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Filling Up On Stupid

May 11, 2011 by  

Filling Up On Stupid

The next time you pull into a gas station and pull out $100 from your wallet, take a look around. Notice the other vehicles that are sucking up the $4-per-gallon gasoline. My guess is you would be hard-pressed to find a late-model car, truck or SUV that has anything smaller than a 200-horsepower engine.

I know more than half-a-dozen family and friends driving vehicles that punch out a mind-numbing 300 to 500 horsepower. That is a lot of ponies unless you spend your Friday nights down at the local drag strip.

It was not supposed to turn out this way. Thirty-five years ago, I carpooled to the University of Calgary with my best friend Dave. The world had just come off of two OPEC-induced oil shocks and he drove a 1976 Honda Civic. It looked exactly like the car pictured at the top, replete with the tiny fog lights and the canary-yellow paint.

Dave’s Honda had a 91-cubic-inch engine that produced 53 horsepower. For four years, we drove 40 miles round-trip in it. On alternate weeks we took my car, a 1976 Mercury Capri. That was a bit of a hot rod for its day, generating 130 horsepower.

What I remember most about Dave’s Honda is that it got us to class on time, it never broke down and we passed a lot of gas stations. It was to be the wave of the future.

But in the early 1980s, crude-oil prices fell all the way to $12 per barrel. People stopped caring about fuel economy and became obsessed with horsepower and status.

From 1984 through 2010, the fuel economy of new U.S. cars increased… from 27 mpg to 27.5 mpg. Forget the tech revolution. In the past three decades, the average car can now go half a mile farther on a gallon of gasoline.

Source: Wikipedia

 

As a result, it is not hard to understand that demand for gasoline in the U.S. has nearly doubled in the past 35 years.

The Wall Street Journal addressed the issue a year ago with a story which asked: Whatever happened to fuel efficiency? According to the newspaper, “If there is a super fuel-efficient car in your future, then it was built in 1986.”

The Journal pointed out the Environmental Protection Agency’s top 10 list of cars with the best fuel economy in history. According to The Journal: “Many of the best haven’t been available in showrooms for years or even decades.”

“In addition to music, the 1980s were a high point for fuel-efficient cars,” concluded the WSJ. “Even when judged against today’s high-tech hybrids, cars like the 1987 Honda CRX shine.”

The CRX was updated version of my friend Dave’s ’76 Honda Civic. Like that Civic, the CRX was fun, dependable and it got 47 mpg! It turned out nobody wanted it.

The New “Stupid” Car

It almost seems as if Detroit doesn’t even know what the price of gasoline is.

A few weeks ago, Ford announced its newest Mustang, the Shelby Super Snake (try saying that four times in row). In case you are worried about merging onto the interstate, you can take comfort in knowing the Super Snake pumps out 800 horsepower. That is about the same horsepower Japan used in Zero fighters during World War II, and it will catapult today’s new Mustang from zero to 60 in fewer than 4 seconds. If luxury is more your style, you can pick up the Cadillac CTS-V super sedan with its 556-horsepower supercharged engine that gives you a top speed of 190 mph.

With products like these, it is not hard to see how Detroit has been broke and begging Washington for money since Chrysler first got on bended knee in 1980.

The real question is: Why do we ignore all common sense when it comes to things like cars, yet complain when we have to pay so much at the gas pump? (By the way, I don’t exempt myself from these criticisms. My lust for fast cars ended only after I almost killed myself in my 1995 Chevy Camaro. By today’s standards, the Camaro was relatively tame, generating just 275 horsepower and a top speed of only 155 mph.)

It’s the Economy that Needs Turbo-charging

Remember the 1980s when America had a fast economy and slow automobiles? Today, it is the opposite. Unemployment is a chronic problem. Credit is almost gridlocked. And inflation is starting to boil over. A single oil shock — say upheaval in Saudi Arabia — could send the U.S. economy over a cliff.

Even-higher gasoline prices would quickly choke off U.S. consumer spending, the one bright spot in a dull economy. Say gasoline gets above $7 per gallon. In that case, there won’t be much left to spend on clothes, entertainment and even basics like food and mortgages.

That is exactly what happened in the 1970s following two oil embargoes. The price of crude oil rocketed from $3 per barrel to $36 per barrel. Unemployment soared from 4.9 percent in 1973 to 5.6 percent in 1974 and then hit 8.5 percent in 1975. Then, things got bad. As a result, the Dow Jones Industrial Average lost two-thirds of its inflation-adjusted value by 1980.

All this happened just more than a generation ago, yet we Americans continue to make stupid mistakes — from the cars we choose to the leaders we elect.

For example, President Barack Obama wants to spend billions of dollars on new rail systems, new solar-energy power plants and electric cars — most of them built off a blueprint that doesn’t even exist.

My question is: Why don’t we improve our economic prospects by returning to tried-and-true technologies (like fuel-efficient cars) while exploring and developing America’s own fossil fuel reserves, especially those offshore and in Alaska?

The answer comes down to two words: power and corruption. Despite the fact taxpayers keep bailing out Detroit, U.S. automakers could not care less about what is good for the country. They care about padding profits and collecting big bonuses. And you don’t have to be an automotive engineer to see the fat profits in an 800-horsepower muscle car compared to an economy car that gets 50 mpg.

As a nation, we must start making smarter choices because we are running out of chances. When I was going to college in that Honda, the U.S. imported 6 million barrels of crude oil each day. Today, the U.S. imports twice that amount (see chart below). Yet Washington doesn’t bat an eye as Madison Avenue convinces us we cannot possibly be happy unless we have a 300-horsepower V-8 parked in the garage.

 

U.S. Imports of Crude Oil and Petroleum Products (Thousand Barrels per Day)

Through it all, Obama proclaims he wants to rebuild America, make it a Green utopia fabricated from fanciful wishes and borrowed money.

But listen hard and you can almost hear them coming: a mechanized army of Obama electric cars. What a shame when all we needed was to modernize that little yellow Honda and elect some good leaders.

Yours in good times and bad,

John Myers

Editor, Myers’ Energy & Gold Report

John Myers

is editor of Myers’ Energy and Gold Report. The son of C.V. Myers, the original publisher of Oilweek Magazine, John has worked with two of the world’s largest investment publishers, Phillips and Agora. He was the original editor for Outstanding Investments and has more than 20 years experience as an investment writer. John is a graduate of the University of Calgary. He has worked for Prudential Securities in Spokane, Wash., as a registered investment advisor. His office location in Calgary, Alberta, is just minutes away from the headquarters of some of the biggest players in today’s energy markets. This gives him personal access to everyone from oil CEOs to roughnecks, where he learns secrets from oil insiders he passes on to his subscribers. Plus, during his years in Spokane he cultivated a network of relationships with mining insiders in Idaho, Oregon and Washington.

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  • Henry Ledbetter

    I owned a 51 Studebaker that consistantly got 27 mpg with a V/8 engine and overdrive transmission. It was great to drive 540 miles before filling up. They were ahead of their time and so didn’t last. With all the technolagy we have today, it should not be hard to improve fuel milage greatly..

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      Agreed Henry, Problem is when cars were at they’re finest, the elites realized they were too simple for regular folks to repair and were losing money they could readily cash in on, thus regulation & computers took over. Now ya practically have to have a college education to even tune up one of these new fangled cars. Then you have planned obsolescence, on top of it, to keep car manufacturers and parts supply in business. The elites aren’t happy unless they control EVERYTHING!

  • Bill

    This article forgets about the 31mpg mustang. or the hybrid truck escape. Yes there is 400+ horse power mustang and etc. The mustang gt gets 25mpg highway. Also forgets chevy volt! The honda and toyota keeps raising the bar in horse power so detroit must answer. Want the gas price to go down stop buying new SUV from anyone. Detroit is not the only place to buy a gas guzzler.

  • Dad

    As BO’s pastor of 20 years says… god damn America. I am sure, like Michele, he doesn’t like this place much… and it’s showing.

    When this administration took office, the price of gas was under $2 per gallon… now it’s approaching $4/gal. This is of course what his administration set out to do as stated in 2008.

    … and true to their lack of honesty and integrity, they are trying to place the blame everywhere else. Ask yourself, who does this hurt most? This pinko group have no qualms of stepping on the head of “the little guy” to obtain their power.

    Americans are just too self-absorbed or apathetic to recognize the loathing Barack Obama displays for the United States of America.

  • hottrodscars

    Fifteen years ago I bought a 1983 Buick diesel station wagon with the 5.7 diesel engine for $400. With me in it, it weighs 5000 pounds, and it gets 23 mpg in town, and 30 mpg on the road. I have not had any trouble with the engine because I maintain it well. To date, I have not spent over $500 on mechanical repairs. I do any required work myself as I am a mechanic. I would never put my family in an econobox. By the way, if you look at what batteries cost for this new electric car junk, they range from $4000 to $5000 in cost, and the Chevrolet Volt battery is around $8000. The Volt’s electric motor is $10,000 to replace, and that’s what GM pays for them. I figured out the 12.5 amps tapering to 8 amps the Volt draws from your house current, and my electric cost for that would cost more than the fuel I burn per month. Diesel fuel is easily available from coal which we have a lot of. It is old technology, German’s got diesel from coal in World War 2. First thing we need to do is get rid of Obama, and put some limits on the extremists at the EPA which is causing our industries to not be able to compete.

    • Aix Sponsa

      Oh, so you’re the one that got the only good GM diesel car.

  • Bert Cundle

    So many eyes yet can’t see… ( Austriches…) When things look bad, just put your head in the sand as deep as you can! In High School… We Paid $0.25 / Gallon for Ethal. “101 Octain” (With Lead). Smog in L.A. Cal. got so bad that Driving on 5 Freeway, My Eyes Wattered, & Burned so bad that I Couldn’t drive. Un Leaded Gas Went to $0.50 / Gal. To Comply with LAW! Than we encited wars in the M.E. & Evan Got involved in Many of them… Well The Distruction & Changes, Cost $$$,$$$,$$$,$$$. Their income is “OIL”! So they Upped the Price… Our Government Saw that the Price of Oil going up Works for them too. ( MORE TAX $$$,$$$,$$$.) Any one that has any thinking abilities relizes, that Oil has a Lifes end. BUT THE SUN, Seems like having a longer life than Oil. Conserve on Oil, for Lubbracting, Oil will last longer… There is lots of Jobs & $ for Sun, Wind, & other forms of Energy.
    How would you like to have a car that did all you want it to do, From Sun Power With Storage unit. ( I’m to old for it, but… I’d love it!) Don’t wory about the M.E.tiners… There INVESTMENTS are FAR INTO OTHER THINGS, Realestate, Solar, Food Chains, & Department Stores!

  • Louie

    I drive a small Ford Ranger (1987) & it gets good gas mileage…but that’s what I choose to drive & I let everyone else drive what they want. And I don’t try & tell them what to drive, that’s their business. All you people need to get a life & leave people to their own vices…I don’t care what it costs them to fill up…quit trying to tell people what to do…………………………………….
    let the “gas” run out, I don’t give a damn, ok???

    • Bert Cundle

      I’m with You… I Have 2, Ford Couriers… The Problem with the new cars… They are “FOREGINERS”, Made here! People have NO LOYALITY, to our COUNTRY!

      • http://WeThePeople Jean

        My 2000 Firebird – the engine was made in Canada – the other engine parts were made in Mexico. And Yes that was the first LEMON I have ever owned.

      • Dan az

        Jean
        You forgot that japan makes the computers!
        The only cars made now in the USA is toyota,Honda and a few others that are considered overseas the fact that chevy Ford and others are made outside the US is apparently hard for people to digest.I cant wait for the new chineese made chevy I’ll bet the head lights will be slanted.

      • Aix Sponsa

        Those who decide to absolutely “buy only American”, period, will be naked, cold, and gnawing on tree bark pretty damn soon.

      • 45caliber

        Exactly. We did and could now feed the world – but the government wants the farms cut back. Control of food.

  • Wayne Leathers

    Brazil can sell the USA alcohol at about $1.00/gal but we charge them $.57 import tax. Why not charge $.57/gal import tax on oil? We could probably balance the national budget and slow down the money going to our enemies!

    Who are we kidding we keep electing thieves to office!

    What elected official has said, we need to cut all spending by 5% and I will start with my salary and that of my staff!?!

  • http://aol.com sean murrey

    i will keep my old car 1995 ford.

  • Les

    The electric car is a joke. In order for it to be practical it has to have a range above 1000 miles and not take 8-16 hours to recharge. Alternative fuels are a lot more expensive per unit cost. That’s why we drive gas powered cars. The stupidity comes from people that drive vehicles like SUVs because they can afford them. This is a very selfish attitude considering the fact you are burning our fuels at 2 to 3 times the rate of people trying to make a difference. We can’t afford you. We also don’t appreciate the fact that you use those jacked up vehicles to intimidate those of us that don’t drive them. The good news is gas is going to 5+ a gallon and most of you will not be able to pump $12,000 per year into you tank.

    I’m a motorhead, I own lots of cars, but my daily driver is an Eagle Talon with 220,000 miles on it and gets 30+ mpg daily and 38.5 during a full highway trip. And guess what, it’s fun to drive except for the jerks that insist on driving over me in their SUVs and Pickups. This will all self-correct, just like it did for Rome.

    • Wayne

      Is it lonely up there in your ivory tower looking down your nose at us who don’t comform to the way you live, don’t drive what you drive. There is only one person who is impressed with the fact you drive a car with 220,000 miles and get 30 mpg and that’s you.

      • Eddie47d

        Les is wise and efficient. He enjoys his vehicles and takes care of them which should be a conservative principle. Apparently there aren’t very many real conservatives on this site.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Oh, eddie for God’s sake get over yourself, like your a conservative__That too is laughable!!!

      • Eddie47d

        You know better than that Angel but we use to depend on conservatives to have high economic principles and morality. Now they have neither.

      • JeffH

        Angel Wannabe, 47D think’s he more like a “Libertarian” if you can phathom that.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Jeffh, more like LIBBER-tarian! :)

      • Eddie47d

        I’ll accept that even if it was kind of a weak remark. Now is that like being a CON servative. See ya later.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        eddie, Oh my God the Great OZ has Spoken! Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain…..

      • Carlucci

        Eddie47 – we can really do without the condescending attitude and lectures. Yawn….

      • Eddie47d

        Then don’t encourage your fellow travelers.

    • Cliffystones

      Another phenomenon I haven’t seen mentioned. Back in 2008 there was suddenly a glut of used SUVs that people unloaded because gas hit $4. Then in the ensuing months I heard news reports to the effect that sales for larger vehicles and SUVs were up. Not I guess those same folks who can;t do math will again be trading in those SUVs and spending thousands of dollars to save hundreds of dollars at the pump.

      Lie Ron White says “You can’t fix stupid”.

    • 45caliber

      Les:

      There used to be vehicles out that would carry at least five people and usually six. Station wagons would sometimes go to eight people. But now the ONLY choices other than a full sized van is an SUV or a four door pickup. If you have more than four in your family, you need something bigger or you have to drive TWO cars – which immediately eats up the gas savings with a smaller car. It takes even more room for smaller children here in Texas since they require them to be in child restraint seats. No one is allowed to hold a child on their laps any more. (And don’t claim that it is safer that way. We know it. I also know that if it was as dangerous as they make it out to be, none of us would be alive.)

      On top of that, the SUVs are better built and therefore safer to drive. Take a look at the accidents between a big car and a little one. The little one gets the worst of it every time. I prefer the big one simply for that reason – although the only big one I have now is a pickup I need for hauling.

      • Les

        So for safety reasons we should all be driving dump trucks cause we all know who loses when hit by one. Reminds me of the News commentator that stated he drove and H2 hummer because he could afford it. Glad everyone can afford to use up all the resources at 2 and 3 times what should be the normal rate. Just gets us to the end a lot quicker.

  • American Overseas

    Manners. Civility. Respect. I do not really like the job our president is doing. However he is our president. We must respect and honor him.
    I am sure that some of you who write crudely of him would not speak so in person.
    I was surprised by some of my Democratic friends during the Bush years. They hated Bush. Now, it seems the shoe is on the other foot and many Republicans hate Obama. As I said, I do not like the job he is doing, but I do not hate the man.
    He is the president. If you do not like the job he is doing, then come 2012, vote him out of office. Until then you should speak about him with the respect the office demands.
    I believe it is fine to disagree with his decisions and to say so. But to use derogatory terms to describe him is sad.

    • http://aol.com sean murrey

      He maybe your president but he is not mine.

      • wasadoc

        Sean–Hear! Hear!–He has given us absolutely nothing to respect, except lies and more lies. And I would ask that “ya’ll” please do not confuse me with the other “doc”.

      • Carlucci

        Dear American Overseas: – FYI – I respect people only if they deserve my respect. I could give a rat’s patootie about their “title” and/or “position”. If you are truly living overseas, you have no idea what is going on here. I lived overseas myself for several years and wasn’t really savvy to the goings on here, except that my parents and friends kept telling me to stay where we were and make as much tax free money as we could.

        The last thing I need is a lecture from people like you. MYOB.

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      American Overseas__I repsect the office, nothing more! When Obama does something to deserve my respect, he will get it. Up until now, he has done nothing but destroy!

