Newark Mayor: Turn In Gun Owners For $1,000

January 13, 2012 by Sam Rolley

Newark, N.J., Mayor Corey Booker wants people to report their neighbors to law enforcement if they are exercising their 2nd Amendment rights.

The Mayor hopes to incentivize people to snitch on gun-owning neighbors by offering a $1,000 reward for every report that leads to an illegal firearm arrest.

“We as individuals have to do something about it. So we have a program in our city right now that is completely anonymous and we will give you cash— $1000 to anyone who calls our anonymous tip-line. Give us the information about who is carrying a gun, we don’t even have to have a conviction. If we arrest that individual and simply get that gun off the streets.” Booker said in a commercial announcing the program, which you see below.

The Newark program is seemingly modeled after the Federal “If You See Something, Say Something” campaign that enlists everyday citizens to be government spies.

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Filed Under: 2nd Amendment Under Fire, Liberty News, Staff Reports

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Mitch A

Coming to your own hometown soon, the new national greeting.
“Your papers please, comrade.”
Scott in SC

Just watched the commercial and it is absolutely disgusting. Reminds me of those pay day loan and sell your gold for cash hucksters, but much more dangerous. This is turn in your friends, neighbors, parents and children to the government for cash. Trust no one but Big Brother; love no one but Big Brother.
Definitely designed to appeal to the lowest common denominator. Constantly waving that handful of cash to a population where poverty is the rule rather than the exception. Of course these cash starved folks will respond, but will never turn in a criminal for fear of retribution.
GrayStroke

Looks like Esau has a large family living in New Johy-cee they are willing to sell their shredded 2d amendment rights to protect themselves for a false sense of security. As the adage goes when seconds count police are minutes away and hope your never in need of one.Here is a good read worthy of cutting-n-pasting far and wide:
The Phases of Surrender

The first phase of surrender is failing to be armed, trained and committed to fight. We are prepared to surrender when we are unprepared to resist.

The second phase of surrender is failing to be alert. You must see trouble coming in order to have time to respond. The warning may be less than one second but it will be there and it must be recognized and acted upon immediately.

The Third phase of surrender is giving up your weapons.

The last phase of surrender is up to the monsters who have taken control of your life and perhaps the lives of your loved ones. The last phase of surrender is out of your hands.

Surrender during war

During the American Revolution 12,000 Colonists captured by the British died in captivity on prison ships, while only 8,000 died in battle. Had the 12,000 who surrendered continued to fight many would have survived and they could have done great damage to the British and likely shortened the war.

Civil War prisoners were treated so badly that some 50,000 died in captivity. More Americans have been killed by Americans than by any foreign army in any war. Six hundred eighteen thousand (618,000) Americans died in the Civil War.

As many as 18,000 captured American and Filipino prisoners died or were murdered at the hands of the Japanese during the six days of the “Bataan Death March.” Had most of these soldiers slipped into the jungle and fought as guerrillas they could have tied up elements of the Japanese Army for months or years and perhaps more of them would have survived the war.

Of the Americans who actually reached Japanese prison camps during the war, nearly 50,000 died in captivity. That is more than 10 percent of all the American military deaths in the entire war in both the Pacific and European theaters combined.

In addition to the 50,000 captured Americans who died in Japanese prison camps an additional 20,000 were murdered before reaching a prison camp. If those 70,000 Americans had continued to fight, they could have provided time for the United States to build and maneuver its forces, perhaps shortening the war and saving even more lives. Some of them would have likely survived the war. If they had all died in battle their fate would have been no worse.

During the early stages of the Battle of the Bulge American soldiers were massacred by the German troops who captured them.

During the Vietnam conflict many American Prisoners Of War were tortured daily for years by the Communist North Vietnamese. Many Americans died during the process. Only Officers (Aviators) held in North Vietnam were ever repatriated. Enlisted Americans captured in South Viet Nam were routinely tortured, mutilated and murdered by the Communists. As a combat soldier and knowing my fate should I be captured, I was committed to fighting to the death. I made specific plans to force the enemy to kill me rather than allow myself to be captured.

In recent years, American troops captured by Islamic terrorists groups have virtually all been tortured and murdered in gruesome fashion. If I were fighting in the Middle East, I would make a similar vow and plan to fight to the death. Under no circumstances would I allow myself to be captured by our Islamic enemies.

Death by Government

R.J. Rummel, who wrote the book, “Death by Government” states that prior to the 20th Century; 170 million civilians were murdered by their own governments. Historians tell us that during the 20th Century perhaps as many as 200 million civilians were murdered by their own governments.

Some of the Nations where the mass murder of civilians occurred during the 20th Century include Russia, Ukraine, Germany, Poland, Czechoslovakia, The Congo, Uganda, Armenia, Viet Nam, Cambodia, Nigeria, Laos, China, Cuba, Manchuria, Iraq, Iran, Biafra, Rwanda and many others. The slaughter of civilians by governments appears to be as common as not.

Most of these slaughters were only made possible by disarming the victims before killing them. Had these people resisted, their fate would have been no worse and perhaps better. Resistance is much more difficult after the government has already taken the means of resistance away from the people. Planned genocide has been the primary reason for weapon confiscation throughout history.

Jews and others who surrendered to the Nazis were murdered in slave labor camps by the millions. Had all the Jews in Europe resisted when the Nazis started rounding them up they could have made the Nazis pay an enormous price for the holocaust. The fact that Hitler confiscated guns in 1936 made resistance far less feasible.

Had the Jews in Germany resisted, the outcome may have been the same but the world would have learned about the holocaust years earlier and may have intervened. Most people would prefer to die fighting and trying to kill their oppressor, than be taken off to a death camp and starved to death or murdered in a gas chamber.

William Ayers, former leader of the Terrorist organization The Weather Underground, and close friend of Barack Obama, told his followers in the Weather Underground, “When we (Communist Revolutionaries) take over the United States, we will have to kill 25 million Americans.” He was referring to those who would never submit to a Communist takeover. Those who would refuse to deny and reject the Constitution would have to be murdered. If this sounds impossible, remember that Genocide by Government was the leading cause of death in the last Century.

Surrendering to Criminals

The Onion Field Murder in California was a wake up call to Law Enforcement Officers everywhere. On March 9, 1963, two Los Angeles Police Department officers were taken prisoner by two criminals. The Officers submitted to capture and gave up their weapons.

They were driven to an onion field outside of Bakersfield.

One Officer was murdered while the other Officer managed to escape in a hail of gunfire. The surviving Officer suffered serious psychological case, having been unable to save his partner. As a result of this incident, the LAPD policy became, “You will fight no matter how bad things are.” “You will never ever surrender your weapons or yourself to a criminal.”

Consider the Ogden, Utah record store murders. Read the book if you do not know the story. The manner in which the criminals murdered their young victims cannot be described here. Resistance might have been futile. Compliance was definitely and absolutely futile.

The courts in this country have ruled that the police have no legal obligation to protect anyone. Why do Law Enforcement Officials always tell civilians not to resist a criminal, while they tell their Officers to always resist and never surrender? Police administrators fear being sued by a civilian victim who gets hurt resisting. Furthermore, the police, like all government agencies derive their power by fostering dependence.

According to Professor John Lott’s study on the relationship between guns and crime, a victim who resists with a firearm is less likely to be hurt or killed than a victim who cooperates with his attacker. His book is titled “More Guns, Less Crime.”

The Doctor and his family in Connecticut complied and cooperated, meeting every demand of the home invasion robbers to whom they had surrendered. The Doctors wife and daughters were tortured, raped, doused with gasoline and burned alive. How did surrender and cooperation work out for them?

In another home invasion robbery, a kindly couple with 9 “adopted, special needs children,” surrendered to the robbers. The victims opened their safe and did not resist in any way. When the robbers where finished ransacking the home and terrifying the children, they shot both parents in the head several times before leaving. How did surrender and complete cooperation work out for them?

Handing over your life by surrendering to someone who is in the process of committing a violent crime against you is a form of suicide. Some survive but many do not. The monster gets to decide for you.

We have heard brutalized victims say, “The robber said that he would not hurt us if we cooperated.” Why would you believe anything that someone who is committing a crime against you says? He will be lying if he speaks. As we say in law enforcement, “If a criminal’s lips are moving while he is speaking, he is lying.” Criminals by definition are dishonest and should never be trusted or believed.

You have no doubt heard friends say, I would not resist a criminal, after all why would he kill me? This is stupid and naive. In law enforcement, we call these people “Victims by Choice” (VBC). There could be a long list of reasons why a criminal would kill you despite your cooperation.

You may be of a different race, thus a different tribe. Only members of his tribe are actually human in his mind. He may feel hatred toward you because you have more than he does. Gratification from being in a position of total power is reason enough for some.

Criminals are sometimes members of a Satanic Cult who worship death such as the “Night Stalker” in California. Eliminating a potential witness is often cited as a reason to kill a victim. Sometimes criminals simply enjoy causing suffering and death. There are people who are in fact, pure evil. I have heard criminals say, “I killed her just to watch her die.”

