Smilee, That’s a glimpse into the insight I was looking for. Thanks. To counter I would say the DOI and Constitution, regardless of imperfect authors, reflects Judeo Christian values. Further, when comparing track records with whatever else you choose to compare the American experience to, America comes out well ahead of any other societal experiment in history. Please explain why we must ‘progress’.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=csj-wr9qqgY&feature=PlayList&p=AB509C76D7478D34&playnext_from=PL&index=1&playnext=2

Uponaroof, You are so right!
Lets look at pre American experiment, thats about 5000 years according to whats within written records.

So that means that man was held down for 5000 years and then along comes a new form of FREEDOM so any person can if they are so compelled become wealthy, own land, own anything they wish.
They are no longer slaves to the state or King.

Yet some of the neo Marxist who feel thats failed want to drag all of us down into the abyss of being slaves again so everyone can be the same. Strange how they forget the KINGS.
But hey as you and I know Marx was a malcontent who hated other Jews, as well as all mankind no matter who.

And as we have seen time after time when the Marxist experiment has taken place its failed time after time. Lets also not forget the fact that more humans have been killed by Marxist than any other form of Government ever.

But as we seem to have a plethora of neo Marxist who post here with thier mindless dribbel, as well thier post filled with such vitriol toward the American way of life.
What can we expect from such Godless mindless droids that will follow blindly into that good night.

uponroof says:
July 5, 2010 at 9:56 am

Smilee, That’s a glimpse into the insight I was looking for. Thanks. To counter I would say the DOI and Constitution, regardless of imperfect authors, reflects Judeo Christian values. Further, when comparing track records with whatever else you choose to compare the American experience to, America comes out well ahead of any other societal experiment in history. Please explain why we must ‘progress

_____________________________
That may be your insight but disagree with your conclusion that it reflects Judeo Christian values but that’s not to say its free expression is not protected as are all other religious /spiritual beliefs not just Judeo Cristian beliefs or values. Billy Graham a few years back in an interview with David Frost said We have never been a Christian Nation and the country was not founded on these principals and I agree with him and the Constitution does not say it was was so that is but your opinion . I agree with the rest of your post and I said nothing about progress but all must live in the present and that is very different than circumstances of the eighteenth century and we have changed the Constitution 27 times so it is no longer a document of just the founding fathers as they designed it not to be, the first amendments were in 1791 and the last in 1992, these changes spanned 201 years, you tell me if you call that progress or not? Progress has always been the present and the future, the Constitution and the DOI are our roots (very good ones at that) only, so they are just a part of the whole tree so to speak. We are the product of the twentieth and twenty-first centuries not the 17th and 18th centuries and its new growth so to speak

This in part a letter from Thomas Jefferson to James Madison after the constitution was ratified and before it was amended to include the “Bill of Rights” You might find it interesting.

Thomas Jefferson, Letters, THE EARTH BELONGS TO THE LIVING
The Letters of Thomas Jefferson: 1743-1826

THE EARTH BELONGS TO THE LIVING

To James Madison Paris, Sep. 6, 1789

– I sit down to write to you without knowing by what occasion I shall send my letter. I do it because a subject comes into my head which I would wish to develope a little more than is practicable in the hurry of the moment of making up general despatches. The question Whether one generation of men has a right to bind another, seems never to have been started either on this or our side of the water. Yet it is a question of such consequences as not only to merit decision, but place also, among the fundamental principles of every government.

…….On similar ground it may be proved that no society can make a perpetual constitution, or even a perpetual law. The earth belongs always to the living generation. They may manage it then, and what proceeds from it, as they please, during their usufruct. They are masters too of their own persons, and consequently may govern them as they please. But persons and property make the sum of the objects of government. The constitution and the laws of their predecessors extinguished them, in their natural course, with those whose will gave them being. This could preserve that being till it ceased to be itself, and no longer. Every constitution, then, and every law, naturally expires at the end of 19. years. If it be enforced longer, it is an act of force and not of right.

Smelly,
We all await your briliance. I guess we all will be waiting a long time.

My post was in response to uponroof says, so your “WE” is not of any concern

Smelly, Yada – Yada – Yada, more babble from a POSER.

Time,
That’s Yadda, Yadda Bush Bad. Yadda, Yadda, Bush terrible! Yadda, Yadda gotta kiss Obummers behind!!! thats Norms mantra!!!

Smelly, The law is nothing but shades of gray, but as it goes its nearly as bent as you, thus whats your point again?