      • Thamera

        Exactly Angel…respect has to be earned…

    • Cliffystones

      Like Angel, I respect the office. But the way he speaks to the American People who disagree with him, I’m sorry but any respect I had at the beginning of his term he’s managed to prove unworthy of. Like the smart-assed comments he made yesterday in El Paso. If he were just another guy and talked to me in person like that he’d be a candidate for a knuckle sandwich (and no I wouldn’t unless he struck first, but the thought would cross my mind).

      Obama the person, is by no means a leader, a unifier or “Presidential” He speaks like an adolescent punk, not the leader of the free world.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Cliffystones, Obama = Chicago Thugery at it’s finest!!!

    • Eddie47d

      What did you find out A. O.? That is as good as it get’s whether anti-Bush or Obama. Civility was yesteryear.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        eddie, if ya don’t like us calling you commander and thief names, email him, and tell him the butter spreads both ways on the bread. He talks down to us as if he’s King Obama, he only wishes!!!

      • Carlucci

        “commander and thief”….good one!

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        :)

    • Aix Sponsa

      I bought that speile for Bill, but no way for the zero.

  • pennsyltuckian

    For most of us it comes down to practicality and pleasure. I will not spend a fortune on a new PoS econobox and give up my 12 year old, no payment BMW. It is good for about 24 mpg if I am careful and I drive under 5000 miles per year. The payback for any econobox PoS would be well past my lifespan no matter what the mileage, even a pure electric car. Far better to pay an extra $40/month for gas than have a $300 car payment, even at $10/gal like Europe.

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      Pennsyltuckian, Its true what it comes down to is lifestyle. If you live on a farm I doubt that electric truck is going haul hay or livestock around.__On another note_Our neighbor has one of those new “matchbox” cars, it pulled out in front of someone with a mattress tied to the roof. I said to my husband, if that little car had that matress on it, all it would take is a good gust of wind to become air borne. The little cars may save gas, but aren’t practical. Hence the question remains are you really saving money, if you buy one of those little cars, and then have to pay delivery charges or pay someone else to haul an item that’s bigger than your car?

    • rockland pirate

      you are right on that point. I’m not making any car payments, so paying the extra $120 is not like making a car payment.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        rockland pirate, we’re not making payments either.Our 93 minivan looks like hell, but works just fine!

        On another note, I think this gas hike is being done for two reasons, one to pay for the oil spill damages in the Gulf, and two, to push electric and “supposed” more fuel efficient cars of today. The economy is down, so not many folks are buying new cars either.

      • Kinetic1

        Angel,
        Why isn’t anyone on this site talking about speculators? In the old days only people in the oil business traded in oil futures and the prices were based on projected supply and demand. Now we have people who wouldn’t know what to do with a barrel of oil driving the price up over and over again based not on their future needs, but on what they believe they can drive the value up to and make a profit. Let’s change the rules to require that any purchases require the delivery of the product and see what happens. The cost of storing 1,000 barrels of oil ought to take the profit out of speculating.

    • Aix Sponsa

      AMEN, logic wins everytime.

  • Barry Nall

    first, horsepower and fuel economy are not always antithetical to each other. A lot of the horsepower boom in the 80s was generated from technology used to boost fuel economy and lower emissions. (Electronic Fuel Injection) The main culprit is the size of the vehicle.

    As our fuel management technology has increased, so has the weight of our vehicles. In the mid 1990s, I had a crappy 1987 Mercury Lynx. I bought it from a friend with 45,000 miles, and 3 years, and just a clutch and brake jobe later, it through the timing belt and bent a lot of valves at 80,000 miles. In between those events, I got an honest 40-45 mph. In 1995, with $1.20 gas, my weekly commute was a whopping $15.00

    Can Fords comparable cars of today get close to that? Close, maybe. They are heavier, because of crash standards, and they are larger with more wind drag.

    I blame both consumers, automakers and the Federal Government. Europe has a plethora of small, high mph cars that don’t transision to the US because of various regulatory agencies. If there was more constant demand for efficient cars we might see them. Case in point – small turbo diesel cars. Typically, in the US market this means VW. and even these are porkier and less fuel efficient than Euro versions. If people purchased VW turbo diesels to the exclusion of other small cars, than Detroit would respond. (The diesel pickup market is large)

    You want 50 MPG? Can you live with a Geo Metro type vehicle? (I’m talking size, not necessarily quality.)

  • pete0097

    By the way, I have built a car that gets 26 mpg, goes 100 mph in the 1/4 mile in 14 seconds, has a top end around 170 mph and I built it for $2500. It is dependable, and only weighs 2700 pounds, hence the fuel economy and performance. Also consider the Dodge Charger. The 69 (best looking car ever) weighed around 3500 pounds, the new one (not bad looking) weighs around 4500 pounds. Put the new driveline into the old car will probably net higher fuel economy than either car could hope for.

    • Cliffystones

      I had a 68 Charger R/T. 440 V8, automatic. That bad boy would burn rubber from a standstill for a good 50-75 feet and the engine was on it’s last dying breath! It was a very, very lightweight car compared to the 73 Malibu I also owned at the time but what fun!

    • Aix Sponsa

      ‘Cuse me? 4500? Your scale is defective. My 69 LOADED up big block street charger weighs 3950 on calibrated electronic scales. Now, this new Challenger weighs 4400 on the same scales.

  • Lucille Atwater

    First I don’t believe we are out of oil or are going to be in the next couple hundred years even if we still live comfortably. Second I believe we should be reasonably conservative, not purposely wasteful in use of energy. With this in mind I have to say that maybe there are people who don’t like hondas, maybe there are people who like to travel in comfort. My son has nine children, They will not fit in a Honda. I know there are those who will say nine children is too many but that is and should remain a personal decision. Then rural people have to get to work where their are no buses trains or even carpools available. I know there is the idea we should all have to live in cities and pile ourselves a little higher with resulting loss of community and rise in crime that again is a personal decision. the oil prices right now are not due to a shortage of oil or any threat there there will at any time soon be a shortage of fuel. Prices are manufactured by our government to control our choices. Big Uncle is always watching and increasing his power over our lives. Did not the great Uncle, himself, say we are too warm in the winter and too cool in the summer and eat too well? He is using his power to take care of that. Let the wind blow and the sun shine and let development go ahead but those things are not any where near ready to supply us the power we need so in the meantime open American oil fields and bring the prices down, down, down. I drive a 1990 diesel Jetta which gets 40 miles a gallon and I feel oppressed by these gas prices. I have friends and neighbors who heat with oil and many of them have turned their thermostats down so I have to keep my coat and boots on when I visit them. This is not about economy, it is about social control.

    • Jennie

      I know we are not out of oil. The president just refuses to allow anyone to drill for it (unless it is on private property). I am sorry one of the auto makers has not designed a vehicle which would be large enough for your son and his family and also fuel efficient. That would be a win/win situation . . . the auto manufacturer would make a lot of money and your son could save a lot. I live in a rural area and make a 63 mile round trip to work five days a week. . . total mileage for a week 318+ miles. Believe me, I am sympathetic.

      • Jennie

        And, by the way, I drive a Honda AccentGT hatchback.

    • Don

      Lucille, You hit the nail right on the head, this whole oil thing is bs, even the oil well in the gulf i think was staged to shut down all oil drilling in the states and here in Alaska, we need to rid our selves of this administration in 2012, lets take this country back and vote in some people who will do the right thing, we are loosing are freedoms people !!

      • Aix Sponsa

        Grab your butt with both hands. We’re stuck with this jerk administration for another 6 years… by then it will be too late.

      • Lewis Munn

        Just what makes you think you will really have a vote in 2012?

        Obama can shut down voting, declare himself the winner by executive decree, and what will you do about it? Or he can bring in the union Electricians like some others have done to be sure of a win! Computers do as they are programmed, regardless of the truth.

  • Jennie

    I feel sorry for all those people who are driving gas guzzlers. My car is a 2005 two-door hatchback with a 5 speed standard transmission that gets 40+ miles to the gallon. I have gotten as much as 44 mpg. They are out there if you look for them.

    • Nadzieja Batki

      Who aked you to feel sorry for anyone? People buy the vehicle they need.

      • http://WeThePeople Jean

        Heh – he probably has to drive at the speed of 35 MPH to get that – and these people need to drive in the median with a tall red flourescent flag attached to the roof. When the Prius first came out they gave a outstanding MP gallon – the only thing was that it was never road tested. I think that he is just too embarresed to tell the truth. Bragg some where else

      • Eddie47d

        Prius gets 51/48 mpg.(4 cyl) Still very impressive even if it’s a little less which all vehicles seem to do less than advertised.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        eddie, Oooo a fricken’ Prius!

      • Dan az

        Eddie
        The prius is a toyota echo with a generator that only runs in the city.The echo which I have gets 47 mpg even at 110 mph.Its because of the vvti cam that’s it can.The prius has the additional weight of the generator and the batteries to carry around and no one has gotten better than 35 mpg with it where I live.They also have the problem of 18 computers that cost on the average of 1800 apiece which constantly give up after about 5000 miles.I pass up prius’s all the time going up a 6% grade the best they seem to do is 65 on a 75 highway and yes I speed because I pass them at 110 just before the rev limiter kick’s in.I also have 375000 miles on my 01 and still drives like new.The prius cost at the time 20,000 and the echo cost 12,000 and will go 500,000 easy.They quit making them after four yrs because they didn’t break.I still haven’t had to do anything to it yet.It has a timing chain rather than a belt.the prius has a belt which needs to be replaced every 50,000 miles at the cost of 600 dollars.Built in obsolescence!

      • Aix Sponsa

        My friend is on Prius #4. None got better than 41 anywhere, anytime. He’s satisfied, just as I am with my TownCar.

      • Aix Sponsa

        One of my best friends has a 06 Carolla stick shift he bought new. He regularly claims 40-42 mpg. When we go someplace, he only gets 32. Guess it is my extra 170 lbs. LOL……. facts are MOST people are clueless as to what mileage they ACTUALLY get. If they find out the truth, they lie to save face because they hate to admit that their little toy car only gets a couple mpg more than the largest passenger car manufactured in North America.

      • Aix Sponsa

        Let me clarify: On this same 300 mile trip his Corolla gets 32, my TC gets 25. He uses 2.62 gallons less than me. That’s less than $10 difference. Consider reality. Should someone spend $25,000 to buy a smaller car to save a few hundred bucks a year?

      • Thamera

        No it doesn’t Eddie. I don’t know where you are getting your information from, but Prius tops out at 44 mpg under perfect driving conditions that according to the latest report from Consumer Reports.

      • Eddie47d

        As I said most car companies advertise higher mileage than what they actually get. 44 mpg is still impressive and few today can top that but I wish they could.

      • Dan az

        Eddiee
        Buy an echo from 2000 to 2004 they are on the market for about 3500 with 70,000 on them.trust me they just broke in the rings and will go the whole 500,000.

      • Dan az

        Oh I all most forgot they are made in Virgina by your friends the union.
        I did work the parts back counter at toyota for a couple of years so if you don’t believe me your loss.

  • pete0097

    Basicall, we have two government agencies working against each other and both against us, sort of. One is the EPA. they just want to have clean air. They charge us to test our cars so that the percentage of pollutants is below a required level (not realistic as that percentage is the same whether the pollutant comes from a car getting 30 mpg or 5 mpg.) The other is the NTSB. They want us to be protected from our poor driving habits with heavy, very durable cars. This has cause our cars to become very heavy versus the 80′s. A Neon went from 2600 pounds to 3500 pounds (GM and Ford did the same) so we could be better protected. The European, Asian countries decided that for the sake of saving fuel (market driven)they have kept cars lighter. The people know that they are not as safe, but with good driving habits including 1. better trained, 2. less road rage, 3. harsher penalties. They know that if they cut off a big truck, they will get smashed. Solution, stay away from them. They have ultimately better and safer roads and cleaner air.

    • Nadzieja Batki

      Sorry to contradict but the highest highway fatalities are in Asia and Europe. They just don’t make a fuss over anyone if they get killed or injured.

      • Eddie47d

        Saudi Arabia has the highest road fatalities in the world. They love speed and most deaths come from running red lights. Maybe they are color blind. 1/3 of all hospital patients there are from auto accidents. They also love drag racing and not with camels anymore.

      • Carlucci

        There is no speed limit in Saudi Arabia, and if you are a native, you don’t need a license to drive. Kids as young as 12 can drive there (males only – women cannot drive). And then there is Yemen, where everyone drives around high on Gat, which is a leaf they chew. It’s kind of like cocaine.

      • Cawmun Cents

        Nothing like the smell of Nitro Methane in the morning!N.H.R.A.Dragracing….speed limit 350 mph

    • Cliffystones

      Pete,

      So true! This mileage thing is more complicated than “Sherman Tanks vs Motorized Roller Skates”.

      I like John’s mention of the Capri. My friends older sister had one of those. In 1977 6 bucks would fill it up and we could drive forever, or so it seemed.

      Something not mentioned that I remember is how those shows like “Entertainment Tonight” and “Access Hollywood” used to do feature stories on the celebs who were trading in their Mercedes and Limos on huge, gadget-packed SUVs. These stories accelerated their popularity in the early 90s IMO. And those same limousine liberals now chastise us little people for following their gas guzzling trends.

      And why the argument over Civics vs Excursions anyway? The problem as I see it is the 5’2″. 120lb blond chick with her 5’6″ 150lb hubby and their 2 preschool kids who live in West Los Angeles and commute 12 miles one way but STILL make excuses about why they NEED that Excursion. Then they bitch and moan when it now costs $150 to fill it up.

      I’m 6’3″, 210lbs, so I tend to need a little leg room. I drive a CRV as I have only occasional need for more, which my small trailer usually covers. But I completely see the need for larger vehicles, especially trucks in many circumstances. And no way will electric motors and batteries ever replace those big boys in our lifetime.

      • Aix Sponsa

        Geez, I remember regular gas for 27 cents……… trouble is, I was making $1 hr. Good union jobs paid $2.20….. so today gas should cost how much? 7 bucks?

    • Thamera

      Are you kidding Pete? Have you ever been to Europe? How about driving through Italy or on the autoban in Germany? No road rage? No aggression? You sir could not be more WRONG! Driving through Europe was a harrowing experience whether on a bus or in our car!

  • TIME

    We have a Mazda Midia for running around town it gets about 28 MPG, but when on the HWY she still is near that amount at no more than 32 MPG, she is way below 200 HP.

    Thats odd when you think that our 2000 740 IL BMW gets around town 19-21 MPG – yet on the HWY an easy 29-30 MPG and we have gotten even better on long trips as high as 34 MPG when the CC is set at 75 MPH.
    As 90% of her time is on HYW driving, she is a big 8 with well over 350 hp.

    The Porsche gets around town 17-21 MPG, HWY she will hit an easy
    30 MPG. And yes she is pumping an easy 300 HP.

    A lot of folks don’t take care of their cars as in keep them clean, to avoid wind drag, keep the oil in all venues changed tranny etc., tires at the right air levels, and or tire’s that’s cut drag.
    Also always keeping your car tuned up. As well as alignment’s done. Also driving by way of proper methods aid’s in higher MPG too.

    So you need not have a box to drive, just take care of what you have.

    We as a nation went wrong back in the 1970′s we built cars and BIG TRUCKS, then in the 1980′s built BIGGER TRUCKS, then in the 90′s even BIGGER TRUCKS, and we still are building MEGA TRUCKS.
    Folks TRUCKS have a rotten wind drag, making them use as much as 50% more Gas. Then add in the mass of weight and thats why most trucks rate in the less than 15 MPG range top end.

    And on that note Electric cars are not the answer, thats totaly absurd by any standards of rational thinking.
    Go check out the cost of the Carbon Energy unit, aka the battery.
    As well what do you think these carbon energy units will cost to dispose of?

    As in how much ground pollution will they create?

    Just a quick question how much ground POLLUTION do you all think 6 million cell phone battery’s per month are creating?
    Or that many Computer Battery’s?
    Or the melimine resin plastic’s to make the shells of these units? Let alone the waste materials from making these units in production?

    • rockland pirate

      Nobody wants to answer the questions you just asked until it’s a huge problem.

      • TIME

        Rock,

        I know and how sad is that?
        We know a couple who bought one of the special electirc cars a Volt only to have the battery starting to die in just 18 months.
        To get a new one was just a $6000.00 ticket; ~ OTD.

        When they asked what do you do with these battery’s the answer was we recycle. When pushed to buy a recycled battery, the answer was well they get recycled into a “Land Fill” so you can’t buy one of them.
        WOW ~ all that toxic waste and why is that again?

        So what happens when we have 3 million cars on the road that have these special battery’s?

    • MJ Montana

      Time, you are exaggerating again, at least on your “old” Bimmer and its horsepower. Google the 2000 BMW 740il:
      Engine: 32-valve, 4.4-litre V-8 Horsepower: 282 h.p. @ 5,700 rpm
      Torque: 324 lb.-ft.@ 3,700 rpm Transmission: 5-speed automatic

      • TIME

        Well MJ, Thats a 100% stock car would it not be?

        Did I say ours was 100% stock BRO? No, BRO not quite, not a single car we own is 100% stock. So perhap you should be a tad less of an ASS when you make stupid a POST, perhaps ask a question rather than make an ASS~umption out of yourself.

        But thanks for displaying that your good at finding trivia about 100% stock items. GOOD ON YA BRO. So other than looking at details have you ever owned a BMW?

        Let me just tell you a tad about BMW’s.

        They are the “BEST made cars” in the world bar non.

