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Paterno, Kardashian, Bialek And Why We're No Longer Slouching Towards Gomorrah

November 9, 2011 by  

Paterno, Kardashian, Bialek And Why We're No Longer Slouching Towards Gomorrah

In 1996, famed jurist and Supreme Court nominee Robert H. Bork wrote a book titled Slouching Towards Gomorrah: Modern Liberalism and American Decline. In it, Bork posits that the American and Western cultures are in a state of decline, and the cause of the decline is modern liberalism and the rise of the New Left.

I’m not debating his premise; but if we haven’t actually reached Gomorrah in the 15 years since Bork published his book, we’re certainly headed there at a full sprint. Recent news items display this distinctly.

Joe Paterno, an icon and revered coach at Penn State, apparently learned that one of his former assistant coaches was assaulting young boys but abdicated his responsibility to inform law enforcement, choosing instead to pass the information along to the school’s athletic director and thereby wash his hands of the affair.

Kim Kardashian, famous for simply being famous and with a show watched by hundreds of thousands of people (many of them impressionable young girls), married and now is divorcing husband Kris Humphries after just 72 days. The wedding earned her a reported $10 million, which comes to almost $139,000 per day of “wedded bliss.” There is a word for that.

Sharon Bialek has come forward to claim GOP Presidential hopeful Herman Cain attempted to sexually assault her when she approached him for job advice. Either she’s a liar of Clintonesque proportions, or Cain is indeed a sexual predator. Either way, the affair is a sordid reflection upon society.

It seems fewer and fewer people in the public eye choose to do what’s right, what’s proper, what’s moral. Our society as a whole has rejected God, and there is a segment of society that would have us accept as normal the depravity of a carnal lifestyle, as was the case in the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah. Don’t be surprised if our country’s fate is similar to that of those two cities.

Filed Under: Conservative Politics, Freedom Watch, Hot Topics
Bob Livingston

is an ultra-conservative American who has been writing a newsletter since 1969. Bob has devoted much of his life to research and the quest for truth on a variety of subjects. Bob specializes in health issues such as nutritional supplements and alternatives to drugs, as well as issues of privacy (both personal and financial), asset protection and the preservation of freedom.

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  • power Leyba

    It is always amazing to me to hear the rant that the US was founded as a Christian nation, when all evidence to the contrary is so blatant and easily found. Nowhere in the Constitution is Jesus mentioned. Someone wrote that many of the precepts in the Constitution were based on Scripture. I’d like to know which ones they are referring to. Whenever someone starts to spout out jibberish about Sodom and Gomorrah and why they were destroyed they always show their ignorance of the Bible which they are using to back their argument. Homosexuality was not even an issue back then and had nothing whatsoever to do with the destruction of those two cities. I’d like to know how there can be references to a biased liberal media when a large majority of news stations, newspaper etc., are owned by conservatives. See, you people don’t even know what you are talking about. You take things said by drug-addicted, draft-dodging, adulterous radio show hosts and make them gospel without bothering to check if the information is correct. I have never ever seen or heard a liberal station refuse to allow a conservative response to anything. As a matter of fact, they love to have such opposing views debated on their programs. The dope who could not remember which liberal site refused to allow him to respond, what did he say it was, huff something, but you try and see for yourself. If I were going to make a claim like that, I’d be certain that I had the information to back me up right at hand. Typical Republican, confront by asking for evidence or proof and they completely lose control. The drug-addict, draft-dodging, aduterous radio show host once used a word on the air in response to a comment made by one of his listeners. Another listener called in and asked what that word meant, that he liked that word and that he wanted to know more about it. The host flustered, flubbered and fumed but had no idea what the word meant, yet he used it and he used it incorrectly at that. He then had that listener cut off from speaking anymore thinking he was a liberal plant trying to embarrass him, but no that was not the case at all. He was merely asking for information that the fatman could not give.
    It is so much fun reading your pathetic comments on things you have absolutely no knowledge of whatsoeever. I could go on and on and on about you conservative hypocrites spouting out things you know nothing about but I will stop now. It does get a bit monotonous reading the same old tired arguments day after day. According to one, up until 1947 all elected officials were moral and ethical. After 1947, that was not the case; since the Supreme Court removed God from schools or some such nonsense where He did not belong in the first place.
    I know I said I would stop and so I will.

    • http://www.boblivingstonletter.com/ Bob Livingston

      Dear power Leyba,

      Most of your incoherent rant (drug-addicted, draft-dodging, adulterous radio host?) is irrelevant. However, you write: “Whenever someone starts to spout out jibberish about Sodom and Gomorrah and why they were destroyed they always show their ignorance of the Bible which they are using to back their argument. Homosexuality was not even an issue back then and had nothing whatsoever to do with the destruction of those two cities.” Read Genesis 18:16-19:29 for the account of the depravity of Sodom and Gomorrah and their fate. (Gen. 19:5–And they called to Lot and said to him, “Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us that we may know them carnally.”)

      Best wishes,
      Bob

      • Doug

        The point of Sodom and Gomorrah was that it was wall to wall evil.

        In any American city there are easily fifty good people.

        18:23 And Abraham drew near, and said, Wilt thou also destroy the
        righteous with the wicked? 18:24 Peradventure there be fifty
        righteous within the city: wilt thou also destroy and not spare the
        place for the fifty righteous that are therein? 18:25 That be far
        from thee to do after this manner, to slay the righteous with the
        wicked: and that the righteous should be as the wicked, that be far
        from thee: Shall not the Judge of all the earth do right? 18:26 And
        the LORD said, If I find in Sodom fifty righteous within the city,
        then I will spare all the place for their sakes.

    • Jay

      power Leyba, you’re crazy and ignorant. A rather lethal combination!

  • Monte

    That should have read ‘naive generation created’.

  • jopa

    Back in the Sixties our generation was also compared to Sodom and Gomorrah with the anti-war, peace and free love movements.Most of us survived, the world is still turning and the sun is gonna shine again tomorrow.What is truly amazing, when I used spell check I think I spelled tomorrow right for the first time.

    • Monte

      That generation, for which I am shamefully a member, destroyed everything and created nothing but chaos. This country will probably not survive the stupidity that my naive created. We were born into a great country and will leave it in ruins. Sad.

      • Karolyn

        I am proud to be a child of the 60s! The first generation to make noise!

      • http://marcum1@wildblue.net coal miner

        Karolyn,

        You will find this interesting.1

        These Sumerian sources deal with the same events – the creation of Man, … “The invaders seized all the possessions of Sodom and Gomorrah and all their food, and departed … THE BORROWED LEGENDS OF THE OLD TESTAMENT ….. He maintains that they were the sons of pagan deities and called themselves Nefilim. …
        http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/serpents_dragons/boulay04e.htm

      • Karolyn

        Thank you for that, coal. Too bad more people can’t open their minds to anything other than what they have been taught their whole lives.

  • http://sydmead.com THESYD

    Lilvingston is only mildly delusional. His ‘christian’ ethic and attendant judgemental asides are fine if limited to intra-personal relalationships which have been filtered out after thousands of years of trial and error. The ‘christian’ dogma extension of basic social sense is bogus. Personal integrity is developed as a social awareness of whatever becomes behavioral cliche in any society. We will for the moment exclude those ‘systems’ which prompt the shouting of ‘god is good’ while beheading some hapless human. They have already voided any possible classification as ‘human.’ America was founded on common sense principles, not a ‘christian’ religious premise as is so erroneously touted. What is happening now in terms of ‘ethics’ is an allowance that rides side-by-side with overt pretense that we are all nice folk and don’t pay any attention to pulchritude, nudity, exciting liaisons…all elaborately presented by media sources. Preposterous, of course. This society celebrates in-your-face physical exposure while at the same time meting out punishment to those who are suggestively led to believe that they can duplicate depicted violation of mores thae they see every day in media. This dichotomy of explicit demonstration and punitive reaction served on the plate of ‘public outrage’ is typical of what can be called ‘victorian hypocrisy.’ In older societies, adult men took boys under their tutuledge with the attendant physical familiarity, a practice wholly agreed to by parents. In some societies the father deflowered the young female on the theory that he would be gentler and produce a more careful memory. In other societies, the female of the pair was offered as a hospitality gift to household visitors. So Bob; let’s turn down the ‘religulous’ screed and concentrate on valid, social issues that actually bear resemblance to intelligent rationalilty.

    • Dale on the left coast

      And which of “those societies” . . . would you care to live in???
      As the US staggers toward 3rd world status . . . you may even get to select a model . . . San Fran or Detroit come to mind!!!

    • Dale on the left coast

      thesyd . . . And which of “those societies” . . . would you care to live in???
      As the US staggers toward 3rd world status . . . you may even get to select a model . . . San Fran or Detroit come to mind!!!

      • eddie47d

        San Francisco is a lively thriving city and doing fairly well.

      • Joe H.

        Dale,
        If syd is of the muslim persuasion, he would like Detroit!! And we all know eddie is in love with San Fran!!!

    • TomP

      Thesyd, just where does the authority for “common sense principles” come from? Evolutionary ideals? Communism? True self-evaluation begets an awareness of selfishness. All world religions save Christ, are a self-improvement course. Jesus did’t say, “Do what I do and I’ll make you a better person.” He said we are all sick and need a foundational transformation. He said repent of your lawless, wicked behavior and put your faith in me, because punishment, though delayed, is coming and I want to save you.

      How do I know this is true? I see and hear the garbage that runs through my mind and my conscience knows (fortunately) it’s wrong. Many have seered thier concience so little matters any more.

  • Tom H

    Readers may wish to purchase & view the documentary “Agenda – Grinding America down”. In an hour you will view the entire leftist Socialist plan to destroy America. (do a Google and you’ll find it)

    The Radicals in the 1960s have never abandoned their plan to destroy America and turn it into a Socialist Utopia. Their strategy involved donning respected attire (ie. suits and ties) and infiltrating government at all levels, dumbing down the school system (Dept of “Educ”), taking control of children at the earliest possible age while their minds were most maleable, injecting sexuality, the more immoral the better, whether possible, removing references to God whereever possible, promoting Islam, overwhelming the social service systems, creating class warfare etc., removing Civics and American History from our classrooms, eliminate instruction on the Constitution and on and on. It is remarkable to think the Bible was part of the core curriculum in public shools 100 years ago. We are now reaping the results of its removal.

    It was a truly stunning DVD. As many commenters have pointed out, the Leftists are close to success.