A victim who begs for mercy can give his attacker a tremendous feeling of power which many criminals seem to enjoy. You cannot expect mercy from someone who does not know what mercy is.

Resist!

We each have a duty to ourselves, our loved ones, our neighbors, our community, our city, our state and our country to resist criminals. Reasoning with a thug who believes that his failures are because of people just like you is not likely to be helpful. Pleading with a terrorist who has been taught from birth that his salvation depends on murdering people like you is a doomed plan. Resist!

Resist! His gun may not be real. After you are tied up it will not matter. His gun may not be loaded. After you are tied up it will not matter. He may not know how to operate his gun. After you are tied up it will not matter. Resist!

Statistically if you run and your assailant shoots at you he will miss. Statistically if you run and he shoots and hits you, you will not die. Bad guys shooting at the police miss 90 percent of the time. The odds are on your side. Better to die fighting in place than to be tied up, doused with gasoline and burned alive. There are things worse than death. Surrender to a criminal or a terrorist and you will learn what they are. Resist!

If you resist with a commitment to win you may well prevail, especially if you are armed and trained. If you lose it is still better to die fighting in place than to be taken prisoner and have your head cut off with a dull knife while your screams gurgle through your own blood as we have witnessed on numerous videos from the Middle East, brought to us by the “Islamic practitioners of peace.”

Some who have refused to surrender

History is filled with brave people who refused to surrender. Some of these men and woman have won their battles despite what seemed to be insurmountable odds. Others have gone down fighting and avoided being tortured to death. Some fought to the death to help or save others. Many have fought to the death for an idea or a belief.

When General Santa Ana (also the President of Mexico at the time) ordered 180 “Texacans” to surrender the Alamo, Col. Travis answered with “a cannon shot and a rebel yell.” Eventually General Santa Ana was able to build his troop strength to ten thousand. The Mexicans then swarmed the defenders and killed them all.

The battle of the Alamo delayed the Mexican Army long enough for Sam Houston to build his Texacan Army, which met and defeated the Mexican Army and captured General Santa Ana. General Santa Ana traded Texas for his life and the sacrifices of the Alamo defenders changed history.

Frank Luke was a heroic aviator in WWI. Shot down and wounded he refused to surrender when confronted by a German patrol. He killed 4 German soldiers with his 1911 Pistol before being killed. Luke was posthumously awarded the Medal of Honor.

When his unit was pinned down by German Machine Guns and all of the Officers and non commissioned officers in his company were killed or wounded, Alvin York never considered surrendering. Instead, he attacked hundreds of German soldiers killing about 25 with his rifle and pistol and then captured 132 others by himself!

Most of the Jews in the Warsaw Ghetto (Poland) surrendered to the German Army. They were taken off to death camps and murdered. Between 400 and 1,000 Jews refused to surrender and armed with only a few pistols, revolvers and rifles, they held off the German Army for three months before dying in battle.

During the “Battle of the Bulge,” the 101st Airborne was surrounded by the German Army and ordered to surrender. Faced with overwhelming odds, the Commanding Officer of the 101st sent this reply to the Germans. “Nuts.” The Americans refused to surrender and they stopped the German advance. Most of the Americans troops survived.

On Sept 2, 2010, 40 armed criminals took over and robbed a train in India. Some of the robbers had guns, others used knives and clubs. When they began to disrobe an 18 year old girl for the purpose of gang raping her, one of the passengers decided to fight. He was a 35 year old retired Gurkha soldier. He drew his Khukasri knife and attacked the 40 robbers. He killed three of the robbers and wounded 8 more despite his being wounded in this 20 minute fight. The remaining criminals fled for their lives leaving their stolen loot and eleven comrades dead or wounded on the floor of the train. The eight wounded robbers were arrested.

How does one man defeat 40? How does he summon the courage to fight such odds? He utilized all of the Principles of Personal Defense: Alertness, Decisiveness, Aggressiveness, Speed, Coolness, Ruthlessness, and Surprise. He was skilled in the use of his weapon. Most importantly, He refused to be a victim and allow evil to triumph!

If this one inspirational soldier can defeat 40 opponents using his knife, it would seem that we should all be able to defeat a group of armed criminals by using our firearms if we are professionally trained as was this heroic Gurkha soldier.

Final thoughts

How will you respond if you are confronted by evil as some of us have been in the past and some of us will be in the future? If you have not decided ahead of time what you will do, you will likely do nothing. Those who fight back often win and survive. Those who surrender never win and often die a horrible death. Have you made your decision? Remember, no decision is a decision to do nothing.

http://google gary gerke

GREAT POST!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

This administration is afraid of the 93-million plus gun owners in the USA today. This number of gun owners would be the largest army in the world.

McCarthy was right!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Harvey

Thank GOD for people like you that know the truth and are willing to share the truth with others!
GOD bless you and keep you safe.
” Retreat Hell “
Boris

GrayStroke, Great post! One of the most valuable lessons that I learned in the military is Never Surrender (under ANY circumstances). Fight to the death.
Cliffystones

Gray,

Thanks for the wonderful essay.

Though I never served myself, I was fortunate to know many Veterans. My Dad was a Marine in the Pacific in WWII, my Father-in-Law a Pearl Harbor survivor who went on to fight in the battle of the Coral Sea.

The stories I heard from them and other Vets of Vietnam were a lesson to me having never known or faced such evil. Those who would attempt to create peace on earth by pacifying law abiding citizens need to hear these stores. Then think long and hard about the consequences of abdicating their Liberty.
Scott in SC

Gray,
I don’t know why you left out the facts pertaining to the Ogden robbery, rape, toture and murders as they are relevant to the conversation. The assailants were black and all the victims were white. In this situation the only chance for survival is to fight back. Both assailants were also members of the USAF, so if you think the police and govt are going to save you, you are 100% wrong.

GrayStroke

Scott this was a big picture overview of the herd mentality if you want details to educate yourself and others lease do so and come back and share. I am not omnipotent nor pretend to be.
Thanks!

mike1127

Bravo! Excellent post. Thank you very much for writing this. I hope you are a member of OathKeepers.
Erik

The “holocaust” is a myth, but the rest of your post was interesting.

independent thinker

The only myth about the holocost is the notion that only Jews were killed or that only a few non Jews were killed.
Cliffystones

I worked with a Lithuanian who had the serial numbers tattooed on his arm. He was Catholic. We had a conversation once about the Holocaust. He hated the fact that the media and the Jews never bothered to mention the fact that they weren’t the only ones destined for the “showers’, but were just the first in line.
JC

13 million total. 6 million were Jews.

WVSheepDog

@GrayStroke: Amen. To all of you who fear the gun but not the hand it is in – There are those of us who forgive you your naivete and ignorance. God Bless the Sheepdogs and watch over the sheep.

CSW

So you think if you gave away your weapons for a $1000.00 dollars will really help you. This Mayor doesn’t care about you and your freedoms. Just in case you don’t know President Obama signed in to Law Bill S-1867/NDAA. The Mainstream Media hasn’t talked about. All your freedoms and Liberties have been taken from you now. Every God fearing loving American is now a Terrorist, The Military,Police and TSA can come arrest you even if you’ve done nothing. Here is another thing to think about. When that time comes you can fight for your freedoms are go to a FEMA camp,There set up just like the ones the Nazis had in WW2.If I lived in your city I would keep my Guns and go out and get some more. You need to find out if your Sheriff is one who stands for the Constitution. If his great get together and have him get rid of the Mayor, If not you need to elected one that is. A sheriff can tell the Fed’s where they can go….

michael

buy up a large number of trash guns. hide them in the house of known left wing sympathizers like Karolyn,turn them in collect the 1000, buy more junk guns and repeat. Watch Karolyn squeal as she is arrested.

repeat as needed.
mike1127

A lot of our police and military belong to an organization called “The OathKeepers”. They have pledged to support their oath they took to the Constitution, and not to the authority over them. “ALL enemies, foreign an DOMESTIC”.

The police and military are just as divided as the public regarding these issues.

Daylo

What a cheap way to be undermine the constitution. Of course, he is a Democrat. They love this crap.
PW from Texas

Like it has been said many, many times. If you take the guns from the public, only criminals will have guns.

The Government can not tell you whether or not you can own a gun. It is not only your right to own a gun it is your RESPONSIBILITY to your country and countrymen to own and know how to use a gun.

If every body owned a gun and knew how to use it you would see crime all but disappear in all cities.

My philosophy is, Get yourself a gun and one for each member of your family over the age of 12 years old, learn how to use it well and teach each family member how to use their gun well, and have no less than 1,000 rounds of ammunition for each gun you own. Last but not least, Keep Your Powder Dry.

God bless America.

Awakened Avenger

“only criminals will have guns”. Yes I agree. They will have been integrated into the ‘enforcemnet’ arm of government. History is replete with examples. Checka, NKVD, Stasi, Gestapo, SAVAK, and etc. Better known as the police. Local, County, State, and Federal.

