, the tendency is to project the present, onto the past……Aristotle made this attempt with ‘economics’, and got it wrong, even though the past he was imagining preceded him by less than two thousand years.

        “A recent phenomenon, and you have to ignore almost all of the previous 195,000 years…..which you seemed to have managed quite easily.”

        Show me a “group” (a group formed by relative values) that has NOT changed or dispersed without notice within the past 195,000 years.

        Pick any hunter/gatherer group you like…..the value is survival, and dispersal was not an option……but this is what is known and logically consistent with the evidence……your mythology is insufficient, and the burden rests with you, because you have no evidence.

        “Survival of the group being the primary value of the previous 195,000 years.”

        The desire of the individual to “survive” comes long before the survival of the group. Group survival values are predicated on individual desires. Therefore, the group cannot exist without individual need. You still have not made a single meaningful point.

        Would that be in the first trimester, second, or third? At birth, age one, five, ten? The individual does not survive without the group, unless of course you are declaring yourself an exception, did you spring fully formed from the brow of your father? You still have not made a single meaningful point. ( see how easy that is……..you have to survive long enough to have any desires, and you have to satisfy the required needs first…….Maslow put “self actualisation” at the end of his list, why do you think that is?

        There is no such thing as a “group need”.

        Individual survival is dependant on the group, the group is dependant on reproduction, the individual is capable of neither of these functions, independantly, even Tarzan.

        We are not ants in a hive.

        Are you sure? I suggest you put aside your mythology, and read a little empirical work, The Social Conquest of Earth by E.O. Wilson might be interesting since it addresses Eusocial Behavior in humans…..and you also have “altruistic” behavior to consider or are you denying that and the reasons for it too?

        There are only individual needs that happen to coincide with OTHER individual needs.

        The need to survive seems pretty co-incidental, not to mention PRIMARY and UNIVERSAL.

        The existence of ANY group requires that the individuals involved share coinciding values and coinciding objectives.

        Yup, survival works there as well.

        Otherwise, the “group” cannot function, and usually cannot even form.

        Yup, no problem there……as you begin in a group.

        Individual expression does not require the approval of the group.In fact, it often occurs in the face of disapproval.

        Projection and extremely dangerous depending on the “expression”, at least for the first 185,000 years……..and still can be depending on the group.

        There is no such thing as “group evolution”.

        Now your disputing all of history, and the 185,000 years which precedes it…….and all the “mythologies” that have evolved from it.

        Only individual awareness. This awareness is not a biological process but a spiritual and psychological one. I suggest you study the works of MIT Professor Steven Pinker to learn more.

        Pinker is a psychologist and he is dealt with above…..I hope you are not suggesting he is a “mystic”……..in any case you are dealing ( if this hasn’t actually sunk in yet ) with an empirical and biological description…….your consciousness, represents a fraction of your physical brain, and exerts far more influence over you ( self aware ) than you do over it. ( unless you are a tibetan monk and have dedicated your life to mastering your biology )

        I suggest:The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind [Julian Jaynes] to deal with that mythical spiritual thing?

        Again, all groups are an abstraction of the human mind. They cannot exist without the individual believing in them and voluntarily participating in them.

        Except for that first one and that survival thing.

        There is no contradiction, because I never claimed that “groups” are wrong.

        No you said this: Groups are an abstraction created by other people, and we have the choice to not associate with any group at any time. That is what is in dispute here……and the reasons why……are you conceding?

        I said COLLECTIVES are wrong. The problem is, you haven’t learned the difference yet.

        Really, lets see……

        Collectives are created by force of law, or force of arms, and require the suppression of inherent individualism. A collective is a “group” of like-minded people holding a gun to the head of an unlike-minded person and demanding they conform.

        Well that certainly is definitive…..also seems to be pretty much how humans behave……..although the expression of the “unevolved group dynamic” ( That 50, 000 year old thing we can’t get past ) is usually manifested by “exclusion” where they torment and bully outsiders. The behavior you are describing, is simply the extension of the natural dominant hierarchy which is mostly beneficial for the size group that pre-dates “civilization”………..since their are certain advantages that accrue to dominance and status, and since there is no “natural competition” toward which they can be directed……they are simply transferred to the “larger group” made possible ( and necessary ) by civilization with mostly negative consequences.

        I do not endorse collectives.

        Under those circumstances described neither do I, unfortunately you are dealing with 10, 000 years of the effects of this behavior, and again, if this comes down to a matter of “survival” which can be empirically demonstrated……co-operation becomes essential.

        What I do endorse is voluntary community. Individuals working within a group by choice; a group which acknowledges and respects their individualism and does not seek to supplant it.

        That’s nice…….a group of individuals……..sounds a bit mythical and misdirected, but no harm, no foul. Now me, I am a “First, Do no harm”…type and I suppose it is possible that our positions would seem to suggest harmony rather than conflict…..except that because of that 50,000 year old behavior…….humans have not evolved the ability to see harm where it’s consequences are not immediate and whose effects are not readily anticipated or considered.

        This is exactly the kind of value system America was founded on;

        No, not really……it was founded by groups fleeing other groups, or those seeking “opportunity” because they were excluded from it where they were, unfortunately these were acting at the behest of others, who were dominant and the cause of both the persecution and the lack of opportunity.

        a philosophy which the founders hoped our country would grow into.

        No, not really…….the founders were those who realised that while they were doing better than most, they were still excluded by those who were “connected” here, acting in the interests of those back there and their attempts to negotiate a bigger piece of the action failed.

        So they revolted, using the appropriate rhetoric to inspire focus on a common enemy…..and they managed to win, mostly by luck and the sheer incompetance of “the enemy”. None of the ideas were particularly new, so the only significant change, was the reactive choice of discarding the monarchy. After the dust settles, the game continues with a new elite, replacing the old……although there is the unaticipated shift in technology, which challenges the agrarian model, but this is settled by another war…….and history resumes as it always has, although there is one other factor which produces the “illusion” of freedom….and that is western expansion…..we will overlook that fact that all of this requires the conquest and extermination of the previous occupants, since the “moral statute” of limitations seem to have expired…….and it does so mess up that whole “special feeling” that is the mythology of the founders and the “spirit of america”.

        Unfortunately, collectivists like yourself have derailed the design, and turned it into just another experiment in feudalism.

        If you say so, it must be true! Ya’all do seem to like labels, as they comprise the bulk of your “arguments”……..unfortunately, I will admit to being an EMPIRICAL REALIST and a self defined and designated e.i. P.L.F. which is not available for relevation at this time, but it begins with the previously stated “unalienable right” you do actually have; and proceeds from there, using empirical knowledge and history to develope a consistent philosophy and intelligently reasoned solutions to the problems we now face and are a clear threat to our continued existance. I have clues that will allow you to determine if you MIGHT be a P.L.F……..but indications are that you are not, since there is no mythology involved…….no spirituality, and no eternity, unless you intend to achieve it by “not dying”? But other than that we have no problems……..other than your totally unrealistic view of the REALITY you occupy…….and these pointless essays, which are space filler for your real purpose here…….and which remains completely elusive as it regards form and substance…….which makes it impossible to determine the effects…….until you remedy that.

        Deception and self deception are also part of our “unevolved biology” and we have turned these, on ourselves, also….. because we do not posses the ability to reason logically, it must be learned….and that requires the acceptance of that FACT: which hasn’t happened for most yet, despite the overwhelming evidence of it that occurs everyday here and elsewhere……..it is one you constantly allude to and employ, while actually saying nothing regarding the “specifics”……put names to the ‘elite”, identify the myths, and your tactic of “assumed inclusion”, quickly fades…….as it does when challenged, and you perform no better than those who have applauded your “brilliance”. Of course, now you have actually managed to achieve “inclusion” and can share “Alinsky” allusions, collectivist, progressive, socialist, labeling as argument, and most importantly that unqualified reverance for the founder mythology. Loyalty forever…..successful business model, who can say? Solution to anything…….insufficient data at the moment, but we shall see.

    • DaveH

      Just when I thought Galt couldn’t get any more annoying, he starts with the bolding.

      • Kate8

        DaveH – :) :) :)

        GALT is like a pitbull on a pulltoy when he gets locked on to a topic. He’ll never drop it until he wears you out and you go away.

      • Vicki

        Are you guys actually bothering to read his stuff?

      • Kate8

        Vicki – LOL. Hardly.

        Sometimes I really try to follow some of his logic just out of curiousity, but his thinking process is unique unto himself. I simply don’t want to have to work that hard to make sense of it all.

      • GALT

        Kate, there is nothing particularly difficult in the tasks you cite.

        “Sometimes I really try to follow some of his logic just out of curiousity,”

        First step: Application of oft repeated Confucian quote regarding the determination of the meaning of the “words” employed. Your above quote, for example, uses the word “logic”…………the intent in your use of the word is “unclear”.

        If you are failing in the actual attempt to grasp the “logic”, ( in that you mean logic ) this would seem to be fairly easy to accomplish, since logic has rules, so “understanding” would be simply your questioning the “logic” you do not understand, by way of your own logic….to identify and clarify, whatever the problem might be.

        “Sometimes I really try to follow some of his logic just out of curiousity, but his thinking process is unique unto himself. I simply don’t want to have to work that hard to make sense of it all.”

        When taken all together, however, while you use the word “logic”, your meaning and implication has nothing to do with “logic” or your failure to understand…… you are simply playing to the “crowd”……..and given the choice of whom you chose to address……….any requirement that “logic” has anything to do with the means you actually employ to determine the validity or reasoning of anything expressed here…….is totally discredited.

        DavidH has no grasp of logic or any understanding of the use of it, for the purposes of “intelligent reasoned argument”…….and all that was required to demonstrate that was “extracting” a single definition, what does he mean by “free markets”, he has stated it as being one consisting of “unregulated trade based on voluntary transactions”.

        Since this definition is “foundational” to any and all of his understanding of, economics, history, governments and philosophy, his logic is open to challenge across the entire spectrum……..and further “defined” by any other clearly stated “axioms” or “principles” he may have identified.

        The result of this “challenge” has been that he has been completely unable to establish any indication that anything that he “believes”, can be supported as a product of “consistent logically reasoned intelligence.” He therefor simply demonstrates his “willfull ignorance” of “economics, history, governments, philosophy and science” and his “functional illiteracy” each and every time he responds to me, because he can not deal with evidence or argument, so he simply ignores it, hides behind a link and runs away. ( pretends it never happened, and simply repeats it, over and over…..and endless cycle of desperate delusional avoidance which to camouflage his actual “perceived self interest” which would be “obvious” to anyone, who was not “similarly afflicted” with the same deficiencies for precisely the same reason.

        For Brandon Smith, this condition surfaced fairly quickly in the simplicity required to expose it………..which began with the challenge of his “magnus opus posts which say absolutely nothing”……..but are carefully targeted at those predisposed to respond to key words and phrases, which lack any specificity……..and in some cases, have no actual meaning that can be “defined” ( as demonstrated with the phrase “unalienable rights” ) but which suggests an “atmosphere” of “inclusion”, simply because, common understanding of meaning is “assumed”, where no such understanding exists……..

        To demonstrate this, after challenging Mr. Smith with what has just been stated………he was asked to participate in a simple exercise, having stated clearly in his post……..How To Win The War For Your Mind, which included Acknowledging The Power Of Symbolism And Myth…….where he raises Jung and archetypes……..

        Before this exercise is introduced, he is informed of the empirical basis for the “reasoning apparatus” that evolved in humans and that it is directly connected to the goal of survival of the species, and is entirely caused by “biology” and that it ceased to evolve 50,000 years ago, where it’s final product was NOT a “self aware” consciousness whose ability to “reason” was based on “logic”, in either the model developed by Aristotle, or the more advanced model developed by Quine, or anything resembling how “logic” operates in a computer.

        The purpose of the exercise is to determine the “specificity” of the myths he is refering to, what his myths are if any, and by what power does he refer to or employ as a means of determining which of the phrases on the list are myths, why and by what reasoning does he reach his conclusion, if any.

        His response, fails immediately…..as he does not respond with a yes or no to “any phrase on the list”, indicating that he actually understood the task or exercise or comprehended the meaning of the listed phrase and in response to the question regarding intelligence in humans, he offers an answer that is completely irrelevant to the biologically based pattern recognition or the logic based alternative …..and when all of this has been laid out and exposed line by line……..does he correct or redirect his response?

        NO! He launches into an appeal to “everyone”, reagarding the “effort” his exposure required……and then procedes to attempt “introduce” the topic of “todays” say nothing opus……which has also been completely dismantled…….by raising allegations concerning “individualism”…..assigning “collectivism” as a “label”, and pretending to argue, things which to this point have no relevance to the challenge that has been made to him……..because the only point raised that has been offered by me that can be considered argument is:

        Given the biologically described origin for the basis of “intelligence” as described and the group requirement for survival, which evolved and is inseparable from humans from the point of the origin of the species, to the point where the conditions, permited significant deviation, the needs of the group, clearly supercede the needs of any “individual”, and the behavior of any “individual” which ran counter to this…..would be dealt with accordingly. For the first 185,000 of our existance, this model holds by neccessity and the only distinctions that would be discernable within the group would exist on the dominant hierarchy that would arise naturally within the group, conferring status, as well as the assignment of tasks within the group for the purposes of survival.

        Because of the hunterer gatherer model, both the size of the group and it’s territorial range are limited to practical restrictions…..which are governed by external conditions……..and there no way to alter this dynamic until one overcomes these conditions.

        This does not occur until the developement of “agriculture” which changes the previous limit on the the size of the group……..but NOT the evolved ” biologically pattern based intelligence” which determines behavior. It is now that “individual survival strategies” can be attempted, so that while the “goals regarding status and reproduction are the same”, the opportunites for achievement are increased……because there are now multiple “groups” which are now available as subsets, within the larger group set…….each one offering a different hierarchy and status, etc.

        It is here, and only here that the concept of the “individual” and the developement of “archetypes” can begin to evolve……and since even this is based of the “evolution” of various “survival strategies” to emerge……….this process is neither rapid nor determinate as to the results.

        Yet, Brandon’s claim is that both archetypes and individuality are universal and precede any possibility of needs of the “group” ever being dominant……which is accompanied by a claim of “spirituality” whose characteristics are not identified or origin defined.

        He is confronted with the “evidence” that the Jungian model has no empirical foundation…….and given the areas where it does seems to have demonstrated some “useful” application……….” archetypes have proved useful in the analysis of myths, fairy tales, literature, artistic symbolism, and religious expression.”

        All of these areas require “civilization” to exist before they can even begin to evolve, and quite some time before they even begin to approach the level of sophisticated distinction that would match the individual archetypes identified by Jung. Pinker, on the other hand has no relevant application here.

        Had Mr. Smith any intelligence at all, there is no reason to insist on argument regarding the evidence here………..after all, if there is a validity to whatever he is trying to get at………….it is rather foolish to insist that………..empirical evidence must be ignored as a pre-condition.

        No “intelligent person” would listen…….

        His final denouement is his description of my challenge to him and his claim that this is an “elitist diatribe”………which like every other term Brandon has used has no specific meaning because he has never applied it or other other term he constantly uses……..to anything that is specifically identified……..

        Does Mr. Smith have an agenda, quite obviously and it is focused on alt.market and his “belief” that the “future” is “his future” and “his solution” is the only solution to it………does if have any bearing on his say nothing diatribes……..other than the fact that they are designed “not to exclude” anyone if “possible”……..not really, because if he is questioned at all………he reacts as if his “solution” is being attacked, rather than as a challenge to the specific “nothing” that might have prompted it…………and he demonstrates that he can neither defend his “nothingness” as a support for his agenda, or argue that the concepts have any relevance at all…….to anything including his agenda…….which leaves with the only “response” available…….to attack using labels, and distorting the argument or challenge he is facing, in order to misrepresent it……so that the “labels” now apply……..at least to those who believe he actually said something in the first place.

        It is a tactic that no person capable of “intelligent logical reasoning” would ever require or use…..and Mr. Brandon Smith would never be confused as being one. Q.E.D.

  • http://roberttitle.wordpress.com roberttitle

    The so-called Left vs. Right political prism is actually incorrect. It should be UP vs. Down. Conservatives and neo-cons that support these unconstitutional, undeclared murderous wars are on what you call the Left as well. The group of liberals, progressives, neo-cons that all support these wars are pro-oligarchy. Liberty and pro-constitutionalism are above are UP and oligarchy is below or down. If you really belief Left vs. Right, there is no middle-ground as both contain elements of oligarchy within them…how do you find a middle-ground (a compromise) between Evil and Evil? You can’t.

  • nc

    Brandon, We are still the best place in the world to live! Ask those who live in the OTHER nations. Do we have problems? Yes! Has there ever been a time when we didn’t have some ‘PROBLEM” or another? NO! Did we roll up in a ball and quit? NO!! Are more than .002% going to take your prepper counseling and go hide in the desert with a case of beans?NO!! We are going to stay and fight with the reality that it is going to be with a Republican or Democrat in the Oval Office!

    This is a country where you still have a choice of dropping out of the real fight but don’t expect to have much clout when you drop into the 2 percentile! That’s not how the old guys drew it up!! You can talk of taking your 2nd. amendment guns into the streets and “TAKING OVER” but even the knuckle draggers know that will not end good for them!

    You either play in the big leagues or sit in the bleachers and bitch BUT YOU CAN’T DO BOTH!! WE WELCOME YOU BACK TO THE GAME!

    !PEANUTS,PEANUTS, HOT ROASTED PEANUTS!

    • Brandon Smith

      @NC

      There are “problems” and then there is TYRANNY. What we face today, as I have clearly shown, is the development of a tyrannical system. You may be happy to accept your own enslavement. I am not.

      If anyone attempts to force me or people like me to participate in such a system, we are going to fight, and just so you know, we are going to prevail. Collectivist systems always meet their match eventually. It sounds like you are starting to believe your own disinfo-trolling. Such hubris makes you blind and works in our favor, so by all means, continue…

      • GALT

        hhhhhmmmmm….alt.market is a non profit CORPORATION, would that
        be an example of your resistance to TYRANNY?????

        Given the Jungian mysticism, if you can strengthen that eternal/spiritual
        connection……you could give the religious exemption a shot??????

        The Decentralized Voluntary Group of Individuals Church of Barter
        and Archetypes? ( click here before they shut it down )

        Of course actual resistance to tyranny might be better served if
        you understood the legal basis by which it was accomplished,
        because the “constitution” did present a problem for the
        TYRANNY you allude to, but they found a way around it, although
        it did take 25 years to complete…….and your ‘consent”, which
        you have given. ( willful ignorance can be expensive )

        http://www.supremelaw.org/authors/freeman/freeman4.htm

        P.S. You don’t need a gun or an army……..no posturing is
        required……but you will need to grow a pair, because you MAY
        have to stand in front of a member of the cult of the black robe,
        whose only weapon is a gavel and his reliance on your ignorance.

        Oh and one more thing……you will have to do it ALONE!

        Which is a rare quality among the voluntary group of individual
        collectivists.

        Do not be afraid, become an INDIVIDUAL, if nothing else, you will
        not be “paying” for your oppression……

    • JC

      nc says:

      January 15, 2013 at 8:38 am

      Brandon, We are still the best place in the world to live! Ask those who live in the OTHER nations
      _____________________________________________________________________

      That is “highly” debatable. I can think of a couple nations that have more respect for freedom than do the last two administrations that’s for sure.
      Canada comes immediately to mind.
      They allow gun ownership and as police states go, it’s way behind the US.

    • DaveH

      You have the nerve to call others “knuckle draggers”, NC, when your comments are almost always fallacious?

      • GALT

        You have the nerve to keep showing up, and they let you in,
        why should he be worried about anything?

  • Deerinwater

    Well Brandon, ~ the Lord willing, you will wake up a few more times before your race is ran.

    The devil appears in many forms and moves about. Once you think that you have him identified, labeled and located ~ he will change.

    Kerry didn’t have good Ju Ju ~ he didn’t come out against the war ~ thinking that his military service might benefit him ~ while W was not Presidential material , neither was Kerry.

    In 2004 the far and near right had sold their soul to the devil ~ Any American that opposed the war was painted by a loud majority as a tree loving, pinko, [expletive deleted] and unAmerican . I had three bar fights over being outspoken in my opposition to these wars myself, one with gun play.

    American’s had gone nutts! ~ It was all King George, Karl Rove and Dick Chaney’s show.

    It was some of my most disappointing day of being an American and realizing I had no control of events. I felt as if I was on a run away train and couldn’t jump off.

    For you to jump ship to the other side ~ does not impress me much ~ but you are young and I do understand if you follow your convictions. ~ But must understand, if you can be wrong once, you can be wrong twice.

    • DaveH

      Funny, but I’ve never seen a comment of yours where you dissed Obama’s wars, Deer. Why is that?

      • Dave67

        Hmmm DaveH… which wars are those that Obama started and have boots on the ground occupying another country. Maybe I was on vacation in San Diego that day.