    It is not too late, but drastic action is needed and must be done now.

  • Capitalist at Birth

    I usually ignore these types of stories, however I think Paterno may have known about this mans depravity for up to 10 years and did nothing. Sad, Sad, Sad.

  • Roger, Canadian LIBERTARIAN

    SUSAN ..I don’t believe that is what Polski was meaning…best you read his message a FEW TIMES and for MONTE, I guess the murder of Native Americans, Slavery, and MILLIONS murdered from American world aggression was the work of the Devil also and wasn’t responsible for making America wealthy???…Dream on with hollywood.

    Live in your deluded world…I can no longer suffer fools…bye ,bye

    • Joe H.

      Roger,
      Then however do you stand YOURSELF???

  • Robert Walker

    In all of the writings of the founders of this nation that I have read, and that is limited, I can find no reference to Jesus or Christ. There are, however, references to God. The Declaration of Independence refers to Nature and Nature’s God. Nowhere in the Declaration of Independence nor the Constitution is there a reference to Christ or His teachings. There is reference to a Creator. Franklin called the Ultimate Power The Author of the Universe. Did Samuel Adams, Jefferson, Franklin, Payne, or any of the others refer to Christ? I cannot easily find such a reference. Franklin wrote that there is a God and He should be worshiped. This nation may be referred to as a Godly nation, but to be called a Christian nation may be as incorrect as Our Fearless Golfer’s statement that we may be referred to as a Muslim nation.
    Thank you,
    Robert Walker

  • Polski

    If you say God is a supreme being that can do everything, then why would God need a “middleman” to talk/contact us. That is what religion is, what the churches are, is “middlemen”. We don’t need them. What’s more, “the church” has committed crimes against all of us throughout all of our history. They have constantly caused wars. They have constantly killed people or groups of people for their own greed. Religion, “church”, is nothing more than a group of people who are constantly killing and stealing from us for their own benefit. When you say Christian, like some icon, or Muslim, like some icon, or Buddhist, like some icon, or Jew, like some icon, etc. etc. you are simply contributing to people’s greed and violence and are responsible for it, just like they are.

    Can’t any of you think with the brain that’s in your head, instead of the brain that you sit on? FOR SHAME!!!

    • Susan, remaining humble

      Polski, You are right, God is Supreme, and no, He doesn’t need a “middleman” to commune with us. If you are referring to a “church” as four walls and a building, again, you are right, we don’t necessarily NEED them, but if you are referring to the “church” as the true believers in Jesus Christ who worship together, then I would challenge you. God does not mandate the building of church structures, but does rejoice when two or more believers gather in His name. You are also right, religions won’t save souls either. Because humans are created with a conscience, and live with a sinful nature, we have personal choices and responsibilities to ourselves and others. ALL have sinned and we can either decide to repent and develope a relationship with God for Eternity or reject Him. You don’t need a “church” — four walls building — to assist you in that decision, but you might want to commune with others in faith who will support you. Only you can make that choice and be willing to live with the consequences of that decision.

      • Capitalist at Birth

        May God Bless you.

      • Deborah

        Well said and clearly explained, Susan. Thank you.

      • Joe H.

        Susan,
        If I wasn’t sure I’d bet you were from Rockford Michigan!!!

    • Dennis48e

      I do NOT need a middleman to talk to God. I can “dial him up” (pray) anytime I want and talk to him and he can talk to me no middleman needed.

  • jopa

    Joe Paterno I feel should step down and the truly sad part is the witness seeing the 10 year old boy being attacked by Sandusky just reported it to Joe.What kind of chicken sh– action is that?If not step in and beat the crap out of Sandusky st least call a cop.

    • Joe H.

      jopa,
      For once we are in agreement 100%!!

  • Roger, Canadian LIBERTARIAN

    Oh yes I forgot….blame it on the “Devil”…another perverted creation of religion, designed to escape reponsibility and keep the masses poor and ignorant.

    ……thanks for confirming what I I have said Monte

    • Dawged

      This is a good read and unfortunately a picture of our country’s current state of decline-God please help us take our country back in the next election and meanwhile protect us from all enemies—both foreign and domestic—-both the Muslim Terrorist and Obama and Eric Holder….

      • wandamurline

        Thank you. If you cannot see that God is unhappy with his children, look no further than the droughts across the south and the floods across the middle of America. Turkey had stated that it would give military escort to the ships of the Hamas across Israel’s embargo…then you get a earth quake of huge proportions. In New Orleans, the black mayor was getting a lot of complaints of having a Gay Pride Parade…he held his fist up and said no one would stop the gay parade….so he got Katrina. California is the next corrupt, sinful, pervasive state in America….don’t be surprised if something of huge proportions hit that state…Aids didn’t stope them, but I see them as a modern Sodom and Gomorrah….just waite for it. We are living in the last days if you believe in Jesus….my advice is to get right with our Lord….I don’t plan on being the one left behind when he comes.

      • Karolyn

        The reason for so much disruption is the collective consciousness. With so much negative energy in the world, it is bound to affect the planet. We are all made of the same stuff as everything that exists and are all part of a whole. Everything emits energy.

      • 45caliber

        I’m sorry but I don’t believe there is a “collective consciousness”. If there was, there would be no crime or any individual action since the collective consciousness would prevent it.

      • Karolyn

        45 – As I said, it is the collective negative energy outweighing the positive energy that causes all unrest. The more love that is spread, the more positive energy and the better chance for our world. I am sure you’ve heard that prayer heals. Well, there have been experiments that show that people who are prayed for, even if they are unaware of it, do heal faster. That is collective positive (love)energy.

      • Joe H.

        45,
        Remember, RESISTANCE IS FUTILE!!!!!!

    • Monte

      Roger, foreign atheist. The Soviet Union was godless. The perfect state, right? Man replaced God and it was a utopia. They exterminated 20 million of their own citizens, but they did it without that nasty, primitive religion. So therefore it was perfection. Without God, there is neither morality, nor basis for it, only the law as it made up by man. And what are their credentials for such an important role? We live under a greater and greater proof of just such tyranny. Perhaps you will be the one beheaded, instead of making the rules.

    • Dale on the left coast

      Roger . . . athiesm is not Provable, you can not prove there is not G*d . . . therefore you have to Believe . . . belief is a Religious Experience . . . therefore you, like other famous athiests of the past century, are a religous person!!!
      How do you feel about the fact that “Athiesm” was directly responsible for the deaths of more people than all the wars of the 20th century???

      • Karolyn

        it was not ahteism; it was power-hungry man.

      • Susan, remaining humble

        Karolyn, you are right…..”power hungry man” can result in a “power hungry humanistic government” or, as many would describe as a tyrannical government. Humanism, a religion which believes man is the measure of all things, denies a belief in a Supreme Being or God. Humanism, according to the US Supreme Court, is a religion so therefore, one has to discern logically if the Humanism Religion is also Atheism. Food for thought — Almighty man or Almighty God. It’s a matter of your personal world view.

      • Susan, remaining humble

        In conclusion, “power hungry man” without a conscience is humanistic which is an atheistic religion.

      • http://marcum1@wildblue.net coal miner

        Dale says

        “Roger . . . athiesm is not Provable”Neithe is God.

        How many people have been killed by Christians since biblical times? … 1568 Spanish Inquisition Tribunal ordered extermination of 3 million rebels in ….. R.H. Robbins, The Encyclopedia of Witchcraft and Demonology, New York 1959, 180 million people were butchered in the name of christianity. .
        http://www.truthbeknown.com/victims.htm

      • http://marcum1@wildblue.net coal miner

        Dale

        The matter in the universe is made out of positive energy. … universe began as a perfect vacuum and that all the particles of the material world were created from …
        http://the-great-learning.com/vaccum-physics.htm -

      • Jay

        That was the Catholic church cm, it was anything but Christian. Practically all precepts of the Roman Catholic institution contradict the Bible repeatedly. Do try and be more precise!

      • 45caliber

        Dale:

        Actually atheism IS a religion for most who follow it. Even the government recognizes it as such.

  • Roger, Canadian LIBERTARIAN

    LIBERALISM is NOT the cause of the Decline of the Western “empire”.. MORAL,PHILISOPHICAL, MILITART and ECONOMIC BANKRUPTCIES are the cause!

    Being an ATHIEST, I am not referring to what the perverted, “Victorian”, inhibited, definition/view, Christianity,Islam or Judaism espouse and is prevalent in society today. In fact those views are the main part of the problem!

    • Monte

      I could not more disagree with your whole absurd statement. Secular humanism, as a replacement for religion, is silly, foolish and evil. Satin is very clever, but he is not God. Only a fool would deny that Christianity was not a major foundation of our Western civilization. Without it, we have become an immoral, decadent mockery of our past greatness. Our decline and moral decadence dates from the appearance of those like yourself.

      • Karolyn

        Unfortunately, Christians are all taught that man is born in sin. This is not the case. Man is inherently good; however, society corrupts.

      • Susan, remaining humble

        If humans were born “inherently good and society corrupted them”, please explain how young child will lie when he know he has done something wrong. Do children know inherently they are to share their toys? Have you ever had to correct a small child by saying “no”? Why do you have to correct or discipline children? IF inherently good, a child should just know by birth to share toys, not lie, not be jealous of his siblings or friends, take toys away from others, etc. As an adult working with high school students, a child without discipline and not understanding the difference between right and wrong is confused and rebellious when he is corrected. It is an understood concept children learn right and wrong before the age of five. Families who think children will magically make all the right choices because they are inherently good are insulting their child’s moral growth. Any parent with two or more children in a family knows that each child is unique and will react differently within the same situation. If inherently good, which child is right and is the other wrong? Please explain your logic….

      • Karolyn

        Susan – Babies in the womb are affected by the energy around them. Babies and young children are also absorbing everything around them. Unless they are with parents, friends, family who don’t fight, argue, get mad, etc. they will be affected.

      • libertytrain

        Susan, remember she doesn’t have kids to have experienced the actuality of life. Though she has friends that have kids….it’s not the same thing as we all know from the day to day experience.

      • Joe H.

        libertytrain,
        Remember “them as can, DO. them as can’t try to TEACH!!!!