Kenneth Appel

You turn me in, I turn you in, We both get a free AK. Such a deal!
DoctorBob

The Gestapo would be so envious!
jim

“WE CANT AFFORD.”….to have another politicain BF the american folks while raping our rights under the constitution.
jon brown

A QUOTE IN 1944 BY NORMAN MATTOON THOMAS.(A SOCIALIST PARTY PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE) THE AMERICAN PEOPLE WILL NEVER KNOWINGLY ADOPT SOCIALISM .BUT UNDER THE NAME LIBERALISM THEY WILL ADOPT EVERY FRAGMENT OF THE SOCIALIST PROGRAM ,UNTILL ONE DAY AMERICA WILL BE A SOCIALIST NATION, WITHOUT KNOWING HOW IT HAPPENED.I NO LONGER NEED TO RUN AS A PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE FOR THE SOCIALIST PARTY. THE DEMOCRATE PARTY HAS ADOPTED OUR PLATFORM. SCARY TO SAY THE LEAST!!!!!!!!

Sirian

Very good historical point jon b. But here’s the problem, just as Thomas stated “The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism. . . until one day America will be a socialist nation, without knowing how it happened.” In reality, his statement is true and becoming more and more evident. Such fools, never to accept how easily they have been manipulated. Check out some of John T. Flynn’s books from back in the forties, you’ll find them both interesting and very applicable to today.

jimmy the greek

I lived in Newark back in the late 60s even back then you were crazy not having a gun .
Jeff

Everyone should get together and turn each other in and get the millions in reward and use it to sue the mayor… And demand that they put them all in jail. There releasing because of overcrowding now. How utterly STUPID this mayor is….

Awakened Avenger

Mayors of major urban metropolises are not ‘selected’ and paid to think. They are paid to be stupid!

JCfromDC

Welcome to the United Soviet Socialist States of AmeriKa, Mr. Mayor. This is EXACTLY what went on in the Soviet Union for 60 odd years. Bastard! One can only HOPE that Gov. Christie would put the squelch to this usurpish nonsense!

Karolyn

Christy should have no say in what a city does.

mike1127

Isn’t he the Governor? At this point I am seriously entertaining the thought that you just may be out of your mind, off in a little fantasy world of your own somewhere.

Jerry

The guns are not the problem, the criminals and urban culture are the problem. A criminal can use a gun, knife, car, tire iron or a hammer to commit a violent crime. Why doesn’t the mayor pay someone $1,000 to report the crime?
My right to bear arms

People stop and think for a minute.People were killing each other thousands of years before guns were thought of.If someone wants to kill another person they will weather they have a gun or not.It is not the gun that kills it is the person holding it.We need tougher laws against the criminals not against gun owners or guns.I am an avid hunter and will never use my gun for other then hunting but to defend me and my property I will use it.Think of the NRA cartoon that shows they let the criminal go and hung his gun.Think of this.It is not the gun,it is the criminal!!!!

Robert Smith

Was it Cane who shot Able or Able who shot Cane?

Was it a command from a registered god?

Rob

JC

A little O.C.D. on the religion thing aren’t you Robert?
Unfortunately for you, it aligns you perfectly with Communist doctrine.

http://www.personalliberty.com/news/paul-holding-strong-leading-into-first-primary/?eiid= William L collins

its people like claire that will be working for the NEW WORLDER HITLER force and will trun her freinds or anyone she thanks that has a gun thats just how it happend in eruope when hitler disarmed the people and then they took the arms away from the ones that was truning everyone in every one knows noe that CLAIRE AND HER HUSBAND are the first hitler backers that has came out lust like there mayor so N.J. will be the first bunch that go strate to the FEAMA CAMPS with the help of people like CLAIRE and her husband EVERY BODY HAD BETTER VOTE FOR RON PAUL so we the people can start taken our country back from hitler regime
Jesse

My point proven again, keep the sheeple arguing and we do what we want. Its not up to anyone here or law enforcement to decide who carries a weapon or not. Everyone is entitled to….it America!

If the mayor wants to do something good, make an announcement that the city has bought guns for everyone that does not have one and they can have one and free training. Then everyone has one and the criminals will think twice about doing anything.

Again, controlling anthers rights to protect themselves is not up to you or any agency, its our right. Even a criminal is entitled to protect himself from another criminal whether you understand, like, or dislike it…it just is.

2centsworth

The Attorney General of the United States of America, Eric Holder was getting powerful assault weapons into the hands of drug dealers in Mexico….as a set up to proceed with “their” desire to take guns away from all Americans. It’s the only thing that they are pretty sure will stop Americans from defending themselves against their Communistic goals to enslave the people, and do away with 80%+ of them, and also put them in their fema prison camps. So, knowing that…the people of the United States of America need to get the Thugs out of the White House and Government, and keep and buy more guns and ammunition as a deterrent to an evil conspiracy against human’s rights to exist in peace and freedom here on this planet.

Karolyn

Oh, yeah, put up an article about gun ownership to rile the folks, while not telling them what kind of problems the city of Newark has faced for many years as a crime/drug city.

bill

Karolyn,the answer is not enlisting the general population to ‘snitch’ on their neighbors. the answer lies in better policing, armed citizenry (studies prove that an armed citizenry reduces crime),
and much tougher prison sentences for gun related crimes.

These initiatives have to be better thought out and written so as not to infringe on the liberties of law abiding citizens.

Karolyn

How about if NOBODY had guns?
Robert Smith

Won’t work and it’s obvious.

If you want to take the time to learn a little Gary Kleck is an excellent place to start.

From Wikipedia as a starting point: “Kleck has done numerous studies of the effects of guns on death and injury in crimes,[1] on suicides,[2] and gun accidents,[3] the impact of gun control laws on rates of violence,[4][5] the frequency and effectiveness of defensive gun use by crime victims,[6][7] patterns of gun ownership,[8] why people support gun control,[9] and the myth of big-time gun trafficking.[10]”

Not all the footnotes. This stuff has been researched and although argued against never refuted.

You can start at: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gary_Kleck

As a suggestion that will help create a mindset that tosses out some of the pre-concieved notions may I suggest that you start with his information about suicide and guns? After all guns are blamed for a lot of suicides. I think the facts will be interesting to you.

The bottom line of the suicide thing is we need to address mental health issues, NOT guns. But those who support guns from the extreme right don’t support the necessary mental health care so they catch themselves with nothing to do but scream about their precious guns. It’s dumb that they aren’t working in their own self interest, but that seems to be a trait of the extreme right.

Rob
Karolyn

Rob – Just think about it. If nobody had guns, wars would have to be fought with hand-to-hand combat. There would be less death and destruction. Guns are not necessary for security. It would include any type of explosive weapon. Just think of how much safer the world would be. Hunters could use bow and arrows. Cops could still have tazers. As a matter of fact, tazers could take the place of the guns people keep for protection. However, I think that men would have a hard time with this because they love their loud noises so much and the power that having a gun gives them.

On a side note regarding suicide: If I ever wanted to leave this plane, I would just take a bunch of pills to put me to sleep. Why would anybody want to shoot himself?
Robert Smith

The suggested world without guns, etc. is covered. For a complete answer I suggest you start with S.M. Stirling’s trilogy “Dies the Fire.”

It’s a fantacy series and you can get some of the basics at: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dies_the_Fire

I particularly identify with the Bearkillers.

Rob
David in MA

If “nobody” had guns then only the government (and criminals)would have guns…
THIS IS what the 2nd Amendment to the Constitution is all about!
The ability of the people to resist an oppressive government.
And if you have not noticed lately the obozo administration is becoming more oppressive every day.

Arise Patriots, resist tyrany.

Pray for the Oath Keepers.
Hope for the Lone Wolf.
Karolyn

David – When I say NOBODY, I mean NOBODY! Think about it. What if explosives had never been discovered?
Robert Smith

From Karolyn who asks: “What if explosives had never been discovered?”

Look at history before guns. It’s not as if there wasn’t violence, war, criminals, and general mahem before guns.

The issue isn’t guns. It’s PEOPLE. Some people are evil. It’s that simple.

The Inquisitors didn’t shoot anyone. They tortured them. And I can guarantee you the stakes that people were burned at weren’t “registered.”

Rob
libertytrain

Karolyn, it is thought the Chinese first used (and had invented) explosives in about 1141. If they hadn’t someone else would have within the last 875 years or so.
Gil

The 2nd Amendment was about maintaining the militia forcse that were helpful during the Revolution. Hence the Constitution gives the Governemnt the power to call up militia forces suppress rebellions and insurrection. That is to say, the militia is supposed to be there to help government out in it times of need. People who gang up on the government will be classed as traitors and treated as such. The American Revolutionaries were traitors to the Crown and were treated as such too. Had George Washington lost he would have been hung, drawn and quartered.
Cliffystones

Even the late John Lennon said “Imagine”. The guns are just inanimate objects. Outlawing or eliminating them will no change what’s in the hearts and minds of people bent on doing harm to others.