      • DaveH

        Since when is the Commander-in-Chief not responsible for the engagements of our military, Dave67?

      • Kate8

        Dave67 – It’s definitely not for lack of trying. O’s been ‘workin’ hard’ (to use Hillary’s words) to cause WW3 to erupt in the middle east, and he’s for sure determined to start one here at home, with his complete disregard for the Constitution and our guaranteed Rights.

        Getting us into foreign wars is bad enough, but waging war on our own people is unspeakable.

        • navyjr

          NOT O doing that; if you understand chains of command in the military; that’s the Generals at work; O is upper level major, to maybe low end light colonel; Valerie Jarrett is upper level light colonel, to MAYBE lower level bird colonel; the generals aren’t even in the US!

      • Dave67

        Obama has yet to start ANY war… If you got your head out of your economic theory sites you would nkow this.

        Your boy and fellow conservative Bush gets the credit for starting both the Iraq war and the Afghanistan war. Obama merely ended Iraq and got Bin laden with the use of a small team, not hundreds of thousands of troops.

  • Bill

    I had a similar epiphany a few years ago. I started asking hard questions regarding 911, the Iraq war pretense and all of that. I have been a Republican all my life. I know that I’ve been used. I saw how utterly corrupt the system was and how it acts on behalf of interests that aren’t my interests or the interests of the American people. That doesn’t mean I’ve become a liberal democrat. I just refuse to let a political idealism mold my world view any longer. I finally understand that the two party paradigm is a strategy to keep us divided, pissed off and distracted while they dismantle and destroy and then remake America in the image of the globalists, which will destroy our way of life forever.

    The interesting thing is that it has been quite liberating. I no longer feel compelled to hate liberals. I think there is a great deal of common ground we can find and be a whole lot more tolerant of each other because if this little experiment in self governance fails we can expect a return of the dark ages.

    • Bill

      Hi Bill,
      It looks like we have three posters named Bill. This should confuse the hell out of the progressives

      • DaveH

        Yes, it would be nice to further qualify your names, so we know who to treat respectfully and who to not.

  • steve

    your first paragraph sounds like something out of religion, that is false teachings. ex; when you die you go to heaven. that’s not what the bible teaches. so you’ve been douped.

  • S. Banks

    Mr. Smith: You write well, clearly and succinctly. While I do not agree with your observations, I appreciate the time you invested in putting them to paper. I am an independent, and have been for decades. I do not endorse everything my Government does; I do not endorse all that the President does. And I would certainly welcome a much larger turnover in Congress to shake up the current lot of grey-haired third graders we have there now.

    However, I note that most of your observations and commentary is based on a presumption that your tenets are the only correct position, and that all else is contrived, false, or wrong. I don’t buy that. In fact, one possible real outcome of your Alternative Market Project philosophy is to create communities of like-minded folks (positive outcome) who use barter and trade mechanisms for the exchange of goods and services. This willing disenfranchisement from the conventional marketplace can easily lead to “balkanization” of regional communities (not-so-positive outcome). Locally-derived rules and standards would drive market operations, and there would be no organizational body to adjudicate market rules from one island community to the next.

    Innovation would still exist, and potentially thrive on a small scale, but would employ tens of people perhaps, rather than thousands. Technology and education would be at risk of falling into a sharp decline, when we can no longer fashion the exotic hardware and machines that drive commerce today. Why? Because in a decade or two under such conditions, we would no longer produce the educated people needed to make such discoveries, or facilitate bringing those ideas to market.

    In your world-view, I see the potential for America to enter a declining position of relevance in the world, the dollar no longer the currency of choice for global trade.

    Yes, you would have your liberty, be able to choose whether you own guns, and live your life generally unfettered by a central government of a republic. A nation filled with island communities slipping off the grid of global interaction. Each community filled with people whose primary focus is “me”.

    Yay, you….

    • Brandon Smith

      @Banks

      Your assumption is that America and the dollar are not ALREADY declining. The reality is, they both are, due to the policies of the private Federal Reserve. My goal of independent and self sufficient local markets is a counter to the implosion that is already occurring.

      I honestly couldn’t care less about the perceived “relevance” of the U.S. on the world economic stage. That is superficial and irrelevant. What does matter is that our economy has been hijacked, and is being driven off a cliff. We can either stay on the titanic, or build our own boat. What are you going to do when the system breaks?

      • JC

        I’ll be going hunting…want to come along? ;-)

      • GALT

        Sharp shooting for individual toes, or are you going to use a shotgun to be sure?

    • DaveH

      Banks says — “In fact, one possible real outcome of your Alternative Market Project philosophy is to create communities of like-minded folks (positive outcome) who use barter and trade mechanisms for the exchange of goods and services”.

      Why would you think Free Markets would be without money, Banks? We would use money, but it would be sound money that couldn’t easily be inflated to enrich self-interested Leaders who have assumed control of the money supply.
      Read this to see what I mean:
      http://mises.org/books/whathasgovernmentdone.pdf

    • Vicki

      Since money is a method to dramatically improve the efficiency of barter I strongly suspect money will come into these “barter” economies. Money does not change the nature of barter (free trade amongst individual buyer/seller pairs). Money simply makes it more efficient by giving the partners a common object of agreed value to exchange when otherwise they might not.

      Simple example. I have a lot of apples to sell. Joe is a painter. Gail is a candlestick maker.

      I want a paint job on my apple barn.
      Joe wants candles to be able to paint at night
      Gail wants apples for pies.

      I don’t want candles. Without money Gail will have to go without her pies or grow her own apples. Joe will have to keep looking for someone who will trade candles for his painting or give up painting at night (or make his own candles).

      Now we add money. The oil of a good barter system.

      I hire joe to paint my barn and pay him in silver coins of known weight. (That hard money of the history books) Joe takes the coins to Gail and buys some candles. Gail comes to me and gives me the coins for some apples.

      Gail gets her pie
      Joe gets to paint at night
      And I get my barn painted.
      Voila. Commerce happens.

      It could have happened without money but it became much more efficient with.

      • GALT

        And , of course, everybody is real clear on the math too…..

        xApples = yCandles = zLabor = $Silver

        Of course, no one actually needs the silver…..and since we know,

        xApples = yCandles = zLabor

        The same thing can be done with a piece of paper and pencil.

        Or a clay tablet……which is the way it did start, and it didn’t work.

        see Debt: The First 5000 Years, Economics Unmasked, Extreme Money,
        Econned, Power, Inc, The Great Divergence.

        Do you need the links Vicki? Unfortunately, you still have to buy
        the books…..unless you avail yourself of the services of your local
        public library……..no waiting, as most of the “talking monkeys”
        choose to share their “ignorance”……….

  • DaveH

    Once you realize that Government is just one very large self-serving Gang, everything they do becomes understandable.

  • Bill Quigley

    Forget Brandon’s rambling about party affiliation and right versus left, he’s trying to sell you something. None of what he is saying makes any sense except in the context of what he is trying sell!

    • GALT

      ssssssshhhhhhhhhhh! Actually it doesn’t look like he selling anything, at least
      right off……..but you do have to “sign up” to get in…….and you do get most of
      the same ads, plus a few different ones……..but the devil is in the details…..
      and they are registered as a non-profit, at least on the “primary level”.

    • Brandon Smith

      So, Bill, do tell….what am I trying to sell you?

    • JC

      Yeah Bill…I’m curious…what is Brandon trying to sell?

      • GALT

        Well my little talking monkey you could try…..,.altmarket.com and see?

    • DaveH

      You might think differently if you did some reading, Bill.
      Start here:
      http://library.mises.org/books/Murray%20N%20Rothbard/Conceived%20in%20Liberty_Vol_2.pdf

      • DaveH
      • GALT

        Really DavidH, you have a “von mises” link that explains Brandon and alt;market??????

        Those guys are good man!!!!!!!

        So you got the lists? Refutation of “Lords of Finance or “Econned”?

        I mean, seriously, if they can do Brandon Smith???????

  • Chester

    Jeanette, perhaps YOU would be better served by visiting a site where only opinions that matched your own were allowed to be presented. Of course, that might result in a blog with only one author, and only one reader, but you would not be forced to deal with ideas you don’t agree with.

  • DaveH

    Great article, Brandon.
    I don’t understand how such a wise man could have ever been a Democrat (or a Republican).

    • Bill

      Hi Dave,
      Even Reagan was once a Democrat. We all make mistakes

    • JC

      Yes indeed, good article for sure.

  • FreedomFighter

    “This enemy devours liberty without thought. It usurps power without conscience. It manipulates minds as quietly as a python enveloping its sleeping prey. It is a sinister serpent that strangles freedom, and it is this serpent that the masses have placed into power and begged to abandon the separation of powers that have kept our Republic relatively free for over two hundred years.

    Today, America stands on the verge of domestic war precisely because America stands on the verge of dictatorship. A corporate-flavored variety of fascism has reared its ugly soul, where corporations and government conspire in dark rooms to rob from the American people their health, their paychecks, their voices and their rifles.”

    Beware, radicals on the left. Beware what you wish for… and what you unleash. Your continued insulting and “terrorist” labeling of legal firearms owners across America is only strengthening the resolve of those you would be unwise to provoke. Do not make the mistake of thinking that the military and law enforcement are on your side; they are not. The most capable defenders of American society today are also the most dedicated, sworn defenders of the American constitution and its Bill of Rights. If you press your fascist agenda too far, you will trigger an almost automatic response from every sector of society, law enforcement and the military.

    And that response will drench the streets of our nation with unnecessary blood. This is why my heart sobs for history harshly learned.

    O war! Thou son of hell – As America stands on the verge of domestic war, my heart sobs for history harshly learned

    Learn more: http://www.naturalnews.com/038677_civil_war_history_lessons_learned.html#ixzz2I41w3ei1

    Laus Deo
    Semper Fi

    • Irish Love

      AMEN Darlin Semper FI!!!

  • Johnc

    It does not matter no matter what the present Rebulicrat party is it is not for the people it is like a Virus making copies of itself in its image consuming all the resources until finally it kills its host. When this happens Chaos will prevail The country will then be ripe for the NWO to come in and save us. Don’t Look to them for your salvation. They will oppress and subjugate you slavery will be the final result when the freedom that America Had is gone from the planet then only darkness as those who rule dictate everything to you and even tell you where and when you can take a crap

    • JC

      You mean of course….if we weren’t all armed to the teeth right?

  • http://apoliticalpundit.wordpress.com Political Pundit

    As a Senior Citizen, I remember how great our nation used to be. I am actually sad that I have lived to see the day that all the things I believed in so passionately are eroded so as to be unrecognizable. I mourn!

  • r b

    all politicians are crooks.
    party platforms are nothing more than propaganda to influence the fools to vote.
    your story will read just as well if you replace democrat with republican.

  • Bobseeks

    Smith is far too charitable in his assessment of democrats as people. I grew up in a democrat-controlled, heavily unionized area (St. Clair County, IL) and believe that democrats are truly evil. I do not know any democrats that could not make the transition from their current job to working as a concentration camp guard. In looking at the issue of terrorism; if any other group had murdered as many people as the democrats have murdered, destroyed as many cities and properties as the democrats have destroyed, and caused the economic and social disintegration the democrats have caused, we would have declared war on them immediately. We will not be successful in our battle for freedom until we understand that, in the democrat party, we face the greatest evil the world has ever known.

  • Melvin2344

    For EVERYONE who has NOT read the ARMY FIELD MANUAL FM 3-39.40 (Internment and Reeducation) , which is ACTUALLY an Obama approved ( check the APPROVED DATE !), you need to LOOK IT UP ! If anyone is DUMB enough to “think” that they will be teaching “The Bill of Rights” , or “The Constitution of the United States” as a part of that “reeducation” , you are beyond any hope of ever figuring out the Path that the IMPERIAL ELITES have set for US Citizens ! HINT : “think” SOVIET or NAZI concentration camps !
    This is the VERY REASON why the founding Fathers put the SECOND AMENDMENT right after the FIRST, and before ALL OTHERS ! It was to SHOW the American people when their government was returning to EUROPEAN DICTATORSHIP PROCESS !
    BTW; while you are looking at the actual PDF version , have the Document do a word search for “executions” ! If you think that I’m joking – you need to take SERIOUS steps to EDUCATE yourself BEFORE the Government tries it via FM 3-39.40 ! ! ! !

    • DaveH

      http://info.publicintelligence.net/USArmy-InternmentResettlement.pdf

      “This manual addresses I/R [internment and resettlement] operations across the spectrum of conflict, specifically the doctrinal paradigm shift from traditional enemy prisoner of war (EPW) operations to the broader and more inclusive requirements of detainee operations”.

      Scary indeed.

      • DaveH

        Another interesting quote — “Typically, overpopulated third world societies suffer from a lack of legitimate and effective enforcement mechanisms, which is generally accepted as one of the cornerstones of a stable society”.

        Yet, the countries with the most Government, are also coincidentally the countries with the worst economies:
        http://heritage.org/index/ranking

        Bullies always think they know what’s best for their subjects.

      • DaveH

        Here is an example of the dreaded Anarchy in the late 17th century. Dreaded, at least, by Power-Seeking Leaders:
        http://www.lewrockwell.com/rothbard/rothbard81.html

  • Mary

    Here we go again. Look, we are individuals and within limits and laws, we make choices. We live in a system of government and we elect our represenatives to make those laws that will benefit the majority. They are laws that deal with safety and security and health. If we do not like those we put in office, we get another chance to change things. That is the way it has been for over 200 yrs and will remain the same. There is absolutely no way that taking up arms against the government is going to benefit anyone who does so. All of this rhetoric has occurred because those in power are seeking a solution to make us all safer. If taking away assault weapons does that, then we should be grateful. I understand this is not the first time that assault weapons have been banned. Who were the idiots that re-instated them anyway? Be prepared to be called a terrorist if you advocate taking up arms against the government and rightfully so. Obviously you are all for keeping YOUR weapons of mass destruction while being against the military (drones) and weapons of mass destruction. You do realize that is what separates ordinary citizens from our military. We have law enforcement agencies to protect us here at home. Ordinary citiizens with access to “Bushmaster’s” and those similar weapons, make it very difficult for our local police to do their jobs. They are not necessary and not having them available still gives you the right to own other guns, the same rights you had before they were invented.. If you want to make your own laws, start your own army and become your own entity then you are living in the wrong country. Maybe you can go start your own country somewhere and I can guarantee that it will end up the same as the one you live it. You will still have power hungry politicians, big business that thrives on greed and the very wealthy and the very poor. And guess what, your new country government will be passing regulations and laws to make it safer for the people who live there. They will insist on it. Like it or not, it is the only way it can work. Look at all the countries around the world. They are all the same, with rules to keep peace and harmony. Some are governed by force and others by the people who sometimes have to make unpopular decisions.
    I do not know what big secret you and your extremist groups think you know, but I am pretty sure it is more right wing rhetoric that makes its rounds as it has done ever since our country has been in existance. I am well into my sixties, served in the military, Ilived in a dozen different states, done a lot of traveling and watched a lot of politics. It is not our government that I find fightening. It is people who advocate violence to further their ideology when they can’t accept what the majority wants. It’s the “my way or no way” mentality. That is not the way the founding fathers drafted the constitution, you all claim to support.

    • http://flyovercindy.wordpress.com flyovercindy

      Whoa Mary, not only do I think you are the type of sheeple that tyrannical governments love, I’m afraid you have opened up a whole new can of whoop-a$$ on yourself…
      Enjoy the comments that are sure to come…

    • Bobseeks

      Wow – you have swallowed every liberal lie hook, line, and sinker. Even the dumbest catfish doesn’t always take the bait. I am sure that the puppet masters love witless sheep such as you.

  • JeffH

    Off topic: Rifle found in Adam Lanza’s trunk is not a Bushmaster or even an AR style weapon.

    After two weeks of media reports that a .223 AR-15 Bushmaster was found in the trunk of Lanza’s car, gun aficionados point out that the rifle is not a Bushmaster, nor even an AR-class assault weapon.

    Gun experts say that the weapon shown in an NBC News report is some kind of shotgun.

    Now it turns out that the rifle found in the trunk is not a Bushmaster at all, The police officer is, in gun owner’s jargon, cycling a bolt to clear the weapon. An AR uses a charging handle. Gun experts have said that the weapon shown in the video is some kind of shotgun. Here is the news report in which the “long weapon” is shown:
    http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/340113#ixzz2I4H4yfWV

    • JC

      Which makes reports of .223 ammunition all over the floor all the more suspicious.
      Who had the AR-15? Was it one of the other men arrested at the school? And what became of those guys?

      This whole thing has cover up written all over it.

      • nc

        JC, are you one of those sick imbeciles who have been harassing that kind fellow who cared for the children he discovered in his yard after the Newtown killings? Accusing him of being a part of a government plot to stage the whole thing? Sound familiar??? It doesn’t get any sicker than that! The only good part was that every one who responded to the report CONDEMNED THE COWARD WHO HARRASSED HIM WITHOUT GIVING THEIR NAME! IT’S PEOPLE LIKE THOSE CREEPS THAT KEEPS THE RIGHT WING CHASING IT TAIL IN THE PUBLIC POLLS!

    • redhawk

      How do you spell C O N S P I R A C Y? With our most high attorney general, Eric Holder at the helm, we’ll NEVER know, will we? My 78 year old mother sniffed that out a few days after it happened. If this is all cooked up it wouldn’t surprise me one bit. I’m half ashamed of myself for being so cynnical but people in high places, Repugnants or Demicans, are capable of anything these days!

      • JeffH

        This is just classic Alinsky, straight out of Rules for Radicals.
        When will the common people begin to recognize that there is intentional complicity by the media to mis-report and mis-represent almost every bit of news for the “cause” of the global eletists controlling them.

      • Karolyn

        “these days”? Like it’s something new?

      • Kate8

        JeffH – I’ve come to the conclusion that EVERY BIT OF NEWS WE GET OVER THE MEDIA IS FAKE.

        They never tell us the real stuff. What passes for “news” is concocted nonsense and coverup geared toward manipulating our reactions. Or it’s spun to appear other than what it is. It’s to “nudge” us into begging government to take away our rights in order to save us.

        The funny things is, when we don’t move the way the want, they simply report that we do. Like telling us how much we all love Obama, so we don’t question why he’s still there. Like they’re telling us how most of us WANT guns removed…when more guns than ever are being purchased.

        The real news is exactly what we need to know, and that is why we don’t get it.

        If we were to just stop listening, how would they control us?

        • navyjr

          Maybe that’s what I did wrong; I stopped listening; at least to the TV and radio; and I get my news from various sites on both sides of an issue; then seek the truth from the muddle. {No that wasn’t a typo, it IS a muddle!}

      • Vicki

        Kate8 writes:
        “Like they’re telling us how most of us WANT guns removed…when more guns than ever are being purchased.”

        Who is the “they” that told us (you?) that more guns then ever are being purchased?

        • navyjr

          I can’t speak for Kate8; but I live almost next door to a gun store, and they’ve been busier than a one-armed paper hanger in a wind storm of late; where they’d not been near that busy in general for some considerable time.

      • Kate8

        Vicki – Yes, I did think of that even as I was typing that out. That’s exactly the whole issue, isn’t it.

        Bottom line is, we’re told what we think. Media can throw up or out anything they want, and we react exactly as programmed.

  • http://midcontent brand inspector

    Remember this is the USA and Omoron hasn’t though of taxing soap, so Flashy can take a vaction with his soap, and he can soap as fast as he wants, we are not yet a UN dictatorship country yet..

  • Ted Keller

    There are so many controversies in America it makes my head spin. One wonders when will common sense ever prevail in regards to gun control, abortion, our national debt etc. We as Americans MUST come together on common ground to iron out our differences, always remembering history, United we stand, divided we fall. Becoming one way politically whether right or left leaves us open not only to harsh criticism, but to misinterpretation by those same critics. Common sense places us squarely in the middle of a controversy enabling us to see both sides rather than from a skewed point of view. This is primarily why our congress cannot get things done. They are so embroiled in partisan politics, that the will of the people gets thrown under the bus. That brings me to this point,”Life long congressmen and women are the bane of our countries existence. By that I mean, If we had term limits on Senators and Representatives, then they would not be able to so thoroughly entrench themselves in our treasury. Special interest groups lobby them to get special favors. Ever stop to think just how do those politicians get so wealthy. It’s not on their salary! Here’s the deal. We limit them to two terms of four years each, (what’s good enough for the president should be good enough for them) After the first four years in office and they thwart the will of the people, they are not voted back in, and oh incidentally, We as American tax payers are mandated by law to vest in our retirements only after five years of continuous service. See where I am going with this? If our congressmen and women do not get voted back in, their golden parachute will also not kick in. They didn’t make the cut of five years continuous service! No retirement if you don’t prove up. By the way, have you ever been able to vote yourself a raise? Our political landscape needs some mighty tweaking in regards to how our representatives access our treasury. Speaking of our treasury, ever stop to think, just how much $ does it really cost us to run the IRS. You know we hired them, we can fire them. A flat tax is really worth looking into!!!!!!!!