That’s the problem with our “law” system. It isn’t a “justice” system.
It’s merely a football to be kicked around in Kangaroo court until somebody scores.
We’ll need to re-enact a system of justice before this whole circus can be brought to an end.

My point cannot be given until you tell me hat the heck you are talking about assuming you know that.

Smelly,
Its quite clear your 100% totaly clueless so other than having no point your pointless.
Go to law school, then tell me all about the shades of gray.

Smilee,
Don’t waste your time. If you look over Time’s past posts, you’ll see that he is short on information, long on insults. He seems to be here for no reason other than to feed his ego, so let him have his fun.

Kinetic1 says:
July 5, 2010 at 4:30 pm

You convinced me, you are right!!

notmoving one(a little exlax will fix that!),
On the contrary i find Times posts to have a lot more thought as well as intelligence that is quite sorely lacking in edduh, smelly and of course, yours!!!

Joyie

Thats not surprising coming from you who has no intelligence!!

Well Norm you seem to know a lot about gay people so you tell us all about how that works.

Norm, now you know you can’t get too much more crazy than the current administration. I don’t have time to rewrite the bad list of things they have done, so you got lucky. Put a sock in it Norm!

In reply to Norm. Not all teabaggers are extremists! “We the people” are ordinary citizens who have had enough of government orgainized crime. There are traitorous people in our government and need to be expunged in order to continue our way of life and our freedom. You haven’t realized yet what repercutions are in store for you, my friend, and they are going to turn your world upside down unless you get a grip on reality and understand the workings of manipulating government officals. Unless you like being told what to do, when to do it, and lose your freedom and money.

I personally do not care about their sexual practices. I care about their ability to read and comprehend. It would also be nice of those that COULD read would bother to do so before they vote.

I might feel a little more represented if they read the bills they pass on us.

Norm you are entitiled to your liberal opinion i could call you a stuped nazi teabagging homosexual that likes boys but we on here are haveing a grown up debate about kagen and the supreme courty, not you having sex with your boy friend, and as for you if you don,t like it here leave this is not a liberal site,kagen will say anything right wrong or indifferance to be conformed,like you stuped is as stuped does and why tell the truth if a lie will work

Grown up debate??????? Your are a comedian full of jokes are you not!!! Norm is right there are a lot of professed mind readers on here who in reality cannot read minds like you.

Marvin,
It frightens me to think that your version of a “grown up discussion” includes resorting to name calling and sexual innuendo. No, I do not think that Norm should have resorted to using “nazi”, but look how quickly you sank to the same level and then kept going. How fitting, then that you ended with the quote “stuped (sic) is as stuped (sic) does.”

Ms. Kagan is a well educated person with, by all accounts a fine grasp of the law. Her lack of judicial experience is not considered a limiting factor by either history, the larger part of the legal world (including many Republicans) or the Constitution. Her response to this question is no less than what others, such as Justice Roberts gave for other controversial subjects during his confirmation hearings. You may recall that commenting on one’s opinions of issue likely to be heard is not considered appropriate, thus the question of Roe v Wade is often responded to in this manner. To contend that she is unqualified due to your bias against those you consider liberals is fine for these conversations, but it ignores the realities of past selections, many of whom have judged differently than anyone had expected,
and holds little weight in the real world.

Lack of movement1, If it were not for double standards you would have none.
But really thanks for displaying that here daily so we can all observe just what that means.

It is not her lack of intelligence that should render her ineligible nor her lack of Judicial experience, though I think they should have to have served as a judge before. What makes her not right for the job is the completely partisan/political focus of her entire career. How is she supposed to make constitutional decisions without bias when her whole life is dedicated to one view point? The judges are our last line of governmental defense, they should not be on any side but the constitutions.

Kinetic, you said she has a fine grasp on the law. I ask you can you give an example of this fine grasp?

del’
“…fine grasp on the law.” is, of course a personal opinion, though it is shared by many in the legal world. I base my opinion on the memos recently released. I these memos I saw a person who was not afraid to consider all sides of an issue, even in cases where she would likely disagree.

Kagan criticized a California court for rejecting a landlady’s claim that an state anti-discrimination law violated her religious freedom and suggested that her appeal should be accepted by the Supreme Court. Further, she felt the court should side with the landlady, saying it was her right not to rent to unmarried couples based on her belief that sex outside of marriage was wrong. I am not sure where I stand on this, but it has given me much to consider. You may or may not agree with her stance, but she has taken both the couples freedoms and the landlady’s freedom of religious belief into account, rather than taking the easy way out.