Newark has tried it Mayor Booker’s way for quite some time. And you freely admit that it hasn’t helped in Newark. So how about we try this? Following the letter of the constitution for a one year trial period in Newark. If things do get worse, us Libertarians will freely acknowledge this and the city can return to it’s old statutes. But I will bet you right here and now there will be a lot less crime, and a lot fewer hardened criminals among the living in Newark.
lyle de vore

you are a moran ligeally owned guns is what keeps our copuntry safe i will never give up my guns too anyone this country is headed into socialism because of people like you, ill bet you even voted for obama who is destroying this country wake up. put your left hand on your right ear and your right hand on your left ear give a big pull and pull your head out of your ass
michael

Will you volunteer to disarm the gang bangers, the terrorists, the psychotic criminals ? I mean just go door to door, unarmed of course and politely inform them that they must turn over their firearms to you. You of course will give them a coupon for a new pair of Nike Tennis shoes in ex change for their firearms… I’m sure that if you tell them that you are a liberal obamma suporter that they will see
your point of view… oh, while you are at it, pick up their pointy knives and clubs as well, as they have done in England

You do have a sign in your front yard stating that you are a liberal non gun owning victim who will give up all valuables when a criminal
shows up at her door, and to allow herself to be abused as well ???
mike1127

How about if Santa Claus and unicorns were real? We’re talking about FACTS, not fantasy.
Robert Smith

Hey Mike, Unicorns are REAL.

You can see it at Ringling Brothers Circus: http://www.ringling.com/FlashSubContent.aspx?id=11718&parentID=366&assetFolderID=372

Oberon Zell bred it in the early ’80s.

Rob
Erik

What if Santa, Batman, and the Easter Bunny were real?
Let’s see if we can find something bright and shiny for you to play with.
You’re very precious.
JC

Karolyn says:
January 13, 2012 at 7:33 am
How about if NOBODY had guns?
_______________________________________________________

Does “Nobody” include the Government and the Police?
What planet are you on?

zed

Karolyn,
Knuckledraggers will always be knuckledraggers. They cannot be trusted; Booker is the chief knuckledragger of Newark and Obama the chief knuckledragger of all democrat scum. Their ultimate goal is to remove all firearms from white people so they can enslave us, this latest scheme of bookers will just be the start. Give the scum money so they turn on their own then expand it. It is the foot in the door approach. The revolution is brewing and the insurrection is coming. Newark is a violent city because it is full of democrat knuckledraggers; they are subhuman one and all.

2centsworth

Newark is a city where the “game” is drugs, cops, courts, and money and it goes on in a never ending cycle. It’s really ridiculous the way “poor” people are always on drugs. If you’re so poor…how can you afford drugs? Why is that your priority? Do you starve your kids to get drugs? This is a bad cycle, and until people elevate their knowledge and open their eyes to what is REALLY going on, they will not be able to ascend up to a higher plane of existance. You Karolyn CAN get out of the mess you are in, and Zed is right in what he is saying. Please don’t take anything personally, just if the shoe fits, put it on if you want.
Karolyn

I’m not in a mess. If drugs were legalized, there wouldn’t be so much crime in the first place because the crimes have to be committed to get the money for the illegal drugs.

The ONLY way the cycle can be changed is to start with GOOD teachers teaching the kids at an early age how to live. I heard a guy on he radio this morning expounding on how worthless the SATs are in judging if a child will be successful in college. He made a very good point that thought processes and attitude, etc. are more important that learning things by wrote and filling in little circles on a test. More schools with teachers who take an interest in their students would go a long way to making big changes in our society.
Harvey

Using your theory we could make robbing a bank be a legal act. Just do away with all laws and there will not be any crimes. I do agree with your comments about schools. Another place that. Reds addressing is the home life or lack of one. The slave owners fed,clothed, provide medical care and provided a place to live ( slavery was wr
Karolyn

Harvey – I didn’t say anything about doing away with all laws – just legalizing drugs so they can be taxed and regulated. Using all the money saved by getting rid of the DEA would provide more money for education and rehabilitation.
Harvey

Using your theory we could make robbing a bank be a legal act. Just do away with all laws and there will not be any crimes. I do agree with your comments about schools. Another place that needs addressing is the home life or lack of one. The slave owners fed,clothed, provide medical care and provided a place to live ( slavery was was totally wrong ). The only difference in slavery and todays slaves to the democratic party is that the slaves do not have to work!
Check history and you will find that Hitler used this snitching as a prelude to his taking over the country. The parents need to police their offspring and stop them from breaking the law before the fact. The only problem with this is that the parents ( not all ) are bad role models. These parents already have a criminal record.
When someone reports ” I saw Joe with a gun ” what happens. If the gun holder is legal or not the police will detail ( arrest ) the person. Guilty until proven innocent. I know it would help to some extent, but giving up a freedom for a false Sense of security never has worked and never will.
Karolyn

Harvey – People are slaves to the Democrat AND Republican parties. Why cite just one?
JC

Karolyn says:
January 13, 2012 at 8:34 am
I’m not in a mess. If drugs were legalized, there wouldn’t be so much crime in the first place because the crimes have to be committed to get the money for the illegal drugs.
________________________________________________________________

That is correct. people are sovereign over themselves, and that includes the right to be stupid.

Harvey, have you forgotten or did you ever know how badly the prohibition on alcohol failed? Did you know that when it was legalized the murder rate in the US fell by half almost overnight?

Drug Laws are merely another level of Government control and that is all they are meant to be.
mike1127

Really? All poor people are on drugs? That’s news to me. The vast majority of drug-users are middle-class citizens. The vast majority of those jailed are poor people. They are jailed because they can’t afford a lawyer. Court-appointed defense lawyers are a joke. You get what you pay for. I’m just a bit disgusted by the fact that you think all poor people are on drugs. There’s also the fact that some drugs are cheaper than a pack of cigarettes to buy.
Karolyn

OMG! Racism not welcome here!
Harvey

Karolyn you need to read my comments again. In order to be racist I would have mention a race of people or used a demeaning name. Neither of these were used. Just for the record, people of all races have been slaves throughout history. This is true today. Take your blinders off and see the truth and try not to accuse falsely accuse someone of being racist.
Karolyn

Harvey – It wasn’t you it was Zed. Please read his post.

My2cents

Will he pay if Obama gets reported for each weapon that is in the hands of the military? If so someone is going to get very rich very quickly.

I have never seen a military weapon licensed, including my own when I was there. They were just issued to you according to the serial number.

Robert Smith

Hey 2 cents how the heck are you? You posted: “I have never seen a military weapon licensed, including my own when I was there.”

Our military guys and gals don’t carry passports either. Their military ID is sufficient.

I get the impression you really don’t understand how things work.

Rob

libertytrain

Rob per your: “Our military guys and gals don’t carry passports either. Their military ID is sufficient. I get the impression you really don’t understand how things work.”
I think perhaps you may want to revisit your statement and do some quick checking. That’s been gone at least 4-5 years now. Military ID is not sufficient.
Robert Smith

Posted: “Military ID is not sufficient.”

Oh? How are things different? Do they issue passports to our military now? How is liberty in forign ports accomplished?

Rob
libertytrain

Yes, they issue passports to our military now. Have for the last 4 or 5 years. And they need the regular passport that the rest of us use to travel aside from the military travels. Doesn’t take much to look that up, but I’m helping you here.

Erik

The Second Amendment isn’t up for debate. The words “shall not be infringed” covers all and any future questions.
This mayor is a perfect example what is wrong with this once great nation. When criminals have little recourse to divert from their evil ways and we elect criminals the result is always more crime. Laws andpolicess of this nature only hurt the law abiding citizens that are encumbered by them. This is a joke and I hope this lunatic gets thrown out of office. As we all know the only reason politicians hate guns is because they bring equalization and are the only thing that gives any other rights we have “teeth”.

Gil

Had the 1st Amendment read “intelligent, respectful political speech and press being important to freedom, the right of people to speak and print shall not infringed” then Larry Flint and co,. would no legal leg to stand for their right to publish obscenities. If the Framers simply wanted people to own guns without restrictions then they wouldn’t have mentioned well-regulated militias . . .”

Buster the Anatolian

” If the Framers simply wanted people to own guns without restrictions then they wouldn’t have mentioned well-regulated militias . . .”

Gil……….first lets look at militias. When the consttution was written the militia was (and still is) all men between 16 and 45 years of age. With the anti-discrimination and equality amendments to the Constitution it would now incluse women and have no upper age limit.

Well regulated in the context of the second amendment means well equiped and trained NOT controlled or registered.
Gil

Switzerland operates a militia force and makes a clear distinction between militia weapons and private weapons. The Framers would have had the same notion. They were trying to protect the ability for militia to be formed and summoned.
Buster the Anatolian

We are not talking about Switzerland but rather the US. As stated above the militia is the citizens of the US not some special group of citizens but ALL the citizens. Historicaly the militia in the US was/is expected to furnish their own arms so they must own and posess the firearms to bring if called to serve.

Joe in CT

And how is anyone supposed to know if a gun holder is a legal or illegal gun owner? Yes, Communism and National Socialism both started that way – snitching on your neighbors. What’s next? Snitching on people who criticize the President? Having children snitch on their parents? As Thomas Jefferson said, we will get the government we deserve.