    • gunner

      The problem with the idea of term limits is that voters still want their Senators and Representatives to bring home the bacon so voters won’t approve terms limits. They won’t even vote them out of office when they run for re-election. keep the gravy train flowing!

  • GALT

    Which socialist enemies did you have in mind, Blankfein, Dimon, Welch, Koch,
    Buffet, Romney, Gates, etc?

  • http://www.resolutionsociety.org christine Fitz

    This is the best article I have read this month! It is clear, concise, and honest. I am a resistor to the tyranny. I hear and read so much crap and it’s mostly bitching about the problems. The “peaceful” resistance is getting on my nerves. I like your analogy, “sometimes the bully just needs to be punched in the teeth”. Look at where our peaceful redress for our grievances have gotten us. NOWHERE, not only nowhere, but 2 steps backwards. Time for that punch in the teeth!

    • GALT

      Yo Brandon……..you have another FAN…….who found something in your
      much ado about nothing………so does your alt.market do a brisk business
      in guns, ammo, survival training and assault knives?

  • Jimmy G

    Thanks Brandon, Amen brother. Taking my family to the Gun Show this Saturday. What a great state I live in.

  • robert

    We should all cut Craig some slack. He’s only 14.

  • Karolyn

    It seems as though Bob Livingston’s filters have been changed so as to get rid of as much ad hominem as possible. Today even people who have NEVER been edited before have had comments deleted.

  • Karolyn

    Tiday’s Good News! WalMart to carry more Made in USA merchandise! And they are hiring more veterans. It’s about time they gave something back!
    http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/business/2013/01/wal-mart-reveals-biggest-veterans-job-offer/

    • Karolyn
    • JeffH

      Karolyn says about Wal-Mart “It’s about time they gave something back!” Have they been stealing?

      And what pray tell do you mean by that comment? Hint, hint…she doesn’t have a clue but being a liberal she had to say it. Why don’t you just them evil K?

      • JeffH

        …just call them evil.

      • Dave67

        Walmart: Doesn’t pay many of the employees a full time wage which put them able to recieve food stamps from the Gov. THEFT OF OUR TAX PAYER MONEY

        Walmart, Does pay for employee benefits for this same group. THEFT OF OUR TAX PAYER MONEY WHEN THEY GET SICK.

        Walmart: Uses their market position to undercut pricing on anyone else (Small Business) in the market they go into, reducing competition and increasing the monopoly they have especially in poor areas. (ANTI-CAPITALISM)

        Walmart aides in driving our manfacturers to make more and more oveseas due to cheap labor which in turn drives our median wage down. (ANTI-AMERICAN)

        How is that JeffH? Walmart is not the company the Walton family started anymore. You probably shop there don’t you?

        • JeffH

          That’s just your deluded opinion D67, a lot of conjecture and nothing more.

          Walmart doesn’t force anybody to work for them and they crtainly don’t force anybody to collect welfare, food stamps or any other government handouts.

          Now I’d bet there are a whole lot worse companies to work for tha Wal-Mart…ya think?
          http://www.walmartstores.com/sites/sustainabilityreport/2007/associatesPersonal.html
          WalMart Compensation and Benefits:
          In the United States, our compensation package is competitive with others in the industry, totaling over $5.2 billion last year. In addition to what the market requires, we base wages on experience, skills, problem-solving and job accountability. The average hourly, full-time wage for Associates in our U.S. stores is $10.76.

          These wages, while competitive with industry, are in many cases entry level jobs. Every Associate is eligible to receive performance bonuses based on the performance of their store. In fact, earlier this year, 813,759 Wal-Mart and Sam’s Club hourly Associates in the United States were awarded more than $529.8 million in bonuses. A full-time, hourly Associate can receive bonuses of up to $1,800 at Wal-Mart Stores and $2,200 at Sam’s Club per year. We also offer a long-term service award, which rewards hourly Associates and assistant managers who have been with the company for 20 years or more with an extra week of pay.

          Our view of compensation is a holistic one that takes into account much more than the wages and bonuses we pay. It encompasses health benefits, retirement savings, profit sharing and stock purchase programs that allow our Associates to plan for the future.

          Consistent with our belief in sharing our profits, we may contribute up to two percent of an Associate’s salary to the profit-sharing plan and 401(k) plan. Associates are not required to contribute any of their own money to the plans in order to get the company contribution.

          Details of the various benefits include:

          Health Benefits: All Associates – whether full-time or part-time – can become eligible for health benefits with Wal-Mart, and all children of Associates become eligible for coverage as soon as their parents do. We offer a wide variety of health plan options to meet their differing needs. Every Associate who works in the continental United States can become eligible for individual health coverage that costs as little as $5 per month in some areas and no more than $8 per month nationwide. Moreover, beginning in January 2008, those who participate in our plans will be able to get more than 2,400 generic prescriptions for $4. Read more about Health Care benefits.

          401(k) Plan: Wal-Mart may contribute up to two percent of eligible Associates’ annual wages to a 401 (k) plan, after a 12-month waiting period. Contributions may be made even if Associates choose not to add money of their own.

          Profit Sharing Plan: Every eligible Associate who has worked for the company for 12 months may receive a company contribution of up to two percent of their wages to a profit sharing account. Contributions are made even if Associates choose not to add money of their own.

          Stock Purchase Plan: We contribute to Associates’ stock purchase by matching 15 cents for every dollar of stock purchased through payroll deductions, up to the first $1,800 in purchases each plan year.

          How Do Our Benefits Compare?

          In a comparison of 20 large retailers and grocers, the Hewitt Benefit Index® found that Wal-Mart’s benefits are competitive. While the Hewitt Benefit Index® average score is 100, Wal-Mart scored 104.8 on all employer-paid benefits, 102 on employer-paid active health care (medical, dental, vision and hearing), and 217.4 on retirement savings. The next closest employer to Wal-Mart in the retirement savings benefits category scored 199.1.

          Every Associate who works in the continental United States can become eligible for individual health coverage that costs as little as $5 per month in some areas and no more than $8 per month nationwide. For Associates who enroll in the Value Plan, we introduced an annual pre-deductible health care credit for each covered family member who will be able to choose a $100, $250 or $500 credit that can be used to pay for covered medical expenses before costs are applied to the annual deductible. With the credit, the first $100, $250 or $500 in eligible medical expenses for each person covered by the plan are paid by the plan and not by the covered Associate or family member.

          In addition to low premiums and pre-deductible health credits, we want to make sure that Associates and their family members have access to the medicines they need. Starting in January 2008, those who participate in our plans will be able to get more than 2,400 generic prescriptions for $4, up from less than 20 generic medicines for $3 in 2007.

          How Our Health Care Benefits Compare to Other Retailers and Grocers

          The changes we’ve made to our health care benefits add up to health coverage that is competitive with other retailers. In fact, a recent Hewitt Benefit Index® showed that amongst a competitor set of 20 unionized and non-unionized retailers and grocers, Wal-Mart measured 102 on health benefits, which was above the average retail score of 100.

          Diversity Awards

          Continually recognized as a top employer by well-regarded diversity publications and organizations, the company still continues to strive for excellence in all of our business practices. Our effort to foster an environment where diversity is understood, valued, and incorporated at the core of our business, has earned us numerous awards and accolades.

          This year, Diversity Inc. named Wal-Mart one of the “Top 50 Companies for Diversity, and Working Mother magazine identified us as a 2007 “Best Company for Multicultural Women.” In 2006, Black Enterprise magazine honored us as one of the “40 Best Companies for Diversity,” and Hispanic Magazine has called us one of the “Corporate 100 Best Places to Work for Latinos” for the last three years running. In addition, the American Bar Association recognized us with its 2007 “Spirit of Excellence Corporate Award” for promoting diversity in the legal profession, and for the last several years in Mexico we have received an award on Gender Equity from the National Women Institute. The award recognizes our numerous programs that support female recruitment and career development at Wal-Mart de Mexico.

          Yes, I rarely but occassionaly do shop there…your point?

          .

    • Karolyn

      WalMart has become one of the largest companies in the world by underpaying their employees and providing cheap chinese merchandise. Sam Walton would be ashamed of his family. I know someone who used to sit and talk with him around the potbelly stove. He could care less about money and only had two Cadillacs because his wife bought one for him and one for her. This country made WalMart and it is fitting that it should carry more products made in this country, and hiring 100,000 vets is a plus.

      • Vicki

        Karolyn says:
        “WalMart has become one of the largest companies in the world by underpaying their employees…..”

        According to you. If you don’t like what they are doing go start your own. You could call it k-Mart. Pay your employees so well that all of those supposedly under paid Walmart employees will run to your store.

        Tell us how it works out. Might need a different name though.

  • Dave67

    I do enjoy right wing conservatives wanting progressives and the left to see them as “individuals” and trying to explain “conservatism” as practiced in this country while at the same time conservatives generalize progressives and liberals at every turn and make false cliams about progressives/liberals…

    Its nothing else but entertaining…

    Now. “NeoCon”. A NeoCon is just a conservative who reaches a position of real power. There is nobody using the term “neo-Liberal” to describe liberals who “gasp” compromise to get things done. Its another way conservatives get out of responsibility for anything they do.

    Ronnie Reagan would NOT be a conservative today as defined by the looney right that comes to this board. It was George W. Bush that passed the Patriot Act less we forget. He flies the conservative flag too… But Brandon and his ilk don’t let him in the conserfvative club because like Reagan, both expanded the fed Gov.

    Brandon, your article was entertaining to this liberal… Its BS but entertaining. Are conservatives ever responsible for anything?

  • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing WTS/Jay

    The warning signs of a tyrannical takeover of our Constitutional Republic have been flashing red for some time now and are now reaching a fever pitch. Despite the flashing signs, the clamor of the alarms and the cries of the watchmen, most Americans of this era remain in denial or have been rendered intellectually catatonic by busily chasing immediate gratification in the form of the newest version of the iPhone, iPad, or whatever “i” device will satisfy their ADHD addled intellect.

    Others have simply chosen to adhere to a normalcy bias that is continuously fed by the familiar faces and voices of political pundits who remain dedicated to the lie of the right-left, Republican-Democrat paradigm of American politics, unwilling or unable to look at the larger picture for fear of being shamed by accusations of being part of a conspiracy fringe. Instead, these pundits would rather ignore the lie and squander their ability to make a difference, to educate and inform others of the dangers of the lie they know exists.

    We must realize that we are not witnessing the fundamental change of America as represented by the mindless mantra of the Obama campaign, but something much deeper, much more nefarious, and something that will not be rectified through the ballot box. As uncomfortable as it is, what we face cannot and will not wait for the next general election. Actions have consequences, but so does inaction.

    We are living in a time in history where some will rise to be held in high esteem as heroes in history books that have yet to be written, and victims who never saw their unfortunate status coming or were fooled into believing that things are not as bad as some make them out to be. The former will suffer greatly by selfless acts performed to save what previous generations have fought to preserve, while the latter will remain complicit by their cluelessness and catatonic in ignorance that will be anything but blissful.

    The fuse that will ignite one of the most turbulent times in American and global history has been lit and now burns with incredible speed. It’s ignition is neither an accident nor does it originate from good intent, but a deliberate act by a “deluded elite” advancing an agenda that is so breathtakingly evil that it defies all rationality.

    Hanlon’s Razor does not apply

    There is a familiar adage known as Hanlon’s Razor that states “[N]ever attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.” Unfortunately, too many people have chosen to believe that the events we are seeing, including all of the related consequences, are due to the incompetence of those who have been elected and appointed to lead our nation. This is particularly evident by those who continue to purvey the defunct notion of the right-left, Republican-Democrat paradigm of American politics, and the people who follow them.

    The Agenda

    We are not witnessing incompetence, but the fulfillment of an agenda generations in the making. A century ago our Republic experienced a coup in the form of a monetary takeover through the creation of the Federal Reserve, followed by a consolidation of power through the IRS. We were slowly being led into a system of global governance by the same international banking cabal that exists today. Yet, too few understand the larger picture.

    Over a half-century ago, Senator Joe McCarthy was vilified by trying to warn Americans that our government was being infiltrated by Communists. Much like today, his warnings went unheeded, and the infiltration of the Communist element into America thrived. History books have been not only been unkind, but incorrect, as we are bearing witness today to the very threat of which he warned. In fact, documents and testimony related to his findings were found to have been inexplicably removed from the national archives. Not in the 1950′s, but as late as the 1990′s. The timing of such removal is no accident.
    The Communist infiltration combined with the Islamic infiltration, the Balkanization of America through our open borders and lax immigration enforcement, and numerous other policies and practices antithetical to the survival of our Republic have been embraced and advanced by both political parties to bring us to the point we find ourselves today. We are on the verge of a civil war, exactly as warned by my source inside the DHS last spring.

    This civil war is designed to divide America, to soften us and ultimately destroy us from within. United, our Republic poses an insurmountable impediment of the implementation of a global society rooted in Communism and disguised as social progressivism. The methods of implementation are not secret. They are outlined in part by the Cloward-Piven strategy, and well documented by Carroll Quigley, a god of the Clinton power structure. At the base of the agenda exist the Fabian Socialists, Karl Marx. Antonio Gramsci, and the Frankfort School of neo-Marxist interdisciplinary social theory.

    Bitter clingers in the cross-hairs

    Today, we find ourselves at the precipice of a tyrannical takeover and the complete destruction of our Republic, best illustrated by the talk of disarming the American populace.

    The assertion is that the it’s for the children when, in fact, the children are being used as political capital to advance the political agenda of American disarmament, loss of liberty, sovereignty, and the rights bestowed on our Republic by God as enumerated by our Constitution. Notice how there is a war not only against gun owners, but a parallel war against the very Judeo-Christian principles on which this country was founded.

    Today, we are facing a crisis of epic proportions where you will have to choose a side. Will you be the one who stands bravely and alone before a column of tanks, or will continue on your quest for instant gratification?

    The war we face is not just about guns. It’s about our survival as a nation and the fate of our children, grandchildren and future generations. Which side of history will you be on?

    http://www.homelandsecurityus.com/archives/7462#more-7462

    • Nick Czudy

      Jay, what you said was well written, but it turned out to be another doom and gloom our country is going down the drain and will be taken over my communists, that want to take our guns , etc, etc, etc,. What happened in your life that you think like this? really. I am trying to figure this out. You condone the McCarthy which hunts? I feel sorry that you grew up with this type of indoctrination. Nick Cz

  • don211

    A thoughtful piece about the problems we all face in choosing sides and how to vote. We are often divided as a nation and as individuals since so many of us are conservative on some issues and liberal on others. We vote for change and we get the same old stuff regardless of party. Yet there seems to be some light at the end of the tunnel if Rubio and Obama can agree on an immigration policy. Progress likely lies in finding more issues where we can work on problem solving instead of name calling

    • navyjr

      Why would they NOT agree? They’re in the same “club” and on the same agenda page!

  • Dan

    Your all just nuts

    • navyjr

      That’s a pretty broad spectrum “diagnosis” from someone who evidently has no clue what’s really going on around him…. Might want to really check some of the facts before you make such a foolish decision, because the price of doing so might be called in soon, and a LOT higher than you’re willing to pay.

  • FreedomFighter

    As they taught me in Boy Scouts – “Be Prepared”

    > The White House, Congress and government agencies will leap at any
    > opportunity to place the citizens of the U.S.A. under Martial Law. Thanks
    > to our government, we have never been so vulnerable. Be prepared to act when
    > one or more of the various “terrorist” attacks occur.

    Juval Aviv was the Israeli Agent upon whom the movie ‘ Munich ‘ was based.
    > He was Golda Meir’s bodyguard. She appointed him to track down and bring to
    > justice the Palestinian terrorists who took the Israeli athletes hostage and
    > killed them during the Munich Olympic Games.
    >
    > In a lecture in New York City a few weeks ago, Aviv shared information that
    > EVERY American needs to know – but that our government has not yet shared
    > with us.
    >
    > Aviv predicted the London subway bombing on the Bill O’Reilly show on Fox
    > News stating publicly that it would happen within a week. At the time,
    > O’Reilly laughed and mocked him saying that in a week he wanted Aviv back on
    > the show. But, unfortunately, within a week the terrorist attack had
    > occurred.
    >
    > Juval Aviv gave intelligence (via what he had gathered in Israel and the
    > Middle East ) to the Bush Administration about 9/11 a month before it
    > occurred. His report specifically said that they would use planes as bombs
    > and target high profile buildings and monuments. Congress has since hired
    > him as a security consultant.
    >
    > Now for Aviv’s future predictions: He predicts the next terrorist attack on
    > the U.S. will occur within the next few months..
    >
    >
    > Forget hijacking airplanes, because he says terrorists will NEVER try
    > hijacking a plane again as they know the people onboard will never go down
    > quietly again. Aviv believes our airport security is a joke–that we have
    > been reactionary rather than proactive in developing strategies that are
    > truly effective.
    >
    > For example:
    >
    >
    > 1) Our airport technology is outdated. We look for metal, and the new
    > explosives are made of plastic.
    >
    > 2) He talked about how some idiot tried to light his shoe on fire. Because
    > of that, now everyone has to take off their shoes. A group of idiots tried
    > to bring aboard liquid explosives. Now we can’t bring liquids on board. He
    > says he’s waiting for some suicidal maniac to pour liquid explosive on his
    > underwear; at which point, security will have us all traveling naked! Every
    > strategy we have is reactionary.
    >
    > 3) We only focus on security when people are heading to the gates. Aviv says
    > that if a terrorist attack targets airports in the future, they will target
    > busy times on the front end of the airport when/where people are checking
    > in. It would be easy for someone to take two suitcases of explosives, walk
    > up to a busy check-in line, ask a person next to them to watch their bags
    > for a minute while they run to the restroom or get a drink, and then
    > detonate the bags BEFORE security even gets involved. In Israel , security
    > checks bags BEFORE people can even ENTER the
    > airport.
    >
    > Aviv says the next terrorist attack here in America is imminent and will
    > involve suicide bombers and non-suicide bombers in places where large groups
    > of people congregate… (i.e., Las Vegas
    > casinos, big cities (New York, San Francisco, Chicago, etc.) and that it
    > will also include shopping malls, subways in rush hour, train stations,
    > etc., as well as rural America this time (Wyoming, Montana, etc.).
    >
    > The attack will be characterized by simultaneous detonations around the
    > country (terrorists like a big impact), involving at least 5-8 cities,
    > including rural areas.
    >
    > Aviv says terrorists won’t need to use suicide bombers in many of the larger
    > cities, because at places like the MGM Grand in Las Vegas , they can simply
    > valet park a car loaded with explosives and walk away.
    >
    > Aviv says all of the above is well known in intelligence circles, but that
    > our U.S. Government does not want to ‘alarm American citizens’ with the
    > facts.. The world is quickly going to become ‘a different place’, and issues
    > like ‘global warming’ and political correctness will become totally
    > irrelevant.
    >
    > On an encouraging note, Aviv says that Americans don’t have to be concerned
    > about being nuked. He says the terrorists who want to destroy America will
    > not use sophisticated weapons. They like to use suicide as a front-line
    > approach. It’s cheap, it’s easy, it’s effective; and they have an infinite
    > abundance of young militants more than willing to ‘meet their
    > destiny’.
    >
    > Aviv also says the next level of terrorists, over which America should be
    > most concerned, will not be coming from abroad. But will be, instead, ‘home
    > grown’- that means having attended and been educated in our own schools and
    > universities right here in the U.S. He says to look for ‘students’ who
    > frequently travel back and forth to the Middle East . These young terrorists
    > will be most dangerous because they will know our language and will fully
    > understand the habits of Americans; but that we Americans won’t
    > know/understand a thing about them.
    >
    > Aviv says that, as a people, Americans are unaware and uneducated about the
    > terrorist threats we will, inevitably, face. America still has only a
    > handful of Arabic and Farsi speaking people in our intelligence networks,
    > and Aviv says it is critical that we change that fact SOON.
    >
    > So, what can America do to protect itself? From an intelligence perspective,
    > Aviv says the U.S. needs to stop relying on satellites and technology for
    > its intelligence. We need to, instead, follow Israel ‘s, Ireland ‘s and
    > England ‘s hands-on examples of human intelligence, both from an
    > infiltration perspective as well as to trust ‘aware’ citizens to help… We
    > need to engage and educate ourselves as citizens; however, our U.S.
    > Government continues to treat us, its citizens, ‘like babies’. Our
    > government thinks we ‘can’t handle the truth’ and are concerned that we’ll
    > panic if we understand the realities of terrorism.
    >
    > Aviv says this is a deadly mistake..
    >
    > Aviv recently created/executed a security test for our Congress, by placing
    > an empty briefcase in five well-traveled spots in five major cities. The
    > results? Not one person called 911 or sought a policeman to check it out. In
    > fact, in Chicago , someone tried to steal the briefcase!
    >
    > In comparison, Aviv says that citizens of Israel are so well ‘trained’ that
    > an unattended bag or package would be reported in seconds by citizen(s) who
    > know to publicly shout, ‘Unattended Bag!’ The area would be quickly & calmly
    > cleared by the citizens themselves. But, unfortunately, America hasn’t been
    > ‘hurt enough’ yet by terrorism for their government to fully understand the
    > need to educate its citizens or for the government to understand that it’s
    > their citizens who are, inevitably, the best first-line of defense against
    > terrorism.
    >
    > Aviv also was concerned about the high number of children here in America
    > who were in preschool and kindergarten after 9/11, who were ‘lost’ without
    > parents being able to pick them up, and about our schools that had no plan
    > in place to best care for the students until parents could get there.. (In
    > New York City , this was days, in some cases!)
    >
    > He stresses the importance of having a plan that’s agreed upon within your
    > family, to respond to in the event of a terrorist emergency. He urges
    > parents to contact their children’s schools and demand that the schools,
    > too, develop plans of actions, as they do in Israel .
    >
    > Does your family know what to do if you can’t contact one another by phone?
    > Where would you gather in an emergency?
    >
    > He says we should all have a plan that is easy enough for even our youngest
    > children to remember and follow.
    >
    > Aviv says that the U.S. Government has in force a plan that, in the event of
    > another terrorist attack, will immediately cut-off EVERYONE’s ability to use
    > cell phones, blackberries, etc., as this is the preferred communication
    > source used by terrorists and is often the way that their bombs are
    > detonated.
    >
    > How will you communicate with your loved ones in the event you cannot speak?
    > You need to have a plan.