      • libertytrain

        Joe,I have a sister that had attempted to teach me the proper way to do things with my kids when they were little because she had a social work degree so she “knew” and knew more than I ever could. What a doofus. I can’t remember the last year she worked, never married, never had kids, lived off my dad, stole my dad’s money, put him in a nursing home and she still thinks she knows more because she has a degree – but no life experience whatsoever in her 62 or so years. Lazy woman, turned my dad’s home into hoarder’s express, filth, stinks, cats… Yep I’ve unfortunately met so many woman in that age group that seemed to have turned out that way. Sad in a way. What happened…

      • Joe H.

        libertytrain,
        such is the reason I say TRY to teach!! most of them couldn’t teach a fish to swim when they come by it naturally!!!

  • Conservative Canadian

    And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains.
    And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
    For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

  • CP

    I am so very glad to hear that Sandusky is guilty and put to death before there has even been a trail. Or is his a case like most other so-called sex offenders, guilty until proven innocent? There is one big problem with that theory, and that is the fact that you can never prove you did NOT do something. And now people are jumping on the people above Sandusky who did exactly what they were supposed to do, report an alleged problem to the proper authorities. In Paterno’s case. he reported what he had been told to his superiors for investigation. Once he did that, it was out of his hands, unless he wanted to chance termination for insubordination by stepping outside the chain of command to report something that he had no direct knowledge of to someone outside his chain of command.

    • http://www.boblivingstonletter.com/ Bob Livingston

      Dear CP,

      See my response to Ryan above.

      Best wishes,
      Bob

    • Doug

      And like I said above if it was one of his kids or grand kids do you think he would have just reported it the chain of command?

      • libertytrain

        oh sure, chain of command….right….

    • 45caliber

      CP:

      Committing the act of a crime makes a person guilty – not being found guilty in court. A trial is simply meant to determine if the person was the one who committed the crime – not an action to make him guilty. An innocent person can be ruled guilty in a court when he really isn’t. When it is apparent that he committed the act, a trial is more a formality than anything. So please don’t play semantics here.

    • Joe H.

      CP,
      Oh goodness yes!!! His JOB is so much more important than those kids that play for HIM!!! Get Real! I would hope he has the cahones to do the RIGHT thing!!

  • Roger

    The Bible says there would be a “great falling away”. There are many today in America that claim Christianity but only a few that live the life of a Christian. It isn’t a Sunday only lifestyle. So yes, when the few trumped the many to remove God from the schools and other parts of the American landscape, I would say that that prophey has already come true. With homosexuality running rampant in America and around the world, Sodom and Gomorrah are here. Folks, we are living on borrowed time.

    • Karolyn

      Roger – “homosexuality running rampant.” Once again, more people, more homosexuals. And once again, you hear about it more. Do you seriously think there were less homosexuals in the past?

      • 45caliber

        Karolyn:

        Perhaps it is bad to say it this way but Yes, there were less homosexuals in the past. For one thing it was considered wrong and people didn’t want to be wrong so they stayed away from it. For another, gays were frequently killed so that thinned them out too. I’m not saying it was right to do that but it occurred.

      • Karolyn

        No, 45, they were all in the closet; that’s why there appeared to be less.

      • 45caliber

        Karolyn, they wouldn’t even admit to themselves that they were gay – if they were. I still tend to believe being gay is a choice. They certainly weren’t hiding it in that they knew they were gay and didn’t want to tell.

      • eddie47d

        Probably true Karolyn. If anyone even suggests treating a homosexual as not deserving equal treatment under our Constitution is a hypocrite. I do find TV sexually deviant and all hours of the day yet that is coming from heterosexuals.

      • libertytrain

        Unfortunately eddie, the tv has become the site of too much coming from intense homosexual and even more intense heterosexual displays – night and day. I’m not a prude, just don’t need to see these things continuously no matter the channel I put on, I’m almost afraid to watch Sesame Street with the grandbabies.

      • Jay

        eddie, immorality is not exclusive to heterosexuals, or to a particular gender. It is an issue of character, or a lack there of!

      • Joe H.

        libertytrain,
        gotta agree with you on sesame street. Did you see what happened withKatie perry? herself practically bouncing out of her bustier!!! they cancelled her show!! Real proper dress around 5 n 6 year olds!!!
        My kids watch it and we watched gabriella grow up on the show but it is getting too “progressive” as of late!!!

      • libertytrain

        goodness what is happening in this world – …. Gosh I remember when Marlo Thomas came out with her Free To Be Me album and that was controversial. Probably still have the one I bought for my oldest child…. Life was comparatively simpler even 40 years ago then to what we have become. Tacky, sleazy…how impressive.

  • Sol of Texas

    Dagger –

    I’d be willing to say we’ve been “there” for quite some time. The influence of liberals (in fact, “progressives”) has been going on since before the start of the 20th century. We certainly were “there” during and after Wilson administration. FDR and LBJ’s “pragmatic” do whatever it takes to get re-elected approach to politics has contributed significantly to the decline since.

    Most people have been sleep walking through history. I think if the American ideal and the significance of the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution can be restored 3 things MUST happen:

    1. The tax system must shift purely from income (production) tax to a sales (consumption) tax
    2. An Constitutional amendment enforcing term limits at least at the federal level for not only the president, but the top cabinet and administrative positions and legislature as well.
    3. A school voucher system must replace the existing government school monopoly (at the state level). The mission of a federal Department of Education (if there should be one at all) should be to disseminate “comparative” information to the states and nothing more.

    Frankly, I don’t see a single one of these actions occurring within the next 12 months, but electing people who sincerely believe in these principles might turn the tide within the next 2 – 10 years.

    Your thoughts?

  • Doc Sarvis

    Interesting that of Livingston’s three examples of modern liberalism at least two of them are Republicans.

    • http://www.boblivingstonletter.com/ Bob Livingston

      Dear Doc Sarvis,

      Neither liberalism nor morality know party labels. You should know by now we deal only in truths.

      Best wishes,
      Bob

      • Doc Sarvis

        I cannot recall one columnist here who does not regularly paint every Democrat as a liberal.

        Please, your comment about truth was just too funny.

      • http://www.boblivingstonletter.com/ Bob Livingston

        Dear Doc Sarvis,

        That is because there are no conservative Democrats holding political office (if any still even exist), and conservative Republicans can be counted on one hand.

        Best wishes,
        Bob

      • Doc Sarvis

        How very subjective of you.

      • libertytrain

        Doc you spend so much time here, posting your thoughts and ideas…and Mr. Livingston provides you that Personal Liberty even when it’s contrary and attempts to ridicule the site. Do you realize how fortunate you are? The sites on the left don’t even let anyone with a contrary view to post…

      • Doc Sarvis

        libertytrain,

        I seriously doubt that Mr. Livingston or any of the others who run this site would want only those who agree exactly with their viewpoints to post. How boring would that be?

        I don’t spend much time on leftist sites. Which ones are you referring to that only let agreeable viewpoints to post?

      • libertytrain

        That’s the beauty, he doesn’t stunt your liberty. I gave up a while ago on the left sites. I believe I had a prob on the huff thing, and others have mentioned several over the last few years. Try it sometime and see how far you get if you state a conflicting opinion. Try it and experience it for yourself.

      • eddie47d

        Left blogs do allow opposing opinions. Try Alternet.org and yes we should thank Bob Livingston for providing an outlet for the nations frustrations. So Thank You Bob.

      • Joe H.

        Yeah eddie, try Huffpo some time and pose as a conservative!!

      • Dale on the left coast

        Look around the world Doc . . . progressives/lieberals/socialists have DESTROYED economies all over Europe. Even leftist Diktaters like the clown in Venesula can’t run his show. The of course we have your favorite Comm Organizer . . . how’s he doin Doc? As he prints and spends this country over a cliff . . . will you still be a believer??
        Left = failure . . . the evidence is all around!!!

      • eddie47d

        Wall Street imploding …the evidence is all around even in other parts of the world. I have no,love for Hugo Chavez but gas is only .06 a gallon down there.

      • Joe H.

        That’s nice eddie, but the normal citizen can’t afford a car!! What good is cheap gas when you don’t DRIVE???

  • Geronimo Schmidt

    Maybe is time for the mass indignation of moral and ethical people to move us to another direction.
    I am a believer in personal freedom, but the limits of my freedom is when such afreedom start affecting other people and society in general.
    Is it time for the FCC and the media to start implementing censorship of the programs aired or offered to general cable viewing? I think the answer is YES.
    Is it time for parents to retake their responsability seriously and get more involve in parenting than in their own personal selfish lifes? YES
    Is it time to really look at our schools and implement reforms to enhanced education of our children as well as improve the working conditions of “good teachers” (get rid of the bad ones) YES

    • http://www.boblivingstonletter.com/ Bob Livingston

      Dear Geronimo Schmidt,

      More government is not the answer. It will lead you over a cliff. You should know by now that you can’t legislate morality.

      Best wishes,
      Bob

      • Susan, remaining humble

        Mr. Livingston, Unfornately I inserted my response below “Thor” comments and in saving space, thanks, in advance, for reading my additional comments.

      • http://marcum1@wildblue.net coal miner

        Bob Livingston says:
        November 9, 2011 at 8:07 am
        Dear Geronimo Schmidt,

        “More government is not the answer. It will lead you over a cliff. You should know by now that you can’t legislate morality.

        Best wishes,
        Bob”

        Catholic Church prove that one and also other religions.Ha ha ha.

      • libertytrain

        coal miner – your hatred is showing again.

      • Dale on the left coast

        Coal . . . but you’re OK with heterophobes training up children . . . right!!!

      • http://marcum1@wildblue.net coal miner

        Dale,
        It wasn’t little girls molested.It was boys.I think that was kind of queer.Don’t you think?I blame the church.
        Everyone watches the fox around the hen house,but not the coyote.I have no use for a child molester,whether he molested little girls or little boys. they are scum of the earth.Catholic Church has being covering this up for years.To me,all religions are sick jokes,perpetrated on the weak minded and the gullible.It is all about power and it is a form of mental rape.
        Mar 24, 2010… XVI, did not defrock a priest who molested as many as 200 deaf boys, even … Even as the pope himself in a recent letter to Irish Catholics has …
        http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/25/world/europe/25vatican.html%3Fpagewanted%3Dall

      • Buddy

        You’re certainly correct, Bob. More government is not only not the answer, but is the antithesis of much of anything positive. More likely we need a lot less government because its size is costing us both productive activities and contentment in our lives.

        What we need is smaller and less intrusive government. A breakup of the USA union will be in the best interest of most of us.