Vagabond

you are so right Joe. and it seems we have far too many IDIOTS who love obama’s type of governing. folks you better keep your powder dry and ready,
Karolyn

When you live in poverty in a city like Newark, more than likely the fun owner next door is not legal.

Karolyn

And. yeah. I’m sure he has “fun” with his “gun.” Sorry for the typo. fingers too fast!
mike1127

You MUST be a psychic.

Gil

“Snitches deserve stitches.”

http://deleted Claire

Illegal gun owners should be caught. If they are illegal, their intent is not favorable. It is a neverending saga, the criminals always get guns and there are some people out there willing to make a buck regardless of how they do so. Seems like politicians will always have a problem with gun ownership/rights. They say one thing and do another, just to get elected.

Vagabond

define illegal Claire. have you read the constitution? I have and I see no where in the 2nd ammendment where it says providing they shall have permission from ANYONE. quite the contray. it reads. a well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED,

http://deleted Claire

Read my post again. My point has nothing to do with the Constitution–I posted my THOUGHTS. To me, illegal use pertains to the criminals that harbor evil against Americans and America. Am I to assume you don’t care if criminals have guns?
http://deleted Claire

BTW–I am well aware of what the Constitution says concerning the Second Amendment. My husband and I are legal gun owners and abide by the law. In return, nothing or no one will take our guns without a struggle.
TC

So, you are saying you don’t mind if, say, half a dozen of your neighbors turn you in to try and profit, paid for by the taxpayers of Newark…
and you don’t mind the investigations that follow these neighbor’s turning turning you in…
Bottom line here: If you allow the politicians to infringe upon your rights, they will always try and take it to the next level.
Karolyn

TC – This is about ILLEGAL gun owners! Duh! Read my post above. Most gun owners in Newark are criminals!
wararrow

Well said Clair,I to am a legal gun owner and feel the same way !!
independent thinker

Karolyn as someone said above (Buster I think) the word illegal is used one time and that is over half way into the video. The word guns without the qualifier “illegal” is used many times. Therefore it is logical to conclude the mayor wants ALL guns reported.
JC

Karolyn says:

January 13, 2012 at 7:08 am

TC – This is about ILLEGAL gun owners! Duh! Read my post above. Most gun owners in Newark are criminals!
__________________________________________________________
Define “illegal gun owner”. Does that mean “criminal”
So you go after the criminals, not guns.
If you do want to target guns…why not steak knives? or sharp pencils? How about reporting your neighbor for having a pointy stick?
I mean come on…ANYONE might be a criminal if they want to harm someone right?
Why don’t we just start imprisoning people who “might” commit a crime?

The whole thing is ridiculous and completely fascist in nature.
Cliffystones

Claire,

That’s the problem, the chuckle-heads who “define illegal”. The same people who will have an 8 year old arrested because he found a spent plastic shot shell on the side of the road on the way to school and brought it in.
michael

The idiot mayor, doesn’t want to remove guns carried by criminals, he wants to make any one with a gun a criminal. you are most certainly a certified moron, and you should report to newarks office of lobotomy to get yours repaired as it is leaking badly.
JC

That’s an accurate observation.

Karolyn

Claire – You are right. It’s a shame that people see anything about guns and they jump right on the bandwagon, not even knwing all the circumstances. Gun ownership in Newark, NJ is in the hands of the criminals, which comprise a large part of the population. What the point is here is for neighbors in the projects and ghettos to turn in those people who make their neighborhoods unliveable.

bill

yes, that is the point of the law. But there is a second law in operation here: the law of unintended consequences.
While criminals should have their guns taken away, the chance of lawful gunowners being subjected to unfair law enforcement intimidation and illegal gun confiscation out weighs the ‘good intentions’ of the initiative. The criminals will always have guns, take one away and they can get another the same day. So this kind of initiative is half baked. You don’t throw away liberties for security; if you do you don’t deserve either.
Karolyn

Wouldn’t law enforcement in any city have a list of lawful gun owners to reference?
CHP

No, they have a list of people who are forbidden to own guns; everyone else is a potential lawful owner.
Scott in SC

Not so, CHP,
In NJ Anyone who wants to purchase a firearm must obtain a permit. If you want to purchase a handgun an additional permit must be obtained for evry purchase. All transfers must likewise be registered.
Criminals are not going to follow these procedures for obvious reasons, so the only list of gun owners in NJ are the law abiding citizens. And anyone who has sudied gun control knows the first step of confiscation is registration, always.
Cliffystones

Karolyn,

No, No, NO!! It’s none of the governments damn business who does or does not have guns. This “Hollywood Myth” that guns need to be “registered” is just that. A big lie perpetrated by the liberals and their “guns are evil” mindset that has infected a lot of the populace.

This mindset even affect many folks who own and/or like guns. I watch “Storage Wars” from time to time. One buyer thinks that you have to report any firearms found in a storage locker to the ATF. Another one (a New Yorker) thinks you have to turn over any firearm with a serial number to the ATF! And then the one buyer who found an ammo can with some .223 caliber hollow points in it and exclaimed “scary stuff”. Talk about indoctrination!
wararrow

At this time that kind of list is ilegal.
JC

Karolyn says:

January 13, 2012 at 7:30 am

Wouldn’t law enforcement in any city have a list of lawful gun owners to reference?
____________________________________________________________

OMG…can you imagine? Hitler’s dream come true, right here in America. That way, “law enforcement” can disarm Americans…ALL Americans.
Rick

Claire here’s a better idea Control the criminals lae enforcement do have a list of them. The whole idea of this is a waste of time and money. If you take the criminals off the street then they can’t posess guns in prison. And if they are really violent and dangerous do society a favor and put them down like a vicious animal.
Vic Bailey

Rick, I agree with you, BUT the federal judges don’t agree with either one of us, they don’t make any money off of LAW ABIDING citizens, they make their money off of CRIMINALS, so WHO do they protect? The CRIMINALS!! Same way with the Cops, they CAN’T protect us, BUT they DON’T want to protect ourselves, it would cut into their saliries! Like the Judges! There is NOT a neighborhood in America anymore that knows the name of ANY of the cops that patrol their neighborhoods, yet they want our help, when ALL the cops are OUTSIDERS, and the cop bosses want it that way! It makes the cops NOT CARE about helping strangers, THINK ABOUT IT! We didn’t have half of the crime when the cops knew EVERYBODY, now that they don’t, they DON’T CARE! They have a gun and a badge and they are the protectors of their friends and it is NOT US! Semper Fi.
wararrow

VIC you said it right on the mark,when I was a younster we knew policemen in our area of town and they got to the bottom of the problem.
Awakened Avenger

“They” don’t ‘us’ possessing weapons because both parties would have equal powers of destruction. That’s called parity and governments, throughout history have retained a monopoly on such destructive powers; that is but one of the definitions of government; the monopoly of or retention of destructive power.
http://deleted Claire

Rick–I agree with you–only I would probably send all criminals to prison for life. It is a good thing that I am not a judge, the criminals would receive no mercy from me. The judicial system nowadays is far too lenient with the wrongdoers. Prisons are overcrowded now from what I hear, perhaps this is why so many criminals go free.
Cliffystones

So you freely admit that laws do not prevent criminals from having guns in Newark? So why not uphold he Constitution and stop infringing upon the rights of those of us who are willing to take the responsibility to arm ourselves legally?

I am a legal, law abiding citizen of the United States,and have been so for 53 years. The US Constitution clearly and simply states that my right to bear arme “SHALL NOT be infringed”. I don’t give a flying squirrel about the criminals, I’m responsible for myself and my own actions. What gives you, the mayor of Newark, Rosie O’Donnell or anybody else the right to micro-manage MY right that was endowed to me by MY creator?
Robert Smith

So Cliffy, you say: “anybody else the right to micro-manage MY right that was endowed to me by MY creator?”

You were created by the PEOPLE?

You know, that “WE THE PEOPLE” thing in the Constitution…

There is NO mention of your god if that’s what you mean.

Rob
Cliffystones

“We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. That to secure these rights, governments are instituted among men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed. That whenever any form of government becomes destructive to these ends, it is the right of the people to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their safety and happiness.”

and………

“Amendment 2 – Right to Bear Arms. Ratified 12/15/1791. Note

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.”

Uh……… you were saying? And BTW, that “We The People” includes those of us who wish to exercise our second amendment rights.

I’d prefer not to have a battle of wits with an unarmed person. Post your lame arguments on “moveon.org”
JC

Get stuffed Smith.
Laws weren’t made to “grant” us the right to self defense.
Laws were written to recognize what was already inherently ours, and NO law can justifiably take away.
So cram your Liberal Gobbledy Gook where the sun…
Robert Smith

Cliffy says: ““We hold these truths to be self-evident…”

Our laws are NOT based in the Declaration of Independance but in out Constution. The Constitution is the rule and guide for American Law, NOT your god.

To imply that we get our rights from anything but “WE THE PEOPLE” is a lie. What does your god say about lying?