    >>>>>>>>>from an email author unknown, Is this a reason why they are pushing for gun control so much, disarm us b4 all hell breaks loose?

    Laus Deo
    Semper Fi

    • navyjr

      I think the one thing that has escaped Mr Aviv, in this is the fact that our own government IS the terrorists, or at least part of them, so don’t want us protected from them, or aware of how to defend ourselves against them. His points are all well taken otherwise, and from what I learned growing up about security at Tel Aviv airport from my Dad who flew in and out of there as a pilot often, it fits the pattern I’m familiar with. Israel has had to be much more intensively security aware than America has, or has been allowed to be. But those measures are NOT at our airports to stop terrorists at all; they’re to strip us of our 4th Amendment rights and protections and to acclimate us to being molested routinely; to break down our moral compunctions against such behavior, along with the homosexual agenda, to eliminate our moral foundations.

      • Nick Czudy

        Jeeeezzzz What a bunch of Bull Pucky.! Government is the terrorists and want us all to be homos and slaves. Do you guys actually go about your daily lives in such paranoia?

        • navyjr

          Keep in mind it’s only paranoia when there’s NOT someone after you; my government declared me a “potential domestic terrorist” over 3 years ago! My “crime”? Serving in our military to keep our Constitutional rights ours. And I have a gift, from a Power you apparently aren’t acquainted with, that I can see where pieces of a puzzle fit, that others often, but NOT always, fail to see as quickly; in fact, a great many are beginning to see that picture now. So I’ll just leave you with this; when you find yourself herded into a slave camp or colony, don’t say you weren’t warned.

          • Nick Czudy

            Navy Jr. You did not mention what your issue was in being declared a terrorist while you served in the military? You are correct, I do not have a gift from on high. You are lucky. But I will not lose a single night of sleep, being worried about being herded into a camp or colony. I really believe that we are past this sort of thing happening in our world. I think that you should chill out a little bit. But anyway. I wish you the warmest regards. Nick Cz

      • FreedomFighter

        I believe everything you said navyjr, its all wraped in one big ugly full spectrum attack on we Americans.

        Laus Deo
        Semper Fi

        • navyjr

          Semper Fi, sir, and thank-you for your service. I wish others did see the truth, but most choose to remain blind and deaf to it; because it’s “too scary” for them, and might actually require something of them they’re unwilling to give!

      • Nick Czudy

        Navyjr. Can you please tell me how our current government are terrorists? What have they done? I am not aware of anything. I for one do not mind being checked at an airport to keep me safe. It is a small interruption. I would rather have a thousand pat downs and scans than be on one airplane that crashes. Yes it is a executive cabinet clandestine plan to take our moralities and away and make us all into homos. They are not busy with gun amendments, the debt, jobs, economy, immigration, world wars in Syria and Afghanistan. No they are busy plotting to make us all into homosexuals. jeeeezzz. Why is it only on these right wing sites that all of this flap crap is proliferating?

        • navyjr

          TSA couldn’t secure a wet paper bag, much less a flight from terrorists; and if you don’t know how this regime is a terrorist organization, there’s no way to tell you because you’ve already bought the poisoned fruit and eaten it!

    • Nick Czudy

      FF Thanks for the article,. it was very interesting and enlightening. Thanks. Nick Cz

  • Kate8

    Brandon Smith – I have become a great admirer of your thinking and your writing. Thanks for another great article… and please, keep ‘em coming.

    PS. I also love the way you handle GALT. He’s an enigma, for sure.

  • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing WTS/Jay

    In 1969, William Kunstler, the famous radical-left lawyer, gave a speech in Oakland, California, to the black community. In his concluding remarks, he reminded the audience that the Black Panther Party for Self Defense was the full name of the Panthers.

    Kunstler, speaking “both as a lawyer and a human being,” affirmed the legality of armed self-defense against brutal actions by the white police.

    “It is most important to secure your community…If you have the power to defend yourself by weapons that are legal…what I’m advising here is perfectly legal…you must stand ready…to protect yourself…your lives…your property…”

    Why is that need for self-defense any different from, say, white ranchers living in border states where Mexican drug gangs are setting up powerful outposts on American soil?

    The government wants no one to make the connection, to see the common cause.

    No one must believe that, when citizens, black or white or Latino or Asian, are under threat from criminals of ANY skin color, they have the right to armed self-defense.

    If all Americans perceived this common need, regardless of circumstances or the skin-tone of the particular criminals who constitute a threat, then all people would stand together.

    Here are the words of conservative author, Ann Coulter, who is reviled by the progressive Left. She is writing about Robert Williams, a black man who understood the value and role of guns.

    “A World War II Marine veteran, Williams returned home to Monroe, N.C., to find the [Ku Klux] Klan riding high — beating, lynching and murdering blacks at will. No one would join the NAACP for fear of Klan reprisals. Williams became president of the local chapter and increased membership from six to more than 200.

    “But it was not until he got a charter from the NRA in 1957 and founded the Black Armed Guard that the Klan got their comeuppance in Monroe.

    “Williams’ repeated thwarting of violent Klan attacks is described in his stirring book, Negroes with Guns. In one crucial battle, the Klan sieged the home of a black physician and his wife, but Williams and his Black Armed Guard stood sentry and repelled the larger, cowardly force. And that was the end of it.

    “As the Klan found out, it’s not so much fun when the rabbit’s got the gun.

    “…In the preface to Negroes With Guns, Williams writes: ‘I have asserted the right of Negroes to meet the violence of the Ku Klux Klan by armed self-defense — and have acted on it. It has always been an accepted right of Americans, as the history of our Western states proves, that where the law is unable, or unwilling, to enforce order, the
    citizens can, and must act in self-defense against lawless violence.’”

    continued:
    http://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/2013/01/14/what-government-fears-most-blacks-and-whites-united-with-guns/

  • http://gravatar.com/bychoosing WTS/Jay

    The best way to depict what’s going on in America is through a letter from the head of the Sinaloa Drug Cartel, to President Obama.

    In case people are ready to assume this letter is real, it isn’t, but the spirit of it is very true and very real:

    Dear President Obama,

    Let me begin by saying that you can count on us to support your efforts in disarming American citizens in any way we can.

    The Fast and Furious operation backfired a bit in this regard, but I’m glad to see it hasn’t stopped you.

    As you know, we are making inroads on US soil. We’ve set up significant operations in the Southwest, one area where armed citizens can be a bit of trouble to us, especially if they own land we cross or are adjacent to.

    We view their disarming with a positive attitude. I would say your basic gun-grabbing strategy is primarily aimed at the American West. The border states need to be cleaned out. The fewer people there who have guns (particularly those with high-capacity clips), the easier it is for us.

    But since our drug trafficking lines take in most of America, wherever citizens aren’t armed we’re generally in better shape.

    I’m pleasantly surprised that media in your country haven’t pressed you to name the areas where most gun violence is taking place. After all, if your objective is to reduce that violence, you would think a campaign directed at gangs in inner cities would rank number one on your to-do list.

    Those areas and those gangs do subcontracting work for us (and other Mexican cartels). Leaving them in place is a priority for us. So congratulations on being able to skirt this tricky issue. Your cojones are, indeed, huge.

    Please pass along my thanks to Brian Williams, Scott Pelley, and Diane Sawyer. I assume they are in your pocket and carrying your message. Undoubtedly, they are also refraining from bringing up the gang issue. Whenever I speak with the president of Mexico, I point out your masterly and deft control of media as a model we should emulate.

    Now to the real reason I’m writing. In Chicago, your crime stronghold, one of our people is on trial. This is a sensitive matter, as you know.

    The defendant, Jesus Vicente Zambada-Niebla, wants to expose our arrangement. This must not happen. So far, your DEA and CIA have managed to gain trial delays.

    Niebla and his lawyers are ready to offer documents that show the Sinaloa has US federal permission to ship tons of drugs into Chicago, and from there to other distribution points in the US.

    Niebla will reveal this deal was made so that Sinaloa would provide valuable information on our rival cartels to the DEA and the FBI.

    Therefore, Niebla will point out that he has special immunity from prosecution. That was part of the deal for high-ranking Sinaloa members.

    Fortunately, his trial hasn’t been played up in the American press. Again, well done. Coverage has been stifled. It’s stayed on the back burner, and the CIA and DEA are claiming no such immunity deal exists for Niebla.

    But at the same time, the CIA has been making motions in court to have documents excluded from the trial on the basis of National Security.

    This is a gross tip-off to our deal, and it doesn’t sit well with me. It’s awkward. I’m sure you agree, Mr. President.

    The last thing we need here is exposure, especially while you’re pushing forward your gun-grabbing program.

    Sinaloa has members and agents and sub-contractors operating all over the US, and naturally these people are armed. They not only sell drugs, they shoot people. We can’t control everything they do.

    They get into intramural squabbles and use their weapons to settle disagreements. Bodies pile up. Sometimes, innocent people are killed.

    Our subcontractors commit unrelated crimes that have nothing to do with drugs. They rob, they steal, they shoot, they kill.

    If it comes out that Sinaloa and all its component parts, operating within US borders, are contributing mightily to high gun-violence statistics—

    And if it comes out that Sinaloa has a special arrangement to do business in the US without fear of disruption—

    Your gun-grabbing program and our operations will both be in dire jeopardy.

    And the blow-up in the press will be catastrophic for both of us.

    You and I understand this is just business, but other people don’t see it that way.

    Therefore, Mr. President, I’m stating, in the strongest terms possible, that the Niebla trial in Chicago has to be shut down, one way or another.

    Either a quiet plea deal has to be struck, or we will be forced to do something drastic. Soon.

    If I’m reading you right, and I believe I am, your gun-grabbing program is just one step in an Operation Chaos aimed at destabilizing your country.

    In the past, we have contributed to that agenda, and we continue to do so. We don’t pretend to understand this whole game at its higher levels, but to us that doesn’t matter. We’re in business to make money and sell product.

    We support you.

    And we expect you to support us.

    Congratulations on achieving a second term in office. Please pass along my regards to President Bush, his father, and President Clinton.

    By the way, in case you weren’t briefed on the specifics of the Aurora and Sandy Hook shootings, I want to state, unequivocally, that no Sinaloa member provided professional services in those operations, which were obviously aimed at provoking a successful follow-up gun-control program.

    Yours truly,

    XXXXXX

    CEO, Sinaloa

    http://jonrappoport.wordpress.com/category/2012-massacres/

    • Kate8

      Excellent, Jay.

  • ibcamn

    wow did king Obama’s thin skin show today or what??that’s the tip of the iceburg,wait till you see what the kids and the mrs have been putting up with all these years,i feel bad for his kids..not for her(she’s a little upputty and angtsy)the mum!he doesn’t have to answer to anyone now so he’s gonna steamroll his agenda and his true colors will come out!

  • James

    I too, was a Democrat and I see what is happening and their point of view on things are wrong. Calling evil good.

    • navyjr

      Welcome to the harsh and often lonely world of reality, James.

  • dianiline

    “…angry blood-crazed Republicans that bumbled into the Iraq War while blindly following Bush…”

    Those were figments of your fevered left-wing imagination. We went to war because the Iraqi people deserved peace and freedom just as much as we do. Perhaps you will say that it was not our job to provide it for them, and perhaps we have not been as successful as we would have liked. And certainly we bailed on them before we should have.

    It is hard to imagine how you can consider yourself a proponent of liberty, and yet oppose the Iraqi war.

    • Bob666

      “We went to war because the Iraqi people deserved peace and freedom just as much as we do. Perhaps you will say that it was not our job to provide it for them, and perhaps we have not been as successful as we would have liked. And certainly we bailed on them before we should have”.

      “It is hard to imagine how you can consider yourself a proponent of liberty, and yet oppose the Iraqi war”

      Well Dianiline,
      Let’s stroll down that road with your road map and review the history of that one trillion dollar folly that took out over 5k American service men and women (not counting allies and contractors) that was charged to “W” credit card -off of the balance sheet that my children will be paying for. “We went to war because the Iraqi people deserved peace and freedom just as much as we do”-Horse hockey!

      If that were even 1% true, then how come we stopped there? Why not Somalia, Mali, Chad or Algeria? Better yet, Libya with Muammar Gaddafi-He actually did promote real terrorism against the United States and the rest of the free world and forget the fact that three of these five African countries are the Petri-dish for terr-university, there is more human suffering there than Iraq as a whole. What about Iran, now that IS THE hot bed of bad guys-remember that little hostage situation between 1979 and 1981, because they are real deal when it comes to bad guys that hate us.

      No Dianiline, we went to Iraq because there is oil in that there ground and pissing off Iran to the north was to be the icing on the cake to get those Iranian mullah’s in line. Thanks to that gee-wiz Quest, Iran has a new pro-Iran neighbor. “perhaps we have not been as successful as we would have liked” is probably the only statement in your post that is even semi-rational and remotely resembles reality.

      “It is hard to imagine how you can consider yourself a proponent of liberty, and yet oppose the Iraqi war”.

      Seriously? Most people probably feel dumber for having read that statement. Fair and Balanced has failed you.

      • dianiline

        Bob666 says:
        January 16, 2013 at 7:49 pm
        1. (snip)“We went to war because the Iraqi people deserved peace and freedom just as much as we do”-Horse hockey!”

        2. (snip)”Thanks to that gee-wiz Quest, Iran has a new pro-Iran neighbor. “perhaps we have not been as successful as we would have liked” is probably the only statement in your post that is even semi-rational and remotely resembles reality.”

        3. (snip)”“It is hard to imagine how you can consider yourself a proponent of liberty, and yet oppose the Iraqi war”.

        Seriously? Most people probably feel dumber for having read that statement. Fair and Balanced has failed you.”
        _______________

        Hi, Bob Number of the Beast!

        1. No, really, we did go to war for the peace and freedom of the Iraqi people. Also, of course, because of the threat of Iraqi weapons of mass destruction. Yes, I know we didn’t find any. Without going to war, we would not have known that they didn’t have any because they consistently refused to allow the inspections required of them.

        It amazes me that people claim that the war was about oil. If that were true, why is gas so expensive? I do think that with all that we’ve done and continue to do for the oil-producing countries in the Middle East, they ought to be selling us oil very cheaply. Instead they keep taking our money and raising their prices. Not a grateful people.

        2. And we have not been as successful as we would have liked mostly because of the enemy’s minions here at home, who kept up this blather about a war for oil and a quagmire and about the American lives lost, when for the most part our soldiers are proud to fight for the freedom of others. Then we betrayed those soldiers, and the people of Iraq, and ourselves, by pulling out when the job was not yet done. It will be a hard thing to establish and maintain a republic with a largely Muslim population, since Islam is fundamentally opposed to the principles of a republic. Separation of church and state is essentially heresy to Muslims. We ought not to have deserted our allies in Iraq, and we will live to regret that political blunder.

        3. Yes, seriously. You should feel dumber for having read that statement, if it came as news to you.

        Dianiline

        • Bob666

          Dianiline,
          Do you read this stuff before posting?

          “Also, of course, because of the threat of Iraqi weapons of mass destruction”, would that be Pixy Dust? “Yes, I know we didn’t find any”-Duh?

          “If that were true, why is gas so expensive?” Maybe Supply is less than demand, never took econ 101 in school did you?

          “I do think that with all that we’ve done and continue to do for the oil-producing countries in the Middle East, they ought to be selling us oil very cheaply. Instead they keep taking our money and raising their prices” –that statement is not stupid, it’s naive!

          “Not a grateful people”, “deserved peace and freedom just as much as we do”- No world history in school or econ 101?

          “And we have not been as successful as we would have liked mostly because of bla, bla, bla, bla, bla, bla, bla, bla, bla, bla, bla, bla” Do you know how many Iranian lives were lost?

          “Then we betrayed those soldiers and the people of Iraq, and ourselves, by pulling out when the job was not yet done”. They wanted us out of there!

          But-mY Favorite, wait, here it is:

          “It will be a hard thing to establish and maintain a republic with a largely Muslim population, since Islam is fundamentally opposed to the principles of a republic. Separation of church and state is essentially heresy to Muslims”. Iraq is Muslim (official) 97% (Shia 60%-65%, Sunni 32%-37%). READ THIS AND ASK YOURSELF-AM I REALLY THAT STUPID?????

          Yes, seriously. You should feel dumber for having read that statement, this was not news, this was a pathetic cry for help from someone who lives in a cultural vacuum.

          Dianiline, it’s one thing to be ignorant, but it’s quite another to Waller in Ignorance with Pride.

          This is so very sad.

        • Nick Czudy

          to all of you that think that USA went to war with Iraq over oil. It was not about oil. It was about OPEC had been discussing moving the valuation of oil from the US dollar to the Euro. Because oil denominated in US dollars was world wide standard. every country in the world needed to keep the US dollar as the defacto universal currency. Since the Euro was beating out the US dollar, and with the urging of France and Germany, OPEC had been talking about moving the valuation over to the Euro. This would have devalued the US dollar by more than 20% world wide and set the USA into the worst depression ever. Our dollar would lose most of its value. Dollars would have been dumped world wide. There would have been a run on our banks and we would have been screwed.
          Ny invading Iraq, this basically waved a sword in front of Sadam (One of the main instigators of this switch) and the other OPEC countries to stick with the US dollar. This is a little know underlying fact of the Iraq invasion. It was not about access to the oil or to take over control of the oil.. It was a much more important factor to keep the USA as the defacto world currency. There are only a few economists that know about this factor.

          • Bob666

            Yo Nick,
            I remember somthing about that. In fact, if memory serves me, our friend to the south, Hugo Chávez was also pushing that agenda at rhe same time. While I’m not sure that I agree with you, it could very well have been a factor in that ten plus year folly.

            You do know that you will be corrected on this issue very soon.

          • Nick Czudy

            Bob. It was a very deep underlying factor. And yes you are probably right, I am sure that I will get reprimanded soon. But I will go to bed soon and will not have to read it until tomorrow. Warm regards. Nick Cz

      • dianiline

        Hi Bob,

        You obviously know a great deal of stuff. Too bad so much of it is not true.

        The supply of oil is not less than the demand. Those who control the supply restrict their production to artificially keep the prices high. And they do not make an exception for the people who pulled their fat out of the fire when Saddam violated their borders in the last century and took him out in this century. That is ingratitude.

        You invite me to consider myself stupid for pointing out that Iraq is a Muslim country and you support your point by stating that Iraq is a Muslim country.

        I repeat that this makes it difficult for Iraq to be a free republic, because a free republic is a heretical concept in Islam. Freedom of speech is a non sequitur; Muslims are not free to express a desire for Western infidels to remain in any position of power. Under Muslim law Western infidels should never have power over Muslims in any sense. It is irrelevant whether or not Muslims actually believe this, because under Islam it would be praiseworthy to kill any Muslim who doesn’t believe it. Few of us would be so outspoken if we risked our lives by speaking out.

        Thus you cannot know whether the people of Iraq wanted us out. They are only free to publicly take one side of that issue.

        • Bob666

          dianiline,
          You have an extremely myopic & limited view of the world and your source of information is obviously very limited and bias.

          “You obviously know a great deal of stuff. Too bad so much of it is not true”-such as?

          “The supply of oil is not less than the demand”.
          No, other parts of the developing world (Asia) are increasing consumption at double digits every year, demand is out pacing supply. I guess the term Inelastic demand escapes you?

          “Those who control the supply restrict their production to artificially keep the prices high”, Could that be OPEC?