        We were hit at well over 70 MPH from the rear when were were at a dead stop.
        We walked away with out even a single scratch. Not one single window was broken and other than her tail that was crushed as well as some side dings from being bounced about she still was running. Yes the car was totaled.
        We were hit by a “GMC SURBAN” that was also Totaled and couldn’t even be moved, by the way the GMC’s air bags failed deploy.

      • MJ Montana

        Okay,

        First of all you can be a revisionist all you want and say how you hot-rodded you decade old Bimmer to push out more than 350 hp (which I seriously doubt). And you can say I don’t know anything because I make ass-umptions. You just made one. I have owned a 318i, a 525i and a 530i so I probably know as much or more about the BMWs as you do.

        But this you can’t escape; that you have a “big 8″. Sorry “bro”, it is four litres or 244 cubic inches. Your big 8 is a little more than half the engine size of the Lincolns people were driving in the ’70s which was a 460 cubic inch V8s.

        Are you going to write back and tell me you also bored out your “little” V-8 as well and that I made another ass-umption?

      • TIME

        Well MJ,

        Wowie for you,
        I can’t even count all the cars I have owned over the last 40 plus years, perhaps 50 or more. Heres a start; 3, BMW 5′s one of we gave to our kid who’s at school. 3, BMW 7′s.
        My first BMW was 2002 model 2 door with stick way back in 1974, that was back when I even had a Lotus Europa as well as a brand new TVR with the Massive 8, and a 74 XKE 12, and all at the same time.

        I have also owned a 63, 66, 68, and 72 Corvette’s.
        Also a 68 BRG XKE, and even XJS 12 too I had three of these beast.
        I am one of the few who has ever owned a “REAL 1964 Ferrari 250 GTO,” I even owned a 1968 Shelby Cobra GT 500.
        Yea BRO, your right I know nothing about car’s.

        Hey BRO you know what saddly all the noted cars its even a drop in the bucket of cars I have owned since 1968 when I new BRG TR 6.
        So whats your point BRO?

        You can question what ever makes your little mind feel good.
        But in the end I stand by what I posted rather you like it or not.

      • MJ Montana

        You owned all those “fantastic” cars and you still don’t know that a 4 litre is a small V-8?

        You must either be stupid or a liar.

        In case you are telling the truth then “my” real name is “Jackie Stewart.” I won 27 Formula 1 races and oh by the way, the hired help drove the 5 Series BMWs that I mentioned.

        Get over yourself. The point of making comments is to be insightful and not simply brag about how rich you are, all the Ferraris and Vetts you have owned, or how you scored in the top 5 percent of Mensa.

      • TIME

        MJ,
        I can see why your not anywhere near mensa level. You try and conform everything to your thinking when you don’t have ANY base facts at your disposal. Really quite normal for people with “very low IQ’s” who can’t grasp much of anything other than LITTLE BOX’S.

        First off we bought the car done up the way it is, as well it was done by the former owner who was speed nut. So no we didn’t hopp up a 10 year old car, as well we have owned it for 9 years now and oddly it’s not even broken 80K yet.

        Be that as it may ~ BRO, the car has been Turbo Charged, as well has up graded headers, the gears were reworked, let alone upgraded anti sway bars added, up graded wheels Tires and brakes, as well as many other upgrades that lend to at least 350 HP, as well the ability to handle the upgrade in HP, so Master Jackie Montana now I have explained it to you can you get back in your tight little box BRO?

        I hear mensa is looking for a coffee boy, perhaps thats a job you can handle.

      • MJ Montana

        I hear more bragging.

        Oh by the way, Mr. Mensa, you certainly have a lot of typos in your comments. For example you write about your Mazda “Midia”.

        Mazda didn’t make a Midia but they did make a Miata.

        While you are at it you should get the guy that sold you your 244 cubic inch 740il to turbo-charge your brain.

        Please write back and tell me what an accomplished author you are; that I have too limited intelligence “BRO”, to understand such a complex mind. I have a running bet you will.

  • DMS

    In 2002, the REPUBLICAN BUSH administration sued the California Air Resource Board and won; Ford, GM, Honda, Toyota electric cars were immediately destroyed and replaced with gas guzzlers (kinda like Building 7). You know one deceitful way the Bushes made there filthy lucre$$$$$ – oil.
    Should you watch Who Killed the Electric Car,
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39K36Rw7LYc
    you will realize the technology has been around for 30 or more years.
    Know that Stan Meyer mysteriously died of food poisoning before he was able to get his proven water car to the market.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vyYEfRqjcgg
    Joseph Newman has tried to get a patent for his energy machine which produces more output energy than input, but the patent office will not give him one: either his drawings are not accurate enough or his description is physically impossible.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJXst04Lswk
    GE was given a patent for Newman’s pump technology, but still no patent for the Newman Generator.
    The TRUTH is out there – you just have to have eyes to see and ears to here, what happened to Building 7 is what is happening to these technologies. Hopefully the Hopi prophecy will come to pass, and we as truthers will choose a better way!

  • rockland pirate

    I do own a SUV, and it’s the ridiculous statements that they ONLY get 6-10 in city driving and 15 miles on the highway that perpetuate the continuous lie. I get 15 city and 20 highway. True, not even close to 30-45 miles per gallon but with 5 people you sure travel in a hell of a lot more comfort than in a Honda Civic for family vacations ranging from Cooperstown, Ny to Pompano Beach, Fl. And it is still cheaper to drive to these places than to fly and rent a car. And that SUV has saved us with it’s all wheel drive capacity in the winter. I also use it to haul trash barrels of horse manure, and have moved furniture with it. I don’t think trash barrels can even stand upright in a car….so my SUV is a practical thing to own.
    Yes, I do agree that we need to weed ourselves from oil consumption, but please don’t blame it on the SUV.

    • libertytrain

      I have to agree with much of what you pointed out. It’s tough to get around the mountain in the winter here, without the 4 wheel drive capability of the SUV.

    • Christin

      rockland,
      We, too, own a new SUV purhcased last summer for our family of four, driving and hauling, and making long treks to our farm from town and now the grocery stores many miles away as we have moved to our country property. My spouse has a small truck and can haul things that can be outside even if it rains, but is tight for all of us to ride… my two boys are getting really big. My Honda Accord died and I have been driving a mini-van since my oldest was six months old. The van has been great with lots of room, but was not the best for the long journeys and awful driving on the rocky county roads and bumpy terrain here in the country. So my spouse purchased a SUV so we could pull things on the back, haul three coolers of food to our farm from stores far away, and be safe driving long distances in strong winds on the road. A purchase of necessity and an enjoyable ride as well.

      America just needs to rise up get the rest of the public on the band wagon and force our Stupid Gov’t TO DRILL FOR OIL and GAS in our own country.

      I think maybe many of you are NOT aware that we use ‘crude oil’ for many products such as: gasoline, diesel, jet fuel, heating oil, and natural gas. It is also an ingredient for the manufacture of chemicals, fertilizer, plastics, synthetic fibers (fabric), rubber and even the everyday products such as: petroleum jelly, ink, crayons, bubble gum, dishwashing liquids and deodorants.
      JUST WAIT FOR ‘A L L’ the prices to rise on those products…

      It seems… even though ‘Global Warming’ has been debunked with alarmists lieing and falsifying documents & research and ‘Going Green’ has been proven a job loser and failed product causing those countries to lose money and not save the environment at all… that many ‘sheeple people’ are still ignorant to those facts and unwilling to listen to stand for using our natural resources of oil, gas, and coal to help our nation be energy independant and prosper.

      • jibbs

        Diesel is a by-product of making gasoline, on so are lot of other oil based products,

    • jibbs

      My F-350 7.3L diesel gets 18mpg and 15mpg pulling about 7000lbs. of weight for a total of about 13 to 14000lbs. I just beat the pants off your SUV, do the math.

      • Dan az

        Hey jibbs
        I have a Dodge diesel that gets 21mpg in the city and 23 on the highway 17mpg’s when towing 17000 pounds and dont plan on getting rid of it either.You can store diesel and make your own with veggy oil.I’m keeping an eye on veggy oil in the stores when it becomes lower than diesel.

      • kodster5

        Dan, what about recycled veggy oil? Look at celebs like Jimmy Buffett who stop at places like McDonald’s, where they put their used fry oil in containers to be picked up by waste handlers. Jimmy, and others like him, use it to run their RVs and tour buses, because they’ve converted them over to it. I’ve heard stories from Jimmy himself doing this. It’s a great idea, to recycle.

  • MASON

    Automobiles are much more efficient than they were in the 1970′s. But even with the present MPG averages of 27.5 mpg, we are back to square one on having enough fuel supplies. This is because we are beholding to foreign oil producers that are taking full advantage of us. We are facing again what our self representing representives were supposed to address nearly 40 years ago — being self sufficient. The cost of getting rid of that present day gas hog is going to be high. Dealers are already raising the price of small cars, while lowering the trade-in values of big cars.

    Our moble society is almost irreversibly locked into having personal transportation — expecially in small venues. The larger cities still have some public transportation. Finding a solution to our massive fuel usage is going to be a steep mountain to climb.

    I offer my solution in 3 parts. Drive as little as possible, and impeach this Marxist President for high crimes and misdemeanors, which he and his henchmen have definitely commited. Then, DRILL BABY DRILL!!!

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      Mason, Hear, Hear!

  • Mitchell Ennis

    You city people really are a joke. Our idiot president say’s check you tires and get a tuneup. That jackass and all you others need to stop flying around in your jets. You use more fuel in one trip than my town uses in a month. All these little aircraft run 100 octane LEADED GAS. No pollution devices at all. Jets take off from everyy major airport in this country every 3-5 minutes full or not. Jets use highly refine kerosine which is very expensive and a wasteful process to produce.
    So city boy come out your little nest with your honda civic and try to drive on one of our roads. Take a look at the safety rating of your wonderous little peice of junk. Drive in 2 foot of snow with them.

    We have plenty of oil reserves and the environment will always be polluted regardless of any mode of transportation.

    Whats running you electric trains and cars. Where is the electricity coming from???? Think about it, it comes from a power plant run by coil or natural gas.

    Fill up on stupid, well Mr. Myers to use a phrase from Forrest Gump, “stupid is as stupid does”

    • Dan az

      stupid is as stupid does”
      That fits your comment,The fact is kerosene is just one step above diesel 2 and is the cheapest thing to produce.That must be why the cost is the highest at the pumps jack ass.By the way I would put a front wheel drive car up against any four wheel drive in the snow or the mud and bet pink slips that I would get there first.BTW I live up 7 miles up a dirt road and get three feet of snow to boot.Want to bet?

      • Aix Sponsa

        pretty obvious that you don’t know anything about what jet fuel is. It is NOT what it was 20 years ago. EPA schtuff and all.

      • Kinetic1

        I’m with ya Dan. There’s a reason you see all those VW Golfs driving around Switzerland. And if you just have to have 4WD, my old Subaru used to just glide over the snow.

      • Mitchell Ennis

        Highly refined kerosine ding ding, costs more to produce get it. There has not been one front wheel drive car that can make it up my driveway when it snows many have tried. Then again any idiot knows that four wheel drive is better in the snow. Go take a pill and call a doctor in the morning, meathead.

    • jibbs

      Avgas grades are defined primarily by their octane rating. Two ratings are applied to aviation gasolines (the lean mixture rating and the rich mixture rating) which results in a multiple numbering system e.g. Avgas 100/130 (in this case the lean mixture performance rating is 100 and the rich mixture rating is 130).

      In the past, there were many different grades of aviation gasoline in general use e.g. 80/87, 91/96, 100/130,108/135 and 115/145. However, with decreasing demand these have been rationalised down to one principle grade, Avgas 100/130. (To avoid confusion and to attempt to eliminate errors in handling aviation gasoline, it is common practice to designate the grade by just the lean mixture performance, i.e. Avgas 100/130 becomes Avgas 100). More recently, an additional grade was introduced to allow one fuel to be used in engines originally designed for grades with lower lead contents: this grade is called Avgas 100LL, the LL standing for ‘low lead’.

      All equipment and facilities handling avgas are color coded and display prominently the API markings denoting the actual grade carried. Currently the two major grades in use internationally are Avgas 100LL and Avgas 100. To ease identification the fuels are dyed; for example Avgas 100LL is colored blue, while Avgas 100 is colored green.

      Avgas fuelling nozzles for overwing dispensing are painted red. To help prevent the possibility of jet fuel being supplied to a piston engine aircraft, the nozzle of an Avgas fueller is limited to a maximum diameter of (internationally) 40 mm (49 mm in U.S.A) and the aperture on an aircraft Avgas tank to a maximum of 60 mm diameter. Nozzles for Jet A-1 are larger than 60 mm and thus cannot be placed into an aircraft’s Avgas tank.

      Jet A is a similar kerosene type of fuel, produced to an ASTM specification and normally only available in the U.S.A. It has the same flash point as Jet A-1 but a higher freeze point maximum (-40°C). It is supplied against the ASTM D1655 (Jet A) specification.

      • Dan az

        Thanks jibbs
        Sounds like they only put antifreeze in the jet fuel.We use it in the trucks in the winter time for easier starting.

  • Insurgent

    How can people who can barely afford high gas prices be able to go out and buy a new fuel efficient car, pay all the registration fees, pay higher insurance rates, and pay the higher property taxes?

    Buckwheat says, “Get used to it.” He does not pay for any fuel for his vehicles or jet trips. The American taxpayer pays his bills.
    What an embarrassment he is to the White House !!!!!!!!!!!

    • Bob G

      Amen brother.

    • Doc Sarvis

      “Buckwheat”!!! Another racist comment I’ve too often noticed on the pages of this site.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Doc, if ya don’t like it then leave, it ain’t rocket science! :)

      • Doc Sarvis

        That would be a quitter’s way out. Another trait of an unAmerican individual you seem to like to promote. I am not a quitter.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        doc, if your trying to be a comedian, don’t quit your day job.

      • http://naver samurai

        No one is asking you to quit, just fade away into the sunset. FOR GOD AND COUNTRY!

      • Doc Sarvis

        If folks on this site don’t regulate racist communication here and elsewhere, then conservatives/tea party people will continue to earn that label.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Doc, thats the difference between Liberal & Conservative, we believe in Freedom of speech across the board, you Liberals only believe in it when the when majority agrees with you. BTW, I saw no racial slurs, your just trying to start trouble.

      • Bob G

        I’ve got your unamerican racism right here doc.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Bob G, LMAO!!!

      • jibbs

        Well, don’t go away mad, just go away.

      • Dan az

        That’s just what I needed a good laugh,Thanks guys!

      • Thamera

        What “racist communication” would that be Doc LMAO! For you to even make that statement is clear that you don’t even know what racism is – there is a new label for you Doc – “Racer”. People that cry “racism” when they are losing an argument or can’t think of anything better to say. LMAO – you are pathetic.

      • Raggs

        Doc is just mad because you left out Zira… :)

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Raggs LOL!

      • Doc Sarvis

        I’m not surprised so many of you find racisim so funny.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Doc, Nothing in life is fair Doc I found that out at 7 when I started taking care my sick Mother, get over it. You Politically Correct Nutz act like everythings “Not Fair” and has to be to your liking__EGADS!!Talk to someone, who REALLY know just how bad life can be. Being called a racist slur isn’t nothing compared to some curves life can really throw ya!! How’s ’bout a LiL’ Cheese with that Whine?

      • Lewis Munn

        I didn’t see any racism when I read it, and it is still hard after rereading it.

        I think it takes a dedicated racist to really find all these “intentional slurs” in ordinary conversation!

      • Carlucci

        What does “Buckwheat” mean to you, doc sarvis? Where I come from, it can mean a person from the country, like a hick. I used to go to school with a family of kids with the last name of “Wheat”. The oldest boy and his dad went by “Buck Wheat” – “Buck” was their nickname. Then there were our neighbors the Corns – Pat and Bill. Guess what their nicknames were? “Pop” and “Bull”.

        Like a typical libtard, you are reading the term “Buckwheat” as negative. I guess you thought Eddie Murphy’s hilarious portrayal of Buckwheat was “racist”. Someone as self righteous as you are probably doesn’t have many friends, or if you do, they are most likely as boring…

      • Kinetic1

        Carlucci,
        To most under the age of say 40, Buckwheat is a reference to the Eddie Murphy sketch. To those of us who have been around it is clearly a reference to the old “Our Gang” comedies and the character Buckwheat. By today’s standards, the Buckwheat character was a racial stereotype of a simple minded yet sweet black. He was part of the group, but they made it clear through his speech and his actions that he was not as bright as the white kids. How can you or anyone else on this site truly defend the description of our President as Buckwheat and claim with a straight face that it was not racially motivated?

      • Eddie47d

        They can’t and they won’t.

      • Carlucci

        Kinetic – you will just never get it. I’ve heard people called much worse names than “Buckwheat”. And who said Our Gang’s Buckwheat was “simple minded”? You did! Personally, I thought he and Stymie were darling. I really only liked three kids on that show – Spanky, Buckwheat, and Stymie. I guess you have forgotten that there were white kids on that show who portrayed simpletons. Alfalfa is a good example.

        You know, I’m sure you might be a nice person, but I would really appreciate it if you would stop with the condescending and insipid lectures.

      • American Patriot

        OK! From now on we will call him SAMBO. And, That seem to fit him better anyway.