Rob
JC

Robert Smith says:
January 14, 2012 at 4:41 pm

To imply that we get our rights from anything but “WE THE PEOPLE” is a lie. What does your god say about lying?
______________________________________________________________

I see you’ve completely avoided the FACT that the right to self defense is a FACT of Nature or Nature’s God. It does not come from “We The people” or any people anywhere for that matter. It’s simply a FACT.

You’re just another twisted Liberal trying to twist this to a Twisted Liberals twisted way of thinking….did I mention that you’re twisted?
And so is the Mayor of Newark.
Cliffystones

JC,

Smitty doesn’t get it. He’ll never get it. He reminds me of Daniel Stern in the movie “City Slickers” when Billy Crystal was trying to explain to him how you could videotape one program while watching another. The cows they were driving figured it out , but Daniel never did.

For some strange and sad reason, the logic circuits in many of these Liberals are cross-wired. They simply cannot fathom the concept of individual liberty and responsibility. This wouldn’t be a problem if they would simply quit trying to impose their nanny state on those of us who do.

I’s also obvious from his derogatory remarks that Smitty has a problem with the belief in a supreme being.
JC

That’s a good start Cliffystones.
I’m sure “volumes” can be written on why Liberals are incapable of seperating the reality of human existence from their utopian ideals that simply don’t work.

R Crain

Most people are illegal when it comes to gun ownership. I know people that have never been arrested, never ticketed for anything, but they cannot get a permit to purchase a gun legally. They are not one of the good ol boys, or they do not hold positions of power.They are not large cash contributors either.They are just every day workers and tax payers. They have to purchase a gun through other channels, which makes them illegal.A friend of mine married a hard core Liberal woman, and she refused to have a gun in her house.He , like a fool, was selling them to anyone to make her happy. Some he gave to relatives to get them gone.Under our current laws of the land, just about anyone can be illegal, even when you are legal. It depends on who you pissed off, who is prosecuting you. That is why I live in the woods, and avoid the city at all cost.Where I live, I don`t need a gun. All my neighbors are 4 legged. The most they want is to be left alone, the same as me.

Karolyn

Anybody who wants to own a gun can just move to the south!
mike1127

Just move to the South? What an amazing display of one person stereotyping a whole group of people. I’ll bet you are one of the first in line about racial discrimination, yet you publicly print a statement like that. Are you implying that those of us that live in the South are mouth-breathing knuckle-draggers that will shoot you at the drop of a hat?

I’m all for more people down here owning guns. Here’s a fun little fact for you. Kennesaw, a small town in Georgia, mandated that all homeowners were required to own at least one firearm. Oddly enough, after that law was enacted, break-ins and muggings dropped to practically zero percent. I wonder why? Maybe because the criminal knew he wasn’t attacking a helpless victim?

I’m willing to bet that you truly believe the police are here to serve and protect you. That is not true. Try calling the cops and tell them that you are afraid someone outside your house may have a gun and looks as if he is casing your house. They will tell you that they can do NOTHING until a crime has been committed. When seconds count, the police are only minutes away. Cops are for revenge, not protection.

In a perfect world, we would not have to worry about getting attacked/robbed/raped or whatever. Since this is not a perfect world, only a fool does not take steps to protect him/herself. Remember, the police do not want to protect you, they may get hurt in the process; they only want to bring your assailant to “justice”.

Remember that case in New York last year where the cops listened to a woman being murdered on the other side of her door? They were in her hallway listening to her beg for help. They couldn’t enter because one of their officers might have gotten hurt (official police policy). They literally stood there and listen to this woman get killed by her own son (with a knife, by the way), while bystanders (including the apartment owner and her other son) were begging them to go in and stop him.

I live in Tennessee, and I guarantee you that anybody that brings a knife to someone’s house to do some violence will not leave that house alive. You may ridicule the South all you want, this is a free country. I was born down South, but grew up in Ohio. There is a big difference between the two: Southerners don’t go crying for their babysitter (police) when someone enters their house with ill intentions. We call the ambulance after the problem has been disposed of. I sleep very well at night knowing if someone breaks into my house, my wife and children will be well-protected. The cops are useless for anything other than motor-vehicle violations and busting small-time drug users.

From your posts, you seem to fear living in your city. Why don’t you move somewhere else if you are so scared?

And calling someone a subhuman democratic knuckle-dragger is NOT racist. It is hatred for a political party, not any specific race. You just love pointing that finger of yours, don’t you?
Karolyn

I just said move to the south because everybody here has guns and it’s no big deal. Why did you have to freak out?
Karolyn

BTW – I live in a tiny town in SC. You sure as hell read an awful lot into what I wrote.
libertytrain

Karolyn, I think that’s what you don’t realize – your posts always come across as some sort of heckling about the South. You aren’t Southern and you can live anywhere but embrace it or leave it. You’ve been here long enough to either accept the differences from Jersey or go home.
Karolyn

liberty – I have no problem with people owning guns here. I wouldn’t, but I’ve gotten used to it. We had a rape/murder recently, and many women are taking classes with the Sheriff’s office and getting guns. Hey – good for them. The trouble with “talking” online is that meanings get misconstrued. I was not talking badly about the south.
independent thinker

Karolyn as Liberty said anytime you mention the south in one of your posts it comes accross as a putdown of the south. Since it always comes across that way it is logical to conclude you feel that way.
http://deleted Claire

To add some lightheartedness– I am probably considered a “Yank’ but I love the South. I love everything about the South. And right now I wish I lived there–it is colder than heck here.
libertytrain

Karolyn, I understand what you are saying. Just reread what you write first and think about the “multiple” meanings of what you are writing as if your didn’t write it. That’s an art in itself. “Words are the source of much misunderstanding” – Antoine de St. Exupery
libertytrain

Claire – I’m a “recovered” Yank myself as you know. And it’s very cold here – last night, today and tonight. It should warm up some here as the days go on.
http://google gary gerke

Your friend is pussified!!!!
All he had to do is hide one in his garage!!!!!!!!

sandcasstle

Maybe we need a more refined definition of “illegal”. We have a nation full of “illegal” people that are sucking our country dry in so many ways, yet you are upset about someone owning a so-called “illegal” gun. “If they are illegal, their intent is not favorable.” Does this only apply to guns? Why does the government get to pick and choose what is “illegal” and what is not, hmmmm?? Like someone already stated, nowhere does it state that in order to bear arms that we have to be licensed, registered, or in anyway given governmental permission. It always mystifies me how so many choose where and when rules/laws apply and when they don’t.

Gil

Well actually: “A welll regulated militia . . .”
JimH

Gil, The 2nd amendment was writen in the late 18th century. Use the 18th century definition of militia instead of the 20th& 21rst century definition and it will become clear what it really means.
Buster the Anatolian

Gil also needs to look up “well regulated” as it applies to the second amendment. It means well equiped and trained NOT controlled.
Gil

Sure! Just like dickering over the term “general welfare”.
JimH

Gil, Remember what year the term general welfare was written and there should be no dickering. It isn’t dificult if you understand that.
Late 18th century.
Gil

Using the 18th century definition of a militia was free men between the ages of 18 and 45 who turned up for training every now and then and could be called up for action when needed.
independent thinker

Exactly Gil. When called they were expected to show up with their PERSONALY OWNED military grade firearm and ammunition for the firearm. Since then we have passed equal rights/non-discrimanation amendments and laws so now women and those over 45 able to serve would be included. Generaly the local sheriff or other local official was supposed to call the citizens for their occasional training so any lack of training now can be laid at those peoples feet.
Gil

The Founders didn’t want society to be equal so the 2nd Amendment should interpreted that way, right?

mike1127

A lot of people have unregistered weapons simply because it is nobody’s business if they have one. Just because they have an unregistered weapon does not mean they are criminals.

http://msn WG

Heil Hitler Jack!
Jack

Sounds like a good policy to me.

Vagabond

why am I not surprised that it would sound good to you jacka55??
Mustang

Off Jack
Pat

Jack, you have proven yourself to be a Nazi. I hope your neighbors treat you accordingly! A firing squad would work.

s c

People of Newark, New Jersey. You have filth in your community. You have a poser mayor who needs to be tarred and feathered. Decide NOW if you decide if you live in a free country, or if you live in Obummer’s 1984.
Use your imagination and isolate that useful idiot mayor. Ship the poser to Mexico. It’s YOUR freedom, people. No criminal politician can take it away from you if you love being free. Freedom is lost only once. Decide.

Karolyn

You obviously know nothing about Newark! It is a dangerous city that has struggled forever to make its streets safe. When I was a kid, we went to Newark for school shopping. That stopped in the 70s due to stores closing and rising crime. Most of the people who own guns in Newark are thugs.