          “And they do not make an exception for the people who pulled their fat out of the fire when Saddam violated their borders in the last century and took him out in this century. That is ingratitude.”
          This is the only thing you got correct in this post, but it is both stupid an naive to think that anything else would take place even if “W” thought this would happen. But remember, Bush was a “C” student in history.

          “You invite me to consider myself stupid for pointing out that Iraq is a Muslim country and you support your point by stating that Iraq is a Muslim country”

          Pardon me for pointing out the obvious, you seem to have missed the point believing they (Iraq) wanted a western style democracy, They don’t and that’s OK. What right do we have to impose our will on the rest of the world? This was the fatalistic flaw of the Bush administration regarding Iraq and you have yet to answer my question regarding Africa about saving the huddle masses and spreading freedom?

          “I repeat that this makes it difficult for Iraq to be a free republic, because a free republic is a heretical concept in Islam”
          Very Incorrect, but I don’t have time to explain it to you.

          “Freedom of speech is a non sequitur; Muslims are not free to express a desire for Western infidels to remain in any position of power. Under Muslim law Western infidels should never have power over Muslims in any sense. It is irrelevant whether or not Muslims actually believe this, because under Islam it would be praiseworthy to kill any Muslim who doesn’t believe it. Few of us would be so outspoken if we risked our lives by speaking out”

          Have you ever been outside of North America? Ever read the Koran? You seem to a very limited view of Islam that was formulated by right wing media, this is the problem with the western view is Islam.

          “Thus you cannot know whether the people of Iraq wanted us out”.
          The US was like an in-law who overstayed his welcome. They wanted us out even if we were paying the bills and feeding them, they wanted us gone and you would have wanted us gone too if you were an Iraq citizen.

          You need to leave the US borders and experience the world for what it is, not the crap that you are getting fed by a media with an agenda.

    • Irish Love

      AMEN Darlin………. it is easy for the “Left” top BLAME Bush… BUT take NO responsibility for Obama’s War decisions…… WAKE UP AMERICA!!

  • dianiline

    Robert Smith says:
    January 15, 2013 at 11:25 am

    “DaveH says: “But to argue that the unborn fetus is not a person requires a large amount of mental gymnastics.”

    Really… Particularly early in pregnancy what’s there just kinda drips through one’s fingers. Ooooooy gooooooy. That’s a “person?”

    Again you are trying to portray another as they are not. (snip)
    Your slimy effort to twist others into something they are not…”
    _________________

    Hi Robert,

    In the course of asserting that people aren’t people until they’re outside of their mothers, you *twice* refer to portraying “another” or “others” as something “they are not”.

    It would seem that you are referring to unborn babies here, saying that they are not persons though DaveH portrays them as such.

    In fact your own language tacitly acknowledges that they are persons, as you refer to them as “another” and “others”. In both cases the implied noun is person.

  • Libertyman50

    I disagree. Both political parties specially the establishment wish to see this country become communist. These are the beginnings of such a system similar to Cuba, North Korea and others Both parties give such a false message on liberty.> I look at both of these political parties and see that they do not have the best of intentions for we the people. They wish for us to become their slaves, pure and simple. Government by its nature is coercive. Government is like a mafia. It extorts money from we the people in the form of herendous taxation and limiting our constitutional rights In my opinion respectfully stated I say that those who see good intentions by these parties doea not have all the information. They becomr brain washed, indoctrinated into such a system. I know for in Cuba they tried to do the same thing to me As it turned out that government never had the best of intentions for its people. Let’s not kid ourselves….

    • http://roberttitle.wordpress.com roberttitle

      You are absolutely correct. It’s a legalized mafia…both parties. But it is Fascism we face today…a police state internally and a war machine that attacks nations without cause abroad. We have an oligarchy now which will continue into the future. Even Russia was ruled by a group of oligarchs…theoretical communism has never been achieved and never will.

  • dianiline

    Bob666 says:
    January 17, 2013 at 8:13 am

    –”dianiline,
    You have an extremely myopic & limited view of the world and your source of information is obviously very limited and bias.”–

    Hi Bob,

    I won’t make generalizations about your view of the world and your sources of information based upon what you write here on this very limited subject. Possibly in other areas you depart from the lock-step of the left.

    Yes, it would be OPEC that controls the supply of oil. Demand is outpacing supply because the suppliers want it that way. It is true that the supply is ultimately limited, but the immediate issue is that the suppliers choose to limit the supply to keep the price high.

    –(snip)(regarding the high oil prices set by the producers)”“And they do not make an exception for the people who pulled their fat out of the fire when Saddam violated their borders in the last century and took him out in this century. That is ingratitude.”
    This is the only thing you got correct in this post, but it is both stupid an naive to think that anything else would take place even if “W” thought this would happen.”–

    The only people who appear to have thought this would happen are those who thought the war was about oil. So by now they should know better. Yet they (you) continue to make this claim.

    (snip)–”Pardon me for pointing out the obvious, you seem to have missed the point believing they (Iraq) wanted a western style democracy, They don’t and that’s OK. What right do we have to impose our will on the rest of the world? This was the fatalistic flaw of the Bush administration regarding Iraq and you have yet to answer my question regarding Africa about saving the huddle masses and spreading freedom?”

    Some of them obviously don’t want a republic–they seem okay with a democracy but (especially in the middle east) that doesn’t protect the rights of the minorities.

    Some of them do want a republic. Those are our friends and the ones we must side with. If I were living in Iraq, I would want the US to stay and secure the country, because I know how unlikely it is that the majority would respect my rights. Even if I were a Muslim, I would still be a woman and thus would have no rights under a Muslim government. So I think it’s likely that many sensible Iraqis do in fact want peace and freedom, but they are not strong enough to protect themselves from those who want something else.

    It is just evil to side with the oppressors because there are more of them and you’re tired of the war.

    You ask about freedom in Africa, thinking that somehow the lack of freedom in other places makes it okay for us to let Iraq remain in darkness or slide back into it after we have done the work to free them. You do realize that your arguments *support* the war in Iraq? Indeed you make the case that we should not have stopped with Iraq.

    It is a hard case to argue, but we are not the policemen of the world. However, securing one bastion of peace and reason in the middle east would have helped all of those others in the region struggling for freedom. Iraq was different because it had already committed a war of aggression and was continually in violation of numerous UN requirements; thus it was the responsibility of the UN to intervene and the US enjoyed universal support in its efforts.

    Except for the bozos abroad who chose to use this excuse to vilify the US for doing what every country on earth should have done, and the lying sacks in this country who chose to portray the US as acting without UN support when we were actually carrying out UN policy. We were vilified for doing the right thing, and those who shirked their responsibility upbraided us for not shirking it. And the blowhard enemies of the US within our borders fretted that the world wouldn’t like us anymore.

    So the situation in Iraq was different from the situation in other countries. There was broad international agreement about intervening in Iraq, though many of those in agreement were just blowing smoke and were shocked when the time came to put their money where their mouth was. And Iraq had opened itself up to outside intervention by its own aggression.

    –(snip)”“I repeat that this makes it difficult for Iraq to be a free republic, because a free republic is a heretical concept in Islam”
    Very Incorrect, but I don’t have time to explain it to you.”

    Right, because you’d have to rewrite the Koran to explain it otherwise to me. The point of Islam is submission “to God”, for which individual freedom is neither necessary nor desirable. In practice this means submission to the lowest form of fundamentalism, for any idiot can call for the death of another on the grounds of heresy, and the faithful can hardly stand up for the supposed “heretic” for they would just be branded along with him.

    Even if the vast majority of Muslims are moderate peaceful people, as is likely, they can’t argue with the violent lunatic fringe who claims to be doing the will of God and has always the blessing of the Koran in doing whatever is necessary to bring about the “umma” or Muslim heaven on earth. Not heaven to the rest of us, of course.

    • Bob666

      Dianiline,
      “The only people who appear to have thought this would happen are those who thought the war was about oil. So by now they should know better. Yet they (you) continue to make this claim.”

      It was all about oil, Africa has no oil and that is why we went into Iraq. You have a very limited memory. That oil was going to pay from their liberation and rebuilding-NOT.

      “Right, because you’d have to rewrite the Koran to explain it otherwise to me” No, beacuse I deal with facts. Have you ever read the Koran or the Tora? Even seen one? ever been outside of North America?

      I would bet that you have not as your post indicate this.

      It is the lunatic fringe that sets the stereo type on all religions, Christianity & Islam. I can give you countless examples of what some Christians and Jews have done in the name of god and it would be no less wrong.

      The vast majoriety of Muslims like most Christians and Jews are peace loving people.

      “Except for the bozos abroad who chose to use this excuse to vilify the US for doing what every country on earth should have done, and the lying sacks in this country who chose to portray the US as acting without UN support when we were actually carrying out UN policy. We were vilified for doing the right thing, and those who shirked their responsibility upbraided us for not shirking it. And the blowhard enemies of the US within our borders fretted that the world wouldn’t like us anymore.”

      Wow, how does anyone respond to that objectively? You have a way of combining your opinion to wako idealogy and packaging it to the rest of the world as an altered state of reality.

      Dianiline, the more you post, the more ignorant you appear, It is very sad. Go abroad and see the world for what it is, not what Fox News tells you it should be.

      • dianiline

        Bob666 says:
        January 17, 2013 at 1:00 pm
        (snip)”It was all about oil, Africa has no oil and that is why we went into Iraq. You have a very limited memory.”

        That’s an interesting way to look at memory. Because I don’t agree with your revisionist take on history, my memory must be poor. In fact, it would have to be poor for me to agree with you, because what you say is just not how it was.

        –(snip)”“Right, because you’d have to rewrite the Koran to explain it otherwise to me” No, beacuse I deal with facts. Have you ever read the Koran or the Tora? Even seen one? ever been outside of North America?”

        Why do you keep asking that? Of course I’ve read the Koran, else I would not know these things. What has the Torah to do with this? I have read that too.

        My travel history is not really relevant to this discussion. What is yours?

        –(snip)”It is the lunatic fringe that sets the stereo type on all religions, Christianity & Islam. I can give you countless examples of what some Christians and Jews have done in the name of god and it would be no less wrong.

        The difference here would be that Christianity as a whole denounces the evil done in the name of God, whereas Islam commands it.

        –”The vast majoriety of Muslims like most Christians and Jews are peace loving people.”

        Still irrelevant as I have said, because it is not safe for them to denounce the terrorists, and it is really not true that their love of peace is sanctioned by their religion.

        –(Wow, how does anyone respond to that objectively? You have a way of combining your opinion to wako idealogy and packaging it to the rest of the world as an altered state of reality.”

        Objective thought would be a good start. You continue to spout the left-wing party line, with the inane confidence that saying it again or saying it louder will make it true. When faced with arguments that contradict your altered state divorced from reality, you are astonished and feel that insults and amazement will make the arguments go away.

        Normally, people meet arguments with other arguments.

        –(snip)”Dianiline, the more you post, the more ignorant you appear, It is very sad. Go abroad and see the world for what it is, not what Fox News tells you it should be.”

        Ah, Fox News. A news source that doesn’t pander to your left-wing fantasies.

        If I had time to watch TV, that would be a good source to go to.

        • Bob666

          “Objective thought would be a good start. You continue to spout the left-wing party line, with the inane confidence that saying it again or saying it louder will make it true”.

          Horse Hockey, I am the most conservitive guy you Will ever meet, I just dont accet the right or left wing Babble of il informed people like yourself.

          “Ah, Fox News. A news source that doesn’t pander to your left-wing fantasies”.

          Well, thanks for confirming what is obvious.

          My travel history is not really relevant to this discussion. What is yours? Lived in Europe (three countries) and Isreal. have traveled to at least a dozen others, I have seen what you think you know.

          “You continue to spout the left-wing party line, with the inane confidence that saying it again or saying it louder will make it true. When faced with arguments that contradict your altered state divorced from reality, you are astonished and feel that insults and amazement will make the arguments go away”.

          Were you looking in the mirrow when you wrote that? I state facts, not the altered state that you live in.

          “Of course I’ve read the Koran, else I would not know these things. What has the Torah to do with this? I have read that too”.

          OK, the please explain the differance of Abraham in the Koran verse the Torah. if you are quite the well read peson to past judgment on all, this should be a cake walk.

  • dianiline

    Bob666 says:
    January 17, 2013 at 4:06 pm
    –(snip)”I have seen what you think you know.”

    Seeing is not enough; one must think about what one sees. You don’t sound any different from any other left-wing individual who gets all of his news from the Non Fox Media, despite what you’ve seen.

    “Conservative” is a non-specific term. What are you trying to conserve? For me, I am trying to conserve the constitutional republic that was left to me by my forbears, who obtained it at great price. It is in grave danger, both from the manchild who currently thinks he owns it, and from the Religion of Peace that eternally thinks it owns the world.

    I don’t think this is really the forum for a discussion of Old Testament patriarchs.

    • Bob666

      Dianiline,
      “Seeing is not enough; one must think about what one sees. You don’t sound any different from any other left-wing individual who gets all of his news from the Non Fox Media, despite what you’ve seen”.

      You tend to pull stuff out of the air when you are pressed to provide facts and that says that you have a very limited scope of experience which shows in your post. I get my “news” from several sources and by the way, Fox is one of them. One has to have multiple sources if you want the facts with out spin since the truth always lies in the middle.

      As far as the Old Testament patriarchs, I don’t believe that you can produce and I would be willing to bet that you have never touched a Torah or Koran but you feel incline to preach as if you had.

      I awas also amused that you throw the “left wing” mud since I was voting for republicans when you were crawling around in huggies.

      This will be my last post to you since you seem to be all mouth with no substance. Send us a post card when you go out in the world and experience life – go actually learn something.

      • dianiline

        Bob666 says:
        January 17, 2013 at 6:02 pm
        (snip)”You tend to pull stuff out of the air when you are pressed to provide facts….”(snip)”I would be willing to bet that you have never touched a Torah or Koran but you feel incline to preach as if you had.”
        (snip)”…I was voting for republicans when you were crawling around in huggies.”

        This will be my last post to you….”

        You are correct about needing multiple sources to learn the facts, but completely mistaken about the truth lying in the middle. In fact you could watch a large number of sources and find that the truth was entirely to one side or the other of all of them.

        You do still sound like every other left-wing individual who gets all of his news from the Non Fox Media, despite watching Fox. Well, you differ in one way; they usually don’t admit to ever having voted for Republicans. But you have the usual left-wing lock on jumping to conclusions without basis and resorting to insults very early in your frustration curve, which is unnecessarily steep.

        The outright claim that your correspondent is a liar, however, should probably be reserved for cases where you have some reason to believe that it is true, and even then you should probably not use it. It makes you look mean in both senses of the word.

        To help save you from further embarrassment, I will point out to you that if you continue to argue with people on the web, you may often find yourself arguing with people who have never crawled around in huggies.

        Huggies are a recent invention.

        Thank you for agreeing to disengage.

        • Bob666

          Dian,
          Ignorance and the need to get a last word-you are so prdictable.

  • Linda

    Dear Brandon
    Your position is exactly why the Republicans won and won big in the last election.ROTFLMAO Apparently you have been sleeping your way thru elections and who is in the White House and who controls the Senate. Not to mention who had to lie and try to twist polling times and places. Here in OH the Rethugs were actually putting up threatening billboards in minority and poor neighborhoods about voting. How about in FL where they hired a dirty tricks guy to knock people off the polls. This is America and people don’t like their votes being taken away.

    • Bob666

      Linda,
      You need to remember four things when dealing with many of the people on this site as follows:

      * Obama did not win the election, he stole it through whole sale voter fraud.

      * Democrats are responsible for every ill in the history mankind, even the plague of the mid- evil era.

      * George W Bush is revered as a Genius and the world went south the day that Obama was sworn in.

      * And finally, when pressed in a corner, they will bring in the Bible (they are experts here and know the meaning-word for word of gods intention as well as that of the founding fathers-in fact one guy on this site can tell you how many freckles were on Jefferson’s right but cheek).

      You don’t win arguments here. One out of six will have an intelligent debate with you, The other five are for your amusement, It’s kind of like watching crack junkies freak before they get their next fix.

      Hope this helps

  • Irish Love

    FIRST, let me make it clear I am an ex-republican, never a democrat; and NOW a “Three Precenter” and belong to the Tea Party. NOW, toYOU Mr Craig Swift, I more than anyone want to honor your 1st Amendment Right. However, I am from the “Question Authority” generation and you surprise me with how little YOU know about facts & history.

    Instead of attacking folks with nothing but name calling & character assassination why NOT look into a LIBRARY or other informative genre and seek the TRUTH ~ then make an informed decision?!

    My fear for you Lad is with a “sheep” mentality, you just may end up in a FEMA camp wondering wtf happened….. then again YOU may become an officer in some governmental branch that places YOU infront of ME = resistance. Mark my words, I come to this sight to see how many INFORMED people still exist in AMERICA and are unwilling to let this GREAT Nation go under. AMERICAN is a creed NOT a race, it is an HONOR!!

    • Bob666

      I was not aware the American Fascist party claimed to be 3%?

      • Irish Love

        Awwwwwwwwwww Bob, is that the BEST you got??? Jaysus…….. lol

        • Bob666

          “I am Locked & Loaded and WILL NOT surrender my 2nd Amendment right PERIOD. G’Day Mate! ”

          Big I Love,
          Are you trying to over compensate for a physical or mental insecurity or are you abusing the Testosterone pump bottle again?

      • Irish Love

        BOB: During the American Revolution, the active forces in the field against the King’s tyranny never amounted to more than 3% of the colonists. Three percenters today, for the most part, identify with this 3% because they were true patriots fighting for the freedoms the nation we love and honor was founded on.

        Three percenters intend to maintain their God-given natural rights to liberty and property. History itself, for good or ill, is made by determined minorities. Never underestimate the power of a small group of committed citizens to change the world. Indeed, it has never been done otherwise. Many of us three percenters swore an oath to support and defend the Constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic, and affirming that we are guardians of the Republic, of the principles in our Declaration of Independence, and of the rights of our people, we affirm and declare the following:

        1. We will NOT obey orders to disarm the American people.
        2. We will NOT obey orders to conduct warrantless searches of the American people
        3. We will NOT obey orders to detain American citizens as “unlawful enemy combatants” or to subject them to military tribunal.
        4. We will NOT obey orders to impose martial law or a “state of emergency” on a state.
        5. We will NOT obey orders to invade and subjugate any state that asserts its sovereignty.
        6. We will NOT obey any order to blockade American cities, thus turning them into giant concentration camps.
        7. We will NOT obey any order to force American citizens into any form of detention camps under any pretext.
        8. We will NOT obey orders to assist or support the use of any foreign troops on U.S. soil against the American people to “keep the peace” or to “maintain control.”
        9. We will NOT obey any orders to confiscate the property of the American people, including food and other essential supplies.
        10.We will NOT obey any orders which infringe on the right of the people to free speech, to peaceably assemble, and to petition their government for a redress of grievances.

        DO U GET IT NOW!!!

        • Bob666

          Big I Love,
          Yea I get it,
          Are you trying to over compensate for multiple physical or mental insecurities & are you abusing the Testosterone pump bottle.

          You spreading that stuff on you nut sack will make you grow a third rock, but the way you conduct yourself, I believe that we know they must be the size of raisins.

          • Irish Love

            Awwwwwwwwwwww Bobby Bobby Bobby….. I can tell from your previous comments on here YOU love being the “messiah” and the “man” with all the ANSWERS. Well darlin, first and foremost I am a Lady; a mother; and a Patriot….. YOU my friend need to grow up… My comment was to Craig Swift in the first place NOT you!! Why was it sooo important for yopu to make erroneous and uninformed remarks??? Aloha!

        • Nick Czudy

          Wow Irish Love. You must be a Patriot. I am scared. You do not have my respect. What a bunch of hooey. Most of what you said does not apply to an average citizen. we need to add you name to the confiscate weapons list.

      • Irish Love

        BTW BOB666: Facism: a political philosophy, movement, or regime (as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition

        3%ers ARE NOT Facists…… Get your FACTS straight before YOU shoot your mouth off…. This is WHY America is in trouble = MISINFORMATION…. jaysus…..

    • Financially Insecure John

      Irish Love says:

      January 19, 2013 at 7:36 pm

      First let me make it clear I am an ex-republican; never a democrat; a “Three Percenter” and a member of the Tea Party. The 2nd Amendment is NOT about hunting or sportsmanship.

      Jeff: You appear to be “unable” to seperate the criminal & mentally ill from “Law Abiding Citizens”. “The Right To Bear Arms…” is about “tyranny” PERIOD! The right for every AMERICAN citizen to “brace” (arm) themselves against: government control; violation of OUR Constitution; Bill Of Rights; and Declaration of Independence. NOT to mention, a “leader” who has now positioned himself to a “dictator” posture.

      If you would visit a LIBRARY ans stay away from Left or Right media, you will find TRUTH in history of the world and how socialism; marism; and communism blossomed throughout the World.

      I am Locked & Loaded and WILL NOT surrender my 2nd Amendment right PERIOD. G’Day Mate!