      • Lewis Munn

        Hey, maybe you are right! Obama doesn’t seem to know that printing “funny money”s by the trillion leads to runawey inflation.

        He doesn’t see the fallacies in Global Warming claims, especially since the sun is building up into a hot cycle now, from what astronomers have said, or that Mars is also warming up, without man’s efforts!

        He has to read his speeches, cannot learn them and say what needs to be said on his own.

        You might have a real point; he might be described as the character “Buckwheat” so long ago was cast. Likeable, but a bit slow. No teleprompter in Buckwheat’s day tho!

        Good thinking.

      • karolyn

        Oh, come on, Carlucci. You know very well how the term is usd in this context, and it’s not the first time I’ve heard Obama referred to in this way on this site.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Karolyn_ yeah and I’ve heard of some Blacks refer to us as crackers, so whats the point?__

        I have friend who’s a staunch Jew, he stutters terribly, but sings like a bird, I call him the Jewish Rapper!
        Get off the name calling bit for God’s sake, that’s for kindergarders or better yet, just ignore it.

      • Carlucci

        karolyn – see my comments above to Kinetic. BTW – I’m an equal opportunity offender when it comes to D.C. You should have heard what I used to call the Bushes.

        Correct me if I’m wrong, but I think we still have freedom of opinion and speech in this nation.

    • Cliffystones

      Stop insulting Buckwheat! He was a cool dude. Call BHO what he really is, The Antichrist!

      • Christin

        Cliff,

        Nah, BHO is probably not that important or high on the evil scale… to get the name of Anti-Christ. Oh… he’s evil all right, but I would call him more of “Barack the Burner” … kind of like the Good ‘John the Baptist’ came before Jesus did and laid the way for him to come on the scene, obamy comes before and lays the way for the evil Anti-Christ to come and ruins things beyond repair.

      • jibbs

        @ Christin…….Barack the Burner, I like that! lmao, thats funny.

      • Raggs

        Beg your pardon Christin… The definition of an anti christ is one that is not for Christ…. This is around 80% of the worlds population!

      • Christin

        Raggs,

        Not all non-believers are as evil as the Liar in Chief.

        The Anti-Christ is the one who is ‘against Christ’, but he tries to impersonate him for a time and is the opposite of Christ. The Anti-Christ can NOT save anybody, only destroy them.

        “Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.”
        Matthew 7: 13-14 [Bible]

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        cliffystones, we get referred to as “Crackers” all the time, if I got p*ssed every time I heard that so called slur from across the street, I’d need an umbrella!

      • Eddie47d

        I didn’t think you had a funny bone in your body Angel. That was a good one although Doc was right. Obama insults are a dime a dozen on this site and with inflation those insults are now worth .20.

      • Raggs

        Ed.. here you go again… No one is insulting obama, we are just telling the truth!.. Can’t handle it? Go away!

      • Eddie47d

        Raggs; You and Jeff think you’ll get a bigger award for the most insults you throw at Obama. I think you are up to about 50 and Jeff is slightly lagging behind. Then again he’s always had a lagging Be Hind. LOL Yes Jeff I see your next insult below and they are plentiful.

      • JeffH

        …and well deserved I might add…

      • Cliffystones

        When I worked in L.A. with 90% Hispanics (not all of whom were bone-headed progressives), I would simply tell them “I’m just a White Dude with an attitude”

      • JeffH

        Angel Wannabe, as you can see by his followup comment, 47D is still a mindless troll.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Jeffh, yes and damn I didn’t hardly get my line in the water!;)

      • Raggs

        Did you have enough time to bait the hook?

      • JeffH

        Raggs & Angel, that moron has a permanently affixed hook.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Raggs___ I baited the hook with a cracker!_lol

  • Anthony

    Okay – Here’s the deal …

    1. Recently, Stan Meyer was poisoned, and died, upon leaving the Pentagon. They were attempting to sign a deal where the Millitary would begin to use his new technology. You do realize it’s possible to run your car on water, yes?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a74uarqap2E

    2. Going back in time – there’s this, about a Nikola Tesla invention
    http://presscore.ca/2011/?p=91

    3. Here’s more evidence and discussion on the Water Fuel Secret —
    http://pesn.com/2011/05/9501821_10x_Attempted_Murder_Survivor_Mr_X_to_Reveal_Water_Fuel_Secret/

    Now, it’s up to you, but this nonsense of defending the status quo as if your own Government & this Countries’ Corporations would never lie to you… is something all need to quit doing.

    It’s as bad as the Cancer discussion where mutliple cures are now out there, but the TV simply doesn’t have time to tell America about it…

    Here’s another extended video of a guy running his Truck in much the same way. And, no, this is not fuel assist, with some add-on that was viral a couple of years ago … this is the real deal.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4yuN3pl7Vwk&NR=1

    You can search Stanley Meyer and come up with much much more. In fact, I believe one guy is selling the designs for only $47.

    • Cliffystones

      Buy a set of those plans, set it up, and let us know how it works out for you :) .

      • Lewis Munn

        Or buy me a set of plans, and finance me for the needed items, and I will make a full report on my old truck.

        I am retired, so have time, and was in engineering so feel I can do a good job.

        Just cannot afford to on SS, as Obama drives my outgo out the roof. Be glad to report back fully, even with pics.

    • Cliffystones

      Ok with regard to the Tesla thing, maybe he did do something wonderful (he was brilliant IMO) but the explanation the author of the article gives is pure, unadulterated BS!

      An amplifier, be it vacuum tube, transistor or IC doesn’t actually “amplify” anything. An amplifier uses a small source voltage (microphone, tuner, cd player etc.) to control, or “modulate” a larger supply voltage. The output of the amplifier is a larger, but (theoretically) exact replica of the input source. But you need a source of DC voltage like a battery or ac to dc power supply to provide the larger source voltage to be modulated. Nothing coming out of a guitar amp (the author’s example) is magically “made bigger” or “amplified”. The guitar’s small output is being used to modulate the supply dc voltage to an exact replica of the guitars signal, only larger DUE TO the larger DC voltage supplied. Kind of like those “Pantographs ” where you could insert 2 pencils and write with one and the other would duplicate your movements. I think they have those for routers in woodworking as well, but that’s the basic idea.

      As far as the big “water” secret, if these folks have had as many attempts on their lives as claimed, why not just use the Internet to spread the “secret” to everyone? Load up a bunch of thumb drives and leave them laying around public places. Take them to public PCs at libraries and other places and upload the content all over the web. No it’s easier to set up a web site and charge some amount of money, like the powers that be would never be able to track them down that way,NOT!

  • Doc Sarvis

    Oil is a dying mode of energy. We need to wise up and move to alternatives. And the market/industry, as a whole, is stuck-not investing in our country’s future.

    • Pete

      Their were many alternatives. The US government killed them off when they bailed out GM.

      Personally, I wanted to buy a TATA Nano car for under 3 grand ! It’s a very well built low cost car for getting around, made in India. If Obama hadn’t bailed out the bankrupt domestic auto industry , the Indians and Chinese car manufacturers would have filled the vacum ! I sure would like to buy a new car ! But i’m not going into debt for a crappy car from rip em off GM ….

      I’m driving a 1994 Geo Prizm my brother gave me about a decade ago. I fill her up once every 3 weeks. I almost cried last night when it cost 40 bucks and some change fill up my gas tank !

      If you own a house, and have a garage, you should build your own electric car. You can convert a small used car to electric in your spare time ! Put up some solar cells to charge the batteries ….

      Let’s face it – Obama will probably be re-elected – so no cheap energy for anybody ! Might as well get our hand dirty and start converting cars to electric….

      • vagabond

        Pete how many cars have you converted to electricity? how much does it cost to convert one?

      • http://aol Bill

        Building an electric car is simple. Buy a small fiberglas sports car body from an aftermarket company like the old Devin body that I used. Weld up a simple box frame, and used golf cart motor and electronics. With enough lightening, larger wheels, you can get about 40 MPH and 25 mile range. I used a “Harbor Frieght” solar panel glassed in where the trunk is, and got a 45 watt charge for a few extra miles when not plugged in at home.

      • John Sullivan

        I converted a 1995 Geo Tracker to an electric. The cost was about $7000.
        It uses 12 lead acid deep cycle marine batteries to get 144 volts. I bought the parts form EV America (http://www.evamerica.com/). All the conversion parts were made in the US although the donor car was not (but it was free to me). The conversion vehicle of choice is a Chevy S10 pickup with the Colorado’s coming in second. I plug it in for pennies a day and it get’s me the five miles to and from work and the shopping center with no problem. It does take some handyman skills to do a conversion and I had a shop do the welding I needed.

      • Pete

        Vagabond,

        Seems like a good idea, but I haven’t converted any to electric .. yet. I reckon it’s going to be a necessity because of high gas prices.

        Now this article has me thinking. I figure I’m going to have to get myself a house with a garage and a arc welder from Wal Mart … and get going. Put up some solar panels ….

        I went to a foreclosure auction and the house smelled like dog pee ! Then the bank out bid everyone and bought the house ! Darn Federal government ! Why did they bail out them banks ??? It just causes prices to go up on foreclosures. Just like on gas ! The government bails out gas guzzling Detroit and then doesn’t let anybody drill …..

      • DavidL

        Pete:
        I’m in the market for a new car, and I recently drove a couple of GM cars. I can assure you that they are not crappy as you say.They are very nice.

        I had a couple of friends in the 70′s who owned electric cars. They just plugged them in at home. They loved them. They paid nothing for gasoline.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Davel, well ya either ya pay at the pump or in your electric bill.

      • Bob G

        I like you kid.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Bob G, LOL!

      • Christin

        I love the title… “Filling Up on Stupid”… thanks John Meyers. Good article.

        I say ‘Drill baby Drill’ the natural God given resources we have right here in America and CUT OFF O.P.E.C. (redistribution of wealth), now!

      • jibbs

        and you need fossil fuel to supply the electric..and some of the solar panel parts are made from petrolium.

      • Kinetic1

        Angel,
        “…well ya either ya pay at the pump or in your electric bill.” Yes, but the cost of electricity is much less and you save a fortune in maintenance with an electric. no oil, no coolant, no exhaust system, and the list goes on. It’s one of the reasons that the auto manufacturers prefer hybrids. They make a fortune on maintaining their cars and much of that would go right out the window with electrics.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Kinectic, Yeah the cost of electric RIGHT NOW would be more efficient for electric cars, But you just wait til’ ya get several humdred thousand cars hooked up, and see how much we’ll all be paying?!!

      • http://marcum1@wildblue.net coal miner

        Pete:
        I’m in the market for a new car, and I recently drove a couple of GM cars. I can assure you that they are not crappy as you say.They are very nice.

        I had a couple of friends in the 70′s who owned electric cars. They just plugged them in at home. They loved them. They paid nothing for gasoline.

        David,

        Aren’t those cars kind of expensive? Most people can’t afford them.

      • Pete

        My Geo Prizm almost has 200,000 miles on it. But it’s a Toyota clone. Original engine, still working !

      • AttilaTheHun

        It’s all well and good to say we should use electric cars. However, the first law of thermodynamics says that you don’t get something for nothing. The energy used to run an electric car has to come from somewhere. That somewhere is the electric power grid, which is primarily fed by coal plants.

        Now if we can get the green thugs to let us build more coal plants I might be interested in talking about electric cars. Otherwise, it’s a non-starter.

        As an unrelated thought, I believe that one of the most serious threats to our national security is from Iran (North Korea, Libya,…) launching a small nuke into the upper atmosphere from a ship and causing an electromagnetic pulse (EMP). An EMP occurring off the eastern seaboard will very likely knock out the power grid for the entire eastern half of the country and kill significant portion of anything electrical. I’d hate to have my car dependent upon the same utilities.

      • http://aol Bill

        WRONG! You have hundreds of square feet of roof on your garage that could charge your car as fast as plugging it in. A two car roof gives enough area to give 3,000 watts of power free, after installation of course.

      • Bob G

        We get maybe 30 cloudless days a year here where I’m at Billy boy.

      • jibbs

        Nothing is free, what about maint. and the cost of those panels are $$$$

      • Kinetic1

        You’d be surprised how well modern solar panels can work on a cloudy day.

      • Steelhead

        You are actually referring to the second law of thermodynamics, which is concerned with entropy. One easy way to remember the laws of thermodynamics is the way we learned it in engineering school. First law is you get what you pay for. Second law is there’s no free lunch.

      • AttilaTheHun

        I suppose you are right in that regard. I was thinking more in terms of the energy having to come from somewhere and the first law is the energy balance.

        As for Bill’s 3 KW, one gallon of gas is worth about 114,000 BTUs and a KW-H of electricity is worth about 3413 BTUs, so a gallon of gas is equivalent to ~33 KW-H of electricity. Bill’s 3 KW of sunlight (it’s rained for over a month here in the midwest) for say, ten hours a day are equivalent to 3KW * 10 hours / 33 KW-H/gal = 0.9 gal of gas. Assuming that you actually get 40 MPG, that means that you can drive 36 miles on one “fillup”. That’s also assuming that you’ll do it at NIGHT, because you have to have your car charging during the day, unless you come up with another energy storage medium. No thanks.

      • Pete

        Attila,

        I figger that the “suburban home” of the future will be built on 5 acre lots, instead of these 1/2 acre to 1/4 acre lots they use today. Most people will probably have a small solar farm ( a solar “garden” ?) on their property.

        Your gonna need two of them battery packs, maybe just two electric cars. One is being charged and one is being used. One thing that is holding all this back is zoning laws and high taxes on land ! Fix that and your in business !

      • Pete

        Just bury a real long cable into the ground … that will generate some electricity ! I guess it comes down to how much land you have ….

      • Kinetic1

        Attila,
        If you have a modern car it won’t matter. Your car’s computer system will be affected and you’ll be just as bad off as if your car were electric.

      • pete

        I was wondering if an “EMP” can damage/destroy a solar panel ??

      • Christin

        Pete,

        Electric car… Really is better than gasoline? And what will happen to all the people who own, have converted their car, and must drive this ‘electric car’ to work, school, errands and vacations when BHO’s plan “will cause the price to necessarily SKY ROCKET?”

      • Pete

        Christin,

        I’m not worried about other people to much, I’m just worried about myself. Other people can do what they want .

        I sure would love to get one of them TATA Nanos ! For under 3 grand a car, I could buy two and convert one to electric !! Put it all on a “credit card” ……. Darn Detroit ! Obama should have just let them DIE (go bankrupt)…

        Now I got to spend over 10 grand for a new car !!!! I became a tight wad a few months ago … makes me want to cry !!!!

      • Christin

        Pete,

        I hear ya.

        What’s a ‘TATA Nanos’?

        I think Americans should care about other Americans, especially Conservatives who want America to suceed with Freedom and Prosperity… just a though, Pete.

      • Pete

        Christin,

        It’s a golf cart sized, low cost, new car I can afford … here’s the wiki link

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tata_Nano

      • Cawmun Cents

        Ever notice the POTUS is in bed with Genital Electric?!I wonder why…hmmmmm.

      • JeffH

        OOPS!

      • Omawazzi

        You said:
        Obama will probably be re-elected – so no cheap energy for anybody ! Might as well get our hand dirty and start converting cars to electric….

        Do you think that if the Republican Party (Gas & Oil Party) comes into control in 2012 they will turn to electric cheaper made cars???
        You can’t be serious and if you are serious, you gotta be dreaming.

      • Pete

        Omawazzi,

        I’m just trying to “adapt” to the “Energy Crisis”. I ‘m gonna have to use what is available.

      • Aix Sponsa

        A gasoline/ water (hydrogen) hybrid is the best way. It’s simple, easy, and done correctly, it works. I know that mileage increases of 50% are real.
        Laugh and ridicule if you want. I couldn’t care less about your financial plight.

      • DaveH

        If we could get the Government out of our marketplace, people would invest in viable technologies, and the consumers would buy the ones that made the most sense. Some that sounded good on paper would fall by the wayside and others would succeed. That is the most efficient way to improve our society.
        As it stands now, Government is wasting a lot of our money on unproven pipe-dreams that sound good to voters, but in reality don’t deliver. If a technology is indeed viable, the marketplace will accept it and the companies that produce it will profit. Government only steps in (with taxpayer money) when the people with good sense won’t invest their own money in the effort.

      • Christin

        Aix Sponsa,
        Is that relly true… water and gasoline?

        I’d like to see some web sites discussing that.

        And Dave H. so true, again…
        Get gov out of the way and we could do what we do best with the Free-market… the tried and true (sell and make profits) or fail (and go away) or try again to better your idea.

        America Inginuity! (stifled with micro-managing BIG gov)

      • Pete

        Yo dude, whatever works !!!

        Just get a still going then get your car all liquered up ! That will fix it ..

    • http://! Angel Wannabe

      Brilliant Doc, then ya better get your azz in gear and figure out a way to convert, weedwackers, lawn mowers, tractors, chain saws, home heating oil, wood chippers, tractor-trailers, farm equipment, dump trucks, delivery vehicles, four wheelers, motorcycles, logging equipment, ocean liners, barges, sea-dos, ski-dos, boat motors, ANY & ALL plastics,fans, the list is endless …….You don’t quit gas/oil consumption, unless you have a full arsenal that is the equivalent or better, than what is available now__AND THERE ISN’T ANYTHING ANYWHERE!
      Just for shytes and giggles, I can see a Tractor-trailer pulling tandem, running on wind, solar or electric power, that’s just laughable!_lol

      • Doc Sarvis

        An unAmerican approach if ever I heard one. You just want to give up and say it can’t be done. Talk about “brilliant”. You propose to leave your head in the sand-do nothing as the world burns through our oil at an ever increasing rate.