2centsworth

Guess what Karoly: When guns are confiscated from law abiding citizens trying to protect themselves from thugs, only thugs will have guns, which makes Newark even that much more dangerous. And all you sell out supposed to be Americans…..looks like you would sell your soul to the devil to have a morsel of bread. You ought to work on your integrity and try to improve your spirit. Just say NO to people like this so called Mayor who ought to be yanked off the stage with a bent pole. Run his a$$ out of town!
Vic Bailey

Sounds like Bama and his Elitist Handlers are winning, when you take the guns away from the citizens they become subjects and easy prey for the crooks, local and FEDERAL! Wake up people Hitler did the same thing, took the guns so the citizens couldn’t protect themselves, just like every other Socialist including England, Austraila, Canada and America is next, they want to destroy the LAST TRUE FREE COUNTRY! Semper Fi.
eddie47d

The NRA and GOA isn’t doing much to keep illegal guns off the street so apparently city mayors have to step in. Didn’t you catch the second sentence and if you did why do you spend so much of your anger supporting folks who possess Illegal guns. That means you support the criminal and criminal behavior. So many of you smack down the legal and honest gun owner when you support illegal gun sales and those who possess illegal guns.
wararrow

It is not the job of the NRA or GOA to get criminal gun posession off the sreets,again it is the police force who has that job,legal gun owners do not commite these crimes it is bad guys that do these things.The second amenment is a law ,and I am tired of government officials at all levels trying to subvert the meaning to disarm America,again WE ARE THE LAST FREE LAND IN THE WORLD and it must be maintained by freedom at any cost,by blood if we must,because if our Government goes completely in the direction Ocommie has us pointed then you will be sorry you didnt have a gun.
Buster the Anatolian

eddie how nieve can you be. The mayor isn’t after illegal guns he is after all guns. He mentioned illegal guns one time over half way thru the video the rest of the time he just said guns. Are you so brainwashed that you think a person who is reported for having a gun will have that gun returned immediately if it is proven to be legaly owned? It will take days if not weeks to return the gun if it is ever returned.

You obviously only want to know what the brady bunch and bloomberg tell you about the NRA. They are all for removing illegal guns from the criminals hands they just oppose doing it at the expense of the rights of persons who can legaly own firearms.
SweetOlBob

Eddie: Get in gear and review the stats published by the FBI. You will see, if you’re willing to do something besides spout untruths, that as private gun ownership and particularly concealed carry is passed into law, that violent crime starts dropping. This has happened IN EVERY CASE, IN EVERY LOCATION, AND IN EVERY STATE.
You are being used by the anti-gun, anti-freedom factions who only distort facts and lie about the effectiveness of law abiding citizens being able to protect themselves. Thugs are not so ready to invade a home or mugg a person if the fact that they may be shot or killed is present. The Mayor is just looking for something to cover his a$$ because he can’t do his job and stop crime.
steve

1st it will be ok everybody let’s just register all of the these guns…then the government will know exactly who has them and where they are located…then guess what…something bad happens like a Congress woman gets shot in the head by a gun…OMG now we have to confiscate all of these evil guns….de ja vu Nazi Germany 1937…wake up you idiots…once they take our guns we are done…game over…If I live in Newark I would buy a gun and go to the range and become an excellent shot…If everybody packed in Newark what would the thugs do?
Landon

Hi Eddie47,
Newark is without a doubt a violent and dangerous city. I subscribe to the philosophy of one of the greatest shooting instructors that ever lived, Lt. Col. Jeff Cooper (Gunsite.com), who remarked: “The solution to violent crime in our streets is a dead perpetrator at the scene of every crime.” Newark would be a far healthier place to live, if each evening over the next year or so, a dozen thugs and car-jackers met up with well armed Citizens, and were promptly dispatched to their eternal reward. I suspect the level of civility amongst strangers would rise in tandem with the body count.
If you know a cop, ask them why THEY carry guns; it’s not to protect YOU from the miscreants, but to protect themselves. Have a great weekend.
Eddie

You just can’t help Eddie47d. You just can’t fix STUPID.
eddie47d

You proved my point Wararrow and that mayor who has that authority is doing just that.
eddie47d

In other words Buster do nothing and let the problem fester.
eddie47d

I could just as easily say that SweetOlBob is a blind tool of the NRA.
eddie47d

What part of illegal guns don’t you comprehend Steve. Your legal weapon is still legal and your rights will be upheld.
eddie47d

Well Landon I don’t trust the police all the time and a few are as despicable as the perps.Nothing wrong with being armed to protect your home and family and the police should not be counted on to protect you from harm.
Dennis48e

“The NRA and GOA isn’t doing much to keep illegal guns off the street…….”

Prove it eddie. You cannot because you have no facts to back your claim up. You never have facts to back up your anti-gun claims just your opinion.
Buster the Anatolian

“In other words Buster do nothing and let the problem fester.”

No eddie enforce the existing laws that say a felon in posession of a firearm must spend 5 years in the federal pen with no paroll. Enforce existing laws that say the use of a firearm in the commission of a crime will result in additional time over and above the time for the crime itself. Those are just two examples of things that can be done without harassing honest legal gun owners.
eddie47d

What you said makes for a pleasant soundbite Buster but the reality is that those laws are enforced if you care to look at criminal records and sentencing.The thing is why were they allowed to possess those weapons in the first place.It’s all too easy to break the law and buy weapons under the table. Additional sentencing after the fact doesn’t do much for the victim of the crime. Not enough is done to stop these actions(crime and gun buying)before they happen which does seem to be approved by pro gun groups like the NRA.
JC

Newark Mayor: Turn In Gun Owners For $1,000.

Should read “Another Liberal Moron Sells Out To Nazism”
JC

eddie47d says:

January 13, 2012 at 1:35 pm

What part of illegal guns don’t you comprehend Steve. Your legal weapon is still legal and your rights will be upheld.
_______________________________________________________________

What part of “There’s no such thing as an illegal gun” don’t you get eddie47? Just illegal or criminal acts and intentions. And someone above very astutely pointed out the solution…a dead perpetrator at the scene of every crime.
Buster the Anatolian

No eddie you are the one who uses sound bites. You say do something but you never offer any solutions. I offered a solution to at least part of the problem. There are very few federal prosecutions for felons in posession of a firearm and the added time for use of a firearm in comission of a crime is frequently plea bargined away
watchdog

eddie47d, I hate to burst your left wing radical bubble, but the mayor does NOT have the right to take away guns from citizens. He is NOT a LEO, he has NO authority over the citizens of his city to take away ANY of their Constitutionally Guaranteed rights. You also are either misinformed, or a complete moron if you believe the enhanced penalties are being enforced on criminals for carrying a gun. Turn off msnbc, cnn and stop reading moron.org. Try going to the FBI websites (that is if you can find it). The REAL data is there. not sound bites from crooked politicians, like this mayor.
vicki

JC writes:
“What part of “There’s no such thing as an illegal gun” don’t you get eddie47? Just illegal or criminal acts and intentions.”

Well. Actually there are just illegal or criminal acts. If intentions were criminalized we would have the thought police. Oh wait.

The point is that only actions can be criminal. A gun is an inanimate object and is unable to act thus there can not be a criminal act committed by a gun. Only Sentient beings can do that.

Do not buy into the liberal talking points about guns being illegal. Can’t happen.

Let’s now address the act of possessing the best tool for self defense (a gun). In a truly free society it would not be possible for it to be illegal to posses a gun. Even if you were an ex-con. The only affect of the “law” is to keep the person serving a life sentence for his/her crime(s). If he/she really is a danger to others there is no reason to believe that he/she will care about what tool is used. A car does just fine for mass murder too. You don’t see someone loosing the right to own THAT property just because of a felony conviction even when the conviction is for using a car to commit the felony.
http://aol jeff

($1000 to anyone who calls our anonymous tip-line. Give us the information about who is carrying a gun, we don’t even have to have a conviction. If we arrest that individual and simply get that gun off the streets.” Booker said in a commercial announcing the program.)
Don’t know if you read this part, but that means even if you legally own your gun that someone can call and have you arrested. better hope you haven’t pissed anyone off, or your neighbor hasn’t resently lost their job and know you own guns cause $1000.00 sounds good. Then you have to try and prove your self in a court of law, get a lawyer, loss time at work, or your job because you got arrested. If you believe that the government will protect you then look to Venezuela because they do a great job protecting there public. I mean Odumba and his czars think that country is a great role model. And remember that the police don’t want to deal with a crime in progress. they show up after only to report what happened and clean up the mess, not prevent them.
JC

Vicki…”Criminal Intentions”…sorry I didn’t spell it out more clearly.
I thought it was obvious.
Vicki

JC says:
”Criminal Intentions”…sorry I didn’t spell it out more clearly.
I thought it was obvious.”

It was clear. I did understand it. Intentions of any kind can not be criminalized. Only acts. Intention is used to modify an act but just the intent to do something can not be criminalized.

For instance a rapist may intend to rape but until he actually commits the act there is no crime.

Besides how would you even know that he intended to commit a crime unless he did something, thus an “act”.
Daylo

Exactly. That is why good citizens must be armed. For self-protection. This is against the constitution!

It sounds like Nazi Germany when Hitler wanted to take control.