Kagan also argued against a ban on abortion, noting that the ban made no concession for situations where the mother’s life was at risk, again speaking to the gray area of the pro life stance: which life takes precedence?

You may or may not consider these and other of her opinions worthy of a Supreme Court Justice, but I, though I am concerned that she may prove less liberal than many think, can find no reason not to support her.

Sorry, that should have read “In these memos…”

Obama always considers all sides of an issue …………………… then he says we are doing it my way.

non-mover1,
marvin obviously feels like I do. I return what is thrown at me! normie and even you have stooped to name calling as have most of your progressive bretheren here!!

Your viewpoint is well-taken and with respect I submit that I personally would not have had much with which to formulate bias (except my inclination toward my Republican Party Conservatism)against her… there is however some evidence that both she and her office were involved in the birthing of the bill known as OBAMAscare and further in the obvious attempt to cover up her personal knowledge of its content well before Obama selected her for his nominee… and then there were the inescapable conferences that targeted insulation of her involvement or the appearance of her isolation from its tenets while the agency from which she came consulted the author of the bill on its legality. All that is now published on the Internet in this venue indicates a large amount of redacted (for the general public) material and that remaining does in small part bear the signature of a cover-up. While this is being carefully raked over by appropriate legal community experts we have in the wake the approaching day when the highest court will indeed be making a determination of the final outcome of this highly speculative piece of legislative work that many see as a threat to the very fabric of our Republic. Should she not recuse herself from the final panel of judges then there will undoubtedly become a cry throughout the land for her removal… her staff and her own complicity to give the bill its stamp of approval with the understanding and full knowledge that she just might one-day be enthroned to give it the flag of victory for the liberal left’s agenda to further democratize America… our Republic be damned.

Norm ,, have you ever stared down the business end of a firearm? Have you ever faced someone willing to use it? My friend, I have ,,, 4 times. It is not a pleasant experience, believe me. I served as a law enforcement officer for 13 years. Has Kagan ever done that ??? She needs to, it would change her beliefs drastically. And, personally, I think she needs to face that, one time in her life. And, if she continues with her current belief, it could happen. It can happen to anyone. She needs to go away. ANYONE, who has never dealt with that, only needs to have it happen. It can change a belief or conviction against firearms.

Non movable, Where is that? For sure ot you.
If your mind were a parachute you would be dead after the first jump.

Time,
The minds I speak of are those that will confirm or deny Ms. Kagan’s appointment, but rather than consider this obvious reference you, once again consider a personal insult an intelligent retort. Hooray for your side!

The point of my post is that MR considers Ms. Kagan unqualified based on two or three basic principles.
1) She is, according to MR a common liberal and, therefore is unlikely to support the 2nd amendment.
2) She is so anxious to get on the court that she will lie to do so.
3) She has never been a judge.

I would contend that the degree to which she is a Liberal is up for debate. We will only know the truth once she is seated, as is the case with all Justices, both right and left of center. To suggest that she is so desirous of a seat on the SC that she would do or say anything is quite an offensive stance and demands some proof. The fact that she never sat on the bench and therefore has no record to turn to is not proof, nor does it meet the standards set for becoming a judge.

In reviewing this site I see that frequent participants seem to take great joy in hurling ad hominem insults at those they consider liberal and a few “liberals” will return in kind. If, Time you have ANY comments that relate to these issues, please speak up. If you are just here to make your little friends giggle, then please, hurl away.

Non movable,
I am a “REAL LIBERAL”, but your as far from being a real liberal as the Sun is from Pluto. As I see it everyone here knows I am a real Liberal.
Yet how odd is it how no one here has any issues with me.
Don’t you think thats a bit odd dude?

That is other than you Posers like yourself who claim to be something your not.
As I see it when one makes a absurd argument we all have the door open to adress such in a way thst displays the overt stupidity posted by the likes of people like yourself.

If you don’t like that – then post something that is based in some form of real logic and drop the Poser Rap Crap.

As for Kagan’s qualification’s for such a job, she has {ZIP, Nada Non!}
Need I explain that in detail so your very slow mind can grasp it?

If a person is to sit in the Supreem Court then I expect that person to display an “open mind” and not be set within a “grid of radical platforms.”
Ms. Kagan has displayed nothing but 100% radical views from day one. Thus one can not trust her to have any change.

The old adage of a leoprard can never change its spots fits this profile to a tee.
Now do you need me to be more detailed or can you grasp that?