        I know that America can lick this challenge of moving beyond oil as our primary energy source AND using all energy we do have much more efficiently. We can lead the world if we choose to. THAT is a realistic American perspective. I didn’t say it would be easy but true Americans would be up to the challenge.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Doc, Un American Doc really?__Who are you trying to kid here?__The only reason you gave that answer is you have nothing else to counter it with!__

        There is nothing really to discuss, all this so-called search for alternative energy is already in place and have been for some time. The GUV is using our corn supply to produce ethanol, hence corn prices on the rise…Then ya have Wind and Solar Power, Bio Fuels and on and on__ C’mon Bud, Get a Grip. I don’t care what ingenious scheme the GUV comes up with, it going to take a hell of a lot more time to convert everything we use on a daily basis, that’s made with oil, into something that’s going to work as well or better!_Right now, there is nothing!!!

      • wasadoc

        The answer is actually right under our nose, but those in DC don’t want us to do it. We are sitting on “proven oil reserves”. We need to drill and build refineries. Then after that is setup, we need to start looking at “VIABLE” alternatives. Spain and a few other foreign countries have proven that the wind stuff doesn’t work. It costs much more than it saves. Thirteen yrs ago, Pres Clinton said that if we started drilling and building, it would take ten yrs for it to be operational. Following that thinking, we would have been operational 3 yrs ago. A month ago, obama made almost word for word the same speech. They do not want us to drill. The environmentalists are the ones who are holding this country back, yet they have no problem using oil, themselves. It doesn’t take much of a degree to figure out that if we started drilling and building today, the Arabs would drop their prices, hoping we would quit.

      • kodster5

        EXACTLY, wasadoc! And surprisingly, look at what the so-called environmentalists drive? LOL! Do you think they drive economical cars? Nope! They have their Prius-hybrids that they show off, but look what they have in their garages… that gas-guzzling SUV that they refuse to give up… and don’t need, because they live in an urban area. Get them out here in the rural area, where the nearest decent-sized grocery story is over an hour away, and those big SUVs and trucks are the ones used, because they can haul big loads. Most of the folks out here in rural America only drive into areas where they stock up for up to a month at a time, so they don’t drive those vehicles and waste fuel.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Doc, why don’t realize all of this “Green” and “Clean” energy is nothing more than a Governmental money making scheme, it’s so poorly managed, that the scientist the GUV paid to lie about the Global Warming couldn’t even do that right, and got caught lying. Why do you think this gas hike is anything different??_-As I said above there was a massive oil spill in the Gulf, the oil giants paid alot out in damages, don’t ya think this is a re-coup of funds???

      • Eddie47d

        How do you know someone is an environmentalist strictly on the car they drive? Most environmentalists I know do drive fuel efficient cars and some do own SUVs. They also ski and do alot of camping which requires plenty of room for gear. Not much different for guys in the construction trade who need larger trucks for their loads. I do see plenty of SUVs without a scratch on them and always clean as a whistle. Status does seem to play a role in what a person drives not fuel efficiency. Those who do drive a Prius seem to get it. 55,000 of those babies were bought in 2010 irregardless of those minor accelerator problems. My Dodge still gets 22/27 mpg and I’m looking for another vehicle that get’s at least 30-32. I know this country can do even better than that so I keep searching.

      • Pete

        Angel Wannabe,

        You make some good points, but Doc Sarvis point is we got to think “outside the box” ….

        You got these ultra technological elites flying around in them UFO/Saucers. Us frank n beans little guys have just get going and “innovate” …..

        We still should drill, drill, drill for more oil and mine all that coal !

        The best policy is to FREEDOM from government interference – so a individual can chose his own energy technology, be it oil, coal, solar or “Mr. Fusion” like in the movie “Back to the Future” !!!

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        wasadoc, well said, the earth continually reproduces it’s own oil, the only challenge is, finding it.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Pete, I get it_ok!__I could care less if they build electric cars or matchstix, my point is, ya don’t start pulling off on oil, until there is substantial evidence that there is another form of energy, that is just as good or better. THERE IS NOTHING BETTER THAN OIL! It affects every aspect of our daily life, from gas to hand lotion!

        new forms of energies are being worked on continually, I say let them do it, but don’t FORCE US to comply through regulation or making it mandatory, like they did Obamacare.__If ya let these do-gooders keep taking away more and more of our freedoms we’ll have nothing.YA GOTTA WISE UP!

        When the GUV says’ “That something is good for us, you can bet your azz, its only good for THEM!

      • Bob G

        Angel, you have your head screwed on right.
        Doc, your’s is up your ass.

      • Al Sieber

        Good one Bob G, I’ve been telling Doc that for a long time. I think he’s a doctor of Proctology.

      • CJ

        This is why the debate gets stuck. Pie-in-the-sky idealists who’s only thought is “I hate oil” think they can wish us into spending Billions to replace something that currently costs Millions. People think short-sitedly with their pocket book and won’t pay $100 grand to replace a car costing them $2000 extra a year, but will complain all the way, hoping someone else will foot the bill. I doubt women will give up their pantyhose and farmers can’t force land to produce more than it’s capable of without the fertilizers from oil. It’s not as simple as the simple minded would hope. All the money spent by government comes from OUR pockets. ALL OF IT! They take it by tax or inflation. So, how much of the bill are you willing to cover? And don’t give me the “save the environment” argument. You give up your polluting gas car for an electric one that polluts through the coal burning electric plant. Get real.

      • Marty S.

        Thats right CJ they are going to jump all over the dollars to get to the quarters as far as alternative energy is concerned. Soros is tied into that scam too. If the price of gasoline keeps climbing people will just drive less and eventually vote Oilbummer out of office when the time comes. I dont think there are a lot of happy voting age and above drivers out there despite his recent spike in approval ratings. He wants the highest gas prices possible to basically shut down the petroleum industry and get people to buy that Chevy Volt or use some pathetic fast train system. Its all about control of the people not saving the planet. What a waste of time.

      • DaveH

        Exactly, Marty and CJ. Here is strong evidence for that:
        http://mises.org/daily/5217/Happy-Mother-Earth-Day-Citizen

      • kodster5

        Doc, you don’t get it… you didn’t read Angel’s comment… did you see ALL the things listed? You just don’t realize just how much of our lives revolve around petroleum products, NOT JUST GASOLINE! We will never wean ourselves off oil 100%. Even the microwave sitting in your kitchen uses products made out of petroleum.

        John’s article has the answer in it, but Obama (and his puppet handlers) won’t let us use it! We have more than enough domestic oil right here in the US, if we’re allowed to get to it, to get us away from foreign oil (just like Jimmy Carter’s administration promised us, but never followed through, and I graduated from high school during that administration, my father lost his job in that economy downturn, etc., so I remember it well). I live in a state that straddles the largest oil field in the US, and they’re saying it will last for the next 20-30 years just to get it out, let alone use it all. They’ve also discovered another, even larger, oil field on the eastern side of the Rockies! But the administration won’t let us extract it, and the environmentalists won’t give in. THEY are the ones strangling us! (Oh, and btw, I don’t want ANYONE here start blaming the Israelis for our oil shortages! I don’t want to hear anyone blaming them for any of our woes… now or in the future… because they import their oil from outside, too… our problems are self-inflicted!)

      • Eddie47d

        “our problems are self inflicted”! Well said, I have never heard of anyone say we will ever be free of oil. Not on the left or the right! That is a weak argument and made up talking point. The issue is being wise and efficient in our energy use which is a point everyone can agree on.

      • ValDM

        Kod,
        Glad you brouht up this issue about “oil independence”. Let’s see what oil is in these days : plastics , hand/body lotion , hand/body soaps , facial moisturizers , most cosmetic foundations , clothing (polyester) , laundry detergent , dryer sheets , Downy (or whichever softener you use) , all those “man-made” materials used in shoes/sandals , asphalt , tar , and let’s not forget the petroleum based pestcides/herbicides. These are just a handful that I have here in my own house that I can think of off the top of my head. I’m sure there are many more. Oil independence? Completely laughable.

      • jibbs

        Ok smart guy, you lead the way…maybe eddie47, joviazz, or dizzio can help you. Most cars have the same or more horse power that my semi truck has. You must be a rocket scientist. When my truck is loaded, it can weigh up to 80,000ibs. ooohhh boy!! I see a small hill up ahead!! Now what do I do smart guy? My rig has a 431hp cat engine, governed at 68mph and rpm peaks at 1600rpm in tenth gear. With that low rpm, I don’t really achieve 431hp. Is that why I go slower and down shift on small to medium hills? WTF do I do in the mountains smart guy?? ELECTRIC my a$$!! To achive full horse power, you need to eliminate the transmission and governer, which would bring you to full 431 Break Horse Power, and that still will not be enough in Mountain States.
        What do you like best about my diesel engine, the smell or the noise?? hehehe, lmao…electric my azz

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Jibbs!_-I was waiting for a semi truck driver to show up and chime in, well said!

      • Eddie47d

        Who says you can’t have your 431 hp cat engine? Why are you saying something when no one has even suggested that you would loose the power you need for work.

      • kodster5

        eddie47d, you have obviously NEVER driven a semi-truck! You try getting the power to climb even a moderate climb with a diesel engine with less than 500hp, fully loaded with 80,000 lbs of truck, trailer, and freight. You need a minimum of 525hp to make those hills. You ever wonder why those rigs are creeping up those hills, with their flashers on, because they’re going less than 45 mph, and everyone is flying past them? You think they wanna be there, hoping their engines don’t stall out, as they watch the temperature gauge creep up well past 210 degrees? Guess what? I have! So, until you’ve been behind the wheel of a 10-gear rig, with a governor on it that won’t let you get past 62 mph (as a lot of the larger trucking companies have put on their company vehicles, so they can get a tax break and cost-savings, yet choke their drivers because the drivers can’t get to their delivery appointment on time!), shut the heck up! You don’t know crap!

      • Eddie47d

        No I haven’t and thanks for informing me of what those drivers have to deal with.

      • DaveH

        What is “Unamerican”, Doc, is you Liberals who want to turn our once Free society into a third world country complete with know-nothing dictators who could care less how their citizens fare. It is you Liberals who want us to give up and just do everything your way. And your way is nonsensical and proven as a failure in country after country.
        If indeed oil will run out some day, then what difference does it make if it’s 5 years from now or 50 years from now? People will still suffer eventually. Rather than impoverish ourselves now at the hands of Liberals, we should Free up our Marketplaces, and let people make voluntary contracts and transactions with their fellow men (and women). If and when the oil started running out, the prices would naturally go higher at which point some of the alternative energy schemes would make economical sense. Then people could make a peaceful transition to those alternative energies. But you Liberals want to cram them down our throats now, when they aren’t yet economically viable. Impoverishing our nation with your uneconomical solutions is certainly not the course of “wise” people.
        You are not a True American, Doc. Don’t pretend.

      • Thamera

        Interesting isn’t it that Doc and others (Jovi has asserted that I am not only “unamerican” but could not possibly be a “patriot” LMAO) are the first to make those audacious claims of the very people fighting to maintain our freedoms? I’m trying to decide if they are completely brain washed, lacking education or can’t think of anything better to say, or all of the above?!!

      • DaveH

        They may damn well know better, Thamera, and are in the Political Class, so are purposely misleading the ignorant left-leaning readers.

      • vagabond

        well said Angel. I ignor doc sarvis. he’s just another liberal with typical liberal thinking,

      • Oldpoop

        “Nothing in the world is more dangerous than a sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.” MLK

      • Doc Sarvis

        Thank you for confirming my stand with the borrowed quote.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Lol, Doc, if you consider that a win, you really are desperate!

      • Mitchell Ennis

        “There is an almost universal quest for easy answers and half-baked solutions. Nothing pains some people more than having to think.” Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.

      • Eddie47d

        Well said Ennis. We need to think outside oil to achieve energy efficiency. Leave oil to the products that can only operate on oil. Homes can be converted to gas or solar.Coastal power can come from wave generators and wind power can be fuel prairie towns.Even coal will be used for generations to come until other sources will come on line. If you enjoy driving your car then encourage new technology so we can continue to do so.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        EDDIE, First of all, I’ll decide what I’ll drive and what’s fuel efficient for me. Secondly, I’ll heat my home on what I decide, not some damn bureaucrat who thinks they know better than me! When these damn do-gooders, start paying my bills they can have some say, until then, they can shut the hell up and mind they’re own business!

      • Eddie47d

        Angel, go away with your arrogant closed mind. Once again everything is not about you or your hatred for government. This issue is bigger than that. Still like me? Open up and smell a better future for life is constantly changing.

      • JeffH

        Angel Wannabe, don’t let that mindless troll get to ya. Keep hammerin away, yur doin great!

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Eddie, for your freakin information Einstein, I did go away and cut grass for awhile but Now I’m back, and I’ll do and say just whatever the hell it is I please! Why don’t you take a LONG WALK OFF A SHORT PIER, your the INFIDEL Liberal HERE NOT ME!

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Jeffh, Thanks! ;)

      • Eddie47d

        Speaking of trolls and Jeff pops up with nothing useful to say about anything or our energy needs. He’s like a barking dog and always annoying.

      • Eddie47d

        Angel did you sniff a little too much methane gas while cutting grass.What a foggy attitude for a “sunny” Republican.Now if you and Jeff don’t settle down I’ll have to take you both in for your yearly distemper shot. LOL

      • JeffH

        47D’s is the perfect example of why “you can’t fix stupid”!

      • JeffH

        47D makes another imbicillic comment.

        “Now if you and Jeff don’t settle down I’ll have to take you both in for your yearly distemper shot.”

        Like they say, “you can’t fix stupid’!

      • Eddie47d

        Anything new Jeff or you just love repeating yourself.Talk about Stupid!

      • JeffH

        47D’s a MONKEY! …nanner nanner nanner…

      • Kinetic1

        Angel,
        It’s not an all or nothing jump in with both feet game. My string trimmer is propane powered ad my lawn mower is electric. I have a small lawn, so it’s more than enough and again, almost no maintenance. Everyone was happy with gas lights until the electric bulb was invented. Viable alternatives are out there, it’s just going to take the right vision.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        and Kinectic, I make my own tallow candles and use kerosene lamps alot, it suits me just fine,my home decor is old world anyway. I do whatever it takes, to save money!

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        kinectic, your not understanding wherE I’m coming from, I don’t give a Rats azz if the GUV or whoever wants to makes elEctric cars or electric pipe cleaners FOR THAT FACT, as long as they don’t demand that I have to buy it. Which is the same problem we are having with Obamacare, if they let Obamacare stand, they, the Guv will be able to force us to do ANYTHING!!_-we will NEVER BE OIL FREE!

      • kodster5

        Angel, you use kerosene lamps & tallow candles? Then you ought to check out hemp lamp oil! It’s the cleanest, brightest, most efficient lamp oil on the market, and the stupid government outlawed it in 1939! We’re trying to bring it back, and it would make a helluva lot more sense, because it comes from a renewable plant source. Even paper made from hemp would be more practical than cutting down trees that take YEARS to grow, to produce paper, clothing, all kinds of things… but the government has outlawed hemp production. The individual states are wanting to grow it, because it’s a cash crop that is good for the economy (our founding fathers required Americans to grow it!), but the federal government says no, because it looks too much like marijuana! Bah! As JeffH says… stupid is as stupid does.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Kodster5, Yepper candles and Kerosene lamps, especially in the winter months. We have electric, but why turn a light on, when ya can light a candle or a lamp and let it lit until bedtime. The old man and I worked for a candle company back in the early 90′s after our house burned out from a fire, and we needed work. It came in handy._

        -On another note, my favorite perfume Mary Chess 1932 is no longer in production,(it is if ya wanna pay $200 bottle) I found a recipe and ordered the oils ‘n’ I’m gonna make my own. I also make my own Breads, Pizza Doughs and butter. A couple years ago we started a veggie garden, we make it larger each year.__Hey, I look at it this way, our Grandparents did with out, that of which we enjoy today, if they can do it, so can I. With prices going up I cut corners where I can, it’s actually kinda fun. _Now I’m looking into get a couple chickens for eggs.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        kodster, sorry I went off on a tangent and didn’t really answer your comment__-I agree,anything that is good for us the consumer, the GUV outlaws. And yes the states should start stepping in here, take back the control the GUV has taken. I just said the the old man, that no matter what the GUV gets they’re hands on, you can bet. The price is going up, it’ll be outlawed, or taxed and regulate to death!

        But Ronald Reagan said it best ” The government’s view of the economy could be summed up in a few short phrases: If it moves, tax it. If it keeps moving, regulate it. And if it stops moving, subsidize it.
        Ronald Reagan

    • Greg

      I’m all for finding alternative forms of energy, but the truth is that the technology just isn’t there yet to be pushing solar and wind power and electric cars on us. These supposedly “free” energy sources end up costing more than twice what conventional oil, gas, and coal do. We have more than enough oil, gas, and clean coal available to meet all our energy needs for the next 100 years without importing a single drop of oil. I think the only common sense solution involves allowing us to tap into our own energy resources, while investing in more R & D on alternative energy and more fuel efficient vehicles. That way we create jobs and buy time until the technology really does allow PRACTICAL use of alternative energy. At the same time we are reducing or eliminating our dependence on foreign oil, which is especially critical with all the instability in the Middle East.