Read your constituion for further instruction!
Kinetic1

Daylo,
Wait just a minute. This offer is not made to people for turning in neighbors with legally registered guns. This offer does not apply to gun owners with a permit to carry. This program is clearly aimed at arresting and confiscation guns from those who have obtained them illegally or are carrying without a permit. How does that violate your Constitutional right to own a gun?
Boothe

Kinetic, what is it that people like you fail to understand about “shall not be infringed”? Registration of arms is prohibited by the Supreme Law of the Land. Registration, nosey-busy-body-laws, prohibition and confiscation help the real criminals ply their trade. If you managed to take away all the privately held firearms in this nation, the next truck coming north across the border would be half full of dope and half full of guns because they would be so valuable. What Heinlein said is true: “An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life.” The only thing criminals respect is superior force. When seconds count the cops will be there in minutes. Consequently, a responsible American is armed and “well regulated” (i.e. well trained and equipped, in 18th century terms) not only for his own defense but for the benefit of society as a whole. Wake up to the truth.
wararrow

This will only lead to legal gun owners when all is said and done.
Buster the Anatolian

Kinetic the mayor used the word illegal ONE time over half way thru the video but mentioned guns several times. Based on this it is logical to conclude he wants ALL gun owners turned in. Even if their guns are eventualy returned to them the harassment factor is a big part of what he is after and I would guess that many of those legal guns will be either confiscated or “lost” and never returned to their legal owners.
TML

I think what is revealing about the Major’s proposal is that he makes no attempt to ensure law abiding gun owners of their rights while monetarily enticing every individual to point the finger at anyone who has a gun.

He even said it didn’t matter if the people were arrested or not, if they get the gun off the ‘streets’, you will get $1000.

Expressing that he isn’t concerned with whether or not the person is arrested, while also failing to ensure law abiding gun owners of their rights, leads to the idea that the law abiding citizens could be targeted as well.

Then again… this is a Mayor, not a President, voted into office by those that live there. If they continue to elect him, then it’s their problem.
mike1127

You can spot the difference between a “legal” carrier and an “illegal” one just by looking? That is an amazing talent!
Pat

how do you think their neighbors know what guns are legal or not. This is just a storm trooping Nazi operation.
JC

Kinetic1 says:

January 13, 2012 at 9:13 am

Daylo,
Wait just a minute. This offer is not made to people for turning in neighbors with legally registered guns.
_____________________________________________________

So you allow that the Government “should” know where all the guns are?
Well I guess you’re right, “Gun Control Works” just ask Hitler, Stalin
Mao, Pol Pot, Kim Jong Il, Idi Amin…

You need to clean out your skull gear Kinetic, it’s all jammed up with
anti American Bullsh*#t
watchdog

There is no such thing as an “illegal gun”….maybe an illegally owned gun, which violates the 2nd Amendment of the Constitution of this once great nation. Please show even one place in our Constitution, where it says the government has the right to regulate, register or otherwise permit the ownership and use of a gun. Just one place mind you……here is the part you fail to understand. “A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.” SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED….(v infringe [inˈfrindʒ]
to break (a law etc) or interfere with (a person’s freedom or rights).
n inˈfringement)
Lastmanstanding

newark is the way it is because its democratic politicians continue to paint a picture of “equal outcome’ as they have for 50 years…along with NYC, phila, atlanta, chicago, detroit, etc.

These people have been kept here for 50 years by the elites, politicians for a reason…think about it and do some research…using a little common sense will help to.

Someone a week or 2 ago posted a link to “The Corruption” by Porter Stansberry…read it for the candid truth…
vicki

“equal outcome” is like the change part of “hope and change”. If you don’t ask (and liberals don’t) WHAT outcome or WHAT change, they will fall for the hook (and they do) every time.
Cliffystones

You mean to tell me that outlawing guns in Newark didn’t fix the problem?
eddie47d

Time for a new game plan in getting illegal weapons off the streets. Open season is for hunting and not meant for civilized people.
independent thinker

” Open season is for hunting and not meant for civilized people.”

Hey everyone eddie47e says hunters are not civilized people and civilized people do not hunt.
JC

And apparently, “civilized people” don’t defend themselves!
Well done eddie, you’re Liberal colors are flying proud today. LOL Moron!
watchdog

eddie, eddie, eddie, you really have a lack of understanding of the basic bill of rights…no where does it mention “hunting” in the second amendment. Do you even have a concept of why people became civilized? Because of the gun. Someone you share close beliefs with once stated; “Germans who wish to use firearms should join the SS or the SA – ordinary citizens don’t need guns, as their having guns doesn’t serve the State….Heinrich Himmler”

I share more of the same beliefs of another famous person; “No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.”
-Thomas Jefferson, Proposed Virginia Constitution, 1776, Jefferson Papers 344
Vicki

“ordinary citizens don’t need guns, as their having guns doesn’t serve the State….Heinrich Himmler”

Himmler was wrong of course. Citizens having guns protects the State. It is even listed one of the reasons in the 2nd Amendment for not infringing on the right of the people to keep and bear arms.
steve

excellent cliffy!!!
mike1127

No, it wouldn’t.
steve

back around the turn of the century people were quite a bit more courteous to strangers then they are today…maybe it was because they never knew if they came up and insulted someone like they do today that the person might pull out a darringer and blow his brains out…
Cliffystones

“An armed society is a polite society. Manners are good when one may have to back up his acts with his life.”
― Robert A. Heinlein, Beyond This Horizon
watchdog

Perfect quote Cliffy
Mustang

The in this case, I suggest you get the neighborhoods together and march against City Hall and demand that your Mayor (though he sounds as though he is a very weak and meek individual) take the money wasted by the council from them and get a police force that will confront the gangsters and clean up the city with the help of the citizenry. Turn in the criminal for $1000 not the honest people
Chris

Those who choose security over freedom deserve neither.
Like all of the gun grabber laws,this only affects LAW abiding citizens. Sure,some criminals will get nabbed,but the majority of the guns taken will be from law abiding citizens because their neighbors want $1,000 free and it’s easy.
Criminals cause chaos in unarmed society because it’s EASY. If you take the arms away,you open up a smorgasboard for the thugs because they DON’T get their guns legally.Robbing an unarmed neighborhood is like slaughtering a basket of kittens.Look at what Hitler did to he Jews once all the guns were taken.
That Mayor is an enemy of the constitution and a rights killer. Get him OUT of there!
Constitutional carry. Arm EVERYONE and crime will plunge because why would a criminal risk his life to rob if he knows EVERYONE,down to that sweet 84 year old gramma’s carrying?
Jag

You just made a good case for people that live there to be armed, but personally I wouldn’t want to live there. Only time I was ever in Newark was in the airport on our way to Zurich.
http://personallibertydigest gunner689

OK, then let’s outlaw thugs and give rewards to those who turn them in. A thug is a thug is a thug. Be it with a gun, a knife, or a baseball bat. Stats show that most victims of shootings have a criminal record themselves. In other words it’s the trash taking out the trash.

Robert Smith

What part of: “a $1,000 reward for every report that leads to an illegal firearm arrest.”

Law abiding citizens shouldn’t have to worry

Rob

keycat

based solely on what i see in this article, there’s nothing restricting anti-second amendment activities to the bad guys!

“Give us the information about who is carrying a gun, we don’t even have to have a conviction.”
Kinetic1

keycat,
Right to the point. Once again PLD has failed to make the details clear, favoring a misleading article that fits their narrow view. The only thing close to pointing out the fact that this law is about unregistered guns or those without a carry permit is the line “…offering a $1,000 reward for every report that leads to an illegal firearm arrest.” and it would appear that many of you have interpreted this to mean that the arrest is illegal.
UCS

You’re basing your argument on “registered” and “illegal.” That’s where you’re going wrong, IMO.

The 2nd Amendment makes both registration and illegality non-issues. They are both attempts to restrict gun ownership, and those attempts are unconstitutional violations of our rights.

If more law abiding citizens carried self protection, the thugs, monsters, and animals out there would be weeded very quickly out of the neighborhoods they destroy. We don’t need less gun ownership, we need less government regulation and infringement getting in the way of natural selection.
wararrow

This was not explained to reflect a criminal, it says a person carring a fire arm ,that leaves it open for interpration according to who the officer might see this, and make a judement on how that officer might view it at the time.
steve

don’t be so stupid really it’s all about gun control…
watchdog

what part of there are no illegal guns do you not understand??? Please show me where in the Constitution it say the government has the right to take away anyone’s guns? If you can, I will change my opinion and sing it loud.
country boy bubba

The article said arrest,not “illegal firearm arrest”. This goes to imply that even those not prohibited by federal law to own firearms will be arrested and their firearms seized.
watchdog

What part of there are no “illegal” guns do you not understand? Show me in the Constitution where it says that ANY politician has the right to take away guns? If you can, I will change my opinion and sing it loud. That is my challenge to you bobo

2centsworth

I hope a group of people doesn’t get some crazy idea like lynching this guy for being a traitor to everyone in America who knows that the Constitution was written to protect the peoples of it’s country.
Pat

This is Hitler in power again. Instead of the Jewish people it is gun owners instead. Why can’t people see this???!!?? The Nazis did this to the Jews. I guess that makes this Mayor a Nazi!
Kevin M. Sullivan

He doesn’t even speak proper English. “More safe”? We’ll be safer without him….

Newark Mayor: Turn In Gun Owners For $1,000

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