      • 1955thekeeper

        Why has no one mentioned that the victim in this situation has no responsibility to take a proactive stance to get his grievances heard and the perpetrator sanctioned? I’m male and proudly a heterosexual. Having stated that, if some goofball touched my junk or took advantage of his authority over me and raped me, I wouldn’t have gone to anyone within the framework of the program to seek justice. I, personally would have gone directly to the police and or the newspapers with the allegations of wrong doing. Who cares who was privy to this or that and failed to act on the behalf of the student/athlete. Why didn’t the student/athlete take it upon himself to be forth coming with the information which would have stopped this creep from skating. Why is there always so much finger pointing in this society as to the responsibility of “OTHERS” in our lives. Why do we not stress to everyone the importance of being personally responsible for the things which can and do happen in our lives.

      • libertytrain

        While I understand your point, we are talking about a 10-year old boy. They are usually far too embarrassed, ashamed, scared, to talk about such things till they are a little older.

      • Joe H.

        1955 the keeper,
        YUP I’m sure when you were 16, you would have gone to the police and reported it KNOWING it would come out to your buddies that you wereRAPED by a GUY!!! Sure you would!!!

      • libertytrain

        this is an interesting article regarding who knew what and saw what when… there are a lot of sorry excuses for human beings that should have done something a lot sooner —- a decade ago….and didn’t.
        http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/7203566/penn-state-nittany-lions-sex-abuse-case-officials-arraigned-police-seek-alleged-assault-victim

      • nw

        Dear Bob Livingston,
        You can’t legislate morality? What do you call abortion on demand, same sex marriage, removal of ten commandments and prayer in school? These appear to be legislating morals.

      • Karolyn

        That’s a stretch. I’m sure you must understand the statement. It means you can’t force someone to be moral, no matter how many laws you write.

      • Joe H.

        karolyn,
        On this there is a way to force morality. If they mess with your kid in this manner, put ‘em under!!! They’ll remain moral for eternity!!!

    • 45caliber

      Geronimo:

      There are two ways to achieve freedom – and only two ways.

      You can grant everyone around you freedom to do as they will as long as they grant the same freedom to you.

      OR

      You can take all freedom for yourself and leave NONE for the other people.

      The problem is that our government chooses to use the second way since it is far easier to do and they are the ones who want the freedom.

  • Ryan

    Wrong about Paterno, he told those whose responsibility it was to take it to the authorities, a chain of command type thing you know? Of all the places to jump on the heresay bandwagon and get on Joe’s case when his previous best friend did these things and Joe DID report it, is a joke! Hell, you didn’t even mention the one who COMMITTED these accusations. Sandusky. How can you write an article outlining these findings and not even mention the true Perp but mention Paterno who, based on a GA’s word, reported it to his superiors.

    Honestly it makes me sick.

    • http://www.boblivingstonletter.com/ Bob Livingston

      Dear Ryan,

      Paterno’s “superiors” were/are superiors in name only. Paterno runs the sports program and he failed those young boys when he didn’t follow through to make sure law enforcement was involved. Take off your “Paterno-worship” blinders and see the truth.

      Best wishes,
      Bob

      • http://personalliberty rockdoc01

        Sorry Bob. Joe Paterno is the coach and runs the football team and delegates responsibilities to assistant coaches and the program is run by the athletic department headed by the athletic director. Penn State has an internal protocol like the military. You address grievances to your superiors and those in the position to deal with it according to their protocol make the decision on how to deal with it. I could say alot more but the entire condition of this country under Obama and the media makes me sick.

      • libertytrain

        I understand what you are saying, but there are times when one has to take action. No different when one priest ignoring what he discovered another priest doing. We don’t grant them absolution for ignoring what they knew…or acting meekly about the problem. This isn’t just petty crime. This is child sex abuse. Whole different “ball-game” – the heck with chain of command or any command. A little common sense would have been useful.. This needed attention, not passiveness.

      • Patriot

        Absolutely right, where is his moral compass? If you see someone being harmed, raped, etc. in the street, my hope is that anyone of us would “Stop the Crime” and not follow protocol and call the police and walk away! This is exactly the point where is our Moral Decency??

      • Doug

        Exactly he should have shoot the pervert or gave him the biggest ass kicking so that he could never hurt a kid again! What if is was one of Joe’s grand kids think he would have just reported up the chain of command and let the monster keep doing crap to kids?

      • Joe H.

        rockdoc01,
        He owes it to those kids that play for HIM to protect them from the likes of this assistant coach! That includes going to the authorities! What would HE have expected if one of the boys were HIS son and he was not the coach??

      • Rick USAF (ret)

        Bob and rocdoc, you’re both partially correct on this one. Granted, joepa may have been the head coach but every organization has it’s chain of command and it is understood that one follows the chain of command. The only time one goes outside the chain is when they feel they will be persecuted by someone directly over them or are relatively certain that by sticking to the chain of command, proper actions won’t be taken. In this case, joepa did the right thing but failed to do the right thing in the end. When the issue was addressed and proper measures taken within a reasonable time initially, he should have then elevated his concerns to the Chancellor of the college and, if that still failed to generate a response that he deemed befitting, ultimately to the police. Now the question is: Did he try and conclude what the ultimate action should be (in this case, removal of the perpetrator and charges filed) and then follow through? If not, why not. If he did, then why didn’t he take it further up the chain of command and, if necessary, ultimately to law enforcement?

      • Rick USAF (ret)

        sorry, the sentences “In this case, joepa did the right thing but failed to do the right thing in the end. When the issue was addressed and proper measures taken within a reasonable time initially, he should have then elevated his concerns to the Chancellor of the college and, if that still failed to generate a response that he deemed befitting, ultimately to the police.” should read:

        In this case, joepa did the right thing initially but failed to do the right thing in the end. When the issue was addressed and proper measures weren’t taken within a reasonable time initially, he should have then elevated his concerns to the Chancellor of the college and, if that still failed to generate a response that he deemed befitting, he should have gone to the police.

      • Joe H.

        Rick,
        sorry, but I have to call BS!!! If the coach had killed one of the kids, does he then still go thorugh a chain of command?? NO! A major crime was commited, therefore he has a RESPONSIBILITY BY LAW to report it to the authoeities, not his SUPERIORS!!!

    • James

      Ryan, If memory serves, the law requires those who witness crimes to report them to the proper authorities. Everyone who knew what Sandusky was doing, and didn’t report it, should be arrested.

  • 45caliber

    Considering the government requirements for sexual grooming of kids even in kindergarten, it looks as if we are speeding right along …

  • http://none John Johns

    Most likely there are others of the same ilk as paterno and his buddy coach but we only hear of the things our media can sensationalize, exactly like this kardasian whomever she is. I wondered who she was and one youngster said I was behind the times. Well I hope so, I believe in God and my right to worship as I see fit. Sports are such big business now there is no doubt there are other horror tales available. From what I see of pro football it has become like pro wrestling

    • 45caliber

      I agree. All pro sports is more concerned with what increases the income and not who wins a game. Just like pro wrestling. And like pro wrestling, in many cases the match is fixed ahead of time.

      • Joe H.

        45,
        That is why I watch highschool sports instead! Those kids play for the sport and give 110% of themselves in the process! The pros only care about the MONEY! Figure, 20.00 parking, 25.00 for a seat, 50.00 for refreshments, and then as high as a cool 100.00 for souveneers. that’s 170.00 for a single game. I can go all season to highschool and not pay 1/4 of that!!!

    • Robin from Arcadia, IN

      John Johns… I would compare the United States all-consuming interest in sports to that of the Roman empire and the ‘games’ they indulged in. History is repeating….

      • Karolyn

        So according to you, people can’t even enjoy sports anymore? I grew up in a football family (Giants) and will always enjoy a good game. It’s fun!

      • Deborah

        You know, Karolyn, I have noticed that you take any comment and take it to the extreme. Sports are fine, obsession with sports is not. You are hostile and you miss the point by being so. Try to think a bit beneath the surface. I know that’s always difficult for a liberal.

      • Karolyn

        Deborah – Have you read any of your fellow conservatives’ posts? I am as far from hateful as one can get. I’m not the one who calls people names and wishes them evil and tells them to geet out of the country.

      • 45caliber

        Robin:

        The original rules of takeover of the US by the Communists had three rules:

        #1 was: Destroy the ruggedness of the American people by concentrating their attention on spectator sports and sex.”

        When you consider the programs on TV now, I think they have done that.

      • eddie47d

        Is that what the Romans used to seduce the known world? They were well known for sports,sex and violence.

      • 45caliber

        They were – particularly just before they went under.

  • Larry Miller

    Two things bother me with Paterno, “former” assistant coach” and “had passed the information to the Athletic Director”! So was Paterno supposed to personally slap a “former” coach around the head & neck when he “learned” about this situation!

    • Karolyn

      Well, you would think he would do SOMETHING.

      • independant thinker

        He did SOMETHING Karolyn the problem is he passed the buck to his superiors instead of calling the police himself.

      • Joe H.

        I T,
        FINALLY some common sense!! People seem to think that because Paterno is a winning coach he is above repreve! BS!! He is entrusted with the greatest gift a parent can give, their own kids, for him to watch over while they are in his care! He FAILED MISERABLY!!!

    • 45caliber

      No, he should have called the police and let THEM slap the guy around his head and shoulders …

    • Robin from Arcadia, IN

      Larry… What would you have done in his shoes? Firing the pervert comes to mind, along with police intervention.

    • Doc Sarvis

      He should have banned his former assistant from all PSU football facilities. The alleged “perp” was in the football weight room just last week.

      • Joe H.

        Too bad one of the parents weren’t there, as well!

  • Dagger

    We are already there: Sodom and Gomorrah are here in the good ole U.S.A.
    Perverts now have more rights than straights. When courts and law enforcement are protecting and defending perversion more than the straight people then you must conclude that we have already arrived at Sodom and Gomorrah. Anyone that knows what the Holy Bible has to say about Sodom and Gomorrah should be aware that this type of society is an abomination in the sight of God the Father and will not be tolerated much longer.

    • 45caliber

      Dagger:

      One good thing may come of this, though. We may never again have a shortage of salt …

  • gerryrichard

    the fact that this nation yanked god out of the public school system,as well as government in general has nothing to do with it ,eh?

    • Karolyn

      It was really no different when God was in everything. As I said, nothing has changed; there are just more people and better communications.

      • Robin from Arcadia, IN

        Karolyn…
        You really don’t see that things have gone from bad to worse? Wow! Your drugs must be good!