      I am from the “Question Authority” generation and I continue to be amazed at the number of Americans who possess a “sheep” mentality that will run this countery into the ground. Perhaps if you spent sometime in a country whose government is controlled under “socialism” and/or “communism” you may enlighten yourself on HISTORY and why AMERICA fought for independence from TYRANNY.

      AMERICA: NOT a race but a CREED; it is an HONOR!!

      Irish Love says:

      January 19, 2013 at 8:26 pm

      Awwwwwwwwwww Bob, is that the BEST you got??? Jaysus…….. lol

      Irish Love says:

      January 19, 2013 at 8:40 pm

      BOB: During the American Revolution, the active forces in the field against the King’s tyranny never amounted to more than 3% of the colonists. Three percenters today, for the most part, identify with this 3% because they were true patriots fighting for the freedoms the nation we love and honor was founded on.

      Three percenters intend to maintain their God-given natural rights to liberty and property. History itself, for good or ill, is made by determined minorities. Never underestimate the power of a small group of committed citizens to change the world. Indeed, it has never been done otherwise. Many of us three percenters swore an oath to support and defend the Constitution against all enemies, foreign and domestic, and affirming that we are guardians of the Republic, of the principles in our Declaration of Independence, and of the rights of our people, we affirm and declare the following:

      1. We will NOT obey orders to disarm the American people.
      2. We will NOT obey orders to conduct warrantless searches of the American people
      3. We will NOT obey orders to detain American citizens as “unlawful enemy combatants” or to subject them to military tribunal.
      4. We will NOT obey orders to impose martial law or a “state of emergency” on a state.
      5. We will NOT obey orders to invade and subjugate any state that asserts its sovereignty.
      6. We will NOT obey any order to blockade American cities, thus turning them into giant concentration camps.
      7. We will NOT obey any order to force American citizens into any form of detention camps under any pretext.
      8. We will NOT obey orders to assist or support the use of any foreign troops on U.S. soil against the American people to “keep the peace” or to “maintain control.”
      9. We will NOT obey any orders to confiscate the property of the American people, including food and other essential supplies.
      10.We will NOT obey any orders which infringe on the right of the people to free speech, to peaceably assemble, and to petition their government for a redress of grievances.

      DO U GET IT NOW!!!

      Irish Love says:

      January 19, 2013 at 9:01 pm

      Awwwwwwwwwwww Bobby Bobby Bobby….. I can tell from your previous comments on here YOU love being the “messiah” and the “man” with all the ANSWERS. Well darlin, first and foremost I am a Lady; a mother; and a Patriot….. YOU my friend need to grow up… My comment was to Craig Swift in the first place NOT you!! Why was it sooo important for yopu to make erroneous and uninformed remarks??? Aloha!

      Irish Love says:

      January 19, 2013 at 8:50 pm

      BTW BOB666: Facism: a political philosophy, movement, or regime (as that of the Fascisti) that exalts nation and often race above the individual and that stands for a centralized autocratic government headed by a dictatorial leader, severe economic and social regimentation, and forcible suppression of opposition

      3%ers ARE NOT Facists…… Get your FACTS straight before YOU shoot your mouth off…. This is WHY America is in trouble = MISINFORMATION…. jaysus…..

      Irish Love says:

      January 19, 2013 at 9:02 pm

      Name calling and character assassination is a VERY Liberal tool……. you hiding under that cloth boy????

      Irish Love says:

      January 19, 2013 at 9:33 pm

      Who is “we” boy??? Excuse Me??? I thought Personal Liberty is about “discussion”?? You have done nothing but “attack” those who do not agree with YOU…….. hmmmmmm OK I get it!! Do you honestly think your shallow insults and name calling upset me??? Why don’t you find a sight that supports your “views” and leave this one to the intelligent folks….. OH I get it…. this is a place for you to spew venom; insults; lies; disruption & misinformation…… another ploy by the LEFT……. divide and conquer the American people…… Well Bobby, I honor your 1st Amendment Right (NAZI), carry on….. PLEASE!!! I’ll check back later on the “mayhem” you insist on creating!! TA-TA

      Irish Love says:

      January 19, 2013 at 10:03 pm

      IMPEACH OBAMA…. Bob Livingston for PRESIDENT!!!!!!!!!!!!

      Irish Love says:

      January 19, 2013 at 10:27 pm

      I had to re-post this my friend, YOU are a true PATRIOT:

      Totalitarian control is only possible in a disarmed society, as the Nazis and communists demonstrated in the twentieth century.

      Obama’s regime starting with the DHS has purchased 1.6 billion rounds of ammunition including hollow point “MAN RIPPER” ammo that is outlawed in war due to the horrific wounds these rounds inflict on the human body, fully automatic weapons, semi-auto and sniper, armored vehicles, war type body armor, drones (armed and surveillance) all to be used in America on Americans. In addition, military, police, Russian, Chinese, UN, NATO and other special units over the last several years have been and are being trained to:

      CONFISCATE YOUR GUNS DOOR TO DOOR – they will lock down as area and with overwhelming force remove all guns, one area at a time, resistors will be terminated and their families sent to re-education FEMA CAMPS or formed into WORK BRIGADES (slaves).

      FEMA has already setup the camps, purchased millions of coffins, trained guard dog, hired personnel to man the camps (recently), have special design rail cars and buses stationed all over America waiting for MARTIAL LAW implementation

      “the goal of the 1 percent. It’s total disarmament. That would give the state the long-awaited monopoly on violence.”

      Look at the shootings designed to herd the masses thru fear…almost all at GUN FREE ZONES where the easy targets are:

      • Congress woman Gifford
      • High School mass murders
      • Movie theater mass murders
      • Elementary School mass murders

      Ever notice no mass murders at hospitals? – No a gun free Zone.

      Now shootings at Firemen doing their jobs and at police at their homes with police cars parked. All designed to create FEAR and when people are afraid they will jump on the first wagon out of the fire. Guess who is driving the wagon?

      The elite psychopaths in the cesspool of Washington, D.C., and their communist cohorts.

      Time to make a stand America, the take over is almost complete:

      Differance between a slave and his master? The slave owns no guns.

      Laus Deo
      Semper Fi

      Irish Love says:

      January 20, 2013 at 11:40 am

      Your name spells it all about who you are and YOU should change it to Mr Entitlement!! I find it amusing that a handful of Liberal fools with NO idea of what is going on in this GREAT Republic (read your Constitution) would spend their time “hanging” on a site that is MORE “right” then I am. I love Bob Livingston and his “cohorts”.

      2ndly, none of you so called 97% here (who laugh at me) can engage in a debate; discussion or intelligent conversation WITHOUT name calling; blaming and finger-pointing. NOW who is the MORON?!? Your hipocrisy is nauseating.

      In a chat format, YOU find it comfortable to bully others like a kid on the playground stealing lunch money. BUT I bet if the truth be known, YOU could never hold your own in a face-to-face discussion.

      About the Constitution; Bill of Rights and Declaration of Independence YOU my friend are sorely schooled. YOU are the one who has NO understanding of what those documents mean and HOW they were meant to guide us as a Nation. YOU would rather see America divided and conquered from WITHIN….. so that we no longer resemble what AMERICA is. AMERICAN is a creed NOT a race. It is an Honor. JAYSUS!! (I prefer that spelling TY) LOL

      Irish Love says:
      January 20, 2013 at 1:02 pm

      John: Here is EXACTLY the “hipocrisy” I am speaking of –

      “The more that you post, the less credibility you have to call people a bully, call anyone ignorant or a hypocrite. You have been a very busy he/she posting your tea-bagging dribble on multiple boards on this site looking for a fight.” (I am not allowed to post my thoughts on Personal Liberty because you disagree??? ONLY you can have an opinion??? I have been called names; insulted; bullied BUT I’m still here John )

      “Like most people, when someone hits back, you go running home to mommy crying. grow up and accept that 97% have just as many rights as you do. We the people applies to everyone, not just you and your fellow Tea Braggers.” (OH! I am not allowed to believe in my 1st & 2nd Amendment Right??? ONLY you can decide what is right or wrong??? BTW no one ran to mommy here, I am standin toe-to-toe with ya John)

      “Your guy lost, more than once. People like you are why the GOP has hit a new low and why we have Obama.” (MY guy vs YOUR guy??? This isn’t about AMERICA anymore??? This isn’t about what’s right for our Nation?? BTW Who is MY guy John??)

      “Speaking Obama, I did not vote for him, but if it came down to Obama or someone like you, Obama would get my vote and to prove my point, That is who McCain lost to by just over 5% -The pin headed Tea Bag Darling that he picked cost him and to deny that will prove just how out of touch you really are.” (YOU didn’t vote for Obama John??? Who was YOUR guy??? lol)

      “One day you may sober up and realized the reality of your political consequences, but until then, look in the mirror and thank your self for Obama as our president.” (NOW it’s MY fault this GREAT Nation is in trouble because YOU didn’t vote for Obama?? BTW John, I just joined the Tea Party 2 weeks ago when I had enough of the “dictorial” leadership and violations of our Constitution ~ OUR Constitution John ~ Have you spent any time abroad?? More then a week’s vacation?? Lived in a foreign land that is under a socialistic/communistic government?? YOU scare me John…. YOU misguided political stance & hipocrisy)

      HAGD!!

      Irish,
      Never has no many words been used with so little purpose.

  • Irish Love

    Name calling and character assassination is a VERY Liberal tool……. you hiding under that cloth boy????

    • Bob666

      Yea Big I Love,
      We get you all to well, abusing the Testosterone pump bottle will make the rack go away, buy you do seem to have a “man” complex. Go do your Tea Bagging thing and we will continue to be amused by your post.

      • Irish Love

        Who is “we” boy??? Excuse Me??? I thought Personal Liberty is about “discussion”?? You have done nothing but “attack” those who do not agree with YOU…….. hmmmmmm OK I get it!! Do you honestly think your shallow insults and name calling upset me??? Why don’t you find a sight that supports your “views” and leave this one to the intelligent folks….. OH I get it…. this is a place for you to spew venom; insults; lies; disruption & misinformation…… another ploy by the LEFT……. divide and conquer the American people…… Well Bobby, I honor your 1st Amendment Right (NAZI), carry on….. PLEASE!!! I’ll check back later on the “mayhem” you insist on creating!! TA-TA

        • Bob666

          yawn………………………….

        • Bob666

          Lovie-Dovie,
          I will probably regert asking, but exactly waht “OH I get it…. this is a place for you to spew venom; insults; lies; disruption & misinformation” are you specifically refering to:

  • Irish Love

    IMPEACH OBAMA…. Bob Livingston for PRESIDENT!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • Irish Love

    I had to re-post this my friend, YOU are a true PATRIOT:

    Totalitarian control is only possible in a disarmed society, as the Nazis and communists demonstrated in the twentieth century.

    Obama’s regime starting with the DHS has purchased 1.6 billion rounds of ammunition including hollow point “MAN RIPPER” ammo that is outlawed in war due to the horrific wounds these rounds inflict on the human body, fully automatic weapons, semi-auto and sniper, armored vehicles, war type body armor, drones (armed and surveillance) all to be used in America on Americans. In addition, military, police, Russian, Chinese, UN, NATO and other special units over the last several years have been and are being trained to:

    CONFISCATE YOUR GUNS DOOR TO DOOR – they will lock down as area and with overwhelming force remove all guns, one area at a time, resistors will be terminated and their families sent to re-education FEMA CAMPS or formed into WORK BRIGADES (slaves).

    FEMA has already setup the camps, purchased millions of coffins, trained guard dog, hired personnel to man the camps (recently), have special design rail cars and buses stationed all over America waiting for MARTIAL LAW implementation

    “the goal of the 1 percent. It’s total disarmament. That would give the state the long-awaited monopoly on violence.”

    Look at the shootings designed to herd the masses thru fear…almost all at GUN FREE ZONES where the easy targets are:

    • Congress woman Gifford
    • High School mass murders
    • Movie theater mass murders
    • Elementary School mass murders

    Ever notice no mass murders at hospitals? – No a gun free Zone.

    Now shootings at Firemen doing their jobs and at police at their homes with police cars parked. All designed to create FEAR and when people are afraid they will jump on the first wagon out of the fire. Guess who is driving the wagon?

    The elite psychopaths in the cesspool of Washington, D.C., and their communist cohorts.

    Time to make a stand America, the take over is almost complete:

    Differance between a slave and his master? The slave owns no guns.

    Laus Deo
    Semper Fi

  • dalene44

    The beauty of our now defunct two party system is it kept the masses divided. When Bush signed the Patriot act half the people strongly objected. When Obama Expanded the Patriot act and added indefinite detention for US citizens half the people objected with a handful of brave leftists who dared speak up with the “right” against Obama. Trillions have been stolen by both the banks and government, much of it going overseas. The end game is disarming the populous. Less messy. They have to make it political to get half the people to agree to become subjects and give up the one Right that protects the other Rights. When we lose the right to defend ourselves we become helpless and subservient. Just where the elite want and need us to be.

    • Irish Love

      Well said dalene44!!

    • Irish Love

      A lil humor dalene44: “A well-crafted pepperoni pizza, being necessary to the preservation of a diverse menu, the right of the people to keep and cook tomatoes, shall not be infringed.”

      I would ask you to try to argue that this statement says that only pepperoni pizzas can keep and cook tomatoes, and only well-crafted ones at that. This is basically what the so-called states rights people argue with respect to the well-regulated militia, vs. the right to keep and bear arms. – Bruce Tiemann

  • Irish Love

    WHO is NickCrusty and why is he allowed on this site with IQ of 54??? GOD help America and the piss poor school system……. jaysus LOL

    • Financially Insecure John

      Irish,
      Could it be that you are so wrapped up over the 2nd amendment (or the last half) that you have lost tea bagging touch with the 1st amendment?

      Nick and everyone else have just as much right to this or any other site as you and your “3%” do. As far as IQ goes, Nick out matches you 3 to 1.

      Based on your ratings, your just a small person with a big mouth with a very limited knowledge of the Constitution. Your guy lost-twice. It’s called democracy and people like you all but guarantee that more people will vote against the GOP. Go find yourself a queen and put those tea bags to good use because 97% laugh at you.

      And by the way, it spelled Jesus-you MORON!

      • Irish Love

        Your name spells it all about who you are and YOU should change it to Mr Entitlement!! I find it amusing that a handful of Liberal fools with NO idea of what is going on in this GREAT Republic (read your Constitution) would spend their time “hanging” on a site that is MORE “right” then I am. I love Bob Livingston and his “cohorts”.

        2ndly, none of you so called 97% here (who laugh at me) can engage in a debate; discussion or intelligent conversation WITHOUT name calling; blaming and finger-pointing. NOW who is the MORON?!? Your hipocrisy is nauseating.

        In a chat format, YOU find it comfortable to bully others like a kid on the playground stealing lunch money. BUT I bet if the truth be known, YOU could never hold your own in a face-to-face discussion.

        About the Constitution; Bill of Rights and Declaration of Independence YOU my friend are sorely schooled. YOU are the one who has NO understanding of what those documents mean and HOW they were meant to guide us as a Nation. YOU would rather see America divided and conquered from WITHIN….. so that we no longer resemble what AMERICA is. AMERICAN is a creed NOT a race. It is an Honor. JAYSUS!! (I prefer that spelling TY) LOL

        • Financially Insecure John

          Irish,
          The more that you post, the less credibility you have to call people a bully, call anyone ignorant or a hypocrite. You have been a very busy he/she posting your tea-bagging dribble on multiple boards on this site looking for a fight.

          Like most people, when someone hits back, you go running home to mommy crying. grow up and accept that 97% have just as many rights as you do. We the people applies to everyone, not just you and your fellow Tea Braggers.

          Your guy lost, more than once. People like you are why the GOP has hit a new low and why we have Obama.

          Speaking Obama, I did not vote for him, but if it came down to Obama or someone like you, Obama would get my vote and to prove my point, That is who McCain lost to by just over 5% -The pin headed Tea Bag Darling that he picked cost him and to deny that will prove just how out of touch you really are.

          One day you may sober up and realized the reality of your political consequences, but until then, look in the mirror and thank your self for Obama as our president.

          • Irish Love

            John: Here is EXACTLY the “hipocrisy” I am speaking of –

            “The more that you post, the less credibility you have to call people a bully, call anyone ignorant or a hypocrite. You have been a very busy he/she posting your tea-bagging dribble on multiple boards on this site looking for a fight.” (I am not allowed to post my thoughts on Personal Liberty because you disagree??? ONLY you can have an opinion??? I have been called names; insulted; bullied BUT I’m still here John ;))

            “Like most people, when someone hits back, you go running home to mommy crying. grow up and accept that 97% have just as many rights as you do. We the people applies to everyone, not just you and your fellow Tea Braggers.” (OH! I am not allowed to believe in my 1st & 2nd Amendment Right??? ONLY you can decide what is right or wrong??? BTW no one ran to mommy here, I am standin toe-to-toe with ya John)

            “Your guy lost, more than once. People like you are why the GOP has hit a new low and why we have Obama.” (MY guy vs YOUR guy??? This isn’t about AMERICA anymore??? This isn’t about what’s right for our Nation?? BTW Who is MY guy John??)

            “Speaking Obama, I did not vote for him, but if it came down to Obama or someone like you, Obama would get my vote and to prove my point, That is who McCain lost to by just over 5% -The pin headed Tea Bag Darling that he picked cost him and to deny that will prove just how out of touch you really are.” (YOU didn’t vote for Obama John??? Who was YOUR guy??? lol)

            “One day you may sober up and realized the reality of your political consequences, but until then, look in the mirror and thank your self for Obama as our president.” (NOW it’s MY fault this GREAT Nation is in trouble because YOU didn’t vote for Obama?? BTW John, I just joined the Tea Party 2 weeks ago when I had enough of the “dictorial” leadership and violations of our Constitution ~ OUR Constitution John ~ Have you spent any time abroad?? More then a week’s vacation?? Lived in a foreign land that is under a socialistic/communistic government?? YOU scare me John…. YOU misguided political stance & hipocrisy)

            HAGD!!

          • Bob666

            Yo Lovie Dovie,
            “OH I get it…. this is a place for you to spew venom; insults; lies; disruption & misinformation…… another ploy by the LEFT”

            I’m still waiting to exactly what lies, venom and mis-information that you say I am spreading?

            No matter how you spread it, you really are a very broken toy.

          • Irish Love

            I’m done with you Bobby 6-6-6 U bore me…. You offer nothing intelligent to any conversation and it is sooo tiresome when I am speaking to someone other then you…. how you “false crack” because you are a coward. Go spew your venom else where “Lovie-Dovie” LOL

          • Bob666

            Yo Lovie-Dovie (AKA Dr Strangelove),

            You show up with an abstract diatribe that you cut and pasted from a wacka –doodle web site screaming like you have a clue and accuse me of spewing venom.

            “I’m done with you Bobby 6-6-6 U bore me…. You offer nothing intelligent to any conversation and it is sooo tiresome when I am speaking to someone other then you”

            Let me translate Lovie-Dovie, I let my mouth over ride my brain and can’t prove a word I said –so I am going to run home crying to mommy.

            Small person-big mouth and not an original thought, you’re a shill.

            By the way, Bob Nailed you and Nailed you good.

          • Irish Love

            YOU nailed ME??? For copy & pasting information from a website (which I included) which is TRUE!!! Did you go to the LIBRARY and into the history books and challenge it??? YOU are soooooo ridiculous it is hilarious! Why don’t YOU stalk someone else Mr Bobby 6-6-6 JAYSUS!!!

            YOU BORE ME LAD!!!! Buzz OFF!!

          • Irish Love

            THANK GOD Bobby 6-6-6 and TY TY, I FEEL like Martin Luther King’s message to America: FREE AT LAST, FREE AT LAST, THANK GOD ALMIGHTY FREE AT LAST………. Now shuffle on down the road Lovie Dovie!!

          • Irish Love

            “The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject races to posses arms. History shows that all conquerors who have allowed their subject races to carry arms have prepared their own downfall by doing so.” -Adolph Hitler 1938

        • Financially Insecure John

          Irish

          I have read many of your post and I must make the following observations:

          You are like that woman that one has the misfortune of running into at a dinner party or other social function that people run from when they see you coming. I have to imagine that you are that excessive bore that once you get your hooks onto someone, you dominate the conversation while talking at people rather than to them. Reviewing your post, you use an excessive amount of words to convey very little meaning in depth or scope and I have to believe that most people would chew their arm off like a desperate animal to escape your clutches. As a result, I am willing to bet that you don’t get invited back a second time unless the host is a bigger bore than you are and you only look good in comparison

          You have elaborated that I have a posse of Bob and Nick. I have read many of their post and while Bob is a bit out there and I am sure that people would like to turn him off at times, his comments are generally methodical and decent to those to treat him with respect as I have seen him show respect to many people and that is something that I have yet to see you do.

          Then we have Nick. Nick has yet to ever show you anything but respect, but you mock him and ridicule him as if you had a right to do so and all he has ever done is come to you with facts as he sees them. But like anyone who does not agree with you, he is obviously the one who is wrong.