Oh and by the way Non Movable one, the Progressive Marxist that sit in both houses I have zero respect for and I find them repugnant.
Thus their minds are as far as I see it equal to used TP.

Time.
“..as far from being a real liberal as the Sun is from Pluto.” “Posers like yourself who claim to be something your not.” ” Rap Crap”?
Thanks, Time. It is clear now that your intent is to rile people up and, as you noted no one seems to have a problem with that. Now that I have a better understanding of you and your limitations, neither will I. Your posts have not been worth getting animated about, so, in the future I will not be bothered to respond unless you can come up with an honest, informed point.

Enjoy yourself!

Non Movable,
Your as transperant as a clear glass window, as well totaly clueless. As to whats in your twisted and bent nano mind one can only fathom what a five year old thinks about or will come up with as logical.
Don’t chew on any electric wires while pluged in, it may be shocking.

There’s nothing wrong with classic “live and let live” liberalism. Its those pesky social engineering commies running around as liberals that are the problem.

non movable,
“as far as her being a liberal I think that will be determined after she is in office”! Typical liberal stance!!! “We gotta pass the bill to see what is in it”!!!!! I say we don’t find out if that is what it takes! Keep her off the bench!!! Call your reps and DEMAND that they vote against her!! I have and will keep remnding them weekly!!

Ms.Kagan Is First and Foremost: an Attorney; Ah-to/ torn-turn about or CHANGE Ah-Torn-ey. The First Rule of LAW is: Any THING, that you CAN get AWAY with, is LEGAL, unless, Timely and Specific Objection is Uttered thereunto!

Sub siletio( below silence) is a “position at LAW”, and supports the assertion of the Plantiff at bar and thier asserted accustions if not REPONDED to in a timely fashion, however, EVADING by “Legal Trickeries of LAW” by bobbing and weaving or RE-PHRASING the QUESTION, is a TACTIC, to obfuscate(confuse by changing the facts) by retorical meanderings, ad infinitum.

Ms Kagan and her:S.C.O.T.U.S. STACKER in Chief. are Social Justice,(Humanistic-NeoPlatonistic, Pythagorean, MYSTERY School), Gnostic Ilumminati worshippers of Baal, Ashtoreth(Lilith);Cannanites{ source of:canna-Baals) and students of: Marx, Lennin, Stalin, Cloward and Plevin, Saul Alinski, SWORN to thier God: LUCIFER/SATAN, to Destroy the Righteous People of SHEM, as Their KIND,(the Canninites have done for over THREE THOUSAND YEARS as They Have Learned from thier Religions books: Zohar, Kahbbalah( based on the Sephiroth),Koran and midrash
It may be wise to recall: Christ’s WARNING! to:”Beware of FALSE Profits, who come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ravenous wolves!” Ms Kagan and the PRETEND President(all though as mere Corporate President of Corp U.S.(the Federal Gavernment , ie: the 10 mile square, which is but; Washington, District of Criminals, and ancillary Federal Zones, it should surprise NO one, That he tends to think in terms of: “International LAW” not American Law, as Corp U.S. assets, inclusive of the asserted; Federal Reserve(in fact: Central Bank), I.R.S.(Fed’s ENFORECEMENT/Revenue Collection ARM)& Social Security Admin. were Under the Bretton Woods Agreement, all said asssets of Corp U.S, were, at LAW: QUIT CLAIMED to Private Foreign Bankers:(Rothschild-Myer Amschell Bauer, in truth),Warburg,(U.B.S.W.) Rockefeller, J.PEABODY Morgan, Brown Harriman and Harriman/(Prescott Bush and Sons), Queen of England, Royal Bank of Scotland…) thus NOT One RED cent, of what Americans pay to the IRS, Goes to Anything, here in America!

The S.S.A.( Frauduently asserted as: Old Age Retirement Insurance) is in Fact and at LAW, a TRUST in Toten! It is NOT YOUR S.S.Number, It belongs to a Private Foreign TRUST but, has a NAME of an ENTITY spelled JUST like yours, BUT in Capitals, designating a TRUSTEE, a mere Corporate Entity said Benefits, pursuant to the to the TRUST, are SUBJECT to: the POWER of CONGRESS and as such, may at the mere WHIM of Congress, be Cancelled! so Much for the PONZI SCHEME, where will you set, when the MUSIC STOPS?

So it Goes with Stealthy Praticers, of the COLORABLE ARTS(in truth, able to be COLORED, in any way that may benefit the Monopolistic Cabal of the Rights of the Black NOBILITY) devised by SCHEME, under mere Liscence, of what is but, TERMED: “secret mysteries” of LAW!