      • John Scolaro

        Well Karolyn,
        I suspect nothing has changed for you because you yourself haven’t changed. You are what you’ve always been, doing no more or less than you’ve always done. So which are you then? More of the same or more of the same more apparent because of your better communication?

      • Karolyn

        Your assumption about me could not be more wrong. I have always felt that anyone who does not change and grow is like a rock, although even rocks change. Either one changes, or change is forced upon one.

      • Doug

        I don’t like to defend Karoyn but what she is saying is correct! There are millions of more people on this earth now so more people mean more chances for things to happenn or people to do them. Also communication has changed everything you can’t hide from anything anymore if you are using modern technology. There were the same percentage of people committing sins or what have you years ago now they just get got or can’t payoff enough people or hold something over them!

      • Deborah

        Doug and Karolyn- where have you seen the surveyed statistics proving that the same percentage of sins have always been happening? And do they cover all of history, all of recorded history, just the last 2000 years, 500 years? Who took the polls? I would love to see the surveys.
        Yes, sin has always been, ever since Adam and Eve were evicted. But the moral breakdown just in the last 50-100 years has been escalating. The media you give so much credit to are in large part not just reporting, but encouraging sin and immorality. Sodom and Gommorrah, yes, it went on then, and look what God did to them! Just because it’s becoming more common and is being more publicized, that makes it ok to rip apart Christians for speaking out against it?

      • Joe H.

        Deborah,
        Very good! morality in a lot of people is in its death throes. The more accepting society becomes the more morality dies! Where does it all end? I’d be willing to bet that where ever it ends it will be damn warm!!!

      • Karolyn

        Deborah – Who’s ripping apart Christians? I used to be one and some of my favorite people are GOOD Christians. You have to be kidding if you don’t know about all the corruption, sleaze, etc. that has been going on in the world for thousands of years! It’s just logical that if you multiply the amount of crime by the amount the population has grown, it would no doubt be comparable.

      • Capitalist at Birth

        You need to look up the definition of the word naive, in order to believe that growing up in the 50′s and 60′s is the same as growing up today.

      • Doug

        You need to look up the word technolgy to think that people in the 50″1s and 60′s were different.

      • Dale on the left coast

        Doug . . . silly response. Obviously you were never there. The 50′s was a magic time, even the early 60′s were special . . . before the progressives/socialists and entitlement class came out of the woodwork.
        The differences between then and now are mindboggling, were there problems then . . . you bet, but the quality of the people – they were giants compared to the midgets of today!!!

      • eddie47d

        Yes those years were indeed special because we worked together as a nation. Yet the wealthy were taxed at a much higher rate than now and they still remained rich. Now the wealthy are even more so while that special Middle Class is tanking.I think greed won so don’t blame everything on Progressives.

      • Joe H.

        Gee eddie, I didn’t know the subject was taxes on the rich!!! Pay attention, boy!

      • James

        Kaarolyn, What has changed is that Homosexuals insist on being treated like heterosexuals, while God wants them removed from our societies. I’m sure we will see the wisdom of that before this is over. Homosexuals want to be Scout Masters, teachers and college professors. They want to make our world like theirs, that’s what happened in Sodom and Gomorrah. Wait till young boys come home from school, and complain to mommy: “The teacher pulled my pants down.”

  • Karolyn

    So I guess Christianity doesn’t work! If this is a Christian nation, that ain’t sayin’ a lot for Christianity. Nothing is different than it ever was. The only difference is that there are more people and we hear about everything at the speed of light.

    • http://www.boblivingstonletter.com/ Bob Livingston

      Dear Karolyn,

      As usual, you stand logic on its head.

      Best wishes,
      Bob

      • Karolyn

        Seems pretty logical to me! Look back through history and see how horribly people have acted through the ages.

      • jimmy the greek

        You got that right ! just look at the way iserial is screwing over the palestinians .

      • Capitalist at Birth

        Can you elaborate on these false claims, that Israel is screwing over the Palestinians?

      • Ken

        I’ll elaborate and ask some important questions. In 70A.D., Jerusalem was taken from the Jews who then dispersed. The Bible tells us that, in the end times, the Jews will return to Israel. Against all odds, that has happened. However, the land was seized from another group of human beings, some of whom are Christians.(we usually don’t think about that). As Christians, we have to wonder why God would give Israel back to a people who have mostly become secular and liberal. After all, much of the garbage we see on television comes from them. They also played a big part in electing our loser and chief. According to the Bible, God will now protect Israel from attack, yet ultimately, the antichrist will inhabit the new temple in Jerusalem. All of this is apparently, part of the master plan. In the meantime, the Jews are pretty brutal with the Palestinian people and the Palestinians are pretty brutal back. Meanwhile, back in the USA, Christians feel the need to protect a country populated by people whose counter parts here put us down as nutty right wingers. The whole thing is twisted. Israel is supposedly a nuclear country. Can’t they take care of themselves? Why are we so bent on protecting her when that is promised by God? I’m not saying that we should turn our backs, but I do think that occasionally, Israel needs a leash.

      • 45caliber

        Ken:

        Let’s back up a little.

        The Jews did not seize Israel from those living there. The British “owned” and ran the place as a territory. The United Nations decided to create two nations there – Palestine and Israel. Israel hadn’t existed in nearly two thousand years; Palestine NEVER existed.

        When the Jews arrived in Israel they were willing to live with all that were there. And they still do today – with those who stayed. The Muslims in the area decided to kill all the Jews, something they have tried to do for centuries. So about half the people who were there left. Many joined the army formed to destroy the Jews. But they failed to kill the Jews who kicked their behinds. So they ran back to other countries for help.

        Most of those other countries (like Syria) didn’t want to let them become citizens because they were trouble-makers. (And for other reasons.) So they put them into camps.

        In the meantime, the Israeli government did exactly the same thing our own government will do if you decide to walk off and abandon any property you own – they took it for back taxes. The Arabs and Christians who continued to live in the area who did not leave are still there and are Israeli citizens.

        When the Muslims tried again during the 6 Day War in the sixties, they were again badly beaten. But in the meantime Israel had gotten tired of constant attacks by terrorists from areas listed as Palestinian. They also didn’t like getting shelled from the Golan Heights area. So when the war was over, those areas weren’t given back.

        Today they still control part of those areas and have given back other parts. So officially they still control some areas of “Palestine”, the country that has never existed. However ALL lands in Isreal are legally owned by the present owners. There is NO legal reason to return these lands to people who walked off and abandoned them over sixty years ago.

        So all your rants about the “poor” Palestinians is pure hog-wash as my grandma used to say.

      • eddie47d

        Maybe Caliber needs to back up alittle. You are mostly correct but most Palistinians would be happy with their own country and few want Israel back which I think you were implying.They do want the West Bank which Israel keeps encroaching on against terms of the last agreement. I think this Israel/Palistine dog has been kicked around enough by these two entities. Neither side will get exactly what they want so they need to get over it. I think it was horrendous when Turkey killed or booted out over 1 million Armenians but how far back in history do we have to go before these issues are resolved.

      • Rhondar

        All Christians should be aware of this power structure to save our religion and our country because it’s under attack…the Rothschilds are the puppet masters of our government. BOTH Obama and McCain went to see Rothschild before the last election….why?
        Rothschild promised that country to many and for profit decided to give it to the Jews…that before Palestine was settled upon as “homeland for the Jews”,
        the Rothschild’s were considering Madagascar, Chad, Mato Grosso in Brazil,
        the Upper Nile Valley, Kenya, Northern Rhodesia, Guyana?

        “I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the Synagogue of Satan.” – Revelation 2:9

        http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y_wkVJcH65s&feature=player_embedded

        Evil family of Satanist who are trying to rule the world….and are almost succeeding if we will only stop doing their bidding. Their true combined wealth is somewhere around 500 TRILLION dollars.

      • Rhondar

        Palestine has been inhabited for thousands of years. The Israelis ran off the indiginous people when Israel was created or killed them if they wouldn’t sell their land.

        Yes I’ve read about 1/3 of Palestinians are Christians and the Israelis persecute the Christians as well. Israel is not a true democracy as we know it…Christians and Muslims are 2nd class citizens. Therefore it doesn’t make much sense for Christians all over the world not to support Palestine.

      • Joe H.

        You people forget one thing. The palistinians, up until recent history, were and always have been a nomadic people!! In Fact, they only started making real noise about having a country after Isreal was AGAIN formed!!

      • Old Henry

        eddie

        Maybe we should gev Detroit to the Palistinians for their own country…

      • bhscpa

        People behave more responsibly when they have been schooled in the Christian faith. America was founded as a Christian country, make no mistake. Just read history. America was a better country before the Supreme Court began its systematic removal of Christianity from our society in 1947 (Everson v. Board of Education). Since then we can’t get a moral public servant to save our lives. School kids shoot-up their schools, the LGBT lifestyle is literally being shoved down our throats (no pun intended), Islam, the bigoted anti-everybody-except-us religion/political system has a special place in the hearts of the far-left in America, the violent OWS with its provable ties to Socialists and other revolutionaries wants to destroy the Western way of life, our main-stream media is so slanted to the left that the truth has no chance to see the light of day, many Americans can’t think beyond the entitlement mentality of what the government can do for them and there is very little thought as to what is best for the future survival of our country.

      • http://yahoo Rickster

        One of the best comment responses I have seen in a long time, clear, lucid and accurate…nice job…

      • Kinetic1

        bhscpa,
        It could be said with reasonable certainty that no one is better schooled in Christianity than the clergy, yet the clergy is often found molesting children and cheating with the wives of the congregation. Those who are raised in a moral household, no matter what (if any) religion is practiced have a better start, but there are no guarantees. As for our nation being better prior to 1947, perhaps you have forgotten the gang wars between immigrant groups in the late 19th and early 20th century, or the results of prohibition in the 20s and 30s? How about open and legal prejudice, rampant alcoholism and sexual violence whitewashed as “seduction”? Watch a movie from the 30s and you may see the story of a women sleeping her way up the corporate ladder. Sex, drugs, corruption and greed are nothing new, though each generation looks at the next as if everything is so much worse than during their childhood. There’s much to condemn about society today, but I would venture to say that much of what we complain about today was there before, it just existed in the shadows.

      • David

        Kinetic1, you are refering to Catholics? What about all of the other christian religions that do not forbid their pastors from marriage….which is natural and just. These pastors do not seem to make it in the news…..