          I come to this site as a lifelong republican who is looking for the group of people that I can relate to and vent to at times when I see other people who are reasonably rational and politically practical. Unfortunately, the internet has provided an outlet for socially repressed people to be on line something they could never be in real life-respected, admired and liked.

          My guess is, you have been around for a while, the kids are grown and if you do have a spouse. Having you on the computer gives him/her a break from your overbearing diatribes that you expound about everything and anything as if someone actually cared.

          You are obviously a bitter, mean spirited individual who is pissed off at the world and by Jasus, you are going to make everyone around you aware of your anger. You are that stereotypical angry white man who has his fingers embedded into wall and you’re not letting go.

          The world is changing and in some ways for the better and in others, for the worse. I believe the reason people perceive you as a fascist is if it were up to you, Bob, Nick and myself would be in a reeducation camp being forced to listen to Rush Limbaugh and Sean Hannity 24-hours a day until we claw our ears off to stop the pain.

          But the most sad thing is, you really bring nothing to the table that has not been said or hashed out before. All you have demonstrated is the ability to copy and paste stuff from ultra-right wing web sites and treat it as if were the holy grail of Knowledge. You have yet to see the fact that opinions can be based on facts, but facts are never based on opinion, yours or anyone else’s. To prove this you went head to head with me on a “let’s quote famous people post a -thon” as I wanted to see just how far you would go and you did not disappoint me.

          Do what you will because you have a first amendment right to be here like anyone else. But just in case you’re not aware, this is not YOUR country and it is not MY country. You and I are part of WE the people and the most vile of your post is when you insinuate that you might be a more worthy American because of your beliefs. There are good democrats and good republicans and they have no more or less rights than you do. The fact of the matter is, you are one of the huddled masses and not the center of the universe.

          No more interaction will be made with you, but I would suggest this; read this post, read it again and again and think about what you are reading. Don’t hit the reply button, think about it-and maybe, just maybe you could become a better person.

          • Irish Love

            I obviously make YOU very uncomfortable…… GOOD;) Someone needs to keep an eye on you as you write lengthy posts that are merely meant to “attack” ridicule; insult; demean; bully… YOU don’t scare me brother….. Carry on Mr Entitlement as I will…….. GOD, I feel popular ;)

          • Irish Love

            BTW Mr Entitlement this is MY Country and I will fight til I die for it…. WILL YOU??? I think not….. I would rather die standing then live kneeling!! So for the 4th time PLEASE BUZZ OFF!!

          • Bob666

            Yo FIJ,
            Very interesting post. Just for the record, I read the post and read it again and I did think about the post. I could ask for a worse posse.

    • Nick Czudy

      really Irish Love. Mr. McCrusty really? How do you think that you know my IQ?

      In fact I am the charter president of the Anti-Crusty club. I can’t be liberal and crusty at the same time. those are contradictions.

      • Irish Love

        Politics aside Nick…… the Anti-Crusty Group??? I think I love you becuz of your sense of humor!!! LOL

  • SJJolly

    (1) Old Jewish proverb: “Put not your faith in princes.”

    (2) The biggest mistake the hard-right could make would be to try an armed uprising. It would be militarily crushed, the survivors and supporters hunted down by the organs of the Dept Homeland Security, as domestic terroists. Following which, Dep Home Sec would enjoy decades of greatly increased funding. (The same sort of thing worked for the FBI re hunting down Communists).
    You want to change the system? Keep plugging away in the political system — an irrestable force against an immovable object.

    • Nick Czudy

      Well spoken SJ. they need to put their guns away and get out their pens or keyboards. they talk the talk. they rant about the 47%, but statistics show that they are mostly part of the 47%.

  • dalene44

    Sadly, insecure John betrays his ignorance and bigotry against those who believe in the constitution. The Two party system is almost indistinguishable and neither defend the constitution. Remember Pelosi who said “God Bless Occupy” then gleefully turned the dogs on them? And those who continue to try to attack or silence the Tea Party are also part of the system trying to dissolve our rights.
    Hopefully, the entire country wakes up and realizes this is about protecting what remains of our rights. If we lose the second amendment you can bet the first amendment will follow.

    • Irish Love

      Awwwwwwwwww dalene44 U R a breath of fresh air!! TY

    • Financially Insecure John

      Dalene44,
      “Sadly, insecure John betrays his ignorance and bigotry against those who believe in the constitution”.

      Absolute not true. I would never consider myself to a constitutional scholar, but I read it and reread it several times and recognized the document as a whole-I don’t cherry pick it to serve my agenda.

      “The Two party system is almost indistinguishable and neither defend the constitution. Remember Pelosi who said “God Bless Occupy” then gleefully turned the dogs on them”?

      I could not agree with you more-you nailed it.

      “And those who continue to try to attack or silence the Tea Party are also part of the system trying to dissolve our rights”.

      Absolutely not true, in fact, not anywhere close. There are many in the tea party with very good intentions and many can make a rational argument to stand their ground effectively. The Tea Party was to John McCain what Ross Perot was to George Bush and Ralph Nader was to Al Gore. The Tea Party folks that I have run into like our friend here tend to be the least informed and most verbal at proving their ignorance. They have help purge the GOP of all rational followers and taken the party to the irrational extreme.

      “Hopefully, the entire country wakes up and realizes this is about protecting what remains of our rights. If we lose the second amendment you can bet the first amendment will follow”.

      We are going to agree to disagree on this statement. Our rights are at stake, but this started a long time ago before Obama and where was the Tea Party then? As far as the second amendment goes, There will be some effort to bring the second amendment into modern times with the technology that has presented itself in killing people. But I do not believe for a moment that our government is out to get your guns, my guns or anyone else’s gun. What I see is a collection of paranoia and incoherent diatribes on this board presented by some pretty irrational people. but you are correct-our rights are at risk.

      Remember, I was polite and diplomatic to you.

      • Irish Love

        I am sorry Mr Entitlement, did YOU really ask where the Tea Party was before Obama??? You aren’t talking about Boston are YOU??? Maybe I misunderstood you….. REMEMBER, I was polite & diplomatic to you.

  • Irish Love

    The 1938 Nazi law barred Jews from businesses involving firearms. On November 10. 1938 — one day after the Nazi party terror squads (the SS) savaged thousands of Jews, synagogues and Jewish businesses throughout Germany — new regulations under the Weapons Law specifically barred Jews from owning any weapons, even clubs or knives.

  • Irish Love

    “Waiting periods are only a step. Registration is only a step. The prohibition of private firearms
    is the goal”–(Janet Reno)

  • Financially Insecure John

    Irish,

    People who like assault weapons, they should join the United States Army; we have them.

    Wesley Clark

    CNN Crossfire, 2003-06-25

    General

    Boy, I can cut and past famos quotes too!

  • dalene44

    Innsecure John, When the corporate/government media compares the NRA to NAZI’s (ironically a big government organization) and Chuckie Schumer calls them an extremist fringe group, one can assume the government’s intent is to decimate gun right defenders. Next step…confiscate.

    • Irish Love

      U DA BOMB dalene 44 (no pun intended) AMEN to the truth!!

      • Financially Insecure John

        Irish,
        I know that you were there and if you were not you would claim that you knew being a student of history, but chew on this for a bit. I know there will be a snakie reply as to why this gentleman is wrong and you are right.

        But, I thought it might be worth considering whether it’s really so clear that the Founders wrote up the Second Amendment as a bulwark against the tyranny of the government they’d just created.

        Most people, most of the time, focus on one part of the Second Amendment:

        “The right of the people … shall not be infringed.”

        This leads people to believe that the only thing that matters is the right of the people to keep and bear arms, which leads to the notion that the Founders feared nothing so much as a government that wasn’t itself perpetually afraid of the weapons to which the citizens were constitutionally entitled.

        But there are alternative explanations, which stem from reading the whole Second Amendment (rather than just the nice part that talks about possessing weapons) and they cast the Second Amendment in a very different light.

        Here’s Saul Cornell, who holds an endowed chair in American History at Fordham University:

        In 1776, most of the original state constitutions did not even include an arms-bearing provision. The few states that did usually also included a clause protecting the right not to bear arms. Why? Because, in contrast to other cherished rights such as freedom of speech or religion, the state could not compel you to speak or pray. It could force you to bear arms.

        The founders had a simple reason for curbing this right: Quakers and other religious pacifists were opposed to bearing arms, and wished to be exempt from an obligation that could be made incumbent on all male citizens at the time.

        When the Second Amendment is discussed today, we tend to think of those “militias” as just a bunch of ordinary guys with guns, empowering themselves to resist authority when and if necessary. Nothing could be further from the founders’ vision.

        Militias were tightly controlled organizations legally defined and regulated by the individual colonies before the Revolution and, after independence, by the individual states. Militia laws ran on for pages and were some of the lengthiest pieces of legislation in the statute books. States kept track of who had guns, had the right to inspect them in private homes and could fine citizens for failing to report to a muster.

        Also important to consider is the fact that taking up arms against the government is specifically considered treason in Article 3, Section 3 of the Constitution:

        The founders had a word for a bunch of farmers marching with guns without government sanction: a mob. One of the reasons we have a Constitution is the founders were worried about the danger posed by individuals acting like a militia without legal authority. This was precisely what happened during Shays’ Rebellion, an insurrection in western Massachusetts that persuaded many Americans that we needed a stronger central government to avert anarchy.

        Many people think that we have the Second Amendment so that we can take up arms against the government if it overreaches its authority. If that interpretation were correct, it would mean that the Second Amendment had repealed the Constitution’s treason clause, which defines this crime as taking up arms against the government. In reality, in the first decade after the Constitution, the government put down several rebellions similar to Shays – and nobody claimed that they were merely asserting their Second Amendment rights.

        So what happened?

        In 2008, a closely divided Supreme Court abandoned more than 70 years of precedent and for the first time in American history affirmed that the Second Amendment is about a right to have a handgun in the home for self-defense. Lost in most of the commentary then and now is that this is almost the exactly opposite of what James Madison, the primary architect of the amendment, intended, and is hard to reconcile with the way most ordinary Americans would have read it in 1791.

        There’s also little chestnut, from Thom Hartmann:

        The real reason the Second Amendment was ratified, and why it says “State” instead of “Country” (the Framers knew the difference – see the 10th Amendment), was to preserve the slave patrol militias in the southern states, which was necessary to get Virginia’s vote ….

        At the ratifying convention in Virginia in 1788, [Patrick] Henry laid it out:

        “Let me here call your attention to that part [Article 1, Section 8 of the proposed Constitution] which gives the Congress power to provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining the militia, and for governing such part of them as may be employed in the service of the United States… .

        “By this, sir, you see that their control over our last and best defence is unlimited. If they neglect or refuse to discipline or arm our militia, they will be useless: the states can do neither … this power being exclusively given to Congress. The power of appointing officers over men not disciplined or armed is ridiculous; so that this pretended little remains of power left to the states may, at the pleasure of Congress, be rendered nugatory.”

        George Mason expressed a similar fear:

        “The militia may be here destroyed by that method which has been practised in other parts of the world before; that is, by rendering them useless, by disarming them. Under various pretences, Congress may neglect to provide for arming and disciplining the militia; and the state governments cannot do it, for Congress has an exclusive right to arm them [under this proposed Constitution] … “

        Henry then bluntly laid it out:

        “If the country be invaded, a state may go to war, but cannot suppress [slave] insurrections [under this new Constitution]. If there should happen an insurrection of slaves, the country cannot be said to be invaded. They cannot, therefore, suppress it without the interposition of Congress … . Congress, and Congress only [under this new Constitution], can call forth the militia.”

        And why was that such a concern for Patrick Henry?

        “In this state,” he said, “there are two hundred and thirty-six thousand blacks, and there are many in several other states. But there are few or none in the Northern States… . May Congress not say, that every black man must fight? Did we not see a little of this last war? We were not so hard pushed as to make emancipation general; but acts of Assembly passed that every slave who would go to the army should be free.”

        Patrick Henry was also convinced that the power over the various state militias given the federal government in the new Constitution could be used to strip the slave states of their slave-patrol militias. He knew the majority attitude in the North opposed slavery, and he worried they’d use the Constitution to free the South’s slaves (a process then called “Manumission”).

        [Madison’s] first draft for what became the Second Amendment had said: “The right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed; a well armed, and well regulated militia being the best security of a free country [emphasis mine]: but no person religiously scrupulous of bearing arms, shall be compelled to render military service in person.”

        But Henry, Mason and others wanted southern states to preserve their slave-patrol militias independent of the federal government. So Madison changed the word “country” to the word “state,” and redrafted the Second Amendment into today’s form.

        • dianiline

          Financially Insecure John said in response to Irish Love:

          (snip)”…I thought it might be worth considering whether it’s really so clear that the Founders wrote up the Second Amendment as a bulwark against the tyranny of the government they’d just created.”

          Oh, yeah, I think they did.

          They had just spent some time and effort throwing off the tyranny of another government, and they may have known that humans are fallible.

          The slave thing is an interesting aside. You say that this was necessary to get Virginia to sign on, but Virginia was only one state. Also sometimes good things are entered in to for poor reasons; they are still good things. At least the second amendment is.

          It’s perfectly reasonable for the government to hold it as treason to take up arms against it. I’m sure King George thought that the colonists were committing treason.

          We think that if that was treason it was in a good cause, that of throwing off tyranny.

          Likewise you can’t expect the new US government to say, go ahead and shoot back. That must remain an extreme last resort. But it would definitely be a game changer if the government had the power to disarm the citizens.

          Thank God it doesn’t.

    • Financially Insecure John

      “ironically a big government organization”

      The NRA is nothing more than an industrial co-op that represents the gun industry. What I find fascinating is; they get the consumers of the those they represent to pick up the tab.

      Yes, there are people who want your guns just as well as there are people who have a petition to the White House to build a Death Star (I can’t make this stuff up). But there are two things that people need to realize.

      First, there are so many guns in our society, if you started today and had cooperation of say 70% of all citizens, it would take years to get every gun.

      Finally, the gun industry through the NRA has created such a paranoia that Obama and his buddies want your gun, that gun sales have hit records.

      Dalene44, Just a question to you, could your concern really be the by-product of one of the best sales campaigns in the history of marketing?

      extremist fringe group=record sales for guns.

      • Bob666

        FIJ,
        I believe that it is called a trade group, but you bring up an interesting point that our “well informed” cut and paste queens might have over-looked.

        As for the diatribe of Dr. Strangelove, you can tell a woman, but you can’t tell her much-she knows everything-just make the mistake of asking her. Were you just bored or do you like engaging in a dialog with a concrete block?

      • Diana

        Financially Insecure John said in response to dalene44:

        –(snip)”The NRA is nothing more than an industrial co-op that represents the gun industry. What I find fascinating is; they get the consumers of the those they represent to pick up the tab.”

        That’s just insulting. The NRA is a small subset of those who understand that second amendment rights are what secure all the others. The NRA represents everybody who has rights and wants to keep them. Lots of us, like me, don’t support them financially, although we should.

        –(snip)”First, there are so many guns in our society, if you started today and had cooperation of say 70% of all citizens, it would take years to get every gun.”

        Thanks for pointing out the big short term problem with gun control. It would be a long time before criminals didn’t have guns. The nice people would turn theirs in tomorrow.

        The smart people would never give them up.

        Many people are both smart and nice. They would have a dilemma. I hope they’d go with smart, because we’d really like it if all gun owners were in this group.

        The long term problem with gun control, of course, is that it would make the US much easier to invade, and it would make the US population much easier for the government to abuse. And we look like having a much higher likelihood of abusive government in the future.

        –”Finally, the gun industry through the NRA has created such a paranoia that Obama and his buddies want your gun, that gun sales have hit records.”

        Ironic that the only positive result of an Obama policy is an unintended consequence. No, I guess that doesn’t even rise to the level of irony.

        Dianiline

      • emerutil

        Are you stupid, insane, or just joking?!

        • Financially Insecure John:

          No, I’m Objective……….

          “free of any bias or prejudice caused by personal feelings or emotions”

          “based on facts rather than thoughts or opinions”

          “medicine describes disease symptoms that can be observed by somebody other than the person who is ill”

          “philosophy existing independently of the individual mind or perception”

    • Irish Love

      Americans have the right and advantage of being armed – unlike the citizens of other countries whose governments are afraid to trust the people with arms. – James Madison

    • Irish Love

      The Constitution shall never be construed … to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms. – Samuel Adams

    • Irish Love

      Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the act of depriving a whole nation of arms, as the blackest. – Mahatma Gandhi, in Gandhi, An Autobiography, p. 446

      • Financially Insecure John

        Irish,
        If it was up to me, no one but law enforcement officers would own handguns…

        Richard Daley

        Federal Gun Legislation Press Conference in Washington, D.C.

        Chicago Mayor

        1998-11-13

        I can cut and paste to-Just like you!

    • Irish Love

      The usual road to slavery is that first they take away your guns, then they take away your property, then last of all they tell you to shut up and say you are enjoying it. – James A. Donald

      • Financially Insecure John

        Guns have a place in the theater of war, they have no place out on the streets.

        Gray Davis

        California Governor

        1999-07-20

        Here we go again, just as origional as the Irish

    • Irish Love

      They have gun control in Cuba. They have universal health care in Cuba. So why do they want to come here? – Paul Harvey 8/31/94

      • Financially Insecure John

        I think you have to do it a step at a time and I think that is what the NRA is most concerned about, is that it will happen one very small step at a time, so that by the time people have “woken up” — quote — to what’s happened, it’s gone farther than what they feel the consensus of American citizens would be. But it does have to go one step at a time and the beginning of the banning of semi-assault military weapons, that are military weapons, not “household” weapons, is the first step.”

        Barbara Fass

        ABC News Special, Peter Jennings: Guns

        Stockton, CA Mayor

        1991-04-11

        I can cut and paste just like a Tea Bagger!

    • Irish Love

      Armed people are free. No state can control those who have the machinery and the will to resist, no mob can take their liberty and property. And no 220-pound thug can threaten the well-being or dignity of a 110-pound woman who has two pounds of iron to even things out … People who object to weapons aren’t abolishing violence, they’re begging for rule by brute force, when the biggest, strongest animals among men were always automatically right. Guns ended that, and a social democracy is a hollow farce without an armed populace to make it work. – L. Neil Smith (from The Probability Broach)

      • Financially Insecure John

        In fact, only police, soldiers and, maybe, licensed target ranges should have handguns. No one else needs one.

        Michael Gartner

        WSJ

        then president of NBC News

        1991-01-10

        Wow this is just so much fun-can I go Tea Baggin too????????

    • Irish Love

      The people of the various provinces are strictly forbidden to have in their possession any swords, bows, spears, firearms or other types of arms. The possession of these elements makes difficult the collection of taxes and dues, and tends to permit uprising. – Toyotomi Hideyoshi, Japanese Shogun, August 29, 1558

      • Financially Insecure John

        I’m a babbling idiot who can cut and paste my way into any debate that I can’t win

        Dr Strangeloviedovie

        An Mental Hospital somewhere off my medications

        January 20, 2013

    • Irish Love

      When the resolution of enslaving America was formed in Great Britain, the British Parliament was advised by an artful man, who was governor of Pennsylvania, to disarm the people; that it was the best and most effectual way to enslave them; but that they should not do it openly, but weaken them, and let them sink gradually…I ask, who are the militia? They consist of now of the whole people, except a few public officers. But I cannot say who will be the militia of the future day. If that paper on the table gets no alteration, the militia of the future day may not consist of all classes, high and low, and rich and poor… – George Mason, Virginia Constitution Convention

    • Irish Love

      Gun control? It’s the best thing you can do for crooks and gangsters. I want you to have nothing. If I’m a bad guy, I’m always gonna have a gun. Safety locks? You will pull the trigger with a lock on, and I’ll pull the trigger. We’ll see who wins. – Sammy “The Bull” Gravano, whose testimony convicted John Gotti

    • Irish Love

      Switzerland is a land where crime is virtually unknown, yet most Swiss males are required by law to keep in their homes what amounts to a portable, personal machine gun. –Tom Clancy

    • Irish Love

      Today, we need a nation of Minutemen, citizens who are not only prepared to take arms, but citizens who regard the preservation of freedom as the basic purpose of their daily life and who are willing to consciously work and sacrifice for that freedom. – John F. Kennedy

    • Irish Love

      Finally, before I sign off: Criminals obey “gun control” laws in the same manner politicians follow their oaths of office. – Anonymous

      I LOVE THAT ONE!! Night my friend…….

      • Financially Insecure John

        as my wife said, that woman meets the saying; that nut job is driven to get the last word.

        is this what happens when you get barred from match.com?

        • Irish Love

          As my husband said: that wuss is hell bent on proven his pointless point. Have a great night Mr Entitlement!! BTW, I read in the newspaper they are giving out “cheese” at DHS on wednesday…. YOU & your wife might want to get there early……. NOW Buzz Off & quit stalking me!!! TY

          • Financially Insecure John

            my wife was right-last word and stay away from your husbands pump bottle.