      One more thing; we have had the technology for better fuel economy for years, but have chosen not to use it. I recall my 1987 Honda CRX getting 52 mpg on the highway. I also recall renting a full-sized turbo-diesel SUV a couple years ago in Germany which got 40 mpg on the Autobahn at 100 mph! Of course this model was not sold in the US. Since the Germans are perhaps even more anal on emmissions and safety than we are, I cannot imagine any valid reason why we shouldn’t be able to get that car here. No doubt it is tied to government corruption and corporate greed- the real driving force behind everything done in the US.

      • CJ

        Clean Coal? Did they find a source on another planet?

      • Dan az

        Greg
        Your right about that,there is also diesels by volkswagen that get 100 mpg but are not aloud to be imported here because of the EPA.The idea of solar cars are just a pipe dream the problems with solar are the storage capacity of the batteries,200 yr old technology.Until they release the batteries that they use in space its just not going to happen.Hydrogen producing cars will be the next generation of cars that we will see, that only produce clean air and water.But it is still a long ways off.Unlimited fuel that is made from water that can produce clean energy for your home and your car from tap water.Until then there is know reason to raise gas prices,it is just another way to redistribute the wealth and break the backs of our citizens.The technology is there but is being withheld for that one purpose.
        Solar is fine for single family houses but not for large cities,there is just not enough land available to cover up with panels,let alone the massive amount of batteries that it would take to store the necessary energy to run all of the houses and industry.It’s just a joke (lie) to prolong the theft of our economy.The funny thing is if lead is such a bad thing with the environmentalist why are they pushing lead acid batteries for everything.Batteries have a life cycle of 80 cycles then they are dead.The EPA has stopped the mining of lead so where is the batteries going to come from?China is the one that is buying up all our lead new and used.I guess that must be one of those shovel ready jobs that the great one is talking about.The solar panel industry has been bought up by Big oil companies as to keep the prices up.
        Nuclear energy needs to be replaced as well as coal plants with new technology that is available with thorium 232 which is clean and safe and is everywhere.But there not doing it either.We can blame each other all day long but until we take back this country from the marxist in chief we will never go forward only backwards.
        Trying times for sure!

      • Christin

        Dan AZ,
        Great post.

    • http://marcum1@wildblue.net coal miner

      Doc Sarvis and Bill:

      Nova Technologies Pursuing Self-Charging Vehicle Technology
      Dec 30, 2006 … Institute claims to be developing a “self-recharging electric vehicle, … State -of-the-art kit cars with polycarbonate body components, …
      http://pesn.com/Radio/Free_Energy_Now/shows/2006/12/30/9700220_Nova_Technologies/ -

      Check it out.

    • 5StarTexan

      Doc if you believe that oil is a dying market you are unbelievable ignorant & you have believed the “greenhorn toads” lies. What happened in the 60′s set up the 70′s and the future and that was called earth day and the EPA. Catalytic converters happened in the 70′s which cut back fuel mileage tremedously and then the government got involved in car making requiring this and that on cars until the car manufacturing industry was ruined. Next the government came up with the Nafta Trade agreement which brought in more foriegn manufacturing of autos and other trade agreements began to sell the USA out of the car manuf business. On top of that unions went mafia style and pushed car workers to demand way more than manuf could afford to pay. Government and unions should have kept out of the private businesses of corporations and private business. One thing that affected the car industry was when the steel industry was allowed to shift all its work ot overseas companies.
      Now about the oil,America has the largest pool of oil sitting under her than all other nations put to gether!!! The EPA and other officials are lying to this nation about the status of oil. Most people think oil comes from dead dinasors but that is not true. Oil is being continously made. The only poblem we have here is idiots who will not allow us to drill for our own resource claiming harm to the enviroment while allowing enemy nations to drill for our oil at the same time…..It is about money and power to control the people!!! Why should we give Brazil over a trillion dollars to help them drill in the Gulf of Mexico when we have over 50,000 oil feild workers out of a job because Obama won’t allow American to drill and get those workers back to work?? Why should China be drilling off the coast of Florida and Alaska??? You see the EPA is about giving our sovereignty over to the UN and it is about controlling the world economy and one world government not about cleaning up the environment. That is only a Trojan Horse!!

      • Aix Sponsa

        Right on. //The anti-smog mandate did produce more fuel efficient vehicles. //Oil is believed to be a renewable resource produced in the magma several miles down. (What, no dead dinosaurs 6 miles deep?) //Drilling was approved in AK and WY and the EPA and the animal people put a stop to it. DEFUND THE EPA. Why should the USA and Europe fight for cleaner air when countries like Russia and China get to ignore their polution? And those volcanoes. How dare they erupt. Oil will fuel the planet for another 200 years. Do I hear voices from “1984″?

      • Dan az

        5Star Texan
        You sir are Right on the money!And very well put!Thanks!!!!

      • Christin

        Also well stated.
        Thanks, 5StarTexas.

    • DaveH

      So, Doc’s idea of wising up is to use an uneconomical alternative energy when we don’t need to. Oh yeah, that is wise. Doc is one of those ignorant people who think they know best how to run our lives.
      They don’t.

    • Lewis Munn

      How about nuclear energy? France has made it work well, and we are as smart as the French, and do not have the fault/earthquake problem of Japan!

  • Cawmun Cents

    For thirty years I have watched as people living in the city buy and drive big 4 wheelers,that dont have sratches or dents in them.I doubt very seriously whether they ever get used for recreational purposes.And yet it is the suburbanites dream to own a 4 wheeler that he will never even put in 4/low and drive up a hill with…its freakin hilarious.Those things may get 12-15 mpg on the highway,6-10 in the city.Its a joke how many folks never booney crash now days.I have a 4 wheeler but it gets used as much as I can.It has scratches and dents,and has been hauled up out of a river once….once.

    • karolyn

      We do agree on this, Cawmun. Too many people go into debt strictly for the “prestige” of owning a big FWD, when half of them never haul much of anything other than a few kids.

      • DaveH

        Yeah, what right do those people have to spend their own hard-earned money on their own choices? String’em up!

      • PaulR.

        Yeah, everyone can spend their hard earned money on whatever they want **BUT** if you feel the necessity to own and drive a Hummer (any of the models) or a CTSV or a Super Snake, don’r pi** and moan when gasoline gets to be $7.00 a gallon and it takes you $190.00 to fill up you gas tank. Twice a week. Or just maybe you’re one of the fortunate few who don’t have to care how much gas costs: you’ll just hand your credit card over to the chauffer and have HIM fill up the monster…

        As for me, I commute 150 miles each day (total) to work ’cause ther’s nothing closer in my field, and I drive an ’06 Cobalt getting about 34 mpg. I cringe at filling up for $40.00…

      • http://www.firsthollywooddigital.com Milena

        No, he is one of the fortunate ones that owns stakes in the oil industry. he was oilmens magazine writer…what do you expect? he is trying to stay on the oil side even when it is chalking us all. I see no better than electrical cars and windmills and solar. He is …well whatever I say now it will be a mild description for I am really pissed at the author of this …### article.
        I agree cars should be gas savy but where was he about 20 years ago?

      • Richard Pawley

        If it weren’t for the EPA we could buy the five passenger VW Polo that gets 74 mpg in real time driving. It has one of the cleanest diesels on earth (and one of ten popular diesels that Europeans can drive but we can not). These are not the smoky cars or trucks we might have seen as kids. One of them even pollutes less than the ‘green’ Prius. VW also has an experimental two passenger prototype (the XL1) that gets over 250 mpg – really! VW says they may be selling it by 2013 and it can drive over 20 miles just on the batteries.

      • JeffH

        DaveH, I agree. I’ve prefer and drive big vehicles, currently a ’99 Yukon 4dr, 4WD with 124,000 on it that gets 13city & 15-17hwy mpg and it runs like a top. Why? Because I feel safer and because I like the roominess. I’ve had it in 4wd maybe 3 times since I bought it in ’04. I almost killed myself and possibly others in a ’99 Ford Escort station wagon in Oakland because I couldn’t see traffic farther ahead slamming on their brakes. I was scared and lucky. Swore off little cars right there.

        As for those driving big SUV’s just to keep up with the Joneses, I know that the housing bubble scam created false equity which people used to buy their toys and SUV’s. Now who created the housing bubble? Thanks to the quasi-government agencies of Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac, and the Federal Housing Administration. Another common denominator…government involvement.

        Back to the auto/gas mileage deal. The Corporate Average Fuel Economy (CAFE) enacted in 1975 was intended to increase gas mileage in new vehicles. In 1993, the Clinton administration grandiosely announced the “Program for a New Generation of Vehicles”, which showered the then-Big Three with about a billion bucks to produce a fuel-sipper. It never appeared.

        The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration regulates CAFE standards and the US Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) measures vehicle fuel efficiency. US Congress specifies that CAFE standards must be set at the “maximum feasible level”. The EPA has encouraged consumers to buy more fuel efficient vehicles, while the NHTSA expressed concerns that smaller, more fuel efficient vehicles may lead to increased traffic fatalities. Thus higher fuel efficiency was associated with lower traffic safety, intertwining the issues of fuel economy, road-traffic safety, air pollution, and climate change.

        Government intervention just creates mass confusion.

        Just an FYI…the Shelby GT500 Super Snake with 750-800HP gets 13/19 mpg and several of the newer, high horsepower cars and trucks are getting as high as 31mpg and averageing around 19-22mpg.

      • Jay

        Electric cars, windmills and solar panels? Heck, why not just go with the horse and buggy and plant trees, walk around naked and pick fleas out of each other’s hair? Have you hugged your tree lately?

      • Jay

        My post was for Milena and Paul, the sour grape eating team. Would you like a little cheese with your whine?

      • Karolyn

        Dave – To me it’s a sign of this self-centered, keeping up with the Jones’s society we live in, and the reason other countries look down their noses at us. Like we’re so much better than everybody else. I don’t care what anybody does and am certainly not jealous. I’m very happy with my ’95 Escort wagon that suits me just fine. I just disagree with the whole materialistic way our society functions. I live about 60 miles south of Charlotte, NC, and my mind is boggled when I am up there and see so many Escalades, etc. driving around the city. I can’t help but wonder where these people get all this money in this economy.

      • Warrior

        So Karolyn,

        Somehow it’s ok to have the elected representitives ride around in limo’s and SUV’s and take jet ride’s on the taxpayers dime?

      • Cawmun Cents

        Please dont misconstrue my personal observation of cityots(combination of city dwellers and idiots)owning 4WD’S as pro-environmentalism.I despise granola chewers.Yet,watching how folks function is a hobby of mine.I am keenly aware of my proxi….the ape that throws fecal matter at you in the zoo,but I have as much fun watching you,as you do dodging my fecal matter.I feel that if I want to own a gas guzzler,stock in an oil company,a bazooka,cesium 235,tickets to a Ted Nugent concert,or whatever irritates a tree romantic/PETA vegan,then it is my God given,liberty livin’right to do so.I feel that for everyone else who loves red meat,firearms,and being offensive to others…..-CC.

      • DaveH

        It’s this “materialistic” society, Karolyn, that has allowed even the poorest people to live better lives. If you aren’t materialistic then why do you aid and abett the Socialists in their efforts to take other peoples’ money? It seems to me that a non-materialistic person would have no interest in other peoples’ money. And don’t tell me you don’t, we all know different.

      • Cawmun Cents

        My observation was that I find it hilarious how some will spend(I realize it is their prerogative)extra thousands for something that never gets used.It just seems wasteful,thats all.When I was in Alaska,I had a 65 dodge Powerwagon,and in low gear that thing could practically climb a tree.One time when I was going down a steep hill that came to a “T” crossing with a stop sign,I hit a patch of black ice.I could not stop at the crossing so I hung a left and rode the guardrail for 20 yards or so,narrowly missing a logging truck as it came from the same direction,headed sraight at me.Talk about your a-hole puckering,sheesh!Unfortunately I could not afford to bring it(the Powerwagon)home with me,when I moved back to California. In Alaska,I lived where there are no roads in or out.You had to have a boat or a plane to enter or leave.I miss that old truck,my Stihl chainsaw,and my Virginian Dragoon .44 Magnum,all of which I had to sell for my boatride back to Seattle…..

      • JeffH

        CC, sounds like a pretty good time in your life. Ah, I could tell some good stories from the past with my 76 Chevy shortbed 4×4, my first. $6600 out the door with air and power stearing. It went everywhere…finally put it to rest in ’97 or’98.

      • http://aol Bill

        Did you notice, the author and his friend had a 1976 cars in college, IN 1976!!!! New cars then, even if economy cars, while in college??? Some author was rich. Where did he go to college? Harvard? Yale? Stanford? I was lucky to own a rusty old 1952 ford wagon while in college in 1964 where I had to live in and sleep in. I had to work and live in my car while in college. I couldn’t work and study, so I flunked out and was drafted to Vietnam where I earned $211 a month in combat. I don’t think any one should talk unless he walks a mile in my combat boots.

    • wasadoc

      I am still trying to figure out just exactly what has Jimmy Carter’s Energy Department has done other than “grow” there yearly budget. Remember, they were supposed to get us off foreign oil.

      • Eddie47d

        Every President has said that since Nixon.

      • Mike

        Carter’s energy dept. is a joke, like so many other gov. agencies. Poor fuel economy can be blamed on the EPA more than anything else. Their increasingly stringent pollution rules drag down mpg’s like a lead weight.Ethanol fuel is less efficient, thus lower fuel economy. Low sulphur diesel along with the particulate filters in the exhaust of the new diesel engines has caused a drop in the fuel economy of diesel engines. The gov. needs to put the breaks on the EPA.

      • john r. sr.

        carter was a 1 term ill excuse for a president and had his pitfalls to face. but, obama has no problem with the help of his cohorts to make up incidentals like obamacare that nobody will benefit from to making electric junkers, to saving face so that he can run for a second term, to screw the american public even more. this incoherent prompter reader needs to be sent out to pasture so he can spread his B.S somewhere else and not in anything that has anything to do with politics.

      • http://Illinois'17th Old Henry

        Yep, Little Barry does need to be sent somehwere – Levenworth to await the gallows for treason.

      • Matt Newell

        Amen!!!

      • http://Illinois'17th Old Henry

        Mike:

        You are correct about the Peanut Farmer’s Dept. o Energy. It has done exactly the reverse of what Jimmy promised. Or has it?

        People say that ethanol gets lower MPG, but I don’t see it. We ran it in my wife’s mini van when it was priced less than the 87 octane and I saw absolutely no difference in the MPG, and I figure the milage out to the third digit. The thing that does destroy the milage is the “re-formulated” gas that comes out every October thru about March. That gas costs us 15% to 20% in milage. Once again another facsist Fed agency known as the EPA.

      • Kinetic1

        O.H.
        Ethanol does have, as I understand it a lower energy to weight ratio to gasoline, so it should provide slightly lower milage, but that’s not the real issue with Ethanol. The cost of producing corn ethanol, both in direct and indirect costs is just too high. If the government were not subsidizing both the production of the Ethanol and the growing of corn crops no one wold have anything to do with it.

        As for the EPA, I doubt we would have the fuel efficient cars of today without their regulations.

      • Eddie47d

        Kinetic; So true and the American car companies and Congress won’t take higher gas mileage lying down. Those bozos still are clueless and really don’t give a rats patute. Institute higher standards and stop pussy footing around.

      • JeffH

        LMAO! “Institute higher standards”? Like a big government lackey you be!

      • Eddie47d

        Well Jeff you are the symbol of low standards who still endorses Ringers anything goes policy. No wonder this nation spins it’s wheels and goes now where. More proof of the pudding from Jeff.

      • JeffH

        47D, LMAO…a Monkey if ever there was one.

      • Jay

        Eddie, If only you could see what a fool you are you would blush with embarrassment, you tree hugging government lap-dog!!! The EPA is a useless, degenerate, lying, anti-American organization run by thugs! It is nothing more then just another branch of the white house crime syndicate!!! Btw,The only dangerous emissions that I detect are coming out of your mouth. Boob!

      • Patty

        OH-Ethanol reduces the life of you engine. Causes that “knock”. Car companies including gov’t. motors will not honor a car warranty if you use less than 87 octane in your vehicle. Having been very close to a mechanic who says they would never put even 1 tank of ethanol in their vehicle. I will go with someone who sees the damage 1st hand.
        http://fuelfix.com/blog/2011/05/10/ethanol-mess-with-your-engine-you-may-be-on-your-own/

      • Lewis Munn

        The EPA is responsible for raising my electric bill by 100% this year, and promises to raise it 100% each year for the next 4 years, making it 3200% higher in 5 years, AND they are making the electric plants here buy and import high sulfur and high dirt coal from 1000 miles away! More pollution in our air here!

        I fail to see how raising the pollution levels up here plus raising the costs of the electricity 3200% is anything other than vindictive against us for having kept the pollution down over the years!

        And of course, they sit on the large oil fields we have right underneath us, so our oil products have to come from Arab oil, run over by smoking tanker ship, and hauled to our local refineries on smoking trucks from ports 1500 miles away or more. No wonder it is $4/gallon already

        Such economies! Such great ideas for increasing pollution and wasting energy!.