May The GOD of Shem, the Creator of all the Heavens and the Earth, Protect and Save America and the Sovereign Human Beings sojourning here, from the Satanic Jihadists, plotting the DESTRUCTION of our Chrstianity, Freedom and Liberty concieved Grand Experiment of the REPUBLIC

You wasted a lot of fancy words, amigo. I write like I talk. I don’t give a sh&* about impressing anyone with a bunch of BS talk. I say it like it is. You may be right with what you said, but, why use so many words to say it ???? I’m just a simple, good ol’ boy from the southwest. So, I’ll put it in simple terms that anyone can understand. Kagan is a stupid (word removed). Raised on a silver spoon, and has no clue as to what it is to face a firearm, or any conflict in her world. Well, Mijo’ ,, I HAVE !!! She has no damned business being involved in politics AT ALL !!!! But, it shouldn’t take so many words to get your point across. Half way into your comment, I lost interest. Sorry, don’t mean to be disrespectful. You made a good point. And, I agree. But keep your point short, and directly to the point. I hate her, she needs to go. And, most will agree with that. Keep ypur comments simple, and directly to the point.

Then you should welcome the lack of freedoms as promoted by the 1984 scenario guised as antiterrorism. So long as you have the right to bear arms (for the time being). Eventually in the police state you will be shown that is no longer needed (as other freedoms are trampled)and you will give yours up or be the criminal. Your freedom is protected by the entire Constitution and Bill of Rights. Not just the ones you pick and choose.

Soma,
I will never willingly give up any of my freedoms, especially my right to own and carry guns!

Perhaps, you would consider the Pre-emminent Felix Frankfurter in the CLOTH of Kagan?

You may Note: that the aforesaid, S.C.O.T..U.S., adjudicator of the “Brown vs. Board of Education” FRAUD on the PEOPLE, by: FAILURE to RECUSE when an “absolute” bonafide conflict exists, as is REQUIRED by Moral and Ethical Oaths and Affirmations pursuant to:the Oath of OFFICE, in re, Said Justice Frankfurter, having been the Plantiff Brown’s and his enjoinded in actio, Counsel of Record: N.A.A.C.P (founded in 1910 by all but one, Caucasian Canninite Lawyers, and so untill 1971), Said; Counsel, for the Plantiff, in the suit at Bar, for the N.A.A.C.P. which had in FACT and at LAW, Justice Frankfurter had been for approx 12 YEARS be said: Counselor General for the Plantiff, N.A.A.C.P., thus creating a: MONUMENTAL, bonafide, Controversy at LAW which, had any of the asserted; Learned, practitoners, of the Colorable Black Arts of Law, OBJECTED, in a TIMELY and Specific manner the HONERABLE JUSTICE?, in homage, to his High Officious Position, of Public TRUST?, at LAW should have RECUSED his KAGANISTIC self but, as the present Social JUSTICE communista candidate, will merely proceed to confirmation just like the previous Stalthy Presidents: Wilson, F.D.R., Cater, and Clintons will easily be CONfirmed against the WILL of “WE THE PEOPLE” by subversives clothed as President and their Co-Conspirators in TREASON!

You actually expect me to look that up ??? Less than 1% of the people who read this crap will bother. What ??? Are you an attorney ?? I’m willing to bet, I have been in court against more defense attorneys than you ever have in your carrier ,, if you are. And I NEVER lost a case. 13 years as a Law Enforcement Officer,,, please, take some advice … stop with all the ‘legal quotes’ ,, just say what you have to say ,, it will get more respect.

Maverick,
no, being the progressive liberal she is, she would just demand all firearms be banned!!!

Unfortunately, Gun freedom doesn’t guarantee constitutional freedom. Beware of the police state and cameras and drones.

Many freedoms were given up during the last administration.

Hugh Jordin; The “Bush” excuse for everything is so passe’! It’s time for this administration to grow-up and take responsibility for the last 18 months. Half a term “transition”, the longest in history!

100% agree! FOR GOD AND COUNTRY!

Also agree… that that person should begin to see the insult to him/herself whenever their only comment can amount to a pathetic draw of the “old Bush” card thingy – a typical liberal modus operandi that oft-times takes on the character of using the “race-card” or the “anti-semitic card” in defense of their view or to prove a point that always, to me sounds about as deep as their generally deep-rooted belief they emerged from some primordial stew eons ago – imagine stew morphing into an intelligent with a stewed brain. That’s a dyed in the wool liberal alright.