          • dalene44

            Irish love… your quote from Gandhi shows peace seekers know the value of the right to bear arms.
            From other less benevolent leaders:
            1.“The most foolish mistake we could possibly make would be to allow the subject races to possess arms.” Hitler
            2.“If the opposition disarms, well and good. If it refuses to disarm, we shall disarm it ourselves.” Stalin
            3.”All political power comes from the barrel of a gun.” Mao Tse Tung

          • Irish Love

            TY dalene44… I appreciate engaging in intelligent informed discussion! I think outside the box and research all “media” info for credibility and in addition, I admit, my “touchstone” is the Constitution and other “guiding” documents created by OUR forefathers to protect us as “We The People…” from a tryannical government. May I ask you for your thoughts on the following “excerpt”??

            “Perhaps it’s time to ask the true purpose of FEMA and other federal agencies. When the necessity arises, National Guard Units under martial law paradigms will be rolled out for “control of widespread domestic unrest.” A 2009 report discusses something called a Stability Police Force resembling a hybrid military/ law enforcement entity created “under the guise of controlling domestic riots.” Use of National Guard units became familiar to residents of New Orleans during the Katrina episode, so citizens may initially not consider it unusual to see guard members serving along with FEMA in these 10 regions.

            Executive Orders, “…have been on the books for a half century now, empowering the Federal Emergency Management Agency to take control of everything from public and private communications, energy and transportation to housing and more.” (5) And since 9/11, the president has been given nearly limitless power, permitting officers of the Executive branch to ignore completely the constitutional rights of the American people.

            In March of 2012, Barack Obama created Executive Order number 13603, entitled National Defense Resources Preparedness. “In this Executive Order, Obama essentially gave himself the authority to declare Martial Law in times of war or peace.” War OR Peace! No longer will the federal government need the excuse of a disaster to impose its full will and authority on the American public!”

            Lieutenant McCoy was right when he observed that “we’re in huge trouble!” The question is, will We the People have the courage to reclaim our constitutional rights?

            Your thoughts please dalene44…… TY

          • http://gravatar.com/dalene44 dalene44

            I think we need to be mindful of Obama’s insistence of indefinite detention for US citizens and his court battle to keep it after one judge found it unconstitutional. He also won a court battle to keep drone attacks on Americans secret. I’m hoping FEMA will be used for their intended purpose, to help in disasters but they were unresponsive in Sandy and seemed to spend more time confiscating guns than useful assistance in Katrina.
            http://rt.com/usa/news/drone-kill-mcmahon-obama-245/
            http://rt.com/usa/news/appeals-ndaa-detention-public-536/
            http://rt.com/usa/news/obama-ndaa-detention-president-288/
            http://rt.com/usa/news/court-law-obama-citizen-343/

  • http://gravatar.com/dalene44 Justin57

    “…The greatest purveyor of violence in the world, my own government, I can not be silent.” Martin Luther King

    As to the campaign Against the NRA, I think anyone who supports dismantling the constitution or any of our rights have motives that go against the well being of our country. It’s very suspect and pathetic that they allow themselves to be used to further political oppression.. Don’t they realize it will be used against them?

    • Irish Love

      MMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM Justin…….. I find you very INFORMED!!! TY for the comment!!

    • emerutil

      “Don’t they know it will be used against them?” NO. They think they will be part of the ruling elite, and exempt from the system they hope to install!

  • Patriot

    Yeah, all us ‘right wing nuts’ are just stupid hicks that believe in the fantasy that we need weapons to protect us from our own government. Boy,what a bunch of morons we are….Hmm….or are we? Seems that the President is actively looking for military leaders that would agree to fire on U.S. citizens….Bah, more right wing extremism.

    http://www.examiner.com/article/shock-claim-obama-only-wants-military-leaders-who-will-fire-on-u-s-citizens?cid=db_articles

    • Irish Love

      Hmmm indeed Lad, we right-winged extremists have nothing to fear…. BUT fear itself…..BAH! ;)

    • Bob666

      “So, who is the source”?

      “Garrow replied: The man who told me this is one of America’s foremost military heroes.”

      Understand, this is not coming from Alex Jones or Jesse Ventura, or from anyone else the left often dismisses with great ease.”

      just above alien probing Iowa farmer on the national enquirer of the web

    • Irish Love

      LOL this one is YOURS Patriot……… I am soooo BORED with this guy. Take it away…….Bobby 6-6-6 just loves “pissin on other’s territory” yanno……. like a dog “markin”……… ;)

      • Patriot

        Doesn’t matter much. I have followed the posts of this guy and he just loves to read his own text. One of the many that fight for ideology over ideas. And regardless of the source – if it were the liberal equivalent of god herself – it wouldn’t matter. We are but right wing nuts and shall always be.
        But I shall always be with the comfort of the weapons they so loathe, and the belief in a free nation they so despise.
        In other words *yawn*.

        • Irish Love

          OMG Patriot……… WELL said….. indeed!!

          • Bob666

            Well Dr Loviedovie, playing with the pump bottle again?????

        • Bob666

          Patriot,
          You and Dr Strangeloviedivie are ment for ecah other. enjoy probing each other-their wont be inteligent life.

          • Patriot

            *sigh* and that is the kind of reply I expected, based on all of the other intelligent discussions you have offered here. Thus my complete disinterest in engaging you further.

          • Bob666

            that works “Patriot” now go back to your National Enquirer for the facts as you seem to be in the “know”

    • Irish Love

      OMG Patriot…….. I thought I was the only sane person here and could see that this guy needs some”sheese” with his whine!! TY TY TY I totally understand how boring this is!!! All TALK no SUBSTANCE!! ;)

      • Irish Love

        I meant “CHEESE” a typo excuse me LOL!!!!!!!!!

        • Patriot

          I am not even seeing anything that could be misconstrued as ‘whining’ from this guy. That, at least, would add something substantive to the discussion. It is less than whining. More like, uninteresting blather from a clearly disenfranchised sycophant whose postings here make up a large part of his own self worth. Again, pay him no mind. There are more interesting people here that – even though they disagree with us and we with them – have something to add that isn’t rooted in lack and sociological retardation.

          • Bob666

            “isn’t rooted in lack and sociological retardation”.

            eat any good books latley other than what is sold on the check-out isle?

          • Irish Love

            You are right…… there is no sense putting any energy in to social retards….. they offer nothing intelligent for discussion… it is all built on name calling; insults; sarcasm and bullying…… wast of time! I do like dalene44 and Justin…… GOOD folks with an honest discussion inlight of what is going on in OUR country. I prefer NOT to allow this country to be divided & conquered…. which is the current leaderships goal…. at least Hitler succeeded under the same premise. TY for the chat!!

        • Bob666

          “All TALK no SUBSTANCE”

          So says Dr Strangeloviedove, the “Cut and Paste” queen?

    • Irish Love

      Yanno Patriot,. when I first responded on this sight after several weeks of monitoring it….. Mr Bobby; Mr Insecure John; and Mr Nick Crusty attacked me for voicing MY opinion on the 2nd Amendment.

      At first I was “taken aback” and really didn’t understand what was going on…..I had not said anything other then MY beliefs….But, I GET IT NOW …. whether you call them: “plants” “stoolies” “snitches” “drones” it all equals the same…… they are just folks hell bent on “undermining” any group which MAY confront their illusion of utopia.

      Not only are they misinformed, THEY are actually WILLING to give up LIBERTY for security. Security from the government…….. OH Boy are they in for a REAL wake-up call.

      • Bob666

        Dr. Strangeloviedovie,
        “whether you call them: “plants” “stoolies” “snitches” “drones” it all equals the same…… they are just folks hell bent on “undermining” any group which MAY confront their illusion of utopia”

        Really, where did copy and paste that origional thought from??

  • Irish Love

    TY Darlin, I come from Irish roots who fled tryanny and came to AMERICA for Liberty & Freedom; my family has faught in WWI; WWII; Korean War & Vietnam…. I LOVE this Country, albeit has faults…. BUT still the greatest Nation! AMERICAN: a creed NOT a race ~ an HONOR!! TY dalene44

    • dianiline

      Irish Love said: “TY Darlin, I come from Irish roots who fled tryanny and came to AMERICA for Liberty & Freedom….”

      Hi Irish,

      How many people do you suppose come from families who have recently escaped from tyranny and yet vote Democratic? Not many, I’d imagine.

      How smug and secure one must be, to think that tyranny could not happen here.

      How foolish to think that one can give up the rights that protect us from tyranny, and still be safe from tyranny.

      How stupid to think that one can impose the tyranny that one likes, such as mandatory health insurance, gun-free zones, discrimination on the basis of legal activity such as smoking, and still be safe from tyranny that one will not like.

      Dianiline

      • Irish Love

        Hi dianiline!

        I know you have heard the expression: “It’s like talking to a brick wall”

        I am still amazed at the number of people who DO NOT UNDERSTAND what “tyranny” means and that our guiding documents of this GREAT Nation are being VIOLATED & DESTROYED.

        The “head in the sand” attitude by liberals AMAZES me and is SHOCKING!! I am so glad I met you TY for your post!!

  • http://gravatar.com/dalene44 dalene44

    This is from our “community” email network where I live in San Francisco…even in San Francisco people are having second thoughts about losing the right of defending themselves.

    +++Hi Neighbors, a dear friend who lives on Nob Hill came home at 3am on 1/19/13 and got robbed at gunpoint in front of his house. The robber said he will shoot if my friend turns around. The theif took his backpack, phone and wallet and got in a getaway car
    waiting nearby. They turned off his cell phone. The police told my friend that someone else was robbed 15 min before. Another friend got his car broken into by the ballpark last nite. SFPD and the city DOES NOT CARE. TOO COMMON. WE NEED TO FIGHT BACK and MAKE A STINK! WE PAY FOR THEIR SALARIES SO WHY ARE WE NOT SAFE???

    +++Very scary, I live on that corner. Did your friend see what kind of car he got away in? I hope he reported it to the police – they need to find this guy

    +++He just told me that it was a young black male. Will find out about car. Stay safe

    +++The City is becoming less safer by the day. Someone rear-ended me recently in a nearby neighborhood and made a run for it ..I called the police and sure enough they arrived within minutes to the site….I was chatting with the officers and they seem to hint that Friday and Saturday nights are the most dangerous time to be out…walking or driving…they told me about horror accidents in the area….I didn’t wanna be rude to the officer but I also couldn’t help but wonder “what is the police doing about it?”. I think the default answer will be…budget cuts…under staffing…etc…etc..etc

    +++Hi Neighbors – with the increase in robberies (one taking place at Leavenworth and Jackson just last night), I called the non-emergency SF police line and spoke with a Sergeant today. I requested a “passing call”, which means a formal citizen’s request to increase police presence in the area between the hours of 10am and 3am. The common denominator for every single robbery is that both male and females were on their cell phones. The robber is an African American male and may be working with a female (getaway car).

    +++I wrote to both Supervisor Chiu and Mayor Lee.

    +++I’m not really supporting the use of guns … but I now … I am unconvinced. making firearm illegal will only harm people that want and need to protect themselves.These neighborhood events pose a conundrum in the gun logic as criminals will always find ways to score a weapon. As laws taking the equilibrating factor away, results will be the good getting the ugly side of bad.

    • Irish Love

      And rightly so dalene4…… “gun-free zones” only encourage criminals….. BUT more importantly is the “right to bear arms”……. I do not want to 2nd guess those tragic events you described,,,,,,, however,. did anyone own a gun?? 2ndly, the “Right To Bear Arns” as the Constitution explains………… We The People….. should be armed to protect ourselves from a “tyrannical government”… I definitely see the “shift” in posture with our current “leader” and his desire to CONTINUE to violate OUR Constitution…… There lies MY concern!!

      • Irish Love

        I guess what I am saying is those ppl had every right to protect their property and a “gun” was the leveling field… I totally understand the frustration of “waiting” for police protection……. they arrive AFTER a crime…. NOT during…… YOU as an AMERICAN have every right to PROTECT your self………. from criminals & GOVERNMENT!! Just sayin!! ;)

      • http://gravatar.com/dalene44 dalene44

        Crime is going steadily up so the hard core liberal San Francisco citizens are starting to realize the criminals with guns have plenty of time to do their thing before the cops get there…If they get there at all.
        Australians are having a huge increase in crime after their gun ban particularly Home Invasions, armed robbery and rape. Easy pickins’.
        England is now the most violent country in Europe. Guess that’s why China, Russia and Piers Morgan are pushing for gun control in the US…they’re hoping the criminals take over to make it easier for them to get their foot in the door. I think Piers just hates America.

      • http://gravatar.com/dalene44 dalene44

        I agree completely. The second amendment protects what’s left of our other rights, without it the government could have their way with us. No more free speech or free stuff. Obama operatives are being used to try to control the gun debate but they don’t realize gun control will effect them too and not in a good way. We’d ultimately be at the mercy of gangs if the economy collapsed. The rising popularity of home invasions in Australia is creepy. They keep warning us “Don’t give up your rights!”

        • Irish Love

          OMG dalene44 I just returned from Down Under 5 months ago after living there for a year. YOU are exactly right…. MOST Aussies say DO NOT GIVE UP YOU RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS……… the socialistic government in which they live under with forced social medicine; taxation of 70% and a pack of cigarettes at $25.00 has the workin Aussie infuriated.

          They are good people and generous in nature, however, they continually told me: DO NOT GIVE UP YOUR RIGHTS……. why do you think they were so adamant about that??

          • http://gravatar.com/dalene44 dalene44

            Strange isn’t it that China, Russia and obama operatives want us to give up guns but Australians and survivors of tyrannical governments warn us to Never give up your rights. Once they’re gone they’re gone for good.

          • Irish Love

            ABSOLUTELY………… the infringements on Australians is unbelieveable…… YOU can be stopped at any time WITHOUT cause and questioned…… it was a very scary experience for me as an American…….. HOWEVER, I see my OWN country on the same path…… GOD HELP US!!!

    • Nick Czudy

      Dalene.
      How about if in all of these examples, would it have helped the victims if they had a Glock with a 10 bullet magazine?

      What is the problem?

      Are you telling me that you need a machine gun?

      • Irish Love

        OH Jaysus Nick… just when I thought YOU were OK….. YOU ask that questions…… GET REAL LAD!!! Why do you operate from a “sheep” mentality??? Investigate; research; learn………. don’t accept what your commardes say…. C’mon Nick get some cojones!!! lol

      • http://gravatar.com/dalene44 dalene44

        If gangs get big and invasive enough it’d be nice that someone have the option. Cities are in rapid decline and decay and gangs tend to take over if you let them. They can be scared away from your neighborhood with the right weapon. The police just can’t be relied on.

        • Irish Love

          YES dalene, YOU have every right to bear arms equal to what the government has….. will you need a weapon of that type in daily protection….. probably not, HOWEVER, your right to obtain it should NOT be infringed upon….. YOUR current leadership may decide to “disarm” law biding citizens……… then YOUR 2nd Amendment right is infringed upon

          • http://gravatar.com/dalene44 dalene44

            Irish Love, Absolutely. What part of “shall not be infringed” do the anti-rights radicals not understand? There’s no doubt the Founders saw this coming (even 237 years ago) and wanted to be sure citizens had protection. It was their greatest gift to generations of Americans…like leaving your child a security nest egg…and the most critical of all amendments to the Bill of Rights.

          • Irish Love

            I need say no more, YOU totally understand the 2nd Amendment as written by OUR Forefathers!! God Bless America and as OUR National Anthem says: Does the flag still wave??

      • emerutil

        I do not need a machine gun (yet). However, my only limitations to having one should be my desire, and my financial capability. So says the 2nd Amendment

  • Terry Ray Anderson

    I remember back when Reagan came into office and the movie “Red Dawn” came out. EVERYBODY I knew was convinced that Ronny the Ray Gun was going to bring on a war and that the Soviets would invade the entire continental USA through their proxy state of Cuba. Hell, I even stocked up on 7.62 x 39 and an AK so that if they succeeded I’d be ready for the “hit and run” tactics the would save my “freedom”. Never mind that the USSR and Cuba never had the infrastructure to pull it off, and after a while the hysteria died down. Well guess what kiddies, cooler minds who were calling it BS were correct and it never happened. Same here. The US of A has over 300,000,000 milion people; do you actually think that the infrastructure to confiscate all guns, much less just the semi autos, exists? The NRA has too deep of pockets (thank God) to pass a ban, so stay frosty and can the paranoia. There is no national database (and in the call for that there is admittedly future danger) for gun sales in the US, so how will “they” (the BATF, FBI, PsyCops) know where to look in the first place (not valid in Connecticut, where firearms are registered) , via questionnaire or mental telepathy, I suppose. I think you guys should turn off the TV with “Preppers” and FOX and turn off Rush (not the band, they rock!), relax, go pop off a few rounds at the shooting range. People do know what “tyranny” means, and if we actually had tyranny you wouldn’t be blogging and bitching on the web that isn’t allowed, shooting (with all the purchases that entails; ammo, ect.), you couldn’t leave your “papers” at home, permission to go out after curfew. In other words, you think Obama’s a tyrant, move to China, or Russia, or Cuba or parts of Africa and taste some real pain, ’cause I’ve seen it and we ain’t got it. In the meantime, polish your six inch barrel on your shotgun, make sure to tape the fuzes on your RPG, make sure the belt on your M234 SAW is going to feed properly. Oh wait, that’s right, you can’t own those things either! So much for “shall not be infringed”…

    • Bob666

      Terry Ray Anderson,
      “Well guess what kiddies, cooler minds who were calling it BS were correct and it never happened. Same here”

      Very well stated, I am no fan of the current administrsation, but it would be impossible to get every gun and the “cooler minds” would prevail.

      • Terry Ray Anderson

        Thank you! It’s nice that there are still some people with a sense of “measured response” out there. Keep your powder dry and thanks again!

      • Speak2Truth

        The Communists figured out that they’d never be able to take America by force because the Americans would kick their a**es. Red Dawn was an illustration of the power of civilian resistance in a well armed society.

        So, as Obama’s communist buddy Van Jones explained, they dropped the “radical pose”, put on suits, pretended to be Americans, weaseled their way into just about every important system of control in the US. They took it over from the inside.

        How many news people commented that the Communist Party USA was working hard to get Obama elected to “fundamentally transform” the United States? It was important to the Communists to get control over the major TV news networks to give them cover.

        Americans have been killed by the tens of thousands fighting to keep the Communist Empire from spreading across the world like the cancer it is. Now look who put THEIR guy into the White House.

        • Bob666

          Yo Speak,
          “How many news people commented that the Communist Party USA was working hard to get Obama elected to “fundamentally transform” the United States”

          I Just don’t recall news people commented that the Communist Party USA was doing anything? It there some special cable network that you have been watching?

    • kimo3690

      SO TRUE MY FRIENDS!!! God Bless America ~ IMPEACH OBAMA NOW!!!

    • http://gravatar.com/dalene44 dalene44

      Never underestimate the actions of a wannabe dictator, his complicit media and the greedy global elites behind the scenes. They appear desperate to disarm us. It’ll be interesting to see what they come up with next.

  • kimo3690

    WELL SAID BROTHER SPEAK & THE TRUTH regardless of the Lefty-Liberal “communist” response!!!

  • Speak2Truth

    Bob – that’s the point. None of the news people commented on the Communist Party USA working hard to get Obama elected. It was their own website that bragged about it.

    None of the news people commented on Obama’s trip to Kenya in 2006 to go on the campaign trail with Raila Odinga, the Marxist thug who promised the Islamists he would impose Sharia law if he won. Imagine that, a US Senator traveling to a foreign nation to actively campaign for the election of a Marxist/Islamist. Then running for President of the USA. That is HUGE! And the newsies all kept their mouths shut.

    Obama has only gotten this far in politics, to where he could “fundamentally transform” the United States to serve Marxism and Islam, because the news people kept SILENT about who he really is. They actively protected him from scrutiny to help him get to power.

    And they won’t even talk about his ongoing fight to prevent legal verification of his Natural Born Citizen status. His lawyers are STILL fighting to keep his legal birth certificate out of any courtroom, even this year!

    The coup only continues because the mainstream media are its official propaganda arm.

    Amazing, eh?

    • kimo3690

      TRULY Amazing indeed!!! TY for an excellent post!!

  • emerutil

    We have allowed statists and other oligarchs to become our rulers because of a twisted mindset known as Zeitgeist. Loosely translated, it is German for Spirit of the Times. Mistaken ideas that are universally accepted. I have witnessed this phenomenon for most of my life. God help us!

  • http://Yahoo Maynard

    Dear Right Wing Extremist. I am a Left Wing Extremist in that I believe the resources of our earth should be used sparingly and wisely – not based on the profit motive, but on their efficacy in promoting the over-all health and well-being of its ecologies and human populations. However, I agree with much of your analysis concerning sheeple.
    I look to the day when we can both agree that abuses of power towards our fellow man and our earth should all be ended.

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