        No wonder it is the EPA, the Environmental Polluting Agency!!

      • Kinetic1

        Lewis,
        Why do people like you so often insinuate that most of our oil imports are from the Middle East? The vast majority of our imports come from Canada and Mexico. Less than 20% of our oil imports come from the Middle East and since imports make up 60% of our oil used, those Arab imports account for less than 12% over all. That’s not to say that we do not import an awful lot of oil and there is, as you say a price to pay in moving that oil, but let’s stop acting as if the Middle East is our only outside source of oil.

    • Dagney

      This article and most of the responses in it are nonsensicle. Americans don’t want fuel efficient cars any more than they want Obama’s prissy “high-speed” trains. America was BUILT on engines and gasoline. And, in our hearts we all know that there is no oil shortage and we aren’t going to run out of energy any time soon. We are AMERICANS, we buy what we WANT. And, that is big engine trucks and SUV’s that can SAFELY take our families and haul our stuff from point A to point B.

      It really would have been good, in this article, to have worked into it the statistics of the deaths caused by Jimmie Carter’s prissy (yes, all socialists are PRISSY) “fuel efficiency” because people were forced to economize and buy a YUGO. Now, it’s the STUPIDcar. You want to tangle in that with a truck? Go right ahead.

      I repeat, this is AMERICA, it was built by BIG engines and lots of oil. Their ain’t no shortages except what is caused by LIES and FEAR. DRILL baby, DRILL!!

      • Bob G

        OOOORRAAAAHHHHHH Dagny!

      • Eddie47d

        Nobody buys Yugos! How about pulling your head out of that posterior of yours and wise up for a change. Back in the 60′s we heard about the Ugly American because we poked our nose into other peoples business in foreign lands. We’ve escalated that status big time. On top of that we’ve seen the oil crises coming for decades and still haven’t pulled our heads out.Our arrogance only supersedes our stupidity. We still buy gas guzzling cars and SUV’s then cry at the pump. Can you say morons?! Oh the shame and embarrassment of driving a fuel efficient vehicle. Even some of these smaller SUVs only get 19 miles a gallon in the city. Big whoop! Thanks John Meyers for a timely article.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        eddie, Like I’ve said before, I wanna see you haul a truck load of hay or a pick up truck load of funiture, if ya decide to move?….Honestly are ya saving money if ya have to constantly hire people to haul for you, now use your head?!_-Choose your poison, Electric cars you’ll for pay in your electric bill, Gas fueled car ‘n’ Trucks, you pay at the pump?!!_-It’s gotta come from somewhere__ and it ain’t free!

      • Kinetic1

        Angel,
        “Honestly are ya saving money if ya have to constantly hire people to haul for you..” Well, that depends on your life style, doesn’t it? I drove a Subaru Hatchback back in the 80′s. Great little car, good milage and it never let me down. For 90% of my hauling needs it fit the bill, and I could handle 98% by pulling a small trailer. As the family grew we added a minivan and with that hauling the trailer our need for anything more dropped to almost never.

        I do a lot of woodworking and home restoration, so the minivan is a great hauler. Plywood and sheetrock fit just fine and I don’t have to worry about rain. I’ve even hauled some hay bales from time to time, but I certainly wouldn’t make a habit of it, but then I don’t have a farm. And there is the point. How much hauling do you do? My home is in a dairy community and I can’t imagine those farmers getting by without a good solid pickup, but there are just as many people driving around in trucks with no logical reason to do so. Just like the SUV and 4X4 (not FWD, that’s front wheel drive) owners who never pull anything and never see anything other than pavement, it’s all about image. Well, for some women I know it’s the high seating position that makes them feel safe, but we all know the truth about that. The point is, just like women’s shoes it’s more about looks than practicality.

        So, did I save any money by driving a small car even though I had to occasionally rent a truck or trailer? You bet! And It was easier to park than a truck, easier to wash, more comfortable to drive, quieter and cheeper to shod.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Kinectic, I’m glad it worked out for ya. I prefer a pick up or a minivan, I don’t live in the city. Point is, I’ll make the desicion based on my lifestyle. You can make all the electric cars ya want, But no matter how you slice it, no electric semi is gonna haul a trailer or anything else….I’m just sayin…see jibbs comment! :)

      • DaveH

        I’m happy for you, Kinetic, to have made the choices that suited you.
        Now, butt out of other peoples’ choices.

      • DaveH

        Angel,
        Here’s a good analysis of electric cars:
        http://mises.org/daily/4714

      • Kinetic1

        Dave,
        Nice attitude! Note that I said that people should by the car or truck that suits their needs. No, I don’t see the sense in owning a truck if you don’t need one, but I didn’t say you shouldn’t be allowed to. Get off your “I’m independent and I make my own choices” high horse.

      • Kinetic1

        Angel.
        Again, I can see your point. If your situation requires some hauling capacity on a regular basis, then your choices make sense. I just question the folks who insist on owning a truck to drive around suburbia. I’m not asking anyone to prohibit it, but I don’t see the sense.

        One thing I should have mentioned. For a while one of my neighbors had a beat-up little toyota pickup that we used as a neighborhood hauler. He made the original purchase, but we all paid for our own gas and helped out with maintenance as needed. On the down side it wasn’t always available, but when you knew you were going to need to make a dump run or wanted to pick up a load of mulch you could plan ahead. It’s a great use for an old heap.

      • Kinetic1

        Dave,
        Nice article, but totally misleading. First the writer bases his figures on the $9.000 alteration of a Prius, but then refers to “electric” cars. even after the alterations, a Prius is not an electric car. Second, he basis much of the cost on a $33,000 battery needed to get 100 miles per charge, but there are already electric cars that can go over 100 miles without such a battery. Third, as I mentioned in another post, a true electric car saves a great deal on reduced maintenance and that, due to the Prius being a hybrid is not entered into the equation.

        I agree that altering a Prius is a false savings, but the writer of this article was disingenuous at best.

      • AndyZ

        Every energy conversion has a loss converting fuel to motion to drive a generator consumes more energy than the electricity it delivers then you charge an electric cars batteries with it it takes twice the energy or more to charge them than the best batteries can deliver then you have another conversion loss in the electric motor that powers the car. Not to mention that they are always telling us that the power grid is at almost 100% utilization now how will the rolling blackouts work when all the mandated electric cars are plugged in and charging and think of all the extra fossil fuel the power companies will have to burn to fuel those “enviromentallly friendly” Vehicles at least the pollution will be from a stationary source

      • DaveH

        You are misleading, Kinetic. The author is very clear in his statements. You need to learn how to read. The author is critiqueing Mr. Sandalow’s conversion of his Prius to an all-electric car. A person could easily copy his analytic methodology and apply it to any electric car. Of course, each model will have different results, but the main line of thinking will still apply.
        Then there are the hidden costs of subsidization that one would also have to consider (not so easy), because even though the purchaser will pay less, somebody still has to pay.
        The writer of the article was not disingenuous at all. He was very clear in his statements. The people who are being disingenuous are those you support who don’t tell people about all the hidden costs that the taxpayers get stuck with. And they don’t tell people about the next great Liberal panic — what to do with all those used batteries and their poisonous metals.

      • Dagney

        You want to buy a friggin’ 4 cylinder pop can of a car? Go right ahead! If it’s being built, and you like it, buy it! This is America! Don’t you dare tell me I HAVE TO buy one of them, though! I have a RIGHT to buy as big and costly of a car as I want and can afford. You can just go pound sand if you think you have some moral high ground because you buy a pop can car that you can easily die in!

        Let me repeat, THERE IS NO OIL SHORTAGE. There is only lack of drilling and lack of political will to SHUT UP the environmental WHACKOS who are standing in the way of America’s progress and economy. These WHACKOS value their own power more than they value American freedom and livlihood. They need to shut the HELL up and get out of the way.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Dagney, HEAR, HEAR!!!!

      • Lewis Munn

        Yup, the EPA makes more environmental mistakes for political purposes than about anybody else.

        One area: In the early and late 1800′s, volcanoes exploded, and we had years without summers…why? Dust blown to a dust layer high up reflecting the sun’s IR back out into space! So, the EPA, while screaming about “Global Warming”, has been taking all the dust it can out of the air, so now the IR from the suns hits the ground, and the “climate” is heated very efficiently.

        Those of use who are older also remember the ’50′s when it was feared the next ice age was coming on…but it turned out to be factory smoke that was reflecting the IR back into space, and when the EPA got rid of that, the climate warmed twice as fast as it had before! Yea for the EPA, making global warming faster and faster, and making our prices higher and higher!

        ‘Cause they have a budget, and an agenda, and constantly need more budget to fulfill and expand their agenda! And more politics to effectively propagandize the Sheeple!!

      • DaveH

        As usual, Eddie can’t make one of his Liberal comments without it being laced liberally with nasty remarks. It’s Eddie’s way or the highway. This, Folks, is what you can expect when you put Liberals into office. They, like Eddie, want to make your choices for you, even though most of them, like Eddie, are severely lacking in knowledge and cognitive skills.

      • Kinetic1

        And that, folks is how the pot calls the kettle black.

      • Eddie47d

        Heck Dave, You’ve mastered the skill of arrogance and yes sir you are way ahead of me.If this is a race to you then I’ll let you win, hands down.

      • Lewis Munn

        Yup, Dave. I have noted the Liberals in general have a much greater knowledge of profanity and vulgarity, and feel it adds to their arguments! Does make them longer and look larger on paper, I will agree.

      • DaveH

        I’m treating Eddie with the same disrespect that he showers on others, Kinetic. If you bring a knife to the fight, I will bring a knife.

      • Eddie47d

        Angel; Very few people haul a truck load of hay so this issue isn’t just about you. Drive whatever it takes to get the job done that is efficient to you. Some construction companies have dump trucks that are 20 times bigger than than most cars . It’s what they need to do business and get their job done. Most folks don’t need a dump truck either.

      • Thamera

        Eddie, Eddie, Eddie, what suburban or metropolitan do you live in that your world is so convex? Almost all of our neighbors have a truck for loading all kinds of things from hay to four wheelers to fertilizer. You can’t drive a city block (or a country mile) without passing several trucks and/or SUV’s. Just because you don’t “see” it doesn’t mean that many, many people don’t require there use on a daily basis. btw: the average family size is 5 people out here…tell me what should they be driving?

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Thamera. Hell we live in farm country, I’ve even seen large John deere tractos driven and parked at the Grocery store! Things get too bad I drive that or my little Deere! :)

      • http://Illinois'17th Old Henry

        Eddie:

        Out energy problem has been caused by the American people allowing the facsist government in DC to completely impeed the developement of our own oil supplies. We have more oil than the ME. We have alos not built any refineries since 1976.

      • Eddie47d

        Then those oil companies should have invested in more refineries back in the 70′s. Now did they? Fewer refineries guarantee them high gas prices and that is how they like it. You know that law of supply and demand. There is a big demand for oil and even a good supply but if it’s not refined it can’t get to market fast enough. Look at all the oil Iran has but no refineries so they have to import gasoline.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe
      • AndyZ

        The Environazis wouldn’t let the oil companies build any since 1976 THANK YOU EPA

      • Eddie47d

        That Republican Henry Kissinger makes a deal with the Middle East over oil and you blame Environmentalists. More wacko thinking from the right. Got anymore enlightened thoughts to share with us.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Eddie, he was a rino!__

      • Christin

        Henry Kissinger… a RINO? Maybe in Title Only, but he is a New World Order dude. He has stated that he believes obama is the one to lead it.

        Most of us on this site are Constitutional Conservatives… NOT Republicans and Democrats… not anymore, now that we know that both sides are corrupted by TPTB and Progressivism.

      • Frank

        That’s right baby! Freedom of choice on what to drive and not get buried in a Smart (dumb) car.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Frank, our neighbor has one of those smart cars, the old man and I say the same thing, If they get hit in one of those, they are a goner and if it’s a semi, they’ll disintegrate!__there is no protection what so ever!

      • DaveH

        Here is a famous picture of a smart car misfortunate enough to get hit by a Semi:
        http://www.fatalfailblog.com/uploads/2/9/2/7/2927851/1594479_orig.jpg

        Of course, no passenger car would fare well in such a case, but smart cars are inherently unsafe due to their very small size.

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Daveh, My point exactly!!!

      • libertytrain

        I remember seeing Smart Cars for the first time 12 years ago in Germany – and the one I saw daily was used as a Pizza Delivery car in Mannheim – saw it for the next few years I visited there – however, driving one of those in a city Downtown area seems more sensible than going up against something on the Autobahn – I didn’t see any then on the Autobahn. Will be interesting for me to pay attention the next time round -

      • Thamera

        I’ve seen that kind of damage in person on a 2 lane highway on our way to Nevada. Needless to say there were no survivors. Very sad.

      • BOOHOO

        I don’t drive my SUV (not the huge ones just a regular SUV) because I love it. I drive it because when I lived in Los Angeles and driving on those CRAZY freeways everyday either you had a good strong car or you were going to get really hurt or killed. The drivers are nuts, they think only of themselves their talking on their cell phones, texting, putting on makeup ,I even once saw a woman driving down the street holding a bowl in one hand and eating with chop sticks in the other. I”m sorry but my kids were young and I needed protecting driving them and my self to and from work (took 1 1/2 hours each way on the 405 freeway) Now 12 years later I drive it because It’s paid for and I have NO MONEY and NO JOB.. I don’t drive much I now live in Arizona and I fill it up once a month. Trust me if I could afford a safe (key word here) fuel-efficient car I would buy one

      • john r. sr.

        drill baby drill… how bout we start on your backside there is enough hot air there and we might strike oil in the process.

      • Dagney

        LOL, what an intelligent rebuttal. Typical Marxist “useful idiot” response.

      • Kinetic1

        Dagney,
        There you go blaming stupidity on ideology again. I’ve seen more that my share of comments like that coming from the right on this site.

      • Lewis Munn

        Liberals in general apparently get a lot of profanity and vulgarity learned in early childhood, so it just comes out naturally. Don’t blame them, blame their parents.

        Vulgarity is used when they cannot think of a refined way to speak. Refined, knowledgable speech can be much more cutting, but they never could, or would, learn it.

      • Dagney

        Kinetic1: Oh, I think you will find the percentage of inarticulate, unintelligent, and just plain nasty ad hominum posts much higher coming from the left than from the right. No one is perfect, it is true, but the left is much less so! :-)

      • Kinetic1

        Dagney,
        I beg to differ, but I can’t imagine a much bigger waste of my time than to tabulate the posts.

      • http://Illinois'17th Old Henry

        Amen Dagney!

    • Void1972

      “IT WAS INCREDIBLY OBVIOUS”
      by Sharon Rondeau

      Image released by the White House which Obama claims is his birth certificate
      (May 9, 2011) — The Post & Email was able to reach Mr. James Colby, who recently performed an analysis aired on a Colorado television station of the image released on April 27, 2011 by the White House purported to be a certified copy of Obama’s long-form birth certificate from Hawaii. Mr. Colby stated during that interview that the image contained as many as 50 layers.
      MRS. RONDEAU: How did you determine that there were as many as 50 layers in this image?
      MR. COLBY: It started when you open the birth certificate in your browser, in Adobe Acrobat. It was a friend of mine who noticed that the text on the birth certificate would flash to white in and out. The reason it was doing that was that there were different layers in the document that caused the layers to flash as it rebuilt the preview layer by layer. So those layers would flash over the top and rebuild that image in that way. From there, you can open it in Adobe Illustrator and see those layers first-hand.
      MRS. RONDEAU: If the image had come from a paper document and then been scanned in and put on a computer screen, what would have happened when you opened it?
      MR. COLBY: Almost all scanned images would be a single layer, so zooming in and out, there would have been nothing noticeable. Additionally, if you zoom in using Acrobat with your browser on a lot of the text, you’ll notice that it appears jagged and a single color. That’s not original. A pen doesn’t write in a single color; as you write lighter, the color is lighter; as you press harder, it’s darker than everything else. So writing in pen is not a single solid color, and when it scanned, anti-aliased, which means that the square pixels on the edges fade to make it appear smooth. Most of the text in the document including a large portion of the signatures is just a single blotch of color. The likely explanation is that someone just drew them in using a tool similar to “pencil” in Adobe Photoshop.
      MRS. RONDEAU: Do you think that this came from any kind of a paper document originally?
      MR. COLBY: There’s definitely a component of it that came from a paper document originally and was then edited after the fact. I can’t tell you how much of it was taken from a paper document unless the entire thing was connected. Another aspect to this is that in Illustrator, you can examine what’s called the “Clipboard.” Let’s say if you’re editing a paper document and you add another document and you are cutting fragments of other documents to paste over them to produce a final copy. The Clipboard on a computer is like all those cutouts, if you will, a kind of storage place. The clipboard for this document is still intact in its original form. It reflects the objects that have been “cut” from somewhere else and “pasted” into this document. By the way, all the things in the clipboard are rotated at 90 degrees without any explanation. Basically, there’s no computer-based explanation for that.
      There are things in the clipboard that are notable; for instance, the “type of occupation outside home during pregnancy;” the “Non” in “none.” That’s in the clipboard…both the dates, “20″ and “22,” are on the clipboard. The signature of the state registrar and the April 25th date are both foreign objects.
      There are explanations that people have proposed. Some have proposed OCR, which is Optical Character Recognition, and that’s when scanners are giving computers the ability to read text. But that doesn’t apply here because OCR converts things into text, not images of text. All of the information in this document is stored as an image.
      MRS. RONDEAU: How long have you been involved in work with documents?
      MR. COLBY: I’ve been doing graphic arts since 2004 using Version 5 of Adobe Creative Suite, but I’m also a programmer. I’m a LAMP developer with a specialty in dynamic graphics. I’ve developed quite a few notable online graphics programs myself, from scratch, including a GD image editor, a 3D dynamic graphing generator, a system to develop the entire graphic profile of a site dynamically. I’m a little bit more than a graphic artist; I’m an internet engineer.
      MRS. RONDEAU: What is your work background?
      MR. COLBY: I incorporated my first IT company in 2004 and have been self employed since. I’ve been self-employed since 2004. I started our current business back in 2007, and I got started in the technology field early through an internship when I was about 15 or 16. I have not stopped working since.