      • home boy

        are you talking about the episcopal church that has lesbians as their leaders?

      • Ranger 1

        Not so certain that glorifying the Christian religion is a good idea. I mean, the premise of Christianity is an ideal, but its practice at the hands of lay people, with their corrupt agendas, has brought us things like the Inquisition, Salem Witch trials, the Crusades, the California Missions, etc. In fact, a brief historical review of the practice of Christianity, in just the many vile wars conducted in its name, will show probably more evil practice than that of most other religions. Yep, not a whole lot to be proud of there!

      • always right

        Kinetic, you’re confusing Christianity with Catholicism. They’re not the same thing. Catholicism is a blend of early Christianity with Roman Paganism. The Cath church spent over 1,000 years trying to wipe out all other forms of Christianity, even ordering the execution en masse’ of the Huguenots (70,000 or so murderer on Papal orders) and trouble makers like Martin Luther, in order to consolidate their power and income as the only “christian” church. They failed. God had other plans. The end result is that true Christianity is still thriving in this nation outside the cath church. The other result is that because of the Catholic church’s Godly stand on homosexuality, homo priests were knowingly planted within that church by homo activists in the 70′s, with the intent to bring down the Catholic church. This is to say that, although the Catholic church is highly flawed it is unfair to blame them for the cho-mo’s per se, only hteir foolish cover-up of same. It is also wildly incorrect to blame Christians, whom the Catholic church attempted to eradicate for over 1,000 years, for the acts of the Romist church

      • libertytrain

        David, those other married ministers frequently make the news in these parts….abusing girls, boys, stealing from their churches, and the like. You can count on a few each year in this little area alone.

      • libertytrain

        always right, I’m pretty sure it was man that had other plans. And it was men that caused the problems you are mentioning.

      • Karolyn

        Always – The Roman Catholic Church was the original christian church, and Catholics are Christians.

      • Deborah

        Wow-you hit the nail on the head. It’s so refreshing to read such an intelligent and well thought out comment.

      • Jay

        The Roman Catholic Church contends that its origin is the death, resurrection, and ascension of Jesus Christ in approximately A.D. 30. The Catholic Church proclaims itself to be the church that Jesus Christ died for, the church that was established and built by the apostles.

        Is that the true origin of the Catholic Church? On the contrary.

        Even a cursory reading of the New Testament will reveal that the Catholic Church does not have its origin in the teachings of Jesus or His apostles. In the New Testament, there is no mention of the papacy, worship/adoration of Mary (or the immaculate conception of Mary, the perpetual virginity of Mary, the assumption of Mary, or Mary as co-redemptrix and mediatrix), petitioning saints in heaven for their prayers, apostolic succession, the ordinances of the church functioning as sacraments, infant baptism, confession of sin to a priest, purgatory, indulgences, or the equal authority of church tradition and Scripture.

        So, if the origin of the Catholic Church is not in the teachings of Jesus and His apostles, as recorded in the New Testament, what is the true origin of the Catholic Church?

      • Joe H.

        to all,
        I can claim to be the ruler of the world, does that make it so? I could claim to be santa clause, does THAT make it true? Just because the people you speak of CLAIM to be Christians does NOT make it so! Being a Christian is in the way you live your life and what’s in your heart, and lastly in your love of Christ Jesus! It is NOT in just saying it and living like satan the rest of your life!

      • Robert Smith

        On its head Bob? Really… How so.

        Every day I see claims about how America is a “christian nation.” Yet when something is wrong it appears you bail on the idea.

        Either it is, or it isn’t. Actually I know it isn’t, and the “sins” are just that, SINS. They aren’t unusually bad for society in general. For example, pot is simply another recreational drug like alcohol is. Yet alcohol destroys lives quietly (usually) and pot has a war going on around it. Why?

        Because some declare pot “immoral.” It is the war that is immoral, yet the fight continues.

        Rob

      • jimmy the greek

        Hell i have been smoking the weed most of my life . The first time i smoked i was 16 it was at work on the night shift i was a helper in the shop of a trucking CO in jersey we were doing the brakes on a trailer and the mechanic i was working with fired one up . I am now 60 still in Trucking and still smoking Fyi I now own a trucking CO Here in Texas .

      • jacob

        Jimmy the Greek :

        How was the saying “Nothing more dangerous than a Greek wearing sneakers”

        So your weed smoking must have cooked your brain already, from the
        way you spelled the word Israel and what you said about it screwing
        who you call “Palestinians”…
        How about the way around instead ??
        Tell me:
        What would you think of your country if it will allow the Mexicans
        to bomb with impunity South Texas and would send terrorists to blow
        up rewstaujrants, ice cream parlors, busess, etc,.

        Then before opening your trap, make sure your cooked up brain is
        engaged, which is what I would younin your shoes

      • jimmy the greek

        (offensive comment removed)

      • Buster the Anatolian

        What is the name of your trucking company?

      • Kate

        Hence you support the drug cartels who bring the drugs into the Country to destroy lives.You should be really proud of yourself ! Alcohol can destroy lives but at least the guy I buy it from didn’t kill pregnant women and decapitate men in Mexico in the ongoing war on drugs. Again next time you light up give yourself a big hug !

      • home boy

        in some states weed grows naturally along the side of the road.

      • Karolyn

        Kate – If there was no war on drugs, these killings wouldn’t be happening.

      • Joe H.

        jimmy the greek,
        I hope your company is local only and not long distance hauling! Why? Because if you believe in working on brakes on a trailer while stoned, I don’t want to be on the same highways with your trucks any more than I would want a stoned pilot flying a jet that I’m a passenger on!!

      • fred morse

        The USA was founded by people who were Christians. They established a secular country with an overlay of Christian values. Today all of that is gone. The US is no longer a nation that is guided by Christian values or principels, The US is now a Pagan nation having rejected God, Christianity and morals.

      • http://yahoo Rickster

        ..so true..and sad because of the great potential we once had in global influence (Lech Walesa, the solidarity leader from Poland was once quoted as saying he was deeply saddened at the losses in demise in American culture in its adoption of a socialist ideology and acknowledged ” we always, at least, had America to look to as an example of democracy” and human values…sadly …no more…

      • Patsy Cochran

        I liked what you said, but I would like to take issue with the way you said it. When someone says that the USA was founded as a Christian nation, that is exactly what they mean. In the very beginning, to hold public office, you had to profess Christianity. Before decisions were made, officials prayed openly as a group before the decision was made. After the constitution was implemented this was no longer true. A profession of faith was no longer required. A lawyer by the name of David Barton has produced several videos based on his search of the archives in Washington DC with these little tidbits of information.

        The constitution itself is based on Biblical truths with most of the decisions based on the Bible. Also, there is nothing in the constitution about separation of church and state. What it does say is that the federal government will make no law respecting an establishment of religion or prohibiting the free practice thereof.

      • Kinetic1

        Patsy,
        David Barton is well known on this site, and to some of us who have studied his work he is known as a charlatan. Yes, many of the early colonies had requirements regarding faith, not just to hold office but to be a member of the colony! The results were often negative, with the Massachusetts colony becoming notorious for its persecution of Christians who were of denominations other than the one accepted by the colony and were therefore deemed heretical. The majority of people who settled America were of European decent and therefore raised Christian, but it does not follow that the nation was therefore a “Christian Nation.”

      • patrick H.T. paine

        “To conquer, first DIVIDE!”

        Slight correction, america was colonized by “persecuted christians”
        and various “sects” of christianity created little ghetto’s here and there……

        Most of our enlightened “daddies” were “deists”…..and if you can equate that to a religion, good luck to you.

        It’s more like…..”gee, I hope there’s a reason for THIS!”

        BTW just in case you missed this…..”My kingdom is NOT of this earth.”

        and then there’s ” As you treat the least of my brethren……”

        Not a whole lot of christianity in AMERICA it would seem.

        But it could just be ME?

        “Do not ask for whom the bell tolls………”

      • Mark

        It’s not Christians that are doing all of the things you are reading about in the news. It’s the left wing liberals that think it’s a good idea to take Christianity out of everything then complain about things going wrong in America. What do you think is going to happen when you remove a moral compass from a society?

      • Karolyn

        Oh, really? So now Christians don’t do anything wrong? Puhleeeze! Such a narrow view. Of course, you neglect the fact that the majority of liberals are probably Christian. Of course, I have no proof of this, only my own experience.

      • Kate

        We will have a society of obamas, holders, reids, pelosis,trumkas,clintons,emanuels,olbermans, schultzes,hoyers, loudmouth waters,jacksons, jackson lees, jarretts…omg!

      • bob wire

        “So I guess Christianity doesn’t work! If this is a Christian nation, that ain’t sayin’ a lot for Christianity.”

        Boy ! they changed the subject on you quick enough Karolyn !! LOL!

        You stated the most obvious! Like WTF!??????

        No , we are not a Christian Nation, not at all. We are a nation full of people that “claim” that they aspire to Christian teaching and values.

        That they have done a very poor job of it, does not seem to matter as there is always forgiveness, a “get out of jail free” card.

        The purpose of the “Get out of Jail Free” card is to avoid the damages in character associated with “Toxic Shame”. Toxic Shame unlike shame is not earned but given undeserving. So,~ you can earn “shame” or you can inherit shame.

        Some Christian will tell us that we are born in sin, that is a form of Toxic Shame, to be born again is suppose to wash the shame away and you are then baptized in Christ. I say horse $hit ~most Christian seem to enjoy making their own hells and make things more confusing then they need to be.

        Mr. Livingston didn’t appreciate you attempting to use this , this “matter” as a “scoring grade” to our Christianity. Thus suggesting you are on your head as usual. I take exception to that as you are not.

        But you are guilty of posting an opening inflammatory statement! Something that Mer. Livingston’s own writers enjoy and are paid to do~ often.

        While you and I both know Christianity does work or to say we don’t question or doubt that it works as we both practice it, live and think it and enjoy the benefits associated with living a life founded in faith. I understood your statement, we are slow to anger and slow to fear as we have surrendered such matters to the Divine.

        But Karolyn, many fail to understand such things while still claiming to be Christians. They are! but yet to come full bloom and become what they wish to be.

        So saying such things as “Christianity does not work” is considered an attack and upsetting as it goes against their beliefs.

        I only wish their faith was a strong as their beliefs. Not only would they understand you and I but they would not live a life full of constant and unrelenting conflict. To be driven by a “some need”, to do and say things that need not be done and said, would disappear.

        I thought your posting was on the button.

        This displace importance people place on sports and people in sports has everyone “SHOCKED”. In a truly Christian environment such things would never come up.

        But we don’t live in a Christian nation or a Christian world.

        Christ is where ever “faithful” Christians are and he clearly was not there in this case.

      • Joe H.

        Karolyn and bob wire,
        first off karolyn, thanks for proving what I and others have said about you. you say that most liberals are christians and then say you have no proof just as you ALWAYS do!!
        bob, you claim things that are a bit outlandish so your agreement with karolyn comes as no suprise to me and I doubt anyone else. you belittle the very thing you claim to be and with that you uncover the lie in your words!!

      • Gay AMERICAN DAN

        Read Jerimiah in the bible and see where God tells israel and the jews THAT THEY MAKE HIM SICK GOING OUT IN THE FEILDS UNDER TREES AND HAVEING SEX, GOD SAIDS I WILL DESTROY U ISRAEL YOU ARE JUST LIKE SODOM AND GAMORRAH YOU COMMIT FORNICATION AND ADULTRY. WHY WOULD LOT LIVE IN A CITY FULL OF HOMOSEXUALS WITH HIS FAMILY, WAS HE A PRO GAY ATTIVIST, IF GOD DESTROYS AMERICA IT WILL MAINLY BE FOR THE 95%OF AMERICANS WHO COMMIT HETEROSEXUALITY AND MOST OF THEM COMMIT IT OUTSIDE OF MARRAIGE AND THEN HAVE ABORTIONS AND MURDER MILLIONS,OF GODS CHILDREN,EACH YEAR, WHY DESTROY AMERICA FOR 5% of the popunlation (GAYS) when we dont,murder babies, CLEAN OUT UR OWN HOME HETEROSEXUALS, THEN U CAN SEE CLEARLY TO CLEAN OUT OUR GAY HOME, AMERICA IS MY COUNTRY AND I AM A REPUBLICAN AND IM PROUD, LETS SAVE AMERICA FROM KING HUSSEIN OBAMA AND THE RADICAL UNGODLY EVIL,DEMOCRATS. DONT USE THE HOLY WORD OF ALMIGHTY GOD TO HATE AND HARM GAY PEOPLE THAT JESUS DIED FOR, IF U DO U WILL SURELY BURN IN HELL FOR GOD IS LOVE AND NO ONE I MEAN NO ONE WHO HATES WILL ENTER HEAVEN, THANK GOD WE GAYS DONT MURDER MILLIONS OF BABIES EACH YEAR THROUGH ABORTION,LIKE U HETEROSEXUALS DO. AMEN

      • Wapitiman

        What did I just read? Is this a joke? I couldn’t write this badly or incoherently if I tried.
        This gives new meaning to the old adage that ‘an empty vessel makes the most noise’!

      • Rick USAF (ret)

        As incoherant as this statement is, there is one line that I made out to essentially say that “the LGBT community is not guilty of killing babies” (i.e. are not guilty of “abortions”). Well duhhhhh! How could they be? They can’t procreate while living their lifestyles. If anything, they are pro-life only because a lot of them want children but can’t produce any of their own so they adopt hence they need the straight people to keeping producing children that they (the straight people) didn’t want anyway.

      • Gay AMERICAN DAN

        Sorry Mr. Livingston, I found my comments, thank u and GOD BLESS U FOR BEING FAIR

      • Gay AMERICAN DAN

        Libertytrain, I made a mistake, im embarresed, sorry I cant spell good yall, I have cancer and feel really bad, GOD BLESS U ALL

      • libertytrain

        Don’t be embarrassed – we all make errors. And I’m so sorry. Please take care of yourself. Goodness, don’t know if this will be any use but I copy this article to all my friends because it seems useful and I’ve read much more about it that makes it sound feasible. Read this one and see if you think it could be of use to you. You have nothing to lose. http://www.personalliberty.com/alternative-medicine/bicarbonate-maple-syrup-cancer-treatment-international-medical-veritas-association/

      • Gay AMERICAN DAN

        bob why did u take my comments off, they are the truth, contact me, thats what cnn did to me, im a conservative, moderate republican gay guy and I should be able to defend gays from hate attacks

      • libertytrain

        Are you sure you’re not talking about the comment of yours just a few above this comment…. Just scroll up a little. Mr. Livingston doesn’t just randomly remove comments unless they are truly foul…

      • Gay AMERICAN DAN

        Christians, true ones, and Americas protection of Israel are the only reason GOD HASNT DESTROYED AMERICA, VOTE King Hussein Obama back to KENYA AND SAVE AMERICA, ALSO CALL 404-827-2600, thats CNN AND GIVE THEM HELL FOR THEIR LIEING LIBERAL BIAS BEFORE THEY DESTORY ANOTHER CONSERVATIVE MODERATE REPUBLICAN, SPREAD CNN’s MAIN NUMBER EVERYWHERE ITS 404_827_2600, lets occupy their phone lines, IM CALLING NOW

      • Joe H.

        Dan,
        I looked up the number you listed, and I will give you credit it is, indeed, CNN.

    • John Scolaro

      Karolyn,

      It is not that Christianity doesn’t work; it’s that Christians aren’t doing the work. Christianity enables all of the freedoms that we enjoy today. However these freedoms cannot be enjoyed or perpetuated if we fail to live proper Christian lives each and every day. You can’t count on someone to do it for you either. It is up to everyone to live honorably individually everyday of the week and twice on Sunday.

      • Robert Smith

        John says: “It is up to everyone to live honorably individually everyday of the week…”

        One doesn’t have to be “christian” for that.

        There are lots of honerable and moral people of all religions and those who don’t have religion.

        It’s the height of huberous and ego to claim that christanity is the only way.

        Rob

      • Buddy

        You’re correct, Rob. I am not a Christian. However, I consider myself highly ethical and moral simply because being such is the best way for me to live. There are many, probably the majority, who follow a very decent path in living. If the majority did otherwise, we collectively couldn’t function.

        Like Livingstone says, it is mostly people in the public’s eyes who screw-up big time. That’s probably a reason that they are in the public’s eyes. They are “news”. I suppose that many of us like to gossip, so that “news” is as much gossip as it is any real news.

        And I go along with Bork. Modern liberalism (progressivism) is the source of our moral decline. And nothing can be done about it because the people in government get their positions of power by appealing to the lowest common denominator. Those lowest common denominator are people who expect entitlements regardless of their contribution. They don’t even follow the communist line of “from each according to his ability” which they like to parrot.

      • 1955thekeeper

        Rob, one of the many things I thank God for is that when I am called to stand before Him, I don’t have to answer for anyone else’s sin but my own. The very last person who possessed the height of hubris, ego, and might I add righteousness to claim that Christianity was the only way was Christ Himself. And we all know the story of how the religious, deeply religious community of the time treated Him. I expect that like myself, Christians world wide struggle daily to stay in the faith and remain steadfast to he fundamental principles of belief in God. Some succumb and stumble while others blossom and prosper in their faith. What I see going on in this world is what Edmund Burke, who, whether you call him an English philosopher or an Irish politician is quoted as saying, “The only thing necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing.” I may be paraphrasing, but you get the meat of his thoughts.

        With secular pressure of today’s society on the individual with the expedient and not necessarily the righteous way of going through life, strains the thin bonds we all espouse to have in our beliefs of God, Jesus, and The Holy Spirit. Basically, the machine we have built for us to live in, our society, is slanted in the direction of moral failure. For some of us God IS the moral compass of life. For others He is only when it is convenient in the framework of their daily lives. Still yet for some, they state that they hold faith in the Holy Trinity, but their actions tell a different story and also there are those people who either decry His non-existence and make no bones about their “faith” that God has never and will never exist for them. And lastly, there are those, and thank God they are not yet in the majority, who acknowledge God’s existence, yet would rather rally around His greatest foe, satan.

        God hates sin, yet loves the sinner. God gave us all free will to either accept or reject Him. If we choose to reject Him through our words or deeds, it makes it impossible for Him to accept us in that final moment before our eternity is decided on.

        Now, you brought up the use of pot as being a “sin.” I know that He wishes for us to adhere to the laws of those He has placed in authority over us. And back in Biblical times He indeed did do just that. But I know of no time in recent history where a group of people have gathered together in His name, now I’m talking on a NATIONAL not individual church level to ask God to place an anointed person over them. Last I checked WE all go to our appointed polling places and decide who we want to decide our fates for the next 4 to 6 years. Money talks while bulls**t walks. If there were lobbyists in Washington for the Association of American Marijuana Growers, (AAMG), well, need I draw the picture any sharper for you. When the acquisition of money overrides all the moral lessons a person has been raised around, that’s where problems arise. Now, place that person in the same temptation situation, but they have been stripped of that up bringing by legislation to be brought up in a God centered moral climate, well there are no decisions which are difficult for them to make. Forget the greater good, forget that which is moral and correct, forget that which is lawful and legal, all I care about is how does it pan out for ME. The prisons are full of people who simply forgot or ignored the moral consequences of their actions.

        All of what has been described here has been going on in the world ever since we were cast out of Eden. It won’t get better in this country or in the world in general until more people turn their lives toward something far greater than their own persons and desires. I say that that greater something is my faith in God. You may not believe as I do and that’s alright. As I have come full circle in this discussion, I don’t have to answer for the sins of any person other than myself. And take it from me, what I have to ask forgiveness for is extensive already and my life is not yet over. Peace be with you and your family.

      • home boy

        here’s a verse from the bible you might enjoy reading . matt 7;21,22,23 not everyone saying to me,lord lord,will enter into the kingdom of the heavens, but the one doing the will of my father who is in the heavens will. many will say to me that day, lord, lord, did we not prophesy in your name , and expel demons in your name, and perform many powerful works in your name? and yet then i will confess to them: i never knew you! get away from me you workers of lawlessness. we live in a world controlled by satan and until he is eliminated , our world world will be corrupt and destructive. you are however on the right road.

      • Patsy Cochran

        Amen. Nuff said

      • Karolyn

        Why is it that it has to be Christian to be moral??? The majority of people are moral, and they’re not all Christians. What’s up with that?

      • Wapitiman

        Christians do not have a ‘hammerlock’ on morality. They do, however have their feet on the road to salvation.

      • 45caliber

        You do not need to be a Christian to be moral. But morality comes primarily from some set of laws. For instance, it was moral for most Indians to rob and murder people from outside their tribe.