      Image which circulated on the internet in October 2009 and again last week following the release of an image from the White House purported to be Obama’s long-form birth certificate
      MRS. RONDEAU: Would you say that analyzing this particular image was difficult? Did you have to look closely to find the 50 layers?
      MR. COLBY: It was incredibly obvious.
      The Post & Email then asked Mr. Colby if he was familiar with the “Blaine document” which had appeared on the internet as early as October 2009 but resurfaced last week following the release from the White House. We mentioned that to the untrained eye, the formatting of the two images appeared similar. Mr. Colby responded that he had not seen the Blaine image, so we sent it to him. We asked him to comment on whether or not he believed that the White House long-form image was assembled from the Blaine image, as some have suggested. Mr. Colby responded:
      “I can’t find a high enough resolution sample to make any actual image based determinations. I will say the parent and attendant signatures have some appearance of being signed from the same hand, with attempt to create variation. Only one background mark seems to coincide between the two documents, while the rest are independent between – so the certificate released by the white house is not based on the “Blaine” document. Information like name, address, etc. obviously correlate but are publicly available so there is no significance.”
      Mr. Colby’s final comments to us were, “One thing about documents is that it is possible to make flawless forgeries, especially with the resources of the Executive office. That’s what brings this into question; there’s no question that they have the ability to make a flawless forgery if they desire. So the question is, ‘Why was this released?’”
      The Post & Email then asked him, “If you had a flawless forgery on the screen in front of you, could you detect that it was forged?” and he said, “No. If the proper resources research was were put into it, it’s would be impossible to detect it without having access to external information like original records from the issuer of the given document.”
      Mr. Colby left some instructions whereby readers can discover for themselves the information he has presented about the White House image release:
      Verify yourself:
      In your browser (acrobat):
      Visit the original certificate at whitehouse.gov. Zoom in rapidly, in and out. The text flashing is your computer revealing the upper layers with a slight delay to process the preview of each.
      In Adobe Illustrator:
      Visit the original certificate at whitehouse.gov. Go to File – “Save Page As” in your respective browser. Save the page somewhere where you may easily access it. Then, either open it by browsing to it, right clicking on it, and selecting “open with”; finally selecting Adobe Illustrator (you might have to browse to find the program), or open Adobe Illustrator, select open, and browse to the file (make sure to select *.* “Any Type” in the bottom dropdown). Once open, you may navigate the individual layers yourself and hide their visibility; additionally, if you go to Windows-Actions and select the “Links” tab, you may view the clipboard associated with the original birth certificate.

      • Kinetic1

        Void,
        What does this have to do with cars or gas milage or oil prices?

      • DaveH

        Oh, and who appointed you to be the Site police?

      • kilrntex

        Kinetic, it has much to do with gas mileage. This illegal alien you call your president has said get used to high energy prices, because they “will skyrocket”. This regime is hellbent on destroying this nation. High gas prices aren’t that big a deal for me where I live, because I drill oil wells for a living and high prices keep us working. What really bothers me is this halfbreed alien giving billions to our enemies to drill in the same areas where he shuts us down. Care about the environment? I don’t think the socialist down south care a damn bit about trashing the GOM or any other offshore habitat. The halfbreed alien prez only cares about his agenda to destroy America and he has plenty of idiots helping him do it. I see many of them on this site.

      • Kinetic1

        Please kilrntex, tell me about the foreign nations the President is paying to drill?

      • JeffH

        September 11, 2010
        Despite President Obama’s moratorium on U.S. deepwater drilling in the Gulf of Mexico, the U.S. Export-Import Bank intends to guarantee $1 billion in loans to PEMEX, the Mexican state oil company, to bolster the company’s oil drilling in the region.

        The bank, which is the official American export credit agency, loaned more than $1 billion to PEMEX in 2009 — when the company was the bank’s largest borrower — in support of its drilling activities.
        ——————————————————————

        The U.S. is going to lend billions of dollars to Brazil’s state-owned oil company, Petrobras, to finance exploration of the huge offshore discovery in Brazil’s Tupi oil field in the Santos Basin near Rio de Janeiro. Brazil’s planning minister confirmed that White House National Security Adviser James Jones met this month with Brazilian officials to talk about the loan.

        The U.S. Export-Import Bank tells us it has issued a “preliminary commitment” letter to Petrobras in the amount of $2 billion and has discussed with Brazil the possibility of increasing that amount.
        —————————————————————-

        Billionaire investor George Soros bought an $811 million stake in Petroleo Brasileiro (Petrobras) in the second quarter, making the Brazilian state-controlled oil company his investment fund’s largest holding.
        —————————————————————

        So….to summarize:

        1. The Export-Import Bank of the United States Government is part of the $1 Billion loan to Mexico to boost their oil drilling operation.

        2. The same bank (Ex-Im Bank) is involved in the underwriting a $2 Billion dollar loan to Brazil for Petrobras Oil.

        3. The Export-Import Bank ex-officio Board Members just SO HAPPEN to be

        U.S. Secretary of Commerce Gary Locke

        AND

        U.S. Trade Representative: Ambassador Ron Kirk /

        4. On the Export-Import Bank, on the Advisory Board just SO HAPPENS to include Debbie Dingell.

        Debbie Dingell is a Democratic strategist and is MARRIED to Democratic Congressman John Dingell of Michigan.
        ———————————————————————-

        We certainly have learned that Mr. Obama is good at rewarding those who put him into office.

        WHY doesn’t someone ask Obama WHY…..GM (Government Motors) is building a plant in Mexico?

        GM to build $500 million plant in Mexico

        Payoffs for the Unions

        Payoff for Soros (Petrobras)

        Yet Obama can’t figure out WHY we are still in a Recession?

        HAD ENOUGH YET AMERICA?
        http://romanticpoet.wordpress.com/2010/09/11/u-s-backs-1b-loan-to-mexico-for-oil-drilling-despite-obama-moratorium-another-foreign-oil-company-what-about-american-oil-rig-workers/

      • http://! Angel Wannabe

        Jeffh< Right on!__Read up folks!__Good post Jeff, you get an Atta Boy and a big thumbs up!

      • Kinetic1

        JeffH (and Angel by association)
        I had hoped that you would have come up with something new, but I see you are still hung up on the same misinformation. The U.S. Import/Export bank is not the President’s bank account. Obama did not “give” money to Mexico or Brazil, but as noted in your articles the Ex/Im Bank guaranteed LOANS. These loans are not without ties. In fact, the point of these loan guarantees is to create more business for American companies and, by extension American workers. You might also wish to note that the notorious 2 Billion dollar giveaway that Glen Beck made so famous was negotiated during the previous administration. Oh, and speaking of that, Soros sold 5 million of his stake before the loan was completed, bringing the idea of a “pay off” into question.

        How about that drilling? Well, according to a February article in the Houston Chronicle, Houston’s Noble Energy was the first company to receive final approval to begin drilling again. Petrobras did not get final approval until March, followed by another American company.

        Next on your list,
        “3. The Export-Import Bank ex-officio Board Members just SO HAPPEN to be U.S. Secretary of Commerce Gary Locke AND U.S. Trade Representative: Ambassador Ron Kirk”
        Do you know what ex-officio means? “Ex officio” is a Latin term meaning “by virtue of office or position.” Imagine that! Each administration has officials on the board and now Obama has his. They weren’t there when the Bush administration made their deals, but oh my they are now! He even has board advisors, just like every other administration.

        So what did you prove? The Obama administration has ex-officio board members and board advisors at the U.S. Export/Import Bank just like every other administration. George Soros had a large stake in the Brazilian Oil Company Petrobras. The Bank, under the Bush administration approved a 2 Billion dollar loan to Petrobras. The Bank guaranteed loans to other nations drilling for oil just like the last administration (and others I would guess). The intent of the loans is to secure business for U.S. companies and their employees. And finally the Obama administration began reopening the gulf for drilling by granting their first and third permits to American companies. Now THAT’S a scandal!

        By the by, Soros sold ALL of his holdings in Petrobras in 2010, months before they were permitted to drill.

      • JeffH

        Kinetic1…This administration has proven that it is deathly against U.S. oil drilling (especially after the BP spill), particularly when it comes to deepwater drilling. And yet, they are willing to send money to Brazil to drill even deeper. Whether or not this move helps U.S. jobs, the irony is too great to write it off as merely an employment booster.

        Obama could call the whole thing off. No matter how politically isolated the Ex-Im Bank might be painted, revisit the Wisconsin/India case for a quick foray into Obama’s influence over the bank’s decision to approve the loan:

        “The reversal came just in time for a visit by President Barack Obama Wednesday to Wisconsin, the home base of Bucyrus International Inc. [Wisconsin company], which hopes to sell the mining equipment to Reliance [Indian company] with the help of loan guarantees.”

        But instead of Obama preventing the Petrobras deal from going through, the Ex-Im bank raised the value of the preliminary loan from $2 billion to $10 billion

        The irony only becomes sinister when we consider that this loan is meant to boost the capabilities of a company that, until just recently, had been George Soros’s greatest asset for two years. It is now his second largest asset.

        (a) George Soros’s largest holding at the time of the initial loan and currently is invested in Petrobras;

        b) $10bil from the U.S. federal government are on the table to help Petrobras explore potentially lucrative oil mines;

        (c) Petrobras has been salivating for Gulf drilling rigs since the spill in April, so much so that it is looking for more financing to expand its drilling operations;

        (d) The U.S. government’s Gulf oil moratorium has effectively given the drilling rigs an incentive to go elsewhere (at the time of this writing, two rigs have already migrated to Egypt and the Congo). Drilling rigs that leave are not expected to return for years, leaving the Gulf with less rigs and potentially older and more dangerous models;

        (e) Tens of thousands of jobs are currently in limbo in the Gulf oil industry, as are tens of millions of barrels of oil. The fishing industry in the Gulf is stalled, and the tourism industry has taken a hit.
        http://tripplecheck.wordpress.com/2010/07/31/debunking-snopes-the-soros-petrobras-obama-gulf-moratorium-conspiracy/

      • JeffH

        FYI – According to an Aug. 14, 2009 filing with the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission. Soros’s fund sold 22 million U.S.-listed common shares of Petrobras and bought 5.8 million shares of the company’s(Petrobras) U.S.-traded preferred shares, according to the filing.

      • DaveH

        Kinetic,
        I thought you were a little smarter than the average Liberal. For once, I have been wrong.
        Misinformation? The Import Export Bank is chartered as a Government Corporation and is an agency in the Executive Branch. Who is the head of the Executive Branch? Duh, would it be Obama? But, even if it wasn’t, what part of Obama’s ordering a drilling moratorium do you not understand? If he could and would shut down all the deep-water drilling, he certainly could have put the kibosh on the Import Export Bank’s funding to Brazil, yet he didn’t. If deep water drilling is bad for the environment, why would that man turn a blind eye to the funding of Brazil’s similar efforts?

        And News Flash, a Liberal (Kinetic) is lying. Wow, how unusual!
        http://www.exim.gov/brazil/petrobasfacts.cfm

        Who was President in April 2009? Only one guess allowed.
        From the article: “In April 2009, Ex-Im Bank formally offered to consider up to $2 billion in financing to secure the purchase of U.S. goods and services by Petroleo Brasileiro S.A. (Petrobras), Brazil’s national oil company. Ex-Im Bank told Petrobras it would consider increasing its offer above $2 billion if requested. Potentially, Petrobras $2 billion of purchases financed by Ex-Im Bank will help create and maintain over 16,000 American jobs.”

      • DaveH

        So, a normal person might ask “if the Import-Export Bank considers that their loan would employ American people, wouldn’t it be easier for Obama to just lift the moratorium and put those oil rig workers back to work?”. Not so easy. You see those oil rig workers aren’t Unionized.

      • Kinetic1

        DaveH,
        You see, this is what I despise about Conservatives like you. You call me a lier because I said that the decision was made under the Bush administration, and you cite the date in the article as proof, but you conveniently fail to print their detailed explanation. If I may:

        “It is notable that the Bank’s bipartisan Board of Directors unanimously approved the preliminary commitment to Petrobras on April 14, 2009, before any Obama appointees joined the Bank. In fact, at the time the Bank’s Board consisted of three Republicans and two Democrats, all of whom were appointed by President George W. Bush”

        So while Bush was no longer President, the board was still from the Bush administration. Just as the 2009 budget was set during the Bush administration but partially carried out during Obama’s first year, the request for this loan was brought up during the Bush administration and voted on by the same Bush appointed board during the first quarter of the Obama administration. Still, just as the right want’s to blame Obama for the results of the 2009 budget, they also accuse Obama of controlling a loan that began during the Bush administration and decided upon by Bush appointees and say it’s purpose was to help George Soros. Just how did he persuade the Ex/Im bank to consider this loan before he was even chosen as a candidate? I may have missed the final date, but not everything changes the day the President is sworn in.

      • Lewis Munn

        It is related indirectly, since Obama is wild about “environmental” issues, and seems determined to get his way with us by artificially raising prices; while dropping incomes in comparison. My SS payment has been stuck for 3 years, while gas has almost doubled!

        His policies drive American incomes down, and prices up, catching many of us squarely in the middle.

        I thought that the “birther” issues were not applicable, but om second thought, I think it is, if true. Much bad stuff could be rescinded if he is not legal!

        On the side, whatever happened to that Kenyan/British Birth Certificate that came on line, showing a footprint and all, and then abruptly totally disappeared?

        It would, if true, explain how he got to Pakistan when US citizens were not permitted to fly in, would it not?

        His secrecy is itself suspicious.

        I have nothing to hide, so my paperwork is readily available. And there are still people who knew me (and pictures) from when I was young. So I have to wonder if he is a plant to ruin our economy by regulations and by a pre-Hitler Germany-type inflation.

      • DaveH

        Did we expect anything other? Thanks, Void.

      • DaveH
    • Aix Sponsa

      I had one of those tiny 80 Civics that got a whopping 28 mpg on a highway trip. It was a horribly dangerous car. I dumped it in a few months for a new Accord that got= 28 on a trip. Later I had a 98 Lincoln Mark 8 with the 270 hp DOHC engine that regularly got 28.3 mpg at 73 mph across the same I55. Now I drive a 2000 Lincoln TownCar that gets 27.5+ at 73 mph on that same trip, and got 29 across I90. The Lincolns are somewhat bigger than the Civic, and safer, more comfortable. New cars make 300 hp and get a real 30+ mpg. I see women and children herding SUVs down the road with their phones stuck to their heads, driving erratically in their “own world”. Picture your 40 mpg “Smart Car” or similar impaled by a Ford Excursion. Not me, I’ve already been hit head on in my big car by a large pickup loaded with drunk teens. I will stick to my gas guzzling Lincolns as I remember being in pain for 12 years. My 2000 was hit in the side by a semitruck driven by a person who was asleep. No thanks, I’ll stick with an adult sized vehicle.

      • Aix Sponsa

        This is on pure gasoline. My experience has shown that 10% ethanol blend drops mileage by 6% across the board, on several different vehicles tested. A friend’s new GM E85 multi-fuel vehicle loses 36% mileage from pure gas to E85. Save 50 cents per gallon, lose 1/3 of your mileage….. right. Try water/hydrogen injection, it works.

      • Kinetic1

        Aix,
        Let’s take a look at this. in 1973 a 5920 lb. Lincoln Continental was Powered by a 460 cu in engine that produced 219 horsepower and got about 16 mpg. In 1982 the Continental ran a 301 with just 131 horsepower and still just 16 mpg. By 2001 the Conti was down to a svelte 3867 lb. ran a smaller 280 cu in engine, but it was now producing 275 bhp and pulling 23 hwy mpg! These days the Lincoln MKZ is running a little 215 (3.5 liter) that produces 263 bhp and is rated at 27 hwy mpg. It’s a little smaller than your Town Car (you lose about 3 inches in the back seat) but it’s a lot more fun to drive.

        In other words, even the “big” cars are engineered to be lighter than what we drove 40 years ago, but they have also made huge leaps in safety. Along the way they have also learned a lot about how to get more out of an engine. This didn’t happen just because the car companies thought it was a good idea. No, the government pushed and the auto makers went kicking and screaming all the way, complaining that they couldn’t possibly build a safe car that got good gas milage. So please, feel free to drive a bigger “safer” car. In fact, you might even want to consider a Lincoln MKZ hybrid with an EPA-estimated 41 city/36 highway. Spending the summer Cruzin’ down I55 on air conditioned seats while passing one gas station after another doesn’t sound to bad, does it?

      • jibbs

        BHP is taken direct from the crank, before the trans.

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