        Man cannot live by a set of inborn morals – because these change as the man changes. They can change from moment to moment.

        In our culture, morals are basically set by a Christian background since that was what our country was founded upon. For instance, in the Christian moral set, it is wrong to murder and steal. So we don’t and we teach our children to not do it either. Most religions contain basically the same set of morals with minor changes. Islam is different in that it teaches that it is moral to lie to, rob,and kill anyone who isn’t a member of Islam.

        So while you do not need to be Christian to be moral, the morals we tend to follow here originated from Christian beliefs.

      • Deborah

        Karolyn, one does NOT have to be Christian to be moral. But moral people GET their sense of morality from Biblical principles, either consciously or not. God gives us our consciences, the 10 Commandments are within them. Anyone who completely denies God is either not a moral person, or is fooling himself believing that the source of his higher morals are due to some kind of evolutionary process. If you do not believe in Jesus Christ as the only way to salvation, I pity you. But high morals are taught in the Old Testament too.
        By the way, man is NOT inherently good. You drink the new age koolaid. Man is born to sin, which is why we need a savior to reach God. God cannot dwell with sin. Someday, I pray that you realize the truth before you have to face God with your “theory”!

      • Joe H.

        Deborah,
        THAT I will truly pray for!

      • Karolyn

        I respect your beliefs. I ask that you respect mine as well. And you will notice that I am never the one telling people that if they don’t believe what I do, they will burn in hell. You must feel really bad for the native people who have never been introduced to Christianity, for according to you, they don’t stand a chance! Yes, there are native peoples in South America who have never been visited by “civilization.”

      • Joe H.

        karolyn,
        No, but you ARE the one who ALWAYS belittles what Christians believe in, the BIBLE and any tennet of our religeon you don’t believe in! So please don’t EVEN talk of RESPECT!!!

      • Karolyn

        Joe – What’s good for the goose is good for the gander. How many have belittled my beliefs? As I’ve said, I do respect your beliefs, although I think they are wrong and simplistic. That is my prerogative. It seems that Christians are too sensitive and take themselves too seriously.

    • DanB

      Christianity works. The problem is that we’ve been abandoning it for decades. There have been lots of studies in the past showing the decline in religion in America. I believe there may have been a recent surge in religion in the past few years but some of us wonder if it might be too late to save the nation as a whole. It can take years for the changes we make to change the society….

      We stopped going to church as a nation. At first it seemed to make no difference. Then we started having crooks run government, run our businesses, run our banks, and then after this we wonder why greed has run rampant. Because of the delay between possible cause and effect we don’t connect them. Or perhaps we are self-interested to deny there is a connection. We stopped teaching morals and then wonder why people stop having morals….

      • John Lilleburns ghost

        Th only time christianity worked it was for Lions. This country needs Lions

    • Thor

      Karolyn,

      I hate seeing you get so depressed. It’s all just a strategy called “heaping dirt upon the grave” of those things you most want to bury. One way to measure whether Christianity—or a political candidate—is alive and well or whether it presents a threat is to witness how much dirt is piled on. They did it to Palin. Now they are doing it to Cain—and they will do it to any candidate or belief outside progressive liberalism (which I think we can now safely start referring to as ‘Communism’). A poet once pointed out that one should not heap dirt upon the graves of those you would seek to forget because the pile you raise will forever mark the spot. We seem to have missed the point that the pile of dirt should be viewed as a measure of our success. When are we going to learn that this is what progressives do to everything they fear? They have applied this strategy to Christianity for two centuries now in this country. They are doing it to Herman Cain now. They will do the same to Ron Paul or any other candidate that starts presenting a genuine threat to the liberal cause.

      It is a win-win strategy. In Cain’s case, for example, now his accusers have a face, he can either spend his money defending his honor or he can spend it to get the nomination. If he manages to prove in court that all these people are liars, he loses the nomination by default. If he doesn’t, straight-laced conservatives will cut him loose on moral grounds. What’s not to like if he’s not your candidate? You just managed to marginalize the GOP attempt at black candidate parity.

      This nation was founded upon the principle of religious freedom—by Christian people; but has long since become a secular nation. That is not a reflection on Christianity…it reflects a lack of wisdom on the part of its citizens who remain free to reject it.

      • Susan, remaining humble

        Mr Livingston, At one time I, too, thought one could not legislate morality, but then realized through logic and learning from Dr. Kennedy that, yes, we have. Morally it is wrong to kill, steal, lie, commit adultery, or covet other people’s posessions. There are laws regarding the consequences for killing someone, robbery, perjury, sexual sins, etc. Humans, in our fallen nature, have gravitated to the idea that a “humanistic government” will solve all the issues by passing laws. You are correct in saying that a government can not legislate personal morality, because that is a choice and decison each human makes regarding their world view. One has to chose whether man or “humanism” is the measure of all things. Or is Jesus, God in human form, the Way, the Truth, and Life, as he stated? We are all sinners, but with a conscience and the ability to seek and learn what is true and what is not. Life is a personal responsibility of making decisions and living with the results of them.

      • Karolyn

        Why would you think I’m depressed?

    • http://yahoo Rod

      Yes, though America is a Christian nation, that doesn’t mean that many people in power are Christians. Too many people in power who say they are Christians do not act as Christians. Example: How can a true Christian believe in abortion. The “so-called” Christians hide behind “Woman’s Choice.” Need I say more…….

    • Ellen

      Karolyn, Who do you think went to help all the people affected by the tornadoes in Alabama? Christians provide far more assistance to people in need than the government provides. You may not see it in the news because the liberal media wants to leave religion out of our lives. I think one of the greatest exmples of karma is that the woman who fought to get religion our of our schools was murdered several years later. Moral degrading is rampant in our TV shows and teens are the most impressionable. Three way sex is mentioned on prime time TV regularly, as if everyone does it all the time. Teens believe this and many think it’s normal. Many also believe bisexuality is normal for the same reason. Progressives have certainly damaged our society and they continue to push the envelope at every turn.

      • independant thinker

        “Christians provide far more assistance to people in need than the government provides. You may not see it in the news because the liberal media wants to leave religion out of our lives.”

        While the failure to report that help is true to a large extent nationaly our local news regularly has pieces on various groups with a religious/Christian connection helping others.

      • John Lilleburns ghost

        Amazing in a short paragraph you manage to misunderstand both christianity with your evident pleasure over of a womans murder and Budhism/Hinduism with your erroneous use of the word karma.

      • Rick USAF (ret)

        Ellen, I have to agree with you. I have become so enraged over the progressives efforts to demoralize our youth and to sexualize them. It started out as teaching tolerance of those considered different (whether they were mentally or physically challenged or living an alternative lifestyle – i.e. LGBT) to our children which I didn’t have a problem with. But they went beyond that and started indoctrinating our children that the LGBT lifestyle is normal and perfectly acceptable. This lead children to start to question their own sexuality long before they even reached puberty. But now, they have gone past indoctrination (which went well over the line for me at that point) and now are actually conditioning children to choose alternative lifestyles. A few recent cases in point: 1. some school system out east recently came under fire because they felt they had to teach children as young as 10 and 11 years old about “oral sex with braces, anal sex, beastiality,…” just to name a few topics as part of their sex education program. When the parents challenged the school board and the curriculum they were told that they could keep their children out of class when it dealt with birth control but their children had to attend when all other topics were taught/discussed, 2. A few months ago there was the issue of some school in Mass. that gave a survey to 5th graders pertaining to sexual activity/experience and one of the questions asked was “have you ever performed oral sex?”, 3. On the news just 2 days ago there was a breaking story about a school in Louisianna where the teacher (5th grade again) left the classroom for a several minutes and 4, ultimately 5, students engaged in sexual relations before the whole class. These are just three examples in the past year. First of all, schools have NO business even thinking about broaching the subject of sex education to kids as young as 6, 7, or 8 yrs old (as they are now) and should leave it to the parents to teach their children (when the parents feel the child needs to know – and parents are in the best position of authority for such a determination). Most far leftists will argue that parents aren’t teaching the kids these things so it must fall upon the education system to do so. WRONG!!! And as far as what should be taught when it comes to sex education in the schools is the basics about human anatomy and the reproductive system and even then it should be reserved until 6th or 7th grade. When one starts to teach kids about sex when they are only 7 or 8 yrs old and then include topics like beastiality, anal and oral sex, and same sex relations it is no wonder our children are experimenting with each other long before puberty even has a chance to take hold. Another good case in point is the recent news story about some young boy in (I think) Ohio who wants to join the Girl Scouts because he apparently decided at age 3 or 4 that he wants to live life as a girl and has been dressing like a girl since that age. I believe it is germaine to point out (tho I know the LGBT community would vehemently disagree) that the boy was adopted when he was a baby by two women in a lesbian relationship. Now you have to ask, is it just mere coincidence that the child decided he wanted to be a girl when he was only 3 yrs old? I sincerely don’t think so. But I guess all in all it should be no surprise that the morally depraved in our society would be on such an offensive in recent years when it comes to advocating acceptance of their lifestlyes and, now, apparently not just acceptance but the conversion of our children to their lifestyles. It shouldn’t come as much of a surprise when you consider who the “Education Czar” in the Whitehouse is……Kevin Jennings….a proud and life-long member of NAMBLA (North American Man Boy Love Association) and author of a half dozen or so books with such titles as “the Queering of Our Children”. Then people wonder why there is such moral decay in this country in, especially, recent years.

    • http://testra.com John Hart

      The problem isn’t Christianity it’s the criminalization of sin. Authoritarians imprison sinners, call it justice and do it in the name of Christ. It doesn’t stop the slide into degeneracy it accelerates it but they are blinded by the devil and doing it’s work.

      Sex is God’s greatest gift to man, jailing people for abusing it doesn’t create respect it grows fear. Just as the criminalization of drugs has caused a horrible drug problem, the criminalization of sex has caused a horrible sex problem and led to the murder of millions of children in the womb.

    • James

      Kaarolyn, Today’s Christianity barely resembles the Christianity Jesus started. There’s good reason, if they had followed Christ’s lead they would have been nailed to crosses or otherwise done away with. Christ’s message dealt with politics while today’s religion concentrates on salvation and the hereafter. The Bible says salvation is a gift, that Jesus paid the price for all sin, while modern churches make a business out of attaining it. Jesus said “No man has ascended into heaven” while churches claim all Christians go there.

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